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Speaker 1: Welcome to Creature future production of iHeartRadio. I'm your host

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Speaker 1: of Many Parasites, Katie Golden. I studied psychology and evolutionary biology,

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Speaker 1: and today on the show, we're gonna talk about Jane

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Speaker 1: good Old Jane Goodall. As you've probably heard, she did

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Speaker 1: pass away recently.

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Speaker 2: While she was on a speaking tour. She's ninety one,

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Speaker 2: still at it, still going.

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Speaker 1: On speaking tours, which I mean, she really loved being

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Speaker 1: with the Champanzees, so the like, it was kind of

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Speaker 1: a sacrifice for her to go on these speaking tours

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Speaker 1: because she would much prefer to be, you know, out

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Speaker 1: there with the Champanzees, but she really wanted to educate

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Speaker 1: the public. Wonderful, wonderful woman, one of the most influential primatologists, So.

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Speaker 2: We're gonna talk about her.

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Speaker 1: She obviously did a lot of amazing research, and she

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Speaker 1: was just also really fun.

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Speaker 2: And cool lady.

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Speaker 1: Joining me today is comedian and musician host of the

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Speaker 1: podcast Coldbrew Got Me Like and whose new record just

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Speaker 1: came out.

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Speaker 2: I'm your Man, Chris crafton.

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Speaker 3: Welcome Chris, Hi, How are you nice to be here? Katie.

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Speaker 3: It's been a little while.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, it's good to have you back.

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Speaker 3: It's always fun.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, No, I'm I'm excited to talk about this. Of course,

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Speaker 1: the news is sad, of course, like we we've lost

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Speaker 1: We've lost Jane. But I I just she's so she's

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Speaker 1: such a cool, positive person. And I mean, obviously her

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Speaker 1: contributions to primatology were immense and amazing, So I really

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Speaker 1: I just want to kind of celebrate like how fun

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Speaker 1: she was. She had an actually really good sense of humor.

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Speaker 1: She made some really incredible observations, and I'll give a

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Speaker 1: little bit of back ground about her, but yeah, I mean, like,

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Speaker 1: what what is your perception of Jane Goodall, Chris, Like,

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Speaker 1: how have you? Because she's in I mean, she's so famous,

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Speaker 1: she's in all sorts of bits of populace.

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Speaker 3: Yeah. I would describe her as like the led Zeppelin

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Speaker 3: of primatologists.

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Speaker 1: That's like like sort of like you know, like you

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Speaker 1: might not know anything about primatologists.

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Speaker 3: But you know who Jane Goodall is. That's how much

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Speaker 3: she how much she transcended science. And and I think

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Speaker 3: a lot of times for people, science is like you know,

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Speaker 3: scary or or you know, and so people who cut through,

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Speaker 3: like Carl Sagan or these types of people who human,

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Speaker 3: like put a human face on science. You know, it's

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Speaker 3: such a it makes huge steps forward possible. And so

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Speaker 3: I think of her as that like the sort of yeah,

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Speaker 3: just like the the rock star of of of one

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Speaker 3: of those rock stars.

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Speaker 1: Of science kind of absolutely, And you know, I think

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Speaker 1: that's a really good observation about how she made science

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Speaker 1: very accessible to people, right, she put a human face

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Speaker 1: to it. And her story is actually really interesting because

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Speaker 1: she didn't. She had a very unusual career path. She

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Speaker 1: did not start out as a scientist, like I mean,

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Speaker 1: she was doing science at the beginning, but she actually

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Speaker 1: had no formal scientific education. She had no bachelor's degree.

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Speaker 1: She just loved animals so much that she kept putting

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Speaker 1: her foot in the door where she since there was

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Speaker 1: an opportunity to be around animals. So like, she had

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Speaker 1: no no bachelor's degree, no formal education in primatology, evolutionary biology, nothing,

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Speaker 1: but she managed to get herself to Kenya for a

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Speaker 1: job as a secretary and she was on this farm

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Speaker 1: where she got to be, you know, at least closer

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Speaker 1: to these animals that she had grown up really really loving.

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Speaker 1: And then she reached out to the Kenyan paleontologist uh

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Speaker 1: Louis Leakly uh, and she wanted she was interested in

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Speaker 1: working with animals. Leakally at the time was actually really

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Speaker 1: interested in getting someone on board to study chimpanzees.

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Speaker 2: But he didn't tell her this.

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Speaker 1: Uh. He was kind of keeping it. He wasn't sure

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Speaker 1: of the plan yet, so he hired her on as

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Speaker 1: a secretary. And she just I think that she just

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Speaker 1: kind of like, uh, inspired him about her personality about her.

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Speaker 1: She had such the this U such an intense love

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Speaker 1: for animals and such a great spirit about it. He's like,

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Speaker 1: you know what, I actually think you could. You could

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Speaker 1: do this despite her not having the the credentials right

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Speaker 1: and also being a woman, which at the time was

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Speaker 1: a barrier.

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Speaker 2: Uh. He said, you know what, I would like you to.

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Speaker 1: Make these observational studies champanzees. And she was absolutely, like

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Speaker 1: one hundred percent on board.

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Speaker 2: This was her dream.

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Speaker 3: So she do you know how she got interested in

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Speaker 3: in chimps or monkeys in general?

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Speaker 2: Was this something she actually so like?

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Speaker 1: She said that when she was a kid, she had

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Speaker 1: a stuffed animal that her parents got. Instead of a

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Speaker 1: teddy bear, they got her chimpanzee, and she just loved

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Speaker 1: it and then started loving chimpanzees and animals. And I

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Speaker 1: think it's it's I really relate to this, right because

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Speaker 1: like when I was a kid, I was very much

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Speaker 1: a stuffed animal girl. Like I didn't have a lot

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Speaker 1: of dolls, didn't have a lot of barbies.

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Speaker 2: I loved stuffed animals though.

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Speaker 1: I was fascinated with them, and I would get a

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Speaker 1: stuffed animal and I would want to learn more about it, right,

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Speaker 1: Like of course, like when I was a kid, that

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Speaker 1: we didn't quite have the Internet yet. It was starting,

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Speaker 1: but it wasn't like easy to look up stuff online.

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Speaker 1: But I would always like watch Animal Planets, so to

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Speaker 1: have like my stuffed animals with me watching Animal Planet, and.

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Speaker 2: So I really relate to that.

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Speaker 1: I think I think she she had this since childhood,

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Speaker 1: just a fascination with animals. Uh, you know, she may

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Speaker 1: have become interested in chimpanzees regardless, but she didn get

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Speaker 1: like a little stuffed chimpanzee that seemed to really capture

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Speaker 1: her heart.

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Speaker 3: So I wonder if it was curious George, I mean

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Speaker 3: curious George probably did a lot, probably activated a lot

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Speaker 3: of rhymatologists or something. Yeah, because I had stuffed animals too,

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Speaker 3: and I was pretty like attached to them. But I

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Speaker 3: never like, I just you know what I mean, Like

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Speaker 3: I never well, I never went further with the biological

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Speaker 3: Like I was just like, oh, I love my rabbit

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Speaker 3: and I love my my bear. But I never like

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Speaker 3: got interested in bears. Yeah, I just clung to them. Yeah,

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Speaker 3: you know, because I was frightened.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: No, I I think I got into it actually because

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Speaker 1: of Beatrix Potter, because uh, I had I had all

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Speaker 1: those books. Uh And actually my my nursery was apparently

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Speaker 1: decorated with a bunch of Beatrix Potter animals. And Beatrix

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Speaker 1: Potter is interesting because she makes these very anthropomorphic animals

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Speaker 1: right there wearing clothes. I know that was I would say,

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Speaker 1: Eel White. Maybe, I'm not sure she did yet. No,

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Speaker 1: she did Peter Rabbit and all those other stories. But

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Speaker 1: she was actually a really good naturalist illustrator, and so

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Speaker 1: she even though the animals would be wearing little like

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Speaker 1: waistcoats and dresses and stuff, they were very realistic looking,

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Speaker 1: like she didn't make them cartoony, which was I think

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Speaker 1: really interesting because for me, that was that made really

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Speaker 1: fascinated in them, because like they were these little animals

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Speaker 1: wearing clothes, but they were also very realistically portrayed.

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Speaker 3: Sure, So.

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Speaker 1: For Jane, I think it was just something that she

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Speaker 1: had grown up love absolutely loving animals, uh, and it

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Speaker 1: just felt, you know, feels like they're some people who

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Speaker 1: just kind of like for her, it was like she

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Speaker 1: kept putting herself in the position to get closer and

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Speaker 1: closer and closer to the animals that she loved, and

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Speaker 1: she got there, and she that kind of like patience

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Speaker 1: right where like I have this goal and I'm gonna

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Speaker 1: like get there. She was really really patient when she

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Speaker 1: started to study chimpanzees. So in nineteen sixty she went

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Speaker 1: to the old Duvai Gorge in what is now Tanzania

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Speaker 1: and started to observe champanzees, which was not easy because

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Speaker 1: at first the champanzees are like, who is this lady

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Speaker 1: and they would be either really avoidant of her or

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Speaker 1: even aggressive, and she had to spend a bunch of

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Speaker 1: time just acclimating them to her presence by just sitting

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Speaker 1: there and being quiet, which you know, is like that

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Speaker 1: is one of the most like she was obviously really

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Speaker 1: really smart, but one of the most impressive things about

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Speaker 1: her is her monk like patience where she could just

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Speaker 1: do that and also endure the threat of these chimpanzees.

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Speaker 1: Who a chimpanzee can mess you up, like it's not

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Speaker 1: it's not a shy woodland creature like it can.

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Speaker 3: No I know about Yeah, we all know about chimpanzees

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Speaker 3: from various documentaries that have come out. But I, uh,

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Speaker 3: it's funny because I was just overfeeding my sister's cats

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Speaker 3: and I have to do a sort of similar thing.

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Speaker 4: Oh yeah, Like cats are very mad at me for

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Speaker 4: no reason, and and I have to sit there quietly

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Speaker 4: and let them hiss at me and stuff until they

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Speaker 4: finally get it out of their system and then they

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Speaker 4: let me give them food.

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Speaker 2: That's kind of exactly what she had to.

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Speaker 3: Do, and that irritates me. And it takes like eight minutes.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, this took a lot longer.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I can imagine. No, I would I get it though.

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Speaker 1: I would not have the patience. Honestly, I would also

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Speaker 1: not have the nerve the first time I trimpancy would

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Speaker 1: like run at me, I'd be like, you know what,

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Speaker 1: you're right, this is your area. I'll leave goodbye. But no,

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Speaker 1: she was she was with She was like patient, She

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Speaker 1: had nerves of steel, and she was highly.

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Speaker 2: Observant, so she no internet either, no internet, just writing.

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Speaker 1: Seeing there, writing down a huge amount of observations.

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Speaker 3: So she she.

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Speaker 1: Was impressive enough that she was actually able to uh

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Speaker 1: uh get her pH d in ethology without having obtained

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Speaker 1: her bachelor's degree first. She later got an honorary bachelor's degree,

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Speaker 1: but she kind of like just she started out being like,

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Speaker 1: I'm gonna just make these observations, and she was so

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Speaker 1: good at it.

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Speaker 2: Uh, it was like, actually, yeah.

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Speaker 1: You you should get a PhD like the your you're

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Speaker 1: you know, even though she received no, no, no, she

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Speaker 1: worked for the the for the peace, she had to

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Speaker 1: work for it. So she did a lot of work

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Speaker 1: for the PhD. The bachelor's degree she got as like

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Speaker 1: an honorary degree, but honestly, at that point she had

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Speaker 1: already done enough work to have gotten several bachelor's degrees,

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Speaker 1: so like, you know.

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Speaker 2: She was not she did it was not like the easy,

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Speaker 2: the easy way.

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Speaker 3: But I'm gonna I'm going for my honorary doctorate in

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Speaker 3: most broke musician.

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Speaker 1: I think that's you know, I I I think that's

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Speaker 1: a very competitive feel, Chris, I think, but yeah, so

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Speaker 1: she but she did receive a lot of pushback. I

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Speaker 1: mean a lot of it was sexism, but also a

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Speaker 1: lot of it was from her perspective, based on her perspective,

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Speaker 1: where she sort of she humanized the chimpanzees while also

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Speaker 1: making very accurate observations. So what I mean by that

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Speaker 1: is that she'd give them all names. She would kind

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Speaker 1: of talk about their individual personalities, which the idea that

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Speaker 1: animals would have individual personalities was not like a super

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Speaker 1: commonly accepted idea in evolutionary biology or primatology, right.

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Speaker 3: That, I sure, like I read about that. Yeah, so

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Speaker 3: I read that she gave them.

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Speaker 1: Names based on their personalities or or like, and she

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Speaker 1: would describe them as being different individuals, right, Like some

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Speaker 1: of them are really sweet and good natured, some of

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Speaker 1: them were bullies.

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Speaker 2: And so she was.

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Speaker 1: Kind of conducting herself a little bit like an anthropologist.

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Speaker 1: And so there was a lot of pushback at the

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Speaker 1: time saying, well, this isn't scientific, this is an objective

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Speaker 1: But honestly, I think that what was interesting was that

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Speaker 1: she wasn't really pretending to be completely impartial and objective, right,

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Speaker 1: she was noting her opinions and writing stuff like writing

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Speaker 1: down all these observations, which I think, like, there it

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Speaker 1: is a bit of a myth that any kind of

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Speaker 1: observational science is going to be completely without bias. So

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Speaker 1: she kind of like leaned into that, where it's like, yes,

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Speaker 1: I'm going to I'm going to make sure that I

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Speaker 1: am recording reality, but it's obviously through my own eyes

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Speaker 1: and through my own understanding of what's going on. So

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Speaker 1: I think that it was a really interesting kind of

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Speaker 1: like in a way more honest approach to observational studies,

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Speaker 1: where it's like, yeah, like these are I'm certainly like I'm.

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Speaker 2: Part of the equation, right, which is a difficult.

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Speaker 1: Thing to admit when you're like doing doing science right,

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Speaker 1: because it's like, well, we need objectivity. We can't be

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Speaker 1: coloring the results, which is a valuable is definitely a

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Speaker 1: valuable principle, especially if you're doing like laboratory studies, right,

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Speaker 1: But for observational studies, I mean, it's kind of hard

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Speaker 1: to avoid. We're human beings, we have our own perspectives,

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Speaker 1: and so she kind of, you know, she she leaned

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Speaker 1: into it, like, yeah, I named these chimpanzees. I feel

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Speaker 1: like I'm friends with them, right, Like she she didn't

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Speaker 1: pretend that she wasn't involved, which I think kind of

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Speaker 1: helped change people's perception of what, uh what primatology could be,

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Speaker 1: what like and in general, what science could be that

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Speaker 1: you didn't You couldn't always be like just have you know,

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Speaker 1: being a white lab coat have a thing and be

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Speaker 1: completely impersonal about it.

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Speaker 3: Well, especially with chimpanzees like or primates, because primates are

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Speaker 3: it's not like a fish. Like. You know, you could

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Speaker 3: sit around in a lab coat around some fish all

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Speaker 3: day long and uh, it wouldn't make one. You could

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Speaker 3: wear a tuxedo or a lab coat and the fish

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Speaker 3: wouldn't mind. Right, But if you wear a tuxedo around

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Speaker 3: a chimp, next thing, you know, you're at a dinner park,

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Speaker 3: right So you yeah, yeah, you're damn right. I guess

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Speaker 3: you know that better than me. But I'm sure, yeah

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Speaker 3: it's no good. But uh, I don't know what they eat?

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Speaker 3: What do they bark?

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Speaker 2: They eat their omnivores. This is great because actually this.

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Speaker 1: Was one of Jane's one of her discoveries, which was

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Speaker 1: that they're not vegetarians.

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Speaker 2: They're omnivores like we are.

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Speaker 1: So they do eat vegetation, but they also eat meat

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Speaker 1: and insects and basically anything they can find, nuts, fruits.

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Speaker 2: Uh So they like us.

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Speaker 1: Are omnivores, will actively hunt for meat, and we'll also

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Speaker 1: eat insects like termites.

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Speaker 2: So yeah, they're they they.

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Speaker 1: Have similar palettes to us, except that maybe the specific

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Speaker 1: menu is a bit different.

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Speaker 3: Right, kind of like macabre trail mix.

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Speaker 1: Yes, yeah, yeah, the trail mix would be it would

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Speaker 1: be uh yeah, termites, little bits of yeah, a little

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Speaker 1: bits of veget Yeah. Yeah, if they can get their

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Speaker 1: hands on absolutely, they would show down on that.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, So yeah, I would think there's a social component

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Speaker 3: to automatically with dealing with primates that if you tried

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Speaker 3: to well, who knows, I don't really, but anyway, there's

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Speaker 3: I would imagine it's sort of unique that that you

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Speaker 3: know that they're so smart and and that you would

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Speaker 3: have to be hard to hide your presence. Yeah, completely, Yeah,

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Speaker 3: for sure.

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Speaker 1: And I mean it's like, yes, you do become part

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Speaker 1: of the equation, but that does allow you to see

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Speaker 1: their behaviors with some with someone present, right, So as

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Speaker 1: long as you're, in my opinion, as long as you're

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Speaker 1: kind of showing your hand in terms of like yes,

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Speaker 1: I am here, and yes, my presence influences their behavior.

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Speaker 1: You're still learning things about them, right, because you're still

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Speaker 1: learning about like how they act, how they act around

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Speaker 1: an observer. But because she became so such a common

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Speaker 1: sight for them, they did begin to exhibit behaviors where

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Speaker 1: they are just like interacting with each other and kind

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Speaker 1: of ignoring her. Where she could see their their interactions

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Speaker 1: among themselves. And she even though she loved them, uh

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Speaker 1: and she empathized with them, she had a pretty unflinching

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Speaker 1: look at them, like she didn't shy away from the

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Speaker 1: fact that they can be real jerks, like chimpanzees can

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Speaker 1: be terribly unpleasant. They can be they can fight each

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Speaker 1: other and kill each other. And she would she would

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Speaker 1: make these observations, and she wouldn't try to, like, you know,

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Speaker 1: make it seem all sunshine and rainbows, right Like it's like, yeah,

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Speaker 1: there's a lot of a lot of grim reality to

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Speaker 1: the chimpanzee life, but she she documented it all. She

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Speaker 1: also had, like I said earlier, she had a great

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Speaker 1: sense of humor. There's this story that I love because

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Speaker 1: I I love Have you do you read, uh, have

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Speaker 1: you read a Gary Larson's cartoons?

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Speaker 2: Yeah? Far Side exactly.

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Speaker 3: Of course. Yeah, I'm like I'm fifty six, so like yeah,

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Speaker 3: like like in college and stuff that was like a

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Speaker 3: big deal also pre internet, so like yeah, like those

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Speaker 3: everybody loved Farside. Farside's so funny.

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Speaker 1: I love Farside when I was a kid. I like

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Speaker 1: also because he had so many cartoons about animals, right,

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Speaker 1: like a lot.

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Speaker 2: Of the humans.

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Speaker 1: Oh yeah, genius, Yes for me as a kid, I

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Speaker 1: loved it. I bought a bunch of his, like galleries, right,

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Speaker 1: his collections.

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Speaker 3: It holds up its insants, it's so good.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: And so there's this really funny story of between Jane

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Speaker 1: Goodall and Gary Larson, so like oh wow, yeah, so

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Speaker 1: he uh did a did a comic strip where it's

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Speaker 1: like it was one of his one panels, right, he

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Speaker 1: loved doing those, just like one panel, the art and

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Speaker 1: the text under it, and it's these two chimpanzees female

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Speaker 1: grooming a male, and she's got the like she's got

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Speaker 1: like the horn rim glasses, you know, like he he

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Speaker 1: liked most of the female characters, I know exactly. The

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Speaker 1: yeah those granny cat eye glasses. That's the only clothes she's.

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Speaker 2: Wearing, right, But she's got those, so you know that.

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Speaker 1: Uh and she uh she The caption of the comic

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Speaker 1: was the female chimp saying to the male chimp, as

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Speaker 1: she's grooming him. Well, well, another blonde hair conducting a

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Speaker 1: little more quote research with that. Jane Goodall tramp.

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Speaker 2: Uh. Yeah, fantastic funny.

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Speaker 1: And then what happened is the Jane Goodall Institute wrote

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Speaker 1: into the newspaper and the Jane Goodall Institute called the

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Speaker 1: cartoon an atrocity. There was this fear that they were

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Speaker 1: gonna sue Gary Larson. Jane Goodall had no idea this

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Speaker 1: was happening. When she found out, like someone finally like

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Speaker 1: she's got sent this, uh the cartoon, she said, wow, fantastic,

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Speaker 1: real famoute last fancy being in a Gary Larson cartoon.

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Speaker 1: And it was her favorite thing.

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Speaker 2: Like she loved it.

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Speaker 1: She was like, oh, maybe I should write to Gary

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Speaker 1: Larson and let him know I loved it. But she

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Speaker 1: got distracted because chimpanzees and so like. She had no

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Speaker 1: idea that this like beef was going on where people

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Speaker 1: were like, oh, Jane Goodall hated this cartoon, and when

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Speaker 1: she found out, she's like, no, I loved it. It's amazing.

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Speaker 1: Of course I don't want to see Gary Larson. And

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Speaker 1: so she invited him to her research institute at the

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Speaker 1: Gombe National Park, and so he came as a guest,

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Speaker 1: and he was really apparently really nervous because he's like, like,

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Speaker 1: I was worried that I had maybe offended her, and

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Speaker 1: she's like, no, no, of course not. She she loved

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Speaker 1: the cartoon. She actually received a bunch of copies of

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Speaker 1: it and she couldn't throw any of them out, so,

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Speaker 1: like she just had a massive collection of the same

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Speaker 1: Gary Larson cartoon and so yeah, she ended up writing

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Speaker 1: the forward to one of his collections of cartoons, the

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Speaker 1: I think the Far Side Gallery five. Yeah, and so

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Speaker 1: she like told she like told these stories about Gary

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Speaker 1: Larson coming to visit her at the Gombe National Park

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Speaker 1: and she introduced him to like she brought him with

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Speaker 1: her to go see the chimpanzees. But like it went

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Speaker 1: a little awry because there was a this mail chimp

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Speaker 1: that she called Frodo, who was actually kind of an asshole,

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Speaker 1: a real jerk and a bully, and Frodo saw Gary

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Speaker 1: Larson and it was like nerd alert and went over

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Speaker 1: and started bullying Gary Larson like pushing him around, kind

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Speaker 1: of hitting him. And Jane was really like she was

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Speaker 1: projecting calm, right, like trying to remain very calm, trying

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Speaker 1: to redirect Frodo's attention from Gary Larson to herself. But

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Speaker 1: she was like, I was panicking internally because like what if,

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Speaker 1: like I get the world's best cartoonist killed by this chimpanze. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: but the chimpane Frodo gave up after a while. He

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Speaker 1: was just like just like kind of like all right,

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Speaker 1: gave you a wedge, he slapped around a little bit.

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Speaker 2: All Right, I'm fine, I'm done. Uh so Gary Larson survived.

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Speaker 1: And uh yeah, so it's I think it's just one

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Speaker 1: of these humanizing moments, right. She's like she's a she

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Speaker 1: was a person who had a great sense of humor

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Speaker 1: about herself and about her work, and uh yeah, I

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Speaker 1: mean like it's the it's very it's also like, uh

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Speaker 1: you know, it's a it's so funny to me that

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Speaker 1: she's like because she just seems so serene right, like

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Speaker 1: like almost like just like like monk like right, but

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Speaker 1: then she's like apparently like uh you know, internally panicking

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Speaker 1: because she thinks she's gonna get Gary Larson killed by this.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I think people, I mean, yeah, they people like

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Speaker 3: to look at her like as a monk. I think,

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Speaker 3: because I don't know why, that's just maybe.

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Speaker 2: Because she has calm presence, she.

404
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Speaker 3: Doesn't show off like that doesn't But that doesn't mean

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Speaker 3: you're a monk. I mean, I think the comparison now

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Speaker 3: is just like you're either a monk or or you're

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Speaker 3: Taylor Swift or whatever. Yeah, I mean I think there's

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Speaker 3: something in between. But I think people take serious people

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Speaker 3: as you know. I just think like you can be

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Speaker 3: a serious person but also be fun. I mean, just

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Speaker 3: because you have an attention span doesn't mean you're some

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Speaker 3: kind of a monk. Yeah, so I think I also

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Speaker 3: think that is a I think of everything through the

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Speaker 3: lens of like modern attention span versus old time attention span,

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Speaker 3: and like it just makes me, I like the idea

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Speaker 3: of somebody who has the has the sort of attention

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Speaker 3: span where they can be fun and serious at the

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Speaker 3: same time, which is just very It's not an either

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Speaker 3: or situation, you know, but I do she gets portrayed

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Speaker 3: as I don't know. Also, she had like long straight hair.

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Speaker 3: They always like to just make her look like, I

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Speaker 3: don't know, they make her look serious.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: She actually had a very very good sense of humor.

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Speaker 1: I mean you can you can definitely see it when

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Speaker 1: you watch interviews with her where she.

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Speaker 3: Y she gave a backstage past the chimps, Yeah to

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Speaker 3: Gary Larson.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and she she she like she in some of

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Speaker 1: her interviews. She I mean she finds things very funny,

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Speaker 1: because how can you not when you're surrounded by chimps,

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Speaker 1: She said.

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Speaker 2: She like, well it's fun yeah, Like.

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Speaker 1: And she she like talks about chimps laughing at things right,

435
00:24:40,680 --> 00:24:43,880
Speaker 1: like they they have a specific way that they they laugh.

436
00:24:44,720 --> 00:24:48,880
Speaker 1: There was a case where she saw like a mother

437
00:24:49,680 --> 00:24:52,480
Speaker 1: saw like her. This is really funny because like chimp

438
00:24:52,520 --> 00:24:55,600
Speaker 1: humor can be pretty like mean, but like a mother

439
00:24:55,840 --> 00:24:59,920
Speaker 1: like her offspring, her baby was like, uh, you know

440
00:25:00,119 --> 00:25:02,280
Speaker 1: in the like in the young phase where he's like

441
00:25:02,400 --> 00:25:05,040
Speaker 1: able to walk around on his own, but he got

442
00:25:05,200 --> 00:25:08,639
Speaker 1: a little bit lost and he's like sending out this

443
00:25:08,760 --> 00:25:10,720
Speaker 1: kind of like he's like kind of crying because he

444
00:25:10,760 --> 00:25:13,120
Speaker 1: doesn't know where he is. But the mother's like right there,

445
00:25:13,160 --> 00:25:17,080
Speaker 1: but he's not seeing her, and she's laughing at because

446
00:25:17,160 --> 00:25:20,280
Speaker 1: it's so the like because like she finds it funny

447
00:25:20,640 --> 00:25:22,840
Speaker 1: that her her kid is so dumb that he doesn't

448
00:25:22,920 --> 00:25:25,720
Speaker 1: see her like sitting right there in the nearby tree.

449
00:25:25,760 --> 00:25:28,720
Speaker 1: And so Jane's like recounting this, and it's you know,

450
00:25:29,080 --> 00:25:31,240
Speaker 1: I think it's uh, yeah, it's just like she had

451
00:25:31,240 --> 00:25:34,320
Speaker 1: a she had a great way of humanizing the chimps,

452
00:25:34,320 --> 00:25:39,720
Speaker 1: but also making these observations that genuinely changed like our

453
00:25:39,920 --> 00:25:43,280
Speaker 1: understanding of chimpanzees and their behavior.

454
00:25:44,040 --> 00:25:46,040
Speaker 3: Well, yeah, the idea of laughing. Yeah, like, you know,

455
00:25:46,080 --> 00:25:49,840
Speaker 3: that's just that's just like something that that I would

456
00:25:49,840 --> 00:25:52,719
Speaker 3: always think is you know, without if I didn't think

457
00:25:52,720 --> 00:25:55,239
Speaker 3: about it too much, I would assume only humans last. Right.

458
00:25:55,960 --> 00:25:58,720
Speaker 3: You know, I saw a video. I don't know if

459
00:25:58,760 --> 00:26:00,960
Speaker 3: it's true or not because it's on the stupid internet,

460
00:26:01,000 --> 00:26:03,320
Speaker 3: But have you seen that. I'm sure you have that

461
00:26:03,440 --> 00:26:06,399
Speaker 3: ant eater that plays around with their trainer. Is that

462
00:26:06,480 --> 00:26:07,200
Speaker 3: a real video?

463
00:26:07,480 --> 00:26:07,760
Speaker 2: Yeah?

464
00:26:07,840 --> 00:26:10,879
Speaker 1: I think that it's I'm not I haven't done a

465
00:26:10,920 --> 00:26:14,200
Speaker 1: lot of investigation into that specifically, but I would believe

466
00:26:14,240 --> 00:26:16,560
Speaker 1: that an ant eater could play around, for sure.

467
00:26:16,640 --> 00:26:18,879
Speaker 3: Yeah, so it's an ant eater playing around. Yeah, And

468
00:26:18,920 --> 00:26:21,239
Speaker 3: so it just changes. I mean I think we have

469
00:26:22,800 --> 00:26:24,440
Speaker 3: you know, we have all these things we can learn

470
00:26:24,960 --> 00:26:29,440
Speaker 3: and and they do require an open mind and patience,

471
00:26:30,119 --> 00:26:32,240
Speaker 3: which we are not you know, we are not excelling

472
00:26:32,280 --> 00:26:34,440
Speaker 3: in at the moment. So I think it's also nice

473
00:26:34,440 --> 00:26:37,240
Speaker 3: to have a hero like to be reminded of people

474
00:26:37,280 --> 00:26:41,880
Speaker 3: who you know, had patients and and and taught us. Yeah,

475
00:26:41,920 --> 00:26:44,959
Speaker 3: because animals are, like, I mean, really overlooked in this

476
00:26:45,080 --> 00:26:48,440
Speaker 3: really funny way, like I mean, or people. Certainly people

477
00:26:48,520 --> 00:26:51,320
Speaker 3: value certain animals like cats and things, but people don't

478
00:26:51,320 --> 00:26:53,640
Speaker 3: necessarily ever think that an ant eater has any fun.

479
00:26:54,080 --> 00:26:56,080
Speaker 3: And so I was amazed by that, and so like

480
00:26:57,280 --> 00:27:00,040
Speaker 3: and then you see like those videos of chimps like

481
00:27:00,080 --> 00:27:02,080
Speaker 3: getting tricks played on them at the zoo, you know

482
00:27:02,119 --> 00:27:03,880
Speaker 3: those people who do those magic tricks and then they

483
00:27:03,880 --> 00:27:05,920
Speaker 3: fall on the ground and like laugh their heads off,

484
00:27:05,960 --> 00:27:07,240
Speaker 3: Like I mean that's insane.

485
00:27:07,640 --> 00:27:07,920
Speaker 2: Yeah.

486
00:27:07,960 --> 00:27:10,200
Speaker 3: And then yeah, then you might be a little less

487
00:27:10,200 --> 00:27:12,800
Speaker 3: cavalier about cutting down their habitat if you know they're

488
00:27:12,800 --> 00:27:14,280
Speaker 3: in there like crying.

489
00:27:14,359 --> 00:27:14,719
Speaker 2: Yeah.

490
00:27:14,800 --> 00:27:18,680
Speaker 1: Yeah, absolutely, yeah, I mean like everything from them being

491
00:27:18,720 --> 00:27:23,600
Speaker 1: amused by things to demonstrating grief has all been documented.

492
00:27:23,800 --> 00:27:26,360
Speaker 1: I mean I think that yeah, and this is it's

493
00:27:26,400 --> 00:27:29,000
Speaker 1: definitely part of Jane Goodall's legacy. I think like she's

494
00:27:29,040 --> 00:27:32,639
Speaker 1: certainly not the only one to point out that animals

495
00:27:33,040 --> 00:27:35,199
Speaker 1: feel things in the same way that humans do, but

496
00:27:35,240 --> 00:27:37,359
Speaker 1: she was one of the one of the people that

497
00:27:37,440 --> 00:27:40,800
Speaker 1: really brought it to both the public's attention but also

498
00:27:40,920 --> 00:27:46,400
Speaker 1: introduce these ideas into you know, the scientific literature.

499
00:27:47,240 --> 00:27:51,560
Speaker 3: That makes me think of, you know, like the opposite

500
00:27:51,600 --> 00:27:54,720
Speaker 3: of that, like the opposite of that the part of

501
00:27:54,760 --> 00:27:57,000
Speaker 3: humanity that brings in a chimp to their house and

502
00:27:57,040 --> 00:27:59,840
Speaker 3: feeds them, makes them drink wine and smokes cigars, so

503
00:28:00,040 --> 00:28:01,200
Speaker 3: that it can go too far.

504
00:28:01,680 --> 00:28:05,800
Speaker 1: Humanizing chimps can go too far. Obviously, they're not pets,

505
00:28:06,760 --> 00:28:09,080
Speaker 1: and like Jane Goodle was also very clear about that

506
00:28:09,080 --> 00:28:11,879
Speaker 1: these are not These are not good pets. They're not

507
00:28:13,119 --> 00:28:15,320
Speaker 1: they Yeah, I mean, I think I think it's like this.

508
00:28:15,640 --> 00:28:17,080
Speaker 1: I talk about this a lot on the show, Like

509
00:28:17,160 --> 00:28:20,320
Speaker 1: sometimes we over anthropomorphize animals, like we assume they're just

510
00:28:20,440 --> 00:28:23,960
Speaker 1: like us, that their communication styles, their needs and their

511
00:28:23,960 --> 00:28:27,600
Speaker 1: wants and their emotional landscape is the same as ours,

512
00:28:27,960 --> 00:28:30,400
Speaker 1: or we just think they don't feel stuff at all

513
00:28:30,480 --> 00:28:33,080
Speaker 1: and that they're not at all like us, and it's like, obviously,

514
00:28:33,119 --> 00:28:35,239
Speaker 1: the truth is that, yes, they do feel things, they

515
00:28:35,240 --> 00:28:40,640
Speaker 1: do feel emotions, but they're they're not they're not humans.

516
00:28:40,840 --> 00:28:45,720
Speaker 1: They're not fluffy humans, right, they are chimpanzees or ant

517
00:28:45,720 --> 00:28:48,480
Speaker 1: eaters or you know, all these different animals have their

518
00:28:48,480 --> 00:28:52,960
Speaker 1: own their own needs, their own emotional landscapes, and you know,

519
00:28:53,120 --> 00:28:56,440
Speaker 1: we have to kind of like humble ourselves to understand them,

520
00:28:56,520 --> 00:28:59,320
Speaker 1: meet them where they're at. Not assume that we put

521
00:28:59,320 --> 00:29:01,600
Speaker 1: them in a little three piece suit and give them

522
00:29:01,600 --> 00:29:04,280
Speaker 1: a cigar that they're gonna be happy.

523
00:29:06,080 --> 00:29:07,560
Speaker 3: Yeah, don't make them capitalists.

524
00:29:09,000 --> 00:29:12,120
Speaker 1: Yeah, man, oh man, remember the remember the the uh

525
00:29:12,920 --> 00:29:14,920
Speaker 1: what was it the chimpin fts?

526
00:29:16,600 --> 00:29:17,840
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, yeah, for a minute.

527
00:29:17,920 --> 00:29:21,600
Speaker 1: Yeah, that was absurd, God, the worst artwork you've ever

528
00:29:21,640 --> 00:29:22,440
Speaker 1: seen in your life.

529
00:29:23,440 --> 00:29:24,840
Speaker 2: Yeah, it looked, it.

530
00:29:24,760 --> 00:29:28,120
Speaker 1: Looked worse than something that would have actually been drawn

531
00:29:28,240 --> 00:29:31,000
Speaker 1: by a chimpanzee. And that would actually be cool if

532
00:29:31,040 --> 00:29:31,720
Speaker 1: we could get some.

533
00:29:31,880 --> 00:29:35,800
Speaker 3: Yeah, imagine being one of the hapless owners of one

534
00:29:35,840 --> 00:29:38,400
Speaker 3: of those things because you fell for the marketing that

535
00:29:38,640 --> 00:29:41,680
Speaker 3: happened for ten minutes in twenty nineteen or whatever.

536
00:29:41,840 --> 00:29:43,600
Speaker 2: I weep many tears for.

537
00:29:44,840 --> 00:29:47,200
Speaker 3: Yeah, there's some people somewhere that paid a million dollars

538
00:29:47,280 --> 00:29:48,360
Speaker 3: or some digital picture.

539
00:29:48,680 --> 00:29:52,440
Speaker 1: I'm very sad for whoever paid a million dollars for

540
00:29:52,520 --> 00:29:54,960
Speaker 1: a digital picture of a chimpanzee And it's.

541
00:29:54,880 --> 00:29:57,640
Speaker 3: All Jimmy Fallons for Yeah, like most.

542
00:29:57,400 --> 00:29:59,960
Speaker 2: Things, everything is mm hmm.

543
00:30:00,080 --> 00:30:01,840
Speaker 1: Well, we're going to take a quick break and when

544
00:30:01,880 --> 00:30:04,240
Speaker 1: we get back, we're going to talk about some of

545
00:30:04,320 --> 00:30:08,720
Speaker 1: the cool discoveries that Jane Goodall made and then also

546
00:30:09,000 --> 00:30:15,440
Speaker 1: how that research led us to more recent observations and

547
00:30:15,480 --> 00:30:17,320
Speaker 1: findings about chimpanzees.

548
00:30:16,720 --> 00:30:19,680
Speaker 2: That are also really really cool cool.

549
00:30:20,240 --> 00:30:24,960
Speaker 1: So yeah, Jane Goodall really forced the field of primatology

550
00:30:25,000 --> 00:30:27,920
Speaker 1: to accept that chimpanzees fashion.

551
00:30:27,600 --> 00:30:28,360
Speaker 2: And use tools.

552
00:30:28,400 --> 00:30:32,400
Speaker 1: This is one of her huge contributions based on her

553
00:30:32,440 --> 00:30:38,120
Speaker 1: observations of them fishing for termites. So I'm sure people

554
00:30:38,120 --> 00:30:40,720
Speaker 1: who lived in the area had been making these observations

555
00:30:40,720 --> 00:30:45,280
Speaker 1: for a long time, but the field of primatology and

556
00:30:45,320 --> 00:30:50,400
Speaker 1: evolutionary biology did not necessarily widely accept this idea that

557
00:30:50,800 --> 00:30:53,880
Speaker 1: chimpanzees would make tools, and Jane Goodall kind of made

558
00:30:54,200 --> 00:30:57,880
Speaker 1: force them to with her observations. So she would see

559
00:30:57,920 --> 00:31:01,200
Speaker 1: them take like a twig, maybe a sturdy blade of

560
00:31:01,240 --> 00:31:05,880
Speaker 1: grass and stick it into termite mounds or rotting logs

561
00:31:06,360 --> 00:31:09,520
Speaker 1: and get at like fish out the termites pull it

562
00:31:09,560 --> 00:31:12,840
Speaker 1: out and like, you know, lick them off like it's

563
00:31:12,840 --> 00:31:14,040
Speaker 1: a little I don't know.

564
00:31:14,720 --> 00:31:17,080
Speaker 2: Little dipsticks or whatever, like fun dip.

565
00:31:17,200 --> 00:31:20,040
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, exactly, the stuff you stick the paddle in when.

566
00:31:19,880 --> 00:31:23,520
Speaker 1: You're Yeah, they don't make that anymore like kid sugar, Kids,

567
00:31:23,560 --> 00:31:26,760
Speaker 1: you're missing out. It was a somewhat flavorless white stick

568
00:31:26,840 --> 00:31:28,920
Speaker 1: and you'd lick it and stick it into a bag

569
00:31:29,040 --> 00:31:32,640
Speaker 1: of sugar and then lick it and it was good.

570
00:31:32,720 --> 00:31:37,240
Speaker 2: Fun just didn't make any sense. But they basically that.

571
00:31:37,200 --> 00:31:40,640
Speaker 3: I think it was called fun wasn't right. It was yeah,

572
00:31:40,720 --> 00:31:43,160
Speaker 3: like what a what a? What a like a very

573
00:31:43,240 --> 00:31:44,960
Speaker 3: unambitious candy went through.

574
00:31:44,920 --> 00:31:46,920
Speaker 2: Concept candy went through a weird phase.

575
00:31:47,600 --> 00:31:50,120
Speaker 3: And I don't understand why the paddle tasted like such ship.

576
00:31:50,760 --> 00:31:53,440
Speaker 3: Really the paddle was unnecessarily bland.

577
00:31:53,600 --> 00:31:56,240
Speaker 2: Yeah, it was bad. It was supposed to have a flavor,

578
00:31:56,240 --> 00:31:57,480
Speaker 2: but I never tasted it.

579
00:31:57,880 --> 00:32:00,480
Speaker 3: So those chips were using fun dip paddles to the.

580
00:32:01,280 --> 00:32:03,840
Speaker 1: Probably the twigs tasted better, but yeah, they were using

581
00:32:03,840 --> 00:32:06,760
Speaker 1: that to get at uh termite. So she published an

582
00:32:06,800 --> 00:32:10,040
Speaker 1: article called tool using and aimed throwing in a community

583
00:32:10,040 --> 00:32:14,800
Speaker 1: of free living chimpanzees in nineteen sixty four. So at

584
00:32:14,800 --> 00:32:18,320
Speaker 1: the time, it was difficult to get the larger scientific

585
00:32:18,320 --> 00:32:21,720
Speaker 1: community in the public to except that animals could use tools,

586
00:32:21,720 --> 00:32:23,760
Speaker 1: because for the longest time, there.

587
00:32:23,680 --> 00:32:24,880
Speaker 2: Was this idea that.

588
00:32:26,760 --> 00:32:29,800
Speaker 1: Human beings are different from animals, were unique because we

589
00:32:29,920 --> 00:32:34,400
Speaker 1: use tools. And this kind of you know, shattered this

590
00:32:34,520 --> 00:32:40,120
Speaker 1: idea that we were uniquely I mean, we are uniquely intelligent,

591
00:32:40,280 --> 00:32:45,120
Speaker 1: I would say, like we we obviously have a.

592
00:32:44,160 --> 00:32:45,720
Speaker 2: Lot of evidence of that.

593
00:32:47,000 --> 00:32:50,760
Speaker 1: Maybe not always, but like, but tool use is certainly

594
00:32:50,800 --> 00:32:53,320
Speaker 1: not the thing that makes us human, right, And that

595
00:32:53,480 --> 00:33:00,240
Speaker 1: was like an idea before dispelled that idea, And so,

596
00:33:00,440 --> 00:33:05,480
Speaker 1: like I said earlier, she also dispelled the notion that

597
00:33:05,720 --> 00:33:07,320
Speaker 1: chimpanzees were vegetarians.

598
00:33:07,360 --> 00:33:08,680
Speaker 2: They're actually omnivores.

599
00:33:09,360 --> 00:33:12,120
Speaker 1: They eat meat when they can get at it, and

600
00:33:12,120 --> 00:33:16,840
Speaker 1: they actively hunt for it. So so now, like with

601
00:33:16,960 --> 00:33:20,560
Speaker 1: both of these these paradigm shifts that Jane Goodall was

602
00:33:21,440 --> 00:33:23,840
Speaker 1: more or less responsible for, we have a lot of

603
00:33:24,040 --> 00:33:28,760
Speaker 1: really cool observations. So one is that chimpanzees use tools

604
00:33:28,760 --> 00:33:34,560
Speaker 1: in their hunting. So this was an observation of the

605
00:33:34,600 --> 00:33:38,280
Speaker 1: Fongoli site in Senegal, So this is a different site

606
00:33:38,920 --> 00:33:42,600
Speaker 1: from Jane Goodall's research. But again, like she was so

607
00:33:42,680 --> 00:33:47,920
Speaker 1: influential that you know that there are now you know,

608
00:33:47,960 --> 00:33:51,800
Speaker 1: all these other different observations at all these other different sites,

609
00:33:51,840 --> 00:33:55,640
Speaker 1: which is really also interesting because different sites, different groups

610
00:33:55,680 --> 00:33:59,800
Speaker 1: of chimpanzees in different countries, different national parks, have different

611
00:34:00,120 --> 00:34:01,240
Speaker 1: tool use behaviors.

612
00:34:01,360 --> 00:34:03,600
Speaker 3: Yeah, they wear different and they wore different cuts of

613
00:34:03,640 --> 00:34:04,680
Speaker 3: their pants and stuff.

614
00:34:04,840 --> 00:34:08,359
Speaker 1: Essentially essentially it's like that, It is like that if

615
00:34:08,400 --> 00:34:10,440
Speaker 1: they if they could wear pants, it would be like that,

616
00:34:10,480 --> 00:34:13,520
Speaker 1: Like they have different styles of doing things different.

617
00:34:14,360 --> 00:34:17,200
Speaker 3: Whereas bell bottoms, the other ones were Bible wols exactly.

618
00:34:17,239 --> 00:34:20,239
Speaker 1: They're all they're all antless, they're all they all are

619
00:34:20,239 --> 00:34:23,480
Speaker 1: missing the butt so that they can do chimp stuff.

620
00:34:24,360 --> 00:34:26,520
Speaker 2: But like the so they were.

621
00:34:27,719 --> 00:34:33,200
Speaker 1: These these chimpanzees in Senegal were observed to fashion tools

622
00:34:33,200 --> 00:34:38,640
Speaker 1: made out of branches, but not to hunt for termites,

623
00:34:38,680 --> 00:34:41,799
Speaker 1: not to fish for termites, but actually to hunt for meat.

624
00:34:42,120 --> 00:34:44,600
Speaker 1: So what they would do is they would take these branches,

625
00:34:44,600 --> 00:34:47,440
Speaker 1: they would strip them of their leaves, trim the ends,

626
00:34:47,520 --> 00:34:50,320
Speaker 1: and then go to like a tree where they would

627
00:34:50,840 --> 00:34:54,680
Speaker 1: know that a tasty tree is hiding inside. And this

628
00:34:54,760 --> 00:34:57,160
Speaker 1: tasty tree is very very cute. One of my favorite

629
00:34:57,160 --> 00:34:59,560
Speaker 1: animals growing up actually called.

630
00:34:59,360 --> 00:35:00,880
Speaker 2: A bush base be uh.

631
00:35:01,320 --> 00:35:04,200
Speaker 1: I actually I actually received a stuffed bush baby for

632
00:35:04,400 --> 00:35:07,760
Speaker 1: Christmas once, and I fell in love with them. They're

633
00:35:07,880 --> 00:35:08,720
Speaker 1: very very cute.

634
00:35:09,560 --> 00:35:09,680
Speaker 4: Uh.

635
00:35:09,800 --> 00:35:14,280
Speaker 1: They're also apparently delicious for chimpanzees. They're they're they themselves

636
00:35:14,320 --> 00:35:17,719
Speaker 1: are very small primate, but this does not matter. The

637
00:35:17,840 --> 00:35:21,120
Speaker 1: relatedness earns them no favors from the chimpanzees. So they

638
00:35:21,200 --> 00:35:23,600
Speaker 1: use the sticks to like flush like kind of flush

639
00:35:23,680 --> 00:35:27,400
Speaker 1: them out of these these crevices in these trees, and

640
00:35:27,440 --> 00:35:29,319
Speaker 1: then they hunt them and they eat them. So they're

641
00:35:29,440 --> 00:35:33,360
Speaker 1: using tools to hunt for meat, which is both really

642
00:35:33,400 --> 00:35:35,920
Speaker 1: cool and also a little sad when you see a

643
00:35:35,920 --> 00:35:37,400
Speaker 1: picture of a bush baby, because.

644
00:35:37,239 --> 00:35:39,239
Speaker 3: I'm looking up a bush baby right now. Yeah, they're

645
00:35:39,280 --> 00:35:44,680
Speaker 3: they're very cute, baby.

646
00:35:44,200 --> 00:35:46,840
Speaker 2: No, I mean, but oh oh yeah.

647
00:35:47,480 --> 00:35:49,319
Speaker 3: Oh my gosh, they're very cute. They look like.

648
00:35:49,960 --> 00:35:53,279
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, I mean the lemurs are also primates, you know,

649
00:35:53,280 --> 00:35:54,320
Speaker 1: it's they're similar.

650
00:35:55,440 --> 00:35:58,239
Speaker 3: Oh, they're so cute. They've got eyes like those those

651
00:35:58,239 --> 00:35:59,719
Speaker 3: little kids and those paintings by.

652
00:35:59,640 --> 00:36:03,560
Speaker 1: That Yeah, the big eyed kids. Yeah yeah, yeah, they

653
00:36:03,600 --> 00:36:04,560
Speaker 1: have giant eyes.

654
00:36:04,800 --> 00:36:05,520
Speaker 3: That's terrible.

655
00:36:05,719 --> 00:36:08,720
Speaker 2: Those chimps should quit quit well, you know, I mean.

656
00:36:09,120 --> 00:36:11,600
Speaker 3: Jane Goodall should have stepped in and been like that's enough.

657
00:36:11,440 --> 00:36:13,400
Speaker 1: We're not they got they got They don't got like

658
00:36:13,440 --> 00:36:17,840
Speaker 1: a McDonald's there though, so they can get bush baby burgers.

659
00:36:17,840 --> 00:36:19,120
Speaker 2: So they got to do it themselves.

660
00:36:19,400 --> 00:36:22,040
Speaker 3: So they like take these like they strip these these

661
00:36:22,080 --> 00:36:23,759
Speaker 3: sticks and stick them down in the tree.

662
00:36:23,840 --> 00:36:26,879
Speaker 1: Yeah, and like because like the exactly the bush baby

663
00:36:26,880 --> 00:36:28,880
Speaker 1: will be hiding in the crevice of the tree, and

664
00:36:28,880 --> 00:36:31,239
Speaker 1: then the like they use them as like to root

665
00:36:31,320 --> 00:36:33,279
Speaker 1: them out to get them out of there.

666
00:36:34,920 --> 00:36:35,240
Speaker 2: Yeah.

667
00:36:35,760 --> 00:36:38,680
Speaker 1: A less uh, a less disturbing tool use is that

668
00:36:38,719 --> 00:36:40,920
Speaker 1: they like to make sponges.

669
00:36:41,040 --> 00:36:43,360
Speaker 2: So they will use leaves.

670
00:36:43,040 --> 00:36:46,400
Speaker 1: Sometimes moss and kind of like bundle it up so

671
00:36:46,480 --> 00:36:48,200
Speaker 1: it's a sponge and they use it. They dip it

672
00:36:48,239 --> 00:36:51,400
Speaker 1: into like pools of water so that they can drink it.

673
00:36:51,440 --> 00:36:53,680
Speaker 1: They can drink water in other ways, but they do

674
00:36:53,800 --> 00:36:58,359
Speaker 1: like to use this technique, particularly because it allows them,

675
00:36:58,840 --> 00:37:00,839
Speaker 1: like there's a lot of pools water that like has

676
00:37:01,360 --> 00:37:03,600
Speaker 1: minerals and stuff that might be kind of hard to

677
00:37:03,640 --> 00:37:06,240
Speaker 1: slurp up when it's a really shallow pool, So they'll

678
00:37:06,360 --> 00:37:08,920
Speaker 1: stick the sponge in that little pool and then like

679
00:37:09,040 --> 00:37:14,399
Speaker 1: suck out the juices. And a lot of chimpanzees use

680
00:37:14,760 --> 00:37:19,720
Speaker 1: sponges and it's a behavior noticed across different chimpanzee troops,

681
00:37:19,960 --> 00:37:22,719
Speaker 1: but this is an example where based on the troop,

682
00:37:22,800 --> 00:37:23,840
Speaker 1: they might do it differently.

683
00:37:23,960 --> 00:37:24,680
Speaker 2: So like in.

684
00:37:24,880 --> 00:37:30,960
Speaker 1: Wow, researchers have actually observed them changing their type of

685
00:37:31,000 --> 00:37:33,960
Speaker 1: sponge if one of them figures out a better way,

686
00:37:34,080 --> 00:37:37,120
Speaker 1: like maybe uses more moss or something, and then the

687
00:37:37,160 --> 00:37:39,520
Speaker 1: rest of the chimpanzees are like, oh, that looks pretty good.

688
00:37:39,840 --> 00:37:42,799
Speaker 1: The sponge looks pretty great, and they'll start doing it too.

689
00:37:42,840 --> 00:37:46,880
Speaker 1: And so we've actually seen in real time chimpanzees developed

690
00:37:46,960 --> 00:37:51,359
Speaker 1: like a specific culture, a sponge culture. It's I mean,

691
00:37:51,640 --> 00:37:55,280
Speaker 1: you know again, humans, like we go through phases where

692
00:37:55,320 --> 00:37:59,160
Speaker 1: like everyone's having Stanley cups right like where we're like, oh,

693
00:37:59,239 --> 00:38:02,799
Speaker 1: this vessel for drinking beverages is really.

694
00:38:02,520 --> 00:38:06,799
Speaker 2: In right now. Remember when everyone Stanley mode? And then

695
00:38:07,080 --> 00:38:10,760
Speaker 2: now everyone has like like what are they called? Like ooh, Wallas.

696
00:38:11,040 --> 00:38:14,000
Speaker 1: I'm not I'm actually not super up to date on

697
00:38:14,880 --> 00:38:19,440
Speaker 1: uh water bottle culture anymore, but like we do the

698
00:38:19,480 --> 00:38:22,600
Speaker 1: same thing where like there's a trendy thing to drink

699
00:38:22,640 --> 00:38:26,080
Speaker 1: water in and that seems like a weird thing to

700
00:38:26,120 --> 00:38:30,440
Speaker 1: be trendy, but it happens and we like it instead

701
00:38:30,440 --> 00:38:32,439
Speaker 1: of chimpanzees, Like we're the same.

702
00:38:33,480 --> 00:38:35,399
Speaker 3: Yeah, because if you go to a thrift store now,

703
00:38:36,120 --> 00:38:39,880
Speaker 3: like the whole place is just whatever water bottle it used.

704
00:38:39,719 --> 00:38:40,600
Speaker 2: To be exactly.

705
00:38:40,760 --> 00:38:44,560
Speaker 3: There's a kind of ruined thrift stores because it's seriously

706
00:38:44,600 --> 00:38:48,120
Speaker 3: wall to wall whatever cup went out of fashion.

707
00:38:48,280 --> 00:38:50,080
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, that's the Yeah.

708
00:38:49,920 --> 00:38:52,399
Speaker 3: Like hundreds of them, and no one buys them because

709
00:38:52,400 --> 00:38:55,279
Speaker 3: they're all like vaguely afraid that they have germs on them.

710
00:38:55,440 --> 00:38:58,800
Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, no, I mean it's and also like sometimes

711
00:38:58,800 --> 00:39:01,080
Speaker 1: there's scares of like, oh, don't want this water bottle

712
00:39:01,080 --> 00:39:04,239
Speaker 1: because it actually has lead in it, or it's got

713
00:39:04,239 --> 00:39:07,840
Speaker 1: a plastic in it that's gonna sit and sit inside

714
00:39:07,840 --> 00:39:08,920
Speaker 1: your testicles forever.

715
00:39:09,440 --> 00:39:12,760
Speaker 3: So we I think chimps would probably be like, listen,

716
00:39:13,640 --> 00:39:17,920
Speaker 3: we don't need these cup updates. Yeah, but like we

717
00:39:17,960 --> 00:39:19,560
Speaker 3: need these sponge Yeah.

718
00:39:19,480 --> 00:39:22,279
Speaker 1: Unless it's a new sponge, they'll be like cup updates now,

719
00:39:22,560 --> 00:39:25,279
Speaker 1: like that's stupid, But a new sponge tell me.

720
00:39:25,280 --> 00:39:28,160
Speaker 3: More, right, and that makes sense.

721
00:39:28,239 --> 00:39:28,520
Speaker 2: Yeah.

722
00:39:28,560 --> 00:39:31,759
Speaker 1: One of the this is my favorite story of a

723
00:39:32,120 --> 00:39:36,399
Speaker 1: chimpanzee tool use it's actually not a wild chimp. It's

724
00:39:36,440 --> 00:39:39,000
Speaker 1: in a it's a behavior that was displayed by a

725
00:39:39,000 --> 00:39:41,680
Speaker 1: captive chimp, and it actually makes a lot of sense

726
00:39:41,920 --> 00:39:43,839
Speaker 1: that he would do this given that he was at

727
00:39:43,880 --> 00:39:47,960
Speaker 1: a zoo. Now I'm not anti zoo. I think that

728
00:39:47,960 --> 00:39:50,840
Speaker 1: there are a lot of zoos. I'm obviously anti roadside

729
00:39:50,920 --> 00:39:53,279
Speaker 1: zoo or non accredited zoo where they're not treating the

730
00:39:53,280 --> 00:39:55,879
Speaker 1: animals well, and they're not they don't care about conservation

731
00:39:56,040 --> 00:39:59,480
Speaker 1: and it's all about just extracting entertainment from the animals.

732
00:39:59,560 --> 00:40:03,320
Speaker 1: That's terrible and it does happen to chimpanzees and it's awful.

733
00:40:04,160 --> 00:40:08,080
Speaker 1: There are a lot of zoos that are very much

734
00:40:08,120 --> 00:40:15,719
Speaker 1: focused on rehabilitation, on conservation, and on making sure that

735
00:40:15,800 --> 00:40:21,200
Speaker 1: they have sufficient resources for their animals. It's never completely

736
00:40:21,239 --> 00:40:23,960
Speaker 1: ideal though, right Like animals, behavior is always going to

737
00:40:24,000 --> 00:40:26,279
Speaker 1: be different in a zoo, So any observations you make

738
00:40:26,280 --> 00:40:29,600
Speaker 1: of animal behaviors and a zoo is not necessarily going

739
00:40:29,680 --> 00:40:32,320
Speaker 1: to tell you a lot about what they.

740
00:40:32,200 --> 00:40:33,960
Speaker 2: Do in the wild, but it does tell you what

741
00:40:34,000 --> 00:40:34,920
Speaker 2: they're capable of.

742
00:40:35,040 --> 00:40:37,200
Speaker 1: This is what's kind of interesting to me. It tells

743
00:40:37,200 --> 00:40:40,759
Speaker 1: you what their minds are capable of. Doesn't necessarily show

744
00:40:40,760 --> 00:40:44,800
Speaker 1: you natural behavior, but it shows you what their range

745
00:40:44,800 --> 00:40:48,200
Speaker 1: of potential behavior could be given the right circumstances. So

746
00:40:48,520 --> 00:40:52,520
Speaker 1: this is the story of Santino, a chimp at the

747
00:40:52,560 --> 00:40:53,600
Speaker 1: Swedish Zoo.

748
00:40:54,920 --> 00:40:56,440
Speaker 2: Who decided to take.

749
00:40:56,320 --> 00:41:02,000
Speaker 1: Revenge against onlookers against a zoo visitors. We don't know

750
00:41:02,040 --> 00:41:06,880
Speaker 1: why he wanted vengeance. It could have just been because

751
00:41:06,920 --> 00:41:09,840
Speaker 1: he thought it would be funny. We really don't know.

752
00:41:10,000 --> 00:41:11,440
Speaker 1: It could be as simple as that he thought it

753
00:41:11,480 --> 00:41:13,799
Speaker 1: was a fun game to do this. But what he

754
00:41:13,920 --> 00:41:22,800
Speaker 1: did was premeditated assault on zoo visitors by collecting rocks

755
00:41:23,320 --> 00:41:26,400
Speaker 1: of a very specific sort of like parameter of like

756
00:41:26,840 --> 00:41:29,400
Speaker 1: I can throw this, it's a nice projectile. So he

757
00:41:29,440 --> 00:41:34,680
Speaker 1: would carefully select AMMO and then gather it in a

758
00:41:34,719 --> 00:41:38,640
Speaker 1: pile and like chill out until the zoo visitors came.

759
00:41:39,200 --> 00:41:40,920
Speaker 1: And then when they would get close enough, he'd go

760
00:41:40,960 --> 00:41:44,000
Speaker 1: to his pile, pick one out and run out of

761
00:41:44,040 --> 00:41:46,200
Speaker 1: them and check it at them and try to hit

762
00:41:46,360 --> 00:41:54,279
Speaker 1: these these zoop visitors. So zookeepers had a unfortunately, like

763
00:41:54,320 --> 00:41:57,080
Speaker 1: you know, obviously you have to be careful in terms

764
00:41:57,080 --> 00:41:59,880
Speaker 1: of warning the public, like okay, you could get hit

765
00:41:59,880 --> 00:42:03,560
Speaker 1: with a rock, so please don't get too close. But

766
00:42:03,840 --> 00:42:08,759
Speaker 1: despite the zookeeper's mourning visitors, Santino still enjoyed doing this,

767
00:42:08,920 --> 00:42:11,719
Speaker 1: so he would make hundreds of these rock piles over

768
00:42:11,719 --> 00:42:16,520
Speaker 1: the years, and he he would even start collecting things

769
00:42:16,520 --> 00:42:18,719
Speaker 1: like chunks of concrete that he would find if it

770
00:42:18,760 --> 00:42:22,200
Speaker 1: was the right size and shape, and really give it

771
00:42:22,239 --> 00:42:23,960
Speaker 1: a go, like really.

772
00:42:23,640 --> 00:42:26,880
Speaker 2: Try to nail these zoo visitors.

773
00:42:27,520 --> 00:42:30,359
Speaker 1: And when they would observe him, what was interesting was

774
00:42:30,640 --> 00:42:35,160
Speaker 1: like it was all very calm and premeditated beforehand, so

775
00:42:35,239 --> 00:42:38,399
Speaker 1: like he would find the rocks, he was selective about

776
00:42:38,440 --> 00:42:41,399
Speaker 1: what rocks he would use. He would like gather them

777
00:42:41,400 --> 00:42:46,040
Speaker 1: in a you know, convenient pile. Then when he would

778
00:42:46,040 --> 00:42:48,880
Speaker 1: throw the rocks, he would display sort of a typical

779
00:42:48,960 --> 00:42:54,279
Speaker 1: chimpanzee aggression body language like I'm angry, I'm mad at you.

780
00:42:54,960 --> 00:42:57,280
Speaker 2: But it's also like but he it was all.

781
00:42:57,960 --> 00:43:01,480
Speaker 1: Very calmly and coolly premeditated, like he would collect the rocks, and.

782
00:43:01,400 --> 00:43:03,760
Speaker 2: He was just like, oh, here's a good.

783
00:43:03,640 --> 00:43:08,360
Speaker 1: One for trying to nail Nancy from accounting that I

784
00:43:08,400 --> 00:43:09,600
Speaker 1: see comes to the zoo too.

785
00:43:09,960 --> 00:43:12,600
Speaker 3: So did they so did they get did they Did

786
00:43:12,640 --> 00:43:13,680
Speaker 3: he hurt anybody?

787
00:43:14,040 --> 00:43:14,959
Speaker 2: I don't he never.

788
00:43:15,440 --> 00:43:19,560
Speaker 1: I don't think he ever like actually seriously hurt anyone.

789
00:43:19,680 --> 00:43:23,799
Speaker 2: But he tried. He wanted to the desire was there

790
00:43:24,360 --> 00:43:25,359
Speaker 2: and so did that?

791
00:43:25,640 --> 00:43:28,760
Speaker 3: Was that? Was that? Did that? Was that surprising to people?

792
00:43:28,920 --> 00:43:33,080
Speaker 1: Yes, because this was a case where it's an observation of.

793
00:43:34,480 --> 00:43:36,880
Speaker 2: It's not so much the tool use that it was surprising.

794
00:43:37,040 --> 00:43:41,200
Speaker 1: It was that he made a plan, right, a mischief,

795
00:43:41,440 --> 00:43:44,920
Speaker 1: a plan of mischief long in advance, and he did

796
00:43:44,960 --> 00:43:50,239
Speaker 1: it with it this like kind of calm premeditation. That

797
00:43:51,000 --> 00:43:53,480
Speaker 1: was I think it's like, you know, so like it

798
00:43:53,560 --> 00:43:57,080
Speaker 1: was a premeditated crime. We've never really seen a premeditated

799
00:43:57,120 --> 00:44:02,680
Speaker 1: crime so closely observed and chimpanzees, but you know, it

800
00:44:03,280 --> 00:44:06,759
Speaker 1: was something where it was a pretty clear demonstration that

801
00:44:07,200 --> 00:44:11,680
Speaker 1: he could make a plan, he could think through the plan, right,

802
00:44:11,760 --> 00:44:15,439
Speaker 1: Like he selected rocks based on things he could reasonably throw.

803
00:44:15,520 --> 00:44:18,200
Speaker 1: It wasn't like he would get something too small or

804
00:44:18,200 --> 00:44:21,400
Speaker 1: too large. They're all kind of this like perfect size

805
00:44:21,440 --> 00:44:27,520
Speaker 1: for throwing. Also that he was calculating the distance right like, ah,

806
00:44:27,560 --> 00:44:30,319
Speaker 1: this is a rock that could actually make it far enough, right,

807
00:44:30,400 --> 00:44:33,839
Speaker 1: Like if he had like a stick or a smaller rock,

808
00:44:33,880 --> 00:44:35,880
Speaker 1: it's not going to make it that far. And then

809
00:44:35,920 --> 00:44:38,080
Speaker 1: he also wouldn't choose things that were too big for

810
00:44:38,200 --> 00:44:40,080
Speaker 1: him to throw, So he was like, these are the

811
00:44:40,160 --> 00:44:43,200
Speaker 1: right sides projectiles that I'm estimating are going to reach

812
00:44:43,840 --> 00:44:49,279
Speaker 1: the zoo visitors, collecting them in advance, having them in

813
00:44:49,400 --> 00:44:53,560
Speaker 1: convenient caches, so when he sees someone that pisses him off,

814
00:44:54,000 --> 00:44:54,680
Speaker 1: he can like.

815
00:44:55,280 --> 00:44:56,440
Speaker 2: Easily access it.

816
00:44:56,520 --> 00:44:59,319
Speaker 1: This is all like this, like planning and premeditation that

817
00:45:00,360 --> 00:45:02,000
Speaker 1: it makes sense that chimps.

818
00:45:01,680 --> 00:45:02,759
Speaker 2: Are capable of doing.

819
00:45:02,800 --> 00:45:06,000
Speaker 1: But we like, this is one of the clearer examples

820
00:45:06,200 --> 00:45:08,640
Speaker 1: of one of them doing it, and.

821
00:45:08,800 --> 00:45:10,399
Speaker 3: You know, yeah, I want to see this. I want

822
00:45:10,440 --> 00:45:12,359
Speaker 3: to see this happen now. I want to go see him.

823
00:45:12,480 --> 00:45:14,160
Speaker 3: I want to see who he picked and whether he

824
00:45:14,200 --> 00:45:18,080
Speaker 3: picked people with like glasses, washy eyebrows, or hats or whatever.

825
00:45:18,360 --> 00:45:20,799
Speaker 1: He hated the Mets, anyone that had a Mets hat

826
00:45:21,080 --> 00:45:24,719
Speaker 1: right right, wonder But yeah.

827
00:45:24,440 --> 00:45:26,000
Speaker 2: I don't know Sweeterish sports.

828
00:45:26,320 --> 00:45:32,080
Speaker 1: Yeah, so he uh yeah. It was an amazing observation

829
00:45:32,160 --> 00:45:36,879
Speaker 1: of a chimpanzee planning. And again we were not really

830
00:45:36,920 --> 00:45:39,520
Speaker 1: sure why he did it, like it could it could

831
00:45:39,560 --> 00:45:44,239
Speaker 1: be aggression or I mean, obviously it was aggressive. It

832
00:45:44,280 --> 00:45:47,040
Speaker 1: could be something where he felt defensive or he didn't

833
00:45:47,239 --> 00:45:49,839
Speaker 1: like people. It could also be because he thought it

834
00:45:49,880 --> 00:45:53,200
Speaker 1: was funny, like honestly, I'm not even making a joke, right,

835
00:45:53,280 --> 00:45:56,160
Speaker 1: Like he might have been bored and it was like,

836
00:45:56,200 --> 00:45:58,560
Speaker 1: this is funny when I like throw things. I watched

837
00:45:58,560 --> 00:46:03,040
Speaker 1: people like run Away. I think zoos can be quite

838
00:46:03,080 --> 00:46:07,360
Speaker 1: like one of the more dangerous perils for animals in

839
00:46:07,880 --> 00:46:12,360
Speaker 1: nice zoos is boredom, and so a lot of zoos

840
00:46:12,400 --> 00:46:15,560
Speaker 1: try their best to offer enrichment to their animals, so

841
00:46:15,680 --> 00:46:23,080
Speaker 1: like toys, games, play areas natural puzzles for them to solve,

842
00:46:23,120 --> 00:46:25,719
Speaker 1: like things for them to do that kind of mimics

843
00:46:26,000 --> 00:46:28,239
Speaker 1: the types of problem solving that they have to do

844
00:46:28,280 --> 00:46:33,400
Speaker 1: in the wild. But obviously they can't they can't completely

845
00:46:33,480 --> 00:46:35,719
Speaker 1: compensate for the fact that it's a limited area. It's

846
00:46:35,719 --> 00:46:39,239
Speaker 1: a zoo, it's not actually in wild with all the

847
00:46:39,280 --> 00:46:41,800
Speaker 1: different sort of variables that being out in the wild brings.

848
00:46:41,880 --> 00:46:46,640
Speaker 1: So occasionally you'll get an animal who's bored. And in

849
00:46:46,640 --> 00:46:51,359
Speaker 1: this case, I think Santino was like figured out how

850
00:46:51,360 --> 00:46:55,120
Speaker 1: to keep himself amused, and it was by terrorizing people.

851
00:46:56,120 --> 00:46:57,880
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean that's when I go to the zoo.

852
00:46:57,960 --> 00:47:01,879
Speaker 3: If there's ever anything I think about, it's usually I mean,

853
00:47:02,760 --> 00:47:05,279
Speaker 3: I haven't I mean the zoo. I'm thinking about the

854
00:47:05,360 --> 00:47:08,200
Speaker 3: Nashville zoo or or you know zoos that are pretty

855
00:47:08,239 --> 00:47:10,680
Speaker 3: pretty nice, you know, and you just worry about the

856
00:47:10,719 --> 00:47:12,759
Speaker 3: animals being born. I mean, that's that's the thing I

857
00:47:12,760 --> 00:47:14,919
Speaker 3: think of the most, you know, I mean, because they've

858
00:47:14,960 --> 00:47:17,239
Speaker 3: just they have checked out every square inch of their

859
00:47:17,440 --> 00:47:20,640
Speaker 3: you know, quote unquote habitat. Yeah, and then they're like,

860
00:47:20,719 --> 00:47:22,120
Speaker 3: let's throw some rocks these people.

861
00:47:23,000 --> 00:47:23,560
Speaker 2: Exactly.

862
00:47:25,160 --> 00:47:27,719
Speaker 1: It's a genuine problem and you have like the like

863
00:47:28,400 --> 00:47:31,680
Speaker 1: intelligent animals in a zoo, and I think zoos do

864
00:47:31,760 --> 00:47:36,280
Speaker 1: their best to address it. But yeah, I mean sometimes

865
00:47:36,719 --> 00:47:38,919
Speaker 1: Champanzee is just gonna be like, all right, I'm sick

866
00:47:38,960 --> 00:47:42,080
Speaker 1: of your these puzzles that you're giving me. Like, I

867
00:47:42,120 --> 00:47:46,440
Speaker 1: think what would be really fun is some uh some

868
00:47:47,040 --> 00:47:49,920
Speaker 1: projectile rock throwing and uh yep.

869
00:47:50,800 --> 00:47:52,319
Speaker 3: I wonder if any of the zoo keepers tried to

870
00:47:52,320 --> 00:47:55,320
Speaker 3: get in there and switch out the piles of rocks

871
00:47:55,360 --> 00:47:57,400
Speaker 3: for like a you know, a pile of banas.

872
00:47:59,480 --> 00:48:02,160
Speaker 1: Then he'd learned, he'd probably learned that's like a currency

873
00:48:02,200 --> 00:48:07,480
Speaker 1: to get bananas. Uh yeah, you know, many knows then

874
00:48:07,520 --> 00:48:12,839
Speaker 1: he knows he can extort them, you would think. Unfortunately,

875
00:48:12,840 --> 00:48:16,360
Speaker 1: I wish, we I wish we couldn't. Unfortunately we often

876
00:48:16,400 --> 00:48:20,200
Speaker 1: do that's they're threatened. But yeah, I mean, you know,

877
00:48:20,760 --> 00:48:25,319
Speaker 1: real smart, so yeah, I mean, uh again, just uh,

878
00:48:26,840 --> 00:48:32,000
Speaker 1: Jane Goodall really like was I think just I think

879
00:48:32,320 --> 00:48:34,400
Speaker 1: what I love about her is she's she was just

880
00:48:34,960 --> 00:48:38,120
Speaker 1: she was an animal lover, and that was like her

881
00:48:38,160 --> 00:48:44,480
Speaker 1: main her main thing. Like she was obviously of unique

882
00:48:44,520 --> 00:48:52,600
Speaker 1: intelligence and patience and persistence, so she was a remarkable individual.

883
00:48:53,719 --> 00:48:57,839
Speaker 1: But she also she also was kind of like us, right,

884
00:48:58,120 --> 00:49:02,120
Speaker 1: someone who just loves animals and and then made mineral

885
00:49:02,239 --> 00:49:03,120
Speaker 1: life about that.

886
00:49:04,120 --> 00:49:07,040
Speaker 3: It's not like everybody could, you know. I think people

887
00:49:07,120 --> 00:49:10,880
Speaker 3: like Grizzly Man probably may have been inspired by someone

888
00:49:10,880 --> 00:49:13,759
Speaker 3: like Jane Goodall, but he didn't have the the right

889
00:49:13,800 --> 00:49:17,759
Speaker 3: temperament for it. He was too manic. Yeah, Like, uh,

890
00:49:17,920 --> 00:49:21,680
Speaker 3: you know, I think that's I always think about that

891
00:49:21,800 --> 00:49:24,240
Speaker 3: documentary when I think about people trying to live with animals,

892
00:49:24,280 --> 00:49:26,080
Speaker 3: you know, and I feel bad for that guy because

893
00:49:26,080 --> 00:49:30,120
Speaker 3: he just I think he was motivated by by something,

894
00:49:30,440 --> 00:49:33,600
Speaker 3: probably sweet, but he was His energy was like it's

895
00:49:33,640 --> 00:49:35,759
Speaker 3: like me going in to feed my sister's cats, Like

896
00:49:35,880 --> 00:49:38,520
Speaker 3: I don't, I don't like now I'm kind of afraid

897
00:49:38,520 --> 00:49:41,760
Speaker 3: of him, and I can't really like because one time,

898
00:49:42,600 --> 00:49:45,760
Speaker 3: Polly like really went off and hissed at me like crazy,

899
00:49:46,239 --> 00:49:49,120
Speaker 3: and I was like like, I just now I'm a

900
00:49:49,160 --> 00:49:51,120
Speaker 3: little bit scared, and so like it makes.

901
00:49:51,080 --> 00:49:52,880
Speaker 2: She and she's just like fear now.

902
00:49:53,320 --> 00:49:54,920
Speaker 3: Yeah, and she's just like kind of a bit of

903
00:49:54,960 --> 00:49:58,279
Speaker 3: a bully. I mean she's really Also whenever I'm there,

904
00:49:58,360 --> 00:50:02,319
Speaker 3: it's because the cats are already mad, because because they

905
00:50:02,400 --> 00:50:04,919
Speaker 3: are pissed at my sister for going away, so they're

906
00:50:04,920 --> 00:50:07,040
Speaker 3: already mad at me. Just like we know what you are.

907
00:50:07,200 --> 00:50:08,920
Speaker 3: We know you're the guy who brings us some food,

908
00:50:08,960 --> 00:50:12,680
Speaker 3: but so what we're still pissed and and so you know,

909
00:50:12,719 --> 00:50:16,520
Speaker 3: you better be And I respond to that not in

910
00:50:16,600 --> 00:50:19,799
Speaker 3: a in a you know, a levelheadedche So I would

911
00:50:19,880 --> 00:50:21,920
Speaker 3: imagine that I get I get nervous, and so I

912
00:50:21,960 --> 00:50:30,839
Speaker 3: think that you know, to have a temperamentally.

913
00:50:28,520 --> 00:50:31,239
Speaker 1: While also being respectful of the fact that you're around

914
00:50:31,320 --> 00:50:32,360
Speaker 1: a powerful animal.

915
00:50:32,840 --> 00:50:35,640
Speaker 2: I think that, I mean, yeah, like the I think.

916
00:50:35,520 --> 00:50:43,200
Speaker 1: She she saw the chimpanzees as individuals with feelings and personalities.

917
00:50:43,760 --> 00:50:46,680
Speaker 1: She did not see them as human beings right Like

918
00:50:46,760 --> 00:50:50,439
Speaker 1: she wasn't like, this is a person who is going

919
00:50:50,480 --> 00:50:55,640
Speaker 1: to have the same reactions to things as a person

920
00:50:55,680 --> 00:50:58,680
Speaker 1: would write like she didn't, she didn't underestimate, she didn't

921
00:50:58,719 --> 00:51:03,600
Speaker 1: underestimate them, she respect acted there there being uh, wild

922
00:51:03,640 --> 00:51:07,640
Speaker 1: animals always, which I think was important, right, Like if

923
00:51:07,920 --> 00:51:11,600
Speaker 1: it's it's what it's what makes the difference between someone

924
00:51:11,760 --> 00:51:16,239
Speaker 1: like uh, Chain goodall and then like you know, I

925
00:51:16,280 --> 00:51:18,560
Speaker 1: don't even want I mean, Tiger King's kind of a

926
00:51:18,560 --> 00:51:23,440
Speaker 1: different like you're you're, you're, you're a guy. The King's

927
00:51:23,800 --> 00:51:25,520
Speaker 1: he just sees them as objects.

928
00:51:25,520 --> 00:51:26,000
Speaker 2: He doesn't.

929
00:51:26,320 --> 00:51:27,920
Speaker 3: Yeah, he's just he's.

930
00:51:27,800 --> 00:51:29,120
Speaker 2: Just he's just a huge shirt.

931
00:51:29,160 --> 00:51:31,839
Speaker 1: But but like no, like the grizzly guy like that

932
00:51:32,080 --> 00:51:35,200
Speaker 1: you're talking about, he thought he could kind of live

933
00:51:35,239 --> 00:51:43,040
Speaker 1: among bears, underestimated that bears are very dangerous and uh,

934
00:51:43,160 --> 00:51:47,040
Speaker 1: yeah he was killed. But I think that that's I

935
00:51:47,480 --> 00:51:50,359
Speaker 1: think this is it is. It is interesting because it's

936
00:51:50,400 --> 00:51:56,240
Speaker 1: obviously the balance is understanding you understanding, and a wild

937
00:51:56,280 --> 00:52:01,920
Speaker 1: animal is a wild animal, understanding their individual there that

938
00:52:02,080 --> 00:52:04,400
Speaker 1: the fact they do have emotions. It's true, they're not

939
00:52:04,480 --> 00:52:09,879
Speaker 1: just mindless monsters, but they're under there that you have

940
00:52:09,960 --> 00:52:13,080
Speaker 1: to meet them where they're at, right, like, uh, and

941
00:52:13,120 --> 00:52:16,520
Speaker 1: they're not going to have the same kind of like oh,

942
00:52:16,600 --> 00:52:19,600
Speaker 1: this guy probably doesn't mean me any harm. I'll be

943
00:52:19,680 --> 00:52:21,799
Speaker 1: chill around them, right. They have a completely different way

944
00:52:21,840 --> 00:52:25,000
Speaker 1: of thinking, even though we have a lot of similarities,

945
00:52:25,040 --> 00:52:27,680
Speaker 1: and so I think, yeah, I think Jingoddle was really

946
00:52:27,719 --> 00:52:31,759
Speaker 1: really good at threading that needle of like, you know, look,

947
00:52:31,840 --> 00:52:34,280
Speaker 1: they are like us.

948
00:52:34,120 --> 00:52:37,960
Speaker 2: But they're not us. They're wild animals. They're like us.

949
00:52:38,120 --> 00:52:42,160
Speaker 1: We can't impose our humanness on them, but they are

950
00:52:42,719 --> 00:52:45,560
Speaker 1: sort of mirrors of our behavior.

951
00:52:46,520 --> 00:52:48,759
Speaker 3: That's a very special talent, I think. I mean, I

952
00:52:48,760 --> 00:52:51,799
Speaker 3: think everybody wishes animals were comfortable around them, at least

953
00:52:51,880 --> 00:52:55,279
Speaker 3: I do, and I do, okay, you know, but I

954
00:52:55,360 --> 00:52:58,239
Speaker 3: used to be frightened of dogs because when I grew up,

955
00:52:58,560 --> 00:53:00,480
Speaker 3: I mean, this is all suburban and you know what

956
00:53:00,480 --> 00:53:02,440
Speaker 3: I mean, Like I don't have any good animals, Like

957
00:53:02,480 --> 00:53:04,040
Speaker 3: I grew up in the suburbs, so the only thing

958
00:53:04,080 --> 00:53:05,480
Speaker 3: you ran to do was like a dog or a

959
00:53:05,480 --> 00:53:09,759
Speaker 3: cat mostly or or maybe a frog. And frogs never

960
00:53:09,920 --> 00:53:13,279
Speaker 3: frightened me, although I didn't like grabbing them. I kind

961
00:53:13,280 --> 00:53:15,160
Speaker 3: of always thought that, like you know, when people, when

962
00:53:15,160 --> 00:53:17,400
Speaker 3: people were catching frogs and stuff, I was like, are

963
00:53:17,440 --> 00:53:18,680
Speaker 3: you sure they don't have any teeth?

964
00:53:18,760 --> 00:53:19,840
Speaker 2: Yeah, that was my thought.

965
00:53:20,239 --> 00:53:22,880
Speaker 3: So so I would kind of fake act like I

966
00:53:22,920 --> 00:53:24,480
Speaker 3: wanted to catch them, but I always pulled away with

967
00:53:24,520 --> 00:53:26,160
Speaker 3: one a second because I really didn't want to catch

968
00:53:26,160 --> 00:53:28,360
Speaker 3: the bull. I was afraid it would hurt me. So anyway,

969
00:53:28,400 --> 00:53:30,160
Speaker 3: this is I'm not good for see, I'm not good.

970
00:53:30,200 --> 00:53:32,480
Speaker 3: I'm not good for this kind of job. But like

971
00:53:33,200 --> 00:53:35,399
Speaker 3: it is a it is a very special talent because

972
00:53:35,440 --> 00:53:39,560
Speaker 3: I love animals. It's just I you know, I'm not

973
00:53:39,800 --> 00:53:42,799
Speaker 3: like as insightful about animals as I am about some

974
00:53:42,880 --> 00:53:46,000
Speaker 3: other things. And she obviously was insightful. And you know

975
00:53:46,080 --> 00:53:48,560
Speaker 3: that it's not like anybody could be Jane Goodall.

976
00:53:48,680 --> 00:53:50,440
Speaker 2: Yeah, but she did.

977
00:53:50,560 --> 00:53:53,160
Speaker 1: I think she It's true that not not just anyone

978
00:53:53,239 --> 00:53:55,680
Speaker 1: could be Jane Goodall, but she inspired like a bunch

979
00:53:55,719 --> 00:53:58,480
Speaker 1: of people to be like be like that, right.

980
00:53:58,360 --> 00:53:59,799
Speaker 2: Like like she she was.

981
00:54:01,280 --> 00:54:04,759
Speaker 1: It made it clear that this like an at the

982
00:54:04,880 --> 00:54:08,000
Speaker 1: very at the very least, an appreciation for nature and

983
00:54:08,040 --> 00:54:14,520
Speaker 1: an interest in and evolutionary biology was not something inaccessible

984
00:54:14,600 --> 00:54:17,560
Speaker 1: to people. Of course, not everyone can do what she did,

985
00:54:17,800 --> 00:54:19,880
Speaker 1: but she inspired a lot of people to follow in

986
00:54:19,920 --> 00:54:23,360
Speaker 1: her footsteps, and they're like nowadays there are tons of

987
00:54:23,360 --> 00:54:27,799
Speaker 1: people doing a lot of the similar type of observational

988
00:54:27,840 --> 00:54:30,960
Speaker 1: research that she's doing and they're just as you know,

989
00:54:31,280 --> 00:54:34,640
Speaker 1: they're doing work that's like, uh, you know, as important.

990
00:54:35,280 --> 00:54:37,360
Speaker 2: But she really paved the way for that.

991
00:54:38,800 --> 00:54:42,800
Speaker 3: Did you two things? Are you a katie? Are you aware?

992
00:54:43,000 --> 00:54:47,640
Speaker 3: Did she ever wear banana perfume? And the other question

993
00:54:47,840 --> 00:54:50,680
Speaker 3: is is that in anywhere in the thing or in

994
00:54:50,719 --> 00:54:52,920
Speaker 3: her bio? And then the other thing was like when

995
00:54:52,920 --> 00:54:56,680
Speaker 3: I was growing up, I was crazy about music, like

996
00:54:56,680 --> 00:54:59,600
Speaker 3: like like more than animals, you know, so I like

997
00:55:00,040 --> 00:55:02,600
Speaker 3: wore a John Denver T shirt. Did you ever have

998
00:55:02,640 --> 00:55:04,520
Speaker 3: a Jain Goodall T shirt? Or do you have any

999
00:55:04,600 --> 00:55:05,560
Speaker 3: Jane Goodall merch?

1000
00:55:06,040 --> 00:55:09,760
Speaker 1: Both good questions. I don't think she ever wore banana perfume.

1001
00:55:10,520 --> 00:55:13,200
Speaker 3: The closest thing, then, why is her biography called banana

1002
00:55:13,239 --> 00:55:15,400
Speaker 3: perfume for autobio.

1003
00:55:16,600 --> 00:55:21,080
Speaker 2: Scent called oh oh do monkey? Uh?

1004
00:55:21,280 --> 00:55:21,360
Speaker 1: No?

1005
00:55:21,760 --> 00:55:24,680
Speaker 2: I I The closest thing was that they.

1006
00:55:24,560 --> 00:55:27,279
Speaker 1: Did have sometimes like feeding stations to be able to

1007
00:55:28,000 --> 00:55:32,520
Speaker 1: observe chimps more. And that could be sometimes controversial because

1008
00:55:32,520 --> 00:55:36,120
Speaker 1: they're saying that, well, then you're not getting the natural behavior.

1009
00:55:37,400 --> 00:55:37,840
Speaker 3: She was.

1010
00:55:38,560 --> 00:55:41,960
Speaker 1: Her opinion on it really only changed in terms of

1011
00:55:42,000 --> 00:55:43,839
Speaker 1: like getting like too close to them with these things

1012
00:55:43,880 --> 00:55:46,360
Speaker 1: really only changed when she when they had later found

1013
00:55:46,360 --> 00:55:49,080
Speaker 1: out that champanzees can get human diseases.

1014
00:55:49,760 --> 00:55:52,320
Speaker 2: Uh, so like she had kind of changed.

1015
00:55:52,400 --> 00:55:55,560
Speaker 1: She was like, yeah, actually, because now we know that

1016
00:55:55,600 --> 00:55:58,480
Speaker 1: there can be these this pathogenic exchange, we want to

1017
00:55:58,560 --> 00:56:02,479
Speaker 1: keep some more distance from them, Like you can still

1018
00:56:03,239 --> 00:56:06,680
Speaker 1: you can still observe them, but she would she increased

1019
00:56:06,680 --> 00:56:09,040
Speaker 1: her distance with them right like once once because they

1020
00:56:09,040 --> 00:56:11,239
Speaker 1: didn't know, like at that point, they didn't know that

1021
00:56:11,280 --> 00:56:13,080
Speaker 1: there was potential transfer.

1022
00:56:13,200 --> 00:56:16,560
Speaker 2: So she changed that. So I would say no to

1023
00:56:16,600 --> 00:56:19,600
Speaker 2: the banana perfume. I actually don't have.

1024
00:56:20,040 --> 00:56:24,120
Speaker 1: I didn't have like a lot of Jane Goodall merch

1025
00:56:24,160 --> 00:56:24,840
Speaker 1: as a kid.

1026
00:56:25,040 --> 00:56:25,759
Speaker 2: I didn't have like A.

1027
00:56:25,960 --> 00:56:30,120
Speaker 1: I didn't have like a I think mostly I was

1028
00:56:30,120 --> 00:56:32,239
Speaker 1: focused on the animals, to be honest, So I would

1029
00:56:32,280 --> 00:56:35,440
Speaker 1: have like images of animals as posters and things, not

1030
00:56:35,480 --> 00:56:38,880
Speaker 1: so much of the people, uh doing the research. But

1031
00:56:38,920 --> 00:56:43,000
Speaker 1: I remember really really liking her and once being really

1032
00:56:43,000 --> 00:56:45,600
Speaker 1: excited because there was like a did you ever were

1033
00:56:45,640 --> 00:56:47,640
Speaker 1: you Are you aware of the cartoon The Wild thorn

1034
00:56:47,760 --> 00:56:50,520
Speaker 1: Berries or is that that stuff that's like a squarely

1035
00:56:50,600 --> 00:56:51,399
Speaker 1: millennial thing.

1036
00:56:52,440 --> 00:56:52,640
Speaker 3: No?

1037
00:56:53,320 --> 00:56:55,840
Speaker 2: Yeah, I was like this cartoon about a.

1038
00:56:55,680 --> 00:56:57,759
Speaker 1: Girl who could talk to animals and there was like

1039
00:56:57,800 --> 00:57:00,400
Speaker 1: an episode where Jane there was a Jane Goodall characters,

1040
00:57:00,400 --> 00:57:03,719
Speaker 1: so I was very excited about that. But yeah, no,

1041
00:57:04,200 --> 00:57:06,000
Speaker 1: I didn't have much. I didn't really do a lot

1042
00:57:06,040 --> 00:57:10,360
Speaker 1: of Jane Goodall merch. Maybe I should, maybe I should

1043
00:57:10,400 --> 00:57:14,200
Speaker 1: get she did actually speaking actually merch. So they did

1044
00:57:14,200 --> 00:57:16,120
Speaker 1: get permission from Gary Larson. You know the story I

1045
00:57:16,200 --> 00:57:19,520
Speaker 1: told you earlier about the comic that got his permission

1046
00:57:19,560 --> 00:57:24,520
Speaker 1: to do shirts with that comic printed on it, that

1047
00:57:24,520 --> 00:57:27,640
Speaker 1: that benefited their foundation, and it was one of their

1048
00:57:27,640 --> 00:57:31,320
Speaker 1: best sellers. So real, it's just she's like she was

1049
00:57:31,360 --> 00:57:34,480
Speaker 1: cool with making fun of herself. Their most popular shirt

1050
00:57:34,520 --> 00:57:38,280
Speaker 1: was calling Jane Goodall a tramp, which which and she

1051
00:57:38,440 --> 00:57:40,240
Speaker 1: loved it and she loved it.

1052
00:57:40,240 --> 00:57:43,640
Speaker 3: It's so funny. So yeah, I mean it's so out there,

1053
00:57:43,680 --> 00:57:44,160
Speaker 3: it's great.

1054
00:57:44,240 --> 00:57:44,760
Speaker 2: Yeah.

1055
00:57:44,800 --> 00:57:46,800
Speaker 1: So before we go, we're gonna play a little game

1056
00:57:46,840 --> 00:57:49,600
Speaker 1: called Guess Who's Squawk and the Mystery Animal Sound Game.

1057
00:57:50,000 --> 00:57:52,360
Speaker 1: Every week I play Mystery Animal Sound in you the listener.

1058
00:57:52,480 --> 00:57:54,720
Speaker 3: I've played Yeah, I've played this before. I've lost a

1059
00:57:54,760 --> 00:57:55,480
Speaker 3: lot of money on this.

1060
00:57:56,280 --> 00:57:58,800
Speaker 2: He is a Chris is deep in debt.

1061
00:57:58,720 --> 00:58:03,040
Speaker 1: To me and I hope you remember always yeah and

1062
00:58:03,320 --> 00:58:06,240
Speaker 1: uh yeah, so I will play mister animal sound, and

1063
00:58:06,320 --> 00:58:08,320
Speaker 1: you will try to guess who it is. The hint

1064
00:58:08,360 --> 00:58:11,680
Speaker 1: for this one is this, you may find these colorful

1065
00:58:11,760 --> 00:58:14,960
Speaker 1: animals at zoos, but they're not always behind bars.

1066
00:58:22,640 --> 00:58:24,200
Speaker 2: Christy Gotteny guesses.

1067
00:58:26,320 --> 00:58:26,880
Speaker 3: Flamingo.

1068
00:58:27,200 --> 00:58:28,400
Speaker 2: You're actually close.

1069
00:58:28,800 --> 00:58:32,200
Speaker 1: This is a type of bird about the size of

1070
00:58:32,200 --> 00:58:34,840
Speaker 1: a flamingo. But this is a peacock.

1071
00:58:35,840 --> 00:58:38,000
Speaker 3: Hora. I can't believe I was close.

1072
00:58:39,440 --> 00:58:43,440
Speaker 2: Yes, so this is a peacock. They are, at least

1073
00:58:44,040 --> 00:58:44,640
Speaker 2: I did get.

1074
00:58:45,440 --> 00:58:47,520
Speaker 1: Someone told me that, like, they haven't been at the

1075
00:58:47,560 --> 00:58:51,280
Speaker 1: San Diego Zoo recently, but they used to be very

1076
00:58:51,280 --> 00:58:55,480
Speaker 1: abundant at the San Diego Zoo and also at other zoos,

1077
00:58:55,520 --> 00:59:00,280
Speaker 1: just kind of walking around and they're beautiful birds make

1078
00:59:00,360 --> 00:59:04,720
Speaker 1: the most horrific screeching sounds. I got a lot of

1079
00:59:04,760 --> 00:59:08,200
Speaker 1: people who wrote in with the correct answers, and honestly, like,

1080
00:59:08,280 --> 00:59:10,160
Speaker 1: I'm so proud of you guys. I'm gonna read off

1081
00:59:11,040 --> 00:59:14,439
Speaker 1: in the order quite a few names in the order

1082
00:59:14,440 --> 00:59:19,080
Speaker 1: of receiving your emails. Con congratulations to Laura W. N. L.

1083
00:59:19,280 --> 00:59:23,480
Speaker 1: Craig K, Julie, Penelope and Eleanor T. Carolyn H. Emiliam

1084
00:59:23,720 --> 00:59:27,640
Speaker 1: and Julie B. Who described the sound as being like

1085
00:59:27,680 --> 00:59:29,280
Speaker 1: a baby being tortured.

1086
00:59:30,600 --> 00:59:35,120
Speaker 3: My friend had a peacock like move it on to

1087
00:59:35,200 --> 00:59:39,240
Speaker 3: her balcony during the pandemic. Oh yeah, and yeah, and

1088
00:59:39,280 --> 00:59:42,560
Speaker 3: they were it was no fun. Yeah, they're loud, they

1089
00:59:42,560 --> 00:59:45,320
Speaker 3: make so much noise and they and they like stick

1090
00:59:45,360 --> 00:59:46,800
Speaker 3: around forever once they get gone.

1091
00:59:46,880 --> 00:59:48,920
Speaker 1: Yeah. No, we had when I was a kid, we

1092
00:59:48,960 --> 00:59:53,120
Speaker 1: had a stray peacock wander into our yard and I

1093
00:59:53,160 --> 00:59:56,240
Speaker 1: was like, this is good and my mom would feed

1094
00:59:56,280 --> 00:59:58,680
Speaker 1: it bread, which you're not You shouldn't feed it bread.

1095
00:59:58,840 --> 01:00:01,000
Speaker 1: We didn't know, we didn't have internet. We were just

1096
01:00:01,280 --> 01:00:03,320
Speaker 1: she was trying to be nice and so she did

1097
01:00:03,320 --> 01:00:06,919
Speaker 1: her best. It's not like we knew how to feed it.

1098
01:00:07,600 --> 01:00:08,880
Speaker 3: She was no Jane Goodall.

1099
01:00:09,040 --> 01:00:11,400
Speaker 2: We just didn't know how to a goddamn peacock. And

1100
01:00:11,440 --> 01:00:12,480
Speaker 2: the peacock showed up.

1101
01:00:12,520 --> 01:00:17,200
Speaker 1: We didn't go out and acquire a peacock like this

1102
01:00:17,280 --> 01:00:20,800
Speaker 1: is this peacock was like hoisted itself upon us and

1103
01:00:20,840 --> 01:00:22,560
Speaker 1: we're like, all right, you want I don't know, do

1104
01:00:22,600 --> 01:00:23,280
Speaker 1: you want bread?

1105
01:00:23,360 --> 01:00:23,920
Speaker 2: Like we don't know?

1106
01:00:25,000 --> 01:00:27,919
Speaker 3: And yeah, well, I mean Jane Goodall, when she first

1107
01:00:27,920 --> 01:00:30,880
Speaker 3: started out, was making the monkey's omelets, and then they

1108
01:00:30,920 --> 01:00:31,720
Speaker 3: told her that was.

1109
01:00:33,840 --> 01:00:33,960
Speaker 2: Right.

1110
01:00:34,040 --> 01:00:37,040
Speaker 3: Excuse me swear this is this has been such a

1111
01:00:37,880 --> 01:00:39,800
Speaker 3: very nice podcast. I keep swearing.

1112
01:00:39,880 --> 01:00:42,760
Speaker 2: No, no, it's okay, I'll cuack it all out, okay, okay.

1113
01:00:42,600 --> 01:00:44,880
Speaker 1: But yeah, this peacock showed up. We fed it for

1114
01:00:44,920 --> 01:00:46,360
Speaker 1: a while. It was like it was just like, yeah,

1115
01:00:46,400 --> 01:00:47,320
Speaker 1: this is this yard.

1116
01:00:47,200 --> 01:00:47,720
Speaker 2: Is mine now.

1117
01:00:48,840 --> 01:00:52,200
Speaker 1: And it would scream every morning, and it would like

1118
01:00:52,280 --> 01:00:53,640
Speaker 1: do this thing where it would like get up on

1119
01:00:53,640 --> 01:00:57,120
Speaker 1: our fence, scream and then like fly across the yard

1120
01:00:57,360 --> 01:01:00,640
Speaker 1: and then scream again. It was like all right, and

1121
01:01:00,680 --> 01:01:02,680
Speaker 1: then it was done screaming for the day. For the

1122
01:01:02,720 --> 01:01:05,080
Speaker 1: most part, it just had this like ritual of screaming

1123
01:01:05,120 --> 01:01:09,200
Speaker 1: every day and flying across the yard. But yeah, it

1124
01:01:09,320 --> 01:01:12,800
Speaker 1: was never like super friendly with us. It was more

1125
01:01:12,960 --> 01:01:17,040
Speaker 1: like I'm a tenant here, I don't pay rent, and

1126
01:01:17,080 --> 01:01:19,600
Speaker 1: you do feed me bread. And then it eventually moved

1127
01:01:19,600 --> 01:01:22,800
Speaker 1: on like it was just like okay.

1128
01:01:22,680 --> 01:01:23,360
Speaker 2: I'm out.

1129
01:01:24,640 --> 01:01:29,320
Speaker 1: Off to visit another person's yard and demand bread from them.

1130
01:01:29,400 --> 01:01:31,439
Speaker 3: So that's a loud noise. Yeah, I wonder what they're

1131
01:01:31,480 --> 01:01:32,600
Speaker 3: asking for with that noise.

1132
01:01:32,760 --> 01:01:35,120
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean probably sex, to be honest.

1133
01:01:36,080 --> 01:01:41,160
Speaker 1: Okay, Yeah, onto this week's mister animal sound. They may

1134
01:01:41,280 --> 01:01:44,600
Speaker 1: look like squirrels, but they're more closely related to us,

1135
01:01:52,840 --> 01:01:53,880
Speaker 1: Chrissy getting giesses.

1136
01:01:54,800 --> 01:01:55,400
Speaker 3: Donald Duck.

1137
01:01:55,560 --> 01:01:58,840
Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly, you got it, doll Duck. He's more like

1138
01:01:58,960 --> 01:02:02,240
Speaker 2: us then we know, because he wears the shirt but

1139
01:02:02,360 --> 01:02:02,920
Speaker 2: no pants.

1140
01:02:03,800 --> 01:02:05,680
Speaker 3: You're right, or maybe it was here we do it

1141
01:02:05,760 --> 01:02:08,360
Speaker 3: sounded smaller than Donald Duck, so I'd say hewey do here?

1142
01:02:08,560 --> 01:02:13,280
Speaker 1: Yeah, one of the little ones, one of the little nephews. Yeah, no, exactly,

1143
01:02:13,360 --> 01:02:16,200
Speaker 1: that's that's right. But if you out there, if you

1144
01:02:16,280 --> 01:02:18,160
Speaker 1: out there think you have another a better idea, if

1145
01:02:18,200 --> 01:02:20,320
Speaker 1: you've got a better idea than Donald Duck or one

1146
01:02:20,320 --> 01:02:23,400
Speaker 1: of his irascable nephews, you can write to me at

1147
01:02:23,480 --> 01:02:26,800
Speaker 1: Creature Feature Pod at gmail dot com. Thank you guys

1148
01:02:26,840 --> 01:02:28,680
Speaker 1: so much for listening. Chris, thank you so much for

1149
01:02:28,720 --> 01:02:30,640
Speaker 1: coming on the show. Where can people find you?

1150
01:02:31,280 --> 01:02:34,960
Speaker 3: It's always fun. You can unfortunately find me on Instagram

1151
01:02:35,000 --> 01:02:39,440
Speaker 3: at the Crofton Show, and you can find my record

1152
01:02:40,600 --> 01:02:43,240
Speaker 3: just because that's the most recent thing I've I've put

1153
01:02:43,280 --> 01:02:45,560
Speaker 3: out and it's it's I'm so proud of it. It's

1154
01:02:45,560 --> 01:02:47,520
Speaker 3: called I'm Your Man. And I don't say I'm proud

1155
01:02:47,520 --> 01:02:51,040
Speaker 3: of everything, but this record is is really my whole

1156
01:02:51,040 --> 01:02:56,960
Speaker 3: life in the making, and uh, it's just super sweet

1157
01:02:57,040 --> 01:03:01,800
Speaker 3: and hopefully inspiring for you know, some stressful times. And

1158
01:03:02,200 --> 01:03:05,000
Speaker 3: so I'm Your Man. You can get it. You can

1159
01:03:05,040 --> 01:03:07,680
Speaker 3: stream it, or you can buy it on band Camp

1160
01:03:07,720 --> 01:03:09,800
Speaker 3: but it's called I'm Your Man and it's yeah, it's

1161
01:03:09,840 --> 01:03:10,160
Speaker 3: just fun.

1162
01:03:10,360 --> 01:03:14,040
Speaker 1: You Google it comes right up on band Camp. On

1163
01:03:14,200 --> 01:03:15,760
Speaker 1: Italian Amazon too, I don't know.

1164
01:03:15,760 --> 01:03:16,320
Speaker 2: If you knew that.

1165
01:03:17,360 --> 01:03:19,600
Speaker 3: I did not know that. I've not been on Italian

1166
01:03:19,600 --> 01:03:23,120
Speaker 3: Amazon in a while. And also Craft, sorry not crafton

1167
01:03:23,400 --> 01:03:27,080
Speaker 3: Colebrew got me, Like, is really a great podcast? I

1168
01:03:27,080 --> 01:03:29,320
Speaker 3: mean if you look at the summaries, like, I don't

1169
01:03:29,320 --> 01:03:31,000
Speaker 3: know if you know about this, Katie, but you probably do.

1170
01:03:31,400 --> 01:03:36,120
Speaker 3: Like now Spotify like we'll do chapters against your will,

1171
01:03:36,440 --> 01:03:40,000
Speaker 3: They'll they'll have AI do chapters for your podcast, like

1172
01:03:40,080 --> 01:03:42,800
Speaker 3: describing what you say, which I can only imagine is

1173
01:03:42,840 --> 01:03:44,560
Speaker 3: just for Border Patrol to be able to when you

1174
01:03:44,640 --> 01:03:46,640
Speaker 3: say my podcast is fine, you know, and they can

1175
01:03:46,680 --> 01:03:49,280
Speaker 3: be like, oh, that's not what it says here, but

1176
01:03:49,680 --> 01:03:53,320
Speaker 3: because it makes my podcast sound so dark. But it's fun.

1177
01:03:53,320 --> 01:03:56,439
Speaker 3: But it's all about like, you know, politics, So it's

1178
01:03:56,560 --> 01:03:58,640
Speaker 3: it's about politics in a way. I mean, I don't

1179
01:03:58,640 --> 01:04:00,720
Speaker 3: want to talk about politics. I want to talk about Bigfoot.

1180
01:04:00,760 --> 01:04:02,200
Speaker 3: I always say that, but I but I kind of

1181
01:04:02,200 --> 01:04:06,560
Speaker 3: got stuck talking about politics. But anyway, I don't look

1182
01:04:06,600 --> 01:04:08,360
Speaker 3: at the summary because it makes it sound really like

1183
01:04:08,400 --> 01:04:11,160
Speaker 3: it's no fun, and it's it's a pretty fun podcast.

1184
01:04:11,280 --> 01:04:14,040
Speaker 3: So Colbrew got me like, is the podcast?

1185
01:04:14,120 --> 01:04:14,480
Speaker 1: Check it out.

1186
01:04:14,480 --> 01:04:17,080
Speaker 2: Don't believe AI you know lies it lies to you.

1187
01:04:17,760 --> 01:04:19,440
Speaker 3: I mean, if I if you, if I showed you

1188
01:04:19,480 --> 01:04:22,960
Speaker 3: the description. It's just like the dead End of Capitalism

1189
01:04:23,080 --> 01:04:23,800
Speaker 3: chapter one.

1190
01:04:23,920 --> 01:04:26,360
Speaker 2: Chapter two, the Ballad true valid.

1191
01:04:26,520 --> 01:04:30,120
Speaker 3: Yeah, like living under the Thumb of the Internet chapter two.

1192
01:04:30,200 --> 01:04:32,800
Speaker 2: It's just like all this miserable detected there.

1193
01:04:33,240 --> 01:04:35,040
Speaker 3: It's not as miserable as it looks.

1194
01:04:35,440 --> 01:04:38,560
Speaker 1: Well, do check that out, and thank you so much

1195
01:04:38,560 --> 01:04:40,280
Speaker 1: for listening. If you're enjoying the show and you leave

1196
01:04:40,280 --> 01:04:42,560
Speaker 1: a rating or review, I read all the reviews. I

1197
01:04:42,560 --> 01:04:45,280
Speaker 1: really take him to heart and it does help the

1198
01:04:45,280 --> 01:04:47,440
Speaker 1: podcast to get those, So thank you so much for that.

1199
01:04:48,160 --> 01:04:50,560
Speaker 1: Thanks for the Space Classics for their super awesome song.

1200
01:04:50,640 --> 01:04:51,360
Speaker 1: Ex So Lumina.

1201
01:04:51,480 --> 01:04:54,640
Speaker 2: Creature features a production of iHeartRadio. For more podcasts like the.

1202
01:04:54,600 --> 01:04:56,600
Speaker 1: One you just heard, vis of the iHeart Radio Abubble

1203
01:04:56,600 --> 01:04:59,919
Speaker 1: podcasts or I Guess what wherever you get your favorite show.

1204
01:05:00,080 --> 01:05:02,120
Speaker 2: So I'm not your mother. I can't tell you what

1205
01:05:02,240 --> 01:05:08,320
Speaker 2: to do. I can tell you though, like, uh, if.

1206
01:05:08,240 --> 01:05:10,840
Speaker 1: You're hanging around Jane Goodall and you get a blonde

1207
01:05:10,840 --> 01:05:13,520
Speaker 1: hair on you and you're a chimp, your wife will

1208
01:05:13,560 --> 01:05:14,160
Speaker 1: find out.

1209
01:05:14,520 --> 01:05:19,160
Speaker 2: So have your have your stories straight. See you next Wednesday.

1210
01:05:20,200 --> 01:05:20,960
Speaker 3: Thanks Katie,