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Speaker 1: Welcome back all the Smoke, New York. I'm just enamored.

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Speaker 5: Is that a good work?

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Speaker 1: I can't spell it, but I agree with you because

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Speaker 1: I love I've only seen snowfall like five times in

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Speaker 1: my life, and it's literally falling right now, so I

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Speaker 1: think it's a beautiful thing.

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Speaker 3: Man.

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Speaker 1: We're here in New York City, and I'm excited about

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Speaker 1: this one. This guy right here is someone who I,

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Speaker 1: you know, watched for a long time on television and

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Speaker 1: just admired what he stood for. And it's a rarity,

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Speaker 1: you know, when you kind of work for a machine

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Speaker 1: to really be able to stand on what you believe in,

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Speaker 1: and this guy did that, and then he also took

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Speaker 1: another chance on on on wanting to team up with

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Speaker 1: me and you, which is which is dope. So welcome

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Speaker 1: to the show, Dan Levatart, Yes, sir, Thank you guys.

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Speaker 5: I have trouble generally. He's already working on his pocket.

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Speaker 5: He's already working on his slightly racist but notarized and

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Speaker 5: endorsed by me. He said, he's gonna get good at

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Speaker 5: this impersonation of my father Stephen Jackson.

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Speaker 2: Stephen Jackson and and and Dan's got his ankles out too,

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Speaker 2: which I love.

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Speaker 1: I'm normally an ankle abuser myself, but he's got his

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Speaker 1: ankles out today, It's gonna be a good day.

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Speaker 5: I have trouble with style.

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Speaker 1: I'm sorry, Irsa, you asked him. I have ankles out,

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Speaker 1: all of them, my suits, everything. It just was cold

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Speaker 1: here so I kept mine in. But man, let's get

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Speaker 1: to it. Your transition from ESPN, you know, obviously that's

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Speaker 1: where everyone kind of got a chance to get to

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Speaker 1: know you. Your transition from ESPN to Metal Lark. Can

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Speaker 1: we talk about that the ending there in the beginning

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Speaker 1: of something which is amazing with yourself and Bimo and

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Speaker 1: John Skipper.

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Speaker 5: H Yeah, before we do that, though, I just like

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Speaker 5: your audience to know how deeply appreciative I am of

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Speaker 5: you guys and admire how it is you did what

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Speaker 5: you did beyond you know, a decade and a half

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Speaker 5: each in the league, working through a bunch of commedan

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Speaker 5: competitive ecosystems in a sport where the inner cities are

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Speaker 5: fighting for money. The idea that you guys would have

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Speaker 5: so many teammates who would love you and know that

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Speaker 5: you had their back get every turn. The idea that

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Speaker 5: you are consummate friends, not just with each other, but

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Speaker 5: that your teammates always know that you are somebody who

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Speaker 5: can be counted on, and that you did it your

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Speaker 5: way every step of the way and are still doing

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Speaker 5: it your way. I don't do thrilled a lot, but

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Speaker 5: I am thrilled to be in business with you guys.

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Speaker 5: I am thrilled that you guys, who have had all

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Speaker 5: sorts of business opportunities coming your way for twenty five years,

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Speaker 5: that you would trust us with your future because I

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Speaker 5: believe we've got a giant one ahead, because we've all

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Speaker 5: seen the market inefficiencies of you can build your own

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Speaker 5: brand now you can work outside the machine. You can

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Speaker 5: be legitimately free to be an independent thinker to say

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Speaker 5: what you want because you're your own boss, like you can,

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Speaker 5: and you can form your own teams, like you can

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Speaker 5: be your own boss and form your own teams. So

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Speaker 5: like we are kindred spirits in this space, and I

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Speaker 5: believe like together we're going to do big things that

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Speaker 5: inspire us and other people. So, yeah, I leave ESPN,

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Speaker 5: and they forced upon me self employment, and I don't

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Speaker 5: know that I would have chosen it. From the safety

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Speaker 5: of the machine. It would be easy to stay there

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Speaker 5: and just keep cashing checks. But some of the things

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Speaker 5: that happened were uncomfortable enough that I felt pushed into something.

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Speaker 5: And it's been a successful business venture because in order

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Speaker 5: to get out of there without making a mess that

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Speaker 5: was loud with headlines, they gave us all our stuff,

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Speaker 5: They gave us all our intellectual property to just don't

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Speaker 5: cause Disney headlines talking about all the stuff you've been

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Speaker 5: talking about. Just leave and take your stuff. And so

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Speaker 5: we packed up our stuff and went and it's been

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Speaker 5: something that is wildly fulfilling, as all things that are

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Speaker 5: difficult must be. Like if you're going to accomplish something

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Speaker 5: that feels fulfilling, it almost has to be difficult. You

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Speaker 5: have to choose the hard path.

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Speaker 1: When you're exiting ESPN, is Metal Lark already brewing? Is

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Speaker 1: it not even a thought?

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Speaker 5: Like?

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Speaker 1: What is your thought process? I almost seem like it

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Speaker 1: seems like that, you know, the transition from NBA to

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Speaker 1: what was next for us? It almost seems like that's

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Speaker 1: what that was for you.

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Speaker 5: I don't do a lot in the way of regret,

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Speaker 5: but one of the things that I would say that

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Speaker 5: I do regret is not planning a little less emotionally

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Speaker 5: my exit on their dime the way stephen A. Smith

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Speaker 5: is doing it now. On first take, we're across the

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Speaker 5: scroll on the bottom you see and go check out

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Speaker 5: the Stephen A. Smith show over here that has nothing

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Speaker 5: to do with ESPN, where he's saying the things he

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Speaker 5: won't say on ESPN to build his brand outside of ESPN.

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Speaker 5: I did it more emotionally. I'm like, Okay, you're gonna

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Speaker 5: make me do this myself, all right, fuck it, we'll

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Speaker 5: do it. We'll do it ourselves. And because they fired

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Speaker 5: they let go of one of my guys, my mentor's

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Speaker 5: son was fired off our show without telling me, and

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Speaker 5: that was sort of the last straw after you know,

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Speaker 5: inhibiting freedoms and stuff. That was the last straw. And

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Speaker 5: so I wish I'd been slightly less emotional because I

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Speaker 5: had about a year and a half that I could

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Speaker 5: have done it on their dime. But like I said,

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Speaker 5: the forcing me to do it has made me like

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Speaker 5: speed up the curve on what I have to learn

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Speaker 5: about business so that you guys can now see the

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Speaker 5: business gorillas I've got, and you guys can learn from

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Speaker 5: them and we can make all the things we want

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Speaker 5: to make.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean in our situation too, was we kind

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Speaker 1: of saw it coming, you know, obviously with the paramount

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Speaker 1: situation and showtime and kind of working and seeing, okay,

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Speaker 1: what was next. You know, it's been a tremendous opportunity

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Speaker 1: with showtime to partner learn, get to build our brand,

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Speaker 1: and when it was time to make a move similar stuff.

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Speaker 1: I mean, they didn't push us out by any means,

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Speaker 1: but you know, the sign was on the wall, the

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Speaker 1: writing was on the wall, was coming to an end.

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Speaker 1: But in that meantime, we had already started building our

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Speaker 1: production company. And luckily for us, you know, paramount and

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Speaker 1: showtime and shout out Stephen Espinoza found a way for

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Speaker 1: us to get all of our intellectual property, all of

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Speaker 1: our archives, and it was almost like a good luck situation.

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Speaker 1: So when we left, we got lucky and landed right

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Speaker 1: on our feet because we had already started building this company.

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Speaker 1: And then, you know, two months after we're up and running,

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Speaker 1: we get news that we're gonna have the opportunity to

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Speaker 1: team up with you guys and take your brain and

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Speaker 1: learn and utilize your ecosystem and feel like we can

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Speaker 1: bring some you know, some credible and and and good stuff.

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Speaker 1: You guys's way too. So I mean again, we talked

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Speaker 1: about this all night at dinner last night. We won't

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Speaker 1: bore you guys with that conversation.

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Speaker 5: This is a good conversation. It would have been boring

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Speaker 5: close the restaurant.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, for real, for real. So to those who don't

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Speaker 1: know what is what is Metal Lark and who are

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Speaker 1: your your teams? And you know obviously John Skipper, former

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Speaker 1: ESPN president bim with someone who was over at ESPN,

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Speaker 1: So who are they and what is metal Ark about?

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Speaker 5: Yeah, we've got Dedra who leads our documentary division and

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Speaker 5: h what We are is uh, storytellers in the media

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Speaker 5: business who are looking to evolve in the new media world.

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Speaker 5: You know, we are a company that has a giant

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Speaker 5: audio product that is now growing in the video space.

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Speaker 5: I've had to we've had to do all of that.

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Speaker 5: You guys have learned what it takes. Content business is expensive,

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Speaker 5: like you and especially if you're gonna do video like this,

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Speaker 5: you have to have people in order to do that.

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Speaker 5: And so we've got almost twenty documentaries that are going

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Speaker 5: to be sold in the next two years. Because John

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Speaker 5: Skipper was the most powerful man in sports when he

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Speaker 5: was at ESPN, Like he knows how to do this.

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Speaker 5: He did the thirty for thirty series. So you guys

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Speaker 5: see that Hollywood has been crumbling or stagnant or atrophying

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Speaker 5: or unstable for two years. And we're gonna have twenty

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Speaker 5: documentaries in the next few years. And I know, you

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Speaker 5: guys got a thousand ideas, you got a thousand connections,

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Speaker 5: and so we're going to be a company that builds

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Speaker 5: out this arm over here. I'm the side of the

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Speaker 5: company where we do this stuff, you know, interviews, intimacies, vulnerabilities, laughter,

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Speaker 5: get to know these people for real, I can't wait. Like,

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Speaker 5: I know they've seen some of Stephen Jackson here, but

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Speaker 5: his dark comedy thespian I don't think the world is ready.

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Speaker 5: I do not think the world is ready for how

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Speaker 5: funny this person actually is. Even though he can kick

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Speaker 5: your ass and everyone knows he could kick your ass,

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Speaker 5: I don't know that they know how funny is. And

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Speaker 5: so hopefully we'll have some unscripted work for him to do,

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Speaker 5: because I believe there are a lot of Hollywood roles

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Speaker 5: for this man if he chooses them.

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Speaker 1: Indeed, indeed, I asked you, I asked you in Rachel

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Speaker 1: a question last night, and it was interesting because.

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Speaker 5: I literally got we should mention her too, by the way,

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Speaker 5: because just a true gangster who's going to help us

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Speaker 5: a lot here.

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Speaker 1: I mean, Rachel Nichols is obviously very instrumental. And Jack

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Speaker 1: and I start in media, and I was telling a

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Speaker 1: story last night that when we had Rachel long was

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Speaker 1: it a year and a half ago? Last season, I

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Speaker 1: got a call from one of the bosses at ESPN,

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Speaker 1: like right after it air, like, hey, how come you

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Speaker 1: didn't tell us you were going to have Rachel. I'm

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Speaker 1: just like, I didn't think I had to tell you

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Speaker 1: that I was going to have Rachel, you know what

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Speaker 1: I mean, And it was and at that moment, you know,

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Speaker 1: and I told her last night for the first time,

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Speaker 1: I think and the crew knew. I was like, you know, obviously,

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Speaker 1: I still I hadn't had no issues with ESPN up

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Speaker 1: to that point, and I really didn't even have no

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Speaker 1: issues with my exit up to that point. I was

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Speaker 1: just like, you know, we got to be careful because

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Speaker 1: that's just the machine. But like the more and more

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Speaker 1: I thought about it, and the more and more we

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Speaker 1: were talking when we were hearing her story, I was

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Speaker 1: willing to lose my job at ESPN to allow Rachel

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Speaker 1: to have a platform to tell her truth on because

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Speaker 1: I don't feel like she had an opportunity to tell

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Speaker 1: her truth. There was the machine's word and then Rachel,

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Speaker 1: You're silenced, you can't say anything. So I just thought

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Speaker 1: that was extremely unfair. I hated the narrative that was

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Speaker 1: painted with her because we know who she is and

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Speaker 1: what she stands for, and the narrative that was painted

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Speaker 1: by the bigger machine couldn't be further from the truth.

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Speaker 1: So us I feel like us allowing her to kind

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Speaker 1: of speak her truth on our platform and then kind

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Speaker 1: of get her back, you know, kind of be a

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Speaker 1: stepping stone to get her back in this space. I mean,

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Speaker 1: she's probably the most trusted NBA reporter in the game.

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Speaker 1: Everybody loves her and respects her and she does great work.

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Speaker 1: So again to definitely shout out Rachel, and that was

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Speaker 1: one of the first things when Jelani and I came

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Speaker 1: out with you. You know, you spoke highly on her

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Speaker 1: and how much respect and love you guys have for

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Speaker 1: each other. So definitely throwing her in the mix only

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Speaker 1: is gonna go.

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Speaker 5: When you talk about the machine, right, and you guys

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Speaker 5: can both sort of speak to this uniquely because you've

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Speaker 5: navigated the labyrinth so well. The machine makes you or

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Speaker 5: can make you with its pressures, dilute your authenticity by

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Speaker 5: degrees by requesting compromises from you at every turn, and

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Speaker 5: choices like that, where what an it's possible spot for

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Speaker 5: the two of you. You know Rachel Nichols, you know

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Speaker 5: everything she's about, and now you're put in the spot

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Speaker 5: where a white woman has lost her job in the

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Speaker 5: climate of after George Floyd and Disney doesn't know how

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Speaker 5: to react, and there's corporate pressure and American pressure, and

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Speaker 5: now you two are put in the spot where you're

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Speaker 5: defending Rachel Nichols, and it sounds like you might be

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Speaker 5: against black women or can be perceived against black women.

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Speaker 5: A difficult spot for you, guys to choose. No, we're

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Speaker 5: going to be authentic, and this is one of the

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Speaker 5: many reasons I admire you guys. Your authenticity and your

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Speaker 5: audience knows this, and it's why they ride with you everywhere.

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Speaker 5: Your authenticity matters to you and cannot be compromised by

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Speaker 5: any machines, not like not the NBA machine. That I

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Speaker 5: mean he went into the stands for his brother and

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Speaker 5: and would do it again, and would do it again

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Speaker 5: no matter the cost, because that's I mean, that's where

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Speaker 5: you guys live. Who doesn't want to ride with that?

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Speaker 1: No, completely agree, But I was gonna say My question

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Speaker 1: to you was as someone who studied journalism for thirty

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Speaker 1: plus years and Rachel again, I post close question to

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Speaker 1: both you guys, how do you feel about athletes who are,

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Speaker 1: for lack of a better word, cutting the lines so

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Speaker 1: to speak, in this space and able to come in

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Speaker 1: and tell our stories and have the trust from our

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Speaker 1: brothers and sisters that have played the same sport, and

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Speaker 1: that's kind of coming in. I wouldn't even say taken over,

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Speaker 1: but I think there's definitely a there's been a shift

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Speaker 1: in the tide, and athletes are kind of coming in

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Speaker 1: and taking We don't necessarily have to have the journal

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Speaker 1: journalist credentials to be able to be successful in the space.

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Speaker 1: And someone who again prided themselves on you know, your

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Speaker 1: journalistic qualities and in your body of work for so long.

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Speaker 1: How do you feel about the athletes kind of coming

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Speaker 1: in with this new wave of media.

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Speaker 5: It's been fascinating to watch you guys shake the constructs.

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Speaker 5: It's been fascinating to watch athletes understand they don't need

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Speaker 5: the media because they can be their own media and

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Speaker 5: without a filter. You don't have to go and make

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Speaker 5: ESPN or someone else's profit when you can keep all

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Speaker 5: your profit by telling the story. I understand why my

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Speaker 5: brethren would be threatened by the changing of that guard.

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Speaker 5: In fact, when I've talked to former athletes who go

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Speaker 5: into ESPN and work at ESPN, they're all stunned because

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Speaker 5: they don't come from the environment of the locker room

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Speaker 5: that's so competitive, cutthroat. They're stunned by the insecurity in

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Speaker 5: the room and the vanity business because it's not coachable people.

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Speaker 5: It's ego. It's a lot of people who haven't had

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Speaker 5: to earn what you guys have had to earn, the

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Speaker 5: difficulties of what you had to climb over in order

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Speaker 5: to get to what you did. And so I understand

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Speaker 5: why it's threatening to us. You're shaking the machine, and

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Speaker 5: when you say you're not taking over yet, you're threatening

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Speaker 5: to like we are tired of the way we're covered.

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Speaker 5: I came up as a sports columnist. What I learned

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Speaker 5: from the writing about sports is you stand in judgment.

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Speaker 5: I'm embarrassed by some of the things that I wrote

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Speaker 5: in my twenties about Alonzo moarning should be loyal to

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Speaker 5: the Miami Heat because x y Z I've apologized Zoe

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Speaker 5: I was in my twenties. I'm learning from other columnists

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Speaker 5: who have written sports columns, and what you do is

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Speaker 5: you judge the athlete you write the provocative thing. You

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Speaker 5: guys are trying to provide a safe space for a

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Speaker 5: different perspective, so you're allowing a broader view. I welcome

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Speaker 5: it because it feels like democracy. It feels like meritocracy.

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Speaker 5: But you're going to be met at a lot of

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Speaker 5: turns with resistance from people who don't want that change

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Speaker 5: because cutting the line or why do they get to

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Speaker 5: to do this when they haven't had, you know, the

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Speaker 5: twenty years of journalistic training.

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Speaker 2: A lot of these words, Dan using the hope y'all

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Speaker 2: writing them down because I many definitions of them, so

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Speaker 2: I know you got me yeah about six of them already. Okay,

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Speaker 2: we can't really follow up what you said about us,

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Speaker 2: but we honored too definitely. You know, like you said

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Speaker 2: to piggyback on what he said, we had our own

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Speaker 2: relationship too, So the biggest thing for us and me

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Speaker 2: and Mad been through a lot. We bounced around the

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Speaker 2: NB a lot. But to have somebody believe in us

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Speaker 2: is the best feeling, right, and to know you believe

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Speaker 2: in us, it's priceless. So we thank you as well.

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Speaker 2: Betting on yourself. You had to bet on yourself leading.

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Speaker 2: What's the hardest part, the most gratified and part of

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Speaker 2: metal law so far.

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Speaker 5: The most gratifying part, what I say all the time,

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Speaker 5: is getting to do it is I don't take for granted.

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Speaker 5: I don't know how much guys you guys suffered sort

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Speaker 5: of the grieving of your former identity of I was

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Speaker 5: a professional athlete. That transition can be very difficult. You're

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Speaker 5: burying who you've been and who you've been working to

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Speaker 5: be for twenty years getting out into freedom when I

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Speaker 5: am the son of Cuban exiles and doing it principled,

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Speaker 5: like the people who are with us are. We've got

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Speaker 5: an unbelievably loyal audience, loyal because they think they know

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Speaker 5: us and me and what I'm about. And if my

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Speaker 5: mentor's son gets fired, it's going to be like, no,

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Speaker 5: we all leave now. All of us are going now.

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Speaker 5: And when you connect with your audience from there right,

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00:18:21,080 --> 00:18:24,240
Speaker 5: because these are intimate mediums and mine it's audio, So

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00:18:24,280 --> 00:18:27,800
Speaker 5: we're like the friends in your head when you're at work,

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Speaker 5: maybe an unhappy job that you have for eight hours,

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Speaker 5: and we're getting you through four of them, or a

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Speaker 5: dark time or whatever, because we're in this intimate space.

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Speaker 5: The idea that I get to do this with and

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Speaker 5: four people I believe in, the idea that I don't

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Speaker 5: have to answer to anybody. How can that not be gratifying?

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Speaker 5: When I could just make things. They pay us to

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Speaker 5: make things, and they pay us to support the people

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Speaker 5: who we want to make things with Like that is

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Speaker 5: real and genuine freedom from Cuban parents who left an

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Speaker 5: island fleeing communism. And I never in my life had

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Speaker 5: negotiated a contract for money. Ever, I always negotiate freedom.

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Speaker 5: I didn't want to work at ESPN and Disney for

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Speaker 5: ten years. I resisted skippers advances. He needed a Latin person,

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Speaker 5: didn't Latin. They underrepresent with Latin. I don't even look Latin.

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Speaker 5: My last name is French. So I had to get

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Speaker 5: I had to get Steven Jackson. I had to get

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Speaker 5: the I had to get the accent so that I

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Speaker 5: would look Latin on television. But what ends up happening?

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Speaker 1: Right?

401
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Speaker 5: So you rent, you rent my father's voice, but at

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Speaker 5: the end I get to leave because you don't own mine.

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Speaker 1: Real quick, before you go on, jack, I was just

404
00:19:39,760 --> 00:19:41,920
Speaker 1: in the bay. I was covering the game for the Kings,

405
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Speaker 1: and I went to dinner with a friend of mine

406
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Speaker 1: and we went to stk in San Francisco, and the bartender,

407
00:19:46,760 --> 00:19:49,960
Speaker 1: older white guy knew me from the Warriors, you know,

408
00:19:50,280 --> 00:19:54,359
Speaker 1: came and brought his shots and he said, congratulations on

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Speaker 1: teaming up with metal Ark I look forward to learning

410
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Speaker 1: more about you and Steven, And I'm just like, so

411
00:19:59,280 --> 00:20:01,159
Speaker 1: he knew we were for basketball players. But again, I

412
00:20:01,200 --> 00:20:04,080
Speaker 1: think that speaks to your audience, because because we're with

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Speaker 1: you guys now, they're looking forward to getting to know

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Speaker 1: who we are.

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00:20:06,800 --> 00:20:10,480
Speaker 5: I cannot wait, Like I mean, I'm sure the people

416
00:20:10,520 --> 00:20:12,720
Speaker 5: who follow here feel like they've got the breath of

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00:20:12,760 --> 00:20:15,520
Speaker 5: your personality. But just in the stories that you were

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Speaker 5: telling last night about what your journey has been, and

419
00:20:19,280 --> 00:20:22,000
Speaker 5: when I talk about my admiration for you guys, I

420
00:20:22,119 --> 00:20:25,440
Speaker 5: don't think people understand how hard it was for you

421
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Speaker 5: to get to the first of the fifteen years or

422
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Speaker 5: the seventeen years in the league, and how hard it

423
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Speaker 5: is to stay to stay there when all of the

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00:20:34,840 --> 00:20:37,960
Speaker 5: young people want your money and it's the world's most

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Speaker 5: competitive place. There don't get to be many of you

426
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Speaker 5: like it's all inspiring to behold, even though we get

427
00:20:46,720 --> 00:20:49,000
Speaker 5: very used to seeing it on television every night, Like

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00:20:49,400 --> 00:20:52,040
Speaker 5: your stories are amazing and I cannot wait to sit

429
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Speaker 5: down and reverse this on you guys, because the one

430
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Speaker 5: time I interviewed him on television, he gave it all up,

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00:20:58,600 --> 00:21:01,399
Speaker 5: Like he gave it all up and and the stories

432
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Speaker 5: were amazing, and I know he's got a thousand more.

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Speaker 5: It's one of the most memorable interviews highly Questionable has

434
00:21:07,280 --> 00:21:09,280
Speaker 5: ever done because.

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Speaker 1: It was highly questionable what he was talking about.

436
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Speaker 4: Yeah, I got questions a both high and take us

437
00:21:21,080 --> 00:21:25,120
Speaker 4: don't sit. How was the approach in your daily show? Now?

438
00:21:25,400 --> 00:21:27,240
Speaker 3: Compare up and when you started in the media space?

439
00:21:27,640 --> 00:21:28,160
Speaker 4: Oh Man.

440
00:21:28,240 --> 00:21:32,359
Speaker 5: So I start as a newspaper columnist and I get

441
00:21:32,400 --> 00:21:36,159
Speaker 5: to the sports reporters in Times Square. The construct is

442
00:21:36,800 --> 00:21:41,560
Speaker 5: guys on Sunday morning judging athletes at the ESPN Zone

443
00:21:41,560 --> 00:21:45,160
Speaker 5: in Times Square. I'm thirty years old. I'm at the news.

444
00:21:45,200 --> 00:21:48,800
Speaker 5: It's downtown New York. ESPN Zone smells like urine from

445
00:21:48,840 --> 00:21:52,400
Speaker 5: the night before and vomit and like chairs on tables.

446
00:21:52,440 --> 00:21:54,159
Speaker 5: And I get there, I'm like, is that all there is?

447
00:21:54,600 --> 00:21:54,719
Speaker 3: Uh?

448
00:21:55,280 --> 00:21:58,760
Speaker 5: And it felt lonely. Uh. Success didn't look like what

449
00:21:58,840 --> 00:22:01,720
Speaker 5: I thought it would, And so I went on a

450
00:22:01,760 --> 00:22:04,040
Speaker 5: path of how do I make this more communal? Writing

451
00:22:04,119 --> 00:22:09,359
Speaker 5: is lonely? Arriving at sports reporters didn't seem like the

452
00:22:09,400 --> 00:22:12,280
Speaker 5: accomplishment I thought it would be, And so I wanted

453
00:22:13,840 --> 00:22:16,280
Speaker 5: group stuff, stuff that had laughter in it. I went

454
00:22:16,560 --> 00:22:20,119
Speaker 5: behind the scenes at PTI when that was starting, Cornheiser

455
00:22:20,160 --> 00:22:22,760
Speaker 5: and Wilbond behind the scenes, the show is much better

456
00:22:22,800 --> 00:22:24,800
Speaker 5: than the show they do on air because they're yelling

457
00:22:24,800 --> 00:22:26,760
Speaker 5: at each other and they're cursing. And the group of

458
00:22:26,800 --> 00:22:29,399
Speaker 5: people they had around them, the sport team, like the

459
00:22:29,400 --> 00:22:32,960
Speaker 5: people that you have here. They had relationships with families,

460
00:22:33,040 --> 00:22:35,480
Speaker 5: so it's jocular, feels a little bit like a locker room.

461
00:22:35,600 --> 00:22:38,280
Speaker 5: So I hear that laughter and the loneliness of writing,

462
00:22:38,320 --> 00:22:40,879
Speaker 5: I'm like, no, no, I want I want that. I

463
00:22:40,880 --> 00:22:42,800
Speaker 5: want something I do with my friends. I want something

464
00:22:42,800 --> 00:22:47,160
Speaker 5: that feels like laughter. I want something that shared, because yeah,

465
00:22:47,200 --> 00:22:49,960
Speaker 5: writing is super lonely. Nobody can do it for you.

466
00:22:50,000 --> 00:22:52,920
Speaker 5: I always identified as a writer for you know, fifteen

467
00:22:53,040 --> 00:22:55,920
Speaker 5: twenty years growing up. That's the one thing people told

468
00:22:55,960 --> 00:22:57,359
Speaker 5: me I was good at when I was young, and

469
00:22:57,359 --> 00:22:58,920
Speaker 5: so that's what I chose because they didn't tell me

470
00:22:58,960 --> 00:23:01,600
Speaker 5: I was good at anything else. And and then I

471
00:23:02,119 --> 00:23:05,520
Speaker 5: went and did fun things that that were meant to

472
00:23:05,520 --> 00:23:08,399
Speaker 5: be counterculture, that were meant to Hey, sports aren't that serious.

473
00:23:08,440 --> 00:23:10,119
Speaker 5: I know, we can take it all serious, but we

474
00:23:10,160 --> 00:23:12,159
Speaker 5: can laugh with my dad, or we can laugh with

475
00:23:12,200 --> 00:23:14,879
Speaker 5: my co host to God too, you know, We've got

476
00:23:14,920 --> 00:23:17,960
Speaker 5: an odd couple relationships. So I've just been trying to

477
00:23:17,960 --> 00:23:20,720
Speaker 5: create environments that are both fun and thoughtful, that they

478
00:23:20,760 --> 00:23:22,880
Speaker 5: that they have some range, that they can go between

479
00:23:22,880 --> 00:23:25,840
Speaker 5: smart and dumb. And so that's what that's some of

480
00:23:25,880 --> 00:23:26,919
Speaker 5: the stuff that we've been building.

481
00:23:27,640 --> 00:23:30,280
Speaker 1: Love it transitioning a little bit. I got a chance

482
00:23:30,280 --> 00:23:31,760
Speaker 1: to meet your wife Valerie last night.

483
00:23:33,040 --> 00:23:33,560
Speaker 4: I loved it.

484
00:23:33,600 --> 00:23:36,120
Speaker 1: She had us all sign a cork to kind of remember, oh.

485
00:23:36,160 --> 00:23:38,439
Speaker 5: I'm supposed to bring it. I forgot to bring it.

486
00:23:38,640 --> 00:23:40,239
Speaker 1: I will leave it after I know she's got it.

487
00:23:40,280 --> 00:23:42,920
Speaker 1: But speak to the effect that she's had on you

488
00:23:43,200 --> 00:23:44,639
Speaker 1: as a man, a businessman.

489
00:23:45,119 --> 00:23:46,920
Speaker 5: This is the part where you're gonna try and get

490
00:23:46,920 --> 00:23:48,800
Speaker 5: me to cry. They told me, you guys are gonna

491
00:23:48,840 --> 00:23:51,760
Speaker 5: try and get me to cry. So you want me

492
00:23:51,800 --> 00:23:53,920
Speaker 5: to talk about love. All right, I'll talk about love,

493
00:23:53,960 --> 00:23:56,040
Speaker 5: but you guys are gonna have to share this with me.

494
00:23:57,520 --> 00:24:02,359
Speaker 5: I simply would not be capable of doing this if

495
00:24:04,240 --> 00:24:06,639
Speaker 5: I don't believe in myself the way that she believes

496
00:24:06,880 --> 00:24:09,919
Speaker 5: in who I am. She thinks I've never looked at

497
00:24:09,920 --> 00:24:14,320
Speaker 5: myself this way. I'm not an entrepreneur. I've just wanted

498
00:24:14,359 --> 00:24:16,480
Speaker 5: to be left alone to do these silly things we do.

499
00:24:16,760 --> 00:24:19,399
Speaker 5: She thinks I'm a boss, and I would say she

500
00:24:19,480 --> 00:24:24,120
Speaker 5: has made me one. Her strength is uncommon. She has

501
00:24:24,960 --> 00:24:30,439
Speaker 5: turned upside down my worldview, and I just feel safe

502
00:24:30,480 --> 00:24:33,800
Speaker 5: with my every vulnerability with her. And now I'm accomplishing

503
00:24:33,840 --> 00:24:37,879
Speaker 5: things I never dreamed of because of the strength and

504
00:24:37,960 --> 00:24:40,000
Speaker 5: her backing me. Because I wish to be the man

505
00:24:40,040 --> 00:24:44,000
Speaker 5: that she thinks and believes I am. I aspire to it,

506
00:24:44,119 --> 00:24:44,680
Speaker 5: and it.

507
00:24:46,520 --> 00:24:47,000
Speaker 4: I don't.

508
00:24:47,600 --> 00:24:50,040
Speaker 5: I never knew what love was, or that it could

509
00:24:50,040 --> 00:24:52,679
Speaker 5: feel that way, or how healing it could be in

510
00:24:52,720 --> 00:24:55,679
Speaker 5: the places where I'm not gentle on myself, like she

511
00:24:55,840 --> 00:24:59,560
Speaker 5: has been a medicine, a bomb that makes all of

512
00:24:59,600 --> 00:25:03,240
Speaker 5: this post Like I could not do it if I

513
00:25:03,640 --> 00:25:08,400
Speaker 5: didn't have with me a foreign feeling that I'd never

514
00:25:08,520 --> 00:25:09,119
Speaker 5: known before.

515
00:25:09,160 --> 00:25:19,240
Speaker 1: That booies me, shut up, valve. I love hearing that.

516
00:25:19,320 --> 00:25:21,160
Speaker 1: I mean behind every good man is a great woman.

517
00:25:21,400 --> 00:25:22,919
Speaker 1: Yeah you know what I mean. You always hear that,

518
00:25:23,080 --> 00:25:24,119
Speaker 1: but you know to have I.

519
00:25:24,119 --> 00:25:26,080
Speaker 5: Wouldn't say she's behind me. I would say she's out

520
00:25:26,119 --> 00:25:26,560
Speaker 5: in front.

521
00:25:26,680 --> 00:25:27,000
Speaker 4: Like I.

522
00:25:29,240 --> 00:25:33,720
Speaker 5: Lost my brother recently, and you know, at his deathbed

523
00:25:33,840 --> 00:25:38,199
Speaker 5: for a year, he and I were praying that I

524
00:25:38,359 --> 00:25:44,639
Speaker 5: might get to joy a more joyous existence, because I've

525
00:25:44,880 --> 00:25:49,399
Speaker 5: had trouble all my life with Joy and I will

526
00:25:49,400 --> 00:25:51,400
Speaker 5: only get there if I'm following her.

527
00:25:52,840 --> 00:25:56,520
Speaker 1: Obviously, I know it's a tough topic. You lost your

528
00:25:56,800 --> 00:25:59,760
Speaker 1: younger brother about four months ago, Jack lost his younger

529
00:25:59,800 --> 00:26:02,879
Speaker 1: brother or has it been a year, a year, a

530
00:26:02,920 --> 00:26:05,960
Speaker 1: little bit over a year ago? Do you mind kind

531
00:26:05,960 --> 00:26:09,200
Speaker 1: of just speaking to that, and you know, like you said,

532
00:26:09,240 --> 00:26:10,840
Speaker 1: you don't you told us off are like he was

533
00:26:10,920 --> 00:26:12,679
Speaker 1: kind of almost like one of my kids because I

534
00:26:12,680 --> 00:26:15,080
Speaker 1: don't have children, and that's how close your guys bond was.

535
00:26:15,160 --> 00:26:19,040
Speaker 5: So this is, uh, it's a long story, and it's

536
00:26:20,000 --> 00:26:22,919
Speaker 5: the hardest thing I've ever experienced. It's a pain that

537
00:26:22,920 --> 00:26:24,639
Speaker 5: has not gone away. It is with me when I

538
00:26:24,680 --> 00:26:27,119
Speaker 5: wake up in the morning. When we briefly touched on it,

539
00:26:27,160 --> 00:26:29,600
Speaker 5: I don't know what he was feeling right before we started,

540
00:26:29,600 --> 00:26:33,600
Speaker 5: but Stephen had to compose himself because of whatever it is.

541
00:26:33,640 --> 00:26:37,840
Speaker 5: I don't know how long how long ago did and

542
00:26:38,040 --> 00:26:41,040
Speaker 5: the grief. I don't know if men talk about this,

543
00:26:41,440 --> 00:26:47,719
Speaker 5: either privately or publicly enough. It is a horror that

544
00:26:49,320 --> 00:26:54,800
Speaker 5: a physical pain in my stomach, that is sadness that

545
00:26:54,920 --> 00:26:57,919
Speaker 5: reminds me that it's there. Even when I'm laughing, I

546
00:26:57,920 --> 00:27:01,320
Speaker 5: can be laughing about something transported and the reminders there

547
00:27:01,320 --> 00:27:05,640
Speaker 5: that my brother is not here. I have isolated from

548
00:27:05,800 --> 00:27:09,280
Speaker 5: people because I don't want to keep rummaging through this bin.

549
00:27:09,440 --> 00:27:14,320
Speaker 5: It hurts too much, and avoidance sometimes feels easier. But

550
00:27:14,440 --> 00:27:17,879
Speaker 5: the specifics of the horror a year daily next to

551
00:27:17,920 --> 00:27:21,480
Speaker 5: a deathbed, A vibrant, colorful personality who did a career

552
00:27:21,520 --> 00:27:24,760
Speaker 5: harder than mine. Art. He was a successful professional artist.

553
00:27:24,760 --> 00:27:27,720
Speaker 5: He was braver than I was. He was more charismatic

554
00:27:27,840 --> 00:27:29,960
Speaker 5: than I was. He was my little brother. I never

555
00:27:30,080 --> 00:27:33,280
Speaker 5: imagined a scenario in which he would die, To watch

556
00:27:33,280 --> 00:27:36,960
Speaker 5: his body wither away, to watch people need to pick

557
00:27:37,000 --> 00:27:39,960
Speaker 5: him up, to go to the bathroom every day, to

558
00:27:40,080 --> 00:27:45,119
Speaker 5: have the memories of that seared in my sleep in

559
00:27:45,160 --> 00:27:50,359
Speaker 5: a way that doesn't give me any rest. It's been

560
00:27:50,520 --> 00:27:53,400
Speaker 5: the most painful thing I've endured, by leaps and bounds.

561
00:27:53,600 --> 00:27:56,680
Speaker 5: But I am so grateful that I got that year

562
00:27:57,640 --> 00:28:01,200
Speaker 5: next to him, to solve all the little brother big

563
00:28:01,240 --> 00:28:05,760
Speaker 5: brother shit, to ask forgiveness for everything, to not have

564
00:28:06,000 --> 00:28:08,880
Speaker 5: in like the horror that is my grief. There is

565
00:28:08,920 --> 00:28:11,720
Speaker 5: no guilt. There is no guilt because I said all

566
00:28:11,720 --> 00:28:18,080
Speaker 5: the things, and he went loved and I'm deeply appreciative

567
00:28:18,080 --> 00:28:20,840
Speaker 5: that I didn't lose him suddenly, Like even though I

568
00:28:20,880 --> 00:28:25,160
Speaker 5: would wish on no one to watch, to watch a body,

569
00:28:25,359 --> 00:28:28,800
Speaker 5: a vibrant body, an athletic body, decomposed in front of you.

570
00:28:28,920 --> 00:28:30,879
Speaker 5: He didn't have the use of the bottom half of

571
00:28:30,920 --> 00:28:33,800
Speaker 5: his body for the last six months, but he wanted

572
00:28:33,840 --> 00:28:39,920
Speaker 5: to stay here. I'd ask you to explore grief with me,

573
00:28:40,000 --> 00:28:42,320
Speaker 5: because I haven't. I have not spent a lot of

574
00:28:42,360 --> 00:28:46,880
Speaker 5: time doing this with others because it hurts to Everyone's

575
00:28:46,880 --> 00:28:50,840
Speaker 5: got their own experience with this. It is different for everybody.

576
00:28:52,840 --> 00:28:55,880
Speaker 5: But I don't have the words to articulate to you

577
00:28:56,120 --> 00:28:59,479
Speaker 5: the level of pain that this caused and the belief

578
00:28:59,520 --> 00:29:02,240
Speaker 5: that I will have a greater appreciation for the growth

579
00:29:02,280 --> 00:29:04,360
Speaker 5: on the other side of that pain because of what

580
00:29:04,480 --> 00:29:07,040
Speaker 5: I learned next to that bed every day for a year.

581
00:29:07,360 --> 00:29:09,440
Speaker 1: Thank you for sharing. I mean, Jack, it's been a

582
00:29:09,480 --> 00:29:13,520
Speaker 1: little over a year for you, and obviously we all

583
00:29:13,560 --> 00:29:15,480
Speaker 1: know how hard you like, where are you kind of

584
00:29:15,520 --> 00:29:25,320
Speaker 1: at with your situation still? I mean it's I mean,

585
00:29:25,320 --> 00:29:28,240
Speaker 1: it's tough, you know again. I told this briefly before

586
00:29:28,280 --> 00:29:30,080
Speaker 1: we got on the air. How Jack and I got

587
00:29:30,080 --> 00:29:33,440
Speaker 1: so close was the loss of my mom, and I'm

588
00:29:33,480 --> 00:29:37,000
Speaker 1: on the opposite spectrum from you and your brother. My

589
00:29:37,080 --> 00:29:40,040
Speaker 1: mom was diagnosed with four cancers November first and died

590
00:29:40,120 --> 00:29:44,240
Speaker 1: November twenty seventh, so I had literally with twenty six days.

591
00:29:45,120 --> 00:29:46,560
Speaker 1: But it was when I was playing for the Warriors

592
00:29:46,600 --> 00:29:48,920
Speaker 1: and I was just gone and Jack was the one

593
00:29:48,960 --> 00:29:52,520
Speaker 1: every day where whether he was calling to crack jokes

594
00:29:52,520 --> 00:29:55,000
Speaker 1: to make me laugh, bringing me food, coming to sit

595
00:29:55,040 --> 00:29:57,760
Speaker 1: and watch TV or movies, coming to bring me some

596
00:29:58,200 --> 00:30:01,600
Speaker 1: weed to smoke, like, Jack was the that was kind

597
00:30:01,600 --> 00:30:04,960
Speaker 1: of just checking on me every day, didn't want didn't

598
00:30:05,000 --> 00:30:06,800
Speaker 1: want nothing to return, just was the one.

599
00:30:06,800 --> 00:30:08,160
Speaker 2: And overall the whole.

600
00:30:08,000 --> 00:30:10,760
Speaker 1: Warriors or organization was great, but you know, Jack really

601
00:30:10,800 --> 00:30:13,720
Speaker 1: went out of his way to just let me know

602
00:30:14,320 --> 00:30:16,720
Speaker 1: he was there, and when I was ready to talk

603
00:30:16,840 --> 00:30:19,320
Speaker 1: or needed to talk, he would be the ear and

604
00:30:19,400 --> 00:30:21,719
Speaker 1: the shoulder I can talk on. And I think what

605
00:30:21,760 --> 00:30:25,080
Speaker 1: I've learned since then is, you know, the pain never

606
00:30:25,120 --> 00:30:27,280
Speaker 1: goes away. You just learn how to manage it over time,

607
00:30:27,800 --> 00:30:30,040
Speaker 1: you know what I mean. And I felt like it.

608
00:30:29,920 --> 00:30:33,240
Speaker 5: Doesn't seem real to me still, like even you're going

609
00:30:33,280 --> 00:30:35,720
Speaker 5: to a deathbed you're going to a hospital every day,

610
00:30:35,840 --> 00:30:38,560
Speaker 5: like for it to still not feel like a real

611
00:30:38,640 --> 00:30:41,280
Speaker 5: thing months after the fact, I can't imagine what you're

612
00:30:41,320 --> 00:30:45,960
Speaker 5: talking about. Seems unreachable to me, you said sixteen seventeen

613
00:30:46,080 --> 00:30:51,280
Speaker 5: years Yeah, it seems it's almost a mountain too overwhelming

614
00:30:51,320 --> 00:30:54,200
Speaker 5: to climb, the idea that I'm going to believe this

615
00:30:54,280 --> 00:30:56,320
Speaker 5: is real. It's the realist thing in the world. Right,

616
00:30:56,400 --> 00:31:00,520
Speaker 5: You're by a deathbed with a cancer patient, and to me,

617
00:31:00,600 --> 00:31:02,520
Speaker 5: it doesn't I don't know if it's the same for you.

618
00:31:02,560 --> 00:31:05,080
Speaker 5: It doesn't seem like a real thing, even though I've

619
00:31:05,120 --> 00:31:05,880
Speaker 5: lived the whole thing.

620
00:31:06,440 --> 00:31:08,360
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's just a crazy experience for me.

621
00:31:08,440 --> 00:31:10,720
Speaker 2: Then I lost my little sister two months for my

622
00:31:10,760 --> 00:31:13,680
Speaker 2: little brother, So I lost both my siblings two much

623
00:31:13,760 --> 00:31:14,120
Speaker 2: of parts.

624
00:31:15,320 --> 00:31:16,480
Speaker 3: And you're ready to talk about it.

625
00:31:17,200 --> 00:31:22,400
Speaker 1: I'm sorry, bro. Let's speak to your upbringing started here

626
00:31:22,400 --> 00:31:24,280
Speaker 1: in New York before you move to Florida. You know,

627
00:31:24,360 --> 00:31:28,680
Speaker 1: parents sacrificed a lot coming from Cuba. Explain your kind

628
00:31:28,680 --> 00:31:32,880
Speaker 1: of upbringing and and and the values and principles you

629
00:31:32,880 --> 00:31:36,000
Speaker 1: were raised with from two people who didn't start in

630
00:31:36,040 --> 00:31:36,560
Speaker 1: the States.

631
00:31:38,280 --> 00:31:42,280
Speaker 5: Work, work means freedom. Work is how you get ahead

632
00:31:42,400 --> 00:31:45,719
Speaker 5: in this country, there have been any number of things

633
00:31:45,800 --> 00:31:52,560
Speaker 5: over the last You're right, I wonder sometimes whether avoidance

634
00:31:52,640 --> 00:31:54,400
Speaker 5: is the best thing on that. Forgive me. I'll answer

635
00:31:54,440 --> 00:31:55,960
Speaker 5: your question in a second, but I can go ahead.

636
00:31:55,960 --> 00:32:00,120
Speaker 5: I marveled. I did an interview with Marcellus Wiley, and

637
00:32:00,360 --> 00:32:02,720
Speaker 5: he's such a tough human being, and his hands are

638
00:32:02,760 --> 00:32:05,640
Speaker 5: gnarled as he's sort of telling the story of being

639
00:32:05,640 --> 00:32:08,560
Speaker 5: asked to close his mom's casket, and he's just chosen

640
00:32:08,600 --> 00:32:11,400
Speaker 5: the path of avoidance because he's like, if I don't

641
00:32:11,760 --> 00:32:14,840
Speaker 5: avoid He's obviously a very tough man, but he's like,

642
00:32:14,920 --> 00:32:18,320
Speaker 5: that's too much for me to handle. Whatever your feeling

643
00:32:18,920 --> 00:32:24,440
Speaker 5: there where I would counsel you from what little I

644
00:32:24,480 --> 00:32:27,520
Speaker 5: know in these four months. You shouldn't stuff all of

645
00:32:27,560 --> 00:32:29,360
Speaker 5: that down. You should share it with somebody. Maybe not,

646
00:32:29,560 --> 00:32:33,400
Speaker 5: maybe it's too much, maybe it's not here. But anyways,

647
00:32:33,440 --> 00:32:39,200
Speaker 5: my parents, they came from Cuba. They left in their

648
00:32:39,200 --> 00:32:42,200
Speaker 5: teenage years. They get on planes, freedom is lost, get

649
00:32:42,200 --> 00:32:44,600
Speaker 5: on planes. They think they're going to see their family soon.

650
00:32:44,800 --> 00:32:48,520
Speaker 5: It goes many, many years without seeing their family. Imagine

651
00:32:48,520 --> 00:32:50,720
Speaker 5: what the desperation has to be on an island where

652
00:32:50,760 --> 00:32:53,440
Speaker 5: people literally throw their lives to the winds on like

653
00:32:53,520 --> 00:32:57,320
Speaker 5: inner tubes. That the between Cuba and Miami is the

654
00:32:57,320 --> 00:33:00,880
Speaker 5: biggest cemetery, and that ocean is the big cemetery that

655
00:33:00,920 --> 00:33:03,520
Speaker 5: you will find because so many people are literally the

656
00:33:03,560 --> 00:33:07,800
Speaker 5: desperation pushes them out. So my parents as teenagers come

657
00:33:07,840 --> 00:33:10,560
Speaker 5: to this country and make their way, believing this country

658
00:33:10,560 --> 00:33:12,800
Speaker 5: to be a certain thing, which it was for them,

659
00:33:12,840 --> 00:33:15,320
Speaker 5: a land of opportunity, a land where they would I

660
00:33:15,360 --> 00:33:17,920
Speaker 5: would never have to make any sacrifices because they made

661
00:33:17,920 --> 00:33:20,960
Speaker 5: all of them. They got me to freedom. And the

662
00:33:21,000 --> 00:33:24,280
Speaker 5: way you get to freedom is through work. That's how

663
00:33:24,320 --> 00:33:27,160
Speaker 5: immigrants do it, exiles do it. This country has a

664
00:33:27,160 --> 00:33:31,720
Speaker 5: lot of economies that thrive off you work, and so

665
00:33:32,040 --> 00:33:36,600
Speaker 5: in that I got almost the entirety of my identity

666
00:33:36,360 --> 00:33:40,920
Speaker 5: in ways that probably aren't healthy but have been successful.

667
00:33:40,960 --> 00:33:44,120
Speaker 5: I'm lopsided, lopsided in the ways you know you guys

668
00:33:44,120 --> 00:33:46,920
Speaker 5: can be. I would imagine that to be as great

669
00:33:46,920 --> 00:33:49,440
Speaker 5: as you were at basketball, you couldn't have time for

670
00:33:49,560 --> 00:33:52,760
Speaker 5: much of anything else. It had to be an obsession

671
00:33:52,800 --> 00:33:56,160
Speaker 5: that you were doing all the time, every day, thinking

672
00:33:56,160 --> 00:33:58,640
Speaker 5: about all the time, always pressurized.

673
00:33:58,720 --> 00:34:00,880
Speaker 2: And so I made time for I have made time

674
00:34:00,880 --> 00:34:02,840
Speaker 2: for weed and strip clubs too, so.

675
00:34:03,000 --> 00:34:05,200
Speaker 1: Strip clubs, Yeah, I got all that in So those

676
00:34:05,240 --> 00:34:07,760
Speaker 1: are those are even split.

677
00:34:08,239 --> 00:34:09,920
Speaker 4: I was dedicated to all of them, saying.

678
00:34:10,600 --> 00:34:12,520
Speaker 1: The one thing I will say is Jack has his

679
00:34:12,640 --> 00:34:14,520
Speaker 1: jersey retired into Atlanta strip clubs.

680
00:34:14,520 --> 00:34:15,359
Speaker 4: Three stop three?

681
00:34:15,560 --> 00:34:16,080
Speaker 1: Excuse me?

682
00:34:16,200 --> 00:34:17,040
Speaker 3: Yeah.

683
00:34:17,080 --> 00:34:19,520
Speaker 5: Oh, but then people get the impression though that you

684
00:34:19,600 --> 00:34:22,520
Speaker 5: don't work, that some holy man reached into your crib

685
00:34:22,560 --> 00:34:26,759
Speaker 5: and just made you a better basketball Like okay, yeah,

686
00:34:26,840 --> 00:34:28,800
Speaker 5: you had fun because you had to blow off steam,

687
00:34:28,840 --> 00:34:31,400
Speaker 5: but you guys had to be obsessive competitive to be

688
00:34:31,560 --> 00:34:33,600
Speaker 5: great in a way that's not even reasonable.

689
00:34:34,600 --> 00:34:37,040
Speaker 1: Your relationship with your father, obviously, the world got the

690
00:34:37,120 --> 00:34:39,680
Speaker 1: chance to know him and love him on your show.

691
00:34:40,320 --> 00:34:44,440
Speaker 1: How's he doing? And and and what's that that process

692
00:34:44,440 --> 00:34:45,839
Speaker 1: of father son been like for you?

693
00:34:46,000 --> 00:34:49,680
Speaker 5: I mean, it's so great and interesting so many ways. Uh,

694
00:34:49,880 --> 00:34:56,440
Speaker 5: my father worked for I'm gonna say, this is so

695
00:34:56,600 --> 00:34:59,000
Speaker 5: funny all of this. My father didn't know how to

696
00:34:59,040 --> 00:35:01,359
Speaker 5: tell me he didn't want to do the television show

697
00:35:01,360 --> 00:35:03,520
Speaker 5: anymore because he's worked all his life. He was approaching

698
00:35:03,520 --> 00:35:06,040
Speaker 5: eighty and the celebrity and the stuff, you know, getting

699
00:35:06,160 --> 00:35:08,560
Speaker 5: you know, free tuna sandwiches and slapped on the back

700
00:35:08,560 --> 00:35:09,240
Speaker 5: on heath games.

701
00:35:09,239 --> 00:35:09,640
Speaker 4: He's eighty.

702
00:35:09,680 --> 00:35:11,440
Speaker 5: He just wants to shuffle around the house and be

703
00:35:11,520 --> 00:35:19,279
Speaker 5: left alone. So he tells ESPN that he's underpaid and

704
00:35:19,320 --> 00:35:21,880
Speaker 5: he wants to be paid more because he can't figure

705
00:35:21,880 --> 00:35:23,680
Speaker 5: out a way to tell me he doesn't want to

706
00:35:23,719 --> 00:35:27,080
Speaker 5: do the show anymore. And he figures, well, ESPN won't

707
00:35:27,080 --> 00:35:30,160
Speaker 5: give him the raise, and they called his bluff and

708
00:35:30,520 --> 00:35:33,839
Speaker 5: they gave him more money. And so my father ends

709
00:35:33,920 --> 00:35:36,400
Speaker 5: up winning at the end. But at the very end

710
00:35:36,480 --> 00:35:38,680
Speaker 5: of what we were doing, he really didn't want to

711
00:35:38,719 --> 00:35:41,680
Speaker 5: do it anymore. But the eight years that we had

712
00:35:41,719 --> 00:35:44,640
Speaker 5: before that are the biggest professional blessing of my life

713
00:35:44,840 --> 00:35:47,919
Speaker 5: because I got closer with my father than I'd ever

714
00:35:47,960 --> 00:35:53,239
Speaker 5: been in retirement. I allowed him to do something with

715
00:35:53,360 --> 00:35:56,480
Speaker 5: his later years that felt like he was genuinely helping me,

716
00:35:56,560 --> 00:35:58,680
Speaker 5: and he was because he was the star of the show.

717
00:35:58,760 --> 00:36:01,000
Speaker 5: I gave him a TV show and fucker stole it

718
00:36:01,040 --> 00:36:07,239
Speaker 5: from me. And one of the greatest delights and surprises

719
00:36:07,440 --> 00:36:09,759
Speaker 5: in all of that, And you guys could speak to

720
00:36:09,800 --> 00:36:14,000
Speaker 5: the barbershop quality of this. When Memorial Day weekend in

721
00:36:14,080 --> 00:36:18,320
Speaker 5: miamient no, No. But when he goes in his car,

722
00:36:19,640 --> 00:36:24,319
Speaker 5: he is a king black people love my father more

723
00:36:24,440 --> 00:36:28,600
Speaker 5: than Latin people do. I'm not kidding you.

724
00:36:29,280 --> 00:36:30,320
Speaker 1: Because of his rap lyrics.

725
00:36:31,840 --> 00:36:34,080
Speaker 3: Just lit he get it.

726
00:36:34,320 --> 00:36:36,000
Speaker 5: I'm not kidding you that that was one of the

727
00:36:36,400 --> 00:36:38,960
Speaker 5: how would I have imagined that? From from where it

728
00:36:39,040 --> 00:36:42,000
Speaker 5: is that we started. So my father's doing the show

729
00:36:42,040 --> 00:36:45,520
Speaker 5: in his second language. He doesn't really know anything about sports.

730
00:36:45,600 --> 00:36:48,680
Speaker 5: But my earliest memory was like walking with my little

731
00:36:48,680 --> 00:36:51,400
Speaker 5: hand in his into a magical stadium and it was

732
00:36:51,440 --> 00:36:54,680
Speaker 5: a father son connection and I learned to love sports,

733
00:36:54,760 --> 00:36:56,600
Speaker 5: and the energy of that was like, how do I

734
00:36:56,600 --> 00:36:59,600
Speaker 5: connect with my father through sports? So to be able

735
00:36:59,640 --> 00:37:03,520
Speaker 5: to be on television and with my father And then

736
00:37:03,640 --> 00:37:06,640
Speaker 5: this part was important because my CEO, John Skipper was

737
00:37:06,680 --> 00:37:09,840
Speaker 5: working very hard to try and diversify the opinions and

738
00:37:09,880 --> 00:37:14,240
Speaker 5: the voices and the perspectives at ESPN. Every single person

739
00:37:14,280 --> 00:37:16,880
Speaker 5: who sat next to my father was always a minority

740
00:37:17,000 --> 00:37:19,439
Speaker 5: with another voice. It was important to me to put

741
00:37:19,480 --> 00:37:22,320
Speaker 5: that on the platform. All of them made more likable

742
00:37:22,520 --> 00:37:25,200
Speaker 5: as I was because my father was in the middle

743
00:37:25,239 --> 00:37:28,359
Speaker 5: of it, providing the laughs, providing the show. That made

744
00:37:28,400 --> 00:37:31,040
Speaker 5: it just this much different than the other shows on ESPN.

745
00:37:31,080 --> 00:37:31,400
Speaker 3: I have it.

746
00:37:31,640 --> 00:37:34,080
Speaker 1: Can you give us Poppy's introduction of you.

747
00:37:35,880 --> 00:37:39,520
Speaker 3: Today we have introducing Stephen Juckson.

748
00:37:41,800 --> 00:37:44,919
Speaker 5: He says he's going, he says he's going to profess better.

749
00:37:46,040 --> 00:37:46,719
Speaker 4: It's pretty good.

750
00:37:46,880 --> 00:37:49,120
Speaker 3: Who was some of the journalists you looked up to

751
00:37:49,440 --> 00:37:50,319
Speaker 3: as you was coming up?

752
00:37:52,719 --> 00:37:55,400
Speaker 5: So I guess these were to all be too old.

753
00:37:55,440 --> 00:37:57,200
Speaker 4: You guys would age out.

754
00:37:56,880 --> 00:37:59,920
Speaker 5: Like they're all too old, I would think for you.

755
00:38:00,800 --> 00:38:03,440
Speaker 5: Gary Smith was a great writer at Sports Illustrated. He

756
00:38:03,520 --> 00:38:06,359
Speaker 5: wrote profiles. He wrote three or four a year where

757
00:38:06,400 --> 00:38:09,160
Speaker 5: he would really and this is one of my attractions

758
00:38:09,200 --> 00:38:11,719
Speaker 5: to the sociology of sports, because I'm more interested in

759
00:38:11,760 --> 00:38:14,359
Speaker 5: the human condition in it than I am in even

760
00:38:14,400 --> 00:38:17,239
Speaker 5: the drama of the games. He'd write these profiles of

761
00:38:17,280 --> 00:38:20,440
Speaker 5: people where he would interview fifty people before he started writing.

762
00:38:20,480 --> 00:38:22,439
Speaker 5: And when I was in college reading one of them,

763
00:38:22,520 --> 00:38:26,400
Speaker 5: I threw the Sports Illustrated across the dorm room because

764
00:38:26,440 --> 00:38:28,879
Speaker 5: I didn't think I would ever be that good at

765
00:38:28,920 --> 00:38:32,120
Speaker 5: being able to capture the essence of who somebody was.

766
00:38:32,280 --> 00:38:36,520
Speaker 5: But he wasn't an opinion giver. These weren't essays. These

767
00:38:36,600 --> 00:38:40,680
Speaker 5: were just rich, deep profiles of Let me explain who

768
00:38:40,800 --> 00:38:44,640
Speaker 5: Stephen Jackson is to you in ways that Stephen Jackson

769
00:38:44,680 --> 00:38:48,879
Speaker 5: will read and learn about himself because he's taking the

770
00:38:48,920 --> 00:38:53,160
Speaker 5: care that a journalist should to get it right, to

771
00:38:53,280 --> 00:38:57,200
Speaker 5: be fair, to tell the story correctly, to tell it thoroughly.

772
00:38:57,440 --> 00:39:02,800
Speaker 5: And so you know, my early influencers weren't the opinion givers.

773
00:39:02,880 --> 00:39:05,040
Speaker 5: They were the people who could tell a human story

774
00:39:05,080 --> 00:39:07,839
Speaker 5: about a human being that made me feel something that

775
00:39:07,920 --> 00:39:10,960
Speaker 5: would attached to them. So now I'm not just rooting

776
00:39:11,000 --> 00:39:13,799
Speaker 5: for sports. I'm not rooting for the regional identity of

777
00:39:13,800 --> 00:39:17,520
Speaker 5: my team. I'm rooting for this guy, this guy because

778
00:39:17,560 --> 00:39:18,680
Speaker 5: I liked what they're about.

779
00:39:19,440 --> 00:39:22,360
Speaker 3: Interesting wrote fort to Miami Hero in the nineties.

780
00:39:22,640 --> 00:39:24,840
Speaker 2: One story that you're proud of that you wrote, and

781
00:39:24,880 --> 00:39:26,360
Speaker 2: one story you covered that you regret.

782
00:39:27,320 --> 00:39:33,680
Speaker 5: Oh wow, Okay, So I went to Cuba. I wrote

783
00:39:33,680 --> 00:39:39,160
Speaker 5: an assortment of articles from Cuba, you know, visiting my parents' homeland,

784
00:39:39,239 --> 00:39:43,200
Speaker 5: seeing the way the stories of their childhood that they

785
00:39:43,280 --> 00:39:45,840
Speaker 5: described as palatial, I saw a place stuck in the

786
00:39:45,920 --> 00:39:51,400
Speaker 5: nineteen fifties. I sat on the steps of their home,

787
00:39:51,600 --> 00:39:55,920
Speaker 5: old home and wept because, you know, this island, this childhood,

788
00:39:55,920 --> 00:40:00,120
Speaker 5: this freedom, this was all taken from them. And so

789
00:40:00,560 --> 00:40:02,640
Speaker 5: the stuff that I wrote about Cuba, where I was

790
00:40:02,680 --> 00:40:07,400
Speaker 5: explaining to my where I was giving a Cuban voice

791
00:40:07,640 --> 00:40:14,120
Speaker 5: nationally to how Hispanic people feel, and also telling personally

792
00:40:14,280 --> 00:40:18,120
Speaker 5: intimate stories that were meaningful to me. And I have

793
00:40:18,200 --> 00:40:20,719
Speaker 5: a lot of regrets about things that I wrote in

794
00:40:20,719 --> 00:40:23,400
Speaker 5: my twenties, just because I was trying to learn how

795
00:40:23,400 --> 00:40:26,239
Speaker 5: to be a columnist. Like I was a columnist at

796
00:40:26,280 --> 00:40:29,560
Speaker 5: twenty six. It was too early for me to have

797
00:40:29,640 --> 00:40:34,000
Speaker 5: to be given the right to have opinions that would

798
00:40:34,000 --> 00:40:37,880
Speaker 5: put in print something that judged you, guys as less

799
00:40:37,920 --> 00:40:41,120
Speaker 5: than because of an athletic performance, because you took too

800
00:40:41,200 --> 00:40:43,960
Speaker 5: much money. You know you took you were holding out

801
00:40:43,960 --> 00:40:44,920
Speaker 5: over money or whatever.

802
00:40:45,120 --> 00:40:45,520
Speaker 4: I didn't have.

803
00:40:45,719 --> 00:40:48,720
Speaker 5: I didn't have world views that were formed and shaped.

804
00:40:48,800 --> 00:40:50,560
Speaker 5: I just knew how to write things that were in

805
00:40:50,680 --> 00:40:53,560
Speaker 5: scendiary or you know. And I would learn over time

806
00:40:53,600 --> 00:40:55,120
Speaker 5: that's not who I want to be. That's not who

807
00:40:55,120 --> 00:40:57,600
Speaker 5: I want to be. It's just if that was what

808
00:40:57,719 --> 00:41:00,520
Speaker 5: success looked like. When I'm telling you, the story tellers

809
00:41:00,560 --> 00:41:02,879
Speaker 5: who are telling the long stories about things, those are

810
00:41:02,920 --> 00:41:05,240
Speaker 5: like poets. That's a hard way to make a living.

811
00:41:05,560 --> 00:41:08,839
Speaker 5: The ones who were getting rewarded were the ones who

812
00:41:08,880 --> 00:41:12,840
Speaker 5: were getting engagement because they were crushing you guys. Or having,

813
00:41:13,040 --> 00:41:16,280
Speaker 5: you know, very strong opinions. And you've seen what's happened

814
00:41:16,560 --> 00:41:19,640
Speaker 5: in the last twenty years with sports debate, television and stuff.

815
00:41:19,840 --> 00:41:22,960
Speaker 5: How all this stuff gets crueler when the path to

816
00:41:23,040 --> 00:41:26,759
Speaker 5: success and attention is well, you gotta, you gotta come

817
00:41:26,840 --> 00:41:29,520
Speaker 5: down on the athlete. You gotta tell you, gotta, you

818
00:41:29,560 --> 00:41:31,879
Speaker 5: gotta show them that we're the customer, We're the fan,

819
00:41:32,520 --> 00:41:35,080
Speaker 5: and we're the ones who deserve X, Y and Z.

820
00:41:35,280 --> 00:41:37,720
Speaker 5: Like you guys grew how many how many rip jobs

821
00:41:37,719 --> 00:41:40,120
Speaker 5: did you guys? How many things did you guys read

822
00:41:40,400 --> 00:41:42,560
Speaker 5: about yourselves that you had to hide from your children?

823
00:41:43,480 --> 00:41:45,440
Speaker 1: No, I mean it was a lot of good. It

824
00:41:45,480 --> 00:41:49,919
Speaker 1: was all on TV. I think you made a great

825
00:41:49,960 --> 00:41:53,040
Speaker 1: point from a standpoint of what the standard is now

826
00:41:53,120 --> 00:41:57,799
Speaker 1: to to to grow in sports media when it when

827
00:41:57,880 --> 00:41:59,960
Speaker 1: it comes to debate shows. And you know, I was

828
00:42:00,080 --> 00:42:03,560
Speaker 1: over at ESPN and there were times where the producer

829
00:42:03,640 --> 00:42:05,520
Speaker 1: would want me to say stuff that I just wasn't.

830
00:42:05,760 --> 00:42:07,480
Speaker 1: I'm not going to say that, you know, I'm not

831
00:42:07,560 --> 00:42:09,600
Speaker 1: comfortable saying that. But like you said, I feel like,

832
00:42:09,640 --> 00:42:11,480
Speaker 1: and this is no knock on anyone who's been able

833
00:42:11,520 --> 00:42:14,520
Speaker 1: to kind of climb those corporate ladders in those spaces,

834
00:42:14,560 --> 00:42:18,280
Speaker 1: I feel like the more outlandish, the louder, the wilder

835
00:42:18,320 --> 00:42:23,520
Speaker 1: the take you have rather wide or wrong, you're rewarded

836
00:42:23,560 --> 00:42:26,000
Speaker 1: for and you start climbing the ladder because again, like

837
00:42:26,040 --> 00:42:28,400
Speaker 1: I said, whatever the angle is, whether it's bashing athletes

838
00:42:28,520 --> 00:42:30,439
Speaker 1: or keeping it real or whatever the fuck they want

839
00:42:30,440 --> 00:42:33,080
Speaker 1: to call it, it's getting clicks, it's getting views, and

840
00:42:33,680 --> 00:42:37,279
Speaker 1: you're becoming a personality, you know, on this platform. So

841
00:42:37,880 --> 00:42:41,080
Speaker 1: I was always just very comfortable with staying in my

842
00:42:41,239 --> 00:42:41,959
Speaker 1: lane over there.

843
00:42:42,239 --> 00:42:45,040
Speaker 5: And you know, oh, but you were already famous, you are.

844
00:42:45,160 --> 00:42:48,160
Speaker 5: You already knew what came with the currency of attention.

845
00:42:48,440 --> 00:42:51,680
Speaker 5: You had, you had money. They're like, yeah, if you're

846
00:42:51,680 --> 00:42:54,600
Speaker 5: a career is perhaps you'd have to compromise your principles

847
00:42:54,680 --> 00:42:56,480
Speaker 5: because would you yeah, to get ahead.

848
00:42:56,520 --> 00:42:57,960
Speaker 1: And you're not even mad about it. Like I said,

849
00:42:58,000 --> 00:43:00,000
Speaker 1: I get it, and I understand it. But we talked

850
00:43:00,040 --> 00:43:02,000
Speaker 1: about it last night at dinner. You know, when it

851
00:43:02,040 --> 00:43:04,080
Speaker 1: comes to certain things, This is no knock on anyone.

852
00:43:04,120 --> 00:43:07,920
Speaker 1: I just I value relationships more than I value views

853
00:43:08,320 --> 00:43:10,600
Speaker 1: or clicks. I guess, like I love the fact that

854
00:43:10,640 --> 00:43:13,239
Speaker 1: I could still call former teammates and ask for a

855
00:43:13,239 --> 00:43:15,480
Speaker 1: favor or ask them to do interviews or ask them

856
00:43:15,480 --> 00:43:16,799
Speaker 1: to come on the show. And I feel like some

857
00:43:16,960 --> 00:43:20,600
Speaker 1: athletes once they crossed that line, like there is no

858
00:43:20,760 --> 00:43:23,640
Speaker 1: going back with some of their former teammates or colleagues

859
00:43:23,719 --> 00:43:25,359
Speaker 1: or people they played in the league with. Because it's

860
00:43:25,360 --> 00:43:26,919
Speaker 1: not that I wouldn't even call it the dark side,

861
00:43:26,960 --> 00:43:29,759
Speaker 1: but it's just like they've kind of fully embodied this

862
00:43:29,880 --> 00:43:33,000
Speaker 1: media persona now that athletes are looking at them like,

863
00:43:33,719 --> 00:43:35,319
Speaker 1: you used to play here. How couldn't you even say

864
00:43:35,320 --> 00:43:36,880
Speaker 1: something like that? You know what I mean? And I

865
00:43:36,960 --> 00:43:39,239
Speaker 1: never wanted to be on that, but I saw that

866
00:43:39,280 --> 00:43:40,920
Speaker 1: if you died't kind of do that. You get an

867
00:43:40,960 --> 00:43:43,440
Speaker 1: opportunity to climb up in the space.

868
00:43:43,239 --> 00:43:45,960
Speaker 5: What happened with you? You had some experiences like that.

869
00:43:46,200 --> 00:43:48,040
Speaker 5: I can't imagine people were trying to tell you what

870
00:43:48,080 --> 00:43:50,600
Speaker 5: to be saying about anything, ESPN anywhere.

871
00:43:51,120 --> 00:43:53,400
Speaker 1: ESPN was the only place that I got rubbed the

872
00:43:53,400 --> 00:43:55,480
Speaker 1: wrong way.

873
00:43:55,719 --> 00:43:56,799
Speaker 3: One they didn't want to pay me.

874
00:43:56,840 --> 00:43:58,839
Speaker 2: But I think the whole reason why the didn't want

875
00:43:58,840 --> 00:44:02,759
Speaker 2: to pay me because I'm embarrassed woes on TV.

876
00:44:03,600 --> 00:44:06,000
Speaker 3: I embarrassed on TV. We was on had a situation

877
00:44:06,000 --> 00:44:06,359
Speaker 3: where he.

878
00:44:06,320 --> 00:44:09,000
Speaker 2: Was saying something about Jimmy Butler, I mean, Jimmy had

879
00:44:09,000 --> 00:44:11,319
Speaker 2: a great relationship, and I didn't believe it when he

880
00:44:11,360 --> 00:44:12,920
Speaker 2: said it so off air, I called him and he

881
00:44:12,960 --> 00:44:14,719
Speaker 2: was on a commercial break and I hit him and

882
00:44:14,760 --> 00:44:16,600
Speaker 2: he said it wasn't true. And you know, Rachel's my girl.

883
00:44:16,600 --> 00:44:19,080
Speaker 2: And I told Rachel, Rachel, don't say it now, wait

884
00:44:19,080 --> 00:44:21,440
Speaker 2: till we get back on air. And I told him

885
00:44:21,440 --> 00:44:23,040
Speaker 2: that wasn't true on air, and I, you know, showed

886
00:44:23,080 --> 00:44:26,920
Speaker 2: him the message from Jimmy. And after that, my relationship

887
00:44:26,960 --> 00:44:29,960
Speaker 2: I stopped working as much. Gena start giving me calls

888
00:44:30,040 --> 00:44:33,279
Speaker 2: like we gotta start figuring something else. Well, have you

889
00:44:33,280 --> 00:44:34,800
Speaker 2: talk to guys at Fox? Like I knew it was

890
00:44:34,800 --> 00:44:37,160
Speaker 2: about to be over because nobody never did him like that.

891
00:44:37,239 --> 00:44:41,839
Speaker 4: But I knew he was full of shit now.

892
00:44:41,840 --> 00:44:47,640
Speaker 1: But then, on another note, you know the transition that

893
00:44:48,120 --> 00:44:51,719
Speaker 1: has been made with someone like a Pat McAfee transitioning

894
00:44:51,760 --> 00:44:55,040
Speaker 1: into ESPN and really kind of doing it his way

895
00:44:55,120 --> 00:44:58,040
Speaker 1: or as close to his way as can be. Obviously,

896
00:44:58,239 --> 00:45:02,520
Speaker 1: just called out a studio had in Norby Williamson lately,

897
00:45:03,000 --> 00:45:04,680
Speaker 1: what are your thoughts you know kind of mean in

898
00:45:04,760 --> 00:45:07,680
Speaker 1: that and now looking at it from an outside perspective.

899
00:45:07,880 --> 00:45:10,959
Speaker 5: It's fascinating here, and I think you guys will find

900
00:45:11,040 --> 00:45:14,360
Speaker 5: much of this very interesting. It's going to take some telling,

901
00:45:14,400 --> 00:45:17,839
Speaker 5: and I want to be careful because I support people

902
00:45:17,880 --> 00:45:20,719
Speaker 5: who bet on themselves. I don't want to appear like

903
00:45:20,800 --> 00:45:24,200
Speaker 5: I'm bitter at ESPN or that I'm not rooting for

904
00:45:24,239 --> 00:45:27,680
Speaker 5: Pat McAfee, because I want everybody to get their money.

905
00:45:27,760 --> 00:45:31,440
Speaker 5: He's creative, he's charismatic. But what do you guys know

906
00:45:31,680 --> 00:45:35,560
Speaker 5: about the details of my story? Because the last straw

907
00:45:36,600 --> 00:45:40,880
Speaker 5: was them letting go of my mentor's son without telling me.

908
00:45:41,040 --> 00:45:43,720
Speaker 5: But what do you guys know about the previous parts

909
00:45:43,760 --> 00:45:45,440
Speaker 5: of the story and where it is I was getting

910
00:45:45,480 --> 00:45:47,839
Speaker 5: in hot water and what I was bumping against when

911
00:45:47,880 --> 00:45:49,160
Speaker 5: I was bumping against it.

912
00:45:49,400 --> 00:45:51,319
Speaker 1: I don't know the details, and I don't know if

913
00:45:51,360 --> 00:45:52,160
Speaker 1: Jack Onno was well.

914
00:45:52,719 --> 00:45:54,840
Speaker 2: I just from what just I'll just say this, I

915
00:45:54,920 --> 00:45:58,600
Speaker 2: knew from being at ESPN band from Jena, I knew

916
00:45:58,800 --> 00:46:04,800
Speaker 2: your show was the show that it was one quote

917
00:46:04,800 --> 00:46:08,479
Speaker 2: away from being kicked off ESPN. That's what I always felt,

918
00:46:08,480 --> 00:46:10,759
Speaker 2: and that was the mode around every time I seen

919
00:46:10,800 --> 00:46:13,279
Speaker 2: your show, people talking about your show ESPN like that's

920
00:46:13,280 --> 00:46:15,400
Speaker 2: the show that that that treads the line.

921
00:46:15,200 --> 00:46:17,440
Speaker 5: All right, So let me tell you where the backstory is,

922
00:46:17,440 --> 00:46:19,399
Speaker 5: because I think you guys to be you guys will

923
00:46:19,400 --> 00:46:23,080
Speaker 5: find fascinating sort of the corridors of power and how

924
00:46:23,080 --> 00:46:25,800
Speaker 5: some of this stuff works. So John Skipper, the CEO

925
00:46:25,880 --> 00:46:29,400
Speaker 5: of Metal Lark, was running ESPN and I was there.

926
00:46:29,840 --> 00:46:32,600
Speaker 5: I got suspended for silly things. I put up billboards

927
00:46:33,239 --> 00:46:37,040
Speaker 5: at Lebron's return to Cleveland saying you're welcome Miami, you know,

928
00:46:37,239 --> 00:46:40,040
Speaker 5: and I put and I got suspended for that. I

929
00:46:40,080 --> 00:46:42,120
Speaker 5: got suspended for that. It was a joke, it was funny,

930
00:46:42,120 --> 00:46:44,480
Speaker 5: it was great. I got it, but I got suspended

931
00:46:44,480 --> 00:46:46,640
Speaker 5: for silly things. I got suspended for selling my Hall

932
00:46:46,680 --> 00:46:50,319
Speaker 5: of Fame vote to dead Spin in baseball because I

933
00:46:50,360 --> 00:46:54,200
Speaker 5: was like, come on, athletes, they're gonna use healing things

934
00:46:54,200 --> 00:46:56,759
Speaker 5: if they're competitive on steroids. Can we stop keeping them

935
00:46:56,800 --> 00:46:58,120
Speaker 5: out of the Hall of Fame? And I sort of

936
00:46:58,400 --> 00:47:00,919
Speaker 5: sold my vote away because I didn't like the moralizing there.

937
00:47:01,760 --> 00:47:06,640
Speaker 5: But when Skipper leaves, a new president comes in charge

938
00:47:06,800 --> 00:47:09,960
Speaker 5: and there's a new policy, and the first time I

939
00:47:10,000 --> 00:47:12,840
Speaker 5: got in trouble with him is when Trump is going

940
00:47:12,960 --> 00:47:17,880
Speaker 5: after for women of color of political power, one of

941
00:47:17,920 --> 00:47:23,680
Speaker 5: them a refugee from Somalia, who is advocating for how

942
00:47:25,000 --> 00:47:28,759
Speaker 5: inhumane the cages are at the borders where there are

943
00:47:28,760 --> 00:47:32,000
Speaker 5: brown babies, And what is being shouted at the protest

944
00:47:32,160 --> 00:47:36,360
Speaker 5: rally is send her back the crowd of Trump people.

945
00:47:36,440 --> 00:47:38,400
Speaker 5: And so the first time I get in trouble is

946
00:47:38,400 --> 00:47:42,480
Speaker 5: calling bullshit on that policy, saying you cannot tell a

947
00:47:42,560 --> 00:47:45,960
Speaker 5: son of exiles that I'm not allowed to talk about

948
00:47:46,000 --> 00:47:49,279
Speaker 5: this unless an athlete says about it first, something about

949
00:47:49,320 --> 00:47:50,920
Speaker 5: it first, so that I can then use him as

950
00:47:50,920 --> 00:47:53,440
Speaker 5: a meat shield, which is what their policy was. If

951
00:47:53,480 --> 00:47:56,799
Speaker 5: it's news, you can talk about politics. But I'm like,

952
00:47:57,160 --> 00:48:00,759
Speaker 5: these microphones matter, man, And if I'm not just talk

953
00:48:00,800 --> 00:48:04,200
Speaker 5: about whether the Pacers are better with Haliburton, like I

954
00:48:04,400 --> 00:48:07,759
Speaker 5: come like, if you're gonna give me the power to

955
00:48:07,800 --> 00:48:10,160
Speaker 5: represent a minority for you on television, if I'm gonna

956
00:48:10,160 --> 00:48:12,640
Speaker 5: be a Hispanic man with my Hispanic father as a

957
00:48:12,680 --> 00:48:15,960
Speaker 5: cartoon that we're gonna have fun with, because all right,

958
00:48:16,280 --> 00:48:19,600
Speaker 5: we'll do your game. When the microphone's gotta matter. Because

959
00:48:19,600 --> 00:48:25,399
Speaker 5: they're chanting send her back. I can't say anything about

960
00:48:25,400 --> 00:48:27,600
Speaker 5: how racist that is. I can't say anything about how

961
00:48:27,640 --> 00:48:29,919
Speaker 5: that's not the America I signed up, Like, send her

962
00:48:29,960 --> 00:48:32,680
Speaker 5: back because she's trying to get cages like kids in

963
00:48:32,719 --> 00:48:35,239
Speaker 5: cages at the border, and I gotta So that's where

964
00:48:35,239 --> 00:48:37,960
Speaker 5: it's That's where it starts, right on the compromising of

965
00:48:38,000 --> 00:48:43,359
Speaker 5: the principles, the dilutions by degrees. So to have had

966
00:48:43,520 --> 00:48:46,520
Speaker 5: access at that time to the most powerful man in sports,

967
00:48:46,560 --> 00:48:48,160
Speaker 5: who was an ally of mine, who wanted me to

968
00:48:48,200 --> 00:48:51,880
Speaker 5: start little fires, but he's not out to the Disney

969
00:48:51,920 --> 00:48:55,319
Speaker 5: power machine after George Floyd, to have like to be

970
00:48:55,400 --> 00:48:57,520
Speaker 5: in there and be like, wait a minute, can I

971
00:48:57,520 --> 00:49:01,040
Speaker 5: get to Eiger and Disney on like re change stuff

972
00:49:01,480 --> 00:49:07,160
Speaker 5: to now watch cowboy hats make a mets with Aaron

973
00:49:07,239 --> 00:49:11,799
Speaker 5: Rodgers that gets to Eiger and Disney and gets to

974
00:49:11,840 --> 00:49:14,719
Speaker 5: the top of the power chain because he's got the

975
00:49:14,840 --> 00:49:19,239
Speaker 5: power to not need ESPN anymore because these brands have

976
00:49:19,880 --> 00:49:22,879
Speaker 5: like ESPN needs this now they have to so they

977
00:49:22,920 --> 00:49:26,279
Speaker 5: make all sorts of precedents for him. He can curse

978
00:49:26,320 --> 00:49:28,600
Speaker 5: on television and everything else. And again I need to

979
00:49:28,640 --> 00:49:33,680
Speaker 5: make this clear, like more power to him. Because Pat McAfee,

980
00:49:33,760 --> 00:49:36,920
Speaker 5: you have done an amazing job of realizing before anybody

981
00:49:37,000 --> 00:49:39,880
Speaker 5: else did that this was a space that the people

982
00:49:39,920 --> 00:49:42,759
Speaker 5: who were actually dominating the space weren't as good at

983
00:49:42,800 --> 00:49:46,520
Speaker 5: competition as you are. Because a punter got into the

984
00:49:46,520 --> 00:49:48,799
Speaker 5: space and figured it all out. I can knock these

985
00:49:48,840 --> 00:49:52,480
Speaker 5: journalists out of the way, So may he have all

986
00:49:52,560 --> 00:49:56,160
Speaker 5: of the fun and chaos and anarchy that is shaking

987
00:49:56,200 --> 00:50:00,520
Speaker 5: that machine from the inside. Because to me it's comedy

988
00:50:00,600 --> 00:50:03,239
Speaker 5: to watch it, but the portions of it that hurt

989
00:50:03,280 --> 00:50:06,399
Speaker 5: are like, Man, I was so close with whatever our

990
00:50:06,440 --> 00:50:10,360
Speaker 5: show was, which was sort of like that to getting

991
00:50:10,360 --> 00:50:13,000
Speaker 5: into the real, you know, corridors of power where I

992
00:50:13,040 --> 00:50:19,080
Speaker 5: could have maybe influenced how it made a change and

993
00:50:19,160 --> 00:50:24,799
Speaker 5: how bullshit corporate. The statements were after George Floyd, how like,

994
00:50:24,840 --> 00:50:28,360
Speaker 5: because you've seen the machine whatever was happening that moment,

995
00:50:28,520 --> 00:50:34,959
Speaker 5: after the pandemic that year, after George Floyd, to see

996
00:50:35,000 --> 00:50:38,440
Speaker 5: the machine that was saying to us, while you know,

997
00:50:39,440 --> 00:50:42,600
Speaker 5: at every turn now we're the black lives matter now,

998
00:50:43,120 --> 00:50:45,719
Speaker 5: to see it now shift and everything go back to

999
00:50:45,760 --> 00:50:49,160
Speaker 5: the way that it was, it has been a little

1000
00:50:49,239 --> 00:50:51,799
Speaker 5: jarring given that at that moment, I remember it, we

1001
00:50:51,800 --> 00:50:54,640
Speaker 5: were in it. It lasted for a while. It felt empowering,

1002
00:50:54,719 --> 00:50:58,880
Speaker 5: it felt strong, It felt like, oh okay, maybe maybe

1003
00:50:59,239 --> 00:51:02,120
Speaker 5: people will be heart to see the machine go right

1004
00:51:02,160 --> 00:51:05,000
Speaker 5: back to where it was. How do I say any

1005
00:51:05,040 --> 00:51:07,680
Speaker 5: of that and walk you guys down that path without

1006
00:51:07,719 --> 00:51:11,400
Speaker 5: sounding like I'm bitter at ESPN or bitter at McAfee,

1007
00:51:11,520 --> 00:51:14,439
Speaker 5: Like I want to walk that path, honestly. But that's

1008
00:51:14,760 --> 00:51:17,719
Speaker 5: how it happened from my viewpoint, So to see him

1009
00:51:17,760 --> 00:51:21,319
Speaker 5: call out by name an executive when I like, I

1010
00:51:21,320 --> 00:51:23,359
Speaker 5: had to go and when I said what I said,

1011
00:51:23,400 --> 00:51:25,520
Speaker 5: I had to go meet with Pataro in New York,

1012
00:51:25,560 --> 00:51:29,000
Speaker 5: and there were headlines and then stuff gets leaked about

1013
00:51:29,000 --> 00:51:31,719
Speaker 5: what my salary is and all the stuff that he's

1014
00:51:31,760 --> 00:51:35,480
Speaker 5: complaining about started happening to us. At the end, I

1015
00:51:35,600 --> 00:51:39,200
Speaker 5: enjoyed seeing him call it out. I was surprised to

1016
00:51:39,200 --> 00:51:42,279
Speaker 5: see that there were no consequences for the person that

1017
00:51:42,360 --> 00:51:44,359
Speaker 5: he called out or for him. But it's a new

1018
00:51:44,400 --> 00:51:47,080
Speaker 5: age over there. They have to make the compromises because

1019
00:51:47,200 --> 00:51:48,799
Speaker 5: I think they need him more than he needs them.

1020
00:51:48,920 --> 00:51:52,560
Speaker 1: Mmmm. I said that the other day. So I mean, currently,

1021
00:51:52,640 --> 00:51:55,120
Speaker 1: where do you think, maybe not even just ESPN, but

1022
00:51:55,360 --> 00:51:59,959
Speaker 1: like the machines that make this sports media go where

1023
00:52:00,080 --> 00:52:03,120
Speaker 1: they're kind of at a crossroads because I wholehearty believe

1024
00:52:03,680 --> 00:52:08,920
Speaker 1: that these bigger the personalities have outgrown the machines. I

1025
00:52:08,920 --> 00:52:11,000
Speaker 1: feel the machines will always be there, and they're great

1026
00:52:11,040 --> 00:52:14,200
Speaker 1: for what they're great at, but they're not necessarily needed anymore.

1027
00:52:14,239 --> 00:52:17,279
Speaker 1: So where does ESPN Fox? Where do you kind of

1028
00:52:17,280 --> 00:52:19,480
Speaker 1: think they sit in the whole grand scheme of things

1029
00:52:19,520 --> 00:52:23,800
Speaker 1: as journalism or reporting, or athletes moving into the space

1030
00:52:23,880 --> 00:52:24,680
Speaker 1: kind of takeover.

1031
00:52:26,120 --> 00:52:30,120
Speaker 5: It'll be super interesting because there's been a monopoly in

1032
00:52:30,160 --> 00:52:34,600
Speaker 5: this space of what's on your television when you're walking

1033
00:52:34,600 --> 00:52:36,840
Speaker 5: through the airport bar. Like, I don't think that people

1034
00:52:36,920 --> 00:52:40,719
Speaker 5: understand what the business model of ESPN is. All of

1035
00:52:40,760 --> 00:52:44,279
Speaker 5: those shows exist as infomercials just to get you to

1036
00:52:44,400 --> 00:52:47,879
Speaker 5: the next game, Like, here is sports content, whatever it is,

1037
00:52:48,280 --> 00:52:50,280
Speaker 5: how do we get you to the games, to the games,

1038
00:52:50,280 --> 00:52:53,120
Speaker 5: to the games. They decided to become a journalism company

1039
00:52:53,200 --> 00:52:56,440
Speaker 5: because they didn't have to be from the very beginning,

1040
00:52:56,800 --> 00:52:59,280
Speaker 5: there's not a jay in ESPN. It's entertainment in sports.

1041
00:52:59,320 --> 00:53:02,320
Speaker 5: They decided to be a journalism company that was initially

1042
00:53:02,400 --> 00:53:05,839
Speaker 5: run by newspaper people. Uh, they're sort of getting out

1043
00:53:05,840 --> 00:53:08,719
Speaker 5: of that business now and they're going to need those

1044
00:53:08,800 --> 00:53:13,720
Speaker 5: personality driven people to whether it's McAfee or Steven A. Smith,

1045
00:53:14,640 --> 00:53:17,919
Speaker 5: to to help their brand because the whole the whole

1046
00:53:17,960 --> 00:53:22,720
Speaker 5: game has has changed, the programming matters. It's it McAfee

1047
00:53:22,800 --> 00:53:25,840
Speaker 5: needs to do a number after first take because of

1048
00:53:25,880 --> 00:53:29,640
Speaker 5: the way that they're paying these people like they're they're

1049
00:53:29,680 --> 00:53:32,719
Speaker 5: trying to keep up now with a changing game as

1050
00:53:32,760 --> 00:53:35,840
Speaker 5: the streaming service its service services just change everything.

1051
00:53:44,000 --> 00:53:45,759
Speaker 1: Kind of a little bit off topic, but not. Is

1052
00:53:45,800 --> 00:53:48,719
Speaker 1: there any truth to this urban legend that Disney was

1053
00:53:48,880 --> 00:53:51,480
Speaker 1: trying to stop the Miami Zoo from naming a hippo

1054
00:53:51,560 --> 00:53:51,920
Speaker 1: after you.

1055
00:53:52,360 --> 00:53:54,640
Speaker 5: Now it's not an urban legend. There is now a

1056
00:53:54,920 --> 00:53:57,960
Speaker 5: Miami zoo that has a hippo named Dan Lebato. No,

1057
00:53:58,040 --> 00:54:01,160
Speaker 5: but that's all true. Yes, that was They were fearing

1058
00:54:01,239 --> 00:54:04,759
Speaker 5: the liability of the hippo escaping named Dan Lebotard, and

1059
00:54:04,800 --> 00:54:09,240
Speaker 5: then you got Disney's Dan LeBatard tramples three kids.

1060
00:54:10,320 --> 00:54:10,520
Speaker 1: Yeah.

1061
00:54:11,560 --> 00:54:14,879
Speaker 5: The first thing I did, No, the first thing I did,

1062
00:54:16,080 --> 00:54:19,080
Speaker 5: the first act of freedom after leaving ESPN was going

1063
00:54:19,080 --> 00:54:21,239
Speaker 5: to that zoo and that there isn't There is not

1064
00:54:21,400 --> 00:54:23,840
Speaker 5: no longer a baby hippo. There is a hippo at

1065
00:54:23,960 --> 00:54:27,440
Speaker 5: Zoo Miami named Dan Levittard who hopefully doesn't trample any

1066
00:54:27,520 --> 00:54:30,520
Speaker 5: kids escaped. Yeah, hoping that doesn't happen.

1067
00:54:30,719 --> 00:54:31,400
Speaker 4: You haven't met him.

1068
00:54:32,040 --> 00:54:34,480
Speaker 5: I have met him, Yeah, went to meet him the

1069
00:54:34,520 --> 00:54:37,680
Speaker 5: first day. But isn't that it isn't that instructive As

1070
00:54:37,719 --> 00:54:42,759
Speaker 5: you guys build your own thing. When you're corporate, you

1071
00:54:42,880 --> 00:54:46,920
Speaker 5: have to fear things like this joke we're making with

1072
00:54:47,040 --> 00:54:50,120
Speaker 5: this hippo. I have to fear the liability of what

1073
00:54:50,280 --> 00:54:55,080
Speaker 5: happens if the hippo tramples everybody. I look forward to

1074
00:54:55,160 --> 00:55:00,000
Speaker 5: you guys making everything you do without any of those constraints, right.

1075
00:55:00,239 --> 00:55:01,360
Speaker 1: I definitely don't want to hippo.

1076
00:55:01,760 --> 00:55:02,480
Speaker 4: I know you kind of.

1077
00:55:04,480 --> 00:55:06,400
Speaker 2: I feel the same way about your Dolphins how I

1078
00:55:06,400 --> 00:55:07,680
Speaker 2: feel about my Cowboys.

1079
00:55:07,880 --> 00:55:10,400
Speaker 5: You know, the only thing that saves two and the

1080
00:55:10,440 --> 00:55:12,800
Speaker 5: Dolphin fans is what happened to your.

1081
00:55:12,680 --> 00:55:16,120
Speaker 1: Cowboys about them boys? Yeah, to your fans, that's a

1082
00:55:16,160 --> 00:55:16,720
Speaker 1: good excuse.

1083
00:55:16,800 --> 00:55:19,279
Speaker 4: But you're on the same on the same table with us.

1084
00:55:19,160 --> 00:55:22,279
Speaker 3: In cancn Now what you mean losses were all at home?

1085
00:55:22,920 --> 00:55:25,320
Speaker 1: You guys have had three straight twelve win seasons, shipped

1086
00:55:25,320 --> 00:55:27,319
Speaker 1: the bed every time in the playoffs. Miami is a

1087
00:55:27,360 --> 00:55:28,560
Speaker 1: new up and coming team with the.

1088
00:55:28,520 --> 00:55:32,879
Speaker 2: Young How many super Bowls Miami got, no team too?

1089
00:55:32,960 --> 00:55:37,200
Speaker 4: How many we got? Damn five. You were you were five?

1090
00:55:37,280 --> 00:55:38,839
Speaker 1: Last time they want to say I wasn't born when

1091
00:55:38,840 --> 00:55:41,319
Speaker 1: they won their So.

1092
00:55:41,600 --> 00:55:45,759
Speaker 5: It was the boy the Dolphins. I think I read

1093
00:55:45,800 --> 00:55:49,239
Speaker 5: the other day. Yeah, this was Ethan Skolnick said this

1094
00:55:49,440 --> 00:55:54,160
Speaker 5: that Dwayne Wade went to Hyde, I went to college.

1095
00:55:54,880 --> 00:55:59,759
Speaker 5: Uh had a Hall of Fame pro career and got

1096
00:55:59,840 --> 00:56:03,560
Speaker 5: us statue in. All of the time since the Dolphins

1097
00:56:03,680 --> 00:56:05,560
Speaker 5: last won a playoff game, it's.

1098
00:56:05,400 --> 00:56:06,040
Speaker 1: A long run.

1099
00:56:06,920 --> 00:56:08,759
Speaker 2: So I know you feel how I feel. What about

1100
00:56:08,760 --> 00:56:10,200
Speaker 2: the heat? How do you feel about the heat right now?

1101
00:56:10,640 --> 00:56:13,520
Speaker 5: I mean, you guys have to marvel at everything they are.

1102
00:56:13,560 --> 00:56:16,840
Speaker 5: They embody so many of the things that you guys

1103
00:56:16,880 --> 00:56:20,040
Speaker 5: were about, where if you go there and are willing

1104
00:56:20,160 --> 00:56:25,359
Speaker 5: to work, they will make all players better. It to

1105
00:56:25,440 --> 00:56:28,200
Speaker 5: me what it's been amazing to watch what pat Riley

1106
00:56:28,200 --> 00:56:30,600
Speaker 5: has been there built there since the beginning, because what

1107
00:56:30,719 --> 00:56:34,319
Speaker 5: he's got on the bay there in Miami is a

1108
00:56:34,480 --> 00:56:40,520
Speaker 5: military silo where those basketball players are united in nothing

1109
00:56:40,640 --> 00:56:43,839
Speaker 5: more than how do they get better at this thing

1110
00:56:44,000 --> 00:56:46,440
Speaker 5: so that Gave Vincent can get his contract, so that

1111
00:56:46,480 --> 00:56:49,719
Speaker 5: Max Strus can get his contract, so that you guys

1112
00:56:49,760 --> 00:56:52,160
Speaker 5: have played so many guys and this is no knock

1113
00:56:52,280 --> 00:56:55,080
Speaker 5: on Gay Vincent or Max Struce. But what they build

1114
00:56:55,120 --> 00:56:57,719
Speaker 5: where they get guys to believe in the idea of

1115
00:56:57,800 --> 00:57:00,520
Speaker 5: hard work will pay off and all of us make money.

1116
00:57:00,600 --> 00:57:03,760
Speaker 5: Like that's how you get a team of players rowing

1117
00:57:03,840 --> 00:57:06,160
Speaker 5: in the right direction, no matter who their players are.

1118
00:57:06,200 --> 00:57:09,239
Speaker 5: Like you, it's not easy to be as good as

1119
00:57:09,239 --> 00:57:11,319
Speaker 5: they've been for as long as they've been with as

1120
00:57:11,320 --> 00:57:14,839
Speaker 5: many different players as they've had. I did not think

1121
00:57:14,920 --> 00:57:19,040
Speaker 5: Jimmy Butler was that Jimmy. Did you guys think Jimmy

1122
00:57:19,040 --> 00:57:22,360
Speaker 5: Butler was good enough to carry a team to the two?

1123
00:57:22,480 --> 00:57:23,640
Speaker 4: I knew he had the heart, I didn't know.

1124
00:57:23,680 --> 00:57:26,000
Speaker 2: If I didn't know he was good enough to do it,

1125
00:57:26,160 --> 00:57:27,520
Speaker 2: he did a couple of times.

1126
00:57:27,520 --> 00:57:28,800
Speaker 1: I didn't know it until I saw it. I've always

1127
00:57:28,840 --> 00:57:30,040
Speaker 1: been a big fan of Jimmy. I didn't know it

1128
00:57:30,080 --> 00:57:31,680
Speaker 1: until I saw it. But I also think it too.

1129
00:57:31,680 --> 00:57:34,800
Speaker 1: Obviously it's the environment. Ryle's is creative, but then also spoke.

1130
00:57:34,880 --> 00:57:38,040
Speaker 1: I think spos one of the best minds in the NBA.

1131
00:57:38,120 --> 00:57:40,680
Speaker 5: But think about that though you use the video room

1132
00:57:40,960 --> 00:57:44,040
Speaker 5: like all he's done. You know, the root of culture

1133
00:57:44,120 --> 00:57:47,720
Speaker 5: is cult. That is a cult like that play like that.

1134
00:57:48,160 --> 00:57:51,040
Speaker 5: He grew up in the dark recesses of the thankless

1135
00:57:51,200 --> 00:57:53,720
Speaker 5: video room, and he climbs to he's going to be

1136
00:57:53,760 --> 00:57:57,280
Speaker 5: running that franchise next an eight year contract when you

1137
00:57:57,320 --> 00:58:00,720
Speaker 5: can sell that to your employees as a way of life,

1138
00:58:00,840 --> 00:58:02,760
Speaker 5: like it feels like a mafia family.

1139
00:58:03,560 --> 00:58:05,600
Speaker 2: I could have been Mafia Pat. I could have been

1140
00:58:05,640 --> 00:58:11,240
Speaker 2: a Heat player. Man two drills, three man, we even seventeens.

1141
00:58:12,320 --> 00:58:14,040
Speaker 2: That's that's the reason why I ended up being a

1142
00:58:14,080 --> 00:58:15,919
Speaker 2: Miami Heat player. We did that shit for the first

1143
00:58:15,920 --> 00:58:19,560
Speaker 2: three minutes of practice. Nah, I don't want to be here.

1144
00:58:21,000 --> 00:58:22,920
Speaker 1: Which you said, I don't love it as much as

1145
00:58:22,960 --> 00:58:23,520
Speaker 1: I thought I did.

1146
00:58:23,600 --> 00:58:25,800
Speaker 4: I definitely don't. I definitely don't.

1147
00:58:25,800 --> 00:58:27,600
Speaker 2: And if I got to throw up every practice to

1148
00:58:27,640 --> 00:58:29,240
Speaker 2: make a million dollars, maybe I need to go on

1149
00:58:29,240 --> 00:58:30,960
Speaker 2: another team where that's not in the contract.

1150
00:58:33,920 --> 00:58:39,520
Speaker 5: The Marlins, oh my god, they've they've hurt Miami so

1151
00:58:39,560 --> 00:58:45,480
Speaker 5: many different ways. I mean, they but they betrayed. They

1152
00:58:45,960 --> 00:58:49,080
Speaker 5: sold after championships, they sold all their players like They've

1153
00:58:49,120 --> 00:58:52,400
Speaker 5: crushed generations of fan bases by taking the field good

1154
00:58:52,400 --> 00:58:56,160
Speaker 5: immediately and making it all about just finances. So somehow,

1155
00:58:56,720 --> 00:59:00,000
Speaker 5: in a Latin city where an economy was supposed to flourish,

1156
00:59:00,080 --> 00:59:04,560
Speaker 5: around our love for baseball, and how flamboyantly because baseball's changed.

1157
00:59:04,600 --> 00:59:05,960
Speaker 5: I don't know if you guys watch it all, but

1158
00:59:06,040 --> 00:59:10,760
Speaker 5: baseball is more colorful and more ethnic and more joyous.

1159
00:59:12,520 --> 00:59:16,840
Speaker 5: We are a broken baseball city. There's a niche group

1160
00:59:16,840 --> 00:59:18,919
Speaker 5: of people who believe in the Marlins, but they don't spend.

1161
00:59:19,000 --> 00:59:21,560
Speaker 5: They can't keep up. And I think I think as

1162
00:59:21,560 --> 00:59:24,440
Speaker 5: we tape this, that the Dodgers have spent one point

1163
00:59:24,520 --> 00:59:27,400
Speaker 5: seven billion dollars on free agents and the Marlins have

1164
00:59:27,520 --> 00:59:30,440
Speaker 5: not yet spent a dollar. They definitely do it bit

1165
00:59:30,480 --> 00:59:31,880
Speaker 5: hard to keep up that way.

1166
00:59:32,080 --> 00:59:36,120
Speaker 2: Is the undefeated Dolphins winning a soup bought a year?

1167
00:59:36,320 --> 00:59:38,320
Speaker 2: Is the best moment is Miami sports history?

1168
00:59:38,680 --> 00:59:41,720
Speaker 5: Oh man, So it's so long ago. It's I don't

1169
00:59:41,760 --> 00:59:46,280
Speaker 5: know how long ago your memories go on. Childhood so

1170
00:59:46,720 --> 00:59:48,760
Speaker 5: I was born in sixty eight seventy two was the

1171
00:59:48,800 --> 00:59:53,120
Speaker 5: proudest thing football was. Football made Miami famous because they

1172
00:59:53,160 --> 00:59:55,160
Speaker 5: were successful at it. At the time, it wasn't a

1173
00:59:55,200 --> 00:59:59,000
Speaker 5: thriving town. The Dolphins were something that made it huge.

1174
00:59:59,120 --> 01:00:02,880
Speaker 5: But I would say in my lifetime, the most fun

1175
01:00:03,040 --> 01:00:06,000
Speaker 5: I've ever had covering things in sports thirty years in

1176
01:00:06,040 --> 01:00:10,200
Speaker 5: that market was covering the championship University of Miami teams

1177
01:00:10,320 --> 01:00:14,800
Speaker 5: that were urinating on all of sportsmanship and making America

1178
01:00:14,840 --> 01:00:19,840
Speaker 5: insane because they won and were crazy. So covering those

1179
01:00:19,880 --> 01:00:26,320
Speaker 5: teams was great fun because you know, Jimmy Johnson would say,

1180
01:00:27,560 --> 01:00:29,800
Speaker 5: this week against Notre Dame, we're not going to have

1181
01:00:29,840 --> 01:00:32,920
Speaker 5: any trash talking, and then would make the captain the

1182
01:00:32,960 --> 01:00:35,600
Speaker 5: safety of the team who called himself the Grim Reaper

1183
01:00:35,640 --> 01:00:38,600
Speaker 5: and took a picture in the paper leaning against a

1184
01:00:38,640 --> 01:00:42,720
Speaker 5: tombstone that read shut up, bitch, and he made him

1185
01:00:42,760 --> 01:00:46,439
Speaker 5: a captain. Like those teams were renegades first, and then

1186
01:00:46,520 --> 01:00:50,600
Speaker 5: the lebron Era Heat, where you don't you rarely get

1187
01:00:50,640 --> 01:00:53,560
Speaker 5: these situations that are that actually feel like the country

1188
01:00:53,640 --> 01:00:57,000
Speaker 5: is against you on something, and so the lebron Era

1189
01:00:57,080 --> 01:01:01,320
Speaker 5: Heat were like crack cocaine for four years about regular

1190
01:01:01,320 --> 01:01:03,880
Speaker 5: season game seventeen because the Heat are nine and eight

1191
01:01:03,920 --> 01:01:06,600
Speaker 5: and Lebron has bumped Spolster on his way off.

1192
01:01:06,480 --> 01:01:09,120
Speaker 1: The court, give me a pin on that team, though,

1193
01:01:09,280 --> 01:01:13,320
Speaker 1: Ed Reid uh ed and James No. That was before

1194
01:01:13,400 --> 01:01:14,840
Speaker 1: I mean I'm talking about.

1195
01:01:16,560 --> 01:01:18,400
Speaker 5: I mean before they've.

1196
01:01:18,160 --> 01:01:21,680
Speaker 1: Had that was like Michael, yeah, the Dead well like

1197
01:01:21,720 --> 01:01:23,280
Speaker 1: two went back to the same time.

1198
01:01:23,200 --> 01:01:25,600
Speaker 5: You're allowed to get confused because I think Frank Gore,

1199
01:01:25,680 --> 01:01:26,560
Speaker 5: Clinton Port.

1200
01:01:26,440 --> 01:01:29,320
Speaker 4: Is McGahee all the same time.

1201
01:01:30,960 --> 01:01:34,000
Speaker 5: Yeah, it all runs together because yeah, those but it's

1202
01:01:34,040 --> 01:01:34,800
Speaker 5: not just that.

1203
01:01:34,840 --> 01:01:36,600
Speaker 1: Like the Two Live two. I was talking about the

1204
01:01:36,600 --> 01:01:38,400
Speaker 1: Two Live Crew, Uncle Luke, Miami.

1205
01:01:38,120 --> 01:01:39,320
Speaker 4: Hurricane, Mike Irvenue.

1206
01:01:39,440 --> 01:01:43,160
Speaker 5: No, but that's that's yes, that's well before Snoop Dogg

1207
01:01:43,240 --> 01:01:46,200
Speaker 5: was on USC sideline when they were winning championships, and

1208
01:01:46,240 --> 01:01:49,920
Speaker 5: before you know, even like Ice Cube was wearing a

1209
01:01:50,040 --> 01:01:52,520
Speaker 5: Raider jacket or there were people on the West Coast

1210
01:01:52,560 --> 01:01:56,720
Speaker 5: wearing Miami jackets because of what Miami represented. Uncle Luke,

1211
01:01:56,800 --> 01:02:02,080
Speaker 5: you'll love this story. Uncle Luke was as the you know,

1212
01:02:02,120 --> 01:02:07,080
Speaker 5: one of the originators of hip hop Miami sound, who

1213
01:02:07,080 --> 01:02:09,520
Speaker 5: would say things like shub Knight can't come into Miami

1214
01:02:09,600 --> 01:02:13,880
Speaker 5: unless he asks my permission. He was putting bounties on

1215
01:02:14,080 --> 01:02:18,320
Speaker 5: Notre Dame players that was collected with NFL money on

1216
01:02:18,480 --> 01:02:21,720
Speaker 5: anybody who injured Tim Brown or whatever. There's this pool

1217
01:02:21,760 --> 01:02:26,360
Speaker 5: of money and it was being held by the team priest.

1218
01:02:26,720 --> 01:02:30,560
Speaker 5: How can you not love those How can you not

1219
01:02:30,840 --> 01:02:32,560
Speaker 5: love those footballs?

1220
01:02:33,120 --> 01:02:33,640
Speaker 1: I love it.

1221
01:02:33,680 --> 01:02:35,560
Speaker 5: I love it. Oh yeah, I love it.

1222
01:02:36,760 --> 01:02:39,360
Speaker 1: Obviously shout out Dwayne Wade. You mentioned it earlier, but

1223
01:02:39,440 --> 01:02:43,240
Speaker 1: he will we have he will have a statue out there,

1224
01:02:43,600 --> 01:02:46,360
Speaker 1: you know, being there his entire career. To me, I

1225
01:02:46,400 --> 01:02:48,960
Speaker 1: think he's a top three shooting guard of all time

1226
01:02:49,000 --> 01:02:51,960
Speaker 1: behind him and Co. Just thoughts on his journey in

1227
01:02:52,000 --> 01:02:52,480
Speaker 1: his career.

1228
01:02:53,800 --> 01:02:56,680
Speaker 5: What a joy to watch from start to finish, because

1229
01:02:56,760 --> 01:02:59,840
Speaker 5: I remember when he came in initially one of the

1230
01:02:59,840 --> 01:03:02,400
Speaker 5: things people were all. He was clearly on the path

1231
01:03:02,440 --> 01:03:04,200
Speaker 5: to start him like it was about to happen. He

1232
01:03:04,240 --> 01:03:08,080
Speaker 5: was still accessible still, and the janitors and the people

1233
01:03:08,120 --> 01:03:10,840
Speaker 5: who worked in the building would ask him not to change,

1234
01:03:11,120 --> 01:03:14,280
Speaker 5: Please don't change, because you're so approachable, You're so accessible

1235
01:03:14,280 --> 01:03:17,360
Speaker 5: and stuff. To watch that guy have the twenty year

1236
01:03:17,440 --> 01:03:20,240
Speaker 5: career he has had to watch the greatness that would

1237
01:03:20,320 --> 01:03:22,640
Speaker 5: rank him among the all time greats at doing that

1238
01:03:22,720 --> 01:03:25,960
Speaker 5: and at that size. To see him grow into an

1239
01:03:26,040 --> 01:03:31,000
Speaker 5: even better man because he changed in all the best ways.

1240
01:03:31,080 --> 01:03:34,760
Speaker 5: He didn't change being personal and professional. But now that

1241
01:03:34,840 --> 01:03:38,960
Speaker 5: dude's a civic leader. That dude like helped Lebron with

1242
01:03:39,040 --> 01:03:41,640
Speaker 5: whatever the strength was in wearing the hoodies for Trayvon

1243
01:03:41,760 --> 01:03:45,240
Speaker 5: Martin because they found their voice as leaders. Were like

1244
01:03:45,320 --> 01:03:48,000
Speaker 5: to see him be better as a man than he

1245
01:03:48,120 --> 01:03:51,240
Speaker 5: was as a basketball player. To see him be better

1246
01:03:51,280 --> 01:03:55,120
Speaker 5: as a leader, on behalf of his daughter, to fight

1247
01:03:55,200 --> 01:04:01,400
Speaker 5: against just hate. He loves that he has learned how

1248
01:04:01,440 --> 01:04:04,800
Speaker 5: to love big, so he uses his power to combat hate.

1249
01:04:05,200 --> 01:04:08,720
Speaker 5: We've never had an athlete better than that in South Florida.

1250
01:04:08,960 --> 01:04:11,280
Speaker 5: I don't have an athlete I can say that about

1251
01:04:11,360 --> 01:04:13,840
Speaker 5: like he grew into a He grew into a man

1252
01:04:14,160 --> 01:04:17,520
Speaker 5: that any of us would be honored to know and

1253
01:04:17,720 --> 01:04:21,680
Speaker 5: inspired by his behavior. To say that his basketball career,

1254
01:04:22,480 --> 01:04:25,440
Speaker 5: I'm not gonna say pales compared to anything, but what

1255
01:04:25,480 --> 01:04:28,360
Speaker 5: I've seen him grow into to me is moving in

1256
01:04:28,440 --> 01:04:31,160
Speaker 5: ways that are truly inspirational about like what you want

1257
01:04:31,240 --> 01:04:34,240
Speaker 5: human beings to grow into through the platform and strength

1258
01:04:34,240 --> 01:04:35,960
Speaker 5: of sports, like a beast.

1259
01:04:36,320 --> 01:04:38,800
Speaker 1: Yeah, no, shout out d Way definitely a you know,

1260
01:04:38,840 --> 01:04:42,400
Speaker 1: great player, but even better human. Recently, twenty one Savage

1261
01:04:42,800 --> 01:04:45,080
Speaker 1: had an impersonation of your show with the music video.

1262
01:04:45,560 --> 01:04:48,320
Speaker 1: We talked about it a little bit, but thoughts on this.

1263
01:04:51,080 --> 01:05:00,400
Speaker 5: That characterization of me is deeply racist, stereotypical, bloated, thick.

1264
01:05:00,560 --> 01:05:03,919
Speaker 5: My father doesn't have a mustache. It looks nothing like that.

1265
01:05:04,160 --> 01:05:07,040
Speaker 5: But I do like the juxtafication of saying that my,

1266
01:05:07,560 --> 01:05:12,880
Speaker 5: uh my character is deeply racist. But Bomani's exactly right.

1267
01:05:12,920 --> 01:05:15,000
Speaker 5: They got it, They got it, They got it. Who

1268
01:05:15,160 --> 01:05:17,760
Speaker 5: playing Bamani? He fresh out the right.

1269
01:05:17,920 --> 01:05:18,680
Speaker 4: They just bet him.

1270
01:05:18,840 --> 01:05:21,080
Speaker 5: That's exactly right, That's exactly right.

1271
01:05:22,840 --> 01:05:25,360
Speaker 1: But thoughts I mean overall, I mean twenty one being

1272
01:05:25,360 --> 01:05:27,520
Speaker 1: one of the hottest artists in this game right now.

1273
01:05:27,440 --> 01:05:31,480
Speaker 5: I don't understand Matt Love like this. So Matt, I'm

1274
01:05:31,680 --> 01:05:34,120
Speaker 5: I don't know you guys well enough yet to know

1275
01:05:34,160 --> 01:05:37,080
Speaker 5: how spiritual you are or what it is that the

1276
01:05:37,200 --> 01:05:40,560
Speaker 5: universe brings you in terms of comedy or blessings. Okay,

1277
01:05:41,440 --> 01:05:45,360
Speaker 5: I have no reason at fifty five years old to

1278
01:05:45,680 --> 01:05:48,520
Speaker 5: connect with the young sports fan who is nineteen or

1279
01:05:48,520 --> 01:05:50,800
Speaker 5: twenty years old who does so now, But things like

1280
01:05:50,960 --> 01:05:56,200
Speaker 5: that are always happening to us, uh in ways that

1281
01:05:56,240 --> 01:06:00,479
Speaker 5: I can't help but feel moved by inspiration and real

1282
01:06:00,520 --> 01:06:03,560
Speaker 5: inspiration in the idea of of course, it's ridiculous, it's funny.

1283
01:06:03,600 --> 01:06:06,640
Speaker 5: But yes, at one point my father and twenty one

1284
01:06:06,680 --> 01:06:09,480
Speaker 5: Savage talked on television and he remembered enough to do that.

1285
01:06:09,520 --> 01:06:11,840
Speaker 5: And I will tell you, guys, both of you, the

1286
01:06:11,880 --> 01:06:15,680
Speaker 5: hardest I have ever seen you Donnis Haslam laugh. The

1287
01:06:15,760 --> 01:06:18,960
Speaker 5: hardest is when I came into the highly questionable studio

1288
01:06:19,080 --> 01:06:21,480
Speaker 5: and my father was holding him up because he was

1289
01:06:21,600 --> 01:06:24,440
Speaker 5: leaning laughing on his shoulder, and all they were looking

1290
01:06:24,640 --> 01:06:28,400
Speaker 5: at were those rap collaborations my father was doing with

1291
01:06:28,400 --> 01:06:30,000
Speaker 5: with rappers, And so.

1292
01:06:32,400 --> 01:06:34,520
Speaker 1: Dan was like, what is it called? He was what

1293
01:06:34,600 --> 01:06:35,120
Speaker 1: is it called?

1294
01:06:35,600 --> 01:06:42,400
Speaker 5: Embarrassed? What is it called? Would I get worse than that?

1295
01:06:42,760 --> 01:06:43,160
Speaker 5: I said?

1296
01:06:43,240 --> 01:06:43,560
Speaker 4: Duet?

1297
01:06:44,000 --> 01:06:52,439
Speaker 6: I did worse than that, I definitely publicly, but that

1298
01:06:52,440 --> 01:06:55,600
Speaker 6: that was a private conversation. I was embarrassed enough where

1299
01:06:55,640 --> 01:06:57,360
Speaker 6: it was happening that I did.

1300
01:06:57,440 --> 01:07:00,200
Speaker 5: I loved across the table and yeah, my father those

1301
01:07:00,320 --> 01:07:04,640
Speaker 5: duets he does with the rabbit.

1302
01:07:04,800 --> 01:07:10,240
Speaker 1: Who Who's Dan? Outside of media, outside of running Metal Lark?

1303
01:07:10,800 --> 01:07:11,360
Speaker 4: He burned out?

1304
01:07:12,600 --> 01:07:13,720
Speaker 1: Who's the day to day guy?

1305
01:07:14,880 --> 01:07:19,840
Speaker 5: Well, this project self employment has been so fond, exhilarating,

1306
01:07:20,000 --> 01:07:24,280
Speaker 5: overwhelming that I haven't gotten. What I would love to

1307
01:07:24,360 --> 01:07:28,440
Speaker 5: have is work life balance. What I would like to

1308
01:07:28,480 --> 01:07:32,160
Speaker 5: be doing is get to a point in my life

1309
01:07:32,840 --> 01:07:38,120
Speaker 5: before you know, freedom expires, that that I can have

1310
01:07:38,280 --> 01:07:41,480
Speaker 5: more fun outside of what I'm doing. What we're presently

1311
01:07:41,520 --> 01:07:44,400
Speaker 5: doing is consuming. Okay, so I don't have kids, the

1312
01:07:44,440 --> 01:07:47,520
Speaker 5: people that I work with are people that I've largely

1313
01:07:47,680 --> 01:07:50,840
Speaker 5: raised professionally, like they haven't worked in other places. They've

1314
01:07:50,880 --> 01:07:55,240
Speaker 5: gone from being, you know, people who learned under us.

1315
01:07:55,240 --> 01:07:57,640
Speaker 5: Twenty years later, they now have their own kids, and

1316
01:07:57,800 --> 01:08:00,760
Speaker 5: it's my responsibility to make sure that all those people

1317
01:08:00,960 --> 01:08:04,280
Speaker 5: like it's now my responsibility to make sure that everything

1318
01:08:04,360 --> 01:08:07,080
Speaker 5: works so that those people that those I don't have kids.

1319
01:08:07,120 --> 01:08:10,480
Speaker 5: So I this is what passes. This is what, This

1320
01:08:10,560 --> 01:08:14,200
Speaker 5: is what passes for, this is what and and so

1321
01:08:14,520 --> 01:08:18,360
Speaker 5: what I what I hope people think of me is

1322
01:08:18,400 --> 01:08:22,280
Speaker 5: that I am someone who tries to spread love and

1323
01:08:22,360 --> 01:08:26,720
Speaker 5: decency to people he cares about. And I, you know,

1324
01:08:26,760 --> 01:08:28,679
Speaker 5: I spend a lot of time in that space trying

1325
01:08:28,720 --> 01:08:32,080
Speaker 5: to provide for others creatively and other ways. But I

1326
01:08:32,120 --> 01:08:34,240
Speaker 5: it embarrassed me. It embarrasses me that I don't have

1327
01:08:34,320 --> 01:08:37,160
Speaker 5: a better answer to your question because I'm so lopsided

1328
01:08:37,160 --> 01:08:41,240
Speaker 5: at the moment trying to take on this big undertaking

1329
01:08:41,280 --> 01:08:44,040
Speaker 5: of I don't consider myself a businessman. I have business people,

1330
01:08:44,040 --> 01:08:47,280
Speaker 5: but you can't. You can't build a corporation that cares

1331
01:08:47,640 --> 01:08:50,800
Speaker 5: unless you're the one personally caring for all of the

1332
01:08:50,880 --> 01:08:54,120
Speaker 5: details so that you make sure and and it's hard.

1333
01:08:54,320 --> 01:08:56,920
Speaker 5: It's it is hard to build a corporation with a soul.

1334
01:08:56,960 --> 01:08:58,880
Speaker 5: It's why most of them don't have one.

1335
01:09:00,160 --> 01:09:03,920
Speaker 1: I just love hearing that, because again, I'm two three

1336
01:09:04,000 --> 01:09:06,840
Speaker 1: years behind the process you started, and you know, giving

1337
01:09:06,880 --> 01:09:09,240
Speaker 1: a chance to pick your brain last night and looking

1338
01:09:09,280 --> 01:09:11,439
Speaker 1: forward to you know, talking to John and picking his brain,

1339
01:09:11,640 --> 01:09:14,200
Speaker 1: just the ups and downs and the ebbs and flows

1340
01:09:14,200 --> 01:09:16,080
Speaker 1: of this. You know, I was literally talking about like

1341
01:09:16,120 --> 01:09:18,760
Speaker 1: I'd do a ton of shit, but I'm gonna have

1342
01:09:18,760 --> 01:09:20,720
Speaker 1: to cut that out because this is you know, all

1343
01:09:20,720 --> 01:09:22,760
Speaker 1: the smoke productions and teaming up with you guys is

1344
01:09:23,479 --> 01:09:25,600
Speaker 1: my baby is our baby, and we look forward to

1345
01:09:25,680 --> 01:09:29,920
Speaker 1: getting partnering with you guys and changing you know, the landscape.

1346
01:09:29,920 --> 01:09:32,679
Speaker 1: But at the same time, it's not something you talk about.

1347
01:09:32,680 --> 01:09:34,360
Speaker 1: It's something you have to do and the hours you

1348
01:09:34,400 --> 01:09:36,080
Speaker 1: have to put in you can't cheat that well.

1349
01:09:36,360 --> 01:09:39,639
Speaker 5: I'd ask you, guys, I'd love some guidance on this front.

1350
01:09:40,880 --> 01:09:44,760
Speaker 5: I because you guys are athletes, and because you're coachable,

1351
01:09:44,920 --> 01:09:47,479
Speaker 5: and because there's so much failure no matter how great

1352
01:09:47,600 --> 01:09:51,320
Speaker 5: you are. I've had a real tough time mentally dealing

1353
01:09:51,520 --> 01:09:57,120
Speaker 5: with failure as learning like treating it like, oh, we're

1354
01:09:57,120 --> 01:10:00,280
Speaker 5: a startup. Ooh, we fell in this hole because you know,

1355
01:10:00,360 --> 01:10:03,400
Speaker 5: you're trying to figure things out. That's that's learning. Be

1356
01:10:03,479 --> 01:10:06,320
Speaker 5: gentle on yourself, like you've got to figure these things out.

1357
01:10:06,360 --> 01:10:08,720
Speaker 5: I'd ask you, guys, how it is that you handle that,

1358
01:10:08,880 --> 01:10:13,120
Speaker 5: because I've always marveled at athlete ability to deal with

1359
01:10:13,160 --> 01:10:15,800
Speaker 5: failure when your entire job is based on being paid

1360
01:10:15,840 --> 01:10:16,439
Speaker 5: for success.

1361
01:10:16,800 --> 01:10:18,880
Speaker 1: I mean, I'll start with that personal I feel like,

1362
01:10:19,479 --> 01:10:21,320
Speaker 1: as long as you learn something for the failure of

1363
01:10:21,400 --> 01:10:24,439
Speaker 1: the loss, it's not necessarily a blemish, you know what

1364
01:10:24,479 --> 01:10:26,400
Speaker 1: I mean, Like no one is. You know, Michael Jordan

1365
01:10:26,439 --> 01:10:28,320
Speaker 1: missed a ton of shots, Kobe missed a ton of shots,

1366
01:10:28,320 --> 01:10:30,479
Speaker 1: people lost, Lebron's lost a ton of finals. But I

1367
01:10:30,479 --> 01:10:33,760
Speaker 1: think when you're able to learn from those mishaps, those

1368
01:10:33,800 --> 01:10:36,920
Speaker 1: mistakes or those shortcomings, as long as you got something

1369
01:10:36,920 --> 01:10:38,599
Speaker 1: out of it to be able to apply you from

1370
01:10:38,600 --> 01:10:41,680
Speaker 1: hopefully not hitting it again. You know, it's a long game.

1371
01:10:41,720 --> 01:10:45,040
Speaker 1: And I think today is such instant gratification everything and

1372
01:10:45,160 --> 01:10:47,880
Speaker 1: understanding anything worth building or anything we're doing is going

1373
01:10:47,920 --> 01:10:50,360
Speaker 1: to take some time. It's a slow burn, like you know,

1374
01:10:50,439 --> 01:10:52,800
Speaker 1: rest in peace, Nipsey House so it's a marathon, not

1375
01:10:52,840 --> 01:10:54,639
Speaker 1: a sprint, you know, a slow for you.

1376
01:10:54,600 --> 01:10:57,840
Speaker 5: Guys though like it, I mean it hadn't you guys know.

1377
01:10:57,840 --> 01:10:59,640
Speaker 1: We jumped, No, we made a jump, but at the

1378
01:10:59,640 --> 01:11:01,439
Speaker 1: same time, you know, being able to slow down and

1379
01:11:01,479 --> 01:11:04,200
Speaker 1: still learn, you know, because we don't want to although

1380
01:11:04,200 --> 01:11:06,000
Speaker 1: like I said earlier, maybe it was a good we

1381
01:11:06,080 --> 01:11:07,800
Speaker 1: kind of cut the line. So we've been able to

1382
01:11:07,800 --> 01:11:09,880
Speaker 1: get a multi year deal and team up with someone

1383
01:11:09,920 --> 01:11:12,240
Speaker 1: like you guys. But I think what I'm most excited

1384
01:11:12,240 --> 01:11:14,120
Speaker 1: about is learning from you guys. You know what I

1385
01:11:14,120 --> 01:11:17,439
Speaker 1: mean again, because you guys have had a thirty year

1386
01:11:17,520 --> 01:11:19,920
Speaker 1: run in this space, and you've seen a lot of

1387
01:11:19,920 --> 01:11:22,160
Speaker 1: people come and go when a lot of different things happen.

1388
01:11:22,240 --> 01:11:23,960
Speaker 1: So being able to almost be like a bigger brother

1389
01:11:24,439 --> 01:11:27,200
Speaker 1: to us and hopefully allowing us to not maybe hit

1390
01:11:27,240 --> 01:11:30,040
Speaker 1: some of the same pitfalls you guys hit, you know,

1391
01:11:30,120 --> 01:11:33,400
Speaker 1: outside of making great content, that's what I look forward

1392
01:11:33,400 --> 01:11:35,400
Speaker 1: to most of really, kind of having like a mentor

1393
01:11:35,880 --> 01:11:38,400
Speaker 1: and a whole company that believed in us, that wants

1394
01:11:38,439 --> 01:11:40,320
Speaker 1: to bring us along to where they're going is what

1395
01:11:40,360 --> 01:11:40,959
Speaker 1: I appreciate.

1396
01:11:41,120 --> 01:11:44,559
Speaker 5: Honestly, you honor me when you say that, because I

1397
01:11:44,600 --> 01:11:46,679
Speaker 5: would imagine from the two of you. And I don't

1398
01:11:46,920 --> 01:11:49,519
Speaker 5: take this part lightly. I don't pretend to know you,

1399
01:11:49,600 --> 01:11:52,840
Speaker 5: but I've marveled at your work for fifteen years. Is

1400
01:11:52,840 --> 01:11:56,160
Speaker 5: someone who cares about sports and hope to know you

1401
01:11:56,320 --> 01:12:02,759
Speaker 5: very well. What I have seen over the years of

1402
01:12:02,880 --> 01:12:07,920
Speaker 5: where athletes mistrust on business because the problems that come

1403
01:12:07,960 --> 01:12:11,920
Speaker 5: with money. For you, guys, to trust us with your

1404
01:12:11,960 --> 01:12:16,320
Speaker 5: business and your future, you two specific guys, not just anybody.

1405
01:12:17,160 --> 01:12:19,720
Speaker 5: It honors me that you would do business like that

1406
01:12:20,040 --> 01:12:23,360
Speaker 5: with us, and I believe in it wholeheartedly. Like I'm

1407
01:12:23,360 --> 01:12:26,600
Speaker 5: going to learn from you as well, because it is

1408
01:12:26,640 --> 01:12:30,519
Speaker 5: inevitable that we're going to conquer things here because we've

1409
01:12:30,600 --> 01:12:33,479
Speaker 5: got the right people in place during a changing media time.

1410
01:12:33,760 --> 01:12:36,040
Speaker 5: And you guys are going to bring the same competition

1411
01:12:36,120 --> 01:12:39,160
Speaker 5: to this that you did when you were winning at basketball, because.

1412
01:12:40,280 --> 01:12:41,040
Speaker 4: Winning is winning.

1413
01:12:41,240 --> 01:12:44,080
Speaker 5: Like you guys are conquerors. You guys are conquered.

1414
01:12:43,760 --> 01:12:46,479
Speaker 1: By less clothes lines and punches and open hands slaps.

1415
01:12:47,160 --> 01:12:48,680
Speaker 2: I want to touch on what he said too, like

1416
01:12:48,840 --> 01:12:52,679
Speaker 2: for us experience. For me, experience is the best teacher.

1417
01:12:53,000 --> 01:12:54,639
Speaker 2: And I think for me and Man, we've been those

1418
01:12:54,760 --> 01:12:57,200
Speaker 2: We've been through so much stuff in our life that

1419
01:12:57,439 --> 01:13:00,679
Speaker 2: we basically may learn how to make love the pressure

1420
01:13:01,280 --> 01:13:03,519
Speaker 2: and enjoy the good and the bad times the same.

1421
01:13:04,000 --> 01:13:07,720
Speaker 2: So a loss, yes, it's a part of life, and

1422
01:13:08,120 --> 01:13:09,720
Speaker 2: you go through things and you try to figure out

1423
01:13:09,720 --> 01:13:11,920
Speaker 2: what's the good side of it, but it's out the

1424
01:13:11,960 --> 01:13:14,400
Speaker 2: only good side of it is going through it, because

1425
01:13:14,520 --> 01:13:17,200
Speaker 2: it's only it can't get worse, you know what I mean.

1426
01:13:17,200 --> 01:13:19,120
Speaker 2: So everything we didn't been through in life, I think

1427
01:13:19,160 --> 01:13:20,840
Speaker 2: we dealt with it what I had up chest out

1428
01:13:20,960 --> 01:13:22,599
Speaker 2: knowing that we're gonna get through it.

1429
01:13:22,640 --> 01:13:24,760
Speaker 5: But do you realize how much stronger that makes you

1430
01:13:24,960 --> 01:13:29,000
Speaker 5: than me? No stronger than me, No, the specifics of

1431
01:13:29,040 --> 01:13:30,840
Speaker 5: what it is that you did. Now there are different

1432
01:13:30,920 --> 01:13:33,840
Speaker 5: kinds of strengths right like I would I would say

1433
01:13:33,840 --> 01:13:36,719
Speaker 5: to you that I'm getting stronger around my brother's grief,

1434
01:13:36,800 --> 01:13:39,200
Speaker 5: although i am not. I am not yet strong. But

1435
01:13:40,160 --> 01:13:43,800
Speaker 5: that attitude that you're talking about makes you guys much

1436
01:13:43,840 --> 01:13:48,600
Speaker 5: stronger than the average human being. Because the days have

1437
01:13:48,800 --> 01:13:51,280
Speaker 5: so much failure in them, they.

1438
01:13:51,160 --> 01:13:53,120
Speaker 2: Have these guys depend on us, and we know that,

1439
01:13:53,200 --> 01:13:54,559
Speaker 2: you know what I'm saying, We got people that depend

1440
01:13:54,560 --> 01:13:54,840
Speaker 2: on us.

1441
01:13:54,840 --> 01:13:57,160
Speaker 5: I'm just talking about your basketball careers though now you're

1442
01:13:57,160 --> 01:13:59,760
Speaker 5: inventing yourself in the second space right now, you're going

1443
01:13:59,800 --> 01:14:03,320
Speaker 5: to apply whatever competitiveness exists anywhere, and you quit a

1444
01:14:03,360 --> 01:14:05,960
Speaker 5: good job. You're leaving a good job that if you

1445
01:14:06,040 --> 01:14:09,280
Speaker 5: wanted to take the traditional path, you could be a

1446
01:14:09,360 --> 01:14:14,599
Speaker 5: color commentators and King's icon. Matt Barnes, you don't want

1447
01:14:14,640 --> 01:14:18,840
Speaker 5: to take the traditional path. The strength that you guys

1448
01:14:18,920 --> 01:14:21,880
Speaker 5: have makes you go chase the difficult things because the

1449
01:14:21,920 --> 01:14:24,320
Speaker 5: rewards are on the side of the most difficult things

1450
01:14:24,600 --> 01:14:25,240
Speaker 5: on the other side.

1451
01:14:25,280 --> 01:14:27,320
Speaker 1: I'll share a quick story about you know, when we

1452
01:14:27,439 --> 01:14:30,880
Speaker 1: sat down with Cobe our last interview and before we

1453
01:14:30,920 --> 01:14:33,919
Speaker 1: were in his office talking and he was so adamant

1454
01:14:33,960 --> 01:14:37,679
Speaker 1: about you know, this last twenty years of me being

1455
01:14:37,680 --> 01:14:39,720
Speaker 1: the Laker and Covid like, I don't want people to

1456
01:14:39,720 --> 01:14:41,559
Speaker 1: remember me by that, And I'm like, what are you

1457
01:14:41,560 --> 01:14:43,320
Speaker 1: talking about. You know, you're a five time champ, one

1458
01:14:43,320 --> 01:14:45,000
Speaker 1: of the greatest players ever. He's like, no, they're like

1459
01:14:45,040 --> 01:14:48,280
Speaker 1: these next twenty this business side is what I want

1460
01:14:48,320 --> 01:14:50,519
Speaker 1: people to remember him for. And he's just like, you know,

1461
01:14:50,560 --> 01:14:54,280
Speaker 1: as athletes, we're disciplined where you know, we're coachable, we listen,

1462
01:14:54,360 --> 01:14:57,600
Speaker 1: we apply ourselves and we have to be elite you know,

1463
01:14:57,640 --> 01:15:00,439
Speaker 1: He's like, I'm taking all that to the business, and

1464
01:15:00,479 --> 01:15:01,840
Speaker 1: I know there was a lot of people. Just with

1465
01:15:01,880 --> 01:15:03,200
Speaker 1: that alone, I'm going to surpass.

1466
01:15:03,240 --> 01:15:05,000
Speaker 5: Oh he was going to get there before Lebron. And

1467
01:15:05,000 --> 01:15:07,439
Speaker 5: there's Tom Brady. They're all competing that space now for

1468
01:15:07,520 --> 01:15:10,439
Speaker 5: the ownership. They're all this is how you get into

1469
01:15:10,479 --> 01:15:14,479
Speaker 5: the halls of power, though, right, because now Tom Brady's

1470
01:15:14,560 --> 01:15:16,599
Speaker 5: choosing between a three hundred and seventy five million dollar

1471
01:15:16,720 --> 01:15:19,479
Speaker 5: job and owning the Raiders Lebron. I think Lebron showed

1472
01:15:19,520 --> 01:15:21,920
Speaker 5: all these guys what could be possible here. But of course,

1473
01:15:21,960 --> 01:15:25,080
Speaker 5: now Dwayne owns part of the Utah Jazz because here

1474
01:15:25,160 --> 01:15:28,160
Speaker 5: comes real power, here comes real change. Michael Jordan, the

1475
01:15:28,160 --> 01:15:30,920
Speaker 5: only black owner in basketball, gets out with all of

1476
01:15:30,960 --> 01:15:33,080
Speaker 5: the money, had very little in the way of impact,

1477
01:15:33,080 --> 01:15:37,240
Speaker 5: But here come his descendants as competitive as him and

1478
01:15:37,320 --> 01:15:40,040
Speaker 5: learning the things that a new generation learns with more

1479
01:15:40,080 --> 01:15:44,840
Speaker 5: power in this space, Like you're going may one day

1480
01:15:44,880 --> 01:15:47,759
Speaker 5: you be making the deals with Lebron at the top,

1481
01:15:48,120 --> 01:15:51,760
Speaker 5: just because you have the relationships, because because there's plenty

1482
01:15:51,800 --> 01:15:53,920
Speaker 5: of money here for everybody. Once you guys have the

1483
01:15:53,960 --> 01:15:56,640
Speaker 5: power and get into this game and start like disrupting,

1484
01:15:56,920 --> 01:15:57,720
Speaker 5: disrupting it.

1485
01:15:58,240 --> 01:15:59,880
Speaker 1: I love this. I'm obviously going to say the number.

1486
01:16:00,120 --> 01:16:01,600
Speaker 1: I love when he said last night, He's like, the

1487
01:16:01,640 --> 01:16:04,040
Speaker 1: money you're getting this year is just the beginning. I'm

1488
01:16:04,080 --> 01:16:06,759
Speaker 1: just like, oh, I love to hear that. But anyway,

1489
01:16:07,680 --> 01:16:10,360
Speaker 1: this is man, this has been great. We got quick hitters.

1490
01:16:10,400 --> 01:16:10,599
Speaker 4: Now.

1491
01:16:11,120 --> 01:16:13,360
Speaker 1: First thing to come to mind, let us know what

1492
01:16:13,520 --> 01:16:17,320
Speaker 1: is your top five Miami athletes of all time?

1493
01:16:17,520 --> 01:16:19,559
Speaker 5: Okay, that is putting me on the spot in no

1494
01:16:19,600 --> 01:16:23,280
Speaker 5: particular order. We're not going in any particular order. Okay,

1495
01:16:23,360 --> 01:16:26,000
Speaker 5: I'm gonna clear. No, I'm gonna do it in order.

1496
01:16:26,000 --> 01:16:28,600
Speaker 5: I'm gonna go number five. Jose Fernandez. I'm going to

1497
01:16:28,640 --> 01:16:33,880
Speaker 5: say that because he he told a particularly Cuban tale. No,

1498
01:16:34,040 --> 01:16:36,800
Speaker 5: there are three. There are three Cuban guys. He Jose

1499
01:16:36,920 --> 01:16:40,760
Speaker 5: Fernandez is the Latin player who passed away. But he's

1500
01:16:40,920 --> 01:16:42,880
Speaker 5: probably the biggest arm in history. But you've got the

1501
01:16:42,880 --> 01:16:45,680
Speaker 5: two brothers you're mentioning, Levan and El Duque. I'd put

1502
01:16:45,720 --> 01:16:47,559
Speaker 5: all three of them together just because of the emotion

1503
01:16:47,720 --> 01:16:53,439
Speaker 5: of they told my family story that came over from Cuba. Four,

1504
01:16:53,640 --> 01:16:59,960
Speaker 5: I would go Alonzo morning because of he helped over

1505
01:17:00,240 --> 01:17:05,040
Speaker 5: town in a way. Uh. He had real impact charitably

1506
01:17:05,360 --> 01:17:07,960
Speaker 5: in our community, caring about people that not a lot

1507
01:17:08,000 --> 01:17:10,400
Speaker 5: of people cared about, and was obviously a Hall of

1508
01:17:10,400 --> 01:17:11,400
Speaker 5: Famer and great.

1509
01:17:12,120 --> 01:17:12,320
Speaker 2: Uh.

1510
01:17:12,600 --> 01:17:19,200
Speaker 5: Three would be u Dan Marino because he built a

1511
01:17:19,280 --> 01:17:22,400
Speaker 5: children That should probably be number two. Uh because he

1512
01:17:22,439 --> 01:17:26,280
Speaker 5: built a children's hospital and was a Hall of famer uh.

1513
01:17:26,080 --> 01:17:27,280
Speaker 1: And played in ace Ventura.

1514
01:17:27,680 --> 01:17:31,880
Speaker 5: Played they played in ace Ventura. I am Uh. I

1515
01:17:31,880 --> 01:17:33,599
Speaker 5: got to think about this for a second. I'm gonna

1516
01:17:33,600 --> 01:17:37,760
Speaker 5: go number three Ricky Williams because his story is uh.

1517
01:17:37,800 --> 01:17:40,439
Speaker 5: He's friends were friends, and I love him. I love

1518
01:17:40,520 --> 01:17:42,880
Speaker 5: him like a brother, and he was great and he

1519
01:17:42,960 --> 01:17:45,840
Speaker 5: was wronged, like I mean, got chased out of the

1520
01:17:45,880 --> 01:17:46,880
Speaker 5: league for smoking weed.

1521
01:17:46,960 --> 01:17:47,160
Speaker 3: Yeah.

1522
01:17:48,160 --> 01:17:48,280
Speaker 1: Uh.

1523
01:17:48,360 --> 01:17:50,200
Speaker 5: And then number one would be Dwane Wade. He's the

1524
01:17:50,200 --> 01:17:52,200
Speaker 5: best best athlete in the history of our town.

1525
01:17:53,439 --> 01:17:55,120
Speaker 4: One thing you wish you were better.

1526
01:17:54,880 --> 01:17:57,240
Speaker 5: At forgiving myself?

1527
01:17:57,520 --> 01:17:59,879
Speaker 1: Oh that's date being less.

1528
01:17:59,640 --> 01:18:00,559
Speaker 4: Hard on myself.

1529
01:18:01,120 --> 01:18:02,200
Speaker 5: That's why I go to therapy.

1530
01:18:02,200 --> 01:18:02,679
Speaker 4: I'm trying.

1531
01:18:03,040 --> 01:18:05,160
Speaker 5: I've had a lot of trouble with that one. If

1532
01:18:05,160 --> 01:18:07,040
Speaker 5: I could be more gentle with myself, I would be

1533
01:18:07,080 --> 01:18:10,200
Speaker 5: more loving and kinder to myself.

1534
01:18:10,280 --> 01:18:14,320
Speaker 1: You'll get there. One dream interview that you haven't had

1535
01:18:14,400 --> 01:18:15,599
Speaker 1: yet that you would like to get.

1536
01:18:16,520 --> 01:18:25,479
Speaker 5: Oh Man one dream interview. I'm gonna go Jim Carrey, Jim.

1537
01:18:25,360 --> 01:18:28,240
Speaker 1: Carrey, I like that.

1538
01:18:29,000 --> 01:18:32,120
Speaker 2: Top five sports personalities of all times?

1539
01:18:32,240 --> 01:18:39,280
Speaker 5: Oh dear God, Oh sports personalities of all time. Give

1540
01:18:39,320 --> 01:18:42,000
Speaker 5: me some nominations here, right, because we're gonna go Howard

1541
01:18:42,000 --> 01:18:45,960
Speaker 5: cosell Is obvious sports personalities. You're not talking about broadcaster types.

1542
01:18:46,000 --> 01:18:48,960
Speaker 5: You're talking about Okay, you're talking about characters. You're talking

1543
01:18:48,960 --> 01:18:56,519
Speaker 5: about charisma and yeah, of course, okay, Ali Jim Brown,

1544
01:18:56,600 --> 01:19:03,320
Speaker 5: although complicated legacy, yeah so, But I mean you're talking

1545
01:19:03,320 --> 01:19:07,639
Speaker 5: about civil rights activist, bad relationship with women that causes

1546
01:19:07,680 --> 01:19:10,640
Speaker 5: a moral conundrum that but as a person, I mean,

1547
01:19:11,760 --> 01:19:15,280
Speaker 5: retires from the league at the age of thirty as

1548
01:19:15,560 --> 01:19:18,559
Speaker 5: MVP from the set of The Dirty doesn't because he

1549
01:19:18,600 --> 01:19:21,679
Speaker 5: doesn't like his pay and wouldn't go to jail because

1550
01:19:21,680 --> 01:19:24,799
Speaker 5: he wasn't I'm sorry, wouldn't pick up trash and preferred

1551
01:19:24,800 --> 01:19:26,320
Speaker 5: to go to jail because he wasn't going to be

1552
01:19:26,400 --> 01:19:30,440
Speaker 5: undignified as a black man in his position picking up trash.

1553
01:19:30,520 --> 01:19:34,719
Speaker 5: So all of these guys who who had activist causes

1554
01:19:34,840 --> 01:19:43,240
Speaker 5: are moving to me personalities personalities. Rodman going a basketball here.

1555
01:19:43,360 --> 01:19:48,280
Speaker 5: Football rubbed some of that out, Dean. Yeah, I know, well,

1556
01:19:48,720 --> 01:19:51,439
Speaker 5: thank you, thank you for the help Dion, because he

1557
01:19:51,520 --> 01:19:57,120
Speaker 5: taught Dion knew all of this stuff much earlier, how

1558
01:19:57,120 --> 01:19:59,960
Speaker 5: to manage his brand, how to be a master market

1559
01:20:00,320 --> 01:20:03,760
Speaker 5: how to be somebody who who paved the way on

1560
01:20:03,840 --> 01:20:06,919
Speaker 5: both commerce and funny and and knew how to sell himself.

1561
01:20:07,080 --> 01:20:09,000
Speaker 5: That's enough. You guys are wearing me out. This is

1562
01:20:09,760 --> 01:20:12,880
Speaker 5: I don't like. I don't that's it. You're making me

1563
01:20:12,920 --> 01:20:17,800
Speaker 5: think too much. I grieved, I wept. Come on, emotional

1564
01:20:17,880 --> 01:20:21,599
Speaker 5: roll call the hip hop duet. Come on, man, you're

1565
01:20:21,640 --> 01:20:22,320
Speaker 5: wearing me out.

1566
01:20:22,760 --> 01:20:27,160
Speaker 1: Welcome to death row stuck on an island? Three shows

1567
01:20:27,240 --> 01:20:28,880
Speaker 1: or movies in rotation on?

1568
01:20:29,000 --> 01:20:31,400
Speaker 5: Man, how many more of these are there? I can't.

1569
01:20:31,720 --> 01:20:34,800
Speaker 5: You guys have more stamina than I do.

1570
01:20:35,000 --> 01:20:36,280
Speaker 1: Three favorite shows and movies.

1571
01:20:36,320 --> 01:20:41,200
Speaker 5: Okay, I'm gonna go. I'm gonna go, uh, Breaking Bad,

1572
01:20:42,320 --> 01:20:49,920
Speaker 5: the Sopranos and the Jefferson's.

1573
01:20:50,880 --> 01:20:54,120
Speaker 1: That's nice. I like that.

1574
01:20:54,760 --> 01:20:55,879
Speaker 4: What's your guilty pleasure?

1575
01:20:56,360 --> 01:20:56,880
Speaker 5: Cheesecake?

1576
01:20:57,360 --> 01:20:57,639
Speaker 3: Geez?

1577
01:20:58,040 --> 01:20:59,800
Speaker 4: That was easy. You have.

1578
01:21:02,360 --> 01:21:03,599
Speaker 1: Speaking about something right now?

1579
01:21:05,880 --> 01:21:07,760
Speaker 5: Well, if you want to ask me about food, I'm

1580
01:21:07,920 --> 01:21:10,320
Speaker 5: happy to go on for another three hours.

1581
01:21:10,439 --> 01:21:14,000
Speaker 1: With five dinner guests, dead or alive. You plus five

1582
01:21:14,000 --> 01:21:15,920
Speaker 1: around the dinner table talking about whatever.

1583
01:21:17,280 --> 01:21:20,719
Speaker 5: You know what, I can't do it. That's a pleasure

1584
01:21:23,439 --> 01:21:29,439
Speaker 5: looking forward to I love it.

1585
01:21:29,600 --> 01:21:36,360
Speaker 1: Hey only only only here. Hey man, that's a wrap,

1586
01:21:36,640 --> 01:21:41,360
Speaker 1: Dan Levantar. We're thankful. Thank you Dan, Thank you John Skipper,

1587
01:21:41,520 --> 01:21:45,120
Speaker 1: Thank you Metal Lark for believing in us DraftKings. This

1588
01:21:45,240 --> 01:21:47,760
Speaker 1: new this new era of all the smoke production is

1589
01:21:47,800 --> 01:21:50,080
Speaker 1: going to be great. Thank you guys for sticking bias

1590
01:21:50,120 --> 01:21:52,400
Speaker 1: and being loyal fans. Me and Jack got a lot

1591
01:21:52,439 --> 01:21:58,040
Speaker 1: of new ship coming your way. Come on, man, this Dan,

1592
01:21:58,520 --> 01:22:00,400
Speaker 1: I just I just hope when he hugged he didn't

1593
01:22:00,400 --> 01:22:03,880
Speaker 1: mess my hair up. God damn it. You can catch

1594
01:22:03,960 --> 01:22:07,960
Speaker 1: all the smoke productions you too. Find this interview on Bennymore.

1595
01:22:08,040 --> 01:22:09,080
Speaker 1: We'll see you guys next week.