WEBVTT - Sterlin Harjo, Reservation Dogs 0:00:15.076 --> 0:00:25.396 Pushkin, this is solvable. I'm Ronald Young Jr. Growing up, 0:00:25.436 --> 0:00:30.356 there was not a single positive reference that I remember 0:00:30.676 --> 0:00:35.156 in media or popular culture or anything like. I grew 0:00:35.236 --> 0:00:37.556 up with Peter Pan and like the whole like what 0:00:37.676 --> 0:00:40.716 makes the Red Man Red? And then we got Disney Spokeahonis, 0:00:40.796 --> 0:00:45.116 which everyone thought was a sort of good depiction of natives, 0:00:45.116 --> 0:00:48.356 and it did make some limited strides, But then that 0:00:48.436 --> 0:00:51.156 meant that everyone would just when I said I was Native, 0:00:51.156 --> 0:00:54.076 would like sing Colors of the Wind to me. You 0:00:54.156 --> 0:00:56.396 might remember this conversation I had in twenty twenty one 0:00:56.436 --> 0:00:59.516 with doctor Adrian Keane, a citizen of the Cherokee Nation, 0:00:59.836 --> 0:01:03.476 scholar and author of Notable Native People. We were talking 0:01:03.476 --> 0:01:07.396 about the erasiar and invisibility of Indigenous people. We agreed 0:01:07.436 --> 0:01:09.756 that there was a disconnect between the way Natives are 0:01:09.756 --> 0:01:13.276 portrayed on film and television and the realities of Native 0:01:13.316 --> 0:01:16.476 and Indigenous life. What I love about movies and cinemas 0:01:16.516 --> 0:01:19.196 that like, you can create a world, and if you 0:01:19.276 --> 0:01:22.196 do it right, an audience will go along with you, 0:01:22.236 --> 0:01:24.916 and they go into your world that you've created, and 0:01:25.796 --> 0:01:28.476 they give themselves over to that. And already had a 0:01:28.556 --> 0:01:31.316 leg up because the world I come from is so unknown. 0:01:32.276 --> 0:01:35.956 That's filmmaker Sterlin Harjoe, a citizen of the Seminal Nation 0:01:35.996 --> 0:01:40.316 of Oklahoma. He's the creator and showrunner of Reservation Dogs. 0:01:40.676 --> 0:01:43.276 It's an FX series about a group of Native American 0:01:43.316 --> 0:01:47.596 teenagers coming of age on a reservation in Oklahoma. I mean, 0:01:47.636 --> 0:01:50.676 like we only talk about the warriors and the heroes 0:01:50.676 --> 0:01:52.316 and stuff. It was like, you know, what about the 0:01:52.316 --> 0:01:55.756 ones that didn't do shit or they were scared, like 0:01:56.356 --> 0:01:59.836 the diet because their horse hit a gopher hole. You know, 0:01:59.876 --> 0:02:02.316 like like what about them? You know, like that's also 0:02:02.356 --> 0:02:05.396 a part of us. Harjo's other work, including award winning 0:02:05.396 --> 0:02:09.116 feature films and documentaries, has also largely focused on Native 0:02:09.156 --> 0:02:13.396 of history, identity, and culture. In Reservation Dogs, he strives 0:02:13.396 --> 0:02:18.636 to portray fully realized Indigenous books in America, a departure 0:02:18.876 --> 0:02:21.516 from the representation that some of us may be all 0:02:21.516 --> 0:02:26.116 too familiar with. My name is Charlin Harjoe. I am filmmaker, creator, 0:02:26.196 --> 0:02:30.196 showrunner of Reservation Dogs, and I feel that representing the 0:02:30.236 --> 0:02:37.596 humanity of Native people is a solvable problem. I think 0:02:37.596 --> 0:02:40.636 the work that you're doing is very tangible when it 0:02:40.676 --> 0:02:43.716 comes to stopping the erasure of a culture. Can you 0:02:43.756 --> 0:02:46.156 talk a little bit about how your work is encouraging 0:02:46.196 --> 0:02:50.516 that visibility. We just tell the truth, you show the good, 0:02:50.676 --> 0:02:53.076 you show the bad, because because that's what's missing is 0:02:53.076 --> 0:02:55.476 we haven't been seen as human and humans are good 0:02:55.476 --> 0:02:59.076 and bad, and we have to show those sides and 0:02:59.196 --> 0:03:02.156 also tell a good story first, and then you're gonna 0:03:02.236 --> 0:03:07.236 get the activism or the real stuff that we're going for. 0:03:07.476 --> 0:03:10.236 Right Like, as long as I a good story, like 0:03:10.436 --> 0:03:12.636 that's the trojan horse, right Like, you tell the good 0:03:12.676 --> 0:03:15.156 story and you get in there. I feel like I 0:03:15.276 --> 0:03:17.996 know how to bring us into the rest of the world. 0:03:18.316 --> 0:03:20.356 I was so proud to be able to do it 0:03:20.396 --> 0:03:23.196 because I feel like I had known how to do 0:03:23.236 --> 0:03:24.756 I feel like I know how to do it, you know, 0:03:24.796 --> 0:03:27.036 because you know how it is, like like as soon 0:03:27.076 --> 0:03:30.516 as you're an underrepresented person gets to tell their story, 0:03:30.836 --> 0:03:33.436 they don't want to share the darkness, they don't want 0:03:33.436 --> 0:03:36.796 to share the blemishes. They only want us to look perfect. 0:03:36.876 --> 0:03:40.636 They only want us us to be you know, everything, 0:03:40.636 --> 0:03:43.676 to look amazing and like, you know, like like there's 0:03:43.676 --> 0:03:46.356 no issues here, like because like it's it's the pendulum swinging, 0:03:46.476 --> 0:03:47.996 you know. I mean, like one of the best things 0:03:47.996 --> 0:03:51.556 about this show is the feedback I've gotten from the community, 0:03:51.596 --> 0:03:54.276 people from all over indigenous communities writing me and saying, men, 0:03:54.396 --> 0:03:57.876 like my kids are finally feel like they're seeing something 0:03:57.916 --> 0:04:00.116 that represents them. Like I mean, my dad said the 0:04:00.156 --> 0:04:02.916 other day, it was like you've given them an identity again, 0:04:02.956 --> 0:04:06.036 Like we can be proud. And part of that being proud, 0:04:06.276 --> 0:04:13.236 I think is just showing us as flawed, beautiful human 0:04:13.276 --> 0:04:17.196 beings and showing that we face death and that sometimes 0:04:17.276 --> 0:04:20.956 we can't handle life and sometimes we sometimes we are upset, 0:04:21.036 --> 0:04:23.916 and sometimes we're not good people, and sometimes we're really good, 0:04:23.956 --> 0:04:26.916 you know, and just showing that, letting people kind of 0:04:26.956 --> 0:04:29.276 relax a little bit and take a breath, and that 0:04:29.316 --> 0:04:32.756 we don't have to be these historical figures that that 0:04:33.076 --> 0:04:36.196 fought and lost or won for our land and like 0:04:36.516 --> 0:04:38.556 and it was just kind of shaking that off and 0:04:39.036 --> 0:04:40.836 like a good blues song, you know, it's like what 0:04:40.956 --> 0:04:43.036 is the how do you strip it down to what 0:04:43.076 --> 0:04:45.156 it is? You know, It's like, yeah, without all the 0:04:45.196 --> 0:04:47.316 fancy stuff, like what are we? We're human, you know, 0:04:47.356 --> 0:04:49.636 and like you try to tell that the truth and 0:04:49.716 --> 0:04:51.556 the and the and the and the light and the 0:04:51.636 --> 0:04:53.476 darkness with that, and I think that that's what makes 0:04:53.476 --> 0:04:56.356 a difference, and that's what gets people to identify with it, 0:04:56.516 --> 0:04:58.836 and watching the show, I felt that I felt, you know, 0:04:58.876 --> 0:05:02.556 watching a show like yours, watching a show like Rami Atlanta. 0:05:02.876 --> 0:05:05.276 I feel like there's other shows where they're just showing 0:05:05.396 --> 0:05:09.076 humans of cultures that have been have been in America 0:05:09.116 --> 0:05:11.116 and a part of America for a long time, but 0:05:11.196 --> 0:05:12.996 showing them as human. But I think one of the 0:05:12.996 --> 0:05:15.276 most interesting ways that you did in a Reservation Dogs 0:05:15.676 --> 0:05:18.516 was that you have a bear. One of the main characters, 0:05:19.076 --> 0:05:22.116 Jeans T Shirt, teenage boy. He is talking to one 0:05:22.116 --> 0:05:26.516 of his ancestors, his grandfather uncle cousin, who explicitly states 0:05:26.596 --> 0:05:28.676 that he's not one of the awesome ones. But I 0:05:28.756 --> 0:05:31.276 fought bravely. Well. I didn't actually fight. I actually didn't 0:05:31.276 --> 0:05:33.116 even get into the fight itself, but came over that 0:05:33.196 --> 0:05:36.316 hill real real good like. But then the damn horse 0:05:36.956 --> 0:05:39.956 hit a gopher hole, fucking rolled over and squashed me. 0:05:40.876 --> 0:05:44.756 I died there. He was just the guy who who 0:05:44.876 --> 0:05:47.996 died on his horse after horse fell into a hole. 0:05:48.356 --> 0:05:51.836 I thought, what's hilarious was all of that? The inspiration 0:05:51.876 --> 0:05:56.636 behind giving Bear this very regular ancestor to guide him totally. 0:05:56.756 --> 0:05:58.956 I mean, like we only talked about the warriors and 0:05:59.476 --> 0:06:01.236 the heroes and stuff. I was like, you know, what 0:06:01.316 --> 0:06:04.196 about the ones that didn't do shit or they were 0:06:04.236 --> 0:06:09.676 scared die because their horse hit a gopher hole? Like 0:06:09.676 --> 0:06:12.116 like what about them? Yeah, Like that's also a part 0:06:12.156 --> 0:06:14.356 of us. And I think one thing that's important about 0:06:14.356 --> 0:06:17.276 that character. I'm glad you brought it up is what 0:06:17.396 --> 0:06:21.196 I learned because we had a comedy group Dallas Goals, 0:06:21.556 --> 0:06:23.396 who plays Spirit, We had a comedy We have a 0:06:23.396 --> 0:06:25.356 comedy group and we would travel around and we really 0:06:25.436 --> 0:06:28.396 learned like what works for non native audiences for native 0:06:28.476 --> 0:06:31.996 humor and what doesn't specifically wide audiences. You know what 0:06:31.996 --> 0:06:34.956 I'm saying, um like because you gotta almost give them 0:06:34.956 --> 0:06:37.836 permission to laugh when it's Native stuff because they want 0:06:37.876 --> 0:06:40.556 to be like so like oh I find the same 0:06:40.636 --> 0:06:43.916 thing with black humor, but continue exactly right, like you 0:06:43.956 --> 0:06:46.236 gotta you gotta like oh like like oh I don't 0:06:46.236 --> 0:06:48.316 want to laugh, like you know, you had to give 0:06:48.396 --> 0:06:51.196 them permission a laugh. And it was it was a 0:06:51.436 --> 0:06:53.436 taking the stereotype that like if I were to say, 0:06:53.476 --> 0:06:56.716 like like draw me a Native American, like they wouldn't 0:06:56.756 --> 0:06:58.996 draw bearer, they would draw spirit. You know. It's a 0:06:59.156 --> 0:07:02.196 delicate thing, like trying to get people to laugh at 0:07:02.236 --> 0:07:05.716 things that they're used to not laughing with or about 0:07:05.916 --> 0:07:08.516 or anything, you know. So I think that that character 0:07:08.556 --> 0:07:12.236 specifically was kind of works as that mechanism. I guess. 0:07:12.796 --> 0:07:16.076 Tell me a little bit about how you got into film. 0:07:16.116 --> 0:07:18.156 You know. I got into college and I was at 0:07:18.196 --> 0:07:22.436 the University of Oklahoma, and I took an intro to 0:07:22.476 --> 0:07:27.116 film and video studies with this Hungarian professor named Misha Nadelkovich, 0:07:27.836 --> 0:07:31.436 and his like love for cinema was so contagious. And 0:07:31.516 --> 0:07:35.116 it was when I discovered that it was a language 0:07:35.356 --> 0:07:37.836 was when I was pumped, and like that's when I 0:07:37.876 --> 0:07:42.756 really got into it. It was like, okay, I like 0:07:42.796 --> 0:07:46.836 when I realized it wasn't just pointing a camera towards something, 0:07:46.916 --> 0:07:49.716 it was literally like telling stories with the camera and 0:07:49.836 --> 0:07:53.596 using cameras and shots too, and music and everything all 0:07:53.596 --> 0:07:57.316 the senses to tell a story. I just really, I 0:07:57.356 --> 0:07:59.516 don't know, I fell in love and I didn't look back. 0:07:59.556 --> 0:08:00.916 I was like, I have to do this, you know, 0:08:00.916 --> 0:08:03.396 And and it's sort of that sort of coincided with 0:08:03.436 --> 0:08:06.436 me discovering that I was a pretty good writer. I 0:08:06.436 --> 0:08:08.876 think I was always a good storyteller. I just was 0:08:08.956 --> 0:08:12.116 not confident in writing. But it was in college that 0:08:12.156 --> 0:08:14.676 I discovered that I could, you know, with a little work, 0:08:14.716 --> 0:08:17.436 I could write. College is the time that we all 0:08:17.476 --> 0:08:20.156 become a lot more self aware. I think that was 0:08:20.316 --> 0:08:24.236 identified most with my blackness when I got to college 0:08:24.596 --> 0:08:27.476 and I began to kind of express it and everything 0:08:27.516 --> 0:08:30.076 that I did, you know, whether it was playing music, 0:08:30.276 --> 0:08:32.516 talking to friends, whatever, it was like I had to 0:08:32.516 --> 0:08:35.396 express my blackness. As you were becoming more creative and 0:08:35.436 --> 0:08:39.476 writing and enjoying telling stories, did you find yourself having 0:08:39.516 --> 0:08:42.036 that same level of expressiveness when it comes to your 0:08:42.036 --> 0:08:45.396 indigenous heritage. Yeah, I mean, like it was there's two things. 0:08:45.436 --> 0:08:47.316 I mean, like, on one hand, like I'd kind of 0:08:47.316 --> 0:08:50.356 grown up in this community and I was hungry for 0:08:50.396 --> 0:08:54.476 things like punk rock and indie rock, and like I 0:08:54.516 --> 0:08:58.236 was wanting to express myself through art, and I was 0:08:58.276 --> 0:09:01.036 discovering artists and cinnamon and all this stuff that had 0:09:01.076 --> 0:09:05.236 nothing to do with my heritage or background, and I 0:09:05.316 --> 0:09:08.556 really just kind of dove into all of that. But, 0:09:08.716 --> 0:09:11.956 like you said, a couple of years of that though, 0:09:12.356 --> 0:09:15.836 when I started applying myself and writing and wanting to 0:09:15.876 --> 0:09:19.716 be a filmmaker. Then I was like, oh, but this 0:09:19.756 --> 0:09:22.796 is the thing that's unique about me. And then and 0:09:22.836 --> 0:09:25.676 then it was like, oh, now, then I like discovered 0:09:25.756 --> 0:09:28.996 rediscovered who I was and everything kind of came from 0:09:28.996 --> 0:09:33.156 that lens after that, and I realized that, you know, 0:09:33.276 --> 0:09:36.356 a lot of people don't have the leg up that 0:09:36.436 --> 0:09:38.956 I had, Like I have this like I mean what 0:09:38.996 --> 0:09:41.796 I love about movies and cinemas that like, you can 0:09:41.796 --> 0:09:45.116 create a world and if you do it right, an 0:09:45.156 --> 0:09:47.676 audience will go along with you and they go into 0:09:47.756 --> 0:09:51.156 your world that you've created and they give themselves over 0:09:51.196 --> 0:09:53.476 to that. And already had a leg up because the 0:09:53.476 --> 0:09:58.316 world I come from is so unknown that it was 0:09:58.356 --> 0:10:00.356 a little easier. I felt like to bring people into 0:10:00.356 --> 0:10:03.236 this world that they didn't know, you know. So after that, 0:10:03.436 --> 0:10:07.476 I'm very similar to you. Everything kind of filtered through 0:10:07.476 --> 0:10:11.036 that lens. When you're making discoveries about new things that 0:10:11.116 --> 0:10:13.596 you love that weren't necessarily a part of your culture 0:10:13.636 --> 0:10:15.836 growing up, for instance, punk rock, but there are things 0:10:15.836 --> 0:10:18.716 that you're introduced to that you love. As you become 0:10:18.756 --> 0:10:21.236 more in touch with your culture, do you look for 0:10:21.276 --> 0:10:24.236 the connections between the thing that you love and your culture. 0:10:24.436 --> 0:10:29.596 Oh yeah, for sure. And you know I like hip hop, 0:10:29.636 --> 0:10:34.756 I like punk rock, I like rebellious music, and I 0:10:34.796 --> 0:10:38.076 think that Indigenous people, you know, we've always been in 0:10:38.116 --> 0:10:40.676 a bit of a rebellion. It's like, you know, it's 0:10:40.676 --> 0:10:43.956 like there was always something to fight for to this day, 0:10:44.036 --> 0:10:48.036 and so I connect to that. And you know, the 0:10:48.156 --> 0:10:51.356 show is filled with punk rock and indie rock and 0:10:51.436 --> 0:10:54.036 hip hop, and like the opening as you know, I 0:10:54.076 --> 0:10:55.996 Want to Be Your Dog by the Stooges, and it's like, 0:10:56.596 --> 0:10:58.956 you know, one of my favorite things, definding ways to 0:10:59.236 --> 0:11:02.036 bring all of that back into my community, because I 0:11:02.036 --> 0:11:03.756 mean it's there anyway, but it's like, how do I 0:11:03.916 --> 0:11:06.436 show that and express it? You know, I did not 0:11:06.516 --> 0:11:09.116 know that that was That song was by the band 0:11:09.156 --> 0:11:22.956 Red Bull. Yeah, come and Get Your Love, incredibly popular song. Yeah, yes, 0:11:23.036 --> 0:11:25.516 it was on I remember as they're singing it, I'm like, 0:11:25.796 --> 0:11:28.276 this is from the Guardians of the Galaxy. What significance 0:11:28.316 --> 0:11:30.676 does have here? And then at the end when you 0:11:30.716 --> 0:11:33.236 show the band playing it, I'm like, oh my goodness, 0:11:33.316 --> 0:11:36.356 this is all of those happy little connections. I imagine 0:11:36.356 --> 0:11:39.156 that that inspires, inspires you to do more work to 0:11:39.196 --> 0:11:42.156 say like see there, look at these connections, understand how 0:11:42.156 --> 0:11:43.836 it all comes together. Oh yeah, I mean that was 0:11:43.876 --> 0:11:46.396 one of my favorite things. It's like kind of reclaiming 0:11:46.876 --> 0:11:49.276 red Bone. You know, it's like the world knows who 0:11:49.276 --> 0:11:52.156 they are, but they don't know where they come from 0:11:52.196 --> 0:11:53.676 and who they really are. And it was like, I 0:11:53.716 --> 0:11:56.116 want to show that in this unique way as this 0:11:56.276 --> 0:11:59.756 in this episode. A lot of times native people are shown, 0:12:00.276 --> 0:12:02.996 we're only shown in the eighteen hundreds most of the time, 0:12:03.076 --> 0:12:05.676 you know, so trying to show us in a contemporary 0:12:05.756 --> 0:12:09.316 light and how you know, we're just as influenced by 0:12:09.396 --> 0:12:11.956 all these things pop culture like everyone is, you know, 0:12:12.076 --> 0:12:17.756 like from hip hop to movies to um to clothing, 0:12:17.756 --> 0:12:20.676 I mean like style, you know, we're so one of 0:12:20.716 --> 0:12:25.676 our strengths is that we were able to adapt. Like 0:12:25.796 --> 0:12:29.316 for instance, in my community, UM, we have songs that 0:12:29.316 --> 0:12:32.036 are really important and you'll you hear them being sung 0:12:32.716 --> 0:12:52.476 at a funeral scene in the show, and they are hymns. 0:12:52.756 --> 0:12:55.516 And those hymns were there are a mix of like 0:12:56.556 --> 0:13:00.396 the style of singing was kind of brought here by 0:13:00.836 --> 0:13:04.236 Scottish missionaries and it was called line singing. Well, then 0:13:04.276 --> 0:13:08.836 you had free to African slaves. Next to that, there 0:13:08.836 --> 0:13:10.956 were also a part of our tribe with the Seminal nation, 0:13:11.036 --> 0:13:12.916 but also lived in those in the same area in 0:13:12.916 --> 0:13:16.156 the southeast. And you know, all this style of singing 0:13:16.196 --> 0:13:18.756 emerges and you hear it Enslave spiritual as you also 0:13:18.796 --> 0:13:21.236 hear in these Muscogee Creek and Seminal hymns, and it's 0:13:21.236 --> 0:13:23.716 a style of singing that they call it line singing, 0:13:24.356 --> 0:13:26.756 and you know, it's a way of worshiping. It's a 0:13:26.756 --> 0:13:30.636 way of kind of singing prayer, you know, and all 0:13:30.676 --> 0:13:32.436 of those cultures kind of have a mix of that. 0:13:32.516 --> 0:13:35.516 And I think that that's a beautiful thing. Like that's 0:13:35.516 --> 0:13:38.276 what I love celebrating that, right, Like I love talking 0:13:38.316 --> 0:13:41.156 about how our culture is intersect I think part of 0:13:41.156 --> 0:13:43.796 our survival has been adapting, you know. I think the 0:13:43.836 --> 0:13:46.396 same thing for you know, Black people in this country. 0:13:46.436 --> 0:13:49.876 It's like part of survival is absorbing things and culture 0:13:50.036 --> 0:13:52.836 and claiming it for ourselves, you know, and like as 0:13:52.996 --> 0:13:55.316 or just like presenting it in a new way, you know. 0:13:55.356 --> 0:13:58.236 And I think that's something beautiful about the intersection of 0:13:58.596 --> 0:14:02.316 cultures us. It's about survival. I think I am I 0:14:02.356 --> 0:14:04.076 am a Black Christian. I've been in the church my 0:14:04.116 --> 0:14:06.876 whole life. My father's an assistant pastor. Like, I'm heavily 0:14:06.956 --> 0:14:09.676 involved in the church. And I do remember that funeral 0:14:09.756 --> 0:14:13.756 scene where they were singing, doing the line singing. I 0:14:13.836 --> 0:14:16.276 was struck by that part. I was like, this is very, 0:14:16.436 --> 0:14:19.036 very familiar. And I think that's one thing about the 0:14:19.036 --> 0:14:22.556 show Reservation Dogs is that it's it's very familiar. As 0:14:22.556 --> 0:14:24.836 soon as it comes on and you realize that the 0:14:24.876 --> 0:14:28.836 main characters are are basically on a quest to get 0:14:28.876 --> 0:14:32.156 out of their little small town. I was like, oh, oh, yeah, 0:14:32.156 --> 0:14:34.636 this is familiar, Like I know this story. Yeah, everybody 0:14:34.636 --> 0:14:37.316 can relate to that, right, yeah, And I like that 0:14:37.396 --> 0:14:39.796 you use that in order to make it familiar. But 0:14:39.876 --> 0:14:43.116 then you you slowly start introducing concepts that I didn't 0:14:43.116 --> 0:14:45.116 know about, which is an episode two. You immediately start 0:14:45.156 --> 0:14:49.636 talking about Indian Health Services and subtly making these little 0:14:49.636 --> 0:14:52.716 statements about it throughout What are you here for? Come 0:14:52.756 --> 0:14:57.236 to a fight bosting my nose? I got some good ones, 0:14:57.276 --> 0:15:04.956 and now tell your mom, no, I didn't. You shouldn't 0:15:04.956 --> 0:15:09.516 either patient doctor protocol or whatever it's called. Tell me 0:15:09.516 --> 0:15:12.396 a little bit about what your intentions were by teasing 0:15:12.396 --> 0:15:15.876 out the lessons that that me is not non indigenous 0:15:15.916 --> 0:15:19.636 person would learn from watching a show like this. We 0:15:19.716 --> 0:15:23.876 all know what bad health care is, right, Like, my 0:15:23.916 --> 0:15:29.316 whole goal is to be very specific show this culture, 0:15:30.236 --> 0:15:33.796 be very specific about the nuance and the differences and 0:15:33.836 --> 0:15:36.636 the little things that details that make it real. But 0:15:37.076 --> 0:15:42.676 it all has an undercurrent of your universality. And I 0:15:42.716 --> 0:15:46.436 think that those two, the combination of those two things 0:15:46.476 --> 0:15:48.636 are what make people want to come back and watch 0:15:48.676 --> 0:15:50.876 the show, because I think when we're like young and 0:15:50.876 --> 0:15:53.636 we're activists and we're you know, in our early twenties, 0:15:53.636 --> 0:15:55.756 we want to yell, you know, we want like a 0:15:55.796 --> 0:15:59.076 bullhorn to yell. But you realize people don't listen when 0:15:59.076 --> 0:16:04.436 you yell, and if you want people to hear, you 0:16:04.556 --> 0:16:07.556 have to find the right way to deliver it to them, 0:16:08.196 --> 0:16:12.396 like making a podcast, right, making a podcast, making a show, 0:16:12.436 --> 0:16:15.436 but also making a balance of like where I don't 0:16:15.516 --> 0:16:19.876 feel like I'm you don't feel like you're you're getting 0:16:19.916 --> 0:16:24.676 a lecture, You're just getting little tastes of lessons of 0:16:24.916 --> 0:16:28.996 healthcare disparities in America and Indigenous communities through a really 0:16:29.036 --> 0:16:32.196 funny episode that all takes place at the Indian Clinic, 0:16:32.276 --> 0:16:34.196 you know, where Bobby Lee is a doctor and like 0:16:34.276 --> 0:16:36.356 all of these things. Yeah, So I think it's like 0:16:36.396 --> 0:16:37.996 something that I've been this a needle I've been trying 0:16:37.996 --> 0:16:41.196 to threat through from a whole career. Most people that 0:16:41.236 --> 0:16:43.916 have an opportunity, especially when it comes to underserved communities 0:16:44.156 --> 0:16:47.476 and minority groups that are underrepresented, especially in how in 0:16:47.516 --> 0:16:49.836 TV and film, you don't necessarily know if you're going 0:16:49.876 --> 0:16:52.076 to get another chance at this, So you kind of 0:16:52.076 --> 0:16:54.236 just have to, you know, set your path straight and 0:16:54.716 --> 0:16:57.636 whatever happens happens. But you guys get a season two, 0:16:58.476 --> 0:16:59.996 Do you have a plan for us to have a 0:16:59.996 --> 0:17:03.396 long term stay with reservation dogs or oh yeah, yeah. 0:17:03.436 --> 0:17:07.236 My friend Taikytt helped open the door for me and 0:17:07.276 --> 0:17:08.996 then he was like all right, you know, there you go. 0:17:09.356 --> 0:17:13.716 And I was like I have to swing for the fences, 0:17:13.716 --> 0:17:17.916 like I'm gonna not doubt myself. You know, we all 0:17:17.956 --> 0:17:22.156 have that in our heads where where that imposter syndrome 0:17:22.236 --> 0:17:24.436 like should I be here? Like am I supposed to 0:17:24.476 --> 0:17:27.356 be here? Like do I deserve this? I mean, you 0:17:27.396 --> 0:17:31.156 know that's something I've always dealt with and you know, 0:17:31.236 --> 0:17:33.916 and I've always as a as a Native person minority. 0:17:33.916 --> 0:17:37.316 I've always fought any sort of I don't hand me 0:17:37.356 --> 0:17:40.916 anything like, and I've never gotten manned at something that 0:17:40.996 --> 0:17:43.596 I felt was racist. I mean, I've been told so 0:17:43.596 --> 0:17:46.556 many times like this is too native, we can't fund this, 0:17:46.676 --> 0:17:49.156 you know, like I don't like Native films, don't sell 0:17:49.236 --> 0:17:51.476 or anything. I never let that get me, man, it 0:17:51.596 --> 0:17:55.676 just fueled me. I almost wanted the hardest path because 0:17:55.756 --> 0:17:57.516 it's in. It was in my head from a young age. 0:17:57.556 --> 0:18:00.036 My mom, I remember, we would get this. My tribe 0:18:00.036 --> 0:18:03.316 would give us a clothing voucher before school started, two 0:18:03.396 --> 0:18:05.116 hundred and fifty bucks to go to the mall and 0:18:05.156 --> 0:18:08.756 get yourself some clothing. And because it's tribal money, it's 0:18:08.916 --> 0:18:12.436 not untaxable. But you know, the people at Dillards weren't 0:18:12.516 --> 0:18:15.796 used to that, and my mom would just battle them 0:18:15.796 --> 0:18:18.996 and be like, no, it's non taxable. And if they 0:18:19.036 --> 0:18:20.996 made it sound like it was a handout anyway, my 0:18:21.036 --> 0:18:22.596 mom would be like, this is not a handout. This 0:18:22.716 --> 0:18:26.596 is inheritance from our trial, you know. And so I 0:18:26.636 --> 0:18:30.036 always almost like subconsciously one of the harder, like like, yeah, 0:18:30.236 --> 0:18:33.116 be racist, Like I hope you don't understand what Native 0:18:33.116 --> 0:18:35.596 stories are because someday I'm gonna show you, you know. 0:18:35.996 --> 0:18:38.636 And I made all low budget films until this point. 0:18:38.796 --> 0:18:41.836 I mean, like you could have only made two episodes 0:18:41.876 --> 0:18:44.476 of Reservation Dogs with the budget of most of my 0:18:44.516 --> 0:18:46.996 feature films, you know. So when I got here, I 0:18:46.996 --> 0:18:48.676 was like, all right, I fought to be here. I 0:18:48.716 --> 0:18:50.956 got nothing to lose. I'm gonna swing for the fences 0:18:50.996 --> 0:18:53.676 and see what happens. And I never doubted myself and 0:18:53.716 --> 0:18:55.356 I just went for it. And I think that that 0:18:55.476 --> 0:19:00.396 was key to having a successful show because I wasn't 0:19:00.436 --> 0:19:03.636 second guessing myself. I wasn't editing myself. I was just 0:19:03.716 --> 0:19:14.636 going for it. With the success that you're having with 0:19:14.676 --> 0:19:17.716 the show, how do you consider opening the door for 0:19:17.876 --> 0:19:21.076 other Native creators that maybe want to come after you? 0:19:21.116 --> 0:19:22.556 Do you have a plan for to have Do you 0:19:22.596 --> 0:19:24.716 feel a responsibility to do that right? And if so, 0:19:25.356 --> 0:19:26.916 plan for that? I mean definitely. I mean, like I 0:19:26.916 --> 0:19:29.676 don't have the show without Taykott, you know, like like 0:19:30.196 --> 0:19:32.836 um him helping a friend down, and I've done the same. 0:19:32.876 --> 0:19:37.636 I mean, like every writer on the show, they're all Indigenous, 0:19:37.676 --> 0:19:40.556 and they're all friends. All of the directors were friends 0:19:40.556 --> 0:19:43.236 of mine that I wanted to give you know, their 0:19:43.236 --> 0:19:45.636 first TV shot or and one of them a directs 0:19:45.716 --> 0:19:47.436 TV already, but two others like it was their first 0:19:47.476 --> 0:19:50.716 time directing TV. UM doing the same thing for the 0:19:50.756 --> 0:19:53.916 next season. UM. And then also I have no overall 0:19:53.956 --> 0:19:56.236 deal at ects now and part of that is me 0:19:56.436 --> 0:20:01.196 bringing okay, bringing in other folks. Yeah, so like that's honestly, 0:20:01.196 --> 0:20:03.796 like I think my favorite thing about what's happened is 0:20:03.836 --> 0:20:06.596 like I now get to help people with their projects. 0:20:06.596 --> 0:20:10.076 And because I mean, for me, like how I always 0:20:10.076 --> 0:20:12.276 made my films and also how I made Reservation Dogs 0:20:12.356 --> 0:20:14.596 was it was not like a top down thing, like 0:20:14.636 --> 0:20:18.516 I don't like the hierarchy of Hollywood and how they 0:20:18.596 --> 0:20:21.396 usually do it. Like for me, it's just like you 0:20:21.476 --> 0:20:28.116 can't say that old Mike Sterling getting tracked. But like 0:20:28.396 --> 0:20:30.396 you know, I love the community aspect of it, Like 0:20:30.436 --> 0:20:33.636 I love like just how Reservation Dogs is kind of 0:20:33.636 --> 0:20:35.916 about a community. That's how I like making this stuff. 0:20:36.156 --> 0:20:38.476 So with being with bringing in a lot more and 0:20:38.556 --> 0:20:41.636 working with other Native creators, you know, we're seeing kind 0:20:41.636 --> 0:20:44.796 of like an inflection point right now where the Native 0:20:44.836 --> 0:20:48.036 community is receiving a lot of artistic attention. These stories 0:20:48.036 --> 0:20:51.476 and perspectives have always been important, but what do you 0:20:51.516 --> 0:20:53.956 think makes them more important to tell in this moment. 0:20:54.876 --> 0:20:59.436 Like with African American cinema and TV, you know, you 0:20:59.516 --> 0:21:01.876 had these moments like Boys in the Hood and things 0:21:01.916 --> 0:21:05.636 like that where it's like you're reflecting on your communities. 0:21:05.676 --> 0:21:07.316 I mean, like one of my biggest influences on the 0:21:07.356 --> 0:21:11.476 show was was Friday. Oh that's a classic ice cube 0:21:11.556 --> 0:21:14.756 Chris Tucker, nineteen ninety five. I love that movie. By 0:21:14.756 --> 0:21:17.636 all accounts, that neighborhood is supposed to be the ghetto 0:21:17.716 --> 0:21:22.196 and scary and dangerous, but it's you know, in Friday, 0:21:22.236 --> 0:21:24.836 it's like funny, Like it's not thriving, but it's like 0:21:24.836 --> 0:21:27.756 a beautiful you know, it's a celebration. And there might 0:21:27.796 --> 0:21:30.716 be one house that's like an asshole lives in, but 0:21:30.756 --> 0:21:32.956 then the next one was like manicured and they're funny 0:21:32.996 --> 0:21:34.396 and whatever. You know, It's like, that's what I want 0:21:34.436 --> 0:21:38.076 to do. Like literally, whenever I was designing the kind 0:21:38.116 --> 0:21:40.956 of the neighborhood of the of the reservation where they live, 0:21:42.076 --> 0:21:45.836 we looked at Friday, and we use more pastel colors 0:21:45.836 --> 0:21:48.636 and painted the houses and you know, like I think 0:21:48.676 --> 0:21:52.476 people's first inclination when I think of reservation is to 0:21:52.596 --> 0:21:54.716 make everything trashy, you know, because that's what we've seen 0:21:54.716 --> 0:21:57.156 in the documentaries. I was like, no, Like there might 0:21:57.196 --> 0:21:58.956