1
00:00:02,320 --> 00:00:03,040
Speaker 1: Guess what, mango?

2
00:00:03,440 --> 00:00:04,080
Speaker 2: What's that? Will?

3
00:00:04,640 --> 00:00:06,920
Speaker 3: So, a couple of weeks ago, you quoted this old

4
00:00:06,960 --> 00:00:09,799
Speaker 3: deep thought by Jack Candy and it took me by surprise.

5
00:00:09,840 --> 00:00:10,600
Speaker 1: Do you remember doing this?

6
00:00:11,280 --> 00:00:13,399
Speaker 2: So I don't remember what we were talking about, but

7
00:00:13,440 --> 00:00:16,480
Speaker 2: I definitely remember quoting Deep Thoughts, and I think it

8
00:00:16,560 --> 00:00:19,040
Speaker 2: was like the face of a child can say it all,

9
00:00:19,280 --> 00:00:21,119
Speaker 2: especially the mouth part of the faces.

10
00:00:21,400 --> 00:00:24,919
Speaker 3: That is definitely the one that was one of my favorites,

11
00:00:24,920 --> 00:00:27,760
Speaker 3: although it's hard to pick a favorite, And honestly, it

12
00:00:27,760 --> 00:00:29,880
Speaker 3: had been a few years since i'd really binged on

13
00:00:29,960 --> 00:00:32,000
Speaker 3: Deep Thoughts, and I feel like that's the only way

14
00:00:32,040 --> 00:00:34,600
Speaker 3: to experience them, like you have to read one hundred

15
00:00:34,640 --> 00:00:36,760
Speaker 3: at a time, and so I was a little bit

16
00:00:36,840 --> 00:00:39,199
Speaker 3: overdue for this. And for any listeners who might not

17
00:00:39,280 --> 00:00:42,840
Speaker 3: remember Deep Thoughts, they were these silly and stupid one

18
00:00:42,880 --> 00:00:46,160
Speaker 3: liners that were delivered as though they were these inspirational

19
00:00:46,280 --> 00:00:49,520
Speaker 3: and meaningful pieces of advice. And you know, Jack Candy

20
00:00:49,520 --> 00:00:51,680
Speaker 3: had actually been writing these since the mid eighties, but

21
00:00:51,920 --> 00:00:54,000
Speaker 3: I'm pretty sure you and I both discovered them when

22
00:00:54,040 --> 00:00:56,560
Speaker 3: Handy would read them on Saturday Night Live. Is that

23
00:00:56,640 --> 00:00:57,720
Speaker 3: is that where you first heard them?

24
00:00:57,840 --> 00:01:00,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, definitely, that's when I was first exposed to them.

25
00:01:00,400 --> 00:01:02,560
Speaker 3: Yeah, so this was the early nineties. I guess we

26
00:01:02,560 --> 00:01:05,160
Speaker 3: were both in middle school at the time. And I

27
00:01:05,200 --> 00:01:08,000
Speaker 3: thought about another one when Tristan was wearing these fancy

28
00:01:08,080 --> 00:01:10,319
Speaker 3: kicks the other day. He's got lots and lots of shoes,

29
00:01:10,319 --> 00:01:13,039
Speaker 3: but he had some really fancy ones on, and so

30
00:01:14,120 --> 00:01:17,240
Speaker 3: I thought about this when it said before you criticize someone,

31
00:01:17,280 --> 00:01:20,199
Speaker 3: you should walk a mile in their shoes. That way,

32
00:01:20,280 --> 00:01:22,840
Speaker 3: when you criticize them, you're a mile away from them

33
00:01:23,000 --> 00:01:24,320
Speaker 3: and you're in their shoes.

34
00:01:25,480 --> 00:01:27,840
Speaker 2: So stupid. I love that, but it is kind of

35
00:01:27,840 --> 00:01:28,319
Speaker 2: good advice.

36
00:01:28,360 --> 00:01:29,920
Speaker 1: I guess it definitely is.

37
00:01:30,040 --> 00:01:32,200
Speaker 3: And actually, one of the other things I noticed is

38
00:01:32,240 --> 00:01:36,200
Speaker 3: that there was more than one deep thought about pirates weirdly,

39
00:01:36,280 --> 00:01:40,160
Speaker 3: but I think my favorite was pirates were always going

40
00:01:40,200 --> 00:01:43,800
Speaker 3: around searching for treasure and never realized the real treasure

41
00:01:44,000 --> 00:01:45,960
Speaker 3: was the fond memories they were creating.

42
00:01:47,880 --> 00:01:50,520
Speaker 2: Well, I do feel like you're reading that as a

43
00:01:50,560 --> 00:01:52,880
Speaker 2: sign because we've been talking about doing an episode on

44
00:01:52,920 --> 00:01:55,200
Speaker 2: pirates for such a long time now.

45
00:01:55,320 --> 00:01:56,160
Speaker 1: We definitely have.

46
00:01:56,280 --> 00:01:58,320
Speaker 3: I mean, that's how we knew it was time to

47
00:01:58,400 --> 00:02:00,920
Speaker 3: do this, because we've been keeping this list of all

48
00:02:00,960 --> 00:02:04,080
Speaker 3: the pirate stereotypes, and I wanted to know what of

49
00:02:04,120 --> 00:02:07,960
Speaker 3: them are actually true and you know, we're pirates, anything

50
00:02:08,160 --> 00:02:10,240
Speaker 3: like the ones that we see in the movies. Did

51
00:02:10,280 --> 00:02:14,240
Speaker 3: they actually say stuff like shiver me timbers or bury treasure?

52
00:02:14,440 --> 00:02:17,720
Speaker 3: Or did they really carry around monkeys and parrots? And

53
00:02:17,880 --> 00:02:20,520
Speaker 3: my god, I hope that they did. But it's time

54
00:02:20,560 --> 00:02:44,240
Speaker 3: to find out. So let's dive in. Hey, their podcast

55
00:02:44,240 --> 00:02:46,520
Speaker 3: listener is welcome to Part Time Genius. I'm Will Pearson

56
00:02:46,560 --> 00:02:48,840
Speaker 3: and as always I'm joined by my friend Mangesh hot

57
00:02:48,840 --> 00:02:51,360
Speaker 3: ticketter and on the other side of the soundproof glass,

58
00:02:51,840 --> 00:02:54,640
Speaker 3: I actually don't know what Tristan is doing today.

59
00:02:54,720 --> 00:02:55,679
Speaker 1: I am up in New York.

60
00:02:55,720 --> 00:02:58,560
Speaker 3: I'm in my hotel room in this very fancy studio,

61
00:02:58,639 --> 00:03:01,560
Speaker 3: which is just myesk in my hotel room. So it

62
00:03:01,600 --> 00:03:04,280
Speaker 3: may not sound as great as Tristan usually makes it sound,

63
00:03:04,280 --> 00:03:06,320
Speaker 3: but Mango, I gotta know what is Tristan doing.

64
00:03:06,639 --> 00:03:09,000
Speaker 2: So he did not disappoint. He showed up in a

65
00:03:09,040 --> 00:03:14,840
Speaker 2: total pirate Halloween costume. He's got everything. He's got an ipatch,

66
00:03:14,840 --> 00:03:18,680
Speaker 2: a bandana, tri corner hat, he's got a hoop, earrings,

67
00:03:18,720 --> 00:03:21,720
Speaker 2: he's got a stuffed parrot on his shoulder, and he

68
00:03:21,800 --> 00:03:25,000
Speaker 2: even has a tri corner hat for his stuffed parrots.

69
00:03:25,480 --> 00:03:27,280
Speaker 2: I'm not sure how true to life that far it is,

70
00:03:27,560 --> 00:03:30,520
Speaker 2: but it is a nice touch. So well done, Tristan McNeil.

71
00:03:31,000 --> 00:03:31,600
Speaker 1: Oh wow.

72
00:03:31,639 --> 00:03:34,160
Speaker 3: And actually, I just as we're talking, I just got

73
00:03:34,200 --> 00:03:37,200
Speaker 3: a text from Ramsey's showing me a picture of Tristan.

74
00:03:37,280 --> 00:03:39,200
Speaker 1: This is amazing.

75
00:03:39,240 --> 00:03:42,680
Speaker 3: I mean, you could say every part of his costume

76
00:03:42,960 --> 00:03:45,320
Speaker 3: is pretty much in line with the way that we

77
00:03:45,480 --> 00:03:47,680
Speaker 3: conceive of pirates, because I mean, I guess this is

78
00:03:47,720 --> 00:03:50,280
Speaker 3: how we're used to seeing them in books and pop culture.

79
00:03:50,400 --> 00:03:54,640
Speaker 3: So thank you Tristan for furthering this stereotype of pirates.

80
00:03:54,640 --> 00:03:56,920
Speaker 3: But it does make us wonder like, how much, if

81
00:03:56,960 --> 00:03:59,480
Speaker 3: any of this is actually true. And I don't just

82
00:03:59,560 --> 00:04:02,560
Speaker 3: mean how pirates dressed in real life, but how they

83
00:04:02,640 --> 00:04:03,320
Speaker 3: acted too.

84
00:04:03,520 --> 00:04:03,640
Speaker 2: Like.

85
00:04:04,080 --> 00:04:06,000
Speaker 3: On the one hand, pirates we see in movies and

86
00:04:06,040 --> 00:04:09,600
Speaker 3: theme parks often come off as these really these charming

87
00:04:09,720 --> 00:04:12,520
Speaker 3: and kind of rough around the edges folk heros, almost

88
00:04:12,520 --> 00:04:14,560
Speaker 3: like Robin Hoods of the Sea or something.

89
00:04:14,680 --> 00:04:14,880
Speaker 1: Yeah.

90
00:04:14,880 --> 00:04:16,520
Speaker 2: I mean, do you think about like Wesley from The

91
00:04:16,520 --> 00:04:19,400
Speaker 2: Princess Bride, and he's just kind of a gentleman pirate.

92
00:04:19,880 --> 00:04:21,360
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's that's exactly right.

93
00:04:21,400 --> 00:04:24,800
Speaker 3: And you know, when you read these historical accounts and pirates,

94
00:04:24,839 --> 00:04:28,480
Speaker 3: mostly those sound like these bloodthirsty outlaws. It's a bit

95
00:04:28,520 --> 00:04:31,200
Speaker 3: of a mixed message. So with today's show, we thought

96
00:04:31,200 --> 00:04:32,760
Speaker 3: it would be fun to try to make sense of

97
00:04:32,800 --> 00:04:35,880
Speaker 3: the competing pirate narratives, and to do that, we'll fact

98
00:04:35,960 --> 00:04:38,640
Speaker 3: check some of the biggest stereotypes we typically associate with

99
00:04:38,720 --> 00:04:41,800
Speaker 3: pirates and see which ones hold water. And then a

100
00:04:41,800 --> 00:04:45,120
Speaker 3: little bit later, we'll separate pirate truth from pirate fiction

101
00:04:45,240 --> 00:04:47,359
Speaker 3: when we share a few of our all time favorite

102
00:04:47,400 --> 00:04:50,200
Speaker 3: pirate stories. So, Meguel, you want to kick us off,

103
00:04:50,480 --> 00:04:53,440
Speaker 3: like what pirate cliche do you feel like we should

104
00:04:53,440 --> 00:04:54,200
Speaker 3: start with today?

105
00:04:55,279 --> 00:04:57,080
Speaker 2: Well, I was thinking about it. You know, it was

106
00:04:57,160 --> 00:04:59,680
Speaker 2: international talk like a Pirate Day not too long ago,

107
00:05:00,040 --> 00:05:02,719
Speaker 2: and while I did manage to slip a few rs

108
00:05:02,760 --> 00:05:06,440
Speaker 2: into my conversation this year, I also, you know, I

109
00:05:06,440 --> 00:05:09,040
Speaker 2: couldn't help feeling like a little bit of a phony

110
00:05:09,160 --> 00:05:12,839
Speaker 2: since I actually have no idea how pirates talked, and

111
00:05:12,880 --> 00:05:16,600
Speaker 2: as it turns out, nobody does. So piracy was as

112
00:05:16,640 --> 00:05:19,320
Speaker 2: peaked during the seventeenth and eighteenth centuries, so there aren't

113
00:05:19,320 --> 00:05:21,840
Speaker 2: really any audio recordings to refer to. And the witness

114
00:05:21,839 --> 00:05:24,400
Speaker 2: accounts that we do have only acclude kind of a

115
00:05:24,480 --> 00:05:26,440
Speaker 2: handful of quotes from actual pirates.

116
00:05:27,400 --> 00:05:28,960
Speaker 1: What about writing from the pirates?

117
00:05:28,960 --> 00:05:30,200
Speaker 3: I mean, it feels like there's got to be at

118
00:05:30,279 --> 00:05:33,760
Speaker 3: least one pirate autobiography floating around out there, wouldn't there be?

119
00:05:34,160 --> 00:05:34,440
Speaker 1: Yeah?

120
00:05:34,520 --> 00:05:36,719
Speaker 2: Actually there really aren't. That There isn't much of a

121
00:05:36,760 --> 00:05:40,760
Speaker 2: record of anything written by pirates themselves. Blackbeard supposedly kept

122
00:05:40,760 --> 00:05:43,800
Speaker 2: a diary of all his exploits, but that's never been recovered,

123
00:05:43,839 --> 00:05:46,000
Speaker 2: and so the little bit of writing we do have

124
00:05:46,040 --> 00:05:48,440
Speaker 2: from actual pirates comes mostly from the ones who start

125
00:05:48,480 --> 00:05:51,440
Speaker 2: out as nobility before going rogue, and since they tend

126
00:05:51,520 --> 00:05:54,720
Speaker 2: to be really well educated, their speech patterns probably wouldn't

127
00:05:54,720 --> 00:05:56,720
Speaker 2: have mimicked those of most pirates anyway.

128
00:05:57,720 --> 00:05:59,640
Speaker 3: So, you know, you think about all the talk of

129
00:06:00,279 --> 00:06:03,640
Speaker 3: salty dogs and scally wags and pirates inviting folks to

130
00:06:03,760 --> 00:06:07,800
Speaker 3: shiver me timbers, whatever that actually means. But like, none

131
00:06:07,880 --> 00:06:10,239
Speaker 3: of those are phrases that pirates actually used.

132
00:06:10,480 --> 00:06:13,479
Speaker 2: Yeah, probably not. I mean, like I mentioned earlier, there's

133
00:06:13,520 --> 00:06:16,240
Speaker 2: no real evidence one way or the other, but most

134
00:06:16,240 --> 00:06:19,279
Speaker 2: scholars think English speaking pirates from the so called Golden

135
00:06:19,320 --> 00:06:22,960
Speaker 2: Age of piracy probably spoke the same way merchant sailors

136
00:06:22,960 --> 00:06:25,160
Speaker 2: did at the time. A lot of both of the

137
00:06:25,320 --> 00:06:28,520
Speaker 2: people in these groups came from a riverfront neighborhoods in London,

138
00:06:28,640 --> 00:06:31,400
Speaker 2: so it's likely they spoke with similar accents and used

139
00:06:31,400 --> 00:06:34,400
Speaker 2: common slang. But sadly you don't really see shiver me

140
00:06:34,520 --> 00:06:36,880
Speaker 2: timbers coming up in much of that discussion.

141
00:06:37,160 --> 00:06:38,760
Speaker 1: That is a real disappointment.

142
00:06:38,839 --> 00:06:42,520
Speaker 3: But I'm guessing the pirate jargon were used to mostly

143
00:06:42,520 --> 00:06:45,159
Speaker 3: comes from books and movies, right, stuff like Treasure Island

144
00:06:45,240 --> 00:06:45,880
Speaker 3: or Peter Pan.

145
00:06:46,000 --> 00:06:49,039
Speaker 2: I guess yeah, And Treasure Island in particular is the

146
00:06:49,040 --> 00:06:51,160
Speaker 2: one that'll come up a lot today. A lot of

147
00:06:51,200 --> 00:06:54,000
Speaker 2: the phrases we connect with pirates were first popularized by

148
00:06:54,040 --> 00:06:56,400
Speaker 2: the book in eighteen eighty three, and then again in

149
00:06:56,480 --> 00:07:00,200
Speaker 2: Disney's movie adaptation in the nineteen fifties. And actually the

150
00:07:00,240 --> 00:07:03,280
Speaker 2: movie version is also credited for our association of pirates

151
00:07:03,320 --> 00:07:07,880
Speaker 2: with these gruff and vaguely Scottish accents, and that's because

152
00:07:07,920 --> 00:07:11,480
Speaker 2: it starred Robert Newman as the fictional pirate Long John Silver.

153
00:07:11,920 --> 00:07:14,960
Speaker 2: So Newman was a native of southwest England, and as

154
00:07:15,000 --> 00:07:19,000
Speaker 2: such he spoke with this really distinctive regional dialect called

155
00:07:19,080 --> 00:07:22,400
Speaker 2: West Country English, and some of the dialect's characteristics line

156
00:07:22,480 --> 00:07:25,000
Speaker 2: up perfectly with how most of us imagined pirates to

157
00:07:25,040 --> 00:07:27,720
Speaker 2: have talked. So, for example, West Country speakers tend to

158
00:07:27,720 --> 00:07:31,960
Speaker 2: emphasize their rs. They also replaced the verb is with b,

159
00:07:32,600 --> 00:07:35,360
Speaker 2: which is, you know, a decidedly pirate move when you

160
00:07:35,360 --> 00:07:38,360
Speaker 2: think of constructions like where be the rum? Right? And

161
00:07:38,800 --> 00:07:41,360
Speaker 2: if that wasn't enough, West Country speakers are even known

162
00:07:41,400 --> 00:07:44,760
Speaker 2: to replace the word yes with ours sometimes huh.

163
00:07:44,840 --> 00:07:47,280
Speaker 3: So our conception of pirate speech seems to be pretty

164
00:07:47,400 --> 00:07:49,600
Speaker 3: arbitrary when you break it down like this, I mean,

165
00:07:49,640 --> 00:07:52,960
Speaker 3: if it really does go back to just that one performance.

166
00:07:53,800 --> 00:07:56,280
Speaker 2: Yeah, so Newman's role in Treasure Island wasn't his only

167
00:07:56,280 --> 00:07:58,240
Speaker 2: one as a pirate. He also appeared in a couple

168
00:07:58,320 --> 00:08:00,800
Speaker 2: other pirate movies in the era, and it was all

169
00:08:00,800 --> 00:08:03,560
Speaker 2: of this together that started to influence other people's portrayal

170
00:08:03,640 --> 00:08:06,560
Speaker 2: of pirates, until finally the West Country accent just became

171
00:08:06,600 --> 00:08:09,520
Speaker 2: the standard. And while it might seem random that a

172
00:08:09,600 --> 00:08:13,040
Speaker 2: Southwest English accent would become the de facto voice, there's

173
00:08:13,040 --> 00:08:15,640
Speaker 2: actually more of a historical connection than you might expect.

174
00:08:15,720 --> 00:08:19,480
Speaker 2: So just listen to this explanation. I found on slate. Quote.

175
00:08:19,520 --> 00:08:22,200
Speaker 2: It's not entirely arbitrary that Newton should have used an

176
00:08:22,200 --> 00:08:25,120
Speaker 2: exaggeration of his own dialect to play long John Silver.

177
00:08:25,600 --> 00:08:30,080
Speaker 2: The West Country, the southwest corner of England, including Cornwall, Somerset, Devon,

178
00:08:30,240 --> 00:08:33,840
Speaker 2: Dorset and Bristol, has a long seafaring tradition, and so

179
00:08:33,920 --> 00:08:36,880
Speaker 2: many historical pirates would likely have spoken in a similar way.

180
00:08:37,280 --> 00:08:40,360
Speaker 2: Both Blackbeard and Sir Francis Drake were from that area,

181
00:08:40,679 --> 00:08:44,400
Speaker 2: although Sir Francis was technically a privateer. But perhaps the

182
00:08:44,400 --> 00:08:47,559
Speaker 2: most famous inhabitant of the West Country is Hagrid from

183
00:08:47,559 --> 00:08:50,920
Speaker 2: the Harry Potter series. Can't you just imagine Haggard saying

184
00:08:51,080 --> 00:08:53,079
Speaker 2: you're a pirate Harry end quote?

185
00:08:53,559 --> 00:08:56,000
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean I can easily imagine that, And I

186
00:08:56,000 --> 00:08:58,640
Speaker 3: actually can't believe that I'd never made that connection before,

187
00:08:58,679 --> 00:09:00,760
Speaker 3: because Haggrid totally said like a.

188
00:09:00,679 --> 00:09:03,640
Speaker 1: Pirate or other Yeah, fictional one, I guess.

189
00:09:03,679 --> 00:09:06,559
Speaker 3: But uh, you know, there is some evidence that pirates

190
00:09:06,760 --> 00:09:09,560
Speaker 3: really did have their own unique way of speaking, including

191
00:09:09,600 --> 00:09:12,480
Speaker 3: some bits of nautical lingo that eventually found their way

192
00:09:12,520 --> 00:09:13,760
Speaker 3: into popular usage.

193
00:09:13,800 --> 00:09:14,719
Speaker 1: And now the.

194
00:09:14,679 --> 00:09:17,440
Speaker 3: Origin of these phrases can be pretty tough to pin down,

195
00:09:17,480 --> 00:09:19,360
Speaker 3: but there are at least a few that are thought

196
00:09:19,400 --> 00:09:23,000
Speaker 3: to have come from pirates and privateers, including you know,

197
00:09:23,080 --> 00:09:25,640
Speaker 3: learn the ropes, and of course three sheets to the wind.

198
00:09:25,760 --> 00:09:28,080
Speaker 3: And the first of these came from the need for

199
00:09:28,120 --> 00:09:31,000
Speaker 3: sailors to understand how to use the complex system of

200
00:09:31,080 --> 00:09:34,480
Speaker 3: ropes and pulleys that controlled the ship's sails, so they

201
00:09:34,480 --> 00:09:36,560
Speaker 3: would literally have to learn the ropes.

202
00:09:36,960 --> 00:09:39,840
Speaker 2: And so was three sheets to the wind just as literal?

203
00:09:40,120 --> 00:09:42,240
Speaker 2: Or was that a term for being super drunk like

204
00:09:42,280 --> 00:09:43,160
Speaker 2: how we use it today?

205
00:09:43,920 --> 00:09:46,880
Speaker 3: This one was actually pretty literal too, And actually the

206
00:09:46,960 --> 00:09:50,360
Speaker 3: original phrase pirates used was three sheets in the wind,

207
00:09:50,480 --> 00:09:52,880
Speaker 3: not to it. And so you might guess that the

208
00:09:52,880 --> 00:09:55,480
Speaker 3: sheets in question were the sails on a ship, but

209
00:09:56,040 --> 00:09:58,880
Speaker 3: actually they were the ropes that controlled those sails. So

210
00:09:59,280 --> 00:10:03,360
Speaker 3: apparently if three or more ropes became loose, the sales

211
00:10:03,400 --> 00:10:06,040
Speaker 3: would start flapping, and then the crew can lose control

212
00:10:06,080 --> 00:10:08,840
Speaker 3: of where the ship's headed. So if somebody's really drunk,

213
00:10:08,840 --> 00:10:10,880
Speaker 3: they're just as out of control as a ship with

214
00:10:11,000 --> 00:10:12,319
Speaker 3: three sheets in the wind.

215
00:10:13,960 --> 00:10:16,000
Speaker 2: So another question I was eager to answer is whether

216
00:10:16,080 --> 00:10:19,240
Speaker 2: or not pirates really hid buried treasure. And while it

217
00:10:19,280 --> 00:10:22,240
Speaker 2: does seem like this happened on occasion, it was definitely

218
00:10:22,400 --> 00:10:25,440
Speaker 2: not a widespread practice. In fact, I could only find

219
00:10:25,440 --> 00:10:28,760
Speaker 2: a couple historical accounts of pirates actually burying their loot,

220
00:10:29,320 --> 00:10:32,000
Speaker 2: and even in those cases, the pirates only hit it

221
00:10:32,040 --> 00:10:34,080
Speaker 2: for a short period while they waited for the heat

222
00:10:34,120 --> 00:10:36,880
Speaker 2: from their latest heist to die down. In fact, pirate

223
00:10:36,920 --> 00:10:40,240
Speaker 2: treasure never stayed buried for long, and they certainly didn't

224
00:10:40,280 --> 00:10:42,760
Speaker 2: circulate a bunch of treasure maps with big red x's

225
00:10:42,840 --> 00:10:45,079
Speaker 2: on them for people to go looking for it. And

226
00:10:45,160 --> 00:10:48,720
Speaker 2: that's partly because pirates didn't really deal in treasure chests

227
00:10:48,800 --> 00:10:51,240
Speaker 2: full of gold or pieces of eight or whatever you

228
00:10:51,320 --> 00:10:54,720
Speaker 2: like to imagine like. Instead, when pirates looted ships, they

229
00:10:54,880 --> 00:10:57,720
Speaker 2: were stealing things like coffee and sugar and tea and

230
00:10:57,800 --> 00:11:00,920
Speaker 2: textiles like whatever those ships were care and then they

231
00:11:00,960 --> 00:11:03,440
Speaker 2: would sell those spoils on the black market, and that's

232
00:11:03,480 --> 00:11:05,520
Speaker 2: how they'd end up with the pirate gold we associate

233
00:11:05,559 --> 00:11:08,880
Speaker 2: with them. But even then, once pirates had all this

234
00:11:09,000 --> 00:11:12,360
Speaker 2: gold in hand, they weren't super frugal or forward thinking

235
00:11:12,440 --> 00:11:15,560
Speaker 2: enough to invest it. Instead, you know, according to this

236
00:11:15,640 --> 00:11:19,840
Speaker 2: maritime historian named David Cordingly, pirates typically blew their loot

237
00:11:19,920 --> 00:11:22,439
Speaker 2: on drinking gambling and women as soon as they got

238
00:11:22,480 --> 00:11:22,840
Speaker 2: to port.

239
00:11:23,960 --> 00:11:25,840
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, I'd say that fits with the pirate

240
00:11:25,920 --> 00:11:28,840
Speaker 3: lifestyle a lot more than squirreling away your money.

241
00:11:28,880 --> 00:11:29,800
Speaker 1: And you know, I mean I.

242
00:11:29,880 --> 00:11:33,560
Speaker 3: Think about this, burying treasure would effectively be like putting

243
00:11:33,640 --> 00:11:36,280
Speaker 3: your money in a bank, and I don't know banking.

244
00:11:36,320 --> 00:11:39,040
Speaker 3: Does it strike me as this very piratey thing to do?

245
00:11:39,200 --> 00:11:42,240
Speaker 3: But exactly anyway, I mean, this idea of buried treasure

246
00:11:42,400 --> 00:11:44,439
Speaker 3: had to come from somewhere, though, So do you think

247
00:11:44,480 --> 00:11:46,680
Speaker 3: it just spun out of those few scattered accounts that

248
00:11:46,720 --> 00:11:47,200
Speaker 3: you found?

249
00:11:48,040 --> 00:11:49,840
Speaker 2: I mean, that's why I thought at first, But it

250
00:11:49,880 --> 00:11:52,080
Speaker 2: turns out this is another case that's rooted less in

251
00:11:52,160 --> 00:11:55,240
Speaker 2: history and more in treasure Island. So in the book,

252
00:11:55,320 --> 00:11:57,520
Speaker 2: long John Silver is on the hunt for a stash

253
00:11:57,559 --> 00:12:00,000
Speaker 2: of hidden gold, and of course a secret treasure map

254
00:12:00,200 --> 00:12:02,640
Speaker 2: is the key to finding it. But what's funny is

255
00:12:02,679 --> 00:12:06,400
Speaker 2: that Robert Lewis Stevenson didn't actually invent this idea, and

256
00:12:06,440 --> 00:12:08,600
Speaker 2: he didn't base it on real life either. Instead, he

257
00:12:08,640 --> 00:12:12,320
Speaker 2: flat out stole the idea from another seventeenth century author,

258
00:12:12,679 --> 00:12:14,080
Speaker 2: Edgar Allan Poe.

259
00:12:14,679 --> 00:12:14,920
Speaker 1: Poe.

260
00:12:15,160 --> 00:12:18,959
Speaker 2: Really, yeah, So it comes from Poe's short story the Goldbug,

261
00:12:19,400 --> 00:12:22,720
Speaker 2: and the main characters hunt down Captain Kidd's treasure using

262
00:12:22,760 --> 00:12:25,520
Speaker 2: a cipher that's based on how frequently certain letters appeared

263
00:12:25,520 --> 00:12:26,760
Speaker 2: in the English language.

264
00:12:26,400 --> 00:12:26,960
Speaker 1: In this story.

265
00:12:27,480 --> 00:12:30,360
Speaker 2: And this is pretty much the same premise as in

266
00:12:30,440 --> 00:12:34,160
Speaker 2: Treasure Island, except Stevenson substituted a map in place of

267
00:12:34,200 --> 00:12:37,640
Speaker 2: the cipher, and the author later copped this too. Like

268
00:12:38,000 --> 00:12:40,480
Speaker 2: in his preface to the book, he said, quote, the

269
00:12:40,559 --> 00:12:43,120
Speaker 2: map was the chief part of my plot. For that

270
00:12:43,360 --> 00:12:45,520
Speaker 2: I broke into the gallery of mister Poe.

271
00:12:46,600 --> 00:12:49,079
Speaker 3: All right, Well, a pattern is definitely starting to emerge

272
00:12:49,080 --> 00:12:52,080
Speaker 3: here because I actually have another pirate stereotype that we

273
00:12:52,080 --> 00:12:55,160
Speaker 3: can at least partly thank Treasure Island for. And that's

274
00:12:55,200 --> 00:12:58,440
Speaker 3: the idea that pirates made people walk the plank. Not

275
00:12:58,559 --> 00:13:01,000
Speaker 3: to be fair, plank walking did exist among pirates to

276
00:13:01,080 --> 00:13:03,720
Speaker 3: some degree, but most historians will tell you that it

277
00:13:03,760 --> 00:13:07,040
Speaker 3: was a pretty rare form of punishment. Now, the most

278
00:13:07,080 --> 00:13:10,800
Speaker 3: recognizable example of the practice occurred in the mid eighteen hundreds,

279
00:13:10,840 --> 00:13:13,480
Speaker 3: I think, and this was when an eyewitness reported that

280
00:13:13,559 --> 00:13:16,440
Speaker 3: a British ship captain had been abducted by pirates. In

281
00:13:16,520 --> 00:13:19,640
Speaker 3: that quote, a plank was run on the starboard side

282
00:13:19,640 --> 00:13:22,920
Speaker 3: of their schooner, upon which they made Captain Smith walk,

283
00:13:23,240 --> 00:13:25,720
Speaker 3: and as he approached the end, they tilted the plank

284
00:13:26,000 --> 00:13:28,640
Speaker 3: when he dropped into the sea. Now beyond that, we

285
00:13:28,679 --> 00:13:31,760
Speaker 3: know that some Caribbean pirates also force captured sailors to

286
00:13:31,800 --> 00:13:34,160
Speaker 3: walk the plank, and there are even some accounts of

287
00:13:34,200 --> 00:13:37,360
Speaker 3: Mediterranean pirates taking part in something similar back in the

288
00:13:37,440 --> 00:13:40,440
Speaker 3: days of ancient Rome. In this case, the pirates would

289
00:13:40,440 --> 00:13:43,760
Speaker 3: suspend a ladder out over the ocean and then mockingly

290
00:13:43,800 --> 00:13:46,440
Speaker 3: invite prisoners to crawl out on it and swim back

291
00:13:46,440 --> 00:13:47,240
Speaker 3: home to freedom.

292
00:13:47,520 --> 00:13:50,880
Speaker 2: Oh that seems pretty cruel. But yeah, I'm curious. How

293
00:13:50,880 --> 00:13:52,640
Speaker 2: does Treasure Island fit into all of this?

294
00:13:53,040 --> 00:13:55,600
Speaker 3: Basically, Robert Lewis Stevenson and a few other writers of

295
00:13:55,600 --> 00:13:58,520
Speaker 3: his era are mostly responsible for making plank walking, you know,

296
00:13:58,600 --> 00:14:02,160
Speaker 3: more ubiquitous than it really was, and their stories presented

297
00:14:02,200 --> 00:14:04,640
Speaker 3: as kind of the go to form of punishment that

298
00:14:04,720 --> 00:14:08,600
Speaker 3: pirates used, and this idea was only enforced by popular

299
00:14:08,640 --> 00:14:12,520
Speaker 3: illustrations and paintings from this same time period. Now all

300
00:14:12,520 --> 00:14:15,160
Speaker 3: of that really cemented. Plank walking is one of the

301
00:14:15,240 --> 00:14:18,880
Speaker 3: visual icons of piracy, and the interesting thing about this

302
00:14:18,920 --> 00:14:21,760
Speaker 3: misplaced attention is that it actually makes some pirates seem

303
00:14:21,840 --> 00:14:25,000
Speaker 3: less cruel than they really were, because if pirates really

304
00:14:25,040 --> 00:14:27,440
Speaker 3: wanted to do away with a mutinous crew member or

305
00:14:27,480 --> 00:14:30,720
Speaker 3: a troublesome captive, I mean, they had far worse methods

306
00:14:30,760 --> 00:14:34,200
Speaker 3: than simply forcing somebody overboard. And you know, some of

307
00:14:34,200 --> 00:14:37,720
Speaker 3: the more common practices included marooning someone onto an island,

308
00:14:37,720 --> 00:14:41,400
Speaker 3: which almost always resulted in a slow death for the victim.

309
00:14:41,680 --> 00:14:45,280
Speaker 3: Then there was the especially grizzly punishment called keel hauling,

310
00:14:45,320 --> 00:14:47,520
Speaker 3: and this was when the victim was tied naked to

311
00:14:47,600 --> 00:14:52,360
Speaker 3: a rope, thrown overboard, and then just tragically dragged beneath

312
00:14:52,400 --> 00:14:54,800
Speaker 3: the entire length of the ship while barnacles cut up

313
00:14:54,800 --> 00:14:55,120
Speaker 3: their skin.

314
00:14:55,160 --> 00:14:56,560
Speaker 1: It's pretty gross to read about.

315
00:14:56,640 --> 00:14:59,680
Speaker 2: Yeah, it feels horrible. In fact, I want to get

316
00:14:59,680 --> 00:15:03,160
Speaker 2: as an happier note asap. So I'm just gonna come

317
00:15:03,240 --> 00:15:05,680
Speaker 2: right out and tell you that pirates almost certainly kept

318
00:15:05,720 --> 00:15:11,280
Speaker 2: parrots as pets. Good and so this is another pirate

319
00:15:11,320 --> 00:15:14,480
Speaker 2: trope that was popularized by Treasuer Island. Long John Silver

320
00:15:14,600 --> 00:15:16,320
Speaker 2: was the first fictional pirate to walk around with a

321
00:15:16,320 --> 00:15:19,480
Speaker 2: parrot on his shoulder, But in this case, Stevenson was

322
00:15:19,560 --> 00:15:22,880
Speaker 2: really drawing from history So to give a little background

323
00:15:22,880 --> 00:15:24,760
Speaker 2: when we talk about the Golden Age of piracy, which

324
00:15:24,800 --> 00:15:28,080
Speaker 2: I still find such a funny phrase to say that,

325
00:15:28,600 --> 00:15:30,760
Speaker 2: you know, we're really referring to this period from about

326
00:15:30,800 --> 00:15:34,480
Speaker 2: the mid sixteen hundreds to around seventeen thirty. And in

327
00:15:34,520 --> 00:15:37,400
Speaker 2: that time, the recent discoveries of the Americas in Australia

328
00:15:37,440 --> 00:15:40,240
Speaker 2: had created a boom and exploration, so for the first

329
00:15:40,280 --> 00:15:42,720
Speaker 2: time in history and multiple nations were shipping tons and

330
00:15:42,800 --> 00:15:46,800
Speaker 2: tons of money and valuable goods all across this largely

331
00:15:47,120 --> 00:15:51,080
Speaker 2: uncharted and unprotected oceans, and of course this made them

332
00:15:51,160 --> 00:15:54,560
Speaker 2: easy picking for enterprising pirates, hence the term Golden Age.

333
00:15:54,800 --> 00:15:57,240
Speaker 2: But in order to rob ships of their precious cargo,

334
00:15:57,600 --> 00:15:59,880
Speaker 2: pirates had to go where the ships went, which meant

335
00:16:00,080 --> 00:16:02,440
Speaker 2: taking to trade routes that mostly led to the Caribbean

336
00:16:02,600 --> 00:16:05,800
Speaker 2: or West Africa or the various coasts along the Indian Ocean.

337
00:16:06,280 --> 00:16:09,400
Speaker 2: And this required long voyages that lasted weeks or months

338
00:16:09,440 --> 00:16:11,760
Speaker 2: at a time and often took the pirates to these

339
00:16:11,800 --> 00:16:17,160
Speaker 2: exotic lands populated by unusual animals like parrots and also monkeys.

340
00:16:17,880 --> 00:16:19,360
Speaker 1: So let's get to the important part.

341
00:16:19,400 --> 00:16:22,160
Speaker 3: Please tell me that the monkey thing is true, because

342
00:16:22,680 --> 00:16:24,960
Speaker 3: the world is kind of a rough place right now,

343
00:16:25,000 --> 00:16:27,560
Speaker 3: And I feel like it would make me feel better

344
00:16:27,640 --> 00:16:29,640
Speaker 3: to know that a pirate captain could have had a

345
00:16:29,640 --> 00:16:32,680
Speaker 3: parrot on one shoulder and a monkey on the other one.

346
00:16:32,880 --> 00:16:37,040
Speaker 2: So there isn't much documentation about that specific combination, but

347
00:16:37,840 --> 00:16:41,640
Speaker 2: pirates with monkeys certainly weren't uncommon. Parrots were the more

348
00:16:41,720 --> 00:16:45,080
Speaker 2: practical pet though. Parrots would eat things that were already

349
00:16:45,120 --> 00:16:47,120
Speaker 2: on board, so you think about like fruits or seeds

350
00:16:47,240 --> 00:16:49,600
Speaker 2: or nuts, and they didn't really need that much to

351
00:16:49,640 --> 00:16:52,600
Speaker 2: sustain them. Plus they could be taught all these kind

352
00:16:52,600 --> 00:16:55,160
Speaker 2: of neat tricks like how to talk. And you know,

353
00:16:55,240 --> 00:16:57,600
Speaker 2: there's no better way for a pirate to start up

354
00:16:57,640 --> 00:16:59,760
Speaker 2: a conversation at port than by introducing people to the

355
00:17:00,000 --> 00:17:02,520
Speaker 2: talking bird that he, you know, picked up well at sea.

356
00:17:02,920 --> 00:17:03,880
Speaker 1: Well that's a good point.

357
00:17:03,920 --> 00:17:06,040
Speaker 3: And still you think after a while it might be

358
00:17:06,119 --> 00:17:08,399
Speaker 3: kind of risky to walk around with a big, bright

359
00:17:08,520 --> 00:17:10,640
Speaker 3: bird on your shoulder. I mean, it seems like that's

360
00:17:10,640 --> 00:17:12,400
Speaker 3: a tough way to keep a low profile.

361
00:17:12,960 --> 00:17:17,040
Speaker 2: Yeah, but it's also good branding. I don't think that

362
00:17:17,080 --> 00:17:20,160
Speaker 2: many pirates actually kept their parrots for that long. According

363
00:17:20,160 --> 00:17:23,760
Speaker 2: to this historian, Angus Constam, author of the history of pirates,

364
00:17:23,880 --> 00:17:27,000
Speaker 2: he writes, back home, people would pay good money for

365
00:17:27,040 --> 00:17:30,359
Speaker 2: parrots and other exotic creatures, and sailors could easily buy

366
00:17:30,400 --> 00:17:33,720
Speaker 2: them in Caribbean ports. Some were kept, but most were

367
00:17:33,760 --> 00:17:36,239
Speaker 2: sold when the ship reached home. So really they were

368
00:17:36,240 --> 00:17:37,720
Speaker 2: selling them as soon as they got to port.

369
00:17:38,160 --> 00:17:40,040
Speaker 3: Well that makes sense, So it's still it's nice to

370
00:17:40,040 --> 00:17:43,520
Speaker 3: know that pirates really did keep parrots, even if only.

371
00:17:43,280 --> 00:17:44,359
Speaker 1: For a little while.

372
00:17:44,400 --> 00:17:46,160
Speaker 3: But all right, well, I know there are a couple

373
00:17:46,240 --> 00:17:48,000
Speaker 3: more pirate myths that we want to take a look at.

374
00:17:48,040 --> 00:18:08,160
Speaker 3: But before we do, let's take a quick break. You're

375
00:18:08,160 --> 00:18:09,800
Speaker 3: listening to Part Time Genius, and we're talking about the

376
00:18:09,840 --> 00:18:11,480
Speaker 3: facts and fiction that fuel.

377
00:18:11,200 --> 00:18:13,840
Speaker 1: The modern view of pirates. All right, mego.

378
00:18:13,920 --> 00:18:15,760
Speaker 3: So one of the more interesting topics that I looked

379
00:18:15,800 --> 00:18:18,679
Speaker 3: into this week were the big gold ear rings that

380
00:18:18,760 --> 00:18:21,399
Speaker 3: pirates wore. And the question here wasn't whether or not

381
00:18:21,520 --> 00:18:24,480
Speaker 3: pirates really wore them. I think, you know, most historians

382
00:18:24,480 --> 00:18:26,840
Speaker 3: agree that many of them did. But why did they

383
00:18:26,880 --> 00:18:27,600
Speaker 3: wear them?

384
00:18:28,119 --> 00:18:30,440
Speaker 2: So the story I'd always heard is that the earrings

385
00:18:30,480 --> 00:18:33,119
Speaker 2: were away for pirates to pay for their burials, like

386
00:18:33,880 --> 00:18:36,119
Speaker 2: if a pirate happened to die on land instead of

387
00:18:36,200 --> 00:18:39,240
Speaker 2: at sea, the gold from their earrings could cover the costs,

388
00:18:39,280 --> 00:18:42,480
Speaker 2: and obviously, even for a pirate, that would be preferable

389
00:18:42,560 --> 00:18:45,400
Speaker 2: to just being put in this mass grave or left

390
00:18:45,400 --> 00:18:46,360
Speaker 2: out for the crows to eat.

391
00:18:46,400 --> 00:18:47,800
Speaker 1: I'm guessing yeah.

392
00:18:47,800 --> 00:18:50,440
Speaker 3: I mean, there is some evidence that supports this idea.

393
00:18:50,560 --> 00:18:53,400
Speaker 3: But those earrings and other kinds of jewelry weren't just

394
00:18:53,520 --> 00:18:55,920
Speaker 3: a failsafe for pirate burial. I mean they were also

395
00:18:56,040 --> 00:18:59,720
Speaker 3: symbols of rebellion against the seventeenth and eighteenth century laws

396
00:18:59,760 --> 00:19:02,760
Speaker 3: that we're really meant to control what people could wear

397
00:19:02,920 --> 00:19:05,879
Speaker 3: or do in their private lives. So in England, just

398
00:19:05,920 --> 00:19:09,000
Speaker 3: for example, men weren't allowed to wear jewelry, and certain

399
00:19:09,040 --> 00:19:11,920
Speaker 3: colors were off limits for commoners to wear, and if

400
00:19:11,960 --> 00:19:15,000
Speaker 3: somebody didn't conform to those rules, they could be heavily

401
00:19:15,080 --> 00:19:18,680
Speaker 3: fined or even imprisoned. So, as this pirate historian, Gail

402
00:19:18,800 --> 00:19:22,320
Speaker 3: Cellinger put it, these so called sumptuary laws were quote

403
00:19:22,359 --> 00:19:25,160
Speaker 3: a legal way for the ruling class to separate themselves

404
00:19:25,160 --> 00:19:28,359
Speaker 3: from commoners by regulating what they wore, what they could drink,

405
00:19:28,440 --> 00:19:29,360
Speaker 3: and where they could live.

406
00:19:30,440 --> 00:19:32,640
Speaker 2: Well, I mean, it is easy to see how none

407
00:19:32,640 --> 00:19:34,440
Speaker 2: of that would sit very well with pirates. Who are

408
00:19:34,440 --> 00:19:37,680
Speaker 2: obviously big fans of flouting the law whenever possible.

409
00:19:37,760 --> 00:19:39,520
Speaker 1: Right, yeah, exactly.

410
00:19:39,760 --> 00:19:43,520
Speaker 3: But for full disclosure, some historians do question how widespread

411
00:19:43,520 --> 00:19:47,439
Speaker 3: the practice of dressing flamboyantly and wearing ear rings really was,

412
00:19:47,600 --> 00:19:50,399
Speaker 3: and many of them would argue that the bandanas and

413
00:19:50,400 --> 00:19:53,840
Speaker 3: the sashes and ear rings that we usually picture pirates

414
00:19:53,840 --> 00:19:57,000
Speaker 3: wearing actually come from more like these series of drawings

415
00:19:57,040 --> 00:19:59,520
Speaker 3: in children's books, and that those depictions had really been

416
00:19:59,520 --> 00:20:03,239
Speaker 3: based on Spanish bandits, not pirates. But you know, as

417
00:20:03,320 --> 00:20:05,679
Speaker 3: was most things we've talked about today, there's not a

418
00:20:05,680 --> 00:20:08,760
Speaker 3: ton of evidence in either direction, though, so it's likely

419
00:20:08,800 --> 00:20:11,320
Speaker 3: that at least a few pirates did dress this way.

420
00:20:12,200 --> 00:20:14,360
Speaker 2: Well, and that kind of in your face fashion sense

421
00:20:14,359 --> 00:20:17,280
Speaker 2: would also fit into what we do know about pirates backgrounds.

422
00:20:17,760 --> 00:20:20,240
Speaker 2: Most of them actually started out as crew members aboard

423
00:20:20,359 --> 00:20:24,160
Speaker 2: the respective countries merchant marines or naval ships before turning

424
00:20:24,240 --> 00:20:26,880
Speaker 2: to a life of piracy, and from what I've read,

425
00:20:27,200 --> 00:20:30,560
Speaker 2: life aboard those ships was often rougher and actually more

426
00:20:30,640 --> 00:20:33,919
Speaker 2: tyrannical than it was on actual pirate ships. Like on

427
00:20:33,960 --> 00:20:36,560
Speaker 2: a merchant ship, for instance, crew members lived in these

428
00:20:36,560 --> 00:20:39,879
Speaker 2: squalid conditions. They were subject to a ton of rules

429
00:20:39,920 --> 00:20:42,640
Speaker 2: that were just as strict, if not stricter, than those

430
00:20:42,680 --> 00:20:46,160
Speaker 2: on land and merchant marines and naval captains. They had

431
00:20:46,160 --> 00:20:48,480
Speaker 2: the final say on everything that happened on their ships,

432
00:20:48,520 --> 00:20:52,760
Speaker 2: which left many crew members feeling oppressed and really voiceless

433
00:20:52,800 --> 00:20:53,399
Speaker 2: as a result.

434
00:20:54,200 --> 00:20:56,240
Speaker 3: Yeah, and it's really no wonder that so many of

435
00:20:56,280 --> 00:20:59,480
Speaker 3: them would jump ship and sign on as pirates instead,

436
00:20:59,600 --> 00:21:03,200
Speaker 3: because you know, despite their reputation, pirates weren't anarchic or

437
00:21:03,280 --> 00:21:06,160
Speaker 3: lawless when dealing with one another. I mean, their ranks

438
00:21:06,200 --> 00:21:10,040
Speaker 3: were composed of these societal outsiders and outcasts, you know,

439
00:21:10,080 --> 00:21:13,080
Speaker 3: that's definitely true, But they weren't so jaded as to

440
00:21:13,119 --> 00:21:16,199
Speaker 3: think that social orders of any sort were automatically a

441
00:21:16,240 --> 00:21:19,240
Speaker 3: bad thing. They just needed to find a better or

442
00:21:19,280 --> 00:21:22,760
Speaker 3: what they saw as a more fair system, So onboard

443
00:21:22,800 --> 00:21:25,720
Speaker 3: pirate ships, that's exactly what they did. I mean, the

444
00:21:25,760 --> 00:21:28,840
Speaker 3: pirates recognized that in order to prevent infighting and to

445
00:21:28,840 --> 00:21:31,879
Speaker 3: be able to keep morale high during their months at sea,

446
00:21:31,960 --> 00:21:34,800
Speaker 3: they needed to do things a little bit more democratically,

447
00:21:35,320 --> 00:21:37,960
Speaker 3: and so to that end, pirate captains took a vote

448
00:21:37,960 --> 00:21:40,640
Speaker 3: on just about everything, I mean, from where to go,

449
00:21:40,920 --> 00:21:44,440
Speaker 3: what to steal, how to deal with prisoners. So really,

450
00:21:44,480 --> 00:21:47,600
Speaker 3: the only time that the captain took complete control was

451
00:21:47,680 --> 00:21:50,440
Speaker 3: during a battle, and you know that's for obvious reasons.

452
00:21:50,480 --> 00:21:52,560
Speaker 3: That's not a time when it would be smart to

453
00:21:52,600 --> 00:21:53,800
Speaker 3: pause and take a vote.

454
00:21:54,359 --> 00:21:57,080
Speaker 2: I love this idea that like deciding what the steal

455
00:21:57,119 --> 00:21:58,679
Speaker 2: should be a democratic vote.

456
00:21:58,920 --> 00:22:00,879
Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly, it's so fun.

457
00:22:00,920 --> 00:22:03,440
Speaker 2: But you know, obviously there were more perks to pirate

458
00:22:03,440 --> 00:22:06,720
Speaker 2: democracy than just saying you know where the ship would

459
00:22:06,720 --> 00:22:08,840
Speaker 2: go or what you're going to steal. If you listen

460
00:22:08,880 --> 00:22:11,679
Speaker 2: to this breakdown I found from Robert Curson. He's this

461
00:22:11,720 --> 00:22:14,639
Speaker 2: pirate historian and author of the book Pirate Hunters. It's

462
00:22:14,680 --> 00:22:18,399
Speaker 2: pretty great. So so here's what he says. Quote, the

463
00:22:18,440 --> 00:22:21,800
Speaker 2: captain's vote didn't count any more than the lowliest deckhands.

464
00:22:22,040 --> 00:22:24,400
Speaker 2: If they wanted to throw the captain out, they could

465
00:22:24,440 --> 00:22:27,680
Speaker 2: dismiss him or lower his rank. They could maroon him

466
00:22:27,680 --> 00:22:30,160
Speaker 2: on an island or dump him into the sea, all

467
00:22:30,160 --> 00:22:33,000
Speaker 2: by vote. That was true. Even if a captain owned

468
00:22:33,040 --> 00:22:36,520
Speaker 2: his own ship, they had a constitution and even compensation

469
00:22:36,640 --> 00:22:39,879
Speaker 2: schemes for injuries. The captain almost never earned more than

470
00:22:39,920 --> 00:22:42,360
Speaker 2: two or three times the way to the lowliest deckhand.

471
00:22:42,720 --> 00:22:45,399
Speaker 2: Think about how that must have struck a guy who's

472
00:22:45,480 --> 00:22:48,280
Speaker 2: come from a tyrannical rule on a merchant ship where

473
00:22:48,280 --> 00:22:51,240
Speaker 2: the hours were terrible and the conditions even worse. He

474
00:22:51,320 --> 00:22:53,280
Speaker 2: gets on a pirate ship and suddenly he has a

475
00:22:53,320 --> 00:22:55,560
Speaker 2: real say in what they're doing. I mean, it sounds

476
00:22:55,800 --> 00:22:56,640
Speaker 2: kind of amazing.

477
00:22:57,160 --> 00:22:59,240
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's pretty weird to think about, but you know,

478
00:22:59,280 --> 00:23:02,400
Speaker 3: some of these pirates were practicing democracy nearly a century

479
00:23:02,400 --> 00:23:05,040
Speaker 3: before it took root in America and in France. And

480
00:23:05,359 --> 00:23:08,160
Speaker 3: you know those constitutions you mentioned were even written down

481
00:23:08,240 --> 00:23:10,919
Speaker 3: in some cases. And I was looking for some examples

482
00:23:10,960 --> 00:23:13,160
Speaker 3: of this, and one of them I was reading about

483
00:23:13,240 --> 00:23:15,520
Speaker 3: it was from one of the most prolific pirates of

484
00:23:15,560 --> 00:23:17,280
Speaker 3: this Golden Age, and his name.

485
00:23:17,119 --> 00:23:18,280
Speaker 1: Was black Bart Roberts.

486
00:23:18,720 --> 00:23:21,200
Speaker 3: Now, he managed to overtake more than four hundred ships

487
00:23:21,280 --> 00:23:24,040
Speaker 3: during his many years at sea, which obviously is no

488
00:23:24,240 --> 00:23:27,160
Speaker 3: small feat. But I think what I found most impressive

489
00:23:27,160 --> 00:23:30,239
Speaker 3: about his career was this set of bylaws that he

490
00:23:30,280 --> 00:23:33,800
Speaker 3: and a crew member drafted back in seventeen twenty two. Now,

491
00:23:33,800 --> 00:23:37,280
Speaker 3: this included some pretty progressive rules that you might not expect,

492
00:23:37,440 --> 00:23:39,840
Speaker 3: you know, from a pirate ship. But you know, take

493
00:23:39,840 --> 00:23:42,440
Speaker 3: this worker's compensation plan that you had mentioned.

494
00:23:42,760 --> 00:23:43,600
Speaker 1: According to the.

495
00:23:43,560 --> 00:23:47,000
Speaker 3: Bylaws, quote, every man who shall become a cripple or

496
00:23:47,040 --> 00:23:49,679
Speaker 3: lose a limb in the service shall have eight hundred

497
00:23:49,720 --> 00:23:52,959
Speaker 3: pieces of eight from the common stock, and for lesser

498
00:23:53,040 --> 00:23:54,320
Speaker 3: hurts proportionately.

499
00:23:55,280 --> 00:23:57,400
Speaker 2: I mean, it's kind of amazing that they got that

500
00:23:57,440 --> 00:24:00,280
Speaker 2: sort of security from a pirate job, right, There's no

501
00:24:00,359 --> 00:24:02,200
Speaker 2: wonder so many people went into piracy.

502
00:24:02,640 --> 00:24:05,560
Speaker 3: Yeah, you know, to stick with Blackbart's bylaws for just

503
00:24:05,600 --> 00:24:07,760
Speaker 3: a second here. The other thing I think I was

504
00:24:07,800 --> 00:24:10,720
Speaker 3: struck by was the picture they painted of life aboard

505
00:24:10,800 --> 00:24:13,000
Speaker 3: his ship, because you know, we tend to think of

506
00:24:13,040 --> 00:24:16,320
Speaker 3: pirates as this rowdy bunch up all hours of the night,

507
00:24:16,440 --> 00:24:19,800
Speaker 3: drinking and gambling. Of course, that's how things were when

508
00:24:19,800 --> 00:24:23,280
Speaker 3: the pirates came to port, but according to these bylaws,

509
00:24:23,359 --> 00:24:26,240
Speaker 3: it was a very different story when they were at sea.

510
00:24:26,359 --> 00:24:28,280
Speaker 1: So just listen to this from it as well.

511
00:24:28,320 --> 00:24:32,119
Speaker 3: It says none shall gain for money either with dice

512
00:24:32,200 --> 00:24:35,200
Speaker 3: or cards, and the lights and candles shall be put

513
00:24:35,240 --> 00:24:37,320
Speaker 3: out at eight at night, and if any of the

514
00:24:37,359 --> 00:24:39,800
Speaker 3: crew desire to drink after that hour, they shall sit

515
00:24:39,880 --> 00:24:42,040
Speaker 3: upon the open deck without lights.

516
00:24:43,240 --> 00:24:46,160
Speaker 2: I mean, that's pretty amazing, and that there's this curfew

517
00:24:46,200 --> 00:24:48,360
Speaker 2: on a pirate ship, Like, that's not something I wouldn't

518
00:24:48,359 --> 00:24:51,400
Speaker 2: expected exactly. And at the same time, you know there's

519
00:24:51,400 --> 00:24:54,480
Speaker 2: no gambling. I mean, I guess if the goal is

520
00:24:54,520 --> 00:24:57,040
Speaker 2: to form some sort of piece, those dudes sound like

521
00:24:57,200 --> 00:24:59,960
Speaker 2: really smart moves. And you know, since we're talking about

522
00:25:00,160 --> 00:25:03,159
Speaker 2: how shockingly judicious pirates could be, I do want to

523
00:25:03,200 --> 00:25:06,560
Speaker 2: mention another famous pirate that fits that bill, and that's Blackbeard.

524
00:25:07,080 --> 00:25:09,680
Speaker 2: So he and his cohorts were based in the Bahamas

525
00:25:09,720 --> 00:25:12,280
Speaker 2: and they were only active for around seven years or so.

526
00:25:12,440 --> 00:25:15,879
Speaker 2: But this period from seventeen thirteen to seventeen twenty was

527
00:25:15,920 --> 00:25:19,480
Speaker 2: a super eventful one. In fact, there's some historians that

528
00:25:19,600 --> 00:25:22,520
Speaker 2: argue that the term Golden Asia piracy should really only

529
00:25:22,600 --> 00:25:25,320
Speaker 2: be applied to those seven years. In that seven year span,

530
00:25:25,800 --> 00:25:27,640
Speaker 2: so that kind of gives you an idea of how

531
00:25:27,680 --> 00:25:31,560
Speaker 2: successful black Beard and the other islander pirates were. By

532
00:25:31,600 --> 00:25:34,920
Speaker 2: seventeen seventeen, the pirates had actually thrown the commercial trade

533
00:25:34,920 --> 00:25:38,640
Speaker 2: of three separate empires into total disarray, and they even

534
00:25:38,720 --> 00:25:41,120
Speaker 2: managed to beat back the Royal Navy's warships. I mean,

535
00:25:41,400 --> 00:25:43,720
Speaker 2: whether you'd love them or hate them, these pirates really

536
00:25:43,800 --> 00:25:45,000
Speaker 2: knew how to shake things up.

537
00:25:45,800 --> 00:25:47,959
Speaker 3: That's to put it mildly, I guess, but I mean,

538
00:25:48,000 --> 00:25:50,520
Speaker 3: what was Blackbeard's deal anyway, Like, was he one of

539
00:25:50,560 --> 00:25:53,480
Speaker 3: those legitimate sailors who went rogue or had he always

540
00:25:53,520 --> 00:25:54,960
Speaker 3: been more of a proper pirate?

541
00:25:55,720 --> 00:25:57,919
Speaker 2: Yeah, so, he and most of the other pirates from

542
00:25:57,920 --> 00:26:01,119
Speaker 2: the Bahamas start out on merchant and naval and in

543
00:26:01,160 --> 00:26:03,240
Speaker 2: a way, their actions as pirates were kind of this

544
00:26:03,440 --> 00:26:07,240
Speaker 2: revolt and revenge against their former bosses. And this is

545
00:26:07,320 --> 00:26:09,840
Speaker 2: kind of a tangent, but one of Blackbeard's contemporaries was

546
00:26:09,880 --> 00:26:13,399
Speaker 2: this guy named Captain Bellamy, and his crew especially loved

547
00:26:13,440 --> 00:26:15,240
Speaker 2: this new role that they were taking on. Like the

548
00:26:15,280 --> 00:26:18,800
Speaker 2: crew actually called themselves Robin Hood's Men, and Bellamy once

549
00:26:18,840 --> 00:26:22,800
Speaker 2: explained to a captive quote they vilify as the scoundrels

550
00:26:22,840 --> 00:26:25,879
Speaker 2: do when there is only this difference. They rob the

551
00:26:25,960 --> 00:26:28,639
Speaker 2: poor under the cover of law, and we plunder the

552
00:26:28,760 --> 00:26:30,720
Speaker 2: rich under the cover of our own courage.

553
00:26:32,680 --> 00:26:34,320
Speaker 3: I want to make sure we don't go too far

554
00:26:34,359 --> 00:26:37,360
Speaker 3: here and paint pirates is more heroic than they really were.

555
00:26:37,480 --> 00:26:40,240
Speaker 3: I mean, you're kind of saying Blackbeard was a level

556
00:26:40,240 --> 00:26:43,480
Speaker 3: headed guy, or that his actions were maybe justified in

557
00:26:43,520 --> 00:26:45,959
Speaker 3: some way, at least in his own mind, But how

558
00:26:46,000 --> 00:26:49,000
Speaker 3: does that square with his reputation as being really a

559
00:26:49,080 --> 00:26:51,440
Speaker 3: cruel and fearsome pirate. I mean he was a pretty

560
00:26:51,520 --> 00:26:53,919
Speaker 3: violent guy, right well.

561
00:26:53,720 --> 00:26:55,760
Speaker 2: I mean yes and no. So pirates on the Hole

562
00:26:55,840 --> 00:26:58,440
Speaker 2: did some pretty terrible things, and there's no question about that.

563
00:26:58,760 --> 00:27:03,280
Speaker 2: They invaded, they pillaged ships and colonies, they ransom hostages,

564
00:27:03,480 --> 00:27:06,040
Speaker 2: and pretty much ignored any laws but the ones they

565
00:27:06,040 --> 00:27:08,440
Speaker 2: made up for themselves at sea. But in a lot

566
00:27:08,480 --> 00:27:11,919
Speaker 2: of cases, including black Beards, that brutality was exaggerated. You know,

567
00:27:12,320 --> 00:27:15,080
Speaker 2: it was mostly by the imperial authorities on land and

568
00:27:15,160 --> 00:27:18,040
Speaker 2: the newspapers that they held sway over And if you

569
00:27:18,040 --> 00:27:20,680
Speaker 2: think about it, nearly every bit of pop culture associated

570
00:27:20,720 --> 00:27:24,640
Speaker 2: with pirates, including Treasure Island, is derived from those stories,

571
00:27:24,720 --> 00:27:28,040
Speaker 2: and it's inspired by Blackbeard and these other Bahamas pirates.

572
00:27:28,440 --> 00:27:30,760
Speaker 2: So that means a lot of our understanding of what

573
00:27:30,880 --> 00:27:33,800
Speaker 2: pirates did is skewed as well, since most of it

574
00:27:33,800 --> 00:27:38,080
Speaker 2: can be traced back to these somewhat embellished accounts.

575
00:27:37,800 --> 00:27:41,760
Speaker 3: So you're saying Blackbeard wasn't as terrifying and cutthroat as

576
00:27:41,800 --> 00:27:42,720
Speaker 3: we might think.

577
00:27:43,240 --> 00:27:46,520
Speaker 2: Exactly, And there are actually dozens of eyewitness accounts of

578
00:27:46,840 --> 00:27:50,359
Speaker 2: Blackbeard's victims and with the exception of his final bloody

579
00:27:50,400 --> 00:27:53,080
Speaker 2: showdown with the Royal Navy, not a single one of

580
00:27:53,119 --> 00:27:56,960
Speaker 2: them mentions the pirate captain actually killing anyone. And if

581
00:27:56,960 --> 00:27:58,800
Speaker 2: that's kind of hard to swallow it, it's probably because

582
00:27:58,840 --> 00:28:01,560
Speaker 2: black Beard and self purpose cultivated his image as this

583
00:28:01,960 --> 00:28:04,920
Speaker 2: fearsome force to be reckoned with. Like if you listen

584
00:28:04,960 --> 00:28:07,920
Speaker 2: to this description. I found this at the Smithsonian, but

585
00:28:08,160 --> 00:28:10,879
Speaker 2: you'll see what I mean. Quote Blackbeard wore a silk

586
00:28:10,920 --> 00:28:13,840
Speaker 2: sling over his shoulders, on which there were three braces

587
00:28:13,880 --> 00:28:17,560
Speaker 2: of pistols hanging in holsters like bandoliers. Under his hat,

588
00:28:17,600 --> 00:28:20,320
Speaker 2: he tied lit fuses, dangling some of them down the

589
00:28:20,359 --> 00:28:22,199
Speaker 2: sides of his face so as to surround it with

590
00:28:22,240 --> 00:28:25,200
Speaker 2: a halo of smoke and fire, making him look more

591
00:28:25,240 --> 00:28:28,640
Speaker 2: frightful than a fury from hell. Merchant crews would take

592
00:28:28,680 --> 00:28:31,160
Speaker 2: one look at this apparition and the army of wild

593
00:28:31,160 --> 00:28:34,600
Speaker 2: men around him, bearing cutlasses, muskets, and primitive hand grenades,

594
00:28:34,840 --> 00:28:39,760
Speaker 2: and invariably surrender without firing a shot. So I guess

595
00:28:39,800 --> 00:28:41,320
Speaker 2: it was all for show then, like kind of an

596
00:28:41,360 --> 00:28:45,040
Speaker 2: intimidation tactic, right, And I mean, some pirates really did

597
00:28:45,080 --> 00:28:48,160
Speaker 2: perform the horrible acts we read about like dragging someone

598
00:28:48,160 --> 00:28:50,720
Speaker 2: who crossed them beneath their ship, but that wasn't their

599
00:28:50,760 --> 00:28:53,320
Speaker 2: first choice, Like, they mostly wanted to just frighten people

600
00:28:53,360 --> 00:28:55,600
Speaker 2: into giving up without a fight. And that's actually what

601
00:28:55,640 --> 00:28:58,800
Speaker 2: the whole pirate flag was about. Like when a black

602
00:28:58,840 --> 00:29:01,520
Speaker 2: flag was hoisted, it is a message that another ship

603
00:29:01,560 --> 00:29:04,560
Speaker 2: should prepare to be boarded and pillaged, but also that

604
00:29:04,600 --> 00:29:07,960
Speaker 2: they wouldn't come to harm so long as they cooperated. Meanwhile,

605
00:29:07,960 --> 00:29:09,840
Speaker 2: you've got like a red flag, which was a much

606
00:29:09,880 --> 00:29:13,560
Speaker 2: more rare but a completely different story, and that meant

607
00:29:13,560 --> 00:29:16,720
Speaker 2: the pirates had come for blood. But this desire for

608
00:29:16,840 --> 00:29:19,080
Speaker 2: nonviolent resolution really makes a lot of sense when you

609
00:29:19,120 --> 00:29:21,400
Speaker 2: think about how practical pirates were in general. I mean,

610
00:29:21,480 --> 00:29:24,600
Speaker 2: like why slaughter your captives when you could just ransom

611
00:29:24,640 --> 00:29:26,440
Speaker 2: them for money or put them to work in your

612
00:29:26,480 --> 00:29:26,920
Speaker 2: own crew.

613
00:29:27,560 --> 00:29:31,800
Speaker 3: I mean, that's just just business one oh one. Right, So,

614
00:29:31,840 --> 00:29:34,920
Speaker 3: since we're on the subject of surprising pirate trades, we

615
00:29:34,960 --> 00:29:38,920
Speaker 3: should probably talk about how egalitarian pirates actually were, because

616
00:29:39,280 --> 00:29:41,360
Speaker 3: you know, not only did they welcome those of low

617
00:29:41,400 --> 00:29:44,840
Speaker 3: economic or social standing into their crews, but they also

618
00:29:44,960 --> 00:29:48,000
Speaker 3: made room for folks who were frequent targets of discrimination

619
00:29:48,160 --> 00:29:52,400
Speaker 3: on land. And that includes Africans, European Jews, and women.

620
00:29:53,040 --> 00:29:54,920
Speaker 3: But before we get into that, let's take one more

621
00:29:54,960 --> 00:30:10,560
Speaker 3: quick break.

622
00:30:12,120 --> 00:30:15,000
Speaker 2: Okay, Well, so you mentioned before the break that pirating

623
00:30:15,160 --> 00:30:18,320
Speaker 2: was sort of an equal opportunity profession, and that makes

624
00:30:18,360 --> 00:30:20,200
Speaker 2: sense when you think about it, because if you're on

625
00:30:20,240 --> 00:30:22,720
Speaker 2: the run from the Royal Navy or whatever, the race

626
00:30:22,840 --> 00:30:24,880
Speaker 2: or gender of your crewmates isn't going to be a

627
00:30:24,880 --> 00:30:28,560
Speaker 2: top priority. And for the most part, pirates welcomed all comers,

628
00:30:28,680 --> 00:30:30,880
Speaker 2: and that have to be pretty enticing for people who

629
00:30:30,880 --> 00:30:33,920
Speaker 2: felt repressed or restricted on land. I'm guessing right, like,

630
00:30:34,240 --> 00:30:35,360
Speaker 2: what did they have to lose?

631
00:30:36,240 --> 00:30:38,200
Speaker 3: Yeah, that makes sense, and I do think a great

632
00:30:38,240 --> 00:30:41,360
Speaker 3: example of that mentality are the bands of Jewish pirates

633
00:30:41,360 --> 00:30:44,520
Speaker 3: that took to the open Ocean during the early seventeen hundreds.

634
00:30:44,800 --> 00:30:47,360
Speaker 3: That this is honestly something I'd never heard about before

635
00:30:47,480 --> 00:30:51,560
Speaker 3: this week, And apparently historians are still piecing together their

636
00:30:51,640 --> 00:30:54,680
Speaker 3: history as well, like I was reading that just in

637
00:30:54,720 --> 00:30:58,360
Speaker 3: this past decade, several graveyards were found in the Caribbean,

638
00:30:58,480 --> 00:31:01,840
Speaker 3: and many of the tombstone there feature Hebrew writing and

639
00:31:01,880 --> 00:31:06,880
Speaker 3: stars of David right alongside those iconic skull and crossbones symbols.

640
00:31:07,240 --> 00:31:09,480
Speaker 2: I mean, that is pretty wild. So I hadn't heard

641
00:31:09,480 --> 00:31:12,640
Speaker 2: about this either, But what made so many Jewish people

642
00:31:12,720 --> 00:31:13,320
Speaker 2: go pirate?

643
00:31:13,920 --> 00:31:16,240
Speaker 3: Well, I guess the seeds of it were actually planted

644
00:31:16,280 --> 00:31:18,920
Speaker 3: in the very same month that Columbus set sail back

645
00:31:18,960 --> 00:31:22,880
Speaker 3: in fourteen ninety two. So after sending Columbus on his way,

646
00:31:22,960 --> 00:31:25,720
Speaker 3: the King and Queen of Spain ordered the expulsion of

647
00:31:25,840 --> 00:31:29,360
Speaker 3: all Jews and Muslims from the country. Now, Portugal did

648
00:31:29,400 --> 00:31:32,240
Speaker 3: the same thing just a few years later. So these

649
00:31:32,280 --> 00:31:35,640
Speaker 3: Spanish Portuguese Jews set out to find new homes, and

650
00:31:35,960 --> 00:31:39,920
Speaker 3: many of them wound up settling on Caribbean islands. And

651
00:31:39,960 --> 00:31:43,040
Speaker 3: in fact, by the seventeen twenties, when Jewish pirates first

652
00:31:43,040 --> 00:31:47,440
Speaker 3: set sail, an estimated twenty percent of Kingston, Jamaica's population

653
00:31:47,760 --> 00:31:49,760
Speaker 3: was descended from Jewish exiles.

654
00:31:49,880 --> 00:31:50,200
Speaker 2: Wow.

655
00:31:50,800 --> 00:31:52,120
Speaker 1: Yeah, So a few.

656
00:31:51,920 --> 00:31:55,280
Speaker 3: Of these Jews started captaining their own pirate ships and

657
00:31:55,680 --> 00:31:58,560
Speaker 3: christening them with names like Queen Esther and the Shield

658
00:31:58,640 --> 00:32:01,719
Speaker 3: of Abraham. And for the most part, these Jewish pirates

659
00:32:01,760 --> 00:32:06,560
Speaker 3: would exclusively target Spanish and Portuguese ships, not surprisingly because

660
00:32:06,800 --> 00:32:09,440
Speaker 3: this was really seen his payback for those generations of

661
00:32:09,520 --> 00:32:10,320
Speaker 3: unjust treatment.

662
00:32:11,120 --> 00:32:13,800
Speaker 2: I mean, This is fascinating. So it sounds like we're

663
00:32:13,840 --> 00:32:16,440
Speaker 2: still uncovering the full history of Jewish pirates. But I

664
00:32:16,480 --> 00:32:19,560
Speaker 2: am curious, are there any notorious ones we should know about, Like, like,

665
00:32:19,600 --> 00:32:21,880
Speaker 2: who's the Blackbeard of Jewish pirates?

666
00:32:22,240 --> 00:32:24,360
Speaker 3: You know, I'm not sure about that exactly, but I

667
00:32:24,400 --> 00:32:28,280
Speaker 3: think my favorite was probably Schmool Pilachi, who supposedly joined

668
00:32:28,280 --> 00:32:30,800
Speaker 3: in a number of pirate raids against the Dutch and

669
00:32:30,960 --> 00:32:31,800
Speaker 3: Spanish ships.

670
00:32:31,840 --> 00:32:34,840
Speaker 1: But here's the wild thing about Polacci. He was actually

671
00:32:34,920 --> 00:32:35,520
Speaker 1: a rabbi.

672
00:32:36,480 --> 00:32:39,760
Speaker 2: Wait, he was a rabbi pirate. I feel like that's

673
00:32:39,840 --> 00:32:41,320
Speaker 2: kind of an oxymoron, right.

674
00:32:41,680 --> 00:32:42,720
Speaker 1: Well apparently not.

675
00:32:42,920 --> 00:32:46,600
Speaker 3: I mean, by most accounts, Polachi was also pretty pious.

676
00:32:46,640 --> 00:32:48,840
Speaker 3: So not only did he insist that his crew donate

677
00:32:48,920 --> 00:32:51,800
Speaker 3: a tenth of their treasure to charity, he also made

678
00:32:51,840 --> 00:32:54,440
Speaker 3: sure they all kept kosher during their voyages.

679
00:32:54,960 --> 00:32:58,360
Speaker 2: That's amazing. So no shellfish. But uh, you know, we're

680
00:32:58,400 --> 00:33:01,400
Speaker 2: talking about how piracy was this drastic kind of escape

681
00:33:01,400 --> 00:33:04,080
Speaker 2: for repressed people, and I think another great example of

682
00:33:04,080 --> 00:33:06,600
Speaker 2: that are the many women who built new lives for

683
00:33:06,640 --> 00:33:09,280
Speaker 2: themselves at sea. So most of them earned their keep

684
00:33:09,280 --> 00:33:12,400
Speaker 2: as servants or cooks or prostitutes, but a few also

685
00:33:12,440 --> 00:33:16,800
Speaker 2: found work as merchant, sailors, naval officers, and even pirates.

686
00:33:17,120 --> 00:33:20,520
Speaker 2: For instance, there's this Irish pirate named Grace O'Malley and

687
00:33:20,600 --> 00:33:22,520
Speaker 2: in the sixteenth century she became one of the few

688
00:33:22,560 --> 00:33:25,240
Speaker 2: female pirates to captain her own ship, and she made

689
00:33:25,240 --> 00:33:27,840
Speaker 2: a pretty frightening name for herself all along the coast

690
00:33:27,840 --> 00:33:30,160
Speaker 2: of Ireland. Like she had a bunch of really intense

691
00:33:30,200 --> 00:33:32,280
Speaker 2: scars on her face, which he claimed were from being

692
00:33:32,320 --> 00:33:35,920
Speaker 2: attacked by an eagle. And if that wasn't badass enough,

693
00:33:35,960 --> 00:33:38,680
Speaker 2: she also reportedly gave birth to her youngest son while

694
00:33:38,680 --> 00:33:41,800
Speaker 2: aboard her ship and then proceeded to fight off invaders

695
00:33:41,800 --> 00:33:43,840
Speaker 2: with her baby in one hand and a sword in

696
00:33:43,880 --> 00:33:44,200
Speaker 2: the other.

697
00:33:44,480 --> 00:33:45,520
Speaker 1: Is that unround?

698
00:33:45,720 --> 00:33:49,120
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's pretty impressive and definitely something Blackbeard can't claim

699
00:33:49,200 --> 00:33:52,040
Speaker 3: to have done. But yeah, I think for my money,

700
00:33:52,080 --> 00:33:55,520
Speaker 3: the undisputed queen of female pirates and honestly maybe just

701
00:33:55,600 --> 00:33:59,680
Speaker 3: pirates in general has got to be Captain Ching Shew.

702
00:33:59,760 --> 00:34:02,440
Speaker 3: In the early nineteenth century, she spent her youth working

703
00:34:02,480 --> 00:34:06,440
Speaker 3: as a courtison on a floating brothel in Canton, China. Now,

704
00:34:06,680 --> 00:34:09,399
Speaker 3: during this time she made a name for herself as

705
00:34:09,560 --> 00:34:13,279
Speaker 3: this really shrewd business woman, and apparently she had a

706
00:34:13,360 --> 00:34:17,480
Speaker 3: knack for blackmail and would often use the secrets that

707
00:34:17,520 --> 00:34:19,960
Speaker 3: she'd heard as a prostitute. And she would do this

708
00:34:20,000 --> 00:34:23,840
Speaker 3: in order to control her wealthy and influential clients. So,

709
00:34:23,960 --> 00:34:26,520
Speaker 3: as you might imagine, this was a pretty attractive skill

710
00:34:26,640 --> 00:34:29,080
Speaker 3: to a pirate, which is how she came to marry

711
00:34:29,120 --> 00:34:32,799
Speaker 3: this other very famous pirate, one of the South China Sea,

712
00:34:32,880 --> 00:34:35,960
Speaker 3: and his name was ching I Sao. And this guy

713
00:34:36,040 --> 00:34:38,560
Speaker 3: was no slouch when it came to pirrating and by

714
00:34:38,600 --> 00:34:40,759
Speaker 3: the time he married the twenty six year old ching

715
00:34:40,880 --> 00:34:44,520
Speaker 3: She this was in I think eighteen oh one, Chang

716
00:34:44,560 --> 00:34:47,919
Speaker 3: had already united a bunch of rival pirate gangs into

717
00:34:47,960 --> 00:34:50,200
Speaker 3: what he called the Red Flag Fleet.

718
00:34:51,200 --> 00:34:53,719
Speaker 2: So did Chingshi have any power herself or was she

719
00:34:53,800 --> 00:34:55,279
Speaker 2: kind of just this figurehead.

720
00:34:56,000 --> 00:34:59,160
Speaker 3: No, she was definitely a very active participant in her

721
00:34:59,280 --> 00:35:02,080
Speaker 3: husband's inner prize. In fact, you know, many of these

722
00:35:02,120 --> 00:35:05,840
Speaker 3: stories report that she actually demanded equal control of the

723
00:35:05,880 --> 00:35:09,239
Speaker 3: fleet as a condition of their marriage, and her role

724
00:35:09,360 --> 00:35:12,440
Speaker 3: really only grew as time went on. So it was

725
00:35:12,480 --> 00:35:16,920
Speaker 3: only six years into their marriage that Chang passed away suddenly.

726
00:35:16,920 --> 00:35:18,960
Speaker 3: And this was at the age of forty two and

727
00:35:19,400 --> 00:35:22,280
Speaker 3: a few weeks later, Chang She took her husband's place

728
00:35:22,360 --> 00:35:24,719
Speaker 3: as the leader of the Red flag fleet.

729
00:35:25,000 --> 00:35:28,200
Speaker 2: Which to me sounds a little suspicious, like our husband

730
00:35:28,239 --> 00:35:31,760
Speaker 2: suddenly dies. But do we know how big that fleet

731
00:35:31,840 --> 00:35:32,719
Speaker 2: was that she inherited.

732
00:35:33,680 --> 00:35:35,440
Speaker 3: Well, we don't know how many ships are men she

733
00:35:35,480 --> 00:35:38,480
Speaker 3: inherited from her husband, but we do have a pretty

734
00:35:38,480 --> 00:35:40,520
Speaker 3: good estimate of the size of her fleet a few

735
00:35:40,560 --> 00:35:43,680
Speaker 3: years after she took over, and that's because in eighteen

736
00:35:43,680 --> 00:35:46,840
Speaker 3: oh nine, her forces captured an East India Company employee

737
00:35:46,920 --> 00:35:50,279
Speaker 3: named Richard Glasspool. Now, after he was released a few

738
00:35:50,320 --> 00:35:53,839
Speaker 3: months later, he writes this account of his experience, and

739
00:35:54,000 --> 00:35:58,239
Speaker 3: it included this detailed estimate of Chang She's forces. So,

740
00:35:58,360 --> 00:36:02,000
Speaker 3: according to him, there were roughly eighty thousand pirates under

741
00:36:02,000 --> 00:36:05,360
Speaker 3: her command and over eighteen hundred ships in her fleet.

742
00:36:05,560 --> 00:36:07,839
Speaker 3: And so to give you an idea of just how

743
00:36:07,960 --> 00:36:12,240
Speaker 3: vast her entourage was, consider that Blackbeard himself commanded only

744
00:36:12,360 --> 00:36:15,680
Speaker 3: four ships and three hundred pirates, and that was at

745
00:36:15,719 --> 00:36:16,240
Speaker 3: his peak.

746
00:36:17,320 --> 00:36:19,840
Speaker 2: I mean, those numbers really are insane, like eighty thousand

747
00:36:19,880 --> 00:36:23,080
Speaker 2: pirates and eighteen hundred ships, Like I I don't know

748
00:36:23,120 --> 00:36:26,000
Speaker 2: how you could actually keep that many pirates in check.

749
00:36:26,800 --> 00:36:30,320
Speaker 3: Well changed she borrowed from other pirates playbooks in that regard,

750
00:36:30,400 --> 00:36:34,280
Speaker 3: because once she took command, she quickly instituted this strict

751
00:36:34,280 --> 00:36:36,720
Speaker 3: code of laws for all of her men to follow,

752
00:36:37,280 --> 00:36:39,880
Speaker 3: and strict really is the key word here. And just

753
00:36:39,960 --> 00:36:43,840
Speaker 3: as an example, if any pirate disobeyed a superior's orders

754
00:36:44,040 --> 00:36:47,359
Speaker 3: or started giving orders of their own, they were immediately

755
00:36:47,400 --> 00:36:50,279
Speaker 3: beheaded right on the spot. And you know, she had

756
00:36:50,320 --> 00:36:53,760
Speaker 3: some really specific rules about female captives that you probably

757
00:36:53,800 --> 00:36:57,160
Speaker 3: won't find in any other pirate codes. Like there was

758
00:36:57,200 --> 00:36:59,040
Speaker 3: this one rule that said if a pirate took a

759
00:36:59,080 --> 00:37:02,360
Speaker 3: female prisoner for his wife, he had to be faithful

760
00:37:02,400 --> 00:37:03,920
Speaker 3: to her and couldn't sleep around.

761
00:37:04,160 --> 00:37:07,279
Speaker 2: That's really interesting. But you know, I am still kind

762
00:37:07,320 --> 00:37:09,440
Speaker 2: of hung up on the sheer size of her operation.

763
00:37:09,880 --> 00:37:12,800
Speaker 2: I mean, her fleet probably like you could see it

764
00:37:12,880 --> 00:37:15,879
Speaker 2: rivaling some other nations entire armed forces from that time.

765
00:37:16,280 --> 00:37:17,319
Speaker 1: I mean probably so.

766
00:37:17,640 --> 00:37:20,600
Speaker 3: In fact, under Ching She's command, the Red Flag Fleet

767
00:37:20,680 --> 00:37:23,440
Speaker 3: fought off not only the Chinese military, but the East

768
00:37:23,480 --> 00:37:27,439
Speaker 3: India Company, the Portuguese Navy, and you know, they were

769
00:37:27,560 --> 00:37:31,880
Speaker 3: undefeated for three full years until Ching she finally retired

770
00:37:31,920 --> 00:37:33,560
Speaker 3: altogether back in eighteen ten.

771
00:37:34,560 --> 00:37:36,720
Speaker 2: Wait, so she retired like I didn't even know pirates

772
00:37:36,719 --> 00:37:37,120
Speaker 2: could do that.

773
00:37:38,000 --> 00:37:39,839
Speaker 3: I mean, of course, not many of them did, and

774
00:37:39,920 --> 00:37:42,520
Speaker 3: even fewer, if any, retired in a way that Ching

775
00:37:42,640 --> 00:37:45,560
Speaker 3: She did. And you know, you look back at her retirement,

776
00:37:45,600 --> 00:37:48,359
Speaker 3: it was actually part of a deal that she made

777
00:37:48,360 --> 00:37:51,640
Speaker 3: with the Chinese government. And you know, after years of defeat,

778
00:37:52,080 --> 00:37:54,919
Speaker 3: the officials were just desperate to get Ching She out

779
00:37:54,920 --> 00:37:58,239
Speaker 3: of the spotlight by any means necessary, and so they

780
00:37:58,280 --> 00:38:01,240
Speaker 3: extended this offer to her, wherein she and her forces

781
00:38:01,239 --> 00:38:04,440
Speaker 3: would surrender and go their separate ways. And this was

782
00:38:04,480 --> 00:38:08,360
Speaker 3: in return for amnesty and full pensions for every single

783
00:38:08,520 --> 00:38:09,920
Speaker 3: member of the crew.

784
00:38:10,200 --> 00:38:12,880
Speaker 2: Wait, all eighty thousand of them got pensions.

785
00:38:13,239 --> 00:38:14,360
Speaker 1: Yeah, isn't that wild?

786
00:38:14,400 --> 00:38:17,200
Speaker 3: So she and her forces were seen as such a

787
00:38:17,239 --> 00:38:20,320
Speaker 3: big threat that the Chinese government basically paid them all

788
00:38:20,360 --> 00:38:23,359
Speaker 3: to stop being pirates. I mean, it was definitely a

789
00:38:23,480 --> 00:38:25,160
Speaker 3: one of a kind deal, at least as far as

790
00:38:25,200 --> 00:38:25,760
Speaker 3: I can tell.

791
00:38:26,239 --> 00:38:29,200
Speaker 2: That is amazing, And you know, I know we're talking

792
00:38:29,200 --> 00:38:31,040
Speaker 2: about criminals here, but I have to say it is

793
00:38:31,080 --> 00:38:34,399
Speaker 2: pretty cool that not only were their female pirates, but

794
00:38:35,160 --> 00:38:37,960
Speaker 2: kind of the most badass pirates of them all tend

795
00:38:38,000 --> 00:38:38,719
Speaker 2: to be women here.

796
00:38:39,960 --> 00:38:42,080
Speaker 3: Yeah, and there's Actually, this great quote that I wanted

797
00:38:42,080 --> 00:38:44,600
Speaker 3: to read from a pirate historian and the author of

798
00:38:44,640 --> 00:38:47,640
Speaker 3: a book called Pirate Women. So her name is Laura

799
00:38:47,719 --> 00:38:51,120
Speaker 3: Silk Duncomb, and here she's talking about that attraction to

800
00:38:51,160 --> 00:38:54,800
Speaker 3: pirrating and the freedom it entailed that we mentioned earlier.

801
00:38:54,840 --> 00:38:58,440
Speaker 3: And while she's talking specifically in this case about female pirates,

802
00:38:59,080 --> 00:39:01,040
Speaker 3: I really think this could have applied to almost all

803
00:39:01,080 --> 00:39:03,600
Speaker 3: the ones that we've talked about today. So here's what

804
00:39:03,640 --> 00:39:06,400
Speaker 3: she says. All of these pirates had ships that were

805
00:39:06,520 --> 00:39:09,440
Speaker 3: very different and methods that were very different, but I

806
00:39:09,480 --> 00:39:12,400
Speaker 3: think they share the desire to control their own fates,

807
00:39:12,840 --> 00:39:15,839
Speaker 3: and the desire for freedom from convention would unite all

808
00:39:15,880 --> 00:39:18,960
Speaker 3: these women. Their hopes to escape the normal and be

809
00:39:19,040 --> 00:39:22,480
Speaker 3: a part of something adventurous would tie all these women together.

810
00:39:23,080 --> 00:39:25,600
Speaker 3: And we all share that desire for adventure, not the

811
00:39:25,640 --> 00:39:28,759
Speaker 3: desire for slitting throats or plundering the high seas. But

812
00:39:28,760 --> 00:39:31,040
Speaker 3: one can empathize with the desire to have a say

813
00:39:31,080 --> 00:39:32,040
Speaker 3: in how their life goes.

814
00:39:32,920 --> 00:39:35,239
Speaker 2: Yeah, I do feel like people want to have a

815
00:39:35,280 --> 00:39:37,160
Speaker 2: say in how their life goes, and I like that.

816
00:39:37,280 --> 00:39:39,840
Speaker 2: But how about we end on that note and start

817
00:39:39,840 --> 00:39:53,800
Speaker 2: the fact off. So the Pittsburgh Pirates used to go

818
00:39:53,880 --> 00:39:57,160
Speaker 2: by a totally different name, the Pittsburgh Alleghenies, you know,

819
00:39:57,239 --> 00:40:00,120
Speaker 2: named after the Mountain Range. But when they poasted the

820
00:40:00,239 --> 00:40:03,240
Speaker 2: second basement from the Philadelphia Athletics in the eighteen eighties,

821
00:40:03,640 --> 00:40:07,160
Speaker 2: Philadelphia newspapers were outraged. They called it a theft, and

822
00:40:07,200 --> 00:40:09,400
Speaker 2: they referred to the team as a bunch of pirates,

823
00:40:09,520 --> 00:40:11,879
Speaker 2: and the name stuck. That's how they got the name.

824
00:40:12,160 --> 00:40:12,399
Speaker 1: Wow.

825
00:40:13,239 --> 00:40:15,839
Speaker 3: One of my favorite pirates who isn't often talked about

826
00:40:15,880 --> 00:40:19,200
Speaker 3: these days is Jean Lafoote, who was a barefoot pirate

827
00:40:19,640 --> 00:40:23,000
Speaker 3: who used to be the nemesis of Captain Crunch. So

828
00:40:23,600 --> 00:40:26,920
Speaker 3: now I don't know the full story behind this rivalry. Apparently,

829
00:40:27,360 --> 00:40:30,680
Speaker 3: Captain Horatio P. Crunch was created by an ad firm,

830
00:40:30,719 --> 00:40:33,520
Speaker 3: and this was in response to a survey that claimed

831
00:40:33,640 --> 00:40:36,520
Speaker 3: kids hated soggy cereal. I love that they had to

832
00:40:36,520 --> 00:40:38,560
Speaker 3: do a survey to find out that people don't like

833
00:40:38,680 --> 00:40:42,560
Speaker 3: soggi cereal. But because the cereal was so crunchy, the

834
00:40:42,640 --> 00:40:46,520
Speaker 3: pirates wanted it anyway. The Captain was so popular and

835
00:40:46,560 --> 00:40:48,960
Speaker 3: did such a good job of fighting off lafoot that

836
00:40:49,400 --> 00:40:51,960
Speaker 3: there was once a public movement to promote him to

837
00:40:52,000 --> 00:40:55,160
Speaker 3: the rank of admiral, but Quaker Oaths was not convinced,

838
00:40:55,200 --> 00:40:58,560
Speaker 3: and he's been overlooked now for I don't know several decades.

839
00:41:00,080 --> 00:41:03,399
Speaker 2: Yeah, admiral crunches in a cereal, I'd pick off this scenreals, right.

840
00:41:04,160 --> 00:41:06,640
Speaker 2: So have you ever heard of Pirate Joe's in Vancouver?

841
00:41:07,000 --> 00:41:08,359
Speaker 1: Yeah? I don't think so.

842
00:41:08,360 --> 00:41:11,040
Speaker 2: So it's this store that was recently shut down. But basically,

843
00:41:11,239 --> 00:41:14,480
Speaker 2: this guy in Canada would drive down to Trader Joe's

844
00:41:14,480 --> 00:41:17,200
Speaker 2: groceries in the US because there are no Trader Joe's

845
00:41:17,239 --> 00:41:19,880
Speaker 2: stores in Canada. He'd buy a ton of stuff in

846
00:41:19,960 --> 00:41:22,200
Speaker 2: bulk and then sneak it back up and sell it

847
00:41:22,239 --> 00:41:25,200
Speaker 2: at a higher cost. He had actually been banned from

848
00:41:25,200 --> 00:41:27,640
Speaker 2: Trader Joe's stores for doing this, so sometimes he'd wear

849
00:41:27,680 --> 00:41:31,920
Speaker 2: wigs or dresses or fake mustaches and pinstripe suits. It

850
00:41:32,000 --> 00:41:35,600
Speaker 2: got really elaborate. Sometimes he'd even recruit day laborers to

851
00:41:35,600 --> 00:41:37,839
Speaker 2: help him shop and pay at the register like it

852
00:41:38,000 --> 00:41:41,040
Speaker 2: was crazy. And when Trader Joe's took him to court

853
00:41:41,200 --> 00:41:44,160
Speaker 2: in twenty sixteen, they did this in the US, they

854
00:41:44,200 --> 00:41:47,319
Speaker 2: couldn't prove that he was actually hurting their business, so

855
00:41:47,560 --> 00:41:49,640
Speaker 2: he kind of got to keep doing it for a while,

856
00:41:50,160 --> 00:41:53,080
Speaker 2: and then finally Trader Joe's brought another court battle. During

857
00:41:53,080 --> 00:41:55,080
Speaker 2: the last court battle, he took the p off his

858
00:41:55,160 --> 00:41:58,320
Speaker 2: sign to change it from Pirate Joe's to Irate Joe's

859
00:41:58,480 --> 00:42:01,880
Speaker 2: and when he finally settled the case, the shop closed

860
00:42:01,880 --> 00:42:03,080
Speaker 2: down in twenty seventeen.

861
00:42:04,120 --> 00:42:07,439
Speaker 3: All right, well, something equally ridiculous here. We've talked about

862
00:42:07,440 --> 00:42:10,240
Speaker 3: the Pastafarian religion before in the Church of the Flying

863
00:42:10,280 --> 00:42:13,680
Speaker 3: Spaghetti Monster, so for anybody who doesn't know, it was

864
00:42:14,080 --> 00:42:17,279
Speaker 3: this satirical religion that was invented really in response to

865
00:42:17,400 --> 00:42:21,080
Speaker 3: religious fundamentalists, and the main claim is that a flying

866
00:42:21,120 --> 00:42:24,520
Speaker 3: spaghetti monster is just as likely as any other type

867
00:42:24,520 --> 00:42:27,520
Speaker 3: of God, so that's the one they chose to worship.

868
00:42:27,600 --> 00:42:31,800
Speaker 3: But for some reason, the very first Pastafarian wedding also

869
00:42:31,920 --> 00:42:34,879
Speaker 3: had a pirate connection to it. Now, the event took

870
00:42:34,880 --> 00:42:37,000
Speaker 3: place in New Zealand. This was just a couple of

871
00:42:37,080 --> 00:42:39,560
Speaker 3: years ago, and the bride and groom were head to

872
00:42:39,560 --> 00:42:42,680
Speaker 3: toe in pirate gear and everyone there wore.

873
00:42:42,560 --> 00:42:44,880
Speaker 1: Eyepatches of course.

874
00:42:44,960 --> 00:42:48,360
Speaker 3: Right now, that said, there was also this nod to

875
00:42:48,480 --> 00:42:52,239
Speaker 3: pasta and so the officiant wore a colander on her head,

876
00:42:52,280 --> 00:42:55,640
Speaker 3: which is the official headdress of the church. The couple

877
00:42:55,680 --> 00:42:59,040
Speaker 3: exchanged rings of pasta, and in their vows they agreed

878
00:42:59,080 --> 00:43:01,480
Speaker 3: to always add when boiling spaghetti.

879
00:43:03,080 --> 00:43:03,920
Speaker 1: Very romantic.

880
00:43:05,040 --> 00:43:07,480
Speaker 2: So when Julius Caesar was twenty five years old, he

881
00:43:07,560 --> 00:43:10,239
Speaker 2: was kidnapped by pirates, and when the pirates asked for

882
00:43:10,280 --> 00:43:13,080
Speaker 2: a ransom of twenty talents of silver, he just laughed

883
00:43:13,120 --> 00:43:15,000
Speaker 2: in their faces and told them to up it to

884
00:43:15,120 --> 00:43:17,440
Speaker 2: fifty because he was worth so much more than that.

885
00:43:17,920 --> 00:43:20,240
Speaker 2: So that's actually the part of the story i'd heard before.

886
00:43:20,360 --> 00:43:22,360
Speaker 2: But the part I didn't know was that he was

887
00:43:22,360 --> 00:43:25,800
Speaker 2: stuck on the ship for thirty eight days, and during

888
00:43:25,800 --> 00:43:29,080
Speaker 2: that time he was not a good hostage. He was

889
00:43:29,160 --> 00:43:32,960
Speaker 2: just completely unintimidated by these pirates. Not only did he

890
00:43:33,040 --> 00:43:35,080
Speaker 2: refuse to coward to them, he actually treated them like

891
00:43:35,160 --> 00:43:38,320
Speaker 2: they were his servants. He'd write poetry and then forced

892
00:43:38,360 --> 00:43:40,840
Speaker 2: them to listen to it. When when he slept he

893
00:43:40,880 --> 00:43:44,320
Speaker 2: demanded they stopped talking, and instead of acting like a prisoner,

894
00:43:44,360 --> 00:43:46,080
Speaker 2: he just kind of like stomped around doing what he

895
00:43:46,080 --> 00:43:48,760
Speaker 2: wanted to do, and they kind of gave him respect

896
00:43:48,760 --> 00:43:51,080
Speaker 2: for it. Of course, while he did act chummy with

897
00:43:51,120 --> 00:43:52,719
Speaker 2: them the whole time, he let them know that they

898
00:43:52,760 --> 00:43:56,120
Speaker 2: should watch out. And when he was finally freed, he

899
00:43:56,200 --> 00:43:59,160
Speaker 2: of course rounded up a small fleet, found his way

900
00:43:59,200 --> 00:44:01,799
Speaker 2: back to them, took back as fifty talents, took the

901
00:44:01,840 --> 00:44:04,160
Speaker 2: rest of their possessions as well, and then eventually had

902
00:44:04,200 --> 00:44:06,880
Speaker 2: them killed, which you know, is very Julius Caesar of him.

903
00:44:07,120 --> 00:44:08,879
Speaker 1: That is so Julius Caesar of him.

904
00:44:08,920 --> 00:44:11,840
Speaker 3: But all right, well, one of the best ways to

905
00:44:11,920 --> 00:44:15,360
Speaker 3: fight off modern pirates might just be pop music, and

906
00:44:15,760 --> 00:44:19,040
Speaker 3: in particular the music of Britney Spears. I was look

907
00:44:19,080 --> 00:44:22,680
Speaker 3: at this old Guardian article from twenty thirteen and Britney

908
00:44:22,680 --> 00:44:26,280
Speaker 3: Spears emerged as this unlikely figurehead and a fight against

909
00:44:26,320 --> 00:44:30,759
Speaker 3: Somali pirates. And that's because British naval officers started blasting

910
00:44:30,800 --> 00:44:33,440
Speaker 3: the songs Oops, I did it again and Baby one

911
00:44:33,560 --> 00:44:37,200
Speaker 3: more time at them, and strangely the tactic proved more

912
00:44:37,200 --> 00:44:41,320
Speaker 3: intimidating than guns and harpoons, apparently because it's one naval

913
00:44:41,320 --> 00:44:44,200
Speaker 3: officer put it quote her songs were chosen by the

914
00:44:44,200 --> 00:44:46,879
Speaker 3: security team because they thought the pirates would hate them

915
00:44:46,920 --> 00:44:50,440
Speaker 3: the most. These guys can't stand Western culture or music,

916
00:44:50,760 --> 00:44:53,880
Speaker 3: making Brittany hits perfect And as soon as the pirates

917
00:44:53,880 --> 00:44:56,480
Speaker 3: get a blast of Brittany, they move on as quickly

918
00:44:56,600 --> 00:44:57,280
Speaker 3: as they can.

919
00:44:58,040 --> 00:44:59,880
Speaker 2: So what I love about that story too, is like

920
00:45:00,040 --> 00:45:03,560
Speaker 2: you're talking about reporting from twenty thirteen, and those songs

921
00:45:03,560 --> 00:45:05,200
Speaker 2: I feel like came out in like two thousand and

922
00:45:05,239 --> 00:45:08,880
Speaker 2: two thousand and one sometime around then. Like they didn't

923
00:45:08,880 --> 00:45:11,239
Speaker 2: just like pick the latest pop songs. They went back

924
00:45:11,239 --> 00:45:13,640
Speaker 2: and specifically chose Brittany to scare.

925
00:45:13,360 --> 00:45:15,320
Speaker 1: Out fire and very specific.

926
00:45:15,360 --> 00:45:18,440
Speaker 3: They're still just as powerful today, so I'd be curious

927
00:45:18,440 --> 00:45:20,160
Speaker 3: that if they go back and use them again.

928
00:45:20,239 --> 00:45:22,600
Speaker 2: Well, I do feel like you have to get the

929
00:45:22,600 --> 00:45:23,399
Speaker 2: trophy for that.

930
00:45:23,800 --> 00:45:26,319
Speaker 3: I saved that one especially for last, just for that fact.

931
00:45:26,360 --> 00:45:28,200
Speaker 3: I knew i'd get this one locked up. Well, I'm

932
00:45:28,239 --> 00:45:30,160
Speaker 3: sure there are other great facts that we have not

933
00:45:30,320 --> 00:45:32,640
Speaker 3: mentioned today about pirates, and we'd love to hear those

934
00:45:32,640 --> 00:45:35,160
Speaker 3: from you guys. As always, you can always email us

935
00:45:35,160 --> 00:45:37,960
Speaker 3: part Time Genius at HowStuffWorks dot com or hit us

936
00:45:38,040 --> 00:45:41,120
Speaker 3: up on Facebook or Twitter. But from Tristan, Gabe, Mango

937
00:45:41,200 --> 00:45:42,600
Speaker 3: and me, thanks so much for listening.

938
00:45:56,880 --> 00:45:57,960
Speaker 1: Thanks again for listening.

939
00:45:58,080 --> 00:46:00,320
Speaker 3: Part Time Genius is a production of How Stuff and

940
00:46:00,320 --> 00:46:02,960
Speaker 3: wouldn't be possible without several brilliant people who do the

941
00:46:03,000 --> 00:46:05,440
Speaker 3: important things we couldn't even begin to understand.

942
00:46:05,680 --> 00:46:07,319
Speaker 2: Christa McNeil does the editing thing.

943
00:46:07,520 --> 00:46:09,520
Speaker 3: Noel Brown made the theme song and does the mixy

944
00:46:09,560 --> 00:46:10,359
Speaker 3: mixy sound thing.

945
00:46:10,880 --> 00:46:13,000
Speaker 2: Jerry Roland does the exact producer thing.

946
00:46:13,200 --> 00:46:15,600
Speaker 3: Gabe Bluesier is our lead researcher, with support from the

947
00:46:15,640 --> 00:46:19,000
Speaker 3: Research Army including Austin Thompson, Nolan Brown and Lucas Adams

948
00:46:19,080 --> 00:46:19,399
Speaker 3: and Eves.

949
00:46:19,440 --> 00:46:21,800
Speaker 2: Jeff Cook gets the show to your ears. Good job, Eves.

950
00:46:21,960 --> 00:46:23,920
Speaker 3: If you like what you heard, we hope you'll subscribe,

951
00:46:23,920 --> 00:46:25,800
Speaker 3: And if you really really like what you've heard.

952
00:46:25,600 --> 00:46:27,319
Speaker 1: Maybe you could leave a good review for us.

953
00:46:27,440 --> 00:46:28,760
Speaker 2: Do we forget Jason?

954
00:46:29,000 --> 00:46:29,560
Speaker 1: Jason who