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Speaker 1: Hey, this is Sam, this is John. We're the ancient

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Speaker 1: two case story Time podcast hosts, and we have some

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Speaker 1: ancient wisdom in the stories coming up. If you want

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Speaker 1: to hear the wisdom from two old heads that will

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Speaker 1: know more than they know what to do with, you're

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Speaker 1: gonna have to wait for a quick message from our

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Speaker 1: sponsors for the next two minutes or so.

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Speaker 2: My wife cheated with her cousin and now doesn't want

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Speaker 2: a divorce.

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Speaker 3: I have a case just like that right now, actually perfect.

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Speaker 2: I thirty one male, have been married to my wife

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Speaker 2: twenty eight female for five years and together for thirteen

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Speaker 2: years total. We have two little ones, both under five.

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Speaker 2: We were planning on moving to Florida and just three

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Speaker 2: days before we were set to fly out, Carr was

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Speaker 2: already there waiting along with all of her crap. She

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Speaker 2: hits me with this crap. By the way, this comes

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Speaker 2: from partiotque And if you want to spit your own stories,

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Speaker 2: good to the r slash okay Storytime subreddit.

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Speaker 4: And guys, we have a special guest today. This is Sarah. Hello, Sarah,

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Speaker 4: Hi uh So Sarah. She's a graduate from UCLA and

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Speaker 4: Southwestern Law graduate who has practiced family law exclusively since

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Speaker 4: two thousand and eight. Raised by a mother with nearly

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Speaker 4: thirty years in the field, she brings long life insight,

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Speaker 4: skilled advocacy, and deep empathy to guiding clients through divorce, custody,

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Speaker 4: and other complex family matters.

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Speaker 2: She's a favorable review.

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Speaker 5: I paid him a lot of money.

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Speaker 2: I was like, uh huh.

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Speaker 4: She is also the author of Live, Laugh, Fine, True Love,

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Speaker 4: and A step by step guide to dating and building

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Speaker 4: meaningful relationships.

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Speaker 2: And she's here to help us talk about this story,

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Speaker 2: which apparently you already have a.

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Speaker 5: Case leg Well, yeah, it's similar.

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Speaker 2: Yeah yeah, So I work out of town on a

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Speaker 2: rotational schedule, three weeks on, three weeks off. About six

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Speaker 2: weeks ago, when I returned home from work, she completely

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Speaker 2: blindsided me with I'm no longer in love with you.

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Speaker 2: I don't want to be with you. We lost her spark,

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Speaker 2: I haven't been happy in years, et cetera. Ouch. While

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Speaker 2: she's telling me all this, she drops another bomb. She

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Speaker 2: feels she had an emotional affair with someone that someone

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Speaker 2: just happens to be her first cousin twenty two Male. Okay,

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Speaker 2: I like, no, I read the title, but I don't

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Speaker 2: think I've fully read the title.

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Speaker 3: Oh, okay, it was emotional.

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Speaker 5: At least we know the kid's emotional, so it's.

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Speaker 3: Fine's fine, it's fine, right. We know the kids are

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Speaker 3: his right, yeah?

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Speaker 2: Is it that physical?

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Speaker 6: Right?

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Speaker 5: Right?

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Speaker 2: Ooh?

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Speaker 7: Man, and they share the same set of grandparents.

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Speaker 2: Too, Yeah, this is like, this is blood cousin. Yeah. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: I think this is what twelve Night's about. I'm obviously

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Speaker 2: extremely confused and distraught, so I left to stay at

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Speaker 2: my dad's place that night. I tell her on the phone,

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Speaker 2: I'll give you until the end of the day to

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Speaker 2: stop talking to him, otherwise I'm filing for divorce. He

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Speaker 2: tells me, Yeah, I'm gonna star talking to him. I

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Speaker 2: want to fix this for the kids. I don't know

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Speaker 2: if I would want to continue a relationship with someone

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Speaker 2: who was having an emotional affair with their cousin.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, I mean, what was happening.

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Speaker 2: In your case? Did they want to continue the relationship

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Speaker 2: with their cousin? No?

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Speaker 3: Oh, oh, the relationship with the cousin. Yeah, the person

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Speaker 3: denied it.

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Speaker 2: Oh, but.

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Speaker 5: Right, right.

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Speaker 3: The person denied the relationship, but the cousin's spouse contacted

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Speaker 3: my client to out the relationship, So it was kind

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Speaker 3: of a little different about the creation.

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Speaker 2: So we didn't even have to go through all this

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Speaker 2: because she just came forward and said, I'm in love

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Speaker 2: with my cousin.

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Speaker 3: I don't think it was emotional, That's what I'm saying.

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Speaker 2: Oh, that's even worse, man that yikes. The next day,

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Speaker 2: I go back over to her place to talk things through,

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Speaker 2: and I go through her phone. I noticed she had

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Speaker 2: deleted the text with him, and in her photos app

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Speaker 2: the last photo she was looking at where Budoir photos

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Speaker 2: she'd gotten done for me Valentine's Day this year, not

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Speaker 2: fully unclothed but very revealing lingerie shots. When I confront

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Speaker 2: her about this, she says, I deleted the messages because

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Speaker 2: I didn't want anything with him in my phone, and

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Speaker 2: I was looking at those photos because I wanted to

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Speaker 2: remind myself that I'm more than just a mom. I

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Speaker 2: don't fully believe that.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, I'm not buying it.

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Speaker 2: I'm sorry.

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Speaker 5: Sorry.

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Speaker 2: I call her bluff and tell her I'm going to

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Speaker 2: contact our phone provider to get the text logs, so

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Speaker 2: if she has anything to tell me, she better fess up.

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Speaker 2: She says, okay, well, he sent me a photo. Who

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Speaker 2: could have seen that?

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Speaker 5: Come, was it a salacious photo?

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Speaker 2: I think maybe? All right, what else? Okay, I sent

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Speaker 2: him a boudoir photo. Yeah, so it wasn't just for

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Speaker 2: self confidence reasons.

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Speaker 3: And maybe not just taken for the husband for Valentine's.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, that's what I was saying. I don't think it

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Speaker 2: was for you, Wicky.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, it's kind of I really would.

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Speaker 2: Have kind of completely different view on my partner if

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Speaker 2: I found out about that.

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Speaker 7: But like what cousin, like second cousin, third cousin.

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Speaker 3: But like, okay, though, oh wow, I twice removed.

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Speaker 5: I don't know.

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Speaker 2: It's like there's no blood relation at all. It's just

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Speaker 2: kind of a person that went to one wedding that

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Speaker 2: you had.

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Speaker 7: Yeah, okay, okay, that makes sense.

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Speaker 5: No chance for inbreeding it.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, yes, this just breaks me down even further, obviously,

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Speaker 2: So I take my kids and go stay with my

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Speaker 2: mom for a few days. At this point, I'm still

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Speaker 2: drowning in mental grief, confused and lost, but I'm still

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Speaker 2: willing to try to fix this because I truly love

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Speaker 2: her and want our kids to have an intact home.

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Speaker 2: Over the next week, we barely talk unless it's about

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Speaker 2: the kids. He comes over to my moms to get

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Speaker 2: them and takes them for the following week. So now

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Speaker 2: I have a week to myself at my mom's. During

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Speaker 2: this time, she emails me divorce papers that she started

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Speaker 2: filling out, and I'm begging her not to do this,

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Speaker 2: not to force this, but she doesn't care. So I

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Speaker 2: spent my week at my mom's alone filling out these

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Speaker 2: papers while still trying to fight for her. She keeps

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Speaker 2: telling me, Oh, he's just a friend. At this point,

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Speaker 2: nothing's going on. He's not your friend, he's your cousin.

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Speaker 2: He's your cousin to whom you're just my cousin.

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Speaker 3: Boudoir photos, Yeah, okay, just one. Maybe maybe maybe a couple.

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Speaker 3: Maybe they weren't taken for you, honey.

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Speaker 2: Maybe they were while he was there.

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Speaker 5: Who's to say, Maybe he took that head out.

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Speaker 2: I don't know. Blah blah blah. Until one day she

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Speaker 2: tells me, I'm actively pursuing him her cousin. I think

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Speaker 2: at this point we have to tell her parents.

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Speaker 3: Her parents, Yeah, yeah, I mean yeah, probably. I think

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Speaker 3: you say, hey, we need an intervention. Yeah yeah, this

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Speaker 3: is your cousin.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. I completely crumble, give up, hope, and just focus.

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Speaker 2: The next few days getting the papers finished. At this point,

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Speaker 2: I go back to get my kids and move into

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Speaker 2: a new rental. I just found she'd had them for

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Speaker 2: a week by now. I tell her, Hey, before I

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Speaker 2: go back to work for my rotation, I want to

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Speaker 2: get this crap filed. I finally get her over to

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Speaker 2: my place, get everything signed, and we file the following Monday.

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Speaker 2: I leave for work on Tuesday, and it's been about

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Speaker 2: three weeks since all this news broke. Nothing is said

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Speaker 2: about her not wanting a divorce or not wanting this.

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Speaker 2: We just file and go about our way cordially. I

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Speaker 2: get to work and she finds out I'm talking to

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Speaker 2: another woman. If she's upset about this, that's kind of ridiculous.

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Speaker 2: How often in your experience to like a partner who

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Speaker 2: cheats then get really mad that they're part Like the

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Speaker 2: other partner is now seeing someone else? Is that ever, like, No,

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Speaker 2: get more complicated.

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Speaker 3: Usually it's just one person who's cheating, it's not usually both. Yeah,

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Speaker 3: but yeah, I can see it. It's like I can

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Speaker 3: do it, but you can't.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah exactly.

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Speaker 7: Also, is this illegal?

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Speaker 2: What the cousin.

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Speaker 5: To marry your cousin?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, but just to see that.

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Speaker 3: To send boudoir photos. No, no, totally totally legally yes.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, oh man, rough, really rough. It just seems like, oh,

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Speaker 2: he's very chill about this.

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Speaker 3: I mean I kind of felt a little bit bad

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Speaker 3: for him until I found out he was also cheating.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, well I wonder if he was cheating or if this.

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Speaker 5: Was after if after Okay, okay, I take it back.

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Speaker 2: But they're not divorced, so it's still that's okay.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, divorces take a long time, so you

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Speaker 3: can totally have a relationship. And once you've separated and

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Speaker 3: you've decided you want to go your separate ways.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, and once you found out that your wife is

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Speaker 2: seeing her cousin totally fair. Yes, someone I have history

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Speaker 2: with from when we were teenagers, and she absolutely hates

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Speaker 2: her for whatever reason. Well I think it's pretty obvious reason.

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Speaker 2: She asks if I'm talking to her, and I tell

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Speaker 2: her it's none of your business who I'm talking to.

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Speaker 2: So we're getting divorced. Over the next few days, she

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Speaker 2: keeps pestering me about this, so I finally tell her, yes,

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Speaker 2: I am talking to her, just for support.

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Speaker 3: He should have said, don't worry about it. It's not

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Speaker 3: my cousin.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, or I was gonna say, don't worry about it.

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Speaker 2: It's just an emotional thing, that's fine, which was honestly

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Speaker 2: why I reached out to her. This hurts her and

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Speaker 2: she hangs up on me. Whatever. The next day she

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Speaker 2: calls me saying, I miss you. I don't want to

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Speaker 2: get divorced. We need to fix this for the kids.

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Speaker 2: I'm not talking to my cousin anymore, et cetera, et cetera,

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Speaker 2: et cetera.

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Speaker 5: Now he's a cousin. Before he was a friend and

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Speaker 5: a friend.

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Speaker 2: Pretty convenient timing. Right At this point, I've pretty well

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Speaker 2: accepted my fate and reality. I've come to terms with

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Speaker 2: everything and decided it's best not to go back because

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Speaker 2: of the circumstances. It's taken you too long to get

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Speaker 2: to that point.

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Speaker 3: But you got there. That's all that matters. Right, Okay, Good.

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Speaker 2: She's been a essentially begging me not to follow through

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Speaker 2: with this divorce after starting it.

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Speaker 5: Mm hmm, Yeah, that happens.

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Speaker 2: It happens a lot. Yeah, like not a lot.

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Speaker 5: But it does happen.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, Yeah, essentially manipulating me, and it's messing with my head.

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Speaker 2: I truly feel I cannot go back to that. She

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Speaker 2: betrayed me with her cousin and abandoned me during the

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Speaker 2: darkest time of my life. But I still do love

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Speaker 2: her and care for her obviously, even though she destroyed

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Speaker 2: everything we had built.

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Speaker 5: Run, dude, run.

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Speaker 2: I wonder how much her kids know.

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Speaker 5: Well, oh, my gosh, how do you explain this to

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Speaker 5: your cousin too?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, they're like, oh, it's it's cousin. He comes

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Speaker 2: around a lot. It's kind of strange. Mom and him

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Speaker 2: are really close in your case where their kids involved, Yes,

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Speaker 2: oh oh no. My thing is I'm struggling with guilt.

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Speaker 2: I know I shouldn't feel guilty since I did nothing

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Speaker 2: wrong in the scenario, but I do feel guilty. I

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Speaker 2: feel guilty because I know she'll struggle. She's been a

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Speaker 2: stay at home mom since our first was born and

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Speaker 2: has no career. I feel guilty for my children's sake,

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Speaker 2: knowing they'll be raised in a broken home. And I

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Speaker 2: feel guilty for giving up on my family. Well, she's

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Speaker 2: not giving up on her family.

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Speaker 3: Well, I mean she's manipulating.

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Speaker 2: Really close to her family, right. Yeah, she wants back

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Speaker 2: with me, but it seems like it's not for the

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Speaker 2: right reason. It seems more out of jealousy knowing she's

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Speaker 2: going to struggle financially. Yeah, she stayed home up.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, well there there are workarounds around that.

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Speaker 2: But you know, I mean, I guess, I know. I

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Speaker 2: know it's state to state, but typically would favor him

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Speaker 2: because of the affair.

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Speaker 3: Or not in California. California is a no fault state.

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Speaker 3: There are states that are fault states, and I'm not

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Speaker 3: sure how that affects custody situations, but like I know,

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Speaker 3: for example, like there are fault states where if you're

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Speaker 3: found to have been cheating on your spouse, you get nothing,

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Speaker 3: You lose all of your property, you get nothing in

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Speaker 3: the divorce, which she.

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Speaker 2: Has no money right so that's probably realizing. Oh yeah,

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Speaker 2: and because I know she doesn't want to live in

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Speaker 2: our small hometown where we grew up. She's feeling upset

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Speaker 2: that we aren't in Florida like we had originally planned.

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Speaker 2: Not because she loves me and wants to fix this.

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Speaker 2: I feel I can't go back because of what she

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Speaker 2: did to our family and the fact that she made

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Speaker 2: such rash decisions. If she can do this with a cousin,

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Speaker 2: what's to prevent this from happening again, or prevent her

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Speaker 2: from making any other rash decisions.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, like with a sibling with the next time.

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Speaker 2: I mean, I mean, how many other families can she

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Speaker 2: go through before she gets to the idea. I'm just

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Speaker 2: lost on what to do, So any feedback would be appreciated,

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Speaker 2: And there are some relevant comments, but before we get

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Speaker 2: into those, I want to know what you think oh

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Speaker 2: Pe should do and what advice you have for him.

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Speaker 3: Well, it's obviously a personal decision, yes, but it sounds

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Speaker 3: like he is sort of being manipulated. It's never an

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Speaker 3: easy decision, but it seems like it's either going to

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Speaker 3: happen again or there's some underlying problems that led him

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Speaker 3: to this place in the in the first place.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, if he decides to stay with her, is there

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Speaker 2: a way that like down the line, I don't know,

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Speaker 2: Like she could divorce again, and then if it were

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Speaker 2: a fault state, she could divorce again and then kind

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Speaker 2: of have a more favorable.

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Speaker 5: I wouldn't.

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Speaker 3: I wouldn't know, just because it's a state by state

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Speaker 3: issue and the law is different in every state. But yeah,

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Speaker 3: I mean, I think the operative word there is if

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Speaker 3: it happens again, which probably will down the roads.

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Speaker 2: I mean it's her cousin.

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Speaker 3: He's not going anywhere, Yeah, I mean not even with

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Speaker 3: a cousin. Like, there's obviously something that led her to

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Speaker 3: have an emotional affair, something that's not being met, some

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Speaker 3: needs that aren't being met in the relationship. And so

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Speaker 3: if they don't address that and they don't work on that,

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Speaker 3: and you know, it's probably just going to happen again

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Speaker 3: in some capacity.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 7: I'm just worried about like Christmases and things Thanksgiving. No, No, yeah,

295
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Speaker 7: because you can't. You got to break that up, like

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Speaker 7: or not.

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Speaker 2: I really think that he needs to tell I think

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Speaker 2: he should tell her parents.

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Speaker 3: But that might be messy, that might be messy for

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Speaker 3: his kids. Or that's true, gotta put his kids first,

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Speaker 3: that's true.

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Speaker 4: Where they get all through this and their family is stronger, yikes,

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Speaker 4: stronger bond.

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Speaker 5: Can all share the same last name now?

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Speaker 2: Exactly? So easy?

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Speaker 7: Yeah, they've been doing that with the Kings and queens

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Speaker 7: for a while.

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Speaker 2: Oh boy relevant comments unusual. Potato fifteen fifteen says, why

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Speaker 2: do you feel guilty? You're not the one bang and

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Speaker 2: your cousin. Let's see how her life is with her

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Speaker 2: twenty two year old cousin. How old is she? Again?

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Speaker 3: There wasn't banging, let's just be yeah, there was. It

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Speaker 3: was emotional emotional.

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Speaker 2: The emotionally banged.

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Speaker 4: She's thirty eight and op is thirty one. Sorry, sorry, sorry,

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Speaker 4: she's twenty eighth.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I was gonna say she's thirty eight. Bang your

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Speaker 2: twenty two year old cousin or no banking guys, yes,

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Speaker 2: sorry sorry, emotionally emotionally, emotionally bank There.

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Speaker 5: No emotionally banging exactly.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, okay, twenty eight and twenty two. It's not that great,

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Speaker 2: especially if this is like her younger cousin. I'm kind

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Speaker 2: of concerned about him, Huger. I'm going to concern about him,

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Speaker 2: but it's less bad than thirty eight. I'm sure he

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Speaker 2: doesn't want to take on two kids who are his cousins.

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Speaker 2: Opie says, yeah, I know. I shouldn't feel guilty. I

327
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Speaker 2: did nothing wrong in this scenario, but I feel guilty

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Speaker 2: knowing she'll struggle and my kids won't have the same

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Speaker 2: lifestyle with her that I'll be able to provide for them,

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Speaker 2: which is more important. Even though this is the most

331
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Speaker 2: ft situation, I still care that's a fault of mine.

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Speaker 2: I do care too much and put others before myself.

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Speaker 2: At the end of the day, I just want my

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Speaker 2: babies to be happy and live a good life with

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Speaker 2: no struggle, and to grow up to be good people

336
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Speaker 2: with respect and manners. Brew Dog nineteen fifty seven says,

337
00:15:50,840 --> 00:15:54,640
Speaker 2: remember she made this decision, not you. If you stay,

338
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Speaker 2: you'll be miserable and untrusting, and your kids will see

339
00:15:59,040 --> 00:16:02,200
Speaker 2: all of this play out. Don't teach them that. Teach

340
00:16:02,240 --> 00:16:04,920
Speaker 2: them how to make life adjustments when faced with difficulties.

341
00:16:05,360 --> 00:16:09,400
Speaker 2: Your wife wants to say, for all the wrong reasons,

342
00:16:10,160 --> 00:16:11,640
Speaker 2: but there's a little bit left to the story. Do

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Speaker 2: you have any final thoughts including.

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Speaker 3: I mean, yeah, I think that he's still going to

345
00:16:17,400 --> 00:16:19,760
Speaker 3: get to be a part of his children's lives, and

346
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Speaker 3: so he still has a say in.

347
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Speaker 5: Their upbringing and all of that.

348
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Speaker 3: And it's sometimes better when couples are apart than when

349
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Speaker 3: they are together.

350
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Speaker 2: Yeah. I think that this relationship would benefit from a

351
00:16:31,360 --> 00:16:34,440
Speaker 2: lot of space. Yeah. Yeah, but I always say like

352
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Speaker 2: I think that a lot of other stories we read,

353
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Speaker 2: I feel like therapy in terms of co parenting, even

354
00:16:39,400 --> 00:16:41,760
Speaker 2: if you're not staying together. Yeah, it super helpful.

355
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Speaker 3: I'm a big advocate of co parenting therapy, and also I.

356
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Speaker 2: Just think she needs therapy in general, a lot of it.

357
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Speaker 2: I worry that something else is going on in this family.

358
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Speaker 7: Yeah.

359
00:16:52,160 --> 00:16:55,680
Speaker 4: Also, would you want to like DNA test your own kids?

360
00:16:56,000 --> 00:16:57,480
Speaker 2: Now that's so concerning.

361
00:16:57,560 --> 00:16:59,200
Speaker 3: Well, that's what I was thinking in the beginning. But

362
00:16:59,240 --> 00:17:00,200
Speaker 3: she said it was a motion.

363
00:17:00,840 --> 00:17:03,400
Speaker 5: Yeah, I mean right, But.

364
00:17:03,400 --> 00:17:05,560
Speaker 2: Then she's trickle cheothing a lot of them, information.

365
00:17:05,160 --> 00:17:08,359
Speaker 3: Sending boudoir photos. If it's just emotional, I don't know,

366
00:17:08,520 --> 00:17:09,479
Speaker 3: something isn't adding up.

367
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Speaker 2: I don't know.

368
00:17:10,400 --> 00:17:13,440
Speaker 4: Most people say that like if you send any photos,

369
00:17:13,480 --> 00:17:16,080
Speaker 4: it's the same as cheating, Like if you physically cheat, well,

370
00:17:16,119 --> 00:17:16,560
Speaker 4: I think it's.

371
00:17:16,480 --> 00:17:19,439
Speaker 2: Absolutely cheating, but you're saying, oh, it's it is.

372
00:17:19,520 --> 00:17:21,639
Speaker 4: Some people like are like, oh, would you break up

373
00:17:21,680 --> 00:17:23,880
Speaker 4: if they just send the noodles? And they're like, yeah,

374
00:17:23,880 --> 00:17:26,440
Speaker 4: I'm breaking up. And then if they cheat, yeah I'm

375
00:17:26,440 --> 00:17:28,320
Speaker 4: breaking up, Like they consider it the same thing.

376
00:17:28,760 --> 00:17:31,280
Speaker 5: Yeah, I mean I would cheating is cheating.

377
00:17:31,320 --> 00:17:34,000
Speaker 3: There are different degrees of it, but it's still betrayal

378
00:17:34,040 --> 00:17:36,720
Speaker 3: and it's still cheating, and it's yeah, you know, I

379
00:17:36,760 --> 00:17:37,400
Speaker 3: think it's.

380
00:17:37,240 --> 00:17:40,680
Speaker 2: Even worse than physical cheating because the clust is involved.

381
00:17:42,320 --> 00:17:44,800
Speaker 2: I think it. I think it goes to several more degrees.

382
00:17:45,480 --> 00:17:47,560
Speaker 2: But there is a little bit left to the story.

383
00:17:47,680 --> 00:17:50,240
Speaker 2: If you coat twelve ninety seven says if you and

384
00:17:50,960 --> 00:17:54,479
Speaker 2: you should one hundred percent follow through change your work pattern.

385
00:17:54,680 --> 00:17:57,280
Speaker 2: This three weeks on three weeks off won't go down

386
00:17:57,280 --> 00:18:00,000
Speaker 2: well in family court. Consult a divorce lawyer to minimize

387
00:18:00,280 --> 00:18:03,000
Speaker 2: your financial exposure to her. The court's job is to

388
00:18:03,040 --> 00:18:06,159
Speaker 2: protect the kids fiscally. Keep any communication now to a

389
00:18:06,200 --> 00:18:10,080
Speaker 2: bare functional co parenting minimum. See a therapist. Stay single,

390
00:18:10,280 --> 00:18:13,400
Speaker 2: Do not jump into a relationship. Sure, try your luck

391
00:18:13,440 --> 00:18:16,480
Speaker 2: for hookups if that's your thing, but don't get emotionally

392
00:18:16,520 --> 00:18:19,800
Speaker 2: invested in anyone until you've moved on and invested in

393
00:18:19,840 --> 00:18:22,280
Speaker 2: yourself for a while. She bought into the stay at

394
00:18:22,280 --> 00:18:25,399
Speaker 2: home mom life and it wasn't rewarding. This isn't her fault,

395
00:18:25,600 --> 00:18:28,879
Speaker 2: nor is it uncommon. She rightly wanted more as a woman,

396
00:18:29,000 --> 00:18:31,960
Speaker 2: but instead of trying to communicate her feelings and frustration

397
00:18:32,080 --> 00:18:35,240
Speaker 2: to you, she wanted to have her cousin. The problem

398
00:18:35,400 --> 00:18:38,240
Speaker 2: is that she'll do something like this again the next time.

399
00:18:38,240 --> 00:18:40,880
Speaker 2: Her life is boring and dull, and you will always

400
00:18:41,000 --> 00:18:43,760
Speaker 2: in her head be a part of that boring and

401
00:18:43,840 --> 00:18:47,320
Speaker 2: dull life. That's even before we talk about trust. Your

402
00:18:47,320 --> 00:18:50,720
Speaker 2: marriage is unfortunately over. You're young and you deserve better,

403
00:18:50,920 --> 00:18:54,000
Speaker 2: Opie says, I can't change the work pattern. Unfortunately, it's

404
00:18:54,119 --> 00:18:56,360
Speaker 2: very common in the state I live in, since it's

405
00:18:56,359 --> 00:18:58,960
Speaker 2: in the oil Field family court. Here is fair and

406
00:18:59,000 --> 00:19:02,520
Speaker 2: equitable thought. Lawyer conversations have been bare over the last

407
00:19:02,640 --> 00:19:06,240
Speaker 2: four days, and I saw therapy after like three days.

408
00:19:06,760 --> 00:19:09,359
Speaker 2: It's been very helpful. Oh and there is a really

409
00:19:09,800 --> 00:19:13,400
Speaker 2: quick final update. Actually, I followed through with the dissolution,

410
00:19:13,800 --> 00:19:16,720
Speaker 2: didn't get lawyers involved. We agreed on all conditions of

411
00:19:16,760 --> 00:19:19,720
Speaker 2: dissolving our marriage, fifty to fifty custody and fifty to

412
00:19:19,720 --> 00:19:22,600
Speaker 2: fifty split of assets. She will not be exposing the

413
00:19:22,680 --> 00:19:25,879
Speaker 2: children to that relationship if she chooses to continue with it.

414
00:19:26,359 --> 00:19:30,680
Speaker 3: What about like Christmas time, Christmas and Thanksgiving?

415
00:19:30,920 --> 00:19:34,919
Speaker 2: What about any family event as it's legally binding in

416
00:19:34,960 --> 00:19:40,040
Speaker 2: our parenting plan. Opie's too normal about them. Everything was

417
00:19:40,080 --> 00:19:43,359
Speaker 2: finalized this last week. Looking forward to rebuilding my life

418
00:19:43,440 --> 00:19:47,280
Speaker 2: and moving forward, and folks, that's the end of that story.

419
00:19:47,680 --> 00:19:48,080
Speaker 7: I don't know.

420
00:19:48,280 --> 00:19:50,760
Speaker 4: It seemed like he could have gotten an attorney and everything.

421
00:19:50,760 --> 00:19:52,800
Speaker 4: Would you recommend having that in the scenario?

422
00:19:53,160 --> 00:19:54,439
Speaker 2: Well, pretty complicated.

423
00:19:54,480 --> 00:19:56,359
Speaker 3: I mean they seem to have worked it out pretty

424
00:19:56,359 --> 00:19:59,760
Speaker 3: amicably and done everything without lawyers. So if people can

425
00:19:59,800 --> 00:20:03,399
Speaker 3: do that, that's wonderful and certainly save a lot of money

426
00:20:03,400 --> 00:20:06,399
Speaker 3: as long as you're getting a fair deal and you know,

427
00:20:06,560 --> 00:20:09,800
Speaker 3: avoiding court. That's always better for your children. Get better

428
00:20:09,840 --> 00:20:12,320
Speaker 3: that the money goes to your children. But you should always,

429
00:20:12,359 --> 00:20:15,119
Speaker 3: I think, consult with an attorney at the beginning of

430
00:20:15,160 --> 00:20:18,240
Speaker 3: a divorce because you don't necessarily know what the law is,

431
00:20:18,320 --> 00:20:20,640
Speaker 3: you don't know what your rights are, and I think

432
00:20:20,680 --> 00:20:22,920
Speaker 3: a lot of people are very intimidated by the process,

433
00:20:22,920 --> 00:20:25,720
Speaker 3: and rightfully so, and the best thing to do is

434
00:20:25,760 --> 00:20:28,680
Speaker 3: to get the information so you feel empowered and unless

435
00:20:29,320 --> 00:20:31,280
Speaker 3: terrified by you know, the unknown.

436
00:20:31,480 --> 00:20:33,919
Speaker 2: Yeah, especially I think when us the agreements are involved,

437
00:20:33,920 --> 00:20:35,920
Speaker 2: because those are so you know, but.

438
00:20:35,920 --> 00:20:38,600
Speaker 3: Property too, because it could be you know, you could

439
00:20:38,680 --> 00:20:40,920
Speaker 3: have a big chunk in property and not even realize.

440
00:20:41,160 --> 00:20:43,240
Speaker 2: Yeah. Absolutely, good advice.

441
00:20:43,680 --> 00:20:45,240
Speaker 5: Thanks, you know, I give it occasionally.

442
00:20:45,320 --> 00:20:50,120
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's kind of your job. Yeah, I mean, yeah,

443
00:20:50,160 --> 00:20:54,080
Speaker 2: but we actually have some more questions for you that

444
00:20:54,200 --> 00:20:56,680
Speaker 2: I think we're these were sent in or.

445
00:20:56,920 --> 00:20:57,640
Speaker 7: Yeah, yeah, yeah.

446
00:20:57,680 --> 00:21:01,280
Speaker 4: So these are acommitted questions for you, okay, and they

447
00:21:01,280 --> 00:21:02,160
Speaker 4: want to get your.

448
00:21:02,320 --> 00:21:04,280
Speaker 7: Two cents on some of the matters they.

449
00:21:04,200 --> 00:21:05,000
Speaker 5: Are going to bring them on.

450
00:21:05,240 --> 00:21:08,040
Speaker 3: I can't give any legal advice, but I'm happy to

451
00:21:08,720 --> 00:21:10,440
Speaker 3: dance around that as much as I can.

452
00:21:10,520 --> 00:21:12,679
Speaker 4: Can you give me like an example of legal advice

453
00:21:12,720 --> 00:21:14,040
Speaker 4: so we know not to take that.

454
00:21:14,400 --> 00:21:17,159
Speaker 3: Yeah, I can't tell them what the law is because

455
00:21:17,200 --> 00:21:19,440
Speaker 3: I'm only licensed to practice in California, so I can

456
00:21:19,520 --> 00:21:22,600
Speaker 3: generally talk about the law is in California. I can't

457
00:21:22,600 --> 00:21:24,879
Speaker 3: tell anybody what to do or what they shouldn't do.

458
00:21:25,200 --> 00:21:29,679
Speaker 3: I can give relationship kind of direction, and I can

459
00:21:29,880 --> 00:21:31,800
Speaker 3: sort of talk about divorce very generally.

460
00:21:31,960 --> 00:21:34,919
Speaker 2: Perfect. Yeah, excellent. We're going to give you, guys general.

461
00:21:34,680 --> 00:21:38,040
Speaker 5: Advice, but that's not advice, but it's not We're.

462
00:21:37,920 --> 00:21:39,240
Speaker 2: Going to talk of generally.

463
00:21:40,040 --> 00:21:42,240
Speaker 5: If you need advice, seek legal advice exactly.

464
00:21:42,520 --> 00:21:44,920
Speaker 2: Okay. So we have a little little story and then

465
00:21:44,920 --> 00:21:47,920
Speaker 2: some questions. All right, divorce when you have two kids

466
00:21:47,960 --> 00:21:51,120
Speaker 2: and both want them, so both parents, I guess want them.

467
00:21:51,359 --> 00:21:53,840
Speaker 2: We have been fighting for four months now. I feel

468
00:21:53,840 --> 00:21:55,360
Speaker 2: that there is nothing that I can do that will

469
00:21:55,400 --> 00:21:58,440
Speaker 2: get her back. So we are starting to discuss divorce often.

470
00:21:58,560 --> 00:22:01,000
Speaker 2: We have been together for more than twenty years. We

471
00:22:01,080 --> 00:22:03,399
Speaker 2: have two kids, ten year old boy and six year

472
00:22:03,400 --> 00:22:06,560
Speaker 2: old girl. Right now, we're thinking about splitting everything fifty

473
00:22:06,600 --> 00:22:08,560
Speaker 2: to fifty, but we want to make it as normal

474
00:22:08,600 --> 00:22:11,439
Speaker 2: for kids as possible. As much as I'm thinking about it,

475
00:22:11,480 --> 00:22:13,240
Speaker 2: I don't feel that it would be normal for both

476
00:22:13,320 --> 00:22:16,520
Speaker 2: kids to be separated. They definitely must keep living their

477
00:22:16,560 --> 00:22:19,440
Speaker 2: life together, but we both want them so right now,

478
00:22:19,480 --> 00:22:21,359
Speaker 2: the idea is that we could have them living in

479
00:22:21,400 --> 00:22:24,639
Speaker 2: our new future separate homes every second week. Is that

480
00:22:24,720 --> 00:22:27,119
Speaker 2: a good idea? Maybe there are some people that have

481
00:22:27,200 --> 00:22:30,639
Speaker 2: experienced something like and this work. Personally, I think it

482
00:22:30,640 --> 00:22:32,800
Speaker 2: would be horrible to be a child and live on

483
00:22:32,840 --> 00:22:36,320
Speaker 2: suitcases all the time. Maybe we're overlooking some better options.

484
00:22:36,480 --> 00:22:40,639
Speaker 2: Thanks in advance. Have you ever had cases with multiple

485
00:22:40,720 --> 00:22:44,280
Speaker 2: kids and you know, do you have any like, I guess,

486
00:22:44,359 --> 00:22:46,679
Speaker 2: relationship advice about what's best for those kids, or really.

487
00:22:46,760 --> 00:22:50,080
Speaker 3: Yeah, that you've seen so most of my cases do

488
00:22:50,160 --> 00:22:54,840
Speaker 3: involve children, and most of my cases involved multiple children.

489
00:22:55,720 --> 00:22:58,280
Speaker 3: Children are not typically split up. That's not considered, at

490
00:22:58,359 --> 00:23:00,639
Speaker 3: least in California, it's not considered in their best interest.

491
00:23:00,680 --> 00:23:04,159
Speaker 3: I don't do parent, No, it's typically like they should

492
00:23:04,160 --> 00:23:09,440
Speaker 3: stay together. In California, usually when there's some sort of

493
00:23:09,520 --> 00:23:12,000
Speaker 3: joint custody arrangement, it plays out like a fifty to

494
00:23:12,040 --> 00:23:15,760
Speaker 3: fifty sort of arrangement, and there are different ways of

495
00:23:15,800 --> 00:23:18,280
Speaker 3: doing that. Like the most common is a two two five,

496
00:23:18,359 --> 00:23:21,120
Speaker 3: where like one parent has Monday Tuesday, the other has

497
00:23:21,119 --> 00:23:23,639
Speaker 3: a Wednesday Thursday, and then they alternate weekends from like

498
00:23:23,720 --> 00:23:27,320
Speaker 3: Friday to Monday. That's just something that's generally done in California.

499
00:23:27,400 --> 00:23:30,320
Speaker 3: When people share custody. The thing is that you both

500
00:23:30,359 --> 00:23:32,639
Speaker 3: want your children, but the reality of divorce is that

501
00:23:32,680 --> 00:23:35,400
Speaker 3: you're never going to see your children one hundred percent.

502
00:23:35,480 --> 00:23:38,560
Speaker 3: I mean, of course, in extenuating circumstances like there's like

503
00:23:38,640 --> 00:23:42,000
Speaker 3: abuse or one parent is in jail or you know, obviously,

504
00:23:42,119 --> 00:23:45,920
Speaker 3: but like in general, most cases, it's it's some sort

505
00:23:45,920 --> 00:23:49,560
Speaker 3: of shared custody arrangement, and you know that. Something that

506
00:23:49,640 --> 00:23:52,080
Speaker 3: struck me in that question was we don't want our

507
00:23:52,160 --> 00:23:55,400
Speaker 3: kids living in suitcases. Well, you're gonna have two separate homes. Yeah,

508
00:23:55,400 --> 00:23:58,280
Speaker 3: and your kids will presumably have their own bedrooms or

509
00:23:58,400 --> 00:24:01,480
Speaker 3: bedroom that they share in each home, and they should

510
00:24:01,520 --> 00:24:04,159
Speaker 3: each have their own stuff in the separate homes, so

511
00:24:04,200 --> 00:24:06,840
Speaker 3: they know that. Yeah, so they know that they have

512
00:24:07,320 --> 00:24:10,360
Speaker 3: two homes. They're not shuffling back and forth with suitcases.

513
00:24:10,560 --> 00:24:14,800
Speaker 3: And they can use the opportunity to create a really

514
00:24:14,880 --> 00:24:17,239
Speaker 3: nice space for their children in two different places as

515
00:24:17,280 --> 00:24:19,639
Speaker 3: opposed in just one, and the children can be a

516
00:24:19,680 --> 00:24:23,120
Speaker 3: part of doing that. And really, like the best advice

517
00:24:23,760 --> 00:24:27,560
Speaker 3: that I can give on this is co parent amicably

518
00:24:27,640 --> 00:24:30,600
Speaker 3: for your children. No matter how much you hate your ex,

519
00:24:30,680 --> 00:24:33,720
Speaker 3: you're soon to be ex, you have to co parent

520
00:24:33,760 --> 00:24:36,400
Speaker 3: amicably for them. And if you find that you cannot

521
00:24:36,400 --> 00:24:38,240
Speaker 3: do that, because that's the reason you're getting divorced. If

522
00:24:38,240 --> 00:24:40,560
Speaker 3: you could co parent amicably, you wouldn't be getting divorced,

523
00:24:40,960 --> 00:24:43,920
Speaker 3: then get into some sort of co parent and counseling.

524
00:24:43,960 --> 00:24:47,159
Speaker 3: You mentioned it earlier, Like do whatever you can to

525
00:24:47,240 --> 00:24:50,800
Speaker 3: minimize the damage to your children emotionally, because there are

526
00:24:50,840 --> 00:24:52,880
Speaker 3: a lot of studies out there that show that children

527
00:24:53,359 --> 00:24:56,800
Speaker 3: who have parents who are divorced but get along, they

528
00:24:56,840 --> 00:25:01,000
Speaker 3: do really well. They find I'm sure studies that show

529
00:25:01,440 --> 00:25:05,080
Speaker 3: some heavy stuff that children whose parents have this really

530
00:25:05,119 --> 00:25:08,280
Speaker 3: acrimonious divorce they don't get along, that they have higher

531
00:25:08,359 --> 00:25:13,639
Speaker 3: rates of depression, anxiety, even suicidal ideations, promiscuse behaviors in

532
00:25:13,720 --> 00:25:16,720
Speaker 3: their tenures, things like that. So it does really really

533
00:25:16,760 --> 00:25:21,199
Speaker 3: impact children. Yeah, well when the parents don't shield them

534
00:25:21,200 --> 00:25:23,320
Speaker 3: from the acrimony and kind of like drag them into

535
00:25:23,359 --> 00:25:26,880
Speaker 3: it and make them be the intermediaries. So just keep

536
00:25:26,960 --> 00:25:27,840
Speaker 3: things amagable.

537
00:25:27,960 --> 00:25:28,160
Speaker 7: Yeah.

538
00:25:28,200 --> 00:25:31,560
Speaker 4: So let's say, like a couple is divorced they have

539
00:25:31,600 --> 00:25:33,560
Speaker 4: to do co parenting. Would you just say, hey, go

540
00:25:33,640 --> 00:25:37,000
Speaker 4: run in like couples counseling or like, you know, some

541
00:25:37,040 --> 00:25:38,960
Speaker 4: sort of therapy to like figure out how to talk

542
00:25:39,000 --> 00:25:39,440
Speaker 4: to each other.

543
00:25:40,000 --> 00:25:44,200
Speaker 3: Yeah, So a co parenting counselor would be somebody who

544
00:25:45,119 --> 00:25:48,960
Speaker 3: helped them navigate disagreements, teaches them how to speak to

545
00:25:49,000 --> 00:25:53,399
Speaker 3: one another. You know, it's a place that's reserved for

546
00:25:53,840 --> 00:25:57,879
Speaker 3: addressing conflicts where they don't they're not doing it in

547
00:25:57,920 --> 00:25:58,320
Speaker 3: front of the.

548
00:25:58,280 --> 00:25:59,800
Speaker 2: Kids, at least the kids are not involved in.

549
00:26:00,480 --> 00:26:03,200
Speaker 3: Yeah, and there's somebody who can like really help them

550
00:26:03,640 --> 00:26:06,400
Speaker 3: learn how to communicate with one another better because obviously,

551
00:26:06,440 --> 00:26:09,960
Speaker 3: again it's like complicated. The reason you're getting divorced most

552
00:26:10,040 --> 00:26:12,520
Speaker 3: likely is because you can't communicate or or you're not

553
00:26:12,560 --> 00:26:14,720
Speaker 3: on the same page about things. And yet you're expected

554
00:26:14,720 --> 00:26:17,240
Speaker 3: to raise children together and be on the same page. Suddenly,

555
00:26:17,480 --> 00:26:19,320
Speaker 3: if you were on the same page about raising children,

556
00:26:19,359 --> 00:26:20,680
Speaker 3: you probably wouldn't be getting divorced.

557
00:26:20,720 --> 00:26:22,280
Speaker 5: So it's kind of like a catch twenty two.

558
00:26:22,480 --> 00:26:26,400
Speaker 2: Yes, got it, got it, But we have another question. Yeah,

559
00:26:27,000 --> 00:26:30,439
Speaker 2: Crystal Pancake says, if my husband has been estranged for

560
00:26:30,480 --> 00:26:33,360
Speaker 2: more than ten years, where would I start the divorce process?

561
00:26:33,480 --> 00:26:36,240
Speaker 2: And context? My X and I split in twenty eleven

562
00:26:36,560 --> 00:26:39,479
Speaker 2: and due to finances, were never able to afford a divorce.

563
00:26:39,600 --> 00:26:41,600
Speaker 2: Oh my goodness, he stocked me for years until I

564
00:26:41,640 --> 00:26:44,280
Speaker 2: moved to a new county seven years ago. Now I

565
00:26:44,280 --> 00:26:46,639
Speaker 2: have been in a relationship since twenty fourteen and we

566
00:26:46,680 --> 00:26:49,359
Speaker 2: would like to get married, but I need to divorce first.

567
00:26:49,600 --> 00:26:53,040
Speaker 2: Do the past use in stocking. I'm hesitant to reach

568
00:26:53,040 --> 00:26:54,960
Speaker 2: out to him myself. I have no idea where he

569
00:26:55,040 --> 00:26:57,760
Speaker 2: lives or anything. So do you have cases where like

570
00:26:58,119 --> 00:27:02,480
Speaker 2: the person's just not arow, Yeah, even divorce.

571
00:27:03,280 --> 00:27:05,680
Speaker 3: I had one case like that and we couldn't find

572
00:27:05,720 --> 00:27:08,760
Speaker 3: the guy and we had to do In California, you

573
00:27:08,800 --> 00:27:11,240
Speaker 3: can do a service by publication. After you've made, like

574
00:27:11,320 --> 00:27:14,080
Speaker 3: many many attempts to find the person, you can prove

575
00:27:14,200 --> 00:27:16,879
Speaker 3: that you weren't able to so Basically, you publish in

576
00:27:16,920 --> 00:27:19,479
Speaker 3: a newspaper saying, look, so and so it is divorcing you,

577
00:27:19,600 --> 00:27:22,040
Speaker 3: and the court has to grant you the right to

578
00:27:22,080 --> 00:27:24,880
Speaker 3: do that. So this question to this person, I would

579
00:27:24,920 --> 00:27:27,600
Speaker 3: say that it's probably best to consult with a lawyer

580
00:27:27,600 --> 00:27:30,200
Speaker 3: in your jurisdiction to find out what you can do.

581
00:27:30,359 --> 00:27:32,720
Speaker 3: Like in most cases, you have to at least make

582
00:27:32,760 --> 00:27:34,640
Speaker 3: a due diligence, like an effort.

583
00:27:34,320 --> 00:27:35,320
Speaker 5: To find the person.

584
00:27:35,760 --> 00:27:40,680
Speaker 3: And then if you're afraid that this person knows them right,

585
00:27:40,800 --> 00:27:43,520
Speaker 3: like the attorney, if you do end up hiring an attorney,

586
00:27:43,520 --> 00:27:45,440
Speaker 3: it might be worth it because the attorney can kind

587
00:27:45,480 --> 00:27:47,760
Speaker 3: of act as your sort of agent on your behalf

588
00:27:47,840 --> 00:27:49,960
Speaker 3: without revealing any personal information about you.

589
00:27:50,440 --> 00:27:54,520
Speaker 2: Second question, Christian Abiva Junior says father forced mother to

590
00:27:54,600 --> 00:27:57,800
Speaker 2: move out of the house no legal separation or divorce.

591
00:27:58,320 --> 00:28:01,480
Speaker 2: What is she entitled to when worst does eventually happen

592
00:28:01,720 --> 00:28:04,280
Speaker 2: and contacts They have four children, one of them was

593
00:28:04,280 --> 00:28:07,080
Speaker 2: a miner. At that time. Father made most of the money,

594
00:28:07,119 --> 00:28:09,720
Speaker 2: but mother did all of the parenting and housework. She

595
00:28:09,800 --> 00:28:12,840
Speaker 2: was kicked out over false cheating accusations when she began

596
00:28:13,000 --> 00:28:16,520
Speaker 2: advancing her career, school and residency to make more money

597
00:28:16,960 --> 00:28:20,440
Speaker 2: father is an emotional deadbeat narcissist and is now emotionally

598
00:28:20,480 --> 00:28:23,639
Speaker 2: cheating on video call with another woman almost all the

599
00:28:23,640 --> 00:28:24,280
Speaker 2: time at home?

600
00:28:24,600 --> 00:28:25,280
Speaker 5: Is it his cousin?

601
00:28:25,640 --> 00:28:29,359
Speaker 2: I wasna that too? Is this the same It's the

602
00:28:29,400 --> 00:28:30,040
Speaker 2: same story.

603
00:28:30,080 --> 00:28:31,360
Speaker 5: Ope, again, I have.

604
00:28:31,359 --> 00:28:36,640
Speaker 2: Since been parentified and frequently covered food and miscellaneous miscellaneous expenses.

605
00:28:36,920 --> 00:28:40,040
Speaker 2: So I guess the main question is just like, yeah,

606
00:28:40,080 --> 00:28:42,480
Speaker 2: which is I'm assuming kind of difficulty A yeah.

607
00:28:42,560 --> 00:28:46,000
Speaker 3: I unfortunately can't really answer that because it is very

608
00:28:46,080 --> 00:28:50,360
Speaker 3: jurisdiction specific, and so I mean some jurisdictions like I'm

609
00:28:50,360 --> 00:28:53,480
Speaker 3: also licensed to practice in Texas spousal support which is

610
00:28:53,520 --> 00:28:56,720
Speaker 3: commonly referred to as alimony. You are allowed to get

611
00:28:56,800 --> 00:29:01,000
Speaker 3: some spousal support under very narrow circumstan answers in Texas,

612
00:29:01,280 --> 00:29:03,640
Speaker 3: but in California it's like, oh, we just give it out,

613
00:29:03,640 --> 00:29:06,040
Speaker 3: we make your rain on Spalsbrina. So I don't know

614
00:29:06,080 --> 00:29:08,239
Speaker 3: if they are jurisdictions and don't even allow it. So

615
00:29:08,520 --> 00:29:12,440
Speaker 3: in that scenario, that might be something to pursue if

616
00:29:12,480 --> 00:29:16,040
Speaker 3: that's available, But it sounds like custody and property division

617
00:29:16,080 --> 00:29:17,680
Speaker 3: are going to be the issues in that case at

618
00:29:17,680 --> 00:29:18,360
Speaker 3: the very least.

619
00:29:18,680 --> 00:29:21,680
Speaker 2: Yeah, absolutely, And also it doesn't seem like they've proceeded

620
00:29:21,680 --> 00:29:23,880
Speaker 2: with a divorce. Yeah.

621
00:29:23,920 --> 00:29:26,560
Speaker 3: Again, consult with the lawyer, find out what your rights are,

622
00:29:26,600 --> 00:29:29,640
Speaker 3: because that is really what makes you feel empowered and

623
00:29:30,640 --> 00:29:34,200
Speaker 3: demystifies the whole process because it's obviously super intimidating. Nobody

624
00:29:34,240 --> 00:29:37,040
Speaker 3: goes into a divorce knowing anything about divorce for the

625
00:29:37,040 --> 00:29:40,640
Speaker 3: most part, unless they're you know, revolving door second time around,

626
00:29:41,440 --> 00:29:42,320
Speaker 3: then they're experts.

627
00:29:43,920 --> 00:29:46,960
Speaker 2: Third question, just Shin asks if I got in a

628
00:29:47,000 --> 00:29:49,720
Speaker 2: relationship with someone with a pet and my pet bond

629
00:29:49,840 --> 00:29:52,800
Speaker 2: with them, do they get to stay together or they separated?

630
00:29:52,840 --> 00:29:55,720
Speaker 2: In the divorce context, my friend's Kat went into a

631
00:29:55,720 --> 00:29:58,720
Speaker 2: deep depression after she was separated from her ex partner's dog.

632
00:29:59,240 --> 00:30:01,520
Speaker 2: I heard the dog wasn't any better. Would that be

633
00:30:01,600 --> 00:30:04,240
Speaker 2: considered animal cruelty to keep them apart? Which I think

634
00:30:04,240 --> 00:30:07,480
Speaker 2: this question is what they talk about in legally.

635
00:30:07,160 --> 00:30:08,480
Speaker 5: Blot I object.

636
00:30:08,680 --> 00:30:11,280
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, I might have or might not have gone

637
00:30:11,320 --> 00:30:15,960
Speaker 3: to law school because of that movie I love. Yeah,

638
00:30:16,080 --> 00:30:19,800
Speaker 3: I couldn't answer that either. Sorry, I'm striking out here.

639
00:30:20,960 --> 00:30:22,040
Speaker 3: I'm not even a real lawyer.

640
00:30:22,160 --> 00:30:25,719
Speaker 2: Yeah, these are off the cups.

641
00:30:25,760 --> 00:30:28,080
Speaker 3: Well, I mean yeah, I mean I can answer questions

642
00:30:28,120 --> 00:30:31,080
Speaker 3: off the cuff. That one, again is sort of jurisdiction specific,

643
00:30:31,280 --> 00:30:33,280
Speaker 3: and I don't think I mean, I don't know anything

644
00:30:33,320 --> 00:30:37,440
Speaker 3: about animal emotional abuse, but I think ultimately that's in California,

645
00:30:37,480 --> 00:30:38,800
Speaker 3: animals are considered property.

646
00:30:38,800 --> 00:30:41,120
Speaker 2: I have to say, is this like a division of properties. Yeah,

647
00:30:41,160 --> 00:30:44,280
Speaker 2: it's like if it's something that you like, a pet,

648
00:30:44,280 --> 00:30:47,240
Speaker 2: that you acquired during the marriage, it would be considered

649
00:30:47,280 --> 00:30:49,600
Speaker 2: division of property in California.

650
00:30:49,200 --> 00:30:52,000
Speaker 3: Correct, because it would be considered community property, because California

651
00:30:52,040 --> 00:30:55,080
Speaker 3: is a community property state. I've had people do custody

652
00:30:55,160 --> 00:30:59,280
Speaker 3: arrangements around animals and agreements to pay for things. I mean,

653
00:30:59,440 --> 00:31:02,680
Speaker 3: enforceable is sort of a question mark on those, and

654
00:31:02,720 --> 00:31:05,680
Speaker 3: I always let people know. But if people want to

655
00:31:05,960 --> 00:31:07,920
Speaker 3: enter into some sort of written agreement and they want

656
00:31:07,920 --> 00:31:10,280
Speaker 3: to share custody of pets, you know, it always gets

657
00:31:10,320 --> 00:31:12,680
Speaker 3: sticky when there's a new significant other down the road

658
00:31:12,720 --> 00:31:15,160
Speaker 3: and you're still sharing custody of a dog or cat

659
00:31:15,160 --> 00:31:17,960
Speaker 3: with your ex. I find that usually that it sort

660
00:31:17,960 --> 00:31:20,320
Speaker 3: of peters out. I had a friend who was sharing

661
00:31:20,360 --> 00:31:22,880
Speaker 3: custody of a cat with her ex and he got

662
00:31:22,920 --> 00:31:25,959
Speaker 3: a new girlfriend and he stopped coming to visit, and

663
00:31:26,000 --> 00:31:27,800
Speaker 3: she said he's a deadbeat dad now.

664
00:31:28,400 --> 00:31:31,920
Speaker 2: So yeah, and eventually, yeah, it makes sense.

665
00:31:31,680 --> 00:31:32,200
Speaker 5: And he is.

666
00:31:36,200 --> 00:31:39,880
Speaker 2: I was going to ask in California, if like you

667
00:31:39,960 --> 00:31:43,280
Speaker 2: had two people who had both been taking care of pets,

668
00:31:43,360 --> 00:31:46,120
Speaker 2: but like maybe one person had gotten that pet prior

669
00:31:46,280 --> 00:31:49,440
Speaker 2: to the marriage, because there ways to say, like, well,

670
00:31:49,480 --> 00:31:51,600
Speaker 2: we both were taking care of it, so that we

671
00:31:51,680 --> 00:31:55,840
Speaker 2: both have like you know, ownership, you know thing or ownership.

672
00:31:55,960 --> 00:31:59,040
Speaker 3: No, because in California, if you acquire something prior to

673
00:31:59,080 --> 00:32:02,240
Speaker 3: the marriage a superate property, there are sort of exceptions

674
00:32:02,280 --> 00:32:04,280
Speaker 3: around it, like if payments are made on that pet,

675
00:32:04,320 --> 00:32:06,720
Speaker 3: like meaning yes, but you wouldn't be making payments on

676
00:32:06,760 --> 00:32:09,440
Speaker 3: a pet unless you purchase like one hundred thousand dollars

677
00:32:09,600 --> 00:32:13,600
Speaker 3: toy poodle from China and now you're making payments every

678
00:32:13,640 --> 00:32:16,720
Speaker 3: month for it. I don't know, but but yeah, it's

679
00:32:16,720 --> 00:32:18,880
Speaker 3: probably your separate property if you came into it with

680
00:32:18,880 --> 00:32:21,080
Speaker 3: the marriage. I mean, if you wanted to enter into

681
00:32:21,080 --> 00:32:23,720
Speaker 3: some agreement about sharing custody of the pet, you certainly

682
00:32:23,720 --> 00:32:24,240
Speaker 3: could do.

683
00:32:24,320 --> 00:32:29,480
Speaker 2: In California before marriage, it's that's yours. Yeah, during you'd

684
00:32:29,520 --> 00:32:30,520
Speaker 2: have to work out properly.

685
00:32:31,120 --> 00:32:33,640
Speaker 3: There are exceptions to that, but yes, generally speaking, yes,

686
00:32:33,640 --> 00:32:35,400
Speaker 3: it would be considered community property.

687
00:32:35,480 --> 00:32:37,240
Speaker 4: Yeah, and I think the person that just sent that

688
00:32:37,360 --> 00:32:39,800
Speaker 4: question is actually here right now, and she says she

689
00:32:39,920 --> 00:32:41,040
Speaker 4: is in La County.

690
00:32:41,400 --> 00:32:45,160
Speaker 3: Oh okay, that helps, so yeah, yeah. So I don't

691
00:32:45,200 --> 00:32:48,120
Speaker 3: know anything about whether that would be considered emotional abuse

692
00:32:48,160 --> 00:32:50,080
Speaker 3: to the pet. I don't think, well, I don't think

693
00:32:50,080 --> 00:32:52,520
Speaker 3: the family court would go there because there are really

694
00:32:52,600 --> 00:32:55,880
Speaker 3: no laws about the family court pairing about a doll.

695
00:32:56,480 --> 00:32:58,440
Speaker 3: I know, we think of our pets as children, but

696
00:32:58,520 --> 00:33:00,600
Speaker 3: it's not like the best interest of the dog or

697
00:33:00,640 --> 00:33:03,680
Speaker 3: the cat, right, It's just property in the eyes of

698
00:33:03,720 --> 00:33:06,280
Speaker 3: the court, and so you know, that would really be

699
00:33:06,400 --> 00:33:08,960
Speaker 3: up to two people. You can't cut a dog in half,

700
00:33:09,160 --> 00:33:15,280
Speaker 3: you know, It's not like the King Solomon's Yeah, yeah, yeah.

701
00:33:15,560 --> 00:33:17,400
Speaker 7: We had another question from one person.

702
00:33:17,680 --> 00:33:20,640
Speaker 2: Now I'm not married or getting divorced, but ask Sarah,

703
00:33:20,680 --> 00:33:23,440
Speaker 2: is there a way to una reverse the prenuptial agreement?

704
00:33:24,720 --> 00:33:28,440
Speaker 2: Interesting in California or in California. We'll go in California.

705
00:33:28,480 --> 00:33:32,760
Speaker 3: We're going California, all right, baby, We're going California. Okay, So, yes,

706
00:33:33,720 --> 00:33:38,040
Speaker 3: there is a way to set it aside, to challenge it.

707
00:33:38,880 --> 00:33:42,760
Speaker 3: Under very specific set of circumstances. There are a number

708
00:33:42,800 --> 00:33:45,440
Speaker 3: of criteria, but like, for example, if somebody was not

709
00:33:45,560 --> 00:33:49,400
Speaker 3: represented by council during the negotiation and at the time

710
00:33:49,440 --> 00:33:52,240
Speaker 3: of entry of prenup, if there wasn't sufficient time between

711
00:33:52,280 --> 00:33:56,080
Speaker 3: the signing and the marriage, if there wasn't sufficient financial

712
00:33:56,120 --> 00:34:00,640
Speaker 3: disclosure upon entering into it. So there are some that

713
00:34:00,840 --> 00:34:03,719
Speaker 3: potentially for setting it aside, but you would probably have

714
00:34:03,760 --> 00:34:05,840
Speaker 3: to have like a mini trial on that issue, sure,

715
00:34:06,480 --> 00:34:09,799
Speaker 3: and a judge would have to decide whether that criteria

716
00:34:09,880 --> 00:34:11,000
Speaker 3: of the Family Code is met.

717
00:34:11,680 --> 00:34:12,000
Speaker 2: Yeah.

718
00:34:12,080 --> 00:34:16,319
Speaker 4: Oh, and real quick, the Christian question was about the

719
00:34:16,320 --> 00:34:18,120
Speaker 4: deadbeat dad, not the pet.

720
00:34:18,520 --> 00:34:20,000
Speaker 7: If that changes anything.

721
00:34:20,080 --> 00:34:24,240
Speaker 2: I see saying that the question about can my mom

722
00:34:24,360 --> 00:34:26,439
Speaker 2: get like out the alimony question?

723
00:34:26,520 --> 00:34:33,120
Speaker 3: Car Oh, yes, yes, yes, so definitely spousal support is

724
00:34:33,400 --> 00:34:36,640
Speaker 3: a possibility in that one. You were saying that law, Yeah,

725
00:34:36,680 --> 00:34:41,040
Speaker 3: I mean it would depend on a number of financial factors.

726
00:34:41,400 --> 00:34:44,640
Speaker 3: I can't say in a vacuum without like seeing everybody's finances.

727
00:34:45,080 --> 00:34:48,280
Speaker 3: But yes, in Los Angeles, in California, you are able

728
00:34:48,320 --> 00:34:50,759
Speaker 3: to request spousal support, and so that would be an

729
00:34:50,800 --> 00:34:51,640
Speaker 3: option in that case.

730
00:34:51,880 --> 00:34:52,640
Speaker 7: Oh good, good.

731
00:34:53,080 --> 00:34:54,600
Speaker 2: And then some other questions.

732
00:34:54,920 --> 00:34:56,920
Speaker 7: Hey, y'all, it's John og Host here. We're gonna get

733
00:34:56,920 --> 00:34:57,480
Speaker 7: back to the stories.

734
00:34:57,480 --> 00:34:59,000
Speaker 1: But here's a quick three minute break from as for

735
00:34:59,040 --> 00:34:59,680
Speaker 1: more sponsors.

736
00:35:00,200 --> 00:35:03,239
Speaker 2: What's the most outrageous reason someone filed for divorce? Which

737
00:35:03,360 --> 00:35:06,200
Speaker 2: you said that you had a story.

738
00:35:05,880 --> 00:35:07,160
Speaker 5: I got a doozy for everyone.

739
00:35:07,520 --> 00:35:11,600
Speaker 3: So I represented a client after they had a child,

740
00:35:11,760 --> 00:35:14,919
Speaker 3: their kind of marriage was on the fritz. They were

741
00:35:14,920 --> 00:35:19,439
Speaker 3: not necessarily feeling very attracted to one another anymore, and

742
00:35:19,520 --> 00:35:23,799
Speaker 3: so they decided to bring in a third And we

743
00:35:23,920 --> 00:35:28,200
Speaker 3: read so many story yes, yes, yes, So they decided

744
00:35:28,239 --> 00:35:31,800
Speaker 3: to do that, and they had this whole packed around

745
00:35:31,840 --> 00:35:34,400
Speaker 3: it that they were only going to do this like

746
00:35:34,480 --> 00:35:37,440
Speaker 3: this one time, and if they did it again, it

747
00:35:37,520 --> 00:35:40,200
Speaker 3: was only by agreement that they would both be there.

748
00:35:40,640 --> 00:35:42,360
Speaker 5: So anyway, the wife goes out.

749
00:35:42,239 --> 00:35:48,360
Speaker 3: Of town and the husband brings this third, the third

750
00:35:49,200 --> 00:35:52,600
Speaker 3: over for a little rendezvous. I'm assuming it wasn't just

751
00:35:52,680 --> 00:35:58,400
Speaker 3: for you know, coffee, and it was.

752
00:35:58,800 --> 00:36:00,600
Speaker 5: But what's great is.

753
00:36:00,560 --> 00:36:03,839
Speaker 3: That the wife saw them coming in on the security

754
00:36:03,880 --> 00:36:07,520
Speaker 3: cameras and there's you know, the audio that you can

755
00:36:07,640 --> 00:36:11,040
Speaker 3: like on the ring camera. They like busted right, So

756
00:36:11,239 --> 00:36:12,720
Speaker 3: like she did.

757
00:36:12,560 --> 00:36:15,360
Speaker 2: That, Oh just like in the panic room exactly.

758
00:36:15,960 --> 00:36:18,479
Speaker 3: So yeah, just like in the panic room. I think

759
00:36:18,560 --> 00:36:20,320
Speaker 3: they might have had a little bit too much wine.

760
00:36:20,400 --> 00:36:23,680
Speaker 3: They were coming back, you know, he wasn't thinking.

761
00:36:24,200 --> 00:36:25,640
Speaker 5: So that's why they got divorced.

762
00:36:26,000 --> 00:36:27,320
Speaker 7: Oh gosh.

763
00:36:27,400 --> 00:36:30,200
Speaker 4: Yeah, we read about these like here and there, but

764
00:36:30,280 --> 00:36:32,000
Speaker 4: like actually seeing it happen.

765
00:36:32,120 --> 00:36:35,600
Speaker 7: Yeah, Oh my gosh. It was awkward in the room knowing, like.

766
00:36:35,719 --> 00:36:37,919
Speaker 3: Oh, I knew so many details. You guys, I'm leaving

767
00:36:37,960 --> 00:36:41,319
Speaker 3: so many details out, you can't. I just don't want

768
00:36:41,360 --> 00:36:44,920
Speaker 3: it to be so specific that it's somebody, Wait, wasn't

769
00:36:44,920 --> 00:36:49,000
Speaker 3: this Yeah yeah, so I'm just kind of like saying

770
00:36:49,000 --> 00:36:52,600
Speaker 3: it very generally here, but yeah, there were like I

771
00:36:52,600 --> 00:36:54,920
Speaker 3: wish I could get into the just use your imagining.

772
00:36:55,160 --> 00:36:57,839
Speaker 2: Yeah, we've read some stories like that, so I can

773
00:36:58,120 --> 00:37:00,759
Speaker 2: oh yeah, yeah, no, that's kind of a crazy that

774
00:37:00,880 --> 00:37:02,000
Speaker 2: you literally have one rule.

775
00:37:02,480 --> 00:37:05,000
Speaker 5: But hey, the cool thing is it was nobody's cousin.

776
00:37:05,320 --> 00:37:08,680
Speaker 2: That's and every day I'm thankful for that. We read

777
00:37:08,680 --> 00:37:10,920
Speaker 2: a lot of stories and every day I go, yeah,

778
00:37:10,960 --> 00:37:14,160
Speaker 2: she cheated, but yeah, not with her cousin. Have you

779
00:37:14,280 --> 00:37:17,080
Speaker 2: managed several divorce cases from the same person, If so,

780
00:37:17,239 --> 00:37:18,680
Speaker 2: why did they divorce so much?

781
00:37:19,239 --> 00:37:19,840
Speaker 5: I haven't.

782
00:37:20,360 --> 00:37:23,560
Speaker 3: I've seen people get prenups and then eventually go on

783
00:37:23,680 --> 00:37:26,360
Speaker 3: to divorce and have to invoke use of the prenup.

784
00:37:26,400 --> 00:37:30,719
Speaker 3: But I've not actually represented somebody. I'm just so good

785
00:37:30,760 --> 00:37:34,279
Speaker 3: at giving relationship advice that if somebody comes to me

786
00:37:34,400 --> 00:37:36,319
Speaker 3: and they go on to remarry.

787
00:37:35,880 --> 00:37:36,960
Speaker 2: Their marriage will be perfect.

788
00:37:37,000 --> 00:37:40,240
Speaker 3: It'll be perfect, which is crazy because there's a super

789
00:37:40,280 --> 00:37:43,880
Speaker 3: interesting statistic which is that forty percent of first marriages

790
00:37:44,200 --> 00:37:47,760
Speaker 3: fail in the United States, sixty percent of second marriages

791
00:37:47,760 --> 00:37:52,279
Speaker 3: fail it's like approximately, and seventy plus percent of third

792
00:37:52,280 --> 00:37:52,879
Speaker 3: marriages fail.

793
00:37:52,920 --> 00:37:53,880
Speaker 5: So the average.

794
00:37:54,080 --> 00:37:57,400
Speaker 2: So the more marriages you did, the worst.

795
00:37:57,120 --> 00:37:57,799
Speaker 5: Your odds are.

796
00:37:57,960 --> 00:38:00,399
Speaker 3: And the crazy thing is that, you know, when they

797
00:38:00,400 --> 00:38:02,880
Speaker 3: say like fifty percent of marriages and in divorce in

798
00:38:02,880 --> 00:38:05,480
Speaker 3: the United States, it's the reason that the average is

799
00:38:05,480 --> 00:38:08,560
Speaker 3: fifty percent is because that seventy percent figure is bringing

800
00:38:08,640 --> 00:38:11,440
Speaker 3: it down to fifty because it's forty percent of first

801
00:38:11,440 --> 00:38:12,640
Speaker 3: marriages approximately.

802
00:38:12,760 --> 00:38:15,560
Speaker 2: Okay, that's good news, I mean about the first marriages.

803
00:38:15,719 --> 00:38:18,720
Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, it's not as bleak as it sounds. Fifty percent.

804
00:38:18,800 --> 00:38:20,360
Speaker 5: It says half, not half.

805
00:38:20,760 --> 00:38:23,120
Speaker 3: You have a better odds of succeeding than it failing

806
00:38:23,160 --> 00:38:24,200
Speaker 3: at your first marriage.

807
00:38:24,239 --> 00:38:25,360
Speaker 5: Okay, all right.

808
00:38:25,239 --> 00:38:28,000
Speaker 4: Yeah, I'm like, you know, in the thoughts of maybe

809
00:38:28,200 --> 00:38:31,319
Speaker 4: getting married one day to a special lady, would you

810
00:38:31,400 --> 00:38:33,440
Speaker 4: say I should look into getting a prenup? Just you know,

811
00:38:33,520 --> 00:38:35,040
Speaker 4: even though I'm like one hundred percent it's going.

812
00:38:35,040 --> 00:38:35,680
Speaker 7: To be a okay.

813
00:38:36,000 --> 00:38:38,520
Speaker 3: In terms of should you get a prenup, it's like

814
00:38:38,600 --> 00:38:40,799
Speaker 3: the million dollar question because I think there are pros

815
00:38:40,840 --> 00:38:44,440
Speaker 3: and cons to prenups. I think obviously, legally it can

816
00:38:44,560 --> 00:38:48,040
Speaker 3: offer some protection if you have assets. If you don't

817
00:38:48,040 --> 00:38:49,120
Speaker 3: have anything, there's not.

818
00:38:49,120 --> 00:38:49,840
Speaker 5: Really a point.

819
00:38:50,280 --> 00:38:52,840
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's like what are you trying to preside?

820
00:38:53,680 --> 00:38:56,239
Speaker 3: But I think that you know, if you have considerable

821
00:38:56,280 --> 00:38:58,440
Speaker 3: assets and both of you are going into the marriage

822
00:38:58,480 --> 00:39:01,160
Speaker 3: or one or there's a gross toy, like one person

823
00:39:01,239 --> 00:39:03,960
Speaker 3: has really sizeable assets and the other has nothing, so

824
00:39:04,160 --> 00:39:07,440
Speaker 3: there could be some protection that it could offer. However,

825
00:39:07,600 --> 00:39:12,040
Speaker 3: there's this like overarching consideration with prenups that I think

826
00:39:12,239 --> 00:39:14,920
Speaker 3: people don't necessarily think about so much, and that is

827
00:39:15,120 --> 00:39:16,120
Speaker 3: that when.

828
00:39:16,040 --> 00:39:18,680
Speaker 5: You ask your future spouse for a.

829
00:39:18,600 --> 00:39:22,040
Speaker 3: Prenup, you are telling them I'm not sure this marriage

830
00:39:22,120 --> 00:39:22,759
Speaker 3: is going to work out.

831
00:39:22,960 --> 00:39:26,440
Speaker 5: Yeah, and are you okay sending that message?

832
00:39:26,480 --> 00:39:30,480
Speaker 3: Because if you're not, then you know, there's a lot

833
00:39:30,480 --> 00:39:33,319
Speaker 3: of backlash when people ask for a prenup. They think, oh,

834
00:39:34,280 --> 00:39:36,000
Speaker 3: you know what you think we're going to get a divorce,

835
00:39:36,040 --> 00:39:38,200
Speaker 3: our marriage isn't going to work out, or they think,

836
00:39:38,480 --> 00:39:40,120
Speaker 3: what you think if we get divorced, I'm going to

837
00:39:40,200 --> 00:39:40,960
Speaker 3: take you to the cleaners.

838
00:39:40,960 --> 00:39:41,840
Speaker 5: You don't trust me.

839
00:39:42,239 --> 00:39:43,880
Speaker 2: I think it's a super taboo question.

840
00:39:43,800 --> 00:39:46,239
Speaker 5: And so I think it does sour the relationship.

841
00:39:46,280 --> 00:39:49,600
Speaker 3: And I think that even if somebody does begrudgingly ultimately

842
00:39:49,800 --> 00:39:52,280
Speaker 3: enter into a prenup where they have that bad taste

843
00:39:52,280 --> 00:39:53,919
Speaker 3: in their mouth from being asked.

844
00:39:53,640 --> 00:39:57,120
Speaker 5: Yeah, I think that that is always there.

845
00:39:57,200 --> 00:40:00,839
Speaker 3: There's always this nagging sort of like question of like

846
00:40:01,000 --> 00:40:03,319
Speaker 3: do you think I'm just this gold digger? Do you

847
00:40:03,360 --> 00:40:06,480
Speaker 3: think I'm just you know, because it's it's oftentimes men

848
00:40:06,520 --> 00:40:08,480
Speaker 3: who are asking women. I mean that's not always the case.

849
00:40:08,480 --> 00:40:10,759
Speaker 3: I've seen it the other way around, but ultimately it

850
00:40:10,800 --> 00:40:13,200
Speaker 3: is like you think this marriage is going to fail?

851
00:40:13,360 --> 00:40:15,399
Speaker 3: Like is this not till death do us part?

852
00:40:15,480 --> 00:40:15,600
Speaker 6: Like?

853
00:40:15,719 --> 00:40:18,360
Speaker 3: Is this just something that on a whim if we

854
00:40:18,400 --> 00:40:21,280
Speaker 3: feel like it doesn't work out, we can just invoker

855
00:40:21,440 --> 00:40:23,799
Speaker 3: prenup and kudus of ours. So I think that the

856
00:40:23,880 --> 00:40:27,920
Speaker 3: considerations for premup have to really go well beyond just

857
00:40:27,960 --> 00:40:30,600
Speaker 3: the financial is it worth it? There is a way

858
00:40:30,640 --> 00:40:33,640
Speaker 3: of keeping and this is again I'm talking about California. Yeah,

859
00:40:33,680 --> 00:40:36,719
Speaker 3: there is a way of keeping records of what you

860
00:40:36,800 --> 00:40:39,400
Speaker 3: come into the marriage with and as long as you

861
00:40:39,480 --> 00:40:44,000
Speaker 3: erase that and you keep a very very careful record

862
00:40:44,000 --> 00:40:46,200
Speaker 3: of everything. Like if you buy a house, you own

863
00:40:46,200 --> 00:40:48,719
Speaker 3: a house before you get married, and then that house

864
00:40:48,840 --> 00:40:50,960
Speaker 3: is sold during the marriage, and that money is used

865
00:40:51,000 --> 00:40:52,560
Speaker 3: to make a down payment on a new house that's

866
00:40:52,600 --> 00:40:56,359
Speaker 3: now a community property house in California, and then that

867
00:40:56,440 --> 00:40:58,560
Speaker 3: house is sold and that money is now really co

868
00:40:58,719 --> 00:41:00,640
Speaker 3: mingled and that's used to make it down payment on

869
00:41:00,680 --> 00:41:03,719
Speaker 3: another house. Then you know, again, if you trace that

870
00:41:03,840 --> 00:41:06,919
Speaker 3: all along the way, you have good records, you can

871
00:41:06,960 --> 00:41:09,759
Speaker 3: probably trace it back to your separate property and in

872
00:41:09,840 --> 00:41:12,880
Speaker 3: the divorce hopefully get some sort of reimforson you know.

873
00:41:12,920 --> 00:41:15,399
Speaker 3: But there are other things like spousal support and other

874
00:41:15,520 --> 00:41:18,879
Speaker 3: considerations and things like that that you that go into

875
00:41:18,920 --> 00:41:21,920
Speaker 3: a prenup. So it's it's complicated. I think that question

876
00:41:22,120 --> 00:41:24,680
Speaker 3: is not black and white if you want to answer.

877
00:41:24,719 --> 00:41:26,759
Speaker 3: It's so nuanced and it's so personal.

878
00:41:26,920 --> 00:41:28,799
Speaker 4: Yeah, I think I'm gonna be like, well, I don't

879
00:41:28,840 --> 00:41:31,359
Speaker 4: want the government to tell me how to split my

880
00:41:31,440 --> 00:41:34,400
Speaker 4: assets up, so I'm gonna just get a prenup.

881
00:41:34,480 --> 00:41:35,600
Speaker 2: You're gonna go even more.

882
00:41:36,640 --> 00:41:41,760
Speaker 3: You get none of my one dollar yeah.

883
00:41:40,800 --> 00:41:42,200
Speaker 7: None of my silver coins.

884
00:41:43,960 --> 00:41:45,360
Speaker 2: I'm bearing all my goals.

885
00:41:45,680 --> 00:41:47,000
Speaker 5: My Xbox is coming with me.

886
00:41:47,080 --> 00:41:47,239
Speaker 6: Man.

887
00:41:48,880 --> 00:41:51,120
Speaker 2: So what are the most common reasons that people get divorced?

888
00:41:51,320 --> 00:41:54,560
Speaker 3: Okay, so statistically I read the statistic There was a

889
00:41:54,600 --> 00:41:58,479
Speaker 3: study and the number one reason, the majority that most

890
00:41:58,480 --> 00:42:02,319
Speaker 3: marriages end is that people they've lost a connection, like

891
00:42:02,360 --> 00:42:05,640
Speaker 3: there's no more connection. I don't necessarily find that to

892
00:42:05,680 --> 00:42:07,080
Speaker 3: be true in my practice.

893
00:42:07,360 --> 00:42:09,360
Speaker 5: I think ultimately it's.

894
00:42:09,200 --> 00:42:14,480
Speaker 3: Like resentment, deep resentment, and not communicating effectively. I mean, actually,

895
00:42:14,480 --> 00:42:16,440
Speaker 3: in my book, I really go into the reasons that

896
00:42:16,520 --> 00:42:20,360
Speaker 3: I think all marriages fail. Statistically, according to the studies,

897
00:42:20,440 --> 00:42:24,040
Speaker 3: the second most common reason is infidelity.

898
00:42:23,520 --> 00:42:25,960
Speaker 2: Yes, which we read a lot of stories about.

899
00:42:26,400 --> 00:42:26,720
Speaker 5: Yeah.

900
00:42:26,800 --> 00:42:29,960
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's the most fun one. But not fun obviously,

901
00:42:30,200 --> 00:42:34,520
Speaker 3: but not for the people being right right. I think

902
00:42:34,920 --> 00:42:38,080
Speaker 3: personally that the biggest reason that relationships fail and do

903
00:42:38,160 --> 00:42:41,040
Speaker 3: not work out is because people don't share fundamental value.

904
00:42:41,320 --> 00:42:42,960
Speaker 3: And I'm not talking about like, oh my god, we

905
00:42:42,960 --> 00:42:45,880
Speaker 3: both love yoga and kombucha, you know, I'm talking about

906
00:42:45,920 --> 00:42:50,319
Speaker 3: like the moral compass, Like what you fundamentally value in

907
00:42:50,360 --> 00:42:52,520
Speaker 3: like what you want your life to look like, what

908
00:42:52,640 --> 00:42:54,359
Speaker 3: is important to you in your life, how you want

909
00:42:54,400 --> 00:42:56,439
Speaker 3: to raise your children, things like that, and they take

910
00:42:56,680 --> 00:43:01,080
Speaker 3: they're so preoccupied with the physical attraction and or these

911
00:43:01,120 --> 00:43:03,799
Speaker 3: superficial interests, and all of those things are good and

912
00:43:03,840 --> 00:43:08,160
Speaker 3: fine when you're dating and everything's fun and why Yeah,

913
00:43:08,200 --> 00:43:11,920
Speaker 3: and ultimately, when you're in a real relationship and stuff

914
00:43:11,960 --> 00:43:14,120
Speaker 3: gets real and you have children and you have to

915
00:43:14,239 --> 00:43:18,640
Speaker 3: raise them together, and those little children are trying to

916
00:43:18,880 --> 00:43:22,000
Speaker 3: just care every part of you limb from them, like

917
00:43:22,560 --> 00:43:24,520
Speaker 3: in one of those like zombie movies, you know, like

918
00:43:24,600 --> 00:43:25,600
Speaker 3: being like dismembered.

919
00:43:26,040 --> 00:43:27,960
Speaker 5: Because I can speak from experience.

920
00:43:28,160 --> 00:43:33,239
Speaker 3: Yeah, no, I love my kids, but yeah, I think

921
00:43:33,280 --> 00:43:35,480
Speaker 3: that if people don't seek to navigate life in a

922
00:43:35,520 --> 00:43:38,000
Speaker 3: similar way, they're not going to navigate life in a

923
00:43:38,000 --> 00:43:38,560
Speaker 3: similar way.

924
00:43:38,600 --> 00:43:39,920
Speaker 5: It's it's pretty simplistic.

925
00:43:40,080 --> 00:43:43,160
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, in your experience, What are the biggest differences

926
00:43:43,160 --> 00:43:45,280
Speaker 2: on why a man and a woman decide to get divorce?

927
00:43:45,600 --> 00:43:47,400
Speaker 3: You know, I think it's similar. I think it plays

928
00:43:47,400 --> 00:43:50,400
Speaker 3: out differently. I think both feel like their emotional needs

929
00:43:50,440 --> 00:43:52,520
Speaker 3: are not being met, but I think in a very

930
00:43:52,560 --> 00:43:56,440
Speaker 3: different way. Sure, And I'm making gross generalizations now, but

931
00:43:56,480 --> 00:43:59,839
Speaker 3: I think men need to feel wanted and needed and

932
00:44:00,000 --> 00:44:03,319
Speaker 3: and they need to feel like they're contributing. And I

933
00:44:03,360 --> 00:44:07,040
Speaker 3: feel like oftentimes when women have kids, and rightfully so,

934
00:44:07,200 --> 00:44:09,359
Speaker 3: they have to keep their child alive, right so they're

935
00:44:09,360 --> 00:44:12,680
Speaker 3: placing all of their attention on keeping this child alive.

936
00:44:12,880 --> 00:44:17,480
Speaker 3: And there's they're biological reasons for that. Women's brains actually change,

937
00:44:17,560 --> 00:44:21,200
Speaker 3: like the structure sites called neuroplasticity when they have children.

938
00:44:21,320 --> 00:44:25,640
Speaker 3: So a lot of men in those heterosexual relationships feel

939
00:44:25,760 --> 00:44:29,880
Speaker 3: very marginalized. They don't feel attractive anymore, and then women

940
00:44:30,200 --> 00:44:35,040
Speaker 3: feel like their partner isn't fulfilling their emotional needs. I

941
00:44:35,080 --> 00:44:38,640
Speaker 3: would say it's kind of a dance almost in a way.

942
00:44:38,680 --> 00:44:41,920
Speaker 3: It's like, Okay, a man feels marginalized, he feels like

943
00:44:41,920 --> 00:44:45,320
Speaker 3: maybe he's not needed, he's been replaced, so he starts

944
00:44:45,320 --> 00:44:48,160
Speaker 3: to withdraw and retreat, and the woman feels like, oh,

945
00:44:48,360 --> 00:44:51,319
Speaker 3: the man's not attracted to me anymore, or he's not

946
00:44:51,600 --> 00:44:55,680
Speaker 3: giving me the emotional connection that I need at this moment,

947
00:44:55,760 --> 00:44:58,359
Speaker 3: so she retreats. Yeah, and now they're both retreating from

948
00:44:58,440 --> 00:45:01,319
Speaker 3: each other and they're leading kind of parallel lives. And

949
00:45:01,360 --> 00:45:04,759
Speaker 3: then they dance around the children instead of actually connecting

950
00:45:04,800 --> 00:45:08,560
Speaker 3: and having that intimacy and communicating and all these things.

951
00:45:08,600 --> 00:45:11,200
Speaker 5: So great answer, Thanks.

952
00:45:11,400 --> 00:45:13,839
Speaker 2: But uh, we got another story, all right, I'll hear it.

953
00:45:14,200 --> 00:45:15,880
Speaker 1: Hey, it's Sam. We're gonna get back to the stories.

954
00:45:15,880 --> 00:45:17,919
Speaker 1: But here's three minutes of bads from our sponsors.

955
00:45:18,520 --> 00:45:20,640
Speaker 2: I need to divorce, but I don't want to leave

956
00:45:20,640 --> 00:45:26,560
Speaker 2: my wife homeless. To sum up what's happening, I'm moving

957
00:45:26,640 --> 00:45:30,040
Speaker 2: towards divorcing my wife. Let's call her Susan, whom I've

958
00:45:30,080 --> 00:45:34,319
Speaker 2: been with for seventeen years, since I was eighteen years old.

959
00:45:34,719 --> 00:45:37,160
Speaker 2: The simple truth is that Susan and I don't have

960
00:45:37,200 --> 00:45:39,920
Speaker 2: a partnership. It's not just that she hasn't had a

961
00:45:40,000 --> 00:45:43,600
Speaker 2: job since twenty thirteen. She doesn't do anything to contribute

962
00:45:43,640 --> 00:45:46,480
Speaker 2: to our relationship. By the way, this comes from ghost Turtles,

963
00:45:46,520 --> 00:45:47,920
Speaker 2: and if you want to spend your own stories, go

964
00:45:47,960 --> 00:45:50,960
Speaker 2: to the r slash. Okay, storytime suppered it and our.

965
00:45:50,840 --> 00:45:53,920
Speaker 7: Co host with us right now is Sarah.

966
00:45:53,560 --> 00:45:56,640
Speaker 2: Yes Hi, and she's gonna be helping out with these

967
00:45:56,680 --> 00:45:59,719
Speaker 2: stories today. I am the sole breadwinner. I take care

968
00:45:59,760 --> 00:46:04,200
Speaker 2: of our finances, get groceries, clean the house everything. She

969
00:46:04,239 --> 00:46:06,640
Speaker 2: doesn't have any friends either because she doesn't make the

970
00:46:06,680 --> 00:46:09,440
Speaker 2: effort to make them. I actually have to introduce her

971
00:46:09,480 --> 00:46:12,279
Speaker 2: to people from my life, then politely hint that she

972
00:46:12,320 --> 00:46:16,000
Speaker 2: should keep in touch. Hey, how's Jen doing? Maybe you

973
00:46:16,040 --> 00:46:21,360
Speaker 2: should Texter. Even then, the relationships always wither. In twenty seventeen,

974
00:46:21,520 --> 00:46:26,160
Speaker 2: after years of soul searching, I asked Susan Ford divorce.

975
00:46:26,760 --> 00:46:30,040
Speaker 2: She was so devastated that I reluctantly agreed to try

976
00:46:30,080 --> 00:46:34,160
Speaker 2: marriage counseling. It seemed to finally help. She began applying

977
00:46:34,200 --> 00:46:36,319
Speaker 2: for jobs and was open to therapy on her own,

978
00:46:36,360 --> 00:46:39,279
Speaker 2: which I arranged and drove her to because she refuses

979
00:46:39,360 --> 00:46:43,200
Speaker 2: to drive. But once the immediate danger of divorce no

980
00:46:43,280 --> 00:46:46,760
Speaker 2: longer hung over our marriage, she reverted to her old ways.

981
00:46:47,200 --> 00:46:49,759
Speaker 2: It's become a predictable pattern. When I ask why she

982
00:46:49,800 --> 00:46:52,560
Speaker 2: won't apply for jobs, she says she doesn't know I

983
00:46:52,560 --> 00:46:55,439
Speaker 2: have to like them and claims she's interested in something

984
00:46:55,480 --> 00:46:58,800
Speaker 2: else now. So I pay thousands of dollars for training

985
00:46:59,360 --> 00:47:01,759
Speaker 2: or classes in the new thing, and after a few

986
00:47:01,800 --> 00:47:06,040
Speaker 2: months she quits. When I express my frustration, she cries

987
00:47:06,120 --> 00:47:08,440
Speaker 2: and says I make her feel like she can't do

988
00:47:08,600 --> 00:47:13,919
Speaker 2: anything right, consciously or not. This is extremely manipulative, and

989
00:47:14,000 --> 00:47:16,880
Speaker 2: it makes me feel like the bad guy, and she

990
00:47:16,960 --> 00:47:20,399
Speaker 2: avoids taking any responsibility. So even if she did get

991
00:47:20,400 --> 00:47:22,960
Speaker 2: a job, it wouldn't really change things for me. I

992
00:47:23,000 --> 00:47:27,960
Speaker 2: have seventeen years of evidence showing that she won't truly change.

993
00:47:28,480 --> 00:47:31,239
Speaker 2: I just don't trust her or respect her anymore. I

994
00:47:31,239 --> 00:47:33,760
Speaker 2: don't think she's being malicious, but it almost doesn't matter.

995
00:47:34,239 --> 00:47:37,240
Speaker 2: We don't have children, and I want to have children

996
00:47:37,400 --> 00:47:40,920
Speaker 2: so desperately, but I can't have them with her. Although

997
00:47:40,960 --> 00:47:43,360
Speaker 2: this weekend she said she wants to go to grad school,

998
00:47:43,440 --> 00:47:45,759
Speaker 2: she also occasionally says she doesn't want to get a

999
00:47:45,840 --> 00:47:48,040
Speaker 2: job because she wants to be a mom, But I

1000
00:47:48,080 --> 00:47:50,839
Speaker 2: cannot do that to a child. I don't know if

1001
00:47:50,880 --> 00:47:53,680
Speaker 2: Susan has any insight into why. It's so clear to

1002
00:47:53,719 --> 00:47:57,879
Speaker 2: me that she couldn't handle motherhood. It's painful. I love her,

1003
00:47:58,080 --> 00:48:02,040
Speaker 2: but I've given her so much support and so many chances,

1004
00:48:02,080 --> 00:48:04,560
Speaker 2: and I can't have the life I want if I

1005
00:48:04,600 --> 00:48:07,240
Speaker 2: stay in this marriage. I hope this doesn't sound arrogant,

1006
00:48:07,239 --> 00:48:10,440
Speaker 2: but I feel like I am an extraordinary husband and

1007
00:48:10,480 --> 00:48:13,279
Speaker 2: she isn't grateful for anything I do. Or probably have

1008
00:48:13,320 --> 00:48:16,520
Speaker 2: to pay her some sort of spousal support, perhaps indefinitely,

1009
00:48:16,880 --> 00:48:18,680
Speaker 2: but I'm more than willing to do that if I

1010
00:48:18,719 --> 00:48:20,440
Speaker 2: can have a chance at the life I want.

1011
00:48:20,560 --> 00:48:23,239
Speaker 7: I would really like to see her side of.

1012
00:48:23,200 --> 00:48:26,120
Speaker 4: Things, because it feels like we're just getting one side

1013
00:48:26,120 --> 00:48:28,800
Speaker 4: of things and it might be all true, but I

1014
00:48:28,800 --> 00:48:31,080
Speaker 4: don't know. I'm getting a little bit of an unreliable

1015
00:48:31,239 --> 00:48:32,000
Speaker 4: narrator here.

1016
00:48:32,160 --> 00:48:34,560
Speaker 2: I just a little bit had a question for you

1017
00:48:34,600 --> 00:48:38,240
Speaker 2: because they said they have been together since they were eighteen. Yeah,

1018
00:48:38,320 --> 00:48:40,279
Speaker 2: so I was kind of wondering how many in your

1019
00:48:40,320 --> 00:48:45,040
Speaker 2: experience marriages where people have gone together at eighteen or

1020
00:48:45,200 --> 00:48:46,280
Speaker 2: gotten married at eighteen.

1021
00:48:47,000 --> 00:48:50,680
Speaker 3: Last my own didn't. We didn't get married at eighteen.

1022
00:48:50,880 --> 00:48:52,960
Speaker 3: I mean, I'm remarried now, but I met my ex

1023
00:48:53,000 --> 00:48:55,399
Speaker 3: husband when I was seventeen and then we ended up

1024
00:48:55,680 --> 00:48:57,719
Speaker 3: getting married whenst twenty six and divorced when I was

1025
00:48:57,719 --> 00:49:01,120
Speaker 3: twenty seven. So yeah, I think that it's hard to

1026
00:49:01,160 --> 00:49:03,120
Speaker 3: say because back in the day, I feel like people

1027
00:49:03,200 --> 00:49:05,239
Speaker 3: got married younger, and I think in certain parts of

1028
00:49:05,280 --> 00:49:07,279
Speaker 3: the country it's like you go to college and you

1029
00:49:07,320 --> 00:49:10,040
Speaker 3: just get married and it's more prevalent. I also think

1030
00:49:10,080 --> 00:49:12,040
Speaker 3: it's a lot more prevalent for people to get married

1031
00:49:12,080 --> 00:49:12,680
Speaker 3: later in life.

1032
00:49:12,760 --> 00:49:13,400
Speaker 5: Nowadays.

1033
00:49:13,480 --> 00:49:15,920
Speaker 3: So I don't think the fact that people got together

1034
00:49:16,480 --> 00:49:20,439
Speaker 3: so young is necessarily indicative of whether the relationship will.

1035
00:49:20,360 --> 00:49:23,040
Speaker 5: Succeed or not. But I do see a lot.

1036
00:49:22,920 --> 00:49:26,600
Speaker 3: Of people whose marriages do end because they got together

1037
00:49:26,680 --> 00:49:28,879
Speaker 3: so young, because you don't even know who you are

1038
00:49:29,000 --> 00:49:30,120
Speaker 3: really at that age.

1039
00:49:29,920 --> 00:49:32,120
Speaker 2: Which feels like that's kind of the issue with her.

1040
00:49:32,239 --> 00:49:33,960
Speaker 2: It feels like she doesn't know who she is and

1041
00:49:34,000 --> 00:49:36,839
Speaker 2: she's stuck in this kind of purgatory of being like,

1042
00:49:36,840 --> 00:49:37,560
Speaker 2: I don't know what I want.

1043
00:49:37,880 --> 00:49:42,759
Speaker 3: I mean, assuming Riley's cynical viewpoint aside, let's just take

1044
00:49:42,800 --> 00:49:45,520
Speaker 3: the story at face value. I assume that he is

1045
00:49:45,760 --> 00:49:48,960
Speaker 3: telling his story and it's correct. You know, I think

1046
00:49:49,040 --> 00:49:53,400
Speaker 3: that people do outgrow relationships, and I think that you

1047
00:49:53,560 --> 00:49:56,440
Speaker 3: do owe it to yourself to be in a fulfilling

1048
00:49:56,480 --> 00:49:59,920
Speaker 3: relationship and have a good life. And if he doesn't

1049
00:50:00,080 --> 00:50:02,920
Speaker 3: feel like he is, you know, he wants to have children,

1050
00:50:02,960 --> 00:50:05,480
Speaker 3: he doesn't want to any tap them with her, whatever

1051
00:50:05,600 --> 00:50:09,440
Speaker 3: her side of the story is, if that's how he feels, ultimately,

1052
00:50:10,040 --> 00:50:12,759
Speaker 3: then you have to trust the person you're with. You

1053
00:50:12,880 --> 00:50:15,400
Speaker 3: have to be a team, you have to have a partnership,

1054
00:50:15,440 --> 00:50:17,880
Speaker 3: and all of these things that he's saying, are like

1055
00:50:17,960 --> 00:50:20,719
Speaker 3: major buzzwords for me that sound like it's not a

1056
00:50:20,760 --> 00:50:25,359
Speaker 3: healthy relationship and that it's not right for him. If

1057
00:50:25,360 --> 00:50:27,480
Speaker 3: that's how he feels. That doesn't mean that what he's

1058
00:50:27,480 --> 00:50:30,160
Speaker 3: saying about her is necessarily true. But if he feels

1059
00:50:30,200 --> 00:50:32,719
Speaker 3: that way save to him, then it's his truth and

1060
00:50:32,920 --> 00:50:34,280
Speaker 3: he needs to honor his truth.

1061
00:50:34,680 --> 00:50:37,600
Speaker 2: I agree. I think just like him saying, I don't

1062
00:50:37,640 --> 00:50:40,200
Speaker 2: I want children and I don't trust her to have

1063
00:50:40,320 --> 00:50:41,000
Speaker 2: children with her.

1064
00:50:41,200 --> 00:50:44,400
Speaker 3: Yeah, well you can't, ding, ding ding, You have your answer.

1065
00:50:44,600 --> 00:50:47,279
Speaker 2: Oh, he continues, I'm just so afraid of hurting her.

1066
00:50:47,440 --> 00:50:49,600
Speaker 2: I know logically that it's not my job to live

1067
00:50:49,600 --> 00:50:52,640
Speaker 2: in misery to avoid hurting her feelings, and yet I'm

1068
00:50:52,840 --> 00:50:55,960
Speaker 2: terrified that she'll forever be haunted by the breakdown of

1069
00:50:56,000 --> 00:50:59,200
Speaker 2: the only relationship she's ever had. How do I do this?

1070
00:50:59,480 --> 00:51:02,319
Speaker 2: What should I do? I'm lost and in so much pain.

1071
00:51:02,840 --> 00:51:05,719
Speaker 2: Thank you for your time and note. I imagine people

1072
00:51:05,800 --> 00:51:08,759
Speaker 2: will say Susan is depressed. That may be true, but

1073
00:51:08,840 --> 00:51:11,040
Speaker 2: she doesn't think so. I mean, I think a lot

1074
00:51:11,080 --> 00:51:12,839
Speaker 2: of people who are don't think so.

1075
00:51:12,960 --> 00:51:13,200
Speaker 5: Yeah.

1076
00:51:13,239 --> 00:51:16,319
Speaker 3: I mean, it's not his job to fix her. She's

1077
00:51:16,320 --> 00:51:19,480
Speaker 3: not a project. It sounds like he may have some

1078
00:51:20,120 --> 00:51:25,480
Speaker 3: issues from his past from his upbringing with how dependency caretaking,

1079
00:51:25,920 --> 00:51:30,360
Speaker 3: like maybe his parents divorced or maybe he had to

1080
00:51:30,400 --> 00:51:32,960
Speaker 3: take care of one of his parents in some capacity

1081
00:51:33,000 --> 00:51:36,600
Speaker 3: as a child, and so that became very normalized for him.

1082
00:51:37,400 --> 00:51:39,319
Speaker 5: And it seems like he is.

1083
00:51:39,400 --> 00:51:41,480
Speaker 3: Like looking for someone to take care of, Like we

1084
00:51:41,520 --> 00:51:44,000
Speaker 3: call it like broken wing syndrome, right, He's looking for

1085
00:51:44,040 --> 00:51:46,000
Speaker 3: someone to take care of, even to the point where

1086
00:51:46,040 --> 00:51:51,600
Speaker 3: he's he's not willing to even end the marriage because

1087
00:51:51,640 --> 00:51:55,000
Speaker 3: he's so worried about her needs and her emotions and

1088
00:51:55,040 --> 00:51:57,560
Speaker 3: how it's going to impact her instead of taking care

1089
00:51:57,600 --> 00:52:00,799
Speaker 3: of himself. And I think he needs to address that.

1090
00:52:01,000 --> 00:52:03,200
Speaker 3: I think he means to maybe get into some sort

1091
00:52:03,200 --> 00:52:07,919
Speaker 3: of counseling and figure out why he feels the need

1092
00:52:08,000 --> 00:52:10,960
Speaker 3: to be in a relationship and stay in this relationship

1093
00:52:11,000 --> 00:52:13,000
Speaker 3: or has stayed in it for so long and feel

1094
00:52:13,040 --> 00:52:15,640
Speaker 3: the need to like fix and take care of and

1095
00:52:15,680 --> 00:52:18,280
Speaker 3: be the caretaker instead of having an equal and a partner,

1096
00:52:18,440 --> 00:52:21,920
Speaker 3: and that even in making the decision, he is placing

1097
00:52:21,960 --> 00:52:23,360
Speaker 3: her needs above his own.

1098
00:52:23,520 --> 00:52:24,480
Speaker 5: And I mean, I get it.

1099
00:52:24,520 --> 00:52:26,279
Speaker 3: He loves her and he probably knows her, and he

1100
00:52:26,320 --> 00:52:28,160
Speaker 3: probably knows that that's how she's going to react. So

1101
00:52:28,160 --> 00:52:30,680
Speaker 3: he's pretty confident about that. He's been with her for

1102
00:52:30,719 --> 00:52:34,240
Speaker 3: so long. And ultimately, here's the deal. People get broken

1103
00:52:34,320 --> 00:52:36,759
Speaker 3: up with all the time. Yeah, she'll get divorced all

1104
00:52:36,760 --> 00:52:40,879
Speaker 3: the time. It may actually be something that is good

1105
00:52:40,880 --> 00:52:43,520
Speaker 3: for her because it may force her out of her

1106
00:52:43,600 --> 00:52:46,799
Speaker 3: comfort zone and may force her to evaluate her situation.

1107
00:52:47,360 --> 00:52:48,120
Speaker 5: She's depressed.

1108
00:52:48,400 --> 00:52:50,200
Speaker 3: This isn't the thing that's going to make her depressed.

1109
00:52:50,200 --> 00:52:52,560
Speaker 3: She's already depressed. Yeah, you know, I don't mean to

1110
00:52:52,600 --> 00:52:55,839
Speaker 3: sound callous. I'm glad that he's being empathetic and he

1111
00:52:55,880 --> 00:52:58,279
Speaker 3: loves her and he wants to consider her needs. But

1112
00:52:58,400 --> 00:53:00,520
Speaker 3: maybe this is a wake up call to her her

1113
00:53:01,000 --> 00:53:04,319
Speaker 3: in some ways, because like, the most difficult and emotionally

1114
00:53:04,360 --> 00:53:07,080
Speaker 3: painful experiences are the ones that make us grow the most.

1115
00:53:07,120 --> 00:53:11,440
Speaker 3: And maybe that will give her the impetus to, you know,

1116
00:53:11,480 --> 00:53:14,040
Speaker 3: go make friends or go to therapy and figure out

1117
00:53:14,080 --> 00:53:16,040
Speaker 3: what got her to this point in the first place.

1118
00:53:16,400 --> 00:53:18,520
Speaker 3: He might be doing her a favor and not even

1119
00:53:18,600 --> 00:53:22,800
Speaker 3: realize it. And he's sacrificing his own happiness for no reason.

1120
00:53:22,960 --> 00:53:25,359
Speaker 2: Yeah, for something that's probably hurting her as well, Right,

1121
00:53:25,400 --> 00:53:27,959
Speaker 2: it is hurting her, Yeah, As I mentioned, I found

1122
00:53:28,000 --> 00:53:30,080
Speaker 2: her a therapist and drove her to appointments, but she

1123
00:53:30,120 --> 00:53:32,040
Speaker 2: said she was fine and stopped going after two to

1124
00:53:32,080 --> 00:53:34,960
Speaker 2: three sessions. Audition number one to clarify we do not

1125
00:53:35,000 --> 00:53:37,920
Speaker 2: have children, are not in danger of her getting pregnant.

1126
00:53:38,160 --> 00:53:41,640
Speaker 2: Addition number two, Susan has never been diagnosed with a

1127
00:53:41,680 --> 00:53:45,120
Speaker 2: mental disorder and has no substance abuse issues. Three. A

1128
00:53:45,120 --> 00:53:49,680
Speaker 2: few people have said that from her behavior, Susan seems unintelligent. Ironically,

1129
00:53:49,719 --> 00:53:53,160
Speaker 2: she's actually very bright if you believe standardized test. She

1130
00:53:53,200 --> 00:53:55,400
Speaker 2: has more raw smarts than I do, which sort of

1131
00:53:55,400 --> 00:53:58,000
Speaker 2: makes this situation all the more frustrating. Which seems like

1132
00:53:58,040 --> 00:54:01,080
Speaker 2: she just feels unfulfilled in her life, or Susan does

1133
00:54:01,160 --> 00:54:03,760
Speaker 2: conceivably have a place to go if and when we split.

1134
00:54:04,080 --> 00:54:06,640
Speaker 2: Her parents are good people who have the room and

1135
00:54:06,719 --> 00:54:08,680
Speaker 2: ability to take her in, which I think would be

1136
00:54:08,719 --> 00:54:13,040
Speaker 2: the best way forward. And there is an update, But uh,

1137
00:54:13,520 --> 00:54:16,000
Speaker 2: I think I'm also in agreement of I think this

1138
00:54:16,120 --> 00:54:17,920
Speaker 2: relationship needs to end for both of them.

1139
00:54:18,000 --> 00:54:20,560
Speaker 3: I mean it sounds like he answered his own questions there, like.

1140
00:54:20,800 --> 00:54:22,560
Speaker 2: She has a place to stay, she has a place to.

1141
00:54:22,480 --> 00:54:25,759
Speaker 3: Sday, she's not clinically depressed, no. But even if she is,

1142
00:54:25,840 --> 00:54:28,600
Speaker 3: that's not a reason to stay with someone. You know

1143
00:54:28,640 --> 00:54:30,440
Speaker 3: you can try to get them the help that they

1144
00:54:30,480 --> 00:54:33,440
Speaker 3: need and of the support that they need. But if

1145
00:54:33,440 --> 00:54:35,040
Speaker 3: she has a place to go because her parents have

1146
00:54:35,080 --> 00:54:37,840
Speaker 3: a place for her to stay, then she has presumably

1147
00:54:37,880 --> 00:54:40,160
Speaker 3: some families support them.

1148
00:54:40,200 --> 00:54:41,040
Speaker 5: Are the breaks? Kid?

1149
00:54:41,239 --> 00:54:45,160
Speaker 2: Update? I followed your advice to leave my wife yay.

1150
00:54:46,640 --> 00:54:49,920
Speaker 5: So quickly. Wow, I'm very persuasive.

1151
00:54:50,080 --> 00:54:53,759
Speaker 2: Heed, which was the same advice I received from literally

1152
00:54:54,000 --> 00:54:56,880
Speaker 2: every person in my life. It was the most difficult

1153
00:54:56,880 --> 00:55:00,160
Speaker 2: thing I've ever done. I've never wept so hard ward

1154
00:55:00,560 --> 00:55:03,120
Speaker 2: as I did after I told my now ex, whom

1155
00:55:03,120 --> 00:55:05,840
Speaker 2: I've been with for half my life, that I filed

1156
00:55:05,880 --> 00:55:09,279
Speaker 2: for divorce and was leaving. But despite any pain and

1157
00:55:09,280 --> 00:55:12,400
Speaker 2: stress I've experienced in the last few months, filing for

1158
00:55:12,440 --> 00:55:15,640
Speaker 2: divorce was by far the best decision I've ever made.

1159
00:55:15,800 --> 00:55:19,120
Speaker 2: In that time, I've experienced a sense of lightness, possibility,

1160
00:55:19,560 --> 00:55:22,800
Speaker 2: and fierce joy I never knew was possible. I'm happy

1161
00:55:22,800 --> 00:55:25,520
Speaker 2: to answer any questions you might have, including those from

1162
00:55:25,560 --> 00:55:29,120
Speaker 2: people looking for advice or comfort in similar situations. Here

1163
00:55:29,239 --> 00:55:32,560
Speaker 2: are some highlights and takeaways from my personal experience the

1164
00:55:32,600 --> 00:55:36,040
Speaker 2: divorce process. Isn't a ton of fun. I had to

1165
00:55:36,040 --> 00:55:38,640
Speaker 2: switch attorneys when I realized the first law firm was

1166
00:55:38,760 --> 00:55:42,160
Speaker 2: unethically making the process more contentious than anyone wanted to

1167
00:55:42,160 --> 00:55:43,600
Speaker 2: boost their billable hours.

1168
00:55:43,600 --> 00:55:44,680
Speaker 5: Oh yes, I know those.

1169
00:55:46,080 --> 00:55:48,560
Speaker 2: I will end up paying a not insignificant amount of

1170
00:55:48,600 --> 00:55:51,160
Speaker 2: spousal support for a couple of years, but all of

1171
00:55:51,160 --> 00:55:53,120
Speaker 2: this is a very small price to pay for the

1172
00:55:53,160 --> 00:55:56,400
Speaker 2: freedom I now have. There have been emotional ups and downs,

1173
00:55:56,400 --> 00:55:59,520
Speaker 2: for sure. Aside from one brief texting conversation, I haven't

1174
00:55:59,560 --> 00:56:02,520
Speaker 2: spoken with my ex since I left in September. Old

1175
00:56:02,640 --> 00:56:06,600
Speaker 2: habits diehard, though during long weekends alone, I've twice been

1176
00:56:06,640 --> 00:56:10,520
Speaker 2: overcome with guilt about leaving and broken down in tears.

1177
00:56:10,840 --> 00:56:13,200
Speaker 2: I know I don't truly have anything to feel guilty about.

1178
00:56:13,800 --> 00:56:15,719
Speaker 2: I think this is simply part of the process of

1179
00:56:15,760 --> 00:56:19,879
Speaker 2: grieving and extricating myself from the familiar emotional ruts I'd

1180
00:56:19,960 --> 00:56:24,120
Speaker 2: mistaken for reality for so long. Modern dating is strange

1181
00:56:24,680 --> 00:56:26,759
Speaker 2: and fun, but strange.

1182
00:56:26,719 --> 00:56:29,200
Speaker 5: So strange, strange, so strange.

1183
00:56:29,320 --> 00:56:31,560
Speaker 2: I mean, he hasn't dated in seventeen years.

1184
00:56:31,640 --> 00:56:34,080
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's like welcome to the future, like dating. I

1185
00:56:34,120 --> 00:56:36,240
Speaker 3: know this is what happened to me when I got divorced,

1186
00:56:36,280 --> 00:56:39,319
Speaker 3: Like I met my ex husband, we still had landlines. Yeah,

1187
00:56:39,360 --> 00:56:40,840
Speaker 3: you know, that's how old I am. Just by the

1188
00:56:40,880 --> 00:56:44,520
Speaker 3: way everybody and we had landlines. There was no texting,

1189
00:56:44,840 --> 00:56:47,480
Speaker 3: there was no social media, none of that existed. And

1190
00:56:47,560 --> 00:56:50,560
Speaker 3: so then when I got back out there into the world, like,

1191
00:56:50,640 --> 00:56:53,440
Speaker 3: guys were hitting me up by like Facebook Messenger to

1192
00:56:53,560 --> 00:56:55,600
Speaker 3: like ask me out. And I was like, is this appropriate?

1193
00:56:55,600 --> 00:56:57,560
Speaker 3: Aren't they supposed to pick up the phone and call me?

1194
00:56:57,680 --> 00:56:59,719
Speaker 3: I was like, you know, like an old like eighteen,

1195
00:56:59,760 --> 00:57:01,960
Speaker 3: hun is so inappropriate?

1196
00:57:02,640 --> 00:57:03,319
Speaker 2: Ask my father?

1197
00:57:03,600 --> 00:57:08,279
Speaker 6: Yeah, exactly, exactly. Put my hand holding me correctly. The

1198
00:57:08,360 --> 00:57:11,560
Speaker 6: last time I was single, my phone flipped. Hah, I

1199
00:57:11,600 --> 00:57:15,400
Speaker 6: remember flip phones. So dating apps took some getting used to.

1200
00:57:15,840 --> 00:57:18,160
Speaker 6: That said, I was very relieved to find that my

1201
00:57:18,280 --> 00:57:21,000
Speaker 6: worst fears that I would be an undesirable guy to

1202
00:57:21,080 --> 00:57:23,640
Speaker 6: date and would be forever loan could not have been

1203
00:57:23,720 --> 00:57:26,480
Speaker 6: less realistic. I often had dates with two to four

1204
00:57:26,480 --> 00:57:27,760
Speaker 6: different women per week.

1205
00:57:28,320 --> 00:57:29,720
Speaker 2: Look at you missed.

1206
00:57:29,480 --> 00:57:34,800
Speaker 3: The Okay, hopefully not with his cousin please.

1207
00:57:36,280 --> 00:57:38,640
Speaker 2: I live in a major city, which helps more than

1208
00:57:38,680 --> 00:57:42,440
Speaker 2: once I found myself jokingly asking a lovely woman, are

1209
00:57:42,480 --> 00:57:44,920
Speaker 2: you sure you're on the right date, like, have you

1210
00:57:45,080 --> 00:57:47,880
Speaker 2: seen me? Okay, well, we don't need to put ourselves down.

1211
00:57:47,960 --> 00:57:50,000
Speaker 2: I'm not the crypt keeper or anything, but I look

1212
00:57:50,120 --> 00:57:53,080
Speaker 2: like what I am, a mid thirties creative guy who

1213
00:57:53,080 --> 00:57:56,760
Speaker 2: works in tech and owns entirely too much Nintendo memorabilia?

1214
00:57:56,960 --> 00:57:59,240
Speaker 5: WHOA is he still single? A?

1215
00:57:59,360 --> 00:58:00,360
Speaker 2: Ladies? Come on?

1216
00:58:01,680 --> 00:58:03,240
Speaker 5: How can you resist that decision?

1217
00:58:03,600 --> 00:58:08,680
Speaker 2: Guys? Luckily no ladies bolted mid dinner. I did not

1218
00:58:08,800 --> 00:58:11,720
Speaker 2: plan on dating seriously for at least six months, but

1219
00:58:11,760 --> 00:58:14,360
Speaker 2: I met a woman on Tinder who is my dream

1220
00:58:14,480 --> 00:58:19,240
Speaker 2: girl and so much more. We're deliriously happy. She's a

1221
00:58:19,280 --> 00:58:22,080
Speaker 2: few years younger than I am, but is deeply wise

1222
00:58:22,200 --> 00:58:26,520
Speaker 2: as well as hilarious, kind, thoughtful, generous, and beautiful. This

1223
00:58:26,640 --> 00:58:28,960
Speaker 2: sounds like I'm making it up, but she's literally a

1224
00:58:29,000 --> 00:58:33,760
Speaker 2: professional model. As I joke with friends, I swear she's

1225
00:58:33,800 --> 00:58:36,560
Speaker 2: really guys, she just goes to a different school. There

1226
00:58:36,560 --> 00:58:39,080
Speaker 2: were many folks who reached out and said how much

1227
00:58:39,120 --> 00:58:42,160
Speaker 2: they related to my previous circumstances. So if I had

1228
00:58:42,200 --> 00:58:44,400
Speaker 2: any advice to share with those struggling with leaving a

1229
00:58:44,440 --> 00:58:47,160
Speaker 2: partner who is dependent on them, it would be this,

1230
00:58:47,720 --> 00:58:51,000
Speaker 2: do not set yourself on fire to keep someone else warm.

1231
00:58:51,440 --> 00:58:53,440
Speaker 2: We're on this earth for all too brief a trip,

1232
00:58:53,880 --> 00:58:56,640
Speaker 2: and it's not fair to make ourselves miserable just to

1233
00:58:56,680 --> 00:58:58,880
Speaker 2: avoid making someone else uncomfortable.

1234
00:58:59,280 --> 00:58:59,640
Speaker 5: Amen.

1235
00:59:00,080 --> 00:59:03,920
Speaker 2: Yes, relationships should be about two people coming together because

1236
00:59:03,920 --> 00:59:06,400
Speaker 2: they want to share their lives, not because one of

1237
00:59:06,400 --> 00:59:09,760
Speaker 2: them needs the other. And anyway, people are more resilient

1238
00:59:09,800 --> 00:59:11,760
Speaker 2: than we can give them credit for. And I think

1239
00:59:11,840 --> 00:59:13,880
Speaker 2: that's lovely that he learned that, because I feel like

1240
00:59:13,920 --> 00:59:16,600
Speaker 2: he was so worried about his partner's feelings. Yeah, and

1241
00:59:16,640 --> 00:59:18,840
Speaker 2: I think a lot of times people are very worried

1242
00:59:18,840 --> 00:59:21,560
Speaker 2: about hurting someone's feelings, and so they just put off

1243
00:59:21,880 --> 00:59:24,720
Speaker 2: breaking up or telling someone the truth or all that,

1244
00:59:25,240 --> 00:59:26,520
Speaker 2: and in the long run, that's worse.

1245
00:59:26,600 --> 00:59:29,520
Speaker 3: And also they don't realize that the more you prolong it,

1246
00:59:29,560 --> 00:59:32,560
Speaker 3: the more emotionally invested someone got. You know, like I

1247
00:59:32,600 --> 00:59:35,760
Speaker 3: always tell people, if you're on a first date and

1248
00:59:35,840 --> 00:59:38,960
Speaker 3: this isn't clicking, you're not sharing you know, you don't

1249
00:59:39,160 --> 00:59:42,000
Speaker 3: you haven't ascertained that you guys share fundamental values. There's

1250
00:59:42,040 --> 00:59:44,520
Speaker 3: something there more than just oh he's so hot or

1251
00:59:44,560 --> 00:59:47,640
Speaker 3: she's so attractive or whatever it is. Then instead of

1252
00:59:47,840 --> 00:59:51,040
Speaker 3: going on many dates exactly and getting more emotionally invested

1253
00:59:51,160 --> 00:59:53,680
Speaker 3: or you know, jumping in bed with someone, which there's

1254
00:59:53,720 --> 00:59:55,600
Speaker 3: nothing wrong with that, but if you do that, now

1255
00:59:55,680 --> 00:59:59,160
Speaker 3: you're more invested, yes, and more connected, and it's going

1256
00:59:59,200 --> 01:00:01,320
Speaker 3: to be much harder to break it off, even though

1257
01:00:01,360 --> 01:00:03,800
Speaker 3: you probably shouldn't be with this person and you intuitively

1258
01:00:03,880 --> 01:00:05,400
Speaker 3: know it, and then now down the.

1259
01:00:05,360 --> 01:00:07,080
Speaker 5: Road, it's way harder to break it off.

1260
01:00:07,160 --> 01:00:07,320
Speaker 2: Yeah.

1261
01:00:07,320 --> 01:00:10,040
Speaker 3: So I always tell people, listen, every moment of your

1262
01:00:10,080 --> 01:00:12,000
Speaker 3: life that goes by is a moment you will never

1263
01:00:12,080 --> 01:00:14,840
Speaker 3: ever get back again, So make sure that you use

1264
01:00:14,880 --> 01:00:15,360
Speaker 3: it wisely.

1265
01:00:15,560 --> 01:00:18,720
Speaker 2: Yeah, don't waste time. Thank you so much, Reddit, you

1266
01:00:18,840 --> 01:00:21,440
Speaker 2: help change and save my life. If I can repay

1267
01:00:21,440 --> 01:00:23,920
Speaker 2: the favor by answering any questions, please let me know.

1268
01:00:24,400 --> 01:00:26,959
Speaker 2: And there is an edit. I think this is clear

1269
01:00:27,000 --> 01:00:28,720
Speaker 2: if you read both posts, but I get that most

1270
01:00:28,760 --> 01:00:31,360
Speaker 2: folks won't, so just to be safe, I didn't leave

1271
01:00:31,480 --> 01:00:35,560
Speaker 2: just because of Reddit. We knew that everyone in my life,

1272
01:00:35,640 --> 01:00:38,320
Speaker 2: including friends who loved both me and my AX, believed

1273
01:00:38,360 --> 01:00:41,080
Speaker 2: it was the right thing. Because I tried for years

1274
01:00:41,120 --> 01:00:43,800
Speaker 2: to get our marriage to work. You wouldn't reciprocate and

1275
01:00:43,840 --> 01:00:48,240
Speaker 2: the effort hurt me. Reddit offered enormous comfort and further

1276
01:00:48,400 --> 01:00:50,680
Speaker 2: confidence though, and I'm deeply grateful.

1277
01:00:50,760 --> 01:00:52,760
Speaker 5: Who needs therapy when you got Reddit right?

1278
01:00:53,000 --> 01:00:58,440
Speaker 2: I tell you harsh truths and sometimes harsh lies. Sometimes,

1279
01:00:58,440 --> 01:01:00,560
Speaker 2: maybe don't listen to Reddit all the time. Edit two

1280
01:01:00,880 --> 01:01:03,520
Speaker 2: quick notes to address some questions in the comments. What

1281
01:01:03,720 --> 01:01:06,800
Speaker 2: is my ex doing now? Aside from a brief text conversation,

1282
01:01:06,880 --> 01:01:09,960
Speaker 2: we haven't spoken since they left, which is a huge

1283
01:01:10,080 --> 01:01:12,720
Speaker 2: change for the best. Yeah, yeah, definitely for the best,

1284
01:01:12,720 --> 01:01:15,720
Speaker 2: but like, definitely big switch up to go from, you know,

1285
01:01:15,960 --> 01:01:18,480
Speaker 2: talking to someone for seventeen years and then nothing.

1286
01:01:18,640 --> 01:01:18,840
Speaker 5: Yeah.

1287
01:01:19,120 --> 01:01:21,000
Speaker 2: Through my lawyer, I know that she's living with her

1288
01:01:21,040 --> 01:01:23,760
Speaker 2: parents and is looking for work. In the text conversation,

1289
01:01:23,880 --> 01:01:25,960
Speaker 2: she said she hopes we can be friends and talk

1290
01:01:26,040 --> 01:01:28,720
Speaker 2: when this is over. She also said she understands and

1291
01:01:28,840 --> 01:01:31,360
Speaker 2: respects my decision to not be in contact with her.

1292
01:01:31,640 --> 01:01:34,680
Speaker 2: Whether or not we'll have a relationship after this process,

1293
01:01:34,760 --> 01:01:37,680
Speaker 2: I truly don't know, but I admire the strength that

1294
01:01:37,760 --> 01:01:41,240
Speaker 2: took to send that magnanimous message, and I wish her

1295
01:01:41,360 --> 01:01:44,920
Speaker 2: only happiness and the best. How did my ex's parents

1296
01:01:44,960 --> 01:01:48,520
Speaker 2: take this? They understood completely. It feels like everyone in

1297
01:01:48,560 --> 01:01:52,200
Speaker 2: your life was like, yeah, no, we were waiting seventeen years.

1298
01:01:53,000 --> 01:01:53,560
Speaker 7: For a while.

1299
01:01:53,680 --> 01:01:55,600
Speaker 5: Yeah, they tried to put her off and then they

1300
01:01:55,600 --> 01:01:59,280
Speaker 5: got her back. Yeah, she's back.

1301
01:01:59,440 --> 01:02:01,120
Speaker 2: Yeah, Like, I just don't I don't want her to

1302
01:02:01,160 --> 01:02:02,880
Speaker 2: be homeless. I don't like, I don't know what to do,

1303
01:02:02,920 --> 01:02:06,760
Speaker 2: and they're like, we will take her over. They didn't

1304
01:02:06,760 --> 01:02:10,240
Speaker 2: even ask why I was leaving. They already knew, which

1305
01:02:10,320 --> 01:02:13,480
Speaker 2: was both comforting and said what did my original lawyers

1306
01:02:13,520 --> 01:02:16,520
Speaker 2: do that made me seek new counsel. Well, they weren't

1307
01:02:16,520 --> 01:02:19,320
Speaker 2: billing me for hours they didn't work. Rather, they were

1308
01:02:19,400 --> 01:02:22,400
Speaker 2: creating unnecessary work so that they could have more hours

1309
01:02:22,400 --> 01:02:23,400
Speaker 2: of work to bill.

1310
01:02:23,560 --> 01:02:24,320
Speaker 5: Called fee churning.

1311
01:02:24,800 --> 01:02:26,760
Speaker 2: Yikes, do you do that?

1312
01:02:26,880 --> 01:02:30,680
Speaker 5: Absolutely, I wouldn't admit it even if I did so.

1313
01:02:31,360 --> 01:02:32,880
Speaker 5: Obviously I don't do that.

1314
01:02:34,080 --> 01:02:35,880
Speaker 2: We only bring on the bestket Yeah, of course.

1315
01:02:35,960 --> 01:02:36,400
Speaker 5: Of course.

1316
01:02:36,680 --> 01:02:39,800
Speaker 2: Basically, they were misrepresenting my ex's lawyer as being much

1317
01:02:39,840 --> 01:02:43,280
Speaker 2: more aggressive and litigious than he actually was. I found

1318
01:02:43,280 --> 01:02:46,560
Speaker 2: this out when they described an email conversation they'd had

1319
01:02:46,600 --> 01:02:50,520
Speaker 2: with them. Then accidentally I assume sent me the actual

1320
01:02:50,560 --> 01:02:55,240
Speaker 2: conversation as part of an unrelated email, for the real

1321
01:02:55,280 --> 01:02:58,360
Speaker 2: conversation was nothing like what they had reported. There were

1322
01:02:58,400 --> 01:03:00,480
Speaker 2: a lot of things like that. Yeah, it's like if

1323
01:03:00,480 --> 01:03:02,520
Speaker 2: you're gonna do that, do it better.

1324
01:03:03,360 --> 01:03:06,400
Speaker 5: Yeah. Yeah, if you're going to be unethical, good at

1325
01:03:06,480 --> 01:03:07,360
Speaker 5: being unethical.

1326
01:03:07,600 --> 01:03:12,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, you're not actually dating a model, because that's ludacris.

1327
01:03:12,280 --> 01:03:15,160
Speaker 2: Or you're dating a model have fun paying for her

1328
01:03:15,240 --> 01:03:20,160
Speaker 2: life too? Einstein. Oh yeah, totally. I agree, it's ludacrous,

1329
01:03:20,440 --> 01:03:23,160
Speaker 2: especially since I basically have the physique of a guy

1330
01:03:23,200 --> 01:03:26,760
Speaker 2: who loves ordering fitness DVDs but doesn't love opening them.

1331
01:03:26,800 --> 01:03:30,280
Speaker 2: Oh wait, I thought that was a brag, but then

1332
01:03:30,320 --> 01:03:32,200
Speaker 2: it didn't seem like a brag at the end. But

1333
01:03:32,280 --> 01:03:34,400
Speaker 2: she really is a model, and her looks are honestly

1334
01:03:34,480 --> 01:03:38,800
Speaker 2: the least beautiful thing about her. Oh also, she's thirty

1335
01:03:38,840 --> 01:03:41,760
Speaker 2: and knows modeling won't last forever, so she's already fielding

1336
01:03:41,800 --> 01:03:44,640
Speaker 2: offers to go back to work as a psychological counselor.

1337
01:03:44,680 --> 01:03:46,960
Speaker 3: So basically she's just sitting on the couch eating giant

1338
01:03:47,000 --> 01:03:48,400
Speaker 3: bags of flaming hot Cheetos.

1339
01:03:48,520 --> 01:03:49,280
Speaker 2: Yes, exactly.

1340
01:03:49,280 --> 01:03:51,280
Speaker 3: She's letting it all go now that she's found her man.

1341
01:03:51,400 --> 01:03:51,600
Speaker 5: Yeah.

1342
01:03:51,680 --> 01:03:53,640
Speaker 2: Yeah, she's like, I don't need to do any.

1343
01:03:53,520 --> 01:03:56,080
Speaker 5: Yeah, he loves me for who that's the least beautiful

1344
01:03:56,120 --> 01:03:57,680
Speaker 5: part of it, So why do I gotta keep this

1345
01:03:57,840 --> 01:03:58,800
Speaker 5: up exactly.

1346
01:03:59,560 --> 01:04:01,360
Speaker 2: How did my I actual react when I told her

1347
01:04:01,400 --> 01:04:05,000
Speaker 2: about the divorce. She was terribly upset and lashed out

1348
01:04:05,000 --> 01:04:08,040
Speaker 2: at me verbally. I'd expected that and don't begrudge her

1349
01:04:08,080 --> 01:04:11,479
Speaker 2: for it, And I'd made arrangements for people he loves

1350
01:04:11,520 --> 01:04:14,080
Speaker 2: to be nearby and come over right after the conversation

1351
01:04:14,360 --> 01:04:16,240
Speaker 2: so that she wouldn't be alone. I mean even in

1352
01:04:16,320 --> 01:04:18,800
Speaker 2: divorcing her. Oh, he's like, how do I make this

1353
01:04:18,880 --> 01:04:21,040
Speaker 2: easy for her? Though? Yeah?

1354
01:04:21,080 --> 01:04:23,200
Speaker 3: But you know what, I think there's something to note

1355
01:04:23,240 --> 01:04:25,480
Speaker 3: in there, which is that he mentioned she went out

1356
01:04:25,480 --> 01:04:28,080
Speaker 3: and she was getting a job or getting like training.

1357
01:04:28,200 --> 01:04:31,000
Speaker 3: He's got a job, So, like I said earlier, you

1358
01:04:31,000 --> 01:04:32,919
Speaker 3: know this this was good for her too.

1359
01:04:33,440 --> 01:04:37,240
Speaker 2: Yes, but there is a little bit left to this story.

1360
01:04:37,440 --> 01:04:39,440
Speaker 2: Any final thoughts for OPI.

1361
01:04:40,520 --> 01:04:42,760
Speaker 3: I think he did the right thing, and I hope

1362
01:04:42,800 --> 01:04:45,440
Speaker 3: that he's worked on his codependency issue, yeah, so that

1363
01:04:45,480 --> 01:04:48,000
Speaker 3: he doesn't work that with the model.

1364
01:04:48,640 --> 01:04:50,920
Speaker 2: Yeah. Just I think it's like important, especially for him

1365
01:04:50,960 --> 01:04:53,200
Speaker 2: to get into a relationship with someone who has her

1366
01:04:53,200 --> 01:04:57,360
Speaker 2: own life, yeah, and who is very independent in terms

1367
01:04:57,400 --> 01:04:57,800
Speaker 2: of just.

1368
01:04:58,200 --> 01:05:00,920
Speaker 3: Like a partner, like a partner on his level, as

1369
01:05:00,960 --> 01:05:04,680
Speaker 3: opposed to someone who needs to like fold up on

1370
01:05:04,720 --> 01:05:05,760
Speaker 3: his shoulder and carry out.

1371
01:05:06,040 --> 01:05:07,880
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, I can imagine that he wouldn't want

1372
01:05:07,880 --> 01:05:10,560
Speaker 2: to have children with a person that he's basically become

1373
01:05:10,600 --> 01:05:14,240
Speaker 2: parentified in the relationship. There are some last couple questions

1374
01:05:14,240 --> 01:05:17,920
Speaker 2: that Opie answers, Why are you in another relationship so quickly?

1375
01:05:18,440 --> 01:05:21,440
Speaker 2: Have you actually met your new girlfriend? Aka? Is she

1376
01:05:21,480 --> 01:05:25,280
Speaker 2: even real? Opie says, I definitely didn't intend to get

1377
01:05:25,320 --> 01:05:28,120
Speaker 2: into another relationship so soon. I mean, you were going

1378
01:05:28,200 --> 01:05:30,640
Speaker 2: on dating apps, so it feels like you were looking

1379
01:05:30,760 --> 01:05:32,360
Speaker 2: for some sort of relationship.

1380
01:05:32,440 --> 01:05:33,160
Speaker 5: It's just a blow up.

1381
01:05:33,440 --> 01:05:37,000
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, it's a model right, it's a Model.

1382
01:05:38,800 --> 01:05:39,080
Speaker 5: Five.

1383
01:05:40,520 --> 01:05:43,320
Speaker 2: But things have gone incredibly well so far, and I

1384
01:05:43,360 --> 01:05:45,560
Speaker 2: cannot wait for my new girlfriend to use the money

1385
01:05:45,600 --> 01:05:48,080
Speaker 2: I sent her to get her buried inheritance out of

1386
01:05:48,160 --> 01:05:52,120
Speaker 2: Nigeria so we can finally meet. Okay, in all seriousness,

1387
01:05:52,200 --> 01:05:55,680
Speaker 2: these are great and totally fair questions. In fact, my

1388
01:05:55,760 --> 01:05:59,200
Speaker 2: friends and family, while absolutely thrilled to see me, we're

1389
01:05:59,240 --> 01:06:01,760
Speaker 2: all so concerned and that I was jumping in too quickly.

1390
01:06:01,960 --> 01:06:05,200
Speaker 2: I can imagine that they would be until they met

1391
01:06:05,200 --> 01:06:08,680
Speaker 2: my girlfriend. Wendy saw what I saw and fell in

1392
01:06:08,720 --> 01:06:11,200
Speaker 2: love with her as well. Wendy is in some ways

1393
01:06:11,240 --> 01:06:13,919
Speaker 2: the opposite of my ex. She won't let me pay

1394
01:06:13,920 --> 01:06:16,800
Speaker 2: for anything outside of date night costs, for instance. She's

1395
01:06:17,000 --> 01:06:20,120
Speaker 2: very independent, and she has a professional career as a

1396
01:06:20,120 --> 01:06:23,800
Speaker 2: psychologist that she's looking forward to returning to whenever the

1397
01:06:23,840 --> 01:06:26,280
Speaker 2: modeling time in her life is through. I'm sure I

1398
01:06:26,320 --> 01:06:29,440
Speaker 2: have a lifetime of lessons yet to learn, but although

1399
01:06:29,480 --> 01:06:33,000
Speaker 2: I will make mistakes in this and any relationship, I

1400
01:06:33,040 --> 01:06:37,640
Speaker 2: won't be repeating the mistakes for my marriage promise, and folks,

1401
01:06:37,680 --> 01:06:40,120
Speaker 2: that's the end of that story. I think I would

1402
01:06:40,160 --> 01:06:42,400
Speaker 2: usually recommend taking some time if you've been in a

1403
01:06:42,400 --> 01:06:45,120
Speaker 2: long term relationship, but I think sometimes.

1404
01:06:44,720 --> 01:06:46,640
Speaker 5: You just happened, have happened?

1405
01:06:46,760 --> 01:06:49,200
Speaker 3: Yeah yah, I mean I think he was out of

1406
01:06:49,200 --> 01:06:51,280
Speaker 3: that relationship for a long time, to be fair.

1407
01:06:51,520 --> 01:06:53,080
Speaker 5: Yeah, So I think.

1408
01:06:52,800 --> 01:06:55,040
Speaker 2: That emotionally, absolutely, he.

1409
01:06:55,000 --> 01:06:57,920
Speaker 3: Was checked out and he was just protecting his acts

1410
01:06:58,080 --> 01:07:01,680
Speaker 3: as opposed to like like a character, I just came

1411
01:07:01,720 --> 01:07:03,000
Speaker 3: to the realization that I don't want to be in

1412
01:07:03,000 --> 01:07:04,960
Speaker 3: this relationship. Like he even told his ex that he

1413
01:07:05,080 --> 01:07:07,520
Speaker 3: wanted to divorce many many years ago, and she said no, no, no,

1414
01:07:07,680 --> 01:07:11,000
Speaker 3: let's go to counseling. So I think he had one

1415
01:07:11,000 --> 01:07:13,840
Speaker 3: foot out the door, and so he was ready to

1416
01:07:13,920 --> 01:07:16,440
Speaker 3: be in something new as opposed to being very fret.

1417
01:07:16,440 --> 01:07:18,840
Speaker 2: Yeah that's a point, but that is the end of

1418
01:07:18,920 --> 01:07:19,640
Speaker 2: that story.

1419
01:07:20,120 --> 01:07:22,320
Speaker 4: Yeah, thank you for being here before you head out.

1420
01:07:22,360 --> 01:07:24,840
Speaker 4: Is there anything else you'd like this? Okay, story time

1421
01:07:24,920 --> 01:07:27,480
Speaker 4: peeps to know or how to find you online or

1422
01:07:27,480 --> 01:07:28,280
Speaker 4: anything like that.

1423
01:07:28,760 --> 01:07:31,920
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, well, they can find my book Amazon

1424
01:07:32,040 --> 01:07:34,560
Speaker 3: or wherever books are sold called Live Laugh, Find True Love,

1425
01:07:34,560 --> 01:07:38,560
Speaker 3: and it's about how to find a meaningful relationship based

1426
01:07:38,560 --> 01:07:42,800
Speaker 3: on reverse engineering essentially where relationships go wrong and telling

1427
01:07:42,800 --> 01:07:45,960
Speaker 3: people how to find the right relationship. And people can

1428
01:07:46,000 --> 01:07:48,640
Speaker 3: find me on my Instagram which is Sarah dot a

1429
01:07:49,160 --> 01:07:53,040
Speaker 3: dot Intelligator dot sq it's a very very long handle,

1430
01:07:53,280 --> 01:07:56,960
Speaker 3: or LA Family Law Practice dot com. There you go

1431
01:07:56,960 --> 01:07:59,000
Speaker 3: for that, or you can just google Sarah and Delligator.

1432
01:07:59,040 --> 01:08:01,400
Speaker 3: There aren't many of us, so that's pretty much you'll

1433
01:08:01,480 --> 01:08:02,080
Speaker 3: you'll find me.

1434
01:08:02,240 --> 01:08:04,360
Speaker 2: It'll come up. Yeah, it's not like.

1435
01:08:04,360 --> 01:08:06,560
Speaker 3: You're enough to sort through like twenty Sarah and delligators.

1436
01:08:06,640 --> 01:08:07,960
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, just the one.

1437
01:08:07,960 --> 01:08:09,080
Speaker 5: It is my real last name.

1438
01:08:09,280 --> 01:08:11,560
Speaker 2: It's a great last name. We commented on it before

1439
01:08:11,600 --> 01:08:13,000
Speaker 2: we started. It's very cool.

1440
01:08:13,080 --> 01:08:15,720
Speaker 3: Thank you, thank you. Yeah, I get asked if it's

1441
01:08:15,760 --> 01:08:16,800
Speaker 3: real all the time, and I'm like.

1442
01:08:16,800 --> 01:08:18,439
Speaker 5: No, I just made it up. I'm that creative.

1443
01:08:19,080 --> 01:08:19,880
Speaker 2: I don't know. It's thought.

1444
01:08:19,880 --> 01:08:20,599
Speaker 5: It's not cool.

1445
01:08:21,400 --> 01:08:23,280
Speaker 2: Yeah. Well, thank you so much for coming on and

1446
01:08:23,280 --> 01:08:26,559
Speaker 2: giving all of your your thoughts. Thanks you having California

1447
01:08:26,600 --> 01:08:27,400
Speaker 2: specific advice.

1448
01:08:27,479 --> 01:08:29,400
Speaker 5: California specific not advice.

1449
01:08:29,200 --> 01:08:34,960
Speaker 2: Not advice, California specific thoughts, thoughts. Yes, and thank you

1450
01:08:35,040 --> 01:08:38,080
Speaker 2: for your shoes. One more time, just just visually thank

1451
01:08:38,120 --> 01:08:43,640
Speaker 2: you bringing up so much. Thank you, and everyone say

1452
01:08:43,680 --> 01:08:44,400
Speaker 2: thank you in the chat