WEBVTT - Ukrainian Resistance Has Russia Rethinking Strategy 0:00:01.800 --> 0:00:04.440 This is Bloomberg Business Week. I'm Karl Masser and I'm 0:00:04.480 --> 0:00:07.280 Bloomberg Quick Takes Tim Stanovik. We're here every day bringing 0:00:07.320 --> 0:00:09.840 you the latest news from the world to business and finance, 0:00:09.840 --> 0:00:13.640 plus technology, politics, economics, all purtnising the power of Business 0:00:13.680 --> 0:00:17.119 Week reporters and editors, not to mention our journalists and 0:00:17.120 --> 0:00:20.000 analysts in more than one twenty countries. You can download 0:00:20.000 --> 0:00:23.239 Bloomberg Business Week and iTunes, SoundCloud, or Bloomberg dot Com. 0:00:23.400 --> 0:00:25.200 You can also listen to our radio show at two 0:00:25.200 --> 0:00:27.760 pm Eastern Time on the Bloomberg Radio or watch us 0:00:27.760 --> 0:00:32.360 on YouTube search Bloomberg Global News Present bundes in Poland, 0:00:32.440 --> 0:00:35.199 his second stop today, taking him to Warsaw. He has 0:00:35.240 --> 0:00:39.240 met with US troops, He's meeting Ukrainian refugees. He's expected 0:00:39.280 --> 0:00:41.680 to also make a major address tomorrow, and one of 0:00:41.720 --> 0:00:43.519 the most read stories on the Bloomberg is about how 0:00:43.560 --> 0:00:46.760 the buying administration officials are worried that Russian President Vladimir 0:00:46.760 --> 0:00:50.200 Putin may lash out dangerously as Russian troops find themselves 0:00:50.200 --> 0:00:53.400 bogged down in Ukraine and Western sanctions begin to bite. Tim. 0:00:53.400 --> 0:00:55.720 It's a lot to digest, it is. Unfortunately, we have 0:00:55.720 --> 0:00:58.760 Anne Marie Horder and Washington correspondent for Bloomberg TV with 0:00:58.840 --> 0:01:01.360 us now on the phone from warsaw Enemory. You've been 0:01:01.840 --> 0:01:05.560 in Europe before the president, since before the president even arrived. Um, 0:01:05.600 --> 0:01:09.000 how would you characterize what he's accomplished thus far on 0:01:09.040 --> 0:01:13.399 the trip versus what he set out to accomplish. Yeah, 0:01:13.600 --> 0:01:15.800 Luckily I actually used to live here, so I could 0:01:15.880 --> 0:01:19.080 say as well that there is a sense of there's 0:01:19.080 --> 0:01:21.200 a welcomeness in Europe right now, and you can see 0:01:21.200 --> 0:01:23.959 that in the Poles as well for this administration and 0:01:24.160 --> 0:01:27.080 actually of the unity they've brought and I was thinking Poland, 0:01:27.080 --> 0:01:30.600 there's definitely a sense that they want to welcome and 0:01:30.840 --> 0:01:34.759 have Ukrainian refugees. That the president did today called them 0:01:34.760 --> 0:01:37.520 their guests. You haven't only seen that in European countries, 0:01:37.800 --> 0:01:41.080 with refugees coming through other countries, notably a few years 0:01:41.120 --> 0:01:45.400 ago from Kyria. It's hard to characterize the success right 0:01:45.480 --> 0:01:49.800 because these trips are very much so also symbolic. But 0:01:49.960 --> 0:01:52.360 yesterday was a school of diploma scene. He had NATO 0:01:52.440 --> 0:01:55.480 had cours G seven Extraordinary meeting, and then he went 0:01:55.520 --> 0:01:59.680 and a dressed the European uh Commission and you did 0:01:59.760 --> 0:02:03.600 walk go away with a feeling that leaders are united 0:02:03.680 --> 0:02:07.080 in terms of wanting to make sure there is resolve 0:02:07.240 --> 0:02:10.720 and standing up to President Puchin. The big question is 0:02:10.760 --> 0:02:14.040 going forward, how far can this last? It will be 0:02:14.120 --> 0:02:17.640 pressured to increase sanctions, but also there's gonna be a 0:02:17.720 --> 0:02:21.880 lot of uh pushback and reverberations on all of these 0:02:21.880 --> 0:02:24.720 economies as well, especially in Europe, which are very reliant 0:02:24.960 --> 0:02:28.080 on Russia, including a number of businesses but most notably 0:02:28.480 --> 0:02:31.320 natural gas in oils. So, and I think we've talked 0:02:31.320 --> 0:02:33.920 with you about this before. So who is kind of 0:02:33.960 --> 0:02:36.840 the leader on all of this. I am curious if 0:02:36.840 --> 0:02:39.480 everybody is looking to President Biden or is it really 0:02:39.960 --> 0:02:45.600 you know, European leaders, because they are obviously geographically and 0:02:45.919 --> 0:02:48.560 you know, economically, going to feel and are in feeling 0:02:48.600 --> 0:02:51.880 the impacts of this, uh, you know, much more severely, 0:02:52.000 --> 0:02:57.240 much more closely than the US is well. Definitely the 0:02:57.280 --> 0:03:00.120 United States is taking a headlestand in all into but 0:03:00.240 --> 0:03:02.079 they have been in luck sets. If there's a lot 0:03:02.080 --> 0:03:04.480 of stuff with the European leaders that and they remind 0:03:04.520 --> 0:03:06.360 you of that that what they are doing, they are 0:03:06.400 --> 0:03:10.040 doing alongside their partners. When it comes to Europe's very 0:03:10.040 --> 0:03:12.679 difficult because this is a union of a number of 0:03:12.800 --> 0:03:15.639 nations that they're only as strong as their weakest link, 0:03:15.720 --> 0:03:17.600 in the sense that they can only go as tough 0:03:17.639 --> 0:03:20.240 as they're willing to as all the countries are willing 0:03:20.280 --> 0:03:23.320 to go. So I think the Latin in president yesterday, 0:03:23.360 --> 0:03:26.120 he says he's ready to cut off Russian oil and gas. 0:03:26.120 --> 0:03:28.399 He says, we shouldn't be paying for this, it's we're 0:03:28.400 --> 0:03:31.240 paying for Ukrainian blood, and he says there's a cost 0:03:31.280 --> 0:03:34.280 of freedom. But then you talked to Germans who very 0:03:34.320 --> 0:03:37.720 much so want to loosen their dependence on oil and gas, 0:03:37.720 --> 0:03:40.400 which we should note is a complete one. Eight when 0:03:40.400 --> 0:03:43.840 we saw into the Mercal chancellorship who really wanted to 0:03:43.880 --> 0:03:46.680 have this nord stream too, and SPD had a lot 0:03:46.680 --> 0:03:49.760 of not her exactly, but the stbc He party had 0:03:49.800 --> 0:03:52.640 a lot of connections with Russia. And now you see 0:03:52.640 --> 0:03:54.960 them even going to cut her. Looking to nine stats, 0:03:55.200 --> 0:03:58.560 they're building l ND terminals, so you see that there 0:03:58.560 --> 0:04:02.200 are cracked. But I would say that it would be 0:04:02.320 --> 0:04:05.840 Germany given how big that economy is and how reliant 0:04:05.880 --> 0:04:08.280 they are, specifically when it comes to natural gas. About 0:04:08.280 --> 0:04:12.320 fifty five coming from Russia. One thing we've been grappling with, 0:04:12.360 --> 0:04:14.440 as far as questions go and ray for the last 0:04:14.440 --> 0:04:16.320 month or so has been on the other side of 0:04:16.360 --> 0:04:18.479 this what things look like and when you know, without 0:04:18.520 --> 0:04:22.799 trying to, without asking you to prognosticate or even predict 0:04:22.880 --> 0:04:27.360 what happens. I'm wondering how the appetite for decreasing reliance 0:04:27.400 --> 0:04:31.560 on Russian energy, how to what extent that actually sticks 0:04:31.600 --> 0:04:36.080 across the continent. Yeah, you know, we just don't know yet. 0:04:36.160 --> 0:04:39.080 The way the infrastructure set up is that r Extream 0:04:39.160 --> 0:04:41.400 one a number of other pipelines about the third of 0:04:41.480 --> 0:04:44.520 natural gas goes through Ukraine. Actually they get billions of 0:04:44.520 --> 0:04:47.400 transit feeds like these, like an ev path almost are 0:04:47.400 --> 0:04:51.960 allowing that gas to go through. But you do see 0:04:51.960 --> 0:04:56.320 Europe looking for other alternatives. Now, Europe was already putting 0:04:56.360 --> 0:04:59.240 a lot of money in investment in renewable they wanted 0:04:59.279 --> 0:05:03.000 to elector by their continent. But now, I mean, it 0:05:03.120 --> 0:05:06.160 is pretty astonishing seeing the German economy minister who's the 0:05:06.240 --> 0:05:09.080 leader of the Green Party show up and cut her 0:05:09.440 --> 0:05:12.200 to try to ink ellen g deal. And he had 0:05:12.279 --> 0:05:14.919 said when he was in Doha, we may have to 0:05:14.960 --> 0:05:17.720 be rely on Russian guests for the next month, maybe 0:05:17.720 --> 0:05:20.880 in a year, but this might not always be the case, 0:05:20.920 --> 0:05:23.960 and he who has ears should listen. So really availed 0:05:24.000 --> 0:05:26.400 threat to President m Hey. One of the benefits of 0:05:26.440 --> 0:05:29.560 having you actually out there on the ground with the 0:05:29.600 --> 0:05:32.840 President as he makes his moves around Europe is what 0:05:32.920 --> 0:05:37.040 you are seeing directly, something that I can't Tim can 0:05:37.160 --> 0:05:40.719 in our studio and most of Americans can't do. What 0:05:40.839 --> 0:05:42.440 have you been seeing? And we've just got about a 0:05:42.440 --> 0:05:46.240 minute left. Well, I'll just say quickly at the moment 0:05:46.240 --> 0:05:49.160 I'm stuck on a street corner with the President, Motoricata, 0:05:49.279 --> 0:05:53.080 just come through to the security everywhere. But you cannot 0:05:53.240 --> 0:05:57.320 walk a block in Warsaw right now without seeing individuals. 0:05:57.360 --> 0:05:59.080 I'm looking at a woman right now wrapped in the 0:05:59.160 --> 0:06:02.440 Ukrainian flag. I'm seeing people sell Ukrainian flags and seeing 0:06:02.520 --> 0:06:06.080 Ukrainian flags and Rauciti everywhere. This is a city that 0:06:06.200 --> 0:06:08.880 is standing in solidarity with Kiev, and that is very 0:06:08.880 --> 0:06:12.480 apparent the moment you step off the plane. All right, 0:06:12.520 --> 0:06:15.120 we'll save travels, kiddo, and really appreciate it. We know 0:06:15.160 --> 0:06:17.640 you've been running around a lot, but really great to 0:06:17.680 --> 0:06:20.320 check in with you. Bloomberg TV Washington or Bloomberg I 0:06:20.320 --> 0:06:23.520 should say TV and Radio Washington correspondent and Marie Horden 0:06:24.040 --> 0:06:26.600 joining us. She's on the ground in Warsaw, Poland, and 0:06:26.720 --> 0:06:28.880 she's been there with the President as he moves around. Yeah, 0:06:28.920 --> 0:06:31.680 we're also expecting to hear from the President once again tomorrow, 0:06:31.880 --> 0:06:35.040 following up on yesterday's major addressed from what I understand right, 0:06:35.880 --> 0:06:38.279 so we'll see what he has to say. Um. But 0:06:38.360 --> 0:06:40.640 the energy, you know that Energy news and then working 0:06:40.640 --> 0:06:43.440 at a deal of the EU to get more US 0:06:43.560 --> 0:06:45.719 l n G. We've seen that impact some of the 0:06:45.760 --> 0:06:47.720 E n P players. I mean, energy has been to 0:06:47.760 --> 0:06:51.240 standout performer last year this year, but you definitely see 0:06:51.360 --> 0:06:54.440 different sectors move based on these different headlines. Questions, Carol, 0:06:54.480 --> 0:06:56.359 is it a permanent shift on the other side of this, 0:06:56.400 --> 0:06:58.240 it's a question we've been grappling with for weeks. You 0:06:58.320 --> 0:07:01.680 make deals, right, they stick around own. I guess something. 0:07:02.080 --> 0:07:03.840 All right, you're listening to Bloomberg Business Week. We're just 0:07:03.839 --> 0:07:09.520 getting started on this Friday. You're listening to Bloomberg Business 0:07:09.520 --> 0:07:13.360 Week with Carol Messer and Bloomberg Quick Takes Tim Stinovic 0:07:13.840 --> 0:07:17.480 on Bloomberg Radio. As we've been talking about Germany's COVID situation. 0:07:17.600 --> 0:07:19.920 It is getting worse meantime. Just yesterday we talked with 0:07:19.960 --> 0:07:23.920 Bloomberg's Ian Marlowe about how Hong Kong went from zero 0:07:24.760 --> 0:07:26.720 to one of the worst areas of the world when 0:07:26.760 --> 0:07:28.840 it comes to COVID in the health pandemic. So what 0:07:28.880 --> 0:07:30.800 does that mean for the United States and the next 0:07:30.840 --> 0:07:32.760 few weeks here at the Round. Well, that's a question 0:07:32.760 --> 0:07:34.840 that we're gonna post to. Dr Ian LUs Bader, clinical 0:07:34.840 --> 0:07:37.239 professor of medicine at n y U Lang's Medical Center. 0:07:37.240 --> 0:07:39.120 He joins us on the phone from New York City, 0:07:39.160 --> 0:07:42.880 Dr Lusbader, how are you hey? Happy Friday, guys. So 0:07:43.360 --> 0:07:47.120 everyone is doing well? Yeah, we're good, Thank you. Um So, 0:07:47.960 --> 0:07:51.119 I was startled to see this UK COVID headline among 0:07:51.160 --> 0:07:53.960 the others that Carol read surging by one million in 0:07:54.000 --> 0:07:57.000 just a week. Oftentimes with over the last two years 0:07:57.040 --> 0:07:58.920 what's happened in the UK, we've seen happen here in 0:07:58.960 --> 0:08:02.880 the United States. Is this any exception, you know, like 0:08:03.120 --> 0:08:06.320 nineteen the Spanish flu. You don't want to always compare 0:08:06.760 --> 0:08:09.720 one pandemic to another, but so far I think that's 0:08:09.760 --> 0:08:13.600 provided a pretty good model. Um It took about three years, 0:08:13.720 --> 0:08:16.360 and I think we're still seeing a number of places 0:08:16.400 --> 0:08:19.560 around the world that are seeing a surge another wave 0:08:19.800 --> 0:08:23.520 of COVID, in this case primarily over crowned the B 0:08:23.640 --> 0:08:27.200 A two variant, which is much more transmissible, maybe fifty 0:08:28.640 --> 0:08:33.079 more transmissible, fortunately not more deadly. And we're really seeing 0:08:33.120 --> 0:08:36.080 this in different parts of the world. For example, in 0:08:36.240 --> 0:08:39.840 China and Hong Kong, they tried the lockdown approach. We've 0:08:39.840 --> 0:08:43.080 seen data that that does not work well. Their vaccination 0:08:43.200 --> 0:08:46.839 rates were not particularly high as a small island um. 0:08:46.920 --> 0:08:49.160 They also used the sign of fact vaccine, which we 0:08:49.200 --> 0:08:52.160 don't really know that much about where it is unclear 0:08:52.200 --> 0:08:55.600 how effective that is. And certainly for many of the 0:08:55.679 --> 0:08:59.560 people in uh China and Hong Kong, they've only had 0:08:59.720 --> 0:09:02.800 one or two vaccines, not the three or now that 0:09:02.880 --> 0:09:05.800 we're contemplating four here, not nearly as much as in 0:09:05.800 --> 0:09:08.320 the US. So I don't think we can really compare 0:09:09.280 --> 0:09:11.559 different parts of the world, but certainly the surge in 0:09:11.600 --> 0:09:14.760 the UK is concerning. I think we're in a better 0:09:14.840 --> 0:09:18.960 position in the US. I think our case numbers are dropping. 0:09:19.040 --> 0:09:22.199 Could we see another minor peak um with the B 0:09:22.480 --> 0:09:25.400 two variant. I think we might we're not seeing an 0:09:25.400 --> 0:09:28.400 increase in hospitalizations or deaths. And I think part of 0:09:28.440 --> 0:09:32.080 that is because we've been generally very good with vaccines 0:09:32.160 --> 0:09:34.960 and you know, MOUs and sort of simple procedures. But 0:09:35.040 --> 0:09:38.080 I think we have a lot of antibodies around, both 0:09:38.160 --> 0:09:42.960 from getting ill and uh and from vaccinations. Well, okay, 0:09:43.000 --> 0:09:46.640 because it's funny some of the conversations Ian. I mean, 0:09:46.800 --> 0:09:50.200 I've you know, things have happened in terms of contract 0:09:50.320 --> 0:09:52.720 contact tracing, even at our office, you know, been reached 0:09:52.720 --> 0:09:57.640 out where I kind of thought, wait, everything was getting coming. 0:09:58.400 --> 0:10:00.240 Let's say, if I just want to say, you're four 0:10:00.240 --> 0:10:05.679 feet away from me. So, so how do we because 0:10:05.720 --> 0:10:09.440 of those antibodies? Because I've had three shots, Um, it 0:10:09.480 --> 0:10:11.960 doesn't mean I won't have some symptoms, but or or 0:10:12.000 --> 0:10:15.280 I could possibly or anybody could or or nothing. Right, 0:10:15.320 --> 0:10:17.839 I mean that's kind of where we are because of 0:10:18.480 --> 0:10:23.360 because of mutation, people can have they kind of their 0:10:23.400 --> 0:10:26.800 three shots, can have had COVID or the alpha variant 0:10:27.160 --> 0:10:29.600 and are often still getting O macron. But what we're 0:10:29.640 --> 0:10:33.120 noticing is it's very mild. And in your case, you 0:10:33.120 --> 0:10:35.959 you had a positive swab, but really no symptoms. Wasn't 0:10:36.120 --> 0:10:39.760 a false positive maybe, but we're seeing very mild to 0:10:39.720 --> 0:10:42.120 to really no symptoms, some people a little bit more 0:10:42.200 --> 0:10:45.600 with cough and and laryngitis. So I think I had 0:10:45.640 --> 0:10:51.440 that variant, But I think the key metric is hospitalizations 0:10:51.559 --> 0:10:54.599 and fatal disease. And really what I would say is 0:10:54.679 --> 0:10:58.400 many people are concerned should I get a fourth vaccine 0:10:58.520 --> 0:11:02.240 right now? Cdc UH is limiting it. Really the only 0:11:02.280 --> 0:11:05.040 people who are im you know, compromised. My bet, like 0:11:05.200 --> 0:11:07.760 israel As, we will approve it for people sixty five 0:11:07.840 --> 0:11:11.040 and older or people with underlying disease, and I would say, yes, 0:11:11.360 --> 0:11:14.280 if you're in that high risk group, sure it's worth 0:11:14.360 --> 0:11:18.720 taking another vaccine. How effective that is not quite clear 0:11:18.720 --> 0:11:22.760 because remember we keep giving alpha boosters and the and 0:11:22.880 --> 0:11:25.720 the virus has mutated. You know, if we could develop 0:11:25.720 --> 0:11:28.640 an omicron vaccine, that would make a lot more sense 0:11:29.120 --> 0:11:33.000 in your view, Dr LUs Beder, Have we gone from 0:11:33.040 --> 0:11:37.560 pandemic to endemic yet? I think we're in that transition, 0:11:37.720 --> 0:11:41.160 and if we see covid in the full, which we might, 0:11:41.720 --> 0:11:44.400 my bet is it will be more of an endemic. 0:11:44.559 --> 0:11:48.520 We might get you know, flu shots combined with COVID shots. 0:11:48.559 --> 0:11:50.840 But in my mind, I think we need to. What 0:11:51.040 --> 0:11:53.160 this tells me is we need to work harder on 0:11:53.480 --> 0:11:57.720 an appropriate vaccine like omicron and a universal vaccine for 0:11:58.080 --> 0:12:02.679 coronaviruses which would protect against other common cold viruses. Yeah, 0:12:02.679 --> 0:12:04.720 and there's a story in the Bloomberg about that. Uh 0:12:04.760 --> 0:12:08.040 and also in our weekend show looking at booster development 0:12:08.040 --> 0:12:10.360 and ongoing. Hey, Ian, thank you so much, have a 0:12:10.400 --> 0:12:13.000 great weekend. Ian LUs Beda, Dr Ian las Beda over 0:12:13.000 --> 0:12:16.080 at n y u Lango Medical Center. This is Bloomberg 0:12:16.080 --> 0:12:19.760 Business Week with Carol Masser and Bloomberg Quick Takes. Tim 0:12:19.800 --> 0:12:23.520 Stenovic on Bloomberg Radio. A lot going on on the 0:12:23.559 --> 0:12:27.080 Russian Ukrainian front today, you know that, And that includes 0:12:27.120 --> 0:12:31.240 something that we heard thanks to our Bloomberg's Maria today 0:12:31.320 --> 0:12:33.760 or she caught up with Ukrainian President Zelinski's chief of 0:12:33.760 --> 0:12:38.280 staff igor Zakova, and he told her the Ukraine will 0:12:38.360 --> 0:12:42.240 never surrender. He don't want the peace agreement on the 0:12:42.320 --> 0:12:45.480 Russian terms. They wanted us to have a peace agreement 0:12:45.480 --> 0:12:47.840 on the Russian forms at the beginning. They wanted to 0:12:47.960 --> 0:12:51.040 all their provisions to be implemented, all their demands of dreadlines. No, 0:12:51.400 --> 0:12:54.280 but we don't have any agreement any any peaceful agreement 0:12:54.400 --> 0:12:57.120 or the peaceful women at any terms. We will want 0:12:57.160 --> 0:13:00.640 the peaceful women at Ukrainian terms because we're served in West. 0:13:00.679 --> 0:13:07.240 Survivan again that as Ukrainian President Zelanski's chief of staff Egorzakova. Um, 0:13:07.320 --> 0:13:10.160 we are so lucky to have access to this next guest, 0:13:10.160 --> 0:13:13.880 her expertise and Russian President Vladimir Putin has just been 0:13:14.280 --> 0:13:17.160 uh so important and valuable to us. Back with us 0:13:17.200 --> 0:13:20.360 as Angela Stent, Senior advisor to the Center for Eurasian, 0:13:20.440 --> 0:13:23.360 Russian and East European Studies, also served as a National 0:13:23.360 --> 0:13:26.800 Intelligence Officer for Russia and Eurasia at the National Intelligence 0:13:26.840 --> 0:13:29.439 Council and before that served at the U. S Department 0:13:29.440 --> 0:13:32.240 of State. Her latest book is on Vladimir Putin. It's 0:13:32.320 --> 0:13:35.040 entitled Putin's World, Russia against the West End with the 0:13:35.120 --> 0:13:38.840 rest once again on the phone from Washington, d C. Angela, 0:13:38.960 --> 0:13:40.880 thank you again for just checking in with us or 0:13:40.960 --> 0:13:45.040 giving us some time again. Um, where are we on this? 0:13:45.200 --> 0:13:47.480 What do you think might be next? In terms of 0:13:47.679 --> 0:13:52.480 Vladimir Putin's efforts and moves? So interestingly enough, the Russian 0:13:52.520 --> 0:13:56.199 military today held a press conference and said, well, actually 0:13:56.240 --> 0:13:59.680 we're just going to focus on securing the Donbass region, 0:13:59.760 --> 0:14:04.480 that's the region in southeastern Ukraine with the two separatist entities. 0:14:04.800 --> 0:14:08.960 So suddenly they're not talking anymore about the whole of Ukraine, 0:14:08.960 --> 0:14:11.680 about Kiev, and they're saying, well, we never meant to 0:14:11.840 --> 0:14:15.079 do anything else but that anyway, which of course is 0:14:15.120 --> 0:14:17.440 completely different from what they said a few weeks ago. 0:14:17.880 --> 0:14:20.880 If that's true, then that means that, you know, the 0:14:20.960 --> 0:14:25.280 Ukrainians have successfully been resisting them. They're not going to 0:14:25.280 --> 0:14:27.840 be able to take key of any time soon. So 0:14:27.880 --> 0:14:29.680 we'll have to see what this brings in the next 0:14:29.720 --> 0:14:33.960 few days. So what do you make of that specific move? 0:14:34.000 --> 0:14:35.760 I mean, is that a way for Putin in his 0:14:35.840 --> 0:14:40.120 military to to save face, to get out. It appears 0:14:40.120 --> 0:14:42.440 that it could be they could say we said all 0:14:42.480 --> 0:14:45.640 along we wanted to secure these republics. Uh, they will 0:14:45.680 --> 0:14:48.200 have them secured, and they can say now we know that, 0:14:48.720 --> 0:14:51.720 you know, the Ukrainian quote unquote fascists and Nazis won't 0:14:51.760 --> 0:14:53.880 get them, and we can go home. I mean, I 0:14:53.880 --> 0:14:56.960 wouldn't jump to conclusions that's that's going to happen immediately, 0:14:57.280 --> 0:15:00.040 but they are giving themselves now a way out. It 0:15:00.760 --> 0:15:03.000 is there there there a lot of questions about whether 0:15:03.080 --> 0:15:06.960 or not Zelinski and the Ukrainians would actually seed on 0:15:07.000 --> 0:15:11.360 the don Bus region right there. Certainly is and you 0:15:11.400 --> 0:15:13.920 know it would depend. Then you'd have to have negotiations 0:15:14.280 --> 0:15:16.480 and you'd have to see, you know, what the Russians 0:15:16.480 --> 0:15:19.360 are demanding and what the Ukrainians are willing to concede. 0:15:19.400 --> 0:15:22.240 And obviously there you know, if they've done well the 0:15:22.360 --> 0:15:24.560 Ukrainians as they have, they're going to be tougher in 0:15:24.600 --> 0:15:27.600 these negotiations. But is this just a case if indeed 0:15:27.640 --> 0:15:31.920 we see President Putin and Russia retreating on this, is 0:15:31.920 --> 0:15:34.760 this just a case of okay for now, but that 0:15:34.880 --> 0:15:39.160 his intentions haven't really changed about his uh feelings and 0:15:39.240 --> 0:15:42.760 plans for Ukraine. Yeah, I don't think we can say 0:15:42.800 --> 0:15:46.440 at this point that his intentions have changed. I think 0:15:46.440 --> 0:15:49.080 that he you know, his goal remains the subjugation of 0:15:49.160 --> 0:15:51.840 Ukraine and having a government in power and KEIV that's 0:15:51.880 --> 0:15:54.680 pro Russian and gives up on trying to join the West. 0:15:55.280 --> 0:15:58.160 Those were his goals you know, years ago, months ago, 0:15:58.480 --> 0:16:00.880 and they remained the same. But you know, you could 0:16:00.920 --> 0:16:02.960 at least have a lot, You could have a siege fire. 0:16:03.200 --> 0:16:06.000 You're gonna have a regrouping, and then let's see what 0:16:06.080 --> 0:16:09.280 happens going forward, and let's see if Russia changes some 0:16:09.400 --> 0:16:12.000 of its gold depending on how badly all of these 0:16:12.200 --> 0:16:15.200 sanctions hit. Going forward, if there is a regrouping, what 0:16:15.320 --> 0:16:17.480 happens to the rest of the world. Has have things 0:16:17.600 --> 0:16:21.280 changed indefinitely at this point, whether it comes to where 0:16:21.280 --> 0:16:25.360 Europe gets its energy, whether it comes to strengthening of NATO, 0:16:25.520 --> 0:16:31.400 has that changed at least for the mid term. I'm 0:16:31.400 --> 0:16:33.360 trying to think of duration, what's the right duration. Have 0:16:33.480 --> 0:16:38.280 these kind of changed They definitely, yeah, I think they 0:16:38.320 --> 0:16:42.240 definitely have, because you know, the Europeans, outside world has 0:16:42.280 --> 0:16:46.520 realized that Russia undertook this unprovoked invasion in the middle 0:16:46.520 --> 0:16:52.520 of Europe, causing this humanitarian catastrophe, refugee crisis, displaced persons. 0:16:52.520 --> 0:16:55.160 We've heard that Ukrainians have been abducted and taken to 0:16:55.520 --> 0:16:59.920 different locations in Russia. So nobody is you know, going 0:17:00.080 --> 0:17:03.160 to It's not going to go back to what it 0:17:03.240 --> 0:17:07.280 was before. The question is whether the conflict would in 0:17:07.359 --> 0:17:10.479 fact be over um at some time in the near future, 0:17:10.520 --> 0:17:13.720 and that meant might that make people rethink things? But 0:17:13.960 --> 0:17:16.520 I think for the medium term, nothing's going to change. 0:17:16.560 --> 0:17:18.879 People are going to realize that the system we had 0:17:19.000 --> 0:17:22.440 before Febry twenty four, before the invasion is broken, and 0:17:22.840 --> 0:17:24.919 you know, something needs to be done to fix it. 0:17:25.080 --> 0:17:30.240 Just real quickly. What's medium term that? Three five years? Yeah, 0:17:30.359 --> 0:17:35.479 I mean it's it's it's a few years. I would say, definitely, definitely, Angela. 0:17:35.520 --> 0:17:37.720 You wrote a book, as Carol mentioned, called Putin's World, 0:17:37.800 --> 0:17:40.800 Russia against the West and with the rest. What do 0:17:40.840 --> 0:17:43.640 you think is going on in Putin's head right now? 0:17:43.840 --> 0:17:46.119 How do you think he is feeling and how do 0:17:46.160 --> 0:17:48.720 you think he how do you It's hard to be 0:17:48.920 --> 0:17:50.679 It's impossible to predict what he's going to do. But 0:17:50.960 --> 0:17:52.760 given that he thought he was going to take Keep 0:17:52.800 --> 0:17:55.840 in a matter of hours or days, and here Russian 0:17:55.840 --> 0:17:58.280 troops are in a stalemate outside many of the major 0:17:58.320 --> 0:18:02.600 cities right now, well, I mean, he must be very 0:18:02.680 --> 0:18:06.040 angry at those advisors of his who reinforced what he 0:18:06.080 --> 0:18:08.080 wanted to believe, which was this was going to be 0:18:08.080 --> 0:18:11.679 a cakewalk and the Ukrainians were going to concede, you know, 0:18:11.760 --> 0:18:15.040 within seventy two hours. So he must be very angry 0:18:15.080 --> 0:18:18.840 at that. I think he's amazed, really by the fact 0:18:18.920 --> 0:18:21.760 that you've had allied unity on these very tough sanctions. 0:18:21.800 --> 0:18:24.080 I don't think he thought the sanctions like this would 0:18:24.080 --> 0:18:26.760 be imposed, and now Russian has to scrambled to see 0:18:26.800 --> 0:18:30.160 how it's gonna deal with you sanctions going forward. Uh, 0:18:30.160 --> 0:18:33.320 he's and I think he's seen, um, you know, very 0:18:33.400 --> 0:18:36.880 surprised by Ukrainian resistance. Hey, really quickly twenty seconds, because 0:18:36.880 --> 0:18:38.840 you understand this world. Do you think the oligarchs are 0:18:38.840 --> 0:18:42.000 calling him up and saying enough already, Vladimir, knock it 0:18:42.040 --> 0:18:45.240 off just quickly. Well, they may be, but they don't 0:18:45.240 --> 0:18:47.720 really have that kind of influence over him. The people 0:18:47.760 --> 0:18:50.360 who have influence overhead of the people from the security 0:18:50.400 --> 0:18:53.760 said this is not the oligarchs. You're a gem. Thank 0:18:53.800 --> 0:18:56.040 you so much. When we heard all the news and 0:18:56.080 --> 0:18:57.920 headlines again this morning, we're like, this is who we 0:18:57.960 --> 0:18:59.840 want to talk to. So Angela, thank you so much. 0:19:00.000 --> 0:19:02.959 Aways appreciated. Angelis Stent, advisor to the Center for Eurasian, 0:19:03.000 --> 0:19:05.560 Russian and East European Studies. Check out her book called 0:19:05.600 --> 0:19:09.879 Putin's World. You're listening to Bloomberg Business Week with Carol 0:19:09.920 --> 0:19:14.359 Messer and Bloomberg Quick Takes Tim Stinovic on Bloomberg Radio 0:19:14.760 --> 0:19:17.959 flet of crypto headlines among them, and Caroline mentioned at 0:19:17.960 --> 0:19:20.600 Caroline Hyde earlier about eight Ether up for a second day, 0:19:20.640 --> 0:19:23.199 extending it's a performance compared with Bitcoin. There's a lot 0:19:23.240 --> 0:19:26.760 of excitement over an upcoming software upgrade, promises to reduce 0:19:26.840 --> 0:19:30.240 the blockchains carbon footprint, paved the way to improve the 0:19:30.240 --> 0:19:32.320 network scalability and efficiency. So that's given a little bit 0:19:32.320 --> 0:19:34.120 of a boost. Let's get into it with our next guests. 0:19:34.160 --> 0:19:36.360 We're really pleased to be joined by Bret Harrison, who's 0:19:36.400 --> 0:19:39.359 president of f t X US. Before f t x 0:19:39.640 --> 0:19:43.679 he was the head of semi systematic technology at Citadel Securities. 0:19:44.160 --> 0:19:46.280 Before that, he was at Jane Street, where you led 0:19:46.280 --> 0:19:49.200 the firm's algorithmic trading system development. Brett, good to talk 0:19:49.200 --> 0:19:51.680 to you again. How are you Yeah, great to talk 0:19:51.680 --> 0:19:53.720 to you too. How are you We're doing well? Thanks. Um. 0:19:53.760 --> 0:19:55.359 I want to start with just what you're seeing on 0:19:55.400 --> 0:19:58.640 the platform right now. We did talk just a few 0:19:58.640 --> 0:20:00.520 moments ago about the rise of is that we're seeing 0:20:00.520 --> 0:20:02.160 with Bitcoin is up for a second day in a row. 0:20:02.200 --> 0:20:05.840 It's getting another bid today, best levels in more than 0:20:05.880 --> 0:20:07.040 a month. What are you seeing on f t X 0:20:07.160 --> 0:20:13.200 USS platform. Yeah, we're definitely seeing increased volumes across the board. Um. 0:20:14.200 --> 0:20:16.880 The top asset on the platform right now is Ether, 0:20:17.000 --> 0:20:19.240 a lot of excitement around as you mentioned the upcoming 0:20:19.280 --> 0:20:23.800 upgrades on Ether promise about future scalability, lower transaction costs 0:20:23.880 --> 0:20:27.520 or emissions, and so Ether followed by Bitcoin, followed by 0:20:27.520 --> 0:20:30.360 Salona the top three assets on ft X. You asked today, 0:20:30.440 --> 0:20:32.600 so what would you say an increase in volume? Give us, 0:20:32.600 --> 0:20:34.720 give us some numbers, were Bloomberg. We're nerdy, we like 0:20:34.760 --> 0:20:37.520 to know numbers. So how much are you seeing an 0:20:37.520 --> 0:20:39.959 increase in volumes? And I'm curious about types of users 0:20:40.000 --> 0:20:43.480 new users? What kind of growth are you seeing there? Sure? Um, 0:20:43.600 --> 0:20:47.920 generally speaking, dish increase, uh, compared to let's say the 0:20:48.480 --> 0:20:52.679 last month or so. UM, we are are bought volumes 0:20:52.680 --> 0:20:55.040 tends to have and slow, not just with you know, 0:20:55.119 --> 0:20:58.240 increasing prices, but also with just general volatility and a 0:20:58.280 --> 0:21:01.480 lot of institutional market makers. On the last form UM 0:21:01.680 --> 0:21:04.600 users send a just subtly increase. Of course, it's not 0:21:04.680 --> 0:21:07.520 just the prices of assets, but also the budget that 0:21:07.560 --> 0:21:09.879 we've been putting into marketing and trying to acquire and 0:21:10.040 --> 0:21:13.080 used onto the platform as well. Hey, Brett. Um, I 0:21:13.119 --> 0:21:14.640 want to I want to talk a little bit about 0:21:14.680 --> 0:21:16.280 follow you on Twitter. A lot of people follow you 0:21:16.320 --> 0:21:19.600 on Twitter. I'm not the only one. UM. I want to, 0:21:19.760 --> 0:21:21.760 uh just get you to expand on something that you 0:21:21.800 --> 0:21:26.000 tweeted last week. It was all about marijuana related companies 0:21:26.320 --> 0:21:28.679