1 00:00:15,320 --> 00:00:19,439 Speaker 1: That's right. It's spooky weak. It can happen here. Those 2 00:00:19,440 --> 00:00:22,479 Speaker 1: were ghost noises if you haven't realized, and that must 3 00:00:22,480 --> 00:00:26,320 Speaker 1: mean that today we are doing a podcast about mass graves. 4 00:00:27,040 --> 00:00:31,520 Speaker 1: What's going on? What is happening in aboutground, running sounds, 5 00:00:31,560 --> 00:00:35,440 Speaker 1: running water? We've summoned a fucking spirit. Where's that coming from? 6 00:00:36,159 --> 00:00:38,200 Speaker 1: I don't hear it. I don't. I don't hear anything. Guys, 7 00:00:38,320 --> 00:00:42,640 Speaker 1: you're just you don't hear it. It's gone, now, it's gone. 8 00:00:43,440 --> 00:00:47,200 Speaker 1: It's the podcast where we convince Garrison there's a ghost 9 00:00:47,240 --> 00:00:50,840 Speaker 1: in the zoom machine. It's okay, I could I could 10 00:00:50,880 --> 00:00:52,479 Speaker 1: like do a I could do a lesser bad as 11 00:00:52,520 --> 00:00:54,800 Speaker 1: you go to the pentagram? Who really want to? It's fine, 12 00:00:55,360 --> 00:00:58,920 Speaker 1: I'm not worried. I like the pentagram. That's what I'm 13 00:00:58,960 --> 00:01:03,240 Speaker 1: tattooing on my children. Oh nice me too. Yeah, you 14 00:01:03,280 --> 00:01:05,600 Speaker 1: haven't done the forehead though, Like a coward, you've done there. 15 00:01:06,400 --> 00:01:10,320 Speaker 1: Yeah no, I mean elbow. Elbow is the way to go. So, Garrison, 16 00:01:10,360 --> 00:01:14,119 Speaker 1: what do you know about mass graves? Um never been 17 00:01:14,160 --> 00:01:20,040 Speaker 1: to one to my knowledge. They seem like they're not great. 18 00:01:20,120 --> 00:01:24,280 Speaker 1: Usually they're a signifier that something something not great happened. 19 00:01:24,360 --> 00:01:28,840 Speaker 1: A little bit of a noopsie. Uh yeah, yeah, can 20 00:01:28,840 --> 00:01:32,240 Speaker 1: be a way to hide one's mistakes, certainly. Yeah, where 21 00:01:32,280 --> 00:01:34,000 Speaker 1: would you if you have to guess where the biggest 22 00:01:34,000 --> 00:01:36,399 Speaker 1: mass grave in the world is? Where where would you go? For? Well, 23 00:01:36,440 --> 00:01:38,200 Speaker 1: I know there's a lot of big ones in Canada. 24 00:01:39,920 --> 00:01:42,680 Speaker 1: But if I'm going to guess, they call those schools 25 00:01:42,760 --> 00:01:46,560 Speaker 1: in Canada, and yeah, I would say, like Russia, maybe 26 00:01:46,600 --> 00:01:48,440 Speaker 1: he has the biggest mass grave. I don't know. That's 27 00:01:48,440 --> 00:01:50,880 Speaker 1: just like off the top of my head. No, it's not. 28 00:01:51,080 --> 00:01:54,360 Speaker 1: It's you got a guest sharing. Oh no, I know 29 00:01:54,360 --> 00:01:56,840 Speaker 1: where the biggest cemetery is, but I guess that's very different. 30 00:01:57,240 --> 00:02:01,640 Speaker 1: Where is the biggest cemetery? Rock? Really? Okay? Iraq has 31 00:02:01,680 --> 00:02:08,400 Speaker 1: the world and it's supposed to be haunted, so okay, 32 00:02:08,400 --> 00:02:10,720 Speaker 1: this one is not haunted. But as far as I 33 00:02:10,760 --> 00:02:13,120 Speaker 1: can tell, it's the biggest mass grave in the world. 34 00:02:13,800 --> 00:02:18,160 Speaker 1: About thirty four thousand people. Um, And this is in Spain. 35 00:02:18,720 --> 00:02:21,480 Speaker 1: Spain does not get enough credit for it its mass graves. 36 00:02:21,639 --> 00:02:25,520 Speaker 1: In fact, second only to Cambodia in the number of 37 00:02:25,560 --> 00:02:28,639 Speaker 1: mass graves that it has. Spain has about a hundred 38 00:02:28,639 --> 00:02:32,440 Speaker 1: and fifteen thousand people who were forcibly disappeared and are 39 00:02:32,800 --> 00:02:37,760 Speaker 1: still buried in unidentified graves, but about thirty five four 40 00:02:37,800 --> 00:02:39,160 Speaker 1: thousands of them are buried in the place we're going 41 00:02:39,160 --> 00:02:42,280 Speaker 1: to talk about today, which is the Vadi los Cailos 42 00:02:42,400 --> 00:02:47,160 Speaker 1: or the Valley of the Fallen. So the Calros is 43 00:02:47,680 --> 00:02:50,400 Speaker 1: not only a mass grave, but it's also a Catholic basilica. 44 00:02:50,840 --> 00:02:53,880 Speaker 1: It's also the largest basilica in the world. And it 45 00:02:54,000 --> 00:02:58,160 Speaker 1: was built by one Francisco Franco, who was the dictator 46 00:02:58,200 --> 00:03:04,839 Speaker 1: of Spain from the nineteen from nine till and it 47 00:03:04,960 --> 00:03:10,320 Speaker 1: was also his own grave until when Spain dug him up, 48 00:03:10,480 --> 00:03:12,840 Speaker 1: put him in a helicopter, flew him across the country 49 00:03:12,919 --> 00:03:16,399 Speaker 1: so that no one could like car bomb or protest 50 00:03:16,520 --> 00:03:21,160 Speaker 1: or otherwise desecrate his corpse, and buried him in another grave. 51 00:03:22,320 --> 00:03:26,680 Speaker 1: So that's what I want to talk about today, the 52 00:03:26,760 --> 00:03:30,720 Speaker 1: Va los cao It means Valley of the Fallen. Right. Incidentally, 53 00:03:30,760 --> 00:03:33,519 Speaker 1: there's a film called Valley of the Dead, which I said, 54 00:03:33,520 --> 00:03:36,000 Speaker 1: anyone else seen? This? Was it just me who decided 55 00:03:36,040 --> 00:03:41,200 Speaker 1: to curse himself? Okay, just me? More of the shame. Yeah, 56 00:03:41,840 --> 00:03:44,880 Speaker 1: many more people should be enjoying Spanish Civil War zombie 57 00:03:45,080 --> 00:03:49,960 Speaker 1: fiction movies in which both sides come together to fight 58 00:03:50,000 --> 00:03:54,040 Speaker 1: against the greater foe of the undead, and not actually 59 00:03:54,080 --> 00:03:57,280 Speaker 1: a thing that happened. It's the value of the undead. Yeah, 60 00:03:57,360 --> 00:03:59,040 Speaker 1: it could be called the value of the undead. But 61 00:03:59,080 --> 00:04:02,160 Speaker 1: they didn't. They didn't quite get that far. Some of 62 00:04:02,200 --> 00:04:05,360 Speaker 1: the least spectacular dubbing I've ever seen in a film, 63 00:04:06,520 --> 00:04:10,520 Speaker 1: like like, I'm used to watching like English stuff dubbed 64 00:04:10,840 --> 00:04:14,480 Speaker 1: in Spanish, but I don't think I've before seen something 65 00:04:14,560 --> 00:04:18,680 Speaker 1: Spanish dubbed in like really cringe American English. It's not 66 00:04:18,720 --> 00:04:21,359 Speaker 1: it's it's not great. No it's not, but in a 67 00:04:21,400 --> 00:04:25,080 Speaker 1: sense it is also great, but in you know, in 68 00:04:25,080 --> 00:04:29,919 Speaker 1: in a sort of enjoyably bad sense. But yeah it is. 69 00:04:30,040 --> 00:04:34,240 Speaker 1: It is very funny. It's on Netflix. It's free malon Nazis. 70 00:04:34,360 --> 00:04:36,960 Speaker 1: I think it was called in Spanish, but Valley of 71 00:04:37,000 --> 00:04:40,920 Speaker 1: the Dead in in English. People should check it out 72 00:04:40,920 --> 00:04:43,719 Speaker 1: if they want a different spooky film towards this Halloween. 73 00:04:44,640 --> 00:04:47,560 Speaker 1: So let's talk about the value of the fallen. It 74 00:04:47,640 --> 00:04:50,919 Speaker 1: was built under Francos direction as kind of this national 75 00:04:50,920 --> 00:04:54,320 Speaker 1: act of atonement for the Civil War, and at first 76 00:04:54,360 --> 00:04:58,600 Speaker 1: he said it was going to be memorial to both sides, 77 00:04:58,680 --> 00:05:01,760 Speaker 1: so that's like value of the all in. But well, first, 78 00:05:01,800 --> 00:05:03,679 Speaker 1: it was supposed to be a memorial to the martyrs 79 00:05:03,720 --> 00:05:10,000 Speaker 1: of his glorious crusade against the Reds, against Adonism, against Satanism, 80 00:05:10,040 --> 00:05:13,200 Speaker 1: against all the things that are bad according to Franco's 81 00:05:13,320 --> 00:05:16,840 Speaker 1: but it wasn't. Really. It was just a giant monument 82 00:05:16,920 --> 00:05:20,640 Speaker 1: of Franco's national Catholic ideology, which kind of fuses the 83 00:05:20,720 --> 00:05:24,160 Speaker 1: Nah and the Church in this one massive ball of 84 00:05:24,279 --> 00:05:28,040 Speaker 1: terrible shit. It's designed in the neoclassical style, which fascists love. 85 00:05:28,120 --> 00:05:30,960 Speaker 1: Fascist loves the neoclassical style because they can like draw 86 00:05:31,120 --> 00:05:35,320 Speaker 1: these direct lines between themselves and the empires of antiquity, 87 00:05:35,520 --> 00:05:39,080 Speaker 1: right and except without the fucking paint because their cowards 88 00:05:39,080 --> 00:05:44,760 Speaker 1: and fools look white because they're tiny babies. This is true. Yeah, yeah, 89 00:05:44,800 --> 00:05:47,600 Speaker 1: they never did the thing where they like bedazzled their 90 00:05:47,640 --> 00:05:51,359 Speaker 1: statues like the Greeks and the Romans did. Most of shame, 91 00:05:51,440 --> 00:05:53,360 Speaker 1: someone should bust in there with some glit of spray 92 00:05:53,400 --> 00:05:58,000 Speaker 1: paint and tarted up a bit. I haven't done that, unfortunately, 93 00:05:58,240 --> 00:06:02,320 Speaker 1: returned to tradition. Make your stat who look cringe yeh, 94 00:06:02,320 --> 00:06:06,320 Speaker 1: that's how they're supposed look, don't worry that the statues 95 00:06:06,400 --> 00:06:12,080 Speaker 1: do look cringe, but unfortunately they're not shiny, which is disappointing. 96 00:06:12,080 --> 00:06:15,480 Speaker 1: It's built of granite, though, which I guess is kind 97 00:06:15,520 --> 00:06:19,760 Speaker 1: of a return for tradition. It was built very near 98 00:06:20,600 --> 00:06:24,120 Speaker 1: the Escorial, which is like the resting place and palace 99 00:06:24,200 --> 00:06:27,840 Speaker 1: of the Kings of Spain. And that's because Franco wants 100 00:06:27,839 --> 00:06:31,600 Speaker 1: to draw a link between himself and Philip the Second. Right. 101 00:06:31,720 --> 00:06:35,440 Speaker 1: Philip the Second was the King of Spain who, at 102 00:06:35,440 --> 00:06:38,480 Speaker 1: the time that he ruled, ruled every continent that was 103 00:06:38,560 --> 00:06:42,760 Speaker 1: known to European people, or rule territory, and which is great, 104 00:06:42,800 --> 00:06:46,479 Speaker 1: which is not a problem, of course, it's in fact good, 105 00:06:46,320 --> 00:06:50,839 Speaker 1: and an inbred old Spanish dude was ruling over places 106 00:06:50,839 --> 00:06:54,120 Speaker 1: that he couldn't really conceive of and had never visited, 107 00:06:54,200 --> 00:06:57,640 Speaker 1: and there are no problems with that. Okay. So work 108 00:06:57,720 --> 00:07:01,080 Speaker 1: begins on Vils Cairos in ninety forty. Right, it's a 109 00:07:01,160 --> 00:07:03,680 Speaker 1: year after the end of the Spanish Civil War, and 110 00:07:03,760 --> 00:07:06,279 Speaker 1: Franco decrees that he's going to make this memorial to 111 00:07:06,320 --> 00:07:10,720 Speaker 1: the glorious national crusade against the Reds, and unbelievably, he 112 00:07:10,760 --> 00:07:15,080 Speaker 1: wanted work to be finished in a year, which obviously 113 00:07:15,160 --> 00:07:18,080 Speaker 1: he's not operating in like reality because he's a piece 114 00:07:18,120 --> 00:07:22,880 Speaker 1: of ship. But it took twenty years to build, right, 115 00:07:22,920 --> 00:07:29,560 Speaker 1: so it was off by yeah, big construction, understand, Francisco Franco. 116 00:07:31,120 --> 00:07:34,520 Speaker 1: And like King Philip, he could have plunder the entire 117 00:07:35,720 --> 00:07:39,000 Speaker 1: labor and capital of the America's to build his folly, 118 00:07:39,360 --> 00:07:43,080 Speaker 1: and instead he relied on the forced labor of about 119 00:07:43,120 --> 00:07:48,640 Speaker 1: twenty thousand prisoners of war. These were former Republicans, right, 120 00:07:49,120 --> 00:07:52,800 Speaker 1: and they were forced to build a church. Obviously many 121 00:07:52,840 --> 00:07:56,400 Speaker 1: of them did not like the church, and we're not 122 00:07:56,520 --> 00:07:59,920 Speaker 1: really very fond of building what is now the biggest 123 00:08:00,040 --> 00:08:02,200 Speaker 1: Catholic cathedra in the world, actually, and it has the 124 00:08:02,200 --> 00:08:04,880 Speaker 1: biggest cross in the world, which it shocked me that 125 00:08:04,960 --> 00:08:07,320 Speaker 1: the biggest cross in the world wasn't in the United States, 126 00:08:09,520 --> 00:08:11,920 Speaker 1: but I'm sure Ted Cruz is actively working on it 127 00:08:11,960 --> 00:08:16,400 Speaker 1: as we speak. Yeah. I feel like if you like 128 00:08:16,480 --> 00:08:18,920 Speaker 1: walked around my hometown and told people at the biggest 129 00:08:18,960 --> 00:08:20,600 Speaker 1: cross in the world was a Catholic one, they would 130 00:08:20,640 --> 00:08:24,720 Speaker 1: immediately spent twenty trillion dollars building a bigger one. Yeah, 131 00:08:25,520 --> 00:08:28,000 Speaker 1: I mean, the only thing that could convince them to 132 00:08:28,080 --> 00:08:34,080 Speaker 1: defund the police would be yeah, yeah, owning the Catholic cross. 133 00:08:34,440 --> 00:08:36,160 Speaker 1: Maybe we should put that, Maybe we should enter that 134 00:08:36,200 --> 00:08:42,600 Speaker 1: into the discourse on true social or something. That Franco, 135 00:08:42,760 --> 00:08:45,640 Speaker 1: of course, is not the only person buried there. Right 136 00:08:46,040 --> 00:08:48,280 Speaker 1: right next to Franco in the center of the basica 137 00:08:48,640 --> 00:08:51,600 Speaker 1: is his friend Jossi Antonio Primo de dri Veda um 138 00:08:52,920 --> 00:08:56,719 Speaker 1: Primo died exactly thirty nine years before Franco on the 139 00:08:56,760 --> 00:09:01,720 Speaker 1: twenty November, and he because he was killed by the Republicans, 140 00:09:01,720 --> 00:09:05,959 Speaker 1: which is based on good and and he has just 141 00:09:06,040 --> 00:09:10,800 Speaker 1: little gravestone there next to Franco, which of course has 142 00:09:10,840 --> 00:09:15,040 Speaker 1: not created any problems. After Spain it sort of began 143 00:09:15,160 --> 00:09:19,200 Speaker 1: to transition to democracy and Franco died. It's of course 144 00:09:19,280 --> 00:09:21,440 Speaker 1: not a bad thing to put a giant monument to 145 00:09:21,920 --> 00:09:25,600 Speaker 1: fascism and Francoism, and nobody is going to turn up 146 00:09:25,640 --> 00:09:30,559 Speaker 1: there and do a fascism in the years afterwards. Oh yeah, 147 00:09:30,720 --> 00:09:35,080 Speaker 1: it's a little bit unfortunate. So there's every day at 148 00:09:35,080 --> 00:09:39,199 Speaker 1: eleven o'clock a priest sas a mass, and at that 149 00:09:39,360 --> 00:09:43,800 Speaker 1: mass you can generally find old people who will sort 150 00:09:43,800 --> 00:09:46,800 Speaker 1: of mill around for a while and then quietly start 151 00:09:46,880 --> 00:09:52,680 Speaker 1: doing fascist salute, which is not, which is not great. Yeah, 152 00:09:53,120 --> 00:09:55,599 Speaker 1: to be comfortable first, yeah, well you got yeah, you 153 00:09:55,640 --> 00:09:58,800 Speaker 1: gotta get like you've got to sample the vibes and 154 00:09:58,840 --> 00:10:01,520 Speaker 1: then do a fascist and the vibes here are probably 155 00:10:01,520 --> 00:10:04,920 Speaker 1: not great. They also have acquired to any acquire of 156 00:10:05,000 --> 00:10:11,400 Speaker 1: small children who sing why because of fucking what? Because 157 00:10:11,440 --> 00:10:15,360 Speaker 1: everything about this is cursed. There's a film, there's a 158 00:10:15,360 --> 00:10:17,520 Speaker 1: film about these old children who go to a quote 159 00:10:17,559 --> 00:10:22,440 Speaker 1: unquote traditional school at the Basilica, which I can imagine 160 00:10:22,640 --> 00:10:24,680 Speaker 1: it's great, and they learn all kinds of wonderful things 161 00:10:24,679 --> 00:10:27,800 Speaker 1: about critical race theory. Yes. So the priests also says 162 00:10:27,800 --> 00:10:30,600 Speaker 1: a prayer for the fate of Spain and the blessed 163 00:10:31,600 --> 00:10:37,400 Speaker 1: blessed martyrs, which really really is wonderful and perhaps points 164 00:10:37,400 --> 00:10:40,240 Speaker 1: in the direction of the complicity of the Catholic Church 165 00:10:40,320 --> 00:10:42,640 Speaker 1: in looks of the war crimes that we're going to 166 00:10:42,679 --> 00:10:46,319 Speaker 1: talk about today. Second consecutive episode where the Catholic Church 167 00:10:46,559 --> 00:10:49,440 Speaker 1: possible for the whole thing. Wow, I can't believe the 168 00:10:49,480 --> 00:10:53,880 Speaker 1: Catholics did anything bad. No, it's shocking, isn't it, given 169 00:10:53,880 --> 00:10:57,000 Speaker 1: their history of being kind and good and generally respectful 170 00:10:57,040 --> 00:11:01,559 Speaker 1: towards people they disagree with. So true James. Yeah, no 171 00:11:01,679 --> 00:11:05,560 Speaker 1: problems with the Catholic Church. So this particular church is 172 00:11:05,720 --> 00:11:08,800 Speaker 1: hun It's just a giant hole in a granite ridge, 173 00:11:08,920 --> 00:11:11,640 Speaker 1: right again, a giant hole cup by the Fourth labor 174 00:11:11,679 --> 00:11:16,120 Speaker 1: of Prisoners of War. It's called the Value the Fallen 175 00:11:16,200 --> 00:11:20,240 Speaker 1: because today it houses the remains of about thirty three 176 00:11:20,280 --> 00:11:24,199 Speaker 1: thousand people, and this is what makes it the biggest 177 00:11:24,240 --> 00:11:27,640 Speaker 1: mass grave in the world. Right. The monuments Register includes 178 00:11:27,760 --> 00:11:31,760 Speaker 1: many of their names, and it has the motto kaidos 179 00:11:31,800 --> 00:11:37,120 Speaker 1: portiosi Espana, so fallen for God in Spain, which conveniently 180 00:11:37,440 --> 00:11:40,520 Speaker 1: overlooks the fact that most of the people there didn't 181 00:11:40,559 --> 00:11:42,880 Speaker 1: like God very much and really didn't like the version 182 00:11:42,920 --> 00:11:45,800 Speaker 1: of Spain that's being presented here either, right, because the 183 00:11:45,840 --> 00:11:48,840 Speaker 1: vast majority of them were Republicans, people who would fought 184 00:11:48,880 --> 00:11:52,360 Speaker 1: against Franco's idea of Spain and the civil war, and 185 00:11:52,520 --> 00:11:55,360 Speaker 1: the bodies that came there really kind of came there 186 00:11:55,400 --> 00:11:58,920 Speaker 1: in two distinct waves. And so, like I said, Spain 187 00:11:59,000 --> 00:12:03,840 Speaker 1: has about underd and fourteen thousand odd people who are 188 00:12:03,880 --> 00:12:07,600 Speaker 1: buried in unidentified graves. Right. The vast majority of these 189 00:12:07,600 --> 00:12:11,360 Speaker 1: people are Republicans who were killed by Francois forces. But 190 00:12:11,400 --> 00:12:15,480 Speaker 1: some of them are not. Some of them are Francoists, Catholics, 191 00:12:16,400 --> 00:12:21,760 Speaker 1: Carlist other like right wing fascist type people who were 192 00:12:21,840 --> 00:12:26,120 Speaker 1: killed by the Republicans right now, the bulk of those 193 00:12:26,160 --> 00:12:30,320 Speaker 1: people were dug up and identified by the Franco Wish 194 00:12:30,400 --> 00:12:32,440 Speaker 1: regime in the time that he was in power, and 195 00:12:32,480 --> 00:12:34,800 Speaker 1: many of them were moved to the Value of the 196 00:12:34,800 --> 00:12:38,760 Speaker 1: Fallen and they're identified there. But the majority of the 197 00:12:38,760 --> 00:12:42,839 Speaker 1: people in the Valley of the Fallen were Republican people 198 00:12:43,360 --> 00:12:48,160 Speaker 1: whose remains were taken without their consent from mass graves 199 00:12:48,559 --> 00:12:53,240 Speaker 1: where they were victims of Franco's terror right and they 200 00:12:53,240 --> 00:12:56,360 Speaker 1: were moved to the Valley of the Fallen to be 201 00:12:56,520 --> 00:13:02,600 Speaker 1: some kind of like weird pyramid sacrificed ritual. I don't 202 00:13:02,640 --> 00:13:06,520 Speaker 1: have a complete grasp of Catholicism, but I certainly don't 203 00:13:06,559 --> 00:13:10,959 Speaker 1: understand this ship too sort of I don't know, make 204 00:13:11,080 --> 00:13:17,280 Speaker 1: make Franco's temple more like spectacular and it's very strange, 205 00:13:17,320 --> 00:13:20,640 Speaker 1: it's it's it's very cruel, right. I want to quote 206 00:13:21,360 --> 00:13:24,920 Speaker 1: from the BBC article in two thousand and eleven that 207 00:13:25,000 --> 00:13:28,920 Speaker 1: was written about one of these people, Jorge Valdrico so Um, 208 00:13:29,000 --> 00:13:32,640 Speaker 1: Joe Vadrico Canales was taken from his home in August 209 00:13:32,760 --> 00:13:35,200 Speaker 1: six in the middle of the night and shot by 210 00:13:35,200 --> 00:13:38,560 Speaker 1: a Fascist execution squad. His town had fallen to the 211 00:13:38,640 --> 00:13:41,240 Speaker 1: uprising and he had been singled out as a socialist. 212 00:13:42,200 --> 00:13:45,120 Speaker 1: In ninety nine. His remains were dug from a well 213 00:13:45,559 --> 00:13:48,480 Speaker 1: and moved to the valley of the fallen More than 214 00:13:48,520 --> 00:13:51,080 Speaker 1: thirty thousand warded from both sides of transferred there on 215 00:13:51,120 --> 00:13:55,760 Speaker 1: Franco's orders. For me, it's excruciatingly painful that my father's 216 00:13:55,800 --> 00:13:57,640 Speaker 1: remained from a place built to the glory of the 217 00:13:57,720 --> 00:14:01,680 Speaker 1: victors in the military coup, the Fausto Annales. It feels 218 00:14:01,679 --> 00:14:05,480 Speaker 1: like a double crime, first when he was executed, then 219 00:14:05,559 --> 00:14:07,680 Speaker 1: when they moved his body without our permission to a 220 00:14:07,679 --> 00:14:13,520 Speaker 1: place which is totally inappropriate. H So that experienced, sadly, 221 00:14:14,040 --> 00:14:19,360 Speaker 1: is far from uncommon. Right between three, Like I said 222 00:14:19,360 --> 00:14:22,960 Speaker 1: about thirty these graves were dug up. Lots of these 223 00:14:23,000 --> 00:14:27,800 Speaker 1: were like shallow roadside graves. They were wells. Some people 224 00:14:27,800 --> 00:14:31,280 Speaker 1: were buried in graveyards and they were transferred to the value. 225 00:14:31,600 --> 00:14:35,960 Speaker 1: Sometimes they weren't transferred in their entirety. Incidentally, that like 226 00:14:36,080 --> 00:14:42,720 Speaker 1: they did. These mass graves are not well organized, so 227 00:14:42,840 --> 00:14:46,920 Speaker 1: like to perhaps give some context here, like these they 228 00:14:46,920 --> 00:14:50,440 Speaker 1: began in Spain, began exhuming these mass graves in two 229 00:14:50,440 --> 00:14:53,240 Speaker 1: thousand seven, Right, there was a historical memory law past, 230 00:14:54,440 --> 00:14:57,920 Speaker 1: and they're often just just jumbles of corpses and bones. Right, 231 00:14:58,000 --> 00:15:00,520 Speaker 1: some of these mass graves contained like a thousand and people. 232 00:15:01,840 --> 00:15:03,720 Speaker 1: I don't imagine them being like, hey, we're going to 233 00:15:03,800 --> 00:15:05,760 Speaker 1: do a mass grave, now, you know what I mean? 234 00:15:05,800 --> 00:15:10,760 Speaker 1: Like there's kind of digging a hole putting bodies in it. Yeah, yeah, 235 00:15:10,320 --> 00:15:12,800 Speaker 1: it's fair to say, yeah, no one made a good plan, 236 00:15:13,640 --> 00:15:17,880 Speaker 1: which is unfortunate, isn't it. But yeah, they like they 237 00:15:17,920 --> 00:15:19,480 Speaker 1: would were they would get all the people who they 238 00:15:19,520 --> 00:15:23,600 Speaker 1: identified as socialist or or feminist or otherwise objectionable to 239 00:15:23,640 --> 00:15:25,880 Speaker 1: their vision of spanishness and then kill them all. Yeah, 240 00:15:25,920 --> 00:15:28,760 Speaker 1: and then put them in a hole because they consider 241 00:15:28,840 --> 00:15:32,200 Speaker 1: them to be less than human. And they seemingly seemed 242 00:15:32,240 --> 00:15:34,200 Speaker 1: to have dived into the hole and grab some bits 243 00:15:34,200 --> 00:15:35,880 Speaker 1: and pieces and move them to the value of the 244 00:15:35,880 --> 00:15:39,760 Speaker 1: fallen at some point. Wait, so wait, we like how 245 00:15:39,760 --> 00:15:43,320 Speaker 1: are did okay? Like Like what what actually? Like? How 246 00:15:43,360 --> 00:15:45,400 Speaker 1: are like the bodies in the valley of the Fallen? 247 00:15:45,480 --> 00:15:47,920 Speaker 1: Like held? Like what are are they just like, are 248 00:15:47,960 --> 00:15:51,480 Speaker 1: they in like caskets? They just dumped them in another hole? No, 249 00:15:51,840 --> 00:15:54,480 Speaker 1: there are like there are like various it seems like 250 00:15:54,520 --> 00:15:56,600 Speaker 1: there are various different Like some of them are in 251 00:15:56,640 --> 00:16:00,480 Speaker 1: these little stone there are like these little stone tomb 252 00:16:00,520 --> 00:16:03,640 Speaker 1: looking things. But I don't think that those actually contain 253 00:16:03,720 --> 00:16:07,720 Speaker 1: the remains. I think they're in these various pits. So 254 00:16:07,800 --> 00:16:11,240 Speaker 1: they just it's another they moved from one mass grade. 255 00:16:11,400 --> 00:16:14,920 Speaker 1: It's another mass grave that they build a sacrifice temple over. Yeah, 256 00:16:14,960 --> 00:16:20,000 Speaker 1: so they're now beginning to exhume the already exhumed bodies 257 00:16:20,360 --> 00:16:22,560 Speaker 1: front that. So they're now digging up the valley of 258 00:16:22,600 --> 00:16:27,840 Speaker 1: the fallen right to to identify these remains. And Catalonia 259 00:16:27,880 --> 00:16:30,120 Speaker 1: has a d n A registry, So if you believe 260 00:16:30,200 --> 00:16:34,040 Speaker 1: that you're it would be like people of our generations grandparents. 261 00:16:34,920 --> 00:16:37,400 Speaker 1: If you believe that your grandparents are in a mass 262 00:16:37,400 --> 00:16:40,600 Speaker 1: grade that they would disappeared, then you can register your 263 00:16:40,680 --> 00:16:45,120 Speaker 1: DNA And they tested against the mass graves that they're excuming. Well, 264 00:16:45,680 --> 00:16:49,560 Speaker 1: so that's how they that's how they identify people. And Christie, 265 00:16:49,600 --> 00:16:51,880 Speaker 1: do you know what won't dig a mass grave and 266 00:16:51,880 --> 00:17:01,080 Speaker 1: throw your grandparents in it? I cannot Yeah, Black Rifle 267 00:17:01,120 --> 00:17:04,240 Speaker 1: Coffee company. Well, I was just gonna go with Coca Cola. 268 00:17:04,359 --> 00:17:22,159 Speaker 1: But that's three options and we're back. Hopefully. There was 269 00:17:22,240 --> 00:17:25,000 Speaker 1: no reference to mass graves in those adverts, but we 270 00:17:25,119 --> 00:17:28,720 Speaker 1: can't promise you that. Sadly, they also can't promise you 271 00:17:28,720 --> 00:17:31,840 Speaker 1: that there's mass graves they didn't talk about. Yeah, that's 272 00:17:31,920 --> 00:17:36,040 Speaker 1: probably more likely, isn't it. Anyway, enjoy that advert for Nestley. 273 00:17:36,480 --> 00:17:41,159 Speaker 1: Moving on, some of these mass graves have been identified 274 00:17:41,160 --> 00:17:44,240 Speaker 1: by a Spanish nonprofit group called Innovation and Human Rights, 275 00:17:44,560 --> 00:17:47,760 Speaker 1: and they actually have this incredible data set specifically on 276 00:17:47,800 --> 00:17:50,919 Speaker 1: the Valley of the Fallen, where you can look up 277 00:17:51,040 --> 00:17:53,639 Speaker 1: the location of the corpses that are there, right, so 278 00:17:53,760 --> 00:17:58,399 Speaker 1: like where did these where the of the remains that 279 00:17:58,440 --> 00:18:02,200 Speaker 1: have been identified from where they come? And three thousand, 280 00:18:02,359 --> 00:18:06,440 Speaker 1: nine d and two corpses. That's about seventy bus loads 281 00:18:06,480 --> 00:18:11,280 Speaker 1: of dead people. If you want to imagine that they 282 00:18:11,320 --> 00:18:13,720 Speaker 1: came from this small town of Taigona, which is where 283 00:18:13,720 --> 00:18:16,600 Speaker 1: I used to live. That's that's not a big town. 284 00:18:16,720 --> 00:18:18,600 Speaker 1: I was trying to think of like a California town 285 00:18:18,640 --> 00:18:20,400 Speaker 1: to contextualize it by it, but I think most people 286 00:18:20,440 --> 00:18:25,880 Speaker 1: would have heard of towns that's more. I this, despite 287 00:18:25,880 --> 00:18:30,359 Speaker 1: being a pretty rural area, the camp to Tarragon that 288 00:18:30,480 --> 00:18:34,399 Speaker 1: can take contributed about the corpses that remain in the valley, 289 00:18:35,000 --> 00:18:38,919 Speaker 1: and that's probably because it's part of Catalonia. Catalonia was. 290 00:18:39,600 --> 00:18:42,679 Speaker 1: Spain is a is a multi national state, so there 291 00:18:42,720 --> 00:18:45,159 Speaker 1: are lots of nations within Spain, like Catalonia and the 292 00:18:45,160 --> 00:18:47,439 Speaker 1: bas Country being the ones that people are most familiar with. 293 00:18:48,080 --> 00:18:52,240 Speaker 1: Franco particularly hated Catalan separatists, and so as part of 294 00:18:52,280 --> 00:18:56,960 Speaker 1: this ongoing punishment of Catalonia for like trying to leave 295 00:18:57,080 --> 00:19:01,119 Speaker 1: Spain during the Civil War, the Francois dug up the 296 00:19:01,200 --> 00:19:03,640 Speaker 1: remains of the people they'd already murdered and moved them 297 00:19:03,640 --> 00:19:07,480 Speaker 1: to a long way from Catalonia right the Vadlos Gilos 298 00:19:07,560 --> 00:19:11,640 Speaker 1: is near Madrid. Conditions for people who built the valley 299 00:19:11,680 --> 00:19:15,560 Speaker 1: were pretty appalling to the workers and their families lived 300 00:19:15,800 --> 00:19:19,800 Speaker 1: in these shacks. According to archaeologists who exsume them last year, 301 00:19:20,400 --> 00:19:23,879 Speaker 1: families lived in nine meter square shacks with no water electricity. 302 00:19:24,000 --> 00:19:26,480 Speaker 1: They made shoes out of old tires, and they had 303 00:19:26,520 --> 00:19:30,280 Speaker 1: no windows or no heating. Their beds were made of stone, 304 00:19:31,359 --> 00:19:35,720 Speaker 1: and they and their children suffered from malnutrition. It's it's 305 00:19:35,760 --> 00:19:39,080 Speaker 1: not particularly rare for people to have suffered from malnutrition 306 00:19:39,119 --> 00:19:42,160 Speaker 1: in Spain after the Civil War, this period was called 307 00:19:42,200 --> 00:19:45,240 Speaker 1: the Years of Hunger. But even so, it seems like 308 00:19:46,440 --> 00:19:50,480 Speaker 1: there was particular cruelty applied to these people, many of 309 00:19:50,480 --> 00:19:54,239 Speaker 1: whom were serving sentences for things like forming unions or 310 00:19:54,480 --> 00:19:57,760 Speaker 1: forming student political movements right like that. They were like 311 00:19:58,880 --> 00:20:01,439 Speaker 1: they hadn't done anything wrong, that they were the victims 312 00:20:01,480 --> 00:20:04,800 Speaker 1: of a totalitarian state. So one of those people is 313 00:20:05,080 --> 00:20:09,960 Speaker 1: Nicolas Sanchez al Bognosum. He was interviewed being a Catline 314 00:20:09,960 --> 00:20:14,800 Speaker 1: newspaper and Nathionale, and he talks a lot about his 315 00:20:14,880 --> 00:20:19,960 Speaker 1: memories there, and incidentally, he escaped after a few months 316 00:20:20,000 --> 00:20:25,680 Speaker 1: with the help of Norman Mailer's sister. Yeah yeah, oh yeah, 317 00:20:25,760 --> 00:20:30,960 Speaker 1: based Norman. She's incredibly based actually, like yeah, she she 318 00:20:31,200 --> 00:20:33,760 Speaker 1: like helped him escape and then ferried him across the 319 00:20:33,800 --> 00:20:40,320 Speaker 1: Pyrenees to France, where he escaped into exile and Argentina 320 00:20:40,400 --> 00:20:43,880 Speaker 1: and lived for decades. And the only good well, okay, 321 00:20:44,000 --> 00:20:45,359 Speaker 1: I was gonna I was gonna make an only good 322 00:20:45,440 --> 00:20:50,200 Speaker 1: Argentini and exile joke, but I probably probably is actually 323 00:20:50,280 --> 00:20:52,480 Speaker 1: genuinely worth mentioning that a lot like a lot of 324 00:20:52,480 --> 00:20:54,840 Speaker 1: people who were Jews fled to Argentina to like right 325 00:20:54,840 --> 00:20:57,840 Speaker 1: before wor War two. Yeah, and that's a huge thing. 326 00:20:57,920 --> 00:21:01,320 Speaker 1: And you get people like calling them Nazis because they're 327 00:21:01,359 --> 00:21:03,560 Speaker 1: fucking dumb as ship and it's like, guys, come fucking 328 00:21:03,960 --> 00:21:06,679 Speaker 1: like if you can't tell between the Nazi and the 329 00:21:06,680 --> 00:21:09,479 Speaker 1: people they were killing, like please stop. Okay, this has 330 00:21:09,480 --> 00:21:12,520 Speaker 1: been my interlude about people doing this ship because oh 331 00:21:12,560 --> 00:21:16,200 Speaker 1: my god, yeah, maybe maybe don't cast his persons, maybe 332 00:21:16,520 --> 00:21:20,080 Speaker 1: do a little bit of reading first. So yeah, a 333 00:21:20,080 --> 00:21:21,720 Speaker 1: lot of people, a lot of them end up in 334 00:21:21,720 --> 00:21:27,200 Speaker 1: in Argentine exile. Actually, ironically, Argentina also claims universal jurisdiction. 335 00:21:28,640 --> 00:21:31,560 Speaker 1: So what we've seen in the last few years it's 336 00:21:31,640 --> 00:21:37,080 Speaker 1: like Spanish historical memory groups trying to trying to get 337 00:21:37,119 --> 00:21:41,600 Speaker 1: people who perpetrated crimes against humanity under Franco extradited to 338 00:21:41,720 --> 00:21:45,919 Speaker 1: Argentina to be questioned, which which is also very funny 339 00:21:46,040 --> 00:21:49,680 Speaker 1: given that Argentina has its own legacy of crimes against humanity, right, 340 00:21:50,440 --> 00:21:53,560 Speaker 1: and Spain does his ship too. Actually, Spain claims universal 341 00:21:53,640 --> 00:21:57,119 Speaker 1: jurisdiction and we'll try and like extradite people who have 342 00:21:57,160 --> 00:22:01,639 Speaker 1: done crimes against humanity in formerly colonized countries without Spain 343 00:22:01,680 --> 00:22:03,800 Speaker 1: has not faced up to its own crimes against his 344 00:22:03,920 --> 00:22:06,920 Speaker 1: own population. You know, I will say I am entirely 345 00:22:07,040 --> 00:22:09,879 Speaker 1: down for like intentionally starting some sort of like Spain 346 00:22:10,000 --> 00:22:12,720 Speaker 1: Argentina like ship fast where both of them like get 347 00:22:12,720 --> 00:22:14,680 Speaker 1: piste off with each other and start trying each other's 348 00:22:14,680 --> 00:22:18,320 Speaker 1: war criminals. That's really funny. I would be better. I 349 00:22:18,320 --> 00:22:21,439 Speaker 1: would be even more impressed to see, Um, are you 350 00:22:21,480 --> 00:22:29,560 Speaker 1: familiar with who Balfa Gathon is? See that weird prosecutor guys? Yes? Yes, yes, yeah, 351 00:22:30,160 --> 00:22:33,720 Speaker 1: who tried to who tried to try US officials for 352 00:22:33,760 --> 00:22:38,760 Speaker 1: crimes against humanity for the things they didn't guantanamobey. Yeah, 353 00:22:38,840 --> 00:22:41,400 Speaker 1: it would be outstanding. I would love to see like 354 00:22:41,480 --> 00:22:44,119 Speaker 1: Spain and the United States come to blows over like 355 00:22:44,160 --> 00:22:48,680 Speaker 1: their respective crimes against humanity. It would be wonderful, Sandy, 356 00:22:48,800 --> 00:22:52,000 Speaker 1: And like in Iraq too, I think he like, um, 357 00:22:52,080 --> 00:22:54,879 Speaker 1: what was it called that? The do they call it 358 00:22:55,000 --> 00:22:58,320 Speaker 1: enhanced interrogation techniques that they were using when they were 359 00:22:58,320 --> 00:23:01,520 Speaker 1: like elextrocuting people in search? Yeah, so like he tried 360 00:23:01,520 --> 00:23:04,800 Speaker 1: to prosecute people for that, sadly, like everything else in Spain. 361 00:23:05,119 --> 00:23:07,280 Speaker 1: He strayed a little bit too close to looking at 362 00:23:07,280 --> 00:23:11,680 Speaker 1: the corruption of the Spanish state and lost his position, 363 00:23:12,760 --> 00:23:15,600 Speaker 1: which is a shame. He did some pretty chuddly ship himself, 364 00:23:15,640 --> 00:23:18,960 Speaker 1: like he very clearly presided at betrials where people had 365 00:23:19,080 --> 00:23:23,120 Speaker 1: very clearly been tortured and was just like, oh, that's 366 00:23:23,160 --> 00:23:25,920 Speaker 1: interesting to see you in the witness box giving this testimony. 367 00:23:25,960 --> 00:23:27,639 Speaker 1: I'm not going to note the fact that you've like 368 00:23:28,080 --> 00:23:32,520 Speaker 1: very clearly been beaten to ship with a night stick. Yeah, 369 00:23:32,720 --> 00:23:38,320 Speaker 1: Spain a country with no problems, famously, and so yeah, 370 00:23:38,359 --> 00:23:43,000 Speaker 1: Albunos escapes. Actually, there's a film called the Los Angeles Barbaras, 371 00:23:43,160 --> 00:23:49,320 Speaker 1: the Barbara's Years, I guess the Barbarian Years, which which 372 00:23:50,240 --> 00:23:52,320 Speaker 1: looks at his escape, and he was one of only 373 00:23:52,320 --> 00:23:56,520 Speaker 1: two people to be escaped. But people died building the 374 00:23:56,600 --> 00:23:59,560 Speaker 1: Valley of the Fallen right and then were buried there 375 00:23:59,600 --> 00:24:05,120 Speaker 1: in this weird monument to to Francoism. So, like I said, 376 00:24:05,640 --> 00:24:11,120 Speaker 1: Spain really hasn't dealt with its legacy of of mass 377 00:24:11,200 --> 00:24:13,880 Speaker 1: murder right. Um. And it never really had a Truth 378 00:24:13,920 --> 00:24:17,399 Speaker 1: and Reconciliation commission, never really dealt with the amount of 379 00:24:17,440 --> 00:24:23,359 Speaker 1: people murdered after the war. Um. And it's really only 380 00:24:23,400 --> 00:24:25,720 Speaker 1: in the last like ten or fifteen years at Spain 381 00:24:25,800 --> 00:24:29,040 Speaker 1: has begun digging up these mass graves. So um and 382 00:24:29,160 --> 00:24:34,120 Speaker 1: the pedroal Sanchez and the Socialist government, they've they've begun 383 00:24:34,320 --> 00:24:36,479 Speaker 1: doing more to deal with this. In two thousand and 384 00:24:36,520 --> 00:24:39,760 Speaker 1: seven and earlier, Spanish Socialist government passes thing called the 385 00:24:39,800 --> 00:24:43,359 Speaker 1: Law for Historical Memory, and the Law for Historical Memory 386 00:24:43,520 --> 00:24:46,840 Speaker 1: funded the recovery of the memory of the Civil War right. 387 00:24:46,960 --> 00:24:53,200 Speaker 1: And you can draw very obvious parallels between how Spain 388 00:24:53,240 --> 00:24:55,800 Speaker 1: has dealt with its civil war and its tradition to democracy, 389 00:24:55,840 --> 00:24:58,040 Speaker 1: and how the United States has dealt with its Civil 390 00:24:58,119 --> 00:25:01,960 Speaker 1: war right. And you will see like that there is 391 00:25:02,240 --> 00:25:06,240 Speaker 1: um do you got do you know what voxes? Yeah, 392 00:25:06,240 --> 00:25:09,520 Speaker 1: they're they're like the insane for the right party in Spain, yes, 393 00:25:10,240 --> 00:25:13,959 Speaker 1: and so fucking cringe, holy shit, even for the standards 394 00:25:14,000 --> 00:25:18,560 Speaker 1: of far right parties, like oh my fucking god, oh god, yeah, 395 00:25:18,600 --> 00:25:22,840 Speaker 1: do they wear silly outfits? Oh yeah, I would imagine, 396 00:25:22,880 --> 00:25:24,360 Speaker 1: So I don't I don't think. I don't think there's 397 00:25:24,359 --> 00:25:26,399 Speaker 1: ever been a picture of them like where they haven't 398 00:25:26,440 --> 00:25:30,400 Speaker 1: been in like the weirdest looking ship. Because occasionally some 399 00:25:30,520 --> 00:25:34,320 Speaker 1: of the like Spanish fascists were some pretty gay outfits, 400 00:25:34,480 --> 00:25:39,159 Speaker 1: and it's really funny. Are you talking about the phone Legion, 401 00:25:39,200 --> 00:25:43,000 Speaker 1: the ones who were like if Tom of Finland created 402 00:25:43,040 --> 00:25:47,440 Speaker 1: a military Yes, yes, that is exactly who I'm referring to. Yeah, okay, yeah, 403 00:25:47,680 --> 00:25:50,760 Speaker 1: they are not so much outright fascists as a fashy 404 00:25:50,800 --> 00:25:56,440 Speaker 1: military unit. Yeah, but yes, uh yeah, it's I know, yeah, 405 00:25:56,440 --> 00:26:00,800 Speaker 1: absolute first trap. Just like if people should google photos 406 00:26:00,840 --> 00:26:03,560 Speaker 1: if they haven't seen them, it'll occasionally pop up on 407 00:26:03,680 --> 00:26:06,560 Speaker 1: like Twitter or something where people will find these incredibly 408 00:26:06,560 --> 00:26:09,680 Speaker 1: butch dudes who like, like, it's not that they've unbuttoned 409 00:26:09,720 --> 00:26:12,399 Speaker 1: their shirts just so just that their pecks are ripping 410 00:26:12,400 --> 00:26:14,480 Speaker 1: out of their shoes. No, it's their shirts are not 411 00:26:14,600 --> 00:26:19,320 Speaker 1: equipped with buttons, because it ye like, to be in 412 00:26:19,359 --> 00:26:22,360 Speaker 1: that unit, you have to be so incredibly buff that 413 00:26:22,400 --> 00:26:25,000 Speaker 1: you you start buttoning your shirt from the navel down, 414 00:26:26,280 --> 00:26:28,840 Speaker 1: and which, to be fair, is more appropriate in Spain. 415 00:26:29,200 --> 00:26:32,320 Speaker 1: I remember, like I used to teach in Spain and 416 00:26:32,359 --> 00:26:34,400 Speaker 1: then I taught in the United States and coming back 417 00:26:34,440 --> 00:26:36,240 Speaker 1: and being like, oh, I really have to change the 418 00:26:36,280 --> 00:26:41,480 Speaker 1: way I dress to be appropriate for an American audience. Yeah. 419 00:26:41,560 --> 00:26:44,440 Speaker 1: The to get back to mass graves and away from 420 00:26:44,560 --> 00:26:50,320 Speaker 1: tactical first traps. The what Spain didn't have right was 421 00:26:50,560 --> 00:26:54,400 Speaker 1: like Franco didn't get hung upside down from a gas 422 00:26:54,400 --> 00:26:56,960 Speaker 1: station and beaten with sticks in the face. Right, more 423 00:26:57,080 --> 00:27:00,760 Speaker 1: is the shame. There's still time, right body, his body 424 00:27:00,800 --> 00:27:04,800 Speaker 1: is still available for beating. You know, maybe maybe they 425 00:27:04,800 --> 00:27:08,800 Speaker 1: would be the worst thing. But Spain never really faced 426 00:27:08,800 --> 00:27:12,520 Speaker 1: its past. Right, So in seven and amnesty law was 427 00:27:12,560 --> 00:27:16,120 Speaker 1: passed which prevented any criminal investigation into the crimes committed 428 00:27:16,119 --> 00:27:20,320 Speaker 1: in the Franco years. Um statues of Franco, some of 429 00:27:20,320 --> 00:27:23,399 Speaker 1: them were not moved until like the last five or 430 00:27:23,440 --> 00:27:26,760 Speaker 1: ten years, and when they were removed, it was like 431 00:27:26,880 --> 00:27:28,800 Speaker 1: the government just went in in the night and scooped 432 00:27:28,800 --> 00:27:31,760 Speaker 1: them up and no one really said anything and then 433 00:27:31,760 --> 00:27:36,359 Speaker 1: they were gone. And so like Spain has only really 434 00:27:36,400 --> 00:27:39,800 Speaker 1: really recently entered into this period like that we call 435 00:27:39,880 --> 00:27:47,240 Speaker 1: it second transition, and that's like it's transition from Spain 436 00:27:47,320 --> 00:27:50,440 Speaker 1: began transitioning to democracy in right, but what we call 437 00:27:50,520 --> 00:27:54,440 Speaker 1: the period after that, it's more of a post dictatorship then, 438 00:27:54,680 --> 00:27:59,560 Speaker 1: like a complete democratic transition in Spain was still processing. 439 00:28:00,160 --> 00:28:03,720 Speaker 1: As you can see, right, many of its crimes under Franco, 440 00:28:03,800 --> 00:28:07,000 Speaker 1: and it's it's really only begun to process those in 441 00:28:07,040 --> 00:28:10,720 Speaker 1: the last few years. So that gets us up to 442 00:28:12,119 --> 00:28:16,639 Speaker 1: the oh that I think election of Pedro Sanchez right 443 00:28:16,680 --> 00:28:23,680 Speaker 1: in the Socialist government, and um, their decision to exhume Franco. Alright, 444 00:28:23,720 --> 00:28:26,399 Speaker 1: so Franco's Franco's lying in this monument. Right, it's the 445 00:28:26,400 --> 00:28:29,320 Speaker 1: biggest mass grave in the world, and on the day 446 00:28:29,320 --> 00:28:33,400 Speaker 1: of his death, on the twenty February every year, it's 447 00:28:33,440 --> 00:28:36,760 Speaker 1: it's a gathering place for fascists. Right, So, Franco and 448 00:28:36,840 --> 00:28:39,240 Speaker 1: Primo de la Vera both died on the same day, 449 00:28:39,800 --> 00:28:44,040 Speaker 1: and fascists and castalist both love this this kind of 450 00:28:44,080 --> 00:28:52,360 Speaker 1: weird spiritual magic shit and really really yeah, yeah, I've heard, 451 00:28:52,600 --> 00:28:58,200 Speaker 1: I know there are some books about it apparently, huh yeah, okay, 452 00:28:58,400 --> 00:29:01,680 Speaker 1: So yeah, it's it's said that both of them have 453 00:29:01,720 --> 00:29:04,880 Speaker 1: a funnest for this stuff. So then both dying on 454 00:29:04,920 --> 00:29:08,280 Speaker 1: the same day, it's an extremely fucking cursed thing that 455 00:29:08,640 --> 00:29:12,520 Speaker 1: has led to sucks. M hmm. It sucks if you 456 00:29:13,080 --> 00:29:14,560 Speaker 1: if you ever have to go near this place on 457 00:29:14,600 --> 00:29:17,360 Speaker 1: the twenty November, which I don't recommend. Oh god, I 458 00:29:17,400 --> 00:29:20,560 Speaker 1: could only imagine that must be that must be the 459 00:29:20,560 --> 00:29:23,840 Speaker 1: worst time. Yeah, because it's all because it's all of 460 00:29:23,880 --> 00:29:31,760 Speaker 1: the nerdiest Nazis like yeah, it's like yeah, yeah. It's 461 00:29:31,760 --> 00:29:35,760 Speaker 1: like if if like nerdy like Nazi internet people had 462 00:29:35,760 --> 00:29:38,360 Speaker 1: a real life place to gather and just openly do 463 00:29:38,560 --> 00:29:42,840 Speaker 1: fucking fascist salutes, that sounds like it sounds horrible. The 464 00:29:42,880 --> 00:29:46,800 Speaker 1: fascist with a calendar, like no, yeah, the calendar who's 465 00:29:46,840 --> 00:29:52,400 Speaker 1: like into praying. It's like yeah, yeah, really really really 466 00:29:52,440 --> 00:29:56,479 Speaker 1: into praying. I'm just I'm just gonna say this, if 467 00:29:56,520 --> 00:29:59,120 Speaker 1: the if the anarchists were in charge of it wouldn't 468 00:29:59,120 --> 00:30:04,719 Speaker 1: be having fucking stupid, cringe prey fascist meetings. This can 469 00:30:04,760 --> 00:30:09,880 Speaker 1: be prevented, then can rise a third time. Sure, but 470 00:30:09,920 --> 00:30:11,800 Speaker 1: it is the nerdiest thing ever to think about a 471 00:30:11,840 --> 00:30:15,800 Speaker 1: fascist like updating their Google calendar being like, yeah, for 472 00:30:15,880 --> 00:30:19,960 Speaker 1: all their spiritual holidays where their leaders died, why do 473 00:30:20,040 --> 00:30:22,800 Speaker 1: they always celebrate the day that their leaders died. It's 474 00:30:22,800 --> 00:30:28,800 Speaker 1: always the weirdest for us. It's a death cult, right, like, like, 475 00:30:29,400 --> 00:30:32,160 Speaker 1: like their leader dying is this is the moment when 476 00:30:32,160 --> 00:30:35,200 Speaker 1: they finally expressed the pure core of fascism. That's true, 477 00:30:35,280 --> 00:30:38,760 Speaker 1: that that's actually a really good observation that actually is 478 00:30:38,760 --> 00:30:41,880 Speaker 1: is more on the point than what it should be, right, Yeah, 479 00:30:42,040 --> 00:30:48,680 Speaker 1: like immortalizing them on that day? Yeah, I mean was 480 00:30:48,800 --> 00:30:54,400 Speaker 1: the slogan of the did the African the African Army 481 00:30:55,080 --> 00:30:58,000 Speaker 1: like yeah, I think it spains for a legion actually 482 00:30:58,040 --> 00:31:01,000 Speaker 1: like long lived death and they called themselves se yes, 483 00:31:01,360 --> 00:31:04,520 Speaker 1: that is their slogan. They called themselves the um what's 484 00:31:04,520 --> 00:31:08,200 Speaker 1: it called, the Fiances of Death. Yeah, they're they're they're 485 00:31:08,440 --> 00:31:11,760 Speaker 1: they're all gay because they're all married to death, which 486 00:31:11,920 --> 00:31:14,240 Speaker 1: is pretty metal. They're also kind of fashy. But yeah, 487 00:31:14,320 --> 00:31:17,840 Speaker 1: that that that does really showcase the whole death cult 488 00:31:17,960 --> 00:31:21,800 Speaker 1: aspect of fascism. Yeah, you know, you know what, he 489 00:31:21,880 --> 00:31:27,600 Speaker 1: isn't a gay neckcromancer. Again, we can't promise. I wish, 490 00:31:27,760 --> 00:31:32,440 Speaker 1: I wish we could advertise some more recollect I would 491 00:31:32,560 --> 00:31:35,400 Speaker 1: I would be in my element. Yeah. I've just done 492 00:31:35,400 --> 00:31:36,880 Speaker 1: an ad read for a couple of them, as I 493 00:31:36,880 --> 00:31:39,400 Speaker 1: should have should have. Let you know, I am the 494 00:31:39,480 --> 00:31:43,000 Speaker 1: so jealous. That's all that's all I want out of life. Yeah, 495 00:31:43,040 --> 00:31:56,480 Speaker 1: please enjoy these gay necromancy products and services. Okay, we're back. 496 00:31:56,560 --> 00:31:58,160 Speaker 1: I hope you enjoyed that as much as we did, 497 00:31:58,640 --> 00:32:04,080 Speaker 1: so I think credibly cringe and just Boomerie fascist cerevation 498 00:32:04,160 --> 00:32:08,080 Speaker 1: on Franco's death and primer der Rivera's death on November 499 00:32:08,760 --> 00:32:11,520 Speaker 1: always happened at the videos Caidos right, they would turn 500 00:32:11,600 --> 00:32:15,760 Speaker 1: up in two thousand and ten Spain band like fascist symbolism. 501 00:32:15,760 --> 00:32:19,080 Speaker 1: But this hasn't really stopped fascist doing fascist symbolism right, 502 00:32:19,120 --> 00:32:23,160 Speaker 1: including bringing their for land flags, giving it the fascist salute, 503 00:32:24,080 --> 00:32:29,680 Speaker 1: marching and just generally doing like cringe like where where 504 00:32:29,760 --> 00:32:33,760 Speaker 1: like r OTC cosplay meet meets the Catholic Church stuff 505 00:32:34,960 --> 00:32:38,400 Speaker 1: on the twenty November of a year at Franco's grave, 506 00:32:38,840 --> 00:32:41,800 Speaker 1: and its like there are always flowers on Franco's grave, 507 00:32:41,960 --> 00:32:44,640 Speaker 1: like you can't go there on a given day and 508 00:32:44,760 --> 00:32:49,120 Speaker 1: not find someone like lamenting the fact that Franco is 509 00:32:49,160 --> 00:32:51,640 Speaker 1: dead and they can no longer just disappear people they 510 00:32:51,680 --> 00:32:58,640 Speaker 1: disagree with. Right, It's ship and so incidentally an amusing 511 00:32:59,000 --> 00:33:02,320 Speaker 1: sort of side effective. Do you remember the storm area 512 00:33:02,440 --> 00:33:11,000 Speaker 1: fifty one like Facebook thing? Yeah, the right area challenge 513 00:33:11,160 --> 00:33:15,360 Speaker 1: like last year or two years ago, yea three years ago, 514 00:33:16,720 --> 00:33:21,040 Speaker 1: a lot longer ago. It does it also it also 515 00:33:21,040 --> 00:33:25,080 Speaker 1: feels like a very thing. Yeah. So the Spanish version 516 00:33:25,080 --> 00:33:30,120 Speaker 1: of this was Invade via los Calos with the slogan 517 00:33:30,160 --> 00:33:32,880 Speaker 1: that like if the state, the state can't get him, 518 00:33:32,880 --> 00:33:41,960 Speaker 1: if we get him first. I don't think this was 519 00:33:42,000 --> 00:33:45,520 Speaker 1: an anarchist attempt to steal his body, but like massive 520 00:33:45,560 --> 00:33:47,560 Speaker 1: respect of it was. I think it was just some 521 00:33:47,960 --> 00:33:50,960 Speaker 1: extremely online people doing something that they thought was and 522 00:33:51,080 --> 00:33:56,760 Speaker 1: actually is funny, which was yeah, like unfortunately it didn't 523 00:33:56,760 --> 00:33:59,760 Speaker 1: really come too much because they planned to do this 524 00:33:59,840 --> 00:34:05,520 Speaker 1: on a twenty November and in October Franco's body was 525 00:34:05,640 --> 00:34:08,719 Speaker 1: removed from the Valley of the Fallen. Okay, see this 526 00:34:08,719 --> 00:34:10,160 Speaker 1: this is this is the thing with all of these things. 527 00:34:10,200 --> 00:34:11,920 Speaker 1: That's the same thing with the fucking stop Coney thing. 528 00:34:12,000 --> 00:34:14,640 Speaker 1: Like the problem that all of these groups have if 529 00:34:14,640 --> 00:34:16,719 Speaker 1: they want to is they always set their date too 530 00:34:16,760 --> 00:34:20,600 Speaker 1: far out, Like you gotta give it like max. It 531 00:34:20,640 --> 00:34:22,640 Speaker 1: has to be like two weeks out, because if it's 532 00:34:22,680 --> 00:34:27,240 Speaker 1: any longer than that, you moment momentum, Yeah, you get scooped. 533 00:34:27,400 --> 00:34:29,160 Speaker 1: So look, if if you, if you, if you, if 534 00:34:29,200 --> 00:34:30,960 Speaker 1: you want to seize the body of a dead dictator 535 00:34:31,000 --> 00:34:33,840 Speaker 1: and throw them into a canal, you have to move fast. 536 00:34:34,200 --> 00:34:40,480 Speaker 1: And that's why I'm announcing that for for November nineteenth, 537 00:34:40,560 --> 00:34:42,800 Speaker 1: we're all now we probably should not go to Russia 538 00:34:43,840 --> 00:34:46,799 Speaker 1: to have fun with Trotsky's body. Should be Yeah, we're 539 00:34:46,840 --> 00:34:51,080 Speaker 1: going Trotsky's body in Russia. Yeah, I thought so. I know, 540 00:34:51,120 --> 00:34:55,040 Speaker 1: I've seen back from Mexico. I have had I've had 541 00:34:55,160 --> 00:34:58,759 Speaker 1: friends that have gone places to make fun of Trotsky's body, 542 00:34:59,000 --> 00:35:03,120 Speaker 1: um lenning his body, lending his bodies up for grabs, 543 00:35:03,360 --> 00:35:08,080 Speaker 1: like okay, it's just sitting there. Well, maybe get I 544 00:35:08,080 --> 00:35:10,719 Speaker 1: think we should start small. Let's encourage the fans of 545 00:35:10,800 --> 00:35:13,960 Speaker 1: the podcast between now and what we got right, but 546 00:35:14,040 --> 00:35:17,440 Speaker 1: now in eleventh of November, right, go after Papa doctor Valier. 547 00:35:18,360 --> 00:35:22,960 Speaker 1: Get get him start you know that, and then move 548 00:35:23,000 --> 00:35:26,600 Speaker 1: on from there. Okay, it is it's a Mexico. Yeah, 549 00:35:26,680 --> 00:35:30,800 Speaker 1: you're right closer to the sort of geographical heartland, and 550 00:35:31,200 --> 00:35:33,000 Speaker 1: we don't need to go into a war zone. So yeah, 551 00:35:33,440 --> 00:35:35,400 Speaker 1: and the middle of November, we're all going to be 552 00:35:35,440 --> 00:35:39,600 Speaker 1: going going to Mexico road trip, yep, field trip. Yeah, 553 00:35:39,680 --> 00:35:41,439 Speaker 1: let's go. You know, I will say, there is something 554 00:35:41,480 --> 00:35:45,759 Speaker 1: genuinely interesting here about the way that like, okay, so 555 00:35:46,560 --> 00:35:49,120 Speaker 1: you look at sort of fascism, sorry, you look at 556 00:35:49,120 --> 00:35:51,120 Speaker 1: fascism's death drive and the way that it sort of 557 00:35:51,120 --> 00:35:53,719 Speaker 1: like treats his money means to death. And then like 558 00:35:53,880 --> 00:35:55,680 Speaker 1: you look at the way that every single sort of 559 00:35:55,719 --> 00:36:00,160 Speaker 1: like like all this day socialist regimes, like it's not 560 00:36:00,280 --> 00:36:01,960 Speaker 1: so much that they have a death drive, but it's 561 00:36:02,000 --> 00:36:04,840 Speaker 1: like they're like all of them, Like I learned this recently, 562 00:36:04,880 --> 00:36:07,200 Speaker 1: Like so I knew that they didn't too, that they'd 563 00:36:07,239 --> 00:36:10,200 Speaker 1: like embalmed Stalin, right, and like, well they involved Lenin, 564 00:36:10,239 --> 00:36:15,000 Speaker 1: they inbalved mao. Yeah, they also learned they did it 565 00:36:15,000 --> 00:36:17,560 Speaker 1: to Ho Chi Minh too. Yeah, it's just like they 566 00:36:17,560 --> 00:36:19,040 Speaker 1: did it to like all of these people, and it's 567 00:36:19,080 --> 00:36:22,680 Speaker 1: like there there's there's this sort of weird like almost 568 00:36:22,680 --> 00:36:27,440 Speaker 1: in version of it where it's like like fascism is 569 00:36:27,440 --> 00:36:29,120 Speaker 1: based sort of on like you know, like on on 570 00:36:29,160 --> 00:36:31,799 Speaker 1: the sort of totalizing worship of death, whereas stalism is 571 00:36:31,920 --> 00:36:33,719 Speaker 1: like it has this kind of inversion of it where 572 00:36:33,719 --> 00:36:36,560 Speaker 1: it's like it's based on like a kind of like 573 00:36:36,600 --> 00:36:42,320 Speaker 1: eternal life for their leaders in this also incredibly bizarre way. 574 00:36:42,640 --> 00:36:44,440 Speaker 1: And don't want to be like all of Europe is 575 00:36:44,520 --> 00:36:48,319 Speaker 1: determined by its previous like totalitarian religions. But there's there's 576 00:36:48,320 --> 00:36:51,960 Speaker 1: something there's something orthodox about the way they've done the 577 00:36:51,960 --> 00:36:55,759 Speaker 1: dead Russian dudes so I'm wanna talk about Franco's corps 578 00:36:55,760 --> 00:36:56,960 Speaker 1: a little bit, and then I want to end with 579 00:36:57,000 --> 00:36:59,319 Speaker 1: something else, because I don't want to just focus on 580 00:36:59,440 --> 00:37:01,920 Speaker 1: Spanish fact ships because they suck and I hate them 581 00:37:02,080 --> 00:37:05,000 Speaker 1: and I am sad that they are not all dead. 582 00:37:05,040 --> 00:37:09,160 Speaker 1: But Franco is. So Franco's family weren't allowed to use 583 00:37:09,239 --> 00:37:13,120 Speaker 1: the Spanish flag on his coffin. Yeah, so in staid, 584 00:37:13,120 --> 00:37:15,640 Speaker 1: they fucking got the Franco with flag, right, the old 585 00:37:15,719 --> 00:37:19,040 Speaker 1: nationalist flag, which because they have filth, they did that. Instead, 586 00:37:20,000 --> 00:37:22,759 Speaker 1: they carried his coffin onto a helicopter. They flew in 587 00:37:22,840 --> 00:37:28,319 Speaker 1: by helicopter to Madrid, where the services provided over by 588 00:37:28,360 --> 00:37:31,200 Speaker 1: a priest who is the son of Lieutenant Colonel Antonio 589 00:37:31,280 --> 00:37:34,080 Speaker 1: to head on Molina, the man who led the failed 590 00:37:34,760 --> 00:37:39,040 Speaker 1: one coup that attempted to topple Spain's young democracy. And 591 00:37:39,840 --> 00:37:42,520 Speaker 1: great to see this continuation of these elites right like, 592 00:37:42,719 --> 00:37:45,120 Speaker 1: this is a this is a country which has of 593 00:37:45,160 --> 00:37:48,400 Speaker 1: course moved on completely from its civil war and dictatorship 594 00:37:49,400 --> 00:37:52,279 Speaker 1: on the post of side. Franco is now buried with 595 00:37:52,320 --> 00:37:55,880 Speaker 1: his wife and he is very near to Luis Carlo Blanco, 596 00:37:55,960 --> 00:37:59,040 Speaker 1: who people will remember as a podcast alumni in Spain's 597 00:37:59,040 --> 00:38:04,040 Speaker 1: first astronaut and so I was going to quote Vox, 598 00:38:04,600 --> 00:38:08,440 Speaker 1: but I won't because they fucking suck. And now I 599 00:38:08,480 --> 00:38:11,879 Speaker 1: want you quote Box. You should just like throw fruit 600 00:38:11,960 --> 00:38:14,400 Speaker 1: at them, and I think that's like, that's not an 601 00:38:14,400 --> 00:38:19,560 Speaker 1: actionable threat, right, just uh sure, don't throw like any 602 00:38:19,600 --> 00:38:22,160 Speaker 1: fruit sort of potentially lethal, right, like like a large 603 00:38:22,200 --> 00:38:25,920 Speaker 1: watermelon or something potentially fatal like just to banana or 604 00:38:25,960 --> 00:38:29,600 Speaker 1: if you know the Vox representatives like allergic to a fruit, 605 00:38:29,719 --> 00:38:31,440 Speaker 1: you throw it at them and gets on their face 606 00:38:31,600 --> 00:38:34,440 Speaker 1: and they die and it gets blamed on James. We 607 00:38:34,560 --> 00:38:37,600 Speaker 1: all get taken into a year's long lawsuit and then 608 00:38:37,640 --> 00:38:40,080 Speaker 1: we all lose their jobs. Don't do that. Don't do that. 609 00:38:40,200 --> 00:38:43,759 Speaker 1: No blame someone else for that. You can if you 610 00:38:43,800 --> 00:38:47,040 Speaker 1: are directing the police to me in Spain, they can 611 00:38:47,080 --> 00:38:50,000 Speaker 1: contact me by Twitter DM by Twitter is at at 612 00:38:50,080 --> 00:38:53,440 Speaker 1: Chopped at Chappo Trappers. Yep, that's where you can find me. 613 00:38:54,320 --> 00:39:02,759 Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, sell traps. Okay. So of course Fox make 614 00:39:02,800 --> 00:39:05,920 Speaker 1: exactly the same bullshit destroying history argument that the Confederates 615 00:39:05,960 --> 00:39:08,040 Speaker 1: making in the United States. It doesn't make them anymore 616 00:39:08,520 --> 00:39:12,960 Speaker 1: right because they're in fact wrong. But incidentally, someone else 617 00:39:13,040 --> 00:39:18,520 Speaker 1: died on November and that is one boilivant order duty right. 618 00:39:18,760 --> 00:39:22,359 Speaker 1: Unlike Franco, he's not buried in a monument made both 619 00:39:22,360 --> 00:39:28,080 Speaker 1: fucking slaves. He's buried alongside other anarchists in mow in Barcelona. 620 00:39:28,360 --> 00:39:31,160 Speaker 1: You can visit his grave there. It's very cool. You 621 00:39:31,160 --> 00:39:34,759 Speaker 1: can always meet interesting people hanging around his grave. And 622 00:39:34,760 --> 00:39:37,919 Speaker 1: if you're in Bathonia, you should do it. Drutti died 623 00:39:38,320 --> 00:39:40,480 Speaker 1: in the middle of the Battle of Madrid, like so 624 00:39:40,520 --> 00:39:46,080 Speaker 1: many other Spanish anarchists. He died. It's lunclear actually, if 625 00:39:46,120 --> 00:39:49,799 Speaker 1: he died because someone negligently discharged their own weapon into 626 00:39:49,800 --> 00:39:52,400 Speaker 1: his back, and which seems to be the most likely case, 627 00:39:52,600 --> 00:39:55,120 Speaker 1: or leading a frontal charge on a machine gun, which 628 00:39:55,280 --> 00:39:58,960 Speaker 1: which is how so many Spanish anarchists died because they 629 00:39:59,000 --> 00:40:02,400 Speaker 1: were so utterly con vinced if they're incredible, like and 630 00:40:02,400 --> 00:40:05,240 Speaker 1: they're not wrong either, they were right about most things, 631 00:40:05,960 --> 00:40:09,360 Speaker 1: but like you get, their willingness to die for anarchism 632 00:40:09,440 --> 00:40:11,600 Speaker 1: was perhaps a little bit problematic. Well, I mean this 633 00:40:11,800 --> 00:40:13,319 Speaker 1: is this is like a thing across the whole history 634 00:40:13,320 --> 00:40:15,200 Speaker 1: of anarchism, Like like like one of the reasons the Russian 635 00:40:15,200 --> 00:40:17,560 Speaker 1: Revolution went the way they did was that like it's 636 00:40:17,600 --> 00:40:20,480 Speaker 1: like the sort of like first crop of Russian anarchists, 637 00:40:20,520 --> 00:40:22,600 Speaker 1: like the moment the White are formed, immediately just went 638 00:40:22,640 --> 00:40:24,560 Speaker 1: to the front lines and all got killed, and like 639 00:40:24,680 --> 00:40:27,320 Speaker 1: Lenning and meanwhile learning the Trotsky are like fucking Chilling 640 00:40:27,360 --> 00:40:32,280 Speaker 1: and Lenning like fucking Patrick Grading, Like yeah, which exactly 641 00:40:32,360 --> 00:40:35,959 Speaker 1: what happened in Spain, right, like Ferrara, all these people 642 00:40:36,200 --> 00:40:39,760 Speaker 1: like get to the front lines and immediately start killing fascists. Meanwhile, 643 00:40:40,800 --> 00:40:45,959 Speaker 1: tanky people, I was gonna say something else, um like 644 00:40:46,520 --> 00:40:49,239 Speaker 1: spending their time plotting and scheming to from becoming a 645 00:40:49,280 --> 00:40:52,640 Speaker 1: completely fucking irrelevant political force in Spain to taking over 646 00:40:52,840 --> 00:40:56,279 Speaker 1: in a year and a half because they are the 647 00:40:56,280 --> 00:40:59,279 Speaker 1: only people are willing to provide weapons and many of 648 00:40:59,280 --> 00:41:01,799 Speaker 1: the anarchists have it. What were you going to call 649 00:41:01,920 --> 00:41:11,560 Speaker 1: take people? What were you going to call take it? 650 00:41:11,760 --> 00:41:13,799 Speaker 1: Just it makes me angry. I know, it's just gonna 651 00:41:14,000 --> 00:41:21,120 Speaker 1: just that's that is that is an ovisive answer. Yeah, 652 00:41:21,200 --> 00:41:23,680 Speaker 1: I was just gonna say scum or filth or British 653 00:41:23,680 --> 00:41:26,920 Speaker 1: swear word I can't use on the podcast because of 654 00:41:27,080 --> 00:41:32,480 Speaker 1: fans American people, which is fine. Yeah, it's disappointing. I 655 00:41:32,480 --> 00:41:37,319 Speaker 1: don't want to be canceled by work mob. Okay, yeah 656 00:41:38,440 --> 00:41:41,680 Speaker 1: he did Australian moments. Yeah, yeah, exactly. Yeah, I nearly 657 00:41:41,719 --> 00:41:45,160 Speaker 1: went full of Australian which, like I've done it before 658 00:41:45,200 --> 00:41:48,080 Speaker 1: on television and it just doesn't end well, all right, 659 00:41:48,719 --> 00:41:53,319 Speaker 1: uh in Spanish not English, which also a Spanish word. 660 00:41:53,600 --> 00:41:56,120 Speaker 1: Twenty November in Spain this year it will be like 661 00:41:56,200 --> 00:41:58,799 Speaker 1: what three weeks when people are listening to this, some 662 00:41:59,520 --> 00:42:02,200 Speaker 1: fascion ship head if you live in a town in Spain, 663 00:42:02,440 --> 00:42:07,319 Speaker 1: will be walking around doing shitty fascist things. And people 664 00:42:07,360 --> 00:42:08,759 Speaker 1: who live in Spain of course very aware of this. 665 00:42:08,840 --> 00:42:11,160 Speaker 1: But I wanted to finish it said with another thing 666 00:42:11,239 --> 00:42:14,200 Speaker 1: that anti fascists in Spain doing November. So in the 667 00:42:14,239 --> 00:42:18,319 Speaker 1: fifte November this year, anti fascists all over Spain will 668 00:42:18,360 --> 00:42:22,799 Speaker 1: be gathering to remember fifteen years without Carlos Palomino. People 669 00:42:22,880 --> 00:42:25,399 Speaker 1: might not know who Carlos Palomino is, but I want 670 00:42:25,440 --> 00:42:29,000 Speaker 1: to very briefly recap his story to finish up. So 671 00:42:29,040 --> 00:42:31,920 Speaker 1: on the eleventh of November two thousand and seven, Carlos 672 00:42:31,960 --> 00:42:35,160 Speaker 1: Palomino and about a hundred other anti fascists got on 673 00:42:35,239 --> 00:42:37,560 Speaker 1: the subway in Madrid to counter protest a right wing 674 00:42:37,640 --> 00:42:41,360 Speaker 1: rally and Luca, an immigrant neighborhood that's home to mcgrid's 675 00:42:41,400 --> 00:42:44,360 Speaker 1: Chinatown today. On the train on the way there, he 676 00:42:44,440 --> 00:42:46,719 Speaker 1: ran into a twenty four year old spanage soldier, or 677 00:42:46,800 --> 00:42:52,600 Speaker 1: says wait Este banners. Uh. Estebanez was dressed in clothes. 678 00:42:53,480 --> 00:42:55,120 Speaker 1: I mean, I don't want to talk about the brand actually, 679 00:42:55,120 --> 00:42:59,880 Speaker 1: because we shouldn't hype market Nazis. But the clothes showed 680 00:43:00,080 --> 00:43:03,839 Speaker 1: he was a far right skinhead. Right. Carlos Palomino notes 681 00:43:03,960 --> 00:43:09,280 Speaker 1: is Estebanez takes offense at Carlos Palomino, noting his Nazi 682 00:43:09,320 --> 00:43:15,280 Speaker 1: clothes and stabs him with a machette. Yeah, he stabbed 683 00:43:15,320 --> 00:43:19,240 Speaker 1: someone else as well, but unfortunately Carlos dies pretty quickly. 684 00:43:19,600 --> 00:43:22,160 Speaker 1: He was sixteen years old at the time of his death. 685 00:43:23,480 --> 00:43:25,239 Speaker 1: He was the only child of his mother, and he 686 00:43:25,320 --> 00:43:27,319 Speaker 1: lived with his mom, who was separated from his dad 687 00:43:27,320 --> 00:43:30,920 Speaker 1: and his grandmother. And it affected his mother, as one 688 00:43:30,960 --> 00:43:33,640 Speaker 1: can imagine, pretty terribly right the loss of loss of 689 00:43:33,680 --> 00:43:37,359 Speaker 1: her young son, and as a result, his mother has 690 00:43:37,400 --> 00:43:41,760 Speaker 1: become a prominent anti fascist activist in Spain. She founded 691 00:43:41,800 --> 00:43:45,480 Speaker 1: the Association of the Victims of Fascist, racist and Homophobic Violence, 692 00:43:46,560 --> 00:43:49,840 Speaker 1: and ten years after his death, a thousand people turned 693 00:43:49,840 --> 00:43:53,879 Speaker 1: out and a memorial to him, and ever like, ever 694 00:43:53,920 --> 00:43:57,480 Speaker 1: since he died, every year you'll see these massive rallies 695 00:43:57,520 --> 00:44:01,320 Speaker 1: in Spain of anti fascists And if you've ever seen, 696 00:44:01,960 --> 00:44:03,799 Speaker 1: do you remember, like a year or so ago, there 697 00:44:03,880 --> 00:44:05,680 Speaker 1: was this video going around Tricher and there was a 698 00:44:05,680 --> 00:44:09,520 Speaker 1: group of people chanting like a kiss anti fascist us, 699 00:44:09,840 --> 00:44:14,040 Speaker 1: here are the anti fascists. I see such videos on 700 00:44:14,040 --> 00:44:16,520 Speaker 1: Twitter all the time, so I don't, I don't, I 701 00:44:16,560 --> 00:44:19,520 Speaker 1: don't know, okay, it like it gained relevance among people 702 00:44:19,560 --> 00:44:23,400 Speaker 1: who I've never seen engaging with Spain in any thing before. 703 00:44:23,960 --> 00:44:28,359 Speaker 1: It was a huge rally one thousands of people came 704 00:44:28,400 --> 00:44:31,359 Speaker 1: out to remember him, and I'm sure thousands of people 705 00:44:31,360 --> 00:44:35,800 Speaker 1: will this year too. Like it with Spain's like Spain's 706 00:44:35,880 --> 00:44:37,799 Speaker 1: right for a long time tried to couch itself in 707 00:44:37,920 --> 00:44:40,560 Speaker 1: terms of the neoliberal center right. Yes, so like the 708 00:44:40,600 --> 00:44:44,280 Speaker 1: Partido Popular would see itself in terms of like maybe 709 00:44:44,280 --> 00:44:48,560 Speaker 1: the Tories in Britain or Editories are pretty uh pretty mental, 710 00:44:49,200 --> 00:44:52,000 Speaker 1: but like this this kind of neoliberal European right. Yeah, 711 00:44:52,000 --> 00:44:57,520 Speaker 1: and it it broadly sort of wanted to see itself 712 00:44:57,560 --> 00:45:01,960 Speaker 1: as part of this like post fascist European right. But 713 00:45:02,239 --> 00:45:06,000 Speaker 1: in recent years it's just taken this disk swing towards 714 00:45:06,000 --> 00:45:09,160 Speaker 1: the hard right like Vox has emerged, and even the 715 00:45:09,200 --> 00:45:12,120 Speaker 1: Partido Popular, which would have seen itself as like neoliberal right, 716 00:45:12,320 --> 00:45:15,839 Speaker 1: have tried to like outbox Vox and they're now like 717 00:45:16,360 --> 00:45:21,000 Speaker 1: just openly standing Francoism again. And in this climate, anti 718 00:45:21,040 --> 00:45:25,719 Speaker 1: fancism has also seen itself resurgent. I guess we're an 719 00:45:25,719 --> 00:45:28,279 Speaker 1: anti fascist. Identities in Spain are more relevant or more 720 00:45:28,600 --> 00:45:32,680 Speaker 1: common than they would have been ten, fifteen, twenty years ago, 721 00:45:32,800 --> 00:45:36,440 Speaker 1: something like that. And as a result, these memorials for 722 00:45:36,520 --> 00:45:38,360 Speaker 1: Carlos have become bigger and bigger for a year, and 723 00:45:38,840 --> 00:45:41,799 Speaker 1: so I wanted to end with a letter his mum 724 00:45:41,880 --> 00:45:45,160 Speaker 1: rate to global anti fascist collectives in two and eleven. 725 00:45:46,760 --> 00:45:49,440 Speaker 1: In our memories, all the anti fascist victims will always 726 00:45:49,480 --> 00:45:52,920 Speaker 1: exist who fighting for a world of equality, dignity, freedom 727 00:45:52,960 --> 00:45:55,839 Speaker 1: and social rights were killed by the ideas of intolerance 728 00:45:55,840 --> 00:45:59,839 Speaker 1: and fascism. The memory will exist for all those victims who, 729 00:46:00,120 --> 00:46:03,000 Speaker 1: due to their different cultures, religions or sexual orientations, were 730 00:46:03,080 --> 00:46:06,960 Speaker 1: murdered by the same murdering hands who hate those who 731 00:46:06,960 --> 00:46:10,600 Speaker 1: are different. Now it's time to continue working against hate 732 00:46:10,960 --> 00:46:13,080 Speaker 1: that it is the best tribute we can offer. Their 733 00:46:13,080 --> 00:46:15,680 Speaker 1: struggles were not in vain. We will continue the path, 734 00:46:16,239 --> 00:46:18,760 Speaker 1: although they are no longer with us in every action 735 00:46:18,760 --> 00:46:21,800 Speaker 1: of anti Fascy struggle. They're inside and in each and 736 00:46:21,840 --> 00:46:25,640 Speaker 1: every one of our hearts, which I thought was really poignant. 737 00:46:25,680 --> 00:46:29,160 Speaker 1: His mother is amazing. Yeah, this whole thing fucking breaks me. 738 00:46:29,280 --> 00:46:32,920 Speaker 1: Like I was. This was a time when, like I too, 739 00:46:33,000 --> 00:46:36,719 Speaker 1: was being a teenage anti fascist in Spain, and this 740 00:46:36,800 --> 00:46:41,680 Speaker 1: is someone who's like almost exactly my age, and obviously 741 00:46:42,080 --> 00:46:46,440 Speaker 1: it isn't alive anymore. And yeah, I'd encourage people to 742 00:46:46,480 --> 00:46:51,239 Speaker 1: read more about him. I'd normally share these events on 743 00:46:51,320 --> 00:46:55,280 Speaker 1: social media when they happen. And yeah, this is extremely 744 00:46:55,320 --> 00:46:59,240 Speaker 1: sad and continues to be extremely sad because Spain refuses 745 00:46:59,239 --> 00:47:02,480 Speaker 1: to face up to it past the dictatorship. You can 746 00:47:02,480 --> 00:47:05,560 Speaker 1: look at where Franco's grave is, organized a protest and 747 00:47:05,920 --> 00:47:08,799 Speaker 1: executed within two weeks and toss him in the river 748 00:47:08,880 --> 00:47:11,880 Speaker 1: if you want to be very proud of you. That 749 00:47:12,120 --> 00:47:17,480 Speaker 1: is absolutely illegal thing to do, and I would be 750 00:47:17,520 --> 00:47:21,239 Speaker 1: prosecuting in Spain, but yeah it did. Any Spain has 751 00:47:21,280 --> 00:47:26,879 Speaker 1: prosecuted everyone from sucking clowns to puppeteers. Now it's now. 752 00:47:26,920 --> 00:47:29,040 Speaker 1: It's serious. When you start coming out of the clowns 753 00:47:29,120 --> 00:47:32,399 Speaker 1: is when I I started getting personally consulted. We need 754 00:47:32,440 --> 00:47:35,120 Speaker 1: to do our episode on clown Block soon, don't we 755 00:47:35,120 --> 00:47:37,600 Speaker 1: we do. I can put on I have clown Block 756 00:47:37,760 --> 00:47:43,840 Speaker 1: right behind me. Okay, yeah yeah, And then the British 757 00:47:43,840 --> 00:47:46,680 Speaker 1: police will send someone undercover in your clown movement for 758 00:47:46,719 --> 00:47:52,160 Speaker 1: five years who will marry one of you and let 759 00:47:53,360 --> 00:47:56,560 Speaker 1: maybe a silly gesture, leave me alone. No, not in Britain. 760 00:47:57,320 --> 00:48:02,120 Speaker 1: It's a crime, all right. Uh, okay, that's been a podcast. 761 00:48:02,440 --> 00:48:18,040 Speaker 1: Few crimes. Okay. It could happen here as a production 762 00:48:18,040 --> 00:48:21,080 Speaker 1: of cool Zone Media. For more podcasts from cool Zone Media, 763 00:48:21,200 --> 00:48:23,640 Speaker 1: visit our website cool zone media dot com, or check 764 00:48:23,719 --> 00:48:25,960 Speaker 1: us out on the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, 765 00:48:26,080 --> 00:48:29,040 Speaker 1: or wherever you listen to podcasts. You can find sources 766 00:48:29,080 --> 00:48:31,680 Speaker 1: for It could Happen here, updated monthly at cool zone 767 00:48:31,680 --> 00:48:34,480 Speaker 1: Media dot com slash sources. Thanks for listening.