Speaker 1: Hey, and welcome to the short stuff. I'm Josh, there's
Speaker 1: Chuck and this is short stuff, So let's stop wasting
Speaker 1: time and begin speaking. Now. Yes, we are going to
Speaker 1: talk about adoption birth certificate access and where did we
Speaker 1: get this? Uh? Where do we get some of this? Rob?
Speaker 1: I believe we found out how stuff works, but they
Speaker 1: were published it from the Conversation. We're working largely from
Speaker 1: an article by Andrea Ross, right, and this is all
Speaker 1: about the thorny matter of uh whether or not, not
Speaker 1: really whether or not, but the idea that a grown
Speaker 1: up or maybe sometimes not even grown up adopted person
Speaker 1: um might want to gain access to their original birth certificate.
Speaker 1: And in many states in the United States, those are
Speaker 1: sealed and you are not allowed to unless you jump
Speaker 1: through a lot of hoops, which is really interesting, Like
Speaker 1: you think access to birth certificates would be the most
Speaker 1: boring thing you can think of, But um, I saw
Speaker 1: it described as a basic human right to know your
Speaker 1: genuine identity. UM. And that's a really good point. I
Speaker 1: can't I It's just I'm sure it's so easy for
Speaker 1: somebody like me on the outside to just be like, well,
Speaker 1: sure you know, do that or don't do that. It's
Speaker 1: is it that big of a deal. And then to
Speaker 1: to put yourself in somebody's shoes is going through that
Speaker 1: who wants to know who their biological parents are and
Speaker 1: is not allowed as being prevented from doing that by
Speaker 1: the state. I can't imagine anything more frustrating than that. Really, Yeah,
Speaker 1: I got some thoughts, but we'll we'll pepper those in.
Speaker 1: As it stands now, there are ten states in the
Speaker 1: United States that offer um complete access to their original
Speaker 1: birth certificates. Um. In eighteen states, I believe that you
Speaker 1: need a court order, Is that right? Yeah? In eighteen states, UM,
Speaker 1: what happens is they put your original birth certificate under
Speaker 1: seal and they issue you a supplemental birth certificate that
Speaker 1: doesn't have your biological parents names on it has your
Speaker 1: adoptive parents names. And in those states, if you successfully
Speaker 1: petition the court, they will unseal your original birth certificate
Speaker 1: and then you can find out who your biological parents are, right. Uh.
Speaker 1: And then in twenty three states there you can get
Speaker 1: a redacted version, which I don't even see the point that. Uh.
Speaker 1: And then in twelve other states they have restrictions that
Speaker 1: allow for access. And this is the one I really
Speaker 1: don't understand. It's just between if you were born between
Speaker 1: certain time frames. So the best that I can come
Speaker 1: up with for that is that there were laws passed
Speaker 1: that that named like those dates that are still on
Speaker 1: the books that are now affecting people today's but those
Speaker 1: dates have been outlived. So now there's people who have
Speaker 1: access to their birth certificate, whereas other people who were
Speaker 1: born after a different date don't, which makes it arbitrary
Speaker 1: and an easy low to overturn. Okay, all right, well
Speaker 1: let's take a break and we'll talk about kind of
Speaker 1: where this came from and how the culture has shifted
Speaker 1: over the years right after this alright, so amending birth
Speaker 1: certificates uh started I think I'm saying birth Uh this
Speaker 1: started in the nineteen forties, originally to kind of keep
Speaker 1: parents from interfering with the adoptive family of the child.
Speaker 1: And there has been, um, you know, a big swing
Speaker 1: over the last seventy years since since then as far
Speaker 1: as what the norms are like, things have really changed
Speaker 1: over the years in terms of how adoptions go down. Yeah,
Speaker 1: because Andrew Ross points out that there's a lot of
Speaker 1: people who think that the off the book's reason for
Speaker 1: sealing birth certificates was also to protect the identity of
Speaker 1: unwed mothers, because back in that time, if you're if
Speaker 1: you were out it as an unwed mother who had
Speaker 1: had what they considered illegitimate child that you put up
Speaker 1: for adoption, Um, it could probably make it hard for
Speaker 1: you to get a job. You might lose friends, your
Speaker 1: neighbors might shun you. It was a big deal. And
Speaker 1: so yeah, she's saying, like, we've really come a long
Speaker 1: way since then. So if that's really the reason why
Speaker 1: we were sealing birth certificates to begin with, it doesn't
Speaker 1: make any sense anymore. Yeah, And there's a lot of
Speaker 1: states that have come around since then. Obviously we mentioned
Speaker 1: those ten that now allow complete access, but as we speak,
Speaker 1: there are other states that are kind of in the
Speaker 1: midst of enacting new policy changes. I know Tennessee in
Speaker 1: Connecticut and Rhode Island all heaven and the last few years,
Speaker 1: UM kind of put legislation for word that favor access
Speaker 1: for uh. I keep saying kids, but I guess usually
Speaker 1: you have to be over eighteen, right, Yeah, that's another
Speaker 1: thing too. There are some so clearly there's a big
Speaker 1: patchwork of laws, right and depending on what state you
Speaker 1: live in, you might have, like you said, unfederal access
Speaker 1: or no access at all. But then there's a bunch
Speaker 1: of states that have laws that say, when you turn eighteen,
Speaker 1: you can get your original birth certificate if you ask
Speaker 1: for it. Yeah, and it's you know, adoption is different
Speaker 1: across the board in all states anyway, So it's when
Speaker 1: I was going through it, I just remember being shocked
Speaker 1: at sort of every state has its own set of
Speaker 1: rules and laws and um, which you know, obviously a
Speaker 1: lot of people feel that's how it should be, states
Speaker 1: just choosing the way they want to do things. But
Speaker 1: there is no sort of straight ahead way that you
Speaker 1: can say this is how adoption works. So it doesn't
Speaker 1: surprise me that there's no straightforward reason or way that
Speaker 1: people can determine or get their hands on their original
Speaker 1: birth certificate. Right. So yeah, and like you said, there
Speaker 1: are some changes on the horizon, Like I think Tennessee
Speaker 1: said that um they said a parent, a birth parent
Speaker 1: is no longer allowed to veto UM the their biological
Speaker 1: child's right to access their original birth certificate, which is
Speaker 1: a It's a feature in a lot of states as well,
Speaker 1: where you can be granted access to if you petition
Speaker 1: at court, but your biological parent has the right to
Speaker 1: say Nope, they can't, I don't want that released. And
Speaker 1: usually it goes the other way to the biological child
Speaker 1: can also can can revoke or veto the release of
Speaker 1: their own birth certificate to their biological parents. Yeah, I
Speaker 1: mean it is. It is a thorny issue when you
Speaker 1: start looking at kind of both sides, because you certainly
Speaker 1: feel like it's a right to be able to know
Speaker 1: where you came from. Uh, and it's certainly made a
Speaker 1: lot easier these days with DNA testing, if that's something
Speaker 1: that someone can afford to do. But uh, you also
Speaker 1: think about, you know, the right of a biological mom
Speaker 1: to retain their privacy, because if they had an adoption
Speaker 1: plan to begin with it, one of the reasons may
Speaker 1: have or one of the things that went along with
Speaker 1: that may have been like, listen, this is why I'm
Speaker 1: doing this. I don't want to be contacted. I don't
Speaker 1: want to have a relationship. And you know, I guess
Speaker 1: at the end of the day, even if they live
Speaker 1: in a state where they can make contact, the biological
Speaker 1: parents can still say, well, now I don't want a relationship. Yeah,
Speaker 1: they can for sure. So to kind of like take
Speaker 1: a middle ground for some of these states that don't
Speaker 1: have unfederate access to original birth certificates, they've created something
Speaker 1: called Confidential in their intermediary services, and it's basically like Tinder,
Speaker 1: but for adoptions or biological families. Right, so one family
Speaker 1: member can say, hey, I really want to get in
Speaker 1: touch with my biological parents. Can can you see if
Speaker 1: you can put me in touch with them? That that
Speaker 1: service will contact the biological parents and the biological parent,
Speaker 1: and so will they're swipe left or right right. Um,
Speaker 1: Here's what I didn't see mentioned anywhere that I can't
Speaker 1: quite wrap my head around is that these days, it's, Um,
Speaker 1: I think it's very uncommon for adoptive parents too to
Speaker 1: not share this information and to say like, no, I'm
Speaker 1: not gonna let you know who this was. That's a
Speaker 1: very old school sort of way adoptions used to go.
Speaker 1: So I'm kind of wondering how much this matters in
Speaker 1: these modern times where we're generally parents are pretty open
Speaker 1: about saying like, hey, this is who your logical parents were.
Speaker 1: If you ever want to get in touch with them,
Speaker 1: we can try and do that one. Yeah, so um,
Speaker 1: Andrea Ross sites one statistic. I'm not sure if it's
Speaker 1: in the United States in general or if it's in
Speaker 1: New Hampshire. But um, less than one percent, actually less
Speaker 1: than three quarters of a percent of birth parents said
Speaker 1: that they don't want to be contacted by um their
Speaker 1: biological child ever. Yeah, that I want to know more
Speaker 1: about that because that just says in states like New Hampshire, right,
Speaker 1: But that seems like a very narrow sort of well,
Speaker 1: states offering unrestricted access. So yeah, I don't know, it's
Speaker 1: it's I guess it's kind of unclear. Yeah, well it
Speaker 1: gives so if you have unrestricted access to your birth certificate,
Speaker 1: I think the state some states give the biological parent
Speaker 1: the right to say please like check the box like
Speaker 1: don't I don't want to be contacted ever kind of thing. So,
Speaker 1: like the the kid might be able to see who
Speaker 1: the biological parent is, but there they will also get
Speaker 1: a message thing like don't don't bother this, they don't
Speaker 1: want to be contacted. Yeah, it's you know, this is
Speaker 1: something I'm going to face one day as a parent
Speaker 1: of an adopted child, and it's I think they say
Speaker 1: that girls usually are more interested in this earlier than boys,
Speaker 1: and that like in the teenage years, typically girls might
Speaker 1: be a little more interested in making that connection. In boys,
Speaker 1: it's like sometimes in their adult life. But you know,
Speaker 1: this is something we're gonna face and we're always it's
Speaker 1: always that thing where you you're gonna do We're gonna
Speaker 1: do the right thing and be like, all right, if that,
Speaker 1: if now is the time, we'll try. But there's always
Speaker 1: that risk that biological mom or and or dad it's
Speaker 1: just gonna say no, thank you, And then you know,
Speaker 1: that's just something you've got to go through. Is a family.
Speaker 1: It's tough, tough stuff, and that's one of the tough
Speaker 1: parts about adopts. Yeah, but you guys are a strong family.
Speaker 1: You can do it. Yeah, And you know, I would
Speaker 1: love for there to be relationships one day, but that's
Speaker 1: something that you know, you can't force them, So we're
Speaker 1: definitely not one way or the other for sure. I
Speaker 1: think that's a good thing to remember and to end
Speaker 1: this episode on what do you think? I totally agree
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