WEBVTT - Endless WOR 0:00:01.520 --> 0:00:04.840 You are listening to Waiting on Reparations, the production of 0:00:04.960 --> 0:00:19.520 I Heart Radio, Wong two three Folk, Yeah, yo yo, 0:00:19.880 --> 0:00:22.720 when the revolutions over exploded like a nova. I just 0:00:22.760 --> 0:00:24.919 took a rod to Kroger and nobody pulled me over. 0:00:25.000 --> 0:00:27.680 I got blood so on site and they't nobody sober. Yo. 0:00:27.760 --> 0:00:30.159 My name's Dope Knife. My mama called me Toga go 0:00:30.240 --> 0:00:32.800 and smoke up. It's all rego, it's all legal. We 0:00:32.960 --> 0:00:36.040 all ball, no such things as small people gun sticks, 0:00:36.120 --> 0:00:38.960 pots and pants and fall evil. Now we got plots 0:00:38.960 --> 0:00:41.920 of land for zero. I'm tired of saying, ship, give 0:00:41.920 --> 0:00:44.760 me reparations. Bitch. Nigga's getting hungry in the streets, so 0:00:44.800 --> 0:00:47.120 we ate the rich cops trying to make a brother. Please, 0:00:47.159 --> 0:00:49.680 so I take the fifth, But I'm like CP three 0:00:49.720 --> 0:00:52.360 with the great assists. Bring the troops home. I got 0:00:52.360 --> 0:00:54.560 a new flow, but I'll be blocking on your ship 0:00:54.720 --> 0:00:57.360 like the new bowl wrapping so sweet. They're messing with 0:00:57.400 --> 0:01:05.160 my glue coast. I don't want Delta too close. Hey, 0:01:05.200 --> 0:01:09.240 what is happening? My name is Dope Knife, and you 0:01:09.280 --> 0:01:14.679 are listening to Waiting on Reparations? Hurry up with my 0:01:14.760 --> 0:01:19.480 motherfucking check once again, I am all by my lonesome 0:01:20.319 --> 0:01:23.200 on this one. Well not completely, but I'm just without 0:01:23.280 --> 0:01:27.240 my co host still. Mariah is still on her leave. 0:01:27.800 --> 0:01:32.040 But good news is that she did have the baby, 0:01:32.400 --> 0:01:36.880 and everybody's good and recovering and getting to know one another. 0:01:37.280 --> 0:01:39.160 Don't you know. It's not even my place. I'm not 0:01:39.440 --> 0:01:41.160 talking about any about you know, I want to put 0:01:41.160 --> 0:01:44.040 anybody's business out in the street. But y'all should go 0:01:44.240 --> 0:01:46.760 check us out on Instagram because you can go look 0:01:46.760 --> 0:01:49.680 at Mariah's baby picks. They're up there if you guys 0:01:49.680 --> 0:01:52.920 want to see how the baby's doing. But I can 0:01:52.920 --> 0:01:57.920 speak for all of you listening that lingua franca. We 0:01:58.000 --> 0:02:01.080 miss you and we can't wait to have you back 0:02:01.120 --> 0:02:06.400 on the show. Now. Um, what things to get into 0:02:06.480 --> 0:02:12.120 before we start with the episode? Um, you know what, 0:02:12.400 --> 0:02:15.799 you know what I went and did. I went and 0:02:16.000 --> 0:02:19.760 listened to the new Kanye album Donda, because that came out, 0:02:20.280 --> 0:02:22.680 and I'm a rapper, I'm a hip hopper, and this is, 0:02:22.760 --> 0:02:25.000 you know, somewhat of a hip hop show. So I 0:02:25.040 --> 0:02:27.959 felt that I had to do my my part, and 0:02:28.800 --> 0:02:36.040 I guess I listened to it. I tried to nip, 0:02:36.320 --> 0:02:38.720 you know, killed two Birds with One Stone. So I 0:02:38.840 --> 0:02:43.880 listened to the album while watching the live stream at 0:02:43.919 --> 0:02:47.440 the stadium because even though me and Mariah had talked 0:02:47.480 --> 0:02:52.959 about it before, I hadn't actually seen one of those 0:02:53.040 --> 0:02:55.560 I just saw pictures of it, but I actually sat 0:02:55.560 --> 0:02:57.280 down and watched I think it was like an hour 0:02:57.480 --> 0:03:00.880 and thirty minutes or something of a live stream just 0:03:01.000 --> 0:03:06.000 of the whole event, and it was interesting to say 0:03:06.040 --> 0:03:08.840 the least. But I did you know, in that, I 0:03:08.880 --> 0:03:12.240 did get to hear the album, So I've got some 0:03:12.320 --> 0:03:15.200 thoughts on it, and you know, we'll we'll get into 0:03:15.280 --> 0:03:18.240 that a little bit in the episode today about what 0:03:18.360 --> 0:03:24.200 my thoughts on Kanye's Donda album is. Um, I'll give 0:03:24.240 --> 0:03:30.000 you a little preview of what my thoughts were. It was, Yeah, 0:03:30.240 --> 0:03:35.160 is I musically? Is I? But I, you know, I 0:03:35.320 --> 0:03:40.280 just I'm not in the position where I can consume 0:03:40.480 --> 0:03:45.120 Kanye on a strictly musical level. There's some baggage there, 0:03:46.040 --> 0:03:49.920 So yeah, we'll get into that later. What we've got 0:03:50.000 --> 0:03:54.600 going today is we're gonna be talking about Afghanistan. Obviously, 0:03:54.680 --> 0:03:58.280 it's been in the news heavy for the last few weeks, 0:03:58.880 --> 0:04:01.480 and if you're going to be a prisoner of the 0:04:01.560 --> 0:04:05.760 moment and be caught up into political polls and stuff 0:04:05.760 --> 0:04:10.200 like that. It seems to be shaping the mid term 0:04:10.640 --> 0:04:14.000 elections how those are going to play out, or at 0:04:14.040 --> 0:04:17.400 least what the narratives are going to be. And it's also, 0:04:17.520 --> 0:04:21.320 in my opinion, putting up as risk again of the 0:04:21.360 --> 0:04:29.760 Republicans kind of rallying themselves around US imperialism, which is 0:04:29.839 --> 0:04:32.719 no good for anybody with the Democrats doing bad in 0:04:32.760 --> 0:04:38.200 the polls. So so, you know, it's got some sentimental 0:04:38.520 --> 0:04:42.840 quality to it. Just yesterday, I think they pulled out 0:04:43.040 --> 0:04:47.560 or the last of the US troops left, and Biden 0:04:47.640 --> 0:04:51.680 gave a fiery speech defending his decision to pull the 0:04:51.680 --> 0:04:55.560 troops out. And you know, I'm a I was in 0:04:55.680 --> 0:05:00.960 high school when we invaded Afghanistan. So it's just crazy 0:05:01.000 --> 0:05:03.080 to think of all the time that's past, all the 0:05:03.120 --> 0:05:06.120 people I know, like literally all the adults in my 0:05:06.200 --> 0:05:11.799 life somehow had those wars that we were in affect 0:05:11.839 --> 0:05:13.279 them and touch them. So that's what I want to 0:05:13.279 --> 0:05:17.159 talk about today. We're gonna be talking about Afghanistan. What 0:05:17.320 --> 0:05:21.360 the hell were we doing there? What do we accomplish? 0:05:21.480 --> 0:05:23.800 And uh, maybe looking into the future a little bit 0:05:23.839 --> 0:05:26.760 and seeing what's gonna happen and to talk about that. 0:05:27.080 --> 0:05:31.560 I thought I might bring on a vet to come 0:05:31.640 --> 0:05:35.440 talk with me today, John Hannah, who is in fact 0:05:35.640 --> 0:05:40.919 a Afghan vette of multiple tours and a former army ranger. 0:05:41.800 --> 0:05:45.720 Now he's just I've been I've been coining him the 0:05:45.839 --> 0:05:49.640 lefty surfer Dad. But we'll see how he reacts to 0:05:49.720 --> 0:05:52.200 that when he gets on. But we're gonna have him on. 0:05:52.240 --> 0:05:55.640 We're gonna talk about Afghanistan, and later on because he's 0:05:55.680 --> 0:05:58.359 such a hip hop enthusiast, he's gonna join me for 0:05:58.360 --> 0:06:01.480 the music discussion and we'll talk about out that Kanye 0:06:01.680 --> 0:06:04.960 Donda album and what our experience was like and if 0:06:04.960 --> 0:06:08.880 our minds are blown, we're gonna get into that after 0:06:08.920 --> 0:06:16.800 the jump. You'll stay tuned, all right, We are back. 0:06:17.160 --> 0:06:21.440 So Monday, right before midnight, the last of the U. S. 0:06:21.520 --> 0:06:26.160 Troops departed from Afghanistan. This happened just a few months shy. 0:06:26.240 --> 0:06:27.840 I think actually might have been like a month with 0:06:27.960 --> 0:06:30.600 some change, Shy of the twentieth year mark that the 0:06:30.680 --> 0:06:34.200 United States have you know, been involved since the invasion 0:06:34.200 --> 0:06:37.760 of that country. It seems like the conflict went on forever. 0:06:38.040 --> 0:06:39.919 I know that it was going on for most of 0:06:39.960 --> 0:06:43.719 my adult life and for you know, obviously anybody who's 0:06:43.760 --> 0:06:45.960 my age to kind of feel the same way. Now. 0:06:45.960 --> 0:06:48.839 The US first engaged in this war in the aftermath 0:06:48.880 --> 0:06:51.960 of the September eleventh attacks, the attacks that led to 0:06:52.000 --> 0:06:55.920 the creation of a slew of new federal agencies, including ICE, 0:06:56.400 --> 0:07:01.880 Homeland Security, the opening of Guantanamobile Prison that's still operational 0:07:01.920 --> 0:07:04.719 to this day. There's people still locked up in there 0:07:05.000 --> 0:07:08.479 with you know what, doesn't seem like any you know, 0:07:08.560 --> 0:07:11.760 forward progress in terms of them getting uh their due 0:07:11.800 --> 0:07:17.840 day in court. Um. It also opened the doors for 0:07:18.680 --> 0:07:22.920 the military industrial complex to have twenty years of pretty 0:07:23.000 --> 0:07:27.240 much just the buffet of defense contracts. And we can't 0:07:27.280 --> 0:07:30.160 forget about the other country that we ended up invading 0:07:30.160 --> 0:07:33.720 in the aftermath of September eleventh, which was Iraq obviously, 0:07:34.480 --> 0:07:39.120 but back to Afghanistan, with President Biden pulling the trigger 0:07:39.160 --> 0:07:42.120 to pull troops out. It appears at almost every aspect 0:07:42.120 --> 0:07:45.960 of corporate media is trying to make them pay for this. Politically, obviously, 0:07:46.040 --> 0:07:50.280 the Republicans are pouncing on it, whether coincidentally or it's 0:07:50.320 --> 0:07:53.720 because of the rise of COVID, or if it actually 0:07:53.800 --> 0:07:56.320 is a result of what people are seeing on the news. 0:07:57.120 --> 0:08:00.040 Biden's polls are taking a dip since the Taliban and 0:08:00.120 --> 0:08:04.600 started taking over everything. Um A pair of suicide bombings 0:08:04.680 --> 0:08:07.760 killed more than a hundred people, including thirteen U S 0:08:07.760 --> 0:08:12.120 Service members and ninety Afghan civilians, and at the Cobo Airport, 0:08:13.520 --> 0:08:16.600 as expected, one of the US parting gifts with the 0:08:16.680 --> 0:08:20.360 country was a revenge drone strike on a vehicle and 0:08:20.480 --> 0:08:25.080 Kabbol that killed ten people, including seven children. This whole 0:08:25.160 --> 0:08:28.680 issue has the Maga Republicans and the neo cons of 0:08:28.720 --> 0:08:32.480 the Bush era kind of finding a truce and they're 0:08:32.520 --> 0:08:36.120 all kind of going after Biden and pretty much pushing 0:08:36.160 --> 0:08:39.080 that we shouldn't be getting out of Afghanistan. In what 0:08:39.200 --> 0:08:43.199 was almost a comical turn, Mitt Romney was on CNN. 0:08:43.440 --> 0:08:45.280 I think it was on Sunday, but he was on 0:08:45.280 --> 0:08:49.040 one of those shows, and he was actually advocating for 0:08:49.280 --> 0:08:52.240 endless war. Like he he was straight up saying that. 0:08:53.240 --> 0:08:58.319 Surprisingly to me, with all of these uh, multifronted criticism 0:08:58.360 --> 0:09:01.680 that's coming at Joe Biden's way, he stood firm by 0:09:01.720 --> 0:09:06.360 his decision. Uh Per CNN. President Joe Biden on Tuesday 0:09:06.400 --> 0:09:09.920 offered a vigorous defensive of his decision to withdraw US 0:09:09.960 --> 0:09:14.480 troops from Afghanistan, defending the chaotic withdrawal from Kabbo, day 0:09:14.520 --> 0:09:18.800 after the last American military planes left the country, marking 0:09:18.800 --> 0:09:22.280 the conclusion to the US longest war, nearly twenty years 0:09:22.320 --> 0:09:26.200 after it began, he said, my fellow Americans, the war 0:09:26.240 --> 0:09:30.280 in Afghanistan is now over. I am the fourth president 0:09:30.360 --> 0:09:32.920 who has faced the issue of weather and when to 0:09:33.040 --> 0:09:35.720 end this war. When I was running for president, I 0:09:35.760 --> 0:09:37.840 made a commitment to the American people that I would 0:09:37.880 --> 0:09:41.480 end this war. Today I've honored that commitment. I was 0:09:41.559 --> 0:09:44.959 not going to extend this forever war. This decision about 0:09:44.960 --> 0:09:49.040 Afghanistan is not just about Afghanistan. It's about ending an 0:09:49.160 --> 0:09:54.719 error of major military operations to remake other countries. So 0:09:55.040 --> 0:09:58.640 for cat like me on paper, that's literally the sort 0:09:58.679 --> 0:10:02.080 of ship that I want to hear. But we'll see, 0:10:02.559 --> 0:10:06.760 we'll see. You know, politics will determine what all of 0:10:06.800 --> 0:10:08.800 these cats do at the end of the day, and 0:10:10.720 --> 0:10:14.080 numbers don't lie. And Joe Biden's taken a hit. Now, 0:10:15.160 --> 0:10:18.720 the voting public's memory can be short, and you know, 0:10:18.840 --> 0:10:21.880 there's still got some time before the mid terms, and 0:10:21.960 --> 0:10:24.600 you have obviously have more time than that before the 0:10:24.600 --> 0:10:27.480 next election. So will this affect them if that is 0:10:27.520 --> 0:10:31.960 what's making the numbers dip. I don't know, but hopefully 0:10:32.000 --> 0:10:35.600 he keeps this tone throughout it. Now I'm gonna bring 0:10:35.600 --> 0:10:39.640 on our guests who's gonna help me try to talk 0:10:39.679 --> 0:10:43.920 about the complicated situation that is the US involvement in Afghanistan. 0:10:44.320 --> 0:10:47.760 We're gonna be talking with a former specialist in the 0:10:47.800 --> 0:10:51.960 one seventy five Ranger Regiment who between two thousand and 0:10:51.960 --> 0:10:54.520 one and two thousand five did multiple tours in Iraq 0:10:54.600 --> 0:10:58.520 and Afghanistan and Small Line Squad, heavy Weapons Squad, and 0:10:58.640 --> 0:11:02.079 as the armory officer. These days, he's pretty much a 0:11:02.240 --> 0:11:06.160 lefty surfer dad and hip hop enthusiasts, and he's a 0:11:06.160 --> 0:11:09.680 good friend of mine. Uh, gonna welcome John Hannah to 0:11:09.720 --> 0:11:13.160 the show. I always I always do my introductions like this, Hannah, 0:11:13.320 --> 0:11:15.880 like in a way like there's an audience or something 0:11:15.880 --> 0:11:21.360 that's gonna go yeah, I like it. How are you doing, man, 0:11:21.760 --> 0:11:27.360 I'm doing great. I'm doing great. That was that was good? 0:11:27.760 --> 0:11:33.480 Is I that? It was good? But uh good? Exactly 0:11:33.480 --> 0:11:36.600 what you said? Surf for Dad mostly Dad, since covid 0:11:36.800 --> 0:11:40.559 U took both kids out of school last year. Um, 0:11:40.559 --> 0:11:43.040 because I don't trust Florida. As you can see, I 0:11:43.160 --> 0:11:46.640 was right. Um I put him back in school because 0:11:46.679 --> 0:11:49.440 the numbers dipped. I just took them back out of 0:11:49.480 --> 0:11:53.720 school because the governor threatened our school to take away 0:11:53.760 --> 0:11:56.240 state funding. And our school was like, yeah, we're just 0:11:56.280 --> 0:11:59.400 gonna do you know honor system. I'm like, yeah, I 0:11:59.440 --> 0:12:03.640 don't trust any honor system. That is insane. So it 0:12:03.679 --> 0:12:08.640 took them out. Um, they'll be going back to school tuesday. Uh, 0:12:09.080 --> 0:12:14.559 our school because the governor got sued. The santis is little. 0:12:15.600 --> 0:12:18.280 I don't know what you would cause like a mobster tactic, right, 0:12:19.840 --> 0:12:22.640 like a shake. I mean, it's not my fault. I 0:12:22.720 --> 0:12:24.280 killed the guy because I held the gun to his head. 0:12:24.280 --> 0:12:25.840 All you have to do is give me fifty bucks. 0:12:27.200 --> 0:12:30.000 That's what it feelt like. So for like you after 0:12:30.120 --> 0:12:32.600 after coming out of the year of like having the 0:12:32.640 --> 0:12:34.920 girls to be out of school. Um, oh, one of 0:12:35.000 --> 0:12:37.079 one of his daughters is my god daughter by the way, 0:12:37.559 --> 0:12:43.920 full disclosure, But like are you more like what do 0:12:44.040 --> 0:12:46.160 you what are you looking for forward to? Do you 0:12:46.200 --> 0:12:48.640 want them to like be back in school or do you? Man? 0:12:48.720 --> 0:12:50.680 I can't wait for them to be back in school. 0:12:50.720 --> 0:12:52.880 I am not a good teacher. We need to pay 0:12:52.920 --> 0:12:56.560 them way more money than any corporate executive. I don't 0:12:56.559 --> 0:13:01.679 know that anybody realizes what it requires teach mathematics and 0:13:01.720 --> 0:13:04.480 physics to one and then to like A B and 0:13:04.520 --> 0:13:08.640 C the other one. But it is impossible. I'm just 0:13:08.800 --> 0:13:11.400 I'm not cut out. Just all the tasks and my 0:13:11.440 --> 0:13:15.960 wife's full time works, so but it's all at home. Yeah. Well, 0:13:16.000 --> 0:13:18.200 I mean you guys are maintaining though, right, Oh yeah, yeah, 0:13:18.320 --> 0:13:21.120 we're doing good. We're making it. I skate a lot 0:13:21.160 --> 0:13:24.120 more because there's no kids at the skate park, so 0:13:24.400 --> 0:13:28.559 ghost town. Well, so I brought you on because obviously 0:13:28.600 --> 0:13:32.640 with everything going on in Afghanistan, and I mean one 0:13:32.679 --> 0:13:35.160 of the things that, you know, one of the things 0:13:35.160 --> 0:13:40.160 that was kind of kind of shape my political awareness 0:13:40.360 --> 0:13:43.160 and identity was you know, around the time when I 0:13:43.200 --> 0:13:46.320 met you and you were just getting out of the 0:13:46.400 --> 0:13:49.720 Rangers and stuff like that. So just, you know, for 0:13:49.720 --> 0:13:52.280 for due diligence, why don't you tell us a little 0:13:52.280 --> 0:13:55.160 bit about how you ended up getting into the Rangers 0:13:55.160 --> 0:13:59.640 and subsequently ended up in Afghanistan. Of course, skipping the 0:13:59.720 --> 0:14:03.000 norm small town trying to get out of here story. 0:14:03.200 --> 0:14:06.120 I ended up in range of Reattalion after the normal 0:14:06.120 --> 0:14:10.760 selection process and the moment I got in, I got 0:14:10.760 --> 0:14:13.000 out of airborne school. We get to our unit and 0:14:13.040 --> 0:14:17.199 they're like, hey, you need to get on this helicopter 0:14:17.360 --> 0:14:21.120 and here's some AMMO and here's this film of what 0:14:21.240 --> 0:14:24.640 happened to the twin towers. I'm like, oh wow, they're 0:14:24.680 --> 0:14:29.800 really into this. The whole like production values insane and 0:14:29.840 --> 0:14:32.760 I'm like, wait a minute, this is fucking live ammo. 0:14:34.920 --> 0:14:37.160 This isn't one of our normal you know, jog for 0:14:37.200 --> 0:14:40.080 twenty miles and may get to a shoot house type 0:14:40.080 --> 0:14:43.920 of deal. Anyway, it actually caught me by surprise. I 0:14:44.000 --> 0:14:47.880 missed whatever the public saw, right. Uh. I caught the 0:14:47.920 --> 0:14:51.040 second tower falling because of the first tower video, and 0:14:51.080 --> 0:14:53.440 we were like booted and suited, ready to go, and 0:14:53.480 --> 0:14:59.520 I had just gotten there. So from two thousand one on, uh, 0:14:59.560 --> 0:15:02.600 I don't know. Oh, from October on, I had been 0:15:02.720 --> 0:15:06.840 in and out of Afghanistan for our tour was ninety 0:15:06.920 --> 0:15:09.880 days there, ninety days Hong, which was just preparation to 0:15:09.920 --> 0:15:11.880 go back. So it was just I don't know how 0:15:11.880 --> 0:15:16.120 many times I've deployed, but it's a lot um and 0:15:16.160 --> 0:15:19.080 then we took on a second mission to Iraq after that, 0:15:19.160 --> 0:15:22.920 but because Afghanistan felt squandered after a while, we had 0:15:22.960 --> 0:15:27.640 been doing a lot there that seemed odd to imagine 0:15:29.200 --> 0:15:33.120 jumping out of an airplane and landing in like Midwest USA. 0:15:33.880 --> 0:15:36.600 It's a bunch of farms. There's a bunch of people 0:15:36.600 --> 0:15:39.600 that are looking at you like what are you doing. 0:15:40.320 --> 0:15:43.280 You're like scrambling to get all your squad mates up. 0:15:43.360 --> 0:15:45.000 You're in a line and you look to your left 0:15:45.000 --> 0:15:47.560 and light right through nods and there's people coming out 0:15:47.560 --> 0:15:51.600 of their house like who that? Who dare? Like what 0:15:51.640 --> 0:15:55.000 the hell is? What is all this? Right? And then 0:15:55.000 --> 0:15:57.000 We're just going to some objective we have and I'm 0:15:57.040 --> 0:16:00.200 just like looking around, like, wow, this is a lot 0:16:00.240 --> 0:16:03.880 of crops, right, and some of its mountainous. I don't know. 0:16:03.920 --> 0:16:05.720 I was on the board of Pakistan a lot of 0:16:05.760 --> 0:16:09.040 the time, and that's I didn't get all the intel, 0:16:09.200 --> 0:16:11.400 but what I knew, I'm pretty sure we were there 0:16:11.400 --> 0:16:13.720 because we knew Osama bin Laden was there the whole time, 0:16:14.200 --> 0:16:16.800 and most of the objectives were just taking out al 0:16:16.880 --> 0:16:20.160 Kaeda operatives. Whatever was the top of the blacklist at 0:16:20.200 --> 0:16:21.960 the time. We just knocked them down and there would 0:16:21.960 --> 0:16:24.800 be a new name. Um, everybody knows some of them, 0:16:24.840 --> 0:16:32.640 like Ali Quari or Alazari. There's a lot um Alilaki right, UM, 0:16:32.680 --> 0:16:36.280 I don't know. It changed a lot depending on Okay, 0:16:36.320 --> 0:16:38.960 well this target is no longer accessible, new target, so 0:16:39.400 --> 0:16:45.560 the list just constantly revolved. So like if between Afghanistan 0:16:45.600 --> 0:16:47.520 and Iraq, which one did you spend more time in? 0:16:47.960 --> 0:16:54.240 Um hm Afghanistan just because the initial invasion to Afghanistan, 0:16:55.000 --> 0:16:57.080 I was gaining a foothold. So if you can imagine, 0:16:58.000 --> 0:17:01.240 we only run night operations, but someone had to get 0:17:01.240 --> 0:17:04.960 there first, takeover bases, make bases. There's not a lot 0:17:05.400 --> 0:17:08.920 left there. If you know the history of Afghanistan, they've 0:17:08.960 --> 0:17:14.240 been through tons of wars. Basically, UM communist regimes have 0:17:14.280 --> 0:17:17.399 shut up set up like tiny little hotspots where you 0:17:17.400 --> 0:17:20.440 could start an army base, but that was destroyed in 0:17:20.640 --> 0:17:24.280 some other regimes attempt to take off take over Afghanistan. 0:17:24.480 --> 0:17:27.760 So UM, we just had to like build areas where 0:17:27.840 --> 0:17:29.639 we can go from one spot to the other fast 0:17:29.960 --> 0:17:33.000 and that took a lot of time. So one of 0:17:33.040 --> 0:17:36.800 the main things you know that makes people paint the 0:17:36.840 --> 0:17:39.679 whole conflict that's being like this endless war is the 0:17:39.680 --> 0:17:43.159 whole notion that the mission, at least what was stated 0:17:43.200 --> 0:17:47.119 as the mission, was kind of accomplished a while ago, 0:17:48.080 --> 0:17:50.320 you know, before this like current pull out. So I'm 0:17:50.359 --> 0:17:52.960 just curious because if you got out in two thousand five, 0:17:53.760 --> 0:17:57.639 was the mission was accomplished by the right technically technically, yeah, 0:17:57.920 --> 0:18:00.800 but um it wasn't. Just so, I don't know what 0:18:01.040 --> 0:18:05.080 everybody's idea of the mission was, but it seemed to 0:18:05.119 --> 0:18:09.000 me it's not like anybody gave a really good statement 0:18:09.240 --> 0:18:12.320 a fact of like step one, do this, step two, 0:18:12.359 --> 0:18:15.320 do this. I know that. Uh. The main mission seemed 0:18:15.320 --> 0:18:18.440 to be to remove any elements that could operate from 0:18:18.480 --> 0:18:21.760 Afghanistan as a jumping point to do terrorists operations. Right, 0:18:22.040 --> 0:18:25.080 that seemed to be the focus. Um. Other than that, 0:18:25.280 --> 0:18:28.000 I mean, it was just like high value targets is 0:18:28.040 --> 0:18:31.040 what they would call them. Anybody that seemed that they 0:18:31.040 --> 0:18:34.240 could either take over or had already taken over. Um, 0:18:34.280 --> 0:18:38.480 anybody that was like a local warlord was probably I 0:18:38.480 --> 0:18:40.960 don't want to say paid, but you know coherst by 0:18:41.000 --> 0:18:44.159 our government to to kind of act as a de 0:18:44.280 --> 0:18:46.520 fact of government. We would usually run through them. They 0:18:46.520 --> 0:18:48.840 seem to know the area better, and for the most 0:18:48.880 --> 0:18:51.560 part they are the government in these small little townships 0:18:51.560 --> 0:18:54.480 because like I said, it's mostly farms. I mean, imagine 0:18:54.520 --> 0:18:59.040 like Aztecs step pyramids filled with crops on those steps 0:18:59.040 --> 0:19:03.080 of each mountain you run across. That's most of Afghanistan 0:19:03.320 --> 0:19:07.000 except for Kabul. But I don't know. Kabul is like 0:19:07.040 --> 0:19:09.640 a range of architecture, like you can tell the Russians 0:19:09.640 --> 0:19:12.720 were there. You can tell it was like Indian inspired. 0:19:12.760 --> 0:19:15.680 There's Buddhists like what looks like used to be Buddhist 0:19:15.720 --> 0:19:19.679 temples there. It's pretty pretty insane how modern and old 0:19:19.720 --> 0:19:23.760 and multicultural it seems to be there. So it's you know, 0:19:23.800 --> 0:19:26.119 one of the things that gets left out in a 0:19:26.160 --> 0:19:29.440 lot of the media coverage of it is just the 0:19:29.480 --> 0:19:32.360 Afghan The afghanis themselves, you know what I mean. It's 0:19:32.400 --> 0:19:38.040 like just even when talking about the bombing that was 0:19:38.080 --> 0:19:40.560 at the airport, you know, all that they mentioned is 0:19:40.600 --> 0:19:43.240 the U. S service members they get killed, and they've 0:19:43.280 --> 0:19:47.359 they've kind of like aghanis exactly the hundred others. Just 0:19:47.400 --> 0:19:50.080 like as a footnote, So just for for you and 0:19:50.080 --> 0:19:52.840 your experience like that, how did you feel that the 0:19:53.720 --> 0:19:59.360 find that the Afghans responded to y'all in y'all's presence there, 0:20:00.080 --> 0:20:03.640 whenever you did, I don't know, I have a biased view. 0:20:04.680 --> 0:20:10.120 Any time I met Afghanians that weren't part of a mission, 0:20:11.000 --> 0:20:12.480 or that were part of a mission, it was at 0:20:12.560 --> 0:20:17.639 nighttime and they were super scared, um obviously or fighting us. 0:20:17.680 --> 0:20:20.399 That the only two only two options. There wasn't like, 0:20:20.440 --> 0:20:24.679 oh my gosh, it's you guys, but right, um. But 0:20:24.760 --> 0:20:27.000 then during when we were in like Kabul, we did 0:20:27.040 --> 0:20:29.080 a lot of to get from one point to the other. 0:20:29.160 --> 0:20:33.960 Like day operations, they looked similar tonight. It It didn't 0:20:34.000 --> 0:20:36.680 look like we could stop and talk to anybody. They 0:20:36.680 --> 0:20:39.280 were going about the business and the bull but and 0:20:39.320 --> 0:20:42.720 the farm areas they would run. And the reason why 0:20:42.840 --> 0:20:45.800 is a lot of them have weapons, and not like 0:20:46.200 --> 0:20:50.000 big arms, but like old World War two weapons and 0:20:50.119 --> 0:20:53.760 maybe an a K but for a whole huge like farming, 0:20:54.560 --> 0:20:58.960 single family area. If we run across them, the first 0:20:58.960 --> 0:21:01.959 thing we do is searching house, even at night, day, whatever, 0:21:02.280 --> 0:21:03.919 And that doesn't matter what unit is. So if you 0:21:03.920 --> 0:21:07.159 can imagine the next house that has weapons in it, 0:21:07.240 --> 0:21:09.560 we find a weapon and we're about to question and 0:21:09.600 --> 0:21:12.080 bring in an interpreter and talk to everyone in their family. 0:21:12.359 --> 0:21:15.000 How many farms in the midwest of the United States 0:21:15.000 --> 0:21:18.920 has weapons in them? Exactly? Right? Like now, imagine being 0:21:18.920 --> 0:21:22.159 in the middle of the desert where there's Bedouins and 0:21:22.640 --> 0:21:26.080 the Taliban what we call all Kada. All of those 0:21:26.080 --> 0:21:28.840 people are coming in left and right. I imagine most 0:21:28.880 --> 0:21:32.000 of them had weapons, so it was just like a 0:21:32.040 --> 0:21:34.119 lottery for them who was going to get messed with? 0:21:34.240 --> 0:21:37.720 Next that it seemed like we caused more fear than help. 0:21:38.640 --> 0:21:40.560 Did you feel kind of like a cop? Yeah, a 0:21:40.560 --> 0:21:44.400 lot like a cop. I just tested the feeling. Yeah. Later, 0:21:45.040 --> 0:21:47.440 like not at first because it was mission mission mission, 0:21:47.520 --> 0:21:49.399 but then like later, like I started to get the 0:21:49.440 --> 0:21:52.879 idea that wow, like if this guy's name was Gary, 0:21:53.320 --> 0:21:56.040 I had no Gary. He looks real familiar to me, 0:21:56.080 --> 0:21:58.320 and I feel really bad about the face he's making 0:21:58.400 --> 0:22:02.920 right now. Yeah, just a long time. So how how 0:22:02.920 --> 0:22:05.919 did that make you feel? When you're like in in 0:22:05.960 --> 0:22:09.120 the like like, for example, if you're you're doing something 0:22:09.240 --> 0:22:12.240 and you've got to like question some poor guy at night, 0:22:12.960 --> 0:22:14.960 you know what I mean, and he's fucking scared to 0:22:15.080 --> 0:22:19.760 death because there's commando's armed to the teeth, Like questioning perfect, 0:22:20.960 --> 0:22:25.760 I've actually so it's like compartmentalized, sure, like anybody would expect, 0:22:25.880 --> 0:22:29.359 But have you ever heard of like, uh, so, let's 0:22:29.359 --> 0:22:32.639 say you have a rat in your farmhouse and instead 0:22:32.680 --> 0:22:37.840 of killing the rat, you just shoot it away. Now, 0:22:38.280 --> 0:22:42.120 that would seem compassionate and helpful. Um, you didn't harm 0:22:42.160 --> 0:22:44.560 the rat, and he's not in your stable anymore. But 0:22:44.640 --> 0:22:47.280 what you've effectively done is you move the rat, and 0:22:47.320 --> 0:22:52.560 if there's another homestead anywhere near that farm, it's now 0:22:52.600 --> 0:22:55.160 infested that area. So it was just in the farm, 0:22:55.200 --> 0:22:57.040 you could have filled it, you had access to it, 0:22:57.280 --> 0:23:00.320 and now it's in your house and now it's making 0:23:00.320 --> 0:23:01.960 babies and it's hard to get to and that's a 0:23:02.040 --> 0:23:04.320 much harder area to clear it from. So you've created 0:23:04.359 --> 0:23:07.440 a bigger problem. That was basically what our mission felt like, 0:23:07.960 --> 0:23:13.439 is to like not exterminate, but basically rude out any 0:23:13.600 --> 0:23:17.119 instance of this. I don't know, that's kind of what 0:23:17.200 --> 0:23:18.800 it felt like we were doing the whole time. It 0:23:18.840 --> 0:23:21.680 felt like that's what I was And I guess that's 0:23:21.680 --> 0:23:26.000 how it was compartmentalized, right, Like, sure, this person seems innocent, 0:23:26.160 --> 0:23:29.320 but he might be one of those get back into 0:23:29.359 --> 0:23:31.480 your house rats and to make sure we need to 0:23:31.480 --> 0:23:33.760 make sure he doesn't have anything of value here that 0:23:33.880 --> 0:23:37.679 could send a message to al Qaeda and let them 0:23:37.720 --> 0:23:40.639 know where we're at, or maybe give them intel. Okay, 0:23:40.680 --> 0:23:42.399 so it's searched the whole place. And if you do 0:23:42.480 --> 0:23:45.040 that to every single person that you run across, right, 0:23:45.119 --> 0:23:48.120 I don't know. It made me feel probably a lot 0:23:48.160 --> 0:23:50.679 like they felt. I mean, that doesn't sound very compassionate, 0:23:50.720 --> 0:23:55.359 but obviously they felt worse, but now worse, then not 0:23:55.560 --> 0:23:58.480 so bad about it. In that same way that I described, 0:23:58.520 --> 0:24:01.600 I was thought I was rooting out a bigger problem. 0:24:01.680 --> 0:24:04.359 There's some collateral damage along the way, but I thought 0:24:04.359 --> 0:24:09.879 it was for a greater cause. So when you got out, 0:24:10.760 --> 0:24:12.400 or not even when you got out, but when when 0:24:12.400 --> 0:24:17.520 did you start feeling like that? In Afghanistan it was 0:24:17.600 --> 0:24:21.800