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Speaker 1: This program features the individual opinions of the host, guests,

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Speaker 1: and callers, and not necessarily those of the producer, the station,

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Speaker 1: its affiliates, or sponsors. This is True Crime Tonight.

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Speaker 2: Welcome to True Crime Tonight on iHeartRadio. We're talking true

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Speaker 2: crime all the time. It is Monday, June thirtieth, and

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Speaker 2: we have a stack night of headlines. It's been an

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Speaker 2: explosive day in the press. If you haven't been following

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Speaker 2: along today, there's been some issues with a juror that

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Speaker 2: is deliberating in Diddy's trial, and maybe more significantly, a

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Speaker 2: huge explosive break in the Idaho murders. We've been tracking

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Speaker 2: this case, as you all know, closely and reporting on

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Speaker 2: it regularly here on the show. Candidly, we're all a

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Speaker 2: little shook at this exact moment. It's it's pretty earth shattering.

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Speaker 2: Brian Coberger, the accused who has been accused of murdering

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Speaker 2: for college students at the University of Idaho, has claimed

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Speaker 2: his innocence. You'll remember as recently as last week he

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Speaker 2: was looking to get a continuance on his trial, which

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Speaker 2: is scheduled to happen in August, and that was denied

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Speaker 2: and he has pled. He has admitted to killing four

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Speaker 2: students that he seemingly has no connection to. He was

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Speaker 2: a PhD student studying criminology and apparently took the time

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Speaker 2: to possibly stock and murder for incredible humans and went

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Speaker 2: back to school and graded some papers after and went

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Speaker 2: home for the holidays and was picked up by his

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Speaker 2: beloved father, who drove through multiple states to get him

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Speaker 2: just in time for Thanksgiving. And we've done the podcast.

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Speaker 2: We did two seasons of that, and we're currently making

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Speaker 2: the documentary for Peacock. As recently as today we were

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Speaker 2: delivering the master Not to get too inside baseball on it,

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Speaker 2: but the spirit of it has been to make sure

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Speaker 2: that we are treating this case fairly and not convicting

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Speaker 2: anybody in the press. We've you know, turned it on

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Speaker 2: ourselves to make sure that the media wasn't creating a

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Speaker 2: frenzy so that this person could have a fair trial

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Speaker 2: and that justice could be served. And instead, this guy

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Speaker 2: has decided that he is going to take accountability so

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Speaker 2: that he can live, and his death sentence provisions appear

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Speaker 2: to be removed, and he will be in court on Wednesday,

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Speaker 2: and apparently we'll have to kind of face the music.

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Speaker 2: But it seems as though this riddle has been solved

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Speaker 2: and the boogeyman is Brian Coburger according to him, and

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Speaker 2: we are we're so sad, so sad. I don't even

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Speaker 2: know where to start with it. I know we've all

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Speaker 2: been talking all day. It's been real time developments happening. Obviously,

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Speaker 2: we'll be following this every day and you know they're

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Speaker 2: on Wednesday, et cetera. But the lead is, this is

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Speaker 2: a person who had a full life. He was loved,

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Speaker 2: he was raised by parents that took very good care

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Speaker 2: of him by all accounts. We have spoken to so

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Speaker 2: many people that we took out of the podcast, that

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Speaker 2: we took out of the documentary because we didn't want

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Speaker 2: to lead. We didn't want to interrupt, God forbid, the trial.

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Speaker 2: We didn't want to cause more pain for the victims'

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Speaker 2: families who are who are bracing for this horrible unpack

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Speaker 2: of this nightmare they've lived for two and a half years.

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Speaker 2: And instead this clown just decides today on some random Monday,

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Speaker 2: that h the gig is up. I've wasted everybody's time,

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Speaker 2: all of Idaho's resources. I've been in the press, maybe

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Speaker 2: enjoying it every step of the way, and every single

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Speaker 2: thing that we thought was possibly maybe not true or

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Speaker 2: we maybe hoped for the sake of humanity wasn't true.

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Speaker 2: That photograph that he took allegedly after the murders was real.

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Speaker 2: This guy took a photo of himself in a bathroom

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Speaker 2: after murdering four people, called mom and dad or somebody

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Speaker 2: in his family for hours or close to it, and

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Speaker 2: now has decided he doesn't want to die. And now

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Speaker 2: we get to all unpack it from here. And I

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Speaker 2: don't even know what to say.

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Speaker 3: Court.

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Speaker 2: Well, we're also close to it. Yeah we are.

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Speaker 4: We're all, you know, invested in this case. And you know,

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Speaker 4: we were just talking about what is the fascination with

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Speaker 4: this case?

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Speaker 2: What is it about this case?

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Speaker 4: And you know, it's so hard to imagine that this

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Speaker 4: guy is this dork. Let's be honest.

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Speaker 2: You know, the gloves are off. We are not protecting

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Speaker 2: him anymore. That is like, the gloves are off.

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Speaker 4: This dork, you know, is capable of this kind of madness.

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Speaker 4: And if he's capable of doing it to four people,

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Speaker 4: who's capable of doing it to us. It's it's hard

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Speaker 4: to it's hard to go there. But I have to say,

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Speaker 4: I'm not shocked. I'm a little surprised that this happened.

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Speaker 4: But there was a May fifteenth hearing and the judge

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Speaker 4: did say that the best offer would have to be

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Speaker 4: done at the end of.

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Speaker 2: July or June early July.

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Speaker 4: And here we are the last day of June, and

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Speaker 4: apparently what happened was the state or I'm sorry, the

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Speaker 4: defense approached the state about a plea, and last night

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Speaker 4: the state went to the defense and said, here's the offer,

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Speaker 4: and it was accepted. I don't know if there's any

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Speaker 4: negotiations or not. We don't have any of those details.

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Speaker 4: But we are going to be talking to a lawyer

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Speaker 4: later who's going to come on and he.

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Speaker 2: Is a prosecutor.

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Speaker 4: He's prosecuted many cases, and hopefully we'll be able to

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Speaker 4: unpack this with us. But apparently, yeah, he's accepted the

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Speaker 4: plea offer. He will have to plead guilty, he will

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Speaker 4: not be eligible for parole. He'll probably get four life

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Speaker 4: sentences without the possibility for parole, and there will be

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Speaker 4: no appeals.

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Speaker 2: Throw We don't say the key through that way.

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Speaker 5: That's important, the fact that he will waive his right

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Speaker 5: to appeals because at least it won't be protracted. If

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Speaker 5: there's any silver lining whatsoever that his day in court

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Speaker 5: will know.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, And we don't know, like I would like to

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Speaker 4: know if if he has to provide something to you know,

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Speaker 4: the state, that state can pass on to the family,

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Speaker 4: you know, or whatever to give them any kind of reason,

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Speaker 4: And not that that's going to make anything better. Those

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Speaker 4: those lovely kids are gone, you know, those young adults

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Speaker 4: with their whole life ahead of them, are gone forever.

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Speaker 4: And I don't know if it would be helpful to

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Speaker 4: the family to know why, But I can imagine that

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Speaker 4: they often wonder why.

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Speaker 2: Well, why, because how do we all keep ourselves safe?

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Speaker 2: Which is why it's so important that we're talking about it.

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Speaker 2: Because again, we don't think the boogeyman is the guy

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Speaker 2: that's standing behind you online at the pharmacy. You don't

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Speaker 2: think the boogeyman is the guy sitting next to you. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: the dorky PhD student who's you know, has an issue

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Speaker 2: with women or it doesn't really feel confident enough to

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Speaker 2: make friends easily. We've heard so many reports and I

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Speaker 2: feel like now the gloves can come off a little bit,

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Speaker 2: given that he is now confessing to this mess. You know,

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Speaker 2: we heard reports and you know, Courtney, you were, you know,

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Speaker 2: right there with it from day one. Think about it.

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Speaker 2: This is a guy who was getting his PhD. His dad,

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Speaker 2: I think, went bankrupt putting him through school when they

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Speaker 2: moved him into school post COVID, post a drug addiction

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Speaker 2: that he kicked, and then he slimmed down and got

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Speaker 2: healthy and got his schoolwork done and he got into

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Speaker 2: a PhD program that is nothing to shake a stick at.

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Speaker 2: And we had heard reports that, you know, he had

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Speaker 2: some issues in high school, all of which we've been

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Speaker 2: so careful not to share because again, we don't want

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Speaker 2: to try anybody in the media. We've asked ourselves this

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Speaker 2: day in and day out, in fact, and that's just

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Speaker 2: in the last week alone, we've lost sleep just over

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Speaker 2: the fact that there's so much coverage around this case.

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Speaker 2: And by the way, it wasn't looking great, even for

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Speaker 2: a sucker like me who was holding out some hope

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Speaker 2: for humanity, that this doesn't happen anymore, that stranger danger

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Speaker 2: isn't necessarily your thing, or some weirdo at the light

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Speaker 2: staring into your house for no real reason other than

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Speaker 2: a thrill kill. Remember this was a major overkill like

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Speaker 2: the likes of which is very rare, and this trial

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Speaker 2: was one of the most anticipated trials because we needed

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Speaker 2: to understand better why, how, how could this be? Why

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Speaker 2: would anybody just wake up on a random day and

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Speaker 2: decide to murder four people that he has no obvious

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Speaker 2: connection to. There's no revenge, there was no like money

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Speaker 2: at large, there was no like shenanigans. These were epic

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Speaker 2: human beings. Not that murder is ever justified, obviously, but

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Speaker 2: we're talking senseless in an overkill. Ethan Shapin was possibly decapitated.

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Speaker 2: This guy used a Rambo knife and man to man

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Speaker 2: combat like a video game, and walked away somehow and

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Speaker 2: then went about his life and apparently was a real

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Speaker 2: joy in the classroom in the days after.

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Speaker 5: I mean, evil in this world exists. I do. That's

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Speaker 5: just a fact that I contend with and I do

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Speaker 5: believe is true. And I think you know, part of

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Speaker 5: what you and everyone and we all are struggling with

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Speaker 5: is to try and make sense. Like you were saying, Stephanie,

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Speaker 5: what's the why. There's no reason applied to madness?

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Speaker 1: Right?

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Speaker 5: You can't, that's you can't reason.

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Speaker 2: You can't.

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Speaker 4: We're not mad.

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Speaker 2: We can't understand it, but like, imagine for a moment

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Speaker 2: that and again this is admittedly I'm close to this.

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Speaker 2: We're all too close to it and have been following

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Speaker 2: it too closely and are kind of in the rabbit

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Speaker 2: hole a little bit too deep. But again, the walls

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Speaker 2: were bleeding in this house. There was so much blood.

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Speaker 2: This bloodshed was unfathomable. And this clown leaves, gets back

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Speaker 2: in his car, dips, goes to school, goes home for

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Speaker 2: the holiday, faces his loving parents and his beloved sisters,

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Speaker 2: both of whom who have since lost their jobs because

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Speaker 2: of their notorious accused brother. Mom and dad. Mom was

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Speaker 2: like working for the school. Dad was a janitor and

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Speaker 2: like gave everything he had to make Brian have a

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Speaker 2: great education. And he just leaves them holding the bag.

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Speaker 2: And four family members, you know, four victims and their families. Rather,

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Speaker 2: that is generational trauma that is going to be passed

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Speaker 2: down and shared. It's like the ripple effect of this

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Speaker 2: kind of madness can't be understated. And I'm mad.

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Speaker 5: I don't know why I'm so up insanity. Here's a

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Speaker 5: little bit of what we do know and stuff. Everyone,

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Speaker 5: the rage you are feeling and that we all are

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Speaker 5: feeling is because it's rage inducing. Just a little bit

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Speaker 5: of knowledge. The families of the victims they met with

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Speaker 5: the prosecutors last week, which I was not aware of

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Speaker 5: until today, and that was to discuss the possibility of

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Speaker 5: a plea deal. And in a letter that the prosecution

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Speaker 5: sent to the families and it was signed by Bill Thompson,

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Speaker 5: according to new sources, he said that they weighed heavily

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Speaker 5: the family in their decision making quote, we cannot fathom

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Speaker 5: the toll that this has taken on your family. This

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Speaker 5: resolution is our sincere attempt to seek justice for your family.

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Speaker 5: This agreement ensures that the defendant will be convicted, will

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Speaker 5: spend the rest of his life in prison, and will

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Speaker 5: not be able to put you and the other families

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Speaker 5: through the uncertainty of decades of post conviction appeals.

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Speaker 4: And that's something that that's something to be considered. I mean,

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Speaker 4: with a death penalty case, there's appeal after appeal after appeal,

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Speaker 4: and as a family member of a victim, you're going

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Speaker 4: to want to go to those appeals. That's and you're

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Speaker 4: gonna have to be reliving this over and over and

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Speaker 4: over again. And you know, Honestly, I'm sure they relive

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Speaker 4: it every day right now. You know, they've been living

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Speaker 4: and they've been living in suspended animation for the last

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Speaker 4: two and a half years, right and waiting for this,

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Speaker 4: and you know, I just listen. I think, you know,

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Speaker 4: this was a random Monday. I agree with you, Stephanie.

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Speaker 4: But I do think that there's a lot behind the

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Speaker 4: scenes that obviously were not privy to. I do kind

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Speaker 4: of think that, you know, his family, Brian Coberger's family,

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Speaker 4: his mom, his dad, his sisters. I'm not sure were

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Speaker 4: possibly pleading with him to you know, not put them

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Speaker 4: through this because you know, if you write, if you know,

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Speaker 4: I I think that the sister called the FBI and

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Speaker 4: made a tip, you know, to them about Brian Coberger.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, he said that. You've said that since day one, honestly,

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Speaker 2: you think five since so long, and we haven't been

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Speaker 2: able to say that out loud because we didn't. Now

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Speaker 2: we can say whatever I said it out loud. I

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Speaker 2: haven't know but that, but we couldn't even put it

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Speaker 2: in the documentary. We left it out of the podcast

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Speaker 2: because we didn't want to interrupt.

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Speaker 5: Go ahead.

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Speaker 2: It's a lot.

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Speaker 4: I mean, there's a lot of different reasons. But you know, Steve,

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Speaker 4: Steve has been in the media talking and he's been

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Speaker 4: alluding to somebody calling the FBI. And I've always suspected

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Speaker 4: that the trip the dad took to you know, to

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Speaker 4: go get him was not planned and that it was

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Speaker 4: like an emergency.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, well, emergency is the right word. Since coming up,

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Speaker 5: we will continue unpacking the Coburger's shocking plea deal. We

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Speaker 5: also do have the latest and the pdy trial and

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Speaker 5: one of his sons facing legal troubles, and do join

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Speaker 5: the conversation. We're at eight to day three one Crime.

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Speaker 5: We want to hear your thoughts.

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Speaker 2: Big day in the news, breaking stories that are explosive.

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Speaker 2: We're going to be covering the Didty trial and some

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Speaker 2: issues potentially with a juror as deliberations are about to begin.

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Speaker 2: But on that because first there's been an explosive development

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Speaker 2: in the Idaho college murders. I'm Stephanie Leidecker, I head

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Speaker 2: of KT Studios, where we make true crime podcasts and documentaries,

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Speaker 2: and I get to do that with true crime analyst

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Speaker 2: and host Body move In and true crime producer and

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Speaker 2: host Courtney Armstrong. We have been really in the trenches

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Speaker 2: on this case since day one, and it's got us

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Speaker 2: a little shattered in the heart space. On the one hand,

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Speaker 2: there's an answer, and on the other looking back, I

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Speaker 2: am for sure the dumbest in the room right now

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Speaker 2: and feel a little more hYP dope because every day

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Speaker 2: we ask ourselves, well, what if? What if? Because their

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Speaker 2: info was mounting against him, but there was always a

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Speaker 2: counter argument to it. And you know, listen, watch the doc,

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Speaker 2: check out the podcast. It's not a shameless plug. It's

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Speaker 2: just because we don't have the time here to unpack

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Speaker 2: every little detail that we do in those and we

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Speaker 2: really we want to hear from you also, so please

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Speaker 2: jump in. I know you have opinions, So eight eight

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Speaker 2: eight three one crime call us, leave us a talkback.

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Speaker 2: Download the app on the iHeartRadio app. It's free. Press

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Speaker 2: the button in the right hand corner. You can leave

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Speaker 2: us a message boom you're on the show, or you

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Speaker 2: can hit us up on our socials at True Crime

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Speaker 2: Tonight's Show on TikTok and Instagram, and you could also

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Speaker 2: just try us at True Crime Tonight on Facebook. And

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Speaker 2: we want to hear like this doesn't make any sense, Jarrett,

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Speaker 2: who we love he's also in the documentary. He's excellent,

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Speaker 2: is an outstanding trial attorney. He's tried some of these

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Speaker 2: large cases and knows how the prosecution thinks, right, so

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Speaker 2: he's going to be joining us to really unpack some

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Speaker 2: of these details, probably far less emotionally if you haven't

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Speaker 2: been following that case closely. The accused, Brian Coberger, who

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Speaker 2: was a PhD student studying criminology, was accused of murdering

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Speaker 2: for co eds at the University of Idaho back in

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Speaker 2: twenty twenty two. He has pled not guilty and today

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Speaker 2: has decided to plea. He is not going to be

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Speaker 2: facing the death sentence. You'll remember he was looking at

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Speaker 2: a death sentence potentially in front of a firing squad,

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Speaker 2: and today, seemingly, very unceremoniously, he has confessed and has

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Speaker 2: pled guilty to all four counts of murder. And there's

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Speaker 2: a big hearing on Wednesday, and we'll be there following

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Speaker 2: it so closely where he will have to face a

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Speaker 2: judge and the media and hopefully family members can get

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Speaker 2: there in time to see this happen, because again, this

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Speaker 2: has been such an exhaust potentially on the system. We

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Speaker 2: made the podcast the Idaho massacre on iHeart two seasons.

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Speaker 2: Courtney is the voice of it and bodies been on it,

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Speaker 2: and we're also making the documentary based on the podcast

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Speaker 2: for Peacock. They've been extraordinary partners. The spirit of that

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Speaker 2: has been to really unpack the did he didn't he?

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Speaker 2: The guilty not guilty very balanced look at this particular case.

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Speaker 2: Because there's been so much coverage and so much misinformation,

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Speaker 2: we really wanted to curate it prior to the trial.

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Speaker 2: And you know, honestly, it's pretty unbelievable that this guy

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Speaker 2: is just like, Yeah, I did it. I took a

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Speaker 2: Rambo knife and I gutted for human beings and then

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Speaker 2: what about and denied it.

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Speaker 4: We don't know that he confessed, right like, we know

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Speaker 4: that he's going to plead guilty as part of the arrangement,

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Speaker 4: but we don't know what that is going to detail,

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Speaker 4: right We don't know if there's going to be I

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Speaker 4: would have, I would suspect, And this is going to

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Speaker 4: be something that I would like to ask Jarrett when

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Speaker 4: he comes on. Is part of the plea deal? Does

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Speaker 4: he think as a former prosecutor that prosecuted these kinds

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Speaker 4: of cases, is there any part of this that he

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Speaker 4: can foresee where there's no kind of confession included. I

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Speaker 4: can't imagine that there's not going to be a confession.

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Speaker 2: I just can't saving his own life right, maybe it's possible.

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Speaker 2: And by the way, I just like kind of have

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Speaker 2: blacked out. I feel a little emotionally charged. Admittedly speaking,

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Speaker 2: our hearts go out to the victims' families. Let's just

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Speaker 2: start there for a hot And we've.

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Speaker 4: Heard from the Gonsalves family, Kaylee's dad specifically, and I

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Speaker 4: think Kaylee's sister too, about this, and they are very

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Speaker 4: displeased with this.

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Speaker 2: They are very displeased with this.

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Speaker 4: In fact, I can quote them as saying, the Layta

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Speaker 4: County Prosecutor's office treatment of our family during this process

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Speaker 4: is something I wouldn't wish on anyone. You know, they

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Speaker 4: really feel they should be more consulted in this decision,

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Speaker 4: or I'm not necessarily consulted, but their feelings about this

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Speaker 4: should be, you know, taken under advisement. And you know,

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Speaker 4: they're dealing with four families, They're dealing with four who

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Speaker 4: might feel the same or might not. You know, this

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Speaker 4: is all just very very very sad.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, and the Gonzalez family has been vocal throughout and

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Speaker 5: as you said body right now as well, I will

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Speaker 5: just say we've spoken to so many officers of the

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Speaker 5: law over the course of producing documentaries and podcasts, and

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Speaker 5: it's really hard a lot of times for good reasons,

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Speaker 5: to help further an investigation. The families can't get all

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Speaker 5: of the information that they want in the time that's allocated,

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Speaker 5: and it can be an impossibility, as you said, while

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Speaker 5: trying to do with the investigation, to satiate for families

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Speaker 5: to try and make sense of the senseless. So I

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Speaker 5: just say that to say, of course, I think the victims'

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Speaker 5: families don't have much else, nowhere else to go with

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Speaker 5: their grief.

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Speaker 2: So and can you blame them? And yes, to your point,

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Speaker 2: not all of the family members really were pro the

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Speaker 2: death sentence, right, the death penalty.

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Speaker 4: Well, initially I don't know how they feel now, but

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Speaker 4: initially they weren't. I know Xana's family is very upset,

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Speaker 4: I know Kaylee's family is very upset, but I'm not

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Speaker 4: sure about Maddie and Ethan's family. I know initially Ethan's

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Speaker 4: family was, you know, not really excited about the possibility

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Speaker 4: of the death penalty.

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Speaker 2: I just don't know where they stand today.

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Speaker 4: And you know it's their right to keep that to

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Speaker 4: themselves if they want to.

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Speaker 2: And just to add to that, you know, we keep,

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Speaker 2: you know, glossing over their names. Madison Mogan and Kaylee

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Speaker 2: Gonzalvez are two of the victims. If you recognize that

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Speaker 2: iconic photo of them wearing their shirts in front of

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Speaker 2: the house, they're the two blonde ones and they were

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Speaker 2: best friends from childhood. They grew up like sisters and

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Speaker 2: died together in the most hideous way. And then Xaner

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Speaker 2: Kernodle and Ethan Shapin they were a couple, and Ethan's

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Speaker 2: siblings he was a triplet, still attend the school. So again,

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Speaker 2: grief beyond words, Grief beyond words.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, you're listening to True Crime tonight. I am body

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Speaker 4: Movin and I am joined by Stephanie Leidecker and Courtney Armstrong,

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Speaker 4: and we're right in the middle of talking about this

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Speaker 4: explosive news in the Moscow case where suspect Brian Colberger

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Speaker 4: has accepted a plea deal. If you have any questions

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Speaker 4: or you know you want to make a comment, give

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Speaker 4: us a call at eighty eight thirty one crime or

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Speaker 4: use the talk box on the iHeartRadio app. You know,

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Speaker 4: I just listen. I think I feel a little bit differently.

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Speaker 4: I'm sad for the families, no doubt, but I'm not surprised.

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Speaker 4: You know, the death penalty is used as a negotiation tool.

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Speaker 4: I read I've been talking about this for about a year.

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Speaker 4: I read this study on the death penalty specifically in Idaho, Okay.

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Speaker 4: And from two thousand and two to two thousand and

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Speaker 4: nineteen eight, they analyzed all the murder cases in Idaho, Okay.

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Speaker 4: And there were one hundred and fifty five murder cases

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Speaker 4: in that almost twenty year span, and of those cases,

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Speaker 4: one hundred and fifty five qualified for the death penalty. Okay,

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Speaker 4: one hundred and fifty five of those murders qualified for

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Speaker 4: the death penalty. Of those murders that qualified, the state

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Speaker 4: pursued thirty two cases. Okay, so that's only, like, you know, eight,

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Speaker 4: It's like a really small, really small amount.

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Speaker 2: I've got the stats. I just need to pull them up.

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Speaker 4: But in so twenty two went to to went, I'm sorry,

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Speaker 4: got that we're going to get the death penalty. I

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Speaker 4: got all discombobulated. One hundred and fifty fives qualified for

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Speaker 4: the death penalty. Thirty two were filed, so they proceeded

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Speaker 4: with thirty two of those thirty two cases, twenty three

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Speaker 4: plied over seventy percent of cases that get the death

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Speaker 4: penalty in Idaho.

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Speaker 2: Plead. Yeah, it gets real. But we've been paying for

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Speaker 2: his vegan meals behind bars this entire time. The family

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Speaker 2: has been like subjected to more gruesome details. I'm getting high,

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Speaker 2: but you would.

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Speaker 4: But here's the thing that doesn't change. Even if he

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Speaker 4: pled guilty day one, he would still we would still

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Speaker 4: be paying for those vegan.

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Speaker 2: Mills, with the vegan meals. I don't know why that

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Speaker 2: irks me so badly. I know that, you know, Jared

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Speaker 2: Sarantino is going to weigh in on this and like

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Speaker 2: keep us on this straight and narrow, because he's so

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Speaker 2: smart with this stuff. And I'm so curious, you know,

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Speaker 2: if we can just bring him in right now to

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Speaker 2: join us, Tombo, because Jarrett, are you are you there?

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Speaker 6: I'm here too, So I'm feeling a little numb tonight,

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Speaker 6: like all three of you, I've been covering this very invested,

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Speaker 6: have been following it.

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Speaker 7: You know, I've done death penalty cases. I pursued death

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Speaker 7: penalty all the way and I've pled them out. So

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Speaker 7: I'm in a unique position here and I feel exactly

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Speaker 7: like I did on those nights where we took it

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Speaker 7: off the table and took a plate. Yeah, and here's

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Speaker 7: the thing. All though everyone is shocked and numb, this

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Speaker 7: is a good day. I mean, I know what happened,

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Speaker 7: and he's going to enter a guilty plea and he's

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Speaker 7: going to spend the rest of us. I used to

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Speaker 7: say this, and it applies here. Brian Kohlberger is not

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Speaker 7: going to die at the hands of the state. He's

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Speaker 7: going to die in the hands of the state. And

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Speaker 7: that is a distinction to a lot of people. But

432
00:22:23,920 --> 00:22:26,040
Speaker 7: the reality is he's never going to be a free

433
00:22:26,080 --> 00:22:27,480
Speaker 7: man again because of what he did.

434
00:22:27,880 --> 00:22:28,000
Speaker 3: Right.

435
00:22:28,080 --> 00:22:30,400
Speaker 4: That's a really good, really good point, And maybe that's

436
00:22:30,400 --> 00:22:32,760
Speaker 4: why I'm kind of like, well, you know, I don't

437
00:22:32,800 --> 00:22:36,320
Speaker 4: feel sad about this, and I know I'm in the minority,

438
00:22:36,359 --> 00:22:39,760
Speaker 4: and that's okay. I'm okay with that because this doesn't

439
00:22:39,840 --> 00:22:43,159
Speaker 4: change anything. He's still going to go to prison, Like

440
00:22:43,240 --> 00:22:45,720
Speaker 4: it's he's still going to be homes so horrible too.

441
00:22:45,960 --> 00:22:48,960
Speaker 2: In prison, it's like not fun from what I'm told Jared,

442
00:22:49,320 --> 00:22:51,960
Speaker 2: and I think you could report. It's like no easy

443
00:22:52,000 --> 00:22:52,480
Speaker 2: place to be.

444
00:22:52,880 --> 00:22:55,520
Speaker 4: So Jared, can you can you tell us what happens next?

445
00:22:55,520 --> 00:22:58,840
Speaker 4: We know on Wednesday that there's going to be the plea,

446
00:22:59,320 --> 00:23:00,880
Speaker 4: the change of plea.

447
00:23:00,760 --> 00:23:01,879
Speaker 2: Hearing, right right?

448
00:23:02,640 --> 00:23:05,640
Speaker 7: Has not he has not entered his plea. What has

449
00:23:05,720 --> 00:23:07,840
Speaker 7: happened now? First of all, I don't understand why Bill

450
00:23:07,880 --> 00:23:11,679
Speaker 7: Thompson sent a letter to the victims. Why not call them?

451
00:23:12,440 --> 00:23:15,879
Speaker 7: You know, I don't get that. I've had that conversation

452
00:23:16,000 --> 00:23:19,040
Speaker 7: with many families. I don't get why we're sending letters.

453
00:23:19,119 --> 00:23:23,000
Speaker 7: But besides that, here's what happened on Wednesday. Colberger has

454
00:23:23,160 --> 00:23:25,719
Speaker 7: entered a formal plea. If not guilty, he has a

455
00:23:25,880 --> 00:23:28,199
Speaker 7: change of plea hearing where he will come before the

456
00:23:28,320 --> 00:23:31,040
Speaker 7: judge and not let his lawyers speak, this time, in

457
00:23:31,119 --> 00:23:34,119
Speaker 7: his own voice, will say, your honor, I change my

458
00:23:34,280 --> 00:23:38,560
Speaker 7: plea to guilty. Then there will be likely another hearing

459
00:23:38,640 --> 00:23:41,840
Speaker 7: date set where he will formally enter that plea if

460
00:23:41,880 --> 00:23:44,400
Speaker 7: he doesn't do it Wednesday, and the victims and their

461
00:23:44,480 --> 00:23:47,960
Speaker 7: families will have the opportunity to address him before sentence

462
00:23:48,040 --> 00:23:52,080
Speaker 7: is imposed. That's what's going to happen here. So sentence

463
00:23:52,240 --> 00:23:55,120
Speaker 7: is basically written in stone here it's four consecutive life

464
00:23:55,119 --> 00:23:58,240
Speaker 7: sentences plus ten for the burglary. But the families will

465
00:23:58,240 --> 00:24:00,000
Speaker 7: be given the chance to confront him.

466
00:24:00,160 --> 00:24:02,520
Speaker 4: Wow, well, stick around. Jared's going to stick with us.

467
00:24:02,520 --> 00:24:04,879
Speaker 4: We're going to continue this conversation. Please give us a

468
00:24:04,920 --> 00:24:06,919
Speaker 4: call at eight eight eight thirty one Crime if you

469
00:24:06,920 --> 00:24:08,760
Speaker 4: have any questions for Jared. This is an opportunity of

470
00:24:08,800 --> 00:24:11,520
Speaker 4: a lifetime. Stick right here eight eight eight thirty one Crime,

471
00:24:11,680 --> 00:24:21,400
Speaker 4: stick right here in true crime tonight.

472
00:24:22,920 --> 00:24:27,880
Speaker 2: This big development in the Brian Coburger, Idaho murder trial

473
00:24:28,000 --> 00:24:29,959
Speaker 2: that is not going to be if you haven't been

474
00:24:30,000 --> 00:24:33,720
Speaker 2: following this case. Brian Coburger has been accused. He's also

475
00:24:33,760 --> 00:24:36,760
Speaker 2: said he was innocent of man blamed other people and

476
00:24:36,800 --> 00:24:41,040
Speaker 2: blamed other people, caused chaos and grief for two and

477
00:24:41,080 --> 00:24:44,440
Speaker 2: a half years, and he's been accused of murdering four

478
00:24:44,440 --> 00:24:48,720
Speaker 2: college co eds in a massive overkill on November thirteenth,

479
00:24:48,800 --> 00:24:53,440
Speaker 2: twenty twenty two, and today, in an unexpected twist of events,

480
00:24:53,640 --> 00:24:56,640
Speaker 2: he has said he's guilty and his taking a plead

481
00:24:56,680 --> 00:25:01,000
Speaker 2: deal so he does not have to face the death sentence. Stephanieleidecker, I,

482
00:25:01,000 --> 00:25:03,440
Speaker 2: head of KT Studios and I'm here with Body move

483
00:25:03,520 --> 00:25:07,520
Speaker 2: In and Courtney Armstrong, both of which have been following

484
00:25:07,520 --> 00:25:10,199
Speaker 2: this case from day one. We make the podcast The

485
00:25:10,240 --> 00:25:14,040
Speaker 2: Idaho Massacre, two seasons of that, and we're literally handing

486
00:25:14,119 --> 00:25:18,240
Speaker 2: in the documentary to Peacock, also based on the same tragedy.

487
00:25:18,520 --> 00:25:22,040
Speaker 2: Jarrett Farentino, who is also in the documentary, is an

488
00:25:22,040 --> 00:25:25,480
Speaker 2: extraordinary trial attorney. He has covered some of these largest

489
00:25:25,560 --> 00:25:28,679
Speaker 2: cases in the state of Pennsylvania, which is also the

490
00:25:28,760 --> 00:25:32,600
Speaker 2: state that the accused Brian Coberger is from. He's also

491
00:25:32,600 --> 00:25:36,000
Speaker 2: the host of True Crime Boss because he is the

492
00:25:36,040 --> 00:25:38,639
Speaker 2: True Crime Boss, and that podcast is excellent, as is

493
00:25:38,640 --> 00:25:41,480
Speaker 2: your YouTube channel. And Jarrett, thank you for always breaking

494
00:25:41,480 --> 00:25:43,879
Speaker 2: this down to us in Layman's terms and kind of

495
00:25:43,880 --> 00:25:48,600
Speaker 2: bringing us into the beehive of what happens in these moments.

496
00:25:48,640 --> 00:25:51,199
Speaker 2: As a prosecutor, you've lived it in such big ways

497
00:25:51,359 --> 00:25:53,600
Speaker 2: and we know you know this case so closely. Thank

498
00:25:53,640 --> 00:25:56,240
Speaker 2: you for a joining us, but also for breaking it down.

499
00:25:56,320 --> 00:25:58,360
Speaker 2: I don't know why we're I think I just feel

500
00:25:58,440 --> 00:26:01,199
Speaker 2: duped because somewhere in the back of my heart, I

501
00:26:01,359 --> 00:26:03,479
Speaker 2: was I don't know what boogeyman I thought was going

502
00:26:03,520 --> 00:26:06,520
Speaker 2: to show up with a mask on and somehow that

503
00:26:06,560 --> 00:26:09,119
Speaker 2: would make sense. I just didn't believe that this college

504
00:26:09,119 --> 00:26:11,679
Speaker 2: student would be that messy PhD student would be that

505
00:26:11,800 --> 00:26:14,880
Speaker 2: messy and make such baseline errors. And it turns out

506
00:26:14,920 --> 00:26:17,280
Speaker 2: that joke has been on me and all of us

507
00:26:17,320 --> 00:26:19,920
Speaker 2: who have been following this very closely, and we're heartbroken

508
00:26:19,960 --> 00:26:20,680
Speaker 2: for the families.

509
00:26:20,960 --> 00:26:25,359
Speaker 5: So, Jared, Jared, I have a specific question on something

510
00:26:25,400 --> 00:26:29,399
Speaker 5: you had mentioned before the break, So the plea. We

511
00:26:29,480 --> 00:26:32,199
Speaker 5: know that the plea has been accepted by Coburger and

512
00:26:32,280 --> 00:26:34,960
Speaker 5: the defense and that in two days there will be

513
00:26:35,480 --> 00:26:38,960
Speaker 5: a hearing, and you said that we will hear from Coburger.

514
00:26:39,119 --> 00:26:41,359
Speaker 5: So is that a matter if I understood correctly, is

515
00:26:41,400 --> 00:26:43,600
Speaker 5: it a matter of law if you're accepting a plea

516
00:26:43,640 --> 00:26:47,000
Speaker 5: deal that you have to speak and can't have your attorney.

517
00:26:47,359 --> 00:26:50,320
Speaker 7: Yes, you have to go before the judge under oath

518
00:26:50,480 --> 00:26:54,240
Speaker 7: and say that you are doing this voluntarily. You recognize

519
00:26:54,240 --> 00:26:56,879
Speaker 7: that you have the right to trial, especially case of

520
00:26:56,920 --> 00:27:01,160
Speaker 7: this magnitude where it has to be knowing and voluntary.

521
00:27:01,320 --> 00:27:04,399
Speaker 7: And you know there's a colloquy that occurs between the

522
00:27:04,560 --> 00:27:07,439
Speaker 7: judge and the defendant. And here's why this happens. And

523
00:27:07,480 --> 00:27:10,560
Speaker 7: a calloqui is just a list of questions, and we've

524
00:27:10,600 --> 00:27:13,840
Speaker 7: prepared them ourselves. The judges get them. The lawyers will

525
00:27:13,920 --> 00:27:18,360
Speaker 7: ensure that Brian Kolberger answers very pointed questions. I've had

526
00:27:18,359 --> 00:27:20,679
Speaker 7: the opportunity. You're not going to come be able to

527
00:27:20,680 --> 00:27:22,560
Speaker 7: come back and file an appeal and say he didn't

528
00:27:22,600 --> 00:27:26,000
Speaker 7: have enough time to do an investigation. You acknowledge that

529
00:27:26,080 --> 00:27:28,280
Speaker 7: you had the right to trial all of these things

530
00:27:28,359 --> 00:27:30,560
Speaker 7: under oath. Brian Colberger is going to have to admit

531
00:27:30,800 --> 00:27:34,600
Speaker 7: and acknowledge voluntarily, and that is critical to the plea

532
00:27:34,720 --> 00:27:38,160
Speaker 7: because you're building a record to protect that plea down

533
00:27:38,200 --> 00:27:40,680
Speaker 7: the road in the event he tries to file an appeal,

534
00:27:40,720 --> 00:27:43,399
Speaker 7: which he's waiving the ninety nine point nine percent of

535
00:27:43,440 --> 00:27:45,280
Speaker 7: his appellate rights at this point as well.

536
00:27:45,520 --> 00:27:48,879
Speaker 5: And Jared on top of that, does Coburger or anyone

537
00:27:48,960 --> 00:27:51,919
Speaker 5: who is in his position, do they need to or

538
00:27:52,000 --> 00:27:55,159
Speaker 5: is it customary for them to give details of X

539
00:27:55,200 --> 00:27:57,399
Speaker 5: happened and then why happened? Or are they under no

540
00:27:57,520 --> 00:28:00,880
Speaker 5: obligation to explain the events of the night.

541
00:28:01,280 --> 00:28:04,919
Speaker 7: Well, three likely things could happen, okay. Number one, the

542
00:28:04,960 --> 00:28:08,960
Speaker 7: prosecutor will read a factional, a factual basis for the crimes.

543
00:28:09,040 --> 00:28:12,440
Speaker 7: He'll go into Bill Thompson would read on November thirteen,

544
00:28:12,480 --> 00:28:15,160
Speaker 7: twenty twenty two, you know, Brian Colberger into the home,

545
00:28:15,240 --> 00:28:18,359
Speaker 7: and we all know what happened. And then Colberger could admit, yes,

546
00:28:18,440 --> 00:28:21,359
Speaker 7: that's what happened. That's what I did. Okay. But in

547
00:28:21,400 --> 00:28:24,159
Speaker 7: a case like this, if I was the prosecutor, I

548
00:28:24,200 --> 00:28:27,320
Speaker 7: would want an elocution. I would want Coberger to say

549
00:28:27,359 --> 00:28:32,480
Speaker 7: affirmatively I killed Xana, Maddie, Ethan and Kayley. I want

550
00:28:32,640 --> 00:28:34,920
Speaker 7: to hear him say it. I don't just want him

551
00:28:34,960 --> 00:28:36,760
Speaker 7: say to say yes. And that could be part of

552
00:28:36,760 --> 00:28:37,640
Speaker 7: the plea agreement.

553
00:28:37,920 --> 00:28:41,200
Speaker 4: And that would happen at sentencing, like right before sentencing.

554
00:28:40,840 --> 00:28:43,320
Speaker 7: Right, well, it would happen when he's It could happen

555
00:28:43,320 --> 00:28:46,800
Speaker 7: when he's entering the plea. Yes, oh it could. It could,

556
00:28:46,920 --> 00:28:50,280
Speaker 7: And it could happen in response to the victim's families.

557
00:28:50,280 --> 00:28:52,800
Speaker 7: He could apologize for them. He could acknowledge that he

558
00:28:52,840 --> 00:28:55,560
Speaker 7: did it. We may never know why. And I think

559
00:28:55,600 --> 00:28:57,800
Speaker 7: some of the things I'm seeing online, they're asking is

560
00:28:57,840 --> 00:28:59,920
Speaker 7: it an Alfred plea? You know, that's the kind of thing.

561
00:29:00,000 --> 00:29:01,960
Speaker 2: You know, why do people think that? What does that mean?

562
00:29:02,080 --> 00:29:04,840
Speaker 7: So that that's the name of the case out of

563
00:29:04,880 --> 00:29:08,720
Speaker 7: North Carolina from nineteen seventy. The Supreme Court basically said

564
00:29:08,920 --> 00:29:12,360
Speaker 7: a guilty tlea could be accepted if a defendant doesn't

565
00:29:12,400 --> 00:29:15,360
Speaker 7: admit the criminal act as long as they're saying, I

566
00:29:15,400 --> 00:29:18,040
Speaker 7: acknowledge there's enough evidence against me, and I'm going to

567
00:29:18,160 --> 00:29:19,280
Speaker 7: likely be convicted.

568
00:29:19,640 --> 00:29:21,240
Speaker 2: You can spends three got out.

569
00:29:21,360 --> 00:29:25,040
Speaker 7: It's exactly how they got out. But those now, if

570
00:29:25,120 --> 00:29:27,800
Speaker 7: I'm the prosecutor in this case, if I'm Bill Thompson,

571
00:29:27,960 --> 00:29:32,000
Speaker 7: I don't accept an outfits. I'm not taking death off

572
00:29:32,000 --> 00:29:35,600
Speaker 7: the table until you bring some closure and some accountability

573
00:29:35,600 --> 00:29:36,480
Speaker 7: to these families.

574
00:29:37,120 --> 00:29:39,320
Speaker 2: Percent I'm so curious too, it was there a big

575
00:29:39,360 --> 00:29:43,240
Speaker 2: ticket moment or something that maybe happened. And listen. If

576
00:29:43,240 --> 00:29:45,560
Speaker 2: you're just joining us, you're listening to true Crime tonight.

577
00:29:45,600 --> 00:29:47,520
Speaker 2: We want to hear from you. Eight eight eight three

578
00:29:47,640 --> 00:29:50,800
Speaker 2: one crime. Please jump in join the conversation. We're talking

579
00:29:50,880 --> 00:29:54,960
Speaker 2: about the recent developments. The accused, Brian Coberger, who was

580
00:29:55,000 --> 00:29:58,880
Speaker 2: really facing the trial of our time this summer, has

581
00:29:59,080 --> 00:30:03,560
Speaker 2: now pled guilty to murdering for college co eds Madison Mogan,

582
00:30:03,640 --> 00:30:08,840
Speaker 2: Kayleie Gonzalvez, Zana Kernodle, and Ethan Chapin and Madison Mogen

583
00:30:09,000 --> 00:30:12,880
Speaker 2: and their families have been ripped apart. So yeah, we're

584
00:30:12,920 --> 00:30:15,520
Speaker 2: all a little shook, and everybody's kind of fact checking

585
00:30:15,600 --> 00:30:18,560
Speaker 2: real time. We wondered, like, what was the big ticket moment?

586
00:30:18,760 --> 00:30:21,680
Speaker 2: Was it this door dash video? Potentially, because if that

587
00:30:21,880 --> 00:30:24,480
Speaker 2: was the case, we covered this pretty extensively this week

588
00:30:24,840 --> 00:30:28,120
Speaker 2: or last week when this video got out there of

589
00:30:28,400 --> 00:30:33,040
Speaker 2: this door dash driver who apparently maybe saw him directly,

590
00:30:33,400 --> 00:30:38,000
Speaker 2: and was this like air quotes eyewitness, you know that person,

591
00:30:38,040 --> 00:30:41,000
Speaker 2: she's a hero, if you know, if she is a

592
00:30:41,000 --> 00:30:43,680
Speaker 2: big piece of this equation. Or is this just like

593
00:30:43,920 --> 00:30:46,200
Speaker 2: it's the end of June or maybe it was July.

594
00:30:46,360 --> 00:30:49,240
Speaker 4: Or maybe it was a combination of door Dash, the

595
00:30:49,240 --> 00:30:52,600
Speaker 4: the third party suspects being denied in court, the trial

596
00:30:52,760 --> 00:30:55,840
Speaker 4: not being delayed like denial after denial for denial.

597
00:30:57,080 --> 00:31:01,080
Speaker 7: Family that really did it. I think the sandbags were

598
00:31:01,080 --> 00:31:03,840
Speaker 7: thrown off here. You know, the door dash video. Although

599
00:31:03,880 --> 00:31:06,400
Speaker 7: we found out about it very recently. He would have

600
00:31:06,480 --> 00:31:09,040
Speaker 7: known about that, So that's not news to him. Because

601
00:31:09,040 --> 00:31:11,280
Speaker 7: that's one thing about this case. So much was done

602
00:31:11,400 --> 00:31:14,960
Speaker 7: under seal. We don't have all those details. He did.

603
00:31:15,120 --> 00:31:18,560
Speaker 7: What happened here was his off ramps were closed. He

604
00:31:18,760 --> 00:31:21,600
Speaker 7: lost the ability to challenge the DNA several months ago.

605
00:31:21,840 --> 00:31:25,520
Speaker 7: He lost the theory on alternate suspects. At that point,

606
00:31:25,680 --> 00:31:27,640
Speaker 7: you've got to explain why your DNA's there, and you

607
00:31:27,720 --> 00:31:31,200
Speaker 7: have no ability to suggest it with somebody else. All

608
00:31:31,200 --> 00:31:34,240
Speaker 7: the fingers are pointing at Brian Kolberger. His lawyers at

609
00:31:34,280 --> 00:31:36,800
Speaker 7: that point are working very hard on him to say, Brian,

610
00:31:37,000 --> 00:31:39,000
Speaker 7: we're running out of options here. The only thing you

611
00:31:39,040 --> 00:31:41,000
Speaker 7: can do is try to save your life. You got

612
00:31:41,000 --> 00:31:42,920
Speaker 7: to come to your senses, Jarret.

613
00:31:42,920 --> 00:31:46,240
Speaker 5: Question for you so as obviously you are a former

614
00:31:46,280 --> 00:31:50,520
Speaker 5: homicide prosecutor and veteran trial attorneys, and you have handled

615
00:31:50,520 --> 00:31:53,880
Speaker 5: some huge, high profile murder cases. So you are the

616
00:31:53,880 --> 00:31:56,720
Speaker 5: one to ask. Yes, you are Gezon, all your greatness,

617
00:31:56,720 --> 00:31:58,520
Speaker 5: I got confused for a second.

618
00:31:59,280 --> 00:32:00,480
Speaker 2: Oh my god, it's okay.

619
00:32:00,600 --> 00:32:01,320
Speaker 5: I can jump down.

620
00:32:01,520 --> 00:32:06,520
Speaker 2: I have more kind of for more questions, Jared Jarrett. Jarrett, Jarrett,

621
00:32:06,560 --> 00:32:08,760
Speaker 2: you know, I I there's a story in my head

622
00:32:09,000 --> 00:32:11,280
Speaker 2: that does not make it fact. But a little bit

623
00:32:11,280 --> 00:32:13,200
Speaker 2: of the story or the spidey sense that we've all

624
00:32:13,240 --> 00:32:15,520
Speaker 2: talked about offline is, you know, he had a really

625
00:32:15,600 --> 00:32:19,040
Speaker 2: loving family, right and he is it possible that maybe

626
00:32:19,080 --> 00:32:21,360
Speaker 2: his parents, his mom and dad, you know Dad, we

627
00:32:21,520 --> 00:32:24,840
Speaker 2: know he called or someone who was in the family

628
00:32:24,880 --> 00:32:28,160
Speaker 2: who was registered to that phone number. In the hours

629
00:32:28,240 --> 00:32:32,680
Speaker 2: after the deaths and before the bodies were discovered, Brian Coburger,

630
00:32:32,920 --> 00:32:36,479
Speaker 2: you know, called home and spoke for pretty lengthy amounts

631
00:32:36,520 --> 00:32:39,680
Speaker 2: of time. Let's just assume with dad. And we also

632
00:32:39,760 --> 00:32:42,680
Speaker 2: know that Dad picked him up at the university and

633
00:32:42,760 --> 00:32:45,440
Speaker 2: was driving him back for Thanksgiving and they got pulled

634
00:32:45,440 --> 00:32:48,760
Speaker 2: over by the police two separate times, which is unheard of.

635
00:32:49,000 --> 00:32:52,280
Speaker 2: Maybe that was divinely guided. Now in retrospect, that was

636
00:32:52,320 --> 00:32:54,880
Speaker 2: another factor that just seemed impossible to me. Is it

637
00:32:55,160 --> 00:32:59,680
Speaker 2: sometimes the family of the accused that kind of weighs

638
00:32:59,680 --> 00:33:02,520
Speaker 2: in and is like, look, enough is enough? Your sister

639
00:33:02,640 --> 00:33:05,800
Speaker 2: may have to testify against you, Like we've been through enough,

640
00:33:05,960 --> 00:33:08,920
Speaker 2: make it end, or like there's I guess we'll never know.

641
00:33:09,400 --> 00:33:13,800
Speaker 7: Yes, well, that fact. I've had cases where lawyers have

642
00:33:13,880 --> 00:33:16,960
Speaker 7: brought in members of family, the people that the defendant

643
00:33:16,960 --> 00:33:19,600
Speaker 7: respects and looks up to, to come in and talk

644
00:33:19,640 --> 00:33:22,360
Speaker 7: to them. This is not one conversation, this is a

645
00:33:22,440 --> 00:33:25,920
Speaker 7: series of conversations over a period of weeks. I would

646
00:33:26,040 --> 00:33:28,440
Speaker 7: bet I've been waiting for the phone to ring on

647
00:33:28,480 --> 00:33:30,840
Speaker 7: the other side, saying how did mom make out? Trying

648
00:33:30,840 --> 00:33:33,760
Speaker 7: to talk him into a plea, etc. So I don't

649
00:33:33,760 --> 00:33:36,520
Speaker 7: think Brian Kolberger told his family what happened. I think

650
00:33:36,600 --> 00:33:39,840
Speaker 7: he refused to show that side of himself to them,

651
00:33:40,080 --> 00:33:42,640
Speaker 7: but once it was clear to them they accepted who

652
00:33:42,680 --> 00:33:44,880
Speaker 7: he is. I'm sure they told them, Brian will love

653
00:33:44,920 --> 00:33:47,240
Speaker 7: you despite this. We're trying to save your life. You

654
00:33:47,360 --> 00:33:50,480
Speaker 7: need to take this thing that probably weighed very heavy

655
00:33:50,480 --> 00:33:52,000
Speaker 7: on him, and I bet you that's what happened.

656
00:33:52,240 --> 00:33:55,280
Speaker 5: Wow, I have another question. I remembered my question from

657
00:33:55,320 --> 00:33:59,800
Speaker 5: before Jarrett the alternate suspects and it was under seal,

658
00:34:00,240 --> 00:34:02,040
Speaker 5: so we don't know who they were. But how does

659
00:34:02,080 --> 00:34:05,960
Speaker 5: that work? Does the defense attorney? Because you can't knowingly

660
00:34:06,120 --> 00:34:08,600
Speaker 5: throw someone under the bus, can you explain a little

661
00:34:08,600 --> 00:34:09,640
Speaker 5: bit how that would have worked.

662
00:34:09,960 --> 00:34:12,640
Speaker 7: Sure, there has to be some kind of a causal

663
00:34:12,680 --> 00:34:16,680
Speaker 7: connection to the individuals you are proposing as alternates to

664
00:34:16,800 --> 00:34:19,440
Speaker 7: the case, and reading the tea leads here there were

665
00:34:19,520 --> 00:34:22,480
Speaker 7: four two individuals whose DNA may have been found there

666
00:34:22,560 --> 00:34:25,200
Speaker 7: or something like that, or two individuals that were initially

667
00:34:25,360 --> 00:34:28,279
Speaker 7: crossed off as suspects. The person who was stalking I

668
00:34:28,360 --> 00:34:31,440
Speaker 7: believe Maddie. At one point at Walmart, all of those

669
00:34:31,520 --> 00:34:34,880
Speaker 7: people were eliminated as suspects because their DNA was not

670
00:34:35,000 --> 00:34:38,080
Speaker 7: found there. They had an alibi. Whatever it was that

671
00:34:38,280 --> 00:34:40,840
Speaker 7: judge used the word cintilla. He said, there's not a

672
00:34:40,880 --> 00:34:44,959
Speaker 7: sentilla of evidence that connects these individuals to the murder. Okay,

673
00:34:45,040 --> 00:34:47,440
Speaker 7: when a judge uses the word scintilla, you're in trouble

674
00:34:47,680 --> 00:34:50,840
Speaker 7: because they're saying there's no one ever says there's anything

675
00:34:51,320 --> 00:34:55,920
Speaker 7: of a scintilla suggesting that somebody else is responsible. So

676
00:34:56,080 --> 00:34:58,880
Speaker 7: when I saw that, it was clear Judge Hitler was

677
00:34:58,880 --> 00:34:59,560
Speaker 7: not buying it.

678
00:35:00,080 --> 00:35:03,280
Speaker 4: One more question is how as a former prosecutor, how

679
00:35:03,520 --> 00:35:07,160
Speaker 4: much did you put into what the families wanted when

680
00:35:07,200 --> 00:35:10,480
Speaker 4: you were deciding charges and things like that and then

681
00:35:10,640 --> 00:35:11,640
Speaker 4: accepting a plea.

682
00:35:11,719 --> 00:35:15,960
Speaker 7: Personally, I was always keeping families informed and discuss the

683
00:35:15,960 --> 00:35:18,480
Speaker 7: reality of a plea very early on, even if it

684
00:35:18,560 --> 00:35:21,879
Speaker 7: was on the table. So, but however, they're on the bus,

685
00:35:21,920 --> 00:35:25,160
Speaker 7: they're not driving the bus. Input is important, should always

686
00:35:25,160 --> 00:35:28,040
Speaker 7: be considered, but ultimately the DA has to make that call.

687
00:35:28,520 --> 00:35:29,479
Speaker 2: Well, yep, I.

688
00:35:29,400 --> 00:35:32,759
Speaker 5: Love that analogy about the bus. That's actually really a

689
00:35:32,800 --> 00:35:34,240
Speaker 5: clear one to keep in our minds.

690
00:35:34,520 --> 00:35:36,879
Speaker 4: So there was a letter sent to the family by

691
00:35:36,920 --> 00:35:40,200
Speaker 4: the prosecutors, and in that letter it said that sentencing

692
00:35:40,360 --> 00:35:43,160
Speaker 4: is expected to take place in late July as long

693
00:35:43,160 --> 00:35:46,360
Speaker 4: as Coburger enters the guilty plea as expected. At the

694
00:35:46,480 --> 00:35:49,799
Speaker 4: change of plea. Hearing that schedule for Wednesday, walk us through,

695
00:35:50,400 --> 00:35:53,880
Speaker 4: kind of quickly, walk us through Wednesday. What is Wednesday

696
00:35:53,920 --> 00:35:54,480
Speaker 4: going to look like?

697
00:35:55,000 --> 00:35:58,560
Speaker 7: Wednesday may be quick and painless. He may just come

698
00:35:58,600 --> 00:36:01,320
Speaker 7: in and enter a plea of to the four counts

699
00:36:01,320 --> 00:36:04,479
Speaker 7: of murder and burglary and have that call of que

700
00:36:04,480 --> 00:36:07,239
Speaker 7: with the judge, and then a sentencing date in late

701
00:36:07,320 --> 00:36:10,640
Speaker 7: July is then scheduled. That may be now, it may

702
00:36:10,640 --> 00:36:15,719
Speaker 7: be quick, quicker than people expect, but it's very very

703
00:36:15,760 --> 00:36:19,040
Speaker 7: powerful and important that that process happen obviously, and then

704
00:36:19,080 --> 00:36:23,279
Speaker 7: the emotional opportunity for victims to confront Colberger happens at

705
00:36:23,320 --> 00:36:23,960
Speaker 7: the end of July.

706
00:36:24,440 --> 00:36:27,760
Speaker 4: Now, does the judge accept the plea at that point,

707
00:36:27,800 --> 00:36:30,839
Speaker 4: does he have the opportunity to reject it, or does

708
00:36:30,880 --> 00:36:33,839
Speaker 4: he take it under consideration and issue an order later.

709
00:36:34,719 --> 00:36:37,640
Speaker 7: In all likelihood, the judge would accept the plea right

710
00:36:37,680 --> 00:36:40,440
Speaker 7: then and there. Now he's aware of what it is,

711
00:36:40,600 --> 00:36:43,279
Speaker 7: He's prepared to accept it. I'm sure the prosecution and

712
00:36:43,320 --> 00:36:44,840
Speaker 7: defense have met with him already.

713
00:36:45,800 --> 00:36:49,120
Speaker 4: Is there any chance of him denying its?

714
00:36:49,560 --> 00:36:52,040
Speaker 7: Look, it's possible, but I would say it is not

715
00:36:52,640 --> 00:36:54,440
Speaker 7: extremely unlikely, okay.

716
00:36:54,800 --> 00:36:56,239
Speaker 2: And the spirit of it is that he gets to

717
00:36:56,280 --> 00:36:59,160
Speaker 2: take away the death sentence, right, so in an effort

718
00:36:59,160 --> 00:37:01,960
Speaker 2: to spare his own life, he will he will have

719
00:37:02,000 --> 00:37:02,920
Speaker 2: to confess.

720
00:37:03,040 --> 00:37:05,560
Speaker 7: Yes, and the terms of the flea will be set

721
00:37:05,640 --> 00:37:07,040
Speaker 7: forth for the judge too.

722
00:37:07,080 --> 00:37:09,520
Speaker 4: Would that be made to the public, like the terms

723
00:37:09,520 --> 00:37:11,520
Speaker 4: of the plea with the public get knowledge of what.

724
00:37:11,480 --> 00:37:12,160
Speaker 2: The terms are?

725
00:37:12,440 --> 00:37:12,640
Speaker 3: Oh?

726
00:37:13,120 --> 00:37:15,120
Speaker 7: Yes, and the public will be able to watch that

727
00:37:15,200 --> 00:37:16,200
Speaker 7: proceeding as well.

728
00:37:16,320 --> 00:37:19,640
Speaker 4: Excellent, excellent, Wow, Oh interesting?

729
00:37:20,160 --> 00:37:23,840
Speaker 5: And Jared? With the sentencing, is that up to Is

730
00:37:23,840 --> 00:37:26,400
Speaker 5: that up to the judge? Is that already set in stone?

731
00:37:27,120 --> 00:37:28,800
Speaker 5: What happens with the sentencing.

732
00:37:28,800 --> 00:37:32,799
Speaker 7: It's one up to the judge with a recommendation by

733
00:37:32,800 --> 00:37:38,200
Speaker 7: the prosecutors. Is advisory compliant with the law, But ultimately

734
00:37:38,200 --> 00:37:42,080
Speaker 7: it's the judge's discretion. But the sentence that's in the

735
00:37:42,160 --> 00:37:45,160
Speaker 7: letter to the victims' families from Bill Thompson says it's

736
00:37:45,200 --> 00:37:48,960
Speaker 7: four consecutive life sentences without the possibility of parole plus

737
00:37:48,960 --> 00:37:51,080
Speaker 7: the ten years for burglary for good measure.

738
00:37:51,120 --> 00:37:54,080
Speaker 4: I guess I wonder, I wonder if the judge what

739
00:37:54,160 --> 00:37:57,319
Speaker 4: would be swayed. My understanding is that some of the

740
00:37:57,360 --> 00:38:01,279
Speaker 4: family is asking the public to call Judge Hipler and

741
00:38:01,360 --> 00:38:02,880
Speaker 4: ask him to reject the plea.

742
00:38:03,000 --> 00:38:04,080
Speaker 2: Is that a possibility.

743
00:38:04,360 --> 00:38:07,360
Speaker 7: Yeah, it's just not likely. I don't have the judge

744
00:38:07,400 --> 00:38:12,080
Speaker 7: telegraphed this as well. He said, as you will, Stephanie.

745
00:38:12,120 --> 00:38:15,360
Speaker 7: I think mentioned that the judge directed the prosecution of

746
00:38:15,360 --> 00:38:17,120
Speaker 7: the defense. If you're going to work this out, it's

747
00:38:17,160 --> 00:38:18,440
Speaker 7: got to be in the end of r.

748
00:38:18,920 --> 00:38:22,120
Speaker 4: The last best offer had to be done. Now, yeah, yeah,

749
00:38:22,200 --> 00:38:23,080
Speaker 4: the last best offer.

750
00:38:23,600 --> 00:38:27,359
Speaker 7: So he signaled there he's willing to accept something and

751
00:38:27,400 --> 00:38:29,920
Speaker 7: consider it. And this is Look, this is the only

752
00:38:30,040 --> 00:38:32,480
Speaker 7: plea that was really an option here on both sides

753
00:38:32,719 --> 00:38:35,320
Speaker 7: saved their client's life for the defense and the prosecution

754
00:38:35,480 --> 00:38:38,160
Speaker 7: locks Brian Coberger up and throws away the key.

755
00:38:39,200 --> 00:38:42,400
Speaker 5: Jareded, we want to thank you so much for everything

756
00:38:42,440 --> 00:38:43,399
Speaker 5: you've clarified.

757
00:38:43,960 --> 00:38:45,360
Speaker 7: Oh, thank you. It's my pleasure.

758
00:38:45,640 --> 00:38:47,760
Speaker 2: Consider yourself booked for Wednesday.

759
00:38:47,960 --> 00:38:51,640
Speaker 7: You got it covered. This has been just a whirlwind

760
00:38:51,719 --> 00:38:55,440
Speaker 7: for everyone. It's a. It's an incredibly fascinating and tragedy.

761
00:38:55,520 --> 00:38:58,279
Speaker 7: Takes ability to have the opportunity to talk with all

762
00:38:58,320 --> 00:38:59,440
Speaker 7: of you, takes a village.

763
00:38:59,480 --> 00:39:03,000
Speaker 5: Jared Fair and veteran trial attorney, co host of the

764
00:39:03,000 --> 00:39:06,600
Speaker 5: YouTube series Primetime Crime and host of the podcast True

765
00:39:06,600 --> 00:39:09,000
Speaker 5: Crime Boss. Coming up at the top of the hour

766
00:39:09,040 --> 00:39:11,239
Speaker 5: at eleven. We've got a lot more to cover. The

767
00:39:11,320 --> 00:39:14,320
Speaker 5: latest with p Diddy this time his kids are actually

768
00:39:14,400 --> 00:39:17,680
Speaker 5: in trouble as well. Keep it here True Crime tonight.

769
00:39:17,719 --> 00:39:19,439
Speaker 5: We're talking true crime all the time.

770
00:39:30,600 --> 00:39:33,520
Speaker 2: It has been a wild day. We're going to be

771
00:39:33,560 --> 00:39:36,600
Speaker 2: talking about some issues with the juror in the Ditty case,

772
00:39:37,120 --> 00:39:40,800
Speaker 2: as jury deliberations are already off to a wacky start.

773
00:39:40,920 --> 00:39:43,840
Speaker 2: So more on that to come. Shout out to Oscar

774
00:39:43,960 --> 00:39:46,040
Speaker 2: who works with us every day, who is back and

775
00:39:46,080 --> 00:39:49,200
Speaker 2: we're so happy about that. But you know, first, first,

776
00:39:49,520 --> 00:39:52,840
Speaker 2: we're talking about the Brian Coburger developments. If you haven't

777
00:39:52,840 --> 00:39:56,759
Speaker 2: been following this case closely, Brian Coburger is accused and

778
00:39:56,840 --> 00:40:01,400
Speaker 2: has now pled guilty to murdering four Idaho college students

779
00:40:01,480 --> 00:40:05,000
Speaker 2: on November thirteenth, twenty twenty two. All four students were

780
00:40:05,520 --> 00:40:09,359
Speaker 2: were murdered with a knife like a Rambo knife, a

781
00:40:09,440 --> 00:40:13,359
Speaker 2: major overkill. He has claimed his innocence, was looking at

782
00:40:13,360 --> 00:40:16,719
Speaker 2: a death sentence trial set to begin in August. He

783
00:40:16,880 --> 00:40:20,320
Speaker 2: was going to face a firing squad potentially if found guilty,

784
00:40:20,680 --> 00:40:25,160
Speaker 2: and instead he has decided to change his ways and

785
00:40:25,480 --> 00:40:29,040
Speaker 2: come clean after two and a half years of putting

786
00:40:29,239 --> 00:40:35,439
Speaker 2: families in his family, even through so much grief, that

787
00:40:35,640 --> 00:40:38,520
Speaker 2: he will be in court on Wednesday and he will

788
00:40:38,640 --> 00:40:43,080
Speaker 2: officially make make a statement I suppose or enter a

789
00:40:43,120 --> 00:40:47,880
Speaker 2: guilty plea and change his original innocent. Those days are over.

790
00:40:48,040 --> 00:40:50,759
Speaker 2: So you know, Courtney Body, this has been one of

791
00:40:50,760 --> 00:40:53,320
Speaker 2: those cases that we're all so close to, maybe a

792
00:40:53,400 --> 00:40:56,280
Speaker 2: little too close to at this point. Admit it's important

793
00:40:56,280 --> 00:40:58,200
Speaker 2: to talk talking about and we want to hear from

794
00:40:58,239 --> 00:41:00,880
Speaker 2: you too, So please, I'm told our is ringing off

795
00:41:00,920 --> 00:41:03,920
Speaker 2: the hook tonight. Ooh eight eight eight three to one crime.

796
00:41:04,000 --> 00:41:06,520
Speaker 2: Please jump in join the conversation. We want to hear

797
00:41:06,560 --> 00:41:08,640
Speaker 2: from you, or you could also leave us a talk back.

798
00:41:08,960 --> 00:41:12,280
Speaker 2: Just download the iHeart app, press the right hand top button,

799
00:41:12,680 --> 00:41:15,080
Speaker 2: leave a message and boom, you're in the show. Because

800
00:41:15,120 --> 00:41:16,440
Speaker 2: we really want you to weigh in.

801
00:41:16,800 --> 00:41:19,880
Speaker 4: Yeah, definitely, and you know everyone's very like emotional about this,

802
00:41:20,080 --> 00:41:22,440
Speaker 4: and like, I totally get it. I don't want anybody

803
00:41:22,480 --> 00:41:24,560
Speaker 4: think that I'm like, eh, whatever about it. I just

804
00:41:24,640 --> 00:41:27,480
Speaker 4: kind of expected this to happen. And you know, I

805
00:41:27,520 --> 00:41:31,440
Speaker 4: think as long as this plea deal includes like the

806
00:41:31,680 --> 00:41:35,160
Speaker 4: idea of allocution or like a confession of sorts with

807
00:41:35,280 --> 00:41:38,560
Speaker 4: detailed information maybe to give to the family if so

808
00:41:38,719 --> 00:41:41,080
Speaker 4: they want it, if they want a motive, if they

809
00:41:41,120 --> 00:41:43,200
Speaker 4: want to know the reason, why why did you do

810
00:41:43,320 --> 00:41:45,200
Speaker 4: this to my kid? You know, like, as long as

811
00:41:45,239 --> 00:41:47,359
Speaker 4: it includes something like that, I'm not going to be upset.

812
00:41:47,640 --> 00:41:52,440
Speaker 5: Why that day, I doubt I'll be so curious. My

813
00:41:52,719 --> 00:41:56,560
Speaker 5: guess is that the salient details of that that will

814
00:41:56,600 --> 00:41:59,440
Speaker 5: be that and the motive. I don't I don't know,

815
00:41:59,600 --> 00:42:01,799
Speaker 5: I say, I'm just I'm just guessing in the wind.

816
00:42:01,800 --> 00:42:04,759
Speaker 5: I guess everyone is until he is in court. But

817
00:42:05,000 --> 00:42:08,600
Speaker 5: we have a talkback to get to first of the couple.

818
00:42:09,000 --> 00:42:12,800
Speaker 8: Hatre Crumb tonight, Well, I'm shocked about that, Brian Kolberger Pleadale,

819
00:42:12,800 --> 00:42:15,080
Speaker 8: And honestly, if I was a family member, I'd be

820
00:42:15,160 --> 00:42:17,480
Speaker 8: happy to have answers and an idea about the motive.

821
00:42:17,640 --> 00:42:19,799
Speaker 2: Why do you think the Gonsale's family is so mad.

822
00:42:20,080 --> 00:42:21,480
Speaker 5: Why don't you want to have answers?

823
00:42:22,120 --> 00:42:23,040
Speaker 2: Mm?

824
00:42:23,040 --> 00:42:27,360
Speaker 4: Well, you know, and I yeah, I think they you know,

825
00:42:27,400 --> 00:42:29,440
Speaker 4: you would want to have answers. But you know, I

826
00:42:29,480 --> 00:42:33,560
Speaker 4: think the idea of justice for them specifically is sitting

827
00:42:33,640 --> 00:42:36,960
Speaker 4: in the trial, you know, being the voice for Kaylee, right,

828
00:42:37,400 --> 00:42:41,359
Speaker 4: and you know, seeing this through they They've said, you know,

829
00:42:41,640 --> 00:42:43,960
Speaker 4: Steve Gonsalve is an early interviews, said the reason they

830
00:42:44,040 --> 00:42:46,600
Speaker 4: chose Idaho to live in was because of the death penalty.

831
00:42:46,600 --> 00:42:48,680
Speaker 2: They're very strong believers in the death penalty.

832
00:42:48,880 --> 00:42:52,320
Speaker 4: Uh. And you know, if if that's their belief of justice.

833
00:42:52,440 --> 00:42:54,640
Speaker 4: So the fact, you know, if you're Steve Gonsalves and

834
00:42:54,760 --> 00:42:57,040
Speaker 4: you know his wife and the whole family, the sisters,

835
00:42:57,080 --> 00:43:00,000
Speaker 4: the the idea that this has been ripped from you

836
00:43:00,080 --> 00:43:03,120
Speaker 4: has got to be just devastating, right, the idea of

837
00:43:03,320 --> 00:43:05,560
Speaker 4: justice being ripped out of your hands. And I feel

838
00:43:05,600 --> 00:43:07,840
Speaker 4: like that's where they're at. I don't understand it. But

839
00:43:07,920 --> 00:43:10,879
Speaker 4: I'm not them, you know, I'm not I'm not them.

840
00:43:10,920 --> 00:43:13,360
Speaker 4: I can't put myself in their position. And we haven't

841
00:43:13,360 --> 00:43:16,240
Speaker 4: heard from anybody else. We've heard from you know, Xanna's aunt,

842
00:43:16,560 --> 00:43:20,080
Speaker 4: and apparently they're very upset. I don't know who specifically is,

843
00:43:20,160 --> 00:43:22,920
Speaker 4: but we haven't heard from anybody else. There's four families

844
00:43:22,960 --> 00:43:25,279
Speaker 4: in this that that have to, you know, weigh in,

845
00:43:25,600 --> 00:43:28,319
Speaker 4: and we've only heard really from one. We've heard from

846
00:43:28,320 --> 00:43:30,840
Speaker 4: the Consolvest family. They've been very vocal, they're very upset

847
00:43:30,840 --> 00:43:34,520
Speaker 4: about this. They've written several statements. Zanna's aunt has said

848
00:43:34,520 --> 00:43:36,239
Speaker 4: that the family is upset. But we haven't heard from

849
00:43:36,280 --> 00:43:38,760
Speaker 4: them directly, and we don't know how anybody else feels.

850
00:43:38,920 --> 00:43:42,640
Speaker 5: And that's their right, that's right, absolutely have you know,

851
00:43:42,680 --> 00:43:45,200
Speaker 5: whatever their process is. And as you said, for the

852
00:43:45,200 --> 00:43:49,440
Speaker 5: Gonsalves family, that was to go and go to the trials,

853
00:43:49,960 --> 00:43:53,479
Speaker 5: and then for others it may not be and an

854
00:43:53,640 --> 00:43:57,399
Speaker 5: ending and ending to at least the litigation of this.

855
00:43:57,960 --> 00:44:00,600
Speaker 2: And you know, but Spence also for the you know,

856
00:44:00,640 --> 00:44:03,080
Speaker 2: the state, the expense is tremendous.

857
00:44:03,560 --> 00:44:05,759
Speaker 4: It would have been so much more had to continued though,

858
00:44:06,000 --> 00:44:10,120
Speaker 4: had this continued, it would have been death penalty cases

859
00:44:10,360 --> 00:44:13,920
Speaker 4: are appeal after appeal after those are so expensive, not

860
00:44:14,000 --> 00:44:16,480
Speaker 4: only for the state but the defense. He's publicly defended,

861
00:44:16,719 --> 00:44:20,440
Speaker 4: you guys, like, the cost on the state is tremendous.

862
00:44:20,760 --> 00:44:23,560
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's true, it's true. And for good reason. Listen,

863
00:44:23,600 --> 00:44:27,040
Speaker 2: we all cover cases where sometimes, you know, listen, unfortunately,

864
00:44:27,200 --> 00:44:29,960
Speaker 2: sometimes the wrong person is put to death, right, so

865
00:44:30,000 --> 00:44:32,279
Speaker 2: it's important that we have this checks and balances and

866
00:44:32,320 --> 00:44:34,520
Speaker 2: that there are appeals. Again, this is not a soapbox

867
00:44:34,520 --> 00:44:37,279
Speaker 2: about the death sentence. However, our hearts really do go

868
00:44:37,360 --> 00:44:41,760
Speaker 2: out to Madison Mogan's family, Kaylee Gonzalveez's family, Xana Kernodle's family,

869
00:44:41,880 --> 00:44:44,960
Speaker 2: and Ethan Chapin's family because they've been on the front line.

870
00:44:45,040 --> 00:44:47,800
Speaker 2: And you know, unless you're in that situation and facing

871
00:44:47,840 --> 00:44:52,319
Speaker 2: such unimaginable grief, it's hard to it's hard to speculate.

872
00:44:52,200 --> 00:44:54,640
Speaker 4: Right right, Well, I understand we have another talk back.

873
00:44:55,000 --> 00:44:57,560
Speaker 7: Hi, ladies, I love this podcast.

874
00:44:57,840 --> 00:45:02,480
Speaker 9: So, Brian Colberger, this plead seems out of nowhere. Do

875
00:45:02,560 --> 00:45:06,600
Speaker 9: you think that the parents of the victims had any

876
00:45:06,719 --> 00:45:09,560
Speaker 9: say at all in this plea deal? And do you

877
00:45:09,600 --> 00:45:12,200
Speaker 9: think that they're happy that he'll be behind bars forever?

878
00:45:12,560 --> 00:45:15,400
Speaker 4: Well, we know on May fifteenth, the judge told the

879
00:45:15,400 --> 00:45:19,120
Speaker 4: defense that the lass best the last best offer, was

880
00:45:19,200 --> 00:45:22,520
Speaker 4: expected at the end of June early July. So I

881
00:45:22,600 --> 00:45:24,960
Speaker 4: think that you know, there was all a sense that

882
00:45:25,040 --> 00:45:27,200
Speaker 4: something was coming, whether it was going to be accepted

883
00:45:27,280 --> 00:45:29,360
Speaker 4: or rejected or even offered at all. I think was

884
00:45:29,440 --> 00:45:31,560
Speaker 4: up in the air. And if the family was aware

885
00:45:31,600 --> 00:45:34,920
Speaker 4: of it, Yes, they were. They were aware that it

886
00:45:34,960 --> 00:45:37,399
Speaker 4: was a possibility because they met last week. Right they

887
00:45:37,440 --> 00:45:40,200
Speaker 4: met last week. A letter was sent to them, a letter,

888
00:45:40,560 --> 00:45:43,319
Speaker 4: like you couldn't even call them. That's so ridiculous to me.

889
00:45:43,680 --> 00:45:47,000
Speaker 2: Maybe maybe they did. Maybe they did, but they're they're

890
00:45:47,040 --> 00:45:48,239
Speaker 2: not saying yeah.

891
00:45:48,239 --> 00:45:52,480
Speaker 5: In a previous segment, Jared Farantino, the legal expert we

892
00:45:52,560 --> 00:45:55,439
Speaker 5: had on he has been in a similar position, and

893
00:45:55,480 --> 00:45:57,799
Speaker 5: he said he couldn't believe it was actually in a

894
00:45:57,880 --> 00:45:59,719
Speaker 5: letter and not a call. So, like I said, maybe

895
00:45:59,719 --> 00:46:02,960
Speaker 5: there was a call. But the letter again does indicate

896
00:46:03,440 --> 00:46:07,480
Speaker 5: that families were involved, and we now have the fallout

897
00:46:07,560 --> 00:46:10,239
Speaker 5: that at least one of the four families, the consolvas Is,

898
00:46:11,520 --> 00:46:12,200
Speaker 5: are not happy.

899
00:46:12,320 --> 00:46:14,759
Speaker 4: All right, this is your Crime Tonight on iHeartRadio, I'm

900
00:46:14,760 --> 00:46:17,640
Speaker 4: body movin and I'm here with Courtney Armstrong and Stephanie Leidecker.

901
00:46:17,760 --> 00:46:20,480
Speaker 4: We're all very emotionally charged right now. We're talking about

902
00:46:20,520 --> 00:46:23,920
Speaker 4: the potential plea agreement that's been made with Brian Coberger

903
00:46:24,000 --> 00:46:26,800
Speaker 4: to plead guilty in the murders of the four college

904
00:46:26,840 --> 00:46:29,799
Speaker 4: students in Moscow, Idaho. Give us a call at one

905
00:46:30,200 --> 00:46:33,520
Speaker 4: eight eight thirty one crime or use the talkbacks and

906
00:46:33,600 --> 00:46:34,839
Speaker 4: we'll try to get it on the air as soon

907
00:46:34,880 --> 00:46:37,480
Speaker 4: as possible. We have another one. We have another talkback

908
00:46:37,520 --> 00:46:37,880
Speaker 4: you guys.

909
00:46:38,040 --> 00:46:40,239
Speaker 8: Hey, y'all, this is any from Oakland. I hope you

910
00:46:40,239 --> 00:46:41,760
Speaker 8: guys are all doing well tonight.

911
00:46:41,840 --> 00:46:42,080
Speaker 5: Now.

912
00:46:42,160 --> 00:46:45,799
Speaker 8: The Gonsalves' family just released a family statement, and the

913
00:46:45,840 --> 00:46:49,200
Speaker 8: family statement is has some pretty strong words in it

914
00:46:49,280 --> 00:46:52,480
Speaker 8: about Letal County and the Leetal Counties prosecuting Office. So

915
00:46:52,520 --> 00:46:54,480
Speaker 8: I just want to know your guys' thoughts on the

916
00:46:54,600 --> 00:46:56,520
Speaker 8: very strong worded family statement.

917
00:46:56,920 --> 00:46:59,319
Speaker 2: That's a really good question, and we have it. We

918
00:46:59,400 --> 00:47:00,239
Speaker 2: have it very here.

919
00:47:00,360 --> 00:47:04,920
Speaker 4: I don't know if should read it. Yeah, absolutely, okay,

920
00:47:05,000 --> 00:47:09,160
Speaker 4: thank you INNDY the Cancalvas family statement. The death penalty

921
00:47:09,200 --> 00:47:12,680
Speaker 4: is merely an illusion in the criminal justice system. When available,

922
00:47:12,800 --> 00:47:15,239
Speaker 4: it serves as a bargaining tool for the state, and

923
00:47:15,520 --> 00:47:19,560
Speaker 4: when rarely applied, it's never enforced to the highly ineffective

924
00:47:19,560 --> 00:47:23,040
Speaker 4: appellate process. Again, we've been talking about that, right that's

925
00:47:23,120 --> 00:47:26,480
Speaker 4: me now. The notion that someone complete guilty to a

926
00:47:26,520 --> 00:47:30,480
Speaker 4: crime and still face years of appellet delays reveals a

927
00:47:30,520 --> 00:47:34,440
Speaker 4: systematic failure the Leytal County Prosecutor's office. Treatment of our

928
00:47:34,480 --> 00:47:37,760
Speaker 4: family during this process is something I wouldn't wish on anyone.

929
00:47:38,000 --> 00:47:41,239
Speaker 4: We questioned decisions early on in the investigation. Why was

930
00:47:41,280 --> 00:47:43,880
Speaker 4: the mayor commenting on the case. Why was the coroner

931
00:47:43,920 --> 00:47:46,319
Speaker 4: speaking to families? Why was an officer with less than

932
00:47:46,400 --> 00:47:49,640
Speaker 4: two years experience leading this investigation? Why was the University

933
00:47:49,640 --> 00:47:53,040
Speaker 4: of Idaho involved when they declared it an isolated off

934
00:47:53,080 --> 00:47:55,799
Speaker 4: campus incident. Why was the university permitted to write a

935
00:47:55,800 --> 00:47:58,040
Speaker 4: book about the incident while others were silenced under an

936
00:47:58,080 --> 00:48:01,880
Speaker 4: overly broad order. As a result, we were branded adversaries.

937
00:48:02,320 --> 00:48:03,319
Speaker 2: So it was no.

938
00:48:03,400 --> 00:48:07,399
Speaker 4: Shock how the Laytal County Prosecutor's office mishandled this plea deal.

939
00:48:07,560 --> 00:48:10,200
Speaker 4: They vaguely mentioned a possible plea deal on Friday without

940
00:48:10,239 --> 00:48:12,720
Speaker 4: seeking our input, and presented the plea deal on Sunday.

941
00:48:12,840 --> 00:48:16,040
Speaker 4: Laytalk County should be ashamed of its prosecutor's office. Four

942
00:48:16,080 --> 00:48:19,200
Speaker 4: wonderful young people lost their lives, yet the victims' families

943
00:48:19,280 --> 00:48:21,759
Speaker 4: were treated as opponents from the outset. We weren't even

944
00:48:21,880 --> 00:48:24,360
Speaker 4: called about the plea re received an email with the

945
00:48:24,440 --> 00:48:28,880
Speaker 4: letter attached. That's how Leaytalk County Prosecutor's office treats murder victims' families,

946
00:48:28,920 --> 00:48:32,000
Speaker 4: adding insult to injury. They're rushing the plea, giving families

947
00:48:32,080 --> 00:48:34,200
Speaker 4: just one day to coordinate and appear in the courthouse

948
00:48:34,440 --> 00:48:36,399
Speaker 4: for a plea on July second. Who do they think

949
00:48:36,440 --> 00:48:38,920
Speaker 4: they are after more than two years? This is how

950
00:48:39,040 --> 00:48:41,239
Speaker 4: it concludes, with a secretive deal and hurried effort to

951
00:48:41,239 --> 00:48:43,600
Speaker 4: close the case without any input from the victims' families

952
00:48:43,600 --> 00:48:46,439
Speaker 4: on the plea details. Our family is frustrated right now,

953
00:48:46,520 --> 00:48:48,480
Speaker 4: and that will subside and we will come together as

954
00:48:48,480 --> 00:48:51,080
Speaker 4: always and deal with the reality that we face moving forward.

955
00:48:51,280 --> 00:48:53,720
Speaker 4: Once again, we thank everyone for their thoughts and prayers.

956
00:48:53,760 --> 00:48:57,200
Speaker 4: I mean, I'm done. That was the whole statements. He's

957
00:48:57,280 --> 00:49:00,759
Speaker 4: on point though, right, It's so true. Are really with

958
00:49:00,920 --> 00:49:04,239
Speaker 4: a Gonzalvez family. They are Kaylee's parents, and I can

959
00:49:04,280 --> 00:49:08,839
Speaker 4: say firsthand that they're wonderful people, and you know Kaylee's brother,

960
00:49:08,920 --> 00:49:11,600
Speaker 4: all of them have you know, been living in this

961
00:49:11,880 --> 00:49:13,160
Speaker 4: never ending nightmare.

962
00:49:13,400 --> 00:49:15,919
Speaker 2: And yeah, they're being caught off guard. We were caught

963
00:49:15,960 --> 00:49:18,000
Speaker 2: off guard. I felt sucker punched. And it's not a

964
00:49:18,000 --> 00:49:21,120
Speaker 2: family member. Imagine if you're in that situation, you know,

965
00:49:21,320 --> 00:49:24,040
Speaker 2: God willing, nobody has to face that. But again, they

966
00:49:24,120 --> 00:49:27,720
Speaker 2: have been through two and a half years of this mess.

967
00:49:27,840 --> 00:49:30,239
Speaker 2: When this story broke, body you were on it. We

968
00:49:30,239 --> 00:49:32,920
Speaker 2: were all losing our minds at Harvey Levin, we were

969
00:49:32,960 --> 00:49:35,760
Speaker 2: all like, you know, connecting, is this fact? Is this fact?

970
00:49:35,760 --> 00:49:38,000
Speaker 2: Has this been confirmed? Because it did seem a little

971
00:49:38,000 --> 00:49:41,359
Speaker 2: out of nowhere, like a bombshell on a Monday. And look,

972
00:49:41,480 --> 00:49:45,759
Speaker 2: we're still kind of feeling emotionally dysregulated. Imagine if it's

973
00:49:45,800 --> 00:49:49,040
Speaker 2: your daughter, right, it's unimaginable, and you.

974
00:49:48,920 --> 00:49:50,520
Speaker 4: Have this idea in your head. You're going to go

975
00:49:50,520 --> 00:49:52,640
Speaker 4: to court every day. You're going to be Kaylee's voice.

976
00:49:52,760 --> 00:49:55,120
Speaker 4: You're going to take time off in your voice, You're

977
00:49:55,120 --> 00:49:57,640
Speaker 4: going to be Zana's voice. You're going to show up

978
00:49:57,680 --> 00:50:00,160
Speaker 4: every day. You're going to remember your daughter. Are you

979
00:50:00,239 --> 00:50:02,600
Speaker 4: going to remember your son in the courtroom? You're going

980
00:50:02,640 --> 00:50:04,400
Speaker 4: to give an victim And none of that's going to

981
00:50:04,440 --> 00:50:04,879
Speaker 4: happen now.

982
00:50:05,160 --> 00:50:05,239
Speaker 8: No.

983
00:50:05,480 --> 00:50:09,080
Speaker 2: And also listen, the trial got moved. Remember all of

984
00:50:09,080 --> 00:50:11,480
Speaker 2: the days it wasn't going to be in Moscow anymore.

985
00:50:11,520 --> 00:50:15,719
Speaker 2: They had to move it to Boise, big transition, more delays.

986
00:50:15,960 --> 00:50:19,400
Speaker 2: So now we have this maniac in Boise. The families

987
00:50:19,520 --> 00:50:21,520
Speaker 2: have to you know, take time off work, they have

988
00:50:21,560 --> 00:50:24,000
Speaker 2: to fly there or drive there in some cases many

989
00:50:24,080 --> 00:50:27,280
Speaker 2: many many hours. The expense of that. So they're already

990
00:50:27,280 --> 00:50:30,080
Speaker 2: putting their lives on hold for this summer. They're bracing

991
00:50:30,120 --> 00:50:30,480
Speaker 2: for it.

992
00:50:30,560 --> 00:50:30,759
Speaker 3: Right.

993
00:50:30,840 --> 00:50:34,319
Speaker 2: So on the one hand, of course, justice is you know,

994
00:50:34,480 --> 00:50:37,560
Speaker 2: has its own way. Yeah, oh for sure.

995
00:50:37,640 --> 00:50:41,000
Speaker 5: And what you read, body, I mean that really that

996
00:50:41,160 --> 00:50:43,160
Speaker 5: was a lot of well, there's a lot of facts

997
00:50:43,160 --> 00:50:46,480
Speaker 5: and feelings in there, and you know, I guess again,

998
00:50:46,600 --> 00:50:48,960
Speaker 5: I don't know where else a family has to go

999
00:50:49,239 --> 00:50:50,120
Speaker 5: as an outlet.

1000
00:50:50,880 --> 00:50:52,839
Speaker 4: I don't know. I know that I know that they'll

1001
00:50:52,840 --> 00:50:55,200
Speaker 4: probably be doing interviews. And you know, one thing that

1002
00:50:55,200 --> 00:50:57,840
Speaker 4: stood out to me and that impact that statement, was

1003
00:50:57,880 --> 00:50:59,839
Speaker 4: that they only have a day to get down there.

1004
00:51:00,200 --> 00:51:02,680
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's not easy. You don't just drop everything like

1005
00:51:02,680 --> 00:51:05,279
Speaker 2: they it's you know, holiday week, it's fourth of July.

1006
00:51:05,400 --> 00:51:10,760
Speaker 2: You've got kids, kids and grandkids even exactly dogs exactly.

1007
00:51:10,800 --> 00:51:12,560
Speaker 4: No, I mean you have to make arrangements. This is

1008
00:51:12,600 --> 00:51:14,960
Speaker 4: you know, and I'm sure they want to be there,

1009
00:51:15,280 --> 00:51:17,319
Speaker 4: especially if there's an elocution. I mean, if there's an

1010
00:51:17,360 --> 00:51:20,279
Speaker 4: elocution on Wednesday, I'll be surprised, but Jared said, it's

1011
00:51:20,280 --> 00:51:22,480
Speaker 4: possible you're gonna want to be in a courtroom to

1012
00:51:22,520 --> 00:51:25,160
Speaker 4: look at him when he's giving his allocution.

1013
00:51:25,760 --> 00:51:26,160
Speaker 7: Wow.

1014
00:51:26,360 --> 00:51:28,719
Speaker 5: Absolutely, And one day to prepare for that is.

1015
00:51:29,239 --> 00:51:32,319
Speaker 4: It's upsetting and I you know, I don't know. I

1016
00:51:32,440 --> 00:51:36,080
Speaker 4: just I'm upset for the family. I really am.

1017
00:51:36,560 --> 00:51:41,520
Speaker 2: We've been covering this Brian Coburger bombshell. He's a man

1018
00:51:41,600 --> 00:51:45,800
Speaker 2: accused of ordering four college co eds November thirteenth, twenty

1019
00:51:45,880 --> 00:51:51,560
Speaker 2: twenty two. Accused of murdering Madison Mogan, Kaylee Gonzalvez, Anakernodle,

1020
00:51:51,719 --> 00:51:55,400
Speaker 2: and Ethan Shapin. He's claimed his innocence. His death sentence

1021
00:51:55,600 --> 00:51:58,600
Speaker 2: trial was set to begin in August after many, many,

1022
00:51:58,640 --> 00:52:02,480
Speaker 2: many many delays, include just last week an attempt delay

1023
00:52:02,760 --> 00:52:06,520
Speaker 2: and that was denied, and today, out of nowhere, the

1024
00:52:06,560 --> 00:52:10,000
Speaker 2: bomb drops that he is pleading guilty to all four charges.

1025
00:52:10,400 --> 00:52:12,520
Speaker 2: So he'll be back in the courtroom on Wednesday. We

1026
00:52:12,600 --> 00:52:16,000
Speaker 2: will be following this extremely closely. Before we go any further,

1027
00:52:16,040 --> 00:52:17,560
Speaker 2: we want to go to our talk back. The phones

1028
00:52:17,600 --> 00:52:18,520
Speaker 2: have been off the hook.

1029
00:52:19,120 --> 00:52:22,160
Speaker 10: Hey's Saren from Lowell, New York. I'm a huge fan

1030
00:52:22,239 --> 00:52:25,080
Speaker 10: and I tune into you guys every day. But I

1031
00:52:25,120 --> 00:52:28,320
Speaker 10: can't believe that Brian Colberger is going to plead guilty.

1032
00:52:28,920 --> 00:52:30,960
Speaker 10: I know him, probably in the minority, but I totally

1033
00:52:30,960 --> 00:52:33,160
Speaker 10: thought the defense was going to come through with an

1034
00:52:33,200 --> 00:52:36,440
Speaker 10: alternate suspect and that someone else or even multiple people

1035
00:52:36,440 --> 00:52:37,040
Speaker 10: were behind this.

1036
00:52:37,680 --> 00:52:39,879
Speaker 2: Your thoughts, well.

1037
00:52:39,840 --> 00:52:42,200
Speaker 5: First of all, thank you for the talkback erin, And

1038
00:52:42,600 --> 00:52:46,120
Speaker 5: yes you know you thought that because that is what

1039
00:52:46,200 --> 00:52:50,000
Speaker 5: the defense had put up, so you know, even though

1040
00:52:50,040 --> 00:52:53,440
Speaker 5: it was under seal, everyone was kind of waiting, and

1041
00:52:53,719 --> 00:52:57,640
Speaker 5: earlier in the show, Jarrett Farentino broke it down a

1042
00:52:57,640 --> 00:53:00,880
Speaker 5: little bit of who the alleged p people who were

1043
00:53:00,920 --> 00:53:04,399
Speaker 5: going to be listed as alternate suspects, you know who

1044
00:53:04,400 --> 00:53:09,640
Speaker 5: they were tangentially their connection to the victims. But yeah,

1045
00:53:09,160 --> 00:53:11,920
Speaker 5: you probably are the minority, but.

1046
00:53:11,960 --> 00:53:15,719
Speaker 2: It makes a lot of sense. Yeah, I thought the

1047
00:53:15,719 --> 00:53:17,360
Speaker 2: same thing. Courtney and I used the battle about this

1048
00:53:17,400 --> 00:53:20,239
Speaker 2: every day. She's always so sensible, right, so smart. That

1049
00:53:20,280 --> 00:53:22,600
Speaker 2: one was like, this guy's guilty, this guy's guilty. Oh,

1050
00:53:22,680 --> 00:53:25,200
Speaker 2: only to be joined by body this guy's guilty, this

1051
00:53:25,239 --> 00:53:28,919
Speaker 2: guy's guilty. So the two of them are the smart ones.

1052
00:53:29,120 --> 00:53:31,920
Speaker 2: I was hook line and sinker a sucker and felt

1053
00:53:31,960 --> 00:53:35,440
Speaker 2: as though he was a PhD student and frankly wouldn't

1054
00:53:35,480 --> 00:53:38,920
Speaker 2: be so messy about this perfect crime. And I also

1055
00:53:39,000 --> 00:53:41,200
Speaker 2: thought that maybe he was getting tried in the press

1056
00:53:41,280 --> 00:53:45,000
Speaker 2: and being targeted. This was a worldwide case. There were

1057
00:53:45,160 --> 00:53:48,080
Speaker 2: very few people that were being looked at except for

1058
00:53:48,160 --> 00:53:50,480
Speaker 2: by him. He was apparently putting up all kinds of

1059
00:53:50,520 --> 00:53:52,680
Speaker 2: suspects and a lot of people were dragged into this

1060
00:53:52,800 --> 00:53:56,440
Speaker 2: that were not connected to the murders, who were like

1061
00:53:56,680 --> 00:53:59,600
Speaker 2: discussed on social media as the guy, remember the man

1062
00:53:59,600 --> 00:54:01,760
Speaker 2: that was a food truck, which was the last place

1063
00:54:01,760 --> 00:54:04,400
Speaker 2: two of the victims were seen that night. That poor

1064
00:54:04,440 --> 00:54:08,200
Speaker 2: boy in the hooded sweatshirt behind them on the ring

1065
00:54:08,320 --> 00:54:10,680
Speaker 2: cam of the food truck. That guy had to like

1066
00:54:10,760 --> 00:54:14,080
Speaker 2: leave the country because he was getting so much hate

1067
00:54:14,480 --> 00:54:18,279
Speaker 2: from you know, crazy super sleuths who were were really

1068
00:54:18,400 --> 00:54:22,440
Speaker 2: put putting a finger at the wrong person. And honestly,

1069
00:54:22,640 --> 00:54:25,279
Speaker 2: that like Starry, you know, he was out stargazing. That

1070
00:54:25,440 --> 00:54:29,920
Speaker 2: was Brian Coberger's alleged alibi. I don't know, it doesn't

1071
00:54:29,960 --> 00:54:34,920
Speaker 2: sound very great, but it's plausible. Everything was still plausible,

1072
00:54:35,040 --> 00:54:38,040
Speaker 2: and I guess that's why I'm feeling so bummed. It's

1073
00:54:38,040 --> 00:54:38,960
Speaker 2: such a bummer.

1074
00:54:40,640 --> 00:54:44,200
Speaker 5: It's your belief in humanity, is what I think it is, Stephanie,

1075
00:54:44,840 --> 00:54:46,920
Speaker 5: And I think that's what it is to me.

1076
00:54:47,520 --> 00:54:50,319
Speaker 4: For me, it's more like people have a really hard

1077
00:54:50,360 --> 00:54:54,000
Speaker 4: time believing that this dork is. It just took these

1078
00:54:54,239 --> 00:54:59,160
Speaker 4: four magnificent souls. Like if this dork could break into

1079
00:54:59,320 --> 00:55:02,680
Speaker 4: too somebody's house and kill four people, you know, who

1080
00:55:02,719 --> 00:55:06,720
Speaker 4: are young, fit, aware, you know, like, then then anything

1081
00:55:06,760 --> 00:55:10,480
Speaker 4: can happen. Right, It's it's implausible, it's it's hard to

1082
00:55:10,480 --> 00:55:12,600
Speaker 4: wrap your mind around. So of course it has to

1083
00:55:12,640 --> 00:55:15,600
Speaker 4: be somebody else. It has to be the boogeyman. Well,

1084
00:55:16,160 --> 00:55:18,520
Speaker 4: sorry to tell you, but Brian Kolberger is the boogeyman.

1085
00:55:19,080 --> 00:55:22,759
Speaker 2: I hate it. It's makes so maddening. And you know

1086
00:55:22,840 --> 00:55:24,759
Speaker 2: what one thing we should all be grateful for is

1087
00:55:24,840 --> 00:55:27,480
Speaker 2: that there were two surviving victims. One of them actually

1088
00:55:27,520 --> 00:55:31,320
Speaker 2: identified him as somebody who she essentially saw in the hallway,

1089
00:55:31,440 --> 00:55:34,719
Speaker 2: and she identified bushy eyebrows, which he, of course is,

1090
00:55:34,840 --> 00:55:38,440
Speaker 2: you know, notably has. They could have been killed as well,

1091
00:55:38,520 --> 00:55:41,800
Speaker 2: and thank god they weren't. The door dash driver who's

1092
00:55:41,840 --> 00:55:45,800
Speaker 2: gotten so much play recently, the door dash driver who

1093
00:55:45,840 --> 00:55:50,080
Speaker 2: delivered food to Ethan Shapin and Xannerknodle just before the murders,

1094
00:55:50,120 --> 00:55:55,240
Speaker 2: who was you know, technically a potential eyewitness moments moments before,

1095
00:55:55,480 --> 00:55:58,080
Speaker 2: so you know, he could have killed her, and thank

1096
00:55:58,120 --> 00:56:01,439
Speaker 2: god she survives. So there are the like sliding door

1097
00:56:01,520 --> 00:56:05,760
Speaker 2: moments of you know, insanity, but like the survivor's guilt,

1098
00:56:05,880 --> 00:56:09,120
Speaker 2: it's real, and you know, again our hearts go out

1099
00:56:09,160 --> 00:56:12,040
Speaker 2: to the whole town. Imagine Ethan Chapin was a triplet

1100
00:56:12,160 --> 00:56:15,879
Speaker 2: his you know, twin sister and twin brother. I don't

1101
00:56:15,920 --> 00:56:17,720
Speaker 2: know how you say that correctly if it's a triplet,

1102
00:56:17,760 --> 00:56:22,319
Speaker 2: but that school got annihilated. And imagine like now it's

1103
00:56:22,480 --> 00:56:25,160
Speaker 2: just the gig is up and this maniac has just

1104
00:56:25,200 --> 00:56:28,839
Speaker 2: been lyon with that smug face this whole time.

1105
00:56:29,960 --> 00:56:31,680
Speaker 5: Fair enough. I don't even I don't even know what

1106
00:56:31,760 --> 00:56:34,759
Speaker 5: to say to follow that speechless Well, one thing I

1107
00:56:34,840 --> 00:56:40,680
Speaker 5: can speak to is uh Diddy deliberation Sean Ditty Combs

1108
00:56:40,840 --> 00:56:45,360
Speaker 5: deliberations began today in the trial against Shawn Combs. But

1109
00:56:45,520 --> 00:56:50,120
Speaker 5: not is all correct with the jury so prosecutor. Prosecutors

1110
00:56:50,200 --> 00:56:54,440
Speaker 5: allege that for twenty years Combs has operated a criminal enterprise.

1111
00:56:54,800 --> 00:57:00,279
Speaker 5: They allege kidnapping, bribery, sex, trafficking and more. But today

1112
00:57:00,680 --> 00:57:03,920
Speaker 5: his fate fell into the hands of twelve jurors, and

1113
00:57:04,800 --> 00:57:10,160
Speaker 5: it was very very quick that a problem occurred. So

1114
00:57:10,440 --> 00:57:14,360
Speaker 5: the first note that came out to the judge was expected,

1115
00:57:14,440 --> 00:57:17,320
Speaker 5: and it was that the jury the four person was

1116
00:57:17,400 --> 00:57:20,120
Speaker 5: chosen during number five, a forty two year old nursing

1117
00:57:20,240 --> 00:57:24,280
Speaker 5: home aid from Manhattan, a mother of two, So that

1118
00:57:24,400 --> 00:57:28,600
Speaker 5: was an expected note. Not long after, another note came

1119
00:57:28,680 --> 00:57:32,880
Speaker 5: to the judge that indicated that members were concerned about

1120
00:57:32,960 --> 00:57:36,600
Speaker 5: jur number twenty five and the other quote is that

1121
00:57:36,960 --> 00:57:40,480
Speaker 5: they cannot follow your honors instructions. So what we know

1122
00:57:40,600 --> 00:57:45,600
Speaker 5: about Juror number twenty five that he has a PhD.

1123
00:57:45,920 --> 00:57:49,600
Speaker 5: I believe in you fact checked me on that to see.

1124
00:57:49,600 --> 00:57:52,320
Speaker 2: Twenty five jurors, Am I wrong? Like that's a lot

1125
00:57:52,360 --> 00:57:54,000
Speaker 2: of jurors. No, I thought there were only twelve.

1126
00:57:54,400 --> 00:57:56,640
Speaker 5: Well, there's alternates, but I guess they all they have

1127
00:57:56,760 --> 00:57:59,880
Speaker 5: different numbers, maybe from where they were sitting during vais D.

1128
00:58:00,560 --> 00:58:03,600
Speaker 5: I don't know, fancy, Actually we should, we should maybe

1129
00:58:03,600 --> 00:58:08,040
Speaker 5: look into how juror's numbers are given out. But yeah,

1130
00:58:08,120 --> 00:58:11,280
Speaker 5: so they said that they were concerned about this juror,

1131
00:58:12,000 --> 00:58:15,200
Speaker 5: and then later in the day the jury raised had

1132
00:58:15,200 --> 00:58:19,400
Speaker 5: another question, and this is seeking clarification about whether an

1133
00:58:19,440 --> 00:58:23,280
Speaker 5: individual can be found responsible for distributing drugs if the

1134
00:58:23,280 --> 00:58:27,160
Speaker 5: person who received the drugs requested them. So the judge

1135
00:58:27,360 --> 00:58:31,320
Speaker 5: said he will provide an answer in the morning, so

1136
00:58:31,440 --> 00:58:34,240
Speaker 5: we'll know tomorrow what I guess because I don't know

1137
00:58:34,280 --> 00:58:35,760
Speaker 5: the answer to that question or.

1138
00:58:35,760 --> 00:58:38,840
Speaker 4: Either well, you're listening to True Crime tonight. I'm Boddy

1139
00:58:38,880 --> 00:58:41,800
Speaker 4: Movin and I'm here with Stephanie Leidecker and Courtney Armstrong

1140
00:58:41,840 --> 00:58:44,600
Speaker 4: and we are talking about the p Diddy. If you

1141
00:58:44,680 --> 00:58:46,280
Speaker 4: want to weigh in, give us a call at eighty

1142
00:58:46,280 --> 00:58:48,560
Speaker 4: eight eight thirty one Crime or use the talkbacks on

1143
00:58:48,640 --> 00:58:50,160
Speaker 4: the iHeartRadio app.

1144
00:58:50,360 --> 00:58:52,640
Speaker 2: So we'll find out tomorrow. But I guess I think

1145
00:58:52,680 --> 00:58:55,280
Speaker 2: it's worth noting though, because again this is a very

1146
00:58:55,400 --> 00:58:58,040
Speaker 2: major case. Again, don't get me started, you know, did

1147
00:58:58,080 --> 00:59:01,120
Speaker 2: he We were very surprised to find out was not

1148
00:59:01,240 --> 00:59:04,200
Speaker 2: putting forward any defense. He wasn't going to speak in

1149
00:59:04,240 --> 00:59:06,760
Speaker 2: his own trial. That's not unusual, but also he wasn't

1150
00:59:06,760 --> 00:59:10,080
Speaker 2: calling forward any witnesses. That's been highly debated. Is that

1151
00:59:10,160 --> 00:59:12,880
Speaker 2: a show of confidence or was that just a way

1152
00:59:12,920 --> 00:59:16,800
Speaker 2: to muzzle any more cross examination that could potentially lead

1153
00:59:16,840 --> 00:59:20,440
Speaker 2: to celebrities or other people who are not being dragged

1154
00:59:20,480 --> 00:59:22,960
Speaker 2: into this. Possibly let's just go there for a second.

1155
00:59:23,080 --> 00:59:27,280
Speaker 2: So again we're easing into a July fourth holiday weekend.

1156
00:59:27,520 --> 00:59:30,200
Speaker 2: If you're a juror and you're you know, over a

1157
00:59:30,240 --> 00:59:33,240
Speaker 2: month into this and you're you want to get back

1158
00:59:33,280 --> 00:59:35,680
Speaker 2: and get back to your routine, get back to your job,

1159
00:59:35,720 --> 00:59:38,800
Speaker 2: you know, listen, TikTok. I'm sure they're anxious to start

1160
00:59:38,840 --> 00:59:41,160
Speaker 2: the real world again. So for there to be so

1161
00:59:41,240 --> 00:59:44,600
Speaker 2: many like complicated things to your point, I think the

1162
00:59:44,680 --> 00:59:46,960
Speaker 2: question was, Look, if somebody is asking for the drugs

1163
00:59:47,000 --> 00:59:48,560
Speaker 2: and I give it to them, does that make me

1164
00:59:48,760 --> 00:59:52,600
Speaker 2: a distributor? I think the answer to that is probably yes.

1165
00:59:52,680 --> 00:59:56,920
Speaker 2: It's illegal to have drugs. And if somebody's asking you

1166
00:59:57,000 --> 01:00:01,560
Speaker 2: for something illegal and you supply something illegal, I have

1167
01:00:01,640 --> 01:00:06,040
Speaker 2: to assume that's illegal. But again, Jarrett Farantino, our resident

1168
01:00:06,160 --> 01:00:08,880
Speaker 2: attorney who's been breaking down so much of this trial stuff,

1169
01:00:08,920 --> 01:00:11,000
Speaker 2: will have to weigh in on that. And if anybody

1170
01:00:11,080 --> 01:00:14,240
Speaker 2: here knows the answer, please jump in eight eight eight

1171
01:00:14,240 --> 01:00:16,720
Speaker 2: to three one crime. Because it's complicated.

1172
01:00:17,040 --> 01:00:20,120
Speaker 5: It is complicated, And speaking of knowing the answer, a

1173
01:00:20,200 --> 01:00:24,200
Speaker 5: little research helped just came in and jur number twenty five,

1174
01:00:24,240 --> 01:00:26,800
Speaker 5: because that was an interesting question, Stephanie. It's just an

1175
01:00:26,840 --> 01:00:31,360
Speaker 5: internal identifier. It's not the total count. So the total count,

1176
01:00:31,400 --> 01:00:33,800
Speaker 5: there are twelve seat adjurors. There are eight men and

1177
01:00:33,920 --> 01:00:38,720
Speaker 5: four women. There are six alternates, four men and two women.

1178
01:00:39,480 --> 01:00:43,080
Speaker 2: Because there's been all this speculation chatter online. Not my opinion,

1179
01:00:43,240 --> 01:00:46,080
Speaker 2: just an observation that, you know, the jurors in this

1180
01:00:46,120 --> 01:00:50,720
Speaker 2: particular case, it's a racketeering case. The racketeering kind of symbolizes,

1181
01:00:51,040 --> 01:00:53,320
Speaker 2: you know, the mob, right, you know.

1182
01:00:53,360 --> 01:00:57,640
Speaker 3: Organized and organized, snitches get stitches, and you know, if

1183
01:00:57,640 --> 01:01:00,840
Speaker 3: you're a juror and you are sitting a trial that

1184
01:01:01,040 --> 01:01:04,160
Speaker 3: is so high profile and the person that's being accused

1185
01:01:04,440 --> 01:01:07,480
Speaker 3: is also so her profile and has deep pockets, the

1186
01:01:07,560 --> 01:01:09,840
Speaker 3: fear would always be that the jury pool is being

1187
01:01:09,880 --> 01:01:11,960
Speaker 3: tainted somehow, that maybe they got to them.

1188
01:01:12,240 --> 01:01:14,200
Speaker 2: Right, That's how it happens in the Sopranos and in

1189
01:01:14,240 --> 01:01:17,160
Speaker 2: the movies, right, the Goodfellas of it all. You know,

1190
01:01:17,200 --> 01:01:19,120
Speaker 2: I'm not saying that that's happening here, but you know,

1191
01:01:19,160 --> 01:01:22,720
Speaker 2: we have seen some juror issues throughout this entire trial.

1192
01:01:22,840 --> 01:01:25,240
Speaker 2: So one of them got a text. One of them

1193
01:01:25,240 --> 01:01:27,280
Speaker 2: got a text. The other one got to get dipped,

1194
01:01:27,320 --> 01:01:29,560
Speaker 2: you know, like there's been stuff. So when this first

1195
01:01:29,600 --> 01:01:31,600
Speaker 2: hit the news, I was like, oh my gosh, in

1196
01:01:31,680 --> 01:01:35,640
Speaker 2: the eleventh hour, can you imagine deliberations are finally underway

1197
01:01:36,160 --> 01:01:39,400
Speaker 2: and the juror got tampered with. There's no indication that

1198
01:01:39,400 --> 01:01:42,000
Speaker 2: that's the case, and it's appropriate to have a question,

1199
01:01:42,200 --> 01:01:44,600
Speaker 2: right And we saw that in the Karen Reid trial

1200
01:01:44,800 --> 01:01:48,000
Speaker 2: where the jurors, you know, Karen Reid of course infamously

1201
01:01:48,040 --> 01:01:51,040
Speaker 2: just got off of her retrial for being accused of

1202
01:01:51,160 --> 01:01:55,400
Speaker 2: killing her boyfriend in her lexus, the jurors had a

1203
01:01:55,440 --> 01:01:57,919
Speaker 2: lot of questions, and we want to make sure they're

1204
01:01:57,960 --> 01:02:00,960
Speaker 2: asking those questions so that they get the answer, because

1205
01:02:01,000 --> 01:02:03,640
Speaker 2: a lot of chatter is saying he may walk. He

1206
01:02:03,680 --> 01:02:05,960
Speaker 2: seems to be laughing it up in the courtroom, and

1207
01:02:06,200 --> 01:02:08,120
Speaker 2: you know, Courtney, you were just having a giggle about

1208
01:02:08,160 --> 01:02:10,280
Speaker 2: what he's reading. I mean talk about optics.

1209
01:02:10,480 --> 01:02:14,760
Speaker 5: Oh yeah. Sitting this I've found kind of infuriating that

1210
01:02:14,800 --> 01:02:18,560
Speaker 5: he is sitting there with his attorneys in the room

1211
01:02:18,840 --> 01:02:21,920
Speaker 5: and his self help book sitting right in front of him.

1212
01:02:22,000 --> 01:02:24,080
Speaker 5: Is the power of positive thinking.

1213
01:02:24,640 --> 01:02:26,560
Speaker 2: Like that's going to do the trick and let's talk

1214
01:02:26,560 --> 01:02:28,680
Speaker 2: about the optics, because Courtney, you had brought this up

1215
01:02:28,760 --> 01:02:30,800
Speaker 2: last week and I thought this was really astute. You know,

1216
01:02:30,880 --> 01:02:33,280
Speaker 2: the optics of a trial. It's such an important thing.

1217
01:02:33,280 --> 01:02:35,280
Speaker 2: It's like a play, right, like who puts on the

1218
01:02:35,320 --> 01:02:38,680
Speaker 2: biggest show? Is important and it has to be broken

1219
01:02:38,720 --> 01:02:41,720
Speaker 2: down into Layman's terms. We'll be right back, stick around,

1220
01:02:42,560 --> 01:02:44,320
Speaker 2: We'll be back. We're going to hit a talk back

1221
01:02:44,360 --> 01:02:47,040
Speaker 2: for Diddy. Stick around right here for true crime tonight.

1222
01:02:58,600 --> 01:03:00,520
Speaker 2: The phones have been off the hook because we have

1223
01:03:00,560 --> 01:03:04,400
Speaker 2: been talking about the bombshell developments in the Brian Coburger case.

1224
01:03:04,840 --> 01:03:08,680
Speaker 2: If you've been following along, Brian Coburger, accused of murdering

1225
01:03:08,800 --> 01:03:12,760
Speaker 2: for Idaho college students, has pled guilty and will be

1226
01:03:12,960 --> 01:03:15,760
Speaker 2: in court on Wednesday. We will be following these developments

1227
01:03:15,880 --> 01:03:19,720
Speaker 2: very very closely. And did he watch deliberations game on?

1228
01:03:20,120 --> 01:03:23,680
Speaker 2: They're happening on the eve of a holiday weekend, so

1229
01:03:24,200 --> 01:03:26,720
Speaker 2: this verdict could come in as soon as tomorrow or

1230
01:03:26,800 --> 01:03:30,200
Speaker 2: Wednesday is feeling very likely. I think the nation is

1231
01:03:30,240 --> 01:03:33,320
Speaker 2: getting increasingly divided about how this is all going to

1232
01:03:33,360 --> 01:03:35,560
Speaker 2: shake out. And the big ticket item today is that

1233
01:03:35,720 --> 01:03:39,480
Speaker 2: their juror juror number twenty five is having some some

1234
01:03:39,640 --> 01:03:44,120
Speaker 2: questions and is apparently not following following orders or the rules.

1235
01:03:44,240 --> 01:03:46,920
Speaker 2: What is the what's the Rundown Court? It was?

1236
01:03:47,200 --> 01:03:49,880
Speaker 5: It was the fact that jur Number twenty five didn't

1237
01:03:49,920 --> 01:03:53,640
Speaker 5: seem like he could follow along with the judges orders

1238
01:03:54,400 --> 01:03:57,280
Speaker 5: and they were having they cannot follow. Yeah, your honors

1239
01:03:57,320 --> 01:04:01,480
Speaker 5: instructions is exactly right. And what they are hung up on,

1240
01:04:01,600 --> 01:04:06,360
Speaker 5: which honestly, I think is incredibly valid, is clarification about

1241
01:04:06,360 --> 01:04:09,440
Speaker 5: whether an individual can be can be found responsible for

1242
01:04:09,520 --> 01:04:13,600
Speaker 5: distributing drugs if the person who received them requested them.

1243
01:04:14,000 --> 01:04:16,760
Speaker 5: So the judge will be clarifying this tomorrow we'll have

1244
01:04:16,800 --> 01:04:20,520
Speaker 5: the official answer. But honestly, I think this speaks to

1245
01:04:20,600 --> 01:04:24,000
Speaker 5: the confusion of all of the rico charges that we

1246
01:04:24,080 --> 01:04:28,520
Speaker 5: have been talking about for weeks, because it's so intermingled.

1247
01:04:28,560 --> 01:04:32,360
Speaker 5: It's not a black and white that drug dealer off

1248
01:04:32,480 --> 01:04:36,480
Speaker 5: the street goes and sells it to somebody. No, it's

1249
01:04:36,960 --> 01:04:41,200
Speaker 5: Ditty's assistant, it's Ditty's you know, potentially loved one. So

1250
01:04:41,760 --> 01:04:47,120
Speaker 5: it is messy. So honestly, you're twenty five, I'm with you.

1251
01:04:47,680 --> 01:04:50,000
Speaker 5: That's all I gotta say, because it is confusing and

1252
01:04:50,200 --> 01:04:52,520
Speaker 5: I think it does again speak to how it might

1253
01:04:52,600 --> 01:04:55,000
Speaker 5: all get a little messy with the rico.

1254
01:04:55,240 --> 01:04:58,040
Speaker 2: And listen, better to have the question answered prior to

1255
01:04:58,280 --> 01:05:00,840
Speaker 2: giving a verdict. Yeah, you know, so he gets off

1256
01:05:00,880 --> 01:05:03,280
Speaker 2: because they didn't have it clear, or he gets sentenced

1257
01:05:03,280 --> 01:05:05,200
Speaker 2: to life because they didn't have it clear. That's not

1258
01:05:05,280 --> 01:05:09,440
Speaker 2: the goal, right, We want justice period. And frankly, it

1259
01:05:09,480 --> 01:05:12,200
Speaker 2: has been a little confusing with these charges. So to

1260
01:05:12,240 --> 01:05:14,960
Speaker 2: your point, Courtney, it's a fair question. Yeah, it is.

1261
01:05:15,520 --> 01:05:16,600
Speaker 4: So we have a talk back.

1262
01:05:17,000 --> 01:05:18,439
Speaker 2: Can we put the go hi?

1263
01:05:18,600 --> 01:05:22,480
Speaker 11: This is Tanya from Alabama and regarding the Didty trial

1264
01:05:22,960 --> 01:05:27,280
Speaker 11: and these women that were supposedly in the loving relationships

1265
01:05:27,280 --> 01:05:31,320
Speaker 11: with Ditty, do you suppose they were being threatened to

1266
01:05:31,400 --> 01:05:34,120
Speaker 11: say and act certain ways to be in a loving

1267
01:05:34,240 --> 01:05:38,240
Speaker 11: relationship because it's always the women who are supposed to

1268
01:05:38,240 --> 01:05:40,680
Speaker 11: well why didn't she get out? Why didn't she leave?

1269
01:05:40,960 --> 01:05:43,240
Speaker 11: But what kind of threats were made to them to

1270
01:05:43,320 --> 01:05:44,360
Speaker 11: keep them quiet?

1271
01:05:44,520 --> 01:05:47,280
Speaker 2: Yes, exactly, it was such a great question. I'm going

1272
01:05:47,320 --> 01:05:49,960
Speaker 2: to get crazy again. But listen, we saw what happened

1273
01:05:50,040 --> 01:05:53,760
Speaker 2: when Cassi Evnsura, his ex who testified for days on

1274
01:05:53,800 --> 01:05:58,440
Speaker 2: the stand nine months pregnant, faced the monster. We saw

1275
01:05:58,480 --> 01:06:01,480
Speaker 2: the video of her try to get away, and he

1276
01:06:01,960 --> 01:06:04,479
Speaker 2: beat her to the ground and kicked her and kicked

1277
01:06:04,480 --> 01:06:06,919
Speaker 2: her again and dragged her by her hair. We've seen

1278
01:06:06,960 --> 01:06:10,400
Speaker 2: the photographs. Getting out of a traumatic scenario like that

1279
01:06:10,600 --> 01:06:13,439
Speaker 2: is so much easier said than done, And unless you've

1280
01:06:13,440 --> 01:06:16,160
Speaker 2: been in that spot, I don't think people can judge.

1281
01:06:16,160 --> 01:06:17,840
Speaker 2: And it does surprise me a little bit to your

1282
01:06:17,880 --> 01:06:20,920
Speaker 2: point that it's sometimes it's women that are extra hard

1283
01:06:21,120 --> 01:06:24,520
Speaker 2: on female victims. You know, we've heard this, you know,

1284
01:06:24,600 --> 01:06:26,640
Speaker 2: Courtney and I were, you know, talking about this very

1285
01:06:26,680 --> 01:06:30,640
Speaker 2: recently in terms of jury selection. Sometimes if it's female

1286
01:06:30,760 --> 01:06:33,800
Speaker 2: victim centric and when they're picking a jury, they don't

1287
01:06:33,800 --> 01:06:37,200
Speaker 2: always necessarily want women because women are harder on women. Allegedly.

1288
01:06:37,680 --> 01:06:40,080
Speaker 2: That was astounding to me and it still is a

1289
01:06:40,400 --> 01:06:42,600
Speaker 2: very judge to me. I don't think, first of all,

1290
01:06:42,720 --> 01:06:44,720
Speaker 2: neither of you are and I would want you on

1291
01:06:44,800 --> 01:06:47,760
Speaker 2: my jury and a heartpiece, I really would, but like,

1292
01:06:47,960 --> 01:06:51,240
Speaker 2: I not feel more of the ladies. I think more

1293
01:06:51,320 --> 01:06:53,840
Speaker 2: like guys, Like it's not easy to get out of

1294
01:06:53,840 --> 01:06:58,240
Speaker 2: these situations. Yeah, coercion abuse. Everybody that worked for him,

1295
01:06:58,280 --> 01:07:03,120
Speaker 2: they would threaten them and threatened to put videos out

1296
01:07:03,240 --> 01:07:08,280
Speaker 2: of them doing really intense sexual things in ruining their lives.

1297
01:07:09,960 --> 01:07:11,240
Speaker 2: Why is that up for question?

1298
01:07:11,640 --> 01:07:16,800
Speaker 5: Yeah, very fair well. And additionally, there is yet another

1299
01:07:16,960 --> 01:07:22,160
Speaker 5: Ditty family member that is facing some legal battles. This

1300
01:07:22,280 --> 01:07:26,640
Speaker 5: is civil, but Sean Combs's son, Justin, he's thirty one

1301
01:07:26,720 --> 01:07:30,080
Speaker 5: years old. He's been accused in this civil lawsuit of

1302
01:07:30,160 --> 01:07:34,080
Speaker 5: luring a woman from Louisiana to come to Los Angeles.

1303
01:07:34,480 --> 01:07:37,640
Speaker 5: It was allegedly under the promise of, hey, I'll help

1304
01:07:37,680 --> 01:07:40,600
Speaker 5: you get a job in TV. My dad has connections.

1305
01:07:41,520 --> 01:07:46,280
Speaker 5: And the allegation state that she was allegedly gang raped

1306
01:07:47,000 --> 01:07:50,320
Speaker 5: by three masked men and she is claiming that one

1307
01:07:50,360 --> 01:07:54,920
Speaker 5: of them was Ditty because Justin called him Pops. I

1308
01:07:55,000 --> 01:07:57,800
Speaker 5: just want to state that still feels really tenuous. I

1309
01:07:57,840 --> 01:08:01,960
Speaker 5: do not doubt this woman's story over all. But this

1310
01:08:02,040 --> 01:08:07,360
Speaker 5: lawsuit that was filed last week, it claims very similar

1311
01:08:07,640 --> 01:08:12,080
Speaker 5: that Justin used status, celebrity status to lure the woman

1312
01:08:12,320 --> 01:08:15,360
Speaker 5: and his powerful father to make this happen.

1313
01:08:16,080 --> 01:08:19,320
Speaker 2: And listen is that you know, it's it's wild. It's

1314
01:08:19,360 --> 01:08:23,120
Speaker 2: interesting timing. As you know, deliberations begin and there is

1315
01:08:23,120 --> 01:08:25,840
Speaker 2: some speculation that did he may walk because of these

1316
01:08:25,880 --> 01:08:29,439
Speaker 2: complicated charges, or that maybe the state has not proven

1317
01:08:29,720 --> 01:08:33,599
Speaker 2: racketeering because that's such a big charge. You know, we're

1318
01:08:33,600 --> 01:08:36,240
Speaker 2: we always are wondering, why not domestic violence? We think

1319
01:08:36,320 --> 01:08:38,479
Speaker 2: we that's for sure the case. Even he says, yeah,

1320
01:08:38,479 --> 01:08:41,799
Speaker 2: I'm not so great with women, clearly. But that's an

1321
01:08:41,840 --> 01:08:45,360
Speaker 2: interesting point. And it's a state charge. It's a state charge,

1322
01:08:45,439 --> 01:08:47,479
Speaker 2: but like better to get a state charge guilty than

1323
01:08:47,520 --> 01:08:50,919
Speaker 2: a federal charge not guilty. I mean, sex trafficking is federal.

1324
01:08:51,080 --> 01:08:53,919
Speaker 4: So I mean it's hard to it's hard to commingle

1325
01:08:54,000 --> 01:08:57,200
Speaker 4: those things in one chores the other.

1326
01:08:57,320 --> 01:08:58,479
Speaker 2: Son, go ahead. I'm sorry.

1327
01:08:58,520 --> 01:09:01,680
Speaker 5: I was gonna say, oh, this was several weeks ago, Stephanie.

1328
01:09:01,680 --> 01:09:05,920
Speaker 5: We had your brother, an attorney, and he explained Rico

1329
01:09:06,160 --> 01:09:09,120
Speaker 5: as body thankfully has continued to educate us with and

1330
01:09:09,200 --> 01:09:12,200
Speaker 5: he said, it's an umbrella in which you are. Then

1331
01:09:12,439 --> 01:09:16,400
Speaker 5: it gives you the platform to charge people who are

1332
01:09:16,439 --> 01:09:22,200
Speaker 5: worth charging, with many different tentacles in different crimes, all

1333
01:09:22,280 --> 01:09:24,960
Speaker 5: under one bubble. And that's what this is. Again, it's

1334
01:09:25,040 --> 01:09:26,519
Speaker 5: twenty years of this.

1335
01:09:26,439 --> 01:09:29,200
Speaker 2: Is the allegation, and it's not a one off crime.

1336
01:09:29,400 --> 01:09:32,160
Speaker 2: So yes, it does show that it's organized. And there

1337
01:09:32,200 --> 01:09:34,400
Speaker 2: was another son, I think and by the way, thank

1338
01:09:34,439 --> 01:09:39,080
Speaker 2: you to our True Crime Tonight listener, Alicia, because she

1339
01:09:39,280 --> 01:09:41,720
Speaker 2: flagged that last night when we were talking about the

1340
01:09:41,760 --> 01:09:46,160
Speaker 2: sons and their charges, I misspoke that this particular son, Justin,

1341
01:09:46,200 --> 01:09:49,400
Speaker 2: who's now being brought into this, he is not Albi

1342
01:09:49,560 --> 01:09:54,040
Speaker 2: Shore's son. Quincy is the eldest son, and he is

1343
01:09:54,200 --> 01:09:57,559
Speaker 2: Albi Shore's birth son. Did he allegedly adopted him, But

1344
01:09:57,720 --> 01:10:00,479
Speaker 2: just for clarity, Quincy was not brought up on any charges.

1345
01:10:00,840 --> 01:10:03,559
Speaker 2: Justin was and the other Christian back in April twenty

1346
01:10:03,560 --> 01:10:07,280
Speaker 2: twenty four also was brought into a suit that acclaimed

1347
01:10:07,479 --> 01:10:10,519
Speaker 2: that he was also doing very bad things to a

1348
01:10:10,560 --> 01:10:12,040
Speaker 2: woman on a yacht.

1349
01:10:12,439 --> 01:10:14,360
Speaker 5: And I think that's gonna have to be a mess

1350
01:10:14,439 --> 01:10:17,559
Speaker 5: for another day. You're listening to True Crime Tonight. I'm

1351
01:10:17,600 --> 01:10:21,320
Speaker 5: Courtney Armstrong. I'm here with Stephanie Leidecker and crime analyst

1352
01:10:21,439 --> 01:10:25,200
Speaker 5: Body Moven, and we're talking about p Diddy. We are

1353
01:10:25,240 --> 01:10:29,000
Speaker 5: talking about Justin Didty, and we are also I've been

1354
01:10:29,040 --> 01:10:33,479
Speaker 5: talking about today's bombshell of Brian Kohlberger taking a pleat

1355
01:10:33,560 --> 01:10:38,639
Speaker 5: deal for murdering the four University of Idaho's students. If

1356
01:10:38,640 --> 01:10:40,639
Speaker 5: you want to weigh in with your thoughts on any

1357
01:10:40,680 --> 01:10:43,439
Speaker 5: of these topics, give us a call. We're at eighty

1358
01:10:43,520 --> 01:10:46,320
Speaker 5: eight three one crime or hit us on the talkbacks

1359
01:10:46,360 --> 01:10:51,840
Speaker 5: on the iHeartRadio app Yeah, Stephanie, that third suit is

1360
01:10:51,880 --> 01:10:55,120
Speaker 5: worth talking about. But I think to two ditties is

1361
01:10:55,240 --> 01:10:56,040
Speaker 5: enough for one night?

1362
01:10:56,320 --> 01:10:58,559
Speaker 2: How about three ditties? And then the apples in the

1363
01:10:58,600 --> 01:11:01,200
Speaker 2: trees are not lost on me? Like this is in

1364
01:11:01,240 --> 01:11:05,120
Speaker 2: the genetics potentially allegedly allegedly allegedly everybody have a drink.

1365
01:11:05,160 --> 01:11:09,400
Speaker 2: Allegedly it's not a great look or is it something

1366
01:11:09,439 --> 01:11:13,000
Speaker 2: that's you know, strategy. I don't know. Did he do it?

1367
01:11:13,479 --> 01:11:15,920
Speaker 2: Did he do it? I? I think did he did?

1368
01:11:16,040 --> 01:11:18,479
Speaker 2: And I wait to say that for a time. Let's

1369
01:11:18,520 --> 01:11:20,559
Speaker 2: just get it, get it, get a nice job. Nice job.

1370
01:11:20,640 --> 01:11:23,160
Speaker 5: That's a book title who we have had and it's

1371
01:11:23,200 --> 01:11:24,200
Speaker 5: our esteemed guest.

1372
01:11:24,560 --> 01:11:27,200
Speaker 2: Yeah, did he do it? Did he do it? That's right,

1373
01:11:27,240 --> 01:11:32,200
Speaker 2: that's right? That was our wonderful did he correspondent? You know,

1374
01:11:32,280 --> 01:11:34,920
Speaker 2: the optics of this one though, was crazy making, because

1375
01:11:35,000 --> 01:11:37,320
Speaker 2: you know, we know, bad boy for life?

1376
01:11:37,320 --> 01:11:37,600
Speaker 5: Did he?

1377
01:11:37,880 --> 01:11:40,640
Speaker 2: And you know he's giving you know, tough guy, but

1378
01:11:40,720 --> 01:11:43,759
Speaker 2: in the courtroom he's giving huxtable vibes. Right, he's wearing

1379
01:11:43,760 --> 01:11:46,320
Speaker 2: his little wool sweaters, and his hair is gray. Courtney

1380
01:11:46,360 --> 01:11:49,800
Speaker 2: pointed out that that was fully intentional because he needed

1381
01:11:50,040 --> 01:11:52,200
Speaker 2: because he was so old in prison and couldn't get

1382
01:11:52,240 --> 01:11:54,600
Speaker 2: the hair dye. But it makes him look like this

1383
01:11:54,720 --> 01:11:57,160
Speaker 2: sweet little old man. He could never do all these

1384
01:11:57,240 --> 01:11:59,639
Speaker 2: very bad things. Oh, and he has this little book

1385
01:11:59,640 --> 01:12:03,879
Speaker 2: of pop it of thinking. Meanwhile, his daughters, his lovely,

1386
01:12:04,280 --> 01:12:08,360
Speaker 2: beautiful young daughters, have been having to go to court

1387
01:12:08,479 --> 01:12:12,280
Speaker 2: and witness all of this hideousness, Like, how would you

1388
01:12:12,360 --> 01:12:14,120
Speaker 2: as a parent. This is where he loses me from

1389
01:12:14,200 --> 01:12:17,360
Speaker 2: day one. How do you let your daughters be in

1390
01:12:17,400 --> 01:12:19,720
Speaker 2: that room? Why? Because it's a good look. It makes

1391
01:12:19,760 --> 01:12:22,120
Speaker 2: him look like a dead and so sweet, even though

1392
01:12:22,120 --> 01:12:25,160
Speaker 2: he's beating women senselessly by his own admission, we've seen it.

1393
01:12:25,160 --> 01:12:28,679
Speaker 2: That's not a solization, Yes that that's not even alleged.

1394
01:12:29,400 --> 01:12:33,439
Speaker 5: It's not. But he appears to be a megalomaniac. So

1395
01:12:33,760 --> 01:12:35,760
Speaker 5: I have no degree. I don't even know if that's

1396
01:12:35,920 --> 01:12:36,320
Speaker 5: died on.

1397
01:12:36,600 --> 01:12:38,679
Speaker 2: Merror with the lipstick. You're an icon?

1398
01:12:38,760 --> 01:12:43,160
Speaker 4: Did he You know he's a sobal megalomaniac, Yes, super villain.

1399
01:12:43,240 --> 01:12:46,760
Speaker 2: Po word, What does a megalomaniac mean?

1400
01:12:47,200 --> 01:12:49,880
Speaker 4: Oh, it's an egomaniac, like he's an egomaniac.

1401
01:12:49,960 --> 01:12:52,960
Speaker 5: Yeah, the entire world. I am the center of the

1402
01:12:53,120 --> 01:12:56,240
Speaker 5: entire world. And so of course he would have his

1403
01:12:56,360 --> 01:12:58,760
Speaker 5: daughter if they need to be used as props, no problem.

1404
01:12:59,080 --> 01:13:03,160
Speaker 5: So I have no problem from what I understand of

1405
01:13:03,200 --> 01:13:05,360
Speaker 5: his you know, state of mind and how he has

1406
01:13:05,400 --> 01:13:08,000
Speaker 5: treated everyone, that he would have his family sit there.

1407
01:13:08,320 --> 01:13:10,680
Speaker 5: And by the way, body, thanks for bringing up did

1408
01:13:10,680 --> 01:13:14,519
Speaker 5: he do it? That was written by lovely Matthew Russell Lee.

1409
01:13:14,920 --> 01:13:17,479
Speaker 2: Yeah, he's been doing such a great job outside the courthouse.

1410
01:13:17,520 --> 01:13:18,759
Speaker 2: I've been following him daily.

1411
01:13:18,880 --> 01:13:25,840
Speaker 4: So he tweets live like from Inner City Press on Twitter. Sorry, X,

1412
01:13:26,479 --> 01:13:29,240
Speaker 4: got to be right about that, And he's like really

1413
01:13:29,360 --> 01:13:31,080
Speaker 4: up to date on everything, did he right?

1414
01:13:31,320 --> 01:13:35,160
Speaker 2: Like constant updates all day long. He's he's he's been a.

1415
01:13:35,120 --> 01:13:39,559
Speaker 4: Dogged reporter, and he apparently reports only on federal cases,

1416
01:13:39,600 --> 01:13:42,840
Speaker 4: which is interesting, I thought, because you know, there's no TV,

1417
01:13:43,040 --> 01:13:47,040
Speaker 4: there's no there's no recording in any federal case. And I,

1418
01:13:47,080 --> 01:13:50,760
Speaker 4: in fact I gearing I will I suspect that we'll

1419
01:13:50,760 --> 01:13:53,800
Speaker 4: be following him and talking with him during Luigi Maggioni's trial,

1420
01:13:54,000 --> 01:13:55,080
Speaker 4: if there even is one.

1421
01:13:55,200 --> 01:13:58,000
Speaker 5: I know all these please well, he's not.

1422
01:13:57,960 --> 01:13:58,799
Speaker 2: Going to get a trial.

1423
01:13:58,920 --> 01:13:59,080
Speaker 10: Now.

1424
01:13:59,120 --> 01:14:03,240
Speaker 4: We're jumping opined early on that Luigi was gonna plead

1425
01:14:03,280 --> 01:14:05,439
Speaker 4: because of the death penalty, and here we are with Coberg.

1426
01:14:05,439 --> 01:14:07,280
Speaker 2: Girl, I can't handle it.

1427
01:14:07,560 --> 01:14:10,479
Speaker 4: Listen, the last thing the system wants is Luigi on trial.

1428
01:14:10,920 --> 01:14:12,360
Speaker 4: The last thing they want.

1429
01:14:12,439 --> 01:14:15,880
Speaker 5: That's he is so divisive.

1430
01:14:16,000 --> 01:14:16,880
Speaker 2: We'll get into that later.

1431
01:14:17,160 --> 01:14:20,160
Speaker 5: Yeah, that'll be. That'll be an interesting one to get into,

1432
01:14:20,320 --> 01:14:22,960
Speaker 5: is right. But listen, give us a call. We're at

1433
01:14:23,000 --> 01:14:25,960
Speaker 5: eight eight eight three one crime and we're talking about

1434
01:14:26,040 --> 01:14:29,439
Speaker 5: multiple things, but the bulk of this evening was the

1435
01:14:29,479 --> 01:14:34,680
Speaker 5: bombshell where Brian Coburger took a plea deal and that

1436
01:14:34,840 --> 01:14:38,040
Speaker 5: he killed the four University of Idaho students. So that

1437
01:14:38,120 --> 01:14:40,559
Speaker 5: trial that was supposed to happen in August will not

1438
01:14:40,640 --> 01:14:41,200
Speaker 5: be happening.

1439
01:14:41,880 --> 01:14:44,400
Speaker 2: We are still going to be covering this wild case.

1440
01:14:44,479 --> 01:14:48,120
Speaker 2: We are watching the Brian Coburger developments. I feel pretty snookered.

1441
01:14:48,720 --> 01:14:51,120
Speaker 2: Then you're not dumb. I don't mean it that way.

1442
01:14:51,240 --> 01:14:53,360
Speaker 2: I do feel like suckered a little bit. I think

1443
01:14:53,400 --> 01:14:57,519
Speaker 2: I'm more impressionable probably than you. Guys are far more

1444
01:14:57,960 --> 01:15:01,120
Speaker 2: keen ears and you had a se You're.

1445
01:15:00,760 --> 01:15:04,280
Speaker 4: Very empathetic, and the families are clearly upset and this

1446
01:15:04,400 --> 01:15:06,960
Speaker 4: is very traumatic for them. You know, their idea of

1447
01:15:07,160 --> 01:15:10,479
Speaker 4: justice was the death penalty and watching basically an eye

1448
01:15:10,520 --> 01:15:14,839
Speaker 4: for an eye, right and there for some of the families,

1449
01:15:14,920 --> 01:15:19,360
Speaker 4: and you know, the Steve I'm sorry, Steve Golenkalvaz, the

1450
01:15:19,840 --> 01:15:22,439
Speaker 4: father of Kaylee, one of the victims in this case,

1451
01:15:22,760 --> 01:15:25,559
Speaker 4: is you know, he's very upset. And he went on

1452
01:15:25,840 --> 01:15:28,280
Speaker 4: News Nation tonight and he said, you know, this is

1453
01:15:28,920 --> 01:15:31,120
Speaker 4: I'm going to paraphrase, he said, you know, this is

1454
01:15:31,200 --> 01:15:34,080
Speaker 4: not justice. And the majority of the victims' families are

1455
01:15:34,160 --> 01:15:37,479
Speaker 4: upset about this. So it is worth noting that previous

1456
01:15:37,479 --> 01:15:40,000
Speaker 4: segments we weren't really sure how the other families felt,

1457
01:15:40,000 --> 01:15:44,200
Speaker 4: but he's saying the majority. So the majority of the victims'

1458
01:15:44,160 --> 01:15:45,920
Speaker 4: families are upset with this, are upset.

1459
01:15:45,960 --> 01:15:48,160
Speaker 2: This plea deal. And I can say firsthand they're all

1460
01:15:48,200 --> 01:15:52,280
Speaker 2: tight too. You know, trauma brings people together sometimes in

1461
01:15:52,320 --> 01:15:55,400
Speaker 2: the most you know, unexpected, horrible ways, and this has

1462
01:15:55,479 --> 01:15:58,599
Speaker 2: been an experience that's now bonded them for life. And

1463
01:15:59,000 --> 01:16:01,120
Speaker 2: we can't say it enough. I know all of you

1464
01:16:01,360 --> 01:16:04,360
Speaker 2: were all together on this listening. We're sending our hearts

1465
01:16:04,479 --> 01:16:07,920
Speaker 2: in prayers to them real time, if we all close

1466
01:16:07,960 --> 01:16:10,200
Speaker 2: our eyes for one second and to send them love.

1467
01:16:11,040 --> 01:16:13,920
Speaker 2: They deserve it. And this has been a lot, Yeah,

1468
01:16:13,920 --> 01:16:14,240
Speaker 2: it is.

1469
01:16:14,720 --> 01:16:17,840
Speaker 5: I think it's worth taking one moment just to have

1470
01:16:18,000 --> 01:16:22,559
Speaker 5: a little nugget about each of these victims, each of

1471
01:16:22,600 --> 01:16:26,519
Speaker 5: these four. So Xana Karnodle. She was a junior majoring

1472
01:16:26,520 --> 01:16:29,919
Speaker 5: in marketing and when she graduated high school, she decorated

1473
01:16:29,920 --> 01:16:33,479
Speaker 5: her mortar board with butterflies and the words for the

1474
01:16:33,520 --> 01:16:37,639
Speaker 5: lives that I Will change. Ethan Shapin, also twenty years old.

1475
01:16:37,920 --> 01:16:41,559
Speaker 5: His obituary stated Ethan lived his best life. He loved

1476
01:16:41,560 --> 01:16:48,080
Speaker 5: the social life, intermurals, and tolerated the academics. Madison Mogan

1477
01:16:48,280 --> 01:16:51,160
Speaker 5: was a twenty one year old senior from Cordeline. She

1478
01:16:51,280 --> 01:16:55,000
Speaker 5: was majoring in marketing and was incredibly close with twenty

1479
01:16:55,040 --> 01:16:58,920
Speaker 5: one year old Kayleie Gonsalvas since the sixth grade. The

1480
01:16:58,960 --> 01:17:05,360
Speaker 5: two were in step and Kaylee posted pictures of the

1481
01:17:05,400 --> 01:17:09,599
Speaker 5: pair throughout their lives on Instagram for Madison's twenty first

1482
01:17:09,640 --> 01:17:12,439
Speaker 5: birthday and wrote, I wouldn't have wanted anyone else to

1483
01:17:12,479 --> 01:17:16,120
Speaker 5: be the main character in all my childhood stories, and

1484
01:17:16,200 --> 01:17:19,120
Speaker 5: Madison replied I love you more than life, my best

1485
01:17:19,120 --> 01:17:23,400
Speaker 5: friend forever and more. Excuse me, I just thought it

1486
01:17:23,439 --> 01:17:24,880
Speaker 5: was important to take one moment.

1487
01:17:25,120 --> 01:17:26,439
Speaker 2: Oh, it's incredibly important.

1488
01:17:26,560 --> 01:17:29,360
Speaker 4: And what you said, what Xanna said about the butterfly,

1489
01:17:29,439 --> 01:17:31,559
Speaker 4: and this is that it hit me too.

1490
01:17:31,840 --> 01:17:34,439
Speaker 2: They were great friends and our hearts are also with

1491
01:17:34,479 --> 01:17:38,760
Speaker 2: the surviving roommates who have also lived through unimaginable anguish.

1492
01:17:39,040 --> 01:17:42,519
Speaker 2: And you know Brian Coburger who is now set to

1493
01:17:43,080 --> 01:17:47,600
Speaker 2: take a plea deal and has life behind bars in exchange,

1494
01:17:47,800 --> 01:17:50,960
Speaker 2: you know we will take the gloves off. So more

1495
01:17:51,000 --> 01:17:54,040
Speaker 2: on this this week. Tomorrow we will be back covering

1496
01:17:54,120 --> 01:17:56,840
Speaker 2: the new developments that are shaping up real time, both

1497
01:17:56,840 --> 01:18:00,200
Speaker 2: in the Idaho college murders and also did he want much?

1498
01:18:00,520 --> 01:18:03,280
Speaker 2: Will we have a verdict? This is true crime tonight,

1499
01:18:03,360 --> 01:18:06,559
Speaker 2: thank you for being with us. Please stay safe out there,

1500
01:18:06,880 --> 01:18:09,720
Speaker 2: and our hearts are with you. Good night,