WEBVTT - Episode 5: The Trial 0:00:01.920 --> 0:00:08.119 Campsite media for the cops working Project Miguel. The takedowns 0:00:08.119 --> 0:00:11.800 were the culmination of a year's long investigation. After making 0:00:11.840 --> 0:00:15.160 almost sixty arrests in a single day, they patted themselves 0:00:15.160 --> 0:00:17.320 on the back, did a victory lap for the media, 0:00:17.560 --> 0:00:20.319 and moved on to the next big bust. But for 0:00:20.400 --> 0:00:23.640 Derrick White and Hunter Montour, this was just the beginning. 0:00:24.160 --> 0:00:26.680 They didn't understand why they were targets of an international 0:00:26.720 --> 0:00:30.160 sting operation, didn't think they'd broken any laws. The whole 0:00:30.200 --> 0:00:32.639 thing was absurd right from the get go. I went 0:00:32.800 --> 0:00:36.000 the first time I went to court, no idea. I'm 0:00:36.040 --> 0:00:39.040 sitting and inquired. There's like forty people or whatever sitting 0:00:39.080 --> 0:00:44.120 in this courtroom. So I look at my lawyer and 0:00:44.159 --> 0:00:45.960 I said, we gotta sit here all day and wait 0:00:45.960 --> 0:00:47.720 for all these cases to go through. He's like, what 0:00:47.800 --> 0:00:51.760 do you mean? I said, what the funk? All these people? 0:00:51.840 --> 0:00:55.520 I said, what are we gonna do? It's like, these 0:00:55.560 --> 0:00:58.600 are all the people. You don't know anybody here. I'm like, no, 0:00:58.680 --> 0:01:00.560 I've never met any of these people. I don't wunt 0:01:00.560 --> 0:01:02.279 know what they are. I said, what are they here for? 0:01:02.800 --> 0:01:07.800 Is they're all involved in your case? I'm like, okay, 0:01:09.000 --> 0:01:12.080 no Derek, but I don't know anybody else. I had 0:01:12.200 --> 0:01:15.919 no idea who these people are. Derek's situation wasn't too different. 0:01:16.240 --> 0:01:18.560 He was being lumped in with outlaw bikers and Colombian 0:01:18.600 --> 0:01:22.040 cartel runners. He was publicly accused of running a tobacco 0:01:22.120 --> 0:01:26.480 smuggling operation alongside big time organized crime figures like Sylvan Etier, 0:01:27.000 --> 0:01:30.520 someone Derek says he never dealt with. I had no clue. 0:01:30.800 --> 0:01:33.800 I mean, he used to show up but my restaurant, 0:01:33.800 --> 0:01:36.280 would you know, different guys just bringing them there to 0:01:36.400 --> 0:01:39.440 eat and stuff like that. But I never spoke to him. 0:01:39.440 --> 0:01:44.319 I never he He only spoke French for one and 0:01:45.120 --> 0:01:48.520 I never talked to him. But Sylvan would never face 0:01:48.560 --> 0:01:54.880 a judge because not long after the Mygale takedown at 0:01:54.960 --> 0:02:00.000 Sylvan's front door, knocked on his door and killed him 0:02:00.240 --> 0:02:04.720 front porch. No one was ever charged with the murder, 0:02:04.840 --> 0:02:07.560 but a former Quebec police investigator told the media that 0:02:07.600 --> 0:02:12.120 he believed the Hell's Angels were responsible. My understanding of 0:02:12.160 --> 0:02:15.840 it is that this was a retribution because he had 0:02:15.880 --> 0:02:19.560 not turned over all the money that was due the 0:02:19.600 --> 0:02:24.000 bikers and organized crime. It's so in essence if let's 0:02:24.000 --> 0:02:26.240 just make up numbers. Ten lords came in, he was 0:02:26.280 --> 0:02:28.640 only giving them money on six and keeping the four 0:02:28.880 --> 0:02:37.880 to himself. So how did you react when Sylvan was murdered? 0:02:38.280 --> 0:02:40.200 I mean, were you did you feel like anything was 0:02:40.240 --> 0:02:43.760 gonna come to you? Or well not really, I mean 0:02:44.680 --> 0:02:47.640 from what I hear that he owed people money and 0:02:47.960 --> 0:02:53.160 or he was basically I don't know if he was 0:02:53.360 --> 0:02:56.640 if he was gonna squeal on the other guys that 0:02:56.720 --> 0:03:01.360 were bringing the stuff in for him, or I don't know. 0:03:01.400 --> 0:03:04.119 I don't They didn't know much about what was what 0:03:04.160 --> 0:03:08.280 they're what, they're how their operation was working, so they 0:03:08.320 --> 0:03:10.320 don't care. They just want to just round up as 0:03:10.360 --> 0:03:13.400 many people as they can and charge everybody and try 0:03:13.440 --> 0:03:16.440 to get as much money as they can out of everybody. 0:03:16.480 --> 0:03:18.880 But you know what happened. Look at you got fifty 0:03:19.160 --> 0:03:23.440 fifty guys and I'm the only Me and Hunter are 0:03:23.480 --> 0:03:27.160 the only ones that are fighting this because it's our right. 0:03:27.280 --> 0:03:29.120 I mean, we're gonna fight this right till the end. 0:03:30.040 --> 0:03:32.239 From day one, Derek knew he was going to fight 0:03:32.280 --> 0:03:34.760 this case. It didn't cross his mind to roll over 0:03:34.800 --> 0:03:37.320 and plead guilty like most of the other Mohawks had 0:03:37.360 --> 0:03:40.880 been arrested on tobacco charges in the past. From as 0:03:40.920 --> 0:03:44.520 far as I can remember, tobacco and the cigarettes were 0:03:44.520 --> 0:03:47.600 coming in. There was people getting caught and going accord 0:03:47.720 --> 0:03:50.840 and this and that, but nobody really fought it. Nobody 0:03:50.840 --> 0:03:54.120 ever fought it. They would just okay, well, say you 0:03:54.160 --> 0:03:57.080 had ten cases of cigarettes in your in your trunk whatever, 0:03:57.160 --> 0:04:01.320 and they say, okay, well, UH will make you a deal. 0:04:02.640 --> 0:04:05.400 You pay a hundred dollars a month or whatever. So 0:04:05.440 --> 0:04:08.120 everybody would take the deal, and nobody ever fought it. 0:04:08.720 --> 0:04:12.400 And I said, you know what, it's time someone you know, 0:04:12.480 --> 0:04:16.560 steps up to the plate and fight discovernment and see 0:04:16.560 --> 0:04:19.720 what happens. And I'm willing. I'm ready to go to jail. 0:04:19.720 --> 0:04:21.799 I don't care, you know, but I'm not pleading guilty. 0:04:22.120 --> 0:04:25.240 Playing and simple. They could make any offer that they 0:04:25.279 --> 0:04:34.840 want and I'm not taking it. Playing and Simple from 0:04:34.880 --> 0:04:38.560 Campside Media and Dan Patrick Productions. This is Running Smoke, 0:04:49.440 --> 0:05:00.680 I Got great place. I'm Roger Gola and this is 0:05:00.720 --> 0:05:06.080 episode five the trial. As soon as Derek heard that 0:05:06.080 --> 0:05:08.240 he had a warrant out for his arrest, he placed 0:05:08.240 --> 0:05:10.479 a phone call to a golf buddy he'd known for years. 0:05:11.200 --> 0:05:13.760 Pure lick v l e c u y e Er. 0:05:14.880 --> 0:05:19.200 I was the defense lawyer for Derek Whaite. I met 0:05:19.240 --> 0:05:22.320 Pierre in his swinky office in downtown Montreal, and he 0:05:22.400 --> 0:05:24.680 just had one ground rule for me. If I would 0:05:24.720 --> 0:05:28.599 like the question, I won't answer simple enough. Huh. Pierre 0:05:28.640 --> 0:05:31.240 does not mess around. He's about as matter of fact 0:05:31.279 --> 0:05:33.560 as a clerk at the d MB. Was this a 0:05:33.560 --> 0:05:36.480 total surprise to both you and Derek? Was there any 0:05:36.720 --> 0:05:40.080 indication that there was surveillance happening prior or I'm never 0:05:40.160 --> 0:05:44.479 surprised if a client is arrested, and I was aware 0:05:44.560 --> 0:05:48.200 of it because two of his runner were arrested and 0:05:48.920 --> 0:05:51.360 amounts of money were sees. I would say three or 0:05:51.360 --> 0:05:54.880 four months, six months prior to the arrest, so I 0:05:54.960 --> 0:05:58.520 knew something was cooking, But at the time Derek chalked 0:05:58.560 --> 0:06:01.400 it up to a fluke. His suspicions were raised a bit, 0:06:01.600 --> 0:06:06.159 but the business continued for months until March when the 0:06:06.160 --> 0:06:09.200 Mohawk Peacekeepers called Derek to tell him he was wanted. 0:06:10.000 --> 0:06:13.560 Calls me, there's a warrant for his arrest. I ran 0:06:13.600 --> 0:06:17.039 down to his office, We discussed it, made sure that 0:06:17.080 --> 0:06:19.200 he would be released on bail. I found out that 0:06:19.279 --> 0:06:21.080 much the bail was to be sure that I had 0:06:21.080 --> 0:06:24.080 the money to go deposited for the bail. We waited 0:06:24.200 --> 0:06:28.040 for the disclosure and started working the case. Disclosure all 0:06:28.080 --> 0:06:30.160 the evidence that the government had collected on Derek over 0:06:30.160 --> 0:06:33.599 the last couple of years. It was ten bankers boxes 0:06:33.680 --> 0:06:37.640 worth of intercepted phone calls, text, surveillance reports and photos. 0:06:38.040 --> 0:06:40.120 Pierre and his team had their work cut out for them. 0:06:40.400 --> 0:06:44.239 And so just from seeing the full disclosure, how strong 0:06:44.320 --> 0:06:47.159 did you feel the government's case was? Well, obviously it 0:06:47.240 --> 0:06:52.240 was strong. When you have police officers delivering tobacco to you, 0:06:52.800 --> 0:06:55.760 I mean and one at the end stints the guy 0:06:55.880 --> 0:06:58.400 is moving to tobacco to a warehouse in Saint Jeanne. 0:06:59.480 --> 0:07:01.559 Derek is giving shipped to the guy to move faster, 0:07:01.640 --> 0:07:04.400 and the guy who was moving in as an OURCMP officer. 0:07:04.640 --> 0:07:07.919 So Derek was hit with two sets of criminal charges. 0:07:08.560 --> 0:07:12.240 The first set concerned the tax evasion he'd allegedly committed 0:07:12.280 --> 0:07:15.640 against the provincial government of Quebec. For the provincial when 0:07:15.680 --> 0:07:18.680 the finished product, which means a cigarette, has to be 0:07:18.720 --> 0:07:24.280 so they have to prove that it's sold in Quebec territory. Well, 0:07:24.320 --> 0:07:26.840 in there's case that it wasn't because he was shipping 0:07:26.920 --> 0:07:31.160 full containers to Ontario six Nations and that's where they 0:07:31.200 --> 0:07:34.000 were producing the cigarettes and setting them there. I'm not 0:07:34.080 --> 0:07:37.920 liable for paying the taxes or anything. If you look 0:07:37.920 --> 0:07:43.360 into the the Rules and Regulations of Revenue Canada, it 0:07:43.520 --> 0:07:46.040 states right in there do you only paid the taxes 0:07:46.120 --> 0:07:50.240 once it's manufactured and sold. So I've never manufactured any 0:07:50.240 --> 0:07:54.040 cigarettes or sold any cigarettes the actual cigarette. All I 0:07:54.080 --> 0:07:57.200 did was I was a broker of of raw tobacco 0:07:58.280 --> 0:08:00.920 Nation and nation. We knew we had a good chance 0:08:00.960 --> 0:08:04.280 of winning the provincial one, and we knew that their 0:08:04.280 --> 0:08:08.760 case was strong concerning the federal one, which brings us 0:08:08.760 --> 0:08:12.760 to Derek's second set of charges, the federal ones. Derek 0:08:12.920 --> 0:08:17.040 was accused of defrauding the federal Canadian government, which does 0:08:17.160 --> 0:08:20.320 levy taxes on raw tobacco. The federal issue is when 0:08:20.360 --> 0:08:24.080 you enter the border, you've got to declare and pay taxes, 0:08:24.720 --> 0:08:29.679 and they were not. So that's the federal issue they're saying. 0:08:29.680 --> 0:08:34.120 It's it's a more than a billion dollars of taxes 0:08:34.160 --> 0:08:41.080 that were not paid. The big debate on these charges 0:08:41.120 --> 0:08:44.000 came down to a simple question, who was the importer. 0:08:44.800 --> 0:08:47.080 Derek said it wasn't him, He was just the buyer. 0:08:47.600 --> 0:08:50.480 He ordered tobacco from brokers down in North Carolina and 0:08:50.520 --> 0:08:53.280 paid drivers to bring it across the border. It was 0:08:53.320 --> 0:08:55.920 on the broker and the drivers to pay those taxes. 0:08:56.640 --> 0:08:59.720 Derek claimed he only took possession of the tobacco after 0:08:59.800 --> 0:09:03.800 it is in Canada. The government, however, argued that Derek 0:09:04.160 --> 0:09:07.040 was the importer, that he had his own drivers and 0:09:07.160 --> 0:09:10.319 money runners, and that he was running a criminal organization. 0:09:11.120 --> 0:09:13.120 And one of the people the government accused of being 0:09:13.200 --> 0:09:17.280 in Derek's criminal organization was Hunter Montour, who had walked 0:09:17.280 --> 0:09:20.840 into a courtroom full of strangers. The government claimed that 0:09:20.880 --> 0:09:23.000 Hunter had helped Derek find a warehouse in New Jersey 0:09:23.040 --> 0:09:26.080 to store his contraband, and that Hunter had helped manage 0:09:26.080 --> 0:09:33.240 those shipments. My association with the cases so far like 0:09:33.960 --> 0:09:37.640 it was ridiculous, it still is. I referred him to 0:09:37.760 --> 0:09:41.600 this this place in New Jersey that I was told about, 0:09:42.600 --> 0:09:44.959 and I said, well, here's the guy, this is the 0:09:45.040 --> 0:09:47.120 number he's and he asked me, so can you call him? 0:09:47.160 --> 0:09:51.840 I shower, no big deal, and the eyes of the government. 0:09:51.880 --> 0:09:53.880 I didn't realize that that was something being that was 0:09:53.960 --> 0:09:56.439 something that you were doing that was illegal. I had 0:09:56.480 --> 0:10:01.280 no idea. It just couldn't wrap my head around what 0:10:01.280 --> 0:10:04.840 what they're saying I'm doing. I'm like, I'm just helping 0:10:04.840 --> 0:10:08.920 a friend. I got the information here it is that's 0:10:09.360 --> 0:10:17.440 gangsters um. That was the charge Hunter was facing, gangsterism 0:10:17.480 --> 0:10:21.280 aiding a criminal organization. Derek felt guilty about rupping his 0:10:21.320 --> 0:10:23.400 friend into the whole mess. I could have did that 0:10:23.520 --> 0:10:26.320 myself and I couldn't. Didn't even need Hunter involved. They 0:10:26.320 --> 0:10:28.760 didn't go online and okay, well here's a where else, 0:10:29.000 --> 0:10:30.839 store it there, and then they would send their trucks 0:10:30.840 --> 0:10:35.560 there to pick up the product and come across. Gangsterism 0:10:35.600 --> 0:10:37.880 was a steep charge, and Hunter says he was getting 0:10:37.880 --> 0:10:40.599 pressure to plead guilty, take a deal, and avoid a 0:10:40.679 --> 0:10:47.800 lengthy trial. I think it was six months with some 0:10:48.120 --> 0:10:51.280 kind of fine or something, I can't remember, and the 0:10:51.360 --> 0:10:55.520 last one was house arresting, and I told him, no, 0:10:56.160 --> 0:10:58.360 I'm not going to admit to something that I did 0:10:58.360 --> 0:11:01.160 not do. I have to. If you're saying I said, 0:11:01.240 --> 0:11:05.040 is bull, it's not even true. Said you made up 0:11:05.080 --> 0:11:08.079 have this shape, You're gonna strom me in jail, s 0:11:08.080 --> 0:11:11.160 from me in jail. But I'm not gonna admit to 0:11:11.240 --> 0:11:16.840 something that I didn't do. Derreck and Hunter's trial took 0:11:16.840 --> 0:11:20.080 place in the Montreal court House, an imposing brutalist building 0:11:20.200 --> 0:11:24.520 sandwich between Little Chinatown and the Historic District. The proceedings 0:11:24.600 --> 0:11:27.000 were presided over by a judge in a black robe 0:11:27.000 --> 0:11:29.800 and white collar. Dereck and Pierre sat on one side 0:11:29.800 --> 0:11:32.040 of the room and on the other or the Crown 0:11:32.120 --> 0:11:36.720 prosecutors representing the Canadian government. The stage was set for 0:11:36.760 --> 0:11:41.200 a court battle. Without further ado, let the fight begin, gentlemen, 0:11:41.440 --> 0:12:00.280 to your corners, hold on, We'll be right back. The 0:12:00.320 --> 0:12:03.360 Crown prosecutors took the floor first and presented their arguments 0:12:03.400 --> 0:12:07.040 before a jury, while Derek and Pierre listened patiently. The 0:12:07.040 --> 0:12:11.400 government's case relied heavily on the testimonies of investigators, undercover officers, 0:12:11.440 --> 0:12:15.640 and informants that participated in Project My Gale. Day after day, 0:12:15.760 --> 0:12:18.680 Crown prosecutors brought witnesses before the jury to prove that 0:12:18.760 --> 0:12:22.280 Derek was knowingly defrauding the government. They brought out the 0:12:22.320 --> 0:12:25.040 informant who started the whole case, who we heard earlier 0:12:25.679 --> 0:12:31.480 next week. Sure I think of any your man, Thank you, 0:12:31.480 --> 0:12:33.920 you got arrested in the United States for money laundering? 0:12:34.000 --> 0:12:37.480 Is that right? And they brought out the members of 0:12:37.480 --> 0:12:40.640 the surveillance team that intercepted Derek's phone calls and texts 0:12:40.640 --> 0:12:46.679 and read them aloud. For the journey went for the 0:12:46.920 --> 0:12:50.200 s s A, the kind of up Order services agency. 0:12:50.559 --> 0:12:54.680 I was the person that listened to the communications that 0:12:54.760 --> 0:12:58.360 were intercepted. And they brought out the undercover police officers 0:12:58.360 --> 0:13:01.040 that drove the semi trucks shut alling tobacco across the 0:13:01.080 --> 0:13:04.760 border to Derek's reservation. Next winness, you see a three 0:13:04.800 --> 0:13:08.640 three three three? Can you tell me who you work for? 0:13:08.800 --> 0:13:13.240 Right now? Uh U S Department of Homeland Security Poland 0:13:14.080 --> 0:13:20.520 Journey investigations. The Crown strategy was to show that Derek 0:13:20.640 --> 0:13:24.160 was responsible for paying the taxes, that he had violated 0:13:24.200 --> 0:13:29.120 the Excise Act and knowingly committed fraud against the Canadian government. Derek, 0:13:29.679 --> 0:13:32.880 as far as the Crown was concerned, was an importer 0:13:33.000 --> 0:13:37.880 and in the old sailor of tobacco. So the proof 0:13:38.200 --> 0:13:40.360 showed us that he had one big client, which was 0:13:41.040 --> 0:13:45.719 Jason Lee of Six Nations, and when tobacco would get 0:13:45.720 --> 0:13:48.120 to Gnawaugue, then it would be shipped to sixth Nations 0:13:48.120 --> 0:13:51.280 by one of Derek's drivers, and he wouldn't make the 0:13:51.280 --> 0:13:53.960 profit on the sale of the tobacco. One way the 0:13:53.960 --> 0:13:57.240 government tried to prove Derek's wrongdoing and deliberate fraud was 0:13:57.280 --> 0:14:00.679 his alleged use of code words word like pizza dough, 0:14:00.840 --> 0:14:04.920 moose meat, racing tires, golf clubs. One of the cool 0:14:05.000 --> 0:14:07.640 words is the pizza will be ready for Friday, for example. 0:14:08.400 --> 0:14:11.640 It was nothing very complicated. So you put this, and 0:14:11.679 --> 0:14:13.480 you put the fact that Friday there was a deliver 0:14:13.559 --> 0:14:15.319 at to back when the sixth nation. You put two 0:14:15.320 --> 0:14:20.000 and two together and that's nothing very complicated. But Derek 0:14:20.120 --> 0:14:22.440 had an explanation for those code words. What does pizza 0:14:22.520 --> 0:14:26.840 dough mean by sell pizza? It was it started off 0:14:27.120 --> 0:14:30.040 it was pizza that I was bringing from this. They 0:14:30.080 --> 0:14:32.880 never mentioned about the cheese or stuff like that, sauce 0:14:33.080 --> 0:14:35.520 because everything we bring in is mostly from the States, 0:14:36.320 --> 0:14:40.920 so it kind of started from there. I think the 0:14:41.320 --> 0:14:44.720 government just use that as proof that you were speaking 0:14:44.720 --> 0:14:50.040 in code. Yeah, whatever, the moose meats in the cooler 0:14:50.080 --> 0:14:54.040 I was buying Actually I was buying moose meat from Hunter. 0:14:54.720 --> 0:14:57.960 So a lot of the conversations that we're doing here, 0:14:58.120 --> 0:15:04.000 even here under reserve. They suspected that it was tobacco, 0:15:04.960 --> 0:15:08.440 but which we do sell all these kind of you know, 0:15:08.600 --> 0:15:11.600 all these kind of things that we're talking about, the pizza, 0:15:12.120 --> 0:15:15.280 the meat. I have a butcher shop, you know, I 0:15:15.360 --> 0:15:19.480 have a pizza restaurant, everything, So they thought we were 0:15:19.520 --> 0:15:25.440 talking about tobacco, but really it was actual food. To 0:15:25.480 --> 0:15:28.240 be perfectly honest, when I asked Derek about those code words, 0:15:28.520 --> 0:15:31.480 I hadn't actually heard the phone tape or text. All 0:15:31.480 --> 0:15:34.120 he had were local media reports, and I really did 0:15:34.200 --> 0:15:36.960 think Derek was telling the truth. This was just the 0:15:37.000 --> 0:15:39.720 way that folks in Gottawage talked, and if you take 0:15:39.760 --> 0:15:43.000 anything out of context, it's gonna look bad. But a 0:15:43.000 --> 0:15:45.200 few months later we got the tapes from the trial, 0:15:45.680 --> 0:15:48.640 and the code words, well they started sounding a little 0:15:48.720 --> 0:15:53.560 less innocent. I'm sending moost meat soon period. Tell the 0:15:53.680 --> 0:16:00.320 old man it's O D one period. Pezza truck wrote 0:16:00.400 --> 0:16:06.320 down hopefully Tuesday or Wednesday, t will be there for lunch. 0:16:07.440 --> 0:16:10.040 There was so much coded language that even the undercover 0:16:10.120 --> 0:16:13.720 police got confused. In one operation, an undercover truck driver 0:16:13.800 --> 0:16:16.480 accidentally picked up a load of salt instead of tobacco 0:16:16.760 --> 0:16:19.360 because he didn't use the right code word at the warehouse. 0:16:20.400 --> 0:16:22.640 Once I'd heard the tapes, I had to ask Derek 0:16:22.680 --> 0:16:25.160 about it again, and his answer was a bit different 0:16:25.160 --> 0:16:27.440 than what he'd said originally. I don't know. I guess 0:16:27.440 --> 0:16:30.160 it's kind of uh make makes a little bit more 0:16:30.200 --> 0:16:34.080 exciting if you are again, uh, you don't know if 0:16:34.120 --> 0:16:36.680 those guys are being uh, you know, watched or what. 0:16:36.880 --> 0:16:43.360 So that's you know, that's how they that That's the 0:16:43.400 --> 0:16:48.720 way they they do everything is they use cold words, 0:16:48.760 --> 0:16:55.520 and so I just followed what they say. Derek was 0:16:55.560 --> 0:16:58.200 admitting that, yes, he did use the code words. They 0:16:58.200 --> 0:17:00.720 made the whole thing feel like a movie, and more importantly, 0:17:00.920 --> 0:17:03.040 it was the way his truck drivers and brokers spoke. 0:17:03.720 --> 0:17:06.919 Derek was just following their example. But the fact that 0:17:06.960 --> 0:17:10.359 he used code words doesn't make him a criminal. Being 0:17:10.440 --> 0:17:14.800 shady isn't a crime. Derek has rights as a native person. 0:17:15.160 --> 0:17:17.120 The way he sees it, he doesn't have to pay 0:17:17.160 --> 0:17:20.280 taxes to the Canadian government, especially on something as traditional 0:17:20.320 --> 0:17:23.280 as tobacco. He says. The fact that he's using code 0:17:23.280 --> 0:17:25.840 words and trying to do things under the radar is 0:17:25.880 --> 0:17:28.960 because the government refuses to acknowledge his rights. They won't 0:17:29.040 --> 0:17:32.960 let us exercise our rights. They think we're criminals. They 0:17:33.000 --> 0:17:36.680 want to make us look like criminals and their eyes 0:17:36.800 --> 0:17:39.960 were doing something wrong, But in our eyes, it's what 0:17:40.200 --> 0:17:45.879 we were. Um. I was brought up in this in 0:17:46.480 --> 0:17:51.960 the tobacco trade with my grandmother. So from as far 0:17:52.080 --> 0:17:55.800 as I remember, this is all legal stuff, you know. 0:17:56.640 --> 0:17:58.720 So if I pulled up at the border coming from 0:17:58.760 --> 0:18:01.080 the States and m yeah, I got a trunk full 0:18:01.119 --> 0:18:05.240 of tobacco, They're gonna arrest me. They just they put 0:18:05.280 --> 0:18:08.000 their own boarder there. They put their own taxes on 0:18:08.119 --> 0:18:12.960 the cigarettes and stuff like that. It's for the government's Uh, 0:18:13.480 --> 0:18:16.000 they're dire the only one that's benefiting from it. But 0:18:16.359 --> 0:18:19.520 this wasn't a trial over indigenous history and constitutional rights. 0:18:19.880 --> 0:18:22.800 It was a criminal trial over tax evasion. It was 0:18:22.840 --> 0:18:26.080 being heard in a courthouse based on Canadian laws and procedures, 0:18:26.440 --> 0:18:29.960 not Mohawk ones. Despite Derek's firm belief that he was 0:18:30.000 --> 0:18:32.200 in the right, it would ultimately be up to a 0:18:32.280 --> 0:18:35.479 jury to decide, and after months of hearing arguments from 0:18:35.520 --> 0:18:38.960 both sides, that jury was finally ready to present a verdict. 0:18:40.200 --> 0:18:55.560 That's after the break jury we even told that pronounced 0:18:55.560 --> 0:19:03.080 your verdict. Yes, so Mr White, Mr Derek White, and 0:19:03.160 --> 0:19:10.200 Mr aunt Montal to send up, ladies and gentlemen, o 0:19:10.359 --> 0:19:16.879 the really will speaking on it will be all the 0:19:16.960 --> 0:19:20.520 members of the injury and agreement on their verdict. Yes, yes, 0:19:22.119 --> 0:19:25.679 so there White because conspiracy to their crotic government can 0:19:26.040 --> 0:19:33.960 get it. I've gotten Ober five. So there White probed 0:19:34.000 --> 0:19:36.840 against the government to then when you're building it's not 0:19:42.000 --> 0:19:44.879 on council conspiracy to defraud the government of Quebec and 0:19:44.960 --> 0:19:47.879 of committing fraud against the Government of Quebec. Derek White 0:19:48.119 --> 0:19:52.760 was found not guilty. He had beaten the provincial charges. 0:19:53.359 --> 0:19:57.040 And remember Derek's lawyer getting all excited and pumping his 0:19:57.160 --> 0:19:59.520 fists and it was was really happy. So I'm like, well, 0:19:59.560 --> 0:20:04.000 that's to be a good thing. I mean, we were 0:20:04.160 --> 0:20:08.639 very confident in winning the provincial side because they got 0:20:08.720 --> 0:20:14.600 approved that the manufactured products are sold true Quebec and 0:20:14.760 --> 0:20:18.880 their evidence was very weak, so we got that part. 0:20:19.320 --> 0:20:22.479 The provincial government of Quebec only levied taxes on finished 0:20:22.520 --> 0:20:27.440 products manufactured cigarettes, and Derek only ever sold wholesale raw tobacco. 0:20:28.320 --> 0:20:31.040 The government couldn't prove that he actually owed the forty 0:20:31.119 --> 0:20:33.360 four million dollars in taxes that they claimed he did, 0:20:34.000 --> 0:20:37.040 and the jury took Derek's side, and if we were 0:20:37.200 --> 0:20:40.399 very lucky, would have won everything. Unfortunately, Derek still had 0:20:40.480 --> 0:20:43.800 federal charges hanging over his head, the small issue of 0:20:43.920 --> 0:20:47.840 five hundred million dollars innovated taxes owed to the federal 0:20:47.960 --> 0:20:54.200 government of Canada. So oncou number one from some Derek 0:20:54.359 --> 0:20:58.960 white top skating con activities of a criminal organization? What 0:20:59.160 --> 0:21:05.240 is your guilty I'm talking about to mister n Termoto, 0:21:05.600 --> 0:21:10.320 facilitating the activities of criminal organization? What is your real guilty? 0:21:12.240 --> 0:21:16.119 I'm coming abo three. So they required conspiracy to defer 0:21:16.280 --> 0:21:21.560 the government of Canada. What is your limit guilty? Thank you? 0:21:24.400 --> 0:21:26.960 After hearing the slew of evidence on the structure of 0:21:27.040 --> 0:21:30.920 Derek's organization and the involvement he had in the tobacco shipments, 0:21:31.400 --> 0:21:34.920 the jury had decided that Derek was indeed the importer, 0:21:35.680 --> 0:21:39.080 which meant it wasn't the broker's or the driver's responsibility 0:21:39.119 --> 0:21:44.240 to pay taxes at the border, it was Derek's. I thought, 0:21:44.280 --> 0:21:46.600 for sure, we're going to get off on both, you know, 0:21:47.080 --> 0:21:52.000 federal and provincial. Was just shocked at we were found 0:21:52.000 --> 0:21:56.320 guilty on the federal site because it's basically the same argument. 0:21:56.359 --> 0:21:59.320 It's the same thing. You know, I didn't drive the 0:21:59.400 --> 0:22:03.560 fucking truck across the border. All I did was when 0:22:03.680 --> 0:22:06.440 the product got here, I would just send the money. 0:22:07.200 --> 0:22:11.000 So it's delivered to the reserve. It's pax free. Hunter 0:22:11.119 --> 0:22:13.320 had also been found guilty of a gangsters in charge 0:22:13.560 --> 0:22:17.439 of aiding Derek's criminal organization. Together, they were looking at 0:22:17.600 --> 0:22:22.159 years in prison, but Derek had a planned for this 0:22:22.720 --> 0:22:25.879 which had been set in motion months earlier. It was 0:22:25.920 --> 0:22:27.520 a plan that would keep him out of a jail 0:22:27.560 --> 0:22:31.920 cell and postponed sentencing. More importantly, it was a legal 0:22:32.040 --> 0:22:34.440 option that would allow him to argue his native rights 0:22:34.520 --> 0:22:38.600 before a judge. Derek was going to file a constitutional 0:22:38.720 --> 0:22:44.240 challenge Tuesday before. We don't have any anything to sip 0:22:44.359 --> 0:22:48.160 because it's been all scheduled for the constitutional challenge. Thank 0:22:48.200 --> 0:22:51.880 you very much, and we will come and so I'll 0:22:52.240 --> 0:22:56.760 see you in June. Like from day one, we knew 0:22:56.840 --> 0:23:00.680 that our second step was to go to challenge the 0:23:00.720 --> 0:23:05.560 constitutional issue, so we had all rehired the constitutional lawyer. 0:23:05.600 --> 0:23:07.720 In all this, Derek was going to fight his federal 0:23:07.840 --> 0:23:11.240 charges on the grounds of the Canadian Constitution. Itself. He 0:23:11.480 --> 0:23:14.119 wasn't trying to prove that he didn't bring tobacco across 0:23:14.119 --> 0:23:16.800 the border without paying taxes. He was going to try 0:23:16.840 --> 0:23:19.520 to prove that the tax laws didn't apply to him 0:23:19.960 --> 0:23:22.840 and that trading tobacco tax free was his right as 0:23:22.880 --> 0:23:26.600 a Native person. No tobacco case had ever come as 0:23:26.640 --> 0:23:28.920 far in the Canadian legal system. And what are the 0:23:28.960 --> 0:23:32.600 implications of this case if they win or lose. If 0:23:32.680 --> 0:23:35.919 they win, and basically bacco trade will be legal for walks, 0:23:36.119 --> 0:23:41.479 they won't need they won't need permits from the federal 0:23:41.560 --> 0:23:45.080 or provincial governments, and they'll be able to deal into tobacco. 0:23:45.960 --> 0:23:50.080 If Derrick loses, then it's he's gonna have to face 0:23:50.119 --> 0:23:53.119 the sentence and go to jail. Well, why should I 0:23:53.240 --> 0:23:56.800 plead to something that uh, I've I think that it's um, 0:23:57.320 --> 0:24:01.040 I'm not doing anything wrong. I mean, we're exercising our 0:24:01.160 --> 0:24:04.760 rights as Native people. Then we'll see who's ready to 0:24:04.880 --> 0:24:08.119 keep fighting and go on how far you want to go. 0:24:09.440 --> 0:24:12.760 It's not about standing in the tree line and trying 0:24:12.800 --> 0:24:15.119 to scare army guys. This is a this is the 0:24:15.160 --> 0:24:19.360 way things are done now. This is the fight tobacco. 0:24:19.359 --> 0:24:23.120 Who is our is our trade. I mean, like I said, 0:24:23.160 --> 0:24:25.600 it's still going on today and it's not gonna stop. 0:24:26.200 --> 0:24:29.120 I mean, it's tobacco. Who it's our rights. We're gonna 0:24:29.440 --> 0:24:37.119 continue selling tobacco and they ain't gonna stop us. It 0:24:37.200 --> 0:24:38.960 seems like you don't, you know, put a lot of 0:24:39.000 --> 0:24:41.520 stock in his argument that he's standing up for Native 0:24:41.600 --> 0:24:48.200 rights in this I won't be right to say, don't 0:24:48.200 --> 0:24:52.600 add that. Jimmy the anonymous investigator who worked on My Gil. 0:24:53.640 --> 0:24:57.480 It makes my skin crawl when I hear people say 0:24:58.040 --> 0:25:02.280 there's some kind of Native America in warrior, some kind 0:25:02.320 --> 0:25:05.440 of social Native American warrior. They're doing it for the 0:25:05.560 --> 0:25:13.640 fucking money, period, end of story. Yeah, he's not Robin Hood. 0:25:13.800 --> 0:25:16.560 He's not getting money from the rich guys and giving 0:25:16.600 --> 0:25:19.480 it to the poor. That's a social hero, not some 0:25:19.720 --> 0:25:25.200 asshole who pays people organized crime figures and and Hell's 0:25:25.280 --> 0:25:29.399 Angels and people to smuggle across the border. He was 0:25:29.720 --> 0:25:34.119 increasing his wealth and the tribe saw nothing from it. 0:25:35.000 --> 0:25:38.800 So when he makes representations that he's some kind of warrior, 0:25:39.440 --> 0:25:45.679 you know what, I disagree. Derrick White and other natives 0:25:45.760 --> 0:25:49.120 like that would have my respect if they drove down 0:25:49.160 --> 0:25:52.200 to North Carolina and bought a tractor trailer load of 0:25:52.280 --> 0:25:56.440 tobacco under their own name, with a good bill of lading, 0:25:57.359 --> 0:26:00.560 and drove to Canada. And when they got to the 0:26:00.640 --> 0:26:04.120 Canadian Border Services and the agent at the border said, 0:26:05.359 --> 0:26:08.360 what do you got back there? If Derek White would 0:26:08.400 --> 0:26:10.640 have looked at that agent and said, I have cut 0:26:10.760 --> 0:26:14.000