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Speaker 1: M Hey everybody, I'm Robert Evans, and this is once

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Speaker 1: again Behind the Bastards, the show where we tell you

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Speaker 1: everything you don't know about the very worst people in

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Speaker 1: all of history. Now, this is a story, or this

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Speaker 1: is a podcast, I should say, where I read a

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Speaker 1: story about someone terrible, about something terrible that was done,

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Speaker 1: and then get really really really really really deep into it.

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Speaker 1: And today my guest who is coming in cold to

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Speaker 1: this tale is Andrew t Man. Oh great, you know

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Speaker 1: this is my second time on the show, but after

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Speaker 1: the first time, I learned fucking steal yourself. Yeah yeah,

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Speaker 1: buckle in dark, get ready for the roller coaster. Well,

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Speaker 1: your last episode with us was our epic two partter

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Speaker 1: on King Leopold of Belgium, who killed like thirteen million people,

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Speaker 1: half of all of the people in Central Africa because

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Speaker 1: he wanted rubber, sweet sweet rubber dollars. The reward is

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Speaker 1: always so ludicrous when you're even when you think of

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Speaker 1: it as money or like, really, now, he didn't really

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Speaker 1: intend to kill that many people, but he new, yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: he accepted that what the cost is. Today we're talking

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Speaker 1: about another genocide, one that was accidental, done by well meaning,

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Speaker 1: nice people. Who thought that they were making the world

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Speaker 1: a better place. So that's going to be really fun. Yeah. Now,

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Speaker 1: on November seventeen eighteen, a young emergency medical technician and

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Speaker 1: Christian missionary named John ellen Chow traveled to North Centinel Island,

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Speaker 1: and isolated island in India's and Uman Islands and tried

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Speaker 1: to preach the gospel of Jesus Christ to the natives

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Speaker 1: there in. Unfortunately, the centinelis people had no desire to

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Speaker 1: hear this gospel and even less desire to let some

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Speaker 1: stranger onto their island. They shot him to death with arrows,

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Speaker 1: and shortly thereafter his story went viral on the internet.

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Speaker 1: I'm gonna guess you ran into this at least. Oh yeah,

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Speaker 1: I was gonna say without without marking this too close

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Speaker 1: in time. When I talked about this on you as

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Speaker 1: this racist, I half asked so many of the facts

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Speaker 1: because I just did. I was like, I think I

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Speaker 1: know what's happening here. So I'm actually very glad to

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Speaker 1: be with someone who did research and knows what the

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Speaker 1: funk they're talking about. I read a lot about on

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Speaker 1: ellen Chow, but this episode is not going to be

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Speaker 1: particularly about him. It is it is about why I

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Speaker 1: think it's fair to call him a bastard, but this

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Speaker 1: is actually about we're talking about the tales of the

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Speaker 1: Andaman Islands. This entire island chain where he was North

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Speaker 1: Sentinel Island is located in kind the history that I

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Speaker 1: think John ni going into this or even not like yeah,

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Speaker 1: you can still just be like, hey, maybe leave people alone.

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Speaker 1: If they shoot at everyone who lands on there, maybe

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Speaker 1: maybe leave him alone. I guess that's just the Devil

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Speaker 1: telling you you need to talk to these people extra hard. Well,

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Speaker 1: he did say the Devil was this was like that

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Speaker 1: one of his last strong yeah, something like that the

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Speaker 1: writing he did before he yeah, yeah, I will let

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Speaker 1: me just take the opportunity because I figure this is

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Speaker 1: the time he's one of the worst Asian people. I

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Speaker 1: just I I always feel like bad when like Asian

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Speaker 1: folks take on like this like white saviory collodialist hyper

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Speaker 1: role and like this guy is extra in it. The

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Speaker 1: last strongholds of the Devil, Yeah something something I thought

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Speaker 1: that was his exact phrasing, but something similar to that.

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Speaker 1: I guess to be fair, if Homeboy had come to

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Speaker 1: one of the other ones my apartment, I would have

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Speaker 1: shot him with an arrow too. So you're famous for that. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: that's what I do. Yeah, that's actually why we brought

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Speaker 1: you on. There's gonna be a lot of talk of

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Speaker 1: arrows today. Uh So. The immediate response for much of

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Speaker 1: the Internet to John Chow's journey and death was distaste

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Speaker 1: and even hatred for his actions. People called him a colonizer.

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Speaker 1: Some people attacked him as a bad person for recklessly

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Speaker 1: risking the lives of everyone on that island by exposing

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Speaker 1: their stone age immune systems to his twenty first century pathogens.

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Speaker 1: Uh In the days since his death, the Indian government

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Speaker 1: has failed to recover his body and announced that they

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Speaker 1: will no longer attempt to do so. His religious compatriots,

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Speaker 1: who will talk more about later, have been kind of torn.

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Speaker 1: There have been, in total fairness, a lot of Christians

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Speaker 1: and even a lot of Christians in the missionary community

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Speaker 1: who have been like, it's really clear, these people don't

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Speaker 1: want to talk to us. This was a bad call.

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Speaker 1: But a lot have also risen up to defend him

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Speaker 1: and have written articles Christianity Today and The Washington Post

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Speaker 1: pointing out that John Chow was hardly some thoughtless adventure.

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Speaker 1: They know that he trained as a wilderness EMT before

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Speaker 1: going They know that he took linguistics training. They note

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Speaker 1: that he got heavily vaccinated and spent time in what

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Speaker 1: is vaguely described as a quarantine before going over there.

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Speaker 1: So their argument seems to be that no, no, no,

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Speaker 1: he's not he this was an act of love, and

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Speaker 1: this was something he prepared for heavily. And I think

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Speaker 1: the fact that he prepared for it so heavily is

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Speaker 1: kind of what condemns him in my eyes, because he

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Speaker 1: will have known the history that to today. So wait,

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Speaker 1: as far as let me just reach back into a

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Speaker 1: tiny bit of biology training too, It's like if he

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Speaker 1: made himself heavily vaccinated, that makes him more likely to

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Speaker 1: be carrying the pathogens that there. These people are not vaccinated.

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Speaker 1: No no no, no, no no, because that's the great things

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Speaker 1: That's why vaccines are helpful, is that like there's people

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Speaker 1: who can't get vaccinated with datating systems and then you

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Speaker 1: can't spread the flu to them. It's one of those things. Uh.

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Speaker 1: It sounds like he put in a lot of work

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Speaker 1: to try to be safe to them, but also like

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Speaker 1: I went through e m T training, it does not

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Speaker 1: include how to do a quarantine on yourself. You can

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Speaker 1: contact health. That's not part of the E. M. T.

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Speaker 1: P Y Jesus. So. The first European to describe the

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Speaker 1: Andaman Islands was Marco Polo. He said that the people

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Speaker 1: there were quote a brutish and savage race, having heads,

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Speaker 1: eyes and teeth like those of dogs. They are very

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Speaker 1: cruel and kill and eate every foreigner whom they can

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Speaker 1: lay their hands upon. Now, old Marco was not one

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Speaker 1: for actual field research. Historians suspect that he basically heard

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Speaker 1: some vague rumors and then reported on them as if

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Speaker 1: they were his own findings, which kind of have the

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Speaker 1: whole Marco Polo thing but the brand. So that's okay,

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Speaker 1: that's what you do. And as a hack and a fraud,

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Speaker 1: I appreciate fraud. So there is clearly a neugget of

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Speaker 1: truth there. And I think he probably did talk to

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Speaker 1: some people who had been around the Anaman Islands, some

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Speaker 1: like Indians who had been in that area, because what

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Speaker 1: he says about them murdering every foreigner they can get

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Speaker 1: their hands on is one of the through lines of

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Speaker 1: this story because in the centuries before they were contacted,

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Speaker 1: anytime someone got close to the Andamans. It was just

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Speaker 1: shooting like that has been the whole island Shane's policy

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Speaker 1: for quite a while now. The animate islands are located

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Speaker 1: in the Bay of Bengal, which is to India with

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Speaker 1: the Gulf of Mexico is to the United States. Only.

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Speaker 1: While the Gulf of Mexico has been turned into a

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Speaker 1: floating pile of garbage and flesh eating bacteria by the filthy,

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Speaker 1: filthy people of the East Coast, the Bay of Bengal

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Speaker 1: is not one endless oil spill, although I'm sure it has.

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Speaker 1: It's probably will be. It will be everything, will they Yeah,

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Speaker 1: don't worry once we catch them up, Yeah to our

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Speaker 1: cool society, we'll get them on the same train. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: You guys should see what we did to the Gulf

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Speaker 1: in Texas. People lose their skin. They all deserve the

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Speaker 1: luxury of the worst that nature can do. That is

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Speaker 1: the beauty of our system. Um. Now, the animans are

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Speaker 1: kind of in the middle of the bay, closer to

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Speaker 1: Thailand than the mainland of the Indian subcontinent. In other words,

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Speaker 1: geographically speaking, there in the middle of nowhere, east of Jesus,

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Speaker 1: isolated as fun so it's easy to understand why. It

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Speaker 1: wasn't until seventeen seventy one that the grasping hand of

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Speaker 1: colonialism first realized that there was ship worths doling there.

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Speaker 1: So this is one of the latest parts in the

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Speaker 1: globe that, like colonial people start to explore such a

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Speaker 1: pain in the ask that resources are. It's probably relatively small,

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Speaker 1: if I'm recalling that, it's very small, not having pretty

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Speaker 1: good boats to get out there. People aren't doing this

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Speaker 1: in the fift're white people aren't. Yeah, seventeen rubber not enough,

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Speaker 1: sweet sweet rubber, although that was later than this as well.

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Speaker 1: We were congo at this. Not enough. I mean the

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Speaker 1: Portuguese's a copper Yeah, definitely not enough copper for our desires.

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Speaker 1: I don't know that actually, but I assume they don't

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Speaker 1: have much copper. I feel like, you know, in terms

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Speaker 1: of ease of boat murder. Yeah, not worth it. I've

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Speaker 1: known a couple of people from the animals and they

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Speaker 1: didn't look like they had a lot of copper. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: and individually, I mean, neither do any of us. And

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Speaker 1: I think we have copper. That may be a bad

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Speaker 1: way to judge that. I literally I haven't had a

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Speaker 1: copper in years, so seventeen anyone is the year that

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Speaker 1: the East India Company frequent Yeah, yeah, you guys do

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Speaker 1: you guys have a musical sting for them? Yet we

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Speaker 1: should there should be like a dune dune dun for

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Speaker 1: the recurring characters. East India has got to be right

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Speaker 1: up there, because yeah, as soon as the British East

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Speaker 1: India Company comes into a story, you know there's going

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Speaker 1: to be some genocide. You know, there's gonna be some genocide,

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Speaker 1: and it's gonna be really half as that's their number

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Speaker 1: one brand. Yeah, is half asked genocide. Yeah, the British

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Speaker 1: Empire could best be described as slow Nazis in terms

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Speaker 1: of like their death toll, Like they didn't do it

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Speaker 1: at a hate. It was just like, oh, we accidentally

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Speaker 1: fucked up all the agriculture in India and thirty million

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Speaker 1: people died. Are bad? Yeah, yeah, like accident, the accidental Nazi,

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Speaker 1: the accidental slow Nazi. So the East India Company survey

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Speaker 1: ship Diligent first sale past North centonl Island in seventeen

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Speaker 1: seventy one, it reported, and that's the island, of course

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Speaker 1: where John Chow was killed with the Sentinelis tribe and such.

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Speaker 1: It reported quote a multitude of lights upon the shore,

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Speaker 1: so it seemed to be heavily populated. At this point,

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Speaker 1: the ship rolled on without stopping because when it got

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Speaker 1: too close to other islands people had shot arrows at

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Speaker 1: the boat. For a long time, the animals in general

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Speaker 1: were too far away into dangerous to be worth exploding exploiting.

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Speaker 1: So the East India Company for yeah, well either they

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Speaker 1: find it in seventeen seventy one, but the British don't

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Speaker 1: really do anything about it. Like the middle of nowhere,

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Speaker 1: everybody's shooting at us. Why take that stress on? Yeah,

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Speaker 1: you have to be a pretty small island for the

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Speaker 1: British to be like not worth here. They really, we're

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Speaker 1: not good at leaving tiny island chain. Yeah, they love it.

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Speaker 1: They love that ship. So it was not until December

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Speaker 1: eighteen fifty seven when colonialism actually started to take an

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Speaker 1: interest in the animals. That's when another ship from the

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Speaker 1: East India Company, a steamer named the Pluto, came barreling

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Speaker 1: through the waters of the Andaman Islands. The boat had

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Speaker 1: been sent from the capital of company controlled India, Calcutta,

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Speaker 1: to study the islands and see if they might be

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Speaker 1: a good place to put one of the penal colonies

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Speaker 1: that British were so very long. Cool, they love them

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Speaker 1: some if you if you've ever talked to about Australia

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Speaker 1: the British colonies, Yeah, I mean we got the Mad

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Speaker 1: Max movies out of that, so it's not all bad. Yeah. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: there was some genocide, a lot of genocide, actually a

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Speaker 1: huge amount of genocide on going up to the present moment.

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Speaker 1: But Max, but so Push pretty good movies. Push. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: you gotta take what you can. That's right out of history. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: the Bright Shining Lights. Yeah. And you know, Fosters isn't

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Speaker 1: a good beer, but I have been places where it's

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Speaker 1: the best beer, and those are sad places, but they're

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Speaker 1: places where you need beer. Yeah. I guess they do

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Speaker 1: those meat pies where they pour soup on them. Oh cool.

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Speaker 1: I don't know about that, but I feel like you could.

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Speaker 1: You could have done that in Newcastle too, so yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: I feel like that's probably a British thing they just stole.

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Speaker 1: Well they're British, but they took along with them. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: So at that point in history eighteen fifty seven, the

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Speaker 1: Indian subcontinent was busy being convulsed by the Sepoy rebellion,

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Speaker 1: a bloody mutiny of the East India companies, Indu and

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Speaker 1: Muslim troops, sparked by the fact that the British had

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Speaker 1: not told these very religious colonial soldiers that they relied

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Speaker 1: on in order to keep control in their colonies that

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Speaker 1: the Ammo cartridges they used were soaked in pig and

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Speaker 1: cow fat. So they went out of their way to

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Speaker 1: not tell Hindu and Muslim soldiers that like the act

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Speaker 1: of using the bullets that they were being issued with

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Speaker 1: them to violate there was, so there was there was

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Speaker 1: a little bit of a rebellion and such, which is

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Speaker 1: so funny too because it's like, hey, that ship is

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Speaker 1: fucking superstition man like you, you would risk your already

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Speaker 1: tenuous hold on these fucking murder sellouts by having them

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Speaker 1: violate there. I guess. I guess the trick there was

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Speaker 1: to have Muslim troops kill Hindu civilians and vice versa.

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Speaker 1: I mean, that's what they did in the whole empire.

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Speaker 1: You would try to get troops like That's how it

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Speaker 1: were Idi Amine came from. It's like his trade and

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Speaker 1: you're like, oh, we can send them to other parts

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Speaker 1: of Africa and they'll give a just let the sectarianism continue.

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Speaker 1: That was all. That's colonialism and shell But they were

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Speaker 1: not always good at it, as the Sepoy rebellion is

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Speaker 1: evidence of. We'll talk about that in more detail in

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Speaker 1: another episode, but you know today that that's what's happening.

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Speaker 1: That's why they need penal colonies. Uh so that bay

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Speaker 1: In eighteen fifty seven, the Pluto comes, you know, rolling

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Speaker 1: through the animals. The journey had been pretty good for

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Speaker 1: most of its length. The crew was very multinational, not

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Speaker 1: just British people, but a lot of like Indians and

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Speaker 1: stuff like it was it was a pretty mixed multicultural

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Speaker 1: more diversity in our slave ships. Well they were sailors,

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Speaker 1: they're getting paid, sure, yeah, yeah, are not a slave

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Speaker 1: ships are fucking colonial? Yeah, quasi paramilitary navy ish yeah

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Speaker 1: style vessels. Yeah yeah, that's a better attitude. Not two

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Speaker 1: similar to the Nostromo, I guess no, Actually a lot

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Speaker 1: like the Nostromo. Yeah, there's a lot like that. I've

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Speaker 1: read a lot of detail about their Their ship had

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Speaker 1: a band and stuff. They didn't have a cap, but

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Speaker 1: they had a dog. It's kind of like the Nostromo.

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Speaker 1: If the alien was the one that you owned up

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Speaker 1: sympathetic for. Well you don't. We got this movie, okay,

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Speaker 1: So yeah, the crew had yeah, but sailing around the

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Speaker 1: islands looking for places to put a penal colony. And

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Speaker 1: then when they were near the end of their expedition,

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Speaker 1: the Pluto man ran smack dab into a group of

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Speaker 1: several animon ees fishermen hanging out in canoes doing their thing. Now,

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Speaker 1: this was the first interaction any East Indian personnel, and

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Speaker 1: I think any Europeans had ever had with antimonies people.

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Speaker 1: They'd spotted a few tribesmen and women during their voyage

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Speaker 1: from like the water, but always at a distance. And

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Speaker 1: what glimpses that usually had ended in an animate e

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Speaker 1: shooting arrows at them. When when was this this was? So?

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Speaker 1: What were arms like for European folks? Pretty good, pretty

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Speaker 1: decent rifles at that you're talking like civil war level technology.

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Speaker 1: Rival is a pretty formidable thing. Yeah, so it's still yeah,

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Speaker 1: so a lot of a lot of flintlock rifles and

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Speaker 1: stuff like that. You know. So maybe they had muskets

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Speaker 1: or whatever. I don't know how advanced the firearm the count,

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Speaker 1: but there was they had got that point. Yeah, they

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Speaker 1: had guns, and they were probably pretty decent. So the

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Speaker 1: Pluto saw the fisherman as an opportunity to make first contact,

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Speaker 1: which they thought was really exciting. There, so we get

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Speaker 1: to talk to these and they it seems like they

285
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Speaker 1: were probably good intentions with these guys, who are like, Oh,

286
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Speaker 1: it's exciting, we'll get to meet you know, the human beings.

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Speaker 1: That's a really cool thing for us to be able

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Speaker 1: to do. So they sent out a couple of long

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Speaker 1: boats filled with men, including the chairman of the Andaman Committee,

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Speaker 1: which was the group of people running this boat to

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Speaker 1: the Andaman Committee, because it's a corporation, so you've got

292
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Speaker 1: you know, you've got your board of directors for the boat.

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Speaker 1: So it's a little bit like a SpaceX. This is

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Speaker 1: exactly like how SpaceX would have explored exactly this is

295
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Speaker 1: this is exactly that sort of situation. Uh so I

296
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Speaker 1: could what could go wrong? So they get out on

297
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Speaker 1: their boats and they're sailing towards these Andiman fishermen who

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Speaker 1: are just a little dugout canoes and like the canoes

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Speaker 1: that these people use, they're taking like trees that they

300
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Speaker 1: chopped down tropical hardwoods and for months carving out the

301
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Speaker 1: center of the tree to make a canoe. So these

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Speaker 1: are pretty primitive boats, pretty low tech people. Um and

303
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Speaker 1: so yeah, they sail out to them with like a

304
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Speaker 1: couple of dozen dudes, and the chairman of the Andaman

305
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Speaker 1: Committee waves his white handkerchief the fisherman and hopes that

306
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Speaker 1: they will know that this means peace, even though they're

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Speaker 1: an uncontacted Stone tribe. Who does in most cases, I

308
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Speaker 1: don't think most of these tribes even had writing, so

309
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Speaker 1: kind of a stretch to assume the new little white

310
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Speaker 1: flags or a flag because they don't have nations. I

311
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Speaker 1: guess they have cloth. They do, they don't wear anything.

312
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Speaker 1: They naked. They wear jewelry and stuff, but they don't

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Speaker 1: really wear clothing. Yeah, they're not making much in the

314
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Speaker 1: way of cloth. They sure don't have flags. Um. So

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Speaker 1: this guy waves his white handkerchief at the fisherman and

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Speaker 1: they have no idea what he's doing, so they just

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Speaker 1: start shooting at them, which is what they do and

318
00:15:49,320 --> 00:15:51,880
Speaker 1: why in eighteen fifty seven they're one of the only

319
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Speaker 1: people who have not been fucked with bi colonialism because

320
00:15:54,400 --> 00:15:57,520
Speaker 1: they try to murder everyone. It's a smart strategy. So

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Speaker 1: they do the thing that's always worked before, and they

322
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Speaker 1: start shooting at these guys, but the company men fire

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Speaker 1: back with you know, pretty modern guns and stuff. So

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Speaker 1: they kill three and amones, including the chief uh and

325
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Speaker 1: he's described by the men who were there as having

326
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Speaker 1: fallen back in his canoe quote almost with the dignity

327
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Speaker 1: of Caesar. So they're sad that they have to do this,

328
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Speaker 1: but they, you know, they open fire. I don't think

329
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Speaker 1: the anemies kill any but a bunch of these guys

330
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Speaker 1: get injured by their own men because one of the

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Speaker 1: boat's fires on the other boat in a panic because

332
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Speaker 1: they're not you know, the East India companies getting the

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Speaker 1: cheapest soldiers. They generally can't good fire even with good soldiers. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: good fire. Guess what folks, To this day gunfire is

335
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Speaker 1: insanely unpredictable. Well and yeah, I mean you look at

336
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Speaker 1: like desert storm and we probably lost more men to

337
00:16:42,400 --> 00:16:45,720
Speaker 1: our own rockets setting them than giving the iraqis. It's

338
00:16:45,760 --> 00:16:49,120
Speaker 1: it's pretty common today, so no one seems to know how.

339
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Speaker 1: But during this brief fight with the enemy's, one of

340
00:16:52,200 --> 00:16:55,320
Speaker 1: the enemies fishermen wound up on the company's boat or

341
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Speaker 1: in a company long boat. I want to quote from

342
00:16:57,600 --> 00:17:01,200
Speaker 1: a tremendously fine article in The Americans Scholar titled quote

343
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Speaker 1: the Last Island of the Savages, which is the best

344
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Speaker 1: thing anyone's written on the Ennemans on this aspect of

345
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Speaker 1: the end means that I've come across at least uh.

346
00:17:10,480 --> 00:17:12,400
Speaker 1: It is not clear how he got there. The only

347
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Speaker 1: sources we have are two different accounts by the Animan

348
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Speaker 1: Committee chairman. One says that the man was seized as

349
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Speaker 1: he tried to swim away, the other that he grabbed

350
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Speaker 1: a leather strap thrown him from the long boat. Willingly

351
00:17:21,760 --> 00:17:23,639
Speaker 1: or not, he fell into enemy hands and was brought

352
00:17:23,640 --> 00:17:26,320
Speaker 1: back to the Pluto. Once aboard the steamer, at least,

353
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Speaker 1: he does not seem to have struggled. The sailors promptly

354
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Speaker 1: named him Jack and dressed him in an old coat

355
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Speaker 1: and trousers. The clothes must have belonged to one of

356
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Speaker 1: the cabin boys, since Jack, though a full grown adult,

357
00:17:34,920 --> 00:17:37,080
Speaker 1: was well under five feet. One of the crewmen gave

358
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Speaker 1: him a plug of chewing tobacco, which he swallowed. Another

359
00:17:39,640 --> 00:17:42,119
Speaker 1: tried to teach him, unsuccessfully to smoke a clay pipe.

360
00:17:42,600 --> 00:17:46,760
Speaker 1: So cool we murdered this guy's friends. He adopted him

361
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Speaker 1: from the only life he's ever known. I guess we'll

362
00:17:48,840 --> 00:17:52,800
Speaker 1: give him drugs. Oh my god. I mean, I guess

363
00:17:52,840 --> 00:17:55,399
Speaker 1: that's as good a chance of any as like it.

364
00:17:55,520 --> 00:17:58,480
Speaker 1: When when we first encounter aliens, that's a ship that's

365
00:17:58,480 --> 00:18:00,680
Speaker 1: going to happen. I mean, the first thing I'm offering

366
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Speaker 1: an alien is either a joint or sex, and I

367
00:18:03,840 --> 00:18:06,400
Speaker 1: have a standing offer all fun any alien. Yeah, anything

368
00:18:06,440 --> 00:18:09,199
Speaker 1: from another planet con sentiment. Yeah, you can't say no.

369
00:18:09,680 --> 00:18:12,160
Speaker 1: You got to give that a shot, which is why

370
00:18:12,200 --> 00:18:14,879
Speaker 1: I'm going to bring space cyphilis back to the world.

371
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Speaker 1: Probably wipe out two thirds of the planet, but it'll

372
00:18:17,240 --> 00:18:20,040
Speaker 1: be worth it, Oh yeah, especially for us. Yeah, so

373
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Speaker 1: we didn't need that two thirds. So the Animan Commission

374
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Speaker 1: report from the time does make a claim as to

375
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Speaker 1: how Jack wound up on board. Quote, one of the

376
00:18:29,760 --> 00:18:31,760
Speaker 1: natives win in the water sees a strap thrown to

377
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Speaker 1: him from the second cutter and was taken on board.

378
00:18:33,720 --> 00:18:36,480
Speaker 1: The committee deliberated anxiously as to the disposal of this man,

379
00:18:36,560 --> 00:18:38,879
Speaker 1: whether to release or to carry him to Calcutta. They

380
00:18:38,960 --> 00:18:41,560
Speaker 1: ultimately decided on the latter course is the one required

381
00:18:41,600 --> 00:18:44,159
Speaker 1: by the interests of humanity. Although attended with hardship to

382
00:18:44,200 --> 00:18:46,960
Speaker 1: the individual until he can be instructed sufficiently to know

383
00:18:47,040 --> 00:18:49,199
Speaker 1: the reasons which led to his removal from his country

384
00:18:49,200 --> 00:18:52,280
Speaker 1: and his kindred. So the interest of humanity. Yeah, these

385
00:18:52,320 --> 00:18:54,160
Speaker 1: business guys are like, we got to abduct this guy.

386
00:18:54,240 --> 00:18:58,240
Speaker 1: Obviously I'm not a hundred percent clear, but it sounds

387
00:18:58,240 --> 00:18:59,640
Speaker 1: like from some of the reports I read, they took

388
00:18:59,640 --> 00:19:01,080
Speaker 1: the skull ols of a couple of the people they

389
00:19:01,160 --> 00:19:04,280
Speaker 1: killed too, So it sounds like they may have skeletonized

390
00:19:04,320 --> 00:19:06,239
Speaker 1: his friends and brought them on the boat too, and

391
00:19:06,240 --> 00:19:09,160
Speaker 1: then been like this, let's take this guy. Yes, that's

392
00:19:09,200 --> 00:19:13,200
Speaker 1: kind of more common practice of the day. It's very

393
00:19:13,280 --> 00:19:15,640
Speaker 1: it's what you do. Phrenology and stuff is a thing.

394
00:19:16,000 --> 00:19:18,359
Speaker 1: Is there are new people and I miss hearing it

395
00:19:18,440 --> 00:19:21,040
Speaker 1: felt a little bit like the alternative they were offering

396
00:19:21,080 --> 00:19:23,719
Speaker 1: was just dumping him overboard and killing him. No. I mean,

397
00:19:24,040 --> 00:19:25,840
Speaker 1: I'm gonna guess these are island people. I'm gonna guess

398
00:19:25,880 --> 00:19:27,840
Speaker 1: he's a decent swimmer. They could have they could have

399
00:19:27,920 --> 00:19:31,560
Speaker 1: dropped him off in an island and been like, sorry, yeah, yeah,

400
00:19:31,680 --> 00:19:35,120
Speaker 1: we didn't want a gunfight to happen. Yeah, probably shouldn't have. Anyway,

401
00:19:35,160 --> 00:19:40,240
Speaker 1: they abduct him instead. Now, There is one heartwarming detail

402
00:19:40,320 --> 00:19:42,840
Speaker 1: in today's entire terrible story, and I'm going to drop

403
00:19:42,880 --> 00:19:46,399
Speaker 1: it now. Good. While Jack was languishing on the smelly, weird,

404
00:19:46,440 --> 00:19:49,520
Speaker 1: smoke belching boat filled with aliens and probably the corpses

405
00:19:49,520 --> 00:19:51,879
Speaker 1: of his friends, he encountered a type of creature he

406
00:19:51,920 --> 00:19:57,160
Speaker 1: had never seen before, Neptune, the ship's dog. There were

407
00:19:57,160 --> 00:19:59,480
Speaker 1: no dogs or wolves on the Eneman Islands, and yet

408
00:19:59,600 --> 00:20:02,840
Speaker 1: Jack instantly recognized that dogs are good. He hugged the

409
00:20:02,880 --> 00:20:05,000
Speaker 1: animal and started petting it, and the two became best

410
00:20:05,040 --> 00:20:08,240
Speaker 1: friends for the duration of their voyage home. So yeah,

411
00:20:08,320 --> 00:20:11,480
Speaker 1: Neptune was Jack's only solace on his long abduction from Calcutta.

412
00:20:11,560 --> 00:20:14,920
Speaker 1: So that's pretty cool that this guy has never seen

413
00:20:14,960 --> 00:20:17,680
Speaker 1: a dog before, winds up in the most terrifying situation

414
00:20:17,760 --> 00:20:20,320
Speaker 1: a person can be in, and immediately it's like, oh,

415
00:20:20,359 --> 00:20:23,840
Speaker 1: but that things cool. Yeah, clearly that's my friend. Yeah,

416
00:20:24,920 --> 00:20:27,480
Speaker 1: dogs are good. Yeah. I do want to note that

417
00:20:27,520 --> 00:20:29,160
Speaker 1: as bad as all this sounds, it was being done

418
00:20:29,200 --> 00:20:31,960
Speaker 1: with the most humanitarian of intentions by company personnel, or

419
00:20:31,960 --> 00:20:34,720
Speaker 1: at least that's how they justified this themselves. At this point,

420
00:20:34,800 --> 00:20:37,080
Speaker 1: the NI obliteration of the Native Americans in North and

421
00:20:37,119 --> 00:20:39,439
Speaker 1: South America was well known and considered to be a

422
00:20:39,480 --> 00:20:43,760
Speaker 1: horrific cautionary tale by the British. These guys were really yeah,

423
00:20:43,800 --> 00:20:45,840
Speaker 1: I mean because it was it was terrible what was done.

424
00:20:46,000 --> 00:20:48,280
Speaker 1: I mean there were people who recognize that at the time,

425
00:20:48,320 --> 00:20:50,680
Speaker 1: maybe not in America, but a lot of people around

426
00:20:51,160 --> 00:20:53,239
Speaker 1: the world, and there was a lot of sympathy. This

427
00:20:53,320 --> 00:20:55,200
Speaker 1: is a long running thing in Europe, like it's why

428
00:20:55,440 --> 00:20:58,719
Speaker 1: Hitler was always obsessed with Native American novels and stuff,

429
00:20:59,359 --> 00:21:02,000
Speaker 1: like it's a thing, this sort of like fetishization of

430
00:21:02,080 --> 00:21:04,520
Speaker 1: native cultures. But it was very much there was that

431
00:21:04,600 --> 00:21:07,919
Speaker 1: attitude that it was a tragedy. Isn't new people at

432
00:21:07,960 --> 00:21:10,240
Speaker 1: the time because in seven we're still fucking with the

433
00:21:10,280 --> 00:21:13,280
Speaker 1: Native America. People in like Europe and other parts of

434
00:21:13,280 --> 00:21:14,840
Speaker 1: the world at the time knew that was messed up.

435
00:21:15,520 --> 00:21:18,000
Speaker 1: And the fact that a lot of these guys, you know,

436
00:21:18,000 --> 00:21:20,040
Speaker 1: they didn't have the detail now that we have about

437
00:21:20,040 --> 00:21:23,200
Speaker 1: how many people were in North and South America before

438
00:21:23,320 --> 00:21:25,800
Speaker 1: colonial contact and how many died from the disease. But

439
00:21:25,960 --> 00:21:28,040
Speaker 1: they knew that a lot of them had died from disease.

440
00:21:28,080 --> 00:21:30,120
Speaker 1: They didn't have germ theory, but it was pretty clear

441
00:21:31,280 --> 00:21:34,600
Speaker 1: tended to end badly. So these guys would not be

442
00:21:34,680 --> 00:21:37,440
Speaker 1: considered woke by modern standards, but by the standards of

443
00:21:37,480 --> 00:21:39,240
Speaker 1: the time and of the British Empire, a lot of

444
00:21:39,240 --> 00:21:42,440
Speaker 1: the people involved in these decisions were pretty progressive people, right, Well,

445
00:21:42,520 --> 00:21:47,000
Speaker 1: what the alternative alternative was murdering everyone? Yeah, so anything

446
00:21:47,000 --> 00:21:51,400
Speaker 1: shy of that pretty good? Yeah, yeah, exactly. So there

447
00:21:51,520 --> 00:21:53,600
Speaker 1: was no desire to enslave Jack or put him in

448
00:21:53,600 --> 00:21:55,800
Speaker 1: a cage. This isn't like a Christopher Columbus thing, where

449
00:21:55,800 --> 00:21:58,639
Speaker 1: like we find these people and I mean, well, let's like,

450
00:21:59,160 --> 00:22:02,520
Speaker 1: but they did take him back to Calcutta and he

451
00:22:02,560 --> 00:22:04,960
Speaker 1: was kept in the mansion of the Andaman Committee chairman.

452
00:22:05,560 --> 00:22:07,800
Speaker 1: He was given fine suits of tailored clothing and taken

453
00:22:07,840 --> 00:22:10,160
Speaker 1: around to all the high society Calcutta had to offer.

454
00:22:10,480 --> 00:22:13,119
Speaker 1: He met the Viceroy, Lord Canning, and greeted his wife

455
00:22:13,119 --> 00:22:15,440
Speaker 1: by trying to quote blow into her hand with a

456
00:22:15,520 --> 00:22:18,879
Speaker 1: cooing murmur. This was apparently a traditional greeting of his people.

457
00:22:18,960 --> 00:22:21,199
Speaker 1: And I have trouble picturing it myself, but that's how

458
00:22:21,160 --> 00:22:25,640
Speaker 1: I was described. I don't yeah, I don't know, I'm

459
00:22:25,640 --> 00:22:31,399
Speaker 1: doing it. Oh, everly that's the sound. So Jack did

460
00:22:31,440 --> 00:22:33,439
Speaker 1: eventually seem to get into the swing of things, and

461
00:22:33,480 --> 00:22:35,240
Speaker 1: it seems like he even started to enjoy being the

462
00:22:35,280 --> 00:22:38,879
Speaker 1: talk of the town and taken care of stuff, you know.

463
00:22:39,359 --> 00:22:42,639
Speaker 1: Compared to say, again, like Christopher Columbus first contact with

464
00:22:42,680 --> 00:22:48,720
Speaker 1: the Andaman people was relatively less terrible. Yes, still exploitative,

465
00:22:48,880 --> 00:22:51,760
Speaker 1: still gross in a lot of ways, but again you

466
00:22:51,800 --> 00:22:54,199
Speaker 1: can see the difference. You can see these people know

467
00:22:54,480 --> 00:22:56,359
Speaker 1: it's fucked up to do what Columbus did, and they

468
00:22:56,359 --> 00:22:58,760
Speaker 1: don't want to be that, right, right, right, So worth

469
00:22:58,800 --> 00:23:01,440
Speaker 1: pointing out in some as those people are more woke

470
00:23:01,480 --> 00:23:06,120
Speaker 1: than a lot of Americans living today. Well yeah, just

471
00:23:06,119 --> 00:23:10,760
Speaker 1: just to be fair, that's not unfair. Um, it's always

472
00:23:10,840 --> 00:23:12,879
Speaker 1: been a curve so and and it was still pretty

473
00:23:12,880 --> 00:23:14,320
Speaker 1: gross in their time too. I don't want to cover

474
00:23:14,359 --> 00:23:16,200
Speaker 1: that up either. At one point, a picture of Jack

475
00:23:16,280 --> 00:23:18,560
Speaker 1: was taken to be sent to Alexander von Humboldt, the

476
00:23:18,640 --> 00:23:21,200
Speaker 1: German naturalists who became the namesake for my favorite county

477
00:23:21,240 --> 00:23:24,600
Speaker 1: in America. Jack was asked to pose naked for this photo,

478
00:23:24,920 --> 00:23:26,760
Speaker 1: and he'd gotten used to wearing clothes at this point

479
00:23:26,760 --> 00:23:28,400
Speaker 1: and kind of realized it was weird that they wanted

480
00:23:28,480 --> 00:23:31,159
Speaker 1: him to be naked, so he refused, but eventually they

481
00:23:31,200 --> 00:23:33,640
Speaker 1: needled him until he agreed to strip. I only bring

482
00:23:33,680 --> 00:23:35,640
Speaker 1: this up because it will not be the last time

483
00:23:35,680 --> 00:23:38,960
Speaker 1: that we talked about creepy force, nudity and the animate people. Yeah.

484
00:23:39,080 --> 00:23:42,360
Speaker 1: I saw some of the news reports. Yeah, so we

485
00:23:42,520 --> 00:23:45,920
Speaker 1: are going to continue talking about what happens to Jack

486
00:23:46,200 --> 00:23:48,960
Speaker 1: not great, uh, And we're going to continue talking about

487
00:23:49,040 --> 00:23:53,240
Speaker 1: the accidental genocide of the animate islands. But first, something

488
00:23:53,280 --> 00:23:58,080
Speaker 1: intentional that's not genocide is the products and services that

489
00:23:58,160 --> 00:24:08,320
Speaker 1: support this podcast. And we're back. We're talking about Jack,

490
00:24:08,560 --> 00:24:12,000
Speaker 1: the first animan to meet white people and how that goes.

491
00:24:12,359 --> 00:24:17,000
Speaker 1: Which did he ever or maybe you're getting to this,

492
00:24:17,080 --> 00:24:21,119
Speaker 1: did he ever manage to leave behind anything written? Or no?

493
00:24:21,480 --> 00:24:23,600
Speaker 1: And I don't think that was a priority of other people,

494
00:24:23,720 --> 00:24:26,439
Speaker 1: right right right. There was clearly some communication that they

495
00:24:26,440 --> 00:24:28,679
Speaker 1: were able to work out. But I mean it's one

496
00:24:28,720 --> 00:24:31,600
Speaker 1: of those things if you grow up in a society

497
00:24:31,640 --> 00:24:36,120
Speaker 1: without writing to adulthood, Yeah, the odds of you. It's

498
00:24:36,119 --> 00:24:37,800
Speaker 1: not that there are any less intelligent, because I've been

499
00:24:37,800 --> 00:24:40,520
Speaker 1: reading about some of these tribes, and the average people

500
00:24:40,520 --> 00:24:42,280
Speaker 1: in these will be able to recognize something like four

501
00:24:42,320 --> 00:24:46,960
Speaker 1: hundreds something different plants, many of with individual like three

502
00:24:47,040 --> 00:24:49,119
Speaker 1: or four hundred different animal species. Like, there's a lot

503
00:24:49,160 --> 00:24:52,280
Speaker 1: of knowledge in these places, but they don't focus on

504
00:24:52,320 --> 00:24:54,840
Speaker 1: the same things. Yeah, and it's it's hard to imagine

505
00:24:54,880 --> 00:24:58,320
Speaker 1: someone picking that up writing at adulthood without the concept.

506
00:24:58,400 --> 00:25:01,320
Speaker 1: And I'm sure there was not a already to teach

507
00:25:01,400 --> 00:25:03,919
Speaker 1: him anything. No, I mean, I'm sure there was proty

508
00:25:04,000 --> 00:25:06,800
Speaker 1: to teach him how to behave in public. I don't

509
00:25:06,800 --> 00:25:09,200
Speaker 1: think people were like, oh, and he should probably read

510
00:25:09,400 --> 00:25:14,200
Speaker 1: the rights of man. Yeah, right. Uh So, after about

511
00:25:14,240 --> 00:25:18,480
Speaker 1: two weeks in Calcutta, Jack got horribly ill with cholera. Surprise,

512
00:25:20,800 --> 00:25:23,720
Speaker 1: company doctors gave him medicine, but since medicine back then

513
00:25:23,800 --> 00:25:26,040
Speaker 1: was mostly nonsense and whiskey, it didn't do much to

514
00:25:26,080 --> 00:25:29,320
Speaker 1: alleviate things. Jack got over the cholera, but wound up

515
00:25:29,320 --> 00:25:32,200
Speaker 1: with severely inflamed lungs, so maybe he didn't really get over.

516
00:25:32,200 --> 00:25:35,439
Speaker 1: The colug company panicked because public relations was a thing

517
00:25:35,480 --> 00:25:37,679
Speaker 1: now and Jack had become something of a sensation. It

518
00:25:37,680 --> 00:25:39,560
Speaker 1: would not look good if he died in their care.

519
00:25:40,080 --> 00:25:41,919
Speaker 1: They agree that the most ethical way to deal with

520
00:25:41,960 --> 00:25:44,520
Speaker 1: this living tragedy was to ship Jack back to the animals,

521
00:25:44,600 --> 00:25:47,240
Speaker 1: so he could die far away from the press, oh

522
00:25:47,400 --> 00:25:50,679
Speaker 1: and be back with his family. Yeah yeah. The visor

523
00:25:50,880 --> 00:25:53,240
Speaker 1: ordered him sent back. He was given presents, many presents,

524
00:25:53,280 --> 00:25:55,440
Speaker 1: and shipped back to his home on South Reef Island.

525
00:25:55,520 --> 00:25:57,520
Speaker 1: He'd gotten sicker the whole time he was on board,

526
00:25:57,640 --> 00:26:00,440
Speaker 1: because that's how dying works. By the time they dropped

527
00:26:00,480 --> 00:26:02,680
Speaker 1: him off alone naked on the shore with a bunch

528
00:26:02,680 --> 00:26:05,359
Speaker 1: of pots and pans and tailored clothing. The ship's search

529
00:26:05,440 --> 00:26:08,800
Speaker 1: and noted quote it could not be ascertained whether he

530
00:26:08,880 --> 00:26:13,560
Speaker 1: was pleased or not at being restored to his home. Jesus, right, yeah,

531
00:26:13,680 --> 00:26:19,000
Speaker 1: he's the upgraded version of smallpox point kids, right, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

532
00:26:19,000 --> 00:26:20,760
Speaker 1: They take this guy to their thing, they give him

533
00:26:20,760 --> 00:26:22,440
Speaker 1: some clothes, they get him sick, and then they drop

534
00:26:22,560 --> 00:26:23,840
Speaker 1: him off when they don't know what else to do

535
00:26:23,920 --> 00:26:28,440
Speaker 1: with him back on his islands covered with modern industrialized

536
00:26:28,560 --> 00:26:33,080
Speaker 1: nation pathogens. Yeah, one presumes Jack died. One also presumes

537
00:26:33,119 --> 00:26:35,639
Speaker 1: that he may have spread his super fun diseases to

538
00:26:35,880 --> 00:26:38,120
Speaker 1: his fellow anim and these people who had never been

539
00:26:38,119 --> 00:26:41,160
Speaker 1: exposed in them before. So we don't know exactly how

540
00:26:41,160 --> 00:26:43,840
Speaker 1: many people were in the animals prior to the British coming.

541
00:26:43,840 --> 00:26:47,440
Speaker 1: Prior to Jack being sent back. We can presume from

542
00:26:47,480 --> 00:26:50,600
Speaker 1: the context clues that British contact with the Islands was

543
00:26:50,640 --> 00:26:52,840
Speaker 1: just as virulent and devastating in the animals as it

544
00:26:52,920 --> 00:26:56,640
Speaker 1: was basically everywhere else, regardless of their good intentions, whether

545
00:26:56,760 --> 00:26:59,320
Speaker 1: or not Jack spread cholera or whatever to his fellow's

546
00:26:59,359 --> 00:27:01,800
Speaker 1: disease quickly tour through the islands is the first European

547
00:27:01,840 --> 00:27:04,040
Speaker 1: and Indian settlers landed because they were going to build

548
00:27:04,040 --> 00:27:07,600
Speaker 1: that fucking penal Colony. Company established Port Blair in seventeen

549
00:27:07,640 --> 00:27:10,280
Speaker 1: eighty nine. It became the Empire's capital in the Damans

550
00:27:10,320 --> 00:27:12,399
Speaker 1: until rampant sickness and death forced them to move it

551
00:27:12,440 --> 00:27:18,239
Speaker 1: in seventeen oh even sickness and deaths because they're all

552
00:27:18,240 --> 00:27:23,160
Speaker 1: still and yeah, yeah, it's the jungle. Medicine is whiskey. Yeah,

553
00:27:23,320 --> 00:27:26,480
Speaker 1: like they don't have a lot of British people die

554
00:27:26,520 --> 00:27:28,760
Speaker 1: into Yeah, And I guess for what it's worth. I

555
00:27:28,800 --> 00:27:31,600
Speaker 1: mean we always talk about modern pathogens, but it's more

556
00:27:31,680 --> 00:27:34,680
Speaker 1: just like different pathogens, right, Like that's part of it,

557
00:27:34,720 --> 00:27:36,880
Speaker 1: is like you can just have different stuff. I mean,

558
00:27:36,920 --> 00:27:39,000
Speaker 1: the odds are not as high. I guess the biggest

559
00:27:39,000 --> 00:27:42,760
Speaker 1: thing is that we live around animals. Everyone in even

560
00:27:42,800 --> 00:27:44,800
Speaker 1: in India too, which I think is probably why you

561
00:27:44,800 --> 00:27:47,040
Speaker 1: didn't hear about like the same sort of diseases sweeping

562
00:27:47,040 --> 00:27:49,680
Speaker 1: through them, because like, well, they already lived the domesticated

563
00:27:50,000 --> 00:27:53,840
Speaker 1: Yeah animals vaguely remember that part of gun stumps and steel. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

564
00:27:54,240 --> 00:27:59,240
Speaker 1: So there's a lot of reasons this goes badly. Um So,

565
00:27:59,359 --> 00:28:02,560
Speaker 1: the author of that wonderful American scholar article, Adam Goodheart,

566
00:28:02,600 --> 00:28:05,080
Speaker 1: actually traveled to the National Archives of India in New

567
00:28:05,119 --> 00:28:06,960
Speaker 1: Delhi and looked over some of the books from the

568
00:28:06,960 --> 00:28:09,600
Speaker 1: records of the company and the British Raj's rule in

569
00:28:09,680 --> 00:28:13,320
Speaker 1: the Andaman Islands. Entries in these notebooks include titles like

570
00:28:14,000 --> 00:28:17,880
Speaker 1: quote flogging to check a natural crime in the settlement

571
00:28:17,920 --> 00:28:21,399
Speaker 1: of Port Blair, Mortality among the sheeps sent from Calcutta,

572
00:28:22,000 --> 00:28:25,920
Speaker 1: Branding of life prisoners, Sentence of death passed on Bialio

573
00:28:26,080 --> 00:28:29,960
Speaker 1: alias Philip and Andam Andes Port Blair Superintendent applies for

574
00:28:30,040 --> 00:28:34,560
Speaker 1: large ice machine. Okay, this is the kind of going

575
00:28:34,640 --> 00:28:38,080
Speaker 1: on that ice machine. That pretty I mean, I assume

576
00:28:38,400 --> 00:28:41,720
Speaker 1: that's a machine. Branding people is not nice, but I

577
00:28:41,760 --> 00:28:46,360
Speaker 1: do support ice, yeah, not the department, but this and

578
00:28:46,440 --> 00:28:50,320
Speaker 1: the flogging thing. I guess that's just data you're collecting. Yeah,

579
00:28:50,560 --> 00:28:54,120
Speaker 1: flogging to unnatural crime, which I am curious about. What

580
00:28:56,160 --> 00:28:59,480
Speaker 1: probably having whatever the British considered wrong sex. Yeah, yeah,

581
00:28:59,520 --> 00:29:02,480
Speaker 1: that would be my guess. Now. According to Goodheart, the

582
00:29:02,560 --> 00:29:05,160
Speaker 1: number one topic of discussion between the authorities and Calcutta

583
00:29:05,200 --> 00:29:07,240
Speaker 1: and their officers and the animals was what was to

584
00:29:07,240 --> 00:29:11,480
Speaker 1: be done with the Andamanese aboriginal people. Quote. The British

585
00:29:11,560 --> 00:29:13,640
Speaker 1: arrived in the islands determined that their contact would be

586
00:29:13,640 --> 00:29:16,240
Speaker 1: above reproach. They did not behave like the Americans on

587
00:29:16,280 --> 00:29:18,960
Speaker 1: the upper plains, or the Belgians and the Congo raping

588
00:29:18,960 --> 00:29:21,560
Speaker 1: and butchering for sport, nor had they any desire to

589
00:29:21,560 --> 00:29:24,800
Speaker 1: repeat the unpleasant experience of their compatriots in Tasmania, whose

590
00:29:24,840 --> 00:29:28,080
Speaker 1: careless expansionism had led to the accidental extinction of an

591
00:29:28,200 --> 00:29:32,240
Speaker 1: entire race. British have a history of that. Rather than

592
00:29:32,480 --> 00:29:35,080
Speaker 1: the first Superintendent was dispatched to the animals in eighteen

593
00:29:35,120 --> 00:29:37,440
Speaker 1: fifty eight with the unequivocal instructions that the natives be

594
00:29:37,480 --> 00:29:40,160
Speaker 1: treated with the greatest forbearance and humanity, and that they

595
00:29:40,200 --> 00:29:42,880
Speaker 1: be promptly informed that our intentions towards the people of

596
00:29:42,880 --> 00:29:46,040
Speaker 1: the Andamans are of the most friendly character. So again,

597
00:29:46,480 --> 00:29:48,640
Speaker 1: were your buddies were just here to help that we're here.

598
00:29:48,840 --> 00:29:53,480
Speaker 1: You're not using these all of the land prisoners. We

599
00:29:53,560 --> 00:29:57,120
Speaker 1: might mind some stuff. That's all a little bit on

600
00:29:57,240 --> 00:30:00,720
Speaker 1: mining and little hit of the British Empire. We swear

601
00:30:00,800 --> 00:30:06,040
Speaker 1: it won't become a problem. How likely is that at

602
00:30:06,120 --> 00:30:09,240
Speaker 1: least they're trying good for you don't want good for that,

603
00:30:09,400 --> 00:30:11,840
Speaker 1: good for the British Empire. I say that all the time.

604
00:30:12,200 --> 00:30:14,760
Speaker 1: So the antemn these people, by contrast, made it clear

605
00:30:14,760 --> 00:30:16,760
Speaker 1: that they wanted not one fucking thing to do with

606
00:30:16,760 --> 00:30:19,720
Speaker 1: the British Empire. The standard response by these people was

607
00:30:19,760 --> 00:30:22,360
Speaker 1: to flee if there were too many British people, or

608
00:30:22,400 --> 00:30:25,800
Speaker 1: to try and murder them and self defense. Repeated ambushes

609
00:30:25,840 --> 00:30:28,800
Speaker 1: of Royal and Company troops eventually sparked a war and

610
00:30:28,880 --> 00:30:31,440
Speaker 1: a great battle wherein men with spears charged a modern

611
00:30:31,440 --> 00:30:34,640
Speaker 1: British warship and its modern British guns. This did not

612
00:30:34,720 --> 00:30:37,600
Speaker 1: end well for the Anemones people. In fairness to them,

613
00:30:37,640 --> 00:30:40,760
Speaker 1: if you're at their level of technological sophistication and you

614
00:30:40,800 --> 00:30:43,640
Speaker 1: see a steamboat with cannons on it, you probably think

615
00:30:43,800 --> 00:30:46,960
Speaker 1: that's a monster Yeah, we just have to all charge

616
00:30:47,000 --> 00:30:51,080
Speaker 1: it and killed it. It's it's like it's like a dinosaur. Yeah,

617
00:30:51,160 --> 00:30:54,360
Speaker 1: it's it's what you would do. Anyone would would have

618
00:30:54,640 --> 00:30:57,640
Speaker 1: that way, something that looked similar to this giant monster

619
00:30:57,720 --> 00:31:01,240
Speaker 1: coming on. What do you do? What do you do? Anyway?

620
00:31:01,320 --> 00:31:03,880
Speaker 1: Once they were beaten and subdued by rampant disease, most

621
00:31:03,880 --> 00:31:06,160
Speaker 1: of the aim and E survivors eventually appeared to decide,

622
00:31:06,200 --> 00:31:08,320
Speaker 1: if you can't beat them, join them. They stopped fleeing,

623
00:31:08,400 --> 00:31:11,000
Speaker 1: started hanging out in British settlements and asking for coconuts

624
00:31:11,040 --> 00:31:14,040
Speaker 1: and liquor and cigarettes. The British, in response to this,

625
00:31:14,120 --> 00:31:17,200
Speaker 1: setup and Andese homes where volunteers would be allowed to

626
00:31:17,200 --> 00:31:19,800
Speaker 1: live if they let the Englishmen try to civilize them.

627
00:31:19,880 --> 00:31:22,400
Speaker 1: By British estimation, they took pretty good care of the

628
00:31:22,440 --> 00:31:26,120
Speaker 1: anemones natives. One official at the time noted, quote, the

629
00:31:26,160 --> 00:31:28,680
Speaker 1: government of British India has adopted a policy towards the

630
00:31:28,720 --> 00:31:31,240
Speaker 1: aborigines of the Andaman Islands which has made them, above

631
00:31:31,240 --> 00:31:34,080
Speaker 1: all races of savages, the most carefully tended and petted.

632
00:31:35,000 --> 00:31:39,560
Speaker 1: It's not nice. Doesn't give you a little shiver, right? Yeah?

633
00:31:39,840 --> 00:31:44,360
Speaker 1: When you read what colonialists colonizers wrote about what they

634
00:31:44,360 --> 00:31:47,800
Speaker 1: were doing, even the ones who aren't like outwardly racist

635
00:31:47,840 --> 00:31:51,280
Speaker 1: and say the Indians like Andrew Jackson level, it's all

636
00:31:51,360 --> 00:31:54,800
Speaker 1: just so gross. Yeah. Yeah, well it's still like the

637
00:31:54,840 --> 00:32:01,840
Speaker 1: phrenology level of classifying humans like races of sava. Yeah. Yeah. Now,

638
00:32:02,200 --> 00:32:06,000
Speaker 1: many Aboriginals were adopted temporarily by company officials who spent

639
00:32:06,080 --> 00:32:08,160
Speaker 1: time in the islands. Uh, they would like live in

640
00:32:08,200 --> 00:32:11,320
Speaker 1: their houses and work as servants and stuff. Some nicknames

641
00:32:11,400 --> 00:32:13,360
Speaker 1: for these people because the British could never learn their

642
00:32:13,400 --> 00:32:18,360
Speaker 1: real names, found in documents include quote Topsy Snowball, Jumbo,

643
00:32:18,760 --> 00:32:24,680
Speaker 1: Kitty Boy, Ruth Naomi, Joseph Crusoe, Friday, Tar Baby, King,

644
00:32:24,800 --> 00:32:31,880
Speaker 1: John Moriarty, Totalis, Punch, Jacko, Jingo Sambo, and Queen Victoria

645
00:32:32,320 --> 00:32:35,560
Speaker 1: Jesus Christ. I mean, I guess right, it is is

646
00:32:35,760 --> 00:32:38,200
Speaker 1: is they were treating them like animals. I mean, I

647
00:32:38,240 --> 00:32:40,040
Speaker 1: can't blame him for totist, because if I knew a

648
00:32:40,080 --> 00:32:42,160
Speaker 1: guy with no toast, I would call him totist or

649
00:32:42,320 --> 00:32:46,080
Speaker 1: a bunch of extra toast. Yeah, I would call him tofal. Yeah,

650
00:32:46,080 --> 00:32:48,560
Speaker 1: that's that One's okay. You see someone without toes, you

651
00:32:48,600 --> 00:32:51,760
Speaker 1: call him totist. Can't blame a man for that. All

652
00:32:51,800 --> 00:32:56,360
Speaker 1: the others though, Yeah, well it's it's like they're treating

653
00:32:56,400 --> 00:33:02,880
Speaker 1: them like pets. So yeah, they're treating like snowball. Yeah yeah.

654
00:33:03,000 --> 00:33:05,280
Speaker 1: Queen Victoria, that is literally the name of the cat

655
00:33:05,280 --> 00:33:10,120
Speaker 1: in the Simpsons. Yeah. Yeah. Pretty bad. Yeah, pretty bad,

656
00:33:10,160 --> 00:33:12,760
Speaker 1: and pretty bad, better than they've ever done it before.

657
00:33:13,280 --> 00:33:16,960
Speaker 1: Pretty bad, and yet the best of this sort of yeah, yeah,

658
00:33:17,440 --> 00:33:19,440
Speaker 1: because at least they're not whipping them to death for

659
00:33:19,440 --> 00:33:23,400
Speaker 1: a rubber Yeah, not often, not often. They whipped them

660
00:33:23,440 --> 00:33:27,440
Speaker 1: the death, but not for rubber them. And if they

661
00:33:27,480 --> 00:33:29,880
Speaker 1: happen to die, they whipped them too hard, and they

662
00:33:29,880 --> 00:33:32,640
Speaker 1: whipped them too hard, and that's regrettable and they know that, yeah,

663
00:33:32,680 --> 00:33:35,600
Speaker 1: and they feel bad, they do. The animal people became

664
00:33:35,640 --> 00:33:38,600
Speaker 1: briefly something of a meme around the British Empire. Hundreds

665
00:33:38,600 --> 00:33:40,920
Speaker 1: of books and photographs were passed around England with images

666
00:33:40,920 --> 00:33:43,880
Speaker 1: of naked tribesmen fishing and dancing and worshiping. You have

667
00:33:43,920 --> 00:33:45,520
Speaker 1: to remember that white people at this time were just

668
00:33:45,560 --> 00:33:48,240
Speaker 1: as fascinated by stories of native tribes as we've always seen,

669
00:33:48,560 --> 00:33:50,680
Speaker 1: but this was the first example, you know, in sort

670
00:33:50,680 --> 00:33:53,120
Speaker 1: of this modern era of photographs, being available of an

671
00:33:53,200 --> 00:33:57,200
Speaker 1: uncontacted tribe being really reached, so that they're able to like, oh,

672
00:33:57,280 --> 00:33:58,760
Speaker 1: we can show people what it would have looked like

673
00:33:59,240 --> 00:34:02,360
Speaker 1: in North Amora back before we killed all right, right, yeah,

674
00:34:02,400 --> 00:34:04,760
Speaker 1: you know that. That that's kind of the the attitude here,

675
00:34:04,760 --> 00:34:06,640
Speaker 1: and so that's why people are just fascinated with all

676
00:34:06,680 --> 00:34:10,200
Speaker 1: these pictures they can get of the enemies. Um. Now,

677
00:34:10,239 --> 00:34:12,400
Speaker 1: one thing that helped to spread the popularity of the

678
00:34:12,480 --> 00:34:15,200
Speaker 1: Enemies people was the fact that, oddly enough, they seemed

679
00:34:15,200 --> 00:34:18,880
Speaker 1: to be slowly dying out. How that works now, Between

680
00:34:18,920 --> 00:34:21,440
Speaker 1: eighteen sixty four and eighteen seventy nine, hundred and fifty

681
00:34:21,440 --> 00:34:24,040
Speaker 1: babies were born by the women living in the Andemnese home.

682
00:34:24,440 --> 00:34:27,000
Speaker 1: None of these babies lived past two. It was noted

683
00:34:27,000 --> 00:34:28,759
Speaker 1: by observers at the time that it seemed as if

684
00:34:28,760 --> 00:34:31,480
Speaker 1: the will of the Anemones people to continue existing had

685
00:34:31,520 --> 00:34:36,440
Speaker 1: been broken. Sure, yeah, now to the beyond that is

686
00:34:36,440 --> 00:34:40,120
Speaker 1: there any It's just disease, probably just disease. But they

687
00:34:40,120 --> 00:34:42,359
Speaker 1: were noted as all being depressed, maybe because all their

688
00:34:42,360 --> 00:34:47,319
Speaker 1: friends had died. Uh, And the STDs didn't help. Europeans

689
00:34:47,320 --> 00:34:49,960
Speaker 1: had instantly as soon as they started establishing settlements in

690
00:34:49,960 --> 00:34:53,400
Speaker 1: the islands began fetishizing the anemones women, and so syphilis

691
00:34:53,400 --> 00:34:56,000
Speaker 1: and ganaia tore through the unprepared immune systems of the

692
00:34:56,040 --> 00:34:59,200
Speaker 1: Aboriginal women like wildfire. This came as a real surprise

693
00:34:59,239 --> 00:35:02,800
Speaker 1: to the British government. They'd assumed that quote excessive development

694
00:35:02,800 --> 00:35:05,600
Speaker 1: of fat around the gluteal region that had been noted

695
00:35:05,640 --> 00:35:08,320
Speaker 1: in Aboriginal females and the animals would stop the British

696
00:35:08,360 --> 00:35:12,879
Speaker 1: soldiers and sailors from finding them attractive. Yeah that's pretty gross, right,

697
00:35:13,000 --> 00:35:16,680
Speaker 1: That's that's pretty rough. That's literally the uh the open too.

698
00:35:16,680 --> 00:35:19,959
Speaker 1: Baby got back, yeah, but with genocide. Baby got back,

699
00:35:20,360 --> 00:35:24,360
Speaker 1: but but genocide. Yeah. So it was into this environment

700
00:35:24,480 --> 00:35:28,040
Speaker 1: that we have just been painstakingly setting up. Eighteen seventy

701
00:35:28,120 --> 00:35:31,759
Speaker 1: nine that a man named Maurice dal Portman was made

702
00:35:31,800 --> 00:35:35,560
Speaker 1: officer in charge of the Anemones Now. Portman had joined

703
00:35:35,600 --> 00:35:38,520
Speaker 1: the Royal Indian Marine at age sixteen and risen quickly

704
00:35:38,520 --> 00:35:41,239
Speaker 1: through the ranks until he found himself basically the guy

705
00:35:41,280 --> 00:35:44,080
Speaker 1: in charge of the dying and amnes race. I'd like

706
00:35:44,120 --> 00:35:46,560
Speaker 1: to quote from his obituary because it really gives you

707
00:35:46,600 --> 00:35:49,239
Speaker 1: a sweet, sweet hit of that British Empire flavor. That

708
00:35:49,280 --> 00:35:52,319
Speaker 1: we've all come to love. But yeah, get ready here

709
00:35:52,880 --> 00:35:56,640
Speaker 1: now this was written five by the way, Yeah, for

710
00:35:56,640 --> 00:35:59,120
Speaker 1: the times of London. In many parts of the islands,

711
00:35:59,160 --> 00:36:02,480
Speaker 1: the natives will still ferocious enemies, or at best half tamed,

712
00:36:02,520 --> 00:36:05,120
Speaker 1: and his work consisted in making contact with them and

713
00:36:05,280 --> 00:36:09,080
Speaker 1: very gradually bringing them to recognize the value of British

714
00:36:09,160 --> 00:36:12,839
Speaker 1: rule above all men. He had the native touch, that rare,

715
00:36:12,920 --> 00:36:16,400
Speaker 1: mysterious gift that attracts and makes friends at once with natives,

716
00:36:16,640 --> 00:36:19,720
Speaker 1: and slowly, through a long period of years he made

717
00:36:19,719 --> 00:36:23,279
Speaker 1: his gift prevail. Work of extraordinary difficulty, for most of

718
00:36:23,280 --> 00:36:25,600
Speaker 1: them were as shy as wild animals, and often of

719
00:36:25,680 --> 00:36:28,800
Speaker 1: extreme danger. He would frequently have to land on their beaches,

720
00:36:29,000 --> 00:36:31,239
Speaker 1: standing up in an open boat amid a shower of

721
00:36:31,239 --> 00:36:34,319
Speaker 1: poisoned arrows. But in course of due time he won

722
00:36:34,400 --> 00:36:37,640
Speaker 1: them by sheer personal magnetism. He doctored them. They were

723
00:36:37,760 --> 00:36:40,719
Speaker 1: very rapidly dying out from venereal disease. He judged them,

724
00:36:40,760 --> 00:36:47,520
Speaker 1: and if necessary, he hanged them Ah nineteen thirty five

725
00:36:47,960 --> 00:36:56,160
Speaker 1: Jesus Ah. Also they were dying out also he hanged them. Yeah, well,

726
00:36:56,280 --> 00:36:59,359
Speaker 1: you know that's the good and the I don't feel

727
00:36:59,360 --> 00:37:00,919
Speaker 1: so bad of our all the ship I wrote about

728
00:37:00,960 --> 00:37:06,080
Speaker 1: John McCain. Oh it's fine man, fuck itt. Wow, there's

729
00:37:06,120 --> 00:37:09,040
Speaker 1: plenty of fun and obituaries. Yeah, be a dick, it's

730
00:37:09,080 --> 00:37:13,400
Speaker 1: good now that's from his yeah between the time, don't know. Obviously,

731
00:37:13,719 --> 00:37:15,480
Speaker 1: his obituary in the Times of London is not an

732
00:37:15,560 --> 00:37:18,759
Speaker 1: unbiased account of Mr Portman's life. At times. I did

733
00:37:18,760 --> 00:37:21,040
Speaker 1: find a more balanced description of his life in the

734
00:37:21,080 --> 00:37:23,920
Speaker 1: book Lonely Islands than Negrito People in the Out of

735
00:37:23,960 --> 00:37:25,759
Speaker 1: Africa Story of the Human Race. And I should pause

736
00:37:25,800 --> 00:37:28,040
Speaker 1: you to say that is where the comedy group got

737
00:37:28,040 --> 00:37:30,719
Speaker 1: their name from. Oh my god, is that? Oh yeah,

738
00:37:30,760 --> 00:37:35,000
Speaker 1: Lovely Island? Oh yeah, no, I mean maybe. Uh. The

739
00:37:35,040 --> 00:37:37,920
Speaker 1: Aboriginals of the Animate Islands are called the Negrito people

740
00:37:37,960 --> 00:37:42,520
Speaker 1: because they are black skinned and they were essentially sixty

741
00:37:42,600 --> 00:37:46,239
Speaker 1: something thousand years ago, people from Africa figured out how

742
00:37:46,280 --> 00:37:49,080
Speaker 1: to get boats up to the Animate Islands, which I

743
00:37:49,160 --> 00:37:54,160
Speaker 1: can't even comprehend what kind of current that's journey would take.

744
00:37:54,200 --> 00:37:57,200
Speaker 1: That sounds insane, but they made it storms in an

745
00:37:57,239 --> 00:37:59,920
Speaker 1: accident and like you fucking survived and that's where you

746
00:38:00,040 --> 00:38:02,759
Speaker 1: lived now, I mean, but that's a long like that's

747
00:38:02,920 --> 00:38:06,800
Speaker 1: that feels intentions. People were looking for something I don't know. Yeah,

748
00:38:06,920 --> 00:38:08,759
Speaker 1: I mean, I don't know what. How else And the

749
00:38:08,840 --> 00:38:10,920
Speaker 1: name calling them the negree to a people was a

750
00:38:11,040 --> 00:38:13,640
Speaker 1: name given to them by racists in a racist time.

751
00:38:14,160 --> 00:38:16,320
Speaker 1: It's but that's one of the terms you'll hear for

752
00:38:16,360 --> 00:38:19,359
Speaker 1: these people. I feel uncomfortable saying it because it's tough,

753
00:38:19,440 --> 00:38:23,720
Speaker 1: feels gross. But anyway, Uh, here's a quote from that book,

754
00:38:23,760 --> 00:38:27,080
Speaker 1: Lonely Islands quote. This is about Portman. He was very

755
00:38:27,120 --> 00:38:30,200
Speaker 1: popular with the Anemones, enough to attract his predecessor's envy.

756
00:38:30,320 --> 00:38:33,320
Speaker 1: Yet he could be a stern, even brutal colonial administrator,

757
00:38:33,400 --> 00:38:35,719
Speaker 1: not hesitating to burn down anem and these villages who

758
00:38:35,760 --> 00:38:38,960
Speaker 1: had somehow offended to quote show them who was the master,

759
00:38:39,239 --> 00:38:41,680
Speaker 1: as he put it himself, and to hang the insane

760
00:38:41,680 --> 00:38:44,400
Speaker 1: son of a chieftain. He was also personally brave, repeatedly

761
00:38:44,400 --> 00:38:48,360
Speaker 1: facing down armed Anemones war parties without flinching. So Apportman

762
00:38:48,600 --> 00:38:51,880
Speaker 1: is sort of the best case scenario for an officer

763
00:38:51,920 --> 00:38:54,880
Speaker 1: of a brutal colonial empire, because he does seem to

764
00:38:54,920 --> 00:38:57,640
Speaker 1: have at least genuinely cared about the Anemones people in

765
00:38:57,719 --> 00:39:00,560
Speaker 1: their culture. He learned twelve local language just during the

766
00:39:00,600 --> 00:39:02,960
Speaker 1: time he worked there, So he was not like an

767
00:39:02,960 --> 00:39:06,480
Speaker 1: oblivious guy. He cared about communicating with these people, and

768
00:39:06,520 --> 00:39:09,320
Speaker 1: he wrote several anthropological histories of tribes in the area

769
00:39:09,360 --> 00:39:11,799
Speaker 1: that didn't include really useful information about their culture. So

770
00:39:11,840 --> 00:39:13,920
Speaker 1: he was not just a guy who burned down villages,

771
00:39:14,200 --> 00:39:17,040
Speaker 1: but he was a guy who burned down villages. Yeah. Unfortunately,

772
00:39:17,640 --> 00:39:21,839
Speaker 1: Portman also almost certainly possessed an unquenchable desire to funk

773
00:39:21,920 --> 00:39:24,759
Speaker 1: the men of the Andimnese Islands, and since he was

774
00:39:24,920 --> 00:39:26,840
Speaker 1: a good servant of the crown, he seems to have

775
00:39:26,920 --> 00:39:30,560
Speaker 1: sublimated that desire into dozens and dozens of unsettlingly erotic

776
00:39:30,560 --> 00:39:33,680
Speaker 1: photographs and detailed descriptions of their genitals. And that's what

777
00:39:33,680 --> 00:39:39,680
Speaker 1: we're gonna be talking about after some none of which

778
00:39:39,719 --> 00:39:44,560
Speaker 1: will contain the tailed descriptions of genitals. I some of

779
00:39:44,600 --> 00:39:46,759
Speaker 1: our ads are randomly slotted. If I don't lead an ad,

780
00:39:46,760 --> 00:39:49,399
Speaker 1: it's a random ad. People got angryst because like one

781
00:39:49,440 --> 00:39:54,080
Speaker 1: came on for the Emirates Airline. We've complained about that

782
00:39:54,120 --> 00:39:56,080
Speaker 1: should be removed from the thing, But like we don't

783
00:39:56,080 --> 00:39:58,320
Speaker 1: know what what comes up, so it is possible I

784
00:39:58,400 --> 00:40:00,560
Speaker 1: was gonna say fairly reasonable of in the state of

785
00:40:00,600 --> 00:40:03,800
Speaker 1: podcast advertising today, there's gonna be a dead genital mentioned

786
00:40:03,800 --> 00:40:07,279
Speaker 1: in that ad. I hope not. It's possible. You never

787
00:40:07,320 --> 00:40:10,760
Speaker 1: know if an ad comes on that's advertising detailed depictions

788
00:40:10,760 --> 00:40:13,480
Speaker 1: of genitals. I apologize. It was not my intention to

789
00:40:13,520 --> 00:40:17,520
Speaker 1: lie to you. You could be an E. D. But

790
00:40:17,560 --> 00:40:25,560
Speaker 1: that's a little different. A braik and we're back. We

791
00:40:25,719 --> 00:40:28,440
Speaker 1: just got finished with a shrieking loud fire alarm. This

792
00:40:28,480 --> 00:40:30,680
Speaker 1: has been quite the day over the offices. But now

793
00:40:30,719 --> 00:40:33,319
Speaker 1: it's time to talk about the animans more. When we're

794
00:40:33,400 --> 00:40:35,879
Speaker 1: last talking, we were talking about that guy Portman and

795
00:40:35,920 --> 00:40:38,640
Speaker 1: the we're about to start talking about his erotic photographs

796
00:40:38,680 --> 00:40:43,080
Speaker 1: and detailed descriptions of the genitals of the native Animonise people. Sure, yeah,

797
00:40:43,200 --> 00:40:45,239
Speaker 1: let's get back into it. Who among us has not

798
00:40:45,840 --> 00:40:51,080
Speaker 1: taken erotic genitalia photos in the name of science? Who

799
00:40:51,160 --> 00:40:55,960
Speaker 1: among us has not committed colonialism via pictures of dicks?

800
00:40:56,400 --> 00:40:58,920
Speaker 1: By the eighteen nineties, basically the only thing that Portman

801
00:40:59,000 --> 00:41:01,160
Speaker 1: did anymore, he'd en up all the other aspects of

802
00:41:01,200 --> 00:41:03,319
Speaker 1: his job, and he pretty much just took pictures of

803
00:41:03,320 --> 00:41:07,319
Speaker 1: anem and these people now not just pictures He also

804
00:41:07,360 --> 00:41:10,520
Speaker 1: described their bodies in deeply uncomfortable detail. He made a

805
00:41:10,520 --> 00:41:12,480
Speaker 1: lot of money doing this. At the time, it probably

806
00:41:12,480 --> 00:41:14,440
Speaker 1: looked like a scheme to pat out his salary by

807
00:41:14,480 --> 00:41:18,400
Speaker 1: selling photographs. But historical perspective makes it seem like something

808
00:41:18,440 --> 00:41:21,759
Speaker 1: else was at stake here. So I'd like to quote

809
00:41:21,760 --> 00:41:24,880
Speaker 1: from a fabulous historical study published by satadru Sin of

810
00:41:24,960 --> 00:41:29,600
Speaker 1: Queen's College depicting Portman's photographs. Quote. In one image, a

811
00:41:29,719 --> 00:41:32,480
Speaker 1: robed Portman poses regally on an improvised throne, with a

812
00:41:32,520 --> 00:41:35,640
Speaker 1: group of semi naked anemone standing beside him. The names

813
00:41:35,640 --> 00:41:37,600
Speaker 1: of the islanders, who are given as a group of

814
00:41:37,640 --> 00:41:40,720
Speaker 1: anemones chiefs are given in the caption. All have authentic

815
00:41:40,760 --> 00:41:43,080
Speaker 1: anem and these names. They do not inhabit the frightening

816
00:41:43,080 --> 00:41:46,880
Speaker 1: and alienating tropical jungle of the colonial imagination that savages

817
00:41:46,920 --> 00:41:49,920
Speaker 1: renamed Crusoe and Friday inhabited in the early days of

818
00:41:49,920 --> 00:41:52,480
Speaker 1: the settlement. One man, a thirty five year old named

819
00:41:52,480 --> 00:41:55,280
Speaker 1: Reala It described elsewhere in the archive as the titular

820
00:41:55,400 --> 00:41:57,160
Speaker 1: king of the Animans, and is said to have been

821
00:41:57,200 --> 00:41:59,440
Speaker 1: given this title by the British in eighteen seventy eight.

822
00:42:00,000 --> 00:42:02,520
Speaker 1: Wan himself was instrumental in these kinds of appointments, having

823
00:42:02,560 --> 00:42:06,440
Speaker 1: installed Aboriginal men as chiefs after eighteen seventy nine. Several

824
00:42:06,440 --> 00:42:09,400
Speaker 1: other Aboriginal men wearing white robes marked with crosses, stand

825
00:42:09,400 --> 00:42:12,280
Speaker 1: formally among them, but they are external to the pictured community,

826
00:42:12,320 --> 00:42:15,359
Speaker 1: identified only as staff. And another image in the same file,

827
00:42:15,440 --> 00:42:17,680
Speaker 1: Portman is dressed in a kind of white Safari suit.

828
00:42:17,880 --> 00:42:20,800
Speaker 1: He reclines on the ground, surrounded by the principal chiefs

829
00:42:20,800 --> 00:42:24,120
Speaker 1: of the South Andamans who wear nothing. In a third picture,

830
00:42:24,120 --> 00:42:26,920
Speaker 1: probably taken in the same session, he steps forward aggressively

831
00:42:26,960 --> 00:42:29,560
Speaker 1: from the center of a line of naked Aborigines. So

832
00:42:29,640 --> 00:42:33,920
Speaker 1: again Portman dressed to the nines, everyone else naked, sort

833
00:42:33,960 --> 00:42:38,400
Speaker 1: of like pictures a closeted jetticidal dan bills are in

834
00:42:40,760 --> 00:42:43,960
Speaker 1: He's like, yo, this is this is the life. Yeah,

835
00:42:44,200 --> 00:42:48,319
Speaker 1: he is doing this for the Graham. Yeah yeah. And

836
00:42:48,400 --> 00:42:53,480
Speaker 1: it's also unsettlingly and uh exploitatively sexual, just like the Graham,

837
00:42:53,840 --> 00:42:59,239
Speaker 1: just like the still still tracks. Sata Drew identified much

838
00:42:59,280 --> 00:43:02,759
Speaker 1: of Portman's for photography as quote quite conventionally erotic, more

839
00:43:02,800 --> 00:43:06,040
Speaker 1: specifically homo erotic. He goes on to note that this

840
00:43:06,120 --> 00:43:08,120
Speaker 1: is to be expected in the art of imperialism in

841
00:43:08,120 --> 00:43:14,120
Speaker 1: India in the eighteen nineties. Okay, yeah, that's the best,

842
00:43:14,200 --> 00:43:16,480
Speaker 1: is what scholars are like. Well, of course, and all

843
00:43:16,520 --> 00:43:19,359
Speaker 1: the British guys did this. There was a lot of

844
00:43:19,400 --> 00:43:24,080
Speaker 1: weird homo erotic photography and sexualizing of native bodies done

845
00:43:24,080 --> 00:43:28,040
Speaker 1: throughout the British Empire. It was a capital a capital

846
00:43:28,080 --> 00:43:32,840
Speaker 1: t thing. Uh. So we don't precisely know that Portman

847
00:43:32,960 --> 00:43:35,080
Speaker 1: was gay. There are no references in the historical record

848
00:43:35,160 --> 00:43:36,800
Speaker 1: to any lovers he may have had, but we do

849
00:43:37,000 --> 00:43:39,279
Speaker 1: know he never married. And Sata Drew notes that his

850
00:43:39,400 --> 00:43:43,399
Speaker 1: chosen photographic subjects are almost all male and almost always nude.

851
00:43:43,719 --> 00:43:47,640
Speaker 1: Portman himself regularly praised the attractiveness of Andemon's men, writing

852
00:43:47,680 --> 00:43:49,879
Speaker 1: at one point that quote, many of the men are

853
00:43:49,880 --> 00:43:52,000
Speaker 1: good looking, as they have none of the thick lips,

854
00:43:52,080 --> 00:43:54,560
Speaker 1: high cheat bones, and flat noses of the negro type.

855
00:43:54,800 --> 00:44:02,000
Speaker 1: So cool, what a weird dig even needs that he's

856
00:44:02,040 --> 00:44:07,120
Speaker 1: a weird duum. Yeah, here's another quote. At the center

857
00:44:07,160 --> 00:44:09,080
Speaker 1: of his gaze as a particular sort of fantom in

858
00:44:09,120 --> 00:44:12,000
Speaker 1: ees who is typically young, male and muscular, Whereas his

859
00:44:12,040 --> 00:44:15,040
Speaker 1: photographs of heads capture equal numbers of males and females.

860
00:44:15,280 --> 00:44:17,799
Speaker 1: The other images, especially those that might be described as

861
00:44:17,840 --> 00:44:21,640
Speaker 1: casually posed or overwhelmingly pictures of males, a few show

862
00:44:21,680 --> 00:44:24,799
Speaker 1: individuals younger than fourteen or older than forty, and none

863
00:44:24,800 --> 00:44:27,040
Speaker 1: of those depicted as wrinkled by age your illness. Even

864
00:44:27,080 --> 00:44:29,480
Speaker 1: in an era where it had become common for British observers,

865
00:44:29,520 --> 00:44:32,239
Speaker 1: including Portman, to comment on the devastation of the and

866
00:44:32,360 --> 00:44:36,200
Speaker 1: amnes by syphilis, measles and pulmonary disease, when behind his camera,

867
00:44:36,280 --> 00:44:38,600
Speaker 1: Portman sought to record not that a crepitude brought on

868
00:44:38,640 --> 00:44:41,400
Speaker 1: by civilization, but the beauty of a savage body that

869
00:44:41,440 --> 00:44:44,400
Speaker 1: he had recuperated in the clearing. The discourse of imminent

870
00:44:44,440 --> 00:44:47,759
Speaker 1: extinction provided a context and an urgent justification within which

871
00:44:47,800 --> 00:44:51,279
Speaker 1: a vanishing aesthetic asset could be showcased and preserved. So

872
00:44:51,880 --> 00:44:53,640
Speaker 1: he took a bunch of naked pictures of people and

873
00:44:53,680 --> 00:44:55,640
Speaker 1: justified it by saying, well, they're all dying out, so

874
00:44:55,640 --> 00:44:58,920
Speaker 1: we gotta otherwise, we want to have have naked pictures of them.

875
00:44:58,960 --> 00:45:03,239
Speaker 1: I mean, I guess he's right. He's right. Here's an

876
00:45:03,280 --> 00:45:05,080
Speaker 1: example of the pictures. We'll have this up on the

877
00:45:05,080 --> 00:45:08,360
Speaker 1: site behind the bat. Yeah, that's porn. Yeah, that's like,

878
00:45:08,400 --> 00:45:10,359
Speaker 1: I'm not a big guy where like any naked picture

879
00:45:10,400 --> 00:45:13,840
Speaker 1: of someone is porn. This is specifically well it seems

880
00:45:13,880 --> 00:45:17,839
Speaker 1: like he's getting his rocks off. Yeah, it's like what

881
00:45:17,920 --> 00:45:22,359
Speaker 1: you would imagine like a playgirl. Yeah, it's like if

882
00:45:22,400 --> 00:45:24,120
Speaker 1: you're the National Geographic and you go to a place

883
00:45:24,120 --> 00:45:25,840
Speaker 1: where people don't wear clothes and you just take pictures

884
00:45:25,840 --> 00:45:29,200
Speaker 1: of them doing their thing. It's actually about that this

885
00:45:29,280 --> 00:45:30,800
Speaker 1: is a point in time in which many of the

886
00:45:30,840 --> 00:45:33,280
Speaker 1: Anemones do wear close because the British are in charge.

887
00:45:33,320 --> 00:45:37,239
Speaker 1: He's not going out into the uncontacted tribes and making

888
00:45:37,280 --> 00:45:40,680
Speaker 1: them take He's getting people who live in towns who

889
00:45:40,680 --> 00:45:43,680
Speaker 1: are and Amones aboriginals, and he's making them strip and

890
00:45:43,719 --> 00:45:47,160
Speaker 1: put on traditional jewelry, and then he's taking pictures of

891
00:45:47,200 --> 00:45:50,440
Speaker 1: them because he thinks it's hot making nudes. He's making nudes.

892
00:45:50,560 --> 00:45:55,920
Speaker 1: He's making willingly, unwillingly forcing people to take nudes. Yeah,

893
00:45:55,960 --> 00:46:00,000
Speaker 1: I don't think we're seeing them. But also he burned

894
00:46:00,200 --> 00:46:03,120
Speaker 1: down villages that don't do what the British wants, so

895
00:46:03,160 --> 00:46:06,040
Speaker 1: maybe you're like, we probably can't say no to this.

896
00:46:06,200 --> 00:46:09,760
Speaker 1: It's a type of force. I'm back to being comfortable

897
00:46:09,840 --> 00:46:12,280
Speaker 1: saying he forced them. Yeah, I think I think there's

898
00:46:12,280 --> 00:46:16,520
Speaker 1: it's not consent is not clear in this case. I

899
00:46:16,600 --> 00:46:18,720
Speaker 1: have no problem with people taking naked pictures of whoever

900
00:46:19,080 --> 00:46:22,040
Speaker 1: if there's consent, I don't think these people can really

901
00:46:22,080 --> 00:46:25,799
Speaker 1: consent because of the I can't really be freely. Yeah yeah, yeah.

902
00:46:26,200 --> 00:46:28,920
Speaker 1: Now Portman's gross. His pictures are gross. He clearly has

903
00:46:28,960 --> 00:46:31,440
Speaker 1: a lot of grossness in him. But one of the

904
00:46:31,480 --> 00:46:34,680
Speaker 1: confusing and frustrating things about this sort of anthropological study

905
00:46:34,760 --> 00:46:37,319
Speaker 1: is that we as students are indebted to him for

906
00:46:37,400 --> 00:46:40,680
Speaker 1: providing us with crucial details about antimonies culture. Uh. And

907
00:46:40,760 --> 00:46:42,080
Speaker 1: in a little bit of fairness to him, it was

908
00:46:42,080 --> 00:46:44,319
Speaker 1: clearly important to him that these details be preserved, so

909
00:46:44,360 --> 00:46:47,680
Speaker 1: it was not pure exploitation. Uh. And I mean we

910
00:46:47,800 --> 00:46:51,640
Speaker 1: learned from Nazi experiments too, and that's that's also very

911
00:46:51,640 --> 00:46:53,799
Speaker 1: fair to say. That's it. I did come across some

912
00:46:53,880 --> 00:46:56,360
Speaker 1: cultural details in his writings in this study that I

913
00:46:56,360 --> 00:46:57,839
Speaker 1: read that I really wanted to read because I think

914
00:46:57,840 --> 00:47:00,239
Speaker 1: it provides a little bit of fascinating insight into sort

915
00:47:00,280 --> 00:47:02,399
Speaker 1: of the culture that was being wiped out at this point.

916
00:47:02,680 --> 00:47:06,359
Speaker 1: Quote when the Andemnes meet after a long separation they

917
00:47:06,400 --> 00:47:09,120
Speaker 1: cry this custom applying to both sexes for about half

918
00:47:09,120 --> 00:47:11,799
Speaker 1: an hour and sometimes till the dusk. After they actually meet,

919
00:47:11,880 --> 00:47:14,200
Speaker 1: they sit about a foot apart or I'm not sure

920
00:47:14,239 --> 00:47:16,839
Speaker 1: how far apart. It just say, is about apart, take

921
00:47:16,920 --> 00:47:18,960
Speaker 1: no notice of each other and do not speak. Then

922
00:47:19,000 --> 00:47:21,239
Speaker 1: one approaches the other. They throw their arms around each

923
00:47:21,280 --> 00:47:25,319
Speaker 1: other's necks, and, sitting on the ground, cry demonstratively. Others join,

924
00:47:25,440 --> 00:47:27,480
Speaker 1: and one may see a heap of tin and amnees

925
00:47:27,560 --> 00:47:29,319
Speaker 1: crying and howling in a way that can be heard

926
00:47:29,320 --> 00:47:31,440
Speaker 1: a mile off. In the case of men and women,

927
00:47:31,440 --> 00:47:34,120
Speaker 1: in particularly of husbands and wives, the man sits on

928
00:47:34,120 --> 00:47:36,640
Speaker 1: the woman's legs as shown. The crying may continue for

929
00:47:36,680 --> 00:47:40,000
Speaker 1: an hour and generally ends in a dance. That is

930
00:47:40,719 --> 00:47:44,200
Speaker 1: by far the most healthy way to do with that.

931
00:47:44,239 --> 00:47:47,400
Speaker 1: Seems like a really healthy that I've ever heard, a

932
00:47:47,520 --> 00:47:50,160
Speaker 1: really healthy way to deal with seeing someone for the

933
00:47:50,160 --> 00:47:53,120
Speaker 1: first time after a long absence, sitting in their presence

934
00:47:53,120 --> 00:47:56,040
Speaker 1: and yeah, crying and making it clear. Yeah, it's kind

935
00:47:56,040 --> 00:47:58,040
Speaker 1: of beautiful. But it's also like one of those things, right,

936
00:47:58,080 --> 00:48:00,480
Speaker 1: It's like this has written It's like, oh, this is

937
00:48:00,520 --> 00:48:04,400
Speaker 1: the custom, and it also equally could be this was

938
00:48:04,440 --> 00:48:09,600
Speaker 1: the custom reserved for terrible tragedies, and it's just that

939
00:48:09,640 --> 00:48:12,000
Speaker 1: we have done nothing but visit terrible tragedies all these

940
00:48:12,000 --> 00:48:14,319
Speaker 1: people since we saw them. Yeah, it's impossible to know

941
00:48:14,800 --> 00:48:18,080
Speaker 1: exactly the context of this because we just have Portman's recitation,

942
00:48:18,400 --> 00:48:22,160
Speaker 1: but it's a tantalizing glimpse of a very complex culture

943
00:48:22,280 --> 00:48:25,560
Speaker 1: that was mostly wiped out as we will continue to

944
00:48:25,600 --> 00:48:29,240
Speaker 1: change that and again, healthier than ours in some aspects,

945
00:48:29,239 --> 00:48:31,600
Speaker 1: for sure. Sure they did a lot of they did.

946
00:48:31,640 --> 00:48:32,880
Speaker 1: They did the thing that a lot, and it like

947
00:48:32,920 --> 00:48:34,920
Speaker 1: they killed babies and stuff like if your baby is sick,

948
00:48:34,920 --> 00:48:36,800
Speaker 1: they're going to kill that baby, Like that's a pretty

949
00:48:36,800 --> 00:48:39,560
Speaker 1: normal thing for tribes at that sort of technological level.

950
00:48:39,840 --> 00:48:42,399
Speaker 1: There's ugliness. They had wars, they did fucked up ship.

951
00:48:42,920 --> 00:48:45,319
Speaker 1: Like when we talk about native cultures, we shouldn't like

952
00:48:45,480 --> 00:48:49,640
Speaker 1: idealize them either. They weren't perfect, but not worse than us.

953
00:48:49,680 --> 00:48:52,960
Speaker 1: They sure a ship, not worse than us. Yeah. Um,

954
00:48:53,040 --> 00:48:55,520
Speaker 1: so there are a bunch of weird findings. In Sata

955
00:48:55,600 --> 00:48:58,319
Speaker 1: drew Sin's study of Portman's writings on the enem and East,

956
00:48:58,760 --> 00:49:01,120
Speaker 1: he notes that Portman went to great effort to record

957
00:49:01,120 --> 00:49:03,520
Speaker 1: details about the exact shape and size of these people,

958
00:49:03,560 --> 00:49:07,160
Speaker 1: measuring their skulls probably some phrenology uh, and measuring their

959
00:49:07,200 --> 00:49:10,120
Speaker 1: other bodily dimensions, and writing detailed descriptions of men and women.

960
00:49:10,640 --> 00:49:13,759
Speaker 1: He describes one seven year old woman named Bia as

961
00:49:14,080 --> 00:49:16,880
Speaker 1: very cheerful, pleasant woman, intelligent and bright, docile and not

962
00:49:16,960 --> 00:49:20,319
Speaker 1: quarrelsome breath, sweet and no offensive smell from body said.

963
00:49:20,320 --> 00:49:22,759
Speaker 1: How Drew notes that in almost all cases, almost all

964
00:49:22,760 --> 00:49:25,560
Speaker 1: of the women described as pleasant by Portman are also

965
00:49:25,560 --> 00:49:28,760
Speaker 1: described as smelling good. Women described as mean or irritable,

966
00:49:28,840 --> 00:49:34,239
Speaker 1: or always described as smelling bad. The vast majority of

967
00:49:34,239 --> 00:49:37,680
Speaker 1: Portman's descriptive efforts, however, took on heavily erotic dimensions and

968
00:49:37,719 --> 00:49:41,440
Speaker 1: focused on Talia Riwa, a forty four year old man,

969
00:49:41,520 --> 00:49:44,680
Speaker 1: is described as very intelligent, government interpreter for the North

970
00:49:44,719 --> 00:49:47,640
Speaker 1: and Aman group of tribes, fond of gayety and dancing, violent,

971
00:49:47,680 --> 00:49:51,640
Speaker 1: tempered and hectoring disposition, penis and left testical, normal, right testical,

972
00:49:51,680 --> 00:50:00,440
Speaker 1: small and atro feed, very lustful. Oh ah, what do

973
00:50:00,520 --> 00:50:03,560
Speaker 1: you what do you remember? An throw class that? Well?

974
00:50:03,600 --> 00:50:07,120
Speaker 1: But at some point where do we leave lustful off

975
00:50:07,160 --> 00:50:10,920
Speaker 1: on the scale? Yes, got to be there somewhere, it

976
00:50:11,320 --> 00:50:15,240
Speaker 1: should be right, yeah, Portman describes another man, woy Cella

977
00:50:15,360 --> 00:50:18,400
Speaker 1: as quote, exceptionally plucky and brave. Allowed me to fire

978
00:50:18,400 --> 00:50:20,360
Speaker 1: at a small pot on his head with an iron

979
00:50:20,400 --> 00:50:24,040
Speaker 1: pointed arrow, very good tempered, breath, sweet, not very lustful,

980
00:50:24,200 --> 00:50:28,800
Speaker 1: penis unusually large, both testies well formed the same breath.

981
00:50:29,000 --> 00:50:32,640
Speaker 1: He let me shoot at his head. His dicks big.

982
00:50:33,520 --> 00:50:40,319
Speaker 1: What this is like, I mean, it's it is like

983
00:50:40,360 --> 00:50:43,560
Speaker 1: a John Waters movie. At a certain point, I keep

984
00:50:43,600 --> 00:50:46,800
Speaker 1: bringing up quotes from and will later in this podcast

985
00:50:46,800 --> 00:50:50,120
Speaker 1: weird kindling. But that quote from the poem Mandalay about

986
00:50:50,200 --> 00:50:52,600
Speaker 1: the attitude the British had about places like this where

987
00:50:52,600 --> 00:50:55,200
Speaker 1: there ain't no tin commandments and a man can raise

988
00:50:55,200 --> 00:50:57,880
Speaker 1: a thirst. There's no rules out in the colonies. You

989
00:50:57,920 --> 00:50:59,600
Speaker 1: can shoot a thing off a dude's head if you

990
00:50:59,600 --> 00:51:04,279
Speaker 1: want to, just ask him. Well, yeah again ask I

991
00:51:04,320 --> 00:51:08,279
Speaker 1: mean he exactly. It's like, I mean, we don't know

992
00:51:08,640 --> 00:51:11,000
Speaker 1: from the other way, right, you have an arrow trained

993
00:51:11,080 --> 00:51:15,280
Speaker 1: upon this man, can I shoot you? It's hard to

994
00:51:15,480 --> 00:51:19,399
Speaker 1: make a request in that case. It's like, hey, dude,

995
00:51:19,840 --> 00:51:21,239
Speaker 1: I got this bow and arrow. Can I try to

996
00:51:21,239 --> 00:51:23,200
Speaker 1: shoot this thing off your head? It's a pretty big dick,

997
00:51:23,239 --> 00:51:28,919
Speaker 1: by the way. Yeah, I'm definitely making a note of that. No, oh,

998
00:51:28,960 --> 00:51:32,279
Speaker 1: I mean yes, Sorry, I definitely meant yes. In fact, oh,

999
00:51:32,320 --> 00:51:35,160
Speaker 1: you're you're burning down village? Just it. Yes, it's always yes, Yeah,

1000
00:51:35,200 --> 00:51:38,440
Speaker 1: it's never not been yes now. Maurice Vidale Portman is

1001
00:51:38,440 --> 00:51:41,160
Speaker 1: an important figure in understanding what happened to John Chow,

1002
00:51:41,320 --> 00:51:43,960
Speaker 1: the young missionary who died in North Sentinel Island, because,

1003
00:51:43,960 --> 00:51:46,680
Speaker 1: in addition to being a creepy weirdo who wrote extensively

1004
00:51:46,719 --> 00:51:49,560
Speaker 1: about the genitalia of strangers whilst shooting arrows at their heads,

1005
00:51:49,760 --> 00:51:51,640
Speaker 1: he was also the first European to make contact with

1006
00:51:51,680 --> 00:51:54,279
Speaker 1: the Sentinels people. But we will have to wait to

1007
00:51:54,400 --> 00:51:57,600
Speaker 1: tell that story until Thursday when we have part two.

1008
00:51:57,800 --> 00:52:01,279
Speaker 1: Are you ready for part two? Andrew us that's the

1009
00:52:01,320 --> 00:52:04,600
Speaker 1: proper attitude to this podcast. All right, Andrew plugs some

1010
00:52:04,600 --> 00:52:07,840
Speaker 1: plug doubles before we roll. Oh sure, just you know

1011
00:52:08,000 --> 00:52:11,879
Speaker 1: yours this racist Please take a listen. If you are

1012
00:52:12,040 --> 00:52:16,360
Speaker 1: going to be on the you know, west north side

1013
00:52:16,360 --> 00:52:19,400
Speaker 1: of the West coast of the United States in early

1014
00:52:19,440 --> 00:52:23,759
Speaker 1: two thousand nineteen, keep an eye open for for some

1015
00:52:24,800 --> 00:52:29,040
Speaker 1: live appearances. Uh, San Francisco we can announce um and

1016
00:52:29,120 --> 00:52:31,600
Speaker 1: you know, maybe some other cities who knows San Francisco,

1017
00:52:31,840 --> 00:52:36,320
Speaker 1: City of Angels, the Big Apple. Yep, alright, I'm Robert Evans.

1018
00:52:36,360 --> 00:52:38,319
Speaker 1: This has been Behind the Bastards. You can find me

1019
00:52:38,360 --> 00:52:40,280
Speaker 1: on Twitter at I right, Okay, I have a book

1020
00:52:40,320 --> 00:52:43,520
Speaker 1: called A Brief History of Vice where I dangerously experiment

1021
00:52:43,560 --> 00:52:45,920
Speaker 1: on myself with ancient drugs by it if you want.

1022
00:52:46,360 --> 00:52:48,439
Speaker 1: You can find this podcast on the internet at behind

1023
00:52:48,440 --> 00:52:50,440
Speaker 1: the Bastards dot com. We will have all of the

1024
00:52:50,480 --> 00:52:55,080
Speaker 1: sources for this episode and one pornographic picture. That's the

1025
00:52:55,080 --> 00:52:58,840
Speaker 1: only one I necessary to include. It is porn. You know,

1026
00:52:59,239 --> 00:53:02,880
Speaker 1: you make a note of it. Uh. We will also

1027
00:53:03,040 --> 00:53:06,680
Speaker 1: you could argue that it's not porn it's trashy because

1028
00:53:06,719 --> 00:53:09,320
Speaker 1: it's black and white, so you know, probably fine. It's tasteful.

1029
00:53:09,400 --> 00:53:13,879
Speaker 1: It's tasteful. It's a tasteful nude. Yeah, a tasteful, exploitative

1030
00:53:13,960 --> 00:53:18,000
Speaker 1: newd um. You can find us on Instagram, uh a

1031
00:53:18,440 --> 00:53:21,640
Speaker 1: the Graham as people aren't calling it now happen for

1032
00:53:21,719 --> 00:53:24,600
Speaker 1: a while in Twitter at at Bastard's pod. And we

1033
00:53:24,680 --> 00:53:30,839
Speaker 1: sell shirts and stickers and uh cups and uh bowls, handguns,

1034
00:53:31,440 --> 00:53:34,399
Speaker 1: uh cell phone cases, not handguns. We do not yet

1035
00:53:34,440 --> 00:53:37,799
Speaker 1: sell handguns. We're working on yeah, branded with all of

1036
00:53:37,840 --> 00:53:42,600
Speaker 1: our favorite bastard pod quotes and and stuff by they

1037
00:53:42,680 --> 00:53:44,360
Speaker 1: do you guys suffer from a similar problem that we

1038
00:53:44,400 --> 00:53:47,399
Speaker 1: have on yours is racist where it's hard to know

1039
00:53:47,520 --> 00:53:53,319
Speaker 1: whether your merch will be used the wrong way, you know,

1040
00:53:53,719 --> 00:53:56,480
Speaker 1: just like behind the bastards or anything like that, where

1041
00:53:56,480 --> 00:53:59,600
Speaker 1: you're like, I do worry that our firebomb a cop

1042
00:53:59,640 --> 00:54:03,680
Speaker 1: cars might be inciting. They may have been a poor choice.

1043
00:54:03,760 --> 00:54:05,920
Speaker 1: You know, that may have been a poor choice. We'll

1044
00:54:05,960 --> 00:54:09,399
Speaker 1: find out. Yeah, yeah, yeah, let the lawsuits fall where

1045
00:54:09,400 --> 00:54:12,920
Speaker 1: they may. I probably shouldn't have released those rolling coal

1046
00:54:13,040 --> 00:54:15,919
Speaker 1: is cool bumper stickers for people's trucks. That was also

1047
00:54:15,960 --> 00:54:18,960
Speaker 1: an error. Oh yeah, now looking at your page right now,

1048
00:54:19,080 --> 00:54:21,520
Speaker 1: this is but we we just released a shirt for

1049
00:54:21,560 --> 00:54:27,160
Speaker 1: advertising go back to Europe Airlines, which is appropriate appropriate

1050
00:54:27,200 --> 00:54:30,600
Speaker 1: in the United States. We had some European listeners say,

1051
00:54:31,239 --> 00:54:34,080
Speaker 1: maybe not such a good look because that's almost like

1052
00:54:34,120 --> 00:54:39,320
Speaker 1: a neo Nazis as far as yeah, yeah, t shirts

1053
00:54:39,320 --> 00:54:43,080
Speaker 1: are a dangerous game. Oh well yeah, oh well, suck

1054
00:54:43,120 --> 00:54:46,200
Speaker 1: it us. You know, if I've learned one thing from

1055
00:54:46,200 --> 00:54:49,040
Speaker 1: the East India Company, if you can't let the possible

1056
00:54:49,080 --> 00:54:52,959
Speaker 1: consequences of your actions given the way of commerce ever, ever, ever,

1057
00:54:53,160 --> 00:54:56,120
Speaker 1: and on that note, I'm Robert Evans. This has been behind.

1058
00:54:56,160 --> 00:55:02,560
Speaker 1: The bastards have a bastardful tomorrow. Eight