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Speaker 1: Hey, this is Anny and SMITHA and welcome to stuff

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Speaker 1: I Never told you Production by Heart Radio, and welcome

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Speaker 1: back to our continuing classics around Pride Month.

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Speaker 2: This one is one.

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Speaker 1: Every now and then you come out with a title

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Speaker 1: name and you're just so proud of it even though

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Speaker 1: you shouldn't be.

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Speaker 2: And this was one I loved, you know, I love

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Speaker 2: it coming up with title. Yes, yes, this was one.

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Speaker 2: But it's just kind of like.

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Speaker 1: My my experience realizing I was queer and then asexual.

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Speaker 2: And I haven't been thinking.

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Speaker 1: About this lately because I tell the story in there

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Speaker 1: about this guy I dated very briefly who's like you

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Speaker 1: were the most tragic figure. I cannot figure you out.

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Speaker 1: And now I just wonder about that guy. I wonder

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Speaker 1: if he's come around, like as he changed his tune.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, if he's listened to any of your stuff.

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Speaker 3: Possibly possibly.

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Speaker 2: I feel like there's two extremes that could go. But

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Speaker 2: I hope so, I hope so well, I do.

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Speaker 1: I am like colliating my thoughts around that, so it

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Speaker 1: will it will be in an upcoming episode of some sort.

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Speaker 1: But in the meantime, just enjoying that teaser and enjoy

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Speaker 1: this classic episode.

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Speaker 3: Hey, this is Adie and Samantha.

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Speaker 1: I'm aw coome to stuff I've never told you, but

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Speaker 1: actually ir Radio, Samantha, did you keep a diary or

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Speaker 1: journal at all?

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Speaker 3: I did. We don't talked about this before. I kept

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Speaker 3: a diary for a very long time. I did more poems,

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Speaker 3: so I have a lot of poetry books more so

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Speaker 3: than diaries.

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Speaker 2: I do have.

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Speaker 3: And i'd laugh because but it was beautifully written. When

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Speaker 3: I was really religious and doing all of the traveling

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Speaker 3: and the mission work. And I say mission work, I

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Speaker 3: lived for a year out of children, some in Oklahoma,

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Speaker 3: working with them and living on campus with them, and

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Speaker 3: I got to beat a lot of sweet people, including

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Speaker 3: a lot of people from the indigenous community because they

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Speaker 3: were near tribes out that way. So I got to

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Speaker 3: meet a lot of amazing people. But I would keep

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Speaker 3: journals of that, and I also set out newsletters to

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Speaker 3: people it, which is super weird, and I got a

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Speaker 3: lot of responses about how I was an amazing writer,

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Speaker 3: So put that out there. I don't think I am.

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Speaker 3: I think they love the flowery words that I would

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Speaker 3: mess with Bible verses, so I definitely did a lot

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Speaker 3: of that. I tried to do the single line one

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Speaker 3: line of day thing that did not work.

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Speaker 2: Out because you just gave up.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I lost it during to the pandemic, so I

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Speaker 3: haven't taken it outside the house. I just don't know

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Speaker 3: where it is in my house.

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Speaker 2: That's I can relate to that.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, well what about you.

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Speaker 2: Yes, I did keep a diary.

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Speaker 1: As you know, it is a very popular story among

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Speaker 1: my friend group. I had a bad run of pets,

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Speaker 1: so I had a lot of tragic pet deaths when

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Speaker 1: I was growing up. So every entry, I can laugh now,

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Speaker 1: but every entry would start with like, well, Fluffy's gone.

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Speaker 3: Can you call them Katie? Just naming them what they were.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, Well one of my rabbit Fluffy. And then I

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Speaker 2: had four Katies.

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Speaker 1: And then I thought para keeps and I thought the

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Speaker 1: name Katie was cursed, so I named one Rebecca.

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Speaker 2: But Rebecca also died very quickly.

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Speaker 3: I had to know, did you name these after your friends?

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Speaker 3: And were they worried after the fact.

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Speaker 1: I don't recall naming them after my friends, but it

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Speaker 1: is Popslar that I did because I thought, uh, I

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Speaker 1: thought Katie was the coolest, and I thought, yeah, so possibly,

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Speaker 1: and Rebecca was a good friend of mine too, so

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Speaker 1: maybe Unfortunately, and I believe I've shared this story on

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Speaker 1: the show before, I destroyed everything I wrote, whether that

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Speaker 1: was like books that I wrote or stories I wrote

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Speaker 1: from pretty much anytime during my primary education, so kindergarten

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Speaker 1: to high school.

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Speaker 2: I got rid of all of them.

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Speaker 1: And it makes me very sad because I do think

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Speaker 1: there would be some wonderfully embarrassing things that I could uncover, Yes,

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Speaker 1: but also just I think that it could be telling

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Speaker 1: to look back on some of the entries and be like, oh,

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Speaker 1: you didn't know you were struggling with this or just

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Speaker 1: this like p of who I was that I hadn't

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Speaker 1: accepted yet or didn't realize what quite what was going

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Speaker 1: on or what I was wrestling with because I did

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Speaker 1: keep I was pretty regular in and updating my journal

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Speaker 1: or diary whichever oh it was.

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Speaker 2: It had a unicorn on the front. It had key.

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Speaker 2: It was cool, it was so mine mine too.

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Speaker 3: I didn't have a unicorn, but it definitely had the

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Speaker 3: keys all that. I also did a friends only file

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Speaker 3: thing that also.

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Speaker 1: You told me, Well, see the thing is, I still

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Speaker 1: have the key, and it's so flimsy, like it would

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Speaker 1: have been so easy to get into that diary.

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Speaker 2: If somebody wanted.

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Speaker 4: To just good paper clip, I think you could have

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Speaker 4: literally just cried it. Okay, but I thought it was

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Speaker 4: really cool, very key around my neck.

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Speaker 2: It felt me, it did, it did.

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Speaker 1: So I I wanted to ask this, and before we

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Speaker 1: get into the episode of very quick trigger warning, a

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Speaker 1: brief mention of sexual trauma and eating disorders.

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Speaker 2: Very brief, but just in case.

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Speaker 1: I wanted to talk about this because I have been

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Speaker 1: discussing my experience being queer and kind of claiming that

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Speaker 1: identity and the journey I've gone through with it, and

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Speaker 1: all the questions and looking back and subscribing meaning to

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Speaker 1: things where I didn't understand at the.

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Speaker 2: Time what was going on. But now that I look.

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Speaker 1: Back, I'm like, oh, yeah, okay, you just didn't realize

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Speaker 1: that you identified in this way.

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Speaker 2: And I'm gonna go ahead and say.

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Speaker 1: To you, if you're like me and you connect so

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Speaker 1: hard with fictional characters, or you were like I prefer

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Speaker 1: this or this or this, this is a very anti

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Speaker 1: citric episode. So if you don't like me, you can

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Speaker 1: click away. If you prefer Samantha this.

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Speaker 3: That everybody wants to hear, keep going.

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Speaker 2: Yes, okay, thank you.

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Speaker 1: Well, several of you have sent me messages asking about

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Speaker 1: this journey and if I could ask me if I

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Speaker 1: would share it with you, and I'm always happy to share.

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Speaker 1: And I thought that I would just say it on

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Speaker 1: podcasts since it is Pride months. This is the kind

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Speaker 1: of edited message I sent to our dear listener and

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Speaker 1: friend Jamie, who asked me about about my journey, was

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Speaker 1: so supportive and also open in her own So this

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Speaker 1: is a message that I sent to her, and I

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Speaker 1: thought I would just share it with everybody.

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Speaker 2: So it feels like reading a diary entry. Though.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, so it's a little weird, but bear with me.

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Speaker 1: I can't remember a time ever wanting to have sex,

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Speaker 1: and I never once had sex that I wanted to have.

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Speaker 1: In high school, I pretended I did want to have

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Speaker 1: sex to fit in. I thought that eventually it would

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Speaker 1: kick in, that maybe I was just like a late bloomer,

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Speaker 1: as they say. I also thought maybe I was just

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Speaker 1: a prude because I was very religious at a time.

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Speaker 1: I won't too, so I thought maybe I had just

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Speaker 1: soaked up these messages and I didn't realize it. And

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Speaker 1: even though I think of myself as a very liberal person.

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Speaker 1: I had been raised in a pretty conservative environment. Maybe

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Speaker 1: I just absorbed all that. This was all complicated by

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Speaker 1: the fact that there were all these rumors that I

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Speaker 1: was a slut flying around. So people assumed I wanted

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Speaker 1: to have a lot of sex and that I had

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Speaker 1: had a lot of sex, and that was in part.

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Speaker 2: I don't want to say my.

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Speaker 1: Fault, but I again, I would make these sexual jokes

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Speaker 1: because I wanted to fit in, and I was kind

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Speaker 1: of over compensating because I really didn't want to have sex,

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Speaker 1: so I went over the top implying that I did.

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Speaker 3: I did the same thing. Yeah, except I'm not an ace,

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Speaker 3: But yes, I did the same thing as a kid.

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Speaker 3: I was trying to be cool. So I was a kid.

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Speaker 3: I knew all about sex, which was funny as I

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Speaker 3: didn't know anything about sex.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I had to look up what sex was in

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Speaker 1: an encyclopedia.

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Speaker 2: And trust me that it is not how you want

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Speaker 2: to learn what it is.

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Speaker 3: I don't know. I asked my mom what a blowjob was,

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Speaker 3: and that was really comfortable.

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Speaker 2: Oh, I'm sure it was positive that it was.

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Speaker 1: And yes, sometimes I did, and I still do, feel

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Speaker 1: an intense attraction to people, very rarely physical attraction. Usually

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Speaker 1: if that happens, then it happens after the emotional attraction,

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Speaker 1: but not sexual And like, sometimes I do like kissing

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Speaker 1: and cuddling, but I'm too afraid to do it because

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Speaker 1: I feel like it's going to escalate. And like I

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Speaker 1: said in a recent happy hour, I'm afraid I won't

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Speaker 1: stand up for myself or say I don't want this

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Speaker 1: because I'm so used to pleasing other people, but also

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Speaker 1: doubting what I my own self and knowing what I

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Speaker 1: actually do want, I will question that too, like maybe

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Speaker 1: you do want this, I like, I don't think so,

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Speaker 1: and then that just.

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Speaker 2: Becomes this loop that is not helpful.

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Speaker 1: When I got to college, I tried really hard to

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Speaker 1: convince myself I wanted to have sex or that I

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Speaker 1: just had to get over it and have sex with

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Speaker 1: people until I liked it. And this is when I

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Speaker 1: started dating men and women. But I always felt safer

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Speaker 1: with women because of my past with sexual abuse and trauma.

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Speaker 2: I thought maybe one day something.

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Speaker 1: Would click, which sounds so silly now that I've been

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Speaker 1: doing years of therapy, like that one day it would

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Speaker 1: just be fine. I did a lot of things I

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Speaker 1: didn't want to do because of this, and that makes

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Speaker 1: me really sad and agree that.

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Speaker 2: That's one of the things that sticks with me.

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Speaker 1: I also was state raped in college, so I had

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Speaker 1: a new like I had a new trauma on top

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Speaker 1: of all this old trauma. So I thought, maybe that's

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Speaker 1: why I didn't want to have sex. And yeah, my

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Speaker 1: trauma goes back to like some of my first memories.

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Speaker 1: So I was like, this has just been with me

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Speaker 1: this whole time, so how can I know for sure?

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Speaker 1: And I also realized that the eating disorder I had

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Speaker 1: messes with sex drive, so I thought it could be that.

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Speaker 1: Basically all of these doubts and questions. Then I started

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Speaker 1: as an intern on this very show back in twenty eleven.

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Speaker 1: I had just graduated college, and we did an episode

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Speaker 1: on being ace and being a romantic and I remember thinking,

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Speaker 1: huh uh, that's the first I've heard about this other

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Speaker 1: than sort of yeah, joking misrepresentation of it, Like I

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Speaker 1: have more than one memory of being laughed at or

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Speaker 1: hearing someone else get laughed at when they would talk

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Speaker 1: about it. And I told my then boyfriend about it,

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Speaker 1: and he said it made him sad because he thought

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Speaker 1: people who identified that way were clearly damaged and we

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Speaker 1: broke up soon after that. Okay, yeah, and I kept

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Speaker 1: thinking about it, but I was really torn about the intersection, yeah,

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Speaker 1: of this sexual trauma and eating disorders and being ace and.

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Speaker 2: Where that left me. Also at the time, that was

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Speaker 2: when there was all this like.

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Speaker 1: I don't know if science is the right word, but

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Speaker 1: people were like, you know, maybe we can just boost

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Speaker 1: women's sex drive, as if women just in general don't

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Speaker 1: have a high enough sex drive, instead of maybe asking

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Speaker 1: other questions. And because my dad was at that time

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Speaker 1: he wanted to have grandkids, I wanted that for him.

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Speaker 1: At the time, of my siblings, I was the one

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Speaker 1: that had the best shot. And because our society does

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Speaker 1: tell us that success equal stable relationship and or kids,

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Speaker 1: and your value as a woman is desirability, I tried

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Speaker 1: so hard, so hard to make relationship work, and I

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Speaker 1: felt incredibly guilty that I never wanted sex, and I

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Speaker 1: reached the point I really couldn't even have sex without

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Speaker 1: having a massive panic attack, like it almost never happened

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Speaker 1: because it would like come time and I would freak out.

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Speaker 1: And when my last boyfriend and I broke up, he said, like,

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Speaker 1: I can feel myself beginning to resent you. And one

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Speaker 1: of the things about that is I was resenting myself too,

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Speaker 1: because I knew. I knew that that was a piece

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Speaker 1: that was missing and that I was We didn't communicate

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Speaker 1: about it openly, and that was on both of us.

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Speaker 2: But I was just internalizing all of this stuff and

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Speaker 2: thinking of how he sees.

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Speaker 1: Me and avoiding the topic at all costs, which isn't healthy.

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Speaker 1: And yeah, we thought, both of us thought that eventually

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Speaker 1: i'd get there again, that it might just go away,

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Speaker 1: that maybe I would want to have sex one day.

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Speaker 1: And yeah, now I've come to realize that that was

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Speaker 1: not the case, and that I shouldn't have tried to

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Speaker 1: force it. I don't really blame either of us because

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Speaker 1: we were younger and I didn't know. I do think

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Speaker 1: we both could have communicated way better, but I don't

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Speaker 1: That's just where we were in that time. But yeah,

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Speaker 1: sex is not something I want or really think about,

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Speaker 1: even though I do sometimes wish it was, and sometimes

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Speaker 1: I still want other aspects of a physical relationship. Mostly

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Speaker 1: I just want a companion that I can kiss and

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Speaker 1: cuddle and occasionally feel up. But my trust issues are

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Speaker 1: so severe it's going to take a long time before

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Speaker 1: I reach that point. If I ever ever reach that point,

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Speaker 1: I like to believe being in a healthy relationship as

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Speaker 1: an asexual person exists, and I will put in here Jamie,

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Speaker 1: who I was corresponding with with this, she is a

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Speaker 1: good example of that. She has found that and I

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Speaker 1: know that it does exist. So this is also a

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Speaker 1: couple of years old when I wrote this. It's interesting

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Speaker 1: to see how I've changed even from this. But yeah,

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Speaker 1: I've felt like something's wrong with me my entire life,

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Speaker 1: and I've done so much that I wished I hadn't

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Speaker 1: to fit in. So knowing that there are others out

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Speaker 1: there like me, it's hugely validating. And to this day

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Speaker 1: it blows my mind that I was willing to get

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Speaker 1: married and have kids with someone I wasn't in love

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Speaker 1: with to please my dad, and that even to this day,

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Speaker 1: I'm both scared bi sexual attraction and feel like I

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Speaker 1: need it to prove my worth and that sends me

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Speaker 1: on a very dark cycle. And at this the time

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Speaker 1: I was writing this, I had recently had a friend

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Speaker 1: of my family's say she was married to someone who

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Speaker 1: didn't want to have sex and how sad that made

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Speaker 1: her and how that something had to be wrong with

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Speaker 1: him and that's why they broke up. And that cultural

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Speaker 1: association between love and sex has been one that I

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Speaker 1: have been struggling with. I've been talking about it on

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Speaker 1: this fe show, just because that's how it's commonly depicted,

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Speaker 1: and that's that makes me feel like a failure, like

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Speaker 1: I owe someone something or else I'm just a tease

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Speaker 1: or it's not love, and I know that's not true.

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Speaker 2: I know it's not true.

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Speaker 1: And you can't have healthy relationships without sex, and even

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Speaker 1: romantic relationships without sex. It's just been it's a lot

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Speaker 1: of stuff I have to unlearn, right.

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Speaker 3: And you're not the only one. Just even without identifying

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Speaker 3: as aces, it's still a complication in trying to understand

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Speaker 3: the implications of sex and what that means in it.

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Speaker 3: It has become such a oh, it's a holdover, especially

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Speaker 3: for young girls and just people in general who feel

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Speaker 3: vulnerable when it comes to what that means, and oftentimes

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Speaker 3: the misconceptions that usually benefit men yeah and harm women

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Speaker 3: in general. And then again, our value is still undermined

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Speaker 3: by what someone else's attraction to them. It's just such

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Speaker 3: a gross aspect in general, and it has led into

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Speaker 3: a whole societal failing. Yeah, but we're not going to

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Speaker 3: get into all that. But yeah, I know, I'm very

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Speaker 3: proud of who you are, and I think you have

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Speaker 3: done a phenomenal job of being an example for others

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Speaker 3: and the honesty that comes out is just as much

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Speaker 3: of working progress for everyone else who trying to learn

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Speaker 3: anything about themselves in general, it has been beautiful.

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Speaker 1: Well, I am proud of who you are to submit that. Yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: And like I said in that happy hour, we did something.

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Speaker 1: I'm still learning and I still have questions and I

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Speaker 1: you listeners have just.

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Speaker 2: Been so helpful for all of this.

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Speaker 1: And when I hear from someone who's like, oh, you've

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Speaker 1: helped me, hearing your story helped me, that is That's

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Speaker 1: what this is all about. That is so amazing and

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Speaker 1: I'm so happy that we can connect on that way

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Speaker 1: and find community in that way. So that being said,

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Speaker 1: thank you so much for listening to my story. We

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Speaker 1: always really appreciate hearing from you. If you would like

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Speaker 1: to contact as you can or email is Stuff Media Mom

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Speaker 1: Stuff at iHeartMedia dot com. You can find us on

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Speaker 1: Instagram at stuff I've Never Told You or on Twitter

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Speaker 1: at mom Stuff podcast.

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Speaker 2: Thanks as always to our super producer Christina.

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Speaker 3: We're always proud of you too, Yes Yes.

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Speaker 1: And thanks to you for listening Stuff I've Never Told

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Speaker 1: yousproduction of iHeartRadio. For more podcasts from iHeartRadio is the

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Speaker 1: iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your

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Speaker 1: favorite shows.