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Speaker 1: Welcome to the Wired to Hunt podcast, your home for

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Speaker 1: deer hunting news, stories and strategies, and now your host,

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Speaker 1: Mark Kenyon. Welcome to the Wired to Hunt podcast. I'm

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Speaker 1: your host, Mark Kenyan, and this is episode number four

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Speaker 1: oh three, and today we're kicking off a new series

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Speaker 1: in which we're diving deep into specific types of habitat

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Speaker 1: with a roundtable of experts. And today that's hill country

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Speaker 1: habitat and we're talking with Andy May, Joe Elsinger, and

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Speaker 1: Justin Wright. All Right, welcome to the Wired to Hunt podcast,

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Speaker 1: brought to you by on X. Today we're kicking off

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Speaker 1: a new series in this series is all about getting

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Speaker 1: into the nitty gritty details of specific types of habitat

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Speaker 1: across the country. If you were to look across the country,

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Speaker 1: you can kind of bucket certain parts of you know,

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Speaker 1: the deer hunting world. Within these these I guess, for

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Speaker 1: lack of better world categories, you've got hill country, like

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Speaker 1: what we're talking about today. You could say we've got

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Speaker 1: agricultural land. You could say there's big woods habitat, there's swamps,

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Speaker 1: there's mountains, there's open country. There's all these different types

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Speaker 1: of ground we might spend our time hunting deer, and

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Speaker 1: each one of these different locations and types can be

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Speaker 1: found really in different parts of the country, but each

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Speaker 1: of them requires a different set of ideas and skills

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Speaker 1: and information and and even hunting philosophies. And so what

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Speaker 1: we're trying to do over the next I don't know

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Speaker 1: how many weeks it's gonna end up being, but we're

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Speaker 1: going to get a collection of experts on these topics

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Speaker 1: together to talk through all the different things they think

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Speaker 1: about when it comes to these specific kinds of places

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Speaker 1: we hunt. And this was inspired by my buddy Andy May.

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Speaker 1: If you listen to the podcast, you know Andy. He's

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Speaker 1: he's one of the very best deer hunters in the country.

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Speaker 1: I'm convinced of that, and he does it all. D

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Speaker 1: I y a lot of public land of private land

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Speaker 1: by permission, and he he is one of these guys

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Speaker 1: who I frequently looked to for inspiration or guidance. And

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Speaker 1: and the interesting thing is that he came to me

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Speaker 1: with this idea saying, hey, man, I am trying to

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Speaker 1: learn more. This is one of the best guys out

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Speaker 1: there in the world, saying I'm trying to learn more.

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Speaker 1: And the way he was trying to learn more. It

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Speaker 1: was by pulling in these groups of people who he

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Speaker 1: viewed his experts on these topics and picking their brain.

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Speaker 1: And so we got to think, and what if we

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Speaker 1: did that, but instead of it just being, you know,

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Speaker 1: on a phone by ourselves, what if we share that

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Speaker 1: with everybody out there. What if we share that with

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Speaker 1: all the deer hunters out there that are probably curious

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Speaker 1: about the same thing. So I tasked Andy with coming

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Speaker 1: up with the people he wants to hear from, the

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Speaker 1: people that he views as being the most likely to

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Speaker 1: teach him something new about each of these different habitat types.

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Speaker 1: And then we set out to schedule these conversations and

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Speaker 1: to get these groups of people together where each one

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Speaker 1: of us can share our ideas and then balance ideas

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Speaker 1: off each other, maybe argued from perspectives, maybe agree, maybe not.

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Speaker 1: Today we're starting that, and today, as I mentioned, it's

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Speaker 1: hill country. We've got Andy kind of leading the discussion.

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Speaker 1: I'm sitting in as uh as ah, I don't know,

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Speaker 1: steering the bus as we go kind of character. And

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Speaker 1: then we're also joined by Joe al Singer and Justin Wright,

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Speaker 1: and I have Andy introduced these guys here in a minute,

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Speaker 1: so you can learn more about why he views them

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Speaker 1: as the right expert to talk about Hell Country hunting.

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Speaker 1: But I just gotta say, this is a riveting conversation.

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Speaker 1: And yeah, I know when this episode is coming out,

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Speaker 1: it's January, a lot of us are maybe taking a

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Speaker 1: little time away from deer hunting. But now is the

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Speaker 1: time to learn. Now was the time to be thinking.

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Speaker 1: Now is the time to be planning for the next

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Speaker 1: hunting season. And I think this conversation, if it does

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Speaker 1: anything like what it did for me, it's gonna give

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Speaker 1: you that kick in the butt to jump right back

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Speaker 1: into it. And uh, I'm pretty excited about that. So

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Speaker 1: with all that out of the way, I will just

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Speaker 1: uh let you get right into it. I hope you

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Speaker 1: enjoy it. And here we go with my conversation with

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Speaker 1: Andy May, Joe Elsinger, and Justin right all right with

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Speaker 1: me on the phone. We have got kind of the

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Speaker 1: if you were, if you're if you're a superhero fan,

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Speaker 1: you like those Marvel movies, imagine the Avengers of the

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Speaker 1: deer hunting world. We've got Andy May, Justin Wright, and

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Speaker 1: Joe Elsinger on the phone with me. I might be

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Speaker 1: you know that character. If you have you've ever seen

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Speaker 1: these movies, Samuel Jackson is the guy that I don't

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Speaker 1: even know what his name is in the movies, but

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Speaker 1: he's just kind of the guy that says, you do this,

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Speaker 1: what do you think about this? And then he sits

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Speaker 1: back in the office and lets them all do the fighting.

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Speaker 1: That's kind of my role here tonight. So so what

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Speaker 1: I wanna do? Um And and rather than do the

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Speaker 1: whole like introduction thing that we do on a lot

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Speaker 1: of podcasts, I don't think I'm gonna do that as

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Speaker 1: normal because there's there's four of us and there's so

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Speaker 1: much good stuff to talk about. UM. I want to

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Speaker 1: begin with you, Andy, because you and I were having

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Speaker 1: a conversation the other day, and the conversation is what

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Speaker 1: sparked us doing this podcast, and I'd love to get

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Speaker 1: you to explain that a little bit more. You were saying,

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Speaker 1: I remember I was pacing back and forth in my

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Speaker 1: living room as we were talking. You're stressing me out

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Speaker 1: so much without you're saying, because you're saying, man, you know,

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Speaker 1: I just feel like I've never been more frustrated in

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Speaker 1: a hunting season than I was this past year. And

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Speaker 1: I'm thinking to myself, Andy, you had one of the

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Speaker 1: most successful hunting seasons like any normal person could ever

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Speaker 1: ask for. You killed three or four really impressive mature

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Speaker 1: white tail box, he killed a giant mule dere and

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Speaker 1: still you were sitting here focusing on how can I

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Speaker 1: get better? How can I learn more about this terrain?

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Speaker 1: How could I figure out what to do in this

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Speaker 1: kind of situation or this kind of situation. And you

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Speaker 1: were telling me how you were, you know, reinvigorated and

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Speaker 1: just chomping at the bit to get better, to to

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Speaker 1: talk to more people, to get more ideas, and I

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Speaker 1: it was it was, I don't know what it was.

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Speaker 1: It was. It was maybe inspiring or maybe it made

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Speaker 1: me hate you just a little bit more that you

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Speaker 1: were going to get even better than you already hard

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Speaker 1: And so what I what I wanted to just can

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Speaker 1: you can you explain like where that? Can you explain

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Speaker 1: your mindset after the season you have had and where

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Speaker 1: you are now that has led you to pulling people

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Speaker 1: like this together to have in depth conversations. How how

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Speaker 1: did you get here? Andy? Why why do you think

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Speaker 1: this way? Well? I think I kind of always I've

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Speaker 1: always had that mindset I know, I've mentioned it in

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Speaker 1: a lot of podcasts. You know, I think when I

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Speaker 1: really think about my goal, you know, my main goals

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Speaker 1: as a deer hunter is UM, I just want to

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Speaker 1: I would just want to become the best hunter that

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Speaker 1: I can be UM. And I always have. I've always

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Speaker 1: had that real strong drive to learn in UM, seek

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Speaker 1: out information from guys that I think are more knowledgeable

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Speaker 1: than me and more skilled than me. UM. This year,

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Speaker 1: I I'm not I'm I'm not asking anyone to feel

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Speaker 1: sorry for me, but it's just how I feel this year.

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Speaker 1: I did have some great success I had some phenomenal

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Speaker 1: hunts UM, but I made some really key mistakes on

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Speaker 1: some really big deer this year UM that have really

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Speaker 1: left up a bad taste in my mouth. I take

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Speaker 1: I take UH failure pretty hard. I Mean, the successes

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Speaker 1: are great, UM, but when I fail at something that

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Speaker 1: I did wrong or that I should have done that

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Speaker 1: I could have done, man, those really stick with me.

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Speaker 1: And I don't know, I guess it's just the way

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Speaker 1: I'm wired. But there was a couple, I don't know,

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Speaker 1: just a couple of situations and hunts and and times

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Speaker 1: throughout the season where I just felt real frustrated. UM.

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Speaker 1: You know, I had four great hunts, but I hunted

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Speaker 1: more than I ever did this year, and there was

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Speaker 1: a lot of time in between those and around those

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Speaker 1: where you know, I felt, I don't know, I felt

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Speaker 1: like I was really struggling and UM just not I

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Speaker 1: wouldn't say lost, but I just felt like I wasn't

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Speaker 1: on top of my game, I guess. And you know,

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Speaker 1: none of us are going to be, you know, deadly

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Speaker 1: a percent of the time, but you know, it does

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Speaker 1: get a little frustrating with the majority of your season,

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Speaker 1: you feel like that. I haven't felt like that in

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Speaker 1: quite a while. I certainly have moments, but I guess

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Speaker 1: I came out of the season, UM, not liking that feeling.

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Speaker 1: And you said it best. I just felt, UM, I

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Speaker 1: guess re energized to really really try to improve some

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Speaker 1: of these areas that I feel uh I could improve in,

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Speaker 1: UM and one of the areas UM that I certainly

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Speaker 1: felt competent in, but I wouldn't say My confidence is

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Speaker 1: the highest. UH is in hill country, UM, and I've

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Speaker 1: been hunting more and more of that. I really like

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Speaker 1: the hills. I feel I'm I feel like I'm maybe

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Speaker 1: a little above average. But I know a couple of

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Speaker 1: guys that I mean, as far as I'm concerned, there

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Speaker 1: two of the best hill country guys UM in the country.

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Speaker 1: I'm I know there's guys out there that we don't know.

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Speaker 1: I'm sure they're not gonna agree with that, But I mean,

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Speaker 1: I know deer and I know deer hunting, and I

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Speaker 1: don't deer hunters, and these guys are some of the best.

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Speaker 1: And they're not only some of the best deer hunters,

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Speaker 1: are just some of the best guys. Um. They're consistent,

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Speaker 1: they're d i y guys like like me. Um, they

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Speaker 1: hunt a lot of pressured land. UM. I don't know.

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Speaker 1: I just look up to him. And we're lucky enough

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Speaker 1: to have both those guys on here now. So uh.

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Speaker 1: The first guy, Joe L. Singer. UM. A lot of

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Speaker 1: people you know Joe. He's been on a few podcasts.

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Speaker 1: He's kind of a legend on the hunting Beast. Um Man.

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Speaker 1: Joe is just he's just one of those guys that

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Speaker 1: when you hear about his season and the way he hunts, UM,

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Speaker 1: it kind of makes you feel like you don't know

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Speaker 1: a whole lot. Um. He's just he his his hunts

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Speaker 1: are very detail oriented. They're almost um they almost that

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Speaker 1: he almost like engineers them in his mind with the

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Speaker 1: way his setups are in the conditions and he takes

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Speaker 1: so many things into account. And I just really admire

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Speaker 1: the way he hunts and the way he goes about

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Speaker 1: his hunts because it's a it's a little different than me. Um,

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Speaker 1: we have some similarities, but uh, he just he just

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Speaker 1: takes it to a whole new level, I think with

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Speaker 1: his efficiency and I just he's just a guy that

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Speaker 1: I've always learned from and I've always I've been fortunate

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Speaker 1: enough to become friends with him and keep in contact

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Speaker 1: with him, and I'm just really thankful for that because

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Speaker 1: I've learned a lot from him. Um. The other guy

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Speaker 1: on on the episode today is Justin Wright, who again

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Speaker 1: another hunting beast guy. Um Man probably one of the

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Speaker 1: most deadly guys I know. UM, a straight d I

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Speaker 1: y hunter and he just every year, Um, he just

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Speaker 1: kind of leaves me in awe with what he does

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Speaker 1: on such limited time. Both these guys kind of like myself,

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Speaker 1: maybe even more so definitely this year. UM. I mean

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Speaker 1: these are family guys. These are guys that you know,

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Speaker 1: don't hunt big leases. They don't hunt you know, big

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Speaker 1: family farms. It's a it's a mix of you know,

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Speaker 1: pressured private ground and in public and they travel around

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Speaker 1: a different chunks and they're just as deadly as they come,

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Speaker 1: and they're super efficient. So they're they're family men first,

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Speaker 1: they're good guys first, their humble, but on such limited

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Speaker 1: time they do things that just almost don't seem possible.

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Speaker 1: And both of their specialties I think they're probably deadly

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Speaker 1: just about any situation, but both their specialties are our

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Speaker 1: hill country. And I just feel real fortunate to have

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Speaker 1: them on this episode so that we can all kind

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Speaker 1: of dive into their minds a little bit and learn. Um,

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Speaker 1: it should be a good one. Yeah, Well, I'm I'm

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Speaker 1: feeling the same way. I'm I'm excited. And these are

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Speaker 1: the three of you are all three folks who all

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Speaker 1: of us can learn from me, especially Um. I always

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Speaker 1: feel like with Joe, he's he's of all the different

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Speaker 1: Maybe not everyone, but if I can look at a

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Speaker 1: lot of different people's hunting styles and the way they

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Speaker 1: go about things, I see the way that Joe approaches

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Speaker 1: it and his his analytical mindset. It seems very much

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Speaker 1: like what I want to be, like what I what

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Speaker 1: I try to get to, but I inevitably fall into

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Speaker 1: these circular, circular arguments with myself that send me down

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Speaker 1: different rabbit holes. And and one not of five times

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Speaker 1: I pull it off right. But I feel like every

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Speaker 1: time I get a chance to talk to you, it's

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Speaker 1: going to it's gonna help me get a little bit

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Speaker 1: closer to that goal destination. And and justin, I'm excited

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Speaker 1: that we finally get to talk. Uh, and he has

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Speaker 1: been talking to me about getting you on the podcast

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Speaker 1: for a long time now, so I'm glad it's happening.

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Speaker 1: And um, and I'm gonna kind of play, like I mentioned,

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Speaker 1: I'm gonna kind of sit in the background a little

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Speaker 1: bit and and maybe kind of play the audience member.

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Speaker 1: I'll let Andy be the host. I'll let him drive

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Speaker 1: the ship. He'll be the school bus driver, and I'm

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Speaker 1: gonna be the kid in the back sea of the bus,

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Speaker 1: the kid that's I'm not necessarily gonna be looking out

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Speaker 1: the back window waving at all the other cars. But

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Speaker 1: I will kind of let you guys have this conversation

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Speaker 1: because I know Andy's wanted to have these talks with

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Speaker 1: you guys in more detail, and I'm gonna listen in

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Speaker 1: and when I'm confused by something, or if I hear

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Speaker 1: something that I think other people might be wondering more about,

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Speaker 1: or if you really get my curiosity going, I'll jump in. UM.

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Speaker 1: But otherwise I want to kind of be a fly

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Speaker 1: on the wall and just sit here, sit here in

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Speaker 1: the circle of legends, and see what we can get into.

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Speaker 1: So Andy, let's let's scratch your itch. Where do you

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Speaker 1: want to start? Where? What are you dying to know

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Speaker 1: from these guys to be in this conversation about hill country?

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Speaker 1: All right, Well, let's just start with something that's kinda

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Speaker 1: pretty basic. UM. This is this is what I do

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Speaker 1: when I'm going into a new piece of hill country.

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Speaker 1: When I'm looking at the topo maps, UM, I look

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Speaker 1: for UM ridge systems. I call them dynamic ridge systems.

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Speaker 1: I don't know if that's the right term, but I

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Speaker 1: look for ridge systems that have a lot of terrain features,

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Speaker 1: a lot of points jutting off in different directions. UM

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Speaker 1: saddles benches. The more terrain and the more dynamic it is,

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Speaker 1: the better UM. And those are the ridge systems that

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Speaker 1: I'm kind of drawn to. And I tend to stay

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Speaker 1: away from the ones that are more long um less

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Speaker 1: points maybe you know, maybe just off that beIN ridge,

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Speaker 1: maybe just one or two you know, secondary points. And

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Speaker 1: I guess I've never really been told that that's a

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Speaker 1: good or bad thing, but I wanted to get your

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Speaker 1: guys opinions on that approach, UM, and maybe what if

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Speaker 1: you could dive into what what you look for? If

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Speaker 1: you're starting from scratch, you're going to a whole new

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Speaker 1: piece of hill country, and uh, what you look for?

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Speaker 1: So let's start with you, Joe, Yeah, than Sandy. UM.

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Speaker 1: First off, thanks Mark for having us back on UM noise.

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Speaker 1: Let's say that for justin to this should be a

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Speaker 1: good conversation. But yeah, you're you're definitely feel flattered by

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Speaker 1: your your guys descriptions. UM, maybe we can dive into

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Speaker 1: some of the failures I've had this year, because I

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Speaker 1: had some pretty good luck. But I have to admit

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Speaker 1: that when um Andy described this season as you know,

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Speaker 1: kind of focusing on what went wrong, I have that

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Speaker 1: similar bank set where I royally screwed up a couple

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Speaker 1: of times and and it bugs the economy. So definitely

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Speaker 1: does not go right all the time. Or even most

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Speaker 1: of time for me. So um, but anyway, c civic

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Speaker 1: to this. So yeah, UM, all else being equal, and

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Speaker 1: it really is, uh, the more rugged the ground the

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Speaker 1: better in my opinion. It's just you know, the more

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Speaker 1: terrain features you have, the better, um, hill country. UM,

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Speaker 1: you know, but you don't get that often you can't

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Speaker 1: you know, UM, you might have really you might be

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Speaker 1: hunting properties that are really steep and rugged rugged, or

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Speaker 1: you might be hunting properties that have just gentle rolling

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Speaker 1: hills that funnel the deer way less aggressively. Um. And

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Speaker 1: then um, you know, and some of the gentle hills

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Speaker 1: you have to deal with. Really the the deer move

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Speaker 1: more according to cover than terrain. Um. There's kind of

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Speaker 1: a there's kind of a point where you know, when

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Speaker 1: it becomes the hill has become so steep that the

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Speaker 1: deer have to work going up and down them. That's

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Speaker 1: when the terrain seems to be the dominant um factor

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Speaker 1: and how deer move. And then when it's a little flatter,

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Speaker 1: I couldn't tell you a slope, I couldn't tell you

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Speaker 1: an elevation. UM. It's kind of case by case. We

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Speaker 1: should think of it like that, where the flatter hills. UM,

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Speaker 1: you know, you kind of have to focus more on

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Speaker 1: the cover and additions, et cetera. UM, and the steeper

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Speaker 1: stuff transitions can still be important, but terrain becomes the

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Speaker 1: driving factor for how they move. UM. So yeah, I

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Speaker 1: like points and saddles and UM, you know crows feet

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Speaker 1: ridges where a whole bunch of points come together. That's

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Speaker 1: one of the key areas that I would focus on.

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Speaker 1: You know, when you have a whole bunch of secondary

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Speaker 1: points come together, that's often a really killer area. UM,

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Speaker 1: if the cover is reasonably good conducive for you know,

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Speaker 1: betting on those ends of those points. UM. Benches are

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Speaker 1: another thing, and it Benches are a thing that UM,

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Speaker 1: I think our predecessors long ago kind of realize that

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Speaker 1: wildlife travel on benches and bed on benches. But I

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Speaker 1: don't hear much discussion about benches UM and current hunting community.

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Speaker 1: And they're kind of hard to spot on a TAPLE map.

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Speaker 1: You know, they're just where the contours gets based out

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Speaker 1: a little bit. On the side hills, you have contours

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Speaker 1: that are all stack tight. You know, you show the

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Speaker 1: steep slope and makes the base out and make it

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Speaker 1: tight again. Lots of bench, um, and deer bed on

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Speaker 1: them and they travel on them. So the bigger the hills,

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Speaker 1: they really like those benches, um, some of the three

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Speaker 1: four hundred foot bluffs that I hunt, and they they

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Speaker 1: I really spot those benches and don't seem like you know,

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Speaker 1: the secrets out now talking about it, but don't seem

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Speaker 1: like very many hunters try to hunt those. The wind

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00:19:29,440 --> 00:19:33,520
Speaker 1: can be dicey, but there's ways to you know, um

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Speaker 1: hunts on those benches. So yeah, I guess that's a

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Speaker 1: quick summary of where, um, how how I kind of

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Speaker 1: look at it. Um. They basically similar to you Andy

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Speaker 1: that the more more train features the better usually, Um,

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Speaker 1: that really final deer. Yeah, it's interesting. Um, that's what

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Speaker 1: I look for now. Um. But my first year hunting Iowa, UM,

351
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Speaker 1: I was hunting hill country and I was on a

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Speaker 1: ridge that had it was a CRP field on top,

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Speaker 1: so they had an opening on the top that was

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Speaker 1: good cover. It probably wouldn't hunt the inside corner, right

355
00:20:17,200 --> 00:20:23,360
Speaker 1: I did. Yeah, but this ridge, this ridge was very long, UM,

356
00:20:23,680 --> 00:20:26,679
Speaker 1: didn't have a lot of points uh coming off of it,

357
00:20:26,760 --> 00:20:28,439
Speaker 1: so it was kind of you know, it lacked a

358
00:20:28,440 --> 00:20:32,840
Speaker 1: lot of features. But on the end of that long point, um,

359
00:20:32,880 --> 00:20:35,600
Speaker 1: just kind of a long, narrow point without much going on,

360
00:20:36,800 --> 00:20:40,400
Speaker 1: was to this day the biggest typical buck um I've

361
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Speaker 1: ever seen in Iowa. And it was interesting, you know.

362
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Speaker 1: I mean, like now, I don't draw a lot of

363
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Speaker 1: tension to those types of ridges, uh for some reason.

364
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Speaker 1: But I did see a real big but I didn't

365
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Speaker 1: see a lot of deer, but I did see a

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Speaker 1: real big buck betted on the end of that. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: And length the length of a ridge system. So if

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Speaker 1: you're right hunting other times a year, you know de

369
00:21:04,840 --> 00:21:09,160
Speaker 1: aren't moving as far. But rot um, those long ridges

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Speaker 1: are megafunnels. You know, deer bucks are running up and down.

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Speaker 1: So if you've got a ridge that system that's half

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Speaker 1: a mile long or more and you can get in

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Speaker 1: the middle of it, Um, that's even if you're not

374
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Speaker 1: real close to betting. If it's peak rot and you

375
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Speaker 1: know you've got decent deer population, you can have you know,

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Speaker 1: just that's one of those things. Going blind, you could

377
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Speaker 1: have a great hunt. I agree. Um. So the um particularly,

378
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Speaker 1: I would say during the rot, you know, outside of

379
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Speaker 1: the rout, you kind of have to look at more

380
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Speaker 1: than micro features exactly where they're betting where they're feeding. Yeah, okay,

381
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Speaker 1: hey Justin how about you, Yeah, I mean I would

382
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Speaker 1: thinking back kind of also what both of you guys said, Um,

383
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Speaker 1: I was talking about the long ridges, and I know

384
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Speaker 1: that's something before I think, you know, you kind of

385
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Speaker 1: look past those. UM. I have seen a lot of

386
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Speaker 1: uh there in the ride. I've seen a lot of

387
00:22:07,080 --> 00:22:10,120
Speaker 1: cruising on the side of those, um, you know, kind

388
00:22:10,119 --> 00:22:13,439
Speaker 1: of going back and forth, uh, checking different doe groups

389
00:22:13,440 --> 00:22:15,280
Speaker 1: and stuff, you know, on the ends of those grid

390
00:22:15,359 --> 00:22:18,240
Speaker 1: business stuff. So I would agree with that. But for me,

391
00:22:18,359 --> 00:22:23,920
Speaker 1: I wrote, I've mainly hunted more rolling hills. Um. I've

392
00:22:23,920 --> 00:22:26,040
Speaker 1: got into a little bit of this steeper stuff the

393
00:22:26,080 --> 00:22:28,919
Speaker 1: blow country here in the past few years, and it

394
00:22:29,000 --> 00:22:32,040
Speaker 1: does seem like kind of what Joe said. It seems

395
00:22:32,080 --> 00:22:35,479
Speaker 1: like the deer a little more predictable based on like

396
00:22:35,520 --> 00:22:38,480
Speaker 1: the terrain, you know, drain features kind of funnel them

397
00:22:38,480 --> 00:22:41,520
Speaker 1: a little more. But the rolling hills, for me, it's

398
00:22:41,520 --> 00:22:46,320
Speaker 1: about diversity. I mean, I have to find diversity, you know,

399
00:22:47,119 --> 00:22:52,920
Speaker 1: multiple different uh coverage just coming together. Um, because they

400
00:22:52,920 --> 00:22:55,280
Speaker 1: really seemed to kind of like Joe said, they really

401
00:22:55,280 --> 00:22:58,560
Speaker 1: seemed to stick to cover more so than kind of

402
00:22:58,560 --> 00:23:01,280
Speaker 1: the terrain funnel on them. And I'll be honest, I

403
00:23:01,359 --> 00:23:04,280
Speaker 1: think in the in the rolling kills the winds and suffer,

404
00:23:05,160 --> 00:23:07,560
Speaker 1: they just seem to be a little bit more difficult

405
00:23:07,840 --> 00:23:10,639
Speaker 1: because of the thermals don't have white and strong plate.

406
00:23:11,080 --> 00:23:13,560
Speaker 1: You know. Is that you in like the secret drink

407
00:23:14,240 --> 00:23:18,960
Speaker 1: um so me, Yeah, it's diversity. Um. I do have

408
00:23:19,040 --> 00:23:22,680
Speaker 1: to say, I've seen a lot of I've kicked a

409
00:23:22,760 --> 00:23:24,639
Speaker 1: lot of bucks. Uff. I kill a lot of bucks

410
00:23:25,320 --> 00:23:29,280
Speaker 1: in these bowl shaped ridges. These bridges it's like so

411
00:23:29,320 --> 00:23:31,119
Speaker 1: it would be like a ridge like in the shape

412
00:23:31,119 --> 00:23:34,919
Speaker 1: of the seed, and it has several secondary points that

413
00:23:34,960 --> 00:23:37,880
Speaker 1: shut down off of it, offering a you know, several

414
00:23:37,960 --> 00:23:41,639
Speaker 1: different um points to bed on based on the winds

415
00:23:41,640 --> 00:23:44,919
Speaker 1: and stuff. And I have seen a ton of box

416
00:23:44,960 --> 00:23:47,840
Speaker 1: betting in those. M hmm. That's really one thing that

417
00:23:47,880 --> 00:23:50,679
Speaker 1: I that I really looked for. I just had some

418
00:23:50,720 --> 00:23:55,000
Speaker 1: really good love to quick with those. Yeah. So yeah,

419
00:23:55,080 --> 00:23:56,520
Speaker 1: I mean you guys kind of get on it though,

420
00:23:56,640 --> 00:23:59,480
Speaker 1: you know pretty much pretty much the same. I mean,

421
00:23:59,720 --> 00:24:03,600
Speaker 1: you know, saddles and and all. That's the points. Uh,

422
00:24:04,200 --> 00:24:06,639
Speaker 1: you know, that's all things I look for. But probably

423
00:24:06,680 --> 00:24:08,959
Speaker 1: the first thing would be the bull. I don't know,

424
00:24:09,040 --> 00:24:11,600
Speaker 1: I've just had a lot of u uh finding bucks

425
00:24:11,600 --> 00:24:18,040
Speaker 1: better than Yeah, let's uh. I was gonna ask about

426
00:24:18,040 --> 00:24:21,320
Speaker 1: bowls a little later. But since we're on that and

427
00:24:21,359 --> 00:24:25,919
Speaker 1: we're talking about bucks betting, UM, let's talk about like

428
00:24:26,000 --> 00:24:28,320
Speaker 1: we you know, you hear about the leeward side of

429
00:24:28,320 --> 00:24:31,320
Speaker 1: the ridge, you know, on the points and whatnot, and

430
00:24:31,040 --> 00:24:35,920
Speaker 1: and that's really the majority of what you hear about

431
00:24:36,040 --> 00:24:38,159
Speaker 1: as far as the mature bucks betting, so we know

432
00:24:38,280 --> 00:24:41,640
Speaker 1: that's one of the features. And now Justin and Joe

433
00:24:41,760 --> 00:24:44,119
Speaker 1: you're mentioned you know these bowls, and I've seen that

434
00:24:44,160 --> 00:24:48,719
Speaker 1: as well. Um. I've also seen him down low and

435
00:24:48,800 --> 00:24:53,959
Speaker 1: I've also seen them bed just right at the right

436
00:24:54,000 --> 00:24:58,040
Speaker 1: at the head of a drainage on a really thick hillside,

437
00:24:58,080 --> 00:25:02,080
Speaker 1: like right at the right where drainage comes to, uh

438
00:25:02,240 --> 00:25:04,919
Speaker 1: where it dies off at the top there below the

439
00:25:04,960 --> 00:25:07,040
Speaker 1: ridge top, but at the head of the drainage. So

440
00:25:07,359 --> 00:25:10,680
Speaker 1: can you guys, Justin, let's start with you. Why don't

441
00:25:10,720 --> 00:25:14,199
Speaker 1: you go through some of the all the types of

442
00:25:14,240 --> 00:25:16,840
Speaker 1: features that you have seen mature bucks bet on it

443
00:25:17,119 --> 00:25:22,000
Speaker 1: besides just points, I've seen them bet download two um

444
00:25:22,040 --> 00:25:24,880
Speaker 1: a lot of times. I don't know if that's more

445
00:25:24,920 --> 00:25:28,040
Speaker 1: based on so like here, for instance, than the majority

446
00:25:28,040 --> 00:25:30,760
Speaker 1: of the stuffy hunt. A lot of your access would

447
00:25:30,760 --> 00:25:34,280
Speaker 1: be from the tops of these bridges. Um. And then

448
00:25:34,359 --> 00:25:37,040
Speaker 1: guys will you know, they'll go up a certain distance

449
00:25:37,080 --> 00:25:39,000
Speaker 1: and then they'll they'll shut down off this bridge and

450
00:25:39,000 --> 00:25:40,520
Speaker 1: they'll hunt that. Well. I don't know if it's just

451
00:25:41,240 --> 00:25:42,880
Speaker 1: you know, if the deer is gonna survive there, they're

452
00:25:42,920 --> 00:25:45,199
Speaker 1: gonna have to do something to get away from that pressure,

453
00:25:45,240 --> 00:25:48,080
Speaker 1: so they're gonna drop down a little bit lower. Um.

454
00:25:48,119 --> 00:25:51,879
Speaker 1: I don't know about actually betting in the bottom, but um,

455
00:25:51,920 --> 00:25:54,399
Speaker 1: I have seen them be a lot lower on the

456
00:25:54,640 --> 00:25:57,800
Speaker 1: you know, like the points. Uh even I'm talking to

457
00:25:58,040 --> 00:26:01,080
Speaker 1: ten ft from the bottom, you know. And again this

458
00:26:01,119 --> 00:26:05,560
Speaker 1: is more so you're rolling hills. Um. I've seen a

459
00:26:05,640 --> 00:26:07,720
Speaker 1: bed like you said, Andy, I've seen that is ahead

460
00:26:07,760 --> 00:26:12,119
Speaker 1: of drainage systems. And I have seen them bed on

461
00:26:12,520 --> 00:26:15,600
Speaker 1: just like a bench on the side, you know, especially

462
00:26:15,640 --> 00:26:17,720
Speaker 1: in the lake. See that it seems like when the

463
00:26:17,760 --> 00:26:20,399
Speaker 1: weather's cool and they're trying to get some sun, it

464
00:26:20,480 --> 00:26:23,080
Speaker 1: all bed on the south basin slopes and getting out

465
00:26:23,080 --> 00:26:27,080
Speaker 1: of the wind. Um Man, I have seen them bed

466
00:26:27,240 --> 00:26:30,040
Speaker 1: of course on points you know, as the majority of

467
00:26:30,080 --> 00:26:32,680
Speaker 1: the time on the secondary point, Um, is where you'll

468
00:26:32,680 --> 00:26:37,040
Speaker 1: find them. Mm hmm, yeah. I mean even in the

469
00:26:37,200 --> 00:26:41,200
Speaker 1: open you know, hardwoods, if you've got some blowdowns, three

470
00:26:41,280 --> 00:26:43,800
Speaker 1: tops and stuff, it looks rather open, but you've got

471
00:26:43,800 --> 00:26:45,600
Speaker 1: a little bit of cover there, and I've seen them

472
00:26:45,600 --> 00:26:47,960
Speaker 1: bet on that and it could even be up on

473
00:26:48,000 --> 00:26:51,480
Speaker 1: the very top of the ridge even. Um, I've seen

474
00:26:51,520 --> 00:26:53,560
Speaker 1: a bet in a lot of a lot of weird places.

475
00:26:53,560 --> 00:26:56,080
Speaker 1: I know that, you know, I think everybody believes and

476
00:26:56,200 --> 00:26:58,640
Speaker 1: you know, put for the points, and I would say

477
00:26:58,640 --> 00:27:01,119
Speaker 1: that's probably where they bed majority of time. But I

478
00:27:01,200 --> 00:27:03,280
Speaker 1: have I've seen him in a lot of weird and

479
00:27:03,359 --> 00:27:06,560
Speaker 1: odd places. And I'll jump in real quick and ask

480
00:27:06,600 --> 00:27:11,359
Speaker 1: you follow up, justin uh, has it been pretty consistent

481
00:27:12,080 --> 00:27:16,359
Speaker 1: that they use those features in relation to a certain

482
00:27:16,359 --> 00:27:20,040
Speaker 1: wind direction? Like Andy mentioned, typically we'll hear about the

483
00:27:20,119 --> 00:27:23,200
Speaker 1: leeward side of a ridge. Um, how do you think

484
00:27:23,200 --> 00:27:26,520
Speaker 1: about wind when trying to predict you know, where these

485
00:27:26,560 --> 00:27:30,080
Speaker 1: bucks might be betted in that kind of terrain? Yes,

486
00:27:30,119 --> 00:27:35,040
Speaker 1: and no. Um, so I've seen the majority of the time, guest,

487
00:27:35,040 --> 00:27:37,720
Speaker 1: I would say they're betting on, you know, the leeward

488
00:27:37,800 --> 00:27:41,159
Speaker 1: side based on the wind direction and all that. But

489
00:27:41,440 --> 00:27:44,720
Speaker 1: I have seen them. Like take a pole. Um, that's

490
00:27:44,840 --> 00:27:47,520
Speaker 1: kind of hard to point, but like take a bowl

491
00:27:48,040 --> 00:27:51,040
Speaker 1: and say the wind is coming over on like the

492
00:27:51,080 --> 00:27:53,840
Speaker 1: east side of that bowl, and the buck may be

493
00:27:53,960 --> 00:27:58,800
Speaker 1: betted on, uh, like the eastern side of the you know,

494
00:27:58,840 --> 00:28:01,080
Speaker 1: the other ridge system like as a bowl shaped around

495
00:28:01,200 --> 00:28:03,160
Speaker 1: on the other side of it. But the wind will

496
00:28:03,240 --> 00:28:05,199
Speaker 1: kind of come up and go once you get into them.

497
00:28:05,200 --> 00:28:07,560
Speaker 1: A lot of times you still find that the wind

498
00:28:07,640 --> 00:28:09,960
Speaker 1: is doing something kind of funny. So it would like

499
00:28:10,119 --> 00:28:13,480
Speaker 1: roll over that one ridge and cause like a swirling

500
00:28:13,480 --> 00:28:16,600
Speaker 1: effect to where that deer can pretty much I mean

501
00:28:16,640 --> 00:28:19,320
Speaker 1: anything around him. He's gonna he's gonna catch you. You know,

502
00:28:19,440 --> 00:28:21,680
Speaker 1: he's gonna get a whiff of you at some point there.

503
00:28:22,040 --> 00:28:26,640
Speaker 1: But I have seen a bed on windward float. Um.

504
00:28:26,680 --> 00:28:29,440
Speaker 1: You know, it's not always the wind over the back thing.

505
00:28:29,480 --> 00:28:34,720
Speaker 1: I think sometimes visual uh comes into play. Uh. You know,

506
00:28:34,920 --> 00:28:38,320
Speaker 1: so in the winter times and stuff. You know, they

507
00:28:38,400 --> 00:28:40,680
Speaker 1: like to get in suns, so they'll they'll get wherever

508
00:28:40,720 --> 00:28:44,440
Speaker 1: they can do that. But I do believe no matter what,

509
00:28:44,480 --> 00:28:47,320
Speaker 1: they have some sort of an advantage. They're not just

510
00:28:47,320 --> 00:28:50,120
Speaker 1: gonna lay down in the spot that they're vulnerable wind.

511
00:28:51,600 --> 00:28:53,440
Speaker 1: But yeah, I think a lot of times like that.

512
00:28:53,520 --> 00:28:55,400
Speaker 1: Like I said, on the windward slope, I think the

513
00:28:55,400 --> 00:28:57,640
Speaker 1: wind a lot of times. If you get right in

514
00:28:57,680 --> 00:29:00,680
Speaker 1: those beds, you'll start to feel the wind doing some

515
00:29:00,800 --> 00:29:06,320
Speaker 1: funny things as it swirls around or whatever makes sense.

516
00:29:07,080 --> 00:29:12,280
Speaker 1: So Joe, you do you see some of those same things. Yeah,

517
00:29:12,640 --> 00:29:16,200
Speaker 1: justin hit on a lot of the good points. Um.

518
00:29:16,320 --> 00:29:21,960
Speaker 1: I expand on a thing or two that I've seen. Um.

519
00:29:22,000 --> 00:29:25,760
Speaker 1: I think, um bucks, as they the lower they bed,

520
00:29:26,080 --> 00:29:29,880
Speaker 1: the last a line they are to you know, the

521
00:29:29,880 --> 00:29:35,880
Speaker 1: the theward slopes, um so a pie. Yeah, most of

522
00:29:35,880 --> 00:29:37,920
Speaker 1: the time it seems like they are betting on the

523
00:29:37,960 --> 00:29:42,880
Speaker 1: leeward side leeward point, um knobs and stuff as they

524
00:29:42,960 --> 00:29:49,720
Speaker 1: bed down lower. Um. You really seeing break in that correlation. Um.

525
00:29:50,040 --> 00:29:53,880
Speaker 1: And now you see it sometimes and not as often. Um.

526
00:29:54,040 --> 00:29:57,960
Speaker 1: And for reference Herberty reference. You know some people have

527
00:29:58,000 --> 00:30:01,720
Speaker 1: heard this before. But I run a lot of trick cameras. Um.

528
00:30:01,760 --> 00:30:03,920
Speaker 1: I'm not hunting on my cameras. I'm doing it just

529
00:30:03,960 --> 00:30:08,720
Speaker 1: to learn more about deer. So. UM. I leave cameras

530
00:30:08,760 --> 00:30:11,600
Speaker 1: silk and spots for you know, three or four months,

531
00:30:11,960 --> 00:30:16,840
Speaker 1: and then look at that. Look at the observations of

532
00:30:18,280 --> 00:30:22,040
Speaker 1: and correlate them with weather data. UM. You know all

533
00:30:22,440 --> 00:30:31,160
Speaker 1: that stuff UM, wind, temperature, UM pressure, humidity, UM, cloud cover, UH,

534
00:30:31,320 --> 00:30:35,840
Speaker 1: time of year, all that jazz and UM. I see

535
00:30:36,360 --> 00:30:39,680
Speaker 1: a ton of correlations, and sometimes I don't. I don't

536
00:30:39,680 --> 00:30:43,560
Speaker 1: see them. You know, the deer move and bed very consistent,

537
00:30:43,680 --> 00:30:47,680
Speaker 1: the window high down low, there's less that consistency UM.

538
00:30:48,200 --> 00:30:51,960
Speaker 1: And I agree with justin UM. I see bucks that

539
00:30:52,080 --> 00:30:54,200
Speaker 1: and all the time kind of low points or low

540
00:30:54,240 --> 00:30:56,240
Speaker 1: benches so they can kind of look out across the

541
00:30:56,280 --> 00:31:00,520
Speaker 1: bottom UM or a bowl. UM. They love betting around

542
00:31:00,560 --> 00:31:04,880
Speaker 1: those perimeter those bowls UM. And you know that those

543
00:31:05,080 --> 00:31:08,000
Speaker 1: those are kind of thermal HUB. I think, UH see

544
00:31:08,040 --> 00:31:10,400
Speaker 1: a lot of times you'll see the rubs are scrape

545
00:31:11,080 --> 00:31:14,320
Speaker 1: and they bucks dropped. They really like to drop down

546
00:31:14,320 --> 00:31:17,400
Speaker 1: off off their bed down through that bowl and then

547
00:31:17,480 --> 00:31:19,520
Speaker 1: kind off the other side. UM. I see that a

548
00:31:19,520 --> 00:31:22,720
Speaker 1: lot and UM. The one thing I would have there

549
00:31:22,920 --> 00:31:26,959
Speaker 1: is UM. When you're talking bottom, UM, when the bottom

550
00:31:26,960 --> 00:31:30,160
Speaker 1: gets to a certain size, it seems like that's when

551
00:31:30,240 --> 00:31:32,840
Speaker 1: bucks start betting down in it. And not just box,

552
00:31:32,920 --> 00:31:36,440
Speaker 1: but those two UM and I don't know, hundred a

553
00:31:36,440 --> 00:31:42,240
Speaker 1: couple hundred yards apartment yards across UM when deer start

554
00:31:42,400 --> 00:31:46,320
Speaker 1: feeling more secure and bedding down in that bottom um,

555
00:31:46,360 --> 00:31:47,920
Speaker 1: and I think it's a matter of they don't feel

556
00:31:47,960 --> 00:31:50,800
Speaker 1: as trapped. It might be a little claustrophobic if it's

557
00:31:50,800 --> 00:31:54,840
Speaker 1: real tight and constructed, the narrow um bottom, but a

558
00:31:54,880 --> 00:31:58,680
Speaker 1: bigger bottom then they bed down in that cover and

559
00:31:58,760 --> 00:32:01,280
Speaker 1: that's when they start treating that like you know, a

560
00:32:01,360 --> 00:32:07,680
Speaker 1: bigger um, you know, swamp or um, marsh um, even

561
00:32:07,720 --> 00:32:09,840
Speaker 1: though it might not be marshy or swampy, but they're

562
00:32:09,880 --> 00:32:14,080
Speaker 1: betting out in that bigger bottom um, So bring out it.

563
00:32:14,120 --> 00:32:16,200
Speaker 1: That's that's when I think I see them actually bet

564
00:32:16,240 --> 00:32:18,560
Speaker 1: down in there, when it gets a little bigger. You

565
00:32:19,120 --> 00:32:24,840
Speaker 1: have you have you seen Joe any you both Justin Andrew.

566
00:32:24,880 --> 00:32:29,960
Speaker 1: You both mentioned many different types of spots within a

567
00:32:30,080 --> 00:32:33,080
Speaker 1: hill country setting that they could be betted. As I'm

568
00:32:33,160 --> 00:32:36,280
Speaker 1: listening to this, one of the first things I'm wondering is, well,

569
00:32:36,320 --> 00:32:39,000
Speaker 1: how the hell do I figure out what they're using now? Right?

570
00:32:39,040 --> 00:32:40,480
Speaker 1: They could be there, and they could be there, and

571
00:32:40,520 --> 00:32:42,880
Speaker 1: they could be here, and if I was walking onto

572
00:32:42,920 --> 00:32:45,040
Speaker 1: a neat piece of ground, I would just be swimming

573
00:32:45,080 --> 00:32:48,760
Speaker 1: in all these different ideas. Um. One of the first

574
00:32:48,760 --> 00:32:51,600
Speaker 1: things I'm thinking if I was trying to filter this

575
00:32:51,640 --> 00:32:53,680
Speaker 1: down and make sense of it, I would say, okay, well,

576
00:32:54,520 --> 00:32:57,760
Speaker 1: would the time of year change where they'd be betted?

577
00:32:58,400 --> 00:33:01,560
Speaker 1: Do you see any correlation between wan time of the season,

578
00:33:01,640 --> 00:33:04,360
Speaker 1: so early season versus the rut versus late season or

579
00:33:04,400 --> 00:33:07,480
Speaker 1: anything like that that would give you guidance as to

580
00:33:08,200 --> 00:33:11,760
Speaker 1: how to pick your most likely betting spots. Is that

581
00:33:12,000 --> 00:33:13,920
Speaker 1: you know, in the early season, when there's lots of

582
00:33:14,000 --> 00:33:16,400
Speaker 1: leaf cover, they're more likely to be betted high, and

583
00:33:16,640 --> 00:33:18,600
Speaker 1: when it's a late season they're more likely better lower.

584
00:33:18,640 --> 00:33:20,600
Speaker 1: I don't know, is there anything like that that comes

585
00:33:20,640 --> 00:33:27,600
Speaker 1: to mind? Yeah, I definitely have. UM. So, you know,

586
00:33:27,960 --> 00:33:30,920
Speaker 1: in hill country, I would say, general rule of thumb,

587
00:33:31,080 --> 00:33:34,280
Speaker 1: majority of deer going to be bettered up high, but

588
00:33:34,440 --> 00:33:37,520
Speaker 1: there are a lot of like like, it's not a

589
00:33:37,560 --> 00:33:41,840
Speaker 1: big majority, it's a slight majority. Um. So tiny year

590
00:33:41,920 --> 00:33:45,200
Speaker 1: is a big thing, and um, within that time of year,

591
00:33:45,240 --> 00:33:48,440
Speaker 1: the biggest factor is, in my opinion, comfort besides hunting

592
00:33:48,440 --> 00:33:53,360
Speaker 1: pressure and touch hunting pressure, but comfort. Um, late season

593
00:33:53,720 --> 00:33:57,080
Speaker 1: deer are gonna favor those subtly exposures. Um, they're gonna

594
00:33:57,120 --> 00:33:59,680
Speaker 1: be I don't know that they're going to be up high,

595
00:33:59,720 --> 00:34:01,479
Speaker 1: but are going to be up high enough so they

596
00:34:01,480 --> 00:34:03,560
Speaker 1: can get sune. They're not gonna be necessarily down in

597
00:34:03,640 --> 00:34:07,640
Speaker 1: thick cover unless there's no sun if it's a blizzard.

598
00:34:07,640 --> 00:34:10,920
Speaker 1: That's one of my favorite times hunt down in the

599
00:34:11,000 --> 00:34:14,160
Speaker 1: bottom when a blizzard rolls through an hill country because

600
00:34:14,160 --> 00:34:15,960
Speaker 1: all those deer dropped down to the bottom to get

601
00:34:16,000 --> 00:34:17,719
Speaker 1: out of the wind of the snow. And I have

602
00:34:17,800 --> 00:34:20,479
Speaker 1: had some crazy good hunts just seeing tons and tons

603
00:34:20,480 --> 00:34:25,320
Speaker 1: of deer um buck hays and does and in in December,

604
00:34:25,560 --> 00:34:29,800
Speaker 1: you know, like like weird stuff. UM in the middle

605
00:34:29,800 --> 00:34:35,840
Speaker 1: of a blizzard. You know, UM down wall and early season, UM,

606
00:34:36,000 --> 00:34:39,319
Speaker 1: they it's hot out. They favor of those cool north

607
00:34:39,360 --> 00:34:43,000
Speaker 1: slopes um or or bottoms where they might be the

608
00:34:43,000 --> 00:34:45,560
Speaker 1: bottom might be a little tighter um or has water

609
00:34:45,640 --> 00:34:48,520
Speaker 1: in it and they'll be close water, so cooler down there.

610
00:34:49,160 --> 00:34:52,400
Speaker 1: So UM comforts a big thing. And then hunting pressure

611
00:34:52,560 --> 00:34:57,000
Speaker 1: there's another big variable, and that has a big impact

612
00:34:57,400 --> 00:35:01,240
Speaker 1: UM and stead of for but UM when the pressures,

613
00:35:01,560 --> 00:35:04,600
Speaker 1: you know, when access is up high, that pushes deer down.

614
00:35:04,719 --> 00:35:08,480
Speaker 1: When access is down low, it pushes deer up. UM.

615
00:35:08,560 --> 00:35:12,560
Speaker 1: It's wherever the hunters UM are. The thickest the deer

616
00:35:12,719 --> 00:35:18,400
Speaker 1: going to be in the other elevation. Basically, Yeah, that

617
00:35:18,480 --> 00:35:21,880
Speaker 1: makes sense. Justin would you add anything to to that

618
00:35:22,000 --> 00:35:25,000
Speaker 1: question about how time of year might impact where they

619
00:35:25,080 --> 00:35:28,600
Speaker 1: choose to bed. Yeah, absolutely, I think Joe spot on

620
00:35:28,640 --> 00:35:32,560
Speaker 1: them there. Um. I will say I think Joe hunts,

621
00:35:32,600 --> 00:35:34,040
Speaker 1: and I don't know you can correct me if I'm

622
00:35:34,080 --> 00:35:37,959
Speaker 1: wrong here, Joe. But I think um in the hunt

623
00:35:37,960 --> 00:35:43,800
Speaker 1: more rugged terrain up in the hills here, like I said,

624
00:35:43,840 --> 00:35:46,680
Speaker 1: with the rolling hills, um, I will see a bit

625
00:35:46,760 --> 00:35:50,640
Speaker 1: lower UM, and a lot I think a lot of

626
00:35:50,640 --> 00:35:53,560
Speaker 1: that is to to you know, access being from the

627
00:35:53,600 --> 00:35:57,120
Speaker 1: top and stuff. But even in the early season and stuff,

628
00:35:57,160 --> 00:36:00,680
Speaker 1: I see him bend down lower UM, and I don't

629
00:36:00,719 --> 00:36:03,160
Speaker 1: know if it is you know, he dropped down off

630
00:36:03,160 --> 00:36:06,120
Speaker 1: in there, and it's it's generally it's a lot cooler

631
00:36:06,160 --> 00:36:08,439
Speaker 1: down there. And the winds in the in the rolling

632
00:36:08,560 --> 00:36:11,920
Speaker 1: hills will stay I don't want to say stay consistent

633
00:36:11,920 --> 00:36:14,279
Speaker 1: because they're hard. They were consistent, but you'll fill them

634
00:36:14,280 --> 00:36:16,000
Speaker 1: down in there. The wind will still be at the back,

635
00:36:16,120 --> 00:36:19,520
Speaker 1: you know, even further down it um, because it's more

636
00:36:19,640 --> 00:36:24,799
Speaker 1: you know, if a gradual slow versus like deep crop UM.

637
00:36:24,840 --> 00:36:27,279
Speaker 1: But yeah, I would say, I mean, Joe, I would

638
00:36:27,320 --> 00:36:30,160
Speaker 1: I would agree with all that. I do see him

639
00:36:30,200 --> 00:36:34,120
Speaker 1: bending higher, it seems in the later season, and I

640
00:36:34,160 --> 00:36:36,440
Speaker 1: think that's you know, get up high and gets fun.

641
00:36:37,560 --> 00:36:41,400
Speaker 1: Um And on the generally it seems like late season

642
00:36:41,600 --> 00:36:45,440
Speaker 1: can pretty much for the most part. Anyways, from what

643
00:36:45,520 --> 00:36:48,720
Speaker 1: I see, it seems like they're betting more wind based,

644
00:36:49,000 --> 00:36:51,200
Speaker 1: and I think it's a lot of times to get

645
00:36:51,239 --> 00:36:54,160
Speaker 1: out of the wind, you know, to block the wind. Yeah,

646
00:36:55,120 --> 00:36:57,880
Speaker 1: but uh yeah, I mean I think he pretty much

647
00:36:57,920 --> 00:37:02,040
Speaker 1: get on everything. And justin when you say you're you're

648
00:37:02,080 --> 00:37:05,239
Speaker 1: seeing them that lower, Um, is that like say half

649
00:37:05,320 --> 00:37:08,360
Speaker 1: way down the hill or yeah, I don't want to down,

650
00:37:09,200 --> 00:37:13,760
Speaker 1: I would say a half about halfway down, uh, Joe.

651
00:37:13,920 --> 00:37:17,160
Speaker 1: Generally it kind of depends on two you know, where

652
00:37:17,160 --> 00:37:20,600
Speaker 1: the covers at. Um. Even in the early season. Sometimes

653
00:37:20,600 --> 00:37:23,480
Speaker 1: if it's a you know, a rather open area, it

654
00:37:23,560 --> 00:37:25,880
Speaker 1: still seems like Bill, you know, they favor the cover.

655
00:37:26,239 --> 00:37:29,160
Speaker 1: So if it the color covers, you know, on the

656
00:37:29,200 --> 00:37:32,240
Speaker 1: bottom third even I've seen him bed down in there. Um,

657
00:37:33,360 --> 00:37:37,040
Speaker 1: but uh yeah, I would say you know that one third.

658
00:37:37,280 --> 00:37:40,000
Speaker 1: That was one thing that I think a lot of

659
00:37:40,000 --> 00:37:42,479
Speaker 1: guys around here, you know that was preached a lot

660
00:37:42,840 --> 00:37:46,240
Speaker 1: um on the Hunt the Beast, uh, and I agree

661
00:37:46,280 --> 00:37:50,520
Speaker 1: with it in most cases, but I believe that you know,

662
00:37:50,560 --> 00:37:53,879
Speaker 1: on the rolling hills there's exceptions to that and there,

663
00:37:54,360 --> 00:37:56,040
Speaker 1: but they're just kind of bed. I mean, if you

664
00:37:56,040 --> 00:37:59,040
Speaker 1: get a stronger win day or bed and lower light

665
00:37:59,200 --> 00:38:02,440
Speaker 1: variable winds, think like they do that a little bit higher. Um,

666
00:38:02,440 --> 00:38:06,680
Speaker 1: if there's so many variables those situations on with that. Uh,

667
00:38:07,600 --> 00:38:13,400
Speaker 1: but yeah, I wanna circle back around to the bulls

668
00:38:13,480 --> 00:38:18,600
Speaker 1: real quick because, uh, justin you and I had this conversation.

669
00:38:18,760 --> 00:38:21,680
Speaker 1: You told me that you see some of your your biggest,

670
00:38:21,719 --> 00:38:24,880
Speaker 1: most mature deer bed in those bowls, and they seem

671
00:38:24,880 --> 00:38:29,120
Speaker 1: almost bulletproof. And I after you said that, I started

672
00:38:29,160 --> 00:38:31,279
Speaker 1: thinking back because most of my hill country has been

673
00:38:31,360 --> 00:38:37,239
Speaker 1: in Ohio, Iowa, and a little bit in Indiana and

674
00:38:37,239 --> 00:38:40,920
Speaker 1: then in Kentucky. And there was an early season several

675
00:38:40,960 --> 00:38:45,080
Speaker 1: years ago where Um, I was hunting a pretty nice

676
00:38:45,120 --> 00:38:47,560
Speaker 1: buck and he was betted in that same type of

677
00:38:47,600 --> 00:38:51,640
Speaker 1: train feature like a bowl, and I couldn't get in

678
00:38:51,680 --> 00:38:55,920
Speaker 1: there without getting busted because I just could not get

679
00:38:55,960 --> 00:38:57,960
Speaker 1: a consistent wind. And I got I went in there

680
00:38:58,000 --> 00:39:04,040
Speaker 1: twice and got busted twice. But Joe, you I asked

681
00:39:04,080 --> 00:39:09,920
Speaker 1: you about that, and you have found uh unique Uh

682
00:39:10,000 --> 00:39:13,400
Speaker 1: circumstance are a set of conditions that you feel like

683
00:39:13,440 --> 00:39:20,800
Speaker 1: you can hunt that effectively. Yeah, um, some of the time.

684
00:39:21,040 --> 00:39:23,480
Speaker 1: And then I'll conclude this with a story about how

685
00:39:23,480 --> 00:39:28,720
Speaker 1: it didn't work this year on me. But uh, yeah,

686
00:39:28,760 --> 00:39:32,720
Speaker 1: so I see that too, and I think it's because

687
00:39:32,760 --> 00:39:36,520
Speaker 1: of the popularity, um, the spreading popularity of you know,

688
00:39:36,640 --> 00:39:40,799
Speaker 1: hill country hunting, and people focus on leeward slope, the

689
00:39:40,840 --> 00:39:45,440
Speaker 1: military crest, the classic places where dear do move. But

690
00:39:45,760 --> 00:39:48,359
Speaker 1: once the pressure is on up on the ridges, then

691
00:39:48,680 --> 00:39:50,680
Speaker 1: you know, like I've said, I've seen that push down

692
00:39:50,719 --> 00:39:55,040
Speaker 1: lower and the justice point. You know, I would stress

693
00:39:55,040 --> 00:39:58,160
Speaker 1: to everybody listening, you know, think about how steep your

694
00:39:58,239 --> 00:40:02,120
Speaker 1: hills are and if they're more role versus steep enough

695
00:40:02,200 --> 00:40:04,160
Speaker 1: that a deer doesn't want to travel up and down

696
00:40:04,200 --> 00:40:09,040
Speaker 1: it very easily. Um, you know, that really changes how

697
00:40:09,080 --> 00:40:11,480
Speaker 1: they use it. And if they can bed you know,

698
00:40:11,520 --> 00:40:14,600
Speaker 1: the entire slope versus they could you know, only top

699
00:40:14,640 --> 00:40:18,879
Speaker 1: and bottom it's so steep, that's that's a big difference. Um.

700
00:40:18,920 --> 00:40:22,640
Speaker 1: So down in those bowls, um, I have found there's

701
00:40:22,719 --> 00:40:27,719
Speaker 1: two kind of two circumstances UM, that I found consistent

702
00:40:27,800 --> 00:40:30,920
Speaker 1: WHIM and I'm I'm a fanatic about this. Like in

703
00:40:30,960 --> 00:40:33,680
Speaker 1: the off season, I'm carrying milk weed with me scouting

704
00:40:34,520 --> 00:40:38,319
Speaker 1: and sometimes if I like, I don't carry all the time,

705
00:40:38,320 --> 00:40:39,960
Speaker 1: but I'll carry a couple of sticks and I'll try

706
00:40:39,960 --> 00:40:41,719
Speaker 1: to get up in a tree and I'll drop milk weed,

707
00:40:41,800 --> 00:40:45,399
Speaker 1: like in the spring, UM and just see what it does. UM.

708
00:40:45,480 --> 00:40:49,880
Speaker 1: And I'll take note of those weather conditions and you know,

709
00:40:50,040 --> 00:40:51,960
Speaker 1: try to figure out if I can have a consistent

710
00:40:52,000 --> 00:40:54,120
Speaker 1: air current down low. So I've done a lot of

711
00:40:54,120 --> 00:40:59,640
Speaker 1: experimenting UM. And I like situations where there's almost no

712
00:40:59,719 --> 00:41:05,240
Speaker 1: whin and so the predominant activities just thermals um. That's

713
00:41:05,239 --> 00:41:08,759
Speaker 1: a little tricky because of course you've got a thermal switch. UM.

714
00:41:08,880 --> 00:41:13,160
Speaker 1: But say even like a cool, overcast day, you don't

715
00:41:13,200 --> 00:41:16,160
Speaker 1: have much for rising thermals um, and the thermal switch

716
00:41:16,239 --> 00:41:19,440
Speaker 1: might be happening pretty early in the afternoon or late

717
00:41:19,440 --> 00:41:21,960
Speaker 1: in the morning, UM, and you can get like a

718
00:41:21,960 --> 00:41:25,120
Speaker 1: consistent I really like those consistent down draft you know,

719
00:41:25,239 --> 00:41:27,440
Speaker 1: early in the morning and down at night. And I

720
00:41:27,480 --> 00:41:29,800
Speaker 1: set up right next to usually a big bowl. It

721
00:41:29,920 --> 00:41:31,920
Speaker 1: usually it's got a ditch or something. And if I

722
00:41:31,960 --> 00:41:35,000
Speaker 1: set up right next to that ditch, that's getting pulled

723
00:41:35,000 --> 00:41:38,160
Speaker 1: down into the ditch fairly fairly well, um, and you

724
00:41:38,280 --> 00:41:41,640
Speaker 1: can have a safe hunt that way, um. And the

725
00:41:41,680 --> 00:41:45,279
Speaker 1: other circumstances. The opposite is a screaming wind over the

726
00:41:45,360 --> 00:41:48,360
Speaker 1: hill over top, and this is usually for those deeper

727
00:41:48,440 --> 00:41:53,520
Speaker 1: hills and um, this is something I don't know. It

728
00:41:53,640 --> 00:41:57,000
Speaker 1: might be my favorite tactic. Get a screaming wind wind

729
00:41:57,160 --> 00:42:00,239
Speaker 1: over a ridge, coming across the ridge and you're you're

730
00:42:00,239 --> 00:42:02,440
Speaker 1: on the leeward side, except I'm way down at the

731
00:42:02,440 --> 00:42:05,600
Speaker 1: bottom of the leeward side um, or wherever the deer

732
00:42:05,640 --> 00:42:08,840
Speaker 1: are down low um, and the air is getting pulled

733
00:42:08,880 --> 00:42:12,759
Speaker 1: back up that leeward side. So it's actually, um, it's

734
00:42:12,800 --> 00:42:15,800
Speaker 1: a vacuum effect. That's what's causing it. It's not a

735
00:42:15,920 --> 00:42:18,880
Speaker 1: rising therminal. It's a vacuum effect. Um. And if I

736
00:42:18,920 --> 00:42:22,240
Speaker 1: get a twenty plus nine hour sustained wind over the ridge,

737
00:42:22,440 --> 00:42:25,279
Speaker 1: I know I'm going to usually have a consistent updraft. UM.

738
00:42:25,320 --> 00:42:28,080
Speaker 1: The Turkey thing there is wind dies down a lot

739
00:42:28,120 --> 00:42:31,480
Speaker 1: of time. You know, first light, last light, there's a

740
00:42:31,480 --> 00:42:33,480
Speaker 1: big buck around that's bag because then it starts to

741
00:42:33,480 --> 00:42:36,560
Speaker 1: get swirling, but if you have that consistent wind. I've

742
00:42:36,920 --> 00:42:40,359
Speaker 1: had situations where I have a consistent updraft and I'm

743
00:42:40,400 --> 00:42:43,279
Speaker 1: dropping milkweed and it's going right over my head all

744
00:42:43,280 --> 00:42:46,239
Speaker 1: the time. Like it's impossible for a deer smell on

745
00:42:46,320 --> 00:42:50,400
Speaker 1: me unless it's fly it, you know. Um. And I

746
00:42:50,560 --> 00:42:53,680
Speaker 1: love those situations because deer they think they're in this

747
00:42:53,840 --> 00:42:58,400
Speaker 1: bulletproof situation down low where they're used to smell and everything,

748
00:42:58,680 --> 00:43:01,120
Speaker 1: and I can get in there. Um. And I've killed

749
00:43:01,120 --> 00:43:05,400
Speaker 1: a couple of big bucks doing that. UM, So you

750
00:43:05,440 --> 00:43:08,920
Speaker 1: know that sounds all good and it works. I've got proof.

751
00:43:09,480 --> 00:43:13,200
Speaker 1: But this year I was after a big old buck, um,

752
00:43:13,680 --> 00:43:19,560
Speaker 1: big nine point typical split T two's and uh um

753
00:43:19,640 --> 00:43:22,960
Speaker 1: he loved a bed on a low low benches around

754
00:43:22,960 --> 00:43:26,799
Speaker 1: this big bowl. Uh, real rugged terrain. Um, and he

755
00:43:26,880 --> 00:43:29,680
Speaker 1: loved to bed down there. Well, the bulls was kind

756
00:43:29,680 --> 00:43:35,279
Speaker 1: of oriented northwest southeast, so with the northwest wind, uh,

757
00:43:35,440 --> 00:43:37,080
Speaker 1: it was kind of I was going for a light

758
00:43:37,160 --> 00:43:41,000
Speaker 1: northwest wind and a falling thermal. Those were aligned going

759
00:43:41,080 --> 00:43:44,120
Speaker 1: down into the bowl. And UM, I set up right

760
00:43:44,120 --> 00:43:47,080
Speaker 1: by the ditch. Um. He'd been there last year. This

761
00:43:47,160 --> 00:43:49,680
Speaker 1: is the circumstances there. Last year, I checked my camera.

762
00:43:49,760 --> 00:43:52,719
Speaker 1: Once I knew he was on camera. Um, I knew

763
00:43:52,719 --> 00:43:55,080
Speaker 1: he was around this, he was alive. I figured he's

764
00:43:55,120 --> 00:43:57,439
Speaker 1: done in the same spot. He was six years old

765
00:43:57,440 --> 00:44:02,279
Speaker 1: this year, I estimated, and mid October. Um it was

766
00:44:02,680 --> 00:44:05,800
Speaker 1: the second week October, I think, um my first or

767
00:44:05,920 --> 00:44:09,879
Speaker 1: second out of the season. Um, and I set up

768
00:44:10,239 --> 00:44:13,279
Speaker 1: got it. I snuck in there, up the ditch, called

769
00:44:13,320 --> 00:44:17,080
Speaker 1: up a tree, perfect and that while the old deer

770
00:44:17,160 --> 00:44:19,240
Speaker 1: he just dropped down into the bowl. And he dropped

771
00:44:19,280 --> 00:44:21,960
Speaker 1: down into the ditch, which I never thought he would,

772
00:44:22,000 --> 00:44:24,560
Speaker 1: about six yards down wind and I saw him, you know,

773
00:44:24,680 --> 00:44:27,800
Speaker 1: and then he he he was down wind to me,

774
00:44:27,880 --> 00:44:30,200
Speaker 1: but he was up on the rim of the ditch,

775
00:44:31,120 --> 00:44:33,480
Speaker 1: and I did not think he couldn't smell me. My

776
00:44:33,560 --> 00:44:35,759
Speaker 1: son was getting pulled down into this ditch. The ditch

777
00:44:35,800 --> 00:44:38,400
Speaker 1: was fairly big. It was probably thirty feet across. And

778
00:44:38,440 --> 00:44:40,440
Speaker 1: they dropped down to the ditch and boom, up came

779
00:44:40,480 --> 00:44:42,160
Speaker 1: his head and that was that, you know. So he

780
00:44:42,360 --> 00:44:44,319
Speaker 1: was murdered. Me. Now I had the last laugh because

781
00:44:44,320 --> 00:44:46,160
Speaker 1: I put my brother down there a few weeks later,

782
00:44:46,200 --> 00:44:48,880
Speaker 1: and not in exacts up but nearby, and um he

783
00:44:49,000 --> 00:44:54,120
Speaker 1: killed him in early November. UM, so he's dead, but um,

784
00:44:54,160 --> 00:44:56,720
Speaker 1: you know it was it's turkey. Hunting low is turkey.

785
00:44:56,840 --> 00:44:59,439
Speaker 1: Hunting hills in general's turkey with their currents. The hunting

786
00:44:59,440 --> 00:45:06,919
Speaker 1: low is really a turkey, So be prepared to screw up. Definitely. Yeah,

787
00:45:07,000 --> 00:45:09,960
Speaker 1: justin have you ever have you ever attempted, uh anything

788
00:45:10,080 --> 00:45:14,080
Speaker 1: or found a way to successfully hunt those those balls, well,

789
00:45:14,239 --> 00:45:16,920
Speaker 1: like in the rolling hills and stuff. I understand what

790
00:45:17,040 --> 00:45:20,680
Speaker 1: Joe's saying, and I can see that in the steeper train. Um,

791
00:45:20,719 --> 00:45:23,120
Speaker 1: and it may still you may still get that instant

792
00:45:23,200 --> 00:45:27,880
Speaker 1: situations with you know, the more gently rolling hills, but

793
00:45:29,920 --> 00:45:33,919
Speaker 1: from my experience, it's just really hard to get any

794
00:45:34,000 --> 00:45:37,399
Speaker 1: kind of a consistent wind in there. Um. I did

795
00:45:37,480 --> 00:45:40,680
Speaker 1: find kind of a unique situation a few years ago,

796
00:45:41,120 --> 00:45:44,279
Speaker 1: and uh it actually ended up being the biggest buck

797
00:45:44,360 --> 00:45:49,040
Speaker 1: after put an arrow through. Um. What this situation was,

798
00:45:49,440 --> 00:45:51,759
Speaker 1: there was a couple of guys that had found some

799
00:45:51,880 --> 00:45:55,520
Speaker 1: find down on this bolt and they were they basically

800
00:45:55,560 --> 00:45:58,680
Speaker 1: set up camp. They put a ladder stand down on

801
00:45:58,719 --> 00:46:02,359
Speaker 1: the bottom, They put a uh hanging on on the

802
00:46:02,400 --> 00:46:06,400
Speaker 1: side of this bridge, and I found it that the

803
00:46:06,560 --> 00:46:08,799
Speaker 1: spring before that. I went in there to check it out,

804
00:46:08,880 --> 00:46:10,400
Speaker 1: you know, because I do a lot of kind of

805
00:46:10,400 --> 00:46:13,600
Speaker 1: in season scouting check in areas, and I'm looking for

806
00:46:13,719 --> 00:46:16,839
Speaker 1: first sign in and around the perimeters of these bed

807
00:46:16,880 --> 00:46:19,239
Speaker 1: in areas. But I knew that buck was in there.

808
00:46:19,239 --> 00:46:22,520
Speaker 1: It was a great bed in area. Um. And once

809
00:46:22,520 --> 00:46:24,840
Speaker 1: I've seen all that sign I've seen these ribbons and everything,

810
00:46:24,840 --> 00:46:27,680
Speaker 1: I just kind of my billo. Well, then fast forward

811
00:46:27,760 --> 00:46:31,399
Speaker 1: to that following spring, I went back in there and

812
00:46:31,480 --> 00:46:34,239
Speaker 1: noticed the sign there. The buck was back in there.

813
00:46:34,719 --> 00:46:37,600
Speaker 1: You see, the bed was being used. So the following

814
00:46:37,680 --> 00:46:41,960
Speaker 1: year I was waiting for So let's see how this

815
00:46:42,800 --> 00:46:46,719
Speaker 1: It's set up like the head of the bowl, so

816
00:46:46,760 --> 00:46:49,440
Speaker 1: it's kind of a C shaped, you know bowl. The

817
00:46:49,480 --> 00:46:53,640
Speaker 1: head of the bowl would have been facing to the west. Um.

818
00:46:53,800 --> 00:46:57,520
Speaker 1: The buck was betting kind of on the southern side

819
00:46:57,520 --> 00:47:00,480
Speaker 1: of the slope. But when coming over his back and

820
00:47:00,560 --> 00:47:02,800
Speaker 1: I waited on a day it was eighty five degrees

821
00:47:03,239 --> 00:47:07,400
Speaker 1: it was early October, and the wind was blowing out

822
00:47:07,440 --> 00:47:10,200
Speaker 1: of the southwest. Well, it was blowing kind of over

823
00:47:10,280 --> 00:47:13,359
Speaker 1: the head of this pole and then down into the bowl,

824
00:47:13,440 --> 00:47:16,040
Speaker 1: blowing kind of with it out toward the mouth of it.

825
00:47:16,840 --> 00:47:21,160
Speaker 1: And I set up on basically on the mouth of

826
00:47:21,239 --> 00:47:24,360
Speaker 1: this bole as this buck dropped down off this point.

827
00:47:24,440 --> 00:47:27,160
Speaker 1: He was swinging around, slinging down lower that bowl because

828
00:47:27,320 --> 00:47:31,640
Speaker 1: there was still stand in there, and accountdent that deer

829
00:47:32,280 --> 00:47:35,600
Speaker 1: was checking that area out. For one, I think most

830
00:47:35,640 --> 00:47:38,000
Speaker 1: of the time to see him in the early season,

831
00:47:38,000 --> 00:47:40,160
Speaker 1: it was rather thick down in there, so I think

832
00:47:40,200 --> 00:47:42,480
Speaker 1: he would just safely drop down off this while I

833
00:47:42,560 --> 00:47:44,920
Speaker 1: was set up on the northern side. And as he

834
00:47:45,000 --> 00:47:48,000
Speaker 1: swung around got a whip, everything was clear and nobody

835
00:47:48,040 --> 00:47:49,600
Speaker 1: was down on the bottom. He carried on about his

836
00:47:49,640 --> 00:47:51,160
Speaker 1: white and he come on up, got an here on.

837
00:47:51,840 --> 00:47:55,040
Speaker 1: Most of the time on the bowls, for me, I

838
00:47:55,120 --> 00:47:58,319
Speaker 1: have to find either how they're entering or exiting the

839
00:47:58,360 --> 00:48:01,359
Speaker 1: bowl in order to get another And a lot of times,

840
00:48:01,360 --> 00:48:04,440
Speaker 1: I'll be honest, it has to be like on the

841
00:48:04,440 --> 00:48:06,560
Speaker 1: front or something like that. It seems like these big

842
00:48:06,600 --> 00:48:09,040
Speaker 1: old deers they just dropped down off and then things

843
00:48:09,520 --> 00:48:11,040
Speaker 1: and they kind of hang up in there in the

844
00:48:11,080 --> 00:48:13,440
Speaker 1: evenings and me and by the time they make it

845
00:48:13,440 --> 00:48:15,960
Speaker 1: out of them, you're not getting a shot at it,

846
00:48:17,120 --> 00:48:19,200
Speaker 1: or they dip into them, you know, way too early

847
00:48:19,239 --> 00:48:22,640
Speaker 1: in the morning. Um, I will say, if you can find,

848
00:48:23,280 --> 00:48:26,440
Speaker 1: if you know how that deer's entering that and you

849
00:48:26,480 --> 00:48:30,160
Speaker 1: can manipulate the wind, you know, get blowing or get

850
00:48:30,239 --> 00:48:33,160
Speaker 1: just down, you know, to where your thermals will be falling,

851
00:48:33,280 --> 00:48:35,719
Speaker 1: dropping one further off to where he can't get it.

852
00:48:36,360 --> 00:48:40,439
Speaker 1: But yeah, I mean I've had my poet more times

853
00:48:40,440 --> 00:48:43,840
Speaker 1: than I've been successful in the balls. I'll say that,

854
00:48:43,160 --> 00:48:47,839
Speaker 1: m justin, you're um most of the time when you're

855
00:48:47,840 --> 00:48:50,160
Speaker 1: seeing a buck bedded around the side of a bowl,

856
00:48:50,520 --> 00:48:53,160
Speaker 1: are you seeing it? Use them like that? It sounds

857
00:48:53,200 --> 00:48:56,080
Speaker 1: like you are, Like when they get up, they're dropping

858
00:48:56,120 --> 00:48:58,839
Speaker 1: down in you know, whether they're going across or at

859
00:48:58,880 --> 00:49:03,320
Speaker 1: least you know so they you that's why they're there, right,

860
00:49:04,160 --> 00:49:06,680
Speaker 1: And like you said earlier, a lot of times down

861
00:49:06,719 --> 00:49:09,440
Speaker 1: in those bottoms, or at least from my experience, I

862
00:49:09,520 --> 00:49:11,719
Speaker 1: find a lot of sign a lot of scrapes, a

863
00:49:11,800 --> 00:49:13,840
Speaker 1: lot of rubs, and that's what drew the attention to

864
00:49:13,880 --> 00:49:17,560
Speaker 1: those guys camped down. Yeah, they set up right over

865
00:49:17,600 --> 00:49:20,520
Speaker 1: this stuff in that you know, obviously it's betting up

866
00:49:20,520 --> 00:49:24,600
Speaker 1: on that side and you can watch that or hear

867
00:49:24,719 --> 00:49:28,200
Speaker 1: them or whateverthing. So yeah, but yeah, I see the

868
00:49:28,239 --> 00:49:35,480
Speaker 1: same thing justin you mentioned Sorry, any I'll jump in

869
00:49:35,560 --> 00:49:39,840
Speaker 1: really quick. You had mentioned that one of the better

870
00:49:39,880 --> 00:49:42,560
Speaker 1: ways you've found to actually hunt those spots is to

871
00:49:42,600 --> 00:49:45,080
Speaker 1: find where they're entering and exiting the bowl, because that's

872
00:49:45,080 --> 00:49:48,880
Speaker 1: a little bit safer for you, Um, for someone listening

873
00:49:49,280 --> 00:49:53,120
Speaker 1: who doesn't exactly know how to pinpoint that entrance or exit.

874
00:49:53,200 --> 00:49:55,960
Speaker 1: Could you describe what it is you're looking for to

875
00:49:56,000 --> 00:49:58,240
Speaker 1: help you determine that, Yeah, this is how they're getting

876
00:49:58,239 --> 00:50:02,000
Speaker 1: in and out the times saddles, To be quite honest

877
00:50:02,040 --> 00:50:05,680
Speaker 1: with you, Um, if there's a slight little saddle that

878
00:50:05,800 --> 00:50:09,319
Speaker 1: kind of dips off into that bowl, Gosh, a lot

879
00:50:09,360 --> 00:50:11,719
Speaker 1: of times if that there is going to cross that

880
00:50:11,880 --> 00:50:15,160
Speaker 1: in daylight hours, it's gonna be through something that something

881
00:50:15,200 --> 00:50:19,399
Speaker 1: where um, you know he's safe and secure, not gonna

882
00:50:19,440 --> 00:50:22,920
Speaker 1: be skyline. Um. And then a lot of times too,

883
00:50:23,080 --> 00:50:25,759
Speaker 1: you know there's there may not be signed right on

884
00:50:25,880 --> 00:50:28,000
Speaker 1: top of the ridge as far as like a rub

885
00:50:28,120 --> 00:50:31,759
Speaker 1: or a scrape or something like that, but you can

886
00:50:31,880 --> 00:50:35,759
Speaker 1: generally find sign kind of leading in or out of

887
00:50:35,840 --> 00:50:39,719
Speaker 1: those bowls, you know, on the ridge there. Um. But yeah,

888
00:50:39,760 --> 00:50:42,440
Speaker 1: I be honestly, a lot of them I've seen dip

889
00:50:42,520 --> 00:50:44,880
Speaker 1: through staddles, and it may not be a big obvious

890
00:50:44,920 --> 00:50:48,880
Speaker 1: sattle that shows up on a Topo map. Sometimes you

891
00:50:48,920 --> 00:50:51,120
Speaker 1: just have to get out there and and gout it

892
00:50:51,160 --> 00:50:53,680
Speaker 1: and you'll just see a a slight little dip in

893
00:50:53,760 --> 00:50:56,160
Speaker 1: the in the ridge there, and that's where that will

894
00:50:56,200 --> 00:51:00,600
Speaker 1: dip through. Yea. From my own it's someone one of

895
00:51:00,600 --> 00:51:05,160
Speaker 1: my favorite. Uh, Like, saddles are important, but the bigger

896
00:51:05,160 --> 00:51:08,360
Speaker 1: ones to attract hunters pretty easily. So, like you mentioned

897
00:51:08,400 --> 00:51:11,279
Speaker 1: the ones when you find one that might drop you know,

898
00:51:11,440 --> 00:51:16,239
Speaker 1: five ft or tennessee from the ridge. Yeah, you can't

899
00:51:16,280 --> 00:51:18,160
Speaker 1: see it on a TAPO until you're walking through it

900
00:51:18,200 --> 00:51:21,040
Speaker 1: and you're like, oh, you know, only my head sticking out,

901
00:51:21,160 --> 00:51:28,920
Speaker 1: you know along the ridge. Those are those can be lethal. Yeah. Yeah,

902
00:51:28,960 --> 00:51:32,080
Speaker 1: So that the hunt example that you just gave justin

903
00:51:32,239 --> 00:51:35,200
Speaker 1: reminded me of something. Um, those guys were kind of

904
00:51:35,239 --> 00:51:38,279
Speaker 1: set up in the bottom there where where there was

905
00:51:38,320 --> 00:51:40,480
Speaker 1: some sign down there. And I remember seeing that you

906
00:51:40,560 --> 00:51:43,279
Speaker 1: sent me that map at Topo, which was really cool

907
00:51:43,320 --> 00:51:45,439
Speaker 1: to see how that hunt and folded by the way,

908
00:51:45,480 --> 00:51:50,200
Speaker 1: but I remember the it was that, I remember it too. Yeah, yeah,

909
00:51:51,080 --> 00:51:55,360
Speaker 1: that bottom was relatively tight, um, and I know I

910
00:51:55,400 --> 00:52:00,160
Speaker 1: remember you know on the beast, you know, the consensus is,

911
00:52:00,320 --> 00:52:02,680
Speaker 1: you know, don't hunt the bottoms, stay out of the bottoms,

912
00:52:03,440 --> 00:52:06,640
Speaker 1: and it was it was ironic because every time I

913
00:52:06,760 --> 00:52:10,440
Speaker 1: read that, or when I was reading that, there was

914
00:52:10,560 --> 00:52:16,320
Speaker 1: actually um a spot in Iowa that UM I had

915
00:52:16,400 --> 00:52:21,799
Speaker 1: killed two bucks um two years or two times that

916
00:52:21,880 --> 00:52:23,680
Speaker 1: I hunted it in a row when I drew the tag,

917
00:52:23,760 --> 00:52:25,880
Speaker 1: and then my my buddy killed one out of the

918
00:52:25,920 --> 00:52:30,120
Speaker 1: same stand as a couple of trees over but same area.

919
00:52:30,440 --> 00:52:33,400
Speaker 1: And it was in the bottom. But what was unique

920
00:52:33,440 --> 00:52:36,400
Speaker 1: about this bottom and Joe, you touched about on this

921
00:52:36,440 --> 00:52:38,440
Speaker 1: a little bit ago, but it was it was a

922
00:52:38,480 --> 00:52:42,640
Speaker 1: wide bottom um. So what I loved about this spot

923
00:52:42,760 --> 00:52:49,680
Speaker 1: was um it was where several points dropped down into

924
00:52:49,719 --> 00:52:52,320
Speaker 1: the same direction. So there was like four or five

925
00:52:52,400 --> 00:52:56,520
Speaker 1: points that were kind of all pointed down into this bottom,

926
00:52:56,800 --> 00:53:01,240
Speaker 1: pointed in the general same area point of this general

927
00:53:01,320 --> 00:53:07,120
Speaker 1: same direction, and at the bottom was actually like a

928
00:53:07,200 --> 00:53:11,320
Speaker 1: like an overgrown like set aside field. And I would

929
00:53:11,360 --> 00:53:16,120
Speaker 1: hunt that that bottom ran east and west, so anytime

930
00:53:16,160 --> 00:53:21,359
Speaker 1: I had a west wind, I could get basically where

931
00:53:21,400 --> 00:53:24,080
Speaker 1: all those points dumped down and converge. There was a

932
00:53:24,080 --> 00:53:26,719
Speaker 1: lot of travel coming up and down those points and

933
00:53:26,760 --> 00:53:29,240
Speaker 1: criss crossing, and I would get right at the bottom

934
00:53:29,239 --> 00:53:33,719
Speaker 1: where all those travel routes converged with that west wind,

935
00:53:33,760 --> 00:53:35,560
Speaker 1: but I would be just on the east side of

936
00:53:35,600 --> 00:53:40,359
Speaker 1: where most of the criss crossing was going. And man,

937
00:53:40,440 --> 00:53:46,400
Speaker 1: it was like, honestly, it literally would be like one

938
00:53:46,400 --> 00:53:48,600
Speaker 1: sit and and I'm not super picky, like you know,

939
00:53:48,640 --> 00:53:51,239
Speaker 1: I'm coming from Michigan. It's an out of state trip back.

940
00:53:51,239 --> 00:53:53,240
Speaker 1: Then I would have two or three days to hunt.

941
00:53:53,520 --> 00:53:55,759
Speaker 1: So I was shooting the first, you know, good buck

942
00:53:55,840 --> 00:53:58,799
Speaker 1: that came by. But it was every time I had

943
00:53:58,840 --> 00:54:03,040
Speaker 1: that wind, and it was in November. Man, the amount

944
00:54:03,080 --> 00:54:06,319
Speaker 1: of deer I saw in bucks I saw cruising down

945
00:54:06,360 --> 00:54:08,799
Speaker 1: through that area and I don't remember ever getting really

946
00:54:08,840 --> 00:54:12,759
Speaker 1: busted as long as I had that consistent wind. But um,

947
00:54:12,800 --> 00:54:14,759
Speaker 1: I mean it was it was quick, you know. I mean,

948
00:54:15,080 --> 00:54:17,000
Speaker 1: if you're gonna wait for a five six year old buck,

949
00:54:17,120 --> 00:54:19,560
Speaker 1: you know, a hundred fifty sixty inches or something might

950
00:54:19,600 --> 00:54:21,919
Speaker 1: be a different story. But I was able to get

951
00:54:21,960 --> 00:54:25,040
Speaker 1: an arrow in a good buck really quickly in that

952
00:54:25,080 --> 00:54:27,960
Speaker 1: type of scenario. You have, you guys, ever found anything

953
00:54:28,000 --> 00:54:30,960
Speaker 1: like that? Yeah, I got the first question for you, Andy,

954
00:54:31,000 --> 00:54:33,839
Speaker 1: where the bucks moving in like that? You've seen down

955
00:54:33,880 --> 00:54:37,120
Speaker 1: there moving consistently, you know, with that wind like where

956
00:54:37,120 --> 00:54:39,160
Speaker 1: they're using in a confiscent way or they move in

957
00:54:39,160 --> 00:54:45,480
Speaker 1: a consistent direction. Did you find her? Well, it just

958
00:54:45,520 --> 00:54:48,600
Speaker 1: seemed like, honestly, it was it was always in that

959
00:54:48,920 --> 00:54:54,000
Speaker 1: kind of November or through the ninth time frame. It's

960
00:54:54,080 --> 00:54:58,480
Speaker 1: just seemed like a lot of cruising going on. To

961
00:54:58,520 --> 00:55:00,480
Speaker 1: be honest with you, it looked like they were kind

962
00:55:00,480 --> 00:55:02,440
Speaker 1: of more doing like point A to point B, but

963
00:55:02,480 --> 00:55:05,319
Speaker 1: they were using these points as travel routes and they

964
00:55:05,360 --> 00:55:09,680
Speaker 1: were crossing that bottom um kind of and that you

965
00:55:09,719 --> 00:55:12,160
Speaker 1: know there there was like probably a seventy five yard

966
00:55:12,320 --> 00:55:15,960
Speaker 1: radius where all those those ridges dumped down are those

967
00:55:16,000 --> 00:55:19,520
Speaker 1: points dumped down, And there was tons and tons of

968
00:55:19,560 --> 00:55:22,640
Speaker 1: buck signed right there in the bottom straps all around

969
00:55:22,640 --> 00:55:24,719
Speaker 1: the edge. It was a set aside field and there

970
00:55:24,800 --> 00:55:27,640
Speaker 1: was a lot of young uh you know, young tree

971
00:55:27,719 --> 00:55:31,200
Speaker 1: drowth down there, like sapling sized trees, and it was

972
00:55:31,239 --> 00:55:33,640
Speaker 1: just shredded. I mean, it had everything you'd want as

973
00:55:33,680 --> 00:55:36,959
Speaker 1: far as his buck signed um, I mean, dose would

974
00:55:37,000 --> 00:55:39,040
Speaker 1: come down off and there'd be you know, bucks following

975
00:55:39,080 --> 00:55:41,040
Speaker 1: the dough. It was just a constant action. It was

976
00:55:41,080 --> 00:55:43,600
Speaker 1: just one of those spots that was just dynamite. But

977
00:55:43,680 --> 00:55:46,839
Speaker 1: I always remember that because everybody was staying, never hunt

978
00:55:46,880 --> 00:55:50,640
Speaker 1: the bottoms. But I think, and we've talked about this

979
00:55:50,680 --> 00:55:53,799
Speaker 1: a little bit, it's it's those steep bottoms that are

980
00:55:53,880 --> 00:55:55,799
Speaker 1: really tough to hunt. It you get, you get one

981
00:55:55,880 --> 00:55:59,799
Speaker 1: that as a decent width on it, if you hunt

982
00:55:59,800 --> 00:56:04,319
Speaker 1: it with the right wind, you can hunt it effectively. Absolutely. Yeah. Yeah,

983
00:56:04,560 --> 00:56:06,799
Speaker 1: I got a question for you, Andy on that was that?

984
00:56:07,239 --> 00:56:09,320
Speaker 1: And you may have mentioned this, was it rather steep

985
00:56:09,400 --> 00:56:12,000
Speaker 1: the rain around there or was it more like gently

986
00:56:12,040 --> 00:56:15,440
Speaker 1: bowling hills or I would say it's more probably what

987
00:56:15,520 --> 00:56:19,879
Speaker 1: you're used to. Um. The only the only place I've

988
00:56:19,960 --> 00:56:25,839
Speaker 1: hunted um that I think might be comparable to what

989
00:56:26,080 --> 00:56:28,280
Speaker 1: a lot of the stuff Joe hunts is is southern

990
00:56:28,280 --> 00:56:32,520
Speaker 1: Ohio and then one spot in Kentucky. And uh so,

991
00:56:32,680 --> 00:56:35,040
Speaker 1: most most of my hill country I think has been

992
00:56:35,080 --> 00:56:40,960
Speaker 1: more rolling to you know, medium size hills, not a

993
00:56:40,960 --> 00:56:45,120
Speaker 1: ton of real steep, steep country. Yeah, I've got any

994
00:56:45,120 --> 00:56:48,319
Speaker 1: example like that, like you were just mentioning, umactly taught

995
00:56:48,360 --> 00:56:52,360
Speaker 1: that me and my dad both killed We've actually killed

996
00:56:52,400 --> 00:56:54,920
Speaker 1: a few bucks out of and it's the wide bottom

997
00:56:54,920 --> 00:56:58,400
Speaker 1: of the bottom itself is probably gosh, a hundred fifty

998
00:56:58,480 --> 00:57:01,840
Speaker 1: yards wide or something like it, and we have found

999
00:57:01,840 --> 00:57:06,200
Speaker 1: some very very consistent cruising and it's it's very similar

1000
00:57:06,239 --> 00:57:08,040
Speaker 1: to what you're saying. There's a lot of points that

1001
00:57:08,239 --> 00:57:12,480
Speaker 1: kind of shut right down into this bottom and it's

1002
00:57:12,520 --> 00:57:14,920
Speaker 1: just I don't know, it's it's always held a lot

1003
00:57:14,920 --> 00:57:17,840
Speaker 1: of deer. There is a a field kind of out

1004
00:57:17,960 --> 00:57:20,680
Speaker 1: from it um and the deer kind of you know,

1005
00:57:21,000 --> 00:57:24,640
Speaker 1: kind of hug that kind of like an inside corner um.

1006
00:57:24,680 --> 00:57:26,400
Speaker 1: But they got down through there and we've had a

1007
00:57:26,400 --> 00:57:30,160
Speaker 1: lot of right down in that bottom on you know,

1008
00:57:30,320 --> 00:57:36,600
Speaker 1: specific wind. Uh. Yeah, it's Joe, I think you you've

1009
00:57:36,640 --> 00:57:40,439
Speaker 1: described that. You call that a thermal hub. Correct, Yeah, yeah,

1010
00:57:40,560 --> 00:57:44,400
Speaker 1: so it's um thermal hubs. So I do believe they

1011
00:57:44,400 --> 00:57:48,880
Speaker 1: are using that to their sent advantage. But it is

1012
00:57:48,920 --> 00:57:54,680
Speaker 1: also the reason these hubs um they're also a terrain

1013
00:57:55,040 --> 00:57:58,440
Speaker 1: hub too. It's not just scent, but when you have

1014
00:57:58,520 --> 00:58:01,320
Speaker 1: both those line up, when it's the shortest distance from

1015
00:58:01,360 --> 00:58:04,120
Speaker 1: A to B and a deer, a buck can go

1016
00:58:04,240 --> 00:58:08,120
Speaker 1: through there and sent a lot of those surrounding points.

1017
00:58:08,200 --> 00:58:10,800
Speaker 1: He can know if there's a dope up there or

1018
00:58:11,640 --> 00:58:14,640
Speaker 1: I really think they use it for their defense too.

1019
00:58:14,680 --> 00:58:17,960
Speaker 1: I think they can check if there's hunters on the

1020
00:58:17,960 --> 00:58:22,560
Speaker 1: surrounding ridges by drumping down in those areas, so you know,

1021
00:58:22,800 --> 00:58:27,360
Speaker 1: they check what's around them and it's the fastest and

1022
00:58:27,920 --> 00:58:30,280
Speaker 1: you know, the most secure point from point A to

1023
00:58:30,320 --> 00:58:34,680
Speaker 1: point B. That's when there, that's when those super hot

1024
00:58:34,720 --> 00:58:38,200
Speaker 1: spuss like you guys described. I've you know a few

1025
00:58:38,200 --> 00:58:44,560
Speaker 1: of those two and then um, often it's like one

1026
00:58:44,800 --> 00:58:49,000
Speaker 1: specific or maybe two specific winds. Usually it's one specific

1027
00:58:49,080 --> 00:58:52,400
Speaker 1: wind you can get hunt out there. It's like you

1028
00:58:52,520 --> 00:58:54,800
Speaker 1: just have to sit, you know, and you might not

1029
00:58:54,920 --> 00:58:58,040
Speaker 1: get that wind one one one season. You know, I've

1030
00:58:58,080 --> 00:59:01,240
Speaker 1: been there where I'm like, yeah, you know, you know

1031
00:59:01,400 --> 00:59:03,480
Speaker 1: it deers in the area. You know, you know it's

1032
00:59:03,480 --> 00:59:05,360
Speaker 1: a hot spot that time of year. You don't have

1033
00:59:05,440 --> 00:59:08,840
Speaker 1: to wind, don't even try it down well you know. Yeah,

1034
00:59:09,160 --> 00:59:11,760
Speaker 1: I'm sure you guys have been there too, and you

1035
00:59:11,800 --> 00:59:14,880
Speaker 1: know you push it and never never seems to work

1036
00:59:14,880 --> 00:59:17,320
Speaker 1: when you push it with the wind, or you get

1037
00:59:17,360 --> 00:59:22,240
Speaker 1: that wind and you can't hunt that night. Yeah exactly, Yeah, yeah, yeah,

1038
00:59:24,200 --> 00:59:27,880
Speaker 1: I wanna. I wanna two things. Number One, Um, I've

1039
00:59:27,920 --> 00:59:30,560
Speaker 1: seen this exact same thing you're describing too in in

1040
00:59:30,640 --> 00:59:32,920
Speaker 1: my southern Ohio spots. The one spot I've hunted a

1041
00:59:32,920 --> 00:59:36,360
Speaker 1: decent bit of of hill country and and the exact thing.

1042
00:59:36,360 --> 00:59:38,760
Speaker 1: It seems like they'll be just a certain angle that

1043
00:59:38,800 --> 00:59:41,640
Speaker 1: you'll get that one consistent wind if you've got it. Um.

1044
00:59:41,680 --> 00:59:45,440
Speaker 1: But I just want to make one simple observation for

1045
00:59:45,480 --> 00:59:49,400
Speaker 1: people that are listening, UM to just kind of simplify

1046
00:59:49,480 --> 00:59:52,600
Speaker 1: a little bit. A lot of the examples you guys

1047
00:59:52,600 --> 00:59:57,080
Speaker 1: have all pointed to have all related to a turkey

1048
00:59:57,120 --> 01:00:00,479
Speaker 1: foot as you described it earlier, Joe, but in two

1049
01:00:00,480 --> 01:00:04,600
Speaker 1: different versions. There's the you could say, there's the turkey

1050
01:00:04,600 --> 01:00:09,800
Speaker 1: foot pointing down, which would be where all the fingers

1051
01:00:09,800 --> 01:00:11,760
Speaker 1: are pointing down. And that's the situation that you were

1052
01:00:11,800 --> 01:00:14,280
Speaker 1: talking about earlier today, Joe, when you're talking about hunting

1053
01:00:14,360 --> 01:00:17,200
Speaker 1: up top where those ridges and there's multiple ridges that

1054
01:00:17,240 --> 01:00:20,760
Speaker 1: come up to uh to a pinch point of sorts,

1055
01:00:20,760 --> 01:00:22,240
Speaker 1: where you would be at the top of those and

1056
01:00:22,320 --> 01:00:24,280
Speaker 1: all these ridges come up to it. So you've got

1057
01:00:24,280 --> 01:00:28,360
Speaker 1: the the downward facing turkey foot you want to hunt high,

1058
01:00:28,440 --> 01:00:31,680
Speaker 1: and then there's the inverted turkey foot where the ridges

1059
01:00:31,840 --> 01:00:34,480
Speaker 1: and the points are coming down to the bottom, and

1060
01:00:34,520 --> 01:00:36,840
Speaker 1: that's when you'd want to hunt low. In these spots

1061
01:00:36,840 --> 01:00:39,080
Speaker 1: that you're all describing. Assuming you can get the right wind.

1062
01:00:39,520 --> 01:00:43,200
Speaker 1: So so just a simple observation, look for those turkey

1063
01:00:43,200 --> 01:00:46,440
Speaker 1: foot type situations and take note is that the upward

1064
01:00:46,520 --> 01:00:48,360
Speaker 1: facing or the downward facing, and that's going to help

1065
01:00:48,360 --> 01:00:51,280
Speaker 1: you determine where that sweet spot of activity will likely

1066
01:00:51,320 --> 01:00:55,840
Speaker 1: be if you can get the wind right put it. Yeah, Yeah,

1067
01:00:56,080 --> 01:00:59,280
Speaker 1: that's that's very good. It's it's exactly it's the same feature.

1068
01:00:59,360 --> 01:01:02,080
Speaker 1: It's just exactly how you put it. You know, whether

1069
01:01:02,160 --> 01:01:04,920
Speaker 1: it's the top of the ridges or the bottom that

1070
01:01:04,960 --> 01:01:10,479
Speaker 1: makes that kind of hand shape, you know pattern. Yeah,

1071
01:01:11,400 --> 01:01:16,360
Speaker 1: So I got a question here in um I'm guessing

1072
01:01:16,480 --> 01:01:19,120
Speaker 1: or I guess I'm hoping that the answer is varied

1073
01:01:19,320 --> 01:01:23,360
Speaker 1: a little bit, but maybe they won't. But if I

1074
01:01:23,480 --> 01:01:27,960
Speaker 1: took you guys down to an area you're not familiar with,

1075
01:01:28,160 --> 01:01:33,040
Speaker 1: southern Ohio, Kentucky, down in Indiana hill country, something you

1076
01:01:33,080 --> 01:01:38,680
Speaker 1: had never hunted before, and you had one week during

1077
01:01:38,680 --> 01:01:41,400
Speaker 1: both season to get an arrow in a mature book,

1078
01:01:42,680 --> 01:01:48,600
Speaker 1: what just give me your kind of overall uh game plan,

1079
01:01:49,000 --> 01:01:55,400
Speaker 1: your strategy from the second you get boots on the ground,

1080
01:01:55,520 --> 01:02:00,439
Speaker 1: you leave your vehicle two the day you shoot that dear,

1081
01:02:00,560 --> 01:02:02,600
Speaker 1: and I would want I want two examples. I want

1082
01:02:02,640 --> 01:02:06,520
Speaker 1: one where let's call it just early season, you know,

1083
01:02:06,640 --> 01:02:11,280
Speaker 1: mid October, and then let's do the same thing more

1084
01:02:11,640 --> 01:02:15,760
Speaker 1: pre run those last couple of days of October into

1085
01:02:16,000 --> 01:02:19,320
Speaker 1: the first you know, week and a half in November.

1086
01:02:19,440 --> 01:02:22,360
Speaker 1: So let's let's start with you, Justin. And while you're

1087
01:02:22,400 --> 01:02:26,120
Speaker 1: thinking about your answer, Justin, I just gotta say, isn't

1088
01:02:26,120 --> 01:02:28,440
Speaker 1: this guy damn good at hosting? I feel like Andy's

1089
01:02:28,440 --> 01:02:32,640
Speaker 1: gonna steal my job. He's got some good questions here

1090
01:02:35,480 --> 01:02:43,080
Speaker 1: now exactly, all right, take it away, Justin. Okay, So

1091
01:02:43,680 --> 01:02:46,680
Speaker 1: we talked about points. We talked about areas that you know,

1092
01:02:46,760 --> 01:02:51,080
Speaker 1: Buck took me bad early season for me and Andy.

1093
01:02:51,200 --> 01:02:54,560
Speaker 1: I know. You know, listen, Joe, I think too. And

1094
01:02:54,720 --> 01:02:57,440
Speaker 1: I'm probably more aggressive than most of your guys in

1095
01:02:57,480 --> 01:03:00,720
Speaker 1: the hills, um, even on stuff that I know. Oh,

1096
01:03:00,880 --> 01:03:02,720
Speaker 1: I'm one of those guys that's not afraid to go

1097
01:03:02,840 --> 01:03:05,560
Speaker 1: bump here up and I do that a lot. And

1098
01:03:05,600 --> 01:03:10,480
Speaker 1: I have killed a lot of my books by doing

1099
01:03:10,600 --> 01:03:12,880
Speaker 1: that and getting back in there stay a couple of

1100
01:03:12,920 --> 01:03:17,040
Speaker 1: days later. And as both you know, Joe and Eady, no,

1101
01:03:17,200 --> 01:03:19,400
Speaker 1: I've killed several of them coming right back in that

1102
01:03:19,520 --> 01:03:23,320
Speaker 1: same day. UM, So that's gonna be my go to

1103
01:03:23,480 --> 01:03:25,360
Speaker 1: if I've got a short period of time that i

1104
01:03:25,400 --> 01:03:29,040
Speaker 1: can go on a new piece of ground that you

1105
01:03:29,080 --> 01:03:32,040
Speaker 1: know that I've never been on, never stepped foot on. Man,

1106
01:03:32,080 --> 01:03:35,240
Speaker 1: I'm going to aggressive. I'm going right forward, where's these

1107
01:03:35,280 --> 01:03:37,080
Speaker 1: deer bed and I'm going to bump him up, and

1108
01:03:37,120 --> 01:03:40,200
Speaker 1: I'm gonna look the area over and then based on

1109
01:03:40,280 --> 01:03:43,280
Speaker 1: what I find from there, then i'll hunt up boarding,

1110
01:03:43,400 --> 01:03:46,520
Speaker 1: you know. So what I think my best cancer to

1111
01:03:46,640 --> 01:03:49,520
Speaker 1: get the crack at that there is, um and it

1112
01:03:49,560 --> 01:03:52,120
Speaker 1: may be that same day. Um. I'm not opposed to

1113
01:03:53,040 --> 01:03:56,560
Speaker 1: bumping a deer up depending on how I spook him.

1114
01:03:56,600 --> 01:03:59,040
Speaker 1: If if I get him up, you know, and and

1115
01:03:59,120 --> 01:04:00,960
Speaker 1: he didn't get my wind, I feel confident in that.

1116
01:04:01,200 --> 01:04:03,440
Speaker 1: I've seen a lot of them turn and come right

1117
01:04:03,480 --> 01:04:07,240
Speaker 1: back in there or swing down wind of it, you know, um,

1118
01:04:07,280 --> 01:04:09,400
Speaker 1: and try to figure out what that was that bumped

1119
01:04:09,440 --> 01:04:13,920
Speaker 1: them up. UM, So that would be kind of what

1120
01:04:13,960 --> 01:04:16,240
Speaker 1: I'm doing. And I'm obviously I'm going to look, you know,

1121
01:04:16,360 --> 01:04:19,720
Speaker 1: for the for the thicker stuff. If there's any type

1122
01:04:19,720 --> 01:04:22,600
Speaker 1: of don't agg nearby, I'm probably gonna look at the

1123
01:04:22,760 --> 01:04:25,520
Speaker 1: secondary points of stuff that shut off the major ridge

1124
01:04:25,720 --> 01:04:30,200
Speaker 1: nearby that m bowls you don't think that we had mentioned. Hey,

1125
01:04:30,240 --> 01:04:32,960
Speaker 1: justin real quick, I'm sorry. I don't mean to interrupt,

1126
01:04:33,040 --> 01:04:36,320
Speaker 1: but no, you're funny. Go ahead, this bump a dump thing.

1127
01:04:36,400 --> 01:04:38,720
Speaker 1: And we've talked about this, and you you pull this

1128
01:04:38,880 --> 01:04:42,720
Speaker 1: off more than anyone I know, and you purposely do it,

1129
01:04:43,160 --> 01:04:48,200
Speaker 1: which I think is just so cool. Um, so correct

1130
01:04:48,240 --> 01:04:52,120
Speaker 1: me if I'm wrong here, Like uh, I would assume

1131
01:04:53,640 --> 01:04:56,440
Speaker 1: you know, if you're gonna purposefully do that, you're you're

1132
01:04:56,440 --> 01:05:00,120
Speaker 1: gonna you're gonna try to do this fairly early in

1133
01:05:00,160 --> 01:05:02,240
Speaker 1: the day obviously when they're beded, so you're gonna wait

1134
01:05:02,280 --> 01:05:05,600
Speaker 1: probably pass you know, mid morning at least, maybe going

1135
01:05:05,640 --> 01:05:09,800
Speaker 1: around lunchtime, maybe you know, one one o'clock, eleven to

1136
01:05:09,880 --> 01:05:13,720
Speaker 1: one o'clock somewhere in there. And obviously you're playing the wind,

1137
01:05:13,720 --> 01:05:17,200
Speaker 1: your winds in your favor, um, and you have an

1138
01:05:17,280 --> 01:05:20,800
Speaker 1: area that you're targeting based on wind direction in the

1139
01:05:20,840 --> 01:05:23,240
Speaker 1: train features that you've looked at on the map, and

1140
01:05:23,320 --> 01:05:26,400
Speaker 1: you're gonna kind of slip through there, and you're trying

1141
01:05:26,400 --> 01:05:30,960
Speaker 1: to you're trying to bump this deer like a soft bump.

1142
01:05:31,080 --> 01:05:34,520
Speaker 1: You don't want this deer to smell you. Um, if

1143
01:05:34,560 --> 01:05:38,440
Speaker 1: he sees you or hears you. Not a big deal. Um,

1144
01:05:38,480 --> 01:05:40,440
Speaker 1: that's kind of the goal. But it's you want a

1145
01:05:40,440 --> 01:05:43,680
Speaker 1: soft bump, not a violent bump, or you know you

1146
01:05:44,000 --> 01:05:46,480
Speaker 1: damn near step on him, or you don't want him

1147
01:05:46,480 --> 01:05:49,280
Speaker 1: to to wind you. And then once he's gone, you're

1148
01:05:49,360 --> 01:05:54,800
Speaker 1: quickly analyzing the situation and estimating where you think that

1149
01:05:54,840 --> 01:05:56,960
Speaker 1: deer is going to circle back down win to scent,

1150
01:05:57,080 --> 01:06:00,280
Speaker 1: check that bed and come back. And you've had great

1151
01:06:00,360 --> 01:06:04,400
Speaker 1: luck even on the same day of deer doing that.

1152
01:06:04,680 --> 01:06:08,280
Speaker 1: And I also would assume if you sat there that

1153
01:06:08,280 --> 01:06:10,720
Speaker 1: that afternoon and he didn't come back, you'd probably give

1154
01:06:10,760 --> 01:06:12,840
Speaker 1: it one more sit in the morning. Would that be

1155
01:06:12,880 --> 01:06:16,680
Speaker 1: accurate statement? That would be accurate? Maybe even another touch shot,

1156
01:06:16,720 --> 01:06:20,320
Speaker 1: you know, the following day, because I have seen to

1157
01:06:20,480 --> 01:06:22,840
Speaker 1: where and again this is gonna be win. I mean,

1158
01:06:22,880 --> 01:06:25,360
Speaker 1: say you jump him off of a point, you know,

1159
01:06:25,400 --> 01:06:27,720
Speaker 1: on a northwest wind or whatever in the next day

1160
01:06:27,800 --> 01:06:31,840
Speaker 1: is gonna be stout. Well, that could change things up. Um,

1161
01:06:31,880 --> 01:06:34,320
Speaker 1: but yeah, and you're you're absolutely correct. I'm not trying

1162
01:06:34,320 --> 01:06:38,000
Speaker 1: to just blowing completely out of the area. Ideally, you

1163
01:06:38,040 --> 01:06:40,640
Speaker 1: want him just to kind of jump up, you know,

1164
01:06:41,120 --> 01:06:43,560
Speaker 1: and just kind of trought off because I've seen that,

1165
01:06:43,840 --> 01:06:47,400
Speaker 1: and that's when I have had the best luck at

1166
01:06:47,480 --> 01:06:50,560
Speaker 1: him coming right back in that that same day. And

1167
01:06:50,600 --> 01:06:53,439
Speaker 1: a lot of times things like they hear me more

1168
01:06:53,480 --> 01:06:56,880
Speaker 1: so than than seeing and obviously not smelling me. Um,

1169
01:06:57,000 --> 01:07:00,000
Speaker 1: they'll just kind of just kind of, you know, shut off,

1170
01:07:00,080 --> 01:07:03,600
Speaker 1: like a deer that spooked, but not uh, they're not

1171
01:07:03,680 --> 01:07:06,560
Speaker 1: running out of the country by thing. And I've seen

1172
01:07:06,560 --> 01:07:08,520
Speaker 1: it so often to where they'll they will they'll just

1173
01:07:08,600 --> 01:07:10,920
Speaker 1: loop around and they'll try to figure out what that was.

1174
01:07:11,520 --> 01:07:14,360
Speaker 1: I had one um that it killed a couple of

1175
01:07:14,440 --> 01:07:18,480
Speaker 1: years ago literally came right back in on the exact

1176
01:07:18,600 --> 01:07:22,200
Speaker 1: trail that I walked into when I bumped him and

1177
01:07:22,240 --> 01:07:25,160
Speaker 1: he was filling the green. I'm sure that dear thought

1178
01:07:25,720 --> 01:07:28,040
Speaker 1: that that whatever it was, just like a coyote. If

1179
01:07:28,080 --> 01:07:29,840
Speaker 1: they run through and they bump them up, they probably

1180
01:07:29,880 --> 01:07:32,400
Speaker 1: circle around and do the same thing, come right back

1181
01:07:32,400 --> 01:07:34,840
Speaker 1: in there that since you know, an hour old, now

1182
01:07:35,080 --> 01:07:37,920
Speaker 1: that whatever it was has long gone, they slipped right

1183
01:07:37,960 --> 01:07:41,440
Speaker 1: back into the bedding area. Um. The only problem for

1184
01:07:41,520 --> 01:07:44,000
Speaker 1: him was I was still in there. I was still

1185
01:07:44,040 --> 01:07:46,480
Speaker 1: in there, and I was actually looking it over to

1186
01:07:46,560 --> 01:07:49,600
Speaker 1: pick a tree for the following day. And that hunt

1187
01:07:49,680 --> 01:07:52,600
Speaker 1: really opened my eye to it on you know, killing

1188
01:07:52,640 --> 01:07:55,600
Speaker 1: him on the same day, but I have done it

1189
01:07:55,840 --> 01:07:57,960
Speaker 1: and then you know, came back the following day or

1190
01:07:58,000 --> 01:08:00,960
Speaker 1: two days later, even five days later and kill them

1191
01:08:01,000 --> 01:08:03,760
Speaker 1: coming out of there. So that would be my my

1192
01:08:03,840 --> 01:08:06,920
Speaker 1: go to in the early seasons. UM for the free run,

1193
01:08:07,760 --> 01:08:11,600
Speaker 1: I'm probably gonna do the same thing, only I'm gonna

1194
01:08:11,600 --> 01:08:13,800
Speaker 1: be paying the more attention to where like the dough

1195
01:08:13,920 --> 01:08:16,960
Speaker 1: pockets are, the dough groups are, and then look at

1196
01:08:17,000 --> 01:08:19,240
Speaker 1: some sign you know, in and around them, maybe trying

1197
01:08:19,240 --> 01:08:21,360
Speaker 1: to even bump up some does trying to figure out

1198
01:08:21,360 --> 01:08:24,519
Speaker 1: exactly where they're laying down it and then looking you

1199
01:08:24,560 --> 01:08:27,760
Speaker 1: know it's down winds of those areas and trying to

1200
01:08:29,120 --> 01:08:33,880
Speaker 1: find setup accordingly do that, Yes, would be my my

1201
01:08:34,040 --> 01:08:37,840
Speaker 1: go too. There's uh I want to tell this story

1202
01:08:37,880 --> 01:08:44,160
Speaker 1: real quickly because it just it just it's uh the

1203
01:08:44,160 --> 01:08:47,439
Speaker 1: epitome of the type of hunter you are justin and

1204
01:08:47,479 --> 01:08:49,160
Speaker 1: I don't don't even know if this was hill country.

1205
01:08:49,200 --> 01:08:51,880
Speaker 1: You can allude to that, but that's more to do

1206
01:08:51,920 --> 01:08:57,280
Speaker 1: with your style. But you hunted uh different state this year.

1207
01:08:57,280 --> 01:08:59,280
Speaker 1: I'm not gonna dive into it, but it's it's actually

1208
01:08:59,439 --> 01:09:04,280
Speaker 1: uh spot that I told you about m and um

1209
01:09:04,520 --> 01:09:08,040
Speaker 1: just so happened that I knew several hunters that were

1210
01:09:08,080 --> 01:09:11,400
Speaker 1: hunting that same piece of public land while you were there,

1211
01:09:11,840 --> 01:09:17,120
Speaker 1: including one of the very best, John eberhard Um, and

1212
01:09:17,240 --> 01:09:23,880
Speaker 1: several other very accomplished hunters. And I don't think he

1213
01:09:24,080 --> 01:09:26,800
Speaker 1: was there that long, but some of those guys were

1214
01:09:26,840 --> 01:09:31,080
Speaker 1: there during your two weeks, um, and it sounds like

1215
01:09:31,120 --> 01:09:37,720
Speaker 1: it was some tough hunting, tons of pressure, and you

1216
01:09:37,760 --> 01:09:41,760
Speaker 1: are the only person out of all those people that

1217
01:09:41,840 --> 01:09:43,800
Speaker 1: pulled a deer out of there, and you pulled an

1218
01:09:43,800 --> 01:09:46,679
Speaker 1: absolute giant out of there in just a few days,

1219
01:09:47,880 --> 01:09:50,680
Speaker 1: and uh, it was just incredible. I mean it was

1220
01:09:50,760 --> 01:09:55,559
Speaker 1: just incredible. Um. But in you know, you told that

1221
01:09:55,600 --> 01:09:57,679
Speaker 1: we talked about this hunt, and you were on foot

1222
01:09:58,400 --> 01:10:02,000
Speaker 1: doing just exactly what you're talking about. Uh A lot

1223
01:10:02,040 --> 01:10:05,840
Speaker 1: of the time, kind of still hunting, trying to get into,

1224
01:10:06,960 --> 01:10:10,439
Speaker 1: you know, where a big buck was living, and if

1225
01:10:10,479 --> 01:10:12,080
Speaker 1: you needed to get him up on his feet and

1226
01:10:12,120 --> 01:10:14,200
Speaker 1: bump him, then so be it, because then now you

1227
01:10:14,240 --> 01:10:17,120
Speaker 1: know what you're hunting. But I don't know, I just

1228
01:10:17,120 --> 01:10:21,080
Speaker 1: did that. I dude, actually kicked that deer. I'm I'm

1229
01:10:21,160 --> 01:10:23,360
Speaker 1: almost a hunter percent to andy that I kicked that

1230
01:10:23,439 --> 01:10:26,599
Speaker 1: deer up. I didn't. I didn't actually see him take off.

1231
01:10:26,600 --> 01:10:28,720
Speaker 1: I just I've heard him. I got up there to

1232
01:10:28,800 --> 01:10:30,680
Speaker 1: the bed, I looked it over. There was plenty of

1233
01:10:30,680 --> 01:10:34,760
Speaker 1: signing there, and I think I killed him two days

1234
01:10:34,880 --> 01:10:38,640
Speaker 1: later coming back into the general area. That was just

1235
01:10:38,680 --> 01:10:46,719
Speaker 1: a giant zealous giants. This is justin is so good

1236
01:10:46,760 --> 01:10:50,080
Speaker 1: at that. I would I Andy said it just stay

1237
01:10:50,160 --> 01:10:53,439
Speaker 1: here from me too, like this is where he like,

1238
01:10:54,360 --> 01:10:56,280
Speaker 1: I've never seen anything like that. You know that that

1239
01:10:56,479 --> 01:11:03,000
Speaker 1: just fair woodsmanship. I'll understand. Then the deer um you

1240
01:11:03,120 --> 01:11:06,559
Speaker 1: mentioned something justin that I wanted to kind of call out,

1241
01:11:06,640 --> 01:11:09,799
Speaker 1: and that's you said. You know, when they get bumped,

1242
01:11:09,880 --> 01:11:12,200
Speaker 1: they come back. They don't pay as much attention to

1243
01:11:12,200 --> 01:11:16,240
Speaker 1: your sign your ground set. And I think that's true.

1244
01:11:16,840 --> 01:11:21,000
Speaker 1: And so a big buck moving through the woods gets

1245
01:11:21,040 --> 01:11:25,080
Speaker 1: human scent. He's on the move. If he locks up,

1246
01:11:25,160 --> 01:11:31,600
Speaker 1: he's worried. But he gets bumped out of somewhere. Deer

1247
01:11:31,920 --> 01:11:35,320
Speaker 1: places they live in North America. They're running into humans.

1248
01:11:35,520 --> 01:11:39,519
Speaker 1: You know, they're getting bumped up by people. So they

1249
01:11:39,560 --> 01:11:41,840
Speaker 1: get bumped up. And if he gets bumped up, maybe

1250
01:11:41,840 --> 01:11:44,600
Speaker 1: he knew you were a hunter a human. Um I

1251
01:11:44,640 --> 01:11:48,479
Speaker 1: do agree, Like once, if they smell you, thoughts go

1252
01:11:48,520 --> 01:12:00,000
Speaker 1: way down. But um, I think that um the um,

1253
01:12:00,360 --> 01:12:04,000
Speaker 1: I think that the deer if they get bumped up

1254
01:12:04,000 --> 01:12:06,519
Speaker 1: and come back, they knew somebody was walking through there,

1255
01:12:06,680 --> 01:12:09,200
Speaker 1: so they're like, oh, yeah, he was there two hours ago,

1256
01:12:09,400 --> 01:12:11,920
Speaker 1: and then he dies because Johnathan was still standing there,

1257
01:12:11,960 --> 01:12:16,120
Speaker 1: you know. So, um that's what they like. I think

1258
01:12:16,200 --> 01:12:20,360
Speaker 1: they're less worry about ground sent under those specific circumstances.

1259
01:12:20,560 --> 01:12:22,479
Speaker 1: You know, not gonna say. I mean, they might still

1260
01:12:22,560 --> 01:12:25,240
Speaker 1: lock up, but they seem to. If they think it's

1261
01:12:25,280 --> 01:12:29,080
Speaker 1: just somebody moving through, they're less worried, and they'll come

1262
01:12:29,120 --> 01:12:32,320
Speaker 1: and they'll be worried coming back. They'll probably sneak try

1263
01:12:32,360 --> 01:12:35,679
Speaker 1: to sneak back in, but it's not like them being

1264
01:12:35,840 --> 01:12:38,720
Speaker 1: on the move and then hitting ground cent that's when

1265
01:12:38,760 --> 01:12:43,759
Speaker 1: they freak out. You know, we're already yeah, yeah, spot

1266
01:12:43,880 --> 01:12:45,519
Speaker 1: on with it. Though. I actually got to watch that

1267
01:12:45,680 --> 01:12:50,200
Speaker 1: year from probably a good and I'm talking about a

1268
01:12:50,320 --> 01:12:52,559
Speaker 1: year until a few years ago. Um, I got to

1269
01:12:52,560 --> 01:12:55,000
Speaker 1: watch him that I like, I said, I bumped him

1270
01:12:55,040 --> 01:12:57,880
Speaker 1: on the same day he made a loop and came

1271
01:12:57,920 --> 01:13:00,000
Speaker 1: back in and I got him. But I watched him

1272
01:13:00,080 --> 01:13:03,000
Speaker 1: coming into the bed from a good I don't know,

1273
01:13:03,120 --> 01:13:06,360
Speaker 1: eighty ninety yards, you know, and it's just like a

1274
01:13:06,640 --> 01:13:09,040
Speaker 1: big buck moved through the woods. I mean he without

1275
01:13:09,080 --> 01:13:10,960
Speaker 1: a doubt, he had his nose to the ground, was

1276
01:13:11,000 --> 01:13:13,920
Speaker 1: spelling where I was. They could be steps. He stopped

1277
01:13:13,960 --> 01:13:16,320
Speaker 1: and he's just stand there and you know you'd look around.

1278
01:13:16,800 --> 01:13:18,040
Speaker 1: I mean he did that all the way and it

1279
01:13:18,080 --> 01:13:21,240
Speaker 1: took him forever to get in there. And uh, to

1280
01:13:21,320 --> 01:13:24,280
Speaker 1: say I held it together, it would be a lie.

1281
01:13:24,360 --> 01:13:26,680
Speaker 1: I was shaking like a leaf as you coming back in.

1282
01:13:26,800 --> 01:13:30,600
Speaker 1: But but it worked out, and that really opened my

1283
01:13:30,640 --> 01:13:33,519
Speaker 1: eyes to that. Uh. Like I said, I wasn't I

1284
01:13:33,560 --> 01:13:36,160
Speaker 1: wasn't there on purpose to do that that day. I

1285
01:13:36,280 --> 01:13:39,639
Speaker 1: was looking the area over, but it just so happened

1286
01:13:39,680 --> 01:13:41,680
Speaker 1: that I caught, you know, I caught movement out of

1287
01:13:41,680 --> 01:13:44,800
Speaker 1: the corner of my eye, and um, the restless history.

1288
01:13:44,840 --> 01:13:47,439
Speaker 1: You know, it worked out. So but I can tell

1289
01:13:47,439 --> 01:13:49,920
Speaker 1: you a lot of stories too that where you know,

1290
01:13:49,960 --> 01:13:52,880
Speaker 1: I've jumped the deer up and I you know, I

1291
01:13:52,920 --> 01:13:54,800
Speaker 1: set up for whatever they they would come back, and

1292
01:13:54,840 --> 01:13:58,759
Speaker 1: he did so. Yeah, And because of course it doesn't

1293
01:13:58,760 --> 01:14:01,080
Speaker 1: always work. I got a couple of follo up questions

1294
01:14:01,120 --> 01:14:05,960
Speaker 1: on that UM number one we hear about this bump

1295
01:14:05,960 --> 01:14:08,759
Speaker 1: and dump tactic, and it makes sense, but it seems

1296
01:14:08,800 --> 01:14:11,880
Speaker 1: like the real crux, like the real trick that separates

1297
01:14:12,000 --> 01:14:14,559
Speaker 1: your average Joe from the guy like you who's actually

1298
01:14:14,560 --> 01:14:17,120
Speaker 1: getting it done. And that wasn't a knock on you, Joe,

1299
01:14:17,200 --> 01:14:22,120
Speaker 1: You're no average show. I really admit I'm not really

1300
01:14:22,160 --> 01:14:24,479
Speaker 1: good at this tactic, Like I don't have a lot

1301
01:14:24,520 --> 01:14:27,200
Speaker 1: of confidence in it. Then let us say it's not

1302
01:14:27,240 --> 01:14:29,679
Speaker 1: because it doesn't work, you know, so feel feel free

1303
01:14:29,680 --> 01:14:32,920
Speaker 1: to use my name. I believe it works. It's just

1304
01:14:32,920 --> 01:14:37,280
Speaker 1: Justin's great at this. So then what separates what separates

1305
01:14:37,320 --> 01:14:40,200
Speaker 1: you from average Joe here on the line is that

1306
01:14:40,760 --> 01:14:44,479
Speaker 1: the trick seems to be in picking the right tree

1307
01:14:44,600 --> 01:14:46,920
Speaker 1: for the setup. Like that seems to be the really

1308
01:14:46,920 --> 01:14:49,120
Speaker 1: tricky spot is figuring out the way to set up,

1309
01:14:49,240 --> 01:14:51,639
Speaker 1: in anticipating how that buck's going to come back, in

1310
01:14:52,160 --> 01:14:55,760
Speaker 1: anticipating how he'll use the wind um. That seems just

1311
01:14:55,840 --> 01:14:58,040
Speaker 1: really tricky. There seems like a really narrow line you've

1312
01:14:58,040 --> 01:15:00,439
Speaker 1: got to walk between being in the right place to

1313
01:15:00,479 --> 01:15:02,639
Speaker 1: be close to being a range of whatever that trail

1314
01:15:02,760 --> 01:15:05,040
Speaker 1: or where that bed is, etcetera, etcetera. But then also

1315
01:15:05,080 --> 01:15:09,920
Speaker 1: anticipating how he's reacting to this bumpyhead. So question number

1316
01:15:09,920 --> 01:15:12,960
Speaker 1: one is I'd love more detail on how you're thinking

1317
01:15:13,000 --> 01:15:15,639
Speaker 1: through where you're going to set up. And then question

1318
01:15:15,720 --> 01:15:22,760
Speaker 1: number two is bumping dumps like this in hill country

1319
01:15:22,800 --> 01:15:28,200
Speaker 1: is that any different than in flatter terrain. I'm imagining

1320
01:15:28,240 --> 01:15:31,679
Speaker 1: that on some of these types of points or betting

1321
01:15:31,760 --> 01:15:34,800
Speaker 1: up a high on bowls these bucks, it's gonna be

1322
01:15:34,840 --> 01:15:36,800
Speaker 1: harder to get close to a buck like that without

1323
01:15:36,840 --> 01:15:39,560
Speaker 1: them seeing you from a distance because of their the

1324
01:15:39,600 --> 01:15:42,519
Speaker 1: way they use terrain to their advantage. It just seems harder.

1325
01:15:42,720 --> 01:15:44,360
Speaker 1: I'm thinking it would be harder to pull off a

1326
01:15:44,360 --> 01:15:47,400
Speaker 1: bump and dump without a buck bumping way sooner than

1327
01:15:47,439 --> 01:15:49,639
Speaker 1: you would ever build it close enough to know where

1328
01:15:49,680 --> 01:15:52,760
Speaker 1: he was betted. So just curious if there's anything when

1329
01:15:52,800 --> 01:15:55,599
Speaker 1: it comes to those types of hilly situations where it's

1330
01:15:55,640 --> 01:15:58,360
Speaker 1: just tough to get close enough to one to know

1331
01:15:58,400 --> 01:16:01,400
Speaker 1: where that bed was. So question one and to start

1332
01:16:01,479 --> 01:16:04,160
Speaker 1: to give you double double ammy there, but give me

1333
01:16:04,200 --> 01:16:09,160
Speaker 1: the real details on that setup in your thought process. First. Well,

1334
01:16:09,160 --> 01:16:11,879
Speaker 1: in the hills, I think you're correct, it is definitely

1335
01:16:11,920 --> 01:16:14,640
Speaker 1: hard to get close enough to see them because I

1336
01:16:14,640 --> 01:16:17,320
Speaker 1: think a lot of times they they get out of

1337
01:16:17,360 --> 01:16:20,240
Speaker 1: there before you were you know, aware of something even

1338
01:16:20,360 --> 01:16:23,360
Speaker 1: being there. Um. But then again I've also had you know,

1339
01:16:23,400 --> 01:16:28,240
Speaker 1: big box, really old pipe an area and they're the

1340
01:16:28,240 --> 01:16:29,680
Speaker 1: heck out of you when they jump up, you know,

1341
01:16:29,680 --> 01:16:32,600
Speaker 1: because you're right next to him or whatever. Um. But

1342
01:16:33,320 --> 01:16:36,200
Speaker 1: in the hills, I mean, with the terrain and everything,

1343
01:16:36,280 --> 01:16:39,439
Speaker 1: I'm usually once I jump one and I feel like that,

1344
01:16:39,520 --> 01:16:42,200
Speaker 1: you know, he didn't get my wind, um, and he

1345
01:16:42,240 --> 01:16:44,080
Speaker 1: didn't take off the bust off out of there like

1346
01:16:44,120 --> 01:16:47,400
Speaker 1: he was here to death. I'm usually looking at the

1347
01:16:47,479 --> 01:16:50,880
Speaker 1: terrain around um that year, I feel like it's going

1348
01:16:50,920 --> 01:16:53,680
Speaker 1: to try to get down wind of that. So if

1349
01:16:53,720 --> 01:16:56,240
Speaker 1: it's you know, say if it's a bowl, you know,

1350
01:16:56,360 --> 01:16:59,120
Speaker 1: he's probably gonna try to use that other side of

1351
01:16:59,120 --> 01:17:02,200
Speaker 1: the ridge to to come back in you know, well

1352
01:17:02,240 --> 01:17:07,080
Speaker 1: out of cider anything. But it's it's it's hard to

1353
01:17:07,120 --> 01:17:11,360
Speaker 1: explain to the situational based on the terrain around there. Um.

1354
01:17:11,400 --> 01:17:13,680
Speaker 1: I had a buddy and I think I sent this

1355
01:17:13,840 --> 01:17:16,800
Speaker 1: you Andy that did it. He went in and and

1356
01:17:16,920 --> 01:17:20,479
Speaker 1: was setting up on a deer and he bumping and

1357
01:17:21,040 --> 01:17:22,960
Speaker 1: the ridge. It was kind of like point this year

1358
01:17:23,040 --> 01:17:27,400
Speaker 1: was fed on well then the main ridge you know say,

1359
01:17:27,439 --> 01:17:30,000
Speaker 1: extend back to the south, and then there was kind

1360
01:17:30,000 --> 01:17:33,519
Speaker 1: of made a ninety right there. It looked around down

1361
01:17:33,560 --> 01:17:37,080
Speaker 1: to another point that dropped down. So I told him,

1362
01:17:37,080 --> 01:17:39,719
Speaker 1: I said, well, I would slip back on that bridge

1363
01:17:39,760 --> 01:17:41,639
Speaker 1: back there. You know that the wind was blown back

1364
01:17:41,680 --> 01:17:45,640
Speaker 1: in that direction. And sure enough that that deer just

1365
01:17:46,120 --> 01:17:48,360
Speaker 1: you know, he dropped down off that point a circle

1366
01:17:48,439 --> 01:17:50,400
Speaker 1: around and he started coming up this other point that

1367
01:17:50,439 --> 01:17:53,320
Speaker 1: would have probably been about it. I don't know, a

1368
01:17:53,400 --> 01:17:58,439
Speaker 1: hundred yards maybe eight hundred yards distance between there, and

1369
01:17:58,760 --> 01:18:02,040
Speaker 1: unfortunately he you know, the shot didn't go so well. Hegnessed,

1370
01:18:02,240 --> 01:18:04,479
Speaker 1: but the deer did. Dude, he came back and he

1371
01:18:04,520 --> 01:18:07,439
Speaker 1: was circling back around, and I'm confident he was circling

1372
01:18:07,479 --> 01:18:10,519
Speaker 1: back around us, you know, to figure out what that was,

1373
01:18:11,400 --> 01:18:15,200
Speaker 1: so the terrain would be um the number one thing

1374
01:18:15,240 --> 01:18:17,160
Speaker 1: for me. I'm looking at the rain and how I

1375
01:18:17,200 --> 01:18:20,360
Speaker 1: think that deer we'll get down winto that position that

1376
01:18:20,439 --> 01:18:23,599
Speaker 1: I was at down when his bed, how he'll loop

1377
01:18:23,640 --> 01:18:26,439
Speaker 1: back in sture. I don't always get it right, you know.

1378
01:18:26,720 --> 01:18:29,559
Speaker 1: There's there's definitely times where, like I said, I don't

1379
01:18:29,600 --> 01:18:32,280
Speaker 1: see him come back, and I'm sure maybe they looked

1380
01:18:32,320 --> 01:18:34,560
Speaker 1: a little further out than I. You know, it's justipated.

1381
01:18:34,800 --> 01:18:40,000
Speaker 1: But and what was your second question there, Mark on that? Well, yeah,

1382
01:18:40,080 --> 01:18:42,479
Speaker 1: so so one part one you kind of answered both

1383
01:18:42,520 --> 01:18:45,479
Speaker 1: of them together. Um, so it kind of worked out.

1384
01:18:45,520 --> 01:18:47,400
Speaker 1: But if you have anything else when it comes to

1385
01:18:47,400 --> 01:18:51,439
Speaker 1: the thought process, I'm picking the tree and or unique

1386
01:18:51,479 --> 01:18:53,640
Speaker 1: aspects in the hills, and you kind of combined them.

1387
01:18:53,680 --> 01:18:55,439
Speaker 1: But if there's anything else as far as picking the

1388
01:18:55,520 --> 01:18:58,800
Speaker 1: right tree in that situation, I'll take it Otherwise. Otherwise, Andy,

1389
01:18:58,840 --> 01:19:04,040
Speaker 1: you can jump in. Well, I ticking the tree and stuff. Um,

1390
01:19:04,080 --> 01:19:07,559
Speaker 1: actually a couple of them. I filled off the ground.

1391
01:19:07,800 --> 01:19:11,559
Speaker 1: I did it this year. Um, early season. I jumped

1392
01:19:11,560 --> 01:19:14,160
Speaker 1: one up, actually jumped this yere up right next to

1393
01:19:14,240 --> 01:19:19,280
Speaker 1: a road and he crossed that. He ran out across

1394
01:19:19,280 --> 01:19:22,439
Speaker 1: the road, which really shocked me that he went that direction,

1395
01:19:22,479 --> 01:19:24,880
Speaker 1: but across the road. So I looked at you know,

1396
01:19:25,439 --> 01:19:28,120
Speaker 1: I looked at it, um, and this was I mean,

1397
01:19:28,120 --> 01:19:29,880
Speaker 1: it's still country, but there was was kind of down

1398
01:19:29,920 --> 01:19:33,559
Speaker 1: off in the bottom and a wide bottom. And I

1399
01:19:33,600 --> 01:19:39,320
Speaker 1: looked it over and I knew about two fifty yards down. Uh,

1400
01:19:39,479 --> 01:19:41,559
Speaker 1: what it was is a blocket timber kind of like

1401
01:19:41,600 --> 01:19:44,240
Speaker 1: a train in the shape blocket timber. At the tip

1402
01:19:44,280 --> 01:19:46,519
Speaker 1: of that was a tree line that went down and

1403
01:19:46,520 --> 01:19:49,160
Speaker 1: split this field and it's kind of like in a wail.

1404
01:19:49,800 --> 01:19:53,200
Speaker 1: And then that went down and head and you know say,

1405
01:19:53,240 --> 01:19:55,439
Speaker 1: if you would go left, it would left let off

1406
01:19:55,479 --> 01:19:58,640
Speaker 1: to the bigger timber to the right was per centry.

1407
01:19:59,040 --> 01:20:02,000
Speaker 1: I felt pretty confident it that that deer was head

1408
01:20:02,040 --> 01:20:06,280
Speaker 1: in that direction. The sign leading out of that um

1409
01:20:06,560 --> 01:20:10,479
Speaker 1: pretty much told the story. So after I jumped him

1410
01:20:10,560 --> 01:20:12,479
Speaker 1: and I was looking over that timber is about an

1411
01:20:12,479 --> 01:20:14,880
Speaker 1: acre and a half size, I knew that I wasn't

1412
01:20:14,880 --> 01:20:16,760
Speaker 1: gonna be able to cover all that if he came

1413
01:20:16,800 --> 01:20:19,240
Speaker 1: back in, And as you got towards the tip of that,

1414
01:20:19,640 --> 01:20:23,040
Speaker 1: the winds kind of got punky up there. So I

1415
01:20:23,120 --> 01:20:25,760
Speaker 1: just looked at the situation over. I thought my best

1416
01:20:25,760 --> 01:20:28,200
Speaker 1: crack would be to move out of there, kind of

1417
01:20:28,240 --> 01:20:30,400
Speaker 1: walk off in a direction like going back to the

1418
01:20:30,479 --> 01:20:34,080
Speaker 1: road in case he try to, you know, follow me out,

1419
01:20:34,840 --> 01:20:37,599
Speaker 1: and uh. I walked out that direction and I kind

1420
01:20:37,600 --> 01:20:40,000
Speaker 1: of made a loop in the field. It dumped back in,

1421
01:20:40,160 --> 01:20:43,000
Speaker 1: dumped down off kind of in this little valley, and

1422
01:20:43,800 --> 01:20:46,400
Speaker 1: set up down there, thinking that deer would probably because

1423
01:20:46,439 --> 01:20:48,560
Speaker 1: I bumped him I think at three in the afternoon

1424
01:20:48,640 --> 01:20:50,920
Speaker 1: and that's when it's getting dark, at like six thirty

1425
01:20:51,040 --> 01:20:57,400
Speaker 1: almost seven, And it worked out. He came back in, Um,

1426
01:20:57,600 --> 01:21:00,400
Speaker 1: came down through there and just carried on out. Is

1427
01:21:00,479 --> 01:21:03,479
Speaker 1: the normal, you know, normal evening thinking. I was a

1428
01:21:03,479 --> 01:21:05,320
Speaker 1: long going and that was probably a two and a

1429
01:21:05,360 --> 01:21:10,040
Speaker 1: half to three hour stretch in between that. So as

1430
01:21:10,080 --> 01:21:11,640
Speaker 1: far as picking the right tree, I don't know. I

1431
01:21:11,720 --> 01:21:14,320
Speaker 1: just have to look the situation over. It's kind of

1432
01:21:14,320 --> 01:21:19,439
Speaker 1: a got feeling and sinkuble type thing, I guess, you know,

1433
01:21:19,600 --> 01:21:22,640
Speaker 1: just being in that situation because they're all they're all

1434
01:21:22,680 --> 01:21:25,000
Speaker 1: so different. It's hard to I mean, if I had,

1435
01:21:25,120 --> 01:21:26,960
Speaker 1: you know, an example in front of me or something,

1436
01:21:27,000 --> 01:21:30,080
Speaker 1: I could, you know, maybe go about the insternet a

1437
01:21:30,080 --> 01:21:35,519
Speaker 1: little better. But yeah, no, that's that's helpful. Um okay,

1438
01:21:35,560 --> 01:21:38,479
Speaker 1: I think I think and lets you want to correct

1439
01:21:38,479 --> 01:21:40,840
Speaker 1: me something wrong here? I think we need to hear Joe.

1440
01:21:40,960 --> 01:21:44,240
Speaker 1: Now answer your example as far as the the new

1441
01:21:44,280 --> 01:21:48,400
Speaker 1: property in southern Ohio, Kentucky. Right, that's right, Joe, so yep,

1442
01:21:48,600 --> 01:21:53,759
Speaker 1: brand new hill country ground. Uh, your strategy from start

1443
01:21:53,840 --> 01:21:59,400
Speaker 1: to finish early season and then rut yeah, um, go

1444
01:21:59,720 --> 01:22:05,040
Speaker 1: go yeah, um going in brand new. UM. I mean,

1445
01:22:05,080 --> 01:22:09,800
Speaker 1: I really admit it. It's distinctly different from justin. UM.

1446
01:22:10,000 --> 01:22:14,559
Speaker 1: I mean he's, as you guys could tell the last

1447
01:22:14,600 --> 01:22:18,080
Speaker 1: that's a mensis next level and that UM, you know,

1448
01:22:18,240 --> 01:22:23,639
Speaker 1: just kind of snooping around, bumping um. UM. That's that's incredible. UM.

1449
01:22:23,760 --> 01:22:25,680
Speaker 1: He's a hunter. I want to be when I go up,

1450
01:22:29,760 --> 01:22:37,200
Speaker 1: you know, in those circumstances. UM. So I like, I

1451
01:22:37,360 --> 01:22:41,320
Speaker 1: like to be efficient with my time. So UM, I

1452
01:22:41,439 --> 01:22:44,839
Speaker 1: do a lot of scouting. I pay attention two tracks,

1453
01:22:45,120 --> 01:22:47,679
Speaker 1: you know, I pay attention to hot sign and food

1454
01:22:47,680 --> 01:22:50,759
Speaker 1: source and all that. But really just to be efficient.

1455
01:22:50,800 --> 01:22:53,920
Speaker 1: If I'm saying, you know, it's a great big piece

1456
01:22:53,960 --> 01:22:58,439
Speaker 1: of property. You know, it's these thousands of akers, UM.

1457
01:22:58,560 --> 01:23:02,240
Speaker 1: And I'm mapping out. I'm I'm mapping out like potential

1458
01:23:02,479 --> 01:23:08,800
Speaker 1: betting UM based on like stem count and points UM,

1459
01:23:09,200 --> 01:23:13,519
Speaker 1: terrain features, UM funnels and and you know like the

1460
01:23:14,000 --> 01:23:18,640
Speaker 1: turkey feet um that we talked about UM, like on GPS,

1461
01:23:18,720 --> 01:23:21,719
Speaker 1: and and I'm mapping all that out ahead of time

1462
01:23:21,760 --> 01:23:24,120
Speaker 1: so I can go in. And basically I'm scouting too,

1463
01:23:24,800 --> 01:23:26,519
Speaker 1: and I want to be like I set offficient of

1464
01:23:26,600 --> 01:23:28,760
Speaker 1: my time. I'm going to swing a big loop through

1465
01:23:28,800 --> 01:23:31,760
Speaker 1: the area, and I'm my goal is to cover as

1466
01:23:31,840 --> 01:23:35,680
Speaker 1: much ground as efficiently as possible. And a lot of

1467
01:23:35,720 --> 01:23:38,840
Speaker 1: times like I'll have my bow with me, you know,

1468
01:23:39,120 --> 01:23:42,200
Speaker 1: and sticks and tree I use a tree saddle. Um

1469
01:23:42,560 --> 01:23:47,760
Speaker 1: so um it's white mobile. And if I hit a

1470
01:23:47,800 --> 01:23:50,160
Speaker 1: spot where I think it's worth setting up, you know,

1471
01:23:50,400 --> 01:23:54,439
Speaker 1: say acorns are fall in early season. Um, and there's

1472
01:23:54,720 --> 01:23:57,360
Speaker 1: you know around a fresh rubber two and you know,

1473
01:23:57,479 --> 01:24:00,040
Speaker 1: big tracks and it's you know, just up the it

1474
01:24:00,320 --> 01:24:03,479
Speaker 1: from a bunch of secondary points. Um. You know. Yeah,

1475
01:24:03,479 --> 01:24:06,280
Speaker 1: obviously I'll be looking for a set up or I

1476
01:24:06,360 --> 01:24:10,320
Speaker 1: might be just you know, um, I'm probably a little

1477
01:24:10,800 --> 01:24:13,960
Speaker 1: heavier handed than justin I don't think I quite quite

1478
01:24:14,000 --> 01:24:17,439
Speaker 1: as touch about stuffed and set up. And I'll come through.

1479
01:24:17,520 --> 01:24:19,800
Speaker 1: I'll just you know, run through it, but still with

1480
01:24:19,840 --> 01:24:23,960
Speaker 1: the mentality of like if I bump something, um, even

1481
01:24:23,960 --> 01:24:26,559
Speaker 1: if I bump it hard, I might come back there,

1482
01:24:26,920 --> 01:24:30,880
Speaker 1: you know a few days later, um, and I and

1483
01:24:30,960 --> 01:24:37,280
Speaker 1: I have um, you know done setting up head deer comeback.

1484
01:24:37,479 --> 01:24:40,000
Speaker 1: I re really admit I have not killed one doing that.

1485
01:24:40,040 --> 01:24:43,200
Speaker 1: I've come real close a couple of times, but I haven't.

1486
01:24:44,400 --> 01:24:47,639
Speaker 1: I don't I don't lie to you. Um. And it's

1487
01:24:47,760 --> 01:24:50,800
Speaker 1: it's and it's more just you know, being good at it,

1488
01:24:50,880 --> 01:24:53,880
Speaker 1: you know, with practice to get better at it. Um.

1489
01:24:53,960 --> 01:24:58,800
Speaker 1: So I like to have a real as much as

1490
01:24:59,000 --> 01:25:03,799
Speaker 1: you know, I like cyber scouting whatever. Um. I don't

1491
01:25:03,840 --> 01:25:06,599
Speaker 1: have high confidence until I put boots on the ground

1492
01:25:06,640 --> 01:25:09,840
Speaker 1: and walk through an area that's kind of my angle. Um.

1493
01:25:10,080 --> 01:25:13,639
Speaker 1: So I'll, like I said, it might be five acres

1494
01:25:13,680 --> 01:25:18,080
Speaker 1: that I'm dealing with, I'll put in eight miles you know,

1495
01:25:18,360 --> 01:25:20,960
Speaker 1: in one day and just swing a big loop and

1496
01:25:21,000 --> 01:25:24,080
Speaker 1: then I feel a lot more comfortable about Okay, you

1497
01:25:24,160 --> 01:25:27,800
Speaker 1: know where the dare distributed in that area? Where is

1498
01:25:27,880 --> 01:25:31,479
Speaker 1: the food right now? You know that very so much

1499
01:25:31,479 --> 01:25:35,320
Speaker 1: earlier season. Um, and it can depend you know, are

1500
01:25:35,320 --> 01:25:37,240
Speaker 1: the white oaks fall? And are the red oaks fall?

1501
01:25:37,280 --> 01:25:39,040
Speaker 1: And are there any white you know, are there any

1502
01:25:39,160 --> 01:25:43,400
Speaker 1: coinsmence woever? Are they you know? I mean per Simmons,

1503
01:25:43,439 --> 01:25:48,800
Speaker 1: you know I just mentioned, Um, there's different, Um, you

1504
01:25:48,840 --> 01:25:52,080
Speaker 1: know early seasons about what's hot right now. It's not

1505
01:25:52,240 --> 01:25:54,720
Speaker 1: last week, it's not next week. You've really got to

1506
01:25:54,760 --> 01:25:59,599
Speaker 1: be you know. They things shift really rapidly. Um. And

1507
01:25:59,640 --> 01:26:02,400
Speaker 1: then you know, my favorite time period is like the

1508
01:26:02,479 --> 01:26:05,960
Speaker 1: pre rut into the early ruts phases. Um, I just

1509
01:26:06,080 --> 01:26:09,320
Speaker 1: love hunting that time period. Bucks are moving more, but

1510
01:26:09,400 --> 01:26:16,080
Speaker 1: they're still really consistent, um, you know, not too erratic movement,

1511
01:26:16,280 --> 01:26:19,839
Speaker 1: just following dose and heat before any does coming there,

1512
01:26:19,840 --> 01:26:22,920
Speaker 1: hardly any does come into astrius. So then then it's

1513
01:26:22,960 --> 01:26:26,840
Speaker 1: more okay where the dough group and the bucks are nearby.

1514
01:26:27,000 --> 01:26:31,240
Speaker 1: They're not necessarily chasing or cruising yet, but the bucks

1515
01:26:31,280 --> 01:26:33,360
Speaker 1: are going to keep tats on those dough groups. So

1516
01:26:33,439 --> 01:26:37,200
Speaker 1: that's where it really I'll be focusing more on those

1517
01:26:37,240 --> 01:26:40,880
Speaker 1: like um, you know, the the high turkey feet or

1518
01:26:40,920 --> 01:26:43,360
Speaker 1: the low turkey seat as it talked about in that

1519
01:26:43,479 --> 01:26:48,920
Speaker 1: pre rot period, the thermal hubs on those spots because

1520
01:26:49,000 --> 01:26:51,840
Speaker 1: usually um, like those turkey seats, they a lot of

1521
01:26:51,840 --> 01:26:54,720
Speaker 1: times have does that are they around there too? And

1522
01:26:54,800 --> 01:26:57,800
Speaker 1: that's when the but you know that week build up

1523
01:26:57,840 --> 01:27:00,800
Speaker 1: into the rut, that's when a lot of time you

1524
01:27:00,880 --> 01:27:03,760
Speaker 1: start seeing bucks get visible in those areas where other

1525
01:27:03,760 --> 01:27:05,840
Speaker 1: times a year they might not be anywhere around there,

1526
01:27:06,200 --> 01:27:09,040
Speaker 1: um because they don't need to, you know, they don't

1527
01:27:09,040 --> 01:27:13,680
Speaker 1: care about it. Those UM that's kind of how I

1528
01:27:13,760 --> 01:27:18,559
Speaker 1: tackle It's it's um probably more um just focusing on

1529
01:27:18,840 --> 01:27:24,400
Speaker 1: strategy and preparation because that's kind of my style, you know,

1530
01:27:24,479 --> 01:27:27,160
Speaker 1: and that that's what I would stress. You know, Justin's

1531
01:27:27,280 --> 01:27:29,400
Speaker 1: that doesn't have you know, he's got the best style

1532
01:27:29,479 --> 01:27:31,920
Speaker 1: for him, not necessarily gonna be a sixth great step

1533
01:27:32,000 --> 01:27:34,479
Speaker 1: for anybody else. I've got the best. I'm you know,

1534
01:27:34,560 --> 01:27:37,559
Speaker 1: working on the best style for me. You know, so

1535
01:27:37,760 --> 01:27:39,760
Speaker 1: if you want to be the best tenor you can

1536
01:27:39,800 --> 01:27:42,760
Speaker 1: be buying something that works for you. Don't try to

1537
01:27:42,840 --> 01:27:45,240
Speaker 1: copy something else to somebody else. You know, you get

1538
01:27:45,240 --> 01:27:47,800
Speaker 1: ideas from mother, Yeah, you can get get ideas from

1539
01:27:47,800 --> 01:27:51,080
Speaker 1: somebody else, you know. You know I listened to Justin,

1540
01:27:51,240 --> 01:27:55,720
Speaker 1: you know, Andy, you Mark, Um, we listened to each other.

1541
01:27:56,040 --> 01:27:58,960
Speaker 1: But you know, um, I do think some people would

1542
01:27:59,000 --> 01:28:01,240
Speaker 1: kind of get hung up. Oh you know I'm doing

1543
01:28:01,280 --> 01:28:05,840
Speaker 1: what is doing? Yeah, you know that you've been you know,

1544
01:28:06,120 --> 01:28:08,600
Speaker 1: kind of waste, been in your wheels if you just

1545
01:28:08,600 --> 01:28:11,160
Speaker 1: just kind of replicate, don't try to replicate, you know,

1546
01:28:12,000 --> 01:28:14,720
Speaker 1: my final works for you. Yeah. I love that you

1547
01:28:14,760 --> 01:28:18,160
Speaker 1: guys answered that so differently, And I was I kind

1548
01:28:18,160 --> 01:28:21,120
Speaker 1: of thought you might, um, But you know, you guys

1549
01:28:21,120 --> 01:28:23,800
Speaker 1: are both you gos, both playing to your strengths like Joe,

1550
01:28:23,800 --> 01:28:27,640
Speaker 1: It's exactly how I thought you would answer that. Um.

1551
01:28:27,800 --> 01:28:33,439
Speaker 1: Your your hunts are very well thought out and very

1552
01:28:33,479 --> 01:28:38,360
Speaker 1: strategic and um and a lot of times you you

1553
01:28:38,439 --> 01:28:41,519
Speaker 1: anticipate exactly what is going to happen, even with your

1554
01:28:41,560 --> 01:28:45,840
Speaker 1: deer drives. I mean that everything is so exact, and

1555
01:28:45,880 --> 01:28:48,640
Speaker 1: I know it doesn't play out perfectly every time, but

1556
01:28:49,479 --> 01:28:53,800
Speaker 1: it plays out just the way you think enough for

1557
01:28:53,880 --> 01:28:57,479
Speaker 1: you to be successful on multiple big bucks a year

1558
01:28:57,680 --> 01:29:00,639
Speaker 1: on very limited time. And I just oppresses me so much.

1559
01:29:00,640 --> 01:29:04,479
Speaker 1: And then and justin like, um, you know, Jeal said

1560
01:29:04,479 --> 01:29:07,760
Speaker 1: it best man. Just on the fly woodmanship skills and

1561
01:29:07,880 --> 01:29:12,760
Speaker 1: more of that aggressive instinctual approach. Um, so cool. Um.

1562
01:29:13,880 --> 01:29:18,360
Speaker 1: You know I I I feel like I feel like

1563
01:29:18,439 --> 01:29:21,360
Speaker 1: I do a little bit of both of those styles,

1564
01:29:21,400 --> 01:29:24,320
Speaker 1: but I don't feel as seasoned as either of you

1565
01:29:24,520 --> 01:29:27,160
Speaker 1: in your style at all. Um. And that's why I love.

1566
01:29:27,280 --> 01:29:29,040
Speaker 1: I just love talking to you guys, because I learned

1567
01:29:29,040 --> 01:29:32,000
Speaker 1: so much. There's a couple of things after talking about

1568
01:29:32,000 --> 01:29:34,519
Speaker 1: that I want to expand on. One is food in

1569
01:29:34,520 --> 01:29:36,479
Speaker 1: the hills, but we'll get to that in a second.

1570
01:29:36,560 --> 01:29:41,640
Speaker 1: But so one of my things when I typically when

1571
01:29:41,680 --> 01:29:43,759
Speaker 1: I go to hill country, it's been every time. Actually

1572
01:29:43,800 --> 01:29:49,160
Speaker 1: it's been during the rut. I've never went early season, um,

1573
01:29:49,200 --> 01:29:54,479
Speaker 1: and I've always focused on terrain features, um, you know,

1574
01:29:55,160 --> 01:29:59,120
Speaker 1: thinking bucks are on the move. Um, I'm gonna play

1575
01:29:59,160 --> 01:30:02,280
Speaker 1: the odds and try to get in these terrain funnels,

1576
01:30:02,360 --> 01:30:07,000
Speaker 1: these train features that should funnel movement, um if assuming

1577
01:30:07,000 --> 01:30:08,960
Speaker 1: the bucks are moving. So I usually wait for a

1578
01:30:08,960 --> 01:30:11,080
Speaker 1: good weather pattern, the right time of year, the right

1579
01:30:11,080 --> 01:30:14,120
Speaker 1: conditions for that to happen, and I've had great luck

1580
01:30:14,160 --> 01:30:18,639
Speaker 1: with that. But you know, obviously I kill. I don't

1581
01:30:18,640 --> 01:30:20,880
Speaker 1: always kill the biggest deer in the woods and that

1582
01:30:21,040 --> 01:30:25,120
Speaker 1: in that you know, in that type of situation. So

1583
01:30:25,200 --> 01:30:28,840
Speaker 1: I guess my question for both of you is during

1584
01:30:28,880 --> 01:30:34,479
Speaker 1: the rut, do you do that same thing, um or

1585
01:30:34,520 --> 01:30:38,000
Speaker 1: do you still focus on some of these known buck

1586
01:30:38,080 --> 01:30:41,040
Speaker 1: betting areas or where this deer has been living most

1587
01:30:41,040 --> 01:30:44,280
Speaker 1: of the year. I know, I know Dan has talked

1588
01:30:44,280 --> 01:30:46,320
Speaker 1: about that he's still even during the rut, he's still

1589
01:30:46,360 --> 01:30:49,800
Speaker 1: bouncing around to some of those, um, those known buck

1590
01:30:49,840 --> 01:30:51,720
Speaker 1: betting areas. So I was curious to see what you

1591
01:30:51,760 --> 01:30:53,960
Speaker 1: guys do for me. Like when I go to an

1592
01:30:54,000 --> 01:30:55,960
Speaker 1: unfamiliar area, I don't know what buck is there, so

1593
01:30:55,960 --> 01:30:58,599
Speaker 1: I don't even know where a specific buck is living.

1594
01:30:58,640 --> 01:31:01,960
Speaker 1: And Joe, I know you are really keen into, really

1595
01:31:01,960 --> 01:31:04,599
Speaker 1: tune into where a lot of these books you're hunting

1596
01:31:04,640 --> 01:31:07,920
Speaker 1: are living. So I'm just curious during the rut, is

1597
01:31:07,960 --> 01:31:10,799
Speaker 1: it one strategy more than the other terrain versus betting,

1598
01:31:11,320 --> 01:31:15,479
Speaker 1: or is it more does what do you think? Let's

1599
01:31:15,479 --> 01:31:21,160
Speaker 1: go to Joe first? Yeah, um, well, I yeah, it

1600
01:31:21,280 --> 01:31:28,920
Speaker 1: depends of course, UM but I would probably so, I'm

1601
01:31:28,960 --> 01:31:33,479
Speaker 1: you're right like I'm I'm fanatical, you know, yeah, I

1602
01:31:33,600 --> 01:31:36,120
Speaker 1: you know I live in Iowa. Majority of my huntings

1603
01:31:36,120 --> 01:31:40,759
Speaker 1: in Iowa. Um, I'm able to hunt even I'm hunting

1604
01:31:41,240 --> 01:31:46,120
Speaker 1: a lot of public land, you know. Um ah, I'm

1605
01:31:46,160 --> 01:31:49,320
Speaker 1: able to hunt deer for several years. You know, we've

1606
01:31:49,320 --> 01:31:53,439
Speaker 1: got a good age structure. Everybody knows that. So I

1607
01:31:53,479 --> 01:31:56,400
Speaker 1: can you know, I cover a tunnel land to find

1608
01:31:56,439 --> 01:31:58,840
Speaker 1: these deer. They're not easy to find. They're not in

1609
01:31:58,920 --> 01:32:01,439
Speaker 1: every piece of public I can find, you know, five

1610
01:32:01,560 --> 01:32:06,040
Speaker 1: six year old ducks. Um, and I can you know?

1611
01:32:06,280 --> 01:32:09,559
Speaker 1: I My goal is to detect that deer, even when

1612
01:32:09,560 --> 01:32:15,320
Speaker 1: it's I spread myself so thin that I don't um,

1613
01:32:15,360 --> 01:32:17,439
Speaker 1: I might you know, I'll get a deer on truck came.

1614
01:32:17,520 --> 01:32:19,760
Speaker 1: I never hunted that property, you know. I was like, oh,

1615
01:32:19,800 --> 01:32:22,599
Speaker 1: that's a nice four year old, you know, and they

1616
01:32:22,720 --> 01:32:26,839
Speaker 1: hopefully I got him on camera, you know, on January. Um. Um,

1617
01:32:26,960 --> 01:32:29,120
Speaker 1: and he made it through this. You know, he's gonna

1618
01:32:29,120 --> 01:32:31,679
Speaker 1: be around next year, and maybe I'll get a couple

1619
01:32:31,680 --> 01:32:34,080
Speaker 1: of years of pictures um, and then I can really

1620
01:32:34,360 --> 01:32:39,240
Speaker 1: and and layer on scouting spring scouting on top of that, um,

1621
01:32:39,280 --> 01:32:42,120
Speaker 1: maybe a hunter or two after him, Like I get

1622
01:32:42,160 --> 01:32:44,240
Speaker 1: a couple of years of history with a deer, and

1623
01:32:44,280 --> 01:32:48,200
Speaker 1: I really map out exactly how he's using that area.

1624
01:32:48,880 --> 01:32:52,679
Speaker 1: And almost always they're not entirely we actually talked about

1625
01:32:52,680 --> 01:32:56,200
Speaker 1: this here earlier, but they're not entirely on a piece

1626
01:32:56,240 --> 01:32:58,880
Speaker 1: of public um. They're like, you're hunting a tiny little

1627
01:32:58,960 --> 01:33:01,600
Speaker 1: corner of the range. You've got like one opportunity or

1628
01:33:01,600 --> 01:33:04,600
Speaker 1: maybe a couple opportunities to kill that beer. He's a

1629
01:33:04,600 --> 01:33:07,360
Speaker 1: crossing public in daylight, or he's bet in one spot

1630
01:33:07,360 --> 01:33:12,120
Speaker 1: on public. So um. So what I'm going am answering

1631
01:33:12,439 --> 01:33:15,599
Speaker 1: to answer your question A long way around. I'm relying

1632
01:33:15,600 --> 01:33:20,160
Speaker 1: on that last year history and it's a rut um.

1633
01:33:20,280 --> 01:33:23,960
Speaker 1: Usually it's this buck was cruising through this area in

1634
01:33:24,040 --> 01:33:27,639
Speaker 1: daylight the last year or the last couple of years. UM,

1635
01:33:27,800 --> 01:33:30,920
Speaker 1: And it might be to a doe betting area. UM,

1636
01:33:30,960 --> 01:33:34,080
Speaker 1: I do target in the hills. I tend to think

1637
01:33:34,200 --> 01:33:38,000
Speaker 1: the bucks shift betting um into the rut, most of

1638
01:33:38,000 --> 01:33:42,840
Speaker 1: them do, UM, So they're betting tends in the rut,

1639
01:33:42,960 --> 01:33:45,559
Speaker 1: tends to be closer to the betting um. Sometimes they're

1640
01:33:45,600 --> 01:33:48,360
Speaker 1: bett and even in what would otherwise be a doe

1641
01:33:48,400 --> 01:33:50,640
Speaker 1: betting area if it's if it's thereout they might be

1642
01:33:50,720 --> 01:33:55,639
Speaker 1: laying down in there. UM. But they're doing it where

1643
01:33:55,640 --> 01:33:57,240
Speaker 1: I knew they were doing it last year. And that's

1644
01:33:57,240 --> 01:34:00,519
Speaker 1: what I really key in on. UM that that's what

1645
01:34:00,760 --> 01:34:05,920
Speaker 1: I just laser focus. I've I've got a UM probably

1646
01:34:05,920 --> 01:34:10,120
Speaker 1: a majority of my dear UM that from multi year

1647
01:34:10,600 --> 01:34:15,160
Speaker 1: history where I knew that buck like okay, like the

1648
01:34:15,240 --> 01:34:17,760
Speaker 1: last ten days of October is my time to kill

1649
01:34:17,800 --> 01:34:20,519
Speaker 1: this buck. I need this wind direction, I'm hot to

1650
01:34:20,600 --> 01:34:25,400
Speaker 1: that spot and that's my chance, you know. So that's

1651
01:34:25,400 --> 01:34:28,759
Speaker 1: what I'm teting. So it's not necessarily more dough betting

1652
01:34:29,120 --> 01:34:31,760
Speaker 1: or more. It might be dough betting. It might be

1653
01:34:32,240 --> 01:34:36,120
Speaker 1: just a buck cruising route. UM, it might be a

1654
01:34:36,160 --> 01:34:42,519
Speaker 1: buck betting UM uh spot Um, that really depends, but

1655
01:34:42,600 --> 01:34:48,000
Speaker 1: it's I'm detecting what it is well advance. So yeah,

1656
01:34:48,040 --> 01:34:49,799
Speaker 1: so a lot of a lot of it probably boils

1657
01:34:49,840 --> 01:34:53,440
Speaker 1: down to, uh, you know, your knowledge of the individual

1658
01:34:53,520 --> 01:34:56,400
Speaker 1: deer um. Like when I travel, I don't I don't

1659
01:34:56,479 --> 01:35:01,160
Speaker 1: have that. So I'm pretty be with any type of

1660
01:35:01,200 --> 01:35:05,200
Speaker 1: mature book. You know what it is. I would say

1661
01:35:05,240 --> 01:35:09,599
Speaker 1: your strategies rock solid. You know you're looking look at terrain, Um,

1662
01:35:09,720 --> 01:35:14,120
Speaker 1: you look at bill betting, and it's really um, those

1663
01:35:14,160 --> 01:35:17,439
Speaker 1: books are moving in between the dough betting areas if

1664
01:35:17,479 --> 01:35:20,920
Speaker 1: you're if you time it right, um, and it's not

1665
01:35:21,160 --> 01:35:22,760
Speaker 1: you know, right in the middle. Even if it's right

1666
01:35:22,760 --> 01:35:24,960
Speaker 1: in the middle of lockdown, they're still you know, might

1667
01:35:24,960 --> 01:35:28,240
Speaker 1: be up looking for another hot dough. But um, you

1668
01:35:28,280 --> 01:35:31,120
Speaker 1: know you just need to you want as many lawyers

1669
01:35:31,200 --> 01:35:34,559
Speaker 1: as possible, you know, you want like we talked about

1670
01:35:34,560 --> 01:35:37,639
Speaker 1: those turkey feet, you know, um, and being a thermal

1671
01:35:37,720 --> 01:35:40,560
Speaker 1: hub and the shortest distance between a point. That's what

1672
01:35:40,680 --> 01:35:42,519
Speaker 1: you need a key and on. You know, if you're

1673
01:35:42,520 --> 01:35:44,680
Speaker 1: not worried, you know, not worrying about dear history and

1674
01:35:44,720 --> 01:35:47,639
Speaker 1: I know the maths best majority Like that's what gets

1675
01:35:47,640 --> 01:35:49,960
Speaker 1: me super excited, Like I want to kill a buck

1676
01:35:50,280 --> 01:35:56,200
Speaker 1: that you know I've stalked and you know, assassinate him basically. Uh,

1677
01:35:57,680 --> 01:36:01,120
Speaker 1: but that's not everybody's situation. That's when yeah, you just

1678
01:36:01,400 --> 01:36:04,679
Speaker 1: you know, you die on on the train to cover

1679
01:36:04,880 --> 01:36:11,960
Speaker 1: the does. Um yeah, yeah, justin Uh, I'm guessing it's

1680
01:36:11,960 --> 01:36:15,800
Speaker 1: probably a combination of what Joe said and what I do,

1681
01:36:15,920 --> 01:36:18,719
Speaker 1: depending on your familiarity with with the deer in question,

1682
01:36:18,720 --> 01:36:23,080
Speaker 1: would that be accurate? Yeah? Um, So if we're talking

1683
01:36:23,120 --> 01:36:25,559
Speaker 1: a piece that I'm familiar with in the does and

1684
01:36:25,600 --> 01:36:28,800
Speaker 1: where they've bet at. I think Joe touched on this earlier.

1685
01:36:29,479 --> 01:36:32,800
Speaker 1: So generally I find myself trying to kill a buck

1686
01:36:32,840 --> 01:36:36,200
Speaker 1: that has better going private land. Well, you get into

1687
01:36:36,200 --> 01:36:39,599
Speaker 1: the rut and they will move closer to the dough group,

1688
01:36:40,520 --> 01:36:44,240
Speaker 1: and I know, you know, from experience, I know generally

1689
01:36:44,280 --> 01:36:46,320
Speaker 1: where that's gonna be, where the bucks in the move

1690
01:36:46,439 --> 01:36:49,120
Speaker 1: in at and better closer to the end. So I

1691
01:36:49,200 --> 01:36:51,439
Speaker 1: kind of I kind of base a lot of it

1692
01:36:51,479 --> 01:36:53,639
Speaker 1: on that on the history. But if we're going off

1693
01:36:53,640 --> 01:36:56,479
Speaker 1: of you know, something that I don't know, then yeah,

1694
01:36:56,520 --> 01:36:59,240
Speaker 1: it's gonna be terrain. It's definitely gonna be thrain. And

1695
01:36:59,320 --> 01:37:01,360
Speaker 1: if I can find the hot food stores like a

1696
01:37:01,880 --> 01:37:05,280
Speaker 1: you know, fay, it's a year, whether it's low acorns

1697
01:37:05,439 --> 01:37:07,560
Speaker 1: or whatever. And I find a spot this drop in

1698
01:37:07,600 --> 01:37:10,240
Speaker 1: those I'm not opposed even in the rud that stit

1699
01:37:10,360 --> 01:37:12,240
Speaker 1: up there, because that's gonna draw all that does in

1700
01:37:12,400 --> 01:37:14,080
Speaker 1: and the b they're gonna come through there and check

1701
01:37:14,120 --> 01:37:17,559
Speaker 1: them out. So you know, it's a it's a very

1702
01:37:17,600 --> 01:37:20,680
Speaker 1: age of it depends on I guess if I have

1703
01:37:20,880 --> 01:37:24,160
Speaker 1: history with the property, we're talking something new or something

1704
01:37:24,160 --> 01:37:28,080
Speaker 1: I've punn it. Mm hmm, okay, So that leads me

1705
01:37:28,120 --> 01:37:29,720
Speaker 1: to I know we're getting a little long here. I

1706
01:37:29,760 --> 01:37:32,400
Speaker 1: got just a couple more questions. This is this is

1707
01:37:32,400 --> 01:37:40,600
Speaker 1: awesome stuff acorns food in general, um, but specifically acorns.

1708
01:37:40,640 --> 01:37:48,439
Speaker 1: I'll admit that this is I'm pretty man, pretty green

1709
01:37:48,479 --> 01:37:53,519
Speaker 1: when it comes to acorns. UM. I mean, obviously it's

1710
01:37:53,520 --> 01:37:56,360
Speaker 1: not hard to find red and white acorns. It doesn't

1711
01:37:56,400 --> 01:38:05,479
Speaker 1: play a huge strategy for me personally around home. Um,

1712
01:38:05,560 --> 01:38:11,360
Speaker 1: sometimes it can, but not not a lot um. And

1713
01:38:11,400 --> 01:38:14,679
Speaker 1: I know in the hill country it can be everything.

1714
01:38:15,720 --> 01:38:20,919
Speaker 1: So I just wanna touch on how big of impact

1715
01:38:20,920 --> 01:38:25,920
Speaker 1: does that have on your strategy when it comes to

1716
01:38:26,080 --> 01:38:28,760
Speaker 1: chasing these older deer. So Justin and you and I

1717
01:38:28,800 --> 01:38:30,519
Speaker 1: talked about it a little bit. So why why don't

1718
01:38:30,520 --> 01:38:35,599
Speaker 1: you start with that? Man? It's you, um finding those

1719
01:38:35,680 --> 01:38:37,800
Speaker 1: It depends on the year to some years you have them.

1720
01:38:37,840 --> 01:38:41,160
Speaker 1: Just it just seems like they're everywhere. You know, find

1721
01:38:41,200 --> 01:38:45,560
Speaker 1: those those spots that that they are really congregate to.

1722
01:38:45,760 --> 01:38:48,200
Speaker 1: I guess you know that really is a hot Hey,

1723
01:38:48,680 --> 01:38:51,559
Speaker 1: this term fat free, I've heard um, but you know

1724
01:38:51,600 --> 01:38:53,280
Speaker 1: that's the best way to put it, a feat free

1725
01:38:53,400 --> 01:38:57,559
Speaker 1: that all the deer are really hitting. So this year, uh,

1726
01:38:58,000 --> 01:39:00,840
Speaker 1: we did not have acres at all. There was a

1727
01:39:00,840 --> 01:39:03,200
Speaker 1: few here and there when they were dropping. It was

1728
01:39:03,240 --> 01:39:07,400
Speaker 1: just like that's where the deer were. Um. But yeah,

1729
01:39:07,479 --> 01:39:10,479
Speaker 1: it's huge. Um, if you know where the bucks are betting,

1730
01:39:11,080 --> 01:39:13,960
Speaker 1: and you know when they're working for the egg, they

1731
01:39:14,240 --> 01:39:16,400
Speaker 1: a lot of them will hang up on those those

1732
01:39:16,439 --> 01:39:19,720
Speaker 1: acren freeze um on the way to you know an

1733
01:39:19,720 --> 01:39:22,960
Speaker 1: act feel So yeah, I mean it's huge. It gives

1734
01:39:23,000 --> 01:39:26,679
Speaker 1: you at least an idea of where you're going to drown.

1735
01:39:26,840 --> 01:39:29,400
Speaker 1: You know, where he's kind of heading off even if

1736
01:39:29,400 --> 01:39:32,360
Speaker 1: the if the eggs over here, but there's you know,

1737
01:39:32,439 --> 01:39:35,120
Speaker 1: acrons up on this bridge that you know isn't in

1738
01:39:35,160 --> 01:39:37,479
Speaker 1: the same direction. He may head their first hanging up

1739
01:39:37,520 --> 01:39:39,960
Speaker 1: and eat and work his way off down to the

1740
01:39:40,000 --> 01:39:43,400
Speaker 1: agg So it's huge. I mean it's huge. So like

1741
01:39:43,479 --> 01:39:46,720
Speaker 1: if if if the one one thing I noticed down

1742
01:39:46,720 --> 01:39:50,200
Speaker 1: in Ohio is like bucks tend to have like obviously

1743
01:39:50,200 --> 01:39:53,800
Speaker 1: they're they're a little they're little core range. You know,

1744
01:39:53,800 --> 01:39:57,760
Speaker 1: it might encompass you know, two or three bridges, maybe more,

1745
01:39:57,880 --> 01:40:00,360
Speaker 1: But I just noticed that I get pictures of them

1746
01:40:00,360 --> 01:40:03,360
Speaker 1: and see them repeatedly on, repeatedly on. You know, these

1747
01:40:03,360 --> 01:40:05,720
Speaker 1: two or three ridges, they got their little areas. So

1748
01:40:06,280 --> 01:40:09,080
Speaker 1: you're just looking for, like if you're after a particular buck,

1749
01:40:09,120 --> 01:40:13,040
Speaker 1: you're just looking for that concentration of acorns in that

1750
01:40:13,240 --> 01:40:16,479
Speaker 1: in that system. Because like I've I've always been and

1751
01:40:16,520 --> 01:40:23,360
Speaker 1: I think it's I think it's inbreded me from hunting Michigan. Um,

1752
01:40:23,520 --> 01:40:28,479
Speaker 1: at all costs, do not, like let the deer know

1753
01:40:29,200 --> 01:40:32,240
Speaker 1: that you're even in the area. Um. I've never had

1754
01:40:32,280 --> 01:40:34,920
Speaker 1: good luck once a deer and once I've bumped a

1755
01:40:34,960 --> 01:40:37,960
Speaker 1: deer of mature buck, I've never had good luck even

1756
01:40:38,000 --> 01:40:42,839
Speaker 1: seeing that deer again. I've I've told you that justin UM.

1757
01:40:42,880 --> 01:40:48,280
Speaker 1: So I'm trying to wrap my mind around more when

1758
01:40:48,280 --> 01:40:51,120
Speaker 1: I travel out of state that you know, deer are

1759
01:40:51,200 --> 01:40:54,479
Speaker 1: very different, and I'm starting to see that from state

1760
01:40:54,520 --> 01:40:58,120
Speaker 1: to state to state there they all behave and tolerate

1761
01:40:58,160 --> 01:41:02,400
Speaker 1: different things. Um. But like in hill country, let's say

1762
01:41:02,400 --> 01:41:05,559
Speaker 1: I'm trying to find that that were the hot like

1763
01:41:05,600 --> 01:41:09,760
Speaker 1: you said, hot feet tree or hot little area of acorns. Man,

1764
01:41:09,800 --> 01:41:11,400
Speaker 1: you can cover a lot of ground because there are

1765
01:41:11,400 --> 01:41:14,160
Speaker 1: a lot of these uh these pieces of hill country

1766
01:41:14,160 --> 01:41:17,320
Speaker 1: have oaks everywhere. And I was down in southern Ohio

1767
01:41:17,560 --> 01:41:20,879
Speaker 1: for New Year's and I did some had some scouting

1768
01:41:20,920 --> 01:41:23,160
Speaker 1: down there, and it was like I walked a ton

1769
01:41:23,280 --> 01:41:27,519
Speaker 1: of ground and then I found fresh acorns even on

1770
01:41:27,520 --> 01:41:32,240
Speaker 1: on uh January one, fresh acorns on the ground. Um.

1771
01:41:32,320 --> 01:41:34,559
Speaker 1: But man, I had to I sure had to walk

1772
01:41:35,040 --> 01:41:38,800
Speaker 1: a lot to find that. And it's just like it

1773
01:41:39,000 --> 01:41:42,120
Speaker 1: just I just thought about all the deer that I

1774
01:41:42,200 --> 01:41:45,799
Speaker 1: must have just educated, you know what I mean, alright

1775
01:41:46,080 --> 01:41:48,599
Speaker 1: going through that area. So that's something I struggle with,

1776
01:41:49,120 --> 01:41:52,760
Speaker 1: um as far as like looking for food um in

1777
01:41:52,840 --> 01:41:56,120
Speaker 1: the hill country and and having to cover so much

1778
01:41:56,120 --> 01:41:58,720
Speaker 1: ground to look for that. So I don't know, what

1779
01:41:58,760 --> 01:42:00,800
Speaker 1: do you what do you think on that? Well? Like

1780
01:42:00,880 --> 01:42:04,320
Speaker 1: are you talking? So you're how familiar are you with that?

1781
01:42:04,360 --> 01:42:06,519
Speaker 1: I mean, you know generally where the bucks are betting

1782
01:42:06,520 --> 01:42:10,160
Speaker 1: at anyways, I mean outside of even not even looking

1783
01:42:10,200 --> 01:42:13,000
Speaker 1: at the treat the food. I mean, you know, for

1784
01:42:13,040 --> 01:42:16,559
Speaker 1: the most part where Yeah, well, I guess I'm thinking

1785
01:42:16,880 --> 01:42:19,240
Speaker 1: I'm thinking more in terms of areas that I'm not

1786
01:42:19,400 --> 01:42:22,000
Speaker 1: familiar with that I haven't hunted before, because you know,

1787
01:42:22,200 --> 01:42:25,640
Speaker 1: my plan is the hunt some new hill country, So

1788
01:42:25,640 --> 01:42:28,840
Speaker 1: I'm thinking more in terms of in terms of that.

1789
01:42:28,960 --> 01:42:31,800
Speaker 1: So yeah, obviously, you know, when you when you have

1790
01:42:31,840 --> 01:42:34,599
Speaker 1: an idea where these bucks are betted and where they're living,

1791
01:42:34,600 --> 01:42:38,479
Speaker 1: it's it's easier to kind of work around at Yeah, well,

1792
01:42:38,520 --> 01:42:40,120
Speaker 1: I don't know. I mean for me, I would be

1793
01:42:40,160 --> 01:42:44,240
Speaker 1: looking for either or either trying to find where that

1794
01:42:44,240 --> 01:42:47,280
Speaker 1: that there is, you know obviously it's betting at. Or

1795
01:42:47,320 --> 01:42:50,920
Speaker 1: if I run into saying, you know, a wide oak

1796
01:42:51,000 --> 01:42:52,439
Speaker 1: or something up on the top of the ridge and

1797
01:42:52,439 --> 01:42:55,680
Speaker 1: it just has a ton of beer signed around it, well,

1798
01:42:55,720 --> 01:42:58,679
Speaker 1: if you can kind of work out on the perimeter

1799
01:42:58,760 --> 01:43:02,040
Speaker 1: of that. You know, for the most part, these books,

1800
01:43:02,320 --> 01:43:04,400
Speaker 1: even in the early seasons, they're going to have some

1801
01:43:04,479 --> 01:43:08,760
Speaker 1: sign you know, working toward it coming in grapes and

1802
01:43:08,800 --> 01:43:13,160
Speaker 1: stuff and grapes and big tracks and the scrapes and stuff.

1803
01:43:13,200 --> 01:43:17,439
Speaker 1: I mean I've told the I mean I've killed I've

1804
01:43:17,520 --> 01:43:22,360
Speaker 1: killed several bucks, um, just based off that alone. Big

1805
01:43:22,400 --> 01:43:25,720
Speaker 1: tracks in a scrape coming through there, not even being

1806
01:43:25,760 --> 01:43:28,360
Speaker 1: a hundred percent you know where the where the buck

1807
01:43:28,439 --> 01:43:31,760
Speaker 1: is betting at it. It's a gamble. Sometimes sometimes you

1808
01:43:31,840 --> 01:43:33,519
Speaker 1: set up on it and he maybe coming through there

1809
01:43:33,520 --> 01:43:38,000
Speaker 1: at night. But I think the sign for the early season, yes,

1810
01:43:38,120 --> 01:43:42,160
Speaker 1: early season, right justin yeah, yeah, absolutely they're going to

1811
01:43:42,200 --> 01:43:46,320
Speaker 1: be close by, right right. That would be my kind

1812
01:43:46,320 --> 01:43:48,799
Speaker 1: of go to. I would be looking for the sign

1813
01:43:49,120 --> 01:43:51,200
Speaker 1: on the perimeter of that tree, working out for it.

1814
01:43:51,400 --> 01:43:54,519
Speaker 1: You know, it's where Ford points or a pole you know.

1815
01:43:54,560 --> 01:44:01,360
Speaker 1: Let me talked about earlier some of those you're betting at. Okay,

1816
01:44:01,880 --> 01:44:08,040
Speaker 1: So I would go about it. Joe, what's your thoughts? Yeah, Um,

1817
01:44:08,080 --> 01:44:11,840
Speaker 1: a lot like what he said. So this past year

1818
01:44:11,920 --> 01:44:15,880
Speaker 1: we had a few more acorns I think around here

1819
01:44:16,160 --> 01:44:19,600
Speaker 1: eastern Iowa. Then what Justice said, there's still not a

1820
01:44:19,640 --> 01:44:23,680
Speaker 1: big crop. So by mid to late not mid to

1821
01:44:23,760 --> 01:44:28,240
Speaker 1: late November, um, they were gone um and the deer

1822
01:44:28,240 --> 01:44:32,920
Speaker 1: were back heavy on the crop field. UM. And I

1823
01:44:32,960 --> 01:44:34,720
Speaker 1: will say I mean a lot of people know this,

1824
01:44:35,000 --> 01:44:39,080
Speaker 1: but like you can tell immediately as if you're in

1825
01:44:39,120 --> 01:44:42,680
Speaker 1: farm country, you can tell immediately when they corns are

1826
01:44:42,680 --> 01:44:46,920
Speaker 1: falling because the deer deal there's no deer, but you

1827
01:44:46,920 --> 01:44:48,640
Speaker 1: know their corns are falling. You don't need to in

1828
01:44:48,720 --> 01:44:53,120
Speaker 1: set put in the woods to know that. So um,

1829
01:44:53,160 --> 01:44:55,760
Speaker 1: so you know that's something I watch for. Um. And

1830
01:44:55,760 --> 01:44:58,880
Speaker 1: when they show back up, there's not no way corns

1831
01:44:58,880 --> 01:45:01,800
Speaker 1: in the area or eat them all up, you know. Um,

1832
01:45:02,000 --> 01:45:04,519
Speaker 1: they showed back up in the crowd fields. Um. It's

1833
01:45:04,600 --> 01:45:07,400
Speaker 1: like I saw starting in the November, all of a sudden,

1834
01:45:07,400 --> 01:45:11,040
Speaker 1: deer really they became way more visible in the crowd

1835
01:45:11,120 --> 01:45:16,840
Speaker 1: field um beating does and stuff um uh. And and

1836
01:45:16,880 --> 01:45:19,160
Speaker 1: that's actually I found how it killed one of my

1837
01:45:19,200 --> 01:45:23,160
Speaker 1: books this past year is I found like the last

1838
01:45:23,200 --> 01:45:26,120
Speaker 1: spot I think, um that I knew about where there

1839
01:45:26,240 --> 01:45:28,880
Speaker 1: was still acorns in the ground in late November, and

1840
01:45:28,920 --> 01:45:34,000
Speaker 1: I killed it. Gin old monster deer Um that that

1841
01:45:34,360 --> 01:45:36,800
Speaker 1: I don't know. I think he's eight years old. Um.

1842
01:45:36,840 --> 01:45:39,920
Speaker 1: I can't prove it, but I have Victorial camera photo

1843
01:45:40,040 --> 01:45:42,760
Speaker 1: or two of him from several years ago. And his

1844
01:45:42,800 --> 01:45:46,960
Speaker 1: teeth there warn't flat to his gums. Um. So doing

1845
01:45:46,960 --> 01:45:50,240
Speaker 1: them he's coming to acorns um in hand. The does

1846
01:45:50,360 --> 01:45:53,880
Speaker 1: that were also drawn to that that oak flap so on.

1847
01:45:53,960 --> 01:45:58,639
Speaker 1: That's that's you know, late November, post rut um tail

1848
01:45:58,720 --> 01:46:03,559
Speaker 1: under the rutum early season, everything's you know, squished down.

1849
01:46:03,600 --> 01:46:06,280
Speaker 1: Most of the bucks are moving way less. UM. It

1850
01:46:06,400 --> 01:46:10,840
Speaker 1: gets tough in the real early season. One of the

1851
01:46:10,880 --> 01:46:15,760
Speaker 1: big things I've struggled with is sometimes those bucks are

1852
01:46:15,800 --> 01:46:19,320
Speaker 1: bed and virtually with an eye sight where they're feeding. Um.

1853
01:46:19,400 --> 01:46:22,000
Speaker 1: And that's you know, you find where they feed and

1854
01:46:22,400 --> 01:46:26,200
Speaker 1: you know you're in trouble already. Uh. Sometimes but if

1855
01:46:26,720 --> 01:46:29,679
Speaker 1: at the same time it can be real thick. So

1856
01:46:30,280 --> 01:46:32,599
Speaker 1: maybe they're better within a hundred yards view if you're

1857
01:46:33,240 --> 01:46:35,599
Speaker 1: finding you know, you've got to scrape near by, or

1858
01:46:35,640 --> 01:46:38,000
Speaker 1: you see a fresh rubber two and big tracks coming

1859
01:46:38,040 --> 01:46:42,360
Speaker 1: to a patch oak trees. UM, don't assume you spooked them.

1860
01:46:42,400 --> 01:46:44,799
Speaker 1: You might be better at you know, eight yards away,

1861
01:46:44,840 --> 01:46:48,320
Speaker 1: but you haven't seen it yet, so you can you

1862
01:46:48,360 --> 01:46:54,120
Speaker 1: can have some uh luck just scouting and blind um.

1863
01:46:54,160 --> 01:46:56,519
Speaker 1: When you know the area and you know where the

1864
01:46:56,560 --> 01:47:01,920
Speaker 1: oak trees are. UM, it does help a lot, obviously,

1865
01:47:01,960 --> 01:47:03,920
Speaker 1: and then you can just you know, you know how

1866
01:47:03,960 --> 01:47:06,840
Speaker 1: to get in check though and be like, you know,

1867
01:47:06,840 --> 01:47:10,000
Speaker 1: are they falling? Are there any acorns? Um? Is there?

1868
01:47:10,040 --> 01:47:13,800
Speaker 1: You know buck sign? If there's not, you know there

1869
01:47:13,880 --> 01:47:16,880
Speaker 1: might be. I really focus on those big tracks just

1870
01:47:16,920 --> 01:47:20,559
Speaker 1: like you do, justin you know, the area might be

1871
01:47:20,600 --> 01:47:22,479
Speaker 1: tore up, there might be even rubs. But if I'm

1872
01:47:22,520 --> 01:47:24,960
Speaker 1: not finding those big tracks, I'm like, there's probably a

1873
01:47:25,040 --> 01:47:28,160
Speaker 1: couple of little bucks running around. I'm not gonna waste

1874
01:47:28,160 --> 01:47:32,000
Speaker 1: a hunt. I'm going to keep going. Um and uh,

1875
01:47:32,040 --> 01:47:33,960
Speaker 1: you know, try to find a big set tracks or

1876
01:47:34,080 --> 01:47:35,559
Speaker 1: you know, if I see a rub and it's real,

1877
01:47:35,680 --> 01:47:38,280
Speaker 1: toss the ground that you know, something else to you

1878
01:47:38,360 --> 01:47:43,360
Speaker 1: in on um that big sea? Yeah yeah, do you

1879
01:47:43,360 --> 01:47:46,400
Speaker 1: see that? Generally? Joe, like with the smaller the year,

1880
01:47:46,439 --> 01:47:50,439
Speaker 1: are the ones easily hearing the woods up? Yeah? Yeah yeah,

1881
01:47:50,560 --> 01:47:53,760
Speaker 1: so around here might be a little different. Obviously we've

1882
01:47:53,760 --> 01:47:55,519
Speaker 1: got a fairly good air structure. But the two and

1883
01:47:55,560 --> 01:47:59,040
Speaker 1: three year olds there are the places up. Um they

1884
01:47:59,120 --> 01:48:03,719
Speaker 1: just um if most of the time, if I walk

1885
01:48:03,840 --> 01:48:07,400
Speaker 1: into an area, you know, and there's rubs everywhere, um

1886
01:48:07,560 --> 01:48:10,080
Speaker 1: they are particularly high off the ground, a lot of

1887
01:48:10,080 --> 01:48:14,439
Speaker 1: guys get super excited and I'm like, you know, I

1888
01:48:14,479 --> 01:48:16,720
Speaker 1: start looking. I want to see a big whopper set

1889
01:48:16,720 --> 01:48:19,760
Speaker 1: of tracks or a rub that's you know, waist hie

1890
01:48:19,840 --> 01:48:21,960
Speaker 1: on me and I'm a tell guy, um, and then

1891
01:48:22,000 --> 01:48:30,360
Speaker 1: I'm like, oh, you know, then my my nose starts twitching. People. Sorry,

1892
01:48:29,720 --> 01:48:33,280
Speaker 1: I'm gonna quick follow up question just for people that

1893
01:48:33,320 --> 01:48:36,800
Speaker 1: are newer to this, that are maybe thinking, what's a

1894
01:48:36,840 --> 01:48:40,280
Speaker 1: whopper set of tracks? How do you quantify that? What

1895
01:48:40,560 --> 01:48:42,360
Speaker 1: if you had to put some kind of measurement around

1896
01:48:42,439 --> 01:48:44,720
Speaker 1: that that would tell you like, yeah, that that's a

1897
01:48:44,760 --> 01:48:48,200
Speaker 1: big one. What would you tell someone I don't, um,

1898
01:48:48,240 --> 01:48:54,479
Speaker 1: so that varies like region of the country. Um, and

1899
01:48:55,080 --> 01:48:57,720
Speaker 1: you know some I know there's a role thumber. It's like, oh,

1900
01:48:57,720 --> 01:48:59,840
Speaker 1: it's a four finger track. Well, I've got big hand.

1901
01:49:00,000 --> 01:49:02,759
Speaker 1: I'm just a large, large guy. I've got big hands,

1902
01:49:02,800 --> 01:49:05,519
Speaker 1: and I've never seen a four finger track made by

1903
01:49:05,520 --> 01:49:08,439
Speaker 1: a deer. Like a four finger track is a probably

1904
01:49:08,439 --> 01:49:13,839
Speaker 1: a bowl elk on me. So, like, you know, I've

1905
01:49:13,880 --> 01:49:16,360
Speaker 1: gone around a major tracks. Other guys don't even do that,

1906
01:49:16,479 --> 01:49:18,439
Speaker 1: but like a big track for me, you know, if

1907
01:49:18,520 --> 01:49:20,600
Speaker 1: it gets to be two and a half inches or

1908
01:49:20,640 --> 01:49:25,120
Speaker 1: wider um and not splayed out, ignore those running tracks.

1909
01:49:25,160 --> 01:49:27,280
Speaker 1: You can get a big dough looking like a giant

1910
01:49:27,280 --> 01:49:30,559
Speaker 1: buck if it's running especially up you know, down down

1911
01:49:30,560 --> 01:49:33,920
Speaker 1: a hill or something. Um. I kind of ignore the

1912
01:49:33,960 --> 01:49:37,320
Speaker 1: split out tracks. In soft ground they all splay out, um.

1913
01:49:37,640 --> 01:49:40,880
Speaker 1: But in firmer ground, UM, I want a standing or

1914
01:49:40,960 --> 01:49:43,439
Speaker 1: walking track, you know two and a half inches. They're

1915
01:49:43,479 --> 01:49:45,640
Speaker 1: wider for around here. And I think it varies. I

1916
01:49:45,640 --> 01:49:47,639
Speaker 1: think it's some parts of the country might be bigger.

1917
01:49:48,080 --> 01:49:51,360
Speaker 1: Other parts of the country probably not nearly that big. Um.

1918
01:49:51,400 --> 01:49:55,160
Speaker 1: That's a that's a big buck. Um. And I will

1919
01:49:55,240 --> 01:49:59,680
Speaker 1: say I have seen a shock like a majority you

1920
01:49:59,760 --> 01:50:05,000
Speaker 1: find big track it's a big, big old deer. But um,

1921
01:50:04,240 --> 01:50:09,280
Speaker 1: A high number of bucks that I've killed actually had

1922
01:50:09,760 --> 01:50:14,280
Speaker 1: doe size feet, um, like big doe size feet. Um.

1923
01:50:14,320 --> 01:50:18,120
Speaker 1: Not a majority, but like I don't know, like like

1924
01:50:18,280 --> 01:50:21,639
Speaker 1: way more than you'd think. Um. I killed a buck

1925
01:50:21,720 --> 01:50:26,920
Speaker 1: this year. Um, he weighed two d forty pounds field

1926
01:50:27,000 --> 01:50:32,120
Speaker 1: dressed mid November. And that deer I have photos of

1927
01:50:32,240 --> 01:50:36,320
Speaker 1: his puff and that deer had a doe size huff um.

1928
01:50:36,360 --> 01:50:38,400
Speaker 1: And he had a huge body and he was a

1929
01:50:38,840 --> 01:50:41,599
Speaker 1: you know, a hundred and seventy plush it sixteen pointer,

1930
01:50:42,320 --> 01:50:44,920
Speaker 1: and he had a doe size foot so big they

1931
01:50:45,080 --> 01:50:48,040
Speaker 1: come in all shapes and sizes, and that's not that

1932
01:50:48,200 --> 01:50:50,760
Speaker 1: that's not not like I've got I could pull up

1933
01:50:50,840 --> 01:50:54,000
Speaker 1: half a dozen other deer that I've killed that weren't similar.

1934
01:50:54,360 --> 01:50:56,840
Speaker 1: But you find a big track that's a big buck,

1935
01:50:56,960 --> 01:51:01,760
Speaker 1: you know that's still a rule. So yeah, cool, just

1936
01:51:01,960 --> 01:51:05,080
Speaker 1: when you try to say something, no, I mean, I agree.

1937
01:51:05,120 --> 01:51:10,360
Speaker 1: I think it absolutely varies own size, just like on location,

1938
01:51:10,479 --> 01:51:13,840
Speaker 1: like Joe was saying, because I've seen it, Like you

1939
01:51:13,920 --> 01:51:17,800
Speaker 1: go from you know, Missouri to Illinois and there's an

1940
01:51:17,840 --> 01:51:21,559
Speaker 1: older age structor over there and the tracks over there

1941
01:51:21,600 --> 01:51:24,200
Speaker 1: that they are just there's a there's a big difference

1942
01:51:24,240 --> 01:51:27,679
Speaker 1: in a big buck track in the Surrey versus Illinois

1943
01:51:27,800 --> 01:51:31,880
Speaker 1: from from my experience. But going back earlier, one question,

1944
01:51:32,160 --> 01:51:35,080
Speaker 1: So when you had that you tell that one buck

1945
01:51:35,160 --> 01:51:37,720
Speaker 1: going to Akarns, did you know where he was betting it?

1946
01:51:38,080 --> 01:51:42,479
Speaker 1: Or was that you're just setting up on sign? Yeah,

1947
01:51:43,479 --> 01:51:46,639
Speaker 1: I was setting up on sign, but I knew the property,

1948
01:51:46,720 --> 01:51:50,600
Speaker 1: so I knew he was coming from you big overgrown

1949
01:51:51,080 --> 01:51:53,200
Speaker 1: kind of weed field. Um that they like to put

1950
01:51:53,200 --> 01:51:56,479
Speaker 1: that in, um so with our foul field like cr

1951
01:51:56,680 --> 01:52:01,000
Speaker 1: CRP a brush year um so um, I figured he

1952
01:52:01,120 --> 01:52:04,520
Speaker 1: was coming up that rich system from that sure enough. Um,

1953
01:52:04,640 --> 01:52:07,120
Speaker 1: that's what you know you did, but I did. That

1954
01:52:07,280 --> 01:52:10,639
Speaker 1: was the first deer I've killed in a few years

1955
01:52:10,680 --> 01:52:16,040
Speaker 1: that I did not know about him really, um in advance. Um,

1956
01:52:17,000 --> 01:52:19,840
Speaker 1: it was I was just I was taughting more your

1957
01:52:19,880 --> 01:52:22,040
Speaker 1: style where I was like that, this feels like a

1958
01:52:22,120 --> 01:52:29,920
Speaker 1: good spot. That's a good feeling. Though I I've really come.

1959
01:52:30,280 --> 01:52:32,720
Speaker 1: You know, a lot of times the deer I kill

1960
01:52:32,800 --> 01:52:36,519
Speaker 1: around home, like you know, northern Ohio, Michigan. A lot

1961
01:52:36,560 --> 01:52:38,880
Speaker 1: of times I know the deer. You know, I have

1962
01:52:39,000 --> 01:52:42,360
Speaker 1: some familiar familiarity with them, and it's cool and it's

1963
01:52:42,439 --> 01:52:45,800
Speaker 1: it's cool to learn that history. But I really love

1964
01:52:46,080 --> 01:52:48,880
Speaker 1: that feeling like we had when we were younger, when

1965
01:52:48,920 --> 01:52:52,240
Speaker 1: you you don't know what's out there. And uh, that's

1966
01:52:52,280 --> 01:52:56,800
Speaker 1: why that's what I get to experience when I travel. Um.

1967
01:52:56,960 --> 01:52:59,400
Speaker 1: And I just love that the element of surprise and

1968
01:53:00,000 --> 01:53:02,680
Speaker 1: know it's just if that if that book makes my

1969
01:53:02,720 --> 01:53:05,920
Speaker 1: heart skip, you know, I'm drawing back, and I just

1970
01:53:06,000 --> 01:53:08,360
Speaker 1: really love that. It's a it's such a cool feeling

1971
01:53:08,400 --> 01:53:12,040
Speaker 1: and a lot of with so much technology now these days,

1972
01:53:12,240 --> 01:53:15,639
Speaker 1: sell cameras and you know, people running all kinds of crap.

1973
01:53:16,240 --> 01:53:19,240
Speaker 1: It's like there's hardly any secrets left, you know what

1974
01:53:19,280 --> 01:53:21,880
Speaker 1: I mean? And I just I love I love traveling

1975
01:53:21,920 --> 01:53:25,160
Speaker 1: and just leaving the cameras at home and just hunting

1976
01:53:25,200 --> 01:53:31,080
Speaker 1: off instinct and sign and shooting what whatever gets me excited. Yeah,

1977
01:53:31,240 --> 01:53:34,639
Speaker 1: I agree with definitely something to be said by that. Yeah.

1978
01:53:35,880 --> 01:53:38,600
Speaker 1: I keep threatening myself one of these years, I'm just

1979
01:53:38,640 --> 01:53:42,280
Speaker 1: gonna leave all my cameras in the cupboard and do that.

1980
01:53:42,520 --> 01:53:45,599
Speaker 1: And I will, It's just I haven't done it yet. Well,

1981
01:53:45,800 --> 01:53:48,000
Speaker 1: you know what we gotta do, Joe's we gotta make

1982
01:53:48,040 --> 01:53:52,479
Speaker 1: a pact that one of these years you and Dan

1983
01:53:52,600 --> 01:54:05,080
Speaker 1: Johnson promise not to use trails podcast. Yeah. Well that's

1984
01:54:05,120 --> 01:54:10,920
Speaker 1: a perfect segue into my last question. Um, what is

1985
01:54:11,120 --> 01:54:16,519
Speaker 1: your guys trail camp strategy in the hills? Um? Where

1986
01:54:16,600 --> 01:54:19,679
Speaker 1: you like to put them, how you like to check them.

1987
01:54:19,720 --> 01:54:21,840
Speaker 1: If it's a mix of leaving them out year round

1988
01:54:22,040 --> 01:54:24,479
Speaker 1: and some of you check more frequently, What types of

1989
01:54:24,520 --> 01:54:29,120
Speaker 1: train features, scrapes, benches, saddles, give me the give me

1990
01:54:29,160 --> 01:54:33,000
Speaker 1: the rundown of of how you personally use truck cameras

1991
01:54:33,040 --> 01:54:37,840
Speaker 1: in the hills justin Um, Yeah, it depends on a

1992
01:54:37,880 --> 01:54:39,920
Speaker 1: lot what you said there, Like if if it's one

1993
01:54:39,920 --> 01:54:42,800
Speaker 1: I'm going to leave and and I'll admit this. I

1994
01:54:42,840 --> 01:54:45,880
Speaker 1: got this from Joe, you know, I think his scredity

1995
01:54:46,240 --> 01:54:49,960
Speaker 1: it is obviously found. So I've got to wear you know,

1996
01:54:50,080 --> 01:54:52,320
Speaker 1: the past four or five years, I've I've left a

1997
01:54:52,360 --> 01:54:55,440
Speaker 1: lot of cameras out and uh, I'll put them in

1998
01:54:55,680 --> 01:54:58,800
Speaker 1: right in near Betting. Um. It may be on a

1999
01:54:58,880 --> 01:55:03,080
Speaker 1: ditch crossing, you know, or a saddle leading out of

2000
01:55:03,080 --> 01:55:06,480
Speaker 1: a bowl like I was talking about earlier, or some

2001
01:55:06,480 --> 01:55:10,280
Speaker 1: something like that, some rain feature in there de Betting area,

2002
01:55:10,360 --> 01:55:13,000
Speaker 1: and I'll just leave that in there for the majority

2003
01:55:13,040 --> 01:55:15,000
Speaker 1: of the season. I've actually got some cameras out now

2004
01:55:15,040 --> 01:55:19,160
Speaker 1: that I put out in late August. Haven't been back

2005
01:55:19,200 --> 01:55:22,440
Speaker 1: to them yet. So but the other ones, I mean

2006
01:55:24,520 --> 01:55:27,560
Speaker 1: around fields and stuff like that, was I can flip

2007
01:55:27,600 --> 01:55:30,720
Speaker 1: in and check. Um. You know, I know we talked

2008
01:55:30,720 --> 01:55:33,920
Speaker 1: about this before. But the ones that you can get

2009
01:55:33,920 --> 01:55:35,720
Speaker 1: in like that, that you're probably not going to get

2010
01:55:35,800 --> 01:55:39,680
Speaker 1: daylight pictures on. But you're just trying to see what's

2011
01:55:39,680 --> 01:55:41,720
Speaker 1: in the area, see if there is a mature buck

2012
01:55:41,760 --> 01:55:43,760
Speaker 1: in the area, you know, and a lot of a

2013
01:55:43,800 --> 01:55:46,520
Speaker 1: lot of them. I'll throw up as I'm scouting if

2014
01:55:46,560 --> 01:55:48,760
Speaker 1: I see a big set of tracks, you know, leading

2015
01:55:48,760 --> 01:55:50,880
Speaker 1: out into a field, and I'll throw the camera up

2016
01:55:50,880 --> 01:55:54,720
Speaker 1: to try to get an idea what it is. Um.

2017
01:55:54,760 --> 01:55:57,520
Speaker 1: I mean yeah, a lot of its train features. I

2018
01:55:57,600 --> 01:56:01,280
Speaker 1: like ditch crossing. I really like ditch crossing to funnel

2019
01:56:01,320 --> 01:56:04,360
Speaker 1: steer down and a lot of times too you can

2020
01:56:04,360 --> 01:56:06,200
Speaker 1: get a good idea of just looking at this tract

2021
01:56:06,200 --> 01:56:11,080
Speaker 1: phone that its crossed, what's moving through there. So for me,

2022
01:56:11,120 --> 01:56:14,000
Speaker 1: if that would probably be the majority of my replacement

2023
01:56:14,160 --> 01:56:19,640
Speaker 1: right here at this cross mm hmm. How about you, Joe. Yeah,

2024
01:56:19,680 --> 01:56:23,800
Speaker 1: I like dis grassings too. Um So yeah, if anybody

2025
01:56:24,280 --> 01:56:28,680
Speaker 1: hasn't heard my spiel, I really focus on leaving them soaked.

2026
01:56:29,080 --> 01:56:34,320
Speaker 1: I'm just like justin Like I've got quite umb half

2027
01:56:34,320 --> 01:56:37,680
Speaker 1: a dozen cameras out yet early January right now that

2028
01:56:37,800 --> 01:56:40,320
Speaker 1: I haven't. I've been slowly picking them up over the

2029
01:56:40,400 --> 01:56:46,080
Speaker 1: last few weeks. Um, but um, I've got some cameras

2030
01:56:46,160 --> 01:56:50,320
Speaker 1: out and um I'll be looking at you know, when

2031
01:56:50,360 --> 01:56:52,680
Speaker 1: bucks were, what time of year they were on camera.

2032
01:56:53,360 --> 01:56:56,680
Speaker 1: I recognized the deer from past years, you know, and

2033
01:56:56,720 --> 01:57:01,760
Speaker 1: then all the weather conditions um hm for these spots.

2034
01:57:01,840 --> 01:57:06,480
Speaker 1: I really like thermal hubs too. Um. I love sticking

2035
01:57:06,520 --> 01:57:09,080
Speaker 1: them down like in a thermal hub and figuring out

2036
01:57:09,280 --> 01:57:13,960
Speaker 1: you know what what conditions and exactly thermal they are

2037
01:57:15,280 --> 01:57:19,600
Speaker 1: very time of year. Um. Like the annual pattern, there's

2038
01:57:19,800 --> 01:57:24,040
Speaker 1: really pretty consistent annual patterns with hubs and the deer

2039
01:57:24,200 --> 01:57:27,440
Speaker 1: bucket activity through them. Um. Usually within a few days

2040
01:57:27,480 --> 01:57:31,880
Speaker 1: every year it lights up. UM. Some hubs, I mean

2041
01:57:31,880 --> 01:57:34,480
Speaker 1: they some some hubs are used earlier season. Other hubs

2042
01:57:34,480 --> 01:57:37,400
Speaker 1: there are more used during the rut. It depends where

2043
01:57:37,400 --> 01:57:42,160
Speaker 1: the betting plays out and around them, but um, hubs

2044
01:57:42,160 --> 01:57:47,360
Speaker 1: are really major part. UM. I used to have cameras

2045
01:57:47,360 --> 01:57:51,160
Speaker 1: in more easy access areas and I still have. I

2046
01:57:51,400 --> 01:57:56,760
Speaker 1: have a couple um here and there, but I don't anymore.

2047
01:57:57,080 --> 01:58:00,240
Speaker 1: And it's really just because of time. UM, My time

2048
01:58:00,360 --> 01:58:06,720
Speaker 1: still limited. I just um, that's that's been the struggles

2049
01:58:07,400 --> 01:58:09,400
Speaker 1: both of you have gonna share a little bit. I

2050
01:58:09,920 --> 01:58:12,880
Speaker 1: am struggle to get out there and I have such

2051
01:58:12,880 --> 01:58:16,920
Speaker 1: a limited time. Um. You know whatever, hunted seven or

2052
01:58:17,280 --> 01:58:21,320
Speaker 1: eight times this year with a bow and it stressed

2053
01:58:21,320 --> 01:58:23,400
Speaker 1: me out, Like that's pretty pathetic over the course of

2054
01:58:23,480 --> 01:58:28,560
Speaker 1: two months. Um, and uh, I don't have time to

2055
01:58:28,560 --> 01:58:31,680
Speaker 1: stop and check a camera like I'll still speed scout.

2056
01:58:31,920 --> 01:58:34,880
Speaker 1: You know, once or twice a week, but like, just

2057
01:58:35,000 --> 01:58:37,000
Speaker 1: if I have a camera, that's one more thing I

2058
01:58:37,040 --> 01:58:42,440
Speaker 1: gotta do. So I've almost entirely now. And yeah, i'll

2059
01:58:42,480 --> 01:58:46,440
Speaker 1: check a camera speed scouting, but um, I don't want

2060
01:58:46,440 --> 01:58:50,040
Speaker 1: it to be an extra thing, so I'll just um,

2061
01:58:50,080 --> 01:58:54,000
Speaker 1: you know, cameras there, I hang them, and I start

2062
01:58:54,080 --> 01:58:57,600
Speaker 1: hanging them in July August. By September, I want them

2063
01:58:57,600 --> 01:59:00,600
Speaker 1: all out and most of them aren't going to get

2064
01:59:00,600 --> 01:59:05,600
Speaker 1: touched until December. So um, that's just kind of how

2065
01:59:05,640 --> 01:59:11,920
Speaker 1: it works. Um. Yeah, yeah, that's that's that's pretty much.

2066
01:59:12,360 --> 01:59:16,760
Speaker 1: And and um, since hopefully Dan Johnson is listening, I'll

2067
01:59:16,760 --> 01:59:20,320
Speaker 1: tell a quick story about another bucket up on um.

2068
01:59:20,400 --> 01:59:23,400
Speaker 1: In early November, I was after this great big wite

2069
01:59:23,440 --> 01:59:28,360
Speaker 1: eight pointer um and he was um he this. I

2070
01:59:28,440 --> 01:59:31,240
Speaker 1: knew where he was betting. He's down in Oxbow on

2071
01:59:31,360 --> 01:59:34,200
Speaker 1: public land and he was coming in out of there.

2072
01:59:34,600 --> 01:59:37,800
Speaker 1: Um he's coming out and out of there pretty consistent

2073
01:59:37,880 --> 01:59:42,640
Speaker 1: the previous year. Um and and um I figured he

2074
01:59:42,680 --> 01:59:46,080
Speaker 1: was still alive. Um. I went down there and I hunted,

2075
01:59:46,480 --> 01:59:50,120
Speaker 1: and I saw him. I plan on hunting a full day.

2076
01:59:50,600 --> 01:59:54,240
Speaker 1: Well work called my name, and I could only hunt

2077
01:59:54,360 --> 01:59:57,880
Speaker 1: the morning um and I saw him that morning from

2078
01:59:57,880 --> 02:00:01,440
Speaker 1: a distance, and my I had to climb down at noon,

2079
02:00:01,760 --> 02:00:04,760
Speaker 1: and Mike Gut said, Joe, you're making a mistake. But

2080
02:00:04,920 --> 02:00:09,640
Speaker 1: I just could not stay in the tree. And I

2081
02:00:09,720 --> 02:00:12,360
Speaker 1: picked that camera up in December and half an hour

2082
02:00:12,440 --> 02:00:14,320
Speaker 1: after I climbed down, and I did not check. So

2083
02:00:14,440 --> 02:00:16,400
Speaker 1: I bring the story up because I did not check

2084
02:00:16,440 --> 02:00:18,960
Speaker 1: that camera. That cameras thirty yards from my spand but

2085
02:00:19,000 --> 02:00:21,080
Speaker 1: I had across a bunch of trails check that camera,

2086
02:00:21,120 --> 02:00:23,160
Speaker 1: and I did. I left it there. I could see

2087
02:00:23,160 --> 02:00:25,800
Speaker 1: it from my stand. Half an hour after I climbed down,

2088
02:00:26,000 --> 02:00:29,959
Speaker 1: that darn buck came through and I could have killed him.

2089
02:00:30,000 --> 02:00:33,520
Speaker 1: So that one probably burns more than any other, uh

2090
02:00:34,080 --> 02:00:39,840
Speaker 1: encounter I had this year. You know, Yeah, I've heard

2091
02:00:39,880 --> 02:00:42,080
Speaker 1: that story and you know you just near it. People,

2092
02:00:42,120 --> 02:00:45,040
Speaker 1: I climbed down too early. Well this year was me

2093
02:00:45,440 --> 02:00:49,600
Speaker 1: so well what you pulled off though this year and

2094
02:00:49,800 --> 02:00:53,280
Speaker 1: such limited time with a ball during bowl seasons just

2095
02:00:54,160 --> 02:00:56,880
Speaker 1: I mean just incredible. I mean, you killed you killed

2096
02:00:56,880 --> 02:00:59,400
Speaker 1: two awesome bucks. I know it was a frustrating year

2097
02:00:59,400 --> 02:01:04,480
Speaker 1: for you, but yeah, man, just great stuff. Mark. You

2098
02:01:04,560 --> 02:01:08,640
Speaker 1: got any other questions for these guys, Well, I'll say,

2099
02:01:08,880 --> 02:01:14,160
Speaker 1: first off, UM, awesome work all three of you guys.

2100
02:01:14,160 --> 02:01:16,560
Speaker 1: As far as having a hell of an interesting conversation,

2101
02:01:16,640 --> 02:01:20,120
Speaker 1: I've I have really enjoyed kicking back and listening and

2102
02:01:20,200 --> 02:01:23,760
Speaker 1: just enjoying this as a listener really. Um. But I

2103
02:01:23,800 --> 02:01:27,640
Speaker 1: do want to give you as an opportunity for one

2104
02:01:27,760 --> 02:01:31,280
Speaker 1: last thought and and this is something I like to

2105
02:01:31,320 --> 02:01:35,320
Speaker 1: ask people on occasion. If if I were to give

2106
02:01:35,360 --> 02:01:39,880
Speaker 1: you a billboard on the side of the highway, and

2107
02:01:40,080 --> 02:01:44,200
Speaker 1: you could put any simple message there for hunters, and

2108
02:01:44,280 --> 02:01:46,160
Speaker 1: let's say we're gonna stick with a hill country theme.

2109
02:01:46,200 --> 02:01:49,480
Speaker 1: So if you could leave one last parting bit of

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02:01:49,520 --> 02:01:52,040
Speaker 1: wisdom that you had to put on a billboard. This

2111
02:01:52,120 --> 02:01:54,760
Speaker 1: could be one thing you want everyone to do, or

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02:01:54,960 --> 02:01:58,160
Speaker 1: or one thing that everyone should you know remember, or

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02:01:58,280 --> 02:02:01,480
Speaker 1: one thing you don't want people screw up on. Um.

2114
02:02:01,520 --> 02:02:03,480
Speaker 1: And if you could synthesize it down to that one

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02:02:03,560 --> 02:02:07,760
Speaker 1: simple phrase you would put on that billboard, Um, what

2116
02:02:07,800 --> 02:02:10,120
Speaker 1: would that be? And I'm actually gonna ask you Andy

2117
02:02:10,160 --> 02:02:14,760
Speaker 1: as well. UM, So, so Joe, tell me what would

2118
02:02:14,800 --> 02:02:23,600
Speaker 1: your hill country billboard side of the highway? B oh man? Um,

2119
02:02:23,720 --> 02:02:26,560
Speaker 1: I'd probably keep it pretty big and and you know,

2120
02:02:27,120 --> 02:02:32,680
Speaker 1: find your own way. Um. I think that's more important

2121
02:02:32,680 --> 02:02:36,000
Speaker 1: than any you know, the details. You look look at

2122
02:02:36,200 --> 02:02:40,200
Speaker 1: the differences between Andy and myself and Justin. You know,

2123
02:02:40,360 --> 02:02:46,760
Speaker 1: yeah there's overlap, but like, um, you know, um or

2124
02:02:46,880 --> 02:02:49,120
Speaker 1: or stick to the basics. That's another one. I guess,

2125
02:02:49,120 --> 02:02:57,360
Speaker 1: can I get two billboards? Uh? You know something like that? Um,

2126
02:02:57,760 --> 02:03:01,440
Speaker 1: look at like back bare and ball with in public. Um.

2127
02:03:01,480 --> 02:03:05,000
Speaker 1: I just love how he hunts. Uh you know, it's

2128
02:03:05,040 --> 02:03:09,120
Speaker 1: completely different how I hunt. Um, he sneaks around and

2129
02:03:09,320 --> 02:03:11,640
Speaker 1: even crazier and justice he's like or maybe he just

2130
02:03:11,680 --> 02:03:14,120
Speaker 1: carries the camera. Maybe he justin doesn't you know the

2131
02:03:14,160 --> 02:03:17,440
Speaker 1: same thing. But um, you know he's just honest feed

2132
02:03:17,480 --> 02:03:19,800
Speaker 1: all the time. He's not staying in very much like

2133
02:03:20,160 --> 02:03:23,800
Speaker 1: he's and he's you know, having crazy good luck in

2134
02:03:23,840 --> 02:03:28,000
Speaker 1: many different states. Um. You know he's learned through widmanship

2135
02:03:28,080 --> 02:03:31,240
Speaker 1: and attention to detail. And it's completely different than the

2136
02:03:31,280 --> 02:03:34,960
Speaker 1: strategy I've found that works for me. So um, you know,

2137
02:03:35,640 --> 02:03:38,440
Speaker 1: trying new stuff, listening to new listening to different people,

2138
02:03:38,560 --> 02:03:41,120
Speaker 1: but really, you know, trying to find it work for you.

2139
02:03:41,840 --> 02:03:43,680
Speaker 1: That's a hell of a lot of billboards. Now, Joe,

2140
02:03:43,880 --> 02:03:51,320
Speaker 1: But what about you, Justin? You got any ideal you know,

2141
02:03:51,520 --> 02:03:53,640
Speaker 1: kind of stole my my answer there. I was going

2142
02:03:53,680 --> 02:03:56,200
Speaker 1: to say in season, I was gonna stay in season

2143
02:03:56,280 --> 02:04:00,160
Speaker 1: scounting because for me, I had seen my success go

2144
02:04:00,280 --> 02:04:04,120
Speaker 1: through the roof by not being complacent, not just going

2145
02:04:04,200 --> 02:04:06,920
Speaker 1: up and finding a buck bed and then hunting near

2146
02:04:07,000 --> 02:04:10,040
Speaker 1: that buck bed or finding big sign or what you know,

2147
02:04:10,080 --> 02:04:12,920
Speaker 1: whatever it be, and just being complacent and hunting that

2148
02:04:13,040 --> 02:04:16,040
Speaker 1: to death, or hunting you know, when I get tapportunity

2149
02:04:16,120 --> 02:04:17,920
Speaker 1: just on that spot that I may have found two

2150
02:04:17,920 --> 02:04:21,000
Speaker 1: weeks ago. Because we all know so many things are

2151
02:04:21,040 --> 02:04:23,640
Speaker 1: happening out there. I mean, it's it's changing day by day.

2152
02:04:23,720 --> 02:04:29,880
Speaker 1: So I would say in season, I like it, and Andy,

2153
02:04:30,320 --> 02:04:33,640
Speaker 1: what do you got? Yeah? I think I think my

2154
02:04:33,720 --> 02:04:37,879
Speaker 1: answer stems from the fact that I typically have hunted,

2155
02:04:38,160 --> 02:04:42,040
Speaker 1: uh well, pretty much all of my hill country experience

2156
02:04:42,080 --> 02:04:46,000
Speaker 1: has been during the rut. But mine's gonna say ten

2157
02:04:46,120 --> 02:04:51,240
Speaker 1: to two, ten o'clock to two pm I have had

2158
02:04:52,080 --> 02:04:55,960
Speaker 1: during the rut um that time frame has been my

2159
02:04:56,000 --> 02:05:00,400
Speaker 1: most successful for seeing big deer on their feet, um

2160
02:05:00,480 --> 02:05:03,920
Speaker 1: more so than in any other type of terrain. My

2161
02:05:03,960 --> 02:05:06,520
Speaker 1: mornings tend to be a little slow, my evenings tend

2162
02:05:06,560 --> 02:05:08,400
Speaker 1: to be a little slow, and that's probably because of

2163
02:05:08,680 --> 02:05:13,440
Speaker 1: where I'm sitting. But man, that midday time frame, you know,

2164
02:05:13,520 --> 02:05:16,480
Speaker 1: when the conditions and then the timing of year is

2165
02:05:16,480 --> 02:05:20,120
Speaker 1: is right, just deadly, So keep your butt in the tree,

2166
02:05:20,200 --> 02:05:24,680
Speaker 1: tended to tended to well, you definitely win for keeping

2167
02:05:24,680 --> 02:05:30,960
Speaker 1: it nice and tight and billboard size. Yea. Well, Uh

2168
02:05:31,560 --> 02:05:33,720
Speaker 1: this has been This has been great, guys, all three

2169
02:05:33,760 --> 02:05:36,640
Speaker 1: of you. Thank you for taking the time. I learned

2170
02:05:36,640 --> 02:05:38,840
Speaker 1: a lot in this one. I'm I'm excited to listen

2171
02:05:38,880 --> 02:05:41,080
Speaker 1: to it again and think through everything. A lot of

2172
02:05:41,080 --> 02:05:44,120
Speaker 1: great stories to review. And uh, I know a lot

2173
02:05:44,200 --> 02:05:46,320
Speaker 1: of people are going to come out the other end

2174
02:05:46,360 --> 02:05:48,840
Speaker 1: of this one with something to work on and something

2175
02:05:48,880 --> 02:05:53,160
Speaker 1: to chew on. So thank you all. And uh, I

2176
02:05:53,160 --> 02:05:55,400
Speaker 1: know it's only January right now as we're speaking, but

2177
02:05:56,440 --> 02:05:59,160
Speaker 1: good luck and about nine months or whenever your next

2178
02:05:59,160 --> 02:06:02,600
Speaker 1: tithing season kicks up. Uh yeah, it's kicking off right now.

2179
02:06:02,760 --> 02:06:06,160
Speaker 1: You know. My my season ended January tenth. So I

2180
02:06:06,200 --> 02:06:08,720
Speaker 1: think both of these other guys in the same boat

2181
02:06:08,840 --> 02:06:11,400
Speaker 1: like this, this is where we earned the next year.

2182
02:06:12,400 --> 02:06:17,920
Speaker 1: That's right, good stuff right there? Great parting words. All right,

2183
02:06:18,400 --> 02:06:22,920
Speaker 1: that was a conversation, wasn't I Mean, there was some

2184
02:06:23,000 --> 02:06:25,080
Speaker 1: really good stuff and they're probably one of those episodes

2185
02:06:25,080 --> 02:06:27,080
Speaker 1: you need to listen to a time or two to

2186
02:06:27,200 --> 02:06:29,080
Speaker 1: collect it all and to make sense of it all.

2187
02:06:29,320 --> 02:06:32,200
Speaker 1: But man, I'm thrilled with how that turned out and

2188
02:06:32,320 --> 02:06:35,080
Speaker 1: excited for some of these other shows to come. Stay

2189
02:06:35,080 --> 02:06:38,120
Speaker 1: tuned on all that. Uh. Next week, we're hoping to

2190
02:06:38,120 --> 02:06:40,720
Speaker 1: have another one of these habitat deep dives, so so

2191
02:06:40,760 --> 02:06:44,240
Speaker 1: stay tuned. Make sure you're following Wired Hunt on Instagram

2192
02:06:44,280 --> 02:06:47,080
Speaker 1: and Facebook. We're gonna be posting more updates there as

2193
02:06:47,160 --> 02:06:50,720
Speaker 1: well as the white Tail Weekly newsletter that comes out

2194
02:06:50,760 --> 02:06:54,040
Speaker 1: every Monday with the latest content for myself and other

2195
02:06:54,080 --> 02:06:56,920
Speaker 1: people on the Mediator team that are focused on Whitetail stuff.

2196
02:06:56,960 --> 02:07:00,560
Speaker 1: So check it out, stay tuned, Thank you for your

2197
02:07:00,600 --> 02:07:09,200
Speaker 1: time and attention, and until next time, stay wired to Hunt. Yeah,