1 00:00:02,440 --> 00:00:05,480 Speaker 1: Hello, I'm Michael Barnes and I'm Scottsnik. On this Memorial 2 00:00:05,600 --> 00:00:08,079 Speaker 1: Day holiday show, we explore the big money issues in 3 00:00:08,119 --> 00:00:10,160 Speaker 1: the world of sports and talk about some of the 4 00:00:10,200 --> 00:00:13,600 Speaker 1: top stories the week. Joining us as always is Bloomberg 5 00:00:13,680 --> 00:00:16,919 Speaker 1: Sports reporter Eban nob Williams, but we also have a 6 00:00:17,000 --> 00:00:20,119 Speaker 1: special guest host with us on this holiday special. He 7 00:00:20,239 --> 00:00:23,520 Speaker 1: is the managing director and member of Hulo Hen's Loki's 8 00:00:23,600 --> 00:00:28,480 Speaker 1: Technology Media Telecom Group. He is a recognized industry leader 9 00:00:28,520 --> 00:00:32,120 Speaker 1: and innovator in digital sports, media and technology. Chris Russo, 10 00:00:32,600 --> 00:00:35,159 Speaker 1: thanks for joining us. Glad to be here, Thank you. 11 00:00:35,560 --> 00:00:39,480 Speaker 1: I want to start with the Carolina Panthers. Who then team? 12 00:00:39,520 --> 00:00:42,440 Speaker 1: Are you sharing the Panthers because I'd like the Panthers. 13 00:00:42,600 --> 00:00:45,120 Speaker 1: I thought, well, you're not a Panthers I know, I'm 14 00:00:45,159 --> 00:00:47,360 Speaker 1: a Detroit Lions fan. Oh so you have nothing to 15 00:00:47,400 --> 00:00:52,840 Speaker 1: root for? So oh lord. Anyway, the NFL team leaders, 16 00:00:52,880 --> 00:00:56,360 Speaker 1: you're not absolutely approved David Tepper's two point to billion 17 00:00:56,360 --> 00:00:59,240 Speaker 1: dollar record purchase. That was pretty much a no brainer 18 00:00:59,240 --> 00:01:02,040 Speaker 1: in this gase. Should we get Chris in here right away? Chris, 19 00:01:02,320 --> 00:01:03,760 Speaker 1: you do this sort of stuff. By the way, I 20 00:01:03,760 --> 00:01:05,399 Speaker 1: didn't know all that stuff about you in the interest. 21 00:01:05,400 --> 00:01:08,400 Speaker 1: That was really impressive industry leader stuff. Yeah, normally it's 22 00:01:08,440 --> 00:01:12,320 Speaker 1: just chrismas. But by the way, bar I can't quite 23 00:01:12,360 --> 00:01:13,880 Speaker 1: see you in this line of but you are the 24 00:01:13,920 --> 00:01:16,600 Speaker 1: only person wearing a jacket and tie today, Chris, thank you, 25 00:01:16,760 --> 00:01:19,240 Speaker 1: thanks for coming in all dressed. I appreciate it. But 26 00:01:19,440 --> 00:01:22,400 Speaker 1: is that if I'm the NFL, i'm the other NFL owners? 27 00:01:22,880 --> 00:01:26,000 Speaker 1: Am I happy at two three? Or am I not 28 00:01:26,080 --> 00:01:28,839 Speaker 1: happy at three? Am I saying wait a minute, only 29 00:01:28,920 --> 00:01:32,240 Speaker 1: to three? They're Probably is some level of disappointment, in 30 00:01:32,319 --> 00:01:34,640 Speaker 1: part because some of the numbers that were initially thrown 31 00:01:34,680 --> 00:01:37,360 Speaker 1: out there were high twos, could have even reached three billion, 32 00:01:37,640 --> 00:01:39,759 Speaker 1: so there might have been some expectation of those kind 33 00:01:39,760 --> 00:01:41,880 Speaker 1: of higher numbers. And also when you look at some 34 00:01:41,920 --> 00:01:44,440 Speaker 1: of the recent NBA deals that are in the low twos, 35 00:01:44,440 --> 00:01:46,240 Speaker 1: I think there might have been a sense that, hey, 36 00:01:46,280 --> 00:01:48,520 Speaker 1: maybe we should achieve more. But I think all things considered, 37 00:01:48,520 --> 00:01:50,320 Speaker 1: when you look at the last deal, which was I 38 00:01:50,320 --> 00:01:52,160 Speaker 1: think a billion four for the bills, this is still 39 00:01:52,240 --> 00:01:54,520 Speaker 1: nice appreciation. And they've got a really good partner in 40 00:01:54,600 --> 00:01:57,480 Speaker 1: David Tepper, temper you wanted, and this would be my 41 00:01:57,520 --> 00:02:00,400 Speaker 1: disappointed and Van We've talked about this. If I'm an 42 00:02:00,480 --> 00:02:03,840 Speaker 1: NFL guy and a team comes on the market and 43 00:02:03,880 --> 00:02:06,920 Speaker 1: in an unexpected way, like much like the Clipper situation, 44 00:02:06,920 --> 00:02:08,520 Speaker 1: where there was this froth and all of a sudden 45 00:02:08,520 --> 00:02:11,280 Speaker 1: the team was available and people really are hurried and 46 00:02:11,280 --> 00:02:13,720 Speaker 1: scurry to see if they can get involved. They had 47 00:02:13,800 --> 00:02:17,359 Speaker 1: three bidders at the end. Realistically they had three, three 48 00:02:17,360 --> 00:02:21,280 Speaker 1: to four bidders, but only one whale. I mean, not 49 00:02:21,400 --> 00:02:23,639 Speaker 1: that Michael Rubin isn't a billionaire, but you know, one 50 00:02:23,680 --> 00:02:27,000 Speaker 1: point whatever billion two whatever. I mean, Temper is the 51 00:02:27,120 --> 00:02:29,880 Speaker 1: kind of guy you want to attract in an auction 52 00:02:29,919 --> 00:02:33,680 Speaker 1: like this. You want multiple teppers, guys with real money, 53 00:02:33,760 --> 00:02:35,640 Speaker 1: and have to compete against each other to drive that 54 00:02:35,680 --> 00:02:37,760 Speaker 1: price up. But he didn't have to do that. He 55 00:02:37,840 --> 00:02:40,400 Speaker 1: sort of sat back and waited to see how it 56 00:02:40,440 --> 00:02:42,919 Speaker 1: would play out. Well, it wings both ways, doesn't it. 57 00:02:42,960 --> 00:02:46,080 Speaker 1: I mean there's a chance that one of those other groups, 58 00:02:46,080 --> 00:02:49,280 Speaker 1: maybe Keston, Volm, maybe Navarro, would have played a bigger 59 00:02:49,360 --> 00:02:51,400 Speaker 1: number in the end if they could have raised the money. 60 00:02:52,120 --> 00:02:53,600 Speaker 1: But in the end, you know that, but that you 61 00:02:53,680 --> 00:02:55,359 Speaker 1: just said, you just had the key there. If they 62 00:02:55,440 --> 00:02:57,480 Speaker 1: raised the money, only young guy had the money to 63 00:02:57,480 --> 00:02:59,280 Speaker 1: write the check. No, I'm with you. I mean, obviously 64 00:02:59,280 --> 00:03:01,320 Speaker 1: you'd rather have a lot of guys with the liquidity 65 00:03:01,360 --> 00:03:02,920 Speaker 1: to do it on their own and bring cash to 66 00:03:02,919 --> 00:03:05,959 Speaker 1: the table, etcetera. Um, it didn't happen that way. But 67 00:03:06,400 --> 00:03:08,680 Speaker 1: as we talked about a couple of weeks ago, sometimes 68 00:03:08,720 --> 00:03:10,560 Speaker 1: maybe you prefer the bid that might be a couple 69 00:03:10,560 --> 00:03:13,120 Speaker 1: of hundred million dollars less if it's from a guy 70 00:03:13,160 --> 00:03:15,880 Speaker 1: who has the money all himself and doesn't need to 71 00:03:15,960 --> 00:03:18,000 Speaker 1: kind of go around to a bunch of other people 72 00:03:18,040 --> 00:03:20,040 Speaker 1: to get it together. I guess I throw this out 73 00:03:20,080 --> 00:03:23,040 Speaker 1: on the table. David Tepper said, the name of the 74 00:03:23,040 --> 00:03:27,000 Speaker 1: team the Carolina Panthers, and we're going to stay in 75 00:03:27,080 --> 00:03:31,200 Speaker 1: the Carolinas. However, having said all that, the stadium is 76 00:03:31,200 --> 00:03:35,880 Speaker 1: twenty two years old, will they move one day? You 77 00:03:35,920 --> 00:03:37,800 Speaker 1: know this? You know, I don't think so. I think 78 00:03:37,840 --> 00:03:40,800 Speaker 1: there's really deep roots to that community. And again, getting 79 00:03:40,800 --> 00:03:43,080 Speaker 1: into the weeds on what the ultimate stadium will be 80 00:03:43,200 --> 00:03:45,400 Speaker 1: or not be is still something TBD. But I think 81 00:03:45,720 --> 00:03:47,520 Speaker 1: Tepper wants to keep the team there. I think the 82 00:03:47,600 --> 00:03:49,800 Speaker 1: NFL wants the team there, and I think ultimately they'll 83 00:03:49,800 --> 00:03:53,400 Speaker 1: figure out the stadium situation. Is my view. And you know, Chris, 84 00:03:53,440 --> 00:03:57,280 Speaker 1: the differentiator in the NFL between the Cowboys and the 85 00:03:57,320 --> 00:03:59,240 Speaker 1: rest of folks who wind up being in kind of 86 00:03:59,240 --> 00:04:01,680 Speaker 1: the lower third of the group is the stadium revenue. 87 00:04:02,160 --> 00:04:04,160 Speaker 1: I mean the Panthers used to be when that stadium 88 00:04:04,160 --> 00:04:06,240 Speaker 1: was first built, that was like top tier team in 89 00:04:06,320 --> 00:04:09,640 Speaker 1: terms of revenue. You share the national stuff evenly, so 90 00:04:09,840 --> 00:04:12,800 Speaker 1: the national contracts get get cut up and everybody shares 91 00:04:12,800 --> 00:04:14,480 Speaker 1: in that. If you've got to differentiate yourself, you've got 92 00:04:14,560 --> 00:04:16,760 Speaker 1: to build Jerry's world and you've got to figure out 93 00:04:16,760 --> 00:04:19,880 Speaker 1: how do I make more local revenue than my competition 94 00:04:20,040 --> 00:04:22,400 Speaker 1: that like the luxury suite those I can keep all 95 00:04:22,440 --> 00:04:25,320 Speaker 1: that money stays in my coffers. And that's true when 96 00:04:25,320 --> 00:04:27,279 Speaker 1: team owners do spend a lot of time thinking about that. 97 00:04:27,320 --> 00:04:29,880 Speaker 1: But over the last twenty five years, think about how 98 00:04:29,880 --> 00:04:32,800 Speaker 1: many new stadiums have been built, it ultimately gets figured out. 99 00:04:32,800 --> 00:04:35,880 Speaker 1: There's oftentimes bluster in the press about we might move, 100 00:04:36,000 --> 00:04:37,920 Speaker 1: or we need this, or we need that, but ultimately 101 00:04:37,960 --> 00:04:39,720 Speaker 1: it does tend to get figured out. What these kind 102 00:04:39,720 --> 00:04:42,440 Speaker 1: of franchises. So let's be honest about the size of 103 00:04:42,440 --> 00:04:45,960 Speaker 1: the market. No matter what Temper does with the Carolina Panthers. 104 00:04:46,000 --> 00:04:48,679 Speaker 1: They're never gonna be what Jerry's doing down in Dallas. 105 00:04:49,120 --> 00:04:51,559 Speaker 1: You know that the city is just a very different city. 106 00:04:51,600 --> 00:04:55,360 Speaker 1: The fans are like Aferent banking. They got banking headquarters. 107 00:04:55,560 --> 00:04:58,680 Speaker 1: It might be better than Buffalo or Jacksonville, but there's 108 00:04:58,680 --> 00:05:01,039 Speaker 1: no amount of stadium in a nation that is going 109 00:05:01,120 --> 00:05:03,560 Speaker 1: to let the Carolina Panthers make local revenue the way 110 00:05:03,600 --> 00:05:05,680 Speaker 1: that the Dallas Cowboys do. No, but they certainly don't 111 00:05:05,680 --> 00:05:07,520 Speaker 1: need to be bottom third. If they had a new facility, 112 00:05:07,520 --> 00:05:09,599 Speaker 1: they'd be right back in the top third. There's there's 113 00:05:09,640 --> 00:05:12,719 Speaker 1: things they can do. And I have this from somebody 114 00:05:12,760 --> 00:05:16,800 Speaker 1: familiar with the transaction. I can tell you that the 115 00:05:16,839 --> 00:05:19,320 Speaker 1: fact that legalized sports betting, which we're gonna talk to 116 00:05:19,320 --> 00:05:20,880 Speaker 1: on later. I don't want to get into the topic now, 117 00:05:21,440 --> 00:05:25,960 Speaker 1: but that was very attractive to David Tepper. He sees 118 00:05:26,320 --> 00:05:29,680 Speaker 1: not only a real estate opportunity with this purchase, but 119 00:05:29,839 --> 00:05:32,760 Speaker 1: he's these things he can do with sports betting as well, 120 00:05:32,800 --> 00:05:34,839 Speaker 1: which kind of drove his bit up a little higher 121 00:05:34,880 --> 00:05:36,800 Speaker 1: than where he wanted to be originally, as it should be. 122 00:05:36,839 --> 00:05:39,599 Speaker 1: I mean, we've talked about Mark Cubans saying that franchise 123 00:05:39,640 --> 00:05:42,360 Speaker 1: valuations were going to double. That seems a little bit 124 00:05:42,520 --> 00:05:45,440 Speaker 1: aggressive to me, but there's no question. I mean, if 125 00:05:45,440 --> 00:05:48,200 Speaker 1: we talk about local revenue, if if North Carolina were 126 00:05:48,240 --> 00:05:51,159 Speaker 1: to legalized sports gambling, there's gonna be a ton of 127 00:05:51,160 --> 00:05:53,200 Speaker 1: sponsorship dollars that are going to flow to the Carolina 128 00:05:53,240 --> 00:05:56,840 Speaker 1: Panthers that were not available to Jerry Richardson, Chris because 129 00:05:56,839 --> 00:05:59,320 Speaker 1: you jump let me. Let you tell me, Mark Cuban 130 00:05:59,400 --> 00:06:02,760 Speaker 1: hyperbole are not hyperbole, franchise values will double. I I 131 00:06:02,800 --> 00:06:05,000 Speaker 1: sent him the email and I said, Mark, we'd like 132 00:06:05,040 --> 00:06:09,560 Speaker 1: to use you, but I don't want to quote hyperbolic stuff. 133 00:06:09,760 --> 00:06:11,760 Speaker 1: And he said, it's not hyperbole. I don't think they're 134 00:06:11,760 --> 00:06:13,840 Speaker 1: gonna double overnight. I do think there's going to be 135 00:06:14,000 --> 00:06:16,920 Speaker 1: increased value, and I think that will be reflected as 136 00:06:16,960 --> 00:06:19,200 Speaker 1: the realities of what those revenue streams really are. So 137 00:06:19,240 --> 00:06:21,920 Speaker 1: I think immediately there is some bumping value, but I 138 00:06:21,960 --> 00:06:23,960 Speaker 1: think it will take two or three years for those 139 00:06:24,000 --> 00:06:27,440 Speaker 1: kind of dramatic numbers to impact what actually gets paid 140 00:06:27,440 --> 00:06:29,360 Speaker 1: for in terms of teams. So you're David Tepper, what 141 00:06:29,400 --> 00:06:32,680 Speaker 1: are you doing well? I think David Tepper, you know 142 00:06:32,760 --> 00:06:35,839 Speaker 1: right now, is getting himself familiar with the organization, getting 143 00:06:35,839 --> 00:06:38,159 Speaker 1: the right folks in place to make sure it's his 144 00:06:38,279 --> 00:06:40,280 Speaker 1: culture and his vision of the team. I think that's 145 00:06:40,279 --> 00:06:43,000 Speaker 1: probably job one is in terms of people in personnel 146 00:06:43,040 --> 00:06:45,320 Speaker 1: and culture. And then I think you're basically getting your 147 00:06:45,360 --> 00:06:47,560 Speaker 1: arms around the stadium issue. I think you're looking at 148 00:06:48,000 --> 00:06:51,279 Speaker 1: local sponsorship, some of the local radio and other media 149 00:06:51,360 --> 00:06:53,880 Speaker 1: rights that you own. And in terms of the gambling thing, 150 00:06:53,920 --> 00:06:55,920 Speaker 1: I think it's not clear whether that will be handled 151 00:06:55,920 --> 00:06:57,880 Speaker 1: on a league level or a local level, but if 152 00:06:57,880 --> 00:06:59,920 Speaker 1: it's handled on a local level, I think that also 153 00:07:00,040 --> 00:07:03,120 Speaker 1: represents a pretty big opportunity in the near term. Talk 154 00:07:03,160 --> 00:07:06,920 Speaker 1: about revenue. Sunday Night Football, they just came out some 155 00:07:07,000 --> 00:07:09,600 Speaker 1: of the best ratings ever. I mean, it'd beat American 156 00:07:09,640 --> 00:07:11,920 Speaker 1: Idol and all this and that. Whatever. What's on in 157 00:07:11,960 --> 00:07:19,040 Speaker 1: your in your household, I think I know I'm still 158 00:07:19,080 --> 00:07:21,640 Speaker 1: saying this isn't Monday night football whatever. Bar has no 159 00:07:21,720 --> 00:07:26,440 Speaker 1: control of control in his household. Alright, Bar, let's move on. 160 00:07:26,880 --> 00:07:30,160 Speaker 1: Joining in on the conversation is, as always, Bloomberg Sports 161 00:07:30,160 --> 00:07:33,400 Speaker 1: reporter Evan Nobi Williams, along with our special guest host 162 00:07:33,480 --> 00:07:35,560 Speaker 1: Chris Russo. Chris Red and if you don't know your 163 00:07:35,560 --> 00:07:37,360 Speaker 1: title by the way, you're managing director and member of 164 00:07:37,400 --> 00:07:41,040 Speaker 1: Hulohan Loki's Technology Media Telecom group. Now I'm out of breath. 165 00:07:41,160 --> 00:07:43,040 Speaker 1: That's a long title. It is a long title. You know, 166 00:07:43,080 --> 00:07:46,440 Speaker 1: it's a long time coming sports betting. Thank you very much. 167 00:07:46,560 --> 00:07:48,400 Speaker 1: I don't need to praise on air. You're all looking. 168 00:07:48,440 --> 00:07:51,880 Speaker 1: Really it did very well in the seguee sports betting 169 00:07:51,920 --> 00:07:54,000 Speaker 1: Russo did you think it was coming? Did you think 170 00:07:54,040 --> 00:07:58,600 Speaker 1: it was coming now? And can you overestimate the impact 171 00:07:58,600 --> 00:08:02,040 Speaker 1: it will have on the entire sports world. I believe 172 00:08:02,120 --> 00:08:03,840 Speaker 1: that the Supreme Court was going to rule this way, 173 00:08:03,880 --> 00:08:06,640 Speaker 1: so I'm not surprised, but it's almost like hard to 174 00:08:06,680 --> 00:08:09,120 Speaker 1: believe it actually happened. So I think in the industry 175 00:08:09,160 --> 00:08:11,840 Speaker 1: there was some expectation, but at the same time there's 176 00:08:11,840 --> 00:08:14,240 Speaker 1: also some shock that the world is actually different. So 177 00:08:14,480 --> 00:08:17,120 Speaker 1: I do think it's going to have a transformational impact 178 00:08:17,320 --> 00:08:20,080 Speaker 1: on the sports industry, on sports business. To kind of 179 00:08:20,120 --> 00:08:22,520 Speaker 1: put it in somewhat of perspective, there's a lot of 180 00:08:22,520 --> 00:08:24,760 Speaker 1: reports out there that say that the amount of betting 181 00:08:25,000 --> 00:08:27,560 Speaker 1: going on illegally is like a hundred fifty billion dollars 182 00:08:27,560 --> 00:08:30,160 Speaker 1: in the US offshore and whatever. Ways, when you think 183 00:08:30,200 --> 00:08:32,960 Speaker 1: about that a hundred fifty billion versus the billion or 184 00:08:32,960 --> 00:08:35,440 Speaker 1: two billion that was going on in daily fantasy. We 185 00:08:35,480 --> 00:08:39,079 Speaker 1: all remember every day every commercial that happened in those games, 186 00:08:39,080 --> 00:08:40,680 Speaker 1: and in the amount of stature. Are we are we 187 00:08:40,679 --> 00:08:42,440 Speaker 1: going to see that again? Is it gonna be William 188 00:08:42,520 --> 00:08:44,679 Speaker 1: Hill and Draft Kings and Patty? Are we going to 189 00:08:44,760 --> 00:08:47,040 Speaker 1: see this again? I think you very well could be. 190 00:08:47,080 --> 00:08:50,760 Speaker 1: Not exactly in that same way, there's been some lessons. 191 00:08:50,760 --> 00:08:52,560 Speaker 1: There's not the guys with the big check over their 192 00:08:52,600 --> 00:08:55,200 Speaker 1: head and uh, you know, I'm gonna win a million dollars, 193 00:08:55,200 --> 00:08:57,080 Speaker 1: but really more about the engagement in the fun of it. 194 00:08:57,240 --> 00:08:58,760 Speaker 1: I think you will see a lot of media and 195 00:08:58,800 --> 00:09:03,200 Speaker 1: advertising over time change. That's where the fantasy sports industry, 196 00:09:03,240 --> 00:09:06,040 Speaker 1: for lack of a better term, screwed up, because it 197 00:09:06,160 --> 00:09:08,199 Speaker 1: was a nice industry going and then all of a 198 00:09:08,240 --> 00:09:10,520 Speaker 1: sudden they brought these commercials and you can win a 199 00:09:10,559 --> 00:09:14,600 Speaker 1: million dollars and everybody is going crazy, and then all 200 00:09:14,640 --> 00:09:17,319 Speaker 1: of the legislators are like, well wait a minute, Evan, 201 00:09:17,360 --> 00:09:20,200 Speaker 1: you know more than anybody else in this room about this. 202 00:09:20,240 --> 00:09:22,640 Speaker 1: Who won, who lost, and who set up nicely? Man? 203 00:09:22,679 --> 00:09:25,440 Speaker 1: I mean there's tons of winners. Pressure though the no 204 00:09:25,600 --> 00:09:30,520 Speaker 1: question that your your Vegas, your big Vegas companies, William Hill, MGM, Caesar's, 205 00:09:30,920 --> 00:09:34,320 Speaker 1: They're gonna look good. Uh. Draft Kings certainly positioning themselves. 206 00:09:34,320 --> 00:09:37,840 Speaker 1: They put up advertising last week for the first time 207 00:09:37,920 --> 00:09:41,880 Speaker 1: on New Jersey Turnpike at Penn Station, you know, at airports, 208 00:09:41,920 --> 00:09:45,320 Speaker 1: making a clear people don't understand what they have the customers, right, 209 00:09:45,640 --> 00:09:47,719 Speaker 1: That's what makes I mean they say they have the 210 00:09:47,720 --> 00:09:51,720 Speaker 1: customers they've got certainly have a client list that is young, 211 00:09:52,480 --> 00:09:55,640 Speaker 1: used to gaming online, used to giving their credit card over. 212 00:09:56,080 --> 00:09:58,400 Speaker 1: But if you were to compare Draft Kings client list 213 00:09:58,480 --> 00:10:00,800 Speaker 1: to what MGM sits on in It's Vegas. There's no 214 00:10:00,880 --> 00:10:04,560 Speaker 1: question that you prefer to have the casinos database. But 215 00:10:04,640 --> 00:10:07,720 Speaker 1: sure DraftKings has experience over the past couple of years 216 00:10:08,040 --> 00:10:10,680 Speaker 1: pitching games and states that that don't have casinos, or 217 00:10:10,720 --> 00:10:13,480 Speaker 1: that MGM and William Hill have zero presence in. They 218 00:10:13,480 --> 00:10:17,240 Speaker 1: have a group of team dedicated to building online games 219 00:10:17,240 --> 00:10:20,079 Speaker 1: that cater to millennials. That's the audience that all these 220 00:10:20,080 --> 00:10:23,079 Speaker 1: gambling companies are really looking to reach. Um. There is 221 00:10:23,120 --> 00:10:25,120 Speaker 1: certainly an argument to be made for for Draft Kings 222 00:10:25,200 --> 00:10:27,760 Speaker 1: and to an extent, Fandel being well positioned for this. 223 00:10:28,440 --> 00:10:30,200 Speaker 1: On the other side of that coin, William Hill has 224 00:10:30,240 --> 00:10:33,120 Speaker 1: been around for decades and decades. It's the one of 225 00:10:33,160 --> 00:10:35,400 Speaker 1: the biggest gambling companies in the world. You know, they 226 00:10:35,640 --> 00:10:38,440 Speaker 1: operate a third of the sports book money in Vegas. 227 00:10:39,080 --> 00:10:42,200 Speaker 1: In Jersey exactly. They have a place in Jersey at 228 00:10:42,280 --> 00:10:45,760 Speaker 1: Monmouth Park. Um, so you know, yeah, casinos are going 229 00:10:45,800 --> 00:10:48,360 Speaker 1: to be well positioned. Also, then you have kind of 230 00:10:48,360 --> 00:10:50,200 Speaker 1: this big unknown and Chris, I'd love to hear your 231 00:10:50,200 --> 00:10:53,200 Speaker 1: thoughts here as well. What other companies out there. Maybe 232 00:10:53,200 --> 00:10:57,000 Speaker 1: it's a media company, Um, maybe it's an online digital company, 233 00:10:57,000 --> 00:10:59,880 Speaker 1: a social media company, other companies that might look at 234 00:10:59,880 --> 00:11:02,079 Speaker 1: the US and say, you know what, we're well positioned here, 235 00:11:02,120 --> 00:11:04,640 Speaker 1: We've got a huge client base. Maybe we start offering 236 00:11:04,640 --> 00:11:06,720 Speaker 1: this as well. Yeah. Look, I think the large media 237 00:11:06,760 --> 00:11:08,679 Speaker 1: companies are going to benefit just in the same way 238 00:11:08,679 --> 00:11:11,640 Speaker 1: they've benefited when all the daily fantasy money got spent. Obviously, 239 00:11:11,720 --> 00:11:14,400 Speaker 1: they'll have to customize and target ads to local states, 240 00:11:14,640 --> 00:11:17,360 Speaker 1: but I think that's certainly doable. I think you'll you know, 241 00:11:17,600 --> 00:11:19,920 Speaker 1: one of the two tough subjects is how will it 242 00:11:20,000 --> 00:11:22,640 Speaker 1: benefit or not the leagues and the teams. I think 243 00:11:22,640 --> 00:11:25,280 Speaker 1: what you'll see fairly early on is teams getting approached 244 00:11:25,480 --> 00:11:28,600 Speaker 1: about local sponsorships the same way they got approached by 245 00:11:28,679 --> 00:11:30,839 Speaker 1: Daily Fantasy. And the issue for the for the league's 246 00:11:30,840 --> 00:11:33,319 Speaker 1: will be do we let that activity happen state by 247 00:11:33,320 --> 00:11:35,760 Speaker 1: state from a marketing standpoint, or do we control all 248 00:11:35,760 --> 00:11:37,840 Speaker 1: of that nationally. So so, tell me about the integrity 249 00:11:37,840 --> 00:11:39,559 Speaker 1: feed they came out with. I mean, we've had the 250 00:11:39,559 --> 00:11:41,400 Speaker 1: guys from William Hill call the money grab and like, 251 00:11:41,440 --> 00:11:43,800 Speaker 1: come on, give me a break. They operate in places 252 00:11:43,840 --> 00:11:46,520 Speaker 1: where their bets. Was that a mistake, poorly phrase, poorly 253 00:11:46,600 --> 00:11:49,719 Speaker 1: rolled out? You know? I think, Look, I think there's 254 00:11:49,720 --> 00:11:52,360 Speaker 1: a larger issue, which is, you know, have the league's 255 00:11:52,360 --> 00:11:53,840 Speaker 1: been able to get in front of all of this 256 00:11:53,960 --> 00:11:55,439 Speaker 1: or are they now chasing it. I think some of 257 00:11:55,480 --> 00:11:57,000 Speaker 1: the leagues were trying to get out of in front 258 00:11:57,040 --> 00:11:58,800 Speaker 1: of it a couple of years ago, including Adam Silver. 259 00:11:58,880 --> 00:12:01,080 Speaker 1: I think others were less aggressive about it. I think 260 00:12:01,120 --> 00:12:03,959 Speaker 1: they truly are interested in integrity, but now I think 261 00:12:03,960 --> 00:12:07,240 Speaker 1: they find themselves chasing the opportunity. I do think the 262 00:12:07,320 --> 00:12:09,480 Speaker 1: leagues have a lot to provide in terms of their data, 263 00:12:09,679 --> 00:12:12,679 Speaker 1: in terms of their marketing. As we talked about earlier, 264 00:12:12,920 --> 00:12:15,240 Speaker 1: the one thing you really need here is going to 265 00:12:15,400 --> 00:12:18,640 Speaker 1: be the data that is there in the intellectual property 266 00:12:19,000 --> 00:12:21,040 Speaker 1: that can be sold on a global basis. There are 267 00:12:21,080 --> 00:12:23,120 Speaker 1: companies like sport Radar doing it now. By the way, 268 00:12:23,160 --> 00:12:26,960 Speaker 1: investors in sport Radar Mark Cuban Um Ted Leon says 269 00:12:27,040 --> 00:12:29,680 Speaker 1: Michael Jordan's folks, we know. Yeah. So I think that 270 00:12:29,720 --> 00:12:31,880 Speaker 1: there are great things that the leagues have to offer 271 00:12:31,920 --> 00:12:33,720 Speaker 1: and provide here. I think they just have to be 272 00:12:33,720 --> 00:12:36,880 Speaker 1: careful about overreaching like they did in the fantasy space 273 00:12:37,040 --> 00:12:39,200 Speaker 1: where they try to assert rights and then basically the 274 00:12:39,240 --> 00:12:41,240 Speaker 1: courts said, oh, this is all public domain. So I 275 00:12:41,280 --> 00:12:43,240 Speaker 1: think they have to be smart about what they assert 276 00:12:43,280 --> 00:12:45,280 Speaker 1: and what they actually sell in this context, and I 277 00:12:45,320 --> 00:12:47,880 Speaker 1: think we can. I mean, the basic facts here are 278 00:12:47,920 --> 00:12:50,520 Speaker 1: that the leagues are gonna make more money in the 279 00:12:50,559 --> 00:12:53,360 Speaker 1: total off of this than whatever the cost it's going 280 00:12:53,400 --> 00:12:56,200 Speaker 1: to take to maintain integrity within their support. That seems 281 00:12:56,280 --> 00:13:00,160 Speaker 1: unequivocally accurate. If the leagues want money because they think 282 00:13:00,160 --> 00:13:03,079 Speaker 1: it's a royalty or because it's just people making money 283 00:13:03,080 --> 00:13:05,240 Speaker 1: off of their games, that's one thing. And I think 284 00:13:05,320 --> 00:13:07,800 Speaker 1: that's the big mistake the league's made originally with this 285 00:13:07,880 --> 00:13:10,959 Speaker 1: integrity fee, is that they tried to cauch it originally 286 00:13:10,960 --> 00:13:13,079 Speaker 1: as this thing that they needed money that they needed 287 00:13:13,080 --> 00:13:16,599 Speaker 1: to have because they needed to maintain the sanctity and 288 00:13:16,640 --> 00:13:19,960 Speaker 1: integrity of their sport. That's not true. But as they've 289 00:13:20,000 --> 00:13:22,640 Speaker 1: kind of positioned it again as a as a royalty, 290 00:13:22,679 --> 00:13:25,640 Speaker 1: as a licensing payment, uh, they may get more traction 291 00:13:25,679 --> 00:13:28,840 Speaker 1: with that. Well, here's the big debate that fantasy sports 292 00:13:29,400 --> 00:13:32,680 Speaker 1: geeks like me have been talking about ever since this 293 00:13:33,040 --> 00:13:37,120 Speaker 1: has been legalized now for regular betting, is this the 294 00:13:37,280 --> 00:13:42,040 Speaker 1: end of fantasy sports, especially daily fantasy sports. I don't 295 00:13:42,040 --> 00:13:44,040 Speaker 1: think it's the end of daily fantasy. I think they're 296 00:13:44,080 --> 00:13:46,480 Speaker 1: just different kinds of activities. I think there are people 297 00:13:46,480 --> 00:13:49,640 Speaker 1: who believe fantasy is a little bit more skill based, 298 00:13:49,840 --> 00:13:52,920 Speaker 1: requires a little bit more analysis, a little bit deeper involvement, 299 00:13:53,240 --> 00:13:55,280 Speaker 1: and so I do think fantasy will continue to grow, 300 00:13:55,320 --> 00:13:56,719 Speaker 1: but I don't think it will grow at the rate 301 00:13:56,760 --> 00:13:59,240 Speaker 1: it had been growing. And I do think the explosive 302 00:13:59,320 --> 00:14:01,880 Speaker 1: kind of amic and the sports industry will be gambling 303 00:14:02,000 --> 00:14:04,160 Speaker 1: and prop betting, in game betting, which I think we 304 00:14:04,240 --> 00:14:06,560 Speaker 1: have not really talked about our thought a lot here 305 00:14:06,559 --> 00:14:09,440 Speaker 1: in the US. Actually overseas in the UK, more betting 306 00:14:09,440 --> 00:14:11,680 Speaker 1: happens after the game starts than before. I love the 307 00:14:11,679 --> 00:14:14,440 Speaker 1: line Cuban said where when somebody asked him about you know, 308 00:14:14,480 --> 00:14:16,840 Speaker 1: the legalized sports betting is finally going to a baseball game. 309 00:14:16,920 --> 00:14:18,840 Speaker 1: Is gonna be fun again? He likes to take shots 310 00:14:18,840 --> 00:14:20,960 Speaker 1: of Major League Baseball. But how funny if you can 311 00:14:21,000 --> 00:14:23,760 Speaker 1: just sit there just pushing cents that whatever you want 312 00:14:23,760 --> 00:14:26,120 Speaker 1: to bet. But is this guy gonna strike out? Is 313 00:14:26,120 --> 00:14:28,640 Speaker 1: this guy gonna hit a home run? And the algorithms 314 00:14:28,640 --> 00:14:31,360 Speaker 1: are spinning as it goes, the odds are changing, you 315 00:14:31,400 --> 00:14:34,360 Speaker 1: could you could see where the engagement will soar. Yeah, 316 00:14:34,760 --> 00:14:36,320 Speaker 1: I think I think it's gonna be a big advantage. 317 00:14:36,320 --> 00:14:38,040 Speaker 1: It's going to take time for that all to shake out, 318 00:14:38,040 --> 00:14:39,440 Speaker 1: but I think it's gonna be good for the leagues 319 00:14:39,440 --> 00:14:41,000 Speaker 1: in that regard. And going back to what Chris just 320 00:14:41,040 --> 00:14:43,560 Speaker 1: said real quick on on Daily Fantasy, I think you're 321 00:14:43,560 --> 00:14:46,280 Speaker 1: definitely right. You're the hardcore fantasy players are going to 322 00:14:46,360 --> 00:14:49,080 Speaker 1: continue to do it because they like the gameplay and 323 00:14:49,120 --> 00:14:51,280 Speaker 1: it is a little bit more skill based than than 324 00:14:51,320 --> 00:14:53,840 Speaker 1: than sports gambling. The problem they're going to have is 325 00:14:53,880 --> 00:14:56,960 Speaker 1: that all the casual players, the guys whose money they 326 00:14:57,040 --> 00:15:00,720 Speaker 1: take in these drafting pools, are going going to transfer 327 00:15:00,760 --> 00:15:03,880 Speaker 1: over to sports gambling. A lot of those people view 328 00:15:04,080 --> 00:15:08,160 Speaker 1: DFS Daily Fantasy as just a proxy waiting until they 329 00:15:08,200 --> 00:15:10,800 Speaker 1: could regularly bet on the Cowboys minus five or the 330 00:15:10,840 --> 00:15:13,920 Speaker 1: Giants plus twelve. When that all shakes out and the 331 00:15:14,040 --> 00:15:17,520 Speaker 1: DFS pool is suddenly just professionals, I think they may 332 00:15:17,560 --> 00:15:21,359 Speaker 1: see a totally different return on investment uh in daily fantasy. 333 00:15:21,360 --> 00:15:22,680 Speaker 1: One quick no one I wanted to add to that 334 00:15:22,760 --> 00:15:26,200 Speaker 1: is that when you play daily fantasy sports, you really 335 00:15:26,320 --> 00:15:30,280 Speaker 1: don't care who wins or loses the game. What you're 336 00:15:30,320 --> 00:15:34,560 Speaker 1: caring about is your player. How well does that player do? 337 00:15:35,200 --> 00:15:38,520 Speaker 1: Now with betting, It's like, well, that's one of our 338 00:15:38,560 --> 00:15:40,080 Speaker 1: guests said, it gives you a reason to watch the 339 00:15:40,080 --> 00:15:43,600 Speaker 1: Cleveland Browns when they're thirteen the fourth quarter down, by 340 00:15:43,960 --> 00:15:46,680 Speaker 1: I mean yeah over under, how your guy is gonna 341 00:15:46,720 --> 00:15:48,640 Speaker 1: Do you have a reason to watch? Let's talk about 342 00:15:48,680 --> 00:15:52,200 Speaker 1: sports rights and the fees. They continue to go up 343 00:15:52,480 --> 00:15:55,600 Speaker 1: and up and up. Is there a ceiling? Let's put 344 00:15:55,640 --> 00:15:59,480 Speaker 1: it that way. Well, I think before this month people 345 00:15:59,480 --> 00:16:02,720 Speaker 1: thought maybe and with all of the cord cutting that 346 00:16:02,800 --> 00:16:04,840 Speaker 1: was going on and some of the challenges that ESPN 347 00:16:04,960 --> 00:16:07,280 Speaker 1: was having, there was some notion that maybe we've hit 348 00:16:07,280 --> 00:16:10,040 Speaker 1: a peak or a wall in terms of sports rights growth. 349 00:16:10,080 --> 00:16:13,200 Speaker 1: But now with the UFC deal with ESPN, the rumor 350 00:16:13,360 --> 00:16:16,240 Speaker 1: w w E deal there there's a sense that maybe 351 00:16:16,440 --> 00:16:19,400 Speaker 1: we still have growth ahead of us. Surprisingly, so again, 352 00:16:19,440 --> 00:16:21,520 Speaker 1: I think a lot of industry experts three or four 353 00:16:21,560 --> 00:16:23,680 Speaker 1: months ago we're saying it's kind of a barish outlook 354 00:16:23,840 --> 00:16:25,720 Speaker 1: for sports media rights, But now I think that might 355 00:16:25,760 --> 00:16:28,800 Speaker 1: be changing. Chris, w w E shot up like nine percent. 356 00:16:29,320 --> 00:16:32,520 Speaker 1: They're getting a three fourfold increase on their deal. We're 357 00:16:32,520 --> 00:16:36,360 Speaker 1: talking two hundred and fifty two hundred plus whatever million 358 00:16:36,440 --> 00:16:40,240 Speaker 1: dollars annually, over a billion over five years. This, by 359 00:16:40,280 --> 00:16:42,680 Speaker 1: the way, for what in essence is scripted drama? Do 360 00:16:42,800 --> 00:16:44,120 Speaker 1: we put it under? Where do you put it under? 361 00:16:44,120 --> 00:16:46,400 Speaker 1: Sports entertain What do you put w w E under? 362 00:16:47,080 --> 00:16:49,880 Speaker 1: I think it is sports, but I think sports is entertainment. 363 00:16:49,920 --> 00:16:52,280 Speaker 1: I think they're they're they're merging and melding, and I 364 00:16:52,360 --> 00:16:55,480 Speaker 1: think it's really about attracting an audience that advertisers want 365 00:16:55,480 --> 00:16:57,480 Speaker 1: to spend money in and viewers want to see. So 366 00:16:57,520 --> 00:16:59,720 Speaker 1: I don't think that distinction is so important as it 367 00:16:59,800 --> 00:17:02,680 Speaker 1: is the the audience and the advertise, demo, demo Demo 368 00:17:02,760 --> 00:17:06,040 Speaker 1: and w W E definitely excus Younger. Yep. All the 369 00:17:06,080 --> 00:17:09,200 Speaker 1: properties that that you mentioned in the intro, those are 370 00:17:09,240 --> 00:17:12,960 Speaker 1: all premium sports properties, you know, UFC WW. We've seen 371 00:17:12,960 --> 00:17:14,720 Speaker 1: these increases for a lot of other content in the 372 00:17:14,800 --> 00:17:17,640 Speaker 1: US as well. How about that second tier down, I mean, 373 00:17:17,760 --> 00:17:20,320 Speaker 1: if you look at the past five years, the rights 374 00:17:20,359 --> 00:17:23,560 Speaker 1: fees that we've seen go down significantly are your smaller 375 00:17:23,600 --> 00:17:27,760 Speaker 1: conference and CIA, you know, your Conference USA, your sun Belt, 376 00:17:27,760 --> 00:17:30,439 Speaker 1: you know, schools like that. Uh. Does this mean that 377 00:17:30,480 --> 00:17:32,680 Speaker 1: they may go up as well? Or are we seeing 378 00:17:32,680 --> 00:17:35,960 Speaker 1: this big schism between premium and non premiums. Well, there 379 00:17:36,000 --> 00:17:38,960 Speaker 1: certainly is, and I think historically has been somewhat of 380 00:17:38,960 --> 00:17:42,119 Speaker 1: a schism between the biggest properties like the NFL's of 381 00:17:42,160 --> 00:17:44,399 Speaker 1: the world and some of the mid tier properties. The 382 00:17:44,480 --> 00:17:47,520 Speaker 1: question going forward it will be what does the combination 383 00:17:47,560 --> 00:17:50,119 Speaker 1: of traditional TV rights and digital rights look like. Some 384 00:17:50,200 --> 00:17:53,240 Speaker 1: of those second tier properties may be really conducive to 385 00:17:53,680 --> 00:17:56,320 Speaker 1: the ESPN pluses of the world and other digital outlets, 386 00:17:56,359 --> 00:17:58,920 Speaker 1: so on a combined basis, they may still do well 387 00:17:59,000 --> 00:18:01,600 Speaker 1: even though the traditional TV rights may be lower. Now 388 00:18:01,680 --> 00:18:05,200 Speaker 1: for old geezers like me who just binge watched the rifleman. 389 00:18:08,040 --> 00:18:11,400 Speaker 1: Is the audience not even paying attention to me anymore? 390 00:18:11,520 --> 00:18:14,440 Speaker 1: When it comes to something like this, when you see 391 00:18:14,440 --> 00:18:18,879 Speaker 1: the garital edds, you'll know they're paying to look. You know. 392 00:18:18,920 --> 00:18:22,480 Speaker 1: Advertisers still focus on you know, eighteen to thirty, eighteen 393 00:18:22,520 --> 00:18:25,159 Speaker 1: to forty nine. I think that will continue. But I 394 00:18:25,200 --> 00:18:28,320 Speaker 1: think when you come to these pay models subscription models, 395 00:18:28,320 --> 00:18:30,000 Speaker 1: at the end of the day, it's who is going 396 00:18:30,080 --> 00:18:32,320 Speaker 1: to pay the subscription, and I think the demos are 397 00:18:32,400 --> 00:18:35,600 Speaker 1: less important there. Sometimes some of the very youngest of 398 00:18:35,640 --> 00:18:38,000 Speaker 1: the demos don't like to pay subscription moneies. They like 399 00:18:38,080 --> 00:18:41,760 Speaker 1: to take their parents. Not that Williams shares passports. He 400 00:18:41,800 --> 00:18:45,040 Speaker 1: does not do that. Not that on occasion I haven't 401 00:18:45,040 --> 00:18:46,960 Speaker 1: and said, Edmond, what's that barrow pass word you use? 402 00:18:47,000 --> 00:18:49,200 Speaker 1: I need to plug into something that does not happen. 403 00:18:50,040 --> 00:18:53,720 Speaker 1: So interestingly, the subscription models may be more conducive to 404 00:18:53,800 --> 00:18:56,120 Speaker 1: audiences that are a little bit older. And again there 405 00:18:56,119 --> 00:18:58,960 Speaker 1: may be that dichotomy. Never forget something John Skipper said 406 00:18:58,960 --> 00:19:01,280 Speaker 1: to me, and it's so simple, like he didn't care 407 00:19:01,320 --> 00:19:04,359 Speaker 1: what it was, Tiddley Wings Dark, it didn't didn't matter, 408 00:19:04,680 --> 00:19:08,080 Speaker 1: just said, you find a way to aggregate the eyeballs. 409 00:19:08,880 --> 00:19:11,119 Speaker 1: I will figure out a way to monetize it. I mean, 410 00:19:11,160 --> 00:19:13,320 Speaker 1: that's what it boils down to. You know, we talked 411 00:19:13,320 --> 00:19:16,480 Speaker 1: about remember when E sports, which is big obviously now, 412 00:19:16,680 --> 00:19:19,840 Speaker 1: but I mean I remember back in the day. Just 413 00:19:19,880 --> 00:19:21,760 Speaker 1: what you just when you say that, when you say 414 00:19:21,760 --> 00:19:24,320 Speaker 1: back in the day, that's not our casual listeners that 415 00:19:25,680 --> 00:19:27,920 Speaker 1: you're back in the day. It's not everybody else's back 416 00:19:27,960 --> 00:19:31,960 Speaker 1: in We watch Championship Bridge and that was that people 417 00:19:31,960 --> 00:19:35,440 Speaker 1: were mesmerizing, Are you gonna play? Do you? Oh? Yeah, Well, 418 00:19:36,040 --> 00:19:37,680 Speaker 1: if I can see you on one of those cruises, 419 00:19:38,000 --> 00:19:42,720 Speaker 1: you and your wife on a cruise. I mean shuffleboard. 420 00:19:42,840 --> 00:19:45,320 Speaker 1: You look at this, it's I mean, you just hit 421 00:19:45,320 --> 00:19:47,200 Speaker 1: the nail on the head. And gentle one, if there's 422 00:19:47,320 --> 00:19:51,879 Speaker 1: something to watch on TV, somebody somewhere is going to 423 00:19:51,920 --> 00:19:53,880 Speaker 1: find a way to make money on it. And if 424 00:19:53,880 --> 00:19:57,360 Speaker 1: you can gamble on it. Dart shuffle board doesn't sound fun, 425 00:19:57,400 --> 00:19:59,280 Speaker 1: but if I can gamble on the shuffle board, that 426 00:19:59,280 --> 00:20:03,879 Speaker 1: sounds a little more interesting. Yeah. I mean that that's 427 00:20:03,920 --> 00:20:05,920 Speaker 1: that's the key to the whole thing, and that which 428 00:20:05,920 --> 00:20:10,760 Speaker 1: brings up another point. E sports and gambling with fees. 429 00:20:12,160 --> 00:20:14,000 Speaker 1: Can that is that going to happen. Is that a 430 00:20:14,040 --> 00:20:16,400 Speaker 1: marriage we're gonna have one day? I think you'll see 431 00:20:16,440 --> 00:20:19,560 Speaker 1: them certainly trying and experimenting with it, And the question 432 00:20:19,600 --> 00:20:21,320 Speaker 1: will be, with the sports still being a bit of 433 00:20:21,320 --> 00:20:23,960 Speaker 1: the wild West, can they kind of control all the 434 00:20:24,000 --> 00:20:26,840 Speaker 1: integrity issues and make sure everything is done in the 435 00:20:26,920 --> 00:20:29,159 Speaker 1: right way so you don't have issues and challenges. I 436 00:20:29,200 --> 00:20:31,480 Speaker 1: think that will be the kind of question you'll have 437 00:20:31,520 --> 00:20:34,240 Speaker 1: across all of the sort of smaller or emerging sports. 438 00:20:34,480 --> 00:20:36,200 Speaker 1: There will be interest in gambling on it, but you 439 00:20:36,320 --> 00:20:38,760 Speaker 1: just need to have the systems in place to monitor 440 00:20:38,800 --> 00:20:41,240 Speaker 1: and keep the integraty. You just said something. There are 441 00:20:41,280 --> 00:20:43,840 Speaker 1: there are billions gambles on the sports already right now. 442 00:20:43,880 --> 00:20:45,600 Speaker 1: I mean you can make an argument that the sports 443 00:20:45,600 --> 00:20:50,080 Speaker 1: are are better suited and also more accustomed to gambling 444 00:20:50,160 --> 00:20:52,679 Speaker 1: right now than even NFL and NBA. I mean, it 445 00:20:52,760 --> 00:20:55,960 Speaker 1: is a fundamental part of the viewership experience right now 446 00:20:56,480 --> 00:20:58,000 Speaker 1: is gambling on the sports, and a lot of that 447 00:20:58,080 --> 00:21:01,679 Speaker 1: happens illegally. A lot of that happen through proxy currencies, 448 00:21:01,760 --> 00:21:04,239 Speaker 1: a lot of that happens through in game apps that 449 00:21:04,280 --> 00:21:08,480 Speaker 1: have monetary value that you can wager on between two people. Um, 450 00:21:08,520 --> 00:21:11,800 Speaker 1: but I would argue that that there are NFL teams 451 00:21:12,200 --> 00:21:14,720 Speaker 1: leagues out there that should be taking a page from 452 00:21:14,800 --> 00:21:17,600 Speaker 1: the sports book in terms of how it has integrated 453 00:21:17,640 --> 00:21:22,040 Speaker 1: gambling into the full viewership experience. We are joined by 454 00:21:22,080 --> 00:21:25,159 Speaker 1: Bloomberg Sports reporter Eben Novie Williams, along with our special 455 00:21:25,200 --> 00:21:28,640 Speaker 1: guest host Chris Russo, managing director and member of Hulahan 456 00:21:28,720 --> 00:21:32,720 Speaker 1: Loki's Technology Media Telecom Group, And let's continue our discussion 457 00:21:32,760 --> 00:21:37,879 Speaker 1: on sports rights because right now, yes, UFC, yes ww e, 458 00:21:38,000 --> 00:21:41,960 Speaker 1: those are major rights, Chris. But if we look just 459 00:21:42,160 --> 00:21:50,600 Speaker 1: a little ahead two, you've got major, big time, big 460 00:21:50,640 --> 00:21:54,200 Speaker 1: four sports rights, including the NFL, and we're talking digital, 461 00:21:54,240 --> 00:21:58,399 Speaker 1: we're talking linear, the whole shebang, the big Enchilada coming do. 462 00:21:59,000 --> 00:22:02,160 Speaker 1: What is that war world going to look like? Well, 463 00:22:02,200 --> 00:22:04,240 Speaker 1: that's that's a good question. And if I actually knew 464 00:22:04,240 --> 00:22:06,879 Speaker 1: the answer, probably wouldn't be here in the studio today, 465 00:22:06,880 --> 00:22:09,720 Speaker 1: but you should be here even if you did have. 466 00:22:10,440 --> 00:22:14,760 Speaker 1: But I think before this month, ironically, I think the 467 00:22:14,800 --> 00:22:17,320 Speaker 1: outlook was, boy, it's gonna be tough for these folks 468 00:22:17,320 --> 00:22:21,879 Speaker 1: to get big increases in two because of some of 469 00:22:21,880 --> 00:22:24,000 Speaker 1: the pressure in the media space. But I think now 470 00:22:24,680 --> 00:22:26,439 Speaker 1: with some of the buoyancy that we've seen in the 471 00:22:26,480 --> 00:22:28,720 Speaker 1: last couple of deals. But I think again as importantly, 472 00:22:28,720 --> 00:22:31,080 Speaker 1: going back to this gambling issue, I think they're going 473 00:22:31,119 --> 00:22:34,159 Speaker 1: to be integrated kind of deals that might incorporate the 474 00:22:34,200 --> 00:22:36,879 Speaker 1: broadcast itself as well as the opportunity to promote in 475 00:22:36,920 --> 00:22:39,879 Speaker 1: market gambling within the games and leverage that online. So 476 00:22:39,920 --> 00:22:41,760 Speaker 1: I think, on the one hand, you'll see that, and 477 00:22:41,800 --> 00:22:43,239 Speaker 1: I think on the other thing, on the other hand, 478 00:22:43,280 --> 00:22:47,520 Speaker 1: you'll also see potentially joint bids that include traditional broadcasters 479 00:22:47,560 --> 00:22:49,720 Speaker 1: along with some of these new media folks like the 480 00:22:49,760 --> 00:22:52,760 Speaker 1: twitters and amazons, where the concept of having a game 481 00:22:52,800 --> 00:22:55,840 Speaker 1: in one place doesn't necessarily make sense anymore. It can 482 00:22:55,880 --> 00:22:59,040 Speaker 1: be broadcast one place but then be available somewhere else, 483 00:22:59,320 --> 00:23:01,960 Speaker 1: and those I numbers could be meaningful. I'm looking for 484 00:23:02,000 --> 00:23:04,240 Speaker 1: a lot of fun in the next year's because of 485 00:23:04,320 --> 00:23:07,720 Speaker 1: once something you said before, you said experimentation, and in 486 00:23:07,760 --> 00:23:09,960 Speaker 1: the conversation I had with Ted Leonsis on the day 487 00:23:10,040 --> 00:23:13,760 Speaker 1: the Supreme Court legalized sports betting, he said, everybody's looking 488 00:23:13,760 --> 00:23:17,080 Speaker 1: at my lacrosse team and my arena league team differently. 489 00:23:17,080 --> 00:23:19,600 Speaker 1: Now makes a lot of sense. He says he's going 490 00:23:19,640 --> 00:23:23,119 Speaker 1: to experiment with those teams and leagues like the w 491 00:23:23,200 --> 00:23:26,560 Speaker 1: n b A. We'll see experimentation and both in the broadcast, 492 00:23:26,640 --> 00:23:29,720 Speaker 1: in sports betting and seeing what appeals setting up the 493 00:23:29,800 --> 00:23:32,200 Speaker 1: day where those major rights fees come due. I'm curious 494 00:23:32,200 --> 00:23:34,360 Speaker 1: about whether you think we're going to see a lot 495 00:23:34,400 --> 00:23:37,600 Speaker 1: of fracturing in that next set. I mean, the UFC 496 00:23:37,680 --> 00:23:41,440 Speaker 1: had one partner, Fox, and now they've broken out into 497 00:23:41,480 --> 00:23:44,960 Speaker 1: a digital and a linear partner. Is the next round 498 00:23:45,000 --> 00:23:47,520 Speaker 1: going to be eight or eight or ten different digital partners? 499 00:23:47,560 --> 00:23:50,800 Speaker 1: Does Yeah who get two NFL games? Does Facebook get two? 500 00:23:50,840 --> 00:23:53,359 Speaker 1: Does Amazon get too? Does to Zone get too? And 501 00:23:53,400 --> 00:23:56,680 Speaker 1: then spread the linear the same way? Is there more 502 00:23:56,680 --> 00:23:58,679 Speaker 1: money that way? I? I don't. I don't think. I 503 00:23:58,680 --> 00:24:01,640 Speaker 1: think the experimentation that going on right now, one game here, 504 00:24:01,720 --> 00:24:05,000 Speaker 1: one game there. I think that's just what it is, experimentation. 505 00:24:05,040 --> 00:24:06,840 Speaker 1: I don't know how meaningful that really is in the 506 00:24:06,840 --> 00:24:09,000 Speaker 1: long run. I think what is meaningful is kind of 507 00:24:09,000 --> 00:24:12,000 Speaker 1: what ESPN is doing. Now. They've got the rights to 508 00:24:12,240 --> 00:24:15,000 Speaker 1: UFC television and they also have the rights to the 509 00:24:15,240 --> 00:24:18,680 Speaker 1: ESPN Plus product. They can cross promote, cross market reach 510 00:24:18,840 --> 00:24:21,679 Speaker 1: both audiences that the cord cutters as well as the 511 00:24:21,680 --> 00:24:24,119 Speaker 1: people who have cable and that stuff sinks together. I 512 00:24:24,160 --> 00:24:26,840 Speaker 1: think you're going to see more deals and opportunities like 513 00:24:26,880 --> 00:24:29,200 Speaker 1: that where it's really integrated, not just to throw away. 514 00:24:29,280 --> 00:24:31,359 Speaker 1: Let's put one game on Amazon or one game on Twitter. 515 00:24:31,440 --> 00:24:33,760 Speaker 1: How much longer do the folks and I'm just gonna 516 00:24:33,880 --> 00:24:36,760 Speaker 1: pick on them because it's the eight pound guerilla. Do 517 00:24:36,800 --> 00:24:40,960 Speaker 1: the folks that ESPN look at those subscriber numbers? How 518 00:24:40,960 --> 00:24:43,880 Speaker 1: long do they hold on and be like, well, one 519 00:24:43,960 --> 00:24:46,760 Speaker 1: subscriber linear TV and a cable bundle is worth X 520 00:24:46,880 --> 00:24:50,639 Speaker 1: versus an ESPN and plus subscriber. When doesn't it matter 521 00:24:50,760 --> 00:24:52,960 Speaker 1: where they have the customer in their universe? Well, I 522 00:24:53,000 --> 00:24:55,720 Speaker 1: think too. To ESPN it doesn't necessarily matter. But the 523 00:24:55,720 --> 00:24:59,119 Speaker 1: fact is they have existing contracts with cable operators that 524 00:24:59,160 --> 00:25:01,199 Speaker 1: pay them a lot of money for those subs, and 525 00:25:01,200 --> 00:25:03,480 Speaker 1: those contracts are going to extend for however that long 526 00:25:03,520 --> 00:25:06,240 Speaker 1: they're extending, And so I think it's an ESPN interest 527 00:25:06,280 --> 00:25:07,880 Speaker 1: to try to have their cake and eat it too, 528 00:25:08,119 --> 00:25:11,280 Speaker 1: to keep the existing cable universe intact and then try 529 00:25:11,320 --> 00:25:14,520 Speaker 1: to as aggressively as possible drive new subs digitally, but 530 00:25:14,680 --> 00:25:17,200 Speaker 1: subject to the contracts that they have. And this goes 531 00:25:17,280 --> 00:25:20,600 Speaker 1: back to what we were talking about earlier. Guys like me, 532 00:25:20,760 --> 00:25:24,760 Speaker 1: the geezer guys, we're not going to go away from cable. 533 00:25:25,520 --> 00:25:28,680 Speaker 1: That's always going to be there, So that audience will 534 00:25:28,760 --> 00:25:32,120 Speaker 1: always be there. Is just for how long I think 535 00:25:32,119 --> 00:25:34,719 Speaker 1: you're can be like the sixty minutes, you know, can 536 00:25:34,760 --> 00:25:37,800 Speaker 1: you aggregate the older skewing audience so you'll always have 537 00:25:37,840 --> 00:25:42,160 Speaker 1: a spot for the geezers like you, but increasingly as 538 00:25:42,200 --> 00:25:44,840 Speaker 1: you I'm gonna put this very nicely bar as you're 539 00:25:45,080 --> 00:25:50,160 Speaker 1: no longer watching TV or dying off. That was really nice. 540 00:25:50,240 --> 00:25:53,320 Speaker 1: But you do listen, you know christened earlier eighteen to 541 00:25:53,359 --> 00:25:56,359 Speaker 1: thirty four. This is about those who spend the cash 542 00:25:57,000 --> 00:25:59,800 Speaker 1: and how do you separate people from their cash? And 543 00:25:59,840 --> 00:26:02,080 Speaker 1: no but he but does that better than Amazon? And 544 00:26:02,200 --> 00:26:05,639 Speaker 1: they're involved in the world of sports, And do we 545 00:26:05,800 --> 00:26:09,760 Speaker 1: not talk about John Skipper coming back that that's interesting 546 00:26:09,760 --> 00:26:12,720 Speaker 1: to me, competing against the ESPN, you know it is, 547 00:26:12,880 --> 00:26:15,000 Speaker 1: it is to me. It's somewhat surprising that he came 548 00:26:15,040 --> 00:26:17,920 Speaker 1: back so fast. I mean, I always John is extremely 549 00:26:17,960 --> 00:26:20,080 Speaker 1: talented and he seems to still have a passion for 550 00:26:20,080 --> 00:26:22,960 Speaker 1: the industry. It does surprise me that he's back so fast, 551 00:26:23,000 --> 00:26:24,800 Speaker 1: because you would think when you leave there'd be some 552 00:26:25,240 --> 00:26:28,399 Speaker 1: level of a noncompete or sometime interim time or whatever. 553 00:26:28,440 --> 00:26:31,080 Speaker 1: But it is surprising that he came back. So for 554 00:26:31,080 --> 00:26:33,080 Speaker 1: those who don't know, Evan tell the audience. For those 555 00:26:33,119 --> 00:26:35,920 Speaker 1: who don't know John Skipper and what happened. John Skipper 556 00:26:36,000 --> 00:26:38,840 Speaker 1: was the president of ESPN. He left last year under 557 00:26:38,880 --> 00:26:43,320 Speaker 1: some suspicious and confusing circumstances. He cleared the air a 558 00:26:43,359 --> 00:26:46,280 Speaker 1: couple of months later, saying that he had a drug 559 00:26:46,320 --> 00:26:49,240 Speaker 1: problem and that he was the subject of an attempted 560 00:26:49,240 --> 00:26:52,399 Speaker 1: extortion as a result of that of that problem. And 561 00:26:52,440 --> 00:26:54,680 Speaker 1: he has popped up last week or a couple of 562 00:26:54,680 --> 00:26:57,600 Speaker 1: weeks ago. He is now running The Zone, which is 563 00:26:57,640 --> 00:27:00,800 Speaker 1: the over the top O t T digital UH news 564 00:27:00,840 --> 00:27:03,600 Speaker 1: network that launched part of Performed Group, but it is 565 00:27:03,680 --> 00:27:07,240 Speaker 1: launching in the US this year. It's doing so with 566 00:27:07,320 --> 00:27:12,160 Speaker 1: a one billion dollar investment into boxing of all sports. Chris, 567 00:27:12,160 --> 00:27:14,960 Speaker 1: how do you see the O T T battle playing 568 00:27:14,960 --> 00:27:17,720 Speaker 1: out two years or three years down the line? Is 569 00:27:17,760 --> 00:27:20,520 Speaker 1: it still ESPN plus and and Bleacher Report is the 570 00:27:20,520 --> 00:27:22,840 Speaker 1: top two? Where do you see to Zone and and 571 00:27:22,920 --> 00:27:25,320 Speaker 1: maybe even all these other ones kind of slotting in that. 572 00:27:25,520 --> 00:27:28,560 Speaker 1: I I believe the battle is still yet to be one, 573 00:27:28,720 --> 00:27:31,280 Speaker 1: in part because there are some major rights that could 574 00:27:31,359 --> 00:27:34,520 Speaker 1: ultimately drive this, including NFL rights going forward and other 575 00:27:34,640 --> 00:27:36,960 Speaker 1: rights from the major league. So right now, I think 576 00:27:37,000 --> 00:27:39,240 Speaker 1: we're still in early early days where you've got UFC, 577 00:27:39,240 --> 00:27:41,000 Speaker 1: you've got boxing, You've got some other things out there 578 00:27:41,000 --> 00:27:44,159 Speaker 1: which are valuable. But ultimately some of these major rights 579 00:27:44,200 --> 00:27:46,600 Speaker 1: are yet to be doled out, and that could have 580 00:27:46,640 --> 00:27:48,600 Speaker 1: a great influence on who the winners and losers are. 581 00:27:48,680 --> 00:27:51,040 Speaker 1: And let's talk to Zone for a second. They wanted 582 00:27:51,040 --> 00:27:54,440 Speaker 1: to launch in the US. Obviously a lot of basic 583 00:27:54,960 --> 00:27:58,520 Speaker 1: a lot of the premium rights were gobbled up. They decided, 584 00:27:58,560 --> 00:28:00,240 Speaker 1: we have a billion dollars, we want to do something 585 00:28:00,280 --> 00:28:02,359 Speaker 1: in the US. They looked at all the sports. They 586 00:28:02,359 --> 00:28:05,400 Speaker 1: decided boxing was the best chance. They built a property 587 00:28:05,400 --> 00:28:07,040 Speaker 1: around that, and that's going to be their way into 588 00:28:07,080 --> 00:28:09,600 Speaker 1: the US market. If I gave you an O T 589 00:28:09,680 --> 00:28:11,840 Speaker 1: T to launch in the US and a billion dollars, 590 00:28:12,840 --> 00:28:15,720 Speaker 1: how would you have spent it? Yeah, again, I that's 591 00:28:15,760 --> 00:28:18,080 Speaker 1: a that's a good question. I think I would clearly 592 00:28:18,320 --> 00:28:20,640 Speaker 1: think of a variety of sports, not not just one. 593 00:28:20,720 --> 00:28:23,280 Speaker 1: Boxing I think is distinctive in the sense that there's 594 00:28:23,320 --> 00:28:25,840 Speaker 1: a hardcore, passionate audience behind it, and that may be 595 00:28:25,920 --> 00:28:28,480 Speaker 1: a way to differentiate. But my sense is they're gonna 596 00:28:28,520 --> 00:28:30,879 Speaker 1: find a wide range of rights over time, and then 597 00:28:30,920 --> 00:28:33,359 Speaker 1: they're gonna try to make it very appealing to various 598 00:28:33,600 --> 00:28:36,920 Speaker 1: niche audiences and collect and aggregate that all into something meaningful. 599 00:28:37,040 --> 00:28:40,400 Speaker 1: The voices you recognize Michael Barr, Edbond, Novi Williams, and 600 00:28:40,480 --> 00:28:43,640 Speaker 1: our guest host Chris Russo from Juli Han Loki and 601 00:28:44,000 --> 00:28:46,920 Speaker 1: Bar and Chris, I want to ask you about the NFL. 602 00:28:47,000 --> 00:28:48,400 Speaker 1: Let's pivot a little bit. We all right, well, we 603 00:28:48,440 --> 00:28:50,120 Speaker 1: don't know where these rights are going. Where we have 604 00:28:50,200 --> 00:28:53,640 Speaker 1: this digital O T T versus linear, Let's see where 605 00:28:53,640 --> 00:28:56,360 Speaker 1: it plays out. But what about the NFL? Chris used 606 00:28:56,360 --> 00:29:00,480 Speaker 1: to work there. Are they doing a good job at 607 00:29:00,560 --> 00:29:02,720 Speaker 1: messaging and some you know what? You know what people 608 00:29:02,720 --> 00:29:04,720 Speaker 1: always ask me, how would the NFL be doing We 609 00:29:04,720 --> 00:29:06,920 Speaker 1: know they're making a lot of money, so that's good. 610 00:29:06,920 --> 00:29:11,080 Speaker 1: They're doing a good job. The question is would they 611 00:29:11,120 --> 00:29:16,320 Speaker 1: make more money? Can they make more money if managed differently? 612 00:29:16,720 --> 00:29:19,840 Speaker 1: Your take on how are they doing well? There's certainly 613 00:29:19,840 --> 00:29:22,320 Speaker 1: has been a lot of challenges of the last couple 614 00:29:22,360 --> 00:29:25,200 Speaker 1: of years from a from a communication standpoint, and but 615 00:29:25,240 --> 00:29:27,720 Speaker 1: I think in the long run the NFL is well 616 00:29:27,760 --> 00:29:30,840 Speaker 1: managed there. They do a great job of getting input 617 00:29:30,920 --> 00:29:33,200 Speaker 1: from a whole host of parties when they make decisions. 618 00:29:33,480 --> 00:29:37,840 Speaker 1: I think they're facing some broader topics and issues around 619 00:29:37,880 --> 00:29:41,360 Speaker 1: kind of youth participation in the sport going down. They were, 620 00:29:41,440 --> 00:29:44,480 Speaker 1: I think facing the issue of potential rights fee issues 621 00:29:44,560 --> 00:29:46,720 Speaker 1: because of the media landscape. But I think those are 622 00:29:46,720 --> 00:29:49,400 Speaker 1: maybe reversing. But I think generally speaking, they're going to 623 00:29:49,520 --> 00:29:51,280 Speaker 1: have a bright future and they tend to make the 624 00:29:51,360 --> 00:29:54,040 Speaker 1: right decisions in part because they have such a big 625 00:29:54,040 --> 00:29:56,920 Speaker 1: group of people helping to drive a consensus that usually 626 00:29:56,920 --> 00:29:59,920 Speaker 1: winds up being the right thing. Albeit some challenges over 627 00:30:00,040 --> 00:30:01,560 Speaker 1: past couple of years, but I think they can put 628 00:30:01,560 --> 00:30:04,600 Speaker 1: those behind them. My prediction looking at the Crystal ball 629 00:30:05,120 --> 00:30:09,320 Speaker 1: that one day the NBA will surpass all the other 630 00:30:09,360 --> 00:30:12,400 Speaker 1: sports because it's the perfect product. It's two and a 631 00:30:12,480 --> 00:30:16,800 Speaker 1: half hours. It's now for an audience for people, the 632 00:30:17,200 --> 00:30:18,560 Speaker 1: whole game is two and a half hours. Of the 633 00:30:18,560 --> 00:30:23,280 Speaker 1: final seven minutes that was just Adam Silver. I'm joking, 634 00:30:23,320 --> 00:30:26,800 Speaker 1: Michael Bass at the NBA. I'm joking, but you I 635 00:30:26,840 --> 00:30:29,120 Speaker 1: know you're you're bullish on the I am bullish on 636 00:30:29,160 --> 00:30:33,160 Speaker 1: the NBA. Global it's a global product to yeah, yeah, 637 00:30:33,200 --> 00:30:35,440 Speaker 1: I mean that that this is going to surpass one 638 00:30:35,520 --> 00:30:40,080 Speaker 1: day and unless the other sports catch up, the NBA 639 00:30:40,200 --> 00:30:42,920 Speaker 1: is going to be number one, Chris, do you see 640 00:30:42,960 --> 00:30:46,760 Speaker 1: in a world where the money increasingly is coming from media? 641 00:30:47,240 --> 00:30:49,640 Speaker 1: I believe this is the first season where media eclipsed 642 00:30:49,760 --> 00:30:54,200 Speaker 1: gate at an in stadium revenue. In a world of 643 00:30:54,960 --> 00:30:57,280 Speaker 1: O T T, in a world of let me cut 644 00:30:57,360 --> 00:30:59,480 Speaker 1: up my rights, in a world of selling highlights, of 645 00:30:59,520 --> 00:31:02,720 Speaker 1: selling the final minute of basketball games? Is the NBA 646 00:31:02,840 --> 00:31:05,800 Speaker 1: best positioned to drive revenue? You know? I would say 647 00:31:05,840 --> 00:31:07,800 Speaker 1: the NBA and the NFL. I would look at both 648 00:31:07,800 --> 00:31:09,720 Speaker 1: of them. I think the NBA, has has been pointed out, 649 00:31:09,760 --> 00:31:13,080 Speaker 1: has a great global footprint. They have a great young audience, 650 00:31:13,120 --> 00:31:16,080 Speaker 1: great social media following, so I think in many ways, 651 00:31:16,120 --> 00:31:19,560 Speaker 1: like soccer, they can be the pre eminent global sport. 652 00:31:20,040 --> 00:31:22,720 Speaker 1: But I do think the NFL has this event notion 653 00:31:22,800 --> 00:31:24,400 Speaker 1: that's still I guess it used to be once a 654 00:31:24,440 --> 00:31:25,920 Speaker 1: week now and maybe three or four times a week 655 00:31:25,960 --> 00:31:28,560 Speaker 1: depending was a mistake? Is it a mistake? Would you 656 00:31:28,600 --> 00:31:30,680 Speaker 1: have gone to? That's sort of saturation? I think the 657 00:31:30,720 --> 00:31:33,240 Speaker 1: saturation is starting to become a challenge again. I know 658 00:31:33,280 --> 00:31:35,360 Speaker 1: they thought carefully about that. I think what made the 659 00:31:35,440 --> 00:31:38,080 Speaker 1: NFL great was the kind of the event nature of 660 00:31:38,120 --> 00:31:41,200 Speaker 1: it that also drove things like fantasy and other kinds 661 00:31:41,240 --> 00:31:43,480 Speaker 1: of activities around it. So I think they're gonna have 662 00:31:43,560 --> 00:31:46,160 Speaker 1: to be thoughtful about how they allocate the product going forward. 663 00:31:47,440 --> 00:31:50,200 Speaker 1: I guess I asked this too, because we always used 664 00:31:50,240 --> 00:31:53,520 Speaker 1: to have the old Sunday games and then Monday night. 665 00:31:54,000 --> 00:31:56,120 Speaker 1: That was special, that was something that happened. But now, 666 00:31:56,160 --> 00:31:59,240 Speaker 1: like you said about the saturation, Yeah, a Thursday night game. 667 00:31:59,720 --> 00:32:02,160 Speaker 1: You have the Sunday one o'clock games, and you have 668 00:32:02,280 --> 00:32:04,800 Speaker 1: the four o'clock games, and then you have the Sunday 669 00:32:04,880 --> 00:32:07,680 Speaker 1: night football game, and then you have the Monday night 670 00:32:07,720 --> 00:32:12,360 Speaker 1: football game. I see, I've been getting agitated here. It's like, up, 671 00:32:13,080 --> 00:32:15,920 Speaker 1: you just called an NBA a perfect product, and NBA 672 00:32:15,960 --> 00:32:19,400 Speaker 1: plays on every night of the week. That may be true, 673 00:32:19,680 --> 00:32:22,360 Speaker 1: But at the same time, too, is that, Look, you're 674 00:32:22,400 --> 00:32:25,840 Speaker 1: talking about a sport in the NFL, or you've beaten 675 00:32:25,880 --> 00:32:29,000 Speaker 1: the living snot out of the other eleven guys, and 676 00:32:29,080 --> 00:32:32,960 Speaker 1: we wanted to increase this league in the games in 677 00:32:33,040 --> 00:32:37,680 Speaker 1: it to eighteen games and it's like, no, you can't 678 00:32:37,720 --> 00:32:39,880 Speaker 1: do that. The body's got to recover. I'm with you 679 00:32:39,880 --> 00:32:41,560 Speaker 1: on that. I mean, I don't think we should be 680 00:32:41,600 --> 00:32:43,520 Speaker 1: playing football every day of the week. I just the 681 00:32:43,760 --> 00:32:46,680 Speaker 1: oversaturation thing I don't fully under I mean every every 682 00:32:46,720 --> 00:32:50,080 Speaker 1: other sport. And almost coming from a guy, by the way, 683 00:32:50,080 --> 00:32:53,840 Speaker 1: who played something called lightweight football, just so you know, 684 00:32:54,120 --> 00:32:56,680 Speaker 1: coming from you, he likes to tell people and played 685 00:32:56,680 --> 00:32:59,160 Speaker 1: college football and then you know in parenthes, the silent 686 00:32:59,200 --> 00:33:07,480 Speaker 1: parentheses up wrap this up. It was it was really 687 00:33:07,520 --> 00:33:09,440 Speaker 1: getting good man. That's like, we're gonna be talking about 688 00:33:09,440 --> 00:33:12,960 Speaker 1: this more. By the way, Hart Ornstein, thank you for 689 00:33:13,000 --> 00:33:16,959 Speaker 1: listening to the show very much, and I appreciate the compliment. 690 00:33:17,720 --> 00:33:21,800 Speaker 1: But stay awake because Scott's got to tell this story 691 00:33:22,000 --> 00:33:23,800 Speaker 1: because I don't want you burning the hot. One of 692 00:33:23,800 --> 00:33:26,680 Speaker 1: our loyal listeners listening to the podcast on the way 693 00:33:26,720 --> 00:33:29,400 Speaker 1: home and tells me fell asleep on his New Jersey 694 00:33:29,440 --> 00:33:32,280 Speaker 1: transit ride, missed his stop and then had to uber 695 00:33:32,320 --> 00:33:35,560 Speaker 1: back home because the sultry, silky tones of Michael Barr 696 00:33:35,560 --> 00:33:38,320 Speaker 1: put them out go in b a our big thanks 697 00:33:38,360 --> 00:33:42,280 Speaker 1: to Bloomberg Sports reporter Evan Nobi Williams and a very 698 00:33:42,360 --> 00:33:46,040 Speaker 1: special thank you for our guest host, Chris Russo. Thank 699 00:33:46,080 --> 00:33:48,360 Speaker 1: you so much for joining us, Heir, thanks for including me. 700 00:33:48,640 --> 00:33:51,320 Speaker 1: You've been listening to Bloomberg Business of Sports. I'm Michael 701 00:33:51,320 --> 00:33:53,480 Speaker 1: barn and I'm Scott sash Nick. Thanks for joining us, 702 00:33:53,480 --> 00:33:55,479 Speaker 1: and you can listen to us talk to the biggest 703 00:33:55,480 --> 00:33:57,959 Speaker 1: and brightest in the sports industry every Friday at eight 704 00:33:58,000 --> 00:34:00,200 Speaker 1: p m, Saturday at noon, and Sunday at four am 705 00:34:00,280 --> 00:34:03,360 Speaker 1: Eastern Time here on Bloomberg Radio. You're listening to Bloomberg 706 00:34:03,400 --> 00:34:06,200 Speaker 1: Business of Sports from Bloomberg Radio around the world and 707 00:34:06,240 --> 00:34:08,680 Speaker 1: online as an Apple podcast on iTunes.