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Speaker 1: Who baby, my baby, I need you, Oh how I

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Speaker 1: need you? What to Expect? As a production of I

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Speaker 1: Heart Radio, I'm your host Heidi Murkoff and I'm a

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Speaker 1: mom on a mission, a mission to help you know

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Speaker 1: what to expect every step of the way. You've seen

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Speaker 1: her on The Today Show, Good Morning America, The View,

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Speaker 1: and Sarah Strahan and Kiki on ABC. Sarah Hans is

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Speaker 1: a pro at bringing you the news and sharing inspiring

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Speaker 1: stories from around the country. But today she's getting personal,

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Speaker 1: sharing her own story of motherhood, balancing her kids, her career,

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Speaker 1: and her marriage. Plus she's opening up about an issue

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Speaker 1: that's personal to her, body shaming. We're going to find

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Speaker 1: out how Sarah shut down the haters and hear her message,

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Speaker 1: which I gotta say sounds a lot like my message.

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Speaker 1: There is no shame in the mom game or judgment

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Speaker 1: at least there shouldn't be. So welcome, Sarah, thank you.

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Speaker 1: I'm so happy to be here. I wanted to say

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Speaker 1: a big, happy, belated first birthday to Caleb because I've

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Speaker 1: heard he just turned the big zero one. We made it,

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Speaker 1: We made it through the first year. You're on your

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Speaker 1: own now. I got you covered and I've pretty much

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Speaker 1: put him on his own. Yeah, how did you guys celebrate?

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Speaker 1: We're kind of lazy parents when it comes to the

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Speaker 1: first couple of birthdays because we don't do a lot

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Speaker 1: of sugar in our household, to a lot of those

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Speaker 1: pictures of the cake and so uh, I think for

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Speaker 1: Alec we didn't celebrate until he was or um. But

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Speaker 1: for Caleb because now the other the the siblings know,

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Speaker 1: So we made a special little cake. Every time we

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Speaker 1: come into a room on someone's birthday, we sing to them.

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Speaker 1: So it was all day my family calling in. Everyone

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Speaker 1: always has to sing their FaceTime sessions and so up

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Speaker 1: Hill he went to bed. When he goes down first,

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Speaker 1: we're like one more time, guys, family sing, and so

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Speaker 1: all day long it was Caleb Caleb game. So you

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Speaker 1: have three little so you have three four and under right, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: not Max, that's my husband, Alex Alex. Yes, oh my gosh.

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Speaker 1: Alec turned four in March, so he's just a little

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Speaker 1: over four. He's our oldest in Sanders two and a half.

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Speaker 1: And then Caleb is the big one. Which was the

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Speaker 1: hardest transition from one to two or two to three kids,

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Speaker 1: zero to one, like that's the zero one. I always

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Speaker 1: say to everyone that every I mean, clearly it gets

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Speaker 1: more in the logistics of all of it are harder

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Speaker 1: the more the less hands you have, and the more

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Speaker 1: kids you have here or laps. Yeah, I think the

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Speaker 1: the transition from zero to one was the most life altering. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I have to agree with you there. So, but between

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Speaker 1: one and two and two to three, Um, was there

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Speaker 1: really a significant difference? It's weird. I feel so hazy

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Speaker 1: on even remembering when I'm like, when when was when

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Speaker 1: were there only two? Um? So I guess I guess

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Speaker 1: I'd have to say two to three because you know, um,

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Speaker 1: after Alec, everything was the other two I've been really easy.

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Speaker 1: So again Alec being now knowing all three of them

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Speaker 1: a little better. Uh, anything that involves Alec is harder.

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Speaker 1: So oh good. So I think that Caleb is going

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Speaker 1: to be a really sweet boy because no one pays

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Speaker 1: any attention to him, so he's going to have this

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Speaker 1: humility and that is I'm a third child, so I

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Speaker 1: practically right too. I always tell people I was like,

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Speaker 1: by the third child, I mean, your parents really nail it.

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Speaker 1: How I turned out totally totally. I won't I won't

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Speaker 1: disparage number one and number two in my family. But

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Speaker 1: I have to say it does give you a lot

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Speaker 1: more resilience. And it's funny because I was going to

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Speaker 1: ask you about that because moms tend to get more

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Speaker 1: relaxed with each kid. So the first one, you know,

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Speaker 1: they fall down and you're like, oh my god, are

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Speaker 1: you okay? Then with the second one, you're like, puppy go,

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Speaker 1: and then the third one like nothing's broken, you're breathing.

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Speaker 1: What about your pregnancies where they each different? Of course

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Speaker 1: they were. They were all different. My hardest one. I

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Speaker 1: had postpartum after the first and the third. So everything

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Speaker 1: about Sandra, and I don't think it has to do

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Speaker 1: with her being my one girl. It just happens to

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Speaker 1: be her. But everything around that pregnancy was good because

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Speaker 1: on the heels of postpartum and fully expecting i'd have

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Speaker 1: it again, when everything was easier and more enjoyable and

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Speaker 1: I was laxed, I was like, oh, this is why

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Speaker 1: people have ten like I love this. And then I

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Speaker 1: was so busy and we didn't quite not that anyone

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Speaker 1: really plans the timing. But when when I got pregnant

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Speaker 1: with Caleb, it was the first time i'd ever said

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Speaker 1: out loud because I felt so blessed that we had

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Speaker 1: our you know, our two kids, and I was good

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Speaker 1: that the three would be a beautiful bonus, but that

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Speaker 1: when we got pregnant, I said, this is not the

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Speaker 1: time to have a baby, like I can't have one mentally,

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Speaker 1: I'm not ready. And then it was like I said

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Speaker 1: that out loud, and I think I found out a

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Speaker 1: week later, two weeks later that I was pregnant. And

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Speaker 1: it was the one time that I risked jenks in

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Speaker 1: my womb by saying, we're good. We always wanted a third,

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Speaker 1: but I'll let you know when that's a healthy mental decision.

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Speaker 1: It's not now. My husband agreed, and then he came,

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Speaker 1: so um it was. And then with that one, I

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Speaker 1: just didn't pay attention. It was full survival mode. And

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Speaker 1: then I ended up with postpartum after him as well.

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Speaker 1: So the first and third were definitely the hardest. Did

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Speaker 1: you have pregnancy depression as well, like when you found

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Speaker 1: out you were pregnant the third time? Did you have

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Speaker 1: any of that, like mixed feelings that you felt guilty about? Yeah,

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Speaker 1: so I had it. I always wanted babies, so I

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Speaker 1: never understood why I could have depression while being pregnant,

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Speaker 1: and then this New York Times article came out when

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Speaker 1: I was pregnant with Alec and it was about I

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Speaker 1: think it's called perinatal depression. So um. I think the

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Speaker 1: postpartum caught me off guard because when I realized, oh, perinatal,

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Speaker 1: this is what this looks like, postpartum looked so different

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Speaker 1: that I didn't realize you could be struck twice, you know,

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Speaker 1: by lightning and in with the same child. So um

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Speaker 1: I And then I definitely had it with Caleb. But

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Speaker 1: I really could barely say that out loud because I

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Speaker 1: always felt like, you look around and so many people

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Speaker 1: struggle to have babies, and at so many people in

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Speaker 1: my life, so many people close to me I can't

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Speaker 1: even fathom. So I almost in a quiet room by myself,

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Speaker 1: couldn't say out loud, I can't believe this, well, you know,

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Speaker 1: and I feel like, I'm sure you agree that actually

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Speaker 1: we do have to say it out loud to help

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Speaker 1: other moms cope with it, because so many times I get,

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Speaker 1: you know, I get messages on Instagram, and my heart

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Speaker 1: breaks for these moms because they feel like they have

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Speaker 1: to be so strong. You know, it's good to say

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Speaker 1: it without any guilt whatsoever, because there's never to be

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Speaker 1: any guilt about it. It's weird because I would say

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Speaker 1: that someone wants gave me the best advice. They said,

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Speaker 1: treat yourself like you treat your best friend. I never

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Speaker 1: effatuate that advice, but I would tell my best friend

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Speaker 1: say it out loud, it's okay, Like I can give

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Speaker 1: that advice because I do believe it's okay. I can

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Speaker 1: view someone with more layers and grace than I can myself.

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Speaker 1: So I think that I totally try to talk about

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Speaker 1: it because I believe exactly what you're saying that. I

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Speaker 1: believe more people struggled and we'll ever know. I think

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Speaker 1: talking about it is the only thing that helps because eventually,

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Speaker 1: whether it's therapy or support in friend groups or a minister,

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Speaker 1: however you find your help. If you don't say I

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Speaker 1: need help, then there's there's just no hope. So I

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Speaker 1: agree with you, Well, you know, sometimes being strong means

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Speaker 1: asking for help, and I think that's that's really the

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Speaker 1: bottom line with that. So what about like every mom

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Speaker 1: out there, right, you have a job, and you have

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Speaker 1: a day job, and both are super demanding. You can't

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Speaker 1: exactly fake it on camera, So how do you manage

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Speaker 1: to balance it all? And I know, you know there

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Speaker 1: are balls in the air. Sometimes they drop and that's

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Speaker 1: okay because we're all moms here, we can admit that

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Speaker 1: we dropped the balls, hopefully not the baby, but that

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Speaker 1: you know that happens occasionally, Yeah, it happens. So what's

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Speaker 1: your secret? My secret is uh I I definitely when

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Speaker 1: I'm on camera there's such a presence of mind that

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Speaker 1: and I feed off people's energy. I I've been that

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Speaker 1: wait wait before I was on air, Like my personality

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Speaker 1: from the moment I leave, whether it's a a neighbor,

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Speaker 1: a mailman, a doorman, and it doesn't matter who it is.

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Speaker 1: I feed off the human soul like not like in

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Speaker 1: a gross vampire way, look a good way. So when

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Speaker 1: I see people, I am so eager to connect that

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Speaker 1: there's this energy, this energy that just since I was

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Speaker 1: a kid, always comes out of me. So with TV

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Speaker 1: and my job being that, I get to make people smile,

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Speaker 1: I get a connect, I get to talk. Everything you

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Speaker 1: see in my job is so real because I'm constantly

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Speaker 1: surrounded by all these points of light. You know all

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Speaker 1: these people, and in those moments, it's actually easy to

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Speaker 1: be present and easy, uh to feel whatever is going

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Speaker 1: on in that moment. The harder part is at home.

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Speaker 1: I think, uh, one, it's hard at home in general.

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Speaker 1: I'm better at my other job. But no, I just

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Speaker 1: had a moment this morning where I snapped at I

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Speaker 1: was doing laundry and Sandra was at want the babies asleep,

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Speaker 1: and Sandra was screaming because she wanted to be with me,

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Speaker 1: and I brought her up to the laundry room and

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Speaker 1: she's fussing and asking a question. And before I paused

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Speaker 1: to listen to what she was saying, I said, you know,

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Speaker 1: the Washington scene machine is not a toy, Sandra, And

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Speaker 1: I was like snapping at her, and she looks up

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Speaker 1: at me and she has this lip and she's like,

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Speaker 1: you didn't answer me, Mama, you didn't answer me. And

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Speaker 1: she had asked me like just what is it? And

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Speaker 1: I was so busy moving on and defaulting to getting

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Speaker 1: something done that she wasn't playing with it. She was

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Speaker 1: pointing and asking and so I've had to learn to

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Speaker 1: like get down on the ground with her. And I said,

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Speaker 1: you know, like Daniel Tiger Sandra. Mom is not always

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Speaker 1: good with her patients, Like I was frustrated, and so

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Speaker 1: I've had to become My parents weren't like that with

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Speaker 1: their feelings. But I think it's important to arm my

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Speaker 1: kids with all the range of emotions and parents imperfection

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Speaker 1: young um totally. That pedestal fall is pretty severe. When

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Speaker 1: you become an adult, you have to figure out that

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Speaker 1: there's no perfect humans, and so, uh, I have to

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Speaker 1: work on it a lot. It's with kids. There's also

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Speaker 1: the power dynamic. I'm in charge and they aren't, so

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Speaker 1: I can get very quickly in disciples of just getting

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Speaker 1: things done and not stopping to truly collaborate or cooperate

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Speaker 1: or communicate. And so I think work is harder the

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Speaker 1: moods and the it's hard faking. I don't. I'm not

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Speaker 1: able to fake it at home, but I think I

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Speaker 1: feel more of those seasons of change at home than

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Speaker 1: I do at work. Absolutely. And I think the takeaway,

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Speaker 1: which is a really smart one, is that there's no

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Speaker 1: such thing as a perfect mom a perfect parent, because

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Speaker 1: we're human parents. There's so much pressure from so many

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Speaker 1: different sides, and you know, especially on social media, everybody

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Speaker 1: it's always pressuring you and saying, you know, this is

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Speaker 1: how you become a perfect parent. You can't be. So

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Speaker 1: you're really smart about that and you dealt with her

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Speaker 1: just perfectly. That was the best response. You know, we're

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Speaker 1: all going to snap once in a while a lot,

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Speaker 1: you know, when you have three little ones and they're

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Speaker 1: all screaming for your attention at the same time. It's

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Speaker 1: it's super hard. I love the show you do with

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Speaker 1: Max called Couples in Quarantine. I'm a little insulted you

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Speaker 1: haven't asked me and Eric yet, but that's I'm just kidding.

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Speaker 1: But you know you're open for that because we're recording

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Speaker 1: right now, so I now know that that yes, and

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Speaker 1: just another good excuse to be in bed with him.

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Speaker 1: But really, you get to be in bed with Max,

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Speaker 1: you know, while you're filming this and and so how

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Speaker 1: is your coupling going in quarantine? But also, you know,

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Speaker 1: having three little ones, I mean, it's it's hard to

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Speaker 1: prioritize everything in your life, but that's probably the most

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Speaker 1: important relationship up of all in my opinion. Yeah, I

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Speaker 1: think one thing my parents did really right is they

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Speaker 1: didn't tell us this, but they raised us like we

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Speaker 1: were secondary to their like they were in charge of

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Speaker 1: their life was center. They were together and we were not.

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Speaker 1: I remember seeing an OPRAH episode about twenty years ago

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Speaker 1: where the whole episode was about a mom said I

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Speaker 1: love my husband more than my kids, and by the end,

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Speaker 1: you of course agree with her. I fully believe with

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Speaker 1: that that the marriage comes first and the kids are

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Speaker 1: a chapter, a beautiful, chaotic, crazy and amazing chapter all

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Speaker 1: at once. But that uh, at the end, Max will

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Speaker 1: be here with me, and if I did a good job,

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Speaker 1: we did a good job with the kids, they'll be

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Speaker 1: gone and so um and we we want to be

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Speaker 1: one of those healthy versions of love that Kathie Lee

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Speaker 1: Gifford used to say something brilliant. She said, I let

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Speaker 1: my kids know that they're the center of my world,

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Speaker 1: but not the center of the world. And if that's

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Speaker 1: knowing they are small parts of a massive global world

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Speaker 1: and beyond is one of my our number one tasks

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Speaker 1: in raising them. So we definitely don't do the as much,

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Speaker 1: you know, date nights and things that we aim to

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Speaker 1: eventually do because the kids are so young and pandemic

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Speaker 1: has been really hard because Max is a lawyer and

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Speaker 1: he's a pretty cool cucumber. But to have the kids

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Speaker 1: on top of his job and on top of taking

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Speaker 1: care of anything I'm going through has been really, really hard.

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Speaker 1: But the thing I love about Max is we're both

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Speaker 1: we bonded. The number one thing that made us know

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Speaker 1: we were right for each other was we both admittedly

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Speaker 1: lived our lives like we're works in progress. And so

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Speaker 1: he's the one person I can come back to and

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Speaker 1: whether it's a parenting moment, a life moment, um, he

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Speaker 1: sees my worst sides. But then he'll often be the

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Speaker 1: first person I come to and I'm like, you know,

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Speaker 1: I was thinking about that, and this is what I think.

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Speaker 1: He's a collaborator in moving forward, Like we both admit

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Speaker 1: we're imperfect for today and hopefully a little better tomorrow

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Speaker 1: and the day after that. And so um, I would

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Speaker 1: say that in the parenting we're always putting our heads

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Speaker 1: together on how we want to lead because we believe

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Speaker 1: in the United Front. So um, yes, oh totally, it's

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Speaker 1: a team. Yeah. I would never do this alone. I

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Speaker 1: respect single parents more than ever, Like, I could never

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Speaker 1: do this by myself. But what you said is that

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Speaker 1: you know you're United Front. And I tell that to

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Speaker 1: parents all the time, because there will be times when

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Speaker 1: you disagree about, you know, a certain parenting issue, but

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Speaker 1: you have to talk about it and come to agreement

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Speaker 1: because kids are easily confused when all the rules are

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Speaker 1: different depending on who's in charge. You know, the rules

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Speaker 1: can be a little bit different at Grandma's, but still,

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Speaker 1: you know, there's got to be consistency. That's, you know,

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Speaker 1: the golden rule of parenting. Yes, and so if you're

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Speaker 1: on different pages, it's it makes the kids feel insecure, absolutely,

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Speaker 1: you know, because fetuses grow up into baby, and babies

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Speaker 1: grow up into children, and children grow up and move

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Speaker 1: away from home. Like you were saying, that that partner

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Speaker 1: is yours for life, and so that's the priority relationship.

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Speaker 1: And I also think there's something that as I when

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Speaker 1: I saw that Oprah episode, I had stopped believing in

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Speaker 1: romance because I was single at the time. But I thought,

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Speaker 1: if I get married and I have kids and this

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Speaker 1: whole soccer mom generation where I have to live for

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Speaker 1: my kids every day, what's the point? And I remember

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Speaker 1: thinking that I don't want my kids to be around

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Speaker 1: someone who has running so haggard and only worried about them,

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Speaker 1: to the point that they don't see a loving friendship

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Speaker 1: and relationship and at times difficult communication. I want to

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Speaker 1: arm them with the tools of what that is and

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Speaker 1: what it looks like. So you've interviewed so many incredible

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Speaker 1: women during your career, and a lot of them I'm

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Speaker 1: sure mom's celebrity, mom's, mom's on the street. Do you

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Speaker 1: have a favorite mom's story. One mom I've always admired

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Speaker 1: and loved is Meredith he Eira, And I think it's because, um,

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Speaker 1: I probably have a lot of moms stories along the way,

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Speaker 1: because I think we gravitate towards people that inspire and

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Speaker 1: you find hoping and so people that are buried in

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Speaker 1: the same things you're in, you're like, oh, please show

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Speaker 1: me that we make it through this. But one thing

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Speaker 1: I always loved about Meredith is she left her career

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Speaker 1: at a pretty top peak to be a mom, And

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Speaker 1: not that I think you have to do either or

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Speaker 1: I fully support and believe people can do both. I

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Speaker 1: think a lot of people in life and at the

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Speaker 1: very end regretting which road they chose in a fork

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Speaker 1: and whether that was in literal choice or a mental

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Speaker 1: presence or whatever it is, we often look back and

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Speaker 1: forgot what really mattered. And I think the fact that

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Speaker 1: she continually comes back to her north star, which is

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Speaker 1: her kids and her husband. I think you can have

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Speaker 1: all those meaningful, loving relationships and still be ambitious and amazing.

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Speaker 1: But I'm always inspired by people that have that wisdom

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Speaker 1: before end of life to say I knew what mattered.

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Speaker 1: I knew what mattered when there were other amazing things

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Speaker 1: being offered to me that are sparkly and distracting, and

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Speaker 1: I chose the right thing. Now that's inspiring. Yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: So what's the best advice who ever got as a mom?

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Speaker 1: To go easy on yourself and that whole put your

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Speaker 1: own your own mask on first. I think as literally

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Speaker 1: literally I hope there are masks on this plane. But

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Speaker 1: I think as women before I was even a mom.

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Speaker 1: And this is a total stereotype. I'm strong, I'm using

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Speaker 1: broad strokes, but every woman I met was so overly

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Speaker 1: burden by taking on the world, and and then they

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Speaker 1: become mothers, which amplifies it, and it gives them more

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Speaker 1: people to mama bear and fight for, and it almost

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Speaker 1: enhances it to a level that you're like, there's got

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Speaker 1: to be a moment to take a break and I

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Speaker 1: think as someone who grew up under a mom who

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Speaker 1: didn't did at all in a way. She was a nurse,

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Speaker 1: but off and on throughout our childhoods and then ran

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Speaker 1: us to all our lessons and clean the house and

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Speaker 1: cooked and was a wife, a devoted wife, all those hats.

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Speaker 1: I sometimes set the bar so high, um and think

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Speaker 1: I need to do it all without forgetting, without remembering

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Speaker 1: that to be the type of mom I want to

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Speaker 1: be that remembers to eye to eye, I'm sorry I

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Speaker 1: wasn't listening, that has the moments to realize, I'm I've

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Speaker 1: lost control. I can't be stretched to the borders of

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Speaker 1: my capacity every day. And I think that means it's

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Speaker 1: not about just taking care of myself. Even if you

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Speaker 1: can only see it through a prism of being good

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Speaker 1: for your kids, you still can't be good for your

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Speaker 1: kids unless you take care of yourself. Bingo. And it's

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Speaker 1: probably one of the best lessons that you're teaching your kids, right,

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Speaker 1: I hope, So, I hope some of the stuff is sticking.

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Speaker 1: I mean, it sounds like you're you're teaching them a

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Speaker 1: lot of really good lessons and being a role model,

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Speaker 1: and the two of you in your relationship. Thank you,

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Speaker 1: but you're not perfect because nobody knows. No mom is

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Speaker 1: the first one to say that. So what about all

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Speaker 1: the advice that pregnant women get, A new mom's get

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Speaker 1: that you don't ask for, right, because it's all of

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Speaker 1: a sudden, you're like community property. Did you notice that

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Speaker 1: when you're pregnant? I think the biggest thing is the

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Speaker 1: invisible factor. No one warned you that the second you

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Speaker 1: announce your pregnant one whoever knows, even if it's the

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Speaker 1: secret inner circle, you will rarely hear people ask you

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Speaker 1: how you're doing. It's always within regard to the baby

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Speaker 1: and the pregnancy. And although we have to remind people

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Speaker 1: were not broken, we're just pregnant. I would think you

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Speaker 1: were broken because all people want to know about is

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Speaker 1: the baby. And it's not that that's not beautiful and exciting,

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Speaker 1: but I think it's the beginning of the journey of

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Speaker 1: just feeling in the back seat like you're expected to drive,

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Speaker 1: but you're in the back seat because stop seeing you

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Speaker 1: as a human, they start seeing only the baby, and

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Speaker 1: you're still operating at full capacity. But to other people,

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Speaker 1: there's a red flag on you, and you're just pregnant

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Speaker 1: and that that's uh. That was a hard uh juxtaposition

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Speaker 1: for me. Right, did you ever get any you know,

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Speaker 1: saying about your choices? Oh, my gosh, Like where do

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Speaker 1: I start? Um? I can't even There were a couple

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Speaker 1: of times, like my doctors were very lenient on what

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Speaker 1: I ate, you know, they were saying times have changed,

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Speaker 1: and there was a time where people were very strict

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Speaker 1: and my doctor was always things like, you can eat

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Speaker 1: sushi as long as at high level you're not eating

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Speaker 1: it at like the grocery store, you know, like you

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Speaker 1: don't want to take risks. Uh, And so I would

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Speaker 1: eat things, and I felt like every time I was

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Speaker 1: out in public someone was looking at me. I got

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Speaker 1: paranoid to the point that I would hide my stomach

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Speaker 1: because I didn't care if you just didn't like my sweater.

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Speaker 1: If I saw you looking at me, I knew you

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Speaker 1: were judging something. And it's already such. But you're already

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Speaker 1: judging yourself so much as you enter parenthood, I don't

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Speaker 1: need everyone else to join. I'm doing well enough beating

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Speaker 1: myself up without your help. So you did make headlines

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Speaker 1: about a topic that I hear from moms about all

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Speaker 1: the time the body shaming after your third baby, which

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Speaker 1: I find inexplicable, But can you explain what happened as

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Speaker 1: someone who's been on air through three pregnancies. Um, I

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Speaker 1: without a pregnancy and without a body shaming. The amount

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Speaker 1: of things you see negatively posted about you are just endless,

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Speaker 1: and you know so now at anybody changes. And the

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Speaker 1: amount of times I was pregnant before I was pregnant

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Speaker 1: was hilarious because it could have been, you know, like

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Speaker 1: any time you looked wrong in the angle, you must

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Speaker 1: be pregnant, which is different. But finally I decided to

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Speaker 1: address it. And it's weird because it didn't hurt my

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Speaker 1: I mean, the amount of things I've heard now about

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Speaker 1: me directed at me that are awful and offensive whatever, like,

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Speaker 1: I don't think you ever feel good as a pregnant woman.

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Speaker 1: But I had a professional stylist dressing me, and so

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Speaker 1: I would say, I'm not taking credit for my clothes.

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Speaker 1: I think she did a beautiful job. And my belly

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Speaker 1: button pops each pregnancy. And there was a man. Usually

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Speaker 1: it's women, by the way, but it was a man

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Speaker 1: that wrote some thing about how he could barely watch

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Speaker 1: the TV because my belly button was so disgusting, Dan

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Speaker 1: and yeah and I. The first thing people say is

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Speaker 1: don't read the comments. But the reason I always pushed

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Speaker 1: back on that is my whole career started with Kathie

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Speaker 1: Leonhoda reading social media. I was in I was raised

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Speaker 1: in Iowa, never or had been in a TV studio,

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Speaker 1: so I always said I could relate more to the

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Speaker 1: people outside the window on the Today Show Plaza than

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Speaker 1: the people inside. Social media changed that because we became

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Speaker 1: one click away from people like myself who would never

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Speaker 1: be near those studios, but all of a sudden, are

429
00:24:14,440 --> 00:24:17,560
Speaker 1: voice counted and it mattered. So my whole career began

430
00:24:17,800 --> 00:24:22,280
Speaker 1: by going back and forth and engaging people. It's become

431
00:24:22,280 --> 00:24:25,000
Speaker 1: and as you know with your career, it's become a

432
00:24:25,040 --> 00:24:29,160
Speaker 1: really essential tool to hearing back from people, from continuing

433
00:24:29,200 --> 00:24:33,400
Speaker 1: conversations to sometimes changing my opinion based on what someone says.

434
00:24:34,040 --> 00:24:37,639
Speaker 1: It's a beautiful place that I refuse to avoid just

435
00:24:37,760 --> 00:24:41,040
Speaker 1: because of trolls. So I don't think not reading the

436
00:24:41,080 --> 00:24:43,320
Speaker 1: comments is the answer. I think knowing when you're in

437
00:24:43,359 --> 00:24:46,560
Speaker 1: the right place to read the comments is important, and

438
00:24:46,640 --> 00:24:48,960
Speaker 1: walking away when you realize something got to you in

439
00:24:48,960 --> 00:24:51,200
Speaker 1: a way that you know you need to step away,

440
00:24:51,200 --> 00:24:54,560
Speaker 1: and that particular day that you're talking about. Um, I

441
00:24:54,600 --> 00:24:56,760
Speaker 1: have a little I have a little pooch, And when

442
00:24:56,760 --> 00:24:59,199
Speaker 1: I say I love it, I'm not just trying to

443
00:24:59,240 --> 00:25:03,720
Speaker 1: empower everyone. I actually looked down, and because I've been

444
00:25:03,800 --> 00:25:07,359
Speaker 1: so close and empathized with people that have struggled, I

445
00:25:07,480 --> 00:25:10,360
Speaker 1: look down and that's my little my little sweet war

446
00:25:10,400 --> 00:25:13,880
Speaker 1: wound of it housed my three babies, and like, when

447
00:25:13,920 --> 00:25:16,720
Speaker 1: I look at it, my body was able to come

448
00:25:16,760 --> 00:25:19,160
Speaker 1: through for me. I was able to you know, I've

449
00:25:19,200 --> 00:25:21,840
Speaker 1: had women. My two best friends have lost their breast

450
00:25:21,880 --> 00:25:23,760
Speaker 1: to breast cancer. I look at my boobs and they

451
00:25:23,840 --> 00:25:27,320
Speaker 1: sag and I'm like, but they're there, and they didn't,

452
00:25:28,000 --> 00:25:30,080
Speaker 1: you know. So I look at my body in a

453
00:25:30,160 --> 00:25:32,760
Speaker 1: different way with a wisdom at forty two than I

454
00:25:32,800 --> 00:25:35,760
Speaker 1: did any year before this, Like I've I look at

455
00:25:35,800 --> 00:25:39,680
Speaker 1: it as a functioning, healthy body. So my stomach poches,

456
00:25:39,800 --> 00:25:42,280
Speaker 1: and I actually am lighter than I've been since before

457
00:25:42,320 --> 00:25:44,680
Speaker 1: I had kids. So when I say I actually feel

458
00:25:44,720 --> 00:25:46,960
Speaker 1: really good, I mean even in the most shallow way.

459
00:25:47,119 --> 00:25:51,520
Speaker 1: My numbers have me feeling very competent, but my stomach pooches.

460
00:25:52,080 --> 00:25:55,000
Speaker 1: So one day that this this person came for me

461
00:25:55,040 --> 00:25:57,280
Speaker 1: about how I know you're you know, you must be pregnant,

462
00:25:57,359 --> 00:26:00,840
Speaker 1: and all this stuff, and what bothered and that is

463
00:26:00,880 --> 00:26:04,480
Speaker 1: that I'm one of the lucky ones. I stand here

464
00:26:04,520 --> 00:26:08,600
Speaker 1: with three kids. I stand here uh able to have

465
00:26:08,720 --> 00:26:11,959
Speaker 1: babies and with the luxury and privilege of having babies

466
00:26:12,000 --> 00:26:14,280
Speaker 1: in a way that so many people can't these days.

467
00:26:14,320 --> 00:26:19,280
Speaker 1: For whatever reason, all ages um women are struggling, and

468
00:26:20,280 --> 00:26:24,440
Speaker 1: that could bring someone to their knees. They were trying

469
00:26:24,480 --> 00:26:27,520
Speaker 1: to have a baby, if they were possibly in fertility

470
00:26:27,600 --> 00:26:31,359
Speaker 1: and having hormonal responses, if they were just depressed and

471
00:26:31,440 --> 00:26:34,679
Speaker 1: eating their feelings and had a pooch, or they may

472
00:26:34,680 --> 00:26:38,280
Speaker 1: be decided not to have kids, and you're assigning them

473
00:26:38,280 --> 00:26:41,680
Speaker 1: once again and defining them by just their ovaries. Everything

474
00:26:41,720 --> 00:26:45,879
Speaker 1: about it, to me paints women into a box that

475
00:26:45,960 --> 00:26:49,399
Speaker 1: can be so painful. And as I addressed that person,

476
00:26:49,440 --> 00:26:51,480
Speaker 1: I wanted them to know you're lucky you picked up

477
00:26:51,680 --> 00:26:54,440
Speaker 1: on me, because I have to string to swing back.

478
00:26:54,960 --> 00:26:58,120
Speaker 1: But I'm swinging back for all those people that are

479
00:26:58,320 --> 00:27:01,199
Speaker 1: on the floor crying because of what you've done and

480
00:27:01,200 --> 00:27:04,560
Speaker 1: what you probably continue to do online and in life everywhere.

481
00:27:04,800 --> 00:27:07,280
Speaker 1: So I was fighting from a place of strength for

482
00:27:07,359 --> 00:27:09,920
Speaker 1: something that I realized people have to stop doing. They

483
00:27:09,960 --> 00:27:13,040
Speaker 1: have to stop defining women by their uterus. They have

484
00:27:13,160 --> 00:27:15,320
Speaker 1: to stop asking about it. It's none of their business

485
00:27:15,560 --> 00:27:17,760
Speaker 1: if no one engages them and no one announces it.

486
00:27:17,760 --> 00:27:19,520
Speaker 1: And the amount of people that say, I knew you

487
00:27:19,520 --> 00:27:21,560
Speaker 1: were pregnant, I was just waiting for you to tell me.

488
00:27:21,760 --> 00:27:24,199
Speaker 1: I'm kind of like, that's fine, but guess what. No

489
00:27:24,280 --> 00:27:27,200
Speaker 1: cookies are handed out for knowing. You can sit around

490
00:27:27,320 --> 00:27:30,320
Speaker 1: and ponder who else in the world is pregnant. But

491
00:27:30,359 --> 00:27:32,600
Speaker 1: guess what, there are no rewards for that. There's so

492
00:27:32,640 --> 00:27:35,919
Speaker 1: many people that like feed off this need to have women,

493
00:27:36,520 --> 00:27:39,320
Speaker 1: you know, to it just it. It eats at me

494
00:27:39,520 --> 00:27:41,960
Speaker 1: because again they're just people way too close to me

495
00:27:42,440 --> 00:27:45,640
Speaker 1: that UM have struggled. They could, They couldn't walk past

496
00:27:45,640 --> 00:27:48,840
Speaker 1: the baby carriage without crying, and so I guess um.

497
00:27:48,840 --> 00:27:52,399
Speaker 1: In closing, I was glad that got the buzz it

498
00:27:52,520 --> 00:27:56,119
Speaker 1: did because I needed other women to know they're not alone.

499
00:27:56,520 --> 00:27:59,640
Speaker 1: Because there are areas and struggles I have where all

500
00:27:59,640 --> 00:28:01,600
Speaker 1: be the on my knees and I'm gonna need them

501
00:28:01,640 --> 00:28:04,920
Speaker 1: to swing for me, and in this moment, I'll swing

502
00:28:05,040 --> 00:28:08,840
Speaker 1: for them. Well, done, well done, and I'm so I'm

503
00:28:08,880 --> 00:28:13,560
Speaker 1: so glad you you took no names and prisoners. Um,

504
00:28:14,119 --> 00:28:17,720
Speaker 1: you're standing up for your sisters, right, You're there for them.

505
00:28:18,119 --> 00:28:20,560
Speaker 1: And and we have to get to a point where

506
00:28:20,560 --> 00:28:24,440
Speaker 1: we're all there for each other because it's never our

507
00:28:24,480 --> 00:28:28,280
Speaker 1: place to judge another mom. It's always our place to

508
00:28:28,400 --> 00:28:31,880
Speaker 1: support her in whatever it is that she does right

509
00:28:32,080 --> 00:28:34,800
Speaker 1: and and and funny in life, not just in motherhood.

510
00:28:34,800 --> 00:28:37,080
Speaker 1: Whenever I've thought I was right, the universe has a

511
00:28:37,080 --> 00:28:40,560
Speaker 1: way of humbling me. The times I've thought I knew

512
00:28:40,560 --> 00:28:42,960
Speaker 1: what was going on, I will be knocked down next.

513
00:28:43,080 --> 00:28:46,440
Speaker 1: It's just the way life teaches us. So I always

514
00:28:46,440 --> 00:28:48,760
Speaker 1: say we're all doing the best that we can. And

515
00:28:48,840 --> 00:28:50,960
Speaker 1: I when I look at someone, I rarely am like

516
00:28:51,040 --> 00:28:53,840
Speaker 1: why would they do that? I'm like, does it work?

517
00:28:54,080 --> 00:28:56,280
Speaker 1: Because I'm gonna try it, like whatever it is? Like

518
00:28:56,320 --> 00:28:59,480
Speaker 1: I think looking at everyone knowing how hard it is

519
00:28:59,520 --> 00:29:02,520
Speaker 1: to end the day having tried to guide another human

520
00:29:03,080 --> 00:29:05,480
Speaker 1: Strangers that say to me, good job, mama. I used

521
00:29:05,520 --> 00:29:07,120
Speaker 1: to think, why would you say that because you don't

522
00:29:07,120 --> 00:29:08,720
Speaker 1: know the person. Now when people do, I'm like you,

523
00:29:08,880 --> 00:29:14,760
Speaker 1: thank you. I needed that. I needed that. So we

524
00:29:14,840 --> 00:29:29,040
Speaker 1: always need that now I hand those out. Yeah, so

525
00:29:29,200 --> 00:29:33,120
Speaker 1: I hear you have a question from me. I do so.

526
00:29:33,240 --> 00:29:35,959
Speaker 1: I have one daughter, and I know that you and

527
00:29:36,400 --> 00:29:40,720
Speaker 1: am I clearly have such a close relationship. Thinking ahead

528
00:29:40,800 --> 00:29:42,959
Speaker 1: right now, I'm the center of Sanders world. At two

529
00:29:42,960 --> 00:29:44,760
Speaker 1: and a half, she was obsessed with me. But I

530
00:29:44,800 --> 00:29:47,720
Speaker 1: know she's going to evolve through phases that are more difficult.

531
00:29:48,400 --> 00:29:52,840
Speaker 1: How did you keep communication open even at facing those

532
00:29:53,640 --> 00:29:57,320
Speaker 1: stages where they want to push you away? Way, I'm

533
00:29:57,320 --> 00:30:01,920
Speaker 1: not gonna lie. Wasn't always easy. It looks easy now,

534
00:30:02,040 --> 00:30:07,240
Speaker 1: you know. Emma's is pubably beautiful, full of personality, so funny,

535
00:30:07,360 --> 00:30:10,880
Speaker 1: and we are best friends, I mean not as best

536
00:30:10,920 --> 00:30:14,400
Speaker 1: as Eric and I, but very very very close friends.

537
00:30:14,840 --> 00:30:18,000
Speaker 1: But it wasn't always like butterflies and rainbows and you know,

538
00:30:18,120 --> 00:30:21,760
Speaker 1: besties because she once upon a time she was a teenager,

539
00:30:22,680 --> 00:30:25,080
Speaker 1: and even even further back, she was a toddler and

540
00:30:25,120 --> 00:30:27,320
Speaker 1: she was a first child. You know how you said

541
00:30:27,320 --> 00:30:30,600
Speaker 1: that your first child was so much harder, and I

542
00:30:30,640 --> 00:30:33,480
Speaker 1: think she definitely was a classic first child in so

543
00:30:33,520 --> 00:30:36,520
Speaker 1: many ways. But you know, it's funny because people say,

544
00:30:36,960 --> 00:30:39,120
Speaker 1: you know, why don't you ever write a book called

545
00:30:39,160 --> 00:30:41,920
Speaker 1: What to Expect? The teenage years. I tell them just

546
00:30:42,080 --> 00:30:44,760
Speaker 1: reread the second year, what to expect the second year,

547
00:30:44,760 --> 00:30:47,600
Speaker 1: and do some creative editing, because if you think about it,

548
00:30:47,960 --> 00:30:51,160
Speaker 1: they called toddlerhood the first adolescent. Why did they call

549
00:30:51,240 --> 00:30:53,680
Speaker 1: it that? Because it's the first time that a kid

550
00:30:53,760 --> 00:30:58,040
Speaker 1: is separating from you and having those ambivalent feelings, and

551
00:30:58,040 --> 00:31:00,760
Speaker 1: and there are power struggles, and there are ten her tantrums,

552
00:31:00,800 --> 00:31:03,840
Speaker 1: and there's you know, you can't make me. That's the

553
00:31:03,920 --> 00:31:06,960
Speaker 1: first time you see it. But they're way smaller and cuter.

554
00:31:07,440 --> 00:31:10,120
Speaker 1: But when they're teenager, you know, it gets a little chickier.

555
00:31:10,640 --> 00:31:13,760
Speaker 1: And and so you know, m I through plenty of tantrums.

556
00:31:13,760 --> 00:31:16,120
Speaker 1: She knew how to push the buttons. But the one

557
00:31:16,280 --> 00:31:21,720
Speaker 1: thing that I think kept us solid throughout those challenging

558
00:31:21,840 --> 00:31:24,600
Speaker 1: years was the fact that she knew she could come

559
00:31:24,600 --> 00:31:27,200
Speaker 1: to me and talk to me about anything. And when

560
00:31:27,240 --> 00:31:30,960
Speaker 1: I say anything, I mean anything. And there were times

561
00:31:31,160 --> 00:31:34,720
Speaker 1: when I was like, oh, I want to put on

562
00:31:34,800 --> 00:31:37,479
Speaker 1: ear muff so badly because I really don't want to

563
00:31:37,520 --> 00:31:40,680
Speaker 1: hear this. I really don't. And she spared, you know,

564
00:31:40,880 --> 00:31:43,000
Speaker 1: she talked to both of us, but she spared Eric

565
00:31:43,040 --> 00:31:45,120
Speaker 1: a lot of the details. She did not spare any

566
00:31:45,160 --> 00:31:48,080
Speaker 1: details with me, And you know I wasn't like that

567
00:31:48,120 --> 00:31:51,200
Speaker 1: with my mom. I didn't I know, I was super

568
00:31:51,200 --> 00:31:53,760
Speaker 1: good at hiding things like I wasn't like I was

569
00:31:53,800 --> 00:31:56,560
Speaker 1: a perfect teenager, but she never knew any better because

570
00:31:56,680 --> 00:32:00,240
Speaker 1: I was hiding. I didn't want m n Wyatt to

571
00:32:00,280 --> 00:32:03,920
Speaker 1: be those kids who are afraid to tell their parents

572
00:32:04,200 --> 00:32:06,320
Speaker 1: whatever it is that's on their mind, because you know,

573
00:32:07,160 --> 00:32:09,479
Speaker 1: if they don't go to you, they're going to go

574
00:32:09,520 --> 00:32:11,880
Speaker 1: to someone else, and it's probably not going to be

575
00:32:11,920 --> 00:32:15,480
Speaker 1: a safe space. But just the fact that you and

576
00:32:15,560 --> 00:32:19,440
Speaker 1: Sandra has spent that time together where she knows she can.

577
00:32:19,760 --> 00:32:21,160
Speaker 1: You know she's not going to come to you with

578
00:32:21,200 --> 00:32:23,120
Speaker 1: things that are going to shock you at this point,

579
00:32:23,360 --> 00:32:27,800
Speaker 1: but she will eventually, But one day she will. If

580
00:32:27,800 --> 00:32:30,400
Speaker 1: you shut her down in that moment, then she'll stop

581
00:32:30,440 --> 00:32:33,880
Speaker 1: coming so as hard as it sometimes, as you keep

582
00:32:33,880 --> 00:32:37,240
Speaker 1: that line of communication open through throughout all of it,

583
00:32:37,560 --> 00:32:40,240
Speaker 1: eventually at one point she won't want to just flop

584
00:32:40,240 --> 00:32:42,480
Speaker 1: in your lap. Well, she won't fit in your lap

585
00:32:42,480 --> 00:32:45,480
Speaker 1: if she's like Emma. Emma's like six inches taller than me.

586
00:32:45,640 --> 00:32:49,800
Speaker 1: But there were points when you know, maybe she wasn't

587
00:32:50,000 --> 00:32:53,280
Speaker 1: feeling snugly anymore. But but we talked there would be

588
00:32:53,320 --> 00:32:55,760
Speaker 1: a place like would be in the car. My eyes

589
00:32:55,760 --> 00:32:58,840
Speaker 1: were on the road therefore I wasn't making the direct

590
00:32:58,960 --> 00:33:02,160
Speaker 1: eye context. So you felt safe opening up And you'll

591
00:33:02,160 --> 00:33:05,120
Speaker 1: find that place you know that's safe where she can

592
00:33:05,160 --> 00:33:07,000
Speaker 1: open up. But as long as she has it, then

593
00:33:07,120 --> 00:33:11,240
Speaker 1: then I think you're you're golden. Is there anything you

594
00:33:11,320 --> 00:33:15,280
Speaker 1: wish you knew at this phase that I'm in everything

595
00:33:15,600 --> 00:33:18,240
Speaker 1: that you wish you could tell yourself? First of all,

596
00:33:18,280 --> 00:33:21,120
Speaker 1: I knew nothing. I was like the definition of clueless

597
00:33:21,120 --> 00:33:25,480
Speaker 1: and all things parenting because I hadn't written any books yet. Yes,

598
00:33:25,680 --> 00:33:28,240
Speaker 1: well that's the whole point. So it's like I had

599
00:33:28,240 --> 00:33:29,920
Speaker 1: no idea what to expect. I didn't know how to

600
00:33:29,960 --> 00:33:32,200
Speaker 1: get a screaming. You know, I was two for two

601
00:33:32,200 --> 00:33:35,400
Speaker 1: with colic, right, So what I wish I knew is

602
00:33:35,480 --> 00:33:37,960
Speaker 1: what you said is that there's no such thing as

603
00:33:37,960 --> 00:33:40,360
Speaker 1: a perfect parent, and that you've got to cut yourself

604
00:33:40,400 --> 00:33:42,760
Speaker 1: some slack. I've always had a sense of humor, but

605
00:33:42,840 --> 00:33:46,720
Speaker 1: I think that's a parent's most vital accessory. Right. If

606
00:33:46,760 --> 00:33:48,960
Speaker 1: you don't have a sense of humor, you are screwed

607
00:33:49,000 --> 00:33:51,440
Speaker 1: from day one. You are already noticing that they're going

608
00:33:51,480 --> 00:33:55,760
Speaker 1: to do things that if you don't laugh, you're you're doomed, right,

609
00:33:56,080 --> 00:33:59,680
Speaker 1: she's your battles, like, don't make everything a battle with Emma.

610
00:33:59,760 --> 00:34:03,160
Speaker 1: Every was a battle. I wish I had just said, Okay,

611
00:34:03,400 --> 00:34:06,760
Speaker 1: don't wear your shoes, you know, don't wear them, because

612
00:34:06,880 --> 00:34:08,919
Speaker 1: then came that day when we were like in front

613
00:34:08,960 --> 00:34:11,280
Speaker 1: of the Natural History Museum and she took her shoe

614
00:34:11,600 --> 00:34:13,600
Speaker 1: and she threw it into the pond in front of

615
00:34:13,600 --> 00:34:16,640
Speaker 1: the Natural History Museum and we never found it again.

616
00:34:16,719 --> 00:34:19,000
Speaker 1: We went looked for, you know, when it thawed because

617
00:34:19,000 --> 00:34:21,040
Speaker 1: it was the middle of winter. But anyway, the point

618
00:34:21,120 --> 00:34:24,440
Speaker 1: is you gotta laugh, right, Yeah, you gotta laugh about

619
00:34:24,480 --> 00:34:27,879
Speaker 1: those things that and stop and smell the babies, which

620
00:34:27,960 --> 00:34:30,760
Speaker 1: I think you've realized too, that you've got to stop

621
00:34:30,760 --> 00:34:33,840
Speaker 1: and smell the babies. They grow up in a blink

622
00:34:34,080 --> 00:34:35,879
Speaker 1: of an eye. And I wish I had paid more.

623
00:34:36,360 --> 00:34:40,640
Speaker 1: I wish I had remember to push pause. Thank you, Heidie,

624
00:34:40,640 --> 00:34:46,080
Speaker 1: that's such priceless information. Well, Sarah, listen, where can people

625
00:34:46,160 --> 00:34:49,359
Speaker 1: find you so they can write nice, nice comments to you?

626
00:34:49,800 --> 00:34:53,080
Speaker 1: So I am at at Sarah Haynes on Instagram, same

627
00:34:53,120 --> 00:34:55,960
Speaker 1: on Twitter and Facebook. I dropped into the view every

628
00:34:56,000 --> 00:34:58,760
Speaker 1: once in a while, so really any of the above,

629
00:35:00,440 --> 00:35:03,080
Speaker 1: that's great. Well. I can't wait to one day have

630
00:35:03,200 --> 00:35:06,440
Speaker 1: a hug because I'm lub starved. I'm so hugged starved.

631
00:35:06,480 --> 00:35:09,960
Speaker 1: I would love them. We can hold on awkwardly long.

632
00:35:12,480 --> 00:35:15,200
Speaker 1: Thanks for being here today. Thank you so much for

633
00:35:15,239 --> 00:35:21,479
Speaker 1: having me hide. I really appreciate it. Who baby Love,

634
00:35:22,160 --> 00:35:27,040
Speaker 1: my baby belove. I need you, Oh how I need you.

635
00:35:28,440 --> 00:35:32,200
Speaker 1: Thanks for listening. Remember, I'm always here for you. What

636
00:35:32,360 --> 00:35:35,160
Speaker 1: to Expect is always here for you. We're all in

637
00:35:35,320 --> 00:35:39,120
Speaker 1: this together. For more on what you heard on today's episode,

638
00:35:39,280 --> 00:35:42,879
Speaker 1: visit what to Expect dot com slash podcast. You can

639
00:35:42,920 --> 00:35:45,680
Speaker 1: also check out what to Expect when You're Expecting, What

640
00:35:45,800 --> 00:35:48,920
Speaker 1: to Expect the first Year, and the What to Expect app.

641
00:35:49,440 --> 00:35:52,920
Speaker 1: And we want to hear from you. Connect with us

642
00:35:52,920 --> 00:35:56,240
Speaker 1: on our community message board or on our social media.

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Speaker 1: You can find me at Heidi Murkoff and Emma at

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Speaker 1: Emma bing w t E and of course at What

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00:36:04,120 --> 00:36:08,840
Speaker 1: to Expect. Baby Love is performed by Riley Peterer. What

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Speaker 1: to Expect is a production of I Heart Radio. From

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Speaker 1: more shows from I Heart Radio, check out the I

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Speaker 1: heart Radio app Apple podcasts or wherever you listen to

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00:36:19,520 --> 00:36:25,120
Speaker 1: your favorite shows. In my arms right, don't you stay

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Speaker 1: Neja Njo, baby, baby,