1 00:00:00,680 --> 00:00:02,759 Speaker 1: Hello, and welcome to cool people who did cool stuff. 2 00:00:02,800 --> 00:00:05,080 Speaker 1: I'm your host, Margaret Kiljoy, and every week I talked 3 00:00:05,080 --> 00:00:09,240 Speaker 1: about rebels and revolutionaries and weirdos and I guess people 4 00:00:09,240 --> 00:00:11,280 Speaker 1: who passed the basic minimum bar of not like the 5 00:00:11,400 --> 00:00:15,120 Speaker 1: Nazis and people I find interesting. And with me today 6 00:00:15,440 --> 00:00:19,680 Speaker 1: is Shrek. Shrek, how are you doing? Oh? I was 7 00:00:20,800 --> 00:00:24,280 Speaker 1: I was gonna try to do a terrible Scottish accent, 8 00:00:24,320 --> 00:00:27,880 Speaker 1: and then oh, that's what I thought you were going 9 00:00:27,920 --> 00:00:32,040 Speaker 1: to do. I don't know what I was gonna say. 10 00:00:32,159 --> 00:00:36,640 Speaker 1: It was gonna be bad. Um, so I decided against it. 11 00:00:36,840 --> 00:00:42,800 Speaker 1: I'm great, Donkeys great, Um, Fiona is great. We're just 12 00:00:42,960 --> 00:00:47,800 Speaker 1: chilling in the swamp. Yeah. And UM, I believe you. 13 00:00:47,840 --> 00:00:50,000 Speaker 1: Most people might know you by your previous name, which 14 00:00:50,000 --> 00:00:51,960 Speaker 1: is I'm under the impression not a dead name, but 15 00:00:52,000 --> 00:00:54,240 Speaker 1: just not your current name, which is Caitlin Drante. Is 16 00:00:54,240 --> 00:00:57,880 Speaker 1: that that's true? Um? I I go in and out 17 00:00:57,920 --> 00:01:01,600 Speaker 1: of identities, and all of those identity these are fictional 18 00:01:02,080 --> 00:01:08,039 Speaker 1: movie characters. So right now I'm Shrek excellent, and I'm 19 00:01:08,080 --> 00:01:12,840 Speaker 1: the dictator of people's identities. With me today is Sophie. 20 00:01:12,840 --> 00:01:16,280 Speaker 1: How are you Sophie? Ah? No, no, no, I'm sorry. 21 00:01:16,400 --> 00:01:20,920 Speaker 1: I want to do it again. I really, I really 22 00:01:21,000 --> 00:01:23,120 Speaker 1: want to rewatch Shrek to see if it holds. We 23 00:01:23,280 --> 00:01:25,760 Speaker 1: have we have we been a Shrek on? Have we 24 00:01:25,800 --> 00:01:29,000 Speaker 1: done any of the Shreks on bet Cass? We've done 25 00:01:29,000 --> 00:01:31,600 Speaker 1: Shrek one and two, although I don't know if you 26 00:01:31,640 --> 00:01:33,440 Speaker 1: were present for either, but I don't think I was. 27 00:01:34,200 --> 00:01:37,600 Speaker 1: I would have had I would have been, I would 28 00:01:37,640 --> 00:01:40,920 Speaker 1: have been annoying. Um, but did they pass the beck 29 00:01:40,920 --> 00:01:46,200 Speaker 1: deel test? Um? You know what? I don't remember. Listeners, 30 00:01:46,200 --> 00:01:51,640 Speaker 1: you'll have to go back and listen to the episodes. Okay, Yeah, 31 00:01:51,960 --> 00:01:53,480 Speaker 1: there's no way you can just watch the movies and 32 00:01:53,520 --> 00:01:55,080 Speaker 1: find out if they passed the beck dee'l test. That. 33 00:01:55,200 --> 00:01:57,520 Speaker 1: I do really want to rewatch the movies because I 34 00:01:57,560 --> 00:01:59,600 Speaker 1: want to see if they hold up at all or 35 00:01:59,640 --> 00:02:02,920 Speaker 1: if they are an absolute nightmare. Well, you can also 36 00:02:02,960 --> 00:02:05,840 Speaker 1: listen to our episodes about them. The Shrek one episode 37 00:02:05,840 --> 00:02:11,280 Speaker 1: sucks because mostly my fault. Um it was it was 38 00:02:11,760 --> 00:02:14,440 Speaker 1: just like one of our earlier episodes. Within the first 39 00:02:14,480 --> 00:02:16,120 Speaker 1: like I don't know, a few months of doing the 40 00:02:16,200 --> 00:02:20,080 Speaker 1: show and before we really Jamie watch the wedding, Jamie 41 00:02:20,120 --> 00:02:26,800 Speaker 1: did watch the Wow called out has been dropping completely called. 42 00:02:26,840 --> 00:02:30,280 Speaker 1: Caitlin has a podcast called Bechdelcast where they can talk 43 00:02:30,320 --> 00:02:33,000 Speaker 1: about movies and you should listen, thank you so much. 44 00:02:33,280 --> 00:02:35,880 Speaker 1: I agree you should listen, but not to the Shrek 45 00:02:35,960 --> 00:02:39,680 Speaker 1: one episode. The Shrek two episode, however, is what we 46 00:02:39,760 --> 00:02:43,359 Speaker 1: did to celebrate I think the podcasts five year anniversary. 47 00:02:43,480 --> 00:02:46,720 Speaker 1: It was some celebratory episode and so Jamie and I 48 00:02:46,840 --> 00:02:49,760 Speaker 1: there's no better way than to, you know, celebrate with 49 00:02:49,800 --> 00:02:57,160 Speaker 1: some puss in boots. Oh my gosh, he and isn't 50 00:02:57,200 --> 00:03:00,000 Speaker 1: we supposed to be having a fiesta as Puss in boot? 51 00:03:00,040 --> 00:03:06,160 Speaker 1: It's the end of trek to Caitlin and I could 52 00:03:06,200 --> 00:03:14,520 Speaker 1: do this panter for probably several hours. So Margaret, okay, no, no, no, 53 00:03:14,600 --> 00:03:18,760 Speaker 1: please continue. This will be a three part um. Okay, 54 00:03:18,760 --> 00:03:21,240 Speaker 1: so Ian does our audio editing and our theme music 55 00:03:21,280 --> 00:03:23,680 Speaker 1: was written for us by a woman. One person said, 56 00:03:23,840 --> 00:03:25,959 Speaker 1: you keep saying your music is done by a woman, 57 00:03:26,440 --> 00:03:29,799 Speaker 1: And while that is true, is a as a performer 58 00:03:29,880 --> 00:03:34,519 Speaker 1: named on woman like non woman who ironically is a woman. 59 00:03:34,639 --> 00:03:37,520 Speaker 1: But so and you can check out her music much 60 00:03:37,560 --> 00:03:42,640 Speaker 1: like the music that you already listened to. Anyway. On Monday, 61 00:03:42,720 --> 00:03:45,360 Speaker 1: we talked about German expressionist Horror, who and the people 62 00:03:45,400 --> 00:03:48,880 Speaker 1: who fought Nazis, and today we're going to talk about 63 00:03:49,240 --> 00:03:51,640 Speaker 1: Hollywood as a sleepy little town. Have you ever heard 64 00:03:51,640 --> 00:03:57,000 Speaker 1: of Hollywood? Caitlin heard of it? I have? Yeah, it's okay, 65 00:03:57,000 --> 00:03:59,960 Speaker 1: I are you Okay, I'm back to Caitlin for now. Okay, 66 00:04:00,760 --> 00:04:04,920 Speaker 1: I have heard of Hollywood. I live adjacent to the 67 00:04:05,000 --> 00:04:11,000 Speaker 1: neighborhood in fact, and um, yeah, I would say I'm 68 00:04:11,160 --> 00:04:18,800 Speaker 1: very very peripherally working in Hollywood. Oh, okay, in that 69 00:04:19,000 --> 00:04:24,080 Speaker 1: I have a movie podcast that the analyze this film, 70 00:04:24,360 --> 00:04:27,480 Speaker 1: and therefore I work in Hollywood. That's how that works, right. 71 00:04:28,000 --> 00:04:30,960 Speaker 1: Does that mean I temporarily work in Hollywood? Yes? Yeah? 72 00:04:31,000 --> 00:04:36,400 Speaker 1: For this yes? Hell yeah. Well did you know that 73 00:04:36,440 --> 00:04:39,240 Speaker 1: there was a home grown anti Nazi league in Hollywood? 74 00:04:40,400 --> 00:04:42,839 Speaker 1: I don't know if I knew about this. What do 75 00:04:42,880 --> 00:04:45,880 Speaker 1: you think that the anti Nazi league in Hollywood was called? 76 00:04:46,880 --> 00:04:51,160 Speaker 1: Was it called the Hollywood Anti Nazi League? Why did 77 00:04:51,160 --> 00:04:55,560 Speaker 1: you read my script ahead of me? Is that really correct? Yeah? 78 00:04:55,800 --> 00:04:59,320 Speaker 1: Stilled the Hollywood Anti Nazi League? Okay, Well, I mean 79 00:04:59,360 --> 00:05:03,080 Speaker 1: you set me up for it, so yeah, I do 80 00:05:03,120 --> 00:05:06,320 Speaker 1: still appreciate that, probably more than anything else. The actual 81 00:05:06,320 --> 00:05:08,480 Speaker 1: long term sponsor of the show is naming things. All 82 00:05:08,480 --> 00:05:10,080 Speaker 1: of your groups have to have a league in the name, 83 00:05:10,360 --> 00:05:13,320 Speaker 1: because I think there was a period between eighteen eighty 84 00:05:13,320 --> 00:05:17,400 Speaker 1: and nineteen thirty where there was not a social movement organization, 85 00:05:17,839 --> 00:05:19,880 Speaker 1: both right wing or left wing, that did not have 86 00:05:20,040 --> 00:05:25,600 Speaker 1: league in the name. So and we don't use league anymore. 87 00:05:26,400 --> 00:05:30,680 Speaker 1: I know. It's it's all like people are like, I 88 00:05:30,720 --> 00:05:39,080 Speaker 1: don't know, organization or association, association group. Yeah, whatever happened 89 00:05:39,080 --> 00:05:43,840 Speaker 1: to league, I suspect, And I'm just gonna go ahead 90 00:05:43,839 --> 00:05:46,320 Speaker 1: and claim this is truth. Tell you the truth, which 91 00:05:46,360 --> 00:05:48,680 Speaker 1: is that in the nineteen thirties, with the fall of 92 00:05:48,720 --> 00:05:54,080 Speaker 1: the cloak as a fashion item, also fell the league's 93 00:05:54,080 --> 00:05:56,160 Speaker 1: because I think that the leagues and the cloaks were 94 00:05:56,160 --> 00:06:01,680 Speaker 1: inexcricably tied together. Okay, a cloak pin holding the two 95 00:06:01,760 --> 00:06:06,599 Speaker 1: concepts together. Wow makes you think, I know, I don't 96 00:06:06,800 --> 00:06:09,719 Speaker 1: sure what it makes me think. But the Hollywood Anti 97 00:06:09,800 --> 00:06:12,359 Speaker 1: Nazi League, they actually started out really cool. It was 98 00:06:12,400 --> 00:06:16,080 Speaker 1: probably the first American anti Nazi organization that wasn't specifically Jewish. 99 00:06:16,640 --> 00:06:21,480 Speaker 1: M other organizations had started earlier, and a lot of 100 00:06:21,520 --> 00:06:24,160 Speaker 1: the Hollywood Anti Nazi League was Communist like members of 101 00:06:24,160 --> 00:06:26,760 Speaker 1: the Communist Party, but notably a lot of it wasn't 102 00:06:26,800 --> 00:06:29,880 Speaker 1: It was sort of a a popular front against fascist 103 00:06:29,920 --> 00:06:34,040 Speaker 1: influence in filmmaking. Practically who's who of Hollywood, including communist, 104 00:06:34,080 --> 00:06:37,200 Speaker 1: liberal and conservative members actually, and including a bunch of 105 00:06:37,200 --> 00:06:39,400 Speaker 1: refugees from the Nazis like Fritz Lang, who we talked 106 00:06:39,400 --> 00:06:43,000 Speaker 1: about last time. Chico Marks, the oldest Marx brother, was 107 00:06:43,040 --> 00:06:47,240 Speaker 1: in it. John Ford, who directed The Grapes of Wrath 108 00:06:47,279 --> 00:06:50,039 Speaker 1: and basically like every movie at the time, was in it. 109 00:06:50,360 --> 00:06:53,680 Speaker 1: Very popular director. Yeah, and he so I looked more 110 00:06:53,720 --> 00:06:55,640 Speaker 1: into him, and he was never a communist, but he 111 00:06:55,640 --> 00:06:58,000 Speaker 1: made it clear that if being in an anti Nazi 112 00:06:58,080 --> 00:07:00,200 Speaker 1: league got him smeared as a communist, then like can 113 00:07:00,240 --> 00:07:03,799 Speaker 1: bring it on. Specifically, as quote was, may I express 114 00:07:03,839 --> 00:07:06,120 Speaker 1: my wholehearted desire to cooperate to the utmost of my 115 00:07:06,160 --> 00:07:09,640 Speaker 1: ability with Hollywood Anti Nazi League. If this be communism, 116 00:07:09,680 --> 00:07:15,160 Speaker 1: count me in. Mhm. Pretty cool, John, Yeah. And basically 117 00:07:15,200 --> 00:07:17,400 Speaker 1: the whole pro Nazi press, because there's this whole pro 118 00:07:17,480 --> 00:07:21,400 Speaker 1: Nazi press was like, this is a Jewish Communist conspiracy, 119 00:07:21,480 --> 00:07:24,640 Speaker 1: which is always funny because anti Semitism either accused the 120 00:07:24,680 --> 00:07:27,640 Speaker 1: Jews of being communists or capitalists, depending on which ideology 121 00:07:28,040 --> 00:07:31,720 Speaker 1: they want to demonize, and I love how it's like 122 00:07:31,760 --> 00:07:34,200 Speaker 1: doesn't even hit a cognitive dissonance in the anti Semitic 123 00:07:34,240 --> 00:07:36,680 Speaker 1: mind that like, you're like, what you ever want? I 124 00:07:36,720 --> 00:07:39,240 Speaker 1: hate or mad at? Right now? That's what you know 125 00:07:39,600 --> 00:07:42,920 Speaker 1: people are doing or whatever, And it's like worth knowing 126 00:07:43,520 --> 00:07:45,400 Speaker 1: because when you're like, oh, in anti Nazi legual those 127 00:07:45,400 --> 00:07:47,800 Speaker 1: who league dedicated to being mad at like the Germans. 128 00:07:47,840 --> 00:07:50,400 Speaker 1: Like in the ninet thirties, if you were a right 129 00:07:50,440 --> 00:07:53,400 Speaker 1: wing person in the United States, you were probably a fascist. 130 00:07:53,680 --> 00:07:57,560 Speaker 1: You are probably sympathetic to fascism. And there was this 131 00:07:57,680 --> 00:08:01,080 Speaker 1: huge pro fascist movement in the US by people who 132 00:08:01,120 --> 00:08:04,520 Speaker 1: once the US enters of the war, people immediately drop 133 00:08:04,560 --> 00:08:07,480 Speaker 1: off the Some people stay Nazis, but most people are like, Okay, 134 00:08:07,480 --> 00:08:09,360 Speaker 1: well we want to be American right wing people, not 135 00:08:10,240 --> 00:08:14,880 Speaker 1: you know, our enemy right wing people or whatever. Anyway. 136 00:08:15,200 --> 00:08:18,200 Speaker 1: John Ford during World War Two, he joins the military 137 00:08:18,200 --> 00:08:21,520 Speaker 1: as a filmmaker. He gets wounded twice filming battles. He 138 00:08:21,680 --> 00:08:24,720 Speaker 1: lands at D Day, he films, and he got less 139 00:08:24,720 --> 00:08:26,920 Speaker 1: cool as he got older. He goes from fighting against 140 00:08:27,040 --> 00:08:31,600 Speaker 1: McCarthy is um to supporting Nixon and Reagan. Later, but 141 00:08:31,760 --> 00:08:34,960 Speaker 1: more important, to the Anti Nazi League and more personally 142 00:08:35,120 --> 00:08:37,080 Speaker 1: really is actually not more important. It's just personal to me. 143 00:08:37,480 --> 00:08:40,920 Speaker 1: My my great grandfather was this tin pan alley songwriter 144 00:08:41,480 --> 00:08:43,560 Speaker 1: who used to write songs in the nineteen twenties for 145 00:08:43,559 --> 00:08:46,560 Speaker 1: this guy named Eddie Cantor. And Eddie Cantor was like 146 00:08:46,600 --> 00:08:51,760 Speaker 1: this big vaudeville singer guy, right, and he gave a 147 00:08:51,800 --> 00:08:54,600 Speaker 1: speed Eddie Cantor, not my great whatever great grandfather, great 148 00:08:54,600 --> 00:08:57,480 Speaker 1: great grandfather. He gave a speech at the inaugural party. 149 00:08:57,720 --> 00:08:59,600 Speaker 1: And I just got really excited whenever I see his name, 150 00:08:59,600 --> 00:09:01,800 Speaker 1: because I'm like, oh, maybe my great grand dad was 151 00:09:01,840 --> 00:09:03,760 Speaker 1: really cool guy. I don't know about my great granddad. 152 00:09:05,040 --> 00:09:06,480 Speaker 1: And I'm not even gonna tell you his name because 153 00:09:06,559 --> 00:09:08,200 Speaker 1: Nazis have already worked hard enough to figure out who 154 00:09:08,240 --> 00:09:13,080 Speaker 1: my family is anyway. Okay, So they published not that 155 00:09:13,120 --> 00:09:14,959 Speaker 1: there's like a through line to the modern world or 156 00:09:15,000 --> 00:09:21,080 Speaker 1: anything like that. So they published two papers, the Hollywood 157 00:09:21,120 --> 00:09:24,520 Speaker 1: Anti Nazi News and Hollywood Now, which I feel like 158 00:09:24,559 --> 00:09:26,960 Speaker 1: Hollywood Now is probably a clever way to name your 159 00:09:27,000 --> 00:09:31,520 Speaker 1: paper because it's it's very just like it just makes 160 00:09:31,520 --> 00:09:37,920 Speaker 1: it seem like and here's what's happening in the movie industry. Yeah, 161 00:09:38,120 --> 00:09:42,800 Speaker 1: totally without any sort of like other objective. Yeah, which 162 00:09:42,800 --> 00:09:44,719 Speaker 1: one would you have worked for? Like if you're like, 163 00:09:45,080 --> 00:09:47,720 Speaker 1: which one have you put your weight behind? The Hollywood 164 00:09:47,720 --> 00:09:50,000 Speaker 1: Anti Nazi news or just Hollywood now both with the 165 00:09:50,040 --> 00:09:56,360 Speaker 1: same purpose? Just which every I mean, I I feel 166 00:09:56,920 --> 00:10:00,920 Speaker 1: based on the names alone, I would say the first 167 00:10:01,000 --> 00:10:05,520 Speaker 1: one because why you know, I like transparency. Yeah, so 168 00:10:06,040 --> 00:10:09,920 Speaker 1: the first one has a way more transparent name. I 169 00:10:09,920 --> 00:10:13,400 Speaker 1: think I think I would have to you just and 170 00:10:13,440 --> 00:10:15,880 Speaker 1: also you get to be like part of Hollywood Anti 171 00:10:15,960 --> 00:10:19,920 Speaker 1: Nazi news. You know, all your anti Nazi news about Hollywood. Yep, 172 00:10:20,559 --> 00:10:25,319 Speaker 1: read all about it? Yeah, exactly. They had to l 173 00:10:25,360 --> 00:10:28,480 Speaker 1: a radio shows, they sponsored lectures and rallies, they organized 174 00:10:28,520 --> 00:10:31,120 Speaker 1: boycotts of Nazi products, and they fucked with all the 175 00:10:31,120 --> 00:10:35,160 Speaker 1: American Nazis, mostly the German American boond as well as 176 00:10:35,160 --> 00:10:39,240 Speaker 1: the Silver Shirts. And they fucked with visiting European Nazis, 177 00:10:39,800 --> 00:10:43,280 Speaker 1: at least one of whom stayed with Walt Disney because 178 00:10:43,280 --> 00:10:47,360 Speaker 1: Walt Disney was a piece of ship. Oh yeah, and 179 00:10:47,840 --> 00:10:50,240 Speaker 1: now let's talk about Walt Disney. A piece of ship. 180 00:10:50,679 --> 00:10:54,280 Speaker 1: M a little a little mini reverse, a little bastard. Yeah. 181 00:10:54,360 --> 00:10:58,040 Speaker 1: It was like I was like, uh, just a little 182 00:10:58,080 --> 00:10:59,840 Speaker 1: mini bastards, just like a little taste, like you know, 183 00:11:00,040 --> 00:11:05,840 Speaker 1: gonna start like a tonal shrieking. Are you no? Great? 184 00:11:06,280 --> 00:11:11,720 Speaker 1: Just making sure Yep, no you thought about it, you 185 00:11:11,800 --> 00:11:14,280 Speaker 1: definitely I didn't think about it. Yeah, yeah, no, I know. 186 00:11:14,360 --> 00:11:16,280 Speaker 1: But that's in the same way that like when someone 187 00:11:16,320 --> 00:11:17,840 Speaker 1: tells you not to do something, it just do. You 188 00:11:17,840 --> 00:11:20,160 Speaker 1: instinctively want to do it, even if it's and then 189 00:11:20,160 --> 00:11:24,280 Speaker 1: you realize you don't want to do it anyway. M hm, Disney. 190 00:11:25,040 --> 00:11:27,880 Speaker 1: He gives a Nazi propaganda filmmaker tour of his studio 191 00:11:28,000 --> 00:11:31,200 Speaker 1: a month after Crystal Knocked while she's there to promote 192 00:11:31,200 --> 00:11:35,000 Speaker 1: her Nazi propaganda film. He later claims that he didn't 193 00:11:35,040 --> 00:11:38,160 Speaker 1: know like that she was a Nazi or whatever. My 194 00:11:38,280 --> 00:11:40,880 Speaker 1: argument is, twy, this is obviously not a lie. Is 195 00:11:40,920 --> 00:11:43,920 Speaker 1: that the Anti Nazi League was like boycotting him over 196 00:11:43,960 --> 00:11:46,000 Speaker 1: it and making it really clear ahead of time and 197 00:11:46,040 --> 00:11:48,600 Speaker 1: doing all of this press being like, don't host the 198 00:11:48,679 --> 00:11:52,000 Speaker 1: Nazi lady with her Nazi propaganda, And he's like, oh, 199 00:11:52,120 --> 00:11:54,720 Speaker 1: I just well, as an a political filmmaker, I'll just 200 00:11:54,720 --> 00:11:57,440 Speaker 1: show you around the space, you know. Um, I don't 201 00:11:57,440 --> 00:11:59,360 Speaker 1: know why, Yes, that accent. He does not have that accent. 202 00:12:01,480 --> 00:12:05,560 Speaker 1: So a Disney animator the main evidence of Disney as 203 00:12:05,559 --> 00:12:09,319 Speaker 1: a Nazi. There's a lot of weird rumors and complicated 204 00:12:09,440 --> 00:12:12,280 Speaker 1: things around Disney, but the like main single thing that 205 00:12:12,280 --> 00:12:13,599 Speaker 1: I can point to and be like, no, he was. 206 00:12:13,679 --> 00:12:16,600 Speaker 1: He was a fucking Nazi. A Disney animator named Art 207 00:12:16,600 --> 00:12:20,480 Speaker 1: Babbitt said quote, in the immediate years before we entered 208 00:12:20,520 --> 00:12:23,160 Speaker 1: World War Two, there was a small but fiercely loyal 209 00:12:23,200 --> 00:12:26,199 Speaker 1: I suppose legal following of the Nazi Party that were 210 00:12:26,240 --> 00:12:28,720 Speaker 1: open meetings anyone could attend, and I wanted to see 211 00:12:28,720 --> 00:12:31,199 Speaker 1: what was going on myself. On more than one occasion 212 00:12:31,240 --> 00:12:34,240 Speaker 1: I observed Walt Disney and his lawyer there, along with 213 00:12:34,280 --> 00:12:37,880 Speaker 1: a lot of prominent Nazi afflicted Hollywood personalities. Disney was 214 00:12:37,880 --> 00:12:41,120 Speaker 1: going to these meetings all the time. So my argument 215 00:12:41,120 --> 00:12:42,520 Speaker 1: with that he was a Nazi is that he went 216 00:12:42,559 --> 00:12:46,400 Speaker 1: to Nazi organized You know, it's not hard to connect 217 00:12:46,440 --> 00:12:49,320 Speaker 1: those dots. Yeah, because people are like, is a Nazi 218 00:12:49,360 --> 00:12:50,599 Speaker 1: because like this or that? And I'm like, no, no, 219 00:12:50,679 --> 00:12:52,960 Speaker 1: because he was. Because he went to the naz actively 220 00:12:52,960 --> 00:12:59,680 Speaker 1: participating in Nazi meetings, and and there's this thing happening 221 00:12:59,760 --> 00:13:01,880 Speaker 1: and I'm kind of curious if you've caught this where 222 00:13:01,920 --> 00:13:04,400 Speaker 1: there's like this whole big like backlash. This's like there's 223 00:13:04,400 --> 00:13:07,240 Speaker 1: like a Disney Wasn't a Nazi discourse that the Internet 224 00:13:07,320 --> 00:13:10,800 Speaker 1: is trying to have. I haven't been paying attention to that. 225 00:13:10,960 --> 00:13:14,920 Speaker 1: Why what are they saying? It's like, I think what's 226 00:13:14,920 --> 00:13:18,040 Speaker 1: happening is that people are conflating like personal bigotry with 227 00:13:18,400 --> 00:13:21,760 Speaker 1: supporting fascism, because basically what people are saying is that 228 00:13:21,760 --> 00:13:25,280 Speaker 1: they're like they're like literally listing out all of his 229 00:13:25,280 --> 00:13:27,199 Speaker 1: black friends or all of his Jewish friends or whatever, 230 00:13:27,800 --> 00:13:31,679 Speaker 1: um and being like and like, it seems to me 231 00:13:31,840 --> 00:13:34,680 Speaker 1: that most of his like most of the bigotry that's 232 00:13:34,679 --> 00:13:37,400 Speaker 1: expressed in the old Disney films actually is kind of 233 00:13:37,400 --> 00:13:39,640 Speaker 1: in line with all of the other bigotry happening in 234 00:13:39,640 --> 00:13:42,920 Speaker 1: Hollywood films at the time. Like I think it wasn't 235 00:13:42,960 --> 00:13:47,880 Speaker 1: particularly exemplary, I mean, or like particularly stand out ish, right, right. 236 00:13:49,000 --> 00:13:51,280 Speaker 1: But but yeah, so people are like, oh, it wasn't 237 00:13:51,280 --> 00:13:54,440 Speaker 1: a Nazi because he like didn't have personal bigotry against 238 00:13:54,520 --> 00:13:59,280 Speaker 1: Jews necessarily his entire life. But my argument is that 239 00:13:59,360 --> 00:14:01,559 Speaker 1: I literally liam not thinking about that one where or 240 00:14:01,600 --> 00:14:03,480 Speaker 1: the other because I don't have enough information. I'm just 241 00:14:03,520 --> 00:14:06,240 Speaker 1: saying he went to fucking Nazi meetings and he was 242 00:14:06,280 --> 00:14:09,719 Speaker 1: like super right wing, so I don't know, it's not 243 00:14:09,880 --> 00:14:14,520 Speaker 1: much for me, right and and some of his films 244 00:14:14,559 --> 00:14:16,880 Speaker 1: were the last ones to be he was like trying 245 00:14:16,880 --> 00:14:18,240 Speaker 1: to be buds of the Nazis, and some of his 246 00:14:18,280 --> 00:14:20,240 Speaker 1: films were the last American films to get banned in 247 00:14:20,240 --> 00:14:23,560 Speaker 1: Germany during the war, and Go Bowls and all the rest. Uh. 248 00:14:23,720 --> 00:14:26,760 Speaker 1: They actually put together a plan to try and figure 249 00:14:26,760 --> 00:14:28,840 Speaker 1: out if they could claim that Walt Disney was German 250 00:14:29,080 --> 00:14:31,640 Speaker 1: so that they could get it get his films to 251 00:14:31,640 --> 00:14:33,440 Speaker 1: be allowed to continue to be played because they liked 252 00:14:33,480 --> 00:14:35,960 Speaker 1: his film so much, because they were kind of right wing, 253 00:14:36,000 --> 00:14:38,920 Speaker 1: you know. And so they were like put together this 254 00:14:38,960 --> 00:14:40,480 Speaker 1: thing about whether or not they could get away with 255 00:14:40,480 --> 00:14:44,120 Speaker 1: claiming he was born Walter Distler instead of Walt Disney 256 00:14:44,440 --> 00:14:46,880 Speaker 1: and that that's not Disney's fault, like he didn't make 257 00:14:46,960 --> 00:14:51,440 Speaker 1: sure Gobels do that. Once the war started, and this 258 00:14:51,520 --> 00:14:53,000 Speaker 1: is the other reason that people claimed that he wasn't 259 00:14:53,000 --> 00:14:56,120 Speaker 1: a Nazi. He absolutely like the rest of these fucking Nazis. 260 00:14:56,160 --> 00:14:58,600 Speaker 1: As soon as the US entered the war against Germany. 261 00:14:59,160 --> 00:15:01,120 Speaker 1: He was like, no, no, no, I'm an American right 262 00:15:01,120 --> 00:15:04,840 Speaker 1: wing person and so now I'm anti Nazi. He was 263 00:15:04,880 --> 00:15:08,840 Speaker 1: just a social conservative capitalist, and he made a whole 264 00:15:08,880 --> 00:15:12,320 Speaker 1: bunch of anti Nazi films during the war because everyone 265 00:15:12,360 --> 00:15:18,080 Speaker 1: did mm hmm. But very few of the Hollywood studios 266 00:15:18,120 --> 00:15:20,280 Speaker 1: were willing to stick their next out in critique fascism 267 00:15:20,280 --> 00:15:24,000 Speaker 1: at the time, like very very few foreign films made 268 00:15:24,040 --> 00:15:26,920 Speaker 1: up about movie revenue before World War Two. This is 269 00:15:26,920 --> 00:15:31,880 Speaker 1: like before America entered the war, basically, and so they 270 00:15:31,920 --> 00:15:34,160 Speaker 1: didn't want to rock the boat, right because they're like, well, 271 00:15:34,200 --> 00:15:36,080 Speaker 1: we we want the foreign market and we want all 272 00:15:36,080 --> 00:15:39,280 Speaker 1: the Nazi controlled areas to still show off movies and 273 00:15:39,320 --> 00:15:46,520 Speaker 1: give us money. With one exception, the Warner Brothers, okay, 274 00:15:47,320 --> 00:15:52,240 Speaker 1: the most based Hollywood studio of the nineteen thirties. Harry 275 00:15:52,240 --> 00:15:54,560 Speaker 1: and Jack Warner were the sons of a Jewish cobbler 276 00:15:54,600 --> 00:15:57,640 Speaker 1: who had fled programs in Poland, and they didn't forget 277 00:15:57,640 --> 00:16:00,920 Speaker 1: their roots. There's was the first studio to criticize Hitler 278 00:16:01,200 --> 00:16:04,240 Speaker 1: in a nineteen thirty three Looney Tunes cartoon called Bosco's 279 00:16:04,280 --> 00:16:07,240 Speaker 1: Picture Show, in which Hitler is chasing someone around with 280 00:16:07,240 --> 00:16:09,880 Speaker 1: a meat cleaver Um. The person they're chasing around is 281 00:16:09,880 --> 00:16:11,720 Speaker 1: is played by someone whose last name is Durante. But 282 00:16:11,720 --> 00:16:17,440 Speaker 1: I forgot to write down his first name, Jimmy Jimmy Duranty, 283 00:16:18,000 --> 00:16:21,760 Speaker 1: Oh Duranti. Yeah, which is also how my family pronounces 284 00:16:21,840 --> 00:16:24,200 Speaker 1: my last name. But I was like, I'm also how 285 00:16:24,320 --> 00:16:28,480 Speaker 1: Robert consistently mispronounces your last name. Yes, and so in 286 00:16:28,480 --> 00:16:33,000 Speaker 1: a way, I do change, um, my identity year round 287 00:16:33,000 --> 00:16:36,520 Speaker 1: because I lived the first eighteen years of my life 288 00:16:36,600 --> 00:16:39,720 Speaker 1: is Caitlin Duranty. And then I was like, I hate 289 00:16:39,760 --> 00:16:44,120 Speaker 1: the way that sounds Caitlin Durante because that's like the 290 00:16:44,120 --> 00:16:48,640 Speaker 1: anglicization of its Duranty. So yeah, okay, which, like I don't. 291 00:16:48,680 --> 00:16:55,120 Speaker 1: I mean, Durante is an Italian name, so uh it's yeah, 292 00:16:55,960 --> 00:17:04,240 Speaker 1: slightly more correct pronunciation wise to say Durante. But um, anyway, 293 00:17:04,320 --> 00:17:09,440 Speaker 1: Jimmy Durranty was a famous uh person in Hollywood at 294 00:17:09,480 --> 00:17:13,560 Speaker 1: one time, but no relation. I'm not related to him. Okay, 295 00:17:13,640 --> 00:17:18,879 Speaker 1: so he was your great grandfather. He's my husband, that 296 00:17:18,960 --> 00:17:22,399 Speaker 1: actually makes sense. He took his name, he took my 297 00:17:22,520 --> 00:17:29,000 Speaker 1: name good, Okay, I'm sorry such a thing feminism hello, Yeah, yeah, 298 00:17:29,080 --> 00:17:32,199 Speaker 1: he used to be his maiden name was like Jimmy 299 00:17:32,480 --> 00:17:36,760 Speaker 1: Jimmy Smith. Yeah, well you all made that film together. 300 00:17:36,800 --> 00:17:42,080 Speaker 1: So I made a married a vampire exactly starring the 301 00:17:42,119 --> 00:17:49,359 Speaker 1: same actor who plays Shrek. Yeah, whose name is Shrek? Shrek? Okay, yeah, 302 00:17:50,000 --> 00:17:54,440 Speaker 1: County Mike Myers? Is that who that is? Mike Myers? 303 00:17:54,520 --> 00:17:57,840 Speaker 1: Well he was in that movie something something married an 304 00:17:57,880 --> 00:18:03,359 Speaker 1: axe murderer. I used him, that's what you were referring to. Yeah, absolutely, 305 00:18:03,400 --> 00:18:08,840 Speaker 1: I actually have seen that movie. Okay. So Warner Brothers 306 00:18:09,880 --> 00:18:12,760 Speaker 1: they closed their German offices entirely in nineteen thirty four. 307 00:18:12,880 --> 00:18:15,000 Speaker 1: When the Nazis told them to fire all the Jewish employees. 308 00:18:15,040 --> 00:18:18,480 Speaker 1: They were like, nope, you get nothing from us ever again. 309 00:18:18,800 --> 00:18:21,800 Speaker 1: Funk all of you. Uh. They stopped working with the 310 00:18:21,880 --> 00:18:24,439 Speaker 1: Nazi regime. It took five more years. It took till 311 00:18:24,520 --> 00:18:27,000 Speaker 1: ninety nine for the other major studios to follow suit, 312 00:18:27,560 --> 00:18:30,920 Speaker 1: and and the heads of many of these other major 313 00:18:30,920 --> 00:18:34,159 Speaker 1: studios were Jewish too. It's almost like an ethnic heritage 314 00:18:34,200 --> 00:18:36,479 Speaker 1: doesn't make you a good or bad person, and instead 315 00:18:36,600 --> 00:18:39,399 Speaker 1: it's your own actions that do that. It's almost as 316 00:18:39,440 --> 00:18:45,880 Speaker 1: if capitalism really just warps your brain. Yeahs of who 317 00:18:46,000 --> 00:18:49,080 Speaker 1: you are and kind of what your background is yeah, 318 00:18:50,080 --> 00:18:53,760 Speaker 1: and if you want your brain warped, you can purchase 319 00:18:54,280 --> 00:18:59,479 Speaker 1: goods and services um from yes, thank you. I remally 320 00:19:00,200 --> 00:19:04,119 Speaker 1: retird on that one, such as the following advertisers who 321 00:19:04,200 --> 00:19:06,880 Speaker 1: we support in every way whole with our entire hearts, 322 00:19:06,920 --> 00:19:11,840 Speaker 1: our entire golden onion hearts, especially those weird as for 323 00:19:11,960 --> 00:19:21,399 Speaker 1: gold that keep popping up. Oh yeah, that nobody should buy. Okay, 324 00:19:21,480 --> 00:19:24,240 Speaker 1: but hear me out. If you bury gold, don't do it. 325 00:19:24,520 --> 00:19:30,600 Speaker 1: Don't do it cold onions only, okay, if anyone, well, okay, 326 00:19:30,600 --> 00:19:32,800 Speaker 1: but if the if the sponsors sent me gold, I'd 327 00:19:32,840 --> 00:19:36,440 Speaker 1: probably tell people that, oh, that's the problem with capitalism. 328 00:19:37,000 --> 00:19:42,520 Speaker 1: Now I understand you've been capitalism. I got owned by 329 00:19:42,600 --> 00:19:47,840 Speaker 1: my need to eat food every day. Here's some ads 330 00:19:52,760 --> 00:19:55,800 Speaker 1: and we are back and we are talking about how 331 00:19:56,520 --> 00:20:00,639 Speaker 1: MGM Studios, which had a Jewish head that wish had um. 332 00:20:01,160 --> 00:20:03,879 Speaker 1: Adolf Zukor said, I don't think Hollywood should deal with 333 00:20:03,920 --> 00:20:06,919 Speaker 1: anything but entertainment. The newsreels take care of current events 334 00:20:07,400 --> 00:20:12,280 Speaker 1: in the Warner Brothers had to fight anti semitism at 335 00:20:12,359 --> 00:20:15,760 Speaker 1: home as well. Hollywood had a self censorship board called 336 00:20:15,800 --> 00:20:19,160 Speaker 1: the Production Code Administration, which was led by this anti 337 00:20:19,240 --> 00:20:22,399 Speaker 1: Semite named Joseph Breen. And when I say anti semit 338 00:20:23,200 --> 00:20:25,199 Speaker 1: I'm not once again not trying to be like subtle here, 339 00:20:25,200 --> 00:20:28,480 Speaker 1: because he wasn't very subtle. What he said what's wrong 340 00:20:28,520 --> 00:20:31,440 Speaker 1: with Hollywood was all the quote lousy Jews and that 341 00:20:32,440 --> 00:20:34,680 Speaker 1: of Jews were Eastern Jews, the scum of the earth. 342 00:20:35,560 --> 00:20:38,960 Speaker 1: Oh my goodness, Yes, that's who was in charge. And 343 00:20:39,000 --> 00:20:41,520 Speaker 1: then it's funny too, right, because everyone's always like anti Semitic. 344 00:20:41,560 --> 00:20:44,440 Speaker 1: Ship's always like the Jews controlling Hollywood and whatever, and 345 00:20:44,480 --> 00:20:47,159 Speaker 1: you're like, the fucking Censorship Board was like run by 346 00:20:47,200 --> 00:20:52,560 Speaker 1: this guy who whatever. Yeah, regardless of the p c A, 347 00:20:52,880 --> 00:20:56,040 Speaker 1: the Warner Brothers went ahead as best they could. In 348 00:20:56,800 --> 00:20:59,200 Speaker 1: seven they made a Humphrey Bogart film called Black Legion 349 00:20:59,440 --> 00:21:02,680 Speaker 1: about to stick fascism that compared the KKK to the Nazis. 350 00:21:03,440 --> 00:21:06,080 Speaker 1: They made a ninety eight version of the Adventures of 351 00:21:06,160 --> 00:21:08,720 Speaker 1: Robin Hood that was like really transparently about the need 352 00:21:08,760 --> 00:21:12,600 Speaker 1: to fight Nazis M. And then they made a film 353 00:21:12,960 --> 00:21:15,640 Speaker 1: that I had never heard of but made a big 354 00:21:15,760 --> 00:21:18,040 Speaker 1: fucking we'll talk about what a big deal it was. 355 00:21:18,560 --> 00:21:20,760 Speaker 1: They made a film called Confessions of a Nazi Spy. 356 00:21:20,920 --> 00:21:25,439 Speaker 1: Either of you ever heard of this, I've not heard 357 00:21:25,560 --> 00:21:30,000 Speaker 1: of Maybe I've heard of it, but I know nothing else. Well, 358 00:21:30,080 --> 00:21:31,520 Speaker 1: that's what's so interesting to me, is kind of like 359 00:21:31,560 --> 00:21:34,199 Speaker 1: the how these things can be like cultural moments, right, 360 00:21:34,960 --> 00:21:39,120 Speaker 1: and then not become classics kind of have no legacy 361 00:21:39,200 --> 00:21:42,480 Speaker 1: after that. Yeah, Confessions of a Nazi Spy was directed 362 00:21:42,520 --> 00:21:45,639 Speaker 1: by a Jewish refugee, and it brings us the Hollywood 363 00:21:45,760 --> 00:21:51,600 Speaker 1: Nazi the like, here's a caricature of a shitty fucking Nazi, right, 364 00:21:52,320 --> 00:21:54,040 Speaker 1: and this is way before the US was involved in 365 00:21:54,080 --> 00:21:56,120 Speaker 1: the war. And it was based on the true story 366 00:21:56,160 --> 00:21:58,879 Speaker 1: of an American detective who uncovered Nazi spies in the US. 367 00:21:59,280 --> 00:22:01,200 Speaker 1: And since it was a true story, it could kind 368 00:22:01,200 --> 00:22:05,639 Speaker 1: of get around pc A censorship barely mhm. The the 369 00:22:05,720 --> 00:22:08,480 Speaker 1: Reich did not like this film. The Reich declared it 370 00:22:08,480 --> 00:22:10,520 Speaker 1: would ban all films ever made by any of the 371 00:22:10,600 --> 00:22:14,040 Speaker 1: actors in the film. Other studios wanted it to not 372 00:22:14,200 --> 00:22:16,239 Speaker 1: come out because they were afraid the Nazis would ban 373 00:22:16,320 --> 00:22:19,280 Speaker 1: all American films if this movie came out, which eventually 374 00:22:19,480 --> 00:22:22,680 Speaker 1: the Nazis did ban all American films. A pc A 375 00:22:22,800 --> 00:22:26,040 Speaker 1: official wrote, are we ready to depart from the pleasant 376 00:22:26,080 --> 00:22:29,639 Speaker 1: and profitable course of entertainment, to engage in propaganda, to 377 00:22:29,800 --> 00:22:35,679 Speaker 1: produce screen portrayals arousing controversy, conflict, racial, religious, and nationalistic antagonism, 378 00:22:35,760 --> 00:22:42,600 Speaker 1: and outright human hatred. Yeah, they're saying that about a 379 00:22:43,200 --> 00:22:49,879 Speaker 1: film that criticizes fascism and Nazism. That reminds me of 380 00:22:49,960 --> 00:22:54,200 Speaker 1: the time when, um, what the fun is that loser's 381 00:22:54,320 --> 00:22:58,280 Speaker 1: name d W. Griffith, after making Birth of a Nation, 382 00:22:58,440 --> 00:23:01,840 Speaker 1: which was so racist that at the time in nineteen fifteen, 383 00:23:03,119 --> 00:23:06,520 Speaker 1: people were like, this is really racist. So when something 384 00:23:06,880 --> 00:23:10,159 Speaker 1: when people when like critics and and the general public 385 00:23:10,280 --> 00:23:13,560 Speaker 1: in nineteen fifteen thinks something is really racist, you know, 386 00:23:13,720 --> 00:23:17,800 Speaker 1: it was very, very racist, and he didn't like. Griffith 387 00:23:17,840 --> 00:23:21,000 Speaker 1: didn't like how many people were calling his movie racist 388 00:23:21,040 --> 00:23:25,720 Speaker 1: and we're being quote unquote intolerant towards his his movie 389 00:23:25,840 --> 00:23:28,400 Speaker 1: that he then made a movie a couple of years 390 00:23:28,440 --> 00:23:32,919 Speaker 1: later called Intolerance because he didn't like that people were 391 00:23:33,000 --> 00:23:39,680 Speaker 1: so intolerant of his work. Yeah. So anyway, real Nazis 392 00:23:39,720 --> 00:23:43,960 Speaker 1: were the anti Nazis all along. I'm so glad that 393 00:23:44,040 --> 00:23:46,600 Speaker 1: this is a twentieth century relic that is not a 394 00:23:46,640 --> 00:23:52,240 Speaker 1: pattern that we have ever seen. Again mm hmmm, Uh, yeah, 395 00:23:53,320 --> 00:23:56,280 Speaker 1: so so the Warner Brothers. They released Confessions of a 396 00:23:56,359 --> 00:23:58,960 Speaker 1: Nazi Spy anyway. When asked why they were doing it, 397 00:23:59,119 --> 00:24:02,200 Speaker 1: Jack Warner said, the Silver Shirts and the Buddhists, the 398 00:24:02,320 --> 00:24:05,520 Speaker 1: two American fascist organizations and the rest of these hoods 399 00:24:05,560 --> 00:24:08,080 Speaker 1: are marching in Los Angeles right now. There are high 400 00:24:08,119 --> 00:24:11,320 Speaker 1: school kids with swastikas on their sleeves a few crumby 401 00:24:11,359 --> 00:24:13,600 Speaker 1: blocks from our studio. Is that what you want in 402 00:24:13,680 --> 00:24:19,080 Speaker 1: exchange for some crummy film royalties from Germany? And um good, yeah, 403 00:24:19,640 --> 00:24:22,639 Speaker 1: and shout out for just using the word crummy twice 404 00:24:24,119 --> 00:24:27,320 Speaker 1: and a very intense yeah. But and there was one 405 00:24:27,359 --> 00:24:29,239 Speaker 1: concession that they had to make in order to get 406 00:24:29,280 --> 00:24:31,000 Speaker 1: the p c A to release the film at all. 407 00:24:31,280 --> 00:24:34,080 Speaker 1: They couldn't outright talk about the fact that the Jews 408 00:24:34,160 --> 00:24:36,000 Speaker 1: were the people who are being fucked with the most 409 00:24:36,080 --> 00:24:39,480 Speaker 1: by the Nazis. And we'll talk about in a moment 410 00:24:39,560 --> 00:24:42,560 Speaker 1: the first film that did center Jews in an anti 411 00:24:42,680 --> 00:24:46,320 Speaker 1: Nazi film, but Confessions of a Nazi Spy they received 412 00:24:46,359 --> 00:24:48,159 Speaker 1: more than a hundred threatening letters and they have to 413 00:24:48,200 --> 00:24:51,119 Speaker 1: hire extra security. They didn't do any publicity for it. 414 00:24:51,480 --> 00:24:53,800 Speaker 1: The cast and cruise names were kept secret until like 415 00:24:53,960 --> 00:24:56,760 Speaker 1: right before release, and they were hard to recruit cast 416 00:24:56,800 --> 00:24:58,240 Speaker 1: and crew in the first place. And it was like 417 00:24:58,280 --> 00:25:01,120 Speaker 1: almost entirely made by a German fugees and like committed 418 00:25:01,160 --> 00:25:06,600 Speaker 1: anti fascists from the US. M hmmm. And this movie 419 00:25:06,720 --> 00:25:09,600 Speaker 1: was controversial. And when I say controversial, I'm going to 420 00:25:09,720 --> 00:25:13,679 Speaker 1: quote from an article by Stephen J. Ross. Not everyone 421 00:25:13,800 --> 00:25:17,399 Speaker 1: was enamored with the film. Nazi sympathizers in Milwaukee burned 422 00:25:17,440 --> 00:25:20,200 Speaker 1: down the local Warner Brothers theater shortly after the movie opened. 423 00:25:20,720 --> 00:25:24,440 Speaker 1: Angry citizens and other cities picketed theaters, slashed seats, and 424 00:25:24,560 --> 00:25:28,760 Speaker 1: threatened exhibitors. In Poland, anti Semitic audiences hanged several theater 425 00:25:28,840 --> 00:25:32,560 Speaker 1: owners in their movie houses for exhibiting the films film 426 00:25:33,040 --> 00:25:37,119 Speaker 1: Nazis burned the film everywhere they could exert pressure. Wow, 427 00:25:37,640 --> 00:25:42,480 Speaker 1: So people like literally died for showing this anti fascist film, 428 00:25:42,520 --> 00:25:45,920 Speaker 1: which is like the stakes that I think sometimes it 429 00:25:45,960 --> 00:25:49,399 Speaker 1: gets forgotten about. You know, the film was carried to 430 00:25:49,480 --> 00:25:51,920 Speaker 1: its premier in an armored car and all the Chicken 431 00:25:51,960 --> 00:25:55,719 Speaker 1: Ship celebrities didn't show up because not many of them did, 432 00:25:55,840 --> 00:25:57,960 Speaker 1: but many of the like A list celebrities didn't show 433 00:25:58,040 --> 00:26:00,560 Speaker 1: up because they were afraid of being seen as quote political, 434 00:26:01,480 --> 00:26:04,679 Speaker 1: and they're like excuse that they came up with MGM 435 00:26:04,720 --> 00:26:07,080 Speaker 1: Studios through a birthday party for someone that night, like 436 00:26:07,160 --> 00:26:10,480 Speaker 1: a surprise birthday party, like all of a sudden to 437 00:26:10,560 --> 00:26:13,399 Speaker 1: give all their stars an excuse to miss it. And 438 00:26:14,680 --> 00:26:16,280 Speaker 1: and there's some kind of like one of the most 439 00:26:16,320 --> 00:26:18,639 Speaker 1: interesting parallels to me about this as everything in the 440 00:26:18,640 --> 00:26:20,360 Speaker 1: world compares to the Spanish Civil War in my head, 441 00:26:20,960 --> 00:26:23,360 Speaker 1: which is not true, but you know whatever, my brain 442 00:26:23,440 --> 00:26:27,640 Speaker 1: fixates on things. And the Americans who fought against fascism 443 00:26:28,320 --> 00:26:31,320 Speaker 1: in the Spanish Civil War were called premature anti fascists, 444 00:26:31,680 --> 00:26:33,919 Speaker 1: and they were mistrusted and they had like had trouble, 445 00:26:34,000 --> 00:26:35,560 Speaker 1: like they would like later go and sign up for 446 00:26:35,560 --> 00:26:37,040 Speaker 1: the army because being like what we fought not not 447 00:26:37,240 --> 00:26:39,200 Speaker 1: fascist before and we want to fight them again, and 448 00:26:39,280 --> 00:26:41,560 Speaker 1: the army was like holding them at arm's length, being like, 449 00:26:41,600 --> 00:26:44,359 Speaker 1: we don't trust you because you're too anti fascist. Is 450 00:26:44,400 --> 00:26:48,600 Speaker 1: you were prematurely anti fascist? And this happens to the 451 00:26:48,680 --> 00:26:52,959 Speaker 1: filmmakers and ship right. They're now under suspicion because they 452 00:26:53,000 --> 00:26:57,040 Speaker 1: were anti fascist before the US government was officially anti fascist. 453 00:26:57,680 --> 00:27:02,280 Speaker 1: Mm hmmm. And it was basically seen as as big 454 00:27:02,320 --> 00:27:04,359 Speaker 1: of a deal as the birth of the nation, but 455 00:27:04,800 --> 00:27:08,600 Speaker 1: from the opposite point of view. A Jewish film producer, 456 00:27:08,800 --> 00:27:12,719 Speaker 1: Lou Edelman, wrote to his boss last night the motion picture, 457 00:27:12,920 --> 00:27:16,080 Speaker 1: like the concept of the motion picture had a bar mitzvah. 458 00:27:16,440 --> 00:27:19,200 Speaker 1: It came of age, it said today, I am a man, 459 00:27:20,560 --> 00:27:24,440 Speaker 1: um so big fucking deal. I've never heard of it. 460 00:27:24,480 --> 00:27:27,560 Speaker 1: I kind of want to go watch it now, right, Yeah, yeah, 461 00:27:28,359 --> 00:27:29,760 Speaker 1: I have no idea if it like holds up like 462 00:27:29,840 --> 00:27:33,399 Speaker 1: as like entertainment, but it was fucking important that they 463 00:27:33,440 --> 00:27:36,520 Speaker 1: made it. Yeah, I'm I'm curious and like you said that, 464 00:27:36,800 --> 00:27:40,480 Speaker 1: the stakes surrounding something like that, yeah, we kind of 465 00:27:40,560 --> 00:27:45,240 Speaker 1: we can forget how hot like literally life and death 466 00:27:45,320 --> 00:27:50,600 Speaker 1: stakes in some cases. Um, for we're making something like that. 467 00:27:51,000 --> 00:27:57,200 Speaker 1: Um wow, Yeah, I'm gonna go check it out. Yeah, 468 00:27:57,560 --> 00:28:01,880 Speaker 1: if it's accessible, even I wonder. Yeah, I think it is. Um, 469 00:28:02,680 --> 00:28:04,680 Speaker 1: I like didn't specifically look it up to be like 470 00:28:04,920 --> 00:28:06,560 Speaker 1: it's It's kind of my plan over the next couple 471 00:28:06,560 --> 00:28:08,680 Speaker 1: of nights to watch some of these movies that I 472 00:28:08,760 --> 00:28:10,520 Speaker 1: didn't have a chance to watch before I recorded a 473 00:28:10,560 --> 00:28:13,399 Speaker 1: podcast about them, because that is the nature of podcasting. 474 00:28:13,440 --> 00:28:16,959 Speaker 1: And now you all know I do a lot of research. 475 00:28:17,640 --> 00:28:20,080 Speaker 1: I never watched any of the movies that I cover 476 00:28:20,200 --> 00:28:22,600 Speaker 1: on the back to cast. That's not true. I watched 477 00:28:22,600 --> 00:28:25,800 Speaker 1: them twice, sometimes three times. No, I thought, you just 478 00:28:25,840 --> 00:28:31,879 Speaker 1: read the Wikipedia entry out. Yeah, exactly. Okay, let's go 479 00:28:31,920 --> 00:28:34,160 Speaker 1: back to the Anti Nazi League, and there's a big 480 00:28:34,240 --> 00:28:36,120 Speaker 1: Popular Front group made up of all the various people 481 00:28:36,119 --> 00:28:39,640 Speaker 1: were posed to fascism. But they had another There's another 482 00:28:39,680 --> 00:28:41,960 Speaker 1: comparison I can make against with the Popular Front of 483 00:28:42,000 --> 00:28:46,640 Speaker 1: Spain because the people fighting the Popular Front fighting fascist 484 00:28:46,720 --> 00:28:49,600 Speaker 1: in Spain had a problem, and that problem was Stalin, 485 00:28:50,240 --> 00:28:53,640 Speaker 1: because Stalin, you know, went around and like started shooting 486 00:28:53,640 --> 00:28:55,200 Speaker 1: everyone else who didn't agree with him in the middle 487 00:28:55,200 --> 00:28:57,880 Speaker 1: of the war and caused all this terrible ship m 488 00:28:58,640 --> 00:29:01,960 Speaker 1: The Hollywood Popular Front also had a problem. You want 489 00:29:01,960 --> 00:29:08,200 Speaker 1: to guess what that problem was, um, I would guess that. 490 00:29:11,040 --> 00:29:17,200 Speaker 1: I mean, what problems don't they have? Um? I mean 491 00:29:17,240 --> 00:29:25,200 Speaker 1: it's probably having something with capitalism and or they, I 492 00:29:25,280 --> 00:29:30,400 Speaker 1: don't know, the studio system, something something you tell me, Okay, yeah, 493 00:29:30,440 --> 00:29:31,920 Speaker 1: I kind of it was a kind of a terrible 494 00:29:32,000 --> 00:29:36,520 Speaker 1: riddle that I'm like, it was Stalin. Their problem was Stalin? Okay, 495 00:29:40,360 --> 00:29:45,480 Speaker 1: I get it. Yeah, as the parallels okay because Okay, 496 00:29:45,520 --> 00:29:47,400 Speaker 1: So the group was made up of a wide variety 497 00:29:47,400 --> 00:29:52,520 Speaker 1: of anti fascists, including even conservative members, and its political 498 00:29:52,560 --> 00:29:56,200 Speaker 1: aims were purely anti Nazi, but it was controlled from 499 00:29:56,240 --> 00:29:59,320 Speaker 1: behind the scenes by the Communist Party through the Communist 500 00:29:59,360 --> 00:30:01,880 Speaker 1: Party of America UH and the American League for Peace 501 00:30:01,920 --> 00:30:06,360 Speaker 1: and Democracy, which was controlled by the Soviet Union, which 502 00:30:06,440 --> 00:30:08,760 Speaker 1: had the goal of getting the US into a defensive 503 00:30:08,760 --> 00:30:11,040 Speaker 1: alliance with the uss ARE in case of Nazi aggression. 504 00:30:11,480 --> 00:30:13,720 Speaker 1: So the Hollywood Anti Nazi League was created in that 505 00:30:13,920 --> 00:30:19,200 Speaker 1: context in which the USSR wanted Americans to be anti Nazi? 506 00:30:20,160 --> 00:30:23,200 Speaker 1: But have you ever heard of the I keep asking 507 00:30:23,440 --> 00:30:25,000 Speaker 1: I need to stop asking you questions. Have you ever 508 00:30:25,040 --> 00:30:26,360 Speaker 1: heard of? I don't like putting you on the spot 509 00:30:26,400 --> 00:30:30,200 Speaker 1: like that. I'm just gonna tell you because if I 510 00:30:30,320 --> 00:30:34,680 Speaker 1: have heard of it, I get to feel so freaking cool, like, yeah, 511 00:30:34,800 --> 00:30:37,560 Speaker 1: I've heard of it and I've seen it. Try me 512 00:30:37,760 --> 00:30:40,000 Speaker 1: and then if I if I haven't, then I exposed 513 00:30:40,040 --> 00:30:43,360 Speaker 1: myself as once again a fraud. But I'm willing to 514 00:30:43,440 --> 00:30:46,040 Speaker 1: take that risk. Okay, have you ever heard of the 515 00:30:46,080 --> 00:30:53,360 Speaker 1: Molotov ribbon? Trop packed? No? And then I burst into tears. Yeah, yeah, Um. 516 00:30:54,000 --> 00:30:57,920 Speaker 1: Actually it is literally crying Shrek right now on camera crying. 517 00:30:58,960 --> 00:31:03,600 Speaker 1: So on August it's the eve of World War two 518 00:31:04,280 --> 00:31:07,040 Speaker 1: and the U s SR decides to be budds with Hitler, 519 00:31:07,800 --> 00:31:10,240 Speaker 1: so they sign a treaty called the Molotov Ribbon trup 520 00:31:10,280 --> 00:31:14,200 Speaker 1: Packed with Hitler. And it's two things. First, and this 521 00:31:14,320 --> 00:31:18,840 Speaker 1: part of public at the time, it's a non aggression pact. Second, 522 00:31:18,920 --> 00:31:20,560 Speaker 1: and this part of the secret part of it, the 523 00:31:20,640 --> 00:31:24,760 Speaker 1: secret protocol that we find out decades later. It carved 524 00:31:24,840 --> 00:31:26,880 Speaker 1: up chunks of Eastern Europe and the Baltic states in 525 00:31:26,960 --> 00:31:30,080 Speaker 1: Finland and said, okay, we can invade this, you can 526 00:31:30,120 --> 00:31:33,200 Speaker 1: invade that. They just like split up the spoils of 527 00:31:33,280 --> 00:31:38,440 Speaker 1: War Um with Nazi Germany. And the most dramatic effects 528 00:31:38,480 --> 00:31:41,320 Speaker 1: of this, of course, is that Germany and the USS 529 00:31:41,400 --> 00:31:44,479 Speaker 1: are both invaded Poland and then they held like common 530 00:31:44,600 --> 00:31:48,200 Speaker 1: parades where the Red Army and the Vyemarkt or whatever 531 00:31:48,440 --> 00:31:50,959 Speaker 1: would like march around together and be like we are friends. 532 00:31:51,160 --> 00:31:54,000 Speaker 1: You know, people don't like talking about this as much. 533 00:31:55,280 --> 00:31:58,120 Speaker 1: And then the USS are conquered tried to conquer Finland, 534 00:31:58,720 --> 00:32:01,200 Speaker 1: which gets called the Winter War, and the Finns put 535 00:32:01,280 --> 00:32:03,680 Speaker 1: up a surprising resistance and the USSR steals about nine 536 00:32:03,720 --> 00:32:05,560 Speaker 1: percent of the country instead of all of the country. 537 00:32:06,280 --> 00:32:10,280 Speaker 1: M hm. And you know how the USSR. The the 538 00:32:10,360 --> 00:32:12,840 Speaker 1: way that they got the USSR got that packed with 539 00:32:13,080 --> 00:32:16,800 Speaker 1: Hitler is Stalin gave an order to quote purge the 540 00:32:16,840 --> 00:32:22,360 Speaker 1: Foreign Ministry of Jews in order to be friends with 541 00:32:22,480 --> 00:32:27,120 Speaker 1: the Nazis. USSR Nazi relations only fell apart when the 542 00:32:27,200 --> 00:32:29,440 Speaker 1: two countries couldn't agree about how to split the spoils 543 00:32:29,480 --> 00:32:33,560 Speaker 1: of war. Basically, Um, they were in talks with I 544 00:32:33,640 --> 00:32:37,240 Speaker 1: didn't know this ship until fucking way recently, like five 545 00:32:37,360 --> 00:32:39,400 Speaker 1: years ago or something, and I've been politically engaged for 546 00:32:39,400 --> 00:32:42,160 Speaker 1: a long time. They were in talks with the USSR 547 00:32:42,280 --> 00:32:45,760 Speaker 1: to formally join the Access Powers until eventually, at some 548 00:32:45,800 --> 00:32:48,280 Speaker 1: point Hitler was like, nah, we're just going to invade 549 00:32:48,280 --> 00:32:51,680 Speaker 1: the USSR and take it all. Um. But the USSR 550 00:32:51,760 --> 00:32:58,320 Speaker 1: tried to join Hitler basically oops, yeah, exactly. It doesn't 551 00:32:58,320 --> 00:33:01,200 Speaker 1: look great in retrospect. The biggest deal, of course, was 552 00:33:01,280 --> 00:33:03,479 Speaker 1: how the uss ARE invaded a bunch of places, uh, 553 00:33:03,560 --> 00:33:05,920 Speaker 1: and then sent millions of tons of food to Hitler 554 00:33:06,040 --> 00:33:08,840 Speaker 1: because there was the Western Powers had a blockade on Germany, 555 00:33:08,880 --> 00:33:11,080 Speaker 1: you know, and so they would like send shipped all 556 00:33:11,080 --> 00:33:15,880 Speaker 1: the way from the eastern part of Russia. But there's 557 00:33:15,880 --> 00:33:18,320 Speaker 1: another thing that mattered at all of this too. All 558 00:33:18,360 --> 00:33:21,040 Speaker 1: the communist parties in the West were forced to become 559 00:33:21,040 --> 00:33:25,800 Speaker 1: anti anti fascist because now anti fascism so like, so 560 00:33:25,960 --> 00:33:29,760 Speaker 1: communist communists in parliament in France, like a few weeks earlier, 561 00:33:29,880 --> 00:33:32,920 Speaker 1: had voted unanimously for war against Germany, but then they 562 00:33:32,960 --> 00:33:36,080 Speaker 1: were like suddenly against the war and called it imperialist. 563 00:33:36,480 --> 00:33:39,400 Speaker 1: It would be imperialist for France to attack Nazi Germany. 564 00:33:40,000 --> 00:33:46,560 Speaker 1: Mm hmmm, because the Soviet Union was suddenly friends. Yeah, 565 00:33:51,320 --> 00:33:53,360 Speaker 1: I guess there's always a bit of bastards in every 566 00:33:53,400 --> 00:33:56,800 Speaker 1: episode about good people. And all the anti fascist organizations 567 00:33:56,840 --> 00:33:59,760 Speaker 1: that were just communist front groups got dissolved, or some 568 00:34:00,000 --> 00:34:03,360 Speaker 1: times they did worse than dissolve. The Hollywood Anti Nazi 569 00:34:03,440 --> 00:34:06,800 Speaker 1: League didn't just dissolve, It joined the American Peace Mobilization, 570 00:34:07,320 --> 00:34:10,440 Speaker 1: an organization dedicated to keeping the US from helping Britain 571 00:34:10,440 --> 00:34:14,600 Speaker 1: and France in their fight against the fucking Nazis. Okay um, 572 00:34:14,960 --> 00:34:20,400 Speaker 1: And how does one thing become the other? So I 573 00:34:20,520 --> 00:34:24,160 Speaker 1: think I think what happened was all of the like 574 00:34:24,840 --> 00:34:28,719 Speaker 1: regular anti fascists get out of the group, right, because 575 00:34:28,760 --> 00:34:32,200 Speaker 1: the group dissolves officially and becomes this other group, and 576 00:34:32,280 --> 00:34:33,840 Speaker 1: then all of the people who are there because they 577 00:34:33,880 --> 00:34:38,960 Speaker 1: were like communists loyal to the USSR stay and become 578 00:34:39,040 --> 00:34:42,920 Speaker 1: anti anti fascists, got it, and they start fighting against 579 00:34:43,040 --> 00:34:46,960 Speaker 1: military recruitment until of course the Nazis invade the USSR, 580 00:34:47,440 --> 00:34:50,279 Speaker 1: and then they became the American People's Mobilization and then 581 00:34:50,320 --> 00:34:51,840 Speaker 1: they tried to get the US into the war. And 582 00:34:51,920 --> 00:34:53,800 Speaker 1: then after the war, during the Cold War, they decide 583 00:34:53,880 --> 00:34:56,600 Speaker 1: now they're pacifists and they become the National Committee to 584 00:34:56,640 --> 00:35:00,800 Speaker 1: Win the Peace. Mm hmmm, which is I guess, like 585 00:35:00,920 --> 00:35:03,080 Speaker 1: my takeaway from this is it's cool to be coalition 586 00:35:03,160 --> 00:35:05,120 Speaker 1: with other anti fascists, but maybe don't trust the people 587 00:35:05,120 --> 00:35:10,279 Speaker 1: who are only into it for some weird, other shady reason. Yeah, right, 588 00:35:10,960 --> 00:35:13,400 Speaker 1: And that's why again, transparency is nice. You gotta have 589 00:35:13,440 --> 00:35:17,799 Speaker 1: these conversations similar to the conversation that what was his name, 590 00:35:18,000 --> 00:35:23,399 Speaker 1: Fritz Lang should have had with his wife about how 591 00:35:23,520 --> 00:35:26,799 Speaker 1: she was a Nazi. Um, you know, maybe be like, hey, 592 00:35:26,880 --> 00:35:32,279 Speaker 1: why are you in this group? Totally? You pick out 593 00:35:32,320 --> 00:35:35,399 Speaker 1: your friends based on that? Are you trying to say 594 00:35:35,440 --> 00:35:37,360 Speaker 1: that Fritz Lang could have become a stand up comedian 595 00:35:37,560 --> 00:35:43,680 Speaker 1: with my wife jokes. Yes, he would be like, get 596 00:35:43,719 --> 00:35:51,040 Speaker 1: a load of my wife, she's a Nazi. Um, And 597 00:35:51,160 --> 00:35:53,359 Speaker 1: that's and that's a perfect joke that I just wrote. 598 00:35:53,400 --> 00:35:58,680 Speaker 1: Believe it or not. Yeah, Okay, um, it's part of 599 00:35:58,840 --> 00:36:02,520 Speaker 1: Shrek for whatever, whatever your next movie is after Shrek. 600 00:36:02,520 --> 00:36:04,600 Speaker 1: I don't know how many Shreks there are. There's um, 601 00:36:04,880 --> 00:36:12,120 Speaker 1: I've started in four Shreks. This is Shrek five exactly. Okay, 602 00:36:12,800 --> 00:36:18,200 Speaker 1: hence hence forth coming what I my brain. It's not 603 00:36:18,440 --> 00:36:22,400 Speaker 1: the best today, Okay. Well, I will say that the 604 00:36:22,719 --> 00:36:26,640 Speaker 1: liberal ish, the not actual anti Nazis in Hollywood, they 605 00:36:26,680 --> 00:36:29,400 Speaker 1: did come together in a not controlled by Stalin way um, 606 00:36:29,680 --> 00:36:33,000 Speaker 1: and they pushed for progressive themes in film during the 607 00:36:33,080 --> 00:36:36,480 Speaker 1: war and after the war, and most famous among these 608 00:36:36,560 --> 00:36:40,600 Speaker 1: is the progressive Orson Wells. But we've got to talk 609 00:36:40,640 --> 00:36:43,200 Speaker 1: more about the lead up to the war. Megan Feenie, 610 00:36:43,200 --> 00:36:45,760 Speaker 1: in an article for the site and Movie, described Hollywood 611 00:36:45,840 --> 00:36:47,719 Speaker 1: once the US was involved in the war and said 612 00:36:48,520 --> 00:36:51,799 Speaker 1: the war represented a pivotal moment in Hollywood history, one 613 00:36:51,840 --> 00:36:54,040 Speaker 1: in which the US film industry came to take itself 614 00:36:54,120 --> 00:36:58,359 Speaker 1: seriously as a significant socio political force. Hollywood's left liberal 615 00:36:58,400 --> 00:37:01,160 Speaker 1: filmmakers ascended during the war, and in close collaboration with 616 00:37:01,200 --> 00:37:04,680 Speaker 1: the Roosevelt administration, used fascism as a foil to redefine 617 00:37:04,760 --> 00:37:08,120 Speaker 1: the so called American War on their own terms, emphasizing 618 00:37:08,160 --> 00:37:13,520 Speaker 1: popular democracy, civil liberties, religious tolerance, ethnic pluralism, and liberal internationalism. 619 00:37:15,040 --> 00:37:18,160 Speaker 1: And so the anti war movies that were happening during 620 00:37:18,200 --> 00:37:20,239 Speaker 1: the war weren't just we hate the Nazis from like 621 00:37:20,320 --> 00:37:21,719 Speaker 1: kind of a right wing point of view. They were 622 00:37:21,760 --> 00:37:24,839 Speaker 1: being made by the people who are like mostly being 623 00:37:24,920 --> 00:37:26,880 Speaker 1: made by the people who are the most versed in 624 00:37:27,000 --> 00:37:31,400 Speaker 1: being actually anti Nazi, being leftists, you know. And this 625 00:37:31,560 --> 00:37:34,759 Speaker 1: is in contrast to how later during the Cold War, 626 00:37:34,880 --> 00:37:37,800 Speaker 1: starting the late forties, conservatives take control of Hollywood and 627 00:37:38,040 --> 00:37:40,440 Speaker 1: bring Hollywood back to its like so called a political 628 00:37:40,520 --> 00:37:43,920 Speaker 1: past of being conservative, and you get the Red Scare, 629 00:37:44,040 --> 00:37:48,879 Speaker 1: you get the Hollywood blacklist, um and the at this point, 630 00:37:49,040 --> 00:37:52,320 Speaker 1: at that point, the the like leftists in Hollywood or 631 00:37:52,360 --> 00:37:55,839 Speaker 1: even just the like anti censorship people in Hollywood kind 632 00:37:55,880 --> 00:37:58,000 Speaker 1: of pivot to just being First Amendment groups. Instead of 633 00:37:58,080 --> 00:38:01,280 Speaker 1: being like fighting for liberal ideas in Hollywood, they're literally 634 00:38:01,360 --> 00:38:03,560 Speaker 1: fighting for like please just let us have fucking free speech, 635 00:38:03,600 --> 00:38:08,960 Speaker 1: what the fuck right? And unfortunately, one of our previous heroes, 636 00:38:09,120 --> 00:38:11,880 Speaker 1: the Warner brother, Jack Warner, testified to the House of 637 00:38:11,920 --> 00:38:15,960 Speaker 1: on American Activities and fired the co writer of Confessions 638 00:38:15,960 --> 00:38:18,279 Speaker 1: of a Nazi Spy because that guy might have been 639 00:38:18,320 --> 00:38:22,920 Speaker 1: like secretly communist or whatever the fuck. But back to 640 00:38:23,000 --> 00:38:25,759 Speaker 1: the golden age of anti fascist filmmaking also known as 641 00:38:25,800 --> 00:38:30,400 Speaker 1: World War Two. I love accidentally saying positive things about 642 00:38:30,760 --> 00:38:34,680 Speaker 1: one of the worst things. Okay, anyway, it's this anti 643 00:38:34,760 --> 00:38:37,960 Speaker 1: fascist era that gives us the Nazis the ultimate villain um, 644 00:38:38,200 --> 00:38:40,680 Speaker 1: and it also gives us the unfortunate like good war 645 00:38:40,960 --> 00:38:43,320 Speaker 1: narrative and the idea that like America is the savior 646 00:38:43,360 --> 00:38:47,279 Speaker 1: of humanity. And then I found it even more of 647 00:38:47,360 --> 00:38:49,920 Speaker 1: disturbing ship that even the lefties and liberals were doing 648 00:38:49,960 --> 00:38:51,239 Speaker 1: at this time, or at least some of them were. 649 00:38:52,000 --> 00:38:54,680 Speaker 1: So you know how like Nazis are like the ultimate 650 00:38:54,760 --> 00:38:58,600 Speaker 1: villain right in Hollywood, they didn't start out that way, 651 00:38:59,320 --> 00:39:06,680 Speaker 1: um because of racism. More films with Nazis, like films 652 00:39:06,719 --> 00:39:08,960 Speaker 1: with Nazis started off before the war like really got 653 00:39:09,040 --> 00:39:11,560 Speaker 1: in where like usually the Nazis could be like redeemed 654 00:39:12,040 --> 00:39:15,640 Speaker 1: right and like a lot of like Nazi collaborators like 655 00:39:15,719 --> 00:39:19,200 Speaker 1: come around to see the light. The Japanese, however, were 656 00:39:19,320 --> 00:39:22,319 Speaker 1: presented as monsters, and the Japanese were to be fought 657 00:39:22,360 --> 00:39:24,800 Speaker 1: in a similar way to other like classic monsters of 658 00:39:24,840 --> 00:39:28,560 Speaker 1: the screen, the indigenous people of North America, who the 659 00:39:28,680 --> 00:39:30,920 Speaker 1: US was, you know, continuing it's war of genocide and 660 00:39:31,000 --> 00:39:35,960 Speaker 1: expension against So basically everyone can twist anti fascism into 661 00:39:36,280 --> 00:39:40,400 Speaker 1: obnoxious propagandistic ends to do really bad things. That's my 662 00:39:41,160 --> 00:39:43,000 Speaker 1: that's actually turned into more of a bastard's episode than 663 00:39:43,000 --> 00:39:46,719 Speaker 1: I thought. Okay, actually that we're about to get into 664 00:39:46,760 --> 00:39:50,480 Speaker 1: the most complicated of them all. I'm ready, okay. And 665 00:39:50,560 --> 00:39:52,320 Speaker 1: the lead up to this anti fascist film era, you 666 00:39:52,400 --> 00:39:55,080 Speaker 1: get the Warner Brothers being pretty consistently cool, and a 667 00:39:55,160 --> 00:39:57,400 Speaker 1: few more people start coming on board. You've got a 668 00:39:57,440 --> 00:40:00,600 Speaker 1: producer Walter Wanger, who puts hen I Fonda in the 669 00:40:00,640 --> 00:40:04,200 Speaker 1: Spanish Civil War movie in ninety eight called Blockade, and 670 00:40:04,719 --> 00:40:07,040 Speaker 1: gets Alfred Hitchcock to make an anti fascist film in 671 00:40:07,080 --> 00:40:11,000 Speaker 1: nineteen forty called Foreign Correspondent. Hitchcock made more movies during 672 00:40:11,040 --> 00:40:16,520 Speaker 1: the war. And then you get Charlie fucking Chaplin, Oh 673 00:40:16,840 --> 00:40:22,200 Speaker 1: the Great Dictator. Yeah, And and Charlie Chaplin. He gets both. 674 00:40:22,840 --> 00:40:25,080 Speaker 1: Charlie fucking Chaplin A isn't like hell yeah because of 675 00:40:25,120 --> 00:40:27,000 Speaker 1: some of the interesting shit he did, and he gets 676 00:40:27,200 --> 00:40:30,000 Speaker 1: Charlie fucking Chaplin because what the funk is wrong with 677 00:40:30,080 --> 00:40:32,120 Speaker 1: this guy? What the funk is wrong with this guy? 678 00:40:32,320 --> 00:40:35,279 Speaker 1: He did some bad things. He did do some bad things. 679 00:40:35,360 --> 00:40:36,719 Speaker 1: We're gonna talk about some of them, and if you 680 00:40:36,760 --> 00:40:41,000 Speaker 1: know more of them, please um. Charlie Chaplin is maybe 681 00:40:41,120 --> 00:40:44,719 Speaker 1: the most dramatic, rags richest entertainment story in history, not 682 00:40:44,880 --> 00:40:48,359 Speaker 1: just filmmaking, just fucking all over. He was born four 683 00:40:48,440 --> 00:40:50,600 Speaker 1: days before Hitler. A lot of people like make weird 684 00:40:50,640 --> 00:40:52,880 Speaker 1: comparisons about the fact that he's like just like Hitler 685 00:40:53,400 --> 00:40:55,880 Speaker 1: because he was the same age and also had a 686 00:40:56,120 --> 00:41:01,680 Speaker 1: toothbrush mustache. He was born in April sixteen nine. He 687 00:41:01,760 --> 00:41:05,080 Speaker 1: grew up dirt fucking poor in South London to a 688 00:41:05,200 --> 00:41:08,520 Speaker 1: probably Roma family in a community of like sex workers 689 00:41:08,560 --> 00:41:11,400 Speaker 1: and buskers and like just like down and out folks 690 00:41:11,719 --> 00:41:13,880 Speaker 1: coming up with the creative means by which to survive. 691 00:41:14,200 --> 00:41:17,960 Speaker 1: He might have been born in Avardo, the the wagons 692 00:41:18,040 --> 00:41:23,080 Speaker 1: that Roma folks would would have and he grew up 693 00:41:23,200 --> 00:41:25,759 Speaker 1: more or less orphaned. And he's not even fucking seven 694 00:41:25,840 --> 00:41:27,880 Speaker 1: years old when he's like clog dancing on the streets 695 00:41:27,920 --> 00:41:29,960 Speaker 1: outside bars for money. And you know what he could 696 00:41:30,000 --> 00:41:36,000 Speaker 1: have done with that money, Caitlin Durante. Um, yeah, I 697 00:41:36,080 --> 00:41:40,600 Speaker 1: can imagine a few things. But why don't you know? Yeah, yeah, 698 00:41:40,640 --> 00:41:44,839 Speaker 1: he could have purchased products and services. Oh I see 699 00:41:44,880 --> 00:41:48,239 Speaker 1: what you were doing. Yeah yeah, yeah, no, sorry, Um, 700 00:41:49,120 --> 00:41:51,600 Speaker 1: products and services, much like those that support the show, 701 00:41:51,719 --> 00:41:56,800 Speaker 1: the concept of potatoes are perennial sponsor. Everyone should well know, 702 00:41:56,960 --> 00:41:58,840 Speaker 1: some people should eat potatoes and some people shouldn't, but 703 00:41:59,040 --> 00:42:02,839 Speaker 1: people should do whatever they want. Food. Food is good. Okay, 704 00:42:02,920 --> 00:42:10,000 Speaker 1: here's some ads, and we are back, and we're talking 705 00:42:10,040 --> 00:42:14,760 Speaker 1: about Charlie Chaplin. Uh. He's clogged dancing on the streets 706 00:42:14,800 --> 00:42:18,320 Speaker 1: for money. He gets discovered and on the streets he 707 00:42:18,360 --> 00:42:20,560 Speaker 1: gets given a job of the theater troop. At age seven, 708 00:42:21,120 --> 00:42:24,040 Speaker 1: he learns physical comedy. He moves to America to make 709 00:42:24,120 --> 00:42:27,640 Speaker 1: films in the nineteen tens, and by age six he's 710 00:42:27,680 --> 00:42:30,120 Speaker 1: maybe the most famous man in the world. People refer 711 00:42:30,200 --> 00:42:33,520 Speaker 1: to it as like the world was suffering from chaplainitis. Um. 712 00:42:33,960 --> 00:42:38,120 Speaker 1: The He's like the symbol of popular culture. And there's 713 00:42:38,160 --> 00:42:41,120 Speaker 1: two stories to tell about Chaplin because and they're fucking 714 00:42:41,160 --> 00:42:43,080 Speaker 1: message to resolve with each other. And I think that 715 00:42:43,600 --> 00:42:45,719 Speaker 1: learning how to not necessarily resolve with these with each other, 716 00:42:45,800 --> 00:42:49,000 Speaker 1: but understand them both, I think it's like crucial. Sure, 717 00:42:49,440 --> 00:42:52,719 Speaker 1: I'm gonna start with the bad story, um, because before 718 00:42:52,760 --> 00:42:54,640 Speaker 1: I say cool about a guy, I want to say 719 00:42:54,719 --> 00:42:59,239 Speaker 1: he sucks. He he's a fucking monster. He is an 720 00:42:59,320 --> 00:43:02,120 Speaker 1: early exam bull of why Hollywood is a misogynist cesspool 721 00:43:02,239 --> 00:43:06,640 Speaker 1: run by fucking predators. Yeah, he bragged to have slept 722 00:43:06,680 --> 00:43:10,000 Speaker 1: with two thousand women in his lifetime. He never trusted women. 723 00:43:10,360 --> 00:43:13,960 Speaker 1: He constantly married children. He always waited until they were 724 00:43:14,000 --> 00:43:17,560 Speaker 1: sixteen to marry them. His first wife, Mildred Harris, was 725 00:43:17,640 --> 00:43:20,480 Speaker 1: sixteen when they got married. The stories that she feigned 726 00:43:20,480 --> 00:43:23,600 Speaker 1: pregnancy to get married, but I don't know that's his story, 727 00:43:23,760 --> 00:43:27,160 Speaker 1: and I don't fucking trust anything he has to say. Um. 728 00:43:28,600 --> 00:43:31,800 Speaker 1: And once they got married, she wound up institutionalized for weeks, 729 00:43:32,680 --> 00:43:35,200 Speaker 1: and when she divorced him, she cited cruelty as the 730 00:43:35,239 --> 00:43:39,440 Speaker 1: reason for the divorce. He was a literal groomer. His 731 00:43:39,560 --> 00:43:43,280 Speaker 1: second wife, Leta Gray, was twelve. When they met at sixteen, 732 00:43:43,360 --> 00:43:46,279 Speaker 1: he started assaulting her, then married her while she was 733 00:43:46,480 --> 00:43:51,400 Speaker 1: pregnant to avoid statutory rape charges. Um. He tried to 734 00:43:51,440 --> 00:43:55,520 Speaker 1: pressure her into an abortion, but uh, and he also 735 00:43:55,600 --> 00:43:57,320 Speaker 1: and she said no to that. And then so he 736 00:43:57,400 --> 00:43:59,799 Speaker 1: tried to pick a random man her age to marry her, 737 00:43:59,840 --> 00:44:01,560 Speaker 1: to take the and then take care of the kid, 738 00:44:01,680 --> 00:44:03,960 Speaker 1: and offered like the man like two hundred thousand dollars 739 00:44:04,040 --> 00:44:06,759 Speaker 1: to do this, oh my god, m but she turned 740 00:44:06,800 --> 00:44:10,279 Speaker 1: that down as well. So he married her and called 741 00:44:10,320 --> 00:44:12,640 Speaker 1: her a little horror and told her to kill herself 742 00:44:13,040 --> 00:44:16,239 Speaker 1: because Charlie Chaplin is the fucking worst. She was around 743 00:44:16,320 --> 00:44:19,120 Speaker 1: nineteen when he divorced her. His next wife was a 744 00:44:19,160 --> 00:44:21,600 Speaker 1: seventeen year old who he claims told him that she 745 00:44:21,719 --> 00:44:26,520 Speaker 1: was twenty two. His final wife was thirty six years 746 00:44:26,560 --> 00:44:29,240 Speaker 1: younger than him. He was fifty four, she was eighteen. 747 00:44:30,080 --> 00:44:32,680 Speaker 1: She was terrified of him and regularly locked herself in 748 00:44:32,840 --> 00:44:36,640 Speaker 1: her room to get away from him. Ah. He had 749 00:44:36,800 --> 00:44:39,520 Speaker 1: tons of children. He was constantly cruel to all of them. 750 00:44:39,960 --> 00:44:45,000 Speaker 1: He got sued over parentage, lost that suit in six 751 00:44:45,080 --> 00:44:48,520 Speaker 1: He described his ideal woman as I am not exactly 752 00:44:48,600 --> 00:44:50,560 Speaker 1: in love with her, but she is entirely in love 753 00:44:50,640 --> 00:44:56,799 Speaker 1: with me. Okay, so he's in narcissist. Yeah. On top 754 00:44:56,880 --> 00:45:02,239 Speaker 1: of all that, I mean, well, yeah, funk that guy. 755 00:45:02,680 --> 00:45:04,759 Speaker 1: Yeah that was what I knew. I I didn't even 756 00:45:04,800 --> 00:45:06,880 Speaker 1: know most of those details. I just knew that he 757 00:45:07,080 --> 00:45:13,279 Speaker 1: was a um, sexual predator, slash child rapists. Yeah, yep, 758 00:45:13,560 --> 00:45:16,080 Speaker 1: he is absolutely those things. Well, fortunately now he's just 759 00:45:16,160 --> 00:45:19,319 Speaker 1: dead at a high school teacher who was obsessed with him, 760 00:45:19,360 --> 00:45:21,840 Speaker 1: and like, we had to watch so many of the films, 761 00:45:21,920 --> 00:45:25,640 Speaker 1: and I was just like, just like without knowing any 762 00:45:25,680 --> 00:45:28,800 Speaker 1: of this, it's just like the the unbelievable amount of 763 00:45:28,880 --> 00:45:31,080 Speaker 1: red flags you see even in his work, you know 764 00:45:31,160 --> 00:45:35,960 Speaker 1: what I mean. Yeah. I like the way that it's 765 00:45:36,000 --> 00:45:37,840 Speaker 1: been a long time since I watched Chaplin films. I 766 00:45:37,920 --> 00:45:39,319 Speaker 1: used to watch them a lot when I was younger. 767 00:45:39,520 --> 00:45:44,480 Speaker 1: Um yeah, no, it's it's um. Now I'm going to 768 00:45:44,560 --> 00:45:50,399 Speaker 1: tell you about anti fascism and film. Please please tell 769 00:45:50,520 --> 00:45:56,000 Speaker 1: us magpie. Yeah, okay, So the other story about Charlie 770 00:45:56,040 --> 00:45:59,920 Speaker 1: Chaplin is it a story about an anti fascist filmmaker 771 00:46:00,000 --> 00:46:03,120 Speaker 1: who risks his entire career, who tanks his entire career 772 00:46:03,640 --> 00:46:08,360 Speaker 1: two try and stop the Nazis. In this story, m 773 00:46:09,160 --> 00:46:12,000 Speaker 1: It is his unshakable self confidence that one might call 774 00:46:12,120 --> 00:46:15,440 Speaker 1: narcissism that allowed him to survive on the streets of 775 00:46:15,480 --> 00:46:18,759 Speaker 1: Victorian London as a fucking like seven year old orphan. 776 00:46:19,480 --> 00:46:22,840 Speaker 1: You know. Um. It offered him the self confidence, and 777 00:46:22,920 --> 00:46:25,640 Speaker 1: he offered that self confidence to his viewers into the world. 778 00:46:26,000 --> 00:46:28,759 Speaker 1: He described how he survived in his youth by the 779 00:46:28,840 --> 00:46:31,880 Speaker 1: exuberance that comes from utter confidence in yourself. Without it, 780 00:46:32,000 --> 00:46:35,239 Speaker 1: you go down in defeat. And his main character, the 781 00:46:35,280 --> 00:46:38,000 Speaker 1: Little Tramp. No matter what happens, he picks himself up 782 00:46:38,000 --> 00:46:42,000 Speaker 1: and he trots off jauntily into the sunset. It's also 783 00:46:42,080 --> 00:46:45,239 Speaker 1: the story of a person with an unshakable political moral 784 00:46:45,280 --> 00:46:48,719 Speaker 1: compass with the largest blind spot the world has ever seen, 785 00:46:50,640 --> 00:46:53,279 Speaker 1: an unshakable moral compass when it's applied on a geopolitical 786 00:46:53,360 --> 00:46:57,600 Speaker 1: level instead of an interpersonal level. UH. In the nineteen thirties, 787 00:46:57,640 --> 00:47:01,080 Speaker 1: he did radio broadcast supporting the New Deal and his 788 00:47:01,239 --> 00:47:04,080 Speaker 1: first talkie, his first non silent movie. Um. He was 789 00:47:04,120 --> 00:47:05,560 Speaker 1: like one of the last people to want to switch 790 00:47:05,640 --> 00:47:09,920 Speaker 1: over to two talkies. Was The Great Dictator in and 791 00:47:10,040 --> 00:47:12,719 Speaker 1: it came out before the US entered the war. His 792 00:47:12,840 --> 00:47:16,360 Speaker 1: Little Tramp character is modified slightly into a Jewish barber, 793 00:47:16,680 --> 00:47:19,400 Speaker 1: and he also plays a like really obvious Hitler clone. 794 00:47:20,200 --> 00:47:22,200 Speaker 1: And it's the first and this is the first time 795 00:47:22,320 --> 00:47:24,920 Speaker 1: that a Hollywood film acknowledges that the Nazis were specifically 796 00:47:24,960 --> 00:47:27,520 Speaker 1: after the Jews. And I think it's interesting to me 797 00:47:27,640 --> 00:47:29,400 Speaker 1: that also the fact that he was roma like this 798 00:47:29,560 --> 00:47:36,120 Speaker 1: is something that you know affects him right, right, and 799 00:47:36,280 --> 00:47:38,239 Speaker 1: it it brings us one of the greatest moments in 800 00:47:38,280 --> 00:47:40,960 Speaker 1: political Hollywood history. At the end of the film, the 801 00:47:41,000 --> 00:47:43,560 Speaker 1: Jewish barber is mistaken for the Dictator and he goes 802 00:47:43,600 --> 00:47:46,080 Speaker 1: up and he gives a speech, and the film gets 803 00:47:46,160 --> 00:47:49,279 Speaker 1: rid of the fourth wall, much as Breckt and all 804 00:47:49,280 --> 00:47:51,839 Speaker 1: the other people would have liked, right and specifically as 805 00:47:51,880 --> 00:47:54,880 Speaker 1: a way to counter propaganda, look directly at the camera 806 00:47:55,000 --> 00:47:56,840 Speaker 1: and talk. Which is interesting because I feel like, now, 807 00:47:56,880 --> 00:47:59,000 Speaker 1: if you did that, it would kind of read as propagandistick, 808 00:47:59,360 --> 00:48:03,000 Speaker 1: and like this speech that he gives is kind of propagandistic, 809 00:48:03,200 --> 00:48:05,359 Speaker 1: but by breaking the fourth wallet ties into this art 810 00:48:05,400 --> 00:48:07,839 Speaker 1: movement at the time of using that to get people 811 00:48:07,880 --> 00:48:11,280 Speaker 1: to question ship. So the Jewish barber goes up pretending 812 00:48:11,320 --> 00:48:13,600 Speaker 1: to be the dictator and he gives a speech about 813 00:48:13,719 --> 00:48:15,960 Speaker 1: how we should destroy national borders, How we should never 814 00:48:16,040 --> 00:48:19,640 Speaker 1: listen to despots, How soldiers should fight for democracy and 815 00:48:19,719 --> 00:48:23,200 Speaker 1: against dictatorship. And I'm gonna I'm gonna read part of it. 816 00:48:24,080 --> 00:48:26,320 Speaker 1: I don't want to rule or conquer anyone. I should 817 00:48:26,360 --> 00:48:29,479 Speaker 1: like to help everyone if possible. Jew, gentile, black, man white. 818 00:48:29,920 --> 00:48:32,080 Speaker 1: We all want to help one another. Human beings are 819 00:48:32,160 --> 00:48:34,480 Speaker 1: like that. We want to live by each other's happiness, 820 00:48:34,760 --> 00:48:37,200 Speaker 1: not for each by each other's misery. We don't want 821 00:48:37,239 --> 00:48:39,880 Speaker 1: to hate and despise one another. In this world. There 822 00:48:39,960 --> 00:48:42,200 Speaker 1: is room for everyone, and the good Earth is rich 823 00:48:42,280 --> 00:48:44,799 Speaker 1: and can provide for everyone. The way of life can 824 00:48:44,840 --> 00:48:46,839 Speaker 1: be free and beautiful. But we have lost the way. 825 00:48:47,320 --> 00:48:50,839 Speaker 1: Greed has poisoned men's souls, has barricaded the world with hate, 826 00:48:51,000 --> 00:48:53,480 Speaker 1: has goose stepped us into misery and bloodshed. We have 827 00:48:53,560 --> 00:48:57,120 Speaker 1: developed speed, but we have shut ourselves in. Machinery gives abundance. 828 00:48:57,520 --> 00:48:59,880 Speaker 1: That gives abundance has left us in want are not 829 00:49:00,040 --> 00:49:02,920 Speaker 1: Ledge has made a cynical our, cleverness hard and unkind. 830 00:49:03,360 --> 00:49:06,440 Speaker 1: We think too much and feel too little. More than machinery, 831 00:49:06,520 --> 00:49:09,640 Speaker 1: we need humanity more than cleverness. We need kindness and gentleness. 832 00:49:09,880 --> 00:49:12,160 Speaker 1: Without these qualities, life will be violent and all will 833 00:49:12,200 --> 00:49:15,160 Speaker 1: be lost, and he just goes on in this like 834 00:49:15,280 --> 00:49:18,920 Speaker 1: complete not what people are sucking doing in movies at 835 00:49:18,960 --> 00:49:22,600 Speaker 1: the time, m hm. And he spent two years making 836 00:49:22,640 --> 00:49:25,520 Speaker 1: The Great Dictator, and all the while the English and 837 00:49:25,560 --> 00:49:28,319 Speaker 1: American censors because England isn't at war at the start. 838 00:49:28,440 --> 00:49:31,400 Speaker 1: England isn't at war with Nazi Germany either, and they're like, 839 00:49:32,000 --> 00:49:34,440 Speaker 1: don't fucking make this movie. We're at peace with Hitler. 840 00:49:34,600 --> 00:49:38,000 Speaker 1: You can't make fun of Hitler. And he basically is like, 841 00:49:38,040 --> 00:49:39,879 Speaker 1: all right, well, I'm going to hire all the movie 842 00:49:39,920 --> 00:49:42,799 Speaker 1: halls myself. I'm the most famous man in the world, 843 00:49:42,880 --> 00:49:46,080 Speaker 1: and I'm going to fucking make this anti Nazi film mhm, 844 00:49:46,640 --> 00:49:50,440 Speaker 1: because I fucking hate Hitler. And before he finishes, a 845 00:49:50,719 --> 00:49:53,279 Speaker 1: war was on and France was conquered and England was 846 00:49:53,320 --> 00:49:56,120 Speaker 1: at war with Germany and the US hadn't entered the 847 00:49:56,160 --> 00:50:00,120 Speaker 1: war yet. It winds up his highest grossing film to 848 00:50:00,239 --> 00:50:03,240 Speaker 1: that date, but it's controversial. A lot of the critics 849 00:50:03,320 --> 00:50:05,759 Speaker 1: at the last speech was just him declaring communism, which 850 00:50:05,840 --> 00:50:08,560 Speaker 1: is funny because it's a speech about democracy, like literally 851 00:50:08,640 --> 00:50:11,160 Speaker 1: used the word democracy over and over again. M hmm. 852 00:50:11,800 --> 00:50:13,560 Speaker 1: And the press starts to hate him at this point, 853 00:50:14,000 --> 00:50:16,520 Speaker 1: and he he literally tanks his career with this. All 854 00:50:16,600 --> 00:50:19,359 Speaker 1: of his films afterwards played to his existing fan base, 855 00:50:19,600 --> 00:50:23,240 Speaker 1: but failed to attract new audiences because the press spence 856 00:50:23,280 --> 00:50:26,600 Speaker 1: the rest of his life attacking him. Sometimes they the 857 00:50:26,640 --> 00:50:28,440 Speaker 1: press gets it right, and they attack him for being 858 00:50:28,480 --> 00:50:33,120 Speaker 1: a fucking child, raping piece of shit, fucking absolute monster. Yeah, 859 00:50:34,040 --> 00:50:36,839 Speaker 1: you will be surprised to know that. Mostly they spend 860 00:50:36,880 --> 00:50:40,560 Speaker 1: all of their time calling him a communist, which he wasn't, 861 00:50:41,480 --> 00:50:45,880 Speaker 1: but even if he was, you know, right, and his 862 00:50:46,000 --> 00:50:50,360 Speaker 1: film start being picketed after the Great Dictator and some 863 00:50:50,480 --> 00:50:52,919 Speaker 1: other filmmakers love the speech. At least one director puts 864 00:50:52,960 --> 00:50:55,200 Speaker 1: the whole text into like his Christmas card that year, 865 00:50:55,400 --> 00:50:58,279 Speaker 1: which is like the most like lefty Hollywood thing I 866 00:50:58,320 --> 00:51:02,640 Speaker 1: can imagine someone doing. He reads it to about sixty 867 00:51:02,680 --> 00:51:06,239 Speaker 1: million people on the radio. Um. But while he's reading it, 868 00:51:06,360 --> 00:51:09,880 Speaker 1: he's in a hall and Nazis, American Nazis in the 869 00:51:09,920 --> 00:51:12,680 Speaker 1: audience are like jeering him and coughing really loudly and 870 00:51:12,719 --> 00:51:16,080 Speaker 1: trying to disrupt the whole thing. And he also in 871 00:51:16,200 --> 00:51:20,279 Speaker 1: his autobiography, he wrote about the film, quote, had I 872 00:51:20,360 --> 00:51:22,759 Speaker 1: known the actual horrors of the German concentration camps. I 873 00:51:22,800 --> 00:51:25,000 Speaker 1: could not have made the Great Dictator. I could not 874 00:51:25,120 --> 00:51:28,120 Speaker 1: have made fun of the homicidal insanity of the Nazis. However, 875 00:51:28,280 --> 00:51:30,680 Speaker 1: I was determined to ridicule their mystic builge about a 876 00:51:30,719 --> 00:51:36,279 Speaker 1: pure blooded race. And uh, it seems like you can 877 00:51:36,480 --> 00:51:39,080 Speaker 1: you can react as this, like tension or weirdness, like 878 00:51:41,600 --> 00:51:48,440 Speaker 1: I'm just over here processing. I'm like, still, no, keep 879 00:51:48,480 --> 00:51:52,239 Speaker 1: going and I'm still collecting my thoughts. He doesn't stop 880 00:51:52,280 --> 00:51:54,560 Speaker 1: his anti Nazi stuff with just making a film. He 881 00:51:54,640 --> 00:51:56,200 Speaker 1: fox up his whole career by going out on a 882 00:51:56,239 --> 00:51:58,520 Speaker 1: limb over politics. Time and time again, he gives speeches 883 00:51:58,520 --> 00:52:00,480 Speaker 1: about how America needs to help angle and open up 884 00:52:00,480 --> 00:52:03,239 Speaker 1: a second front against the war. While the Nazis were 885 00:52:03,280 --> 00:52:06,000 Speaker 1: busy fighting in the USSR. He talked with Roosevelt and 886 00:52:06,080 --> 00:52:08,480 Speaker 1: with previous presidents, anyone who would listen about why the 887 00:52:08,600 --> 00:52:10,800 Speaker 1: US needed to join the war and ally themselves with 888 00:52:10,880 --> 00:52:15,040 Speaker 1: England and Russia. Um, and he makes no bones about 889 00:52:15,040 --> 00:52:18,759 Speaker 1: being like, yes, and Russia. I don't care that they're communists, right, Um, 890 00:52:18,880 --> 00:52:22,359 Speaker 1: I hate Nazis. In the middle of his autobiography, while 891 00:52:22,400 --> 00:52:25,279 Speaker 1: talking about the speeches, he was giving he like, and 892 00:52:25,360 --> 00:52:28,480 Speaker 1: all the flat users he got. He stops and then 893 00:52:28,560 --> 00:52:30,600 Speaker 1: spends like a paragraph talking about the tits of some 894 00:52:30,719 --> 00:52:34,480 Speaker 1: lady that he saw, because he's a piece of ship. 895 00:52:35,280 --> 00:52:39,640 Speaker 1: There's no other um. He gets labeled a communist, which 896 00:52:39,640 --> 00:52:41,720 Speaker 1: he denies his entire life because he wasn't a communist. 897 00:52:41,800 --> 00:52:44,879 Speaker 1: He called himself two things instead. This part makes me sad. 898 00:52:45,000 --> 00:52:47,760 Speaker 1: He called himself a peacemonger, and he called himself an anarchist, 899 00:52:47,880 --> 00:52:52,640 Speaker 1: and I don't want him. In ninety seven, he put 900 00:52:52,680 --> 00:52:55,120 Speaker 1: out A King in New York, and he's playing a 901 00:52:55,239 --> 00:52:57,320 Speaker 1: king and his own ten year old son plays a 902 00:52:57,400 --> 00:53:00,160 Speaker 1: kid who choose choose him out about how he old 903 00:53:00,160 --> 00:53:03,480 Speaker 1: giant corporations are and how national borders is like shitty, 904 00:53:03,560 --> 00:53:06,920 Speaker 1: and the whole thing is this anti McCarthy film. In 905 00:53:07,040 --> 00:53:09,359 Speaker 1: the same year he says he's an anarchist. He says, 906 00:53:09,360 --> 00:53:11,480 Speaker 1: as for politics, I'm an anarchist. I hate governments and 907 00:53:11,560 --> 00:53:14,919 Speaker 1: rules and fetters. Can't stand caged animals. People must be free, 908 00:53:15,680 --> 00:53:20,040 Speaker 1: except obviously not except teenage the women he was married to. Yeah, 909 00:53:20,120 --> 00:53:22,799 Speaker 1: the girl little girls he was married to, who are 910 00:53:22,880 --> 00:53:27,879 Speaker 1: hiding in their rooms from yet. Yeah. So he wasn't 911 00:53:27,880 --> 00:53:30,759 Speaker 1: American born, And one time in nineteen fifty two, while 912 00:53:30,760 --> 00:53:32,040 Speaker 1: he was out of the country, the U S sort 913 00:53:32,040 --> 00:53:34,600 Speaker 1: of doesn't invite him back because he's a filthy communist. 914 00:53:34,640 --> 00:53:37,160 Speaker 1: They review provoke his re entry permit and he moves 915 00:53:37,160 --> 00:53:40,480 Speaker 1: to Switzerland. Not you came here and sexually assaulted um 916 00:53:40,840 --> 00:53:44,799 Speaker 1: uncountable numbers of people, But you are a communist even 917 00:53:44,800 --> 00:53:48,439 Speaker 1: though you're not um. And this should be a story 918 00:53:48,480 --> 00:53:50,759 Speaker 1: about a Roma born anarchist filmaker makes himself into the 919 00:53:50,800 --> 00:53:52,520 Speaker 1: greatest star in the world, gambles at all the pressure 920 00:53:52,520 --> 00:53:54,880 Speaker 1: the US government public into going to war against Nazi empire, 921 00:53:55,320 --> 00:53:57,640 Speaker 1: and instead it's a story about gross fucking vanny ripped 922 00:53:57,640 --> 00:54:00,759 Speaker 1: teenagers who went to parties and his of entertaining people 923 00:54:00,760 --> 00:54:04,120 Speaker 1: at parties was to mimic a woman having an orgasm. Um, 924 00:54:04,840 --> 00:54:08,480 Speaker 1: So fuck you Charlie Chaplin for fucking all that up. 925 00:54:09,360 --> 00:54:13,840 Speaker 1: When Chaplin died, some grave robbers stole his body and 926 00:54:13,960 --> 00:54:16,440 Speaker 1: they held it for ransom. They called up one of 927 00:54:16,480 --> 00:54:18,440 Speaker 1: his ex wives and I was like, we've got Chaplin. 928 00:54:19,200 --> 00:54:25,520 Speaker 1: She says, so what and hangs up the phone. There 929 00:54:25,560 --> 00:54:28,520 Speaker 1: should be a whole episode of your podcast on just that. 930 00:54:28,760 --> 00:54:37,600 Speaker 1: And even yeah, yeah, so what click click I love 931 00:54:37,719 --> 00:54:42,600 Speaker 1: that I see And and Marlon Brando described Charlie Chaplin 932 00:54:42,680 --> 00:54:46,920 Speaker 1: as the most sadistic man I have ever met. Alright Brando, 933 00:54:47,239 --> 00:54:52,640 Speaker 1: alright Brando, And this is this is not how I 934 00:54:52,719 --> 00:54:55,440 Speaker 1: usually end an episode. Uh That's what I've got about it, 935 00:54:55,640 --> 00:54:58,840 Speaker 1: Like fast something and left is him that flows through filmmaking. 936 00:55:00,680 --> 00:55:05,440 Speaker 1: So what we've learned here today is that Shrek, uh, 937 00:55:05,800 --> 00:55:09,000 Speaker 1: not the ogre with the docky friend, but Max Shrek, 938 00:55:09,120 --> 00:55:12,880 Speaker 1: as far as we know, it wasn't a real life 939 00:55:13,719 --> 00:55:22,160 Speaker 1: monster slash uh predatory vampire literally like but um, yeah, 940 00:55:23,440 --> 00:55:27,320 Speaker 1: there's I mean, I'm glad there were um people I 941 00:55:27,880 --> 00:55:32,399 Speaker 1: never quite understand. I don't know, I've complicated feelings about 942 00:55:32,400 --> 00:55:38,279 Speaker 1: this because on one hand, Hollywood and many many of 943 00:55:38,360 --> 00:55:41,560 Speaker 1: not most film industries around the world are I mean, 944 00:55:41,600 --> 00:55:46,160 Speaker 1: they're all for sure capitalist, and they are you know, 945 00:55:46,280 --> 00:55:50,920 Speaker 1: priority number one is to make entertainment. Is you know, 946 00:55:51,080 --> 00:55:53,880 Speaker 1: to entertain and some of that. But but I think 947 00:55:53,920 --> 00:55:58,160 Speaker 1: a lot of people conflate the entertainment has to be 948 00:55:58,600 --> 00:56:05,239 Speaker 1: completely escapist and cannot also be informative or you know, 949 00:56:06,480 --> 00:56:11,160 Speaker 1: getting behind a particular movement or like political ideology or 950 00:56:11,400 --> 00:56:14,080 Speaker 1: like I don't know the people who are like, no, 951 00:56:14,360 --> 00:56:19,000 Speaker 1: entertainment should just be strictly entertainment all the time and 952 00:56:19,320 --> 00:56:22,560 Speaker 1: not anything that has any sort of like political message. 953 00:56:22,880 --> 00:56:27,880 Speaker 1: I don't trust those people because while a lot of 954 00:56:27,920 --> 00:56:32,240 Speaker 1: the entertainment I like is very strictly you know, like silly, mindless, 955 00:56:32,680 --> 00:56:37,760 Speaker 1: escapist media, a lot of it is also very political 956 00:56:37,960 --> 00:56:42,040 Speaker 1: or like you know, has some kind of message that 957 00:56:43,000 --> 00:56:47,759 Speaker 1: could be perceived as political. So I anyone who's like 958 00:56:48,400 --> 00:56:53,239 Speaker 1: entertainment should never be political. I don't. Again, I don't. 959 00:56:53,640 --> 00:56:57,279 Speaker 1: I just don't agree. So for the people who are 960 00:56:57,400 --> 00:57:01,920 Speaker 1: willing to with their platform arm and with their art 961 00:57:02,000 --> 00:57:05,960 Speaker 1: form and entertainment also push a political agenda, especially for 962 00:57:06,000 --> 00:57:12,000 Speaker 1: that political agenda is anti fascist. Um that's rock and roll. 963 00:57:13,239 --> 00:57:18,040 Speaker 1: So good for them, and fuck Charlie Chaplin the end 964 00:57:19,680 --> 00:57:23,880 Speaker 1: my tirade. Yeah yeah, Caitlin, do you have anything you 965 00:57:23,920 --> 00:57:29,640 Speaker 1: would like to plug? Um give hey speaking of anti 966 00:57:29,800 --> 00:57:38,720 Speaker 1: fascist media, the Bechtel cast is anti fascists. Yeah right, um? 967 00:57:39,680 --> 00:57:43,760 Speaker 1: And uh not only that, Jamie and I are um 968 00:57:44,800 --> 00:57:50,080 Speaker 1: good people who in our private lives are still good 969 00:57:50,400 --> 00:58:00,640 Speaker 1: and not um scary or just I co sign for 970 00:58:00,760 --> 00:58:05,560 Speaker 1: Jamie and Okay, thank you so much, really good, really 971 00:58:05,720 --> 00:58:12,560 Speaker 1: really good friends to me. Yeah, I've got I've got receipts. 972 00:58:13,480 --> 00:58:17,200 Speaker 1: Good of a person I am. I'm kidding. Cas talked 973 00:58:17,240 --> 00:58:24,680 Speaker 1: to me while I cried before okay forever, Um, Yeah, 974 00:58:24,840 --> 00:58:30,800 Speaker 1: I I believe um to quote Paddington to Okay, if 975 00:58:30,880 --> 00:58:33,360 Speaker 1: we are kind and polite, the world will be right. 976 00:58:33,440 --> 00:58:36,600 Speaker 1: And I behave that way in my public life and 977 00:58:36,720 --> 00:58:40,880 Speaker 1: in my private life. Excuse me, someone um who has 978 00:58:40,960 --> 00:58:43,840 Speaker 1: something to prove, had a very loud engine that just 979 00:58:44,040 --> 00:58:50,600 Speaker 1: drove by. Anyway, I can be followed, like what would 980 00:58:50,640 --> 00:58:54,320 Speaker 1: I say? You can follow me on social media at 981 00:58:55,240 --> 00:58:59,440 Speaker 1: Caitlin Darante on Twitter and Instagram. Hey, if you want 982 00:58:59,480 --> 00:59:01,960 Speaker 1: to follow me on TikTok, I have exactly two posts 983 00:59:02,000 --> 00:59:05,480 Speaker 1: on there and they're both Titanic related. Um. So really 984 00:59:05,560 --> 00:59:09,320 Speaker 1: just filling out the trifecta of my personality. We've got Titanic, 985 00:59:09,480 --> 00:59:14,120 Speaker 1: Paddington and now are are are So I'm so glad 986 00:59:14,240 --> 00:59:18,480 Speaker 1: we filled that out to a trifecta. As as was 987 00:59:18,560 --> 00:59:23,240 Speaker 1: stated earlier, the triangle is the strongest shape that might 988 00:59:23,280 --> 00:59:26,040 Speaker 1: have been in the first episode, but I was stated 989 00:59:26,120 --> 00:59:29,400 Speaker 1: on the record. It's on the record and you can 990 00:59:29,520 --> 00:59:33,400 Speaker 1: you cannot remove it. So what am I saying? Um, 991 00:59:33,520 --> 00:59:36,680 Speaker 1: and listen to the Bechtel Cast please. Oh that's where 992 00:59:36,760 --> 00:59:40,480 Speaker 1: this all started. And we are publicly and privately anti 993 00:59:40,560 --> 00:59:44,880 Speaker 1: fascist on the Bechtel Cast. It's a it's a podcast 994 00:59:44,920 --> 00:59:51,560 Speaker 1: about movies and examining those movies from an intersectional feminist lens. 995 00:59:53,200 --> 00:59:59,160 Speaker 1: And uh, that's yeah, that's it. That's so Wait, which 996 00:59:59,200 --> 01:00:05,760 Speaker 1: what did you do? We did nine to five and 997 01:00:06,280 --> 01:00:12,240 Speaker 1: um and once again the Shrek two episode bang Banger? Yeah, 998 01:00:13,000 --> 01:00:16,520 Speaker 1: when are you gonna do noes for ough to Oh? 999 01:00:17,360 --> 01:00:19,680 Speaker 1: Do you want to come on for it? Because yeah, 1000 01:00:19,680 --> 01:00:21,640 Speaker 1: I'll re watching us for a trip. What if it 1001 01:00:21,680 --> 01:00:23,800 Speaker 1: doesn't hold up, I'll be so disappointed. I'll be like 1002 01:00:24,360 --> 01:00:26,080 Speaker 1: I went through all this work to be like, yeah, 1003 01:00:26,160 --> 01:00:29,040 Speaker 1: this guy rules, and then I'm gonna be like this 1004 01:00:29,200 --> 01:00:31,640 Speaker 1: portrayal is different. I mean, actually, I don't. It doesn't 1005 01:00:31,680 --> 01:00:34,720 Speaker 1: make someone a bad person if they played it. I'm 1006 01:00:34,760 --> 01:00:36,360 Speaker 1: pretty sure he praised on women. I think that's this 1007 01:00:36,520 --> 01:00:39,040 Speaker 1: thing in the in the movie is kind of the 1008 01:00:39,160 --> 01:00:43,320 Speaker 1: whole thing about vampire Loure. He's actually just playing Charlie 1009 01:00:43,400 --> 01:00:47,880 Speaker 1: Chaplin in it. I think, dude, Charlie Chaplin real life vampire, 1010 01:00:49,280 --> 01:00:53,160 Speaker 1: and you know, listeners stay tuned. After we forced to 1011 01:00:53,200 --> 01:00:56,480 Speaker 1: watch the Twilight series find out she's Team Edward or 1012 01:00:56,560 --> 01:01:04,760 Speaker 1: team Jacob. I'm team Charlie Swan. Charlie, Charlie, Charlie Swan. 1013 01:01:04,880 --> 01:01:13,560 Speaker 1: Oh oh, okay, good to know Bella. Bella's dad. He's 1014 01:01:13,560 --> 01:01:16,919 Speaker 1: a cop. He is a cop. Never mind, never mind, 1015 01:01:16,960 --> 01:01:20,560 Speaker 1: I forgot. It was like I was like, Charlie, Sorry, Charlie, 1016 01:01:20,800 --> 01:01:27,360 Speaker 1: A cab includes you. There's truly no one on team 1017 01:01:27,560 --> 01:01:34,400 Speaker 1: Anna Kendrick and wonderful in those films. Um, Margaret, you 1018 01:01:34,520 --> 01:01:36,680 Speaker 1: have a book that's out that people can purchase, and 1019 01:01:37,040 --> 01:01:39,080 Speaker 1: they can see you on book tour, which they can 1020 01:01:39,120 --> 01:01:42,720 Speaker 1: find from your Instagram at Margaret Killjoy. Is that's true? 1021 01:01:42,960 --> 01:01:47,080 Speaker 1: That is correct? I am also a good person, probably 1022 01:01:47,960 --> 01:01:51,600 Speaker 1: I hope to be. You are aspiring good person. Yeah, 1023 01:01:51,720 --> 01:01:56,280 Speaker 1: and you can also check me out. I'm kidding. You 1024 01:01:56,320 --> 01:01:58,360 Speaker 1: can find me on the back deel cast. I will 1025 01:01:58,400 --> 01:02:00,560 Speaker 1: be talking about no Ferato. This is is literally the 1026 01:02:00,600 --> 01:02:02,160 Speaker 1: whole thing was a long con to get myself back 1027 01:02:02,200 --> 01:02:05,560 Speaker 1: on back dollcast. And also, um, we'd love to hide 1028 01:02:05,920 --> 01:02:07,919 Speaker 1: back anytime. We Are the Best, which is a movie 1029 01:02:07,960 --> 01:02:11,800 Speaker 1: about me and Jamie and Caitlin when we started a 1030 01:02:11,840 --> 01:02:17,360 Speaker 1: punk band as teenagers in Sweden. Mhm, it's a biopic 1031 01:02:17,480 --> 01:02:21,400 Speaker 1: about us. Um that we actually directed ourselves and this 1032 01:02:21,600 --> 01:02:23,960 Speaker 1: is a funny joke that I am making and it's 1033 01:02:24,000 --> 01:02:26,440 Speaker 1: really good to point that out. Um. And you can 1034 01:02:26,520 --> 01:02:32,000 Speaker 1: follow Sophie on the internet at rub Salted can find me, 1035 01:02:32,240 --> 01:02:34,880 Speaker 1: you can. You can find me on Twitter. Sometimes you 1036 01:02:34,920 --> 01:02:37,240 Speaker 1: can't find me on Instagram because they banned my account 1037 01:02:37,280 --> 01:02:41,560 Speaker 1: all the time, but you can't find me. It happens often. 1038 01:02:42,440 --> 01:02:45,720 Speaker 1: But you can't find me on Twitter at Why Underscore 1039 01:02:45,760 --> 01:02:48,120 Speaker 1: Sophie Underscore Why. And you can follow at cool Zone 1040 01:02:48,160 --> 01:02:50,800 Speaker 1: Media at fool zone Media. Is that correct, Margaret, I 1041 01:02:50,880 --> 01:02:53,440 Speaker 1: do it? I think so. I wasn't paying enough attention 1042 01:02:53,480 --> 01:02:56,400 Speaker 1: to the specifics cool I mean, if you're not paying attention, 1043 01:02:56,440 --> 01:03:00,720 Speaker 1: I guess the episode has to be over. What it's over? Oh? 1044 01:03:04,240 --> 01:03:06,720 Speaker 1: Cool People Who Did Cool Stuff is a production of 1045 01:03:06,760 --> 01:03:09,880 Speaker 1: cool Zone Media. For more podcasts on cool Zone Media, 1046 01:03:10,080 --> 01:03:12,880 Speaker 1: visit our website cool zone media dot com, or check 1047 01:03:12,960 --> 01:03:15,640 Speaker 1: us out on the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, 1048 01:03:15,800 --> 01:03:17,520 Speaker 1: or wherever you get your podcasts.