1 00:00:00,760 --> 00:00:03,640 Speaker 1: Hey, guys, ready or not, twenty twenty four is here 2 00:00:03,840 --> 00:00:06,320 Speaker 1: and we here at breaking points, are already thinking of 3 00:00:06,360 --> 00:00:08,560 Speaker 1: ways we can up our game for this critical election. 4 00:00:08,800 --> 00:00:11,720 Speaker 2: We rely on our premium subs to expand coverage, upgrade 5 00:00:11,720 --> 00:00:15,720 Speaker 2: the studio ad staff, give you, guys, the best independent. 6 00:00:15,120 --> 00:00:16,239 Speaker 3: Coverage that is possible. 7 00:00:16,280 --> 00:00:18,239 Speaker 2: If you like what we're all about, it just means 8 00:00:18,320 --> 00:00:20,000 Speaker 2: the absolute world to have your support. 9 00:00:20,160 --> 00:00:21,840 Speaker 3: But enough with that, Let's get to the show. 10 00:00:26,239 --> 00:00:28,040 Speaker 1: All right, Let's go ahead and move on to a 11 00:00:28,080 --> 00:00:30,400 Speaker 1: lot that is unfolding in Israel. Right now, I can 12 00:00:30,400 --> 00:00:33,240 Speaker 1: put this up on the screen. We have beb once 13 00:00:33,280 --> 00:00:36,680 Speaker 1: again to get back to the US humiliation, snubbing the 14 00:00:36,800 --> 00:00:39,479 Speaker 1: US which is claimed to want them to wrap up 15 00:00:39,520 --> 00:00:42,080 Speaker 1: their assault on Gaza kind of soon, and say, you 16 00:00:42,080 --> 00:00:44,760 Speaker 1: know what, Actually, this war against some US it's set 17 00:00:44,800 --> 00:00:48,760 Speaker 1: to continue at least into twenty twenty five. He reportedly 18 00:00:48,800 --> 00:00:51,920 Speaker 1: told local council chiefs from communities near Gaza on Tuesday, 19 00:00:51,920 --> 00:00:54,680 Speaker 1: he anticipates the war against from US extending into twenty 20 00:00:54,720 --> 00:00:57,600 Speaker 1: twenty five, According to an unsourced Channel twelve report on 21 00:00:57,680 --> 00:00:59,960 Speaker 1: the meeting, which was held at the IDF's Southern Command 22 00:01:00,080 --> 00:01:03,400 Speaker 1: headquarters and attended by other Security Cabinet ministers Natana who 23 00:01:03,400 --> 00:01:06,120 Speaker 1: told the Council chiefs that according to the current assessment, 24 00:01:06,440 --> 00:01:10,560 Speaker 1: the war may continue into next year. I'm going to 25 00:01:10,600 --> 00:01:14,000 Speaker 1: get in a moment into the psychology of not only 26 00:01:14,080 --> 00:01:17,600 Speaker 1: Babe who we focused on before, his incentives in keeping 27 00:01:17,640 --> 00:01:22,160 Speaker 1: this thing going forever and potentially expanding this thing, you know, 28 00:01:22,280 --> 00:01:25,840 Speaker 1: even more aggressively into at least a northern front, potentially 29 00:01:25,959 --> 00:01:29,600 Speaker 1: drawing in Iran Iran as well. But if you look 30 00:01:29,640 --> 00:01:33,840 Speaker 1: at the entirety of the War Cabinet and the Defense establishment, 31 00:01:34,120 --> 00:01:36,560 Speaker 1: they all have a lot of interest in keeping this 32 00:01:36,680 --> 00:01:38,840 Speaker 1: war going. So I don't want anybody to get it 33 00:01:38,880 --> 00:01:41,440 Speaker 1: into their head that it's just like one bad apple 34 00:01:41,560 --> 00:01:44,120 Speaker 1: who wants this to go on forever and has incentives, 35 00:01:44,160 --> 00:01:48,080 Speaker 1: personal political incentives tied to his own ambitions to hold 36 00:01:48,120 --> 00:01:51,480 Speaker 1: onto his power, that has an interest in keeping this 37 00:01:51,520 --> 00:01:55,120 Speaker 1: thing going. Basically all of the leadership share very similar 38 00:01:55,160 --> 00:01:59,280 Speaker 1: interests in that regard. At the same time, Jake Sullivan 39 00:01:59,440 --> 00:02:02,400 Speaker 1: and Tony B. Lincoln, we're at the World Economic Forum 40 00:02:02,560 --> 00:02:06,560 Speaker 1: in Davos spinning their version of what they would like 41 00:02:06,600 --> 00:02:10,720 Speaker 1: to see supposedly in the quote unquote day after in Gaza, 42 00:02:10,800 --> 00:02:13,720 Speaker 1: and they continue to push for a two state solutions, 43 00:02:13,760 --> 00:02:17,120 Speaker 1: something I certainly support. I think the only resolution to 44 00:02:17,160 --> 00:02:19,720 Speaker 1: this conflict is not a military resolution, It is a 45 00:02:19,760 --> 00:02:23,640 Speaker 1: diplomatic resolution that results in Palestinians having actual statehood and 46 00:02:23,760 --> 00:02:27,720 Speaker 1: actual rights and dignity. They claim to support that, Let's 47 00:02:27,720 --> 00:02:29,160 Speaker 1: take a listen to what they had to say. 48 00:02:29,400 --> 00:02:31,920 Speaker 4: We seek to stop the spread of conflict and to 49 00:02:31,960 --> 00:02:37,520 Speaker 4: create the conditions for de escalation. Our approach is and 50 00:02:37,560 --> 00:02:42,480 Speaker 4: remains focused on moving towards greater integration and stability in 51 00:02:42,520 --> 00:02:47,799 Speaker 4: the region. Long before October seventh, the United States was 52 00:02:47,840 --> 00:02:51,119 Speaker 4: deeply engaged in an effort to secure a political horizon 53 00:02:51,160 --> 00:02:55,000 Speaker 4: for the Palestinian people, with Israel security guaranteed as part 54 00:02:55,040 --> 00:02:55,320 Speaker 4: of that. 55 00:02:55,639 --> 00:02:57,799 Speaker 1: So listen, that's well, all well and good, except I mean, 56 00:02:57,800 --> 00:03:00,160 Speaker 1: he's lying when he says that we were doing anything 57 00:03:00,280 --> 00:03:03,239 Speaker 1: to try to push for Palestinian statehood before October seventh. 58 00:03:03,240 --> 00:03:05,320 Speaker 1: We'd completely thrown them under the bus in this attempt 59 00:03:05,360 --> 00:03:08,960 Speaker 1: at normalization with Saudi Arabia. But the other problem Saga 60 00:03:09,000 --> 00:03:12,720 Speaker 1: is this is utter and complete fantasy. The only way 61 00:03:12,760 --> 00:03:14,399 Speaker 1: you're going to have any sort of a two state 62 00:03:14,480 --> 00:03:17,600 Speaker 1: solution at this point is if the US basically forces 63 00:03:17,639 --> 00:03:20,840 Speaker 1: it is really actually willing, and I think we could 64 00:03:20,960 --> 00:03:25,040 Speaker 1: theoretically do this to use our muscle and to use 65 00:03:25,080 --> 00:03:27,360 Speaker 1: the points of leverage that we have to force this 66 00:03:27,480 --> 00:03:29,520 Speaker 1: outcome in spite of the fact that this is not 67 00:03:30,080 --> 00:03:33,120 Speaker 1: what the Israelis want. And I'm not just talking about Netanyahu, 68 00:03:33,360 --> 00:03:35,720 Speaker 1: who is out there bragging about how he is thwarted 69 00:03:35,720 --> 00:03:38,160 Speaker 1: a two state solution for years now and that he 70 00:03:38,280 --> 00:03:40,360 Speaker 1: is your guy to guarantee there will never be a 71 00:03:40,360 --> 00:03:45,080 Speaker 1: Palestinian state. But Israelis are by and large the population 72 00:03:45,440 --> 00:03:47,640 Speaker 1: not interested in a two state solution. Put this up 73 00:03:47,680 --> 00:03:51,600 Speaker 1: on the screen. This was prior to October seventh. The 74 00:03:52,200 --> 00:03:54,960 Speaker 1: numbers that I've seen post October seventh are actually very 75 00:03:55,000 --> 00:03:57,960 Speaker 1: similar to where this stands, which is only thirty two 76 00:03:58,080 --> 00:04:00,760 Speaker 1: percent of Jewish Israelis and five five percent of the 77 00:04:00,800 --> 00:04:05,000 Speaker 1: Israeli public overall believe that you could have an independent 78 00:04:05,000 --> 00:04:08,280 Speaker 1: Palestine that could coexist peacefully. And that's why you hear 79 00:04:08,400 --> 00:04:12,400 Speaker 1: Netanyahu out there campaigning effectively to keep his job based 80 00:04:12,440 --> 00:04:15,760 Speaker 1: on a promise that he will guarantee this never ever happens. 81 00:04:15,920 --> 00:04:18,799 Speaker 1: So it would be one thing sager if the US 82 00:04:19,080 --> 00:04:22,520 Speaker 1: had shown any willingness to use the points of leverage 83 00:04:22,560 --> 00:04:24,719 Speaker 1: they had to obtain this outcome. But if you're just 84 00:04:24,760 --> 00:04:27,720 Speaker 1: going to go out there at Davos and pretend like 85 00:04:27,800 --> 00:04:30,440 Speaker 1: there's some fantasy world out there that exists that doesn't 86 00:04:30,440 --> 00:04:33,040 Speaker 1: actually exist, and you are not willing to use any 87 00:04:33,080 --> 00:04:36,800 Speaker 1: sort of power to try to create that reality you 88 00:04:36,800 --> 00:04:39,320 Speaker 1: claim to support, like you're just a liar and a fraud. 89 00:04:39,360 --> 00:04:39,760 Speaker 5: At that point. 90 00:04:39,839 --> 00:04:41,919 Speaker 2: The problem I think that they really have here is 91 00:04:41,960 --> 00:04:45,359 Speaker 2: that everyone in the international system is pretending otherwise. So 92 00:04:45,520 --> 00:04:48,520 Speaker 2: I was reading earlier today the Saudi Arabians and the 93 00:04:48,600 --> 00:04:51,799 Speaker 2: UAE are like, we must have Palestinian statehood, and it's. 94 00:04:51,640 --> 00:04:53,720 Speaker 3: Like okay, well, like what are you going to do 95 00:04:53,760 --> 00:04:54,080 Speaker 3: about it? 96 00:04:54,120 --> 00:04:55,800 Speaker 2: And then the Israelis are like, well, we don't really 97 00:04:55,839 --> 00:04:58,400 Speaker 2: want Palestinian statehood, and in America is like, well, we 98 00:04:58,440 --> 00:05:00,920 Speaker 2: do want Palestinian stated but we're not necessarily going to 99 00:05:01,200 --> 00:05:02,120 Speaker 2: do anything. 100 00:05:02,040 --> 00:05:02,479 Speaker 3: Like you said. 101 00:05:02,600 --> 00:05:05,200 Speaker 2: I think we may be able to force them, but honestly, 102 00:05:05,320 --> 00:05:08,520 Speaker 2: I don't know. Their political system is so screwed up 103 00:05:08,560 --> 00:05:12,240 Speaker 2: and their democratic incentives are such that they may honestly 104 00:05:12,279 --> 00:05:15,960 Speaker 2: favor either a break of relations or like really daring 105 00:05:16,040 --> 00:05:18,200 Speaker 2: us to actually break off, and I think they would 106 00:05:18,240 --> 00:05:20,400 Speaker 2: win in a standoff, Crystal, like we're in a standoff 107 00:05:20,440 --> 00:05:24,080 Speaker 2: with our political system, as in Americans would break first 108 00:05:24,160 --> 00:05:26,320 Speaker 2: in terms of like no Israel, like don't go. We're 109 00:05:26,320 --> 00:05:28,760 Speaker 2: not really going to do anything we promise, Whereas I 110 00:05:28,760 --> 00:05:30,760 Speaker 2: think the Israelis, I mean, at least for where the 111 00:05:30,839 --> 00:05:34,120 Speaker 2: population is and all of that, they could certainly walk 112 00:05:34,160 --> 00:05:36,279 Speaker 2: considering where things are trending in that direction. 113 00:05:36,320 --> 00:05:39,320 Speaker 1: That's obviously true because there's not even willingness. 114 00:05:38,960 --> 00:05:39,680 Speaker 5: To even try. 115 00:05:39,880 --> 00:05:42,800 Speaker 3: So even if we did, I think they were win. 116 00:05:42,760 --> 00:05:45,320 Speaker 1: There's no way, I mean, we're not even willing to 117 00:05:45,400 --> 00:05:48,840 Speaker 1: even try. This is all fantasy. These people are smart 118 00:05:48,920 --> 00:05:51,359 Speaker 1: or not. Like Jake Sullivan is not an idiot, for 119 00:05:51,440 --> 00:05:53,960 Speaker 1: all of the issues I have with him. Tony Blinken. Also, 120 00:05:54,240 --> 00:05:58,719 Speaker 1: these are not stupid people. They know the reality of 121 00:05:58,760 --> 00:06:00,960 Speaker 1: who not only nan Yahu, but the entire you know, 122 00:06:01,040 --> 00:06:03,200 Speaker 1: the war cabinet and where is really public. 123 00:06:03,320 --> 00:06:04,840 Speaker 5: But they know all of this. 124 00:06:05,279 --> 00:06:07,719 Speaker 1: They know that the settlements that have been allowed to 125 00:06:07,800 --> 00:06:13,160 Speaker 1: expand under every single Israeli prime minister, not just Benjamin Natanah, 126 00:06:13,440 --> 00:06:17,720 Speaker 1: every single one. Okay, those settlements make it almost impossible 127 00:06:17,760 --> 00:06:20,159 Speaker 1: and that's the goal of the settlements to have any 128 00:06:20,200 --> 00:06:23,560 Speaker 1: store of a two state solution. They know that Naanyahu 129 00:06:23,600 --> 00:06:25,440 Speaker 1: made this cynical deal of I'm going to prop up 130 00:06:25,480 --> 00:06:27,960 Speaker 1: Hamas because They're a useful foil for me, and I'm 131 00:06:27,960 --> 00:06:30,880 Speaker 1: going to keep the West Bank and the Gaza Strip separated, 132 00:06:30,920 --> 00:06:32,440 Speaker 1: and I'm going to use Himas to say, look, we 133 00:06:32,440 --> 00:06:35,159 Speaker 1: don't have a partner. They know all of this, but 134 00:06:35,200 --> 00:06:37,120 Speaker 1: they are willing to go out there and lie and 135 00:06:37,160 --> 00:06:41,320 Speaker 1: create some fantasy situation and potential solution that they are 136 00:06:41,320 --> 00:06:45,280 Speaker 1: not in any way willing to actually back up and 137 00:06:45,320 --> 00:06:47,159 Speaker 1: push for, you know, to get back to what I 138 00:06:47,200 --> 00:06:50,240 Speaker 1: was saying about Bibi and his interests in forever war, 139 00:06:50,360 --> 00:06:53,000 Speaker 1: which is shared by the war cabinet. This was a 140 00:06:53,000 --> 00:06:56,120 Speaker 1: fantastic piece that laid out the calculus here from Haretz 141 00:06:56,320 --> 00:06:57,520 Speaker 1: got and put this up on the screen. 142 00:06:57,560 --> 00:06:58,160 Speaker 5: The headline is. 143 00:06:58,080 --> 00:07:03,040 Speaker 1: Why Israel's political and military leaders want a perpetual war. 144 00:07:03,360 --> 00:07:06,240 Speaker 1: Many of the country's decision makers appear enamored of a 145 00:07:06,279 --> 00:07:10,120 Speaker 1: situation in which the Israel War Hamas war continues with 146 00:07:10,160 --> 00:07:13,120 Speaker 1: no end in sight. This is why it could benefit them. 147 00:07:13,480 --> 00:07:17,920 Speaker 1: And he goes through peace by piece member, my member 148 00:07:18,240 --> 00:07:20,520 Speaker 1: and says, this is their calculus, this is why it's 149 00:07:20,560 --> 00:07:23,320 Speaker 1: in their interests to keep this thing going forever. He 150 00:07:23,400 --> 00:07:24,960 Speaker 1: starts with this quote, could keep this up on the 151 00:07:25,000 --> 00:07:27,440 Speaker 1: screen because we've got the quote there. The war has 152 00:07:27,520 --> 00:07:30,960 Speaker 1: become the objective. Think about that. Just the war itself 153 00:07:31,320 --> 00:07:35,239 Speaker 1: has become the goal. Former Shinbet Security Agency director Amy 154 00:07:35,280 --> 00:07:38,600 Speaker 1: Alen told me in a recent Haretz interview the statement 155 00:07:38,640 --> 00:07:42,960 Speaker 1: attracted wide attentional tension in Israel and around the world 156 00:07:43,320 --> 00:07:45,680 Speaker 1: because think of what an omission that is. No, we're 157 00:07:45,720 --> 00:07:47,960 Speaker 1: not trying to take Ahamas now, We're not really trying 158 00:07:47,960 --> 00:07:48,760 Speaker 1: to accomplish, you. 159 00:07:48,760 --> 00:07:50,960 Speaker 5: Know, security for our people. All we want is war. 160 00:07:51,040 --> 00:07:52,360 Speaker 5: That's the whole goal is war. 161 00:07:52,440 --> 00:07:55,119 Speaker 1: To keep the war going forever, not because it served 162 00:07:55,160 --> 00:07:59,640 Speaker 1: the interests of certainly not the Palestinians, certainly not the 163 00:07:59,720 --> 00:08:03,720 Speaker 1: israel public, because it serves their own political interest to 164 00:08:03,800 --> 00:08:06,280 Speaker 1: keep this thing going. So as one example here to 165 00:08:06,280 --> 00:08:09,320 Speaker 1: see the way that this thinking plays out, Benny Gance, 166 00:08:09,320 --> 00:08:13,560 Speaker 1: who is supposedly, you know, oppositional to Netnyahuo, who joined 167 00:08:13,600 --> 00:08:15,600 Speaker 1: the war cabinet as a show of unity in the 168 00:08:15,600 --> 00:08:19,200 Speaker 1: wake of October seventh. He writes, Gan seems to be 169 00:08:19,240 --> 00:08:21,720 Speaker 1: basking and success in the polls, concerned he would lose 170 00:08:21,760 --> 00:08:24,080 Speaker 1: his high rating in the polls if he quits the government. 171 00:08:24,400 --> 00:08:27,320 Speaker 1: From that perspective, there's little difference between him and Netanyahu 172 00:08:27,400 --> 00:08:29,520 Speaker 1: and their management of the war. The decisions of both 173 00:08:29,840 --> 00:08:33,880 Speaker 1: are motivated by personal and political considerations. In addition, keep 174 00:08:33,880 --> 00:08:37,040 Speaker 1: in mind it's not just net Yahu and his policy 175 00:08:37,400 --> 00:08:40,960 Speaker 1: that failed on October seventh, It was also the entire 176 00:08:41,480 --> 00:08:45,920 Speaker 1: defense security intel establishment. So people like Joev Galant, who 177 00:08:45,920 --> 00:08:48,880 Speaker 1: again had been at odds with net Yaho over the 178 00:08:49,000 --> 00:08:54,520 Speaker 1: judicial coup situation, he shares in that failure on October 179 00:08:54,640 --> 00:08:58,680 Speaker 1: seventh of preventing and then responding to those attacks. So 180 00:08:58,840 --> 00:09:01,840 Speaker 1: he also has an interest in keeping this thing going 181 00:09:01,960 --> 00:09:04,760 Speaker 1: as long as possible to avoid the questions in the 182 00:09:04,800 --> 00:09:07,559 Speaker 1: scrutiny that will come of what the hell happened that 183 00:09:07,760 --> 00:09:11,240 Speaker 1: enabled this all to unfold. They also believe that the 184 00:09:11,240 --> 00:09:14,360 Speaker 1: more fighting they do, you know, decimate Gaza, okay, then 185 00:09:14,400 --> 00:09:17,720 Speaker 1: we'll move on to Hesbalah and wherever else beyond that. 186 00:09:17,800 --> 00:09:21,120 Speaker 1: They can then bring home more supposed victories to the 187 00:09:21,160 --> 00:09:24,640 Speaker 1: people and maybe that'll bolster their political standing. And let's 188 00:09:24,679 --> 00:09:27,600 Speaker 1: be honest, for them, also, it's not like what's happened 189 00:09:27,600 --> 00:09:29,959 Speaker 1: in Gaza has gone all that well for them, they 190 00:09:30,000 --> 00:09:32,240 Speaker 1: have not destroyed Hamas. They have not come even close 191 00:09:32,280 --> 00:09:34,680 Speaker 1: to destroying Hamas. They have not destroyed the tunnel system. 192 00:09:34,840 --> 00:09:37,280 Speaker 1: They haven't even been able to They have not been 193 00:09:37,320 --> 00:09:39,880 Speaker 1: able to free the hostages. The only time hostages were 194 00:09:39,920 --> 00:09:42,360 Speaker 1: being freed was from through a ceasefire, which they all 195 00:09:42,440 --> 00:09:44,679 Speaker 1: oppose because they want this thing to go on forever. 196 00:09:44,960 --> 00:09:47,280 Speaker 1: They killed three of their own hostages, that's more than 197 00:09:47,280 --> 00:09:51,360 Speaker 1: they were able to rescue, and top Hamas leadership remains 198 00:09:51,520 --> 00:09:55,000 Speaker 1: at large within the Gaza strip. So they have not 199 00:09:55,160 --> 00:09:58,320 Speaker 1: accomplished anything close to the impossible goals that they sent 200 00:09:58,320 --> 00:10:00,480 Speaker 1: out the beginning of this, which were now are really 201 00:10:00,520 --> 00:10:03,360 Speaker 1: the real goals, and have every interest in keeping this 202 00:10:03,440 --> 00:10:05,000 Speaker 1: thing going and expanding it even further. 203 00:10:05,120 --> 00:10:07,240 Speaker 2: Well the expansion actually, you know one of the things 204 00:10:07,240 --> 00:10:09,520 Speaker 2: that we've been looking and wanted to fly for all 205 00:10:09,559 --> 00:10:11,320 Speaker 2: of you. Can we put D six please up on 206 00:10:11,360 --> 00:10:13,480 Speaker 2: the screen. It's about the Wall Street Journal. They say 207 00:10:13,559 --> 00:10:16,840 Speaker 2: Israel's war in Gaza is entering its most perilous phase yet. 208 00:10:17,120 --> 00:10:19,640 Speaker 2: Military is aiming to take control of the maze of 209 00:10:19,640 --> 00:10:22,880 Speaker 2: tunnels under communists. As refugees crowd into the South and 210 00:10:22,960 --> 00:10:26,800 Speaker 2: international outcry grows over the death toll. The reason that 211 00:10:26,800 --> 00:10:28,880 Speaker 2: they put it that way is that a obviously there's 212 00:10:28,880 --> 00:10:30,680 Speaker 2: no more shelter in Gaza, so it's not like you 213 00:10:30,679 --> 00:10:33,600 Speaker 2: can tell people to leave. But the tunnel network that 214 00:10:33,840 --> 00:10:37,079 Speaker 2: is in, the tunnel network from the Egyptian border is 215 00:10:37,120 --> 00:10:39,400 Speaker 2: the one that the Israeli has had the least amount 216 00:10:39,400 --> 00:10:42,800 Speaker 2: of visibility in and brings them not only in contact 217 00:10:42,800 --> 00:10:45,920 Speaker 2: with the vast majority of whatever's left of the civilian populace, 218 00:10:46,120 --> 00:10:48,720 Speaker 2: but more and more likely of a mistake and a 219 00:10:48,760 --> 00:10:53,240 Speaker 2: perilous step over the border with Egypt. Because Egypt has 220 00:10:53,280 --> 00:10:56,000 Speaker 2: their military all right there at the Rafa crossing, They're 221 00:10:56,080 --> 00:10:58,960 Speaker 2: very sensitive and have been previously to any like military 222 00:10:59,000 --> 00:11:02,080 Speaker 2: incursion or any age to the Egyptian status quo. That 223 00:11:02,160 --> 00:11:05,080 Speaker 2: all goes back to the the peace agreements. Already both 224 00:11:05,120 --> 00:11:08,040 Speaker 2: are technically in violation of some of the Sinai agreements, 225 00:11:08,040 --> 00:11:09,880 Speaker 2: but this could make it so that if the Israelis 226 00:11:09,880 --> 00:11:12,520 Speaker 2: do cross the border, if there's one you know, wrong 227 00:11:12,920 --> 00:11:16,560 Speaker 2: strike or which we've previously seen in the past, dramatically 228 00:11:16,840 --> 00:11:19,800 Speaker 2: escalate tensions. Not to mention the civilian problems, and also 229 00:11:19,880 --> 00:11:22,480 Speaker 2: because Rafa is the main way which humanitarian aid has 230 00:11:22,480 --> 00:11:24,720 Speaker 2: been going through, which we know that there's a new Dalon, 231 00:11:24,840 --> 00:11:27,440 Speaker 2: but this could even imperil that because if you destroy 232 00:11:27,480 --> 00:11:29,480 Speaker 2: the infrastructure, there's nowhere to even move anything through. 233 00:11:29,679 --> 00:11:29,920 Speaker 3: Yeah. 234 00:11:29,960 --> 00:11:33,840 Speaker 1: Well, Egypt is extremely pissed at Israel for a variety 235 00:11:33,840 --> 00:11:36,040 Speaker 1: of reasons, but in particular because Israel tried to throw 236 00:11:36,040 --> 00:11:38,960 Speaker 1: them under the bus at the International Court of Justice 237 00:11:39,040 --> 00:11:42,040 Speaker 1: and claim they were the reason that Palestinians were not 238 00:11:42,160 --> 00:11:45,400 Speaker 1: receiving anywhere close to sufficient aid and why half of 239 00:11:45,440 --> 00:11:49,080 Speaker 1: the population of the Gaza strip is starving right now, 240 00:11:49,120 --> 00:11:53,880 Speaker 1: a disease spreading rampantly and no wildly inadequate medical supplies, 241 00:11:53,880 --> 00:11:56,520 Speaker 1: amputations happening on children without anesthetic. 242 00:11:56,760 --> 00:11:58,200 Speaker 5: They tried to blame Egypt for that. 243 00:11:58,400 --> 00:12:00,719 Speaker 1: Egypt was so pissed off that they're now submitting their 244 00:12:00,720 --> 00:12:04,880 Speaker 1: own filings disputing that is really report to the ICJ 245 00:12:05,160 --> 00:12:09,280 Speaker 1: to rebut those you know, scurrilous claims that were made, 246 00:12:09,760 --> 00:12:11,920 Speaker 1: and you know so at the same time as you 247 00:12:12,040 --> 00:12:15,560 Speaker 1: have all of this interest in the direction of forever war, 248 00:12:16,000 --> 00:12:19,600 Speaker 1: Israel is really making themselves into a global paria to 249 00:12:19,720 --> 00:12:22,400 Speaker 1: the extent that, of course they had charges filed against 250 00:12:22,440 --> 00:12:26,079 Speaker 1: them at the ICJ claiming that they violated the Genocide 251 00:12:26,080 --> 00:12:28,520 Speaker 1: Convention and the very latest that we can show you 252 00:12:28,559 --> 00:12:30,120 Speaker 1: with regard to that, they claimed, you know, oh, we 253 00:12:30,200 --> 00:12:32,560 Speaker 1: don't bomb any hospitals. That's part of what the claims 254 00:12:32,600 --> 00:12:35,040 Speaker 1: that they made at the ICJ. Well, we have another 255 00:12:35,120 --> 00:12:38,080 Speaker 1: hospital reportedly. Put this up on the screen, Al Nasar Hospital. 256 00:12:38,120 --> 00:12:41,280 Speaker 1: This is in southern Gas. I believe in your conunis 257 00:12:41,840 --> 00:12:46,240 Speaker 1: that multiple news organizations have reported is now under attack. 258 00:12:46,600 --> 00:12:51,000 Speaker 1: You can see there were thousands of Palestinians who had 259 00:12:51,040 --> 00:12:55,280 Speaker 1: been displaced, who were sheltering there. Not to mention that, 260 00:12:55,920 --> 00:12:58,600 Speaker 1: you know, many of the hospitals across the Gaza Strip 261 00:12:58,679 --> 00:13:04,080 Speaker 1: are now completely holy or partially incapacitated. So this is 262 00:13:04,080 --> 00:13:06,920 Speaker 1: one of the few places that still remained and was 263 00:13:07,240 --> 00:13:09,600 Speaker 1: treating patients to the best of their ability given the 264 00:13:09,720 --> 00:13:14,120 Speaker 1: woeful inadequacy of medical supplies. So you see people fleeing 265 00:13:14,240 --> 00:13:18,679 Speaker 1: now from that hospital, and you know, the toll here 266 00:13:18,840 --> 00:13:22,640 Speaker 1: is unbelievable. You referenced Sager, there was a deal. We 267 00:13:22,679 --> 00:13:25,840 Speaker 1: can put the D seven up on the screen here. 268 00:13:26,200 --> 00:13:28,679 Speaker 1: There was some sort of a deal that was struck 269 00:13:28,880 --> 00:13:33,520 Speaker 1: for additional medical aid. In particular, this was in Hamas 270 00:13:33,559 --> 00:13:36,360 Speaker 1: in Qatar they say Hamas and Israeli forces have negotiate 271 00:13:36,360 --> 00:13:39,040 Speaker 1: an agreement to bring aid to Gaza. The Katari Foreign 272 00:13:39,040 --> 00:13:41,520 Speaker 1: Ministry said the deal arrangement cooperation with France. We'll see 273 00:13:41,559 --> 00:13:44,280 Speaker 1: medicine and other humanitarian aid delivered to civilians in the 274 00:13:44,320 --> 00:13:47,040 Speaker 1: most affected and vulnerable areas of Gaza. I think northern 275 00:13:47,080 --> 00:13:50,360 Speaker 1: Gaza in particular, in exchange. This is why the Israelis 276 00:13:50,520 --> 00:13:53,800 Speaker 1: agreed to it for the delivery of medication to Israeli 277 00:13:53,920 --> 00:13:57,560 Speaker 1: captives held in Gaza. The ministry spokesperson said that the 278 00:13:57,600 --> 00:14:00,400 Speaker 1: medication aid would leave Doha on Wednesday to each before 279 00:14:00,440 --> 00:14:01,880 Speaker 1: being transported into Gaza. 280 00:14:01,960 --> 00:14:03,679 Speaker 5: This has actually sparked also a whole. 281 00:14:03,520 --> 00:14:06,480 Speaker 1: Domestic dispute within Israel, because there was question over whether 282 00:14:06,520 --> 00:14:08,720 Speaker 1: the Israelis were going to inspect this aid before it 283 00:14:08,760 --> 00:14:11,200 Speaker 1: goes in or not. It seemed like the agreement said 284 00:14:11,240 --> 00:14:14,080 Speaker 1: no and then Natanya who claimed yes. And in any case, 285 00:14:14,080 --> 00:14:17,520 Speaker 1: there was a whole additional divide over this. But the 286 00:14:17,520 --> 00:14:20,320 Speaker 1: fact that you need additional aid going in is kind 287 00:14:20,360 --> 00:14:22,640 Speaker 1: of an admission that what has been going in has 288 00:14:22,680 --> 00:14:25,040 Speaker 1: been wildly inadequate, to the extent that you know in 289 00:14:25,040 --> 00:14:28,800 Speaker 1: the hostages who the Hamas has every interest in keeping 290 00:14:28,840 --> 00:14:31,360 Speaker 1: alive and keeping well, we're not getting sufficient careag. 291 00:14:31,400 --> 00:14:33,720 Speaker 2: Yeah, it's really interesting just to look at this whole thing, 292 00:14:33,800 --> 00:14:36,320 Speaker 2: because you know, it's like things are moving in a 293 00:14:36,360 --> 00:14:39,280 Speaker 2: bunch of different directions. You've got the hostage situation which 294 00:14:39,320 --> 00:14:43,240 Speaker 2: remains completely unresolved, the humanitarian situation, the military one on 295 00:14:43,280 --> 00:14:45,480 Speaker 2: top of that, and then Israeli domestic politics. 296 00:14:45,480 --> 00:14:47,240 Speaker 3: So we have this we can put up there on 297 00:14:47,280 --> 00:14:47,720 Speaker 3: the screen. 298 00:14:47,760 --> 00:14:51,840 Speaker 2: The Israeli Labor Party actually issued a no confidence vote 299 00:14:52,080 --> 00:14:57,040 Speaker 2: which kind of calls into question the current coalition which 300 00:14:57,080 --> 00:14:59,840 Speaker 2: is governing Israel. That was a no confidence vote against 301 00:15:00,040 --> 00:15:04,320 Speaker 2: nata Yah, who challenging his approach. Now this this would 302 00:15:04,360 --> 00:15:07,840 Speaker 2: be like if the Labor Party in Britain during the 303 00:15:07,920 --> 00:15:11,920 Speaker 2: you know, coalition wartime government of Winston Churchill had to 304 00:15:11,960 --> 00:15:14,840 Speaker 2: no confidence vote against his leadership, which really called into 305 00:15:15,080 --> 00:15:18,000 Speaker 2: the entire idea of like a bipartisan war and that. Now, 306 00:15:18,120 --> 00:15:19,760 Speaker 2: let's be clear, it's not like the Labor Party is 307 00:15:19,800 --> 00:15:21,920 Speaker 2: against the war per se, but they are very much 308 00:15:21,920 --> 00:15:24,680 Speaker 2: against nata Yah who. I mean, in my opinion, wouldn't 309 00:15:24,680 --> 00:15:26,560 Speaker 2: be a bad outcome for them to be a new 310 00:15:26,600 --> 00:15:29,640 Speaker 2: Prime minister, just to give them some better legitimacy. In 311 00:15:29,760 --> 00:15:31,880 Speaker 2: terms of their own popular and they need to have 312 00:15:31,920 --> 00:15:34,360 Speaker 2: an election so they can decide what they want to do, 313 00:15:34,640 --> 00:15:36,800 Speaker 2: because right now you're being ruled by the guy who 314 00:15:36,880 --> 00:15:39,480 Speaker 2: was Basically all of this is his fault, and every 315 00:15:39,480 --> 00:15:41,680 Speaker 2: incentive he has, as you laid out, is keep this 316 00:15:41,720 --> 00:15:43,840 Speaker 2: thing going on as long as possible. Now, if these 317 00:15:43,920 --> 00:15:46,280 Speaker 2: Raelies want war with Lebanon, okay, you know, go for it. 318 00:15:46,280 --> 00:15:48,240 Speaker 2: You guys can sign up, hopefully you'll pay for it, 319 00:15:48,280 --> 00:15:50,480 Speaker 2: and you can do all of it yourself. But you know, 320 00:15:50,520 --> 00:15:52,640 Speaker 2: it's like you should have some sort of say and 321 00:15:52,720 --> 00:15:54,720 Speaker 2: vote over that. I'm kind of shocked there isn't more 322 00:15:54,760 --> 00:15:57,320 Speaker 2: of a pressure inside society. Maybe the hostage thing is 323 00:15:57,360 --> 00:15:57,640 Speaker 2: just takes. 324 00:15:57,680 --> 00:15:59,440 Speaker 3: I'm not there. You know, it's very difficult to figure 325 00:15:59,440 --> 00:16:01,080 Speaker 3: out what the political sentiments. 326 00:16:01,280 --> 00:16:04,720 Speaker 1: So on the Labor Party no confidence vote, Let's be 327 00:16:04,800 --> 00:16:09,040 Speaker 1: clear about how irrelevant the Labor Party is at this 328 00:16:09,160 --> 00:16:11,240 Speaker 1: point in Israeli politics. 329 00:16:11,240 --> 00:16:13,600 Speaker 5: They have four on of one hundred and twenty seats 330 00:16:13,640 --> 00:16:14,200 Speaker 5: in the Kaddessa. 331 00:16:15,320 --> 00:16:17,600 Speaker 1: What they have said about the reason that they are 332 00:16:17,640 --> 00:16:20,240 Speaker 1: doing this is they tweeted, our daughters and sons have 333 00:16:20,320 --> 00:16:22,600 Speaker 1: been held captive by Jamas for one hundred and three days, 334 00:16:22,600 --> 00:16:24,440 Speaker 1: one hundred and three days, that the state of Israel's 335 00:16:24,440 --> 00:16:27,920 Speaker 1: torn between Israel and Gaza and the government doesn't care 336 00:16:28,040 --> 00:16:30,920 Speaker 1: at all, echoing some of the criticism from the hostages 337 00:16:30,960 --> 00:16:33,320 Speaker 1: who were released and also the families of those who 338 00:16:33,880 --> 00:16:37,120 Speaker 1: those hostages and those who still remain in Gaza. In 339 00:16:37,160 --> 00:16:39,720 Speaker 1: another post, the party said they don't have time. We 340 00:16:39,840 --> 00:16:41,640 Speaker 1: do not have time, and there's no trust in the 341 00:16:41,680 --> 00:16:44,040 Speaker 1: government that does not do everything to return them. There 342 00:16:44,080 --> 00:16:46,160 Speaker 1: is no trust in a government that does not put 343 00:16:46,160 --> 00:16:48,400 Speaker 1: the kidnapped as a priority, a government that cares about 344 00:16:48,440 --> 00:16:50,520 Speaker 1: its own corrupt interest and not those who give their 345 00:16:50,560 --> 00:16:52,600 Speaker 1: lives for it. They ended by saying, this is a 346 00:16:52,640 --> 00:16:55,600 Speaker 1: government that cannot be trusted. It should be overthrown. So listen. 347 00:16:55,760 --> 00:16:58,920 Speaker 1: The Labor Party has become fairly irrelevant in Israeli politics, 348 00:16:58,960 --> 00:17:01,600 Speaker 1: but the sentiment they're express here is extremely common in 349 00:17:01,640 --> 00:17:04,880 Speaker 1: Israeli politics, and you can see this in the incredibly 350 00:17:05,000 --> 00:17:08,399 Speaker 1: low ratings for Netanyahu in particular right now. I mean 351 00:17:08,400 --> 00:17:09,879 Speaker 1: the last one we saw you had like a six 352 00:17:09,960 --> 00:17:14,160 Speaker 1: percent approval rating. So he's been able to forestall any 353 00:17:14,160 --> 00:17:17,040 Speaker 1: political consequences by saying, yes, I hear you, We're going 354 00:17:17,080 --> 00:17:19,040 Speaker 1: to talk about it. After the war, and then he says, 355 00:17:19,160 --> 00:17:21,440 Speaker 1: but by the way, the war's going to go on forever. 356 00:17:22,240 --> 00:17:26,400 Speaker 1: So you know their theory, his and Yoav Galant and 357 00:17:26,480 --> 00:17:30,440 Speaker 1: the rest apparently of the war cabinet's theory of the 358 00:17:30,480 --> 00:17:34,280 Speaker 1: way to secure the hostage release is by continuing to 359 00:17:34,640 --> 00:17:37,600 Speaker 1: bomb the hell out of the Gaza strip. That's the 360 00:17:37,640 --> 00:17:41,080 Speaker 1: way to secure the hostage release. And even many of 361 00:17:41,080 --> 00:17:44,240 Speaker 1: the hostages who came back, who were furious, who thought 362 00:17:44,280 --> 00:17:45,640 Speaker 1: they were going to be killed, and some of whom, 363 00:17:45,640 --> 00:17:48,360 Speaker 1: by the way, were killed by Israeli forces, they said, 364 00:17:48,400 --> 00:17:48,720 Speaker 1: you have. 365 00:17:48,720 --> 00:17:50,280 Speaker 5: No idea what you're doing here. 366 00:17:50,440 --> 00:17:53,920 Speaker 1: The only time hostages were released was through a ceasefire deal, 367 00:17:54,000 --> 00:17:57,000 Speaker 1: the polar opposite of the strategy that they claimed to 368 00:17:57,040 --> 00:17:58,440 Speaker 1: be employing here. 369 00:17:58,720 --> 00:18:03,120 Speaker 5: So you know, their strive for obtaining the hostage getting. 370 00:18:02,920 --> 00:18:06,199 Speaker 1: The hostages back has clearly failed at this point. But 371 00:18:06,240 --> 00:18:08,760 Speaker 1: of course they're not going to acknowledge that, because to 372 00:18:08,800 --> 00:18:11,000 Speaker 1: acknowledge that which to acknowledge that there needs to be 373 00:18:11,040 --> 00:18:13,480 Speaker 1: some sort of a diplomatic solution, and that would create 374 00:18:13,520 --> 00:18:15,920 Speaker 1: some sort of an opportunity for reckoning on their own 375 00:18:15,960 --> 00:18:17,160 Speaker 1: failed leadership. 376 00:18:16,760 --> 00:18:17,919 Speaker 5: And of course they don't want any of that. 377 00:18:20,800 --> 00:18:26,240 Speaker 1: The Houthis have, surprised surprise, continued to attack US ships 378 00:18:26,280 --> 00:18:30,560 Speaker 1: and other commercial vessels in the Red Sea even after 379 00:18:30,880 --> 00:18:34,040 Speaker 1: we struck, and actually we conducted additional strikes in Yemen, 380 00:18:34,119 --> 00:18:37,920 Speaker 1: illegal strikes in Yemen against their facilities and their weapons capacity. 381 00:18:38,000 --> 00:18:40,520 Speaker 1: Clearly hasn't slowed them down one bit. Let's put this 382 00:18:40,600 --> 00:18:43,000 Speaker 1: up on the screen. The Huthi's hit a US ship. 383 00:18:43,200 --> 00:18:46,440 Speaker 1: This was after the US took this additional step which 384 00:18:46,440 --> 00:18:48,720 Speaker 1: I think the Houthis probably rightly see as like fairly 385 00:18:48,760 --> 00:18:52,800 Speaker 1: meaningless as designating them as a terror organization. The Huthi 386 00:18:52,880 --> 00:18:56,280 Speaker 1: group said they hit the Genco Paccardi Bolt carrier with missiles, 387 00:18:56,320 --> 00:18:59,080 Speaker 1: which resulted in a direct hit. US military says the 388 00:18:59,160 --> 00:19:02,320 Speaker 1: vessel was hit by a drone on Wednesday evening. Washington's 389 00:19:02,320 --> 00:19:05,720 Speaker 1: new designation of the Houthis will require US financial institutions 390 00:19:05,720 --> 00:19:08,080 Speaker 1: to freeze Hoothy funds and its members will be banned 391 00:19:08,240 --> 00:19:10,520 Speaker 1: from the US. Put the next one up on the screen. 392 00:19:10,560 --> 00:19:11,080 Speaker 5: This comes on the. 393 00:19:11,080 --> 00:19:15,040 Speaker 1: Heels of a different Hoothy attack. They launched another attack 394 00:19:15,080 --> 00:19:17,600 Speaker 1: on merchant shipping on Tuesday, just hours after the US 395 00:19:17,640 --> 00:19:20,600 Speaker 1: preemptively struck missiles and Yemen that were prepared to launch, 396 00:19:20,640 --> 00:19:24,960 Speaker 1: according to a statement from US sent Com. US Income, 397 00:19:24,960 --> 00:19:27,439 Speaker 1: by the way, said there were no injuries reported from 398 00:19:27,600 --> 00:19:31,080 Speaker 1: the merchant ship and Counterpoints covered this yesterday, But just 399 00:19:31,080 --> 00:19:36,640 Speaker 1: to underscore how stupid and counterproductive this whole strategy has been, 400 00:19:37,119 --> 00:19:40,960 Speaker 1: Shell has suspended red sea shipments amid fears of more 401 00:19:41,040 --> 00:19:43,359 Speaker 1: hoothy attacks. We'll have to see whether this becomes a 402 00:19:43,400 --> 00:19:46,320 Speaker 1: longer standing issue. That CEO told the Wall Street Journal 403 00:19:46,640 --> 00:19:50,640 Speaker 1: in Davos, So, congratulations, you haven't slowed them down one bit. 404 00:19:50,880 --> 00:19:52,680 Speaker 1: There was reporting, what was that The New York Times 405 00:19:52,680 --> 00:19:55,679 Speaker 1: that said, you really haven't degraded their offensive capabilities really 406 00:19:56,080 --> 00:19:59,160 Speaker 1: one bit, because they are very mobile, they're very agile, 407 00:19:59,200 --> 00:20:01,520 Speaker 1: they're very used to be bomb to hell all the time. 408 00:20:02,000 --> 00:20:05,040 Speaker 1: So you haven't degraded their capacity. You certainly haven't degraded 409 00:20:05,040 --> 00:20:07,480 Speaker 1: the will of the many people who are overwhelming le 410 00:20:07,640 --> 00:20:11,200 Speaker 1: back them, and all these commercial vessels are like, Okay, 411 00:20:11,240 --> 00:20:13,360 Speaker 1: this is an active war zone. Now there's no way 412 00:20:13,400 --> 00:20:15,960 Speaker 1: that we're shipping through the Red Sea. So commercial shipping 413 00:20:15,960 --> 00:20:18,120 Speaker 1: has only gone in the opposite direction of what you wanted. 414 00:20:18,200 --> 00:20:21,080 Speaker 2: Yeah, it's actually pretty terrifying to just realize how delicate, 415 00:20:21,160 --> 00:20:23,239 Speaker 2: you know, we talked about Taiwan and all this with 416 00:20:23,520 --> 00:20:26,720 Speaker 2: how delicate and asymmetric you can have an impact on 417 00:20:27,040 --> 00:20:29,879 Speaker 2: the global economy with some of these choke points. And 418 00:20:30,000 --> 00:20:32,440 Speaker 2: actually it's more surprising that it hasn't happened up until now, 419 00:20:32,680 --> 00:20:34,960 Speaker 2: and it's probably a function of just technology, which is, 420 00:20:35,200 --> 00:20:37,800 Speaker 2: these Hoothis are spending forty grand on a drone and 421 00:20:37,840 --> 00:20:40,760 Speaker 2: we have to spend one hundred million dollars to destroy 422 00:20:40,880 --> 00:20:44,199 Speaker 2: maybe fifteen percent of their offensive capability. Even you know, 423 00:20:44,200 --> 00:20:47,040 Speaker 2: if you just read the Scentcom statement out this morning 424 00:20:47,080 --> 00:20:50,040 Speaker 2: about the fourteen new strikes, they say that they destroyed 425 00:20:50,040 --> 00:20:52,679 Speaker 2: fourteen missiles and their launchers. Is who Thi's were preparing 426 00:20:52,720 --> 00:20:55,119 Speaker 2: to fire them? Two US officials said that the strikes 427 00:20:55,119 --> 00:20:57,040 Speaker 2: were carried out with Tamahawk cruise miss I mean, these 428 00:20:57,080 --> 00:20:59,440 Speaker 2: are four hundred grand a pop every time we fire 429 00:20:59,760 --> 00:21:02,879 Speaker 2: one of these, fired by navy vessels. Local news outlets 430 00:21:02,880 --> 00:21:05,480 Speaker 2: and Yemen said that they had struck who the controlled territory. 431 00:21:05,560 --> 00:21:07,600 Speaker 3: They're still doing battle damage assessment. 432 00:21:08,119 --> 00:21:10,840 Speaker 5: What's the coalition doing here, Foger? What are they doing 433 00:21:10,880 --> 00:21:11,280 Speaker 5: for us? 434 00:21:11,600 --> 00:21:12,600 Speaker 3: Yeah, that's a great point. 435 00:21:13,000 --> 00:21:16,520 Speaker 2: Interesting, every US coalition ends up just being US dropping 436 00:21:16,520 --> 00:21:16,840 Speaker 2: the bombs. 437 00:21:16,880 --> 00:21:18,239 Speaker 3: Yeah, it's kind of great and paying for it. 438 00:21:18,240 --> 00:21:21,000 Speaker 5: By the way, occasionally the UK we'll do some little something. 439 00:21:20,920 --> 00:21:22,640 Speaker 2: But we sell them the weapon, so it's not even 440 00:21:22,680 --> 00:21:24,440 Speaker 2: real so because it's like if you use our bomb 441 00:21:24,480 --> 00:21:25,840 Speaker 2: to bomb somebody, then whatever. 442 00:21:25,880 --> 00:21:27,000 Speaker 3: That's a whole other conversation. 443 00:21:27,400 --> 00:21:29,280 Speaker 2: Let's put up the final part here because it just 444 00:21:29,280 --> 00:21:31,840 Speaker 2: demonstrates about the precarity of this, and this is kind 445 00:21:31,840 --> 00:21:34,959 Speaker 2: of the function of this segment in looking at the 446 00:21:35,000 --> 00:21:38,040 Speaker 2: Israel situation. The Chief of Staff of the IDF currently 447 00:21:38,119 --> 00:21:40,760 Speaker 2: says that the likelihood of war in the North is 448 00:21:40,840 --> 00:21:44,199 Speaker 2: higher than before made the remarks during actually visit to 449 00:21:44,320 --> 00:21:47,520 Speaker 2: reserve forces in the North on Wednesday, a mere growing 450 00:21:47,560 --> 00:21:50,840 Speaker 2: fears of a war with Hesbolah. You as pointed out 451 00:21:50,840 --> 00:21:54,720 Speaker 2: this crystal gallant. The Defense Minister also apparently said something 452 00:21:55,040 --> 00:21:57,320 Speaker 2: very similar. We saw some remarks that came out from 453 00:21:57,359 --> 00:22:00,720 Speaker 2: Ben Givie, the right wing politician inside of Israel. They 454 00:22:00,920 --> 00:22:04,520 Speaker 2: really really want you know, they want war with Israel, 455 00:22:04,800 --> 00:22:07,399 Speaker 2: or so they want war with Hesbola. It's clear the 456 00:22:07,400 --> 00:22:11,080 Speaker 2: military wants it, the defense establishment wants it. Netanyahu definitely 457 00:22:11,119 --> 00:22:13,280 Speaker 2: wants it. The only people who don't want it is America. 458 00:22:13,400 --> 00:22:15,959 Speaker 2: Now it's relatively unclear whether Hesbola wants it or not. 459 00:22:16,080 --> 00:22:18,359 Speaker 2: They've been pretty you know, as they've stayed out of it. 460 00:22:18,400 --> 00:22:21,200 Speaker 2: They've had some tit for tat strikes, They've taken some casualties. 461 00:22:21,240 --> 00:22:24,520 Speaker 2: These Raelies have taken some casualties. Both seem to realize 462 00:22:24,520 --> 00:22:27,679 Speaker 2: how devastating and horrible the conflict would be. But it 463 00:22:27,800 --> 00:22:31,159 Speaker 2: is clear to me that this is kind of like 464 00:22:31,359 --> 00:22:35,280 Speaker 2: in Afghanistan Iraq situation. Even when we were at war 465 00:22:35,359 --> 00:22:40,760 Speaker 2: in Afghanistan, our defense establishment and top leaders, army and others, 466 00:22:40,880 --> 00:22:43,320 Speaker 2: they really wanted to invade Iraq. It took two years 467 00:22:43,320 --> 00:22:45,680 Speaker 2: to build the political case and all that. Obviously we're 468 00:22:45,720 --> 00:22:48,240 Speaker 2: on an accelerated timeline and all this. But if the 469 00:22:48,280 --> 00:22:50,399 Speaker 2: political will is there at the top of the government, 470 00:22:50,480 --> 00:22:52,159 Speaker 2: if they want to do this, then we should take 471 00:22:52,200 --> 00:22:54,840 Speaker 2: it really, really seriously. There's only really one check that 472 00:22:54,840 --> 00:22:56,840 Speaker 2: could have happened in the US, which would have been 473 00:22:56,920 --> 00:23:00,600 Speaker 2: like genuine small d democratic you know, revolt. I don't 474 00:23:00,600 --> 00:23:03,399 Speaker 2: know how the Israeli public feels about something like this. 475 00:23:03,520 --> 00:23:05,719 Speaker 2: I will give them credit for at least this because 476 00:23:05,760 --> 00:23:10,639 Speaker 2: they have mandatory they have mandatory enlistment. They are not stupid. 477 00:23:10,800 --> 00:23:12,679 Speaker 2: They all watched two thousand and six. It wasn't that 478 00:23:12,760 --> 00:23:15,480 Speaker 2: long ago. Their sons and daughters had to fight with Hesbola. 479 00:23:15,720 --> 00:23:20,120 Speaker 2: So they could have some you know, at least input 480 00:23:20,280 --> 00:23:22,800 Speaker 2: or try to campaign or something like against us, because 481 00:23:22,960 --> 00:23:25,440 Speaker 2: they know too there's there are a country that reads 482 00:23:25,480 --> 00:23:27,640 Speaker 2: a lot of the news. They would know that thousands 483 00:23:27,680 --> 00:23:30,199 Speaker 2: and thousands of them would die in a conflict like this, 484 00:23:30,320 --> 00:23:31,400 Speaker 2: not to mention a. 485 00:23:31,280 --> 00:23:32,280 Speaker 3: Lot more civilians. 486 00:23:32,520 --> 00:23:35,160 Speaker 2: Israeli civilians would die in this than probably any October 487 00:23:35,160 --> 00:23:39,359 Speaker 2: seventh because of the sheer capability of Hesbola from missiles 488 00:23:39,359 --> 00:23:41,200 Speaker 2: and all that. On the other side, maybe they think 489 00:23:41,240 --> 00:23:43,360 Speaker 2: of it as like a last stand. They're like, listen, 490 00:23:43,440 --> 00:23:45,399 Speaker 2: you know, October seventh was our nine to eleven. Now 491 00:23:45,440 --> 00:23:47,119 Speaker 2: we have to do something, you know, just to make 492 00:23:47,119 --> 00:23:48,880 Speaker 2: we have to make sure that this never happens again. 493 00:23:48,920 --> 00:23:51,640 Speaker 2: And you can use the extension from Hamas to Hesbola. 494 00:23:51,720 --> 00:23:53,760 Speaker 2: I could see the Israeli public signing up for that 495 00:23:53,800 --> 00:23:55,200 Speaker 2: and be like, sure, you know, we're going to risk 496 00:23:55,200 --> 00:23:58,199 Speaker 2: tens of thousands, but they'll ensure our security in the future. 497 00:23:58,600 --> 00:24:00,600 Speaker 2: I could see it going both ways. But I mean 498 00:24:00,600 --> 00:24:05,520 Speaker 2: it's pretty terrifying because from a reserve perspective and military perspective. 499 00:24:05,880 --> 00:24:08,040 Speaker 2: Their Israel's not doing very well right now. They had 500 00:24:08,040 --> 00:24:10,040 Speaker 2: to pull a lot of their troops out of Gaza, 501 00:24:10,359 --> 00:24:10,760 Speaker 2: a lot. 502 00:24:10,640 --> 00:24:12,800 Speaker 3: Of their reserves. They're sending them back to the economy. 503 00:24:12,880 --> 00:24:14,399 Speaker 2: If you get into war with Hesbol, you're going to 504 00:24:14,400 --> 00:24:16,479 Speaker 2: call every single one of those guys not just back up, 505 00:24:16,480 --> 00:24:18,280 Speaker 2: but they're in forever. They're in for a long time, 506 00:24:18,280 --> 00:24:20,040 Speaker 2: for a long haul. This is not Hamas you know, 507 00:24:20,080 --> 00:24:22,760 Speaker 2: a couple of month deployment. We're talking fifteen twenty months 508 00:24:22,840 --> 00:24:23,600 Speaker 2: or something like that. 509 00:24:24,520 --> 00:24:27,479 Speaker 1: The US really in a sense went mad after nine 510 00:24:27,520 --> 00:24:30,120 Speaker 1: to eleven, and that was that was exploited right by 511 00:24:30,920 --> 00:24:33,960 Speaker 1: you know, neocons who had a long standing agenda that 512 00:24:34,000 --> 00:24:36,720 Speaker 1: they wanted to pursue, and it took them a very 513 00:24:36,760 --> 00:24:39,920 Speaker 1: little small amount of time to push for a war 514 00:24:39,960 --> 00:24:43,040 Speaker 1: in a rock that made absolutely no sense, in a 515 00:24:43,280 --> 00:24:47,320 Speaker 1: you know, indefinite war in Afghanistan that you know, initially, okay, 516 00:24:47,359 --> 00:24:49,040 Speaker 1: go in and get in Latin, that part made sense. 517 00:24:49,080 --> 00:24:50,800 Speaker 1: But then whatever the hell we were doing after that, 518 00:24:50,840 --> 00:24:54,240 Speaker 1: even the people who were in military leadership couldn't explain 519 00:24:54,720 --> 00:24:57,119 Speaker 1: what we were doing, what the goals were, what counted 520 00:24:57,160 --> 00:25:00,159 Speaker 1: as success, et cetera. So we went mad after nine 521 00:25:00,160 --> 00:25:02,200 Speaker 1: to eleven. I think the Israeli public has gone mad 522 00:25:02,480 --> 00:25:05,040 Speaker 1: after October seventh, and I think net, Yahoo and co. 523 00:25:05,560 --> 00:25:07,760 Speaker 1: Are using that in a very similar way that the 524 00:25:07,800 --> 00:25:10,159 Speaker 1: neocons use it to further their own ends and agenda, 525 00:25:10,280 --> 00:25:13,320 Speaker 1: to further their own ends and agenda. You know, the 526 00:25:13,400 --> 00:25:18,480 Speaker 1: real response to what happened on October seventh was, listen, 527 00:25:18,600 --> 00:25:21,800 Speaker 1: this idea that you can imprison people forever, that you 528 00:25:21,840 --> 00:25:26,480 Speaker 1: can definitely thwart their like basic rights to self determination, 529 00:25:26,680 --> 00:25:30,000 Speaker 1: control what's happening in their own territory, that you can 530 00:25:30,080 --> 00:25:32,879 Speaker 1: have you know, this massive security established and all this 531 00:25:33,000 --> 00:25:34,800 Speaker 1: high tech and that that's going to keep you safe. 532 00:25:34,840 --> 00:25:37,240 Speaker 1: You're going to be able to quote unquote control the flames. 533 00:25:37,600 --> 00:25:42,120 Speaker 1: Well after the horror and humiliation of October seventh, that 534 00:25:42,280 --> 00:25:45,480 Speaker 1: fell apart. So the real response is, Okay, there is 535 00:25:45,520 --> 00:25:48,520 Speaker 1: no military solution to this. There is no occupying force 536 00:25:48,680 --> 00:25:51,240 Speaker 1: solution to this. The only actual solution to this is 537 00:25:51,280 --> 00:25:53,560 Speaker 1: a diplomatic one. But of course no one wants to 538 00:25:53,560 --> 00:25:56,639 Speaker 1: hear that when they're in the midst of rage and 539 00:25:56,680 --> 00:26:00,119 Speaker 1: fury and disgust and horror and pain and loss and 540 00:26:00,119 --> 00:26:04,440 Speaker 1: suffering and all of that. So instead the direction is 541 00:26:04,560 --> 00:26:07,600 Speaker 1: not in the favor in favor of diplomacy. The direction 542 00:26:07,760 --> 00:26:10,479 Speaker 1: is in favor of We're going to do war even harder. 543 00:26:10,800 --> 00:26:12,440 Speaker 1: We're going to crush from Moss and by the way, 544 00:26:12,480 --> 00:26:16,040 Speaker 1: those of you in northern Israel, we're going to crush Hasblatwo, 545 00:26:16,080 --> 00:26:17,960 Speaker 1: so you don't have to worry about them either. That 546 00:26:18,119 --> 00:26:20,240 Speaker 1: was our mistake, is that we didn't crush them and 547 00:26:20,280 --> 00:26:23,440 Speaker 1: their ambitions and their spirit hard enough that we weren't 548 00:26:23,480 --> 00:26:26,960 Speaker 1: big enough assholes in the region to deter everyone from 549 00:26:27,080 --> 00:26:29,159 Speaker 1: you know, ever messing with us. So we have to 550 00:26:29,240 --> 00:26:32,080 Speaker 1: launch this insanely brutal and I certainly would say in 551 00:26:32,080 --> 00:26:35,520 Speaker 1: the ic J South Africa case would agree genocidal assault 552 00:26:35,840 --> 00:26:38,159 Speaker 1: on the Gaza Strip. That's what we have to do 553 00:26:38,240 --> 00:26:40,679 Speaker 1: to make sure no one messes with us ever again. 554 00:26:41,119 --> 00:26:44,080 Speaker 1: And that's the logic that has taken hold with at 555 00:26:44,200 --> 00:26:46,840 Speaker 1: least it appears based on the polling a majority of 556 00:26:46,840 --> 00:26:49,680 Speaker 1: the Israeli public. And that's why these politicians think it's 557 00:26:49,720 --> 00:26:52,320 Speaker 1: in their cynical best interests to continue the war going 558 00:26:52,400 --> 00:26:56,120 Speaker 1: indefinitely and you know, bring home as many horror, horrible 559 00:26:56,200 --> 00:26:58,080 Speaker 1: military prizes as they possibly. 560 00:26:57,760 --> 00:26:58,680 Speaker 3: Can it's a big question. 561 00:26:58,720 --> 00:27:00,600 Speaker 2: I mean, we just don't know, right, because it's like 562 00:27:00,640 --> 00:27:02,760 Speaker 2: the US public went along with it until they didn't 563 00:27:02,760 --> 00:27:04,960 Speaker 2: go along with it, So it's two do it took 564 00:27:05,000 --> 00:27:05,480 Speaker 2: four years? 565 00:27:05,840 --> 00:27:07,320 Speaker 3: Yeah, a lot of people died in the interim. 566 00:27:07,359 --> 00:27:08,720 Speaker 2: I'm not saying it was a good thing, but it's 567 00:27:08,760 --> 00:27:10,679 Speaker 2: not like you know, it was actually kind of rapid 568 00:27:10,720 --> 00:27:13,320 Speaker 2: sometimes if you think about it. By four five or so, 569 00:27:13,400 --> 00:27:16,120 Speaker 2: people were at least beginning to have the conversation we 570 00:27:16,160 --> 00:27:16,919 Speaker 2: wanted to spare them. 571 00:27:17,000 --> 00:27:18,600 Speaker 3: Yeah, everybody told we elected George W. 572 00:27:18,720 --> 00:27:18,920 Speaker 1: Bush. 573 00:27:19,040 --> 00:27:20,840 Speaker 2: Biden literally went over there and he's like, you really 574 00:27:20,880 --> 00:27:22,840 Speaker 2: should not make the same mistakes as nine to eleven. 575 00:27:22,880 --> 00:27:24,880 Speaker 3: And they didn't want to listen. So this is their problem. 576 00:27:25,000 --> 00:27:26,840 Speaker 2: Unfortunately, you know, to the extent that we cover a 577 00:27:26,840 --> 00:27:29,320 Speaker 2: lot of this conflict, it's also about it's our problem 578 00:27:29,320 --> 00:27:30,480 Speaker 2: because we're the ones bombing the. 579 00:27:30,440 --> 00:27:31,760 Speaker 3: Who these not the Israelis. 580 00:27:31,800 --> 00:27:34,120 Speaker 2: Where are the ones who are bearing the vast majority 581 00:27:34,119 --> 00:27:35,480 Speaker 2: of the cost, not the Israelis? 582 00:27:35,520 --> 00:27:36,760 Speaker 3: And so they have had it. 583 00:27:36,960 --> 00:27:39,440 Speaker 2: They have always had this tremendous ability to outsource the 584 00:27:39,520 --> 00:27:42,040 Speaker 2: vast majority of their problems, but then they get to 585 00:27:42,119 --> 00:27:45,960 Speaker 2: keep all of the benefits to their overall security very 586 00:27:46,119 --> 00:27:49,480 Speaker 2: you know, very very unbalanced relationship, and they very much 587 00:27:49,600 --> 00:27:52,280 Speaker 2: risk I think balancing it definitely in the wrong way 588 00:27:52,359 --> 00:27:55,240 Speaker 2: in the long term, not necessarily in the short when 589 00:27:55,240 --> 00:27:57,800 Speaker 2: you can see so much of the domestic political situation 590 00:27:57,920 --> 00:27:58,520 Speaker 2: shifting here. 591 00:27:58,560 --> 00:28:00,440 Speaker 3: But why don't we get to our guests great guest. 592 00:28:00,520 --> 00:28:02,560 Speaker 1: Yeah, we have a great guest standing by to talk 593 00:28:02,600 --> 00:28:05,879 Speaker 1: about some of the other sick incentives that constantly pushed 594 00:28:06,080 --> 00:28:08,440 Speaker 1: us all towards more war and more conflict. 595 00:28:08,520 --> 00:28:09,160 Speaker 5: Let's get to it. 596 00:28:11,760 --> 00:28:13,800 Speaker 1: Our next guest has been shining a light on a 597 00:28:13,840 --> 00:28:17,000 Speaker 1: really undercovered part of Israel's assault on the Gaza Strip. 598 00:28:17,080 --> 00:28:19,959 Speaker 1: Anthony Lowenstein is an independent journalist and author of The 599 00:28:20,000 --> 00:28:23,600 Speaker 1: Palestine Laboratory who was based in East Jerusalem between twenty 600 00:28:23,640 --> 00:28:26,640 Speaker 1: sixteen and twenty twenty, and he joins us now, great 601 00:28:26,640 --> 00:28:28,000 Speaker 1: to see you, Anthony, Welcome. 602 00:28:28,119 --> 00:28:29,800 Speaker 6: Man, Thanks for having me. Thank you. 603 00:28:30,520 --> 00:28:32,160 Speaker 1: Tell us a little bit about the book and how 604 00:28:32,160 --> 00:28:33,840 Speaker 1: it relates to what we're seeing right now. 605 00:28:34,920 --> 00:28:37,840 Speaker 7: The book essentially is a multi year investigation looking at 606 00:28:37,880 --> 00:28:41,160 Speaker 7: how Israel's occupation of Palestine's a long best in modern times, 607 00:28:41,200 --> 00:28:44,560 Speaker 7: and over those decadeses more than half a century, Israel's 608 00:28:44,600 --> 00:28:48,360 Speaker 7: developed huge amounts of tools and technologies to maintain that occupation. 609 00:28:48,480 --> 00:28:51,320 Speaker 7: So in the modern act, you're talking about drones, spy where, 610 00:28:52,280 --> 00:28:55,480 Speaker 7: biometric tools, all these different methods that Israel used to 611 00:28:55,480 --> 00:28:58,840 Speaker 7: control Palestinians twenty four to seven. That's bad enough, but 612 00:28:58,920 --> 00:29:01,760 Speaker 7: what Israel's been doing for decades, pretty much since the 613 00:29:01,840 --> 00:29:06,600 Speaker 7: nineteen fifties, so very soon after Israel's birth, is promoting 614 00:29:06,720 --> 00:29:09,920 Speaker 7: and selling and marketing those tools and technologies as so 615 00:29:10,040 --> 00:29:14,240 Speaker 7: called battle tested in Palestine on Palestinians, to the world. 616 00:29:14,840 --> 00:29:18,720 Speaker 7: And essentially what that means practically is that I calculated 617 00:29:18,800 --> 00:29:21,520 Speaker 7: at least one hundred and forty countries, so the majority 618 00:29:21,560 --> 00:29:24,360 Speaker 7: countries on the planet have brought some form of this 619 00:29:24,480 --> 00:29:27,120 Speaker 7: technology in the last decades. How that relates to what's 620 00:29:27,120 --> 00:29:31,840 Speaker 7: happening now since October seven, is really clear is that 621 00:29:32,000 --> 00:29:35,760 Speaker 7: Israel has been live testing, both the government and private 622 00:29:35,800 --> 00:29:40,000 Speaker 7: companies live testing new weapons in Gaza. And that's not 623 00:29:40,120 --> 00:29:43,360 Speaker 7: just for a domestic Israeli audience who obviously are mostly 624 00:29:43,440 --> 00:29:46,760 Speaker 7: supporting the war, but for a global market that in 625 00:29:46,840 --> 00:29:49,080 Speaker 7: months and years to come a likely want to buy 626 00:29:49,080 --> 00:29:51,120 Speaker 7: those tools and technologies in their own wars. 627 00:29:51,600 --> 00:29:55,640 Speaker 2: Yeah, Anthony, I remember that Israeli drones made a big 628 00:29:55,960 --> 00:30:00,080 Speaker 2: appearance in Azerbaijan, and I'm wondering if you could talk 629 00:30:00,120 --> 00:30:01,880 Speaker 2: a little bit about that, because I know that those 630 00:30:02,000 --> 00:30:04,800 Speaker 2: drones were kind of the forefront of the technology and 631 00:30:04,800 --> 00:30:08,720 Speaker 2: they've made a couple of appearances in being sold into 632 00:30:08,800 --> 00:30:10,479 Speaker 2: that and they actually made quite a bit of a difference. 633 00:30:10,480 --> 00:30:11,440 Speaker 3: If you could tell us about that. 634 00:30:12,280 --> 00:30:15,200 Speaker 7: Yeah, well, those drones were suicide drones mostly in Israel 635 00:30:15,320 --> 00:30:18,720 Speaker 7: is a really key provider and developer of those tools. 636 00:30:18,760 --> 00:30:20,680 Speaker 7: Now that's obviously a conflict that, as you say, hasn't 637 00:30:20,680 --> 00:30:23,480 Speaker 7: got a lot of international attention, but should because Israel's 638 00:30:23,480 --> 00:30:25,200 Speaker 7: pretty much on arguably the wrong side. 639 00:30:25,200 --> 00:30:26,880 Speaker 6: They're the very repressive side. 640 00:30:27,240 --> 00:30:29,000 Speaker 7: And one of the things I think that shows in 641 00:30:29,040 --> 00:30:33,360 Speaker 7: that as a Baioijan conflict is that and this is not, 642 00:30:33,440 --> 00:30:36,480 Speaker 7: on one level, massively different to say the US. The 643 00:30:36,560 --> 00:30:39,360 Speaker 7: US is the world's biggest arms dealer, sells about forty 644 00:30:39,440 --> 00:30:41,120 Speaker 7: forty five percent of the world's weapons. 645 00:30:41,280 --> 00:30:42,800 Speaker 6: Israel's tenth. 646 00:30:43,080 --> 00:30:48,320 Speaker 7: And there's not really any moral qualms to sell to anybody, 647 00:30:48,640 --> 00:30:50,760 Speaker 7: literally anybody, I mean at the moment as far as 648 00:30:50,760 --> 00:30:55,960 Speaker 7: where Israel does not sell to sirious South Korea or Iran, 649 00:30:56,680 --> 00:30:58,360 Speaker 7: but the majority of other nations in. 650 00:30:58,320 --> 00:30:59,360 Speaker 6: The world they will. 651 00:30:59,560 --> 00:31:02,560 Speaker 7: And the reason so many other nations want these tools 652 00:31:02,680 --> 00:31:06,120 Speaker 7: is because they're tested in Palestine on Palestinians like literally. 653 00:31:06,160 --> 00:31:08,240 Speaker 7: To the point I show this in the book and 654 00:31:08,280 --> 00:31:11,880 Speaker 7: it's appeared in other shows that I've talked about on film, 655 00:31:12,520 --> 00:31:19,080 Speaker 7: is that Israel routinely will document these testing in Palestine. 656 00:31:18,560 --> 00:31:21,080 Speaker 6: And they show those videos to clients. 657 00:31:21,680 --> 00:31:24,760 Speaker 7: So in the last years, some of the most notorious 658 00:31:24,800 --> 00:31:27,560 Speaker 7: examples obviously these Pegasus, the phone hacking tool that has 659 00:31:27,600 --> 00:31:31,680 Speaker 7: been appearing in countless countries from India to Bangladesh to others, 660 00:31:32,200 --> 00:31:35,360 Speaker 7: and those tools were originally tested in Palestine and then 661 00:31:35,400 --> 00:31:37,520 Speaker 7: in fact they're still being used in Palestine and other 662 00:31:37,520 --> 00:31:40,760 Speaker 7: countries around the world. So the Jezerbaijan conflict was one, 663 00:31:41,040 --> 00:31:43,080 Speaker 7: and there are so many others that I think don't 664 00:31:43,080 --> 00:31:44,600 Speaker 7: get enough attention, but they should. 665 00:31:45,040 --> 00:31:48,080 Speaker 1: Haraz took a look at related topic here. Let's put 666 00:31:48,080 --> 00:31:50,360 Speaker 1: this up on the screen. The headline here is shark 667 00:31:50,400 --> 00:31:54,880 Speaker 1: tanks with Gaza as testing ground israelly. Defense startups flourish, 668 00:31:55,320 --> 00:31:58,240 Speaker 1: suicide drones and AI systems. Strict regulations and the dominance 669 00:31:58,280 --> 00:32:00,040 Speaker 1: of the major defense firms. I mean few small and 670 00:32:00,120 --> 00:32:02,440 Speaker 1: startups are found in Israel each year. They are looking 671 00:32:02,440 --> 00:32:06,680 Speaker 1: at new opportunities amid geopolitical tensions, rising military budgets and 672 00:32:06,880 --> 00:32:09,920 Speaker 1: the Gaza war. Can you just talk to us about 673 00:32:09,960 --> 00:32:13,920 Speaker 1: how the profit motive incentivizes war and conflict. 674 00:32:14,680 --> 00:32:15,800 Speaker 6: Well, it's key, isn't it. 675 00:32:15,840 --> 00:32:19,680 Speaker 7: Because the global arms trade is now over two trillion dollars, 676 00:32:20,120 --> 00:32:22,160 Speaker 7: not just in Israel but globally. And of course, after 677 00:32:22,240 --> 00:32:25,240 Speaker 7: Russia's invasion of Ukraine in February a couple of years ago, 678 00:32:25,840 --> 00:32:28,920 Speaker 7: huge amounts of European nations were begging the US and 679 00:32:29,080 --> 00:32:31,719 Speaker 7: Israel for new missile the finance shields, another kind of 680 00:32:32,440 --> 00:32:35,800 Speaker 7: equipment which they claim would protect them against potential attack 681 00:32:35,880 --> 00:32:38,680 Speaker 7: by Russia if that ever happened. What Israel I think 682 00:32:38,760 --> 00:32:41,320 Speaker 7: is doing in that article Equote is interesting, which also 683 00:32:41,520 --> 00:32:44,640 Speaker 7: mirrors what I'm hearing from my sources, is that a 684 00:32:44,680 --> 00:32:48,640 Speaker 7: lot of Americans, Silicon Valley venture capital companies and others 685 00:32:48,680 --> 00:32:51,320 Speaker 7: are looking to Israel since October seven, And it started 686 00:32:51,360 --> 00:32:54,640 Speaker 7: before then, of course, but particularly since October seven, and 687 00:32:54,680 --> 00:32:59,520 Speaker 7: they see opportunity. They see the huge amounts of possibilities 688 00:32:59,600 --> 00:33:05,080 Speaker 7: of not just weapons, but also economic opportunities investing, and 689 00:33:05,320 --> 00:33:08,360 Speaker 7: a lot of those companies are live testing the weapons 690 00:33:08,400 --> 00:33:10,720 Speaker 7: in Gaza to the point where they're often putting that 691 00:33:10,800 --> 00:33:15,520 Speaker 7: on social media live, which is then promoted and sold 692 00:33:15,560 --> 00:33:19,240 Speaker 7: to other nations across the globe. So the arms industry 693 00:33:19,480 --> 00:33:22,240 Speaker 7: is booming. And it's interesting the latest figures we have 694 00:33:22,280 --> 00:33:25,040 Speaker 7: from Israel's twenty twenty two it was twelve and a 695 00:33:25,080 --> 00:33:28,840 Speaker 7: half billion US, which is the biggest by far. Twenty 696 00:33:28,880 --> 00:33:31,280 Speaker 7: four percent of that were Arab Autocracy is the so 697 00:33:31,400 --> 00:33:36,480 Speaker 7: called abraham acause that Trump began and Biden has continued. 698 00:33:37,040 --> 00:33:40,840 Speaker 7: And so these are nations like Saudi and UAE, Bahrain, 699 00:33:40,960 --> 00:33:44,760 Speaker 7: Morocco and others. They're buying all this surveillance equipment because 700 00:33:44,800 --> 00:33:48,560 Speaker 7: they're petrified at the next Arab spring basically, and Israel 701 00:33:48,720 --> 00:33:49,680 Speaker 7: is the key provider of that. 702 00:33:49,800 --> 00:33:50,600 Speaker 6: So that's I think a. 703 00:33:50,600 --> 00:33:53,120 Speaker 7: Context that people often don't remember that Israel to me, 704 00:33:53,400 --> 00:33:56,479 Speaker 7: and I say this to someone who's Jewish myself, is 705 00:33:56,520 --> 00:34:00,000 Speaker 7: that Israel in some ways is exporting the occupation globally. 706 00:34:00,120 --> 00:34:02,400 Speaker 6: What's happening in Palestine is not staying there. 707 00:34:03,480 --> 00:34:05,480 Speaker 2: Yeah, Anthony, give us some more examples of some of 708 00:34:05,520 --> 00:34:07,720 Speaker 2: the things that you've seen just from resources and others 709 00:34:07,760 --> 00:34:11,000 Speaker 2: in this current war, Traditionally they've relied, you know, currently 710 00:34:11,040 --> 00:34:13,919 Speaker 2: on nothing particularly new, at least for now. We've seen 711 00:34:14,000 --> 00:34:16,600 Speaker 2: like two thousand pound bombs. We've seen some infantry, but 712 00:34:16,719 --> 00:34:18,880 Speaker 2: we've also, as you said, we've had suicide drones and 713 00:34:18,880 --> 00:34:21,600 Speaker 2: those have also proliferated, been copied the hoo. Theies have 714 00:34:21,640 --> 00:34:23,960 Speaker 2: been using them in some cases. So what is the 715 00:34:23,960 --> 00:34:27,160 Speaker 2: current conflict? What are some of the technologies and others 716 00:34:27,200 --> 00:34:28,799 Speaker 2: that you see that we're going to be seeing in 717 00:34:28,920 --> 00:34:30,399 Speaker 2: other conflicts sometime soon. 718 00:34:31,440 --> 00:34:32,719 Speaker 6: Some of it's surveillance tech. 719 00:34:32,840 --> 00:34:35,880 Speaker 7: So after October seven, when Hamas took in large numbers 720 00:34:35,920 --> 00:34:39,000 Speaker 7: of hostages, around two hundred and forty, there was a 721 00:34:39,040 --> 00:34:41,640 Speaker 7: lot of those surveillance the Israeli companies that we used 722 00:34:41,680 --> 00:34:43,880 Speaker 7: by the government to try to find those people in Gaza. 723 00:34:43,880 --> 00:34:46,399 Speaker 7: Now arguably not very successfully. Of course, they are still 724 00:34:46,400 --> 00:34:48,440 Speaker 7: now around one hundred and thirty one hundred and forty 725 00:34:48,760 --> 00:34:52,200 Speaker 7: stuck in Gaza, and the intelligence is actually being provided 726 00:34:53,080 --> 00:34:54,759 Speaker 7: to is Rael to find that. Now it's not just 727 00:34:54,840 --> 00:34:57,360 Speaker 7: coming from Israel sexually, also coming from other sources of 728 00:34:57,400 --> 00:35:00,560 Speaker 7: the US, particularly in effectual so Australia. So one of 729 00:35:00,600 --> 00:35:05,040 Speaker 7: the advances that Israel is testing, yes, surveillance equipment also 730 00:35:05,200 --> 00:35:10,600 Speaker 7: particularly sophisticated surveillance drones, suicide drones, and also I think 731 00:35:10,640 --> 00:35:15,560 Speaker 7: the idea of moster sort of nightgoggles, but very sophisticate nightgoggles, 732 00:35:15,600 --> 00:35:19,160 Speaker 7: because what Israel is facing in Gaza is a deeply 733 00:35:19,480 --> 00:35:24,160 Speaker 7: problematic enemy from their perspective, where Israel is gone into 734 00:35:24,200 --> 00:35:27,040 Speaker 7: Gaza all guns blazing, and they're actually having a problem 735 00:35:27,040 --> 00:35:30,880 Speaker 7: because four months in hermast is still standing. Bloody to 736 00:35:31,000 --> 00:35:35,160 Speaker 7: be sure, but it's still standing and arguably is never 737 00:35:35,200 --> 00:35:37,239 Speaker 7: going to be fully defeated. So I think we're talking 738 00:35:37,239 --> 00:35:40,960 Speaker 7: about surveillance tech, drones and various other forms like that, 739 00:35:41,000 --> 00:35:42,880 Speaker 7: which is a set of being tested in real time, 740 00:35:43,360 --> 00:35:45,640 Speaker 7: which will then we'll see in other conflicts around the 741 00:35:45,680 --> 00:35:47,120 Speaker 7: world in the coming months and years. 742 00:35:47,760 --> 00:35:50,799 Speaker 1: To that point, has there been any loss of confidence 743 00:35:51,080 --> 00:35:52,759 Speaker 1: in this high tach because one of the things that 744 00:35:52,760 --> 00:35:55,520 Speaker 1: we saw in October seventh is the first thing that 745 00:35:55,640 --> 00:35:58,680 Speaker 1: Hamas did as they took these very low tech basically 746 00:35:58,719 --> 00:36:02,000 Speaker 1: like off the shelf drone and disabled a lot of 747 00:36:02,040 --> 00:36:06,439 Speaker 1: this incredibly expensive high tech equipment that the Israelis had. 748 00:36:06,840 --> 00:36:09,120 Speaker 1: They took a bulldozer and took down the you know, 749 00:36:09,280 --> 00:36:13,719 Speaker 1: multimillion dollar border wall, and as you pointed out, you know, 750 00:36:13,800 --> 00:36:16,640 Speaker 1: for all of the high tech surveillance equipment that the 751 00:36:16,719 --> 00:36:20,279 Speaker 1: Israelis have, they clearly haven't been able to locate or 752 00:36:20,360 --> 00:36:23,799 Speaker 1: certainly effectively extract their own hostages, to the point that 753 00:36:23,800 --> 00:36:26,239 Speaker 1: they actually killed three of their own hostages because they 754 00:36:26,239 --> 00:36:28,960 Speaker 1: thought that they were Palestinians. So there has there been 755 00:36:29,000 --> 00:36:31,920 Speaker 1: any reassessment or even any sort of leveling of the 756 00:36:31,960 --> 00:36:35,160 Speaker 1: playing field in this era of gorilla warfare between the 757 00:36:35,400 --> 00:36:38,200 Speaker 1: incredible high tech that the US and Israel and a 758 00:36:38,239 --> 00:36:40,839 Speaker 1: lot of other modern countries rely on, and what these 759 00:36:40,840 --> 00:36:44,319 Speaker 1: sort of you know, ragtag gorilla army type insurgencies are 760 00:36:44,320 --> 00:36:45,600 Speaker 1: able to cobble together. 761 00:36:46,239 --> 00:36:47,640 Speaker 6: Amongst the Israeli public. 762 00:36:47,680 --> 00:36:50,799 Speaker 7: The answer is undeniably yes, I mean Israeli public, and 763 00:36:50,840 --> 00:36:53,160 Speaker 7: I'm generalizing here, of course, there are always exceptions. 764 00:36:53,560 --> 00:36:55,440 Speaker 6: Have spent years and years and years with. 765 00:36:55,440 --> 00:36:58,440 Speaker 7: The deluded belief that you can occupy people in definitely 766 00:36:58,440 --> 00:37:00,880 Speaker 7: in the West Bank and Gaza and get so called security. Now, 767 00:37:00,920 --> 00:37:04,960 Speaker 7: obviously October seven shattered that so many of Israeli Jews 768 00:37:05,000 --> 00:37:08,319 Speaker 7: in Israel do not feel safe anymore. If you ask 769 00:37:08,440 --> 00:37:11,800 Speaker 7: me about how the Israeli defense sector and military feel 770 00:37:12,160 --> 00:37:15,120 Speaker 7: their response has been hubris. So on the one hand, 771 00:37:15,160 --> 00:37:17,440 Speaker 7: they are trying to make up for what they clearly 772 00:37:17,800 --> 00:37:21,840 Speaker 7: failed miserably on on October seven, and that's just overwhelming force, 773 00:37:22,080 --> 00:37:26,880 Speaker 7: massive amounts of war crimes and completely insane amounts of 774 00:37:26,960 --> 00:37:30,560 Speaker 7: violence against Loactis Garzans in people themselves, but also infrastructure 775 00:37:30,560 --> 00:37:33,759 Speaker 7: and Garza's way of life. But I think what I'm 776 00:37:33,800 --> 00:37:38,279 Speaker 7: seeing actually is hubris in the Israeli defense sector. They 777 00:37:38,440 --> 00:37:40,840 Speaker 7: very much seed akin to nine to eleven in the US. 778 00:37:41,200 --> 00:37:44,759 Speaker 7: Nine to eleven was obviously a massive intelligence failure in America, 779 00:37:44,800 --> 00:37:49,120 Speaker 7: but that in fact bolstered America's defense sector massively wars 780 00:37:49,160 --> 00:37:52,120 Speaker 7: in Iraq, Afghanistan, and et cetera. You're going to see 781 00:37:52,120 --> 00:37:55,200 Speaker 7: a very similar situation in Israel, where, yes, October seven 782 00:37:55,320 --> 00:37:59,080 Speaker 7: was a catastrophic failure, clearly, but there's no indication that 783 00:37:59,160 --> 00:38:03,160 Speaker 7: I've seen thus at all that those defense companies which 784 00:38:03,200 --> 00:38:07,640 Speaker 7: failed miserably holding themselves account or they're actually being held 785 00:38:07,680 --> 00:38:09,839 Speaker 7: account by these relevant government you get at all. 786 00:38:10,120 --> 00:38:13,239 Speaker 1: Yeah, they're actually really making more money probably than ever. 787 00:38:14,040 --> 00:38:15,200 Speaker 5: Anthony, thank you so much. 788 00:38:15,520 --> 00:38:18,040 Speaker 1: It was fantastic to talk to you and really recommend 789 00:38:18,080 --> 00:38:19,160 Speaker 1: that people check out the book. 790 00:38:19,200 --> 00:38:20,880 Speaker 5: It's incredibly revelatory. 791 00:38:20,960 --> 00:38:22,600 Speaker 3: Yeah, we'll have a linked down in the description. Thank 792 00:38:22,600 --> 00:38:24,160 Speaker 3: you very much, you guys. 793 00:38:25,040 --> 00:38:25,279 Speaker 6: Sure. 794 00:38:25,360 --> 00:38:27,480 Speaker 2: Thanks for watching, guys, we appreciate it. Well, we'll have 795 00:38:27,719 --> 00:38:30,239 Speaker 2: some extra content for you over the weekend. Otherwise, we'll 796 00:38:30,280 --> 00:38:41,000 Speaker 2: see you all on Monday.