Speaker 1: The Around the NFL podcast hit twenty three miles per
Speaker 1: hour on next Gen Stance. Welcome to another edition of
Speaker 1: Around the NFL. I am Dan Hanss joined by heroes
Speaker 1: Greg Rosenthal and Mark Sessler. It is the post Christmas
Speaker 1: Day recap. We're gonna hit a bunch of games where
Speaker 1: you're gonna hit a TNF preview for yes week seventeen.
Speaker 1: My goodness, and I gotta say, guys, like, first of all,
Speaker 1: Happy Happy Day, Happy Day after Christmas and Boxing Day,
Speaker 1: Boxing Day to the Canadians. Shout out to the Canadians,
Speaker 1: whatever that is, I hope you enjoy it. But after
Speaker 1: TNF and then the X miss Eve XL and then
Speaker 1: Jesus of Nazareth presents the Holiday Classic triple header, I'm
Speaker 1: now like the opposite of what I was talking about
Speaker 1: on Christmas Eve, where you know you have the old
Speaker 1: hidden gift routine. I'm terrified looking under the tree for
Speaker 1: a gift that has not been open. And all of
Speaker 1: a sudden it's the you know, Nashville Ninjas led by
Speaker 1: Brock Osweiler against the Vancouver Grizzlies led by John Beck.
Speaker 1: And yeah, we know the Grizzlies were already taken, but
Speaker 1: the NFL didn't care. They just bought that website and
Speaker 1: they just added a couple more teams and it's going
Speaker 1: to do the biggest number of any show today. Also,
Speaker 1: this is now my fear, the fear of the gift
Speaker 1: not being seen yet.
Speaker 2: I think Dan, you you said it well, because we
Speaker 2: were discussing this on text with a various with variable
Speaker 2: angst between the three of us. Greg seems to completely
Speaker 2: enjoy the scenario. Dan and Mark maybe a little bit less.
Speaker 1: Greg's finally gotten it, He's got He's finally gotten what
Speaker 1: he wanted all those years ago. Football every day because
Speaker 1: Greg Greg quickly, Greg quickly turned around said but next week,
Speaker 1: you know, next year, Christmas is on Wednesday.
Speaker 2: Yeah, we're going to avoid all of this, which you
Speaker 2: know in theory, you know, comforting.
Speaker 3: But Dan, I thought you made the right point.
Speaker 2: Was like, it doesn't matter when Christmas is, Like, the
Speaker 2: NFL will do this every Christmas Day and Christmas Eve
Speaker 2: for the rest of time, So whether you enjoy it
Speaker 2: or not, it will be in your life eternally.
Speaker 1: I try to be a good sport about it. It
Speaker 1: was a busy day yesterday with all the things with
Speaker 1: the big holiday. I'm starting to think, Greg, your your
Speaker 1: family goes to Japan every Christmas, and I sometimes be
Speaker 1: like I feel bad for Greg, But now I'm thinking,
Speaker 1: like this is now sinking up perfectly for you, the
Speaker 1: way the New World is operating. But I you know, I.
Speaker 4: Tried, No, it sucks.
Speaker 1: I know, I know it does. I tried to keep
Speaker 1: up and be professional while also being a family man.
Speaker 1: And then I jumped on Twitter this morning. I got
Speaker 1: up early to get ready for these games we're about
Speaker 1: to talk about, and people are just going nuts on Twitter,
Speaker 1: apparently all throughout the night. Everyone listen the product. It's successful.
Speaker 4: Well, I got to say, when you looked at the slate,
Speaker 4: you were like, Okay, there's some good teams here. But
Speaker 4: the games, you know, they other than the marquee one,
Speaker 4: which we'll start with one of the best, maybe the
Speaker 4: best matchup of the year, the others were like, okay,
Speaker 4: three out of four were like huge upsets with insane comebacks.
Speaker 4: They were like surprising results. So at the very least
Speaker 4: NFL did their thing in terms of like wow, because
Speaker 4: the league looks a little different, I feel like than
Speaker 4: it did. Even when we tape Saturday night.
Speaker 1: I agree with you on that, and we got to
Speaker 1: start with the most impactful game of the regular season
Speaker 1: that changed standings. It changed how the top and the
Speaker 1: bottom of the playoff picture looks with two weeks to play.
Speaker 1: It likely changed how the MVP will be decided. We'll
Speaker 1: go in reverse chronicle order, starting with Christmas Night in
Speaker 1: Santa Clara.
Speaker 2: Raven stretch three receivers to the right, Labar Jackson fax
Speaker 2: the toss to the right, throws across a.
Speaker 5: Little touchdown, say Flowers, and the Ravens strike on back
Speaker 5: to back.
Speaker 4: Drives and it is done.
Speaker 3: I just believe here at Levi Stadium in Santa Clara.
Speaker 4: Wow.
Speaker 1: Lamar Jackson throws two touchdown passes in the span of
Speaker 1: eighteen seconds, wrapped around one of brock Party's four interceptions,
Speaker 1: and they coast. Really, this is a game that started
Speaker 1: out as a heavyweight fight. I said that to my
Speaker 1: father in law as we're watching it. As a game
Speaker 1: goes to halftime. By like midway through the third quarter,
Speaker 1: it was just kind of running out the clock. Maybe
Speaker 1: got a little bit interesting at the very end, but
Speaker 1: you always knew that this was a Ravens night, a
Speaker 1: dominating performance. Thirty three to nineteen over the mighty thought
Speaker 1: to be unstoppable San Francisco forty nine ers, like I said,
Speaker 1: at the Big Bell Bottom, and that is a changes
Speaker 1: greg a lot about what you think. It removes the
Speaker 1: invincibility cloak around the Niners. Like I said, brock Party
Speaker 1: kind of threw himself out of the MVP conversation. Potentially
Speaker 1: we'll see. Lamar Jackson and the Ravens once again affirmed
Speaker 1: that they are an absolute wrecking crew that should not
Speaker 1: be looked over by anyone, and they made sure everyone
Speaker 1: knew it on one of the biggest stages, if not
Speaker 1: the biggest stage, of the entire regular season.
Speaker 4: I love this Ravens team all season because there's no
Speaker 4: weak spot. Like they have their weeks where they're not
Speaker 4: impressive overall. They barely squeak past the Chargers even a
Speaker 4: week ago, like they weren't all the way impressive. But
Speaker 4: they have bomb drop games that won against the Lions,
Speaker 4: that went against the Seahawks. They've beaten seven different winning
Speaker 4: teams by at least fourteen points this year, which would
Speaker 4: be an NFL record. No team has ever done that
Speaker 4: more than five times, which is crazy. And they're just
Speaker 4: so physical and I think the contrast with the quarterbacks,
Speaker 4: it's the easiest place to start, but I do think
Speaker 4: it's the right place to start here where there was
Speaker 4: one in Lamar who started the game off kind of
Speaker 4: like the last couple of weeks. The offense looks discombobulated,
Speaker 4: but by the middle of the second quarter he settles
Speaker 4: down and he's just so calm and relaxed when there
Speaker 4: is pressure around him. When he's running. No one else
Speaker 4: runs in slow motion like him. It almost seems like
Speaker 4: he's not accelerating, just trying to avoid the hit, and
Speaker 4: it's all happening in a very calm manner. I've really
Speaker 4: felt that all season, whereas Purdy, in a tougher matchup
Speaker 4: against a better defense, was sped up all night, and
Speaker 4: I just think he was a tick late because of
Speaker 4: what he was seeing, and that tick late was enough
Speaker 4: to cause these mistakes. He was hesitating, and he was
Speaker 4: kind of what you don't want to be as a
Speaker 4: quarterback mark, which is like the combination of too slow
Speaker 4: and hesitant and then too rushed at times. And it
Speaker 4: was enough to make those big plays and really highlight
Speaker 4: what a vicious Ravens defense this is when they're playing
Speaker 4: their best.
Speaker 2: Yeah, this this Baltimore team. I kind of loved reading
Speaker 2: some of the reporting around this game post game where
Speaker 2: they got they got off the plane and you know,
Speaker 2: they're three and zero on the West Coast. They won
Speaker 2: a game in London. There isn't really a situation they're
Speaker 2: not prepared for, and I think that has a lot
Speaker 2: to do with John Harbaugh. But they they got off
Speaker 2: the plane and they were annoyed by the point spread
Speaker 2: they were. They came into the game feeling that, like
Speaker 2: nationally and Greg you were one of the first people
Speaker 2: way back in September to point to the Ravens as
Speaker 2: a team that was complete, that had Super Bowl vibes
Speaker 2: to them. You know, they were weird early on, and
Speaker 2: I thought they were an awkward team. Even when we
Speaker 2: were in London. We thought that their performance was a
Speaker 2: little awkward. But I thought last night was sort of
Speaker 2: the apex of who they are and what they wanted
Speaker 2: to be. And they were very annoyed by the national
Speaker 2: perception that they weren't the equal of the Niners, and
Speaker 2: it was Yes, it was their offense, but I thought
Speaker 2: their defense made Rock Party look confused at times. Now
Speaker 2: Brock party only had two actual turnover worthy plays according
Speaker 2: to PFF. I mean there are four picks. And yes,
Speaker 2: you can say yanksam out of the MVP conversation. I
Speaker 2: don't buy that entirely because I think it's it's your
Speaker 2: overall body of work. But I can see how the
Speaker 2: voters would see that the Ravens right now are as
Speaker 2: complete a team as you'll find in the league. And
Speaker 2: they've They've absolutely destroyed the Lions, the Jaguars, they blew
Speaker 2: up the Seattle Seahawks, and they did what they just
Speaker 2: did to the Niners. So it's like there's really no
Speaker 2: way to talk about anything about them other than to
Speaker 2: say that they are the favorite in the AFC. And
Speaker 2: I don't buy Lamar Jacksons as MVP, but that's.
Speaker 3: Just me personally.
Speaker 2: I don't even think he's as good as he was
Speaker 2: when he was the MVP. But all that is fine.
Speaker 2: Like the Ravens right now are in an up and
Speaker 2: down league. They're the premier AFC squad.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, I think the Ravens listen the league changes
Speaker 1: so fast, because, like we said, the Niners seem to
Speaker 1: be a potential historic juggernaut and they still could be
Speaker 1: This could be a bad, ugly bump in the road.
Speaker 1: We've learned too much covering this game and doing the
Speaker 1: show to count out teams based on a result in
Speaker 1: Week sixteen. But it was eye opening on both sides.
Speaker 1: And the Ravens. Yeah they're bad dudes. I mean, these
Speaker 1: guys they are. What they went out there and showed
Speaker 1: is that with all the pretty weapons the Niners have,
Speaker 1: there are certain teams that are good matchups against that
Speaker 1: type of Kyle Shanahan attack. Baltimore is one of them.
Speaker 1: Baltimore would love to see the Niners again in the
Speaker 1: Super Bowl if it ever got to that. Here's Patrick
Speaker 1: Queen talking about that difference.
Speaker 6: You play a Brandon football and people don't want to play.
Speaker 6: Everybody want to be out here q playing basketball on
Speaker 6: grass and stuff. I mean, we ain't with all that.
Speaker 6: So you can do all that stuff. You just gonna
Speaker 6: hit in the mouth every play. Honestly, you know, get
Speaker 6: care of this by all the pretty stuff you do,
Speaker 6: gammixed stuff. He just out line, we still have had
Speaker 6: a line of play football. You still have to get touch.
Speaker 6: So that's how Mind said, that's how we want to
Speaker 6: come out and just you know, hit people in.
Speaker 1: The mouth and Greg. You know, the game opens with
Speaker 1: a Ravens going three and out on the road. The
Speaker 1: crowd is hot, everyone's pumped, and then San Francisco immediately
Speaker 1: goes right down the field. A big kittle reception is
Speaker 1: the key to that drive and then Party. You know,
Speaker 1: he targets Steve O Samuel and the game. Games can
Speaker 1: swing on single plays, and you know if he hits
Speaker 1: Steve O Samuel at that throw, and he does, it's
Speaker 1: a better job looking off the safety and he fits
Speaker 1: that in there. All of a sudden, the Nighters jump
Speaker 1: ahead early and Purdy's feeling himself, but once that ball
Speaker 1: gets picked off, it is that change in the air.
Speaker 1: And while Purdy maybe he wasn't four interceptions bad, if
Speaker 1: you study the game tape, there were bad throws and
Speaker 1: he got away with a couple as well. Baltimore just
Speaker 1: made him look like everything that the Party doubters have
Speaker 1: been saying that he is someone that is not special
Speaker 1: despite the stats being special. And I thought that interception
Speaker 1: kind of set the table for the rest of the night.
Speaker 4: Yeah, that was one kind of what I'm talking about,
Speaker 4: where he was late and he's not gonna stop firing it,
Speaker 4: but even earlier that drive, I thought, hmmm, like he
Speaker 4: had his best two throws the Knight to Kittle, but
Speaker 4: he dirts one to McCaffrey. Maybe that was the next
Speaker 4: drive on third down where McCaffrey's open and he just
Speaker 4: kind of throws it in the dirt, which is a
Speaker 4: very strange play. He took a bad sack on I
Speaker 4: think it was fourth down on that very drive and
Speaker 4: they got bailed out by a holding call on the
Speaker 4: other side, but he held onto the ball to and
Speaker 4: I think about the other interception where he throws across
Speaker 4: his body, which is also just great defense. Like perty, Yeah,
Speaker 4: he had a bad game, but you have to give
Speaker 4: credit to like Kyle Hamilton coming on a very creative blitz.
Speaker 4: That's what makes Perdy leave the pocket a little early.
Speaker 4: And then Perdy makes the bad decision to throw a
Speaker 4: back across his body and Humphrey makes a terrific and
Speaker 4: maybe he didn't get a turnover where he played for
Speaker 4: this one. Humphrey makes a terrific deflection in Hamilton, who
Speaker 4: had been blitzing, comes back and makes the interception. So
Speaker 4: I think it was a combination. But I'm glad we
Speaker 4: had Queen because the way you can stop San Francisco
Speaker 4: and no one's built for it in the NFC, in
Speaker 4: my mind, is with great linebacker plays and it's great physicality.
Speaker 4: The forty nine ers are supposed to be the toughest
Speaker 4: team in the league, they're supposed to have the best linebackers.
Speaker 4: But if you have two guys in Rokon Smith and
Speaker 4: Patrick Queen that can stay on the field and actually
Speaker 4: keep up for the most part with their running game
Speaker 4: and passing game without getting exposed, because that's what she
Speaker 4: and Ann likes to go after, then you can maybe
Speaker 4: get them off there game. They're just used to winning
Speaker 4: that matchup. They did not in this one. But I
Speaker 4: don't know if there's a team in the nfcuh that
Speaker 4: has that. Let's listen to Purdy after this game talking
Speaker 4: about his performance.
Speaker 7: You know, for me, it's like, you know, I got
Speaker 7: to ask myself, all right, like who who are you?
Speaker 6: You know?
Speaker 7: What do you stand for?
Speaker 6: You know?
Speaker 7: Who are you when things are good? Who are you
Speaker 7: when things don't go your way? It's easy to you know,
Speaker 7: be riding high and thinking you're the man when things
Speaker 7: are going well, winning games and all kinds of stuff.
Speaker 7: And you don't really see you know, a whole lot
Speaker 7: of adversity in some games and whatnot. And you know,
Speaker 7: this is the reality of the NFL.
Speaker 1: Great Mark, the Steinbrunner doctrine is firmly in place for
Speaker 1: this forty nine Ers team. It's win the Super Bowl
Speaker 1: or bust. I'm not gonna I'm not going down the
Speaker 1: road of is Rock Purdy gonna get benched? But Sam
Speaker 1: Darnald did come in at the end of this game
Speaker 1: after Purdy got beat up. Daniel Jeremiah part of the
Speaker 1: discourse on Twitter last night saying, you know, there's just
Speaker 1: arm strength here that Donald possesses that he can make
Speaker 1: throws that Party cannot make. And football is an unpredictable sport.
Speaker 1: You know, once upon a time Earl Murrow won the
Speaker 1: MVP for the Baltimore Cults and got benched for a
Speaker 1: over the hill injured Johnny Unitis in the Super Bowl.
Speaker 1: I think Party has to respond with these in these
Speaker 1: last two games. Forget about the MVP race, but just
Speaker 1: to kind of quell fears that this is all unraveling
Speaker 1: with the biggest games of his life coming.
Speaker 3: Up, he will respond.
Speaker 2: I mean, like I think that something that I find
Speaker 2: so mentally ponderous with these Island games is what happens
Speaker 2: based off of one performance, like can we mix in
Speaker 2: this food coloring with the rest of what we've seen
Speaker 2: from brock Party, which is like, he's been super consistent,
Speaker 2: he's mentally tough, like his teammates Adorham.
Speaker 3: Like the idea that you'd go replace him.
Speaker 2: I know you're not saying this, but the idea that
Speaker 2: you'll replace him with Sam Darnold is utterly and beyond
Speaker 2: absurd to me. Like I'm glad this game happened to
Speaker 2: brock Party.
Speaker 3: I really am.
Speaker 2: I'm glad because I think number one, the way he
Speaker 2: sponded right there verbally is how he's going to respond physically,
Speaker 2: and like the idea that this is suddenly who this
Speaker 2: quarterback is. He played a great defense, There was incredible
Speaker 2: athletic plays on two of his interceptions. Rock Purty in
Speaker 2: general has been careful with the football outside of a
Speaker 2: couple games. He's been mentally consistent, He uses his weapons well,
Speaker 2: like I absolutely expect him to bounce back. I cannot
Speaker 2: believe that it's taking him out of the MVP conversation entirely.
Speaker 3: It's all it's all it is.
Speaker 4: He's just for it. But I think in the ads
Speaker 4: actually so he's I know, but it's just it's.
Speaker 2: Everything that happened, like within the last twenty four hours
Speaker 2: is all we respond to. It's like Rock Purty over
Speaker 2: the course of this entire season and last season when
Speaker 2: he played, has been the same guy in ninety five
Speaker 2: percent of the time, and so I just he will
Speaker 2: bounce back and I cannot wait to see that happen.
Speaker 1: You know what it is though, it is just one game,
Speaker 1: and we talk about it all the time. It's it's
Speaker 1: not just about production or pop the hood's stats. It's
Speaker 1: about the stories and about perception with MVP, and we
Speaker 1: talked about it on Thursday, Greg, you were talking about
Speaker 1: Lamar and this is Lamar's chance to get back in
Speaker 1: the MVP race. And I thought Lamar was very good
Speaker 1: in this game, just like he's been very good to
Speaker 1: great all season for a great AFC team in the Ravens.
Speaker 1: But I think you can lose. I didn't factor that,
Speaker 1: and I didn't think on that stage for Brock to
Speaker 1: totally totally face plant. I do think that has a
Speaker 1: chance to really stick in the minds of voters, and
Speaker 1: I know, the Niners have much more important things. Speaking
Speaker 1: of which Greg the discord to my least favorite factions.
Speaker 1: Although I like a lot of the people involved in
Speaker 1: these conversations in social media is lamarmy and everyone just
Speaker 1: trying to say, listen to me, this is the guys,
Speaker 1: the dude, and then the people that are saying Brock
Speaker 1: party can't actually play everything colliding in that game. So
Speaker 1: right now, from where we stand, the day after Christmas,
Speaker 1: after this great meltdown, Lamar Jackson is now the MVP
Speaker 1: Vegas says, and Brock Purdy has been exposed. I do
Speaker 1: agree with you, Mark, everybody's got to kind of take
Speaker 1: a deep breath. But I wouldn't throw it out entirely
Speaker 1: because that is a huge stage where I think Perty
Speaker 1: could have put a stamp on MVP, and instead he
Speaker 1: kind of led to a ton of questions about himself
Speaker 1: and that award.
Speaker 4: Right, the Ravens have a very tough matchup this week
Speaker 4: against Miami, very tough defense, so like that could be
Speaker 4: a tough matchup for Lamar. The Niners have two easy matchups,
Speaker 4: exceedingly easy, so I don't think it's going to prove,
Speaker 4: you know, the RAMS defense. I wouldn't say is exceedingly easy,
Speaker 4: but just numbers wise, they're below average in general. So
Speaker 4: the forty nine ers have commanders rams and look, if
Speaker 4: you look at the top five, I think it's totally fine.
Speaker 4: People are so strident about MVP, and I love Lamar.
Speaker 4: I think he's I think if you watch him week
Speaker 4: to week and you include the rushing yards and everything
Speaker 4: that he does, he's a totally legit MVP. Can I
Speaker 4: don't have a strong feeling. I look at it and
Speaker 4: it's the six that are the highest favorites right now
Speaker 4: in Vegas are Lamar. I think number two is CMC,
Speaker 4: who would have been my pick going into last night,
Speaker 4: and I still might be on line too. Tua is third,
Speaker 4: Purty is fourth, Josh Allen's fifth, Dak is sixth, and
Speaker 4: Tyreek is seventh, And I don't think there's like some
Speaker 4: great separation between any of those seven if you really
Speaker 4: wanted to make different sort of cases. I my gut
Speaker 4: feel is that Josh Allen's actually been the best quarterback
Speaker 4: in the NFL this year. I've felt that for most
Speaker 4: of the season, even before these last three weeks, but
Speaker 4: because it's such a weird year and there's no big separation.
Speaker 4: Like I'm kind of good with anyone, and Lamar and
Speaker 4: CMC both makes sense to me too, if like one
Speaker 4: of them ends up winning it. I just think, like
Speaker 4: even last night, you've got a lot look at those stats,
Speaker 4: and Lamar's stats aren't crazy good, but you just start
Speaker 4: with the middle section of that game, when like the
Speaker 4: Ravens had the first and twenty late at halftime, and
Speaker 4: he hits those two difficult passes, and then he has
Speaker 4: the great scramble to get three before halftime, and then
Speaker 4: suddenly eight plays into the second half, three of which
Speaker 4: were really good improvs by him. The other was the
Speaker 4: touchdown to Flowers. They're up by eighteen points, and you've
Speaker 4: seen that a lot in Ravens games, where like at
Speaker 4: the key moments, Lamar just like puts people away with
Speaker 4: really special stuff. So like he's a legit choice too.
Speaker 4: I'm not gonna get like worked up if any any
Speaker 4: one of those other guys get it.
Speaker 1: Though.
Speaker 2: I would say one thing about the Ravens, like both
Speaker 2: of these teams have like veteran coaching staffs. The Niners
Speaker 2: have like had their defensive coordinator plucked like forty two
Speaker 2: years in a row and so you're dealing with that.
Speaker 2: But like Todd Monkin, who I really had questions and
Speaker 2: suspicions about that working out, it's working out. And Mike
Speaker 2: McDonald on defense, like I don't even know if he's
Speaker 2: the defensive coordinator if you don't have Jim Harbaugh linked
Speaker 2: to John Harbaugh who knew McDonald from Michigan and all
Speaker 2: this time, I.
Speaker 4: Think he's gonna get a job this offseason too. He's
Speaker 4: been so good.
Speaker 2: Well yeah, And so I would say both of these
Speaker 2: coordinators for the Ravens have worked out so well, and
Speaker 2: there's so well coached, and like their team is not
Speaker 2: star studded, it's not a top heavy They're different to
Speaker 2: me than the Niners, where it's like the Niners have
Speaker 2: If you if you were to look at these two
Speaker 2: rosters and say, pick the ten best players, like nine
Speaker 2: of them eight or nine of them are probably from
Speaker 2: the Niners, I would say, But then like the Ravens
Speaker 2: just somehow year after year jail so well and like
Speaker 2: what they did on defense last night, they were the
Speaker 2: more physical team. I think what Patrick Queen is saying
Speaker 2: is so right. It's not the style of football that
Speaker 2: we want to watch every week. He was talking about
Speaker 2: basketball on grass for the rest of the NFL. I
Speaker 2: so get what he's saying, and it's like that.
Speaker 4: Type of team.
Speaker 2: It's just like I think this Ravens team is just
Speaker 2: like we don't really we don't DGAF to the rest
Speaker 2: of the league. And they and they made they sent
Speaker 2: a message last night. And when it comes down to MVP,
Speaker 2: it's about voters and what they see and how they feel.
Speaker 3: And like, I think there's a different conversation.
Speaker 2: Like who is the MVP and who the voters are
Speaker 2: going to vote for these guys that we're allowing to
Speaker 2: vote for.
Speaker 3: This two different conversations.
Speaker 4: I've I've looked at the results in voting and some
Speaker 4: like sixteen votes get it done out of fifty, like
Speaker 4: you you know, it's like sixteen to twelve to nine
Speaker 4: to eight. It's not often that that happens, but there
Speaker 4: have been years like that, and this feels like it
Speaker 4: might be a year like that.
Speaker 1: I agree with everything both of you said, and Greg
Speaker 1: what you were saying about MVP being truly wide open
Speaker 1: with worthy people, but I do stand by the stage
Speaker 1: matters and I think Brock if he even plays okay
Speaker 1: last night and just kind of coast to the finish line.
Speaker 1: It's his award, but he just opened the whole thing
Speaker 1: up and it's a truly And we've been we've been
Speaker 1: ahead of the national media on this because now people
Speaker 1: are talking about how this MVP race is interesting and
Speaker 1: different than past years. We've been talking about it for
Speaker 1: a few weeks now. I think, yeah, I think Christan
Speaker 1: McCaffrey is the guy having a historic year and a
Speaker 1: year where Lamar and Josh Allen are having great years
Speaker 1: in a down year at the position a quarterback, and
Speaker 1: I think there's just things to take into account. Finally,
Speaker 1: Trent Williams, left tackle, Niners, keep an eye on this.
Speaker 1: He's got a growing injury. We'll see. He finished that
Speaker 1: game on the sideline on a short week. We'll see
Speaker 1: if he plays against Washington and and hopefully for San Francisco.
Speaker 1: He is okay. And also Rock Party did exit that
Speaker 1: game with a stinger as well, so I imagine he's
Speaker 1: gonna be okay. But injuries there as well. And last
Speaker 1: little weird note, they showed this on the telecast and
Speaker 1: NFL the Twitter handle official Twitter handle amplified it. John
Speaker 1: Harbaugh who's obviously feeling great as he deserves to after
Speaker 1: a game like that, had a kind of a strange
Speaker 1: exchange with Rock Purty on the worst night of his
Speaker 1: professional career. Let's actually credit Matt Lively on Twitter with this.
Speaker 1: John shakes his hand, looks him in the eyes. People
Speaker 1: tell me we look alike. Then you see Purty after
Speaker 1: the handshake walking away, like, are you kidding me? Do
Speaker 1: you look alike?
Speaker 4: He's not now?
Speaker 1: Not now, John. That's that's that's very flip and trivial
Speaker 1: in a very dark moment for an injured Rock party
Speaker 1: after the worst game of his career. By the way,
Speaker 1: congratulations Mark, you a lock off. You were pretty fired
Speaker 1: up on text last night, but you you were. You
Speaker 1: have no reason to be in a bad mood because
Speaker 1: the the Ravens absolutely made a statement on your behalf
Speaker 1: as you beat both Nick Westling and Greg Rosenthal and
Speaker 1: a huge, huge spot.
Speaker 3: Well, I mean I so I urged Greg to do
Speaker 3: this for the show.
Speaker 1: Yeah that was a great Greg. I hope you're taking
Speaker 1: the right lessons out of that.
Speaker 4: Yeah, Yeah, that was that was a bad lock I
Speaker 4: thank Nick for making it as well.
Speaker 1: So it was, But like Nick challenged you Greg, imagine
Speaker 1: how sweet it would have been on top of that
Speaker 1: Nick challenging manhood lock off with me, and then you
Speaker 1: instead sided with Nick Westling and then you end.
Speaker 4: Up Well, I didn't know I was siding with him.
Speaker 4: I I make the picks, and that was a very
Speaker 4: wrong pick. I shouldn't have I shouldn't have doubted, doubted
Speaker 4: this team. But yes, I've never seen a person enjoy
Speaker 4: a lock uh less. I I got out of our
Speaker 4: final Channel five broadcasts of the year, thanks for everyone
Speaker 4: watch it over there. Uh got into my car and
Speaker 4: saw an insane amount of hatred towards the Ravens and
Speaker 4: the sport and and everything. It's like, I was a
Speaker 4: joy in the hell out of that game. That's how
Speaker 4: I knew my heart was.
Speaker 2: I know you of course you were, But of course
Speaker 2: you were. You're like like the Why and the Lamarmie,
Speaker 2: so of course you were.
Speaker 4: It felt like a great sworting event and then it
Speaker 4: and then it went sideways.
Speaker 2: But I totally like, so, I I do acknowledge that, like,
Speaker 2: it's not even a Browns thing with the Ravens.
Speaker 3: It isn't it.
Speaker 2: I do think the Ravens fans in general, it's like
Speaker 2: if you're not, like, if you're above the age of twenty,
Speaker 2: understand where the team came from. I've been down that
Speaker 2: road before verbally, but like, I am quite fascinated with
Speaker 2: the Sniners team, and I don't like what happened, and
Speaker 2: it put me in a bad mood. And it's like
Speaker 2: this crowning of the Ravens on December twenty fifth. Cool,
Speaker 2: let's see what happens the super Bowl does not occur
Speaker 2: on December twenty four one.
Speaker 4: No one's crowding him. I thought about that last night, Like, look,
Speaker 4: if they don't win the super Bowl they had last night.
Speaker 4: These are valuable as as fans like enjoy that you
Speaker 4: just won on Christmas Night against the like forty if
Speaker 4: you can't enjoy it at moment, if you can't enjoy
Speaker 4: that win, even if in the end you lose in
Speaker 4: the AFC Championship game, like that is. This is a
Speaker 4: fun couple of weeks to be a Ravens fan.
Speaker 1: Beest dog. You were big mad. I don't think I've
Speaker 1: ever seen you so mad on text as you were
Speaker 1: last night.
Speaker 3: Really, I think there's I don't even know if it
Speaker 3: made the top ten.
Speaker 4: I don't know if it made the top three of
Speaker 4: this week.
Speaker 1: All right, let's take a break and we'll hit the
Speaker 1: rest of the games. Taylor.
Speaker 3: But Taylor is looking.
Speaker 1: He steps up, he starts the pump, he starts.
Speaker 5: To run, He is diving around, he is loading up,
Speaker 5: he is firing, and it is intercepted by the Eagles,
Speaker 5: and the Gables over and is intercepted by Keeley Wringo
Speaker 5: and the Eagles finally a breather. Three game losing streak
Speaker 5: have I had their eleventh winter of season.
Speaker 1: Yes, it wasn't pretty, and it really has not been
Speaker 1: pretty for the Eagles for the last month or so,
Speaker 1: but they got what they needed on Christmas Day a win,
Speaker 1: snapping a three game losing streak with a thirty three
Speaker 1: to twenty five win over the Giants. Jalen Hurts had
Speaker 1: a productive day one week after being ill. On that
Speaker 1: big stage. He throws a touchdown pass, he also runs
Speaker 1: for a score and the Eagles, despite Mark not playing
Speaker 1: a championship level of football, they do enough to beat
Speaker 1: the Giant and take one step closer to the NFC
Speaker 1: East title, which is theirs for the taking with the
Speaker 1: Cowboys stumbling the last two weeks.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean wasn't It wasn't pretty. It doesn't quiet
Speaker 2: some of the questions, but you put up four hundred
Speaker 2: and sixty five yards on offense, one hundred and seventy rushing.
Speaker 2: You know, Matt Patricia. The move to Matt Patricia, I
Speaker 2: mean obviously got on everyone's radar. But you went out
Speaker 2: and had Tommy DeVito benched. You accomplished that. One of
Speaker 2: the biggest sports stories in the NFL this season. So
Speaker 2: I don't like, I think in general, it's like if
Speaker 2: we're going to freak out over the Niners and wonder
Speaker 2: where they are at this point. And I'm not saying
Speaker 2: we're doing that, but like, if there's all this like
Speaker 2: calamity mindset about what happened last night, This didn't change
Speaker 2: what I think about the Eagles. I think they are
Speaker 2: imperfect compared to what we saw down the stretch last year.
Speaker 2: But this was probably a pretty good game for Jalen
Speaker 2: Hurts actually, and I thought that, you know, AJ Brown
Speaker 2: and Demonta Smith showed up, the running game got going,
Speaker 2: like it got a little weird down the stretch with
Speaker 2: the Giants coming back into this. But it for me,
Speaker 2: the Eagles, it's just like, are they going to figure
Speaker 2: out all the problems. They're kind of like the NFC's
Speaker 2: a better version of the NFC's Chiefs, where it's like,
Speaker 2: I think what they're dealing with, they're going to be
Speaker 2: dealing with. It's like, do I trust them to win
Speaker 2: a couple of playoff games?
Speaker 1: Yes? I do.
Speaker 3: I mean it's just like this is sort of just
Speaker 3: another step on the ladder.
Speaker 1: I don't trust them at all. And it also hurts
Speaker 1: through a pick six I should put in there too,
Speaker 1: so his turnover issues another calamitous turnover that let the
Speaker 1: Giants wrap back in this game. I came out of
Speaker 1: this game, yeah, feeling no different about the Philly Eagles
Speaker 1: based on the three losses before.
Speaker 4: I felt so different after reading the coverage and listening
Speaker 4: to a little coverage that I did after watching it
Speaker 4: on condens this morning. I did not watch this game live.
Speaker 4: I wouldn't saw a movie yesterday with a friend out
Speaker 4: during the well. Zone of interest very counter programming.
Speaker 1: Who's in zone of interest?
Speaker 4: It is about, uh, the family who like lives right
Speaker 4: next to our Schwitz and like and like you never
Speaker 4: see inside and it's just like the banality of them
Speaker 4: like fixing their garden and all this the bureaucracy listeners.
Speaker 1: This is my fault. Yeah, I did not know I
Speaker 1: was walking into yet another Nazi conversation on this program.
Speaker 4: But thank you, Jonathan Blazer.
Speaker 1: A great movie.
Speaker 4: No, I wouldn't say great, but it was good.
Speaker 1: It's around every corner.
Speaker 4: I did watch Christmas Vacation the night before, you know,
Speaker 4: I like, I watched Uncondensed, and I thought, oh, this
Speaker 4: does make me feel a little different. This was the
Speaker 4: game they needed. Twenty eight first down, four hundred and
Speaker 4: sixty five yards, a bunch of special plays by Jalen Hurts.
Speaker 4: He definitely ran better than he's run maybe all season.
Speaker 4: I thought he looked spry, like they need to be
Speaker 4: an elite goddter. I thought it his best game of
Speaker 4: the year. Quicker decisions by Hurts, all this, even the
Speaker 4: pick six Dan was Goddard just fell on that play.
Speaker 4: It was just like, okay, flippy bad luck. And the
Speaker 4: other touchdown there Giants got early in the second half
Speaker 4: is like the return man collided into another guy on
Speaker 4: the special turns thing and then it you know, turned
Speaker 4: it over in the ten. So it felt a little fluky.
Speaker 4: The only the only real Eagles thing that was bad
Speaker 4: was giving up that big touchdown late in the game.
Speaker 4: That was bad defense. But then I saw the coverage
Speaker 4: and it's like Siriani is in an argument on the
Speaker 4: sideline with Ausan Reddick and DeVonta Smith and aj Brown
Speaker 4: are like trying to step in and are like kind
Speaker 4: of arguing with him too, and then they give up
Speaker 4: on it because like Sirianni is going crazy that like
Speaker 4: the second the game ends, they actually pan to Sirianni
Speaker 4: and DeVante Smith, who still seemed to be not happy
Speaker 4: about something. They blew the two minute drive at the
Speaker 4: end of the first half too. After the game, AJ
Speaker 4: Brown did not talk to the media even though they won.
Speaker 4: DeVante Smith literally said like, yeah, we you know, we
Speaker 4: had a good game, but we're not happy. And then
Speaker 4: this Jalen Hurts quote that we have also struck me of.
Speaker 4: Just like, man, the vibes are just so weird with
Speaker 4: this team.
Speaker 8: With the standard that we talked about, that double air
Speaker 8: sort of you know what's more important winning or the standard.
Speaker 8: It's a very manipulative thing to the mind sometimes. But
Speaker 8: I can go play to the standard and lose, and
Speaker 8: I'll be sitting at home sick. I can go win
Speaker 8: in that play to the standard, and I can be like, man,
Speaker 8: we got some more in us, you know, we can
Speaker 8: go chase it. So it's the fight that we bouts
Speaker 8: as competitors.
Speaker 1: Nobody's having fun. Nobody's having fun with the Eagles this year.
Speaker 1: It just seems like a very different situation. And you're right,
Speaker 1: Greg that there is obvious and we know it because
Speaker 1: the drama on the defensive side of the ball with
Speaker 1: the coordinator and of these other examples you're pointing out
Speaker 1: that the house is not a happy one. And again,
Speaker 1: everything can change by week, by the playoffs. So week
Speaker 1: sixteen is week sixteen, and we can't form permanent judgments,
Speaker 1: but there is a lot of building evidence that it's, yeah,
Speaker 1: there's there's trouble in Philly, whether or not they won yesterday.
Speaker 2: I think like one thing, like when we talked about
Speaker 2: that like Collision Low Crossers book that we were slightly
Speaker 2: obsessed with about ten years ago. It's like what it
Speaker 2: taught you a lot about was like coordinators and why
Speaker 2: they matter and how much time you spend with them
Speaker 2: during the week, and how like a lot of times
Speaker 2: certain players are with their position, coaches, their coordinators much
Speaker 2: more than they would ever be around like Sirianni or
Speaker 2: the head coach, and it's like you've changed the environment
Speaker 2: for both sides of the ball. And like we just
Speaker 2: about the Ravens. It's working really well in Baltimore and
Speaker 2: there's no complaints, but I'm with you, Dan, like something
Speaker 2: here and I don't know if it's like a coaching
Speaker 2: thing or that, because that's two weeks in a row
Speaker 2: where Jalen hurts. His postgame press conference is quite mystifying,
Speaker 2: and it feels like there's coded language and something else
Speaker 2: being said that's hard to totally unpack. But it's like
Speaker 2: the Ravens are the Eagles a year ago were like
Speaker 2: the high vibes, fun team coming out of nowhere, and
Speaker 2: right now it's like the energy feels to be dragging
Speaker 2: them down. I something strange going is going on.
Speaker 1: Ray.
Speaker 4: I saw these Brandon Graham quotes where he was kind
Speaker 4: of like, man, we got to enjoy this and like
Speaker 4: he almost said it, even said it to Jalen, like
Speaker 4: we want to see you kind of having fun and
Speaker 4: being happy. Because I think what Jalen was saying if
Speaker 4: and it was tough to figure out, was kind of
Speaker 4: like he he has a certain level that he wants
Speaker 4: to play to, and he's been saying all season, like
Speaker 4: I'm not playing to that level even though we're winning.
Speaker 4: So it's like so now he's just like in a
Speaker 4: weird mental space where like they can't even enjoy these
Speaker 4: wins because there's just like some mystical level that they're
Speaker 4: not reaching. And I don't know, there's something weird here.
Speaker 4: And yet if you just watch their offensive tape, it
Speaker 4: was their best game in a long long time. I
Speaker 4: know it was against the Giants, but the Giants defense
Speaker 4: been a little better when Lawrence is out there, and
Speaker 4: he was out there, like they had a great offensive game.
Speaker 4: There were a couple of moments in this game they
Speaker 4: could have totally folded and they went on these long drives,
Speaker 4: Like after that pick six, they responded with an awesome
Speaker 4: kind of vintage running drive and they had a couple
Speaker 4: of clock killing drives late. They didn't finish them, but
Speaker 4: they were good, like they had a good offensive day.
Speaker 1: Has has there ever been a more obvious tease to
Speaker 1: a seth Wickersham expose coming straight for your ass. It's
Speaker 1: either gonna be middle January, late January maybe if he
Speaker 1: needs more time to work on it February. But we're
Speaker 1: gonna get some of the dirt because I just get
Speaker 1: a feeling that the Sirianni ship might leak as well
Speaker 1: when things take a turn to postseason irrelevance, which I
Speaker 1: just sincerely believe. This is not Philadelphia's year. But they're
Speaker 1: gonna win the division. So the Giant side, by the way.
Speaker 4: I mean, they gotta win both of these games, and
Speaker 4: I guess wait or no, do they they only need
Speaker 4: to win one? Probably that's true.
Speaker 1: They're in good position obviously with the Cowboys losing these
Speaker 1: two weeks. The Giant side, I think the only real
Speaker 1: takeaway and people shouldn't be surprised by this because he's
Speaker 1: not really a prospect. It's just been a really nice story.
Speaker 1: But Tommy Devido gets benched and Tyrod Taylor plays better
Speaker 1: than him because he is better than him. And now
Speaker 1: the only real question there, Mark is Brian Dable. Do
Speaker 1: I ride with a younger quarterback to continue quote unquote
Speaker 1: to develop him, or do I put the quarterback on
Speaker 1: the field that probably gives us the best chance to win.
Speaker 1: Giants fans are going to be probably pulling hard for
Speaker 1: DeVito's return, both because he's a cult hero in the
Speaker 1: Tri State area and also the worst quarterback gives you
Speaker 1: a better draft pick at this point. But it'll be
Speaker 1: interesting to see where the head coach and leadership there
Speaker 1: comes down.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, I guess if I'm Brian Dabel number one,
Speaker 2: I think like job totally safe. I do think he's
Speaker 2: He's shown some stuff as a coach, Like I would
Speaker 2: rather bring DeVito back into the fold and like have
Speaker 2: him have a good game or two and show that,
Speaker 2: like that development that I did with a player that
Speaker 2: no one had ever heard of before, like shows my
Speaker 2: ability as a coach versus we know what Tyrod Taylor
Speaker 2: is and like winning, like trying to win with Tyrod
Speaker 2: Taylor does literally nothing for the Giants. So I would
Speaker 2: go back to DeVito. He's been one of the better stories.
Speaker 2: He had a rough situation here against the Eagles, But
Speaker 2: if you're a dable, like go show your QB whispering
Speaker 2: skills a.
Speaker 4: Rough game against the Saints too, And you know who's
Speaker 4: rooting for DeVito to get the job too is the
Speaker 4: Rams and the Eagles, who have big games again against
Speaker 4: the Giants. Because I think they'll feel more comfortable. Dabele
Speaker 4: did speak on Tuesday about it, saying he wouldn't reveal
Speaker 4: what he's doing, which is usually a sign they're gonna
Speaker 4: make a choice. It has been a different tie Rod
Speaker 4: this year. For what it's worth, he leads the NFL
Speaker 4: with quarterbacks with one hundred dropbacks in big time throw percentage,
Speaker 4: which is very unlike Tyler Rod, who's usually very safe.
Speaker 4: He's also missed a lot of throws too. But he's
Speaker 4: just like taking big chances and hitting a lot of them.
Speaker 4: I don't know, Maybe it's he's just in his yolo.
Speaker 4: I may never get a chance again.
Speaker 2: Just stay away from the stargers, doctor, and you'll continue
Speaker 2: to make these big throws.
Speaker 1: I'm not crazy, right like, and not to offend, you know,
Speaker 1: members of the Knights of Columbus and so on listening
Speaker 1: to the show. But Tomy Devido can't play, right like,
Speaker 1: what do we We must develop or we're gonna qb whisper.
Speaker 1: It was nice, it was a nice story.
Speaker 4: Right, he's not ready to play right now. I think
Speaker 4: I think he could have a career, but he's he's
Speaker 4: maybe the worst starter in the league. I would agree
Speaker 4: with you on that.
Speaker 1: All right, let's keep moving. That's what I was looking for.
Speaker 1: I'm not crazy to Arrowhead where just you just can't
Speaker 1: make sense of it. You cannot make sense of what
Speaker 1: has happened to the Chiefs this year. Chiefs takeover on
Speaker 1: our twenty five.
Speaker 9: Kelsey out of the gun, rolls out to his right,
Speaker 9: tries to find his receiver, ster scept it down the sideline, intercepted,
Speaker 9: Jack Jones heading watching touchdown. Back to back plays for
Speaker 9: the defense with touchdowns, and the Raiders defense has completely
Speaker 9: flipped this game in Kansas City.
Speaker 1: I mean, come on now, after the Chiefs put up
Speaker 1: what like minus twenty yards in the first quarter, they
Speaker 1: have back to back turnovers on offense that give the
Speaker 1: Las Vegas Raiders they're only touchdowns of the game. And
Speaker 1: Kansas City then has two quarters to get things figured
Speaker 1: out and win a game and win a division. They
Speaker 1: can't do it because they can't make plays on offense.
Speaker 1: Final score Raiders twenty, Chiefs fourteen. The chief You know,
Speaker 1: bye bye, it's not even a question anymore. No more
Speaker 1: talking Mark about the Chiefs somehow finding a way to
Speaker 1: get the number one seed. That ain't happening now. It's
Speaker 1: just about holding off the Raiders and the Broncos for
Speaker 1: the division, which they will, and they will have one
Speaker 1: home game in the playoffs, But call the fight. This
Speaker 1: offense has never looked more broken. You said it Greg
Speaker 1: on Thursday, that they've actually gotten worse since the buye
Speaker 1: and this game, Mark there is watch this tape. Everybody
Speaker 1: who hasn't seen this game. No one's open. And now
Speaker 1: Mahomes is in a position where he's clearly clearly pressing,
Speaker 1: and he's making mistakes too. The whole thing is broken
Speaker 1: and they won't be able to fix it until after
Speaker 1: this depressing, frustrating season's over.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I thought it was, you know, arguably the worst
Speaker 2: game of Patrick Mahomes's career. And a lot of credit
Speaker 2: to the Raiders too. It's not just the Chiefs thing.
Speaker 2: They have allowed the least points per game since Antonio
Speaker 2: Pierce took over as coach, and so there's something really
Speaker 2: happening with the Raiders. But you know, we just talked
Speaker 2: about Siriani tangling with a player like that, Travis Kelcey
Speaker 2: Andy Reid entanglement at the end of that or during
Speaker 2: that game stood out as I mean, you just haven't
Speaker 2: seen with Kansas City. It's been nothing but feel good
Speaker 2: vibrations the entire time, and their offense is like, well,
Speaker 2: I think there are these teams that we just assume
Speaker 2: will suddenly transform and fix everything and become like the
Speaker 2: superpower we once knew. It's like, it's not gonna happen
Speaker 2: with the Chiefs. I just don't think so. And it's like,
Speaker 2: if you told me in this game like that Aid
Speaker 2: and O'Connell would not complete a pass after the first quarter,
Speaker 2: that for the next three quarters, Aid and O'Connell would
Speaker 2: not complete a pass, I would say this is gonna
Speaker 2: be a Kansas City romp, just by the sheer statistical
Speaker 2: unusual nature of that. The last team to win a
Speaker 2: game where they had not completed a pass after the
Speaker 2: first quarter you have to go back to two.
Speaker 3: Thousand, the Bengals twenty three years ago.
Speaker 2: And so like the Raiders weren't like on the other
Speaker 2: side of the ball torching the Chiefs defense.
Speaker 3: It's just that Kansas City could not unhook.
Speaker 2: And I feel like this is a team at this
Speaker 2: point now where I'm like, when they get picked off
Speaker 2: in the playoffs and they will, I will not be
Speaker 2: surprised at all.
Speaker 3: And I don't think either of you will be surprised.
Speaker 4: No, and Raiders fans will get to giving you some
Speaker 4: love because that was a fun, fun game. If you're
Speaker 4: a Raiders going to Arrowhead on a big stage, getting
Speaker 4: that win and staying alive. They got to they actually
Speaker 4: have a legit chance to make the playoffs here, but
Speaker 4: we got to stay with the Chiefs. They had negative
Speaker 4: yards through four drives, negative yards the Chiefs. They had
Speaker 4: the lowest amount of yards in the first quarter. I
Speaker 4: think of any team, what was it in the last
Speaker 4: nineteen years, it's something like this, totally totally insane. Then
Speaker 4: they finally get a touchdown drive and that precedes the
Speaker 4: two defensive touchdowns in seven seconds. I mean one is
Speaker 4: where they're getting too cute because they can't just like
Speaker 4: run a normal running play successfully. They're like new problems
Speaker 4: are popping up, which is to me what's worrisome. They
Speaker 4: are getting worse. Uh Rashid. Rice was at the center
Speaker 4: of a lot of the miscommunications. Probably four I was
Speaker 4: living and dying by because I was watching for my kids.
Speaker 4: Fantasy team was Rice on it. Walker's got Rice. I'm
Speaker 4: hoping for a big day And there was probably about
Speaker 4: five different plays where him and Mahomes were not on
Speaker 4: the same page, including a big fourth down. You had
Speaker 4: Mahomes yelling at the offensive line, and that's what really
Speaker 4: stuck out to me in this game was they could
Speaker 4: not run the ball. Their success rate on early downs
Speaker 4: was disastrous running before Pacheco got a concussion, and the
Speaker 4: offensive line was getting absolutely housed in pass protection. Malcolm
Speaker 4: Koons and Crosby. They've really kind of remade their defense
Speaker 4: because Coon's has gone nuts the last three or four weeks,
Speaker 4: and like, well, you got new problems popping up. Like
Speaker 4: this offense has gone from like, wow, they're kind of
Speaker 4: mediocre to like they're they're bad. I'm with you, Mark.
Speaker 4: That probably was the worst Mahomes game I've ever seen.
Speaker 4: He could have had four or five interceptions.
Speaker 1: And now Isaiah Pacheco, he's in the concussion protocol on
Speaker 1: a really I mean brutal luck whereas helmet pops off
Speaker 1: and then he gets kicked in the head. Their guard
Speaker 1: Tray Smith hurt his leg in the fourth quarter. They
Speaker 1: have Cincinnati on Sunday, and Cincinnati is a team that's
Speaker 1: obviously pretty hot and cold. It's themselves right now, but
Speaker 1: it's just crazy. It's crazy to watch it. And I
Speaker 1: know the prevailing sentiment now is Antonio Pierce deserves to
Speaker 1: be the head coach of the Raiders. Okay, I mean
Speaker 1: I would say I would push back a little bit
Speaker 1: in that they're obviously playing hard for him. They've caught
Speaker 1: in a couple of teams flat footed and delivered really
Speaker 1: spirited efforts. But they also got b three nothing at
Speaker 1: home once they didn't have a completion after the first
Speaker 1: quarter in this game. I wouldn't if I'm Mark Davis,
Speaker 1: I would. I would take a look at the whole
Speaker 1: picture and what are you trying to build there before
Speaker 1: getting sucked in by a really fun December. But I'll
Speaker 1: leave it at that because I don't want to be
Speaker 1: the grinch with Antonio Pierce and the Raiders, because it
Speaker 1: has really been from where they were with Josh McDaniels
Speaker 1: got fired to having any conversation about the playoffs now
Speaker 1: is really commendable.
Speaker 4: I'll push back on that. I like the idea of
Speaker 4: them keeping him right now.
Speaker 1: Just that's the general sentiment energy.
Speaker 4: I mean, I'm a little torn because I'm with you,
Speaker 4: Like offensively, they've had some good play calls, but you
Speaker 4: know that hasn't changed. But he is a defensive coach,
Speaker 4: and the difference there is something more about being a
Speaker 4: head coach and getting your players to play for you.
Speaker 4: And they look like a completely different team. Like I
Speaker 4: know they've caught teams that are the right time or whatever,
Speaker 4: but they're the team that got stalely fired. No one
Speaker 4: else did that to them. They're the team that did
Speaker 4: this to Mahomes. No one else did that to them.
Speaker 4: And I think Mark Davis will be informed by what
Speaker 4: happened with Basacia, who he's voice some regret about the
Speaker 4: way he handled that. The next two games are big,
Speaker 4: They're at Indy and then home for Broncos if they want,
Speaker 4: if they win those two games, which would be tough.
Speaker 4: They still got to win these two games with O'Connell.
Speaker 4: But if they won the those two games, there's actually
Speaker 4: a sixty something percent chance they make the playoffs. According
Speaker 4: to the New York Times. That's krat which is just crazy.
Speaker 2: And Greg like I like, I think that it comes
Speaker 2: down to, like these hirings are obviously like owner's choice.
Speaker 2: And to hear what Mark Davis said about not hiring Basaci,
Speaker 2: which he like really regrets.
Speaker 3: He verbally regretted.
Speaker 2: I think that informs this. I think he's going to
Speaker 2: get the job. And and Dan, you're right, like it's
Speaker 2: the sample size is small. But then like you go
Speaker 2: hire someone else with no sample size as a head
Speaker 2: coach too.
Speaker 3: It's like I would say the same.
Speaker 2: These same Raiders players were uninspired and underperforming under Josh McDaniels,
Speaker 2: and that had a lot to do, I think with
Speaker 2: personality and coaching staff, and like they're all so much
Speaker 2: better now. It's and they want to play for him,
Speaker 2: like you got you at least you know you have that.
Speaker 4: He's just so raidary. That's to me, what does it is?
Speaker 1: All that stuff is what I'm like, okay, because I
Speaker 1: mean I know that too, Like I don't know, like
Speaker 1: he he put it this way. He also replaced the
Speaker 1: right guy. I think he. I think McDaniels is in
Speaker 1: that club occupied by only a few. Adam Gase was
Speaker 1: waiting for him smoking a cigarette when he arrived at
Speaker 1: the door of truly overmatched, disliked failures at head coach.
Speaker 1: And it makes everything look even better in case anybody
Speaker 1: doesn't know, because it is a blip in the NFL radar,
Speaker 1: but Rich Bassacia was on John Gruden's coaching staff in
Speaker 1: twenty twenty one when Gruden gets himself fired for being
Speaker 1: a dumbass, and then Bassacia takes that team to the
Speaker 1: playoffs with a ten and seven season. That's their only
Speaker 1: trip to the playoffs in the last seven years. So yeah,
Speaker 1: there was the Basachia bump and now the Pierce pop
Speaker 1: and we'll see what happens to the rest of the way.
Speaker 4: I mean, he's taken like cast offs. This defense is
Speaker 4: not that talented other than Crosberry, like Jack Jones was.
Speaker 4: You know, he's talented, but he got cut by the
Speaker 4: Patriots earlier this year. He's taken a bunch of castoffs
Speaker 4: and had like the top three defense since he took over,
Speaker 4: which is, you know, what more can you do?
Speaker 1: Sure? Absolutely commendable, do it. We have my home sound,
Speaker 1: but I think we kind of know. He still believes,
Speaker 1: but you know he knows, he knows, And don't you
Speaker 1: dare anybody out there, don't blame this on Taylor Swift.
Speaker 1: I don't want to hear it and not her fault.
Speaker 1: Maybe your boyfriend got a little older too, But this
Speaker 1: is not about Taylor. This is about Brett Veach and
Speaker 1: Andy Reid having to come to Jesus moment because I
Speaker 1: know it's the personnel's bad, but maybe this is a
Speaker 1: wake up call that maybe it's time the scheme needs
Speaker 1: to You know, it's been an incredible run by the Chiefs,
Speaker 1: but this is a whole different thing. Let's close out
Speaker 1: with the Christmas Eve game at Mile High, another one
Speaker 1: that was hard to figure out. Ryland Wakes leaning forward
Speaker 1: in the stairs, the snap, the spot, the kit clears
Speaker 1: the line sadly to the uprights. It's killing. There's God,
Speaker 1: the kid did it.
Speaker 3: With two seconds to go, Hyler, just give it.
Speaker 9: The Patriots put twenty six, twenty three lead here in Denver.
Speaker 1: He's moved by his teammates on the far side, and
Speaker 1: how good must that feel? I couldn't tell the howling
Speaker 1: and pain in the crowd was that Broncos fans or
Speaker 1: Patriots fans. The Pats entered Christmas Eve with the number
Speaker 1: two overall pick in the draft lined up but behind
Speaker 1: Chad Ryland, the fourth round pick who's had his struggle
Speaker 1: as a kicker. He hits a fifty six yard field
Speaker 1: goal seconds two seconds to play, and the Patriots another
Speaker 1: team that scored two touchdowns in less than seven seconds
Speaker 1: over this holiday round of games. They jump way ahead,
Speaker 1: hold off a Broncos rally, and win twenty six to
Speaker 1: twenty three. Mark that Ryland kick cap to seven play
Speaker 1: forty four yard drive that began with fifty eight seconds
Speaker 1: left after Denver goes three and out with their chance
Speaker 1: to win the game. The Broncos all but done in
Speaker 1: the AFC playoff race and they have no one to
Speaker 1: blame but themselves. You got to win at home against
Speaker 1: the Patriots on Christmas Eve night.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean like New England scores twenty of their
Speaker 2: twenty six points in the third quarter. I mean it
Speaker 2: start the game starts. It was handed to Denver to
Speaker 2: get a big start. Like Zappy fumbles the ball deep
Speaker 2: in his own territory right on like the first play,
Speaker 2: and Denver is sitting there with a touchdown, like you know,
Speaker 2: a gift touchdown, looking them in the face and they
Speaker 2: don't score. And like they have multiple drives out of
Speaker 2: the gate where like they could not get anything going
Speaker 2: on offense. I think their first three drives started in
Speaker 2: New England territory for zero points. So a lot of
Speaker 2: it is just comes back to the fact that the
Speaker 2: Broncos have been a good story in general. Like Sean Payton,
Speaker 2: after a disastrous start, you thought, well, maybe this is
Speaker 2: a fringe playoff team, and you go out and you
Speaker 2: need to handle your business against a very you know,
Speaker 2: the equivalent of a sitting duck in the New England Patriots.
Speaker 2: They've been a good defense Courtland Sutton going out to
Speaker 2: not help Denver at all, But like, this is a
Speaker 2: this is the end of the Broncos season, and I
Speaker 2: find them to be visually I was watching this game,
Speaker 2: you know, you know, without taking notes to sort of
Speaker 2: trying to observe it, Like I don't need this team
Speaker 2: in the playoffs. They are visually dull to me, and
Speaker 2: I need the Bronzes to go figure out something else
Speaker 2: over the course of this offseason.
Speaker 3: I think it's the end of Russell Wilson. I really do.
Speaker 2: I believe that Russell Wilson's journey with Denver has come
Speaker 2: to a close.
Speaker 3: After the season.
Speaker 4: I tend to agree because of games like this, which
Speaker 4: kind of was the whole thing. I thought it was
Speaker 4: one of his worst games, maybe his worst of the
Speaker 4: season until the fourth quarter. At that point they had
Speaker 4: already had eleven drives, which is a whole game for
Speaker 4: most teams, and they had like one hundred and sixty
Speaker 4: yards at that point. There was actually a stretch. I
Speaker 4: think they had five drives in a row that had
Speaker 4: a total of negative fifteen yards, and so they just
Speaker 4: like couldn't get anything done. He was just scrambling for
Speaker 4: no reason, like running around doing crazy stuff, and none
Speaker 4: of it was working. Then the fourth quarter starts and
Speaker 4: suddenly he turns into you know, Pete Russell Wilson. They
Speaker 4: put up sixteen points. They do the Super Bowl come
Speaker 4: back for the Patriots where they hit both two point conversions.
Speaker 4: Not only that, they get a three and out from
Speaker 4: the Patriots with like two and a half minutes to go,
Speaker 4: and they get the ball back with plenty of time,
Speaker 4: only needing three in the ball game. You're thinking, Wow,
Speaker 4: this is really gonna happen. And then they blow it.
Speaker 4: They go three and out, punt it right back and
Speaker 4: Peyton I don't kill him for wanting to get the
Speaker 4: ball back the way the Patriots offense was playing at
Speaker 4: the point, but he's using his timeouts to try to
Speaker 4: get the ball back and he didn't know that a
Speaker 4: magical man named Bailey ZAPPI was gonna hit his fifth
Speaker 4: twenty plus yard play of the game, get an eighty
Speaker 4: nine PFF grade, the highest for a Patriots to go
Speaker 4: back in like three years, and hit Devonte Parker over
Speaker 4: one of the best quarterbacks in the league for the
Speaker 4: second time, Patrick Sartan one on one. I mean, it
Speaker 4: is ridiculous things happening. And then Rylan hits the kick.
Speaker 4: It was totally proper Fostro's game. And I have to
Speaker 4: admit I did as a Patriots fan enjoy ending We're
Speaker 4: all but ending the Sun Peyton and Russell Wilsons.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that that doesn't suck, and I it is easy
Speaker 1: to get sucked into draft pick mania and all that stuff.
Speaker 1: And you know, the same thing happening with my team
Speaker 1: against the Commanders on Sunday, where you know they probably
Speaker 1: should miss this field goal. It's probably better for in
Speaker 1: the long term interest of the franchise, but you know what,
Speaker 1: there is something to be said, especially with my team
Speaker 1: that's had a history of losing and young players that
Speaker 1: you do not want to get infected with the funk
Speaker 1: of failure. You see Bailly Zappy celebrating on that sideline
Speaker 1: after the kick you see, and with my team guys
Speaker 1: like Sauce Gardner, Garrett Wilson, getting to enjoy a moment
Speaker 1: like that's important too, like to win football games and
Speaker 1: to not get kind of lost in the be a
Speaker 1: casualty of war that you've lost, so you know, And
Speaker 1: for the Patriots fans that are like kind of like
Speaker 1: my dad, who don't care about anything but about draft
Speaker 1: standing or this or that. Just I like to see
Speaker 1: my team win. Well, you got a nice win on
Speaker 1: Christmas Eve. And speaking of the New York Jets, they
Speaker 1: are let's spin two week seventeen. They are on the
Speaker 1: road against the Cleveland Browns Thursday night football. Mark, you
Speaker 1: are no doubt educated on this. The Niners did not
Speaker 1: wait a second, Mark, Greg, wait a second? What's up?
Speaker 1: Angry cess dog? Christmas Night? The Ravens get beat. There
Speaker 1: is a pathway to the AFC North title for the Browns. Now,
Speaker 1: it's not really there. That's why you were so mad?
Speaker 1: Yes or no?
Speaker 2: Well, like it's sort of like I said before, like
Speaker 2: because I have pet teams just like you know everyone else,
Speaker 2: and like the Niners are one of my pet teams,
Speaker 2: and like I.
Speaker 1: Kind of just I'll talk about the Niners.
Speaker 2: Not well, no, I mean it's it wasn't a Cleveland
Speaker 2: winning the division thing, because I I I would say, like,
Speaker 2: I like teams to be tiered where they belong, and like, like,
Speaker 2: if Cleveland were to win that division, they very likely
Speaker 2: are the number one seed in the AFC. And let's
Speaker 2: be realistic, like, I think they've been a fun team
Speaker 2: and we'll see where they land. But like the idea
Speaker 2: that the number one seed wouldn't I don't think would
Speaker 2: be a great thing for football in general.
Speaker 3: I'm being really.
Speaker 4: An insane answer.
Speaker 1: Yeah, not an.
Speaker 2: Insane answer, because they're a very incomplete team that's overachieving
Speaker 2: in a lot of ways. I mean, based on the
Speaker 2: injuries they've had, they're missing a lot of starters.
Speaker 1: So like the number one seed, it would be the
Speaker 1: most amazing thing that has ever happened in the history
Speaker 1: of pro football. Come on, now, that'd be fun. Nobody
Speaker 1: would be upset about that it's not gonna happen.
Speaker 3: But come on, it's it's not gonna happen.
Speaker 2: But like I I kind of just I think I'm
Speaker 2: I like the storyline that they're actually living in, that
Speaker 2: they're inhabiting, which is a strange, injury riddled, over achieving
Speaker 2: team with a Coach of the Year candidate and an
Speaker 2: amazing story in Joe Flacco. Who you know the Jets?
Speaker 2: If anything, the Jets defenders know Joe Flacco as well
Speaker 2: as any group of players in the league. And I
Speaker 2: think that presents an interesting challenge if the Jets show
Speaker 2: up to this game and they still care about their season,
Speaker 2: and I believe the defense does, Like I think that
Speaker 2: this uh, you know, one thing that happened to the
Speaker 2: Jets that I think makes a difference is for Woody
Speaker 2: Johnson to come out, whether you like it or not,
Speaker 2: Damn for Woody Johnson to come out and say the
Speaker 2: coaches are safe, everyone's staying, the GM's staying, like the
Speaker 2: ship is not going to be blown up from the
Speaker 2: inside out, Like you're gonna get players, so like we're
Speaker 2: gonna play hard because we're still being looked at by
Speaker 2: the same people. Our careers aren't gonna be in flux
Speaker 2: the way they we thought they might. And like you
Speaker 2: have practiced against Joe Flacco seasons in a row, I
Speaker 2: think that matters, and I think it's like a huge
Speaker 2: chance for Cleveland to not basically drop a bomb on
Speaker 2: themselves because it's like, you you win this game and
Speaker 2: you're just in the playoffs. They probably are already, but
Speaker 2: if you go and do it on Thursday night at
Speaker 2: home in a celebratory way, it puts a cherry on
Speaker 2: top of a very unusual, strange, the strangest Brown season
Speaker 2: that I can recall since like nineteen eighty eight, when
Speaker 2: like a forty something year old Don Strouck came in
Speaker 2: and like beat the Oilers in the final week of
Speaker 2: the season in a snowstorm to send the Browns into
Speaker 2: the playoffs.
Speaker 3: Like it's that level of weird, and.
Speaker 2: It's become enjoyable because, like, Joe Flacco is someone I
Speaker 2: never enjoyed in my life, and now I'm like, Joe
Speaker 2: Flacco is one of the most enjoyable football players the
Speaker 2: Browns have ever had because of what's occurred.
Speaker 4: I think it's a good test though forget even knowing
Speaker 4: Joe Flacco, but just their offensive line, which you know,
Speaker 4: is certainly better against Houston than it was the week before,
Speaker 4: really injured. They're overcoming a lot having to go against
Speaker 4: this Jets defense. Like that's a real deal test. Now
Speaker 4: you can feel confident. I believe that you are not
Speaker 4: going to need that many points to win this game.
Speaker 4: If you're the Browns, you'd like to get a ground
Speaker 4: game going. They're winning without any running game. But people
Speaker 4: have who have just been watching the highlights. I guess
Speaker 4: that does show it for Flacco, but I just can't
Speaker 4: believe how well he's playing. Like I like, maybe it's
Speaker 4: I'm not gonna say it's fluky because I don't know
Speaker 4: that it's going to continue, but the level that he's
Speaker 4: at just seems out is outrageous, Like he is playing
Speaker 4: like like Stafford or something like. It's just it's just
Speaker 4: insane how well he's playing. Like he's playing way better
Speaker 4: than he played at the end of his Ravens career.
Speaker 4: It should almost go without saying. I mean, he is
Speaker 4: giving them a legit chance because you have an elite defense.
Speaker 4: You have the number eight team in DVOA overall because
Speaker 4: of that defense, largely an elite defense. In a quarterback,
Speaker 4: it's like you can make some noise.
Speaker 1: The most recent Jets game will it's hard to decipher
Speaker 1: if you're looking to get any type of glean, any
Speaker 1: type of preview of how this game will turn out
Speaker 1: because for two quarters the Jets defense played at a
Speaker 1: level that would you know, bury Joe Flacco and many
Speaker 1: other quarterbacks, and then in the second half they let
Speaker 1: Jake Brisket go up and down the field on them.
Speaker 1: So while the Jets defense is on a ballance a
Speaker 1: very good year, they're not unstoppable. They're not They're not
Speaker 1: gonna go to Cleveland and dominate. And I think a
Speaker 1: big part of that is something that has nothing to
Speaker 1: do with them, which is the offense is so bad.
Speaker 1: And Zach Wilson, who, by the way, we didn't really
Speaker 1: talk about it, but all that controversy around Wilson about
Speaker 1: you know, when it leaked out of the locker room
Speaker 1: that he wasn't sure he even wanted to play because
Speaker 1: he was worried about getting injured in an uncertain future.
Speaker 1: Well what happened. He had that one good game and
Speaker 1: then the offensive line no shows on him two weeks
Speaker 1: ago and gets his head bashed in and he's been
Speaker 1: in concussion protocol since, so I actually I don't know
Speaker 1: if he's in the protocol, but he's still in it.
Speaker 1: So that's a sign that you're gonna get Trevor Siemion
Speaker 1: again who's terrible. So what that tells me Mark is
Speaker 1: that Cleveland's defense is going to put the clamps on
Speaker 1: the Jets running game priests. Hall is a really good
Speaker 1: player who's had a great year considering the circumstance. But
Speaker 1: there's not gonna be a lot of room for him,
Speaker 1: I think. And what's gonna happen is that Brown's defense
Speaker 1: is going to put Flacco in a lot of positive
Speaker 1: game scripts. And I feel very good about this. In fact,
Speaker 1: what the hell? Why not I'm gonna lock up the
Speaker 1: Cleveland Browns on Thursday Night Football because I think it
Speaker 1: just sets up very well. Is it in the zone?
Speaker 6: Wait?
Speaker 4: Think so?
Speaker 1: Is it not in the zone?
Speaker 4: I'd have to check that. I think it's like seven
Speaker 4: and a half or something. Let me check. You could
Speaker 4: love it's like, I absolutely love this it is.
Speaker 3: We could let Dan do that though.
Speaker 4: It's out of the zone. Why would know we go?
Speaker 4: You gotta have a you gotta have a code.
Speaker 3: Overtake you for the brown number one position? No, like,
Speaker 3: let him lock up the Browns?
Speaker 1: Why like? Why?
Speaker 6: Like?
Speaker 3: Let let him have a Christmas gift?
Speaker 1: It opened at six and a half. What are you
Speaker 1: talking about?
Speaker 4: It is at seven. It is at seven, just saying
Speaker 4: you got you gotta played by rules, you know, play
Speaker 4: by rules.
Speaker 3: Well that's fine. I mean, I Dan, I'm with you.
Speaker 1: I think like you go see another pleasure movie.
Speaker 3: Greg, Yeah, yeah, Greg?
Speaker 4: Mean we look up against your team. I mean, look,
Speaker 4: if if this was lockable, I think we would all
Speaker 4: lock this way or not that's fair.
Speaker 2: I mean it's like you just lean on, like what's
Speaker 2: the best position group on Thursday night? And it's like
Speaker 2: Cleveland Stefens. Couldn't you see like Miles Garrett having like
Speaker 2: a strip sack and then like you know they are
Speaker 2: a little banged up, but like I mean, I could
Speaker 2: just see them causing total chaos for Trevor Simeon and hopefully,
Speaker 2: you know, they don't blow it. Like if if you're
Speaker 2: a Browns fan, you finally maybe not just assuming everything
Speaker 2: will go negatively. Like it's like it's a little different
Speaker 2: right now, and that's a very weird feeling.
Speaker 4: It probably won't be like a great game, but it
Speaker 4: is kind of a nice moment and opportunity for a
Speaker 4: party here for the Browns. The way this lined up
Speaker 4: the last TNF game, who knows, maybe the last Almichael's
Speaker 4: Herb Street game period. You never know, I think, Yeah,
Speaker 4: I mean he's Undercoon the contract. I'm just saying, like
Speaker 4: hearing Herb Street on College makes me it's like, what
Speaker 4: are we doing here? So not into it. They just
Speaker 4: that they could clinch a playoff spot with Joe Flacco
Speaker 4: in an Island game. That that's kind of fun. That
Speaker 4: is fun.
Speaker 1: Indeed, what a what a great time? All right, anything else, We'll.
Speaker 4: Be back on Thursday. Weird weird schedule.
Speaker 1: Week rightday week.
Speaker 4: Oh, I'll be with Nick Westling on this game. We're
Speaker 4: finishing that freecaps in style too. This will be a
Speaker 4: nice one.
Speaker 1: Nick Westling on the mic for t n F recap
Speaker 1: with Gregy, So make sure you check that out. And yeah,
Speaker 1: because of the holiday and the wonkiness of everything, we
Speaker 1: will be off tomorrow Wednesday, and back Thursday with yet
Speaker 1: another preview of Games Week seventeen. All right, that was
Speaker 1: the Around the NFL podcast. Thank you everybody for listening,
Speaker 1: and do what you know that you need to do
Speaker 1: that Cop