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Speaker 1: That's time for another shift change here at the NFL

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Speaker 1: Combine at the Indiana Convention Center is where we are

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Speaker 1: stationed here along radio ROGUEOD Afternoon everyone, Jerry Dulac of

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Speaker 1: the Pittsburgh Post Cosette and the Steeler Radio Network, joined

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Speaker 1: for the next two hours by Dale Lawley of SNR

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Speaker 1: and the Steeler Radio Network, Steelers dot Com, and Max Starks,

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Speaker 1: the former Steeler offensive tackle, the sideline reporter for all

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Speaker 1: games during the on the Steeler Radio Network. And glad

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Speaker 1: to be with you boys again. We start day two

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Speaker 1: of the combine, Day two of our coverage and it

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Speaker 1: goes to four or five o'clock today, four o'clock, give

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Speaker 1: me an extra hour, that's right, don't ad his time,

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Speaker 1: Another one on for you. And they had the defensive

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Speaker 1: linemen or some of the edge rushers in this morning

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Speaker 1: and a guy that, uh what I was wanted to

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Speaker 1: bring up yesterday to y'all. And if you look at

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Speaker 1: what this team among the things this team needs. But

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Speaker 1: and Max, you know we've talked about this before. Their

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Speaker 1: need for the next cam. Heyward, you just don't go

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Speaker 1: out and hand pick that guy and find them that easily.

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Speaker 1: But a big time defensive lineman. There aren't a lot

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Speaker 1: of those the three techniques in this draft, but a

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Speaker 1: guy who is extremely intriguing and impressive, and he was

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Speaker 1: this morning even chatting, is a Byron Murphy. And you

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Speaker 1: know he is a he's kind of a I mean,

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Speaker 1: he's a thick guy, he's a quick twitch guy. I'm

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Speaker 1: curious what you think about him. And again, there aren't

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Speaker 1: a lot of them in this draft for the Steelers,

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Speaker 1: but there's no question if they can find that guy.

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Speaker 1: I've thought that for the last two years and I

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Speaker 1: haven't really changed my mind. That's what the Steelers need

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Speaker 1: to do.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, well, you always have to restock, right, You always try,

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Speaker 2: and you want to restock while you have guys in

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Speaker 2: there that under standing and do it at a high level.

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Speaker 2: They do it the way that you want them to

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Speaker 2: do it, so that those young guys can mimic those traits,

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Speaker 2: they can mimic those habits and also pick up the

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Speaker 2: knowledge that they're dropping. And so when you look at

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Speaker 2: Bira Murphy, I love the size injuries. The only thing

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Speaker 2: that's like the caution, beware buyer type of deal because

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Speaker 2: he's had a couple of injuries over the last couple

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Speaker 2: of years that have prevented him from really being the

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Speaker 2: star I think he could be, and that's why I

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Speaker 2: kind of lean towards Defandre Sweat type because I would

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Speaker 2: like to see that run plugger run defense type of

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Speaker 2: guy that's also super athletic, and like you said, he's

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Speaker 2: a smaller guy, so you kind of can't get leverage

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Speaker 2: on him. But Bira Murphy's one of your more atypical types.

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Speaker 2: And I mean, yeah, he has a really quick tritch,

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Speaker 2: he knows how to penetrate. The question is how fast

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Speaker 2: does he pick up the two gap system because that's

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Speaker 2: always the issue with young D linemen that come from

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Speaker 2: four to three systems. How do you do on two

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Speaker 2: gapping because the two gaping is meant to funnel everything

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Speaker 2: to the linebackers. You're not the star, so you know,

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Speaker 2: when you're thinking of the Aaron Smith types of Casey

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Speaker 2: Hampton types, Cam Hayward, like those guys stefan to it

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Speaker 2: were so good at it because they knew the angles,

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Speaker 2: they knew where to force flow. Can Byron Murphy do it?

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Speaker 2: But he would probably be like a two year probably

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Speaker 2: type of project, which is what you want behind Cam

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Speaker 2: Hayward so, I mean, he's not a bad option. It's

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Speaker 2: just injuries are the only thing that that that worried

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Speaker 2: me about him. It's playing in the AFC North.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 4: The size, he's not the ideal height either that you're

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Speaker 4: looking for. Uh, you know, as a three four end.

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Speaker 4: I look more at a sweats a guy that you

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Speaker 4: know would fit the bill. He could play him at

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Speaker 4: either spot really probably more better suited for the nose,

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Speaker 4: but because his overall bulk, yes, but I mean height

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Speaker 4: wise he's six four. Then you know, you look at

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Speaker 4: a guy like Ruque Roro from I can't pronounce it.

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Speaker 5: Just ye hey, hey for trying.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, like it, just say to it.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean he's he's got that classic six four,

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Speaker 4: three hundred pounds size that you're looking for there and

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Speaker 4: and has some some past rush ability.

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Speaker 3: There is an end. You know.

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Speaker 4: That's the tough thing about this draft is that the

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Speaker 4: some of the top guys are all six one ish.

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Speaker 4: And I was looking at those guy as they were

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Speaker 4: coming in, I'm like, yeah, there's six to one.

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Speaker 2: Yeah yeah, right right, but yeah, that's that's about right,

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Speaker 2: that's about right exactly.

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Speaker 3: They built like bowling balls, you know.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, and that's the thing, like the details.

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Speaker 2: Like it's funny how the D tackles of like shrunk

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Speaker 2: in today's era, you know, which is funny because you

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Speaker 2: think in the air of everybody getting taller, slimmer, leaner, right,

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Speaker 2: and they look like skyscrapers. D tackles have gotten shorter

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Speaker 2: and wider.

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Speaker 4: I don't know what I mean, is everybody taking those

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Speaker 4: six four six five guys and we're gonna make him

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Speaker 4: a tackle.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, just let's just slim him. Let's just slim him

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Speaker 5: down and get him there.

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Speaker 2: And we're not going to worry about if you have

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Speaker 2: okay skills, We're not gonna work with your skill set.

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Speaker 5: We're just gonna put you where you are.

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Speaker 2: So, you know, it comes back to the Tom Cable

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Speaker 2: system right where Tom Cable for years was like I

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Speaker 2: could take a bad D line and making a really

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Speaker 2: good offensive lineman. I think you're kind of seeing that

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Speaker 2: in college well also because as the transfer portal is,

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Speaker 2: you know, those those big time D tackles, boom, they're

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Speaker 2: moving up, they're moving on.

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Speaker 3: Jackson Powers.

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Speaker 4: Johnson was was a defensive tackle when he got to

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Speaker 4: work again and they moved him over to the offensive line.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, because they're like, you're quick, and you'd be better

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Speaker 2: suited you have a longer career. You know, they sell

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Speaker 2: the kids on how can you get on the field faster, Well,

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Speaker 2: we have a need over here, not over here, come

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Speaker 2: on over and then they end up working out. So yeah, exactly,

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Speaker 2: they're like, hey, if they're a backup for one year,

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Speaker 2: oh my god, I'm going elsewhere. And also they're offering

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Speaker 2: move more more money, so why not take that opportunity.

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Speaker 2: So I think you're starting to see that, but the

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Speaker 2: curve has to correct eventually, but this year is not

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Speaker 2: that year. That's why I think you take a couple

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Speaker 2: of gyms that are out there and you kind of

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Speaker 2: you kind of make sure that you run them to.

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Speaker 5: The paces because for the Steelers, this is this is.

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Speaker 2: A very critical year because I don't know, you know,

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Speaker 2: we don't know how much longer Cam has and he's

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Speaker 2: still playing at a high level, but you don't want

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Speaker 2: to get to that point where it's step on to it.

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Speaker 2: I need him and you have to replace him and

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Speaker 2: he start throwing everything at the wall to see if

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Speaker 2: one guy sticks and you get him on US Adams

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Speaker 2: off of the States practice squad.

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Speaker 1: You know they took a step toward that last year

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Speaker 1: with Keanu Benton, who they were just thrilled with. I mean,

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Speaker 1: we saw his progress. He was a disruptive player and

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Speaker 1: they really like him. Disappointment though, of course, I know

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Speaker 1: Isaia Loudermilk was a fifth round pick, little farther down there.

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Speaker 1: But I think the biggest disappointment last year it was

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Speaker 1: Demarvin Leal. You know, he got the coaches, you know,

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Speaker 1: I don't like the expression got into the doghouse, but

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Speaker 1: after what he did as a rookie and how they

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Speaker 1: used him with his his athleticism. You know, he went

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Speaker 1: up over three hundred pounds. He was a big enough guy.

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Speaker 1: I don't know if he put on too much weight

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Speaker 1: and it slowed him down, but whatever, he was a disappointment.

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Speaker 1: He was inactive for a lot of games, and after

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Speaker 1: what we saw as a rookie, I think they expected

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Speaker 1: a lot more.

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Speaker 3: I know they expected a lot more of them last year. No.

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Speaker 2: I mean, you know, when you look at what Demarvin

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Speaker 2: offered as a rookie, he got. He gave you the

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Speaker 2: standard three four D n right. He was he was

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Speaker 2: in your dirt, a great job at whole the point

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Speaker 2: penetrating when he needed to split in double teams, and

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Speaker 2: then you lose TJ Watfern extend amount of time. Then

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Speaker 2: you make him an elephant inn and he goes into

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Speaker 2: the stand up two point and you're like, dude, this

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Speaker 2: dude's setting the edge. He's causing pressure, like tackles can't

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Speaker 2: really get a hand on him.

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Speaker 5: Wow.

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Speaker 2: Year two is going to be explosive for him because

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Speaker 2: he's going to be that Swiss army knife along the

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Speaker 2: d line. And you're right, I mean he was slow

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Speaker 2: a step. Then you saw just kind of rumblings about

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Speaker 2: him not really moving as well as he should have,

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Speaker 2: probably had about ten pounds on him too much. And then,

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Speaker 2: like you said, at the end of the season, we're

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Speaker 2: waiting for him to be acting. We're like, we need

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Speaker 2: all the bodies we can get at the end, and

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Speaker 2: the fact that he was a healthy scratch of the last

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Speaker 2: four games of the season was just kind of that

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Speaker 2: was kind of like the stake in the steak in

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Speaker 2: the ground, like we're not moving off of this point.

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Speaker 2: And so, you know, maybe he comes back to their good

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Speaker 2: graces this year. Maybe he comes back in shape and

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Speaker 2: he's ready to rock and Roll. But you're right, that

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Speaker 2: was a big disappointment, and that was a big hole

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Speaker 2: that could have been filled by him. And if you

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Speaker 2: could have put because remember the Tampa Bay game. I

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Speaker 2: just just popped in my head the Tampa get Bay game.

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Speaker 2: They had louder Milk, Bitten and leal in and they

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Speaker 2: absolutely destroyed the Tampa Bay offensive line. I mean they

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Speaker 2: gave them headaches. Talking about the preseason the preseason game,

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Speaker 2: and I was like, oh man, this is going to

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Speaker 2: be the package. This is the young boy package, right,

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Speaker 2: the hot rod package. I'm waiting for it. And then,

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Speaker 2: like you said, it never dissipated because Isaiah Loudermilk wasn't

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Speaker 2: as consistent, he has some bad technique things. And then,

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Speaker 2: like you said, Demarvin not having the greatest of years,

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Speaker 2: and then only Keano really coming in. So now is

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Speaker 2: Keano trying to fit in with the rest of that crew.

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Speaker 2: It would have been nice what could have been had

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Speaker 2: that actually preseason carried over to the regular season.

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Speaker 4: I just wondered, too, Jerry, how much of this is

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Speaker 4: if you remember back when they had Mike Vrabel and

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Speaker 4: one year they would come in and say, Okay, we're

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Speaker 4: gonna make him a defensive end this year. Yeah, and

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Speaker 4: then the next year he would come in. Now this year,

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Speaker 4: we're gonna playhm it outside linebacker. And it went back

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Speaker 4: and forth all four years that he was with the team,

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Speaker 4: and then he's gone and he goes on to the

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Speaker 4: Patriots and and has a very solid career. You know,

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Speaker 4: maybe you just need to take a guy like the

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Speaker 4: Marveley Allen says, you are an end.

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Speaker 3: That's what you are.

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Speaker 4: We're not gonna bump you out and play any elephant package.

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Speaker 4: This is what you're gonna do. We got enough house

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Speaker 4: outline back.

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Speaker 5: This is what this is.

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Speaker 3: This is the weight we want you at.

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Speaker 4: We don't want you balloon him back and forth and

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Speaker 4: you know, putting on a bunch of weight then losing

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Speaker 4: it and just do this and this is and be

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Speaker 4: this and let's see what you are.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, when he brought him in, I can't remember his

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Speaker 1: exact weight, but they thought he was a little undersized.

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Speaker 1: But I remember when I was on lunch and I'm

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Speaker 1: seeing that backside. I remember towards the end of the

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Speaker 1: year asking him, and I believe he told me. I

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Speaker 1: know it was up over three hundred. I think he

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Speaker 1: said he got up to three ten. Well, that's a

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Speaker 1: lot of extra weight on a guy who relies on

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Speaker 1: his athleticism. I don't know if that was the problem,

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Speaker 1: if it was consistent. I know consistency was part of it,

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Speaker 1: you know, effort, you know, practice, habits, whatnot. But yeah,

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Speaker 1: it just didn't materialize last year. But they have made

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Speaker 1: the attempts to address that defensive line.

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Speaker 3: You know.

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Speaker 1: However, look Wilder Milk and then de Marvin Lee Allen,

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Speaker 1: of course Keanu Benton, and I would expect them to

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Speaker 1: do it again this year, just a.

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Speaker 3: Question of where.

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Speaker 1: I don't think obviously, I don't think it's going to

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Speaker 1: be number one now because those guys aren't there. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: but the second round, yeah, you know a couple in

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Speaker 1: triggering guys, that's a sweet spot.

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Speaker 2: Second and third round are very sweet. So I think

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Speaker 2: Day two is a day where you addressed that issue.

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Speaker 2: And like you said, who could it be? Could it

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Speaker 2: be Roukeru or Chris Jenkins? Yeah, but oh yeah, I

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Speaker 2: got a young Chris Jenkins, which is crazy because he

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Speaker 2: looks like his dad.

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Speaker 5: It's wild playing against his dad.

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Speaker 2: I mean, I'm like what I'm like for the fact

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Speaker 2: that Jinks has his clone in here at this age

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Speaker 2: is pretty wild. And if he turned into his dad,

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Speaker 2: you'd be happy with Oh, absolutely, yeah, absolutely, his dad

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Speaker 2: was a terror. I hate it going against Chris Jenkins,

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Speaker 2: but yeah, I mean you have those guys in sweat

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Speaker 2: is all and kind of that. I feel like there

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Speaker 2: are day two's where you'll start to see those guys

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Speaker 2: start to.

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Speaker 4: Problem is everybody needs those guys and there's only you know,

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Speaker 4: if you don't have a biggest it's not like the

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Speaker 4: offensive tackle group, but there's Yeah, there's twenty of them.

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Speaker 4: You've got six that are you know, true and they

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Speaker 4: and they all fit different schemes. Yeah, you know they're

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Speaker 4: they're they're they're scheme flexible so to speak.

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Speaker 5: So it is going to be interested who.

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Speaker 2: Pulls that trigger first and who and then that's going

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Speaker 2: to start a little mini run on those guys and

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Speaker 2: then you can be like, okay, we're out. Yeah right,

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Speaker 2: we've got no more. We have the restock next year.

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Speaker 5: Guys.

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Speaker 1: You know, when you look at you're talking about guys

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Speaker 1: who don't fit maybe the size, the mold. You look

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Speaker 1: at a guy like the kid from LSU, Mason Smith. Right, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: so it was a six six, three hundred plus guy.

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Speaker 1: It was fairly athletic. You know, I don't know where

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Speaker 1: he falls in a pecking order, where he is if

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Speaker 1: he's a Day three guy, you know, or he climbs,

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Speaker 1: you know, he sneaks in day two somewhere.

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Speaker 2: I think, you know, for Massan Smith, because I had

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Speaker 2: him a couple of times, and I mean, he was

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Speaker 2: just consistent, I think is probably the best word for him.

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Speaker 3: Thank you for giving me the pronunciation.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, exactly. Yeah, it's cajun right.

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Speaker 2: But he he's one of those guys I look at

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Speaker 2: him and you expect it to happen. I mean, because

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Speaker 2: I can't tell you how many times I'm I'm like,

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Speaker 2: I'm staring down like this dude, this is the perfect scheme,

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Speaker 2: perfect front. This dude's gonna blow this play up. And

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Speaker 2: he gets blocked and by a guy that you know

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Speaker 2: I would shouldn't block him. Yeah, that should not block him.

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Speaker 2: And I'm like, well, is it leverage? And you kind

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Speaker 2: of watch a little replay on the screen and you're like, yeah,

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Speaker 2: he gave him his chest, like right out the gates.

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Speaker 2: And so there's some technical things he needs to clean up,

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Speaker 2: but You're right, he has the ability. Do you see

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Speaker 2: enough in the natural category to fall in love with him?

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Speaker 2: But I think he's that latter day two day, early

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Speaker 2: day three type of guy. I think he falls in

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Speaker 2: that three four range because you didn't see enough on tape.

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Speaker 2: And I think that's the thing, Like I can't point

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Speaker 2: to one game where I say that's what's selling me, you.

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Speaker 5: Know, because that's what the scouts do.

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Speaker 2: They have to fall in love with at least one game,

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Speaker 2: one half of play, say something there, there's that gym there,

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Speaker 2: And I can't point to it, like there's not even series.

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Speaker 5: He's just so scattered.

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Speaker 4: Well, we just talked about a guy Jenkins and if

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Speaker 4: you look at his college production, it's not there. No,

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Speaker 4: but everything, the athleticism and everything else, the bloodlines is

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Speaker 4: that everything is there. So how do you balance that

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Speaker 4: against the lack of production, because we've seen other Michigan

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Speaker 4: guys come out, in particular Rashan Gary for example, Yeah,

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Speaker 4: didn't have great college stats, much better pro than he

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Speaker 4: was in college.

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Speaker 2: And still you'd argue Rashan where he got drafted versus

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Speaker 2: what his production is has not been there and Rashawn

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Speaker 2: has grown. It's taken him three to four years to

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Speaker 2: really find his footing. And like you said, if you're like, hey,

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Speaker 2: you are the heir apparent to Cam. Whenever Cam decides

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Speaker 2: to hang it up, I need you to be a

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Speaker 2: Sponge then Massan.

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Speaker 5: Smith Chris Jenkins are those type of guys.

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Speaker 2: But if you need a ready play now guy, now

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Speaker 2: you're looking at Bira Murphy and the upside that he

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Speaker 2: offers Devandre sweat plug and go right now. And so

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Speaker 2: you start to figure but what's your plan? And that's

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Speaker 2: what the teams that's why we're here, right you know,

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Speaker 2: it's like where do these these measurables come out? And

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Speaker 2: where does that apply to when we need those measurables?

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Speaker 4: Well, and the Steelers were able to do that with

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Speaker 4: Cam early in his career. He didn't start right away

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Speaker 4: he can become Cam until twenty fifteen.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, and then he became like wow, you know, yeah.

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00:14:25,160 --> 00:14:28,080
Speaker 2: Because Cam had one move and it's it usually started

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Speaker 2: with his head. Learned from his dad, Yeah, learned from

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00:14:31,840 --> 00:14:34,720
Speaker 2: his dad. He would put the low brow on you.

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Speaker 2: We called it so and he was baby huey early on.

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00:14:37,840 --> 00:14:38,600
Speaker 2: But like you said, he.

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00:14:38,600 --> 00:14:41,400
Speaker 3: Fought every offensive lineman in camp except me.

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00:14:41,800 --> 00:14:42,640
Speaker 5: He never had a fight.

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00:14:43,880 --> 00:14:46,440
Speaker 2: It was very it was a very quick hey, hey, hey,

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00:14:47,040 --> 00:14:50,800
Speaker 2: all right, okay. I was like, because I like, listen,

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00:14:50,840 --> 00:14:52,080
Speaker 2: get I get what you're trying to do.

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00:14:53,400 --> 00:14:55,360
Speaker 5: This. This is not the doormat. This is not the

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Speaker 5: doormat you need.

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00:14:57,440 --> 00:14:59,040
Speaker 4: But they didn't need him to start at that point

342
00:14:59,080 --> 00:15:01,160
Speaker 4: because still had Aaron's and breck Eesel.

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00:15:00,960 --> 00:15:02,240
Speaker 5: Exactly, and he could learn.

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00:15:02,240 --> 00:15:04,400
Speaker 2: And I think that's why if you're saying that right now,

345
00:15:04,400 --> 00:15:07,920
Speaker 2: like hey, we're expecting Cam another two years, right, let

346
00:15:07,960 --> 00:15:10,960
Speaker 2: you understand how to take on double teams properly in

347
00:15:10,960 --> 00:15:13,880
Speaker 2: a three four style system and learn the funnel and

348
00:15:13,920 --> 00:15:17,560
Speaker 2: get yourself, you know, immersed in this world and what

349
00:15:17,600 --> 00:15:19,120
Speaker 2: we're trying to do to become a Steeler.

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Speaker 5: Cool.

351
00:15:20,240 --> 00:15:24,000
Speaker 2: We got that time period, but we don't, you know,

352
00:15:24,040 --> 00:15:26,960
Speaker 2: in a lot of respects, because yes, you have Keanu

353
00:15:27,000 --> 00:15:28,920
Speaker 2: Binton who's come on strong and it's probably gonna be

354
00:15:28,920 --> 00:15:33,200
Speaker 2: our nose next year. Larry Ogunjobi, he's up there, and

355
00:15:33,360 --> 00:15:35,280
Speaker 2: we know that Larry gets time off with it's the

356
00:15:35,280 --> 00:15:37,560
Speaker 2: foot and everything else. So we're gonna need a guy

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00:15:37,560 --> 00:15:39,920
Speaker 2: who can jump in right now. So maybe not a

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00:15:40,000 --> 00:15:42,480
Speaker 2: Chris Jenkins or a Masson Smith because we need somebody

359
00:15:42,480 --> 00:15:46,520
Speaker 2: who can play early in the season to give rotational value.

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00:15:46,640 --> 00:15:48,800
Speaker 2: Get Cam in a position where Cam does not have

361
00:15:48,840 --> 00:15:51,640
Speaker 2: to play every single snap, and he doesn't have, you know,

362
00:15:51,680 --> 00:15:53,840
Speaker 2: an injury issue that comes up in sidelines for a

363
00:15:53,880 --> 00:15:57,160
Speaker 2: couple of weeks. So that's that's the quandary right now.

364
00:15:57,200 --> 00:15:59,520
Speaker 2: That is the quandary, and that's what these guys offer,

365
00:15:59,520 --> 00:16:01,920
Speaker 2: those very levels. So it'll be interesting to see how

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00:16:01,920 --> 00:16:05,520
Speaker 2: the Steelers progress on how they evaluate these guys. I

367
00:16:05,560 --> 00:16:07,120
Speaker 2: can't wait to see what they do on the field

368
00:16:07,120 --> 00:16:10,200
Speaker 2: because I think that's also something you want to see

369
00:16:10,280 --> 00:16:13,440
Speaker 2: their natural skill set because a lot of times in

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00:16:13,480 --> 00:16:17,040
Speaker 2: the schemes that they play in college, the spread offense,

371
00:16:17,160 --> 00:16:19,680
Speaker 2: like you know, and two seconds, I can't really see

372
00:16:19,720 --> 00:16:22,480
Speaker 2: what you're worth because the ball's out, you know, and

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00:16:22,520 --> 00:16:25,440
Speaker 2: then our run scheme is all is all lateral, so

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00:16:25,480 --> 00:16:27,160
Speaker 2: it's like, I'm not expecting you to chase. I need

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00:16:27,200 --> 00:16:29,280
Speaker 2: you to block Derrick Henry in the hole, right, I

376
00:16:29,320 --> 00:16:31,120
Speaker 2: need you to I need you to force flow and

377
00:16:31,200 --> 00:16:33,480
Speaker 2: force Nick Chubb to make a cutback before he wants

378
00:16:33,520 --> 00:16:35,560
Speaker 2: to make a cutback. Those are the things that we

379
00:16:35,680 --> 00:16:38,480
Speaker 2: value in the AFC North versus a lot of other places.

380
00:16:40,960 --> 00:16:44,440
Speaker 3: Where would you go in the draft? What would you

381
00:16:44,480 --> 00:16:46,480
Speaker 3: address first center?

382
00:16:47,320 --> 00:16:49,760
Speaker 5: Yeah, and that's not me being an offensive lineman.

383
00:16:50,680 --> 00:16:51,840
Speaker 3: Hey, right now, it.

384
00:16:53,640 --> 00:16:54,440
Speaker 5: Is the biggest hole.

385
00:16:54,480 --> 00:16:57,400
Speaker 2: And like I said, I feel like when I look

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00:16:57,480 --> 00:17:02,960
Speaker 2: at Jackson, he looks like what we like, what we desire,

387
00:17:03,600 --> 00:17:06,679
Speaker 2: and he fits what we're trying to do. And so

388
00:17:07,720 --> 00:17:10,520
Speaker 2: I've watched enough Oregon film and I've watched him play.

389
00:17:11,440 --> 00:17:15,800
Speaker 2: He has that natural tenacity, he has the athleticism, and

390
00:17:15,840 --> 00:17:19,920
Speaker 2: he's smart as hell. So I'm like, when it makes sense,

391
00:17:20,400 --> 00:17:23,240
Speaker 2: don't try and just don't overthink to pick.

392
00:17:23,760 --> 00:17:24,199
Speaker 5: Just take him.

393
00:17:24,240 --> 00:17:26,600
Speaker 2: If he's there at twenty cool. If you get rumblings,

394
00:17:26,640 --> 00:17:29,159
Speaker 2: you have to jump maybe one two spots. I wouldn't

395
00:17:29,200 --> 00:17:32,160
Speaker 2: go anything further than that. You take it because once

396
00:17:32,200 --> 00:17:34,439
Speaker 2: you said it, you can forget it, just like we

397
00:17:34,480 --> 00:17:36,560
Speaker 2: did with Pouncy. And there's very few guys that I'll

398
00:17:36,560 --> 00:17:38,280
Speaker 2: go out on a limb for. And like I said,

399
00:17:38,280 --> 00:17:40,520
Speaker 2: the only other two I felt that way about was

400
00:17:40,560 --> 00:17:41,720
Speaker 2: Linderbaum and Humphrey.

401
00:17:41,760 --> 00:17:43,280
Speaker 5: With the only other two that so this.

402
00:17:43,280 --> 00:17:45,080
Speaker 4: Has come up, how would you compare him as a

403
00:17:45,119 --> 00:17:46,480
Speaker 4: prospect to those two guys?

404
00:17:46,840 --> 00:17:50,360
Speaker 5: So, for Linderbaum, he smaller.

405
00:17:50,640 --> 00:17:54,240
Speaker 2: Yeah, Yeah, he tracks a little bit closer to I

406
00:17:54,280 --> 00:17:57,480
Speaker 2: think what Creed Humphrey is without the left handedness. Yeah,

407
00:17:57,560 --> 00:17:59,960
Speaker 2: but he has the athleticism, he has a staff smart

408
00:18:00,560 --> 00:18:02,960
Speaker 2: and I would probably put him closer to Creed than Tyler,

409
00:18:04,359 --> 00:18:06,520
Speaker 2: just because I think Tyler was probably the perfect one.

410
00:18:06,640 --> 00:18:09,719
Speaker 5: I mean he was. He was big, strong, and nasty

411
00:18:09,760 --> 00:18:10,120
Speaker 5: as hell.

412
00:18:11,119 --> 00:18:13,600
Speaker 2: So I would say he's probably closer to Creed as

413
00:18:13,600 --> 00:18:15,359
Speaker 2: far as tracking, I think, but he fits right in

414
00:18:15,400 --> 00:18:16,400
Speaker 2: that mold between the two.

415
00:18:17,520 --> 00:18:20,480
Speaker 1: Yeah, he's a He's a very intriguing and impressive prospect

416
00:18:20,520 --> 00:18:22,600
Speaker 1: that I'm with you right now if that's where I was,

417
00:18:23,280 --> 00:18:25,000
Speaker 1: if I were if I were going.

418
00:18:24,880 --> 00:18:26,760
Speaker 3: Somebody said you can get me for the twentieth pick

419
00:18:26,840 --> 00:18:31,919
Speaker 3: right now, you can here. It is just absolutely Yeah.

420
00:18:31,960 --> 00:18:34,040
Speaker 3: It is day two of the NFL Combine.

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00:18:34,080 --> 00:18:36,600
Speaker 1: It's our second shift of the day, Jerry Dulac along

422
00:18:36,640 --> 00:18:39,680
Speaker 1: with Dale Lawley and Max Starks. When we come back,

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Speaker 1: we're gonna talk with Tony Grossi of ESPN Cleveland, long

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Speaker 1: time writer covers the Cleveland Brown. Since I think you

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Speaker 1: go back to Otto Graham. If I'm not mistaken, we

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Speaker 1: were talking Tony. When we come back, you're listening to

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Speaker 1: Fox Sports Pittsburgh and Stealer Nation Radio.

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00:18:57,040 --> 00:18:57,800
Speaker 5: When you want.

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Speaker 6: Black and gold football talk, you won SNR Fox Sports

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Speaker 6: Pittsburgh Tailgator Traffic is continuing cop reach Obbout twenty twenty

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Speaker 6: four NFL Combine live from Indianapolis on Steelers Nation Radio.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, welcome back to the Indiana Convention Center.

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Speaker 1: It's the site of the NFL Combine Day two and

434
00:19:27,680 --> 00:19:31,560
Speaker 1: joined now by Tony Grossie, who has covered the Browns

435
00:19:31,600 --> 00:19:35,359
Speaker 1: for many, many years in Cleveland, beginning with the Plane

436
00:19:35,440 --> 00:19:38,680
Speaker 1: Dealer in Cleveland. Now for ESPN Radio tone always good

437
00:19:38,680 --> 00:19:40,320
Speaker 1: to see you, my friend. I haven't seen you since

438
00:19:40,320 --> 00:19:41,080
Speaker 1: dinner last night.

439
00:19:43,080 --> 00:19:45,640
Speaker 3: Oh, it's always good to be with you guys here.

440
00:19:45,960 --> 00:19:47,600
Speaker 3: I look forward to it every year. You know, I

441
00:19:47,640 --> 00:19:49,920
Speaker 3: covered the Browns so long ago. They were better than

442
00:19:49,960 --> 00:19:51,080
Speaker 3: the Steelers back then.

443
00:19:52,080 --> 00:19:54,840
Speaker 1: This first time in thirty four years, right, did they

444
00:19:54,840 --> 00:19:56,920
Speaker 1: finished with a better record in Steeler I was there

445
00:19:57,040 --> 00:20:01,200
Speaker 1: thirty four years ago. Good lord, And you're still trying

446
00:20:01,240 --> 00:20:04,080
Speaker 1: to get over that humiliating defeat in the postseason. I mean,

447
00:20:04,119 --> 00:20:08,199
Speaker 1: just a surprise, did I certainly not with the point production.

448
00:20:08,280 --> 00:20:10,080
Speaker 3: That's what I didn't know. Now, And you know they

449
00:20:10,119 --> 00:20:13,960
Speaker 3: had played Houston on Christmas Eve in Houston. C J.

450
00:20:14,200 --> 00:20:17,359
Speaker 3: Stroud didn't play in that game, and a couple of

451
00:20:17,400 --> 00:20:20,280
Speaker 3: their best defensive players didn't play in that game, and

452
00:20:20,359 --> 00:20:22,760
Speaker 3: I just took it for granted. Maybe they did too that,

453
00:20:23,359 --> 00:20:24,959
Speaker 3: you know, we'll get by this game and go on

454
00:20:25,000 --> 00:20:27,960
Speaker 3: to Baltimore maybe the next round. I think it speaks

455
00:20:28,000 --> 00:20:30,280
Speaker 3: to the importance of winning your division. I don't think

456
00:20:30,320 --> 00:20:34,000
Speaker 3: Houston would go to Cleveland and perform like that, you know,

457
00:20:34,359 --> 00:20:36,960
Speaker 3: but they won their division and they got it to

458
00:20:37,040 --> 00:20:39,359
Speaker 3: host that game. The Browns haven't won a division since

459
00:20:40,119 --> 00:20:44,000
Speaker 3: the eighties, and it's it should be their goal, not

460
00:20:44,200 --> 00:20:45,160
Speaker 3: just being a wild card.

461
00:20:45,280 --> 00:20:47,440
Speaker 4: How much of that, Tony was I mean, the home

462
00:20:47,560 --> 00:20:50,720
Speaker 4: road defensive splits were pretty fubstantial.

463
00:20:50,960 --> 00:20:53,840
Speaker 3: No one can explain it Dale, and if they can't,

464
00:20:53,960 --> 00:20:58,520
Speaker 3: I can't. I didn't think. I mentioned the game in

465
00:20:58,600 --> 00:21:03,360
Speaker 3: Houston on December twenty third. They dominated that game offensive

466
00:21:03,359 --> 00:21:06,719
Speaker 3: and defensively. I thought, Okay, they're getting in the playoff mode.

467
00:21:07,000 --> 00:21:09,600
Speaker 3: But lo and behold, their defense did not show up

468
00:21:09,600 --> 00:21:11,080
Speaker 3: in Houston in the wild card game.

469
00:21:11,400 --> 00:21:13,920
Speaker 4: It was a shock, Like twenty nine points a game

470
00:21:13,960 --> 00:21:16,480
Speaker 4: on the road and thirteen at home. About that, Yeah,

471
00:21:16,680 --> 00:21:18,880
Speaker 4: I mean, that's as drastic as it gets.

472
00:21:19,000 --> 00:21:22,120
Speaker 3: Yeah, it started Week two in Pittsburgh because they had

473
00:21:22,200 --> 00:21:28,920
Speaker 3: two of those were turnover touchdowns for the Steelers. But yeah,

474
00:21:30,359 --> 00:21:32,920
Speaker 3: that's got to be their off season project figuring out

475
00:21:32,960 --> 00:21:35,600
Speaker 3: why that happened. And I don't have the answer.

476
00:21:35,840 --> 00:21:38,200
Speaker 2: Well, And also, you know, defense is normally supposed to

477
00:21:38,280 --> 00:21:40,680
Speaker 2: carry on the road. That's the one thing, especially when

478
00:21:40,680 --> 00:21:43,119
Speaker 2: you have the top defense in the league. Yeah, it

479
00:21:43,200 --> 00:21:46,160
Speaker 2: was interesting the system that they used because obviously they

480
00:21:46,200 --> 00:21:49,080
Speaker 2: know that Miles Garrett moves around and that's I think

481
00:21:49,119 --> 00:21:51,240
Speaker 2: one of the things. So you have the reigning defensive

482
00:21:51,240 --> 00:21:53,480
Speaker 2: player of the year as much as instagrims me to

483
00:21:53,520 --> 00:21:57,800
Speaker 2: say it, and TJ. Watt, Yeah exactly, and TJ. Watt

484
00:21:57,840 --> 00:22:01,440
Speaker 2: was there. But you know, when you look at this

485
00:22:01,560 --> 00:22:06,240
Speaker 2: team offensively and just what they did with the entire

486
00:22:06,320 --> 00:22:09,840
Speaker 2: quarterback carousel and the lack of Nick Chubb to still

487
00:22:09,920 --> 00:22:11,920
Speaker 2: make it there, I mean you had to have kind

488
00:22:11,920 --> 00:22:14,240
Speaker 2: of some hope, like, man, we can get this done.

489
00:22:14,800 --> 00:22:18,800
Speaker 2: But with the big sixty three million dollar elephant in

490
00:22:18,840 --> 00:22:21,400
Speaker 2: the room is what do you have with Deshaun Watson.

491
00:22:21,480 --> 00:22:25,640
Speaker 3: Yeah, and you know, you wonder that they just caught

492
00:22:25,720 --> 00:22:28,679
Speaker 3: lightning in a bottle Joe Flaka. He came in and

493
00:22:28,760 --> 00:22:31,440
Speaker 3: had five three hundred yard passing games of the pick

494
00:22:31,520 --> 00:22:34,520
Speaker 3: se incredible story. The pick sixes end up fighting them

495
00:22:34,520 --> 00:22:36,640
Speaker 3: in the butt because he had two or three pick

496
00:22:36,760 --> 00:22:39,679
Speaker 3: sixes in those wins, and then he had two in

497
00:22:39,720 --> 00:22:41,920
Speaker 3: the playoff game, and that's the only time it really

498
00:22:41,920 --> 00:22:44,800
Speaker 3: cost him. Of course, you got behind though two. Yeah,

499
00:22:44,920 --> 00:22:47,199
Speaker 3: but they were only down by ten. Yeah yeah, the

500
00:22:47,240 --> 00:22:52,040
Speaker 3: one one, yeah, right, but it changed the game. Now,

501
00:22:52,440 --> 00:22:56,199
Speaker 3: the problem is Watson's only played eleven full games in

502
00:22:56,280 --> 00:22:59,719
Speaker 3: two years, and his last game he had a terrific

503
00:22:59,800 --> 00:23:04,520
Speaker 3: sight half against Baltimore. In Baltimore beat Lamar and and

504
00:23:04,560 --> 00:23:07,199
Speaker 3: then Pittsburgh was the next game. I remember coming in.

505
00:23:07,320 --> 00:23:09,879
Speaker 3: You guys came into Cleveland and on Wednesday, all of

506
00:23:09,920 --> 00:23:12,840
Speaker 3: a sudden, he's out for the air. We couldn't find

507
00:23:13,359 --> 00:23:17,159
Speaker 3: an injury on the field. In Baltimore, he had a

508
00:23:17,240 --> 00:23:20,879
Speaker 3: high ankle sprain he played through, but that contributed to

509
00:23:20,920 --> 00:23:24,600
Speaker 3: the weirdness of his season. He had two shoulder injuries

510
00:23:25,320 --> 00:23:27,880
Speaker 3: and neither he finished the game with both of them,

511
00:23:28,240 --> 00:23:31,920
Speaker 3: and you can't pinpoint what happened. So he's got to

512
00:23:31,960 --> 00:23:35,080
Speaker 3: stay in the field, and you know, string together good

513
00:23:35,119 --> 00:23:36,639
Speaker 3: games like he did in Baltimore.

514
00:23:36,920 --> 00:23:39,760
Speaker 1: So, Tom, what did they do with Joe Flaccom.

515
00:23:40,359 --> 00:23:43,040
Speaker 3: I don't think they. I think they are secretly hoping

516
00:23:43,200 --> 00:23:46,840
Speaker 3: he finds a better opportunity. What because I think he

517
00:23:46,880 --> 00:23:49,880
Speaker 3: would be a It would be added pressure. It would

518
00:23:50,200 --> 00:23:53,719
Speaker 3: it would add pressure. It would divide maybe not the

519
00:23:53,720 --> 00:23:56,360
Speaker 3: locker room, but it would divide the fan base absolutely,

520
00:23:56,400 --> 00:23:59,400
Speaker 3: it would divide the media, and then eventually it would

521
00:23:59,440 --> 00:24:03,359
Speaker 3: divide the locker room if Watson doesn't perform. Because listen,

522
00:24:03,640 --> 00:24:07,639
Speaker 3: they loved Floco, I mean Amari Cooper's I was in

523
00:24:07,680 --> 00:24:09,960
Speaker 3: love with him because he could get him the ball.

524
00:24:10,600 --> 00:24:14,959
Speaker 3: David and Joku had his best year with Flaco. But

525
00:24:15,040 --> 00:24:19,960
Speaker 3: they also do love Watson, and but having the two

526
00:24:20,000 --> 00:24:23,600
Speaker 3: of them healthy together, we haven't seen that yet. You

527
00:24:23,640 --> 00:24:28,040
Speaker 3: know what happens if Watson is healthy and doesn't perform.

528
00:24:28,359 --> 00:24:30,879
Speaker 3: So I think the Browns want to avoid that situation.

529
00:24:31,280 --> 00:24:37,080
Speaker 4: Tony Max mentioned Nick Chubb and Uh, that's a looming issue.

530
00:24:37,119 --> 00:24:39,159
Speaker 3: What do you think happens with him? I mean that

531
00:24:39,240 --> 00:24:45,919
Speaker 3: was a pretty significant injury. Gosh, image I still bothers me. Uh,

532
00:24:46,119 --> 00:24:49,360
Speaker 3: he's the most beloved player in Cleveland, in the locker room,

533
00:24:49,359 --> 00:24:52,320
Speaker 3: and outside the locker room, he's very happy. He had

534
00:24:52,359 --> 00:24:58,040
Speaker 3: two surgeries on that left knee, both times the doctor reported.

535
00:24:58,640 --> 00:25:01,000
Speaker 3: We expect him to be able to play in twenty

536
00:25:01,040 --> 00:25:04,680
Speaker 3: twenty four when we don't know, probably the second half

537
00:25:04,720 --> 00:25:05,240
Speaker 3: of the season.

538
00:25:05,280 --> 00:25:08,160
Speaker 4: And he's a fourteen million dollar capit right fifteen to fifteen,

539
00:25:08,240 --> 00:25:11,600
Speaker 4: so that's not difficult. That's not a challenge for the

540
00:25:11,600 --> 00:25:13,400
Speaker 4: Browns to correct that.

541
00:25:13,640 --> 00:25:18,840
Speaker 3: Algians is the players cooperation. Unfortunately for Chubby, he has

542
00:25:18,920 --> 00:25:22,440
Speaker 3: no leverage. Who's going to sign him a free agency? Yeah,

543
00:25:22,680 --> 00:25:25,920
Speaker 3: three major operations on his left knee, two this year,

544
00:25:26,640 --> 00:25:30,359
Speaker 3: and they want to stay together, so it'll happen. I

545
00:25:30,359 --> 00:25:31,879
Speaker 3: don't know what kind of No one knows what kind

546
00:25:31,880 --> 00:25:34,639
Speaker 3: of player he'll be. He's come back before, but this

547
00:25:34,800 --> 00:25:36,760
Speaker 3: is the second time. He'll be twenty nine this year,

548
00:25:36,920 --> 00:25:41,280
Speaker 3: so he already I expect him to be on the

549
00:25:41,320 --> 00:25:44,120
Speaker 3: field at some point and we don't know about next year,

550
00:25:44,119 --> 00:25:46,320
Speaker 3: but worry about twenty twenty five next year.

551
00:25:46,640 --> 00:25:49,119
Speaker 1: We're talking with Tony Gross, he covers the Browns in

552
00:25:49,200 --> 00:25:53,160
Speaker 1: Cleveland with things with ESPN Radio now in Cleveland, a tone,

553
00:25:53,640 --> 00:25:56,560
Speaker 1: you know, the situation with Sean Watson and Joe Flacco,

554
00:25:56,920 --> 00:26:01,200
Speaker 1: somewhat similar to what the Steelers will be facing with

555
00:26:01,600 --> 00:26:04,200
Speaker 1: Kenny Pickett and Mason Rudolph, because you have a guy

556
00:26:04,200 --> 00:26:06,680
Speaker 1: who came in started the last three games all of

557
00:26:06,720 --> 00:26:08,920
Speaker 1: a sudden, the NFL, I mean, excuse me, the offense

558
00:26:08,960 --> 00:26:12,680
Speaker 1: explodes under Mason Rudolph. They can gets them to the postseason,

559
00:26:13,760 --> 00:26:16,920
Speaker 1: and you know the situation. You have a number one

560
00:26:16,960 --> 00:26:21,040
Speaker 1: pick in Kenny Pickett, and it may not be as extreme.

561
00:26:21,640 --> 00:26:24,240
Speaker 1: The story of Mason Rudolph does not match the story

562
00:26:24,320 --> 00:26:28,240
Speaker 1: of Joe Flacco nationally, but there is going to be

563
00:26:28,400 --> 00:26:32,280
Speaker 1: that same type of dynamic in Pittsburgh if Mason Rudolph resigns,

564
00:26:32,880 --> 00:26:36,719
Speaker 1: because if Kenny Pickett struggles, the fans are gonna clamor

565
00:26:37,000 --> 00:26:40,000
Speaker 1: the players who like what Mason Rudolph did with the

566
00:26:40,040 --> 00:26:43,960
Speaker 1: offense are going to start maybe publicly clamoring, certain maybe

567
00:26:44,080 --> 00:26:48,600
Speaker 1: certainly privately, and then it becomes another bit of a hailstorm.

568
00:26:49,200 --> 00:26:50,920
Speaker 3: Well, you got a new character involved in that, and

569
00:26:50,960 --> 00:26:53,800
Speaker 3: that's Arthur Smith. Arthur Smith, right, So how that factors

570
00:26:53,800 --> 00:26:57,080
Speaker 3: into that dynamic. I will tell you that in Cleveland,

571
00:26:57,119 --> 00:26:59,880
Speaker 3: Browns fans are hoping you fall in love with Mason Rudolph.

572
00:27:00,160 --> 00:27:02,840
Speaker 3: They want to see him as your starting quarterback for

573
00:27:03,400 --> 00:27:05,639
Speaker 3: the Cleveland fans just don't have a high opinion of

574
00:27:05,680 --> 00:27:08,840
Speaker 3: Mason Rudolph, Pickets beating him a couple of times, So

575
00:27:10,080 --> 00:27:13,600
Speaker 3: I don't know that that's Pittsburgh's issue. You're right though,

576
00:27:13,920 --> 00:27:17,040
Speaker 3: I called h Mason Rudolf kind of their mini Flacco.

577
00:27:18,200 --> 00:27:20,160
Speaker 3: It wasn't as big of a splash, but they weren't

578
00:27:20,200 --> 00:27:21,720
Speaker 3: games with them. You got to take note of that.

579
00:27:22,359 --> 00:27:24,440
Speaker 1: So where did what? What did the Browns want to do?

580
00:27:24,760 --> 00:27:25,160
Speaker 2: Uh?

581
00:27:25,359 --> 00:27:27,320
Speaker 1: If not in free agency, certainly in the draft.

582
00:27:28,560 --> 00:27:32,119
Speaker 3: They have two major needs on their team. A wide

583
00:27:32,119 --> 00:27:36,479
Speaker 3: receiver to get behind the secondary to compliment Amari Cooper

584
00:27:37,280 --> 00:27:41,880
Speaker 3: and a deep threat. And they need a stud defensive tackle,

585
00:27:42,280 --> 00:27:47,600
Speaker 3: which they ruin everybody. Yeah, we're just talking about that.

586
00:27:47,840 --> 00:27:51,120
Speaker 3: The teams in the playoffs have them Chris Jones when

587
00:27:51,160 --> 00:27:53,720
Speaker 3: the Bengals were good, j D. J. Reider before he

588
00:27:53,760 --> 00:27:59,600
Speaker 3: got hurt. Uh, every team yea yeah, yeah. And and

589
00:27:59,680 --> 00:28:03,520
Speaker 3: so they have to decide which avenue do you use

590
00:28:03,680 --> 00:28:07,560
Speaker 3: to fill each need? My suggestion, which they never take.

591
00:28:08,320 --> 00:28:10,639
Speaker 3: I thought they did. They never do. I thought they

592
00:28:10,760 --> 00:28:15,760
Speaker 3: listened to you. You know, if if DT and free agency,

593
00:28:16,480 --> 00:28:19,000
Speaker 3: guy like Christian Wilkins in Miami if if they don't

594
00:28:19,040 --> 00:28:22,160
Speaker 3: protect him, looks like Chris Jones and bat Matta Week

595
00:28:22,400 --> 00:28:25,680
Speaker 3: will be protected. Yeah, so, and then use their second

596
00:28:25,760 --> 00:28:29,000
Speaker 3: round pick on the receiver you know they've been without

597
00:28:29,040 --> 00:28:32,960
Speaker 3: the first round pick. Is the third year of that penance,

598
00:28:33,880 --> 00:28:36,680
Speaker 3: but each of the previous two years Andrew Berry, the

599
00:28:36,760 --> 00:28:39,479
Speaker 3: GM has traded the second round pick. So he has

600
00:28:39,560 --> 00:28:45,040
Speaker 3: kind of exacerbated his draft problem. Hopefully he keeps it

601
00:28:45,400 --> 00:28:47,720
Speaker 3: and uses it, because this sounds like a deep wide

602
00:28:47,760 --> 00:28:48,760
Speaker 3: receiver class.

603
00:28:49,120 --> 00:28:51,400
Speaker 5: Yeah. Yeah, what was something we've been talking about.

604
00:28:51,880 --> 00:28:54,360
Speaker 3: They passed on George Pickens two years ago. They traded

605
00:28:54,400 --> 00:28:56,240
Speaker 3: out of that pick. I was I was very vocal

606
00:28:56,280 --> 00:28:58,680
Speaker 3: at the time, what you want to pick? Oh you

607
00:28:58,800 --> 00:29:00,480
Speaker 3: just a vocal, but the pick or you want to

608
00:29:00,520 --> 00:29:03,320
Speaker 3: pick ins? No, I want them to take Pickings. That's

609
00:29:03,320 --> 00:29:05,960
Speaker 3: a that's a receiver that they don't have, you know,

610
00:29:06,960 --> 00:29:10,560
Speaker 3: aside from whatever baggage he brings to the table. I

611
00:29:10,560 --> 00:29:12,920
Speaker 3: think I think that baggage falls off if you're on

612
00:29:12,960 --> 00:29:16,440
Speaker 3: a winning team, and I think you know, that wouldn't

613
00:29:16,440 --> 00:29:18,360
Speaker 3: be a problem. But that's what I'm talking about. They

614
00:29:18,440 --> 00:29:21,960
Speaker 3: keep on, uh trading out of it, and you got

615
00:29:21,960 --> 00:29:26,760
Speaker 3: these receivers pouring out of the draft every year nowadays, right, yeah,

616
00:29:26,960 --> 00:29:29,840
Speaker 3: every everybody in the division has one. When we started, remember,

617
00:29:29,880 --> 00:29:32,000
Speaker 3: receivers was one of those positions where it takes you

618
00:29:32,080 --> 00:29:35,479
Speaker 3: two years to really get you know, to get an impact.

619
00:29:35,600 --> 00:29:39,040
Speaker 3: Not anymore. Now they're polished like crazy coming out of college.

620
00:29:39,080 --> 00:29:43,040
Speaker 3: So so that's what i'd say, wide receiver and defensive tackle.

621
00:29:43,440 --> 00:29:45,560
Speaker 2: Now, I know, for for you know, for a lot

622
00:29:45,600 --> 00:29:48,840
Speaker 2: of us when we talk about the division, like that's

623
00:29:48,880 --> 00:29:51,200
Speaker 2: what you match up against before anything else, because like

624
00:29:51,200 --> 00:29:53,400
Speaker 2: you just you said earlier, right, I mean, when the

625
00:29:53,480 --> 00:29:55,480
Speaker 2: last time the Browns have won the division, you need

626
00:29:55,520 --> 00:29:57,920
Speaker 2: to win the division to control your destiny.

627
00:29:57,600 --> 00:29:59,120
Speaker 4: And you get the home game and you don't have

628
00:29:59,160 --> 00:30:00,600
Speaker 4: to worry about your your defense.

629
00:30:00,840 --> 00:30:05,360
Speaker 2: Yeah yeah, but but you know how important when you,

630
00:30:05,400 --> 00:30:07,840
Speaker 2: like you said, you're looking at it and you're saying, okay,

631
00:30:07,840 --> 00:30:10,840
Speaker 2: we need tod tackle because all these teams run the football.

632
00:30:10,840 --> 00:30:13,200
Speaker 2: We need a wide receiver to somebody get behind the

633
00:30:13,240 --> 00:30:16,360
Speaker 2: secondary because the d line is coming after because everybody has.

634
00:30:16,200 --> 00:30:18,360
Speaker 5: A pass rusher on their squad.

635
00:30:18,840 --> 00:30:20,840
Speaker 2: But you know, you also hear people say, well, we're

636
00:30:20,880 --> 00:30:23,680
Speaker 2: looking at the Kansas cities of the world and trying

637
00:30:23,680 --> 00:30:24,760
Speaker 2: to match up against them.

638
00:30:25,000 --> 00:30:27,440
Speaker 3: That to me, that's the wrong way to go about it. Yeah,

639
00:30:27,640 --> 00:30:31,240
Speaker 3: and you're right. See, I think the Browns have gotten

640
00:30:31,280 --> 00:30:36,000
Speaker 3: better at competing in their division. They haven't won it yet,

641
00:30:36,200 --> 00:30:40,400
Speaker 3: but every game against Pittsburgh, Sinci and Baltimore is pretty

642
00:30:40,480 --> 00:30:44,160
Speaker 3: much a good game and a tough game. They just

643
00:30:44,200 --> 00:30:46,920
Speaker 3: have to win that key game. They can't lose that

644
00:30:47,000 --> 00:30:50,280
Speaker 3: Week two game. Uh, you know, to pick it with

645
00:30:50,280 --> 00:30:53,160
Speaker 3: with the Watson turning the ball over for pick sixes.

646
00:30:53,560 --> 00:30:56,480
Speaker 3: Every one of those six games is so important you

647
00:30:56,520 --> 00:30:59,760
Speaker 3: don't get it back, you know, and usually it comes

648
00:30:59,760 --> 00:31:02,280
Speaker 3: down to a tiebreaker in the division, so your record

649
00:31:02,520 --> 00:31:05,160
Speaker 3: is in the division. I always harp on this in

650
00:31:05,440 --> 00:31:08,400
Speaker 3: the in the in my city, and people get sick

651
00:31:08,400 --> 00:31:11,080
Speaker 3: of it. You know, they're thinking, well, can they beat

652
00:31:11,120 --> 00:31:15,320
Speaker 3: homes with with this quarterback? Let's get to bring them

653
00:31:15,360 --> 00:31:19,960
Speaker 3: to Cleveland in a playoff game and taking chances, you know, everybody,

654
00:31:20,400 --> 00:31:22,920
Speaker 3: I'm big on the division. I think the Browns finally

655
00:31:23,000 --> 00:31:27,160
Speaker 3: have you know this coaching Stefanski didn't come from this division,

656
00:31:27,520 --> 00:31:30,880
Speaker 3: but I think over four years he's learned. Uh, they've

657
00:31:30,880 --> 00:31:32,840
Speaker 3: done pretty well against the division.

658
00:31:32,600 --> 00:31:35,520
Speaker 4: In terms of the who you're going to be able

659
00:31:35,560 --> 00:31:38,160
Speaker 4: to keep up out of this group. I mean there's

660
00:31:38,160 --> 00:31:40,920
Speaker 4: going to be some shuffling on the offensive line in particular.

661
00:31:41,080 --> 00:31:44,160
Speaker 3: I don't think so. I think you know, three of

662
00:31:44,240 --> 00:31:48,120
Speaker 3: the tackles had season ending injuries. They expect them to

663
00:31:48,120 --> 00:31:51,360
Speaker 3: be healthy. You might think they devote They pour into

664
00:31:51,400 --> 00:31:54,040
Speaker 3: You'll like, they pour more money into their offensive line

665
00:31:54,040 --> 00:31:56,840
Speaker 3: than all but five teams in the league. Yea, they

666
00:31:56,880 --> 00:31:59,959
Speaker 3: believe in investing and they all have big contracts except

667
00:32:00,120 --> 00:32:05,080
Speaker 3: the rookie. So they want to they'll come. Andrew Berry said, yes,

668
00:32:05,280 --> 00:32:08,480
Speaker 3: he'll continue to do that. It's not an issue. You

669
00:32:08,480 --> 00:32:12,440
Speaker 3: know that they don't need to cut salaries from that

670
00:32:12,560 --> 00:32:13,280
Speaker 3: position group.

671
00:32:13,920 --> 00:32:16,160
Speaker 1: You know, Ton Speaking of getting out of your division,

672
00:32:16,200 --> 00:32:18,800
Speaker 1: I always hark back to the story of when the

673
00:32:18,920 --> 00:32:21,800
Speaker 1: Jaguars came into the division. I came into the league

674
00:32:22,280 --> 00:32:24,200
Speaker 1: and they were going to be placed in with the Steelers.

675
00:32:24,200 --> 00:32:27,800
Speaker 1: And Tom Coughlin spent the previous year before they began

676
00:32:27,880 --> 00:32:31,280
Speaker 1: what ninety four I think it was he's pay. He

677
00:32:31,360 --> 00:32:33,920
Speaker 1: was hired four h and he spent a lot of

678
00:32:33,960 --> 00:32:36,640
Speaker 1: time in Pittsburgh scouting the Steelers. And he said as much,

679
00:32:36,640 --> 00:32:38,440
Speaker 1: and he says, if we are going to compete in

680
00:32:38,480 --> 00:32:41,400
Speaker 1: that division and get out of that division. He goes,

681
00:32:41,680 --> 00:32:43,720
Speaker 1: we have to be able to beat the Steelers, and

682
00:32:43,760 --> 00:32:46,360
Speaker 1: he patterned the Jaguars and what they wanted to do

683
00:32:46,720 --> 00:32:49,040
Speaker 1: after the way the Steelers played. And the Steelers have

684
00:32:49,080 --> 00:32:51,920
Speaker 1: always believed that in teams for years have tried to

685
00:32:52,040 --> 00:32:55,240
Speaker 1: draft and build them, build their team based on how

686
00:32:55,280 --> 00:32:57,080
Speaker 1: are we going to beat the Steelers because for the

687
00:32:57,120 --> 00:32:59,680
Speaker 1: most part they've been the division champ for the most part,

688
00:32:59,760 --> 00:33:01,480
Speaker 1: change the last two years with the Bengals.

689
00:33:01,760 --> 00:33:03,760
Speaker 3: But and and and so that.

690
00:33:03,840 --> 00:33:06,040
Speaker 1: Is a question you have to ask, how how are

691
00:33:06,040 --> 00:33:07,479
Speaker 1: we going to get out of the division and how

692
00:33:07,480 --> 00:33:08,960
Speaker 1: do we build our team to be able to beat

693
00:33:09,000 --> 00:33:10,520
Speaker 1: the teams who have been above us.

694
00:33:10,840 --> 00:33:14,120
Speaker 3: Absolutely, that was the old AFC Central, That's correct, And

695
00:33:14,120 --> 00:33:16,800
Speaker 3: and Kaughlin ended up dominating it for a couple.

696
00:33:16,640 --> 00:33:18,600
Speaker 1: Of years, started up right off the bat. Yeah, they

697
00:33:18,600 --> 00:33:20,360
Speaker 1: got to the championship game with their second year.

698
00:33:20,360 --> 00:33:25,280
Speaker 3: Second year. Yeah, yeah, I really believe that. And uh uh,

699
00:33:25,640 --> 00:33:30,000
Speaker 3: you know, that's what I'm worried about a little bit here.

700
00:33:30,360 --> 00:33:33,400
Speaker 3: The Browns hired Ken Dorsey as their offensive coordinator and

701
00:33:33,440 --> 00:33:36,480
Speaker 3: they did it for Watson. He's had his experience with

702
00:33:36,560 --> 00:33:39,400
Speaker 3: Josh Allen and Cam Newton dual threat quarterback. You know,

703
00:33:39,960 --> 00:33:43,800
Speaker 3: you look at those teams running games. Yeah, and they

704
00:33:43,840 --> 00:33:46,719
Speaker 3: weren't as powerful as what the Browns have been. And

705
00:33:46,760 --> 00:33:48,960
Speaker 3: that's what I'm worried about. The Browns don't lose sight

706
00:33:49,040 --> 00:33:52,200
Speaker 3: of where they're at. They worried too much about taking

707
00:33:52,240 --> 00:33:55,240
Speaker 3: care of Watson. Flaco came off his couch and no

708
00:33:55,320 --> 00:33:57,680
Speaker 3: one said, well, what do we do to help Flacco?

709
00:33:57,960 --> 00:33:59,880
Speaker 3: He went out there and head Cooper and then Joe

710
00:34:00,240 --> 00:34:01,760
Speaker 3: and just threw the ball all over.

711
00:34:02,000 --> 00:34:03,640
Speaker 4: One of the problems with the Bills in the in

712
00:34:03,680 --> 00:34:07,000
Speaker 4: the recent years has been that they play in Buffalo.

713
00:34:07,320 --> 00:34:09,359
Speaker 4: If you're not going to run the football, at some point,

714
00:34:09,440 --> 00:34:11,359
Speaker 4: you're gonna need to run the football in Buffalo. Yeah,

715
00:34:11,840 --> 00:34:14,359
Speaker 4: because yeah, you're in Cleveland, you're gonna need to run

716
00:34:14,360 --> 00:34:14,800
Speaker 4: the football.

717
00:34:14,880 --> 00:34:18,200
Speaker 3: And the Bills won for AFC championships. Yeah, they ran

718
00:34:18,239 --> 00:34:21,239
Speaker 3: that offense, that what they called the KK gun. They

719
00:34:21,239 --> 00:34:23,840
Speaker 3: always let the league in rushing yeap, or we're in

720
00:34:23,880 --> 00:34:28,279
Speaker 3: the top five, yeah, and Buffalo isn't anymore, And that's

721
00:34:28,280 --> 00:34:31,440
Speaker 3: what they're missing, You're right. So I just fear a

722
00:34:31,440 --> 00:34:34,719
Speaker 3: little bit that the Browns running, especially now they lost

723
00:34:34,719 --> 00:34:37,680
Speaker 3: their offensive line coach Bill Callahan, who was the genius

724
00:34:37,719 --> 00:34:41,319
Speaker 3: behind their run system. I hope they don't screw that up.

725
00:34:41,760 --> 00:34:44,120
Speaker 3: You know a tone two things.

726
00:34:44,480 --> 00:34:47,000
Speaker 1: When Joe Flacco in his day with the Ravens, I

727
00:34:47,040 --> 00:34:50,120
Speaker 1: always thought he was the best deep thrower in football,

728
00:34:50,440 --> 00:34:52,800
Speaker 1: and he even showed that with the Browns.

729
00:34:52,800 --> 00:34:56,480
Speaker 3: He did not lose that. I said me too, because

730
00:34:56,600 --> 00:35:00,560
Speaker 3: you know, we cover Flaco twice a year in our

731
00:35:00,640 --> 00:35:04,120
Speaker 3: daily beats, and I always had more respect for him,

732
00:35:04,160 --> 00:35:08,239
Speaker 3: I think than the nationally. The question was is the elite.

733
00:35:08,400 --> 00:35:11,640
Speaker 3: I saw him have the most almost a perfect postseason

734
00:35:11,640 --> 00:35:13,600
Speaker 3: the year they went to the Super Bowl, right, mean,

735
00:35:13,680 --> 00:35:15,520
Speaker 3: Peyton Manning and Tom Brady on the way to the

736
00:35:15,520 --> 00:35:17,879
Speaker 3: Super Bowl? Was it? Yeah? And I was at every game,

737
00:35:18,600 --> 00:35:24,160
Speaker 3: So the deep I said, when Flacco arrived in Cleveland,

738
00:35:24,920 --> 00:35:27,000
Speaker 3: he's like Nolan Ryan. He'll be throwing a hundred miles

739
00:35:27,000 --> 00:35:30,480
Speaker 3: an hour when he's fifty right right? That was, And

740
00:35:30,719 --> 00:35:33,640
Speaker 3: and he sure showed that he had no loss of

741
00:35:33,760 --> 00:35:37,280
Speaker 3: arm strength or touch. He's also got a great touch

742
00:35:37,719 --> 00:35:39,640
Speaker 3: and he says, oh, yes he does. And he's also

743
00:35:39,680 --> 00:35:42,520
Speaker 3: great at the play action game. That's the thing. Watson

744
00:35:42,560 --> 00:35:44,320
Speaker 3: isn't very good at it. And yet that was the

745
00:35:45,560 --> 00:35:49,080
Speaker 3: hallmark of Stefanski's offense. So now they bring in Dorsey,

746
00:35:49,120 --> 00:35:50,960
Speaker 3: we're going to see the less of that play action game.

747
00:35:51,600 --> 00:35:51,799
Speaker 3: You know.

748
00:35:52,120 --> 00:35:54,919
Speaker 1: To your point about Deshaun Watson and how much they're

749
00:35:54,960 --> 00:35:57,520
Speaker 1: going to build around him, you know, they didn't bring

750
00:35:57,560 --> 00:35:59,160
Speaker 1: him in to be a mailman. They brought him in

751
00:35:59,200 --> 00:36:00,640
Speaker 1: to be a gun sling or when you're paying them

752
00:36:00,640 --> 00:36:02,839
Speaker 1: two hundred and fifty million or whatever that number was.

753
00:36:02,840 --> 00:36:05,200
Speaker 3: That's the problem. Yeah, you know that is that the

754
00:36:05,239 --> 00:36:09,600
Speaker 3: best fit for this division, this climate we play in,

755
00:36:09,600 --> 00:36:13,279
Speaker 3: in this team that's already there, you know, so we'll see.

756
00:36:13,280 --> 00:36:16,040
Speaker 3: It's a critical year for the Watson trade, third year

757
00:36:16,120 --> 00:36:19,960
Speaker 3: of five and they haven't got much return on their

758
00:36:20,040 --> 00:36:21,399
Speaker 3: ninety two million so far.

759
00:36:22,160 --> 00:36:24,080
Speaker 1: And so you tell me they're going to blow up

760
00:36:24,120 --> 00:36:25,520
Speaker 1: the stadium and build a new one. Is that what

761
00:36:25,520 --> 00:36:27,560
Speaker 1: your ted told me? Wow, the ownership is talk about it.

762
00:36:27,640 --> 00:36:32,719
Speaker 3: Yeah, the ownership has been conversing for ten years, for

763
00:36:32,800 --> 00:36:36,520
Speaker 3: five years already. The lease is up in five years,

764
00:36:37,360 --> 00:36:42,360
Speaker 3: and they want, actually their public stances, they want a

765
00:36:42,560 --> 00:36:47,120
Speaker 3: billion dollar renovation of that place. And my thing is,

766
00:36:47,440 --> 00:36:50,520
Speaker 3: if you're going to invest a billion, go all the

767
00:36:50,560 --> 00:36:53,680
Speaker 3: way and put them a dome in Cleveland, so you

768
00:36:53,680 --> 00:36:55,600
Speaker 3: can use the thing more than ten times right here.

769
00:36:56,200 --> 00:36:58,960
Speaker 3: So they're they're getting to the point where, you know,

770
00:36:59,000 --> 00:37:02,160
Speaker 3: they start this conversation five years ago, ten years before

771
00:37:02,200 --> 00:37:04,879
Speaker 3: the lease runs out, and now it's time to take

772
00:37:04,920 --> 00:37:07,360
Speaker 3: it seriously because if you're going to do something different

773
00:37:07,400 --> 00:37:10,239
Speaker 3: and build something, it's a three year build in our

774
00:37:10,280 --> 00:37:15,399
Speaker 3: neighborhood right right, and they're twenty five, I means three

775
00:37:15,440 --> 00:37:18,200
Speaker 3: more years left. So yeah, that's what they're going through

776
00:37:18,280 --> 00:37:23,600
Speaker 3: now and talking to the city. You know, the stadiums

777
00:37:23,640 --> 00:37:27,360
Speaker 3: at or they have another location. They actually big news

778
00:37:27,400 --> 00:37:31,359
Speaker 3: in Cleveland was they purchase or want to purchase one

779
00:37:31,400 --> 00:37:34,239
Speaker 3: hundred seventy acres near the airport, which is the side

780
00:37:34,280 --> 00:37:37,680
Speaker 3: of town where their permanent facility is. Anyway, it makes

781
00:37:37,680 --> 00:37:40,640
Speaker 3: so much sense that they might decide, heck it, we'll

782
00:37:40,760 --> 00:37:43,239
Speaker 3: we'll we'll build ourselves, so get it. Get away from

783
00:37:43,280 --> 00:37:46,919
Speaker 3: the lake, yes, yeah, get away from that lake. Yeah,

784
00:37:47,320 --> 00:37:50,360
Speaker 3: well that's what he said. It's an accessible place and

785
00:37:50,440 --> 00:37:52,200
Speaker 3: you know, I get there three hours before a game

786
00:37:52,239 --> 00:37:54,719
Speaker 3: and leave three hours after it. So but there was

787
00:37:54,760 --> 00:37:59,600
Speaker 3: one time, uh, Cleveland Brown Stadium held an outdoor hockey

788
00:37:59,640 --> 00:38:02,359
Speaker 3: game tween Ohio State in Michigan a couple of years ago.

789
00:38:02,800 --> 00:38:05,120
Speaker 3: I went to it with my son and I was

790
00:38:05,120 --> 00:38:07,839
Speaker 3: in that parking lot where we parked the media lot

791
00:38:07,880 --> 00:38:10,719
Speaker 3: by the lake for forty five minutes before I could

792
00:38:10,760 --> 00:38:14,120
Speaker 3: even move an inch. After that game, how do people

793
00:38:14,200 --> 00:38:15,160
Speaker 3: come to these games?

794
00:38:15,320 --> 00:38:17,799
Speaker 2: I didn't realize that I missed two flights leaving me

795
00:38:18,160 --> 00:38:21,239
Speaker 2: year really because I couldn't get an uber to get

796
00:38:21,239 --> 00:38:23,400
Speaker 2: me to the get in there. They couldn't get into

797
00:38:23,440 --> 00:38:25,360
Speaker 2: the stadium. And then I walked up to the to

798
00:38:25,760 --> 00:38:28,440
Speaker 2: the hotel that Hilton right there, and it's still it

799
00:38:28,480 --> 00:38:30,680
Speaker 2: was logjam to get there. So I missed two flights,

800
00:38:30,760 --> 00:38:33,279
Speaker 2: I missed my rescheduled flight, and I ended up having

801
00:38:33,320 --> 00:38:33,560
Speaker 2: to stay.

802
00:38:33,640 --> 00:38:36,200
Speaker 3: Still love it where he may be building the stadium,

803
00:38:36,239 --> 00:38:38,839
Speaker 3: because it's right it's literally a thousand.

804
00:38:38,600 --> 00:38:40,480
Speaker 4: Yards from that's where we always used to stay out

805
00:38:40,520 --> 00:38:42,560
Speaker 4: in that area back in the old days.

806
00:38:42,960 --> 00:38:46,839
Speaker 1: So far five billion dollars out of his pocket. I know,

807
00:38:47,160 --> 00:38:48,920
Speaker 1: I know that most of the places aren't gonna be

808
00:38:48,920 --> 00:38:50,520
Speaker 1: out of the pocket. They're going to hit the city up.

809
00:38:50,719 --> 00:38:53,760
Speaker 3: Yeah, but that's that's the lmity. How much do you

810
00:38:53,800 --> 00:38:55,680
Speaker 3: get from the city or do you just say screw it?

811
00:38:55,719 --> 00:38:58,200
Speaker 1: I'll do it, but guess what you'll get a super Bowl. Yeah,

812
00:38:58,239 --> 00:38:59,480
Speaker 1: if you put a dome on it, you'll put it.

813
00:39:00,080 --> 00:39:02,880
Speaker 1: That's how they extort the cities. You help fund this,

814
00:39:03,000 --> 00:39:04,960
Speaker 1: We'll give you a super Bowl if you put a

815
00:39:05,000 --> 00:39:05,520
Speaker 1: dome on it.

816
00:39:05,520 --> 00:39:05,719
Speaker 5: Though.

817
00:39:05,880 --> 00:39:08,360
Speaker 4: Oh, of course, the last time this happened in the

818
00:39:08,360 --> 00:39:09,960
Speaker 4: city didn't contribute to Browns win.

819
00:39:10,719 --> 00:39:14,200
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's yeah, that's all happened.

820
00:39:14,480 --> 00:39:16,240
Speaker 1: Well, we got to take a break. We always enjoyed

821
00:39:16,239 --> 00:39:18,160
Speaker 1: talking to you. We've gone a little over, but we'd

822
00:39:18,160 --> 00:39:19,359
Speaker 1: go all day with you if we could.

823
00:39:19,360 --> 00:39:21,600
Speaker 3: You know, I'd rather do this than go back there

824
00:39:21,960 --> 00:39:23,440
Speaker 3: unless that's more entertainment.

825
00:39:23,560 --> 00:39:26,839
Speaker 1: Yeah, Tony Grocey of ESPN Cleveland has been our guest.

826
00:39:26,880 --> 00:39:27,640
Speaker 3: We're going to take a break.

827
00:39:27,680 --> 00:39:30,040
Speaker 1: We'll come back with more of the Combine coverage here

828
00:39:30,080 --> 00:39:32,160
Speaker 1: from the Indiana Convention Center right after.

829
00:39:31,960 --> 00:39:41,680
Speaker 6: This live from about twenty twenty four NFL Combine the

830
00:39:41,840 --> 00:39:43,480
Speaker 6: Steelers Nation Radio.

831
00:39:47,920 --> 00:39:50,479
Speaker 1: Yeah, welcome back to the Indiana Convention Center. It's day

832
00:39:50,520 --> 00:39:53,759
Speaker 1: two of the NFL Combine twenty twenty four.

833
00:39:53,880 --> 00:39:54,440
Speaker 5: Jerry do you like?

834
00:39:54,480 --> 00:39:58,440
Speaker 1: Along with Dale Lawley and Max Starts. Thanks to Tony

835
00:39:58,480 --> 00:40:03,440
Speaker 1: grocy from Cleveland for joining us Jeremy Fowler of ESPN

836
00:40:03,560 --> 00:40:05,960
Speaker 1: is going to be joining us in hour two. We

837
00:40:06,040 --> 00:40:08,759
Speaker 1: never know who else might jump on with us. I

838
00:40:08,880 --> 00:40:11,200
Speaker 1: am with Dale and Max until two pm, and then

839
00:40:11,239 --> 00:40:14,400
Speaker 1: after that we'll turn it over to Dale and and Matt.

840
00:40:14,160 --> 00:40:16,720
Speaker 3: Correct Is that right? Does he it too? Yes?

841
00:40:16,920 --> 00:40:20,359
Speaker 1: And Max still one one more hours. I didn't mean

842
00:40:20,400 --> 00:40:28,440
Speaker 1: to interrupt that. Yes, we were talking to Tony about

843
00:40:28,480 --> 00:40:30,840
Speaker 1: the Browns. You know, finished second in division. You know,

844
00:40:30,880 --> 00:40:32,960
Speaker 1: the Bengals took a step back. I actually thought at

845
00:40:33,000 --> 00:40:35,040
Speaker 1: the beginning of the year, there's no reason not to

846
00:40:35,120 --> 00:40:37,680
Speaker 1: think that they were maybe going to three p I mean,

847
00:40:37,719 --> 00:40:40,000
Speaker 1: they were the team to beat. But then you know

848
00:40:40,040 --> 00:40:42,480
Speaker 1: they had injuries, of course, Joe Burrow being the big one.

849
00:40:42,520 --> 00:40:44,200
Speaker 1: First of all, it began with the calf, and then

850
00:40:44,239 --> 00:40:46,560
Speaker 1: it was the wrist, and then injuries to Jamar Chase

851
00:40:46,600 --> 00:40:49,160
Speaker 1: and T Higgins. I mean, those are their guys. And

852
00:40:49,200 --> 00:40:52,200
Speaker 1: so when you talk about trying to get out of

853
00:40:52,200 --> 00:40:55,120
Speaker 1: your division, I mean the Steelers, you know, one of

854
00:40:55,160 --> 00:40:57,239
Speaker 1: the reasons they wanted to draft a corner and they

855
00:40:57,320 --> 00:40:59,640
Speaker 1: drafted a long, leanman and Joey Porter Jr.

856
00:41:00,160 --> 00:41:01,480
Speaker 3: You have to be able to deal with T.

857
00:41:01,680 --> 00:41:04,760
Speaker 1: Higgins, who has been a Steeler killer and or Jamar

858
00:41:04,880 --> 00:41:06,480
Speaker 1: Chase if you want to beat the Bengals.

859
00:41:06,800 --> 00:41:09,080
Speaker 5: Yeah, no, I mean that's why you go get him.

860
00:41:09,080 --> 00:41:11,040
Speaker 2: That's why you went and got Trice Junior as well,

861
00:41:11,800 --> 00:41:12,960
Speaker 2: because you're like, Okay, we need to.

862
00:41:13,920 --> 00:41:15,399
Speaker 1: I want to ask you about him after you finish

863
00:41:15,440 --> 00:41:15,719
Speaker 1: your point.

864
00:41:15,880 --> 00:41:18,680
Speaker 2: Yeah, but I mean that. But that's how that's how

865
00:41:18,680 --> 00:41:21,960
Speaker 2: you're supposed to draft. Traditionally, you draft for and Tony

866
00:41:22,120 --> 00:41:24,640
Speaker 2: was riding the same boat. Right, You've got to draft

867
00:41:24,640 --> 00:41:27,920
Speaker 2: for your division. You can't look beyond that. You can't

868
00:41:28,000 --> 00:41:31,200
Speaker 2: look on the horizon and think of, you know, unicorns

869
00:41:31,200 --> 00:41:34,239
Speaker 2: and rainbows over there in Kansas City, because that's the

870
00:41:34,320 --> 00:41:37,040
Speaker 2: team in our conference that is in the playoffs first,

871
00:41:37,040 --> 00:41:38,840
Speaker 2: and then worry about that and then you want to

872
00:41:38,880 --> 00:41:41,320
Speaker 2: host them. Yeah, you don't want to go to Arrowhead.

873
00:41:41,320 --> 00:41:42,920
Speaker 2: And yes, I know they went on the road. They

874
00:41:42,920 --> 00:41:45,880
Speaker 2: did on the road this year. But what Todd Munkett

875
00:41:45,880 --> 00:41:49,480
Speaker 2: and that crew did was inane as far for an

876
00:41:49,480 --> 00:41:52,440
Speaker 2: offensive scheme against the Chiefs. But that's what you do,

877
00:41:52,480 --> 00:41:54,200
Speaker 2: and I think that's what the Steelers took the step

878
00:41:54,200 --> 00:41:56,319
Speaker 2: in the right direction to do that. Now you just

879
00:41:56,360 --> 00:41:57,959
Speaker 2: had to build upon that and you have to also

880
00:41:58,000 --> 00:42:00,319
Speaker 2: look at you know, we know that Baltimore not a

881
00:42:00,400 --> 00:42:03,960
Speaker 2: huge issue for us because for some reason, it's in

882
00:42:04,080 --> 00:42:07,120
Speaker 2: the head of seven. Yeah, you're in the head of

883
00:42:07,200 --> 00:42:09,839
Speaker 2: Jamar Jason. Everybody down there, John Harbaugh does not want

884
00:42:09,880 --> 00:42:13,560
Speaker 2: to see us. But now it's like Cleveland. Cleveland's the

885
00:42:13,600 --> 00:42:16,439
Speaker 2: one that they're the wild card like we are, So

886
00:42:16,520 --> 00:42:19,560
Speaker 2: how do you combat whatever they're going to do? And

887
00:42:19,920 --> 00:42:21,880
Speaker 2: like I thought, he made a great point, what are

888
00:42:21,920 --> 00:42:23,960
Speaker 2: you going to get with Kim Dorsey? You know, just

889
00:42:23,960 --> 00:42:26,479
Speaker 2: like we're trying to postulate about what Arthur Smith's gonna

890
00:42:26,480 --> 00:42:29,239
Speaker 2: bring to the Steelers. That's still a big issue. Is

891
00:42:29,920 --> 00:42:31,879
Speaker 2: ken Dorsey got fired. They got rid of their whole

892
00:42:31,960 --> 00:42:35,279
Speaker 2: offensive staff. Yeah, except for the offensive line coach. And

893
00:42:35,280 --> 00:42:37,280
Speaker 2: then he goes to join his son in Tennessee.

894
00:42:37,560 --> 00:42:39,279
Speaker 5: Yeah exactly. He's like, well, I'm gonna go.

895
00:42:39,280 --> 00:42:41,560
Speaker 2: I'm gonna follow the kid he's got he's got the

896
00:42:41,560 --> 00:42:43,360
Speaker 2: head huntshow job I know, I got job security.

897
00:42:43,440 --> 00:42:46,319
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's kind of hard to fire your dad.

898
00:42:46,360 --> 00:42:48,640
Speaker 5: Yeah exactly. Exactly. He's like, well, you're not coming to

899
00:42:48,640 --> 00:42:49,120
Speaker 5: dinner tonight.

900
00:42:49,160 --> 00:42:50,000
Speaker 3: Mom's not gonna.

901
00:42:52,320 --> 00:42:53,920
Speaker 1: You know, and and and I'm not going to sit

902
00:42:53,960 --> 00:42:55,920
Speaker 1: here and say that, you know, the Browns of the Browns.

903
00:42:56,400 --> 00:43:00,799
Speaker 1: But until they prove that they have the solidity in

904
00:43:00,840 --> 00:43:04,200
Speaker 1: that franchise to come back the next year and then

905
00:43:04,280 --> 00:43:07,759
Speaker 1: taken another step forward, we just haven't seen them from that.

906
00:43:07,880 --> 00:43:10,799
Speaker 1: And you know, the ownership under Jimmy Haslam has been

907
00:43:11,040 --> 00:43:13,400
Speaker 1: you know, going right down to the to the whole,

908
00:43:13,719 --> 00:43:18,560
Speaker 1: Deshaun Watson, Tobacco, you know, pushing out Baker Mayfield and

909
00:43:18,560 --> 00:43:22,000
Speaker 1: and now being hamstrung. You know, Deshaun Watson walks away

910
00:43:22,000 --> 00:43:25,720
Speaker 1: from you once now what Baker Mayfield's already gone, It's like, okay,

911
00:43:25,880 --> 00:43:28,080
Speaker 1: now we got to throw them all this cash and

912
00:43:28,120 --> 00:43:31,200
Speaker 1: you you just hand traded away all these drafts. Absolutely,

913
00:43:31,239 --> 00:43:34,719
Speaker 1: you've you've handcuffed your franchise. And if and if he's

914
00:43:34,760 --> 00:43:36,920
Speaker 1: not the answer, and they still don't know he said

915
00:43:36,920 --> 00:43:39,960
Speaker 1: in eleven games he's played right, he started star And

916
00:43:40,040 --> 00:43:42,919
Speaker 1: so until the Browns shows some of that, it's hard

917
00:43:42,920 --> 00:43:45,120
Speaker 1: to think, oh, yeah, they'll come back. They've taken they've

918
00:43:45,160 --> 00:43:47,680
Speaker 1: taken one step. They'll come and they'll take the next one.

919
00:43:47,920 --> 00:43:48,919
Speaker 1: We'll see, we'll see.

920
00:43:49,280 --> 00:43:52,400
Speaker 2: And they're still they're still in the debacle with the quarterbacks.

921
00:43:52,719 --> 00:43:55,320
Speaker 2: You pay this Doe two hundred fifty million dollars guaranteed,

922
00:43:55,800 --> 00:43:58,560
Speaker 2: and like Tony said, you're ninety two million dollars into it,

923
00:43:58,600 --> 00:44:02,319
Speaker 2: you've only got eleven games. There's nothing you can do,

924
00:44:02,560 --> 00:44:04,960
Speaker 2: like like you're and then now you're thinking Joe Flacko

925
00:44:05,000 --> 00:44:08,000
Speaker 2: is a better option with Vet minimum with a bunch

926
00:44:08,040 --> 00:44:11,000
Speaker 2: of Eschols, the guy you made it a fifty million two.

927
00:44:11,320 --> 00:44:14,080
Speaker 2: So it's the it's a very brownish type of thing.

928
00:44:14,120 --> 00:44:16,600
Speaker 5: How about that. We'll say very brown browns.

929
00:44:16,680 --> 00:44:20,919
Speaker 2: Yeah, very brown's esque and it's but you're right, I mean,

930
00:44:20,960 --> 00:44:26,360
Speaker 2: and like you said, overhauling the entire offense to appease him,

931
00:44:26,760 --> 00:44:29,200
Speaker 2: and knowing that it's an offense that has struggled with

932
00:44:29,400 --> 00:44:32,200
Speaker 2: run game when you are known for running the football.

933
00:44:32,239 --> 00:44:34,040
Speaker 5: Now, granted you don't know what's gonna be a tip.

934
00:44:34,160 --> 00:44:35,080
Speaker 5: I think running back's.

935
00:44:34,880 --> 00:44:37,080
Speaker 2: Also an issue they have to I think they also

936
00:44:37,239 --> 00:44:39,640
Speaker 2: have to address. It might not be one or two,

937
00:44:39,760 --> 00:44:42,600
Speaker 2: but definitely day two. By the end of the third round,

938
00:44:42,600 --> 00:44:45,120
Speaker 2: you need to have addressed a running back issue because

939
00:44:45,160 --> 00:44:48,359
Speaker 2: that was two surgeries on that knee and you don't

940
00:44:48,360 --> 00:44:48,839
Speaker 2: know when he's.

941
00:44:48,760 --> 00:44:51,160
Speaker 4: Coming back twenty nine. Yeah, he's about to be thirty.

942
00:44:51,239 --> 00:44:54,960
Speaker 4: Fabulous running back. I mean, he's tremendous, had a great career. Yeah,

943
00:44:55,080 --> 00:44:59,000
Speaker 4: could be Adrian Peterson. We don't know, but the proof

944
00:44:59,080 --> 00:44:59,600
Speaker 4: is in the pudding.

945
00:44:59,640 --> 00:45:01,800
Speaker 2: We know that once running backs start taking those knees

946
00:45:01,800 --> 00:45:04,520
Speaker 2: and the amount of pounding that he takes and how

947
00:45:04,600 --> 00:45:06,400
Speaker 2: much they ask of him to run. Now, he has

948
00:45:06,400 --> 00:45:07,880
Speaker 2: a good offensive line in front of him, so he's

949
00:45:07,880 --> 00:45:09,759
Speaker 2: not getting hit till the second level more often than not,

950
00:45:10,160 --> 00:45:13,200
Speaker 2: But still a very big risk if you're hinging everything

951
00:45:13,200 --> 00:45:14,359
Speaker 2: on him being your lead back.

952
00:45:14,800 --> 00:45:18,400
Speaker 4: Crazy thing about it, guys, Kevin Stefanski, as he mentioned

953
00:45:18,400 --> 00:45:21,880
Speaker 4: his one coach of the year now twice without winning

954
00:45:21,880 --> 00:45:22,400
Speaker 4: the division.

955
00:45:22,719 --> 00:45:24,520
Speaker 5: Yeah, right, the.

956
00:45:24,480 --> 00:45:27,520
Speaker 4: Defensive player of the year, they had the comeback player

957
00:45:27,520 --> 00:45:30,839
Speaker 4: of the year, and they had I believe the coordinator

958
00:45:30,880 --> 00:45:33,480
Speaker 4: of the year, the assistant coach of the year in Schwartz.

959
00:45:34,160 --> 00:45:37,000
Speaker 3: And they still haven't won a division. Like, what's going

960
00:45:37,040 --> 00:45:38,960
Speaker 3: to happen if they actually win a division? Are they

961
00:45:39,000 --> 00:45:41,480
Speaker 3: just gonna heavens.

962
00:45:41,280 --> 00:45:44,600
Speaker 5: Yeah, to build him a new stadium, that's yeah.

963
00:45:45,160 --> 00:45:50,719
Speaker 2: And they're gonna just rename the NFL honors, Yeah, it is.

964
00:45:50,760 --> 00:45:53,680
Speaker 2: It's pretty it's pretty wild to think of all those

965
00:45:54,239 --> 00:45:58,200
Speaker 2: individual accolades and it hasn't led to team's success outright.

966
00:45:58,280 --> 00:46:01,000
Speaker 2: That's that's that's pretty pretty be wild to think. And

967
00:46:01,400 --> 00:46:04,160
Speaker 2: I mean, but but that's but that's the Browns, right.

968
00:46:04,280 --> 00:46:07,200
Speaker 2: I mean, it's like, you have all this glitter shiny stuff,

969
00:46:07,200 --> 00:46:09,799
Speaker 2: you got this crazy contract a quarterback you think is.

970
00:46:09,760 --> 00:46:11,080
Speaker 5: Going to be the different and he's not.

971
00:46:11,840 --> 00:46:14,360
Speaker 2: And I would I pushed back on Defensive player of

972
00:46:14,360 --> 00:46:16,400
Speaker 2: the Year, but I also get why he got it

973
00:46:16,840 --> 00:46:18,520
Speaker 2: because he's more versative.

974
00:46:19,360 --> 00:46:20,200
Speaker 3: Any other thing too.

975
00:46:20,239 --> 00:46:22,799
Speaker 1: They were a top three defense, which you'll go, okay,

976
00:46:22,840 --> 00:46:23,920
Speaker 1: why would they top three?

977
00:46:24,080 --> 00:46:26,040
Speaker 3: Well, this guy in particularly that all lenses. When they

978
00:46:26,080 --> 00:46:27,839
Speaker 3: were at home, they were outstads. Oh yeah.

979
00:46:28,000 --> 00:46:30,560
Speaker 4: And they went on the road, they were a different

980
00:46:30,600 --> 00:46:32,759
Speaker 4: deep and that shouldn't it To your point, which we

981
00:46:32,760 --> 00:46:35,239
Speaker 4: were talking about, defense is supposed to travel, Yeah, that

982
00:46:35,360 --> 00:46:37,640
Speaker 4: should travel, and it didn't and should.

983
00:46:37,440 --> 00:46:40,239
Speaker 2: Be easier because there's no crowd noise, right, so you

984
00:46:40,239 --> 00:46:42,600
Speaker 2: should you should be clear on what y'all need to

985
00:46:42,600 --> 00:46:46,680
Speaker 2: communicate in those environments. So you know, it is a quandary.

986
00:46:46,719 --> 00:46:49,279
Speaker 2: But you're right, they had the better record this year,

987
00:46:49,840 --> 00:46:52,080
Speaker 2: and can they do it again? That's gonna be the

988
00:46:52,120 --> 00:46:57,040
Speaker 2: biggest question. Can you be second or better? This upcoming year.

989
00:46:56,880 --> 00:46:59,240
Speaker 1: And they have to prove that and it's just something

990
00:46:59,280 --> 00:47:01,719
Speaker 1: that they don't do now, something they know.

991
00:47:01,840 --> 00:47:03,719
Speaker 2: And they got to figure out their quarterback and can

992
00:47:03,840 --> 00:47:05,600
Speaker 2: he do what they need him to do.

993
00:47:05,880 --> 00:47:06,360
Speaker 5: So much of.

994
00:47:08,239 --> 00:47:11,919
Speaker 4: Of building a winning franchise is learning how to deal

995
00:47:12,000 --> 00:47:15,440
Speaker 4: with success. Because once you get that success, now you're

996
00:47:15,440 --> 00:47:18,560
Speaker 4: getting more Monday night games, you're getting more Thursday night games.

997
00:47:18,680 --> 00:47:21,200
Speaker 4: Now they're gonna want you to travel overseas because you're

998
00:47:21,400 --> 00:47:24,160
Speaker 4: you're a marquee France, and so your players have to

999
00:47:24,200 --> 00:47:25,600
Speaker 4: learn how to deal with those things as well.

1000
00:47:25,680 --> 00:47:28,319
Speaker 1: And the most amazing thing to me, Jimmy Haslam was

1001
00:47:28,320 --> 00:47:30,839
Speaker 1: a Steeler investor for years, and you think he would

1002
00:47:30,840 --> 00:47:34,440
Speaker 1: have learned something about operating a franchise, and everything he

1003
00:47:34,480 --> 00:47:37,279
Speaker 1: does is the antithesis of what the Steelers. We've had

1004
00:47:37,280 --> 00:47:43,800
Speaker 1: a couple of those believers cal and that's gonna do

1005
00:47:43,840 --> 00:47:46,640
Speaker 1: it for hour one for us. We'll be back with

1006
00:47:46,920 --> 00:47:49,800
Speaker 1: our hour two right after this. We're at the Indiana

1007
00:47:49,840 --> 00:47:53,120
Speaker 1: Convention Center. It's site of the NFL Combine. Jerry Dulac

1008
00:47:53,200 --> 00:47:55,920
Speaker 1: along with Dale Lawley and Max Starks. You're listening to

1009
00:47:56,000 --> 00:47:58,920
Speaker 1: Fox Sports Pittsburg and Steeler Nation Radio.

1010
00:48:00,000 --> 00:48:03,439
Speaker 6: Black and Gold football lives here. Twenty four seven. You're

1011
00:48:03,520 --> 00:48:06,800
Speaker 6: listening to SNR Steelers Nation Radio