1 00:00:03,880 --> 00:00:07,520 Speaker 1: Show us that your coaches are trained, show them strainers 2 00:00:08,240 --> 00:00:12,840 Speaker 1: and injury prevention and sports skills and just youth development, 3 00:00:13,240 --> 00:00:16,319 Speaker 1: basic coaching philosophy, how to communicate with kids. There are 4 00:00:16,360 --> 00:00:19,440 Speaker 1: plenty of organizations about they're offering these types of trainings, 5 00:00:19,520 --> 00:00:21,840 Speaker 1: and some of them are very credible. So why can't 6 00:00:21,840 --> 00:00:24,079 Speaker 1: we raise the bar a little bit? You know? Why 7 00:00:24,079 --> 00:00:26,880 Speaker 1: does it have to be the wild West? This is 8 00:00:26,880 --> 00:00:30,320 Speaker 1: the Reformed Sports Project, a podcast about restoring healthy balance 9 00:00:30,360 --> 00:00:35,040 Speaker 1: and perspective in all areas of sports through education and advocacy. Hi, 10 00:00:35,200 --> 00:00:38,360 Speaker 1: this is Nick Bonacoor from the Reformed Sports Podcast. Today, 11 00:00:38,400 --> 00:00:41,960 Speaker 1: I'm speaking with Tom Ferry, founder and Executive director of 12 00:00:42,000 --> 00:00:45,560 Speaker 1: the Aspen Institute's Sports and Society Program, which provides thought 13 00:00:45,680 --> 00:00:49,800 Speaker 1: leadership on topics including the landscape of youth sports, athlete advocacy, 14 00:00:50,000 --> 00:00:53,199 Speaker 1: the future of college sports, and more. A former award 15 00:00:53,240 --> 00:00:56,360 Speaker 1: winning investigative journalists for ESPN and the author of the 16 00:00:56,440 --> 00:00:59,240 Speaker 1: book Game on the All American Race to make Champions 17 00:00:59,240 --> 00:01:01,680 Speaker 1: of Our Children, Tom has been at the forefront of 18 00:01:01,760 --> 00:01:04,560 Speaker 1: youth sports reform for nearly two decades. Tom and I 19 00:01:04,640 --> 00:01:07,400 Speaker 1: discuss why he's taken a top down approach to changing 20 00:01:07,400 --> 00:01:10,600 Speaker 1: the youth sports industry, the importance of educating parents i'm 21 00:01:10,640 --> 00:01:13,720 Speaker 1: the unlikely payoff of a college athletic scholarship, and why 22 00:01:13,800 --> 00:01:17,280 Speaker 1: parents should feel empowered to set community standards when enrolling 23 00:01:17,280 --> 00:01:20,600 Speaker 1: their kids in sports. Man, I am really fired up. 24 00:01:20,600 --> 00:01:23,960 Speaker 1: We've got another awesome guest, someone that I've come to know. 25 00:01:24,520 --> 00:01:28,640 Speaker 1: We share a passion for youth sports reform. I definitely 26 00:01:28,640 --> 00:01:31,720 Speaker 1: consider him one of the leaders. So I'm really excited. 27 00:01:31,760 --> 00:01:34,080 Speaker 1: We've talked several times, and I'm really excited to dig 28 00:01:34,120 --> 00:01:37,960 Speaker 1: in here. The founder of the Aspen Institute Sports and 29 00:01:38,080 --> 00:01:41,160 Speaker 1: Society and Project Play, which many of you have heard of, 30 00:01:41,200 --> 00:01:43,720 Speaker 1: I'm sure, my man, Tom Ferry. Tom, thanks so much 31 00:01:43,760 --> 00:01:47,040 Speaker 1: for hopping on bro just to be here, Nick, thank you, 32 00:01:47,120 --> 00:01:49,960 Speaker 1: Thank you very much a major youth sports advocate. So Tom, 33 00:01:50,040 --> 00:01:53,360 Speaker 1: here's where I love to start with you. Like I said, 34 00:01:53,440 --> 00:01:55,440 Speaker 1: many people will be familiar with your name, familiar with 35 00:01:55,440 --> 00:01:58,560 Speaker 1: your work, and of course in particular you work with 36 00:01:58,600 --> 00:02:01,760 Speaker 1: the Aspen Institute. Where did it all start? When did 37 00:02:01,800 --> 00:02:05,040 Speaker 1: your passion kind of seek out and you start digging 38 00:02:05,080 --> 00:02:08,040 Speaker 1: in here? Yeah? I mean this was about twenty Honestly, 39 00:02:08,080 --> 00:02:12,360 Speaker 1: twenty years ago when I was a parent and I 40 00:02:12,400 --> 00:02:17,480 Speaker 1: was standing on the sidelines of the soccer field in Burlington, Connecticut, 41 00:02:17,720 --> 00:02:22,280 Speaker 1: watching my five year old son, first of three, run 42 00:02:22,360 --> 00:02:24,880 Speaker 1: up and down, run up and down the field in 43 00:02:24,919 --> 00:02:28,240 Speaker 1: the uniform, and the parents are really fired up, right, 44 00:02:28,560 --> 00:02:31,680 Speaker 1: and the score seemed to count quite a bit. And 45 00:02:32,560 --> 00:02:35,080 Speaker 1: I knew that the travel teams are going to start 46 00:02:35,120 --> 00:02:38,359 Speaker 1: forming in two years, and you know, some kids had 47 00:02:38,360 --> 00:02:42,160 Speaker 1: already played you know, six to nine seasons, meaning three 48 00:02:42,200 --> 00:02:46,639 Speaker 1: seasons a year by age six or seven. And I 49 00:02:46,680 --> 00:02:50,480 Speaker 1: was just marveling in myself, saying, WHOA, how did this 50 00:02:50,680 --> 00:02:54,480 Speaker 1: exactly happen? Because when I was a little kid, I 51 00:02:54,560 --> 00:02:57,760 Speaker 1: played plenty of organized sports, but really I slipped on 52 00:02:57,800 --> 00:03:01,480 Speaker 1: the uniform around age eight, okay, and even after that, 53 00:03:01,639 --> 00:03:06,119 Speaker 1: I still most of my play experiences, sport experiences were 54 00:03:06,120 --> 00:03:08,560 Speaker 1: in unstructured settings. It was going out of the park 55 00:03:08,639 --> 00:03:13,160 Speaker 1: and playing basketball games and playing tackle football, and the 56 00:03:13,240 --> 00:03:15,920 Speaker 1: law next to the Junior Women's club and the you know, 57 00:03:16,120 --> 00:03:18,840 Speaker 1: the bushes were out of bounds, and you know, and 58 00:03:19,120 --> 00:03:22,000 Speaker 1: is sneaking onto golf courses, you know, before dusk and 59 00:03:22,040 --> 00:03:24,359 Speaker 1: try and play a couple of holes and not paying 60 00:03:24,360 --> 00:03:26,919 Speaker 1: any money. And I don't know, It's just I'm like, WHOA, 61 00:03:27,160 --> 00:03:30,360 Speaker 1: I think it becomes so organized, so intense at such 62 00:03:30,400 --> 00:03:32,880 Speaker 1: an early age, and no one had really gotten at 63 00:03:32,919 --> 00:03:36,160 Speaker 1: it at that point. You know, we had like a 64 00:03:36,240 --> 00:03:39,320 Speaker 1: thousand reporters covering maybe two thousand reporters covering in the 65 00:03:39,400 --> 00:03:42,520 Speaker 1: NFL and Major League Baseball, in the NBA and the sports, 66 00:03:42,560 --> 00:03:45,600 Speaker 1: and there's also literally no one covering youth sports and 67 00:03:45,920 --> 00:03:47,600 Speaker 1: the trends they were out there. So, I mean, that's 68 00:03:47,640 --> 00:03:50,200 Speaker 1: the tools I had at my disposal. I was an 69 00:03:50,400 --> 00:03:53,640 Speaker 1: ESPN investigative reporter, and I knew how to asked questions. 70 00:03:53,680 --> 00:03:55,800 Speaker 1: I knew how to get to the bottom of something, 71 00:03:55,880 --> 00:04:00,480 Speaker 1: and so I started doing that, and you know, it's research. 72 00:04:00,600 --> 00:04:03,240 Speaker 1: Produced a book in two thousand and eight called Game 73 00:04:03,280 --> 00:04:06,600 Speaker 1: on the All American Race to Make Champions of Our Children. 74 00:04:06,680 --> 00:04:09,920 Speaker 1: It was a deliberately ironic title, because you really can't 75 00:04:09,960 --> 00:04:12,640 Speaker 1: make a champion out of a child and can support them, 76 00:04:12,720 --> 00:04:15,680 Speaker 1: but you can't manufacture one. But I was looking at 77 00:04:15,720 --> 00:04:18,200 Speaker 1: how we became this while all the parents were freaking 78 00:04:18,200 --> 00:04:21,680 Speaker 1: out and we were the world sports superpower. Why are 79 00:04:21,720 --> 00:04:24,880 Speaker 1: only one of every five kids or so physically active 80 00:04:24,960 --> 00:04:27,520 Speaker 1: enough in the teenage years. So, I mean, obviously there 81 00:04:27,600 --> 00:04:31,599 Speaker 1: was something wrong with our support eco system, and I 82 00:04:31,680 --> 00:04:33,279 Speaker 1: was just determined to get to the bottom of it. 83 00:04:33,360 --> 00:04:35,520 Speaker 1: The book was the result of it, and then flowing 84 00:04:35,560 --> 00:04:38,159 Speaker 1: out of the book, I did the lecture tour, spoke 85 00:04:38,200 --> 00:04:40,880 Speaker 1: at the Aspin Ideas Festival, which is a big event. 86 00:04:40,920 --> 00:04:43,880 Speaker 1: To the asked institute, had no idea what the institute was, 87 00:04:44,040 --> 00:04:46,040 Speaker 1: and then went well, and I said, you want to 88 00:04:46,040 --> 00:04:48,200 Speaker 1: start a sports program? And I said, well, I have 89 00:04:48,240 --> 00:04:51,520 Speaker 1: an ESPN job full time, but I'm pretty happy they're 90 00:04:51,520 --> 00:04:54,320 Speaker 1: I'm on TV and all that good stuff. But the 91 00:04:54,360 --> 00:04:58,159 Speaker 1: opportunity to address the problems that I laid out the 92 00:04:58,160 --> 00:05:02,200 Speaker 1: book was too powerful, and ultimately my interest shifted from 93 00:05:02,200 --> 00:05:05,040 Speaker 1: breaking down the problems as they did at ESPN to 94 00:05:05,920 --> 00:05:09,719 Speaker 1: bringing people together and trying to provide the thought leadership 95 00:05:09,760 --> 00:05:12,760 Speaker 1: to solve them. I love them. Thinking back, I guess 96 00:05:12,800 --> 00:05:14,760 Speaker 1: I didn't know you were from Connecticut. I grew up 97 00:05:14,760 --> 00:05:19,080 Speaker 1: in Waterbury. But it's funny because it's kind of similar 98 00:05:19,120 --> 00:05:21,840 Speaker 1: to my path and that, you know, when people ask 99 00:05:21,920 --> 00:05:23,920 Speaker 1: me what made me start the Reforming Sports Project, and 100 00:05:24,040 --> 00:05:25,560 Speaker 1: my thing is, you know, the best way for me 101 00:05:25,600 --> 00:05:27,960 Speaker 1: to describe it, I just got pissed off. I just 102 00:05:28,000 --> 00:05:30,160 Speaker 1: got pissed off. It kind of like what you were describing, 103 00:05:30,520 --> 00:05:33,440 Speaker 1: you know, over zealousness, and just what really got me 104 00:05:33,680 --> 00:05:36,640 Speaker 1: struck Tom was where I saw in particularly this sport 105 00:05:36,640 --> 00:05:38,800 Speaker 1: of baseball, which was what I played in college and 106 00:05:39,160 --> 00:05:42,240 Speaker 1: a little bit afterwards, and I felt like, to put 107 00:05:42,279 --> 00:05:45,960 Speaker 1: a term on it, I felt like baseball turned into 108 00:05:46,000 --> 00:05:48,000 Speaker 1: a country club sport. It was like, you know, kids 109 00:05:48,000 --> 00:05:51,120 Speaker 1: are walking around hundreds of dollars of equipment, and I'm like, God, 110 00:05:51,160 --> 00:05:53,360 Speaker 1: when did Bate like, because I grew up in Waterbury, Connecticut, 111 00:05:53,360 --> 00:05:56,120 Speaker 1: which is very blue collar, and I'm like, you shared back, 112 00:05:56,240 --> 00:05:58,200 Speaker 1: she shared how much I know we're not going back 113 00:05:58,240 --> 00:06:00,360 Speaker 1: in time at a different time, but it really struck me, 114 00:06:00,440 --> 00:06:02,600 Speaker 1: like kids are being priced out of this and that 115 00:06:02,839 --> 00:06:04,760 Speaker 1: that was really one of the things that got me. 116 00:06:05,279 --> 00:06:07,919 Speaker 1: And you talk about that a lot and you do 117 00:06:07,960 --> 00:06:10,920 Speaker 1: a lot of research on that. So how the heck 118 00:06:11,120 --> 00:06:15,640 Speaker 1: does that ever become the situation where there is not 119 00:06:16,000 --> 00:06:18,440 Speaker 1: folks being priced out? Because I'm not sure if you're 120 00:06:18,440 --> 00:06:21,040 Speaker 1: putting the genie back in the bottle where it becomes 121 00:06:21,080 --> 00:06:25,720 Speaker 1: this massive recreation sandlot situation, I could be wrong. No, 122 00:06:26,839 --> 00:06:28,360 Speaker 1: you can't put the genie back in the bottle. And 123 00:06:28,360 --> 00:06:30,159 Speaker 1: I wouldn't want to put the genie back in the bottle. 124 00:06:30,200 --> 00:06:32,920 Speaker 1: I mean, when we think about the way sports was, 125 00:06:33,080 --> 00:06:36,120 Speaker 1: my sports was ever perfect? Right? We still have crazy 126 00:06:36,160 --> 00:06:39,120 Speaker 1: parents back then, I'm sure. And you know, guess what 127 00:06:39,400 --> 00:06:42,640 Speaker 1: girls nineteen seventies when I was a kid, they didn't 128 00:06:42,680 --> 00:06:45,240 Speaker 1: have that much access to sport, and because of disabilities, 129 00:06:45,279 --> 00:06:48,440 Speaker 1: didn't have much access to sport. Even the blow average 130 00:06:48,560 --> 00:06:52,039 Speaker 1: kid didn't have a sustained experience. I'm actually one of 131 00:06:52,040 --> 00:06:54,680 Speaker 1: those kids from the decent athlete. I went to a 132 00:06:54,720 --> 00:06:56,680 Speaker 1: really large high school and I got cut from most 133 00:06:56,720 --> 00:06:58,960 Speaker 1: of my teams. I remember how that hurts, and that 134 00:06:59,080 --> 00:07:02,359 Speaker 1: actually says the core of my motivation is just the 135 00:07:02,440 --> 00:07:06,839 Speaker 1: idea that a child wants to play sports. We have 136 00:07:07,000 --> 00:07:10,840 Speaker 1: an obligation to provide that to them. It's in their 137 00:07:10,880 --> 00:07:14,960 Speaker 1: best interest and that's our best interest to expose them 138 00:07:14,960 --> 00:07:19,160 Speaker 1: the competition opportunities, developmental opportunities from the earliest Asian all 139 00:07:19,200 --> 00:07:21,680 Speaker 1: the way through the teenage years, and all the research 140 00:07:21,760 --> 00:07:25,120 Speaker 1: suggests it's just so powerful, and there's so many different wasions. 141 00:07:25,120 --> 00:07:27,760 Speaker 1: There's the health and community cohesion and all that. So 142 00:07:28,040 --> 00:07:30,480 Speaker 1: you know, no, it's not about putting the gene back 143 00:07:30,520 --> 00:07:34,160 Speaker 1: in the bottle. It's about looking it's about assessing what 144 00:07:34,280 --> 00:07:38,240 Speaker 1: kids want and need from a sport experience. Starting there, 145 00:07:38,480 --> 00:07:40,640 Speaker 1: what sports do you want to play in, what form, 146 00:07:40,760 --> 00:07:43,080 Speaker 1: what type of benefits you're looking to get out of it, 147 00:07:43,160 --> 00:07:47,520 Speaker 1: and then building models that meet the needs of those kids. 148 00:07:47,560 --> 00:07:49,920 Speaker 1: And if you do that, and you're going to find 149 00:07:50,400 --> 00:07:55,640 Speaker 1: there is much greater demand for experiences that aren't hyper 150 00:07:55,680 --> 00:07:57,920 Speaker 1: intense and involve a lot of travel and cost a 151 00:07:57,920 --> 00:08:00,480 Speaker 1: lot of money. Well kids mostly one. We know this 152 00:08:00,680 --> 00:08:05,200 Speaker 1: from our research surveying kids cross communities, urban, rural, suburban. 153 00:08:05,280 --> 00:08:08,160 Speaker 1: Instead of they pretty much say the same thing, looking 154 00:08:08,160 --> 00:08:11,239 Speaker 1: to have fun, looking for a social experience with their friends, 155 00:08:11,480 --> 00:08:14,800 Speaker 1: They're looking to being tested. You know, they like competition, 156 00:08:14,880 --> 00:08:17,960 Speaker 1: but they're not stuck on winning compete at tech, but 157 00:08:18,040 --> 00:08:20,640 Speaker 1: it just doesn't mean the same thing to them as 158 00:08:20,680 --> 00:08:24,160 Speaker 1: it does as apparently is stuck on whether they won 159 00:08:24,240 --> 00:08:26,320 Speaker 1: a game on Friday or not. So like, if you 160 00:08:26,400 --> 00:08:29,119 Speaker 1: build those kind of experiences, inevitably you're going to build 161 00:08:29,160 --> 00:08:35,280 Speaker 1: more local recrea opportunities, ideally and hopefully led by coaches 162 00:08:35,360 --> 00:08:37,040 Speaker 1: who know what they're doing. You know how to work 163 00:08:37,040 --> 00:08:39,880 Speaker 1: with kids, know how to teach some sports skills, and 164 00:08:39,960 --> 00:08:43,240 Speaker 1: so there's an economic equation that needs to be figured 165 00:08:43,280 --> 00:08:46,520 Speaker 1: out there, because you know, you're charging forty dollars a kid, 166 00:08:46,559 --> 00:08:48,520 Speaker 1: how are you going to create the level of quality. 167 00:08:48,600 --> 00:08:51,720 Speaker 1: So there's definitely some challenges there. But let's not kid ourselves. 168 00:08:51,760 --> 00:08:54,280 Speaker 1: Not every kid is looking to be on a superintense 169 00:08:54,520 --> 00:08:57,320 Speaker 1: travel team. No, And I totally agree. I have six kids, 170 00:08:57,440 --> 00:08:59,360 Speaker 1: so I get it. One of the things that always 171 00:08:59,400 --> 00:09:02,000 Speaker 1: gets me. And as you know or may not know, 172 00:09:02,040 --> 00:09:04,679 Speaker 1: I mean, I've done hundreds of these interviews, hundreds with 173 00:09:04,720 --> 00:09:07,320 Speaker 1: so many different college coaches and all different folks, and 174 00:09:07,640 --> 00:09:10,520 Speaker 1: I have come to and I don't think I'm It's 175 00:09:10,559 --> 00:09:13,240 Speaker 1: not like I discovered electricity here, but it sounds like 176 00:09:13,360 --> 00:09:15,520 Speaker 1: to me, every time I talk to somebody, it always 177 00:09:15,559 --> 00:09:19,640 Speaker 1: goes back to to me, the entire ecosystem of youth sport, 178 00:09:19,679 --> 00:09:24,679 Speaker 1: in my opinion, is completely built around exposure to get seen, 179 00:09:24,920 --> 00:09:27,640 Speaker 1: to get recruited, to get this, to get ranked. And 180 00:09:27,679 --> 00:09:30,040 Speaker 1: I mean, you know it, Tom, He's got rankings for 181 00:09:30,120 --> 00:09:31,920 Speaker 1: crying out lout with six year olds, you know, like 182 00:09:32,000 --> 00:09:35,160 Speaker 1: the best six year old team seven years. And there's companies. 183 00:09:35,480 --> 00:09:37,280 Speaker 1: And I'm gonna pick on baseball a little bit because 184 00:09:37,320 --> 00:09:38,720 Speaker 1: I have a little insight there and it kind of 185 00:09:38,720 --> 00:09:41,560 Speaker 1: pisses me off, you know. And again, I'm not saying 186 00:09:41,600 --> 00:09:43,319 Speaker 1: it's bad. I'm not saying it's good, but I'm saying 187 00:09:43,520 --> 00:09:46,360 Speaker 1: in college, according to the NCAA, you can't sign a 188 00:09:46,480 --> 00:09:48,880 Speaker 1: national letter of intent until I believe it's like August 189 00:09:48,960 --> 00:09:51,160 Speaker 1: or September or whatever it is. I think it's November 190 00:09:51,160 --> 00:09:54,840 Speaker 1: of your junior but college coaches can't reach out to 191 00:09:54,920 --> 00:09:57,240 Speaker 1: you prior to your junior year. I think it's I 192 00:09:57,240 --> 00:09:59,720 Speaker 1: don't know what month it is in baseball, but you 193 00:10:00,080 --> 00:10:05,320 Speaker 1: have on Twitter kids verbally committing to colleges, which means 194 00:10:05,320 --> 00:10:07,920 Speaker 1: they are getting offers. They're getting offers, and they're not 195 00:10:07,960 --> 00:10:11,000 Speaker 1: coming out of the woodwork. What's happening is college coaches 196 00:10:11,040 --> 00:10:13,280 Speaker 1: are talking to travel coaches. They're acting as a go 197 00:10:13,440 --> 00:10:17,000 Speaker 1: between and setting up calls so that the kid calls 198 00:10:17,040 --> 00:10:19,480 Speaker 1: the coach because I guess, I guess according to the NCAA, 199 00:10:19,520 --> 00:10:22,000 Speaker 1: as long as the kid calls the college coach, it's 200 00:10:22,040 --> 00:10:24,320 Speaker 1: not illegal. But if the college coach calls the kid, 201 00:10:24,320 --> 00:10:28,360 Speaker 1: it is. So they coordinate these things and then companies 202 00:10:28,400 --> 00:10:33,040 Speaker 1: are announcing thirteen and fourteen year olds commitments. Meanwhile, Tom, 203 00:10:33,320 --> 00:10:37,280 Speaker 1: those commitments are not binding so my son or daughter 204 00:10:37,320 --> 00:10:40,400 Speaker 1: says they're going to Florida State. Okay, great, Well, Florida 205 00:10:40,440 --> 00:10:43,200 Speaker 1: State just got a commitment, which means for that kid, 206 00:10:43,400 --> 00:10:47,840 Speaker 1: their entire recruitment process stops baseball. There's like this gentleman's 207 00:10:47,840 --> 00:10:50,920 Speaker 1: agreement where coaches lay off you once the kid verbally commits. 208 00:10:51,520 --> 00:10:56,000 Speaker 1: But if that kid doesn't develop, there's no guarantee that 209 00:10:56,000 --> 00:10:58,280 Speaker 1: that scholarship is going to be available. I mean, it 210 00:10:58,320 --> 00:11:00,959 Speaker 1: happens all the time. There's nothing thing binding into a 211 00:11:01,080 --> 00:11:04,160 Speaker 1: national letter of intennis inside. So my point is, yeah, 212 00:11:04,200 --> 00:11:06,280 Speaker 1: we have all these rec leagues, but how do we 213 00:11:06,400 --> 00:11:11,440 Speaker 1: come back the interference or the way in which folks 214 00:11:11,760 --> 00:11:15,439 Speaker 1: at all levels are selling the idea of this scholarship 215 00:11:15,480 --> 00:11:18,440 Speaker 1: And quite frankly, it's getting younger and younger and younger, 216 00:11:18,520 --> 00:11:23,679 Speaker 1: and companies are marketing to that. Yeah. So like, look, 217 00:11:23,800 --> 00:11:28,320 Speaker 1: human behavior is still shaped by carrots and sticks, you know, 218 00:11:29,200 --> 00:11:34,640 Speaker 1: rewards and punishments, right, incentives and punishments, and the scholarship 219 00:11:35,440 --> 00:11:39,800 Speaker 1: scholarships have become this incentive that has reorganized the whole system. 220 00:11:40,080 --> 00:11:41,800 Speaker 1: You know, they were probably I don't know what was 221 00:11:41,840 --> 00:11:44,640 Speaker 1: it might be exactly right now. It was like something 222 00:11:44,640 --> 00:11:47,640 Speaker 1: like twenty two hundred and fifty million dollars in scholarship 223 00:11:47,679 --> 00:11:51,160 Speaker 1: aid or distributed by Division one Division two schools in 224 00:11:51,200 --> 00:11:54,719 Speaker 1: the early nineteen nineties. As of a couple of years ago, 225 00:11:54,760 --> 00:11:58,319 Speaker 1: it was more like three point five billion dollars. Okay, 226 00:11:58,559 --> 00:12:01,760 Speaker 1: so there's a lot of what I called chum has 227 00:12:01,800 --> 00:12:04,400 Speaker 1: been thrown into the water, and it's made the fishes 228 00:12:04,440 --> 00:12:06,720 Speaker 1: a little crazy, right. But the thing is, it's not 229 00:12:06,840 --> 00:12:09,760 Speaker 1: actually a meal because that number has gone up so 230 00:12:09,920 --> 00:12:14,600 Speaker 1: dramatically because the cost of college has gone up dramatically, right, 231 00:12:15,080 --> 00:12:19,800 Speaker 1: And some of these scholarships in certain sports soccer, hockey, tennis, 232 00:12:19,920 --> 00:12:22,720 Speaker 1: or otherwise, a fair chunk of them go to international kids, 233 00:12:22,920 --> 00:12:26,200 Speaker 1: and there are very few actually full scholarship sports, and 234 00:12:26,240 --> 00:12:28,840 Speaker 1: a lot of parents don't realize that baseball and soccer 235 00:12:28,880 --> 00:12:32,120 Speaker 1: and otherwise until the kids in high school that oh wait, 236 00:12:32,160 --> 00:12:34,240 Speaker 1: hold on, there's not actually much of a payoff here. 237 00:12:35,480 --> 00:12:37,920 Speaker 1: You know. The real payoff is like preferential admission to 238 00:12:38,040 --> 00:12:40,439 Speaker 1: selective colleges. Sure, that's a great point, you're right. So 239 00:12:40,800 --> 00:12:43,600 Speaker 1: it's a bit of a I don't know. I think 240 00:12:43,600 --> 00:12:46,400 Speaker 1: it's a bit of a house of cards waiting to happen. 241 00:12:46,920 --> 00:12:49,080 Speaker 1: It's like the gold rush. You know, it's like this, 242 00:12:49,320 --> 00:12:53,000 Speaker 1: everybody's buying the pans hoping they're going to get golden. 243 00:12:53,240 --> 00:12:56,400 Speaker 1: Very very few people do, I mean really very few 244 00:12:56,400 --> 00:12:59,760 Speaker 1: people get full ride scholarships, much less one that's going 245 00:12:59,800 --> 00:13:02,079 Speaker 1: to past for four years, and so there's just not 246 00:13:02,200 --> 00:13:04,800 Speaker 1: much of a a payoff there. The parents have not been 247 00:13:05,320 --> 00:13:09,640 Speaker 1: educated on this. They don't realize until again the kids 248 00:13:09,720 --> 00:13:12,920 Speaker 1: like freshman or sophomore usually software depends of junior in 249 00:13:12,960 --> 00:13:15,560 Speaker 1: high schools, there's not really much of a payoff, and 250 00:13:15,600 --> 00:13:17,240 Speaker 1: then they begin to get real about it. But like 251 00:13:17,320 --> 00:13:21,440 Speaker 1: so until in unless you know, colleges get rid of 252 00:13:21,480 --> 00:13:24,040 Speaker 1: the scholarships altogether, which I don't think it be a 253 00:13:24,200 --> 00:13:26,240 Speaker 1: terrible thing. I don't see anything wrong with it. I 254 00:13:26,360 --> 00:13:28,760 Speaker 1: personally would be fiently, which is just a club based 255 00:13:28,760 --> 00:13:32,800 Speaker 1: model and sponsored sports but didn't hand out money, which 256 00:13:32,960 --> 00:13:37,600 Speaker 1: completely is rearranged U sport landscape. But until that day happened, 257 00:13:37,679 --> 00:13:39,920 Speaker 1: I think our best bet is to educate parents, help 258 00:13:40,000 --> 00:13:43,800 Speaker 1: them really get real about the potential payoff down the road. 259 00:13:44,000 --> 00:13:48,040 Speaker 1: And how you know, unlikely their little superstar kid is 260 00:13:48,040 --> 00:13:50,600 Speaker 1: going to receive any of it. Now, how do you 261 00:13:50,640 --> 00:13:54,280 Speaker 1: get the parents, Well, it's through podcasts, like yours. I mean, unfortunately, 262 00:13:54,280 --> 00:13:55,720 Speaker 1: a lot of these clubs are not going to be 263 00:13:55,760 --> 00:13:58,520 Speaker 1: realistic with kids because it's in their best interest to 264 00:13:58,559 --> 00:14:00,880 Speaker 1: have these families, you know, pay them twelve months a 265 00:14:00,960 --> 00:14:03,000 Speaker 1: year under the idea that you know, if you're going 266 00:14:03,040 --> 00:14:06,120 Speaker 1: to get looks from college scouts as you know, thirteen, fourteen, fifteen, 267 00:14:06,160 --> 00:14:08,280 Speaker 1: then you got to start, you know, stroking the big 268 00:14:08,320 --> 00:14:10,240 Speaker 1: checks now when your kids you know, seven, eight and 269 00:14:10,320 --> 00:14:12,480 Speaker 1: nine years old to getting that five point So it's 270 00:14:12,480 --> 00:14:14,480 Speaker 1: a it's a difficult thing to disrupt. At the end 271 00:14:14,480 --> 00:14:16,800 Speaker 1: of the day. It's like again, it's kind of a 272 00:14:16,840 --> 00:14:20,640 Speaker 1: phony market, you know, and there's just a new cycle 273 00:14:20,680 --> 00:14:22,760 Speaker 1: of parents who come through all the time. So you 274 00:14:22,800 --> 00:14:27,480 Speaker 1: have to keep re educating, constantly educating these parents. So 275 00:14:27,640 --> 00:14:30,600 Speaker 1: maybe maybe Nikki answers to reach them when they're signing 276 00:14:30,640 --> 00:14:32,440 Speaker 1: their kids up for sport for the first time when 277 00:14:32,440 --> 00:14:35,680 Speaker 1: they're you know, four or five and six years old. Like, okay, parents, 278 00:14:35,960 --> 00:14:38,920 Speaker 1: here the ten questions you should ask yourself, your child, 279 00:14:38,960 --> 00:14:41,840 Speaker 1: and your support provider to make support a great experience. 280 00:14:42,000 --> 00:14:44,400 Speaker 1: And oh, by the way, you need to know that 281 00:14:44,480 --> 00:14:46,440 Speaker 1: the payoff that you're hoping for down the road is 282 00:14:46,520 --> 00:14:49,560 Speaker 1: elusively that's a great point, and I know, you know 283 00:14:49,640 --> 00:14:52,239 Speaker 1: a lot of the audience might not particularly know exactly, 284 00:14:52,400 --> 00:14:55,080 Speaker 1: you know, what the Aspet Institute does and correct me 285 00:14:55,120 --> 00:14:57,280 Speaker 1: if I'm wrong. A lot of the work at least 286 00:14:57,280 --> 00:14:59,600 Speaker 1: if I'm not mistaken, that you do with the sports 287 00:14:59,600 --> 00:15:02,080 Speaker 1: and side he is dealing with. I believe a lot 288 00:15:02,080 --> 00:15:06,120 Speaker 1: of national governing bodies like large you know, organizations that 289 00:15:06,160 --> 00:15:11,080 Speaker 1: are kind of heading up specific initiatives or whatever the 290 00:15:11,120 --> 00:15:14,240 Speaker 1: case is. But you know, like you just mentioned with 291 00:15:14,520 --> 00:15:18,320 Speaker 1: regard to putting in pamphlets hypothetically at you know, first 292 00:15:18,360 --> 00:15:20,640 Speaker 1: time parents bring their kids to sports. You know that's 293 00:15:20,640 --> 00:15:24,720 Speaker 1: the grassroots, right, So how does the Aspect Institute do 294 00:15:24,800 --> 00:15:28,600 Speaker 1: you guys work to try to educate, you know, at 295 00:15:28,600 --> 00:15:32,680 Speaker 1: the grassroots level to kind of help spawn that education process. 296 00:15:33,440 --> 00:15:35,400 Speaker 1: Most of our work has been what were called B 297 00:15:35,480 --> 00:15:39,600 Speaker 1: to B right, so as us convening the national organizations 298 00:15:39,600 --> 00:15:43,280 Speaker 1: from the Little Committee to different ngbs, national government buses, 299 00:15:43,360 --> 00:15:47,520 Speaker 1: sport to the professional league's ESPN, Nike under our emeric 300 00:15:47,520 --> 00:15:50,840 Speaker 1: competitors sometimes getting them around the table. Is it okay? 301 00:15:50,920 --> 00:15:53,600 Speaker 1: What is a shared agenda? What's a shared framework on 302 00:15:53,680 --> 00:15:56,600 Speaker 1: how we're going to get and keep more children in 303 00:15:56,680 --> 00:16:00,520 Speaker 1: developing more children through sports and it's a lot of work. 304 00:16:01,280 --> 00:16:04,520 Speaker 1: That's something Private Play celebrated or tenth anniversary this year. 305 00:16:04,840 --> 00:16:08,160 Speaker 1: Congratulations man, thank you, thank you. Yeah. I know it's 306 00:16:08,200 --> 00:16:11,800 Speaker 1: been big selling coming up in May and it's gonna 307 00:16:11,800 --> 00:16:14,920 Speaker 1: be great. And so our theory of change is that 308 00:16:15,040 --> 00:16:17,360 Speaker 1: you need to kind of get the top down right 309 00:16:17,400 --> 00:16:19,760 Speaker 1: before you get the bottom operate. We thought about going 310 00:16:19,800 --> 00:16:22,320 Speaker 1: straight to the parents and the grassroots and trying to 311 00:16:22,480 --> 00:16:25,600 Speaker 1: educate them. But if the policies in place, if the 312 00:16:25,720 --> 00:16:31,080 Speaker 1: entities that are organizing the environment, don't understand what good 313 00:16:31,120 --> 00:16:34,560 Speaker 1: looks like in youth sports and athletic development and don't 314 00:16:34,560 --> 00:16:39,720 Speaker 1: have supportive policies around multi sport play or coach training 315 00:16:40,040 --> 00:16:42,240 Speaker 1: or this type of thing, and it makes it much 316 00:16:42,280 --> 00:16:46,440 Speaker 1: more difficult for the parent to like speak up and 317 00:16:46,480 --> 00:16:48,360 Speaker 1: say this needs to happen, to that needs to happen. 318 00:16:48,400 --> 00:16:51,200 Speaker 1: There needs to be something of a receptive audience. So 319 00:16:51,480 --> 00:16:54,440 Speaker 1: you know, we've created I mean, there is a lot 320 00:16:54,520 --> 00:16:57,920 Speaker 1: of awareness and buying now from the powers that be 321 00:16:58,080 --> 00:17:00,040 Speaker 1: about what good looks like and they're all kind I 322 00:17:00,080 --> 00:17:02,920 Speaker 1: bought it into the Project Play framework and ideas, and 323 00:17:03,200 --> 00:17:06,000 Speaker 1: most of them said our table and developing actions that 324 00:17:06,040 --> 00:17:10,399 Speaker 1: are really useful, and we haven't done that much at 325 00:17:10,480 --> 00:17:12,720 Speaker 1: the at the grassroots spot about it. There's a working 326 00:17:12,760 --> 00:17:15,560 Speaker 1: with parents. We had a campaign three years ago. Kobe 327 00:17:15,560 --> 00:17:18,200 Speaker 1: Bryant was our ambassador. He helps us launch. It was 328 00:17:18,240 --> 00:17:21,320 Speaker 1: called Don't Retire a Kid. It's about I don't know 329 00:17:21,320 --> 00:17:23,640 Speaker 1: if you remember it, but I remember. It's a great commercial. 330 00:17:23,680 --> 00:17:25,080 Speaker 1: I mean, it was a great it was it was. 331 00:17:25,119 --> 00:17:27,440 Speaker 1: It was really well done. Thanks, I mean a little 332 00:17:27,480 --> 00:17:29,760 Speaker 1: bunch rewards and all that good stuff. That was basically 333 00:17:29,800 --> 00:17:32,560 Speaker 1: our message to parents, like, Okay, look, chill out. It 334 00:17:32,560 --> 00:17:34,760 Speaker 1: needs to be about the kid first. You shouldn't have 335 00:17:34,840 --> 00:17:38,840 Speaker 1: kids retiring at age eleven, like our data shows is happening. 336 00:17:39,200 --> 00:17:42,320 Speaker 1: And we've created some parent checklist again, these ten questions 337 00:17:42,320 --> 00:17:45,600 Speaker 1: that parents can ask themselves. A child there a sport provider. 338 00:17:45,760 --> 00:17:48,960 Speaker 1: We've also gone into communities, about a dozen communities now, 339 00:17:49,080 --> 00:17:52,560 Speaker 1: you know, from Oakland to Seattle to Detroit to Buffalo, 340 00:17:53,080 --> 00:17:55,080 Speaker 1: and we get on the ground, We get into schools 341 00:17:55,119 --> 00:17:57,080 Speaker 1: and we ask kids what they want to play, why 342 00:17:57,080 --> 00:18:01,960 Speaker 1: they're not playing, a transportation, homework, coaches, don't feel welcome, whatever, 343 00:18:02,200 --> 00:18:05,200 Speaker 1: And then we produce these reports, these state of Player Reports, 344 00:18:05,760 --> 00:18:10,000 Speaker 1: um that end up mobilizing local stakeholders in these different cities, 345 00:18:10,240 --> 00:18:12,200 Speaker 1: and there's been a lot of great stuff come out 346 00:18:12,200 --> 00:18:15,239 Speaker 1: of that, Like tens of millions of grantmaking has been 347 00:18:15,280 --> 00:18:18,960 Speaker 1: shaken places like you know, Detroit and Buffalo, and policy 348 00:18:19,040 --> 00:18:22,600 Speaker 1: changes in Seattle and the state of Washington and you 349 00:18:22,680 --> 00:18:25,800 Speaker 1: know localand's going to be investing. So we've actually done 350 00:18:25,960 --> 00:18:29,120 Speaker 1: a lot in those dositors sell communities and we try 351 00:18:29,119 --> 00:18:31,960 Speaker 1: to create some tools and they're all available on our website. 352 00:18:32,640 --> 00:18:34,960 Speaker 1: How as you play that us all free to everybody. 353 00:18:35,000 --> 00:18:37,760 Speaker 1: Won't sell anything like that, but it's but it's hard. 354 00:18:37,760 --> 00:18:39,760 Speaker 1: I think the challenge again, Nick, is that's why it's 355 00:18:39,800 --> 00:18:43,520 Speaker 1: so great what you're doing is they're just like tens 356 00:18:43,520 --> 00:18:45,720 Speaker 1: of millions of parents out there, and they're just it's 357 00:18:45,720 --> 00:18:48,800 Speaker 1: a constant turn. You know, are four million new kids 358 00:18:49,080 --> 00:18:53,760 Speaker 1: every year, you know, age into a potential sports experience, 359 00:18:53,800 --> 00:18:56,920 Speaker 1: and all those parents are most of them are starting 360 00:18:56,920 --> 00:18:59,560 Speaker 1: from scratch. UM. So it's it's it's a it's a 361 00:18:59,720 --> 00:19:01,920 Speaker 1: it's tough. Ones are really tough enough to crack it. 362 00:19:02,359 --> 00:19:03,840 Speaker 1: You know, you need a lot of steam power to 363 00:19:04,000 --> 00:19:06,560 Speaker 1: kind of stick with it. When we return, Tom and 364 00:19:06,600 --> 00:19:09,560 Speaker 1: I discuss how parents can apply public pressure to help 365 00:19:09,640 --> 00:19:18,400 Speaker 1: change their local youth sports leagues. Welcome back where Tom 366 00:19:18,400 --> 00:19:20,280 Speaker 1: and I left off. We were about to talk about 367 00:19:20,320 --> 00:19:22,840 Speaker 1: why parents need to advocate for what they want their 368 00:19:22,880 --> 00:19:26,639 Speaker 1: local youth sports landscape to look like. It's funny. There 369 00:19:26,680 --> 00:19:29,120 Speaker 1: was a video that went around yesterday, and I mean, 370 00:19:29,240 --> 00:19:31,359 Speaker 1: if you look on social media, you can find these 371 00:19:31,440 --> 00:19:33,600 Speaker 1: videos all the time. I don't wanna say these videos, 372 00:19:33,600 --> 00:19:38,000 Speaker 1: but you see folks who run training facilities or our coaches, 373 00:19:38,160 --> 00:19:40,840 Speaker 1: and the video I saw yesterday was it looked like 374 00:19:40,880 --> 00:19:43,960 Speaker 1: either mixed martial arts or some type of like hand 375 00:19:44,000 --> 00:19:47,040 Speaker 1: to hand combat, you know room where there was a 376 00:19:47,040 --> 00:19:49,760 Speaker 1: bunch of kids laying on the ground doing what's called 377 00:19:49,840 --> 00:19:51,520 Speaker 1: six inches. I don't know if you remember that when 378 00:19:51,520 --> 00:19:53,600 Speaker 1: you lay down you hold your legs up six inches 379 00:19:53,600 --> 00:19:56,479 Speaker 1: and you're trying to tighten your your core and you know, 380 00:19:56,480 --> 00:19:58,320 Speaker 1: it's horrible. I did it. We did it in football, 381 00:19:58,320 --> 00:19:59,600 Speaker 1: and it was like it was horrible. Hate it at 382 00:19:59,600 --> 00:20:02,720 Speaker 1: six because it hurts. It's like conditioning or whatever. And 383 00:20:02,800 --> 00:20:06,280 Speaker 1: this coach or whomever had a big freaking tire and 384 00:20:06,320 --> 00:20:08,200 Speaker 1: I mean, like the type of tire that you flip 385 00:20:08,240 --> 00:20:10,560 Speaker 1: if you want to work out, like a big, big 386 00:20:10,600 --> 00:20:13,040 Speaker 1: freaking tire. It was putting it over his head while 387 00:20:13,040 --> 00:20:15,199 Speaker 1: these kids were doing six inches and hitting them on 388 00:20:15,240 --> 00:20:18,000 Speaker 1: the stomach. I mean, the video was viral. It was 389 00:20:18,040 --> 00:20:21,320 Speaker 1: at like five million views, and I was watching them, going, well, 390 00:20:21,320 --> 00:20:23,640 Speaker 1: I mean, these kids had to be like twelve thirteen 391 00:20:23,720 --> 00:20:26,840 Speaker 1: years old. They're They're like, ohh and the coach is 392 00:20:26,840 --> 00:20:28,879 Speaker 1: going around hit him. You're soft or you're tough, And 393 00:20:28,920 --> 00:20:33,200 Speaker 1: I'm like, well, the first of all, what parents can allow. Secondly, like, 394 00:20:33,359 --> 00:20:35,919 Speaker 1: my wife's an elementary school teacher. She has, you know, 395 00:20:36,000 --> 00:20:38,199 Speaker 1: her bachelor's degree, she has her masters, and she has 396 00:20:38,200 --> 00:20:41,800 Speaker 1: a National Board certification. Like, no one stops a coach 397 00:20:41,920 --> 00:20:44,639 Speaker 1: from wanting to coach. You don't need to have a 398 00:20:44,640 --> 00:20:47,919 Speaker 1: certain certificate, right, Like you don't need to have I 399 00:20:47,960 --> 00:20:49,960 Speaker 1: guess in some cases you have background checks, but I 400 00:20:50,000 --> 00:20:52,639 Speaker 1: mean that's usually if you're going to like a recreation 401 00:20:52,760 --> 00:20:54,440 Speaker 1: or some sort of like organize. But if I want 402 00:20:54,480 --> 00:20:56,959 Speaker 1: to start my own facility, who's going to check on me? Right? 403 00:20:57,000 --> 00:20:59,000 Speaker 1: So I guess is there anything in place? Like how 404 00:20:59,000 --> 00:21:01,880 Speaker 1: do we have checks in all? Some of these knuckleheads 405 00:21:02,040 --> 00:21:04,240 Speaker 1: aren't hitting our kids with tires for crying out out 406 00:21:04,240 --> 00:21:06,320 Speaker 1: and they tell the parents this is how you get tough. No, 407 00:21:06,440 --> 00:21:09,960 Speaker 1: it's not. It's like borderline child abuse. Well, first of all, 408 00:21:10,000 --> 00:21:12,520 Speaker 1: we need to recognize and by we, I mean all 409 00:21:12,640 --> 00:21:18,560 Speaker 1: stakeholders in the space, national governing bodies of sport, municipalities 410 00:21:19,560 --> 00:21:24,320 Speaker 1: that own parting reck spaces, schools all need to recognize 411 00:21:24,359 --> 00:21:27,320 Speaker 1: that basically the rights of children need to be that 412 00:21:27,440 --> 00:21:30,040 Speaker 1: these are human beings too, and they have human they 413 00:21:30,080 --> 00:21:32,320 Speaker 1: have human rights, and one of those is not to 414 00:21:32,359 --> 00:21:36,200 Speaker 1: be abused. Right, your health and safety should be protected. Right, 415 00:21:36,560 --> 00:21:39,560 Speaker 1: um like, start with that foundation and they kind of 416 00:21:39,600 --> 00:21:43,560 Speaker 1: work work from there. And what I think is important 417 00:21:43,720 --> 00:21:46,320 Speaker 1: and is a real opportunity is to use what we 418 00:21:46,400 --> 00:21:50,399 Speaker 1: call the power of the permit to determine access to 419 00:21:50,480 --> 00:21:54,639 Speaker 1: public spaces. Right. So, most youth sports are played in 420 00:21:55,280 --> 00:21:59,440 Speaker 1: two types of spaces Parker Rex So the fields and 421 00:21:59,520 --> 00:22:05,480 Speaker 1: gyms owned by municipalities and schools which are also public 422 00:22:05,520 --> 00:22:08,320 Speaker 1: assets as well. So all these private clubs, all these 423 00:22:09,000 --> 00:22:12,479 Speaker 1: folks rolling through there, they need access to these public, 424 00:22:12,520 --> 00:22:17,359 Speaker 1: taxpayer funded spaces. So why can't we set the conditions 425 00:22:17,480 --> 00:22:21,040 Speaker 1: the public, the taxpayers, parents come together to set the 426 00:22:21,080 --> 00:22:25,600 Speaker 1: conditions under which organizations have access to these spaces, Right, 427 00:22:25,720 --> 00:22:29,480 Speaker 1: so great. Don't you show us your insurance and that's 428 00:22:29,560 --> 00:22:33,000 Speaker 1: you're willing, you're able to pay the small amounts of 429 00:22:33,240 --> 00:22:36,119 Speaker 1: you we're charging for the field. Show us that your 430 00:22:36,119 --> 00:22:39,800 Speaker 1: coaches are trained, Show them that they're trained to use 431 00:22:39,880 --> 00:22:44,720 Speaker 1: prevention and injury injury prevention and sports skills and just 432 00:22:44,880 --> 00:22:48,879 Speaker 1: youth development, basic coaching philosophy, how to communicate with kids. 433 00:22:49,040 --> 00:22:51,760 Speaker 1: There are plenty of organizations now they're offering these types 434 00:22:51,800 --> 00:22:54,760 Speaker 1: of trainings, and some of them are very credible. So 435 00:22:54,760 --> 00:22:57,000 Speaker 1: why can't we raise the bar a little bit? You know, 436 00:22:57,160 --> 00:22:59,600 Speaker 1: why does it have to be the wild West? We allow, 437 00:23:00,320 --> 00:23:03,200 Speaker 1: as the public the wild West to be what it is. 438 00:23:03,680 --> 00:23:06,800 Speaker 1: We should be talking to our parking rex directors. We 439 00:23:06,840 --> 00:23:09,399 Speaker 1: should be talking to our talent council. We should be 440 00:23:09,440 --> 00:23:13,920 Speaker 1: talking to our town recreation board and saying, listen, we 441 00:23:13,960 --> 00:23:17,720 Speaker 1: want our community to be one in which sports are 442 00:23:17,960 --> 00:23:21,520 Speaker 1: accessible to all kids and within the care of adults. 443 00:23:21,600 --> 00:23:24,919 Speaker 1: They you know, these adults know what they're doing and 444 00:23:24,920 --> 00:23:27,000 Speaker 1: they're playing by a set of rules, and these are 445 00:23:27,680 --> 00:23:30,520 Speaker 1: these are our community standards. You can set the bar 446 00:23:30,640 --> 00:23:33,080 Speaker 1: as higher as low as you want, but like set 447 00:23:33,200 --> 00:23:37,560 Speaker 1: some standards. So to me, I mean reform is actually 448 00:23:38,040 --> 00:23:42,520 Speaker 1: at our fingertips. We just haven't seized it. Link. Imagine, Nick, 449 00:23:43,320 --> 00:23:46,320 Speaker 1: where do you live out Wilmington, North Carolina. So what 450 00:23:46,440 --> 00:23:49,560 Speaker 1: if the parents, the youth sport parents, or the youth 451 00:23:49,560 --> 00:23:54,080 Speaker 1: sport organizations in Wilmington, North Carolina came together and say, 452 00:23:54,119 --> 00:23:55,720 Speaker 1: you know what, this is what we want out of 453 00:23:55,720 --> 00:23:58,239 Speaker 1: people who are coaching our kids in our community. And 454 00:23:58,280 --> 00:24:00,639 Speaker 1: then they talk to the parking rector director or the 455 00:24:01,119 --> 00:24:05,760 Speaker 1: city councils or lected officials. It's it's reasonable, little little 456 00:24:05,800 --> 00:24:08,679 Speaker 1: benefits of community. There'll be a lot of pressure, and 457 00:24:08,720 --> 00:24:12,000 Speaker 1: I think good positive pressure to change things so it 458 00:24:12,080 --> 00:24:14,720 Speaker 1: can be done. It just hasn't been done at any 459 00:24:14,760 --> 00:24:17,480 Speaker 1: points in so far. One last thing I want to 460 00:24:17,480 --> 00:24:22,720 Speaker 1: touch on is I've interviewed several great people that I've 461 00:24:22,720 --> 00:24:25,640 Speaker 1: come across, and some of one in particular, I'm sure 462 00:24:25,680 --> 00:24:27,879 Speaker 1: you know the name of Peter Franzillis, who's the CEO 463 00:24:27,960 --> 00:24:31,800 Speaker 1: of Team Snap. We had a great chat. And you 464 00:24:31,800 --> 00:24:34,919 Speaker 1: know Peter's background is tech what He's a private equity guy. Right, 465 00:24:34,960 --> 00:24:37,560 Speaker 1: So so I have a finance background and my former 466 00:24:37,680 --> 00:24:42,120 Speaker 1: you know, my former profession, and you're seeing consolidation, you're 467 00:24:42,160 --> 00:24:45,240 Speaker 1: seeing private equity money you're seeing big business come into 468 00:24:45,240 --> 00:24:48,480 Speaker 1: this space. I mean it's coming in and it's coming 469 00:24:48,520 --> 00:24:51,400 Speaker 1: in for one reason because, in my opinion, they're trying 470 00:24:51,440 --> 00:24:55,119 Speaker 1: to untap value, right, they're trying to untap value in 471 00:24:55,200 --> 00:24:58,439 Speaker 1: a space that's untapped. You know, it's been run by 472 00:24:58,480 --> 00:25:01,080 Speaker 1: a lot of mom and pops and you know, so 473 00:25:01,160 --> 00:25:03,440 Speaker 1: with that, in my opinion, you know there's going to 474 00:25:03,480 --> 00:25:05,960 Speaker 1: be consolidation. You're gonna have companies that are required, you're 475 00:25:05,960 --> 00:25:09,199 Speaker 1: gonna have mergers, all these different things. So how do 476 00:25:09,280 --> 00:25:12,719 Speaker 1: you think the I guess the look of youth sports 477 00:25:12,720 --> 00:25:15,400 Speaker 1: because you know, you look at certain companies where you know, 478 00:25:15,760 --> 00:25:17,960 Speaker 1: it's it's a sports industry, right, So you're going and 479 00:25:18,040 --> 00:25:21,360 Speaker 1: staying at a hotel that's owned by the organization that's 480 00:25:21,359 --> 00:25:23,760 Speaker 1: putting on the tournament at their mega complex that has 481 00:25:23,760 --> 00:25:26,120 Speaker 1: one hundred fields or whatever it is, you know, which 482 00:25:26,160 --> 00:25:28,440 Speaker 1: is great parents, it's a destination, it's a great time, 483 00:25:28,480 --> 00:25:31,080 Speaker 1: the kids get exposure, it's great for college coaches. It's 484 00:25:31,080 --> 00:25:33,680 Speaker 1: all these different things. But there's a lot of money 485 00:25:33,720 --> 00:25:36,560 Speaker 1: to be made and there's nothing wrong with that, but 486 00:25:36,760 --> 00:25:41,480 Speaker 1: it's also at the expense. We're talking that there's children involved, 487 00:25:41,640 --> 00:25:45,080 Speaker 1: So it's a very very slippery slope. So I guess 488 00:25:45,080 --> 00:25:46,879 Speaker 1: where I want to go with this. With big money, 489 00:25:46,960 --> 00:25:50,920 Speaker 1: private equity money, Wall Street coming into this space and 490 00:25:51,480 --> 00:25:54,080 Speaker 1: looking to take it into the future, how do you 491 00:25:54,160 --> 00:25:57,960 Speaker 1: think this space looks as we go forward, you know, five, ten, 492 00:25:58,080 --> 00:26:00,879 Speaker 1: fifteen years, what do you think it becomes. Well, I 493 00:26:00,920 --> 00:26:03,280 Speaker 1: think it's all to be determined. I mean you're asking 494 00:26:03,280 --> 00:26:07,560 Speaker 1: the right questions. As more money comes into this space, 495 00:26:08,480 --> 00:26:11,560 Speaker 1: and money chases money, right, that's what it does. And 496 00:26:11,640 --> 00:26:14,280 Speaker 1: they're not there just to do a social there to 497 00:26:14,320 --> 00:26:20,120 Speaker 1: make money. Will that create less access to sports because 498 00:26:20,160 --> 00:26:22,119 Speaker 1: they're only going to cater for the families they can 499 00:26:22,119 --> 00:26:25,119 Speaker 1: write the big checks. Or are they going to develop 500 00:26:25,280 --> 00:26:30,960 Speaker 1: models basically local sport recreation models that engage a broader 501 00:26:31,000 --> 00:26:34,440 Speaker 1: slop of the population that maybe writes a smaller check, 502 00:26:34,680 --> 00:26:35,879 Speaker 1: but at the end of the day, they had to 503 00:26:36,000 --> 00:26:39,600 Speaker 1: make more money. So can they do the most business 504 00:26:39,600 --> 00:26:43,320 Speaker 1: by catering to you know, the top ten percent of 505 00:26:43,400 --> 00:26:47,359 Speaker 1: the population, or will they make more by developing model 506 00:26:47,400 --> 00:26:51,080 Speaker 1: that reaches thirty to forty percent. We'll see. I think 507 00:26:51,080 --> 00:26:54,440 Speaker 1: they'll respond to models that suggest they can make money. 508 00:26:54,480 --> 00:26:57,440 Speaker 1: So if there are some real pioneering models out there, 509 00:26:57,640 --> 00:27:00,760 Speaker 1: that makes sense from a business perspective to them. It 510 00:27:00,880 --> 00:27:03,720 Speaker 1: could promote access and it could promote quality as well. 511 00:27:03,960 --> 00:27:06,280 Speaker 1: I mean, I think a key question is what do 512 00:27:06,440 --> 00:27:10,000 Speaker 1: parents want? Like, I mean, I know what I wanted 513 00:27:10,080 --> 00:27:13,080 Speaker 1: as a parent. I wanted my kids to have access 514 00:27:13,119 --> 00:27:16,840 Speaker 1: to playing multiple sports through the year, you know, into 515 00:27:17,000 --> 00:27:21,000 Speaker 1: at least the middle of high school. I wanted them 516 00:27:21,040 --> 00:27:23,560 Speaker 1: to play for good coaches, coaches who knew what they 517 00:27:23,560 --> 00:27:28,040 Speaker 1: were doing. I wanted seasons not to overlap. I did 518 00:27:28,080 --> 00:27:30,680 Speaker 1: not want to have holiday tournaments. I did not want 519 00:27:30,680 --> 00:27:35,280 Speaker 1: to play on Mother's Day. You know. I wanted a 520 00:27:35,320 --> 00:27:37,919 Speaker 1: model that was going to provide all the social and 521 00:27:37,960 --> 00:27:42,080 Speaker 1: developmental benefits that sports can provide and would align with 522 00:27:42,280 --> 00:27:45,199 Speaker 1: my family's schedule. And I prefer not to pay a 523 00:27:45,280 --> 00:27:48,000 Speaker 1: ridiculous amount of money. So can someone figure that out? 524 00:27:48,040 --> 00:27:50,919 Speaker 1: I think someone can. I think there is a model, 525 00:27:51,160 --> 00:27:53,800 Speaker 1: but you've got to start with what families want. Problem 526 00:27:53,840 --> 00:27:56,040 Speaker 1: with all these private equity companies coming in right now, 527 00:27:56,160 --> 00:27:59,160 Speaker 1: you're buying a bunch of single sport operators. They're aggregating 528 00:27:59,200 --> 00:28:02,560 Speaker 1: the single sport greaders, and they're trying to just ramp 529 00:28:02,600 --> 00:28:04,359 Speaker 1: that up and bring as much money out of it 530 00:28:04,400 --> 00:28:07,800 Speaker 1: as possible. But I think the real opportunity, real opportunities 531 00:28:07,800 --> 00:28:11,720 Speaker 1: to start with what the marketplace wants, and most parents 532 00:28:11,760 --> 00:28:14,399 Speaker 1: want something closer to what I described, and if they 533 00:28:14,400 --> 00:28:18,520 Speaker 1: were given that option, they go with it. Two things, 534 00:28:19,000 --> 00:28:21,840 Speaker 1: how does Project Play How does the appon Institute help 535 00:28:21,880 --> 00:28:24,720 Speaker 1: take us forward, help grow the space, help make things better? 536 00:28:24,760 --> 00:28:28,280 Speaker 1: And secondly, where could people go and find all the 537 00:28:28,320 --> 00:28:31,600 Speaker 1: wonderful work that you're doing and connect and get educated 538 00:28:31,640 --> 00:28:33,840 Speaker 1: and get some help. Yeah, well they can find everything 539 00:28:34,000 --> 00:28:37,960 Speaker 1: is project play dot us and they'll find all sorts 540 00:28:38,000 --> 00:28:41,719 Speaker 1: of things, and then they'll find a lot of preparent checklists, 541 00:28:41,760 --> 00:28:46,400 Speaker 1: they'll find coach training resources, they'll find you use support facts, 542 00:28:46,600 --> 00:28:50,400 Speaker 1: data and insights can help you write grant applications if 543 00:28:50,440 --> 00:28:54,440 Speaker 1: you're a nonprofit, that kind of thing, and you'll see 544 00:28:54,560 --> 00:28:56,640 Speaker 1: the project place on it on there as well. Again, 545 00:28:56,680 --> 00:28:59,440 Speaker 1: our tenth anniversary thing is May seventeenth and eighteenth and 546 00:28:59,560 --> 00:29:01,960 Speaker 1: color up Springs. It's going to be a big moment 547 00:29:02,040 --> 00:29:06,080 Speaker 1: for us, bring together a network of networks to share 548 00:29:06,160 --> 00:29:09,920 Speaker 1: knowledge and chart next steps and sting helping children and 549 00:29:10,000 --> 00:29:13,400 Speaker 1: communities through sports and so for us, you know, we 550 00:29:13,520 --> 00:29:16,000 Speaker 1: chart these next steps and you ask where we're going 551 00:29:16,040 --> 00:29:18,240 Speaker 1: with Projects Play. I mean, we have some ideas, but 552 00:29:18,360 --> 00:29:21,280 Speaker 1: we do this somewhat in concert with the folks who 553 00:29:21,320 --> 00:29:23,760 Speaker 1: around our table and will come to our events. So 554 00:29:23,800 --> 00:29:26,000 Speaker 1: where do they want how do they want Project Play 555 00:29:26,040 --> 00:29:28,520 Speaker 1: to peace moving forward? I think there are a couple 556 00:29:28,520 --> 00:29:33,200 Speaker 1: of good opportunities. I think there are you know, there 557 00:29:33,240 --> 00:29:37,000 Speaker 1: are a couple events on the horizon, you know, between 558 00:29:37,040 --> 00:29:40,080 Speaker 1: the World Cup and the Olympics in twenty twenty eight 559 00:29:40,160 --> 00:29:42,720 Speaker 1: and offer storytelling moments. So what kind of story can 560 00:29:42,720 --> 00:29:45,000 Speaker 1: we tell a boy those two events collectively? You know, 561 00:29:45,040 --> 00:29:47,400 Speaker 1: what can we do in terms of getting coaches trained? 562 00:29:47,920 --> 00:29:50,000 Speaker 1: That's going to be a real priority of ours is 563 00:29:50,200 --> 00:29:52,480 Speaker 1: It's been a priority already, but we're doubling down. I 564 00:29:52,600 --> 00:29:54,960 Speaker 1: just hired one of the best guys to really drive 565 00:29:55,000 --> 00:29:58,560 Speaker 1: on the coaching piece and really think about how we 566 00:29:58,640 --> 00:30:02,240 Speaker 1: can lift the percentage of coaches who are trained in 567 00:30:02,360 --> 00:30:05,160 Speaker 1: key competencies in use sports. And that's a matter of 568 00:30:05,280 --> 00:30:08,360 Speaker 1: working with some of the key organizations out there in Nike, 569 00:30:08,800 --> 00:30:13,360 Speaker 1: US Olympic and Paralympic Committee, Susan Crown Exchange, which does 570 00:30:13,400 --> 00:30:16,200 Speaker 1: a lot of work with new development, social emotional learning. 571 00:30:17,200 --> 00:30:19,800 Speaker 1: So pushing real hard on the coaching piece try to 572 00:30:19,800 --> 00:30:23,200 Speaker 1: lift the quality there. We're also going to start attacking 573 00:30:24,000 --> 00:30:28,080 Speaker 1: the school sports environment to high school environment right project 574 00:30:28,120 --> 00:30:32,200 Speaker 1: plate to date has been largely focused on community recreation 575 00:30:32,520 --> 00:30:36,760 Speaker 1: and non school environments of what's going on there. But 576 00:30:37,120 --> 00:30:39,120 Speaker 1: I really believe that you can't. I don't think you 577 00:30:39,120 --> 00:30:42,600 Speaker 1: can actually reform or improve the environment in a significant 578 00:30:42,640 --> 00:30:47,000 Speaker 1: way without addressing the school sports environment. Because a lot 579 00:30:47,000 --> 00:30:49,880 Speaker 1: of parents chart their course when their kid is six 580 00:30:49,920 --> 00:30:54,040 Speaker 1: and seven years old based upon is how do I 581 00:30:54,080 --> 00:30:56,200 Speaker 1: get my kids playing time in high school? How do 582 00:30:56,240 --> 00:30:58,440 Speaker 1: I get them on a team and make sure they're 583 00:30:58,440 --> 00:31:02,960 Speaker 1: not stuck on the bench for four years? So that's 584 00:31:03,000 --> 00:31:07,160 Speaker 1: what fuels the you know, the early forming travel teams 585 00:31:07,200 --> 00:31:09,640 Speaker 1: and some of the intensity that we see on the sidelines. 586 00:31:09,760 --> 00:31:12,760 Speaker 1: So you know, we completed as a two year research 587 00:31:12,800 --> 00:31:17,200 Speaker 1: project called Reimagining School Sports in America and issued a 588 00:31:17,320 --> 00:31:21,320 Speaker 1: challenge to school sports leaders to number one, improve the 589 00:31:21,400 --> 00:31:23,840 Speaker 1: experience for the forty percent of kids who do play 590 00:31:24,000 --> 00:31:27,680 Speaker 1: high school sports and then develop more opportunities for the 591 00:31:27,720 --> 00:31:31,120 Speaker 1: sixty percent who do not to play. So how can 592 00:31:31,160 --> 00:31:35,320 Speaker 1: we increase the supply of experiences in high school so 593 00:31:35,440 --> 00:31:38,800 Speaker 1: parents know when their kid is six and seven and 594 00:31:38,880 --> 00:31:40,640 Speaker 1: eight years old, and you know what, there is a 595 00:31:40,880 --> 00:31:43,320 Speaker 1: there is a quality experience. A kid will have a 596 00:31:43,400 --> 00:31:46,800 Speaker 1: chance to play sports when they're you know, sophomore and 597 00:31:46,920 --> 00:31:49,280 Speaker 1: junior and senior in high school. I don't need to 598 00:31:49,320 --> 00:31:52,320 Speaker 1: go completely crazy here at an early age. You know, 599 00:31:52,360 --> 00:31:54,280 Speaker 1: maybe they're not going to be on a scholarship path. 600 00:31:54,560 --> 00:31:58,280 Speaker 1: What's fine, but there's not you know that nice scholarships anyway. 601 00:31:58,400 --> 00:32:01,440 Speaker 1: So we think that updating the based model can relieve 602 00:32:01,520 --> 00:32:04,680 Speaker 1: some of the pressure the parents feel in the non 603 00:32:04,720 --> 00:32:07,800 Speaker 1: school environment at earlier ages. I love it. I love 604 00:32:07,840 --> 00:32:09,560 Speaker 1: the work. I think a one good idea it might 605 00:32:09,600 --> 00:32:12,400 Speaker 1: be you get someone from Reform Sports Project sitting around 606 00:32:12,440 --> 00:32:17,200 Speaker 1: that table with you. Guys. Yeah, you know anybody. I'm 607 00:32:17,240 --> 00:32:18,720 Speaker 1: just giving you a hard time, but it does. Listen. 608 00:32:18,760 --> 00:32:21,040 Speaker 1: I really can't thank enough for coming on. I admire 609 00:32:21,080 --> 00:32:24,400 Speaker 1: your work. I'm grateful for you, and truthfully, I think 610 00:32:24,400 --> 00:32:26,520 Speaker 1: we're all in this thing together and we're all doing 611 00:32:26,520 --> 00:32:28,560 Speaker 1: our best trying to shed some lights. So Tom, I 612 00:32:28,560 --> 00:32:31,480 Speaker 1: know you're a very busy, very busy person doing great work, 613 00:32:31,480 --> 00:32:33,520 Speaker 1: and I just can't thank enough for coming on. Tom Ferry, 614 00:32:33,520 --> 00:32:36,280 Speaker 1: thank you so much. Man. That's Tom Ferry, founder and 615 00:32:36,360 --> 00:32:40,440 Speaker 1: executive director of the Aspen Institute's Sports and Society Program. 616 00:32:40,440 --> 00:32:43,400 Speaker 1: Thanks for listening to the Reform Sports Project podcast. I'm 617 00:32:43,480 --> 00:32:45,800 Speaker 1: Nick Boncourt and our goal is to restore a healthy 618 00:32:45,800 --> 00:32:49,200 Speaker 1: balance and perspective in all areas of sports through education 619 00:32:49,360 --> 00:32:52,800 Speaker 1: and advocacy. For updates, please follow us on Facebook, Twitter, 620 00:32:52,960 --> 00:32:55,640 Speaker 1: and Instagram, or check out our website by searching for 621 00:32:55,680 --> 00:32:57,040 Speaker 1: the Reform Sports Project.