Speaker 1: Of the law and order franchises. SVU is considered especially watchable.
Speaker 2: We are the amateur detectives who kind of investigate the
Speaker 2: vicious felonies. These episodes are based on.
Speaker 3: These are our stories. Dune Done.
Speaker 1: Hello and welcome to That's Messed Up, a SVU podcast.
Speaker 2: I'm one of your hosts, Kara Klink. I'm the other one,
Speaker 2: Lisa Traeger. We talk SVU, we talk crimes, we have guests.
Speaker 2: It's really a jam packed podcast with a lot of
Speaker 2: work that maybe we didn't consider before we.
Speaker 3: Started the podcast. JK.
Speaker 2: We love it so much, so true so, but up
Speaker 2: top we like to chitchat catch up. We've been in
Speaker 2: different states, Cara, I mean luckily I got to see
Speaker 2: you for one little drinks moment yeah, last week. But
Speaker 2: really we've been separate for months. I know that it's
Speaker 2: like the pandemic again. But JK, we're out in the.
Speaker 3: Forbid. I everything's good. Yeah.
Speaker 1: I went on a two week amazing trip with my
Speaker 1: kids to Vermont and to the East Coast, saw some family,
Speaker 1: went to my summer camp.
Speaker 3: It was awesome. Everything was great. The kids were good
Speaker 3: on the.
Speaker 1: Plane, like except Rosie Pete on herself on purpose in
Speaker 1: the bathroom, and I forgot to bring her extra pants,
Speaker 1: so she was just butt out the entire like half
Speaker 1: of the flight. And then one of the flight attendants
Speaker 1: was like, what happened to your pants? And Rosie was like, hey, like,
Speaker 1: would not keep a blanket around yourself? I keep getting
Speaker 1: in trouble for having Rosie naked from the waist down
Speaker 1: at different places. Anyway, I wanted to just say one
Speaker 1: quick thing because I know you have a lot of
Speaker 1: scoop for me right now. I just caught up watching
Speaker 1: like four or five episodes of OC last night, and
Speaker 1: I love that show.
Speaker 3: I am really.
Speaker 1: Loving Organized Crime, not the OC starring Misha Barton, OC
Speaker 1: Organized Crime Christopher Maloney spin off. It is so different
Speaker 1: from SVU. It moves so quickly. They resolve plotline so quick.
Speaker 1: I love that. I watch all these shows that are
Speaker 1: like thrillery and you're like, what happened to that guy?
Speaker 3: Well? Are they ever gonna pay off this one?
Speaker 1: And I get that there's like an art to like
Speaker 1: leaving a lot of different storyline simmering and then getting
Speaker 1: back to them. No, this show uses all this crazy
Speaker 1: technology that's probably not even real. They're like found him
Speaker 1: found this girl like stables chasing down hit women. He
Speaker 1: just chased a hit woman through the streets through a
Speaker 1: fashion show. Like it's crazy. That's free advertisement. They have
Speaker 1: not paid us. And I'm just telling you, guys, get
Speaker 1: into OC.
Speaker 3: I'm liking it.
Speaker 2: Well, you know what, I've been seeing a lot of
Speaker 2: buzz with people that we know really liking the new
Speaker 2: selling the OC. It's like a spinning it's a spinoff
Speaker 2: of Selling Sunset called Selling OC. And the tweets I'm
Speaker 2: seeing that it's one of the best realities shows of
Speaker 2: all time, that it's unhitched and insane, that it's like
Speaker 2: the best television from people I respect, that love that
Speaker 2: love TV, and so I'm excited. I tried to watch
Speaker 2: last night, but I was way too drunk and I
Speaker 2: just needed Seinfeld.
Speaker 3: I found a new hairbo sour Kicks.
Speaker 2: They're little sneakers and no one was I was like, oh,
Speaker 2: these are fresh. I'm like, this is a new batch
Speaker 2: like feel the texture, and everyone was I was with
Speaker 2: was like, wow, this is the freshest texture ever. I go, No,
Speaker 2: I'm like a pro on gummy candies, like this is good,
Speaker 2: such good flavors. If you see the Harbo Sour Kicks.
Speaker 2: There's a sour grape flavor. Can you fucking believe that
Speaker 2: it's It's good? Yeah, it was really good. But so
Speaker 2: I'm excited to watch that. I am so pumped for
Speaker 2: Lindsay and Carl from Summerhouse that they got engaged. I'm
Speaker 2: so sad that I got into Summerhouse, but I'm in
Speaker 2: it and I'm so happy for them.
Speaker 3: So shout out to Lindsay.
Speaker 1: I don't watch, but wasn't it like forever? Her being like,
Speaker 1: why don't we date? And him being like no, no, no,
Speaker 1: And then they finally get together. No, there's a little
Speaker 1: more nuanced to that carey.
Speaker 3: So they are.
Speaker 2: They are best friends, and then there's one night where
Speaker 2: he fingers her but they don't even make out. It's
Speaker 2: just like a loose fingering, and so then it gets
Speaker 2: like talk to him, So he gets talked about in
Speaker 2: the house and he's like so scared that it's spread,
Speaker 2: and he's like, hey, I don't want you to be mad,
Speaker 2: but everyone knows about the fingering, and she goes, I
Speaker 2: don't care, and so then they end up going on
Speaker 2: a date, but they are scared because their friendship means
Speaker 2: a lot to them, and then the date, like it
Speaker 2: just doesn't work out because she's like, Okay, well let's
Speaker 2: do this, and he's like this is just too much
Speaker 2: for me. But the other layers are she is in
Speaker 2: her thirties, once children, like she's ready to settle down
Speaker 2: for him. Throughout these seasons, Sadly, his brother died of
Speaker 2: an overdose and it was really sad. I mean, she's
Speaker 2: the first person he went and told, like they are.
Speaker 2: They have truly been very great friends, and he had
Speaker 2: to then come to terms with his own sobriety and
Speaker 2: so he's been like work focusing on his sobriety. A
Speaker 2: couple relapsed, but he's really good. He's been sober now
Speaker 2: for a while. And so then by the end of
Speaker 2: the last season they were she was just like listen,
Speaker 2: like I have feelings for you, like I don't know
Speaker 2: what you want, and he goes, let's do this. And
Speaker 2: they've been together ever since, and she stopped drinking to
Speaker 2: like help him as well, and so they're both kind
Speaker 2: of sober right now and they got engaged and it's awesome.
Speaker 2: And the thing with her, a lot of her storyline
Speaker 2: is like the other girls and people judge her because
Speaker 2: she is a drunk slut and they're all mad at
Speaker 2: her about it. Like one person shamed her for partying
Speaker 2: because she had had a miscarriage, so like because she
Speaker 2: had a miscarriage, they were like, what is this a brothel?
Speaker 2: And she goes, what's this double standard? Like you're not
Speaker 2: You're not mad at Luke, Like he's a slut just
Speaker 2: like I am. And the girl goes, well, he didn't
Speaker 2: have a mis carriage, Like this is the way people
Speaker 2: speak to Lindsay.
Speaker 3: It's so fucked up.
Speaker 2: And she just is who she is and everyone always
Speaker 2: has an issue. Like one of her ex boyfriends, like
Speaker 2: she gets drunk and likes to take her titties out
Speaker 2: and he would be pissed. And it's like Carl just
Speaker 2: loves her for who she is, and like they just
Speaker 2: are really cute and I just.
Speaker 1: Can't believe that like two people that like we're on
Speaker 1: this show about like debaucherous like hooking up, are now
Speaker 1: like we found monogamy and sobriety together on this show.
Speaker 3: Like yeah, and they.
Speaker 2: Lived in the same building in Manhattan and like also
Speaker 2: like while Lindsay was you know after this Smithscharage like
Speaker 2: trying to have a great summer. They also like hate
Speaker 2: like the there's one really toxic relationship on that show,
Speaker 2: Kyle and Amanda, and it's like horrific.
Speaker 3: It's like, Kyle went to my college. Oh my god,
Speaker 3: he's a know this is our friend? Do our friends
Speaker 3: know this?
Speaker 1: I think I've told her Kyle went is a two
Speaker 1: or three years behind me. I think he was a
Speaker 1: freshman when I was a senior.
Speaker 2: So they're reallylationships is horrible, Like before the wedding, they're crying,
Speaker 2: they don't fuck, they fight all the time. She breaks
Speaker 2: his toilet, like I kinda watch fucking summer. They have
Speaker 2: like a business together. It's like love your voice. Yeah,
Speaker 2: And so eventually he's like telling one of her friends,
Speaker 2: he goes, we have nothing in common except the business.
Speaker 2: Like they are the most awful relationship. She's always crying.
Speaker 2: They're like they never look like they're having fun, and
Speaker 2: yet the whole time they're like, lindsay, are you even happy?
Speaker 3: Your life is a mess?
Speaker 2: Your life's a mess, Like you're such a this than that,
Speaker 2: And she's just like, I own my own PR firm.
Speaker 2: I'm hot as head, Like what's going on here? And
Speaker 2: so I just love that, like they came up out
Speaker 2: on top of like having this like beautiful relationship and
Speaker 2: I wish them all the best. And so I I mean,
Speaker 2: I only started watching the show maybe two and a
Speaker 2: half weeks ago.
Speaker 3: I am not I would die for Lindsay Hubbard. I
Speaker 3: would die for her.
Speaker 4: I cannot believe you started two weeks ago.
Speaker 1: I thought you were like I knew you were a
Speaker 1: like a og summers.
Speaker 3: Probably a three week So yeah, I was wing extremely
Speaker 3: important to me for the last three weeks of my life.
Speaker 2: Well, because you know, my best friend uh lives here
Speaker 2: and we don't see each other that often, and we
Speaker 2: both are TV people. So there were a couple of
Speaker 2: days where we did not leave the couch and we
Speaker 2: watched Summer House for.
Speaker 3: Like ten hours a day. Oh wow, minimum to.
Speaker 1: Be I love the day.
Speaker 3: I love a day where you can just watch TV
Speaker 3: all day. It's so fun. My husband doesn't like to binge,
Speaker 3: as you know.
Speaker 2: But yeah, so I'm just like really happy for them. Also,
Speaker 2: we had to talk about Body's Body's Body is this
Speaker 2: New York Times thing.
Speaker 3: I can't believe you haven't.
Speaker 1: It sounds like the new cat person remember that, like
Speaker 1: article called cat Person that everybody was talking about, and
Speaker 1: then there was like the other like there's all these
Speaker 1: like articles like and everyone's like, have you have you
Speaker 1: read cat Person?
Speaker 3: Like this is different.
Speaker 2: So basically it's a horror movie like Clue Who Done It?
Speaker 2: But with like gen z vibes, Rachel sent it's in it. Yeah, yes,
Speaker 2: I've seen a trailer. Yeah it looks amazing. I can't
Speaker 2: wait to see it. So this critic arts critic at
Speaker 2: the Times wrote in her review, they wrote, ninety five
Speaker 2: percent of this movie is an advertisement for cleavage.
Speaker 3: It's all about titties.
Speaker 2: And one of the actresses from that show did not
Speaker 2: from the movie. Didn't like that, so privately DMD this
Speaker 2: critic and just wrote, maybe if you weren't so focused
Speaker 2: on our tits, you could have watched the movie because
Speaker 2: it's good, like something like that, like you know, sort
Speaker 2: of looking at her.
Speaker 3: Tits, watch the movie.
Speaker 2: So this critic decides to publicly show everyone this private DM,
Speaker 2: but still spin it like they're like a victim where
Speaker 2: they're like these power dynamics. I will not be treated
Speaker 2: like this, And it's like it was a private DM,
Speaker 2: like you're making it public.
Speaker 3: There is no power dynamic. Yeah, so the power dynamic.
Speaker 2: It was a black actress, Like, were what power dynamics
Speaker 2: are you actually talking about? And I don't know either
Speaker 2: of your names, none of you. I don't you know
Speaker 2: what I mean. It's like what power? So she and
Speaker 2: then people start piling on her because she's so annoying,
Speaker 2: and then a TikTok on surfaces from a while ago
Speaker 2: where she's just like five tips on how to be
Speaker 2: a successful writer, and then the first ones like have talent.
Speaker 3: I'm just talented. I don't know what to say.
Speaker 2: I don't even have real formal training, Like I just
Speaker 2: I am an incredible writer too, have an amazing point
Speaker 2: of view. You don't have to know the right point
Speaker 2: of view, but I have a very strong point of
Speaker 2: view on arts and criticism. And like keeps just talking
Speaker 2: about She's like, my therapist would love how positive I'm
Speaker 2: being about myself because I never say nice things about myself.
Speaker 3: So she's talking about like how to be a writer,
Speaker 3: how she's so good, how her first article was barely
Speaker 3: edited and made the cover of the Arts and Culture
Speaker 3: section comes out. Her father works at the New York Times.
Speaker 2: Her father's worked at the New York Times for a
Speaker 2: long time, and like that works a baby, and this
Speaker 2: person has the audacity to make a thing going.
Speaker 3: I'm just talented. I don't know what to tell you.
Speaker 2: And then like publishing a private DM and maybe like
Speaker 2: this actress who cares about criticism, but also she was
Speaker 2: annoyed but it was so that it blew up. And
Speaker 2: this girl now has you know, deleted her TikTok, Instagram, Twitter,
Speaker 2: she's gone, no writer, Yeah, out of ran her out
Speaker 2: of town. Maybe she'll write another article or something. But
Speaker 2: she was just dragged and she seems annoying. She sounded annoying.
Speaker 2: She had a bike hanging on her wall, like nothing
Speaker 2: was good about the situation.
Speaker 3: Oh my god. Okay, I missed this whole drama.
Speaker 1: But I did see the trailer for Bodies, Bodies, Bodies,
Speaker 1: and I'm trying to think of where I saw it,
Speaker 1: but I it looks good.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I want to see that.
Speaker 2: I want to see Marcel Dechelle, me too. There's one
Speaker 2: other one someone said was good, but like I, yeah,
Speaker 2: I would love to because it's so hot here everywhere.
Speaker 3: I would love to see in a movie.
Speaker 1: You're gonna be in the hundreds this week in La,
Speaker 1: I really want to see Morcella sholl. I know it's
Speaker 1: going to make me cry. Wait, tell me about your shows.
Speaker 1: That Caroline's really quick before we start our episode.
Speaker 3: Oh it was awesome. It felt so cool.
Speaker 2: I just really felt like the coolest girl in New York,
Speaker 2: you know, headlining Carolines and running to the cellar and
Speaker 2: doing three spots at a night. Like it was just
Speaker 2: kind of like who am I like, no, you know,
Speaker 2: it just felt cool. But the last and I met
Speaker 2: a lot of listeners. Thank you for coming. I appreciate it.
Speaker 2: Such cuties, fun photos, like cool people. So the last show,
Speaker 2: there was a couple and their energy was weird, and
Speaker 2: we figured out that they had met at the airport
Speaker 2: that day.
Speaker 3: What right.
Speaker 2: Then there's a group of six women in their sixties
Speaker 2: and they've been friends for fifty years.
Speaker 3: I love that they were doing a girl's trip.
Speaker 2: They saw Michael Jackson the Musical in the day and
Speaker 2: Lisa Tragger at night.
Speaker 3: They were going to.
Speaker 2: Handle Inn Matine and Sunday they were just like ready
Speaker 2: to drink.
Speaker 3: It was awesome. Then there was a couple making out
Speaker 3: dressed sexies.
Speaker 2: So I went, okay, what's your energy? You guys are
Speaker 2: clearly cheating on people. And they were because I've like
Speaker 2: used that line before in my standa and it's usually
Speaker 2: like haha, yeah, but this was like legit and they're
Speaker 2: both from out of state and flew in to cheat,
Speaker 2: and so it was just and then there was a
Speaker 2: private chef from a yacht below deck style, so it
Speaker 2: was just side god you got like the dream audience
Speaker 2: stream audience, and in the front there was a Portuguese
Speaker 2: family with like four or five kids, and the youngest kid,
Speaker 2: I swear to you, he was eleven years old.
Speaker 3: I was just like, what is happening. I've seen kids
Speaker 3: at Carolines before and I'm always like.
Speaker 1: Like I've been like why. I remember there was like
Speaker 1: a family at a show that I did at Carolines
Speaker 1: that was like from Sweden or Finland or something, and
Speaker 1: they were all just like had all their kids with them,
Speaker 1: and I was like, what is going on?
Speaker 3: It was wild? But I love it. Yeah, So it
Speaker 3: was super fun.
Speaker 2: And you can fucking buy weed at the bodega's dude. Really,
Speaker 2: you know in La it's like the you know who
Speaker 2: Sean pass and was explaining this to me, like I
Speaker 2: like comparing it we're in la It is like the
Speaker 2: Max Store. You know, they go in, there's cases and
Speaker 2: ID it's official. There's taxes here. You like, go to
Speaker 2: a smoke shop or a bodeg and you go, can
Speaker 2: I get a pre roll? And then they take a
Speaker 2: zip lock bag filled with pre rolls and then you
Speaker 2: buy one for fifteen dollars.
Speaker 1: Oh like Lucy's. It's like selling Lucy's.
Speaker 3: I love it. Yeah, I love it.
Speaker 2: You guys buy a vape at from your dude, from
Speaker 2: the dude that you've been buying, you know, lighters and
Speaker 2: sandwiches from.
Speaker 3: It's incredible. Yeah.
Speaker 1: Now we just have to let everybody out of jail
Speaker 1: that's in jail for dealing weed.
Speaker 2: I've seen two robberies this week, Jesus, like someone running
Speaker 2: and then someone chasing after them.
Speaker 3: Trying to get their stuff back. Fuck.
Speaker 1: Well, yeah, New York's lit up. Well, listen, we have
Speaker 1: to start the episode because we could chat all day,
Speaker 1: but I really quickly wanted to just remind everybody that
Speaker 1: we are going to be on tour starting very soon.
Speaker 1: I think this week when you're hearing this episode, we
Speaker 1: will be in San Diego at Ike Drop Comedy on
Speaker 1: September fifteenth, that's a Thursday, come see us. We loved
Speaker 1: our last show in San Diego. We're doing a different episode.
Speaker 1: And then on September sixteenth, which is a Friday, we
Speaker 1: will be at Los the Dynasty Typewriter in Los Angeles.
Speaker 1: But listen, I don't think we've made it clear enough
Speaker 1: that that is a live stream show. That will be
Speaker 1: our only show from the whole tour that's live streamed.
Speaker 1: You can watch that from anywhere anywhere in the US.
Speaker 1: I think I don't know about other countries. I will
Speaker 1: check that out, but you can live stream the show,
Speaker 1: watch it from anywhere. We're going to do an episode
Speaker 1: that we've never done on a live stream before, and
Speaker 1: that we've probably never done it a live show. So
Speaker 1: you're going to get to watch an awesome show and
Speaker 1: watch it from the comfort of your own home. And
Speaker 1: that link works for a week, so just you know,
Speaker 1: get a tick and watch it at your convenience and
Speaker 1: watch it over and over again if that's what you're into.
Speaker 1: Then the following week or two weeks later, we're going
Speaker 1: to be in Texas.
Speaker 3: Woo.
Speaker 1: We're going to be in Austin on the twenty seventh,
Speaker 1: Dallas on the twenty eighth and Houston on the twenty ninth.
Speaker 1: Please come see us, guys. We're so excited to be
Speaker 1: touring and coming to see you guys. And our live
Speaker 1: shows are so fun. I'm not just saying that because
Speaker 1: I plan them and participate in them. They are super
Speaker 1: fun and that's what all of our listeners tell us afterwards.
Speaker 2: And hurry up because someone already wrote that the VIP
Speaker 2: tickets in New York sold out already.
Speaker 3: Yeah, those are gone, like people are buying ticks. So yeah, not.
Speaker 1: To get out there and get your tickets. Bring friends,
Speaker 1: bring somebody who doesn't even watch us for you. I'm
Speaker 1: telling you, the drag alongs that come to these shows
Speaker 1: always have a great time.
Speaker 3: Oh my god, Kara, what.
Speaker 2: I had a spinach Arctic show crab Dip yesterday.
Speaker 3: I've had that before. It's amazing. Did it change your life?
Speaker 1: It was really good. Come meet crab Dip with us
Speaker 1: on our tour. All right, let's start our episode.
Speaker 2: Bye, it's time for countdown. Kara, I would say, we've
Speaker 2: been wanting to do this episode since we started.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I don't know why, I mean to me, it
Speaker 1: just feels like a huge class, but it is supremely
Speaker 1: fucked up.
Speaker 3: It seems like it's like season two.
Speaker 1: They know people like their product and they're like, let's
Speaker 1: just do the most fucked up stuff possible, Like.
Speaker 3: You know what I mean. Yeah, it is very scary.
Speaker 3: Spoiler alert.
Speaker 2: Jim Gaffigan's in this one, so obviously we've you know,
Speaker 2: that's exciting. It's just like an incredible episode, So I'm
Speaker 2: really excited to do this.
Speaker 3: We start with commotion.
Speaker 2: There's gridlock on the streets of New York, steam trucks, construction, arrows,
Speaker 2: you know, lights, a lot of stuff's happening, and the
Speaker 2: camera is panning and behind all the blinking lights and
Speaker 2: trucks there's an upper class couple. I would say, right,
Speaker 2: they look kind of rich, unhappy, you know, unhappy. The
Speaker 2: man is driving, he's in a bow tie, the wife's
Speaker 2: the passenger. They're bickering. The man decided to take a shortcut.
Speaker 2: The wife calls him an idiot. He goes, you took
Speaker 2: too long to get ready. You look like shit. No,
Speaker 2: but they're fighting. So then because he wants to get
Speaker 2: to wherever ballet they're going to on time, The wife goes,
Speaker 2: why because you want to see your girlfriend and it's like,
Speaker 2: do you know he's cheating?
Speaker 3: Is the girlfriend at the ballet? Like what is this? So?
Speaker 1: I kind of right, yes that I thought that was
Speaker 1: kind of funny. They like stuck in just like you
Speaker 1: know why because your girlfriend's gonna be there?
Speaker 3: Like whoa harsh?
Speaker 1: But like, also, don't you feel like you've seen this
Speaker 1: opening before? I feel like I've seen two rich people
Speaker 1: trying to get to the opera, ballet, the gala, the fundraiser, whatever,
Speaker 1: and like they theycounter a crime. Am I crazy?
Speaker 3: No? You know this, Karra. There's only certain amount of
Speaker 3: ways you can find a victim, you know what I mean?
Speaker 3: I walk through the bush.
Speaker 1: I always feel like it's like unhappy rich people bickering
Speaker 1: when they stumble across a victim.
Speaker 2: You know, absolutely no, it has happened before, and hopefully
Speaker 2: a psycho is listening that can pinpoint it and said
Speaker 2: it our way. He doesn't like being accused of having
Speaker 2: a girlfriend or that his girlfriend's at the ballet, but
Speaker 2: I would also want to be at the bell and
Speaker 2: I'm you know what I.
Speaker 3: Mean, Yeah, whatever, let's get there.
Speaker 2: Then we see somebody fall out of a truck and yelp,
Speaker 2: and the man is looking away and the woman's like
Speaker 2: something fell out.
Speaker 3: The doors are open. Let the truck driver know.
Speaker 2: So the man like you know, lowers his window to
Speaker 2: start hollering at the driver, and the truck just peels off.
Speaker 2: He doesn't give a shit, just like so fast. And
Speaker 2: then it's like do they go or wait?
Speaker 3: What do they do? Ah?
Speaker 1: You know?
Speaker 3: And then a little hand reaches up and we see
Speaker 3: a little hand and they stop the car. And now
Speaker 3: we're at the and like, how did the van get away?
Speaker 3: New York City?
Speaker 1: They're in gridlock and suddenly the van's like, I've got
Speaker 1: a mile to run.
Speaker 2: Away, like so yeah, that's that. So now we're in
Speaker 2: the hospital. Benson and Stabler are well. Benson's in a
Speaker 2: Stabler style jacket, which is wild. It's like lammy fur
Speaker 2: in the middle and down him on the outside. I've
Speaker 2: never seen Benson in a jacket like that. And then
Speaker 2: behind and then Stabler is behind her, and then a
Speaker 2: man with thinning hair and a tie is giving us
Speaker 2: the scoo. It's Sophie Douglas eight, he says. And the
Speaker 2: man is a cop. He's not a doctor.
Speaker 3: I didn't know.
Speaker 2: I just saw an outfit, but then there is a badge.
Speaker 2: So she went missing three days ago. They thought it
Speaker 2: was a custodial like snatching, but I guess it's not.
Speaker 3: There's no ransom.
Speaker 2: But Benson and Stabler call him out on a like
Speaker 2: they're like, you're a fuck up.
Speaker 3: It was not. It was a stranger. I don't know.
Speaker 2: They get into a fight and I don't actually know
Speaker 2: what it's about. And I did watch it a few times. Yeah,
Speaker 2: do you know what they were fighting about?
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think it was just like you got you know,
Speaker 1: it's what we talk about all the time. You guys
Speaker 1: were like convinced it was this custodial snatch and so
Speaker 1: you didn't like look into any other leads and like
Speaker 1: it was not that.
Speaker 3: You know.
Speaker 1: Yeah, you guys are married to your narrative that you
Speaker 1: get stuck on and then you you.
Speaker 2: Know, yeah, because Stabler's never done that, right, right. So yeah,
Speaker 2: But early seasons of SVU, they're really fighting with the
Speaker 2: other cops a lot. They're trying to prove themselves. So
Speaker 2: a rape kit is happening, and it's a child and
Speaker 2: it's a sad exam and it's kind of uncomfortable and weird,
Speaker 2: and this like, you know, the detectives stroll in as
Speaker 2: this doctor is like Q tipping this child's vagina. It's
Speaker 2: like very uncomfortable. It's like, can you have waited two seconds?
Speaker 2: This is insane.
Speaker 1: I know why they had to go in during that
Speaker 1: very vulnerable moment.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it seemed weird.
Speaker 2: So the doctor continues the exam and they sneak away,
Speaker 2: like five feet away, whispering, and the doc stuck starts
Speaker 2: taking pictures, and then Olivia introduces herself to Sophie, who's
Speaker 2: so cute, and Benson is blowing bubbles and while she's
Speaker 2: distracting her malonious talking to the doctor who's explaining the injuries.
Speaker 2: Not good, definitely rape. Stabler and Benson makes sad eye
Speaker 2: contact as bubbles float past Benson's face, and then the credits.
Speaker 2: So now we're back with some squad time whole team
Speaker 2: and Benson and Stabler are filling them in and Kragan's
Speaker 2: in Suspenders Classic. So the talk screen did come back
Speaker 2: positive for tranquilizers.
Speaker 3: Not good.
Speaker 2: The only thing I think about when I think of tranquilizers,
Speaker 2: I always just think of old school. I think of
Speaker 2: Will Ferrell getting tranked and being so funny in the
Speaker 2: La School.
Speaker 1: Well that's a TRNK dart right.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I don't remember.
Speaker 2: It was like meant for one of the animals of
Speaker 2: the kids party and he goes down and it's like
Speaker 2: it's kind of like the Kuaylude scene with Leonardo DiCaprio
Speaker 2: and Wolf of Wall Street.
Speaker 3: It's just like such good acting, Like it's so fun
Speaker 3: is that where he goes I love you man, but
Speaker 3: you're crazy? Like yeah, yeah, I like say that all
Speaker 3: the time. What a good movie. I love school, I
Speaker 3: love old School. Cool.
Speaker 2: We're going streaking in the quad all right? So the
Speaker 2: white van duh okay, we know that already. The two
Speaker 2: witnesses sat behind the van for twenty minutes and couldn't
Speaker 2: give them one number of the license plate, and Benson's
Speaker 2: piss and it's like relax, like you want us all
Speaker 2: memorizing plates constantly while we're in traffic, Like I can't
Speaker 2: imagine being mad at people for not doing that. And
Speaker 2: by the way, it's a Pixie Benson, if you were wondering.
Speaker 2: So Cragan traffic guards them all and sends them all
Speaker 2: on their missions, and he assigns Benson and Stabler to
Speaker 2: interview the girl, and she's like, the mom is not
Speaker 2: really into that vibe.
Speaker 3: And Craigan's like, I don't give a shit.
Speaker 2: Obviously it's you know, you'll be sensitive, but we need
Speaker 2: this information.
Speaker 3: So we head to the.
Speaker 2: Child Advocate Center of Manhattan on eighty first Street and
Speaker 2: it's February tenth and Cabots they're chatting with Stabler and
Speaker 2: she's like, what the fuck? How is everyone still here?
Speaker 2: I was so late. I thought you'd all be gone.
Speaker 2: And Stabler's like, well, we're having problems with this mother.
Speaker 2: She's not willing to separate, she's not willing to help us.
Speaker 2: She doesn't want Sophie talking alone. She's not gonna speak freely,
Speaker 2: and like the mom is being very annoying, but I
Speaker 2: get it. She's being protective, but like truly an annoying person.
Speaker 2: And Cabot's like, fine, just let the fucking mom in.
Speaker 2: So we're in the room with Benson and the girl
Speaker 2: and the lamp base. Did you notice no the lamp
Speaker 2: So the lamp in the room, like the post of
Speaker 2: it is a giant red pencil.
Speaker 1: Perfect for the Liza Trigger interior collection. That would be
Speaker 1: like something in your home design collection.
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, you said, a really cute lamp.
Speaker 2: I don't know how I lost it along the way,
Speaker 2: But the stump of it, what is it called the stump.
Speaker 3: Of a lamp? The pole, the handle, what is the
Speaker 3: base the base lamp? The base of the lamp was
Speaker 3: a poodle. Oh that's cute.
Speaker 2: And the shade was white and black polka dots. Oh
Speaker 2: it was good. But i've you are impressed. I felt that.
Speaker 3: Okay.
Speaker 2: So you know, she starts asking questions about the man.
Speaker 3: What color is he?
Speaker 2: She goes like ours hair, she can't remember, but she
Speaker 2: knows he had scary teeth, like a monster. How did
Speaker 2: she meet the man? And she starts to get really emotional.
Speaker 2: She saw a puppy, and it's like, girl, we can
Speaker 2: all relate, you know what I mean, we can all
Speaker 2: bring into this puppy.
Speaker 1: I hooked up with a guy one time who told
Speaker 1: me he had a puppy back at his apartment.
Speaker 3: And then he didn't he did. Oh okay, just saying
Speaker 3: it's a pretty easy way to get someone to go
Speaker 3: with you.
Speaker 2: Yeah, she feels guilty and like she's dumb, but it's like, truly,
Speaker 2: it could work on any of us. Yeah, she didn't
Speaker 2: want to get in the van, and she doesn't actually
Speaker 2: want to talk about it anymore. And then on a
Speaker 2: tiny TV in the waiting room, Stabler, Cabot and the
Speaker 2: mom are watching and the mom is like, you heard her.
Speaker 3: She wants to stop.
Speaker 2: It's too much, and Keba goes, we don't care what
Speaker 2: you think, and you know, they're trying to explain to
Speaker 2: her it takes time. We don't want to rush her,
Speaker 2: and the mom suggests taking her, and Stabler talks and
Speaker 2: is like like talks through the monitor thing, and it's like,
Speaker 2: hurry up.
Speaker 3: You know, there's the mom's being a bitch.
Speaker 2: So Benson starts pushing her to get the info of
Speaker 2: the place, a street sign, anything, and Sophie responds that
Speaker 2: he didn't talk until the room and he said that.
Speaker 3: It was her party day.
Speaker 2: There was balloons and stuff, but it was grim and
Speaker 2: not a real party because there was no friends there.
Speaker 2: She said there was cupcakes and punch, and then she
Speaker 2: fell asleep and when she woke up, he was standing
Speaker 2: above her and he said it's time for picture day
Speaker 2: and she had to wear lots of costumes, like a princess, mermaid, ballerina,
Speaker 2: and she wanted to dress herself, but he had to
Speaker 2: help her anyways, and that's when the mom freaks out
Speaker 2: and is like and Stabler stops her and is like,
Speaker 2: we need to do this and Cabo, it's like focus, focus,
Speaker 2: and the mom starts crying and doesn't want her to
Speaker 2: have to relive this, and Stabler's like, don't you want
Speaker 2: us to find him? And she's like, I want you
Speaker 2: to kill him? Okay, so let us work, so we continue.
Speaker 2: What's the next day, they ask, and Sophie says, it's
Speaker 2: my special day and she had to be really clean,
Speaker 2: so she had to take up a bubble bath that sucks,
Speaker 2: and then she gets up and walks into the corner
Speaker 2: blair Witch style, and she then sadly says, it's like
Speaker 2: all my fault, and Benson reassures her it's not. She
Speaker 2: faces away from her and cries, and it's really cute.
Speaker 2: She has little bangs and you know, she she just
Speaker 2: he had more puppies in the van, and she starts
Speaker 2: to cry and Benson's like, I like puppies too, girl ah,
Speaker 2: and she climbed in and that you know bam, and
Speaker 2: she's scared her mom will know about it and Benson
Speaker 2: is like, he tricked you, and she says, nope, I
Speaker 2: broke the rule. She just wanted to see the puppies,
Speaker 2: and the mom runs in. They hug the ambra in
Speaker 2: a real way, but she denies any more questioning and
Speaker 2: they're taking her home now and they're all mad at her,
Speaker 2: and Cabot goes, who cares, I have legal recourse. I'll
Speaker 2: get that bitch. So Stabler says he wouldn't put his
Speaker 2: girls through this, and then he turns to the women
Speaker 2: and goes, you wouldn't get it, And so what do
Speaker 2: we do now? So I guess we have to go canvas.
Speaker 2: So Benson hopes that Munch and Finn are having a
Speaker 2: better time with the van lead than they're having talking
Speaker 2: to Sophie. So we cut to our duo in a
Speaker 2: car and Finn is eating I love that, but he's
Speaker 2: not satisfied. He wants a fortune cookie and he's looking
Speaker 2: and Munch is like, I said, no fortune cookies because
Speaker 2: they're stale, and it's like, who gives a shit, it's
Speaker 2: for the fortune what the cookie is?
Speaker 3: Like?
Speaker 1: I believe like fortune cookies, even if they're stale. I
Speaker 1: love how they taste. Oh, controversial opinion.
Speaker 3: I love them.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, I don't need to eat them at all.
Speaker 1: But of course I want a fortune. I know I
Speaker 1: want the fortune, but I also want the cookie. I'm
Speaker 1: telling you, it's weird. I just like the way they taste.
Speaker 3: It's fine. I mean, I'm sure a lot of people don't.
Speaker 3: It's not that weird. Okay, so but okay, but for
Speaker 3: Munch to take away that opportunity for Finn bothers, you
Speaker 3: don't get to choose for him, Finn Munch. Yeah.
Speaker 2: So they're at a man's a man's van garage spot
Speaker 2: and his name is Oliver aka Allie Jolly aka Squiggles
Speaker 2: the clown, and he molested kids.
Speaker 3: He was hired to entertain, obviously.
Speaker 2: So they exit the car to get this guy, and
Speaker 2: as he leaves his car, this is where Jim Gaffigan appears,
Speaker 2: can you believe it?
Speaker 3: And he has the whitest eyebrows.
Speaker 2: I don't think I've noticed like how white his eyebrows are,
Speaker 2: and it does make me uncomfortable. Get some eyebrows, bro. Yeah,
Speaker 2: he is very blonde, yeah, very blonde. And he's like, hey,
Speaker 2: who are you? And it's like, bro, you know they're
Speaker 2: the cops like, who else can these two people be
Speaker 2: and they're you know, it's a red herring.
Speaker 3: It's a red herring. We know this.
Speaker 2: But he says that he was in Connecticut painting houses
Speaker 2: all day and that his business is legit, and they're
Speaker 2: like house painting or raping, Like he's gonna be like, oh, yeah,
Speaker 2: you're right, I was raping. But the sign for the
Speaker 2: business on the van is a magnet. So it is
Speaker 2: an unmarked white van and they're like, we have to
Speaker 2: look inside. He tries to fight it, but they're gonna
Speaker 2: go in. And Munch is wearing a Hasidic style black
Speaker 2: hat with a hint of a Leonard Cohen hat in
Speaker 2: the mix of it, and asks Oli if he's been
Speaker 2: up to his old tricks again, and he says no.
Speaker 2: He keeps saying that he learned his lesson at Sing
Speaker 2: sing and he knows all about impulse control. But of
Speaker 2: course they don't trust him, they do not care, and
Speaker 2: they will be looking into the van, and when they
Speaker 2: go into the van, there's clown clothing.
Speaker 3: He violated his parole.
Speaker 2: They found the balloons, and they're like, we're gonna dust
Speaker 2: for fingerprints and bring him in for a lineup, so
Speaker 2: start talking Bozo.
Speaker 3: He says, no, I didn't give a girl a party.
Speaker 2: But it's like he won't give an alibi that would
Speaker 2: help him, and so what's gonna go.
Speaker 3: What's happening?
Speaker 2: So Benson and Stabler break in with something they found
Speaker 2: going through his belongings interesting and it's like it's like
Speaker 2: a calendar and all the children's events are circled, and
Speaker 2: he says that doesn't mean anything, and they're like, we're
Speaker 2: de tech. So we called all these places and everyone
Speaker 2: saw you, and you were seen at these county fairs
Speaker 2: and you've been gotten and but he does have his alibi,
Speaker 2: but he was breaking his parole and being at town
Speaker 2: fairs with children, so you know he's gonna get in trouble.
Speaker 2: I'm sure.
Speaker 1: For some reason when I look back on this episode,
Speaker 1: I always think Gaffigan is the bad guy.
Speaker 3: But he is the red herring. Yeah he is.
Speaker 2: It's just because the other guy is blonde as well,
Speaker 2: and like, you know, you also you with eyebrows that
Speaker 2: you can't.
Speaker 1: Really yeah, but I remember being like Gaffigan doesn't really
Speaker 1: have like fucked up teeth, which is a huge part
Speaker 1: of this episode. So I wonder if they just gave
Speaker 1: him like a grill, a bad teeth grill.
Speaker 3: Well, no, I don't think he had to have bad teeth.
Speaker 1: No, I know, in my mind that's what I would think,
Speaker 1: because I always thought he was the bad guy. But
Speaker 1: he's not.
Speaker 3: I was creating a full thing that was not real,
Speaker 3: the Mandala effect.
Speaker 2: Yes, yes, So anyways, they say those term touchy feely games.
Speaker 2: Benson says, Connecticut PD does want a word with him,
Speaker 2: so they ditch his ass and he's gonna go back
Speaker 2: to sing. Sing for hanging out with kids at the
Speaker 2: county fair. But I don't think I've ever been to
Speaker 2: a county fair.
Speaker 3: Well me neither.
Speaker 1: But like and when I was in Connecticut, I never
Speaker 1: remember there being a county fair. But there were lots
Speaker 1: of fairs in the summer, like lots of carnivals where
Speaker 1: they would show up for just two days. Like I remember,
Speaker 1: I would always go to one called Saint Leo's. They
Speaker 1: were big at churches and they were so fun. I
Speaker 1: loved fairs so much. Okay, great, perfect time.
Speaker 3: And fine kids. Yeah.
Speaker 2: So back of the squad, they're all meeting up and
Speaker 2: finnhands Olivia Note that says that the mom wants Sophie
Speaker 2: to have more healing time and doesn't want her chatting yet,
Speaker 2: so Benson suggests, like, let's call it a day. Then
Speaker 2: it's eight pm, like peace out. They'll say hell yeah.
Speaker 2: So then Stabler's like, oh, I'll have time to go
Speaker 2: to the toy store and buy a gift for the twins' birthday.
Speaker 2: And Kathy is not gonna believe it that I bought
Speaker 2: these kids the gifts two days early. And Benson gets
Speaker 2: on her stell and starts like having flirty chats and
Speaker 2: making plans for some like sexy dinner time with a
Speaker 2: guy named Michael, and Munch asks how's mister perfect, and
Speaker 2: she goes, I mean I've only met him once. We'll
Speaker 2: see what happens, and doesn't have any plans, but who knows.
Speaker 2: The night is young, so the whole squad piles into
Speaker 2: the elevator to have their nice night off. Then boom,
Speaker 2: Craigan blocks the door from the elevator and says, everybody stays.
Speaker 2: Man in white van grabbed another girl, so they all
Speaker 2: pile back out and they start to work. Now it
Speaker 2: cuts to much at a bodega talking to some men
Speaker 2: and they explain this guy was American six feet drunk.
Speaker 2: He says that the teeth of the man were very unfortunate,
Speaker 2: like Austin Powers. And then Munch asks for the footage
Speaker 2: from the security tape. It's a broken camera, and the
Speaker 2: guy says it's better than nothing, and it's like, I
Speaker 2: don't know, it is nothing. But the guy also paid
Speaker 2: in cash, but we're gonna try to get, you know,
Speaker 2: fingerprints off of the cash and something important. He asks
Speaker 2: for two dollars of his change to be in quarters,
Speaker 2: so that's going to be a clue. And then finnis
Speaker 2: TopKing to a man with a violin case, talking about,
Speaker 2: you know, he heard a smash of glass and he's
Speaker 2: so he's explaining what he sees, but he's also holding
Speaker 2: his violin in a case and he keeps calling it
Speaker 2: her and he's like she doesn't like it in the cold,
Speaker 2: I have to go protect her. Like he's just like
Speaker 2: truly fucking the violin. But he said he saw the
Speaker 2: license plate and it either started with an H or
Speaker 2: a B. I don't believe that's helpful information. So Munch
Speaker 2: meets Leather Daddy Finn outside and they start discussing the
Speaker 2: quarters and mapping out the attack and the struggle, and
Speaker 2: so basically Miss Guzak.
Speaker 3: She left Kirsten.
Speaker 2: Alone in the car, and then the guy saw it
Speaker 2: was an opportunity thing, I think, and he grabbed the
Speaker 2: girl dropped the beer, and that's that. It was not
Speaker 2: a planned snatch, but he saw an opportunity.
Speaker 3: And then they see a payphone and they.
Speaker 2: Asked the tech to dust it and also to dust
Speaker 2: all the quarters inside.
Speaker 3: I bet that has never happened in real life ever. Ever.
Speaker 2: Ever, we're now the apartment of Charles and Jean Gouzac,
Speaker 2: and she is saying how the car was parked right
Speaker 2: out front. She left her daughter in the car for
Speaker 2: just one moment, and the dad's like, fuck, it is
Speaker 2: all my fault. I called and asked her to pick
Speaker 2: up cigarettes, and it is your fault. And then the
Speaker 2: mom just like was saying, oh, it was so cold,
Speaker 2: I just thought it would be easy for her to
Speaker 2: sit in the car.
Speaker 3: She's, of course crying.
Speaker 2: Benson and Stable are asking for details about seeing anything,
Speaker 2: and they give her. The parents give them Kirsten's most
Speaker 2: recent photo. The mom is so worried, like fuck, it's
Speaker 2: past her bedtime. I hope he doesn't hurt my baby.
Speaker 2: And Benson pushes like, come on, did you see anything
Speaker 2: and she says, just the open door, that's.
Speaker 3: All she saw.
Speaker 2: They give her a pick from the last vacation and
Speaker 2: she has just turned to eight and they're like, we're
Speaker 2: Shirt's the same guy, and Munch is like, what are
Speaker 2: the odds there are two pedophiles with horrific teeth snatching
Speaker 2: kids and like New York, but maybe a lot, but
Speaker 2: there are there are.
Speaker 3: So many episodes of this show.
Speaker 2: So Benson is confused why he would risk a girl
Speaker 2: EPs so soon after the last debacle and like the
Speaker 2: kid falling out of the truck and everything, and Finn goes,
Speaker 2: I mean he was drunk, you know, Sophie was very
Speaker 2: organized and Kirsten was an impulse grab. Munch says he's
Speaker 2: flexible and he's not a first time or obviously, and
Speaker 2: Benson has pissed because she's requested certain files and they
Speaker 2: haven't come yet, and it's one thirty am. Stabler's like, fuck,
Speaker 2: So picture day starts in eight hours. We have to
Speaker 2: get moving, and so they all scadattle to do their
Speaker 2: work and now it cuts to past three am and
Speaker 2: they're all still working and Finn is just looking at
Speaker 2: mugshots of people with bad teeth in the system. His
Speaker 2: brow is furrowed, he is working hard. Stabler spits out
Speaker 2: some coffee and Munch is like, hey, I made that
Speaker 2: nineteen hours ago, so a bunch, so much. But when
Speaker 2: Stabler goes to make more, he flips out at Munch.
Speaker 2: I get like, because Munch puts a lid on an
Speaker 2: empty can.
Speaker 3: No wonder he keeps getting divorced. Yeah, they're just, but
Speaker 3: they're all just.
Speaker 1: I think there's just showing how they're all snapped at
Speaker 1: each other because it's three am and they're all at
Speaker 1: each other's fucking throats.
Speaker 3: Yeah, they're are testing this episode. Yeah.
Speaker 2: So then Stabler goes, fine, I'm gonna run and get coffee,
Speaker 2: and Craigan and Munch get their orders in so much
Speaker 2: a double espresso and Craigan no foam two percent latte,
Speaker 2: and then Munch adds a pastrami on rye.
Speaker 3: What I really am pastrami on rye?
Speaker 2: Like, I get you're going to vote, like that's what
Speaker 2: you want from the bodega? No, ha, No, get a
Speaker 2: turkey sandwich and shut up. Then, before Stabler can leave
Speaker 2: to get all the coffees. A uniformed cop stops them,
Speaker 2: and there's boxes and boxes and boxes of files that
Speaker 2: Benson's been waiting for. So we see that Benson's been
Speaker 2: sleeping in the crib and Stabler wakes her up and
Speaker 2: she didn't even get her full thirty minute break. But
Speaker 2: the files are here. She has bedheads, she's messy. She
Speaker 2: swivels out of bed, and it's time to work. It's
Speaker 2: eight am. They've been working for twenty four straight hours.
Speaker 2: I'm sure you're understanding why this episode is called countdown.
Speaker 3: Yes, baby Kristin has.
Speaker 2: Been missing for twelve Finn is in the corner, being
Speaker 2: a very lee as the type person and dripping eye
Speaker 2: drops into his eyes. For those of you who don't know,
Speaker 2: I am an eye drop queen. And then Much is like,
Speaker 2: I want some eye drops, and of course Fin will
Speaker 2: not share, and he says that's how you get pink eye,
Speaker 2: and Stabler, mister bossy pants, demands Fin gives him, gives
Speaker 2: the eye drops to Munch.
Speaker 1: I don't remember any of this.
Speaker 3: Oh my god.
Speaker 2: The eye drops were just important to me because I
Speaker 2: saw myself represented. Yes, yes, so it's okay that you
Speaker 2: didn't you know, notice this one eye drop squeeze.
Speaker 1: I also don't think sharing eye drops is the number
Speaker 1: one cause of pink eye stable or it's not washing
Speaker 1: your hands after you shit just.
Speaker 3: FYI sure, but there has to be more.
Speaker 2: Is the poop thing real or is that just like
Speaker 2: it is it's always poop?
Speaker 3: Yeah, pretty much.
Speaker 1: I don't think it's like people that are like sharing
Speaker 1: eye drops and like when was the last time you
Speaker 1: touched the eye dropper too?
Speaker 3: I don't know.
Speaker 2: I don't like to share mascara or like eyeliner or
Speaker 2: anything like, sure, no, you shouldn't, you shouldn't, you shouldn't.
Speaker 1: But I think that it's mostly nine cases out of
Speaker 1: ten it's poop.
Speaker 2: Well, my favorite eye drops are the Refresh and they
Speaker 2: come in like little vials that are like tiny plastic
Speaker 2: like you get like disposable, yeah, disposable. I like those.
Speaker 2: And it's like a little trail I leave behind. It's
Speaker 2: like a bobby bin. It's like, you know, I've been around.
Speaker 2: If there's little eye drop things everywhere, I just don't
Speaker 2: take off my makeup at night, and it does cause
Speaker 2: a lot of problems for my ducts. Okay, So Benson
Speaker 2: and Saylor are doing a super speed walk and talk
Speaker 2: and they're like, we need to talk to Sophie again.
Speaker 2: We know the mom said she needed more time, but
Speaker 2: that's before he snatched another girl.
Speaker 3: We have to help her.
Speaker 2: So they go to the Douglas residence and she's being
Speaker 2: so difficult and she's like, she told you everything she remembers,
Speaker 2: and it's like, well, how do you note that? And
Speaker 2: she starts rattling off off all the trauma symptoms that
Speaker 2: her daughter is suffering, and it's like, yeah, we know,
Speaker 2: but like, let's save the girl.
Speaker 3: And she does not care.
Speaker 2: Just another bit of evidence how being a parent does
Speaker 2: not make you a better person. She does not give
Speaker 2: a shit about this other child being taken. And so
Speaker 2: Stabler says, we'll get a judge to order you, and
Speaker 2: she goes, well, that's just what you'll have to do.
Speaker 3: That's kind of a drink game thing. I do love
Speaker 3: when people like this little exchange throughout the history of SVU,
Speaker 3: I enjoy it.
Speaker 2: Cabot and opposing counselor are pleading their cases in chambers
Speaker 2: to Judge Petrovsky and she is listening intensely. The mom
Speaker 2: thinks it's cruel, but Petrovsky orders a chat and the
Speaker 2: mom cries, and it's like, relaxed, she's safe, and you
Speaker 2: need to help this other person. So now we're back
Speaker 2: chatting with Sophie. And now I notice there's an ice
Speaker 2: cream shaped rug on the floor. So this really is
Speaker 2: a fun little investigation room for children. The pencil lamp
Speaker 2: is in the scene as well. Benson is so clever
Speaker 2: and slick and is like, well, do you ever order pizza? Like,
Speaker 2: what's the name of the pizza box?
Speaker 3: Cool? So, now that you're kidnapped, like, what did you know?
Speaker 3: Did you get takeout? Like did you see where you
Speaker 3: ate food from?
Speaker 2: And she stakes her hand and says no, all they
Speaker 2: ate was cupcakes, fruit punch, and candy corn and that's it.
Speaker 3: No dinner.
Speaker 2: And she asked like, was there anything with a name
Speaker 2: on it? And she goes, oh my god, Yes, there
Speaker 2: was a streamer at the party and it had my
Speaker 2: name on it.
Speaker 3: So what else was at the party? We got balloons
Speaker 3: and he blew them up with his own what is
Speaker 3: it helium tank machine? And he talked like a cartoon.
Speaker 3: Oh is that what whippets are?
Speaker 1: I mean, yeah, no, I think whippets are we'll go
Speaker 1: into like whipped cream and like other kind.
Speaker 3: Yeah yeah, yeah, I like whippets.
Speaker 1: But if you suck it, it doesn't do anything because I
Speaker 1: do it all the time whenever around.
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, it's just like a fun voice just makes
Speaker 2: your release like a chipmunk.
Speaker 3: Yeah yeah, cute. I mean, you don't even need helium.
Speaker 3: You just killed that. So now we're outside with the crew.
Speaker 2: It's a rainy day, and they're like, oh, he went
Speaker 2: shopping for the streamer after he had the girl, So
Speaker 2: let's figure out like how many party stores there are
Speaker 2: where you can rent a helium tank and all of
Speaker 2: that stuff. And then the stabler again is on this
Speaker 2: facade that's so delusional where he's like, great, and I'll
Speaker 2: pick up some decorations for the twins' birthday party. And
Speaker 2: it's like, in what world is Kathy making you responsible
Speaker 2: for this? Like just what stop lying to all of
Speaker 2: us and yourself. So they're at Aladdin's party supplies and
Speaker 2: the worker knows him, and again the bad teeth come
Speaker 2: up again. He did get a helium tank. He paid
Speaker 2: cash because now they have mini tanks and you don't
Speaker 2: have to rent a big one. He comes in every
Speaker 2: few weeks for the seasonal candy ding Ding Ding ding
Speaker 2: Ding candy corn. I like the like Little mush the
Speaker 2: pumpkin candy corn more than traditional candy corn.
Speaker 1: I'm a huge candy corn fan. I know people think
Speaker 1: it's gross, but I love it so much.
Speaker 3: I love it. I just would rather have the pumpkins. Yeah,
Speaker 3: I like a mix. I like the candy corn with
Speaker 3: the pumpkin. But do you like the candy ki don't
Speaker 3: you like it? Which I think is called I'm not
Speaker 3: going to say it. I don't like that corn.
Speaker 1: I think it's called Indian corn, but I don't know
Speaker 1: if you're allowed to say that anymore, because it's like
Speaker 1: Native American, not Indian.
Speaker 3: Like.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I don't like the chocolate corn. But when you
Speaker 1: but now they call it harvest corn.
Speaker 2: Harvest corn, and okay, we got the right word. We
Speaker 2: got the right word. If you like chocolate candy corns,
Speaker 2: it's harvest corn. Thanks for the investigative reporting, Kara.
Speaker 1: Back to you in the studio.
Speaker 2: Lisa back at the office and everyone is working hard.
Speaker 2: Benson's date calls and she's like, sorry, bro, I gotta go.
Speaker 3: Wait.
Speaker 2: Did you see the Samuel clip that he posted on
Speaker 2: his Twitter doing Pittsburgh. So, as comedians sometimes when you're
Speaker 2: on the road, you have to do morning television or radio.
Speaker 3: Is pressed to sell tickets.
Speaker 2: And on morning news they asked him why he's a comedian,
Speaker 2: and he goes, my uncle molested me, and he keeps
Speaker 2: so I don't remember what else he says, but then
Speaker 2: the reporters are just like, we don't really know where
Speaker 2: to go from here.
Speaker 1: He says like he was molested by an uncle and
Speaker 1: so he needed to like tell Dick jokes to forget
Speaker 1: about it or something like it was. It sounds bad
Speaker 1: now that we're were counting it, but it really made
Speaker 1: me laugh when I watched the clip.
Speaker 2: It was funny. It seemed like a purposeful joke. I
Speaker 2: accidentally brought up rape on morning news in Ohio and
Speaker 2: I was with Mateo. We were co headlining Mateo Lan
Speaker 2: and all these people are very funny. Go follow them
Speaker 2: if you don't already. But Mateo and I were there,
Speaker 2: and so like he starts dying laughing because he he
Speaker 2: suddenly sees like everyone losing it and not knowing what
Speaker 2: to do. The man co host is like turning red
Speaker 2: and blotchy, and Mateo just can't stop laughing that I
Speaker 2: said rape like at nine am. But I thought it
Speaker 2: was a funny story. Anyways, back at.
Speaker 3: Thought, oh my god, there is a clay And.
Speaker 2: I didn't brush my hair because I thought it was radio.
Speaker 2: So I also looked out of control. I'll post a
Speaker 2: photo from this news program, but I looked wild. I
Speaker 2: did morning news yesterday and I had one eye open.
Speaker 2: I was like, truly, no makeup, just like sitting there
Speaker 2: being like, picks news, Come see me this weekend. Back
Speaker 2: at the office and everyone harvest corn. Okay, back at
Speaker 2: the office and everyone's working really hard. Benson's date calls
Speaker 2: and she's like, sorry, bro, I'm obviously trying to save
Speaker 2: a child. So Sailor's on the phone with Kathy, who's
Speaker 2: of course mad at him.
Speaker 3: They're at thirty six hours.
Speaker 2: Munch sadly finds three autopsy reports with the same items
Speaker 2: in the stomach that he fed Sophie.
Speaker 3: And that is sad, but.
Speaker 2: At least we have clues information and we could hopefully
Speaker 2: get closer to catching this guy. But now, okay, wow,
Speaker 2: that was rude, Kara JK.
Speaker 3: I sneezed, but you know what, you know what, I'm.
Speaker 2: Referring to there's a video on YouTube of Christina Aguilera
Speaker 2: and she's like doing an interview and someone coughs off camera,
Speaker 2: and she goes, did you really just cough?
Speaker 3: Right now?
Speaker 2: I can't believe He's just like truly gets livid that
Speaker 2: a man coughed.
Speaker 3: It was the best So I kind of love doing
Speaker 3: it to people.
Speaker 2: Okay, So anyways, but what's sad about this information is
Speaker 2: now we know that he kills the girls, So I
Speaker 2: don't love that all three are strangled, all three killed
Speaker 2: in three days of getting snatched, and all three found
Speaker 2: near the water, But like, how is there no pattern?
Speaker 2: You know, it's all separate burrows. Sophia escaped from the
Speaker 2: van on the third day near the East River, so
Speaker 2: I'm glad she's alive, Like he was obviously going to
Speaker 2: dump her in the water. Kirsten starts the third day tomorrow,
Speaker 2: so they all have to stay at work and we
Speaker 2: have to save this girl. They're going over past cases
Speaker 2: and pinning on a map where all the girls were found,
Speaker 2: and like the time between snatches decreases every single time
Speaker 2: water washes away DNA. But they are all white girls
Speaker 2: in the ages between seven and nine. Finn says the
Speaker 2: guy is definitely a loner, and Munch says he's impulsive
Speaker 2: and socially marginalized. Stabler is like, is he smart or fickle? Like,
Speaker 2: we don't you know he's bouncing around town? Is this
Speaker 2: some purpose? Or is he a maniac? One Pp is
Speaker 2: also bothering them because they want to go public, but
Speaker 2: Benson is scared if we release too much information, then
Speaker 2: he'll know that we're looking for him, and he'll dump
Speaker 2: the van, or he'll change something, or he'll get rid
Speaker 2: of the girl, and so they really want to tread
Speaker 2: lightly with what information they release, but they so she
Speaker 2: thinks just the composite, So everyone's talking to Cragan, and
Speaker 2: Craigan says, this guy's super ritualistic. So let's release the
Speaker 2: composite and van, but hold back the time clock. And
Speaker 2: now a mom of one of the dead girls shows
Speaker 2: up and she hands Stabler photo of her daughter who's dead,
Speaker 2: and goes, this was her last school photo.
Speaker 3: It came in the mail three weeks after she was murdered.
Speaker 2: And it's like, you would think the company would maybe
Speaker 2: communicate a little bit.
Speaker 1: It's an automated process, ma'am. I'm sorry, the pictures are
Speaker 1: just going out, but she.
Speaker 2: Wants the sailor to put the photo in his pocket
Speaker 2: when he catches the man. There weren't any leads before,
Speaker 2: but you know, she believes in the sv detectives. Everyone's
Speaker 2: on edge and needs some sleep. Craigan flips out and
Speaker 2: yells about you know, it being a pig sty and
Speaker 2: Benson's like, you're the one who said no janitor, and
Speaker 2: he's like, yeah, Olivia, it's my fault.
Speaker 3: And it's like they're all losing it.
Speaker 2: Munch says that they got prints off the phone, but
Speaker 2: also like who called? And there was a ten second
Speaker 2: call around this time and it was to Saul Gardner.
Speaker 3: So they go visit this dude. It's a mess.
Speaker 2: He's as shoveled man in his fifties and he's shitting
Speaker 2: on the detectives and how bad they look, and it's like,
Speaker 2: you look pretty bad too. But he's denying the call.
Speaker 2: He said that he was on a date with a girl.
Speaker 2: They don't believe he can get a girlfriend. They're like, listen,
Speaker 2: do you have a message you talk, like, tell us
Speaker 2: what happened. Also, this man has been in for us.
Speaker 2: S v u's just so you guys know, and each
Speaker 2: time he's like a random man. Em Yeah, he's like
Speaker 2: always a random man with information, but he's not being helpful.
Speaker 2: But he swears he has no idea. So then the
Speaker 2: next day the papers hit the stands and the phone
Speaker 2: start ringing, ringing, ringing. Psychics are calling people have tips.
Speaker 2: So Craigan comes in and yells, you four off the phones.
Speaker 2: We got a DNA hit in the database from Sophie
Speaker 2: cold hit. So it was a sample from an their
Speaker 2: body from five years ago. And that's another victim. And
Speaker 2: that was actually before he got smart and started dumping
Speaker 2: in the water. So he left this girl in an
Speaker 2: abandoned factory and since it was sloppy and not in
Speaker 2: the water, they're like, oh, maybe it's close to where
Speaker 2: he lives in Queens, And so they had some Queens.
Speaker 2: Stabler's telling Benson how he got nothing for the Twins party.
Speaker 3: Ha ha.
Speaker 1: The runner of the Twins party is going to end you, Lisa.
Speaker 1: You're gonna it's gonna drive you off a.
Speaker 3: Cliff because Benson's been with him the whole time, Like,
Speaker 3: of course she knows you didn't get anything for the party.
Speaker 3: You've been together. It's raining.
Speaker 2: They have giant folders like the Manila folders, and they
Speaker 2: go to meet two detectives.
Speaker 3: Eating at a diner. I love diners.
Speaker 2: They don't want to be helpful and they want to
Speaker 2: play games. And this woman is from OZ. If you
Speaker 2: are a big OZ person, she was like a correctional
Speaker 2: officer who raped all of the inmates.
Speaker 3: She was.
Speaker 2: An incredible actress at Kristin Rohade. She was like and
Speaker 2: sadly she did die in twenty sixteen at the age.
Speaker 3: Of fifty two. Oh my gosh, she's familiar to me. Yeah,
Speaker 3: she is great.
Speaker 2: You know, she was a New York actress, a lot
Speaker 2: of procedurals cop shows, but Oz. She was a serious
Speaker 2: regular and an incredibly evil character. So yeah, I can't
Speaker 2: wait till rewatch OZ. And Sailor's trying to be, you know,
Speaker 2: reason with the guys and be kind and like we
Speaker 2: need your help. And immediately these queens people are so defensive.
Speaker 2: They're like, oh, yeah, like we had information but kept
Speaker 2: it secret because we're lazy, That's what it is.
Speaker 3: And they're like, we have no time for this bullshit.
Speaker 2: Ventson, slams on the table, and gives a speech about
Speaker 2: being on like turfs and ticking clocks and help and like.
Speaker 3: We're tired, and to me, it's just like.
Speaker 2: How embarrassing, Like a girl is missing and you're like
Speaker 2: arguing about turf, Like.
Speaker 3: It's just so humility.
Speaker 2: Staylor's like, listen, you interviewed like two hundred people. We
Speaker 2: don't have time to interview all these people. Did anyone
Speaker 2: stick out? So they go through the files to give
Speaker 2: their favorite options, and they're like anyone with bad teeth?
Speaker 3: Like what's going on?
Speaker 2: So they pick three people that they think, you know,
Speaker 2: that they pinned for the dude. So they go meet
Speaker 2: one of the guys who's welding. He doesn't have a
Speaker 2: white van. He's like, I know why you're here, and
Speaker 2: it ain't me, bitch. And so then they go to
Speaker 2: the next place and it's Dawson's photo studio and to
Speaker 2: look for mister Mills, one of the you know guys
Speaker 2: in the folder and another guy's working there and he goes, oh, yeah,
Speaker 2: that guy works here, but he's not here today, and
Speaker 2: they're looking around. They go, oh, so you do school
Speaker 2: pictures and he goes, yep, school pictures are my bread
Speaker 2: and butter. And Clayton comes and does lights and helps,
Speaker 2: and then it clicks. The photo he has in his
Speaker 2: pocket of the dead girl has the same clouds background
Speaker 2: as the photo backdrop in the studio, and the guy
Speaker 2: confirms that he took this photo.
Speaker 3: Holy shit.
Speaker 2: He uses the school as a hunting ground. Finally a break,
Speaker 2: he rents the room from an old woman. So they
Speaker 2: rush to missus Rapaport's house. The guns in the air.
Speaker 2: You know, they're entering empty up, so guns, guns, guns.
Speaker 2: They see a purple blue and there's a party set up.
Speaker 3: It says Sophie.
Speaker 2: You know how, it says Sophie, and streamers it now,
Speaker 2: says Kirsten, and then the newspapers in the house.
Speaker 3: He saw it.
Speaker 2: He's on the move. Fuck, there's blood. The blood leads
Speaker 2: to a dead old woman. He killed Rappaport. So we
Speaker 2: cut back to the precinct where they all fill Kraigan
Speaker 2: and the neighbors say that she goes to Atlantic City
Speaker 2: a couple times a year, and that must be when
Speaker 2: he does the attacks because she usually goes for four days.
Speaker 2: But she lost all her money, so she came home
Speaker 2: early and he murdered her. Benson and Stablers start fighting,
Speaker 2: and he tells her to take a nap, and she says,
Speaker 2: screw you, and Daddy Craigan's like break it up.
Speaker 3: And so it's cute.
Speaker 2: And then he makes Benson go breathe the air, and
Speaker 2: he makes Elliott go talk to his wife. Kathy is
Speaker 2: there with the twins and you know, there's hugs. It's cute,
Speaker 2: and he sends them to Munch, who has pudding cups,
Speaker 2: and then Kathy and Stabler hug. He apologizes and of
Speaker 2: course she's handled everything for the party. The twins back
Speaker 2: and Munch for some reason gave the moldy old pudding
Speaker 2: that was fuzzy. Yeah, like that Bart really confused me too,
Speaker 2: I was like, what, like, I don't get that. The
Speaker 2: twins give Stabler a gift, a toothbrush and a fresh shirt.
Speaker 2: He hugs them so hard Benson calls. He goes after
Speaker 2: you know, he kisses Kathy and runs away as Kathy
Speaker 2: is holding the new shirt in the presence like he's
Speaker 2: not changing. He doesn't care if he stinks. He has
Speaker 2: to find this girl Saul. Finally, they like wanted to
Speaker 2: check back with Saul. They didn't trust him the PayPal guy,
Speaker 2: and what they figured out was he has a pawn shop,
Speaker 2: and he finally admitted that Clayton called him and said
Speaker 2: that like he needed money, but he was scared to
Speaker 2: go to the pawn shop. So they're gonna meet in
Speaker 2: a remote area to like do pawn shop activities, and
Speaker 2: so they decided to do a sting. So Saul's in
Speaker 2: the front seat of the van and Munch is sitting
Speaker 2: in the back and he goes, so, what does this
Speaker 2: guy got barbie dolls? And he said, oh no, he
Speaker 2: said there he knows an old lady with an attic
Speaker 2: full of antiques and jeweler and he sells it for her.
Speaker 2: And Munch is like, he murdered her, you idiot, And
Speaker 2: he's like, oh my god, I thought like, yeah, a thief,
Speaker 2: but not a kidnapping, raping killer. And Munch then threatens
Speaker 2: him and says, if you do anything to tip him off,
Speaker 2: you're going down for being an accomplice.
Speaker 3: And he's scared. He's like, what if he shoots me?
Speaker 2: And Monch she's like, I'll lift, but there are sharpshooters
Speaker 2: everywhere in swat teams, and then a white van pulls in,
Speaker 2: but Saul keeps like looking back at Munch and talking
Speaker 2: and Munch is like, shut up, motherfucker stop. If he
Speaker 2: sees you talking and looking, he's gonna know the white
Speaker 2: thing like sorry.
Speaker 1: It's like the same vibes as the lou Diamond Phillips
Speaker 1: episode where the guy it's like, shut up, stop fucking talking.
Speaker 1: All you have to do is sit there and pretend
Speaker 1: like you're doing your normal job.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 2: I was thinking of the train guy the whole time
Speaker 2: as well. Yeah, And so the guy in the white
Speaker 2: van is suspicious and he you know, they yell out
Speaker 2: the windows, but no one really moves. And then I
Speaker 2: think he like notices one of the Swat team people,
Speaker 2: so they're a bad at their jobs as well, and
Speaker 2: he starts backing up, but the cops are driving in
Speaker 2: and then he tries to drive forward.
Speaker 3: More cops.
Speaker 2: He's surrounded your toast, bro, so you know, freeze, freeze,
Speaker 2: get your hands up. They take him disgusting ass out
Speaker 2: of the van, slam him up against the wall, and
Speaker 2: arrest him and the girls in the back of the
Speaker 2: truck and she is alive, thank gone, and a princess dress.
Speaker 2: Stabler gets her and carries her out. She's gonna live,
Speaker 2: and then you know, our criminal gets put in a
Speaker 2: cop car. Now we're at Rikers and the client wants
Speaker 2: a deal. Now this lawyer's playing it, play Frank Deal.
Speaker 2: That's funny. So the client wants the deal and the
Speaker 2: lawyers played by Frank Deal. I wanted to say it
Speaker 2: again because it was really fun. So he's the FBI
Speaker 2: guy from Downloaded Child if you remember, Oh yes, yeah,
Speaker 2: he looks to child abuse images all day in the
Speaker 2: dark Web, and he's been in eight episodes as different characters.
Speaker 3: We love him.
Speaker 2: And Cabot says, your client rapes and kills children. The
Speaker 2: only deal he is getting is a free last meal.
Speaker 2: But he does have a bargaining chip. There's another dead
Speaker 2: girl that none of you know about, and the body
Speaker 2: was never recovered, and Cabot says, I don't care. I
Speaker 2: have four victims. I don't need a fifth one, so like,
Speaker 2: go fuck yourself. I'll get a death penalty with or without.
Speaker 2: And he says, well, I bet the mother would like
Speaker 2: some closure. So she's like, tell me the girl's name
Speaker 2: and he won't, but he says that she was his
Speaker 2: first victim, a perfect little princess, sweet as can be,
Speaker 2: and Cabot.
Speaker 1: So grows the way he talks to He's like that
Speaker 1: whisper talky voice and.
Speaker 3: Like, yeah, he's a creep We hate him.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, we do not love him. So Cabot says,
Speaker 2: give me her name, and he says, then take the
Speaker 2: death penalty off the table and I'll shout it from
Speaker 2: the rooftops. And he is really creepy. If you guys
Speaker 2: don't watch it and you do want to be creeped out,
Speaker 2: this is pretty creepy. Cabot asks her, you know, the boss,
Speaker 2: like the head guy for you know, can you approve
Speaker 2: the deal? And he's like, I'm a public servant and
Speaker 2: the public doesn't want this boil on the butt of
Speaker 2: humanity living to a ripe old age and the senior
Speaker 2: eightya guy is played by Jeffrey Jeffrey Demon dooman demon whatever.
Speaker 2: But he has one hundred and nineteen credits. I mean,
Speaker 2: he was in The Blob like so cool, like really
Speaker 2: acting for really decades. He's been in Billions most recently.
Speaker 2: He has very evil eyebrows. He was in The Walking
Speaker 2: Dead a lot of Dick Wolf and he played opposite
Speaker 2: Sara Jessica Parker.
Speaker 3: And divorced for like four or five episodes. As like
Speaker 3: a bad lawyer.
Speaker 2: So she's like, think of the mother, and he's like,
Speaker 2: I'm sure she wants him dead too, and Cabot's like, sure,
Speaker 2: but she wants to know where her baby is. And
Speaker 2: he retorts, well, what about all the mothers who want
Speaker 2: him dead and the city, even the protesters of the
Speaker 2: death penalty? You want him dead? You don't know what
Speaker 2: she says, So basically, Cabot then brings in Sophie's mom,
Speaker 2: and finally she decides to be helpful, and she convinces
Speaker 2: the man to help them find the body of the
Speaker 2: other girl. And the man is taking it in and
Speaker 2: she's like, I want him dead, but you've got to
Speaker 2: help this woman. To the dramatic music that leads us
Speaker 2: to like a winter deep grave. There's snow and he's
Speaker 2: in an orange jumpsuit and shackles. It's raining. Benson and
Speaker 2: Stale have umbrellas a little red shoe gets taken out
Speaker 2: of the hole. He nods, we found the body of
Speaker 2: the girl who was never found. And then it's Benson
Speaker 2: and Stabler waiting outside of a home like walk you know,
Speaker 2: waiting to walk up to deliver the news to the mother.
Speaker 2: The mom opens the door, and that's the end of
Speaker 2: the episode.
Speaker 3: A toughie. It is a toughy and they did a
Speaker 3: good job.
Speaker 2: Like this seems like obviously the crime is really horrific
Speaker 2: and it's about, you know, a terrible person. But I
Speaker 2: think this one also like how hard a life of
Speaker 2: the detectives are.
Speaker 1: Yes, yeah, even especially when someone is yeah, like moving
Speaker 1: fast like that and like they know that there's a
Speaker 1: timeline and yeah, and.
Speaker 3: Then having to deliver the news and sleeping and missing
Speaker 3: your kid's life. So it's a very like window into
Speaker 3: the world of a detective. So I appreciate that.
Speaker 1: Yeah, Like at one point Benson goes the only time
Speaker 1: I talk to those guys when I'm calling to cancel.
Speaker 1: It's like, yeah, that's you don't have a great social
Speaker 1: life now.
Speaker 3: So that was a fun one.
Speaker 2: I really don't want to know about the crime, but
Speaker 2: we will know about it.
Speaker 3: So see you after the break.
Speaker 1: And we're back to ruin your day with a horrific
Speaker 1: real crime. So this episode is based on a Scottish
Speaker 1: serial killer and pedophile named Robert Black. He had a
Speaker 1: lot of the classic stuff we see in serial killers.
Speaker 3: He was born out of wedlock. His mother gave him up.
Speaker 1: He had multiple foster parents who maybe allegedly beat him.
Speaker 1: He was a bedwetter. He went on to live in
Speaker 1: like care homes. When he was at one care home,
Speaker 1: he was molested there. He was obsessed with genitals, putting
Speaker 1: things up his ass. He was described as antisocial. Alone
Speaker 1: escalated quickly. I just want to I don't want to
Speaker 1: do like a whole this guy's whole fucking life. I
Speaker 1: just want to give you like a quick paragraph on
Speaker 1: this guy's life and then we move on to the crimes.
Speaker 2: I mean, you have not even talked for one whole
Speaker 2: minute and we're already putting things up an ass.
Speaker 3: Like it is wild.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, but because it's all very textbook. It's
Speaker 1: like I could go through it all, but you'd be like, yeah,
Speaker 1: Ted Bundy too. Yeah, Like it's all very textbook of
Speaker 1: what we see with a lot of these people, anti social, aloner,
Speaker 1: without a lot of friends, very unkempt, like gross, like
Speaker 1: not into showering, like bad hygiene, you know, like like
Speaker 1: nothing specific about bad teeth, but it talks about how
Speaker 1: gross he is many times in all my research that
Speaker 1: he like is not clean, you know.
Speaker 3: Interesting and so yeah, so it's embarrassing.
Speaker 1: In nineteen sixty three, a seven year old girl was
Speaker 1: playing alone in a park when Black lured her away
Speaker 1: with the promise of kittens, so right from the episode,
Speaker 1: and then he choked her unconscious and masturbate it over
Speaker 1: her body. But he did not kill her. He did
Speaker 1: not kill her. She was She lived, and he was
Speaker 1: arrested in charge with lude and libidinous behavior.
Speaker 3: I don't know, you know how they have like so
Speaker 3: many weird in the UK.
Speaker 1: It's always like you've been charged with Bobby dagging and
Speaker 1: you know, cookle shelling, Like you never know what the
Speaker 1: fuck they're talking about, Like that's what.
Speaker 3: He jerked off above a child? Lock him up.
Speaker 1: Yeah, well, here's what happened. He had a psych exam,
Speaker 1: and the psych exam suggested that this was an isolated
Speaker 1: incident and that he needed no treatment. Cool, so he
Speaker 1: just kept going about his day, probably just yeah, being gross.
Speaker 1: And in nineteen sixty six his landlords found out that
Speaker 1: he'd been molesting their nine year old granddaughter, but they
Speaker 1: just kicked him out and.
Speaker 3: Didn't call the police.
Speaker 1: Fucked up. Then in sixty seven, he moved in with
Speaker 1: a married couple and molested their six year old daughter,
Speaker 1: but they went to the police, thank god, and he
Speaker 1: did get a year in prison for that. So he
Speaker 1: goes to prison for a year for molesting the six
Speaker 1: year old girls. Not enough, I know, I know. And
Speaker 1: then in nineteen sixty eight he went back, he went
Speaker 1: back to London and started working odd jobs and building
Speaker 1: up a quite a large child sex abuse material collection.
Speaker 1: So he's like obsessed with, you know, child sex abuse material.
Speaker 1: So chronologically, his first murder that he committed was Jennifer Cardi.
Speaker 3: She was nine years old.
Speaker 1: He kidnapped, sexual assaulted, and murdered her in August of
Speaker 1: nineteen eighty one in northern Ireland, and she had just
Speaker 1: been biking to a friend's house. Her bike was found
Speaker 1: hidden under some leaves, and then her body was found
Speaker 1: six days later by some fishermen in a reservoir and
Speaker 1: she had been like drowned and strangled. So then his
Speaker 1: second but her murder is not attached to him until
Speaker 1: two thousand and nine. So then his second victim was
Speaker 1: almost a year later, in July of nineteen eighty two.
Speaker 1: She's eleven year old Susan Maxwell who's walking home from
Speaker 1: playing tennis and her body was found two weeks later
Speaker 1: by a truck driver and she had been bound and
Speaker 1: gagged with they say, sticking plaster and a lot of
Speaker 1: these articles because I'm reading articles that are from like
Speaker 1: Scottish and Irish and English publications, but I feel like
Speaker 1: that's duct tape to correct me if I'm wrong. My
Speaker 1: Brits and her underwear had been removed and folded beneath
Speaker 1: her head.
Speaker 3: And that's that she had been sexually assaulted.
Speaker 1: Because a couple of these victims were found so much
Speaker 1: later that the amount of decomp in their bodies unfortunately
Speaker 1: you couldn't tell that they were sexually assaulted, but like
Speaker 1: ninety nine percent chance they were. And Susan had been
Speaker 1: in blacks Van alive or dead for over twenty four
Speaker 1: hours while he finished his delivery route all around Scotland
Speaker 1: and then he ditched the body on his trip from
Speaker 1: Glasgow to London.
Speaker 3: And then so this is where it's similar to the episode.
Speaker 1: This guy is killing people all over the place, and
Speaker 1: in obviously on SPU they condense it just to the
Speaker 1: five boroughs, but that's why it's like hard to find him.
Speaker 3: And in this one it's like it's Glasgow.
Speaker 1: It's like all over the UK and honestly later other
Speaker 1: parts of Europe, but we'll get to that. Black's the
Speaker 1: second third victim, excuse me, is his youngest victim, who
Speaker 1: was five years old. Her name was Caroline Hogg. She
Speaker 1: went missing while playing outside of her house in Edinburgh,
Speaker 1: the suburbs of Edinburgh in eighty three, so almost a
Speaker 1: year later. So it's feeling like he's doing it once
Speaker 1: a year, kind of like how this guy in this
Speaker 1: episode was only doing it once or twice a year
Speaker 1: when he had like the opportunity. The search for Caroline
Speaker 1: was the largest in Scottish history at the time, so
Speaker 1: pretty huge. They had two thousand local volunteers, fifty members
Speaker 1: of the Royal Scots, few silliers, and her disappearance was
Speaker 1: all over the media and eyewitnesses had seen a sketchy
Speaker 1: man wearing glasses watching Caroline while she played. They also
Speaker 1: saw him followered when you're nearby fairground. Why no one
Speaker 1: said anything, I don't understand. And people saw them both
Speaker 1: sat on a bench chatting and him paying for her
Speaker 1: carousel ride and watching her ride it I need a
Speaker 1: shower anyway, and then they found her body about two
Speaker 1: weeks later in a ditch and cause of death could
Speaker 1: not be determined because of the extent of the decomposition
Speaker 1: as well, and the lack of clothing suggested a sexual
Speaker 1: nature to the crime.
Speaker 3: So the cops.
Speaker 1: Figured out pretty quickly that Susan and Caroline's murders were connected.
Speaker 1: And like I said, they didn't connect Jennifer's two thousand
Speaker 1: and nine, but they connected the first two and with
Speaker 1: the locations being far apart, they that made them think, oh,
Speaker 1: this must be a truck driver or someone who works,
Speaker 1: like you know, covering long distances for their living, and
Speaker 1: it's not it kind of works into their life that
Speaker 1: they're going from, like you know, country to country. So
Speaker 1: they connected these two girls because they were both likely
Speaker 1: sexually assaulted, they were both bound, and they were both
Speaker 1: wearing white ankle socks at the time that they were taken.
Speaker 1: So they quickly formed a task force and the guy
Speaker 1: who headed that up was a guy named Hector Clark.
Speaker 1: I think he actually just died last year, and he
Speaker 1: was an assistant Chief Constable from Northumbria who took over
Speaker 1: the investigation. So remember how I talked about in the
Speaker 1: Yorkshire Ripper case, how they had this like super old
Speaker 1: school analog system of getting tips, like they had paper cards,
Speaker 1: and everybody ridiculed them and was like, you guys fucked
Speaker 1: this up because they just had thousands and thousands of
Speaker 1: paper cards and they got ripped to shreds for it,
Speaker 1: like in the press. Hector Clark did not want to
Speaker 1: look like them, and so he was like, we're using
Speaker 1: computers this time. And so they formed a Holmes database
Speaker 1: that's Holmes that all the forces could use. And I
Speaker 1: guess it was like really pricey, but it's really good
Speaker 1: that they did it because many unsolved crimes that were
Speaker 1: totally unrelated to this one got solved because of all
Speaker 1: the information they were putting into the database about like suspects, vehicles,
Speaker 1: blah blah blah.
Speaker 3: So now it's March of nineteen eighty six.
Speaker 1: It's three years after Caroline Hogg's body is found and
Speaker 1: Sarah Jane Harper, aged ten, goes missing from a suburb
Speaker 1: in Leeds in England, and the police are looking for
Speaker 1: a white Ford van and they say that the suspect
Speaker 1: is possibly a balding, stocky white man who isn't Three
Speaker 1: weeks later, her body was found in a river seventy
Speaker 1: miles from where she went missing, and they determined that
Speaker 1: she had died between five and eight hours of her abduction.
Speaker 1: So like in the episode, like they said there obviously
Speaker 1: isn't the same thing with the.
Speaker 3: Picture day and the birthday day and then.
Speaker 1: The special day. But he does take a certain amount
Speaker 1: of time with them and then kill them pretty quickly.
Speaker 1: And her murderer, luckily, was very quickly linked to the
Speaker 1: murder of Maxwell and Hogg, like for this time period,
Speaker 1: and for like the amount of technology they had, which
Speaker 1: like even though they were using a computer, it's kind
Speaker 1: of like amazing that they were.
Speaker 3: They linked all these together so quickly.
Speaker 1: And it's probably why this guy did not end up
Speaker 1: being able to work for like more decades. And the
Speaker 1: man this was like a full on manhunt for this guy.
Speaker 1: It ended up being like almost a decade, and they
Speaker 1: ran checks on anyone with sexual assault charges within ten years,
Speaker 1: but Black had been busted in nineteen sixty seven, so
Speaker 1: his didn't pop because his only charge had been like
Speaker 1: you know, outside of that ten year thing.
Speaker 3: So then in nineteen.
Speaker 1: Eighty eight, the FBI, the old trust, the FBI shows
Speaker 1: up with George Wang probably and they profile this guy.
Speaker 1: They say that the killer would be between thirty and
Speaker 1: forty years old, a loner, looking a mess, not very educated,
Speaker 1: and they said that his motives for the killing is sexual.
Speaker 1: So it's like, well, the Yorkshire Ripper, it seemed like
Speaker 1: he just wanted to murder this man. It was the
Speaker 1: murder is just to get rid of the sexual, you know,
Speaker 1: assault that he had done. So he had a fixation
Speaker 1: on you know, child sex abuse material, kept momentos from
Speaker 1: his victims, and they also thought that.
Speaker 3: This is so horrible. They also just spoiler alert for
Speaker 3: how horrible this is.
Speaker 1: They also thought that he probably engaged in necrophilia and
Speaker 1: did stuff to the victim's bodies before he got rid
Speaker 1: of them. So in nineteen eighty eight, he tried to
Speaker 1: kidnap Teresa Thornhill, who was actually fifteen, but she was
Speaker 1: four foot eleven and very like petite, and that may
Speaker 1: have made him think that she was like younger than
Speaker 1: she was because fifteen's usually a little bit older than
Speaker 1: he goes for.
Speaker 3: And she was able to fight back and get away.
Speaker 1: She grabbed his balls that loosened up his grip and
Speaker 1: she was like struggling. She had just left her boyfriend
Speaker 1: and her boyfriend like was able to turn around and
Speaker 1: like see what was going on because she was struggling.
Speaker 3: So he came.
Speaker 1: She scratched as she was able to bite his arm
Speaker 1: like all this stuff. So Teresa Thornhill a badass. She
Speaker 1: gets away, but they do connect it to the same guy,
Speaker 1: like it's all connect So now in nineteen ninety, this
Speaker 1: is nine years after Jennifer Cardy, but eight years after
Speaker 1: his last note his first known victim, which was Susan Maxwell.
Speaker 1: A postal worker named David Hrkis was outside of his
Speaker 1: house saw a van grab his six year old neighbor.
Speaker 3: Just like it's like a movie.
Speaker 1: He said. He saw the van pull up and he
Speaker 1: saw the little girl like standing on the sidewalk and
Speaker 1: then he just saw her feet lift up off the
Speaker 1: sidewalk and like him pull her into the van. So
Speaker 1: he gets the van's plate number and calls the police immediately.
Speaker 3: This is wild.
Speaker 1: They arrived within six minutes, like everything's happening very quickly
Speaker 1: with this investigation. The police get there super quick. They're
Speaker 1: all figuring out what's going on. He's describing the van
Speaker 1: to the police and then he goes, that's it. There's
Speaker 1: the van, right there and they see the same van
Speaker 1: coming back through the village and.
Speaker 3: They stop the van. They arrest the driver.
Speaker 1: The missing girl's father is a cop, so he's there
Speaker 1: with all the other cops.
Speaker 3: He gets onto the.
Speaker 1: Van calling his daughter's name. They find her bound, gaged
Speaker 1: a hood over her head, inserted headfirst into a sleeping bag.
Speaker 3: The poor thing. But she's alive.
Speaker 1: But they said she would have died if she was
Speaker 1: in there like that for fifteen more minutes, she would
Speaker 1: have like suffocated. Unfortunately, even in that insanely quick amount
Speaker 1: of time twenty minutes, they said he was able to
Speaker 1: sexually assault her. He had taken her to a place
Speaker 1: and then he had taken a wrong turn and gone
Speaker 1: back through town and that's how they busted him. So
Speaker 1: this guy was it was a completely wrong turn that
Speaker 1: got him arrested and caught. And when they stopped him
Speaker 1: and they pulled the girl out of the car, the
Speaker 1: guy just like super bizarre response, but he said, quote,
Speaker 1: what a day it's been.
Speaker 3: It was a rush of blood.
Speaker 1: I've always liked young girls since I was a young kid,
Speaker 1: and I think it was a rush of blood is
Speaker 1: a phrase that they use over there to just say like, oh,
Speaker 1: it's something I did impulsively. But you know, then obviously
Speaker 1: they looked into this guy and it was not like
Speaker 1: a some of his It was, like we talked about
Speaker 1: in the episode, some of his kidnappings seem to be
Speaker 1: completely opportunistic, like he's just in a place where he
Speaker 1: sees a girl in a car with her mom going
Speaker 1: in to get cigarettes, and sometimes it was planned out.
Speaker 1: He found them, he lured them away, whatever he had,
Speaker 1: you know, a kitten or a puppy ready. So, but
Speaker 1: they did talk about in some of the articles I
Speaker 1: read how he was like an opportunistic killer. So he
Speaker 1: would sometimes describ people that he saw, and that might
Speaker 1: have been what got inbusted in this case. So a
Speaker 1: search of his van found you know, ropes, tape, hoodies,
Speaker 1: a polaroid camera, girl's clothing, a mattress, and it says
Speaker 1: a selection of sexual aids.
Speaker 3: I don't want to know what those are.
Speaker 1: So just for the abduction of this last girl in
Speaker 1: a town called Stow, they don't release her name, but
Speaker 1: the Stowe school girl they call her. Just for this,
Speaker 1: he gets life in prison. So then they try to
Speaker 1: just tie him to the other stuff while he's in
Speaker 1: prison for that. So in nineteen ninety four, like truly,
Speaker 1: thirteen years after his first known murder, he goes to
Speaker 1: trial for the murders of Maxwell Hogg and Harper and
Speaker 1: he's found guilty and on his way out of the courtroom,
Speaker 1: he turns to all the detectives who have been chasing
Speaker 1: him for like over a decade and say, tremendous, well
Speaker 1: done boys, that's what he says. So this man doesn't
Speaker 1: really get how to talk to people, I don't think
Speaker 1: or what's normal behavior. In two thousand and nine, he
Speaker 1: is tried and found guilty for the abduction, sexual assault,
Speaker 1: murder of Jennifer Cardy as I mentioned, And unlike this
Speaker 1: Siko in the episode, he never admitted to any of
Speaker 1: these murders. He never was like, yep, this is me.
Speaker 1: I love these girls and this is what I did.
Speaker 1: He just never he never had not guilty.
Speaker 2: He plaied not guilty, but then he said good job, boys,
Speaker 2: like you got me.
Speaker 3: So isn't that kind of a missions.
Speaker 1: Kind of yeah, kind of this is what I was reading.
Speaker 1: There's a guy named Ray Weier who was a big
Speaker 1: person in the field of treating sex offenders, and he
Speaker 1: interviewed Black many times between nineteen ninety and ninety three,
Speaker 1: and he says that it was all about control why
Speaker 1: he was not confessing, And Wyers said, quote, He's the
Speaker 1: sort of person for whom it's all about power and control.
Speaker 1: Having information about what he's done gives him power. He
Speaker 1: has no desire to ease his conscience, and he's not
Speaker 1: going to give up the one thing that gives him
Speaker 1: power over the pain that his victims' families are suffering.
Speaker 3: End quote.
Speaker 1: I did read that on Wikipedia, the Wikipedia about Robert Black.
Speaker 1: I think it's probably attributed to a book, as many
Speaker 1: things on Wikipedia are, but that is where I read it.
Speaker 3: And he ended up.
Speaker 1: Black ended up dying of a heart attack in jail
Speaker 1: in twenty sixteen, So he was in jail for over
Speaker 1: twenty years, and he was sixty eight when he died.
Speaker 1: And it is thought that he could be connected to
Speaker 1: a possible dozen other murders all over Europe, but none
Speaker 1: of it has been proven. Like there's murders in France,
Speaker 1: in Germany, Netherlands, Ireland, all kinds of places where they
Speaker 1: think that the crimes involve a white van or like
Speaker 1: the bodies are found in a similar fashion, so then
Speaker 1: we won't know I know, so fucked.
Speaker 2: But because when the cop was at the scene of
Speaker 2: the crime, did he know that his daughter was the
Speaker 2: one being taken?
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think so.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 1: And it's like a small town, so I mean, I
Speaker 1: guess the chance of someone being their dad being a
Speaker 1: cop is high.
Speaker 2: I don't know, just to have a thing on your
Speaker 2: head and being a sleeping bag has haunted me throughout
Speaker 2: this whole time we've been talking.
Speaker 3: I know, I know, I know, I know, but she
Speaker 3: did live. I don't know.
Speaker 1: I mean, how crazy that he even had the time
Speaker 1: to commit a crime like he just that's how like,
Speaker 1: you know, desperate this guy is. He doesn't even try
Speaker 1: to like get somewhere like far away where he won't
Speaker 1: get caught. He's just like I you know, like a
Speaker 1: true sick pedophile. You know.
Speaker 3: But listen, if they fucking kept him in jail earlier,
Speaker 3: all of these girls could be alive and not fucking traumatized.
Speaker 2: Like, yeah, it is so fucked up that he was
Speaker 2: jerking off on top of children and people are like, ah,
Speaker 2: he's fine, let him out.
Speaker 3: Yeah yeah, wellstaid just the year what the fuck?
Speaker 1: Yeah, The fact that we just didn't like, they just
Speaker 1: didn't consider like that these kind of crimes would lead
Speaker 1: to other crimes. And it's fucked up because it truly
Speaker 1: would have could have stopped.
Speaker 3: That's the thing.
Speaker 1: They were never going to put him in jail forever,
Speaker 1: and he would have kept doing it.
Speaker 3: You know. Yeah, I'm glad he's dead and I.
Speaker 1: Don't Yeah, Samesise, Okay, but we have a really amazing
Speaker 1: guest interview, so as always, we're excited to have that
Speaker 1: cleanse your palette.
Speaker 3: So don't go anywhere.
Speaker 1: Guys, We have an amazing guest this week. She is
Speaker 1: a prolific actor from both television and the Broadway stage.
Speaker 3: You may know.
Speaker 1: Her for her one of her most well known roles
Speaker 1: playing Terry Hatcher's daughter Julie Meyer on Desperate Housewives, and
Speaker 1: recently she started in a bunch of Lifetime movies, including Psycho,
Speaker 1: Sister in Law and the upcoming Hall Past Nightmare. But
Speaker 1: you knew her in today's episode as the adorable Sophie Douglas. Guys,
Speaker 1: listen to our amazing chat with Andrea Bowen. Thank you
Speaker 1: so much for talking to us today. This is like huge,
Speaker 1: I'm a huge Desperate Housewives fan. So I feel like
Speaker 1: I feel like I've known you since you were a teen,
Speaker 1: but I haven't. But you got into like the Dick
Speaker 1: Wolfe universe as like a baby. You were like five
Speaker 1: years old or something on the original, on an original
Speaker 1: Law and Order.
Speaker 4: Yeah, I did. I've done a total of three lawn
Speaker 4: orders in the Law and Order universe. The first one
Speaker 4: I did, I was either five or six. Uh, it
Speaker 4: was very early in my professional career. We'd just moved
Speaker 4: to New York. And it is not just me, It
Speaker 4: is me, my brother Cameron, my brother Alex, and my
Speaker 4: sister Jillian.
Speaker 3: Wow a family affair.
Speaker 4: Family affair. Yeah, we were all cast to play a
Speaker 4: family and I I don't know. I think our mom
Speaker 4: was I don't remember. There was some something of course
Speaker 4: happened and then we were we were grace stricken. And
Speaker 4: then I did another episode of Law and Order the
Speaker 4: original the following year, I think, or something like that.
Speaker 4: Really shortly after and that one, uh, maybe my mom
Speaker 4: was the victim of a carjacking. Something happened where she
Speaker 4: got shot, because I remember they had to put blood
Speaker 4: on me, they had to put brain stuff on me,
Speaker 4: brain matter, and and they showed me how they made it,
Speaker 4: and they told me I could eat it, and you know,
Speaker 4: all the fun memories of being on set as a kid.
Speaker 4: So by the time I did SVU, I had already done.
Speaker 4: I'd already I'd already paid some paid some dues for
Speaker 4: that SVU Or did you like I went to the
Speaker 4: whole audition process. I think that one too, because it
Speaker 4: was a larger, you know, guess star type of thing
Speaker 4: that they that they wanted to you know, see, they
Speaker 4: knew me from some work in the past, but I'd
Speaker 4: been a couple of years and they were like, let's
Speaker 4: see what you could do.
Speaker 3: Now.
Speaker 1: Well, it's like a very terrifying episode, but you're so
Speaker 1: adorable in it. You're like such a cute I mean,
Speaker 1: it makes it like more powerful that you're like so cute.
Speaker 1: You have such a like little voice and like such
Speaker 1: a little voice.
Speaker 4: Yeah, so funny, so funny to look back on now,
Speaker 4: I'm like, was I I was really that small and
Speaker 4: had that tiny of a little voice.
Speaker 2: And well, so watching it, the subject matter is intense
Speaker 2: and now you're talking about smlish brains and the blood
Speaker 2: and then in this episode you have to recount this
Speaker 2: horrific trauma so do they explain it to you in
Speaker 2: different ways? Did you know what you were saying? How
Speaker 2: do they kind of prep you for that being so little?
Speaker 4: So you know, look, I think in twenty twenty two,
Speaker 4: I would love to say that maybe the writers and
Speaker 4: or the production or the casting would have a hand
Speaker 4: in the way this information is distilled to younger people.
Speaker 4: I don't know if that is the case now, I
Speaker 4: would venture to say it is still not quite there.
Speaker 4: It really falls from my experience mostly on the parents
Speaker 4: and how they or maybe the agents, but usually it's
Speaker 4: it's the parents who who kind of figure out, like,
Speaker 4: how do we want to bro to this type of
Speaker 4: very serious subject matter with our children, and and it's
Speaker 4: kind of left there. So I would say, one, I'm
Speaker 4: very fortunate. I have incredible parents who were not only
Speaker 4: supportive of me getting into the arts, but also we're
Speaker 4: very protective and still really you know, valued putting my
Speaker 4: needs as a little one first, and so they kind
Speaker 4: of operated under the idea of just we'll only tell
Speaker 4: her what she needs to know, you know, like we
Speaker 4: don't need to go deeper into the trauma that this
Speaker 4: little girl experienced. We can talk about it in terms
Speaker 4: that Andrea at the age she's at might understand. So
Speaker 4: my character was obviously struggling with this horrible, horrifying, disgusting
Speaker 4: thing that happened to her. But what her main, if
Speaker 4: I remember correctly, what her main sort of fear was
Speaker 4: in the interview scenes, was that she broke this rule
Speaker 4: that her mom told her to not break, which was
Speaker 4: to you know, not talk to strangers or not, you know.
Speaker 4: And that's what I you know, remember my parents talking
Speaker 4: to me most about was you can relate to knowing,
Speaker 4: you know, when when what it feels like to be
Speaker 4: scared that your parent's going to be upset with you.
Speaker 4: And so we tried to keep it mostly on relatable
Speaker 4: terms in that sense and not go too deep into
Speaker 4: the scary trauma part. But but I did. I was aware,
Speaker 4: you know, of what was going on with this little
Speaker 4: with this little girl, and.
Speaker 1: Yeah, because it's like one of the only episodes I
Speaker 1: can recall, were like a little girl is like getting
Speaker 1: a pelvic exam, and I was just like, oh my god,
Speaker 1: like what did they even tell you you were doing?
Speaker 3: Yeah?
Speaker 4: Then you know, yeah, I know, I know, And I
Speaker 4: remember filming that. I remember lying on the you know,
Speaker 4: the hospital bed, and you know, everybody was really considerate,
Speaker 4: and I think everybody was a little bit on edge
Speaker 4: because of that. You know, I am now thirty two
Speaker 4: years old. I can only imagine being on a set
Speaker 4: and filming that with a ten year old or an
Speaker 4: eleven year old and feeling like, oh gosh, how do
Speaker 4: we do this and be sensitive? And you know, and
Speaker 4: what is this child understanding about what's happening to her?
Speaker 3: Yeah?
Speaker 4: It was such. It's a wonderful set to work. And
Speaker 4: I will say that. And I'm and they're very experienced
Speaker 4: with dealing with heinous crimes as we know, it's not
Speaker 4: in the actual like beginning of the Sculf, and so
Speaker 4: I'm sure they're really experienced with tiptoeing around things or
Speaker 4: trying to be very delicate with the way they handle things.
Speaker 3: Yeah, for sure. And so is your mom an actor?
Speaker 1: Like?
Speaker 2: How did how was it a huge family affair? How
Speaker 2: do you start young? I mean you were on Broadway
Speaker 2: at five years old? So how does that happen?
Speaker 4: My parents are not actors. They are artistic. My dad
Speaker 4: is a musician and my mom was a dancer and
Speaker 4: a performer. But no, they were out of the business.
Speaker 4: They had never done it professionally to that degree. Anyway,
Speaker 4: they pursued it, and they both had talents in those areas,
Speaker 4: but they were focused on other things. They were planning
Speaker 4: on raising They have six children. I'm the youngest, and
Speaker 4: they were planning on raising us in Columbus, Ohio. And
Speaker 4: then my older siblings all kind of line by line,
Speaker 4: started really falling in love with performing via local community
Speaker 4: theater and you know, children's theater programming in Columbus, Ohio.
Speaker 4: Nothing on a serious level, but they just didn't want
Speaker 4: to pursue anything else. They didn't want to do sports,
Speaker 4: they didn't want to do that. This is like what
Speaker 4: they wanted to do. And it just trickled down throughout
Speaker 4: the family. And then at some point someone after my
Speaker 4: two older siblings were in a production of Oliver. Still
Speaker 4: not in New York on that scale, but it was
Speaker 4: a touring production, and the older cast members said, well,
Speaker 4: you guys should be in New York if you want
Speaker 4: to do theater. And they planted this little seed in
Speaker 4: my older siblings' heads, and then that was it. They
Speaker 4: begged my parents. My parents said, well, drive, we could
Speaker 4: not afford six eight plane tickets. I guess it would
Speaker 4: have been. So we took a family road trip to
Speaker 4: New York, met with a manager who expressed interest in
Speaker 4: signing us all and my parents were like, this is
Speaker 4: moving too fast. We don't even know what we're doing.
Speaker 4: This seems crazy. We have a life, like what's going on?
Speaker 4: And so she agreed to send my siblings out on
Speaker 4: a couple of trial auditions so we could kind of
Speaker 4: get a sense of what that life would be like.
Speaker 4: And three of my siblings booked Broadway shows on that
Speaker 4: trip and we never went. We never went back to Ohio.
Speaker 4: I know it is. It is wild when I say it,
Speaker 4: I know.
Speaker 1: Okay, Well I have to jump in and tell you
Speaker 1: now that I'm also one of six kids.
Speaker 3: I am the oldest of six kids.
Speaker 4: I gosh, where the bookends.
Speaker 1: Yeah, And like in a million years, if I had
Speaker 1: told my mom I want to be an actor, she
Speaker 1: would have been like, great, wait until college.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I know, I know.
Speaker 1: Wow, that's so amazing that like they were so because like.
Speaker 4: They had no idea what they were getting themselves in.
Speaker 4: Then if they did, they would have said wait until college.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 1: I mean, I have two kids and I'm overwhelmed constantly,
Speaker 1: so I can't imagine six kids all trying to get
Speaker 1: into that business, all with like different auditions, different like strengths.
Speaker 1: And at that point too, it was wild.
Speaker 3: I mean it was.
Speaker 4: It was transitioning from Columbus, Ohio in a house that
Speaker 4: accommodated us all to a first two bedroom in Queens,
Speaker 4: but then a two bedroom in midtown Manhattan. You know,
Speaker 4: there were no home computers or cell phones. We had pagers.
Speaker 4: We'd have to like stop and call into a payphone
Speaker 4: to get all of our auditions for the day, and
Speaker 4: like run around, stick this kid on a subway, and
Speaker 4: stick that kid on a subway. And I mean, it's
Speaker 4: nuts when I think about it, And I don't know
Speaker 4: how we all did it. I don't know how they
Speaker 4: did it, but you know I watched that.
Speaker 1: I would watch that television show. Yeah, of like the
Speaker 1: Six Industry Kids.
Speaker 4: When we were little, we were approached by somebody, you know,
Speaker 4: before reality TV was really a thing about like pitching
Speaker 4: this idea to us of following us around town. And
Speaker 4: my parents were like, no way, dude, we're not doing that.
Speaker 3: Are how many of the siblings are still acting?
Speaker 4: Let me think about this. So I would say five
Speaker 4: of the six are still in the industry, and some
Speaker 4: fastt or another. A few of them went on to
Speaker 4: pursue music. Some of them are more kind of behind
Speaker 4: the scenes. My oldest brother is still in the broadway scene.
Speaker 4: He works a book of Mormon in New York. And
Speaker 4: then my other brother out here is still an actor
Speaker 4: and still professionally working. So five of the six of
Speaker 4: us have stayed in the arts realm.
Speaker 3: What does the other one do?
Speaker 4: Becoming a lawyer? All right, Yeah, she's in law school.
Speaker 1: Yeah she should become an entertainment lawyer and just rep
Speaker 1: all of you.
Speaker 4: Yeah, exactly right. She's actually been recently studying contract law.
Speaker 4: And I'm like, oh, I just consult you.
Speaker 2: I follow a TikTok person that's like I read the
Speaker 2: Fine Prince so you don't have to, and like she
Speaker 2: reads all this stuff and helps you understand.
Speaker 4: It's an angel. I mean, that is terrible. We none
Speaker 4: of us read it. We just immediately say accept or
Speaker 4: agree or whatever.
Speaker 2: Well, it's just so wild. But how are the other
Speaker 2: people in school? Did you still go to school? Was
Speaker 2: it an artsy school?
Speaker 3: Was ever? Like? How was that?
Speaker 2: Because sometimes you hear like Taylor Swifts and Christina Aguilera'd
Speaker 2: be like, I was bullied for my success.
Speaker 4: Yeah, right, So I was not bullied for my success.
Speaker 4: I did go to eventually, I went to We all
Speaker 4: went to PPAs, which is kind of a famous school
Speaker 4: in New York City. And I say famous, not because
Speaker 4: it's like this prestigious thing, famous because a lot of
Speaker 4: industry people went there, but it's a public school. It
Speaker 4: stands for Professional Performing Arts School. And then there's also PCs,
Speaker 4: which is a private performance art school.
Speaker 1: Which one of your parents was usually your more on
Speaker 1: set person. And who was with you at SPU Was
Speaker 1: it your mom or your dad? It was my mom?
Speaker 3: Your mom?
Speaker 1: Okay? And how did you like your on screen mom?
Speaker 1: And did your on screen did your regular mom feel
Speaker 1: threatened by your on screen I think.
Speaker 4: My sweet mom got very used to me having other
Speaker 4: moms pretty quickly, and she's wonderful. And my on screen
Speaker 4: mom is actually an actress named Debonair. I was named
Speaker 4: devon last name, Air, real name. I remember talking to
Speaker 4: her about that during filming because even though I was young,
Speaker 4: I had heard the word before, probably being a theater kid,
Speaker 4: things are described people are described as Debonair, you know,
Speaker 4: So I was like Hey, that's your name. She was
Speaker 4: also very pregnant and like actually pregnant, and it's kind
Speaker 4: of a fun story because so she was lovely, she
Speaker 4: was very sweet, and we had maybe two scenes together,
Speaker 4: but I always remembered her because she was so nice,
Speaker 4: she was so pregnant, and her name was Debonair. And
Speaker 4: then a million years later I went when I was
Speaker 4: in my early twenties, I went on an arts delegation
Speaker 4: trip to Israel with a an organization that I work with
Speaker 4: from time to time, and we went over to Israel
Speaker 4: to do arts advocacy work and have these meetings and
Speaker 4: talk to people there. And her husband was on this trip,
Speaker 4: who was an actor and a director named Rob Morrow.
Speaker 4: And I didn't know this. I didn't know they were,
Speaker 4: but he was talking about his wife, Devin at some
Speaker 4: point during the trip and I said, wait, do wo wait,
Speaker 4: wait is your wife Debonair? And he was like yes,
Speaker 4: And I was like, she played by mom on an
Speaker 4: episode of an owner like Cup forever ago and she
Speaker 4: was super pregnant with presumably your child.
Speaker 3: That is so funny. What a small world.
Speaker 4: Such a small world, I mean, it's like that. I'm
Speaker 4: sure you guys hear that all the time with law
Speaker 4: and order stories, because it's like everybody who lived in
Speaker 4: New York who was an actor has a law and
Speaker 4: order experience.
Speaker 2: Well, I was gonna say, I wonder if at this
Speaker 2: performing arts school, so many of the kids are like,
Speaker 2: I'm heading to Chelsea Pierce. Like, I'm sure all of
Speaker 2: you are just constantly trying to play a sad kid.
Speaker 4: I mean we did. That's the thing about when you're
Speaker 4: in a performing art school. You know, they're used to
Speaker 4: you having to leave for auditions, and some of them
Speaker 4: have strict rules against it, you know, which is kind
Speaker 4: of odd. I understand it. You don't want to compromise education,
Speaker 4: but at the same time, it's sort of odd when
Speaker 4: you're trying to get them to pursue it professionally and
Speaker 4: then you're like, no, no, no, no auditions for you. But
Speaker 4: we'd sometimes leave at lunch, and at least Chelsea Piers
Speaker 4: was in Midtown, so we could get over there really
Speaker 4: easily and be back in time to be in you know,
Speaker 4: science class or whatever.
Speaker 2: Obviously we got to ask Marishka Maloney iced tea munch,
Speaker 2: you know, I mean Belzer, I said, all their names,
Speaker 2: but who yeah, tell us some stories or what you
Speaker 2: remember with the main cast.
Speaker 4: So I definitely had the most interaction with Marishka, and
Speaker 4: she is so lovely and so gracious and giving and
Speaker 4: considerate and present and just wonderful. I would say. So
Speaker 4: by the time I did SVU, I'd been in the
Speaker 4: business for a while. I was primarily working in the
Speaker 4: Broadway community in theater. So you know, even though I'd
Speaker 4: had a couple of Law and Order experiences before, they
Speaker 4: were smaller than what this episode was. So I would
Speaker 4: say this was my first kind of chunkier role on TV,
Speaker 4: and it definitely was an inciting event in my life
Speaker 4: in that I realized I kind of wanted to bridge
Speaker 4: over into that world, which ultimately led to me moving
Speaker 4: to la and all that. And I do kind of
Speaker 4: attribute some of that to Marie. She goes demeanor and
Speaker 4: the way that she handled being the lead of a show,
Speaker 4: and the way that she respected the other cast members,
Speaker 4: and she was just so wonderful. I mean, I can
Speaker 4: just glow on and on about her because it really
Speaker 4: made a huge impact on me. And not only that,
Speaker 4: but while I was doing that episode of SVU, I
Speaker 4: was also in a Broadway show which was a musical
Speaker 4: based on the novel Jane Eyre. And so I was
Speaker 4: kind of splitting my time. I film during the day
Speaker 4: and then I'd have to go to the theater. And
Speaker 4: she came and saw me in the show, and she
Speaker 4: came backstage and she brought me this beautiful bouquet of flowers,
Speaker 4: and you know, I just think that really speaks to
Speaker 4: who she is. But also you have to imagine being
Speaker 4: a ten year old actress seeing an adult woman actress
Speaker 4: leading this show and handling herself that way and giving
Speaker 4: so much to me. It just really impacted me. And
Speaker 4: I just can't say enough wonderful things about her. I
Speaker 4: saw her years later at an award show. At some
Speaker 4: point over the years, like bumped into her, and you know,
Speaker 4: I went, I never go up to people because I'm
Speaker 4: just terribly awkward the way most of us are dealing
Speaker 4: with that, you know. But uh, but you know, I
Speaker 4: tapped her on the shoulder because I'm sure I was
Speaker 4: there for something with Esper House. I was, and I said,
Speaker 4: you know, I don't know if you remember me. I
Speaker 4: was a lot younger, but and she did, and she
Speaker 4: was so sweet, and she was like, oh my god,
Speaker 4: I can't get over you know, you're so much bigger,
Speaker 4: and you know, it's just great. But anyway, she's wonderful.
Speaker 4: So I would say that I have the most memories
Speaker 4: of what it was like working with her, and they
Speaker 4: have stuck with me my whole career.
Speaker 1: That's amazing that we hear only good things about her,
Speaker 1: and like everybody is so effusive about her, but this
Speaker 1: is the first time, like we've heard somebody be so
Speaker 1: affected by her as a kid, because like, I don't know,
Speaker 1: when you're a kid, I feel like you could just
Speaker 1: be like, oh, yeah, that lady was nice. Oh there
Speaker 1: are there girl cheeses today, like you know what I mean,
Speaker 1: Like yeah, And it's like, it's amazing to hear what.
Speaker 3: An impact she made on you and that she came
Speaker 3: to your play.
Speaker 1: I know we've heard also that she's a Broadway junkie,
Speaker 1: so I'm sure she just wanted to support you and
Speaker 1: check out another play.
Speaker 4: I know. I don't believe that, though. I think it's
Speaker 4: amazing that she came to see the show. And you know,
Speaker 4: my other cast mates in the show too, they were like, yeah.
Speaker 1: That must have been such a flex. You're like, I'm
Speaker 1: eleven and I'm friends with Marisha Ghari.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I just schedule wise is so wild. So you
Speaker 2: were a kid on set all day, then at a
Speaker 2: play at night, and then and just learning the lines
Speaker 2: and doing it.
Speaker 4: I know, I know it is. I sometimes think about
Speaker 4: my schedule between the ages of five to you know,
Speaker 4: I mean until, I mean really my whole life. But
Speaker 4: I will think about that those crucial years of when
Speaker 4: I was little, especially because I have a niece and
Speaker 4: a nephew now, and I I, you know, I just think, wow, like,
Speaker 4: what were we doing? What were we doing? I mean,
Speaker 4: they got for it. I'm super super grateful for all
Speaker 4: of that, but it is pretty wild when you think
Speaker 4: about it.
Speaker 1: So then, Lisa, I don't know if you have any
Speaker 1: more law and order, but I know.
Speaker 2: Well, let's go to Desperate So then you book Desperate Housewives,
Speaker 2: and then your whole family moves you and a parent
Speaker 2: you alone, and what happens You're a series regular at fourteen.
Speaker 4: Yeah. So the process to getting to Desperate Housewives was
Speaker 4: I had come out so right not too long after
Speaker 4: I think after that episode of SVU, the show that
Speaker 4: I was doing at the time in New York closed
Speaker 4: and for the first time since being a professional actor.
Speaker 4: Myself and my brother who I'd mentioned, the other one
Speaker 4: who is also on multiple law and orders, were not
Speaker 4: in shows during what was pilot season, and our manager
Speaker 4: was like, you got to go to LA. If you
Speaker 4: want to get into TV, you gotta go to LA.
Speaker 4: Just give it a whirl. So my dad brought my
Speaker 4: brother and I out and it was just the three
Speaker 4: of us and we came out for a pilot season
Speaker 4: and I got a show. It was not Desperate Housewives,
Speaker 4: but it was another ABC show, and that shot the
Speaker 4: pilot in Canada, went back to New York, was doing
Speaker 4: a workshop of a show. Show got picked up, great,
Speaker 4: moved the family out to LA. Everybody except for the
Speaker 4: two oldest siblings who were off now in college and working,
Speaker 4: and so moved the rest of us out. So four kids,
Speaker 4: two parents, two dogs out to LA. Show gets canceled.
Speaker 4: So then we're like, I know, what did we do?
Speaker 4: Kind of a naive decision, I guess. And then but
Speaker 4: then the following pilot season, Desperastives came along and so
Speaker 4: then got that and then had a good feeling that
Speaker 4: it would get picked up. We all kind of the
Speaker 4: whole cast talks about it during the pilot. We just
Speaker 4: sometimes you work on things and you're like, I have
Speaker 4: no idea, and you never know what this industry, you know,
Speaker 4: if something's going to go or not. That one felt different.
Speaker 4: It felt like this is gonna be this is gonna
Speaker 4: do something. We didn't know what it was gonna do.
Speaker 4: We didn't know it was gonna go on to be
Speaker 4: as successful as it was, of course, But but then
Speaker 4: that got picked up and ran for eight seasons and
Speaker 4: out in La I stayed.
Speaker 1: God, it was just like such a huge show I watched.
Speaker 1: It was like appointment television for me. I would like
Speaker 1: order food from this Vietnamese place every Sunday and like
Speaker 1: sit on my couch and watch that show. And I'm
Speaker 1: just wondering, like, so did you were you right away? Like,
Speaker 1: oh my god, I mean, I guess you'd been in
Speaker 1: the business for so long, but like that was the
Speaker 1: first like huge right, Like that show was like a
Speaker 1: big thing.
Speaker 4: Yeah, it was weird. I mean it was definitely weird
Speaker 4: and foreign, and like you said, I'd been in the
Speaker 4: business for a while. But as as I'm sure other
Speaker 4: people you've talked to since Lonard is such a new
Speaker 4: York concentrated thing. You know, the theater world is it
Speaker 4: operates very differently than television. And so even though I
Speaker 4: had been lucky enough to be a part of three
Speaker 4: Broadway shows at that point, this the scale of being
Speaker 4: on a television show show that is successful is just different.
Speaker 4: Oh and actually, now that I'm saying this to tie
Speaker 4: in these two things, I remember, I remember when we premiered.
Speaker 4: I think it was our it was either our first
Speaker 4: episode or our second episode. We didn't we we could not.
Speaker 4: No one could believe the ratings that we got in
Speaker 4: our first in our early episodes, because it was just uncommon.
Speaker 4: You have to find your footing, you know, even even
Speaker 4: shows that have a great first episode premiere, the numbers
Speaker 4: are still not you know, they're not like really breaking
Speaker 4: any records. They're still you're finding your audience and it's
Speaker 4: strong and it's great and it looks like we're going
Speaker 4: to go. But anyway, one of the things they said
Speaker 4: to us on set, they came to us at lunch
Speaker 4: we were filming, and they said, the numbers are in
Speaker 4: from last week's episode. You guys were number one for
Speaker 4: the week. And someone said, we beat Law and Order,
Speaker 4: And I don't know why they used that as the metric,
Speaker 4: but somebody yelled out, we beat law and orders, so
Speaker 4: that ties those two things together.
Speaker 3: So they probably always have had solid ratings. That's why
Speaker 3: it's been on for twenty million years now. That's so funny.
Speaker 1: Yeah, so wow, So how was I mean, how was
Speaker 1: having Terry Hatcher for your on screen mom?
Speaker 3: Uh?
Speaker 4: Wonderful? I really I really lucked out. I've I've lucked
Speaker 4: out consistently in the the women that I've worked with,
Speaker 4: and I've had a very I've had a very fortunate
Speaker 4: career in that from a young age, I was working
Speaker 4: with powerhouse women, leading shows, leading Broadway shows, leading you know,
Speaker 4: television shows, and then went on to be on a
Speaker 4: show for a long time that was dominated by women,
Speaker 4: which is rare, you know, and and really showed me
Speaker 4: kind of what was possible for me as an actor
Speaker 4: and just sort of, you know, formed the way that
Speaker 4: I operate in the industry and how I look at it.
Speaker 4: Terry's fantastic. We hit it off from from day one
Speaker 4: and and just you know, remain close to this day
Speaker 4: and I just think she's she's the best.
Speaker 1: I met her at a party like three years years
Speaker 1: ago and was like hello, Like I was like trying
Speaker 1: so hard to keep it together, but I was like,
Speaker 1: I've been watching you in so many things my entire life,
Speaker 1: and I was just.
Speaker 3: Like, oh, Hi, great to meet you. Hello. I feel
Speaker 3: like I don't think I could. I don't remember what
Speaker 3: we I think we talked about. I don't know we
Speaker 3: were talking about something for a little while. But she
Speaker 3: was super nice. And I can see she has like
Speaker 3: a warmth about her.
Speaker 1: Yeah, Like I think you can tell that on television
Speaker 1: and then it like translates in real life.
Speaker 4: Yeah, Like she's very warm, she is very funny, and
Speaker 4: she's just great. She's just great.
Speaker 1: Was there ever any sibling like rivalry or fighting over
Speaker 1: the fact that, like you guys were all in the
Speaker 1: same business.
Speaker 4: I would say there is. There was never any negative competition,
Speaker 4: okay between my siblings and I. We were each other's
Speaker 4: cheerleaders and each other's support system. I will say that
Speaker 4: I think I had a better shot at growing up
Speaker 4: and turning out hopefully fingers crossed semi sane because I
Speaker 4: had so many siblings and because I had a big
Speaker 4: family who kept me in line, you know, and so no,
Speaker 4: there really wasn't any of that of it. There was
Speaker 4: really just commiseration more, you know, when things didn't go
Speaker 4: our way. It was like nice to have a built
Speaker 4: in person who got it and and relate and also
Speaker 4: knew what it was like to do it as a kid.
Speaker 4: I know, people who grew up and started young and
Speaker 4: you know, had two parents but then just themselves, you know,
Speaker 4: And I always thought, God, that must have been weird.
Speaker 3: You know.
Speaker 4: It's like you need a little support system, and we had.
Speaker 4: We had a thriving support system within my own family,
Speaker 4: many members.
Speaker 2: You guys like run lines together and stuff and memorize
Speaker 2: and yeah, super cute.
Speaker 4: Yeah, we definitely did. We totally did and still do.
Speaker 3: Uh.
Speaker 4: My dad worked with us a lot. I would, you know,
Speaker 4: read lines with him a lot. And yeah, but my
Speaker 4: brother Cameron is I work with him all the time
Speaker 4: still when I get you know, an audition or I
Speaker 4: am about to film something and I want to do
Speaker 4: a little bit of like prep work on it. He's
Speaker 4: still somebody I go to.
Speaker 3: So that's amazing. So nice, I.
Speaker 4: Know, it does, it's it is nice.
Speaker 3: It's very nice.
Speaker 1: Yeah, my siblings and I all do completely different stuff.
Speaker 1: So I didn't even know what, but the there was
Speaker 1: always like great of overlap.
Speaker 3: Yeah, none of you overlap at all.
Speaker 4: Yeah, we all so interestingly, what's the age? What's the
Speaker 4: age between the first and the last.
Speaker 1: So it's like I'm nine years older than my oldest
Speaker 1: my youngest brother, it's the same. Yeah, we're like one
Speaker 1: two three, Me and my brother and sister are one
Speaker 1: two three, and then there's like five years and then
Speaker 1: twins and then the youngest.
Speaker 3: Wow.
Speaker 1: Okay, so my mom wanted to have more after she's psychotic.
Speaker 4: My mom too. I feel like once you start, once
Speaker 4: you pass four, it's like a drug.
Speaker 3: I don't know, it's like tattoos.
Speaker 1: Yeah, they just want to get more.
Speaker 4: Yeah, all six of us were born, Yeah in nine years,
Speaker 4: So my sister in eighty one and me and ninety.
Speaker 1: And she's like yeah, so I'm like more, I'm closer,
Speaker 1: I'm closer to your sister's age. And then you are
Speaker 1: a little bit younger than my youngest brother.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 1: Yeah, so crazy, But that's like, I what a cool Like,
Speaker 1: I mean, it is nice to hear about little kids
Speaker 1: that also are in the business and then grow up
Speaker 1: to be normal and not like totally crazy. And it
Speaker 1: sounds like your parents really had their heads on straight
Speaker 1: about the whole thing too.
Speaker 4: Yeah, I think they. I really think that they did
Speaker 4: a pretty remarkable job trying to create a safe and
Speaker 4: you know, I try not to use the word like normal,
Speaker 4: because what is that, right? What is normal but a
Speaker 4: safe and grounded family dynamic between all of us, even
Speaker 4: though our circumstances were a little extraordinary, though, it was
Speaker 4: like we had this weird dichotomy happening all the time
Speaker 4: where it was like at home it was just very
Speaker 4: much your regular family, except for the fact that there
Speaker 4: were so many kids and no rooms to be in.
Speaker 4: But then outside of our apartment, there was so much
Speaker 4: going on all the time, and somehow they struck a
Speaker 4: very nice balance between us all and we are all
Speaker 4: very close and yeah.
Speaker 3: So great. What's coming up?
Speaker 2: Is there anything that we should look out for, something
Speaker 2: you'd like to tell our listeners to watch?
Speaker 4: Sure, So I just finished filming a I guess it
Speaker 4: would be a thriller for Lifetime, And I think there's
Speaker 4: a probably a crossover audience between Law and Order fans
Speaker 4: and Lifetime movie fans. Oh yeah, and so maybe that'll
Speaker 4: be of interest. And I don't know, when it's going
Speaker 4: to air. I believe it will be this year, sometime
Speaker 4: over the next few months. It was directed by Marla Sokoloff,
Speaker 4: who I, oh, I don't know if she was on
Speaker 4: Law and Order. I would guess she was at some point.
Speaker 1: Well, she was on the Practice, so I like another
Speaker 1: law show.
Speaker 3: But yeah, and she was like the bad girl on
Speaker 3: Full House.
Speaker 4: Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, she's had so much attitude forgot
Speaker 4: about that. I know her, She's so great and and
Speaker 4: we had the best time working together and also talking
Speaker 4: about like growing up in this business and then you know,
Speaker 4: branching off to do other things, and so we had
Speaker 4: a lot of fun. We filmed that I guess in
Speaker 4: late May into June, and so that should be out
Speaker 4: sometime soon.
Speaker 3: And what did you say that was called?
Speaker 4: I think so they always have like a working title
Speaker 4: and then they have what they eventually become named as.
Speaker 4: And I think I think it's they're cementing it as
Speaker 4: d Hall Past Nightmare.
Speaker 3: Hall Past Nightmare.
Speaker 1: Is this about somebody getting to have sex with their
Speaker 1: hall Pass?
Speaker 4: It would be me yeah, oh, kind of scandalous for lifetime,
Speaker 4: A little racy, I.
Speaker 3: Know, like very indecent proposal. For the lifetime. I love that.
Speaker 4: Yeah, so we had a good time.
Speaker 3: That's amazing.
Speaker 1: Yeah, so I saw like you've been doing some lifetime stuff.
Speaker 1: Do you do Hallmark stuff as well?
Speaker 3: I did one.
Speaker 4: I did one in my early twenties or maybe when
Speaker 4: I was nineteen nineteen or twenty, and I played a
Speaker 4: paraplegia a girl who was a professional horse rider and
Speaker 4: got bucked off her horse and became a paraplegic, but
Speaker 4: then through equine therapy and romance, she was able to
Speaker 4: learn to walk again.
Speaker 1: I was able to walk again. Yeah, oh my god. Yeah,
Speaker 1: the power of.
Speaker 3: Oh I love it. I know. Well, I cannot wait
Speaker 3: to see hall Past night Mare. Thank you. Sounds amazing.
Speaker 4: My grandma too. But then I told her, I was like,
Speaker 4: there might be some parts you have to like not watch.
Speaker 4: She was like at the lifetime and I.
Speaker 3: Was like, yeah, I know, but maybe a yeah.
Speaker 1: A lifetime is it's lifetime in twenty twenty two, grandma, exactly.
Speaker 3: They got to keep up with the time.
Speaker 4: That's right, that's right.
Speaker 3: Well, thank you so much for Lisa. I don't know,
Speaker 3: do you have any lasts? This is very fun. No,
Speaker 3: I had a great time.
Speaker 2: Well, I was just going to say I did see
Speaker 2: that you were on King of the Hill, and what
Speaker 2: a great show, and that's so cool to be a cartoon.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I did. I was.
Speaker 4: That was great. That was fun because once you're in
Speaker 4: that world, you kind of just are I don't want
Speaker 4: to say a pitch hitter because that sounds like I'm
Speaker 4: really like singing tooting my own horn. But I mean
Speaker 4: you're just brought in when they need, you know, people
Speaker 4: to come in to play a teenage boye or to
Speaker 4: play a young woman's voice, or to pay you know,
Speaker 4: a boys like whatever. And so I got I got
Speaker 4: into that show. I forget what the first episode I did.
Speaker 4: But then they you know, call every now and again
Speaker 4: and then pop in and do to you. And that
Speaker 4: is one of the shows where the few shows that
Speaker 4: where they used to record everybody kind of at the
Speaker 4: same time, so you'd be actually in the studio as
Speaker 4: opposed to just being by yourself and in your own Lindes.
Speaker 4: You would get to be with other people in your
Speaker 4: scene and it was such an amazing cast that it
Speaker 4: was always so fun.
Speaker 3: That's cool.
Speaker 1: I wonder if that's like why like a secret to
Speaker 1: why it's so been so successful. And why people love
Speaker 1: it so much is like there's actual like chemistry going
Speaker 1: on between the people.
Speaker 4: It could be, it could be. It definitely feels more
Speaker 4: like a play or a lot, you know, a live
Speaker 4: performance than than because I mean, I love the animated
Speaker 4: world and I've been lucky enough to do a lot
Speaker 4: of voice work throughout my career. There's always a difference
Speaker 4: when you're getting to read with the person who's in
Speaker 4: the scene with you and then when you're just alone
Speaker 4: imagining kind of what they might be doing. So it
Speaker 4: probably is part of why it's such a special show.
Speaker 3: Yeah, well this was amazing. I'm so excited we got
Speaker 3: to talk to you.
Speaker 2: Yeah, this is one of the episodes we've been dying
Speaker 2: to do since we started the pod. It's a favorite
Speaker 2: of ours. It's like scary and so thrilling. Oh caro,
Speaker 2: we did not Is it your little hand in the
Speaker 2: beginning with the car? Yeah, did they put you under
Speaker 2: the car?
Speaker 4: It's not my hand. Oh, it is not my hand.
Speaker 4: I don't know whose little hand that is. Unlast I'm crazy.
Speaker 4: I'm gonna have to ask my mom because she would remember,
Speaker 4: but I am pretty sure that I that they were.
Speaker 4: It was on this sheet to film a certain day
Speaker 4: and we didn't get to it, and they were like,
Speaker 4: we'll just we'll just pick it up sometime.
Speaker 1: I grabbed it like from maybe some other kid from
Speaker 1: like about like because I was like, you know, to
Speaker 1: have you there for a full shooting day or night
Speaker 1: or whatever in cold New York just for your little
Speaker 1: hand to pop up.
Speaker 4: I know, but it's pretty tragic when you see that
Speaker 4: little hand.
Speaker 1: Oh, Liza, that was my most important question. I'm really
Speaker 1: glad you did not let me forget it. Thank you, Kara,
Speaker 1: always have your back.
Speaker 3: Thank you so much. This was awesome. Yeah, so impressive. Wow,
Speaker 3: she's so fun, she's cool.
Speaker 2: I mean, to find a family who hasn't been fucked
Speaker 2: up from child acting, that's I know. I'm happy for her,
Speaker 2: her family, the choices they've made.
Speaker 3: He's like, she's really crushing it.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, for sure.
Speaker 3: To be Broadway. I mean, she could be Leah Michelle
Speaker 3: style bitch, and she chose not to, and she chose
Speaker 3: she chose kindness.
Speaker 1: This episode is a I don't know why I like
Speaker 1: it or like call it a classic, but it really is.
Speaker 2: And I guess what I've learned is you have to
Speaker 2: look at every license plate forever or Marishka Hargatay will
Speaker 2: be pissed.
Speaker 1: You know what's crazy is I used to like memorize
Speaker 1: license plates all the time, thinking if that, if that
Speaker 1: does something in a crime, I'm gonna remember. And I
Speaker 1: would like make little mnamonic devices being like cats love
Speaker 1: food CLF like that was like the license plate, you know,
Speaker 1: like and I would always try to remember them all
Speaker 1: the time, like when I was like a like a preteen,
Speaker 1: like like just thinking of all the crime shows i'd watch.
Speaker 1: I'd be like, I'm going to be the witness that
Speaker 1: remembers that license plate number. Guess what, I don't even
Speaker 1: I don't even know my own license plate number right now.
Speaker 3: I think I could tell you the first two digits.
Speaker 2: We were driving through Pennsylvania from Western New York so
Speaker 2: togain back into the city, and we passed the crime
Speaker 2: scene in the woods. WHOA, there was like detectives in
Speaker 2: suits and then there was someone with a CSU tank
Speaker 2: to like a crime scene investigation CSI. There was like
Speaker 2: people in CSI T shirts suits and they were on
Speaker 2: the edge of the highway like into the woods in Pennsylvania.
Speaker 1: So damn, I wonder what they found.
Speaker 2: I know, right, we were trying to google and stuff,
Speaker 2: but it seemed like an active investigation, so like we
Speaker 2: couldn't find anything in the news, so I don't know.
Speaker 3: Wow, wow, wow, wow wow, that's exciting, and he is
Speaker 3: it's sad.
Speaker 2: And then oh, you posted this and I didn't even
Speaker 2: see until then, but my friend Marie Fauston went viral
Speaker 2: with that SVU video so funny, and he gave her
Speaker 2: a T shirt. I don't know if you saw, but
Speaker 2: he brought her merch. But she said she cannot date
Speaker 2: a cop. That there's absolutely no way. Yeah, she's so funny.
Speaker 2: That video is so funny. So many of you have
Speaker 2: sent us that video of the girl who goes on
Speaker 2: a date with a detective and mentions like SBU and stuff,
Speaker 2: and well, because I asked for a photo and she's like, no, no,
Speaker 2: I met him in the wild. I don't have any
Speaker 2: any photos of him.
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, she met him out in the world. But
Speaker 3: he tricked her because he smelled good.
Speaker 2: She said, yeah, so I saw her last night, got
Speaker 2: the scoop. But she is she will not be dating.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I understand that.
Speaker 2: Yeah, but my sister sent me her video too. Everyone
Speaker 2: was saying, it's like fun, yeah.
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah yeah.
Speaker 1: Anyway, do we have any takeaways postmortem for the episode countdown?
Speaker 1: There's not me. It's not really the kind of episode
Speaker 1: where you learn anything that you did not already.
Speaker 2: Puppies puppies, Yeah, I mean you teach puppies are the
Speaker 2: new candy.
Speaker 3: Yeah, don't let kids get lured away.
Speaker 2: Don eat candy corn only. Also, who is taking child photos?
Speaker 2: Let's double check them, triple check them. Let's get surveillance
Speaker 2: on anyone that does school photos. Yeah, for it's going
Speaker 2: to be a pedophile in every district. I can't imagine
Speaker 2: who else is doing school photos.
Speaker 1: Well, people who do photography and need to pay their.
Speaker 2: Bills and pedophile. This is how I feel about. You know,
Speaker 2: it's like the step parent thing. It's not fair of me.
Speaker 2: But if you're a step parent and you're a man,
Speaker 2: I assume you're doing it to get to the child.
Speaker 2: She's joking's.
Speaker 3: I ain't joking, bitch.
Speaker 1: And I ain't joking.
Speaker 3: All right.
Speaker 1: That is a perfect segue into this week's what would
Speaker 1: Sister peg do? You know, it's interesting that we're talking
Speaker 1: about puppies and stuff like that, because for this week's
Speaker 1: what would Sister Peg Do, which is our weekly segment
Speaker 1: where we talk to you guys, give you as an article,
Speaker 1: a organization, something that a book, something that can help
Speaker 1: you flesh out a little bit more about what you
Speaker 1: learned or saw in this week's episode or what we
Speaker 1: talked about. A lot of people rely, like so heavily
Speaker 1: on stranger danger, but there's like so many other ways
Speaker 1: of protecting your kids against child predators.
Speaker 3: And I just I found this.
Speaker 1: Uh there's this website called very well Family dot com
Speaker 1: and it's just like a bunch of like nurses and
Speaker 1: doctors and people that get together and talk about parenting
Speaker 1: stuff and write articles about parenting stuff and everything's like,
Speaker 1: you know, seems like fact checked and legit to me.
Speaker 1: So this article that I found there was written by
Speaker 1: Catherine Lee, and it's called Protecting against Child Predators and
Speaker 1: it just had some interesting ways on how to educate
Speaker 1: your kids against child predators, like teaching your kids how
Speaker 1: to say no and instead of focusing on full stranger danger,
Speaker 1: knowing that there's all like so many kids are often
Speaker 1: victimized by people that they do know, So it's not
Speaker 1: necessarily even though in this episode, you know there it
Speaker 1: was full stranger danger.
Speaker 2: Well did you see the most recent snatching by the way,
Speaker 2: on the internet. There was like a girl playing outside
Speaker 2: her house and some guy tried to snatch her and
Speaker 2: she like kept like she fought him off, got caught
Speaker 2: on the ring camera.
Speaker 3: I love that.
Speaker 1: Good girl.
Speaker 3: Good.
Speaker 1: We got to teach our kid y, yeah, we got
Speaker 1: to teach our kids. So anyway, this is You can
Speaker 1: check out the website very well family dot com. Their
Speaker 1: parenting articles are all medically reviewed and the link to
Speaker 1: the actual article will of course be in our show
Speaker 1: notes and in our stories, and all of our what
Speaker 1: Sister pegdew stories are saved in a highlight on our
Speaker 1: Instagram called wwspd if you ever want to check out
Speaker 1: the resources that we recommend.
Speaker 3: Thank you so much for that, Kara. We need to
Speaker 3: protect our children.
Speaker 2: And next week the episode will be Rhodium Nights, Season thirteen,
Speaker 2: Episode twenty three. We're jazzed as fuck and so happy
Speaker 2: that you guys listen, and we'll see you soon next week.
Speaker 3: Come see us on tour and we love you guys.
Speaker 3: We'll see you next week. Bye. Messed Up is an
Speaker 3: exactly right production.
Speaker 1: If you have compliments you'd like to give us or
Speaker 1: episodes you'd like us to cover. Shoot us an email
Speaker 1: at That's Messed uppod at gmail dot com.
Speaker 2: Follow the podcast on Instagram at That's Messed Up Pod
Speaker 2: and on Twitter at Messed Up Pod, and follow us
Speaker 2: personally at Kara Klank and.
Speaker 3: At glitter Cheese.
Speaker 1: As always, please see our show notes for sources and
Speaker 1: more information.
Speaker 3: Thank you so much to our producer Kacy O'Brien.
Speaker 1: And to our mixer John Bradley and our guest booker
Speaker 1: Patrick Cottner, and to.
Speaker 2: Henry Kaperski for our theme song and Carly gen Andrews.
Speaker 3: For our artwork.
Speaker 1: Thank you to our executive producers Georgia hard Start, Karen Kilgareff,
Speaker 1: Daniel Kramer, and everybody at Exactly Right Media.
Speaker 3: Dut dun