Speaker 1: Pushkin Today Unbroken Record the One and only Bootsy Collins.
Speaker 1: Bootsy first exploded onto the scene in the early seventies
Speaker 1: as James Brown's young, electrifying bass player, but it was
Speaker 1: with Parliament Funkadelic that Bootsy truly found his voice or voices,
Speaker 1: balancing raw funk with a psychedelic, intergalactic persona that would
Speaker 1: inspire everyone from Prince to Thundercat. In today's conversation, Bootsy
Speaker 1: talks about learning to navigate life as both William Collins,
Speaker 1: the introspective, spiritually grounded man from Cincinnati and Bootsy the
Speaker 1: Ryanstone rimmed avatar of groove. He also reflects on his
Speaker 1: writing partnership with George Clinton and keyboard wizard Bernie Warrel
Speaker 1: and how the three of them cooked up some of
Speaker 1: the most joyful and mind bending music in American history.
Speaker 1: Even now, more than fifty years into his career, mains
Speaker 1: on the vanguard, embracing new technology, collaborating with young artists,
Speaker 1: and continuing to spread the one with his new record
Speaker 1: album of the Year, Number one funk Teer. This is
Speaker 1: Broken Record, real musicians, real conversations.
Speaker 2: Here's my conversation with Bootsy Collins. So hopefully I can
Speaker 2: answer hopefully.
Speaker 1: I mean, look, I try not to, you know, I
Speaker 1: try to have a more conversational stop so I trying
Speaker 1: to have.
Speaker 2: Notes with me with you. I'm like, oh my gosh,
Speaker 2: too much. It's gonna it's gonna be flowing.
Speaker 1: I don't know how you keep track of your life, man,
Speaker 1: Actually I don't.
Speaker 2: It just happens, man, you know, I just let it go.
Speaker 2: Just let it go, just let it go, let it flow. Yeah.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's uh, it's got to feel like one short blur, right,
Speaker 1: not even long in a way, right, Like it's like.
Speaker 2: It's you know, just you know, I got to the
Speaker 2: point where it's just all about you know, just watching observing,
Speaker 2: you know, because it's a lot of time in there
Speaker 2: that you know has been passed. And the onlyess way
Speaker 2: I can learn is just watch and observe and then
Speaker 2: try things. You know, Otherwise, you know, you know, you're
Speaker 2: not staying with the time. And I don't have to
Speaker 2: try to stay with the time because I watch it,
Speaker 2: you know, observe it and learn from it, you know,
Speaker 2: not scared of it. Yeah, you know, because a lot
Speaker 2: of people get get scared when they start getting up
Speaker 2: in the age thing.
Speaker 1: And yeah, you know, but when you were young, you
Speaker 1: weren't even trying to know, trying to fit.
Speaker 2: In invincible man. I mean when you were young.
Speaker 1: Even, it was like you're looking for what's this one
Speaker 1: doing or that one doing?
Speaker 2: Yeah? I know that it never ends, man, you know,
Speaker 2: but come to find out, you know, it's sometimes to
Speaker 2: do you know, that that kind of surge that you have,
Speaker 2: it kind of ends and then you're like, what do
Speaker 2: I do? Now? Wow? What what's what surge is that? Well,
Speaker 2: it's that the young surge that we all have, you know,
Speaker 2: coming up, and we always think that it'll always be that.
Speaker 2: You know, you work with that and it's always going
Speaker 2: to be that. Yeah, but it don't work out like that.
Speaker 2: You know, you got you got a certain time. I
Speaker 2: hope you recording that you got a certain time you
Speaker 2: know to get through that one due to get through
Speaker 2: that portal, you know, and if if you don't get
Speaker 2: through it at that time, then you're a little more lost,
Speaker 2: you know. I just happen to try to stay open
Speaker 2: to what the universe is saying and what it's doing.
Speaker 2: And the only reason I can watch and observe is
Speaker 2: I know too, you know, to you know, to grab
Speaker 2: hold of it and let it be yeah, you know, yeah,
Speaker 2: because you know if you don't let it do its thing,
Speaker 2: it's gonna it's gonna come back to get you. Yeah,
Speaker 2: you know, So that's what I try to do.
Speaker 1: You know, how do you try to counteract the losing
Speaker 1: the surge or not having that surge?
Speaker 2: You don't, I mean, because you know you have to.
Speaker 2: Well for me, I mean, most people try to stop
Speaker 2: it and try to do this, that and the other,
Speaker 2: but I know that don't work. Yeah. Yeah, It's like
Speaker 2: it's gonna happen, and you know, you just try to
Speaker 2: get prepared for it. You know, there's really no way
Speaker 2: to be prepared. It's just you just have to look
Speaker 2: out for it and stay open minded. You know. It's
Speaker 2: like playing piano was one thing, and then when the
Speaker 2: era said, okay, synthesizers are coming in, being a piano player,
Speaker 2: you don't want to hear nothing about no synthesizer. You know,
Speaker 2: this is what I play piano, Acoustic piano. It's beautiful,
Speaker 2: you know, but here's a sensitizer that does this, It
Speaker 2: does that, it does this, and then you have to
Speaker 2: make up your mind whether you're gonna go with something
Speaker 2: new or stay with what you know, you know, and
Speaker 2: a lot of people had problems with that. Bernie Warrell,
Speaker 2: on the other hand, he had no I mean that's
Speaker 2: what he grew up on, was piano and orgon, you know,
Speaker 2: and so when these synthesizers came in, he was, you know,
Speaker 2: supposed to not have a clue, you know. Uh, And
Speaker 2: that's scary, that's scary for you know, for musicians to
Speaker 2: run into a wall where Okay, I got to decide what,
Speaker 2: you know, what I want to do, you know, because
Speaker 2: my way of living is in jeopardy now because you know,
Speaker 2: if I don't jump on that, don't nobody know that
Speaker 2: that's gonna work. I mean, this is a beginning, you know,
Speaker 2: the acoustic has already been established, you know, so you
Speaker 2: have to make your mind up to either be a
Speaker 2: part of the future or stay with the past where
Speaker 2: you used to. And we've always been blessed with both,
Speaker 2: you know, the past and the future. And for me,
Speaker 2: you know, that works best. If you can't accept what's
Speaker 2: getting ready to change, and you know it's getting ready
Speaker 2: to change, you know, then you're gonna get stuck. You know. Drummers,
Speaker 2: you know, they were like you know, they was like
Speaker 2: spellbound when the drum machines come in. It's like the
Speaker 2: drum machines start taking over gigs, you know. And then
Speaker 2: Prince made them famous.
Speaker 1: You know.
Speaker 2: It's like that kick draw man. You can feel. I
Speaker 2: mean you can you can walk in the club nowhere.
Speaker 2: You know, you can come in anywhere. You'll feel that.
Speaker 2: And so everybody wanted to change, you know, but drummers
Speaker 2: was upset. You know. For me, you know, it's like
Speaker 2: you should be you know, all you got to do
Speaker 2: is shift you're thinking, you know, because it's like you
Speaker 2: can play live drums and learn something new, what's happening today,
Speaker 2: you know. But a lot of them casts was like
Speaker 2: so mad, and they was like, you know, you should
Speaker 2: be mad too. I'm like, you know, I mean, you know,
Speaker 2: I play bass, I play guitar, I played drums, I
Speaker 2: mean you know, and I also learned how to program
Speaker 2: the lend drum. I got one, you know. And so
Speaker 2: if you don't stay up with the time, the time
Speaker 2: ain't gonna be good to you, you know. So you know,
Speaker 2: I try to stay up, you know, hang with the
Speaker 2: the new generation, the new era of musicians as well
Speaker 2: as the old, you know. And the key is not
Speaker 2: trying to not try to change nobody's thinking. You know,
Speaker 2: they have to make that up themselves, you know. And
Speaker 2: I think that's why I have a good rapport with everybody,
Speaker 2: because I'm not trying to change nobody. You know. This
Speaker 2: is just the way I came up, and it's the
Speaker 2: way I got the you know. But you know, if
Speaker 2: you see something you like, you're welcome to it. You know.
Speaker 2: If you don't, I'm cool with it. You know.
Speaker 1: Do you spend a lot of time listening to new
Speaker 1: music or any amount of you're listening time listening to
Speaker 1: anything new?
Speaker 2: Every since day one? You know, Day one, I was
Speaker 2: listening because I didn't have nothing in there, you know
Speaker 2: that I thought, you know, it's like I'm learning, you know,
Speaker 2: I got to learn how to play, you know. But
Speaker 2: my brother, Catfish, he was like playing guitar and he
Speaker 2: was like eight years older than I. So I start
Speaker 2: to want to be what he is, you know, And
Speaker 2: that's what kicked my whole thing off, you know, not
Speaker 2: having a father in the house, but having an older
Speaker 2: brother that I really wanted to be like. I didn't
Speaker 2: want to be like my dad because what I had
Speaker 2: heard he was a womanizer, alcohol all, you know, and
Speaker 2: all that, which I could have been, you know, because
Speaker 2: that's the way I started, you know. And so my brother,
Speaker 2: on the other hand, he was somebody that I admired.
Speaker 2: You know. They had to close, you know, they had
Speaker 2: the processes, you know. I mean it was during that
Speaker 2: era that was like, you know, we didn't know who
Speaker 2: we were yet, but we knew something was getting ready
Speaker 2: to happen big, you know, and and so we just continue,
Speaker 2: continue to continue, and getting involved with him and wanting
Speaker 2: to be in a band with him was my dream.
Speaker 2: That was the dream. The only dream I had was
Speaker 2: to be in a band to get my mother out
Speaker 2: of the ghetto where we were at, and so we
Speaker 2: can live, you know, and you know, so she can
Speaker 2: enjoyed life, because watching her come up was like, you know,
Speaker 2: we'd go out to the places that she was working
Speaker 2: and scrubbing floors and all that, you know, and that
Speaker 2: made us sad. You know, It's like a sadness that
Speaker 2: always sticks with you. And so I made up in
Speaker 2: my mind, if I ever get together and make something happen,
Speaker 2: Mama is always first, you know, which was your mom
Speaker 2: happy that you guys were into music or was it
Speaker 2: kind of like she was happy, She was supportive, she
Speaker 2: knew you know, like a lot of mothers would try
Speaker 2: to get in the way, she you know, she'd do
Speaker 2: anything she could to help feed you know, that fire
Speaker 2: that we had because she recognized it. You know, I think,
Speaker 2: you know, this is just my thinking that if I
Speaker 2: had had a father in the house, he would have
Speaker 2: been trying to make me a certain way, you know,
Speaker 2: So I didn't have that. You know, I wouldn't push
Speaker 2: that on everybody, but for me, it worked without him
Speaker 2: being in the house.
Speaker 1: A mother's more sometimes nurturing nature was beneficial for us.
Speaker 2: And that's what that's what we needed. She gave us
Speaker 2: just what we needed. She showed us without showing us,
Speaker 2: you know, she would instead of just telling us, she
Speaker 2: would more show us. So that's what I picked up.
Speaker 2: Like when I got out in the world, you know,
Speaker 2: it was like I knew the street you know, the
Speaker 2: street talk, I knew the street language. But at the
Speaker 2: same time, it was like, you know, give what you
Speaker 2: can give, be who you are and show people instead
Speaker 2: of telling them what to do. Be who you are,
Speaker 2: you know. So I learned that early and Thank god
Speaker 2: I did, because that stuck with me through all the
Speaker 2: changes we've been through, you know, and the power of
Speaker 2: the one is the power of the one, you know,
Speaker 2: and I grabbed onto it.
Speaker 1: Yeah, as you started to develop as a as a
Speaker 1: as who you would becoming, as you started to become
Speaker 1: more bootsy, and you come home and see your mom,
Speaker 1: what was her reaction?
Speaker 2: That's funny, Oh man, she watched me. She let me
Speaker 2: get away with a lot, you know, but she had
Speaker 2: to remind me one time when I came home that
Speaker 2: I'm still William Collins, you know, and I had forgot
Speaker 2: who that guy was. You know, when you get caught
Speaker 2: up in that fame thing, you know, and it happens
Speaker 2: to pretty much everybody, you know, because you don't you know,
Speaker 2: you don't know, you know, you don't know what that
Speaker 2: fame and money and you know, we didn't know nothing
Speaker 2: about none of that stuff, you know, And so I
Speaker 2: got so caught up, you know that you know, I
Speaker 2: didn't know. I'm supposed to come home, chill out, you know,
Speaker 2: take out the garbage, you know, and do what I'm
Speaker 2: supposed to do. Instead of coming back being bootsy, you know,
Speaker 2: I bring the whole crew, you know, got the whole crew,
Speaker 2: you know, because Mama liked to feed everybody, you know.
Speaker 2: But this particular time, she had got fed up with
Speaker 2: me coming home with all these chicks and you know,
Speaker 2: just you know, just being bootsy, you know, and it's like,
Speaker 2: she's going to prove to me that you when you
Speaker 2: come home, you William. You ain't no bootsy, you know,
Speaker 2: and she smacked my glasses off, you know, in front
Speaker 2: of everybody, and I was like, okay, you know, I
Speaker 2: went up ran up to my room, you know, and
Speaker 2: you know, I got dealt with as far as what
Speaker 2: I'm supposed to be and who I'm I'm supposed to
Speaker 2: be when I'm home, you know, and you know that's
Speaker 2: what helped me develop as a supposedly start out in
Speaker 2: the world and come home, I can be me. You know.
Speaker 2: That got so separated from me that I was lost,
Speaker 2: you know, I was really lost, and I start figuring out,
Speaker 2: like I see now what happened to those little young
Speaker 2: child actors. You know, they learned that one way all
Speaker 2: their life, and then when they get to be grown,
Speaker 2: they don't know how to act because they don't know
Speaker 2: who they are, you know. And so when I start
Speaker 2: figuring out who I was. You know, that's when the
Speaker 2: magic really started happening. As far as me realizing who
Speaker 2: I am. You know, I had to go through a
Speaker 2: lot of things, a lot of drugs, a lot of accidents.
Speaker 2: You know. The last act that I was in with
Speaker 2: the motorcycle, you know, reminded me of who and what
Speaker 2: I am. And you're not invincible, you know. You know,
Speaker 2: you take you know, forget the help, and you know,
Speaker 2: you got your hair on, you know, you get riding
Speaker 2: the bike, you got the chicks on the back. You know,
Speaker 2: it's a whole other thing, a whole other world, you know.
Speaker 2: And then once I flipped over about three times, you know,
Speaker 2: riding in the woods, you know, a place I shouldn't
Speaker 2: have had a street bike anyway, I found out that
Speaker 2: you're not invincible, you know, loaded to the gills, you know.
Speaker 2: And that's the thing that snapped me out of a
Speaker 2: lot of you know, the fortune and fame thing, you know.
Speaker 2: And I watch it every day as I see the
Speaker 2: young era coming in, and you know, so I get
Speaker 2: a chance to watch it now as opposed to just
Speaker 2: be in it and stuck.
Speaker 1: Yeah, you also collaborate with a lot of young artists
Speaker 1: there too, and like do they ever Do they ever?
Speaker 1: I mean you kind of can't insert yourself when you're
Speaker 1: not wanting, But did they ever come to you and
Speaker 1: ask you how did you survive?
Speaker 2: They do? They do it all the time, and you know,
Speaker 2: I try to explain it in a way where that's
Speaker 2: what I do because you know, for me, you know,
Speaker 2: to tell a person not to do something and you know,
Speaker 2: it didn't work on me. I mean, you know, James
Speaker 2: Brown was telling me not to do this and not
Speaker 2: to do that, and it didn't work. Yeah, you know,
Speaker 2: as a matter of fact, it pushed me further and
Speaker 2: further away from him, you know, because he was trying
Speaker 2: to be my father, you know, and it's like, you know,
Speaker 2: I couldn't tell him you can't be my father. But
Speaker 2: at the same time, it was like he was doing
Speaker 2: that because that's what he you know, that's what he felt,
Speaker 2: you know, he felt like a father figure and you know,
Speaker 2: so I had to I gave him that respect. And
Speaker 2: at the same time, it was like, I see what
Speaker 2: helped push me, you know, over the edge. Like if
Speaker 2: you tell me to not do something, I'm gonna do it,
Speaker 2: you know, So I figured the kids now they think
Speaker 2: the same way, and so I really stay away from
Speaker 2: trying to tell them what to do, and I show
Speaker 2: them how I am, you know, and then if they
Speaker 2: pick up something, cool if they don't, you know, but
Speaker 2: don't look for me to actually tell you what to
Speaker 2: do in your life. You know, I'll show you what
Speaker 2: I did if you ask, you know. But other than that,
Speaker 2: you know, it's like we're cool, you know. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 2: when when did you get sober? Really sober?
Speaker 3: And when I met Peppermint Patty, I faked like I
Speaker 3: was sober in nineteen eighty three, you know, but.
Speaker 2: It kept coming back, you know, up until nineteen eighty eight.
Speaker 2: Is when I made my mind up that you know,
Speaker 2: I'm gonna do it, you know, and I called Turkey.
Speaker 1: You know.
Speaker 2: It was like it was really really deep. But she
Speaker 2: helped me. A lot of people helped by just being themselves,
Speaker 2: you know, and talking a lot of faith and works
Speaker 2: and how it goes together. But the difference for me
Speaker 2: was everybody that talked about faith had a particular way
Speaker 2: that they wanted you to dive in, you know, and
Speaker 2: to me, I had a problem with that because for me,
Speaker 2: it's like respect everybody's father, whoever they choose, respect it,
Speaker 2: you know. To me, it's really simple, you know, And
Speaker 2: I don't have to. I don't feel like I have
Speaker 2: to change nobody. You know, they'll change it's like I did,
Speaker 2: or they won't, you know, So that's all up to
Speaker 2: the person. But I'm not to be the judge of that,
Speaker 2: you know, And that's that makes me feel good when
Speaker 2: I see how God has changed me and how it
Speaker 2: affects people without me trying to be the number one.
Speaker 2: You know, I'm not number one. You're not number one either.
Speaker 2: You know. We're a part of the one, you know,
Speaker 2: and anybody that feels like they are the one, I
Speaker 2: let them have it. You are the one, you know.
Speaker 2: But I know that all of us together equals the one.
Speaker 2: You know. If we ain't all together on it ain't
Speaker 2: nobody to one.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's interesting here you say that because you also,
Speaker 1: I mean, you know, because you in a way you
Speaker 1: do have like like Boots, Like there's a such a
Speaker 1: bravado to the character of Bucy that's fun and amazing.
Speaker 1: But it's incredible you say that, like you know, I'm
Speaker 1: not number one, Like I'm not like am.
Speaker 2: I saying boots to me, I'm not I'm not fooling
Speaker 2: myself anymore. I mean I went for it. When it happened,
Speaker 2: you know, it blew up so big. You know, it
Speaker 2: was scary. You know, it's like Frankenstein invented the monster
Speaker 2: and then the monster turned on him, you know, and
Speaker 2: that's what happened to me. When did you realize it
Speaker 2: was scary?
Speaker 1: Like?
Speaker 2: What was there an incident or it was a whole
Speaker 2: lot of incidents, oh man, but you know, one at
Speaker 2: one thing after another. I mean, you have to actually
Speaker 2: pay to be that star, you know, to be that
Speaker 2: gigantic being. You have to pay for that. You know.
Speaker 2: It's not like, you know, you learn all this and
Speaker 2: then you know, you know, you get up there and
Speaker 2: everything's cool. Everything was cool, but you got to realize
Speaker 2: there's a cost, you know, and you never you never
Speaker 2: learned about that. Nobody explains that to you because all
Speaker 2: you want to do is play, make money, be successful,
Speaker 2: Da da da da day, you know, and you don't
Speaker 2: even think about that, you know, until it starts crumbling
Speaker 2: down on you. Like you know, wow, I didn't go
Speaker 2: out there to you know, pay the bills, like for
Speaker 2: the truck. I gotta pay the account. I gotta pay
Speaker 2: the ban I gotta. I didn't go out there for that.
Speaker 2: I went out there because I wanted to play to
Speaker 2: the people, period. You know. I didn't want all those
Speaker 2: other responsibilities, you know, but all of that falls on
Speaker 2: you when you're out front doing the thing and becoming
Speaker 2: this big, major star, you know. So I wasn't ready.
Speaker 2: I wasn't and I'll never be ready for that because
Speaker 2: I don't want to, you know, I don't want that
Speaker 2: kind of responsibility, responsibility that I got now. I feel
Speaker 2: like I can take care of that. But if it
Speaker 2: gets any bigger, I will be prepared because I'm being
Speaker 2: prepared now, you know, otherwise, and then I can see
Speaker 2: it coming because I know it's coming. But then you
Speaker 2: can't see nothing, you know, all you see is the
Speaker 2: good things. You know. I can get all this, I
Speaker 2: can get all that. I can do her, I can
Speaker 2: do her. Yeah, I can do that. I can do that.
Speaker 2: You know. You can do everything, you know, And so
Speaker 2: you guys were yeah, yeah, yeah, And to make it
Speaker 2: through that is enough for me to just be like,
Speaker 2: if you want that, you got it, got you know, yeah,
Speaker 2: And I'm here for you if you need me.
Speaker 1: We'll be right back with more from Bootsy Collins after
Speaker 1: the break. When you put out Bootsi's Rubber Band, for instance,
Speaker 1: and you sort of start becoming your own entity within
Speaker 1: the Parliament organization, the Parliament Funkadelic organization. Did you feel
Speaker 1: that coming? Did you know you were gonna be like
Speaker 1: the guy to be?
Speaker 2: I didn't want to be the guy, that's first off.
Speaker 2: I didn't want. All I wanted to do was play
Speaker 2: in the band, you know, and that's stuck with me
Speaker 2: throughout the whole thing, and I couldn't figure out, well,
Speaker 2: I figured out why I was in the front, you know,
Speaker 2: because George really wanted me to be the front of
Speaker 2: my own band as opposed to just being in Parliament Funkadelic,
Speaker 2: and I really didn't want that, you know, But he
Speaker 2: starts showing me ways that it would be beneficial if I,
Speaker 2: you know, took off on another another band, because I
Speaker 2: had been playing with all of them, you know, and
Speaker 2: I had my own band when I first got there,
Speaker 2: and I still had them, so it was like, you
Speaker 2: should take them on the road, and I'll take parliam
Speaker 2: and fro Unkadella. He had a great The concept was great.
Speaker 2: You know. But the downside was I wasn't ready to
Speaker 2: be a front man, you know, and so all those
Speaker 2: years that I was learning, I was losing interest in
Speaker 2: being because that ain't what I wanted to be.
Speaker 1: You really didn't want to that when you know, I
Speaker 1: call that first album cover at Thrasher Design with that
Speaker 1: you want to well.
Speaker 2: Well, that's part of what helped turn into oh this
Speaker 2: this might be all right? You know, you know everybody
Speaker 2: checked this out. Yeah, that's the part that gets you.
Speaker 2: You know, when when it you know, when it first
Speaker 2: starts and then something happened would Warner Brothers. Wow? Then
Speaker 2: it starts hitting you like wow, you know, and then
Speaker 2: gigs start coming up. And I was just talking to
Speaker 2: my man out here about you know, Dave Liebert. He
Speaker 2: came in and started booking us, and you know, it's
Speaker 2: just start growing so fast. And I wasn't ready for that,
Speaker 2: you know, I wouldn't all what I was ready for
Speaker 2: was playing with Parliam and Funkadella. You really still just
Speaker 2: wanted to be part of that, hey man. That was
Speaker 2: that was the beauty, the beauty of you know, a
Speaker 2: band is playing together, you know. Uh. And I knew
Speaker 2: that if I if we separated them. You know, I
Speaker 2: knew that the weight was going to fall on me.
Speaker 2: You know, if I didn't have no sense at all,
Speaker 2: I knew it was gonna follow on me if I
Speaker 2: take that, you know, that approach of being a solo artist.
Speaker 2: You know. But when I saw seeing all the good
Speaker 2: parts that is going to benefits, you know, I was like, Okay, George,
Speaker 2: you know I do it. So I cave in, you know,
Speaker 2: and sure enough it turned out the way I was thinking,
Speaker 2: you know, and you can call that stinking thinking, you know,
Speaker 2: but that ain't what I wanted. You know. What I
Speaker 2: wanted was to be with the band and make people
Speaker 2: feel good about themselves, having fun. You know. Actually fun
Speaker 2: had more to do with it than making money. You know,
Speaker 2: when we got with James Brown, I thought we had
Speaker 2: to pay him, you know, I mean that's how you know,
Speaker 2: we just didn't know, you know, like the artists now
Speaker 2: musicians now know about getting paid. You know, we were
Speaker 2: just having a good time. We want to have fun.
Speaker 2: You know. It wasn't about the era of making money
Speaker 2: for us. You know, we just he snatched us off
Speaker 2: the street. You know, we was riding having a great
Speaker 2: time doing that. You know, and he snatched us off
Speaker 2: the street. How did he find you? Well, we played
Speaker 2: at King and King Records. That's the King fellow right there,
Speaker 2: he's the head here guy King and and so that's
Speaker 2: where we met James Brown. So that's a whole nother
Speaker 2: long story. But Charles Berling brought us the King Records
Speaker 2: because he thought that we were such an energetic you know,
Speaker 2: rhythm section that you know, we could cut his records
Speaker 2: and cut you know, different sessions for and we wound
Speaker 2: up working with Hank Ballard Wow. Uh, Bill Doggett Uh,
Speaker 2: I mean, what's what's my man's name? Henry Glover was
Speaker 2: the first black producer you know of you know, not
Speaker 2: just rhythm and blues, but you know folk music. He
Speaker 2: was doing everything at King Records. Wow. And you know
Speaker 2: his dad, ODIs Williams, was the head of Oldest Williams
Speaker 2: and the Charms Wow nowhere Yeah. Yeah, and so you
Speaker 2: know you never know, yeah, I mean you know, so
Speaker 2: so you know all of that, you know, I was
Speaker 2: growing into you know what those are?
Speaker 1: Guys like like Hank Ballard and Bill Doggett are incredible Yeah,
Speaker 1: musicians from bang Bood, incredible front man even Yeah, talks
Speaker 1: about these days.
Speaker 2: What was it like hanging around them? What were they like?
Speaker 2: Man very encouraging because they were true musicians, I mean,
Speaker 2: true to the bone, you know, and it was such
Speaker 2: a pleasure to be around them. And they treat you
Speaker 2: like regular people, you know, and so being around them
Speaker 2: kind of help set myself up to I want to
Speaker 2: be like that, you know. I want to be, you know,
Speaker 2: like able Town. I'm down to earth where you know,
Speaker 2: I might look crazy, you know, and I probably do.
Speaker 2: But at the same time, it's like I want to
Speaker 2: be able to. I want people to have fun with me,
Speaker 2: you know, I want to I want them to chill,
Speaker 2: have a good time, and and if they whatever they
Speaker 2: want to say, say it, you know. And so I
Speaker 2: try to carry that, you know, once once I start
Speaker 2: picking up from them, you know, it's like we live
Speaker 2: on their backs. And that's what I talk about. You know,
Speaker 2: a lot of people want to put it all on me,
Speaker 2: but I have to tell them, you know, you know,
Speaker 2: I'm really not the one. You know. I worked at
Speaker 2: being on the one, but I'm not. Well, I'm not
Speaker 2: the one. The one is bigger than all of us,
Speaker 2: you know, because it's all all of us collectively together.
Speaker 1: Well, you know what's funny, It's like you're talking about
Speaker 1: how James was almost like a father figure, and like
Speaker 1: most father figures when you're when you're that age, you
Speaker 1: kind of want to like buck buck against him. Yeah,
Speaker 1: but his lesson about the one, oh all, seems to
Speaker 1: have always really stuck with you boys.
Speaker 2: Yeah, what was like?
Speaker 1: And you then you even go and introduce that to
Speaker 1: George and part of my funk delic in that because
Speaker 1: so how did that stick?
Speaker 2: That stuck because I was in it and I got
Speaker 2: to see it work. You know, it wasn't just him talking,
Speaker 2: you know about the one. It was when I put
Speaker 2: it into effect in my music. That's when I found
Speaker 2: out he ain't just rapping. You know, this is real
Speaker 2: because soon as I start doing that because I played
Speaker 2: a lot of you know, playing guitar, and I got
Speaker 2: stuck on bass because my brother the play guitar and
Speaker 2: he needed a bass player. So that's how I got
Speaker 2: stuck on bass. And once that happened, you know, and
Speaker 2: I'm with my brother, I'm happy. You know, I'm happy
Speaker 2: because I don't care what I play, a flute, clarinet,
Speaker 2: whatever with my brother, you know, that was the key.
Speaker 2: And we just happened to get picked up over there
Speaker 2: King Records, you know, because we was tearing it up.
Speaker 2: We were street kids, and we wasn't letting nothing get
Speaker 2: in the way nothing. I mean, oh you won't pay us,
Speaker 2: Oh that ain't no problem, you know, let us put
Speaker 2: let us put this funk down for you, you know.
Speaker 2: And that was the attitude, you know. So but you
Speaker 2: were playing, and it's true you were playing a guitar.
Speaker 2: At first.
Speaker 1: I learned rung like a bass, yeah, like a six
Speaker 1: strings guitar, but with four bass strings.
Speaker 2: Well I had to do that because my brother needed
Speaker 2: a bass player, not a guitar player. And I just
Speaker 2: asked him, can you get me four bass strings? He
Speaker 2: got me four bass strings. And that night, you know,
Speaker 2: was our first gig. And the place was, the place was,
Speaker 2: let's see, it was about from here to the door,
Speaker 2: the whole place, the whole place, you know, no stage.
Speaker 2: We were standing on the floor and people were like
Speaker 2: this in your faith and drunk as I don't you know,
Speaker 2: And here I am. I'm like fifteen, fourteen fifteen, and
Speaker 2: I got into place, you know, because of my brother.
Speaker 2: You know, he's like eight years older than I, so
Speaker 2: I get it in because, you know, because of him,
Speaker 2: and people are just getting off because I'm so young,
Speaker 2: you know, and I'm knowing, I'm knowing that they're getting
Speaker 2: off because I'm young, but I'm also playing what they like,
Speaker 2: you know. And so when I got with when we
Speaker 2: all got with James Brown, he tightened us up and
Speaker 2: told us about the one once. Once that happened, you know,
Speaker 2: we all started knowing where the one was at, and
Speaker 2: it was like, oh, you mean like this, and James said, yeah,
Speaker 2: I'm glad, I'm glad I thought of it. You know.
Speaker 2: So everything he thought of which was great, you know,
Speaker 2: which at the time, you know, then, wasn't nobody telling us, man,
Speaker 2: y'all should be you know, y'all should be doing this, y'all.
Speaker 2: You know, when the rappers came out and started sampling,
Speaker 2: everybody's telling me what I should be getting, you know,
Speaker 2: you know, And if it had been that era instead
Speaker 2: of the era I grew up in, they would have
Speaker 2: been right. Yeah. But the era I grew up in was,
Speaker 2: you know, we was what do you call working? What
Speaker 2: do you call that? Uh? You know, we was kind
Speaker 2: of like worked for hire. Oh yeah, freelance. Yeah, And
Speaker 2: it wasn't about you know, you know, us getting paid.
Speaker 2: It was about you mugs are here with James Brown,
Speaker 2: and y'all better pay attention, you know. And that's what
Speaker 2: we did. We paid attention. And if somebody paid us, cool,
Speaker 2: If didn't, nobody pay us. We had a couple of
Speaker 2: dollars to go get some wine. A couple of girls
Speaker 2: in the backseat were good, were good.
Speaker 1: And he had a way of for I guess for
Speaker 1: people who don't understand the one, it's just a way
Speaker 1: of organizing your playing where you're emphasizing.
Speaker 2: You're emphasizing that one on every four you know, four bards.
Speaker 2: And you know that's so true to this day. Even
Speaker 2: the computers, you know, they they got it shows you
Speaker 2: what the one is. That that's it. That's it, I mean,
Speaker 2: And no computers worked like you know, they don't don't
Speaker 2: work like that. They work like that, you know. And
Speaker 2: for James to be told us about the one way
Speaker 2: back in those years and then to this day, it's
Speaker 2: it's still a give them a nye. I mean, it's
Speaker 2: still there, you know. And once you start doing that,
Speaker 2: you put the emphasis on that people feel that they
Speaker 2: vibe off of that. You know, it's like a internal clock,
Speaker 2: you know, it's the heartbeat of the world. You know.
Speaker 1: So what about like when you go into play with
Speaker 1: like you did a Herbie Hancock record with Sugar for
Speaker 1: Bonner from Ohio players. Can you can you do that
Speaker 1: on a on a Herbie record?
Speaker 2: Well, it's it's it's all the same thing, but it's
Speaker 2: in different measures, you know, different bars. You know. You
Speaker 2: know they they got a one too, but you know,
Speaker 2: them being jazz musicians, they got a certain count, you know.
Speaker 2: But it all, if you know, it all comes back
Speaker 2: to one. You know, they got they got to come
Speaker 2: to the one too. Everybody got to come to the one.
Speaker 2: I don't care what it is. You know, it's just
Speaker 2: not four four, you know, it can be five, you know, five, seven,
Speaker 2: you know, you know whatever whatever that is. But it
Speaker 2: all has to come back to one.
Speaker 1: And when you when when you're introducing this concept of
Speaker 1: parliament funk dialect, this thing that James taught you would
Speaker 1: it have been big Foot Bradley on drums at that
Speaker 1: time or Tiki Fu was.
Speaker 2: Both of them? Both of them were there? Yeah, Well
Speaker 2: it was Tiki first, Tyrone and then Bigfoot. Yeah yeah,
Speaker 2: and for me, I think bigfootre Braley brought home the
Speaker 2: p funk. You know, Tiki brought home on the funkadelic side.
Speaker 2: You know. Tyron Lapkin, he was just an all out
Speaker 2: next level drummer, you know. I mean he made you
Speaker 2: stop and like watch him. You know. You know, it
Speaker 2: wasn't really about the one with him. You know, he'd
Speaker 2: do it if you, you know, told him to, but
Speaker 2: it was about he was like a jazz drummer. Yeah,
Speaker 2: you know, he was all over the place, you know,
Speaker 2: and he find his own one, you know, so you know,
Speaker 2: which was cool because he always he always had to
Speaker 2: come back. You know, I don't know what his count was,
Speaker 2: but he knew what you know, he knew what it was.
Speaker 2: And that's what matters. You guys.
Speaker 1: You guys were playing that just completely different feels going.
Speaker 1: But that would maybe be some of the magic is
Speaker 1: that's what you're feeling one thing, he's feeling a different post.
Speaker 2: And you are allowed to do it. You know, that
Speaker 2: has a big emphasis on how you feel about doing
Speaker 2: what you're doing, you know, because if you're not allowed
Speaker 2: to do it, you know, then you feel like you're constricted.
Speaker 2: You can't express you can't self express yourself, you know,
Speaker 2: the way you want to. And in that era, it
Speaker 2: was very important to express yourself, you know, just like
Speaker 2: the record express yourself, you know, your boy I mean
Speaker 2: The Boys was funky or the original exactly Charles Wright. Yes, yes, yeah,
Speaker 2: so you know, and we had all of that that
Speaker 2: we was growing up in and today, you know, it's
Speaker 2: like where is that at? You know, I mean we
Speaker 2: had we grew up in such a great musical era,
Speaker 2: you know, to have all that around you, you know,
Speaker 2: to absorb all of that and then wake up one
Speaker 2: day and it's not there. You know, it's like, how
Speaker 2: does that feel? You know, people like ask me, how
Speaker 2: does that feel? You know? I had to learn, you know.
Speaker 2: The good thing for me is learning while I'm on
Speaker 2: the job. You know, I'm sure I'm learning, you know.
Speaker 2: And when we got to this part here, it's like
Speaker 2: I was kind of prepared, you know, to accept, Okay,
Speaker 2: it's done change, you know, because I was in the
Speaker 2: changing while it was changing. Yeah, you know, so I
Speaker 2: got a chance to adjust. And most people that I'm
Speaker 2: not gonna stop playing the acoustic. I'm not gonna you know,
Speaker 2: play the electric. Yeah, but I love this acoustic you know.
Speaker 2: That's how I observed it and was like, whatever comes in,
Speaker 2: I'm gonna learn how to you know, or if I
Speaker 2: can't do it, I'm getting somebody else to do it.
Speaker 2: You know.
Speaker 1: After the last break, we'll be back with the rest
Speaker 1: of Bootsy Collins. Were you getting blowback then, like, because
Speaker 1: you know you Larry Graham all right around that same time. Yeah,
Speaker 1: really changing the nature of bass playing, you know, like
Speaker 1: and really making it a different a different instrument.
Speaker 2: You know. Well, I was so glad to be a
Speaker 2: part of that, you know, you know, because it was
Speaker 2: only a few of us, you know, and you know,
Speaker 2: it's like James Jamison was the cat that really changed
Speaker 2: my mind about bass playing, you know, because he had
Speaker 2: he played with one finger. All of that stuff he
Speaker 2: was playing, he used one finger, you know. Wow. Yeah,
Speaker 2: and he I'm glad you mentioned that. He all those
Speaker 2: hit records beforehand. He played upright, upright bass. He got
Speaker 2: introduced to Defender P bass and he wanted to play
Speaker 2: the P bass. Motown said, now you know you can't
Speaker 2: play that. You ain't made no money with you know,
Speaker 2: playing that. So they didn't want to change, but he
Speaker 2: said if you want me, I'm playing the p bass
Speaker 2: and then all after all after that, you know, the
Speaker 2: upright base, all the stuff after that. He made much
Speaker 2: more money for them, And you know, he was a
Speaker 2: perfect example to accept and embrace that change that we're
Speaker 2: talking about right now that most musicians don't want to
Speaker 2: don't want to deal with. You know, we're always gonna
Speaker 2: run into that change that we don't want to change.
Speaker 2: You know. It's like sampling. You know, it's like, you know,
Speaker 2: oh man, God, the sampling. What we're gonna do? It's
Speaker 2: you know, it's just like AI, what we're gonna do.
Speaker 2: You know, they're coming in and they're coming to get us.
Speaker 2: They coming, you know, take our gigs, you know, And
Speaker 2: so it's the same thing, you know. So I'm getting
Speaker 2: ready to face this along with the rest of the world.
Speaker 2: But the only difference is I know it's coming, you know,
Speaker 2: and we made it through the sampling era. You know,
Speaker 2: we can make it through this one too, you know.
Speaker 2: So you know, and I can't tell nobody how to
Speaker 2: do it because I don't know. I didn't know how
Speaker 2: to do the sampling though, you know, I didn't even
Speaker 2: know that was coming, you know, until you in it.
Speaker 2: You know, once you're in it, then you you know,
Speaker 2: you have to try to figure out, you know, like, wow,
Speaker 2: what do you do? You know? And so that's what
Speaker 2: I have to say about the AI because because everybody's
Speaker 2: talking asking me about that, you know, and you know,
Speaker 2: we'll learn, We'll all learn how to deal with it,
Speaker 2: you know, because it ain't no way you're gonna keep
Speaker 2: it from coming. That.
Speaker 1: That's sort of that sensibility of just have taken things
Speaker 1: as they come and working with it.
Speaker 2: I've heard you talk about.
Speaker 1: Getting lost as a part of your creative process, and
Speaker 1: that seems to.
Speaker 2: Kind of fit with that. And that's like, well, we
Speaker 2: don't know where it's going, but but we're going anyway.
Speaker 2: We're going anywhere, you know, and there we go. That
Speaker 2: was one of my whole sayings is I don't know
Speaker 2: where I'm going, but I'm going. That's one of my
Speaker 2: whole you know, it's like very short sentence, but you know,
Speaker 2: I'm committed to that, you know, and people be hanging
Speaker 2: their hopes on well, somebody tell us what to do. Hey,
Speaker 2: I don't know where I'm going, but I'm going. You know,
Speaker 2: that right there just tells you that you have to
Speaker 2: prepare yourself because it's coming, whatever that it is, you know,
Speaker 2: it's definitely coming, you know, and so you have to
Speaker 2: try to prepare yourself the best you can. I'm glad
Speaker 2: you're not running from it. And oh no, on the
Speaker 2: only thing I'm scared of is flying. He hasn't asked
Speaker 2: me about it because you pulled up in R and V.
Speaker 2: When did the flying things start? Oh that's all enough,
Speaker 2: that's all. When did that happened? Since you brought it up,
Speaker 2: that happened? That happened in nineteen seventy nine. You know,
Speaker 2: I wanted to fly on the the concord, you know,
Speaker 2: when Meg for what.
Speaker 1: You could get seed or.
Speaker 2: Not light, speeding sound or whatever. That's it. That's it.
Speaker 2: So I wanted to fly on it because you know,
Speaker 2: it was our first time going to Europe, you know,
Speaker 2: and me headlining. You know, it's like I don't you know,
Speaker 2: just breaking off from Parliament Funkadelic and we getting ready
Speaker 2: to go a headline in London and all England in Paris,
Speaker 2: frank all that, you know, And and so I wants
Speaker 2: to fly on the concord, and so I get to
Speaker 2: fly on the concord you know, So forty five minutes
Speaker 2: into the flight, you know, everybody's you know, you know, happy, beautiful,
Speaker 2: And forty five minutes into the flight, the captain comes
Speaker 2: on and says, you know, because I knew something was
Speaker 2: wrong because the plane was you know, we was flying
Speaker 2: like this, you know, and it's like, you know, and
Speaker 2: I'm sitting there and I'm looking out the wonder and
Speaker 2: then I saw fire shooting out the engine and I
Speaker 2: was like, oh, like, im like, we just we just
Speaker 2: made it, you know. And then not only that Jaws
Speaker 2: was a big movie. Then it's like, okay, if you
Speaker 2: make the crash right you falling in Jaw's territory, the
Speaker 2: right Atlantic, all this come to me, I mean, you know,
Speaker 2: and it's like, oh, man, if I ever get on
Speaker 2: the ground again, I would never ever fly, you know.
Speaker 2: And sure enough I got. We made He turned the
Speaker 2: plane around. You know, we were just getting ready to
Speaker 2: cross the line, you know, but he turned the plane around,
Speaker 2: and we was flying like this all the way back
Speaker 2: to New York. Got back to New York. He landed
Speaker 2: the plane some kind of way, I mean, told us
Speaker 2: to put our heads down. You know. We went through
Speaker 2: the whole drill the whole drill, you know, and the
Speaker 2: tool was so big though that they talked me in
Speaker 2: the you know, taking the next flight out, which was
Speaker 2: a seven forty seven. Yeah, and then and then they
Speaker 2: gave me some drugs to just sleep. I didn't wake
Speaker 2: up until I got over there, so, you know. And
Speaker 2: then when I got back, no more flying. That was it.
Speaker 2: Nineteen seventy nine, Well that was it up until I
Speaker 2: think it was more like two thousand.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's a bad time to start back, I know,
Speaker 1: I know, and I did it.
Speaker 2: I did, and you know, I lost that fear until COVID.
Speaker 2: Once COVID hit, you know, it was like, okay, I
Speaker 2: got I can't fly no more. I can't. What happened
Speaker 2: is how you watch Jaws again more. I didn't watch it.
Speaker 2: I didn't watch it, but but you know, it's always
Speaker 2: I get these signals, you know, and I call it
Speaker 2: the universe. You know, it's like, Okay, you can't fly now.
Speaker 2: And I don't even question it if I hear that,
Speaker 2: you know, because you know, because I'm, like I said,
Speaker 2: I'm really not afraid, you know, until unless it's heights. Yeah,
Speaker 2: I'm scared of heights and flying.
Speaker 1: That's why you didn't tell me you're not afraid.
Speaker 2: I'm letting you know. I'm letting you know. When it
Speaker 2: comes out, all heights I'm through. I mean, you know,
Speaker 2: the roller coasters, I love it, you know, and you
Speaker 2: know we we rode on them thousands of times, you know.
Speaker 2: But she didn't never know I was scared of heights,
Speaker 2: you know, until one day I just broke out into it,
Speaker 2: you know, because we was up in one of those
Speaker 2: hotels that you know, you ride up in the elevator
Speaker 2: and you could see yourself going up, but then you know,
Speaker 2: then it's like, oh, man, I couldn't even look over
Speaker 2: the you know, like if you're up on the forty
Speaker 2: floor or whatever window, look, man, I couldn't do that.
Speaker 2: I couldn't do that. But you know, that's that's the
Speaker 2: two things that got me scared to death. You go
Speaker 2: to the Grand Canyon or anything. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2: If it's natural, is that okay? That that's okay? Because
Speaker 2: I'm not going to go to the edge, you know,
Speaker 2: and look over I'm not you know, I'm staying away
Speaker 2: from that, okay. You know.
Speaker 1: So it's something you do do you navigate around bridges
Speaker 1: on the r v or no is that Okay, that's.
Speaker 4: Kind of deep, that's kind of we don't go there,
Speaker 4: not sorry that trail bike, trail bike in in the
Speaker 4: you know, that's cool.
Speaker 2: You know, as long as it ain't no way up
Speaker 2: in the air, I'm good with. Okay, okay, you know, okay, yeah, okay, I.
Speaker 1: Get that though, because honestly, to a COVID, once you're grounded,
Speaker 1: you're not going anywhere.
Speaker 2: You're not driving.
Speaker 1: To the point too, I used to love to drive,
Speaker 1: like everywhere I could drive.
Speaker 2: See that now you four hours, now you hit it.
Speaker 2: But I'm like, now, I'm like, now driving that's all.
Speaker 2: That's all I used to do. I would take George
Speaker 2: from New Jersey down to Miami, Florida, and all we're
Speaker 2: doing is listening to music, getting loaded, and me driving
Speaker 2: because he couldn't drive. He didn't have a license, didn't
Speaker 2: want a license. Really, yeah, that was a getaway for us.
Speaker 2: You know, we go to Florida and fish. You know,
Speaker 2: we rent a yacht and that was our getaway because
Speaker 2: we was under a lot of pressure trying to get
Speaker 2: these groups and getting the songs and the albums. Because
Speaker 2: George was developing a whole new concept where each group
Speaker 2: was on a different label, and you know, we didn't
Speaker 2: realize at the time what he was doing. He didn't
Speaker 2: really realize, but he thought, you know, that would have
Speaker 2: them fighting against each other to make sure that they
Speaker 2: pushed their own group. And it worked.
Speaker 1: It worked.
Speaker 2: Like did he get sued for that or no?
Speaker 1: No?
Speaker 2: No, I mean you know at that particular time, you know,
Speaker 2: it's like sampling comeing in and you don't know what
Speaker 2: to do with it. They didn't know what to do
Speaker 2: with that. You know, he was a genius as far
Speaker 2: as the you know, it's like, damn, how do you
Speaker 2: figure that out? You know? So no, I mean all
Speaker 2: of them felt like fools, you know. So you know,
Speaker 2: they didn't want you to know that they were that stupid,
Speaker 2: you know. So you know he got away with it.
Speaker 2: That's incredible. Yeah.
Speaker 1: And then you guys, eventually, because it was like Casablanca
Speaker 1: and west Bound exactly, then you guys throw a Warner.
Speaker 2: Yeah, Warner Atlantic had horny horns. Wow. Uh uh. Columbia
Speaker 2: I think had the Brides and so and Paul add
Speaker 2: it was on I can't remember, maybe they were on Westbound,
Speaker 2: I can't remember what. But every group was on a
Speaker 2: different you know, and and then Boosy rubber Band was
Speaker 2: on Warners you know. Yeah, so that was the whole thing.
Speaker 2: That's where doctor Dre and Snoop got that whole concept from.
Speaker 2: You know, it's because that's that whole empire that we
Speaker 2: kind of you know, came came through and we didn't
Speaker 2: know what we was doing. Dre and Snoop they know
Speaker 2: what they're doing. You know, they take care of business.
Speaker 2: We wasn't taking care of no business. We were just
Speaker 2: doing what we thought, you know, what would help us
Speaker 2: at the moment. You know. It wasn't like we was
Speaker 2: looking for longevity or we were looking you know, for legacy,
Speaker 2: you know, none of that. You know. It was like, man,
Speaker 2: I can get some more drugs, you know, like did
Speaker 2: you get because you know, I know like Hendrix was
Speaker 2: a big you know for all you guys, big poster
Speaker 2: on you you know, like his passing, that's that didn't
Speaker 2: spook anyone, like no, because you know, we kind of
Speaker 2: kind of felt the inside story. You know. I used
Speaker 2: to yeah, yeah, I used to go out with his uh,
Speaker 2: his friend Litho Fame.
Speaker 1: You I was just talking about her because she's in
Speaker 1: the she's like the star of his documentary that came
Speaker 1: for him like seventy one or two.
Speaker 2: Well, she was on the road with us with James Brown,
Speaker 2: and she would ride the bus with us, you know. Uh,
Speaker 2: and she was gonna take me to meet Jimmy, you know.
Speaker 2: But what happened was, you know, when he was working,
Speaker 2: we were working, you know, because everybody was on the
Speaker 2: road at that time, you know, and so we never
Speaker 2: got a chance to hook up. Wow yeah yeah, it
Speaker 2: was deep wow yeah. And she told you what yeah wow, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 2: they do. And the rap was they don't ever want
Speaker 2: another one of those kind of talents to to reach
Speaker 2: that level because they can rule the world, you know,
Speaker 2: and we can't have that, you know. So you know,
Speaker 2: and then when we came on the scene, it was like, oh,
Speaker 2: let's make sure these mother you know, we got to
Speaker 2: shut these mothers down because they a big threat. Yeah,
Speaker 2: you know. And we wasn't trying to do nothing but
Speaker 2: play music and express ourselves. Yeah, you know, but it
Speaker 2: was a it was complicated.
Speaker 1: Did you have a relationship with with with Kiss beyond
Speaker 1: just a label?
Speaker 2: Just a label, you know, as far as the label,
Speaker 2: you know, and we both used the same clothes designer,
Speaker 2: you know, Lugaspi Lagasy yeah in New York, you know, so,
Speaker 2: and then Patty LaBelle and then they used them too,
Speaker 2: and they were they had the same lawyer we had,
Speaker 2: so it was all kind of all you know, kind
Speaker 2: of screwed up there.
Speaker 1: Yeah, okay, yeah, I'm getting the picture now, groupe, same lawyer,
Speaker 1: right right?
Speaker 2: What once?
Speaker 1: Talk about the new album too before we get there.
Speaker 1: The song like your songwright songwriter you George and Bernie
Speaker 1: as like a songwriting unit.
Speaker 2: Yeah, how did how did that start? Oh? Wow, I
Speaker 2: see how did it start? I guess it started with
Speaker 2: going in cutting tracks, and then Bernie and I would
Speaker 2: cut tracks, and then George would come in with the party,
Speaker 2: you know, because he always brought the party and we're
Speaker 2: trying to get some music down, and he'd bring the
Speaker 2: party in and busted up, you know, and he'd come
Speaker 2: in loud, you know, and he had this microphone you know,
Speaker 2: in the control room that he would get on, you know,
Speaker 2: as soon as he walk in. You know, he heard the
Speaker 2: music and he was live. I mean, he was so
Speaker 2: live and loud. You know, it's like we was like,
Speaker 2: wait a minute, George, hold up man, we're trying to
Speaker 2: you know, figure this arrangement out, you know, but he
Speaker 2: was so hyped up about whatever we was doing, you know,
Speaker 2: and he would come up with words, you know, and
Speaker 2: lyrics and stuff right on the spot.
Speaker 1: Man, Let's talk about the new album, I mean, talk
Speaker 1: about not being afraid.
Speaker 2: Yeah, not not.
Speaker 1: I mean, you know, there's no boundaries still with your
Speaker 1: there's still he wasn't now me like there's no world
Speaker 1: box or boundaries in which well, you know, after what
Speaker 1: we've all kind of been through, it's like.
Speaker 2: Ain't nothing new they can do to us. I mean,
Speaker 2: you know, you know, we pretty much know, we pretty
Speaker 2: much know the game, you know, and so that allows
Speaker 2: me to do more of what are you to do?
Speaker 2: But even more than that, you know, because I'm not afraid,
Speaker 2: you know, it's more like I got a bigger audience
Speaker 2: to play too. And not only that, you know, I'm
Speaker 2: standing in front of them trying to show them that
Speaker 2: they can do it too. That's my whole thing about
Speaker 2: the mirror star glasses I had, you know, made was
Speaker 2: when the people looking, when the kid looks into my eyes,
Speaker 2: he sees itself, you know, And to me, that meant
Speaker 2: more than him seeing me, you know, And that's why
Speaker 2: I had the star glasses make you know, the same
Speaker 2: thing with the bass the space base. If you notice
Speaker 2: this mirror all on the you know, and that was
Speaker 2: when the lights hit the space Base. It's gonna hit
Speaker 2: you too, you know. And so all of that was
Speaker 2: you know, I thought of that beforehand, before I actually
Speaker 2: had it done, you know, because it had to have meaning,
Speaker 2: you know, not just me being a superhero or star.
Speaker 2: It had to be something deeper than that. Yeah, you know.
Speaker 1: Yeah, these days when you're making music, Yeah, what's your
Speaker 1: how do you organ like?
Speaker 2: Is there a there's no certain way. There's no certain way. No,
Speaker 2: it can come at any time. It can come through
Speaker 2: somebody else, or somebody else might spark you to go
Speaker 2: in a certain direction. You know. I don't ever put
Speaker 2: it on How do should I come up with this music?
Speaker 2: It just comes. It always come.
Speaker 1: You might be doing something, yeah, and what like a
Speaker 1: line or a melody will hit you or a line.
Speaker 2: It either comes in a riff or melody or a beat.
Speaker 2: You know, if you got to be you know, if
Speaker 2: you got to beat down. I'm more comfortable now with
Speaker 2: having a beat, you know. Uh, just something you can
Speaker 2: go back, even if it's just a metrono, you know.
Speaker 2: And and then you can put this idea, doo doo
Speaker 2: doo dooo. Do do do do do do Do Do
Speaker 2: Do Do Do Do Do Do Do do do do
Speaker 2: do doo. You know, you can take that in a
Speaker 2: whole parliament thing, you know, put some collaps on that mode,
Speaker 2: you know. Do doo doo doo doo dooo doo doo dooo.
Speaker 2: You put that, you get at the George, He'll kill it.
Speaker 2: He'll kill it, you know. So you know, that's the
Speaker 2: way it came then, that's the way it comes now.
Speaker 2: But it comes even more so now because of what
Speaker 2: I got around me, you know, different things. You know.
Speaker 2: It used to be all about out the musicians, you know,
Speaker 2: like because they're there, which yeah, you know. Now I
Speaker 2: had to up my game and figure out how to
Speaker 2: work the boy in the box, you know, and instead
Speaker 2: of putting it down, you know, I picked it up
Speaker 2: and started learning. My son start teaching me how to
Speaker 2: work it.
Speaker 1: You know.
Speaker 2: I'm not like a professional engineer, none of that, but
Speaker 2: I know how to record myself, you know, and anytime
Speaker 2: something comes bang, I'm on it, you know. And I
Speaker 2: put the idea down and then I come back to
Speaker 2: it if I feel like, yeah, that's popping, you know.
Speaker 2: So that's that's kind of the way we do it now, because,
Speaker 2: like I said before, we always had the band with us.
Speaker 2: You know, I had to get used to not having
Speaker 2: the band, you know, And so I know how teased
Speaker 2: and how hectic that is without the band because I've
Speaker 2: been through that, you know, and I learned how to
Speaker 2: deal with it, you know. And rejection is another thing
Speaker 2: that the younger generation has to deal with, and they
Speaker 2: don't know how to deal with that, you know. Rejection
Speaker 2: is that's a heck of a thing to be rejected,
Speaker 2: you know. And like the Funk has always been rejected,
Speaker 2: you know. That's why we ain't never been in the
Speaker 2: you know, the Grammys and all that big stuff that
Speaker 2: you know, you know, mugs make you know, they ain't
Speaker 2: give they don't give a funk about that funk. You know.
Speaker 2: That's why we cut Album of the Year. We'll give
Speaker 2: it to ourselves number one funk tier. Now y'all funk
Speaker 2: with that. They gonna have to funk with that.
Speaker 1: I love that, man, The ability of funk to give
Speaker 1: to the audience man, a feeling of of joy and
Speaker 1: eliminating vulnerability. And it's like before hip hop was was
Speaker 1: sort of the language of giving people confidence and that's
Speaker 1: what I feel it was like that was that's where
Speaker 1: funk lived, you know.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, that's it. Yeah, that's totally it. And you know,
Speaker 2: for me, it's like the more I stay committed to that,
Speaker 2: the more I'll still be around and able to speak
Speaker 2: the language of today whatever it is, or I can
Speaker 2: speak the language of it yesterday. It don't make a difference,
Speaker 2: you know. It's being able to hang with whoever it is. Yeah,
Speaker 2: you know, and so when you feel started feeling comfortable
Speaker 2: with that, you start to feel comfortable with yourself, you know.
Speaker 2: And now it's like the sky is not the limit
Speaker 2: because there's walls behind the sky. Yeah.
Speaker 1: Yeah, we're so blessed to have you still making music
Speaker 1: and it's still just giving us that the bootsy energy man,
Speaker 1: because it's needed in the world.
Speaker 2: Man, So thank you for everything. Oh, thank you man,
Speaker 2: thank you.
Speaker 1: In episode description, you'll find a playlist of some of
Speaker 1: our favorite boots of tracks, along with songs from his
Speaker 1: new album album of the Year number one, Funk Tier.
Speaker 1: Be sure to check out YouTube dot com slash Broken
Speaker 1: Record Podcast to see all of our video interviews, and
Speaker 1: be sure to follow us on Instagram at the Broken
Speaker 1: Record Pod.
Speaker 2: You can follow us on Twitter at broken Record.
Speaker 1: Broken Record is produced and edited by Leah Rose, with
Speaker 1: marketing help from Eric Sandler and Jordan McMillan. Our engineer
Speaker 1: is Ben Tollin. Broken Record is a production of Pushkin Industries.
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Speaker 1: Our theme music's by Kenny Beats. I'm justin Richmond.