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Speaker 1: Hoops Tonight, presented by FanDuel here at the volume. Happy Tuesday, everybody.
Speaker 1: I hope all of you guys had an amazing holiday weekend.
Speaker 1: My wife and I got out of town to Porto Panasco,
Speaker 1: a Rocky Point of some of you guys know it
Speaker 1: down in Mexico. For US desert faring folks, US Arizonan's
Speaker 1: Rocky Point is very popular vacation destination because it's only
Speaker 1: about three and a half hours down the road from
Speaker 1: Tucson to get to an ocean. It was amazing. I relaxed,
Speaker 1: got away from the game of basketball, for a little bit,
Speaker 1: which was nice. I haven't done that in a long time.
Speaker 1: Food was amazing, very very enjoyable trip. I am happy
Speaker 1: to be back though, and we have a lot to
Speaker 1: get into today. We had a very interesting report for
Speaker 1: Major in Ogonowski on the Kevin Durant trade situation that
Speaker 1: I want to get into, just kind of update on
Speaker 1: all the latest intel that we have there. We're gonna
Speaker 1: talk some Kyrie Irving, why I think he's not a
Speaker 1: Laker yet, some specific hallmarks from trade negotiations that typically
Speaker 1: me that something's about to happen. That we'll get into
Speaker 1: here a little bit. And then at the end, the
Speaker 1: one trade that did happen while I was out of town,
Speaker 1: Rudy Gobert the Minnesota Timberwolves giving up a lot a
Speaker 1: lot of stuff, five players, four first round draft picks,
Speaker 1: and a pick swap for Rudy Gobert, setting an outrageous
Speaker 1: star trade market to start this summer. We're gonna get
Speaker 1: into all of the details from that trade. What I
Speaker 1: think was a very very interesting misread of the way
Speaker 1: the league is heading from Tim Connolly. That will get
Speaker 1: into some XS and O stuff later on in the shows.
Speaker 1: To stick around for that. But let's get started with
Speaker 1: k D. So you know, up front, I think one
Speaker 1: of the things that people were missing on this specific
Speaker 1: trade was it doesn't resemble any of the other recent
Speaker 1: superstar trades. Like when we look at James Harden wanting
Speaker 1: to get out of Brooklyn, he was a shell of
Speaker 1: him self. His value was incredibly low compared to his peak.
Speaker 1: Even when he got traded from Houston. He was actively
Speaker 1: sabotaging that situation so much that it scared away a
Speaker 1: lot of teams, diminished his own value. You know, we
Speaker 1: look at Paul George, no one, no one even knew
Speaker 1: he was available, right, it was a one man bidding
Speaker 1: war between the in the Clippers, and to the Thunders credit,
Speaker 1: they got everything out of them. Right. Kawhi Leonard that trade,
Speaker 1: if you remember, we hadn't even seen him playing a
Speaker 1: long time because of the right and he tended the
Speaker 1: path you think, and when he did go play, it
Speaker 1: didn't look like Kawhi Leonard. So there's just not a
Speaker 1: great example recently of a bona fide top five player
Speaker 1: at the peak of his powers, who is not a malcontent,
Speaker 1: who doesn't have any sort of drama attached to him
Speaker 1: that wants a trade. It's very, very unusual. That's why
Speaker 1: his value is so much higher than I think people realize.
Speaker 1: And that's why teams like Phoenix and My I mean
Speaker 1: didn't make a ton of sense to me initially when
Speaker 1: they were brought up. I understand why they make sense
Speaker 1: for KD. I mean, these are basketball teams that have
Speaker 1: just about every box checked except for alpha dog superstar. Yes,
Speaker 1: Jimmy Butler can be it on any given night, but
Speaker 1: as you saw in that series against the Celtics, it's
Speaker 1: like you're gonna get two or three heroic performances out
Speaker 1: of him, and then in the other three or four
Speaker 1: he's gonna be pretty mediocre to flat out bad. Sometimes.
Speaker 1: It's a very interesting experience with Jimmy Butler. And then
Speaker 1: we got Phoenix and they were like the perfect basketball
Speaker 1: team minus a superstar, right, So it makes a lot
Speaker 1: of sense and I get that. But the truth of
Speaker 1: the matter was is you just knew Brooklyn was gonna
Speaker 1: want a lot for Kevin Durant, as they should, especially
Speaker 1: in light of everything that went down during the time
Speaker 1: that Katie and Kyrie were in this partnership with the franchise.
Speaker 1: They're gonna want a really, really good basketball player in
Speaker 1: that trade. They're gonna want a lot of draft picks,
Speaker 1: probably gonna want quality role players too. That's the other
Speaker 1: unique angle to this trade. Brooklyn is not incentivized to
Speaker 1: lose because all of their draft picks are going to
Speaker 1: the Houston Rockets. There's just nothing to gain from them losing.
Speaker 1: So they're in the weird predicament where they want to
Speaker 1: actually take in as many draft picks as possible, but
Speaker 1: win as many games as possible because you're basically establishing
Speaker 1: a culture and all the other benefits that come from
Speaker 1: winning when a draft pick is not the reward at
Speaker 1: the end. So there's always going to be a different
Speaker 1: type of negotiation compared to some of the star trades
Speaker 1: that we've seen in the past. And if I'm Brooklyn,
Speaker 1: I just don't think DeAndre Ayton is a foundational piece
Speaker 1: in a league or the center position is like the
Speaker 1: running back is in the NFL, the most easily replaceable
Speaker 1: position in the league. DeAndre Ayton might be one of
Speaker 1: the top three or four role player centers, meaning not
Speaker 1: counting Yokashire Embiid, he might be a top three or
Speaker 1: four role player center in the entire league, but for
Speaker 1: a veteran minimum contract. Let's say Damian Jones who's playing
Speaker 1: for the Lakers next year and played for the King's
Speaker 1: last year. A Damien Jones can give you of what
Speaker 1: Aidon can do for a veteran minimum contract. That's the
Speaker 1: league that we leave. We live in now that just
Speaker 1: that specific position is not as valuable as the other
Speaker 1: areas around the floor. Michael Bridges very good basketball player,
Speaker 1: defensive player of the Year type of candidate, very clearly
Speaker 1: not an offensive star. That just that hasn't developed to
Speaker 1: this point. Is it doesn't mean it can't happen, but
Speaker 1: it doesn't look like it's gonna happen. And then we
Speaker 1: looked over at Miami and Tyler Harrow is not that
Speaker 1: guy either, very similar type of deal. He's a bench
Speaker 1: score in this league and doesn't do enough defensively to
Speaker 1: really hold down a starting spot. Bamon a Bio, in
Speaker 1: addition to being legally incapable of being jammed into this trade,
Speaker 1: is another one of those guys that I'm not sure
Speaker 1: really moves the needle for Brooklyn a lot. That's why,
Speaker 1: if you guys, remember I pointed out two teams as
Speaker 1: teams that I thought had the best chance to get
Speaker 1: Kevin Durant, and the teams that I thought should with
Speaker 1: their name in the hat. It was the Toronto Raptors
Speaker 1: and the New Orleans Pelicans. Why did I bring up
Speaker 1: those teams? I brought up those teams because they immediately
Speaker 1: have two things that will be very appealing to the
Speaker 1: Brooklyn Nets, A ship ton of draft picks in a
Speaker 1: bona fide sure thing young NBA up and coming star.
Speaker 1: I don't know a lot about Scottie Barnes, and I
Speaker 1: don't know a lot about Zion Williamson. Specifically, with Scotty Barnes,
Speaker 1: remains to be seen whether or not his offensive development
Speaker 1: keeps up at the pace that like a Janic Stid
Speaker 1: who is a similar archetype as a young player in
Speaker 1: this league, and was I in its health and body
Speaker 1: weight stuff like that. Right, they have some question marks,
Speaker 1: but we can be relatively certain with both of them
Speaker 1: that they will have many seasons where they are way
Speaker 1: better than DeAndre Atan bay met A Bio or Michail
Speaker 1: Bridges could ever be because they have a firm ceiling
Speaker 1: on on what they're capable of that has been clearly
Speaker 1: defined over there of the last couple of seasons in
Speaker 1: the NBA. But you know, Scotty Barnes kind of looks
Speaker 1: like a similar type of player to Jannis on Antenna Coompa. Obviously,
Speaker 1: Janice is going to go down as an all time great,
Speaker 1: So I'm just saying in a similar type of archetype,
Speaker 1: not as good, could be, not as good, but that
Speaker 1: type of archetype of player, giant point forward that can
Speaker 1: be an all world defensive player that is physically just
Speaker 1: impossible to match up with. It was honestly a very
Speaker 1: impressive player despite playing their injury during his first playoff
Speaker 1: series this year, in terms of his overall impact on
Speaker 1: both ends of the floor. And then Zion Williamson. I mean,
Speaker 1: even if the Pelicans don't trade him, thinking about him
Speaker 1: next year, surrounded with all the shooting that they're gonna have,
Speaker 1: he's gonna be outrageously good. And he's just gonna be
Speaker 1: kind of like Blake Griffin was there during the two
Speaker 1: thousand tens, Like on the low end, they'll be the
Speaker 1: tenth best player in the league. He'll be the seventh
Speaker 1: best player in the league. Right He's gonna be a
Speaker 1: twenty five and thirteen guy in this league when he's healthy.
Speaker 1: So the those guys are your clear cut assets that
Speaker 1: a team like Brooklyn would absolutely want. Or I'm gonna
Speaker 1: get all the draft picks to refill my conference so
Speaker 1: I can start drafting each year and this one singular
Speaker 1: all world talent that I can develop over the course
Speaker 1: of the next few years to possibly partner with one
Speaker 1: of these draft picks. They those two teams always made
Speaker 1: the most sense in this report that came out today
Speaker 1: from Woes And we're gonna talk about the specific team
Speaker 1: you mentioned here in a second, but he talked about
Speaker 1: how every other team around the league needed to facilitate
Speaker 1: this deal with a third team. What does that tell you?
Speaker 1: That tells you Brooklyn isn't seeing the combination of things
Speaker 1: that they want from the singular teams that they're talking to,
Speaker 1: because in their predicament, it would make sense that they
Speaker 1: would want a sure thing type of prospect as opposed
Speaker 1: to a maybe type of prospect or a more developed
Speaker 1: prospect prospect that's not good enough, like a McHale Bridges,
Speaker 1: a Tyler Harrow or DeAndre eight. So who specifically stead
Speaker 1: today that the Raptors are the team that could have
Speaker 1: kd Now if they want him, they have the pieces
Speaker 1: necessary to do a one on one deal with the
Speaker 1: Brooklyn Nets. I saw some other intel elsewhere today that
Speaker 1: the Pelicans are kind of bowing out of that race
Speaker 1: for the time being. I actually thought it would be
Speaker 1: the opposite. I thought the Pelicans would be more likely
Speaker 1: because of Zion's injury concerns, because of Zion's weight concerns.
Speaker 1: I just thought it made more sense for them to
Speaker 1: bail out of that situation, especially with all the intel
Speaker 1: from Zion potentially not being happy with the Pelicans. I
Speaker 1: know he signed the deal for the money, but he
Speaker 1: strikes you as your classic dude, who's gonna leave after
Speaker 1: that deal? Right? I always thought, Scottie Barnes, you know
Speaker 1: it was it was it made more sense to keep
Speaker 1: in that between those two specific scenarios. So interestingly enough,
Speaker 1: Toronto is the team that has kind of entered into
Speaker 1: that discussion. Now we've seen Toronto do this specific thing before,
Speaker 1: target the wind Now Star with Kawhi Leonard and it
Speaker 1: worked for them, and that's probably why M. S I U.
Speaker 1: Jerry has been more interested in potentially making this type
Speaker 1: of deal. Here's why it makes sense to me for
Speaker 1: both teams. If I'm Zion, if I if I have
Speaker 1: Zion under team control, or if I have Scotti Barnes
Speaker 1: under team control. Again, your best case scenario is he
Speaker 1: develops into a top five player and maybe for five
Speaker 1: to seven years you can have him under team control
Speaker 1: as a top five player in the league and make
Speaker 1: some runs at a championship. Right that's the goal, That's
Speaker 1: what you want to do. Drafting in the n b
Speaker 1: A well, if you could have Kevin Durant right now,
Speaker 1: a sure thing top five player in the league, who again,
Speaker 1: we can say all we want about Kyrie. Katie is
Speaker 1: a great part of any franchise, a consummate professional, and
Speaker 1: the dude loves to play basketball. So all the drama
Speaker 1: stuff is just not there with Kadie. So if I
Speaker 1: could have that guy right now, even if you just
Speaker 1: told me, hey, Jason, in this four years, he's only
Speaker 1: going to be an All World MVP candidate for two
Speaker 1: or three of them, Even if you just told me that,
Speaker 1: I'd rather for sure have two or three cracks at
Speaker 1: a title, then maybe five to seven cracks at a
Speaker 1: title maybe in the distant future. With these young players,
Speaker 1: and that's hoping that I've got the requisite pieces around
Speaker 1: them to do so, unlike the Calves with Lebron in
Speaker 1: the late two thousand's right, that's the that's the predicament
Speaker 1: here right now. If you're Toronto and you can flip
Speaker 1: Scotty Barnes and Salary Filler like a Fred vand Lead
Speaker 1: or something to the nets, you right now have the pieces.
Speaker 1: If I'm rolling out lineups with o g Ana Nobi
Speaker 1: and Kevin Durant and and and Pascal Siakam and and
Speaker 1: Bouche and Birch like as an outrageously athletic two way lineup,
Speaker 1: and Kevin Durant fills a super specific need for that group,
Speaker 1: which is high end offensive creation. So like, why would
Speaker 1: you cling to a guy like Scotty Barnes too, Hopefully
Speaker 1: in the future roll him out as a top five
Speaker 1: player with a bunch of good role players when you
Speaker 1: could do that right now with Kevin Durant and get
Speaker 1: a trophy right now. If Kevin Durant gets flipped for
Speaker 1: Fred Van Vleet and Scotty Barnes and Salary Filler, even
Speaker 1: if they tossed in O g as long as they
Speaker 1: keep Pascal Siakam and Kevin Durant, with all the other
Speaker 1: length and athleticism that they have, they instantly become a
Speaker 1: top tier contender to meet with their coaching, who, as
Speaker 1: we remember from this playoff run, that coaching is so
Speaker 1: vitally important, like we saw from Erik Spoelscha and from
Speaker 1: and from Steve Kirk right, go down to the New
Speaker 1: Orleans Pelicans, same type of deal. If I can flip
Speaker 1: Zion Williamson and some other salary filler towards Brooklyn and
Speaker 1: get back Kevin Durant, and I'm rolling out Kevin Durant,
Speaker 1: Herb Jones, Trey Murphy, Brandon Ingram, c J McCollum, I
Speaker 1: instantly had. It's a less athletic version of what was
Speaker 1: going on in Toronto, but way more offensively coherent. Right
Speaker 1: with Brandon Ingram and c J McCollum, that's a top
Speaker 1: tier contender overnight. So, David Griffin, who has backed out
Speaker 1: of this discussion for whatever reason, you're hoping in the
Speaker 1: future to roll out Zion Williamson as a top five
Speaker 1: player and a bunch of role players to win title.
Speaker 1: How about you do that now with Kevin Durant, that.
Speaker 1: That's why those two teams were the two teams that
Speaker 1: had my eye on. I'm impressed by the Raptors for
Speaker 1: sticking their name in that discussion, and I hope they
Speaker 1: closed the deal because they're a very well run organization.
Speaker 1: They will find another player the quality of Scotty Barnes
Speaker 1: in the future, just like they did with Scotti, because
Speaker 1: they're a smart basketball team, and I have no doubts
Speaker 1: that they can do this the like they did with Kauai,
Speaker 1: like they did in the last couple of years, and
Speaker 1: like this potential Kevin Durant situation. Perennially be the team
Speaker 1: that is a mix of excellent culture, excellent coaching, excellent management,
Speaker 1: excellent ownership that can ride the tide of finding talent
Speaker 1: in the draft, finding talent outside the draft, finding talent
Speaker 1: free agency, find finding talent in the trade market. Being
Speaker 1: the team that can do all of those things. That's
Speaker 1: how you get to this point where you're consistently in
Speaker 1: the conversation as a team that can win the title.
Speaker 1: And I'm impressed by them. I hope they put what
Speaker 1: is necessary down to close this deal. Now. Kyrie is
Speaker 1: the one piece that's waiting in the wings here. So,
Speaker 1: first of all, Laker fans have every reason to feel
Speaker 1: confident that Kyrie Irving is going to eventually be a Laker.
Speaker 1: The reason why they should feel that way is because
Speaker 1: Kyrie and the Lakers make sense, and none of the
Speaker 1: other situations really make any sense, even the Dallas Mavericks
Speaker 1: potential partnership, which I pointed out as one that made
Speaker 1: some sense, and that there was some reporting on even
Speaker 1: that situation, like there's some risk there that Dallas might
Speaker 1: not want to deal with. Like basketball wise, having Kyrie
Speaker 1: Irving and they're driving kick system that's heliocentric makes a
Speaker 1: ton of sense as a slot into the Jalen Brunson roll.
Speaker 1: But they also really really like their head coach, and
Speaker 1: Luca don Chitch is trending towards being the best player
Speaker 1: in the league, and they just had this really successful
Speaker 1: low drama season where they came within seven wins of
Speaker 1: an NBA title, and Kyrie has some potential to ruin
Speaker 1: that as well if he brings along the Kyrie drama,
Speaker 1: if he brings along all the negative things that come
Speaker 1: with the Kyrie Irving experience. So there's as a matter
Speaker 1: of fact, you can probably bet that Dallas is looking
Speaker 1: at this like no, thank you. That doesn't mean they
Speaker 1: won't end up with him. It doesn't mean a third
Speaker 1: random team won't end up with him. I said on
Speaker 1: the night of free agency that I put it in
Speaker 1: about an eight percent chance that Kyrie would be a Laker.
Speaker 1: That's where I'm at right now. I think there's an
Speaker 1: eighty percent chance he'll be a Laker. That yes, that
Speaker 1: means there's a one in five chance, which is a
Speaker 1: pretty solid chance, that he ends up somewhere else, either
Speaker 1: as part of the Kadi trade or in some other move.
Speaker 1: If the Lakers get tired and and and move on
Speaker 1: from this situation, it's always a chance. But make no mistake,
Speaker 1: the partnership right there for the Lakers and Kyrie makes
Speaker 1: tons of sense. In the same way that Dallas would
Speaker 1: be scared of what Kyrie could do to mess things up,
Speaker 1: the Lakers just don't have that fear. They just came
Speaker 1: off of arguably the most disappointing season in franchise history.
Speaker 1: They were the second leading favorite in Vegas and didn't
Speaker 1: make the playoffs in a field that allows twenty of
Speaker 1: the thirty teams to make playoffs. It was a disaster.
Speaker 1: They just fired their coach, Russell Westbrook has been incredibly toxic.
Speaker 1: So even if they flipped Russ for Kyrie and Kyrie
Speaker 1: misbehaved a little bit, it's a better situation than what
Speaker 1: they had last year. So that's why that that that
Speaker 1: partnership is so natural. But what Laker fans have learned
Speaker 1: over the course of the last couple of days is
Speaker 1: a simple reality. Brooklyn, as much as it makes sense
Speaker 1: for them to trade Kyrie to the Lakers, has no
Speaker 1: incentive to do it right now. There's just no reason
Speaker 1: they are devoting their focus and energy to the KD
Speaker 1: trade as they should. It's the one that is clearly
Speaker 1: going to bring them the most in return, and Kyrie
Speaker 1: might end up having to help facilitate that if the
Speaker 1: right offer comes around. Plus, no matter what that Lakers
Speaker 1: offer is not going anywhere. The Lakers are gonna be
Speaker 1: there to trade for Kyrie later tonight, They're gonna be
Speaker 1: there to trade for Kyrie tomorrow. They're gonna be there
Speaker 1: in a week. They'd be there in a month if
Speaker 1: they had to. Now, I don't think it will drag
Speaker 1: out that long. My guess is the Kyrie Irving trade
Speaker 1: goes down shortly after the kd trade. But there's no
Speaker 1: reason for this to go down right this second. But
Speaker 1: at the same time, there's absolutely no way in hell
Speaker 1: that he's a Brooklyn Net next year. And I always
Speaker 1: am cracked up when I hear these kinds of of
Speaker 1: threats thrown around in trade negotiations. So many interesting callbacks
Speaker 1: to the to the Anthony Davis situation here, like like, uh,
Speaker 1: we might bring him to camp and see what happens. Yeah, No,
Speaker 1: you're not doing that. When you're trying to run a
Speaker 1: basketball team and you want to set your guys up
Speaker 1: for success, you never bring drama to training camp if
Speaker 1: you can avoid it. He got young players in the group,
Speaker 1: you have veteran players. You have guys that are actively
Speaker 1: bought in to the goal, and a coaching staff that's
Speaker 1: bought into the goal. You're not gonna bring Kyrie Irving
Speaker 1: to training camp in the middle of a trade negotiation.
Speaker 1: That's not going to happen. They weren't going to do
Speaker 1: it with Anthony Davis, and they weren't gonna do with
Speaker 1: Kyrie Irving. I will be stone cold shocked if he's
Speaker 1: at Nets camp, and if he is, he won't be
Speaker 1: at camp. He'll just be under contract with the team.
Speaker 1: As they continue to try to facilitate a trade, they'll
Speaker 1: send him home. There's just no way they'll do that.
Speaker 1: I heard intel that the Nets might use him as
Speaker 1: salary filler. Yeah, no, they're not going to do that
Speaker 1: when they can get a first round pick from the Lakers.
Speaker 1: The only way they're gonna use him as salary filler
Speaker 1: is if it's the only way to facilitate a trade
Speaker 1: with some team out there that nets them more than
Speaker 1: what the Lakers would give them. Like that, they can
Speaker 1: absolutely get a first round pick from the Lakers right now,
Speaker 1: Why why would they Why why would they blow that
Speaker 1: to use him as salary filler. Now, what they are
Speaker 1: saying is, yeah, like, if it comes to a deal
Speaker 1: where some team goes, we'll take Kyrie and Katie or
Speaker 1: here's all the stuff we're gonna give you and we
Speaker 1: want them both, then yeah, like that might happen, But
Speaker 1: you're not keeping Kyrie as an asset for anything else
Speaker 1: than to just see what happens on the KD front. Now,
Speaker 1: the specific reason why Kyrie has so much power in
Speaker 1: this situation, even that you think he wouldn't is his
Speaker 1: threats are especially power focused. He'll actually do them, you know,
Speaker 1: like Kyrie told the Calves in two thou eighteen, in
Speaker 1: the summer of two thou seventeen, if you don't trade me,
Speaker 1: I will get surgery on my knee. Kyrie not this
Speaker 1: past season, but the year before, despite contractual obligations, just
Speaker 1: up and left the team twice for extended periods of
Speaker 1: time without even telling the coaching staff. So his feeling
Speaker 1: when he sees his contract, when he sees his obligation
Speaker 1: to be somewhere, is not all that binding. So for
Speaker 1: him to threaten, like, hey, I'm going to the Lakers,
Speaker 1: so the only team I want to play for if
Speaker 1: you trade for me, I'm going there next year. I
Speaker 1: don't want to play anywhere then for the Lakers. That's
Speaker 1: a threat that he will actually fulfill. And it's a
Speaker 1: huge part of why so many teams out there are
Speaker 1: not interested in Kyrieer but because he's not the guy
Speaker 1: that you'll trade for and convinced to play. K D
Speaker 1: might be like Toronto wasn't his list of destinations originally,
Speaker 1: I don't think at least, but I know it wasn't
Speaker 1: his favorite destination. But as soon as he shows up
Speaker 1: and starts talking basketball with Massiugerie and Nick Nurse, as
Speaker 1: soon as he starts talking basketball with with Pascal Siakim
Speaker 1: and those guys, he's gonna be ready to go. Because
Speaker 1: he's a hooper first and foremost, and he does feel
Speaker 1: binding when he looks at his contract, he does feel
Speaker 1: an obligation to fulfill his contractual expectations. Kyrie does not.
Speaker 1: And so all of that work Kyrie has been doing
Speaker 1: behind the scenes to try to put to to let
Speaker 1: everybody know he wants to be a Laker. It is powerful. Look,
Speaker 1: Brooklyn got just like the Pelicans. Remember when the when
Speaker 1: the Pelicans trade was happening with the Lakers, all of
Speaker 1: this animosity towards the Lakers. You knew the Pelicans hated him.
Speaker 1: All the reporting was like that. To remember when the
Speaker 1: Lakers couldn't get him at the deadline in and then
Speaker 1: Adrian Warznowski is like, and the Boston Celtics will get
Speaker 1: their chance to trade for Anthony Davis. It's like, no,
Speaker 1: but Anthony Davis doesn't want to go there, and he's
Speaker 1: not the type of player that KD is. So Boston
Speaker 1: obviously didn't want to include dassets, and they didn't get
Speaker 1: Anthony Davis. And then there there were the Lakers, and
Speaker 1: yeah they went down kicking and screaming. Yeah I got ugly,
Speaker 1: but the Lakers sent him a bunch of stuff, and
Speaker 1: then Anthony Davis was a Laker. The same situation is
Speaker 1: happening here. The Nets are probably so sick of Kyrie,
Speaker 1: they're probably like, screw this guy. If they had the
Speaker 1: opportunity to burn him down, they would. They probably will
Speaker 1: anonymously after he's gone, after they've made the trade. They
Speaker 1: have no reason to want to send Kyrie to his
Speaker 1: preferred destination. They simply have to because Kyrie has all
Speaker 1: the leverage. He's burnt the bridge with every other team
Speaker 1: in the league, and the Lakers are willing to give
Speaker 1: you a first round pick. Now it seems to me
Speaker 1: like the Brooklyn is trying to haggle him for a
Speaker 1: second first round pick. And don't get me wrong, that
Speaker 1: is actually sound asset management for the Lakers to be like, no, no, no,
Speaker 1: no, no no, that's enough, and we give you Russ, we
Speaker 1: give you a first we take that Kyrie, or we
Speaker 1: keep the first and we'll take on your bad Joe
Speaker 1: Harris contract. But that's it. Those are the only two
Speaker 1: situations there. They don't need to overpay for Kyrie, they
Speaker 1: just might need to wait a little bit for him.
Speaker 1: That said, I still, all things included, expect likely that
Speaker 1: Kyrie will be a Laker, even if he doesn't get traded,
Speaker 1: even if he gets used as salary filler, Even if
Speaker 1: some of those threats from Brooklyn come true. The far
Speaker 1: more likely scenario is the team he ends up on
Speaker 1: ends up buying him out, and then he ends up
Speaker 1: with the Lakers. So it just feels like an inevitability,
Speaker 1: but it's also something that is not a rush. Step
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Speaker 1: of here tonight, let's talk about this Rudy Gobert trade.
Speaker 1: So the Utah Jazz and Rudy Gobert to the Minnesota
Speaker 1: Timberwolves for Malik Beasley, Patrick Beverley, Leandrew Bromorrow, Walker Kessler,
Speaker 1: Jared Vanderbilt, the three first round pick, the first round pick,
Speaker 1: the six pick swap seven first round pick, and he
Speaker 1: protected first round pick in So, before we get any
Speaker 1: for they're into this, I gotta admit that I was
Speaker 1: incredibly wrong about this, specifically that Rudy Gobert would ever
Speaker 1: fetch this much of a trade return. I got into
Speaker 1: several arguments with several people about this this year, and
Speaker 1: I was just flat out wrong. All I was saying, like,
Speaker 1: and you guys know me, I'm a huge believer even
Speaker 1: a defender. I would say, in what Rudy Gobert does defensively,
Speaker 1: I've always just thought with his offensive limitations and the
Speaker 1: fact that he's gonna make forty plus million dollars half
Speaker 1: a decade from now, I didn't understand giving up real
Speaker 1: assets to strap your team down in terms of financial
Speaker 1: flexibility for a player that offensively is pretty limited. And
Speaker 1: so I was talking all sorts of ships, saying there's
Speaker 1: no WAYO Gobert would ever get this kind of trade return.
Speaker 1: And I was just flat out wrong. And I was
Speaker 1: stunned when I saw the trade. It was incredibly interesting.
Speaker 1: Now we all know what happened here. This was a
Speaker 1: textbook new owners, a group, new president of basketball operations.
Speaker 1: Let's just get in and stir the pot. Type of trade.
Speaker 1: You know, like you're foundationally. Now you're looking at this
Speaker 1: is Carl Towns cannot be our foundational defensive center. We
Speaker 1: need a real back line defensive guy. Carl Towns is
Speaker 1: a is a perimeter already ended big, so it shouldn't
Speaker 1: mess with our spacing too much. Anthony Edwards is our
Speaker 1: real star anyway, you know, we're gonna build around this core,
Speaker 1: will build around the periphery with this group, will be
Speaker 1: a much better defensive team. This will be great. I
Speaker 1: get the idea behind it, but I thought this was
Speaker 1: a fundamental misread of the direction that the NBA is
Speaker 1: going from Tim Connolly, If you guys remember, not the
Speaker 1: day after the NBA Finals, but like two or three
Speaker 1: days later, I did a whole thing on the five
Speaker 1: biggest things that I learned from this year's NBA Playoffs,
Speaker 1: and in it, for one of the segments, I've focused
Speaker 1: on the XS and those related things. And in that segment,
Speaker 1: if you guys remember my primary focus, the primary thing
Speaker 1: that I looked yet from as a lesson that I
Speaker 1: learned from this playoff run, is that the most important
Speaker 1: thing in the NBA right now, the most important roster
Speaker 1: construction piece, is perimeter size and athleticism, specifically the ability
Speaker 1: to contain ball handlers. Why did I say that, Because
Speaker 1: every Rudy Gobert type of talent in the world eventually
Speaker 1: can be game planned around. That's what happened to the
Speaker 1: Utah Jazz over the years. He became the butt of
Speaker 1: the joke wrongly as things would go south for Utah.
Speaker 1: You'd see Rudy Obert chasing a shooter out and watching
Speaker 1: him somebody knocked down a shot in his face, or
Speaker 1: you'd see him closing out on a guy and then
Speaker 1: somebody beating him off the dribble to the BASKETBA. What
Speaker 1: you would forget or not notice is that the original
Speaker 1: compromising of the defense was always from Donovan Mitchell or
Speaker 1: Mi con Lee or by Bogdanovitch or any of their
Speaker 1: perimeter players. They were giving up slashing drives to the middle,
Speaker 1: which would have met the compromise their defense. Gobert would
Speaker 1: step up, they kick out to a shooter who would
Speaker 1: either make a shot or they'd attack one more close
Speaker 1: out and get another wide open shot. It was the
Speaker 1: perimeter players that were the problem offensively in Utah. And
Speaker 1: I want to stay on our defensively in Utah. Excuse me,
Speaker 1: and I want to stay on the defensive end of
Speaker 1: the four here for just a second, because going over
Speaker 1: to Minnesota from February to the end of the season,
Speaker 1: when Minnesota really started to get going, they finished the
Speaker 1: year fourteen and seven to claw into the play in picture.
Speaker 1: If you guys remember during that stretch. They were top
Speaker 1: ten defense over the last twenty one games of the
Speaker 1: season's basically a fourth of the season. They were a
Speaker 1: top ten defense despite having Carl Anthony Towns as their
Speaker 1: back line defender, and he's one of the lower end ones.
Speaker 1: He is a below average back line defender in this league,
Speaker 1: and yet they were a top ten defense. Why is that? Because,
Speaker 1: as I said many times throughout the postseason, in the
Speaker 1: early rounds and towards end of the regular season, they
Speaker 1: are a great perimeter contained team. Patrick Beverley, Malik Beasley,
Speaker 1: Jared Vanderbilt, Jaden McDaniels, all of these guys to orient prints.
Speaker 1: All of these guys were a huge part of why
Speaker 1: Carl Towns was not exposed as a week back line defender.
Speaker 1: If you are containing the dribble drives and making it
Speaker 1: so that guys are not getting clear slashing lanes into
Speaker 1: the middle, then your back line defense becomes much less important.
Speaker 1: So the problem here is Tim Connolly should have known better. Yes,
Speaker 1: in the regular season, when you're funneling guys to go
Speaker 1: bear like Utah did, you can functionally run a great
Speaker 1: regular season defense. And for the record, I expect the
Speaker 1: Minnesota Timberwolves to be a better regular season team than
Speaker 1: what they've been in years past. They'll be five ever
Speaker 1: sixth seed as opposed to a playing team, and when
Speaker 1: there are five and six seed, they'll be able to
Speaker 1: look at each other and be like, hey, we made
Speaker 1: this deal. We're better. But just like with Utah, it's
Speaker 1: not about the ability to funnel to go beart in
Speaker 1: the regular season. It's about the ability to cover ground
Speaker 1: on the perimeter and contain ball handlers in the postseason,
Speaker 1: and in this specific case, it'll be the exact same problem.
Speaker 1: Malik Beasley and Patrick Beverley did a great job at
Speaker 1: the point of attack containing ball handlers this year. Jared
Speaker 1: Vanderbilt was arguably their best defensive wing last year. I
Speaker 1: like Jada McDaniels a little a little bit better, but
Speaker 1: they were the same type of athlete on the perimeter
Speaker 1: containing ball handlers. You are now going to be replacing
Speaker 1: those guys. Jade McDaniels will likely become a starter. Torre
Speaker 1: and Prince will likely become a starter. My guess is
Speaker 1: it will be aunt those two guys, Carl Towns and
Speaker 1: Rudy Gobert. That sounds great, right, but now every other
Speaker 1: perimeter player that plays this year will have to be
Speaker 1: filled in around the margins that are in minimum contracts,
Speaker 1: young players, draft picks, things along those lines, Your depth
Speaker 1: in perimeter contain just got way worse. And as a result,
Speaker 1: especially in a playoff series, when teams start targeting you
Speaker 1: and teams start game planning around the Gobert problem, that
Speaker 1: lack of perimeter defense will become an issue. So even
Speaker 1: if we forget about the draft picks and all of
Speaker 1: the capital that they sent and just focus on the basketball,
Speaker 1: I don't understand limiting yourself by taking away your depth
Speaker 1: for the sake of a defensive fulcrum that primarily will
Speaker 1: bring value in the regular season. And that's why I
Speaker 1: say that's why I do those lessons podcasts after each season.
Speaker 1: I did one last year too. Becauld pay attention to
Speaker 1: the league. This is what drives me nuts about the
Speaker 1: Lakers with Rob Polinka. I just feel like he's not
Speaker 1: paying attention to what's happening happening around the league. If
Speaker 1: he was paying attention to what was happening around the league,
Speaker 1: there's no way he would sign Lonnie Walker, a six
Speaker 1: for young guard with his one midlevel exception slot instead
Speaker 1: of a bigger wing that could actually play for the
Speaker 1: Lakers in a postseason series in a closing lineup. Rob
Speaker 1: Polinka hasn't been watching enough NBA basketball to understand that
Speaker 1: that was a bad idea. You had to use your
Speaker 1: one significant salary slot on a player between six six
Speaker 1: and six nine that can guard multiple positions and be
Speaker 1: in your closing lineup alongside Lebron and a d And
Speaker 1: he missed the boat on that because he's not paying attention.
Speaker 1: If Tim connolly closely watched this NBA postseason every single game,
Speaker 1: he would have noticed that his perimeter defense was why
Speaker 1: his team was good, in conjunction with Anthony Edwards greatness,
Speaker 1: in conjunction with cat when he was playing well, that's
Speaker 1: when this was good, and it did. It wasn't back
Speaker 1: line defense that was the problem. They actually were defending
Speaker 1: pretty damn well. Obviously, Aunt needed to get better. D'Angel
Speaker 1: Russell ended up being a shortcoming in the playoffs. Into
Speaker 1: in the playoff series, Carl Towns was a little bit inconsistent,
Speaker 1: but they didn't have a back line defense problem. I
Speaker 1: was really impressed with their half court defense against Memphis,
Speaker 1: against the team that puts a lot of pressure on
Speaker 1: the rim, and so I I just just strictly from
Speaker 1: an XS and O standpoint, it was a misread of
Speaker 1: the way the NBA is going. Then when you get
Speaker 1: into all the picks and players they gave up, then
Speaker 1: it gets even more annoying and frustrating and inconceivable. Now
Speaker 1: let's let's go to the offensive end of the flour
Speaker 1: because this is where I think it gets really really
Speaker 1: Like Dicey from Minnesota, now, what really happened in Utah?
Speaker 1: The real reason that the Rudy Gobert fit didn't work
Speaker 1: was the offensive end of the floor. On defense, Rudy
Speaker 1: was out kicking his coverage. He was covering for a
Speaker 1: ship ton of mistakes from other players. I will go
Speaker 1: to the graves saying that Rudy Gobert has always been
Speaker 1: a very good defensive player, and almost every facet of
Speaker 1: defense is he kawhile entered guarding a wing. No, but
Speaker 1: he's good guarding a wing, and he's good guarding a guard,
Speaker 1: and he's one of the most dominant room protectors of
Speaker 1: all time. The defense is not an issue for Gobert.
Speaker 1: Never made sense to talk about that. But in the
Speaker 1: NBA on the offensive end of the floor. When you
Speaker 1: get into a switching scheme, which is what most teams
Speaker 1: do for most actions in the playoffs. When you get
Speaker 1: to that point, you have to be able to punish mismatches.
Speaker 1: If Rudy Gobert can go up and set a screen
Speaker 1: and they were on drop coverage and he can roll
Speaker 1: to the rim as a as a lop threat, that's great.
Speaker 1: Teams are gonna switch it. Why because Gobert won't post
Speaker 1: them up. And it's not a Utah Jazz problem. It
Speaker 1: was a Gobert problem. He was not capable of quickly
Speaker 1: fighting for a position, demanding the basketball, catching and quickly
Speaker 1: finishing around the rim. That was his shortcoming. That's why
Speaker 1: things went south in Utah. It turned them into an
Speaker 1: isolation team because Gobert's screening roles were not working because
Speaker 1: teams could easily switch them. That was the issue. That
Speaker 1: will become a problem even further as we head into Minnesota,
Speaker 1: and it's especially concerns me because Anthony Edwards is one
Speaker 1: of the best young slashers that we have in the league.
Speaker 1: I like Carl Towns at the five. There with great
Speaker 1: perimeter defensive players so that you don't have to worry
Speaker 1: about Carl Town's defense and so that you can play
Speaker 1: five out, because in a five out situation, you unlock
Speaker 1: Anthony Edwards as a freight train going downhill. Now you
Speaker 1: have to work Rudy Gobert into the dunker spot all
Speaker 1: the time. Now you have to permanently relegate Carl Towns
Speaker 1: to the perimeter. Hey, guess what, It's gonna be harder
Speaker 1: for you to face up from the high post to
Speaker 1: fight on the left block, to fight on the right
Speaker 1: block when Rudy Gobert is on the floor. This will
Speaker 1: fundamentally change the dynamic of their spacing, and I don't
Speaker 1: like that at all. They are gonna be moments where
Speaker 1: it works, They're gonna be lib dunks, They're gonna be
Speaker 1: plays where Rudy looks like he functionally fits into their offense.
Speaker 1: But for the most part in the aggregate, when you
Speaker 1: factor in the way that Rudy Gobert's man is going
Speaker 1: to be able to help drivers around the basket, I
Speaker 1: view it as in that negative. So all in all,
Speaker 1: looking at this thing in totality, I feel like they
Speaker 1: got a little bit better on defense in the regular season,
Speaker 1: but worse on defense in the postseason, and I think
Speaker 1: they flat out got worse offensively, especially with as good
Speaker 1: as a shooter Malik Beasley. Is I just, I just
Speaker 1: it was genuinely, genuinely confounding, but not the least bit
Speaker 1: surprising to see a new ownership group in a new
Speaker 1: basketball operations department go that route. I there'll still be
Speaker 1: an interesting team. They still have those two wings and
Speaker 1: Jade McDaniels and Torre and prints to put around those guys.
Speaker 1: But they gave up all their depth for a player
Speaker 1: that I think actually makes them worse in the postseason.
Speaker 1: And I think the story ends within being a II
Speaker 1: or succeed and then losing to one of the better
Speaker 1: Western Conference teams in the first round. Alright, guys, that
Speaker 1: is all I have for today. As always, I sincerely
Speaker 1: appreciate your guys support. I will follow me on Twitter
Speaker 1: at Underscore Jason LT and I'll give you guys some
Speaker 1: show announcements about what else we have coming this week,
Speaker 1: and I'll see you guys in a couple of days. Oh. Actually,
Speaker 1: I'm headed to NBA Summer League on Thursday, and I
Speaker 1: will be checking out all the top prospects there and
Speaker 1: I will have some special things lined up for you guys.
Speaker 1: Not sure exactly what yet. We're still playing some stuff,
Speaker 1: but like I said, follow me on Twitter at under
Speaker 1: Underscore Jason LT so you guys can see show announcements.
Speaker 1: As always, I appreciate you guys rocking with me and
Speaker 1: I'll see you in a couple of days. Volume