Speaker 1: You're listening to the Buck Sexton Show podcast. Let make
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Speaker 1: Brief everybody. We're going to continue with our coverage today
Speaker 1: of everything happening in Israel and the war against Hamas.
Speaker 1: There joining us is our friend David Harsanyi. He is
Speaker 1: a senior editor at The Federalist. David, thanks for being here.
Speaker 2: It's my pleasure. Thanks for having me.
Speaker 1: Now, I know the conflict is just really beginning now.
Speaker 1: The Israeli response, the counter strike is underway as we speak,
Speaker 1: and we've spent time on the show this week already
Speaker 1: discussing the atrocity, the heinousness of these crimes. It's beyond comprehension.
Speaker 1: It is an evil that it goes to the worst
Speaker 1: steps of depravity. I want to ask you, what do
Speaker 1: you think the strategy now the end state should be
Speaker 1: for net and Yahoo, the Israeli leadership. What what does
Speaker 1: the right response look like?
Speaker 2: Wow? I mean you know, there are I think different
Speaker 2: facets that I have to go through.
Speaker 1: There.
Speaker 2: One is, obviously you need to take care of Hamas. Now,
Speaker 2: I don't think that mission is done until you're speaking
Speaker 2: about them in the past tense, so you you know
Speaker 2: that means a ground war or you know, house to
Speaker 2: house combat or whatever in Gaza, which is going to
Speaker 2: be incredibly dangerous. I'm not like an expert, but surely
Speaker 2: it will be booby trapped. Because Israelis go out of
Speaker 2: their way to help civilians. They're basically like projecting where
Speaker 2: they're going to go, so Hamas knows where they're going
Speaker 2: because they want to move civilians. So it's going to
Speaker 2: be Israelis are going to lose lives doing that, but
Speaker 2: I think it's a necessary thing to do. Then obviously
Speaker 2: you have to start thinking about Isabella, and they're you know,
Speaker 2: threatening Israel constantly in the north, another Iranian proxy with
Speaker 2: real missiles, you know, far more dangerous armaments, I think.
Speaker 2: And then you have to start thinking about Iran. If
Speaker 2: a country actually they did, I mean, if a country
Speaker 2: helped logistically and with funding to attack your country, to
Speaker 2: kill your citizens and celebrated it, that's a declaration of
Speaker 2: war in most places for any normal country. Iranians did
Speaker 2: that to Israel and two eleven American citizens, not to
Speaker 2: mention the six hundred soldiers they've killed in the past,
Speaker 2: or more of Americans and the hostage industry they have.
Speaker 2: So im not saying we should go to war with them.
Speaker 2: What I'm saying is Israel is it has to in
Speaker 2: some way weaken that regime or hurt them. There has
Speaker 2: to be a price to pay for this, or they're
Speaker 2: going to do it again. And another country that needs
Speaker 2: to be thought about is Qatar, where Hamas leadership just
Speaker 2: sits in a Nancy Hotel room as this goes on.
Speaker 2: I mean, they're supposedly an ally of the United States,
Speaker 2: you know, I don't know. Those are the things that
Speaker 2: popped them up into my mind right now.
Speaker 1: What do you think about the the change that this
Speaker 1: may have in terms of the long term implications for
Speaker 1: what happens with the West Bank, with Gaza, you know,
Speaker 1: talk of two state solution, all this kind of stuff.
Speaker 1: I mean, it seems to me that Hamas has made
Speaker 1: it as clear as it as it honestly possibly can
Speaker 1: that not only does it have no it has no
Speaker 1: interest in a peaceful solution ever, but it is just
Speaker 1: a sworn mortal enemy of every every Jew in Israel,
Speaker 1: every Jew.
Speaker 2: In the world. Yeah, that was never going to happen.
Speaker 2: I mean Hamas. I'm sure your listeners know, and you
Speaker 2: know Gaza was given to Hama because it was given
Speaker 2: to the Palestinians in two thousand and five. It's kind
Speaker 2: of a test run for a state. I mean, Sharon,
Speaker 2: who was Prime Minister, literally went in there and moved
Speaker 2: Jews out. It was cleansed of Jews and they had
Speaker 2: a chance to have their own state. And what did
Speaker 2: they do they you know, they they elected Hamas. They
Speaker 2: killed Fatzau, which is supposedly more moderate action. There is
Speaker 2: no way that that can never be a sate and
Speaker 2: not I think it was this summer Fata and Jammas
Speaker 2: Warren talks to have a unity government. If you give
Speaker 2: any Palestinian the state, it's going to be a Fata run.
Speaker 2: I mean it's going to be a Humas run state.
Speaker 2: Kind of an elections in the West Bank because Hummas
Speaker 2: will win or people like Huamas will win those elections.
Speaker 2: That's why they don't have elections. So that is the
Speaker 2: dead idea. There is no two state solution here. There
Speaker 2: are already two states or three. There's Jordan, which has
Speaker 2: a majority Palestinian population, There's Egypt, and then there's Israel.
Speaker 2: Those are real countries. Those are the countries that in
Speaker 2: the end will have to work this out. From my perspective,
Speaker 2: as far as the government in Israel goes, I think
Speaker 2: there's going to be a price to pay for having
Speaker 2: the largest security breach in the history of that country
Speaker 2: in the history. Worse than Young Kipper War, worse than
Speaker 2: the nineteen sixties missile crisis. This is devastating, and I
Speaker 2: don't know why Netanyahu has been very despite perceptions here,
Speaker 2: very soft on Hamas overall, and he's not a hawkish
Speaker 2: type as they always portray him. I don't know how
Speaker 2: you can let this happen. People need to There has
Speaker 2: to be a political price for it as well. I
Speaker 2: don't know where that goes, but there has to be
Speaker 2: a political price.
Speaker 1: I think we'll come back to this in just a
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Speaker 1: I know that you know Biden addressed the nation yesterday
Speaker 1: on this issue, and you know he said a lot
Speaker 1: of the things that I think a lot of the
Speaker 1: things he said were the right things to say under circumstances,
Speaker 1: and I think they're pretty obvious things to say. What
Speaker 1: do you think of people that are tying biden administration
Speaker 1: policy vis ivy Iran and the six billion dollars and
Speaker 1: all of that too in any way, whether sort of
Speaker 1: encouraging or or even directly funding the preparations for this incident,
Speaker 1: the sneak attack that we saw. I mean, how do
Speaker 1: you assess all that.
Speaker 2: Gave a good present, give a good speech yesterday? You know,
Speaker 2: the that doesn't change the fact, first of all, that
Speaker 2: six billion. You know, the idea that that six billion
Speaker 2: didn't go to this exact attack is just a child
Speaker 2: can see that. That's stupid. You know, everyone understands how
Speaker 2: money is fungible, and they're how they conduct their own lives.
Speaker 2: I don't really want to get into that, but actually,
Speaker 2: you know, I should say that it's not just six billity.
Speaker 2: It's more like forty billion in waivers over the last
Speaker 2: few years. And that's not even talking about the hundreds
Speaker 2: of millions of dollars we send American tax payers directly
Speaker 2: to the Palestinians. The idea that none of that goes
Speaker 2: for this kind of preparation. Think about the scale of
Speaker 2: this operation down there. I mean, this is not something
Speaker 2: that you can just you know, get your gang together
Speaker 2: and do you have to plan this? It costs a
Speaker 2: lot of money. There are logistical things that you need
Speaker 2: to do. Israel's not some you know, third world state,
Speaker 2: you know, with like a rickety fence. This was planned.
Speaker 2: I mean, it seems like maybe they are. Actually but
Speaker 2: you know this was planned. So there's a lot of
Speaker 2: money that goes into that, and there's no way that
Speaker 2: indirectly our money or the EUS money or the UN
Speaker 2: money that we give that ends up in Palestinian places
Speaker 2: does not go towards this. It is mind boggling that
Speaker 2: we would send money to people who want to kill us.
Speaker 2: I'm not talking about Jews or Israelis. I'm talking about
Speaker 2: Hamas is, a terrorist organization on the US Department's Terrorists
Speaker 2: Justice Department's terrorist list. We're sending them money. It's insane.
Speaker 2: And has he stopped that payment? No? Has he stopped
Speaker 2: the six billion dollar check? No, as as far as
Speaker 2: I know. So, speech is nice, but actually he has
Speaker 2: done nothing really about those issues.
Speaker 1: So what has I mean Biden's posture toward Israel, if
Speaker 1: it hasn't gotten a lot of attention in the first
Speaker 1: three years of administration, what would you say about it?
Speaker 2: I'd say that he's a doddering old man who can
Speaker 2: put two thoughts together. And this is run by a
Speaker 2: bunch of ex Obama administration officials or pro Iran who
Speaker 2: wanted to lift Iran up to be a regional nuclear
Speaker 2: power in that area in my view, and that that's
Speaker 2: why you get people like Rob Malley, who, you know,
Speaker 2: I don't know if you've talked about this, basically had
Speaker 2: aspiring around him dictating Iranian policy or or you know,
Speaker 2: being in charge of Iranian policy. There is still someone
Speaker 2: in the Pentagon who pledged loyalty to the Islamic state,
Speaker 2: that kills Americans, that he kidnaps Americans, that funds all
Speaker 2: least proxy wars like I see these like in the media,
Speaker 2: you hear people talk about the Arab Israeli conflict. There's
Speaker 2: no Arab Israeli conflict. Most Arab countries are peace with Israel.
Speaker 2: There's a Palestinian Islamic Iran in specifically nexus that Israel
Speaker 2: is fighting. It is not a war against the Arab
Speaker 2: people or anything like that. And the Biden administration has acted,
Speaker 2: you know, in appeasement basically.
Speaker 1: So yeah, I mean, I want to ask you a
Speaker 1: follow up on that, David in just a second. But first,
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Speaker 1: That's t the number two t dot org. Why David
Speaker 1: does the again? The Obama apparatus, the upper echelon the
Speaker 1: Democrat Party, Why do they have? I guess I'd have
Speaker 1: to describe it. We talk about the appeasement a lot,
Speaker 1: but there seems to be an enduring excuse, making reflex
Speaker 1: and some kind of a fondness for the Iranian theocracy
Speaker 1: and the mulas who run it. Where does that come from?
Speaker 2: And Hamas and yeah, So I don't know. I mean,
Speaker 2: I think there's long been a connection between the left,
Speaker 2: the hard left, which has now been normalized where people
Speaker 2: sit in Congress are a part of that, and the
Speaker 2: sort of Third World movement and against colonialization and against
Speaker 2: you know, all that stuff. So I think that's always
Speaker 2: been there. And people like Obama, who I forget the name.
Speaker 2: I think it's called Rising Sun. If you read that book,
Speaker 2: you see he's had a long term of fondness and
Speaker 2: it's sort of almost an obsession with Iran. You know,
Speaker 2: it matters to him, and he surrounded himselfself with people
Speaker 2: like Ben Rhodes and Rob Mallley and others who believe
Speaker 2: that as well. So I don't know what the exact
Speaker 2: root of it is. I just I don't know. I
Speaker 2: just I think that they have an instinct to be
Speaker 2: an anti American. And I'm not saying like you can't
Speaker 2: be pro Palestinian states to make you anti American, but
Speaker 2: it's a civilization against barbarians, basically right from the thirteenth century.
Speaker 2: And if you're on the wrong side of that, if
Speaker 2: you both side that, I don't know what to say.
Speaker 2: I think you're against Western civilization and you're against America
Speaker 2: and you're an anti semit I don't really know how
Speaker 2: else to say it. I think it's pretty simple. I'm
Speaker 2: not saying that we all come to the same conclusion
Speaker 2: of what how we should act or what we should do.
Speaker 2: But if like you're AOC and you're out there tweeting
Speaker 2: about Islamophobia today baby's heads are being chopped off Jewish
Speaker 2: baby's heads, you're you're you're an anti semi. Functionally, you're
Speaker 2: an anti semi to me.
Speaker 1: I wanted to ask you. And I agree, David, with
Speaker 1: everything you just said and I've been saying. I just
Speaker 1: think that this is a choice between civilization and barbarism
Speaker 1: at its core, and the barbarism is motivated by a
Speaker 1: hatred that is fundamentally just about anti Semitism and hatred
Speaker 1: of Jews. But I do want to switch topics just
Speaker 1: for a moment, if I can. You know, it's just
Speaker 1: because it's been a lot, you know, it's been a
Speaker 1: lot this week, and I understandably so when it continues
Speaker 1: to be But I want to switch to the American
Speaker 1: political scene for a moment. Just get your sense of
Speaker 1: the RFK junior third party run, which looks like it's happening.
Speaker 1: How do you see this and what do you think
Speaker 1: it ends up doing? Like what's the effect of it?
Speaker 2: Now? Just to tie it into what we were just
Speaker 2: talking about. I think that this is a pretty clarifying
Speaker 2: moment for me in the sense that you see a
Speaker 2: lot of these people who have kind of like become
Speaker 2: part of the conservative movement because of the populism, anti
Speaker 2: woke stuff, but actually are terrible on a lot of
Speaker 2: other things. Right, That's how I think about RFK. I
Speaker 2: am not a fan. I think the guy is completely nuts.
Speaker 2: He's one of these people who has for a long
Speaker 2: time been conspiratorial and he tripped over something real. I'm
Speaker 2: not saying he was wrong about what he said about
Speaker 2: COVID or that he is wrong. You have to think
Speaker 2: about the bigger picture. It bothers me that so many
Speaker 2: conservatives or people on the right are enamored with him.
Speaker 2: I'm like, is this going to hurt Trump? More? Is
Speaker 2: gonna hurt Biden? Moore I don't really even know.
Speaker 1: Do you know this?
Speaker 2: If Donald Trump sees a poll where RFK is like
Speaker 2: taking away his votes, he's going to destroy that guy
Speaker 2: with a bunch of nicknames. And you know, he's going
Speaker 2: to bring up all this stuff the guy's done, a
Speaker 2: friend of Farakhan, you know, just the other stuff that
Speaker 2: he's done, and I think he'll be destroyed. I don't
Speaker 2: think he's going to be that big of a player
Speaker 2: in this election. But I you know, it's hard for
Speaker 2: me to get a handle on the American people lately.
Speaker 2: I thought that the last midterm. I see no reason
Speaker 2: Democrats should be winning anything these days. But you know,
Speaker 2: so I don't know, David.
Speaker 1: I this is my I walk around sometimes almost in
Speaker 1: a day, is like, what are people not getting at
Speaker 1: this point? You know, especially on things like the border
Speaker 1: and crime. I just I'm like, what what do Democrats?
Speaker 2: Anything? There? Anything going well for Democrats right now? Crime
Speaker 2: is up, the border stinks. The economy is in big trouble.
Speaker 2: I think, you know, we're teetering on some serious problems.
Speaker 2: Inflation is up, interest rates are high, and no one
Speaker 2: can buy a home like this. I've never seen the
Speaker 2: environment primed for Republican landslide since you know, historically speaking
Speaker 2: since maybe nineteen seventy nine, right, and I think it's
Speaker 2: much work. People are more partisan now. I don't know,
Speaker 2: you know how that's going to work out. There are
Speaker 2: other forces involved.
Speaker 1: So I totally, I totally agree. Just quick word from
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Speaker 1: where folks go, just to Federalist dot com to read
Speaker 1: your latest on this. I mean I've been reading your stuff.
Speaker 1: I'm Harsanyi columnist fans so Federless dot com.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's the best place to go for most of
Speaker 2: my stuff, David.
Speaker 1: I always appreciate your your your humble moral passion and clarity.
Speaker 1: You know, your humility while you're while you're in the fight, man,
Speaker 1: I appreciate it and thank you for what you do.
Speaker 1: We'll talk soon.
Speaker 2: Right back at you. Thank you,