WEBVTT - Reclaiming Our Time 0:00:11.840 --> 0:00:14.720 Good morning, peeps, and welcome to okay F Daily with 0:00:14.960 --> 0:00:20.240 Meet Your Girl Danielle Moody. Prerecording from the Home Bunker, Folks. 0:00:20.320 --> 0:00:24.000 I'm really excited to bring to you part one of 0:00:24.000 --> 0:00:28.040 a two part conversation that I had with the very 0:00:28.280 --> 0:00:35.760 esteemed doctor Dina Simmons. Doctor Simmons did a TED talk 0:00:36.560 --> 0:00:42.640 on impostor syndrome that was published at her former job, 0:00:42.960 --> 0:00:47.400 Yale Center for Emotional Intelligence, and she talks about the 0:00:47.479 --> 0:00:53.559 toxic environment of academia, particularly for black women. And you know, 0:00:54.280 --> 0:00:58.279 doctor Simmons in her TED talk, which was about her 0:00:58.320 --> 0:01:05.679 own experience as a black woman in a very racist 0:01:06.240 --> 0:01:08.839 higher ed system. And this is not the first time 0:01:08.920 --> 0:01:12.959 that I've had these conversations before, as it pertains to 0:01:13.040 --> 0:01:20.840 other esteemed doctors that I know from higher ed institutions 0:01:20.880 --> 0:01:25.720 that have been denied tenure. Right, we all watched publicly 0:01:25.800 --> 0:01:30.440 as it happened to Nicole Haddon Jones, the author of 0:01:30.440 --> 0:01:35.720 the sixteen nineteen project. We watched as she was denied 0:01:36.480 --> 0:01:41.360 tenure at Duke University, which was her alma mater, and 0:01:41.400 --> 0:01:44.880 then we watched that play out where she sued them, 0:01:45.760 --> 0:01:49.240 received an undisclosed amount of money and then went over 0:01:49.360 --> 0:01:53.160 to take her brilliance and her project over to Howard University, 0:01:53.560 --> 0:01:58.120 historically black college and university. And so we know that 0:01:58.120 --> 0:02:00.600 these things happened, but it doesn't just happen in the 0:02:00.680 --> 0:02:08.360 field of academia. Toxic, racist, misogynist environments are alive and 0:02:08.440 --> 0:02:12.640 well in every industry. And I will talk to doctor 0:02:12.720 --> 0:02:18.560 Simmons in this first part of two parts robust conversation 0:02:18.880 --> 0:02:22.520 about what it means to own your power, what it 0:02:22.560 --> 0:02:26.560 means to take up space. I was asked recently for 0:02:26.919 --> 0:02:30.120 the best advice that I have ever given and received 0:02:30.440 --> 0:02:34.120 at the Lesbians Who Teach summit in San Francisco earlier 0:02:34.160 --> 0:02:38.200 in October, and I said this about the best advice 0:02:38.280 --> 0:02:45.079 that I've ever given. Take up fucking space. Oftentimes, in 0:02:45.240 --> 0:02:48.760 a lot of my career until probably the last you know, 0:02:49.320 --> 0:02:53.120 I would say, the last five to six years, I've 0:02:53.120 --> 0:02:55.320 been the only one in the room. And what do 0:02:55.360 --> 0:02:57.600 I mean by that? The only black person, the only 0:02:57.680 --> 0:03:00.480 child of immigrants, the only queer person, the only woman, 0:03:00.639 --> 0:03:03.800 not often the only woman, but the other three. Absolutely, 0:03:05.520 --> 0:03:09.160 And that has been my path my entire life. As 0:03:09.200 --> 0:03:11.080 you all know who've listened to the show for a 0:03:11.200 --> 0:03:14.400 very long time, I grew up in a predominantly white 0:03:14.520 --> 0:03:20.680 suburb on eastern Long Island, and my public school education 0:03:20.840 --> 0:03:25.480 was in a ninety six percent white school and ninety 0:03:25.520 --> 0:03:31.560 six percent white community. And you know, by virtue of 0:03:31.720 --> 0:03:35.800 my parents and my family at large, I have never 0:03:35.880 --> 0:03:38.560 been one to shrink in a room where I do 0:03:38.640 --> 0:03:42.880 not see myself reflected for better or worse for many 0:03:43.200 --> 0:03:46.960 For many, many decades, I've seen myself as a need, 0:03:47.560 --> 0:03:51.960 the need to be an ambassador in those spaces. We 0:03:52.120 --> 0:03:55.720 will talk about the undue burden that that presents as well, 0:03:56.160 --> 0:03:59.800 the undue burden and stress, an additional labor that you 0:04:00.040 --> 0:04:03.600 are not being paid to do that happens when you 0:04:03.640 --> 0:04:06.760 are the only one in these spaces. And so what 0:04:06.800 --> 0:04:10.520 does it mean to reclaim rest? What does it mean to, 0:04:10.720 --> 0:04:15.560 as Auntie Maxine has said, Representative Maxine Waters, reclaim your 0:04:15.560 --> 0:04:21.479 time right. I'm currently reading If you guys follow me 0:04:21.520 --> 0:04:26.400 on Instagram, I did post a story recently Tricia Hersey, 0:04:26.480 --> 0:04:30.839 who is the Bishop of the NAP Ministry on Instagram. 0:04:31.200 --> 0:04:37.000 I am reading her debut manifesto Rest is Resistance, and 0:04:37.120 --> 0:04:42.000 in there she talks about how capitalism and white supremacy 0:04:42.080 --> 0:04:46.839 has robbed us of our dream space has robbed Black 0:04:46.960 --> 0:04:51.599 people in particular, which she dives into, but all of 0:04:51.720 --> 0:04:56.279 us collectively that are wrapped into capitalism and this grind culture. 0:04:56.600 --> 0:05:00.800 That I am only as valuable as what I produce right, 0:05:01.040 --> 0:05:05.880 not by virtue of who I am. And I think 0:05:05.920 --> 0:05:08.680 that it is really important for us to continue to 0:05:08.800 --> 0:05:16.320 unpack these conversations that help us reset our programming, because 0:05:16.640 --> 0:05:21.400 don't be mistaken, we have all been preprogrammed from a 0:05:21.520 --> 0:05:25.599 young child. I'll give you this from Tricia Hersey's book 0:05:25.720 --> 0:05:29.880 Rest Is Resistance, which is available now. I'll tell you 0:05:29.920 --> 0:05:35.680 this little tidbit she writes in the book about how 0:05:36.360 --> 0:05:43.560 from elementary school we begin to program children to be workers. 0:05:46.240 --> 0:05:49.720 We force young kids, and she'll tell an anecdote in 0:05:49.760 --> 0:05:55.280 the book to betray their bodies. This is her language, 0:05:55.760 --> 0:06:00.760 betray their bodies and conform to the time constraints that 0:06:00.839 --> 0:06:07.559 a teacher allows them to be able to use the bathroom. 0:06:07.640 --> 0:06:12.320 A child could be squirming in their seat, unable to 0:06:12.360 --> 0:06:15.760 hold their bladder, and a teacher will say to them, well, 0:06:15.960 --> 0:06:19.760 you can't use the restroom until twelve thirty. Well it's 0:06:19.800 --> 0:06:23.000 eleven forty five and my body is telling me I 0:06:23.080 --> 0:06:27.440 need to go now, and what do we do Well, 0:06:27.480 --> 0:06:32.840 we have kids have accidents quote unquote that demoralize them, 0:06:32.880 --> 0:06:37.719 that embarrass them all because they won't conform their bodies, 0:06:37.760 --> 0:06:44.200 won't conform to the productivity schedule that we begin to 0:06:44.240 --> 0:06:51.239 put them on as young as in kindergarten. Well, now 0:06:51.279 --> 0:06:56.040 look at your own routines. How we design our work calendars, 0:06:56.120 --> 0:06:59.560 or rather, how our work days are designed, that we 0:06:59.600 --> 0:07:02.960 are forming too. I can't tell you how many zoom 0:07:03.000 --> 0:07:07.080 meetings I jump on where folks tell me, Hey, Danielle, 0:07:07.200 --> 0:07:09.640 can you give me, you know, just three minutes. I'm 0:07:09.680 --> 0:07:11.960 so sorry, but I've been in back to backs all 0:07:12.000 --> 0:07:13.960 day and I haven't been able to use the bathroom. 0:07:14.400 --> 0:07:18.840 What can you just give me, you know, four minutes 0:07:18.880 --> 0:07:20.760 to go heat up a cup of coffee? Or do 0:07:20.800 --> 0:07:23.120 you mind if I eat on this call because I 0:07:23.200 --> 0:07:28.680 just haven't had any time. Because we have been programmed 0:07:28.720 --> 0:07:34.360 to believe that we are undeserving of that time, that 0:07:34.560 --> 0:07:38.800 we will seem lazy, we will seem like we are 0:07:38.840 --> 0:07:44.160 not dedicated to the work. If what I listen to 0:07:44.320 --> 0:07:46.720 the needs of my body, that I am not a 0:07:46.800 --> 0:07:51.080 machine that I actually do need to physically recharge and 0:07:51.120 --> 0:07:56.240 relieve myself and eat and breathe fresh air and get 0:07:56.320 --> 0:08:03.280 some sunlight and the conversation, the first part of this 0:08:03.360 --> 0:08:06.240 two part conversation that I have with doctor Dina Simmons, 0:08:07.000 --> 0:08:11.160 begins to unpack all of the systems that are at 0:08:11.200 --> 0:08:15.800 play that tell us that we are unworthy, and particularly 0:08:15.840 --> 0:08:19.800 those that have played on repeat for black people and 0:08:19.960 --> 0:08:24.840 black women throughout the course of time. So coming up next, 0:08:25.040 --> 0:08:28.800 dear friends, the first part of a two part conversation 0:08:29.520 --> 0:08:36.880 with my new friend, doctor Dina Simmons. Hey there, I 0:08:36.920 --> 0:08:39.480 want to tell you about another podcast I think you'll love. 0:08:39.559 --> 0:08:42.760 The Brown Girl's Guide to Politics, hosted by a Shanty Gohler, 0:08:42.880 --> 0:08:46.360 the president of Emerge BGG, is the one stop shop 0:08:46.360 --> 0:08:48.280 for women of color who want to hear and talk 0:08:48.320 --> 0:08:51.160 about the world of politics. Join a Shanty this season 0:08:51.200 --> 0:08:53.520 as she talks to incredible women of color who are 0:08:53.600 --> 0:08:55.840 changing the face of politics and tackling some of the 0:08:55.880 --> 0:08:59.680 most important issues basing the United States, from reproductive justice, 0:08:59.720 --> 0:09:02.760 to rights, to climate change and more. Tune in every 0:09:02.800 --> 0:09:08.440 Tuesday wherever you get your podcasts, Folks, I am very 0:09:08.480 --> 0:09:11.760 excited to welcome to woka f Daily for the very 0:09:11.800 --> 0:09:17.440 first time, Doctor Dena Simmons, activist, educator, Ted Talker, and 0:09:17.520 --> 0:09:21.280 the founder of Liberate Ed. She's also the upcoming the 0:09:21.720 --> 0:09:26.160 author of the upcoming book White Rules for Black People. 0:09:26.600 --> 0:09:33.480 Welcome to Woke f So I want to jump in 0:09:33.480 --> 0:09:36.840 and I want to talk about your upcoming book, and 0:09:36.880 --> 0:09:39.440 then we will talk about all the ways in which 0:09:39.880 --> 0:09:49.000 you have found yourself and other highly esteemed black academics, 0:09:49.480 --> 0:09:55.719 black women academics disrespected in your professional field and industry. 0:09:55.880 --> 0:09:58.640 But I want to dig into your upcoming book because 0:10:00.880 --> 0:10:04.240 I'm exhausted, as I know that you must be right. 0:10:04.480 --> 0:10:11.480 I'm exhausted by the chosen ignorance of white people. I'm 0:10:11.559 --> 0:10:17.360 exhausted by the media chasing the desire and the likes 0:10:17.400 --> 0:10:20.960 of the Karens and the Chads in order to decide 0:10:21.000 --> 0:10:24.120 whether or not we're going to turn into a fascist country, right, 0:10:24.160 --> 0:10:26.559 whether or not they deemed that their gas bills are 0:10:26.559 --> 0:10:30.679 too high to give a damn about our democracy and 0:10:30.800 --> 0:10:34.760 just equity in general. So I want to get your 0:10:34.480 --> 0:10:40.480 your your thoughts based around your upcoming book. What prompted it? 0:10:42.120 --> 0:10:46.760 So you know, I think many of us, So I 0:10:46.800 --> 0:10:49.200 think before talking about my book, I think I need 0:10:49.240 --> 0:10:51.880 to talk about the journey, right, So my journey to 0:10:52.480 --> 0:10:55.960 right now, having this conversation, to the book, to the 0:10:56.000 --> 0:10:59.480 places that I end up and have been and whatever 0:10:59.559 --> 0:11:04.600 my future hold. Right. So I started born and raised 0:11:04.640 --> 0:11:07.280 in the Bronx, New York, my mother coming into this 0:11:07.559 --> 0:11:10.880 country as a you know, an immigrant from at cleaning 0:11:10.880 --> 0:11:15.880 white people's homes and saying to herself, one day, I 0:11:15.920 --> 0:11:18.959 want my children to go to school like these white folks, right, 0:11:19.000 --> 0:11:22.679 because we've already she can tell as an immigrant in 0:11:22.720 --> 0:11:26.520 this country that white folks got better stuff, right, And 0:11:26.600 --> 0:11:28.679 so she said, I want my kids to have that too. 0:11:29.760 --> 0:11:31.600 And so when she had the opportunity, and when we 0:11:31.679 --> 0:11:34.360 learned of the opportunity of boarding school, we went to 0:11:34.440 --> 0:11:38.520 boarding school. Now, what no one did is prepare me 0:11:39.120 --> 0:11:42.160 for what it was like to leave the Bronx with 0:11:42.360 --> 0:11:46.360 everyone looking like me and for those who can't see me, 0:11:47.040 --> 0:11:50.320 I am a light skinned black woman. I have my 0:11:50.400 --> 0:11:54.640 hair up up and it's it's natural, curly, big state 0:11:54.880 --> 0:12:00.080 and approach, and I'm here going into this place and 0:12:00.080 --> 0:12:03.800 it was so overwhelmingly white. And so as a fourteen 0:12:03.840 --> 0:12:06.360 year old, I'm like, yo, I'm not gonna make no 0:12:06.440 --> 0:12:09.440 friends here. That was the first response that I had 0:12:09.480 --> 0:12:13.040 to my boarding school and that I ain't gonna make 0:12:13.120 --> 0:12:16.920 no friends here is the response and the feeling I 0:12:17.000 --> 0:12:20.000 usually get when I walk into white spaces. And so 0:12:20.040 --> 0:12:22.960 what I learned in the process of going to boarding 0:12:23.000 --> 0:12:27.040 school and then to college in Vermont and then to 0:12:27.240 --> 0:12:32.199 that you just keep d a white place after white blazing, 0:12:32.520 --> 0:12:38.800 right Ivy League, is I've better learn how to perform here, right, 0:12:38.800 --> 0:12:42.160 And so what black folks are or we are great performers, 0:12:42.400 --> 0:12:47.000 we will, yes, ma'am, and yester you because that's what 0:12:47.040 --> 0:12:52.000 we learned, right. And so I learned the rules of whiteness, 0:12:52.160 --> 0:12:54.000 and so that's why I was like, I learned how 0:12:54.120 --> 0:12:59.040 to navigate white spaces up to the point that it 0:12:59.120 --> 0:13:02.440 made me sick, up to the point that I said, 0:13:02.440 --> 0:13:04.480 I couldn't do this no more because it's me or 0:13:04.640 --> 0:13:07.480 it's me doing this or death. And so it got 0:13:07.520 --> 0:13:10.880 to the point where I just could not follow the 0:13:10.960 --> 0:13:15.360 rules anymore. And you know, I wanted to no longer 0:13:15.440 --> 0:13:19.400 have these white rules oppress me, limit me, keep me 0:13:19.520 --> 0:13:22.360 from my excellence, keep me from my fullness, keep me 0:13:22.400 --> 0:13:27.680 full from freedom. And so I, you know, left my 0:13:27.840 --> 0:13:31.679 Ivy League university because it was the most toxic place 0:13:31.720 --> 0:13:35.920 I've worked and but yet at the same time, as 0:13:35.960 --> 0:13:39.840 a child, the lessons that our schools teach us is 0:13:39.880 --> 0:13:42.880 that you should aspire to end up in a place 0:13:42.920 --> 0:13:46.800 like that. So in many ways, our rule system begins, 0:13:46.840 --> 0:13:54.240 it becomes the beginning or the the place where young 0:13:54.320 --> 0:13:59.080 people learned that they must aspire to whiteness. Yep. And 0:13:59.280 --> 0:14:04.080 so so now it's like my entire journey and my 0:14:04.200 --> 0:14:08.360 book will be about with white journey whiteness. But let 0:14:08.360 --> 0:14:10.800 me tell you, I was very good, like I said 0:14:10.800 --> 0:14:12.840 in my TED talk, and I don't even know if 0:14:12.840 --> 0:14:14.520 it made it to the Ted Talks. So some of 0:14:14.559 --> 0:14:17.600 my TED talk was edited out. But one of the 0:14:17.640 --> 0:14:21.240 parts that I think I edited out was the sort 0:14:21.240 --> 0:14:24.640 of psychic homelessness that many black folks feel in white 0:14:24.640 --> 0:14:28.800 spaces because we are performing for white spaces, but at 0:14:28.840 --> 0:14:32.040 the same time, in that performance, sometimes that performance becomes 0:14:32.040 --> 0:14:37.480 who we are. We leave themselves and sort of the 0:14:37.520 --> 0:14:40.720 grief that goes with that, sort of the trauma of erasure, 0:14:40.840 --> 0:14:44.440 of self erasure that goes with that, but also the 0:14:44.480 --> 0:14:49.000 fact that we learn to perform these places and do 0:14:49.040 --> 0:14:54.040 it so well that sometimes when we go home, our 0:14:54.080 --> 0:14:56.520 home doesn't even recognize us, So we don't even recognize 0:14:56.520 --> 0:14:58.040 our home, and we go home and we don't want 0:14:58.080 --> 0:15:00.840 home because it's nicer over there. So no one talks 0:15:00.880 --> 0:15:04.800 about all of that loss and grief that goes with 0:15:05.040 --> 0:15:07.880 taking a young black child from the hood and to 0:15:08.000 --> 0:15:09.720 saying we're going to give you a better life. But 0:15:09.840 --> 0:15:12.560 no one talks about the loss and the grief. We 0:15:12.640 --> 0:15:16.600 just focus on this very narrow definition of success being 0:15:17.680 --> 0:15:20.040 how do you get as close to whiteness and how 0:15:20.080 --> 0:15:23.360 do you guys far from yourself? So, like I shared 0:15:23.440 --> 0:15:26.840 my book, and we'll see that title six right is 0:15:28.240 --> 0:15:30.960 essentially a homecoming. Right, how do I come back home 0:15:31.000 --> 0:15:33.520 to myself? How do I come back home to my community? 0:15:35.040 --> 0:15:39.800 Because there has been that distance for so long. You 0:15:39.880 --> 0:15:43.080 have said so much that I want to I want 0:15:43.080 --> 0:15:48.840 to unpack for our audience who does not have the 0:15:48.880 --> 0:15:53.560 same experience. Right. I have often shared on this show 0:15:54.000 --> 0:15:56.360 my own experience of growing up in a ninety six 0:15:56.400 --> 0:16:01.000 percent white community, of going to a predominantly white institution, 0:16:01.200 --> 0:16:04.920 of being UM a child of immigrants. My family came 0:16:05.080 --> 0:16:10.000 from Jamaica, UM, so big up the Caribbean UM, and 0:16:10.680 --> 0:16:14.560 you know, and and the idea you know which my 0:16:14.640 --> 0:16:17.840 mother would learn later when my sister and I would 0:16:17.880 --> 0:16:22.600 go for our master's degrees, um, that She's like, I 0:16:22.680 --> 0:16:24.960 just chose the best school. I moved to the best 0:16:25.000 --> 0:16:29.080 school district that we could afford. Right that you know 0:16:29.320 --> 0:16:31.680 that that that we could afford to go to. And 0:16:31.840 --> 0:16:37.280 it didn't occur to me, right um, that there would 0:16:37.280 --> 0:16:42.800 be so many instances of assimilation and a razure that 0:16:42.880 --> 0:16:46.920 you would then unpack as adults and I and I 0:16:46.960 --> 0:16:51.960 didn't experience and I'll be honest, I didn't experience deep trauma. 0:16:52.240 --> 0:16:55.520 There are there are I have memories right that I 0:16:55.600 --> 0:16:58.640 have that I have unpacked over the over the years. 0:16:58.680 --> 0:17:02.160 But my experience allowed me to be able to navigate 0:17:02.680 --> 0:17:07.320 white spaces in a way that I have been able 0:17:07.320 --> 0:17:11.760 to utilize, right um. And again that white people don't 0:17:11.800 --> 0:17:14.439 ever have to do James Baldwin said, they never have 0:17:14.520 --> 0:17:16.719 to look at us, right, but we always have to 0:17:16.720 --> 0:17:20.440 look at them. And so for for for the audience, 0:17:21.200 --> 0:17:25.240 talk a little bit, if it's not too much about 0:17:25.760 --> 0:17:30.080 providing an example about the way that this performance works, 0:17:30.160 --> 0:17:35.000 what this performance actually looks like. And then the toll 0:17:35.840 --> 0:17:39.119 you know in this and I love the phrase in 0:17:39.440 --> 0:17:43.280 this psychic homelessness that happens. And I think that you know, 0:17:43.640 --> 0:17:47.240 in a lot of ways, a lot of performers, Broadway performers, actresses, 0:17:47.720 --> 0:17:49.719 you're taking on and the way that you take on 0:17:49.760 --> 0:17:53.800 these characters, at times you lose yourself in right. But 0:17:54.000 --> 0:17:57.640 unlike a Broadway show or a film, it's not done 0:17:57.680 --> 0:18:00.800 after several months. This is a lifetime performance. So can 0:18:00.880 --> 0:18:04.040 you talk a bit about how that shows up and 0:18:04.080 --> 0:18:08.880 what that looks like. So you set assimilation earlier, and 0:18:08.920 --> 0:18:13.480 so sometimes that assimilation looks like code switching. And so 0:18:13.600 --> 0:18:17.600 for folks who don't know, it's like I'm from the Bronx. 0:18:17.600 --> 0:18:21.000 And so when I'm coming in this white space and 0:18:21.080 --> 0:18:23.440 I'm like, yo, what's up? Good? What's good? Folks? And 0:18:23.600 --> 0:18:27.439 someone corrects me and tells me that good is an 0:18:27.480 --> 0:18:31.080 adjective and that well is an adverb. And when someone 0:18:31.119 --> 0:18:34.119 asks me, as asks me how I'm doing, I should 0:18:34.160 --> 0:18:37.040 answer with an adverbs or should be well right, or 0:18:37.200 --> 0:18:42.320 when I'm corrected for saying acts as acts instead of ask. 0:18:42.600 --> 0:18:45.920 So these little ways right that we get chipped and corrected. 0:18:46.040 --> 0:18:48.240 And so after a while you're like, oh, I gotta 0:18:48.359 --> 0:18:52.000 learn to speak like them. I gotta learn to talk 0:18:52.119 --> 0:18:55.840 like them. I gotta learn to smile like them. So 0:18:55.920 --> 0:18:59.200 you shift and change, and it's like called shape shifting 0:18:59.240 --> 0:19:03.280 that you sent do so that you ensure white comfort. 0:19:03.480 --> 0:19:05.040 That's really what you got to do when you go 0:19:05.080 --> 0:19:06.919 to white spaces and you ain't white, because you got 0:19:07.000 --> 0:19:09.359 to ensure that white folks say comfortable. So and so 0:19:09.480 --> 0:19:13.680 you always got to be aware that when you show 0:19:13.760 --> 0:19:16.040 up in this space, is that you are the work 0:19:16.080 --> 0:19:18.880 that you're doing to one perform and then the other 0:19:18.920 --> 0:19:21.200 work that you're doing to pay attention and to read, 0:19:22.440 --> 0:19:26.679 to read white white response to you is essentially the 0:19:26.720 --> 0:19:30.159 work of performance, right, because you're reading the room, so 0:19:30.200 --> 0:19:31.920 you read the room and as a young show, so 0:19:32.320 --> 0:19:35.200 sometimes change. It's changing the way you're dressing. It's changed 0:19:35.240 --> 0:19:38.119 in the way you walk. It's changing your hair, because 0:19:38.119 --> 0:19:40.159 we all know both. You know, when we wear our 0:19:40.200 --> 0:19:42.880 hair and the way it naturally grows out our head, 0:19:43.119 --> 0:19:46.960 it's considered unprofessional and right, I always say to folks 0:19:46.960 --> 0:19:51.040 who defines professionalism, why can't my natural state of being 0:19:51.119 --> 0:19:54.280 be professional? And those are ways in which we're raised, 0:19:54.400 --> 0:19:56.760 and that's the ways we learn to perform. So let 0:19:56.760 --> 0:19:58.800 me straighten my hair, let me perform. So then I 0:19:58.840 --> 0:20:02.160 don't come across as as too black for these folks, 0:20:02.200 --> 0:20:04.640 are too militant for these folks, right, And so those 0:20:04.680 --> 0:20:08.200 are the ways in which that we perform. But black 0:20:08.240 --> 0:20:12.920 folks have always been performing right when our enslaved ancestors 0:20:13.000 --> 0:20:17.760 were in working in you know, the enslaver's house, best 0:20:17.840 --> 0:20:22.320 believed they were smiling through their rage. Best believe, best 0:20:22.359 --> 0:20:26.359 believe that a bunch of black folks in institutions, whether 0:20:26.400 --> 0:20:30.480 it be corporate, academic, not for profit, are smiling through 0:20:30.520 --> 0:20:35.480 pain or smiling through comfort. Because again, what we learn, 0:20:36.520 --> 0:20:39.119 one of the rules we learn is to ensure that 0:20:39.119 --> 0:20:44.320 white folks maintain their comfort. And so I would say 0:20:44.400 --> 0:20:48.800 it's the shape shifting. It's the shifting and leaving some 0:20:48.880 --> 0:20:53.280 of yourself at home and taking out the yoe at 0:20:53.320 --> 0:20:56.159 the end of the sentence, you know. And folks and 0:20:56.200 --> 0:20:58.879 teachers often say, but that's the correct way to speak. 0:20:58.960 --> 0:21:01.719 You should be thankful to the teachers that corrected the 0:21:01.760 --> 0:21:06.000 way you speak. And I often say, in that correction, 0:21:06.480 --> 0:21:10.320 there's also a triggering. There's also and when I say triggering, 0:21:10.400 --> 0:21:13.680 I mean like the fact that there's a message that 0:21:13.760 --> 0:21:16.840 the way I am is wrong. So there's a way 0:21:16.960 --> 0:21:20.840 to honor what I bring naturally to a space, what 0:21:20.960 --> 0:21:25.000 I bring indigenously to a space. And I could be 0:21:25.080 --> 0:21:28.600 bilingual or multilingual, learn a new language instead of saying 0:21:28.640 --> 0:21:31.000 a race that because that that ain't right, and so 0:21:31.040 --> 0:21:33.199 I think too often an education that's what we do. 0:21:33.359 --> 0:21:35.600 We say a race, who you are and get it 0:21:35.640 --> 0:21:38.840 come correct if you want to be successful, because we 0:21:38.920 --> 0:21:42.480 have a very narrow definition of success, a very narrow 0:21:42.480 --> 0:21:46.480 definition of what professional is, and a very narrow definition 0:21:46.920 --> 0:21:50.359 of what it means to thrive. And in many ways, 0:21:51.119 --> 0:21:55.679 the definition of success or thrive does not have a 0:21:55.840 --> 0:21:58.200 natural black woman's face on it, and we got to 0:21:58.240 --> 0:22:01.760 shift that neither doesn't have rest or relaxation, or joy 0:22:01.960 --> 0:22:04.600 or laughter. And as a result, what do we learn 0:22:05.040 --> 0:22:07.520 as black folks? And what did I learn was that 0:22:08.280 --> 0:22:10.720 I had to show my worth by how much I 0:22:10.840 --> 0:22:16.959 produced I do and how many of us are sick 0:22:17.200 --> 0:22:20.879 and dying because we are still working our tailed up. 0:22:22.840 --> 0:22:26.760 It's no secret that the news is horsepill hard to swallow. Thankfully, 0:22:26.800 --> 0:22:30.679 there's the Bituation Room podcast hosted by comedian and commentator 0:22:30.800 --> 0:22:33.760 Francesca free Or and Tini for a lighter take on 0:22:33.800 --> 0:22:36.760 the heavy staff. Each week The Bituation Room brings you 0:22:36.800 --> 0:22:40.240 progressive comedians, experts, and activists to break down the issues 0:22:40.280 --> 0:22:42.480 in a way that won't just leave you crying under 0:22:42.520 --> 0:22:47.000 a weighted blanket. Get the Bituation Room on Apple, Podcasts, Spotify, Stitcher, 0:22:47.119 --> 0:22:55.560 and streaming on YouTube and Twitch. There was a just 0:22:55.760 --> 0:22:58.680 and I saw that too in my book as well. 0:22:58.680 --> 0:23:03.440 This is this idea as well. There was just released 0:23:03.440 --> 0:23:07.280 in terms of the straightening of straightening of our hair. 0:23:08.440 --> 0:23:11.880 H the report that just came out that said, guess 0:23:11.960 --> 0:23:19.840 what causes cancer? Uterine cancer? At that hair? Relax right right? 0:23:19.960 --> 0:23:24.560 How many mamma's relax their hair? Ye? And you know, 0:23:24.680 --> 0:23:28.800 I thought about it in when when that news broke 0:23:28.960 --> 0:23:33.639 because I I went natural in early two thousand, I 0:23:33.680 --> 0:23:36.240 had grown out, I had started growing out my my 0:23:36.359 --> 0:23:41.439 perm in the nineties. Uh when I and then you know, 0:23:41.520 --> 0:23:44.280 and then went into the process of having locks, which 0:23:44.280 --> 0:23:48.120 I've had now for for a very very long time. 0:23:49.000 --> 0:23:53.159 But you know, it's just this idea that white society 0:23:53.240 --> 0:23:56.280 will tell you how you need to look and then 0:23:56.359 --> 0:23:59.880 provide and then the product that we used to look 0:24:00.040 --> 0:24:03.920 that way will kill us. It is I mean, it 0:24:04.000 --> 0:24:09.119 is just like you know, you there there's no there's 0:24:09.119 --> 0:24:12.000 no other way to look at that, right than for 0:24:12.200 --> 0:24:15.800 than for what it is um And you know the 0:24:15.960 --> 0:24:22.240 ideas like these, Your your message and so beautifully stated, 0:24:23.600 --> 0:24:28.119 is about what it seems to me, the relearning of 0:24:28.160 --> 0:24:33.360 our worth. And how do how you know and how 0:24:33.480 --> 0:24:40.080 do we relearn our worth as black people? Right now 0:24:40.720 --> 0:24:47.000 at a time when literally you have the governor of Florida, 0:24:47.240 --> 0:24:54.320 Ron DeSantis, who literally wrote legislation about white comfort. You 0:24:54.400 --> 0:24:58.520 have a sitting member of Congress, regardless of how crazy 0:24:58.720 --> 0:25:02.280 we know that she is, Marjorie Taylor Green, talking about 0:25:02.560 --> 0:25:11.040 schools teaching anti whiteness. So how do you articulate or 0:25:11.200 --> 0:25:16.320 express how we understand and learn our worth and navigate 0:25:16.440 --> 0:25:20.560 through this imposter syndrome and through this contortion that we 0:25:20.640 --> 0:25:25.160 have been doing our entire lives when literal policies are 0:25:25.200 --> 0:25:30.399 being created to deny us that very avenue, that very pathway. 0:25:31.320 --> 0:25:35.440 It's again white limitations, right, So like we and we've 0:25:35.440 --> 0:25:37.920 seen this. So I just finished I just watched Till 0:25:38.600 --> 0:25:41.920 the movie, and I was just I've been thinking about 0:25:42.240 --> 0:25:46.639 tild story, Emmett tild story. And for those of you 0:25:46.640 --> 0:25:50.639 who don't know, Emma Till was a black a teenager 0:25:50.680 --> 0:25:52.840 who went to visit his family in the South from 0:25:52.920 --> 0:25:56.720 Chicago and did not make it past the entire time 0:25:56.760 --> 0:26:01.040 because he was killed for you know, speaking, you know, 0:26:01.359 --> 0:26:04.600 having some interaction with a white woman who did who 0:26:04.640 --> 0:26:08.520 displeased the white woman, and obviously she you know, Caroline, 0:26:08.520 --> 0:26:13.359 I believe kind of exaggerated the details. And because what 0:26:13.480 --> 0:26:16.200 happens and with black folks is that one we're adultified 0:26:16.320 --> 0:26:19.040 as children would become adults. He was seen as a 0:26:19.080 --> 0:26:21.359 man even though he was a child, and he was killed. 0:26:21.400 --> 0:26:25.120 And and so what I was thinking about was this, 0:26:25.240 --> 0:26:27.359 you know, this idea of you said, we have to 0:26:27.359 --> 0:26:31.399 contort ourselves into these spaces. And now we have legislation 0:26:31.440 --> 0:26:34.520 that says you beuys, stay, you beust stay contorting yourself 0:26:34.640 --> 0:26:39.840 because we like, we're not uncomfortable. And so Till goes 0:26:40.000 --> 0:26:45.480 down to the South and doesn't know the rule right 0:26:45.560 --> 0:26:47.840 because at that time it was a little bit more 0:26:47.920 --> 0:26:49.720 liberal in the North than it was in the South. 0:26:50.440 --> 0:26:52.520 And we have a whole we have a whole conversation 0:26:52.680 --> 0:26:55.040 because I think white supremacy is universal. I just think 0:26:55.080 --> 0:26:59.040 it looks different dependent on where you are, right and 0:26:59.119 --> 0:27:02.280 so so so I think that the tension that we 0:27:02.320 --> 0:27:04.879 have as black folks is how do we raise our 0:27:04.960 --> 0:27:10.199 children so that they can be free ants live to 0:27:10.240 --> 0:27:12.880 see the next day. And that is a real tension 0:27:12.920 --> 0:27:15.960 that that white parents don't have to worry about, Like 0:27:16.440 --> 0:27:20.320 when a there's a point in the movie and I 0:27:20.359 --> 0:27:22.359 actually didn't even need to see the movie to know 0:27:22.480 --> 0:27:25.840 this where you know the kids, the black boys are 0:27:25.840 --> 0:27:28.920