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Speaker 1: Hello everybody, and welcome back to the Psychology of Your Twenties,

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Speaker 1: the podcast where we talk through some of the big

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Speaker 1: life changes and transitions of our twenties and what they

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Speaker 1: mean for our psychology. Hello everybody, Welcome back to the show.

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Speaker 1: Welcome back to the podcast. New listeners, old listeners. Wherever

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Speaker 1: you are in the world, it is so great to

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Speaker 1: have you here. Back for another episode as we, of

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Speaker 1: course break down the psychology of our twenties. Today, we're

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Speaker 1: going to talk about money, not how to make more

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Speaker 1: of it, not how to invest it. We're not going

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Speaker 1: to talk about get rich quick schemes or how to budget,

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Speaker 1: but the ways in which money, our psychology, and our

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Speaker 1: mental health are related in a lot of ways we

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Speaker 1: probably didn't even know. It's been a little over two

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Speaker 1: years since I last ded a specific money episode, which

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Speaker 1: honestly is way too long given how universal I think

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Speaker 1: financial insecurity is during this decade, Given that it is

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Speaker 1: a time when a lot of us are first becoming

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Speaker 1: financially independent, trying our hardest to save living paycheck to paycheck,

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Speaker 1: I think financial anxiety is something we can kind of

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Speaker 1: all relate to in one aspect or another. During this

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Speaker 1: time it kind of really bleeds into every aspect of

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Speaker 1: our lives, and especially during this generation, we are facing

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Speaker 1: a pretty harsh, pretty ruthless economic reality that is making

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Speaker 1: the mental health impacts of our finances even more pronounced.

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Speaker 1: I would say I think at least in in Sydney

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Speaker 1: and Australia in general, really inflation is outpacing earnings. We

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Speaker 1: are paying half of our paycheck each week into rent.

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Speaker 1: Everyone wants to tell you that the next recession is coming.

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Speaker 1: Groceries are so expensive, so there's no doubt that this

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Speaker 1: is really contributing to a decline in overall life satisfaction,

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Speaker 1: in mental well being across society, but especially for young people.

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Speaker 1: In fact, I think the National Youth Mental Health Survey

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Speaker 1: was released a couple weeks ago and it found that

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Speaker 1: eighty percent of Australians, but I would actually say that

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Speaker 1: this includes a lot of young people, people age seventeen

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Speaker 1: to twenty five. Eighty percent of them are experiencing financial anxiety.

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Speaker 1: They're feeling pessimistic about the future, and they're constantly thinking

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Speaker 1: about their finances and what our finances allow us to

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Speaker 1: do or prevent us from doing. For this reason and

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Speaker 1: many many others, money takes on such an emotional role

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Speaker 1: in our lives, and I just think that that fact

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Speaker 1: doesn't get enough airtime. So let's talk about it today.

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Speaker 1: Let's talk about the interactions between money, our psychology, and

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Speaker 1: our mental health. We're going to break down where our

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Speaker 1: specific money fears come from, the root of financial anxiety,

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Speaker 1: our individual money archetypes, how to find out what your

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Speaker 1: money archetype or money language is, what worrying about money

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Speaker 1: can do. You have mental health, your physical health, your relationships,

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Speaker 1: our bodies, but also how to really navigate those obsessive

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Speaker 1: fears and anxieties that we typically have around financial certainty

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Speaker 1: and stability even when we are doing okay, even when

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Speaker 1: we do have money. There is so much to discuss.

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Speaker 2: I think I say that with every single episode, but

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Speaker 2: this one in particular. This I just know this is

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Speaker 2: probably going to go up to fifty minutes, probably an hour,

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Speaker 2: So strap in, guys, I hope that you learn something.

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Speaker 2: I hope you enjoy this episode. Without further ado, let's

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Speaker 2: talk all things money and mental health. Like I said before,

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Speaker 2: money is so much more emotional and psychological than we

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Speaker 2: give it credit for anything that we care about or

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Speaker 2: that is valuable in our lives, will have complicated emotions

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Speaker 2: attached to it because it takes on this larger, more significant,

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Speaker 2: important meaning. Money isn't just you know, a number on

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Speaker 2: a screen that represents your bank balance. It's not like

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Speaker 2: a twenty dollar bill in your pocket or the transactions

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Speaker 2: on your phone. It represents freedom, independence, security, status, a

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Speaker 2: certain lifestyle, sometimes even our level of happiness depending on

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Speaker 2: who you are, and we are really fine tuned to

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Speaker 2: care about it, and so it's a pretty dominant presence

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Speaker 2: in our lives. It also impacts I think some of

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Speaker 2: the most fundamental life decisions that will make in our

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Speaker 2: twenties and beyond. Like, honestly, it impacts who we're friends with,

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Speaker 2: It impacts who we date. It most certainly impacts where

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Speaker 2: we live, not just in terms of neighborhood or suburb,

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Speaker 2: but city country. It impacts what job we want to pursue,

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Speaker 2: what career we would like to have. I think it

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Speaker 2: possibly influence is all of those things almost as much

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Speaker 2: as our personality or as our upbringing. And we'll get

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Speaker 2: to see how upbringing and money are also very very

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Speaker 2: much so interlinked. That's why I think it's really important

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Speaker 2: to see money as something that we have a relationship with,

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Speaker 2: rather than as just this random resource, because in a

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Speaker 2: way we do. We do have a relationship with money,

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Speaker 2: just like a romantic partner, just like a friend. Money

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Speaker 2: can impact our mood. Money can make us feel safe

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Speaker 2: or insecure. Our relationship to money changes and evolves as

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Speaker 2: we have more of it or less of it. It can

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Speaker 2: improve our lives or really bring it down. I could

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Speaker 2: be describing money, or I could be describing a toxic

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Speaker 2: relationship or a healthy relationship. And you know, the same

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Speaker 2: way that our relationships can be influenced by things like

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Speaker 2: childhood experiences, like parental attitudes, culture trauma, self esteem, so

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Speaker 2: can our relationship with money, because it means more than

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Speaker 2: we think it does. The other thing to note is

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Speaker 2: that just like your relationship with your boyfriend or your girlfriend,

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Speaker 2: or your partner, or your friend or your parents, if

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Speaker 2: you were to compare that relationship your closest relationships to

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Speaker 2: you know, a coworker or to one of your own friends,

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Speaker 2: each of us is going to have a different set

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Speaker 2: of circumstances and a different kind of relationship pattern, and

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Speaker 2: that pattern is going to control and impact our emotions

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Speaker 2: and our mental state. In different ways. Basically, what I'm

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Speaker 2: saying is that this is actually a highly personal topic

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Speaker 2: and it's highly nuanced. It's not just about how much

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Speaker 2: money do I have and if I have more. If

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Speaker 2: I have enough, I'm going to be fine, and if

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Speaker 2: I don't have enough, I'm going to be stressed. I

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Speaker 2: think it's really important to note here that when we're

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Speaker 2: talking about financial anxiety and financial stress, it's actually not

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Speaker 2: just one thing. It's two things up of two components.

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Speaker 2: We have objective financial difficulty, and then we have our

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Speaker 2: subjective perceptions about our financial difficulties. Objective financial difficulty will

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Speaker 2: start by talking about that first. It is when you

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Speaker 2: just undoubtedly are struggling, no matter who you are. We

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Speaker 2: kind of all know what it means to be in debt.

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Speaker 2: We all know it's not great to be down to

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Speaker 2: your last five dollars without any money coming in. We

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Speaker 2: know that it's a bad sign if you don't have

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Speaker 2: a steady income that can pay your bills. That is

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Speaker 2: when it's really time to start worrying. And in those moments,

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Speaker 2: I think a lot of us feel justified in our

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Speaker 2: financial worries. Not having money has a lot of run

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Speaker 2: on consequences because this is not an enlightening thing to say,

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Speaker 2: but we need money to live. We need it to

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Speaker 2: access healthcare, to access food, to access housing, to access opportunity,

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Speaker 2: to be quite honest, and when you don't have money,

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Speaker 2: it feels like you can't have a life. It becomes

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Speaker 2: this constant stressor because it's threatening our core sense of survival,

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Speaker 2: and that is normally all our brains can focus on

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Speaker 2: when in that situation. In fact, people who go a

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Speaker 2: long time struggling with their finances, which is becoming more common,

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Speaker 2: or people who have very little for a long time,

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Speaker 2: even if they can meet their basic needs, if it's

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Speaker 2: always this survival state, if it's always living paycheck to paycheck,

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Speaker 2: they actually develop a lot of symptoms of chronic stress, insomnia, fatigue,

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Speaker 2: even stomach ulcers, changes, an appetite, distorted thinking, because all

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Speaker 2: of those survival systems we have that are meant to

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Speaker 2: be for moments of extreme danger are constantly being activated

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Speaker 2: because money has become this important resource for which a

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Speaker 2: lack of is indicative danger, and so they tend to

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Speaker 2: stay in this heightened state of arousal that no living organism,

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Speaker 2: no species, no human is meant to be in for

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Speaker 2: an extended period of time, and that puts a lot

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Speaker 2: of pressure on our body. It damages our immune system,

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Speaker 2: It compromises how our hormones are secreted, which is something

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Speaker 2: that a lot of people don't talk about the impact

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Speaker 2: of chronic stress on literally your DNA, on your ability

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Speaker 2: to meet your basic needs for sleep, for rest, for connection.

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Speaker 2: I don't really think it's a surprise that this one

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Speaker 2: paper in twenty twenty three concluded that having a lower

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Speaker 2: income for an extended period of time, which they said

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Speaker 2: was three months or more, that is strongly correlated with

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Speaker 2: increased psychological distress and mental health concerns, specifically anxiety and depression.

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Speaker 2: And the thing is, you just don't know when that

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Speaker 2: situation is going to end. You just don't know when

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Speaker 2: you're finances will turn for you. No one can say, well,

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Speaker 2: you know, on this date, you're finally going to get

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Speaker 2: that windfall and it's all going to be okay. For

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Speaker 2: so many other stressful situations that we go through in life,

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Speaker 2: you know, whether it's like small things like exam season

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Speaker 2: that might feel very big, or breakups or whatever it is.

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Speaker 2: We can go to therapy, we can be mindful, we

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Speaker 2: can remove ourselves from stressful relationships or situations. We can

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Speaker 2: change how we think about something. We can problem solve.

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Speaker 2: When you're worrying about money, the problem and the solution

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Speaker 2: are the same thing. You wouldn't be worrying about your

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Speaker 2: income or your finances if you had money, if you

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Speaker 2: knew how to make more. But you don't know how

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Speaker 2: to make more, so that's why you're so stressed. There's

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Speaker 2: really nothing else you can do. Again, money is the

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Speaker 2: problem and the solution. I think money just also makes

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Speaker 2: life easier because it firstly eliminates the stress of not

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Speaker 2: knowing if you're going to be able to provide for yourself,

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Speaker 2: but it also just reduces I guess it just reduces

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Speaker 2: the stress of everyday life, of things taking longer, of

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Speaker 2: things being inconvenient. The phrase that always comes to mind

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Speaker 2: to me when I think about this, of like money

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Speaker 2: makes life easier, is the phrase money is time. And

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Speaker 2: so if you have money, you can buy yourself time

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Speaker 2: in your day. And I give the example of you

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Speaker 2: know being able to order in your groceries, therefore saving

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Speaker 2: you time that you can then spend cleaning your house, relaxing, working,

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Speaker 2: compared to not being able to afford that luxury and

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Speaker 2: having to go to the store, which means extra stress,

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Speaker 2: extra travel time, extra time not for yourself or not

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Speaker 2: for other things that are important. And that is a

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Speaker 2: small example, right, but I think it really shows how

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Speaker 2: having more money does make life easier. Unfortunately, the other

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Speaker 2: reason that more money or a steady income or a

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Speaker 2: stable income might also benefit our mental health is that

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Speaker 2: money just gives you more options and freedom to you know,

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Speaker 2: leave toxic workplaces which may have made you stressed, to

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Speaker 2: pay for therapy that will give you peace of mind.

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Speaker 2: You know, there is this daying right, money can't buy happiness,

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Speaker 2: and maybe you've heard of that famous study that after

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Speaker 2: someone is making you know, one hundred and twenty eight

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Speaker 2: more money doesn't exponentially make your life much better. But

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Speaker 2: the thing that money can get you, if not happiness,

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Speaker 2: are the secondary influences of happiness. And I'm talking security, freedom, independence,

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Speaker 2: better services, and of course choice and choice gives you

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Speaker 2: control over your life, all of which helps ease stress.

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Speaker 2: Ease anxiety is the sense that you actually don't have agency,

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Speaker 2: that you actually can't choose for yourself the life that

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Speaker 2: you want to live. Also, and you know not to

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Speaker 2: add to this like a litany of things, but I

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Speaker 2: do think it's important. You know, not making much money,

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Speaker 2: not having the means, also creates limits to what we

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Speaker 2: can do socially, especially if you have friends who are

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Speaker 2: at very different points in their life financially. You know,

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Speaker 2: how do you keep up with the dinners where it's

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Speaker 2: always going to cost you more than your groceries for

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Speaker 2: the week. How do you keep up with going out

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Speaker 2: and paying for drinks every Friday, or going on those holidays,

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Speaker 2: or going shopping or buying all those concert tickets. It's like,

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Speaker 2: with everything you're invited to, price is the first thing

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Speaker 2: you have to think of. And you face this dilemma,

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Speaker 2: go and try and enjoy yourself, knowing you won't be

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Speaker 2: able to say yes to everything because you're limited financially,

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Speaker 2: and you'll probably end up worrying about money afterwards, or

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Speaker 2: stay home and get that intense pomo that we all

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Speaker 2: feel so much more intensely in our twenties, that not

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Speaker 2: only are you missing out on this time in your life,

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Speaker 2: but you're also missing out on the memories and the

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Speaker 2: connections that could have been made between you and your friends.

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Speaker 2: And we know that social isolation or sense of disconnection

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Speaker 2: is one of the biggest predictors of poor mental health outcomes,

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Speaker 2: because we need community, we need those moments with friends,

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Speaker 2: We need to belong somewhere. I think you kind of

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Speaker 2: get my point here, right. I say all of this

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Speaker 2: because I want you to know it's firstly, not just you. Secondly,

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Speaker 2: it's not an overreaction. It's not greedy. It's not obsessive

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Speaker 2: or selfish to be worrying about money. Money has these

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Speaker 2: impacts across all domains of wellbeing, even in very, very

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Speaker 2: hidden ways, even in ways that the average person who

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Speaker 2: isn't struggling with money would never suspect. Right. Something that

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Speaker 2: really frustrates me is people who are like, oh, you know, money,

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Speaker 2: every time I spend money, money comes back to me

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Speaker 2: because I have an abundance mindset. And I totally respect

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Speaker 2: that perspective because I think if it works for you,

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Speaker 2: it works for you. But there are actually just sometimes

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Speaker 2: where it's like, no, I cannot just spend money and

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Speaker 2: hope that it comes back to me. I actually have

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Speaker 2: a life, and I have bills to pay, and I

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Speaker 2: may not be in the same situation as you, and

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Speaker 2: I think that also creates friction and relationships where it's

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Speaker 2: like money. Also, the way we spend money also comes

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Speaker 2: down to values, and it's a really interesting touch point

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Speaker 2: to see how the values between you and your friends differ,

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Speaker 2: the privilege between you and your friends differ, and sometimes

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Speaker 2: that can end up being a bit of a deal

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Speaker 2: breaker in a lot of different relationships. I'm going to

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Speaker 2: move on because I want to talk about subjective financial stress,

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Speaker 2: because even when we have money, even when we can

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Speaker 2: pay all of our expenses, you can still be worried

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Speaker 2: about money. And I think that's something that's often left

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Speaker 2: out of the conversation, and a lot of people are like, Okay,

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Speaker 2: I feel like I'm not justified in my concerns, but

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Speaker 2: I'm so. I don't want to say obsessive because it

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Speaker 2: makes it sound like this is a choice, but the

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Speaker 2: thoughts around this just so obsessive and intrusive to me.

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Speaker 2: That difference in perspective comes down to our subjective appraisals

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Speaker 2: about money. Maybe feeling like we don't have enough in

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Speaker 2: comparison to others, even if we can afford everything we need.

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Speaker 2: Maybe worrying about a future time when you won't have money,

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Speaker 2: even though you have money, right now feeling insecure about

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Speaker 2: your finances no matter what is objectively happening. That is

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Speaker 2: the distinction between objective financial insecurity and subjective financial insecurity,

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Speaker 2: and both equally damaging. You know, I get where the

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Speaker 2: sentiment comes from. Of like, well, obviously the person without

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Speaker 2: money has it worse. But even if someone does is

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Speaker 2: able to meet the basic needs and still is obsessing

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Speaker 2: about money, it is quite I think demanding, and quite

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Speaker 2: a burden. And it comes from a very I think intricate,

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Speaker 2: interesting amalgamation of past experiences that aren't spoken about. If

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Speaker 2: you have had times of financial insecurity in the past,

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Speaker 2: if you know what it's like to be dead broke,

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Speaker 2: that is not a feeling that goes away very easily.

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Speaker 2: The other example I give is if you had parents

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Speaker 2: who were always worried about money, who you know, their incomes,

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Speaker 2: their jobs meant that they could never give you what

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Speaker 2: the other kids had. That is quite a powerful experience.

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Speaker 2: Our brains are wired to remember those periods of stress,

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Speaker 2: whether it's because of money or really anything, because if

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Speaker 2: we've endured and survived these stressful periods, our brain obviously

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Speaker 2: wants to ensure that if this situation comes up again

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Speaker 2: in the future. Our memory of the path out is

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Speaker 2: crystal clear. That is, of course, our brains trying to

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Speaker 2: do the helpful thing and create a bit of a

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Speaker 2: guide book for us, a living guidebook, using stress as

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Speaker 2: basically a sign to pay attention and to consolidate worthwhile memories.

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Speaker 2: But it can also lead to a lot of rumination

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Speaker 2: overthinking about the right way or the wrong way to

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Speaker 2: be spending, saving, investing. This chronic app apprehension and stress,

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Speaker 2: even when objectively you might not have much to worry about.

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Speaker 2: And crucially, this reaction is different for each of us.

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Speaker 2: And this is where I really want to introduce you

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Speaker 2: to this very fascinating concept of our money languages and

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Speaker 2: our money archetypes. All of that and more. After this shortbreak,

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Speaker 2: I think we all know the deal with love languages

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Speaker 2: by now. This is this idea introduced by doctor Gary Chapman,

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Speaker 2: that each of us has a unique way of expressing

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Speaker 2: and receiving love, whether that's acts of service, words of affirmation,

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Speaker 2: quality time, the list goes on. Well, it turns out

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Speaker 2: that each of us also has a unique language when

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Speaker 2: it comes to money. But in this instance, there are

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Speaker 2: nine archetypes or nine languages instead of five, and they

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Speaker 2: are the anxious, the saver, the spender, the investor, the giver,

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Speaker 2: the order, the void, the monk, and the greedy. That

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Speaker 2: is a lot of different labels to take notice of,

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Speaker 2: but the archetype or language that most represents us is

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Speaker 2: basically determined by our emotional attachment to money and how

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Speaker 2: it is mentally represented in our brains. Basically, what I'm

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Speaker 2: saying and what I mean by this is when you

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Speaker 2: think about money, is it with anxiety, is it with

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Speaker 2: longing to stain, apathy? Joy? And this will basically dictate

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Speaker 2: how you end up going about well, you know, of

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Speaker 2: course feeling about the money you have, but also your

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00:19:35,840 --> 00:19:40,760
Speaker 2: behaviors towards spending. Your behavior is towards saving, investing, all

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Speaker 2: of the above, and it's really dictated by your childhood

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Speaker 2: experiences with money, how your parents spoke about money, the

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Speaker 2: culture you grew up in, and even elements of our

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Speaker 2: personality like impulsiveness, cautiousness, things like that. And once again

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Speaker 2: I really want to express that this is really what

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Speaker 2: influences is our level of anxiety, our level of stress,

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Speaker 2: our level of arousal, even when it comes to dealing

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Speaker 2: with our finances. So let's go through these, and just

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Speaker 2: while we're talking about them, see if one of these

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Speaker 2: really draws you in more, or if you just find

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Speaker 2: your ears kind of perking up, you find yourself relating

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Speaker 2: to these different archetypes, or if you can see them

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Speaker 2: reflected in maybe a parent or a partner or a friend.

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Speaker 2: Even so, let's start with the anxious. This is often

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Speaker 2: the money language of those of us who grew up

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Speaker 2: with very little, and so all of our interactions with budgeting, saving,

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Speaker 2: financing are centered around these very prominent anxious thoughts, such as,

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Speaker 2: what happens when I don't have money? Will it all

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Speaker 2: be taken away at some point? What happens when the

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00:20:52,080 --> 00:20:53,000
Speaker 2: tap dries out?

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Speaker 1: Even when you do.

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Speaker 2: Have a steady income, when you do have that savings

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00:20:58,160 --> 00:21:02,440
Speaker 2: account stocked up, So when you do have I don't know, investments, assets,

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Speaker 2: you still have this feeling. You still have this feeling

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Speaker 2: that at some point it's all going to disappear or

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Speaker 2: that it isn't going to last, and that you can't

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00:21:12,000 --> 00:21:15,959
Speaker 2: get used to this state. So basically, there is a

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00:21:16,040 --> 00:21:19,359
Speaker 2: lot of apprehension when it comes to this language. Thinking

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Speaker 2: about money a lot, checking a bank account, frequently seeing

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00:21:22,840 --> 00:21:24,879
Speaker 2: everything in terms of a dollar value and what the

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00:21:24,920 --> 00:21:28,480
Speaker 2: opportunity cost of that is, basically meaning what could that

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00:21:28,560 --> 00:21:30,680
Speaker 2: money have brought you and would it have been better.

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Speaker 2: Some people might call this a fixation, which in some

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Speaker 2: ways it is, but it's not a fixation with accumulating

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Speaker 2: as much wealth as possible. It's a fixation with worrying

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00:21:43,840 --> 00:21:47,159
Speaker 2: about your survival when it comes to money, and it

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Speaker 2: really comes from a permanent scarcity mindset in psychology but

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Speaker 2: also in economics. Actually, scarcity mindset is a pattern of

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Speaker 2: thinking that really focuses on what you don't have and

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Speaker 2: an underlying belief that you could never possibly have enough

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Speaker 2: of the things that you want to need. Can you

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00:22:03,760 --> 00:22:06,680
Speaker 2: see what kind of cycle this creates for else mentally

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00:22:06,880 --> 00:22:11,240
Speaker 2: and emotionally, where at no point are you ever at peace,

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Speaker 2: Even when you have money to spare or to spend,

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Speaker 2: you're always in your mind kind of facing a reality

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Speaker 2: of having nothing. There's no reprieve, there's no kind of

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Speaker 2: break from it. So that's the first money language. Next

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Speaker 2: up we have the saver. Now, the saver is also

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Speaker 2: known as the stressor, so this person is very cautious

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Speaker 2: when handling their money. They derive a lot of satisfaction

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Speaker 2: from seeing their savings grow because it feels like they're

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Speaker 2: doing something with it that is safe and practical. Brings

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Speaker 2: a sense of security, but also because they might not

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Speaker 2: be sure what really to do with their money, or

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00:22:52,119 --> 00:22:55,440
Speaker 2: like the anxious, they're really worried about a time when

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Speaker 2: they won't have money, But instead of that making them

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00:22:59,600 --> 00:23:03,399
Speaker 2: behave right, maybe irrationally or just fixate on the on

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00:23:03,440 --> 00:23:05,800
Speaker 2: the fear, the way that they approach it is just

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00:23:05,880 --> 00:23:09,000
Speaker 2: by saving as much as they can. And whilst this

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00:23:09,119 --> 00:23:11,800
Speaker 2: can mean that they're very good at avoiding frivolous spending,

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00:23:12,400 --> 00:23:17,720
Speaker 2: sometimes they also miss out on opportunities. They miss out

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Speaker 2: on instances in which they could change jobs and men

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00:23:22,040 --> 00:23:25,479
Speaker 2: make more money because there may be this, you know,

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Speaker 2: concern that if they were to do that, that might

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00:23:28,920 --> 00:23:34,320
Speaker 2: impact their primary inclination, their primary behavior, which is to

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00:23:34,400 --> 00:23:36,760
Speaker 2: save and to save as much as they can and

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00:23:36,800 --> 00:23:39,000
Speaker 2: to make this little ness for themselves so they never

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00:23:39,040 --> 00:23:43,040
Speaker 2: have to worry. This is similar to the hoarder, but

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00:23:43,119 --> 00:23:46,640
Speaker 2: the distinction is that the stressor or the saver, their

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00:23:46,680 --> 00:23:50,200
Speaker 2: primary kind of impulse is to save, but they will

390
00:23:50,240 --> 00:23:53,520
Speaker 2: spend when they need to. The hoarder takes it to

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00:23:53,560 --> 00:23:57,240
Speaker 2: the extreme. If you've ever met someone who will literally

392
00:23:57,280 --> 00:23:59,879
Speaker 2: not spend a cent on going out for dinner or

393
00:23:59,880 --> 00:24:03,959
Speaker 2: buying groceries or buying the essentials that they need, that

394
00:24:04,160 --> 00:24:09,879
Speaker 2: is a hoarder. It can make them really isolated and obsessive.

395
00:24:10,119 --> 00:24:15,160
Speaker 2: And specifically, they are hoarding money not with the intention

396
00:24:15,800 --> 00:24:19,119
Speaker 2: to spend it, sometimes not with the intention to even

397
00:24:19,320 --> 00:24:21,280
Speaker 2: allow it to have a better life in the future.

398
00:24:21,760 --> 00:24:24,840
Speaker 2: It's just almost like, I don't even know how to

399
00:24:24,880 --> 00:24:27,639
Speaker 2: explain it. I'm trying to remember how someone explained it

400
00:24:27,680 --> 00:24:30,800
Speaker 2: to me once. But it's basically just like a comfort thing.

401
00:24:31,240 --> 00:24:34,520
Speaker 2: If I hold this money, it's just comfortable to know

402
00:24:34,640 --> 00:24:36,679
Speaker 2: that I have it, even if I really have no

403
00:24:36,760 --> 00:24:41,000
Speaker 2: intention of ever spending it. Next, we have the spender. Now,

404
00:24:41,040 --> 00:24:43,960
Speaker 2: this person, actually, the spender is one of my favorite

405
00:24:44,000 --> 00:24:47,119
Speaker 2: profiles to really talk about, because this person derives a

406
00:24:47,119 --> 00:24:50,439
Speaker 2: lot of joy and satisfaction from seeing their money in

407
00:24:50,520 --> 00:24:54,800
Speaker 2: experiences or material goods. Now, I said it's my favorite,

408
00:24:54,880 --> 00:24:56,840
Speaker 2: not because it's the best, but because I just find

409
00:24:56,880 --> 00:24:59,560
Speaker 2: it the most interesting and the most unique out of

410
00:24:59,560 --> 00:25:02,600
Speaker 2: all of these. They really tend to live in the moment,

411
00:25:02,720 --> 00:25:06,920
Speaker 2: and they may prioritize immediate gratification over long term savings,

412
00:25:07,720 --> 00:25:10,919
Speaker 2: even when that is costly to them or impulsive, And

413
00:25:10,960 --> 00:25:15,960
Speaker 2: the spender is often impulsive because money becomes a mean

414
00:25:16,440 --> 00:25:20,040
Speaker 2: through which to manage their emotions. I'm feeling sad, I

415
00:25:20,119 --> 00:25:23,959
Speaker 2: spend to soothe. Feeling happy, I spend to celebrate. So

416
00:25:24,200 --> 00:25:27,960
Speaker 2: their spending habits are chronic, but they're also tied to

417
00:25:28,000 --> 00:25:30,880
Speaker 2: what they're going through, So no matter where they're at

418
00:25:30,920 --> 00:25:34,520
Speaker 2: on that emotional spectrum, there's always a need, there's always

419
00:25:34,920 --> 00:25:38,800
Speaker 2: a reason to buy something. To note, a twenty twenty

420
00:25:38,800 --> 00:25:42,600
Speaker 2: one paper actually suggests that the spender is on the

421
00:25:42,720 --> 00:25:45,840
Speaker 2: rise because so many of us no longer see the

422
00:25:45,920 --> 00:25:49,200
Speaker 2: value in saving for things like a house, like big

423
00:25:49,240 --> 00:25:53,760
Speaker 2: financial goals, because we kind of believe that we'll never

424
00:25:53,800 --> 00:25:57,119
Speaker 2: be able to get them anyways, So why bother when

425
00:25:57,160 --> 00:26:01,520
Speaker 2: we can really lean into our hedonistic tendencies and we

426
00:26:01,560 --> 00:26:06,719
Speaker 2: can kind of prioritize pleasure over everything else. The pleasure

427
00:26:06,760 --> 00:26:09,520
Speaker 2: of a new outfit, the pleasure of a nice wine,

428
00:26:09,560 --> 00:26:12,600
Speaker 2: of a fancy dinner, of a new couch. I don't

429
00:26:12,640 --> 00:26:14,520
Speaker 2: know why I said couch. I'm thinking about buying a

430
00:26:14,520 --> 00:26:16,520
Speaker 2: new couch, so that's probably where it comes from. But

431
00:26:16,560 --> 00:26:19,439
Speaker 2: you kind of get what I mean, lavish trips, but

432
00:26:19,600 --> 00:26:23,399
Speaker 2: it's not so much for looks. It's not for status.

433
00:26:23,520 --> 00:26:27,040
Speaker 2: It's because I just kind of want to. Very counter

434
00:26:27,119 --> 00:26:29,919
Speaker 2: to the spender, we have the investor. They are very

435
00:26:29,960 --> 00:26:33,440
Speaker 2: focused on growing wealth through investments. They kind of sometimes

436
00:26:33,480 --> 00:26:35,840
Speaker 2: see money as something to play with or something to

437
00:26:35,880 --> 00:26:39,040
Speaker 2: make work for them, and they get really excited, maybe

438
00:26:39,080 --> 00:26:43,640
Speaker 2: obsessed with knowing more about the stock market, financial fluctuations,

439
00:26:43,680 --> 00:26:46,640
Speaker 2: when to buy, when to sell, but that can really

440
00:26:46,680 --> 00:26:51,520
Speaker 2: make them overly focused on financial returns. Sometimes they can

441
00:26:51,560 --> 00:26:56,920
Speaker 2: also become gamblers because they see gambling as an investment,

442
00:26:57,560 --> 00:27:00,480
Speaker 2: kind of like this saver. Sometimes they don't actually spend

443
00:27:00,520 --> 00:27:02,800
Speaker 2: when they need to because either they don't have any

444
00:27:02,840 --> 00:27:06,080
Speaker 2: money because they've invested it all, or because they really

445
00:27:06,160 --> 00:27:08,680
Speaker 2: like to see money as this thing to play with

446
00:27:09,119 --> 00:27:12,680
Speaker 2: that can make more money. This kind of financial alchemy

447
00:27:12,680 --> 00:27:15,399
Speaker 2: that they can perform. This is very similar to the

448
00:27:15,400 --> 00:27:19,199
Speaker 2: amassa our six archetype. This is also known as the

449
00:27:19,240 --> 00:27:24,520
Speaker 2: greed archetype. Some people often confuse this with the with

450
00:27:24,560 --> 00:27:28,280
Speaker 2: the saver, but this individual isn't accumulating wealth for a

451
00:27:28,359 --> 00:27:33,760
Speaker 2: sense of security, but as a measure of success and status.

452
00:27:34,160 --> 00:27:37,800
Speaker 2: They are highly motivated to put money away and gain

453
00:27:38,080 --> 00:27:43,199
Speaker 2: as much as possible to eventually convert into highly coveted

454
00:27:43,240 --> 00:27:47,600
Speaker 2: possessions or to appear impressive to have a really cool portfolio.

455
00:27:48,160 --> 00:27:51,080
Speaker 2: In that way, the mass is often driven I would say,

456
00:27:51,080 --> 00:27:55,080
Speaker 2: my ego and can become really obsessed with money as

457
00:27:55,119 --> 00:27:57,760
Speaker 2: a resource for maintaining their image rather than as a

458
00:27:57,800 --> 00:28:00,280
Speaker 2: resource to make their day to day life better. And

459
00:28:00,320 --> 00:28:02,760
Speaker 2: you can see how that really ties into mental health,

460
00:28:02,800 --> 00:28:06,199
Speaker 2: where the only way they feel good about themselves and

461
00:28:06,240 --> 00:28:11,200
Speaker 2: about their lives is when they are growing this portfolio

462
00:28:11,920 --> 00:28:15,520
Speaker 2: of what they're worth and what they have something that

463
00:28:15,560 --> 00:28:17,439
Speaker 2: you'll quickly realize we've only got a few more to go.

464
00:28:17,520 --> 00:28:20,440
Speaker 2: But with these archetypes, with these languages, they often come

465
00:28:20,480 --> 00:28:24,720
Speaker 2: in pairs, and these pairs sit in opposition, so opposite pairs.

466
00:28:24,760 --> 00:28:27,000
Speaker 2: I guess they kind of sit in our position with

467
00:28:27,040 --> 00:28:29,760
Speaker 2: each other. And that's the case with the amassa and

468
00:28:29,800 --> 00:28:34,440
Speaker 2: the giver. So the amassa is really looking to stock up,

469
00:28:35,160 --> 00:28:39,440
Speaker 2: but the giver sees money is something to donate, to share,

470
00:28:39,680 --> 00:28:44,320
Speaker 2: to be generous with, to use to help others. Think

471
00:28:44,360 --> 00:28:48,280
Speaker 2: about your friend who is kind of always donating to

472
00:28:48,320 --> 00:28:51,160
Speaker 2: those random growthundmes that like pop up on their TikTok.

473
00:28:51,880 --> 00:28:54,479
Speaker 2: The friend who will shower you in gifts on your

474
00:28:54,480 --> 00:28:58,040
Speaker 2: birthday despite the fact that her rent is late, who

475
00:28:58,080 --> 00:29:02,560
Speaker 2: was very selfs us with their money. Often these people

476
00:29:02,640 --> 00:29:05,880
Speaker 2: have been raised to be very generous, but they can

477
00:29:06,000 --> 00:29:12,440
Speaker 2: also be very financially negligent and mismanaged, and they lack

478
00:29:12,480 --> 00:29:15,600
Speaker 2: boundaries around money that can get them in a lot

479
00:29:15,640 --> 00:29:19,320
Speaker 2: of trouble. They're lending money to friends, to family, pay

480
00:29:19,400 --> 00:29:21,920
Speaker 2: me back whenever, and it's kind of like, well, eventually

481
00:29:22,520 --> 00:29:25,200
Speaker 2: you do kind of need a system around where your

482
00:29:25,200 --> 00:29:28,360
Speaker 2: money's going to who it's going to. So we have

483
00:29:28,440 --> 00:29:30,400
Speaker 2: two more. Hopefully I'm not going too fast few, but

484
00:29:30,400 --> 00:29:32,800
Speaker 2: you can always listen back and hopefully it's clear what

485
00:29:32,880 --> 00:29:35,120
Speaker 2: the distinctions are. I think when you really start to

486
00:29:35,120 --> 00:29:37,200
Speaker 2: think about them, it becomes a lot more apparent. But

487
00:29:37,240 --> 00:29:39,080
Speaker 2: the last do we have are the avoid and the Monk.

488
00:29:39,520 --> 00:29:41,960
Speaker 2: Let's start with the monk first, because I really want

489
00:29:41,960 --> 00:29:43,520
Speaker 2: to hone in on the avoid as one of as

490
00:29:43,560 --> 00:29:46,600
Speaker 2: our last archetypes so it stays with you. The monk

491
00:29:46,680 --> 00:29:50,080
Speaker 2: is actually super rare, but they believe that money is

492
00:29:50,200 --> 00:29:52,760
Speaker 2: essentially the root of all evil. And it makes us

493
00:29:52,840 --> 00:29:56,080
Speaker 2: unfulfilled to the point where they are happy to accept

494
00:29:56,200 --> 00:30:01,080
Speaker 2: poverty over sometimes even meeting their basic needs. They're very

495
00:30:01,120 --> 00:30:05,600
Speaker 2: content with a minimalist life, but they can also overlook

496
00:30:05,960 --> 00:30:10,280
Speaker 2: the practical necessity of money. Like I said, not very common.

497
00:30:10,320 --> 00:30:13,600
Speaker 2: I honestly don't think I've met anyone like this. In

498
00:30:13,640 --> 00:30:15,680
Speaker 2: my mind and in my circles. It's much more common

499
00:30:15,680 --> 00:30:20,200
Speaker 2: to meet a giver who kind of unintentionally rids themselves

500
00:30:20,240 --> 00:30:23,760
Speaker 2: of their financial possessions, not because they think it's evil,

501
00:30:24,200 --> 00:30:25,720
Speaker 2: because they think of all the good that it can

502
00:30:25,760 --> 00:30:27,760
Speaker 2: do for their friends and family, and they just kind

503
00:30:27,800 --> 00:30:31,760
Speaker 2: of are quite blase about it. But the final archetype

504
00:30:31,880 --> 00:30:34,720
Speaker 2: is the avoid And let me say there as loud

505
00:30:34,760 --> 00:30:38,080
Speaker 2: and clear, as far as us twenty somethings go, the

506
00:30:38,120 --> 00:30:40,520
Speaker 2: avoid is the one that I see the most of

507
00:30:40,600 --> 00:30:44,239
Speaker 2: in my own life. For sure. They don't want to know.

508
00:30:44,800 --> 00:30:46,840
Speaker 2: They don't want to know what's in their bank account.

509
00:30:47,120 --> 00:30:48,800
Speaker 2: They don't want to know how much they're saving or

510
00:30:48,840 --> 00:30:52,080
Speaker 2: investing or spending, or what bills they have coming up,

511
00:30:52,320 --> 00:30:55,800
Speaker 2: what they spend on the weekend. And it's often because

512
00:30:55,840 --> 00:30:59,520
Speaker 2: we experience a lot of emotional distress even thinking about money,

513
00:31:00,200 --> 00:31:03,520
Speaker 2: even thinking about our finances. A lot of this comes

514
00:31:03,560 --> 00:31:06,680
Speaker 2: from fear, either from struggling in the past, feeling like

515
00:31:07,280 --> 00:31:09,840
Speaker 2: no matter what, you won't you're not educated or capable

516
00:31:09,880 --> 00:31:14,880
Speaker 2: of really treating your money healthily or in a way

517
00:31:14,920 --> 00:31:18,520
Speaker 2: that's going to work for you. And it's really based

518
00:31:18,600 --> 00:31:23,120
Speaker 2: on some simple psychological principles avoid bad feelings, and we

519
00:31:23,160 --> 00:31:25,560
Speaker 2: feel better avoid thinking about money, and we don't feel

520
00:31:25,560 --> 00:31:28,840
Speaker 2: stressed about money. But this can get us in a

521
00:31:28,960 --> 00:31:32,680
Speaker 2: lot of trouble. I feel like that goes without saying,

522
00:31:33,120 --> 00:31:35,480
Speaker 2: and it can end up getting us into an even

523
00:31:35,520 --> 00:31:39,600
Speaker 2: worse place than we were when we began this habit,

524
00:31:40,360 --> 00:31:44,120
Speaker 2: because the money is still being spent, The money is

525
00:31:44,160 --> 00:31:47,719
Speaker 2: still going somewhere, even if we're not thinking about it,

526
00:31:48,000 --> 00:31:52,440
Speaker 2: even if we are consciously or unconsciously ignoring it. And

527
00:31:52,520 --> 00:31:57,200
Speaker 2: all that we're doing there is trying to navigate mediate

528
00:31:57,760 --> 00:32:01,920
Speaker 2: mitigate our emotional response to money by just pretending that

529
00:32:02,400 --> 00:32:05,840
Speaker 2: whatever's going on in our finances doesn't exist, turning a

530
00:32:05,840 --> 00:32:08,200
Speaker 2: blind eye. And I also want to say, I think

531
00:32:08,240 --> 00:32:10,720
Speaker 2: this is really common in our twenties because we don't

532
00:32:10,760 --> 00:32:13,920
Speaker 2: feel like we're very financially literate and because there are

533
00:32:13,960 --> 00:32:17,240
Speaker 2: just like so many There's just so many times when

534
00:32:17,320 --> 00:32:20,719
Speaker 2: like hidden expenses come up, we feel like we're stupid

535
00:32:20,840 --> 00:32:25,320
Speaker 2: or silly for not noticing them. We feel kind of

536
00:32:25,400 --> 00:32:30,960
Speaker 2: ridiculous or really quite i don't know, impulsive, or just

537
00:32:31,080 --> 00:32:33,880
Speaker 2: dumb for like spending money on certain things. And I

538
00:32:33,920 --> 00:32:37,280
Speaker 2: think it's just this whole environment of a lot of

539
00:32:37,360 --> 00:32:40,720
Speaker 2: us are just confused and not educated around how to

540
00:32:40,760 --> 00:32:42,880
Speaker 2: spend money, and we're really learning a lot of those

541
00:32:43,320 --> 00:32:46,440
Speaker 2: financial consequences of money mismanagement for the first time, and

542
00:32:46,480 --> 00:32:49,160
Speaker 2: it's embarrassing and kind of gives us an ego check.

543
00:32:49,240 --> 00:32:52,560
Speaker 2: It makes us feel quite negatively about ourselves. And of

544
00:32:52,560 --> 00:32:55,440
Speaker 2: course our mind loves to protect our ego. It wants

545
00:32:55,440 --> 00:32:57,920
Speaker 2: to protect our sense of self, and so in order

546
00:32:57,960 --> 00:33:00,160
Speaker 2: to do that, it stops us from thinking about how

547
00:33:00,160 --> 00:33:04,440
Speaker 2: we've messed up, stop something thinking about our mistakes. This

548
00:33:04,800 --> 00:33:07,640
Speaker 2: is a great example really of why we need to

549
00:33:07,680 --> 00:33:12,400
Speaker 2: start interrogating this relationship that we have with money that

550
00:33:12,520 --> 00:33:16,640
Speaker 2: comes from our psychology, because I think in all of

551
00:33:16,680 --> 00:33:22,640
Speaker 2: those instances, something is not quite right, something is a

552
00:33:22,640 --> 00:33:26,640
Speaker 2: little bit off balance. And when we don't figure out

553
00:33:26,640 --> 00:33:31,120
Speaker 2: what the emotional and cognitive reactions to money are, or

554
00:33:31,160 --> 00:33:34,400
Speaker 2: we don't really start thinking about what's influencing our behavior.

555
00:33:34,920 --> 00:33:38,920
Speaker 2: We keep getting an outcome that intensifies that initial need

556
00:33:39,440 --> 00:33:41,960
Speaker 2: to be very one tracked minded when it comes to money,

557
00:33:42,000 --> 00:33:45,560
Speaker 2: to avoid, to splurge, to a mass, to save intensely.

558
00:33:46,400 --> 00:33:49,960
Speaker 2: In every instance, though, although you might feel more positively

559
00:33:49,960 --> 00:33:52,120
Speaker 2: about one of those languages or archetypes in the other,

560
00:33:52,720 --> 00:33:56,520
Speaker 2: we are still controlled by money. Our money language is

561
00:33:56,560 --> 00:34:01,200
Speaker 2: still in response to an underlying sense or lack of control,

562
00:34:01,360 --> 00:34:04,520
Speaker 2: or anxiety or stress. So what I want to talk

563
00:34:04,560 --> 00:34:08,200
Speaker 2: about next is how we can approach our finances, whatever

564
00:34:08,239 --> 00:34:11,800
Speaker 2: they may be, with a healthy attitude, with the best

565
00:34:11,840 --> 00:34:15,040
Speaker 2: mindset we can possibly muster, so that A we can

566
00:34:15,080 --> 00:34:17,040
Speaker 2: actually do the best we can with what we have

567
00:34:17,360 --> 00:34:20,040
Speaker 2: in our twenties, with what we're making. B we can

568
00:34:20,080 --> 00:34:24,200
Speaker 2: reduce some of the subjective stress and see we can

569
00:34:24,239 --> 00:34:28,080
Speaker 2: actually start to put in place helpful, productive strategies when

570
00:34:28,080 --> 00:34:30,720
Speaker 2: it comes to thinking about money. So it's not always

571
00:34:30,760 --> 00:34:33,279
Speaker 2: the news around our next, so it's not always controlling

572
00:34:33,320 --> 00:34:37,400
Speaker 2: that controlling us. So all of that and more after

573
00:34:37,440 --> 00:34:44,640
Speaker 2: this shortbreak. Okay, I do want to say one more

574
00:34:44,640 --> 00:34:47,080
Speaker 2: time than I'm not a financial coach. That is not

575
00:34:47,120 --> 00:34:50,200
Speaker 2: my specialty. So I'm not going to give you specific

576
00:34:50,480 --> 00:34:53,040
Speaker 2: financial tips about where to invest what to do with

577
00:34:53,120 --> 00:34:55,440
Speaker 2: your money, because I do believe that's up to you,

578
00:34:55,520 --> 00:34:58,880
Speaker 2: and obviously I don't know your individual circumstances. But what

579
00:34:59,000 --> 00:35:01,640
Speaker 2: I can help you with is the mental side of things,

580
00:35:02,200 --> 00:35:03,920
Speaker 2: and for that I have a number of tips for

581
00:35:03,960 --> 00:35:07,759
Speaker 2: you that I've learned from therapist who specialize in financial anxiety,

582
00:35:08,200 --> 00:35:11,320
Speaker 2: from academic papers, and even some of my own experiences

583
00:35:11,400 --> 00:35:15,280
Speaker 2: as well. Firstly, I really just want you to notice

584
00:35:15,320 --> 00:35:20,799
Speaker 2: whether your financial anxiety and financial distress is objective or subjective.

585
00:35:21,360 --> 00:35:25,080
Speaker 2: Are you objectively unable to meet your needs, pay your bills,

586
00:35:25,520 --> 00:35:27,560
Speaker 2: have a bit left over for you and your interests?

587
00:35:28,280 --> 00:35:32,319
Speaker 2: Or is this more of a subjective appraisal stemming from

588
00:35:32,480 --> 00:35:37,640
Speaker 2: a scarcity mindset or an ingrained anxious attitude towards your finances.

589
00:35:38,520 --> 00:35:41,759
Speaker 2: Here are really three questions to ask yourself in order

590
00:35:41,800 --> 00:35:47,360
Speaker 2: to tell which of these you're experiencing. Are you consistently

591
00:35:47,400 --> 00:35:50,680
Speaker 2: worried about your finances even when you have a stable

592
00:35:50,719 --> 00:35:56,560
Speaker 2: income and stable savings. If yes, that indicates subjective financial anxiety.

593
00:35:56,560 --> 00:35:59,960
Speaker 2: If no, objective when you think about your financial future,

594
00:36:00,040 --> 00:36:04,480
Speaker 2: do you worry more about unlikely scenarios like you know,

595
00:36:04,560 --> 00:36:07,360
Speaker 2: losing your savings all of a sudden, or do you

596
00:36:07,400 --> 00:36:11,080
Speaker 2: worry more about real and current changes. Real and current

597
00:36:11,160 --> 00:36:17,440
Speaker 2: changes is objective. Financial future hypotheticals are subjective. Have you

598
00:36:17,520 --> 00:36:21,160
Speaker 2: reviewed your budget and found that your expenses exceeded your

599
00:36:21,200 --> 00:36:25,800
Speaker 2: income and that you can't afford basic necessities? Yes, indicate

600
00:36:25,800 --> 00:36:31,399
Speaker 2: its objective. No equals subjective. The thing is you may

601
00:36:31,480 --> 00:36:36,040
Speaker 2: still be feeling stressed regardless of whether it's subjective or objective.

602
00:36:36,560 --> 00:36:39,319
Speaker 2: I don't think that there's like a competition, but as

603
00:36:39,400 --> 00:36:41,920
Speaker 2: you just think that there are going to be different

604
00:36:41,960 --> 00:36:45,600
Speaker 2: strategy is depending on where you sit. If it's objective

605
00:36:45,719 --> 00:36:49,560
Speaker 2: financial difficulties that you're managing, you're going to need a

606
00:36:49,600 --> 00:36:53,400
Speaker 2: more practical based strategy. I would really encourage you to

607
00:36:53,440 --> 00:36:56,440
Speaker 2: really just get into your financial basics. Do you have

608
00:36:56,480 --> 00:36:59,600
Speaker 2: a budget? Who can you talk to professionally to help

609
00:36:59,640 --> 00:37:04,320
Speaker 2: you manage your money? Can you ask friends or family

610
00:37:04,680 --> 00:37:08,480
Speaker 2: to help? What needs or ways of spending need to

611
00:37:08,560 --> 00:37:12,440
Speaker 2: change to make your situation more secure? What do you

612
00:37:12,480 --> 00:37:15,160
Speaker 2: know about your bank account? What do you know about

613
00:37:15,520 --> 00:37:18,960
Speaker 2: even your daily spending. It's crazy how many people, I

614
00:37:19,000 --> 00:37:21,000
Speaker 2: think have a lot of problems with money in this

615
00:37:21,080 --> 00:37:24,759
Speaker 2: generation when they are making enough money to survive, but

616
00:37:24,880 --> 00:37:28,040
Speaker 2: they just never really look they never really look at

617
00:37:28,040 --> 00:37:32,120
Speaker 2: what they're spending and what that's on. I also really

618
00:37:32,120 --> 00:37:34,920
Speaker 2: recommend that if it's not a case of like you

619
00:37:34,960 --> 00:37:37,200
Speaker 2: actually have the money there, you're just not spending it, well,

620
00:37:37,880 --> 00:37:40,600
Speaker 2: go and talk to a financial counselor who can help

621
00:37:40,640 --> 00:37:45,080
Speaker 2: you with managing debt, with managing bills. There is literally

622
00:37:45,120 --> 00:37:47,240
Speaker 2: no shame in it. There is no shame. The amount

623
00:37:47,239 --> 00:37:50,560
Speaker 2: of people who have struggles with money or who just

624
00:37:50,600 --> 00:37:54,040
Speaker 2: don't really know what to do is just in the millions,

625
00:37:54,040 --> 00:37:57,239
Speaker 2: probably in the billions, because it's not a system that

626
00:37:57,360 --> 00:38:01,040
Speaker 2: was created to be understandable by everyone. So there are

627
00:38:01,160 --> 00:38:03,000
Speaker 2: so many, so many services. A lot of them are

628
00:38:03,040 --> 00:38:07,240
Speaker 2: from the not for profit sector that offer this service

629
00:38:07,280 --> 00:38:09,839
Speaker 2: for free, that will let you come in and will

630
00:38:09,960 --> 00:38:15,000
Speaker 2: help you through whatever it is you're experiencing money wise. Also,

631
00:38:15,360 --> 00:38:19,560
Speaker 2: you know, financial literacy is a huge asset if you're

632
00:38:19,600 --> 00:38:23,120
Speaker 2: experiencing a lot of objective financial stress. The lack of

633
00:38:23,200 --> 00:38:26,760
Speaker 2: financial literacy we have in the lack of financial education

634
00:38:26,880 --> 00:38:32,640
Speaker 2: that we receive is abysmal, like it's genuinely criminal. The

635
00:38:32,719 --> 00:38:36,280
Speaker 2: fact that you go through decades of school learning about

636
00:38:36,320 --> 00:38:39,359
Speaker 2: calculus and history. No one's going to tell you how

637
00:38:39,360 --> 00:38:42,000
Speaker 2: to ask for a raise, No one's going to tell

638
00:38:42,040 --> 00:38:45,239
Speaker 2: you how to apply for a home loan, how to

639
00:38:45,280 --> 00:38:48,200
Speaker 2: set up a household budget, how to find deals for

640
00:38:48,280 --> 00:38:51,719
Speaker 2: your expenses, where to go for help. But when we

641
00:38:51,800 --> 00:38:55,560
Speaker 2: have more knowledge, we feel more empowered to really not

642
00:38:55,680 --> 00:38:58,759
Speaker 2: live under the thumb of money. Again, I'm not a

643
00:38:58,760 --> 00:39:02,560
Speaker 2: financial advisor, keiping my advice on the rather brief side

644
00:39:02,680 --> 00:39:04,960
Speaker 2: of this, but I do think that there are a

645
00:39:04,960 --> 00:39:08,560
Speaker 2: lot of options out there, and if this is something

646
00:39:08,560 --> 00:39:11,920
Speaker 2: that is gravely impacting your mental health, there is a

647
00:39:11,960 --> 00:39:15,840
Speaker 2: way to find a solution that is going to leave

648
00:39:15,880 --> 00:39:19,080
Speaker 2: you being able to just have the money you need

649
00:39:19,120 --> 00:39:21,960
Speaker 2: to survive, but also the money that you need to

650
00:39:22,000 --> 00:39:25,000
Speaker 2: not constantly be worried about it, to not constantly be

651
00:39:25,080 --> 00:39:28,200
Speaker 2: hung up on things, to find an avenue out, to

652
00:39:28,200 --> 00:39:31,160
Speaker 2: find a better opportunity that's going to kind of elevate

653
00:39:31,400 --> 00:39:35,759
Speaker 2: your financial situation. And let's move on to subjective financial

654
00:39:35,800 --> 00:39:41,279
Speaker 2: anxiety here, because whereby objective financial difficulty really requires a

655
00:39:41,320 --> 00:39:48,000
Speaker 2: practical approach, subjective financial stress requires a more psychological and

656
00:39:48,120 --> 00:39:52,359
Speaker 2: emotional plan of attack. To begin with, I really want

657
00:39:52,440 --> 00:39:55,719
Speaker 2: you to understand your money behaviors and your money archetype.

658
00:39:55,800 --> 00:39:58,440
Speaker 2: So think back to that list we gave, and I

659
00:39:58,480 --> 00:40:01,000
Speaker 2: want you to have having ideas to find where you sat,

660
00:40:01,719 --> 00:40:05,320
Speaker 2: understand where that language or archetype may have come from,

661
00:40:05,640 --> 00:40:08,960
Speaker 2: and the habit loop that is associated with it. Remember,

662
00:40:09,120 --> 00:40:13,880
Speaker 2: subjective financial anxiety is having money and still feeling worried

663
00:40:14,000 --> 00:40:18,719
Speaker 2: despite all of your needs being secured. I really want

664
00:40:18,719 --> 00:40:21,239
Speaker 2: you to notice, and this is a really good exercise,

665
00:40:21,800 --> 00:40:24,719
Speaker 2: how you feel when you get paid, because that is

666
00:40:24,760 --> 00:40:27,319
Speaker 2: obviously a time when money is quite prominent. It's on

667
00:40:27,360 --> 00:40:30,400
Speaker 2: our minds. We're very flushed with cash. What is your

668
00:40:30,440 --> 00:40:33,120
Speaker 2: first instinct? Is it to go out and spend it all?

669
00:40:33,840 --> 00:40:36,600
Speaker 2: Is it to avoid looking at what needs to be paid?

670
00:40:37,320 --> 00:40:41,000
Speaker 2: Is it to invest it immediately or to just immediately

671
00:40:41,080 --> 00:40:46,160
Speaker 2: put it all away? Just notice what your first instinct

672
00:40:46,200 --> 00:40:49,440
Speaker 2: is to do. I will say, if you are obviously

673
00:40:49,600 --> 00:40:52,440
Speaker 2: in a period where you're trying to say for a house,

674
00:40:52,480 --> 00:40:54,760
Speaker 2: you're trying to save for a car and overseas holiday,

675
00:40:55,320 --> 00:40:57,960
Speaker 2: trying to pay off debt, and you have a strategy

676
00:40:58,000 --> 00:41:01,080
Speaker 2: that is balanced, that is not your own money archetype,

677
00:41:01,520 --> 00:41:05,840
Speaker 2: you have consciously overridden your archetype to meet your daily

678
00:41:05,880 --> 00:41:08,880
Speaker 2: needs and what's actually happening in your current reality. But

679
00:41:09,239 --> 00:41:12,400
Speaker 2: you still may have an underlying urge to treat something

680
00:41:12,480 --> 00:41:16,080
Speaker 2: as emotional rather than practical. So even if you have

681
00:41:16,120 --> 00:41:18,200
Speaker 2: an overarching strategy, what I want you to notice is

682
00:41:18,239 --> 00:41:21,120
Speaker 2: the initial impulse. Like you know you should be putting

683
00:41:21,400 --> 00:41:24,319
Speaker 2: twenty percent into a savings account, but what if as

684
00:41:24,360 --> 00:41:26,040
Speaker 2: soon as you get paid, your impulses to go out

685
00:41:26,040 --> 00:41:29,319
Speaker 2: and buy. Then your money archetype is probably that of

686
00:41:29,360 --> 00:41:33,000
Speaker 2: the spender. So when you kind of know where you sit, secondly,

687
00:41:33,760 --> 00:41:37,160
Speaker 2: think back to when you first started thinking about money

688
00:41:37,160 --> 00:41:41,000
Speaker 2: this way. Was it those hard times in childhood? Was

689
00:41:41,040 --> 00:41:43,359
Speaker 2: it not being taught financial literacy when you got your

690
00:41:43,400 --> 00:41:48,319
Speaker 2: first job. Because just being able to identify that route,

691
00:41:48,440 --> 00:41:53,600
Speaker 2: that origin, therefore allows you to notice situations that feel

692
00:41:53,600 --> 00:41:57,359
Speaker 2: similar and which may be confronting for you, and which

693
00:41:57,400 --> 00:42:01,799
Speaker 2: may be triggering you to rely on your money archetype

694
00:42:01,840 --> 00:42:06,200
Speaker 2: even when it's not working. So some really common triggers

695
00:42:06,280 --> 00:42:10,880
Speaker 2: that I tend to see are periods of stress. Is

696
00:42:11,239 --> 00:42:14,200
Speaker 2: when I'm spending too much time on social media. When

697
00:42:14,239 --> 00:42:19,440
Speaker 2: we're upset, grumpy, agitated, going through a big life change,

698
00:42:19,920 --> 00:42:22,640
Speaker 2: we just don't have the mental energy to think about

699
00:42:22,680 --> 00:42:24,719
Speaker 2: money in a way that is rational and helpfuls do

700
00:42:24,800 --> 00:42:31,239
Speaker 2: we revert to that very instinctual and emotional approach. Remember

701
00:42:31,960 --> 00:42:37,719
Speaker 2: often that instinctual approach, that money archetype is defensive and

702
00:42:37,760 --> 00:42:40,880
Speaker 2: it's protective based on what you felt you liked or

703
00:42:40,880 --> 00:42:43,759
Speaker 2: what you couldn't control, maybe at an earlier point in

704
00:42:43,800 --> 00:42:48,320
Speaker 2: your life. And so you're applying this approach of hoarding, avoiding, splurging, saving,

705
00:42:48,960 --> 00:42:52,440
Speaker 2: whatever it is, maybe to self soothes, maybe because it

706
00:42:52,480 --> 00:42:55,600
Speaker 2: brings things back into control, maybe because you just don't

707
00:42:55,640 --> 00:42:58,799
Speaker 2: know how else to do it. So take note of

708
00:42:58,840 --> 00:43:02,040
Speaker 2: your triggers because that helps us understand our habit loop.

709
00:43:02,040 --> 00:43:04,360
Speaker 2: Now I've been kind of teasing you with this habit

710
00:43:04,400 --> 00:43:07,360
Speaker 2: loop idea, but this is a concept that was created

711
00:43:07,360 --> 00:43:10,560
Speaker 2: by this man, doctor Judd, and he's actually a neuroscientist

712
00:43:10,800 --> 00:43:14,760
Speaker 2: specializing an addiction, but his idea of a habit loop

713
00:43:14,840 --> 00:43:18,759
Speaker 2: also applies to money. Basically, a habit loop contains three things,

714
00:43:18,800 --> 00:43:22,040
Speaker 2: a trigger, a behavior, and a result. The trigger could

715
00:43:22,040 --> 00:43:24,720
Speaker 2: be really anything that causes you to think about money

716
00:43:24,719 --> 00:43:28,279
Speaker 2: in a way that is irrational or distressing, and it

717
00:43:28,320 --> 00:43:31,719
Speaker 2: contributes to the behaviors aligned with your money archetype, and

718
00:43:31,760 --> 00:43:34,800
Speaker 2: that results in the same thing happening, the same outcome

719
00:43:34,800 --> 00:43:38,000
Speaker 2: occurring again and again and again. You revert to spending

720
00:43:38,040 --> 00:43:40,880
Speaker 2: because you're feeling upset. That's the trigger. You don't have

721
00:43:41,000 --> 00:43:43,239
Speaker 2: enough money available to you to last you till your

722
00:43:43,239 --> 00:43:47,959
Speaker 2: next get paid. You feel very judged for not having

723
00:43:48,000 --> 00:43:51,000
Speaker 2: as much as other people. That's going to make you

724
00:43:51,040 --> 00:43:54,920
Speaker 2: feel like you need to amass more money now. To

725
00:43:55,080 --> 00:43:58,760
Speaker 2: break the habit loop, we need to interrupt the cycle

726
00:43:59,120 --> 00:44:02,920
Speaker 2: at the behavior, the moment you feel the compulsion to

727
00:44:03,040 --> 00:44:07,640
Speaker 2: just immediately fall back into what's instinctual pause and really

728
00:44:07,680 --> 00:44:11,160
Speaker 2: start to focus on what you actually want from your money.

729
00:44:11,480 --> 00:44:14,239
Speaker 2: An amazing tip for doing this that I got from

730
00:44:14,280 --> 00:44:18,360
Speaker 2: someone I was interviewing for this episode was to imagine

731
00:44:18,480 --> 00:44:21,600
Speaker 2: the next two months, then one year, and then five years.

732
00:44:22,239 --> 00:44:25,239
Speaker 2: What are your long term goals within each of those periods.

733
00:44:25,719 --> 00:44:28,120
Speaker 2: What is the lifestyle you want in two months, in

734
00:44:28,160 --> 00:44:31,759
Speaker 2: one year, then five will that make you happy? Is

735
00:44:31,800 --> 00:44:34,239
Speaker 2: that possible? And what do you need to get there?

736
00:44:34,880 --> 00:44:39,160
Speaker 2: Focus on making this goal or vision realistic. Firstly, so

737
00:44:39,360 --> 00:44:41,480
Speaker 2: scale it back to match what you actually have coming in,

738
00:44:41,560 --> 00:44:46,279
Speaker 2: what your expenses are actually like, and then start to

739
00:44:46,360 --> 00:44:49,680
Speaker 2: plan and start to really sew down for a second

740
00:44:50,040 --> 00:44:53,080
Speaker 2: and think about whether the way we're spending money now

741
00:44:53,640 --> 00:44:55,600
Speaker 2: is going to let us meet that vision we have

742
00:44:55,680 --> 00:44:59,239
Speaker 2: for two months, one year, and five years. When you

743
00:44:59,320 --> 00:45:02,960
Speaker 2: go to spend, save, invest, whatever it is, think about

744
00:45:03,000 --> 00:45:07,360
Speaker 2: what period this best suits, and make sure that you

745
00:45:07,400 --> 00:45:11,800
Speaker 2: are equally distributing your financial choices across these three periods.

746
00:45:11,800 --> 00:45:13,160
Speaker 2: So when she first explained to me, I was a

747
00:45:13,160 --> 00:45:15,200
Speaker 2: little bit confused. I was like, what are you talking about?

748
00:45:15,640 --> 00:45:17,880
Speaker 2: But this is what she told me. She said, you know,

749
00:45:17,920 --> 00:45:21,600
Speaker 2: for example, when you buy and your outfit, that is

750
00:45:21,640 --> 00:45:24,080
Speaker 2: something that your two month self really really wants. That's

751
00:45:24,120 --> 00:45:28,640
Speaker 2: the lifestyle your two month self will enjoy having cool clothes,

752
00:45:28,840 --> 00:45:30,920
Speaker 2: having great clothes that maybe they don't really need but

753
00:45:31,000 --> 00:45:34,080
Speaker 2: they want. So you can still spend the money, but

754
00:45:34,120 --> 00:45:36,120
Speaker 2: when you do, you also need to be thinking about

755
00:45:36,160 --> 00:45:38,799
Speaker 2: your one year self. For all that money that you

756
00:45:38,800 --> 00:45:41,920
Speaker 2: are spending on your two month self, are you also

757
00:45:42,120 --> 00:45:45,520
Speaker 2: putting money into an emergency fund so that in one year,

758
00:45:45,600 --> 00:45:47,799
Speaker 2: when your car breaks down you need to get a

759
00:45:47,840 --> 00:45:50,520
Speaker 2: tooth removed, you can still be able to afford that.

760
00:45:51,280 --> 00:45:53,200
Speaker 2: And then there is the five year self, your long

761
00:45:53,280 --> 00:45:57,600
Speaker 2: term investments, your long term high interest savings account. Are

762
00:45:57,600 --> 00:46:00,680
Speaker 2: you only thinking about money that you'll need for that

763
00:46:00,800 --> 00:46:03,160
Speaker 2: trip in a year, and not the money you'll need

764
00:46:03,760 --> 00:46:08,359
Speaker 2: for life or the money that you'll need for long

765
00:46:08,440 --> 00:46:12,920
Speaker 2: term financial independence. Kind of be thinking about that as well,

766
00:46:12,960 --> 00:46:18,520
Speaker 2: and balance your financial decisions across these three time periods. Now,

767
00:46:18,560 --> 00:46:21,080
Speaker 2: I will say the five year time period, I'm not

768
00:46:21,160 --> 00:46:24,719
Speaker 2: the best at putting money towards my five year lifestyle,

769
00:46:25,120 --> 00:46:27,920
Speaker 2: my five year goal, my five year vision. Think I

770
00:46:27,960 --> 00:46:30,200
Speaker 2: am leaning more towards like the one to two year

771
00:46:30,280 --> 00:46:33,600
Speaker 2: period and definitely like what my two month self wants,

772
00:46:33,640 --> 00:46:36,080
Speaker 2: Like my two month self wants the memories of going

773
00:46:36,080 --> 00:46:37,879
Speaker 2: out for dinner with my friends, and my two month

774
00:46:37,960 --> 00:46:41,439
Speaker 2: self wants to go to this new restaurant and wants

775
00:46:41,440 --> 00:46:43,280
Speaker 2: to buy these new clothes and buy these new books

776
00:46:43,360 --> 00:46:47,319
Speaker 2: and whatever. But really, I think that shows that I

777
00:46:47,360 --> 00:46:52,319
Speaker 2: am maybe an avoid myself. HI sometimes don't really think

778
00:46:52,360 --> 00:46:55,719
Speaker 2: about money because it stresses me out. So the real

779
00:46:55,760 --> 00:46:59,680
Speaker 2: thing here is that balance is key. This really helps us,

780
00:46:59,719 --> 00:47:03,200
Speaker 2: I think, clear out the maze around money and align

781
00:47:03,280 --> 00:47:06,239
Speaker 2: our behavior to a broader goal without feeling overwhelmed by

782
00:47:06,239 --> 00:47:10,840
Speaker 2: our current circumstances or feeling overwhelmed by the potential hypotheticals

783
00:47:10,840 --> 00:47:13,560
Speaker 2: for the future. This is like a great system to

784
00:47:13,600 --> 00:47:17,280
Speaker 2: be like, Okay, I know where my money is going.

785
00:47:17,640 --> 00:47:19,520
Speaker 2: I know that it is balanced. I know that one

786
00:47:20,400 --> 00:47:23,799
Speaker 2: slice of the pie is not overtaking the others. I

787
00:47:23,840 --> 00:47:27,120
Speaker 2: also really want you to be realistic about your finances,

788
00:47:27,640 --> 00:47:32,400
Speaker 2: which means swapping out irrational appraisals of your situation with

789
00:47:33,000 --> 00:47:35,640
Speaker 2: logic and truth. I heard from this listener the other day.

790
00:47:35,640 --> 00:47:40,000
Speaker 2: He was like, no matter what, I'm constantly stressed about money.

791
00:47:40,200 --> 00:47:42,040
Speaker 2: She was telling me about how she had a relative

792
00:47:42,080 --> 00:47:45,920
Speaker 2: pass away. She got something like twenty thousand dollars. Obviously

793
00:47:45,920 --> 00:47:48,160
Speaker 2: I'm keeping her anonymous, but yeah, she got this huge

794
00:47:48,160 --> 00:47:50,719
Speaker 2: windfall of cash. And she was like, all throughout my

795
00:47:50,760 --> 00:47:52,560
Speaker 2: life I thought that once that would happen, I would

796
00:47:52,600 --> 00:47:56,880
Speaker 2: be okay, And yet I'm still stressed. So when you

797
00:47:56,920 --> 00:47:59,520
Speaker 2: start to get paralyzed, when you start to feel overwhelmed,

798
00:48:00,320 --> 00:48:03,560
Speaker 2: I have a checklist for you to basically determine whether

799
00:48:03,600 --> 00:48:06,560
Speaker 2: your current worries are based on circumstances that are actually

800
00:48:06,600 --> 00:48:09,880
Speaker 2: happening or their future fears. And if it's based on

801
00:48:09,880 --> 00:48:12,839
Speaker 2: something that's currently happening, you can problem solve it. If

802
00:48:12,840 --> 00:48:15,520
Speaker 2: it's based on future fears. Then you need to manage

803
00:48:16,080 --> 00:48:19,320
Speaker 2: not actually your money, but your anxiety towards your money.

804
00:48:19,800 --> 00:48:21,959
Speaker 2: So if you check all these boxes, that really gives

805
00:48:21,960 --> 00:48:26,720
Speaker 2: you permission to worry about money another day when something changes.

806
00:48:27,680 --> 00:48:30,680
Speaker 2: So I have a steady income that covers my basic needs,

807
00:48:30,800 --> 00:48:33,239
Speaker 2: yes or no. I can pay my bills on time,

808
00:48:33,320 --> 00:48:36,839
Speaker 2: yes or no. My debt is under control. I have

809
00:48:36,880 --> 00:48:40,240
Speaker 2: an emergency fund that could cover me if things drastically changed.

810
00:48:41,000 --> 00:48:45,120
Speaker 2: There are no immediate financial crises like a redundancy or

811
00:48:45,200 --> 00:48:48,359
Speaker 2: unexpected large expenses that I need to address right now.

812
00:48:49,280 --> 00:48:52,360
Speaker 2: If you answered yes, you can take a pause for

813
00:48:52,400 --> 00:48:55,160
Speaker 2: a second. The reality of your situation is that you

814
00:48:55,200 --> 00:48:57,759
Speaker 2: don't need to be worrying right now. If one of

815
00:48:57,760 --> 00:48:59,560
Speaker 2: those is a no, then you can start to think

816
00:48:59,600 --> 00:49:04,080
Speaker 2: about it solution because you are now experiencing objective financial stress,

817
00:49:04,480 --> 00:49:06,680
Speaker 2: and we already really spoke about some of the strategies

818
00:49:06,680 --> 00:49:09,600
Speaker 2: for that. But there really is a way through. I

819
00:49:09,640 --> 00:49:12,760
Speaker 2: promise you. I promise you. I've seen people in serious

820
00:49:12,840 --> 00:49:16,560
Speaker 2: debt pull it together, pull themselves out of it, still

821
00:49:17,040 --> 00:49:20,759
Speaker 2: find help, find success. I know that money is so

822
00:49:20,960 --> 00:49:25,520
Speaker 2: uniquely stressful during this decade because it never feels like

823
00:49:25,640 --> 00:49:29,880
Speaker 2: we have enough because we are just getting our financial footing.

824
00:49:30,480 --> 00:49:32,480
Speaker 2: But I also know that many of us are in

825
00:49:32,520 --> 00:49:35,320
Speaker 2: the same boat. About seventy two percent of us, based

826
00:49:35,320 --> 00:49:39,320
Speaker 2: on recent estimates by the American Psychological Association, are thinking

827
00:49:39,440 --> 00:49:42,600
Speaker 2: and worrying about money. So take solace that you are

828
00:49:42,600 --> 00:49:46,400
Speaker 2: not alone. You're definitely not behind, you are definitely not

829
00:49:46,600 --> 00:49:50,240
Speaker 2: isolated in your fears. Please try and prioritize your mental

830
00:49:50,239 --> 00:49:53,520
Speaker 2: health throughout this all because money comes and goes. I know,

831
00:49:53,600 --> 00:49:55,440
Speaker 2: I say, I know, I said that. I don't like

832
00:49:55,480 --> 00:49:57,920
Speaker 2: when people say that, but it's true. There will be

833
00:49:57,960 --> 00:50:00,600
Speaker 2: times when you're doing better in times when things aren't

834
00:50:00,600 --> 00:50:04,160
Speaker 2: going as well. But your mental state, your psychological well being,

835
00:50:04,800 --> 00:50:07,320
Speaker 2: is not always something that you can recover as easily

836
00:50:07,400 --> 00:50:11,480
Speaker 2: as money. It is a much more fruitful investment to

837
00:50:11,560 --> 00:50:15,879
Speaker 2: invest in your mental health than anything that money can buy.

838
00:50:16,520 --> 00:50:20,239
Speaker 2: Because once your mental health, I think, really slips, it

839
00:50:20,280 --> 00:50:24,440
Speaker 2: does take so much time, I think, to help yourself

840
00:50:24,480 --> 00:50:26,799
Speaker 2: get back on track. So talk to your friends about it,

841
00:50:27,280 --> 00:50:30,680
Speaker 2: connect with others over their own worries, find people in

842
00:50:30,719 --> 00:50:34,319
Speaker 2: the same situation. Don't neglect your self care because there

843
00:50:34,360 --> 00:50:37,200
Speaker 2: is a lot that is free and affordable that is

844
00:50:37,280 --> 00:50:40,040
Speaker 2: going to still help you feel great without making you

845
00:50:40,080 --> 00:50:43,120
Speaker 2: even more financially stressed. You know, a walk in the park,

846
00:50:43,400 --> 00:50:46,560
Speaker 2: a swim in the ocean, a guided meditation that's all free,

847
00:50:46,760 --> 00:50:50,400
Speaker 2: a yoga video on YouTube, some deep breaths. You know,

848
00:50:50,560 --> 00:50:54,120
Speaker 2: breathing is free, a glass of water is free. Money

849
00:50:54,320 --> 00:50:57,720
Speaker 2: and mental health don't always mix that well. But also,

850
00:50:57,760 --> 00:50:59,680
Speaker 2: if you're in your twenties, you are just at the beginning,

851
00:51:00,200 --> 00:51:02,080
Speaker 2: and I think the most crucial thing for you to

852
00:51:02,080 --> 00:51:04,520
Speaker 2: do is to get an understanding of the ways that

853
00:51:04,560 --> 00:51:07,680
Speaker 2: you emotionally relate to money during this decade. That is

854
00:51:07,719 --> 00:51:10,719
Speaker 2: one of the best tips and steps that you need

855
00:51:10,760 --> 00:51:14,640
Speaker 2: for a financially independent future, and I really hope that

856
00:51:14,680 --> 00:51:17,360
Speaker 2: you find it. So thank you so much for listening

857
00:51:17,440 --> 00:51:21,000
Speaker 2: to today's episode. Although it is close to an hour long,

858
00:51:21,040 --> 00:51:23,319
Speaker 2: I do feel like I missed some things because you

859
00:51:23,400 --> 00:51:26,799
Speaker 2: just get so wrapped up sometimes in the topic and

860
00:51:26,920 --> 00:51:29,360
Speaker 2: in your approach to it. So if there is something

861
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Speaker 2: else that you want to talk about that you think

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Speaker 2: could be added to this conversation, please shoot me a damn.

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Speaker 2: I'd love to do a follow up episode based on

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00:51:35,920 --> 00:51:38,600
Speaker 2: your stories, based on your thoughts. Make sure that you

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Speaker 2: are following along on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, wherever you are

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00:51:41,680 --> 00:51:44,520
Speaker 2: listening right now, give us a five star review. If

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00:51:44,560 --> 00:51:47,200
Speaker 2: you enjoyed this episode, send it to someone that you

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00:51:47,320 --> 00:51:50,920
Speaker 2: love that you think could benefit from it, and, as always,

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00:51:51,040 --> 00:51:55,799
Speaker 2: until next time, stay safe, stay kind, be gentle to yourself,

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Speaker 2: and we will talk very very soon,