Speaker 1: Worrying. Today's episode candid spoilers for the Captain America Films
Speaker 1: and Captain America Well Steve Rogers and Sam Wilson throughout.
Speaker 2: The MCU, you've been warned.
Speaker 1: Hello, my name is Jason Stepsia and I'm Rosie Knight,
Speaker 1: and welcome back to Xtra Vision, the podcast where we
Speaker 1: dive deep into your favorite shows, movies, comedy of pop culture.
Speaker 1: Company from our podcast where we're bringing you through epistence.
Speaker 2: Week last news list news in today's episode, well, we
Speaker 2: have a special treat for you, guys. We're still months
Speaker 2: away from Avengers Doomsday, but with so many players spread
Speaker 2: across movies, TVs and multiverses each month, we were gonna
Speaker 2: deep dive into a set of characters to help you
Speaker 2: prepare for the MCU's next big tempole films. But this
Speaker 2: will not be your average x ray Vision episode. Through
Speaker 2: some multiversal trickery, Jason and I have managed to obtain
Speaker 2: a recording of tonight's nightly news from Earth six one six,
Speaker 2: so we're giving you a look inside the minds of
Speaker 2: the everyday people living with the Avengers and dealing with
Speaker 2: the fallout of the Infinity Saga. Steve Rogers a kid
Speaker 2: from Brooklyn, rejected from military service multiple times before being
Speaker 2: selected for Project Rebirth, a classified SSR program given.
Speaker 1: Steve just couldn't wait to get into the military and
Speaker 1: kill The problem was Rosie. He was eighty five pounds
Speaker 1: and they didn't think he'd be able to do it.
Speaker 2: They were wrong. He would go on to be one
Speaker 2: of the most prolific military killers and military figureheads in
Speaker 2: American history. The process was a success, but the project leader,
Speaker 2: doctor Erskine, and his research were destroyed by Nazi spies.
Speaker 2: Steve became Captain America, led the Howling Commandos against Hydra
Speaker 2: was regarded as the greatest soldier of the war. Disappeared
Speaker 2: in nineteen forty five after reportedly crashing a hydro aircraft
Speaker 2: in the Arctic to prevent a mash casualty attack on
Speaker 2: the American East Coast. He was declared killed in action
Speaker 2: and became a legend. He was recovered from the ice
Speaker 2: decades late up by Shield, one of the most stunning
Speaker 2: discoveries in modern history. Steve was recruited to the Avengers
Speaker 2: Initiative and fought in the Battle of New York, the
Speaker 2: event that changed everything the world learned. It was not alone.
Speaker 1: Who could forget the day that aliens from the sky
Speaker 1: invaded New York City for reasons I think most of
Speaker 1: us were still pretty unclear about correct, But there was
Speaker 1: Captain America running around on the street saving people's lives,
Speaker 1: and what a sight to see. There was some discussion
Speaker 1: about whether that could be him, seeing as how he
Speaker 1: disappeared some seventy years earlier, but indeed it turned out
Speaker 1: it was him. It was the classified records that have
Speaker 1: since been declassified indicate that he was frozen in ice.
Speaker 2: Can you believe it? This is the kind of thing
Speaker 2: that since the Battle of New York we have all
Speaker 2: started to have to get used to. After the battle,
Speaker 2: he became the de facto field leader of the Avengers,
Speaker 2: the one giving the orders while the sky was falling.
Speaker 1: Avengers was a public private partnership project between the government
Speaker 1: Shield and Tony Stark, billionaire philanthropist Tony Starkhall everybody, Uh,
Speaker 1: you know, I think a controversial, surely, a polarizing figure
Speaker 1: whose weapons have rot destruction throughout the world, but whose
Speaker 1: clean energy initiatives are truly impressive.
Speaker 2: Rogers exposed a hydra infiltration that had been festering inside
Speaker 2: Shield for decades. Three Hella carriers destroyed over Washington, DC's
Speaker 2: shield was effectively dismantled. It was then that Rogers went
Speaker 2: rogue to protect Sergeant James Bucky Barnes, the Winter Soldier,
Speaker 2: his childhood friend who had been brainwashed by Hydra given.
Speaker 2: This is where public opinion on Rogers starts to fracture,
Speaker 2: because it was around this time the public began to
Speaker 2: realize that this was a man who would go against
Speaker 2: two hundred and ninety two UN countries in order to
Speaker 2: save his best friend.
Speaker 1: The Russian agent Bucky.
Speaker 3: Barnes, exactly.
Speaker 2: People were not happy about that, Jason.
Speaker 1: No, they weren't happy about that. They weren't happy about
Speaker 1: the destruction of Cekovia after the Avengers battle with all
Speaker 1: Tra Tron rumored to be a creation of Tony Stark.
Speaker 1: You've never answered questions on the record about that, but
Speaker 1: supposedly Tony Stark created the vibranium covered robot Ultron. The
Speaker 1: fight against Ultron didn't destroy the Eastern European nation of
Speaker 1: Secoviet completely.
Speaker 2: Mm hmmm.
Speaker 1: Hundreds of thousands of dead just be.
Speaker 2: A giant piece of island falling out of the sky,
Speaker 2: a crater.
Speaker 1: Where the nation should have been. And after this the
Speaker 1: nations of the world got together and went, can we
Speaker 1: really let six people who can drop an asteroid on
Speaker 1: a nation by themselves just run around doing whatever they want?
Speaker 1: And thus the Cekovia Accords came into power.
Speaker 2: The accords required Avengers to operate under un oversight. Steve
Speaker 2: Rogers refused to sign, though Tony Stark did. The Avengers split.
Speaker 2: Rogers and a faction of Avengers, including Sam Wilson, went underground,
Speaker 2: effectively becoming fugitives. He chose loyalty to bonds and personal
Speaker 2: conscience over institutional authority. When Thanos arrived, Rogers came out
Speaker 2: of hiding. He joined many of our other heroes for
Speaker 2: a last stand in Wakanda. He was one of the
Speaker 2: survivors of the snap. As we know, I was gone
Speaker 2: during the blip, so I don't remember anything from that time.
Speaker 2: You know, it happened to many of us. It was terrible.
Speaker 2: They had the Russo brothers out there at support groups
Speaker 2: being gay. It was like they were trying to connect
Speaker 2: with us guys, and you know what.
Speaker 1: And Steve was cool with it. I just want to
Speaker 1: by all the reports, all the reports we have and
Speaker 1: Steve was cool with it. I just want to stress that.
Speaker 2: Five years later, the Avengers tried for one last mission,
Speaker 2: a time heist. Rogers was instrumental in rallying the remaining
Speaker 2: members of the team to attempt the impossible. In the
Speaker 2: final battle, Steve Rodgers lifted Molnair Thor's hammer. He was
Speaker 2: confirmed worthy. For millions watching, this was the defining image
Speaker 2: of the war. This is the moment that people have painted.
Speaker 2: This is the moment people have talked about. Jason, what
Speaker 2: was it like when you heard that Steve Rogers was
Speaker 2: truly worthy and he had picked up Thor's hammer?
Speaker 1: Well, you wondered how Thor felt about it. But luckily,
Speaker 1: by that point in time, there were two enchanted weapons
Speaker 1: on the field. You had a stormbreaker of the axe,
Speaker 1: and then of course you had the original mulla mm hmm.
Speaker 1: But it was cool. It was an incredible moment. You
Speaker 1: know a friend who has a tattooed on his chest.
Speaker 1: It was It's a moment that continues to resonate throughout time.
Speaker 1: I don't know why Steve didn't get to keep it,
Speaker 1: but maybe maybe because he disappeared. That was that was good.
Speaker 2: Steve stood alone against Thanos's army and said, I can
Speaker 2: do this all day, and then the portals opened it.
Speaker 2: I have heard rumors that this is when Sam Wilson
Speaker 2: came back, saying, on your left, classic bit. Imagine you
Speaker 2: just came back from five years in the blip. When
Speaker 2: that happened to me, I was like what And I
Speaker 2: was swearing and I was cursing, and people I was
Speaker 2: going crazy. I just appeared back and left. Sam Wilson,
Speaker 2: he said a catchphrase, that's a powerful riturn. That's how
Speaker 2: you knew he was going to be the new Captain America.
Speaker 2: He knew branding was so important.
Speaker 1: Well, you know, it must have been extremely confusing and
Speaker 1: disorienting for everybody. Luckily, all the heroes were were able
Speaker 1: to absorb the information and understand what was going on.
Speaker 1: You know, I've seen people come back after the Blip
Speaker 1: to what is known as the Snap, and it was
Speaker 1: quite terrifying. People peering at a thin air, screaming, masturbating,
Speaker 1: all kindness, taking dumb terrible. It was and you know,
Speaker 1: very shocking. So I've heard that most of the heroes
Speaker 1: disappeared in the midst of the battle that took place
Speaker 1: in the mysterious nation of conduct, so probably they were primed,
Speaker 1: you know, for to continue the fight. For them, it
Speaker 1: was just like I was just fighting and now I'm
Speaker 1: back fighting again. It doesn't it make sense. Luckily no
Speaker 1: one was, you know again, no one was taking a
Speaker 1: dump in the middle of the blip.
Speaker 2: I have had that some people were just about to die,
Speaker 2: got blipped and then came back and died straight away,
Speaker 2: which is like, did.
Speaker 1: They get five extra years?
Speaker 2: I mean, it's very strange. I feel like there's going
Speaker 2: to be great academic writing on the blip. We of
Speaker 2: course that XOTV will at some point have a blip
Speaker 2: expose a documentary come out. After the battle, Rogers volunteered
Speaker 2: to return the Infinity Stones to their proper timelines, but
Speaker 2: he never came back, or at least not as expected anyway,
Speaker 2: and elderly Steve Rodgers appeared shortly after, having apparently lived
Speaker 2: out a full life in an alternate time life.
Speaker 1: I wasn't there, but this is what has been incredibly
Speaker 1: told to me, was that after putting the stones back,
Speaker 1: everybody came back, Everything's fine. Then Steve came back and
Speaker 1: he was old, very very very old, skinny with like
Speaker 1: the baggy neck, looking kind of like jo That's what
Speaker 1: they said, looking a lot like Joseph Biden, but but
Speaker 1: but more vital, you know, much more, you know, like
Speaker 1: like he'd been having good, good sex for the last
Speaker 1: fifty to sixty years, right in shape, trim, but bold,
Speaker 1: I mean, Jason.
Speaker 2: That does raise a lot of questions and has raised
Speaker 2: a lot of question about what Steve was doing in
Speaker 2: the past.
Speaker 1: He was, he was just fucking his way. Sorry, let's
Speaker 1: take that again. He was having intercourse with his wife,
Speaker 1: I know.
Speaker 2: But Jason, if he went back in time, does that
Speaker 2: mean he was okay with segregation? Does that mean he
Speaker 2: was okay with the enslavement of people's How far did
Speaker 2: he go back, Jason? And these are the questions people
Speaker 2: want to know.
Speaker 1: We don't have any answers to that, because old Steve
Speaker 1: went back in there to continue his life of intercourse
Speaker 1: with his beautiful wife, Beggy Carter.
Speaker 2: She has beautiful He passed his shield to Sam Wilson,
Speaker 2: causing much chaos and controversy over the fact that he
Speaker 2: did not give it to Bucky Barnes. Steve Rogers has
Speaker 2: not been publicly seen since, and his whereabouts and status
Speaker 2: are unknown post Steve. The mantle of Captain America eventually
Speaker 2: went to Sam Wilson after the brief and ultimately infamous
Speaker 2: John Walker into This video that we are showing right
Speaker 2: now might be a bit triggering for those of you.
Speaker 2: It is the video of John Walker decapitating a member
Speaker 2: of the public with the Captain America shield.
Speaker 1: Shocking events.
Speaker 2: Shocking events, and that is why you will notice that
Speaker 2: he is no longer US agent or Captain America that
Speaker 2: heard him. There are rumors that Steve is coming back.
Speaker 2: Will we have two caps? Will it be cap'n Falcon?
Speaker 2: Will it be cap Falcon and Falcon because now we
Speaker 2: know that the young hero known as Joaquin has also
Speaker 2: taken on the role of Falcon. There are so many questions, guys,
Speaker 2: and that's why we're here to answer them. So let's
Speaker 2: cut to Daniel Blake with the weather and we'll be
Speaker 2: back after these commercials with Soup Center.
Speaker 3: Yeah, welcome back to Soup Center. I'm your host, Aaron M. Kaufman,
Speaker 3: and today on first issue, we're getting into the truth
Speaker 3: about Steve Rodgers and his cohort of shield carriers. Joining
Speaker 3: me for today's debate, we have Jason Conception and Rosie Knight,
Speaker 3: how are the two of you doing today?
Speaker 1: Doing great?
Speaker 2: I'm ready, ready to talk about it, ready to talk
Speaker 2: about this controversial figure in our American history.
Speaker 3: So first up, I want to ask, is the best
Speaker 3: offense actually just a good offense? Is Captain America's shield
Speaker 3: an outdated symbol?
Speaker 1: Jason?
Speaker 2: What do you stand on this?
Speaker 1: I love the shield. The shield is classic. The shield
Speaker 1: has been the symbol of Captain America since World War Two,
Speaker 1: the last good war, and that, you know, I think
Speaker 1: it says a lot about him. He's not going to
Speaker 1: go on the offense. He's going to defend the rights
Speaker 1: of free people everywhere with that shield. The shield is indestructible.
Speaker 1: He's got a gun. The shield is special. Keep the shield.
Speaker 1: I love the shield. It's a powerful, powerful symbol.
Speaker 2: I don't disagree with Jason, though, I will say I
Speaker 2: feel like this shield has to have some rehab posted
Speaker 2: John Walker chopping off ahead. I know it's a different
Speaker 2: shape shield, but I feel like, you know, that vision
Speaker 2: of an American flag inspired shield covered in blood is
Speaker 2: a hard one to get rid of. So I think
Speaker 2: the shield is important. I think we gotta bring the
Speaker 2: shield back in a positive way. That reframes it for
Speaker 2: new people. Because Sam Wilson's shield it's powerful. He can
Speaker 2: get it very far, he's good at throwing it, but
Speaker 2: it's yet to have that true iconic moment the way
Speaker 2: that Steve has. So I feel like we got to
Speaker 2: bring the shield back, maybe reimagine it a little, but
Speaker 2: I think keep the shield. He doesn't need a gun.
Speaker 2: No one wants to see Captain America with a gun.
Speaker 1: Well, you know, the original shield was that kind of
Speaker 1: hearts shape with the flat top on the two sides,
Speaker 1: that kind of tear drop down to a point at
Speaker 1: the bottom. And my issue with that is that looks
Speaker 1: even more dangerous than the than the shield that John
Speaker 1: Wach used to decapitate the guy. It looks sharper, it
Speaker 1: looks more dangerous. There's a point in it. You can
Speaker 1: imagine the Captain America who wields it stabbing somebody with it,
Speaker 1: stabbing them in the net, sawing them and the guts
Speaker 1: and their guts all out. And I think the circular shield,
Speaker 1: it just feels like I'm not discounting the fact that
Speaker 1: there is a serious image problem, that indelible image of
Speaker 1: the head rolling down the street, the blood spurting out
Speaker 1: John Walker. Lynn's standing there looking crazed, screaming incoherently. It
Speaker 1: was a great and you know, and it's something that
Speaker 1: you can see on the internet all the time. It's really, really,
Speaker 1: really horrible, and it was a propaganda victory for America's enemies.
Speaker 1: That said, I do think the circular shield is just
Speaker 1: inherently less aggressive. And listen, maybe you maybe you make
Speaker 1: the edges a little rounder, maybe round them off a
Speaker 1: little bit. I don't know what kind of manufacturing process
Speaker 1: for vibranium, like, am I am I suggesting something that's
Speaker 1: actually impossible with the physics of vibranium. It does it
Speaker 1: affect the aerodynamics? Is it now fly slower? Does it
Speaker 1: not bounce as well? If you do that, whatever the
Speaker 1: case may be, I'd be willing to explore that a
Speaker 1: softer edge shield, But I think the circular shield it's
Speaker 1: just better. It looks better the John Walker stuff. Nonwithstanding,
Speaker 1: let's put that in the past. Let's keep the shield
Speaker 1: the symbol of Captain America, and let's just put it
Speaker 1: in the hands of a person who won't go around
Speaker 1: to capitating people. As simple as that, simple as that.
Speaker 3: Now, a lot has been said about about Sam Wilson,
Speaker 3: who's taken the man of Captain America. He was the
Speaker 3: young developmental kid that we had on the bench. We
Speaker 3: had a lot of faith in him. He had a
Speaker 3: lot of potential and he's now taken over the role
Speaker 3: of Captain America. But the Falcons haven't always had the
Speaker 3: best luck in sports. Did Falcon fumble the role as
Speaker 3: the leader of the Avengers? Rosie? What do you think?
Speaker 1: Oh?
Speaker 2: I think this is an unfair to put it on
Speaker 2: Sam Wilson, though I do think it's a fair question
Speaker 2: to ask. I do not think that he had the
Speaker 2: support of the Avengers, as we have seen in the
Speaker 2: past Steve Rogers Avengers had billions of dollars via Tony Stark.
Speaker 2: By the time Sam takes on Captain America's shield, Tony
Speaker 2: is dead. He's living in a post Tony Stark world.
Speaker 2: And it seems like Tony Stark only bothered to give
Speaker 2: his leftover technology to teenage boys, which you know is
Speaker 2: a question for another day. But I would say that
Speaker 2: I do think Sam didn't have the right preparation and
Speaker 2: to truly take on the lead of Avengers. But also
Speaker 2: I would say I think there's a level of racism
Speaker 2: there to guys playing into this because the government tried
Speaker 2: to get sacked.
Speaker 1: Here we go, be Captain America.
Speaker 2: We go, here, we go, and then they take we
Speaker 2: go right out the history of other Captain Americas who
Speaker 2: are black. So I think that he was not given
Speaker 2: the preparation that he needed and the support to truly
Speaker 2: bring an Avengers team to the forefront, because who do
Speaker 2: we have now? Guys, whoe are the Avengers?
Speaker 3: Now? Rosie, I would like to remind you please stick
Speaker 3: to soups here all right?
Speaker 1: The facts here are the facts. Here are the facts
Speaker 1: about Sam Wilson, who by all accounts is a nice
Speaker 1: man and we you know, appreciate his service to our
Speaker 1: country as a member of the pair of rescue team
Speaker 1: in the Middle East. That said Sam Wilson wings were
Speaker 1: Condon tech. Sam Wilson, the little mobile remote control bird
Speaker 1: were Condon tech. Where's that data going? Where is that
Speaker 1: from the bird going? Is it going to us here
Speaker 1: in the United States of America or is it going
Speaker 1: to athletes?
Speaker 3: Captain America?
Speaker 1: So a scurious country in Afriga we don't even know about. Okay,
Speaker 1: this guy is why can't we he wear the stuff
Speaker 1: that we make for him. Yeah, okay, wearing stuff from
Speaker 1: other countries, and again seems like it seems like a
Speaker 1: nice guy. Okay, but he doesn't have the super soldier
Speaker 1: serum and the only thing that makes him special is
Speaker 1: a foreign nations technology that we don't understand. So I
Speaker 1: just I'm not saying no to Sam Wilson. I'm just
Speaker 1: saying I have questions. The bar, of course, was absolutely
Speaker 1: on the ground, and I try the decapitation of that
Speaker 1: random guy by John Walker, but that means we need
Speaker 1: more clarity from our captain America. Where does this tech
Speaker 1: come from? How does it work? How does the little
Speaker 1: remote control bird work? Where does the intelligence from the
Speaker 1: little remote control bird go? Does it stay here? Does
Speaker 1: it go to Wakanda? Can they kill the suit with
Speaker 1: a push of a button? Question? These are all ken
Speaker 1: is would Sam Wilson feel comfortable going on a mission
Speaker 1: in America's interests against Wakanda. We don't have the answers
Speaker 1: to these questions, and we need to have the answers
Speaker 1: to those questions before I'm comfortable saying Sam Wilson is
Speaker 1: the guy Jason.
Speaker 2: I know that oftentimes we do butt heeads about this,
Speaker 2: But I must say I do have a source who
Speaker 2: did inform me that Bucky Bond's what Coandon arm was
Speaker 2: able to be controlled by Wakanda.
Speaker 1: And they don't even get me start about Bucky Barnes.
Speaker 2: Who stop the arm. So I do think you raise
Speaker 2: a good point about national security here, Jason, as much
Speaker 2: as I hate to admit it.
Speaker 1: Don't even get me started about Bucky Barnes, who has
Speaker 1: is a known victim of mine control which has never
Speaker 1: been solved. He's been rumored and suspected to be an
Speaker 1: active participant in numerous political assassinations over the course of
Speaker 1: multiple decades. He's got the Wakandan Arm. He was a
Speaker 1: Russian agent, we know that absolutely for sure, and then
Speaker 1: he was a Russian Nazi agent, which is crazy for
Speaker 1: much of the Shield period. And he again seems like
Speaker 1: a nice guy. You can see him walking around your
Speaker 1: city all the time, used to talk up and talk
Speaker 1: to me. Seems like a very very sweet guy. But
Speaker 1: I just don't know. I just don't know if we
Speaker 1: can trust him. There was the issue where you know,
Speaker 1: Baronzimo read him a dozen random words and he went
Speaker 1: crazy again and killed multiple people in Switzerland, excuse me, Germany.
Speaker 1: We can't have that happen again. And I just feel
Speaker 1: like until such time as we can be sure that
Speaker 1: the mind can thing is really under control, we have
Speaker 1: to question Bucky Barnes as well. And then you said
Speaker 1: it the Wakandan tech which he does not control, which
Speaker 1: we do not control. We don't know who controls it now.
Speaker 3: I just want to remind that two of you that
Speaker 3: Bucky Barnes was elected congressman and has held political office.
Speaker 1: That's a whole other issue. This is a democracy. If
Speaker 1: people want to elect an absolute Russian spy, Russian Nazi spy,
Speaker 1: they all free to do that. Sadly, it was in
Speaker 1: the United States of America, and he may go all
Speaker 1: the way up to president if if the people of
Speaker 1: this country do so choose to elect that person.
Speaker 2: They did elect the Hulk, so you know it could happen.
Speaker 1: All right, Well, they didn't, to be fair to the electorate,
Speaker 1: they did not know he was a Hulk at that time.
Speaker 1: They didn't although they were sure. Listen, I didn't vote
Speaker 1: for him. He was a whole criminal, yes, but you
Speaker 1: know I didn't vote for him, but many people did.
Speaker 1: And there it is our.
Speaker 3: Next topic I want to hear from both of you
Speaker 3: about is copyright incringement the Avengers versus the New Avengers,
Speaker 3: the branding here we've had an expansion team. I'm not
Speaker 3: really sure if there's the fandom around and the talent
Speaker 3: pool for both teams. But Jason, what do you think
Speaker 3: Avengers New Avengers? Too many teams? Who exactly?
Speaker 2: Exactly?
Speaker 1: Sorry, some people may think that you suddenly had an
Speaker 1: owl come on, but I said, who knew?
Speaker 3: Who?
Speaker 1: Who? What have they done? I'm aware of this team
Speaker 1: that you talk about that you're speaking of. I think
Speaker 1: I bench press more than forty percent of that team.
Speaker 1: The team is just people. There's Buggy Barnes with a
Speaker 1: Condon arm question mark, an active congressman. Who can he
Speaker 1: be doing this running around leading a team of guys
Speaker 1: and gals but who have no special ability that we
Speaker 1: know of, and various members of them are have been
Speaker 1: agents of a foreign government and mind control Yolena for one.
Speaker 1: And then you know, listen, I've decried the decapitation in
Speaker 1: the streets of Vienna. And John Wilson is a member
Speaker 1: of that team.
Speaker 2: Team, He's on the team. This is a team of
Speaker 2: misfits and That's not to say that maybe they could
Speaker 2: have come together and do something good. But guys, who
Speaker 2: have they been brought together by none other than the
Speaker 2: Countess of Valentina Alegrafontee. She's annoying, she's shady, she's machinations
Speaker 2: behind the scenes. Every time we have her on here,
Speaker 2: she avoids answering any serious questions. I am wary of
Speaker 2: any team put together by the American government solely, though
Speaker 2: I must say I understand why the government would want
Speaker 2: to do this after the private public combination of the
Speaker 2: Avengers that led to the issues with the Kovia records.
Speaker 2: But I must say Thunderbolts was a better name. That
Speaker 2: is what the fans named them online. It was contestant.
Speaker 2: He tried to do this New Avengers. You are not
Speaker 2: the new Avengers. You were not even analogous to the Avengers.
Speaker 3: I agree.
Speaker 2: My understanding from what I'm hearing from the food delivery
Speaker 2: guy is that the most powerful member can't even use
Speaker 2: his powers. There's one member who has powers and he
Speaker 2: can't use them. And if we're to be believed what
Speaker 2: the streets are saying, he might even be the reason
Speaker 2: they had to become a team in the first place,
Speaker 2: in which case, just don't put the team together.
Speaker 1: I think that is the fact. Their very first mission
Speaker 1: was to fight the guy that is now part of
Speaker 1: the team. This gentleman who you were talking about made
Speaker 1: several dozen people turned to stains in New York City.
Speaker 1: Now he is apparently part of the team. The rest
Speaker 1: of that roster includes red Guardian for an act. So
Speaker 1: basically the Captain America of Russia, overweight alcoholic Yolana Belova,
Speaker 1: Russian agent, sitting Buggy Barnes mind controlled, sitting congressman, former
Speaker 1: Russian Nazi assassin, a US agent who decapitated a guy
Speaker 1: in the streets of Vienna. It's a tough look, I think,
Speaker 1: and that's why I would say, let's keep it the thunderbolts.
Speaker 1: And that's not Sully the name of the e. Even
Speaker 1: if you put new on it, it's just not it's
Speaker 1: not enough. And then there's I didn't even mention Ghost,
Speaker 1: who were not Can they take a shower? Like, what
Speaker 1: is the deal with Ghost? Are they in this dimension?
Speaker 1: Are they halfway in another dimension? We didn't Can they
Speaker 1: take the suit off? Do they disappear if they take
Speaker 1: the suit off? It's unclear? That said the only maybe
Speaker 1: dependable American. Well, actually she appears to be from England.
Speaker 1: Never mind.
Speaker 3: All right. A follow up to that, a lot of
Speaker 3: our fans have been wondering, are we in a drought
Speaker 3: of American superheroes? Do we have too many international names
Speaker 3: on the superhero market right now?
Speaker 1: Wow, it's a good question. I think it depends on
Speaker 1: It depends on how you look at it. I do
Speaker 1: think that it's true that a certain generation of American
Speaker 1: superhero has passed from the scene. Now we can get
Speaker 1: them back through various multiversal techniques, although that has drawbacks
Speaker 1: in and of itself see the issue with Doctor Doom
Speaker 1: potentially being Tony Stark from another dimension.
Speaker 2: Crazy, But.
Speaker 1: You know, we got to get the talent from where
Speaker 1: we can get it. I do think that there's opportunities
Speaker 1: to find more talent with this kind of mutant trend
Speaker 1: that seems like it's increasing. But to me, the main
Speaker 1: issue is that we've got a young crop of superheroes
Speaker 1: coming and now that haven't proven themselves. We have no
Speaker 1: idea what they can do, we have no idea what
Speaker 1: their power sets are, and we have no idea if
Speaker 1: they can work together. The original Avengers had gotten to
Speaker 1: the point where it was on you know, it was
Speaker 1: it was autopilot for them. They were the synergy was incredible,
Speaker 1: you know, and it was incredible. The chemistry was incredible
Speaker 1: right off the bat. Remember the move and the Battle
Speaker 1: of New York when Tony Stark shot the repulsal rays
Speaker 1: off caps shield, which was he didn't even need to
Speaker 1: do that. That was just they were. They were just
Speaker 1: spite just looking at they were just looking cool doing that, right,
Speaker 1: And they don't We don't know if they can work
Speaker 1: together as a team. The original Steve Rogers was a
Speaker 1: tactical mastermind and could put people in roles and everybody
Speaker 1: respected that. We don't know what roles these young upcoming
Speaker 1: superheroes can play yet, and we've got to figure that
Speaker 1: out on the field.
Speaker 3: Rosie, one final thought from you. With the Captain American name,
Speaker 3: a hero that has meant so much to all of us,
Speaker 3: has that name been sullied? And what do you need
Speaker 3: to see to be a fan again?
Speaker 2: I do believe that the Captain American name has been sullied.
Speaker 2: I believe that. To believe in him again, I just
Speaker 2: need to see him come back and do something good
Speaker 2: because honestly, I don't even think that the sullying began
Speaker 2: with the nation of John Walker being a decapitator. I
Speaker 2: believe that Steve Rodgers's own choice to go into the
Speaker 2: past and time heist and then stay there and have
Speaker 2: make beautiful love to Peggy Carter is in itself a
Speaker 2: sullying because it opens too many questions, Like we said, Steve,
Speaker 2: what were you doing back then? We need to know.
Speaker 2: I also feel like I am hearing from the streets
Speaker 2: that there are these young wild heroes with crazy powers,
Speaker 2: girls who can turn light into physical manifestations, incredible archers.
Speaker 2: There are young heroes. I feel like we need Captain
Speaker 2: America to come back and be the beacon, the leader,
Speaker 2: the center of this new young generation, or else we're
Speaker 2: just gonna end up with more bootleg teams like the
Speaker 2: New Avengers that aren't gonna rise to the same heights
Speaker 2: as what we have previously seen before.
Speaker 3: Well, Rosie and Jason, thank you so much for joining us.
Speaker 3: We're gonna throw to Jackson Wheel now for rush hour traffic,
Speaker 3: and we'll be back up from these messages.
Speaker 1: That work and we're back okay as we head into doomsday, Rosie, Yes,
Speaker 1: what predictions and theories do we have for Captain America,
Speaker 1: the character, the mantle, whether that's Steve Rodgers, whether that's Sam,
Speaker 1: whoever it may be going forward. What do you think
Speaker 1: is who's gonna Who's gonna be the Captain America going forward?
Speaker 2: I think we will get this final movie with Steve
Speaker 2: Rodgers as Captain America. He's gonna be taking it back,
Speaker 2: He's gonna be re establishing the mantle, the framework of
Speaker 2: what it is to be Captain America in a post
Speaker 2: doomsday world. I also think that we'll see that expand
Speaker 2: out from the idea of protecting America because we know
Speaker 2: that this is going to become multiversal. I also think
Speaker 2: we will likely see both Sam and Cap B Cap
Speaker 2: at some point in this movie. We will get two
Speaker 2: of them with the two shields. It will be a
Speaker 2: really powerful moment. But I do feel like we could
Speaker 2: also end Doomsday with multiple caps like they've recently done
Speaker 2: in the comics, where you have different Captain Americas in
Speaker 2: different cities, and it becomes more of a Batman inc
Speaker 2: Esque mantle that inspires different people around the world rather
Speaker 2: than a singular Captain America. Because I do think that
Speaker 2: the Steve Rogers Captain America story, as much as you
Speaker 2: know our six or six counterparts may have issues with
Speaker 2: the choices he's made, has been a pretty definitive version
Speaker 2: of this hero for Marvel. So I think that ending
Speaker 2: it in a triumphant way, while maybe setting the seeds
Speaker 2: for like a different version of how his inspiration has
Speaker 2: kind of shaped them MCU is probably what we're going
Speaker 2: to get. What do you think.
Speaker 1: I'm gonna go crazy? And I think that there was
Speaker 1: at least a chance that I think you're right that
Speaker 1: we're going to see a Steve cap and a Sam cab.
Speaker 1: I think we get Sam retaining the Captain America mantle.
Speaker 1: Six six. I think we get a young Steve nomad.
Speaker 2: Yes, multiversal nomad Steve.
Speaker 1: Nomad Steve who's disillusioned and is just wandering around. And
Speaker 1: then I think we get old Steve who is like
Speaker 1: the tactical brain. Maybe not as Captain America, right, but
Speaker 1: with the old Steve kind of more military uniform with
Speaker 1: the Eagle and the and the star on the j Yeah,
Speaker 1: sitting back in the control room and pulling the strings.
Speaker 1: I think we get I think we get those two
Speaker 1: Steve's and then I mean here's my few. Okay, this
Speaker 1: is the multiverse.
Speaker 2: Mm hmm.
Speaker 1: Do we see the bad one?
Speaker 2: Do we see the I do wonder. I did have
Speaker 2: the fear that we may see Nazis.
Speaker 1: I don't want to see that.
Speaker 2: I don't want to see it. I don't want There
Speaker 2: has been rumors that this could be very secret Empire coded.
Speaker 2: The very controversial Captain America is a Nazi storyline. I
Speaker 2: feel like the EMC nodded to that perfectly when they
Speaker 2: had him say hey, Heyohydra and endgame as part of
Speaker 2: the time heist to get out of the very famous fight.
Speaker 2: I thought that was great. But I do think there
Speaker 2: is a chance. I do think, also sadly, I think
Speaker 2: there's a chance that the young cap we see is
Speaker 2: Nazi cap or something and is going after the babies
Speaker 2: for his own reason. I don't know. I'm interested to
Speaker 2: see where it goes. I never really wanted to see
Speaker 2: Steve Rogers's son, but hey, let's give it a try.
Speaker 2: Let's see if what these kids mean for these heroes,
Speaker 2: because I do think that's gonna be key to whether
Speaker 2: or not the movie works. Are these children something been
Speaker 2: added because of It's the most interesting thing for the character. Like,
Speaker 2: I know that Love and Thunder was not a very
Speaker 2: popular movie, and it was not, by any means a
Speaker 2: high point of the MCU, But I actually think Thor
Speaker 2: is someone who lost the love of his life, who
Speaker 2: lost a lot of his family, who lost his brother.
Speaker 2: I think the introduction of somebody else he can love
Speaker 2: in his life is a really interesting character choice. So
Speaker 2: I want to see if those choices are reflected when
Speaker 2: it comes to Steve, someone that we never really expected
Speaker 2: in the MCU to see again question mark unless you
Speaker 2: kind of knew how this stuff worked, or with a kid.
Speaker 2: So I'm very interested to see how that lands. But Jason,
Speaker 2: I do think I think we are at a high
Speaker 2: fifty to fifty point where we'll probably see a version
Speaker 2: of Nazi Steve.
Speaker 1: Sadly, Oh, do you think we see What do you
Speaker 1: think about Old Steve? Do you think we get old Steve?
Speaker 2: I think Old Steve has to be there one because
Speaker 2: Old Steve became a meme and they do love to
Speaker 2: reference a meme and a bit and that was so mimable.
Speaker 2: Also think look Steve.
Speaker 1: Old Steve was a feature of the Marvel continuity for yeah,
Speaker 1: a couple of years, but that his oldness had to
Speaker 1: do with a side effect of this show.
Speaker 2: Super Solder Serum, where it basically was it stopped. Yes,
Speaker 2: it kind of like in the Clone Wars where they
Speaker 2: did the episode about the Clones who started to age
Speaker 2: and it becomes this really existential thing. It's sort of
Speaker 2: like that very again tied into that Secret Empire era,
Speaker 2: which is interesting to see what they're drawing from. I
Speaker 2: would actually really like to see them do something with
Speaker 2: old Steve because also the Russo's are back. They have
Speaker 2: you know, they started Act Boy, they launched a bunch
Speaker 2: of other movies that didn't really hit for them, even
Speaker 2: though they had a lot of financial backing. They want
Speaker 2: to come back and make something the fans want. They
Speaker 2: also are in conversation with the fans, and have always
Speaker 2: been in conversation with the fans, so I think it
Speaker 2: would be surprising to not at least get some conversation,
Speaker 2: even if it's just a in universe kind of not
Speaker 2: to oh, yeah, he did help people while he was old,
Speaker 2: or oh no he didn't, you know whatever. Version. There's
Speaker 2: also a version where the Steve that went back and
Speaker 2: lived that life is the bad Steve because he ended
Speaker 2: up because he went back and made the choice to
Speaker 2: put himself before.
Speaker 1: If old Steve is bad Steve, does that mean that's
Speaker 1: original Steve?
Speaker 2: And that's what I want to know. I think that there.
Speaker 2: I think there's quite a high likelihood that what we're
Speaker 2: going to see here is old Steve who came back
Speaker 2: was never our real Steve who went away. The no
Speaker 2: mad Steve who we see is actually that Steve who
Speaker 2: had to like come back and be like, hey, I
Speaker 2: need to fix things things I like or something.
Speaker 1: I like this theory that I like the idea that
Speaker 1: we got a different Steve who came back, who's somewhat
Speaker 1: more amoral and much more selfish, was thinking about getting
Speaker 1: his own freak on with Peggy over the interview decades
Speaker 1: and was not thinking about doing good, and that good
Speaker 1: Steve got lost in the sauce somewhere, got lost in
Speaker 1: the mid exactly the multiverse, ended up in a worst
Speaker 1: world and had to go nomad because he's like this
Speaker 1: sucks and I can't be kept in America here. That's interesting, Yes.
Speaker 2: I wonder if there's something like that, because that's like
Speaker 2: way more intriguing to me than just the idea that
Speaker 2: you know, potentially there's just these two different aged good
Speaker 2: Steve's walking around. I think they really need to be
Speaker 2: careful too, because when I thought, when we're talking to thinking,
Speaker 2: when we're talking about this and thinking about this, it
Speaker 2: becomes very clear how much they have to answer just
Speaker 2: about Captain America, let alone the fact that we are
Speaker 2: going to be dealing with, you know, twelve other major
Speaker 2: characters in this movie.
Speaker 1: My question, the big question for me regarding Captain America
Speaker 1: is who is Captain America. I think Sam is going
Speaker 1: to be Captain America for the next two movies, for
Speaker 1: Doomsday and Secret Wars. Yes, the question is what happens then,
Speaker 1: because I think we're going to see a lot of
Speaker 1: turnover and probably see the universe kind of tilted more.
Speaker 2: Towards the Mutants at that point agree.
Speaker 1: And depending on how that goes, I think that Disney
Speaker 1: will probably consider whether they want to continue or whether
Speaker 1: they want to reboot in a kind of like ultimate
Speaker 1: style just started all again type situation.
Speaker 2: Yeah, but.
Speaker 1: What do you think who is Steve Long? Who is
Speaker 1: Captain America? Long term?
Speaker 2: This is the big question because in the comics there
Speaker 2: have been like so many people who've tried to be
Speaker 2: Captain America, like twenty plus people off to Steve quit.
Speaker 2: That was three different people who came in to try.
Speaker 2: That was Bob Russo, who was a professional baseball player
Speaker 2: that was a most cycle thug with an incredible comic
Speaker 2: book named Scot Turpin. And Roscoe Simmons who managed Steve's
Speaker 2: Jim and actually ended up getting killed by the Red
Speaker 2: Skull and that's part of why Steve gave up his
Speaker 2: nomad person owner. And then obviously you have John Walker,
Speaker 2: Isaiah Bradley or who we've already met, I think Sam Wilson.
Speaker 2: And then the most recent one was the United States
Speaker 2: of Captain America, which was very interesting, which was kind
Speaker 2: of different Captain America's for different states. So you had
Speaker 2: Nishelle Wright who was a Captain America of Harrisburg. You
Speaker 2: had Aaron Fisher he was a Captain America of the
Speaker 2: railway Ways. You had Joe Gomez who was the Captain
Speaker 2: America of the Kickaboo Tribe. And you had Ariel Agabarnia
Speaker 2: as the campus Captain America. But I think realistically looking
Speaker 2: at what them so who's doing right now and how
Speaker 2: they're trying to play into fandom and essentially what fandom wanted,
Speaker 2: you know, ten years ago. I think that we will
Speaker 2: see Bucky Barnes become Captain America at some point. I
Speaker 2: think that he's a fan fave of character. People always
Speaker 2: wanted to see it. With him on the Thunderbolts, he
Speaker 2: had cap shield while he was on the Thunderbolts. In
Speaker 2: the comics, I think that they should have probably done
Speaker 2: that first and then built up to Sam really getting
Speaker 2: his place, but sadly that wasn't what happened. So I
Speaker 2: do think, well, we'll see Sam and Steve here. I
Speaker 2: think that post this next event, I think it wouldn't
Speaker 2: be shocking if Bucky became our cap.
Speaker 1: Here's my other question, Well, I think we got to.
Speaker 1: I think whoever is cap going.
Speaker 2: Go to juice them?
Speaker 1: They got a juice them. Yeah, I think you can't
Speaker 1: just be a guy.
Speaker 2: Now, it doesn't work in this world. Yeah, it doesn't
Speaker 2: work in this world anymore.
Speaker 1: Now Sam has some moves where he can increase his
Speaker 1: power with the kind of wing moves and the spins
Speaker 1: and dropping out of the skin. That's all cool. I
Speaker 1: think that's really cool, But ultimately you can just do
Speaker 1: more with it with juiced cap and to me, the
Speaker 1: juice is as important as the It's kind of more
Speaker 1: important than the shield certain respects.
Speaker 2: It kind of is because they want to.
Speaker 1: Out the essential nature as Erskin said of Man, and
Speaker 1: the fact that Steve is such a good man is
Speaker 1: what made him Captain America, not the shield. So I
Speaker 1: think we gotta I think juice. I gotta get juiced.
Speaker 2: I got one last question for you, Jason. It's Captain
Speaker 2: America adjacent and I think is a really important question.
Speaker 2: Are we gonna see Sharon call a power broker again?
Speaker 3: Like?
Speaker 2: Was that real? Like? Is she power broken? What's going
Speaker 2: We gotta go on? What's going on with that? Like
Speaker 2: that's what we need to know.
Speaker 1: I think that's a very rich plot line, actually, you know,
Speaker 1: like it's.
Speaker 2: So interesting if they actually explore it properly.
Speaker 1: Yeah, illegal superhero tech has entered the world, and we've
Speaker 1: seen it with these kind of I think most effectively
Speaker 1: in in the Spider Man movies.
Speaker 3: Mm hmmmm.
Speaker 1: You know the Vulture and his crew guys who collected
Speaker 1: a Battle of New York Tatari tech and you know
Speaker 1: we're selling it on the black market. I think that's
Speaker 1: the kind of thing that will only increase. I think,
Speaker 1: were we really missed out on the armor wars?
Speaker 2: And what hell man, I wanna know? I need to know.
Speaker 1: That isn't that's an unanswered question. Does the government just
Speaker 1: have all like trillion dollars worth of worth of weaponry
Speaker 1: or did that go to somebody else. There was the
Speaker 1: issue with you know, of course, Peter Parker getting the
Speaker 1: sunglasses that I guess gave him key to all of
Speaker 1: Tony's storage lockers. You might imagine, but they've never really
Speaker 1: pursued that. And so I think that there is a
Speaker 1: overall kind of a general trend towards proliferation of superhero stuff,
Speaker 1: both technologies from heroes and villains, and these kind of
Speaker 1: very offshoots of super soldier serum sneaking out into the
Speaker 1: general population, creating villains and creating mercenaries. All of that
Speaker 1: is really cool. And listen, our heroes need more people
Speaker 1: to fight. It can't always be like this huge galactic
Speaker 1: level Thanos level threat all the time.
Speaker 2: No, it can't. And they've struggled with what it looks
Speaker 2: like when it's not that.
Speaker 1: So I think that I think you're right, it would
Speaker 1: be cool if we could pursue that stuff.
Speaker 2: More it would. I think that's what we got to
Speaker 2: look for, and I think that's what's going to be
Speaker 2: most exciting. And I'm very excited that we were able
Speaker 2: to access our secret EMCU six or six tapes and
Speaker 2: can't wait for you guys to keep joining us for
Speaker 2: Impending Doomsday.
Speaker 1: The next episode of Extra Vision, we're diving into the
Speaker 1: biggest news week that's for this episode. Thanks for listening.
Speaker 1: X Ray Vision is hosted by Jasoncepcion and Rosie Knight
Speaker 1: and is a production of iHeart Podcasts.
Speaker 2: Our executive producers are Joel Monique and Aaron Korfman.
Speaker 1: Our supervising producer is Abuzafar.
Speaker 2: Our producers are Common Laurent Dean Jonathan and Bay Wack.
Speaker 1: A theme song is by Brian Vasquez, with alternate theme
Speaker 1: songs by Aaron Kaufman.
Speaker 2: Special thanks to Soul Rubin, Chris Lord, Kenny Goodman and
Speaker 2: Heide our discord moderator.