Speaker 1: The following. He's a production of Dallas Cowboys dot Com
Speaker 1: and the Dallas Cowboys Football Club. Cowboys, Let's go. Are
Speaker 1: you ready for a break? Yes? Are you ready for
Speaker 1: a break? Absolutely? Ready for a break? Yeah, and so
Speaker 1: much for that. It's time for The Break on Dallas
Speaker 1: Cowboys dot Com Wall with Nick Eatman, Brian brought Us,
Speaker 1: and bar Garcia and Derek Eagleton. Welcome to the latest
Speaker 1: edition of The Break. It is Thursday, December first, twenty
Speaker 1: twenty two, season eighteen eight, episode number eighty one percent
Speaker 1: by mill of lte. We are it is the only
Speaker 1: beer of the Dallas Cowboys a day. We're talking Indianapolis
Speaker 1: defense versus Dallas offense, and we'll get into that. I
Speaker 1: don't know how much did you guys get through the
Speaker 1: Indie offense versus Dallas Stephen's yesterday, I'll finish it off.
Speaker 1: It took like thirty seconds, say like Jonathan Taylor's good.
Speaker 1: So Amber didn't go down the list of all the
Speaker 1: great yeah, Shell and all the great she had great notes.
Speaker 1: I had that that that did she I just sent
Speaker 1: over to you just like I don't like she's won
Speaker 1: more awards than anybody in this room. That is fact.
Speaker 1: That is a fact. She's done some of those stats
Speaker 1: just a little bit, you know, after after Brian kind
Speaker 1: of said the same thing like twice, it was like,
Speaker 1: it's going to come down to the Cowboys offense more
Speaker 1: than anything. And then once then we start talking about
Speaker 1: Jeff Saturday. Yeah, I heard about that, you know what
Speaker 1: that that thing with the Jeff Saturday I you know, Nick,
Speaker 1: I appreciate let me bring it up, ear us talk
Speaker 1: about it, because to me, that's listen, there's there's qualified
Speaker 1: you know, men and women that do these jobs and
Speaker 1: they don't do them well enough, you know. I mean,
Speaker 1: then there's people that kind of figure it out and
Speaker 1: manage people and you know, they kind of get everybody organized,
Speaker 1: and you know, so I don't always feel like that
Speaker 1: NFL people have the right. I worked in the league
Speaker 1: thirteen years working in front offices. Nick covered a lot
Speaker 1: of that. There were a lot of times when Nick
Speaker 1: walked in there goes, do you know what the hell
Speaker 1: you're doing? And and you know what, I looked at
Speaker 1: him a couple of times and said, you know, you're right,
Speaker 1: we really don't know what we're doing right now, do it?
Speaker 1: And so, you know, That's the thing about it is
Speaker 1: if you find all walks of life, it really is,
Speaker 1: it's all walks of life. You find the most qualified people. Yeah,
Speaker 1: but sometimes the most qualified people can't get the job done,
Speaker 1: you know. And I think I think the Colts could
Speaker 1: have won all three of these games that Jeff Saturday
Speaker 1: has been head coaching if you go back and watch,
Speaker 1: like I said, I went the Philly game, the Steeler game.
Speaker 1: I mean, yeah, they mismanaged the Steeler game at the end.
Speaker 1: But did they lose those games because he doesn't know
Speaker 1: how to coach because he's never been a coach before. No,
Speaker 1: I don't know. I think I think the Steeler game
Speaker 1: hurt because he didn't have an idea. But there's Andy Reid,
Speaker 1: My my buddy. Andy Reid is one of the most
Speaker 1: successful coaches in NFL history. He blows game management situations
Speaker 1: all the time. The great Bill Parcels had Ray Hanley,
Speaker 1: who was a running backs coach back in the day
Speaker 1: in the eighties. That was Ray was his clock management guy.
Speaker 1: Bill Parcells knows how to finish out games, but he
Speaker 1: had Ray Hanley there kind of saying, okay, coach, you
Speaker 1: need to have two more you know, you'll need two
Speaker 1: more first downs. You'll need this to happen. You'll need
Speaker 1: this to happen, you know. I mean the great ones
Speaker 1: do need help. And you know if these games are
Speaker 1: hard to finish at the end, we all slipped there
Speaker 1: and like, no, man, you gotta call time out here,
Speaker 1: spike it here? No, what are you doing? I mean,
Speaker 1: all we look, how about the game it ended in,
Speaker 1: you know, the playoff game against San Francisco, you know here,
Speaker 1: and you run the ball and you're trying to get
Speaker 1: to the line to spike and you're like, why why'd
Speaker 1: you do that? You know kind of a thing. So,
Speaker 1: I mean it's it's hard. These games are hard to
Speaker 1: manage at the end. I will say this on the
Speaker 1: on the Jeff Saturday thing and Nick, you and I
Speaker 1: had this conversation. Yes, yes, atle bit, No are you pro?
Speaker 1: You're pro? Like HI are the most qualified? Yeah, but
Speaker 1: but just hear me out on this because I do
Speaker 1: think one of the points I made to Nick yesterday
Speaker 1: was before Nick was promoted to director of Editorial, where
Speaker 1: he is managing all of the written content and the
Speaker 1: topics that we hit on a lot of our shows.
Speaker 1: If before that happened. If there was somebody, let's say,
Speaker 1: a contractor type person that we had in our building
Speaker 1: who was coming in and just going on air doing
Speaker 1: a video, right, and and we thought, man, this guy's
Speaker 1: really good, he really understands the content all that kind
Speaker 1: of stuff. We're going to promote him to director of
Speaker 1: editorial and he's gonna be Nick's boss. And let's say
Speaker 1: he had never written a single article in his life, right,
Speaker 1: Nick would have some feelings about that, right, because all
Speaker 1: these years Nick has been the person that's been from
Speaker 1: the time Dallas Cowboys dot com. But you know, you
Speaker 1: would not hide it well. From the time from the
Speaker 1: time Dallas Cowboys dot com. He's been the one that's
Speaker 1: been up late at night trying to figure out what
Speaker 1: we're writing and what we're gonna put on the website.
Speaker 1: And he's been putting in all the work. And then
Speaker 1: all of a sudden, somebody that came in and did
Speaker 1: a show for us that we thought was really good.
Speaker 1: Now he just jumps into that seat. I think he
Speaker 1: would have some feelings about that, right, He would feel
Speaker 1: some kind of way about that. And by the way,
Speaker 1: if you own a company, you have a right to
Speaker 1: hire who you choose to hire. Sure, now that also
Speaker 1: does that doesn't mean that we can't all have an
Speaker 1: opinion about it. We can all have an opinion. We
Speaker 1: can't change it. The owner gets to make the decision. Sure, well,
Speaker 1: we can have an opinion about it. And my opinion
Speaker 1: is that I do think there is something too the
Speaker 1: person that that's been doing the work, all these coaches
Speaker 1: that's been all those hours, all these years trying to
Speaker 1: work up to that, that are currently on that Colt staff.
Speaker 1: You can't tell me there's not at least one of
Speaker 1: them that deserved an opportunity to get an eight week
Speaker 1: try out. Right, Well, you had some coaches on that staff,
Speaker 1: like Gus Bradley who did have an actual job. He
Speaker 1: got to run Jacksonville. I think they were good for
Speaker 1: one year of his tenure there. But to me, you know,
Speaker 1: I mean, I respect what you're saying. I just don't
Speaker 1: think like that you could say the most qualified gal
Speaker 1: or guy get always go in there and get the
Speaker 1: job done, you know, And I think to have an
Speaker 1: open mind find about maybe having a taking a different
Speaker 1: path is kind of the best way to do things,
Speaker 1: you know Itcause if you're saying Okay, because I said
Speaker 1: this yesterday. You look at what urban Meyer did and
Speaker 1: all his college stops. He was a program builder everywhere
Speaker 1: he went, Bowling Green, Utah, Florida, Ohio State, all those places.
Speaker 1: And I'm sitting there thinking, Man, I wish the Dallas
Speaker 1: Cowboys would interview urban Meyer. I wish they would talk
Speaker 1: to urban Meyer about this job, because I thought he
Speaker 1: was the most qualified job guy for the job. In reality,
Speaker 1: he was actually one of the worst NFL coaches we've
Speaker 1: ever had. Like everything that you ever saw at Bowling Green, Utah, Florida,
Speaker 1: and Ohio State, it was like it wasn't even the
Speaker 1: same guy. So to me, I kind of understand if
Speaker 1: you want to take a different path because sometimes the
Speaker 1: most qualified people can't get the job done. Yeah, but
Speaker 1: I think I think that's also I mean, that's saying, okay,
Speaker 1: so in the instances where there's an exception to the rules,
Speaker 1: So you're saying in most I don't think in most
Speaker 1: since the most qualified person can't do the job, like
Speaker 1: I don't know, I'm not saying that, you know, but
Speaker 1: I'm saying is that you to just always feel like
Speaker 1: that the guy with the the gal with the best
Speaker 1: resume is always going to get the job done. I
Speaker 1: think that's I don't think that's the right way to
Speaker 1: approve it. And that's not I don't think anybody's saying
Speaker 1: the person with the best resume is going to get
Speaker 1: the job done. It's saying the person with the best
Speaker 1: resume has the best chance to get the job done
Speaker 1: because they have done it, because they have put in
Speaker 1: the work to get there. That's the point. And they've
Speaker 1: earned the opportunity because of what they've done on that resume.
Speaker 1: That's the point. And so when you don't do that,
Speaker 1: what ends up happening is that's where you start getting
Speaker 1: into the bigger conversation of well, if you're not really
Speaker 1: promoting people who have done the work and have proven
Speaker 1: that they had they deserve the right opportunity, then what
Speaker 1: starts to happen is now that exclude certain people, and
Speaker 1: certain people don't never get the opportunity because it's just
Speaker 1: kind of a it's just kind of a i'll hire
Speaker 1: my buddy kind of thing, and that never is a
Speaker 1: good thing in today's society. The problem, sure, but but look,
Speaker 1: like I said before, the right of an owner and
Speaker 1: the beauty of being able to own your own thing.
Speaker 1: Is you get to make the call. Yeah, it doesn't
Speaker 1: mean we don't get to have an opinion about it.
Speaker 1: And that's just maybe he didn't feel like the owner
Speaker 1: didn't feel like that anybody on that staff deserved that
Speaker 1: opportunity to have a tryout, that that might be their
Speaker 1: such and they might want to clean house completely when
Speaker 1: this thing's all send up. Maybe maybe Jeff Saturday's here
Speaker 1: is doing a favor for the owner. You know. Now
Speaker 1: you get people to come up, call out and call
Speaker 1: him out and say, well, he hired his drinking buddy
Speaker 1: and all that. I think that's unfair. But you know,
Speaker 1: the like you said, the owner has the right to
Speaker 1: put in there he wants. Maybe I could say he's
Speaker 1: evaluated his staff and he's looking at these guys. He goes,
Speaker 1: none of these guys can teach lines the red meat,
Speaker 1: you know that kind of thing. I mean, these guys
Speaker 1: can't coach, you know, it goes, I don't. I don't
Speaker 1: know why I have him here. And to me, I
Speaker 1: I say, I don't have a problem with always thinking
Speaker 1: that to me, always thinking that this is the most
Speaker 1: qualified person I understand about. You know that maybe it
Speaker 1: gives you the best chance, but that's not always guaranteed.
Speaker 1: Oh nothing, that's I mean, But I'm more willing to say,
Speaker 1: you know, let's try something different here, Let's not let's
Speaker 1: not hire Urban Meyern and then all of a sudden
Speaker 1: recks our franchise for the next three years. You know.
Speaker 1: That's the things I would worry about. West say something, Um,
Speaker 1: there's a couple of things. I mean, there's I thought
Speaker 1: it was kind of um hypocritical of the whole the
Speaker 1: whole situation. I think I talked about with you before.
Speaker 1: It was that if if the head coach, Frank Reich
Speaker 1: was such a problem, um, you know, so they got
Speaker 1: rid of him, you know, then they bring in a
Speaker 1: guy Jeff Saturday that obviously he's gonna need to lean
Speaker 1: on the assistance. But if the assistance were so good
Speaker 1: to help him, then why was Frank Reich the guy
Speaker 1: that was the problem in the first place. So the
Speaker 1: whole thing doesn't really add up that well. But you
Speaker 1: also made a good point too, is like the whole situation,
Speaker 1: they kind of can bypass what the rule is if
Speaker 1: the interim coach, if you don't have to use the
Speaker 1: Rooney rule, to get an interim coach, and then when
Speaker 1: you get an interim coach, you don't have to use
Speaker 1: the Rooney rule again to promote him. Then you're bypassing
Speaker 1: the situation. That seems that seems unfair to me, like
Speaker 1: like there's a rule for a reason, and they've kind
Speaker 1: of found a loophole to bypassing. Yeah, that's what they wanted. Well,
Speaker 1: the point is it's it's the spirit of the rule
Speaker 1: as well. The spirit of the rule is we're trying
Speaker 1: to create an environment where everybody can get an equal opportunity,
Speaker 1: and this kind of decision flies in the face of that.
Speaker 1: That's the problem. And again, once again, as an owner,
Speaker 1: you got a right to do what you choose to do.
Speaker 1: I think the NFL has decided as a league something
Speaker 1: like the Rooney rule is a good thing for business
Speaker 1: because they want diversity in their coaching ranks. They think
Speaker 1: it is a good thing. So if you really think
Speaker 1: it is a good thing, and you think it is
Speaker 1: something that you want to get to having diversity in
Speaker 1: your coaching ranks, specifically the head coaching position, then you
Speaker 1: need to abide by your own rule or at least
Speaker 1: push for teams to do it as as frequently as
Speaker 1: possible to make sure you achieve the objective of having
Speaker 1: diversity in the coaching right. And this was not that situation.
Speaker 1: It just that it didn't rise to the level of
Speaker 1: what they're trying to achieve. I don't think or at
Speaker 1: least what they're stating that they're trying to achieve is
Speaker 1: that run that was not. But honestly, I think it's
Speaker 1: a good conversation now, and I love the fact that
Speaker 1: we can have conversations like, yeah, but we don't have
Speaker 1: to always agree on everything. It's fine. I think it's
Speaker 1: a very very difficult conversation because it can go either way.
Speaker 1: On one hand, yes, you can agree on the process
Speaker 1: of how things should be for in order for it
Speaker 1: to create more opportunities to other people. On the other hand,
Speaker 1: you can also argue, like in today's world, at the
Speaker 1: same time, you have to abide by so many new
Speaker 1: things and so many new rules, and then it leads
Speaker 1: to maybe you're not possibly doing what you want to do,
Speaker 1: like you know, if this is what I own, this
Speaker 1: is mine, this is what I want to do, I
Speaker 1: have the right to do so. But then again it
Speaker 1: goes back to the other thing. Well, at the same time,
Speaker 1: you gotta you know, goal kind of because people there
Speaker 1: are a lot of people that put in the work,
Speaker 1: the sweat the hours and then never get a chance
Speaker 1: to really get on to the top and show what
Speaker 1: they can actually do. So I think it's a very
Speaker 1: complicated topic that has many many layers to it, and
Speaker 1: you could definitely argue and give an excuse to either side. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and that's fair. I think it comes back to if
Speaker 1: the NFL again, if the NFL is saying that our
Speaker 1: stated goal is to create diversity, right, and these all
Speaker 1: owners that have agreed this ruining rule is something that
Speaker 1: we want to do. If that's what the goal is,
Speaker 1: then you need to do it to be able to
Speaker 1: get to the goal, right, And that's my thing. I Again,
Speaker 1: owners have a right to do what they choose to do.
Speaker 1: They have decided in this instance as a group, as
Speaker 1: a league, that their stated goal is we want to
Speaker 1: create diverse How big how much do you base on
Speaker 1: people you hire on interviews? Who who? When you when
Speaker 1: you interview people? For me? Yeah, how important is that?
Speaker 1: That's a big part of it. It's not all of it.
Speaker 1: And by the way, it's different kinds of interviews. Like
Speaker 1: we we just went through a process where we were
Speaker 1: hiring someone and we literally had I literally interviewed the
Speaker 1: same person four times. Some of that was interviewing them
Speaker 1: on the technical proficiency, sure, some of that was just
Speaker 1: getting to know them as a person and getting to
Speaker 1: know what they're kind of how their makeup is. Some
Speaker 1: of that was getting them in front of other people
Speaker 1: who are influential in our organization. Some of that was
Speaker 1: getting them in front of people who they may be
Speaker 1: working with and getting their opinions. So it's it's all
Speaker 1: trying to figure out you know, you're trying to get
Speaker 1: as many data points as you can, because let's also
Speaker 1: be honest, when you're trying to hire somebody, you're only
Speaker 1: getting the representative. You don't really get the real person.
Speaker 1: You don't know the real person. That's kind of like dating, right,
Speaker 1: You kind of have to figure it out as you go,
Speaker 1: but you're you're having to make a definitive decision on
Speaker 1: whether you're gonna hire them or not before you know.
Speaker 1: If there's a big problem in this league that guys
Speaker 1: and gals interview poorly, that's the problem. That's the problem
Speaker 1: that guys and gals don't go into this into these
Speaker 1: some of these jobs in the NFL and don't interview well.
Speaker 1: And all of a sudden that you know people and
Speaker 1: you sound like to me that and I've worked with
Speaker 1: you before, so I understand this. You know you you
Speaker 1: take the attention to detail to try and get through
Speaker 1: the interview. A lot of times these front offices will
Speaker 1: interview somebody and it's a one time kind of a thing,
Speaker 1: or they'll look at like, oh, this guy told me
Speaker 1: you need to hire this guy, or this guy you
Speaker 1: need to hire this gal, and they interview them and
Speaker 1: they don't come off as a very good interviewer, and
Speaker 1: then you're all of a sudden, that's what's going on
Speaker 1: right now in Kansas City with with Eric B. Enemy. Eric.
Speaker 1: You talk to people around the league, they will tell
Speaker 1: you Eric B Enemy does not interview well. You know now,
Speaker 1: somebody's going to have to make a gut feeling on that,
Speaker 1: a gut call and say, listen, I don't care about
Speaker 1: the interview. I don't care any office can he coach
Speaker 1: my team. That's where That's where because you you you
Speaker 1: you just told me how how much detail you put
Speaker 1: into it. Teams in the front office might not go
Speaker 1: to the links that you're going to, but that's but
Speaker 1: that's the way, that's that's the way this And my
Speaker 1: only experience is working in the NFL and then working
Speaker 1: in media. And I know when people when I hear
Speaker 1: people like why does this guy not get a job?
Speaker 1: Like Andy Reid wanted to keep Mike Kafka, who's the
Speaker 1: offensive coordinator with the Giants, It wasn't he was trying
Speaker 1: to get rid of Eric b Enemy. He was like, man, Eric,
Speaker 1: I could get him. I need to get him a job.
Speaker 1: I need to get him a job. I want to
Speaker 1: keep this guy, but I want Eric to also be
Speaker 1: a head coach somewhere, you know. And he doesn't interview well.
Speaker 1: And now everybody's going like, oh, okay, well you know, well,
Speaker 1: you know, why did he not have a job. Let's
Speaker 1: bringing this full circle because of what kind of what
Speaker 1: you were talking about giving somebody an opportunity to interview
Speaker 1: on the fly. What if Dan Campbell did an interview? Well,
Speaker 1: but Dan Campbell got an opportunity six seven years ago
Speaker 1: as a tight ends coach to be the head coach,
Speaker 1: and they did well, they performed well, and all of
Speaker 1: a sudden, now he gets another chance, and now he's
Speaker 1: coaching the Lions. Jason Garrett, I doubt he wouldn't interview well,
Speaker 1: but he got the opportunity when when Wade Phillips was
Speaker 1: fired to interview on the fly. And I think, you know,
Speaker 1: when when you make that point of somebody, some even
Speaker 1: if it's a linebacker's coach or whatever, a young guy,
Speaker 1: give him that opportunity to interview on the fly. If
Speaker 1: the enemy didn't interview well but got to take over
Speaker 1: and they went six and two in eight game strikes,
Speaker 1: it's like, well, maybe it doesn't interview well, but he
Speaker 1: could get his team, you know. So I kind of
Speaker 1: see that point too. I know we're all got different
Speaker 1: opinions there, but but I know Dan Campbell got an
Speaker 1: opportunity to do that on the fly, Garrett did. There's
Speaker 1: a lot of coaches that have done and some good,
Speaker 1: some bad. You know, no opportunities matter. And I think
Speaker 1: that's really the crux of what all the criticism that
Speaker 1: I've heard, it's really about opportunity. It's about was their
Speaker 1: fair opportunity for everyone in this instance who could be
Speaker 1: more qualified in this instance than just kind of hiring
Speaker 1: somebody that you just kind of feel comfortable with, because
Speaker 1: that's where you can get into a lot of issues
Speaker 1: that don't go to war, creating the right kind of
Speaker 1: diverse city at you want. I remember I remember working
Speaker 1: in Philadelphia and talking to Jeff Lurry and Joe Banner
Speaker 1: about Andy Reid. I remember, I mean, like like it
Speaker 1: was yesterday, and you know, and again, you know, you
Speaker 1: talk about things this is what I know, a B,
Speaker 1: C and D, and then all of a sudden he
Speaker 1: comes in and he is prepared, he's ready to go.
Speaker 1: He's got all the questions covered, he's got his staff,
Speaker 1: he's got this, he's got all that stuff covered. And Joe,
Speaker 1: Joe and Jeff Lurry, they they're like, and we gotta
Speaker 1: hire this guy. Yeah, we gotta hire this guy, because again,
Speaker 1: sometimes you only have that one shot. You know. Andy
Speaker 1: was never an offensive coordinator or anything like that. And
Speaker 1: you know, I mean he went from being like really
Speaker 1: a position coach to be in a you know, to
Speaker 1: be in a you know, an NFL head coach, and
Speaker 1: sometimes you do. Sometimes you just have to be just
Speaker 1: being prepared going in there. I think goes a long way.
Speaker 1: And in these in some of these jobs, people lose
Speaker 1: because they don't interview. Well, it's just it's it's it's
Speaker 1: it's sad in that way. I am interested to see
Speaker 1: how Jeff Jeff Sarry does on this because Nick, you
Speaker 1: brought this point up to me yesterday. He's not the
Speaker 1: first former player that's wanted to jump right into the
Speaker 1: head coaching seat for an NFL team. We know of
Speaker 1: some guys who've wanted to do that and they didn't
Speaker 1: get that opportunity, but they've wanted to do that. And
Speaker 1: I'll be interested because that could And it happens in
Speaker 1: the NBA, where you got guys who are who are
Speaker 1: former players that become head coaches and they don't go
Speaker 1: through the ranks, they just jump into the head coaches seat.
Speaker 1: I do think in basketball is probably a little bit different,
Speaker 1: but I do think it happens a lot more over there.
Speaker 1: It'll be interesting if Jeff Saturday is successful, we may
Speaker 1: start to see more NFL players going directly from playing
Speaker 1: right into the coaches seat and right into the head
Speaker 1: coaches seat for NFL teams. And now so I think
Speaker 1: for Jeff Saturday and for a lot of players who
Speaker 1: want that kind of opportunity, this is a real big
Speaker 1: moment for them, because if he has success, I guarantee
Speaker 1: you in a league where they always are looking to
Speaker 1: emulate what is working somewhere else, it will become a trend. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I'll ask a question in them break, just probably gotta
Speaker 1: get to it. Yeah, and that was not even on
Speaker 1: my rundown. So we fill this whole first segment. No,
Speaker 1: it's good. Actually it was really good because I didn't
Speaker 1: have a good first segment. So this is perfect. Right,
Speaker 1: We're gonna take a break, gonna come back, and we're
Speaker 1: gonna talk about the indefens versus the Dallas offense. We'll
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Speaker 1: There we go, all right, let's jump in. Sorry, indie
Speaker 1: defense versus Dallas offense. Brian, what's the best thing this
Speaker 1: indie defense does? I think they're not gonna let you try.
Speaker 1: They're not gonna let you run the ball like you
Speaker 1: probably want to run the ball. But you know, to me,
Speaker 1: that's that's okay. You'll figure out ways around it here,
Speaker 1: because I think you can throw the ball on these guys.
Speaker 1: I the player that I would attack would be Stefan
Speaker 1: Gilmour is so and I know that sounds crazy from
Speaker 1: back in the day that that would be the guy
Speaker 1: you attack. But he seems like the guy to me
Speaker 1: that struggles the most. He really doesn't really want to
Speaker 1: get involved. He plays off, he gives space, he doesn't
Speaker 1: drive on the ball like he once did. And so
Speaker 1: you know, he watched the games, the last three games
Speaker 1: that I've seen that teams have kind of found Number
Speaker 1: five on the field and they've made plays in front
Speaker 1: of him, they've made plays intermediate on him, they made
Speaker 1: plays on him down the field, and he's really kind
Speaker 1: of not interested in tackling. So you could throw the
Speaker 1: ball to his side, you could break a run and
Speaker 1: get some yards after catch throwing after him. That was
Speaker 1: a time where you wouldn't throw the ball at this guy.
Speaker 1: But I think he's just trying to kind of hang
Speaker 1: in there and get going there. I mentioned that about
Speaker 1: up front though, the force Buckner number ninety nine. They're
Speaker 1: gonna put him likely over he's a defensive tackle. They're
Speaker 1: likely going to put him over McGovern and just see
Speaker 1: if McGovern can handle him one on one in this
Speaker 1: football game. And so that would be a little bit
Speaker 1: of a challenge with what's going on there. Janik and
Speaker 1: Gakway is their best pass rusher. He plays as really
Speaker 1: that right defensive end. You know, he's the guy that
Speaker 1: you kind of have to worry about in the passing game.
Speaker 1: The way to beat the Colts though, is that they
Speaker 1: will find ways. They don't score enough points on offense.
Speaker 1: We talked about that yesterday. Put a lot of pressure
Speaker 1: on there there. If you can score on their defense,
Speaker 1: find ways to run the ball, you know, which will
Speaker 1: be like I said, it'll be a little bit of
Speaker 1: a difficult task, but I feel like you can you
Speaker 1: can make a little traction. I think throwing the ball
Speaker 1: is going to be a good way to travel in
Speaker 1: this particular game. Put up some points on the game
Speaker 1: on the board. This team has hard time scoring points,
Speaker 1: so that would put a lot of pressure that would
Speaker 1: take them likely out of their running game and then
Speaker 1: put it all on Matt Ryan. So defensively, just kind
Speaker 1: of be ready for that. You know, it might be
Speaker 1: a little bit tough sledding run in it, but I
Speaker 1: feel like you can make some throws on these guys.
Speaker 1: How different I mean, obviously, when you take out an
Speaker 1: All Pro player, I mean it's gonna be bad. But
Speaker 1: they don't have They changed his name with the linebacker Leonard. Yeah, Darius,
Speaker 1: not Darius Leonard. Shack Leonard is his name now, Ye,
Speaker 1: Shack Leonard. He doesn't play, Nope, he's not in this Yep,
Speaker 1: he's not shut out to the bros. You know his name,
Speaker 1: but you know, okay, his name Shaq Shaquille heard of
Speaker 1: him changing his name. He's just Mama call him Darius.
Speaker 1: I call him Darrius. I don't think mamma calls him
Speaker 1: that anymore. Sure, I don't know. I didn't talk to her.
Speaker 1: Did you talk to him? Gosh, they miss him, they
Speaker 1: miss uh they missed play around. I think they I
Speaker 1: think they miss and I'll tell you this, I do
Speaker 1: I feel like that they I think they miss Matt
Speaker 1: Eberflus too a little bit, you know, with the way
Speaker 1: the defense is and stuff like that. But this is
Speaker 1: a I can say, I just kind of you like
Speaker 1: that Dallas can protect well enough to make plays and
Speaker 1: scoring is going to be the key in this one,
Speaker 1: you know. And okay, you don't need me to tell
Speaker 1: you this former NFL scout guy, but the points because
Speaker 1: you could put so much pressure on their offense. You know,
Speaker 1: if you can make them one dimensional they give up sacks,
Speaker 1: that's going to be a big thing for them. If
Speaker 1: they have to sit there and throw the ball a
Speaker 1: bunch in this game, it's gonna be a problem for them.
Speaker 1: So that means attacking their defense. That means attacking guys
Speaker 1: like Gilmore in this game means in blocking in Gackaway
Speaker 1: off the edge and then not letting the Forest Buttner
Speaker 1: kind of wreck shop in the run game. Make sure
Speaker 1: you get bodies on him to take care of those things.
Speaker 1: How are they with like turnovers and get in their
Speaker 1: hands on the ball. Because if this is a game
Speaker 1: that the Cowboys do decide to kind of go on
Speaker 1: the passing game, throw the ball a little more. I mean,
Speaker 1: I think there's chances out there because we've seen it
Speaker 1: happen with that kind of throwing it in yourself. Yeah,
Speaker 1: the games I was watching too with they created a
Speaker 1: turnover to start the second half against the Eagles where
Speaker 1: in Ghakway came from the backside and hammered the ball
Speaker 1: out of Hurts his hands and then all all the
Speaker 1: Colts could do was manage a field goal out of that.
Speaker 1: And they had the ball in the you know, inside
Speaker 1: the red zone inside of Philadelphia and you know, and
Speaker 1: you know going in and they couldn't really do anything
Speaker 1: for it. So, like I said, if you're going to
Speaker 1: throw the ball, if you're going to throw the ball,
Speaker 1: which I think you can, just make sure that you
Speaker 1: take care of that guy. I you know, as far
Speaker 1: as the interceptions and stuff like that, you know, I
Speaker 1: was kind of they were. There were some passes and
Speaker 1: stuff that were knocked down more so, but then getting
Speaker 1: their hands on balls. There's more past defense and things
Speaker 1: like that. Not watching all their games but the last
Speaker 1: three games that they played, but I just I kind
Speaker 1: of feel like you can throw the ball in these guys.
Speaker 1: I mean, I'm not I'm not worried about I'm not
Speaker 1: worried about the dak mistake in this game of maybe
Speaker 1: an interception or something like. I am worried about though,
Speaker 1: if in fact you don't block their edge rusher who
Speaker 1: can cause problems in the pocket. Yeah, it's interesting, Brian,
Speaker 1: because to hear you say that, I actually thought you
Speaker 1: were going to say the exact opposite. Because their numbers
Speaker 1: kind of paint a little different story. I'll throw out
Speaker 1: some of the numbers and I want you kind of
Speaker 1: explain a little bit maybe why these numbers may not
Speaker 1: be the whole story. Right. They don't blitz a lot,
Speaker 1: right are sixteen They are sixteen percent drop back, So
Speaker 1: I think they're at the bottom four of the league
Speaker 1: when it comes to the mouth that they blitz. Not
Speaker 1: a blitzing team. But here's an interesting part. They're eleventh
Speaker 1: and sacks, right, so they're getting pressure with the front
Speaker 1: four not having to send a lot of extra twist fronts.
Speaker 1: Is where the overload one side on the front. Here
Speaker 1: was the interesting part. Right now they are fifth and
Speaker 1: pass defense right now, they only give up on average
Speaker 1: one hundred and ninety point six yards through the air.
Speaker 1: They have not allowed a single game this year where
Speaker 1: a team through for over three hundred yards. They're averaging
Speaker 1: under two hundred yards passing. Why are those numbers not
Speaker 1: really telling the full story. I don't think they've played
Speaker 1: teams that can throw the football, to be honest with you, though,
Speaker 1: I mean, that's that's when you and especially you go
Speaker 1: back and you look at and I could say the
Speaker 1: last three games. I'm trying to go back and look
Speaker 1: at the Jeff Saturday games and you know they fire
Speaker 1: coordinator and all that stuff like that. I just know
Speaker 1: that the teams when I'm watching like the Raiders, the Eagles,
Speaker 1: I'm watching the Steelers, and you know, you're talking about
Speaker 1: teams of that kind of thing hurts and car you know,
Speaker 1: but then pick it, you know, throwing the ball, that's
Speaker 1: a little bit of a like maybe not so much,
Speaker 1: but to me, I mean when when you watch those
Speaker 1: games that I just saw, I was seeing the ball
Speaker 1: go down the field, i was seeing guys making some plays.
Speaker 1: I was seeing some catches. I'm seeing crossing or out. Said,
Speaker 1: That's why I was picking on Gilmore here because it
Speaker 1: seemed like every time there was a big play in
Speaker 1: this game, for the last three, it was on Gilmore.
Speaker 1: So I'm kind of into that point right now, where
Speaker 1: like I say, they're gonna try and overload one side
Speaker 1: and rush. I could see them doing that to Tyler Smith.
Speaker 1: They're gonna say, Okay, Tyler Smith, let's see if you
Speaker 1: could pick up twist stunts. Let's see if you could
Speaker 1: pick up an overload side coming your way. Stuff like that.
Speaker 1: That's what I kind of feel like they're gonna try
Speaker 1: and do because they've done in these games. But they're
Speaker 1: gonna move their front and if you could pick up
Speaker 1: all the movement of the four, that's what you're going
Speaker 1: to be able to do. Because it's four drop seven.
Speaker 1: I think the Cowboys are good enough. I don't think
Speaker 1: they can cover the Cowboys. I really don't. I don't,
Speaker 1: And I don't think they've played anybody Philadelphia was that way.
Speaker 1: Philadelphia's got receivers, but I don't think they've played a
Speaker 1: team that has receivers like the Cowboys. Do you know,
Speaker 1: you look at what this game is as far as
Speaker 1: Buckner going up against left guard Connor McGovern, you know,
Speaker 1: the Cowboys obviously have a decision to make here at
Speaker 1: some point with Tyron Smith Tyren Smith coming back, it
Speaker 1: sounds like they're gonna make the decision. He's gonna play
Speaker 1: left tackle. Then what happens inside? Does Tyler Smith move
Speaker 1: in to guard? Could this be a game or a
Speaker 1: couple of games here where you start to see that
Speaker 1: a little bit more. Maybe Jason Peters play some at
Speaker 1: left tackle. Maybe you get some opportunities for Tyler Smith
Speaker 1: to play guard again. So when Tyrn does come back
Speaker 1: and eases into it, you're also easing Tyler Smith in there. Obviously,
Speaker 1: you gotta win the game. I'm not saying that they're
Speaker 1: gonna just blow him out and all that, but there's
Speaker 1: opportunities to maybe get Tyler Smith more work at guard.
Speaker 1: I would I would look into that, especially if he
Speaker 1: if he's going up against the DeForrest Buckner and go
Speaker 1: all right, well, you know, the Eagles are gonna have
Speaker 1: some some guys in there too. I'm Jacksonville's got some
Speaker 1: guys in there, and you know, I mean, let's let's
Speaker 1: give him a pretty good test. Yeah, I don't, I mean,
Speaker 1: I totally you know, I don't know if they necessarily
Speaker 1: I think they just want to make the move when
Speaker 1: they make the move. You know. I think to me
Speaker 1: it was funny because in that game against the Giants,
Speaker 1: Tyler Smith did not look strong, you know, And now
Speaker 1: you're starting to wonder, okay, is he to the point
Speaker 1: now where he's this is the most games he's played.
Speaker 1: When you start to talk about preseason, all those snaps
Speaker 1: and now the regular season, is he losing a little
Speaker 1: bit of that power? Is he losing a little bit
Speaker 1: of that strength? And it might be three games in
Speaker 1: four in twelve days might be a little bit of
Speaker 1: a problem there. So I would I would hope that,
Speaker 1: you know. And maybe it's the fact that they were
Speaker 1: on a short week that he didn't look great. Also
Speaker 1: at that part of the year where he's used to
Speaker 1: the season being rap rapping up. No, no, that you
Speaker 1: always talk about the rookie wall and stuff like that.
Speaker 1: But I mean to me, I kind of I kind
Speaker 1: of feel like that, you know that you you're in
Speaker 1: a situation where if you're gonna make this move, just
Speaker 1: let him play the tackle spot. He got to play
Speaker 1: a little bit of guard. What gave us at the
Speaker 1: Minnesota game that he got to play a little bit.
Speaker 1: That's when we kind of first saw what was going
Speaker 1: on there. Maybe if you can build a little bit
Speaker 1: of a lead and you know, and and find a
Speaker 1: way to kind of move some guys around. But I
Speaker 1: have a feeling he is going to continue to play
Speaker 1: left tackle until they get tied and the and the
Speaker 1: plan is to get through this week and then now
Speaker 1: we should see next week. You know, uh Tyrn Smith,
Speaker 1: maybe that clock start for him and then get him
Speaker 1: back going for this one of these upcoming games. To
Speaker 1: the point of Buckner, Um, what is it that he
Speaker 1: does well, what's his game like and how does that
Speaker 1: match up against these real drinks and weakness at McGovern. Yeah,
Speaker 1: he's really long and you know, and that and when
Speaker 1: you start to talk about hit the way he comes
Speaker 1: off the ball, he's not one of these guys that's
Speaker 1: like plays real tall. He's a long guy and he
Speaker 1: gets a lot of leverage when he gets pushed. So
Speaker 1: what happens is he puts you at a disadvantage because
Speaker 1: his hands get inside of you first, and now he's
Speaker 1: got you extended and now you're trying to fight to
Speaker 1: get your hands inside on him. He wins a lot
Speaker 1: of times at the point of attack, just because of
Speaker 1: his length and the power, the upper body power that
Speaker 1: he has. But yeah, and he's good because I can
Speaker 1: say the four man rush and the twist game stuff.
Speaker 1: You get a big body like that moving and it
Speaker 1: makes it a little bit difficult to try and stop
Speaker 1: him from getting up the field that way. But the
Speaker 1: length is as biggest thing because he'll extend and now
Speaker 1: he's got the blocker controlled, and then he's able to
Speaker 1: kind of get work off that blocker and then go
Speaker 1: make a play. All we're gonna take our final break.
Speaker 1: When we come back. We'll talk a little bit about
Speaker 1: this Cowboys offense. Some interesting numbers about this offense since
Speaker 1: Dak has returned. We'll throw some of those out and
Speaker 1: have that discussion when we come back. Dallas Cowboys Dotcom Radio.
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Speaker 1: It is the final segment of the Break Life in
Speaker 1: s WBC Boarding Studios at the Star. We're presented by
Speaker 1: Middle Like the only beer of the Dallas Cowboys. Let's
Speaker 1: talk about Dak Prescott. Listen to some of these numbers.
Speaker 1: Since Dak's return, Cowboys are thirty. They have thirty eight
Speaker 1: point eight points per game, that's first in the NFL.
Speaker 1: They have engineered forum sixteen point two yards per game,
Speaker 1: second in the NFL. They are fifty fifty seven point
Speaker 1: one percent on third downs, that's first in the NFL.
Speaker 1: They are eighty four point two percent in red zone
Speaker 1: that is second in the NFL. They are operating at
Speaker 1: a level, quite frankly, operating at a level similar to
Speaker 1: what they were doing last year when they had offensively
Speaker 1: a really really great season. But based on the eye test,
Speaker 1: because I think that's where a lot of the conversation
Speaker 1: is going right now with regards to Desk Dak. Based
Speaker 1: upon the eye test of what you've seen this season,
Speaker 1: is Dak really playing this well or there other factors
Speaker 1: that are making Dallas be this efficient offensively? Yes, you
Speaker 1: were saying those numbers. I'm just here raising an eyebrow
Speaker 1: than the other than the other. I'm like, really, really
Speaker 1: how because it, I mean, based on my memory and everything,
Speaker 1: everything that I've seen enough to say that Dak has
Speaker 1: been terrible by any means. But I don't think he's
Speaker 1: being absolutely great and like the number one you know
Speaker 1: in the NFL either. So it's very it is very
Speaker 1: deceiving to hear those numbers because everything we've watched indicates,
Speaker 1: you know, the inconsistency. We know that's an issue. Just
Speaker 1: the misthrows where he hasn't been connected with the wide receivers,
Speaker 1: which all in all, I wouldn't put all the blame
Speaker 1: in Dak. I think it does split half and half
Speaker 1: on the receivers and him. But it's I'm curious to
Speaker 1: hear to hear, y'all spot, because that's very They're scoring points,
Speaker 1: that's that's the thing. They scored twenty eight points at
Speaker 1: Lambeaux and they lost. Um, you know, you would think
Speaker 1: you would win that if you go on the road
Speaker 1: and score twenty eight points defense, Yeah, thirty eight for
Speaker 1: thirty eight point eight points per game since Dak's returned,
Speaker 1: thirty eight point eight. Wow. And even then it feels
Speaker 1: like every game, you know, it's always been low scoring.
Speaker 1: They've had two forty point games, I mean, okay since
Speaker 1: his return, yeah, yeah, forty nine and a forty and
Speaker 1: and you know twenty a couple of twenty eights and
Speaker 1: then that twenty I think, you know, that first game
Speaker 1: against Detroit, I mean, Russ was was it was a
Speaker 1: problem because they struggled for a while and then they
Speaker 1: finally just kind of pulled away. And look at it now.
Speaker 1: I mean Detroit's good football team. I mean the crappy
Speaker 1: football team, you know, but but I just think that
Speaker 1: that overall, I mean, they're scoring points. And that's when
Speaker 1: Cooper Rush was the quarterback. The defense was winning and
Speaker 1: carrying them when they weren't scoring a lot of points.
Speaker 1: Now they are, and they're becoming a lot more of
Speaker 1: a complete team. The IT test tells me he's healthy.
Speaker 1: The I test tells me the offensive line has gotten
Speaker 1: better since week one, and the I test tells me
Speaker 1: that they run the football better with the two backs.
Speaker 1: They've kind of figured that out. So the balance has
Speaker 1: really really helped him. You know, the one game he lost,
Speaker 1: you mentioned, they scored twenty eight points. But he throws
Speaker 1: the ball forty six times. You know, That's that we've
Speaker 1: talked about. That that's something that we've always hung our
Speaker 1: hat on talking about Dak. Don't make him throw the
Speaker 1: ball forty sometimes, make him throw the ball twenty eight times.
Speaker 1: You know, make him throw the ball twenty five times,
Speaker 1: twenty six times. That's that's when his stat line always
Speaker 1: seems to work out better. He seems to be more productive.
Speaker 1: But I think those around him, the receivers are starting
Speaker 1: to play better. Ceedee Lamb is by far starting to
Speaker 1: elevate with all the targets, gallops starting to come back
Speaker 1: around the young tight ends. You could throw the ball
Speaker 1: to one of those guys. You could throw the ball
Speaker 1: to Shoults, You can throw the ball to any tight
Speaker 1: end and it works out for him so offensively. I
Speaker 1: think that a lot has to do with his health
Speaker 1: and how he's playing, because you're starting to see him
Speaker 1: run the option. You know, you're seeing block, You're seeing
Speaker 1: him kind of get involved with the game. And I
Speaker 1: always believe that with Dac, when he got involved with
Speaker 1: the game, he was always going to be a better player.
Speaker 1: And I think the guys around him. That eye test
Speaker 1: to me is the guys around him have also elevated
Speaker 1: their game to help him. But I will say this,
Speaker 1: though he threw it forty six times against the Packers,
Speaker 1: if he throws it forty five times and I'm taking
Speaker 1: away third and ten at the ten yard line when
Speaker 1: you're forced it end if you throw, if you run
Speaker 1: the ball there and kick a field goal and put
Speaker 1: the Packers down ten points and nothing with their game plan,
Speaker 1: if we will just want to run and run and run,
Speaker 1: We'll see how how long that really goes. They had
Speaker 1: a chance to maybe take them out of that game plan,
Speaker 1: which would have played right back into your hand on
Speaker 1: the coach. Put that on the coach, but also put
Speaker 1: it on deck too. You can't throw that there. You
Speaker 1: gotta know, it's got to be perfect in that situation
Speaker 1: into the half two minute drill. It's got to be
Speaker 1: perfect for you to just be firing it over the
Speaker 1: middle there. All these interceptions are right over the middle
Speaker 1: of the field, and so I think that that's something
Speaker 1: that Kellen and Dak and CD because it's all of
Speaker 1: them have got to get on the same page there.
Speaker 1: I think that's what's kind of clouding our eye test
Speaker 1: a little bit, as these interceptions at really inopportune times.
Speaker 1: But for the most part, I think, yeah, the offense
Speaker 1: has been way better and more efficient with him in there.
Speaker 1: Do you think he is the key to this thing?
Speaker 1: Because it all came also at a time when as
Speaker 1: you just mentioned Brian, when they start to really figure
Speaker 1: out their success running the ball, and really their offense
Speaker 1: success is built around their ability to use both backs
Speaker 1: and using Pollard in more of a multidimensional role where
Speaker 1: they're even getting him out of the backfield and catching
Speaker 1: more passes. What do you think is more key to
Speaker 1: the offense success. I think it's I think it's the
Speaker 1: two running backs. I know that Pollard had really some
Speaker 1: really nice games without Zeke being in there, but I
Speaker 1: think there's something about it. I can't remember the last time,
Speaker 1: and I probably should looked it up. When's the last
Speaker 1: time that Pollard had more carries than Zeke in a
Speaker 1: game when they were both playing? And it happened last week,
Speaker 1: you know, it happened in that game. It was eighteen sixteen,
Speaker 1: the Giants game. Yeah, and it was weird because had
Speaker 1: more yards. Yeah. I think that you really, I think
Speaker 1: you have to The key is to have both those guys,
Speaker 1: I really do, because what happens is it's about staying ahead.
Speaker 1: For Dac, it's about staying ahead in the in the change.
Speaker 1: And you know, hell, he made a great throw in
Speaker 1: that third and fifteen, but it took like a beautiful
Speaker 1: ball and a great catch by you know Schultz, you know,
Speaker 1: or in the back of the end zone there in
Speaker 1: that third and fifteen play. I mean it was the
Speaker 1: same play they try earlier, and you know we got it.
Speaker 1: But do you think that both these guys are top
Speaker 1: twenty running backs in the league? Top twenty? Yes, you
Speaker 1: had to rank them all. Yeah, I don't know if
Speaker 1: either one of them are top ten, but I think
Speaker 1: they're both top twenty. You're you're talking about together. I
Speaker 1: look at him together. I don't look at him as apart.
Speaker 1: I look him as one. Well. The reason why I
Speaker 1: say one, guys, if you just rank all the running
Speaker 1: backs in the league and we don't watch them all,
Speaker 1: I think about a billity. Are we talking about their
Speaker 1: actual yards? Like? No, I'm talking about just like who's
Speaker 1: the number one back in the league, who's the second back? Two?
Speaker 1: Top twenty? I think they're both top twenty backs. And
Speaker 1: the reason why I say that and why it's important
Speaker 1: is what other team, every single play can hand the
Speaker 1: ball to a top twenty running back because Derrick Henry,
Speaker 1: Dalvin Cook, those guys are great, but at some point
Speaker 1: somebody else comes in and then does their offense change.
Speaker 1: They always have a top twenty running back running the football,
Speaker 1: and I think that's important if they use it that way. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I would say this. I do think that Tony people.
Speaker 1: We're just talking about skills and you're matching up against
Speaker 1: skills of other running backs the league. I do think
Speaker 1: he's developed into top ten, like right there at top ten,
Speaker 1: around ten or so. I would put him in that category.
Speaker 1: But I think your points valid still. I mean, you
Speaker 1: got two guys that you think are top twenty running
Speaker 1: backs that are one of us always in the backfield's value.
Speaker 1: I've taken the approach, like I said, of looking to me,
Speaker 1: they're one back. Yeah, they they they It's funny. They
Speaker 1: all as if you look at what skills you need
Speaker 1: to be a really top five running back, you would
Speaker 1: say the ability to make people miss, to get the
Speaker 1: extra yards, tough yards, be able to catch the ball
Speaker 1: and pass block a complete back. Together, those guys are
Speaker 1: a complete back. That's the way I look at what
Speaker 1: you're saying. It really is is exactly the point that
Speaker 1: I'm making is they can go to their back up
Speaker 1: whoever it is right and they don't lose. That don't lose.
Speaker 1: They can still be everything Pollard. I mean there's things like, Okay,
Speaker 1: Zeke is sometimes explosive, and but Pollard sometimes Blitz picks up,
Speaker 1: you know that that kind of thing, you know what
Speaker 1: I'm saying. So that's what I'm saying that that's something
Speaker 1: you know, the deficiency of one is overcome by the
Speaker 1: other one. You know that they're like they cancel each
Speaker 1: other out in the way of Okay, this guy can
Speaker 1: really explode, this guy can this guy can get the
Speaker 1: tough yard, this guy can pass block, this guy could
Speaker 1: catch the ball. You know. I mean, they've got a
Speaker 1: really good balance with those two guys. All Right, we
Speaker 1: appreciate you guys, Joan us. We'll be back tomorrow. We'll
Speaker 1: wrap this whole thing up. Let you know, we think
Speaker 1: it's gonna happen this Sunday night, Sunday Night football Cowboys
Speaker 1: versus Colts. Till then for Nick Eatman, Brian brought us
Speaker 1: Amber Garcia. I'm Derek Eagleton. This has been The Break
Speaker 1: live on Dallas Cowboys dot Com Radio. This has been
Speaker 1: a production of Dallas Cowboys dot Com and the Dallas
Speaker 1: Cowboys Football Club.