Speaker 1: First of all, you don't know me. Were all about
Speaker 1: that high school drama, Girl Drama Girl, all about them
Speaker 1: high school queens. We'll take you for a ride in
Speaker 1: our comic Girl Cheering for the drama Queens Girl Fashion,
Speaker 1: but you'll tough, girl, you could sit with us Girl Drama, Queens, Drama,
Speaker 1: Queen's Drama, Queen's Drama, Drama, Queen's Drama Queens. Hey, sports fans,
Speaker 1: we are back for another edition of Drama Queens, and
Speaker 1: this one we are talking about episode twenty two in
Speaker 1: season two, The Tide That Left and Never Came Back
Speaker 1: Air date two thousand and five. Uh, here's what happens
Speaker 1: in this episode. Um, Hillary cries a lot, Chad does
Speaker 1: a really nice job of being very sincere, and uh
Speaker 1: brand Greenberg is a full teen heartthrob. But really, it's
Speaker 1: part one of season two finale and we have Jimmy
Speaker 1: eat World, Lucas and Brook head to New York for
Speaker 1: an overnight stay of Haley. Peyton and Jake's relationship hits
Speaker 1: another bump in the road because if Nikki and Dan
Speaker 1: is still out to destroy Karen, he's ruining our relationship
Speaker 1: with Andy. And meanwhile, Andy's trying to find out what
Speaker 1: Dan is hiding in his office. Bum bum, and Nathan's
Speaker 1: got a really big decision to make about high Flyers
Speaker 1: and his family. If you're wondering why it sounds a
Speaker 1: little quiet here, it's because I am the only drama
Speaker 1: queen and the only wine in the studio today. But
Speaker 1: never fear, we have an awesome, awesome guest today, one
Speaker 1: of my dearest dearest friends, uh who you may recognize
Speaker 1: Maybe you might recognize him. Um. He was raised in Cologna,
Speaker 1: British Columbia, as the son of an ice hockey player.
Speaker 1: But he started his acting career on a soap opera
Speaker 1: called Santa Barbara. And then he did Beverly Hills nine
Speaker 1: O two and oh, and then he did soap Dish.
Speaker 1: This guy was even in the notebook Ladies and Gentlemen,
Speaker 1: A drama king in his own right, My dear friend,
Speaker 1: Paul Johansson, Hello, Paul King. That's just because we share
Speaker 1: our lives spartally, we know our dramas right, Drama king
Speaker 1: and queen for sure. Oh my goodness, Wait, what did
Speaker 1: it feel like to watch this episode back? I mean,
Speaker 1: how long has it been since you've watched an episode
Speaker 1: except for the one did you watch one before you did?
Speaker 1: Our live episode? I have to admit I didn't watch it.
Speaker 1: I watched part of it, No, I did. I watched
Speaker 1: part of some of it because we discussed it. But
Speaker 1: to really sit and just take it all in after yeah,
Speaker 1: the season finale. Right, Yeah, it's been it's been a
Speaker 1: long time. How did that feel? You know? Actually, um,
Speaker 1: there's a lot of the you know, the world has
Speaker 1: turned TV right. All the great filmmakers are making TV
Speaker 1: shows now, all the big actors are big stars. Were like, oh,
Speaker 1: they'll never do TV. They're all TV. It's all changed.
Speaker 1: It's a huge different world out there. And so but
Speaker 1: to go and see the simpleness and the sweetness, and
Speaker 1: we were talking about it during the pot the episode
Speaker 1: we're watching together, there was something really charming and and
Speaker 1: the way that our creators made music the backbone of
Speaker 1: our show. Yeah, give it a give it a kind
Speaker 1: of like a poetry about it, don't you think? I am?
Speaker 1: I totally think so. I felt like, Um, they introduced
Speaker 1: me to a lot of bands that I didn't know about. Um,
Speaker 1: I guess because I was never really into the modern
Speaker 1: trendy music scene. I was always such like an old
Speaker 1: hippie with music and listening to Carol King in my
Speaker 1: room and Billy Joel and so it was really fun
Speaker 1: to be able to hear what all the new bands
Speaker 1: were and be introduced all this new talent um and
Speaker 1: clearly Jimmy Eat World at the time was a really
Speaker 1: big deal and got bigger. Um, so that was really fun.
Speaker 1: Um do I sh'll have something to do with a
Speaker 1: little bit bump in their careers? I think it did.
Speaker 1: I mean I don't. I would love to ask them,
Speaker 1: but uh, it had to have. I mean, the show
Speaker 1: was huge at the time. Season two was when it
Speaker 1: really started to lift off, Which is crazy because we've
Speaker 1: been saying this whole time that it's was such a
Speaker 1: boring season, like or just it's not boring, but kind
Speaker 1: of a terrible season. It was just so over the
Speaker 1: top and so many things that we didn't love. But um, yeah, no,
Speaker 1: I you know what it reminds me when I you've mentioned,
Speaker 1: um Santa Barbara, like nobody yes back in the day
Speaker 1: is doing soap operas. The producer used to walk through
Speaker 1: the set before everything going, Remember tension, everybody tension, like
Speaker 1: they wanted conflict conflict. Every scene has that conflict, And
Speaker 1: so I was watching this episode that was like, going,
Speaker 1: this is kind of the formula for keeping people interested. Yeah, conflict,
Speaker 1: and this episode is rife with conflict. It's non stop.
Speaker 1: I mean, it was a finale, So I think that's
Speaker 1: fair enough. I wouldn't have said this ten years ago
Speaker 1: when I watched if I watched this episode, which I
Speaker 1: think I did. But my favorite storyline in this episode
Speaker 1: I really liked Jake and Hillary Store. I thought there
Speaker 1: was something. I mean, she was literally sobbing in every scene,
Speaker 1: every scene. I wish she was here right now because
Speaker 1: she would have so many fun things to say about that.
Speaker 1: But you know, he's got you know now that I'm
Speaker 1: a single dad, Yeah, and I know and you're you know,
Speaker 1: we both know what it's like to raise, you know,
Speaker 1: a little one in in the in the in the
Speaker 1: craziness of of having you know, family, cord and all
Speaker 1: that kind of stuff, you know, and you see you know,
Speaker 1: his you know, I just see a real kind of
Speaker 1: honor about the way that he approached it, you know
Speaker 1: what I mean, he's fighting hard, but he's but he's
Speaker 1: but he's he's still got this great and I love
Speaker 1: his love for his daughter, that it's it's more than
Speaker 1: his love for even Peyton kind of be a great parent,
Speaker 1: you kind of love with your kids more than your partner.
Speaker 1: I don't know, you know what I actually have. I've
Speaker 1: heard different sides on that, and I'm very curious about, Well,
Speaker 1: that's something that actually is worth talking about because as
Speaker 1: a parent, I mean, I'm a single mom, so I
Speaker 1: don't I don't. I can't speak from experience on this,
Speaker 1: but it does seem to me that in order to
Speaker 1: give your child the stability that a child needs, that
Speaker 1: making your partner the most important person in the the
Speaker 1: family um to you and then the children come second
Speaker 1: kind of eliminates an element of codependence with your child.
Speaker 1: That you know, the child knows their place in the
Speaker 1: structure of the family and their place in the world,
Speaker 1: rather than feeling like they might be above the other parent.
Speaker 1: That is a beautiful interpretation. I've never heard of put
Speaker 1: that way before. But I really need to sit with
Speaker 1: that and ponder that. I love it. Like what I
Speaker 1: would submit to you would be one is that I
Speaker 1: think they may be different loves, you know, and that
Speaker 1: and the second part would be that um I've never
Speaker 1: experienced either. I've come first before. It's usually know, my
Speaker 1: career comes first. You know this is my favorite car.
Speaker 1: You're never driving it? All right? Yeah, no, I've I
Speaker 1: don't think i've ever I've never experienced that either. Um,
Speaker 1: not my childhood, but first ever, ever, ever in someone's life, like,
Speaker 1: you've never been you are my priority. I'm going to
Speaker 1: make sure that this is the most pore thing to
Speaker 1: me and you've never been made to feel that way. Um,
Speaker 1: I don't. I think I have a couple of with
Speaker 1: Like maybe I can think of maybe one or maybe
Speaker 1: two boyfriends that I felt that way with, but it
Speaker 1: always came with baggage of like there was actually a
Speaker 1: neediness underneath it, where by them making me the priority,
Speaker 1: it felt like they were. That was my follow up question.
Speaker 1: Yeah it was. It was more about them than it right,
Speaker 1: it was more about them than it was about me.
Speaker 1: So so I think, No, I don't think I can
Speaker 1: see why it's hard. It's hard for us as men
Speaker 1: to know I'm gonna make you first. Well, if I
Speaker 1: make a first, you won't respect me. So okay, I'm
Speaker 1: gonna she is first, but I'm going to let her
Speaker 1: know that I'm gonna act like you know, I'm not
Speaker 1: gonna go with the guys tonight, you know, right. I
Speaker 1: don't know if it's that it's that I wouldn't respect
Speaker 1: it or don't respect it. I think it's just that
Speaker 1: I don't want there to be any guile about it.
Speaker 1: I don't want there to be any like like you're
Speaker 1: trying to get something out of it by being the
Speaker 1: Knight in Shining Armor. Like it's the quiet honor that
Speaker 1: you actually talk about a lot, Paul, in your life
Speaker 1: and the way that you function in your life, with
Speaker 1: your relationships and with your son and with your work,
Speaker 1: and there's a there's an internal honor code that and
Speaker 1: that I think is what I'm looking for in the
Speaker 1: context of what we're talking about, where it's not just um,
Speaker 1: hey look at me, I'm then I in tchining armor. Okay,
Speaker 1: now give me something for it. It's just a like
Speaker 1: a genuine offering of you're my priority, and I don't
Speaker 1: need you to give anything any back, because then I
Speaker 1: will give above and beyond. But if I sense that
Speaker 1: there's diyal, it freaks me out and I kind of
Speaker 1: back off. Let me ask you a question about that
Speaker 1: when you feel you're about to step over that line
Speaker 1: of that code, ever, because they know you and I
Speaker 1: have a lot of similarities with it. Yeah, it's almost
Speaker 1: like an alarm is ringing inside of You're going, you're not.
Speaker 1: This isn't who you are, this isn't. But even if
Speaker 1: it's easy, fine, and you test that code sometimes even
Speaker 1: if it's what say again, even if it's it's an
Speaker 1: easy step over the line, like something you know that
Speaker 1: you you like. It's a terrible example, but like taking
Speaker 1: a job just for the money when you know that
Speaker 1: it's like something you shouldn't be doing because your heart's
Speaker 1: taking to be in it. Right. I know a lot
Speaker 1: of people may not may not be able to understand that,
Speaker 1: but from an artist point of view, that that's almost
Speaker 1: like selling your soul and it's hameful, but we've all
Speaker 1: kind of gone there, and you what you do is
Speaker 1: you try not to be too hard in yourself, yeah,
Speaker 1: and say, you know, I'm you know, it's like I've
Speaker 1: got to be able to forgive myself for that moment
Speaker 1: because there's a bigger picture if I can, if I
Speaker 1: can really live the good life that I want to
Speaker 1: live in, and most of all, wake up and look
Speaker 1: in the mirror and not be disappointed, then everything else
Speaker 1: will be okay. Yeah, you know what I mean. Yeah,
Speaker 1: there has to be that internal honor code. And and
Speaker 1: as artists, I think we as actors particularly, I guess,
Speaker 1: we become professional bullshit detectors in a lot of ways,
Speaker 1: and that, you know, bleeds into our relationships because I
Speaker 1: know I do. My alarms all go crazy. Yeah, if
Speaker 1: I feel like somebody's not being real with me, and
Speaker 1: then I can just pick and pick and pick um.
Speaker 1: But but bring it back to the kids, which is
Speaker 1: that you know, I have never been I haven't been
Speaker 1: in a relationship long enough with my romantic relationship long
Speaker 1: enough while I've had my daughter to be able to
Speaker 1: say that this theory works. But in theory, it does
Speaker 1: seem to make sense to me, and I appreciate what
Speaker 1: Jake does. If there was if there was a say,
Speaker 1: here's the here's the components that I need to be
Speaker 1: in a relationship, like you have to be attracted to
Speaker 1: of course you have to respect them, yes, and you
Speaker 1: have to have similar long term goals yea, values and
Speaker 1: long term goals. And I guess, yeah, else I'm missing
Speaker 1: on that. No, I think, I think that's it. Values
Speaker 1: is a huge one. And and then yeah, long term goals,
Speaker 1: I think, well, long term goals changed. I mean the
Speaker 1: long term goals I think I had when I was
Speaker 1: twenty are very different than what I have now. For me,
Speaker 1: it was only I just said to be traffic. That
Speaker 1: was I think, really that was a cut off. How
Speaker 1: many years did you live like that as a as
Speaker 1: a as a handsome acting bachelor like party man out
Speaker 1: there you had access to everything, I mean everything at
Speaker 1: your feet, at your disposal. How long did you live
Speaker 1: your life that way before you started to go, Okay,
Speaker 1: I need a shift now. My dating life is an
Speaker 1: HBO special. It is. It is a It is a
Speaker 1: complicated long I mean I did a girl that we
Speaker 1: were followed by the CIA one time. I did what Yeah,
Speaker 1: I diated a girl who was involved in a very
Speaker 1: big political scandal back in like the late nineteen um
Speaker 1: and uh and you know he's quite a famous person.
Speaker 1: And then you know, you know who else I've dated.
Speaker 1: It's been very interesting. But you know I didn't. I
Speaker 1: came from a small town, you said at the beginning
Speaker 1: of the thing. From Cologna, British Columbia, beautiful little Twasia,
Speaker 1: lake Town in in Canada, which and and you know,
Speaker 1: and you like you you can from New Jersey and
Speaker 1: now we you meet all these people that everyone has
Speaker 1: this idea what they are. Nobody, nobody is like what
Speaker 1: they perceived to be in there in the public persona.
Speaker 1: Everybody's way more complicated, nuanced and deferent. I totally agree
Speaker 1: with that. It's so hard to just take one glance
Speaker 1: or no a character or no, you know, read some
Speaker 1: interviews or whatever, see some interviews and feel like you
Speaker 1: really have a whole rounded picture. When Jake was on
Speaker 1: his motorcycle or you're like, would you say he said
Speaker 1: he's such a teen heart throb, so that there you go,
Speaker 1: see the image of a young, handsome, honorable single man
Speaker 1: fighting for your hair. Los. I know, thanks, I'm having fun.
Speaker 1: He's got the James Dean look over his shoulders, not
Speaker 1: looking at that. He's gotta look over his shoulder over
Speaker 1: it's gotta been going on. And you go, and you know,
Speaker 1: I guess I could hear on the other side you sweating.
Speaker 1: I can hear. And I was like, going, yeah, okay,
Speaker 1: I get it. There's the image. But that sort of
Speaker 1: plays into our thing. It's like, this is the presentation,
Speaker 1: but we know he's goofy and lovable and intelligent and
Speaker 1: funny and fun and like it's he's not just like
Speaker 1: deep and tortured. He's you know, I mean, so we
Speaker 1: get these fragments, you get glimpses, glimpses. Well, I loved
Speaker 1: the glimpses we got of him and Hillary. I agreed
Speaker 1: they did a really nice job and they had a
Speaker 1: great storyline. And I also really liked to chat in
Speaker 1: this episode a lot. I thought he was really sincere,
Speaker 1: you know, being their moments. Yeah, I thought so too.
Speaker 1: I thought he didn't stretch, he wasn't pushing hard. It
Speaker 1: was very natural. I agree with you. I think he
Speaker 1: was very good in Yeah, really since here and just
Speaker 1: kind of the thread between all this all the story
Speaker 1: you questioned the moment when he sits and judges Haley
Speaker 1: for playing around. She wasn't it wasn't it wasn't sexual
Speaker 1: in contest with you and and oh yeah, but come on,
Speaker 1: he hasn't seen her in ages, Like the first time
Speaker 1: he shows up to see her and she's like on
Speaker 1: a couch, you know, mess wrestling with this guy. I
Speaker 1: don't know. I get that he was annoying, giggling, and
Speaker 1: then he's passing judgment. I was like, going, come on,
Speaker 1: you know, yeah too, that's real. It is. And one
Speaker 1: of the things about going back and watching this show, UM,
Speaker 1: it's been fun to realize where we are now in
Speaker 1: our maturity and our understanding of the gray areas of
Speaker 1: life and how nothing is exactly what it seems. And
Speaker 1: you know, there's just so many facets to a person
Speaker 1: and their experiences, and when you're in high school or
Speaker 1: when you're in your early twenties like we were when
Speaker 1: we were filming it, UM, and you know, then there
Speaker 1: you have so much judgment and the world seems much
Speaker 1: more black and white. And I think you and I
Speaker 1: see that with our kids too, because I know Maria's
Speaker 1: like that the things are very black and white and
Speaker 1: trying to explain, well, there's gray areas here. I mean,
Speaker 1: I know, Quentn you're laughing, go ahead, especially as communists.
Speaker 1: I'm this way, Dad, I'm like, yeah, tell me in
Speaker 1: five years what you are. You know, it's funny. I
Speaker 1: was thinking about what you're saying about the what we
Speaker 1: our perception of people too, was like when I was
Speaker 1: in high school. I knew what my my future wife
Speaker 1: was gonna be. She was gonna be speak French and
Speaker 1: where Chanelle all the time, and she was gonna be
Speaker 1: speak nine languages and you know, have a PhD and philosophy,
Speaker 1: and she's gonna love me and we're gonna be together
Speaker 1: for a God, that's such a high box, right, and
Speaker 1: then you know liketies and fifties just of a pulse.
Speaker 1: It's like, literally, I'm gonna narrow it down way small. Right.
Speaker 1: Oh god, now, um I was I'm looking at my
Speaker 1: notes here because there was so there was so much
Speaker 1: drama in this episode. For a second. Yeah, let's talk
Speaker 1: about Dan because what the hell was that with Karen?
Speaker 1: Oh my god, are you going to the kiss right away?
Speaker 1: To go? Okay, we can build up to it. Go ahead. Well,
Speaker 1: I just thought that, you know, I just see Okay,
Speaker 1: First off, there was something early on with you, right,
Speaker 1: we had a little thing there, right that it was
Speaker 1: that that was a flashback when you brought me annulment papers.
Speaker 1: That's okay, okay, that sets up this finale definitely, right,
Speaker 1: And that's the papers that you gave Lucas right to
Speaker 1: give it to him. Yeah, because you I think you've
Speaker 1: forged Nathan's signature or something, but you gave me the
Speaker 1: paperwork and told me that Nathan had signed it, and
Speaker 1: so I believed you. How many times do people have
Speaker 1: to be proven wrong by believing Dan and finding out
Speaker 1: that he's just lying? What's that old adage again? It's
Speaker 1: like when people show you who they are, believe him. Yeah,
Speaker 1: but you know, I gotta be honest with you. Um,
Speaker 1: even though I'm the actor playing the part. Um, I
Speaker 1: really enjoyed Dan. I enjoyed when he came on. I went, Okay,
Speaker 1: something's gonna happen. Yeah, that's a nice feeling, you know
Speaker 1: what I mean? Yeah? Is that one of your favorite
Speaker 1: things about playing Dan? Or playing a character that is
Speaker 1: so um, instigating of things or I don't know, help
Speaker 1: me with my vocabulary, because this is you're so like.
Speaker 1: This is why you and our friends your instincts as
Speaker 1: an artist are always so like like perfect. It's like,
Speaker 1: I love talking because it Jore now with us. We know.
Speaker 1: I know that you cut to stuff. When Karen comes
Speaker 1: in and she's mad, she's like spitting fire man. You know,
Speaker 1: she's Satan's mistress at the moment, and she comes in.
Speaker 1: If you the first cut to me sitting in the chair,
Speaker 1: I see her in my and immediately I started to go,
Speaker 1: got her because peck somebody? And then my character smiling
Speaker 1: because he knows I got her. Oh, why would he
Speaker 1: do anything unless he go to reaction? Everything is for
Speaker 1: a reaction. And that was the fun part of playing down,
Speaker 1: was I get to make people react. Yes, son, Yes,
Speaker 1: that's what that's the fun part about. Any anyone will
Speaker 1: tell you playing a villain is fun mhm, because you
Speaker 1: get to get a reaction out of people. Everything that
Speaker 1: you do is very forward movement. Um, and it's it's
Speaker 1: got a lot of energy behind it. It's really fun.
Speaker 1: But then you don't play. You don't, you don't, you don't,
Speaker 1: you don't want to. The really interesting and nuance to that,
Speaker 1: which makes it really interesting is once you've got them,
Speaker 1: is you play opposite their energy when they come in
Speaker 1: the room. Yes, she's moving and I'm very still. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and she's moving, I'm very still. It's like you want
Speaker 1: and make them. Oh god, it's a classic. I mean,
Speaker 1: I know you and I both have experienced with narcissists
Speaker 1: in different areas in our life, and um, I it's that,
Speaker 1: but that is so classic. That's what they do. They
Speaker 1: pick at you and pick at you, and they do
Speaker 1: enough things to where you explode because you're a normal
Speaker 1: human being with a normal reaction. And then they turn
Speaker 1: around and go, look how crazy you are? Oh you
Speaker 1: really need help. Yeah, yeah, I know it's scary, but
Speaker 1: you knew that, and you know, you knew how to
Speaker 1: had those layers to dan, which I love. You know.
Speaker 1: It's funny because you know, I mean, you know, there's
Speaker 1: no specifics in this, because I don't think of course,
Speaker 1: because we pull a lot of our you know, our
Speaker 1: our work off of not one person, but just a
Speaker 1: plethora of life experience. Absolutely, But I will say that
Speaker 1: the people that have irritated me, that have got under
Speaker 1: my skin the most are the ones that I I,
Speaker 1: against my better nature, still trusted, like yeah, because they
Speaker 1: weren't good. They were like, you know, supportive and loving
Speaker 1: and this and this, But something inside of me was going, yeah,
Speaker 1: it doesn't feel authentic, but I still wanted to give
Speaker 1: the benefit the doubt. Yeah, what is that gut feeling?
Speaker 1: It's hard to get in touch with your gut sometimes
Speaker 1: if you I spent a lot of years of my
Speaker 1: life believing that my instincts were bad and and and
Speaker 1: um it just messed up like they was something wrong
Speaker 1: with my instincts, and so I needed to trust other
Speaker 1: people's instincts for me. And I spent a lot of
Speaker 1: time handing out my autonomy to other people that I trusted.
Speaker 1: Some people were lovely people that I trusted, and some
Speaker 1: people did terrible things to me because I trusted them,
Speaker 1: and um, I shouldn't have. But at the end of
Speaker 1: the day, that's my fault for not not um oh,
Speaker 1: I guess. I mean, you're a kid when I was,
Speaker 1: especially when you're young. You know, those things get taught
Speaker 1: to you in such a strange ways. But um, at
Speaker 1: the end of the day, it is our responsibility to
Speaker 1: learn how to come out of that and and trust
Speaker 1: that nobody knows better for us than us. We're the
Speaker 1: only people that have our gut. We're the only people
Speaker 1: living our lives. And you know, walking through life, not
Speaker 1: taking chances, not not risking, trusting the wrong people is
Speaker 1: no way to live. So I think you kind of
Speaker 1: have to do that. You have to experiment with that.
Speaker 1: These are the great takeaways from our show, though, imagine
Speaker 1: our audience watches all these scenarios. In this episode, there
Speaker 1: was fifty different scenarios of people be manipulated or feeling
Speaker 1: bad or situation is not going the way you wanted
Speaker 1: them to, and it was about how people reacting to them.
Speaker 1: And so what all of our fans come up to
Speaker 1: us at conventions on the street and they want to
Speaker 1: talk about the show and they want to hear about it.
Speaker 1: You know, you realize that they're living through these characters
Speaker 1: and they're bringing in their own life experiences and going
Speaker 1: and it helps in a way. And I don't mean
Speaker 1: like to educate, but the more you see it going
Speaker 1: bad and the more you see it going good, more
Speaker 1: you see and help people react to situations, the more
Speaker 1: that you can say, oh, this is why I need
Speaker 1: to watch the show because it gives me at least
Speaker 1: some sort of um um confirmation that I'm not crazy
Speaker 1: and that I'm not the bad person or I'm not
Speaker 1: doing anything wrong. Life just happens, and it's how I'm
Speaker 1: back to it and finds who I am. Yeah, I
Speaker 1: totally agree with that. All. That's a really sweet way
Speaker 1: of looking at the show too. I love that you said,
Speaker 1: speaking of trust issues, you said. When we were watching
Speaker 1: this episode, Lucas and Haley were laying in bed. They
Speaker 1: were just, you know, it was a late night best friends,
Speaker 1: just laying there, staring out at the moon shining in
Speaker 1: the window and talking about as it does, and you know,
Speaker 1: talking about life. And he says, I noticed you're not
Speaker 1: wearing your wedding ring. And she says, it's not because
Speaker 1: I don't love him, and it's not because of the
Speaker 1: press tour of the record label. It's because I feel
Speaker 1: like I don't deserve to. And you didn't buy it. No,
Speaker 1: I didn't, And I think that's a really genuine So
Speaker 1: tell okay, tell me what you think, Tell me what
Speaker 1: why that bothered you something. We're good friends. You tell
Speaker 1: me why you think I didn't buy and then I'll
Speaker 1: tell you if you're right. You know me and I
Speaker 1: want to see this is like, this is like that
Speaker 1: you know what I said on the any game? They go,
Speaker 1: how well do you know your part? Oh? Gosh, okay,
Speaker 1: all right, um, okay, let's see. You felt like it
Speaker 1: was a you felt like it was an evasive answer,
Speaker 1: and uh, I think you were bothered by the fact
Speaker 1: that she wasn't being completely honest. With herself. You felt
Speaker 1: like she wasn't being honest with herself or with Lucas.
Speaker 1: I think it also bothered you because I know you've
Speaker 1: been lied to many times by women in your life,
Speaker 1: and I'm sure that's built up a pattern. So I
Speaker 1: wonder if maybe your immediate distrust of that answer it
Speaker 1: was partly because you felt like you've been lied to
Speaker 1: a lot. I don't know. You are, in my mind,
Speaker 1: you know me better than anybody, and you answered it beautifully.
Speaker 1: You are the money. Really, yeah, it was I was
Speaker 1: listening to myself, a much prettier version of myself, and
Speaker 1: so you thought the real answer maybe would be, uh,
Speaker 1: I'm confused, I don't know what I want, and you
Speaker 1: know you've got a better The first time when you
Speaker 1: said that there was this, there was a bit of
Speaker 1: dishonesty to herself about it. You know, I think that
Speaker 1: she knows why she take it off, but admitting it
Speaker 1: is to um is to um accountable. It would make
Speaker 1: her too accountable for what she's really feeling, which is
Speaker 1: what do you think? Which is like, I mean, not
Speaker 1: what what's what's on the show, but what Paul Johnson
Speaker 1: interprets those types of behad. But yes, that's what I'm asking, right, okay,
Speaker 1: because I want to make sure there's definitely in it.
Speaker 1: So my interpretation of that is like, I'm a good girl.
Speaker 1: I'm I'm I'm never gonna cheat on my husband. I'm
Speaker 1: never gonna put it out there that I'm available even
Speaker 1: I'm still married, blah blah blah blah blah. But I'm
Speaker 1: gonna pick off my ring and and tickle and you know,
Speaker 1: my my best friend on the sofa gigglily giggli with
Speaker 1: some sexual you know, vibes to it. But I'm medicine,
Speaker 1: though I'm innicine. My feeling is, I'm a diehard romantic.
Speaker 1: I always have been. I believe in love. I'm just
Speaker 1: not very good at it. And my feeling is is
Speaker 1: if I truly loved somebody, you would have to cut
Speaker 1: my finger off before you give my wedding, and off
Speaker 1: even after we divorced, because my love, like is immutable,
Speaker 1: it is strong, and I believe in it. I believe
Speaker 1: in that. I believe in marriage. I believe in that stuff.
Speaker 1: I just wish that you know that there was like
Speaker 1: you and I lived in a fairytale world where, like
Speaker 1: you know, love could survive anything if it was real,
Speaker 1: you know what I mean, But I can't. You know,
Speaker 1: it's it's a it's a romantic vision of the world
Speaker 1: that doesn't exist, and so it bothers me that it
Speaker 1: doesn't exist. You know what I mean? Yes, I do
Speaker 1: know what you mean, as would you say. It's not
Speaker 1: a perfect answer, but it's mine. Yes, so that I
Speaker 1: still just don't understand it though I don't understand mean,
Speaker 1: I get generally what you're saying, but I don't quite
Speaker 1: understand what you love. Does she still love? Yes? Does
Speaker 1: she like? And he knows that she loves her? So
Speaker 1: that's that's real. So that's all the ring means. Taking
Speaker 1: the ring off is not like taking up ease deserve it.
Speaker 1: Taking the ring off is saying, you know, I'm basically
Speaker 1: saying unavailable. My heart is not taken by one person anymore.
Speaker 1: That's what the simbolism to me meant. That's why I
Speaker 1: would I call so it was like almost like us,
Speaker 1: it's a way of deceiving yourself. That's really what you're doing,
Speaker 1: is uh, notifying the world that you are available again,
Speaker 1: and do you think any more? Love story was more
Speaker 1: profound on this series one to real for ten or
Speaker 1: nine years, that story, that was the love story of
Speaker 1: the show. Yeah, it was my favorite one to watch.
Speaker 1: And I was there when he proposed to you. I
Speaker 1: shot that episode, Oh you did? Oh my gosh, Paul,
Speaker 1: I forgot about that shot, the one where you guys were,
Speaker 1: you know, falling off the bed leaving the voice message together.
Speaker 1: And I mean, I loved shooting you guys together. So
Speaker 1: I'm gonna I'm gonna bat back at that response. And
Speaker 1: you're not totally wrong. Actually, Uh, in my opinion, based
Speaker 1: on me being me as Haley listening to that response,
Speaker 1: I wouldn't say you're totally wrong. But what I would
Speaker 1: say is that, um, there's an element of feeling like
Speaker 1: she doesn't deserve it because she knows that she hasn't
Speaker 1: lived up to Nathan's expectations of her, and that she
Speaker 1: has sort of allowed herself to open her heart to
Speaker 1: the possibility of other people or someone else and maybe
Speaker 1: the marriage ending and like that that would lead her
Speaker 1: then to feeling that self loathing of I don't even
Speaker 1: deserve this anyway, which it's kind of like a double
Speaker 1: edged Is it a double edged sword? Is that the
Speaker 1: right analogy? It's definitely. Um. Yeah, I mean I think
Speaker 1: I've been in Can we joy? Can we love? Can
Speaker 1: you love two men at the same time with two guys?
Speaker 1: Like I don't know, you know what I mean, I
Speaker 1: don't know. I know that I can't. Yeah, because I
Speaker 1: know me now, after all these years, I know that
Speaker 1: I can really love a present of the time. I
Speaker 1: mean I could love people in different ways. Yeah, but
Speaker 1: you know what I'm talking about. No, it's been It's hard.
Speaker 1: There's always like if I'm really in love with someone,
Speaker 1: I've I've done it where I've been in love with someone,
Speaker 1: it's not working. And then I go out with other
Speaker 1: people and Um, as much as I try, great as
Speaker 1: they are, just I just can't. No, it's too hard. Yeah.
Speaker 1: Um well, yeah was the was the like you know
Speaker 1: we've commented on the the um Karen and Karen. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I was going to go to them next, because that's
Speaker 1: another another thing of of the tragedies of not to
Speaker 1: not to Well, I should go onto this quote. The
Speaker 1: quote was there two tragedies in life? This is the
Speaker 1: quote of the episode. There are two tragedies in life. Yes,
Speaker 1: to gain the desire of your heart or to lose
Speaker 1: the desire of your heart and also to gain it.
Speaker 1: So another loss here Karen and Andy. But I love
Speaker 1: the two actors. I love them very much. I really
Speaker 1: love them. The love that that felt forced a little
Speaker 1: bit to me, It felt a little bit unearned in
Speaker 1: terms of the way that it ended to me. What
Speaker 1: do you mean because you because they just didn't feel
Speaker 1: like they had enough history. That's that's really the crux
Speaker 1: of the point. You capted immediately as as you do, Joy,
Speaker 1: But are also is that I felt that, you know,
Speaker 1: they maybe there was something edited out of the episode
Speaker 1: that might have given us a little bit more to
Speaker 1: Oh that's interesting, I mean yeah, I mean but also
Speaker 1: you haven't been watching the last you know, twenty two
Speaker 1: episodes and there, husband, come on, we know you don't
Speaker 1: have time for that. You fancy that You've got so
Speaker 1: much going on. That last line that he threw out
Speaker 1: at her, Oh that was rough. That felt like it
Speaker 1: didn't need to be said. What did he say? I
Speaker 1: love you? I love you too? It was just seems
Speaker 1: like it just isn't enough. Yeah, wow, ouch, that was rough. Um, yeah,
Speaker 1: that was rough. But Karen had a Karen had a
Speaker 1: big episode here. Oh she was when she came firing
Speaker 1: in man she does she does that irish anger. Really
Speaker 1: we were staying. In the other episode, her whole chest
Speaker 1: went red in her face when she got angry with
Speaker 1: Lucas for something a few episodes ago. It was great. Yeah,
Speaker 1: And she's such a calm and kind person in life,
Speaker 1: so it's great to see that her her her her
Speaker 1: her as what they called her her paint, her canvas.
Speaker 1: Her canvas is so beautiful with colors that she can
Speaker 1: just raw them in, you know what I mean. There
Speaker 1: was one moment in this that felt strange to me,
Speaker 1: which was when after Andy leaves your office and you
Speaker 1: throw the award through the new glass window, presumably the
Speaker 1: new glass window. You know what budged me about it, Paul,
Speaker 1: is that I just didn't believe Dan would ever give
Speaker 1: anyone the satisfaction of knowing that they had piste him off. No,
Speaker 1: I agree with you. I think there was some There
Speaker 1: were some conversations on this set about it was an
Speaker 1: un unmotivated overreaction to me, and I think that I
Speaker 1: remember having the conversation. But what they wanted was the bookends,
Speaker 1: the window back to back for you know, for the
Speaker 1: drama of the finale, and so we had to get
Speaker 1: there somewhere. My job is to give them what they
Speaker 1: wish in a way that feels truthful, um, and if
Speaker 1: it honestly um. Sometimes you can't fully achieve those things
Speaker 1: when requested, even when you put your very best work
Speaker 1: into it. You know, what was your experience like on
Speaker 1: other shows with things like that, because I think in
Speaker 1: TV that happens a lot where something is just on
Speaker 1: a page or you know, a writer's room decided here's
Speaker 1: what we need for the poetry of the of the episode,
Speaker 1: and they're not taking into consideration that an actor you know,
Speaker 1: may be able to bring to light reasons why it
Speaker 1: would not be organic to do it that way. Um.
Speaker 1: And yet it's television, it's not film. We don't have
Speaker 1: time to rehearse and a just all those things. Do
Speaker 1: you Was it was it, uh the similar on other
Speaker 1: TV shows that you had been on that there was
Speaker 1: a lot of that all the time, or was it
Speaker 1: mostly on more on One Tree Hill or less? Or
Speaker 1: you've had such a long career. There's two answers to
Speaker 1: that that I would like to like to put forward.
Speaker 1: First off, is because it's a really great question for
Speaker 1: people that are listening, that have you know, ideas of
Speaker 1: theater or acting whatever, and so they may run in
Speaker 1: these situations. So it's nicely to talk about the process,
Speaker 1: especially the collabor process on that level. On procedural shows,
Speaker 1: you know, you know them all, there's so many of them.
Speaker 1: There's no conversations. This is what's happening. The committee. The
Speaker 1: committee has has just passed down the lecture and this
Speaker 1: is what's happening to do because they shoot them fast,
Speaker 1: you get out and you don't have debate. You know,
Speaker 1: on that, it's it's happening um on. On a show
Speaker 1: with a really hands on kind of showrunner like a
Speaker 1: Matt Weiner who've worked for people like that, there's intelligent
Speaker 1: conversations which help you understand the process is where they
Speaker 1: got to and these aren't you know, these sort of
Speaker 1: like quick decisions. They're very thought out and they have
Speaker 1: meaningful collaborations without actors and you get to to figure
Speaker 1: things out which which work and they will make adjustments
Speaker 1: in order to make that work. But to turn it
Speaker 1: all around from a directing point of view, as a director,
Speaker 1: and you've worked with me as a director, if an
Speaker 1: actor says to me, uh, this isn't. I'm not just
Speaker 1: doesn't feel or good. I feel like I'm I'm taking
Speaker 1: this to me. That is like the death of anything
Speaker 1: I ever want filmed. Yeah, the same way, you know,
Speaker 1: Yeah you are. And I remember one time, you know,
Speaker 1: you and I were working on a scene and you
Speaker 1: were supposed to what you were supposed to get really
Speaker 1: mad into something, and you said, I just feel like
Speaker 1: I want to like wipe this table theme and smash everything,
Speaker 1: and said, well do it, and you're like, I can't
Speaker 1: do that, and you kind of stopped. Remember in your draft,
Speaker 1: I can do it. I went yea And I said,
Speaker 1: well then they'll have to clean up. And I said,
Speaker 1: then they'll have to clean it over, Like that's no
Speaker 1: disrespect to the but that's their job. Yeah, sure, we'll
Speaker 1: have a job. Your job is to be truthful, and
Speaker 1: our job is to give you the environment to be
Speaker 1: truthful in Yes, you know, so you figure it out,
Speaker 1: you know, Yeah, that's really cool. Yeah, I remember, Yeah,
Speaker 1: I remember on soaps there was there was such a
Speaker 1: fast pace with that schedule, and I don't know if
Speaker 1: they were shot differently in l A. Than they were
Speaker 1: in New York, because did you guys do camera blocking,
Speaker 1: like you went in and did like rehearsal blocking in
Speaker 1: a blank room. Then you did camera blocking, and then
Speaker 1: everybody shot. They had like a slot between one and
Speaker 1: five that they would go in and shoot their scenes
Speaker 1: in the afternoon. That's how we shout our total three
Speaker 1: of those. We didn't have a rear. We had an
Speaker 1: onset read through where the director and the producers would
Speaker 1: walk through the set cold and the director would go,
Speaker 1: this is where you stand, and then you over here.
Speaker 1: Then you move over here, and it's literally paint lines
Speaker 1: on the floor, so you wouldn't miss it, you know.
Speaker 1: But then they always had it was four, you know what,
Speaker 1: always three or four cameras going same time, and then
Speaker 1: in the afternoon you'd block out your pieces and shoot
Speaker 1: them and you usually do them twice, right, because there
Speaker 1: were some soaps that would you would go in and
Speaker 1: everything was done all at once, so you would go
Speaker 1: in and do your blocking, then you would immediately do
Speaker 1: camera blocking, and then you would shoot your scene. So
Speaker 1: everybody just went in hair and makeup at different times,
Speaker 1: but everything would happen at once, and I never liked
Speaker 1: the idea of that. I'm glad we didn't do that.
Speaker 1: Because we gave us time to process after our blocking rehearsal.
Speaker 1: You'd have time to process before you went back to
Speaker 1: camera blocking and said, wait, something feels wrong, something doesn't
Speaker 1: feel right about this country. Hill was every director kind
Speaker 1: of their own vibe, but we always kept the same
Speaker 1: kind of formula, right you know, yeah, yeah, that was
Speaker 1: that everybody. You would come in and get your makeup done.
Speaker 1: You'd really just get to set and start. You'd rehearsed quickly.
Speaker 1: There was a twenty minute break for camera blocking or
Speaker 1: two hours, depending on depending on what was going on
Speaker 1: that day, and then shoot we did among the fans
Speaker 1: would have loved to have been in the in the
Speaker 1: makeup room where all the gossip was going down and
Speaker 1: we're talking about the weekends and who did wet and
Speaker 1: wet and where and now, and it's like bonding and
Speaker 1: friendships and people bringing in cookies. It was. It was fun.
Speaker 1: It was There was also a lot of drama in
Speaker 1: there and makeup trailer and I we've We've talked a
Speaker 1: lot Hillary, Sophia and I on the show. I've talked
Speaker 1: a lot about um. You know, there's just there's so
Speaker 1: many so easy to have so many misunderstandings and and
Speaker 1: it's so it is a place for gossip a lot
Speaker 1: of the time. And something I can say that I've
Speaker 1: noticed in this business is as time has gone on,
Speaker 1: it's not like it used to be. In the hair
Speaker 1: makeup trailer it's talking about someone behind their back or
Speaker 1: gossip or you know where the whole trailer is just
Speaker 1: like up in arms talking about something that's not happening anymore.
Speaker 1: I haven't seen that on a set in a very
Speaker 1: long time. Good. Yeah, So, I don't know, it's just tracking.
Speaker 1: And a lot of times I would wear headphones because
Speaker 1: I just couldn't hear. I have to go do a
Speaker 1: scene with somebody, and I'm finding all these things out
Speaker 1: about them that have nothing to do with my scene,
Speaker 1: and I really want to be focused on the work,
Speaker 1: preparing my performance and preparing mental place for that character
Speaker 1: you're walking into the scene. You know this whole thing
Speaker 1: that people um one thing that is always lacking in
Speaker 1: conversations about watching shows. When you watch neib to watch
Speaker 1: TV show UM and a new scene starts, you remember
Speaker 1: that character is coming in with all the history of
Speaker 1: everything that just happened to that character before. When you're
Speaker 1: an actor. That's what you're reviewing before you go into
Speaker 1: the you're walking into the set, your head is going,
Speaker 1: what's the last time I saw this person? Where did
Speaker 1: they say to me? How did I react? What happened
Speaker 1: since then? What a new information I learn? I'm walking
Speaker 1: in the scene and I have something to say. But
Speaker 1: it doesn't just happen when you walk out and see
Speaker 1: your lines. The whole prime event value going on there.
Speaker 1: Audiences when they watch it, they go, oh, this person
Speaker 1: has always got coming in with something. It's like it's
Speaker 1: because they're doing their work. Yeah, and you have to
Speaker 1: have the space to be able to do that in
Speaker 1: an undistracted space like that. It's super important that That's
Speaker 1: probably why I think it's one of the reasons why
Speaker 1: artists get bad rap as being really fussy sometimes because
Speaker 1: you can be in a moment where you're really trying
Speaker 1: to give the prepare to give the most authentic performance
Speaker 1: so that the audience can have the most authentic experience.
Speaker 1: And uh, if you if you get annoyed with someone
Speaker 1: who's bouncing around the set shit chit chatting, or you know,
Speaker 1: just being super distracting, or if somebody who's standing next
Speaker 1: to you and just gossiping or trying to rope you
Speaker 1: to something and if you, you know, in your zone,
Speaker 1: go I can't. I can't deal with that right now,
Speaker 1: can we? You know, because it's so hard to stay
Speaker 1: focused and also turn to someone and go into a
Speaker 1: completely different zone of Hey, listen, um, I'm just trying
Speaker 1: to focus right now on my work, and I totally
Speaker 1: respect that you want to have this conversation. Would you
Speaker 1: mind doing it somewhere else? Like my brain? It's really
Speaker 1: hard for me to maintain, um, but yeah, but to
Speaker 1: maintain that duel like I don't know how to stay
Speaker 1: and I can't stay in my zone. I have to
Speaker 1: come out of my zone in order to take care
Speaker 1: of someone else's problem and then try and find my
Speaker 1: way back into my zone. And that's really hard joy
Speaker 1: to work with. I can't believe she asked me not
Speaker 1: to talk about my new gardening on my back. Was
Speaker 1: in the middle of toner about my beats being planted,
Speaker 1: and she said, I'm safe, right, No, but I wanted
Speaker 1: to bring your beat. But person, I think on the set,
Speaker 1: you know, everyone has an onset demeanor, right, everyone, Like
Speaker 1: we're sitting in chairs, we're yakking away where the rehearsing
Speaker 1: or we're talking. We're chatting about whatever. We're sitting in
Speaker 1: our in our director chairs waiting to go and shoot
Speaker 1: a scene them while chiming around. There was one person
Speaker 1: who's my favorite person I've ever worked with, and her
Speaker 1: name is I'll name some of her movies. You told
Speaker 1: me who it is. She is in um uh, the
Speaker 1: Daniel day Lewis movie, but Lincoln, Okay, she was in
Speaker 1: Fried Green Tomatoes, Tender Mercies, Mary Stuart Masterson, Sally Field,
Speaker 1: Sally Field, Oh my god, favorite onset demeanors. Sally comes
Speaker 1: with her own chair and a bag, and she's fully,
Speaker 1: fully rehearsed, knows not only her lines, but everybody's lines.
Speaker 1: She's the smartest person in the room. She sits down
Speaker 1: and she just needle points all day and listens in
Speaker 1: the minutes churn down and she's amazing. It's like one
Speaker 1: of those things where she doesn't mean even when she's
Speaker 1: not in the scene, she's still there needle. You worked
Speaker 1: with her on Soap Dish, one of my favorite movies,
Speaker 1: very funny movie, very funny movie was that the Jim
Speaker 1: Doing likeness from Father Corey told me, your experience to
Speaker 1: the soap kitchen. You are right, and I'm my shirts
Speaker 1: off and I'm glistening. Oh so good. I love that.
Speaker 1: You know who else on our show sounds very similar
Speaker 1: to that. Actually, Sharon Lawrence is stellar at that. She
Speaker 1: is a dynamite actress and also can really manage um.
Speaker 1: She's just said, it's such a Southern genteel woman. She
Speaker 1: knows how to manage every personality around her. I love
Speaker 1: her too. She's we talked to was it the party
Speaker 1: that you had? It goes from Christmas point Christmas party. Yeah,
Speaker 1: she was just you know, we talked about you and
Speaker 1: she's like she gets what I get. Sweet, thank you. Yeah,
Speaker 1: It's it's an interesting thing to be an artist in
Speaker 1: this in this world. Games had a very sort of
Speaker 1: solo alone vibe in this episode, suffering by himself, kind
Speaker 1: of like you know, people come in and go, but
Speaker 1: then nobody stays with him. Yeah, he's kind of I
Speaker 1: really like the way they designed that to make him
Speaker 1: kind of like a man alone, you know what I mean.
Speaker 1: That's a great point. I hadn't thought about that. I
Speaker 1: really like that too, because all we've seen of him
Speaker 1: is with Lucas in the last few episodes where um
Speaker 1: or or dealing with stuff with Dan, And this was
Speaker 1: the first time even the dinner table or the barbecue
Speaker 1: table that Dan set out set out flowers. Apparently. I
Speaker 1: was like, Wow, the lavender's out on the table. Okay, Dan,
Speaker 1: give me a second life back. What are you trying
Speaker 1: to turn on? Just popped off? Oh yeah, go ahead,
Speaker 1: She'll turn out his life. Um. But I was gonna say,
Speaker 1: well you do that that? Uh? I love seeing even
Speaker 1: though he had that moment with Dan over the barbecue. Uh,
Speaker 1: horrible about Dan telling him about Deb's addiction was just
Speaker 1: such a bad parenting moment. But um, I think you're right.
Speaker 1: I love seeing that. Giving James the opportunity to just wrestle,
Speaker 1: have Nathan wrestle with himself and his own issues rather
Speaker 1: than wrestling with everyone else's interpretation of Nathan's issues. He
Speaker 1: just had to be alone with himself. Yeah, really nice.
Speaker 1: I liked it too. Can we talk about Lee and Catherine?
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, oh yeah, I love it. Go ahead. She
Speaker 1: threw herself at him, right. It's it's a nice place
Speaker 1: for him to be at as a as a as
Speaker 1: a as a care you know, to have this charming,
Speaker 1: sweet fun southern you know, full of life girl, like
Speaker 1: make him number one, and it's kind of nice to
Speaker 1: see him kind of like like just seeping that. Yeah. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I love Mouth. We all love Mouth. He's our He's
Speaker 1: our favorite go to anytime guy. You know, like he's
Speaker 1: always there for you, he's always reliable. Um, but we're
Speaker 1: gonna go, oh he is. Yeah, that's right. You know
Speaker 1: where We're going to go to listener questions. But before
Speaker 1: we do, in the interest of the the book ends
Speaker 1: that we talked about and the theme of this episode,
Speaker 1: the two tragedies in life. At the end of the episode,
Speaker 1: Mouth disagrees. Speaking of Mouth, he disagrees and says, no,
Speaker 1: it's you know, whoever, whoever. George Bernard Shaw was never
Speaker 1: kissed Derika Marsh Right, but the sentiment of gaining your
Speaker 1: heart's desire isn't a tragedy. Uh. I'm curious as to
Speaker 1: what you think about that quote. I think George Burroshaw
Speaker 1: was a genius, and I think he's right. I do absolutely.
Speaker 1: I mean, you must, you must feel the same way.
Speaker 1: I mean, I've never suffered more than when I'm in love. Yes,
Speaker 1: you know what I mean, I can handle in tragedy
Speaker 1: but when I'm in love everything, it's like magnified. Yes,
Speaker 1: that's true. But also you know what made me think
Speaker 1: of that gaining the desire of your heart there is
Speaker 1: a tragedy in it because then you've got it and
Speaker 1: now what Now you have to find something else. It's
Speaker 1: like the death of the chase when you spent when
Speaker 1: you spend so long chasing a desire. Once you once
Speaker 1: you have it, uh, it's it's scary. It's because it's like, well,
Speaker 1: what do I do now? Now I have it? And
Speaker 1: let's hear the child of an alcoholic and you think
Speaker 1: that you don't deserve it, and so it's going to
Speaker 1: leave you at one point. You've better work really hard
Speaker 1: to keep it interesting, you know, um, you know, tension,
Speaker 1: to prove you're worthy of keeping that low. Oh wow, right, yeah,
Speaker 1: oh that's interesting. I don't I don't know that I
Speaker 1: feel that way. I think I do have a Uh
Speaker 1: I love the chase, and then once I catch it,
Speaker 1: there's a little part of me and it's anything. It's
Speaker 1: not love necessarily, but but professional things projects anything. It's
Speaker 1: like once you once you get it, then it's I
Speaker 1: think it's kind of a human nature thing. Just okay,
Speaker 1: now what I'm going to move on to something else.
Speaker 1: And that's why we is it. The tragedy is that
Speaker 1: we keep climbing, We keep reaching for the next thing
Speaker 1: and the next thing and the next thing, thinking we're
Speaker 1: gonna arrive somewhere, but we never do what's above love?
Speaker 1: What are you? What are you going to reach for
Speaker 1: about love? Like? What is there above that? Like how
Speaker 1: can you reach for anything higher than that? Yeah, but
Speaker 1: then you get into the whole esoteric conversation of what
Speaker 1: is love and like where you know, is love a choice?
Speaker 1: And then the responsibilities Actually, let me take that, let
Speaker 1: me take that. Let me just say this, and this
Speaker 1: is a comes you have to quit. And when I
Speaker 1: have a very special eleven year old, so we do
Speaker 1: have these conversations, I tell him that it doesn't matter
Speaker 1: necessarily because I always talk about, like, you know, this
Speaker 1: pursuit of happiness by it that goes around, I'm not
Speaker 1: believe it. I don't believe that happiness is something to pursue.
Speaker 1: It's the byproduct of of finding yourself on your purpose.
Speaker 1: Happiness is is kind of like it is the result
Speaker 1: of something rather than a goal in itself and in
Speaker 1: love as your as you said, it's like there is
Speaker 1: definitely value in to want, just the words to want.
Speaker 1: I want this, I want that job, I want that money,
Speaker 1: I want that person, I want that acclaim to want
Speaker 1: is a wonderful thing because it gives a lot of
Speaker 1: a lot of direction and a lot of motivation, and
Speaker 1: and But it's really that in itself that to want
Speaker 1: part of the life is really what life is. To
Speaker 1: get is not what life is, but to want is
Speaker 1: you know what I mean? I do this reminds me
Speaker 1: of something. My French hairdresser told me. This is perfect.
Speaker 1: He said, I said, I'm hungry. I was sitting in
Speaker 1: the chair. I said I'm hungry and he said, so well,
Speaker 1: I don't know. I was thinking of ordering some food.
Speaker 1: He said, you will be done and we'll be done
Speaker 1: in about an hour. Are you fine? You know you
Speaker 1: do swait And I was like, well, but I'm hungry.
Speaker 1: He goes, It's okay to be hungry. That's that's his life.
Speaker 1: It's it's just a feeling that exists. You just are hungry.
Speaker 1: So what's if you're unhappy? So what you would be
Speaker 1: happy again? Just live through the hunger, live through the
Speaker 1: unhappiness and you will be fed and you will be
Speaker 1: happy again. This is the French way of life, he says,
Speaker 1: It's okay to be hungry. This is so perfect. We
Speaker 1: were in Paris, not five four or five days ago.
Speaker 1: We've gotten the kids in the car, Sammy's driving. We're
Speaker 1: going to a restaurant. It's ten minutes away. We're four
Speaker 1: minutes into the drive, and in the bat seat, I hear,
Speaker 1: can we just going at that restaurant? I'm hungry? What
Speaker 1: about that pizza place right there? And Sammy's got a
Speaker 1: place for us. He's what he loves in Paris is
Speaker 1: my wife. He knows what we're going, and he's like,
Speaker 1: we're six minutes away, yes, but I'm hungry. And I
Speaker 1: was like thinking to myself, is he going to like
Speaker 1: throw his plans away for us? But it was like
Speaker 1: this is so We had such a passive aggressive fight
Speaker 1: in the car, you and I. By the way, it
Speaker 1: wasn't six it wasn't four minutes in You said, I
Speaker 1: was like, at least long, are not gonna be in
Speaker 1: the car for like a half an hour? How long's
Speaker 1: a ride? You said? Ten minutes? And then twenty minutes later,
Speaker 1: I'm in the car, like, are we still there? And
Speaker 1: he says another ten minutes and then I started to
Speaker 1: have the monster come out, my angry monster. But at
Speaker 1: the end of the day, you're right, at the end
Speaker 1: of the day, it's okay to exist in the feelings
Speaker 1: that you're feeling because they will pass and something new
Speaker 1: will come along. That's all the feelings are. Yeah, they
Speaker 1: never stay. Yeah. I wish we could tell Peyton and Chad, Peyton, Peyton,
Speaker 1: Lucas and Brooke and Haley and Nathan that in this
Speaker 1: episode and Karen, but we can't. We'll have to wait
Speaker 1: until next week where Sophia and me. We'll have a
Speaker 1: special guest, Miss Lindsey mckehon. Very excited for that. So
Speaker 1: we're gonna have a couple of listener questions and we'll
Speaker 1: do a spin a wheel and we'll say goodbye. The
Speaker 1: first listener question, Paul, do you if your chat open?
Speaker 1: Fire away? Okay, you read the first one, the Triana
Speaker 1: go ahead. I have always wondered how they decorate the
Speaker 1: homes with family pictures. Do they have a photo shoot
Speaker 1: before the episode had stoned? Also, did they use your
Speaker 1: real baby pictures or use random people They do both.
Speaker 1: They do both. Yeah, I've had every new job I have.
Speaker 1: When if if I'm in the house they asked me to,
Speaker 1: I usually pawn it off to my mom. I usually
Speaker 1: send the email to my mom and I'm like, can
Speaker 1: you send them baby pictures of mean please? Are like
Speaker 1: family photos. Yeah, but they also throw us in like
Speaker 1: clothes from another period in time in our lives. And
Speaker 1: then they don't. Maybe they photoshop our faces sometimes, remember like,
Speaker 1: oh yeah, yeah, definitely lots of photoshopping happening. Yeah. Our
Speaker 1: next question comes from Frank. How does it work when
Speaker 1: someone who is directing the episode is also in it,
Speaker 1: like Paul with episode seventeen. Um, I've done this too.
Speaker 1: I don't like this at all. I do not like
Speaker 1: directing an episode that I'm in. I would much prefer
Speaker 1: just to sit back and because it's just so hard
Speaker 1: to be in the moment of the scene. I'm so
Speaker 1: fully in the moment as an actor that to have
Speaker 1: to not be to have to be watching the other
Speaker 1: actor in the scene and thinking of notes to give
Speaker 1: them while we're actually just trying to do a scene.
Speaker 1: It's very hard for me. How do you feel, Um,
Speaker 1: it's different from me. You know, I'm you know, I
Speaker 1: I set it up. Um, I'd like to see, you know,
Speaker 1: the framing. So I want to see somebody kind of
Speaker 1: walk through the paces where we're going to be, what
Speaker 1: the camera's gonna see as it goes along. And once
Speaker 1: I'm comfortable with what the framing is, you know, Um,
Speaker 1: I trust usually we always had and we had very
Speaker 1: good people. In fact, our dps all directed, yes, so
Speaker 1: they're there there. Um, their insight was very valuable and
Speaker 1: and I like to lean on people that I trust.
Speaker 1: I've actually worked with a lot of people that I
Speaker 1: don't trust their opinion. But on One Tree Hill, all
Speaker 1: of the technical crew was fantastic, and I trusted Peter
Speaker 1: and and and you know, and and everybody that was
Speaker 1: was working with. So yeah, I didn't even a problem
Speaker 1: when I started getting into a scene and and acting. Um,
Speaker 1: you know, it's like I'm I'm one of those I'm
Speaker 1: one of those fortune kind of people where I kind
Speaker 1: of I'm not too overly harder on myself, you know
Speaker 1: what I mean, My my my outside vision of myself
Speaker 1: doesn't overpower my you know, my wanting to be present
Speaker 1: for that other actor that's I make that a priority.
Speaker 1: So a lot of times I'm not sure how it
Speaker 1: went because I kind of let it go and then
Speaker 1: I trust that, you know, Peter Costo will go great man,
Speaker 1: move on. But how do you give another actor that
Speaker 1: you're in the scene with a note? Well, usually you've
Speaker 1: done the rehearsal right here and you'll kind of know
Speaker 1: what they're going to be throwing out there. Yeah, and
Speaker 1: eating major is going to be addressed in that. But
Speaker 1: if they're if they're having issues, nuanced issues generally, you
Speaker 1: know this, you know, most actors kind of know when
Speaker 1: they've you know, kind of not being able to hit
Speaker 1: there what they want, what they needed to hit to
Speaker 1: make the scene work. And you know, I think I
Speaker 1: think especially on that show where it wasn't terribly sophisticated,
Speaker 1: you know, yeah, that's true, straightforward, good training ground. Okay,
Speaker 1: so guys, we're going to spin a wheel here and Paul,
Speaker 1: this is our every every episode we do most likely
Speaker 1: to like a yearbook. So who is most like who?
Speaker 1: Which character in which real life person is most likely
Speaker 1: to go ahead and read it for us? Please become
Speaker 1: a detective? Oh gosh, well Dan would be Yes, she's
Speaker 1: such a super sleuth. Absolutely, we didn't even talk about
Speaker 1: her on this episode. I know she was so charmingsh
Speaker 1: she her heart out there, and I was gonna bring
Speaker 1: it up a couple of times, and we kept getting
Speaker 1: other stuff that she you know, the one look away
Speaker 1: in the car when she was you know, when she
Speaker 1: was kind of like and I know you like Peyton
Speaker 1: and then you look away and they zurrat focused her
Speaker 1: and you just want to put yeah, we we needed
Speaker 1: her in this episode actually, just to I mean, there
Speaker 1: was so much weight and sadness. Her floating in and
Speaker 1: out of so great with Tyler, isn't she. Yes, she's funny. Yes,
Speaker 1: I wonder those two characters ever did end up in
Speaker 1: bed together. That would have been really funny. Oh you
Speaker 1: know what if they didn't missed opportunity, because those guys
Speaker 1: are Yeah, for me, they're the two funniest people on
Speaker 1: the show. For sure. They're very very funny. Yes, I
Speaker 1: love actually really I loved you to. Her energy was
Speaker 1: so good in that episode. You know. The one thing
Speaker 1: I was gonna say, also, we got a quickly point
Speaker 1: of this. This was a very strong voice of the
Speaker 1: opening where the three girls talked about what's inside their minds.
Speaker 1: I wasn't in the opening, No, that they were reading, Um,
Speaker 1: they were. They were reading the quote and then they
Speaker 1: were talking. It was like Hilary Sophia and then um.
Speaker 1: But we were hearing inside their minds for as we
Speaker 1: got into and I thought, you know, I love that
Speaker 1: our show gave that privilege to us as an audience. Right, yeah, like,
Speaker 1: here's here's the thoughts of Because we always talked about
Speaker 1: what's the influence of the show on young people, here's
Speaker 1: young people talking. You know, this is what my Emry
Speaker 1: noses is happening. I thought that was a nice way
Speaker 1: to make a connection with your audience. Yeah. I think
Speaker 1: so too. I love that. I love that they allowed
Speaker 1: us to take over the monologue that previously had only
Speaker 1: been Lucas is. Yeah, it's really nice. Well, guys, thank
Speaker 1: you for joining us for this very special episode. Paul.
Speaker 1: You were awesome. I love love chatting with you always. Um,
Speaker 1: next time, we'll do it later with wine dinner at Okay, Hey, everybody,
Speaker 1: come on back next week. We're gonna be watching the
Speaker 1: season finale, Season two finale number twenty three, the Lever's Dance,
Speaker 1: and we will pull a scenario from the virtual most
Speaker 1: likely too hat See you later. Hey, thanks for listening.
Speaker 1: Don't forget to leave us a review. You can also
Speaker 1: follow us on Instagram at Drama Queens O t H.
Speaker 1: Or email us at Drama Queens at I heart radio
Speaker 1: dot com. See you next time. We are all about
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