1 00:00:05,920 --> 00:00:15,840 Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. Can you imagine going on 2 00:00:15,880 --> 00:00:19,920 Speaker 1: a dream trip with your family. I plan one every 3 00:00:19,960 --> 00:00:24,440 Speaker 1: summer during COVID. It's been RV trips, but in the 4 00:00:24,480 --> 00:00:29,840 Speaker 1: middle of your dream trip to have your baby girl disappear. 5 00:00:31,480 --> 00:00:34,159 Speaker 1: I'm Nancy Grace. This is Crime Stories. Thank you for 6 00:00:34,240 --> 00:00:37,000 Speaker 1: being with us here at Fox Nation and series x 7 00:00:37,240 --> 00:00:42,760 Speaker 1: M one eleven. I'm talking about Maddie McCann. That's right, 8 00:00:43,240 --> 00:00:47,080 Speaker 1: Madeleine McCann. Take a listen to our cut twenty five 9 00:00:47,120 --> 00:00:50,880 Speaker 1: our friends at wt HR. Finally, is there a break 10 00:00:50,960 --> 00:00:53,440 Speaker 1: in the case. We do have an update now for 11 00:00:53,479 --> 00:00:57,880 Speaker 1: you on a fifteen year long missing child investigation. Prosecutors 12 00:00:57,920 --> 00:01:01,240 Speaker 1: in Portugal now believe they have a suspect in the 13 00:01:01,280 --> 00:01:04,440 Speaker 1: Madeline McCann case. You might remember that was a three 14 00:01:04,440 --> 00:01:07,760 Speaker 1: little three year old little girl from Britain who vanished 15 00:01:07,800 --> 00:01:10,800 Speaker 1: while she was vacationing with her family back in two 16 00:01:10,800 --> 00:01:14,320 Speaker 1: thousand and seven at a resort. The suspect's identity has 17 00:01:14,400 --> 00:01:17,160 Speaker 1: yet to be released. We do know he now is 18 00:01:17,200 --> 00:01:20,720 Speaker 1: in custody for another crime. He also has a previous 19 00:01:20,720 --> 00:01:24,800 Speaker 1: conviction in a child's sexual abuse case. I can't thank 20 00:01:24,800 --> 00:01:28,000 Speaker 1: you for being with us Simancy graysones his crime stories. 21 00:01:29,240 --> 00:01:34,840 Speaker 1: I'm concerned that it has taken this long for police 22 00:01:34,920 --> 00:01:38,600 Speaker 1: to hone in on who they now say is the 23 00:01:39,520 --> 00:01:45,360 Speaker 1: official suspect in the disappearance of Maddie McCann. First of all, 24 00:01:45,600 --> 00:01:50,000 Speaker 1: what happened to Mattie? Joining me? An all star panel 25 00:01:50,000 --> 00:01:53,360 Speaker 1: to make sense of what we know right now? High 26 00:01:53,400 --> 00:01:56,400 Speaker 1: profile lawyer joining me out of the Atlanta jurisdiction, former 27 00:01:56,480 --> 00:02:00,280 Speaker 1: prosecutor of felony crimes just like this one now offense 28 00:02:00,280 --> 00:02:05,480 Speaker 1: attorney Darryl Cohen. Doctor Angela Arnold, renowned psychiatrists, joining us, 29 00:02:05,480 --> 00:02:08,560 Speaker 1: also from the Atlanta jurisdiction, and you can find her 30 00:02:09,080 --> 00:02:14,119 Speaker 1: at her website. Doctor Angela Arnold, MD dot com. Special 31 00:02:14,280 --> 00:02:18,160 Speaker 1: Deputy Sheriff Johnson County Sheriff's Office, Executive Director of the 32 00:02:18,240 --> 00:02:22,040 Speaker 1: Kelsey Smith Foundation, Greg Smith joining us the first to 33 00:02:22,200 --> 00:02:26,960 Speaker 1: Charlie Langston, Editor Dailymail dot com. Charlie, thank you for 34 00:02:27,040 --> 00:02:31,720 Speaker 1: being with us. Charlie, what a long time we've waited 35 00:02:31,760 --> 00:02:35,600 Speaker 1: for justice. And then Mattie McCann disappearance or should I 36 00:02:35,639 --> 00:02:38,680 Speaker 1: just call it like it is, Charlie, Then Mattie McCann 37 00:02:38,760 --> 00:02:42,280 Speaker 1: murder this little girl just three years old, when she 38 00:02:42,760 --> 00:02:45,639 Speaker 1: was abducted. I mean, this is a case as a 39 00:02:45,680 --> 00:02:48,760 Speaker 1: brit It's something that has been a part of my 40 00:02:48,840 --> 00:02:53,240 Speaker 1: life for over a decade now, and I think the 41 00:02:53,400 --> 00:02:57,679 Speaker 1: incredible interest that remains in this case and in all 42 00:02:57,720 --> 00:03:01,760 Speaker 1: of its developments just go to how much of a 43 00:03:01,840 --> 00:03:06,680 Speaker 1: sensational crime this was. It was devastating to the entire country, 44 00:03:06,760 --> 00:03:09,560 Speaker 1: to the entire world to see this three year old 45 00:03:09,560 --> 00:03:13,280 Speaker 1: girl disappear without a trace, and to see her parents 46 00:03:13,600 --> 00:03:18,320 Speaker 1: year after year begging the authorities, begging the public to 47 00:03:18,360 --> 00:03:21,200 Speaker 1: help them try and find out what has happened to 48 00:03:21,240 --> 00:03:26,359 Speaker 1: their child. You're right, Charlie, just seeing the mccns crying 49 00:03:26,760 --> 00:03:30,840 Speaker 1: and begging, and of course under the circumstances where little 50 00:03:30,880 --> 00:03:35,280 Speaker 1: baby Manny went missing, they were first suspected, which tore 51 00:03:35,400 --> 00:03:39,240 Speaker 1: them up all the more. Guys, who is this guy 52 00:03:39,400 --> 00:03:43,320 Speaker 1: that is now the suspect? Finally, he's been in their 53 00:03:43,320 --> 00:03:46,480 Speaker 1: crosshars for a long time. I don't know what has 54 00:03:46,520 --> 00:03:50,000 Speaker 1: taken them so long to name him an official suspect. 55 00:03:50,000 --> 00:03:52,320 Speaker 1: Taking listen to Erica three our friends at Sky but 56 00:03:52,440 --> 00:03:56,800 Speaker 1: Madeline McCann's parents, there's still hope she's alive. But prosecutor 57 00:03:56,800 --> 00:04:01,440 Speaker 1: hands Christian voters, says he's leading a murder investigation. Madeleine's 58 00:04:01,440 --> 00:04:04,400 Speaker 1: parents still believe she could be alive. Why do you 59 00:04:04,640 --> 00:04:08,880 Speaker 1: call it a murder investigation. There's so many facts that 60 00:04:09,640 --> 00:04:17,240 Speaker 1: she's dead, so there's no muclict opportunity opportunity that she 61 00:04:17,400 --> 00:04:20,840 Speaker 1: is still living. The case against the new suspect, Christian 62 00:04:20,880 --> 00:04:25,800 Speaker 1: B is circumstantial. He's a convicted child sex abuser. He 63 00:04:25,960 --> 00:04:29,960 Speaker 1: lived along Portugal's Algalve coast for twelve years. His last 64 00:04:30,000 --> 00:04:33,039 Speaker 1: home was in prior to Luge, where Madeline vanished. His 65 00:04:33,160 --> 00:04:37,040 Speaker 1: phone was used outside the McCann apartment the night she disappeared. 66 00:04:38,360 --> 00:04:42,080 Speaker 1: Laijah from Melin mckenn Vegin Abadaf and Astasi towards us. 67 00:04:42,440 --> 00:04:45,200 Speaker 1: We don't have Madeleine mckenn's body, but we expect that 68 00:04:45,279 --> 00:04:48,320 Speaker 1: she's dead. We have some evidence that the suspect has 69 00:04:48,320 --> 00:04:51,360 Speaker 1: done the deed, but we need more information from people 70 00:04:51,560 --> 00:04:53,880 Speaker 1: places he has lived, so we can target these places 71 00:04:54,000 --> 00:04:57,200 Speaker 1: especially and search there for Madeline. You know, I find 72 00:04:57,200 --> 00:05:01,560 Speaker 1: it really interesting out to Greg Smith, special Deputy sheriff 73 00:05:01,640 --> 00:05:06,039 Speaker 1: joining us Join County. You of all people know the 74 00:05:06,200 --> 00:05:09,960 Speaker 1: power of the ping, okay, the power of a cell 75 00:05:10,000 --> 00:05:14,760 Speaker 1: phone ping? Did I just hear Greg Smith that this 76 00:05:15,000 --> 00:05:23,520 Speaker 1: guy cell phone ping just outside Mattie McCann's apartment. It 77 00:05:23,600 --> 00:05:28,279 Speaker 1: was like an Airbnb where they were staying at this 78 00:05:28,600 --> 00:05:33,240 Speaker 1: plush resort. They didn't know that before. Now, well, NANC 79 00:05:33,400 --> 00:05:37,280 Speaker 1: depends on how they did it. I mean, there is 80 00:05:37,320 --> 00:05:41,720 Speaker 1: a way to get lives location data, you know, at 81 00:05:41,760 --> 00:05:44,480 Speaker 1: the time of the crime. That type of thing, the 82 00:05:44,920 --> 00:05:47,200 Speaker 1: stuff that I work on all the time. There's also 83 00:05:47,240 --> 00:05:49,719 Speaker 1: a way to get that data though, from historical data, 84 00:05:49,800 --> 00:05:53,720 Speaker 1: from what's known as CDRs, are called detailed records. You 85 00:05:53,720 --> 00:05:57,000 Speaker 1: can go back and get the information on which towers 86 00:05:57,040 --> 00:06:00,479 Speaker 1: a phone contacted, and their software you can that into 87 00:06:00,520 --> 00:06:02,760 Speaker 1: and it'll map that out and you can actually see 88 00:06:03,440 --> 00:06:06,839 Speaker 1: where that phone has traveled. So it would be interesting 89 00:06:06,880 --> 00:06:11,560 Speaker 1: to know when they got that information. How long ago 90 00:06:11,680 --> 00:06:14,200 Speaker 1: did they get it. Is it something they just recently said, Hey, 91 00:06:14,240 --> 00:06:16,240 Speaker 1: we can do this. I mean, you know, there's a 92 00:06:16,240 --> 00:06:19,599 Speaker 1: lot of questions here, but yeah, fifteen years is a 93 00:06:19,600 --> 00:06:22,200 Speaker 1: long time, you know. Charlie Linkson, I don't understand that 94 00:06:22,279 --> 00:06:25,400 Speaker 1: Charlie Linkson joining us report with dailymail dot com. She's 95 00:06:25,400 --> 00:06:30,680 Speaker 1: the editor of Female Femail. I don't understand it. If 96 00:06:30,720 --> 00:06:34,960 Speaker 1: he is linked outside where our parents were staying at 97 00:06:35,000 --> 00:06:38,279 Speaker 1: the time. Why has it taken them so long? You know, 98 00:06:38,320 --> 00:06:42,359 Speaker 1: this whole case has just been filled with era after 99 00:06:42,480 --> 00:06:46,800 Speaker 1: era after era, starting right from the jump when Maddie disappeared. 100 00:06:47,040 --> 00:06:50,640 Speaker 1: The Portuguese police came under huge criticism at the time 101 00:06:50,920 --> 00:06:54,760 Speaker 1: because they failed to take any action immediately, which we 102 00:06:54,880 --> 00:06:59,040 Speaker 1: now believe allowed this suspect, this man to get out 103 00:06:59,040 --> 00:07:02,280 Speaker 1: of Portugal. As soon as the media for all began 104 00:07:02,520 --> 00:07:06,039 Speaker 1: around the Maddie McCann case, this guy slipped out of 105 00:07:06,080 --> 00:07:09,240 Speaker 1: Portugal and we believe went back to Germany. None of 106 00:07:09,240 --> 00:07:11,640 Speaker 1: the boarders were locked down, none of that stuff was 107 00:07:11,720 --> 00:07:14,640 Speaker 1: put into place, and that allowed him to walk right 108 00:07:14,680 --> 00:07:18,360 Speaker 1: out of the country. So to even know that he 109 00:07:18,480 --> 00:07:21,120 Speaker 1: was there at the time, we would have had to 110 00:07:21,480 --> 00:07:24,760 Speaker 1: have identified him as being in Portugal. Nobody knew at 111 00:07:24,800 --> 00:07:28,000 Speaker 1: the time because he was allowed to flee before anyone 112 00:07:28,040 --> 00:07:30,960 Speaker 1: could even raise him as a suspect. And at that time, 113 00:07:31,040 --> 00:07:36,040 Speaker 1: Daryl Cohen, he was already a sex offender. He had 114 00:07:36,120 --> 00:07:44,640 Speaker 1: been molesting little girls, oggling them, just a long, long history. 115 00:07:45,080 --> 00:07:49,120 Speaker 1: How he was moving so freely from one country to 116 00:07:49,160 --> 00:07:52,800 Speaker 1: the next. Nancy, you have to wonder where the police were, 117 00:07:53,160 --> 00:07:55,760 Speaker 1: where their eyes were where their head was, and their 118 00:07:55,760 --> 00:07:58,560 Speaker 1: hands weren't moving the way they should. Hear well, obviously 119 00:07:58,600 --> 00:08:01,960 Speaker 1: I know where their heads were up their rear ends 120 00:08:02,000 --> 00:08:06,600 Speaker 1: because this guy was allowed to wander around right there 121 00:08:06,880 --> 00:08:10,640 Speaker 1: where this child was staying. And there are now other 122 00:08:10,720 --> 00:08:14,679 Speaker 1: cases a rape of a US citizen in the area, 123 00:08:14,880 --> 00:08:19,320 Speaker 1: and a sex attack on another elderly lady, another young 124 00:08:19,440 --> 00:08:23,360 Speaker 1: girl who goes missing not too too far away around 125 00:08:23,400 --> 00:08:28,400 Speaker 1: the age and very physically similar to Mattie McCann. And 126 00:08:28,440 --> 00:08:31,680 Speaker 1: he's connected to all these things that I know. I know, 127 00:08:31,920 --> 00:08:35,679 Speaker 1: Daryl Cohen, that you would scream bloody murder at trial 128 00:08:35,760 --> 00:08:38,640 Speaker 1: if I did this. But don't you think it's quite 129 00:08:38,720 --> 00:08:43,320 Speaker 1: the coincidence that where the elderly woman is raped, where 130 00:08:43,360 --> 00:08:46,480 Speaker 1: the US citizen is raped, where the other little girl 131 00:08:46,640 --> 00:08:51,400 Speaker 1: goes missing, that looks like Mattie McCann. Where Maddie goes missing, 132 00:08:51,600 --> 00:08:55,400 Speaker 1: he's always in the area, he's always right there, a 133 00:08:55,400 --> 00:08:58,760 Speaker 1: couple of blocks away. That doesn't bother you. I absolutely 134 00:08:58,800 --> 00:09:01,880 Speaker 1: admit it is not a coincidence, because I don't believe 135 00:09:01,920 --> 00:09:05,960 Speaker 1: in coincidences. But I am very concerned about the lack 136 00:09:06,000 --> 00:09:11,719 Speaker 1: of appropriate police work in their investigation. What dead end 137 00:09:11,920 --> 00:09:16,640 Speaker 1: until finally and maybe now we'll have justice, just maybe. Guys, 138 00:09:16,840 --> 00:09:18,640 Speaker 1: I want you to take a listen now to our 139 00:09:18,760 --> 00:09:21,840 Speaker 1: cut eighteen our friends at Sky News, and this is 140 00:09:21,880 --> 00:09:26,480 Speaker 1: about the possibility that some of Madeline baby Mada McCann's 141 00:09:26,880 --> 00:09:31,200 Speaker 1: clothes were found in an area. I don't know if 142 00:09:31,240 --> 00:09:33,559 Speaker 1: you guys have this, but in a lot of areas, 143 00:09:34,080 --> 00:09:39,360 Speaker 1: especially densely populated areas, there are patches of ground where 144 00:09:39,400 --> 00:09:46,000 Speaker 1: people can plant a garden, they can have a structure there. 145 00:09:46,760 --> 00:09:51,679 Speaker 1: That is what this guy had, this Christian Bruckner, and 146 00:09:51,720 --> 00:09:55,120 Speaker 1: it is there that we believe there's a possibility that 147 00:09:55,240 --> 00:09:59,200 Speaker 1: some of Maddie's clothes were buried. Take a listen. Do 148 00:09:59,240 --> 00:10:02,440 Speaker 1: you still have this same suspect you had three months ago? Yes, 149 00:10:03,080 --> 00:10:06,320 Speaker 1: we have only one suspect, only Christian be How much 150 00:10:06,360 --> 00:10:11,000 Speaker 1: information have you been sent? We've got hundreds of hints. 151 00:10:11,000 --> 00:10:15,720 Speaker 1: Of course, there are some hints which are only rubbish, 152 00:10:15,880 --> 00:10:20,960 Speaker 1: but there are some hints we are hopeful that can 153 00:10:21,320 --> 00:10:27,360 Speaker 1: make our investigation more successful. Three months ago, you said 154 00:10:27,440 --> 00:10:33,200 Speaker 1: you needed good evidence, forensic evidence. Have you found that yet? 155 00:10:33,360 --> 00:10:37,120 Speaker 1: We have no forensic evidence, but it's not necessary to 156 00:10:37,200 --> 00:10:40,839 Speaker 1: have forensic evidence to charge our suspect, but we need 157 00:10:41,040 --> 00:10:45,400 Speaker 1: some more evidence, maybe a witness, maybe a photo or 158 00:10:45,440 --> 00:10:49,600 Speaker 1: a video. I asked the prosecutor what evidence he has 159 00:10:49,640 --> 00:10:53,880 Speaker 1: that makes him certain that Madeline is dead. He won't say, 160 00:10:54,320 --> 00:10:57,640 Speaker 1: but he is aware of rumors. Someone told me that 161 00:10:57,679 --> 00:11:01,880 Speaker 1: we have found the clothes of Yes, the pajamas. Yeah, 162 00:11:02,200 --> 00:11:05,760 Speaker 1: but it's not true. If we found something like that, 163 00:11:05,840 --> 00:11:09,400 Speaker 1: it would be great for our investigation. I just get 164 00:11:09,400 --> 00:11:27,280 Speaker 1: the sense of the keystone cost time stories with Nancy Grace. Okay, 165 00:11:27,600 --> 00:11:29,800 Speaker 1: first there were claims they had found some for closes. 166 00:11:29,840 --> 00:11:32,160 Speaker 1: Then there were claims they didn't find some of her clothes. 167 00:11:32,880 --> 00:11:36,440 Speaker 1: But the most hotly contested piece of evidence linking Christian 168 00:11:36,520 --> 00:11:41,640 Speaker 1: Bruckner to Maddie McCann is we believe a photo or 169 00:11:41,679 --> 00:11:45,520 Speaker 1: a video of her. Now why would he have that? 170 00:11:45,840 --> 00:11:49,240 Speaker 1: Take us? Now we're cut nineteen our friends inside edition, 171 00:11:49,760 --> 00:11:54,680 Speaker 1: Peter van Send questioned prosecutor Hans Christian Vaulters about the investigation. 172 00:11:55,280 --> 00:11:59,280 Speaker 1: We have strong evidence that Christian be killed Maddie McCann. 173 00:11:59,720 --> 00:12:03,240 Speaker 1: But you don't have a body, correct, there's no body. No, 174 00:12:03,679 --> 00:12:06,760 Speaker 1: we have no forensic evidence. Then how can you be 175 00:12:06,800 --> 00:12:10,640 Speaker 1: so certain we have evidence? And may I speculate that 176 00:12:10,640 --> 00:12:15,600 Speaker 1: that evidence may include photographs or video of Maddie McCann. 177 00:12:15,720 --> 00:12:20,600 Speaker 1: You may speculate, but I'm not allowed tool tell you 178 00:12:21,640 --> 00:12:24,440 Speaker 1: if you are right or if you are wrong. Forty 179 00:12:24,440 --> 00:12:27,359 Speaker 1: eight Hours reports that a search of an abandoned warehouse 180 00:12:27,400 --> 00:12:31,040 Speaker 1: that once belonged to the suspect turned up USB drives 181 00:12:31,080 --> 00:12:35,040 Speaker 1: that contain pictures and videos of child abuse. The prosecutor 182 00:12:35,080 --> 00:12:38,240 Speaker 1: wouldn't confirm if images of Madeline were on the drives. 183 00:12:38,600 --> 00:12:42,840 Speaker 1: Let me go out to doctor Angela Arnold, renowned psychiatrists 184 00:12:42,960 --> 00:12:48,880 Speaker 1: joining us, Doctor Angie. It's one thing to molested child, 185 00:12:49,760 --> 00:12:54,640 Speaker 1: it's another thing to video it. Because if in fact 186 00:12:54,960 --> 00:12:59,880 Speaker 1: Rutner had video or photos of Maddie McCann, you would 187 00:13:00,080 --> 00:13:02,880 Speaker 1: have to have made them himself, because at that time 188 00:13:03,360 --> 00:13:06,840 Speaker 1: Maddie was not public, there were not pictures and video 189 00:13:06,960 --> 00:13:09,720 Speaker 1: off her online. He would have to have made it, 190 00:13:10,040 --> 00:13:13,360 Speaker 1: which means it would have been most likely video of 191 00:13:13,480 --> 00:13:16,920 Speaker 1: him raping or torturing this three year old little girl. Well, 192 00:13:16,960 --> 00:13:19,600 Speaker 1: and the horrific thing is if you if you video 193 00:13:19,760 --> 00:13:21,720 Speaker 1: something so that you can watch it over and over 194 00:13:21,760 --> 00:13:24,360 Speaker 1: again because you get some sort of thrill out of 195 00:13:24,679 --> 00:13:28,440 Speaker 1: doing it and watching it over again. It also means 196 00:13:28,480 --> 00:13:31,040 Speaker 1: that this was this had some planning on his part, 197 00:13:31,559 --> 00:13:34,319 Speaker 1: doesn't it. The thing that just gets me is that 198 00:13:34,440 --> 00:13:37,040 Speaker 1: fifteen years later, they're asking if there's still alive, if 199 00:13:37,040 --> 00:13:40,199 Speaker 1: she's still live. Maybe if they had have done their 200 00:13:40,240 --> 00:13:42,640 Speaker 1: work in the beginning, if she was still alive, they 201 00:13:42,679 --> 00:13:44,640 Speaker 1: could have found her then. I don't know why they 202 00:13:44,640 --> 00:13:46,000 Speaker 1: think that all of a sudden she's going to be 203 00:13:46,240 --> 00:13:49,800 Speaker 1: still alive fifteen years later. How are they ever going 204 00:13:49,880 --> 00:13:52,440 Speaker 1: to find her? Well, I don't know that anyone has 205 00:13:52,520 --> 00:13:55,960 Speaker 1: said that she is still alive, and that's not and 206 00:13:56,000 --> 00:13:58,640 Speaker 1: that's not his m o. Apparently he's you know, he 207 00:14:00,400 --> 00:14:03,360 Speaker 1: if he did it, he raped her, he abused her, 208 00:14:03,400 --> 00:14:06,920 Speaker 1: he filmed it, and because of all the bumbling around 209 00:14:06,960 --> 00:14:10,200 Speaker 1: in this in the police in this country, he's gotten 210 00:14:10,240 --> 00:14:13,360 Speaker 1: away with it for this long. It's horrible what happened 211 00:14:13,679 --> 00:14:18,080 Speaker 1: the night that this little girl seemingly vanishes into thin 212 00:14:18,280 --> 00:14:21,360 Speaker 1: air while on vacation with your family. Take a listen 213 00:14:21,360 --> 00:14:23,680 Speaker 1: to our friends at Sky a three year old British 214 00:14:23,720 --> 00:14:26,560 Speaker 1: girl has gone missing in the our Garve in Portugal. 215 00:14:26,600 --> 00:14:28,800 Speaker 1: Of course we can speak out to Dan Mason, who's 216 00:14:28,800 --> 00:14:30,880 Speaker 1: a journalist who works in that area. Dan, thanks for 217 00:14:30,960 --> 00:14:32,960 Speaker 1: joining us on Sky New Sunrise this morning. What are 218 00:14:32,960 --> 00:14:37,200 Speaker 1: the details that you've gleaned so far? Hell yeah, all 219 00:14:37,240 --> 00:14:40,480 Speaker 1: I basically know is that the child was obvious staying 220 00:14:40,480 --> 00:14:45,040 Speaker 1: a Mark Warner establishment and was reported missing around him 221 00:14:45,120 --> 00:14:50,280 Speaker 1: last night. She's three years old, assist the name of 222 00:14:50,320 --> 00:14:57,160 Speaker 1: Madeline or Maddie fair Hair and the most of the 223 00:14:57,200 --> 00:15:00,480 Speaker 1: people in the area. We're searching through four o'clock in 224 00:15:00,520 --> 00:15:06,040 Speaker 1: the morning yesterday, obviously through hedges and down the Great etc. 225 00:15:07,800 --> 00:15:10,200 Speaker 1: To Norville and I've just been down this morning to 226 00:15:10,520 --> 00:15:12,520 Speaker 1: the club again to see so any more news in 227 00:15:12,560 --> 00:15:15,320 Speaker 1: the situation is basically the same. Straight out to Charlie 228 00:15:15,480 --> 00:15:18,240 Speaker 1: length In, joining us from dailymail dot com. Charlie again, 229 00:15:18,320 --> 00:15:23,000 Speaker 1: thank you for being with us. Exactly what happened surrounding 230 00:15:23,160 --> 00:15:29,000 Speaker 1: her disappearance. So, the disappearance happened while Maddie's parents and 231 00:15:29,480 --> 00:15:33,000 Speaker 1: their friends were out at a restaurant in Portugal. They 232 00:15:33,040 --> 00:15:35,280 Speaker 1: were dining at a place about one hundred and eighty 233 00:15:35,400 --> 00:15:39,280 Speaker 1: feet away from where they were staying. Throughout the night, 234 00:15:39,360 --> 00:15:42,360 Speaker 1: the parents went back checked on the children, and at 235 00:15:42,440 --> 00:15:46,160 Speaker 1: ten pm, Kate went back Maddie's mom to find that 236 00:15:46,280 --> 00:15:51,080 Speaker 1: Maddie had disappeared from her bed. Obviously, as any mother would, 237 00:15:51,280 --> 00:15:55,480 Speaker 1: she flew into a blind panic, alerted as many people 238 00:15:55,520 --> 00:15:58,760 Speaker 1: as she possibly could. They then spent the entire night 239 00:15:59,240 --> 00:16:03,560 Speaker 1: hunting for Maddie, but couldn't find her anywhere. Now, Portuguese 240 00:16:03,600 --> 00:16:07,440 Speaker 1: authorities did not issue They didn't even issue a description 241 00:16:07,520 --> 00:16:11,560 Speaker 1: of Maddie until around twenty four hours after she had disappeared. 242 00:16:11,880 --> 00:16:15,080 Speaker 1: They didn't lock down any kind of entrance or exit 243 00:16:15,280 --> 00:16:17,880 Speaker 1: from the town where the family was staying, And it 244 00:16:18,000 --> 00:16:22,840 Speaker 1: really was just a horrific comedy of errors that continued 245 00:16:23,360 --> 00:16:26,920 Speaker 1: right up until the point when Maddie's parents, Captain Jerry, 246 00:16:27,280 --> 00:16:32,040 Speaker 1: were named as official suspects because Portuguese police accused them 247 00:16:32,560 --> 00:16:36,000 Speaker 1: of killing their daughter in some tragic accident in the 248 00:16:36,080 --> 00:16:39,880 Speaker 1: apartment and then trying to cover it up. So fifteen 249 00:16:40,000 --> 00:16:43,280 Speaker 1: years later, we have a man being named as an 250 00:16:43,320 --> 00:16:47,240 Speaker 1: official suspect for the very first time since Maddie's own 251 00:16:47,440 --> 00:16:50,840 Speaker 1: parents were accused of killing their child. I think that 252 00:16:50,960 --> 00:16:55,000 Speaker 1: there was a lot of public outrage that the parents 253 00:16:55,360 --> 00:16:59,480 Speaker 1: left her and her siblings in the hotel room while 254 00:16:59,520 --> 00:17:02,400 Speaker 1: they went to have dinner. True it was only one 255 00:17:02,480 --> 00:17:06,320 Speaker 1: hundred feet away. True, they had nothing to do with 256 00:17:06,440 --> 00:17:10,760 Speaker 1: her disappearance, but still it was a real witch burning. 257 00:17:10,880 --> 00:17:14,920 Speaker 1: Daryl Cohen, go after the people who were closest to 258 00:17:15,480 --> 00:17:19,960 Speaker 1: what appears to be a victim easier than going after 259 00:17:20,480 --> 00:17:25,679 Speaker 1: the real investigation, Easier than saying, don't have a suspect. 260 00:17:26,200 --> 00:17:32,560 Speaker 1: Suspects yet, we're looking carefully, Easier than looking at trigging 261 00:17:32,680 --> 00:17:37,560 Speaker 1: this net and finding this guy who was a convicted 262 00:17:37,680 --> 00:17:41,440 Speaker 1: child molester. Who finding this guy who went after a 263 00:17:41,600 --> 00:17:45,159 Speaker 1: girl that looked like Mattie. I mean, this is outrageous. 264 00:17:45,440 --> 00:17:48,280 Speaker 1: You know. Another thing about it to you, Greg Smith, 265 00:17:48,560 --> 00:17:52,600 Speaker 1: I agree with Daryl Cohen. The fact that they focused 266 00:17:52,760 --> 00:17:56,040 Speaker 1: so much on the parents at the get go really 267 00:17:56,359 --> 00:18:03,240 Speaker 1: delayed the search for Mattie's And another thing, Greg Smith, Greg, 268 00:18:03,640 --> 00:18:07,119 Speaker 1: the very first thing when a woman or a child 269 00:18:07,240 --> 00:18:12,359 Speaker 1: goes missing, you look for sex predators in the area 270 00:18:12,800 --> 00:18:18,399 Speaker 1: and who is in the area unmonitored Christian Bruckner, they 271 00:18:18,520 --> 00:18:23,359 Speaker 1: did nothing. Yeah, that's standard procedure. Nanswy. You you immediately checked. 272 00:18:24,080 --> 00:18:27,040 Speaker 1: I mean here in Kansas we have the sex spender registry, 273 00:18:27,080 --> 00:18:29,920 Speaker 1: so um that was done. In Kelsey's case, that was 274 00:18:30,280 --> 00:18:31,920 Speaker 1: one of the first things that was done. We'll see 275 00:18:32,080 --> 00:18:34,920 Speaker 1: who's in the area who could have been in the area, 276 00:18:35,720 --> 00:18:40,600 Speaker 1: interview them, talk to them, and while in a lot 277 00:18:40,640 --> 00:18:43,280 Speaker 1: of these cases it turns out that there's a family 278 00:18:43,359 --> 00:18:48,159 Speaker 1: member involved um there, and there's a tendency for police 279 00:18:48,200 --> 00:18:50,440 Speaker 1: to focus on that. You've you've got to be aware 280 00:18:50,480 --> 00:18:54,119 Speaker 1: of the big picture and be open minded and figure 281 00:18:54,160 --> 00:18:56,440 Speaker 1: out that you know, they may not be the suspect, 282 00:18:56,520 --> 00:18:58,880 Speaker 1: and you can't just hone in with a preconceived notion 283 00:18:58,960 --> 00:19:02,760 Speaker 1: that this is what you've got. So, yeah, that's problematic. 284 00:19:03,040 --> 00:19:05,960 Speaker 1: And not only that, do you Trolley Langston? It's my 285 00:19:06,160 --> 00:19:11,639 Speaker 1: understanding that this announcement comes nearly fifteen years to the 286 00:19:11,920 --> 00:19:16,520 Speaker 1: day that Maddie goes missing. Do you find that odd 287 00:19:16,680 --> 00:19:20,600 Speaker 1: at all? Fifteen years to the day. It's actually not 288 00:19:20,920 --> 00:19:26,240 Speaker 1: odd because Portugal has a fifteen year statute of limitation 289 00:19:26,960 --> 00:19:31,440 Speaker 1: on crimes that would call for a ten plus year sentence. 290 00:19:31,800 --> 00:19:34,920 Speaker 1: So I think the timing is actually in no way 291 00:19:34,960 --> 00:19:38,120 Speaker 1: coincidental or strange. I think the timing is very very 292 00:19:38,200 --> 00:19:43,119 Speaker 1: purposeful because Portuguese authorities know that if they don't do 293 00:19:43,400 --> 00:19:46,399 Speaker 1: something right here, right now, then it may well be 294 00:19:46,560 --> 00:19:52,080 Speaker 1: too late to ever punish whoever perpetrated this horrific crime 295 00:19:52,400 --> 00:19:55,240 Speaker 1: and to ever find any kind of justice or at 296 00:19:55,359 --> 00:19:59,439 Speaker 1: least answers for Kate and Jerry McCann. Well, you're right. 297 00:20:00,840 --> 00:20:04,440 Speaker 1: What Charlie Langston is telling you is absolutely correct. I 298 00:20:04,680 --> 00:20:08,040 Speaker 1: think that this is just the authorities trying to save 299 00:20:08,200 --> 00:20:10,600 Speaker 1: their own skin in this case. Take a listen to 300 00:20:10,680 --> 00:20:15,000 Speaker 1: arrocut twenty seven. Our friend Simon Jones Madeline went missing 301 00:20:15,040 --> 00:20:17,280 Speaker 1: from a holiday apartment on the third of May two 302 00:20:17,359 --> 00:20:20,120 Speaker 1: thousand and seven while her parents were having dinner at 303 00:20:20,160 --> 00:20:23,720 Speaker 1: a nearby restaurant. In July twenty thirteen, the met Police 304 00:20:23,760 --> 00:20:26,920 Speaker 1: opened its own investigation, saying it had new evidence and 305 00:20:27,080 --> 00:20:29,920 Speaker 1: new witnesses, and it was in June twenty twenty that 306 00:20:30,040 --> 00:20:33,040 Speaker 1: German police first revealed they had a suspect. There have 307 00:20:33,160 --> 00:20:38,560 Speaker 1: been searches in Portugal, but no breakthrough. In less than 308 00:20:38,640 --> 00:20:41,880 Speaker 1: two weeks, a statute of limitations would take effect, meaning 309 00:20:42,000 --> 00:20:44,680 Speaker 1: under Portuguese law it would no longer be possible to 310 00:20:44,800 --> 00:20:48,240 Speaker 1: make someone a person of interest. But it's understood this 311 00:20:48,359 --> 00:20:51,480 Speaker 1: latest development is driven not by timing, but by strong 312 00:20:51,560 --> 00:20:55,479 Speaker 1: indications that a crime has taken place. There have been 313 00:20:55,520 --> 00:20:58,680 Speaker 1: many false dawns in the investigations into what happened to 314 00:20:58,800 --> 00:21:02,520 Speaker 1: Police in Germany have previously worn their inquiry, like the others, 315 00:21:02,760 --> 00:21:07,320 Speaker 1: could end without a charge, but Madeline's parents have always 316 00:21:07,359 --> 00:21:09,800 Speaker 1: said they need to know what happened so they can 317 00:21:09,880 --> 00:21:15,320 Speaker 1: find peace. So bottom line, it's now or never, and 318 00:21:15,520 --> 00:21:20,119 Speaker 1: the Portuguese authorities are still, in my opinion, sitting on 319 00:21:20,240 --> 00:21:22,920 Speaker 1: their thumb. They botched the case at the get go, 320 00:21:23,440 --> 00:21:26,760 Speaker 1: and now the only way they may be able to 321 00:21:26,880 --> 00:21:30,199 Speaker 1: prosecute this three year old little girl's killer is if 322 00:21:30,240 --> 00:21:36,000 Speaker 1: they somehow produced a witness. They've blurted out publicly that 323 00:21:36,119 --> 00:21:39,000 Speaker 1: they don't have any forensic evidence that hurt the case. 324 00:21:39,480 --> 00:21:42,320 Speaker 1: But now I'm understanding trolling links and joining us from 325 00:21:42,359 --> 00:21:46,280 Speaker 1: dalmail dot com that they are claiming they've got a witness. 326 00:21:46,600 --> 00:21:50,320 Speaker 1: Now supposedly, yes, they are saying that they have a 327 00:21:50,440 --> 00:21:54,200 Speaker 1: witness who may be able to come forward and link 328 00:21:54,800 --> 00:21:58,000 Speaker 1: Christian be Christian Bruckner to the crime. But I should 329 00:21:58,040 --> 00:22:01,280 Speaker 1: also point out that a TV special is due to 330 00:22:01,400 --> 00:22:05,880 Speaker 1: air in the UK tomorrow in which four witnesses are 331 00:22:05,960 --> 00:22:10,159 Speaker 1: understood to be coming forward to corroborate an alibi for 332 00:22:10,320 --> 00:22:15,600 Speaker 1: Christian b which would once again, potentially, you know, completely 333 00:22:15,720 --> 00:22:20,240 Speaker 1: ruin this whole case before it's even really got off 334 00:22:20,280 --> 00:22:22,680 Speaker 1: the ground. So it will be interesting to see what 335 00:22:22,880 --> 00:22:26,760 Speaker 1: happens tomorrow when these four people who are named, who 336 00:22:26,960 --> 00:22:30,280 Speaker 1: supposedly have no connection to Christian b whatsoever, no reason 337 00:22:30,520 --> 00:22:35,119 Speaker 1: to defend him, come forward and cooborate whatever alibi it 338 00:22:35,320 --> 00:22:37,159 Speaker 1: is that he plans to offer. Well, you know what, 339 00:22:37,320 --> 00:22:40,400 Speaker 1: Charlie Langston, I'll just burn that bridge when I get there, 340 00:22:41,000 --> 00:22:44,160 Speaker 1: because I've had a lot of cases where the defense 341 00:22:44,240 --> 00:22:48,080 Speaker 1: claims I've got an eyewitness to say fill in the blank, 342 00:22:48,840 --> 00:22:51,800 Speaker 1: and you know what I said to that b s 343 00:22:52,280 --> 00:22:57,400 Speaker 1: I'll stand on my own witnesses, because very often I've 344 00:22:57,440 --> 00:23:01,120 Speaker 1: had witnesses come on for the defense. I remember one, 345 00:23:01,400 --> 00:23:05,520 Speaker 1: very notably Daryl Cohen. They came on trying to tell 346 00:23:05,640 --> 00:23:08,359 Speaker 1: me he saw what he saw the knight of a murder. 347 00:23:08,760 --> 00:23:11,520 Speaker 1: I guess the defense did not count on me going 348 00:23:11,600 --> 00:23:15,359 Speaker 1: to the scene and pointing out that that point of 349 00:23:15,480 --> 00:23:20,000 Speaker 1: view was absolutely impossible because there's a thick hedge of 350 00:23:20,160 --> 00:23:25,720 Speaker 1: bushes about six feet tall between the eyewitness and the murder. 351 00:23:26,320 --> 00:23:30,520 Speaker 1: Impossible unless he flew over the hedge and looked down 352 00:23:30,800 --> 00:23:33,919 Speaker 1: to see the murder. So I don't believe any eyewitness 353 00:23:34,160 --> 00:23:38,000 Speaker 1: until they're tested by cross examination. As a matter of fact, 354 00:23:38,359 --> 00:23:41,960 Speaker 1: Daryl Cohen in the Black and White Letter of the Law, 355 00:23:42,400 --> 00:23:46,800 Speaker 1: eyewitnesses can be tested as to their vision, the lighting, 356 00:23:47,119 --> 00:23:49,800 Speaker 1: the distance at which they saw what they claimed to 357 00:23:49,920 --> 00:23:52,879 Speaker 1: have seen. I mean, it's laid out in black and 358 00:23:53,080 --> 00:23:57,600 Speaker 1: white how a so called eyewitness can be cross examined. 359 00:23:57,920 --> 00:24:00,680 Speaker 1: So I'd like to get ahold of those eyewitness myself 360 00:24:00,920 --> 00:24:03,800 Speaker 1: and see what's left of them after I've finish. I'd 361 00:24:03,840 --> 00:24:07,800 Speaker 1: like to know what these eyewitnesses have to say. I 362 00:24:07,880 --> 00:24:10,320 Speaker 1: would like to be able to cross examine them. I'm 363 00:24:10,359 --> 00:24:14,000 Speaker 1: with you, but let's assume their testimony is impeccable. It 364 00:24:14,200 --> 00:24:18,040 Speaker 1: doesn't stop the police. It doesn't stop the prosecutor the 365 00:24:18,200 --> 00:24:21,560 Speaker 1: courts from trying this guy. And if the statue of 366 00:24:21,600 --> 00:24:26,200 Speaker 1: limitations is running out, I would rather have some prosecutorial 367 00:24:26,680 --> 00:24:31,359 Speaker 1: time incarceration than nothing at all. And if somehow he 368 00:24:31,480 --> 00:24:33,920 Speaker 1: does this again, we'll get him. Explain what you're talking 369 00:24:33,960 --> 00:24:36,280 Speaker 1: about and I both know there are times we know 370 00:24:36,400 --> 00:24:39,160 Speaker 1: a person is guilty as a prosecutor, but we don't 371 00:24:39,200 --> 00:24:42,800 Speaker 1: have enough evidence, and the statue of limitations is running 372 00:24:43,680 --> 00:24:45,840 Speaker 1: in our country. Wouldn't have to worry about a murder 373 00:24:45,920 --> 00:24:50,280 Speaker 1: statue of limitations. It doesn't exist. But they're in Portugal, 374 00:24:50,440 --> 00:24:54,520 Speaker 1: it apparently does. So they can arrest him, they can 375 00:24:54,680 --> 00:24:57,960 Speaker 1: try him and keep him incarcerated and keep the case 376 00:24:58,119 --> 00:25:01,359 Speaker 1: running as long as possible, and if he is acquitted, 377 00:25:01,920 --> 00:25:06,280 Speaker 1: so be it. But he's got he's spent time in jail, 378 00:25:06,520 --> 00:25:11,560 Speaker 1: in prison, and also his name, his likeness, his face 379 00:25:11,760 --> 00:25:14,440 Speaker 1: is all over the media, all over the press, and 380 00:25:14,640 --> 00:25:16,960 Speaker 1: that's all he has to do is breathe again, and 381 00:25:17,119 --> 00:25:19,800 Speaker 1: they've got him for something else. Sometimes you have to 382 00:25:19,920 --> 00:25:23,560 Speaker 1: get even more than getting him the way you really 383 00:25:23,640 --> 00:25:26,920 Speaker 1: want to. Let me just say, officially, I don't know 384 00:25:27,000 --> 00:25:30,280 Speaker 1: what you're talking about. Charlie Langston joining us from dailymail 385 00:25:30,359 --> 00:25:35,359 Speaker 1: dot com. This guy is a child sex predator? What 386 00:25:36,240 --> 00:25:39,960 Speaker 1: is his record? Why has he been labeled already a 387 00:25:40,119 --> 00:25:43,840 Speaker 1: child six predator at the time he was skulking around 388 00:25:43,920 --> 00:25:46,920 Speaker 1: Maddie McCann's airbnb. I mean, this mount is not just 389 00:25:47,280 --> 00:25:50,240 Speaker 1: a child sex predator. He I mean he was described 390 00:25:50,640 --> 00:25:52,600 Speaker 1: by a woman he used to be in a relationship 391 00:25:52,680 --> 00:25:57,440 Speaker 1: with as a human pig. He has perpetrated so many 392 00:25:58,080 --> 00:26:02,560 Speaker 1: sex crimes against children against women, ranging in ages from 393 00:26:02,600 --> 00:26:05,560 Speaker 1: as you said, a seventy two year old American citizen 394 00:26:05,960 --> 00:26:09,840 Speaker 1: who he is understood to have raped in Portugal in 395 00:26:09,960 --> 00:26:12,879 Speaker 1: two thousand and five. Now he was not convicted of 396 00:26:12,960 --> 00:26:16,840 Speaker 1: that crime until twenty nineteen. He is currently serving a 397 00:26:17,000 --> 00:26:20,760 Speaker 1: jail sentence for that crime, seven year jail. Hold on, 398 00:26:20,800 --> 00:26:23,440 Speaker 1: hold on, you know what, Charlie, you know the fact 399 00:26:23,520 --> 00:26:25,360 Speaker 1: so well? Listening to us like Jenking when the fire 400 00:26:25,440 --> 00:26:28,119 Speaker 1: hydrant it's too much, too fast? Did you hear what 401 00:26:28,280 --> 00:26:32,080 Speaker 1: Charlie Linkson just said. This guy, Christian Brickner is just 402 00:26:32,400 --> 00:26:35,840 Speaker 1: now serving a seven year sentence on a two thousand 403 00:26:36,280 --> 00:26:42,560 Speaker 1: five rate of an elderly woman in Portugal, same place 404 00:26:42,840 --> 00:26:47,680 Speaker 1: is where Maddie was stolen. That's a seven year sentence 405 00:26:47,800 --> 00:26:51,200 Speaker 1: and he just now has started serving it. And it 406 00:26:51,359 --> 00:26:54,840 Speaker 1: started the event happened in two thousand and five. So 407 00:26:55,080 --> 00:26:59,480 Speaker 1: you've got that. Then you've got him being connected to 408 00:26:59,560 --> 00:27:03,919 Speaker 1: the rape of an Irish tour represented in two thousand 409 00:27:03,920 --> 00:27:08,359 Speaker 1: and four, exposing himself to children on a playground. But 410 00:27:08,480 --> 00:27:12,320 Speaker 1: there's another little girl where he was near her at 411 00:27:12,359 --> 00:27:14,720 Speaker 1: the time she goes missing. Is she looks so much 412 00:27:14,840 --> 00:27:17,960 Speaker 1: like Maddie? What about that case? So much so that 413 00:27:18,119 --> 00:27:22,240 Speaker 1: she was actually nicknamed German Maddie in the media. This 414 00:27:22,480 --> 00:27:25,280 Speaker 1: was in twenty sixteen, and this is actually the first 415 00:27:25,400 --> 00:27:30,840 Speaker 1: case that made people connect Christian Bruckner to the Maddie 416 00:27:30,920 --> 00:27:34,240 Speaker 1: mccan case, because the similarities between the two was so 417 00:27:34,480 --> 00:27:38,600 Speaker 1: astounding that it didn't seem plausible that he couldn't have 418 00:27:38,760 --> 00:27:41,520 Speaker 1: been connected to the Madeline mccan case. But it's not 419 00:27:41,760 --> 00:27:45,840 Speaker 1: until six years later that we're actually hearing for the 420 00:27:46,000 --> 00:27:48,320 Speaker 1: very first time that he's been named a suspect. Did 421 00:27:48,520 --> 00:27:52,040 Speaker 1: Angie hold the thought because I want to hear it, 422 00:27:52,320 --> 00:27:54,480 Speaker 1: but I want to analyze what you just said. Didra 423 00:27:54,560 --> 00:28:00,360 Speaker 1: Angie with me? Is renowned psychiatrist dicer Angela Arnold, doctor Jie. 424 00:28:00,480 --> 00:28:03,200 Speaker 1: I remember a case. You might remember it too, Daryl Cohen. 425 00:28:04,760 --> 00:28:07,760 Speaker 1: It's the case I tried this guy's serial killer. I 426 00:28:07,840 --> 00:28:13,359 Speaker 1: got him on one and his victim will forever be 427 00:28:13,920 --> 00:28:17,160 Speaker 1: a Jane Doe. She has never been identified. That's really 428 00:28:17,240 --> 00:28:19,520 Speaker 1: hard to prove that kind of case because you can't 429 00:28:19,600 --> 00:28:21,400 Speaker 1: if you don't know the victim. You don't know who 430 00:28:21,480 --> 00:28:24,280 Speaker 1: they hung out with, where they're from, who was their 431 00:28:24,359 --> 00:28:29,040 Speaker 1: last boyfriend. Anyway, she's found strangled, rape out in a field. 432 00:28:30,560 --> 00:28:34,600 Speaker 1: Long story short, I got a bead on the purp, 433 00:28:35,359 --> 00:28:38,480 Speaker 1: so I started looking for people that knew the Purp. 434 00:28:38,800 --> 00:28:42,479 Speaker 1: I found his girlfriend, the mother of his child, who 435 00:28:42,600 --> 00:28:46,400 Speaker 1: had kicked him out for trying to strangle her. I 436 00:28:46,600 --> 00:28:50,280 Speaker 1: found another woman he tried to strangle in the Fulton Nose. 437 00:28:50,360 --> 00:28:54,360 Speaker 1: She was in the Gwnette County jail, Daryl. I had 438 00:28:54,400 --> 00:28:58,240 Speaker 1: a reconstructionist draw the picture of what the dead victim 439 00:28:58,280 --> 00:29:02,600 Speaker 1: would have looked like in life. Guess who she looked like? 440 00:29:03,360 --> 00:29:08,120 Speaker 1: Almost identically. They looked like twins his girlfriend that had 441 00:29:08,200 --> 00:29:11,960 Speaker 1: rejected him and thrown him out of the house. And 442 00:29:12,080 --> 00:29:15,200 Speaker 1: I put those two pictures, those two sketches, up in 443 00:29:15,320 --> 00:29:19,640 Speaker 1: front of the jury and argued, who would have killed 444 00:29:20,000 --> 00:29:24,400 Speaker 1: this woman other than the man who was rejected by 445 00:29:24,520 --> 00:29:29,440 Speaker 1: this woman? Did you hear what Charlie Lankson just said? 446 00:29:29,880 --> 00:29:35,520 Speaker 1: The German Maddie looks just like Maddie McCann, Doctor Angie, 447 00:29:36,120 --> 00:29:39,080 Speaker 1: what about it that? See? The fact of the matter is, 448 00:29:39,640 --> 00:29:42,480 Speaker 1: I don't understand why all of this information is being 449 00:29:42,560 --> 00:29:46,440 Speaker 1: ignored because we have known for a very long time 450 00:29:46,880 --> 00:29:52,920 Speaker 1: that unfortunately, sexual predators do not change their stripes, and 451 00:29:53,080 --> 00:29:57,280 Speaker 1: they will continue and continue their behavior until they are stopped, 452 00:29:57,600 --> 00:29:59,840 Speaker 1: which is why in the United States we have sexual 453 00:30:00,080 --> 00:30:02,760 Speaker 1: predator list that we put them on Nancy, they are 454 00:30:04,040 --> 00:30:08,920 Speaker 1: they are incapable of being rehabilitated. Doctor, and everything you 455 00:30:09,040 --> 00:30:12,080 Speaker 1: just said is correct, but that is not responsive to 456 00:30:12,160 --> 00:30:16,240 Speaker 1: the question I asked. I asked you about the physical 457 00:30:16,400 --> 00:30:21,480 Speaker 1: similarities in victims. Why the perpetrators do that, because they're 458 00:30:21,640 --> 00:30:26,640 Speaker 1: they're playing out their fantasy, whatever it is, they're playing 459 00:30:26,680 --> 00:30:29,040 Speaker 1: it out through another person that looks just like that person. 460 00:30:29,720 --> 00:30:33,320 Speaker 1: It's it's it's right out there, Nancy. It's it's simple. 461 00:30:33,840 --> 00:30:36,560 Speaker 1: We're not looking for a zebra. They are acting it 462 00:30:36,640 --> 00:30:39,480 Speaker 1: out on someone who looks just like the other person. 463 00:30:39,680 --> 00:30:43,000 Speaker 1: They're acting out that that violent fantasy that they have, 464 00:30:43,520 --> 00:30:49,240 Speaker 1: their aggressions, their control. This is all about control also, Nancy. Okay, 465 00:30:49,680 --> 00:31:13,400 Speaker 1: let's remember that crime stories with Nancy Grace to Daryl Cohen, Darryl. 466 00:31:13,480 --> 00:31:16,040 Speaker 1: It's what we call in the law, a similar transaction. 467 00:31:16,800 --> 00:31:19,800 Speaker 1: And when you can show it's a fingerprint crime like 468 00:31:20,280 --> 00:31:26,280 Speaker 1: another little girl the same age, with strikingly similar physical attribute, 469 00:31:26,400 --> 00:31:30,600 Speaker 1: stolen in the same way, raped and murdered that way, 470 00:31:31,080 --> 00:31:34,520 Speaker 1: at least in this country, that evidence can come in. Normally, 471 00:31:34,600 --> 00:31:37,880 Speaker 1: under the constitution, a defendant cannot have past crimes or 472 00:31:37,920 --> 00:31:40,600 Speaker 1: bad acts come before a jury because they're to be 473 00:31:40,680 --> 00:31:42,720 Speaker 1: judged on on their reputation or their pastor on that 474 00:31:43,040 --> 00:31:46,760 Speaker 1: particular case. But when the cases they're so similar, they 475 00:31:46,880 --> 00:31:51,080 Speaker 1: are allowed explain. When they are similar transactions, the girls 476 00:31:51,200 --> 00:31:54,840 Speaker 1: look alike, the crime is probably similar, if not the same, 477 00:31:55,440 --> 00:31:58,280 Speaker 1: then you can in this country at least you can 478 00:31:58,600 --> 00:32:02,200 Speaker 1: enter that into evidence, can have the triers of fact. 479 00:32:02,320 --> 00:32:06,440 Speaker 1: The judge, the jury listen to it and pay attention 480 00:32:06,520 --> 00:32:10,560 Speaker 1: to it because it is exactly the same. You just 481 00:32:10,880 --> 00:32:15,960 Speaker 1: transpose one person for another, but the circumstances are the same, 482 00:32:16,280 --> 00:32:20,560 Speaker 1: so that is absolutely admissible here. I cannot speak for Portugal. 483 00:32:20,680 --> 00:32:24,680 Speaker 1: I am sorry, Charlie Langston. It has been reported that 484 00:32:24,800 --> 00:32:31,000 Speaker 1: prosecutors are quote one hundred sure that Christian Bruckner is 485 00:32:31,120 --> 00:32:35,280 Speaker 1: the part that took Maddie. Why now, and what do 486 00:32:35,400 --> 00:32:37,880 Speaker 1: you think the evidence is? I mean, I think the 487 00:32:38,000 --> 00:32:44,400 Speaker 1: evidence is all circumstantial in terms of he is just 488 00:32:44,720 --> 00:32:49,960 Speaker 1: a truly horrendous man who has perpetrated crime after crime 489 00:32:50,040 --> 00:32:54,480 Speaker 1: after crime against women and children. He has a history 490 00:32:54,960 --> 00:32:58,880 Speaker 1: of perpetrating crimes exactly like that one in the Maddie 491 00:32:58,960 --> 00:33:02,239 Speaker 1: McCann case. Now we said earlier it wasn't his moo 492 00:33:02,440 --> 00:33:07,200 Speaker 1: typically to you know, murder one of his victims. However, 493 00:33:07,760 --> 00:33:11,360 Speaker 1: I think it's important to remember the media farraw around 494 00:33:11,440 --> 00:33:15,960 Speaker 1: this case was so extraordinary that there would have been 495 00:33:16,520 --> 00:33:20,880 Speaker 1: no way for someone to perpetrate this crime and not 496 00:33:22,800 --> 00:33:25,440 Speaker 1: be charged with it. Had she returned to her parents, 497 00:33:25,800 --> 00:33:29,360 Speaker 1: had she been found, had the police managed to track 498 00:33:29,440 --> 00:33:32,160 Speaker 1: her down in one way or another, there's no way 499 00:33:32,600 --> 00:33:35,840 Speaker 1: that the person who committed this crime wouldn't have been found. 500 00:33:36,240 --> 00:33:41,400 Speaker 1: So I think tragically, While I understand how important it 501 00:33:41,600 --> 00:33:44,000 Speaker 1: was to her parents to call attention to this case, 502 00:33:44,600 --> 00:33:48,960 Speaker 1: I think the enormous public interest in it may well 503 00:33:49,440 --> 00:33:53,400 Speaker 1: have sealed Maddie's death, and that, to me is the 504 00:33:53,480 --> 00:33:56,160 Speaker 1: most horrendous thing about this. It took the police so 505 00:33:56,360 --> 00:34:01,800 Speaker 1: long to begin properly investigating this case that Maddie could 506 00:34:01,840 --> 00:34:04,960 Speaker 1: have survived had they actually pulled the sox up and 507 00:34:05,120 --> 00:34:07,000 Speaker 1: gotten on with things in the you know, from the 508 00:34:07,040 --> 00:34:09,359 Speaker 1: get go. I understand what you're saying if she has 509 00:34:09,400 --> 00:34:12,480 Speaker 1: still been alive, but Greg Smith joining us a special 510 00:34:12,560 --> 00:34:16,839 Speaker 1: Deputy sheriff, the reality is when children are taken at 511 00:34:16,960 --> 00:34:21,040 Speaker 1: this age, typically they are killed within the first seventy 512 00:34:21,080 --> 00:34:24,319 Speaker 1: six hours. Yeah, absolutely, Nancy, that's uh, I mean, that's 513 00:34:24,360 --> 00:34:28,960 Speaker 1: the modus operandi for for young children. You know, and 514 00:34:29,520 --> 00:34:32,440 Speaker 1: and I don't know that media attention is a bad thing. Um, 515 00:34:33,560 --> 00:34:38,120 Speaker 1: maybe a double edged sword. But Kelsey's case had a 516 00:34:38,360 --> 00:34:40,600 Speaker 1: heck of a lot of media attention. We were on 517 00:34:40,680 --> 00:34:44,440 Speaker 1: every news outlet in the United States and even international. Um. 518 00:34:44,680 --> 00:34:47,319 Speaker 1: And while Kelsey didn't come home alive, she came home. 519 00:34:47,400 --> 00:34:51,279 Speaker 1: We found her. Now I'm thinking about what you're saying, guys. Uh, 520 00:34:52,320 --> 00:34:55,600 Speaker 1: for those of you just joining us, an official suspect 521 00:34:55,840 --> 00:34:59,560 Speaker 1: has finally been named in the disappearance of a three 522 00:34:59,680 --> 00:35:02,960 Speaker 1: year old little girl, Maddie McCann. Take a listen to 523 00:35:03,040 --> 00:35:06,799 Speaker 1: our cut twenty eight our friend alson Roberts. Yesterday they 524 00:35:06,880 --> 00:35:12,600 Speaker 1: issued a statement saying that on Wednesday an individual had 525 00:35:12,680 --> 00:35:16,480 Speaker 1: been named as an official suspect. That was an international 526 00:35:16,880 --> 00:35:20,960 Speaker 1: request from Portugal to the German authorities to inform that 527 00:35:21,160 --> 00:35:23,800 Speaker 1: person of interest that they had been made an official suspect. 528 00:35:24,160 --> 00:35:26,920 Speaker 1: As your previous interview, he said, this is always a 529 00:35:27,000 --> 00:35:30,200 Speaker 1: significant step because it means effectively that someone is being 530 00:35:30,280 --> 00:35:33,160 Speaker 1: or will soon be questioned under caution. That's the same 531 00:35:33,239 --> 00:35:36,200 Speaker 1: questions maybe put that could incriminate them, which gives them 532 00:35:36,280 --> 00:35:39,240 Speaker 1: the right not to answer. Of course, so it's actually 533 00:35:39,280 --> 00:35:42,320 Speaker 1: a status to protect that individual, but it is always 534 00:35:42,320 --> 00:35:45,719 Speaker 1: significant as it's a necessary prelude to charges at some point, 535 00:35:45,760 --> 00:35:48,960 Speaker 1: although there is no sign of that just yet, no 536 00:35:49,200 --> 00:35:52,920 Speaker 1: sign of official charges after he has been named a suspect. 537 00:35:53,160 --> 00:35:55,160 Speaker 1: What does that mean, Charlie. He has been named an 538 00:35:55,200 --> 00:35:59,600 Speaker 1: official suspect, so why won't charges naturally follow? Well? What 539 00:35:59,719 --> 00:36:03,120 Speaker 1: I think is the next most obvious step is that 540 00:36:03,200 --> 00:36:07,520 Speaker 1: he will be extradited from Germany to Portugal, and that 541 00:36:07,840 --> 00:36:10,759 Speaker 1: is when charges may well be brought against him. But 542 00:36:11,480 --> 00:36:13,680 Speaker 1: right now I think what is going on behind the 543 00:36:13,760 --> 00:36:18,000 Speaker 1: scenes is that Portuguese authorities, in conjunction with German authorities, 544 00:36:18,120 --> 00:36:21,839 Speaker 1: are scrambling to try and get as much evidence as 545 00:36:21,920 --> 00:36:26,279 Speaker 1: humanly possible, to try and get some witnesses who will 546 00:36:26,320 --> 00:36:29,279 Speaker 1: come forward and at least say I saw him at 547 00:36:29,320 --> 00:36:31,800 Speaker 1: this place, I saw him here. I know that he 548 00:36:32,160 --> 00:36:36,279 Speaker 1: is a sex offender, whatever it may be. And right 549 00:36:36,360 --> 00:36:39,480 Speaker 1: now I think the most important thing is that he 550 00:36:40,000 --> 00:36:43,120 Speaker 1: has been named as a suspect again, the first official 551 00:36:43,200 --> 00:36:47,960 Speaker 1: suspect in fifteen years, which marks at least a step 552 00:36:48,120 --> 00:36:51,320 Speaker 1: forward in a case that has been dragging on for 553 00:36:51,480 --> 00:36:55,319 Speaker 1: more than a decade. Now. Surelie, were Maddy's parents ever 554 00:36:55,560 --> 00:36:59,760 Speaker 1: named official suspects. Yes, they were named as official persons 555 00:36:59,800 --> 00:37:04,239 Speaker 1: of interest way back in two thousand and seven, and interestingly, 556 00:37:05,640 --> 00:37:08,640 Speaker 1: at the time they had a huge amount of public 557 00:37:08,719 --> 00:37:12,360 Speaker 1: criticism aimed at them. They were accused of neglect. Portuguese 558 00:37:12,400 --> 00:37:16,440 Speaker 1: authorities suspected that Madeleine had died in a tragic accident 559 00:37:16,560 --> 00:37:18,680 Speaker 1: in the apartment that her parents had then tried to 560 00:37:18,760 --> 00:37:23,359 Speaker 1: cover up. Now. They stopped being official suspects in two 561 00:37:23,440 --> 00:37:28,000 Speaker 1: thousand and eight when Portuguese authorities dropped the case completely 562 00:37:28,400 --> 00:37:31,560 Speaker 1: because there was a lack of evidence. Ever since then, 563 00:37:32,120 --> 00:37:35,080 Speaker 1: not a single official suspect has been named until now. 564 00:37:35,320 --> 00:37:38,720 Speaker 1: Take listen to a twenty nine our friend Martin Brant. 565 00:37:39,040 --> 00:37:42,359 Speaker 1: It's hardly been a secret. The German drifter has been 566 00:37:42,440 --> 00:37:45,480 Speaker 1: the main suspect in the Madeline McCann case for three 567 00:37:45,640 --> 00:37:50,160 Speaker 1: years or more, but now it's official. Christian b is 568 00:37:50,239 --> 00:37:55,080 Speaker 1: suspected of abducting and killing Madeline. German prosecutors are leading 569 00:37:55,160 --> 00:37:59,080 Speaker 1: the investigation but haven't charged him. The British girl was 570 00:37:59,160 --> 00:38:02,640 Speaker 1: three when she vanished from the family's holiday apartment in 571 00:38:02,840 --> 00:38:07,359 Speaker 1: Portugal in two thousand and seven, fifteen years ago. This week, 572 00:38:07,520 --> 00:38:11,239 Speaker 1: the suspect had visitors to the German prison where he's 573 00:38:11,280 --> 00:38:15,759 Speaker 1: serving a rape sentence. He was told that Portuguese prosecutors 574 00:38:15,920 --> 00:38:20,000 Speaker 1: had made him an arguido, a formal suspect. He was 575 00:38:20,120 --> 00:38:23,600 Speaker 1: questioned for the first time but refused to answer. That's 576 00:38:23,600 --> 00:38:28,560 Speaker 1: really lengthen being named a formal suspect there in that jurisdiction. 577 00:38:29,600 --> 00:38:33,759 Speaker 1: That's the first time cups could question him, yes, the 578 00:38:33,920 --> 00:38:38,200 Speaker 1: first time, and he remained entirely silent throughout. He refused 579 00:38:38,239 --> 00:38:43,160 Speaker 1: to answer a single question. But interestingly, a woman that 580 00:38:43,280 --> 00:38:46,960 Speaker 1: he was in a relationship with previously, she came forward 581 00:38:47,040 --> 00:38:50,080 Speaker 1: last week and she said that he told her in 582 00:38:50,239 --> 00:38:54,680 Speaker 1: twenty thirteen, I know what happened to little Maddie. She 583 00:38:54,920 --> 00:38:58,320 Speaker 1: also suggested that he may have been the abductor, the abuser, 584 00:38:58,400 --> 00:39:02,200 Speaker 1: and that he may have passed Maddie off to someone else. 585 00:39:02,719 --> 00:39:06,960 Speaker 1: So there are still an extraordinary number of questions surrounding 586 00:39:07,040 --> 00:39:10,160 Speaker 1: this case. However, the mere fact that he's been named 587 00:39:10,200 --> 00:39:14,120 Speaker 1: as an official suspect. I really can't overstate what a 588 00:39:14,280 --> 00:39:18,719 Speaker 1: key step forward that is in this case, especially given 589 00:39:18,800 --> 00:39:21,799 Speaker 1: that he's only the third person when you look at 590 00:39:21,880 --> 00:39:25,120 Speaker 1: Kate and Jerry McCann, only the third official suspect to 591 00:39:25,239 --> 00:39:29,440 Speaker 1: ever be named by Portuguese authorities. Will there be justice 592 00:39:29,480 --> 00:39:34,080 Speaker 1: for Mannie McCann. We wait as justice spools. Nancy Grace 593 00:39:34,120 --> 00:39:35,160 Speaker 1: Cramb story signing off