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Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Greece.

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Speaker 2: Three people did, Three innocent people did, two of them sisters.

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Speaker 2: Two others left in critical condition in the hospital because

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Speaker 2: a guy named Gregory Black was out walking free on

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Speaker 2: probation in a murder case, slammed into them around one

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Speaker 2: hundred mph and killed them. You know what, there's just

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Speaker 2: so many different directions to go right here. I hardly

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Speaker 2: know where to start. Probation and murder that's one place

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Speaker 2: to start. But even if that weren't true, this guy

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Speaker 2: already has at least three felony convictions that we know

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Speaker 2: of and eleven priors. Even if he wasn't out on

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Speaker 2: probation for murder, He's got a wrap sheet as long

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Speaker 2: as my arm, and he's out walking free amongst innocent people.

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Speaker 2: And now three are dead and two are in critical condition,

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Speaker 2: rushed to the hospital fighting for their lives.

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Speaker 3: Why why is this happening?

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Speaker 2: I know this is a tired old phrase, But we

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Speaker 2: can put a man on the moon, we can't perform

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Speaker 2: all sorts of amazing technological feats, but we can't keep

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Speaker 2: violent offenders behind bars. Is it really that hard? I'm

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Speaker 2: Nancy Grace. This is Crime Stories. Thanks for being with

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Speaker 2: us here at Vox Nation in series exem one eleven.

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Speaker 2: You think it's hard, well ask the family of Kimberly

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Speaker 2: or Veronica?

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Speaker 3: Are Wevlen?

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Speaker 2: Ask the family of Michelle Lee with a broken neck,

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Speaker 2: mister Lopez, Kimberly, Oh wait, don't ask them because they

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Speaker 2: can't answer, because Kimberly, Wevelen, and Veronica are all dead.

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Speaker 2: What happened? Take a listen to our friends at Fox eleven.

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Speaker 4: The five people inside this black Honda Accord, an uber

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Speaker 4: driver and her four passengers, didn't.

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Speaker 1: Stand a chance.

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Speaker 4: The car t BoNT The impact so great one of

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Speaker 4: the young women who died was ejected.

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Speaker 5: The suspect was traveling northbound on Vermont Avenue when he

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Speaker 5: collided with the victims vehicle, an Uber with five occupants inside.

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Speaker 5: The suspect was speeding, going about eighty five ninety miles

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Speaker 5: per hour.

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Speaker 3: He blew through a red light and then t boned

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Speaker 3: the uber.

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Speaker 5: According to the LAPD, he was blowing through several red lights,

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Speaker 5: so it's possible he was trying to flee from something.

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Speaker 5: We also learned he has an extensive criminal history, including

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Speaker 5: three felony convictions and a misdemeanor conviction.

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Speaker 4: Three young women dead to other people seriously injured after

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Speaker 4: a high speed crash caused by one man, say police,

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Speaker 4: the driver of this white Mercedes, who detectives say was

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Speaker 4: not only speeding but also ran a red light.

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Speaker 6: He passes his vehicles that are stopped at the red

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Speaker 6: light into the turn lanes and goes around and strikes

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Speaker 6: the victims. And you're talking about going about eighty five

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Speaker 6: ninety miles or at.

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Speaker 2: Least other estimates placing him at one hundred mph flying

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Speaker 2: down the street and his white Mercedes, a gang member

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Speaker 2: with a rap sheet. As long as I seventy five,

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Speaker 2: that's what I know. With me and all start panel

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Speaker 2: to make sense of what we know right now. First

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Speaker 2: to senior investigative reporter with Dailymail dot Com. That's when

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Speaker 2: I first found out about this case. Kaitlin Becker is

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Speaker 2: joining us. This is your neck of the woods, Kitlin Becker.

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Speaker 2: What happened?

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Speaker 7: Yes it is. It actually happened not too far from

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Speaker 7: the Daily Mail office. It was shortly before five point

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Speaker 7: thirty in the morning. You have a group of three.

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Speaker 7: You've a group of three girls and one guy.

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Speaker 8: Friends.

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Speaker 7: They were coming back from a concert. They were doing

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Speaker 7: the responsible thing. And not driving, and they waiting to

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Speaker 7: a Sources say that they were waiting to make a

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Speaker 7: turn and a white Mercedes came barreling down the street

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Speaker 7: t boned. Then the force was so hard that the

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Speaker 7: Uber spun something like five times, and then the Mercedes

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Speaker 7: and the driver, this guy Black and Gregory Black ended

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Speaker 7: up basically crashing into the median and those three young

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Speaker 7: girls were pronounced dead on the scene.

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Speaker 3: Okay, you just gave me so much information, Caitlin.

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Speaker 2: I want to understand who these victims are. And I'm

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Speaker 2: looking at them right now, and they're beautiful.

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Speaker 3: Did you say they were coming home from a concert,

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Speaker 3: So it was late at night.

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Speaker 2: Let's say twenty three, twenty three, twenty seven.

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Speaker 3: Those are some of the victims.

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Speaker 7: Twenty three and twenty seven. Kimberly and Veronica at worked

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Speaker 7: twenty seven and twenty three and are actually sisters, and

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Speaker 7: Juvelyn was They're another twenty three year old, their childhood

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Speaker 7: best friend. So they were just out for a good

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Speaker 7: fun night. And these were bright girls.

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Speaker 3: When you say there were bright girls, what do you

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Speaker 3: mean by that.

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Speaker 7: Kimberly had just graduated from nursing school. Nancy, she was

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Speaker 7: involved in her dance team. She was a smart, dedicated student.

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Speaker 7: And then her sister, Veronica, has a BS in wildlife conservation,

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Speaker 7: did a kind of volunteer work with the Redwoods, and

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Speaker 7: had actually recently gotten a job with Orange County with

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Speaker 7: the county working with animals, and she was really just

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Speaker 7: getting started in that side of her career. I mean,

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Speaker 7: these these girls were doing amazing things. Me and you're

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Speaker 7: talking about conservation in nursing, two of the most selfless

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Speaker 7: jobs they could possibly think of.

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Speaker 2: Guys, I've got such an awesome panel joining me right now.

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Speaker 2: I want to go to doctor Michelle Duprie, not only

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Speaker 2: longtime colleague, but friend. You remember Dr Duprie, She's shot

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Speaker 2: to fame during the Alex Murdog case.

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Speaker 3: That's her.

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Speaker 2: Billywick, Columbia, South Carolina, former forensic pathologist, medical examiner and

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Speaker 2: lucky for me, detective author of money, Mischief, Murder, the

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Speaker 2: Murdog saga. The rest of the story that's coming out

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Speaker 2: this month. You know, I can't wait to read that.

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Speaker 2: But before I get back on Alex Murdog, who will

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Speaker 2: right in hell, doctor Michelle dupri did you hear what

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Speaker 2: Caitlin Becker from Daily mil just said have you ever.

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Speaker 3: You performed thousands of autopsies.

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Speaker 2: I've prosecuted or investigated literally thousands of cases.

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Speaker 3: When you're looking at.

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Speaker 2: Somebody on that homicide, on that autopsy table after homicide,

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Speaker 2: do you ever wonder why is it that really.

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Speaker 3: Good, pure people.

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Speaker 2: Get murdered or mistreated by predators, I mean like hyenas, coyotes.

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Speaker 3: Wolves, that's what these perps are.

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Speaker 2: And then the dichotomy of the evil nature of the

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Speaker 2: defendant in the sweet, kind, gentle loving nature of the victims.

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Speaker 3: It's sometimes like a kick in the teeth.

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Speaker 9: Absolutely, Nancy. Sometimes it appears that there's no justice, and

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Speaker 9: I've seen it more often than I want for sure.

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Speaker 9: The innocent people sometimes are the victims. It just happens.

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Speaker 3: I know, it just happens.

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Speaker 2: But guess what, doctor dupree, it didn't have to happen

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Speaker 2: in this case. You were hearing our friends at Fox

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Speaker 2: eleven as well as KTLA talking about what happened that

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Speaker 2: night with me, a very well known senior forensic engineer

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Speaker 2: accident reconstructionist at Veritech Consulting Engineering.

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Speaker 3: You can find them as did.

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Speaker 2: We at Veritech eng for engineering dot com. Joseph Tremblay Joseph,

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Speaker 2: thank you for being with us.

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Speaker 3: Man, what a scene. What did this guy do?

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Speaker 2: I've heard estimates between eighty five and one hundred mph,

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Speaker 2: But there is a way to determine exactly what happened

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Speaker 2: that's correct.

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Speaker 10: And one thing that is going to be made readily

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Speaker 10: available is the speed of both vehicles. There's a lot

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Speaker 10: of ways to do that, but fortunately for vehicles that

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Speaker 10: are newer, that speed data is actually recorded on the

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Speaker 10: vehicle itself during an impact, and that's something that the

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Speaker 10: investigators are going to look into when they go through

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Speaker 10: their investigation.

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Speaker 2: Here, to my understanding, the victims were parked at a

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Speaker 2: red light, so they're not going to have any momentum

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Speaker 2: at all. They're sitting at a red light in an uber,

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Speaker 2: just having gone to a concert. These three girls together,

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Speaker 2: two sisters and their childhood best friend.

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Speaker 3: They're in their twenties. They're sitting there at a red.

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Speaker 2: Light, not moving, when this guy comes flying around them

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Speaker 2: at estimates up to one hundred mph.

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Speaker 3: And I don't believe.

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Speaker 2: You know a lot of times acts of reconstructionists use

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Speaker 2: skid marks and it helps them determine what really happened,

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Speaker 2: Like how long are the skid marks, how far away

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Speaker 2: the skin marks from the crash.

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Speaker 3: I don't know that we're even going to have any.

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Speaker 2: Skin marks in this case, Joseph, because I don't think

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Speaker 2: this guy ever touched the brakes.

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Speaker 10: I agree, I don't think he did either. And honestly,

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Speaker 10: there are some other pieces of evidence that are going

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Speaker 10: to be really important for this investigation. There is, I believe,

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Speaker 10: a surveillance footage that captured this impact, at least some

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Speaker 10: of it, not all of the details. But one thing

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Speaker 10: they're going to want to look at when the police

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Speaker 10: do their investigation is whether or not any of the

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Speaker 10: physical evidence that it was left at the scene is

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Speaker 10: pertinent to this investigation. But the fact that this ubercar

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Speaker 10: was either stopped or moving very slowly. You know, they

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Speaker 10: were just traveling through this intersection on a legal green light.

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Speaker 10: And then the impact itself occurred when the Mercedes failed

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Speaker 10: to yield for the green light through on a red

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Speaker 10: light and then contacted the left rear corner of that

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Speaker 10: uber vehicle, causing it to spend.

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Speaker 2: Spinning it around just on that one impact five times,

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Speaker 2: hitting the vehicle so hard. One of the ladies, one

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Speaker 2: of the young girls, actually ejected as they're saying it

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Speaker 2: flew out of the car.

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Speaker 1: Crime stories with Nancy Grace.

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Speaker 2: Guys, we've got a renowned accident as he calls it crash,

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Speaker 2: as I call it reconstructionist. But also with me is

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Speaker 2: Mike McCormick, also from this jurisdiction, owner and lead investigator

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Speaker 2: of mcm Investigations in LA, former LAPD over twenty five

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Speaker 2: years working gangs for five years of that.

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Speaker 3: That ain't a picnic working gangs in LA.

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Speaker 2: I'm surprised you're even alive, Mike McCormick, and you can

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Speaker 2: find them at mcminvestigations dot com. Okay, enough about you,

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Speaker 2: let's talk about murder. When Joseph Tremblay correctly says they're

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Speaker 2: going to look at physical evidence of the same, I

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Speaker 2: think that's going to mean if there are any skid marks,

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Speaker 2: surveillance video, which there's a lot of that in LA

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Speaker 2: and really everywhere now, such as red light cams, corner cams,

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Speaker 2: business cam surveillance videos, and not only that, dash cams.

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Speaker 2: This is an Uber car that was destroyed by Gregory Black.

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Speaker 2: You know they've got a dash cam going. There's gonna

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Speaker 2: be a plethora of cam surveillance camera proof. But but

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Speaker 2: you're also going to look at the angles in which

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Speaker 2: the car was hit. You're going to look for pieces

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Speaker 2: of metal, for pieces of brake lights. All of that

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Speaker 2: is going to be physical evidence to help us reconstruct

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Speaker 2: what happened. Bottom line, I don't really need all that

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Speaker 2: because I know I got three dead girls, three two sisters,

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Speaker 2: one best friend who's sitting at a red light in

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Speaker 2: an uber waiting, and this guy with a wrap sheet

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Speaker 2: out my rear end comes flying down at one hundred mph.

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Speaker 2: I mean, what more to you, Mike McCormick of mcm Investigations.

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Speaker 2: What else are you going to look for? Do I

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Speaker 2: need anything more than that? I think I could take

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Speaker 2: that to you, Jerry Nancy.

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Speaker 8: You really don't need much more than that. There's gonna

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Speaker 8: be a plethora of video.

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Speaker 3: Foot I just said that.

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Speaker 2: I threw out my big word plethora, and you totally

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Speaker 2: stole it. Don't think I don't know what you just did.

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Speaker 2: But go ahead.

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Speaker 8: Anyways, there's footage of him traveling at a high rate

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Speaker 8: of speed and blowing through red lights prior to this accident.

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Speaker 3: Okay, hey, Mike McCormick, are you sitting down?

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Speaker 11: Yes?

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Speaker 2: I am, Well, you may need to lay down after this,

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Speaker 2: take a listen to our friends at Fox eleven and KTLA, so.

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Speaker 6: That for these families who don't know yet who we're

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Speaker 6: working on trying to make contact with, that their loved

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Speaker 6: ones are gone, and you know, it's something that we

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Speaker 6: all do every day just driving. These people had the

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Speaker 6: right of way, they were going through a green light.

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Speaker 5: And LAPD detectives with the South Traffic Bureau here they

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Speaker 5: announced the charges against the suspect. We now know his

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Speaker 5: name Gregory Black, thirty one years old and a well

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Speaker 5: known gang member in the city of Los Angeles. According

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Speaker 5: to the LAPD, on August twenty sixth, the day of

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Speaker 5: the accident, he was out on probation for a previous

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Speaker 5: murder conviction.

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Speaker 12: What's adding to the family's anguish is the news that,

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Speaker 12: according to police, the suspect was on probation and connection

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Speaker 12: with a twenty twenty murder d having this white Mercedes

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Speaker 12: more than one hundred miles per hour through red lights

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Speaker 12: as it smashed into the black Honda the women were

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Speaker 12: ubering in. Greg Black is his name, thirty one years old,

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Speaker 12: described by detectives as a gang member with quote a

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Speaker 12: checkered past.

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Speaker 6: Eleven bookings phony bookings, in which three he's been convicted on.

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Speaker 6: I was the eleven. He's had four misimiter.

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Speaker 2: Bookings, including being on probation on murder. Now even scarier.

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Speaker 2: Back to Mike McCormick joining us not only lead investigator

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Speaker 2: mcm Investigations, but worked gangs. When I hear gang member

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Speaker 2: a lot of people, and I might think that's cool,

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Speaker 2: but every time I had anything to do with gangs,

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Speaker 2: it was a murder, horrible murders. I remember one gang case.

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Speaker 2: It was the Doom gang held I think the victim

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Speaker 2: was thirteen or fourteen, held her upside down and put

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Speaker 2: her on her head in an ice chest full of

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Speaker 2: ice cold water and drowned her dead. When she was

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Speaker 2: drowned being held upside down by her breasts, as I

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Speaker 2: recall it, they threw her body down and said go

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Speaker 2: to Hell and tell them Doom sent you. Okay, drink

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Speaker 2: that in for a moment, Oh yes. And then the

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Speaker 2: last DP case I was working on before I left

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Speaker 2: the court TV, there are two rival gangs. Of course

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Speaker 2: there's rival gangs, but the girlfriends of the rival gangs

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Speaker 2: were mad at each other over some clothes. Clothing clots clothes.

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Speaker 2: So they got their boyfriends, the gang members, to throw

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Speaker 2: molotov cocktails into the other side's town home, knowing that

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Speaker 2: there were two infants and their.

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Speaker 3: Layup beds, their little baby beds.

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Speaker 2: And when they threw the molotovs, which immediately on fire

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Speaker 2: in the chalk baby's bedrooms, they said, let's fry them babies.

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Speaker 3: That's what I'm talking about.

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Speaker 2: So, Mike McCormick, when I hear very well known gang member,

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Speaker 2: ain't nothing good about that?

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Speaker 3: What does that mean?

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Speaker 2: Very well, No, not just a gang member, but a

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Speaker 2: very well known gang member.

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Speaker 8: Oh, that usually means that he's been in and out

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Speaker 8: of Jeral numerous times, has numerous contacts with law enforcement,

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Speaker 8: and usually is an extremely violent individual.

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Speaker 2: Kaylan Becker, have you looked at these girls? Have you

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Speaker 2: looked at Evlyn that smile.

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Speaker 7: Mile her gimbles.

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Speaker 3: I don't know if you remember the old Gidget movies.

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Speaker 3: Does anybody remember them?

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Speaker 2: But me, this looks like Gidget. It's just like Gidget,

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Speaker 2: that big, beautiful smile. And then look at Kimberly, totally glamorous.

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Speaker 2: She's kind of got almost off the shoulder, but not

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Speaker 2: quite like a satin evening dress or blouse on, and

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Speaker 2: her hair as all wavy down the side on one

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Speaker 2: side of her shoulder. Absolutely stunning. I just I want

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Speaker 2: to cry, Caitlin, my daughter and son, of course they're twins,

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Speaker 2: are fifteen. These girls are just a little bit older

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Speaker 2: than my John, David and Lucy, and this guy space

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Speaker 2: through three red lights and kills them.

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Speaker 7: The hole that this loss has left in their family

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Speaker 7: is just impossible to understand. Several of their relatives have

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Speaker 7: spoken to the media and they're just it's just a

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Speaker 7: gut punch. Kimberly and Veronica were actually one of seven children,

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Speaker 7: so they've got brothers and sisters. They were described as

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Speaker 7: great big sisters who would take their siblings to get

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Speaker 7: Starbuck because theydn't get something to eat. They just seemed

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Speaker 7: like this very just close knit, wonderful family, and they'd

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Speaker 7: been friends with Weblin for years and years and years

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Speaker 7: and anty. We also have to remember that in the

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Speaker 7: front seat passenger seat, another friend of theirs was there

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Speaker 7: as well, and he was terribly injured but survived. So

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Speaker 7: now you also have a survivor of this group and

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Speaker 7: of this tragedy that has to live with that moving

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Speaker 7: forward and just knowing that the person who did this,

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Speaker 7: there were plenty of opportunities for this person who have

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Speaker 7: been put behind bars for any number any number of crimes,

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Speaker 7: and maybe wouldn't have been on the road that night.

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Speaker 3: Gosh Cyclist Nower cut seven from title.

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Speaker 5: This tragic accident took the lives of three innocent people.

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Speaker 1: To them sisters.

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Speaker 5: The three women were passengers in an uber when the

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Speaker 5: suspects Mercedes ran that red light and collided with their car.

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Speaker 5: The impact was so strong that the vehicle spun around

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Speaker 5: five time times before coming to a stomp. The uber driver,

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Speaker 5: a thirty eight year old woman, and a fourth passenger,

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Speaker 5: a young man, were taken to the hospital, both of

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Speaker 5: them severely injured.

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Speaker 2: Joining me right now in addition to doctor Joni Johnson

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Speaker 2: and forensic psychologist and author of Serial Killers one hundred

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Speaker 2: and one questions true crime fans asked. Joshua Ritter is

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Speaker 2: with us, a veteran criminal defense attorney, former LA County

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Speaker 2: Deputy district attorney, now partner. You can find him at

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Speaker 2: Joshua Ridder dot com. Joshua, what's the name of your

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Speaker 2: law firm?

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Speaker 11: Held? Dobby Ridder Trial Lawyers.

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Speaker 2: Joshua, why do people insist on calling this an accident,

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Speaker 2: Because when you run three red lights at one hundred mph.

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Speaker 3: That's not an accident.

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Speaker 2: Your foot is on the gas, you are choosing to

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Speaker 2: run through three lights.

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Speaker 3: That's not an accident. That's a crash.

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Speaker 11: Now, that's an excellent point. It's not only not an accident,

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Speaker 11: it's very arguably an intentional act. I mean, you are

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Speaker 11: putting people's lives. There's no argument to be made that

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Speaker 11: you should not be aware that you were putting people's

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Speaker 11: lives at risk by driving that speed down a busy street,

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Speaker 11: running through red lights. That to me is pushing this

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Speaker 11: from you know, they're charging him with vehicular manslaughter. This

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Speaker 11: is pushing this towards murder charges. To me, if you're

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Speaker 11: driving at that high rate of a speed, going through

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Speaker 11: stop science, how can you possibly claim this was an accident,

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Speaker 11: that this was not an unintended, unforeseen consequence of your actions.

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Speaker 3: What is this area?

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Speaker 2: Does anybody on the panel note a lot of you

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Speaker 2: are from this jurisdiction? Doctor Jony Caitlin, Mike McCormick, Joshua Ritter.

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Speaker 7: It's thirty five miles per hour. Yeah, it's a residential area.

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Speaker 3: It is residential.

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Speaker 8: Yeah, Mike unccormick, Gregory Block was on a mission to

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Speaker 8: create a devastating carnage. This was absolutely no.

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Speaker 3: Accident, no accident at all.

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Speaker 2: Joseph Tremblay joining a senior forensic engineer, Accident reconstructionist joining us.

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Speaker 2: You can find them at veritech Janjfengineer dot com.

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Speaker 3: Joseph, if we didn't have.

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Speaker 2: A surveillance video, we may not be able to prove this,

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Speaker 2: but we do have the surveillance video. Why do people

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Speaker 2: insist on calling this an accident.

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Speaker 10: That's a very good question. There's a lot of things

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Speaker 10: that indicate that this was not an accident, and I

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Speaker 10: do want to point out one thing too. We have

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Speaker 10: footage that has this uber car in the intersection. But

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Speaker 10: what's also important to realize is that this ubercar was

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Speaker 10: in that intersection for a long time before the accident happened.

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Speaker 10: So what you can deduce from that is that mister

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Speaker 10: Black may not have even been paying attention or he

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Speaker 10: just didn't care because he probably saw this vehicle. He's

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Speaker 10: probably saw cars passing in front of him long before

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Speaker 10: the impact occurred.

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Speaker 7: And Nancy, if I can just jump in where the

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Speaker 7: accident was located, so it's all kind of This is

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Speaker 7: sort of how a Lock Angeles is sort of set

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Speaker 7: up all around. It's sort of a main thoroughfare with businesses, restaurants,

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Speaker 7: seven eleven, kind of up and down the streets, but

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Speaker 7: all the side streets are residential, so it's not really

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Speaker 7: This isn't a highway area. And at this time of

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Speaker 7: night you can drive on the highways in LA without traffic.

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Speaker 7: So if he was trying to get from point A

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Speaker 7: to B, there are probably better ways to have gotten there.

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Speaker 7: But what some of our sources have said is their

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Speaker 7: investigators are looking into why Black was going the speed

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Speaker 7: he was going in the area that he was driving.

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Speaker 7: There's no reason to be going one hundred miles an

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Speaker 7: hour per hour at that point.

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Speaker 3: Is there any reason I care? Why?

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Speaker 7: Maybe because where was he coming from? And the question

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Speaker 7: is if he was fleeing something, are there potentially more

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Speaker 7: charges we can get there?

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Speaker 3: Give me like a crime flaeing a crime?

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Speaker 2: Oh, by the way, he had a gun in his car.

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Speaker 2: In his car, Okay, with that in mind, take a listener,

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Speaker 2: friend Hal Eisner.

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Speaker 13: To Jose, this is the tragedy.

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Speaker 3: No parents should have to bury their shop.

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Speaker 13: Jose's parents now have to bury two, and their friend's

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Speaker 13: family have to bury one as well. The way Jose

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Speaker 13: puts it, they all grew up together. They grew up

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Speaker 13: as friends, and they died as friends.

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Speaker 9: When people talk about things like soulmates, that's that's what it.

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Speaker 13: Is, investigators told our jugigress. Yet they were looking into

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Speaker 13: whether the suspect driver was fleeing another crime.

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Speaker 2: Just like Caitlin Becker was telling us to. Doctor Joni Johnson,

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Speaker 2: joining us from Dill Mahr, forensic psychologist and also author

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Speaker 2: of Serial Killers one hundred and one questions true crime

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Speaker 2: fans ask, you can find doctor Jony at doctor Joni

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Speaker 2: Johnston dot com. Doctor Joni way in on the thinking,

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Speaker 2: not that this is an element the state has to prove,

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Speaker 2: but the thinking of this killer.

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Speaker 14: Well, we know he wasn't thinking about any potential victims

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Speaker 14: on his wrap, that's for sure. It'll be interesting to

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Speaker 14: find out what he was in fact, if he was

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Speaker 14: fleeing from something, what he was fleeing from. But I

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Speaker 14: think I've interviewed many gang members in prison and outside

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Speaker 14: of prison, and you know, it's a lot of times

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Speaker 14: there is a different mentality and the mentality is is

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Speaker 14: you've put it out this kind of gang war that's

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Speaker 14: going on, and so it's like, that's how the world is.

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Speaker 14: We're soldiers and we have to do these certain things,

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Speaker 14: and if there are a collateral damage, if there are

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Speaker 14: civilian victims, well that's just too bad because this is

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Speaker 14: the world that we live in and this is how

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Speaker 14: we're going to operate. And it's just it's just so unfair.

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Speaker 14: You know, somebody else point out on the panel to

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Speaker 14: think of these beautiful young women, this young man who

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Speaker 14: knows their life in front of them, who are doing

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Speaker 14: everything right, who are being safe, and then you have

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Speaker 14: somebody who is engaging, at the very minimum so recklessly

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Speaker 14: intentionally putting other people's lives in danger, and clearly has

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Speaker 14: this long history of similar behavior or worse behavior behind him.

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Speaker 2: Guys, we're talking about him being out on probation from murder.

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Speaker 3: Take a listener. Our friend Phil Schumann.

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Speaker 12: The District Attorney's office, clarified to Fox eleven that Black

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Speaker 12: did not commit murder. He was caught on camera and

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Speaker 12: a car used in a murder wasn't the shooter or driver.

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Speaker 12: So rather than prosecuting him for that, a plead deal

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Speaker 12: for probation was offered to Black and accepted for another

439
00:26:27,280 --> 00:26:30,040
Speaker 12: related crime, an attempted murder in which no one was hurt.

440
00:26:42,840 --> 00:26:44,679
Speaker 1: Crime stories with Nancy Grace.

441
00:26:46,520 --> 00:26:49,119
Speaker 2: Let me understand, is he or is he not on

442
00:26:49,240 --> 00:26:51,280
Speaker 2: probation for murder Caitlin Becker.

443
00:26:51,359 --> 00:26:55,880
Speaker 7: He's on probation for attempted murder. He received five years probation.

444
00:26:56,119 --> 00:26:57,400
Speaker 7: Initially he it was.

445
00:26:57,480 --> 00:27:01,040
Speaker 11: Four people were charged for or murder.

446
00:27:00,840 --> 00:27:05,639
Speaker 7: Conspiracy to commit murder, and for shooting in an occupied vehicle,

447
00:27:05,720 --> 00:27:08,000
Speaker 7: So this is a drive by shooting. In twenty twenty,

448
00:27:08,359 --> 00:27:12,600
Speaker 7: the murder charges were dropped one of those four, his

449
00:27:12,760 --> 00:27:15,199
Speaker 7: case is still working its way through the court system.

450
00:27:15,560 --> 00:27:17,960
Speaker 7: Two of the others pled down, and in this case,

451
00:27:18,040 --> 00:27:21,080
Speaker 7: our guy that we're concerned with, Gregory Black, got five

452
00:27:21,160 --> 00:27:23,280
Speaker 7: years probation for attempted murder.

453
00:27:23,359 --> 00:27:24,520
Speaker 3: Let me understand something.

454
00:27:25,000 --> 00:27:28,760
Speaker 2: Did the victim in the drive by shooting die?

455
00:27:28,920 --> 00:27:31,480
Speaker 7: Yes, the victim in the drive by shooting did die?

456
00:27:31,520 --> 00:27:35,480
Speaker 7: Because there are murder charges still working their way for

457
00:27:35,560 --> 00:27:37,000
Speaker 7: some of the other defendants.

458
00:27:37,040 --> 00:27:40,560
Speaker 2: So where is the attempted murder coming from? If the

459
00:27:40,640 --> 00:27:41,520
Speaker 2: person died.

460
00:27:41,720 --> 00:27:48,000
Speaker 7: I think it's involving how Black was involved in the instant.

461
00:27:47,720 --> 00:27:51,000
Speaker 2: Okay, so look, either he's they want to tell me

462
00:27:51,440 --> 00:27:56,080
Speaker 2: he's asleep in the car when all this happened, when

463
00:27:56,119 --> 00:27:59,720
Speaker 2: the shooting went down. Is that what they're saying, Kaitlonard,

464
00:27:59,760 --> 00:28:01,000
Speaker 2: Josh ts Ritter, do you know?

465
00:28:01,400 --> 00:28:03,600
Speaker 7: I don't know. And this is specifically because a lot

466
00:28:03,640 --> 00:28:06,280
Speaker 7: of the case details for this twenty twenty case haven't

467
00:28:06,400 --> 00:28:07,720
Speaker 7: been revealed.

468
00:28:07,880 --> 00:28:08,760
Speaker 3: I bet they have.

469
00:28:08,880 --> 00:28:11,439
Speaker 2: Not because you know, the prosecutors don't want me to

470
00:28:11,520 --> 00:28:15,879
Speaker 2: find out this. So, okay, you've got a dead guy,

471
00:28:16,640 --> 00:28:18,760
Speaker 2: but it's just attempted murder.

472
00:28:18,960 --> 00:28:20,480
Speaker 3: It's to drive by shooting.

473
00:28:21,280 --> 00:28:26,640
Speaker 2: But he's on probation for attempted murder even though it's

474
00:28:26,680 --> 00:28:30,760
Speaker 2: a dead body. And his defense is he was asleep

475
00:28:30,960 --> 00:28:35,640
Speaker 2: or unconscious. Do I am I getting this right? Please

476
00:28:35,680 --> 00:28:36,480
Speaker 2: tell me I'm wrong.

477
00:28:36,720 --> 00:28:39,040
Speaker 7: I haven't seen anything along the lines of him being

478
00:28:39,040 --> 00:28:42,360
Speaker 7: asleeper unconscious in my reporting, but I do know that

479
00:28:42,400 --> 00:28:46,520
Speaker 7: he was in the vehicle and the two other people who.

480
00:28:46,520 --> 00:28:49,280
Speaker 2: Let me read to you from Fox eleven and I'm quoting,

481
00:28:49,720 --> 00:28:52,360
Speaker 2: prosecutors have an ethical duty not to pursue charge. We

482
00:28:52,360 --> 00:28:54,680
Speaker 2: cannot prove beyond a reasonable doubt in the murder. We

483
00:28:54,720 --> 00:28:59,040
Speaker 2: had evidence to indicate he was asleep or unconscious at the.

484
00:28:59,040 --> 00:29:00,440
Speaker 3: Time of the fence.

485
00:29:01,960 --> 00:29:04,840
Speaker 2: Now I'm talking, but he was in the car, and

486
00:29:04,880 --> 00:29:07,480
Speaker 2: what he sleeps through a drive by shooting?

487
00:29:08,520 --> 00:29:08,880
Speaker 3: Really?

488
00:29:09,200 --> 00:29:12,720
Speaker 2: And if they're talking about their ethical duty, Joshua Ridder,

489
00:29:13,360 --> 00:29:16,040
Speaker 2: the ethical duty is if you don't think they're involved,

490
00:29:16,160 --> 00:29:19,080
Speaker 2: then you drop the charges. You don't take a plea

491
00:29:19,560 --> 00:29:21,840
Speaker 2: and have somebody plead guilty to something that.

492
00:29:22,040 --> 00:29:26,400
Speaker 3: You don't believe they did. This is completely past ackwards.

493
00:29:26,560 --> 00:29:28,800
Speaker 3: They want their cake and they want to eat it too.

494
00:29:29,080 --> 00:29:31,560
Speaker 2: You can't say, oh, we're dropping the murder charge because

495
00:29:31,600 --> 00:29:34,120
Speaker 2: he was a sleeper unconscious, but we'll let him plead

496
00:29:34,120 --> 00:29:36,040
Speaker 2: guilty to attempted murder.

497
00:29:36,680 --> 00:29:37,800
Speaker 3: What the hey is.

498
00:29:37,720 --> 00:29:39,160
Speaker 7: That he pleaded no contest.

499
00:29:39,200 --> 00:29:42,560
Speaker 3: I don't know if that may it makes no difference none.

500
00:29:42,960 --> 00:29:44,200
Speaker 3: That is total bs.

501
00:29:44,520 --> 00:29:46,880
Speaker 2: That's what a defendant wants to the stand and he

502
00:29:46,960 --> 00:29:50,480
Speaker 2: won't say I'm guilty, But yet he takes his sentence

503
00:29:50,840 --> 00:29:54,200
Speaker 2: and he's adjudicated as guilty. So how does this work

504
00:29:54,240 --> 00:29:59,040
Speaker 2: with their ethical duty? Josh Ritter That they think he

505
00:29:59,120 --> 00:30:01,560
Speaker 2: was a sleeper and conscios during the drive by shooting

506
00:30:01,960 --> 00:30:04,800
Speaker 2: and he's in the car, I guess what slept through it?

507
00:30:06,160 --> 00:30:08,800
Speaker 2: But so they're not going to prosecute him for murder

508
00:30:09,080 --> 00:30:11,800
Speaker 2: or a tip, but they let him played guilty to

509
00:30:11,880 --> 00:30:14,600
Speaker 2: a lesser offense. So how can he be asleep and

510
00:30:14,640 --> 00:30:18,560
Speaker 2: unconscious and not guilty in any way, but yet they

511
00:30:18,640 --> 00:30:19,840
Speaker 2: take a guilty point.

512
00:30:20,000 --> 00:30:23,280
Speaker 11: No, I agree with you, Nancy. This is this is laughable.

513
00:30:23,360 --> 00:30:27,240
Speaker 11: I mean, look at the wording that the DA released there.

514
00:30:27,520 --> 00:30:29,040
Speaker 3: Who is the DA.

515
00:30:29,280 --> 00:30:32,440
Speaker 11: They're not saying what that evidence is, is the evidence

516
00:30:32,480 --> 00:30:36,000
Speaker 11: coming from him? Is the evidence him saying I was

517
00:30:36,040 --> 00:30:37,960
Speaker 11: asleep at the time I didn't know. Is that their

518
00:30:38,000 --> 00:30:40,760
Speaker 11: evidence to indicate he was asleep? They don't say what

519
00:30:40,800 --> 00:30:44,000
Speaker 11: that actual evidence is. I worked as a DA for

520
00:30:44,080 --> 00:30:47,160
Speaker 11: many years and we had cases like this all the time.

521
00:30:47,280 --> 00:30:49,680
Speaker 11: Drive by shootings don't take place with one person in

522
00:30:49,720 --> 00:30:50,520
Speaker 11: the vehicle, and.

523
00:30:50,440 --> 00:30:53,040
Speaker 3: They're not asleep in the backseat either.

524
00:30:53,040 --> 00:30:55,040
Speaker 11: Correct, And they all know what they're going to do.

525
00:30:55,240 --> 00:30:56,840
Speaker 8: They all know what the plan is.

526
00:30:57,120 --> 00:31:01,120
Speaker 11: So that's why everyone is charged with the crimes. Everybody

527
00:31:01,200 --> 00:31:04,920
Speaker 11: is charged with taking part in that drive by shooting.

528
00:31:05,000 --> 00:31:08,400
Speaker 11: A person ended up dead here, and you're saying that

529
00:31:08,480 --> 00:31:10,920
Speaker 11: this person not only got probation, but it was able

530
00:31:10,960 --> 00:31:15,520
Speaker 11: to plead to something less than murder. It's shocking to me.

531
00:31:15,560 --> 00:31:19,680
Speaker 11: I mean, this is why the decisions made by prosecutors

532
00:31:20,040 --> 00:31:24,680
Speaker 11: can have vast disastrous consequences beyond the actual case that

533
00:31:24,720 --> 00:31:27,120
Speaker 11: they might be dealing with. You have a person here that,

534
00:31:27,760 --> 00:31:30,520
Speaker 11: by all of our assessments, should be in prison to

535
00:31:30,640 --> 00:31:33,880
Speaker 11: this day. This led shooting took place in twenty twenty,

536
00:31:34,760 --> 00:31:37,080
Speaker 11: so she's not even three years into what it should

537
00:31:37,080 --> 00:31:39,480
Speaker 11: have been a very long prison sentence, and it steadies

538
00:31:39,520 --> 00:31:41,840
Speaker 11: out and driving one hundred miles down the road and

539
00:31:41,960 --> 00:31:43,160
Speaker 11: kills three innocent people.

540
00:31:43,280 --> 00:31:46,360
Speaker 2: Not only that, did you say, Joshua Ritter and anybody

541
00:31:46,360 --> 00:31:48,600
Speaker 2: on the panel jump in if you know more or

542
00:31:48,600 --> 00:31:52,560
Speaker 2: better facts on this That he has at least three

543
00:31:53,040 --> 00:31:58,600
Speaker 2: felony convictions and eleven priors that are open. Did you

544
00:31:58,680 --> 00:32:03,320
Speaker 2: hear that many of which are failony charges? Why is

545
00:32:03,360 --> 00:32:05,160
Speaker 2: he even out walking around?

546
00:32:05,440 --> 00:32:08,280
Speaker 11: I saw that reporting, and like we talked about earlier,

547
00:32:08,840 --> 00:32:10,920
Speaker 11: the fact that the police are referring to him as

548
00:32:11,040 --> 00:32:14,800
Speaker 11: a known game member, meaning that he's not only committing crimes,

549
00:32:14,800 --> 00:32:18,600
Speaker 11: he's committing game related crimes. This is not a candidate

550
00:32:18,640 --> 00:32:22,120
Speaker 11: for probation. I don't care what they're saying. Their involvement

551
00:32:22,360 --> 00:32:24,960
Speaker 11: was in this drive by shooting This is not the

552
00:32:25,040 --> 00:32:27,760
Speaker 11: person that you put in the column of possible probation.

553
00:32:28,440 --> 00:32:28,920
Speaker 7: This is a.

554
00:32:28,880 --> 00:32:32,080
Speaker 11: Person who once again is caught up in some sort

555
00:32:32,120 --> 00:32:35,600
Speaker 11: of crime that led to someone's death. Talking about that

556
00:32:35,720 --> 00:32:38,040
Speaker 11: drive by shooting and they should have been put in

557
00:32:38,040 --> 00:32:41,360
Speaker 11: prison and taken off the streets so that they couldn't participate,

558
00:32:41,640 --> 00:32:44,120
Speaker 11: and other types of behavior like the one that we're

559
00:32:44,120 --> 00:32:47,240
Speaker 11: talking about today, driving one hundred miles down the road

560
00:32:47,320 --> 00:32:50,520
Speaker 11: and three innocent people who are just trying to go home.

561
00:32:50,680 --> 00:32:51,240
Speaker 11: End ub debt.

562
00:32:51,480 --> 00:32:55,040
Speaker 2: You know, when you are the elected district attorney, you

563
00:32:55,120 --> 00:32:59,200
Speaker 2: have other As you're hearing Joshua Ritter was a deputy

564
00:32:59,240 --> 00:33:04,920
Speaker 2: district attorney. They're the lieutenants. They prosecute the crimes. They're

565
00:33:04,920 --> 00:33:09,440
Speaker 2: in the courtrooms as was I trying cases every day.

566
00:33:10,320 --> 00:33:15,160
Speaker 2: I did it for ten years as a violent fellowy prosecutor.

567
00:33:15,280 --> 00:33:16,440
Speaker 3: Before that, I was a fed.

568
00:33:17,720 --> 00:33:24,360
Speaker 2: The elected district attorney sets the tone of how cases

569
00:33:24,360 --> 00:33:27,720
Speaker 2: are prosecuted. If you're week on crime, you get taken

570
00:33:27,720 --> 00:33:30,520
Speaker 2: out of the courtroom or fired, or you go right appeals,

571
00:33:30,800 --> 00:33:35,520
Speaker 2: or you handle GV cases, or you collect child support

572
00:33:35,520 --> 00:33:39,000
Speaker 2: from deadbeat dads. If you can't prosecute a case and

573
00:33:39,080 --> 00:33:43,960
Speaker 2: put somebody behind bars. So I don't necessarily blame the

574
00:33:44,000 --> 00:33:47,240
Speaker 2: ADA Assistant District Attorney that did this.

575
00:33:48,000 --> 00:33:52,320
Speaker 3: I blame the DA who is the DA renter.

576
00:33:52,520 --> 00:33:55,280
Speaker 11: He's a gentleman by the name of George Gusco who

577
00:33:55,320 --> 00:34:00,160
Speaker 11: came into office and has dramatically changed the way that

578
00:34:00,480 --> 00:34:03,000
Speaker 11: cases are prosecuted in that office from day one. He

579
00:34:03,160 --> 00:34:07,000
Speaker 11: really several directives that dramatically change the way that they

580
00:34:07,040 --> 00:34:07,600
Speaker 11: handle things.

581
00:34:07,680 --> 00:34:10,840
Speaker 3: In what way I take it not more harsh?

582
00:34:11,120 --> 00:34:15,560
Speaker 11: No, from things from abolishing bail essentially to not prosecuting juveniles.

583
00:34:15,560 --> 00:34:17,560
Speaker 2: When you say abolishing mail, you know what I mean,

584
00:34:17,719 --> 00:34:19,640
Speaker 2: Hey you can't have bail, you have to sit in jail.

585
00:34:20,120 --> 00:34:22,799
Speaker 2: He means, hey, you can want free and you don't

586
00:34:22,800 --> 00:34:23,839
Speaker 2: even have to put up bail.

587
00:34:24,040 --> 00:34:28,319
Speaker 11: Exactly and most poignantly to our case here today. He

588
00:34:28,480 --> 00:34:32,440
Speaker 11: also has a near blanket policy, is my understanding.

589
00:34:32,520 --> 00:34:33,200
Speaker 8: As far as.

590
00:34:33,400 --> 00:34:36,440
Speaker 11: Any type of gang allegation, the gang allegation is a

591
00:34:36,600 --> 00:34:41,040
Speaker 11: very powerful tool for prosecutors in California, where if a

592
00:34:41,040 --> 00:34:43,880
Speaker 11: crime was committed for the furtherance or benefit of a gang,

593
00:34:43,960 --> 00:34:48,719
Speaker 11: it can add time to their case. This is a

594
00:34:48,760 --> 00:34:53,279
Speaker 11: known gang member. I am certain I don't even need

595
00:34:53,320 --> 00:34:55,400
Speaker 11: to read the facts of that drive by shooting that

596
00:34:55,520 --> 00:34:59,560
Speaker 11: was somehow gang related. Had those policies been applied or

597
00:34:59,600 --> 00:35:01,560
Speaker 11: been a lot to be applied, they're not off the

598
00:35:01,600 --> 00:35:04,560
Speaker 11: books in California. He just won't apply them to the

599
00:35:04,640 --> 00:35:08,200
Speaker 11: crimes in Los Angeles County. Had those been applied, that person,

600
00:35:08,320 --> 00:35:10,680
Speaker 11: very well, the person that we're talking about here today,

601
00:35:10,800 --> 00:35:12,600
Speaker 11: very well could have still been behind bars.

602
00:35:12,880 --> 00:35:16,160
Speaker 2: If you have information on this case, I'm not sure

603
00:35:16,200 --> 00:35:20,040
Speaker 2: what good it will do with this district attorney who

604
00:35:20,160 --> 00:35:22,360
Speaker 2: was elected by the people.

605
00:35:22,920 --> 00:35:23,520
Speaker 3: It's on them.

606
00:35:24,840 --> 00:35:29,000
Speaker 2: But who is going to stand up for crime victims

607
00:35:29,360 --> 00:35:31,360
Speaker 2: and their families left behind?

608
00:35:32,920 --> 00:35:37,520
Speaker 3: If not me, if not you, then who.

609
00:35:39,200 --> 00:35:42,200
Speaker 2: And what will happen when we're the crime victim or

610
00:35:42,239 --> 00:35:43,600
Speaker 2: our family or our friend.

611
00:35:44,440 --> 00:35:46,080
Speaker 3: Who will stand up for us?

612
00:35:48,200 --> 00:35:51,719
Speaker 2: It's not the elected district attorney there Gasconn It's not.

613
00:35:52,560 --> 00:35:57,440
Speaker 2: And this is yet another example. Look, I don't care

614
00:35:57,480 --> 00:36:02,200
Speaker 2: about politics. I hate politics. This DA is not protecting

615
00:36:02,960 --> 00:36:08,600
Speaker 2: innocent victims. Ask the families of weapland of Veronica of

616
00:36:08,719 --> 00:36:13,200
Speaker 2: Kimberly if you have information on this case, and I

617
00:36:13,239 --> 00:36:16,160
Speaker 2: pray to God it would help, dial eight hundred two

618
00:36:16,280 --> 00:36:20,200
Speaker 2: two two tips. That's eight four seven seven for crime

619
00:36:20,200 --> 00:36:24,120
Speaker 2: Stoppers in La eight hundred two two two eight four

620
00:36:24,520 --> 00:36:25,240
Speaker 2: seven seven.

621
00:36:25,560 --> 00:36:26,239
Speaker 3: Goodbye friend,