1 00:00:00,360 --> 00:00:03,880 Speaker 1: She's a lawyer of former beauty queen, a classical pianist, 2 00:00:03,880 --> 00:00:06,200 Speaker 1: a New York Times bestselling author, and the host of 3 00:00:06,240 --> 00:00:10,280 Speaker 1: Fox News Sunday. But Shannon Bream has also endured her 4 00:00:10,400 --> 00:00:13,840 Speaker 1: share of hard times and darkness. Now she's written a 5 00:00:13,880 --> 00:00:16,840 Speaker 1: new book, Nothing Is Impossible with God, where she talks 6 00:00:16,880 --> 00:00:19,560 Speaker 1: of overcoming that darkness. She tells me about her own 7 00:00:19,600 --> 00:00:23,280 Speaker 1: harrowing journey and the book on this Arroyo Grande. Come on, 8 00:00:33,880 --> 00:00:36,800 Speaker 1: welcome to the show. Go subscribe to a Royo Grande. 9 00:00:36,920 --> 00:00:40,400 Speaker 1: Now turn those notifications on so you always know what 10 00:00:40,440 --> 00:00:42,479 Speaker 1: we're up to and what's coming. And if you'd like 11 00:00:42,520 --> 00:00:45,640 Speaker 1: to support the show, visit Raymondarroyo dot com. Click donate 12 00:00:45,960 --> 00:00:49,680 Speaker 1: your tax free contributions help keep the show coming. Shannon 13 00:00:49,760 --> 00:00:53,400 Speaker 1: Bream is host of Foxnews Sunday and the network's chief 14 00:00:53,479 --> 00:00:56,760 Speaker 1: legal correspondent. She's authored a string of New York Times 15 00:00:56,760 --> 00:01:00,400 Speaker 1: bestselling books. In her latest Nothing is Impossible with Odd 16 00:01:00,680 --> 00:01:06,960 Speaker 1: eleven Heroes one God Endless lessons in overcoming really hits 17 00:01:07,000 --> 00:01:09,600 Speaker 1: the mark. She knows what she's talking about here, having 18 00:01:09,640 --> 00:01:14,399 Speaker 1: battled her own health crises and the despair viewers never 19 00:01:14,520 --> 00:01:17,639 Speaker 1: saw through it all. Prayer and a deep faith carried 20 00:01:17,680 --> 00:01:20,680 Speaker 1: her through. I joined my friend Shannon Breem at her 21 00:01:20,720 --> 00:01:25,039 Speaker 1: home in Nashville. I want to get to your incredible 22 00:01:25,120 --> 00:01:28,960 Speaker 1: new book, which is nothing as impossible, first of all, 23 00:01:29,200 --> 00:01:31,160 Speaker 1: but I want to go back first. You grew up 24 00:01:31,200 --> 00:01:36,520 Speaker 1: in Tallahassee. Yes, tell me what that Shannon wanted to do? 25 00:01:36,800 --> 00:01:38,840 Speaker 1: That girl, what did she want to do? 26 00:01:38,880 --> 00:01:43,320 Speaker 2: You know what? Ride horses? Be a country girl. My 27 00:01:43,440 --> 00:01:46,000 Speaker 2: stepdad who we just lost recently, but really I called 28 00:01:46,040 --> 00:01:48,680 Speaker 2: him dad along with my dad dad, you know, just 29 00:01:48,720 --> 00:01:51,559 Speaker 2: one of those complicated families. But he had a bumper 30 00:01:51,640 --> 00:01:54,240 Speaker 2: segar on his pickup truck that said country when country 31 00:01:54,320 --> 00:01:57,360 Speaker 2: wasn't cool. So my high school years in Tallassee, it's 32 00:01:57,360 --> 00:02:00,080 Speaker 2: a very southern place, even though it's Florida. Yea, And 33 00:02:00,320 --> 00:02:02,800 Speaker 2: I just wanted to you know, yeehaw. 34 00:02:03,200 --> 00:02:05,240 Speaker 1: Was it a faithful family? Did you all have faith. 35 00:02:05,200 --> 00:02:06,040 Speaker 2: From in the beginning? 36 00:02:06,200 --> 00:02:06,400 Speaker 1: Yes? 37 00:02:06,520 --> 00:02:10,399 Speaker 2: Yes. My mom in fact was a baby believer when 38 00:02:10,440 --> 00:02:11,800 Speaker 2: I was a little kid, and she was a single 39 00:02:11,800 --> 00:02:14,799 Speaker 2: mom after my parents divorced, but she was discovering faith 40 00:02:14,880 --> 00:02:16,640 Speaker 2: and growing in it. So it's kind of like we 41 00:02:16,680 --> 00:02:19,520 Speaker 2: had a lot of that journey together. We're always in church. 42 00:02:19,600 --> 00:02:22,880 Speaker 2: I always went to a Christian school, so I was 43 00:02:22,919 --> 00:02:24,040 Speaker 2: getting fed all the time. 44 00:02:24,080 --> 00:02:26,840 Speaker 1: Wow, you you're involved in beauty pageants. 45 00:02:26,440 --> 00:02:30,200 Speaker 2: And I mean we say yes, last Century Miss Virginia. 46 00:02:30,280 --> 00:02:32,760 Speaker 1: Oh come it was. And then I mean you competed 47 00:02:32,800 --> 00:02:36,600 Speaker 1: in major pageants that paid your way through law school. Right, 48 00:02:36,680 --> 00:02:40,000 Speaker 1: and you go to Liberty? Yep? Why did you leave 49 00:02:40,040 --> 00:02:42,320 Speaker 1: the law? What was it about the law that made 50 00:02:42,360 --> 00:02:43,520 Speaker 1: you after all that studies? 51 00:02:43,600 --> 00:02:45,120 Speaker 2: You know what, even when I was in law school, 52 00:02:45,120 --> 00:02:47,600 Speaker 2: I knew I wouldn't do it forever. It just wasn't 53 00:02:47,639 --> 00:02:50,359 Speaker 2: my thing. It wasn't my passion. It was a great, honorable, 54 00:02:50,440 --> 00:02:53,800 Speaker 2: wonderful job at a wonderful firm. I still have friends 55 00:02:53,800 --> 00:02:56,440 Speaker 2: that I worked with back then. But it was punching 56 00:02:56,480 --> 00:02:58,080 Speaker 2: the clock and it was kind of a square peg 57 00:02:58,120 --> 00:03:00,840 Speaker 2: into a round hole every day. And I was just 58 00:03:00,880 --> 00:03:04,000 Speaker 2: so curious digging for stories in law school and being 59 00:03:04,040 --> 00:03:05,800 Speaker 2: a lawyer helped me with that part of it, the 60 00:03:05,880 --> 00:03:06,440 Speaker 2: research and the. 61 00:03:06,480 --> 00:03:09,760 Speaker 1: Right appreciation of not only a case, but what do 62 00:03:09,800 --> 00:03:12,000 Speaker 1: you do? I mean, you need to be very specific 63 00:03:12,000 --> 00:03:13,840 Speaker 1: in the law, and you bring that to your journalism 64 00:03:13,840 --> 00:03:18,960 Speaker 1: and have tell me about Sheldon. You go to Liberty 65 00:03:19,360 --> 00:03:22,800 Speaker 1: and you meet Sheldon. You all are engaged. You're what 66 00:03:23,200 --> 00:03:25,880 Speaker 1: twenty four years old? What happens? Tell me what happens there? 67 00:03:26,000 --> 00:03:28,080 Speaker 2: You know, he had been struggling with a little bit 68 00:03:28,080 --> 00:03:30,200 Speaker 2: of ringing in his ears and some irritation with the 69 00:03:30,240 --> 00:03:32,239 Speaker 2: sinuses and things. We couldn't figure out what was going 70 00:03:32,280 --> 00:03:34,880 Speaker 2: on there, and for months he was getting treated. Didn't 71 00:03:34,920 --> 00:03:37,600 Speaker 2: have insurance, so we weren't married yet, and you know, 72 00:03:37,640 --> 00:03:39,240 Speaker 2: you're trying to do this on a budget and trying 73 00:03:39,240 --> 00:03:42,200 Speaker 2: to figure out good urgent care and all these different things. 74 00:03:42,280 --> 00:03:45,920 Speaker 2: And finally the doctor he was seeing the earness and throat, said, 75 00:03:46,200 --> 00:03:47,680 Speaker 2: you know, I think it was maybe the PA. We 76 00:03:47,760 --> 00:03:50,080 Speaker 2: got to roll something out here. It's a brain tumor. 77 00:03:50,120 --> 00:03:53,200 Speaker 2: And we thought, well, that's crazy. He's this college athlete, 78 00:03:53,280 --> 00:03:55,760 Speaker 2: strong and healthy and everything's going great. Well, then we, 79 00:03:55,920 --> 00:03:57,960 Speaker 2: you know, had to pay for this. MRI was helping 80 00:03:58,040 --> 00:04:00,160 Speaker 2: him pay for that as he got started, and we 81 00:04:00,160 --> 00:04:03,120 Speaker 2: paid full price for it because you know, we weren't married, 82 00:04:03,200 --> 00:04:05,600 Speaker 2: we didn't have matching insurance, he didn't have insurance. We 83 00:04:05,680 --> 00:04:07,360 Speaker 2: paid that thing off for a long time, like twenty 84 00:04:07,360 --> 00:04:09,840 Speaker 2: bucks at a time. But it did reveal the truth 85 00:04:09,960 --> 00:04:13,040 Speaker 2: that he had a brain tumor and it was shocking 86 00:04:13,120 --> 00:04:15,400 Speaker 2: and terrifying, and it just kind of brings your whole 87 00:04:15,440 --> 00:04:18,479 Speaker 2: life to a screeching halt. But both of us were 88 00:04:18,839 --> 00:04:21,920 Speaker 2: people of faith and we found great solace in that. 89 00:04:21,960 --> 00:04:23,880 Speaker 2: And we would get notes from people at churches we'd 90 00:04:23,920 --> 00:04:25,760 Speaker 2: never been to, never heard of. We heard about you 91 00:04:25,800 --> 00:04:27,680 Speaker 2: through the grape vine. We put you on our prayer list, 92 00:04:27,800 --> 00:04:30,200 Speaker 2: and just to see the body of Christ support us 93 00:04:30,200 --> 00:04:30,920 Speaker 2: was a beautiful thing. 94 00:04:31,000 --> 00:04:32,960 Speaker 1: And that whole community really is which He stained you 95 00:04:33,000 --> 00:04:36,480 Speaker 1: through that horrible endeavor and that moment. Okay, I want 96 00:04:36,520 --> 00:04:40,320 Speaker 1: to talk about faith. I mean, you leave a legal 97 00:04:40,360 --> 00:04:43,920 Speaker 1: career because I guess you just didn't want to do it, 98 00:04:43,960 --> 00:04:46,480 Speaker 1: didn't love it. You quit your job and you become 99 00:04:46,520 --> 00:04:50,800 Speaker 1: an unpaid intern at a local TV station. What was 100 00:04:50,839 --> 00:04:55,080 Speaker 1: it about that calling journalism that would make it literally 101 00:04:55,600 --> 00:04:57,600 Speaker 1: give up this law path that you had been on 102 00:04:57,640 --> 00:04:58,360 Speaker 1: for all those years. 103 00:04:58,440 --> 00:05:00,520 Speaker 2: Yeah, my dad was not happy, I'll bet because he 104 00:05:00,600 --> 00:05:02,279 Speaker 2: was like, when I was in college and I was 105 00:05:02,279 --> 00:05:04,200 Speaker 2: a good student, I love school. I would go back 106 00:05:04,279 --> 00:05:06,160 Speaker 2: now if I could find an excuse to go. My 107 00:05:06,240 --> 00:05:08,200 Speaker 2: dad was like, you're wearing a law school or med school. Well, 108 00:05:08,560 --> 00:05:10,240 Speaker 2: there's no way I was going to med school. Okay, 109 00:05:10,480 --> 00:05:12,479 Speaker 2: but I did love politics and I loved arguing. My 110 00:05:12,480 --> 00:05:14,240 Speaker 2: parents thought law school was the right place for you, 111 00:05:14,640 --> 00:05:17,880 Speaker 2: So he was very happy that I had this graduate degree. 112 00:05:18,040 --> 00:05:20,560 Speaker 2: Financially I would be, you know, safe, he thought, taking 113 00:05:20,560 --> 00:05:22,520 Speaker 2: care of myself, a woman in the world kind of thing. 114 00:05:23,520 --> 00:05:25,320 Speaker 2: But I tried to juggle both for a little while. 115 00:05:25,360 --> 00:05:26,720 Speaker 2: So while I was at my law froom, I went 116 00:05:26,800 --> 00:05:30,520 Speaker 2: into that unpaid internship and they called me Grandma intern 117 00:05:30,880 --> 00:05:33,920 Speaker 2: because I was twenty nine and everybody else was like eighteen. 118 00:05:34,240 --> 00:05:34,600 Speaker 1: Wow. 119 00:05:34,960 --> 00:05:37,440 Speaker 2: But I immediately fell in love with the newsroom. And 120 00:05:37,560 --> 00:05:39,680 Speaker 2: I was working terrible hours and doing something I didn't care. 121 00:05:39,800 --> 00:05:42,440 Speaker 2: I was having a ball the police scanners and I 122 00:05:42,480 --> 00:05:45,560 Speaker 2: was making coffee. I was answering phones, I was running 123 00:05:45,600 --> 00:05:47,320 Speaker 2: the teleprompter, and I just kind of I went to 124 00:05:47,400 --> 00:05:49,400 Speaker 2: my boss at the end of the TV boss at 125 00:05:49,400 --> 00:05:51,200 Speaker 2: the end of the internship and said, I'm going to 126 00:05:51,279 --> 00:05:52,480 Speaker 2: leave my law firm and come work for you. And 127 00:05:52,560 --> 00:05:54,680 Speaker 2: he's like, no one's offered you a job, But I said, 128 00:05:54,680 --> 00:05:56,840 Speaker 2: this is what we call stepping out in faith. So 129 00:05:56,880 --> 00:06:00,200 Speaker 2: my first job was two am to eleven am, and 130 00:06:00,520 --> 00:06:02,719 Speaker 2: everyone thought I was crazy. Everyone thought I was crazy. 131 00:06:02,720 --> 00:06:04,760 Speaker 1: What would you tell young journalists. What do they need 132 00:06:04,800 --> 00:06:07,520 Speaker 1: to know? And what did you learn in that experience? 133 00:06:07,560 --> 00:06:08,560 Speaker 1: What's most important? 134 00:06:08,880 --> 00:06:10,760 Speaker 2: Do not take no for an answer, because you're going 135 00:06:10,800 --> 00:06:12,120 Speaker 2: to get it a lot. Even if you feel like 136 00:06:12,160 --> 00:06:14,480 Speaker 2: you get to some measure of success. You're hosting a show, 137 00:06:14,560 --> 00:06:16,839 Speaker 2: you have a beat, you're chasing, You're going to know 138 00:06:17,040 --> 00:06:18,920 Speaker 2: still a lot every time you re quest an interview 139 00:06:18,960 --> 00:06:21,680 Speaker 2: or chase somebody down for information, or somebody doesn't want 140 00:06:21,680 --> 00:06:23,560 Speaker 2: to hire you for a job. It's okay. You just 141 00:06:23,600 --> 00:06:25,960 Speaker 2: have to get to the yes's along the way you're 142 00:06:25,960 --> 00:06:27,200 Speaker 2: going to get no. And I think if you go 143 00:06:27,240 --> 00:06:28,560 Speaker 2: in knowing that it's. 144 00:06:28,400 --> 00:06:31,800 Speaker 1: Okay, and you like, this is the amazing thing. Like 145 00:06:31,839 --> 00:06:35,280 Speaker 1: your husband Sheelle, he has this terrible brain tumor and 146 00:06:35,440 --> 00:06:38,760 Speaker 1: I cannot imagine what that is like struggling with that 147 00:06:39,279 --> 00:06:42,360 Speaker 1: as someone you know who loves that person. I mean, 148 00:06:42,400 --> 00:06:44,240 Speaker 1: we had cancer, we had cancer in our own family. 149 00:06:44,279 --> 00:06:47,200 Speaker 1: I knew what that's like. But then you have your 150 00:06:47,240 --> 00:06:50,040 Speaker 1: own You had these cornial problems with your eyes that 151 00:06:50,200 --> 00:06:52,960 Speaker 1: go on for years, and you're on air. First of all, 152 00:06:53,480 --> 00:06:56,400 Speaker 1: how bad did it get? And secondly, the question I 153 00:06:56,440 --> 00:06:59,240 Speaker 1: always have is how did you continue to broadcast when 154 00:06:59,480 --> 00:07:01,480 Speaker 1: every block is like knives in your eye. 155 00:07:01,600 --> 00:07:05,440 Speaker 2: Yeah, it got so dark for me. Years into this, 156 00:07:05,480 --> 00:07:07,640 Speaker 2: where I've been blown off by doctors, I couldn't get 157 00:07:07,680 --> 00:07:10,360 Speaker 2: a diagnosis. Then I started to look online, which I 158 00:07:10,360 --> 00:07:13,240 Speaker 2: always say to people, do not do that. But the 159 00:07:13,240 --> 00:07:15,320 Speaker 2: one thing I did find was sort of chat rooms 160 00:07:15,320 --> 00:07:18,040 Speaker 2: and message boards where people are the same symptoms, and 161 00:07:18,120 --> 00:07:21,120 Speaker 2: that actually helped me because that pushed me to some answers. 162 00:07:21,160 --> 00:07:22,880 Speaker 2: But I would hear these stories from the same people. 163 00:07:23,280 --> 00:07:25,240 Speaker 2: I go to the emergency room, I'm turned away. They 164 00:07:25,280 --> 00:07:28,560 Speaker 2: say there's nothing wrong with me. So finally, one night 165 00:07:28,560 --> 00:07:30,800 Speaker 2: I just was, it becomes so dark for me. If 166 00:07:30,840 --> 00:07:34,280 Speaker 2: you've lived with pain, chronic, emotional, whatever it is, it's 167 00:07:34,360 --> 00:07:35,640 Speaker 2: very hard to get up in the morning and just 168 00:07:35,640 --> 00:07:38,200 Speaker 2: do what you do. And I would pray, just get 169 00:07:38,200 --> 00:07:39,520 Speaker 2: me through, one more day at a time, one more 170 00:07:39,600 --> 00:07:42,040 Speaker 2: night at a time. And it became so dark that 171 00:07:42,080 --> 00:07:43,800 Speaker 2: I thought, man, I would just love to go to 172 00:07:43,800 --> 00:07:47,000 Speaker 2: sleep and not wake up again. Just really dark thoughts. 173 00:07:47,120 --> 00:07:49,800 Speaker 2: And I thank god I could share them with Sheldon, 174 00:07:50,320 --> 00:07:52,480 Speaker 2: and he didn't judge and freak out. He said, Okay, 175 00:07:52,600 --> 00:07:55,240 Speaker 2: let's tackle this again, Let's find a doctor, let's keep going. 176 00:07:55,480 --> 00:07:57,760 Speaker 2: Because I'd kind of given up on the medical establishment, 177 00:07:57,840 --> 00:08:01,400 Speaker 2: but I found this doctor. He was very tough to 178 00:08:01,440 --> 00:08:03,000 Speaker 2: get in with. But while I was on the phone 179 00:08:03,040 --> 00:08:05,960 Speaker 2: with him, they said, we've got a cancelation for tomorrow. 180 00:08:06,040 --> 00:08:08,480 Speaker 2: Can you come? I said absolutely, I'll be there. He 181 00:08:08,560 --> 00:08:11,600 Speaker 2: was an answer to prayer and began my pathy here. 182 00:08:11,640 --> 00:08:13,320 Speaker 1: And you had been praying to God through all of this. 183 00:08:13,400 --> 00:08:15,360 Speaker 1: What did he tell you? Not the answer you would 184 00:08:15,400 --> 00:08:17,160 Speaker 1: necessarily wanted? What was it? 185 00:08:17,440 --> 00:08:19,640 Speaker 2: You know? I said, if you're not going to heal me, 186 00:08:19,880 --> 00:08:21,960 Speaker 2: like Paul and Corinthians, who has the thorn in his side, 187 00:08:21,960 --> 00:08:24,240 Speaker 2: and he says, okay, I'm not going to get healed. 188 00:08:24,280 --> 00:08:26,440 Speaker 2: I've asked repeatedly. And what does Christ say to him? 189 00:08:26,760 --> 00:08:29,040 Speaker 2: My power is made perfect, My strength is made perfect 190 00:08:29,080 --> 00:08:31,600 Speaker 2: through your weakness. And Paul goes on to say, okay, 191 00:08:31,640 --> 00:08:33,880 Speaker 2: then I'll boast all the more gladly about my weakness 192 00:08:34,000 --> 00:08:36,000 Speaker 2: so that Christ's power may rest on me. And I 193 00:08:36,080 --> 00:08:38,480 Speaker 2: knew those verses, I'd memorize them over the years, but 194 00:08:38,520 --> 00:08:41,440 Speaker 2: they came to life. They became real for me, and 195 00:08:41,480 --> 00:08:43,320 Speaker 2: that so I said to God, if you're not going 196 00:08:43,360 --> 00:08:46,200 Speaker 2: to heal me, let's you know, could you get me 197 00:08:46,240 --> 00:08:48,360 Speaker 2: to somebody who can help me. And after that visit 198 00:08:48,400 --> 00:08:50,880 Speaker 2: with the doctor, it was difficult because he did know 199 00:08:50,920 --> 00:08:53,319 Speaker 2: what I had. But then he told me there's no cure. 200 00:08:54,080 --> 00:08:57,199 Speaker 2: And as I left the office, sobbing in my car 201 00:08:58,200 --> 00:09:00,880 Speaker 2: and I'm praying and I don't underst and I felt 202 00:09:00,880 --> 00:09:03,000 Speaker 2: God say to me, not audibly, but in my spirit, 203 00:09:03,520 --> 00:09:08,320 Speaker 2: I will be with you that phrase, and that was enough. 204 00:09:08,520 --> 00:09:09,040 Speaker 2: That was enough. 205 00:09:09,040 --> 00:09:12,880 Speaker 1: It's been enough to theology of suffering though, really, I 206 00:09:12,920 --> 00:09:16,480 Speaker 1: mean in people, that's hard. Nobody talks about that part 207 00:09:16,480 --> 00:09:20,199 Speaker 1: of the faith walk, which if you go back centuries, 208 00:09:20,440 --> 00:09:22,400 Speaker 1: it's all there, great sayings, all the great people, the 209 00:09:22,440 --> 00:09:25,520 Speaker 1: people on the Bible. Everybody suffers a lot. In fact, 210 00:09:25,600 --> 00:09:28,880 Speaker 1: it's the path to the cross. And people like to 211 00:09:28,880 --> 00:09:32,640 Speaker 1: talk about redemption. Redemption's only found through these crosses. Talk 212 00:09:32,679 --> 00:09:35,960 Speaker 1: to me about the presence of God in that suffering, 213 00:09:36,400 --> 00:09:38,920 Speaker 1: because that's really what the new book is about the 214 00:09:39,000 --> 00:09:41,360 Speaker 1: presence of God. And how do you find it in 215 00:09:41,480 --> 00:09:43,239 Speaker 1: suffering and not despair? 216 00:09:44,760 --> 00:09:47,840 Speaker 2: Said still small voice. It's just pouring out your heart. 217 00:09:47,880 --> 00:09:50,400 Speaker 2: He already knows how much you're struggling, the pain that 218 00:09:50,440 --> 00:09:52,839 Speaker 2: you're in. It's not going to shock him or scare him. 219 00:09:52,840 --> 00:09:53,040 Speaker 1: Off. 220 00:09:53,160 --> 00:09:55,400 Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean he wants to sit with you in that. 221 00:09:55,800 --> 00:09:58,160 Speaker 2: And the beautiful thing about Christ is that obviously he 222 00:09:58,240 --> 00:10:01,600 Speaker 2: came and took on the human mantleful, godfully man, so 223 00:10:01,640 --> 00:10:05,760 Speaker 2: he knows what it's like to suffer. He's not oblivious 224 00:10:05,760 --> 00:10:07,760 Speaker 2: to that. He's not so immune from that that he 225 00:10:07,800 --> 00:10:09,960 Speaker 2: doesn't know what it's like to be in physical and 226 00:10:10,000 --> 00:10:10,840 Speaker 2: emotional pain. 227 00:10:10,960 --> 00:10:12,280 Speaker 1: Well, what do you say to people who say, wait 228 00:10:12,280 --> 00:10:14,000 Speaker 1: a minute, If he already knows what I'm what I'm 229 00:10:14,080 --> 00:10:15,840 Speaker 1: what I'm suffering with, he already knows it, why do 230 00:10:15,880 --> 00:10:18,160 Speaker 1: I have to pray? I can just go on and exist? 231 00:10:18,240 --> 00:10:21,400 Speaker 2: Right to me, that would be so painful not to 232 00:10:21,480 --> 00:10:24,640 Speaker 2: reach for his his hand, that he's reaching down to 233 00:10:24,640 --> 00:10:27,880 Speaker 2: you his presence, and for me, that time was hard. 234 00:10:27,880 --> 00:10:29,880 Speaker 2: I never would have in advance of it if people 235 00:10:29,880 --> 00:10:32,040 Speaker 2: would say, would you like a disease? It's super painful 236 00:10:32,080 --> 00:10:34,200 Speaker 2: and there's no cure for it. Wiling, No, I don't 237 00:10:34,240 --> 00:10:37,240 Speaker 2: want that on my menu. But it was a very 238 00:10:37,280 --> 00:10:40,160 Speaker 2: bittersweet time in that I knew his presence in that 239 00:10:40,280 --> 00:10:42,680 Speaker 2: valley in a way that I wouldn't have known it otherwise. 240 00:10:42,840 --> 00:10:44,640 Speaker 1: It isn't weird that's where you feel him I mean, 241 00:10:44,640 --> 00:10:46,600 Speaker 1: I know in my own dark moments, in the most 242 00:10:46,640 --> 00:10:49,200 Speaker 1: difficult moments, that is when you feel him up. It's 243 00:10:49,200 --> 00:10:53,360 Speaker 1: like it's like he comes closer in those moments and 244 00:10:53,440 --> 00:10:56,720 Speaker 1: you don't want them, no, but they're part of They're 245 00:10:56,760 --> 00:10:58,920 Speaker 1: part of the journey. Yeah, it is faithful. 246 00:10:59,280 --> 00:11:02,360 Speaker 2: A strange thing. And I finally had a surgery several 247 00:11:02,559 --> 00:11:04,719 Speaker 2: years into this that doesn't always work, so I had 248 00:11:04,840 --> 00:11:06,800 Speaker 2: put it off. Finally got to the end of my 249 00:11:06,800 --> 00:11:08,719 Speaker 2: wrote my doctor said, you'll know when everything else we've 250 00:11:08,760 --> 00:11:12,080 Speaker 2: tried is exhausted. The surgery is very difficult. It did 251 00:11:12,120 --> 00:11:14,920 Speaker 2: work for me, so I am so grateful on the 252 00:11:14,960 --> 00:11:17,400 Speaker 2: other side of it. But when I started getting better, 253 00:11:18,040 --> 00:11:20,280 Speaker 2: it was funny to me that I felt a little 254 00:11:20,320 --> 00:11:22,360 Speaker 2: bit of an ache, like, oh, maybe I'm not going 255 00:11:22,400 --> 00:11:25,120 Speaker 2: to be so dependent and so sitting in his presence 256 00:11:25,320 --> 00:11:28,040 Speaker 2: in this real, real way every single day because I 257 00:11:28,120 --> 00:11:30,200 Speaker 2: count on him to be able to get up, to 258 00:11:30,360 --> 00:11:31,360 Speaker 2: go through life, to. 259 00:11:31,520 --> 00:11:33,360 Speaker 1: Just exist every fact. 260 00:11:33,720 --> 00:11:36,120 Speaker 2: And so I thought, yeah, it's been a beautiful thing 261 00:11:36,160 --> 00:11:38,400 Speaker 2: to be in this valley and to have that really 262 00:11:39,240 --> 00:11:42,880 Speaker 2: really the presence that you could almost touch from him. 263 00:11:43,040 --> 00:11:45,800 Speaker 1: Wow, now you've written a new book. Overcoming Nothing is 264 00:11:45,840 --> 00:11:49,079 Speaker 1: impossible with God, which really touches on everything we've been 265 00:11:49,240 --> 00:11:53,720 Speaker 1: talking about in some ways. And it's Moses and Joshua 266 00:11:53,760 --> 00:11:58,840 Speaker 1: and Joseph and Jonah getting him. Why these figures they're 267 00:11:58,840 --> 00:12:00,640 Speaker 1: all male figures, by the way, in the past you've 268 00:12:00,640 --> 00:12:05,040 Speaker 1: done women of the Bible. Why these figures and what 269 00:12:05,280 --> 00:12:06,920 Speaker 1: ties them all together in your mind? 270 00:12:07,440 --> 00:12:09,679 Speaker 2: I've always loved the story of getting He's kind of 271 00:12:09,679 --> 00:12:11,720 Speaker 2: the jumping off point for the whole thing because he 272 00:12:12,080 --> 00:12:15,800 Speaker 2: was completely outmanned, outgunned. Nothing that God was asking him 273 00:12:15,840 --> 00:12:18,120 Speaker 2: to do would make sense on paper. And I've always 274 00:12:18,160 --> 00:12:20,679 Speaker 2: thought of him as an overcomer. So each book that 275 00:12:20,720 --> 00:12:22,640 Speaker 2: I've done, which has been such a blessing, I learned 276 00:12:22,679 --> 00:12:24,440 Speaker 2: so much through each of them. I'd always had this 277 00:12:24,520 --> 00:12:27,640 Speaker 2: collection rattling around of these stories, Like, to me, the 278 00:12:27,679 --> 00:12:30,680 Speaker 2: through line is the overcoming. Sometimes it was external stuff 279 00:12:30,720 --> 00:12:33,000 Speaker 2: that they had to going into a battle, but a 280 00:12:33,000 --> 00:12:36,760 Speaker 2: lot of it's internal stuff like self doubts, rebellion, our 281 00:12:36,800 --> 00:12:38,960 Speaker 2: own failures, like we see with Peter. His story is 282 00:12:39,040 --> 00:12:42,200 Speaker 2: so full of redemption to me. So I had kind 283 00:12:42,200 --> 00:12:43,800 Speaker 2: of collected these over the year, saying, if I can 284 00:12:43,840 --> 00:12:45,840 Speaker 2: do a book on overcomers, I would love to include 285 00:12:45,880 --> 00:12:46,960 Speaker 2: all of these men together. 286 00:12:47,720 --> 00:12:49,480 Speaker 1: And it has come to you. I want to read something. 287 00:12:49,480 --> 00:12:52,400 Speaker 1: This appealed to me as a newsman. You wrote this, 288 00:12:53,000 --> 00:12:56,439 Speaker 1: I'm pondering. I was pondering the verse and Ecclesiastes one 289 00:12:56,640 --> 00:12:59,719 Speaker 1: nine that says there's nothing new under the sun. There 290 00:12:59,720 --> 00:13:02,480 Speaker 1: was all always war, There's always loss in death, and 291 00:13:02,600 --> 00:13:07,200 Speaker 1: medical diagnoses and financial ruin. All those things are studied 292 00:13:07,200 --> 00:13:09,760 Speaker 1: and portrayed in the Bible. So when I look at 293 00:13:09,760 --> 00:13:14,160 Speaker 1: it today and it feels so divisive and chaotic, I think, Okay, 294 00:13:14,559 --> 00:13:17,360 Speaker 1: none of this is a surprise to God. I look 295 00:13:17,360 --> 00:13:20,080 Speaker 1: at news through the lens of eternity and try to 296 00:13:20,120 --> 00:13:24,960 Speaker 1: remember that good will ultimately triumph over evil. How does 297 00:13:25,000 --> 00:13:29,439 Speaker 1: that notion strengthen you? And how does it change the 298 00:13:29,520 --> 00:13:31,280 Speaker 1: way you report what you do on a Sunday and 299 00:13:31,320 --> 00:13:31,960 Speaker 1: throughout the week. 300 00:13:32,760 --> 00:13:34,800 Speaker 2: I think all of us, when we've had to cover 301 00:13:34,920 --> 00:13:36,959 Speaker 2: or be in places that are very difficult and painful 302 00:13:37,000 --> 00:13:41,520 Speaker 2: and see families and loss and suffering and shootings and 303 00:13:41,640 --> 00:13:45,640 Speaker 2: natural disasters, is very hard to sit with that. But 304 00:13:45,760 --> 00:13:48,360 Speaker 2: I don't know how people do it without faith. Because 305 00:13:48,360 --> 00:13:50,360 Speaker 2: for me in the morning to be in the Word 306 00:13:50,760 --> 00:13:52,920 Speaker 2: to journal when I have time to read and pray. 307 00:13:53,640 --> 00:13:55,560 Speaker 2: That sets me up for whatever's coming down the pike 308 00:13:55,600 --> 00:13:59,760 Speaker 2: that day, personally or professionally. But I do have the 309 00:13:59,800 --> 00:14:03,480 Speaker 2: law to term view that I know all of these painful, 310 00:14:03,600 --> 00:14:08,160 Speaker 2: chaotic things will one day be at peace. God will 311 00:14:08,200 --> 00:14:11,400 Speaker 2: triumph good over evil. Wipe boy every tear from every eye. 312 00:14:11,920 --> 00:14:15,079 Speaker 2: Those good things are coming. This life, to me will 313 00:14:15,120 --> 00:14:17,400 Speaker 2: be such a vapor, such a blink for us, compared 314 00:14:17,440 --> 00:14:19,040 Speaker 2: to peace, the peace of eternity. 315 00:14:19,240 --> 00:14:21,040 Speaker 1: You talk about Gideon in the book, who is like 316 00:14:21,080 --> 00:14:23,960 Speaker 1: the patron saint of impostors. Yeah, I mean, you know, 317 00:14:24,040 --> 00:14:29,760 Speaker 1: he's the ultimate impostor syndrome. Tell me about because he's 318 00:14:29,760 --> 00:14:32,480 Speaker 1: called to be this mighty war. Tell me about why 319 00:14:32,560 --> 00:14:34,800 Speaker 1: that story was important. What's the lesson for people? 320 00:14:34,960 --> 00:14:36,920 Speaker 2: What I love is that when we see him, when 321 00:14:36,960 --> 00:14:40,200 Speaker 2: God goes to speak to him, Israel's in trouble. They're 322 00:14:40,240 --> 00:14:43,960 Speaker 2: being oppressed. He is doing threshing. So normally you would 323 00:14:43,960 --> 00:14:46,360 Speaker 2: do that outside the wind would help separate the wheat 324 00:14:46,360 --> 00:14:48,920 Speaker 2: in the chaff. You'd have the assistance of the weight 325 00:14:49,000 --> 00:14:51,720 Speaker 2: of those matters. But now he is hiding out in 326 00:14:51,760 --> 00:14:53,560 Speaker 2: a wine press, which is damp and dark. It's not 327 00:14:53,600 --> 00:14:55,560 Speaker 2: the place you want to be doing threshing. So he's 328 00:14:55,600 --> 00:14:58,600 Speaker 2: completely hiding out and God shows up and, as you said, 329 00:14:58,600 --> 00:15:00,920 Speaker 2: addresses him as mighty war or. He's calling him into 330 00:15:00,920 --> 00:15:03,240 Speaker 2: this battle where Israel's going to throw off their oppressors. 331 00:15:03,760 --> 00:15:05,960 Speaker 2: And I love that Gideon. The interpretation is he says, 332 00:15:05,960 --> 00:15:08,560 Speaker 2: pardon me, you know literally, like, I think you have 333 00:15:08,600 --> 00:15:10,880 Speaker 2: the wrong guy. I'm the least in my family. My 334 00:15:10,880 --> 00:15:13,040 Speaker 2: family's the least in the klam or the least tribe, Like, 335 00:15:13,120 --> 00:15:15,720 Speaker 2: I'm not the guy for this. But little by little 336 00:15:15,720 --> 00:15:18,240 Speaker 2: you see his faith grow, his trust grow. He asks 337 00:15:18,280 --> 00:15:21,360 Speaker 2: Scott for assurances, that whole fleece thing that in the 338 00:15:21,360 --> 00:15:24,040 Speaker 2: secular world knows this putting out a fleece. That's the 339 00:15:24,040 --> 00:15:27,040 Speaker 2: story of Gideon. And so along the way he becomes 340 00:15:27,040 --> 00:15:29,880 Speaker 2: braver and braver and more and more trusting, and at 341 00:15:29,920 --> 00:15:32,400 Speaker 2: the end he's called into battle with just God has 342 00:15:32,400 --> 00:15:34,560 Speaker 2: stripped him down to the three hundred men. That is it. 343 00:15:35,000 --> 00:15:39,360 Speaker 2: Their trumpets, you know, their lamps, and that's it. And 344 00:15:39,440 --> 00:15:42,400 Speaker 2: we see a man who's no longer afraid, who is 345 00:15:42,480 --> 00:15:44,880 Speaker 2: trusting that God is faithful. He means what he says, 346 00:15:45,200 --> 00:15:47,880 Speaker 2: He's got your back, and they have this victorious battle 347 00:15:47,880 --> 00:15:50,800 Speaker 2: and afterwards, the people try to come and say to Gideon, like, oh, 348 00:15:50,840 --> 00:15:53,720 Speaker 2: you're the guy, You're the king. Gudeon's like, Nope, this 349 00:15:53,760 --> 00:15:54,720 Speaker 2: is about God, not me. 350 00:15:55,000 --> 00:15:58,480 Speaker 1: Yeah, wow, I want to tell you about alve Maria 351 00:15:58,640 --> 00:16:03,320 Speaker 1: Mutual Funds. Ave Maria isn't just about investing, It's about 352 00:16:03,440 --> 00:16:07,000 Speaker 1: living your values. As someone who cares deeply about faith 353 00:16:07,400 --> 00:16:10,880 Speaker 1: and family, and as an ave Maria investor myself, for years, 354 00:16:11,520 --> 00:16:16,480 Speaker 1: I've always believed where we put our money matters. Working 355 00:16:16,520 --> 00:16:19,400 Speaker 1: with ave Maria Mutual Funds has shown me you don't 356 00:16:19,440 --> 00:16:24,360 Speaker 1: have to compromise your principles to achieve financial success. 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All mutual funds are subject 363 00:16:52,960 --> 00:16:57,560 Speaker 1: to market risk, including possible loss of principle, request or prospectives, 364 00:16:57,600 --> 00:17:03,040 Speaker 1: which includes investment objectives, risk, fees, charges and expenses, and 365 00:17:03,120 --> 00:17:07,440 Speaker 1: other information that you should read and consider carefully before investing. 366 00:17:07,840 --> 00:17:11,080 Speaker 1: You can get the prospectus by calling eight six six 367 00:17:11,520 --> 00:17:15,280 Speaker 1: two eight three six two seven four, or you can 368 00:17:15,359 --> 00:17:20,080 Speaker 1: view it at ave Mariafunds dot com. Ave Maria Mutual 369 00:17:20,160 --> 00:17:25,119 Speaker 1: Funds are distributed by Ultimus Funds Distributors, LLC. And you 370 00:17:25,160 --> 00:17:27,360 Speaker 1: talk about Moses, which I love the way you frame it, 371 00:17:27,720 --> 00:17:32,240 Speaker 1: where he had physical courage but lack social courage. Talk 372 00:17:32,280 --> 00:17:36,359 Speaker 1: to me about that and the lesson for people about 373 00:17:36,400 --> 00:17:39,680 Speaker 1: trusting God in that way, it's again the eternal. 374 00:17:39,280 --> 00:17:41,840 Speaker 2: Battle, right, Yeah, So of course God comes to him 375 00:17:41,880 --> 00:17:43,919 Speaker 2: and says, you're going to go free the people, the 376 00:17:43,960 --> 00:17:46,600 Speaker 2: millions of people that are being held hostage essentially slaves 377 00:17:46,640 --> 00:17:49,680 Speaker 2: in Egypt. And he again starts arguing with God, Nope, 378 00:17:49,680 --> 00:17:51,080 Speaker 2: not the guy for this. Don't want to do it. 379 00:17:51,240 --> 00:17:54,240 Speaker 2: And we know he's physically strong. He's had this moment 380 00:17:54,280 --> 00:17:56,679 Speaker 2: of feeling that he was rising up against this injustice 381 00:17:56,680 --> 00:17:59,119 Speaker 2: of one of the Hebrew slaves being beaten by an 382 00:17:59,119 --> 00:18:01,719 Speaker 2: Egyptian and he kills the Egyptian and then he's terrified. 383 00:18:01,720 --> 00:18:03,879 Speaker 2: He goes on the run when people find out, but 384 00:18:04,200 --> 00:18:06,240 Speaker 2: he's not only afraid, I think to go to Fedo, 385 00:18:06,359 --> 00:18:08,480 Speaker 2: who listen is the most powerful man in the world 386 00:18:08,520 --> 00:18:10,880 Speaker 2: and could kill him in a moment's notice. But he's 387 00:18:10,920 --> 00:18:13,640 Speaker 2: afraid to go to the leaders of Israel to say, Oh, 388 00:18:13,680 --> 00:18:15,159 Speaker 2: God sent me and this is what we're going to do. 389 00:18:15,240 --> 00:18:17,200 Speaker 2: And he's saying to God like they're not going to 390 00:18:17,280 --> 00:18:20,359 Speaker 2: believe me. They're like, I'm not the guy. But God 391 00:18:20,400 --> 00:18:22,679 Speaker 2: gives him the courage and then, man, we see some 392 00:18:22,720 --> 00:18:25,200 Speaker 2: of the most astounding miracles in the Bible came through 393 00:18:25,200 --> 00:18:27,120 Speaker 2: this guy who started out very fearful. 394 00:18:27,400 --> 00:18:30,639 Speaker 1: Yeah, and I mean we know from the scripture's speech 395 00:18:30,800 --> 00:18:34,639 Speaker 1: was not his calling guard. I mean, Aaron has to 396 00:18:34,680 --> 00:18:37,439 Speaker 1: go speak for him. So it's an interesting interesting how 397 00:18:37,480 --> 00:18:40,240 Speaker 1: God uses this broken and imperfect vessel to do this 398 00:18:40,280 --> 00:18:43,440 Speaker 1: incredible thing. Talk to me about confidence, because you're writing 399 00:18:43,480 --> 00:18:48,000 Speaker 1: the book that the solution to self confidence. The answer 400 00:18:48,040 --> 00:18:49,919 Speaker 1: is not more conscious what is it. 401 00:18:50,240 --> 00:18:53,760 Speaker 2: Yeah, it's more dependence, which completely flies in the face 402 00:18:53,800 --> 00:18:55,879 Speaker 2: of what the world would tell us today. It is 403 00:18:55,920 --> 00:18:58,760 Speaker 2: more about you hype yourself up, get more likes, be 404 00:18:58,920 --> 00:19:00,959 Speaker 2: the brand, do all of these things. But that's so 405 00:19:01,119 --> 00:19:03,199 Speaker 2: antithetical to what God calls us to. I think he 406 00:19:03,280 --> 00:19:05,119 Speaker 2: makes us so that we are dependent we need to 407 00:19:05,119 --> 00:19:08,840 Speaker 2: be dependent on him to get anything done. And that's 408 00:19:08,840 --> 00:19:11,399 Speaker 2: why I think he uses such flawed, broken people because 409 00:19:11,400 --> 00:19:13,840 Speaker 2: in the end, it can't be about them, It's got 410 00:19:13,880 --> 00:19:14,520 Speaker 2: to be about God. 411 00:19:14,640 --> 00:19:18,200 Speaker 1: Yeah, you write about Jesus. Jesus is the ultimate hero 412 00:19:18,280 --> 00:19:22,640 Speaker 1: that you bring full circle. I mean, if your perfection 413 00:19:22,760 --> 00:19:26,800 Speaker 1: and your God, what's the lesson there? It's kind of 414 00:19:26,800 --> 00:19:28,360 Speaker 1: hard to reach for that. Right. 415 00:19:28,640 --> 00:19:31,640 Speaker 2: He doesn't have to overcome anything that he wasn't able 416 00:19:31,680 --> 00:19:34,600 Speaker 2: to overcome. But it was sin and death. And that's 417 00:19:34,640 --> 00:19:37,240 Speaker 2: where all of our hope comes from, for the entire book, 418 00:19:37,280 --> 00:19:39,640 Speaker 2: for the Bible, for all of our faith, is that 419 00:19:39,720 --> 00:19:42,600 Speaker 2: he willingly stood up knowing he was the only person 420 00:19:42,640 --> 00:19:45,280 Speaker 2: who could overcome those things. He was the only being 421 00:19:46,000 --> 00:19:48,440 Speaker 2: who could leave the glories of heaven and say, oh, 422 00:19:48,440 --> 00:19:51,520 Speaker 2: I'm going to go down there, live the dirty, real 423 00:19:51,640 --> 00:19:55,040 Speaker 2: human life, be tortured, be killed. But because he did 424 00:19:55,040 --> 00:19:57,320 Speaker 2: that and had that time of separation from the Father 425 00:19:57,520 --> 00:20:00,720 Speaker 2: and covered our sins, he overcame sit in death for 426 00:20:00,760 --> 00:20:01,359 Speaker 2: all of us. 427 00:20:02,000 --> 00:20:04,920 Speaker 1: Who is the eleven men that you feature in the book. 428 00:20:05,560 --> 00:20:08,480 Speaker 1: Who of them do you think the leaders in DC 429 00:20:08,680 --> 00:20:09,880 Speaker 1: need read today? 430 00:20:10,240 --> 00:20:12,480 Speaker 2: Oh, that's a great question. 431 00:20:12,600 --> 00:20:13,560 Speaker 1: Give the reading list. 432 00:20:13,960 --> 00:20:16,720 Speaker 2: You know what I think of Nehemiah a lot, because 433 00:20:16,800 --> 00:20:20,800 Speaker 2: he was taken away from his homeland. He's living in 434 00:20:20,840 --> 00:20:23,719 Speaker 2: service to a foreign king. His brother tells him the 435 00:20:23,720 --> 00:20:26,399 Speaker 2: walls of Jerusalem have fallen. It is a shame to 436 00:20:26,440 --> 00:20:30,320 Speaker 2: our people. It is completely in disarray. And Niamyah has 437 00:20:30,359 --> 00:20:32,760 Speaker 2: this burden, this dream from God to go back and 438 00:20:32,760 --> 00:20:35,360 Speaker 2: build that. Now he runs in all kinds of trouble yep, 439 00:20:35,480 --> 00:20:37,919 Speaker 2: but he's prayed up. He's prepared. He doesn't go to 440 00:20:37,960 --> 00:20:40,640 Speaker 2: the king to ask for anything without being completely prepared, 441 00:20:40,880 --> 00:20:42,760 Speaker 2: so that when the king says, of course, you're my 442 00:20:42,800 --> 00:20:45,919 Speaker 2: faithful servant, I will send you with people, with what 443 00:20:46,000 --> 00:20:48,840 Speaker 2: you need to go do this. Clearly, Niamiah had been 444 00:20:48,880 --> 00:20:50,800 Speaker 2: the kind of guy that he needed to be to 445 00:20:50,800 --> 00:20:52,160 Speaker 2: be a leader. Now he had to be a leader 446 00:20:52,200 --> 00:20:54,240 Speaker 2: to all these people, and he had to lead them 447 00:20:54,280 --> 00:20:57,920 Speaker 2: in the construction and the work, but also in the defense, 448 00:20:58,440 --> 00:21:00,320 Speaker 2: you know, the physical defense of what they were doing. 449 00:21:00,359 --> 00:21:03,440 Speaker 2: So he was humble, he prayed, he was prepared, He 450 00:21:03,520 --> 00:21:05,800 Speaker 2: went to God. I think all leaders could use that. 451 00:21:05,960 --> 00:21:08,760 Speaker 1: Yes, Okay, here's something I don't think anybody has ever 452 00:21:08,840 --> 00:21:09,199 Speaker 1: asked you. 453 00:21:09,400 --> 00:21:11,200 Speaker 2: Okay, have you come. 454 00:21:10,960 --> 00:21:16,880 Speaker 1: Across anyone in DC where you came away impressed by 455 00:21:16,920 --> 00:21:17,719 Speaker 1: their integrity. 456 00:21:18,640 --> 00:21:21,120 Speaker 2: Yes, I would say there are many people, and one 457 00:21:21,119 --> 00:21:23,520 Speaker 2: of them is in a very public situation right now, 458 00:21:23,520 --> 00:21:26,960 Speaker 2: which is Ben Sass who was senator. He's been a 459 00:21:26,960 --> 00:21:30,479 Speaker 2: college president, all kinds of things. But I always liked 460 00:21:30,520 --> 00:21:32,440 Speaker 2: him and that he seemed like the kind of person 461 00:21:32,480 --> 00:21:35,119 Speaker 2: who was serious about his faith, about his family, his 462 00:21:35,160 --> 00:21:37,919 Speaker 2: commitment to his marriage and to his children, did not 463 00:21:37,960 --> 00:21:41,560 Speaker 2: get sucked into the whole DC machine. And now he 464 00:21:41,680 --> 00:21:46,719 Speaker 2: is essentially dying publicly, and he is man sharing the 465 00:21:46,760 --> 00:21:49,360 Speaker 2: truth and the word at a time when he could 466 00:21:49,440 --> 00:21:51,920 Speaker 2: just go into a shell and say I'm in pain and. 467 00:21:51,960 --> 00:21:53,200 Speaker 1: Depressed and be depressed. 468 00:21:53,200 --> 00:21:58,359 Speaker 2: But he is man sharing the light and it's a beautiful, 469 00:21:58,680 --> 00:22:00,760 Speaker 2: bittersweet thing to watch. But I've always thought he was 470 00:22:00,800 --> 00:22:01,600 Speaker 2: a man of integrity. 471 00:22:01,680 --> 00:22:05,000 Speaker 1: Is there anyone in public life who was so discordant 472 00:22:05,040 --> 00:22:06,960 Speaker 1: from the public image you had of them that it 473 00:22:07,000 --> 00:22:07,439 Speaker 1: shook you? 474 00:22:08,600 --> 00:22:12,800 Speaker 2: Let's think about that. I do think a lot of 475 00:22:12,800 --> 00:22:16,320 Speaker 2: people in DC have a public persona that is different 476 00:22:16,480 --> 00:22:19,560 Speaker 2: than what you see in front of the cameras. Yeah, 477 00:22:19,640 --> 00:22:21,720 Speaker 2: I think that you would know plenty of those people do. 478 00:22:22,200 --> 00:22:23,760 Speaker 1: I'm not talking, I'm asking you. 479 00:22:23,840 --> 00:22:26,719 Speaker 2: Oh, I will say, I won't say it. I will say, 480 00:22:26,760 --> 00:22:31,760 Speaker 2: but there was one lawmaker in particular that very publicly 481 00:22:32,240 --> 00:22:35,800 Speaker 2: person of faith, at least nominally would talk about that 482 00:22:35,880 --> 00:22:40,159 Speaker 2: kind of thing, and yet behind the scenes, you know, 483 00:22:40,320 --> 00:22:44,480 Speaker 2: I witnessed some really terrible behavior that I thought, Gosh, 484 00:22:44,520 --> 00:22:47,280 Speaker 2: if people really knew this is who you are in private, 485 00:22:48,000 --> 00:22:49,560 Speaker 2: I don't think you'd have the same donors in the 486 00:22:49,600 --> 00:22:51,600 Speaker 2: same events in the church things and all that kind 487 00:22:51,600 --> 00:22:54,159 Speaker 2: of stuff showing up. So I think there's always kind 488 00:22:54,160 --> 00:22:56,720 Speaker 2: of that level of disappointment. But we're all human, Yeah. 489 00:22:56,600 --> 00:22:59,800 Speaker 1: Flawed people are flawed, and you hope grace will come 490 00:22:59,880 --> 00:23:03,480 Speaker 1: in we all Yes, I agree. What is the most 491 00:23:04,080 --> 00:23:08,440 Speaker 1: difficult part of covering and returning every week to d C. 492 00:23:08,600 --> 00:23:10,320 Speaker 1: You've been doing this for a long time, longer than 493 00:23:10,359 --> 00:23:13,760 Speaker 1: I have. My friend Richard John Newhouse used to say, 494 00:23:14,320 --> 00:23:18,359 Speaker 1: Father Richard Newhouse, that d C is a one game town, 495 00:23:18,960 --> 00:23:22,840 Speaker 1: power by power. He said, if you're not very careful, 496 00:23:22,880 --> 00:23:24,479 Speaker 1: like an idol, it will crush you. Oh. 497 00:23:24,560 --> 00:23:28,600 Speaker 2: Yes, do you feel that very wise words? Yes, because 498 00:23:28,600 --> 00:23:31,440 Speaker 2: it is a city that trades on power. Who do 499 00:23:31,480 --> 00:23:33,000 Speaker 2: you know, what can you get me? What kind of 500 00:23:33,080 --> 00:23:35,560 Speaker 2: access can you get me. And it's tricky as a journalist. 501 00:23:35,640 --> 00:23:37,320 Speaker 2: You have to have sources and you have to work 502 00:23:37,359 --> 00:23:41,720 Speaker 2: those sources. But man, it's really you got to have 503 00:23:41,960 --> 00:23:45,119 Speaker 2: sort of a boundary and some lines where you won't go. 504 00:23:45,400 --> 00:23:47,720 Speaker 2: I mean, people want to trade information and those kinds 505 00:23:47,720 --> 00:23:49,680 Speaker 2: of things. Listen, some people just it's a leaky place, 506 00:23:49,760 --> 00:23:51,840 Speaker 2: you know that, like people in the minute they leak 507 00:23:51,880 --> 00:23:53,760 Speaker 2: you information, like what's in it for them? Why am 508 00:23:53,760 --> 00:23:57,119 Speaker 2: I getting this bit of information? But man, it's a 509 00:23:57,160 --> 00:23:59,440 Speaker 2: town that will appeal to your ego if you don't 510 00:23:59,440 --> 00:24:00,000 Speaker 2: really watch it. 511 00:24:00,080 --> 00:24:02,320 Speaker 1: Yeah, Now, the distance, it's kind of I mean, you 512 00:24:02,680 --> 00:24:08,200 Speaker 1: split your time now between Tennessee and DC. You know 513 00:24:09,000 --> 00:24:11,000 Speaker 1: I do the same with New Orleans. It's a better 514 00:24:11,040 --> 00:24:14,360 Speaker 1: way that I find to operate just here because you're 515 00:24:14,400 --> 00:24:18,400 Speaker 1: not you're not part of that four seven. Yeah, it's 516 00:24:18,440 --> 00:24:20,879 Speaker 1: its own. It has its own rhythm that can kill you. 517 00:24:20,960 --> 00:24:23,480 Speaker 1: I remember years ago I worked with Bob Novak, who 518 00:24:23,520 --> 00:24:26,320 Speaker 1: is my great mentor, and Bob said, we were at 519 00:24:26,359 --> 00:24:29,879 Speaker 1: a lunch and there was a cabinet secretary and a 520 00:24:29,920 --> 00:24:32,240 Speaker 1: former president came over. It was well, you know, in 521 00:24:32,280 --> 00:24:35,240 Speaker 1: one of them typical Davy clubs, breakfast with the army 522 00:24:35,320 --> 00:24:37,960 Speaker 1: Navy class. And afterward we get in the car and 523 00:24:37,960 --> 00:24:40,520 Speaker 1: he said, remember one because they invited They invited both 524 00:24:40,520 --> 00:24:43,119 Speaker 1: of us to a cookout that weekend. And Bob said, no, no, 525 00:24:43,080 --> 00:24:45,320 Speaker 1: I don't think I don't think we're able to make it. 526 00:24:45,359 --> 00:24:46,960 Speaker 1: I'm like I would have liked. 527 00:24:46,840 --> 00:24:48,399 Speaker 2: To Yeah, exactly, speak for yourself. 528 00:24:48,720 --> 00:24:50,680 Speaker 1: Well, Bob, you know I would have liked to have 529 00:24:50,720 --> 00:24:52,199 Speaker 1: gone to the barbecue. He said, get in the car. 530 00:24:52,280 --> 00:24:55,399 Speaker 1: Get in the car, and he says, remember something. I 531 00:24:55,400 --> 00:24:58,040 Speaker 1: said what he said. These people are your sources, not 532 00:24:58,160 --> 00:25:02,800 Speaker 1: your friends. Don't infuse them. That's very hard at this level, 533 00:25:02,840 --> 00:25:03,440 Speaker 1: the level you. 534 00:25:03,400 --> 00:25:06,159 Speaker 2: Are, Yeah, it is, but it is true because you 535 00:25:06,200 --> 00:25:08,000 Speaker 2: have to think about what are people using me for, 536 00:25:08,119 --> 00:25:10,720 Speaker 2: attempting to use me for, to plan certain information or 537 00:25:10,720 --> 00:25:13,320 Speaker 2: certain ideas, those kinds of things. So it is a 538 00:25:13,359 --> 00:25:16,639 Speaker 2: place that you are on guard a little bit, and 539 00:25:16,680 --> 00:25:19,040 Speaker 2: you should be for a little self protection. But when 540 00:25:19,040 --> 00:25:22,600 Speaker 2: I'm here in Tennessee, not that everyone is a perfect, 541 00:25:22,640 --> 00:25:24,359 Speaker 2: wonderful saint here, but gosh, there are a lot of them. 542 00:25:24,480 --> 00:25:27,920 Speaker 2: There are a lot of good people here who don't 543 00:25:27,960 --> 00:25:31,080 Speaker 2: have an agenda. Yeah, and DC is driven by a vertect. 544 00:25:31,119 --> 00:25:33,639 Speaker 1: Agenda and power and money. I mean, that's what drives 545 00:25:33,720 --> 00:25:36,359 Speaker 1: the place. Yeah, tell me, what are you hearing about 546 00:25:36,440 --> 00:25:39,159 Speaker 1: people reading the new book? I mean overcoming this is 547 00:25:39,160 --> 00:25:42,400 Speaker 1: something everybody grapples with at some point in their life. 548 00:25:42,560 --> 00:25:46,919 Speaker 1: They face an impossible, awful situation at times. What's the 549 00:25:46,960 --> 00:25:49,120 Speaker 1: big takeaway here from the book for you? 550 00:25:49,480 --> 00:25:51,840 Speaker 2: Well? I love when people say I've already gotten it. 551 00:25:51,920 --> 00:25:53,399 Speaker 2: I ordered it so that it showed up the day 552 00:25:53,400 --> 00:25:54,959 Speaker 2: that it was out, or I started listening to it 553 00:25:54,960 --> 00:25:57,840 Speaker 2: on audible, So I'm glad I did the audio version. 554 00:25:57,880 --> 00:26:01,159 Speaker 2: I always do those. My mom prefers that they like 555 00:26:01,200 --> 00:26:04,200 Speaker 2: to drive or are working out or doing whatever they're doing. 556 00:26:04,840 --> 00:26:06,560 Speaker 2: But I'd love to hear that people. I've heard from 557 00:26:06,600 --> 00:26:08,000 Speaker 2: a lot of people who had just gotten for that 558 00:26:08,400 --> 00:26:10,480 Speaker 2: first chapter with Gideon, who have said, I didn't know 559 00:26:10,520 --> 00:26:13,520 Speaker 2: I needed this. I didn't know I needed this specific encouragement, 560 00:26:13,920 --> 00:26:15,520 Speaker 2: and that makes me so happy because I want to 561 00:26:15,600 --> 00:26:17,680 Speaker 2: encourage people, but I want to equip them too. There's 562 00:26:17,720 --> 00:26:20,240 Speaker 2: some practical stuff in the book about when you find 563 00:26:20,240 --> 00:26:22,919 Speaker 2: yourself in this place, what do you do? And so 564 00:26:23,920 --> 00:26:25,359 Speaker 2: you know, when I hear from people they've gotten through 565 00:26:25,359 --> 00:26:27,000 Speaker 2: the first chapter and they already feel that way, that's 566 00:26:27,000 --> 00:26:27,680 Speaker 2: such a blessing. 567 00:26:28,080 --> 00:26:31,440 Speaker 1: Okay, there's an Royal Grande questionnaire that I ask everybody 568 00:26:31,440 --> 00:26:33,399 Speaker 1: on the show of it. You're ready, yeah, this is 569 00:26:33,600 --> 00:26:35,000 Speaker 1: this is rapid fire. 570 00:26:35,040 --> 00:26:36,840 Speaker 2: Are we going to get to sing? Can I sing 571 00:26:36,880 --> 00:26:37,640 Speaker 2: my answers? Yes? 572 00:26:37,680 --> 00:26:39,320 Speaker 1: You can sing your antry if you'd like. 573 00:26:39,320 --> 00:26:41,200 Speaker 2: If there's a if it's an appropriate it's okay. Okay. 574 00:26:41,240 --> 00:26:43,159 Speaker 1: What's the best advice you ever got? 575 00:26:43,520 --> 00:26:46,200 Speaker 2: Uh? To not take no for an answer. I really 576 00:26:46,200 --> 00:26:48,480 Speaker 2: think that that's the secret to getting anywhere, just out 577 00:26:48,520 --> 00:26:49,040 Speaker 2: last people. 578 00:26:49,320 --> 00:26:51,359 Speaker 1: What is the worst advice you ever saved? 579 00:26:52,359 --> 00:26:55,600 Speaker 2: You should show your legs in your body worm. That's 580 00:26:55,640 --> 00:26:56,080 Speaker 2: the worst. 581 00:26:56,440 --> 00:26:57,720 Speaker 1: And I know who gave you that too. 582 00:26:57,800 --> 00:27:02,200 Speaker 2: No, not to be named, just to ponder that among yourselves. 583 00:27:02,480 --> 00:27:05,520 Speaker 1: Okay, we'll leave that one alone. Who's the person you 584 00:27:05,560 --> 00:27:06,280 Speaker 1: most admire? 585 00:27:06,720 --> 00:27:09,480 Speaker 2: My mom, for sure. She was my first Bible teacher, 586 00:27:09,520 --> 00:27:11,119 Speaker 2: I mean, the first person to teach me to memory 587 00:27:11,200 --> 00:27:13,880 Speaker 2: scripture and to be humble. I mean, I think about 588 00:27:13,920 --> 00:27:15,719 Speaker 2: one of the first verses she taught me and Philippians 589 00:27:15,840 --> 00:27:19,119 Speaker 2: was let everyone to seem others better than themselves. And 590 00:27:19,200 --> 00:27:21,040 Speaker 2: so she's always said, no matter how much you achieve 591 00:27:21,080 --> 00:27:23,560 Speaker 2: or where you go, like, we're all equal at the 592 00:27:23,600 --> 00:27:26,560 Speaker 2: foot of the cross, she lives that. 593 00:27:26,920 --> 00:27:29,480 Speaker 1: Yeah, that's a lovely thing and something we need to 594 00:27:29,520 --> 00:27:33,600 Speaker 1: hear more of. Do you have any regrets? What regret 595 00:27:33,680 --> 00:27:35,080 Speaker 1: to Shannon Bramham? 596 00:27:35,800 --> 00:27:37,639 Speaker 2: You know what, I regret that there was a period 597 00:27:37,680 --> 00:27:40,439 Speaker 2: of time I was not so open about my faith. 598 00:27:41,200 --> 00:27:43,360 Speaker 2: I had been told by a boss at one time 599 00:27:43,359 --> 00:27:46,359 Speaker 2: that I was too churchy to religious, and so I 600 00:27:46,440 --> 00:27:48,480 Speaker 2: kind of hid my light for a little while. And 601 00:27:48,920 --> 00:27:52,080 Speaker 2: I have regrets that I compromised in that way, but 602 00:27:52,320 --> 00:27:54,320 Speaker 2: very thankful that I've been able to hopefully make up 603 00:27:54,640 --> 00:27:56,040 Speaker 2: you've made. 604 00:27:56,160 --> 00:27:57,120 Speaker 1: Yeah, I think more. 605 00:27:57,040 --> 00:27:59,720 Speaker 2: Than that was a very human decision that I thought, Okay, 606 00:27:59,720 --> 00:28:01,159 Speaker 2: if this is going to hurt me, I'm not going 607 00:28:01,200 --> 00:28:02,240 Speaker 2: to talk about it all the time. 608 00:28:02,359 --> 00:28:05,359 Speaker 1: What do you know that others don't or may have 609 00:28:05,400 --> 00:28:10,439 Speaker 1: forgotten about anything? About anything? What do you know or 610 00:28:10,600 --> 00:28:13,840 Speaker 1: come to discover that others don't know or fear know. 611 00:28:14,480 --> 00:28:18,800 Speaker 2: I feel like persistence is so much of getting anywhere 612 00:28:18,800 --> 00:28:21,399 Speaker 2: in life, personally or professionally. I think it's easy to 613 00:28:21,440 --> 00:28:23,199 Speaker 2: give up because we have a culture that kind of 614 00:28:23,720 --> 00:28:27,760 Speaker 2: makes people and relationships and even jobs disposable. Everybody's running 615 00:28:27,760 --> 00:28:30,480 Speaker 2: and running run into the next thing. I think persistence 616 00:28:30,720 --> 00:28:32,680 Speaker 2: is an undervalued quality. 617 00:28:34,320 --> 00:28:35,399 Speaker 1: What do you fear most? 618 00:28:36,880 --> 00:28:40,000 Speaker 2: Hmm, you know, I would hate to get to the 619 00:28:40,120 --> 00:28:42,400 Speaker 2: end of my life and feel like I've missed my 620 00:28:42,600 --> 00:28:46,920 Speaker 2: mission that people. You know, I don't write books just 621 00:28:46,960 --> 00:28:49,080 Speaker 2: to write a book and get acclaim for it, but 622 00:28:49,120 --> 00:28:51,960 Speaker 2: that I actually care about people. And it's easy to 623 00:28:52,000 --> 00:28:55,120 Speaker 2: get busy and run on to the next thing. So 624 00:28:55,520 --> 00:28:58,360 Speaker 2: I fear getting off track and waking up one day 625 00:28:58,360 --> 00:29:00,920 Speaker 2: and saying you're missing it. I don't want to do that. 626 00:29:01,280 --> 00:29:04,640 Speaker 1: Wow, that's it's an important Yeah, it's an important thing. 627 00:29:04,640 --> 00:29:07,280 Speaker 1: You keep seing your mission, stay on mission, which is. 628 00:29:07,360 --> 00:29:08,280 Speaker 2: We all get distracted. 629 00:29:08,360 --> 00:29:14,000 Speaker 1: Everybody gets distracted. What what was the last great book 630 00:29:14,040 --> 00:29:16,000 Speaker 1: you read in your favorite. 631 00:29:15,560 --> 00:29:19,720 Speaker 2: Book I am reading THEO of Golden right now. And 632 00:29:20,280 --> 00:29:22,920 Speaker 2: my favorite bookstore here in Tennessee. I was there buying 633 00:29:22,920 --> 00:29:24,720 Speaker 2: some other books and they said, have you read this one? 634 00:29:24,800 --> 00:29:26,720 Speaker 2: And I said, I've heard about it, and they said, 635 00:29:26,720 --> 00:29:28,800 Speaker 2: you got to get this one too. It is so 636 00:29:29,000 --> 00:29:31,280 Speaker 2: lovely and so charming. I'm not done with it yet, 637 00:29:31,280 --> 00:29:34,160 Speaker 2: but I'm in love with it. It is beautiful and 638 00:29:34,240 --> 00:29:37,320 Speaker 2: it is about humanity and caring, and it's just it's 639 00:29:37,320 --> 00:29:39,120 Speaker 2: such a beautiful thing. I don't know if there's going 640 00:29:39,160 --> 00:29:40,760 Speaker 2: to be some twists and turns along the way. I'm 641 00:29:40,800 --> 00:29:43,080 Speaker 2: not done yet. But it's a beautiful book. My outside 642 00:29:43,080 --> 00:29:43,800 Speaker 2: of the Bible, all. 643 00:29:43,760 --> 00:29:45,920 Speaker 1: Right, favorite after the Bible. 644 00:29:45,720 --> 00:29:48,760 Speaker 2: After the Bible. Oh, that's like your favorite baby, your 645 00:29:48,760 --> 00:29:53,240 Speaker 2: favorite child. I am obsessed with books, you know. I 646 00:29:53,320 --> 00:29:56,520 Speaker 2: read one I love. I read this years ago. Same 647 00:29:56,600 --> 00:29:59,280 Speaker 2: kind of different as me. Oh, I don't know, really 648 00:29:59,320 --> 00:30:03,680 Speaker 2: stuck with me. It's a beautiful book about reaching across 649 00:30:05,600 --> 00:30:09,920 Speaker 2: class lines and assumptions about people and just the power 650 00:30:09,960 --> 00:30:12,440 Speaker 2: of faith. Same kind of different as me. It's beautiful. 651 00:30:12,520 --> 00:30:16,600 Speaker 1: Wow. What happens when this is over? Hm hmm, meaning TV, 652 00:30:17,000 --> 00:30:20,080 Speaker 1: I'm leaving it to you. Well, I feel everybody takes 653 00:30:20,120 --> 00:30:20,840 Speaker 1: their own I. 654 00:30:20,840 --> 00:30:22,880 Speaker 2: Think about right, like the job I'm doing now. I 655 00:30:22,920 --> 00:30:25,040 Speaker 2: think TV will kick me out at some point. That 656 00:30:25,240 --> 00:30:27,640 Speaker 2: what we talk about that at some point. I really 657 00:30:27,720 --> 00:30:30,680 Speaker 2: have found so much joy in writing. I would love 658 00:30:30,720 --> 00:30:32,440 Speaker 2: to be able to have this space to sit with 659 00:30:32,480 --> 00:30:34,240 Speaker 2: that a little bit more. I've got a fiction book 660 00:30:34,240 --> 00:30:36,400 Speaker 2: I've been working on for years. Don't know if I'm 661 00:30:36,400 --> 00:30:38,680 Speaker 2: any good at fiction, but it's not something you can 662 00:30:38,720 --> 00:30:40,280 Speaker 2: jump in and out of for an hour or two. 663 00:30:40,320 --> 00:30:42,440 Speaker 2: Here and there. So I think when I get off 664 00:30:42,480 --> 00:30:45,240 Speaker 2: the rat race at some point, I think I'll be 665 00:30:45,280 --> 00:30:47,520 Speaker 2: shocked to the system because we run at such hundred 666 00:30:47,560 --> 00:30:48,640 Speaker 2: miles an hour all the time. 667 00:30:49,280 --> 00:30:51,760 Speaker 1: It's only one hundred come on faster than day. 668 00:30:52,480 --> 00:30:56,719 Speaker 2: But I look forward to being able to write and 669 00:30:56,720 --> 00:30:58,560 Speaker 2: and really just sit in the word a little bit 670 00:30:58,560 --> 00:31:02,160 Speaker 2: more and on a more lengthy basis that I can 671 00:31:02,200 --> 00:31:02,560 Speaker 2: do now. 672 00:31:03,160 --> 00:31:06,960 Speaker 1: No, it takes fiction requires yeah hours, because you have 673 00:31:07,000 --> 00:31:08,440 Speaker 1: to sink into that world you got to be to 674 00:31:08,520 --> 00:31:10,600 Speaker 1: get back to those characters. It's why I find you know, 675 00:31:10,760 --> 00:31:14,240 Speaker 1: I mean, I've written fiction. You do everything, well not everything, 676 00:31:14,320 --> 00:31:16,560 Speaker 1: and I had to take a step back from it 677 00:31:16,600 --> 00:31:19,400 Speaker 1: because of the time. It does require a lot of 678 00:31:20,000 --> 00:31:23,280 Speaker 1: creative space, and that's hard to come by when you're 679 00:31:23,600 --> 00:31:25,360 Speaker 1: I don't have it right now. Multiple shows, none of 680 00:31:25,440 --> 00:31:27,000 Speaker 1: us do, you know, So you kind of write in 681 00:31:27,040 --> 00:31:28,520 Speaker 1: between and pick up where you can. 682 00:31:29,080 --> 00:31:31,120 Speaker 2: You gotta give me some hints, I will do. 683 00:31:31,200 --> 00:31:33,560 Speaker 1: You still enjoy doing what you're doing. 684 00:31:33,920 --> 00:31:36,480 Speaker 2: And I still get scared. I still yeah, people need 685 00:31:36,880 --> 00:31:39,280 Speaker 2: you get scared on someday more. Oh, I still get nervous. 686 00:31:39,320 --> 00:31:41,040 Speaker 2: You never know with live TV where things are going 687 00:31:41,120 --> 00:31:44,000 Speaker 2: to go. I thought people walk off the set, like 688 00:31:44,440 --> 00:31:46,040 Speaker 2: you know, you never know if somebody's going to be 689 00:31:46,080 --> 00:31:48,440 Speaker 2: really combative, if they're not going to own something if 690 00:31:48,480 --> 00:31:50,800 Speaker 2: you come with the receipts like actually in nineteen eighty. 691 00:31:50,680 --> 00:31:55,320 Speaker 1: Three, Oh, I did see it represented recently, we wait, 692 00:31:55,320 --> 00:31:56,960 Speaker 1: those things happen so some dust. 693 00:31:57,080 --> 00:32:00,440 Speaker 2: I don't know if it's scared, but it's nervous. There 694 00:32:00,480 --> 00:32:03,600 Speaker 2: are butterflies there, So I think that's a good thing. 695 00:32:03,640 --> 00:32:03,800 Speaker 1: Though. 696 00:32:03,800 --> 00:32:06,440 Speaker 2: I think if you're so kind of dead into the 697 00:32:06,440 --> 00:32:09,840 Speaker 2: whole thing, maybe you're you're not feeling the challenge and 698 00:32:09,880 --> 00:32:12,280 Speaker 2: the excitement of it. So but yeah, I just I 699 00:32:12,320 --> 00:32:14,040 Speaker 2: think all the time, what a blessing. 700 00:32:13,840 --> 00:32:16,280 Speaker 1: You still have the sparkle when you're Onnator, you still 701 00:32:16,280 --> 00:32:18,920 Speaker 1: have that little edge and that you're right over time. 702 00:32:19,960 --> 00:32:23,520 Speaker 1: I'm thinking of particular anchors. I won't mention it. They 703 00:32:23,680 --> 00:32:27,360 Speaker 1: lose They just lose that. It becomes so if. 704 00:32:27,240 --> 00:32:31,120 Speaker 2: It's sort of wrote and you're losing the joy discovering 705 00:32:31,160 --> 00:32:33,240 Speaker 2: things of having interesting conversation, well. 706 00:32:33,120 --> 00:32:35,480 Speaker 1: They lose connection with the audience. They're not really serving 707 00:32:35,480 --> 00:32:36,920 Speaker 1: the audience. It's just kind of going through the motion, 708 00:32:36,920 --> 00:32:39,320 Speaker 1: all right, or what's next? And you do see that, 709 00:32:39,720 --> 00:32:42,240 Speaker 1: you know, you just it's a danger for doing it 710 00:32:42,720 --> 00:32:45,400 Speaker 1: a long time. I mean musical performers have the same problem. 711 00:32:45,440 --> 00:32:46,960 Speaker 1: You go to a concert, You're like, Wow, I can't 712 00:32:46,960 --> 00:32:50,440 Speaker 1: wait for this, and then get another energy and like yeah, yeah, 713 00:32:50,480 --> 00:32:51,760 Speaker 1: phone totally phoning it in. 714 00:32:51,760 --> 00:32:53,920 Speaker 2: It never happened at a Raymond Row concert. 715 00:32:54,040 --> 00:32:56,680 Speaker 1: Well or maybe not. That's only because the band would 716 00:32:56,720 --> 00:32:59,120 Speaker 1: throw instruments at me. Okay, what are we singing off with? 717 00:32:59,400 --> 00:33:00,960 Speaker 2: I don't know. Would you have a tune that you 718 00:33:00,960 --> 00:33:01,480 Speaker 2: would like to. 719 00:33:01,440 --> 00:33:05,560 Speaker 1: Do in my Tennessee Country home if I knew the words? 720 00:33:05,600 --> 00:33:06,720 Speaker 1: So you don't know with it? 721 00:33:07,440 --> 00:33:09,080 Speaker 2: I know we I've got friends in low places. 722 00:33:10,440 --> 00:33:12,040 Speaker 1: We could sing that one because of. 723 00:33:12,080 --> 00:33:15,280 Speaker 2: My thinking classic country. It's true because we're all in 724 00:33:15,280 --> 00:33:17,880 Speaker 2: low places, right and we need a hand up. 725 00:33:17,960 --> 00:33:21,160 Speaker 1: Depends on your friend. Yeah, all right, are we doing 726 00:33:21,160 --> 00:33:22,040 Speaker 1: it or not? Sure? 727 00:33:22,200 --> 00:33:28,360 Speaker 2: I've got friends places where the risky food and yeah. 728 00:33:31,720 --> 00:33:34,600 Speaker 1: In low place. Yes, yes, I took it up to 729 00:33:34,600 --> 00:33:37,080 Speaker 1: the octave, but you know I'm no guard Brooks. I 730 00:33:37,200 --> 00:33:39,040 Speaker 1: like it all right? Well, well to the next. 731 00:33:38,960 --> 00:33:41,719 Speaker 2: Concert, yes, and I'll come with song sheets next all right? 732 00:33:41,760 --> 00:33:44,240 Speaker 1: Next time? Song sheets in the band are comic. Look, 733 00:33:44,680 --> 00:33:45,960 Speaker 1: this set is pretty darn good. 734 00:33:46,040 --> 00:33:47,400 Speaker 2: Thank you for having me, Thanks for coming. 735 00:33:47,520 --> 00:33:51,920 Speaker 1: Thank you and Shannon Breams book Nothing Is Impossible with 736 00:33:52,120 --> 00:33:55,520 Speaker 1: God is available at bookstores everywhere. Pick up a copy. 737 00:33:56,000 --> 00:33:58,640 Speaker 1: Thanks for joining us on a royal grande. Why settle 738 00:33:58,840 --> 00:34:01,200 Speaker 1: for a dry constriction did life when if you fill 739 00:34:01,240 --> 00:34:04,200 Speaker 1: it with wisdom and knowledge, it can flow into a broad, 740 00:34:04,280 --> 00:34:08,320 Speaker 1: thriving Arroyo Grande. I'm ringing Arroyo. Make sure you like 741 00:34:08,440 --> 00:34:11,719 Speaker 1: this episode. Subscribe to the show so you don't miss 742 00:34:12,000 --> 00:34:14,359 Speaker 1: any of them. Thanks for diving in, and we'll see 743 00:34:14,360 --> 00:34:18,239 Speaker 1: you next time. Arroyo Grande is produced in partnership with 744 00:34:18,400 --> 00:34:21,960 Speaker 1: DP Studios and iHeart Podcasts, and is available on the 745 00:34:22,040 --> 00:34:24,799 Speaker 1: iHeartRadio app or wherever you get your podcasts.