Speaker 1: Native Land Pod is a production of iHeartRadio in partnership
Speaker 1: with Reason Choice Media.
Speaker 2: Welcome, Welcome, Welcome, Welcome, Welcome, Welcome, Welcome.
Speaker 1: Hey, everybody, this is a very very special day. I
Speaker 1: get to share solo pod time with my dear sister
Speaker 1: friend Tiffany Cross. We are here, y'all to talk about
Speaker 1: black beef in these internet streets. We're supposed to be
Speaker 1: joined by Van Lathan, who could no longer make it,
Speaker 1: but we had such a good conversation yesterday to The
Speaker 1: conversation was about how we solve for people who we
Speaker 1: love in conflict, especially in such a critical time. You
Speaker 1: remind us most podcasts right about what we're what's at stake.
Speaker 1: Of course, we're under an authoritarian regime. The courts are turning,
Speaker 1: media companies are turning. Certainly, Congress has, state legislators have,
Speaker 1: and yet and still we got a lot of time, energy,
Speaker 1: clicks and views on folks that want to focus on beef.
Speaker 2: You were mad at me recently speaking of it beef, and.
Speaker 1: I'm gonna let you tell it, but because you thought
Speaker 1: I was wasting my time on said internet beef. So
Speaker 1: I want to get into that and then hopefully you'll
Speaker 1: be with me, You'll be down with me to do
Speaker 1: some type of a pledge and ask our people to
Speaker 1: come to know.
Speaker 3: We'll see what the pledge is. Why I wasn't mad
Speaker 3: at Angela. I was disappointed, annoyed, annoyed. I was annoyed,
Speaker 3: irritated it definitely irritated, frustrated, frustrated, all of yes, you,
Speaker 3: thank you. You just put words to my feelings. Because
Speaker 3: I am at home in my bed, sadly on screen
Speaker 3: time scrolling through Instagram, and I don't want to give
Speaker 3: this person too much attention or credit. But a very dark,
Speaker 3: spirited person who I've never heard of, never seen, never
Speaker 3: popped up in my timeline at all, and she was
Speaker 3: just saying all these very degrading things about Angela. Not
Speaker 3: over some personal beef, not over you know, like Angela
Speaker 3: stepped on her toe and didn't say I'm sorry, like
Speaker 3: nothing like that, but over a policy position in which
Speaker 3: this woman happened to be missing formed, But over a
Speaker 3: policy position that Angela was really just trying to explain
Speaker 3: and express frustration. I don't we're trying to avoid saying
Speaker 3: specific beefs because then we get into the beef instead
Speaker 3: of the whole point. And I'm like, why is this
Speaker 3: stupid chick even popping up on my timeline? Like I
Speaker 3: don't even know. The language was so ugly. And then
Speaker 3: I scroll and look at the comments. You know why
Speaker 3: she was popping up with my timeline because this one
Speaker 3: right here, Angela all up in the comments responding to
Speaker 3: this girl. And this girl had like a couple hundred
Speaker 3: thousand followers, Angela has like two million. So I'm like,
Speaker 3: you just gave your whole The algorithm sees that and says, oh,
Speaker 3: your your followers must want to see this engagement because
Speaker 3: you're engaging her. And so in this rage machine, the
Speaker 3: data is feeding me what it thinks I like, and
Speaker 3: so it really inflated this person's point, which was not
Speaker 3: Angela's intention. And so I know Angela has talked about
Speaker 3: what she's gone through with her mom and just in life,
Speaker 3: what we're all going through, and I just felt like,
Speaker 3: why are you in the comments engaging this person? Now.
Speaker 3: This is punctuated by there are beefs all the time,
Speaker 3: in which Angela inserts herself. She is not the person
Speaker 3: in the beef. But let's say me and Andrew got
Speaker 3: a beef me Andrew don't have no beef. I'm just
Speaker 3: using us as an example. Me Andrew got a beef,
Speaker 3: and I'm like, you know, Andrew ate my bag of
Speaker 3: chips and I tell him those are my doritos. Don't
Speaker 3: eat my doritos.
Speaker 2: You need to use at example because now you're gonna.
Speaker 1: Have people have dragging me for this as president.
Speaker 3: Well, me and Andrew and you never really had no beef,
Speaker 3: you know. But I'm just giving that as an example.
Speaker 3: It got nothing to do with Angela. But she will
Speaker 3: insert and be like, Okay, Andrew like, let's talk about it,
Speaker 3: Tiff like, let's talk about it. Because she loves us both,
Speaker 3: and so she wants to create this koon bay ya.
Speaker 3: And my thought is, you know, I grew up in
Speaker 3: certain ways. So one of the themes of how you grow
Speaker 3: up is mind your business when they don't concern you,
Speaker 3: you know, And so I feel like sometimes Angela should
Speaker 3: mind her business. But Angela, but Angela said this is
Speaker 3: how we even got this, how I even got on
Speaker 3: the pockets we were talking about. Yes, but when I.
Speaker 2: Said that to you, angel doesn't like to debate.
Speaker 3: Clearly I'm in a debate now I'm being help forced
Speaker 3: here to talk about this. So when I won't mind
Speaker 3: my business because she wont my business. But when I
Speaker 3: said that, what was your response? It is my business.
Speaker 3: I didn't say that, but that's how I feel. I
Speaker 3: think that, you know, I think there are two things present.
Speaker 3: One is own man tip.
Speaker 2: How are you gonna make me cry?
Speaker 3: Oh God, she's gonna make me cry. So I'm gonna
Speaker 3: keep talking so I don't cry.
Speaker 2: No wait, wait, I have to say that. Okay, Okay,
Speaker 2: I'm gonna try.
Speaker 3: So see this is this is don't give me, don't
Speaker 3: get I'm not I'm refused.
Speaker 2: I'm trying to try. Okay. So I grew up with
Speaker 2: a dad. So my dad is the oldest, he's the
Speaker 2: oldest sibling.
Speaker 1: He is the shortest boy, so he had to use
Speaker 1: some extra like force to get his brothers to listen
Speaker 1: to them.
Speaker 2: Because they were younger, but they were bigger than him.
Speaker 1: And so my dad's way of being is very much
Speaker 1: a mediator. When my grandfather passed, he told him that
Speaker 1: he had the responsibility keeping the family together because he's
Speaker 1: the patriarch at that point. And I think my dad
Speaker 1: and I are similar enough where I have even when
Speaker 1: it's subconscious tried to emulate his behavior. One of the
Speaker 1: things that my dad does so well that I'm so
Speaker 1: proud of him for is there's not a person in
Speaker 1: the community that he knows about that if he sees
Speaker 1: them as voiceless or not being heard or not being
Speaker 1: fairly represented, that he doesn't go and kind of take
Speaker 1: on that cause.
Speaker 2: I think it is the way of a good activist, right.
Speaker 2: And I think.
Speaker 1: On a more micro level, I had a very traumatizing
Speaker 1: sixth grade year, very traumatic. I think we can all
Speaker 1: find that one year where you were like, this year
Speaker 1: was the worst year of my life and sixth grade
Speaker 1: TIF I had a number of.
Speaker 2: In my emotions.
Speaker 3: My period coming up made me was it was it family?
Speaker 1: No, it was it was all school stuff. Yeah, but
Speaker 1: like a number of occurrences where people would like they
Speaker 1: would decide that I was like the enemy for whatever reason,
Speaker 1: Like my parents were. We did they did pretty well.
Speaker 1: I always had new stuff. I think there was jealousy
Speaker 1: around that, but I also felt very awkward. I was
Speaker 1: flat chested, my teeth was crooked. I am bracest, yet
Speaker 1: I peach fuzz on my lips. Someone are using full
Speaker 1: of mustache, right, Like whatever.
Speaker 2: It was like it was a rough year child, Yeah,
Speaker 2: challenge and so and so it was. It was.
Speaker 1: I felt I got picked on a lot. There were
Speaker 1: times where like the bell would ring for recess and
Speaker 1: I would be like, I do not want to go outside.
Speaker 2: I don't know what's going to happen today, And the.
Speaker 1: People who were closest to me, I felt like, didn't
Speaker 1: defend me. So by the time sixth grade was over, right,
Speaker 1: I was like, I'm not ever going through this again.
Speaker 1: So sixth grade summer to the seventh grade year, girl,
Speaker 1: my period came, my booth started coming in. I was
Speaker 1: a little cute, I had braces, right, I was ready
Speaker 1: for the world. No pun intended with the artist, but
Speaker 1: like you know, I was ready and I can't. I
Speaker 1: made up in my mind in that moment that I
Speaker 1: would never be bullied again, and that nobody I love
Speaker 1: would ever be bullied, right, like nobody. I didn't care
Speaker 1: who with my dad, like whomever, I decided I was
Speaker 1: gonna be the chief defender like I didn't want. I
Speaker 1: didn't like that experience and I didn't want anybody else
Speaker 1: in my world to have that experience. So seventh grade, TIF,
Speaker 1: you will be pleased to know that that's the year
Speaker 1: I got suspended. Why my friend Yolanda was in a
Speaker 1: fight with Lamar Murphy Lamar, I love you, but I'm
Speaker 1: about to tell all your business. Also in the book
Speaker 1: Hope you don't mind, but Yolanda was He was picking
Speaker 1: on Yolanda and I was like, leave how long we
Speaker 1: were in pe. He didn't leave her alone. Lamar came
Speaker 1: charged at me from across the room. I swung and
Speaker 1: he hit Lamar roundhouse right. He drops to the ground.
Speaker 1: Lamar is true. I'm sorry, that's what happened. So I
Speaker 1: get suspend it. Yeah, and my mom wants to know
Speaker 1: why I'm suspended for a battle that wasn't mine. My
Speaker 1: dad is proud. And my point in saying that now
Speaker 1: I'm not encouraging kids. Don't try this at home, don't
Speaker 1: go and get suspended at school, don't fight, Nobody tell
Speaker 1: on the person. Okay, be a snitch. It's totally fine.
Speaker 1: But like I think that is core to who I am.
Speaker 1: If voiceless or voice impacted by they weren't there to
Speaker 1: represent themselves. You know, you hear about those times when
Speaker 1: your name comes up in spaces like the letters written
Speaker 1: about me in sixth grade where I wasn't able to
Speaker 1: defend myself. You have a whole narrative about me, and
Speaker 1: you knew different and you didn't defend me. And that's
Speaker 1: really where it comes from.
Speaker 2: And so I think it's deep. But I also see
Speaker 2: it as a duty.
Speaker 1: And I'm sure there are times, like to your point,
Speaker 1: where you're like, Okay, that's too heavy given everything else
Speaker 1: that you're carrying. But I don't know another way of being,
Speaker 1: you know, And I'm fine with it, particularly when it
Speaker 1: is for people who I know are for the interests
Speaker 1: of black people, even if their means to that and
Speaker 1: is different, and even if they're misunderstood, but if I
Speaker 1: know their heart is to liberate black people, to help
Speaker 1: us get free, to create space for.
Speaker 2: Us, I'm gonna I'm gonna rock with you.
Speaker 3: Well, yes, okay. So what Angela said when I said,
Speaker 3: you know, this isn't your business all the time, she said,
Speaker 3: it is my pleasure to defend people I love. So
Speaker 3: hearing what you said to that, I would say, okay,
Speaker 3: I hear that. So then you can come in and say,
Speaker 3: because you think about all the people Angela's friends with,
Speaker 3: we on the wrong opposite side of a lot of issues,
Speaker 3: you know, So in that case, you can say, hey,
Speaker 3: you know, if I feel like Andrew didn't mean to
Speaker 3: eat your dorito, get back.
Speaker 2: To the dorito.
Speaker 3: And Andrew is a beef, you know, I wish, said Bakari,
Speaker 3: he needs a beef, but just throwing the comb in there,
Speaker 3: Andrew didn't mean to eat your doritos. And Andrew is like,
Speaker 3: I ain't even eat her to READO you knows lyon
Speaker 3: once you had made your first attempt to me, then
Speaker 3: then that's it. Like what So it's a whole thing,
Speaker 3: a whole like conflict going on where some people feel
Speaker 3: away about about somebody said something publicly and a lot
Speaker 3: of us had opinions about it, and people said something
Speaker 3: and Angela felt, you know, like it's her responsibility to
Speaker 3: defend this thing. My thought is defend the thing once
Speaker 3: and then be on your way. But like Angela, don't
Speaker 3: box everybody until they agree with her. And to me,
Speaker 3: that is for me as your friend, that is hard
Speaker 3: to watch because it's like, girl, you like I do
Speaker 3: you just stop me if I'm saying something wrong. But
Speaker 3: Angela's mom had to go to the hospital. She's fine.
Speaker 3: She kicked Angela out the room, so she's fine.
Speaker 2: She told me to mind my business.
Speaker 3: Literally, you tell her to mind her business. So I'm
Speaker 3: looking at this like, why are you spending your like
Speaker 3: you're not gonna convince people like they feel how they feel,
Speaker 3: and me personally, in this instance, I didn't think they
Speaker 3: were wrong, and so Angelin and I just started to think,
Speaker 3: is this about the thing or is this about something else?
Speaker 3: Because as your friend, I want you to step away,
Speaker 3: leave it be. You deserve peace in this moment, and
Speaker 3: you'll take on this beef and eight other beefs at
Speaker 3: the same time. And you know, it just doesn't feel
Speaker 3: like it's living in service to black folks, and it
Speaker 3: doesn't feel like it's living in service to you. And
Speaker 3: you keep telling me it doesn't drain me, like it's
Speaker 3: my pleasure to defend people I love, and so it
Speaker 3: could be me projecting, because that shit would drain me.
Speaker 1: I definitely think you project yeah, I say, but I
Speaker 1: don't think it's all projection. I do think it comes
Speaker 1: from a place of care, right, Like, I don't think
Speaker 1: you're just like, oh, let me put everything I feel
Speaker 1: on you and tell you to feel this. I think
Speaker 1: you're like Okay, I see how I feel about it,
Speaker 1: and I don't want you to feel this, so let
Speaker 1: me do it. Because you're not minding your business either,
Speaker 1: That's true. Your defense comes up in a different way.
Speaker 1: Your defense comes in and protection like I don't want
Speaker 1: you to take this on because you're carrying all these
Speaker 1: other things. I know you're carrying these things. So I'm
Speaker 1: going to try to make you stop.
Speaker 2: Doing this thing because I think this is how I
Speaker 2: would respond to it. I think we all.
Speaker 1: Do that, and I think the question just becomes like
Speaker 1: can you be can you see enough to know when
Speaker 1: it is draining you? And I can honestly tell you
Speaker 1: just from accountability standpoint, I can't always and.
Speaker 2: I won't know until I get to the point Like last.
Speaker 1: Night, I don't know how far you got in a chat,
Speaker 1: but I was like, all right, to keep scrolling. I'm like, okay, yeah,
Speaker 1: I got to the point where I was like, all right,
Speaker 1: you know, I'm not going to do this. But the
Speaker 1: main thing that I would like to get to, Tiff
Speaker 1: is a place where our folks can say, you know what, brother,
Speaker 1: a sister, or sibling, I took issue with your approach
Speaker 1: on this thing, and I wish you would reconsider.
Speaker 2: And I want to use a good example.
Speaker 1: There's a good sister, Hope, Giselle, And I'm calling out
Speaker 1: names because this is something that was resolved during State
Speaker 1: of the people who challenge our tour on social media
Speaker 1: and said that we were missing the representation of the
Speaker 1: trans community. And I was frustrated about it because we
Speaker 1: were hyper inclusive. We had two hundred or half two
Speaker 1: hundred organizational partners local, national level, etc.
Speaker 2: I work, you know this tip. I worked over.
Speaker 1: Time to get black people if we didn't agree on
Speaker 1: everything together, and I felt really frustrated because I'm like,
Speaker 1: I know this isn't true, Like why don't you just
Speaker 1: come through and see. David asked Hope to come through
Speaker 1: and see and to volunteer, and she did and it
Speaker 1: completely shifted her position. And I don't think that in
Speaker 1: every time I do that that people will completely shift
Speaker 1: their position. But I would like for us to love
Speaker 1: the kind of way where we give each other the
Speaker 1: benefit of the doubt first, to not say we're intentionally
Speaker 1: causing harm. I actually hate those comments. The worst tip
Speaker 1: when you were like you in these comments. I'm in
Speaker 1: the comments, especially when somebody says we're intentionally doing something
Speaker 1: to be divisive or to few misinformation or to cause harm.
Speaker 1: We don't move that way. That's that's not the type
Speaker 1: of people we are. It's definitely not the type of
Speaker 1: black folks we are. So that's when I get really concerned.
Speaker 1: And so if there's an opportunity to get people together
Speaker 1: in the same room to realign, I would love to
Speaker 1: see that happen. I really think we need like a
Speaker 1: black people summit where we just like agree to some things,
Speaker 1: you know, like who are the people that you're gonna
Speaker 1: listen to to fact check you if you make a mistake,
Speaker 1: It's okay.
Speaker 2: If you make a mistake, then you could just own
Speaker 2: it and move on.
Speaker 1: Who are the people you go to if they're like
Speaker 1: your tone is drabbed and it's gonna make people feel
Speaker 1: like there's no hope.
Speaker 2: Can we do that? You know?
Speaker 1: Is there a community where that we can create where
Speaker 1: there's some alignment. We won't be perfectly aligned on everything,
Speaker 1: but can we be aligned on some big picture issues
Speaker 1: sex that we don't have black beef in these internet
Speaker 1: streets so much it just feels and that feels distracting.
Speaker 3: Yeah, because like your alignment is one thing, somebody else's
Speaker 3: is another. You know, some things that you want to
Speaker 3: be in a line, I'm on you and I are
Speaker 3: not going to be in alignment on those things. And
Speaker 3: so once I've stayed at my position clear like I've
Speaker 3: done my things, trust that I have done my thinking.
Speaker 3: Like typically when I say something, I've debated myself. You know,
Speaker 3: I've talked to somebody who disagreed with me already. I
Speaker 3: you know, I have conviction in my beliefs. I'm standing here.
Speaker 3: I'm gonna assume that about other people. If it's clear
Speaker 3: they haven't, then yeah, there's room for a discussion. But
Speaker 3: sometimes I think the attitude of oh, but if you
Speaker 3: only understood this other side, and it's like, maybe that's you.
Speaker 3: You need to understand the other side, But a whole
Speaker 3: lot of other people we've already done that part. And
Speaker 3: so then when you're like, no, but I'm trying to
Speaker 3: pull you over here, and it's like, yeah, girl, I'm good.
Speaker 3: I don't need to go over there, Like I it's
Speaker 3: not something else that I'm okay over here, And so
Speaker 3: just for your own piece, still, I'm maybe projecting. I
Speaker 3: do kind of feel like sometimes it's I've said something
Speaker 3: and we talked about a specific situation where there's a
Speaker 3: person who I think uses their platform completely irresponsibly. And
Speaker 3: I said something to the person and she you know,
Speaker 3: it wasn't like she wasn't receptive, but she seemed pretty
Speaker 3: rooted in how she uses her platform. At that point,
Speaker 3: I don't really have shit else to say, you know, like,
Speaker 3: that's how you feel, it's your platform. You gotta live
Speaker 3: with that. That's okay to do it after that, to
Speaker 3: keep saying something to her again and again, at a
Speaker 3: certain point that feels disrespectful. You know, at a certain point,
Speaker 3: I gotta say, Okay, I get it. What Angela's perspective
Speaker 3: was on this particular person is because other people started
Speaker 3: calling her out publicly. But I think sometimes you need
Speaker 3: to be called out publicly. Sometimes people need to and
Speaker 3: sometimes that's gonna make you listen. If thousands of people
Speaker 3: are saying your girl that she was terrible, if that's
Speaker 3: the thing that's gonna make you listen, then yeah, if
Speaker 3: there are other people who are saying something that is harmful,
Speaker 3: that's not correct, and that's reaching a lot of people, like, yes,
Speaker 3: sometimes you gonna get called out publicly. I will say
Speaker 3: when I have my show. I mean I took umbradge
Speaker 3: with people who would try to tell me how to
Speaker 3: use my show, you know, like I there's an executive
Speaker 3: we both know, yes, who sent me an email and
Speaker 3: was like hey, I at a different company, had nothing
Speaker 3: to do and was like, hey, I want to talk
Speaker 3: to you and give you some pointers on your show.
Speaker 3: I ain't know him, like we were not host. It
Speaker 3: fell out of pocket to me, you know, not like hey,
Speaker 3: just would love to just meet you and say hello,
Speaker 3: but like I'm starting out critical, like I'm telling you
Speaker 3: that you're doing something wrong and I'm the person that's
Speaker 3: going to fix it for you. And I just felt like,
Speaker 3: what's your right what's your success record? Because I haven't
Speaker 3: seen the people you work with, I know what you do.
Speaker 3: Like why it just fell out of pocket to me.
Speaker 3: So I try to maneuver in a way with people
Speaker 3: because like that's what you choose to do, then do that,
Speaker 3: you know, Like I'm gonna stay in my lane, you know.
Speaker 3: So I don't know. I take your point about the
Speaker 3: big picture, but your big picture is not gonna be
Speaker 3: everybody's big picture. That's mine.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think that that is right, and I think
Speaker 1: that some of my work is in accepting that right,
Speaker 1: Like the thing that I think is most important is
Speaker 1: not what everybody else thinks is most important.
Speaker 2: My hope is that.
Speaker 1: For our survival, for our liberation, we can have some
Speaker 1: more alignment around that, because there are people that we need,
Speaker 1: and if there are people that we need that we
Speaker 1: can convert, great. There are people that we need that
Speaker 1: we can just potentially sway a little bit amazing. If
Speaker 1: there are people that we need to call out and
Speaker 1: leave out, Okay, I don't love that, but I get it.
Speaker 1: I just don't want to do that so much that
Speaker 1: we end up not having anybody left, especially in this
Speaker 1: space where we need. We don't just need all these voices.
Speaker 1: We need a lot of activists and organizer types. And
Speaker 1: there's some folks who are to the far extreme left
Speaker 1: of me that I don't.
Speaker 2: Want to leave out.
Speaker 1: If we can still find some common ground, I think
Speaker 1: that gets us back into the conversation we were having
Speaker 1: last week about what's that twenty five percent?
Speaker 2: And I was about like, I was like, Tiff had me.
Speaker 2: I was like, tip got me good.
Speaker 1: When she was like, well, the twenty five percent is
Speaker 1: you want a black people.
Speaker 2: Then I was like, yeah, I didn't think about that part.
Speaker 1: But normally I wouldn't even be in the same room
Speaker 1: with them, right, But like, generally speaking, can we find
Speaker 1: enough to agree on to move in a forward direction?
Speaker 2: Lolo dropped in the comments, we have a comment. The
Speaker 2: real issue I don't know.
Speaker 1: Open up your chat friend it says this looks like
Speaker 1: Lashawn Walston. The real issue is all of y'all who
Speaker 1: got millions of followers, shouldn't always be public about y'all disagreements.
Speaker 2: Knowing good and well.
Speaker 1: The ops oppressors just used those quotes for validation. And
Speaker 1: I'm gonna tell you this is one of the things
Speaker 1: that that how TIV got stuck on here where she
Speaker 1: needed to be writing. One of the reasons that I
Speaker 1: wanted to have this conversation exactly what you said. I
Speaker 1: was raised by an activist. I am a conspiracy theorist.
Speaker 1: I fully believe that once they hear that there's a
Speaker 1: wedge that they use bot farms bought people who are
Speaker 1: easily bought off to drive a larger wedge between the community,
Speaker 1: and I don't want us to be subject to that.
Speaker 1: We should be more sophisticated than that. We know the
Speaker 1: ops were involved in twenty sixteen, we know they were
Speaker 1: involved in twenty eighteen, twenty twenty, twenty twenty two, and
Speaker 1: twenty four So why would we do that? And I
Speaker 1: just want us to be a little more sophisticated, patient,
Speaker 1: and compassionate.
Speaker 3: Some people would argue that some of the folks you
Speaker 3: defend who are saying things that they vehemently disagree with
Speaker 3: that they find harmful, that those people are doing something
Speaker 3: that lives in service to the ops, and that it's
Speaker 3: hurting black people. So that's a divide that you may
Speaker 3: not always be able to mend. And sometimes you just
Speaker 3: got to let that ride out, you know, Like if
Speaker 3: I don't know, I mean that that really is, you're
Speaker 3: still saying, No, I know, I.
Speaker 1: Know what you're saying, Tiff. I think that it's one
Speaker 1: thing if you think that, But they literally are in
Speaker 1: our comments sometimes calling us the ops and shields and
Speaker 1: all that stuff. And I think that my reality of
Speaker 1: it is is if there are our friends or people
Speaker 1: who know us, like when you hear that, like on
Speaker 1: the streets, not in these internet streets, because that's why
Speaker 1: we're calling this the black beef in these Internet streets
Speaker 1: because some things don't deserve an audience. But like if
Speaker 1: you hear somebody outside saying that, like, refute that it
Speaker 1: is wrong, it is incorrect. Like we want black people
Speaker 1: to advance. We don't always agree and to and to
Speaker 1: be liberated. We don't always agree on the pod, but
Speaker 1: we definitely agree on the end.
Speaker 3: Golf.
Speaker 2: You know, there's no question.
Speaker 3: That's what I was saying. I was telling Angela, Like,
Speaker 3: if I'm saying something that Angela disagrees with, that a
Speaker 3: lot of people disagree with. I don't expect that of Angela,
Speaker 3: you know, I don't expect her to go out and
Speaker 3: defend me in every room if it doesn't align with
Speaker 3: what you feel, or even if it does. I would
Speaker 3: never put that pressure on you, you know. Like I
Speaker 3: represent me and my thoughts, and I'm okay with that.
Speaker 3: Like I can stand in the truth of what I say.
Speaker 3: I have conviction in my beliefs, and I don't always
Speaker 3: want to be responsible for things you say. Now, if
Speaker 3: somebody in my presence is calling you, I hate to
Speaker 3: even give this. This girl on the internet was out
Speaker 3: here talking about angel the high yellow bit. It was
Speaker 3: just the most disgusting thing I was just looking like
Speaker 3: what a miserable, unhappy person like this is so sad.
Speaker 3: Now in that case, I kind of feel like that
Speaker 3: person don't even deserve my attention. I'm like, oh, you've
Speaker 3: lost me. You don't. I'm not a sounding board for it.
Speaker 3: You can't stand in front of me and say that.
Speaker 3: I'm not gonna try to convince you otherwise because at
Speaker 3: that point you've kind of lost credibility, you know, like
Speaker 3: I don't really want to even talk to you about it.
Speaker 3: I can just let that conversation giving you the energy
Speaker 3: inflates it. Like what you focus on grows, you know,
Speaker 3: like my focus is water and this flower, so it's
Speaker 3: gonna grow. So we may just have a different a
Speaker 3: pro to these things. But you gave the example of
Speaker 3: like you and me, and like, you know, if we
Speaker 3: got a beef, I don't. I really don't feel like
Speaker 3: we'd be having to be but okay, but if we
Speaker 3: just add we argue.
Speaker 2: I think we argue.
Speaker 3: I think I really don't know, like I to look
Speaker 3: y'all tune into the show this week is we have
Speaker 3: Natasha Brown on, who like we love so much, Yes,
Speaker 3: and so you know, like if you have any beef
Speaker 3: like she's the person in our Machete group who I
Speaker 3: think is like the most honest and fair and can
Speaker 3: like reach anybody. And so Angelo is saying like she
Speaker 3: will call her like let me just you know, tell
Speaker 3: you about Tiff, you know, which I think is a
Speaker 3: beautiful thing, a safe space, you know, like it's like
Speaker 3: it's good. But my typical thought is, I you stand
Speaker 3: on the wrong side of an issue with me, or
Speaker 3: I don't like how you handle this thing. I don't
Speaker 3: like what you said to me. I like the way
Speaker 3: you said. Whatever those things are. I feel it in
Speaker 3: the moment. I'm address it in the moment. But if
Speaker 3: five hours later you like you want to go eat, like,
Speaker 3: let's go eat. It was only one time where I was, oh,
Speaker 3: I don't want to say, you're gonna tell me not
Speaker 3: to say a public But it was one time I'm like,
Speaker 3: I need some days. We were talking about something that
Speaker 3: Angela didn't want to talk about on the podcast, and
Speaker 3: I didn't like the way that she responded on the podcast,
Speaker 3: and I was, you remember what I'm talking about?
Speaker 2: No, but I'm sorry, I hate that I don't remember
Speaker 2: what it was.
Speaker 3: I just if you know my memory is bad, but
Speaker 3: we were trying to We went to essence like not
Speaker 3: long after, like days.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I can't I can't remember what happened, but I remember.
Speaker 3: Want me to say what it was about? Want because
Speaker 3: Angela's every time I'm on stayed somewhere. She we have
Speaker 3: like an energy where I feel like she don't want
Speaker 3: me to say something publicly, so I won't see.
Speaker 2: You can't you can you can't go?
Speaker 3: Okay, it was about Diddy, it was about yes, yes,
Speaker 3: And I did not like Angela's response, and so that
Speaker 3: was probably one time where I'm like I need a
Speaker 3: few days because I don't like how that went down.
Speaker 3: You know, I was mad at her too. Yeah, we
Speaker 3: were mad, like we're beriefing. But for me, I'm like,
Speaker 3: I mean I could still go in a week, Like
Speaker 3: I can go, I can go eat with you, I
Speaker 3: can talk to you. My attitude is I don't want
Speaker 3: to talk to you. Angel's attitude.
Speaker 1: I feel like my my essence was messed up from that,
Speaker 1: Like I feel like I don't like that.
Speaker 3: Well if it's just like I'm coming straight to you,
Speaker 3: like I'm coming to you.
Speaker 2: No.
Speaker 1: But we didn't have time, so I was hoping that
Speaker 1: we were going to be able to talk before the show.
Speaker 1: We didn't get to talk before the show. We didn't
Speaker 1: go to our normal events. So that was hard because
Speaker 1: I know your heart is in the right place. It
Speaker 1: sucks when we have a disagreement about strategy and then
Speaker 1: it interferes with our relationship.
Speaker 2: I don't like that, So I hate.
Speaker 1: I don't like that, Like I'm like, oh, I'm gonna
Speaker 1: talk to you, but I don't like to fight with
Speaker 1: my friends. It Actually, I'm that little puff up is
Speaker 1: more about sadness than it is about rage.
Speaker 2: You know.
Speaker 3: Yeah, well, but even the way you handled that, Like
Speaker 3: my thing is like I ain't fucking with you. Don't
Speaker 3: need to talk to you right now, you know, but
Speaker 3: I'll see you. Anngel's attitude is I'm coming straight to you,
Speaker 3: like say if we need to talk, and I'm like,
Speaker 3: le me your own and like no, let's talk, you know.
Speaker 3: And so I appreciate that about you, you know, like
Speaker 3: that is like no, oh, let's just ask this out.
Speaker 3: But sometimes I just need a few days because I
Speaker 3: don't have the expectation of you to be anybody but
Speaker 3: who you are just and you shouldn't have the expectation
Speaker 3: of me to be but who I am and I
Speaker 3: require a lot of grace. And I think we all knew.
Speaker 3: So if you require a lot of grace, you have
Speaker 3: to be willing to give a lot of grace. And
Speaker 3: sometimes for me to give that grace, I just need
Speaker 3: a few days. I got a control issue, like I
Speaker 3: like to be in control me too. And we were
Speaker 3: on the phone earlier and Angela stuff ain't got nothing
Speaker 3: to do with me. She's talking about her solo pod
Speaker 3: and like what she want to talk about. And I'm
Speaker 3: on the car. I don't even know business on the
Speaker 3: call and I'm like, no, no, no, you can do
Speaker 3: that next week because that is still be relevant. You'll
Speaker 3: talk about Nigeria. This is what you say about it.
Speaker 1: I'm like, but Tiffy, just to be fair, this isn't
Speaker 1: just tiff being out of her like Lane or out
Speaker 1: of her not in my business, tiff is a producer
Speaker 1: at heart, like so this is to be fair, I
Speaker 1: think you need to give your speaking of grace, give
Speaker 1: yourself some grace here because this is like, oh no,
Speaker 1: this is feels like a better show.
Speaker 2: We need that. We love the for that. So I
Speaker 2: think that's fine.
Speaker 1: Now I can't remember what you said beforehand, but it's
Speaker 1: the point is you supposed to leave, but we got
Speaker 1: two other comments. You way over to see.
Speaker 3: I see these comments. I got my chat open. Now
Speaker 3: you want me to read them or're gonna read them?
Speaker 2: Yeah?
Speaker 3: No, go ahead, Well says we can Kelvin, Kelvin, forgive me, Kelvin.
Speaker 3: We can't to just be saying anything to our people
Speaker 3: in this moment with all the disinformation and misinformation happening.
Speaker 3: Good point. The reputable voices need to even more be
Speaker 3: even more careful of what they say. DJ quote Crist says,
Speaker 3: but yes, I would have rather Roland had called CTGU
Speaker 3: to Charlemagne. He still could have done a video, but
Speaker 3: first maybe have the convo offline. I don't know if
Speaker 3: that happened. Do we know it did not? Okay, it
Speaker 3: did not, and I was we were.
Speaker 1: Trying to not get into specifics, but nobody know what
Speaker 1: we're talking about since But it's not They're not the
Speaker 1: only one. We just got to internet beef, right like
Speaker 1: there was there was something else last week. There's you know,
Speaker 1: there's constant things kind of happening. We talked reference to
Speaker 1: another one with somebody that we don't know the other
Speaker 1: videos that were made by people that we don't know,
Speaker 1: And that doesn't mean the points necessarily were irrelevant, But
Speaker 1: I just think the approach matters. You know, like people
Speaker 1: say all the time, you win more bees with honey.
Speaker 1: I am a vinegarbish and I'm trying not to be
Speaker 1: because I think that you can be straight to the
Speaker 1: point and not stab someone being straight to the point,
Speaker 1: there's another way, And I really want to refine that.
Speaker 3: Tif.
Speaker 2: I think it's something that you're normally very good at.
Speaker 1: You got to get to a very high point of
Speaker 1: frustration to not be good at it that I just
Speaker 1: want to say.
Speaker 2: This here too. I think.
Speaker 1: That we have gotten to an environment where the clicks
Speaker 1: are more important than character and preserving relationship, and I
Speaker 1: just want us to recenter on the fact that preserving
Speaker 1: our community is more important than clicks right now. So
Speaker 1: if you can have that offline conversation, have it. If
Speaker 1: you need a witness, if you don't want me to
Speaker 1: be there, TIF said, I need to find some business.
Speaker 2: Fine, call the therapist.
Speaker 3: You got all somebodiness.
Speaker 1: Call somebody, apparently, my mama said, not us today. But
Speaker 1: I am going up there just a minute. But we
Speaker 1: we gotta figure out a way to love on each
Speaker 1: other and where we are falling short, where we have
Speaker 1: a blind spot, where we have a growth edge, give
Speaker 1: each other the space to do that. That's one of
Speaker 1: the things I love the most about our Machete Crew
Speaker 1: TIF because we do give each other that too.
Speaker 2: We push, but if.
Speaker 1: Somebody come for one of y'all, we like where we
Speaker 1: gotta be right, Like where we gotta where we gotta
Speaker 1: squabble up. Yeah, And I think that's important to you
Speaker 1: want to have those safe spaces people that you know
Speaker 1: will defend your honor when you can't, maybe when you're tired,
Speaker 1: or maybe where you have a blind spot. But like
Speaker 1: we need that, and I think it's okay to love
Speaker 1: on each other enough to do that.
Speaker 2: Your mindful of my boundary.
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's that's all I want. Like, just protect me, that's.
Speaker 1: All I'm promising, y'all. And can you guys please just
Speaker 1: do me a favor. Reach out to Tiff on Instagram
Speaker 1: and let her know that she does, in fact like
Speaker 1: to debate, and this prof.
Speaker 3: So that they don't know about this, So I say,
Speaker 3: I don't like to debate.
Speaker 2: We did a podcast where you said that.
Speaker 3: Okay, but they don't know about the conversation. Yeah, offline, yo,
Speaker 3: Angela is like I think Angela likes the debate. I'm
Speaker 3: saying I don't like to debate, but she is trying
Speaker 3: to say, like, basically, you do like to debate, like
Speaker 3: you debate all the time. I don't think that's like
Speaker 3: my go to. I don't like to debate what I know,
Speaker 3: you know, like if I feel a way, I'm saying
Speaker 3: this is how I feel, and then if Angela says, really,
Speaker 3: this is how I feel and it's something different for me,
Speaker 3: I might have another like hmmm, I don't know. I
Speaker 3: just I don't agree with that last point you made,
Speaker 3: but I got you. I when it starts becoming like
Speaker 3: you're trying to convince me of something, I'm like, yeah,
Speaker 3: I got it the first time. Like I don't. I
Speaker 3: would rather like I listen for understanding. Like my test is,
Speaker 3: can I repeat back to you your position and if
Speaker 3: I say it to you and you feel like yeah,
Speaker 3: that's how I feel, and then I can say, yeah,
Speaker 3: so I understand it. I don't agree at that point
Speaker 3: to me, the conversation is over at that point, Like
Speaker 3: you know how I feel. I know how you feel.
Speaker 3: It's okay. I wanted to just say real quick too
Speaker 3: about the comments because I told Angela Is before we
Speaker 3: were on the air, there were a lot of comments
Speaker 3: around when Charlemagne was on the show and when you know,
Speaker 3: we were talking about black intellect, and there was so many
Speaker 3: comments that were like Tiffany's elitist and she's classifiant. Ugh,
Speaker 3: my sister act just like her. That's why her and
Speaker 3: oh I got a family full of people like her.
Speaker 3: That's all like being around them. And I can take it,
Speaker 3: you know, I could like I don't. I don't live
Speaker 3: in service. I'm not a slave to the comments. But
Speaker 3: I do appreciate the engagement for the show, even in disagreement.
Speaker 3: But reading some of those comments, I really read them like.
Speaker 2: Oh, I love you.
Speaker 3: Guys, you know, because my thought was, however you feel
Speaker 3: about the conversation, I am yours and you are mine.
Speaker 3: This is a family conversation that is just not had
Speaker 3: anybody outside of us started weighing in. I'm like, you
Speaker 3: don't even belong here, so what are you doing?
Speaker 2: This is we did not welcome you Hall.
Speaker 3: This is my point. If you had a family dinner,
Speaker 3: and you know, you're like, oh, mamma, get on my nerves,
Speaker 3: she said, blah blah blah. But if a guest from
Speaker 3: outside is in there talking about, yeah, your mamma, get
Speaker 3: on my nerves, if you like, hold on, hold hold on,
Speaker 3: like you don't have the right to do that. So
Speaker 3: I look at the conversation around black intellect like that.
Speaker 3: And so even the people who were mad, even people
Speaker 3: saying I don't even know somebody's I don't even know
Speaker 3: her and I want to cheat on her what I'm way,
Speaker 3: you wouldn't have a chance, stupid. But even that, it's
Speaker 3: still felt very familiar, you know. And so it's like, yeah,
Speaker 3: y'all are mine. If even if I don't respect your opinion,
Speaker 3: even if I think you'd be on some ignorant shit,
Speaker 3: sometimes you are mine and I am yours, and there's
Speaker 3: nothing you could do about it, and nothing I could
Speaker 3: do about it. On this side of the divide, when
Speaker 3: they come fall us, ain't nobody gonna be like, oh, well,
Speaker 3: you smart and you not, or you know this or
Speaker 3: you said this or whatever. It don't matter. You gonna
Speaker 3: be mad to hear this.
Speaker 1: But I'm gonna tell you now so there were some
Speaker 1: moments where I was defending your honor, especially around that
Speaker 1: those last couple of podcasts, and the main thing I
Speaker 1: would say it, I was like, it's so fascinating that
Speaker 1: people's read on Tiff is that she's elitist and unapproachable.
Speaker 1: I was like, Tiff is the one I can't if
Speaker 1: I told you this or not, but I'm like, Tip
Speaker 1: is the one on all of our well, I'm gonna
Speaker 1: tell the audience now, all of our machete trips that
Speaker 1: becomes close personal friends with the wait staff, with the chef,
Speaker 1: with like whomever, and then or like an uber driver,
Speaker 1: like reminds me the most of my dad. Is actually
Speaker 1: the thing I admire the most of my dad. We
Speaker 1: will be in a space for a few moments and
Speaker 1: he will find a way to find common ground with you.
Speaker 1: And Tiff is that person. So it's always shocking to
Speaker 1: me when I hear her say something.
Speaker 2: I'm like this, Hey, I don't have seen you act.
Speaker 1: Like this, but she is talking about something very specific,
Speaker 1: and I think people have expanded a very specific conversation
Speaker 1: to think that's how you are in life. But that
Speaker 1: is where I get protective and arguably even defensive because
Speaker 1: I'm like, no, you don't know her, that is not her.
Speaker 1: Like I'm probably the bigger asshole between the.
Speaker 2: Two of us, and it's not on purpose.
Speaker 1: I just got anxiety and I don't show up well
Speaker 1: initially in social settings.
Speaker 2: I gotta get comfortable. Tiff is like, hey are you doing?
Speaker 1: Oh my god, you have she's talking these people's dogs.
Speaker 1: I be protective of Tiff when she's talking to people's
Speaker 1: dogs and the people are rude, I'd be like, she'd be.
Speaker 2: A nicety, y'all dog. So that is like my normal disposition.
Speaker 1: I'm fiercely protective of the people all love, even when
Speaker 1: they didn't ask for it. But I don't apologize for it.
Speaker 1: I think it's a good thing. I just love y'all.
Speaker 3: Apologize. I just I don't. I just you know, I
Speaker 3: don't have that expectation of you. And I know who
Speaker 3: I am, and so somebody who doesn't know me, of course,
Speaker 3: they can receive or perceive something you know a certain way.
Speaker 3: And there are so many people who I don't know
Speaker 3: who do identify with, you know how I feel. I
Speaker 3: thought that was a really interesting thing in some of
Speaker 3: the comments. It was a clear gender divide one which
Speaker 3: I yes, yeah, who feel a certain way, and there's
Speaker 3: a lot of black women who feel a certain way
Speaker 3: about me, who feel like thank you for finally saying this,
Speaker 3: and sometimes they would take it a step further. I'm like, oh,
Speaker 3: I wasn't exactly saying.
Speaker 2: See what I'm saying, And that's so I was like, no,
Speaker 2: let me tell y'all.
Speaker 1: You know.
Speaker 3: Yeah, some so it became a conversation that was bigger
Speaker 3: than me. But I truly do like I I am
Speaker 3: rooted in my beliefs and it's it's okay, you know,
Speaker 3: like I don't regret anything I said around that conversation,
Speaker 3: and I don't. I don't hold ill will for you
Speaker 3: know people, I'm not trying to convince somebody of who
Speaker 3: I am, you know, like.
Speaker 1: I think that's fine, but I just I don't know.
Speaker 1: I'm not I'm not gonna watch nobody lie on you either.
Speaker 1: And I think that that there is a fine line distinction,
Speaker 1: but there is a distinction. And I think if I'm
Speaker 1: in a space where I can be like, yeah, I
Speaker 1: know that's not true, I'm not cool with that. You're
Speaker 1: definitely not gonna say it in my presence I'm fine
Speaker 1: with that. I think it's that's my boundary, Like you're
Speaker 1: not going to disrespect people I love or misrepresent.
Speaker 2: Who they are in the world because of your own.
Speaker 1: Stuff, like your own insecurities, your own you know, shortcoming,
Speaker 1: your own triggers, you know, like you don't get to
Speaker 1: put like paint this person into being this way.
Speaker 2: And I think you know, especially.
Speaker 3: Happen everywhere.
Speaker 1: It does, but if it's in front of me, I'm
Speaker 1: not going to stand for it. It's the same thing
Speaker 1: as like, you know, when you were leaving MSNBC, not
Speaker 1: by choice, but there's articles coming out misrepresenting you, misrepresenting
Speaker 1: your characters, like maligning your reputation. I'm going to defend
Speaker 1: you against that as well. And I think that is
Speaker 1: our It's not just my honor. I think it is
Speaker 1: our duty to make sure that we protect people who
Speaker 1: we know are doing the right thing, are doing it
Speaker 1: for the right reasons, and we have the ability and
Speaker 1: the power to leverage our influence to ensure that they
Speaker 1: are protected. That is what I think about it, and
Speaker 1: I don't I don't see it changing. That is something
Speaker 1: that again I take honor in doing. And I think
Speaker 1: that there are times where like you know, it might
Speaker 1: go from honor to argumentative and I could probably lighten up.
Speaker 1: I need to be more mindful of that, of that shift.
Speaker 1: But I don't regret that at all.
Speaker 3: Well, but I think that's a little different. Like when
Speaker 3: there is a machine powered by whiteness that aims to
Speaker 3: destroy one of us, then yes, for sure, but.
Speaker 1: I think that this machine is powering these bots. That's
Speaker 1: what I think. Bots.
Speaker 3: Yeah, so the bots like I don't engage. But when
Speaker 3: there are real people, you know, who have thoughts or
Speaker 3: opinions about something that we expressed or said, or something
Speaker 3: that somebody else expressed or said, you know, I do
Speaker 3: feel you know, like sometimes it's like, yeah, okay, that's
Speaker 3: how you feel.
Speaker 1: And you know, the funny thing about this comment drag
Speaker 1: that Tip got for me is Tippy in the comments
Speaker 1: more than me.
Speaker 2: Now, her argument is gonna be but I be in
Speaker 2: our comments.
Speaker 3: I do. Yeah, And like I am when people comment
Speaker 3: on on YouTube and Instagram, I do. I'd like to
Speaker 3: see how the show is performing, how much engagement we have.
Speaker 3: I can't read every single comment, obviously, but I like
Speaker 3: maybe one out of ten comments, like I'm just reading
Speaker 3: to get a sense of what people are saying. They
Speaker 3: telling us we gotta rap.
Speaker 2: So I see, but but yeah, I do.
Speaker 3: I appreciate you guys weighing in and you know, and
Speaker 3: and I I want to say also thank you to
Speaker 3: producer Lolo all the people in our arm services who
Speaker 3: are serving. We do want to say we honor today
Speaker 3: as Veterans Day. You know, I know it's a really
Speaker 3: challenging time when Pete Hegseth I think has worked a
Speaker 3: lot of what's happening in our d O D and
Speaker 3: dishonors a lot of the you know, the people in
Speaker 3: our arm services men and women. I want to say,
Speaker 3: we honor you and see you uh and and sleep
Speaker 3: under the blink of the protection you provide, as Jack
Speaker 3: Nicholson said, and a few good men and so we
Speaker 3: just respect and want to send you that honor.
Speaker 1: I want to I want to dedicate today, just since
Speaker 1: you brought up Pete Hegseth to the former Joint chiefs
Speaker 1: of Staff CQ. Brown, Today's day will be dedicated to
Speaker 1: c Q.
Speaker 2: Brown.
Speaker 1: So if you guys want to go ahead and go
Speaker 1: over to Pete Hegseth's social media, let them know y'all
Speaker 1: think about c Q round today who the Trump administration fire,
Speaker 1: probably because they were threatened by this black man h
Speaker 1: and all the DEI greatness and excellence he brought to
Speaker 1: the table. Instead, they got a Fox News host as
Speaker 1: the Department of Defense secretary. But first, so Lolo also said,
Speaker 1: can you also make a mention of how to submit questions? Yes,
Speaker 1: please make sure you all send in your videos to
Speaker 1: our Instagram dms. You can send in a video preferably
Speaker 1: what's this landscape? Landscape?
Speaker 3: One is vertical?
Speaker 2: Portrait? Vertical? I think it's portrait.
Speaker 1: Anyway, Just send in the video with your phone straight
Speaker 1: up like this.
Speaker 2: That's what we're trying to say, Like this, send in
Speaker 2: to us. Try to keep it to sixty seconds or left.
Speaker 1: Make let's make sure you say your name and where
Speaker 1: you're from, and we always try to get to those questions.
Speaker 1: Our question, ombudsman is right here, sitting here, Tiffany Cross.
Speaker 1: You make sure that your voices are presented on every
Speaker 1: Native Lampod show. I have kept my sister about thirty
Speaker 1: five minutes over her exit time.
Speaker 2: I'm gonna honor her boundary and she's got to go.
Speaker 2: So thank y'all so much. Welcome home, y'all see soon.
Speaker 3: My guys.
Speaker 1: Native Lampod is a production of iHeartRadio in partnership with
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