1 00:00:01,760 --> 00:00:10,799 Speaker 1: Col Zone Media book Club book Club book Club Club. 2 00:00:11,680 --> 00:00:14,240 Speaker 1: Hello and welcome to Cool Zone Media Book Club. I'm 3 00:00:14,280 --> 00:00:17,680 Speaker 1: your host, Margaret Kildrey. Today I'm taking you on a 4 00:00:17,760 --> 00:00:23,160 Speaker 1: journey of discovery, well discovery about the things that I've 5 00:00:23,160 --> 00:00:26,599 Speaker 1: been researching obsessively for the past several months. I've been 6 00:00:26,640 --> 00:00:28,360 Speaker 1: doing a lot of research for the past few months 7 00:00:28,520 --> 00:00:31,440 Speaker 1: for my podcast about the history of Russia, especially all 8 00:00:31,480 --> 00:00:33,240 Speaker 1: the stuff that led up to the Russian Revolution of 9 00:00:33,320 --> 00:00:36,880 Speaker 1: nineteen seventeen. And there's this one character who's loomed larger 10 00:00:36,920 --> 00:00:39,800 Speaker 1: in the background of that story, larger than any other. 11 00:00:40,600 --> 00:00:47,160 Speaker 1: And it's not Rasputen, it's Leo Tolstoy. Well, he's loomed 12 00:00:47,159 --> 00:00:49,640 Speaker 1: the largest without taking center stage, at least as a 13 00:00:49,680 --> 00:00:53,279 Speaker 1: political thinker. He's loomed really large because Leo Tolstoy, one 14 00:00:53,280 --> 00:00:56,320 Speaker 1: of the most famous novelists of all time, didn't quite 15 00:00:56,560 --> 00:00:59,280 Speaker 1: start the Christian pacifist anarchist movement that was all the 16 00:00:59,360 --> 00:01:02,440 Speaker 1: rage in Russia the nineteenth century, but instead he had 17 00:01:02,480 --> 00:01:05,840 Speaker 1: become its central theorist and the most influential propagandist of it. 18 00:01:06,240 --> 00:01:09,720 Speaker 1: And so he's just like woven his way through all 19 00:01:09,760 --> 00:01:13,440 Speaker 1: of these narratives and soon enough, with Coolson Media book 20 00:01:13,440 --> 00:01:16,000 Speaker 1: Club and with my own cool people did cool stuff, 21 00:01:16,240 --> 00:01:18,600 Speaker 1: I'll be leaving Mother Russia behind and learning about and 22 00:01:18,640 --> 00:01:22,920 Speaker 1: talking about other places. But I figured last week I 23 00:01:23,000 --> 00:01:26,360 Speaker 1: told Cossack fairy tales, and today I'm going to read 24 00:01:26,400 --> 00:01:30,319 Speaker 1: a folk story written by Tolstoy himself that's about the Cossacks, 25 00:01:30,360 --> 00:01:33,800 Speaker 1: and it's kind of about the origin of the Cossacks 26 00:01:34,120 --> 00:01:38,479 Speaker 1: politically within Russia. I found this story from eighteen ninety 27 00:01:38,560 --> 00:01:42,640 Speaker 1: nine in a book called Fables for Children, and if 28 00:01:42,640 --> 00:01:44,840 Speaker 1: this is the stuff that children were reared on, it 29 00:01:44,920 --> 00:01:48,080 Speaker 1: sort of explains a thing or two about how Russia 30 00:01:48,120 --> 00:01:52,560 Speaker 1: went pretty immediately after. It's a story called Yurmak, the 31 00:01:52,600 --> 00:01:56,920 Speaker 1: Conqueror of Siberia. It's set in the sixteenth century in Russia. 32 00:01:57,000 --> 00:01:59,800 Speaker 1: Well it's not Russia at the time, it's Siberia at 33 00:01:59,800 --> 00:02:02,720 Speaker 1: the time time until it becomes Russia that see the 34 00:02:02,760 --> 00:02:09,840 Speaker 1: title conquer Siberias, but a guy who conquered Siberia. I 35 00:02:09,960 --> 00:02:13,440 Speaker 1: like this story one because it's kind of fun, well 36 00:02:13,639 --> 00:02:16,680 Speaker 1: my version of fun, and because I think it's useful 37 00:02:16,760 --> 00:02:19,440 Speaker 1: to help people understand how colonization is older than the 38 00:02:19,480 --> 00:02:23,120 Speaker 1: concepts of the state, how everywhere is conquered in controlled space. 39 00:02:23,520 --> 00:02:26,560 Speaker 1: How capitalism has been part of colonization since before capitalism 40 00:02:26,600 --> 00:02:29,520 Speaker 1: was even a word. And also the story reads is 41 00:02:29,800 --> 00:02:33,480 Speaker 1: something between a Conan and Wild West adventure, only written 42 00:02:33,600 --> 00:02:39,760 Speaker 1: by a Christian anarchist pacifist novelist. In Russia, here it 43 00:02:39,840 --> 00:02:47,680 Speaker 1: is You're Mac the Conqueror of Siberia by Leo Tolstoy. 44 00:02:48,880 --> 00:02:52,799 Speaker 1: In the reign of Ivan Vasilovich the Terrible, there were 45 00:02:52,800 --> 00:02:55,919 Speaker 1: the rich Mertens, the Stroganovs, and they lived in perm 46 00:02:56,400 --> 00:02:59,720 Speaker 1: on the River Kama. They heard that along the River Kama, 47 00:03:00,160 --> 00:03:02,440 Speaker 1: in a circle of one hundred and forty versts of 48 00:03:02,560 --> 00:03:06,000 Speaker 1: verses about two thirds of a mile, there was good land. 49 00:03:06,360 --> 00:03:09,320 Speaker 1: The soil had not been plowed for centuries, the forests 50 00:03:09,320 --> 00:03:12,519 Speaker 1: had not been cut down for centuries. In the forests 51 00:03:12,600 --> 00:03:15,560 Speaker 1: were many wild animals, and along the river fish lakes, 52 00:03:16,000 --> 00:03:18,640 Speaker 1: and no one was living on that land, but only 53 00:03:18,680 --> 00:03:22,160 Speaker 1: Tartars passed through it. The Stroganovs wrote a letter to 54 00:03:22,160 --> 00:03:25,240 Speaker 1: the Tsar, Give us this land, and we will ourselves 55 00:03:25,240 --> 00:03:28,000 Speaker 1: build towns there and gather people and settle them there, 56 00:03:28,400 --> 00:03:30,639 Speaker 1: and will not allow the Tartars to pass through it. 57 00:03:31,240 --> 00:03:33,440 Speaker 1: The Tsar agreed to it and gave them the land. 58 00:03:33,600 --> 00:03:36,920 Speaker 1: The Stroganovs sent out clerks to gather people, and there 59 00:03:36,960 --> 00:03:40,080 Speaker 1: came to them a large number of roving people. Whoever 60 00:03:40,120 --> 00:03:43,600 Speaker 1: came received from the Stroganov's land forest and cattle, and 61 00:03:43,640 --> 00:03:46,400 Speaker 1: no tenant pay was collected. All they had to do 62 00:03:46,520 --> 00:03:48,600 Speaker 1: was live and in the case of need, to go 63 00:03:48,680 --> 00:03:51,920 Speaker 1: out in mass to fight the Tartars. Thus the land 64 00:03:52,040 --> 00:03:56,920 Speaker 1: was settled by Russian people. About twenty years past. The 65 00:03:56,960 --> 00:03:59,600 Speaker 1: Stroganovs grew richer yet, and that land one hundred and 66 00:03:59,600 --> 00:04:03,160 Speaker 1: forty fives surround was not enough for them. They wanted 67 00:04:03,200 --> 00:04:06,240 Speaker 1: to have more land. Still, About one hundred versts from 68 00:04:06,280 --> 00:04:09,920 Speaker 1: them were high mountains, the Ural mountains, and beyond them 69 00:04:10,320 --> 00:04:12,760 Speaker 1: they had heard there was good land, and to that 70 00:04:12,880 --> 00:04:15,480 Speaker 1: land there was no end. This land was ruled by 71 00:04:15,520 --> 00:04:20,080 Speaker 1: a small Siberian prince, Kuchum by name. In former days, 72 00:04:20,160 --> 00:04:23,400 Speaker 1: Kuchum had sworn allegiance to the Russian Tsar, but later 73 00:04:23,440 --> 00:04:26,920 Speaker 1: he began to rebel, and he threatened to destroy Stroganov's towns. 74 00:04:27,800 --> 00:04:30,960 Speaker 1: So the Stroganovs wrote to the Tsar, you have given 75 00:04:31,040 --> 00:04:32,719 Speaker 1: us land, and we have conquered it and turned it 76 00:04:32,760 --> 00:04:36,159 Speaker 1: over to you. Now the Thievish tsarling Kuchum is rebellion 77 00:04:36,200 --> 00:04:38,240 Speaker 1: against you and wants to take that land away and 78 00:04:38,320 --> 00:04:41,200 Speaker 1: ruin us. Command us to take possession of the land 79 00:04:41,240 --> 00:04:44,719 Speaker 1: beyond the Ural mountains. We will conquer Kuchum and bring 80 00:04:44,760 --> 00:04:48,520 Speaker 1: all his land under your rule. The Tsar assented and 81 00:04:48,560 --> 00:04:52,159 Speaker 1: wrote back, if you have sufficient force, take the land 82 00:04:52,160 --> 00:04:55,240 Speaker 1: away from Kuchum, only do not entice many people away 83 00:04:55,240 --> 00:04:58,920 Speaker 1: from Russia. When the Stroganovs got that letter from the Tsar, 84 00:04:59,240 --> 00:05:02,480 Speaker 1: they sent out to collect more people, and they ordered 85 00:05:02,520 --> 00:05:05,159 Speaker 1: them to persuade mostly the Cossacks from Volga and the 86 00:05:05,240 --> 00:05:08,839 Speaker 1: Dawn to come. At that time, many Cossacks were roving 87 00:05:08,880 --> 00:05:11,520 Speaker 1: along the Volga and the Dawn. They used to gather 88 00:05:11,600 --> 00:05:14,480 Speaker 1: in bands of two, three or six hundred men and 89 00:05:14,560 --> 00:05:17,480 Speaker 1: to select an ottoman, and to row down in barges 90 00:05:17,520 --> 00:05:20,080 Speaker 1: to capture ships and rob them. And for the winter 91 00:05:20,240 --> 00:05:23,400 Speaker 1: they stayed in little towns on the shore. The clerks 92 00:05:23,440 --> 00:05:26,159 Speaker 1: arrived at the Volga, and there they asked who the 93 00:05:26,160 --> 00:05:29,920 Speaker 1: famous Cossacks of the region were. They were told, there 94 00:05:29,920 --> 00:05:32,560 Speaker 1: are many Cossacks. It is impossible to live for them. 95 00:05:32,960 --> 00:05:37,640 Speaker 1: There is Mishka, Tchernishenin and Sarasmin. But there's no fiercer 96 00:05:37,680 --> 00:05:41,560 Speaker 1: one than yar Maktimofitch the Ottoman. He has a thousand men, 97 00:05:41,600 --> 00:05:43,680 Speaker 1: and not only the merchants and the people are afraid 98 00:05:43,720 --> 00:05:46,160 Speaker 1: of him. But even the Czarin army does not dare 99 00:05:46,240 --> 00:05:49,080 Speaker 1: to cope with him. And the clerks went to Ermak 100 00:05:49,160 --> 00:05:51,599 Speaker 1: the Ottoman and began to persuade him to go to 101 00:05:51,600 --> 00:05:55,440 Speaker 1: the Stroganovs. Ermak received the clerks, listened to their speeches, 102 00:05:55,440 --> 00:05:58,120 Speaker 1: and promised to come with his people about the time 103 00:05:58,240 --> 00:06:02,679 Speaker 1: of the assumption of the Blessed Virgin. Near the holiday 104 00:06:02,720 --> 00:06:05,200 Speaker 1: of the Assumption, there came to the Stroganov six hundred 105 00:06:05,240 --> 00:06:09,960 Speaker 1: Cossacks with their ottoman Yermak Timofitch, and at first Stroganov 106 00:06:09,960 --> 00:06:14,440 Speaker 1: sent them against their neighboring Tartars. The Cossacks annihilated them. Then, 107 00:06:14,480 --> 00:06:17,120 Speaker 1: when nothing was doing, the Cossacks roved in the neighborhood 108 00:06:17,160 --> 00:06:20,640 Speaker 1: and robbed. So Stroganov sent for Yermach and said, I 109 00:06:20,640 --> 00:06:22,400 Speaker 1: will not keep you any longer if you are going 110 00:06:22,440 --> 00:06:25,640 Speaker 1: to be so wanton. But Jermach said, I do not 111 00:06:25,839 --> 00:06:28,480 Speaker 1: like it myself, but I cannot control my people. They 112 00:06:28,520 --> 00:06:32,200 Speaker 1: are spoiled. Give us work to do so Stroganov said, 113 00:06:32,640 --> 00:06:35,160 Speaker 1: go beyond the Ural and fight the Kuchum and take 114 00:06:35,240 --> 00:06:38,400 Speaker 1: possession of his land. The Tsar will reward you for it, 115 00:06:39,160 --> 00:06:42,240 Speaker 1: and he showed the Tsar's letter to Ermach. Irmach rejoiced 116 00:06:42,240 --> 00:06:45,200 Speaker 1: and collected his men and said, you are shaming me 117 00:06:45,279 --> 00:06:48,160 Speaker 1: before my master. You are robbing without reason. If you 118 00:06:48,240 --> 00:06:50,599 Speaker 1: do not stop, he will drive you away. And where 119 00:06:50,640 --> 00:06:53,279 Speaker 1: will you go? Then at the Volga there is a 120 00:06:53,360 --> 00:06:55,920 Speaker 1: large Tzarin army. We shall be caught, and then we 121 00:06:55,960 --> 00:06:59,600 Speaker 1: shall suffer for our old misdeeds. But if you feel lonesome, 122 00:07:00,160 --> 00:07:03,520 Speaker 1: here is work for you. And he showed them the 123 00:07:03,560 --> 00:07:06,120 Speaker 1: Tsar's letter, in which it was said that Stroganov had 124 00:07:06,120 --> 00:07:09,320 Speaker 1: been permitted to conquer land beyond the Earl. The Cossacks 125 00:07:09,320 --> 00:07:13,120 Speaker 1: had a consultation and agreed to go. Yermak went to Stroganov, 126 00:07:13,200 --> 00:07:16,080 Speaker 1: and they began to deliberate how they had best go. 127 00:07:16,960 --> 00:07:20,600 Speaker 1: They discussed how many barges they needed, how much grain, cattle, guns, 128 00:07:20,640 --> 00:07:24,960 Speaker 1: powder led, how many captive Tartar interpreters, how many foreigners 129 00:07:24,960 --> 00:07:29,040 Speaker 1: as masters of gunnery. Stroganov thought, though it may cost 130 00:07:29,160 --> 00:07:31,680 Speaker 1: me much, I must give them everything, or else they 131 00:07:31,680 --> 00:07:36,040 Speaker 1: will stay here and ruin me. Stroganov agreed to everything, 132 00:07:36,440 --> 00:07:39,440 Speaker 1: gathered what was needed, and fitted out Yermak and the Cossacks. 133 00:07:40,560 --> 00:07:43,040 Speaker 1: On the first of September, the Cossacks rode with Yermak 134 00:07:43,120 --> 00:07:45,960 Speaker 1: up the river to Savayah on thirty two barges with 135 00:07:46,040 --> 00:07:48,840 Speaker 1: twelve men in each. For four days they rode up 136 00:07:48,880 --> 00:07:51,600 Speaker 1: the river, and then they turned into the Seabernaya River. 137 00:07:52,320 --> 00:07:55,320 Speaker 1: Beyond that point it was impossible to navigate. They asked 138 00:07:55,360 --> 00:07:57,600 Speaker 1: the guides and learned that from there they had to 139 00:07:57,600 --> 00:08:00,520 Speaker 1: cross the mountains and walk overland about two hundred versts, 140 00:08:00,960 --> 00:08:04,320 Speaker 1: and then the rivers would begin again. The Cossacks stopped, 141 00:08:04,360 --> 00:08:07,400 Speaker 1: built a town and unloaded all their equipment. They abandoned 142 00:08:07,440 --> 00:08:10,280 Speaker 1: the boats, made carts, put everything upon them, and started 143 00:08:10,280 --> 00:08:14,440 Speaker 1: overland across the mountains. All those places were covered with forests, 144 00:08:14,440 --> 00:08:17,760 Speaker 1: and nobody was living there. They marched for about ten 145 00:08:17,840 --> 00:08:22,920 Speaker 1: days and struck the river Zaranaya. There they stopped again 146 00:08:22,960 --> 00:08:26,040 Speaker 1: and made themselves boats. They landed, they loaded them and 147 00:08:26,120 --> 00:08:28,800 Speaker 1: rowed down the river. They rowed five days, and then 148 00:08:28,840 --> 00:08:33,600 Speaker 1: they came to more cheerful places, meadows, forests, lakes. There 149 00:08:33,640 --> 00:08:36,480 Speaker 1: they had plenty of fish and animals and animals that 150 00:08:36,559 --> 00:08:39,560 Speaker 1: had not been scared by hunters. They rowed another day 151 00:08:39,640 --> 00:08:42,720 Speaker 1: and sailed into the river Tura. Along the Tura, they 152 00:08:42,720 --> 00:08:47,280 Speaker 1: came upon Tartar people and towns. RMK sent some Cossacks 153 00:08:47,320 --> 00:08:48,680 Speaker 1: to take a look at a town to see what 154 00:08:48,679 --> 00:08:51,520 Speaker 1: it was like and whether there was any considerable force 155 00:08:51,559 --> 00:08:54,120 Speaker 1: in it. Twenty cossacks went there, and they frightened all 156 00:08:54,120 --> 00:08:56,760 Speaker 1: the Tartars and seized the whole town and captured all 157 00:08:56,760 --> 00:08:59,400 Speaker 1: the cattle. Some of the Tartars they killed, and others 158 00:08:59,400 --> 00:09:02,719 Speaker 1: they brought back a live. Yurmak asked the Tartars through 159 00:09:02,720 --> 00:09:05,200 Speaker 1: his interpreters what kind of people they were and under 160 00:09:05,200 --> 00:09:08,000 Speaker 1: whose rule they were living. The Tartars said that they 161 00:09:08,000 --> 00:09:12,080 Speaker 1: were in the Siberian Kingdom and that their king was Kuchum. 162 00:09:12,200 --> 00:09:14,319 Speaker 1: Yumak let the Tartars go, but three of the more 163 00:09:14,320 --> 00:09:16,880 Speaker 1: intelligent he took with him to show him the road 164 00:09:17,800 --> 00:09:21,080 Speaker 1: they rode on. The farther they rode, the larger did 165 00:09:21,080 --> 00:09:24,240 Speaker 1: the river grow. And the farther they went, the better 166 00:09:24,440 --> 00:09:27,360 Speaker 1: did the places become. They met more and more people, 167 00:09:27,559 --> 00:09:30,400 Speaker 1: only they were not strong men. And all the towns 168 00:09:30,400 --> 00:09:33,480 Speaker 1: that were near the river, the Cossacks conquered. In one town, 169 00:09:33,480 --> 00:09:35,960 Speaker 1: they captured a large number of Tartars and one old 170 00:09:36,000 --> 00:09:38,520 Speaker 1: man who was held in respect. They asked him what 171 00:09:38,640 --> 00:09:42,040 Speaker 1: kind of a man he was, and he said, I 172 00:09:42,080 --> 00:09:44,960 Speaker 1: am Tazik, a servant of my king Kuchum, who has 173 00:09:45,000 --> 00:09:48,320 Speaker 1: made me a commander in this town. Yermak asked Tazak 174 00:09:48,360 --> 00:09:50,840 Speaker 1: about his king, how far his city of Cyber was, 175 00:09:51,080 --> 00:09:54,280 Speaker 1: whether Kuchum had a large force, whether he had much wealth. 176 00:09:54,600 --> 00:09:58,320 Speaker 1: Tazak told him everything. He said, Kuchum is the first 177 00:09:58,440 --> 00:10:01,520 Speaker 1: king in the world of Cyber is the largest city 178 00:10:01,559 --> 00:10:04,520 Speaker 1: in the world. In that city, he said, there are 179 00:10:04,520 --> 00:10:06,679 Speaker 1: as many people and as many cattle as there are 180 00:10:06,760 --> 00:10:09,600 Speaker 1: stars in the heaven. There is no counting his force, 181 00:10:09,920 --> 00:10:12,839 Speaker 1: and not all the kings in the world can conquer him. 182 00:10:13,200 --> 00:10:20,040 Speaker 1: But you know what can conquer you is advertising gets 183 00:10:20,040 --> 00:10:32,920 Speaker 1: into everyone's heads, slips into the middle of stories. And 184 00:10:32,960 --> 00:10:38,520 Speaker 1: we're back. Yermak said, we Russians have come here to 185 00:10:38,600 --> 00:10:41,200 Speaker 1: conquer your king and take his city and put it 186 00:10:41,240 --> 00:10:43,640 Speaker 1: into the hands of the Russians. Are we have a 187 00:10:43,720 --> 00:10:46,720 Speaker 1: large force. Those who have come with me are only 188 00:10:46,760 --> 00:10:49,600 Speaker 1: the advance guard. Those that are rowing down behind us 189 00:10:49,600 --> 00:10:52,079 Speaker 1: in barges are numberless, and all of them have guns. 190 00:10:52,480 --> 00:10:55,320 Speaker 1: Our guns pierce trees, not like your bows and arrows. 191 00:10:55,840 --> 00:10:59,080 Speaker 1: Just look, and Yrmak fired at a tree and pierced it. 192 00:10:59,240 --> 00:11:02,160 Speaker 1: The Cossacks began and to shoot on all sides. Tazak, 193 00:11:02,240 --> 00:11:05,080 Speaker 1: in fright, fell on his knees. Yrmak said to him, 194 00:11:05,720 --> 00:11:07,600 Speaker 1: go to your king Kutchum and tell him what you 195 00:11:07,640 --> 00:11:10,319 Speaker 1: have seen. Let him surrender, and if he does not, 196 00:11:10,920 --> 00:11:15,480 Speaker 1: we will destroy him. And he dismissed Tazik. The Cossacks 197 00:11:15,559 --> 00:11:18,880 Speaker 1: rode on. They sailed into the river Tobul and were 198 00:11:18,880 --> 00:11:22,400 Speaker 1: getting nearer to the city of Cyber. They sailed up 199 00:11:22,400 --> 00:11:25,080 Speaker 1: a small river, Babasan, and there they saw a small 200 00:11:25,120 --> 00:11:27,960 Speaker 1: town on its bank, and around the town a large 201 00:11:28,040 --> 00:11:32,080 Speaker 1: number of Tartars. They sent an interpreter to the Tartars 202 00:11:32,080 --> 00:11:33,960 Speaker 1: to find out what kind of people they were. The 203 00:11:34,000 --> 00:11:37,679 Speaker 1: interpreter returned and said, that is Kuchum's army that has 204 00:11:37,720 --> 00:11:41,040 Speaker 1: gathered there. The leader of that army is Kuchum's own 205 00:11:41,040 --> 00:11:44,520 Speaker 1: son in law, Mametku. He has commanded me to tell 206 00:11:44,559 --> 00:11:47,400 Speaker 1: you that you must return or else he will destroy you. 207 00:11:48,520 --> 00:11:51,160 Speaker 1: Urmak gathered as Cossacks landed on the bank and began 208 00:11:51,200 --> 00:11:53,960 Speaker 1: to shoot at the Tartars. The moment the Tartars are 209 00:11:54,000 --> 00:11:56,920 Speaker 1: the shooting, they began to run. The Cossacks ran after 210 00:11:56,960 --> 00:12:01,280 Speaker 1: them and killed some and captured others. Mametku barely escaped. 211 00:12:01,920 --> 00:12:05,160 Speaker 1: The Cossacks sailed on. They sailed into a broad rapid river, 212 00:12:05,320 --> 00:12:08,199 Speaker 1: the irtysh Down Irtysh River. They sailed for a day 213 00:12:08,240 --> 00:12:10,520 Speaker 1: and came to a fair town, where they stopped. The 214 00:12:10,559 --> 00:12:13,280 Speaker 1: Cossacks went to the town. As they were coming near, 215 00:12:13,400 --> 00:12:16,400 Speaker 1: the Tartars began to shoot their arrows and wounded three Cossacks. 216 00:12:17,040 --> 00:12:20,120 Speaker 1: Then Irmak sent an interpreter to tell the Tartars that 217 00:12:20,160 --> 00:12:22,720 Speaker 1: they must surrender the town or else they would all 218 00:12:22,760 --> 00:12:26,120 Speaker 1: be killed. The interpreter went and he returned and said, 219 00:12:26,840 --> 00:12:30,720 Speaker 1: here lives Kuchum's servant at Tikmerza Kharchara. He has a 220 00:12:30,760 --> 00:12:33,079 Speaker 1: large force, and he says he will not surrender the town. 221 00:12:34,240 --> 00:12:37,760 Speaker 1: Yarmak gathered the Cossacks and said, boys, if we do 222 00:12:37,840 --> 00:12:40,240 Speaker 1: not take this town, the Tartars will rejoice and will 223 00:12:40,240 --> 00:12:42,800 Speaker 1: not let us pass on. The more we strike them 224 00:12:42,800 --> 00:12:46,080 Speaker 1: with terror, the easier it will be land all and 225 00:12:46,160 --> 00:12:49,880 Speaker 1: attack them all at once. So they did. There were 226 00:12:49,880 --> 00:12:53,199 Speaker 1: many Tartars there, and they were brave. When the Cossacks 227 00:12:53,280 --> 00:12:56,079 Speaker 1: rushed at them, the Tartars began to shoot their arrows. 228 00:12:56,520 --> 00:12:59,720 Speaker 1: They covered the Cossacks with them. Some were killed and 229 00:12:59,760 --> 00:13:04,000 Speaker 1: some wounded. The Cossacks became enraged, and when they got 230 00:13:04,040 --> 00:13:06,000 Speaker 1: to the Tartars, they killed all that they could lay 231 00:13:06,000 --> 00:13:11,559 Speaker 1: their hands on. In this town, the Cossacks found much property, cattle, rugs, furs, 232 00:13:11,600 --> 00:13:15,080 Speaker 1: and honey. They buried the dead, rested themselves, took away 233 00:13:15,160 --> 00:13:18,360 Speaker 1: much property, and sailed on. They did not sail far 234 00:13:18,600 --> 00:13:20,839 Speaker 1: when they saw on the shore like a city, an 235 00:13:20,920 --> 00:13:24,040 Speaker 1: endless number of troops, and the whole army surrounded by 236 00:13:24,040 --> 00:13:27,920 Speaker 1: a ditch, and the ditch protected by timber. The Cossacks stopped. 237 00:13:28,160 --> 00:13:32,480 Speaker 1: They deliberated. Earmot gathered a circle around him. Well, boys, 238 00:13:33,120 --> 00:13:36,800 Speaker 1: what shall we do? The Cossacks were frightened. Some said 239 00:13:36,800 --> 00:13:38,720 Speaker 1: that they ought to sail past, while others said they 240 00:13:38,720 --> 00:13:40,720 Speaker 1: ought to go back, and others said they should take 241 00:13:40,720 --> 00:13:55,400 Speaker 1: advantage of these sweet, sweet deals. God, I yep, your's ads, 242 00:13:58,160 --> 00:14:03,880 Speaker 1: and we're back. They look gloomy and began to scold Irmak. 243 00:14:04,120 --> 00:14:07,680 Speaker 1: They said, why did you bring us here? Already a 244 00:14:07,720 --> 00:14:09,960 Speaker 1: few of ours have been killed, and many have been wounded, 245 00:14:10,160 --> 00:14:13,080 Speaker 1: and all of us will perish here. They began to weep. 246 00:14:13,679 --> 00:14:18,679 Speaker 1: But Rmak said to his Subottoman Ivan Colsteau, well, Vanya, 247 00:14:19,120 --> 00:14:23,120 Speaker 1: what do you think? And Colstou said what do I think? 248 00:14:23,400 --> 00:14:25,680 Speaker 1: If they do not kill us today, they will tomorrow, 249 00:14:25,800 --> 00:14:28,680 Speaker 1: and if not tomorrow, we shall die anyway on the oven. 250 00:14:29,360 --> 00:14:31,000 Speaker 1: In my opinion, we ought to go out in the 251 00:14:31,040 --> 00:14:34,080 Speaker 1: shore and rush in a body against the Tartars. Maybe 252 00:14:34,080 --> 00:14:37,840 Speaker 1: God will give us victory. Irmak said, you are a 253 00:14:37,880 --> 00:14:41,200 Speaker 1: brave man, Vanya. That is what must be done. Oh 254 00:14:41,240 --> 00:14:44,520 Speaker 1: you boys, you are not cossacks but old woman. All 255 00:14:44,560 --> 00:14:46,880 Speaker 1: you are good for is to catch sturgeon and frighten 256 00:14:46,920 --> 00:14:49,960 Speaker 1: Tartar women. Can't you see for yourselves? If we turn back, 257 00:14:49,960 --> 00:14:52,600 Speaker 1: we shall be destroyed. If we stay here, they will 258 00:14:52,640 --> 00:14:56,080 Speaker 1: destroy us. How can we go back? After a little work, 259 00:14:56,160 --> 00:14:58,760 Speaker 1: it will come easier. Listen, boys, My father had a 260 00:14:58,800 --> 00:15:02,280 Speaker 1: strong mare. Downhill, she would pull. In an uneven place, 261 00:15:02,320 --> 00:15:04,600 Speaker 1: she would pull, but when it came to going uphill, 262 00:15:04,640 --> 00:15:07,280 Speaker 1: she became stubborn and turned back, thinking it would be easier. 263 00:15:07,720 --> 00:15:10,280 Speaker 1: But my father took a club and belabored her with it. 264 00:15:10,680 --> 00:15:13,160 Speaker 1: She twisted and tugged and broke the whole cart. My 265 00:15:13,240 --> 00:15:14,920 Speaker 1: father on hitched her from the cart and gave her 266 00:15:14,920 --> 00:15:17,880 Speaker 1: a terrible whacking. If she had pulled the cart, she 267 00:15:17,920 --> 00:15:21,080 Speaker 1: would have suffered no torment. So it is with us, boys. 268 00:15:21,600 --> 00:15:23,400 Speaker 1: There is only one thing left for us to do, 269 00:15:23,600 --> 00:15:26,560 Speaker 1: and that is to make straight for the Tartars. The 270 00:15:26,600 --> 00:15:30,440 Speaker 1: Cossacks laughed and said, Timofitch, you are evidently more clever 271 00:15:30,520 --> 00:15:33,000 Speaker 1: than we are. You have no business to ask us fools. 272 00:15:33,360 --> 00:15:36,120 Speaker 1: Take us where you please. A man does not die twice, 273 00:15:36,440 --> 00:15:41,240 Speaker 1: and one death cannot be escaped. And your Mak said, listen, boys, 274 00:15:41,280 --> 00:15:43,320 Speaker 1: this is what we shall do. They have not yet 275 00:15:43,360 --> 00:15:46,360 Speaker 1: seen us all. Let us divide into three parts. Those 276 00:15:46,400 --> 00:15:48,600 Speaker 1: in the middle will march straight against them, and the 277 00:15:48,640 --> 00:15:50,680 Speaker 1: other two divisions will surround them on the right and 278 00:15:50,720 --> 00:15:53,920 Speaker 1: on the left. When the middle detachment begins to walk 279 00:15:53,960 --> 00:15:56,320 Speaker 1: toward them, they will think that we are all there, 280 00:15:56,440 --> 00:15:58,600 Speaker 1: and so they will leap forward. Then we will strike 281 00:15:58,640 --> 00:16:02,400 Speaker 1: them from the sides the way. Boys, if we beat these, 282 00:16:02,760 --> 00:16:05,000 Speaker 1: we shall not have to be afraid of anybody. We 283 00:16:05,040 --> 00:16:09,640 Speaker 1: shall ourselves be kings. And so they did. When the 284 00:16:09,640 --> 00:16:13,240 Speaker 1: middle detachment with Yermak advance, the Tartars screamed and leaped forward. 285 00:16:13,560 --> 00:16:15,960 Speaker 1: Then they were attacked by even Colsteaux on the side 286 00:16:16,080 --> 00:16:19,480 Speaker 1: and by Meshcheryakov, the Attaman on the left. The Tartars 287 00:16:19,480 --> 00:16:22,200 Speaker 1: were frightened and ran. The Cossacks killed a great many 288 00:16:22,200 --> 00:16:25,720 Speaker 1: of them. After that, nobody dared to oppose your Mak. 289 00:16:26,600 --> 00:16:31,000 Speaker 1: Thus he entered the city of Sibir, and there Rmak 290 00:16:31,080 --> 00:16:34,760 Speaker 1: settled down as though he were a king. Then Kinglets 291 00:16:34,800 --> 00:16:37,840 Speaker 1: came to see Rmak and bowed to him. Tartars began 292 00:16:37,880 --> 00:16:40,800 Speaker 1: to settle down in Sibir, and Kuchem and his son 293 00:16:40,840 --> 00:16:43,880 Speaker 1: in law Mamat Koul were afraid to go straight at him, 294 00:16:44,240 --> 00:16:46,600 Speaker 1: but kept going around in a circle, wondering how they 295 00:16:46,680 --> 00:16:51,040 Speaker 1: might destroy him. In the spring, during high water, the 296 00:16:51,040 --> 00:16:54,480 Speaker 1: Tartars came running to your Mok and said, Mamatkoul is 297 00:16:54,480 --> 00:16:57,000 Speaker 1: going against us. He has gathered a large army and 298 00:16:57,080 --> 00:17:01,040 Speaker 1: is making a stand near the river vargay Yrmak made 299 00:17:01,080 --> 00:17:04,840 Speaker 1: his way over rivers, swamps, brooks and forests, stole up 300 00:17:04,880 --> 00:17:07,680 Speaker 1: with his cossacks, rushed against Mamat Koul, killed a large 301 00:17:07,760 --> 00:17:10,840 Speaker 1: number of Tartars, and took Mamotkoul alive and brought him 302 00:17:10,880 --> 00:17:14,360 Speaker 1: to Sibir. After that there were only a few unruly 303 00:17:14,359 --> 00:17:17,280 Speaker 1: Tartars left, and yr Mak went that summer against those 304 00:17:17,280 --> 00:17:19,879 Speaker 1: who had not yet surrendered, and along the Irtish in 305 00:17:19,920 --> 00:17:22,800 Speaker 1: the ab Yrmak conquered so much land that one could 306 00:17:22,840 --> 00:17:25,720 Speaker 1: not march around it. In two months, when Yermak had 307 00:17:25,720 --> 00:17:27,720 Speaker 1: conquered all that land, he sent a messenger to the 308 00:17:27,720 --> 00:17:31,600 Speaker 1: Stroganovs and a letter. I have taken Kuchum city, he said, 309 00:17:31,880 --> 00:17:34,520 Speaker 1: and have captured Mamat Koul and have brought all the 310 00:17:34,520 --> 00:17:38,200 Speaker 1: people here under my rule. Only I have lost many Cossacks. 311 00:17:38,720 --> 00:17:41,080 Speaker 1: Send people to us that we might feel more cheerful. 312 00:17:41,560 --> 00:17:44,440 Speaker 1: There is no end to the wealth in this country. 313 00:17:44,640 --> 00:17:48,520 Speaker 1: He sent them many costly furs, fox marten and sable furs. 314 00:17:49,800 --> 00:17:53,720 Speaker 1: Two years passed after that. Hyrmak was still holding Sibir, 315 00:17:54,200 --> 00:17:56,960 Speaker 1: but no aid came from Russia, and a few Russians 316 00:17:57,000 --> 00:18:01,160 Speaker 1: were left with Irmak. One day, the Tartar Karacha sent 317 00:18:01,160 --> 00:18:04,600 Speaker 1: a messenger to your Mak, saying, we have surrendered to you, 318 00:18:05,160 --> 00:18:08,320 Speaker 1: but now the Nogays are oppressing us. Send your brave 319 00:18:08,359 --> 00:18:11,480 Speaker 1: men to aid us. We shall together conquer the Nogays, 320 00:18:12,200 --> 00:18:14,520 Speaker 1: and we swear to you that we shall not insult 321 00:18:14,560 --> 00:18:18,919 Speaker 1: your brave men. Yurmak believed their oath and sent forty 322 00:18:18,960 --> 00:18:22,560 Speaker 1: men under Ivan Costeau. When these forty men came there, 323 00:18:22,640 --> 00:18:25,439 Speaker 1: the Tartars rushed against them and killed them, and there 324 00:18:25,440 --> 00:18:29,919 Speaker 1: were still fewer Cossacks left. Another time, some Bukhara merchants 325 00:18:29,960 --> 00:18:32,320 Speaker 1: sent word to Yrmak that they were on their way 326 00:18:32,320 --> 00:18:35,040 Speaker 1: to the city of Sibir with goods, but that Kuchem 327 00:18:35,200 --> 00:18:37,359 Speaker 1: had taken his stand with an army and would not 328 00:18:37,400 --> 00:18:40,960 Speaker 1: let them pass through. Yrmak took with him fifty men 329 00:18:41,000 --> 00:18:43,400 Speaker 1: and went out to clear the road for the Bukhara merchants. 330 00:18:44,040 --> 00:18:46,480 Speaker 1: He came to the Irtysh River, but did not find 331 00:18:46,520 --> 00:18:49,760 Speaker 1: the Bukharans. He remained there over night. It was a 332 00:18:49,840 --> 00:18:53,360 Speaker 1: dark knight and it rained. The Cossacks are just lain 333 00:18:53,480 --> 00:18:55,800 Speaker 1: down to sleep, when suddenly the Tartars rushed out and 334 00:18:55,840 --> 00:18:58,600 Speaker 1: threw themselves on the sleepy men and began to strike 335 00:18:58,640 --> 00:19:02,520 Speaker 1: them down. Irmak jumped up and began to fight. He 336 00:19:02,640 --> 00:19:05,120 Speaker 1: was wounded in the hand. He ran toward the river. 337 00:19:05,560 --> 00:19:09,359 Speaker 1: The Tartars after him. He into the river. That was 338 00:19:09,400 --> 00:19:12,600 Speaker 1: the last time he was seen. His body was not 339 00:19:12,640 --> 00:19:16,800 Speaker 1: recovered and no one found out how he died. The 340 00:19:16,840 --> 00:19:20,439 Speaker 1: following year came the Tsar's army and the Tartars were pacified. 341 00:19:22,000 --> 00:19:27,959 Speaker 1: The end. What a good story for kids, I, you know, 342 00:19:28,760 --> 00:19:35,000 Speaker 1: can't imagine any other story I'd rather tell children. And 343 00:19:35,600 --> 00:19:37,760 Speaker 1: the thing I find interesting about it, There's so many 344 00:19:37,800 --> 00:19:39,640 Speaker 1: things I find interesting about it, and one of them 345 00:19:39,680 --> 00:19:41,439 Speaker 1: is that, like, Okay, this is you know, presented as 346 00:19:41,440 --> 00:19:45,400 Speaker 1: a story for kids, because your Mak, the conqueror of Siberia, 347 00:19:45,720 --> 00:19:51,199 Speaker 1: was almost certainly a real person, but he also is 348 00:19:51,280 --> 00:19:56,720 Speaker 1: completely shrouded in mystery. And the first sources, the original sources, 349 00:19:56,800 --> 00:19:59,000 Speaker 1: there's a word here that I should know, and I 350 00:19:59,080 --> 00:20:04,240 Speaker 1: normally do know. The prime sources are contradictory and not conclusive. 351 00:20:04,960 --> 00:20:07,680 Speaker 1: And I'm, you know, haven't done a wild deep dive 352 00:20:07,840 --> 00:20:11,320 Speaker 1: into this particular historical figure or time. But I just 353 00:20:12,240 --> 00:20:14,679 Speaker 1: I find it so interesting. I find how this story 354 00:20:14,720 --> 00:20:17,199 Speaker 1: feels like it kind of be anywhere in the world 355 00:20:17,680 --> 00:20:22,240 Speaker 1: so fascinating to me. For a full blown history episode, 356 00:20:22,240 --> 00:20:24,480 Speaker 1: I'll go deeper on my sources in Wikipedia, but for 357 00:20:24,560 --> 00:20:26,600 Speaker 1: now I'm going to reference the Wikipedia page on the 358 00:20:26,680 --> 00:20:30,200 Speaker 1: historical Yarmak. I've talked a lot of my podcasts recently 359 00:20:30,200 --> 00:20:33,320 Speaker 1: about the Cossacks. How culturally that label meant something between 360 00:20:33,400 --> 00:20:35,119 Speaker 1: the name of an ethnic group and the name for 361 00:20:35,680 --> 00:20:38,919 Speaker 1: mercenary groups of bandits loyal to the czar. And I 362 00:20:38,960 --> 00:20:43,879 Speaker 1: had no idea where that had come from, right, that 363 00:20:43,960 --> 00:20:46,280 Speaker 1: was just always presented as like, oh, of course the Cossacks, 364 00:20:46,320 --> 00:20:48,760 Speaker 1: you know, they're loyal to the czar, even though they're 365 00:20:48,800 --> 00:20:54,360 Speaker 1: this nomadic people who do war. I'll probably not get 366 00:20:54,359 --> 00:20:57,639 Speaker 1: into the nomadic war machine concept by delusion quatari, but 367 00:20:57,720 --> 00:20:59,800 Speaker 1: this story is like the best example and I've ever 368 00:20:59,800 --> 00:21:01,400 Speaker 1: seen in my life. If you ever want to lose 369 00:21:01,400 --> 00:21:05,199 Speaker 1: yourself to strange continental philosophy that reads like poetry and 370 00:21:05,280 --> 00:21:09,760 Speaker 1: halfway makes sense, read nomadology by losing kwatari about the 371 00:21:09,760 --> 00:21:13,960 Speaker 1: concept of the nomadic war machine. And anyway, and so 372 00:21:14,119 --> 00:21:17,920 Speaker 1: this story, not this version of it, but your mock 373 00:21:18,520 --> 00:21:23,080 Speaker 1: and this conquering is where the distinction came from about 374 00:21:23,160 --> 00:21:27,439 Speaker 1: what Cossacks mean in sort of more modern contexts. To 375 00:21:27,520 --> 00:21:31,440 Speaker 1: quote Wikipedia, your mock transformed the image of the Cossack 376 00:21:31,520 --> 00:21:34,280 Speaker 1: overnight from a bandit to a soldier recognized by the 377 00:21:34,320 --> 00:21:38,439 Speaker 1: Czar of Moscow. Your Mack's call for aid thus spawned 378 00:21:38,480 --> 00:21:40,840 Speaker 1: a new type of Cossack, which by virtue of its 379 00:21:40,880 --> 00:21:44,280 Speaker 1: link to the government, would enjoy significant favor from future 380 00:21:44,320 --> 00:21:47,680 Speaker 1: Russian rulers. And so you have this idea. Oh, I said, 381 00:21:47,680 --> 00:21:49,399 Speaker 1: I wasn't going to get into the nomadic war machine, 382 00:21:49,400 --> 00:21:51,719 Speaker 1: but here I am doing it. There's this idea. It's 383 00:21:51,720 --> 00:21:55,920 Speaker 1: a philosophical idea. It's not a like true, guaranteed science. 384 00:21:56,359 --> 00:22:00,720 Speaker 1: Thing that we tend to think of violence is the 385 00:22:00,760 --> 00:22:04,000 Speaker 1: thing that the state does. But there's this idea that 386 00:22:04,560 --> 00:22:08,080 Speaker 1: the thing that does the violence is often a force 387 00:22:08,240 --> 00:22:12,920 Speaker 1: that's outside the state, and specifically, it's often a nomadic 388 00:22:13,000 --> 00:22:16,480 Speaker 1: war machine. It is a tool that is used by 389 00:22:16,520 --> 00:22:19,560 Speaker 1: the state to enact violence. And the reason that they 390 00:22:19,600 --> 00:22:23,440 Speaker 1: are distinct is that the state doesn't want chaos, right, 391 00:22:23,520 --> 00:22:26,200 Speaker 1: It wants control. It wants everything to be the same, 392 00:22:26,240 --> 00:22:31,400 Speaker 1: and predictable violence and war are kind of the opposite 393 00:22:31,400 --> 00:22:34,960 Speaker 1: of that. And so the modern state exists on some way. 394 00:22:35,119 --> 00:22:39,320 Speaker 1: Again we're talking philosophically rather than like true or whatever. 395 00:22:39,760 --> 00:22:46,760 Speaker 1: The modern state exists by balancing this calm center, right, 396 00:22:46,880 --> 00:22:52,399 Speaker 1: this non chaotic space, with a harnessed war machine. And 397 00:22:52,480 --> 00:22:56,480 Speaker 1: it's interesting because in that same way, what can undo 398 00:22:56,600 --> 00:22:59,480 Speaker 1: the state also lies there and you will see this 399 00:22:59,560 --> 00:23:02,200 Speaker 1: a lot in say, for example, most famously the Mexican Revolution, 400 00:23:02,720 --> 00:23:07,000 Speaker 1: where a lot of the more important revolutionary figures actually 401 00:23:07,040 --> 00:23:10,880 Speaker 1: came from banditry. And you know, banditree is a sort 402 00:23:10,880 --> 00:23:13,399 Speaker 1: of classic nomadic war machine. The Cossacks are sort of 403 00:23:13,400 --> 00:23:16,080 Speaker 1: a classic nomadic war machine, only in this case they're 404 00:23:16,119 --> 00:23:19,679 Speaker 1: primarily for the state, you know. And you have exceptions, 405 00:23:19,720 --> 00:23:23,120 Speaker 1: like some of the Cossacks ended up fighting in Ukraine 406 00:23:23,320 --> 00:23:27,160 Speaker 1: against all of the armies except the Black Army Maknos 407 00:23:27,200 --> 00:23:30,720 Speaker 1: Black Army, and fighting for a society of equals and 408 00:23:30,760 --> 00:23:33,879 Speaker 1: things like that, and you have like there's like roots 409 00:23:33,880 --> 00:23:36,560 Speaker 1: of democracy. You have this like violent force. The Cossacks 410 00:23:36,560 --> 00:23:39,440 Speaker 1: in this story, right, they're running around and they're colonizing 411 00:23:39,480 --> 00:23:42,520 Speaker 1: and they're killing all these people. But their atomon, their leader, 412 00:23:43,480 --> 00:23:49,320 Speaker 1: is clearly not an authoritarian leader. He is saying like, well, boys, 413 00:23:50,000 --> 00:23:52,200 Speaker 1: what do we do? How are we going to do this? 414 00:23:52,720 --> 00:23:54,120 Speaker 1: You know, and they all have to sort of give 415 00:23:54,160 --> 00:23:57,520 Speaker 1: their assent. And I am not yet an expert on 416 00:23:57,920 --> 00:24:02,840 Speaker 1: exactly how that what their decision structures were, but this 417 00:24:02,960 --> 00:24:05,080 Speaker 1: is the kind of thing that we see again and again, 418 00:24:05,760 --> 00:24:09,040 Speaker 1: most famously in a Western sensed the pirates of the 419 00:24:09,080 --> 00:24:13,440 Speaker 1: Golden Era of piracy, and I think all that stuff's 420 00:24:13,560 --> 00:24:18,640 Speaker 1: neat and I hope you did too, So thanks for listening. 421 00:24:19,080 --> 00:24:22,480 Speaker 1: See you next week with another cool Zone Media book Club, 422 00:24:22,760 --> 00:24:24,600 Speaker 1: the only book club where you don't have to do 423 00:24:24,640 --> 00:24:28,919 Speaker 1: the reading because I read it to you. Unfortunately, you 424 00:24:28,920 --> 00:24:33,080 Speaker 1: don't get to say as much about what happened because 425 00:24:33,520 --> 00:24:36,040 Speaker 1: I also do the interpretation for you. That part doesn't 426 00:24:36,040 --> 00:24:37,879 Speaker 1: seem fair. So if you want to go on Reddit, 427 00:24:38,520 --> 00:24:40,760 Speaker 1: that sentence doesn't start anything good. If you want to 428 00:24:40,760 --> 00:24:42,840 Speaker 1: go on Reddit to the subreddit, then you could talk 429 00:24:42,880 --> 00:24:45,200 Speaker 1: about the stories in the books that we talk about 430 00:24:45,200 --> 00:24:47,080 Speaker 1: on Coolzone Media book Club, and that is one way 431 00:24:47,119 --> 00:24:48,679 Speaker 1: you can talk about it. Otherwise you're stuck with my 432 00:24:48,680 --> 00:24:56,119 Speaker 1: interpretation by It Could Happen Here as a production of 433 00:24:56,160 --> 00:24:59,040 Speaker 1: cool Zone Media. For more podcasts from cool Zone Media, 434 00:24:59,160 --> 00:25:01,960 Speaker 1: visit our website coolzonmedia dot com, or check us out 435 00:25:02,000 --> 00:25:04,960 Speaker 1: on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen 436 00:25:04,960 --> 00:25:07,879 Speaker 1: to podcasts. You can find sources for It Could Happen Here, 437 00:25:07,960 --> 00:25:12,399 Speaker 1: updated monthly at Coolzonemedia dot com slash sources. Thanks for listening.