Speaker 1: I'm off my game today. No, you're not. People are
Speaker 1: going to have to start making better content. I think
Speaker 1: we're gonna be talking about this for a long time.
Speaker 1: When you program for everyone, you program for no one.
Speaker 1: I think it's a we're purpose driven platform, like we're
Speaker 1: trying to get to substance. How was that? Are you
Speaker 1: happy with that? This is marketing therapy right now? It
Speaker 1: really is. What's up? I'm Laura and I'm Alexa Kristen.
Speaker 1: Welcome back to at Landia. We have got a great
Speaker 1: guest today, Rachel Typographic, founder and CEO of mic Mac.
Speaker 1: We wanted to have women entrepreneurs who are reshaping the
Speaker 1: commerce and retail experience continue, so we asked Rachel to
Speaker 1: join us. Two of my favorite things that part of
Speaker 1: this retail blitz, I guess we'll call it going into
Speaker 1: the Holidays shopping season is one the explosion of women
Speaker 1: that are entrepreneurs, not just in shopping from a design
Speaker 1: and product standpoint, but from a software an experience standpoint.
Speaker 1: I think it's really telling that women are trying to
Speaker 1: take back the shopping experience into their own hands, whether
Speaker 1: in real life, as we talked about with Amanda in
Speaker 1: the last episode or with what Rachel's do to kind
Speaker 1: of minimize friction in the e commerce shopping experience. And too,
Speaker 1: I just loved that I learned and interview you passed
Speaker 1: me that she recently did on chatter that the original
Speaker 1: name of Mick Mac was Chak and I thought that
Speaker 1: that was great. But I'm a little and we argued
Speaker 1: about that. We don't argue much, but we we disagreed
Speaker 1: on that. Well, we do argue, but I know we
Speaker 1: save everybody. We save everybody the argument. So, some cool
Speaker 1: disruptions happening. I don't know if we would call them
Speaker 1: cool disruptions. Maybe about for them for their cool disruptions,
Speaker 1: but continued sort of turbulence in what could presumably become
Speaker 1: an e commerce platform on Snapchat, if freaking should be
Speaker 1: any commerce platform. And the fact that Snapchat didn't go
Speaker 1: hard into actually creating ways for brands to come in
Speaker 1: and sell product um automatically like ray DALs product is
Speaker 1: amazing to me. I mean, there's so many opportunities. And
Speaker 1: so today Snapchat announced that ten Cent bought a twelve
Speaker 1: percent steak in the company and now owns twelve percent
Speaker 1: of snap Um. I'm just sad about it because I
Speaker 1: feel like Snap has and had so many opportunities to
Speaker 1: diversify their content from like kind of traditional advertising, and
Speaker 1: they've gone down the more traditional advertising route with media
Speaker 1: company partners and publishers. I remember the lowest common denominator
Speaker 1: right in scale and efficiency and looking to bring people
Speaker 1: in in droves and volume and self created, but they
Speaker 1: still have drop. But Laura, don't you agree that they
Speaker 1: would still have droves of volume they just went for
Speaker 1: the lowest common denominator in format. Yeah, well, they didn't
Speaker 1: diversify the product portfolio within that low hanging fruit, and
Speaker 1: so now you're in this phase where they're obviously selling
Speaker 1: off stakes the company, but potentially missing alternative revenue streams
Speaker 1: in the process, which I think people like Rachel Typograph
Speaker 1: are trying to help them solve from a software standpoint.
Speaker 1: But yeah, it seems like it was a blind swing
Speaker 1: early out of the gate that they could have capitalized
Speaker 1: on early days when you have such a highly saturated
Speaker 1: audience of people, you know, engaging many many times over
Speaker 1: on the platform multiple times a day, especially in the millennials,
Speaker 1: you know age demographic. So I think it's a huge
Speaker 1: miss opportunity for companies that own the pipe, right like
Speaker 1: Snap owns their pipe to not have thought through solutions,
Speaker 1: like a software solution like what we're going to hear
Speaker 1: that Rachel created. And I think that they still have
Speaker 1: the opportunity to be thinking down this line. I mean,
Speaker 1: I don't see any reason why Snap couldn't become a
Speaker 1: major commerce platform or software platform for commerce. Presumably it's
Speaker 1: the inverted model, right, It's starting with content to get
Speaker 1: to conversion versus Amazon starting from conversion with the potential
Speaker 1: to build out content. And so I think what Rachel's
Speaker 1: going to talk about is where scale exists. And you know,
Speaker 1: she believes starting with performance is the way. You know,
Speaker 1: all of these brands that start getting into the e
Speaker 1: commerce space need to think about first. So with that,
Speaker 1: Rachel Typograph, another killer female entrepreneur reshaping the retail world.
Speaker 1: We'll be right back. Welcome back, everybody, We're here with
Speaker 1: Rachel Typograph, founder and CEO of mic MAC. Welcome Rachel,
Speaker 1: Hey Rachel, thanks for having me. We're doing like a
Speaker 1: little bit of like what I would say is the
Speaker 1: min A series on the future of retail. So we
Speaker 1: had Amando Latifian last week, Yeah, last week, last episode,
Speaker 1: and we're getting into our favorite season, holiday shopping season,
Speaker 1: and you and I love. We have two women that
Speaker 1: are going to be on the show, you being one
Speaker 1: of them. That is totally disrupting commerce and retail, and
Speaker 1: that just makes sense. We control all the dollars. We
Speaker 1: do control all the dollars. So tell us a little
Speaker 1: bit about micmac. Because you started as one thing, you've pivoted.
Speaker 1: Now you have a couple of products and a studio,
Speaker 1: explained mcmac. So at mcmac, we create commerce experiences for
Speaker 1: the social video generation. I truly believe that the future
Speaker 1: of commerce is going to be deeply rooted and distributed
Speaker 1: social video. When I launched the company June of two fifteen,
Speaker 1: it was the same thesis, just a different execution. So
Speaker 1: people called us QVC for the Snapchat generation. We were
Speaker 1: an iOS app. I would release fun new videos where
Speaker 1: I had comedians talking products. Everything was about impulse by,
Speaker 1: but the business model didn't make sense. The reason why
Speaker 1: the business model didn't make sense is big aha moment
Speaker 1: that I think most of the marketing and retail world
Speaker 1: have realized, which is the app boom is over. What
Speaker 1: happens with apps is you have to sink costs into
Speaker 1: customer acquisition, customer retention plus for me video production and
Speaker 1: not owning my inventory, I was making pennies on every transaction.
Speaker 1: So the model only could work at insane scale. And
Speaker 1: you see, any company like mine that tried to go
Speaker 1: mobile at first either change their business model or die.
Speaker 1: Do you have people that you consider competitors like you
Speaker 1: mean in the current business model, the old business the
Speaker 1: current business model. So was there in the old business model?
Speaker 1: I mean, in the old business model. At the end
Speaker 1: of the day, my competitor was Amazon, right, like everyone
Speaker 1: competitor is Amazon. Yeah, You're not the only one with
Speaker 1: that problem right now? Exactly? You discover things and Micmac
Speaker 1: and then I couldn't control the fact that you would
Speaker 1: find some you know, black market third party pricing on Amazon.
Speaker 1: Now that makes sense. Okay, So that was the old
Speaker 1: business model. What's the new business model? So the new
Speaker 1: business model is Listen, if I'm right, which I'm betting
Speaker 1: my entire career and being right, the future of commerce
Speaker 1: is going to be deeply routed and distributed social video.
Speaker 1: No one disagrees with me. It's why we've now worked
Speaker 1: with over three hundred brands the challenges. If everyone believes
Speaker 1: I'm right, what's preventing everyone from operating like MICMAC today?
Speaker 1: I totally agree? And why wouldn't Amazon just buy you? Bezos?
Speaker 1: Are you there? So for us, we went on this
Speaker 1: R and D quest and what I wanted to understand
Speaker 1: is if some of the biggest brands in the world
Speaker 1: were working with us or wanted to work with us,
Speaker 1: what was preventing them from operating like MCMAC today. And
Speaker 1: what I learned is that every company has the same
Speaker 1: three pain points. Pain Point number one video production. People
Speaker 1: feel like it's either too expensive, it takes too much time,
Speaker 1: or it's the opposite. They've been created all this video content.
Speaker 1: It's not driving their bottom line, and now they're like, huh,
Speaker 1: maybe we've been creating the wrong types of video content,
Speaker 1: so we need to beat the ship out of that
Speaker 1: in a few minutes, keep going. I like this pain
Speaker 1: point number two attribution. At the end of the month,
Speaker 1: everyone reports last click. As a result, it's impossible for
Speaker 1: people to answer the question of which video drove a
Speaker 1: sale and Y. And then pain point number three, my
Speaker 1: favorite one. In the year two thousand seventeen, the most
Speaker 1: progressive brands in the world still say to me that
Speaker 1: social media is still a small piece of the overall
Speaker 1: eCOM conversion and if they are seeing it, it's only
Speaker 1: coming from paid And what's that's about is the friction
Speaker 1: that exists today between engaging with social content and that
Speaker 1: end checkout experience. So when every brand is saying the
Speaker 1: same thing to me, I'm like, all right, it's clear
Speaker 1: I need to go build software to solve those problems.
Speaker 1: So today you come to micmac to license our software
Speaker 1: to solve those problems. I'll talk about our main product,
Speaker 1: which is called mcmacattached. It's a commerce layer for vertical
Speaker 1: video content experiences. As a result, the primary use case
Speaker 1: is an environments like Instagram, Stories and Snap but it's
Speaker 1: a web application, so it actually can live anywhere that
Speaker 1: you put a U R out. So can you, like,
Speaker 1: just if we're going to break it down into layman terms,
Speaker 1: because sometimes my grandmother listens to the show, can you
Speaker 1: walk us through what that looks like from the consumer
Speaker 1: standpoint before you kind of dig into the software needs
Speaker 1: and why this is a tremendous white space for you
Speaker 1: from a software standpoint totally. So let's take my client
Speaker 1: at bows you are following Bows on Instagram. You are
Speaker 1: looking at their Instagram story and there's a call to
Speaker 1: action to swipe up. You swipe up. You're brought into mcmacattached.
Speaker 1: Here you can watch endless product videos. You can hit
Speaker 1: more info see more product information. So that's product name,
Speaker 1: price description, photography fee. You hit add to cart and boom,
Speaker 1: that item goes directly into Bose's cart. Now, the reason
Speaker 1: why we brought this product to market is that when
Speaker 1: environments like Instagram, Stories and Snap came out, partners were
Speaker 1: just linking to their regular old product pages. They were
Speaker 1: experiencing bounce rate. Why you're going from these highly engaging
Speaker 1: vertical video content experiences to your boring static more often
Speaker 1: than not not optimized for mobile product landing page. Let's
Speaker 1: just throw a mic drop right in there, so listen,
Speaker 1: in this ecosystem, there's obviously a lot of people that
Speaker 1: are in this space. Every other company and thought leader
Speaker 1: in this space has been focusing on what I call
Speaker 1: the pre click pre swipe. So how do we optimize
Speaker 1: everything that's happening and feed from content, from targeting, from
Speaker 1: ad buying. All that's freaking meaningless if the other side
Speaker 1: is broken totally. Yeah, I'm focusing on the other side,
Speaker 1: and no one else really knows how to connect it.
Speaker 1: What are some of the numbers you're seeing early days?
Speaker 1: By minimizing the layers deep, I need to go from
Speaker 1: that initial experience. Yep. So we've completely inverted the bounce right,
Speaker 1: so most people experience bounce rate with mic maciel experience
Speaker 1: ten wo Right, So let's pivots to the content space
Speaker 1: because I think you had some great points around why
Speaker 1: these dots need to be connected. So my business is
Speaker 1: two parts. One is software service what we were just
Speaker 1: talking about, and then the other part is creative services,
Speaker 1: which we call micmac Studios. All of my software clients
Speaker 1: touch micmac Studios in at least one way, which is
Speaker 1: optimizing their own creative because if you give me ship creative,
Speaker 1: you will get ship results. My software can't fix ship creative,
Speaker 1: so we need to fix it before hello Hello. I
Speaker 1: just want everyone to hear that my software can't fix
Speaker 1: ship creative, so we have to fix it before it
Speaker 1: goes into my software, so that will always happen, and
Speaker 1: we build that into sort of our offering of my
Speaker 1: clients use us for original creative. Why we've created thousands
Speaker 1: of product videos. We've flighted millions of video views against them.
Speaker 1: I can tell you what causes someone to hit by
Speaker 1: within nearly every consumer package good stuff category. Can you
Speaker 1: give us an example? Sure? So? Uh. One of my
Speaker 1: brand partners is Dr Brands can Care, family owned can
Speaker 1: Care company in Miami, doing very well and revenue. Also
Speaker 1: available at Sephar and Alta. They have a product called Magnetite.
Speaker 1: It's perfect for the world that we live in. So
Speaker 1: it looks like a mud mask. The piece of creative
Speaker 1: has two girls. They're each putting the mask on each
Speaker 1: other and they're literally doing it for the first time.
Speaker 1: So the reactions are completely genuine. And if you ever
Speaker 1: put this mask on your face, starts to tingle immediately,
Speaker 1: and you have to keep it on your face for
Speaker 1: five minutes and then you remove it with a magnet
Speaker 1: and you watch it come off. So you see the
Speaker 1: entire transformation from beginning to end. And we did it
Speaker 1: in five second video clip, ten second, thirty seconds, just
Speaker 1: like different variations, and we have the genuine reactions. I
Speaker 1: wish you guys would have done that in the studio today.
Speaker 1: We could have done Instagram. I need good skincare dr
Speaker 1: brand skin care. So there's a formula, and we know
Speaker 1: exactly what needs to happen within the first quartile, second quartile,
Speaker 1: third and fourth and we do it over and over
Speaker 1: and over again. It's why I quit my job at
Speaker 1: Gap and fell in love with the infomercial industry. There's
Speaker 1: a freaking formula. There are a few people who really
Speaker 1: understand that content truly is the sticky to brand product
Speaker 1: or purchase, except Jeff Bezos right early on totally understood.
Speaker 1: Now I still hear marketers saying, we have to do
Speaker 1: great content. We have to do great content, but there
Speaker 1: is no connection between that content and the bottom line.
Speaker 1: Why when you talk to a marketer, what is the disconnect?
Speaker 1: Why is that equation still so hard to create and
Speaker 1: to also kind of like operationalize in a marketing team.
Speaker 1: So when I was at Gap, the marketing leadership team
Speaker 1: like never cared about direct response creative. They didn't even
Speaker 1: see it, but that was what was driving the bottom line.
Speaker 1: You want to know, it's completely changed that the mobile phone.
Speaker 1: So if you just think about Facebook feed, Facebook is
Speaker 1: now said to the world, Hey, the future of brand
Speaker 1: marketing is direct response marketing. You will see a bud
Speaker 1: Light Super Bowl spot next to Electric Razor for fifty
Speaker 1: off video in the same feed. So, d your marketing
Speaker 1: now is brand marketing before a CMO it Can you
Speaker 1: go back repeat that? So the mobile feed has collapsed
Speaker 1: the marketing funnel because you will have a I'm pumping.
Speaker 1: I'm like, I'm looking at Rachel right now and literally
Speaker 1: pumping my fist. Yeah, if everyone would open up their
Speaker 1: Facebook app right now, you would see a beautiful piece
Speaker 1: of creative produced by Widen and Kennedy, your Droga five
Speaker 1: and it's gorgeous, don't get me wrong, next to a
Speaker 1: really shitty Razor ad or Mattress Company ad yep. Fifteen
Speaker 1: years ago. That would have never happened in media. The
Speaker 1: Drug of five creative would be in premium television or
Speaker 1: an aspirational magazine, and that Mattress would be in the
Speaker 1: back of the village voice. Right, it's all in one
Speaker 1: place now, no one gives a fuck, and cmos have
Speaker 1: to start not giving a fuck, and well they actually
Speaker 1: have to give a fucking fight harder and understand. Not
Speaker 1: only has the funnel collapsed, it's gotten narrower. Right, So
Speaker 1: the path from one place to the next is so
Speaker 1: much faster, and what you've done is accelerated it even
Speaker 1: more so, Can I ask a question reach on the
Speaker 1: super fascinating because you know there's still this fork in
Speaker 1: the road in terms of brands who are still very
Speaker 1: focused on brand building and then others that are obviously
Speaker 1: gone the way of performance markets and depending on what
Speaker 1: category and you're which probably leans more towards the ladder.
Speaker 1: But are there brands who are talking you saying, since
Speaker 1: this whole funnel has collapsed, what attributes are best practices
Speaker 1: can we take from those product videos? Presumably things that
Speaker 1: get people to click faster, knowing attention spans are shrinking
Speaker 1: and feeds are moving faster, and all those sorts of things,
Speaker 1: so that we can, in the first three seconds of
Speaker 1: a brand video, for example, start to drop more explicit
Speaker 1: direct hits on what that messaging. Maybe maybe I'm not
Speaker 1: necessarily selling a product, but a director response or behavior
Speaker 1: we want to elicit based on some of the best
Speaker 1: practices you've learned from e commerce. Does that make sense? Yeah? Totally. Listen.
Speaker 1: When you work with Micmac as a software client, our
Speaker 1: first kickoff call, I'm like, I'm giving keeps to the
Speaker 1: castle like literally, you can go fire your creative agency
Speaker 1: now because I'm telling you exactly what you should be doing,
Speaker 1: and it's highly applicable. And I'll say it here like
Speaker 1: here is free knowledge. Go tell me if I'm wrong.
Speaker 1: I encourage you to go produce videos this way and
Speaker 1: tell me if I'm wrong. So first and foremost, and
Speaker 1: it's again the reason why I quit my job at GAP.
Speaker 1: It's what psychologists call a para social relationship. When you
Speaker 1: have a host like flow from Progressive, you begin to
Speaker 1: build an emotional connection with that person through repetition, and
Speaker 1: psychologists call it a pair of social relationship because you
Speaker 1: the viewer, believe that I the host of your friend,
Speaker 1: and when you buy from me, you get the same
Speaker 1: emotional benefit as friendship. So put a freaking human in
Speaker 1: your video and do it often through repetition, and you
Speaker 1: will begin to build that brand friendship relationship with the viewer.
Speaker 1: That's one two In the first three seconds, put the
Speaker 1: product in full view. You wouldn't believe how many creative
Speaker 1: assets come across micmac where it takes seven to fifteen
Speaker 1: seconds to see the product. We live in a world
Speaker 1: where most people don't even watch the first three seconds
Speaker 1: of a video, right. And then lastly, color and optimism.
Speaker 1: If you put black and white creative out and do
Speaker 1: an A B test against color creative, I promise you
Speaker 1: color creative is going to perform better. That's really interesting.
Speaker 1: I mean those three simple things, those three simple things.
Speaker 1: So you said something that I wrote down earlier that
Speaker 1: I wanted to ask you because I'm obsessed Mic mac
Speaker 1: in audio because when you talk about what what did
Speaker 1: you call it? Par I mean, this is the definition
Speaker 1: of it. It is in you heard you do the commercials. Yeah,
Speaker 1: you're the para social relationship. Why aren't we doing this
Speaker 1: with you? I know, listen, we're talking to my My
Speaker 1: biggest investor is and you know this is Gary Bannerchuk.
Speaker 1: Oh well he's going hard into audio hard Why because
Speaker 1: right now, and I'm not saying what you guys do
Speaker 1: is easy, but there's very little competition. Right. So, investing
Speaker 1: in audio right now, you're getting in on the ground
Speaker 1: floor and you're going to get someone to listen for
Speaker 1: forty minutes because the average US commune is forty minutes,
Speaker 1: and you're going to build such a deep emotional connection
Speaker 1: with your audience. You already doing it. Are you doing it.
Speaker 1: We're all doing it, so I mean I should advertise
Speaker 1: on this show. But but I'm talking about Mac, so
Speaker 1: micmac attached should be an audio I know. So. In fact,
Speaker 1: we were just on a panel with a guy who
Speaker 1: has a you need to look this up, who has
Speaker 1: a company called Instraumatic. I mean he's basically doing clickable
Speaker 1: audio ads. Yes, Mac, Micmac should be going hard. He's
Speaker 1: a cool guy. Stass. I'm sorry, but I just found
Speaker 1: your competition. But that's where you should. I mean, like,
Speaker 1: because no one's actually figured out how to take the
Speaker 1: forget let's just call it live reads right now, just
Speaker 1: live reads, because there's a lot of cool creative spaces
Speaker 1: that we can do with host reads, and lots of
Speaker 1: cool content and audio. But the fact that there is
Speaker 1: no clickable and you people are listening on their mobile
Speaker 1: phone for the most part until we get like everyone
Speaker 1: listening in their car without their phone. But I'd also
Speaker 1: love to know in this in the same sort of
Speaker 1: behavior you're figuring out from visual cues right you talked,
Speaker 1: what are the audio right exactly? What are sort of
Speaker 1: those key triggers or pneumonics or phrases or you know,
Speaker 1: there are certain things that Alex and I are are
Speaker 1: building equity and around things that we'll do in a
Speaker 1: few minutes, like our favorite Killed by d I Y.
Speaker 1: Where when people start identifying with those things, what would
Speaker 1: you call ax audio identity or language identity that people
Speaker 1: you know have synonymous with the show. So yeah, it's
Speaker 1: super interesting. Wait can we build this with you? I
Speaker 1: want to build BECA. We tested our show. We pilot
Speaker 1: the Dead series. We're going to pilot this because I
Speaker 1: also would love to know because well, Apple podcasts only
Speaker 1: gives do you know this like virtual purchases. Well no, no, no,
Speaker 1: but they only give podcast networks and podcast hosts. You
Speaker 1: only know certain amount of information. They hold back all
Speaker 1: the data. Now they're going to be releasing more data
Speaker 1: this fall, but it's still like not not what you need.
Speaker 1: If you had your software in this space, we could
Speaker 1: start looking at not just download times and understanding like
Speaker 1: day parts. We could start actually dissecting content and understanding
Speaker 1: audiences in a totally different way in the actual content,
Speaker 1: not just the ad content well husiastic writing. I'm bringing
Speaker 1: up we launched a new product today in data with
Speaker 1: one of our clients that would be right for you
Speaker 1: guys in this next So while we keep talking, I'll
Speaker 1: pull it up. So, Yeah, the one thing, and I
Speaker 1: think it's really important because Alex and I have been
Speaker 1: on a crusade to basically, you know, kind of make
Speaker 1: sure this industry does not bastardize um audio in the
Speaker 1: same way we have digital in terms of display banner
Speaker 1: with host reads and sort of prerecorded reads and kind
Speaker 1: of explaining that the contextual nature, as you alluded to,
Speaker 1: you know earlier, Reachil we're building equity, right, we're building relationships,
Speaker 1: is very intimate in your ears environment, and for us,
Speaker 1: we are adamant that preserving the integrity of that creative
Speaker 1: and that context is more important than stuffing it with
Speaker 1: prerecorded ads that become the sort of automated algorithm UM
Speaker 1: that we've kind of you know, fallen behold into within digital.
Speaker 1: So if we're able to prove that out, um, it's
Speaker 1: something I would totally be interested in doing. So we
Speaker 1: created this product called attach rate. You'll swipe up, you'll
Speaker 1: be brought into this new layer. You can see endless
Speaker 1: amount of product videos, but there's this little rotund of
Speaker 1: call to actions. So right now I'm watching a skincare
Speaker 1: video and there's a call to action that says I
Speaker 1: try this, I can indicate between one or five stars.
Speaker 1: If I would boom five stars, next one on her
Speaker 1: skin is goals two stars. All of a sudden, a
Speaker 1: brand is collecting all this first party data around people's
Speaker 1: emotional reactions, just like it's a little mobile game if
Speaker 1: you're highly engaged. You just saw before I served an
Speaker 1: email capture unit where you can unlock a deal. Or
Speaker 1: while all this is happening, I'm generating new audiences. So
Speaker 1: if someone said I try this, they go into a
Speaker 1: cookie pool that we provide to our audience to go retarget.
Speaker 1: So that's just one of the SIXT can break down
Speaker 1: content so that exactly so people are listening and I
Speaker 1: was talking about, you know DRS new brand marketing, we
Speaker 1: can be collecting all that first party data for you.
Speaker 1: I love that. Or we can also say do you
Speaker 1: have a question for Alexa and Laura or Ray each
Speaker 1: all around Why d R is right, Why DR is
Speaker 1: coming back for me? Interactivity is the new form of
Speaker 1: creativity with all of the short form. I actually think
Speaker 1: that d R in this capacity that you're showing us
Speaker 1: and talking about is actually going to upend and gut marketing.
Speaker 1: If you look at any early stage startup or any
Speaker 1: of the darling companies that everyone talks about, their first
Speaker 1: marketing higher is a performance marketer. And the powers that be,
Speaker 1: the four companies that control the internet slash the world,
Speaker 1: also don't want us to be able to do that
Speaker 1: because this is how they profit. That's right. Like the
Speaker 1: biggest I don't know if you guys have talked about
Speaker 1: this on the show or how deep you get into
Speaker 1: at tech, but the scariest thing right now that's happening
Speaker 1: in attack that very few people are talking about is
Speaker 1: the fact that Apple is going to be preventing third
Speaker 1: party cookies within Safari. The entire attack industry is based
Speaker 1: on the ability to cookie people, right, That's right. So
Speaker 1: if we have not talked about that, but they take
Speaker 1: that away, billions of dollars of companies are at stake
Speaker 1: and we're all going to probably have to be paying
Speaker 1: Apple to do that. Well, that's the whole point, and
Speaker 1: that that's what I'm talking about. But I think they're
Speaker 1: going that way with content. I think they're going that
Speaker 1: way with a right content like visual content, audio, all
Speaker 1: of that they're starting to pull they're starting to pull back.
Speaker 1: So what does that mean. I think we gotta go
Speaker 1: build our own pipes. Yeah, I mean I listened to
Speaker 1: I listened to your Bendet's episode, and that's what he said,
Speaker 1: right in terms of d I Y, He's like, I
Speaker 1: want to build my own pipes. Yeah, you have to. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I agree. Curious to know the Rachel typograph Nick mac
Speaker 1: prediction for what we'll be seeing in terms of e
Speaker 1: commerce holiday shopping this year. Yeah. I think that a
Speaker 1: lot of marketers have done a good amount of experimentation
Speaker 1: across the different social platforms and that they're going to
Speaker 1: say during the holiday season, we can't take a risk
Speaker 1: with our media, and they're going to go all in
Speaker 1: on Facebook and Instagram, and the CPMs are gonna be
Speaker 1: as high as they've ever been before. I think that's
Speaker 1: going to be really interesting because that's where you are
Speaker 1: going to see conversion. That's what people care about in
Speaker 1: the holiday season. But because everyone's going to go all in,
Speaker 1: the prices are going to be insane. So I would say,
Speaker 1: by Facebook stuff now, because it's about to shoot shoot
Speaker 1: like crazy, and you saw what happened yesterday with Snap.
Speaker 1: I mean it's very just but twelve percent of them
Speaker 1: because it's cheap. That's the other really interesting thing that
Speaker 1: I have found actually is that because people are so
Speaker 1: highly accountable for driving results and cute four, there's not
Speaker 1: a large appetite for experimentation. So I actually don't feel
Speaker 1: like people are going to be really inventive. I think
Speaker 1: they'll be inventive with experiential marketing, but not in digital marketing.
Speaker 1: And what are your thoughts in terms of DTC, you know,
Speaker 1: online specific companies and how they're strategizing against some of
Speaker 1: the big box retailers, which obviously come with multiple commas
Speaker 1: and zeros during the holiday season in terms of does
Speaker 1: that really matter anymore or do you see that volume
Speaker 1: still by and large drives the bulk of conversion as
Speaker 1: opposed to a smart content strategy for example, It's a
Speaker 1: good question. Yeah, I think UM, the big box players,
Speaker 1: the strategy is scale. It's encouraging people to increase increase
Speaker 1: that average order value UM by offering them deals to
Speaker 1: increase basket size and offer free shipping or click and collect.
Speaker 1: I think with direct to consumer because they're competing for
Speaker 1: the same attention, what they need to do and what
Speaker 1: we continue to see people to do is that they
Speaker 1: have to band together. So I think you're going to
Speaker 1: see a lot of collaborations interesting where people then actually
Speaker 1: are like putting. So I'm not saying I know this,
Speaker 1: but let's just say direct to consumer and a has
Speaker 1: a pixel, they have a like minded brand and maybe
Speaker 1: a different category and sluggage and fitness, right, they exchange pixels.
Speaker 1: They go and retarget each other's audiences. They do a
Speaker 1: product collaboration, They do sweepstakes. Like if you're doing anywhere
Speaker 1: between one and fifty million dollars in revenue, go find
Speaker 1: other companies that are doing one to fifty million dollars
Speaker 1: in revenue with a like minded audience, create a product
Speaker 1: bundle and go remarke it to them together. No, I ah, Rachel,
Speaker 1: so good? All right, so we're here. Kill by d
Speaker 1: I y. It can be in the retail space, but
Speaker 1: it doesn't have to be. Yeah, what would you kill?
Speaker 1: What would you buy? What would you do yourself? I
Speaker 1: would kill the industry standard of last click attribution, Yes,
Speaker 1: And I would buy the universal shopping cart? And I
Speaker 1: would what does that look like? What's universal shopping cart?
Speaker 1: I'm mean right now, if I would buy Apple pay
Speaker 1: or I would buy PayPal, or I buy Shopify, or
Speaker 1: I buy Amazon exactly and d I y, I would
Speaker 1: launch my own skin CareLine. Oh, I don't know what's
Speaker 1: the first product. I see you with Glossier as some
Speaker 1: kind of like board member or something. The reason why
Speaker 1: I say that is that everything that we've done at
Speaker 1: mic mac, I know the exact type of product that
Speaker 1: sells in this format, and I can absolutely launch a
Speaker 1: direct to consumer social video consumer product brand knowing what
Speaker 1: me know, what's your first product? Uh, it'll probably be
Speaker 1: a product that removes oil from your skin and trying
Speaker 1: to come up with a clever name for it. But
Speaker 1: we already have one. Um Rachel typograph amazing conversation. Where
Speaker 1: can people reach you for these free audio pilots that
Speaker 1: we're gonna be doing. My email is Rachel at micmac,
Speaker 1: dot tv, AM k M A k M I k
Speaker 1: M A k dot TV and one plug. If you
Speaker 1: have the opportunity to go here, Rachel speak Yes, brilliant, brilliant,
Speaker 1: Thanks Rachel, Rachel, I'll have a good thank you thanks.
Speaker 1: Episode twenty in the books. It's in the books. I'm
Speaker 1: getting really excited for the holidays. I've got to think
Speaker 1: about what I want to buy you. Now it's your
Speaker 1: birthday and it's my birthday. First of all, I suck
Speaker 1: at buying presents, and I have been doing over what
Speaker 1: to get you for like weeks, and I get to
Speaker 1: a point where I just get annoyed and I'm like,
Speaker 1: I should just ask her, So what do you want?
Speaker 1: What do you want for your birthday? I think I'll
Speaker 1: make you a pinterest sport. My birthday is November thirty,
Speaker 1: so we have a little bit of fun. It's too
Speaker 1: much effort. I'm also thinking about doing a fundraiser for
Speaker 1: my birthday. This is a new thing I've been seeing
Speaker 1: people do on Facebook where they're donating to a cause
Speaker 1: for their birthday. So I'm thinking about starting something like that.
Speaker 1: So maybe it's something we can share with Atlandia. Okay,
Speaker 1: I love that idea. UM. So on that note, Laura's
Speaker 1: birthdays coming up at Landia, which are a happy birthday?
Speaker 1: What is it? Um? Thank you Cameron Drew's we Love You,
Speaker 1: Cameron Drew's we Love You Cameron not turk, Andy Bowers,
Speaker 1: all of our friends and family epanically and Atlantia keep
Speaker 1: talking to us. We're getting awesome. Emails, lots of great tweets. Yes,
Speaker 1: we love the emails. We've been getting awesome ones from
Speaker 1: a lot of college graduates, people looking for their first
Speaker 1: job or their next job. Keep hollering at us at
Speaker 1: Landia Podcast at gmail, or you can find us on
Speaker 1: Twitter out Atlantia Podcast. We're totally opening to connecting the
Speaker 1: dots for our listeners. Thanks for following, and we'll be
Speaker 1: back in two weeks. M Full disclosure, our opinions, our
Speaker 1: own