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Speaker 1: Hey, welcome in.

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Speaker 2: I'm Doug Golly.

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Speaker 1: This is All Ball.

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Speaker 3: We'll take a step aside for the next three All

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Speaker 3: Ball podcast.

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Speaker 2: We're going to drop.

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Speaker 4: These in kind of consecutive days, give a little bit

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Speaker 4: of gap in between. But I just think it's a

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Speaker 4: personal story that is so good, and so many of

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Speaker 4: you are like man, when I'm driving, I'm recruiting, when

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Speaker 4: I'm driving to a high school game, wherever I am,

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Speaker 4: I love to listen to stories.

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Speaker 1: Beach told. Well, I'll have a dear friend. His name

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Speaker 1: is Josh Lucas.

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Speaker 4: Josh was the director of player personnel for the Chicago Bears.

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Speaker 4: How he got there after being a student athlete at Harvard,

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Speaker 4: but the mercurial path that took to getting there, and

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Speaker 4: the time he took and why he stepped aside at

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Speaker 4: times from his job. This is a story that has

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Speaker 4: not been publicly told. Josh is a rising star in

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Speaker 4: the media. He still is a very very well respected

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Speaker 4: player personnel potential GM in the future.

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Speaker 1: Here's his story.

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Speaker 3: The thing I love about my job is when I

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Speaker 3: was a kid, my dad was an old basketball coach. Right.

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Speaker 3: I always felt like my dad was an old basketball coach,

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Speaker 3: even when I wasn't old like they've been doing it

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Speaker 3: since he got out of college.

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Speaker 2: He was a high school coach and then became a

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Speaker 2: college coach.

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Speaker 3: And there's a lot of reasons I put together this

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Speaker 3: pod the way I do. I mean, really, I was

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Speaker 3: I was driving one night between Murphysboro, Tennessee and Bowling Green, Kentucky,

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Speaker 3: and it was pouring rain and actually there was a

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Speaker 3: I didn't know this at the time until like midway

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Speaker 3: through the drive that I was driving through like an

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Speaker 3: active tornado area, and I was listening to Sirius XM

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Speaker 3: and to the Howard to Howard Stern interview Megan Trainer,

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Speaker 3: and Megan told the story of how she kind of

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Speaker 3: made it her breakthrough, which was he went into La

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Speaker 3: Reid's office and she had written songs for lots of people,

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Speaker 3: and she had this I'm Gonna love you like I'm.

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Speaker 2: Gonna lose you, and.

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Speaker 3: She only had I think, like one verse that she

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Speaker 3: could sing and play on a ukulele. You know. Again,

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Speaker 3: like the details is a little fuzzy now because it

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Speaker 3: was actually it's like an amazing interview. He let her

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Speaker 3: just kind of talk her way through it. But she

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Speaker 3: talked about how she was there the whole day, and

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Speaker 3: he wanted her to play the whole song, and anyway,

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Speaker 3: she ended up figuring out how to play the whole

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Speaker 3: and thought it was, you know, for somebody else.

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Speaker 2: He's like, no, I want you to record that.

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Speaker 3: But it was a storytelling element of it that I

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Speaker 3: just I remember, I'm driving through this incredibly shitty.

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Speaker 2: Weather, and I'm like the power of audio.

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Speaker 3: And I've said this on radio before, is when you

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Speaker 3: get a really really good story, where you get a

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Speaker 3: really really good conversation, you don't want to turn off.

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Speaker 3: The greatest compliment you can give to a radio host

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Speaker 3: is I pulled into my driveway and I could not

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Speaker 3: get out of the car until you were done. The

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Speaker 3: second greatest one, or maybe the one B is I

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Speaker 3: listened through a commercial break because I wanted to hear

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Speaker 3: how the conversation ended or something like that. Then I

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Speaker 3: factor in. When I was a kid, my dad would

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Speaker 3: take me to the final four. We go up to

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Speaker 3: the Nike and in the Nike suite that would be

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Speaker 3: Jim Balbano and Dick by tal and Digger Phelps and

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Speaker 3: John Thompson would be there. All these kind of famous

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Speaker 3: old time coaches or my dad was great friends with

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Speaker 3: Dale Brown.

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Speaker 2: And the thing about all those coaches were they're.

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Speaker 3: Amazing storytellers, you know, amazing storytellers, And so I thought,

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Speaker 3: why not have a pod about storytelling and basketball?

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Speaker 2: Tell people the story their best.

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Speaker 3: And there have been times in which we veered off

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Speaker 3: of that, lots of really really good ones. And so

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Speaker 3: now with the holiday season, a couple of my friends

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Speaker 3: who I think have amazing stories, I'm offered up to

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Speaker 3: join me. One of those is a guy, and again,

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Speaker 3: this is kind of part of what makes my job cool.

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Speaker 3: Then it was Josh Lucas. So here's kind of the backstory.

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Speaker 3: I came to work at Fox in twenty seventeen. And

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Speaker 3: truth being told, when I came to work at Fox,

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Speaker 3: I had still had time on my CBS contract left.

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Speaker 3: But I don't know, I don't know if I at

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Speaker 3: the time fit what they were looking for with just

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Speaker 3: with one certain element of it, and so I didn't

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Speaker 3: really we didn't negotiate. We just said, hey, like, can

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Speaker 3: we get out of the deal. Because a bunch of

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Speaker 3: my friends had left to go to Fox. I like CBS.

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Speaker 3: I learned a lot of CBS. I thought there's really

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Speaker 3: good people on CBS. I had a lot of trepidation

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Speaker 3: when I took the job leaving ESPN, because like CBS,

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Speaker 3: I loved ESPN. It was awesome, so there was no

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Speaker 3: negatives who I left CBS, but I went to Fox.

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Speaker 2: And when I went there, the gentleman who.

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Speaker 3: Was running the daytime TV element of it had promised

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Speaker 3: me like, hey, take your deal with the radio and

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Speaker 3: we're going to find a TV show for it. And

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Speaker 3: then of course I do like college basketball games. So

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Speaker 3: three months into that, I was actually overseas as coaching

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Speaker 3: in Israel and I got to call it.

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Speaker 2: He'd been fired.

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Speaker 3: He's a good friend of mine, and it sucked because

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Speaker 3: you learn that in business a lot of it's who

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Speaker 3: you're connected. So Fox, I don't know, trying to do

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Speaker 3: be a solid or I don't know, maybe they were

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Speaker 3: looking for new talent to do different things. But I

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Speaker 3: got to do sideline for one NFL game on Fox,

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Speaker 3: and by the way, it's should be pointing out, they.

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Speaker 2: Did a thorough review of it.

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Speaker 3: I actually had John Madden's old producer did a review

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Speaker 3: and it was a sterling review. He called me afterwards

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Speaker 3: and I never forget driving on the four to five

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Speaker 3: stuck in trap and he was like, do you want

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Speaker 3: to do this for the next twenty years. I was

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Speaker 3: like yes, He's like, well, you're really good at it, Like, well,

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Speaker 3: it's fun. I never did it, by the way, I

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Speaker 3: think I pissed the Dolphins off, and we'll talk about

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Speaker 3: what I mistakenly did or I didn't mistakenly did it.

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Speaker 3: I did it, but they knew it was a bad

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Speaker 3: thing at the time. So to do an NFL game,

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Speaker 3: the games on Sunday, it was Broncos versus the Bears.

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Speaker 2: This is back when the Bears were really good.

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Speaker 3: They had great defense, they traded for Khalil Mack, and

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Speaker 3: the Dolphins had to kind of spot start brock Osweiler.

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Speaker 2: I think the Prayers.

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Speaker 3: Were undefeated at the time too, I'm not mistaken. And

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Speaker 3: it was like mid season. So you go to practice

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Speaker 3: at the facility and you meet with all the coaches.

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Speaker 2: You spend the entire day there, and then.

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Speaker 3: You go back to the hotel and I think it

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Speaker 3: might have been on a Saturday, when, like Saturday, there

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Speaker 3: is nothing going on. You're literally getting paid hang out

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Speaker 3: in Miami at the beach or at the hotel. You

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Speaker 3: have a production meeting which is interminable, but it's like

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Speaker 3: in the afternoon. So to watch college football, I go

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Speaker 3: downstairs and I'm not sitting at the hotel bar, and

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Speaker 3: a guy settles up next to me, and he knows

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Speaker 3: a lot about.

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Speaker 2: Football, like a crazy amount about football. The names Josh Lucas.

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Speaker 2: He joins me.

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Speaker 3: Now, he was director of player personnel for the Chicago

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Speaker 3: Bears at the time, and I didn't actually know that

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Speaker 3: until probably an hour into our conversation when we're just

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Speaker 3: watching and you know, like anybody looking at the screen

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Speaker 3: and commenting. And we've been kind of friends ever since.

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Speaker 3: So Josh joins me now on the All Ball Pod, Josh,

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Speaker 3: how are you.

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Speaker 5: I'm doing well. Thank you for having me.

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Speaker 2: So I want to get to that point from that

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Speaker 2: point forward in a second.

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Speaker 5: But you grew up where North Canton, Ohio.

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Speaker 6: I mean, you can't get more football nope, Ohio right,

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Speaker 6: Like it's just impossible to get paint the picture of

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Speaker 6: what it's like to grew up in North.

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Speaker 7: Camp about what you think, you know, obviously with the

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Speaker 7: Hall of Fame the center of Canton, Ohio, you know,

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Speaker 7: and I grew up in a house with with with

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Speaker 7: all boys. So sports for everything, and obviously football was

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Speaker 7: kind of the the lifeblood of the state still is

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Speaker 7: and so you know, with with my dad and my brothers,

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Speaker 7: it was very similar to when I met you that Saturday,

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Speaker 7: you know, watching all those games. You know, I went

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Speaker 7: down to watch the Ohio State game. That's why I

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Speaker 7: went down to that bar uh in that Saturday afternoon.

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Speaker 5: And uh so, you know we're that That's what That's

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Speaker 5: what it's all about, you know, trying to play as

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Speaker 5: a kid.

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Speaker 7: And then obviously you know, majority of the people are

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Speaker 7: high to State fans, and you know, that's how I

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Speaker 7: was born and raised and just you know, football has

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Speaker 7: been part of my life, you know, as long as

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Speaker 7: I can. You know, you know, think back to my

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Speaker 7: earliest memories.

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Speaker 3: You you went to Harvard to play football, although right,

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Speaker 3: not not the Harvard of the Big Ten.

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Speaker 2: You went to actual Harvard.

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Speaker 3: So let's let's just start with like again outside looking in,

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Speaker 3: academics must have been a huge part of your life

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Speaker 3: as well. What was what was like, give me give

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Speaker 3: me the what was it like growing up in terms

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Speaker 3: of the balance of football, How your parents were with academics,

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Speaker 3: what pushed you to be such not only an impressive student,

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Speaker 3: but impressive athlete as well.

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Speaker 7: Yeah, it's actually you know, it's not a it's not

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Speaker 7: the prettiest, you know, decorative story as far as you know,

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Speaker 7: my passion is exceed in school. You know, I grew

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Speaker 7: up in a you know what what America calls a

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Speaker 7: dysfunctional home. It was just my dad and two half

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Speaker 7: brothers and my real brother. And you know, I to

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Speaker 7: get into my story, you know, there was a lot

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Speaker 7: of trauma. There was there was a lot of chaos

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Speaker 7: in my house. And for me, academics and athletics became

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Speaker 7: my outlet, became my perfectionism. That's kind of how I

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Speaker 7: escaped not feeling so well at home, how I escaped

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Speaker 7: being scared all the time, and that kind of doing

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Speaker 7: well in sports and doing well and school kind of

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Speaker 7: became my identity. And that's what I kind of hid behind.

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Speaker 7: And fortunately I was able to come. I was just

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Speaker 7: good enough in football and I was just good enough

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Speaker 7: as a student to combine that into you know, being

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Speaker 7: able to be recruited by those Ivy League schools. But

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Speaker 7: you know, to be honest with you, like, the what

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Speaker 7: I know now is a major you know, anxiety disorder

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Speaker 7: was very prevalent at a young age for me, and

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Speaker 7: I never knew that there was anything wrong. I just

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Speaker 7: felt that that's how most people must feel, and that

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Speaker 7: anxiety really began to take a toll on me physically

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Speaker 7: and mentally. You know, well before I ever stepped foot

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Speaker 7: on the campus at Harvard, and the way I coped

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Speaker 7: with everything was this identity that I was this great student,

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Speaker 7: I was this great athlete, and that's kind of what

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Speaker 7: shaped me and got me to the position, you know,

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Speaker 7: just to get recruited and to be able to go

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Speaker 7: to a school like Harvard and.

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Speaker 5: Attempt to play football. But you know, I've told you

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Speaker 5: just before I was I didn't feel right when I

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Speaker 5: got there, mentally and physically.

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Speaker 7: I ended up having several shoulder surgeries my first few

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Speaker 7: years I was there. Never really got the full college

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Speaker 7: experience of being a college athlete.

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Speaker 5: Okay, So that that's how I got there.

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Speaker 3: I mean, you can share as much as you want

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Speaker 3: to share, but I like, when you you throw some

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Speaker 3: chum out there in the water, get they're going like, wait,

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Speaker 3: hold on, where was your mom in this escuession?

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Speaker 5: Yeah?

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Speaker 7: So my parents were divorced when I was two years

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Speaker 7: old and my dad took off all four kids, you know,

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Speaker 7: to to two of my mom's kids from her her

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Speaker 7: first marriage, and then my you know, my full brother

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Speaker 7: and myself, and she was basically out of the picture.

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Speaker 7: You know, my dad raised us, working the night shift

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Speaker 7: at the phone company, coaching all of our sports. The

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Speaker 7: most selfless human being that that there is.

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Speaker 2: To get custody of her kids.

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Speaker 5: That's a great question. You know, I think when I

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Speaker 5: was two, they.

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Speaker 7: Were divorced, and I think she was just pretty much

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Speaker 7: unfit to raise kids, and you know, had some instability

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Speaker 7: in her life obviously. You know, I don't know too

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Speaker 7: many of the details of why he ended up taking

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Speaker 7: off four, but you can imagine, you know, my oldest

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Speaker 7: two half brothers, you know, they didn't have their biological

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Speaker 7: dad or their or their mom around, and there was

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Speaker 7: there was a lot of there's a lot of stuff

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Speaker 7: going on in my house. You know, my dad wasn't there,

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Speaker 7: and you know, it was it was a pretty chaotic

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Speaker 7: scene for for.

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Speaker 5: My brother and I.

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Speaker 7: And my earliest memories are all doug They're all self soothing, hiding, scared, rocking,

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Speaker 7: just waiting for my dad to.

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Speaker 5: Get home to feel comforted. You know, to feel comforted.

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Speaker 2: It was who was who was caused? Who was causing

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Speaker 2: the chaos? What wasn't you and your brother?

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Speaker 7: So my my oldest half brother, Mike is is you know,

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Speaker 7: now a firefighter in Beachwood, Ohio, and he he was

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Speaker 7: graduated from high school and off into the military. You know,

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Speaker 7: when I was kind of just getting into like I

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Speaker 7: remember like grade school maybe, but the the what was

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Speaker 7: causing most of the problem was my brother Mark. You know,

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Speaker 7: I don't have a relationship. You know, he himself got

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Speaker 7: into a lot of trouble in high school and and

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Speaker 7: was kind of out of the scene as soon as

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Speaker 7: he turned eighteen. And you know, like I said, my

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Speaker 7: dad worked night shift my whole life. So as soon

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Speaker 7: as my dad was out of the house, it was

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Speaker 7: just it was it was a free it was a

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Speaker 7: free run for for my you know, a high school kid,

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Speaker 7: and and you know he was you know, drugs party

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Speaker 7: and you know, people at the house all the time.

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Speaker 7: It just was a wild scene. And I remember a

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Speaker 7: lot of nights hiding under you know, hiding under the

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Speaker 7: bed and and just waiting for my dad to get

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Speaker 7: home in the morning.

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Speaker 5: And that was kind of you know what we knew,

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Speaker 5: so I didn't know it was anything different.

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Speaker 7: I lived in a normal neighborhood. I didn't know I

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Speaker 7: didn't live in you know, it wasn't like I grew

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Speaker 7: up in, you know, a place that you know, we

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Speaker 7: weren't poor, we weren't rich by any means, but it

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Speaker 7: was just a regular middle class neighborhood.

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Speaker 5: And it was it was all I knew.

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Speaker 7: And uh, you know, I think once my brother left

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Speaker 7: the house, things started to settle in a little bit.

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Speaker 7: And then we would see my mom twice a week,

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Speaker 7: my brother, Matt and I, and it got to a

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Speaker 7: point where, you know, we were seeing her less often

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Speaker 7: and less often. And you know, when I was tenure

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Speaker 7: years old, we were over at her house and she

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Speaker 7: was in a physically abusive relationship and it happened in

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Speaker 7: front of us, and she was able to get us

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Speaker 7: in the car and drive us back to my dad's

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Speaker 7: house and drop us off. And that was the last

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Speaker 7: time I ever saw my mom or spoke to my

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Speaker 7: mom my entire life. And what I remember about that, Doug,

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Speaker 7: was I was relieved. I hated going over there. I

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Speaker 7: did not like having to go over to this house

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Speaker 7: twice a week. And be around the person she was

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Speaker 7: married to. And for me and my brother Matt, who

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Speaker 7: was just eighteen months older than me, it's kind of

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Speaker 7: the defining point in our lives. This is kind of

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Speaker 7: when I took off and became this academic athlete, and

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Speaker 7: it's kind of when my brother met started having some

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Speaker 7: problems and kind of became the under compensator. That's how

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Speaker 7: he was, you know, responded to the trauma and we

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Speaker 7: went completely different paths, you know, through our through middle

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Speaker 7: school and high school. So you know, for me, it

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Speaker 7: was more of a relief now. But it was just

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Speaker 7: my dad and my brother Matt in the house, and

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Speaker 7: it was kind of my time where there.

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Speaker 5: It didn't seem there were as many distractions.

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Speaker 7: I wasn't quite as afraid and and for me that's

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Speaker 7: kind of like where I started to do really well

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Speaker 7: in school and do really well.

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Speaker 5: On the athletic field.

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Speaker 8: Fox Sports Radio has the best sports talk lineup in

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Speaker 8: the nation. Catch all of our shows at Foxsports Radio

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00:17:45,119 --> 00:17:49,240
Speaker 8: dot com and within the iHeartRadio app search FSR to

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Speaker 8: listen live.

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Speaker 5: We show up at Harvard well year I got to

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Speaker 5: Harvard in nineteen ninety seven.

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Speaker 3: Show up at Harvard night ninety seven, North Campton, Ohio.

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Speaker 3: What do you remember about stepping on campus in Cambridge, Massachusetts.

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Speaker 7: I remember the one thing I remembered is I felt

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Speaker 7: I felt, I like escaped.

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Speaker 5: Being back home. And I really felt a lot of

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Speaker 5: relief when I got there immediately, and then just the

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Speaker 5: the just the it's hard to pre to describe, you know.

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Speaker 7: We got there two weeks early for football camps, so

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Speaker 7: campus was empty. I remember feeling very proud of myself, like,

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Speaker 7: oh my god, I can't believe I'm here, you know,

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Speaker 7: that type of feeling. And I thought that geographical relocation

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Speaker 7: was gonna allow me to start to feel better mentally physically,

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Speaker 7: and yeah, initially I did. Initially I kind of had

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Speaker 7: this this you know, as if we were in camp,

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Speaker 7: we were playing, and there was that initial you know,

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Speaker 7: relief and kind of dissipation of some of my anxiety

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Speaker 7: and some of the emotional just kind of stress that

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Speaker 7: I always felt when I was in high school. But

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Speaker 7: we all know they all the trauma and all the

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Speaker 7: underlying factors were still there. I wasn't working on it

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Speaker 7: at all.

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Speaker 3: And so well, it was also it's also before the

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Speaker 3: time when we need to work on it, you know, like,

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Speaker 3: let's just kind of be honest, right, Like I I

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Speaker 3: didn't come from what I would I would consider an

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Speaker 3: abusive home. You know, there was obviously, uh that generation

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Speaker 3: of parents, even the ones that were still married like mine,

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Speaker 3: there was a.

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Speaker 2: Different way of treating you. You know. It's like.

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Speaker 3: It's like you did your dad ever sit down and

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Speaker 3: do homework. Were like, no, we just don'd you to

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Speaker 3: get that shit done. Do it well, you know, get

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Speaker 3: your grades, or you don't play basketball. It was really

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Speaker 3: that simple, right, But there's definitely I I escaped southern California,

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Speaker 3: no question to go to Notre Dame, and I remember

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Speaker 3: showing up and having many of the same feelings. Now,

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Speaker 3: I would tell you that, you know, like we're obviously

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Speaker 3: both bright. We wouldn't have made it to where we

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Speaker 3: made it if we weren't. On the other hand, I

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Speaker 3: will tell you that I remember by Notre Dame, I

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Speaker 3: got to be in a class. There's one class a semester.

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Speaker 3: I was taught by Father Malloy. Mark Malloy was the

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Speaker 3: president of Notre Dame at the time, and he was

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Speaker 3: an English professor, and so I was one of the

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Speaker 3: twelve advisors to each select one person to get to

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Speaker 3: be in a special class.

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Speaker 2: The class is actually taught in the Golden Dome. About that, and.

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Speaker 3: The first class that thought the class was only on

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Speaker 3: a Sunday night and he get downe do a mass,

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Speaker 3: and then he come in and he'd do a class.

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Speaker 2: And it was a very simple format. We read a.

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Speaker 3: Novel book every week and then you had to write

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Speaker 3: a paper that was more than a page less than two.

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Speaker 3: But the first week we went around the room, we

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Speaker 3: kind of told our stories in the like I don't know,

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Speaker 3: like twelve of us.

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Speaker 2: I mean, say you had like Tennis, tell your story or.

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Speaker 3: And I just remember, like I mean my story. The

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Speaker 3: headlines were good Jewish kids, Southern California. Mom went to Syracuse,

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Speaker 3: Dad to Ohio State. You know, basketball player, et cetera,

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Speaker 3: et cetera. But it wasn't really a lot of granular details.

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Speaker 3: Right like they recruited me. I thought I could start.

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Speaker 3: I love the idea of Notre Dame, what it could

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Speaker 3: do for me when I was done playing. And then

390
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Speaker 3: I hear all these stories of these people and things

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Speaker 3: they've accomplished, the places they came from, and I'm like,

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Speaker 3: oh my god, I'm the dumbest, least accomplished person in

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Speaker 3: this room. I like, I just basketball player. That's how

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Speaker 3: I felt at that point, And I don't did what

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Speaker 3: was that? Like you when you you're around campus and like, look,

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Speaker 3: not everybody at Harvard is some some genius, but there's

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Speaker 3: much a much higher percentage of people who are really

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Speaker 3: really intellectually elite.

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Speaker 2: What was it? What was that element of a love?

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Speaker 7: Yeah, that's a you know, to be one hundred percent honest,

401
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Speaker 7: I was never I was so self involved and so

402
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Speaker 7: concerned with just surviving day to day. I never got

403
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Speaker 7: too overwhelmed by the elites and the money and the

404
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Speaker 7: prestige of the place.

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Speaker 5: You know, to be honest, Doug like that the that

406
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Speaker 5: feeling like a fraud and feeling like do I really belong?

407
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Speaker 5: I had? I had that.

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Speaker 7: I started having that in high school. You know, you know,

409
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Speaker 7: are people going to find out? You know that that

410
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Speaker 7: was kind of you know, the gist of my story

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Speaker 7: was and you just said it on the on the ledger,

412
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Speaker 7: like my ledger all ranked high in my class, perfect grades,

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Speaker 7: captain of the basketball team, football team.

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Speaker 5: Like on paper, it was as pretty as it could get.

415
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Speaker 7: And you know, I knew, and I've shared this in

416
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Speaker 7: some and some talks I've given, Like the summer going

417
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Speaker 7: into my freshman year of college, I.

418
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Speaker 5: Knew something was wrong. I knew something was off.

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Speaker 7: I knew there was no way other people felt like this,

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Speaker 7: you know, inside between their ears, and you know, like

421
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Speaker 7: I said, when I got to Harvard, for those first

422
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Speaker 7: few weeks, it kind of dissipated, and I think, maybe

423
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Speaker 7: this is what I needed, Maybe this is what I'm

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Speaker 7: just I just needed to get away. But really soon

425
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Speaker 7: it all started to seep back in. And are they

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Speaker 7: going to find out that, you know, how bad I'm

427
00:23:52,280 --> 00:23:56,000
Speaker 7: hurting physically and they just wasted this recruiting spot, you know,

428
00:23:56,080 --> 00:23:58,119
Speaker 7: not that it's that big of a deal at Harvard,

429
00:23:58,160 --> 00:24:00,800
Speaker 7: but you know, the coaches take this uff seriously. And

430
00:24:01,359 --> 00:24:03,640
Speaker 7: are people going to realize that I'm not that smart?

431
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Speaker 5: You know?

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Speaker 7: And I just studied my butt off every night, and

433
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Speaker 7: you know, I was really good at memorizing stuff. So

434
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Speaker 7: like that feeling that like I'm going to get found out,

435
00:24:12,200 --> 00:24:15,160
Speaker 7: and what that had me to do was really start

436
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Speaker 7: to isolate that that that's what that's what ies were.

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Speaker 2: So when when did you hurt your shoulder?

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Speaker 5: I had my first surgery right after my freshman season.

439
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Speaker 5: So that that that winter of nine.

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00:24:29,880 --> 00:24:31,399
Speaker 2: Did you actually do you remember when you heard it,

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00:24:31,480 --> 00:24:32,680
Speaker 2: Remember the moment you heard it?

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00:24:33,080 --> 00:24:35,280
Speaker 5: Oh back in high school? You know what I mean.

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00:24:35,320 --> 00:24:37,000
Speaker 7: It was one of those deals where you know, it

444
00:24:37,160 --> 00:24:39,840
Speaker 7: just kept it kept grinding on me, and they got

445
00:24:39,880 --> 00:24:40,720
Speaker 7: to that point.

446
00:24:40,480 --> 00:24:42,600
Speaker 5: Where you know, I needed to get it cleaned up.

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00:24:42,640 --> 00:24:46,000
Speaker 7: And you know, I ended up having three surgeries within

448
00:24:46,359 --> 00:24:50,439
Speaker 7: eighteen months, you know, and and never have gotten physically

449
00:24:50,480 --> 00:24:52,399
Speaker 7: well enough where you know, I still feel like my

450
00:24:52,440 --> 00:24:58,000
Speaker 7: shoulders great or anything. It's uh, it's it's hard to describe,

451
00:24:58,000 --> 00:25:01,320
Speaker 7: and I think very few people can understand unless they

452
00:25:01,359 --> 00:25:06,119
Speaker 7: have dealt with debility, debilitating anxiety, just what it can

453
00:25:06,200 --> 00:25:09,080
Speaker 7: do to you physically and how it throws your whole

454
00:25:09,119 --> 00:25:11,960
Speaker 7: body off a whack. And I think for me, it

455
00:25:12,000 --> 00:25:14,639
Speaker 7: all started with a back injury back in like eighth grade,

456
00:25:14,640 --> 00:25:17,199
Speaker 7: and it just kind of got the mechanism of my

457
00:25:17,280 --> 00:25:20,240
Speaker 7: body just completely out of whack. And that's where you know,

458
00:25:20,280 --> 00:25:22,800
Speaker 7: I started having issues with my shoulder and my hip

459
00:25:22,840 --> 00:25:26,080
Speaker 7: and everything else. So, like I said, I was I

460
00:25:26,080 --> 00:25:28,320
Speaker 7: felt like I was falling apart before I was even

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00:25:28,359 --> 00:25:29,320
Speaker 7: a senior in high school.

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Speaker 5: To be honest with you, So, you.

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00:25:33,400 --> 00:25:36,920
Speaker 2: Have shoulder surgery. Did you take pain pills?

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00:25:36,920 --> 00:25:43,359
Speaker 7: In yes, I remember that feeling the first time I

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00:25:43,400 --> 00:25:49,879
Speaker 7: ever took a pain pill, of that immediate relief, the

466
00:25:49,920 --> 00:25:56,480
Speaker 7: world slowed down. But through all those surgeries and the

467
00:25:56,600 --> 00:26:01,679
Speaker 7: amount of medication I took, never did it become a habit.

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00:26:02,520 --> 00:26:06,919
Speaker 7: Never did it become something that, you know, once the

469
00:26:06,960 --> 00:26:09,600
Speaker 7: prescriptions would have run out, that I would be seeking

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00:26:09,600 --> 00:26:11,400
Speaker 7: more of it. I'd always get kind of get back

471
00:26:11,400 --> 00:26:16,719
Speaker 7: into my routine and and and get back into, you know,

472
00:26:16,880 --> 00:26:19,960
Speaker 7: just the regular riggors of college. So that that was

473
00:26:20,040 --> 00:26:25,200
Speaker 7: my first exposure to paying medication. Obviously not the last

474
00:26:25,200 --> 00:26:28,639
Speaker 7: part of my connection and my story to paying medication,

475
00:26:28,760 --> 00:26:31,000
Speaker 7: but that was my first time, you know, being exposed

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00:26:31,000 --> 00:26:32,400
Speaker 7: to it when I was nineteen years old.

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00:26:33,680 --> 00:26:38,240
Speaker 3: You so, did you stay with the football team after

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00:26:38,320 --> 00:26:39,320
Speaker 3: these three surgeries?

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00:26:39,560 --> 00:26:42,040
Speaker 2: You not stay with How does it work?

480
00:26:42,119 --> 00:26:47,199
Speaker 7: So basically, after after my sophomore sophomore spring football I

481
00:26:47,240 --> 00:26:51,040
Speaker 7: had the third surgery, I went home to Canton, Ohio

482
00:26:51,080 --> 00:26:54,199
Speaker 7: and took a whole year off of school, you know,

483
00:26:54,240 --> 00:26:57,080
Speaker 7: because in the IVY League they don't really red shirt,

484
00:26:57,280 --> 00:26:59,480
Speaker 7: so I wanted to. I wanted to get healthy and play,

485
00:26:59,560 --> 00:27:02,280
Speaker 7: so I want to take an entire year off of school.

486
00:27:02,280 --> 00:27:06,159
Speaker 7: I went home, try to do everything I could to

487
00:27:06,200 --> 00:27:09,879
Speaker 7: get healthy, and that year ended up just being a

488
00:27:09,920 --> 00:27:12,160
Speaker 7: waste of a year because I couldn't get healthy physically,

489
00:27:12,200 --> 00:27:15,320
Speaker 7: I was just getting worse mentally. And then returned to

490
00:27:15,359 --> 00:27:18,680
Speaker 7: Harvard my final two years just as a regular student,

491
00:27:19,160 --> 00:27:21,080
Speaker 7: not not a part of the football.

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00:27:20,680 --> 00:27:23,560
Speaker 5: Team, just as a just as a regular, you know

493
00:27:24,000 --> 00:27:24,879
Speaker 5: student at Harvard.

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00:27:25,440 --> 00:27:28,280
Speaker 2: When you were at home, What was it like that.

495
00:27:28,320 --> 00:27:29,720
Speaker 5: Ended up becoming.

496
00:27:31,280 --> 00:27:35,200
Speaker 7: More, you know, once I realized that I wasn't playing,

497
00:27:35,280 --> 00:27:38,320
Speaker 7: it just it just became a lot of socialization, going

498
00:27:38,359 --> 00:27:40,800
Speaker 7: to visit friends at different colleges, taking a lot.

499
00:27:40,680 --> 00:27:47,000
Speaker 5: Of trips, you know. At that point, you know, my brother.

500
00:27:48,520 --> 00:27:53,200
Speaker 7: Was really struggling at home and has continued to struggle

501
00:27:53,240 --> 00:27:56,720
Speaker 7: to this day. So I remember that year specifically. I

502
00:27:56,760 --> 00:27:59,520
Speaker 7: didn't like being at home. So as soon as i'd

503
00:27:59,560 --> 00:28:02,320
Speaker 7: be home and I finally kind of felt this pain

504
00:28:02,560 --> 00:28:05,520
Speaker 7: and a lot of the sadness that was inside that home,

505
00:28:06,240 --> 00:28:08,120
Speaker 7: I didn't want to be I didn't want to be there,

506
00:28:08,160 --> 00:28:10,280
Speaker 7: so I would look for another trip to go on.

507
00:28:10,359 --> 00:28:12,480
Speaker 7: I'd go visit my friend at Florida, state, I'd go

508
00:28:12,560 --> 00:28:14,920
Speaker 7: visit my friend. I spent a lot of time.

509
00:28:14,920 --> 00:28:16,680
Speaker 5: Working at a sporting good store as.

510
00:28:16,600 --> 00:28:18,240
Speaker 7: Much as I could do, just to stay out of

511
00:28:18,280 --> 00:28:23,679
Speaker 7: the house. And that's kind of been the repeating theme,

512
00:28:23,920 --> 00:28:26,760
Speaker 7: you know, with my relationship with North Campton, Ohio and

513
00:28:26,840 --> 00:28:30,119
Speaker 7: my home to this very day.

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Speaker 4: All right, that's it for part one of Josh Lucas

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00:28:36,520 --> 00:28:40,520
Speaker 4: from humble beginnings and of course understanding now all the things.

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00:28:40,360 --> 00:28:45,400
Speaker 1: That you probably should have processed back then. Right, we

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00:28:45,920 --> 00:28:48,560
Speaker 1: all kind of feel that way. Remember.

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Speaker 4: The Doug Goley Show is daily three to five eastern

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00:28:51,040 --> 00:28:54,400
Speaker 4: TULB two Pacific. You can also download and podcasts form

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00:28:54,480 --> 00:28:57,480
Speaker 4: this podcast only our just type in Doug Gotley. Please

521
00:28:58,600 --> 00:29:03,040
Speaker 4: review this download, subscribe, rate it. All that stuff helps

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00:29:03,840 --> 00:29:06,320
Speaker 4: and I truly appreciate Josh for telling his story.

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Speaker 1: Part two. Oh, it's fascinating. That's next time on All

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Speaker 1: Ball