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Speaker 1: Brought to you by the reinvented two thousand twelve Camray.

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Speaker 1: It's ready. Are you welcome to stuff mom never told you?

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Speaker 1: From house Stop works dot com. Hello, and welcome to

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Speaker 1: the podcast. I'm Kristen and I'm Caroline. So today we

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Speaker 1: are going to talk about men. Yes, we're gonna talk

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Speaker 1: about men. But and while we while we are not men,

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Speaker 1: you and I Caroline, sure most of the time, this

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Speaker 1: is true, we do have one very important diversity of

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Speaker 1: perspectives we were bringing to the table because we're talking

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Speaker 1: about men in height, yes, today and you and I Caroline,

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Speaker 1: we we uh, we're at both ends of the spectrum. Yes,

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Speaker 1: I am close to the ground and I am up

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Speaker 1: in the cloud, especially today because I am wearing heels. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: you should see us walking around together. It's kind of funny.

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Speaker 1: Are you in flats? I'm wearing the flattest flat. They're

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Speaker 1: basically cardboard with some straps tattoos. So you're at what

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Speaker 1: height right now? Five to five too? And I am

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Speaker 1: probably close to six one today. Oh my god, that's terrifying.

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Speaker 1: We should join a circus so you can represent the

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Speaker 1: short the short side of this, because I'm going to

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Speaker 1: represent the tall tall side today because uh, the tall

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Speaker 1: dudes have it all they do be Wait wait should

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Speaker 1: I not say that since i'me Is this like debate?

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Speaker 1: Is this like debate? Team? Should I? Should I not

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Speaker 1: sandicate how attracted I am too lumber jacks? Well, we

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Speaker 1: that's maybe that's for another podcast. Um, but yeah, so

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Speaker 1: far the evidence is coming out that toman just have

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Speaker 1: a certain just luck they got. They got a lot

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Speaker 1: of luck. I don't know how else to put it.

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Speaker 1: They do. It's kind of genetic induced luck. Yes, um,

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Speaker 1: but before we go any further, my my first question

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Speaker 1: before we started all this research was why why men

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Speaker 1: are taller than women? Although a lot of times I'm

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Speaker 1: taller than then that's okay, um, so give it. Give

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Speaker 1: it to a scare on why why are dudes taller? Well,

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Speaker 1: it starts in puberty, or right before puberty, I should say, Um,

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Speaker 1: boys actually have a delayed growth spurt. So you might

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Speaker 1: think back to middle school when okay, well you're a

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Speaker 1: bad example because you're you're very tall. Well oh yeah,

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Speaker 1: but but you might think all right, listeners might think

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Speaker 1: back to middle school when all of the girls were

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Speaker 1: shooting up and the guys were still really low to

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Speaker 1: the ground, about about the high I am right now. Well,

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Speaker 1: that's because guys actually have two extra years of childhood growth, yeah,

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Speaker 1: before they hit puberty. So while women or girls I

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Speaker 1: should say, get a growth spurt hit puberty and that's

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Speaker 1: pretty much where they stay. Guys actually kind of keep

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Speaker 1: growing for a little bit. They keep on growing. There's

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Speaker 1: there's skeletal um frame actually keeps growing until they hit

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Speaker 1: around twenty twenty years old. And this is all fueled

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Speaker 1: by a hormone called testosterone. Holler. Gestosterone is what triggers

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Speaker 1: all the cell growth that fosters the height difference on

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Speaker 1: average five between men and women. Yeah, the more testosterone

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Speaker 1: a guy has, the more humoglobin he has, and that

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Speaker 1: carries oxygen to the muscles, and that feeds the muscles,

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Speaker 1: fostering all of this growth, and so they sprout up

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Speaker 1: like trees. Um. But once guy settled into their adult height,

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Speaker 1: the taller ones seemed to have some sort of advantage.

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Speaker 1: And Malcolm Gladwell would agree with me. There was this

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Speaker 1: this passage that I ran across in his book Blink

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Speaker 1: where he talks about the heights of CEOs of fortune

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Speaker 1: companies and in a nutshell. Most Fortune five companies in

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Speaker 1: the United States are run by a lot of tall

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Speaker 1: white men, really tall white men. Uh for an idea here,

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Speaker 1: here we go. In the US, about fourteen point five

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Speaker 1: percent of all men are six feet or over, just

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Speaker 1: fourteen point five percent among the CEOs of Fortune companies

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Speaker 1: that Gladwell looked at, that number was fifty eight percent.

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Speaker 1: And then among the American population only three point nine

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Speaker 1: percent of adult men are six two or taller. As

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Speaker 1: a small sliver among that CEO sample, Gladwell looks at

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Speaker 1: thirty percent, the CEOs are just towering over they are employees.

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Speaker 1: Gladwell puts out there that we kind of associate leadership

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Speaker 1: ability with physical stature. We sort of have this image

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Speaker 1: in our minds, this preconceived notion of a leader as

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Speaker 1: someone who's imposing, so not that everything else goes out

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Speaker 1: the window. You know, if you kind of bomb your

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Speaker 1: job interview, you know, just you're tall, you might not

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Speaker 1: get the position. But still, Well, he was using this

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Speaker 1: as an example of perhaps implicit biases that are going

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Speaker 1: on because, like you said, um, and this also comes

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Speaker 1: from study where we have this perception of tallermant as

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Speaker 1: being more dominant and more assertive than shorter men, and

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Speaker 1: in the workplace, that translates to a potential pay increase.

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Speaker 1: And this is a statistic that's been bad at about

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Speaker 1: a lot. If you just google taller, taller people happier,

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Speaker 1: you will undoubtedly run across this finding that an inch

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Speaker 1: of height is worth seven hundred eighty nine dollars a

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Speaker 1: year in a salary. Yeah, that's nuts. So these researchers

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Speaker 1: looked at four studies that followed people from birth through adulthood,

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Speaker 1: and yeah, they found that seven eighty nine dollar figure.

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Speaker 1: And so basically, if you're six feet tall, you will

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Speaker 1: make five thousand, five hundred twenty five dollars more per

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Speaker 1: year than someone who is five five. That hurts my feelings.

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Speaker 1: And that also Glad will point out that that also

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Speaker 1: controlled for gender, because I as time this is probably

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Speaker 1: men in the workplace. But you know what, this need

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Speaker 1: scarlet is said, I should be making a lot more

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Speaker 1: money right now. And I could also be that the

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Speaker 1: taller people are getting the better positions, not that just

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Speaker 1: like if you and I are equal, they're gone. Kristen,

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Speaker 1: that girl's got something going on about eight extra bucks

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Speaker 1: in one um. And and just to top things off.

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Speaker 1: Maybe because these taller men are making more money. Studies

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Speaker 1: also fine, taller men are happier. Yeah, and for so

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Speaker 1: many reasons. I'm not trying to be pull some kind

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Speaker 1: of tall bias right now. This is coming from the

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Speaker 1: National Bureau of Economic Research that found that both men

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Speaker 1: and women who are above the average height and that

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Speaker 1: would be five ft ten inches for men in the

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Speaker 1: US and five ft four for females, both genders report

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Speaker 1: higher levels of happiness than people who are below average heights. Right.

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Speaker 1: Angus Deaton, a Princeton economist and fellow tall person, found

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Speaker 1: that people who are taller actually have more education and

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Speaker 1: higher income levels. Yeah. And the men who describe their

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Speaker 1: lives as the quote worst possible, it's most were nearly

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Speaker 1: an in shorter than the average man. But that's only

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Speaker 1: five nine. I feel like something's gonna be off because

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Speaker 1: I'm five nine, and I don't feel like men I

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Speaker 1: meet who are five nine seem particularly short. Yeah, you

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Speaker 1: know they talk about short guys. Well, Okay, so they

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Speaker 1: interviewed this basketball player who's six nine. Yeah, this is

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Speaker 1: in Time magazine. So he he has a good perspective

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Speaker 1: on things. Um, yeah, he said in his opinion, and

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Speaker 1: this is a quote. Short people are always ready to disagree,

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Speaker 1: and of course as a short person, I have to

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Speaker 1: disagree disagree, Uh, he said. I found that they seem

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Speaker 1: more likely to have a chip on their shoulder, more

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Speaker 1: likely to have something to prove. Do you feel like

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Speaker 1: short guys you've met have something to prove? No, I

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Speaker 1: don't want to. I don't want to make any kind

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Speaker 1: of stereotypes like generalization because, um, and we're going to

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Speaker 1: talk about this in the next episode that we do,

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Speaker 1: which is gonna flip the script and talk about heightened women.

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Speaker 1: I'm sure that, um, there are more stereotypes kind of

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Speaker 1: similar to short men's stereotypes. There are probably plenty of

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Speaker 1: tall women stereotypes as well, because you know, talking about

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Speaker 1: short men, the whole n polling complex comes up disproven.

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Speaker 1: Which was disproven. There was um a study I think

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Speaker 1: somehow an association with the BBC that found that something

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Speaker 1: like eight percent of I guess this would have been

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Speaker 1: the British public considered short men to be more aggressive. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: and it's actually in studies they did that involved people

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Speaker 1: hitting each other with sticks or something. Uh. They found

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Speaker 1: that tall guys are actually more likely to be the

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Speaker 1: aggressor in those kind of situations. Yeah, so I think

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Speaker 1: that when it comes to personality types, I would be

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Speaker 1: very hesitant to draw any sort of stereotype in terms

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Speaker 1: of correlating height and aggression. But this whole height and

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Speaker 1: happiness thing does seem to hold some water, at least

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Speaker 1: in these economic studies that they've done. And going back

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Speaker 1: to that Time magazine article, um it reports that taller

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Speaker 1: people say they're more content and are less likely to

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Speaker 1: report a range of negative emotions like sadness and physical pain. Well,

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Speaker 1: but maybe it's because of our robust, tall muscles. I

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Speaker 1: don't know. You just feel more, Kristen, you have more.

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Speaker 1: There's more of YouTube feel. I don't know that I

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Speaker 1: have a higher pain tolerance than you do. Maybe we

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Speaker 1: should do Oh my god, let's get some sticks on.

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Speaker 1: I bleed easily. But here here's another question. Though. Perhaps

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Speaker 1: guys are happier because they're more sexually attractive. I'm sorry

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Speaker 1: I had to say it. Yeah, and not that we're

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Speaker 1: saying that tall guys are more sexually attractive. I mean

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Speaker 1: I am saying that taller sexually attracted. You have a

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Speaker 1: personal property Lumberjacks um but yeah, actually, uh sorry, shorter

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Speaker 1: than average man. It's estimated that for every inch shorter

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Speaker 1: you are than average, five percent fewer women will find

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Speaker 1: you attractive. I'm sorry, I'm so sorry. And this is

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Speaker 1: all tracing back to evolutionary biology, which says that we

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Speaker 1: are more attracted to tall mates because height signals make

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Speaker 1: quality and health, and height is also a signal of

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Speaker 1: testosterone levels. So you know, all these innate signals firing off,

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Speaker 1: and they can reach the coffee cups well, and it's

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Speaker 1: easy to see that maybe their faces when they you know,

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Speaker 1: with their heads are popping out of the crowd. Perhaps

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Speaker 1: that could be something because I would just go ahead,

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Speaker 1: like to go ahead and make a point now that

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Speaker 1: a lot of very attractive actors are very short. Sure,

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Speaker 1: but you don't see them in person. You just see

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Speaker 1: them on the big screen where they're cue. We would

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Speaker 1: like to see them in sure, Like Tom Cruise. I

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Speaker 1: mean he's short, well okay, I don't know how tall

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Speaker 1: is he? What he's like five a um, but he's

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Speaker 1: been married three times two lovely ladies. Yeah, tall attractive

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Speaker 1: women women. But because of that, let's let's call that

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Speaker 1: the Tom Cruise hypothesis. Okay, uh and my scientists, now, yes,

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Speaker 1: where's your lab? Go? Okay? And speaking with the BBC,

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Speaker 1: a nevelutionary biologist in Britain said that this is not

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Speaker 1: we are not necessarily attracted to taller men. They're not

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Speaker 1: necessarily more sexually attractive than shorter guys. If this is

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Speaker 1: just an issue of culture, perhaps it's just the fact

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Speaker 1: that Western culture finds taller men more attractive than shorter men. Right, yeah,

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Speaker 1: go find the Mayan people. Did they do they care?

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Speaker 1: I don't know. I mean, I don't know, right, or

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Speaker 1: in Asian cultures, men tend to be shorter on average

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Speaker 1: than say, America can men, So I think that there

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Speaker 1: could be a point to that as well. Um, but

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Speaker 1: I do think that at least in the case of

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Speaker 1: online dating, perhaps shorter men are shooting themselves in the

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Speaker 1: foot a little bit because a lot of them lie

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Speaker 1: about their height. Why because that isn't the point to

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Speaker 1: eventually meet the person in person, right, but a lot

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Speaker 1: of times guys will, especially this starts. This is from

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Speaker 1: analysis from the okay Cupid blog, which is Okay Trends,

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Speaker 1: and if you haven't looked at it, you should check

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Speaker 1: it out because it really It is pretty fascinating curves,

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Speaker 1: bell curves. They they examine the bell curve of heights

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Speaker 1: male heights of the average population in the US, and

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Speaker 1: then they put the okay Cupid bell curve on top

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Speaker 1: of that and found a shift. Yeah, there's quite a

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Speaker 1: bit of a show like something that is not matching.

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Speaker 1: Because the okay cupis population is large enough and representative

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Speaker 1: enough to to put those bell curves on top of

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Speaker 1: each other, and it should should match up pretty much equally.

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Speaker 1: But guys on okay Cupid and on a lot of

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Speaker 1: other online dating sites tend to give themselves a couple

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Speaker 1: extra inches, especially the closer they get to six ft tall. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: this is a rum around five eight to six ft

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Speaker 1: they'll just start rounding up. Yeah, the bell curve starts

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Speaker 1: to lean to one side, right um. And they also

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Speaker 1: examined height and the number of sexual partners that both

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Speaker 1: men and women on okay Cupid had had, and the

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Speaker 1: guys who had the highest number of reported and this

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Speaker 1: is all self reporting, so a grain of salt here.

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Speaker 1: But the guys with the highest number of sexual partners

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Speaker 1: six five. Oh my god, can't I need to step

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Speaker 1: so I wou need to step ladder. Yeah. There. I

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Speaker 1: saw a photo actually online yesterday of Shaquille O'Neal and

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Speaker 1: I don't know if it's his wife or his girlfriend,

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Speaker 1: but there was an image of them. I mean she

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Speaker 1: basically comes up to his like mid thigh, and there's

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Speaker 1: a picture of them and leaning down to kisser and

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Speaker 1: it looks like a baby. Mean, we kind of it

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Speaker 1: really looked uncomfortable because there was such, um, such a

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Speaker 1: significant Have you seen pictures of Kim Kardashian and her

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Speaker 1: fiance Is it a huge difference? Yeah, so looks like

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Speaker 1: he's walking around with a child. But you know, the hobbit, Like,

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Speaker 1: here's hobbit Kim Kardashian. Hey, you know that that's a

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Speaker 1: that's that's kind of like us today though, Caroline, I

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Speaker 1: know if you are Mike, you're Mike. Kim Kardashian genuinely touched. Um.

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Speaker 1: But going back to this this shorter men and and

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Speaker 1: sexual attraction, just for one more study examining um relationships

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Speaker 1: and height. I feel like I'm piling it on, but

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Speaker 1: just a little bit more proof, a little a little

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Speaker 1: bit more evidence. I don't want to, I don't like,

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Speaker 1: but there was a study that we found called height,

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Speaker 1: relationship satisfaction, jealousy, and mate retention, very straightforward title us

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Speaker 1: which examine basically whether or not shorter men are more

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Speaker 1: jealous and insecure in relationships, and the answer is possibly, Okay,

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Speaker 1: Shorter men do tend to be a little more insecure

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Speaker 1: in romantic relationships because, especially when women are ovulating, when

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Speaker 1: they're at their most fertile, we tend to find taller

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Speaker 1: men more attractive, okay, for short term mating. Taller dudes

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Speaker 1: are often where we look, so that if we're if

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Speaker 1: we're in our fertile phase, or we're looking for a

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Speaker 1: hook up. Yeah, so that initiates some insecurity in shorter men.

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Speaker 1: These uh, these researchers hypothesized. But I will say, when

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Speaker 1: it comes to emotional jealousy, there is no heighth correlation

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Speaker 1: at all. Tall men, short men. They're all going to

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Speaker 1: be jealous if they find out that their females obviously

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Speaker 1: it's in heterosexual relationships, if their female partner has been

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Speaker 1: unfaithful to them. Right. But the researchers Gail Brewer and

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Speaker 1: Charlene Riley actually found that um female preference for tall

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Speaker 1: partners might actually represent an increased threat of desertion or

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Speaker 1: cuckoldry to shorter men. Right, but I will say this

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Speaker 1: a short guy, ladies, I will say the According to

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Speaker 1: this little tidbit about the share in this study from

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Speaker 1: the University of Central lancashra, shorter men might make for

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Speaker 1: better long term mates because tallman were less likely to

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Speaker 1: use appearance enhancement or love and care to retain a partner.

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Speaker 1: But we're more likely to employ vigilance, monopolization of time,

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Speaker 1: and jealousy induction if they felt threatened by a lady

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Speaker 1: possibly looking elsewhere. Right, And they relate that to basically

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Speaker 1: tallman's ability to go out and just find a partner

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Speaker 1: willy nilly after that, so that they don't feel that

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Speaker 1: they have to maybe and you know this is all

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Speaker 1: this is all study for generalizing, so that the tall

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Speaker 1: men that they studied might not put their all into

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Speaker 1: winning you back, whereas a short guy, you know, he's

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Speaker 1: going to do what he can to hold on seems

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Speaker 1: to nurture relationships. He might put on some very wide

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Speaker 1: give you BackRub, ask how your day went. Yeah, And

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Speaker 1: you know what, I don't want to I don't want

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Speaker 1: to pay tall men to be insensitive. Yeah, my father

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Speaker 1: is extremely tall. I have tall brothers. They're all stand

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Speaker 1: up guys. Yeah, you know, I know plenty of both

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Speaker 1: tall and short men. But I was kind of sounded

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Speaker 1: as we started researching men and height that over and

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Speaker 1: over and over again. If you look at economic studies,

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Speaker 1: relationships studies, evolutionary biology from all different angles, it's giving

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Speaker 1: tall men some kind of advantage height advantage. There was

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Speaker 1: actually a big study in the UK that took place

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Speaker 1: from nineteen fifty eight to two thousand. They they followed

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Speaker 1: ten thousand people born in nineteen five d eight and

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Speaker 1: at the end they found that the taller people were

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Speaker 1: less likely to be childless and single. Yeah, and there

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Speaker 1: was even going back to those earning studies, there was

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Speaker 1: one that looked at um people who were born I

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Speaker 1: think it was men who were born in the same year,

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Speaker 1: on the same day. Uh. And it was even if

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Speaker 1: they were the same height in adulthood, the men who

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Speaker 1: were taller as teenagers were or earning more money down

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Speaker 1: the road. Maybe it's a confidence thing, it could be,

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Speaker 1: but it's making me a little insecure that I'm not

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Speaker 1: making more money than I am because men. This is

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Speaker 1: the men, folks, but still the you know again going

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Speaker 1: back to the blink a citation that seven eighty nine

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Speaker 1: dollars per inch was controlling for gender. But we will

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Speaker 1: talk about all of that in our next episode, which

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Speaker 1: will look at whether or not taller women enjoy similar

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Speaker 1: benefits or of shorter women. Are where it's at, because

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Speaker 1: we're going to find at Caroline, you're in the spect

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Speaker 1: room is about to get all the blessings. Yeah, height,

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Speaker 1: yea or lack thereof, I should say the listener. Gravity,

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Speaker 1: it's a good luck charm. Yes, So I hope that

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Speaker 1: we have not just alienated all of our five ft

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Speaker 1: nine inch And look, five ft nine is still tall

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Speaker 1: to me. Yeah, well that's me. That's what I'm repping

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Speaker 1: right now. I have to look up at you. I

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Speaker 1: get a crook in my neck. Work. Good thing we're

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Speaker 1: sitting down for the podcast. It's gonna be a very

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Speaker 1: uncomfortable experience otherwise. But but tall folks, short folks, men,

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Speaker 1: let us know what you think it is. There is

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Speaker 1: there some kind of implicit tall person bias? Have you

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Speaker 1: noticed among your friends? Are you a tall guy who's

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Speaker 1: friends with some short guys or vice versa, and you've

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Speaker 1: noticed somebody's more confident or more angry or whatever. Are

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Speaker 1: you healthy? Are you an extremely successful short men man

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Speaker 1: like Tom Cruise? Yeah, let us know your thoughts. Mom

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Speaker 1: Stuff at how Stuffworks dot com is our email at

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Speaker 1: dress and we are going to read a couple of

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Speaker 1: emails we got in response to our episode on male

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Speaker 1: birth control. And I will start off right now with

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Speaker 1: one from Tom and this is calling us out for

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Speaker 1: a little bit of insensitivity that we had um. I

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Speaker 1: think at one point Caroline and I made sort of

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Speaker 1: an off hand joke about getting off birth control to

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Speaker 1: get pregnant. Lickerty split and he writes, I wanted to

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Speaker 1: comment about ladies birth control because my wife and I

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Speaker 1: decided to start a family, and naturally, my wife stopped

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Speaker 1: taking her birth control and we were surprised to find

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Speaker 1: that we were unable to conceive. First she had a

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Speaker 1: medical issue preventing her from ovulating, and then a problem

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Speaker 1: was found in me. My issue is that it's not

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Speaker 1: as easy as just stopping birth control and then starting

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Speaker 1: a family. This has been a very large issue and

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Speaker 1: we were still childless. I would like to see more

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Speaker 1: consideration for the people who cannot have their own child.

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Speaker 1: Please forgive my rant it's hard for me and my

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Speaker 1: wife to your comments about just that birth control and

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Speaker 1: get pregnant. And Tom does make a very good point. Uh,

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Speaker 1: so not the same for everybody exactly. And Caroline, you

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Speaker 1: have another perspective. Sure. Eduardo says that one of the

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Speaker 1: biggest scares for men with male birth control is the

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Speaker 1: possible threat to our libida. Women can just attend coitus.

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Speaker 1: Men have a responsibility to show up. If men don't

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Speaker 1: show up, we run the risk of having the quote

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Speaker 1: it happens to every guy talk and that is not

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Speaker 1: fun for for anyone. So maybe that's why hormonal birth

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Speaker 1: control for men is not marketable. Perhaps. Uh If you

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Speaker 1: have thoughts to send our way about male birth control, height,

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Speaker 1: anything under the sun really, our email addresses mom Stuff

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Speaker 1: at how stuff works dot com. You can also head

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00:21:42,680 --> 00:21:45,320
Speaker 1: over and leave us a comment on Facebook as well,

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00:21:45,760 --> 00:21:49,879
Speaker 1: and follow us on Twitter at mom Stuff Podcast. And then, finally,

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Speaker 1: during the week, you can check out our blog It's

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Speaker 1: stuff Mom Never Told You from how Stuff works dot com.

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Speaker 1: Be sure to check out our new video podcast, Stuff

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Speaker 1: from the Future. Join how staff Work staff as we

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Speaker 1: explore the most promising and perplexing possibilities of tomorrow. The

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