1 00:00:01,160 --> 00:00:04,360 Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff You Missed in History Class from how 2 00:00:04,400 --> 00:00:14,040 Speaker 1: Stuff Works dot com. Hello, and welcome to the podcast. 3 00:00:14,200 --> 00:00:18,000 Speaker 1: I'm Tracy Willy, and today we're going to talk about 4 00:00:18,000 --> 00:00:20,279 Speaker 1: one of those subjects that he's been requested by so 5 00:00:20,400 --> 00:00:23,720 Speaker 1: many people we cannot name them all a billion times, 6 00:00:23,960 --> 00:00:27,600 Speaker 1: lots of times, and that is Boudica. Boudica was the 7 00:00:27,640 --> 00:00:30,520 Speaker 1: first century queen of the ic and I, which is 8 00:00:30,520 --> 00:00:34,239 Speaker 1: the tribe that lived in what's now East Anglia. She 9 00:00:34,640 --> 00:00:38,559 Speaker 1: either staged a successful rebellion against the Romans or a massacre, 10 00:00:39,080 --> 00:00:42,080 Speaker 1: depending on who's doing the talking, and now she's become 11 00:00:42,120 --> 00:00:44,960 Speaker 1: one of the most famous figures from that era of 12 00:00:45,000 --> 00:00:48,440 Speaker 1: British history. And it's not just because of this David 13 00:00:48,479 --> 00:00:51,199 Speaker 1: and Goliath esque nature of the whole story. There were 14 00:00:51,240 --> 00:00:55,480 Speaker 1: definitely other tribal leaders elsewhere in Britain whose fight against 15 00:00:55,520 --> 00:00:58,120 Speaker 1: the Romans was a lot more sustained and really more 16 00:00:58,120 --> 00:01:02,040 Speaker 1: effective when you like the long term consequences. But Buddhica 17 00:01:02,160 --> 00:01:04,800 Speaker 1: really gets tap billing because she was a woman, which, 18 00:01:05,080 --> 00:01:07,360 Speaker 1: in the eyes of the Romans, really made her something 19 00:01:07,360 --> 00:01:10,399 Speaker 1: to talk about. A lot of the surviving accounts of 20 00:01:10,440 --> 00:01:14,240 Speaker 1: Buddhica were written by Roman historians, after the fact. One 21 00:01:14,280 --> 00:01:17,720 Speaker 1: was Tacitus, who was writing within sixty years of her death, 22 00:01:18,120 --> 00:01:20,640 Speaker 1: and the other was Cassius Dio, who wrote about a 23 00:01:20,720 --> 00:01:24,399 Speaker 1: hundred years after the fact. The Britons themselves did not 24 00:01:24,560 --> 00:01:27,000 Speaker 1: leave a lot of written records, so pretty much all 25 00:01:27,040 --> 00:01:29,759 Speaker 1: of our written accounts of her are colored with the 26 00:01:29,880 --> 00:01:33,600 Speaker 1: Roman idea number one that women weren't fit togethern and 27 00:01:33,720 --> 00:01:36,280 Speaker 1: number two that the Britons were an unorganized horde of 28 00:01:36,280 --> 00:01:40,800 Speaker 1: filthy barbarians. But thanks to archaeological discoveries within the last century, 29 00:01:41,000 --> 00:01:43,360 Speaker 1: now we have a lot more complete picture of her 30 00:01:43,480 --> 00:01:46,600 Speaker 1: and of what happened than we ever did before. So 31 00:01:46,680 --> 00:01:50,480 Speaker 1: for background, Boudica is from the Celtic word Buddha, which 32 00:01:50,480 --> 00:01:52,960 Speaker 1: means victory. And we're not sure if that's a name 33 00:01:53,080 --> 00:01:56,040 Speaker 1: or a title, but it's definitely not bodicia, which you 34 00:01:56,120 --> 00:01:58,280 Speaker 1: might have learned in school if you were going at 35 00:01:58,280 --> 00:02:01,080 Speaker 1: s at times that Tracy and I were. Yeah, there 36 00:02:01,160 --> 00:02:06,560 Speaker 1: was a uh an error in in a recopying of 37 00:02:06,680 --> 00:02:10,720 Speaker 1: historical text lar and time ago that transformed it repopulated 38 00:02:10,760 --> 00:02:15,400 Speaker 1: itself through many many texts. Yes, so definitely bodicia. If 39 00:02:15,400 --> 00:02:17,240 Speaker 1: you've heard it said that way or written that way. 40 00:02:17,480 --> 00:02:20,640 Speaker 1: That's not the way. Here's a description of her by Dio. 41 00:02:20,840 --> 00:02:24,560 Speaker 1: In stature, she was very tall in appearance, most terrifying, 42 00:02:25,000 --> 00:02:27,800 Speaker 1: and the glance of her eye most fierce, and her 43 00:02:27,880 --> 00:02:31,160 Speaker 1: voice was harsh. A great mass of the tawniest hair 44 00:02:31,280 --> 00:02:34,040 Speaker 1: fell to her hips. Around her neck was a large 45 00:02:34,040 --> 00:02:37,519 Speaker 1: golden necklace, and she wore a tunic of diverse colors, 46 00:02:37,560 --> 00:02:40,200 Speaker 1: over which a thick mantle was fastened with a brooch. 47 00:02:40,960 --> 00:02:46,000 Speaker 1: This was her invariable attire, and this description is pretty 48 00:02:46,080 --> 00:02:49,080 Speaker 1: much in line with how she's often depicted, a powerful, 49 00:02:49,200 --> 00:02:53,799 Speaker 1: screaming warrior woman with long red hair who is really 50 00:02:53,840 --> 00:02:56,120 Speaker 1: bent on taking you down and ready to do it. 51 00:02:57,000 --> 00:03:00,280 Speaker 1: We don't, however, actually know what color her hair really was. 52 00:03:00,440 --> 00:03:03,160 Speaker 1: The red could have been an embellishment tied to all 53 00:03:03,160 --> 00:03:06,079 Speaker 1: of those prejudices about red haired people, and those have 54 00:03:06,160 --> 00:03:08,880 Speaker 1: been around since antiquity, and we don't have a ton 55 00:03:08,919 --> 00:03:12,280 Speaker 1: of evidence to suggest that she was particularly tall. That's 56 00:03:12,320 --> 00:03:14,440 Speaker 1: a description that went along with a lot of Britain's, 57 00:03:14,560 --> 00:03:17,920 Speaker 1: even though the skeletons that exist suggest otherwise. But it 58 00:03:17,960 --> 00:03:20,320 Speaker 1: may just be part of the myth of her being 59 00:03:20,360 --> 00:03:26,320 Speaker 1: this fierce, incredible creature. So Buddhico was queen of the 60 00:03:26,600 --> 00:03:29,360 Speaker 1: icn I, and as we said before, this was a 61 00:03:29,360 --> 00:03:32,520 Speaker 1: tribe that lived in what's now East Anglia. She was 62 00:03:32,600 --> 00:03:35,640 Speaker 1: born to a royal family around the year twenty five, 63 00:03:36,120 --> 00:03:41,520 Speaker 1: and she married a man named Prostatagas. He was definitely 64 00:03:41,640 --> 00:03:44,360 Speaker 1: from the icn I tribe, and it's not totally clear 65 00:03:44,400 --> 00:03:47,200 Speaker 1: whether she was as well, or whether she became part 66 00:03:47,240 --> 00:03:50,160 Speaker 1: of the tribe through her marriage to him. They had 67 00:03:50,200 --> 00:03:56,520 Speaker 1: two daughters and no sons. The icna I were subsistence farmers, potters, 68 00:03:56,560 --> 00:03:59,880 Speaker 1: and metal workers, and they also raised horses. They probably 69 00:04:00,080 --> 00:04:04,160 Speaker 1: lived in roundhouses with that's roofs, without a lot of fortification. 70 00:04:04,600 --> 00:04:06,280 Speaker 1: They were also one of the tribes that offered to 71 00:04:06,360 --> 00:04:09,680 Speaker 1: join an alliance with Caesar during his unsuccessful attempts to 72 00:04:09,720 --> 00:04:13,440 Speaker 1: invade invade Britannia in fifty five and fifty four b 73 00:04:13,600 --> 00:04:17,960 Speaker 1: c e. After Caesar left Britannia, there wasn't really a 74 00:04:17,960 --> 00:04:21,360 Speaker 1: lot of Roman or really any at all Roman activity 75 00:04:21,400 --> 00:04:25,120 Speaker 1: for almost a hundred years, but then Rome invaded Britain 76 00:04:25,160 --> 00:04:29,640 Speaker 1: again in the year forty three under Emperor Claudius. Unlike Caesar, 77 00:04:29,760 --> 00:04:33,599 Speaker 1: Claudius's army successfully fought off the guerilla resistance of the 78 00:04:33,640 --> 00:04:36,839 Speaker 1: tribes in the area, and they built fortresses and stationed 79 00:04:36,920 --> 00:04:40,640 Speaker 1: troops there. The Roman presence grew through much of eastern 80 00:04:40,680 --> 00:04:46,120 Speaker 1: Britannia after Claudius's invasion. The tribes were actually divided over 81 00:04:46,160 --> 00:04:48,480 Speaker 1: whether they were in favor of the Romans presence or 82 00:04:48,520 --> 00:04:52,920 Speaker 1: against it. There wasn't really one collective unified people known 83 00:04:52,960 --> 00:04:56,080 Speaker 1: as quote the Britons uh. They were scattered tribes with 84 00:04:56,120 --> 00:04:58,720 Speaker 1: their own leadership, and they had their own series of 85 00:04:58,720 --> 00:05:03,680 Speaker 1: struggles amongst themselves. The katu Velounie, for example, were nas 86 00:05:03,720 --> 00:05:06,480 Speaker 1: neighbors to the south, and they had an ongoing guerilla 87 00:05:06,520 --> 00:05:11,000 Speaker 1: campaign against the Romans expansion. The Iceni, though, made an 88 00:05:11,000 --> 00:05:14,839 Speaker 1: alliance with the Romans, but four years later the new 89 00:05:14,960 --> 00:05:19,039 Speaker 1: Roman governor, Astorius, who did not really trust the Britons, 90 00:05:19,360 --> 00:05:21,960 Speaker 1: passed a law that made it illegal for the tribes 91 00:05:22,000 --> 00:05:25,080 Speaker 1: to have weapons other than ones that they needed for hunting. 92 00:05:25,800 --> 00:05:28,160 Speaker 1: This did not go over well, and the I c 93 00:05:28,279 --> 00:05:32,120 Speaker 1: n I staged a rebellion. Astorius put down the rebellion 94 00:05:32,240 --> 00:05:35,640 Speaker 1: and removed their leader and Tedios from power and made 95 00:05:35,640 --> 00:05:39,719 Speaker 1: Buddhica's husband prost Otagous a client king. And as a 96 00:05:39,760 --> 00:05:42,679 Speaker 1: client king, he got to keep control of his tribe, 97 00:05:42,720 --> 00:05:45,080 Speaker 1: and the tribe got to keep some level of autonomy 98 00:05:45,080 --> 00:05:48,440 Speaker 1: in managing its own affairs, but they had to stay 99 00:05:48,520 --> 00:05:52,440 Speaker 1: loyal to Rome and pay taxes. In this arrangement, the 100 00:05:52,480 --> 00:05:55,960 Speaker 1: icen I got protection both from Rome and from the 101 00:05:55,960 --> 00:05:59,320 Speaker 1: other tribes as part of the deal, but it came 102 00:05:59,360 --> 00:06:02,839 Speaker 1: with a cost to The taxation was pretty huge. As 103 00:06:02,880 --> 00:06:05,880 Speaker 1: time went on, the tax costs to the icna I 104 00:06:05,960 --> 00:06:09,240 Speaker 1: got higher and higher. The Romans would also collect part 105 00:06:09,279 --> 00:06:11,719 Speaker 1: of the harvest and store elsewhere and then sell it 106 00:06:11,760 --> 00:06:13,720 Speaker 1: back to the ic and I, who had to both 107 00:06:13,800 --> 00:06:17,680 Speaker 1: pay for the goods and for their transport back to them. 108 00:06:17,800 --> 00:06:20,599 Speaker 1: So tensions started to grow a bit as things got 109 00:06:20,640 --> 00:06:23,520 Speaker 1: financially harder and harder. Yeah, not such a good deal 110 00:06:23,600 --> 00:06:26,920 Speaker 1: after all. Well, maybe you're not having to fight off 111 00:06:26,920 --> 00:06:30,400 Speaker 1: your neighbor's constant, that's true. Emperor Claudius, of course, was 112 00:06:30,440 --> 00:06:33,159 Speaker 1: poisoned in the year fifty four and Nero rose to power. 113 00:06:33,880 --> 00:06:36,560 Speaker 1: Uh Nero ordered a temple to Claudius to be built 114 00:06:36,600 --> 00:06:39,839 Speaker 1: in Camulo Dunham, which was the Roman capital in Britain. 115 00:06:40,560 --> 00:06:43,640 Speaker 1: There the British chiefs would be required to worship once 116 00:06:43,640 --> 00:06:45,800 Speaker 1: a year, and they had to pay for the temple 117 00:06:45,839 --> 00:06:48,560 Speaker 1: as well. This says you can imagine, was not a 118 00:06:48,560 --> 00:06:54,760 Speaker 1: popular move. Prositagus's client king relationship with Rome made things tricky. 119 00:06:54,880 --> 00:06:58,359 Speaker 1: After he died in the year sixty he was considered 120 00:06:58,360 --> 00:07:01,039 Speaker 1: to be a Roman citizen and he had taken the 121 00:07:01,080 --> 00:07:03,719 Speaker 1: step of selecting airs for his kingdom, which was a 122 00:07:03,720 --> 00:07:07,480 Speaker 1: pretty Roman idea. He bequeathed half of his kingdom to 123 00:07:07,640 --> 00:07:10,640 Speaker 1: Nero and the rest of his wife and daughters. This 124 00:07:10,720 --> 00:07:14,960 Speaker 1: was a completely unprecedented arrangement, both in British custom and 125 00:07:15,080 --> 00:07:18,520 Speaker 1: in Roman law. Among the Britons, women had a higher 126 00:07:18,600 --> 00:07:22,000 Speaker 1: social standing than they did in Rome. It really wasn't 127 00:07:22,080 --> 00:07:24,520 Speaker 1: unheard of for women to would hear it property or 128 00:07:24,560 --> 00:07:27,400 Speaker 1: to be next in a line of succession. But because 129 00:07:27,440 --> 00:07:31,200 Speaker 1: of his client kings status, the Icna kingdom really belonged 130 00:07:31,280 --> 00:07:35,680 Speaker 1: to Rome and not to Prostagas in Rome's eyes, this 131 00:07:35,960 --> 00:07:38,800 Speaker 1: this land and kingdom that he had bequeathed was not 132 00:07:38,920 --> 00:07:42,600 Speaker 1: actually his to give away. It would really belong to 133 00:07:42,720 --> 00:07:45,640 Speaker 1: Rome until Rome selected a new client king to take 134 00:07:45,640 --> 00:07:49,760 Speaker 1: his place. So, because they held this belief, Rome took 135 00:07:49,800 --> 00:07:54,000 Speaker 1: possession of his entire kingdom. A Roman official arrived and 136 00:07:54,080 --> 00:07:57,600 Speaker 1: took inventory of Buddica's estate because it was now considered 137 00:07:57,720 --> 00:08:02,320 Speaker 1: Roman property after her husband death. The Romans also shamed 138 00:08:02,320 --> 00:08:05,720 Speaker 1: Boudica and her family. The exact method kind of varies 139 00:08:05,720 --> 00:08:09,720 Speaker 1: in the telling. Tacitus writes that Boudica was flogged and 140 00:08:09,760 --> 00:08:12,720 Speaker 1: her daughters were raped, but Dioh writes that it was 141 00:08:12,760 --> 00:08:17,440 Speaker 1: about money. Roman leaders had loaned her husband money, whether 142 00:08:17,520 --> 00:08:20,440 Speaker 1: he really wanted to borrow money or not, and then 143 00:08:20,520 --> 00:08:24,000 Speaker 1: showed up at her home demanding that she immediately repay 144 00:08:24,040 --> 00:08:27,480 Speaker 1: it with interest. At about this time, the Roman governor 145 00:08:27,560 --> 00:08:30,840 Speaker 1: Gaius Swotonis Pollinus was away in Mona, which is now 146 00:08:30,880 --> 00:08:34,280 Speaker 1: considered Anglesey, which is a Druid island off the coast 147 00:08:34,320 --> 00:08:38,000 Speaker 1: of Wales. His goal was to eliminate the Druid religion, 148 00:08:38,640 --> 00:08:43,160 Speaker 1: and this was accomplished or um pursued, among other ways, 149 00:08:43,320 --> 00:08:47,199 Speaker 1: by cutting down the Druid grove, slaughtering druids, and placing 150 00:08:47,200 --> 00:08:50,920 Speaker 1: a garrison on the island. The icin I and other 151 00:08:51,040 --> 00:08:55,440 Speaker 1: tribes heard about this and were outraged, and Boudica was, 152 00:08:55,640 --> 00:08:58,400 Speaker 1: thanks to the Romans treatment of her husband's estate and 153 00:08:58,400 --> 00:09:02,720 Speaker 1: of her family, pretty much primed to fight back against them. 154 00:09:02,840 --> 00:09:06,360 Speaker 1: So really, considering all the other stuff, that had gone before. 155 00:09:06,440 --> 00:09:09,280 Speaker 1: The Romans actions at Mona were the last straw for 156 00:09:09,440 --> 00:09:12,240 Speaker 1: both Boudica and the I C N I, so she 157 00:09:12,360 --> 00:09:17,360 Speaker 1: amassed an army, which reportedly started with about twenty thousand Britons. 158 00:09:17,679 --> 00:09:20,960 Speaker 1: There's twenty thousand included children and elderly people. It was 159 00:09:21,000 --> 00:09:25,880 Speaker 1: basically all people, come on, let's fight the Romans. Boudica 160 00:09:26,000 --> 00:09:28,440 Speaker 1: and her army laid waste to the Roman capital of Britain, 161 00:09:28,520 --> 00:09:32,080 Speaker 1: Camulo Dunham, which is now Cultister, and destroyed parts of 162 00:09:32,400 --> 00:09:35,760 Speaker 1: Londonium which is now London and very Lammium, which is 163 00:09:35,800 --> 00:09:39,640 Speaker 1: now St. Alban's. They started in Camula Dunham, which was 164 00:09:39,679 --> 00:09:43,360 Speaker 1: an existing town that had become heavily Romanized. It had 165 00:09:43,400 --> 00:09:46,200 Speaker 1: gone from being a collection of thatched roofed cottages to 166 00:09:46,440 --> 00:09:50,240 Speaker 1: having a marketplace, a three thousand seat theater, and the 167 00:09:50,280 --> 00:09:52,800 Speaker 1: Temple to Claudius that we mentioned earlier, which was in 168 00:09:52,840 --> 00:09:57,040 Speaker 1: the process of being built. Both Tacitus and Dio write 169 00:09:57,040 --> 00:10:01,160 Speaker 1: about strange happenings leading up to Boudica's attack on Camulo Dunham, 170 00:10:01,200 --> 00:10:05,400 Speaker 1: including a statue falling over and women making frantic prophecies 171 00:10:05,440 --> 00:10:08,840 Speaker 1: of impending doom. It's possible that this was a deliberate 172 00:10:08,880 --> 00:10:11,920 Speaker 1: effort on the part of Boudica's army to so fear 173 00:10:12,000 --> 00:10:15,560 Speaker 1: and superstition in advance of their attack. Although it had 174 00:10:15,600 --> 00:10:19,920 Speaker 1: been built up really significantly under Roman influence, Camuel Dunham 175 00:10:19,960 --> 00:10:23,640 Speaker 1: didn't really have any defenses. The town sent to lundonni 176 00:10:23,679 --> 00:10:28,800 Speaker 1: Um for assistance. Laundunium only sent two hundred men as reinforcements, 177 00:10:28,840 --> 00:10:31,880 Speaker 1: either because they didn't take this army of Britain seriously 178 00:10:32,160 --> 00:10:36,199 Speaker 1: or because they didn't really have men to spare. Budhica's 179 00:10:36,280 --> 00:10:39,600 Speaker 1: army went house to house for about two days, smashing, 180 00:10:39,800 --> 00:10:43,959 Speaker 1: looting and killing. Survivors took refuge in the Temple in Progress, 181 00:10:44,000 --> 00:10:47,880 Speaker 1: which the forces surrounded and demolished and killed everyone inside. 182 00:10:48,480 --> 00:10:52,679 Speaker 1: In the end, Camuel Dunham was entirely destroyed. Boudica's forces 183 00:10:52,720 --> 00:10:54,839 Speaker 1: burned it to the ground, and the fire was so 184 00:10:54,920 --> 00:10:57,680 Speaker 1: hot that some of the clay walls in the archaeological 185 00:10:57,760 --> 00:11:01,640 Speaker 1: record looked like they've been fired to kilm like pottery. 186 00:11:01,880 --> 00:11:04,800 Speaker 1: I mean, there are pottery shards as well, but these 187 00:11:04,840 --> 00:11:08,760 Speaker 1: clay walls had also been fired by the heat became pottery. 188 00:11:09,240 --> 00:11:12,360 Speaker 1: According to written accounts, the death toll there was approximately 189 00:11:12,400 --> 00:11:16,439 Speaker 1: ten thousand people, but the archaeological record is less clear 190 00:11:16,480 --> 00:11:19,240 Speaker 1: on this account. There is plenty of charred earth, and 191 00:11:19,280 --> 00:11:22,040 Speaker 1: there are, as we mentioned, shards of pottery, but there 192 00:11:22,120 --> 00:11:26,480 Speaker 1: really aren't that many bones, suggesting that many actually managed 193 00:11:26,520 --> 00:11:30,319 Speaker 1: to flee before Budhica's army got there. Quintus Petilius Serre 194 00:11:30,400 --> 00:11:33,880 Speaker 1: Alice Caesus Rufus, who was the commander of the ninth Legion, 195 00:11:34,080 --> 00:11:36,960 Speaker 1: heard about what was going on and headed for Camuel 196 00:11:37,040 --> 00:11:42,679 Speaker 1: and Dunham with two thousand legionaries and five hundred cavalry. Boudica, 197 00:11:42,760 --> 00:11:45,960 Speaker 1: whose army just kept growing and gaining new members as 198 00:11:46,000 --> 00:11:49,400 Speaker 1: she moved across the countryside, ambushed the infantry and wiped 199 00:11:49,480 --> 00:11:54,920 Speaker 1: them out. The cavalry survived and retreated. Then Governor Swetonas 200 00:11:55,040 --> 00:11:57,760 Speaker 1: heard of the rebellion and came back from Mona. He 201 00:11:57,800 --> 00:12:00,400 Speaker 1: wrote ahead of his men and got to Londinium before 202 00:12:00,440 --> 00:12:03,680 Speaker 1: Budhica's army did. He decided that it would be impossible 203 00:12:03,720 --> 00:12:06,400 Speaker 1: to defend, especially since Boudhica was going to get there 204 00:12:06,440 --> 00:12:09,120 Speaker 1: before the rest of his men could. The city was 205 00:12:09,240 --> 00:12:13,040 Speaker 1: unwalled and had few defensive vantage points, so he ordered 206 00:12:13,040 --> 00:12:16,720 Speaker 1: for the city to be completely evacuated. When Boudica arrived, 207 00:12:16,840 --> 00:12:20,520 Speaker 1: she and her force slaughtered everyone who remained. Some of 208 00:12:20,559 --> 00:12:23,760 Speaker 1: the writings about this particular slaughter are really glory and 209 00:12:23,800 --> 00:12:27,680 Speaker 1: they involved sexual mutilation of the bodies. But like we 210 00:12:27,760 --> 00:12:30,439 Speaker 1: saw in Camula Dunham, we don't have a lot of 211 00:12:30,520 --> 00:12:34,360 Speaker 1: bodies or bones in the archaeological evidence here, just a 212 00:12:34,440 --> 00:12:38,840 Speaker 1: really thick layer of char. The layer in the archaeological 213 00:12:38,880 --> 00:12:42,400 Speaker 1: record is full of burned daub from buildings and remnants 214 00:12:42,400 --> 00:12:45,720 Speaker 1: of molten glass. It's not as citywide as the Camula 215 00:12:45,800 --> 00:12:49,360 Speaker 1: Dunham burn, and there aren't many objects other than building debris, 216 00:12:49,920 --> 00:12:52,400 Speaker 1: so people probably picked up as much as they could 217 00:12:52,400 --> 00:12:56,199 Speaker 1: carry when they evacuated, or they somehow survived and returned 218 00:12:56,200 --> 00:12:59,960 Speaker 1: and cleaned up. Boudica and her army then turned northwes 219 00:13:00,080 --> 00:13:03,520 Speaker 1: Us two very Lamnium, which, hearing of their approach, did 220 00:13:03,520 --> 00:13:07,640 Speaker 1: a pretty smart job of emptying. The evacuation was pretty thorough, 221 00:13:07,840 --> 00:13:10,319 Speaker 1: so by the time Boudica's force got there to sack 222 00:13:10,360 --> 00:13:13,760 Speaker 1: and burn, most of it was abandoned, so they sacked 223 00:13:13,760 --> 00:13:15,760 Speaker 1: it and burned it, but didn't do a lot of 224 00:13:15,840 --> 00:13:18,439 Speaker 1: murdering that time around. There aren't lots of stories of gore. 225 00:13:19,240 --> 00:13:21,520 Speaker 1: No that was a lot more just burning things down. 226 00:13:22,480 --> 00:13:26,440 Speaker 1: And meanwhile, Swetonius gathered an army of about ten thousand men, 227 00:13:26,640 --> 00:13:28,840 Speaker 1: including some of the force he had used it Mona 228 00:13:29,080 --> 00:13:33,480 Speaker 1: and some reinforcements from other outposts. It's not entirely clear 229 00:13:33,520 --> 00:13:36,120 Speaker 1: where they fought or how big Boudica's army was at 230 00:13:36,200 --> 00:13:39,600 Speaker 1: this point, but according to Dio, she had more than 231 00:13:39,640 --> 00:13:43,520 Speaker 1: two hundred thousand fighters, including the elderly people and children still, 232 00:13:44,640 --> 00:13:48,160 Speaker 1: but modern historians agree that that number is probably pretty inflated. 233 00:13:48,800 --> 00:13:52,120 Speaker 1: In all likelihood, her force did outnumber the Romans considerably, 234 00:13:52,520 --> 00:13:54,839 Speaker 1: but they also weren't a trained army, so what they 235 00:13:54,840 --> 00:13:58,440 Speaker 1: had in numbers, they probably lacked in skill. So exactly 236 00:13:58,440 --> 00:14:01,080 Speaker 1: where this last battle took aces the subject of a 237 00:14:01,080 --> 00:14:03,800 Speaker 1: lot of debate, as one of those things where they 238 00:14:03,840 --> 00:14:06,600 Speaker 1: compare the written descriptions to the landscape and where they 239 00:14:06,600 --> 00:14:10,800 Speaker 1: would have been moving. Um, the Romans chose to a 240 00:14:10,840 --> 00:14:14,440 Speaker 1: spot to fight that gave them huge advantages. The Britons 241 00:14:14,480 --> 00:14:16,800 Speaker 1: were going to have to move through a large field 242 00:14:16,800 --> 00:14:19,880 Speaker 1: where they would be completely exposed, and then into a 243 00:14:19,960 --> 00:14:23,480 Speaker 1: gorge where they basically hit a bottleneck. But so far, 244 00:14:24,040 --> 00:14:27,760 Speaker 1: while trying to match this description to the local area, 245 00:14:27,800 --> 00:14:30,840 Speaker 1: they have not found a definite X marks the spot 246 00:14:31,000 --> 00:14:33,720 Speaker 1: kind of certainty, like the descriptions don't match up with 247 00:14:33,760 --> 00:14:36,760 Speaker 1: the topography of anywhere yet. Yeah, there there's There are 248 00:14:36,840 --> 00:14:42,760 Speaker 1: several contenders, and none of them is in the definite forefront. Allegedly, though, 249 00:14:43,000 --> 00:14:46,360 Speaker 1: Boudica arrived at the battlefield with her daughters in a chariot, 250 00:14:46,720 --> 00:14:50,480 Speaker 1: and Romans wives came out to watch the fighting. Tacitus 251 00:14:50,480 --> 00:14:54,280 Speaker 1: and Dio both record speeches she allegedly delivered, and those 252 00:14:54,320 --> 00:14:57,320 Speaker 1: speeches don't particularly agree with each other, uh, and they're 253 00:14:57,320 --> 00:15:01,240 Speaker 1: pretty heavily Roman in their sensibility. There there's a lot 254 00:15:01,280 --> 00:15:03,320 Speaker 1: of I'm just a woman, and I know that you're 255 00:15:03,360 --> 00:15:05,200 Speaker 1: not used to fighting for a woman, but I'm a 256 00:15:05,200 --> 00:15:07,800 Speaker 1: woman and you're gonna fight for me and it, which 257 00:15:07,880 --> 00:15:11,320 Speaker 1: might not have really been her mindsets right the If 258 00:15:11,360 --> 00:15:13,920 Speaker 1: you read these and you can find them easily online, 259 00:15:14,320 --> 00:15:17,080 Speaker 1: if you read them, it does definitely sound like someone 260 00:15:17,160 --> 00:15:22,440 Speaker 1: describing something for readers of their own culture about a 261 00:15:22,480 --> 00:15:26,400 Speaker 1: different culture that is not theirs. Um. So probably she 262 00:15:26,520 --> 00:15:29,920 Speaker 1: did say something, but not the things that are written down. 263 00:15:30,640 --> 00:15:36,239 Speaker 1: This battle went overwhelmingly in the romans favor. According to Tacitus, 264 00:15:36,280 --> 00:15:40,000 Speaker 1: the Romans killed about eighty thousand Britons while suffering only 265 00:15:40,400 --> 00:15:44,760 Speaker 1: four hundred or so casualties. Then, when the Britons tried 266 00:15:44,800 --> 00:15:48,240 Speaker 1: to retreat, they found their way blocked by the chariots 267 00:15:48,280 --> 00:15:50,920 Speaker 1: that had brought out the Romans wives, which drove up 268 00:15:50,960 --> 00:15:55,520 Speaker 1: the death toll. Budica herself escaped, but she died shortly thereafter, 269 00:15:55,680 --> 00:15:58,960 Speaker 1: and her cause of death remains unclear. It may have 270 00:15:58,960 --> 00:16:02,440 Speaker 1: been suicide by poison, which is how Tacitus tells the story, 271 00:16:03,280 --> 00:16:05,120 Speaker 1: or it may also have been shocked from an injury 272 00:16:05,120 --> 00:16:09,960 Speaker 1: in the battle. Dio says that she actually fell ill. Many, 273 00:16:10,000 --> 00:16:13,240 Speaker 1: but not most, of the Roman deaths during Boudica's uprising 274 00:16:13,280 --> 00:16:19,200 Speaker 1: were civilians. According to Tacitus, seventy thousand civilians died. The 275 00:16:19,320 --> 00:16:22,640 Speaker 1: small remaining community of Ice and I were absorbed under 276 00:16:22,760 --> 00:16:27,200 Speaker 1: Roman control, and Rome said about rebuilding and also quelling 277 00:16:27,240 --> 00:16:32,040 Speaker 1: any further unrest. The rebuilt Camulo Dunham was much more defensible, 278 00:16:32,240 --> 00:16:35,640 Speaker 1: as were the new Roman settlements elsewhere. Len Dunniam was 279 00:16:35,680 --> 00:16:38,600 Speaker 1: rebuilt as well, and eventually, of course, became a much 280 00:16:38,600 --> 00:16:41,640 Speaker 1: bigger and more important city as we know it today. 281 00:16:42,240 --> 00:16:46,320 Speaker 1: Very Lamium was much lower to rebuild, but once rebuilding started, 282 00:16:46,360 --> 00:16:49,800 Speaker 1: it was definitely in the Roman fashion and not in 283 00:16:49,840 --> 00:16:53,280 Speaker 1: the style of the Britons, and Rome gradually moved into 284 00:16:53,360 --> 00:16:55,560 Speaker 1: more and more of Britain and continued to do so 285 00:16:55,680 --> 00:16:58,640 Speaker 1: right up until the time when the empire fell. This 286 00:16:58,720 --> 00:17:01,040 Speaker 1: is one of those cases where they learned from the 287 00:17:01,080 --> 00:17:05,919 Speaker 1: experience of having been essentially routed by an army of 288 00:17:06,840 --> 00:17:10,359 Speaker 1: various assorted people from around the countryside, and then the 289 00:17:10,359 --> 00:17:14,080 Speaker 1: rebuilding took many steps to make sure that things would 290 00:17:14,080 --> 00:17:18,800 Speaker 1: be better yes in the future. So yes, that is 291 00:17:18,800 --> 00:17:22,160 Speaker 1: the story of Boudica. I actually did find one book 292 00:17:22,240 --> 00:17:24,199 Speaker 1: that had some discussion in it about whether she was 293 00:17:24,240 --> 00:17:28,680 Speaker 1: a real person at all or whether this is sort 294 00:17:28,680 --> 00:17:32,119 Speaker 1: of a story that conveniently has a person that we 295 00:17:32,160 --> 00:17:35,800 Speaker 1: don't really know existed. And the general consensus was, yeah, 296 00:17:35,840 --> 00:17:38,240 Speaker 1: we think she's a real person. I don't know if 297 00:17:38,240 --> 00:17:41,320 Speaker 1: her name was really Boudica or not. That's sort of 298 00:17:41,320 --> 00:17:45,400 Speaker 1: a title maybe, sort of like calling someone Victoria who 299 00:17:45,440 --> 00:17:50,320 Speaker 1: was not actually named Victoria. Um, but yeah, that not 300 00:17:50,440 --> 00:17:55,560 Speaker 1: a lot of definite. There's it's nebulous. Still, Yeah, it's nebulous. 301 00:17:55,600 --> 00:17:58,879 Speaker 1: Some of the particulars of this, they're very nebulous, Like, uh, 302 00:17:58,960 --> 00:18:00,919 Speaker 1: did lots of people Sir five or where they may 303 00:18:00,960 --> 00:18:04,239 Speaker 1: be buried elsewhere. Then people come back and get all 304 00:18:04,240 --> 00:18:06,959 Speaker 1: their stuff or had they taken it all away before 305 00:18:07,040 --> 00:18:10,600 Speaker 1: the looting and sacking happened. So the records we have 306 00:18:10,720 --> 00:18:13,280 Speaker 1: still leave a lot of questions and answered yes, and 307 00:18:13,840 --> 00:18:18,440 Speaker 1: considering how long ago this happened, that's not super surprising. 308 00:18:19,040 --> 00:18:22,439 Speaker 1: And considering how there was not a lot of written 309 00:18:22,480 --> 00:18:27,240 Speaker 1: record from like from the Britton's um pretty much the 310 00:18:27,240 --> 00:18:30,760 Speaker 1: people who were literate in that culture at the time 311 00:18:30,760 --> 00:18:33,959 Speaker 1: where the druids and that was not really focused on 312 00:18:34,600 --> 00:18:38,000 Speaker 1: like keeping daily history of what was going on. We 313 00:18:38,080 --> 00:18:41,480 Speaker 1: definitely have a way more one sided account. Do you 314 00:18:41,560 --> 00:18:44,120 Speaker 1: also have a spot of listener mail us? I knew 315 00:18:44,400 --> 00:18:48,560 Speaker 1: and I have two different pieces of listener mail spots plural. Yes. 316 00:18:49,080 --> 00:18:51,720 Speaker 1: They are both about our episodes on the Irish Potato 317 00:18:51,760 --> 00:18:54,000 Speaker 1: Maamin and they have some similar themes. I want to 318 00:18:54,000 --> 00:18:57,200 Speaker 1: read both of them. The first came to our inbox 319 00:18:57,280 --> 00:19:00,239 Speaker 1: from Shannon. Shannon says, thank you so much for your 320 00:19:00,280 --> 00:19:02,680 Speaker 1: podcasts on the Irish potato Famine. Was one of the 321 00:19:02,720 --> 00:19:06,600 Speaker 1: few times I've heard the story in such depth outside 322 00:19:06,600 --> 00:19:08,879 Speaker 1: of Erin. A few things I'd like to share with 323 00:19:08,920 --> 00:19:11,960 Speaker 1: you one. In Dublin, you can hear stories of how 324 00:19:11,960 --> 00:19:14,800 Speaker 1: women would fake being prostitutes to be arrested and sent 325 00:19:14,880 --> 00:19:18,360 Speaker 1: to jail to get food. There is a prison that's 326 00:19:18,400 --> 00:19:20,560 Speaker 1: now a museum, and the tour guide I had was 327 00:19:20,600 --> 00:19:23,520 Speaker 1: of the opinion that it was an economic genocide since 328 00:19:23,560 --> 00:19:25,600 Speaker 1: there was double the amount of food being grown in 329 00:19:25,640 --> 00:19:28,280 Speaker 1: Ireland that was needed to defeat everyone, but it was 330 00:19:28,320 --> 00:19:32,560 Speaker 1: still being taxed out of the country. Two. My great 331 00:19:32,600 --> 00:19:36,159 Speaker 1: grandmother was a child of Irish immigrants who went to Liverpool. 332 00:19:36,440 --> 00:19:38,600 Speaker 1: My grandmother would always say, and she says, this is 333 00:19:38,760 --> 00:19:41,760 Speaker 1: Irish and I'm not let's try. I'm afraid I would neglet. 334 00:19:42,600 --> 00:19:44,560 Speaker 1: She had a phrase she would say when she ran errands, 335 00:19:44,600 --> 00:19:46,840 Speaker 1: which means off to sell a share, which was how 336 00:19:46,840 --> 00:19:49,280 Speaker 1: they would pay for food. By the way, they came 337 00:19:49,320 --> 00:19:52,080 Speaker 1: over due to the rebellion. Would love this as a podcast. 338 00:19:52,960 --> 00:19:57,160 Speaker 1: Many Irish names were americanized a point three. My great grandfather, 339 00:19:57,200 --> 00:19:59,880 Speaker 1: when arriving in Boston, changed his last name from Oli 340 00:20:00,359 --> 00:20:02,359 Speaker 1: to Leary, thinking it would help him get a job. 341 00:20:02,920 --> 00:20:05,320 Speaker 1: When it didn't, he just never changed it back. And 342 00:20:05,400 --> 00:20:07,680 Speaker 1: my grandfather didn't know that his last name wasn't Larry 343 00:20:07,720 --> 00:20:10,680 Speaker 1: until he was drafted into the army and number four. 344 00:20:10,760 --> 00:20:15,080 Speaker 1: The workhouses continued. Many became quote Magdalene laundries and are 345 00:20:15,080 --> 00:20:17,919 Speaker 1: a massive black mark on the Irish government for not 346 00:20:17,960 --> 00:20:22,440 Speaker 1: stopping them after becoming independent. Also a great podcast topic. 347 00:20:23,080 --> 00:20:26,040 Speaker 1: So that was from Shannon. Our other note is from 348 00:20:26,080 --> 00:20:31,000 Speaker 1: also someone named Shannon, but it's from Facebook. This Shannon says, 349 00:20:31,080 --> 00:20:34,119 Speaker 1: just finished listening to your Irish Famine episode. I am 350 00:20:34,160 --> 00:20:37,960 Speaker 1: an American expat now living in Dublin, Ireland, with a 351 00:20:38,040 --> 00:20:40,919 Speaker 1: master's degree in Irish history. I'm very familiar with the famine. 352 00:20:41,080 --> 00:20:44,240 Speaker 1: I want to congratulate on a very good podcast about 353 00:20:44,240 --> 00:20:48,280 Speaker 1: a very complicated issue. One interesting story concerning the famine. 354 00:20:48,680 --> 00:20:51,240 Speaker 1: In the latter years of the famine, the jails throughout 355 00:20:51,280 --> 00:20:54,960 Speaker 1: Ireland were extremely overcrowded. There were two very good reasons 356 00:20:54,960 --> 00:20:57,880 Speaker 1: for this. First, a vagrancy law was passed so people 357 00:20:57,920 --> 00:21:01,000 Speaker 1: who begged could be put in jail. Second, people were 358 00:21:01,040 --> 00:21:04,120 Speaker 1: so desperate for food that they would purposefully commit crimes 359 00:21:04,160 --> 00:21:06,760 Speaker 1: to be put in jail because once there they would 360 00:21:06,760 --> 00:21:10,359 Speaker 1: get two meals a day. For example, kill Mayhem Jail 361 00:21:10,520 --> 00:21:14,000 Speaker 1: in Dublin had over nine thousand prisoners during eighteen fifty 362 00:21:14,080 --> 00:21:18,240 Speaker 1: and a jail that had less than two dred cells. Yeah, 363 00:21:18,600 --> 00:21:20,800 Speaker 1: disease was rampant in the jail, but it was better 364 00:21:20,880 --> 00:21:23,560 Speaker 1: than being on the outside. Thanks again for the podcast. 365 00:21:23,600 --> 00:21:26,399 Speaker 1: I hope to hear more about Irish Street in the future, 366 00:21:26,960 --> 00:21:30,439 Speaker 1: So thank you Shannon and Shannon. We really did not 367 00:21:30,600 --> 00:21:33,040 Speaker 1: get into. That's what it was. One of those stories 368 00:21:33,040 --> 00:21:35,520 Speaker 1: that just kept getting more and more awful. Well, and 369 00:21:35,640 --> 00:21:37,480 Speaker 1: there are a lot of layers to it, many many 370 00:21:37,480 --> 00:21:39,400 Speaker 1: awful layers. And one of the layers that we did 371 00:21:39,400 --> 00:21:43,440 Speaker 1: not get into was the layer of people deliberately committing 372 00:21:43,440 --> 00:21:46,520 Speaker 1: crimes just in order to get a meal, or pretending 373 00:21:46,680 --> 00:21:49,639 Speaker 1: to commit crimes in order to get a meal. There 374 00:21:49,720 --> 00:21:52,040 Speaker 1: was a lot of people went to great links just 375 00:21:52,080 --> 00:21:54,400 Speaker 1: to try to get footed because there was not really 376 00:21:54,400 --> 00:21:58,879 Speaker 1: another option. We're getting desperate times, desperate measures extremely so 377 00:21:59,680 --> 00:22:01,600 Speaker 1: if you would like to write to us about this 378 00:22:01,760 --> 00:22:04,600 Speaker 1: or any other episode, you can at History Podcast at 379 00:22:04,600 --> 00:22:08,400 Speaker 1: Discovery dot com. We're also on Facebook at Facebook dot com, 380 00:22:08,440 --> 00:22:11,480 Speaker 1: slash history glass Stuff, and on Twitter at mist in History. 381 00:22:11,920 --> 00:22:14,120 Speaker 1: You can find our tumbler at mist in History dot 382 00:22:14,119 --> 00:22:17,719 Speaker 1: tumbler dot com, and we are on Pinterest. For a 383 00:22:17,720 --> 00:22:20,080 Speaker 1: little more about what we've talked about today. 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