1 00:00:01,480 --> 00:00:05,320 Speaker 1: All right, agreg when are illegal drugs good for your 2 00:00:05,320 --> 00:00:05,800 Speaker 1: mental health? 3 00:00:05,800 --> 00:00:08,200 Speaker 2: Thought we already talked about this, We might have, but 4 00:00:08,320 --> 00:00:09,520 Speaker 2: we got more to talk about. 5 00:00:10,440 --> 00:00:12,880 Speaker 3: Some heartbreaking news for Melissa Ethridge. 6 00:00:12,960 --> 00:00:16,640 Speaker 4: The singer announced yesterday that her son, Beckett Ceipher, has died. 7 00:00:17,720 --> 00:00:21,680 Speaker 4: My son was given vicodin and from there he just 8 00:00:21,720 --> 00:00:24,680 Speaker 4: never got off of it. He went from vicodin to 9 00:00:25,520 --> 00:00:28,640 Speaker 4: heroin to the last few days it was spentinels. 10 00:00:28,880 --> 00:00:31,960 Speaker 5: On Twitter, singer Melissa Ethridge wrote in part I joined 11 00:00:31,960 --> 00:00:35,080 Speaker 5: the hundreds of thousands of families who have lost loved ones. 12 00:00:34,840 --> 00:00:35,920 Speaker 2: To opioid addiction. 13 00:00:36,320 --> 00:00:38,800 Speaker 4: He will be missed by those who loved him. 14 00:00:39,320 --> 00:00:42,600 Speaker 5: How do you turn that sadness from the loss of 15 00:00:42,680 --> 00:00:44,879 Speaker 5: backet into the great work that you're doing right now? 16 00:00:45,000 --> 00:00:48,400 Speaker 4: The Etharch Foundation was set up to help people who 17 00:00:48,440 --> 00:00:53,239 Speaker 4: are understanding how much psychedelics can do for pain and 18 00:00:53,320 --> 00:00:56,640 Speaker 4: opioid use disorders. You know, there is no other compound 19 00:00:56,680 --> 00:01:00,720 Speaker 4: that will stop somebody from physically withdrawing on yet. We 20 00:01:00,920 --> 00:01:04,080 Speaker 4: have been working with a group out of Africa that 21 00:01:04,160 --> 00:01:06,200 Speaker 4: has used the Eboga root. 22 00:01:06,480 --> 00:01:07,640 Speaker 3: But you make eyebigam. 23 00:01:07,800 --> 00:01:11,280 Speaker 6: If successful, this mysterious compound could have the power to 24 00:01:11,319 --> 00:01:16,000 Speaker 6: heal millions while seriously disrupting the multimillion dollar opoid. 25 00:01:15,560 --> 00:01:18,520 Speaker 4: Market and the results that we've gotten back that not 26 00:01:18,680 --> 00:01:22,559 Speaker 4: only are these users of fifteen twenty years completely off 27 00:01:22,800 --> 00:01:27,080 Speaker 4: opioids and heroin, but they just turn their life completely around. 28 00:01:33,680 --> 00:01:36,920 Speaker 2: I'm Greg Lad, I'm Clayton, England and this is the 29 00:01:36,959 --> 00:01:41,000 Speaker 2: War on Drugs. Welcome, Welcome, Welcome. 30 00:01:41,080 --> 00:01:46,000 Speaker 1: We are back with another War on Drugs podcast. 31 00:01:46,200 --> 00:01:48,600 Speaker 6: You thought you got rid of us, man, Nope, you 32 00:01:48,680 --> 00:01:49,760 Speaker 6: can't get rid of us. 33 00:01:49,760 --> 00:01:49,960 Speaker 2: Man. 34 00:01:50,000 --> 00:01:52,360 Speaker 6: We like drugs, just like the drug warm where ain't 35 00:01:52,400 --> 00:01:52,840 Speaker 6: going anywhere. 36 00:01:53,040 --> 00:01:56,720 Speaker 1: Just like drugs, We're not going anywhere, and we're slightly addictive, 37 00:01:57,120 --> 00:01:59,560 Speaker 1: so you know, we just give it people. 38 00:01:59,360 --> 00:02:00,000 Speaker 2: They fix man. 39 00:02:00,480 --> 00:02:02,520 Speaker 6: Yeah, no, absolutely, How you. 40 00:02:02,520 --> 00:02:04,680 Speaker 2: Been man, it's good. We in the summer, you know. 41 00:02:04,840 --> 00:02:06,840 Speaker 6: Yeah, no, I've been good man. Yeah, how you been. 42 00:02:07,160 --> 00:02:10,320 Speaker 2: I'm great, man, I'm great. Son just had a birthday. 43 00:02:11,280 --> 00:02:13,800 Speaker 1: Yeah, we didn't have the big party this time, so 44 00:02:13,840 --> 00:02:14,760 Speaker 1: that was a relief. 45 00:02:15,240 --> 00:02:15,920 Speaker 2: Any though. 46 00:02:16,200 --> 00:02:18,919 Speaker 1: The case oh two, he's two, so it's too fast, 47 00:02:18,960 --> 00:02:23,200 Speaker 1: too furious, of course, yeah, he's too fast, and he's 48 00:02:23,240 --> 00:02:24,160 Speaker 1: often very. 49 00:02:23,919 --> 00:02:27,760 Speaker 2: Furious about things. My mom made it. 50 00:02:27,880 --> 00:02:31,000 Speaker 1: My mom made the race car cake, like she every 51 00:02:31,080 --> 00:02:33,200 Speaker 1: year she's stepping up on her cake. So this one 52 00:02:33,320 --> 00:02:35,840 Speaker 1: was like she made little race cars that were edible 53 00:02:35,919 --> 00:02:36,800 Speaker 1: and all types of stuff. 54 00:02:36,840 --> 00:02:39,080 Speaker 2: She went crazy, Oh wow, yeah. 55 00:02:38,960 --> 00:02:41,160 Speaker 6: All right, I need to bring your mom over for Yeah, 56 00:02:41,200 --> 00:02:43,119 Speaker 6: maybe I'll do there. 57 00:02:43,160 --> 00:02:44,360 Speaker 2: You go, I'm telling you. 58 00:02:44,280 --> 00:02:47,400 Speaker 6: The Big three six coming out. 59 00:02:48,080 --> 00:02:48,520 Speaker 2: Awesome. 60 00:02:48,720 --> 00:02:50,399 Speaker 6: Well we'll get into all that later. Yeah. 61 00:02:50,400 --> 00:02:52,440 Speaker 5: Well we could talk birthdays all day. But yeah, even 62 00:02:52,480 --> 00:02:55,560 Speaker 5: a very special occasion. I was getting leiss Athraage to 63 00:02:55,600 --> 00:02:59,240 Speaker 5: come on and talk plant based medicine. And I mean, Clayton, 64 00:02:59,360 --> 00:03:01,600 Speaker 5: we already did the interview, recorded it. That was just 65 00:03:01,600 --> 00:03:04,560 Speaker 5: an amazing conversation and talking to her one of someone 66 00:03:04,600 --> 00:03:06,640 Speaker 5: that you know, we all kind of grew up with 67 00:03:06,680 --> 00:03:07,840 Speaker 5: listen radio. 68 00:03:07,680 --> 00:03:09,959 Speaker 1: Especially if you're from that MTV era, if you that 69 00:03:10,160 --> 00:03:13,240 Speaker 1: MTV generation, you know those songs, you know. 70 00:03:13,240 --> 00:03:15,480 Speaker 2: The videos to go with them. So oh yeah. 71 00:03:15,520 --> 00:03:18,400 Speaker 1: When they sent the email like would you be interested 72 00:03:18,440 --> 00:03:24,880 Speaker 1: in interviewing Melissa Ethridge about hallucinogens and plant based medicine? Yes, man, Yes, 73 00:03:25,160 --> 00:03:28,200 Speaker 1: I didn't even read the other parts. Like some things 74 00:03:28,240 --> 00:03:30,960 Speaker 1: you just asked me when can I do them? You 75 00:03:31,000 --> 00:03:32,800 Speaker 1: don't have to ask me if I want to do them. 76 00:03:32,960 --> 00:03:35,880 Speaker 5: But you know, she's so raw and honest about everything. 77 00:03:35,920 --> 00:03:38,000 Speaker 5: You know, she she had breast cancer and how plant 78 00:03:38,040 --> 00:03:40,680 Speaker 5: based medicines helped her through that, and then she started 79 00:03:40,680 --> 00:03:44,000 Speaker 5: the Melissa Athers Foundation, you know, really spurred from you know, 80 00:03:44,040 --> 00:03:46,600 Speaker 5: the tragic passing of her Sun Beckett, who died of 81 00:03:46,600 --> 00:03:49,840 Speaker 5: an opioid overdose. And you know, the whole crux of 82 00:03:49,880 --> 00:03:53,240 Speaker 5: the foundation is to research and fund studies on a 83 00:03:53,240 --> 00:03:55,200 Speaker 5: lot of plant based medicines. I've been able to help 84 00:03:55,640 --> 00:04:00,680 Speaker 5: treat depression, PTSD, opioated withdraw addiction, and so we continue 85 00:04:00,720 --> 00:04:02,720 Speaker 5: to kind of push that down because the War on 86 00:04:02,800 --> 00:04:05,400 Speaker 5: Drugs prohibits a lot of this funding, this research and 87 00:04:05,440 --> 00:04:08,000 Speaker 5: actually criminalizes doing some of this stuff. And so the 88 00:04:08,040 --> 00:04:11,080 Speaker 5: fact that we're slowly starting to see shreds of research 89 00:04:11,080 --> 00:04:13,760 Speaker 5: and funding come back again made possible by you know, 90 00:04:13,840 --> 00:04:16,360 Speaker 5: foundations like hers, I think it's it's pretty remarkable. 91 00:04:16,400 --> 00:04:18,080 Speaker 6: So it was great to talk to her about. 92 00:04:17,839 --> 00:04:18,120 Speaker 2: All of this. 93 00:04:18,360 --> 00:04:20,680 Speaker 1: Yeah, man, And it's just one of those things where 94 00:04:21,279 --> 00:04:23,800 Speaker 1: we don't know what we don't know, and there's so 95 00:04:24,080 --> 00:04:27,559 Speaker 1: much research that hasn't been done, and everything is pushed 96 00:04:27,560 --> 00:04:30,400 Speaker 1: to the pharmaceutical side, and we know the SADE effects, 97 00:04:30,440 --> 00:04:33,799 Speaker 1: but I really think like just as a whole society 98 00:04:33,839 --> 00:04:34,920 Speaker 1: got to take a step back. 99 00:04:35,040 --> 00:04:35,360 Speaker 2: That's it. 100 00:04:35,480 --> 00:04:37,600 Speaker 5: Just let let these have a seat of the table 101 00:04:37,760 --> 00:04:40,000 Speaker 5: and let them, you know, work on their own parts. 102 00:04:40,040 --> 00:04:40,520 Speaker 6: Like that's all. 103 00:04:40,680 --> 00:04:44,840 Speaker 1: Yeah, let the sciences science, let them science man like. 104 00:04:45,000 --> 00:04:46,600 Speaker 2: Yeah. 105 00:04:46,640 --> 00:04:49,520 Speaker 5: So again, this was it was just an amazing conversation. 106 00:04:49,800 --> 00:04:52,479 Speaker 5: It's an amazing career, amazing life. And she's so open 107 00:04:52,520 --> 00:04:56,600 Speaker 5: and raw and honest about it. Yeah, I can't recommend 108 00:04:56,640 --> 00:04:58,960 Speaker 5: listening to my podcast that I need you to listen to. 109 00:04:59,480 --> 00:05:02,599 Speaker 2: Yeah about that. Let's get too, Let's get into it. 110 00:05:06,400 --> 00:05:09,480 Speaker 1: Hey, Melissa, thank you so much for coming here today 111 00:05:09,520 --> 00:05:13,800 Speaker 1: with us, for being on the War on Drugs podcast 112 00:05:13,839 --> 00:05:14,320 Speaker 1: with me and. 113 00:05:14,279 --> 00:05:15,560 Speaker 2: Greg my pleasure. 114 00:05:15,640 --> 00:05:16,000 Speaker 3: Thank you. 115 00:05:16,200 --> 00:05:17,400 Speaker 2: We really appreciate it. 116 00:05:17,440 --> 00:05:20,919 Speaker 1: We love what you're doing, and we just kind of 117 00:05:20,920 --> 00:05:22,600 Speaker 1: want to get into it. I mean, I'm not sure 118 00:05:22,600 --> 00:05:26,479 Speaker 1: the best way, but give us your personal history with 119 00:05:26,520 --> 00:05:29,200 Speaker 1: the War on Drugs. That is our podcast, so we 120 00:05:29,279 --> 00:05:32,400 Speaker 1: know everybody has their own personal battle. 121 00:05:32,520 --> 00:05:35,680 Speaker 4: So you know, I grew up in the Midwest in 122 00:05:35,720 --> 00:05:39,000 Speaker 4: the sixties and seventies, and I had a big dream 123 00:05:39,040 --> 00:05:42,720 Speaker 4: of becoming a rock star. And in the seventies and 124 00:05:42,760 --> 00:05:45,760 Speaker 4: the early eighties, I saw a lot of my heroes 125 00:05:45,800 --> 00:05:48,160 Speaker 4: and stuff have trouble with drugs, and I saw a 126 00:05:48,200 --> 00:05:50,000 Speaker 4: lot of what the world was kind of going through, 127 00:05:50,040 --> 00:05:53,600 Speaker 4: and so I chose a very I wasn't against anything, 128 00:05:53,640 --> 00:05:57,080 Speaker 4: I just wasn't participating it. And I was more concerned 129 00:05:57,080 --> 00:06:00,880 Speaker 4: with making my career go than sort of losing myself 130 00:06:01,040 --> 00:06:04,560 Speaker 4: in something that was going to numb me out. So I, 131 00:06:04,680 --> 00:06:07,120 Speaker 4: you know, put that aside, and I didn't drink. I 132 00:06:07,200 --> 00:06:10,119 Speaker 4: was a very strange rock star in that I didn't 133 00:06:10,760 --> 00:06:13,760 Speaker 4: participate in any of that, you know. But I would recreationally, 134 00:06:13,839 --> 00:06:16,680 Speaker 4: you know, have fun with my friends with cannabis and 135 00:06:16,760 --> 00:06:21,599 Speaker 4: psilocybin and and but you know, not a lot. And 136 00:06:21,640 --> 00:06:23,400 Speaker 4: I never you know, got it myself. It was always 137 00:06:23,480 --> 00:06:26,400 Speaker 4: just you know, somebody else. Then in two thousand and 138 00:06:26,400 --> 00:06:32,320 Speaker 4: and four, I got breast cancer and started using cannabis 139 00:06:32,360 --> 00:06:37,440 Speaker 4: instead of all of the gosh they handed me like 140 00:06:37,640 --> 00:06:40,640 Speaker 4: for chemotherapy. They hand me like five, you know, prescription drugs, 141 00:06:40,640 --> 00:06:43,120 Speaker 4: and I was like, you know, and then the the 142 00:06:43,200 --> 00:06:46,000 Speaker 4: drugs that help with the side effects of those drugs, 143 00:06:46,040 --> 00:06:48,479 Speaker 4: and and I was like no, no, no, no, no, no, no, wait, 144 00:06:48,680 --> 00:06:50,599 Speaker 4: what are you doing? And and it was it was 145 00:06:50,680 --> 00:06:54,760 Speaker 4: medicinal in California cannabis was even though it was very 146 00:06:54,760 --> 00:06:56,600 Speaker 4: hard to get, you know, it's like they were still 147 00:06:56,640 --> 00:06:59,880 Speaker 4: busting everybody back then. But I was able to, you know, 148 00:07:00,120 --> 00:07:02,200 Speaker 4: find the roadie that knew, the roadie that could get 149 00:07:02,200 --> 00:07:05,760 Speaker 4: me some cannabis. And I finally used it every day 150 00:07:05,800 --> 00:07:08,640 Speaker 4: for medicinal purposes, and I'd never done that before. 151 00:07:08,760 --> 00:07:10,720 Speaker 3: Was it was to feel normal. 152 00:07:11,480 --> 00:07:13,880 Speaker 4: And after you know, three months of using it and 153 00:07:13,920 --> 00:07:15,960 Speaker 4: helping me so much, keeping me out of the hospital, 154 00:07:16,560 --> 00:07:20,760 Speaker 4: giving me an appetite, helping with depression and pain and 155 00:07:20,800 --> 00:07:24,560 Speaker 4: all these things that it was so good for, I thought, 156 00:07:24,600 --> 00:07:28,000 Speaker 4: I want everyone to at least know this information, and 157 00:07:28,560 --> 00:07:30,640 Speaker 4: hopefully they could if they wanted to. 158 00:07:30,680 --> 00:07:32,960 Speaker 3: Everyone should have a choice to use this. 159 00:07:33,080 --> 00:07:35,560 Speaker 4: And that's what really kind of threw me into the 160 00:07:35,600 --> 00:07:41,080 Speaker 4: more political space of plant medicine and quickly realizing that 161 00:07:41,120 --> 00:07:47,480 Speaker 4: there's a big difference between pharmaceuticals and plant medicine that's 162 00:07:47,520 --> 00:07:50,040 Speaker 4: play around for thousands and thousands of years. You know, 163 00:07:50,160 --> 00:07:52,960 Speaker 4: it's just huge, and you can't you cannot lump them together. 164 00:07:53,600 --> 00:07:57,400 Speaker 4: So I really took a journey with that and it 165 00:07:57,520 --> 00:07:59,600 Speaker 4: led me to ayahuasca. It led me to my own 166 00:07:59,640 --> 00:08:03,280 Speaker 4: soul's searching. It led me to changing my life and 167 00:08:03,640 --> 00:08:07,880 Speaker 4: spiritual awakening and all these things that it led me to, 168 00:08:07,960 --> 00:08:13,640 Speaker 4: which helped when my son who was a teenager sixteen, 169 00:08:13,720 --> 00:08:18,160 Speaker 4: seventeen years old and wanted to be a professional snowboarder 170 00:08:18,200 --> 00:08:20,480 Speaker 4: and was trying out with an Aspen snowboard team and 171 00:08:20,480 --> 00:08:23,720 Speaker 4: he broke his ankle, It broke his dreams, and it 172 00:08:23,800 --> 00:08:30,200 Speaker 4: just broke him and he was given vicodint and from 173 00:08:30,200 --> 00:08:32,320 Speaker 4: there he just never got off of it. He went 174 00:08:32,360 --> 00:08:38,600 Speaker 4: from vicodin too heroin to the last few days it 175 00:08:38,640 --> 00:08:44,240 Speaker 4: was fentanyl. And so I've lost my son to the pharmaceuticals, 176 00:08:45,120 --> 00:08:47,600 Speaker 4: and I have really then put so much of my 177 00:08:47,760 --> 00:08:55,040 Speaker 4: own energy and effort into having the world understand and 178 00:08:55,080 --> 00:08:57,800 Speaker 4: bringing the research and data that needs to be collected 179 00:08:58,320 --> 00:09:01,160 Speaker 4: to legalize plant medicine and that won't kill us. 180 00:09:01,559 --> 00:09:04,160 Speaker 5: Well, it's so sad to hear about Beckett and his story, 181 00:09:04,280 --> 00:09:06,040 Speaker 5: but I want to ask, so you you start the 182 00:09:06,040 --> 00:09:09,040 Speaker 5: Etherrets Foundation, really out this trauma, and how do you 183 00:09:09,160 --> 00:09:14,160 Speaker 5: turn that frustration sadness from the loss of Beckett into 184 00:09:14,240 --> 00:09:15,920 Speaker 5: you know, the great work that you're doing right now? 185 00:09:16,040 --> 00:09:18,080 Speaker 5: Can you talk a little about what the Ethers Foundation. 186 00:09:17,840 --> 00:09:20,960 Speaker 3: Does right after he died, I was very frustrated. 187 00:09:21,000 --> 00:09:27,920 Speaker 4: I was sad. And a family when someone is struggling 188 00:09:28,040 --> 00:09:32,480 Speaker 4: with opoid use disorder and it's there's so much shame 189 00:09:32,600 --> 00:09:37,800 Speaker 4: and guilt and stuff that the family doesn't know what 190 00:09:37,920 --> 00:09:39,880 Speaker 4: to do with. You don't know whether to you know, 191 00:09:40,000 --> 00:09:43,320 Speaker 4: give him money, give him help, or take everything away 192 00:09:43,600 --> 00:09:45,600 Speaker 4: or you know what, what are you supposed to do? 193 00:09:45,679 --> 00:09:47,520 Speaker 4: And no matter what you do, it's not right because 194 00:09:48,120 --> 00:09:50,280 Speaker 4: they have to come out of it themselves. 195 00:09:50,280 --> 00:09:51,440 Speaker 3: That's that's the only way. 196 00:09:51,600 --> 00:09:55,000 Speaker 4: And so towards the last couple of weeks of his life, 197 00:09:55,880 --> 00:09:58,520 Speaker 4: I knew that it was a very good possibility that 198 00:09:58,559 --> 00:10:02,760 Speaker 4: he would not survive this, and I was prepared in 199 00:10:02,800 --> 00:10:06,840 Speaker 4: a way. You know, of course, you never are fully 200 00:10:06,880 --> 00:10:09,600 Speaker 4: prepared for that when it happens. But so when he 201 00:10:09,600 --> 00:10:13,160 Speaker 4: passed away, I thought, I've got to do something positive. 202 00:10:13,640 --> 00:10:16,800 Speaker 4: I don't want to be against things. I believe that 203 00:10:17,320 --> 00:10:22,160 Speaker 4: there's more power in being for something. And I really 204 00:10:22,200 --> 00:10:26,920 Speaker 4: believe that these plant medicines, these entheogens and psychedelics, they 205 00:10:27,080 --> 00:10:31,320 Speaker 4: can if a person is open to it, if they 206 00:10:31,360 --> 00:10:32,679 Speaker 4: want to walk that path. 207 00:10:33,000 --> 00:10:33,400 Speaker 3: It's not. 208 00:10:35,160 --> 00:10:39,080 Speaker 4: I don't think psychedelics are like here, try this and 209 00:10:39,120 --> 00:10:43,240 Speaker 4: your life will totally change. It might if you are 210 00:10:43,400 --> 00:10:45,200 Speaker 4: open to it, but a lot of it has to 211 00:10:45,240 --> 00:10:49,720 Speaker 4: do with the person. So the Etharge Foundation was set 212 00:10:49,800 --> 00:10:54,880 Speaker 4: up to help people who are understanding how much psychedelics 213 00:10:54,920 --> 00:10:59,440 Speaker 4: can do for pain and opioid use disorder and generally 214 00:10:59,559 --> 00:11:03,720 Speaker 4: just for the well being of human beings. And yet 215 00:11:03,760 --> 00:11:08,200 Speaker 4: they're thrown into the Schedule one category where there's no 216 00:11:08,320 --> 00:11:12,640 Speaker 4: medicinal value and we can't even do any research on it, 217 00:11:12,720 --> 00:11:14,960 Speaker 4: which is like, you know, you can't get credit unless 218 00:11:14,960 --> 00:11:17,679 Speaker 4: you have credit. You know, it's stuck in this this 219 00:11:17,800 --> 00:11:19,800 Speaker 4: saying well, no, well we don't have any research. So 220 00:11:20,800 --> 00:11:23,400 Speaker 4: I said, well, we need to find the research. We 221 00:11:23,480 --> 00:11:25,520 Speaker 4: need to go do this, and so we have been. 222 00:11:26,040 --> 00:11:30,199 Speaker 4: We actually are the only foundation that is specifically focused 223 00:11:30,280 --> 00:11:34,439 Speaker 4: on opioid use disorder, and the people that are running 224 00:11:34,480 --> 00:11:39,040 Speaker 4: these trials are just just you know, frontline miracle workers 225 00:11:39,120 --> 00:11:41,560 Speaker 4: and we're getting amazing, amazing. 226 00:11:41,640 --> 00:11:44,120 Speaker 5: Yeah, it just does almost sound like a trap, like, yeah, hey, 227 00:11:44,160 --> 00:11:46,600 Speaker 5: are you using illicit drugs? Come on by to this 228 00:11:47,320 --> 00:11:50,679 Speaker 5: discovery exactly. 229 00:11:50,600 --> 00:11:54,400 Speaker 2: You know, are you on drugs? Would you like some more? 230 00:11:55,320 --> 00:11:58,400 Speaker 2: Come by? And we got you. 231 00:11:59,559 --> 00:12:02,920 Speaker 1: I love what you're doing because so much of the 232 00:12:03,040 --> 00:12:06,760 Speaker 1: things are misunderstanding and we haven't done the research and 233 00:12:06,840 --> 00:12:08,240 Speaker 1: haven't had the ability to. 234 00:12:08,280 --> 00:12:09,160 Speaker 2: Really do it. 235 00:12:09,800 --> 00:12:13,320 Speaker 1: And when we look at pharmaceuticals and just the way 236 00:12:13,720 --> 00:12:16,559 Speaker 1: they're so quick to put opioids in people's hands when 237 00:12:16,559 --> 00:12:19,440 Speaker 1: they're in pain, but at the same time they'll cut 238 00:12:19,440 --> 00:12:21,600 Speaker 1: them off at the drop of a hat, knowing how 239 00:12:21,600 --> 00:12:25,679 Speaker 1: addictive they are, and nobody really even talks about that. 240 00:12:25,840 --> 00:12:29,960 Speaker 1: Nobody's like, hey, okay, well maybe this is leading people 241 00:12:30,120 --> 00:12:31,319 Speaker 1: down a path of. 242 00:12:31,480 --> 00:12:34,640 Speaker 4: Yeah, they put so much on the person, the own 243 00:12:34,720 --> 00:12:37,560 Speaker 4: personal well, you you shouldn't get addicted, you know. It's 244 00:12:37,600 --> 00:12:43,199 Speaker 4: like wait a minute, right, So really, these antheogens, the 245 00:12:43,840 --> 00:12:49,680 Speaker 4: psychedelics do so much for a person's spirit and soul, 246 00:12:50,600 --> 00:12:53,120 Speaker 4: and once again, it's still a lot has to do 247 00:12:53,240 --> 00:12:58,640 Speaker 4: with the person and their own life force. So it's 248 00:12:58,720 --> 00:13:05,920 Speaker 4: a it's not in the pharmaceutical categories because we pharmaceuticals 249 00:13:06,440 --> 00:13:08,760 Speaker 4: come from the place of one pill is going to 250 00:13:08,840 --> 00:13:14,040 Speaker 4: fix everybody on this, right, and how can you compete 251 00:13:14,080 --> 00:13:19,719 Speaker 4: with that When you're saying, look, every person has a 252 00:13:19,840 --> 00:13:23,360 Speaker 4: choice of all this and what fits them. It's a 253 00:13:23,360 --> 00:13:28,480 Speaker 4: whole different way of looking at wellness and medicine and health. 254 00:13:28,800 --> 00:13:31,040 Speaker 4: So it's it's a long road we're gonna walk care. 255 00:13:31,120 --> 00:13:34,400 Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm all for the plant based medicines. And you 256 00:13:34,480 --> 00:13:37,960 Speaker 1: said one thing, we put so much trust in the 257 00:13:37,960 --> 00:13:41,600 Speaker 1: pharmaceuticals and big pharma and they call the plant medicine 258 00:13:41,600 --> 00:13:43,520 Speaker 1: and things that have been around for thousands of years, 259 00:13:43,520 --> 00:13:44,880 Speaker 1: that's the alternative medicine. 260 00:13:45,800 --> 00:13:48,600 Speaker 2: When how has it been here longer? 261 00:13:48,679 --> 00:13:52,600 Speaker 1: And it's the alternative and it's been proven throughout history. 262 00:13:52,679 --> 00:13:55,560 Speaker 1: But this so it's one of those things to distance 263 00:13:55,600 --> 00:13:59,800 Speaker 1: it and make it seem foreign, dangerous, or will. 264 00:13:59,760 --> 00:14:01,400 Speaker 2: Take take it to your chance with it if you 265 00:14:01,400 --> 00:14:02,480 Speaker 2: want to. It might alter you. 266 00:14:02,600 --> 00:14:06,000 Speaker 5: Yeah, like you know, you should really start to unravel 267 00:14:06,080 --> 00:14:08,440 Speaker 5: this whole thing where none of this is really based 268 00:14:08,440 --> 00:14:12,040 Speaker 5: in evidence and science. It's all based in propaganda and 269 00:14:12,040 --> 00:14:14,240 Speaker 5: what you can control and what you can't. 270 00:14:14,320 --> 00:14:17,240 Speaker 2: And undoing that. Yeah, that's the work that we try 271 00:14:17,280 --> 00:14:19,320 Speaker 2: to do here, and we see you're doing it. It's 272 00:14:19,360 --> 00:14:22,720 Speaker 2: it's hard. It's like you said, years and. 273 00:14:22,720 --> 00:14:27,120 Speaker 4: Years information education, that's all you know. 274 00:14:27,240 --> 00:14:27,680 Speaker 3: Research. 275 00:14:27,720 --> 00:14:29,840 Speaker 4: That's why it's like, look, let's we're gonna get these 276 00:14:29,880 --> 00:14:32,960 Speaker 4: things one after another. And it's slowly and once again, 277 00:14:33,000 --> 00:14:36,120 Speaker 4: it's not for everybody. You know, there's some people you're 278 00:14:36,160 --> 00:14:38,280 Speaker 4: not going to get to, hey, here's some psilocybin, it'll 279 00:14:38,640 --> 00:14:41,120 Speaker 4: it'll you know, change your life or whatever. You know, 280 00:14:41,120 --> 00:14:42,840 Speaker 4: it's it's not gonna work. They're going to just think 281 00:14:42,880 --> 00:14:46,360 Speaker 4: that's really weird. You You really have to have your 282 00:14:46,360 --> 00:14:49,440 Speaker 4: own personal journey with it. So it's it's it's not easy. 283 00:14:49,440 --> 00:14:51,520 Speaker 4: It's not a one pill fix it all thing. 284 00:14:51,920 --> 00:14:55,080 Speaker 1: Right, Can you talk about that a little bit, just 285 00:14:55,120 --> 00:14:57,680 Speaker 1: as far as the journey and what do they need 286 00:14:57,720 --> 00:14:59,760 Speaker 1: to decide that they want out of it? 287 00:15:00,160 --> 00:15:00,440 Speaker 3: Wow? 288 00:15:00,520 --> 00:15:02,400 Speaker 4: Well, first of all, if they're listening to your podcast, 289 00:15:02,400 --> 00:15:03,800 Speaker 4: they got to be pretty cool, and they got to 290 00:15:03,840 --> 00:15:05,640 Speaker 4: be you know, they've got they've got to be a 291 00:15:05,680 --> 00:15:09,240 Speaker 4: certain you know, understanding going on. I think a lot 292 00:15:09,240 --> 00:15:13,600 Speaker 4: of it's generational. You know, the younger generation is a 293 00:15:13,760 --> 00:15:16,120 Speaker 4: is a bit more open and they know that they've 294 00:15:16,120 --> 00:15:19,360 Speaker 4: been lied to about cannabis. They that you can see 295 00:15:19,360 --> 00:15:22,600 Speaker 4: that as years go by and one by one the 296 00:15:22,680 --> 00:15:26,280 Speaker 4: states are legalizing, so you can see, oh, well, massive 297 00:15:26,320 --> 00:15:30,320 Speaker 4: amounts of people haven't gone crazy or nuts on cannabis. 298 00:15:30,880 --> 00:15:34,120 Speaker 4: So maybe that whole refer madness. 299 00:15:33,760 --> 00:15:36,040 Speaker 3: Was a lie. Oh yeah, it was. It was a lie. 300 00:15:36,280 --> 00:15:38,240 Speaker 4: And so you know, so you kind of start that 301 00:15:38,320 --> 00:15:42,440 Speaker 4: and you check what your own understanding of it is, 302 00:15:43,320 --> 00:15:48,760 Speaker 4: and you have to you're looking for harmony in your life. 303 00:15:48,760 --> 00:15:52,400 Speaker 4: You're looking for some kind of harmony, and that one 304 00:15:53,600 --> 00:15:55,080 Speaker 4: path that so many of us are on. 305 00:15:55,200 --> 00:15:56,360 Speaker 3: We got to get up, go to our job. 306 00:15:56,400 --> 00:15:57,680 Speaker 4: We've got to do this, got to take care of 307 00:15:57,680 --> 00:16:00,160 Speaker 4: the kids, and we've got to solve all the problems 308 00:16:00,320 --> 00:16:02,080 Speaker 4: and then try to get it to go nights sleep. 309 00:16:02,120 --> 00:16:03,880 Speaker 4: But we can't because we're all caffeined and we're all 310 00:16:04,560 --> 00:16:07,920 Speaker 4: worried and the stress. You have to kind of look 311 00:16:07,960 --> 00:16:10,480 Speaker 4: at that first and go, that's the biggest problem. That 312 00:16:10,600 --> 00:16:12,920 Speaker 4: might be why I have back pain, right, not because 313 00:16:12,920 --> 00:16:13,880 Speaker 4: there's something. 314 00:16:13,920 --> 00:16:14,680 Speaker 3: Wrong with me. 315 00:16:15,360 --> 00:16:18,280 Speaker 4: And once you kind of make that choice, if that's 316 00:16:18,320 --> 00:16:22,040 Speaker 4: what you're looking for, then psychedelics can help you. 317 00:16:22,080 --> 00:16:25,920 Speaker 3: If you understand, oh, I need to change some behavior here. 318 00:16:26,400 --> 00:16:29,240 Speaker 4: I need an answer, not just oh God, my back hurts, 319 00:16:29,280 --> 00:16:32,480 Speaker 4: give me a pill, because you're gonna keep going down 320 00:16:32,520 --> 00:16:32,920 Speaker 4: that road. 321 00:16:33,120 --> 00:16:33,280 Speaker 2: Right. 322 00:16:33,320 --> 00:16:38,680 Speaker 4: If you're ready to make a change, then cannabis can help. 323 00:16:38,720 --> 00:16:40,760 Speaker 4: And a little bit of THC can help because it 324 00:16:41,400 --> 00:16:44,000 Speaker 4: kind of spreads time and space out for you and 325 00:16:44,040 --> 00:16:46,400 Speaker 4: you go, oh, there's more to this than what I've 326 00:16:46,440 --> 00:16:49,920 Speaker 4: thought now some people it's a hard jump to go 327 00:16:50,000 --> 00:16:52,920 Speaker 4: from left brain to let your right brain sort of 328 00:16:52,960 --> 00:16:56,080 Speaker 4: do some things. But if you're reading helps, talking to 329 00:16:56,120 --> 00:16:59,920 Speaker 4: other people, information, your podcasts, these things help, and then 330 00:17:00,800 --> 00:17:03,480 Speaker 4: it's a road and before you know it, you're at 331 00:17:03,520 --> 00:17:07,600 Speaker 4: some ayahuasca circle and you're journeying and you're discovering that 332 00:17:07,640 --> 00:17:12,040 Speaker 4: you are light and love and the world is a 333 00:17:12,080 --> 00:17:13,560 Speaker 4: full of a full of love. 334 00:17:14,520 --> 00:17:16,200 Speaker 2: What you said about the psilocybin. 335 00:17:16,320 --> 00:17:20,960 Speaker 1: Definitely, I've had some experiences where it's okay, I need 336 00:17:21,000 --> 00:17:24,200 Speaker 1: to let things go, and it's simple stuff. If you're 337 00:17:24,200 --> 00:17:27,480 Speaker 1: allowed to be in that space, it's like breathing. You're like, wow, 338 00:17:27,520 --> 00:17:30,800 Speaker 1: this feels good. Oh, this is what I'm not doing 339 00:17:30,840 --> 00:17:34,200 Speaker 1: when I get upset. This is why my shoulders hurt, 340 00:17:34,440 --> 00:17:37,240 Speaker 1: this is why my neck. I can hardly turn around 341 00:17:37,320 --> 00:17:39,439 Speaker 1: without you know, spinning my whole body. 342 00:17:39,520 --> 00:17:44,960 Speaker 4: So, yeah, it's to take our population and the majority, 343 00:17:45,000 --> 00:17:47,760 Speaker 4: if we can get them out of the pill, fix 344 00:17:47,800 --> 00:17:50,800 Speaker 4: it all and gets them back on the construction line. 345 00:17:51,560 --> 00:17:56,560 Speaker 4: Quality of life is really important, and not everyone's gonna 346 00:17:56,600 --> 00:17:58,440 Speaker 4: do that. You know, people are always going to think 347 00:17:58,440 --> 00:18:02,960 Speaker 4: that hard work gets you somewhere, you know, and and boy, 348 00:18:03,160 --> 00:18:06,680 Speaker 4: you know, yeah, one one little nice journey with psilocybin 349 00:18:06,800 --> 00:18:10,360 Speaker 4: can really teach you that breathing is an incredibly important 350 00:18:10,359 --> 00:18:10,880 Speaker 4: thing to do. 351 00:18:11,000 --> 00:18:11,640 Speaker 2: Yeah. 352 00:18:11,720 --> 00:18:15,280 Speaker 5: Yeah, And it must have been so trying to flip 353 00:18:15,280 --> 00:18:17,879 Speaker 5: that off, because I mean, being the megastar that you 354 00:18:18,000 --> 00:18:19,919 Speaker 5: are and the amount of work that that takes, and 355 00:18:19,920 --> 00:18:22,080 Speaker 5: then being a female in the time that you were 356 00:18:22,080 --> 00:18:24,240 Speaker 5: coming up and that, and then being a part of 357 00:18:24,280 --> 00:18:26,159 Speaker 5: the LGBTQ community and trying to. 358 00:18:26,119 --> 00:18:26,800 Speaker 3: Do as all that. 359 00:18:26,920 --> 00:18:28,880 Speaker 6: Yeah, I mean there is you had. 360 00:18:28,680 --> 00:18:30,760 Speaker 5: To bust your ass in the way that you did 361 00:18:30,800 --> 00:18:32,439 Speaker 5: to get there, and then to kind of say like 362 00:18:32,960 --> 00:18:34,840 Speaker 5: I have to balance this or turn that. That must 363 00:18:34,840 --> 00:18:36,800 Speaker 5: have been such a challenging experience. 364 00:18:36,840 --> 00:18:38,720 Speaker 3: And so well, you know, I got breast cancer. 365 00:18:39,080 --> 00:18:43,280 Speaker 4: It eventually, you know it eventually, will you know, burn 366 00:18:43,359 --> 00:18:46,400 Speaker 4: yourself up till you finally go, well, okay, I got 367 00:18:46,440 --> 00:18:49,560 Speaker 4: a change, and that change is what saves your life. 368 00:18:49,720 --> 00:18:53,560 Speaker 4: Every time my even doctors, bless their heart, they would say, well, 369 00:18:53,600 --> 00:18:57,160 Speaker 4: we have found people that make a change in their 370 00:18:57,200 --> 00:19:00,639 Speaker 4: lives are the ones that survive. So it's kind of 371 00:19:00,840 --> 00:19:04,159 Speaker 4: simple there, and even they've seen that it's about finding 372 00:19:04,160 --> 00:19:06,760 Speaker 4: that thing, whether it's the family, whether it's your mother, 373 00:19:07,040 --> 00:19:09,280 Speaker 4: you know, whether it's your you know, what you think 374 00:19:09,320 --> 00:19:12,639 Speaker 4: you should do is a job, what you should make 375 00:19:12,840 --> 00:19:15,760 Speaker 4: and all those things. No, that's not what life is about. 376 00:19:15,760 --> 00:19:17,880 Speaker 4: Life is not just some sort of race that we're 377 00:19:17,920 --> 00:19:20,360 Speaker 4: on that That is not how it is. It's it's 378 00:19:21,080 --> 00:19:25,120 Speaker 4: joy is ridiculously important in life, and we just don't 379 00:19:25,160 --> 00:19:27,040 Speaker 4: ever put it first. 380 00:19:27,400 --> 00:19:30,560 Speaker 2: Yeah, very true. You felt that in your life the nineties. 381 00:19:31,200 --> 00:19:33,879 Speaker 4: The nineties was when you know, I was huge and 382 00:19:34,040 --> 00:19:36,800 Speaker 4: was the you know, playing stadiums and arenas, and it's 383 00:19:36,880 --> 00:19:39,720 Speaker 4: like I was there, and I've seen many many people 384 00:19:39,720 --> 00:19:43,520 Speaker 4: that get there and you go, ha wow. It was 385 00:19:43,560 --> 00:19:46,920 Speaker 4: a lot more fun getting too there than it is 386 00:19:46,960 --> 00:19:50,760 Speaker 4: being there, because being there lasts a day maybe, you know, 387 00:19:51,080 --> 00:19:54,320 Speaker 4: and it moves on, and life moves on in the 388 00:19:54,440 --> 00:19:57,560 Speaker 4: light of fame moves on. It's very fickle. It never 389 00:19:57,600 --> 00:19:59,520 Speaker 4: stays in one place. And you see these people that 390 00:20:00,280 --> 00:20:02,600 Speaker 4: make it and then they keep trying. Then then they're like, 391 00:20:02,640 --> 00:20:04,160 Speaker 4: oh God, I got to get up there. I've got 392 00:20:04,160 --> 00:20:06,399 Speaker 4: to I've got to do that again. I've got to 393 00:20:06,440 --> 00:20:08,879 Speaker 4: have that level and there's something can sustain it, you know, 394 00:20:09,280 --> 00:20:13,199 Speaker 4: for a long time, but eventually you got to just 395 00:20:14,119 --> 00:20:19,199 Speaker 4: you know, love it yourself, no matter what the outcome is, 396 00:20:19,280 --> 00:20:22,240 Speaker 4: no matter what people, how many you sell, or you know, 397 00:20:22,320 --> 00:20:25,639 Speaker 4: whatever is happening, you got to love it. That's what 398 00:20:25,800 --> 00:20:29,160 Speaker 4: saved me is it's like, oh no, I love doing this, 399 00:20:29,920 --> 00:20:31,960 Speaker 4: but I can be myself when I'm paying. I don't 400 00:20:32,000 --> 00:20:34,119 Speaker 4: have to be I don't have to make myself up 401 00:20:34,160 --> 00:20:36,800 Speaker 4: to be something else. And that that's the way it is. 402 00:20:36,840 --> 00:20:39,280 Speaker 5: And it's that high chase it feels like to what 403 00:20:39,320 --> 00:20:41,959 Speaker 5: you're talking about and people trying to maintain and getting 404 00:20:41,960 --> 00:20:44,560 Speaker 5: that from other sources in Clayton, I know this is 405 00:20:44,560 --> 00:20:46,760 Speaker 5: something you talked about in your stand up where there 406 00:20:46,760 --> 00:20:49,120 Speaker 5: can't be a better high than like being up there. 407 00:20:49,160 --> 00:20:52,000 Speaker 5: And you've seen it with people trying to maintain that. 408 00:20:52,040 --> 00:20:54,679 Speaker 5: You've lost some friends in the comedy you know world, 409 00:20:54,760 --> 00:20:57,200 Speaker 5: and how difficult that is, and I see those parallels. 410 00:20:57,280 --> 00:21:01,800 Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, and I mean it's but one thing about 411 00:21:01,800 --> 00:21:04,399 Speaker 1: it is the love is what got you in it, 412 00:21:05,119 --> 00:21:08,880 Speaker 1: and it's what keeps you there. And from what you're 413 00:21:08,920 --> 00:21:11,520 Speaker 1: telling me, Melissa, is what can save you too. 414 00:21:11,760 --> 00:21:13,240 Speaker 3: Amen. So exactly. 415 00:21:13,400 --> 00:21:18,880 Speaker 5: Yeah, We'll be right back with the War on Drugs Podcast. 416 00:21:26,560 --> 00:21:29,159 Speaker 7: The War on Drugs Podcast is sponsored by Stand Together. 417 00:21:29,680 --> 00:21:32,879 Speaker 7: Stand Together is a philanthropic community that partners with America's 418 00:21:32,920 --> 00:21:35,600 Speaker 7: boldest change makers to tackle the root causes of our 419 00:21:35,640 --> 00:21:39,480 Speaker 7: country's biggest problems. Like many others who experienced addiction, Scott 420 00:21:39,520 --> 00:21:41,960 Speaker 7: Stroude was using drugs and alcohol to number the pain. 421 00:21:42,440 --> 00:21:45,520 Speaker 7: For him, it was childhood trauma. In his early twenties, 422 00:21:45,520 --> 00:21:47,640 Speaker 7: Scott was invited into a boxing gym by a friend 423 00:21:47,680 --> 00:21:50,280 Speaker 7: and that's where he discovered the healing power of sport 424 00:21:50,480 --> 00:21:54,280 Speaker 7: and community. In two thousand and six, Scott founded The Phoenix, 425 00:21:54,600 --> 00:21:58,160 Speaker 7: a free, sober active community that uses the transformative power 426 00:21:58,200 --> 00:22:01,200 Speaker 7: of sport to help people treat and heal from addiction. 427 00:22:01,640 --> 00:22:04,480 Speaker 7: Scott Strode is one of many entrepreneurs partnering with Stand 428 00:22:04,480 --> 00:22:09,200 Speaker 7: Together to drive solutions in education, healthcare, poverty, and criminal justice. 429 00:22:09,640 --> 00:22:11,880 Speaker 7: To learn more of visit Standogether dot org. 430 00:22:20,840 --> 00:22:22,639 Speaker 5: Melissa, I was listening to one of your interview I 431 00:22:22,640 --> 00:22:24,520 Speaker 5: think it was with Rolling Stone, and you talked about 432 00:22:24,840 --> 00:22:31,880 Speaker 5: doing like a hero dosage of cannabis heroic. Yeah, can 433 00:22:31,920 --> 00:22:33,720 Speaker 5: you talk about that a little bit? And you actually said, 434 00:22:33,720 --> 00:22:36,239 Speaker 5: like it actually really you know, it's funny, but like 435 00:22:36,359 --> 00:22:38,640 Speaker 5: it really helped you and you kind of fell into 436 00:22:38,680 --> 00:22:39,800 Speaker 5: it yeah, I'd love to hear about that. 437 00:22:39,880 --> 00:22:43,679 Speaker 3: Oh yeah, no, break yeah, break it, you got it. 438 00:22:43,720 --> 00:22:45,320 Speaker 3: I'm going to tell you the story. 439 00:22:45,720 --> 00:22:50,440 Speaker 4: So I was had just been through my first divorce. 440 00:22:50,920 --> 00:22:55,280 Speaker 4: It was this the late nineties, and a friend had 441 00:22:55,320 --> 00:22:59,359 Speaker 4: given me just a massive amount of cannabis and I 442 00:22:59,440 --> 00:23:01,280 Speaker 4: was starting to to know cannabis better. 443 00:23:01,320 --> 00:23:02,199 Speaker 3: It was relaxing me. 444 00:23:02,800 --> 00:23:05,840 Speaker 4: My girlfriend at the time was really fun, especially when 445 00:23:06,000 --> 00:23:09,600 Speaker 4: we would smoke. And in one weekend, I said, Oh, 446 00:23:09,640 --> 00:23:12,119 Speaker 4: my gosh, have you ever done like, you know, pop 447 00:23:12,119 --> 00:23:15,320 Speaker 4: brownies or you know, eating it to edibles and and 448 00:23:15,400 --> 00:23:17,520 Speaker 4: she was like no, and I hadn't done it in 449 00:23:17,520 --> 00:23:18,160 Speaker 4: a long time. 450 00:23:18,200 --> 00:23:19,800 Speaker 3: And I was like, oh, it's so much fun, you know. 451 00:23:19,840 --> 00:23:23,160 Speaker 4: And my girlfriend was the kind that she was from 452 00:23:23,160 --> 00:23:26,280 Speaker 4: the Midwest, and she baked really well, like really made 453 00:23:26,320 --> 00:23:29,240 Speaker 4: really good cookies, right. And she was also the kind 454 00:23:29,240 --> 00:23:31,560 Speaker 4: of was like, hey, if a quarter cup is good, 455 00:23:31,600 --> 00:23:35,080 Speaker 4: then a whole cup's got to be fantastic, right, And 456 00:23:35,160 --> 00:23:38,040 Speaker 4: so she puts all this cannabis in, but she makes 457 00:23:38,080 --> 00:23:41,280 Speaker 4: it taste so good in the in the cookie, and 458 00:23:41,359 --> 00:23:43,680 Speaker 4: so you know, I ate one, and it's the you're 459 00:23:43,720 --> 00:23:46,600 Speaker 4: eating one and you're waiting twenty minutes maybe and You're like, 460 00:23:46,600 --> 00:23:48,840 Speaker 4: I don't feel anything. I don't feel anything. Well let's 461 00:23:48,840 --> 00:23:51,760 Speaker 4: have another. And I ate another one and it started 462 00:23:51,800 --> 00:23:53,680 Speaker 4: to kind of come on, and then I got the munchies, 463 00:23:53,760 --> 00:23:57,920 Speaker 4: so I ate another one, you know, and she passed out. 464 00:23:58,000 --> 00:24:00,520 Speaker 4: She fell asleep, which, ladies and gentle, if you don't know, 465 00:24:00,280 --> 00:24:02,680 Speaker 4: you can't overdose on cannabis. 466 00:24:02,680 --> 00:24:03,600 Speaker 3: You just fall asleep. 467 00:24:04,840 --> 00:24:09,720 Speaker 4: But before I fell asleep, I went on what I 468 00:24:09,760 --> 00:24:14,919 Speaker 4: call a heroic dose journey. It was so much cannabis 469 00:24:14,960 --> 00:24:18,720 Speaker 4: that my right brain, my intuitive brain, completely took over 470 00:24:19,040 --> 00:24:23,199 Speaker 4: my inner being and connected to the non physical and 471 00:24:23,240 --> 00:24:25,560 Speaker 4: the spiritual was completely wide open. 472 00:24:26,040 --> 00:24:27,720 Speaker 3: And of course I thought I was dying. 473 00:24:28,000 --> 00:24:31,680 Speaker 4: That's what that's what you think. How many phone calls, 474 00:24:31,680 --> 00:24:34,960 Speaker 4: how many police phone calls have we heard of I'm dying. 475 00:24:35,119 --> 00:24:37,720 Speaker 4: I've taken too much cannabis and my heart's founding and 476 00:24:37,760 --> 00:24:40,000 Speaker 4: I'm dying, and you know, and I did. 477 00:24:40,000 --> 00:24:42,840 Speaker 3: I went through that. I went, oh God, I'm dying. 478 00:24:43,560 --> 00:24:46,920 Speaker 4: And then after a few moments of Okay, I'm dying, 479 00:24:47,000 --> 00:24:50,600 Speaker 4: it was like, well, if I'm dying, it's not so bad. 480 00:24:51,600 --> 00:24:54,879 Speaker 3: This is not so bad. And I started thinking about, well, 481 00:24:54,880 --> 00:24:56,480 Speaker 3: why are we so afraid of death? 482 00:24:56,520 --> 00:25:00,000 Speaker 4: We just it's because my soul felt like it was 483 00:25:00,200 --> 00:25:06,720 Speaker 4: so big that I was I was definitely going to 484 00:25:06,720 --> 00:25:07,720 Speaker 4: continue forever. 485 00:25:07,840 --> 00:25:09,240 Speaker 3: So what am I afraid of dying for? 486 00:25:09,400 --> 00:25:11,840 Speaker 4: So that was the first thing that changed my life, 487 00:25:12,000 --> 00:25:15,840 Speaker 4: was overcoming, like really seriously overcoming the fear of death 488 00:25:16,440 --> 00:25:18,480 Speaker 4: because that that holds so many of us back. 489 00:25:18,520 --> 00:25:21,199 Speaker 3: And for Heaven's sakes, we're all gonna die, really we are. 490 00:25:21,680 --> 00:25:26,640 Speaker 3: And and let's let's make this breakings. Yeah it's great. Yeah, 491 00:25:26,920 --> 00:25:28,280 Speaker 3: we're all dying. Guess what. 492 00:25:28,760 --> 00:25:33,199 Speaker 4: But I know, no matter what they say, we are 493 00:25:33,280 --> 00:25:34,360 Speaker 4: all gonna die someday. 494 00:25:34,560 --> 00:25:37,000 Speaker 1: The funny thing is, you know when you get too 495 00:25:37,119 --> 00:25:39,720 Speaker 1: high and you think you're about to die, you always 496 00:25:39,760 --> 00:25:43,080 Speaker 1: associated with stuff your body's supposed to do, Like my 497 00:25:43,160 --> 00:25:46,200 Speaker 1: heart's beating, Like I can feel the blood flowing through 498 00:25:46,200 --> 00:25:49,199 Speaker 1: my veins, my lungs keep getting bigger, and then they 499 00:25:49,240 --> 00:25:49,880 Speaker 1: get smaller. 500 00:25:49,920 --> 00:25:52,520 Speaker 2: I don't know what's going on, Like this is. 501 00:25:52,480 --> 00:25:59,280 Speaker 5: All yeah, just understanding and being comfortable with death and 502 00:25:59,320 --> 00:26:02,320 Speaker 5: taking that head on. And that's a major area of this. 503 00:26:02,400 --> 00:26:05,040 Speaker 5: And you know, we talked to Ishmael Ali from maps Or. 504 00:26:05,080 --> 00:26:07,080 Speaker 5: They're doing some amazing work and there I think they're 505 00:26:07,119 --> 00:26:10,000 Speaker 5: in their third trials of m DMA and taking combat 506 00:26:10,040 --> 00:26:12,639 Speaker 5: veterans with severe PTSD and. 507 00:26:12,400 --> 00:26:13,880 Speaker 6: Actually curing them. 508 00:26:14,000 --> 00:26:15,920 Speaker 5: And the shame of it is, you know, most of 509 00:26:16,000 --> 00:26:20,560 Speaker 5: these medicines, we had hundreds of research papers and trials 510 00:26:20,600 --> 00:26:22,639 Speaker 5: you know, in the fifties and the sixties, and then 511 00:26:22,720 --> 00:26:25,680 Speaker 5: prohibition comes on all these things and it just stops. 512 00:26:25,720 --> 00:26:28,760 Speaker 5: And because of foundations like yours, you know, they're helping 513 00:26:28,840 --> 00:26:31,199 Speaker 5: kind of move that through and we're getting there. But 514 00:26:31,600 --> 00:26:33,320 Speaker 5: I always just think about what a shame it is 515 00:26:33,359 --> 00:26:36,520 Speaker 5: that we've lost, you know, decades of research and therapeutics 516 00:26:36,520 --> 00:26:38,439 Speaker 5: on this, and that's that's the biggest thing. And so, 517 00:26:38,720 --> 00:26:40,640 Speaker 5: you know, we talked about some of the regulatory aspects 518 00:26:40,680 --> 00:26:42,800 Speaker 5: and prohibition and things like that. What are some of 519 00:26:42,840 --> 00:26:46,400 Speaker 5: the other impediments that you have seen with your work 520 00:26:46,400 --> 00:26:49,199 Speaker 5: with the foundation to actually get these things off the ground. 521 00:26:49,600 --> 00:26:52,800 Speaker 5: And how can people help your foundation? How can they 522 00:26:52,840 --> 00:26:55,000 Speaker 5: help in their individual capacity? We love to you know, 523 00:26:55,040 --> 00:26:56,480 Speaker 5: always end on callbacks. 524 00:26:57,280 --> 00:27:01,960 Speaker 4: Well please look AT's ethargefoundation dot org. And course money 525 00:27:02,000 --> 00:27:04,400 Speaker 4: is what makes us go, because that's what enables us 526 00:27:04,400 --> 00:27:09,200 Speaker 4: to do these the research, you know, do the research 527 00:27:09,359 --> 00:27:13,360 Speaker 4: and these trials. And you can go to the website 528 00:27:13,880 --> 00:27:16,840 Speaker 4: Foundation dot org and you can read what we're doing 529 00:27:17,119 --> 00:27:20,280 Speaker 4: and you can see the incredible results that we're just 530 00:27:20,359 --> 00:27:24,399 Speaker 4: starting to get. We are also starting the very first 531 00:27:25,119 --> 00:27:26,000 Speaker 4: clinical trial. 532 00:27:26,600 --> 00:27:27,320 Speaker 3: We're doing. 533 00:27:27,480 --> 00:27:29,760 Speaker 4: It's like a pre trial so that we can go 534 00:27:29,800 --> 00:27:34,000 Speaker 4: to the next step of it of ayahuasca. Once again, 535 00:27:34,119 --> 00:27:37,600 Speaker 4: very hard because of the legal ramifications. There's a scientist 536 00:27:37,720 --> 00:27:42,440 Speaker 4: in Australia who's able to use Australian vine and leaf 537 00:27:42,680 --> 00:27:46,760 Speaker 4: down there to create the ayahuasca medicine down there, and 538 00:27:46,840 --> 00:27:49,040 Speaker 4: we are just starting that and if you check out 539 00:27:49,040 --> 00:27:51,600 Speaker 4: ETHERG Foundation dot org you can find more information about that. 540 00:27:51,640 --> 00:27:54,399 Speaker 4: We've also one of our this is one of the 541 00:27:54,440 --> 00:27:56,240 Speaker 4: favorite things that we're doing. One of the first things 542 00:27:56,600 --> 00:28:00,440 Speaker 4: we did is Spain, who provides a methadone to their 543 00:28:00,440 --> 00:28:06,760 Speaker 4: heroin addicts. It's a government supplied system. They now have 544 00:28:07,080 --> 00:28:10,960 Speaker 4: people on methadone for fifteen twenty years and they are 545 00:28:11,160 --> 00:28:13,880 Speaker 4: looking to us to find a way to get them off. 546 00:28:14,000 --> 00:28:17,240 Speaker 4: And we have been working with a group out of 547 00:28:17,440 --> 00:28:22,600 Speaker 4: Africa that has used the Aboga route which you make 548 00:28:22,720 --> 00:28:27,639 Speaker 4: ibi gain, which is very similar to ayahuasca, but even deeper. 549 00:28:28,160 --> 00:28:32,320 Speaker 4: And these are not recreational drugs whatsoever. This is really 550 00:28:32,400 --> 00:28:36,480 Speaker 4: hard soul searching work and the results that we've gotten 551 00:28:36,560 --> 00:28:40,680 Speaker 4: back from Spain that not only are these users of 552 00:28:40,760 --> 00:28:46,040 Speaker 4: fifteen twenty years of methadone completely off, opioids and methadone 553 00:28:46,040 --> 00:28:50,720 Speaker 4: and heroin completely off, but they stopped drinking, they stopped smoking. 554 00:28:50,920 --> 00:28:53,720 Speaker 4: They just turn their life completely around. 555 00:28:54,200 --> 00:28:54,400 Speaker 3: You know. 556 00:28:54,440 --> 00:28:56,760 Speaker 4: Once again, it's not one hundred percent because the person 557 00:28:57,200 --> 00:29:00,080 Speaker 4: also has a lot to do with it, but remark 558 00:29:00,520 --> 00:29:02,560 Speaker 4: like like eight out of ten or something, I think 559 00:29:02,840 --> 00:29:05,960 Speaker 4: really had incredible results with that, and so that's what 560 00:29:05,960 --> 00:29:06,400 Speaker 4: we're doing. 561 00:29:06,640 --> 00:29:08,440 Speaker 5: Yeah, if you ever want to know about the War 562 00:29:08,480 --> 00:29:11,280 Speaker 5: on drugs and it not being about drugs, understand the 563 00:29:11,560 --> 00:29:14,400 Speaker 5: addiction of the drug that they put you on to 564 00:29:14,520 --> 00:29:18,240 Speaker 5: take you off another addiction that is methadone, and then 565 00:29:18,440 --> 00:29:21,200 Speaker 5: they counts cannabis as a Schedule one drug. And this 566 00:29:21,360 --> 00:29:22,640 Speaker 5: is all honky dory. 567 00:29:22,760 --> 00:29:29,200 Speaker 3: It's here, we are insanity where we're working on it. 568 00:29:29,200 --> 00:29:31,520 Speaker 6: Thanks guys, thank you so much, Thank you very much. 569 00:29:35,080 --> 00:29:48,720 Speaker 1: We'll be right back with the War on drugs. Man, 570 00:29:49,520 --> 00:29:51,920 Speaker 1: that's it, greg our first celebrity guest man. 571 00:29:52,120 --> 00:29:53,200 Speaker 6: Well, we did have air condo. 572 00:29:53,200 --> 00:29:54,000 Speaker 2: Oh yeah, that's right. 573 00:29:54,040 --> 00:29:57,000 Speaker 1: I forgot, I forgot, we got we got celebrities on 574 00:29:57,040 --> 00:29:58,000 Speaker 1: our show were. 575 00:29:57,920 --> 00:30:01,840 Speaker 2: So humble man and there, Yeah, I forget. Yeah, well, I. 576 00:30:01,840 --> 00:30:04,640 Speaker 5: Guess you're so big now, like what you consider celebrity now? 577 00:30:04,800 --> 00:30:06,840 Speaker 2: No, no, no, that's probably not kidding. 578 00:30:07,080 --> 00:30:10,000 Speaker 1: Saron Andre is definitely a celebrity and I know him. 579 00:30:10,040 --> 00:30:13,120 Speaker 1: That's that's like my dude, So that might be why. 580 00:30:13,280 --> 00:30:16,760 Speaker 1: But nah, that was great just to hear what she's 581 00:30:16,800 --> 00:30:20,680 Speaker 1: doing with the foundation and what it's able to do. 582 00:30:20,880 --> 00:30:23,080 Speaker 1: And I like the point that she brought up that 583 00:30:23,160 --> 00:30:29,360 Speaker 1: is not necessarily one cure for everybody, right, Like, there's 584 00:30:29,400 --> 00:30:31,880 Speaker 1: still work that has to be done. Some of these 585 00:30:31,880 --> 00:30:33,920 Speaker 1: things might work for you, some of them may not, 586 00:30:34,160 --> 00:30:38,080 Speaker 1: but just having that option gives people a chance to 587 00:30:38,120 --> 00:30:41,560 Speaker 1: not be subject to getting addicted. And I love the 588 00:30:41,560 --> 00:30:44,760 Speaker 1: work they're doing, you know, I want to know more exactly. 589 00:30:44,880 --> 00:30:46,720 Speaker 5: This is not going to solve all your problems. This 590 00:30:46,840 --> 00:30:49,160 Speaker 5: is not you know, one hundred percent money back guarantee. 591 00:30:49,200 --> 00:30:51,200 Speaker 5: It's just give all this stuff a chance to at 592 00:30:51,320 --> 00:30:53,800 Speaker 5: least like come out. Because what we're doing right now, 593 00:30:54,560 --> 00:30:56,720 Speaker 5: sure as helling, we're right, you know, we're tipping over 594 00:30:56,760 --> 00:31:00,000 Speaker 5: one hundred thousand overdose tests a year, and so these 595 00:31:00,080 --> 00:31:02,320 Speaker 5: types of things really help and that's one we kind 596 00:31:02,320 --> 00:31:04,280 Speaker 5: of wanted to touch on with our end credits. Here, 597 00:31:05,280 --> 00:31:08,200 Speaker 5: our producer, Michael, one of the hardest working men in 598 00:31:08,200 --> 00:31:11,160 Speaker 5: the book, send us his story of Goward. 599 00:31:11,360 --> 00:31:15,320 Speaker 1: He's scoured Stex and scoured the x of information, went. 600 00:31:15,240 --> 00:31:18,160 Speaker 5: To a library, filled out an application for a library card 601 00:31:18,200 --> 00:31:18,840 Speaker 5: to the whole thing. 602 00:31:19,080 --> 00:31:21,240 Speaker 6: Yeah, he got late fees and everything. 603 00:31:21,800 --> 00:31:25,000 Speaker 5: So he found this story about this guy, Howard, lots 604 00:31:25,040 --> 00:31:28,320 Speaker 5: of you know, we're talking nineteen sixty two. This guy 605 00:31:28,400 --> 00:31:31,280 Speaker 5: was addicted to heroin at nineteen and then he decided 606 00:31:31,440 --> 00:31:33,800 Speaker 5: he wanted to ingest iba game, which is this extract 607 00:31:33,800 --> 00:31:37,040 Speaker 5: from a West African shrub called the aboga. You know, 608 00:31:37,080 --> 00:31:39,480 Speaker 5: now we kind of know that it's helpful with you know, 609 00:31:39,720 --> 00:31:43,400 Speaker 5: opioid with drawls, heroin withdrawals, and actually can reduce the 610 00:31:43,720 --> 00:31:45,080 Speaker 5: cravings for heroin. 611 00:31:45,320 --> 00:31:47,440 Speaker 1: I mean, I guess kind of the way he took it. 612 00:31:47,640 --> 00:31:49,600 Speaker 1: He said he had a friend who had a lot 613 00:31:49,600 --> 00:31:51,640 Speaker 1: of drugs and a freezer and was going through it 614 00:31:51,680 --> 00:31:52,600 Speaker 1: and just kind of offered it. 615 00:31:52,640 --> 00:31:53,560 Speaker 2: Hey, you might like this. 616 00:31:53,800 --> 00:31:55,640 Speaker 5: Yeah, you know, here's a great quote from him, just 617 00:31:55,720 --> 00:31:57,520 Speaker 5: kind of telling the story. This is from a lecture 618 00:31:57,560 --> 00:31:59,360 Speaker 5: that he did in two thousand and eight. I follow 619 00:31:59,400 --> 00:32:01,200 Speaker 5: the tree up in the sky and I saw these 620 00:32:01,200 --> 00:32:02,880 Speaker 5: clouds in the sky, and I realized, for the first 621 00:32:02,880 --> 00:32:05,720 Speaker 5: time in my life, I wasn't afraid. And that brought 622 00:32:05,720 --> 00:32:08,360 Speaker 5: me to the understanding that at least certain drug addiction 623 00:32:08,680 --> 00:32:11,680 Speaker 5: is fear and anxiety driven, and that fear and anxiety 624 00:32:11,920 --> 00:32:13,920 Speaker 5: were gone for the first time of my life. 625 00:32:14,080 --> 00:32:16,640 Speaker 1: And it gets you high for like thirty six hours. 626 00:32:17,000 --> 00:32:18,800 Speaker 1: And he said he took it, and he was like, 627 00:32:18,880 --> 00:32:20,800 Speaker 1: all right, I'm going to go to sleep for a 628 00:32:20,880 --> 00:32:24,000 Speaker 1: week and I'm never doing this again. And that's when 629 00:32:24,040 --> 00:32:26,680 Speaker 1: that realization that you just spoke about kind of hit him. 630 00:32:26,960 --> 00:32:30,200 Speaker 1: And most of the reviews of people that I've seen 631 00:32:30,280 --> 00:32:35,360 Speaker 1: that have taken eyeb again or either the boga plant 632 00:32:35,720 --> 00:32:38,320 Speaker 1: all kind of say that same thing about that fear 633 00:32:39,040 --> 00:32:42,040 Speaker 1: being lifted. It's a thread you want to follow and 634 00:32:42,080 --> 00:32:44,280 Speaker 1: you want to be like, Okay, well, let's find out more. 635 00:32:44,360 --> 00:32:45,400 Speaker 1: Let's find out so. 636 00:32:45,680 --> 00:32:46,880 Speaker 6: Let's pull on this a little bit. 637 00:32:47,320 --> 00:32:49,880 Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, And again, this guy took this in nineteen 638 00:32:49,960 --> 00:32:50,480 Speaker 5: sixty two. 639 00:32:50,560 --> 00:32:55,000 Speaker 6: This is not some new weight loss drug or miracle drug. 640 00:32:55,080 --> 00:32:57,360 Speaker 5: But a lot of the results that we hear from 641 00:32:57,360 --> 00:32:59,880 Speaker 5: this stuff is all anecdotal, where it's just like this 642 00:33:00,080 --> 00:33:02,080 Speaker 5: I doing this thing, or a couple of people doing 643 00:33:02,120 --> 00:33:06,040 Speaker 5: out here because the government blocks so much studies and research. 644 00:33:06,080 --> 00:33:08,280 Speaker 5: And now we're talking. I mean, gosh, I'm not great 645 00:33:08,280 --> 00:33:10,120 Speaker 5: at math. What is that sixty years ago? 646 00:33:10,480 --> 00:33:13,920 Speaker 1: This guy was in for sixty years. We don't have 647 00:33:14,120 --> 00:33:16,880 Speaker 1: any more info, you know what I mean? We have some, 648 00:33:17,040 --> 00:33:21,520 Speaker 1: but yeah, we have nearly what would be if people 649 00:33:21,520 --> 00:33:23,920 Speaker 1: would actually study it are allowed to study it. 650 00:33:24,520 --> 00:33:24,880 Speaker 6: Exactly. 651 00:33:24,960 --> 00:33:27,320 Speaker 5: It's still Schedule one drug and so it's still considered 652 00:33:27,360 --> 00:33:30,520 Speaker 5: to not have any you know, medical value whatsoever, which 653 00:33:31,320 --> 00:33:33,560 Speaker 5: seems kind of bullshit. Yeah, and so you know, the 654 00:33:33,600 --> 00:33:36,440 Speaker 5: Ethers Foundation is actually given to a lot of organizations 655 00:33:36,480 --> 00:33:38,760 Speaker 5: that are studying this. And something I just saw Clayton 656 00:33:38,880 --> 00:33:42,120 Speaker 5: was the state of Kentucky, of all places, just set 657 00:33:42,120 --> 00:33:45,000 Speaker 5: aside like forty two million dollars to research I begain 658 00:33:45,360 --> 00:33:48,000 Speaker 5: to help with opiate addiction and withdrawals because they lose 659 00:33:48,000 --> 00:33:50,120 Speaker 5: about I think the last thing I saw was like 660 00:33:50,160 --> 00:33:53,160 Speaker 5: two thousand to three thousand people every year to overdome. 661 00:33:53,520 --> 00:33:56,960 Speaker 5: So again, slowly but surely we're seeing this to start 662 00:33:56,960 --> 00:33:59,080 Speaker 5: to move. And so we're at this amazing time right 663 00:33:59,120 --> 00:34:00,800 Speaker 5: now where things are getting better of a man. You 664 00:34:00,920 --> 00:34:03,440 Speaker 5: just how many lives have been lost, how many how 665 00:34:03,520 --> 00:34:06,200 Speaker 5: much the research could have been done that just was 666 00:34:06,240 --> 00:34:07,160 Speaker 5: blocked because of the drugs. 667 00:34:07,240 --> 00:34:10,160 Speaker 1: And at this point it feels like, oh, we're trying 668 00:34:10,760 --> 00:34:15,520 Speaker 1: these things because we're desperate now, like we've let it, 669 00:34:15,600 --> 00:34:18,440 Speaker 1: we've shut it down so long and we haven't done research, 670 00:34:18,480 --> 00:34:20,480 Speaker 1: and we could be so much further ahead. 671 00:34:20,840 --> 00:34:24,239 Speaker 5: Yeah, and Howard Lotsov he died in twenty ten, and 672 00:34:24,280 --> 00:34:26,040 Speaker 5: so he didn't really get to see kind of what 673 00:34:26,080 --> 00:34:28,600 Speaker 5: he was doing. Come to this kind of we're not 674 00:34:28,600 --> 00:34:31,360 Speaker 5: there full circle, but at least you know it's getting 675 00:34:31,440 --> 00:34:33,799 Speaker 5: national exposure, and you know it just again just kind 676 00:34:33,800 --> 00:34:36,000 Speaker 5: of takes you back to the lives that have been 677 00:34:36,080 --> 00:34:39,560 Speaker 5: lost like Melissa Sun Beckett and thousands and thousands of 678 00:34:39,560 --> 00:34:42,920 Speaker 5: others have struggled with addiction when these types of cures 679 00:34:42,960 --> 00:34:44,880 Speaker 5: and medicines could have been out there. But there is 680 00:34:44,920 --> 00:34:46,920 Speaker 5: some positives coming out of here, and so you know, 681 00:34:46,960 --> 00:34:48,960 Speaker 5: even though Howard didn't get to see it, even though 682 00:34:49,000 --> 00:34:51,359 Speaker 5: many were not able to see kind of like the 683 00:34:51,400 --> 00:34:54,279 Speaker 5: full clinical aspects of a lot of these plant based 684 00:34:54,360 --> 00:34:56,680 Speaker 5: medicines come to light. I think we're getting to a 685 00:34:56,719 --> 00:34:59,279 Speaker 5: better place. And so you know, like we always try 686 00:34:59,320 --> 00:35:00,879 Speaker 5: to say, we try to leave positive note. I think 687 00:35:00,880 --> 00:35:01,919 Speaker 5: that is the positive note. 688 00:35:01,960 --> 00:35:03,839 Speaker 1: I want to find out more. I'm not quite sure 689 00:35:03,880 --> 00:35:07,520 Speaker 1: I want to partake on the BOGA. I don't think 690 00:35:07,600 --> 00:35:10,480 Speaker 1: being hilfh for thirty four hours is if you do 691 00:35:10,560 --> 00:35:13,320 Speaker 1: anything for thirty four hours you should get a paycheck 692 00:35:13,800 --> 00:35:16,680 Speaker 1: at the end of it. There's no way like that's 693 00:35:16,920 --> 00:35:18,520 Speaker 1: that's not recreational anymore. 694 00:35:19,080 --> 00:35:19,239 Speaker 2: So. 695 00:35:19,520 --> 00:35:21,400 Speaker 6: But yeah, now that's what we call a bender. 696 00:35:21,520 --> 00:35:27,719 Speaker 2: Yeah, that is bent. That is bent, almost broken. You 697 00:35:27,760 --> 00:35:28,160 Speaker 2: hear me. 698 00:35:30,040 --> 00:35:30,719 Speaker 7: With that. 699 00:35:31,520 --> 00:35:34,160 Speaker 2: I'm Greg Glad, I'm Clayton, English and. 700 00:35:34,080 --> 00:35:37,520 Speaker 5: Thanks for listening to War on Drugs. Make sure you 701 00:35:37,560 --> 00:35:39,680 Speaker 5: follow the War on Drugs podcast so you don't miss 702 00:35:39,719 --> 00:35:41,840 Speaker 5: any new episodes. Thank you for listening. 703 00:35:42,560 --> 00:35:45,480 Speaker 1: Executive producers for War on Drugs are Jason Flahm and 704 00:35:45,560 --> 00:35:46,320 Speaker 1: Kevin Wadas. 705 00:35:46,600 --> 00:35:47,920 Speaker 2: Our Senior producer is. 706 00:35:47,880 --> 00:35:53,000 Speaker 1: Michael Epstein, Editing by Nick Massetti and Michael Epstein, Associate 707 00:35:53,040 --> 00:35:57,680 Speaker 1: producer and mixed and mastering by Nick Massetti. Additional production 708 00:35:57,880 --> 00:35:59,040 Speaker 1: by Jeff Cladbone. 709 00:36:00,120 --> 00:36:03,640 Speaker 5: Sure to follow the show on Instagram, Twitter, and Facebook 710 00:36:03,719 --> 00:36:06,960 Speaker 5: at Lava for Good. You can follow Greg on Twitter 711 00:36:07,000 --> 00:36:10,720 Speaker 5: at Greglott, and you can follow Clayton English on Instagram 712 00:36:10,719 --> 00:36:13,600 Speaker 5: at Clayton nabors. The War on Drugs is a production 713 00:36:13,680 --> 00:36:17,280 Speaker 5: of Lava for Good Podcasts in association with Signal Company 714 00:36:17,360 --> 00:36:17,879 Speaker 5: Number one. 715 00:36:18,440 --> 00:36:19,760 Speaker 6: I'm your host, Greg Lott. 716 00:36:19,640 --> 00:36:22,200 Speaker 2: And I'm Clayton English. Thanks for listening.