1 00:00:01,120 --> 00:00:04,480 Speaker 1: You're listening to the Bloomberg Sound on podcast. Catch the 2 00:00:04,519 --> 00:00:08,400 Speaker 1: program live weekdays at one Eastern on Bloomberg Radio, the 3 00:00:08,440 --> 00:00:11,120 Speaker 1: Tune in a Half, Bloomberg dot Com, and the Bloomberg 4 00:00:11,160 --> 00:00:14,440 Speaker 1: Business App. You can also listen live on Amazon Alexa 5 00:00:14,480 --> 00:00:17,880 Speaker 1: from our flagship New York station, Just say Alexa play 6 00:00:17,960 --> 00:00:20,720 Speaker 1: Bloomberg eleven thirty. 7 00:00:20,920 --> 00:00:23,799 Speaker 2: The courthouse was busy again today. Not else going on 8 00:00:23,880 --> 00:00:26,840 Speaker 2: in town, but a buzz around the courthouse for some 9 00:00:27,080 --> 00:00:31,880 Speaker 2: arguing and an important announcements on the trial date for 10 00:00:31,960 --> 00:00:34,319 Speaker 2: the January sixth case. This is the one brought by 11 00:00:34,320 --> 00:00:37,000 Speaker 2: the Special Council Jack Smith. The two first lines in 12 00:00:37,040 --> 00:00:40,160 Speaker 2: the story on the terminal are everything. Zoe Tillman writes. 13 00:00:40,159 --> 00:00:43,600 Speaker 2: Donald Trump's trial in Washington set from March fourth, Yes, 14 00:00:43,680 --> 00:00:47,239 Speaker 2: I said March fourth, on federal charges that he conspired 15 00:00:47,280 --> 00:00:50,440 Speaker 2: to obstruct the twenty election. That means the trial is 16 00:00:50,479 --> 00:00:54,920 Speaker 2: set to start the day before Super Tuesday. Fourteen states, 17 00:00:55,520 --> 00:00:59,040 Speaker 2: including Texas and California, hold their primaries that day. What 18 00:00:59,160 --> 00:01:04,080 Speaker 2: could go wrong? The date announced by Judge Chutkin after 19 00:01:04,120 --> 00:01:06,560 Speaker 2: hearing arguments. This basically was like a mini trial that 20 00:01:06,560 --> 00:01:09,280 Speaker 2: they held in there. But of course there are no 21 00:01:09,360 --> 00:01:11,440 Speaker 2: cameras in a federal courtroom, so I cannot bring you 22 00:01:11,480 --> 00:01:13,759 Speaker 2: in there. What I can do is bring you. Sarah 23 00:01:13,800 --> 00:01:17,400 Speaker 2: Forden from world headquarters in New York, Bloomberg's legal editor 24 00:01:17,480 --> 00:01:19,400 Speaker 2: is with us. Hey, Sarah, we miss you in the Capitol. 25 00:01:19,440 --> 00:01:21,800 Speaker 2: I'll say right off the bat, but hey, this trial 26 00:01:21,880 --> 00:01:24,440 Speaker 2: date March four is not what Donald Trump was looking for. 27 00:01:24,920 --> 00:01:27,880 Speaker 2: The next movie is going to be, yeah, absolutely, So 28 00:01:28,640 --> 00:01:30,959 Speaker 2: what options does he have at this point to delay? 29 00:01:31,600 --> 00:01:33,920 Speaker 3: Well, there could be delays, and maybe that's one reason 30 00:01:33,959 --> 00:01:36,880 Speaker 3: why the judge set the date as early as she did. 31 00:01:36,920 --> 00:01:39,800 Speaker 3: This is March fourth, as you said, before Super Tuesday. 32 00:01:40,000 --> 00:01:44,360 Speaker 3: It's also before the March twenty fifth New York Manhattan 33 00:01:44,400 --> 00:01:47,760 Speaker 3: case and the hush money trial. So there could be 34 00:01:47,840 --> 00:01:50,480 Speaker 3: some some wiggle room here for her to you know, 35 00:01:50,760 --> 00:01:55,440 Speaker 3: incorporate delays and requests for delays, but still bring it out. 36 00:01:55,480 --> 00:01:58,640 Speaker 3: You know, before Trump wanted, which was you know, he 37 00:01:58,720 --> 00:02:01,360 Speaker 3: wanted to delay it until twenty twenty six. 38 00:02:01,920 --> 00:02:04,320 Speaker 2: Yes, that would be a little bit extreme in the 39 00:02:04,360 --> 00:02:08,400 Speaker 2: other direction here, So is this smart analysis somewhere in 40 00:02:08,440 --> 00:02:08,840 Speaker 2: the middle. 41 00:02:09,200 --> 00:02:11,240 Speaker 3: Could be somewhere in the middle, And there was very 42 00:02:11,240 --> 00:02:14,680 Speaker 3: interesting back and forth between the prosecutor and the defense 43 00:02:14,680 --> 00:02:19,080 Speaker 3: attorneys about how much time was needed, and the prosecutor 44 00:02:19,120 --> 00:02:22,480 Speaker 3: for the DOJ, Molly Gassin, laid out the facts that 45 00:02:22,520 --> 00:02:26,120 Speaker 3: they have turned over twelve point eight million pages of 46 00:02:26,160 --> 00:02:29,359 Speaker 3: evidence in this case. But they've also delivered a sort 47 00:02:29,400 --> 00:02:32,640 Speaker 3: of digital roadmap to the indictment where they have paired 48 00:02:32,800 --> 00:02:35,840 Speaker 3: key pieces of evidence in the case with key paragraphs 49 00:02:35,840 --> 00:02:37,920 Speaker 3: in the indictment. So it should be easy for the 50 00:02:37,960 --> 00:02:40,440 Speaker 3: defense to parse, you know, how the case is being 51 00:02:40,440 --> 00:02:41,440 Speaker 3: built against Trump. 52 00:02:41,800 --> 00:02:45,400 Speaker 2: Yeah, so what did we learn today from this set 53 00:02:45,400 --> 00:02:47,800 Speaker 2: of arguments? It was almost to peek into what this 54 00:02:47,960 --> 00:02:51,000 Speaker 2: trial might look like, the contours that might take on. 55 00:02:51,720 --> 00:02:53,560 Speaker 3: Well, I mean, obviously this is going to be the 56 00:02:53,560 --> 00:02:56,760 Speaker 3: federal case about efforts by Trump and his allies to 57 00:02:56,960 --> 00:03:01,040 Speaker 3: overturn the twenty twenty election. A lot of the sets 58 00:03:01,120 --> 00:03:04,320 Speaker 3: are similar to the case that Fannie Willis has filed 59 00:03:04,400 --> 00:03:09,120 Speaker 3: in Georgia in Fulton County, but we have key differences 60 00:03:09,200 --> 00:03:13,880 Speaker 3: in those two cases, one being a state case cannot 61 00:03:13,880 --> 00:03:16,480 Speaker 3: be pardoned if there is a conviction in that case, 62 00:03:16,520 --> 00:03:20,400 Speaker 3: whereas a federal conviction could be pardoned if Trump, you know, 63 00:03:20,480 --> 00:03:24,040 Speaker 3: were to either win or one of his allies were 64 00:03:24,040 --> 00:03:25,600 Speaker 3: to win. In the presidency. 65 00:03:26,480 --> 00:03:30,000 Speaker 2: John Laurel, Donald Trump's attorney called the idea that they 66 00:03:30,040 --> 00:03:34,960 Speaker 2: get this going four months from now an outrage to justice. 67 00:03:35,000 --> 00:03:37,160 Speaker 2: And I guess he was quite animated in the courtroom. 68 00:03:37,160 --> 00:03:39,280 Speaker 2: Our reporting says he was raising his voice at times. 69 00:03:39,840 --> 00:03:41,920 Speaker 2: Judge Chucking at one point had to ask him to 70 00:03:41,920 --> 00:03:44,280 Speaker 2: take the temperature down. Does that tell us anything about 71 00:03:44,280 --> 00:03:47,520 Speaker 2: the way Trump's legal team will comport itself in court. 72 00:03:47,760 --> 00:03:50,120 Speaker 3: Well, it's interesting because we saw this sort of similar 73 00:03:50,200 --> 00:03:53,480 Speaker 3: dynamic play out in the setting of the Florida trial date, 74 00:03:53,800 --> 00:03:55,320 Speaker 3: which is going to be in May. That's in the 75 00:03:55,440 --> 00:03:59,000 Speaker 3: classified document's case that the judges here are really trying 76 00:03:59,120 --> 00:04:02,840 Speaker 3: to walk a far line between the legal requirements of 77 00:04:02,880 --> 00:04:05,400 Speaker 3: making sure they handle all the evidence and you know 78 00:04:05,440 --> 00:04:09,040 Speaker 3: they're they're running a fair and proper trial with the 79 00:04:09,120 --> 00:04:12,320 Speaker 3: kind of the heat being turned up on the political calendar. 80 00:04:14,200 --> 00:04:18,520 Speaker 2: There was another important court date today, the one in 81 00:04:18,560 --> 00:04:21,360 Speaker 2: Georgia having to do with Mark Meadows attempt to have 82 00:04:21,440 --> 00:04:26,040 Speaker 2: that moved to federal court. Even if that decision has 83 00:04:26,040 --> 00:04:29,400 Speaker 2: been made, will we not hear an announcement on that 84 00:04:29,400 --> 00:04:30,680 Speaker 2: for some time? Sarah, what's going on? 85 00:04:30,800 --> 00:04:32,680 Speaker 3: Yeah, we have a reporter in the court room We 86 00:04:32,720 --> 00:04:35,760 Speaker 3: are waiting for the first news out of that hearing. 87 00:04:36,160 --> 00:04:39,000 Speaker 3: We are expecting that Mark Meadows will be testifying about 88 00:04:39,040 --> 00:04:42,039 Speaker 3: why he thinks his case should be moved to federal 89 00:04:42,080 --> 00:04:45,640 Speaker 3: court rather than state court. And his argument is that 90 00:04:45,720 --> 00:04:48,840 Speaker 3: he was acting in his duties as a federal employee 91 00:04:49,160 --> 00:04:52,960 Speaker 3: and so that would justify a federal trial. The counter 92 00:04:53,000 --> 00:04:56,080 Speaker 3: to that, you know, Fanny Willis has already filed her position, 93 00:04:56,520 --> 00:04:59,279 Speaker 3: which is that there's nothing in the law that allows 94 00:04:59,320 --> 00:05:03,320 Speaker 3: a federal e play to try to subvert fairly run election. 95 00:05:03,960 --> 00:05:08,000 Speaker 3: And also she's argued that the Hatch Act applies, which 96 00:05:08,160 --> 00:05:12,880 Speaker 3: prevents of federal employees from political activity while they're in office. 97 00:05:13,440 --> 00:05:16,000 Speaker 2: Sarah, great to have you back, Sarah Fordon, who's got 98 00:05:16,000 --> 00:05:17,960 Speaker 2: more plates in the air than most editors right now, 99 00:05:18,000 --> 00:05:20,920 Speaker 2: Bloomberg Legal Editor, how'd you like that title? Right now? 100 00:05:20,920 --> 00:05:25,080 Speaker 2: In Washington with six we're talking six it's a remarkable piece. 101 00:05:25,160 --> 00:05:27,640 Speaker 2: Trials that could be underway over the course of this 102 00:05:27,720 --> 00:05:29,720 Speaker 2: election cycle. We have to wait for several of them 103 00:05:29,720 --> 00:05:31,720 Speaker 2: to be scheduled here, of course, but we want to 104 00:05:31,720 --> 00:05:35,120 Speaker 2: bring in Jim Zyron, the former Assistant US Attorney for 105 00:05:35,120 --> 00:05:37,600 Speaker 2: the Southern District of New York, He also hosts conversations 106 00:05:37,640 --> 00:05:40,239 Speaker 2: with Jim Zyron on PBS and has been a voice 107 00:05:40,240 --> 00:05:43,400 Speaker 2: of reason and trust here over the course of this 108 00:05:43,680 --> 00:05:47,280 Speaker 2: entire saga of well now four indictments as many as 109 00:05:47,320 --> 00:05:50,680 Speaker 2: six trials. Jim, it's great to have you back on Bloomberg. 110 00:05:50,839 --> 00:05:53,120 Speaker 2: Let's start with the breaking news of the day here 111 00:05:53,240 --> 00:05:57,560 Speaker 2: March fourth. Your thoughts on that, forget the political side 112 00:05:57,560 --> 00:05:59,840 Speaker 2: of it in terms of primary season, but just in 113 00:06:00,120 --> 00:06:02,680 Speaker 2: terms of being able to prepare. Donald Trump's lawyer, as 114 00:06:02,680 --> 00:06:05,479 Speaker 2: I mentioned, says it's an outrage to justice. What do 115 00:06:05,560 --> 00:06:05,919 Speaker 2: you think. 116 00:06:06,560 --> 00:06:08,760 Speaker 4: I don't think it's an outrage to justice. I mean, 117 00:06:09,000 --> 00:06:11,320 Speaker 4: you know, we're living the digital age. It's not the 118 00:06:11,360 --> 00:06:14,720 Speaker 4: way it used to be, where the lawyer had to 119 00:06:14,760 --> 00:06:19,039 Speaker 4: go through of voluminous pages of discovery in order to 120 00:06:19,040 --> 00:06:25,640 Speaker 4: prepare for trial. Now everything is digitalized, it's search friendly, 121 00:06:26,720 --> 00:06:29,359 Speaker 4: and the government has said it's going to tie the 122 00:06:30,360 --> 00:06:34,440 Speaker 4: various pieces of evidence to the charges and the indictment. 123 00:06:35,000 --> 00:06:38,240 Speaker 4: And it's not just one lawyer, it's a team of 124 00:06:38,320 --> 00:06:45,200 Speaker 4: lawyers and paralegals, and there will be searchable discovery. There'll 125 00:06:45,200 --> 00:06:48,719 Speaker 4: probably be more to come. I don't know whether twelve 126 00:06:48,720 --> 00:06:52,640 Speaker 4: point eight million may be modest number of pages, and 127 00:06:52,960 --> 00:06:55,120 Speaker 4: I think that the lawyers really should be up to 128 00:06:55,160 --> 00:06:57,760 Speaker 4: the task of trying the case on March fourth. 129 00:06:58,400 --> 00:07:00,400 Speaker 2: Well, so how does a legal team do that? I'm 130 00:07:00,400 --> 00:07:04,680 Speaker 2: just deeply curious. You get twelve point eight million pages 131 00:07:04,720 --> 00:07:06,760 Speaker 2: dropped on you, you get four months, what do you do 132 00:07:06,839 --> 00:07:08,520 Speaker 2: with that? You give you this up among the team. 133 00:07:08,520 --> 00:07:09,440 Speaker 2: What's the exercise? 134 00:07:10,040 --> 00:07:14,679 Speaker 4: Well, it's on discs and it's searchable, and the first 135 00:07:14,680 --> 00:07:17,440 Speaker 4: you have to have a theory of the defense, and 136 00:07:17,800 --> 00:07:22,160 Speaker 4: you will look for pages of discovery that might amplify 137 00:07:22,320 --> 00:07:26,800 Speaker 4: the defense of the case. But they don't have to 138 00:07:26,880 --> 00:07:32,000 Speaker 4: read every word of twelve point eight million documents. If 139 00:07:32,640 --> 00:07:38,880 Speaker 4: they did, we'd all be here until never, which is 140 00:07:38,920 --> 00:07:41,840 Speaker 4: the trial date that Donald Trump wanted. 141 00:07:42,440 --> 00:07:47,680 Speaker 2: Right, Well, he still wants it, though, So what's the 142 00:07:47,720 --> 00:07:48,760 Speaker 2: team going to do with that? 143 00:07:48,800 --> 00:07:52,760 Speaker 4: Well, basic principle of constitutional law, no trial, no conviction. 144 00:07:53,320 --> 00:07:57,280 Speaker 4: So if you can delay the trial interminably, or delay 145 00:07:57,320 --> 00:08:00,800 Speaker 4: the trial until there's a Republican president who might pardon him, 146 00:08:01,640 --> 00:08:04,000 Speaker 4: then he's home free, at least in the federal system, 147 00:08:04,320 --> 00:08:06,600 Speaker 4: Sarah pointed out, not in the state system. 148 00:08:07,320 --> 00:08:10,440 Speaker 2: Well, so sticking with this federal trial for a moment, though, 149 00:08:10,480 --> 00:08:12,920 Speaker 2: of course the team's going to come back around with 150 00:08:13,040 --> 00:08:15,800 Speaker 2: an attempt to delay. How likely is it this trial 151 00:08:15,800 --> 00:08:18,680 Speaker 2: actually begins on March fourth, Well. 152 00:08:18,440 --> 00:08:21,680 Speaker 4: I think is a realistic prospect of its beginning. They 153 00:08:21,720 --> 00:08:28,840 Speaker 4: will undoubtedly make motions, and they will motions to dismiss 154 00:08:29,720 --> 00:08:33,960 Speaker 4: motions for legal insufficiency. I think I don't know what 155 00:08:34,000 --> 00:08:36,400 Speaker 4: the basis would be for those motions, but I think 156 00:08:36,440 --> 00:08:39,400 Speaker 4: the judge would say there has to be a jury 157 00:08:39,440 --> 00:08:44,079 Speaker 4: determination and will pass the determination on the motions and 158 00:08:44,200 --> 00:08:50,679 Speaker 4: dismiss and until the trial occurs and the prosecutor's evidence 159 00:08:50,720 --> 00:08:53,280 Speaker 4: is laid out before the jury. 160 00:08:54,280 --> 00:08:57,360 Speaker 2: So what do you make of this idea? Knowing that 161 00:08:57,400 --> 00:09:01,319 Speaker 2: we've got the criminal cases as well as a couple 162 00:09:01,320 --> 00:09:05,080 Speaker 2: of civil cases as well. They total six. Could we 163 00:09:05,120 --> 00:09:07,080 Speaker 2: be in a world in which six trials are underway 164 00:09:07,559 --> 00:09:09,160 Speaker 2: in the balance of this campaign cycle. 165 00:09:10,080 --> 00:09:13,440 Speaker 4: Well, it's conceivable the two civil cases will not require 166 00:09:13,480 --> 00:09:18,840 Speaker 4: Trump's attendance. That would be the Tiss James's fraud case. 167 00:09:19,280 --> 00:09:22,280 Speaker 4: She's the Attorney General in New York, her fraud case, 168 00:09:22,880 --> 00:09:25,960 Speaker 4: the civil case that she brought in New York, and 169 00:09:26,000 --> 00:09:30,080 Speaker 4: then also the e Gene Carroll two, which is the 170 00:09:30,200 --> 00:09:35,080 Speaker 4: libel case that is before Judge Kaplan in New York, 171 00:09:35,679 --> 00:09:40,839 Speaker 4: and that may not require a trial either because of 172 00:09:40,960 --> 00:09:42,960 Speaker 4: the findings that were made by the jury in the 173 00:09:43,000 --> 00:09:46,800 Speaker 4: first trial. We'll have to see how that plays out, 174 00:09:47,840 --> 00:09:50,360 Speaker 4: but in any event, they will not require Trump's presence. 175 00:09:50,360 --> 00:09:53,280 Speaker 4: That will be handled by the lawyers, and that should 176 00:09:53,320 --> 00:09:58,600 Speaker 4: not be a distraction. But the other the two cases 177 00:09:59,200 --> 00:10:03,560 Speaker 4: that going to be very important are the case in Georgia, 178 00:10:03,600 --> 00:10:08,240 Speaker 4: of course, and in which Trump may find himself with 179 00:10:08,400 --> 00:10:13,160 Speaker 4: the speedy trial of October of twenty three that his 180 00:10:13,280 --> 00:10:18,240 Speaker 4: co defendants have achieved and although he's asked that he 181 00:10:18,360 --> 00:10:23,240 Speaker 4: be severed from that aspect of the case, and the 182 00:10:23,280 --> 00:10:25,720 Speaker 4: March fourth, which is I think a pretty hard date. 183 00:10:26,280 --> 00:10:30,360 Speaker 4: But the really important thing to focus on is when 184 00:10:30,400 --> 00:10:34,280 Speaker 4: we hear of speedy trial, we think, well, constitution says 185 00:10:34,280 --> 00:10:37,880 Speaker 4: a defendant is entitled to a speedy trial, but as 186 00:10:38,120 --> 00:10:42,120 Speaker 4: Judge Shutkin pointed out and the case law demonstrates, the 187 00:10:42,200 --> 00:10:45,600 Speaker 4: public interest is entitled to a speedy trial. This is 188 00:10:45,600 --> 00:10:48,920 Speaker 4: an issue that the public is entitled to have resolved 189 00:10:49,280 --> 00:10:52,320 Speaker 4: with a jury verdict one way or the other. Trump 190 00:10:52,400 --> 00:10:55,720 Speaker 4: is presumed to be innocent, but the evidence to be 191 00:10:55,720 --> 00:10:59,440 Speaker 4: presented by the prosecutor, and should he be convicted, the 192 00:10:59,480 --> 00:11:02,079 Speaker 4: public is entitled to know that he's been convicted by 193 00:11:02,080 --> 00:11:02,600 Speaker 4: a jury. 194 00:11:03,120 --> 00:11:05,480 Speaker 2: So with all of that said, we're going to be 195 00:11:05,520 --> 00:11:08,160 Speaker 2: choosing candidates. You're going to be voting as soon as 196 00:11:08,200 --> 00:11:13,080 Speaker 2: January fifteenth. That's Iowa Jim. So the political side of 197 00:11:13,080 --> 00:11:14,880 Speaker 2: this is, my goodness, how does he do it all? 198 00:11:15,440 --> 00:11:15,600 Speaker 1: Well? 199 00:11:15,640 --> 00:11:18,959 Speaker 2: He have to be in court for all of these trials. 200 00:11:19,280 --> 00:11:22,319 Speaker 2: How is he going to run a presidential campaign at 201 00:11:22,320 --> 00:11:25,800 Speaker 2: the same time as managing potentially six trials? Give us 202 00:11:25,840 --> 00:11:29,840 Speaker 2: a sense of how much geography will be involved here 203 00:11:29,880 --> 00:11:32,600 Speaker 2: when we consider all of these East Coast courthouses and 204 00:11:32,640 --> 00:11:35,520 Speaker 2: how often he'll be required to show up in person. 205 00:11:36,640 --> 00:11:39,600 Speaker 4: I think it's going to be his problem. It depends 206 00:11:39,640 --> 00:11:43,240 Speaker 4: on the scheduling. As for the criminal cases he will 207 00:11:43,280 --> 00:11:47,800 Speaker 4: be required to appear in court. I suppose he get 208 00:11:47,840 --> 00:11:54,280 Speaker 4: a peer for an hour and then withdraw and waive 209 00:11:54,400 --> 00:11:58,440 Speaker 4: his right to be confronted with the charges. I don't 210 00:11:58,480 --> 00:12:02,880 Speaker 4: know what the Georgia procedure is, but basically all this 211 00:12:03,040 --> 00:12:07,000 Speaker 4: litigation is going to absorb a tremendous amount of attention. 212 00:12:07,120 --> 00:12:09,959 Speaker 4: In his part, he has lawyers to handle it for him, 213 00:12:09,960 --> 00:12:11,800 Speaker 4: but he has to meet with the lawyers and confer 214 00:12:11,880 --> 00:12:15,240 Speaker 4: with them, and they have to fashion the defense to 215 00:12:15,320 --> 00:12:19,680 Speaker 4: the various charges, and that takes time. And if he's 216 00:12:19,720 --> 00:12:25,160 Speaker 4: distracted from the political campaign, that's just his problem. He has, 217 00:12:26,080 --> 00:12:30,640 Speaker 4: as a criminal defendant, no constitutional right to have personal 218 00:12:30,720 --> 00:12:34,760 Speaker 4: or professional commitments. As Judge Chutkins said, he has to 219 00:12:34,800 --> 00:12:36,640 Speaker 4: be treated like any other defendant. 220 00:12:37,400 --> 00:12:41,959 Speaker 2: When we talk about a speedy trial, that obviously has 221 00:12:42,000 --> 00:12:43,640 Speaker 2: to do with when the trial is taken up, but 222 00:12:43,720 --> 00:12:47,120 Speaker 2: also the duration of the trial. Jim or these weeks long, 223 00:12:47,200 --> 00:12:51,080 Speaker 2: months long, they're going to be underway when the election happens. 224 00:12:51,520 --> 00:12:52,000 Speaker 2: Which is it? 225 00:12:52,280 --> 00:12:56,520 Speaker 4: Oh, I think the DC case starts March four, it 226 00:12:56,800 --> 00:13:00,920 Speaker 4: will end long before the election. I think you're talking 227 00:13:00,920 --> 00:13:04,960 Speaker 4: about a four to six week trial here, even if 228 00:13:05,000 --> 00:13:12,200 Speaker 4: it's a two month trial. And we've had significant criminal 229 00:13:12,240 --> 00:13:17,880 Speaker 4: cases in the Southern District of New York, the conspiracy 230 00:13:17,920 --> 00:13:22,480 Speaker 4: cases with multiple defendants and the trial took two months. 231 00:13:23,559 --> 00:13:27,320 Speaker 4: I think, particularly because Jack Smith has peered it down 232 00:13:27,400 --> 00:13:30,880 Speaker 4: in the District of Columbia to have one defendant, one defendant, 233 00:13:30,880 --> 00:13:35,520 Speaker 4: Donald Trump, to prove this conspiracy that he charges actually 234 00:13:35,520 --> 00:13:41,240 Speaker 4: three conspiracies. And he ought to be skilled prosecutor, and 235 00:13:41,280 --> 00:13:43,680 Speaker 4: he ought to be able to present his case. And 236 00:13:43,960 --> 00:13:45,800 Speaker 4: I don't know what the defense will be. I don't 237 00:13:45,800 --> 00:13:49,360 Speaker 4: know whether Trump can take the stand. But the case 238 00:13:49,480 --> 00:13:54,720 Speaker 4: really could be tried within the period of two months 239 00:13:54,720 --> 00:13:55,520 Speaker 4: in my view. 240 00:13:56,200 --> 00:13:58,120 Speaker 2: Two months. So do you feel that way about the 241 00:13:58,120 --> 00:13:59,800 Speaker 2: other Special Council's trial as well? 242 00:14:00,679 --> 00:14:04,679 Speaker 4: Oh, the one in Florida is somewhat more complicated because 243 00:14:04,720 --> 00:14:08,800 Speaker 4: of the presence of two other defendants and also the 244 00:14:08,840 --> 00:14:10,640 Speaker 4: presence of the classified document. 245 00:14:10,720 --> 00:14:13,599 Speaker 2: But still before the election. I'm guessing you're Sam Jim. 246 00:14:13,600 --> 00:14:17,160 Speaker 4: And yes, I don't really believe the Florida case will 247 00:14:17,200 --> 00:14:18,480 Speaker 4: be tried before the election. 248 00:14:19,040 --> 00:14:21,240 Speaker 2: All right, here you have it from jim 'siron. Great 249 00:14:21,240 --> 00:14:24,080 Speaker 2: to have you back. Jimmy's the four assistant US Attorney 250 00:14:24,160 --> 00:14:26,240 Speaker 2: for the Southern District of New York. He knows of 251 00:14:26,280 --> 00:14:29,960 Speaker 2: what he speaks. How does that sound like for a 252 00:14:29,960 --> 00:14:32,440 Speaker 2: little bit of a messy campaign calendar. We'll assemble our 253 00:14:32,440 --> 00:14:34,360 Speaker 2: panel next. Brick and Genie are on the way. This 254 00:14:34,680 --> 00:14:35,280 Speaker 2: is Bloomberg. 255 00:14:37,280 --> 00:14:40,800 Speaker 1: You're listening to the Bloomberg Sound on podcast. Catch us 256 00:14:40,840 --> 00:14:44,000 Speaker 1: live weekdays at one Eastern on Bloomberg dot com, the 257 00:14:44,080 --> 00:14:47,120 Speaker 1: iHeartRadio app, and the Bloomberg Business app or listen on 258 00:14:47,240 --> 00:14:49,760 Speaker 1: demand wherever you get your podcast. 259 00:14:52,000 --> 00:14:55,040 Speaker 2: Live from Washington, where there are many questions about how 260 00:14:55,080 --> 00:14:57,360 Speaker 2: Donald Trump is going to manage these trials in the 261 00:14:57,400 --> 00:14:59,600 Speaker 2: throes of a campaign season. Now that we have a 262 00:14:59,720 --> 00:15:03,760 Speaker 2: date on the January sixth case, this is the one, 263 00:15:03,800 --> 00:15:05,680 Speaker 2: of course, brought by the Special Council. I know it 264 00:15:05,680 --> 00:15:09,880 Speaker 2: gets confusing, Jack Smith January sixth efforts allegedly to overturn 265 00:15:09,920 --> 00:15:13,520 Speaker 2: the twenty twenty election is that's still allegedly thet is 266 00:15:13,560 --> 00:15:18,520 Speaker 2: opening open to this. But either way, March fourth, the 267 00:15:18,640 --> 00:15:21,680 Speaker 2: eve of Super Tuesday, is what we're looking at. And 268 00:15:21,680 --> 00:15:23,240 Speaker 2: you know there's going to be an effort to slow 269 00:15:23,280 --> 00:15:25,720 Speaker 2: this down. But it is quite a headline to read 270 00:15:25,720 --> 00:15:27,400 Speaker 2: on the terminal, and it's a great piece of writing. 271 00:15:27,440 --> 00:15:30,480 Speaker 2: By the way, Trump faces prospective up to six trials 272 00:15:30,520 --> 00:15:33,080 Speaker 2: during primary season. We assembled our panel Rick Davis and 273 00:15:33,200 --> 00:15:37,520 Speaker 2: Jeanie Shanzano or with us Bloomberg Politics contributors. Rick, do 274 00:15:37,560 --> 00:15:41,240 Speaker 2: you think this actually happens the fourth of March? Well, 275 00:15:41,320 --> 00:15:42,800 Speaker 2: something's going to happen on the fourth of March. 276 00:15:42,840 --> 00:15:45,000 Speaker 5: I mean, you know you're going to be two days 277 00:15:45,040 --> 00:15:48,920 Speaker 5: after the Idaho caucuses and and you know, it's the 278 00:15:49,000 --> 00:15:52,520 Speaker 5: kind of thing where you just can't even imagine the 279 00:15:53,880 --> 00:15:58,080 Speaker 5: taking out of the primary season so much time to 280 00:15:58,960 --> 00:16:01,560 Speaker 5: you know, have try for your life. I mean, you know, 281 00:16:01,640 --> 00:16:04,760 Speaker 5: this is really serious stuff for Donald Trump, and he's 282 00:16:04,800 --> 00:16:08,320 Speaker 5: going to be completely you know, taken back by having 283 00:16:08,360 --> 00:16:10,240 Speaker 5: to take time off the road, take time out of 284 00:16:10,240 --> 00:16:13,200 Speaker 5: his campaign, focus on other things. And I think that 285 00:16:13,440 --> 00:16:16,240 Speaker 5: it march forth happens, and there's no way to predict it. 286 00:16:16,240 --> 00:16:19,920 Speaker 5: It will you know, you're an expert. After expert will 287 00:16:19,920 --> 00:16:23,920 Speaker 5: give you a different opinion. But just contemplating this idea 288 00:16:24,080 --> 00:16:26,880 Speaker 5: of having a federal trial in the middle of a 289 00:16:27,160 --> 00:16:30,120 Speaker 5: primary season, it's just it blows my mind as someone 290 00:16:30,120 --> 00:16:33,520 Speaker 5: who is obsessed over dates and where the candidate needs 291 00:16:33,520 --> 00:16:35,040 Speaker 5: to be and how much time they need to have 292 00:16:35,160 --> 00:16:38,000 Speaker 5: and what debates coming up next, and now you're going 293 00:16:38,080 --> 00:16:40,000 Speaker 5: to enter into this kind of thing, and this is 294 00:16:40,040 --> 00:16:43,480 Speaker 5: just one of six. It's it's just mind boggling. 295 00:16:44,120 --> 00:16:48,240 Speaker 2: Twelve point eight million pages, Genie. If you put all 296 00:16:48,320 --> 00:16:51,320 Speaker 2: the students at I own a university together, I wonder 297 00:16:51,320 --> 00:16:52,880 Speaker 2: how long it would take them to get through that. 298 00:16:52,920 --> 00:16:56,080 Speaker 2: Of course, there is a legal team here, but is 299 00:16:56,120 --> 00:16:57,960 Speaker 2: this fair to say go to trial in four months 300 00:16:58,000 --> 00:17:00,120 Speaker 2: when you have that much discovery. 301 00:17:00,120 --> 00:17:03,000 Speaker 6: Students at IONA would get through it a lot quicker 302 00:17:03,040 --> 00:17:07,359 Speaker 6: than those defense attorneys. Kidding you know, I do think 303 00:17:07,480 --> 00:17:10,480 Speaker 6: listen Judge Chuck, and she was very clear today. She 304 00:17:10,640 --> 00:17:15,199 Speaker 6: asked them to give her a reasonable timeframe, a reasonable date. Obviously, 305 00:17:15,240 --> 00:17:19,560 Speaker 6: April twenty twenty six is not reasonable, particularly when you 306 00:17:19,720 --> 00:17:22,440 Speaker 6: have somebody who is going on trial, who is posting 307 00:17:22,480 --> 00:17:25,840 Speaker 6: the kinds of messages he is and tainting the jury pool. 308 00:17:25,920 --> 00:17:28,800 Speaker 6: So she said, look, guys, gals, give me a reasonable date. 309 00:17:29,040 --> 00:17:31,800 Speaker 6: They didn't, So she came back strong. And I think 310 00:17:31,840 --> 00:17:33,320 Speaker 6: one of the things we have to keep in mind 311 00:17:33,400 --> 00:17:37,560 Speaker 6: is this doesn't only impact Trump, and it impacts him severely. 312 00:17:37,880 --> 00:17:40,520 Speaker 6: It also impacts the rest of the field because think 313 00:17:40,520 --> 00:17:44,119 Speaker 6: about this. You're out there normally after Iowa who he 314 00:17:44,119 --> 00:17:46,480 Speaker 6: I'm sure the field starts to winnow down. But now 315 00:17:46,520 --> 00:17:51,200 Speaker 6: you've got the leading contender facing to ricks point six trials, 316 00:17:51,680 --> 00:17:55,520 Speaker 6: four of whom are serious criminal indictments. Do you drop 317 00:17:55,560 --> 00:17:58,720 Speaker 6: out now after a couple of caucuses and primaries or 318 00:17:58,760 --> 00:18:01,360 Speaker 6: do you stick with it? Same for the big donors, 319 00:18:01,600 --> 00:18:04,520 Speaker 6: they might stick with it, thinking we need a viable 320 00:18:04,600 --> 00:18:07,600 Speaker 6: number two or number three, God forbid something happens to 321 00:18:07,640 --> 00:18:10,919 Speaker 6: our number one. So the entire I think calendar is 322 00:18:10,920 --> 00:18:13,880 Speaker 6: going to be blown up in this Republican field. Anybody 323 00:18:13,880 --> 00:18:17,480 Speaker 6: who wanted consolidation probably not going to get it now. 324 00:18:19,000 --> 00:18:21,840 Speaker 2: Well, we've, of course, we've got the matter in Georgia 325 00:18:21,920 --> 00:18:23,800 Speaker 2: as well, and whether this is going to go federal 326 00:18:23,880 --> 00:18:25,960 Speaker 2: or not for Mark Meadows. But we'll wait and see 327 00:18:25,960 --> 00:18:29,200 Speaker 2: what happens with all of that. We heard from Alina Haba, 328 00:18:29,359 --> 00:18:33,359 Speaker 2: Donald Trump's attorney on Fox over the weekend talking about 329 00:18:33,359 --> 00:18:36,879 Speaker 2: this and kind of fascinating. You know, I guess he 330 00:18:36,920 --> 00:18:37,560 Speaker 2: knows what he knows. 331 00:18:37,680 --> 00:18:40,200 Speaker 7: These are not complicated facts. Look at Fanny, it was 332 00:18:40,240 --> 00:18:43,000 Speaker 7: a phone call, a phone call that's been around forever 333 00:18:43,200 --> 00:18:45,879 Speaker 7: that he refers to as the perfect phone call. What 334 00:18:46,080 --> 00:18:48,600 Speaker 7: is he going to have to be prepped for? The truth? 335 00:18:48,880 --> 00:18:51,359 Speaker 7: You don't have to prep much when you've done nothing wrong, 336 00:18:51,600 --> 00:18:52,960 Speaker 7: so that I'm not concerned with. 337 00:18:53,160 --> 00:18:54,919 Speaker 2: So it sounds like then we just go for it, 338 00:18:55,000 --> 00:18:57,080 Speaker 2: rip off the band aid, and hit it. In March, Rick, 339 00:18:57,119 --> 00:18:59,480 Speaker 2: if you were preparing a candidate for Super Tuesday, this 340 00:18:59,520 --> 00:19:02,840 Speaker 2: again is on the eve of what would be a 341 00:19:02,920 --> 00:19:06,720 Speaker 2: normal day before Super Tuesday. Suggest you know, in the 342 00:19:06,720 --> 00:19:08,800 Speaker 2: world in which your candidate was not going to trial, 343 00:19:08,920 --> 00:19:11,119 Speaker 2: where would you have him or her? What would they 344 00:19:11,200 --> 00:19:12,919 Speaker 2: be doing? Well, you would. 345 00:19:12,640 --> 00:19:16,080 Speaker 5: Start probably in the East coast and and and spend 346 00:19:16,119 --> 00:19:19,320 Speaker 5: two days flying from the East coast to the West coast, 347 00:19:19,359 --> 00:19:23,280 Speaker 5: with six to eight stops a day in that in 348 00:19:23,280 --> 00:19:26,160 Speaker 5: that category, just to even set foot on a state 349 00:19:26,240 --> 00:19:29,840 Speaker 5: that's that's voting, you know, on March fifth. So I mean, 350 00:19:30,080 --> 00:19:32,919 Speaker 5: you know, you wouldn't be sitting in a courtroom worrying 351 00:19:32,920 --> 00:19:36,439 Speaker 5: about your imprisonment. You'd be you'd be trying to figure 352 00:19:36,440 --> 00:19:40,200 Speaker 5: out how to get so many rallies at airports that 353 00:19:40,359 --> 00:19:43,440 Speaker 5: you create a little momentum for the states on Super Tuesday, 354 00:19:43,480 --> 00:19:47,600 Speaker 5: and and so you know, that's you can't imagine how 355 00:19:47,760 --> 00:19:50,760 Speaker 5: different it would be if someone walks into the campaign. 356 00:19:51,280 --> 00:19:53,040 Speaker 5: By the way, you can't have the candidate on Super 357 00:19:53,080 --> 00:19:57,040 Speaker 5: Tuesday or the day before because he's sitting in a courtroom. 358 00:19:57,080 --> 00:19:59,240 Speaker 5: And you know, Washington, d C. I mean, we wouldn't 359 00:19:59,240 --> 00:20:02,320 Speaker 5: even go to Washington to DC in a year that 360 00:20:02,480 --> 00:20:06,600 Speaker 5: you're ever prim nevertheless having to repeatedly go there to 361 00:20:06,920 --> 00:20:07,679 Speaker 5: stand trial. 362 00:20:08,240 --> 00:20:12,600 Speaker 2: Oh wow, we've got some new polling data out here today, 363 00:20:12,680 --> 00:20:14,760 Speaker 2: Genie I don't know if you saw the latest from Emerson. 364 00:20:14,800 --> 00:20:17,480 Speaker 2: This is a poll of registered voters, which is something 365 00:20:17,520 --> 00:20:20,560 Speaker 2: that we do want to flag as opposed to likely 366 00:20:20,880 --> 00:20:24,960 Speaker 2: primary voters. But it's got Donald Trump at fifty rohnd 367 00:20:24,960 --> 00:20:28,000 Speaker 2: de Santis at twelve. It's creating the headline at least 368 00:20:28,000 --> 00:20:33,000 Speaker 2: that post debate and post indictments, that this gap might 369 00:20:33,040 --> 00:20:35,159 Speaker 2: be narrowing. But can we even say that in a 370 00:20:35,200 --> 00:20:36,240 Speaker 2: fifty to twelve race. 371 00:20:36,880 --> 00:20:39,280 Speaker 6: Yeah, I mean we we are really stretching it to 372 00:20:39,320 --> 00:20:42,080 Speaker 6: say he has dropped compared to the last poll about 373 00:20:42,119 --> 00:20:46,560 Speaker 6: six points, but you know, you are still so far 374 00:20:46,680 --> 00:20:49,000 Speaker 6: ahead that it's hard to know what to make of 375 00:20:49,040 --> 00:20:51,040 Speaker 6: it at this point. And of course he did not 376 00:20:51,200 --> 00:20:54,159 Speaker 6: show up for the debate. He was just indicted for 377 00:20:54,240 --> 00:20:56,840 Speaker 6: the fourth time and turned himself in in Georgia. And 378 00:20:56,880 --> 00:20:59,080 Speaker 6: can we just go back to the Alina Habba thing 379 00:20:59,200 --> 00:21:03,480 Speaker 6: and say yes, she blows up his entire reason for 380 00:21:03,600 --> 00:21:07,320 Speaker 6: extending the trial. She goes on national television and says 381 00:21:07,440 --> 00:21:09,800 Speaker 6: he's set to go. He's telling the truth. He doesn't 382 00:21:09,880 --> 00:21:12,400 Speaker 6: need to think about this or prepare for it. They're 383 00:21:12,440 --> 00:21:15,040 Speaker 6: not worried at all. This is where the political and 384 00:21:15,080 --> 00:21:17,600 Speaker 6: the legal and I think Haba has, you know, confused 385 00:21:17,640 --> 00:21:20,159 Speaker 6: where she is. She's an attorney. She's trying to make 386 00:21:20,200 --> 00:21:23,040 Speaker 6: a political argument about his ability to tell the truth 387 00:21:23,080 --> 00:21:25,919 Speaker 6: and not prepare. Then why do they need until April 388 00:21:26,000 --> 00:21:27,040 Speaker 6: twenty twenty six? 389 00:21:28,080 --> 00:21:31,919 Speaker 2: Mm hmm, Absolutely, keep going, Jeanie does so. 390 00:21:32,080 --> 00:21:34,720 Speaker 6: I thank you for cheering for me, Joe, I appreciate it. 391 00:21:35,359 --> 00:21:38,639 Speaker 6: Get Zio, so, you know, I think we're going to 392 00:21:38,680 --> 00:21:41,680 Speaker 6: continue to hear these conflicting messages. There are so many 393 00:21:41,760 --> 00:21:44,840 Speaker 6: cooks in the kitchen and you have to have somebody 394 00:21:44,880 --> 00:21:46,760 Speaker 6: take the lead. But now you've got people in the 395 00:21:46,800 --> 00:21:49,520 Speaker 6: political realm who are saying far different things from the 396 00:21:49,520 --> 00:21:52,639 Speaker 6: people in the legal realm, and they don't jibe. So 397 00:21:52,680 --> 00:21:54,879 Speaker 6: you got a judge Calught in the middle saying, listen, folks, 398 00:21:55,200 --> 00:21:58,040 Speaker 6: this is not reasonable. You're saying one thing, doing another. 399 00:21:58,119 --> 00:22:00,880 Speaker 6: You're tainting our jury pool. We're going forward and he's 400 00:22:00,920 --> 00:22:03,119 Speaker 6: going to be victimized in court for that, which is 401 00:22:03,200 --> 00:22:06,240 Speaker 6: unfair to him as a defendant, but as a political figure. 402 00:22:06,280 --> 00:22:08,639 Speaker 6: This is what his folks are saying publicly. 403 00:22:09,200 --> 00:22:11,719 Speaker 2: Facts are the facts, apparently, Genie, and he knows the facts. 404 00:22:11,720 --> 00:22:15,280 Speaker 2: According to Alina Haba, I will ask you both about 405 00:22:15,359 --> 00:22:18,320 Speaker 2: Ron DeSantis in his weekend now, as I've invoked him already, 406 00:22:18,680 --> 00:22:21,359 Speaker 2: whether she's looking better or worse. He had a tough 407 00:22:21,359 --> 00:22:23,639 Speaker 2: weekend and that cheering, by the way, turned into booing 408 00:22:24,080 --> 00:22:26,959 Speaker 2: in Jacksonville over the weekend. Of course, the scene of 409 00:22:27,000 --> 00:22:30,560 Speaker 2: this terrible shooting that made news over the course of 410 00:22:30,600 --> 00:22:32,439 Speaker 2: the weekend. He had to go back to Florida to 411 00:22:32,480 --> 00:22:39,360 Speaker 2: a vigil last night. Here's what it sounded like. He's 412 00:22:39,400 --> 00:22:42,720 Speaker 2: walking in with the first lady and it quickly turns 413 00:22:42,760 --> 00:22:45,000 Speaker 2: to booze. This is a big group of people standing 414 00:22:45,000 --> 00:22:48,040 Speaker 2: around waiting for this vigil to begin. He did attend 415 00:22:48,119 --> 00:22:53,399 Speaker 2: that vigil, but it comes after his comments on the 416 00:22:53,480 --> 00:22:56,600 Speaker 2: matter as well. He did hold a news conference following 417 00:22:56,680 --> 00:22:58,360 Speaker 2: the shooting to talk about what they had learned. 418 00:22:58,520 --> 00:23:02,640 Speaker 8: State and its people can the horrific racially motivated murders 419 00:23:03,080 --> 00:23:07,520 Speaker 8: perpetrated by a deranged scumbag in Jacksonville at the Dollar 420 00:23:07,600 --> 00:23:13,320 Speaker 8: General store. Perpetrating violence of this kind is unacceptable, and 421 00:23:13,440 --> 00:23:16,919 Speaker 8: targeting people due to their race has no place in 422 00:23:16,960 --> 00:23:17,840 Speaker 8: the state of Florida. 423 00:23:17,880 --> 00:23:19,560 Speaker 2: We got a lot of criticism for that, and only 424 00:23:19,560 --> 00:23:21,760 Speaker 2: the use of the term scumbag, but just sort of 425 00:23:21,800 --> 00:23:25,000 Speaker 2: the nature of the delivery, the tone, Rick, is this 426 00:23:25,080 --> 00:23:28,440 Speaker 2: a moment for Ronda Santis to show why he should 427 00:23:28,480 --> 00:23:29,000 Speaker 2: be president? 428 00:23:30,080 --> 00:23:33,720 Speaker 5: Well, certainly leadership matters, and his you know, sort of 429 00:23:33,720 --> 00:23:38,680 Speaker 5: colloquial rhetoric related to this was you know, you could 430 00:23:38,720 --> 00:23:42,000 Speaker 5: cut it both ways, but obviously some of the people 431 00:23:42,040 --> 00:23:45,520 Speaker 5: there took issue at that or took issue in general, 432 00:23:45,800 --> 00:23:48,960 Speaker 5: you know, with his leadership of the state. But this 433 00:23:49,040 --> 00:23:53,159 Speaker 5: is reality descending upon presidential campaign that you know, to 434 00:23:53,240 --> 00:23:56,040 Speaker 5: some degree operates in a bubble, and so pulling him 435 00:23:56,040 --> 00:23:58,800 Speaker 5: out of that, taking him from South Carolina where he'd 436 00:23:58,800 --> 00:24:01,480 Speaker 5: planned to spend the day, uh, take him home to 437 00:24:01,760 --> 00:24:04,639 Speaker 5: uh to you know, uh preside over you know, a 438 00:24:04,720 --> 00:24:08,640 Speaker 5: really disturbing set of facts, you know, is jarring and 439 00:24:08,680 --> 00:24:11,920 Speaker 5: so uh you know, but it's a reality. He's a 440 00:24:11,960 --> 00:24:14,639 Speaker 5: governor of the state. A lot of the campaign before 441 00:24:15,040 --> 00:24:18,239 Speaker 5: he got elected re elected was how much time are 442 00:24:18,240 --> 00:24:19,720 Speaker 5: you going to spend in the state, you know, being 443 00:24:19,720 --> 00:24:23,199 Speaker 5: our governor? And and this is a musco you know, 444 00:24:23,280 --> 00:24:24,879 Speaker 5: right on the backs of this is going to be 445 00:24:24,920 --> 00:24:28,159 Speaker 5: a tropical storm that's coming to the state, and you 446 00:24:28,200 --> 00:24:31,800 Speaker 5: know that's gonna that's gonna disrupt his h his campaign 447 00:24:31,840 --> 00:24:34,679 Speaker 5: reality too. So you know, look, he doesn't have a 448 00:24:34,960 --> 00:24:38,439 Speaker 5: he doesn't have you know, these horrific uh situation that 449 00:24:38,520 --> 00:24:41,840 Speaker 5: Donald Trump does to have to go on trial throughout 450 00:24:41,880 --> 00:24:43,800 Speaker 5: the course of the year. But this is a chance 451 00:24:43,840 --> 00:24:46,959 Speaker 5: to show leadership. And you know, I think that I 452 00:24:47,000 --> 00:24:48,960 Speaker 5: think that, you know, sort of you know, we're still 453 00:24:49,000 --> 00:24:51,320 Speaker 5: looking for that breakout moment for him. 454 00:24:51,480 --> 00:24:53,040 Speaker 2: Well, we're going to get into that a little bit more. 455 00:24:53,040 --> 00:24:54,639 Speaker 2: It does appear that this storm is going to keep 456 00:24:54,680 --> 00:24:56,600 Speaker 2: on to Santus off the trail for a bit longer 457 00:24:56,600 --> 00:24:59,080 Speaker 2: than he might prefer. Rick Davis and Jeanie Shanzana will 458 00:24:59,080 --> 00:25:00,600 Speaker 2: have more on the way that should be handled coming 459 00:25:00,680 --> 00:25:01,119 Speaker 2: up next. 460 00:25:02,280 --> 00:25:05,639 Speaker 1: You're listening to The Bloomberg Sound on podcast. Catch the 461 00:25:05,680 --> 00:25:09,560 Speaker 1: program live weekdays at one Eastern on Bloomberg Radio, the 462 00:25:09,640 --> 00:25:12,960 Speaker 1: tune in alf, Bloomberg dot Com, and the Bloomberg Business App. 463 00:25:13,080 --> 00:25:15,960 Speaker 1: You can also listen live on Amazon Alexa from our 464 00:25:15,960 --> 00:25:21,240 Speaker 1: flagship New York station, Just say Alexa Play Bloomberg eleven thirty. 465 00:25:22,119 --> 00:25:27,560 Speaker 2: They're preparing for hurricane strength conditions in Florida, with an 466 00:25:27,560 --> 00:25:33,080 Speaker 2: eye on Jacksonville. Governor Ron DeSantis spending time there following 467 00:25:33,119 --> 00:25:35,720 Speaker 2: this terrible mass shooting over the weekend. Now dealing potentially 468 00:25:35,800 --> 00:25:38,800 Speaker 2: with two prices at once in the throes of a 469 00:25:38,840 --> 00:25:42,160 Speaker 2: presidential campaign, and as we heard over the weekend, it's 470 00:25:42,160 --> 00:25:45,280 Speaker 2: going to mean likely some time off the campaign trail. 471 00:25:45,320 --> 00:25:48,119 Speaker 2: Let's reassemble our panel for more on the impact of 472 00:25:48,160 --> 00:25:50,640 Speaker 2: all of this. Rick Davis, Jeanie Shanza with US Bloomberg 473 00:25:50,720 --> 00:25:54,720 Speaker 2: Politics contributors. Rick, I remember specifically the first day of 474 00:25:54,760 --> 00:25:57,720 Speaker 2: the Republican convention. It was John McCain's convention, and by that, 475 00:25:57,800 --> 00:26:00,000 Speaker 2: I mean it was your convention in two thousand and eight, 476 00:26:00,080 --> 00:26:02,440 Speaker 2: Saint Paul, and there was a hurricane on the way 477 00:26:02,440 --> 00:26:04,160 Speaker 2: to New Orleans and you had a decision to make 478 00:26:04,200 --> 00:26:07,120 Speaker 2: on whether to run the program per usual that day. 479 00:26:07,160 --> 00:26:09,000 Speaker 2: You also know what it's like to pull a candidate 480 00:26:09,000 --> 00:26:13,280 Speaker 2: off the trail when you suspended John McCain's campaign at 481 00:26:13,320 --> 00:26:16,199 Speaker 2: the threshold of the Great Recession, when of course everyone 482 00:26:16,240 --> 00:26:19,199 Speaker 2: came to Washington to try to figure out a path forward. 483 00:26:19,520 --> 00:26:21,680 Speaker 2: What would you do now for Ronda Santis And if 484 00:26:21,680 --> 00:26:24,320 Speaker 2: it is removal from the campaign trail, how do you 485 00:26:24,359 --> 00:26:24,800 Speaker 2: manage that? 486 00:26:25,720 --> 00:26:27,720 Speaker 5: Well, first of all, you got to, you know, connect 487 00:26:27,720 --> 00:26:29,639 Speaker 5: with the American people and tell them why and what 488 00:26:29,720 --> 00:26:31,960 Speaker 5: you're doing. I mean when we canceled the first day 489 00:26:32,080 --> 00:26:34,320 Speaker 5: of the Republican Convention in two thousand and eight with 490 00:26:34,520 --> 00:26:38,359 Speaker 5: Hurricane gustav you know, coming down on Florida. You know, 491 00:26:38,520 --> 00:26:42,119 Speaker 5: everybody at that time still remembered very clearly, you know, 492 00:26:42,240 --> 00:26:45,840 Speaker 5: the disruption to the state and the failures of the 493 00:26:45,840 --> 00:26:48,960 Speaker 5: Bush administration when it came to managing Hurricane Katrina. So 494 00:26:49,359 --> 00:26:52,320 Speaker 5: that was very much in people's psyche when we made 495 00:26:52,359 --> 00:26:54,600 Speaker 5: that decision. And how can you celebrate? How can you 496 00:26:54,640 --> 00:26:57,840 Speaker 5: have balloons dropping from a ceiling, you know, when people 497 00:26:58,080 --> 00:27:01,120 Speaker 5: in a key state like Florida, you know, or hunkered down, 498 00:27:01,240 --> 00:27:04,280 Speaker 5: you know, hoping that you know, they don't have their 499 00:27:04,280 --> 00:27:07,000 Speaker 5: lives taken away. So you know, at some point you 500 00:27:07,080 --> 00:27:10,600 Speaker 5: have to actually be rational and say no way, you know, 501 00:27:10,680 --> 00:27:12,879 Speaker 5: you can't do it. And we lost a night of 502 00:27:13,000 --> 00:27:17,040 Speaker 5: television and activity, you know, as a result of that. 503 00:27:17,160 --> 00:27:20,440 Speaker 5: But I think sometimes you're graded for what you don't 504 00:27:20,480 --> 00:27:23,399 Speaker 5: do right, you don't make the mistake of celebrating at 505 00:27:23,440 --> 00:27:27,639 Speaker 5: a time of national you know, mourning, or at a 506 00:27:27,720 --> 00:27:29,919 Speaker 5: time when you know people are in danger. 507 00:27:30,600 --> 00:27:34,000 Speaker 2: That's really interesting, Genie. Sometimes you're rewarded for what you 508 00:27:34,040 --> 00:27:36,520 Speaker 2: don't do. Will Ron de Santis be rewarded for this, 509 00:27:36,600 --> 00:27:38,720 Speaker 2: and how does he recover if you think it was 510 00:27:38,760 --> 00:27:40,879 Speaker 2: even an issue from the way he handled the shooting 511 00:27:40,920 --> 00:27:41,679 Speaker 2: in Jacksonville. 512 00:27:42,800 --> 00:27:44,840 Speaker 6: He you know, I think we have to wait and 513 00:27:44,840 --> 00:27:48,000 Speaker 6: see if he'll be rewarded. He has. He is the 514 00:27:48,000 --> 00:27:50,919 Speaker 6: governor of this state. He had a mass shooting in 515 00:27:50,960 --> 00:27:54,720 Speaker 6: his state, a horrific event, on the same weekend we 516 00:27:54,720 --> 00:27:59,360 Speaker 6: were celebrating the March on Washington sixty years and he 517 00:27:59,400 --> 00:28:02,480 Speaker 6: went back and of course, now you have this storm approaching. 518 00:28:03,359 --> 00:28:06,240 Speaker 6: Let's be realistic as to why he was met with 519 00:28:06,359 --> 00:28:10,320 Speaker 6: so much derision when he went back there. It's because 520 00:28:10,320 --> 00:28:14,040 Speaker 6: this is somebody who has loosened gun laws in Florida. 521 00:28:14,119 --> 00:28:17,719 Speaker 6: He has upset many people who care about civil rights. 522 00:28:17,720 --> 00:28:20,800 Speaker 6: He has spent endless amounts of time talking about the 523 00:28:20,840 --> 00:28:24,560 Speaker 6: importance of being woke. He has attacked critical race theory. 524 00:28:24,760 --> 00:28:29,320 Speaker 6: He has attacked the teaching of our history and specifically slavery. 525 00:28:29,800 --> 00:28:32,919 Speaker 6: So there are policy reasons that he wasn't met the 526 00:28:32,920 --> 00:28:36,520 Speaker 6: way he was, coupled with the fact that he used 527 00:28:36,600 --> 00:28:40,520 Speaker 6: language which was a little bit stunning when you hear 528 00:28:40,680 --> 00:28:44,320 Speaker 6: what he had to say about the shooter himself. But 529 00:28:44,600 --> 00:28:47,320 Speaker 6: you know, he is somebody who also by the same 530 00:28:47,360 --> 00:28:51,240 Speaker 6: token as governor, has done a fairly good job handling 531 00:28:51,320 --> 00:28:54,560 Speaker 6: crisis so far. So I think he made the right 532 00:28:54,600 --> 00:28:59,320 Speaker 6: decision just politically going back there and being the executive 533 00:28:59,400 --> 00:29:02,120 Speaker 6: he told us he is and would be, because he's 534 00:29:02,160 --> 00:29:05,120 Speaker 6: going to be able to show that if Americans beyond 535 00:29:05,120 --> 00:29:08,160 Speaker 6: Florida or watching to the American public, which if he 536 00:29:08,200 --> 00:29:11,800 Speaker 6: does it well, he's going to help him. Certainly, the 537 00:29:11,840 --> 00:29:13,480 Speaker 6: worst thing he could do would be go around the 538 00:29:13,480 --> 00:29:16,640 Speaker 6: country campaigning while his state is dealing with all of 539 00:29:16,640 --> 00:29:17,400 Speaker 6: these crises. 540 00:29:17,920 --> 00:29:20,680 Speaker 2: I need to ask you both about the Viake Ramaswami 541 00:29:20,680 --> 00:29:24,280 Speaker 2: and the latest controversy surrounding this presidential candidate. You saw 542 00:29:24,360 --> 00:29:27,920 Speaker 2: him over the weekend defending his remarks about the KKK, 543 00:29:28,560 --> 00:29:34,960 Speaker 2: more specifically calling Ayana Presley, the congresswoman from Massachusetts, a 544 00:29:35,080 --> 00:29:38,000 Speaker 2: part of the modern KKK. He was asked about it 545 00:29:38,080 --> 00:29:38,800 Speaker 2: yesterday morning. 546 00:29:38,800 --> 00:29:40,760 Speaker 9: What I said is the grand wizards of the KKK 547 00:29:40,880 --> 00:29:42,920 Speaker 9: would be proud of what they would hear her say, 548 00:29:42,960 --> 00:29:46,920 Speaker 9: because there's nothing more racist than saying that your skin 549 00:29:47,000 --> 00:29:49,560 Speaker 9: color predicts something about the content. 550 00:29:49,600 --> 00:29:52,280 Speaker 7: He didn't just say that to say they would be proud, 551 00:29:52,360 --> 00:29:55,520 Speaker 7: you said, these are the words of the modern grand 552 00:29:55,560 --> 00:29:57,920 Speaker 7: Wizards of the modern kk. 553 00:29:57,840 --> 00:30:01,240 Speaker 2: Standard bash on CNN. Of course, remember that Aana Presley 554 00:30:01,400 --> 00:30:06,440 Speaker 2: was the first black woman elected to represent Massachusetts in Congress. 555 00:30:06,480 --> 00:30:09,240 Speaker 2: She had said, we don't need any more blackfaces that 556 00:30:09,320 --> 00:30:11,720 Speaker 2: don't want to be a black voice. Coming off the 557 00:30:12,520 --> 00:30:16,560 Speaker 2: debate the other night. This is this is tough stuff here, Rick. 558 00:30:16,760 --> 00:30:19,600 Speaker 2: It does appear that he's doubling down. Is he doing 559 00:30:19,760 --> 00:30:21,800 Speaker 2: the right thing or not? Yeah? 560 00:30:21,880 --> 00:30:24,680 Speaker 5: Look, I mean he's spent the entire weekend, you know, 561 00:30:24,880 --> 00:30:30,200 Speaker 5: on these Sunday shows really sort of recreating history. I mean, 562 00:30:30,240 --> 00:30:34,440 Speaker 5: whether it was a response like this on Aana Presley's comments, 563 00:30:34,440 --> 00:30:37,000 Speaker 5: which by the way, deserves some derision on their own, right. 564 00:30:37,360 --> 00:30:40,000 Speaker 5: I mean, like the idea that she can say these 565 00:30:40,040 --> 00:30:44,040 Speaker 5: things and not be criticized for sounding bias is a 566 00:30:44,040 --> 00:30:47,280 Speaker 5: little bit surprising to me. But look, Ramaswami has his 567 00:30:47,280 --> 00:30:50,440 Speaker 5: own case to be made, and he got stuck in this. 568 00:30:50,560 --> 00:30:52,800 Speaker 5: He got stuck in other comments he's made in his 569 00:30:52,960 --> 00:30:56,680 Speaker 5: book that were, you know, diametrically different than what he 570 00:30:56,720 --> 00:31:00,160 Speaker 5: said on the debate stage. So he's got some splen 571 00:31:00,360 --> 00:31:03,040 Speaker 5: to do. And you know, you put yourself out for 572 00:31:03,080 --> 00:31:04,760 Speaker 5: these Sunday shows and they're not going to be a 573 00:31:04,760 --> 00:31:05,360 Speaker 5: piece of cake. 574 00:31:05,920 --> 00:31:09,200 Speaker 2: Yeah, welcome to the NFL. Here, Jeanie, the big Ramaswami 575 00:31:09,280 --> 00:31:10,920 Speaker 2: is now getting a sense of what it's really like 576 00:31:11,000 --> 00:31:13,320 Speaker 2: to be a presidential candidate. Did he just step in it? 577 00:31:13,360 --> 00:31:15,640 Speaker 2: Does this threaten his campaign? 578 00:31:16,320 --> 00:31:18,520 Speaker 6: He did step in it, and it would threaten his 579 00:31:18,600 --> 00:31:21,520 Speaker 6: campaign if people were listening. But you know, the fear 580 00:31:21,640 --> 00:31:25,000 Speaker 6: is is exactly what he said to Dana Bash. If 581 00:31:25,040 --> 00:31:27,800 Speaker 6: we listen carefully to that interview, what he said was, oh, 582 00:31:27,840 --> 00:31:32,800 Speaker 6: I just said these comments to attract and incite a conversation. 583 00:31:33,320 --> 00:31:37,400 Speaker 6: The reality is, we should have a conversation about this issue, 584 00:31:37,600 --> 00:31:40,360 Speaker 6: but it should not be a conversation with a leading 585 00:31:40,440 --> 00:31:44,840 Speaker 6: candidate or a candidate for the Republican nomination. Comparing a 586 00:31:44,920 --> 00:31:48,240 Speaker 6: representative in Congress who happens to be the first black 587 00:31:48,280 --> 00:31:52,160 Speaker 6: woman elected to a modern klu klux Klan member. It's 588 00:31:52,240 --> 00:31:56,960 Speaker 6: absolutely outrageous. It's beyond controversial. But he admits right there 589 00:31:57,000 --> 00:32:00,680 Speaker 6: he's doing it to spark controversy and conversation, and that 590 00:32:00,960 --> 00:32:03,520 Speaker 6: is the problem. And the reality is this goes far 591 00:32:03,520 --> 00:32:06,920 Speaker 6: beyond Ramaswami. It's the same tactic Trump is used, and 592 00:32:07,040 --> 00:32:09,560 Speaker 6: I fear it's going to be something we hear more 593 00:32:09,600 --> 00:32:12,640 Speaker 6: about if candidates than less because it attracts attention, it 594 00:32:12,680 --> 00:32:17,040 Speaker 6: attracts money, and people sort of set aside the hypocrisy 595 00:32:17,080 --> 00:32:19,000 Speaker 6: of something he wrote in a book eleven months ago 596 00:32:19,080 --> 00:32:20,400 Speaker 6: and something he's saying on the trail. 597 00:32:20,960 --> 00:32:23,000 Speaker 2: Yeah, we're going to be hearing more of that book 598 00:32:23,280 --> 00:32:27,080 Speaker 2: recurgitated over the course of the next couple of weeks, 599 00:32:27,080 --> 00:32:31,120 Speaker 2: and this should provide some very interesting conversation points for 600 00:32:31,160 --> 00:32:35,080 Speaker 2: the second debate, which is September at the Ronald Reagan Library. 601 00:32:35,440 --> 00:32:38,160 Speaker 2: Final thoughts from our panel straight ahead of course, Rick 602 00:32:38,240 --> 00:32:42,280 Speaker 2: Davis and Jeanie Shanzano. I'm Joe Matthew in Washington. I'm 603 00:32:42,320 --> 00:32:45,280 Speaker 2: the fastest show in politics. This is Bloomberg. 604 00:32:46,160 --> 00:32:49,680 Speaker 1: You're listening to The Bloomberg Sound on podcast. Catch us 605 00:32:49,720 --> 00:32:52,880 Speaker 1: live weekdays at one Eastern on Bloomberg dot Com, the 606 00:32:52,960 --> 00:32:56,040 Speaker 1: iHeartRadio app, and the Bloomberg Business app, or listen on 607 00:32:56,120 --> 00:32:58,040 Speaker 1: demand wherever you get your podcast. 608 00:32:59,200 --> 00:33:04,200 Speaker 2: President Biden leaves the bubble. Well not really, Washington, You're 609 00:33:04,200 --> 00:33:06,440 Speaker 2: always in the bubble. The book left the White House 610 00:33:07,120 --> 00:33:09,840 Speaker 2: with the first Lady on what was the first day 611 00:33:09,840 --> 00:33:12,160 Speaker 2: of school for a bunch of kids. I won't out 612 00:33:12,200 --> 00:33:14,520 Speaker 2: the school They didn't put that on the guidance from 613 00:33:14,520 --> 00:33:16,760 Speaker 2: the White House. All that said was they'd visit a 614 00:33:16,760 --> 00:33:19,920 Speaker 2: public school to welcome students back to class, and indeed 615 00:33:20,240 --> 00:33:26,720 Speaker 2: they did, remembering, of course, that doctor Jill is a 616 00:33:26,760 --> 00:33:29,640 Speaker 2: teacher herself. Here's the president in the classroom. 617 00:33:29,880 --> 00:33:33,000 Speaker 10: The hardest thing is to come back after three months 618 00:33:33,000 --> 00:33:36,000 Speaker 10: of not doing any work, not doing any homework, and 619 00:33:36,280 --> 00:33:39,080 Speaker 10: all of a sudden, you've got a lot to make. 620 00:33:39,160 --> 00:33:41,440 Speaker 10: Everybody has a lot to catch up from what the 621 00:33:41,960 --> 00:33:44,520 Speaker 10: end of the last year. And you all look so 622 00:33:44,600 --> 00:33:46,000 Speaker 10: excited to be a math class on. 623 00:33:46,000 --> 00:33:48,480 Speaker 1: Your first day. 624 00:33:48,880 --> 00:33:50,800 Speaker 2: What's your hardest subject from school? 625 00:33:53,240 --> 00:33:53,520 Speaker 1: Math? 626 00:33:53,600 --> 00:33:56,040 Speaker 2: They said, their hardest subject in the school. But Jill 627 00:33:56,080 --> 00:33:59,360 Speaker 2: Biden's an English teacher. Final thoughts from Rick and Jeanie. 628 00:33:59,360 --> 00:34:02,560 Speaker 2: It's an interesting dichotomy here, Genie, you're an educator. While 629 00:34:02,600 --> 00:34:05,920 Speaker 2: many Republican presidential candidates threatened to shut down the Department 630 00:34:05,920 --> 00:34:08,279 Speaker 2: of Education, this one is going to school. Is that 631 00:34:08,360 --> 00:34:09,160 Speaker 2: a good contrast. 632 00:34:09,680 --> 00:34:12,080 Speaker 6: It is a good contrast. And I love the reaction 633 00:34:12,239 --> 00:34:15,080 Speaker 6: of the kids. They were all giggling, they were all smiling. 634 00:34:15,280 --> 00:34:17,920 Speaker 6: They one of them said, I'm shaking hands with the president. 635 00:34:18,000 --> 00:34:20,720 Speaker 6: I remember my eighth grade return to school. No president 636 00:34:20,800 --> 00:34:23,759 Speaker 6: met me. I think it's a very important contrast, and 637 00:34:23,840 --> 00:34:26,200 Speaker 6: we have to invest more in our schools. And nobody's 638 00:34:26,239 --> 00:34:28,960 Speaker 6: better equipped to talk about that than Jill Biden and 639 00:34:29,000 --> 00:34:30,040 Speaker 6: of course her husband. 640 00:34:32,080 --> 00:34:34,880 Speaker 2: He spent something like twenty minutes in the hallway shaking 641 00:34:34,960 --> 00:34:36,719 Speaker 2: hands there, Rick, this is part of the job of 642 00:34:36,760 --> 00:34:39,479 Speaker 2: being the president, right, what's the message? Why take the time? 643 00:34:40,040 --> 00:34:42,480 Speaker 5: I actually thought he gave us a very clear message. 644 00:34:42,520 --> 00:34:44,520 Speaker 5: He said, you know, we've just spent three months not 645 00:34:44,640 --> 00:34:48,080 Speaker 5: doing anything. I think he aptly described the Biden administration 646 00:34:48,200 --> 00:34:50,880 Speaker 5: and exactly why we're in the case we're in. So 647 00:34:51,040 --> 00:34:52,960 Speaker 5: maybe he should get back to school and do a 648 00:34:52,960 --> 00:34:56,160 Speaker 5: little something to help our economy. And you know, sperm 649 00:34:56,239 --> 00:34:58,040 Speaker 5: up the support. 650 00:34:57,680 --> 00:34:58,080 Speaker 4: For the war. 651 00:34:58,120 --> 00:35:00,600 Speaker 2: And is Genie still there? I mean to lay the 652 00:35:00,640 --> 00:35:02,839 Speaker 2: bait like that, Genie, I. 653 00:35:03,000 --> 00:35:05,480 Speaker 6: Know, and look at Rick Davis going right in for 654 00:35:05,600 --> 00:35:10,200 Speaker 6: the hill. Rick, inflation is doing better. You're celebrating Biden nomics. 655 00:35:10,239 --> 00:35:12,680 Speaker 6: Be happy. 656 00:35:12,000 --> 00:35:15,279 Speaker 2: Oh wow, we almost need another hour now with you too. 657 00:35:15,320 --> 00:35:18,480 Speaker 2: We found something here. Rick Davis and Genie shanseo Bloomberg 658 00:35:18,520 --> 00:35:21,680 Speaker 2: Politics contributors are friends that sound on the best panel 659 00:35:21,760 --> 00:35:27,760 Speaker 2: in the business. Thanks for listening. To the sound On podcast. 660 00:35:27,840 --> 00:35:30,960 Speaker 2: Make sure to subscribe if you haven't already, at Apple, Spotify, 661 00:35:31,000 --> 00:35:33,440 Speaker 2: and anywhere else you get your podcasts, and you can 662 00:35:33,480 --> 00:35:36,440 Speaker 2: find us live every weekday from Washington, DC at one 663 00:35:36,480 --> 00:35:40,640 Speaker 2: pm Eastern Time. Bloomberg dot com