1 00:00:02,040 --> 00:00:04,600 Speaker 1: Hi, and welcome back to the Carol Markowitz Show on 2 00:00:04,680 --> 00:00:08,600 Speaker 1: Ihear Radio. My guest today is Jason Bedriick. Jason is 3 00:00:08,640 --> 00:00:13,119 Speaker 1: a research fellow at Heritage where he focuses on education issues. Hi, Jason, 4 00:00:13,280 --> 00:00:14,160 Speaker 1: so nice to have you. 5 00:00:14,120 --> 00:00:15,880 Speaker 2: On, Carol. It's a pleasure to be on. 6 00:00:16,560 --> 00:00:18,680 Speaker 1: So how did a nice Jewish boy like you get 7 00:00:18,720 --> 00:00:21,960 Speaker 1: mixed up with education policy at Heritage? Where did you 8 00:00:22,000 --> 00:00:22,640 Speaker 1: get your start? 9 00:00:24,160 --> 00:00:27,880 Speaker 2: That's a great question. It really, I would say started 10 00:00:27,920 --> 00:00:32,559 Speaker 2: in college. I went to a business school because, like 11 00:00:32,600 --> 00:00:35,639 Speaker 2: a nice Jewish boy, the plan was to take over 12 00:00:35,680 --> 00:00:39,040 Speaker 2: the family business, which was a small furniture store in 13 00:00:39,080 --> 00:00:43,599 Speaker 2: New Hampshire. But a few weeks into my freshman year 14 00:00:43,720 --> 00:00:46,720 Speaker 2: was nine to eleven, and all of a sudden I 15 00:00:46,760 --> 00:00:53,080 Speaker 2: became much more interested in public policy than furniture or 16 00:00:53,240 --> 00:00:59,440 Speaker 2: or business, and at first international policy, but then eventually 17 00:00:59,480 --> 00:01:03,600 Speaker 2: domestic policy with a real focus on education. I always 18 00:01:03,800 --> 00:01:09,080 Speaker 2: loved school, loved education. I guess I did a paper 19 00:01:09,400 --> 00:01:13,039 Speaker 2: in my junior year on school choice. I could pick 20 00:01:13,080 --> 00:01:16,080 Speaker 2: any issue I wanted, and that was the issue, any 21 00:01:16,240 --> 00:01:19,000 Speaker 2: any issue I wanted, but it had to be like 22 00:01:19,080 --> 00:01:21,960 Speaker 2: really specific, couldn't be general. So I was like, we 23 00:01:22,000 --> 00:01:23,880 Speaker 2: should have a school choice in New Hampshire, and at 24 00:01:23,880 --> 00:01:25,959 Speaker 2: the time, there was a bill that was going through 25 00:01:26,000 --> 00:01:29,320 Speaker 2: the New Hampshire State Legislature for school choice and it 26 00:01:29,440 --> 00:01:32,399 Speaker 2: failed by a vote of one to seventy one to 27 00:01:32,520 --> 00:01:33,400 Speaker 2: one seventy two. 28 00:01:34,880 --> 00:01:36,959 Speaker 1: You have that right at the front of your brain 29 00:01:37,000 --> 00:01:37,840 Speaker 1: to recall. 30 00:01:37,600 --> 00:01:40,839 Speaker 2: Huh, yes, Well, you know it was a turning point 31 00:01:40,920 --> 00:01:45,240 Speaker 2: because I was complaining to my professor about it after 32 00:01:45,319 --> 00:01:47,480 Speaker 2: class and he said, what are you going to do 33 00:01:47,520 --> 00:01:50,440 Speaker 2: about it? And I'm thinking, like, you know, I'm twenty 34 00:01:50,560 --> 00:01:52,120 Speaker 2: years old. I'm going to go back to my dorm 35 00:01:52,160 --> 00:01:55,160 Speaker 2: room and eat pizza and drink beer and play video games, 36 00:01:55,160 --> 00:01:56,800 Speaker 2: like what am I going to What am I going 37 00:01:56,840 --> 00:02:02,360 Speaker 2: to do? Education? Right exactly? But that question sort of 38 00:02:02,400 --> 00:02:04,560 Speaker 2: echoed in my head what are you going to do 39 00:02:04,600 --> 00:02:09,520 Speaker 2: about it? So eventually, you know, I ran for office. 40 00:02:10,080 --> 00:02:14,480 Speaker 2: I failed the first time around, but succeeded the second time. 41 00:02:14,360 --> 00:02:16,639 Speaker 1: Around, and I ran I not know this, what did 42 00:02:16,639 --> 00:02:17,200 Speaker 1: you run for? 43 00:02:17,720 --> 00:02:21,680 Speaker 2: I ran for state legislature because it failed by one vote, 44 00:02:21,720 --> 00:02:24,160 Speaker 2: and if I had been there instead of somebody else, 45 00:02:24,560 --> 00:02:27,560 Speaker 2: you know, it could have passed. When I served, I 46 00:02:27,600 --> 00:02:31,320 Speaker 2: was twenty three, my school voucher bill went down in flames. 47 00:02:32,720 --> 00:02:35,240 Speaker 2: But a few years later, when I was in grad school, 48 00:02:36,120 --> 00:02:38,280 Speaker 2: I had been in the minority party. But when I 49 00:02:38,320 --> 00:02:42,040 Speaker 2: was in grad school, the Republicans took back over. And 50 00:02:42,080 --> 00:02:44,160 Speaker 2: I got a call from a friend of mine who said, 51 00:02:44,400 --> 00:02:46,360 Speaker 2: you know, we're going to do school choice this time around. 52 00:02:47,320 --> 00:02:50,320 Speaker 2: So I took my master's thesis, I ripped it up 53 00:02:50,320 --> 00:02:52,760 Speaker 2: and I started over, and I did a master's thesis 54 00:02:52,800 --> 00:02:56,280 Speaker 2: on a school choice bill, and we went we got 55 00:02:56,280 --> 00:02:59,359 Speaker 2: it passed, and it's still still in operation today. That 56 00:02:59,440 --> 00:03:00,440 Speaker 2: was in twenty three Wealth. 57 00:03:00,600 --> 00:03:03,680 Speaker 1: It's amazing. What made you care about this? Like I, 58 00:03:03,720 --> 00:03:06,000 Speaker 1: you know, you joke about going back to your dorm 59 00:03:06,080 --> 00:03:09,080 Speaker 1: room and eating pizza and drinking beer. I mean, I 60 00:03:09,160 --> 00:03:12,880 Speaker 1: was a conservative in college. I had beliefs, I had ideals, 61 00:03:12,960 --> 00:03:16,079 Speaker 1: But to care so specifically, especially about schooling when I 62 00:03:16,120 --> 00:03:18,800 Speaker 1: didn't have kids myself yet, that would have been a 63 00:03:18,840 --> 00:03:21,799 Speaker 1: reach for me. How did you come to care about it? 64 00:03:22,639 --> 00:03:27,360 Speaker 2: I saw it really as the foundation of the American dream. 65 00:03:28,520 --> 00:03:33,280 Speaker 2: So the American dream is predicated on a quality of opportunity. 66 00:03:34,040 --> 00:03:37,000 Speaker 2: And I, you know, I chose my parents well, and 67 00:03:37,080 --> 00:03:40,400 Speaker 2: so I chose parents who could afford to live in 68 00:03:40,440 --> 00:03:43,880 Speaker 2: a school district that had high quality public schools, good 69 00:03:43,960 --> 00:03:48,120 Speaker 2: choice anything exactly, and we didn't have We were I 70 00:03:48,200 --> 00:03:51,200 Speaker 2: was in a very small town in New Hampshire, so 71 00:03:51,400 --> 00:03:53,800 Speaker 2: small that at the time there was no high school, 72 00:03:54,040 --> 00:03:57,400 Speaker 2: and they contracted with a neighboring school district, and then 73 00:03:57,440 --> 00:03:59,600 Speaker 2: that fell apart in the contracted with a different one. 74 00:03:59,640 --> 00:04:01,960 Speaker 2: The public school wasn't so good, so I ended up 75 00:04:01,960 --> 00:04:04,520 Speaker 2: going to a Catholic high school. And my parents could 76 00:04:04,520 --> 00:04:06,840 Speaker 2: afford to send me to a Catholic high school and 77 00:04:06,880 --> 00:04:11,200 Speaker 2: pay that tuition. But I realized that there are a 78 00:04:11,240 --> 00:04:14,600 Speaker 2: lot of families out there who can't afford a home 79 00:04:15,160 --> 00:04:17,800 Speaker 2: in a you know, an expensive home in a school 80 00:04:17,800 --> 00:04:20,279 Speaker 2: district that has a high quality public school, and can't 81 00:04:20,279 --> 00:04:24,520 Speaker 2: afford to pay private school tuition, and that if equality 82 00:04:24,560 --> 00:04:28,120 Speaker 2: of opportunity meant anything, it meant that everyone should have 83 00:04:28,160 --> 00:04:31,200 Speaker 2: access to a high quality education. And that's where I 84 00:04:31,240 --> 00:04:33,719 Speaker 2: fell in love with Milton Friedman's idea that the money 85 00:04:33,760 --> 00:04:37,040 Speaker 2: should follow the child. That even if there is a 86 00:04:37,040 --> 00:04:42,240 Speaker 2: case that the government should subsidize education, it doesn't follow 87 00:04:42,760 --> 00:04:46,719 Speaker 2: that the government should be providing the education because it 88 00:04:46,760 --> 00:04:49,640 Speaker 2: tends to be low quality, especially for lower income families, 89 00:04:50,960 --> 00:04:56,800 Speaker 2: and so you know, once I became passionately engaged with 90 00:04:56,839 --> 00:05:01,000 Speaker 2: that and saw that I could make a difference. One vote. 91 00:05:01,040 --> 00:05:03,599 Speaker 2: That's all it took, was one vote in the legislature 92 00:05:04,640 --> 00:05:09,480 Speaker 2: that sort of launched my public policy crusade for school choice. 93 00:05:10,160 --> 00:05:12,400 Speaker 1: Still impressive that you cared about it at such a 94 00:05:12,440 --> 00:05:15,480 Speaker 1: young age. I just I did not care about much 95 00:05:15,680 --> 00:05:18,960 Speaker 1: at that age. Did your parents have a problem with 96 00:05:19,120 --> 00:05:23,040 Speaker 1: you pursuing this instead of going into the family business 97 00:05:23,080 --> 00:05:25,200 Speaker 1: or instead of doing one of like the three professions 98 00:05:25,200 --> 00:05:27,880 Speaker 1: that Jews are allowed to do, you know, doctor, lawyer, 99 00:05:28,320 --> 00:05:30,240 Speaker 1: It could be accountant, it could be in my day 100 00:05:30,279 --> 00:05:33,520 Speaker 1: it was computer programmer. You know that the third profession 101 00:05:33,560 --> 00:05:38,720 Speaker 1: sometimes changes, but it's never education policy at Heritage. 102 00:05:39,000 --> 00:05:44,280 Speaker 2: Yeah, and they were always very supportive of everything that 103 00:05:44,720 --> 00:05:49,159 Speaker 2: I wanted to do. So and that wasn't the biggest change. 104 00:05:49,160 --> 00:05:51,480 Speaker 2: I mean, I grew up a very secular Jew, and 105 00:05:51,560 --> 00:05:54,040 Speaker 2: so at the same time in college, as I'm becoming 106 00:05:54,080 --> 00:05:58,360 Speaker 2: more politically aware, I was becoming more religiously engaged and 107 00:05:58,440 --> 00:06:01,280 Speaker 2: became observant. So I mean that was like a much 108 00:06:01,320 --> 00:06:05,559 Speaker 2: bigger deal for the family than you know, a change 109 00:06:05,560 --> 00:06:08,440 Speaker 2: in focus and you know, from business to politics. 110 00:06:08,720 --> 00:06:11,719 Speaker 1: Yeah, So they were they were like stunned by one thing, 111 00:06:11,800 --> 00:06:15,080 Speaker 1: so they didn't have time to like focus on the other. Right, 112 00:06:16,320 --> 00:06:17,839 Speaker 1: is your family business still around? 113 00:06:19,040 --> 00:06:23,120 Speaker 2: No, my father Blessed Memory sold it probably close to 114 00:06:23,160 --> 00:06:23,880 Speaker 2: twenty years ago. 115 00:06:24,600 --> 00:06:26,800 Speaker 1: And so what would you be doing if it wasn't this? 116 00:06:27,000 --> 00:06:28,599 Speaker 1: Would you have gone into furniture? 117 00:06:29,080 --> 00:06:31,000 Speaker 2: Probably? You know, that was you know, I kind of 118 00:06:31,040 --> 00:06:33,720 Speaker 2: grew up in the family business. I spent you know, 119 00:06:33,839 --> 00:06:37,760 Speaker 2: summer breaks and winter breaks working as a janitor, working, 120 00:06:38,440 --> 00:06:41,520 Speaker 2: you know, in the accounting department, working in the marketing department, 121 00:06:41,560 --> 00:06:44,320 Speaker 2: you know, sort of learning all the aspects of the business. 122 00:06:45,080 --> 00:06:49,240 Speaker 2: So yeah, I think, you know, but for nine to 123 00:06:49,279 --> 00:06:54,080 Speaker 2: eleven and my budding interest in public policy, I would 124 00:06:54,120 --> 00:06:58,280 Speaker 2: be running a furniture store in New Hampshire right now, What. 125 00:06:58,160 --> 00:07:00,960 Speaker 1: Do you still want to do in education? Public policy? 126 00:07:01,080 --> 00:07:05,880 Speaker 1: I mean, the school choice is becoming not everywhere obviously, 127 00:07:05,920 --> 00:07:08,200 Speaker 1: there's still a lot of battles to fight, but it's 128 00:07:08,360 --> 00:07:11,560 Speaker 1: largely growing in popularity. I think compared to like a 129 00:07:11,600 --> 00:07:15,480 Speaker 1: decade or two ago, it's far more prevalent in different states. 130 00:07:15,840 --> 00:07:17,040 Speaker 1: What's the next frontier? 131 00:07:18,360 --> 00:07:21,280 Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, so when I was in the legislature, 132 00:07:21,280 --> 00:07:24,880 Speaker 2: it was still a pretty fringe idea and I mean 133 00:07:24,920 --> 00:07:28,080 Speaker 2: it was defeated overwhelmingly and it was a small, little, 134 00:07:28,160 --> 00:07:32,840 Speaker 2: you know, low income program. Right now, New Hampshire is 135 00:07:33,680 --> 00:07:37,800 Speaker 2: close to passing universal education saving some house where every 136 00:07:37,800 --> 00:07:40,560 Speaker 2: single child in the state is going to have access 137 00:07:40,600 --> 00:07:44,920 Speaker 2: to an account that you can use for private school tuition, tutoring, textbooks, 138 00:07:44,960 --> 00:07:49,480 Speaker 2: homeschool curricula, online learning, et cetera. They've already passed the law. 139 00:07:50,000 --> 00:07:52,480 Speaker 2: It's just about half the kids in the state are eligible, 140 00:07:52,520 --> 00:07:56,320 Speaker 2: and soon everyone will be eligible. So it's amazing, you know, 141 00:07:56,600 --> 00:07:59,400 Speaker 2: from let's see when I was in the legislature two 142 00:07:59,440 --> 00:08:02,560 Speaker 2: thousand seven, in two thousand and eight till today, you know, 143 00:08:02,640 --> 00:08:05,120 Speaker 2: not even twenty years and we've made all that progress. 144 00:08:05,160 --> 00:08:08,680 Speaker 2: So it's and that's sort of reflects the state of 145 00:08:08,720 --> 00:08:13,200 Speaker 2: play nationwide. Pre COVID, we didn't have any publicly funded 146 00:08:14,000 --> 00:08:17,440 Speaker 2: universal school choice programs, meaning that every child is eligible, 147 00:08:18,480 --> 00:08:21,920 Speaker 2: and now we have about fifteen and we're probably going 148 00:08:22,000 --> 00:08:25,400 Speaker 2: to end the year with eighteen. And if we get Texas, 149 00:08:25,480 --> 00:08:28,160 Speaker 2: which is looking like we will, more than half the 150 00:08:28,240 --> 00:08:31,040 Speaker 2: kids in the country will be eligible for school choice. 151 00:08:31,440 --> 00:08:34,520 Speaker 2: So still a lot of work to do and being 152 00:08:34,559 --> 00:08:37,760 Speaker 2: eligible and having you know, a scholarship is not the 153 00:08:37,760 --> 00:08:39,800 Speaker 2: same thing, so that there's a lot more work to do, 154 00:08:40,480 --> 00:08:43,120 Speaker 2: but the momentum is on our side, and we're, you know, 155 00:08:43,120 --> 00:08:47,400 Speaker 2: we're sort of hitting that tipping point. But I've been 156 00:08:47,400 --> 00:08:51,040 Speaker 2: working on school choice for two decades now, but I'm 157 00:08:51,640 --> 00:08:54,880 Speaker 2: working more on other issues. So this is all sort 158 00:08:54,880 --> 00:08:59,120 Speaker 2: of a preface to your question, what's next beyond school choice? 159 00:08:59,440 --> 00:09:02,480 Speaker 2: We have? I think school choice is a necessary condition 160 00:09:03,080 --> 00:09:07,080 Speaker 2: for solving our education woes, but it's not a sufficient condition. 161 00:09:08,000 --> 00:09:08,120 Speaker 1: Uh. 162 00:09:08,720 --> 00:09:13,240 Speaker 2: You know, I've seen the left essentially take over public 163 00:09:13,360 --> 00:09:19,600 Speaker 2: education and politicize it and dumb it down, and conservatives saying, well, 164 00:09:19,640 --> 00:09:25,080 Speaker 2: you should have choices is important, but it's not enough, right, 165 00:09:25,160 --> 00:09:28,360 Speaker 2: And a lot of school choice organizations, including ones that 166 00:09:28,400 --> 00:09:31,600 Speaker 2: I work for, like their main goal is you should 167 00:09:31,600 --> 00:09:33,720 Speaker 2: have a choice, and we're agnostic about what you choose. 168 00:09:33,840 --> 00:09:35,960 Speaker 2: And I get that, and I think the government should 169 00:09:36,000 --> 00:09:39,840 Speaker 2: be agnostic, but we as conservatives should not be agnostic 170 00:09:40,120 --> 00:09:43,720 Speaker 2: about what parents are choosing. Right. We have to be 171 00:09:44,080 --> 00:09:50,360 Speaker 2: putting forward a positive vision of American education, one that 172 00:09:50,520 --> 00:09:56,040 Speaker 2: is grounded in truth, one that you know, is content rich. 173 00:09:56,480 --> 00:09:59,319 Speaker 2: Where they are it's not just social studies, they're engaging 174 00:09:59,400 --> 00:10:05,960 Speaker 2: in real history, and they have. We are careful about 175 00:10:06,000 --> 00:10:09,560 Speaker 2: cultural transmission, transmitting the best that has been thought and 176 00:10:09,600 --> 00:10:12,560 Speaker 2: said in the West and especially you know, sort of 177 00:10:12,600 --> 00:10:17,640 Speaker 2: the American branch that goes through you know, England. We 178 00:10:18,520 --> 00:10:20,679 Speaker 2: have not been doing that in the public school system, 179 00:10:21,280 --> 00:10:25,040 Speaker 2: and we absolutely have to if we want to preserve 180 00:10:25,520 --> 00:10:26,560 Speaker 2: our way of life. 181 00:10:27,160 --> 00:10:29,480 Speaker 1: So how do you do that? Not that school choice 182 00:10:29,600 --> 00:10:33,679 Speaker 1: was an easy thing to get through, but this seems harder. 183 00:10:33,800 --> 00:10:37,320 Speaker 1: This seems like tougher because you're going to have to 184 00:10:37,640 --> 00:10:39,360 Speaker 1: I mean, teachers unions are always going to be an 185 00:10:39,360 --> 00:10:43,200 Speaker 1: obstacle for your battles, but this one is like they 186 00:10:43,800 --> 00:10:47,240 Speaker 1: to allow curriculum that they don't approve of is going 187 00:10:47,280 --> 00:10:50,520 Speaker 1: to be so much tougher than to get state legislatures 188 00:10:50,559 --> 00:10:54,320 Speaker 1: to allow parents to have the money file follow the child. 189 00:10:55,880 --> 00:10:57,880 Speaker 2: Well, I think the first thing is past school choice. 190 00:10:58,280 --> 00:11:03,199 Speaker 2: Second step, there's the classical education movement that has been 191 00:11:03,280 --> 00:11:06,800 Speaker 2: taking off, and so many families that I've spoken to 192 00:11:07,640 --> 00:11:10,560 Speaker 2: that send their kids to classical schools, but they themselves 193 00:11:10,559 --> 00:11:13,440 Speaker 2: didn't have a classical education, which is most of us 194 00:11:13,480 --> 00:11:16,200 Speaker 2: in this country say something along the lines of, oh, 195 00:11:16,280 --> 00:11:18,360 Speaker 2: this is what I was always looking for. I just 196 00:11:18,360 --> 00:11:22,040 Speaker 2: didn't know it existed. So I think that demand for 197 00:11:22,760 --> 00:11:26,080 Speaker 2: classical ED, which is only about one percent of kids 198 00:11:26,160 --> 00:11:28,599 Speaker 2: right now are going to classical schools, the demand is 199 00:11:28,720 --> 00:11:33,760 Speaker 2: much much higher, and the conservative movement should be doing 200 00:11:33,800 --> 00:11:37,439 Speaker 2: everything they can to foster the growth of classical ED. 201 00:11:38,000 --> 00:11:40,160 Speaker 2: Pull your kids out of public schools, put them whether 202 00:11:40,200 --> 00:11:43,000 Speaker 2: it's a private school, at charter school, find a classical school. 203 00:11:43,679 --> 00:11:46,559 Speaker 2: Put your kid in those schools. If you're homeschooling, there's 204 00:11:46,800 --> 00:11:51,160 Speaker 2: a lot of classical homeschool materials out there. And I 205 00:11:51,200 --> 00:11:54,840 Speaker 2: think what we will see is a shift as demand, 206 00:11:55,600 --> 00:11:58,839 Speaker 2: As awareness of classical ED grows and demand grows, you're 207 00:11:58,880 --> 00:12:01,760 Speaker 2: going to see a shift. I think even public schools 208 00:12:01,760 --> 00:12:04,000 Speaker 2: will start to adopt some of the things. You're not 209 00:12:04,000 --> 00:12:06,480 Speaker 2: going to have public schools go like full blown possible 210 00:12:06,480 --> 00:12:09,440 Speaker 2: for the most part, but I think they will. You know, Okay, 211 00:12:09,880 --> 00:12:12,120 Speaker 2: if we see that a bunch of families are leaving, 212 00:12:12,400 --> 00:12:14,160 Speaker 2: and why are they leaving, Well because they want that 213 00:12:14,200 --> 00:12:16,280 Speaker 2: classical school. Oh well, you know, we have a very 214 00:12:16,280 --> 00:12:21,720 Speaker 2: strong history curriculum over here, but we're actually reintroducing, you know, 215 00:12:22,640 --> 00:12:25,400 Speaker 2: some foreign language. You know, we're gonna have Latin or Greek, 216 00:12:25,679 --> 00:12:30,720 Speaker 2: or we're going to you know, focus more on primary sources. 217 00:12:31,320 --> 00:12:33,720 Speaker 1: Math won't be racist anymore, right. 218 00:12:33,679 --> 00:12:37,040 Speaker 2: Exactly, you'll see these sorts of things. And we've already 219 00:12:37,040 --> 00:12:39,040 Speaker 2: seen this sort of thing in Arizona. I mean I 220 00:12:39,080 --> 00:12:41,760 Speaker 2: see public schools that advertise, oh, we do the core 221 00:12:41,880 --> 00:12:44,840 Speaker 2: knowledge curriculum here, right, Well, why are they do that? 222 00:12:44,880 --> 00:12:47,160 Speaker 2: Well because they lost kids the they lost kids to 223 00:12:47,200 --> 00:12:49,320 Speaker 2: the charter school down the street. It's doing corn knowledge 224 00:12:49,320 --> 00:12:52,120 Speaker 2: and now they're advertising we do corn knowledge. So I 225 00:12:52,160 --> 00:12:55,240 Speaker 2: think that's that's the next step. We It's amazing, Yeah, 226 00:12:55,240 --> 00:12:55,480 Speaker 2: it is. 227 00:12:55,960 --> 00:12:57,800 Speaker 1: I haven't seen that in public schools at all, Like 228 00:12:57,840 --> 00:13:00,040 Speaker 1: where they're competing for the kids like that. 229 00:13:00,320 --> 00:13:04,280 Speaker 2: Well, you'll only spot you'll only have them competing where 230 00:13:04,320 --> 00:13:08,360 Speaker 2: there is a competitive market. Right. So you need to 231 00:13:08,400 --> 00:13:15,439 Speaker 2: have a robust, universal, fully funded private school choice program, 232 00:13:15,480 --> 00:13:18,720 Speaker 2: ideally an ESA. You need to have robust charter schools. 233 00:13:19,160 --> 00:13:21,600 Speaker 2: And what we have in Arizona too is intradistrict choice. 234 00:13:21,880 --> 00:13:26,080 Speaker 2: And when you add up those three categories of school 235 00:13:26,200 --> 00:13:31,200 Speaker 2: choice plus tax credit scholarships, more than half the kids 236 00:13:31,240 --> 00:13:34,840 Speaker 2: in Maricopa County, which is the largest county in the country, 237 00:13:34,880 --> 00:13:38,679 Speaker 2: actually more than half the kids are going to a school. Besides, 238 00:13:38,760 --> 00:13:40,040 Speaker 2: they're assigned district school. 239 00:13:40,400 --> 00:13:40,679 Speaker 1: Wow. 240 00:13:40,800 --> 00:13:42,200 Speaker 2: So it's a very competitive environment. 241 00:13:42,640 --> 00:13:44,880 Speaker 1: That's amazing. I hope that spreads everywhere. 242 00:13:46,000 --> 00:13:48,880 Speaker 2: I'm from your lips to God's ears. 243 00:13:48,960 --> 00:13:52,439 Speaker 1: That's right. What do you worry about, Acus? 244 00:13:52,559 --> 00:13:54,360 Speaker 2: That is not supposed to worry. You're supposed to have 245 00:13:54,679 --> 00:13:58,520 Speaker 2: complete faith. But one thing that does greatly concern me 246 00:13:59,320 --> 00:14:03,760 Speaker 2: is that we are forgetting where we came from as 247 00:14:03,800 --> 00:14:09,640 Speaker 2: a culture. Will Herberg, it's a great sociologist, used to be. 248 00:14:10,080 --> 00:14:12,120 Speaker 2: I think he was a religion editor at National Review 249 00:14:12,920 --> 00:14:17,880 Speaker 2: and talked about cut flower culture. And you know, if 250 00:14:17,880 --> 00:14:20,000 Speaker 2: you take a flower and you cut it and you 251 00:14:20,040 --> 00:14:23,520 Speaker 2: put it in a vase, it'll still be beautiful for 252 00:14:23,600 --> 00:14:26,360 Speaker 2: a while. It'll still have a nice fragrance for a while, 253 00:14:26,400 --> 00:14:28,160 Speaker 2: but eventually it's going to wilton. It's going to die 254 00:14:28,240 --> 00:14:32,080 Speaker 2: because you have divorced it from its source of nurture, 255 00:14:32,680 --> 00:14:35,840 Speaker 2: and so it cannot live long, it cannot thrive. And 256 00:14:36,680 --> 00:14:42,600 Speaker 2: we really do have a Judeo Christian source that we 257 00:14:42,680 --> 00:14:46,800 Speaker 2: are cutting ourselves off from with this, especially with the 258 00:14:46,800 --> 00:14:51,160 Speaker 2: secularization of public schools, most people don't realize all of 259 00:14:51,200 --> 00:14:53,080 Speaker 2: the original school The first of all, there were no 260 00:14:53,080 --> 00:14:56,200 Speaker 2: public schools at the founding era. Right, all the schools 261 00:14:56,280 --> 00:15:01,840 Speaker 2: essentially were religious. Even with the Common Schools movement, you 262 00:15:01,960 --> 00:15:07,640 Speaker 2: had de facto non denominational Protestant public schools. And that's 263 00:15:07,640 --> 00:15:10,200 Speaker 2: why the Catholics were pushing so much for funding for 264 00:15:10,240 --> 00:15:13,240 Speaker 2: their schools. They said, you've got we're paying taxes for 265 00:15:13,240 --> 00:15:19,080 Speaker 2: the Protestant schools, meaning our own. Once we secularized, secularized 266 00:15:19,120 --> 00:15:24,600 Speaker 2: the public schools, we started to forget our roots, and 267 00:15:24,720 --> 00:15:31,400 Speaker 2: our commitments to things like religious liberty, for example, are 268 00:15:31,440 --> 00:15:35,640 Speaker 2: not It's not because we have persuaded people in the 269 00:15:35,760 --> 00:15:38,880 Speaker 2: abstract to believe in these things. It's because we have 270 00:15:38,920 --> 00:15:44,920 Speaker 2: an American story. Right. We were pilgrims who were persecuted 271 00:15:45,040 --> 00:15:48,000 Speaker 2: for their religious beliefs, and they were so devout that 272 00:15:48,040 --> 00:15:51,960 Speaker 2: they decided to cross an ocean in order to have 273 00:15:52,040 --> 00:15:53,400 Speaker 2: religious liberty in the New Land. 274 00:15:53,920 --> 00:15:54,160 Speaker 1: Right. 275 00:15:54,240 --> 00:15:59,920 Speaker 2: And those Puritans saw themselves in biblical terms, right, they 276 00:16:00,120 --> 00:16:05,360 Speaker 2: were the new Israelites. The British king was the Pharaoh, 277 00:16:05,720 --> 00:16:08,760 Speaker 2: the Atlantic Ocean was the Red Sea, and they were 278 00:16:08,800 --> 00:16:11,320 Speaker 2: crossing it to come to the new Promised land. Right. 279 00:16:11,760 --> 00:16:16,560 Speaker 2: It's that story of who we are that is what 280 00:16:16,880 --> 00:16:22,120 Speaker 2: preserves our freedoms. And so if we divorce ourselves from that, 281 00:16:22,200 --> 00:16:25,720 Speaker 2: if we're no longer drawing from the well springs. And 282 00:16:25,920 --> 00:16:29,200 Speaker 2: just look at what our founding fathers, how religious they were, 283 00:16:29,240 --> 00:16:32,760 Speaker 2: and most people don't recognize it was such a religious 284 00:16:32,800 --> 00:16:37,920 Speaker 2: environment that even irreligious or you know, closet atheists of 285 00:16:38,000 --> 00:16:41,440 Speaker 2: Founding fathers like Thomas Paine, I don't know if you 286 00:16:41,480 --> 00:16:45,640 Speaker 2: count them as a Founding Father's pretty the most The 287 00:16:45,680 --> 00:16:49,640 Speaker 2: second most published book in the Founding era after the Bible, 288 00:16:49,880 --> 00:16:53,720 Speaker 2: was Thomas Pain's Common Sense. He explicitly makes the case 289 00:16:53,760 --> 00:16:59,239 Speaker 2: against monarchy, starting with First Samuel, chapter eight and Samuel 290 00:16:59,440 --> 00:17:03,920 Speaker 2: the prophet yelling at the Israelites, how dare you ask 291 00:17:04,000 --> 00:17:06,880 Speaker 2: for a king? Right? Why did he do that? If 292 00:17:06,880 --> 00:17:10,679 Speaker 2: he was not himself religious? He recognized that the Biblical 293 00:17:10,800 --> 00:17:14,880 Speaker 2: story was the most persuasive case you could make for 294 00:17:14,960 --> 00:17:20,440 Speaker 2: freedom and against monarchy. Right, the speeches of Abraham Lincoln. 295 00:17:20,520 --> 00:17:24,760 Speaker 2: You can't understand if you don't understand the religious source. 296 00:17:26,280 --> 00:17:31,800 Speaker 2: Martin Luther, King Junior, right, His argument for civil rights 297 00:17:31,960 --> 00:17:35,400 Speaker 2: and against Jim Crow was a don't forget he's the reverend, 298 00:17:35,520 --> 00:17:39,200 Speaker 2: doctor Martin Luther. It was a biblical based case, and 299 00:17:39,240 --> 00:17:43,600 Speaker 2: we are losing that. And that's what worries me as 300 00:17:43,640 --> 00:17:44,120 Speaker 2: a culture. 301 00:17:44,920 --> 00:17:47,760 Speaker 1: It's so interesting. I feel like you're going to have 302 00:17:47,800 --> 00:17:53,520 Speaker 1: a tough time bridging that across Randy Wingarten. But I 303 00:17:53,600 --> 00:17:56,320 Speaker 1: believe in you. I think that I think if anyone 304 00:17:56,359 --> 00:17:58,800 Speaker 1: could do it, that is a very persuasive case. And 305 00:17:59,000 --> 00:18:02,359 Speaker 1: I really think that you are in perfect shape to 306 00:18:02,400 --> 00:18:03,760 Speaker 1: deliver that message. 307 00:18:03,960 --> 00:18:07,280 Speaker 3: I'll be right back with Jason Bedrick. But first, do 308 00:18:07,359 --> 00:18:10,440 Speaker 3: you know, just like here in the US, Israel has 309 00:18:10,480 --> 00:18:14,000 Speaker 3: their own Independence Day in case you missed it this year, 310 00:18:14,240 --> 00:18:17,680 Speaker 3: Israel's Independence Day was a few days ago on May first. 311 00:18:18,000 --> 00:18:20,680 Speaker 3: But for the people of Israel, freedom is nothing more 312 00:18:20,720 --> 00:18:24,359 Speaker 3: than a daily struggle justice survive. There's no real peace, 313 00:18:24,560 --> 00:18:29,520 Speaker 3: only terror, no joy, just suffering. The Israeli government recognizes 314 00:18:29,600 --> 00:18:33,800 Speaker 3: the International Fellowship of Christians and Jews for ongoing help 315 00:18:33,880 --> 00:18:37,560 Speaker 3: to make sure the elderly, the sick, the wounded, soldiers, 316 00:18:37,560 --> 00:18:42,119 Speaker 3: and impoverished families don't fall through the cracks. Your gift 317 00:18:42,280 --> 00:18:47,119 Speaker 3: to the Fellowship today will provide life saving aid, medicine, 318 00:18:47,160 --> 00:18:51,320 Speaker 3: hearty meals, safety and comfort. I believe that when we 319 00:18:51,400 --> 00:18:54,760 Speaker 3: bless the people of Israel, we unlock God's blessing in 320 00:18:54,840 --> 00:18:58,760 Speaker 3: our lives as well. Show your support for Israel's independence 321 00:18:58,840 --> 00:19:01,679 Speaker 3: by making a life say even gift today, Paul to 322 00:19:01,720 --> 00:19:05,200 Speaker 3: make your gift at eight eight eight for eight eight 323 00:19:05,680 --> 00:19:10,280 Speaker 3: if CJ. That's eight eight eight for eight eight four 324 00:19:10,359 --> 00:19:14,840 Speaker 3: three two five, or go online at IFCJ dot org. 325 00:19:15,359 --> 00:19:18,280 Speaker 3: That's IFCJ dot org. 326 00:19:22,040 --> 00:19:24,679 Speaker 1: What would you tell your sixteen year old self if 327 00:19:24,720 --> 00:19:27,199 Speaker 1: you had to give yourself advice of how things would go? 328 00:19:27,960 --> 00:19:31,280 Speaker 2: Yeah, I don't. I don't know how generalizable this is 329 00:19:31,359 --> 00:19:33,760 Speaker 2: your audience, But I was thinking of the last. 330 00:19:33,600 --> 00:19:37,240 Speaker 1: Question, as you know, is advice generalized. But this is 331 00:19:37,240 --> 00:19:37,440 Speaker 1: for you. 332 00:19:38,000 --> 00:19:41,480 Speaker 2: For myself, I would have gone back and told myself 333 00:19:41,640 --> 00:19:44,439 Speaker 2: to take the opportunity to spend a year in Israel. 334 00:19:45,480 --> 00:19:49,520 Speaker 2: You know, when you're young and you don't have a 335 00:19:49,600 --> 00:19:52,359 Speaker 2: wife and kids and a mortgage and a job and 336 00:19:52,720 --> 00:19:54,439 Speaker 2: all that, and you have this time. You have a 337 00:19:54,440 --> 00:19:57,240 Speaker 2: lot of freedom, and you really need to have that foundation. 338 00:19:58,440 --> 00:20:05,040 Speaker 2: To have spent a year you're in Israel, learning and 339 00:20:06,200 --> 00:20:11,800 Speaker 2: developing greater fluency with language and connecting with my roots. 340 00:20:12,640 --> 00:20:15,400 Speaker 2: I think would have been a tremendous experience. I did 341 00:20:15,400 --> 00:20:17,119 Speaker 2: a month, a month and a half. I did, as 342 00:20:17,119 --> 00:20:21,320 Speaker 2: you know, almost the summer, but only recognized after what 343 00:20:21,359 --> 00:20:24,320 Speaker 2: I was missing by not taking a gap year and 344 00:20:24,760 --> 00:20:25,359 Speaker 2: doing that. 345 00:20:25,760 --> 00:20:28,960 Speaker 1: Yeah, I think in general kids should be encouraged to 346 00:20:29,080 --> 00:20:31,400 Speaker 1: take gap years. A lot of them get to college 347 00:20:31,880 --> 00:20:34,760 Speaker 1: I kind of immature and you know, not really knowing 348 00:20:34,800 --> 00:20:37,199 Speaker 1: what they're going to do. It doesn't have to be 349 00:20:37,280 --> 00:20:39,800 Speaker 1: Israel obviously for a lot of people. But I love 350 00:20:39,840 --> 00:20:43,159 Speaker 1: the idea of that year where you go and you 351 00:20:43,280 --> 00:20:45,800 Speaker 1: learn something else, something maybe you never thought about before, 352 00:20:45,840 --> 00:20:50,720 Speaker 1: and experience new things. All of that is definitely up 353 00:20:50,720 --> 00:20:54,000 Speaker 1: my alley. Hope my kids do it. So I love 354 00:20:54,080 --> 00:20:57,480 Speaker 1: this conversation. I think you're amazing and you're doing such 355 00:20:57,480 --> 00:21:00,520 Speaker 1: incredible work in education. I think a lot of your 356 00:21:00,560 --> 00:21:04,320 Speaker 1: ideas are amazing, and I hope they come to fruition, 357 00:21:04,640 --> 00:21:08,240 Speaker 1: you know, from your lips et cetera. Leave us here 358 00:21:08,720 --> 00:21:11,440 Speaker 1: with your best tip for my listeners on how they 359 00:21:11,480 --> 00:21:12,600 Speaker 1: can improve their lives. 360 00:21:13,119 --> 00:21:16,080 Speaker 2: Yes, so I was. I was discussing this question with 361 00:21:16,160 --> 00:21:20,080 Speaker 2: a close friend of mine, Jeremy Light, who's a fan 362 00:21:20,119 --> 00:21:23,320 Speaker 2: of yours listen to the podcast, and I was like, 363 00:21:23,640 --> 00:21:25,800 Speaker 2: I don't know what sort of advice to give, And 364 00:21:25,800 --> 00:21:28,520 Speaker 2: then I was thinking about, well, what's what's the greatest commandment? 365 00:21:28,720 --> 00:21:32,600 Speaker 2: And there's this very interesting discussion in the midrash among 366 00:21:32,680 --> 00:21:34,840 Speaker 2: the rabbis about you know, what is you know, for 367 00:21:34,920 --> 00:21:37,120 Speaker 2: more than two thousand years ago, what's the greatest commandment? 368 00:21:37,600 --> 00:21:40,560 Speaker 2: And some said, well, it's you know, smay Isral right, 369 00:21:40,720 --> 00:21:43,000 Speaker 2: Hero Israel, the Lord your God, the Lord is won. 370 00:21:43,119 --> 00:21:46,160 Speaker 2: So like, you know, the great statement of Monotheism, which 371 00:21:46,200 --> 00:21:47,920 Speaker 2: is followed by you shall love the Lord your God 372 00:21:47,960 --> 00:21:49,439 Speaker 2: with all your heart, with all your soul, with all 373 00:21:49,440 --> 00:21:54,879 Speaker 2: your might. Another rabbi says, no, no, it's via you 374 00:21:54,880 --> 00:21:58,560 Speaker 2: shall love your fellow as yourself, right, the great statement 375 00:21:58,640 --> 00:22:03,400 Speaker 2: of universe us love and brotherhood. And and then there's 376 00:22:03,440 --> 00:22:09,280 Speaker 2: another rabbi who says, no, it's you shall offer a 377 00:22:09,440 --> 00:22:11,320 Speaker 2: sheep in the morning, you shall offer a sheep in 378 00:22:11,359 --> 00:22:15,200 Speaker 2: the afternoon, right, And then somebody stands out and says 379 00:22:15,200 --> 00:22:18,280 Speaker 2: that he's the He's correct, that's that's the one. So 380 00:22:18,480 --> 00:22:21,920 Speaker 2: what what is this like? It seems it seems like bizarre, right, 381 00:22:22,520 --> 00:22:26,000 Speaker 2: uh uh. You know, we are a great monotheistic faith. 382 00:22:26,520 --> 00:22:30,120 Speaker 2: We believe in you know, loving your fellow. These are 383 00:22:30,160 --> 00:22:33,199 Speaker 2: like really important commandments. How is it that offering a 384 00:22:33,240 --> 00:22:35,880 Speaker 2: sacrifice in the morning in the evening is the great commandment? 385 00:22:36,480 --> 00:22:39,680 Speaker 2: And you know, as the late great Rabbi Jonathan Sachs 386 00:22:39,720 --> 00:22:45,760 Speaker 2: explains it, the message here really is that you need 387 00:22:45,960 --> 00:22:49,600 Speaker 2: every single day to wake up and make that sacrifice 388 00:22:49,640 --> 00:22:51,679 Speaker 2: in the morning, and then in the evening, you know, 389 00:22:51,720 --> 00:22:53,080 Speaker 2: before you go to sleep, you've got to make that 390 00:22:53,080 --> 00:22:57,639 Speaker 2: sacrifice again. If you just have those grand principles, they're abstract, 391 00:22:57,720 --> 00:23:00,400 Speaker 2: they're ephemeral, they're sort of floating out there. Oh yeah, God, 392 00:23:00,440 --> 00:23:02,359 Speaker 2: I believe in one God. Oh yeah, I love my fellow. 393 00:23:03,359 --> 00:23:06,399 Speaker 2: Really show it. Wake up every single day and do 394 00:23:06,440 --> 00:23:10,000 Speaker 2: what you have to do, right. And you know, so 395 00:23:10,920 --> 00:23:13,160 Speaker 2: that applies to so many aspects of our life. Obviously, 396 00:23:13,200 --> 00:23:15,560 Speaker 2: our relationship with God. If we really care, if we 397 00:23:15,600 --> 00:23:18,879 Speaker 2: really oh yes, I love God, we'll show it every morning, 398 00:23:19,000 --> 00:23:22,240 Speaker 2: wake up and pray before you go to bed, pray 399 00:23:22,800 --> 00:23:25,359 Speaker 2: right every single day. You have to put in the work. 400 00:23:25,920 --> 00:23:28,840 Speaker 2: And there was a great Hasidic reba that said, you know, 401 00:23:28,880 --> 00:23:33,000 Speaker 2: it's not just that you sacrifice for what you love. 402 00:23:33,359 --> 00:23:37,359 Speaker 2: You love what you sacrifice for. Right. Your emotions follow 403 00:23:37,480 --> 00:23:42,040 Speaker 2: your actions. You are what you do, and so in 404 00:23:42,440 --> 00:23:46,520 Speaker 2: your family life, right, you want to improve your family life, 405 00:23:46,520 --> 00:23:48,960 Speaker 2: you want to improve your relationship with your wife. Focus 406 00:23:48,960 --> 00:23:50,959 Speaker 2: on what you're doing for her, focus on for what 407 00:23:51,000 --> 00:23:54,520 Speaker 2: you're doing for your kids. Make those sacrifices and do 408 00:23:54,600 --> 00:23:58,080 Speaker 2: them consistently every single day. Make sure you're doing it 409 00:23:58,119 --> 00:24:01,840 Speaker 2: over and over again. You really want to learn more, Okay, 410 00:24:02,160 --> 00:24:05,080 Speaker 2: put your phone down, put it aside, pick up a 411 00:24:05,119 --> 00:24:08,440 Speaker 2: book every single day morning and evening. Spend some time 412 00:24:08,520 --> 00:24:11,679 Speaker 2: with that book. And you know, we understand this, Like 413 00:24:11,680 --> 00:24:13,280 Speaker 2: when it comes to going to the gym right, you 414 00:24:13,280 --> 00:24:16,679 Speaker 2: want to get fit, right, put down the sandwich, go 415 00:24:16,760 --> 00:24:20,479 Speaker 2: to the gym, put in the time. But that's you know, 416 00:24:20,560 --> 00:24:23,560 Speaker 2: this is the I think the message of the mission 417 00:24:23,600 --> 00:24:27,440 Speaker 2: of you have to make these sacrifices and you have 418 00:24:27,480 --> 00:24:28,600 Speaker 2: to make them consistently. 419 00:24:29,520 --> 00:24:31,960 Speaker 1: I love that. Thank you so much. Jason. He is 420 00:24:32,040 --> 00:24:34,720 Speaker 1: Jason Bedwick. Check him out at Heritage, follow him on 421 00:24:34,960 --> 00:24:38,040 Speaker 1: x He's a really wonderful follow Thanks so much for coming. 422 00:24:37,800 --> 00:24:39,440 Speaker 2: On, Thanks so much for having me. 423 00:24:39,359 --> 00:24:41,520 Speaker 1: Thanks so much for joining us on the Carol Marco 424 00:24:41,560 --> 00:24:45,119 Speaker 1: which show. Subscribe wherever you get your podcasts.