1 00:00:05,120 --> 00:00:07,760 Speaker 1: Okay, this is Annie and Samantha. I don't recome to stuff. 2 00:00:07,800 --> 00:00:18,680 Speaker 1: I've never told your production of I Heart Radio. I 3 00:00:18,680 --> 00:00:22,400 Speaker 1: know we've talked about this before, Samantha, about cleanliness, But 4 00:00:23,200 --> 00:00:27,280 Speaker 1: would you say as a child you were clean? No 5 00:00:28,360 --> 00:00:33,319 Speaker 1: emphatic no more. Yes, I mean I can. I can 6 00:00:33,600 --> 00:00:35,599 Speaker 1: leave things up to my imagination and I can come 7 00:00:35,640 --> 00:00:38,200 Speaker 1: up with something. But uh, you know, as I'm thinking 8 00:00:38,240 --> 00:00:40,760 Speaker 1: about it, I don't actually know. As an adult, I 9 00:00:40,800 --> 00:00:42,360 Speaker 1: have had a hard time, and we've talked about this 10 00:00:42,360 --> 00:00:46,199 Speaker 1: many times as a child, because I went through several homes, 11 00:00:46,560 --> 00:00:49,960 Speaker 1: I really can't tell you how clean unclean I was. 12 00:00:50,440 --> 00:00:55,040 Speaker 1: Between being with the grandmother in Korea, I don't remember, 13 00:00:55,280 --> 00:00:57,880 Speaker 1: but I was in a very strict, abusive home, so 14 00:00:57,920 --> 00:01:00,360 Speaker 1: I'm fairly sure I wasn't dirty, uh, or at least 15 00:01:00,400 --> 00:01:03,520 Speaker 1: I didn't make a mess. And in the orphanage, same thing. 16 00:01:04,280 --> 00:01:08,200 Speaker 1: You can't really have messes, I guess, even though technically 17 00:01:08,200 --> 00:01:09,920 Speaker 1: what I was stayed in it was an orphanage at 18 00:01:09,920 --> 00:01:13,360 Speaker 1: that time, but essentially a children's home. And then coming 19 00:01:13,400 --> 00:01:17,560 Speaker 1: into the US, I shared a bedroom with my brother, 20 00:01:18,200 --> 00:01:22,840 Speaker 1: and I oftentimes didn't I hated making up my bed 21 00:01:22,959 --> 00:01:26,399 Speaker 1: and I just could not understand why we needed to 22 00:01:26,600 --> 00:01:28,679 Speaker 1: if we're just gonna sleep in it every night, like 23 00:01:28,720 --> 00:01:32,120 Speaker 1: putting it together shore. But my mother was very clean, 24 00:01:32,200 --> 00:01:34,560 Speaker 1: like that is the prior joy. My mother is a 25 00:01:34,600 --> 00:01:37,920 Speaker 1: person who if she saw a fuzz, she had to 26 00:01:37,959 --> 00:01:40,600 Speaker 1: pick it up. And I mean she never crossed the 27 00:01:40,640 --> 00:01:43,480 Speaker 1: living room without bending over picking up fuss from my carpet, 28 00:01:43,520 --> 00:01:46,880 Speaker 1: Like I distinctly remember this. This is the type of 29 00:01:47,120 --> 00:01:49,440 Speaker 1: person she is. She has also the same one that's like, 30 00:01:50,760 --> 00:01:54,280 Speaker 1: you cannot do the dishwasher properly, so she would just 31 00:01:54,400 --> 00:01:56,680 Speaker 1: rather do it herself. And I used to yell at 32 00:01:56,720 --> 00:01:58,480 Speaker 1: her about that because she would want me to load 33 00:01:58,480 --> 00:02:01,120 Speaker 1: the dishwasher and I'd come in and she would be rearranging. 34 00:02:01,120 --> 00:02:03,560 Speaker 1: I'm like, why in the hell would you have me 35 00:02:03,600 --> 00:02:05,400 Speaker 1: do this as a tour if all you're gonna do 36 00:02:05,440 --> 00:02:09,520 Speaker 1: is redo everything? Right? So this is this is my mother. 37 00:02:10,000 --> 00:02:13,720 Speaker 1: So I don't really know if I was really messy 38 00:02:13,760 --> 00:02:17,000 Speaker 1: because it was always clean, and or I didn't have 39 00:02:17,080 --> 00:02:20,240 Speaker 1: enough stuff to know if I was resy what about you? 40 00:02:21,919 --> 00:02:27,200 Speaker 1: I was a very clean child. I didn't leave stuff out. 41 00:02:27,240 --> 00:02:29,880 Speaker 1: I always put stuff away every night, even though if 42 00:02:29,880 --> 00:02:31,560 Speaker 1: I was going to play it again the next day, 43 00:02:31,600 --> 00:02:35,440 Speaker 1: the same thing. Um, I would put it back, and 44 00:02:36,680 --> 00:02:42,799 Speaker 1: I felt like I had an expectation to be clean. 45 00:02:43,960 --> 00:02:47,120 Speaker 1: And honestly, there's no specific memories I have of like 46 00:02:47,240 --> 00:02:50,440 Speaker 1: why that is. But my brothers were very messy. They 47 00:02:50,480 --> 00:02:52,919 Speaker 1: are very messy compared to them, I am so clean. 48 00:02:54,560 --> 00:02:58,920 Speaker 1: I was a child who asked for chores, so I 49 00:02:58,960 --> 00:03:01,959 Speaker 1: had a chore sheets at Kate Nashley Chores sheet, and 50 00:03:02,600 --> 00:03:05,040 Speaker 1: I would do laundry. I would do all this stuff. 51 00:03:05,520 --> 00:03:08,280 Speaker 1: But I I feel like, I thought, this is a 52 00:03:08,320 --> 00:03:11,560 Speaker 1: deeper psychological issue that I've been digging into in therapy. 53 00:03:11,680 --> 00:03:13,680 Speaker 1: But I felt like I had to earn my keep essentially, 54 00:03:14,480 --> 00:03:18,320 Speaker 1: and like make sure that my parents were not like 55 00:03:18,400 --> 00:03:22,160 Speaker 1: this child is not worth having around um, which is 56 00:03:22,200 --> 00:03:23,840 Speaker 1: messed up. But I think that's where a lot of 57 00:03:23,880 --> 00:03:26,440 Speaker 1: it was coming from where I was like and and 58 00:03:26,480 --> 00:03:30,560 Speaker 1: even when I went to college, my roommates eventually confronted 59 00:03:30,560 --> 00:03:32,600 Speaker 1: me because they were like, it's like, you don't live 60 00:03:32,639 --> 00:03:35,680 Speaker 1: here because I would put stuff. I would like not 61 00:03:35,800 --> 00:03:39,000 Speaker 1: leave anything out. There's like no evidence that I lived 62 00:03:39,000 --> 00:03:41,400 Speaker 1: in that apartment. Because I didn't want to annoy people. 63 00:03:41,800 --> 00:03:44,839 Speaker 1: I wanted it to be like I wasn't even there. 64 00:03:47,160 --> 00:03:52,280 Speaker 1: And that has been interesting through this pandemic because I 65 00:03:52,320 --> 00:03:55,680 Speaker 1: feel my apartment is very A lot of people describe 66 00:03:55,680 --> 00:03:59,560 Speaker 1: it as eclectic or controlled chaos. I'm much messier than 67 00:03:59,600 --> 00:04:01,320 Speaker 1: I was then, even though that's not saying much. But 68 00:04:01,360 --> 00:04:04,840 Speaker 1: I live alone, so I think that's why. And even 69 00:04:04,920 --> 00:04:08,320 Speaker 1: my messy is still relatively clean. It is chaotic in 70 00:04:08,400 --> 00:04:12,040 Speaker 1: some some areas, but it's relatively clean. But I think 71 00:04:12,040 --> 00:04:15,320 Speaker 1: I discussed in a past episode. I recently have had 72 00:04:15,360 --> 00:04:18,800 Speaker 1: people over for the first time since we're vaccinated in 73 00:04:18,839 --> 00:04:21,320 Speaker 1: the you know, it's still really scary out there, but 74 00:04:22,480 --> 00:04:25,920 Speaker 1: we were hanging out in person, and I felt this 75 00:04:25,960 --> 00:04:28,920 Speaker 1: need to go to my mom was also she's very clean, 76 00:04:29,000 --> 00:04:30,440 Speaker 1: and when I come home, she'll tell me all the 77 00:04:30,440 --> 00:04:31,880 Speaker 1: stuff she did for me to come home, and I'm like, 78 00:04:32,040 --> 00:04:34,440 Speaker 1: you don't need to do that. I really, please, don't. 79 00:04:34,480 --> 00:04:40,000 Speaker 1: I don't care, I don't expect it. It's fine, but 80 00:04:40,440 --> 00:04:43,520 Speaker 1: I just caught myself kind of trying to live up 81 00:04:43,520 --> 00:04:46,960 Speaker 1: to that, and I was curious as to why that is. Why. 82 00:04:46,960 --> 00:04:50,080 Speaker 1: I felt like, Okay, I've really got to clean this 83 00:04:50,120 --> 00:04:53,240 Speaker 1: place up and it's got to look really good. And 84 00:04:53,279 --> 00:04:56,200 Speaker 1: that just got me to thinking about our views on 85 00:04:56,360 --> 00:04:58,200 Speaker 1: I even did a deep dive on cleanliness and like 86 00:04:58,200 --> 00:05:01,120 Speaker 1: the history of cleanliness, because I was curious us and 87 00:05:01,560 --> 00:05:05,040 Speaker 1: whether or not it is true that women are cleaner, 88 00:05:05,040 --> 00:05:06,960 Speaker 1: which is kind of the myth, or whether it's more 89 00:05:08,360 --> 00:05:12,280 Speaker 1: that women are expected to be cleaner, and some surveys 90 00:05:12,279 --> 00:05:18,680 Speaker 1: have shown that are judged more harshly for not being cleaner. 91 00:05:19,040 --> 00:05:22,000 Speaker 1: But I do think as we're a lot of us 92 00:05:22,000 --> 00:05:25,760 Speaker 1: are re examining some things after and during this pandemic 93 00:05:26,400 --> 00:05:29,760 Speaker 1: UH strict quarantine, I should stay even though that's not 94 00:05:29,839 --> 00:05:33,039 Speaker 1: outside the real possibility. Again, why we do the things 95 00:05:33,040 --> 00:05:37,600 Speaker 1: we do and what habits are we falling back into 96 00:05:37,800 --> 00:05:40,240 Speaker 1: that we don't need to and why did we have 97 00:05:40,320 --> 00:05:42,640 Speaker 1: them in the first place. I'm not saying you shouldn't 98 00:05:42,640 --> 00:05:44,960 Speaker 1: be clean. I'm just curious as to why I felt this, 99 00:05:45,040 --> 00:05:49,400 Speaker 1: like knee jerk friends are coming over, I must get 100 00:05:49,440 --> 00:05:51,760 Speaker 1: to the very back of my cabinets that they will 101 00:05:51,800 --> 00:05:54,520 Speaker 1: never open and wipe them down. Like I don't know, 102 00:05:55,480 --> 00:05:57,280 Speaker 1: I feel the same way. I think for a long time, 103 00:05:57,320 --> 00:05:59,360 Speaker 1: I'm like, you can't come over unless my house is clean, 104 00:05:59,400 --> 00:06:02,480 Speaker 1: and so I would just whether like not worry about 105 00:06:02,520 --> 00:06:07,480 Speaker 1: having people over. It is it is so in light 106 00:06:07,520 --> 00:06:09,240 Speaker 1: of all of this, we wanted to bring back this 107 00:06:09,320 --> 00:06:14,719 Speaker 1: classic episode, Welcome to Stuff Mom Never Told You from 108 00:06:14,720 --> 00:06:23,120 Speaker 1: how Stuff Works dot Com. Hello, and welcome to the podcast. 109 00:06:23,120 --> 00:06:27,599 Speaker 1: I'm Kristen and I'm Caroline, and Caroline spring has sprung. 110 00:06:29,360 --> 00:06:33,600 Speaker 1: It is now April, and it's time for spring cleaning, right, Yeah, 111 00:06:33,600 --> 00:06:35,640 Speaker 1: I get all that pollen off your car. Do you 112 00:06:35,680 --> 00:06:42,760 Speaker 1: do the spring cleaning thing? It depends I if I'm bored, Yeah, 113 00:06:43,080 --> 00:06:45,479 Speaker 1: but I usually I am too busy to think about it. 114 00:06:45,600 --> 00:06:48,800 Speaker 1: I do think about it, that's good. I don't tend 115 00:06:48,839 --> 00:06:52,720 Speaker 1: to do it though. Well, we're talking about whether women 116 00:06:52,760 --> 00:06:58,040 Speaker 1: are cleaner than men. And you have a male roommate, 117 00:06:58,040 --> 00:07:00,839 Speaker 1: your do roommated roommate, and and you talk to me 118 00:07:00,880 --> 00:07:04,240 Speaker 1: about how you guys do have some some differences in 119 00:07:04,279 --> 00:07:09,080 Speaker 1: your cleaning approach. Yeah, dude, roommate is super neat. He 120 00:07:09,160 --> 00:07:11,360 Speaker 1: gets mad if I leave shoes or purses in the 121 00:07:11,400 --> 00:07:15,480 Speaker 1: living room. But he's not clean as in cleaning dishes, 122 00:07:15,960 --> 00:07:20,000 Speaker 1: spraying down counters, vacuuming. I I'm the opposite clutter. I'm 123 00:07:20,120 --> 00:07:23,880 Speaker 1: naturally a bit of a clutterbug, uh, which I can handle, 124 00:07:23,960 --> 00:07:28,240 Speaker 1: but I can't stomach a dirty kitchen for instance, now 125 00:07:28,360 --> 00:07:31,240 Speaker 1: with the wouldn't that if he can see though a 126 00:07:31,320 --> 00:07:34,640 Speaker 1: pile of dishes in the sink? Is that not? Does 127 00:07:34,640 --> 00:07:37,560 Speaker 1: that not mess with his neatness? Well, see, the thing is, dude, 128 00:07:37,600 --> 00:07:40,280 Speaker 1: roommate doesn't cook very much, so there's never quite a stack. 129 00:07:40,600 --> 00:07:43,240 Speaker 1: It'll be just like a pot that sits low in 130 00:07:43,280 --> 00:07:46,240 Speaker 1: the sinks, so it's not in his field of vision necessarily. 131 00:07:46,680 --> 00:07:50,480 Speaker 1: That makes a lot of sense. Um, well, we're gonna 132 00:07:50,560 --> 00:07:53,920 Speaker 1: get into more about the differences in how you know, 133 00:07:54,000 --> 00:07:57,720 Speaker 1: women and men are clean or not clean, and we're 134 00:07:57,760 --> 00:08:02,840 Speaker 1: looking mostly at hygiene kind of stuff, and I think 135 00:08:02,840 --> 00:08:06,160 Speaker 1: that we could agree that the general assumption is that 136 00:08:06,200 --> 00:08:09,280 Speaker 1: women are cleaner than men. Right, Yeah, Men have the 137 00:08:09,320 --> 00:08:12,280 Speaker 1: whole thing like, oh, they're just these messy guys. They're boys, 138 00:08:12,320 --> 00:08:15,360 Speaker 1: they're dirty, you know, in childhood there's a whole thing 139 00:08:15,400 --> 00:08:18,720 Speaker 1: about girls are made of sugar, spice and all things 140 00:08:18,920 --> 00:08:22,600 Speaker 1: nice boys or snip snails and puppy dog too. I 141 00:08:22,640 --> 00:08:24,520 Speaker 1: don't know that if you've ever been to a public restroom, 142 00:08:24,520 --> 00:08:26,440 Speaker 1: I don't think you could argue that women are necessarily 143 00:08:26,480 --> 00:08:30,680 Speaker 1: cleaner than men. That's true, But as far as the 144 00:08:30,760 --> 00:08:35,880 Speaker 1: standards of cleanliness, what people tend to expect clean wives 145 00:08:36,320 --> 00:08:40,959 Speaker 1: out of boys and girls. There was a study that 146 00:08:41,040 --> 00:08:44,400 Speaker 1: came out of Oregon State University by Sharing Klohe, who's 147 00:08:44,440 --> 00:08:47,440 Speaker 1: a philosopher um and she talks about how the standards 148 00:08:47,480 --> 00:08:50,240 Speaker 1: of cleanliness are generally higher for girls, even by the 149 00:08:50,360 --> 00:08:52,880 Speaker 1: age of five, and it has a lot to do 150 00:08:53,040 --> 00:08:56,840 Speaker 1: with differences such as girls being dressed in dresses whereas 151 00:08:56,920 --> 00:09:00,760 Speaker 1: boys are in more rough and tumble car go shorts 152 00:09:01,080 --> 00:09:06,880 Speaker 1: or denom pan denom denom pant the gene um and 153 00:09:07,480 --> 00:09:11,480 Speaker 1: she talks about how these gendered norms of cleanliness go 154 00:09:11,679 --> 00:09:17,480 Speaker 1: back to nineteenth century US in British schoolyards, where physical 155 00:09:17,559 --> 00:09:20,760 Speaker 1: cleanliness was really taught in school as a form of morality, 156 00:09:21,160 --> 00:09:25,600 Speaker 1: and for girls especially, that emphasis on physical hygiene extended 157 00:09:25,640 --> 00:09:28,920 Speaker 1: to how they carry themselves and presented their bodies. The 158 00:09:28,960 --> 00:09:32,040 Speaker 1: whole cleanliness is next to godliness and the whole virtuous 159 00:09:32,120 --> 00:09:36,920 Speaker 1: woman thing checking themselves. So Chloe would say that from 160 00:09:37,360 --> 00:09:42,400 Speaker 1: the earliest age, girls are acculturated to be cleaner than boys. 161 00:09:42,559 --> 00:09:44,760 Speaker 1: I don't know if that would necessarily apply to me. 162 00:09:45,360 --> 00:09:47,120 Speaker 1: I don't know. The more the longer we do this 163 00:09:47,240 --> 00:09:50,000 Speaker 1: podcast together, the more I think my childhood was very 164 00:09:50,040 --> 00:09:53,400 Speaker 1: strange and atypical for girls. I did wear a lot 165 00:09:53,440 --> 00:09:56,400 Speaker 1: of dresses because my mother, like would still want to 166 00:09:56,520 --> 00:09:59,839 Speaker 1: dress me in smock dresses if she could, But so 167 00:10:00,000 --> 00:10:02,160 Speaker 1: I always need to change out of the dress and 168 00:10:02,280 --> 00:10:04,520 Speaker 1: go outside and play. But when my parents built their house, 169 00:10:04,559 --> 00:10:06,520 Speaker 1: they didn't finish off the backyard for years and years, 170 00:10:06,520 --> 00:10:08,640 Speaker 1: so it was just like this huge mound of Georgia 171 00:10:08,679 --> 00:10:12,559 Speaker 1: red clay, and I would slide down it on my 172 00:10:12,679 --> 00:10:15,600 Speaker 1: butt in my cute pink shorts, and my mother would 173 00:10:15,679 --> 00:10:18,559 Speaker 1: yell at me, and I'm like whatever, I like the 174 00:10:18,679 --> 00:10:23,760 Speaker 1: mud sassy little Caroline and shaking my finger like whatever Sally. Yeah, 175 00:10:23,800 --> 00:10:25,520 Speaker 1: I was a mix of both of those on the 176 00:10:25,600 --> 00:10:28,800 Speaker 1: one hand, wearing lots of dresses. But then as I 177 00:10:28,880 --> 00:10:32,880 Speaker 1: got a little bit older, I wanted to be more 178 00:10:33,040 --> 00:10:36,559 Speaker 1: tomboyish and play with my older brother and getting messy 179 00:10:36,920 --> 00:10:40,000 Speaker 1: and stuff. So maybe it is more of an age thing. 180 00:10:40,280 --> 00:10:43,360 Speaker 1: But the question of our you know, women clearer than men, 181 00:10:43,520 --> 00:10:47,960 Speaker 1: is looking more into our patterns of cleanliness in adulthood, 182 00:10:48,360 --> 00:10:53,600 Speaker 1: because for me, I have lived with guys and girls, 183 00:10:54,160 --> 00:10:56,960 Speaker 1: and I gotta tell you, Caroline, the guys have been 184 00:10:57,000 --> 00:11:01,559 Speaker 1: cleaner overall. Women can be very messy, we can be 185 00:11:02,080 --> 00:11:04,719 Speaker 1: what's up with that? What is maybe all of the 186 00:11:04,880 --> 00:11:07,240 Speaker 1: things that we have which we'll talk about with like 187 00:11:07,360 --> 00:11:09,680 Speaker 1: office spaces. Yeah, we do have a lot of things. 188 00:11:09,840 --> 00:11:13,400 Speaker 1: That's yeah, Yeah, that's that's why my closet is such 189 00:11:13,440 --> 00:11:17,319 Speaker 1: a terrible disaster. But um, Kloe, you know ties in 190 00:11:17,600 --> 00:11:22,520 Speaker 1: her theories about gender and cleanliness to the hygiene hypothesis. Kristin, 191 00:11:22,559 --> 00:11:25,000 Speaker 1: do we want to get into this this now? We 192 00:11:25,200 --> 00:11:27,760 Speaker 1: don't want to confuse anybody. It's kind of a long 193 00:11:28,040 --> 00:11:31,839 Speaker 1: drawn out hypothesis, but basically, the general idea of the 194 00:11:31,920 --> 00:11:35,439 Speaker 1: hygiene hypothesis is that a lack of childhood exposure to 195 00:11:35,640 --> 00:11:39,559 Speaker 1: germs could be responsible for adult allergies and diseases. Basically, 196 00:11:39,640 --> 00:11:41,800 Speaker 1: the idea that if the immune system isn't busy fighting 197 00:11:41,840 --> 00:11:44,880 Speaker 1: off germs, it shifts to developing more allergic tendencies. So 198 00:11:45,040 --> 00:11:46,800 Speaker 1: you know, your immune system gets bored. It's like what 199 00:11:46,920 --> 00:11:49,800 Speaker 1: can I tack? Let's go for peanuts. Yeah, And some 200 00:11:49,960 --> 00:11:53,199 Speaker 1: researchers think that this is responsible for increased rates and 201 00:11:53,280 --> 00:11:57,560 Speaker 1: things like asthma, um. And essentially, you know, we hear 202 00:11:57,559 --> 00:11:59,160 Speaker 1: about it a lot, like the question of whether or 203 00:11:59,200 --> 00:12:02,719 Speaker 1: not like children today especially are so sanitized, that we 204 00:12:02,920 --> 00:12:07,360 Speaker 1: are leaving their immune systems defenseless towards germs like let 205 00:12:07,400 --> 00:12:11,400 Speaker 1: him go outside and good dirty. Yeah, so closed theory, 206 00:12:11,760 --> 00:12:14,679 Speaker 1: uh in in her paper is basically that girls have 207 00:12:14,800 --> 00:12:17,800 Speaker 1: it worse because we are expected from a young age 208 00:12:17,840 --> 00:12:20,120 Speaker 1: to be cleaner and you know, more prim and proper 209 00:12:20,200 --> 00:12:23,439 Speaker 1: than boys are. That we are exposed to fewer germs 210 00:12:23,600 --> 00:12:26,800 Speaker 1: and fewer contaminants, and so we end up growing up 211 00:12:26,840 --> 00:12:31,520 Speaker 1: to be a whole mess of allergic, asthmatic and autoimmune disorder. 212 00:12:31,559 --> 00:12:36,960 Speaker 1: Written people, and may I please briefly talk about cooties? Yeah, 213 00:12:37,320 --> 00:12:40,200 Speaker 1: sure you do? You have them? I don't know. I've 214 00:12:40,240 --> 00:12:44,000 Speaker 1: got my circle circle dot dot immunization a couple of 215 00:12:44,120 --> 00:12:46,520 Speaker 1: years ago when I got my tetanus, So I probably 216 00:12:46,520 --> 00:12:48,160 Speaker 1: get a your due for a boost. I probably do 217 00:12:48,280 --> 00:12:53,040 Speaker 1: need a booster. But in close paper that she published 218 00:12:53,080 --> 00:12:57,160 Speaker 1: in the journal Social Science and Medicine, she cited how 219 00:12:57,440 --> 00:13:02,720 Speaker 1: sociologists have actually studied the cootie's phenomenon and so called 220 00:13:02,800 --> 00:13:06,640 Speaker 1: pollution rituals that take place generally among kids between six 221 00:13:06,760 --> 00:13:09,679 Speaker 1: and nine years old. So we're getting a little bit older, 222 00:13:10,000 --> 00:13:12,720 Speaker 1: and she talks about how girls are far more likely 223 00:13:12,760 --> 00:13:16,200 Speaker 1: than boys to be associated with cooties and be ostracized 224 00:13:16,280 --> 00:13:21,120 Speaker 1: as carriers of cooties mutie carriers. Well, and she links 225 00:13:21,200 --> 00:13:24,040 Speaker 1: that to the whole high giene hypothesis and the high 226 00:13:24,160 --> 00:13:28,120 Speaker 1: the greater expectation for girls to be clean because you know, 227 00:13:29,280 --> 00:13:31,240 Speaker 1: we're from a young age. We're told that, you know, 228 00:13:31,679 --> 00:13:34,760 Speaker 1: we we might even have this thing called cooties, and 229 00:13:34,840 --> 00:13:37,959 Speaker 1: to stay away because we're just covered and covered in 230 00:13:38,160 --> 00:13:42,320 Speaker 1: girl germ. Did you ever make the paper? Well, okay, 231 00:13:42,360 --> 00:13:44,400 Speaker 1: see that's the thing. Everybody calls them fortune tellers, but 232 00:13:44,480 --> 00:13:46,920 Speaker 1: at my school, we call them cootie catchers. The thing 233 00:13:47,000 --> 00:13:49,040 Speaker 1: where the with the flaps and you put your fingers 234 00:13:49,280 --> 00:13:51,720 Speaker 1: in it. Yeah, I would open it, and I wish 235 00:13:51,760 --> 00:13:53,599 Speaker 1: people could see my hands. Our hands are doing this 236 00:13:54,240 --> 00:13:56,800 Speaker 1: some flapping, but we would use them like a beak 237 00:13:56,880 --> 00:14:00,760 Speaker 1: to pick cooties off of our arms. Oh well, again 238 00:14:01,240 --> 00:14:03,559 Speaker 1: there is a bit of a socialization gap with my 239 00:14:03,640 --> 00:14:08,640 Speaker 1: home school. Well, when I tell people cootie catchers, they 240 00:14:08,679 --> 00:14:11,160 Speaker 1: think I'm weird, So don't worry about it. I think 241 00:14:11,200 --> 00:14:15,440 Speaker 1: most people call them fortune tellers. Can be weird together. Great, well, 242 00:14:15,800 --> 00:14:20,000 Speaker 1: let's talk about let's talk about physical cleanliness though in adults, 243 00:14:20,000 --> 00:14:23,400 Speaker 1: because I think we've established that overall, least expectation wise, 244 00:14:23,880 --> 00:14:27,960 Speaker 1: girls clearer than boys. But as we grow up, what 245 00:14:28,120 --> 00:14:31,800 Speaker 1: happens when we're left to our own devices? Is it 246 00:14:31,880 --> 00:14:35,760 Speaker 1: the same? Well? Yes and no. I think men are 247 00:14:35,840 --> 00:14:39,240 Speaker 1: cleaner in summer guards and women are cleaner and others. Um. 248 00:14:39,560 --> 00:14:42,520 Speaker 1: There was a survey performed by cut Ker hand Wash 249 00:14:42,760 --> 00:14:48,200 Speaker 1: in that showed that men are becoming more obsessive about hygiene. 250 00:14:48,440 --> 00:14:51,120 Speaker 1: That might be strong. Language obsessive might be a little strong, 251 00:14:51,480 --> 00:14:54,480 Speaker 1: But basically the survey in the u K goes against 252 00:14:54,560 --> 00:14:57,120 Speaker 1: what a lot of other studies have said in recent years, 253 00:14:57,520 --> 00:14:59,840 Speaker 1: mainly that there's no big difference in how much we 254 00:15:00,000 --> 00:15:03,240 Speaker 1: wash our hands, brush our teeth and clean our sheets. Uh. 255 00:15:03,320 --> 00:15:05,600 Speaker 1: The survey said that both men and women wash their 256 00:15:05,640 --> 00:15:07,800 Speaker 1: hands ten times a day and change their sheets every 257 00:15:07,840 --> 00:15:11,160 Speaker 1: three weeks or so, which makes me want to puke seriously, 258 00:15:11,240 --> 00:15:13,240 Speaker 1: every three weeks? Am I the only one who changes 259 00:15:13,280 --> 00:15:17,240 Speaker 1: my sheets every week? I don't change my sheets every week? Well, 260 00:15:17,360 --> 00:15:21,280 Speaker 1: I'm not sleeping ever anytime, saying it's fine. Well, there's 261 00:15:21,280 --> 00:15:25,120 Speaker 1: a well, some surveys even find that men might wash 262 00:15:25,160 --> 00:15:28,320 Speaker 1: their hair more than women. But I'm gonna go ahead 263 00:15:28,320 --> 00:15:30,240 Speaker 1: and say that that is not a hygiene thing. That 264 00:15:30,480 --> 00:15:33,520 Speaker 1: is a hairstyling thing. Because we're women are told to 265 00:15:33,640 --> 00:15:36,040 Speaker 1: not it's it's actually better for your hair. Do not 266 00:15:36,200 --> 00:15:40,280 Speaker 1: wash your hair. Spoiler. I color my hair and red 267 00:15:40,400 --> 00:15:42,320 Speaker 1: faiths the fastest, so I don't want to. I only 268 00:15:42,360 --> 00:15:44,360 Speaker 1: wash my hair like once or twice a week. But 269 00:15:44,560 --> 00:15:46,760 Speaker 1: you do, you change your sheets more than you wash 270 00:15:46,840 --> 00:15:52,840 Speaker 1: your hair about the same that that's a great step. Um. Yeah. 271 00:15:52,920 --> 00:15:57,280 Speaker 1: There was another UK survey among a thousand college students 272 00:15:57,360 --> 00:16:00,360 Speaker 1: looking at that whole changing of the sheets thing, and 273 00:16:00,480 --> 00:16:04,040 Speaker 1: it also indicated that male students might be changing their 274 00:16:04,040 --> 00:16:06,880 Speaker 1: sheets more of them change your sheets at least once 275 00:16:06,880 --> 00:16:09,760 Speaker 1: a month, with more than washing them once a week, 276 00:16:10,320 --> 00:16:14,320 Speaker 1: meeting the Caroline standard, whereas the female students wash your 277 00:16:14,360 --> 00:16:19,080 Speaker 1: sheets about every two months, which is surprising. I would, 278 00:16:19,160 --> 00:16:22,680 Speaker 1: I would say, ladies, what's wrong? But I remember, I 279 00:16:22,720 --> 00:16:25,120 Speaker 1: mean freshman year of college, I've barely changed my sheets 280 00:16:25,880 --> 00:16:28,400 Speaker 1: either maybe once a month, maybe once a month. I 281 00:16:28,480 --> 00:16:31,640 Speaker 1: was there with the guys changing my sheets. Yeah. But 282 00:16:32,280 --> 00:16:36,320 Speaker 1: with the whole underwear thing, no big surprise here that 283 00:16:36,760 --> 00:16:41,680 Speaker 1: women change their underwear more often than men do. Yeah. 284 00:16:41,800 --> 00:16:44,920 Speaker 1: Forty two. This is back to the Cuticura survey of 285 00:16:45,000 --> 00:16:48,000 Speaker 1: men admitted to wearing the same pair of undepense more 286 00:16:48,080 --> 00:16:51,960 Speaker 1: than once without washing them, and this was often for women. 287 00:16:52,000 --> 00:16:54,200 Speaker 1: This was just And I would like to take this 288 00:16:54,320 --> 00:16:57,280 Speaker 1: time to point out that according to a Keeping It 289 00:16:57,480 --> 00:17:01,800 Speaker 1: Clean That's k l e In infographic that Kristen and 290 00:17:01,840 --> 00:17:05,520 Speaker 1: I found, that's great comparing cleanliness and hygiene between the genders, 291 00:17:06,440 --> 00:17:09,800 Speaker 1: they said that poop just doesn't come off people. You 292 00:17:09,880 --> 00:17:12,280 Speaker 1: need to like really sterilize that if you're going to 293 00:17:12,359 --> 00:17:14,480 Speaker 1: be wearing you can get up to a gram of 294 00:17:14,520 --> 00:17:16,520 Speaker 1: poop in your underwear if you don't wash them. Yeah. 295 00:17:16,560 --> 00:17:20,440 Speaker 1: I was so excited slash disgusted by that fact that 296 00:17:20,560 --> 00:17:24,560 Speaker 1: I tweeted it oh well once I ran across it, 297 00:17:24,800 --> 00:17:29,160 Speaker 1: And I also texted it out of context to my boyfriend, 298 00:17:29,240 --> 00:17:35,040 Speaker 1: who was then very confused and asked if everything was okay. Well, okay, 299 00:17:35,160 --> 00:17:36,840 Speaker 1: so it's not just underwear and sheets that we have 300 00:17:36,920 --> 00:17:42,000 Speaker 1: to worry about. Let's talk about our actual physical selves. Uh. 301 00:17:42,160 --> 00:17:45,680 Speaker 1: An American Society of Microbiology study in two thousand five 302 00:17:46,040 --> 00:17:50,760 Speaker 1: found that women's hands tend to be cleaner than men's. 303 00:17:50,800 --> 00:17:52,399 Speaker 1: And how did they find this? Did they did they 304 00:17:52,440 --> 00:17:54,800 Speaker 1: go up to people and swipe their hands. No, they 305 00:17:54,920 --> 00:17:58,080 Speaker 1: just they just plain all spied on them in the bathroom. Yeah, 306 00:17:58,600 --> 00:18:04,159 Speaker 1: Harris Interactive pulling watched over six thousand adults, six thousand, 307 00:18:04,240 --> 00:18:09,600 Speaker 1: twenty eight adults to be precise, just lingering in bathrooms 308 00:18:09,760 --> 00:18:11,679 Speaker 1: waiting to see if you're gonna wash it on tower 309 00:18:11,800 --> 00:18:16,320 Speaker 1: for nine hours. And they found that women wash your 310 00:18:16,359 --> 00:18:18,080 Speaker 1: hands a lot more often than men. And this is 311 00:18:18,119 --> 00:18:23,560 Speaker 1: in public restrooms and Caroline. The worst hygiene, unfortunately, was 312 00:18:23,640 --> 00:18:28,080 Speaker 1: found for both men and women at Atlanta's Turner Field 313 00:18:28,760 --> 00:18:33,960 Speaker 1: Home of the Braves in our hometown. Thirty seven percent 314 00:18:34,000 --> 00:18:37,240 Speaker 1: of men and six percent of women left the bathroom 315 00:18:37,359 --> 00:18:41,359 Speaker 1: without washing. Yeah, but what about all the catchup and 316 00:18:41,520 --> 00:18:44,120 Speaker 1: mustard from hot dogs? Hey, these people are maybe they're 317 00:18:44,160 --> 00:18:45,960 Speaker 1: during a couple of expensive beers and they want to 318 00:18:46,000 --> 00:18:47,919 Speaker 1: get back out there to their expensive seats with their 319 00:18:47,960 --> 00:18:52,680 Speaker 1: expensive hot dogs, watching the expensive game. The biggest gender 320 00:18:52,760 --> 00:18:55,680 Speaker 1: disparity was at New York's Penn Station, where sixty percent 321 00:18:55,720 --> 00:19:00,199 Speaker 1: of men and women wash their hands. Best hygiene up 322 00:19:00,240 --> 00:19:04,120 Speaker 1: San Francisco in Chicago, San Francisco's Ferry Terminal, Farmers Market 323 00:19:04,160 --> 00:19:07,040 Speaker 1: in Chicago's Museum of Science and Industry, and shut aquarium. 324 00:19:07,600 --> 00:19:10,680 Speaker 1: It's a long name. UH were places where only twelve 325 00:19:11,119 --> 00:19:14,040 Speaker 1: of people left the restroom without washing their hands. But 326 00:19:14,320 --> 00:19:18,120 Speaker 1: when it comes to self reporting, also not so surprisingly. 327 00:19:18,320 --> 00:19:21,520 Speaker 1: When Harris Interactive went back and just called a sample 328 00:19:21,560 --> 00:19:25,000 Speaker 1: of a thousand adults, they reported washing their hands far 329 00:19:25,119 --> 00:19:29,080 Speaker 1: more often than the numbers would imply of the of 330 00:19:29,119 --> 00:19:33,080 Speaker 1: the people who were, you know, scouting out actual handwashing instances. 331 00:19:33,440 --> 00:19:37,720 Speaker 1: But the good news is hand washing is getting better. 332 00:19:37,800 --> 00:19:39,800 Speaker 1: And it might seem like, oh, this is handwashing doesn't 333 00:19:39,800 --> 00:19:41,320 Speaker 1: really make that big of a difference. Yes, it does 334 00:19:41,400 --> 00:19:45,320 Speaker 1: make a massive difference in terms of disease prevention, just 335 00:19:45,440 --> 00:19:47,720 Speaker 1: the basic washing your hands. And I mean I've heard 336 00:19:47,760 --> 00:19:50,040 Speaker 1: people argue. When I say people, I mean boys. I've 337 00:19:50,080 --> 00:19:52,280 Speaker 1: heard boys argue that, well, it's not like, I mean, 338 00:19:52,320 --> 00:19:54,000 Speaker 1: I'm touching a whole lot of stuff in the bathroom 339 00:19:54,040 --> 00:19:55,399 Speaker 1: when I'm in there. They're getting and I'm like, no, 340 00:19:55,680 --> 00:19:57,520 Speaker 1: think about all the stuff you're touching before you go 341 00:19:57,600 --> 00:19:59,919 Speaker 1: to the bathroom. You want to wash all that stuff 342 00:20:00,040 --> 00:20:02,359 Speaker 1: off anyway. Yeah, so you know, we're not perfect, but 343 00:20:02,400 --> 00:20:05,639 Speaker 1: we're getting better. In the American Society of Microbiology, UH 344 00:20:05,800 --> 00:20:08,080 Speaker 1: followed up and in two they went back to the 345 00:20:08,200 --> 00:20:12,479 Speaker 1: same places Kristen turner Field was still the dirtiest except 346 00:20:12,520 --> 00:20:15,320 Speaker 1: for the women. Percent of the women, it was still 347 00:20:15,359 --> 00:20:19,280 Speaker 1: the worst for men. Uh sorry sorry. Thirty five percent 348 00:20:19,359 --> 00:20:21,840 Speaker 1: of men at turner Field in Atlanta did not wash 349 00:20:21,880 --> 00:20:25,440 Speaker 1: their hands, but percent of the women observed did. That 350 00:20:25,600 --> 00:20:28,520 Speaker 1: is commitment because those lines can get crazy, can But um, 351 00:20:28,680 --> 00:20:31,760 Speaker 1: the most likely place for men to wash their hands 352 00:20:32,040 --> 00:20:35,320 Speaker 1: still the Chicago Museum mentioned eighty eight percent of men. 353 00:20:35,520 --> 00:20:40,320 Speaker 1: Maybe intellectual types pay better attention to hand hygiene. Yeah, yeah, 354 00:20:40,359 --> 00:20:43,040 Speaker 1: I don't know, but they were very happy to report 355 00:20:43,080 --> 00:20:46,200 Speaker 1: and I'm happy to read it that the study found 356 00:20:46,320 --> 00:20:49,880 Speaker 1: that about eight percent of people all together wash their hands, 357 00:20:49,960 --> 00:20:52,800 Speaker 1: which is a jump from seventy seven percent in two 358 00:20:52,840 --> 00:20:56,119 Speaker 1: thousands seven and sixty eight percent. And I bet that 359 00:20:56,200 --> 00:20:59,680 Speaker 1: does have to do with more public health awareness in 360 00:20:59,800 --> 00:21:03,000 Speaker 1: terms of washing your hands, the benefits of washing your 361 00:21:03,040 --> 00:21:06,800 Speaker 1: hands and disease prevention, because we've had a couple of 362 00:21:06,920 --> 00:21:10,720 Speaker 1: animal related flus that have circulated swine flu, bird flu, 363 00:21:10,960 --> 00:21:14,879 Speaker 1: zebra flu, giraffe flew all over the place. Um, but 364 00:21:15,240 --> 00:21:18,000 Speaker 1: when we do wash there some researchers think that our 365 00:21:18,080 --> 00:21:22,480 Speaker 1: motivations and by army men versus women might differ. And 366 00:21:22,560 --> 00:21:24,960 Speaker 1: this is coming out of the American Journal of Public 367 00:21:25,040 --> 00:21:27,960 Speaker 1: Health in October of two thousand nine. And what the 368 00:21:28,000 --> 00:21:34,280 Speaker 1: researchers did was put up these flashing pro hand washing 369 00:21:34,560 --> 00:21:38,160 Speaker 1: messages in front of in a public restroom, in front 370 00:21:38,200 --> 00:21:42,720 Speaker 1: of the soap dispenser, and it would change every time 371 00:21:43,000 --> 00:21:46,399 Speaker 1: to see, you know, for a different tax. So some 372 00:21:46,600 --> 00:21:49,800 Speaker 1: of them. Some of the messages were more discussed oriented, 373 00:21:50,240 --> 00:21:53,040 Speaker 1: such as, don't take the loo with you, wash with 374 00:21:53,200 --> 00:22:01,239 Speaker 1: soap or soap it off all eated light. Yeah. Uh. 375 00:22:01,400 --> 00:22:05,560 Speaker 1: There were other ones that were related purely to being informative, 376 00:22:05,720 --> 00:22:09,679 Speaker 1: which was water doesn't kill germs, soap does. Uh. They 377 00:22:09,760 --> 00:22:14,160 Speaker 1: found that that men really responded to the disgusted messages, 378 00:22:14,200 --> 00:22:16,720 Speaker 1: whereas women were more likely to wash their hands that 379 00:22:16,800 --> 00:22:20,600 Speaker 1: they were armed with knowledge. One that performed well for both. 380 00:22:20,640 --> 00:22:23,240 Speaker 1: I'm gonna let Kristin read it is one tied to 381 00:22:23,440 --> 00:22:26,359 Speaker 1: social norms. Is the person next to you washing was 382 00:22:26,520 --> 00:22:31,959 Speaker 1: soap that was just solid up talk right there. Uh 383 00:22:32,920 --> 00:22:36,119 Speaker 1: had that um And that makes sense because you know, 384 00:22:36,640 --> 00:22:38,480 Speaker 1: it is calling you out. It's a little bit of 385 00:22:38,520 --> 00:22:41,440 Speaker 1: a public shaming if you're not washing your hands. But 386 00:22:41,520 --> 00:22:43,960 Speaker 1: the thing is, though, in post interviews, when the researchers 387 00:22:44,000 --> 00:22:47,719 Speaker 1: would wait outside the bathroom and say, hey, gal, did 388 00:22:47,760 --> 00:22:50,080 Speaker 1: you wash your hands? Yeah? Did you see that message? 389 00:22:50,440 --> 00:22:53,920 Speaker 1: Not really, so they weren't really sure whether or not 390 00:22:54,160 --> 00:22:59,560 Speaker 1: it just happened to be a discussed a pro disgusted message. Yeah, 391 00:22:59,600 --> 00:23:02,159 Speaker 1: maybe it was something more subliminal. And I did a 392 00:23:02,240 --> 00:23:06,120 Speaker 1: little bit more digging on this whole discussed aspect of hygiene, 393 00:23:06,359 --> 00:23:09,200 Speaker 1: because there is a ton of research out there on 394 00:23:09,480 --> 00:23:14,640 Speaker 1: the emotion of disgust, how it differs for men and women. 395 00:23:14,680 --> 00:23:17,440 Speaker 1: Are sensitivity to that, and how it's linked to things 396 00:23:17,600 --> 00:23:22,520 Speaker 1: like not only hygiene, but also morality, sexuality, etcetera. And 397 00:23:23,280 --> 00:23:26,120 Speaker 1: there are some studies that would suggest that disgusted sensitivity 398 00:23:26,440 --> 00:23:30,840 Speaker 1: it's higher among women, which would contradict this this study 399 00:23:30,920 --> 00:23:34,840 Speaker 1: finding that don't take the loo with you is more 400 00:23:34,920 --> 00:23:39,240 Speaker 1: effective for men. But I don't know either way. I 401 00:23:39,320 --> 00:23:42,679 Speaker 1: think um, I would I would buy the whole thing 402 00:23:42,760 --> 00:23:46,360 Speaker 1: that the social norm thing of hey, you know you're 403 00:23:46,440 --> 00:23:49,359 Speaker 1: you're gross if you're not washing your hands because everybody 404 00:23:49,400 --> 00:23:54,840 Speaker 1: else is doing it would be effective. Now what about teeth? I, 405 00:23:55,119 --> 00:23:57,240 Speaker 1: for one, I'm a bad flosser. I'm gonna go ahead 406 00:23:57,240 --> 00:23:58,640 Speaker 1: and admit that I feel like I'm in a safe 407 00:23:58,640 --> 00:24:00,639 Speaker 1: space to talk about it. You have a bad floster 408 00:24:00,720 --> 00:24:03,720 Speaker 1: to I. I try, but really it's mainly just after 409 00:24:03,800 --> 00:24:07,359 Speaker 1: I eat popcorn. Um. An American Dental Association study in 410 00:24:07,400 --> 00:24:11,239 Speaker 1: two thousand four found that more Americans are saying now 411 00:24:11,359 --> 00:24:14,639 Speaker 1: that they brush their teeth after every meal, but women 412 00:24:14,720 --> 00:24:17,720 Speaker 1: still outpaced men. A quarter of respondents in this survey 413 00:24:17,840 --> 00:24:20,000 Speaker 1: that they brush their teeth after every meal, more than 414 00:24:20,080 --> 00:24:23,320 Speaker 1: twice the number reported six years earlier. So we're making strides. 415 00:24:23,680 --> 00:24:27,760 Speaker 1: Congratulations everyone. Yeah, and women, though, are still more likely 416 00:24:27,800 --> 00:24:31,000 Speaker 1: to have a regular dentist get their checkups more often. 417 00:24:31,160 --> 00:24:35,280 Speaker 1: Men will tend to go years between dental checkups. Women 418 00:24:35,320 --> 00:24:39,040 Speaker 1: are also more likely to brush twice a day, so 419 00:24:39,160 --> 00:24:43,600 Speaker 1: there's a bit of an oral hygiene gender gaps still there. 420 00:24:43,840 --> 00:24:46,280 Speaker 1: What's up? What's up with people who only brush their 421 00:24:46,280 --> 00:24:51,160 Speaker 1: teeth once a day? Um? Maybe it is a time thing. 422 00:24:51,400 --> 00:24:53,920 Speaker 1: I don't know. I'm really not sure. Just like I 423 00:24:54,040 --> 00:24:56,040 Speaker 1: changed my steets once a week, Kristen, I washed my 424 00:24:56,119 --> 00:24:59,800 Speaker 1: Arab brush my teeth twice a day. I'm looking at 425 00:24:59,800 --> 00:25:02,720 Speaker 1: all of you very disappointed. But let's take it to 426 00:25:03,440 --> 00:25:08,359 Speaker 1: the workplace, because you know what place is teeming with 427 00:25:08,560 --> 00:25:15,879 Speaker 1: germs your desk? Oh yes, um. Clorox company has sponsored 428 00:25:15,920 --> 00:25:18,200 Speaker 1: a number of studies not so surprisingly, I feel like 429 00:25:18,240 --> 00:25:21,040 Speaker 1: I've said not so surprisingly like twenty five times in 430 00:25:21,160 --> 00:25:24,960 Speaker 1: this podcast by the way, not so surprisingly, I know, 431 00:25:26,280 --> 00:25:30,960 Speaker 1: but Clorox sponsored a number of studies on germs and 432 00:25:31,280 --> 00:25:36,080 Speaker 1: our cleaning habits. And one of these studies, which was 433 00:25:36,160 --> 00:25:40,080 Speaker 1: conducted by University of Arizona professor Charles Gerba in two 434 00:25:40,160 --> 00:25:44,399 Speaker 1: thousand seven, it found that women's desks harbor three to 435 00:25:44,600 --> 00:25:48,639 Speaker 1: four times the number of bacteria than men's desks, and 436 00:25:48,760 --> 00:25:52,200 Speaker 1: this was looking at more than one hundred offices around 437 00:25:52,280 --> 00:25:56,320 Speaker 1: New York, Los Angeles, San Francisco, d C, Oregon, and 438 00:25:57,000 --> 00:26:02,560 Speaker 1: the University of Arizona campus and attributes this to women 439 00:26:02,680 --> 00:26:07,200 Speaker 1: having more interactions with small children, keeping food and makeup 440 00:26:07,920 --> 00:26:10,080 Speaker 1: at the desk as well. And even though our desk 441 00:26:10,200 --> 00:26:13,960 Speaker 1: might be neater, they are dirtier, largely because of the 442 00:26:14,040 --> 00:26:17,959 Speaker 1: food in the makeup. Yeah, cosmetics, hand lotions and food 443 00:26:18,240 --> 00:26:23,960 Speaker 1: are microorganism magnets um. The worst offender overall, though, was 444 00:26:24,119 --> 00:26:27,560 Speaker 1: men's wallets, because they're in that warm back pocket that 445 00:26:27,720 --> 00:26:30,560 Speaker 1: just serves as an incubator for bacteria. But not so 446 00:26:30,760 --> 00:26:34,640 Speaker 1: fast ladies, you're not off the hook either. Most handbags 447 00:26:35,000 --> 00:26:39,280 Speaker 1: have tens of thousands of bacteria on them, just just 448 00:26:39,400 --> 00:26:42,159 Speaker 1: to let you know. Bacteria levels of two hundred are 449 00:26:42,200 --> 00:26:45,480 Speaker 1: considered safe, but don't worry. Men's wallets are four times 450 00:26:45,520 --> 00:26:48,520 Speaker 1: dirtier than that. You know what, I'm gonna go ahead 451 00:26:48,520 --> 00:26:52,880 Speaker 1: and say that maybe I have very low discuss sensitivity 452 00:26:53,240 --> 00:26:56,680 Speaker 1: with the in terms of pathogen disgust because it doesn't 453 00:26:56,720 --> 00:27:00,639 Speaker 1: bother me. Our bodies are teeming with bacteria. Sure, but 454 00:27:00,800 --> 00:27:02,880 Speaker 1: just don't put your purse down on the bathroom floor 455 00:27:03,240 --> 00:27:05,919 Speaker 1: or anything. That is a good point, but one thing 456 00:27:06,000 --> 00:27:08,560 Speaker 1: to keep in mind. I mean, it's not hopeless. Don't worry. 457 00:27:09,960 --> 00:27:12,359 Speaker 1: Fewer back here you were found on desktops that were 458 00:27:12,400 --> 00:27:17,680 Speaker 1: regularly sanitized. So keep those antibacterial wipes around or sprays 459 00:27:17,720 --> 00:27:19,800 Speaker 1: whatever you feel like using. I I have a huge, 460 00:27:19,960 --> 00:27:24,360 Speaker 1: like industrial size canister of of wipes because I feel 461 00:27:24,359 --> 00:27:26,440 Speaker 1: like people get all the time at work. Well, that 462 00:27:26,680 --> 00:27:31,720 Speaker 1: is sick building syndrome is a thing, and researchers have 463 00:27:31,880 --> 00:27:36,440 Speaker 1: attributed to bad habits like people not cleaning their desks 464 00:27:36,480 --> 00:27:39,960 Speaker 1: and and speaking of women and food in the desk. 465 00:27:40,320 --> 00:27:44,200 Speaker 1: Charles Gerba that University of Arizona professor said something along 466 00:27:44,280 --> 00:27:48,159 Speaker 1: the lines of, uh, if the apocalypse ever happened, he 467 00:27:48,240 --> 00:27:51,359 Speaker 1: would immediately just rush to a woman's workspace because of 468 00:27:51,400 --> 00:27:54,440 Speaker 1: the amount of food that we keep stowed away in 469 00:27:54,520 --> 00:27:56,080 Speaker 1: our desk. I don't have any food at the moment. 470 00:27:56,119 --> 00:27:59,160 Speaker 1: I usually keep some granola bars, but those are sealed up. Yeah, 471 00:27:59,160 --> 00:28:03,000 Speaker 1: I don't have anything. Just which when you're hungry, the 472 00:28:03,040 --> 00:28:05,359 Speaker 1: most oppressing thing to do is open your drawer and 473 00:28:05,440 --> 00:28:09,400 Speaker 1: only see utensils that could be for food that's not there. 474 00:28:09,600 --> 00:28:13,359 Speaker 1: Your imaginary hook food back when they had the in 475 00:28:13,600 --> 00:28:16,440 Speaker 1: in the movie Hook anyway, uh so, but the opposite 476 00:28:16,520 --> 00:28:20,359 Speaker 1: was true. Interestingly enough, in a plus one study may 477 00:28:21,480 --> 00:28:24,440 Speaker 1: performed by Scott Kelly, who's a biology professor at San 478 00:28:24,480 --> 00:28:27,960 Speaker 1: Diego State University. He looked at ninety offices in New York, 479 00:28:28,000 --> 00:28:31,760 Speaker 1: San Francisco, and Tucson and found that men's offices, not women, 480 00:28:31,840 --> 00:28:39,800 Speaker 1: had up more bacteria. So basically, just be aware people 481 00:28:40,160 --> 00:28:43,120 Speaker 1: that your workspaces grows, particularly if you eat at your desk. 482 00:28:43,360 --> 00:28:46,320 Speaker 1: You want to just clean that sucker off maybe once 483 00:28:46,440 --> 00:28:48,600 Speaker 1: a week or once every other week. Yeah, that's San 484 00:28:48,680 --> 00:28:54,000 Speaker 1: Diego State University study got a ton of press and 485 00:28:54,680 --> 00:28:56,600 Speaker 1: like thinking about all this stuff of you know, like, oh, 486 00:28:56,680 --> 00:29:00,280 Speaker 1: well men have more, Oh but handbags are so rows 487 00:29:00,320 --> 00:29:02,400 Speaker 1: all the stuff. I feel like it all kind of 488 00:29:02,520 --> 00:29:07,440 Speaker 1: comes out in the wash pun there because I don't know, 489 00:29:07,480 --> 00:29:09,400 Speaker 1: I don't know that the that kind of gender difference 490 00:29:09,440 --> 00:29:12,680 Speaker 1: matters that much. It's more of an overall message of saying, 491 00:29:12,840 --> 00:29:14,840 Speaker 1: you know, I just maybe we should keep our spaces 492 00:29:15,400 --> 00:29:19,960 Speaker 1: a little bit cleaner. Um. But once we leave work 493 00:29:20,200 --> 00:29:23,880 Speaker 1: finally and we go home, who is doing a majority 494 00:29:24,040 --> 00:29:27,560 Speaker 1: of that housework? We've talked about it in podcast Divorce. 495 00:29:27,640 --> 00:29:29,400 Speaker 1: We're not going to spend a ton of time on it, 496 00:29:29,840 --> 00:29:34,320 Speaker 1: but it's the women. Yeah, we we as women are 497 00:29:34,360 --> 00:29:37,880 Speaker 1: more likely to do more housework more often. Well we 498 00:29:37,880 --> 00:29:43,360 Speaker 1: should say that is in a male female combo household. Yes, 499 00:29:43,920 --> 00:29:48,320 Speaker 1: and that's also in the Caroline and dude roommate household. Also, 500 00:29:48,880 --> 00:29:52,440 Speaker 1: not that we fight about it or anything dot dot dot, 501 00:29:52,920 --> 00:29:55,680 Speaker 1: but yeah, so we reference that keeping it clean in 502 00:29:55,720 --> 00:30:00,280 Speaker 1: phographic earlier. According to the research they did for men 503 00:30:00,360 --> 00:30:03,880 Speaker 1: are less likely to do some housework every day, not 504 00:30:04,160 --> 00:30:06,840 Speaker 1: in general, just every day, and that's of men versus 505 00:30:07,680 --> 00:30:10,680 Speaker 1: of women. But when they do clean the house, it's 506 00:30:10,880 --> 00:30:14,480 Speaker 1: more thorough. Yeah, and the whole thing about men maybe 507 00:30:14,520 --> 00:30:16,200 Speaker 1: waiting longer to clean the house, but when they do it, 508 00:30:16,280 --> 00:30:20,640 Speaker 1: they do it really, really, really well. Um reminded me 509 00:30:20,920 --> 00:30:24,560 Speaker 1: of a recent article that was published in the Atlantic 510 00:30:24,760 --> 00:30:28,760 Speaker 1: by Alexandra Brander, who's a philosophy professor out at the 511 00:30:28,840 --> 00:30:34,320 Speaker 1: University of Kentucky, and she was talking about reasons why 512 00:30:34,400 --> 00:30:37,440 Speaker 1: potential reasons why men might do less housework than women 513 00:30:37,600 --> 00:30:44,520 Speaker 1: in heterosexual marriages, and she highlighted three major theories. One 514 00:30:44,640 --> 00:30:49,120 Speaker 1: is the epistemic hypothesis, which is basically, men didn't see 515 00:30:49,160 --> 00:30:52,440 Speaker 1: their dad's modeling this household clean behavior, so they're not 516 00:30:52,480 --> 00:30:56,920 Speaker 1: gonna do it. Uh. Motivational hypothesis, which would be house 517 00:30:57,000 --> 00:31:01,280 Speaker 1: cleaning or running errands is an unjustified table time cost, 518 00:31:02,120 --> 00:31:04,880 Speaker 1: so which reminds me of like, you know, they might 519 00:31:04,920 --> 00:31:06,840 Speaker 1: not do it every day, when they do it, they're 520 00:31:06,840 --> 00:31:08,960 Speaker 1: going to do it really really well to make it 521 00:31:09,280 --> 00:31:14,040 Speaker 1: worth it. And one of the reasons why the motivational 522 00:31:14,160 --> 00:31:17,880 Speaker 1: hypothesis is compelling is because sometimes women and I've been 523 00:31:17,920 --> 00:31:19,760 Speaker 1: guilty of this as well, not just with male but 524 00:31:19,800 --> 00:31:23,960 Speaker 1: also female roommates. Um, women will come behind and sort 525 00:31:23,960 --> 00:31:26,400 Speaker 1: of sweep up behind them or even redo what they did, 526 00:31:26,760 --> 00:31:30,640 Speaker 1: for instance, with me, I'm a stickler about dishwashers. Yes 527 00:31:30,760 --> 00:31:33,400 Speaker 1: you are, I am. I have I'm very good at 528 00:31:33,440 --> 00:31:37,320 Speaker 1: loading it, and I feel like you should not waste space. 529 00:31:38,120 --> 00:31:41,280 Speaker 1: And I have been known much too roommates chagrin to 530 00:31:41,760 --> 00:31:44,840 Speaker 1: come behind them and reload the Dishwah, I do that 531 00:31:44,880 --> 00:31:46,760 Speaker 1: behind dude, roommate all the time? Are you kidding? What? 532 00:31:46,920 --> 00:31:50,600 Speaker 1: I just I imagine you might have the same thought 533 00:31:50,680 --> 00:31:53,320 Speaker 1: when you open the dishwasher after a roommate, boyfriend, whoever, 534 00:31:53,480 --> 00:31:55,360 Speaker 1: has loaded it. You look at it and you're like, 535 00:31:56,080 --> 00:31:59,440 Speaker 1: in what way did this make sense in your brain? 536 00:31:59,760 --> 00:32:03,600 Speaker 1: Because as things are like spread out over the entire dishwasher, 537 00:32:03,640 --> 00:32:04,720 Speaker 1: and you're like, no, no, no, no, no no. The 538 00:32:04,760 --> 00:32:08,560 Speaker 1: plates go here, spoons are over here, cups are obviously 539 00:32:08,640 --> 00:32:11,560 Speaker 1: on the top to the right. Yeah. And and it 540 00:32:11,640 --> 00:32:16,280 Speaker 1: ties totally into that motivational hypothesis because man or woman, 541 00:32:16,680 --> 00:32:18,680 Speaker 1: if that's going on, you would say, you know what, 542 00:32:19,440 --> 00:32:21,760 Speaker 1: You're going to do the dishes because you're just gonna 543 00:32:21,800 --> 00:32:24,640 Speaker 1: do them anyway, whether I load the dishwasher or not. 544 00:32:25,320 --> 00:32:29,720 Speaker 1: And interestingly, that's something that Facebook CEO Shell Sandberg has 545 00:32:29,760 --> 00:32:33,080 Speaker 1: brought up for you know, women who are married to 546 00:32:33,160 --> 00:32:36,320 Speaker 1: men saying, you know what, if you want to split 547 00:32:36,480 --> 00:32:40,320 Speaker 1: the household chores fifty fifty, you need to let them 548 00:32:40,440 --> 00:32:45,840 Speaker 1: do that fifty because I think women sometimes unnecessarily kind 549 00:32:45,880 --> 00:32:50,240 Speaker 1: of buy into the whole acculturation of women being the 550 00:32:51,080 --> 00:32:55,040 Speaker 1: chore doers, the maids essentially around the house, and whether 551 00:32:55,160 --> 00:32:58,280 Speaker 1: we are conscious of it or not, and take on 552 00:32:58,520 --> 00:33:00,880 Speaker 1: more than we really have to, and it kind of 553 00:33:01,360 --> 00:33:05,040 Speaker 1: continues that whole epistemic thing, the motivational thing. And then 554 00:33:05,240 --> 00:33:09,680 Speaker 1: there's also the third uh the hypothesis brand or highlighted 555 00:33:09,720 --> 00:33:13,560 Speaker 1: at the Atlantic is the structural hypothesis, saying that basically, 556 00:33:13,600 --> 00:33:15,760 Speaker 1: the modern workplace doesn't afford men the time to do 557 00:33:15,880 --> 00:33:19,960 Speaker 1: it like if they would if they could, which which 558 00:33:20,000 --> 00:33:22,400 Speaker 1: I don't. I don't think again, I feel like that though, 559 00:33:22,480 --> 00:33:25,080 Speaker 1: you know, like I guess what can be frustrating about 560 00:33:25,400 --> 00:33:28,600 Speaker 1: my roommate being such a neat freak is that I'll 561 00:33:28,640 --> 00:33:32,120 Speaker 1: get home and he'll resent me for throwing my purse 562 00:33:32,200 --> 00:33:34,280 Speaker 1: on the floor something like that, but neither one of 563 00:33:34,360 --> 00:33:36,480 Speaker 1: us has time to deal with it, so we end up, 564 00:33:36,520 --> 00:33:38,280 Speaker 1: over the course of the week building up these teeny 565 00:33:38,320 --> 00:33:41,040 Speaker 1: tiny resentments, and one of us finally cleans because we're 566 00:33:41,040 --> 00:33:44,000 Speaker 1: both busy. We both work. But as we pointed out 567 00:33:44,080 --> 00:33:49,080 Speaker 1: too in other podcasts, this issue of the division of 568 00:33:49,120 --> 00:33:54,560 Speaker 1: the household chores not such a divisive issue with same 569 00:33:54,600 --> 00:33:58,400 Speaker 1: sex couples because there aren't those, you know, those gendered 570 00:33:58,480 --> 00:34:03,080 Speaker 1: norms of you know, whom men clean and men lawn? 571 00:34:03,520 --> 00:34:06,360 Speaker 1: Yeah uh where you know, it's kind of like you, 572 00:34:06,680 --> 00:34:09,239 Speaker 1: you find your strength and you stick to it. Like 573 00:34:09,680 --> 00:34:11,840 Speaker 1: for you and I, we should probably do the dishes, 574 00:34:12,680 --> 00:34:16,520 Speaker 1: whereas if someone wants to do the laundry, have at it. 575 00:34:16,800 --> 00:34:19,480 Speaker 1: That is not my favorite thing in the world to do. 576 00:34:19,760 --> 00:34:22,120 Speaker 1: I feel like laundry is such instant gratification. But I 577 00:34:22,239 --> 00:34:25,160 Speaker 1: really won't get into all of that because I really, 578 00:34:25,200 --> 00:34:28,120 Speaker 1: I mean, I could talk about yours. But once we 579 00:34:28,239 --> 00:34:32,200 Speaker 1: circle back around though, to the household cleanliness, you start 580 00:34:32,280 --> 00:34:34,600 Speaker 1: to see that a lot of the patterns that we 581 00:34:34,760 --> 00:34:38,120 Speaker 1: have an adulthood do trace back to those childhood gendered 582 00:34:38,200 --> 00:34:42,000 Speaker 1: norms that start out with the assumption that, you know, 583 00:34:42,200 --> 00:34:46,520 Speaker 1: girls you need to be cleaner than boys, you know, 584 00:34:46,680 --> 00:34:52,880 Speaker 1: in appearance wise, down to neatness and cleanness. So the 585 00:34:53,000 --> 00:34:55,120 Speaker 1: question of whether or not women are cleaner than men, 586 00:34:56,080 --> 00:35:01,360 Speaker 1: I think the answer is no, because they're might be expectations, 587 00:35:01,480 --> 00:35:04,239 Speaker 1: but you and I both have plenty of clean, clean men, 588 00:35:04,400 --> 00:35:07,480 Speaker 1: and I know plenty of dirty women like I have 589 00:35:07,600 --> 00:35:12,920 Speaker 1: had some female roommates whom I love dearly, But spaghetti 590 00:35:12,960 --> 00:35:16,919 Speaker 1: bowls were kept in bedside tables. Oh yeah. I won't 591 00:35:16,960 --> 00:35:19,080 Speaker 1: even get into any stories about women that I have 592 00:35:19,200 --> 00:35:24,440 Speaker 1: lived with who have destroyed spaces that we've shared anyway, 593 00:35:24,840 --> 00:35:26,279 Speaker 1: So maybe it would be a good thing for all 594 00:35:26,320 --> 00:35:29,360 Speaker 1: of us if we abandoned that that gendered notion that 595 00:35:29,520 --> 00:35:32,760 Speaker 1: women are the cleaner sex and just all start pitching 596 00:35:32,840 --> 00:35:36,120 Speaker 1: in and everybody wash your hands. And I'm really never 597 00:35:36,160 --> 00:35:38,080 Speaker 1: going to touch a male wallet again because those things 598 00:35:38,120 --> 00:35:41,960 Speaker 1: are jeremy, a male wallet, a male wallet. Uh. So 599 00:35:42,960 --> 00:35:45,200 Speaker 1: I will be curious though, to hear from listeners on 600 00:35:45,280 --> 00:35:49,080 Speaker 1: this one, especially folks with roommates out there, because cleanliness 601 00:35:49,160 --> 00:35:52,560 Speaker 1: is such a such a big factor I think for 602 00:35:52,840 --> 00:35:54,600 Speaker 1: room I mean, the number one thing I can think 603 00:35:54,680 --> 00:35:58,400 Speaker 1: of with having roommates, Like, whenever fights would come up, 604 00:35:58,520 --> 00:36:01,400 Speaker 1: it was about cleanliness, yeah, and that was it. It 605 00:36:01,480 --> 00:36:04,399 Speaker 1: was about the dishwasher. Yeah. If only if I could 606 00:36:04,440 --> 00:36:08,600 Speaker 1: just live by myself in a silent, uh cluttery, but 607 00:36:08,800 --> 00:36:14,239 Speaker 1: clean apartment with a nice dishwasher, I'd be happy paradise. Yeah, 608 00:36:14,360 --> 00:36:18,000 Speaker 1: it does sound pretty nice. Well, listeners, let us know 609 00:36:18,160 --> 00:36:20,800 Speaker 1: your thoughts on whether men or women are cleaner. I 610 00:36:20,880 --> 00:36:23,399 Speaker 1: know you've got them. Send them our way. Mom Stuff 611 00:36:23,400 --> 00:36:26,120 Speaker 1: at Discovery dot Com is our email address. You can 612 00:36:26,160 --> 00:36:31,560 Speaker 1: also hit us up on Facebook as well. And now 613 00:36:31,880 --> 00:36:36,200 Speaker 1: back to our letters. I have one to hear Kristen 614 00:36:36,280 --> 00:36:39,320 Speaker 1: from Jenna. This is about our pole dancing episode. She says, 615 00:36:39,880 --> 00:36:42,200 Speaker 1: you talked about pole dancing in the latest episode, and 616 00:36:42,200 --> 00:36:43,680 Speaker 1: I just wanted to say that. I think it's a 617 00:36:43,840 --> 00:36:47,080 Speaker 1: very empowered thing to do, to tell those who would 618 00:36:47,120 --> 00:36:50,080 Speaker 1: scoffy your independence and strength as a woman that they're wrong. 619 00:36:50,640 --> 00:36:53,200 Speaker 1: So all the double standards and morality aside, I think 620 00:36:53,239 --> 00:36:55,920 Speaker 1: that means a lot. It's very admirable. I look up 621 00:36:56,000 --> 00:36:58,960 Speaker 1: to strong women like that personally, so thank you for 622 00:36:59,040 --> 00:37:02,160 Speaker 1: the perspective, Jenna. Well, I've got an email here from 623 00:37:02,239 --> 00:37:05,839 Speaker 1: Tina and it's about her daughter, who's five years old 624 00:37:05,880 --> 00:37:09,560 Speaker 1: and she's the youngest of four. She has three older brothers, 625 00:37:09,960 --> 00:37:14,319 Speaker 1: ages nine, thirteen, and sixteen, and she writes, my daughter, 626 00:37:14,440 --> 00:37:17,120 Speaker 1: since she could speak, has described herself as quote a 627 00:37:17,239 --> 00:37:20,000 Speaker 1: girl and a boy, and will explain that she likes 628 00:37:20,080 --> 00:37:22,680 Speaker 1: girrel stuff and boy stuff. She's as comfortable in the 629 00:37:22,760 --> 00:37:25,160 Speaker 1: two day old clothes playing in the dirt as she 630 00:37:25,360 --> 00:37:27,560 Speaker 1: is in a princess dress with lipstick and a tia. 631 00:37:28,000 --> 00:37:30,319 Speaker 1: It's a nerving to some people, such as my mom 632 00:37:30,719 --> 00:37:32,919 Speaker 1: when she calls herself a boy and a girl, even 633 00:37:33,000 --> 00:37:35,600 Speaker 1: though they have no issue with her acting like quote 634 00:37:35,640 --> 00:37:38,080 Speaker 1: unquote one of the boys, and they try to encourage 635 00:37:38,080 --> 00:37:41,080 Speaker 1: her to use the word tomboy instead. My husband and 636 00:37:41,120 --> 00:37:43,440 Speaker 1: I have always let her describe herself however she wants, 637 00:37:43,560 --> 00:37:45,560 Speaker 1: and we tell her that she can be whatever she wants, 638 00:37:45,600 --> 00:37:47,880 Speaker 1: whenever she wants, and to try not to draw attention 639 00:37:47,960 --> 00:37:50,480 Speaker 1: to the labels. She starts kindergarten this year, and I'm 640 00:37:50,520 --> 00:37:53,239 Speaker 1: curious to see if the new pressures will change the 641 00:37:53,280 --> 00:37:56,120 Speaker 1: way she describes herself. And she does note that her 642 00:37:56,200 --> 00:37:59,480 Speaker 1: daughter has been in daycare, so it's even with that 643 00:37:59,600 --> 00:38:02,520 Speaker 1: kind of socialization, she still does see I'm a girl 644 00:38:02,600 --> 00:38:04,680 Speaker 1: and a boy. Yeah, so I thought that was kind 645 00:38:04,719 --> 00:38:07,719 Speaker 1: of interesting. So thanks to Tina and everybody else, we're 646 00:38:07,760 --> 00:38:12,120 Speaker 1: writing into mom stuff at Discovery dot com. You can also, 647 00:38:12,200 --> 00:38:14,399 Speaker 1: of course find us on Facebook, where we do lots 648 00:38:14,440 --> 00:38:16,680 Speaker 1: of fun things during the week. You can follow us 649 00:38:16,719 --> 00:38:19,480 Speaker 1: on Twitter at mom Stuff Podcast and on Tumbler as 650 00:38:19,520 --> 00:38:22,640 Speaker 1: well It's stuff Mom Never Told You dot tumbler dot com. 651 00:38:22,800 --> 00:38:25,560 Speaker 1: And as always, if you'd like to get smarter this week, 652 00:38:25,800 --> 00:38:28,200 Speaker 1: you can head to our website, it's how stuff Works 653 00:38:28,520 --> 00:38:34,400 Speaker 1: dot com for more on this and thousands of other topics. 654 00:38:34,560 --> 00:38:36,040 Speaker 1: Does it how stuff works dot com.