1 00:00:01,480 --> 00:00:04,280 Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff you Should Know, a production of I 2 00:00:04,360 --> 00:00:14,960 Speaker 1: Heart Radio. Hey, and welcome to the podcast. I'm Josh 3 00:00:15,560 --> 00:00:20,599 Speaker 1: the Jet Clark. There's Charles w Chuck, Benny and the 4 00:00:21,480 --> 00:00:28,920 Speaker 1: Bryant and Jerry's over there and she's just Jerry. This 5 00:00:29,040 --> 00:00:33,120 Speaker 1: is Stuff you should Know. Darry's captain fantastic. Oh yeah, 6 00:00:33,120 --> 00:00:35,479 Speaker 1: that's a good one. We're talking about the piano player. 7 00:00:35,920 --> 00:00:41,440 Speaker 1: What about how about Mr Roboto? Sure? Okay, Jerry, Mr 8 00:00:41,600 --> 00:00:46,919 Speaker 1: Roboto Rowland great? So um, how are you doing? Man? 9 00:00:46,960 --> 00:00:50,199 Speaker 1: I think you're probably pretty jazzed about this one, do 10 00:00:50,240 --> 00:00:55,520 Speaker 1: you think? Yea, Dad, Yeah, I'm pretty excited about this one. 11 00:00:55,600 --> 00:00:59,120 Speaker 1: As a musician and guitar nerd uh. And we we 12 00:00:59,160 --> 00:01:02,440 Speaker 1: definitely want to shout out at the beginning. The inspiration 13 00:01:02,480 --> 00:01:04,399 Speaker 1: behind this, and a lot of the research for this 14 00:01:04,560 --> 00:01:08,200 Speaker 1: came from the great book called The Birth of Loud. 15 00:01:09,280 --> 00:01:11,200 Speaker 1: It's not there's not a colon on the cover, but 16 00:01:11,760 --> 00:01:17,160 Speaker 1: it's implied. Should we get a different jingle for implied colon? Um? Yeah, 17 00:01:17,200 --> 00:01:19,120 Speaker 1: but it should could be like a down kind of 18 00:01:19,240 --> 00:01:23,240 Speaker 1: thing burn Okay. The Birth of Loud, Leo Finder, Les 19 00:01:23,240 --> 00:01:26,800 Speaker 1: Paul and the guitar pioneering rivalry that shaped rock and 20 00:01:26,920 --> 00:01:30,680 Speaker 1: Roll And this was from Ian Ports in twenty nineteen, 21 00:01:30,840 --> 00:01:33,280 Speaker 1: and it is a if you're a guitar player, just 22 00:01:33,480 --> 00:01:35,240 Speaker 1: get the book. You probably already read it, but if 23 00:01:35,240 --> 00:01:38,880 Speaker 1: he hadn't get it because it's great. Yes, um, hats 24 00:01:38,880 --> 00:01:40,640 Speaker 1: off to him. Hats off to Dave Russ for helping 25 00:01:40,720 --> 00:01:43,040 Speaker 1: us out with this one as well too. Totally they 26 00:01:43,120 --> 00:01:46,119 Speaker 1: did a great job. So um, well it's a two 27 00:01:46,160 --> 00:01:48,960 Speaker 1: part right, Yeah, we were gonna too parted up because 28 00:01:48,960 --> 00:01:51,840 Speaker 1: it's that big, it's that important of a thing. It's 29 00:01:52,000 --> 00:01:55,120 Speaker 1: really easy for people like me, who um, you know, 30 00:01:55,240 --> 00:01:58,880 Speaker 1: appreciate music but also appreciate music to you know what 31 00:01:58,880 --> 00:02:04,680 Speaker 1: I mean, um, to kind of overlook the just the 32 00:02:04,680 --> 00:02:11,000 Speaker 1: the epic story behind electric guitars. It's almost like like 33 00:02:11,200 --> 00:02:13,320 Speaker 1: I didn't think they were always there, and I knew 34 00:02:13,400 --> 00:02:15,720 Speaker 1: roughly when they've been invented, and I think I kind 35 00:02:15,720 --> 00:02:19,840 Speaker 1: of knew kind of who invented it, but I didn't 36 00:02:19,880 --> 00:02:24,480 Speaker 1: realize just what a sweeping effect and impact that electrifying 37 00:02:25,160 --> 00:02:28,359 Speaker 1: certain kinds of guitars had on the world. Like it's 38 00:02:28,400 --> 00:02:32,440 Speaker 1: it's it's one of the most impactful inventions ever made. 39 00:02:33,000 --> 00:02:35,800 Speaker 1: Oh absolutely, uh. And then when you look at this 40 00:02:35,919 --> 00:02:40,360 Speaker 1: story and read that book, especially Um the Gentleman Les 41 00:02:40,360 --> 00:02:43,960 Speaker 1: Paul and Leo Fender. It's a remarkable story and that 42 00:02:44,080 --> 00:02:48,360 Speaker 1: they were very similar in some ways, they were very 43 00:02:48,440 --> 00:02:51,640 Speaker 1: very different in a lot of ways. They they both 44 00:02:52,160 --> 00:02:56,399 Speaker 1: ended up with um permanent injuries that affected their craft. Um. 45 00:02:56,440 --> 00:03:00,000 Speaker 1: When one was up, another might be down a little um. 46 00:03:00,040 --> 00:03:02,040 Speaker 1: And and this goes to the guitars as well. When 47 00:03:02,040 --> 00:03:04,360 Speaker 1: the the Fender brand was up, it seems like the 48 00:03:04,440 --> 00:03:06,120 Speaker 1: less Paul was down. When the Less Paul was up, 49 00:03:06,160 --> 00:03:10,920 Speaker 1: Fender was down. And it's really they both kind of 50 00:03:11,040 --> 00:03:13,320 Speaker 1: tried to take credit for things that they didn't really 51 00:03:13,360 --> 00:03:18,040 Speaker 1: invent at times. So it's it's really interesting when you 52 00:03:18,080 --> 00:03:20,200 Speaker 1: look at the story of these two dudes and this 53 00:03:20,360 --> 00:03:24,360 Speaker 1: era of innovation and invention and just how remarkable it 54 00:03:24,480 --> 00:03:28,040 Speaker 1: was and for the people who are really unfairly left 55 00:03:28,040 --> 00:03:30,720 Speaker 1: out that had maybe even more to do with it. Yeah, 56 00:03:30,760 --> 00:03:32,960 Speaker 1: because there's a lot of hands that went into the 57 00:03:33,040 --> 00:03:36,400 Speaker 1: creation of the electric guitar as we understand it today, 58 00:03:36,440 --> 00:03:39,160 Speaker 1: a lot of people, a lot of unsung people. Uh, 59 00:03:39,200 --> 00:03:41,920 Speaker 1: these guys just happened to be two the ones who's 60 00:03:42,040 --> 00:03:46,440 Speaker 1: whose names you know, became synonymous with electric guitars. But 61 00:03:46,520 --> 00:03:49,680 Speaker 1: there's also not to say like they didn't deserve to 62 00:03:49,760 --> 00:03:52,640 Speaker 1: have that kind of recognition too. They really did contribute, 63 00:03:53,040 --> 00:03:55,560 Speaker 1: even if they did kind of like you said, take 64 00:03:55,560 --> 00:04:00,720 Speaker 1: credit to some extent for things they didn't necessarily do specifically. Yeah, 65 00:04:00,800 --> 00:04:04,160 Speaker 1: it's one of those inventions that if you ask someone 66 00:04:04,240 --> 00:04:08,320 Speaker 1: who invented the electric guitar, you have to follow that 67 00:04:08,400 --> 00:04:10,440 Speaker 1: up with a lot of questions in order to answer it. 68 00:04:10,520 --> 00:04:13,520 Speaker 1: Is it the person who invented the electric guitar pickup 69 00:04:13,560 --> 00:04:16,880 Speaker 1: which made it possible to electrify something? Or is it 70 00:04:16,920 --> 00:04:18,680 Speaker 1: the first person to stick that pick up on a 71 00:04:18,760 --> 00:04:22,799 Speaker 1: chunk of wood instead of a big hollow guitar? Or 72 00:04:23,160 --> 00:04:25,039 Speaker 1: is it the first person to actually build one that 73 00:04:25,080 --> 00:04:28,400 Speaker 1: worked that you could sell to people. Um, you just 74 00:04:28,440 --> 00:04:31,839 Speaker 1: can't answer that cleanly and say this person invented the 75 00:04:31,839 --> 00:04:36,159 Speaker 1: electric guitar. Like five or six people invented the electric guitar. Yeah, 76 00:04:36,200 --> 00:04:39,280 Speaker 1: And if you're just a normal like non you know, 77 00:04:39,480 --> 00:04:43,359 Speaker 1: guitar person, you probably regretted asking that question. Now you 78 00:04:43,440 --> 00:04:46,080 Speaker 1: just say, is that freedom rock? Hey man? Yeah, that 79 00:04:46,160 --> 00:04:49,120 Speaker 1: ran through my head more than once. For sure. Turn 80 00:04:49,200 --> 00:04:52,800 Speaker 1: it up. So, UM, I guess we should get started. 81 00:04:53,120 --> 00:04:59,720 Speaker 1: Um with you want to start with Leo Fender. Yeah, so, um, 82 00:05:00,000 --> 00:05:06,599 Speaker 1: Aaron's Leonitas Fender. Webster's defines Fender as Leonitas Fender. He 83 00:05:06,680 --> 00:05:08,400 Speaker 1: doesn't have a good name. And he's one of these 84 00:05:08,400 --> 00:05:10,280 Speaker 1: guys you said that. He and Les Paul, who will 85 00:05:10,320 --> 00:05:13,560 Speaker 1: meet in a little while, we're very different. And Um, 86 00:05:14,120 --> 00:05:16,600 Speaker 1: Leo Fender wasn't just different from Less Paul. He was 87 00:05:16,640 --> 00:05:19,400 Speaker 1: different from a lot of people. He was what you 88 00:05:19,440 --> 00:05:22,760 Speaker 1: would call an engineer. And if you have a parent 89 00:05:22,800 --> 00:05:25,839 Speaker 1: who is an engineer, or a friend dad, or you're 90 00:05:25,880 --> 00:05:29,800 Speaker 1: an engineer, you know that engineers are different, kind of different. 91 00:05:30,120 --> 00:05:32,880 Speaker 1: They're cut from a different cloth. And and Leo Fender 92 00:05:32,960 --> 00:05:35,800 Speaker 1: was definitely an engineer from what I can tell. Yeah, 93 00:05:35,839 --> 00:05:38,400 Speaker 1: I totally thought about your dad during this. Um. Leah 94 00:05:38,480 --> 00:05:42,280 Speaker 1: was born on August nineteen o nine in Orange County, California, 95 00:05:43,120 --> 00:05:47,560 Speaker 1: and his first injury that affected his craft was his eye. 96 00:05:47,720 --> 00:05:50,400 Speaker 1: When he was um between seven and eight. He lost 97 00:05:50,440 --> 00:05:53,480 Speaker 1: an eye when he fell off his dad's vegetable truck 98 00:05:53,520 --> 00:05:57,479 Speaker 1: and had a glass eye from there on out. Um, 99 00:05:57,600 --> 00:06:00,520 Speaker 1: you know it's it's not like losing an year, which 100 00:06:00,560 --> 00:06:03,640 Speaker 1: we'll get to that later. Um, if you're an engineer 101 00:06:03,680 --> 00:06:07,320 Speaker 1: who works in generally in sound, but when you're working 102 00:06:07,360 --> 00:06:09,560 Speaker 1: on small circuit boards and stuff like that, losing one 103 00:06:09,600 --> 00:06:12,400 Speaker 1: eye is certainly going to affect your work well. Plus 104 00:06:12,440 --> 00:06:15,160 Speaker 1: also he apparently was self conscious about it, which is 105 00:06:15,240 --> 00:06:18,240 Speaker 1: just just at my heart. Can you imagine a little 106 00:06:18,640 --> 00:06:22,000 Speaker 1: a little eight year old Leo Fender who's like, you know, 107 00:06:22,120 --> 00:06:23,960 Speaker 1: can't look up, He's looking down at the ground all 108 00:06:24,000 --> 00:06:25,680 Speaker 1: the time while he's talking to you because he's self 109 00:06:25,720 --> 00:06:29,000 Speaker 1: conscious about his class ali that it's just heartbreaking. Yeah. 110 00:06:29,040 --> 00:06:31,840 Speaker 1: And like he said, he was an engineer, little electrical 111 00:06:31,920 --> 00:06:35,400 Speaker 1: circuit board nerd Uh. He would take things apart and 112 00:06:35,400 --> 00:06:38,760 Speaker 1: put him back together from an early age. He there's 113 00:06:38,760 --> 00:06:41,800 Speaker 1: a great story from the book when he was about 114 00:06:41,800 --> 00:06:47,160 Speaker 1: ten years old. Uh, he got underneath the car and 115 00:06:47,240 --> 00:06:51,479 Speaker 1: the driveway and basically took a look at it, what 116 00:06:51,520 --> 00:06:56,039 Speaker 1: was going on, went inside and sketched out not only 117 00:06:56,120 --> 00:06:58,600 Speaker 1: just what it exactly looked like, but how it all 118 00:06:58,640 --> 00:07:01,400 Speaker 1: and could explain how it all together to make that 119 00:07:01,440 --> 00:07:05,120 Speaker 1: car move, Yeah, which is astounding. That's like prodigy kind 120 00:07:05,160 --> 00:07:07,799 Speaker 1: of stuff. Like he was an engineering prodigy is another 121 00:07:07,839 --> 00:07:12,320 Speaker 1: way to put that. Not you know, even even among engineers, 122 00:07:12,320 --> 00:07:15,200 Speaker 1: that's pretty remarkable, and especially as a kid to do 123 00:07:15,240 --> 00:07:17,800 Speaker 1: it too. Um, and then what makes him even more 124 00:07:17,840 --> 00:07:19,960 Speaker 1: remarkable as an engineer And for all the things that 125 00:07:20,000 --> 00:07:23,480 Speaker 1: he accomplished, he never had any formal training as an engineer. 126 00:07:23,840 --> 00:07:27,800 Speaker 1: He just kind of became one just by beat. Doing 127 00:07:27,840 --> 00:07:31,200 Speaker 1: things that engineers do. Was like taking things apart, putting 128 00:07:31,240 --> 00:07:34,280 Speaker 1: them back together, inventing new stuff, improving things that he 129 00:07:34,320 --> 00:07:37,760 Speaker 1: thought could be improved. He just kind of learned by doing, 130 00:07:37,840 --> 00:07:42,680 Speaker 1: which is you know, that's that's old school, very old school. 131 00:07:42,800 --> 00:07:45,080 Speaker 1: Get in there and tink her away, right. Yeah, but 132 00:07:45,520 --> 00:07:47,480 Speaker 1: if you don't have overalls on, what are you doing? 133 00:07:47,560 --> 00:07:50,160 Speaker 1: You know what I mean? Now? Was your dad always 134 00:07:50,200 --> 00:07:52,480 Speaker 1: tinkering with things in the house to know? He was 135 00:07:52,560 --> 00:07:55,880 Speaker 1: more like, um, I've had to like make drawings all 136 00:07:55,920 --> 00:07:57,880 Speaker 1: day at work. Leave me alone, Maybe bring me an 137 00:07:57,880 --> 00:08:01,560 Speaker 1: old Milwaukee Tallboy before you leave. But if there was 138 00:08:01,600 --> 00:08:04,120 Speaker 1: anything that went wrong in the house, you know, my 139 00:08:04,160 --> 00:08:06,000 Speaker 1: mom would be like can you fix that? Can you 140 00:08:06,040 --> 00:08:08,720 Speaker 1: fix this? And he could fix it all. Yeah, no problem, 141 00:08:09,480 --> 00:08:13,360 Speaker 1: I can fix nothing. Yeah. He was like, um, he 142 00:08:13,440 --> 00:08:17,120 Speaker 1: was too busy leading um cub scout meetings that I 143 00:08:17,160 --> 00:08:19,760 Speaker 1: was not a part of any longer. It's a tinker. 144 00:08:19,840 --> 00:08:22,200 Speaker 1: He was too busy. Well, it sounds like you guys 145 00:08:22,240 --> 00:08:24,880 Speaker 1: found a great way to not spend time together. Well, 146 00:08:24,920 --> 00:08:26,360 Speaker 1: I would bring a beer. That's how I got to 147 00:08:26,400 --> 00:08:30,280 Speaker 1: spend time. Uh. So Leo was really fascinated with radios 148 00:08:30,280 --> 00:08:32,680 Speaker 1: early on as a child. He would build his own. 149 00:08:33,240 --> 00:08:35,480 Speaker 1: He got a broadcast license when he was in high school, 150 00:08:35,920 --> 00:08:38,240 Speaker 1: and before you know it, he had kids and neighbors, 151 00:08:38,360 --> 00:08:41,040 Speaker 1: adults even that would come over to have him fix 152 00:08:41,080 --> 00:08:43,760 Speaker 1: their radios, and to the point where he had a 153 00:08:43,760 --> 00:08:47,280 Speaker 1: little repair shop and there in Folds in California, where 154 00:08:47,640 --> 00:08:50,200 Speaker 1: the big Fender factory ended up being. Yeah, I guess 155 00:08:50,200 --> 00:08:52,679 Speaker 1: it started out at that radio as the radio repair 156 00:08:52,679 --> 00:08:54,920 Speaker 1: shop and just kind of grew from there, right, Yeah, 157 00:08:54,960 --> 00:08:58,960 Speaker 1: as a radio shack. Isn't that cool? A literal radio shack? Yeah, 158 00:08:58,960 --> 00:09:01,880 Speaker 1: I guess so. I I think that the good people 159 00:09:01,880 --> 00:09:03,679 Speaker 1: at radio Sheck would have had a problem with it 160 00:09:03,720 --> 00:09:07,600 Speaker 1: had you called it that, But it was that. You 161 00:09:07,640 --> 00:09:09,760 Speaker 1: could have made a case like, no, no, radio shack 162 00:09:09,920 --> 00:09:12,200 Speaker 1: is the rip off. This is the radio shack, and 163 00:09:12,240 --> 00:09:14,600 Speaker 1: the judge had been like, shut up, shut up, shut up, 164 00:09:15,120 --> 00:09:19,080 Speaker 1: you're all going to jail. Um. So he was building radios, 165 00:09:19,120 --> 00:09:23,120 Speaker 1: he started working on PA systems, public address systems, which 166 00:09:23,160 --> 00:09:25,960 Speaker 1: I don't know what that is. It's always people are 167 00:09:26,000 --> 00:09:27,920 Speaker 1: getting on me now for saying, like everyone knows what 168 00:09:28,000 --> 00:09:31,200 Speaker 1: that is. It's what the principal talked on. Yeah, or 169 00:09:31,200 --> 00:09:33,319 Speaker 1: anytime you have a microphone attached to speakers, that's a 170 00:09:33,360 --> 00:09:36,240 Speaker 1: public addresses. Yeah, that's funny because it has been a 171 00:09:36,280 --> 00:09:38,920 Speaker 1: little while since since somebody called you out on that 172 00:09:38,960 --> 00:09:41,160 Speaker 1: because you stopped saying if you've been living under a rock, 173 00:09:41,200 --> 00:09:44,680 Speaker 1: But now they're they're they're meeting you wherever you're at. 174 00:09:44,800 --> 00:09:48,160 Speaker 1: As far as that, I think you either have to 175 00:09:48,200 --> 00:09:54,280 Speaker 1: completely stop or just give up caring. One of the two. Well, 176 00:09:54,120 --> 00:09:56,120 Speaker 1: I explained what a PA system was, So maybe I'm 177 00:09:56,120 --> 00:09:58,040 Speaker 1: on the right track. I think you did great with that. 178 00:09:59,160 --> 00:10:02,080 Speaker 1: So this is in he started to become obsessed with 179 00:10:02,920 --> 00:10:06,880 Speaker 1: where we're just gonna call the big challenge, which was basically, 180 00:10:07,480 --> 00:10:09,720 Speaker 1: you have to think back to a time where music 181 00:10:10,720 --> 00:10:15,120 Speaker 1: was not electrified. They were singing through microphones. The they 182 00:10:15,160 --> 00:10:18,960 Speaker 1: did have um lap steel guitars were electrified. That was 183 00:10:19,000 --> 00:10:21,880 Speaker 1: technically the first electric guitar was the lap steel. Yeah, 184 00:10:21,880 --> 00:10:25,480 Speaker 1: the Rickenbacker frying pan I saw, Yeah, that was kind 185 00:10:25,520 --> 00:10:28,680 Speaker 1: of the very first thing. And in fact, the the 186 00:10:28,720 --> 00:10:33,360 Speaker 1: guy who started Rickenbacker, George bow Champ, he was the 187 00:10:33,440 --> 00:10:36,720 Speaker 1: inventor of the electric pickup. So so I gotta thank 188 00:10:36,800 --> 00:10:39,120 Speaker 1: him big time for kind of bleeding the way. Yeah. 189 00:10:39,120 --> 00:10:43,800 Speaker 1: He basically he yeah, he laid the foundation that who 190 00:10:43,840 --> 00:10:46,200 Speaker 1: knows how long it would have taken. But I just 191 00:10:46,240 --> 00:10:48,200 Speaker 1: want to like explain to people who are like me 192 00:10:48,280 --> 00:10:50,680 Speaker 1: who don't understand this kind of stuff, just real quick, 193 00:10:50,720 --> 00:10:53,520 Speaker 1: with a pick up. Yeah, the pickup is the heart 194 00:10:53,559 --> 00:10:57,280 Speaker 1: of what makes the electric guitar electric. And it basically 195 00:10:57,360 --> 00:11:01,040 Speaker 1: works through um the electro magnetus him where you loop 196 00:11:01,080 --> 00:11:04,440 Speaker 1: a bunch of like copper wire around some magnets, and 197 00:11:04,480 --> 00:11:08,600 Speaker 1: then when you move the strings above those magnets, it 198 00:11:08,679 --> 00:11:12,520 Speaker 1: actually affects that magnetic field and produces an electrical signal. 199 00:11:12,880 --> 00:11:16,600 Speaker 1: That electrical signal goes from the pickup through the chord 200 00:11:16,679 --> 00:11:19,200 Speaker 1: to the p a where it's amplified, and now you 201 00:11:19,240 --> 00:11:21,960 Speaker 1: have an electric guitar. And that's the guy who came 202 00:11:22,040 --> 00:11:27,079 Speaker 1: up with this astoundingly impressive invention, because not only did 203 00:11:27,120 --> 00:11:29,360 Speaker 1: it work, he figured out how to make it pretty 204 00:11:29,400 --> 00:11:31,720 Speaker 1: small right out of the gate, like that frying pan. 205 00:11:32,280 --> 00:11:36,319 Speaker 1: Um electric lap steel guitars ugly but it was small 206 00:11:36,360 --> 00:11:38,960 Speaker 1: and compact. It wasn't like those early computers that took 207 00:11:39,000 --> 00:11:42,320 Speaker 1: up an entire room. He like figured out how to 208 00:11:42,400 --> 00:11:44,920 Speaker 1: make it, you know, useful right out of the gate. 209 00:11:45,280 --> 00:11:48,800 Speaker 1: It was a big, big innovation from what I can tell. Yeah. 210 00:11:48,840 --> 00:11:51,000 Speaker 1: And another way to think of h if you know 211 00:11:51,080 --> 00:11:53,800 Speaker 1: nothing about guitars of the pickup is it's like the 212 00:11:53,880 --> 00:11:58,720 Speaker 1: microphone for the guitar. Uh, and you when you're when 213 00:11:58,760 --> 00:12:02,800 Speaker 1: someone is playing a guitar, it's that little horizontal uh 214 00:12:03,240 --> 00:12:06,280 Speaker 1: usually sort of uh, not oval, but it's square and 215 00:12:06,320 --> 00:12:08,320 Speaker 1: then rounded. I don't know what that shape is. What's 216 00:12:08,320 --> 00:12:13,360 Speaker 1: that called ellipsoid? Is that real? Yeah? It's like that 217 00:12:13,400 --> 00:12:17,679 Speaker 1: means that what it really is? Uh? Yeah, I think so. 218 00:12:18,360 --> 00:12:24,720 Speaker 1: All right here it's the little ellipsoid underneath the strings. Uh. 219 00:12:24,840 --> 00:12:28,480 Speaker 1: Sometimes they're covered up. Uh. Sometimes they're left open, like 220 00:12:28,480 --> 00:12:31,760 Speaker 1: on Fender guitars, they're left open. Um. There's something called 221 00:12:31,800 --> 00:12:35,600 Speaker 1: a humbucker pickup, which uh. Fenders have a tremendous amount 222 00:12:35,600 --> 00:12:37,880 Speaker 1: of hum and buzz when you plug them in because 223 00:12:37,880 --> 00:12:40,960 Speaker 1: it's only one magnet. Humbuckers had two sets of magnets 224 00:12:40,960 --> 00:12:43,480 Speaker 1: that canceled the hum out from each other and those 225 00:12:43,520 --> 00:12:46,320 Speaker 1: are usually but not always, covered up with a little 226 00:12:46,360 --> 00:12:50,719 Speaker 1: steel plate. Right, So humbuckers just two pickups so that they, 227 00:12:50,800 --> 00:12:53,400 Speaker 1: like you said, they cancel out the electrical noise from 228 00:12:53,440 --> 00:12:55,680 Speaker 1: the other equipment that it picks up right, Yes, and 229 00:12:55,760 --> 00:12:58,080 Speaker 1: that's what I prefer. Although do you have a rick 230 00:12:58,160 --> 00:13:02,440 Speaker 1: and bocker? I prefer and have quite a few Gibsons. So, um, 231 00:13:02,880 --> 00:13:05,400 Speaker 1: when we say, like the electric guitar, you just hit 232 00:13:05,480 --> 00:13:07,760 Speaker 1: upon something when we were talking about the frying pan. 233 00:13:08,200 --> 00:13:11,440 Speaker 1: The frying pan was the world's first electric guitar. It 234 00:13:11,520 --> 00:13:15,480 Speaker 1: was from nine thirty one. It had pickups, um, it 235 00:13:15,559 --> 00:13:20,960 Speaker 1: had amplified sound, but it was a lap steel guitar. UM. 236 00:13:21,240 --> 00:13:24,880 Speaker 1: So very shortly after that we had what other people 237 00:13:24,920 --> 00:13:27,480 Speaker 1: would call the world's first electric guitar. This is where 238 00:13:27,480 --> 00:13:30,000 Speaker 1: the answer where you're like, well, who invented the electric 239 00:13:30,000 --> 00:13:33,480 Speaker 1: guitar comes from because what a lot of people were 240 00:13:33,480 --> 00:13:36,360 Speaker 1: recognized as an electric guitar came after and it was 241 00:13:36,400 --> 00:13:39,600 Speaker 1: from Gibson I think in N six where it looked like, 242 00:13:39,960 --> 00:13:42,640 Speaker 1: you know, a normal guitar, but it was electrified, like 243 00:13:43,000 --> 00:13:46,600 Speaker 1: the classic acoustic guitar, but an electrified version. And he said, well, 244 00:13:46,600 --> 00:13:49,800 Speaker 1: why doesn't that qualify as the first electric guitar, because 245 00:13:49,840 --> 00:13:52,640 Speaker 1: it doesn't. For our purposes for this episode, that's still 246 00:13:52,679 --> 00:13:55,760 Speaker 1: not the first electric guitars we're talking about. What we're 247 00:13:55,760 --> 00:13:59,280 Speaker 1: talking about is, as we'll see, what's known as the 248 00:13:59,360 --> 00:14:04,000 Speaker 1: first solid body electric guitar. That's what we're really driving at. 249 00:14:04,000 --> 00:14:07,280 Speaker 1: So if you're sitting there, you know, and you're just 250 00:14:07,920 --> 00:14:11,760 Speaker 1: crump crumpling your your issue of Guitarist magazine right now 251 00:14:11,800 --> 00:14:14,520 Speaker 1: and losing your mind, sell down, because I just spelled 252 00:14:14,520 --> 00:14:17,800 Speaker 1: it out for everybody. Okay, Yeah, And so getting back 253 00:14:17,800 --> 00:14:19,680 Speaker 1: to where we kind of got off track in a 254 00:14:19,680 --> 00:14:21,960 Speaker 1: good way, but getting back to the big burning question, 255 00:14:22,040 --> 00:14:25,080 Speaker 1: and the big problem was with these they called them 256 00:14:25,080 --> 00:14:28,760 Speaker 1: Spanish guitars, but we call them acoustic guitars now that 257 00:14:28,920 --> 00:14:32,000 Speaker 1: had those electric pickups in them. They were really prone 258 00:14:32,000 --> 00:14:35,360 Speaker 1: to feedback because they had this big hollow cavity behind 259 00:14:35,360 --> 00:14:37,640 Speaker 1: the hole or it. You know, it usually had what's 260 00:14:37,680 --> 00:14:40,040 Speaker 1: called f holes, and that sounds funny, but if you 261 00:14:40,040 --> 00:14:42,120 Speaker 1: look at them, there to shape like an ornate sort 262 00:14:42,120 --> 00:14:45,280 Speaker 1: of curse of f I'm glad you said it. So 263 00:14:45,920 --> 00:14:49,560 Speaker 1: because of these big hollow acoustic guitars with these pickups 264 00:14:50,280 --> 00:14:53,160 Speaker 1: and early amp technology they would just feedback like crazy 265 00:14:53,280 --> 00:14:55,920 Speaker 1: anytime you try to get any volume. So, yeah, those 266 00:14:55,960 --> 00:15:00,520 Speaker 1: pickups wouldn't differentiate between the vibrations from the string that 267 00:15:00,560 --> 00:15:03,960 Speaker 1: you were intended or the reverberated vibrations from inside the 268 00:15:03,960 --> 00:15:07,240 Speaker 1: hollow body of that that Spanish style guitar, and so 269 00:15:07,360 --> 00:15:10,720 Speaker 1: it just sounds awful, right, So that was the thing 270 00:15:10,800 --> 00:15:13,800 Speaker 1: that Leo Fender was obsessed with. He was like, how 271 00:15:13,840 --> 00:15:16,240 Speaker 1: could because you know, it's hard to imagine, but at 272 00:15:16,240 --> 00:15:19,200 Speaker 1: the time, the guitar was not a lead instrument, and 273 00:15:19,360 --> 00:15:22,320 Speaker 1: it was there were occasionally like guitar solos and stuff 274 00:15:22,360 --> 00:15:25,680 Speaker 1: that you could uh insert into a recording or you know, 275 00:15:25,960 --> 00:15:28,120 Speaker 1: they recorded lives, but you could put on a recording, 276 00:15:28,120 --> 00:15:30,080 Speaker 1: but like if you were playing live in a in 277 00:15:30,160 --> 00:15:32,840 Speaker 1: a venue, the guitar was very much in the background 278 00:15:32,880 --> 00:15:34,720 Speaker 1: because you couldn't turn it up loud enough to cut 279 00:15:34,720 --> 00:15:37,760 Speaker 1: through the vocals and the drums, the piano, the horn sections. 280 00:15:37,760 --> 00:15:42,320 Speaker 1: These were all really loud live instruments. And he was like, 281 00:15:42,400 --> 00:15:44,040 Speaker 1: Leo Fender was like, we've got to be able to 282 00:15:44,440 --> 00:15:48,240 Speaker 1: amplify this sound such that it doesn't feedback to where 283 00:15:48,240 --> 00:15:50,800 Speaker 1: you can actually hear the guitar in a concert hall. Yeah, 284 00:15:50,840 --> 00:15:53,160 Speaker 1: so like it can stand on its own rather than 285 00:15:53,200 --> 00:15:57,080 Speaker 1: a company's you know whoever the horns or get drowned out. 286 00:15:57,720 --> 00:16:00,440 Speaker 1: Like that was the point of like Fender and later 287 00:16:00,520 --> 00:16:03,360 Speaker 1: on Les Paul's quest is to make the guitar its 288 00:16:03,440 --> 00:16:06,440 Speaker 1: own thing, and to basically do that by making it 289 00:16:06,520 --> 00:16:09,080 Speaker 1: really loud and sound really good when it is loud. 290 00:16:09,960 --> 00:16:11,920 Speaker 1: Oh man, this is getting good. It's a good time 291 00:16:11,960 --> 00:16:13,720 Speaker 1: for a break, I think right. I think so too. Man. 292 00:16:14,080 --> 00:16:15,640 Speaker 1: All right, I'm gonna go take a cold shower and 293 00:16:15,680 --> 00:16:46,960 Speaker 1: I'll be right backs and shock alright, chuck, So we're back. 294 00:16:47,040 --> 00:16:49,840 Speaker 1: So Leo Fenders on this quest, he's figured out there's 295 00:16:49,840 --> 00:16:51,680 Speaker 1: a big problem here that if you want to make 296 00:16:51,720 --> 00:16:54,160 Speaker 1: a guitar loud, you have to make it not an 297 00:16:54,160 --> 00:16:58,680 Speaker 1: acoustic guitar. But he one of the things about him 298 00:16:58,760 --> 00:17:01,960 Speaker 1: was he wasn't a musician, and like he didn't clamp 299 00:17:02,040 --> 00:17:06,399 Speaker 1: onto this this problem of creating the electric guitar, figuring 300 00:17:06,400 --> 00:17:10,679 Speaker 1: out how to make an electric guitar because he necessarily 301 00:17:10,720 --> 00:17:13,119 Speaker 1: cared about the music. And he also later on it 302 00:17:13,160 --> 00:17:15,280 Speaker 1: turns out he didn't like rock and roll, which would 303 00:17:15,280 --> 00:17:17,840 Speaker 1: be kind of ironic. He was a country western dude 304 00:17:17,880 --> 00:17:21,320 Speaker 1: from southern California, kind of like Nicolas Cage's character and 305 00:17:21,400 --> 00:17:26,520 Speaker 1: Valley Girl exactly. Belly Girl that was him basically is 306 00:17:26,560 --> 00:17:30,440 Speaker 1: based on Leo Fender. That's my that's my theory. Uh yeah, 307 00:17:30,480 --> 00:17:33,440 Speaker 1: So Fender didn't play, but here's something that was very 308 00:17:33,520 --> 00:17:35,679 Speaker 1: cute that story from the book. He would go to 309 00:17:35,760 --> 00:17:40,000 Speaker 1: local music halls during live performances with his He always 310 00:17:40,000 --> 00:17:42,720 Speaker 1: had this little tool kit on him, I think, much 311 00:17:42,760 --> 00:17:46,119 Speaker 1: like your dad's slide role, and he would jump up 312 00:17:46,160 --> 00:17:48,919 Speaker 1: on stage and tweak the amps during the middle of 313 00:17:49,200 --> 00:17:51,720 Speaker 1: performances and people there would be like, what is this 314 00:17:51,760 --> 00:17:55,040 Speaker 1: guy doing? And in the band sometimes and say, hey, everybody, 315 00:17:55,040 --> 00:17:56,560 Speaker 1: this is Leo Fender. He's the one that makes it 316 00:17:56,600 --> 00:18:00,600 Speaker 1: sound just right. And uh he would like during during 317 00:18:00,640 --> 00:18:03,000 Speaker 1: the show, would kind of get a screwdriver out and 318 00:18:03,040 --> 00:18:05,560 Speaker 1: mess with the amps. That's pretty cute, It's very cool. 319 00:18:06,440 --> 00:18:08,280 Speaker 1: Uh yeah. He'd be like, oh, you want me to 320 00:18:08,320 --> 00:18:10,159 Speaker 1: turn it up, man, I'll turn it up for you, 321 00:18:10,400 --> 00:18:15,600 Speaker 1: dirty hippie. All right? Should we go to Mr Les Paul? Yeah? So, 322 00:18:15,760 --> 00:18:18,879 Speaker 1: um Fender, we should just just recap real quick. Fender 323 00:18:18,920 --> 00:18:23,040 Speaker 1: has has stumbled upon the big problem with electric guitars, 324 00:18:23,119 --> 00:18:26,600 Speaker 1: the reverb with a classical guitar. So he's thinking about that. 325 00:18:26,840 --> 00:18:29,120 Speaker 1: And now we meet Chuck Les Paul who was born 326 00:18:29,240 --> 00:18:34,119 Speaker 1: Lester Paul Fuss in nineteen fifteen and Waukesha, Wisconsin. He 327 00:18:34,240 --> 00:18:37,040 Speaker 1: was a Wisconsin boy like Ed Geene was as well, 328 00:18:37,200 --> 00:18:42,080 Speaker 1: but not nearly as Grizzly. No, but a guitar wizard 329 00:18:42,280 --> 00:18:47,640 Speaker 1: like ed Geene. Right, a little known fact about ed Gaine. Yeah, 330 00:18:47,640 --> 00:18:49,960 Speaker 1: so before we get into his childhood, this is the 331 00:18:50,000 --> 00:18:53,160 Speaker 1: real important distinction between Leo Fender and less Paul. Leo 332 00:18:53,240 --> 00:18:56,320 Speaker 1: Fender did not play instruments, was an engineer at heart 333 00:18:56,400 --> 00:18:59,760 Speaker 1: and love to figure out problems for other people. Less 334 00:18:59,760 --> 00:19:03,879 Speaker 1: Paul all was uh the height of his game, the 335 00:19:04,320 --> 00:19:08,040 Speaker 1: most popular guitar player in the world and with a 336 00:19:08,080 --> 00:19:12,200 Speaker 1: string of number one hits. Uh. He was also a tinkerer, 337 00:19:12,560 --> 00:19:15,320 Speaker 1: but he was like, I need to make my guitar 338 00:19:15,480 --> 00:19:18,359 Speaker 1: sound better for me, so I can get better and 339 00:19:18,400 --> 00:19:21,240 Speaker 1: sound better. Yeah, that was his goal all along. But 340 00:19:21,320 --> 00:19:23,720 Speaker 1: you know, it takes a special kind of person to 341 00:19:23,800 --> 00:19:26,440 Speaker 1: say like, Okay, well then I need to figure out 342 00:19:26,440 --> 00:19:28,520 Speaker 1: how to make that happen. I need to figure out 343 00:19:28,520 --> 00:19:31,480 Speaker 1: how to make an electric guitar rather than oh, what 344 00:19:31,560 --> 00:19:33,520 Speaker 1: can I do. I need to I need somebody to 345 00:19:33,560 --> 00:19:35,520 Speaker 1: do this for me. Somebody needs to invent this, right, 346 00:19:35,520 --> 00:19:37,640 Speaker 1: I need to collaborate somebody. He was like, I'm I'm 347 00:19:37,640 --> 00:19:40,199 Speaker 1: gonna go try to figure this out myself. And he 348 00:19:40,280 --> 00:19:43,240 Speaker 1: really like, I didn't realize what a guitar got he 349 00:19:43,440 --> 00:19:46,720 Speaker 1: was and that he he was like this. Um. I 350 00:19:46,760 --> 00:19:50,000 Speaker 1: think at one point he had like four hits or 351 00:19:50,040 --> 00:19:54,359 Speaker 1: four spots on the Billboard top charts. UM. Like he 352 00:19:54,480 --> 00:19:59,600 Speaker 1: was really a popular musician. UM about midway through his career. 353 00:20:00,119 --> 00:20:02,639 Speaker 1: But even from a young age, he started out playing 354 00:20:02,760 --> 00:20:05,280 Speaker 1: like he was a performer. And I think he's also 355 00:20:05,359 --> 00:20:08,320 Speaker 1: credited Chuck with being the person um because he played 356 00:20:08,320 --> 00:20:12,000 Speaker 1: country western too. He also played the harmonica. His act 357 00:20:12,080 --> 00:20:14,639 Speaker 1: was called rubar Bread and it was just him and 358 00:20:14,680 --> 00:20:16,879 Speaker 1: he played the guitar and the harmonica. And he figured 359 00:20:16,880 --> 00:20:20,520 Speaker 1: out long before Bob Dylan every came along. But that's problematic. 360 00:20:20,920 --> 00:20:24,240 Speaker 1: You technically need four arms for that. So he fashioned 361 00:20:24,240 --> 00:20:27,040 Speaker 1: a harmonica holder that he could wear while he was 362 00:20:27,040 --> 00:20:29,639 Speaker 1: playing the guitar, just like Bob Dylan. More later on, 363 00:20:29,720 --> 00:20:33,800 Speaker 1: he was the kid who invented that years before. Yeah, 364 00:20:33,840 --> 00:20:36,200 Speaker 1: maybe this is another one of those things where it's 365 00:20:36,200 --> 00:20:38,359 Speaker 1: like did he invent it or did he see it 366 00:20:38,480 --> 00:20:41,560 Speaker 1: and make one on his own? But not taking anything 367 00:20:41,560 --> 00:20:44,000 Speaker 1: away from the guy. He was also a kid taking 368 00:20:44,040 --> 00:20:47,240 Speaker 1: apart electronics in his house putting them back together. He 369 00:20:47,280 --> 00:20:50,639 Speaker 1: really knew what he was doing, and he also had, 370 00:20:51,000 --> 00:20:53,200 Speaker 1: you know, like every guitar player, that same big problem 371 00:20:53,280 --> 00:20:55,760 Speaker 1: was when he played, he would be up there and 372 00:20:55,800 --> 00:20:58,680 Speaker 1: he could sing through that microphone, although he didn't sing 373 00:20:58,760 --> 00:21:00,960 Speaker 1: that much. He did when he was a kid, but 374 00:21:01,080 --> 00:21:03,439 Speaker 1: later on he realized he wasn't not like a pro singer. 375 00:21:04,359 --> 00:21:06,560 Speaker 1: Harmonica sounded good through the mic, but the guitar was 376 00:21:06,600 --> 00:21:09,480 Speaker 1: still in the background, and he knew that was an issue. Yes, 377 00:21:09,680 --> 00:21:12,879 Speaker 1: apparently um as this as legend has it, he was 378 00:21:12,920 --> 00:21:17,119 Speaker 1: playing a show at a barbecue stand. Um and I 379 00:21:17,160 --> 00:21:20,800 Speaker 1: think it was a regular potentially a regular show. He 380 00:21:21,440 --> 00:21:24,199 Speaker 1: could his harmonica sounded fine when he was singing. It 381 00:21:24,280 --> 00:21:27,040 Speaker 1: was broadcast fine because he had a microphone, but nothing 382 00:21:27,119 --> 00:21:30,159 Speaker 1: was working for the guitar was He was drowning it 383 00:21:30,200 --> 00:21:33,480 Speaker 1: out himself. So he realized that if he took the 384 00:21:33,560 --> 00:21:38,440 Speaker 1: phonograph needle, the electrified phonograph needle from his his parents 385 00:21:38,440 --> 00:21:42,080 Speaker 1: phonograph and attached it to the guitar and then attached 386 00:21:42,080 --> 00:21:45,760 Speaker 1: to that to a radio, he could actually amplify his guitar. 387 00:21:46,280 --> 00:21:50,440 Speaker 1: So he figured this out I think at like age thirteen, Um, 388 00:21:50,480 --> 00:21:55,119 Speaker 1: because he wanted to improve his barbecue stand chops and 389 00:21:55,240 --> 00:21:58,920 Speaker 1: tips and tips. He supposedly his tips tripled as a result. 390 00:21:58,960 --> 00:22:02,280 Speaker 1: But um, you know that's pretty impressive stuff. I would 391 00:22:02,280 --> 00:22:04,679 Speaker 1: not have thought about that at the as at the 392 00:22:04,680 --> 00:22:09,240 Speaker 1: tender year on the age oft. Yeah, I mean that's 393 00:22:09,240 --> 00:22:11,280 Speaker 1: where the tinkering comes in. And I'm sure it didn't 394 00:22:11,320 --> 00:22:14,879 Speaker 1: sound great to our ears now, but at the time, 395 00:22:15,359 --> 00:22:17,480 Speaker 1: you have to put yourself in the place of like 396 00:22:17,560 --> 00:22:21,520 Speaker 1: literally having never heard something like this happen. Uh, it was. 397 00:22:21,760 --> 00:22:23,480 Speaker 1: It had to have been like a revelation to actually 398 00:22:23,480 --> 00:22:26,840 Speaker 1: hear that guitar coming through a speaker, especially if you 399 00:22:26,920 --> 00:22:29,840 Speaker 1: lived in Waukesha, Wisconsin. You've never heard anything like that 400 00:22:29,880 --> 00:22:33,280 Speaker 1: in your life. But he was very much opposite of 401 00:22:33,320 --> 00:22:36,960 Speaker 1: Leo Fender and his personality. He was very gregarious, very outgoing, 402 00:22:37,840 --> 00:22:40,000 Speaker 1: made a lot of friends. Uh, could also be a 403 00:22:40,000 --> 00:22:43,080 Speaker 1: little brash. Was not a great husband to his two wives, 404 00:22:43,119 --> 00:22:46,399 Speaker 1: which we'll get to, but he was He was always 405 00:22:46,440 --> 00:22:48,000 Speaker 1: sort of the life of the party and he loved 406 00:22:48,000 --> 00:22:50,760 Speaker 1: performing in front of people, whereas Leo Fender really kind 407 00:22:50,760 --> 00:22:52,560 Speaker 1: of wanted to be at the background unless he was 408 00:22:52,840 --> 00:22:57,040 Speaker 1: very quietly getting on stage. Um. Unless Paul from the 409 00:22:57,160 --> 00:23:00,640 Speaker 1: very beginning, once he could afford regular guitars, I think 410 00:23:00,640 --> 00:23:03,480 Speaker 1: he moved to Chicago and was like making decent money, 411 00:23:04,320 --> 00:23:06,879 Speaker 1: like backing other people up. But he had a relationship 412 00:23:06,920 --> 00:23:10,960 Speaker 1: with Gibson from the very beginning because Gibson started out 413 00:23:11,000 --> 00:23:14,560 Speaker 1: as an acoustic guitar maker. Uh, and they're still known. 414 00:23:14,600 --> 00:23:17,199 Speaker 1: I mean, they make these great electric guitars, but you 415 00:23:17,240 --> 00:23:19,359 Speaker 1: know some of the best guitars in the world, or 416 00:23:19,520 --> 00:23:23,080 Speaker 1: Gibson acoustic guitars. Yeah, they also made like Mandolin's and 417 00:23:23,280 --> 00:23:26,600 Speaker 1: like yeah, like just all manner of stringing instruments and 418 00:23:27,000 --> 00:23:30,320 Speaker 1: what they made were basically works of art. Yeah, they 419 00:23:30,320 --> 00:23:33,119 Speaker 1: were beautiful and they still are. My favorite guitar I 420 00:23:33,119 --> 00:23:35,359 Speaker 1: owned is one I bought during the pandemic. I finally 421 00:23:35,440 --> 00:23:40,399 Speaker 1: bought the Gibson Acoustic U based on a nineteen forties model, 422 00:23:40,480 --> 00:23:43,680 Speaker 1: and it's just it's amazing. The sound difference between even 423 00:23:43,680 --> 00:23:47,840 Speaker 1: that and my really nice Martin Acoustic is striking. Yeah, 424 00:23:47,880 --> 00:23:51,800 Speaker 1: Gibs or Fender was not making acoustic guitars, and they 425 00:23:51,840 --> 00:23:55,000 Speaker 1: still to this day don't make a very good acoustic guitar. Yeah, 426 00:23:55,040 --> 00:23:57,320 Speaker 1: I can't imagine. It's really interesting that, like one of 427 00:23:57,359 --> 00:24:00,119 Speaker 1: the biggest guitar companies in the world. I don't if 428 00:24:00,119 --> 00:24:01,800 Speaker 1: they can't or if they just don't put the resources 429 00:24:01,840 --> 00:24:04,800 Speaker 1: toward it, but I think they're nicest acoustic guitar tops 430 00:24:04,800 --> 00:24:07,320 Speaker 1: out at about eight hundred bucks, which is you know, 431 00:24:07,359 --> 00:24:08,919 Speaker 1: you can get a pretty good guitar for that, but 432 00:24:08,960 --> 00:24:12,120 Speaker 1: these really really nice Gibson's are like four and five dollars. Yeah, 433 00:24:12,119 --> 00:24:16,680 Speaker 1: And like Gibson's whole jam was to make professional quality 434 00:24:16,840 --> 00:24:19,400 Speaker 1: instruments that were again works of art, but like if 435 00:24:19,400 --> 00:24:22,640 Speaker 1: you were a professional musician, like Gibson could make an 436 00:24:22,720 --> 00:24:26,400 Speaker 1: instrument that you could use and probably love UM. And 437 00:24:26,440 --> 00:24:29,200 Speaker 1: they were making them already. They were making those electrified 438 00:24:29,880 --> 00:24:33,720 Speaker 1: Spanish style or electrified acoustic guitars as as like I 439 00:24:33,760 --> 00:24:36,520 Speaker 1: was saying, as as early as I think six was 440 00:24:36,600 --> 00:24:41,120 Speaker 1: the e S one fifty. E S stood for Electrified 441 00:24:41,440 --> 00:24:46,600 Speaker 1: Spanish Guitar UM and there was a jazz guitarist named 442 00:24:47,040 --> 00:24:51,200 Speaker 1: Charlie Christian who really kind of championed that development. He 443 00:24:51,320 --> 00:24:55,119 Speaker 1: think he played for Benny Goodman's band, um but um 444 00:24:55,160 --> 00:24:57,400 Speaker 1: I think they named the pickup in those after him, 445 00:24:57,480 --> 00:25:01,200 Speaker 1: Charlie Christian Pickups. But U so les Paul was playing 446 00:25:01,280 --> 00:25:04,600 Speaker 1: these Gibson guitars, but it still wasn't what he was 447 00:25:04,640 --> 00:25:07,959 Speaker 1: looking for, because again, if you turned it up really loud, 448 00:25:08,800 --> 00:25:11,879 Speaker 1: you it would provide all sorts of problems. Yeah, it's 449 00:25:11,920 --> 00:25:14,960 Speaker 1: funny these little letters that like the E S three 450 00:25:15,000 --> 00:25:18,600 Speaker 1: thirty five is just a classic, amazing instrument still today, 451 00:25:18,600 --> 00:25:21,600 Speaker 1: and they have all these cool letters and you never 452 00:25:21,640 --> 00:25:24,840 Speaker 1: know what they name, but they mean but electrified Spanish. 453 00:25:24,920 --> 00:25:27,359 Speaker 1: Is kind of funny that the iconic Gibson s G 454 00:25:27,880 --> 00:25:31,520 Speaker 1: s G stands first Solid Guitar. Really. Yeah, they're all 455 00:25:31,560 --> 00:25:35,200 Speaker 1: just these very mundane abbreviations that all these years later 456 00:25:35,240 --> 00:25:37,560 Speaker 1: just seemed cool because Angus Young plays it. Yeah right, 457 00:25:37,720 --> 00:25:42,080 Speaker 1: well yeah, I mean if used a different example from 458 00:25:42,080 --> 00:25:44,120 Speaker 1: Angus Young and be really on board, but I got 459 00:25:44,160 --> 00:25:48,440 Speaker 1: you I play one. Well, there you go has a 460 00:25:48,520 --> 00:25:53,960 Speaker 1: cool acts. Uh. So he charmed his way into the 461 00:25:54,000 --> 00:25:57,280 Speaker 1: Epiphone factory in New York. Epiphone was a really big 462 00:25:57,320 --> 00:25:59,600 Speaker 1: guitar maker at the time, and I think Gibson eventually 463 00:25:59,600 --> 00:26:03,440 Speaker 1: bought UM, I think they're co Co brand or you know, 464 00:26:03,520 --> 00:26:07,560 Speaker 1: under the Gibson umbrella. Now, but he got to work 465 00:26:07,560 --> 00:26:10,119 Speaker 1: on his problems, and you've got to look up some 466 00:26:10,160 --> 00:26:13,160 Speaker 1: pictures of some of this stuff kind of starting now. Uh, 467 00:26:13,359 --> 00:26:15,960 Speaker 1: just look up a picture of the log from Les Paul. 468 00:26:16,119 --> 00:26:18,600 Speaker 1: And it was a I was about to say essentially, 469 00:26:18,640 --> 00:26:20,680 Speaker 1: but it's not essentially. It was a four by four 470 00:26:21,440 --> 00:26:27,160 Speaker 1: block of pine wood about two ft long that he 471 00:26:27,359 --> 00:26:31,359 Speaker 1: put a guitar neck on, an epiphone guitar neck, and 472 00:26:31,400 --> 00:26:33,240 Speaker 1: he made his own pickup. I guess he didn't go 473 00:26:33,240 --> 00:26:35,800 Speaker 1: out and buy a pickup or use one from another guitar, 474 00:26:36,720 --> 00:26:38,879 Speaker 1: and he made his own pickup, you know, with a 475 00:26:38,920 --> 00:26:42,120 Speaker 1: magnet and the wire, put some strings on it and 476 00:26:42,359 --> 00:26:44,919 Speaker 1: called it the log. And it was a very primitive 477 00:26:45,000 --> 00:26:48,520 Speaker 1: but working, solid body electric guitar. It looked very much 478 00:26:48,560 --> 00:26:53,120 Speaker 1: like something Devo would have played. Yeah, And in fact, 479 00:26:53,200 --> 00:26:56,760 Speaker 1: it freaked people out so much early on UM that 480 00:26:56,880 --> 00:26:59,960 Speaker 1: he ended up taking a part another guitar and glue 481 00:27:00,119 --> 00:27:02,280 Speaker 1: ng sides onto the side of it to make it 482 00:27:02,320 --> 00:27:04,800 Speaker 1: look normal, to make it look normal, And there's this 483 00:27:04,840 --> 00:27:07,320 Speaker 1: great picture of him holding the log, kind of separating 484 00:27:07,359 --> 00:27:11,119 Speaker 1: the sides off with a little wry smile. Um. But 485 00:27:11,200 --> 00:27:14,000 Speaker 1: the Gibson little side note gives the Gibson Firebird guitar, 486 00:27:14,240 --> 00:27:15,879 Speaker 1: which is one of my favorite guitars. I used to 487 00:27:15,920 --> 00:27:18,280 Speaker 1: have one, but I sold it. It is a it's 488 00:27:18,320 --> 00:27:21,119 Speaker 1: called a through neck guitar. I'm sure there are others, 489 00:27:21,119 --> 00:27:23,160 Speaker 1: but it's the only one I can think of that's 490 00:27:23,160 --> 00:27:27,160 Speaker 1: really popular. Whereas it's the same thing. It's basically one 491 00:27:27,240 --> 00:27:29,680 Speaker 1: long piece of wood, like the neck is the same 492 00:27:29,680 --> 00:27:31,879 Speaker 1: piece of wood as the body, and then they glue 493 00:27:31,920 --> 00:27:35,040 Speaker 1: on these wings on the outside. Okay, all right, settle down, Chuck. 494 00:27:35,880 --> 00:27:39,680 Speaker 1: It's pretty exciting, so Chuck. Also, if you ever found 495 00:27:39,720 --> 00:27:43,040 Speaker 1: yourself trapped in walt Kesha, Wisconsin, you go to go 496 00:27:43,080 --> 00:27:45,320 Speaker 1: to the book Kesha County Museum and they actually have 497 00:27:45,520 --> 00:27:50,480 Speaker 1: the original log there on display. Oh really, Yeah, apparently 498 00:27:50,480 --> 00:27:53,119 Speaker 1: they have a lot of Less Paul stuff there, including 499 00:27:53,160 --> 00:27:56,360 Speaker 1: that with the wings of the of the guitar kind 500 00:27:56,359 --> 00:27:59,000 Speaker 1: of pulled away to kind of show you know, it's 501 00:27:59,000 --> 00:28:03,159 Speaker 1: a neck through design like the Fireber. I I was 502 00:28:03,240 --> 00:28:05,000 Speaker 1: just teasing you, and I said to settle down. I 503 00:28:05,040 --> 00:28:08,000 Speaker 1: was just taking an opportunity. Like, I'm charmed very much. 504 00:28:08,160 --> 00:28:11,840 Speaker 1: I'm sure everyone else is by your childlike excitement over 505 00:28:11,880 --> 00:28:14,440 Speaker 1: this whole thing. I'm as excited as when I got 506 00:28:14,480 --> 00:28:16,960 Speaker 1: my first guitar when I was twelve, which was a 507 00:28:17,000 --> 00:28:20,480 Speaker 1: candy Apple red BC rich like metal guitar. I wish 508 00:28:20,480 --> 00:28:22,600 Speaker 1: I knew what mine was. I had a metal guitar too, 509 00:28:22,680 --> 00:28:25,639 Speaker 1: mom was pink, had a light coating of diamond dust. 510 00:28:25,720 --> 00:28:31,639 Speaker 1: And I wish to god I could remember who it was. 511 00:28:31,680 --> 00:28:35,720 Speaker 1: A local metal band from Toledo. Yeah. Yeah, they had 512 00:28:35,760 --> 00:28:37,880 Speaker 1: like an album and a poster and everything. And the guy, 513 00:28:38,200 --> 00:28:42,160 Speaker 1: the guitarist from the band worked at like the music store, 514 00:28:42,760 --> 00:28:45,680 Speaker 1: um where I would take lessons and he taught me 515 00:28:46,200 --> 00:28:50,800 Speaker 1: and he was as interested as um Oh. I can't 516 00:28:50,840 --> 00:28:54,120 Speaker 1: remember Carl Weather's character and happy Gilmore, but he's like 517 00:28:54,160 --> 00:28:58,040 Speaker 1: a golf pro and just totally uninterested. That's how interested 518 00:28:58,080 --> 00:29:02,520 Speaker 1: this guitar player wasn't seeing me as a future guitar player. Um. 519 00:29:02,560 --> 00:29:04,720 Speaker 1: And it's not like I blame him for me losing 520 00:29:04,760 --> 00:29:07,040 Speaker 1: interesting guitar, but he definitely didn't. He wasn't a great 521 00:29:07,120 --> 00:29:10,000 Speaker 1: mentor or anything. But I wish it's so bad I 522 00:29:10,040 --> 00:29:12,560 Speaker 1: would have stuck with it a little bit longer because 523 00:29:12,640 --> 00:29:14,960 Speaker 1: it was pretty pretty boss. When I look back on 524 00:29:15,000 --> 00:29:16,760 Speaker 1: the whole thing. I never knew this. How long did 525 00:29:16,800 --> 00:29:21,160 Speaker 1: you try? I don't know, five six lessons maybe? Al right. 526 00:29:21,400 --> 00:29:23,720 Speaker 1: I wonder what happened to that guitar too, Like my 527 00:29:23,800 --> 00:29:26,440 Speaker 1: parents bought the guitar. I mean it was used in everything, 528 00:29:26,480 --> 00:29:30,240 Speaker 1: but like, I have no idea what became of that guitar. 529 00:29:31,040 --> 00:29:35,680 Speaker 1: I never uh took lessons, So maybe that's the key. Yeah, 530 00:29:35,720 --> 00:29:38,200 Speaker 1: I could totally see that. I just shut myself in 531 00:29:38,240 --> 00:29:42,760 Speaker 1: my room and and started buying tableature, which, if you 532 00:29:42,800 --> 00:29:45,400 Speaker 1: don't know what that is, instead of actual sheet music, 533 00:29:45,560 --> 00:29:47,680 Speaker 1: like written out like a you know, like real sheet 534 00:29:47,760 --> 00:29:51,880 Speaker 1: music tableature or little numbers on they kind of mimic 535 00:29:51,920 --> 00:29:55,000 Speaker 1: a six string guitar and they put little numbers on 536 00:29:55,040 --> 00:29:57,560 Speaker 1: the strings on where you should put your fingers. So 537 00:29:57,640 --> 00:29:59,720 Speaker 1: it allows anyone who can't read music to sort of 538 00:29:59,720 --> 00:30:04,160 Speaker 1: figure out songs like e E G, E e G. 539 00:30:06,520 --> 00:30:08,200 Speaker 1: What are those chords? Someone's going to call you out 540 00:30:08,200 --> 00:30:09,480 Speaker 1: on that. I don't know, but that that was the 541 00:30:09,560 --> 00:30:11,680 Speaker 1: Kids in the Hall reference more than even a Deep 542 00:30:11,680 --> 00:30:15,240 Speaker 1: Purple reference. Oh man, I love that band in the 543 00:30:15,320 --> 00:30:19,800 Speaker 1: in the skits, the little kid garage band. Yeah, it's 544 00:30:21,640 --> 00:30:24,720 Speaker 1: all right. So back to the log. The log was 545 00:30:24,880 --> 00:30:29,400 Speaker 1: very rough, very primitive, but what it did accomplish was 546 00:30:29,960 --> 00:30:35,040 Speaker 1: amplification without feedback in longer sustain. Yeah. And more importantly, 547 00:30:35,080 --> 00:30:38,080 Speaker 1: it was a solid body guitar. Like like Less Paul 548 00:30:38,280 --> 00:30:40,760 Speaker 1: kind of crack that code that Fender, as far as 549 00:30:40,760 --> 00:30:44,760 Speaker 1: I know, is still working on. Because this is nineteen right, Yeah, 550 00:30:44,800 --> 00:30:48,920 Speaker 1: this was pre uh yeah, early nineteen forty. I think 551 00:30:48,960 --> 00:30:50,920 Speaker 1: it was prely Offender for sure. Yeah, so I mean 552 00:30:51,000 --> 00:30:52,800 Speaker 1: Less Paul really does have a claim to fame to 553 00:30:52,920 --> 00:30:57,320 Speaker 1: creating the first wooden solid body electric guitar because I 554 00:30:57,320 --> 00:31:00,760 Speaker 1: think the frying pan was solid body aluminum. He figured 555 00:31:00,800 --> 00:31:02,800 Speaker 1: out that problem of reverse just get rid of the 556 00:31:02,840 --> 00:31:05,440 Speaker 1: hollow body, replace it with the solid body, and it 557 00:31:05,520 --> 00:31:07,400 Speaker 1: was ugly. That seems to be the big problem. It 558 00:31:07,440 --> 00:31:10,720 Speaker 1: wasn't exactly what he was looking for sound wise, but 559 00:31:10,800 --> 00:31:13,360 Speaker 1: it was definitely close enough that it was like, I'm 560 00:31:13,400 --> 00:31:15,680 Speaker 1: on the right track. Let me go show the people 561 00:31:15,680 --> 00:31:19,320 Speaker 1: at Gibson. They're gonna love this kind of thing. And um, 562 00:31:19,360 --> 00:31:22,320 Speaker 1: they basically laughed him out of the meeting in Kalamazoo, 563 00:31:22,480 --> 00:31:28,400 Speaker 1: Michigan because he um showed up with a really ugly guitar. Yeah, 564 00:31:28,440 --> 00:31:30,960 Speaker 1: and not only that, like they just didn't see the 565 00:31:31,040 --> 00:31:33,600 Speaker 1: vision because, like I said, they were working with these 566 00:31:33,960 --> 00:31:38,120 Speaker 1: ancient luthier's who had this ancient craft. They weren't ancient humans, 567 00:31:38,120 --> 00:31:40,280 Speaker 1: but they would wake them from the dead each day 568 00:31:40,360 --> 00:31:43,560 Speaker 1: to go to the workshop and create a new guitar. 569 00:31:44,560 --> 00:31:46,080 Speaker 1: But the point is they were doing great with these 570 00:31:46,080 --> 00:31:49,040 Speaker 1: big acoustic guitars, and they were like, no one's gonna 571 00:31:49,080 --> 00:31:52,840 Speaker 1: want to hear that, because this is what a guitar is, basically, like, 572 00:31:52,920 --> 00:31:54,800 Speaker 1: you don't it's not a lead instrument in the band. 573 00:31:54,880 --> 00:31:57,440 Speaker 1: Lead that to the horns and the piano. So he 574 00:31:57,520 --> 00:32:00,640 Speaker 1: was laughed out of there and a little egg on 575 00:32:00,680 --> 00:32:04,520 Speaker 1: his face. But this was a full five years before 576 00:32:04,600 --> 00:32:07,840 Speaker 1: Leo Fender came up with his first plant guitar, which 577 00:32:07,840 --> 00:32:11,680 Speaker 1: you should also look up just typing Leo Fender black 578 00:32:12,520 --> 00:32:15,560 Speaker 1: Plant guitar. And it looks a little more like a 579 00:32:15,560 --> 00:32:20,840 Speaker 1: guitar than the log, but not that much. No, it 580 00:32:20,840 --> 00:32:22,720 Speaker 1: looks more way more like a guitar than the log, 581 00:32:23,200 --> 00:32:24,920 Speaker 1: but it still doesn't look like a guitar as we 582 00:32:24,960 --> 00:32:27,040 Speaker 1: know it. Yeah, it was almost I get the impression 583 00:32:27,080 --> 00:32:31,240 Speaker 1: that he created the guitar kind of like how you 584 00:32:31,320 --> 00:32:33,560 Speaker 1: might build like a car out of clay, but the 585 00:32:33,600 --> 00:32:37,480 Speaker 1: axle works because you're testing wheels, I don't think people 586 00:32:37,720 --> 00:32:39,800 Speaker 1: and he built it as a test, yeah, but I 587 00:32:39,840 --> 00:32:41,640 Speaker 1: don't think we mentioned that though, Yeah, but it was 588 00:32:41,680 --> 00:32:44,200 Speaker 1: it was he was testing out like pickups and I 589 00:32:44,240 --> 00:32:47,200 Speaker 1: think testing the concept of a solid body as well. 590 00:32:47,680 --> 00:32:49,640 Speaker 1: But he wasn't making it like this is going to 591 00:32:49,720 --> 00:32:52,320 Speaker 1: be my prototype. But it turned out to actually be 592 00:32:52,520 --> 00:32:56,800 Speaker 1: kind of a prototype because um, when he uh, I 593 00:32:56,840 --> 00:32:59,000 Speaker 1: don't exactly know how word got around. I guess because 594 00:32:59,040 --> 00:33:00,920 Speaker 1: he was friends with band and so bands would kind 595 00:33:00,920 --> 00:33:02,760 Speaker 1: of come around the workshop to see what's going on, 596 00:33:03,160 --> 00:33:06,200 Speaker 1: and they started coming around seeing and hearing this guitar 597 00:33:06,320 --> 00:33:09,920 Speaker 1: that he made, and um, people started renting it apparently 598 00:33:09,960 --> 00:33:12,000 Speaker 1: for the weekend to go play shows with and just 599 00:33:12,160 --> 00:33:14,800 Speaker 1: knocking the socks off of the Bobby socksers in town 600 00:33:14,880 --> 00:33:17,720 Speaker 1: from what I can tell. Yeah, And at this point 601 00:33:17,760 --> 00:33:22,640 Speaker 1: he has the Fender Electric Instrument Company. Uh, it's legit. 602 00:33:22,840 --> 00:33:24,600 Speaker 1: And you know, in the background of all of this, 603 00:33:24,720 --> 00:33:26,600 Speaker 1: and we're not going to talk much about amps, but 604 00:33:26,960 --> 00:33:29,200 Speaker 1: in the background of all of this, he's building amps 605 00:33:29,280 --> 00:33:31,360 Speaker 1: along the way. He was one of the first sort 606 00:33:31,360 --> 00:33:34,440 Speaker 1: of master amp builders. Well, yeah, Fender amps are like 607 00:33:34,680 --> 00:33:40,320 Speaker 1: as famous as the guitar. Basically, yeah, so where are 608 00:33:40,360 --> 00:33:43,720 Speaker 1: we at right now? Fenders made his playing guitar, Leo's 609 00:33:43,760 --> 00:33:47,240 Speaker 1: got his log. Neither one of them are going places 610 00:33:47,320 --> 00:33:50,280 Speaker 1: immediately with it. It's just kind of like they've both 611 00:33:50,320 --> 00:33:54,040 Speaker 1: now cracked to the problem and there's a lot of 612 00:33:54,080 --> 00:34:00,160 Speaker 1: obstacles between them and fame, or at least guitar production fame. Um, 613 00:34:00,160 --> 00:34:02,959 Speaker 1: but you know what that means though, Right we're at 614 00:34:03,000 --> 00:34:05,880 Speaker 1: our second break. Oh good, okay, Chuck, I think that 615 00:34:06,000 --> 00:34:08,600 Speaker 1: was great. Um, so Chuck, just separ at our second break. 616 00:34:08,680 --> 00:34:11,520 Speaker 1: He's clearly driving this episode. Let's all go with it, 617 00:34:11,520 --> 00:34:43,759 Speaker 1: shall we shock? Okay, we're back, Chuck, We're back. We 618 00:34:43,880 --> 00:34:46,920 Speaker 1: got a log, We've got this little funny looking black, 619 00:34:46,920 --> 00:34:51,359 Speaker 1: solid body guitar, and uh, we need to pick back 620 00:34:51,440 --> 00:34:55,680 Speaker 1: up with with Les Paul In nineteen I guess forty 621 00:34:55,800 --> 00:35:00,279 Speaker 1: one ish. He moves to Los Angeles. He's and to 622 00:35:00,360 --> 00:35:04,319 Speaker 1: get session work. Uh he plays with Bing Crosby, who was, uh, 623 00:35:04,760 --> 00:35:06,759 Speaker 1: sort of one of the most popular singers at the time. 624 00:35:06,840 --> 00:35:09,360 Speaker 1: Oh yeah, dude. He moved to Los Angeles to be 625 00:35:09,520 --> 00:35:12,279 Speaker 1: near being Crosby, which I did little research, and that 626 00:35:12,360 --> 00:35:15,480 Speaker 1: was kind of a common thing, what to just want 627 00:35:15,480 --> 00:35:17,600 Speaker 1: to be near bing Crosses. Yeah, you've moved across the 628 00:35:17,640 --> 00:35:19,920 Speaker 1: country to be near bing Crosby unless you were one 629 00:35:19,960 --> 00:35:23,560 Speaker 1: of his kids. Oh is he a good father? Oh? 630 00:35:23,719 --> 00:35:27,000 Speaker 1: Really not a good dad. I didn't know that. Wait 631 00:35:27,000 --> 00:35:30,239 Speaker 1: a minute, are you thinking of mommy dearest? Oh yeah, 632 00:35:30,239 --> 00:35:34,080 Speaker 1: that's right, that's one thinking thinking of John Crawford. Uh. 633 00:35:34,320 --> 00:35:36,919 Speaker 1: But he was a huge, huge music star. Um Les 634 00:35:36,920 --> 00:35:39,080 Speaker 1: Paul was out there working with him. But then he 635 00:35:39,120 --> 00:35:41,879 Speaker 1: gets I don't think we mentioned he had electrocuted really 636 00:35:41,880 --> 00:35:45,640 Speaker 1: bad when he was twenty six playing music. He had 637 00:35:45,640 --> 00:35:48,840 Speaker 1: sweaty hands, held the microphone, was also touching the guitar strings, 638 00:35:49,320 --> 00:35:53,400 Speaker 1: completed a circuit and really damaged his hand such that 639 00:35:53,520 --> 00:35:55,359 Speaker 1: it took Uh. I mean I heard his whole body, 640 00:35:55,360 --> 00:35:58,000 Speaker 1: but it damaged his hand such that took quite a 641 00:35:58,040 --> 00:36:01,360 Speaker 1: couple of years to even recover, which was huge. Like 642 00:36:01,440 --> 00:36:03,640 Speaker 1: he he might have never played again, Like there was 643 00:36:03,680 --> 00:36:06,719 Speaker 1: a possibility that was going to happen. Yeah, and that's 644 00:36:06,760 --> 00:36:10,000 Speaker 1: just injury number one for him. Um but he gets 645 00:36:10,080 --> 00:36:13,040 Speaker 1: drafted in World War Two, goes to work in the 646 00:36:13,120 --> 00:36:17,440 Speaker 1: Army at the Armed Forces Radio Network and is playing guitar, 647 00:36:17,480 --> 00:36:20,840 Speaker 1: basically backing up the Andrews sisters backing up Being Crosby 648 00:36:20,880 --> 00:36:23,560 Speaker 1: when they do these USO tours. So as far as 649 00:36:23,560 --> 00:36:26,640 Speaker 1: the army goes in World War Two, pretty plumb gig right. 650 00:36:26,920 --> 00:36:29,719 Speaker 1: Um so. And plus he's again like he did move 651 00:36:29,760 --> 00:36:31,319 Speaker 1: to l A to Bean or being Crosby in the 652 00:36:31,320 --> 00:36:33,879 Speaker 1: fact that he's getting to like play with being Crosby. 653 00:36:33,920 --> 00:36:37,680 Speaker 1: Is I'm guessing a lifelong dream of his come true. 654 00:36:38,320 --> 00:36:40,520 Speaker 1: Um And even after the war, I guess he made 655 00:36:40,600 --> 00:36:43,800 Speaker 1: enough of a connection with being Um I'm on a 656 00:36:43,840 --> 00:36:46,759 Speaker 1: first name basis with him. By the way, um he 657 00:36:47,080 --> 00:36:51,680 Speaker 1: uh that that Less Paul um kind of I guess became. 658 00:36:51,800 --> 00:36:53,520 Speaker 1: I don't know if there was like a mentor thing, 659 00:36:53,520 --> 00:36:56,480 Speaker 1: but at the very least he definitely patronized. Less Paul 660 00:36:56,600 --> 00:36:59,279 Speaker 1: helped his career big time. One of the things that 661 00:36:59,360 --> 00:37:02,719 Speaker 1: really helped Less Paul become like a genuine, bona fide star. 662 00:37:02,800 --> 00:37:04,640 Speaker 1: He was already fairly well known and a lot of 663 00:37:04,680 --> 00:37:07,400 Speaker 1: circles had some hits, but what really shot him to 664 00:37:07,440 --> 00:37:11,279 Speaker 1: the top was the song called It's Been a Long 665 00:37:11,360 --> 00:37:14,319 Speaker 1: Long Time. It's actually a really good song, but it 666 00:37:14,400 --> 00:37:17,000 Speaker 1: was kind of a song that was a hit because 667 00:37:17,040 --> 00:37:21,399 Speaker 1: it kind of summed up America trudging wearily back from 668 00:37:21,440 --> 00:37:24,360 Speaker 1: World War Two. Um, and it's just kind of like 669 00:37:24,400 --> 00:37:29,440 Speaker 1: this mellow solemn song where, uh, it's almost I'm sure 670 00:37:29,480 --> 00:37:32,160 Speaker 1: there's other instruments, but my ears pick up Bing Crosby's 671 00:37:32,239 --> 00:37:37,080 Speaker 1: vocals and Less Paul's jazz guitar um and they his 672 00:37:37,200 --> 00:37:40,839 Speaker 1: guitar enhances the vocals so much. But there's a actual 673 00:37:40,920 --> 00:37:44,960 Speaker 1: guitar solo in there, and it's slow, but it's really good. 674 00:37:45,200 --> 00:37:48,160 Speaker 1: And that kind of shot Less Paul to superstardom from 675 00:37:48,200 --> 00:37:51,560 Speaker 1: that point on. Yeah, so Bing Crosby is like, you 676 00:37:51,600 --> 00:37:55,160 Speaker 1: need to open up a studio. I'll even help finance 677 00:37:55,160 --> 00:37:58,280 Speaker 1: this thing. He did so in his garage and before 678 00:37:58,280 --> 00:38:01,759 Speaker 1: you know it, and Los Angeles, all these famous people 679 00:38:01,800 --> 00:38:05,240 Speaker 1: are stopping by Les Paul's garage to hear him play, 680 00:38:05,280 --> 00:38:08,239 Speaker 1: to hang out with him. Uh. He, like I said, 681 00:38:08,239 --> 00:38:10,879 Speaker 1: he was a very gregarious guy. So people just kind 682 00:38:10,880 --> 00:38:13,200 Speaker 1: of wanted to be around him. And this is all 683 00:38:13,280 --> 00:38:17,040 Speaker 1: going great, but he still wasn't quite satisfied with what 684 00:38:17,080 --> 00:38:20,600 Speaker 1: was going on because the sound just still wasn't there. 685 00:38:21,200 --> 00:38:24,520 Speaker 1: He was he he called it sound on sound recording. 686 00:38:24,520 --> 00:38:28,000 Speaker 1: He was the first person, or one of the first 687 00:38:28,040 --> 00:38:31,560 Speaker 1: people to experiment with studio techniques where you could layer 688 00:38:32,680 --> 00:38:34,960 Speaker 1: recordings on top of one another. And this was before 689 00:38:35,440 --> 00:38:38,319 Speaker 1: they were even recording on magnetic tape. Yeah, dude, multi 690 00:38:38,400 --> 00:38:41,600 Speaker 1: track recording like you know how you hear drums playing, 691 00:38:41,719 --> 00:38:43,799 Speaker 1: and you hear a guitar playing, and then you hear 692 00:38:43,840 --> 00:38:47,359 Speaker 1: like vocals, all of those musicians may never have even 693 00:38:47,360 --> 00:38:49,040 Speaker 1: been in the same room at the same time. You 694 00:38:49,040 --> 00:38:51,759 Speaker 1: can do that with multi track recording. Back in the day, 695 00:38:51,760 --> 00:38:53,440 Speaker 1: if you wanted to make a recording, you had to 696 00:38:53,480 --> 00:38:55,360 Speaker 1: get everybody into a room. You all had to be 697 00:38:55,400 --> 00:38:57,960 Speaker 1: playing it once. He had to be playing the song together, 698 00:38:58,200 --> 00:39:00,600 Speaker 1: and then you recorded it and that was the record wording, right, 699 00:39:00,840 --> 00:39:03,279 Speaker 1: So did it come up with multi track recording? Was 700 00:39:03,360 --> 00:39:05,719 Speaker 1: huge in and of itself, But I looked into what 701 00:39:05,760 --> 00:39:09,360 Speaker 1: he was actually doing and it's mind boggling. He would 702 00:39:09,640 --> 00:39:11,760 Speaker 1: He came up, I think, with a song called Lover 703 00:39:12,760 --> 00:39:15,640 Speaker 1: and it was was that the one where it's like 704 00:39:15,719 --> 00:39:20,120 Speaker 1: seven tracks or eight tracks of guitars. And the way 705 00:39:20,160 --> 00:39:22,800 Speaker 1: that he made each track was he recorded one track, 706 00:39:22,960 --> 00:39:26,360 Speaker 1: the first initial track onto acetate. He made a record 707 00:39:26,440 --> 00:39:29,160 Speaker 1: of that, and then he took that record and he 708 00:39:29,239 --> 00:39:31,920 Speaker 1: played it, and then he played along with it, and 709 00:39:31,960 --> 00:39:35,360 Speaker 1: then he recorded that onto another record, and then another record, 710 00:39:35,480 --> 00:39:38,239 Speaker 1: and then another record, and by the time he was 711 00:39:38,320 --> 00:39:41,760 Speaker 1: doing his seventh track, he had a record of seven 712 00:39:42,600 --> 00:39:45,480 Speaker 1: of seven tracks playing all at once on one record 713 00:39:45,520 --> 00:39:47,800 Speaker 1: that he had recorded one by one, and he was 714 00:39:47,840 --> 00:39:50,400 Speaker 1: playing the eighth track with it. And if you messed 715 00:39:50,480 --> 00:39:52,759 Speaker 1: up one time, say on track five, he had to 716 00:39:52,760 --> 00:39:55,680 Speaker 1: start all over at the beginning, unless he still had 717 00:39:55,719 --> 00:39:59,120 Speaker 1: those first few tracks handy. Hopefully he didn't break each 718 00:39:59,160 --> 00:40:02,440 Speaker 1: record after each recording or anything like that, but in 719 00:40:02,560 --> 00:40:05,400 Speaker 1: that nuts going to that, and that was about as 720 00:40:05,440 --> 00:40:08,759 Speaker 1: innovating uh form of music as anyone had come up 721 00:40:08,760 --> 00:40:11,759 Speaker 1: with to that point. Yeah, it's funny when you hear 722 00:40:11,800 --> 00:40:15,280 Speaker 1: people working with like pro tools and dragon drop digital 723 00:40:15,320 --> 00:40:17,399 Speaker 1: recording now and they talk about like in the old 724 00:40:17,440 --> 00:40:19,920 Speaker 1: days when they used when they would cut and spice tape, 725 00:40:20,239 --> 00:40:24,560 Speaker 1: like go back even further, dude to less Paul doing 726 00:40:24,600 --> 00:40:29,600 Speaker 1: this on actual actual ascetate records. It's crazy. It is crazy. 727 00:40:29,640 --> 00:40:31,560 Speaker 1: When I was like, what what does that mean? What 728 00:40:31,719 --> 00:40:33,880 Speaker 1: was he doing? Like dueling a state records? And I 729 00:40:33,960 --> 00:40:36,919 Speaker 1: looked tonight my eyes popped out of my head. Yeah, 730 00:40:36,920 --> 00:40:39,680 Speaker 1: it's it's pretty remarkable. The innovations he was coming up with. 731 00:40:40,360 --> 00:40:43,800 Speaker 1: So he's doing all that, he's becoming more and more popular, 732 00:40:44,520 --> 00:40:47,240 Speaker 1: and then a very faithful thing happened. Uh a steel 733 00:40:47,239 --> 00:40:51,440 Speaker 1: guitar player name. Uh do we say Joaquin Murphy. That's 734 00:40:51,440 --> 00:40:53,760 Speaker 1: how I'm going with all right, that's how it spelled. 735 00:40:54,239 --> 00:40:56,560 Speaker 1: H He came over to Less's house one day and 736 00:40:56,600 --> 00:40:58,160 Speaker 1: he said, you know what, I got this guy here. 737 00:40:58,800 --> 00:41:01,320 Speaker 1: I want you to meet him. And he's really good 738 00:41:01,760 --> 00:41:04,000 Speaker 1: with working on amplifiers, and I think you guys might 739 00:41:04,000 --> 00:41:06,520 Speaker 1: like each other. Uh. And his name is Leo Fender 740 00:41:07,120 --> 00:41:10,440 Speaker 1: and where you know it? And this this is movie territory. 741 00:41:10,880 --> 00:41:15,239 Speaker 1: Leo Fender and Les Paul are hanging out together, trying 742 00:41:15,239 --> 00:41:20,200 Speaker 1: to figure stuff out together, work shopping, problem solving. They um, 743 00:41:20,239 --> 00:41:22,400 Speaker 1: you know, they pointed out, and he's right that they 744 00:41:22,440 --> 00:41:25,239 Speaker 1: weren't like great friends. But it's not like they were 745 00:41:25,320 --> 00:41:27,879 Speaker 1: enemies or rivals at first. They just were really really 746 00:41:27,880 --> 00:41:31,840 Speaker 1: different from each other. Yeah. Um, they kind of shared 747 00:41:31,880 --> 00:41:34,680 Speaker 1: a U at the very least, they had a common 748 00:41:34,719 --> 00:41:37,279 Speaker 1: problem or a common quest that they were both working on. 749 00:41:37,320 --> 00:41:40,239 Speaker 1: They were just not similar people personality wise, so they 750 00:41:40,280 --> 00:41:43,239 Speaker 1: didn't click. They were like, this is great, let's be 751 00:41:43,280 --> 00:41:47,319 Speaker 1: partners were the same, right exactly, but they also were 752 00:41:47,360 --> 00:41:51,600 Speaker 1: also kind of becoming rivals a little bit too, right, well, 753 00:41:52,200 --> 00:41:54,320 Speaker 1: not quite yet. Like at this point they were genuinely 754 00:41:54,600 --> 00:41:57,880 Speaker 1: trying to figure stuff out together. Uh, and I think 755 00:41:58,280 --> 00:42:02,320 Speaker 1: like Leo was coming over every he can basically musicians 756 00:42:02,320 --> 00:42:05,000 Speaker 1: would come over still, and he would ask them questions 757 00:42:05,000 --> 00:42:07,200 Speaker 1: and try and figure stuff out, try and solve these 758 00:42:07,239 --> 00:42:11,000 Speaker 1: amplification problems. But um, yeah, there may have been a 759 00:42:11,040 --> 00:42:14,200 Speaker 1: little friendly like let's see what this guy's got kind 760 00:42:14,200 --> 00:42:15,840 Speaker 1: of thing, but you know, Les Paul was like, you 761 00:42:15,880 --> 00:42:19,960 Speaker 1: can't even play yeah. And again remember remember though Fender. 762 00:42:20,200 --> 00:42:23,000 Speaker 1: By this time he had a company, the Fender Electric 763 00:42:23,040 --> 00:42:28,640 Speaker 1: Instrument Company. He was mostly focusing on electric steel guitars because, um, 764 00:42:28,760 --> 00:42:31,520 Speaker 1: not just country Western love that stuff, but Hawaiian music 765 00:42:31,560 --> 00:42:34,160 Speaker 1: was really huge as well. Um, and they use a 766 00:42:34,239 --> 00:42:37,080 Speaker 1: lap steel guitar. So um, he was he had a 767 00:42:37,080 --> 00:42:40,960 Speaker 1: company already going. Les Paul had his own musical career going. 768 00:42:41,320 --> 00:42:43,480 Speaker 1: He was just kind of, you know, he tinkered because 769 00:42:43,480 --> 00:42:46,160 Speaker 1: he needed to his his focuses on his musical career. 770 00:42:46,280 --> 00:42:48,080 Speaker 1: So I could see there being like a little bit 771 00:42:48,080 --> 00:42:50,120 Speaker 1: of a rivalry and that they were trying to crack 772 00:42:50,200 --> 00:42:53,960 Speaker 1: the same problem, but other than that, they weren't necessarily rivals. 773 00:42:54,000 --> 00:42:57,680 Speaker 1: You know, that's right. Uh. And in order to really 774 00:42:57,680 --> 00:42:59,800 Speaker 1: solve this problem, it would take the entrance of a 775 00:43:00,080 --> 00:43:03,479 Speaker 1: or gentlemen that we haven't even mentioned yet that was very, 776 00:43:03,560 --> 00:43:06,279 Speaker 1: very important to the story of the electric guitar. And 777 00:43:06,480 --> 00:43:08,919 Speaker 1: that is where we're going to leave you for part one. 778 00:43:09,960 --> 00:43:13,120 Speaker 1: Nice Chuck, it was a very good cliffhanger. Who could 779 00:43:13,120 --> 00:43:15,200 Speaker 1: it be? I don't know, but you're gonna have to 780 00:43:15,280 --> 00:43:19,200 Speaker 1: tune in Thursday to find out. In this very special 781 00:43:19,239 --> 00:43:25,160 Speaker 1: two part episode of Stuff you Should Know, My money's 782 00:43:25,160 --> 00:43:31,200 Speaker 1: on CC to Bill. Stuff You Should Know is a 783 00:43:31,239 --> 00:43:34,600 Speaker 1: production of I Heart Radio. For more podcasts my heart Radio, 784 00:43:34,840 --> 00:43:37,840 Speaker 1: visit the i heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever 785 00:43:37,880 --> 00:43:39,280 Speaker 1: you listen to your favorite shows.