Speaker 1: Recording Recording. Welcome to the Frugal Friends podcast, where you'll
Speaker 1: learn to save money, embrace simplicity, rights, and liver with
Speaker 1: your life. Here your host Jen and Jill. Welcome to
Speaker 1: the Frugal Friends podcast. My name is Jen. Hey, Hey,
Speaker 1: I'm Jill, and we have a special holiday episode for
Speaker 1: you because Christmas and Hanukkah are coming and quanza happy holidays,
Speaker 1: Happy holidays, and that means more conversations with your family,
Speaker 1: probably about money and politics. But we're not here to
Speaker 1: talk about politics. We're just here to help you have
Speaker 1: good conversations about money, just one of the touchy subjects,
Speaker 1: not all of them. We can't do everything. So this
Speaker 1: episode picks up where episodes sixty two and sixty three
Speaker 1: left off. So sixty two is talking to your parents
Speaker 1: about their finances and that's with one of our favorite people,
Speaker 1: Cameron Huddleston's, and episode sixty three is getting your spouse
Speaker 1: on board with frugality. So a lot of the same
Speaker 1: principles you used to talk about money with your spouse
Speaker 1: you can use with family and friends. So today we
Speaker 1: are talking about having those healthy, productive conversations with friends,
Speaker 1: family partner about money and how to approach them first.
Speaker 1: Our sponsors. This episode is also brought to you by
Speaker 1: Student Loans. Ever fall in love with someone and get
Speaker 1: tricked into marrying them only to find out they have
Speaker 1: a ton of student loan debt. Happens to the best
Speaker 1: of us, including my husband. Don't worry if your partner
Speaker 1: has more student debt than they make in a year,
Speaker 1: it can be paid off, but only if you talk
Speaker 1: about it first. Just ask Travis student loan debt. Don't
Speaker 1: make big life decisions without knowing how much is involved.
Speaker 1: Oh my goodness, this was kind of funny and kind
Speaker 1: of like cringe worthy. Yeah, I know, like you started
Speaker 1: talking about it, like have you ever tried vanilla ice cream?
Speaker 1: Happens to the best of us. Have you ever married
Speaker 1: somebody who lied you? At the start? I didn't lie.
Speaker 1: I did not lie. We were engaged, and I just
Speaker 1: didn't say how much student loan did I have. That's
Speaker 1: beyond the point. We're talking about conversations today, and those
Speaker 1: are things you should have asking the questions. It's really
Speaker 1: Travis's fault for not asking the question right. He just
Speaker 1: assumed that I was perfect him. Is simple mistake, simple
Speaker 1: simple mistakes. Like our article from real simple dot com. Um,
Speaker 1: I'm really trying to get away from this conversation. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I see that you're redirecting hard. I am working, but
Speaker 1: it's how I got out of that conversation in Initially,
Speaker 1: our first first headline is ten important money conversations everyone
Speaker 1: should have and it is from real simple dot Com.
Speaker 1: Really liked this one. I liked how they separated it
Speaker 1: between kids, yes, spouse and parents, and these are the
Speaker 1: conversations you should be aware and be focusing in on
Speaker 1: having with each of these categories, depending on who you
Speaker 1: have in your life, because we often focus on the
Speaker 1: spouse and forget the kids and the parents, and they're included.
Speaker 1: They're all part of us. So the article starts with spouse,
Speaker 1: will start there. Uh, And it gives this tip of
Speaker 1: that you need to talk about where your money goes.
Speaker 1: I mean that's crucial. I agree step one, where does
Speaker 1: our money go? And asking are we tracking or spending?
Speaker 1: Do we want our money to go there? Where are
Speaker 1: we each spending? What are each of our priorities? Have
Speaker 1: the conversation, Yeah, I mean you can't talk about you
Speaker 1: can't have productive conversations if you don't have a foundation
Speaker 1: for what's happening, because one person is going to think
Speaker 1: things are way worse than they are. One person is
Speaker 1: going to think things are way better than they are.
Speaker 1: So yeah, you have to know where the money is
Speaker 1: going at first. Um, the next conversation is do we
Speaker 1: need to change who does what? So it sometimes falls
Speaker 1: on one person to make financial decisions or to do
Speaker 1: financial things, and they didn't sign up for it. And
Speaker 1: sometimes they take it on because they like it, but
Speaker 1: sometimes they take it on because nobody else offered to
Speaker 1: do it. And so that is a conversation you need
Speaker 1: to have so you can divvy up responsibilities according to giftings,
Speaker 1: according to strengths, and just according to like diving up
Speaker 1: the things that people don't like to do. And again
Speaker 1: it starts with another list. I mean, get used to that.
Speaker 1: You're going to be making a lot of lists of
Speaker 1: who is currently doing what, begin tracking all of that.
Speaker 1: Some of it may not have been spoken yet, some
Speaker 1: of it just might be you've fallen into these different roles.
Speaker 1: That's fine, but take some time to reevaluate who is
Speaker 1: paying this bill, who's tracking our spending, who's looking at
Speaker 1: goals and keeping us on target? And do we need
Speaker 1: to have a conversation about giving that to the person
Speaker 1: who might be more skilled in that area or more
Speaker 1: interested in taking on that role, especially if it's become
Speaker 1: super burdensome. You never know your spouse may be interested
Speaker 1: in taking it on, passing that baton. Oh that's a ram. Yes,
Speaker 1: next one to ask. Another conversation to have, is our
Speaker 1: our retirement plans on track? So well? Of course if
Speaker 1: you don't, if you're like retirement plan what then yeah,
Speaker 1: certainly you need to be having this conversation. But what
Speaker 1: are you aiming at? I know in a previous podcast
Speaker 1: we talked about long term goals. This is a fantastic
Speaker 1: time to think about what what are we thinking long term?
Speaker 1: We're not talking two to five years anymore. We're talking
Speaker 1: and depending on where you're at in relation to retirement, uh,
Speaker 1: potentially twenty to thirty years out and are we on
Speaker 1: track for that? And the time to talk about that
Speaker 1: is a sap because you're never going to be better
Speaker 1: off in some of these long term goals than if
Speaker 1: you're talking about it as soon as possible. But of course,
Speaker 1: looking for the right time to bring this up. And
Speaker 1: we'll talk about this a little bit more in our
Speaker 1: next article of how to have some of these difficult conversations,
Speaker 1: But this is an important one to be having. Even
Speaker 1: if you are in the thirties bracket still important, just
Speaker 1: as important as if you're in your fifties, sixties, seventies. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I've been reading the twelve week Year, and it's all
Speaker 1: about um having instead of planning for a year out
Speaker 1: to make every twelve weeks um a quote unquote year.
Speaker 1: And if you are treating every twelve weeks like a
Speaker 1: full year, you get so much more done by the
Speaker 1: end of the year because you've essentially gone through four
Speaker 1: years worth of work and you can increase your productivity,
Speaker 1: you know, over sixty percent. And I think translating that
Speaker 1: to your retirement plans can have a big impact for
Speaker 1: making sure your retirement plan is on track, because if
Speaker 1: you have made a twenty year plan for retirement, you
Speaker 1: can get pretty complacent for those first ten years, find
Speaker 1: yourself really behind, and have to work that much harder
Speaker 1: for the next ten years to get back on track.
Speaker 1: But if you are treating retirement in a shorter term
Speaker 1: goals like three years, five years, or even shorter like
Speaker 1: maybe even you've got a twelve week goal for your
Speaker 1: retirement investments. Then you can make sure you're hitting those
Speaker 1: retirement goals um so much more and the goals can
Speaker 1: be so much smart smaller if you are breaking up
Speaker 1: a twenty year goal into twelve week in increments, so
Speaker 1: to speak. And for those who own your own businesses
Speaker 1: and you do quarterly taxes, this thing will come quite
Speaker 1: factually for you. That will be perfect. Another conversation to
Speaker 1: have is what is our risk tolerance when it comes
Speaker 1: to investments. So of course this depends on the season
Speaker 1: of life that you're in. If you're still one goal
Speaker 1: and heavy going at debt repayment, this is a conversation
Speaker 1: that might be able to wait until you're ready for
Speaker 1: that investment stage, or if you're kind of doing both
Speaker 1: at the same time, then find how this conversation now.
Speaker 1: But it is an important one because if one of
Speaker 1: you is very risk averse and the other is thinking
Speaker 1: that there's a fortune to be made in the market
Speaker 1: and ready to just kind of throw all the dollars
Speaker 1: at it, that could lead to some tension. That's how
Speaker 1: all were at that tension. So being able to talk
Speaker 1: about where you think you'll be able to grow your
Speaker 1: money how you want to do that and making sure
Speaker 1: that you're both on board with that. Some natural times
Speaker 1: to have this conversation is during tax season or when
Speaker 1: you're looking at your investment income, to be talking about
Speaker 1: what are we both comfortable with and how do we
Speaker 1: want to approach investment. Yeah, and I appreciate their what
Speaker 1: to do first tip is learn need to know terminology.
Speaker 1: Because so Travis and I actually have this conversation this morning,
Speaker 1: if you can believe it. Yes, not because I had
Speaker 1: already read this article, but he had brought up somebody
Speaker 1: at his work um does stock trading, and he seemed
Speaker 1: really interested in trying it. And I know very little
Speaker 1: about stock trading. I'm very risk averse. I steer towards
Speaker 1: the riskiest index funds is kind of as far as
Speaker 1: I'll go. So I know the history of stock trading
Speaker 1: and penny stocks and stuff like that. So we had
Speaker 1: to do research on terminology and the things his friend
Speaker 1: had been talking about. UM. We needed to back it
Speaker 1: up with research and kind of take rub the shine
Speaker 1: off of all of the you know, shiny nous of
Speaker 1: what his coworker was talking about to kind of get
Speaker 1: down to the rawness of what it really was, and
Speaker 1: so um if that made any sense. So, it took
Speaker 1: a lot of of reading and research to to talk
Speaker 1: about this particular subject. To have an intelligent conversation about this,
Speaker 1: you've got to have a degree of understanding. You can't
Speaker 1: talk about something that neither one of you know about. Certainly,
Speaker 1: you can bring in experts, you can look to the internet,
Speaker 1: you can read reputable articles about this to be able
Speaker 1: to help inform yourself. But this that is part of
Speaker 1: the process and learning together. Woe how much more productive
Speaker 1: to be able to be on the same page as
Speaker 1: you're learning would be fantastic as well. So yes, agree
Speaker 1: with these I think I would definitely just us the
Speaker 1: the simple money conversations first. I definitely would not say
Speaker 1: jump to talking about investments if you don't know where
Speaker 1: your money is going. I think that even the order
Speaker 1: that the this article went in is fantastic because I
Speaker 1: think it's it's always just get back to the basics.
Speaker 1: We can make it so complicated, but if we get
Speaker 1: the foundations right in our conversations with these important people
Speaker 1: in our lives, then the rest will stack on top
Speaker 1: relatively nicely. Yes, Uh, this is a really great topic
Speaker 1: to be talking about a few days before Christmas, because
Speaker 1: I think these conversations to have with your kids are
Speaker 1: going to be um some some very timely conversations. Yeah.
Speaker 1: So it goes into this next portion of the important
Speaker 1: topics to talk about with your kids, and the first
Speaker 1: one is you don't need that new iPhone, you want it.
Speaker 1: It's it's the same old, same old. I remember this
Speaker 1: lesson being taught to me as a kid. The difference
Speaker 1: between need versus want and the definitions are vastly different
Speaker 1: between parents and children. Because for children, it's, yeah, I
Speaker 1: know that I don't need it, like I need food,
Speaker 1: but all the other kids have it, And how am
Speaker 1: I supposed to communicate? And my social life is going
Speaker 1: to go down the drain and whatever you fill in
Speaker 1: the blank. But being important to be aware of that mindset,
Speaker 1: like it's they're not just being like greedy spoiled brats,
Speaker 1: Like there's there's a mindset behind it. Yeah, it doesn't
Speaker 1: mean you give in. Seeking to understand your kid is fantastic,
Speaker 1: but helping them to recognize need versus want, and whether
Speaker 1: we're talking iPhone or something else, helping kids understand this
Speaker 1: will only set them up for a more beneficial financial
Speaker 1: lifestyle in the future, or to be able to differentiate,
Speaker 1: because right now, if you're buying it for them, it
Speaker 1: has far less value or weight to it than if
Speaker 1: they were to really understand what is the difference here
Speaker 1: or had some skin in the game, depending on their
Speaker 1: age of being able to identify, well, is this something
Speaker 1: that I actually want to be able to put money towards.
Speaker 1: So having these conversations of determining what's essential and what's
Speaker 1: not can help them to make those decisions as they
Speaker 1: move forward in life and avoid this nasty debt cycle,
Speaker 1: which is I think the fact that we have not
Speaker 1: gotten need versus want sussed out in our own lives
Speaker 1: is partly why we can experience such crushing debt. Yeah. Yeah,
Speaker 1: And I think if you are having a more frugal
Speaker 1: Christmas this year and not buying as many gifts, um,
Speaker 1: and your kids, you know, wake up Christmas morning, they're
Speaker 1: disappointed that they didn't get that toy or that electronic
Speaker 1: that they wanted. I think this is a great that's
Speaker 1: a great time to segue into a conversation like this.
Speaker 1: They say that you can bring it up by um,
Speaker 1: let's take a look at where the money goes is
Speaker 1: a good opener. So talking to kids about where your
Speaker 1: money goes and and all that stuff and bring them
Speaker 1: into the conversation. You don't need to let them know everything,
Speaker 1: but you can be open about it. More kids understand
Speaker 1: more than we give them credit for, even at a
Speaker 1: young age. And the next one is definitely for older kids.
Speaker 1: Um is, I'm giving you your first credit card. But
Speaker 1: so this is a touchy subject. I don't know if
Speaker 1: I would do it for everyone. I don't think every
Speaker 1: kid should have a credit card, but I mean I
Speaker 1: don't have at teenagers, so other people do give their
Speaker 1: kids credit cards to build credit. And definitely way in
Speaker 1: on this. But you know, when we talk about this
Speaker 1: in our Frugal Friends Facebook community group, you know it's
Speaker 1: really helpful to hear other people's perspectives on this. I
Speaker 1: am not so and this is where we talk about
Speaker 1: articles and our own viewpoints on this. I would be
Speaker 1: very hesitant for this one, to be honest, but it
Speaker 1: would be a good conversation to have. I agree that
Speaker 1: this is a good conversation of how do we handle
Speaker 1: credit cards or debit cards and spending and how do
Speaker 1: we approach this and what are the benefits and what
Speaker 1: are the potential pitfalls. I would more so steer towards
Speaker 1: debit card. And they're talking about when your kids are
Speaker 1: juniors or seniors in high school, I would steer more
Speaker 1: towards debit card, especially if they have a job. If
Speaker 1: they're going to be spending money, they should probably be
Speaker 1: earning money. So and certainly as a junior senior in college,
Speaker 1: you can have a job, you can get a part
Speaker 1: time after school, on the weekend, sporadic, whever you want
Speaker 1: to approach that job. And at that point, get a
Speaker 1: bank account, get a checkbook, get a debit card, and
Speaker 1: learn the hard way with real money, not the fake
Speaker 1: money that's on a credit card and they overdraft, they
Speaker 1: pay the fee that I don't. I don't know a
Speaker 1: better way to learn. To me, that seems more wise
Speaker 1: than credit card learning. To me, that's the next step.
Speaker 1: Start with debit cards, start with real money, and then
Speaker 1: graduate if that's the best route for each individual. Yeah,
Speaker 1: And honestly, for teenagers, I think when they're that young,
Speaker 1: they need to see cash in their hands. For the
Speaker 1: rest of their life, they're going to be paying electronically
Speaker 1: on their computer, on their phone, but for now, like
Speaker 1: when they're under your roof, having cash, paying with cash,
Speaker 1: seeing that when the money's gone, the money's gone, there's
Speaker 1: no there's no extension, that's just how much money there is.
Speaker 1: I think that is going to be a more powerful
Speaker 1: teaching tool than giving a teen a credit card that
Speaker 1: you are responsible for, because that's not always financially smart
Speaker 1: for you either. Um and and but the credit card
Speaker 1: conversation does need to happen before college because there are
Speaker 1: so many banks targeting college kids, and they will if
Speaker 1: if they're they don't know about credit cards, they'll get
Speaker 1: their own credit card and they'll max it out immediately
Speaker 1: as soon as they leave your house. I remember that
Speaker 1: experience being on college, my college campus. I remember that
Speaker 1: they had booths outside the dining hall with attractive people
Speaker 1: trying to get you to sign up for a credit card.
Speaker 1: And mommy and daddy aren't there to advise you on
Speaker 1: what you should or shouldn't do, and here they are
Speaker 1: telling you you've got a two fifty dollar limit and
Speaker 1: you can just sign up for it right now and
Speaker 1: get this piece of plastic and then be able to
Speaker 1: go buy what you want. And how incredibly dangerous so
Speaker 1: informing children about that while they're still in your home. Yes,
Speaker 1: have that conversation. And next another conversation have is speaking
Speaker 1: of college. Let's plan how best to pay for college.
Speaker 1: So this is a conversation that needs to happen, like
Speaker 1: before your kid graduates. It needs to start winning there
Speaker 1: in middle Yeah, sometimes it's like, oh, we'll figure it
Speaker 1: out as we go, and sometimes that works in other situations,
Speaker 1: but not when it comes to college. Uh So to
Speaker 1: be able to talk about and if you have college
Speaker 1: savings set aside, fantastic, but your kids should know about
Speaker 1: that of what are you willing to pay? What are
Speaker 1: the conditions of that? Have you set boundaries around that
Speaker 1: you're paying for their college? Is it dependent on them
Speaker 1: playing a sport or maintaining grades or however you want
Speaker 1: them to be approaching college If you're paying for part
Speaker 1: of that, this can also enter into all other types
Speaker 1: of boundary conversations. Or if you don't have money set aside, okay,
Speaker 1: the kid needs to know that. Do they need to
Speaker 1: start looking for work their freshman year of high school
Speaker 1: to start paying to maybe consider community college or start
Speaker 1: saving up. Maybe they want to take a gap year,
Speaker 1: whatever the case is, these are big decisions, yeah for
Speaker 1: young kids to be making, but all the better if
Speaker 1: parents are approaching these conversations with kids three to four
Speaker 1: years prior to that actually happening. And you can usually
Speaker 1: tell by the time a kid gets to high school
Speaker 1: whether they're going to want to go to college or
Speaker 1: they're going to want to do something else. So you
Speaker 1: don't have to College doesn't have to be the and
Speaker 1: all answer, like you can if you think that your
Speaker 1: kid might be better in a trade, then start bringing
Speaker 1: that up. Start bringing up different options to them. Say yeah,
Speaker 1: you have to finish high school, that's a non negotiable,
Speaker 1: but start opening their eyes to other things that they're
Speaker 1: traditional schooling might not open up to them and still
Speaker 1: figure out how to pay for it and what they
Speaker 1: can expect from you as their parents financially when they
Speaker 1: do graduate from high school. And what are the expectations.
Speaker 1: Do you want them to get out and get a
Speaker 1: full time job. Do you you anticipating they're going to college,
Speaker 1: you're anticipating their moving out? What all of these things
Speaker 1: are super important to have as the parent child relationship
Speaker 1: inevitably shifts. Yeah, So next is conversations to have with
Speaker 1: your parents this is when we talked about with Cameron Huddleson.
Speaker 1: But this is just a brief overview. Do you have
Speaker 1: enough to retire comfortably? And this is going to be
Speaker 1: a very touchy subject that your mom or dad will
Speaker 1: probably not want to have with you that or they're
Speaker 1: the type that's gonna be super open, is going to
Speaker 1: bring it up with you not wanting to hear it.
Speaker 1: But the holidays is definitely when you see parents. It's
Speaker 1: not often that we see Travis's parents, but the holidays
Speaker 1: is a time when we know we're going to see them,
Speaker 1: and so this is a time when we bring up like, so,
Speaker 1: how's how's your retirement, how are you on track with that?
Speaker 1: How many more years you planning on working? And and
Speaker 1: all that stuff. So this is a really good time
Speaker 1: to bring this up gently when when they're in good spirits. Yeah,
Speaker 1: after but still remembering the conversation though that that really
Speaker 1: happy to have to remember it. You record it. Yeah,
Speaker 1: they do have to remember. You have to remember it.
Speaker 1: The other important conversation to have is have you thought
Speaker 1: about long term care insurance? So the average cost for
Speaker 1: a private room in a nursing home can reach over
Speaker 1: ninety thousand dollars a year, so talking about insurance and
Speaker 1: prepping for this kind of thing can be a really
Speaker 1: helpful conversation. Again, I would strongly encourage to reference back
Speaker 1: to the Cameron Huddleston UH episode because we really dove
Speaker 1: into the specifics of what types of things should we
Speaker 1: be talking about, having power of attorney and all of
Speaker 1: these types of conversations, and especially I would say, the
Speaker 1: ones that impact you as an adult child. So while
Speaker 1: I agree with this conversation about retirement planning that it
Speaker 1: depends on the level of openness and desire to have
Speaker 1: these conversations with you as a child even though you
Speaker 1: are an adult. But where it impacts you and where
Speaker 1: you might need to step in and care and assist,
Speaker 1: these are where I would say especially crucial of who's
Speaker 1: going to help make these decisions? What if you are
Speaker 1: unable to how is this going to work out? Because
Speaker 1: far better to have that decided ahead of time, prior
Speaker 1: to when everybody is healthy, then when something unexpected happens
Speaker 1: and the court system takes over. Only only we've heard
Speaker 1: horror stories. Yeah, definitely, So those are the conversations to have.
Speaker 1: So let's talk about now how to have them. Our
Speaker 1: next article is from common ground dot org uh and
Speaker 1: it's just it's about ways to have healthy conversations in general.
Speaker 1: I don't think we have to keep it so specific
Speaker 1: with the money. I think we just need to have
Speaker 1: some topics that are good for general, general conversations which
Speaker 1: we can use these tools across the board, diving into
Speaker 1: finances and and practicing this discipline of talking about it
Speaker 1: helps us in so many other areas because it is
Speaker 1: an uncomfortable conversation. But the more that we get comfortable
Speaker 1: with it, the more we're able to offer dignity and
Speaker 1: value to the other person in these conversations, the better
Speaker 1: off we are. And being able to have other conversations
Speaker 1: like politics and religion and all these other topics they
Speaker 1: tell you not to talk about, you're going to be
Speaker 1: better able to do that without causing a fight, exactly.
Speaker 1: It doesn't have to go there. That doesn't mean that
Speaker 1: there's not going to be tension at times, but learning
Speaker 1: to navigate conflict is an important part of life because
Speaker 1: it's unavoidable. Right, So first tips are bringing up a
Speaker 1: difficult topic. So I'm Jill, I'm super interested to hear
Speaker 1: what you have to say. About all these because this
Speaker 1: is literally what you do for a living. You have
Speaker 1: difficult topics. So policies take us through. Yes, okay, I
Speaker 1: love what they have to say, so that it's a
Speaker 1: whole heading of how to bring up difficult topics. I
Speaker 1: love that they say, know what you want to communicate this.
Speaker 1: I can't stress this enough And it sounds so simplistic.
Speaker 1: But isn't that always where we need to focus in
Speaker 1: on is what's the simple, most basic thing? Because so
Speaker 1: often I hear people describe I want to say such
Speaker 1: and such, and I'm just going to bring up the topic.
Speaker 1: And then I'll ask, Okay, what's the purpose? What are
Speaker 1: you hoping to accomplish? And I tell you what people say,
Speaker 1: I don't know. I just want to bring it up
Speaker 1: and see where the conversation goes. It's like a mantra
Speaker 1: I hear over and over in my counseling office, and
Speaker 1: I'm just like, no, you're gonna walk into more than
Speaker 1: you bargained for, or you're gonna you're not gonna know
Speaker 1: where to go next or what to say, and it
Speaker 1: has the potential to blow up. Know your purpose? Why
Speaker 1: are you bringing it up? That can really help to
Speaker 1: even eliminate unnecessary conversations because if it's just I don't know,
Speaker 1: I just thought that would be a good topic. Well,
Speaker 1: if there's no purpose to it and you don't you're
Speaker 1: not anticipating getting anywhere with the conversation, then don't go
Speaker 1: into it. But if you can say, I want to
Speaker 1: bring up retirement with my parents because I think that
Speaker 1: this is a good time and I want to come
Speaker 1: up with a plan with them that is agreeable to
Speaker 1: both of us, fantastic. You've got a purpose and an
Speaker 1: end goal in mind. You've got the green light. If
Speaker 1: it's just like I don't know, we'll see where it goes.
Speaker 1: No red light, figure it out more before because because
Speaker 1: I think my parents are broke, I don't know. No,
Speaker 1: that's not a good purpose. The purpose has to be
Speaker 1: for you, like why do you why do they need
Speaker 1: to communicate this with you? Why is it important for
Speaker 1: you to have this conversation, because maybe somebody maybe they
Speaker 1: need to have it in general, but maybe it's with
Speaker 1: someone else so or or how does this benefit them too?
Speaker 1: And of course I'm hoping that as you're approaching this,
Speaker 1: it's out of a place of value and care for
Speaker 1: the other person, not just I just want to like
Speaker 1: dig into this topic because I know it's going to
Speaker 1: be uncomfortable. The other thing is to choose the space,
Speaker 1: choose the time, choose how you're going to approach it.
Speaker 1: I think that and I think I've brought this concept
Speaker 1: up in previous episodes, but it's worth repeating. Discovering the
Speaker 1: emotional and relational currency of the person that you're talking with,
Speaker 1: so being able to identify how do they want to
Speaker 1: be approached and approach them in that way. So is
Speaker 1: it over a nice meal, is it through a phone conversation,
Speaker 1: is it beginning with a written letter? Whatever it is,
Speaker 1: Identify what that is for this person and start there
Speaker 1: and then ease your way into the conversation. If you
Speaker 1: know that they're not a morning person, don't have the
Speaker 1: conversation in the morning. It sounds simple, but again, sometimes
Speaker 1: we just dive into these things at the worst possible time,
Speaker 1: and that does not pave the way for healthy conversation.
Speaker 1: So loved that anything that you wanted to say, Jen
Speaker 1: about bringing up a difficult topic before getting into the
Speaker 1: next category. The one thing that I really like is
Speaker 1: choose a quiet time and space. So that's where I
Speaker 1: imagine you'll definitely probably not want to choose Christmas Day.
Speaker 1: But if that's all you get, that's all you get.
Speaker 1: But find a quiet time and space within that, and
Speaker 1: I think that will be set a better foundation for
Speaker 1: getting your point across than maybe allowed or chaotic dinner
Speaker 1: or during cooking or when they have other things on
Speaker 1: their mind and stuff like that. Yeah. Absolutely, Again, that's
Speaker 1: kind of the emotional relational currency piece, and what's what's
Speaker 1: going to speak well and and yeah, giving them the
Speaker 1: value to have it not be chaotic or interrupted, depending
Speaker 1: on the level of importance of the conversation. And this
Speaker 1: goes I mean we're kind of alluding to this as
Speaker 1: if we're talking to parents, but this goes for spouses, kids,
Speaker 1: important people in our lives, anybody, any kind of difficult conversation.
Speaker 1: There may be people that have watched your debt free
Speaker 1: journey on Facebook or Instagram or know that you're paying
Speaker 1: off debt or becoming frugal, and they've seen your transformation
Speaker 1: and they will ask you about it. So this and
Speaker 1: this has happened to me um with friends and family,
Speaker 1: and and if you're doing this long enough, it will
Speaker 1: happen to you so we're we're assuming this is like
Speaker 1: difficult conversations that people don't want to have, But sometimes
Speaker 1: these are conversations people want to have too, and so
Speaker 1: I like this next section talks more about that. Yeah,
Speaker 1: so if somebody else is approaching you on something, somebody
Speaker 1: else wants to talk about a specific topic, that might
Speaker 1: be a touchy subject, and these are some important tips
Speaker 1: for how to respond in those situations. So first of all,
Speaker 1: of course, listen well, and what that means is being
Speaker 1: able to provide feedback, whether that's a head nod or
Speaker 1: a reflection back, just even a mirroring of what the
Speaker 1: person is saying, so you can make sure that you
Speaker 1: are understanding them, clarifying their questions so that you don't
Speaker 1: go off on some tangent that is not even related
Speaker 1: to what they're wanting to talk about, and being able
Speaker 1: to give them the floor as much as possible and
Speaker 1: really not interrupting even if there's something that you disagree
Speaker 1: with or they're bringing up something that's not true, let
Speaker 1: them finish and then say your piece. Uh, it can
Speaker 1: really help the conversation to go smoothly. The other one
Speaker 1: I like on here is to be aware of your
Speaker 1: body language, What is your body communicating to the person,
Speaker 1: and do you want that communication to be happening. If
Speaker 1: you want an eye roll, fine, let let the eyes roll.
Speaker 1: But if you're like, oh, no, I actually I don't
Speaker 1: want them to fully know all of my thoughts, then
Speaker 1: be aware of that because our bodies can say so much.
Speaker 1: A really good counseling tip on this one is to
Speaker 1: mirror whatever the other person's body is doing. So if
Speaker 1: the other person is crossing your legs, cross your legs,
Speaker 1: if they're leaning in, lean in, if they're if they're not,
Speaker 1: they're more in a more relaxed position, mirror that. That
Speaker 1: can really help to communicate subconsciously that you're kind of
Speaker 1: you're listening, you're you're on the same page as them.
Speaker 1: Doesn't necessarily mean that you're agreeing, but it does something
Speaker 1: subconsciously to us. When we're able to kind of mirror
Speaker 1: body language, that is phenomenal in the verbal conversation that's happening.
Speaker 1: I never knew that. That's a great, great concept. You're welcome. Also,
Speaker 1: something else that I like on this list is acknowledging
Speaker 1: the person. Holy moly, And so if I can tease
Speaker 1: this apart a bit. What that means is acknowledge the
Speaker 1: person that's in front of you, the human that's in
Speaker 1: front of you, rather than necessarily the topic, particularly if
Speaker 1: it's something that has points of disagreement or difficulty. Being
Speaker 1: able to add value to the person that's in front
Speaker 1: of you in whatever way that means, whether that's a
Speaker 1: simple compliment or something that you've noticed about the person,
Speaker 1: or affirming them, or acknowledging the emotions that they're expressing.
Speaker 1: That doesn't mean that you have to give up your position,
Speaker 1: but being able to acknowledge the person can bear so
Speaker 1: much weight in again easing a potential uh fiery situation. Yes, yes,
Speaker 1: money is such a fragile topic. It can be very
Speaker 1: charged with emotions and guilt and shame and despair and depression, anxiety.
Speaker 1: There can be a lot of darkness. Even if somebody
Speaker 1: on the surface is very happy and light and joking
Speaker 1: about it, there can still be a lot of of darkness, uh,
Speaker 1: in somebody, So be aware of that when you're talking
Speaker 1: to them and knowing even if they seem okay, always
Speaker 1: just assume that it's a sensitive subject, and I think
Speaker 1: you will be able to help the person that you're
Speaker 1: talking to more by approaching it that way. And holy moly,
Speaker 1: avoid lecturing. If you are hearing yourself talk for a
Speaker 1: long period of time, it's probably time to kind of
Speaker 1: just like reel it in too much. Yeah, most people
Speaker 1: are not asking for a lecture, so be aware of that.
Speaker 1: Don't do it. Just don't, just just don't. Yeah. I
Speaker 1: like these last four points at the end of the article.
Speaker 1: So the first one is avoid lecturing. Second is manage
Speaker 1: your own emotions. So if you are angry, worried, or
Speaker 1: stress like, calm yourself down first and and then go uh.
Speaker 1: The third one is APOLOGI eyes and mean it. So
Speaker 1: if for some reason you've played a part in um,
Speaker 1: this person's like financial struggle or worry or whatever. Uh,
Speaker 1: then an apologize and mean it um. And then the
Speaker 1: last one is respect their privacy. Money is super private. UM.
Speaker 1: So if they don't want to open up to you
Speaker 1: about stuff like that, Um, you can still have these
Speaker 1: conversations without injecting yourself in their in their private matters.
Speaker 1: And then you learn a boundary and you can if
Speaker 1: this is somebody who you you do need to have
Speaker 1: these conversations. Let's say it's a spouse, but they still
Speaker 1: really don't want to go there. Then you learn a
Speaker 1: boundary for them, and you know, maybe a lighter topic
Speaker 1: that you can explore next time. So, okay, that one
Speaker 1: was too far. They're not ready for that conversation. But
Speaker 1: how do they feel about talking about just groceries maybe,
Speaker 1: or just clothing next time or whatever the cases? Kind
Speaker 1: of pick a less contiversial topic and and begin to
Speaker 1: then work more towards the conversation that you need to have.
Speaker 1: Mm hmm. And you know what else we should work
Speaker 1: more towards the best time of the week. It's time
Speaker 1: for the bill of the week. That's right, it's time
Speaker 1: for the best minute of your entire week. Maybe a
Speaker 1: baby was born and his name is William. Maybe you
Speaker 1: paid off your mortgage. Maybe your car died and you're
Speaker 1: happy to not have to pay that bill anymore. That
Speaker 1: bill Buffalo Bills, Bill Clinton, this is the bill of
Speaker 1: the week, high ladies, So I have a double bill
Speaker 1: of the week for you, or like a bill that
Speaker 1: led to Mr Bill which led to no bill at all.
Speaker 1: So my beautiful ten year old car is coming up
Speaker 1: on a lovely major maintenance. It's a kind that if
Speaker 1: I don't do it, my whope, car won't blew up
Speaker 1: the timing belt, but if I do do it, it
Speaker 1: will cost me eleven dollars and I decided I didn't
Speaker 1: want to pay that. So after a lot of research
Speaker 1: and a lot of phone calls, I found that my
Speaker 1: Vocal Community College has an automotive program and they will
Speaker 1: prepare my cars more three And you'll never guess what
Speaker 1: this characters saying is. Wait, yes you can be scause
Speaker 1: his name is Bill and he is awesome and funny.
Speaker 1: They're replacing my time belts for free. It helped me
Speaker 1: a lot about car maintenance. The I y car maintenance,
Speaker 1: so super great. Now I have a cool Jill Bill
Speaker 1: and no car Bill. All right, have a great week, ladies.
Speaker 1: That awesome. I that you were just overjoyed when all
Speaker 1: of this happened. And then to realize that you can
Speaker 1: report this amazing experience with your double Bill. I'm so
Speaker 1: excited to meet Bills these days. But how amazing. We
Speaker 1: talked about this in a previous Bill like somebody going
Speaker 1: to vocational school for something else, but oh my goodness,
Speaker 1: for for repairs of your vehicle, and then for Bill
Speaker 1: to be the instructor. It's just like amazing on top
Speaker 1: of amazing, on top of amazing. Oh my gosh, thank
Speaker 1: you so much, Kelly. That was a fantastic bill. It
Speaker 1: combined our two favorite bills, a bill that you didn't
Speaker 1: have to pay and a guy named Bill. And like,
Speaker 1: I can't think of a better bill than a double
Speaker 1: bill like that. Unless you have one for us anybody
Speaker 1: else out there, I'd love to hear it. Good Segway,
Speaker 1: leave us a bill by visiting Frugal Friends podcast dot
Speaker 1: com slash bill. We are so excited for all that
Speaker 1: you guys are experiencing in your lives. Share it with us, please, yes, yes,
Speaker 1: and now it's time for the goodness. Jill knows how
Speaker 1: that makes me feel. And it doesn't sound any better
Speaker 1: in a whisper, Yeah, especially because I can whisper in
Speaker 1: a deep voice. You can perfect, you can, Yeah, I
Speaker 1: did it. So this lightning round, we are talking about
Speaker 1: how we talk about money with our families. We're going
Speaker 1: to just give you a little inside peek to how
Speaker 1: we personally deal with that. We're not going to talk
Speaker 1: about children because Jill don't have no kids, Kai doesn't
Speaker 1: understand the concert money yet, but we will talk about
Speaker 1: our spouses and our families. Yeah, so I'll start me
Speaker 1: and my spouse Eric, you know him. Well, let's see,
Speaker 1: I do our budget weekly and I just kind of
Speaker 1: fell into that role. But we do talk about it.
Speaker 1: We like how that, how that has landed. So as
Speaker 1: I do what did I say, bi weekly, not weekly
Speaker 1: every other week, two times a month when we get paid,
Speaker 1: that's when I do our budget. And as things come
Speaker 1: up within that process, I bring them up to Eric.
Speaker 1: I'm not saying it's the best way to do it.
Speaker 1: It works for us for now. I hear about these
Speaker 1: people who do these like monthly sit down meetings, and
Speaker 1: sometimes I'll tell him we need to have a business
Speaker 1: meeting and he hates how that sounds, but I forced
Speaker 1: him to do it anyhow, and that's how we talk
Speaker 1: about it. I think ultimately he's just grateful that I
Speaker 1: am staying on top of most of it. That it
Speaker 1: helps for him to know, all right, I've done the
Speaker 1: bulk of it. I'm bringing solutions to the table, but
Speaker 1: I want his input. I'm curious about his opinion, and
Speaker 1: he is good at giving that to me. He's also
Speaker 1: really good at really procrastinating the conversation and delaying it
Speaker 1: by like cracking tons of jokes where I eventually just
Speaker 1: have to be like okay, no, like we're we're honestly
Speaker 1: talking about this, Like what what do you think I
Speaker 1: can see that. I can see that happening. Yeah, because
Speaker 1: when I use the word business meeting or like homework,
Speaker 1: it sets him off like an eight year old boy
Speaker 1: that that still lives inside of him. But but we
Speaker 1: get there and that's not He's not um ignorant to
Speaker 1: finances and there's different roles that he takes on also.
Speaker 1: But I do think the fact that I am curious
Speaker 1: about his opinion, I desire that I want to make
Speaker 1: a big, important decisions together. Um. I think that speaks
Speaker 1: value to him. I don't know. He can insert his
Speaker 1: voice here as he edits if that's true. And someday
Speaker 1: we do have to have Eric and Travis on the podcast.
Speaker 1: I know that's going to do. UM. So that's how
Speaker 1: we approach it at this point. It works for us
Speaker 1: in this season. UM. I'll keep you posted if we
Speaker 1: end up doing you know, our monthly meetings. But so
Speaker 1: far it works as is. How about you, Jen? So, UM,
Speaker 1: I will say when we got married, we did know
Speaker 1: how much debt we were in and we did have
Speaker 1: we did want to pay it off, but that initially
Speaker 1: was not the case because I had um fifty thousand
Speaker 1: dollars of just student loan debt plus a car bill,
Speaker 1: and I made about thirty five thousand dollars um and
Speaker 1: he was unemployed and had about twenty four thousand dollars,
Speaker 1: so he had half as much less than half of
Speaker 1: the debt I had, and he was really adamant about
Speaker 1: wanting to pay it off, and I was really scared
Speaker 1: about what that would mean for my life if we
Speaker 1: chose to do that, and because I was so excited
Speaker 1: to be I, you know, thought I was in the
Speaker 1: best point of my life in my twenties, so I
Speaker 1: really didn't want to ruin that by trying to be
Speaker 1: financially smart. And we talked about this in our like
Speaker 1: finding Your Why episode, but it really took finding my why,
Speaker 1: like my bigger why for life. And Travis was a
Speaker 1: pro at bringing that up. He didn't bring up numbers
Speaker 1: because he's not like a numbers guy, but he's definitely
Speaker 1: of feelings and you know, speak to your soul kind
Speaker 1: of person, and he made me realize I could do
Speaker 1: the things that I wanted to do in my life
Speaker 1: if we were debt free, So not being debt free
Speaker 1: for the sake of not having debt, but doing it
Speaker 1: for UM to better our lives and to have have
Speaker 1: tangible plan for what I wanted to do with my life.
Speaker 1: So that was a really great way that Travis has
Speaker 1: talked to me about finances. And now that I have
Speaker 1: taken it to the extreme, like I do with everything
Speaker 1: and write about personal finance for a living, I do
Speaker 1: most of the budgeting and the nerdy, the number stuff.
Speaker 1: So I plan our our mortgage like pre payments or
Speaker 1: like extra payments for that UM, and our retirement investing
Speaker 1: and the index funds that we choose, the hs A investments,
Speaker 1: all those the percentages we put towards all that, and
Speaker 1: then I just come to him and be like, hey,
Speaker 1: this is what we're doing, and he's like cool. I
Speaker 1: make the budgets and show him and he's like cool.
Speaker 1: So that's kind of how we do things now. Yeah,
Speaker 1: And I think Dave Ramsey, I mean, it sounds like
Speaker 1: how we approach it and the rules is very similar
Speaker 1: between you and I, Jen, and I will say that
Speaker 1: Dave Ramsey was helpful for this in our early years
Speaker 1: of marriage in identifying, Hey, there's probably one of you
Speaker 1: who's a bit more apt to be the budget person,
Speaker 1: like the one with the pencil and putting things on paper.
Speaker 1: That's not to say I mean I'm not type A,
Speaker 1: but I do enjoy this a bit more than Eric does.
Speaker 1: So I am happy for that to fall to me.
Speaker 1: But the other person, maybe more the the spender of
Speaker 1: the couple, must still have a role in that process.
Speaker 1: So inviting in not doing this thing solo, hearing their
Speaker 1: perspective and allowing them to have an eraser, right like
Speaker 1: the figurative eraser, to make changes if needed, or to disagree,
Speaker 1: and to negotiate on what it looks like. That just
Speaker 1: because you've put in some of the legwork of figuring
Speaker 1: it out doesn't mean that it can't be shifted depending
Speaker 1: on the needs of the other person. So I think
Speaker 1: that's the big guess part of this that sure, divide
Speaker 1: and conquer have different roles, but bring each other into
Speaker 1: that process and give some power and authority into each
Speaker 1: of these places and negotiate with one another. Yes, definitely.
Speaker 1: So how about the rest of your family, Jill, how
Speaker 1: you talk to them? Yeah? So this is UM. I'm
Speaker 1: going to try and make this as short and sweet
Speaker 1: as possible. My family, my parents at least, are relatively
Speaker 1: private about their finances and always have them. I think
Speaker 1: growing up this is something that they wanted to shield
Speaker 1: us from. Um. Things were not always super easy for
Speaker 1: my parents financially. They provided us with a fantastic life
Speaker 1: that I'm very grateful for. But um, I think in
Speaker 1: a lot of ways, they wanted us to be kids,
Speaker 1: and they wanted to carry the weight of financial responsibility
Speaker 1: and worry and concern. They didn't want us to hold
Speaker 1: those concerns, which I respect a lot of that of
Speaker 1: what they chose in their like parenting of young children.
Speaker 1: I do think some of that has carried over now
Speaker 1: even as we are adult children now where there is privacy,
Speaker 1: they don't want us to have those degrees of concern
Speaker 1: um for them or maybe even involvement. So I want
Speaker 1: to respect that and and different levels of privacy that
Speaker 1: people have with their finances and recognize what my role
Speaker 1: is as an adult child, that there might be other
Speaker 1: people who would speak into that with my parents or
Speaker 1: dialogue with them about that. You know, I know that
Speaker 1: they've spoken with financial advisors and they've got other people
Speaker 1: in their lives, um and their own wisdom, so this
Speaker 1: is not something that I cross into too often. I
Speaker 1: will say that the podcast has opened more doors for discussion.
Speaker 1: I would say that the Cameron Huddleston podcast episode that
Speaker 1: we did absolutely open the door to conversation with my
Speaker 1: mom that is still evolving. And I think that's an
Speaker 1: important thing to note about this, that we may open
Speaker 1: a door or a window to a conversation, but that
Speaker 1: doesn't mean the whole conversation happens. It is kind of
Speaker 1: even a journey. So the sooner you can start that journey,
Speaker 1: the better. Um. So I would imagine that there are
Speaker 1: more conversations to be had, particularly regarding how my parents
Speaker 1: financial situation might impact me. The things that I'm not
Speaker 1: impacted by where they don't want to share, that's fine,
Speaker 1: but as we talk about long term life insurance or
Speaker 1: planning in in emergencies or power of attorney, Yeah, the
Speaker 1: door has been opened there. And I think podcasts, books
Speaker 1: read coming from a place of concern seeing these things
Speaker 1: happen between my mom and her mom and the things
Speaker 1: that she's walking through. You know, just organic life circumstances
Speaker 1: have opened the door for appropriate conversation. So that's kind
Speaker 1: of where I'm at. Yeah, I think that's where most
Speaker 1: people will be at. Honestly, I think my story is
Speaker 1: definitely an outlier. Um my mom would not talk to
Speaker 1: me about her finances and uh was eventually sent to
Speaker 1: foreclosure and kicked out of her house, all within me
Speaker 1: finding out, all within like a few months of us
Speaker 1: talking about things. And so she's doing a lot better.
Speaker 1: And I think the lesson that I could share would
Speaker 1: not be how to have conversations with parents, because I
Speaker 1: think that I did those things. I think I did
Speaker 1: that really wrong. I think I should have had more
Speaker 1: of the mindset that I'm opening a door and to
Speaker 1: not force or push or judge. Um. So I hear
Speaker 1: a lot of these suggestions in my and in my
Speaker 1: head I'm saying yes, yes, yes, because um, I think
Speaker 1: I pushed my mom away by pushing too hard, and
Speaker 1: she was seeing us pay off our debt and make
Speaker 1: these wise decisions, and I wanted the best for her,
Speaker 1: but my words didn't convey that, and and I regret that.
Speaker 1: And it's not to say that if I had had
Speaker 1: better words that she would have opened up. There's nothing
Speaker 1: that could have changed um the end result of what happened,
Speaker 1: but I could have felt better about it if I
Speaker 1: had been better at the conversations. And even now to
Speaker 1: this day, it's been several years, I still catch myself
Speaker 1: being judgmental um and being stuck in the past with
Speaker 1: her past decisions and letting that influence how I speak
Speaker 1: to her today. So also not letting the past judge
Speaker 1: your present conversations is another thing out which we're not
Speaker 1: perfect at this and we don't know what we don't know,
Speaker 1: and we're all in our own journey, So we're going
Speaker 1: to bring our own perspectives to the table so we
Speaker 1: can have grace on ourselves and absolutely on other people.
Speaker 1: But I think what you're saying there, Jen, is even
Speaker 1: am I the right person to have this conversation? That
Speaker 1: I may see something? But is it my role my responsibility?
Speaker 1: Do I have the emotional relational currency with this person
Speaker 1: to have this conversation? Is it better to wait? Is
Speaker 1: it better for somebody else to have this conversation? Like, Yeah,
Speaker 1: what's my motive in it? What's my purpose? What am
Speaker 1: I hoping to accomplish? Um? And does this conversation really
Speaker 1: need to happen. So yeah, So we hope that helps
Speaker 1: you have conversations with your family this holiday season and
Speaker 1: beyond and make the year or you are having those
Speaker 1: healthy conversations with people about money and breaking the stigma
Speaker 1: of about money talk. We think money should be talked
Speaker 1: about um way more openly than it is and we
Speaker 1: and we hope that you will set a precedent for
Speaker 1: having those positive money conversations. Boom. More ways to set
Speaker 1: good precedents with finances is through our book club. So
Speaker 1: we are reading Jen's book, So excited about this. Pay
Speaker 1: off your debt for good for book club this month,
Speaker 1: so support your own you guys, get checked out this book.
Speaker 1: Thank you so And if you've listened to this far
Speaker 1: and you have not turned off the podcast because we
Speaker 1: say the same thing at the outro every week, I'm
Speaker 1: going to reward you with a special treat. And we've
Speaker 1: never done this before, we will never do this again.
Speaker 1: If you are listening to this podcast the day it
Speaker 1: comes out a December nineteen, if you leave a review
Speaker 1: for the podcast on iTunes or Stitcher, screenshot the review
Speaker 1: and send it to Frugal Friends Podcast at gmail dot com.
Speaker 1: Every single review we get through the end of next week,
Speaker 1: so until the next episode comes out, We'll get a
Speaker 1: free copy of the audio book version of my new
Speaker 1: book every single review. So if you do this, you
Speaker 1: will get a free audio book every single review that
Speaker 1: gets submitted an emailed. So that is the key submitted
Speaker 1: and emailed to us this week. Do the review and
Speaker 1: then email it and you got yourself free audio version.
Speaker 1: More gen in your ears? Who doesn't want more more
Speaker 1: of me? Because I narrated the book. So if you
Speaker 1: like the way I sound, leave a review. Awesome And
Speaker 1: here's an example of a review. This one comes from
Speaker 1: Jordan's and he or she says, awesome, relatable and informative podcast.
Speaker 1: I found this podcast a few months ago and immediately
Speaker 1: loved it. Jen and Jill are extremely relatable and you
Speaker 1: feel like you're one of their friends and their conversations.
Speaker 1: They give great advice and have great stories. I listen
Speaker 1: to all the episodes and have started again from the beginning.
Speaker 1: This podcast is a must listen to anyone interested in
Speaker 1: personal finance. Thank you Jen and Jill for all you
Speaker 1: share than Jordan's that's amazing. Sweet you've started over. I've
Speaker 1: only done that with the office episodes they're like actually
Speaker 1: in Parks and Rec. I don't know the only ones
Speaker 1: that I friends like watch over against Wow, in my mind,
Speaker 1: you've just told me that I'm on par with the
Speaker 1: Office and Parks and Rex. So thank you for that.
Speaker 1: M bless you, bless you. So if you have love
Speaker 1: for the podcast and you want to leave a helpful review,
Speaker 1: please do that. Or if you love audio books, please
Speaker 1: leave a helpful review and you can get one until
Speaker 1: next week. Happy Viewing Herugal Friends is produced, edited and
Speaker 1: mixed by Eric Syria. Who yep, what're you doing for Christmas?
Speaker 1: Oh gosh, I don't know. Well, I'm probably home in
Speaker 1: my trailer and I don't know. Hopefully we're not giving
Speaker 1: many gifts. That's yet to be determined as of one
Speaker 1: this is being recorded. Um, I will say we have
Speaker 1: one tradition that we do love it. Um we did
Speaker 1: it our very first year of marriage. So now we
Speaker 1: will actually do this tradition more times than we have
Speaker 1: celebrated our anniversary. Anyhow, the eighth year, we have a
Speaker 1: get together with our friends Kevin and Chelsea on Christmas
Speaker 1: Eve Eve, so December we get together. We eat all
Speaker 1: the food, all the junk, food. It's different every year,
Speaker 1: but it's always just like amazing trash food and we
Speaker 1: have a sleepover and then we go to the diner
Speaker 1: down the road for breakfast on Christmas Eve. Yeah, they
Speaker 1: just had twins this year, so now they've got three kids,
Speaker 1: and I'm like, this better not interrupt Christmas Eve eve
Speaker 1: and they're like it won't. It definitely won't. Nothing interrupts
Speaker 1: Christmas Eve Eve. The twins will be three months by then. Gosh,
Speaker 1: that's doable. Yeah, they're fine, they're like tiny adults. What
Speaker 1: are you doing? Um, So it's gonna be Kai's first Christmas. Um,
Speaker 1: he's uh, will be seven months old on Christmas and
Speaker 1: he loves to grab things, so maybe he'll unwrap a
Speaker 1: gift or two. I don't think we're getting him anything.
Speaker 1: I haven't gotten him anything yet, Grandma about babies, you
Speaker 1: don't have to for like Grandma, Yeah, um, I think
Speaker 1: my Christmas tradition will to not not be getting my
Speaker 1: kids anything for Christmas and just letting Grandma's do It's
Speaker 1: they won't know any different. Nope, they wouldn't have any expectations.
Speaker 1: Just give him a good cookie and he'll love you.
Speaker 1: Give me a good cookie. That's it, that's it, and
Speaker 1: that's all merry, merry Christmas.