1 00:00:00,400 --> 00:00:04,160 Speaker 1: Why from our nation's camel President Joe Biden's one point 2 00:00:04,280 --> 00:00:07,680 Speaker 1: nine trillion dollar pandemic relief package. We're not going to 3 00:00:07,800 --> 00:00:10,160 Speaker 1: hear any more about Operation Warp Speed. They're gonna be 4 00:00:10,160 --> 00:00:13,400 Speaker 1: calling it the COVID response. We're talking right now about 5 00:00:14,000 --> 00:00:18,960 Speaker 1: Jockey and amongst Republicans, Bloomberg Sound On, the insiders, the influencers, 6 00:00:19,000 --> 00:00:22,360 Speaker 1: the inside. Biding has promised again and again that able 7 00:00:22,400 --> 00:00:25,680 Speaker 1: to unite the country. Who do you think Biden has 8 00:00:25,760 --> 00:00:28,720 Speaker 1: to watch in terms of moderate defectors. The House has 9 00:00:28,720 --> 00:00:32,080 Speaker 1: been voting for this stimulus package basically for months. This 10 00:00:32,640 --> 00:00:37,080 Speaker 1: is Bloomberg Sound On with Kevin Surreley on Bloomberg Radio, 11 00:00:38,400 --> 00:00:42,560 Speaker 1: and I'm Janie Schanzano in for Kevin Sirelli this snowy afternoon, 12 00:00:42,640 --> 00:00:45,839 Speaker 1: and joining me today is Bloomberg contributor Rick Davis. And 13 00:00:45,920 --> 00:00:48,080 Speaker 1: later we're going to talk to Norm Champ about the 14 00:00:48,080 --> 00:00:51,280 Speaker 1: game stops saga, which doesn't seem to stop at this point, 15 00:00:51,320 --> 00:00:55,280 Speaker 1: and the SEC enforcement going forward. Some good news about 16 00:00:55,320 --> 00:00:57,680 Speaker 1: the vaccine We're going to talk more about that later 17 00:00:57,840 --> 00:01:00,440 Speaker 1: or the number of vaccinated, I should say, but a 18 00:01:00,480 --> 00:01:03,560 Speaker 1: lot to get to this afternoon. As over the weekend, 19 00:01:03,600 --> 00:01:07,360 Speaker 1: a group of ten moderate Republican senators pitched a smaller 20 00:01:07,520 --> 00:01:11,720 Speaker 1: counter offer to the President's COVID relief pack a package. Rather, 21 00:01:11,959 --> 00:01:14,759 Speaker 1: their point was to stop the Democrats from using a 22 00:01:14,800 --> 00:01:20,000 Speaker 1: reconciliation process to push the package through without any bipartisan support. 23 00:01:20,440 --> 00:01:24,200 Speaker 1: Of course, their proposal was about six hundred billion, that's 24 00:01:24,240 --> 00:01:27,039 Speaker 1: about a third of what the President was offering at 25 00:01:27,040 --> 00:01:30,640 Speaker 1: one point nine trillion, And based on the reactions of 26 00:01:30,680 --> 00:01:34,280 Speaker 1: Democrats over the weekend and into Monday, it appears that 27 00:01:34,319 --> 00:01:37,639 Speaker 1: we're going to see a continuing standoff on this issue 28 00:01:37,720 --> 00:01:42,039 Speaker 1: this week, Democrats continuing to threaten to use reconciliation and 29 00:01:42,080 --> 00:01:44,759 Speaker 1: their majority vote to push the bill through without any 30 00:01:44,800 --> 00:01:48,160 Speaker 1: GOP support. We heard more about this during a press 31 00:01:48,200 --> 00:01:52,720 Speaker 1: conference on Sunday. Senator Senate majority leader Chuck Schumer said 32 00:01:52,760 --> 00:01:55,480 Speaker 1: that the states are no longer able to wait for 33 00:01:55,560 --> 00:01:58,800 Speaker 1: Republicans to put forward a new plan or to come 34 00:01:58,840 --> 00:02:01,880 Speaker 1: to the table, and he said time is running out 35 00:02:02,040 --> 00:02:05,240 Speaker 1: and they need to move forward. We have sound on that. 36 00:02:06,080 --> 00:02:09,240 Speaker 1: We hope that we can move forward in a bipartisan 37 00:02:09,280 --> 00:02:13,160 Speaker 1: way with our Republican colleagues cooperating, but we need big, 38 00:02:13,160 --> 00:02:17,359 Speaker 1: bold action, and if we can't move forward with them, 39 00:02:17,480 --> 00:02:21,000 Speaker 1: We'll have to do it on our own. Also over 40 00:02:21,040 --> 00:02:25,840 Speaker 1: the weekend, Senator Bernie Sandlers told ABC's Martha at It's 41 00:02:26,240 --> 00:02:29,760 Speaker 1: that the dire need for the American people to this 42 00:02:29,880 --> 00:02:32,720 Speaker 1: issue to be addressed for the American people eclipsed the 43 00:02:32,760 --> 00:02:37,000 Speaker 1: appeal of extensive bipartisan grappling. We have sound on that. 44 00:02:37,560 --> 00:02:41,880 Speaker 1: The issue is not, you know, bipartisanship whatnot. The issue 45 00:02:42,200 --> 00:02:46,320 Speaker 1: is are we going to address the incredible set of 46 00:02:46,400 --> 00:02:49,680 Speaker 1: crises and the pain and the anxiety which is in 47 00:02:49,760 --> 00:02:54,520 Speaker 1: this country and joining me to talk about how we 48 00:02:54,560 --> 00:02:57,040 Speaker 1: are going to see this, if at all move through 49 00:02:57,120 --> 00:03:00,080 Speaker 1: this week because of course next week starts the sun 50 00:03:00,120 --> 00:03:04,480 Speaker 1: impeachment trial. We have Rick Davis Bloomberg, contributor partner at 51 00:03:04,480 --> 00:03:08,160 Speaker 1: Stone Court Capital, former campaign manager for John McCain's two 52 00:03:08,200 --> 00:03:12,760 Speaker 1: thousand and eight presidential campaign, and also former Alaska Senator 53 00:03:13,120 --> 00:03:19,320 Speaker 1: Mark Beget, strategic consulting advisor at Brown's Brownstein Hyatt, Fay Barber, 54 00:03:19,440 --> 00:03:21,920 Speaker 1: and Shrek. I hope, I hope Mark, Senator, that I 55 00:03:21,960 --> 00:03:25,720 Speaker 1: got that? All right? UM, welcome and thank you for 56 00:03:25,840 --> 00:03:30,840 Speaker 1: joining us. Rick. Let me start with you and ask 57 00:03:30,919 --> 00:03:34,360 Speaker 1: you what you make of the Republicans proposal This proposal 58 00:03:34,440 --> 00:03:38,240 Speaker 1: from these ten moderate Republicans over the weekend. Well, you know, 59 00:03:38,280 --> 00:03:40,680 Speaker 1: President Biden swung the door open and said, hey, I 60 00:03:40,720 --> 00:03:43,840 Speaker 1: want to bipartisan bill. Uh and I you know, the 61 00:03:43,920 --> 00:03:48,160 Speaker 1: message to Republicans was, well, then you're not serious about 62 00:03:48,160 --> 00:03:50,800 Speaker 1: the one point nine trillion that you've put on the table, 63 00:03:51,280 --> 00:03:53,520 Speaker 1: because there's no way you're going to get a bipartisan 64 00:03:53,800 --> 00:03:56,960 Speaker 1: yes on that. So they came up with their own strategy, 65 00:03:57,080 --> 00:03:59,520 Speaker 1: you know, and they want to be positive about something. 66 00:03:59,680 --> 00:04:03,040 Speaker 1: It's not the old Republican party in the Biden or 67 00:04:03,040 --> 00:04:05,840 Speaker 1: in the Obama administration, where it was no to everything 68 00:04:06,200 --> 00:04:09,520 Speaker 1: and uh. And so they took out you know, the 69 00:04:09,560 --> 00:04:12,320 Speaker 1: increase in minimum wage, and they took out state and 70 00:04:12,400 --> 00:04:16,880 Speaker 1: local support. Uh and and so that's they're starting in position. 71 00:04:17,000 --> 00:04:20,320 Speaker 1: So the good news is, uh, we're in an environment 72 00:04:20,360 --> 00:04:22,800 Speaker 1: now so different than we were even you know, six 73 00:04:22,839 --> 00:04:25,800 Speaker 1: months ago where Republicans are actually invited up to the 74 00:04:25,839 --> 00:04:28,440 Speaker 1: White House. Democrats would not have been invited up to 75 00:04:28,480 --> 00:04:31,320 Speaker 1: the White House in the last term. And uh. And 76 00:04:31,480 --> 00:04:35,200 Speaker 1: there might actually be a constructive dialogue. It may ultimately 77 00:04:35,640 --> 00:04:38,400 Speaker 1: turn out to be politics, but at least we're starting 78 00:04:38,400 --> 00:04:41,480 Speaker 1: in the right place. Senator let me ask you. The 79 00:04:41,800 --> 00:04:45,640 Speaker 1: Biden administration has so far been reluctant to split this 80 00:04:45,720 --> 00:04:48,919 Speaker 1: bill into two, to handle say, the vaccines and virus 81 00:04:48,960 --> 00:04:52,360 Speaker 1: in one part and then other priorities in a separate piece. 82 00:04:52,839 --> 00:04:58,039 Speaker 1: Do you see that changing as we move forward. I don't, 83 00:04:58,080 --> 00:05:01,520 Speaker 1: and I think, um the reason a simple uh my 84 00:05:01,680 --> 00:05:04,960 Speaker 1: time there when you take the most popular item, which 85 00:05:05,040 --> 00:05:07,800 Speaker 1: is dealing with the vaccine out, and some of the 86 00:05:07,800 --> 00:05:12,119 Speaker 1: other items may not happen or will fall off later 87 00:05:12,200 --> 00:05:13,800 Speaker 1: on in the sense that they won't deal with it. 88 00:05:13,839 --> 00:05:15,960 Speaker 1: But I will say that, you know, I looked at 89 00:05:15,960 --> 00:05:20,000 Speaker 1: the Republican plan and I and you know what's not 90 00:05:20,200 --> 00:05:24,559 Speaker 1: unique about this. Every time they've done a COVID plan, 91 00:05:24,920 --> 00:05:28,800 Speaker 1: there's always been the other plan, the lower value plan against. 92 00:05:29,120 --> 00:05:31,760 Speaker 1: You know, there's a Republican number and then a Democratic number. Well, 93 00:05:31,800 --> 00:05:34,120 Speaker 1: now you have it again. And what's probably gonna happen 94 00:05:34,120 --> 00:05:38,359 Speaker 1: is they're gonna build up, not down from the Republican number. 95 00:05:38,760 --> 00:05:40,720 Speaker 1: Will they get to the one point nine and try 96 00:05:40,760 --> 00:05:43,000 Speaker 1: to get by person? I'm not sure about that. I 97 00:05:43,000 --> 00:05:46,440 Speaker 1: think there are Democrats are very clear that they're not 98 00:05:46,520 --> 00:05:49,800 Speaker 1: going to be patient as they learned, and I was 99 00:05:49,839 --> 00:05:53,000 Speaker 1: there during the healthcare debate waiting six seven months because 100 00:05:53,040 --> 00:05:55,640 Speaker 1: the Republicans would say open over, you know, we'll work 101 00:05:55,680 --> 00:05:58,960 Speaker 1: with you, than they never did. So I think what's 102 00:05:59,000 --> 00:06:02,839 Speaker 1: going to happen. My tells me, Um, they'll if necessary, 103 00:06:02,880 --> 00:06:06,320 Speaker 1: they'll use reconciliation. But there's a couple of pieces of 104 00:06:06,320 --> 00:06:09,159 Speaker 1: the Republican plan that I know several of the more 105 00:06:09,279 --> 00:06:13,000 Speaker 1: moderate Democrats have interested, and that is the way they've 106 00:06:13,080 --> 00:06:16,599 Speaker 1: scaled the direct payment to those that are truly in 107 00:06:16,680 --> 00:06:19,160 Speaker 1: need and those that are not in need. Don't get it. 108 00:06:19,680 --> 00:06:23,880 Speaker 1: Um that excluding state and local support is a non 109 00:06:23,960 --> 00:06:27,800 Speaker 1: starter for Democrats. And you know, you can argue that 110 00:06:28,000 --> 00:06:31,480 Speaker 1: revenue streams for states have been tax streams are about neutral, 111 00:06:31,880 --> 00:06:35,359 Speaker 1: but local governments have taken a huge hit that is 112 00:06:35,400 --> 00:06:38,920 Speaker 1: not reflected in those numbers and have not been talked about. 113 00:06:38,960 --> 00:06:41,480 Speaker 1: And you've noticed very few talk about the local government 114 00:06:41,560 --> 00:06:44,479 Speaker 1: numbers because they are bad. It's the state numbers that 115 00:06:44,520 --> 00:06:48,280 Speaker 1: have been kind of neutral on the overall numbers, but 116 00:06:48,920 --> 00:06:52,359 Speaker 1: local dollars have been hit pretty hard, so they're going 117 00:06:52,400 --> 00:06:55,080 Speaker 1: to crawl up there. But you know what I've learned 118 00:06:55,160 --> 00:06:57,599 Speaker 1: this when I serve in the Senate, everyone loves to 119 00:06:57,600 --> 00:07:01,320 Speaker 1: talk by Parsonship until they need something and then they 120 00:07:01,560 --> 00:07:07,120 Speaker 1: get their votes, line them up and get busy. Rick Davis, Uh, 121 00:07:07,240 --> 00:07:09,640 Speaker 1: I think you make a really important point. And uh 122 00:07:09,760 --> 00:07:12,040 Speaker 1: and and I know you're coming from a lot of 123 00:07:12,040 --> 00:07:15,320 Speaker 1: experience when it comes to uh what it is we 124 00:07:15,360 --> 00:07:19,360 Speaker 1: need at the local level to combat coronavirus because we 125 00:07:19,400 --> 00:07:22,520 Speaker 1: know in the previous administration, all the response to the 126 00:07:22,600 --> 00:07:25,720 Speaker 1: virus was pushed down into the state and local area. 127 00:07:25,920 --> 00:07:30,440 Speaker 1: And as a former mayor of Anchorage, Alaska, give give 128 00:07:30,480 --> 00:07:32,840 Speaker 1: me a sense as to what pressure they've been under 129 00:07:32,920 --> 00:07:36,320 Speaker 1: because that I think people sometimes they think state local 130 00:07:36,400 --> 00:07:39,760 Speaker 1: is just this big autonomous thing and billions of dollars 131 00:07:39,760 --> 00:07:42,000 Speaker 1: gonna be shoved in there to balance their budgets. And 132 00:07:42,400 --> 00:07:43,800 Speaker 1: you know, maybe you could give us a little more 133 00:07:43,840 --> 00:07:46,360 Speaker 1: granularity to it, because I think if people really understood 134 00:07:46,400 --> 00:07:50,440 Speaker 1: what's happening in cities like Alaska or like Anchorage around 135 00:07:50,480 --> 00:07:56,160 Speaker 1: the country, they think differently potentially about this this spend. Yeah, 136 00:07:56,200 --> 00:07:58,560 Speaker 1: I agree. I mean, here here's an example on all 137 00:07:58,640 --> 00:08:04,040 Speaker 1: use Anchorage Anchorage Visitors Bureau Visitors Center. Visitor tax is 138 00:08:04,080 --> 00:08:09,720 Speaker 1: two million dollars that's almost been wiped out. Now the 139 00:08:09,800 --> 00:08:12,880 Speaker 1: state's not doesn't benefit from that. In anyway, So the 140 00:08:12,920 --> 00:08:17,240 Speaker 1: state income or taxes related to that didn't matter at all. 141 00:08:17,240 --> 00:08:19,480 Speaker 1: Well what does that mean for anchors, Well, that means 142 00:08:19,520 --> 00:08:22,600 Speaker 1: they're going to be with probably about of your money 143 00:08:22,920 --> 00:08:28,120 Speaker 1: in local government spent on police, fire, street maintenance, education 144 00:08:28,400 --> 00:08:33,079 Speaker 1: is your core expenditure. So when you start losing significant 145 00:08:33,120 --> 00:08:36,280 Speaker 1: revenue streams, it's not about what people say, Oh, that's 146 00:08:36,280 --> 00:08:38,520 Speaker 1: that fluff and so no, no, no, it's it's about 147 00:08:38,600 --> 00:08:42,040 Speaker 1: like in the winter here, plowing streets, making the streets safe, 148 00:08:42,200 --> 00:08:45,920 Speaker 1: all those core things. The states are much bigger and 149 00:08:45,920 --> 00:08:48,480 Speaker 1: have a lot of more levers to pull and tax 150 00:08:48,520 --> 00:08:50,640 Speaker 1: based to work off of a variety of bother things. 151 00:08:51,160 --> 00:08:54,600 Speaker 1: For the local governments, it is direct. I mean, you know, 152 00:08:54,720 --> 00:08:57,600 Speaker 1: I would bet right now in the Northeast and on 153 00:08:57,720 --> 00:09:00,840 Speaker 1: the East where there's huge snowstorms, their budgets are going 154 00:09:00,880 --> 00:09:05,240 Speaker 1: to get pinched because you cannot say we're not plowing 155 00:09:05,240 --> 00:09:07,920 Speaker 1: the streets right because you can imagine what that would 156 00:09:07,920 --> 00:09:10,680 Speaker 1: be like. The people. They're going to go do their job, 157 00:09:11,080 --> 00:09:12,959 Speaker 1: they're going to plow the streets, they're going to do 158 00:09:13,040 --> 00:09:15,679 Speaker 1: what they need to do. But when they start running 159 00:09:15,720 --> 00:09:18,160 Speaker 1: short on their last tail end of their calendar year, 160 00:09:18,480 --> 00:09:20,600 Speaker 1: the publics are going to feel it at some point, 161 00:09:21,360 --> 00:09:24,600 Speaker 1: versus state governments that much more have a lot more flexibility, 162 00:09:24,600 --> 00:09:26,920 Speaker 1: and there their remnu streams are more neutral right now, 163 00:09:27,480 --> 00:09:30,599 Speaker 1: balanced to a certain extent, versus low governments that just 164 00:09:30,800 --> 00:09:32,800 Speaker 1: when the money is gone there at the end of 165 00:09:32,800 --> 00:09:36,920 Speaker 1: the trail, right there's no one else below, then that's it. Yeah, 166 00:09:36,960 --> 00:09:39,120 Speaker 1: And Senator I can attest to the amount of snow 167 00:09:39,160 --> 00:09:41,320 Speaker 1: we are having here on the East coast right now. 168 00:09:41,960 --> 00:09:46,040 Speaker 1: But Rick, let me ask you are so I feel 169 00:09:46,080 --> 00:09:49,480 Speaker 1: almost like we've got a ticking clock over our heads 170 00:09:49,520 --> 00:09:53,319 Speaker 1: as it pertains to this bill, not just because we 171 00:09:53,400 --> 00:09:56,720 Speaker 1: have this March deadline, but also because of course next 172 00:09:56,760 --> 00:10:01,240 Speaker 1: week starts this impeachment trial. And I can't imagine that 173 00:10:01,360 --> 00:10:03,280 Speaker 1: it is going to be easy to work across the 174 00:10:03,320 --> 00:10:06,640 Speaker 1: aisle while that's going on. What do you think can 175 00:10:06,679 --> 00:10:10,720 Speaker 1: happen in the next few days to move this forward? Well, Uh, 176 00:10:10,920 --> 00:10:14,320 Speaker 1: Sarah Veggas was exactly right that most Democrats we know, 177 00:10:14,559 --> 00:10:18,079 Speaker 1: probably Chuck Schumer uh and Nancy Pelosi think they can 178 00:10:18,120 --> 00:10:20,839 Speaker 1: get pretty much what they want with a Democrat House 179 00:10:20,840 --> 00:10:25,160 Speaker 1: and a Democrats Senate through reconciliation. Maybe in March, maybe 180 00:10:25,200 --> 00:10:28,640 Speaker 1: in April, so nothing immediate right. But what the Republicans 181 00:10:28,679 --> 00:10:32,080 Speaker 1: have is maybe their only advantage right now, is there 182 00:10:32,160 --> 00:10:34,880 Speaker 1: there are enough of them, ten Republicans who are meeting 183 00:10:34,920 --> 00:10:37,960 Speaker 1: with the President today to be able to get you cloture, 184 00:10:38,160 --> 00:10:40,360 Speaker 1: which is that magic number you want to send it 185 00:10:40,440 --> 00:10:43,719 Speaker 1: to have anything happen quick and so you could get 186 00:10:43,800 --> 00:10:47,560 Speaker 1: a deal uh today if you can keep these ten 187 00:10:47,600 --> 00:10:50,920 Speaker 1: Republicans paired with the with the Democrats and and get 188 00:10:50,960 --> 00:10:53,800 Speaker 1: culture and vote on a bill this month, right now, 189 00:10:54,520 --> 00:10:57,120 Speaker 1: and then you can have record another bide at the 190 00:10:57,120 --> 00:11:01,320 Speaker 1: Apple and reconciliation and maybe another bide act with another 191 00:11:01,360 --> 00:11:04,760 Speaker 1: reconciliation later this year. Wow, Rick, you are you You're 192 00:11:04,800 --> 00:11:08,319 Speaker 1: sounding optimistic to me, but and I'm hoping you're right. 193 00:11:08,360 --> 00:11:12,480 Speaker 1: And I love when you talk about culture. Warms my heart. Um. 194 00:11:12,559 --> 00:11:16,560 Speaker 1: We are going to be talking more about this issue. UM. 195 00:11:16,679 --> 00:11:19,360 Speaker 1: We also want to talk about the good news about 196 00:11:19,400 --> 00:11:22,720 Speaker 1: the vaccine that Charlie mentioned. UM. And we also are 197 00:11:22,800 --> 00:11:26,560 Speaker 1: later going to be talking about the Reddit rebellion. UM. 198 00:11:26,679 --> 00:11:29,360 Speaker 1: That is something that we have heard little out of 199 00:11:29,360 --> 00:11:32,240 Speaker 1: the White House at this point. So curious to see 200 00:11:32,320 --> 00:11:35,959 Speaker 1: why they have been reluctant to step into this. UM. 201 00:11:36,000 --> 00:11:39,160 Speaker 1: This is sound on on Bloomberg Radio. I am Genie 202 00:11:39,160 --> 00:11:48,040 Speaker 1: sanzan no in for Kevin CURRELLI. This is Bloomberg Sound 203 00:11:48,120 --> 00:11:54,199 Speaker 1: On with Kevin Surrele on Bloomberg Radio. I'm Genie sanzano 204 00:11:54,360 --> 00:11:57,280 Speaker 1: in for Kevin CURRELLI. And here with me, as always 205 00:11:57,480 --> 00:12:01,920 Speaker 1: is Rick Davis, Bloomberg political contributor and former Alaska Senator 206 00:12:02,040 --> 00:12:05,720 Speaker 1: Mark begets M. As we were talking about, there's some 207 00:12:05,800 --> 00:12:10,320 Speaker 1: good news on the pandemic vaccine front. In addition, in 208 00:12:10,360 --> 00:12:13,440 Speaker 1: a White House press briefing today, Senior Adviser to the 209 00:12:13,440 --> 00:12:17,720 Speaker 1: White House COVID nineteen Response Team, Andy Slavitt announced that 210 00:12:17,720 --> 00:12:21,120 Speaker 1: the US government is investing two d and thirty one 211 00:12:21,160 --> 00:12:24,960 Speaker 1: point eight million dollars to ramp up production from an 212 00:12:24,960 --> 00:12:30,560 Speaker 1: Australian manufacturer of an at home COVID nineteen test that 213 00:12:30,640 --> 00:12:35,080 Speaker 1: doesn't require a prescription. We have sound on that the schedule, 214 00:12:35,240 --> 00:12:37,920 Speaker 1: if it were to be approved under eu A, would 215 00:12:38,000 --> 00:12:41,959 Speaker 1: be about a hundred thousand, hundred million doses by the 216 00:12:42,160 --> 00:12:44,360 Speaker 1: end of the second quarter, that's the end of June. 217 00:12:45,120 --> 00:12:47,960 Speaker 1: And uh, you know, I would not at this point 218 00:12:48,000 --> 00:12:51,320 Speaker 1: be overly confident that those doses would would come evenly. 219 00:12:52,600 --> 00:12:56,280 Speaker 1: Dr Anthony Fauci was also at the briefing, and he 220 00:12:56,440 --> 00:12:59,320 Speaker 1: spoke on the vaccines as well. We have sound on 221 00:12:59,440 --> 00:13:03,600 Speaker 1: that the first priority will always be to get the 222 00:13:03,640 --> 00:13:06,440 Speaker 1: people who have gotten their first doses to get their 223 00:13:06,480 --> 00:13:11,040 Speaker 1: second doses, and then additional doses will be given to 224 00:13:11,080 --> 00:13:14,400 Speaker 1: the next group of people who will get their first doses. 225 00:13:14,559 --> 00:13:18,120 Speaker 1: In this way, there are no doses that are hanging around. 226 00:13:18,640 --> 00:13:23,800 Speaker 1: A dose that's available is going to go into someone's arm. 227 00:13:23,840 --> 00:13:27,360 Speaker 1: And as as we were talking about, really positive news 228 00:13:27,440 --> 00:13:32,400 Speaker 1: that the US hit this milestone with more vaccinated than cases, 229 00:13:32,480 --> 00:13:36,200 Speaker 1: and so Senator let me ask you, how would you 230 00:13:36,360 --> 00:13:40,880 Speaker 1: rate the administration's approach so far, given it's only been 231 00:13:40,920 --> 00:13:43,720 Speaker 1: I think a week and a half now to fighting 232 00:13:43,720 --> 00:13:47,120 Speaker 1: the pandemic. And since you do, as as you and 233 00:13:47,200 --> 00:13:51,040 Speaker 1: Rick were talking about, have so much experience at the 234 00:13:51,080 --> 00:13:54,960 Speaker 1: state and local level, how is the vaccine rollout going 235 00:13:55,120 --> 00:13:57,320 Speaker 1: at the state level as well as someone in New 236 00:13:57,400 --> 00:13:59,920 Speaker 1: York it's somebody, it's something we've been talking and all 237 00:14:00,000 --> 00:14:03,320 Speaker 1: a lot about here. Well, I will say this, you know, 238 00:14:03,360 --> 00:14:05,920 Speaker 1: you're right, there's only been about nine days in office, 239 00:14:05,920 --> 00:14:07,560 Speaker 1: so you've got to take you know, take it for 240 00:14:07,600 --> 00:14:10,240 Speaker 1: what it is. I think they inherited a you know, 241 00:14:10,360 --> 00:14:14,800 Speaker 1: a broken distribution center. I'm not I think distribution system. 242 00:14:14,840 --> 00:14:17,280 Speaker 1: I think that you know, the vaccines were rolling out 243 00:14:17,280 --> 00:14:19,440 Speaker 1: in record time in the center of development, of which 244 00:14:19,520 --> 00:14:23,040 Speaker 1: was good, but for some reason, the distribution was not 245 00:14:23,160 --> 00:14:27,000 Speaker 1: focused on In Alaska. I think we're now number one 246 00:14:27,080 --> 00:14:31,800 Speaker 1: when it comes to per capita vaccinations in two reasons 247 00:14:32,400 --> 00:14:35,120 Speaker 1: UH In Alaska, we've tried to push it out as 248 00:14:35,200 --> 00:14:37,560 Speaker 1: quickly as possible. We have limited doses, so we have, 249 00:14:37,640 --> 00:14:40,800 Speaker 1: like everyone else's, problems with people who want them. But 250 00:14:41,160 --> 00:14:45,360 Speaker 1: we also have a large tribal UH population and they 251 00:14:45,400 --> 00:14:49,520 Speaker 1: have been able to receive UM you know, doses in 252 00:14:49,600 --> 00:14:53,000 Speaker 1: a different format, meaning through the health service and so forth. 253 00:14:53,240 --> 00:14:57,320 Speaker 1: But what's important is they opened up there distribution to 254 00:14:57,360 --> 00:15:01,400 Speaker 1: anyone over eighteen years old, and within the tribal community 255 00:15:01,960 --> 00:15:06,760 Speaker 1: they are three times more likely to get UM the virus. 256 00:15:06,840 --> 00:15:09,520 Speaker 1: So it's kind of a kind of a perfect storm 257 00:15:09,520 --> 00:15:11,200 Speaker 1: in a way of how it's being delivered, and we're 258 00:15:11,200 --> 00:15:14,760 Speaker 1: getting a high number of participants, which is good. But 259 00:15:15,280 --> 00:15:18,400 Speaker 1: you know, it's all about logistics, you know. They I 260 00:15:18,480 --> 00:15:21,640 Speaker 1: think this is the biggest challenge that the federal government 261 00:15:21,640 --> 00:15:24,440 Speaker 1: has because every state has their own method of doing 262 00:15:24,440 --> 00:15:27,480 Speaker 1: it and the reality is you've got to get this 263 00:15:27,640 --> 00:15:31,000 Speaker 1: vaccine out as quickly as possible. And I think it 264 00:15:31,080 --> 00:15:34,480 Speaker 1: was Seattle was a great example where a freezer broke 265 00:15:34,920 --> 00:15:37,160 Speaker 1: and they had to get six doses out and they 266 00:15:37,200 --> 00:15:39,240 Speaker 1: put the word out and people just came and they 267 00:15:39,280 --> 00:15:41,880 Speaker 1: got them done and they didn't waste it. So I 268 00:15:41,880 --> 00:15:45,080 Speaker 1: think they got to get a handle on the distribution, 269 00:15:45,120 --> 00:15:49,080 Speaker 1: but they weren't given this UH system in a very 270 00:15:49,080 --> 00:15:51,800 Speaker 1: good form when they came into the office, and again 271 00:15:51,840 --> 00:15:54,640 Speaker 1: only about nine days in office, Sara this wreck. I mean, 272 00:15:54,640 --> 00:15:58,040 Speaker 1: you make a really good point about the logistical challenges 273 00:15:58,120 --> 00:16:00,480 Speaker 1: that exist, and we heard a lot about that when 274 00:16:00,760 --> 00:16:03,160 Speaker 1: when we were first getting the notion that we're going 275 00:16:03,240 --> 00:16:05,360 Speaker 1: to be able to roll out these hundreds of millions 276 00:16:05,400 --> 00:16:08,960 Speaker 1: of doses of a vaccine. And I would think Alaska 277 00:16:09,320 --> 00:16:12,800 Speaker 1: would be logistically one of the most difficult in the 278 00:16:12,800 --> 00:16:17,800 Speaker 1: country because of the distribution of its population, the isolation 279 00:16:17,840 --> 00:16:21,640 Speaker 1: of tribal communities, UH and UH. And so give us 280 00:16:21,640 --> 00:16:24,080 Speaker 1: a sense as to how the state and localities have 281 00:16:24,200 --> 00:16:26,280 Speaker 1: done such a good job, because I mean, we hear 282 00:16:26,920 --> 00:16:30,240 Speaker 1: UH these numbers about inoculation rates in Alaska. I think 283 00:16:30,280 --> 00:16:33,360 Speaker 1: it's some of the states that have much more resources 284 00:16:33,400 --> 00:16:36,480 Speaker 1: than Alaska has to work with or envious. What's been 285 00:16:36,840 --> 00:16:39,040 Speaker 1: the secret sauce in Alaska to be able to get 286 00:16:39,080 --> 00:16:42,280 Speaker 1: these people shots in the arm? Well, first off, you know, 287 00:16:42,320 --> 00:16:46,160 Speaker 1: again there's still a challenge like anywhere in Alaska's keep 288 00:16:46,200 --> 00:16:48,560 Speaker 1: of mind the size of the state. Right you go 289 00:16:48,640 --> 00:16:52,120 Speaker 1: from Anchorage to Barrow, it's seven hundred miles by air 290 00:16:52,160 --> 00:16:56,040 Speaker 1: and you're still in UH. Two sixty of our communities 291 00:16:56,080 --> 00:17:00,320 Speaker 1: are not accessible other than by plane. So first is 292 00:17:00,720 --> 00:17:03,400 Speaker 1: in rural communities there's a high population of the last 293 00:17:03,520 --> 00:17:07,359 Speaker 1: native community they've been able to focus on eighteen and above. 294 00:17:07,800 --> 00:17:10,200 Speaker 1: So they've just gone in and said, okay, everyone, every 295 00:17:10,240 --> 00:17:12,320 Speaker 1: dose we get, we're going to make sure we get 296 00:17:12,359 --> 00:17:16,000 Speaker 1: as many people as possible because those small, enclosed communities 297 00:17:16,200 --> 00:17:19,160 Speaker 1: are critical to deal with immediately. And in the more 298 00:17:19,280 --> 00:17:23,119 Speaker 1: urban areas, UH, they have gone through the process of 299 00:17:23,280 --> 00:17:27,480 Speaker 1: ensuring that people know they've had population limitations meaning certain 300 00:17:27,520 --> 00:17:31,000 Speaker 1: age groups and so forth, and risk factors UH and 301 00:17:31,000 --> 00:17:33,960 Speaker 1: and medical personnel. But they've been doing in a very 302 00:17:34,000 --> 00:17:37,719 Speaker 1: systematic way now saying that we're like everyone else, we 303 00:17:37,800 --> 00:17:43,439 Speaker 1: have huge populations that are anxiously awaiting more and there 304 00:17:43,480 --> 00:17:46,280 Speaker 1: are some efforts I know as of last night being 305 00:17:46,320 --> 00:17:49,480 Speaker 1: discussed to now go into some of the more impoverished 306 00:17:49,520 --> 00:17:53,400 Speaker 1: areas actually mobile to go there in order to get 307 00:17:53,480 --> 00:17:56,439 Speaker 1: the populations that have a higher risk but are not 308 00:17:56,480 --> 00:18:00,240 Speaker 1: necessarily coming into locations because they can't or accessive lady. 309 00:18:00,240 --> 00:18:03,880 Speaker 1: So it's kind of flexing the ability to distribute. And 310 00:18:04,160 --> 00:18:07,679 Speaker 1: you know, some of these states were I don't want 311 00:18:07,680 --> 00:18:09,639 Speaker 1: to say they were delayed, but they were confused on 312 00:18:09,880 --> 00:18:11,680 Speaker 1: you know, what do we do first? What should we do? 313 00:18:12,160 --> 00:18:17,040 Speaker 1: Senator that Yet, Senator that, that is so fascinating to 314 00:18:17,080 --> 00:18:19,040 Speaker 1: hear you describe what is going on in Alaska and 315 00:18:19,000 --> 00:18:22,040 Speaker 1: in some of these more rural areas. This is sound on. 316 00:18:22,160 --> 00:18:28,640 Speaker 1: I am Genie Enzo filling in for Kevin Surreally. On Sunday, 317 00:18:28,800 --> 00:18:33,360 Speaker 1: Jared Bernstein, a member of President Biden's Council of Economic Advisors, 318 00:18:33,400 --> 00:18:38,639 Speaker 1: expressed confidence in US market regulators, saying that speculation volatility 319 00:18:38,760 --> 00:18:41,720 Speaker 1: are a constant, as he said, in markets we have 320 00:18:41,800 --> 00:18:46,080 Speaker 1: sound on that. The President's main concern there is that 321 00:18:46,160 --> 00:18:49,800 Speaker 1: the regulator in charge, the SEC Security and Exchange Commission, 322 00:18:50,119 --> 00:18:53,159 Speaker 1: has to make sure not that there's no volatility and 323 00:18:53,200 --> 00:18:56,440 Speaker 1: speculation in the market. That's a constant, but that the 324 00:18:56,560 --> 00:19:01,280 Speaker 1: underlying plumbing of the financial markets remains sound, while Senator 325 00:19:01,320 --> 00:19:05,280 Speaker 1: Elizabeth Warren said a broker deal like robin Hood that 326 00:19:05,359 --> 00:19:09,160 Speaker 1: invites a lot of individual investors needs to operate under 327 00:19:09,280 --> 00:19:12,639 Speaker 1: some basic rules we have sound on that. It's not 328 00:19:12,720 --> 00:19:17,119 Speaker 1: about protecting people from making bad trades. It's about keeping 329 00:19:17,160 --> 00:19:19,960 Speaker 1: the playing field level. I can't do that in the 330 00:19:20,000 --> 00:19:24,080 Speaker 1: middle of a trading cycle. And here with me and 331 00:19:24,200 --> 00:19:27,320 Speaker 1: Rick Davis, as always, we want to welcome Norm Champ, 332 00:19:27,480 --> 00:19:30,439 Speaker 1: partner at Kirkland and Ellis and former director of the 333 00:19:30,480 --> 00:19:35,440 Speaker 1: Division of Investment Management at the SEC. So Norm, let 334 00:19:35,440 --> 00:19:37,880 Speaker 1: me just ask you, based on what we were just 335 00:19:38,080 --> 00:19:43,400 Speaker 1: hearing from both Bernstein and Warren, are the underlying, as 336 00:19:43,440 --> 00:19:47,159 Speaker 1: Bernstein said, is the underlying plumbing of the financial markets. 337 00:19:47,480 --> 00:19:50,960 Speaker 1: Does that remain sound or has this story sort of 338 00:19:51,000 --> 00:19:54,840 Speaker 1: thrown a monkey wrench into that? Oh? I think so, 339 00:19:55,119 --> 00:19:57,160 Speaker 1: Thanks so much for having me. I think the underlying 340 00:19:57,160 --> 00:20:01,639 Speaker 1: plumbing is just fine. Um. You know, the the best 341 00:20:01,640 --> 00:20:05,119 Speaker 1: part of that statement was, Look, we've had these short squeezes. 342 00:20:05,280 --> 00:20:09,199 Speaker 1: We've had these events in the past. Frankly, you know, 343 00:20:09,680 --> 00:20:12,080 Speaker 1: there's times when things just sort of cruise up and 344 00:20:12,119 --> 00:20:15,080 Speaker 1: up and up. Which generally they have been where traders 345 00:20:15,080 --> 00:20:19,639 Speaker 1: actually prefer more volatility. So there's our markets are very deep, 346 00:20:20,119 --> 00:20:24,480 Speaker 1: they're very liquid. You've seen a real interesting development with 347 00:20:24,600 --> 00:20:27,200 Speaker 1: the spacks over the last year. That's going to result 348 00:20:27,240 --> 00:20:30,439 Speaker 1: in more public companies. One thing we've been battling is 349 00:20:30,760 --> 00:20:33,160 Speaker 1: actually fewer public companies in the US. We have half 350 00:20:33,160 --> 00:20:35,359 Speaker 1: as many as we had twenty years ago, and I 351 00:20:35,440 --> 00:20:37,480 Speaker 1: p o s have been way down. But the capital 352 00:20:37,520 --> 00:20:39,879 Speaker 1: market has been booming over the last couple of years, 353 00:20:39,960 --> 00:20:42,880 Speaker 1: and that's getting more companies in the market. Our markets 354 00:20:42,880 --> 00:20:45,840 Speaker 1: are still the envy of the rest of the world. 355 00:20:46,320 --> 00:20:50,919 Speaker 1: Our markets have financed you name it, Google, Facebook, Amazon, Right, 356 00:20:51,160 --> 00:20:55,000 Speaker 1: those companies aren't rising in other countries. They're rising here 357 00:20:55,200 --> 00:20:58,560 Speaker 1: because of the depth and breadth of our markets. Norms. 358 00:20:58,680 --> 00:21:01,600 Speaker 1: Rick Davis, thanks so much for being on the program today. 359 00:21:01,880 --> 00:21:05,400 Speaker 1: Looking forward to the conversation. Is is it at all 360 00:21:05,400 --> 00:21:09,159 Speaker 1: an effect in the SEC that it doesn't have a 361 00:21:10,040 --> 00:21:13,200 Speaker 1: sentence Senate confirmed chair right now? Gary Gensler has been 362 00:21:13,240 --> 00:21:17,000 Speaker 1: nominated but not confirmed. Uh does that matter in a 363 00:21:17,040 --> 00:21:20,600 Speaker 1: situation like this where either communication to the market or 364 00:21:20,800 --> 00:21:26,240 Speaker 1: management within the regulatory agency is suffering. That's a great question, Rick, 365 00:21:26,320 --> 00:21:29,960 Speaker 1: I mean, certainly it would be better if we had 366 00:21:29,960 --> 00:21:33,320 Speaker 1: a confirmed chair right at the moment um, but Alison 367 00:21:33,400 --> 00:21:36,840 Speaker 1: leaves the acting chair and experienced hand as a commissioner. 368 00:21:37,280 --> 00:21:42,720 Speaker 1: I think the apparatus that remember, the actual group of 369 00:21:42,760 --> 00:21:45,600 Speaker 1: people who change jobs at the top of the SEC 370 00:21:45,840 --> 00:21:48,959 Speaker 1: and from one administration the other is extremely small. It's 371 00:21:49,000 --> 00:21:52,760 Speaker 1: the five commissioners and call it another you know, maybe 372 00:21:52,760 --> 00:21:57,680 Speaker 1: fifty people something like that out of a four thousand agencies. 373 00:21:57,760 --> 00:22:01,639 Speaker 1: So they have a lot of career apparatus there, people 374 00:22:02,280 --> 00:22:04,760 Speaker 1: that I think are well capable of going out and 375 00:22:04,800 --> 00:22:08,440 Speaker 1: trying to figure this out right, and I'm certain that 376 00:22:08,480 --> 00:22:11,840 Speaker 1: they are out there, you know, getting the market data right. 377 00:22:11,880 --> 00:22:14,879 Speaker 1: They can get all this data of all the trading 378 00:22:14,920 --> 00:22:17,080 Speaker 1: that's been going on, and I'm sure they're trying to 379 00:22:17,080 --> 00:22:20,199 Speaker 1: analyze it and figure out exactly what's been happening over 380 00:22:20,240 --> 00:22:22,159 Speaker 1: the last couple of weeks. That's the first thing, is, 381 00:22:22,720 --> 00:22:26,440 Speaker 1: you know all this, let's see all these stories if 382 00:22:26,480 --> 00:22:28,919 Speaker 1: I was back there. First things first, let's get the 383 00:22:28,960 --> 00:22:33,480 Speaker 1: facts of what exactly has happened. That's my following conversation 384 00:22:33,560 --> 00:22:36,920 Speaker 1: with you I'd like to have. Because the SEC did 385 00:22:36,960 --> 00:22:39,720 Speaker 1: put out a statement saying that they want to probe 386 00:22:39,720 --> 00:22:44,800 Speaker 1: market activity for misconduct. Uh, and these are regulated entities. 387 00:22:44,840 --> 00:22:47,399 Speaker 1: There are certain rules. Um, there are no rules against 388 00:22:47,400 --> 00:22:50,280 Speaker 1: momentum trading, but there are rules against pump and dump. 389 00:22:51,000 --> 00:22:53,119 Speaker 1: Where are we in this? I mean, it seems to 390 00:22:53,160 --> 00:22:55,800 Speaker 1: me that we sort of vascillate to some degree back 391 00:22:55,800 --> 00:23:00,720 Speaker 1: and forth in that scenario. There's no question you your 392 00:23:00,880 --> 00:23:03,520 Speaker 1: lead in there. I heard, you know, the reporter mentioning 393 00:23:03,560 --> 00:23:08,040 Speaker 1: that now game stops down. Um, you know this has 394 00:23:08,160 --> 00:23:13,040 Speaker 1: features of that. It looks like, as you say, it's 395 00:23:13,040 --> 00:23:17,840 Speaker 1: a fine line. People can pile in on momentum. People 396 00:23:17,880 --> 00:23:20,800 Speaker 1: consider around chat rooms and talk about stocks and you know, 397 00:23:20,800 --> 00:23:23,920 Speaker 1: potentially go on and buy them. We saw this huge rise, 398 00:23:24,119 --> 00:23:27,920 Speaker 1: we are now seeing, you know, the downside. I think 399 00:23:28,000 --> 00:23:30,199 Speaker 1: one of the questions I'm sure that they want to 400 00:23:30,200 --> 00:23:35,680 Speaker 1: figure out is are we really talking about just individual 401 00:23:36,080 --> 00:23:40,000 Speaker 1: trading out of these chat rooms, people who are talking 402 00:23:40,040 --> 00:23:41,760 Speaker 1: and so forth and then going and putting you know, 403 00:23:41,840 --> 00:23:46,080 Speaker 1: let's say, their retail money into these names or I'm 404 00:23:46,119 --> 00:23:49,040 Speaker 1: sure the big question they have is are there other 405 00:23:49,160 --> 00:23:53,560 Speaker 1: actors in the market who are potentially monitoring these trade rooms, 406 00:23:53,560 --> 00:23:56,520 Speaker 1: are watching the press or whatever, and are those actors 407 00:23:56,520 --> 00:23:59,320 Speaker 1: helping push these names of that that would be I 408 00:23:59,359 --> 00:24:01,720 Speaker 1: think one of their first questions, because to your point, 409 00:24:02,000 --> 00:24:04,720 Speaker 1: I've got to figure out exactly what's happening before you 410 00:24:04,720 --> 00:24:07,080 Speaker 1: can even reach any kind of conclusion about whether there's 411 00:24:07,119 --> 00:24:12,359 Speaker 1: something wrong happening. I don't think we need market structure 412 00:24:12,480 --> 00:24:15,200 Speaker 1: changes out of this, but we need facts. The SEC 413 00:24:15,280 --> 00:24:17,080 Speaker 1: has got to figure out the facts of what's going on. 414 00:24:17,800 --> 00:24:20,280 Speaker 1: And norm what do you make of the fact that 415 00:24:20,320 --> 00:24:23,399 Speaker 1: we haven't heard much specific out of the White House 416 00:24:23,520 --> 00:24:30,200 Speaker 1: on this yet? Well, if you're you know, I actually 417 00:24:30,240 --> 00:24:32,840 Speaker 1: I think that's why. I mean, if if if I 418 00:24:32,840 --> 00:24:35,000 Speaker 1: was in the White outside, they got the saying some 419 00:24:35,080 --> 00:24:37,040 Speaker 1: of our kind of stuff right that. The SEC has 420 00:24:37,080 --> 00:24:40,560 Speaker 1: got the expertise, they've got the data. You know, FINRA, 421 00:24:40,840 --> 00:24:44,320 Speaker 1: which is a self regulatory organization for broken dealers. FINRA 422 00:24:45,119 --> 00:24:48,400 Speaker 1: has all the trading data for every day, and so 423 00:24:48,520 --> 00:24:51,760 Speaker 1: I'm sure they're working very closely with FINRA. And I 424 00:24:51,800 --> 00:24:54,480 Speaker 1: think if if I were in the White House, she's 425 00:24:54,520 --> 00:24:56,760 Speaker 1: I think I would also wait and let's see what 426 00:24:56,800 --> 00:24:59,840 Speaker 1: the facts are, you know, because it's just there since 427 00:25:00,040 --> 00:25:02,920 Speaker 1: so much publicity and so much on the internet, and 428 00:25:03,480 --> 00:25:06,119 Speaker 1: you know, suddenly, you know, even my kids want to 429 00:25:06,119 --> 00:25:08,840 Speaker 1: talk about you know, what about this? You know, because 430 00:25:08,880 --> 00:25:11,360 Speaker 1: I was at the SEC. You know, we're seeing it everywhere, 431 00:25:11,400 --> 00:25:15,200 Speaker 1: and I think, um, I would be waiting to understand 432 00:25:15,240 --> 00:25:19,080 Speaker 1: what the facts are because it's just no one knows. Yeah, 433 00:25:19,440 --> 00:25:21,560 Speaker 1: And and Norm, I'm with you. My kids as well. 434 00:25:21,760 --> 00:25:25,199 Speaker 1: They are usually not fascinated by Wall Street stories, but 435 00:25:25,320 --> 00:25:27,880 Speaker 1: this one has caught their attention. And I think it's 436 00:25:27,920 --> 00:25:30,000 Speaker 1: not only because it's game stop and read it, but 437 00:25:30,040 --> 00:25:32,280 Speaker 1: there's so much about it that they're, you know, sort 438 00:25:32,320 --> 00:25:34,680 Speaker 1: of glued to the story. I think, like so many 439 00:25:34,760 --> 00:25:37,919 Speaker 1: of us, so we want to ask Norm more. I 440 00:25:37,960 --> 00:25:40,000 Speaker 1: think one of my questions has to do with this 441 00:25:40,040 --> 00:25:43,479 Speaker 1: issue of collusion and so much more so, where are 442 00:25:43,520 --> 00:25:46,800 Speaker 1: going to keep talking to Norm Champ, partner at Kirkland Ellis. 443 00:25:47,200 --> 00:25:50,320 Speaker 1: I am Genie Schanzano filling in for Kevin Currelli, and 444 00:25:50,440 --> 00:25:57,520 Speaker 1: this is sound On on Bloomberg. This is Bloomberg Sound 445 00:25:57,600 --> 00:26:03,080 Speaker 1: On with Kevin Surrele on Bird Radio. I'm Jeanie Schanzano 446 00:26:03,240 --> 00:26:07,320 Speaker 1: in for Kevin Cirelli, speaking as always with Rick Davis 447 00:26:07,359 --> 00:26:10,600 Speaker 1: and Norm Champ, partner at Kirkland and Ellis and former 448 00:26:10,640 --> 00:26:14,080 Speaker 1: director of the Division of Investment Management. At the SEC 449 00:26:15,119 --> 00:26:18,520 Speaker 1: so norm we have heard, of course coming over the 450 00:26:18,560 --> 00:26:22,600 Speaker 1: Bloomberg that robin Hood raised an additional investment of two 451 00:26:22,600 --> 00:26:26,080 Speaker 1: almost two and a half billion dollars with trading restrictions eased. 452 00:26:26,800 --> 00:26:31,800 Speaker 1: So in your mind, um, do robin Hood and interactive 453 00:26:31,840 --> 00:26:35,479 Speaker 1: brokers in the other sort of online popular brokerage firms, 454 00:26:35,840 --> 00:26:41,399 Speaker 1: do they get through this unscathed? Well? I think I 455 00:26:41,440 --> 00:26:46,200 Speaker 1: think trading through apps and trading through the internet is yeah. 456 00:26:46,240 --> 00:26:48,119 Speaker 1: I would was gonna say it's the future, but the 457 00:26:48,119 --> 00:26:51,959 Speaker 1: future is already here, right, so they I do think 458 00:26:52,119 --> 00:26:56,040 Speaker 1: they will, um. And it's like everything else all of 459 00:26:56,119 --> 00:26:57,960 Speaker 1: us are doing in our daily lives, right, you can 460 00:26:58,000 --> 00:27:00,520 Speaker 1: now do most things at the click of an app, 461 00:27:00,600 --> 00:27:03,760 Speaker 1: and I think it's here to stay. Uh. And I 462 00:27:03,800 --> 00:27:07,680 Speaker 1: don't this if anything, that's probably gonna accelerate the popularity. 463 00:27:07,920 --> 00:27:11,760 Speaker 1: I think the one market starture thing that's quite interesting 464 00:27:11,840 --> 00:27:16,240 Speaker 1: from all of this is we had commissions. You know, 465 00:27:16,240 --> 00:27:19,360 Speaker 1: Commissions used to be fixed in this country, um, and 466 00:27:19,440 --> 00:27:24,960 Speaker 1: we want on stock transactions. They became unfixed and they 467 00:27:25,000 --> 00:27:28,480 Speaker 1: have drifted down steadily over the decades since and now 468 00:27:28,560 --> 00:27:31,879 Speaker 1: really have gone to zero. And it's interesting, right because 469 00:27:32,400 --> 00:27:36,560 Speaker 1: feels like that has also helped people get more active 470 00:27:36,560 --> 00:27:39,560 Speaker 1: in trading as commissions have gone down. I wouldn't be 471 00:27:39,640 --> 00:27:44,240 Speaker 1: surprised if the Commission maybe thought about that and sort of, 472 00:27:44,800 --> 00:27:48,639 Speaker 1: you know, at least studied that development, because it's been 473 00:27:48,680 --> 00:27:50,840 Speaker 1: a long time coming, but we're sort of now here 474 00:27:50,880 --> 00:27:55,119 Speaker 1: finally to zero commissions. And Rick Davis on this point, 475 00:27:56,040 --> 00:27:57,959 Speaker 1: you know, one of the things that you and I 476 00:27:58,000 --> 00:28:03,000 Speaker 1: have talked about and and still of mixed feelings about, 477 00:28:03,720 --> 00:28:08,520 Speaker 1: is this question of when Robin Hood restricted trading, did 478 00:28:08,600 --> 00:28:11,160 Speaker 1: you see that as somebody who's worked in this area, 479 00:28:11,200 --> 00:28:16,440 Speaker 1: did you see that as legitimate? Well, you're seeing them 480 00:28:16,520 --> 00:28:20,040 Speaker 1: raise the money. I don't obviously have any particular facts 481 00:28:20,040 --> 00:28:22,080 Speaker 1: about that, but I think in general, when you think 482 00:28:22,119 --> 00:28:26,080 Speaker 1: about brokers, and this is true for all brokers, they 483 00:28:26,119 --> 00:28:29,600 Speaker 1: have under the rules, they have net capital requirements. They 484 00:28:29,640 --> 00:28:31,520 Speaker 1: have to have a certain amount of capital on hand 485 00:28:32,160 --> 00:28:34,040 Speaker 1: when you're dealing with the kind of volumes that the 486 00:28:34,080 --> 00:28:38,280 Speaker 1: market's been dealing with across these names. Um, I didn't 487 00:28:38,360 --> 00:28:41,080 Speaker 1: surprise me that some of these brokers would slow it 488 00:28:41,120 --> 00:28:44,480 Speaker 1: down just because they have to put out capital, you know, 489 00:28:44,480 --> 00:28:46,800 Speaker 1: and they're part of clearing organizations and there's a whole 490 00:28:47,040 --> 00:28:52,840 Speaker 1: complex infrastructure behind every broker in America, and so I 491 00:28:52,880 --> 00:28:55,560 Speaker 1: would imagine it had something to do with that and 492 00:28:55,600 --> 00:28:58,840 Speaker 1: people thinking about their liquidity, their net capital. So I 493 00:28:59,520 --> 00:29:03,360 Speaker 1: wouldn't it didn't surprise me. Hey, norm Rick Davis. Internet 494 00:29:03,360 --> 00:29:06,600 Speaker 1: trading has democratized a lot of investment to some degree, 495 00:29:06,640 --> 00:29:13,040 Speaker 1: and there's another democratization effort going on with public markets. UM. 496 00:29:13,440 --> 00:29:17,360 Speaker 1: I would say some people call the move towards SPACs 497 00:29:17,840 --> 00:29:21,479 Speaker 1: UH blank check companies as a way of democratizing the 498 00:29:21,520 --> 00:29:24,440 Speaker 1: I P O market. You wrote a book, UH called 499 00:29:24,560 --> 00:29:28,000 Speaker 1: Going Public, My Adventures inside the SEC and how to 500 00:29:28,040 --> 00:29:32,720 Speaker 1: present the Next devastating crisis. UM, can you give me 501 00:29:32,760 --> 00:29:35,040 Speaker 1: your senses to how you see this back market and 502 00:29:35,080 --> 00:29:41,000 Speaker 1: the explosion in activity there. So the capital markets the 503 00:29:41,080 --> 00:29:43,800 Speaker 1: last couple of years tremendous time for the capital markets, 504 00:29:43,880 --> 00:29:46,840 Speaker 1: which had not been the case for you know, quite 505 00:29:46,880 --> 00:29:50,640 Speaker 1: some time before that. And I think the SEC should 506 00:29:50,640 --> 00:29:53,800 Speaker 1: get some credits for, you know, in the last four 507 00:29:53,880 --> 00:29:58,000 Speaker 1: years for UH promoting our capital markets and trying to 508 00:29:58,000 --> 00:30:01,760 Speaker 1: make access to them easier. You know, they are they're 509 00:30:01,760 --> 00:30:05,440 Speaker 1: the route of everything in this country, and the fact 510 00:30:05,480 --> 00:30:08,960 Speaker 1: that we've opened them up to retail investors is also 511 00:30:09,120 --> 00:30:12,880 Speaker 1: a huge positive right that retail investors are there and 512 00:30:12,960 --> 00:30:16,520 Speaker 1: being able to participate in those markets and have more options. 513 00:30:17,120 --> 00:30:19,920 Speaker 1: And I think that's what the SPACs represent, is they 514 00:30:20,040 --> 00:30:23,960 Speaker 1: represent more opportunity to go out for people to start 515 00:30:24,000 --> 00:30:27,040 Speaker 1: a blank check company and then go out and look 516 00:30:27,120 --> 00:30:30,720 Speaker 1: for a merger partner who will become a public company. 517 00:30:30,800 --> 00:30:34,960 Speaker 1: And as I mentioned earlier, we've been short on public companies. 518 00:30:35,160 --> 00:30:37,760 Speaker 1: The costs of being a public company are very high, 519 00:30:38,320 --> 00:30:41,080 Speaker 1: uh and the costs of IPOs are very high. So 520 00:30:41,160 --> 00:30:45,680 Speaker 1: you can see the attraction for the blank check companies 521 00:30:45,720 --> 00:30:47,920 Speaker 1: to have more public companies. And I think you know, 522 00:30:48,000 --> 00:30:51,800 Speaker 1: Chair Clayton from the very beginning cited some of those 523 00:30:51,840 --> 00:30:55,000 Speaker 1: same same statistics that we have half the public companies 524 00:30:55,000 --> 00:30:58,000 Speaker 1: that we had twenty years ago, and I think you're 525 00:30:58,040 --> 00:31:01,360 Speaker 1: we're going to have more public companies. And that's important 526 00:31:01,480 --> 00:31:06,360 Speaker 1: because most people, most retails investors in this country access 527 00:31:06,440 --> 00:31:10,240 Speaker 1: the markets through mutual funds, and those mutual funds typically 528 00:31:10,240 --> 00:31:13,440 Speaker 1: have to buy liquid public company names that can't buy 529 00:31:13,480 --> 00:31:17,680 Speaker 1: private investments. So it's very important that we have more 530 00:31:17,720 --> 00:31:20,960 Speaker 1: public companies, more choice, so that retail investors can have 531 00:31:21,040 --> 00:31:25,160 Speaker 1: wider options in there. For one case, there are other plans, 532 00:31:25,200 --> 00:31:28,680 Speaker 1: their own accounts, UM five nine plans. All of those 533 00:31:28,680 --> 00:31:32,280 Speaker 1: places are primarily mutual funds, and we need more public 534 00:31:32,320 --> 00:31:36,240 Speaker 1: companies to make sure that investors have good choices for investing. 535 00:31:36,760 --> 00:31:39,160 Speaker 1: You want to follow up on that, um. It seems 536 00:31:39,200 --> 00:31:42,560 Speaker 1: to me that certainly on capacity right now, this back 537 00:31:42,640 --> 00:31:45,480 Speaker 1: market is is running circles around the I p O market. 538 00:31:45,520 --> 00:31:48,000 Speaker 1: Are there things that either can be done through the 539 00:31:48,040 --> 00:31:51,760 Speaker 1: regulatory environment or with the exchanges to make I p 540 00:31:51,920 --> 00:31:54,560 Speaker 1: o s more competitive right now and bring more companies 541 00:31:54,560 --> 00:31:59,000 Speaker 1: to market. So it's a great question, Rick. I think 542 00:31:59,040 --> 00:32:02,480 Speaker 1: that people have and looking at that issue again for 543 00:32:02,640 --> 00:32:05,280 Speaker 1: twenty years, as we've had declining I p o s. 544 00:32:05,880 --> 00:32:09,000 Speaker 1: It is expensive, you know, to do an IPO in 545 00:32:09,040 --> 00:32:13,240 Speaker 1: the US, and I would I think that certainly the 546 00:32:13,280 --> 00:32:17,840 Speaker 1: Clayton Commission, you know, the SEC under chair Clayton, tried 547 00:32:18,200 --> 00:32:23,200 Speaker 1: multiple rule adjustments to help the I field market and 548 00:32:23,280 --> 00:32:27,400 Speaker 1: help make it easier. You're not quite seeing the impact 549 00:32:27,480 --> 00:32:30,080 Speaker 1: of that right because obviously the facts have taken over 550 00:32:30,160 --> 00:32:33,080 Speaker 1: and are the way that people are doing it. But 551 00:32:33,280 --> 00:32:36,520 Speaker 1: it would be anything we could do to reduce the 552 00:32:36,600 --> 00:32:40,400 Speaker 1: costs of I p o s would help that side 553 00:32:40,400 --> 00:32:42,400 Speaker 1: of the market as well. And get us more companies 554 00:32:42,440 --> 00:32:46,720 Speaker 1: through that channel. So Norm I want to ask you 555 00:32:47,320 --> 00:32:50,120 Speaker 1: when your kids are asking you just to get back 556 00:32:50,160 --> 00:32:52,920 Speaker 1: to the game stop which I can't get over this story, 557 00:32:53,320 --> 00:32:56,880 Speaker 1: when they're asking you about this story, um, you know 558 00:32:57,120 --> 00:32:59,680 Speaker 1: down the line, what do you think is going to 559 00:32:59,800 --> 00:33:04,320 Speaker 1: be the major takeaway when this story is ultimately written 560 00:33:04,360 --> 00:33:07,600 Speaker 1: about this sort of stock mania that's that's sort of 561 00:33:07,640 --> 00:33:10,680 Speaker 1: taken over so much of our popular conscience. What do 562 00:33:10,720 --> 00:33:13,480 Speaker 1: you think the story and the major takeaway is going 563 00:33:13,560 --> 00:33:17,520 Speaker 1: to be in your mind? I think it ties in 564 00:33:17,520 --> 00:33:21,720 Speaker 1: with ricks point about the democratization, right. I think that again. 565 00:33:21,760 --> 00:33:24,360 Speaker 1: I think the SEC is gonna look hard at the 566 00:33:24,480 --> 00:33:29,040 Speaker 1: facts and make sure it is just democratization. I suspect 567 00:33:29,040 --> 00:33:31,240 Speaker 1: there may be other people in their trading and taking 568 00:33:31,240 --> 00:33:33,600 Speaker 1: advantage of all this, and I'm sure the SEC is 569 00:33:33,600 --> 00:33:35,760 Speaker 1: gonna look hard at that. But I think if you 570 00:33:35,880 --> 00:33:41,400 Speaker 1: kind of look big picture, it reflects the continuing access, 571 00:33:41,600 --> 00:33:46,360 Speaker 1: increased access of retail investors to our markets and that 572 00:33:46,400 --> 00:33:49,480 Speaker 1: can only be a positive. Right. We may have gyrations 573 00:33:49,480 --> 00:33:53,240 Speaker 1: on these names and so forth, but big picture, the 574 00:33:53,440 --> 00:33:57,160 Speaker 1: more that all of us participate in these markets and 575 00:33:57,280 --> 00:34:01,239 Speaker 1: have a stake in capitalism and the free markets and 576 00:34:01,320 --> 00:34:04,080 Speaker 1: have a stake in the growth and the financing businesses 577 00:34:04,160 --> 00:34:08,120 Speaker 1: in this country that creates jobs, that creates opportunities for 578 00:34:08,200 --> 00:34:12,480 Speaker 1: all Americans. And when you have those vibrant markets that 579 00:34:12,520 --> 00:34:16,319 Speaker 1: are generating employers, generating companies that are creating jobs, that 580 00:34:16,360 --> 00:34:19,000 Speaker 1: helps everyone. And it's the sort of you know, lists 581 00:34:19,040 --> 00:34:25,160 Speaker 1: all boats philosophy. So I think broadly it's a good story. Again, 582 00:34:25,440 --> 00:34:28,200 Speaker 1: I have to see what the details are these particular situations, 583 00:34:28,239 --> 00:34:31,200 Speaker 1: but but more broadly, I think the more of our 584 00:34:31,600 --> 00:34:35,239 Speaker 1: fellow citizens who participate in these markets, the better, uh 585 00:34:35,320 --> 00:34:38,200 Speaker 1: and the better for the economic Helphilly country. And And 586 00:34:38,280 --> 00:34:42,240 Speaker 1: based on your work in the SEC, is the SEC 587 00:34:43,840 --> 00:34:48,520 Speaker 1: equipped at this point to address what's going on in 588 00:34:48,680 --> 00:34:52,920 Speaker 1: social media, Reddit and these other places visa via the market? 589 00:34:53,239 --> 00:34:55,399 Speaker 1: And I asked that because it's something we always ask 590 00:34:55,440 --> 00:34:59,160 Speaker 1: about the courts, for instance, many of the people within 591 00:34:59,239 --> 00:35:02,280 Speaker 1: the court syste then don't have the knowledge in terms 592 00:35:02,320 --> 00:35:04,640 Speaker 1: of how to address some of what's going on in 593 00:35:04,680 --> 00:35:08,000 Speaker 1: social media. So are you confident that that does exist 594 00:35:08,040 --> 00:35:11,200 Speaker 1: in the SEC and if regulation is necessary, they're well 595 00:35:11,480 --> 00:35:16,080 Speaker 1: poised in position to do that. So it's a tremendous question. 596 00:35:16,080 --> 00:35:18,160 Speaker 1: I've been asked us on a number of different shows. 597 00:35:18,200 --> 00:35:21,800 Speaker 1: I think it's very complicated right looking into the social 598 00:35:21,840 --> 00:35:25,680 Speaker 1: media platforms, there's obviously all sorts of privacy concerns, lots 599 00:35:25,680 --> 00:35:30,279 Speaker 1: of First Amendment concerns and privacy concerns around those platforms. 600 00:35:30,800 --> 00:35:33,640 Speaker 1: I think the SEC understands the markets and has more 601 00:35:34,040 --> 00:35:36,840 Speaker 1: knowledge of the markets than anyone, and in particular the 602 00:35:36,840 --> 00:35:40,200 Speaker 1: people there who have decades of experience in these markets 603 00:35:40,200 --> 00:35:44,000 Speaker 1: and understand them. They understand forgot more about these markets 604 00:35:44,000 --> 00:35:46,160 Speaker 1: and the rest of us whoever learned, so I think 605 00:35:46,160 --> 00:35:50,280 Speaker 1: they've got the market expertise. The interaction with the social 606 00:35:50,280 --> 00:35:54,960 Speaker 1: media platforms is obviously, you know, a new thing. On 607 00:35:55,000 --> 00:35:57,480 Speaker 1: the other hand, you know, we've had there were prior 608 00:35:57,560 --> 00:36:00,400 Speaker 1: versions of this, newsletters people would send out try to 609 00:36:00,800 --> 00:36:03,719 Speaker 1: you know, get certain stocks going, and you know, so 610 00:36:04,160 --> 00:36:07,360 Speaker 1: there have also been lower tech versions of all this, 611 00:36:07,680 --> 00:36:12,799 Speaker 1: and I'm confident the SEC can adapt itself to look 612 00:36:12,840 --> 00:36:17,640 Speaker 1: at these issues around the platforms. Norm speed question, does 613 00:36:17,960 --> 00:36:21,759 Speaker 1: Wall Street with all this activity going on, run the 614 00:36:21,840 --> 00:36:25,560 Speaker 1: risk of a sort of occupy Wall Street movement? Uh? 615 00:36:25,760 --> 00:36:29,560 Speaker 1: We've been talking about the democratization of investing. Are we 616 00:36:29,680 --> 00:36:32,360 Speaker 1: entering another period where there's going to be sort of 617 00:36:32,360 --> 00:36:37,279 Speaker 1: a populous revolt against Wall Street. I don't know, Rick, 618 00:36:37,480 --> 00:36:39,440 Speaker 1: you know, I've obviously seen some you know, there are 619 00:36:39,440 --> 00:36:41,799 Speaker 1: some stories suggesting that I think. I guess. The other 620 00:36:42,160 --> 00:36:45,359 Speaker 1: thing that I would warn against is I don't think 621 00:36:45,360 --> 00:36:49,799 Speaker 1: this should be the moment for additional laws or rules 622 00:36:49,880 --> 00:36:54,680 Speaker 1: around the markets, right I I great, great plug, and 623 00:36:54,719 --> 00:36:57,560 Speaker 1: I want to thank so much our guests and and 624 00:36:57,560 --> 00:37:00,360 Speaker 1: and Rick. I love the speed questions. I want to 625 00:37:00,400 --> 00:37:03,080 Speaker 1: thank Norm champ at partner at Kirkland and Ellis, and 626 00:37:03,360 --> 00:37:06,640 Speaker 1: of course want to thank Senator Mark Beget from Alaska. 627 00:37:07,160 --> 00:37:10,400 Speaker 1: And I always want to thank my partner in crime, 628 00:37:10,480 --> 00:37:14,080 Speaker 1: Rick Davis, Bloomberg contributor. I am Jeanie Shanzano filling in 629 00:37:14,120 --> 00:37:17,080 Speaker 1: for Kevin Sorelli. And this is sound on on Bloomberg. 630 00:37:22,360 --> 00:37:22,400 Speaker 1: H