Speaker 1: The true leaders in the game are people like yourselves
Speaker 1: that are willing to actually do something for the good
Speaker 1: of the growth of the game as it relates to affordability, accessibility, kids.
Speaker 2: I got daughts in my head.
Speaker 3: Can't get them, joh, and not the thing what I'm
Speaker 3: thinking about. Can't get them out, joh, not the thing
Speaker 3: what I'm thinking about.
Speaker 4: Hello, this is Alan schipknoking back for another fire drill.
Speaker 4: This is a special one. We are going to talk
Speaker 4: about the reimagining of Golden Gate Park golf Course. Those
Speaker 4: of you who have been following the Firefit channels, no,
Speaker 4: we've been in the dirt from the very beginning. There's
Speaker 4: been videos, there's been stories, but we want to hear
Speaker 4: from the protagonists. So I'm joined by Matt Janelle of course,
Speaker 4: also Dan Burke Coe of First t of San Francisco,
Speaker 4: j Blasei, the golf course designer, and Josh Lewis, who's
Speaker 4: the project manager and the guru of all things agronomy.
Speaker 4: But before we get to those our special guests, Matt,
Speaker 4: let's pay a few bills. Tell the people who's helping us,
Speaker 4: sponsoring this podcast, and just your general excitement level for
Speaker 4: this project. Is before we get deep in the weeds
Speaker 4: on this podcast.
Speaker 1: Well, yeah, thanks to Dormy Workshop, the family business based
Speaker 1: in Halifax, Nova Scotia who create all the fine leather goods,
Speaker 1: some of which are in our pit shop at Firepitcollective
Speaker 1: dot com and in pro shops all over the world.
Speaker 5: Now, they are very good at what they do.
Speaker 1: We love that we're partners with them and appreciate their support.
Speaker 1: And then Link Soul obviously the lifestyle brand I've been
Speaker 1: wearing forever and always will. Anything John Ashworth does I follow,
Speaker 1: and certainly as it relates to Link Soul and the
Speaker 1: clothing that he makes and what we wear a lot
Speaker 1: out at goat Hill Park, especially the outer outer wear.
Speaker 1: The hoodies are some of my favorites and the shorts
Speaker 1: are very popular. So thanks to Linksoul for all of
Speaker 1: their support and partnership and for everything they bring to
Speaker 1: the game of golf. I will say that Alan this
Speaker 1: and we get to it at the end of this podcast.
Speaker 1: But this group of people, this project, this reimagination of
Speaker 1: a community asset that you know was you know, was surviving.
Speaker 1: I mean they were getting you know, upwards of forty
Speaker 1: thousand rounds a year. I cannot wait to see what
Speaker 1: happens next at Golden Gate Park and then other you
Speaker 1: know San Francisco municipalities on the heels of what will
Speaker 1: be deemed a massive success for everybody involved here, huge win.
Speaker 4: Let's let's get to it, guys. I was out at
Speaker 4: Golden Gate Park with the three of you. Matt couldn't
Speaker 4: make it, but everyone else on this on this little chat,
Speaker 4: we got to play the golf course for real earlier
Speaker 4: this week. It's not open to the public just yet
Speaker 4: because they're waiting for the clubhouse to finish, but golf
Speaker 4: is being played at Golden Gate. Let's just go around
Speaker 4: the horn. So, Dan, now you've seen this come to life.
Speaker 4: How excited are you and how pleased are you with
Speaker 4: the finished product?
Speaker 6: Yeah?
Speaker 7: I would say a twelve on a ten scale. You know,
Speaker 7: we knew the site had great bones, but to actually
Speaker 7: execute the project to a pretty high standard with a
Speaker 7: lot of unknowns, and now to see people play it
Speaker 7: or play it yourself. The number one, you know word
Speaker 7: or feedback is the word fun, right, And that's exactly
Speaker 7: what we want, whether it's you know, a young girl
Speaker 7: playing or a you know, a scratch golfer, an older
Speaker 7: retired guy. You know, it's unanimous feedback is that it's fun,
Speaker 7: and it really is. So I'm just you know, rerilled
Speaker 7: that we were able to execute this to the standard
Speaker 7: it's at and can't wait to share it with you know,
Speaker 7: the community and you know the golf world in general.
Speaker 4: So Jay, we weren't in the same group, but it
Speaker 4: was fun that you get glimpses of other other players
Speaker 4: and you get you see that, you see shots, and
Speaker 4: just just the four of us that that I was
Speaker 4: playing with out there. So many times the ball is
Speaker 4: getting closer to the hole, you know, on the fourth
Speaker 4: a little punch bowl and was like playing off the
Speaker 4: left mound, which I actually did perfectly. It trickled all
Speaker 4: the way around the back of the green and then
Speaker 4: and then took a hard right turn, came back to
Speaker 4: the flag and I looked like it might go in.
Speaker 4: Like there was a lot of shots out there, it
Speaker 4: felt like the ball was moving and usually getting closer
Speaker 4: to the destination, which is one of the thrills in golf.
Speaker 4: I mean for you to hear the whoops and and
Speaker 4: uh and and see the smiles, like what did it
Speaker 4: mean to you just to see golfers having fun on
Speaker 4: your on the golf course, you help bring to live.
Speaker 5: Well, that's that's what it's all about, right, I mean,
Speaker 5: that's what we set out to try and achieve. That's
Speaker 5: why we selected the turf types that we did, That's
Speaker 5: why we shape the greens that the way that we
Speaker 5: did is we wanted it to be a fun factory.
Speaker 5: And to your point, you know, one of the most
Speaker 5: fun things in all of golf is watching the ball
Speaker 5: move on the ground, and particularly when it's moving closer
Speaker 5: to the hole. And so that was truly one of
Speaker 5: the most exciting things about the other day was to
Speaker 5: get to watch others hit shots that were you know,
Speaker 5: they'd hit it beyond the hole and have a backstop
Speaker 5: that would bring it back, or they'd hit it, you know,
Speaker 5: right of the hole and use a sideboard that would
Speaker 5: feed it there. Or they'd get on the green and
Speaker 5: then there'd be a putt that you know, they'd make
Speaker 5: a normal twenty foot put towards the hole and then
Speaker 5: they'd say, I want to try going this way instead,
Speaker 5: and they you know, they'd turn their their whole body
Speaker 5: and angle ninety degrees away and use the slopes and
Speaker 5: put it a different way to get to the hole.
Speaker 5: So it was tons and tons of fun to watch
Speaker 5: that happen. And what it means is that people are
Speaker 5: out there making memories with each other. You could see
Speaker 5: them high fiving and putting their arms around each other,
Speaker 5: and you know, at the end of the day, it's
Speaker 5: just golf, but we really are hopefully making memories for
Speaker 5: people that will last a lifetime and that's very, very rewarding.
Speaker 4: That's cool, Josh. You know, for a brand new golf course,
Speaker 4: the turf was in spectacular shape. What are the challenges
Speaker 4: of this particular site and you have golfers out there
Speaker 4: wall that the course is still maturing, Like what can
Speaker 4: golfers expect in the coming months on how the course
Speaker 4: will keep shaping up? And what are the challenges now?
Speaker 4: Is you have to turn the reins over to the
Speaker 4: city at some point and let them maintain the golf course.
Speaker 4: Can you just speak to the playing conditions where they
Speaker 4: are and where they're going.
Speaker 6: Yeah, I think I think right now we're pretty happy.
Speaker 6: Everybody's you know, I think the golf courses is good.
Speaker 6: It's ready to open. It's you know, the golf balls
Speaker 6: are taking the slopes the way they're supposed to the
Speaker 6: playabilities there. But with any project like this, there's there's
Speaker 6: a maturity phasing. I guess, you know, we're kind of
Speaker 6: in phase one. You know. Year over year, as you know,
Speaker 6: root health and turf health, density, all these things continue
Speaker 6: to build, the golf.
Speaker 8: Course is going to get better and better.
Speaker 6: So you know, as we open there's still going to
Speaker 6: be areas that are maybe a little softer than we like,
Speaker 6: or not quite a turf, you know, isn't quite as
Speaker 6: dense as we want, things like that. But I think
Speaker 6: as we saw the other day, it's it's in a
Speaker 6: position where it's really fun to play, and that's the
Speaker 6: ultimate goal. As it relates to hand off to the city.
Speaker 6: I mean, those guys are more than capable of doing
Speaker 6: a great job, and I think there, you know, the
Speaker 6: energy around this is so good. You know, it's been
Speaker 6: such a collaborative effort so far that we should just
Speaker 6: see this thing continue to sing as it moves forward
Speaker 6: and just get get better and better.
Speaker 8: That's that's the hope.
Speaker 4: Matt knows you're kind of an apostle for for public
Speaker 4: golf and accessibility and affordability. Where do you think Golden
Speaker 4: Gate fits into the larger golf landscape.
Speaker 8: Now.
Speaker 1: I mean it goes from a guy from northern California
Speaker 1: who grew up in Santa Rosa, who frequented a lot
Speaker 1: of golf in and around San Francisco, and have you know,
Speaker 1: had never played Golden Gate Park. Uh knew it existed,
Speaker 1: but had never heard you got to go play Golden
Speaker 1: Gate Park. You should see golden Bit never heard that.
Speaker 1: It goes from like off the national curiosity radar to
Speaker 1: on it, and not only just on it, but like
Speaker 1: at the top of a list, right like at the
Speaker 1: top of a list of people wanting to say I
Speaker 1: got I gotta see this, I got to play this,
Speaker 1: And then the chances are they're going to want to
Speaker 1: come back, or they're going to spread spread that gospel,
Speaker 1: spread that word, which is what golfers are so great
Speaker 1: at doing.
Speaker 8: I just did this.
Speaker 1: You got to go see it too, And I think
Speaker 1: that that's exciting for so many reasons. Yes, this is
Speaker 1: a hub of first t and you know, Dan, we'll
Speaker 1: get into that. Like you know, the intentions here at
Speaker 1: the core of what just took place at Golden Gate
Speaker 1: Park is that it's for the kids, it's for accessibility, affordability,
Speaker 1: fun factor, truly growing the game that you know, they
Speaker 1: planted seeds of fescue and bent grass greens, but they
Speaker 1: also this is a this is a garden of growth,
Speaker 1: and that's going to be good for kids because with
Speaker 1: kids come adults, and with adults and aging adults that
Speaker 1: are dealing with you know, health and physical issues. This
Speaker 1: is walkable, this is accessible like it's just in the
Speaker 1: heart of one of the big cities in the United
Speaker 1: States that, oh, by the way, needed a needed a
Speaker 1: pr win for all. I love San Francisco. I'm sad
Speaker 1: about the sort of the sort of the state of
Speaker 1: the city itself. This is a huge win for San Francisco,
Speaker 1: for the game of golf, for kids, for first tea,
Speaker 1: for fun factors, for all. It checks all the boxes
Speaker 1: and tribute to everybody on this call. I know there's
Speaker 1: a lot of other people involved, and that's kind of
Speaker 1: my question to you, Dan, is it was you know,
Speaker 1: it's one thing to say and a lot of people
Speaker 1: do I want to I want to make this. This
Speaker 1: is underachieving, This could be better, this should be better,
Speaker 1: and you did something about it. I guess my question
Speaker 1: is like from a donor's perspective, and I know some
Speaker 1: of them were out there the other day.
Speaker 2: What's what's there?
Speaker 1: What's their feedback? Is this something worthwhile? And hopefully there
Speaker 1: are more donors around the country that will do something similar.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think it's a good perspective.
Speaker 7: Matt is you know, in my year ten years at
Speaker 7: First Tea, which it's it's really twenty years old, you know,
Speaker 7: as we've you know, it's noted that Sandy Tatum started that, right,
Speaker 7: and people give to people they respect for worthy causes.
Speaker 7: So you take an organization like First He and our
Speaker 7: missions really to change, you know, underserved kids' lives. And
Speaker 7: Sandy's perspective of this game that meant so much to him,
Speaker 7: not just from an athletic perspective but a life perspective. Right,
Speaker 7: the lessons he learned, the network he built to take
Speaker 7: that to underserved kids made perfect sense to him very
Speaker 7: late in his life, and he was all in right,
Speaker 7: and that kind of marching order that he brought to
Speaker 7: the community that's still with us today. So our leadership
Speaker 7: looks at strategy very importantly. They take very seriously the
Speaker 7: impact we're having on the community, and they're very conscious
Speaker 7: of like we need to do more so taking risk
Speaker 7: capital and investing it in the community for the greater
Speaker 7: good of our mission of helping underserved kids.
Speaker 2: That makes sense.
Speaker 7: So you know, the Scott Sellers and Tom Kleines the
Speaker 7: world who have you know, helped Sandy lead this thing.
Speaker 2: They value what we do.
Speaker 7: Their networks and our donor base are very in tune
Speaker 7: with what our efforts are. So this wasn't a play
Speaker 7: of like, hey, we're going to fix the city's golf course,
Speaker 7: that's a byproduct of it. But to use this incredible
Speaker 7: facility for the next fifteen years to you know, develop
Speaker 7: our programs even further. That's what made the most sense.
Speaker 7: And then the byproduct of the community benefit, the golf
Speaker 7: world benefit, the agronomy, the sustainability, all of that are
Speaker 7: really you know, they fall in line after that first
Speaker 7: kind of pillar, which is our kids, right.
Speaker 2: So you know, to you know, our donor bases a
Speaker 2: lot of resourcial people.
Speaker 7: They listen when we ask or or educate them, and
Speaker 7: in this case it made sense, right and you know,
Speaker 7: our leadership myself included, was able to get you know,
Speaker 7: some of our donors and some of the first time
Speaker 7: people to really buy into the concept of how important
Speaker 7: this site is for us in the long term from
Speaker 7: a growth perspective, and then understanding that you know, it
Speaker 7: does have community value and that's why it got done,
Speaker 7: you know, and the park and rec you know, and
Speaker 7: a lot of times municipalities take it on the chin, right,
Speaker 7: I mean, the city has Sharp Park and Lincoln and
Speaker 7: there's always a lot of you know, there can be
Speaker 7: you know, negative things saying about those facilities.
Speaker 2: Well, they've been a partner of ours for twenty years.
Speaker 7: They've shown that Harding Park can work, right, It's hosted
Speaker 7: major championships, They've taken good care of that golf course,
Speaker 7: and as Josh alluded to, they are capable, right, And
Speaker 7: so this whole concept of new clubhouse, new lease investment,
Speaker 7: they were all in on this too, and they value
Speaker 7: this just as much as we do. And kind of
Speaker 7: the stars are aligned, you know, you know, one off,
Speaker 7: but it's it's definitely repeatable around the country, right, But
Speaker 7: there has to be community leaders to get behind it,
Speaker 7: and the synergies have to be there. And then I
Speaker 7: like the fact of a community grassroots effort, you know,
Speaker 7: addressing problems in the local society that was the selling
Speaker 7: point here, not like hey, we're going to fix up
Speaker 7: a golf course, right, There's a community aspect to it
Speaker 7: which really resonated with people that are willing to invest
Speaker 7: their money to, you know, for the better betterment of
Speaker 7: the community.
Speaker 4: People listening and they've they've seen the content we put
Speaker 4: out on the firepit channels. The folks are dying to
Speaker 4: play this golf course. And obviously the course is ready
Speaker 4: went in to can be upen to the public. Kind
Speaker 4: of hinges on the clubhouse being finished. They've had some
Speaker 4: supply chain delays for those who are hoping to book
Speaker 4: a tea time to dan. What is your best guess
Speaker 4: and when the doors are going to open to the public.
Speaker 2: Yeah, you know, that's definitely been a moving target.
Speaker 7: You know, we initially were talking, you know, targeting both
Speaker 7: golf course and clubhouse this fall. You know, sometimes they
Speaker 7: around October November. There's been some things out of our
Speaker 7: control related to the city rebuilding the clubhouse, and that
Speaker 7: continues to get moved, pushed a little bit. I think
Speaker 7: the public is playing golf in this golf course, you know,
Speaker 7: if not in January, you know, early February, it shouldn't
Speaker 7: be more than you know, we're airing right now in
Speaker 7: early December. I would say sixty days is probably the
Speaker 7: back end, but hopefully more like thirty or forty five days.
Speaker 7: And we'll communicate to the greater public when we do
Speaker 7: have a definitive date of when we're going to open it.
Speaker 7: And then it's worth noting you know, we've we have
Speaker 7: invested a lot of money in the property. We want
Speaker 7: the city and their gardeners to take good care of it,
Speaker 7: and so we're going to be very conscious of how
Speaker 7: much traffic we put on the golf course. You know,
Speaker 7: in the early state ages, we won't don't want to
Speaker 7: take a step back just by having too many people
Speaker 7: play the course, So we're going to there'll be a
Speaker 7: little balancing act of like what's the right number of
Speaker 7: rounds versus you know, the excessive demand we assume we're
Speaker 7: going to experience when we first do open.
Speaker 4: Another question is how much is it going to cost?
Speaker 4: And again the city kind of controls that, but the
Speaker 4: talking to folks yesterday when I was on the golf course,
Speaker 4: it seems like the residence fee that that's capped right,
Speaker 4: that can only go up two dollars a year, So
Speaker 4: it's going to be in the mid twenties for city
Speaker 4: residents and for non residents it sounds like a target
Speaker 4: somewhere in the mid to high forties. Greens fee is
Speaker 4: what's on the table. Does that sound right?
Speaker 7: Yeah, that's probably accurate, you know, to your point, the
Speaker 7: part code protects the rates for the residents. You know,
Speaker 7: so the residents are going to you know, a regular
Speaker 7: San Francisco resident's going to play the course for twenty
Speaker 7: twenty five bucks a weekday weekend, extremely affordable, especially by
Speaker 7: San Francisco standards.
Speaker 2: I think we'll probably start the non resident rate around forty.
Speaker 7: Dollars weekday, maybe fifty weekend, you know, and we do
Speaker 7: have we can adjust that up or down with that
Speaker 7: that part of the rates for the non resident, so
Speaker 7: we'll let supply and demand kind of take care of that.
Speaker 7: But you know, in San Francisco, to come play a
Speaker 7: place like this, you know, for forty dollars to me
Speaker 7: by California Bayry standards is great value, and that'll kind
Speaker 7: of be the starting point.
Speaker 4: Yeah, And it's also just part of the experience, right
Speaker 4: if you go play the golf course, you're probably going
Speaker 4: to walk around the park, you might go have lunch
Speaker 4: on the beach like it. It's because of where it's situated.
Speaker 4: It becomes part of a day. It's not just drive
Speaker 4: to a golf course, drive away like I think people
Speaker 4: will be encouraged to explore the park and the whole
Speaker 4: neighborhood there, and it's another win for San Francisco, like
Speaker 4: like Matt was talking about. So, you know, Jay, this
Speaker 4: Matt allude to the fact that you donate your services
Speaker 4: as a Northern California resident, someone who just loves loves golf.
Speaker 5: I know it was.
Speaker 4: Really emotionally satisfying to be part of this project. It's also,
Speaker 4: you know, a chance to spotlight your talents. And I
Speaker 4: think when people play these greens and play this golf course,
Speaker 4: they're gonna they're going out to know more about your
Speaker 4: design philosophy and what else you're working on. Can you
Speaker 4: give listeners kind of a little look into where you
Speaker 4: are in your career, because there's never been a more
Speaker 4: interest in golf course architecture and I think this is
Speaker 4: gonna be a big moment for you.
Speaker 7: Yeah.
Speaker 5: Well, you guys have done a great job of kind
Speaker 5: of documenting the process and getting that out there. And
Speaker 5: I think that's great and it's fun to kind of
Speaker 5: let people behind the curtain a little bit to see
Speaker 5: what goes into designing and building a golf course. So
Speaker 5: we're really grateful for all your efforts on that front.
Speaker 5: But no, I mean, it really is a once in
Speaker 5: a lifetime opportunity. You know, I grew up playing municipal
Speaker 5: golf courses, starting out at a part three, you know,
Speaker 5: moving up to an executive nine, then the Big nine,
Speaker 5: then the Big eighteen, and so the idea of crafting
Speaker 5: a golf course where people are going to play their
Speaker 5: first round of golf and having it be something more
Speaker 5: than just a field, right. You know, so many people
Speaker 5: get started in golf and the facility that they first
Speaker 5: swing a club on, you know, maybe they're hitting off
Speaker 5: mats there, may may not be terf you know, they're
Speaker 5: certainly not likely to have a compelling architecture behind it. Here,
Speaker 5: we've got a situation where you've got this unbelievable facility
Speaker 5: right in the in the heart of the city in
Speaker 5: Golden Gate Park. It's been a treasured part of the
Speaker 5: community for decades. Many people will play their first round
Speaker 5: to golf there, and you've got you know, the soils
Speaker 5: that are perfect for golf, that are so rare to
Speaker 5: find that you know, people like Mike Kaiser, you know,
Speaker 5: scour the ends of the earth to find this type
Speaker 5: of saying. You're within a few hundred yards from the ocean,
Speaker 5: You've got these magical cypress t is. The topography that's
Speaker 5: out there is just ideal for golf. It's really exciting
Speaker 5: and compelling to you know, ascend up to the top
Speaker 5: of the knoll and then look out and get the
Speaker 5: big view and then drop down and see So it's
Speaker 5: just really such a dream opportunity and the connection to
Speaker 5: the first t that it was easy to get behind.
Speaker 6: You know.
Speaker 5: My hope is that people will come and have a
Speaker 5: great time and say, wow, this was fun. You know,
Speaker 5: we talked about it earlier, but the key word is fun.
Speaker 5: And and you know, with any project that I take on,
Speaker 5: my goal is to try and there's kind of two facets.
Speaker 5: One help the client achieve their goals and two to
Speaker 5: try to maximize the potential of the site. And you know,
Speaker 5: I think I think we did a great job on
Speaker 5: those fronts in terms of, you know, the site had
Speaker 5: so much potential with the sand that was there, the
Speaker 5: topography that was there, It just needed a you know
Speaker 5: kind of to peel back some of the layers and
Speaker 5: expose some of those areas and take full advantage of it.
Speaker 5: And so again, just such a dream opportunity and really
Speaker 5: lucky that we had a great team to help us
Speaker 5: get there.
Speaker 1: Let me just jump in there because I know we
Speaker 1: were going to use this podcast, as you know, to
Speaker 1: make sure that some of the stuff that we've been
Speaker 1: documenting isn't everything right. I mean, there's a lot of
Speaker 1: stuff that we do have and we you know that
Speaker 1: we still can't share everything. But some of the people
Speaker 1: that were a part of that team, and some of
Speaker 1: the people that are going to continue to be a
Speaker 1: part of the team to maintain and run and operate
Speaker 1: this facility obviously deserve some talk and credit and mentioned.
Speaker 1: So I know you brought into several other shapers. We
Speaker 1: would see them out there when we were out there.
Speaker 1: Can you talk about who you brought in and what
Speaker 1: they brought to the team and to the party, so
Speaker 1: to speak.
Speaker 5: Yeah, that's a great point. We really want to make
Speaker 5: sure that they get their due. And it's a big team, right,
Speaker 5: So I'll talk about the shapers, and then maybe Josh
Speaker 5: can talk about some of the folks on the irrigation
Speaker 5: side and other side. And then there's people on dance
Speaker 5: team as well that have been there every step of
Speaker 5: the way that really deserves some kudos as well. But
Speaker 5: you know, from the shaping side of things, one of
Speaker 5: the real challenges with this project was that we didn't
Speaker 5: get approval to start the project till February fifteenth. We
Speaker 5: started on March sixth, and we knew that we were
Speaker 5: trying to get our grassing done by June, and so
Speaker 5: we had this really tiny window. And you know, as
Speaker 5: you alluded to earlier, construction's never been busier. People are
Speaker 5: booked up all over the place and whatnot, and so
Speaker 5: we were super lucky to be able to kind of
Speaker 5: recruit three talented guys who came in in different little spurts,
Speaker 5: and you know, they each worked in different parts of
Speaker 5: the golf course, and so there's a fun little game
Speaker 5: to play to try to figure out who did what.
Speaker 5: I'm not sure anybody could do that. Hopefully we did
Speaker 5: our job. If they can't figure that out, but our
Speaker 5: our shaping law firm of Carlton, Hochstein and Nelson is
Speaker 5: very very talented. So Justin Carlton was somebody who I
Speaker 5: had never met before. I knew of him. We have
Speaker 5: a couple of mutual friends, and we were in a
Speaker 5: state in the middle of the project where we needed
Speaker 5: some shaping help on short notice. Justin is based in Florida.
Speaker 5: I called him on a Wednesday and he was here
Speaker 5: on a Thursday. So that's a pretty pretty good indication
Speaker 5: of how special the project was to people in the
Speaker 5: golf world when they heard about sand and ocean and
Speaker 5: topography and all that that they jump on a plane
Speaker 5: within twelve hours to get here to help out.
Speaker 7: And so he.
Speaker 5: Brought great talent, very creative ideas, and just kind of
Speaker 5: the perfect how can I help attitude to the project.
Speaker 5: Brett Hostein is somebody that I've worked with down at
Speaker 5: Santa Anna before, and he's uber talented, particularly as it
Speaker 5: relates to kind of the bunkers and the details of
Speaker 5: some of our sandscapes. He was kind of our bunker
Speaker 5: and sandscape guru. Guy came back in and touched all
Speaker 5: those up and has a really brilliant eye for some
Speaker 5: of those things and helped us out tremendously and he
Speaker 5: kind of came at multiple periods of the project to
Speaker 5: help us out and added great value. And then Robert
Speaker 5: Nelson's another guy with Brett's local. He's a Bay Area guy.
Speaker 5: And Robert's another guy who had ties to the Bay
Speaker 5: areas from the area, has got family in the area.
Speaker 5: He was in North Carolina, but we were able to
Speaker 5: get him to come out and and he dove in
Speaker 5: and provided great value and creativity really excelled at kind
Speaker 5: of the finish it finished work and would get out
Speaker 5: there was hand ranking all sorts of areas and and
Speaker 5: just uber committed to all the fine details about everything.
Speaker 5: And so each each one of those guys really brought
Speaker 5: great creativity ideas. You know, this project is so much
Speaker 5: better because of their involvement and we just couldn't be
Speaker 5: happier to have them as part of the team.
Speaker 4: Josh, before you get into your people, tell the listeners
Speaker 4: why rescue You know that's a rare and special grass
Speaker 4: and people identify it with Scotland and maybe Ireland, and
Speaker 4: you know championship level of golf courses in the Open
Speaker 4: Rota and that sort of thing. But why fscue on
Speaker 4: on this golf course?
Speaker 6: Well, from our perspective, you know, when we start talking
Speaker 6: to clients about their project. You know, grass selections one
Speaker 6: of the big key factors, right, depending on where you're at.
Speaker 6: And I have personal connection to find Vescue with you know,
Speaker 6: between band in Dan's and Chambers Bay and my time
Speaker 6: spent there. But the reality is we want the best
Speaker 6: grass for each specific site that we work. You know,
Speaker 6: if it's somewhere in southern California, it's probably going to
Speaker 6: be Bermuda grass or Coodia grass. You know up here
Speaker 6: there's a lot of different churfs we can grow depending
Speaker 6: on the specific location, you know, the microclimates in the
Speaker 6: Bay area in northern California.
Speaker 8: With this specific site.
Speaker 6: You know, fescue is such a unique animal and that
Speaker 6: it needs well drained soils, It needs a low traffic environment,
Speaker 6: you know. But the benefits of find fescue are you know,
Speaker 6: low chemical use, low you know, low input, overall, great
Speaker 6: drought tolerance once established, low fertility.
Speaker 8: Once established, all these things.
Speaker 6: Right, So when you think about City of San Francisco
Speaker 6: Golden Gate Park, you know, overall sustainability, you sit here
Speaker 6: and you start to have all of these boxes checked,
Speaker 6: right for what fescue can provide. And then we started
Speaker 6: looking at Okay, it's on fifty to one hundred feet
Speaker 6: of dune sand, It's in a cool, moderate climate where
Speaker 6: something like bermuda grass would not thrive. It's going to
Speaker 6: be a walking only facility with relatively low you know,
Speaker 6: cart traffic things like that. You're going, Okay, Well, it
Speaker 6: checks all the boxes for if we can plant it,
Speaker 6: and it also checks all the boxes for if we
Speaker 6: should plant it.
Speaker 5: And so.
Speaker 6: And then you know, from like Jay's perspective and my perspective,
Speaker 6: we're sitting here on we know how great it plays,
Speaker 6: and so you know, you're always looking to those like
Speaker 6: unicorn sites where it's going to work because it does
Speaker 6: play so great. And again, you know we cliche of
Speaker 6: the stars aligning, it really did around this turf selection.
Speaker 6: And I really hope and I believe that this is
Speaker 6: a was a great decision, you know, for the for
Speaker 6: the long term and future of this property as it
Speaker 6: relates to what you know, Record Park can do with it,
Speaker 6: and and it really lines up with their mantra and
Speaker 6: their ideals around how they want to manage their golf
Speaker 6: courses in the city as well. So it just I
Speaker 6: mean it fit in every aspect.
Speaker 4: It's great for beginners, right because there's nothing more discouraging
Speaker 4: when you're learning how to play golf and you kind
Speaker 4: of top a shot or you don't catch it right
Speaker 4: and it travels about six feet just stops dead and
Speaker 4: long grass, and then the next shots even harder because
Speaker 4: you're in this thick rough. And I mean it's kind
Speaker 4: of user friendly for people who are learning the game,
Speaker 4: or maybe seniors who don't get a lot of launch.
Speaker 4: Like it seems like that that has the benefits.
Speaker 6: Saw a few of those the other day, you know,
Speaker 6: bottom two grooves on the golf club, and it still
Speaker 6: worked out. So as far as as far as the
Speaker 6: team goes, I think Jay, you know, Jay put it
Speaker 6: really well.
Speaker 8: As relates to the shapers, it was really the same
Speaker 8: on the contractor's side.
Speaker 6: I mean a lot of the projects that we're working on,
Speaker 6: you know, are two and three years out because frankly speaking,
Speaker 6: that's what it takes to get a team together generally.
Speaker 6: The fact that this team came together and literally a
Speaker 6: matter of two to three weeks is I still don't
Speaker 6: totally see how it worked out that way. It really
Speaker 6: was a project that was meant to happen. But you know,
Speaker 6: the shapers, I'll just really quickly with those guys. I
Speaker 6: mean the fact that they were able to come in
Speaker 6: on the rotation that they did give us, you know,
Speaker 6: and lend us their talents on that rotation. All three
Speaker 6: bought into the overall vision that Jay had and the concept,
Speaker 6: and then put their own little micro unique spin on
Speaker 6: you know, how they saw things unfolding. I think it
Speaker 6: just all came together for such an awesome, awesome golf
Speaker 6: experience and it's it's unique and interesting and different in
Speaker 6: you know, how each shaper puts their talent on things,
Speaker 6: but also it all came together and provides this really
Speaker 6: seamless journey through the property.
Speaker 8: So credit to those guys, Credit to Jay how that
Speaker 8: came together.
Speaker 6: As far as the contractor side, I kind of started
Speaker 6: having conversations with a couple of guys that I knew,
Speaker 6: you know, we're local and would probably have interest in this,
Speaker 6: going back to probably like August September of the year prior,
Speaker 6: just said, hey, I think we have a project. Pretty sure.
Speaker 6: We're not going to know until you know, like two
Speaker 6: three weeks before we're supposed to start. Can you guys,
Speaker 6: can you guys work with us on this, and thankfully
Speaker 6: they were able to. We had to get creative with
Speaker 6: the earthwork. We actually used a great here, a local
Speaker 6: contractor excavation contractor to help us with kind of the
Speaker 6: removal of all the organic soil that was on top
Speaker 6: of the sand, Durantaventables, and I had some relationships with them,
Speaker 6: kind of going back to my time working here at
Speaker 6: local private clubs, and they were great. You know, I'm
Speaker 6: still marveled that they didn't just walk off the property
Speaker 6: when we got the rain that we got in March
Speaker 6: and getting equipment stuck and everything else, and everybody just
Speaker 6: kind of marched forward with the great attitude and really,
Speaker 6: you know, hey, that piece of equipment isn't working.
Speaker 8: Let's try a new one, you know, let's try a
Speaker 8: different one. We did that about four or.
Speaker 6: Five times and ended up just quietly and happily getting
Speaker 6: to the end of that part of it. And then
Speaker 6: you know, a couple of we called them in you know,
Speaker 6: project MVPs. But our ariation contractor is is kind of
Speaker 6: a local legend, Brett Staples Park Consultants and based out
Speaker 6: of Pacific Grove.
Speaker 8: Literally it's him and two guys, and he runs.
Speaker 6: A great little company and helps out a lot of
Speaker 6: local golf courses here, you know, ranging from the Cyperus
Speaker 6: points of the world to you know, this city of
Speaker 6: Walling Creek. So he's kind of all over the place
Speaker 6: and does all different levels and really somebody of high
Speaker 6: integrity and honesty and work ethic and just one of
Speaker 6: those people that's rare to find these days that's going
Speaker 6: to operate really well on a handshake, you know, And
Speaker 6: those are the kind of people that we were able
Speaker 6: to get involved in this. And everybody's attitude was phenomenal.
Speaker 6: It all ended in a place where everybody was very
Speaker 6: excited about it, happy about it. The energy never got
Speaker 6: We never got to a negative point in the project.
Speaker 6: It was always everybody enjoyed coming here from the first
Speaker 6: day of.
Speaker 5: The last day.
Speaker 6: And that's a really special thing. If you've ever been
Speaker 6: a part of a construction project of any magnitude, that
Speaker 6: generally doesn't happen there's always a low point, and we
Speaker 6: never really had that. And I attribute that to the
Speaker 6: group that was brought together to work on this, from
Speaker 6: the contractors to the shapers to j and Dan being
Speaker 6: an awesome client. You know, the city it was, it
Speaker 6: was a really special thing to be a part of.
Speaker 6: So and I also want to mention, you know, a
Speaker 6: couple of strategic partners in this that you know, have
Speaker 6: just really helped us out along the way to Turf Star,
Speaker 6: our local Toro distributor. You know, I can't say enough
Speaker 6: about them. They've come out. And then there's even things
Speaker 6: that Dan and Jay don't know about that they've been
Speaker 6: able to help me with, you know, just dropping off
Speaker 6: mower so we needed, or coming out to adjust how
Speaker 6: to cut you know, I'm in the area, do you
Speaker 6: need anything. Definitely one of those where you know, unsung
Speaker 6: on that front. You know, there's been a lot of
Speaker 6: community that's come together on this thing to make it happen.
Speaker 6: And I'm sure I'm forgetting names, but try to mention
Speaker 6: them all at some point.
Speaker 5: Maybe uh, West Coast Turf and Ross Mitchell, Chris Mitchell,
Speaker 5: you know.
Speaker 6: Yep, yep, yeah, Russ and Chris on the on the
Speaker 6: irrigation design side. And then yeah, definitely the West Coast
Speaker 6: Turf guys coming out getting their hyde receiaters stuck in
Speaker 6: the sand.
Speaker 8: Multiple times, trying to get into places that I was trying.
Speaker 6: To get them to and again the list is very long,
Speaker 6: but point being, everybody did it with the right attitude,
Speaker 6: the right energy and knew the goal.
Speaker 1: There's a lot of people, Dan that are making you
Speaker 1: look really smart, aren't they.
Speaker 2: Yeah?
Speaker 7: No, you know it's interesting. You know, we're finally at
Speaker 7: the end game, which is so rewarding. You know, but
Speaker 7: going back several years ago, you know, as our lease
Speaker 7: was up and we're thinking do we want to stay
Speaker 7: in the golf operating business? And you know, we did
Speaker 7: a lot of modeling fiscally right, and I mean operating
Speaker 7: golf course isn't our first line of business, right, it's
Speaker 7: but we're in it because of the kids, right, It's
Speaker 7: an important strategy. But you know, working on fiscal models
Speaker 7: of and coming up with a new creator of lease
Speaker 7: agreement and could we fundraise in and you know, our leadership,
Speaker 7: Scott Sollers, you know, just kind of taking the reins
Speaker 7: and you know we fundraised nearly three million in a
Speaker 7: matter of months, right, I mean that just doesn't happen
Speaker 7: that often unless you have a strong brand and strong
Speaker 7: people behind it. You know, gentlemen, Chris Williams, who sits
Speaker 7: on the nonprofit board, you know, is there every step
Speaker 7: of the way from a fiscal perspective. So it definitely
Speaker 7: takes a village. It helps that it's a great village,
Speaker 7: and you know, at the end of the day, we're
Speaker 7: so excited to get this thing done and can't wait
Speaker 7: for everybody to see it. You know, it's such a
Speaker 7: massive win. Dan, you might want to share a little bit.
Speaker 5: You know, when people come out to the golf course
Speaker 5: when it is open for public play, they're probably going
Speaker 5: to run into Joe and Riley. You want to talk
Speaker 5: a little bit about them and we can all share
Speaker 5: what they bring to the table.
Speaker 7: Yeah, you know, we have a we kept staff there,
Speaker 7: you know, even though we're closed, and those guys have
Speaker 7: done everything from you know, helping pick weeds or you know,
Speaker 7: fixing fences that fall down in the night to like
Speaker 7: trying to get ready for to operate a new business
Speaker 7: that's going to be radically different than the business before, right.
Speaker 7: I mean we anticipate probably you know, forty five thousand rounds.
Speaker 7: We'll do excessive food and beverage, big first tea programs. Right,
Speaker 7: So those guys have been there with Jay and Josh
Speaker 7: every day. You know, doing daily tasks that maybe they
Speaker 7: haven't signed up for, and in the meantime they get
Speaker 7: ready to kind of open up and run a whole
Speaker 7: new business. So they've been rock stars as well through
Speaker 7: the project. Yeah, as Jos's alluded to, there's just too
Speaker 7: many names to to, you know, to mention, but we've
Speaker 7: been very fortunate to have the people that have been
Speaker 7: involved and have supported this project.
Speaker 4: You know, A natural question that comes out of this
Speaker 4: project is what's next. I mean, golf fans know that
Speaker 4: there's been this movement to save Shark Park and take
Speaker 4: it back to the Alistair McKenzie roots. I saw Richard
Speaker 4: Harris out at Golden Gate the other day. He's been
Speaker 4: the driving force behind Sharp Park for a long time.
Speaker 4: I mean, is this a blueprint perhaps, because I mean
Speaker 4: there's other city courses that need a lot of love,
Speaker 4: and like Golden Gate, they have great bones, they are
Speaker 4: on great sites. They could be amazing destinations for public
Speaker 4: golf and oh, by the way, money makers for the
Speaker 4: city of San Francisco. But it would probably take more
Speaker 4: private investment and more collaboration. But is this maybe a
Speaker 4: prelude to some more ambitious projects locally?
Speaker 7: You know, a few things, right, I mean, yet Harding
Speaker 7: get turned around, you know decades ago, right, hosting major championships.
Speaker 7: You have this project with Golden Gate Park. So a
Speaker 7: couple things are at play. Is one, the city of
Speaker 7: San Francisco in the Rerecon Park phil Ginsburg. They value
Speaker 7: their golf properties more than they ever had, even though
Speaker 7: from a budgetary standpoint, golf is such a small, you know,
Speaker 7: percentage of their overall budget. They're paying attention to it
Speaker 7: more than ever. They value their assets more than ever.
Speaker 7: And then to show the private donors investment world, like, hey,
Speaker 7: this is possible and it has such a great positive
Speaker 7: impact on kids or the community. Those things are lining
Speaker 7: up pretty strongly. And so a lot of the detraction
Speaker 7: of like municipalities and like, you know, it doesn't make sense.
Speaker 7: All those things are kind of those negative side are
Speaker 7: kind of being overcome. So I would say, now more
Speaker 7: than ever, you know, anything's possible. Those you know Lincoln
Speaker 7: Park and you know Sharp Parker two phenomenal public golf courses, right,
Speaker 7: but they are in need of infrastructure and other things.
Speaker 7: But Harding and now Golden Gate Park, you know absolutely
Speaker 7: a model that private public partnerships can work for the
Speaker 7: betterment of the community. It takes time and effort, but
Speaker 7: you know, we'll see what happens from here. I'm cautiously
Speaker 7: optimistic that we might see more of these types of
Speaker 7: things happen, not only locally, but hopefully around the country.
Speaker 1: Yes, it is, you know, this is. This is not
Speaker 1: you know, going back to Beth Page and Harding and
Speaker 1: Tory and then having it trickle down to places like
Speaker 1: Kiney Park or WP nine, goat Hill Park, Canal Shores,
Speaker 1: now Belmont and Richmond like this.
Speaker 5: This is.
Speaker 1: This is an ongoing thing. This is a real trend
Speaker 1: in golf. I this is you know, you don't. The
Speaker 1: good news here is this is yet another layer on
Speaker 1: top of this cake in which people can use as
Speaker 1: an example of what's possible if you have local leadership
Speaker 1: like John Ashworth or like someone like yourself, Dan or
Speaker 1: some like you know, a Sandy Tatum or someone who says,
Speaker 1: hold on, let's identify an issue, let's let's let's formulate
Speaker 1: a plan. Let's look around and see where this plan
Speaker 1: and this process has benefited. Bobby Jones in Atlanta. You know,
Speaker 1: this is happening all over the place, and that's what's
Speaker 1: so cool and fun and exciting about this, And Jay
Speaker 1: you pointed out about how, you know, the par three
Speaker 1: course is a trend, but mostly that's happening at resorts
Speaker 1: where you got to pay a premium. That the really
Speaker 1: cool thing about this being a par three course. Winter
Speaker 1: Park Nine's an executive Go Hill Park's an executive Belmont's
Speaker 1: kind of They went to a par three plus a
Speaker 1: version of of Tilling hass Old you know, old original,
Speaker 1: you know this is this is to me, what's the
Speaker 1: most exciting thing about this momentum and movement, the architecture
Speaker 1: and sustainability, the teamwork makes a dream work like right, Like,
Speaker 1: isn't that what's what you like? That's why people moved
Speaker 1: heaven and Earth to be a part of this or
Speaker 1: stop and said how can I help or how because
Speaker 1: it is feeling like this this organic you know growth
Speaker 1: and why I say the true leaders in the game
Speaker 1: are people like yourselves, you know, and that are willing
Speaker 1: to actually do something for the good of the growth
Speaker 1: of the game as it relates to affordability, accessibility. Kids.
Speaker 5: Yeah, I think you know again, that's what excited all
Speaker 5: of us to be part of this is that we
Speaker 5: saw that opportunity. We saw the impact that it would
Speaker 5: have on the on the community. The idea that you
Speaker 5: could have something that's equally as compelling as the sandbox
Speaker 5: at Sand Valley or the preserve abandoned and have it
Speaker 5: in a local community where people can get there on
Speaker 5: their bike or buy Ammuni bus. Right, those those things
Speaker 5: are are really exciting, And to your point, there are
Speaker 5: other samples around the country. We're good and has happened,
Speaker 5: and public private partnerships have worked, and hopefully this is
Speaker 5: the tip of the iceberg that there. You know, whether
Speaker 5: it's you think about just about every major city in
Speaker 5: the country has their parking rec system or whichever umbrella
Speaker 5: it's under, is going to have multiple golf courses, and
Speaker 5: odds are they're lacking in infrastructure, they're maybe not architecturally compelling,
Speaker 5: maybe they're not thriving from a business standpoint, and hopefully
Speaker 5: the light bulb will go on that there's opportunity there
Speaker 5: and with the right people involved, that dramatic transformation can happen,
Speaker 5: and that transformation is going to positively impact generations of golfers.
Speaker 4: And just to speak to the value that Dan mentioned earlier,
Speaker 4: not to pick on Peter Hay, but it is kind
Speaker 4: of the nearest Part three that's been redone recently. I'm
Speaker 4: not seventy five bucks, and it's on a tight, little
Speaker 4: cramped site. Half the holes are just a little knockdown,
Speaker 4: you know, half swing sixty degree wedges. And I mean
Speaker 4: Golden Gate is a big, expansive piece of property. It's
Speaker 4: almost triple the size the footprint of Peter Hay. And
Speaker 4: you know, the first hole, I hit six iron and it'
Speaker 4: st uphill a little into the breeze. I think it
Speaker 4: was one fifty five on the ground, playing about one
Speaker 4: seventy five. Like you have to swing away at Golden
Speaker 4: Gate a few times, and there's some you know, I
Speaker 4: think the last hole maybe hit an eight iron, like
Speaker 4: you know, it's playing about one fifty five. I mean
Speaker 4: there's some meaty par threes. It's not you're not just
Speaker 4: bunting it around like sometimes you feel like, you know,
Speaker 4: the cradle at Piners is wonderful. Everyone loves it. But
Speaker 4: again it's a lot of little holes. I mean, Golden
Speaker 4: Gate feels like like a big ballpark for a Part three,
Speaker 4: and you have to hit a lot of different shots.
Speaker 4: And because the you know, the holes are long, you're
Speaker 4: gonna miss some greens, and then you have some really
Speaker 4: fun short game options. So and you know, to get
Speaker 4: that much of a golf course for forty bucks, I
Speaker 4: think is incredible, you know, Alan.
Speaker 7: To your point, I mean, you know, there's a lot
Speaker 7: of phenomenal private clubs in our neighborhood, right, I mean
Speaker 7: some of the top twenty courses, top fifty, top hunter
Speaker 7: courses in the world. You know, from my lens, you
Speaker 7: could take any of the nine holes at Golden Gate Park,
Speaker 7: any single one of those, drop them over at the
Speaker 7: neighboring private club as a part three on those courses
Speaker 7: and it would fit in perfect and be a very.
Speaker 2: Good hole at any of those courses. Right. So to
Speaker 2: me that from that lens, boy, it's just phenomenal nine
Speaker 2: you know, great little holes, right yeah.
Speaker 4: I mean, people who don't know the geography of San Francisco,
Speaker 4: Harding Park, the Olympic Club, San Fransco, Golf Club, Lake
Speaker 4: merc said, they're all clustered in on the western edge
Speaker 4: of the Cow Club exactly kind of western edge of
Speaker 4: San Francisco. And to get the Golden Gate Park golf course,
Speaker 4: it is about what ten minute drive up the coast.
Speaker 4: I mean it's so I think you'll get a lot
Speaker 4: of that spill over play where you know, a guy
Speaker 4: goes and plays col Club, he wants a little more golf,
Speaker 4: but he's not he's not ready for another eighteen holes.
Speaker 4: Like why just jump jump in your tesla and drive
Speaker 4: over to to maybe a range rover if you're pretty incorrect,
Speaker 4: and you just just head over to Goldenate Park. And
Speaker 4: I mean it's a perfect sort of afternoon stroll when
Speaker 4: you just need a little more golf. So it is
Speaker 4: going to be an incredible community resource and the first
Speaker 4: tea kids are going to be the big beneficiaries. But
Speaker 4: I think hardcore golfers are still going to go over
Speaker 4: there and play it and see it.
Speaker 2: From cal Club. They're probably actually going to need to
Speaker 2: take an uber the.
Speaker 1: You know, I think I got some time. I wasn't
Speaker 1: there on this last outing, but I was there a
Speaker 1: couple of weeks ago when the course was playable and
Speaker 1: we hit some shots and we met up with some
Speaker 1: of the locals. Haley, who started her own women's group,
Speaker 1: who lives around the corner and has played it for
Speaker 1: twenty years, doesn't have her own handicap because it just
Speaker 1: does never play eighteen holes. She can now eventually start
Speaker 1: registering scores, which is cool, but she's so excited to
Speaker 1: get back there out there. Gary Giubeni. Gary Giubeni, who's
Speaker 1: been playing this golf course since he was five years
Speaker 1: old with his dad and played in the in the
Speaker 1: in the the family event I guess at Golden Gate
Speaker 1: Park And for him, he was admittedly a little bummed
Speaker 1: to have the course closed, but because you guys allowed
Speaker 1: him the occasional access and he got to walk around
Speaker 1: and be a part of the process, and he, you know, said,
Speaker 1: summarize the whole thing as like incredible or amazing, you know,
Speaker 1: and being able to watch him now you know he's
Speaker 1: you know, older in age, he's gone away from Golden
Speaker 1: Gate Park now coming back to me like that's that's
Speaker 1: the most kind of coolest exciting thing about this. In
Speaker 1: addition to the kids, and we talked to Abe, who
Speaker 1: you know, made his first part on the second hole,
Speaker 1: and and Haley had her first hole in one on
Speaker 1: what is now the eighth hole, and can't wait to
Speaker 1: see if she can have a hole in one on
Speaker 1: now what is now the eight Like the locals are
Speaker 1: just like champing at the bit to get back out
Speaker 1: there and experience what is essentially a new golf course
Speaker 1: for them. What a gift.
Speaker 7: It is a true local spot, right, it is got
Speaker 7: you know, it is a nor Cal version of that.
Speaker 2: Right. It's all about the people that live locally.
Speaker 7: There's definitely be a new new segment or sector of
Speaker 7: the population that are going to want to come see it,
Speaker 7: and hopefully we'll be able to exceed everybody.
Speaker 1: It's gonna be the only thing bad about Goligate Park
Speaker 1: is it's only nine olds. It needs to be like
Speaker 1: twenty seven. You got to get more park, Dan, get
Speaker 1: more parks.
Speaker 2: Right, Yeah.
Speaker 7: My line is, yeah, you can go play two through
Speaker 7: eight anytime you want.
Speaker 5: I do want to jump in and say, you know,
Speaker 5: you talked about first Holling ones out there. We're having
Speaker 5: some preview play out there a little bit, and the
Speaker 5: last forty eight hours or so, I've got I've gotten
Speaker 5: to witness three of them. So we had the first
Speaker 5: one on number two Saturday morning, and then on Tuesday
Speaker 5: we had one first swing of the day on whole
Speaker 5: number one, get up, first swing of the day, Jack
Speaker 5: knocks it and the beauty of it is that you know,
Speaker 5: he hits it, you know, fifteen feet left, it goes
Speaker 5: ten feet past the hole and then it just trickles
Speaker 5: back in. And that was one that you could You
Speaker 5: didn't know it was in or out until you got up,
Speaker 5: so you had to wait until you walked all the
Speaker 5: way up the hill and peeped in the hole and
Speaker 5: saw that it was there. And then a good friend
Speaker 5: of mine, Jason Bruno lynks Nation on Twitter. He flew
Speaker 5: in from South Florida to join us, and he makes
Speaker 5: one twenty minutes before sunset on eight where he throws
Speaker 5: it beyond the hole and then it just trickles, and
Speaker 5: you know, it takes ten seconds for the ball to
Speaker 5: move ten feet and trickle back in. And then by
Speaker 5: the time it goes in, you know, everybody's you know,
Speaker 5: and cartwheels and high five and and bear hugging on
Speaker 5: the tee. It's it's it's pretty fun. So if you
Speaker 5: need to make an eighth call me up. I'm happy
Speaker 5: to escort you around.
Speaker 4: Golden Gates at the pins.
Speaker 1: Dude, Josh, I just talked for a second because you know,
Speaker 1: we've been simultaneously working Golden Gate Park and Passa Tempo,
Speaker 1: Santa Cruz to San Francisco, restoring Alistair McKenzie greens to
Speaker 1: re you know, renovating this little local nine hole part
Speaker 1: three course. And you've you know, you've had, You've really
Speaker 1: been on you know, boots on the ground at Golden
Speaker 1: Gate Park, but also consulting with and and and being
Speaker 1: another set of eyes for Justin Mandon and Jim Urbina
Speaker 1: at pass Tempo. My world's collided. As I was at
Speaker 1: Positi come rolling up in a cart. I was like, wait,
Speaker 1: where did I take a wrong turn? That's Josh Lewis
Speaker 1: in a cart at pos Tempo when I was, you know,
Speaker 1: just saw you at Golden Gate Park. But to watch
Speaker 1: simultaneously these two projects happening at two public facilities on
Speaker 1: two very opposite ends of the spectrum in you know,
Speaker 1: price point business model degrees of difficulty, Like, how crazy
Speaker 1: has it been for you to be going sort of
Speaker 1: back and forth from these two and watching all of
Speaker 1: this unfold? Uh, you know, in kind of your your
Speaker 1: neck of the woods.
Speaker 8: I've had I've had a pretty good year. It's been
Speaker 8: a pretty it's.
Speaker 2: Been a pretty good for me.
Speaker 5: How do you top this?
Speaker 6: No, I mean it's it's I kind of you know,
Speaker 6: this has been a twenty five years of doing this
Speaker 6: and it's been a it's been a pretty awesome experience
Speaker 6: this year to have you know, a client like like
Speaker 6: Dan in the first tea and be able to be
Speaker 6: a part of this project, work with a buddy and
Speaker 6: Jay and you know, put something out there for the
Speaker 6: local community in the first tea. And then and then
Speaker 6: on the like you said, on the other end of
Speaker 6: the spectrum, to be a part of something so special
Speaker 6: a posse and you know, be able there to to
Speaker 6: support one of my best friends in Justin and you know,
Speaker 6: I'm I'm pretty grateful for both of those opportunities. But yeah,
Speaker 6: I think the ties that bind writer the public access
Speaker 6: and you know where Mary and Holland started out at
Speaker 6: past Tiempo and wanted to make sure that that remained
Speaker 6: a facet of that business forever, you know, and then
Speaker 6: to look at the way that you know, that's really
Speaker 6: the primary goal of Golden Gate is is you know,
Speaker 6: the first t Outer Richmond Outer sunset, you know, twenty
Speaker 6: five bucks.
Speaker 8: You know, that's that's that's truly growing the game in
Speaker 8: that regard to But.
Speaker 6: Yeah, two of the most special things I've ever gotten
Speaker 6: to do, and I got to do them at the
Speaker 6: same time in the same year is pretty incredible.
Speaker 8: That's awesome.
Speaker 4: And I was just reading on well a named golf
Speaker 4: website that had this big write up of the Tree
Speaker 4: Farm and Old Barnwell, there's two courses in South Carolina
Speaker 4: that are geographically pretty close to each other, and it
Speaker 4: was an interesting article. They sound like cool places, but
Speaker 4: ninety nine point nine nine percent of the readers will
Speaker 4: never get to play either one because they're private. And
Speaker 4: so it's kind of like, what's the point, you know,
Speaker 4: why even why am I even reading the story because
Speaker 4: it doesn't it's not applicable to the golfing public. But
Speaker 4: Pasta Tempo and of course Golden Gate are open everybody.
Speaker 4: And that's just something that you have to shout from
Speaker 4: the rooftops because it's rare in this game. You know,
Speaker 4: the most celebrated courses, the ones that people obsess over
Speaker 4: all the lists, all the you know, the the sunset
Speaker 4: photos on on Twitter. I mean, most people can't play them,
Speaker 4: which is obnoxious. And so the fact that that you know,
Speaker 4: Post Tempo is the top one hundred course everyone's going
Speaker 4: to get to play, and now Golden Gate is gonna
Speaker 4: be its own this magnet. I just think it's such
Speaker 4: a it's so meaningful. It means a lot to me
Speaker 4: and match to spotlight these stories. And obviously it's that
Speaker 4: passion that that drew the three of you guys into this,
Speaker 4: this project at Golden Gates. So hat tip to y'all
Speaker 4: for you know, flying the flag for public golf. It's
Speaker 4: really it's never been more important.
Speaker 1: Hey, Dan, I'm curious from a First Tea perspective, and
Speaker 1: I'm honestly don't know. And you've alluded to the fact
Speaker 1: that you know, generally you guys, don't you know, manage facilities, right,
Speaker 1: You kind of utilize facilities as these hubs of opportunities
Speaker 1: to reach reach kids and have an impact on the
Speaker 1: greater good. Do you think from a blueprint standpoint? And
Speaker 1: back to that question, do you think First T, you know,
Speaker 1: the national First T has got an I on this
Speaker 1: and this will ultimately end up impacting any other First
Speaker 1: te facilities going forward? Like, is this is this something
Speaker 1: within First T that is that you think might happen
Speaker 1: more or or or or to be determined?
Speaker 7: Good question, Matt, I mean, so you know, you take
Speaker 7: one hundred and fifty plus chapters around the country, there
Speaker 7: are First Chapters already operating golf courses, right, you know,
Speaker 7: it's not rare to have a municipal facility look to
Speaker 7: the local First Tea after it's growing and say, hey,
Speaker 7: here's one of our golf courses, why don't you take
Speaker 7: this over?
Speaker 2: So that precedent's been around for a while.
Speaker 7: What will get people excited for this particular project is
Speaker 7: leveraging what First he is doing in their own community
Speaker 7: to raise private funds to invest in those properties for
Speaker 7: the long term success of the chapter.
Speaker 2: Right.
Speaker 7: I think that's the added layer here is where we've
Speaker 7: used our donor base who are already supporting First t
Speaker 7: and they understood, like, this is a play for us
Speaker 7: to control this course and access at an important program
Speaker 7: site for the next fifteen years. That synergy, I think
Speaker 7: is going to really you know, show for the First
Speaker 7: Team network that this is as possible, you know, So
Speaker 7: we hope, you know, it helps the groundswell of you know,
Speaker 7: the First Teas are successful right now and the growth
Speaker 7: is there and the demand is off the charts, right,
Speaker 7: so hopefully with you know, community grassroots efforts to raise money.
Speaker 7: You can see you know, projects like you know Brettschneider
Speaker 7: did in Richmond, and hear what we've done in in
Speaker 7: San Francisco that can happen in a Sacramento or a
Speaker 7: Seattle or you know other first tea hubs around the country.
Speaker 1: You know, the the National Links Trust obviously, you know,
Speaker 1: I think Jay you were on a you were possibly
Speaker 1: on a panel recently Steve Leary, the mayor of winter
Speaker 1: Park nine at the time when that pro you know
Speaker 1: got put through and went from losing two hundred and
Speaker 1: fifty grand a year to now being a money maker,
Speaker 1: like you know what you know, Will Smith obviously being
Speaker 1: a you know, one of these people worth mentioning as
Speaker 1: a true leader trying to rally a community and private
Speaker 1: you know, funding and getting the effort to try to
Speaker 1: like make a difference. Is there best practices to be shared?
Speaker 1: Here are their tips or thought? You know John Ashworth
Speaker 1: gets you know, pinged constantly.
Speaker 5: What do I do?
Speaker 1: How do I do it? How can I do this?
Speaker 1: How can I do what you're doing? I have a
Speaker 1: local course that needs help. What do you guys have?
Speaker 1: Little things that you will ultimately end up sharing with
Speaker 1: others on what can or should be done to make
Speaker 1: a difference.
Speaker 5: Yeah, we talked about that at the National Links Trust.
Speaker 5: They have an annual symposium on municipal golf and they
Speaker 5: have different panels and I was fortunate enough to serve
Speaker 5: on the architecture panel two years ago and then and
Speaker 5: then back just a month ago, and that was one
Speaker 5: of the things that we talked about, is you know,
Speaker 5: how do you pull it off? And so some of
Speaker 5: the things that we talked about were, you know, relationships right.
Speaker 5: So obviously Dan being at Olngate Park and with the
Speaker 5: first Tee for ten years, he's built those relationships within
Speaker 5: the city. So when it came time to work on
Speaker 5: a lease negotiation, they knew who that they who they
Speaker 5: were talking to. So identifying the right team members who
Speaker 5: have the right relationships, I think is critical. And then
Speaker 5: you know, Dan can probably speak to this. But then
Speaker 5: if you are trying to put a project together and
Speaker 5: a plan together, you know, trying to identify a team
Speaker 5: that's going to be all in and invested right and
Speaker 5: is in it for the right reasons. Oftentimes that's finding
Speaker 5: people who have a tie to that community, whether they
Speaker 5: live there locally or grew up in the area, or
Speaker 5: who's going to pour their heart and soul into the
Speaker 5: project and give it everything that they've got and pull
Speaker 5: everything together. So and you know, there's so many aspects
Speaker 5: to it, whether it's the operations or the fundraising, or
Speaker 5: the marketing, or the design and the construction. There's all
Speaker 5: those things. But at the end of the day, stuff
Speaker 5: gets done because of people, and so it's identifying the
Speaker 5: right people and setting them up for success, I think
Speaker 5: is the key.
Speaker 2: Yean, Yeah, I think Jay hit it on the head right. One.
Speaker 7: We've had a long standing positive relationship with the wreck
Speaker 7: and Park right they love us as an operator. We
Speaker 7: see this as a you know, important strategy in the
Speaker 7: long term. And then you have from the funding perspective,
Speaker 7: our long term donors, you know, have invested for the
Speaker 7: last twenty years, so reinvesting makes sense to them, especially
Speaker 7: if it made sense for us from a programmatic standpoint.
Speaker 7: And it's not easy to accomplish, but it is doable
Speaker 7: to Jay's point, if the right people are in the room.
Speaker 7: So you're right, Matt, it does take people from the
Speaker 7: local community to band together, you know, look at things
Speaker 7: very strategically and smartly and do some diligence, but ultimately,
Speaker 7: if you can get the right people in the room,
Speaker 7: you know, things like this can't happen.
Speaker 5: I'll just follow up real quick and just say from
Speaker 5: city side of things or from the municipality side of things,
Speaker 5: what you want to try and identify as who's the
Speaker 5: person on that side of the table that can get
Speaker 5: that can get you to the wind right because municipalities
Speaker 5: are inherently set up with layers and layers of red
Speaker 5: tape and all these different processes, whether it's RFPs or
Speaker 5: things like that that are just barriers to success in
Speaker 5: so many ways. And so identifying the person within the
Speaker 5: municipality who can be your partner, who can who can
Speaker 5: navigate those waters, who can find the way to get
Speaker 5: to yes as opposed to listing the twelve ways that
Speaker 5: we're going to end up at no, and and that
Speaker 5: that person is as critical as anybody.
Speaker 8: I think I think too.
Speaker 6: One thing and working with a couple of different municipalities
Speaker 6: is some things are transferable. You know, some things that
Speaker 6: Dan has been able to do as City of San
Speaker 6: Francisco will work, you know, regardless of the municipality. But
Speaker 6: each city is going to have very specific things that
Speaker 6: are unique to them that you need to understand and
Speaker 6: be flexible in working with, you know, figuring those things out.
Speaker 5: You know.
Speaker 6: I think that's one of the things that Dan's done
Speaker 6: a really good job of with City San Francisco. And
Speaker 6: we've had this conversation quite a bit through this project.
Speaker 6: Is you know, this is this is just how it
Speaker 6: needs to be done. This is you know, I know
Speaker 6: there's an ideal or I know there's a way we'd
Speaker 6: like to do this, but this is the way we
Speaker 6: need to do it. And understanding those key things depending
Speaker 6: on which city you're working with, I think is really important.
Speaker 6: Each region of the country is going to have different
Speaker 6: priorities and you know, learning, learning their system, being a
Speaker 6: master of their system.
Speaker 4: This is so yeah, it is. I mean, Dan, you
Speaker 4: said the key is to get the right people. I
Speaker 4: think it's obvious to the listeners like you guys are
Speaker 4: the right people for this job. You know, we've we've
Speaker 4: been talking about Golden Gate Park going back to February.
Speaker 4: Now now it's here and it's just a delight. I
Speaker 4: think everyone who's listened to this podcast is going to
Speaker 4: want to go play it. I would encourage them to Do,
Speaker 4: so it's it's just a really special thing and it's
Speaker 4: been fun for us to be a part of it.
Speaker 4: Seems like a good time to draw this podcast to close.
Speaker 4: Anyone have any final thoughts before we release the listeners.
Speaker 1: I just want to say that I think it's cool
Speaker 1: from an architectural standpoint that Jay, you know, I know,
Speaker 1: you know, you've been flying below the radar. You're in
Speaker 1: your early forties, You've worked on some big projects, You've
Speaker 1: done some really cool stuff. Some of it's been private,
Speaker 1: or some of it's been under the you know, under
Speaker 1: the in the shadow of other big name architects. And
Speaker 1: you know, we've seen what happened with Keith rev and
Speaker 1: Riley Johns at WP nine and then they did the
Speaker 1: short Course at fors Do, and we've seen you know
Speaker 1: what you know, Gil Hans did with the Cradle, and
Speaker 1: obviously Bill and Bennett to preserve, and then Dave Accident
Speaker 1: and Rod Whitman, you know, and Keith at Shorty. You know,
Speaker 1: the littlest things can somew sometimes have the biggest impact.
Speaker 1: And I'm really excited for you. I've I've really enjoyed
Speaker 1: the walking talks that we've all had out there I'm
Speaker 1: gonna miss I said our text thread of this group
Speaker 1: is one of my favorite things. I wanted to keep
Speaker 1: going just because this project is over. I want us
Speaker 1: to all keep in touch. I'm going to miss you.
Speaker 1: Guys already have separation anxiety. I just it's just, you know,
Speaker 1: the sense of discovery for me, whether it's travel or
Speaker 1: you know, going and seeing a new course or meeting
Speaker 1: a new architect. What Todd Quintino is doing at Canal
Speaker 1: Shores is another thing.
Speaker 7: You know.
Speaker 1: I haven't really met and talked to Ty. Can't wait
Speaker 1: to see like these little projects can have. It can
Speaker 1: be the biggest stones in this in this in this
Speaker 1: pond of golf. And the reason why I support the
Speaker 1: growth of the game, or say anti rollbackers, is be
Speaker 1: simply because the game has given me so much. It's
Speaker 1: given everybody on this call so much, everybody listening so much.
Speaker 1: We want to you know, it makes better people. What
Speaker 1: Golden Gate Park is going to do is help create
Speaker 1: that camaraderie and that culture and that community aspect in
Speaker 1: which we all feel like we're a part of something
Speaker 1: and watching all of this continue to have generational impact
Speaker 1: on the greater good of not just golfers, but as
Speaker 1: like first he says, people, that's why all of this matters,
Speaker 1: and why it's so feel good and why it's just
Speaker 1: fun to be a small part of it. Congratulations to
Speaker 1: you guys, Congratulations to everyone involved, Congratulations to the people
Speaker 1: who who put their money where their mouth is and
Speaker 1: and and I can't wait to continue to watch it
Speaker 1: just sort of uh, you know, thrive and survive and
Speaker 1: flourish and make an impact. So thank you, Thank you
Speaker 1: for letting us be a small part of this.
Speaker 5: Is an easy solution to separation anxiety. Come on up,
Speaker 5: I'm out.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, we got a whole other year of positive
Speaker 1: Temple automatically puts me in the area. So this is uh,
Speaker 1: it's going to happen, and.
Speaker 5: I look forward to it.
Speaker 2: Thanks you guys, much appreciated.
Speaker 5: Thanks, thanks so much for all you've done. It's really
Speaker 5: been special to watch you guys document and your storytelling
Speaker 5: is is really unparalleled, and so it's great for us
Speaker 5: to be able. You know, we knew this was going
Speaker 5: to be something special, but we didn't know how to
Speaker 5: share it with the world, and so to be able
Speaker 5: to have you guys do that as meant the world
Speaker 5: to us, so we appreciate all that you guys.
Speaker 1: Do, watching you taking your designs and layering them over
Speaker 1: that dirt, and and now what we're going to unveil
Speaker 1: in this next part where it actually becomes something real
Speaker 1: like your drawings themselves.
Speaker 5: I hope.
Speaker 1: Dan, this is my suggestion, take Jay's drawings, blow them up,
Speaker 1: post your size, and put them in that new clubhouse
Speaker 1: when it's gonna avail, because they are so cool to
Speaker 1: just look at and see and then go actually watch
Speaker 1: the ball do what he kind of shows it's going
Speaker 1: to do.
Speaker 5: It's amazing.
Speaker 1: It's really cool.
Speaker 2: Jay. Are you gonna charge me for that.
Speaker 5: That he won't donate? That's maybe a Burger dog or something.
Speaker 4: All right, well, great stuff, y'all. This has been another
Speaker 4: fire Drill podcast or Matt Janella, Josh Lewis, Jay Blasei,
Speaker 4: and Dan Burke. This is Allen Schiffnook. Thanks for listening,
Speaker 4: and we'll be back in your ear soon. Definitely go
Speaker 4: to firepay Collective dot com. You can watch the videos,
Speaker 4: read the stories, and get either even more immersed in
Speaker 4: what's happening at Golden Gate Park golf Course. That's the
Speaker 4: end of this podcast. Goodbye, that big gun.
Speaker 3: I played the wind, made a fortune. When my ship
Speaker 3: came in, I ran the table, never thought I could
Speaker 3: fall down.
Speaker 8: The winter time hit me like a cannon in the ball.
Speaker 3: And now I can't shape this losing streak. Every road
Speaker 3: I take it is a dead end street. I got
Speaker 3: thoughts in my head, can't get them out, trying not
Speaker 3: to think what I'm thinking about.
Speaker 8: I got thoughts in my head, can't
Speaker 3: Get them out, Trying not to think what I'm thinking about.