1 00:00:11,880 --> 00:00:15,400 Speaker 1: Greetings and welcome to wok F with me Danielle Moody. 2 00:00:15,480 --> 00:00:17,800 Speaker 1: This week marked the beginning of the murder trial from 3 00:00:17,840 --> 00:00:22,840 Speaker 1: Minneapolis police ex officer Derek Chauvin, who killed George Floyd 4 00:00:22,920 --> 00:00:26,000 Speaker 1: in broad daylight nearly a year ago by kneeling on 5 00:00:26,040 --> 00:00:29,479 Speaker 1: his neck for close to nine minutes, setting off a 6 00:00:29,520 --> 00:00:33,120 Speaker 1: renewed wave of protests against police brutality and white supremacy 7 00:00:33,320 --> 00:00:37,159 Speaker 1: across the country. I'm joined every week with my friend 8 00:00:37,360 --> 00:00:41,040 Speaker 1: and MSNBC legal analyst Glenn Kirshner, who for thirty years 9 00:00:41,080 --> 00:00:44,040 Speaker 1: worked as a federal prosecutor. This week I asked him 10 00:00:44,080 --> 00:00:46,479 Speaker 1: to break down the numerous aspects of the Chauvin pre 11 00:00:46,600 --> 00:00:50,159 Speaker 1: trial process that have been troubling me. Glenn's explanations were 12 00:00:50,240 --> 00:00:53,120 Speaker 1: so in depth and so informative. We ended up talking 13 00:00:53,120 --> 00:00:56,360 Speaker 1: for almost a half hour about this pivotal trial. To 14 00:00:56,440 --> 00:00:58,840 Speaker 1: hear our full conversation, which is one I think is 15 00:00:58,960 --> 00:01:02,080 Speaker 1: essential listening for anyone that will be following this trial 16 00:01:02,120 --> 00:01:04,839 Speaker 1: in the coming weeks, head over to patreon dot com 17 00:01:04,880 --> 00:01:08,479 Speaker 1: slash woke F and subscribe for just five dollars a month. 18 00:01:08,680 --> 00:01:11,160 Speaker 1: I'm sure this will not be the last time that 19 00:01:11,240 --> 00:01:13,920 Speaker 1: Glenn and I talk about this particular trial, and I 20 00:01:13,959 --> 00:01:16,800 Speaker 1: talk with so many other experts and thinkers five days 21 00:01:16,800 --> 00:01:19,320 Speaker 1: a week on my show. But for now, I do 22 00:01:19,480 --> 00:01:22,080 Speaker 1: want to share with you Glenn's breakdown of the lesser 23 00:01:22,120 --> 00:01:25,839 Speaker 1: included third degree murder charge, which has since been restored, 24 00:01:25,959 --> 00:01:29,280 Speaker 1: how the jury selection process works, how Chauvin's defense might 25 00:01:29,400 --> 00:01:33,800 Speaker 1: use George Floyd's autopsy against the prosecution, and ultimately whether 26 00:01:33,840 --> 00:01:36,919 Speaker 1: he thinks Derek Chauvin will be convicted of the murder 27 00:01:36,920 --> 00:01:42,280 Speaker 1: of George Floyd. The feeling here for me with regard 28 00:01:42,360 --> 00:01:45,160 Speaker 1: to the second degree murder charge and a third degree 29 00:01:45,240 --> 00:01:48,400 Speaker 1: murder charge and having both of those stand, is that 30 00:01:49,160 --> 00:01:52,160 Speaker 1: I don't want him to get the lesser charge right, 31 00:01:52,360 --> 00:01:55,520 Speaker 1: And the understanding is that one I'm not hopeful. The 32 00:01:55,560 --> 00:01:58,520 Speaker 1: pattern that we have seen since the murder of Trayvon 33 00:01:58,640 --> 00:02:01,480 Speaker 1: Martin has been the same, has been consistent. There's been 34 00:02:01,520 --> 00:02:06,800 Speaker 1: no deviation, except for I believe in one case where 35 00:02:07,840 --> 00:02:10,440 Speaker 1: the young man and I'm forgetting his name because there 36 00:02:10,480 --> 00:02:13,320 Speaker 1: have just been so many was shot to death in 37 00:02:13,320 --> 00:02:16,600 Speaker 1: a car because he was playing loud music. The older 38 00:02:16,639 --> 00:02:20,320 Speaker 1: white man who shot him went to jail. But in 39 00:02:20,360 --> 00:02:23,560 Speaker 1: every case and every other case, these people get off, 40 00:02:23,600 --> 00:02:26,639 Speaker 1: whether you are a white vigilante or a white police officer. 41 00:02:26,720 --> 00:02:31,520 Speaker 1: My question though, with regard to how we are looking 42 00:02:31,520 --> 00:02:34,200 Speaker 1: at these drawers, some of the questions to me seem 43 00:02:34,280 --> 00:02:38,640 Speaker 1: incredibly problematic, which is, do you support Blue Lives matter? 44 00:02:38,800 --> 00:02:41,120 Speaker 1: Do you support Black lives matter? Have you been to 45 00:02:41,200 --> 00:02:43,720 Speaker 1: a protest? If you were at a protest, did you 46 00:02:43,760 --> 00:02:46,200 Speaker 1: bring a sign. If you brought a sign, what was 47 00:02:46,240 --> 00:02:49,280 Speaker 1: on that sign. The idea that we can't even in 48 00:02:49,320 --> 00:02:52,320 Speaker 1: this country say that black lives matter and make that 49 00:02:52,400 --> 00:02:58,720 Speaker 1: into something that is somehow conspiratorial, somehow violent, when in 50 00:02:58,760 --> 00:03:02,040 Speaker 1: fact everything you've seen is to the contrary of that 51 00:03:02,600 --> 00:03:06,359 Speaker 1: is incredible to me. And we also seek to look 52 00:03:06,360 --> 00:03:11,760 Speaker 1: for people that are what unbiased or are impartial. And 53 00:03:11,800 --> 00:03:16,200 Speaker 1: I don't understand how everyone in the world saw that 54 00:03:16,320 --> 00:03:19,520 Speaker 1: video of George Floyd taking his last ust everyone in 55 00:03:19,560 --> 00:03:23,440 Speaker 1: the world. So how do we look for impartiality when 56 00:03:23,520 --> 00:03:28,000 Speaker 1: something went viral? So okay, there's a lot to unpack, 57 00:03:28,040 --> 00:03:30,320 Speaker 1: so many great questions. First of all, when we talk 58 00:03:30,400 --> 00:03:33,880 Speaker 1: about the judge getting rid of the third degree murder charge, 59 00:03:33,919 --> 00:03:37,120 Speaker 1: he did that because he thought, legally speaking, that was 60 00:03:37,280 --> 00:03:41,400 Speaker 1: not an appropriate theory of liability, as the Minnesota law 61 00:03:41,920 --> 00:03:45,320 Speaker 1: is drafted, so when I said it might be perceived 62 00:03:45,400 --> 00:03:48,760 Speaker 1: I should have said it might be misperceived by chauvin 63 00:03:48,960 --> 00:03:51,600 Speaker 1: or by some as Hey, this judge threw out a charge, 64 00:03:51,640 --> 00:03:53,480 Speaker 1: Maybe that's good for us. He was doing what he 65 00:03:53,520 --> 00:03:56,320 Speaker 1: thought was right. I believe based on the law, So 66 00:03:58,200 --> 00:03:59,560 Speaker 1: it's and it may not. I don't want to get 67 00:03:59,560 --> 00:04:02,080 Speaker 1: down on the lead weeds. It may not technically be 68 00:04:02,200 --> 00:04:05,320 Speaker 1: a lesser included offense under the law because you need 69 00:04:05,360 --> 00:04:07,640 Speaker 1: to have elements in common as you work your way 70 00:04:07,640 --> 00:04:11,440 Speaker 1: down to lesser included offenses, and the theories of liability 71 00:04:11,440 --> 00:04:12,960 Speaker 1: are kind of different, so it may not be a 72 00:04:13,040 --> 00:04:15,600 Speaker 1: lesser included. Let me talk about lesser included every time 73 00:04:15,640 --> 00:04:18,719 Speaker 1: I try to first degree premeditated murder case. You bet 74 00:04:18,760 --> 00:04:21,279 Speaker 1: I wanted the lesser included a second degree murder to 75 00:04:21,320 --> 00:04:24,200 Speaker 1: go to the jury. Why Because if I didn't persuade 76 00:04:24,240 --> 00:04:28,159 Speaker 1: all twelve jurors beyond a reasonable doubt that the defendant 77 00:04:28,200 --> 00:04:34,760 Speaker 1: actually engaged in premeditation and deliberation before killing the victim, 78 00:04:35,279 --> 00:04:38,800 Speaker 1: then if I didn't give them second degree murder, the 79 00:04:38,880 --> 00:04:40,919 Speaker 1: jury would have to find him not guilty, and I 80 00:04:40,960 --> 00:04:45,120 Speaker 1: will take a second degree murder conviction all day, every day, 81 00:04:45,240 --> 00:04:48,000 Speaker 1: rather than a not guilty on first degree with no 82 00:04:48,320 --> 00:04:51,200 Speaker 1: opportunity for the jury to hold them accountable. Then let 83 00:04:51,200 --> 00:04:56,039 Speaker 1: me talk about the problematic juror questions that you refer to. 84 00:04:56,520 --> 00:05:00,120 Speaker 1: I don't see them as problematic. Here's why I want. 85 00:05:00,120 --> 00:05:02,719 Speaker 1: First of all, you're absolutely right, we get to protest. 86 00:05:02,839 --> 00:05:05,039 Speaker 1: I was down at the Black Lives Matter protest in 87 00:05:05,160 --> 00:05:07,400 Speaker 1: DC right in the middle of it. I felt strongly 88 00:05:07,400 --> 00:05:10,520 Speaker 1: about that we need to protest. It's an important part. 89 00:05:10,560 --> 00:05:14,120 Speaker 1: It's our civic responsibility, frankly to protest. Right, it's the 90 00:05:14,120 --> 00:05:15,640 Speaker 1: only one of the only ways we can hold our 91 00:05:15,640 --> 00:05:20,120 Speaker 1: government accountable. But as a prosecutor or as a criminal litigator, 92 00:05:20,440 --> 00:05:26,640 Speaker 1: I want to know what the preconceived notions and beliefs 93 00:05:26,680 --> 00:05:31,080 Speaker 1: and passions are of each juror. So, for example, I 94 00:05:31,120 --> 00:05:33,520 Speaker 1: want to know if somebody is all about Blue Lives Matter, 95 00:05:33,760 --> 00:05:36,680 Speaker 1: and you know, but Derek Chauvin, whatever he needed to do, 96 00:05:36,760 --> 00:05:39,760 Speaker 1: he needed to do because he was protecting us, right. 97 00:05:40,360 --> 00:05:43,600 Speaker 1: I need to know that as a prosecutor because I 98 00:05:43,640 --> 00:05:46,760 Speaker 1: need to be able to exercise a strike for cause 99 00:05:46,800 --> 00:05:52,479 Speaker 1: against that person. Because I welcome your right to express 100 00:05:52,560 --> 00:05:55,520 Speaker 1: and to protest. Whether you're on the Blue Lives Matter 101 00:05:55,600 --> 00:05:58,640 Speaker 1: the Black Lives matter, both neither. But I need to 102 00:05:58,680 --> 00:06:01,839 Speaker 1: know it so I can make informed decisions as a 103 00:06:01,920 --> 00:06:05,000 Speaker 1: prosecutor about who I want and about who has no 104 00:06:05,120 --> 00:06:08,480 Speaker 1: rights sitting on this jury because they have such strong 105 00:06:09,040 --> 00:06:12,320 Speaker 1: preconceived notions that they can't put them aside and base 106 00:06:12,440 --> 00:06:14,800 Speaker 1: the case only on the evidence they here in court. 107 00:06:14,880 --> 00:06:19,240 Speaker 1: So that's my view of what sound to be intrusive 108 00:06:19,760 --> 00:06:23,919 Speaker 1: questions that sound like they trample on our right to 109 00:06:24,000 --> 00:06:27,520 Speaker 1: expect right, it sells freely, okay, because that's how I 110 00:06:27,560 --> 00:06:30,200 Speaker 1: felt when I when I heard it, I said, well, 111 00:06:30,279 --> 00:06:33,200 Speaker 1: that just doesn't seem right to me. The entire country 112 00:06:33,400 --> 00:06:36,960 Speaker 1: was at protest. We were seeing them in all fifty states, right, 113 00:06:37,160 --> 00:06:39,160 Speaker 1: And so when I when I saw that question, I'm 114 00:06:39,160 --> 00:06:42,200 Speaker 1: thinking to myself, well, we're just now going to throw 115 00:06:42,320 --> 00:06:44,840 Speaker 1: people out and assume that if you've sat on your 116 00:06:44,839 --> 00:06:48,800 Speaker 1: couch for the past year, right, didn't involve yourself in 117 00:06:48,839 --> 00:06:51,719 Speaker 1: any which way in these uprisings or calling your representatives 118 00:06:51,800 --> 00:06:54,720 Speaker 1: or anything that, then that makes you impartial. And I 119 00:06:54,720 --> 00:06:58,159 Speaker 1: think that I equate it to when we talk about 120 00:06:58,760 --> 00:07:03,320 Speaker 1: media and journalist not having opinions right, and there is 121 00:07:03,360 --> 00:07:05,640 Speaker 1: no way that you don't have an opinion in this 122 00:07:05,760 --> 00:07:08,080 Speaker 1: day and age, in what we are seeing. There's no 123 00:07:08,160 --> 00:07:10,840 Speaker 1: way that you didn't have an opinion about kids being 124 00:07:10,920 --> 00:07:14,680 Speaker 1: snatched from there from their mothers right and locked in cages. 125 00:07:14,720 --> 00:07:18,120 Speaker 1: There's no way that you are reporting that and saying 126 00:07:18,200 --> 00:07:22,440 Speaker 1: you're you're reporting it in an impartial way. We're human beings, 127 00:07:22,480 --> 00:07:26,240 Speaker 1: and so I thank you for that clarification. What are 128 00:07:26,240 --> 00:07:31,080 Speaker 1: you anticipating as this unfold? Where are you anticipating that 129 00:07:31,160 --> 00:07:34,920 Speaker 1: the defense goes here? I know where the defense is 130 00:07:34,920 --> 00:07:37,520 Speaker 1: going to go. I've studied the autopsy report, and so 131 00:07:37,640 --> 00:07:41,600 Speaker 1: two things about the autopsy. The first one was performed 132 00:07:41,600 --> 00:07:45,760 Speaker 1: by the Hennepin County Medical Examiner, as is ordinarily the 133 00:07:45,840 --> 00:07:50,280 Speaker 1: case in all jurisdictions, your state or your county medical 134 00:07:50,360 --> 00:07:54,960 Speaker 1: examiner performs the autopsy. And then George Floyd's family hired 135 00:07:55,240 --> 00:07:57,760 Speaker 1: doctor Michael Boden, whom I know, and he had a 136 00:07:58,440 --> 00:08:03,520 Speaker 1: fellow forensic pathology do the second autopsy with him. They 137 00:08:03,520 --> 00:08:07,640 Speaker 1: reached two different conclusions. The first one said he experienced 138 00:08:07,800 --> 00:08:12,160 Speaker 1: a heart incident that was a product of the restraint 139 00:08:12,240 --> 00:08:15,720 Speaker 1: being applied to him by police officers, but he wasn't 140 00:08:15,760 --> 00:08:18,160 Speaker 1: suffocated and I'll talk about that in a minute, and 141 00:08:18,200 --> 00:08:23,560 Speaker 1: that's an important finding. And Michael Boden and his associate said, no, 142 00:08:23,640 --> 00:08:28,680 Speaker 1: this was an asphyxial death. He was asphyxiated. Here is 143 00:08:28,800 --> 00:08:32,040 Speaker 1: the issue that we have to contend with. The prosecutor said, 144 00:08:32,160 --> 00:08:35,120 Speaker 1: I'm calling the Hennepin County Medical Examiner to testify, but 145 00:08:35,160 --> 00:08:38,240 Speaker 1: I'm not calling the medical examiner that was hired by 146 00:08:38,280 --> 00:08:43,800 Speaker 1: George Floyd's family. That's a perfectly appropriate tactical decision. And 147 00:08:43,880 --> 00:08:48,199 Speaker 1: he thinks he can prove criminality based on the findings 148 00:08:48,240 --> 00:08:50,719 Speaker 1: of the Hennepin County Medical Examiner. But here are some 149 00:08:50,760 --> 00:08:54,760 Speaker 1: of the challenges with those findings. The Hennepin County Medical 150 00:08:54,760 --> 00:08:59,760 Speaker 1: Examiner found no injuries to his neck, either externally or internally. 151 00:08:59,760 --> 00:09:03,640 Speaker 1: When you resect the neck. I've seen so many strangulation cases. 152 00:09:04,080 --> 00:09:07,520 Speaker 1: There are telltale signs of strangulation. There's a broken highoid bone, 153 00:09:07,520 --> 00:09:09,439 Speaker 1: which is a very delicate bone right here. And I 154 00:09:09,480 --> 00:09:12,800 Speaker 1: can tell you, Danielle, in every manual strangulation case or 155 00:09:12,840 --> 00:09:15,880 Speaker 1: significant pressure that's put on the neck, you're gonna have 156 00:09:15,920 --> 00:09:19,640 Speaker 1: a fractured highoid bone. You're gonna have fractures. They call 157 00:09:19,679 --> 00:09:23,080 Speaker 1: it to the cartlete. You're gonna have bruising internally, you're 158 00:09:23,120 --> 00:09:26,959 Speaker 1: gonna have and you're gonna have what's called peticial hemorrhaging. 159 00:09:27,000 --> 00:09:29,600 Speaker 1: Those are pinpoint hemorrhages in the whites of the eyes 160 00:09:29,800 --> 00:09:32,360 Speaker 1: and in the gums that are a result of your 161 00:09:32,400 --> 00:09:36,600 Speaker 1: brain being deprived of oxygen. The blood vessels begin to pop, 162 00:09:36,920 --> 00:09:40,760 Speaker 1: telltale signs. He had none of that. Okay, none of that. 163 00:09:41,040 --> 00:09:44,640 Speaker 1: So what they're going to argue is it may look 164 00:09:44,720 --> 00:09:48,640 Speaker 1: bad that all this pressure seem to be applied to 165 00:09:48,679 --> 00:09:51,480 Speaker 1: his neck for eight minutes and forty six seconds, but 166 00:09:51,600 --> 00:09:55,920 Speaker 1: there's no injuries and there's no hemorrhaging that would that's 167 00:09:55,920 --> 00:09:59,840 Speaker 1: associated with the brain being deprived of oxygen because there's 168 00:10:00,000 --> 00:10:04,000 Speaker 1: away is being cut off. So he wasn't strangled. What 169 00:10:04,080 --> 00:10:06,600 Speaker 1: he was is he had pressure being put on all 170 00:10:06,640 --> 00:10:09,160 Speaker 1: parts of his body and his body was under duress. 171 00:10:09,400 --> 00:10:12,200 Speaker 1: He couldn't get enough air in, which is right different. 172 00:10:12,240 --> 00:10:17,600 Speaker 1: It's different than a strangulation death. It's called positional asphyxia 173 00:10:17,840 --> 00:10:20,600 Speaker 1: where pressure is being put on the body here and 174 00:10:20,720 --> 00:10:23,959 Speaker 1: here and here, and he can't breathe and he can't breathe, 175 00:10:24,200 --> 00:10:27,200 Speaker 1: which is different than strangling. A guy out not to 176 00:10:27,200 --> 00:10:29,720 Speaker 1: get graphic right. So here's what the defense is going 177 00:10:29,760 --> 00:10:32,880 Speaker 1: to say. They're gonna say, you know what, maybe the 178 00:10:32,920 --> 00:10:36,480 Speaker 1: guy who was putting pressure on his torso was really 179 00:10:36,520 --> 00:10:39,240 Speaker 1: the bad guy. I can't. I can't. I just just 180 00:10:39,320 --> 00:10:40,800 Speaker 1: hang with me, though, hang with me. I know I 181 00:10:40,800 --> 00:10:43,160 Speaker 1: can't either. And it's not a winning argument. I'm just 182 00:10:43,200 --> 00:10:46,520 Speaker 1: trying to set out you for your listeners where I 183 00:10:46,559 --> 00:10:50,960 Speaker 1: think Chauvin is going with this right, but hold fast 184 00:10:51,000 --> 00:10:53,720 Speaker 1: because it's a losing argument for him. So, you know, 185 00:10:53,840 --> 00:10:56,319 Speaker 1: maybe my knee on his neck looked bad, but there 186 00:10:56,320 --> 00:11:00,599 Speaker 1: were no injuries and there was no deprivation acute deprivation 187 00:11:00,640 --> 00:11:05,000 Speaker 1: of oxygen to the brain. Sony didn't strangle him. Here's 188 00:11:05,040 --> 00:11:06,640 Speaker 1: the other thing they're gonna say, and you're not gonna 189 00:11:06,679 --> 00:11:09,120 Speaker 1: like this either. Do you know how long it takes 190 00:11:09,120 --> 00:11:11,160 Speaker 1: if you're strangling somebody. Do you know how long it 191 00:11:11,200 --> 00:11:14,559 Speaker 1: takes for somebody to lose consciousness? The first apologists will 192 00:11:14,559 --> 00:11:18,200 Speaker 1: tell you eight to ten seconds, and then it takes 193 00:11:18,280 --> 00:11:21,560 Speaker 1: less than four or five minutes to kill somebody by 194 00:11:21,600 --> 00:11:25,320 Speaker 1: manually strangling that person. They're going to embrace the eight 195 00:11:25,320 --> 00:11:27,960 Speaker 1: minutes in forty six seconds and say, see he didn't 196 00:11:27,960 --> 00:11:31,560 Speaker 1: lose consciousness in ten seconds. He didn't wasn't strangled to 197 00:11:31,640 --> 00:11:35,160 Speaker 1: death in four minutes. Therefore, my knee on the neck 198 00:11:35,320 --> 00:11:41,240 Speaker 1: was not the bad actor is. Here's my concern. Anytime 199 00:11:41,280 --> 00:11:45,280 Speaker 1: you have multiple people involved in a murder, co defendants 200 00:11:46,080 --> 00:11:49,640 Speaker 1: and you begin to sever them out and try them individually, 201 00:11:49,679 --> 00:11:55,199 Speaker 1: you know what happens every flipping defendant makes this argument, Oh, 202 00:11:55,240 --> 00:11:57,560 Speaker 1: I'm not the one who always the other guy. The 203 00:11:57,600 --> 00:12:00,400 Speaker 1: other guys who aren't in court, they're the bad guys. 204 00:12:00,480 --> 00:12:02,000 Speaker 1: I'm not the bad guy. Look at me. I've got 205 00:12:02,040 --> 00:12:04,000 Speaker 1: a suit and a tie and I'm wearing my college 206 00:12:04,000 --> 00:12:06,640 Speaker 1: boy glass. Look at me, I'm you know. And they 207 00:12:06,679 --> 00:12:09,960 Speaker 1: put on an act and I saw for thirty years. 208 00:12:10,120 --> 00:12:12,120 Speaker 1: And the defense attorney will put everybody in a suit 209 00:12:12,160 --> 00:12:14,160 Speaker 1: that's too big for them to make them look meek, 210 00:12:14,280 --> 00:12:18,120 Speaker 1: and put fake glasses on them to make them look bookish. 211 00:12:18,200 --> 00:12:21,800 Speaker 1: Oh yeah, it's the place defense attorneys. And I'm not 212 00:12:21,840 --> 00:12:24,640 Speaker 1: critic I love my brother and sister defense attorneys, I 213 00:12:24,640 --> 00:12:29,000 Speaker 1: really do. Most of them are good, honest, ethical, zealously 214 00:12:29,040 --> 00:12:33,560 Speaker 1: representing their clients, and we want that. But here's the 215 00:12:33,600 --> 00:12:37,400 Speaker 1: good news. As I watched this as a career homicide prosecutor. 216 00:12:37,920 --> 00:12:40,800 Speaker 1: I know how I would try this case, and I'm 217 00:12:40,800 --> 00:12:43,400 Speaker 1: pretty dang sure I could win a conviction based on 218 00:12:43,440 --> 00:12:47,280 Speaker 1: the evidence I've seen and what I've seen from this prosecutor. 219 00:12:47,960 --> 00:12:50,880 Speaker 1: Is he's strong, he's thoughtful. I haven't. I've only seen 220 00:12:50,960 --> 00:12:53,800 Speaker 1: what I can see on court TV, right right. I 221 00:12:53,840 --> 00:12:56,120 Speaker 1: also think the defense attorney is very strong. I think 222 00:12:56,120 --> 00:12:59,760 Speaker 1: the judge is very thoughtful. I'm thrilled with the civility 223 00:13:00,120 --> 00:13:03,080 Speaker 1: and the professionalism that I'm seeing. I don't think it 224 00:13:03,120 --> 00:13:06,679 Speaker 1: will be a circus because they've allowed cameras into the courtroom. 225 00:13:06,840 --> 00:13:10,880 Speaker 1: Sometimes that can devolve into an absolute mess. At the 226 00:13:11,040 --> 00:13:14,200 Speaker 1: end of the day, my prediction as this jury will 227 00:13:14,240 --> 00:13:18,200 Speaker 1: hold Derek Chauvin criminally accountable for what he did. The 228 00:13:18,240 --> 00:13:22,880 Speaker 1: biggest question in my mind is at what level of homicide. 229 00:13:28,000 --> 00:13:30,040 Speaker 1: In the days and weeks to come, we will be 230 00:13:30,080 --> 00:13:33,640 Speaker 1: following the Derek Chauvin trial across the country as it unfolds. 231 00:13:33,640 --> 00:13:37,280 Speaker 1: In Minneapolis, the city, with its Operation Safety Net, barbed 232 00:13:37,320 --> 00:13:40,120 Speaker 1: wire and boarded up businesses, is already preparing for the 233 00:13:40,120 --> 00:13:44,319 Speaker 1: worst possible outcome, a presumed not guilty verdict and justifiable 234 00:13:44,360 --> 00:13:48,040 Speaker 1: civil unrust over yet another killer cop walking away without 235 00:13:48,160 --> 00:13:50,920 Speaker 1: justice being served. But I will continue to have these 236 00:13:50,920 --> 00:13:55,079 Speaker 1: conversations with Glenn, whose illegal optimism gives me much needed hope, 237 00:13:55,280 --> 00:13:58,440 Speaker 1: and other sound legal minds every week on woke af Daily. 238 00:13:58,559 --> 00:14:00,600 Speaker 1: If you want to follow this trial along with me 239 00:14:00,640 --> 00:14:02,760 Speaker 1: and the rest of the woke a F nation, join 240 00:14:02,880 --> 00:14:05,720 Speaker 1: us at patreon dot com slash woke a F for 241 00:14:05,760 --> 00:14:08,480 Speaker 1: just five dollars a month. We are steadily growing this 242 00:14:08,600 --> 00:14:11,960 Speaker 1: community and an effort to make our world a woker place. 243 00:14:12,559 --> 00:14:15,080 Speaker 1: Power to the people and to all the people. Power, 244 00:14:15,360 --> 00:14:17,480 Speaker 1: get woke and stay woke as fuck.