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Speaker 1: Hello America, Happy New Year to all of you, twenty

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Speaker 1: twenty six.

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Speaker 2: I can't think of a better way.

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Speaker 1: To kick things off than with a topic that we've

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Speaker 1: spoken about a few times in twenty twenty five, but

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Speaker 1: it is something that is so pressing, and the reason

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Speaker 1: that we talk about it a lot is because it

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Speaker 1: is a critical issue when it comes to national security.

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Speaker 1: I of course, am talking about the precursors and those

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Speaker 1: initial ingredients that feed our pharmaceutical industry, and.

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Speaker 2: Not the vanity drugs.

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Speaker 1: I'm talking about the generic drugs, the antibiotics that treat

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Speaker 1: diseases just in case, you know, another pandemic shows up

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Speaker 1: on our shores, or the things that treat kidney disease

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Speaker 1: or heart disease. These are critical issues in our country,

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Speaker 1: and we've had a lot of these great guests on before,

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Speaker 1: but we've got updates from them. So I am delighted

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Speaker 1: to have these conversations starting out the new year.

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Speaker 2: But before we get.

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Speaker 1: Into the larger discussion about drug manufacturing, we got the

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Speaker 1: chance to sit down with Alabama Senator and gubernatorial candidate

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Speaker 1: Tommy Tuberville. Now he spoke about what his office is

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Speaker 1: doing to reshore American pharmaceutical manufacturing, as well as a

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Speaker 1: number of other issues, including the president's drug boat policy

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Speaker 1: and protecting the nation from Islamic terror. So take a

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Speaker 1: look at this from Senator Tommy Tuberville.

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Speaker 3: I want to talk a little bit about an issue

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Speaker 3: that gets so distorted in both the Democratic talking points

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Speaker 3: and in the media, and that is the military's action

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Speaker 3: to protect America from fentanyl, particularly these drug boats. You

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Speaker 3: have some pretty clear vision on this. You know exactly

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Speaker 3: what was happening. Americans want this right and there's nothing

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Speaker 3: legally wrong with it.

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Speaker 4: Well, we had a big hearing yesterday, We've had several

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Speaker 4: in the in the past month, and Pete Hegseeth and

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Speaker 4: President Trump are doing exactly what needs to be done.

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Speaker 4: You know, since all all three of us have been alive,

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Speaker 4: we've heard there's a war on drugs, there's not a

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Speaker 4: war on drugs. To the President of the United States

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Speaker 4: said this is going to stop, and he put his

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Speaker 4: finger on it. He told the Secretary of War, I

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Speaker 4: want this over with. And so they've done the right thing.

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Speaker 4: They've been blowing these these boats out of the water

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Speaker 4: in the Caribbean and on the eastern side of the Pacific,

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Speaker 4: over around Mexico, and you know, they're making a lot

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Speaker 4: of progress.

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Speaker 5: But it's not John and Manna. It's not just about drugs.

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Speaker 4: This is about cutting off the supply line to the

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Speaker 4: basically the capital of Central America for terrorism, and that's Venezuela.

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Speaker 4: I mean, we have got to put our finger on

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Speaker 4: these people. Madua's got to go. And President Trump is

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Speaker 4: binding determined to squeeze him so hard that he will

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Speaker 4: not be in leadership in a few months. And I

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Speaker 4: think President I've got a great idea, a great plan,

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Speaker 4: and I'm looking forward to and work.

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Speaker 3: Coach.

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Speaker 1: There has been controversy surrounding this. I think for a

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Speaker 1: lot of Americans, they don't even they don't see the

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Speaker 1: controversy and blowing up drug votes that if they came

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Speaker 1: to our shores would kill Americans. But I do wonder

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Speaker 1: if another aspect of this is that Democrats will use

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Speaker 1: this if they win back the majority in.

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Speaker 2: The House next year, if they will use this.

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Speaker 1: As one of the first impeachment endeavors.

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Speaker 2: Do you get that sense as well?

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Speaker 4: Yeah, I think that they'll use it against President Trump,

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Speaker 4: and I think they'll use it against Marco Rubio. And

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Speaker 4: I think they'll use it against Secretary Heckxit. That is

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Speaker 4: their plan. They're not for anything that is good for

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Speaker 4: this country. Anybody that stands up and try to protect

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Speaker 4: drug these narco terrorists bringing drugs into our country, which

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Speaker 4: they've done for years. Now, we finally got somebody that's

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Speaker 4: gonna do something about it. And they're taking the side

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Speaker 4: of the terrorists. And it just show they're showing their

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Speaker 4: cards right and left. The mainstream media is on on

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Speaker 4: their side. If they were to win the House next year,

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Speaker 4: it will be a full two years of impeachment processes.

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Speaker 4: The American people will be the ones that suffered, won't

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Speaker 4: get anything done. And that's the reason. After this first

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Speaker 4: of the year, the Big Beautiful Bill is going to

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Speaker 4: kick in. The tariffs are going to kick in. We're

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Speaker 4: going to have a great year. Our economy is going

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Speaker 4: to skyrocket. That's the entire plan. The Democrats have their

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Speaker 4: fingers crossed. It doesn't work, But I am betting on

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Speaker 4: Donald Trump.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I think a lot of Americans are, so. I

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Speaker 3: want to turn to the threat within our homeland. We

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Speaker 3: can put a looking glass up to London and see

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Speaker 3: what the lefty islamis. The radical anarchists want to do

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Speaker 3: to our country because they've already done much of it

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Speaker 3: to Europe. We have so many threats on our soil.

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Speaker 3: We just had a New Year's Eve attack preempted by

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Speaker 3: some good work by the FBI. But do most of

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Speaker 3: Americans understand just how determined our internal enemies are right now?

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Speaker 4: I don't think they do yet, John, they will. I'm

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Speaker 4: going to be screaming from the rooftop. I've been telling

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Speaker 4: my colleagues on the Republican side of the Senate, You've

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Speaker 4: got to start saying something about this. Lindsey Graham did

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Speaker 4: a great job Sunday on television. He and I talked

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Speaker 4: about it today. We have got to We've got to

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Speaker 4: inform people. It's absolutely amazing that if you just look

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Speaker 4: at what's happened in Europe, as you said, London has

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Speaker 4: fallen to these Islamic.

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Speaker 5: Terrorists, well you know who else has fallen is France.

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Speaker 4: France had to cancel all of their Christmas celebrations this

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Speaker 4: year because the Muslims puts so much pressure on them. Now, listen,

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Speaker 4: we have Muslims in this country that are good people,

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Speaker 4: and I'm asking them today if you are believing our constitution,

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Speaker 4: and you want to assimilate and make America greater by

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Speaker 4: your work ethic and by paying taxes and doing things right.

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Speaker 4: I need you to step up and speak with me

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Speaker 4: to the radical Muslims saying nothing enough. If you don't

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Speaker 4: believe in this country, go home, go back to where

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Speaker 4: you came from. I think it's going to take a

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Speaker 4: lot of people on their side even to step up

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Speaker 4: and say something other than just politicians like myself and

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Speaker 4: people here. But we are going to keep informing people

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Speaker 4: across the country. This is a danger to the two

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Speaker 4: hundred and fifty years that we've had had on this

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Speaker 4: great earth.

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Speaker 1: Senator, there was a Muslim community center planned for production

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Speaker 1: in the state of Alabama.

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Speaker 2: It did get shut down at the first hurdle.

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Speaker 1: As I understand that they can go back in and

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Speaker 1: adjust their plans and reapply. But you were recently placed

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Speaker 1: on a hate list. I believe for care and I

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Speaker 1: know that you probably consider that a badge of honor,

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Speaker 1: because it seems to me that in the state of Alabama,

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Speaker 1: much like Florida and Texas, Sharia law and those types

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Speaker 1: of beliefs and ideologies, they don't have a home.

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Speaker 5: Yeah.

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Speaker 4: Well, man, as I said earlier, if you're a Muslim

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Speaker 4: group and you're in this country and you teach things

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Speaker 4: in the schools that are you teach English, you teach math, history,

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Speaker 4: all the things good about our country, our constitution, all,

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Speaker 4: I'm fine with that. I've got no problem. But the

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Speaker 4: problem is I looked at their website. They teach sarial law.

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Speaker 4: They go by the Koran, who, by the way, teaches

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Speaker 4: to kill the infidels, which an infidel, by the way,

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Speaker 4: folks is everybody that doesn't believe in Mohammad and Islam.

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Speaker 4: And so at the end of the day, they didn't

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Speaker 4: need to have a bigger stage, which they wanted, a

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Speaker 4: bigger area, a bigger school to continue to grow.

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Speaker 5: And that's not going to happen again. If you're teaching

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Speaker 5: hate in our country.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, so important to say it every day, not let

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Speaker 3: that go on and set every day. And I know

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Speaker 3: you do. So I want to turn to the attack

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Speaker 3: at Brown. A brave young conservative woman, Ellenox was killed there.

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Speaker 3: We don't know the other whether that was a target

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Speaker 3: or just a victim, but the hatred the case has

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Speaker 3: raised a lot of concerns about what's been fomenting on

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Speaker 3: campuses for a long time. I just wanted to get

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Speaker 3: your thoughts first on Ella and also what we've learned

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Speaker 3: thus far about the Brown case.

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Speaker 5: Yeah.

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Speaker 4: Ella Cook was a young nineteen year old girl that

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Speaker 4: in the summertimes worked in an ice cream shop in

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Speaker 4: Mountain Brook, Alabama. And she didn't have a worry in

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Speaker 4: the world. She loved God, she was a Christian. She

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Speaker 4: went to Brown to work on French history. She was

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Speaker 4: an economic major along with mathematics, a very bright student.

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Speaker 4: She was also vice president of the Republican Party at

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Speaker 4: the school, the young Group. And so we don't know,

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Speaker 4: as you said, whether it was a target or not.

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Speaker 4: But I'm going to tell you these things like Charlie

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Speaker 4: Kirk and the two young National Guard people here in Washington,

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Speaker 4: DC that lost their lives, there's a lot of things

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Speaker 4: that are adding up here. Very seldom do you see

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Speaker 4: anything happen to anybody on the left. It's usually somebody

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Speaker 4: on the right, some Christians, some people, some person that's

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Speaker 4: a patriot that loves America. E Look Cook was that.

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Speaker 4: I gave a speech about her today on the floor

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Speaker 4: of the Senate. It brings tears to you eyes. I

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Speaker 4: cannot believe you know, you know, we have kids. I've

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Speaker 4: got two boys. I don't know what, you know, how

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Speaker 4: i'd make it through life if I lost one of

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Speaker 4: them through something like this. It's a it's a grave tragedy,

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Speaker 4: and it's just a it's sad to see something like

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Speaker 4: this continue to happen across this great country.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, it seems like Mountain Brook has also gotten in

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Speaker 1: so much of a dose of their young women enduring tragedy.

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Speaker 2: I want to ask you before we let you go.

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Speaker 1: Because this ongoing healthcare debate percolating on the House side

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Speaker 1: as well as the Senate side, A lot of people

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Speaker 1: say that that we're too far in with Obamacare. It

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Speaker 1: can't be overturned, but we can patch it up, we

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Speaker 1: can find fixes to it.

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Speaker 2: What's your idea of fixing it.

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Speaker 4: Well, it's a disaster unaffordable health care. They've ruined our hospitals.

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Speaker 4: They've run doctors out out of the business, they've run

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Speaker 4: nurses to other jobs. Our rural hospitals are going under.

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Speaker 4: It is a disaster. It needs to be fixed. And

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Speaker 4: the problem is now the Democrats know that it's a disaster,

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Speaker 4: So what.

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Speaker 5: Do they need?

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Speaker 4: They need fifty billion dollars more year to keep it

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Speaker 4: going from the American taxpayers. And so we have to

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Speaker 4: find a way to make this work now. I'm offer

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Speaker 4: for doing something in the short term to get us

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Speaker 4: by till we can fix this absolute mess. But we've

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Speaker 4: got to be willing to do it. We've got to

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Speaker 4: be as Republicans. We have the House, the Senate, in

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Speaker 4: the White House. If we can't come up with a

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Speaker 4: plan to fix Obamacare. It's not the Democrats' fault. Who

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Speaker 4: could care less about the American people are healthcare. They

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Speaker 4: just believe in power. It is the Republican's fault. And

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Speaker 4: we have to do something and we you know, it's

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Speaker 4: it's something that needs have been fixed five, six, ten

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Speaker 4: years ago, but is completely in a tail spin now

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Speaker 4: and our healthcare is unaffordable and it's getting worse and worse.

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Speaker 5: So we have to do something. To Republicans.

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Speaker 4: We can't count on the socialist, communist Democratic Party to

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Speaker 4: do anything to help make it better for the American people, and.

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Speaker 3: For Republicans to go on offense and this issue that

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Speaker 3: be on defense too long. It's so easy to fix us.

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Speaker 3: There's good ideas and the caucus to do so before

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Speaker 3: we let you go, sir. Another thing that we've learned

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Speaker 3: about is how vulnerable our pharmaceutical supply chain is. I

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Speaker 3: know this is something close to your heart or too

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Speaker 3: reliant on India and too reliant on China, who's definitely

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Speaker 3: not our friend. How are we doing and starting to

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Speaker 3: fix it? Looks like the Trump administration is taking this on,

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Speaker 3: but a lot more.

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Speaker 5: Work to be done. Yeah.

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Speaker 4: We found out during the beginning of COVID, which basically

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Speaker 4: was the start of the Biden administration disaster. And of

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Speaker 4: course they lied to us the whole time about COVID foul, cheap.

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Speaker 4: He should be in jail today. I don't know what

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Speaker 4: we're doing about that. He's a definite crook now. I'm

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Speaker 4: on the help community, health, educational, abor, and pension. I

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Speaker 4: went through all those hearings and he spoke out of

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Speaker 4: both sides of his mouth. Disaster, but we found out

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Speaker 4: that we do not get any drugs from our country

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Speaker 4: that are all made overseas. President Trump has pushing the

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Speaker 4: buttons to try to make it happen to move back.

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Speaker 4: We for instance, in the state of Alabama and Huntsville,

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Speaker 4: Eli Lilly just built a new plant or building a

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Speaker 4: new plant in Huntsville with six hundred to one thousand

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Speaker 4: employees making drugs.

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Speaker 5: So they're moving back.

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Speaker 4: We're giving tax incentives, We're pushing the narrative to get

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Speaker 4: people to understand that we cannot live off Chinese and

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Speaker 4: India pharmaceuticals. We have to be self sufficient. A lot

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Speaker 4: of other things we need to do, but we can't

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Speaker 4: live without that. And of course the bidens four years.

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Speaker 4: They did nothing about it, so we're four years behind.

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Speaker 4: But President Trump's trying to catch up, as he is

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Speaker 4: in the economy and farming and healthcare everything. President Trump's

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Speaker 4: trying to dig itself out of water. Noow, I hope that,

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Speaker 4: you know, people will understand where he was and where

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Speaker 4: we're at today. We're making lots of progress of bringing

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Speaker 4: your factory back to this country.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, it's an exciting moment.

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Speaker 3: People are gonna wake up in twenty six and feel

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Speaker 3: an entirely different America just by the changes that were

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Speaker 3: made this year. We're gonna take a quicker ruse, will

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Speaker 3: break more ahead. Right after these messages, look out, the

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Speaker 3: entry fucked out.

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Speaker 6: Every The radical left knows exactly what they're doing. They

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Speaker 6: want to steal the election.

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Speaker 3: We're going to walk down Pennsylvania.

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Speaker 6: Haven'tue to peacefully and patriotically make your voices heard.

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Speaker 2: Events in Washington have taken a violent, un tumultuous took.

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Speaker 7: January sixth wasn't just a moment in history for thousands

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Speaker 7: of Americans. It was the moment their voices were taken.

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Speaker 8: It's insurrection.

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Speaker 3: They were persecuted, hunted seditious conspiracy.

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Speaker 7: But behind prison walls, something unexpected happened. They found their

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Speaker 7: voice again.

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Speaker 8: Started singing to national anthel We took it up to

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Speaker 8: him and mar Laga oppified voice.

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Speaker 2: So our supporters made this goat real.

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Speaker 7: America's voice is telling the real story of January sixth

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Speaker 7: like you've never seen it before. This is not the

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Speaker 7: story you were showing I pad responsibility.

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Speaker 4: This is the story they lived government and trapment scheme

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Speaker 4: that this actually was.

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Speaker 7: The j six Patriots are no longer staying silent. They

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Speaker 7: are speaking, They are standing, and they are telling the truth.

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Speaker 2: You can't kill us, you can't be us.

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Speaker 7: They tried to silence them. Instead, they woke up an

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Speaker 7: entire nation. The sleeping giant coming soon.

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Speaker 2: Welcome back everybody. Tonight.

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Speaker 1: We are talking all about America's pharmaceutical industry and the

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Speaker 1: steps that we need to take so that we are

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Speaker 1: not dependent on foreign countries for some of our crucial medications.

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Speaker 2: And the Trump administration has made some.

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Speaker 1: Positive progress on policy, but there are loopholes that our

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Speaker 1: next guest says need to be addressed very quickly, so

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Speaker 1: joining us now. He's a retired Army colonel and now

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Speaker 1: is the founder and principal growth partner at Blue Zone

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Speaker 1: Bioscience and Supply Chain Solutions.

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Speaker 3: Now.

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Speaker 1: Back on April thirtieth of last year, he appeared before

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Speaker 1: the Senate Armed Services Committee on Personnel, and his focus

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Speaker 1: was holding the Pentagon accountable for making sure our service

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Speaker 1: members get safe and high quality medications.

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Speaker 2: Vick Suarez, welcome back to the show. Happy new year

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Speaker 2: to you, Happy new year, Amanda.

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Speaker 8: That's great to be back on.

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Speaker 2: Great to have you here.

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Speaker 1: And as you and I were just lamenting over the break,

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Speaker 1: you know, it kind of feels like we are screaming

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Speaker 1: into the ether about this. It is a national security

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Speaker 1: issue and if anyone, if there is anyone, who we

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Speaker 1: should make sure have the drugs and the medications.

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Speaker 2: That they need at the quality that they need.

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Speaker 1: It's our first responders and our first responders overseas aka

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Speaker 1: our service members who protect us. But that has not

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Speaker 1: always been the case, has it.

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Speaker 5: Right?

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Speaker 9: This is a you know, some multi year process. You know,

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Speaker 9: we identified these risks several years ago. We obviously got

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Speaker 9: some attention on this in the past year or so,

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Speaker 9: and what we saw in the last maybe forty five

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Speaker 9: sixty five days is really the administration has been really

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Speaker 9: focused on working with big pharma, big industry, the Health

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Speaker 9: and Human Services CMS, the FDA, and HHS's ASPER team

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Speaker 9: to really put in some strategic fixes in place, whether

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Speaker 9: it's to lower drug prices or really motivate some of

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Speaker 9: the big pharma companies to invest in reshoring their manufacturing.

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Speaker 9: I think really the next logical step right now is

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Speaker 9: to take a bold action to fix the super majority

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Speaker 9: of the medicines that everyday Americans take, and that's our

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Speaker 9: essential generic pharmaceuticals, which is over ninety percent of the

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Speaker 9: prescriptions dispensed every day to Americans.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and these aren't vanity drugs. These are things for

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Speaker 1: chronic conditions, life threatening critical conditions, right, Yeah.

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Speaker 9: For sure. These are for people that have chronic diseases,

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Speaker 9: such as if they have some type of kidney failure

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Speaker 9: or they have some type of diabetes or heart disease.

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Speaker 9: These are legacy drugs that have been on the market

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Speaker 9: for well over twenty twenty five years. And these are

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Speaker 9: medicines that American manufacturers are making, but they're struggling, as

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Speaker 9: your previous guests had pointed out, competing against either Chinese

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Speaker 9: or Indian firms who found these loopholes to get their

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Speaker 9: medicines to undercut American made drugs. And I think that's

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Speaker 9: an area we really need to have really folks, policymakers,

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Speaker 9: decision makers, administration officials really tackle as we get into

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Speaker 9: twenty twenty six.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and Vick, you know, we've had a couple We're

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Speaker 1: having a couple of guests on the show tonight who

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Speaker 1: have testified up on Capitol Hill, you being one of them,

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Speaker 1: who are the change makers out there? Do you feel

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Speaker 1: like we have enough of the trail blazers in Congress

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Speaker 1: to actually fix this because I hear a lot of rhetoric,

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Speaker 1: I hear a lot of people talking about it on

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Speaker 1: both the House and the Senate side, and yet, frankly,

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Speaker 1: for me, considering this as a national security issue, they're

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Speaker 1: not moving fast enough Yeah.

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Speaker 9: I mean, we can always want to see more people

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Speaker 9: take some bold action. I think it's a matter of

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Speaker 9: timing right. This first phase was really to try to

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Speaker 9: get some very large strategic fixes in place, most favored

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Speaker 9: nation pricing agreements they're trying to fix healthcare. I think

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Speaker 9: some emerging leaders that we're seeing pop up, at least

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Speaker 9: on the Senate side, is Rick Scott. You know, Rick

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Speaker 9: Scott has had now three hearings on this topic over

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Speaker 9: the summer and into the fall, and I think that

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Speaker 9: he's really emerging as one of the senior Senate leaders

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Speaker 9: in this. He's really rallied up kind of a bipartisan

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Speaker 9: effort working across the aisle with Senator Jillibrand and others

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Speaker 9: on Senate Aging Committee. And also I think there's some

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Speaker 9: you know, leaders like Senator Tubberville that are standing up

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Speaker 9: and saying, hey, this is not tolerable anymore. This is

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Speaker 9: not only affecting our national security, our war fighters, but

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Speaker 9: small town America as far as you know, citizens of

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Speaker 9: his state and the access to the medicines that they

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Speaker 9: need to have, preferably coming from American pharmaceutical companies.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, Vic and I flicked at this at the top

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Speaker 1: of this segment. These loopholes that are really really dangerous

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Speaker 1: and hindering what we can do to enshore all of

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Speaker 1: this manufacturing. One of which is so Chinese and Indian

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Speaker 1: manufacturers can't sell directly to the US, but they do

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Speaker 1: something with respect to pharmaceutical packaging to get it here.

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Speaker 2: Would talk to us about.

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Speaker 9: That, Yeah, I can clarify that a little bit. So

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Speaker 9: with the Trade Agreement Act back in nineteen seventy three,

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Speaker 9: it's a federal law that basically prevents let's say, non

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Speaker 9: Trade Agreement Act nations, notably China and India, two major

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Speaker 9: ones in the pharmaceutical industry, from making a final dosage

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Speaker 9: for medicine and then selling it to the federal supply schedule. Now,

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Speaker 9: they've always had the ability to sell it on the

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Speaker 9: normal commercial marketplace if they wanted to sell it to

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Speaker 9: a health system or through a distributor that was going

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Speaker 9: to sell it to the civilian healthcare system. That's fair

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Speaker 9: and open competition. The problem that we've seen is that

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Speaker 9: they found a way to disproportionately gain market share selling

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Speaker 9: it to the federal government, specifically to the Defense Department,

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Speaker 9: to the VA, and Health and Human services through a

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Speaker 9: loophole called the Citrus loophole, which was a court case

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Speaker 9: that was settled in federal court in February of twenty twenty,

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Speaker 9: a month before the COVID lockdowns, and what that essentially

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Speaker 9: did that court case did was it allowed these companies,

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Speaker 9: the complainants, to sell API or active pharmaceutical ingredients to

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Speaker 9: suppliers and finished dose manufacturers in the United States and

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Speaker 9: claimed that the drug was substantially transformed in the United States,

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Speaker 9: qualifying it as made in America. Prior to that ruling

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Speaker 9: in February of twenty twenty, what had been long since

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Speaker 9: really ruled as an American manufacturer drug is where the

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Speaker 9: active pharmaceutical ingredient or API was actually produced, and there

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Speaker 9: are several chemical synthesis steps to make an API, and

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Speaker 9: that seems to be or at least prior to the

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Speaker 9: court ruling in February twenty twenty. Where the substantial transformation

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Speaker 9: really is done is the act of pharmaceutical ingredient. But

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Speaker 9: due to that court case, the loophole has really been

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Speaker 9: repackager companies companies that are American companies, but they instead

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Speaker 9: of buying their API or their finished dose medicine from

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Speaker 9: a US manufacturer, they will source to somebody that can

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Speaker 9: actually undercut and dump lower cost and oftentimes lower quality

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Speaker 9: product coming in from normally THA non compliant countries like

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Speaker 9: India and China, and then they will get contracts specifically

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Speaker 9: with the Defense Logistics Agency and sell directly to the military.

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Speaker 9: And we've seen that over the last couple of years

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Speaker 9: as more information has come out, as more people have

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Speaker 9: investigated this, that the military is dependent on these repackager companies.

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Speaker 2: Well, that's terrifying. How did that happen? How did it

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Speaker 2: happen that they are dependent on those Well.

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Speaker 9: Part of it is is just really our federal procurement

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Speaker 9: processes that favor lowest price technically acceptable and when we're

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Speaker 9: dealing with things that are of low technical complexity, that

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Speaker 9: that that contracting strategy is fine if you if you

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Speaker 9: were going to have a long care service contract, you know,

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Speaker 9: the complexity of that and the effect on a human

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Speaker 9: or on a on a system is very negligible. But

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Speaker 9: when you start talking about a pharmaceutical that goes into

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Speaker 9: the health of an individual, now we're talking about a

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Speaker 9: contracting strategy, strategy that should be closer to what we

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Speaker 9: call best value which basically factors in not only the

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Speaker 9: quality of the product, the resiliency of that supply chain,

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Speaker 9: but also looks at things like the location of where

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Speaker 9: the manufacturing is is being done, so that you can

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Speaker 9: look at a total best value of the product, is

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Speaker 9: it in the long run and the best interest for

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Speaker 9: the fit for purpose of what it's intended to do.

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Speaker 9: And when we we talk about pharmaceuticals, uh, we should

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Speaker 9: go to a best value standard which takes in quality,

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Speaker 9: location of manufacturing, and the resiliency of that supply chain.

440
00:24:00,840 --> 00:24:01,040
Speaker 2: Yeah.

441
00:24:01,080 --> 00:24:03,439
Speaker 1: I mean, if anybody deserves the best quality and the

442
00:24:03,440 --> 00:24:06,600
Speaker 1: best supply of this stuff, it's our service members. I

443
00:24:06,680 --> 00:24:09,600
Speaker 1: know that the Trump administration, President Trump, this is something

444
00:24:09,640 --> 00:24:11,679
Speaker 1: that is very much on his radar.

445
00:24:11,760 --> 00:24:12,960
Speaker 2: He is taking.

446
00:24:12,760 --> 00:24:17,239
Speaker 1: Steps to ameliorate the issue. However, I've still seen some

447
00:24:17,400 --> 00:24:19,760
Speaker 1: news blurbs here and there that there are some American

448
00:24:19,840 --> 00:24:23,600
Speaker 1: manufacturing pharmaceutical manufacturing companies that have gone out of business.

449
00:24:23,640 --> 00:24:24,280
Speaker 2: Why is that?

450
00:24:25,600 --> 00:24:28,119
Speaker 9: Yeah, so some of these American companies are really struggling.

451
00:24:28,920 --> 00:24:31,879
Speaker 9: I know of one particular company that makes antibiotics in

452
00:24:31,880 --> 00:24:34,480
Speaker 9: the United States. It's like one of the few, if

453
00:24:34,520 --> 00:24:38,520
Speaker 9: not the only, antibiotic manufacturer in the country. They testified

454
00:24:38,600 --> 00:24:42,520
Speaker 9: in the Senate this past summer that even though they're

455
00:24:42,680 --> 00:24:45,880
Speaker 9: one of the few manufacturers that can make a very

456
00:24:45,920 --> 00:24:48,679
Speaker 9: common drug, a marxistelling, they can make it end to

457
00:24:48,800 --> 00:24:51,159
Speaker 9: end one hundred percent of the United States, they only

458
00:24:51,200 --> 00:24:54,760
Speaker 9: make up about five percent of the sales to let's

459
00:24:54,800 --> 00:24:57,639
Speaker 9: say the Defense Logistics Agency and sell to the military

460
00:24:58,359 --> 00:25:01,720
Speaker 9: and other foreign players can actually get a higher market

461
00:25:01,760 --> 00:25:05,560
Speaker 9: share through either these loopholes through repackager, relabel or companies,

462
00:25:06,040 --> 00:25:11,200
Speaker 9: or an ability to negotiate better contractual terms with selling

463
00:25:11,240 --> 00:25:13,600
Speaker 9: it to the federal supply schedule. And so one of

464
00:25:13,600 --> 00:25:15,720
Speaker 9: the things we can do to remedy this is to

465
00:25:15,840 --> 00:25:20,040
Speaker 9: really look at these American manufacturers and say, why aren't

466
00:25:20,080 --> 00:25:23,159
Speaker 9: they getting the proper market share, and why aren't we

467
00:25:23,280 --> 00:25:27,320
Speaker 9: bolstering their demands selling it to the federal supply schedule

468
00:25:27,760 --> 00:25:31,720
Speaker 9: as kind of an initial guaranteed way to have them

469
00:25:31,760 --> 00:25:36,560
Speaker 9: supply our service members, their families, veterans like myself, those

470
00:25:36,600 --> 00:25:41,080
Speaker 9: high quality medicines here. And then secondly, as they build

471
00:25:41,160 --> 00:25:44,040
Speaker 9: up those sales from five percent to let's say twenty

472
00:25:44,119 --> 00:25:46,280
Speaker 9: or thirty or forty percent of the market share, they

473
00:25:46,280 --> 00:25:49,320
Speaker 9: could then more easily sell to the civilian marketplace as well,

474
00:25:49,400 --> 00:25:51,119
Speaker 9: because they will be able to lower their cost of

475
00:25:51,160 --> 00:25:53,960
Speaker 9: goods over the long run once they can scale their

476
00:25:53,960 --> 00:25:55,400
Speaker 9: manufacturing demands.

477
00:25:56,720 --> 00:25:59,840
Speaker 1: Thank you have touched an incredible periscope into all of

478
00:25:59,840 --> 00:26:02,399
Speaker 1: these issues. We appreciate you being here with us and

479
00:26:02,440 --> 00:26:05,200
Speaker 1: shouting this from the rooftops because it is an issue

480
00:26:05,240 --> 00:26:08,919
Speaker 1: that needs to get solved like yesterday. H Victoires, Founder

481
00:26:08,920 --> 00:26:12,440
Speaker 1: and growth partner at Blue Zone Bioscience and Supply Chain Solutions.

482
00:26:12,440 --> 00:26:14,600
Speaker 2: Thanks for being with us tonight and Happy New Year.

483
00:26:15,520 --> 00:26:16,760
Speaker 5: Thank you you too, Amanda.

484
00:26:17,320 --> 00:26:19,520
Speaker 1: Oh, actually, Vic you're going to stick around because he's

485
00:26:19,560 --> 00:26:20,760
Speaker 1: going to be back with us. I think at the

486
00:26:20,840 --> 00:26:22,239
Speaker 1: end of the show to wrap this up and put

487
00:26:22,280 --> 00:26:23,639
Speaker 1: a pretty little bow on it for all of you.

488
00:26:23,760 --> 00:26:25,360
Speaker 2: All right, everybody, we're going to take a break. We'll

489
00:26:25,359 --> 00:26:25,920
Speaker 2: be back.

490
00:26:30,160 --> 00:26:31,080
Speaker 10: This holiday season.

491
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Speaker 11: at RAP.

511
00:27:36,960 --> 00:27:38,000
Speaker 2: Welcome back everybody.

512
00:27:38,320 --> 00:27:40,840
Speaker 1: We want to continue our conversation now on the crisis

513
00:27:40,840 --> 00:27:44,480
Speaker 1: of pharmaceuticals that are being manufactured overseas because it still

514
00:27:44,520 --> 00:27:48,200
Speaker 1: presents a major vulnerability here in our country. The government

515
00:27:48,280 --> 00:27:53,320
Speaker 1: has taken initial steps to help American drug manufacturers on shore.

516
00:27:53,480 --> 00:27:55,600
Speaker 1: All of that, and the Senate actually also hosted a

517
00:27:55,640 --> 00:27:59,840
Speaker 1: hearing back in November titled Made in America Restoring Trust

518
00:28:00,080 --> 00:28:03,640
Speaker 1: in Our Medicines, and our next guest, Tom Neely, testified

519
00:28:03,720 --> 00:28:05,960
Speaker 1: in that special hearing here is just a part of

520
00:28:06,000 --> 00:28:06,520
Speaker 1: what he said.

521
00:28:07,080 --> 00:28:12,159
Speaker 6: Unfortunately, in today's domestic market, offshore manufacturing of these generic

522
00:28:12,280 --> 00:28:17,159
Speaker 6: medications has dangerously weakened our supply chain, with China and

523
00:28:17,240 --> 00:28:22,640
Speaker 6: India controlling the market. These foreign competitors are heavily subsidized

524
00:28:22,960 --> 00:28:27,040
Speaker 6: by their governments, and studies repeatedly have shown quality of

525
00:28:27,080 --> 00:28:32,560
Speaker 6: their finished products is inferior to domestic produced generics. In addition,

526
00:28:33,160 --> 00:28:39,000
Speaker 6: the three big distributors, PBMs and insurance companies care nothing

527
00:28:39,040 --> 00:28:41,560
Speaker 6: about quality but focus on price.

528
00:28:43,360 --> 00:28:45,400
Speaker 1: Joining us now is the man that you just saw

529
00:28:45,440 --> 00:28:48,560
Speaker 1: in that video, the chairman of the board at Oxford Pharmaceuticals,

530
00:28:48,560 --> 00:28:49,560
Speaker 1: Tom Neely Palm.

531
00:28:49,600 --> 00:28:51,200
Speaker 2: Thanks so much for being back with us.

532
00:28:52,040 --> 00:28:54,320
Speaker 6: Thank you, Amanda, appreciate.

533
00:28:53,720 --> 00:28:56,880
Speaker 1: It absolutely and you've been selling the alarm on this

534
00:28:56,960 --> 00:28:59,600
Speaker 1: for a very long time. Take us back to that

535
00:28:59,680 --> 00:29:03,320
Speaker 1: Senate Special hearing, because you know, when when a witness

536
00:29:03,360 --> 00:29:06,120
Speaker 1: goes in to testify before these committees, you can typically

537
00:29:06,200 --> 00:29:09,719
Speaker 1: tell how receptive the ears and the minds are of

538
00:29:09,760 --> 00:29:11,880
Speaker 1: the people who are in that hearing.

539
00:29:11,920 --> 00:29:13,480
Speaker 2: Did it seem like your.

540
00:29:13,400 --> 00:29:16,520
Speaker 1: Concern over this translated and resonated with.

541
00:29:16,440 --> 00:29:20,560
Speaker 6: Them too, Absolutely, one hundred percent on both sides of

542
00:29:20,600 --> 00:29:25,800
Speaker 6: the isle too. Both the Chairman and ranking member I

543
00:29:25,840 --> 00:29:30,480
Speaker 6: think are directly in path with each other on this

544
00:29:31,440 --> 00:29:33,280
Speaker 6: situation that we face.

545
00:29:34,160 --> 00:29:38,120
Speaker 1: Yeah, Tom, the nature of generic medications.

546
00:29:38,120 --> 00:29:40,400
Speaker 2: These these are items that are used daily.

547
00:29:40,480 --> 00:29:43,320
Speaker 1: They obviously because they are outside of what's often a

548
00:29:43,320 --> 00:29:47,000
Speaker 1: seven year patent period. There are multiple versions of it,

549
00:29:47,080 --> 00:29:50,040
Speaker 1: but we are when it comes to generic medications. These

550
00:29:50,040 --> 00:29:55,280
Speaker 1: are often highly used medications in this country, and yet

551
00:29:55,360 --> 00:29:59,480
Speaker 1: so much of the of the initial pharmaceutical ingredients they're

552
00:29:59,560 --> 00:30:03,000
Speaker 1: manufact lectured in countries that are either it's China, which

553
00:30:03,040 --> 00:30:06,320
Speaker 1: is adversarial, or it's India, where quality controls frankly is

554
00:30:06,520 --> 00:30:09,720
Speaker 1: close to being in the gutter is terrible.

555
00:30:09,880 --> 00:30:14,719
Speaker 6: So you're exactly right. Ninety percent of the prescriptions that

556
00:30:14,840 --> 00:30:21,520
Speaker 6: doctors prescribe patients domestically are generic drugs. So it's the

557
00:30:21,600 --> 00:30:25,560
Speaker 6: drugs that I make every day. People that my neighbors,

558
00:30:26,720 --> 00:30:30,240
Speaker 6: my family, we take on a daily basis their maintenance

559
00:30:30,320 --> 00:30:39,000
Speaker 6: medications like high blood pressure and various other elements. These drugs.

560
00:30:39,040 --> 00:30:45,000
Speaker 6: This is not big pharma. These drugs. Per dose, we

561
00:30:45,080 --> 00:30:48,959
Speaker 6: sell a dose for a pennyion and a half, So

562
00:30:49,040 --> 00:30:54,720
Speaker 6: we sell one hundred doses for dollar fifty, and we

563
00:30:54,880 --> 00:30:59,760
Speaker 6: have to depend on a lot of the raw materials

564
00:31:00,240 --> 00:31:05,240
Speaker 6: from China. They have ninety percent of the active pharmaceutical

565
00:31:05,520 --> 00:31:09,160
Speaker 6: ingredient market in the world.

566
00:31:09,320 --> 00:31:09,600
Speaker 5: Now.

567
00:31:09,880 --> 00:31:16,600
Speaker 6: Also, who manufactures these generic drugs India? Again, they're heavily

568
00:31:16,680 --> 00:31:21,400
Speaker 6: subsidized and they really don't care anything about quality. And

569
00:31:21,520 --> 00:31:25,480
Speaker 6: quality is expensive, as I tried to mention, but it's

570
00:31:25,560 --> 00:31:30,160
Speaker 6: a moral obligation that we have as a domestic manufacturer.

571
00:31:30,840 --> 00:31:35,120
Speaker 6: And when I'm selling one hundred doses for a dollar fifty,

572
00:31:35,960 --> 00:31:39,320
Speaker 6: and yet when it goes through the system and Medicare

573
00:31:39,920 --> 00:31:44,720
Speaker 6: reimburses that dollar fifty, they reimburse to the insurance company

574
00:31:45,160 --> 00:31:49,720
Speaker 6: on average thirteen dollars and twenty five cents. There should

575
00:31:49,800 --> 00:31:54,480
Speaker 6: be a lot of reform on both sides of this equation.

576
00:31:55,040 --> 00:31:58,800
Speaker 6: On the manufacturing side, we need to onshore we need

577
00:31:58,840 --> 00:32:03,480
Speaker 6: more Oxfords us in this country. On the on the

578
00:32:03,520 --> 00:32:10,400
Speaker 6: reimbursement side, we need to really reform PBMs, the distributors

579
00:32:10,880 --> 00:32:13,880
Speaker 6: as well as insurance companies.

580
00:32:14,920 --> 00:32:17,840
Speaker 1: Absolutely, all right, Tom, this is getting into kind of

581
00:32:17,920 --> 00:32:21,760
Speaker 1: the nitty gritty and the nuances of what happens in

582
00:32:21,800 --> 00:32:24,240
Speaker 1: the manufacturing process. But I feel like you're probably the

583
00:32:24,240 --> 00:32:28,960
Speaker 1: perfect person to dig into this. Obviously, China a producer

584
00:32:29,040 --> 00:32:32,160
Speaker 1: of these precursors that then come to you for you

585
00:32:32,240 --> 00:32:38,320
Speaker 1: to compile this drug. China's ingredients, whether they are whether

586
00:32:38,360 --> 00:32:40,640
Speaker 1: they come from the Earth, whether they are created in

587
00:32:40,680 --> 00:32:43,840
Speaker 1: a lab. Is it just not possible for us to

588
00:32:43,920 --> 00:32:47,320
Speaker 1: get those things here? Why don't we have those things

589
00:32:47,360 --> 00:32:51,640
Speaker 1: here so that companies like yours can can produce the

590
00:32:51,720 --> 00:32:52,560
Speaker 1: precursors too.

591
00:32:53,480 --> 00:32:56,760
Speaker 6: Now and in the past, it's been a problem. We

592
00:32:56,880 --> 00:33:03,000
Speaker 6: used to but the permitting build an API facility in

593
00:33:03,480 --> 00:33:08,400
Speaker 6: the last several years was overbearing. That's beginning to change.

594
00:33:08,760 --> 00:33:10,880
Speaker 6: And I don't know if you're familiar with it, but

595
00:33:10,960 --> 00:33:16,680
Speaker 6: the state of Alabama just was awarded a huge API facility.

596
00:33:16,840 --> 00:33:20,800
Speaker 6: The Eli Lillia is building an hour away from us.

597
00:33:21,320 --> 00:33:25,880
Speaker 6: There's a six billion dollar investment they're making for the

598
00:33:26,040 --> 00:33:31,560
Speaker 6: US and for the state of Alabama. That's huge. We

599
00:33:31,640 --> 00:33:35,480
Speaker 6: don't compete with Eli Lilly. They're branded drugs. As you're

600
00:33:35,600 --> 00:33:40,080
Speaker 6: familiar with, we're in engineerics. But we've got to begin

601
00:33:40,400 --> 00:33:48,280
Speaker 6: to bring API facilities on shore. In addition, you're you're

602
00:33:48,360 --> 00:33:52,600
Speaker 6: exactly right when it comes to India. Fifty five percent

603
00:33:52,800 --> 00:33:56,880
Speaker 6: of all engineering drugs are made in India, and the

604
00:33:57,760 --> 00:34:01,360
Speaker 6: quality that they're providing United say, so there's no checks

605
00:34:01,360 --> 00:34:06,160
Speaker 6: and bounces there. If I purchase an API or raw

606
00:34:06,240 --> 00:34:11,319
Speaker 6: material from China, my quality starts from the day it

607
00:34:11,400 --> 00:34:16,040
Speaker 6: hits the dot, meaning I have chemists, I have documentation,

608
00:34:16,360 --> 00:34:19,480
Speaker 6: I review, so I know that that raw material is

609
00:34:20,360 --> 00:34:24,919
Speaker 6: is meet SUS standards at the FDA has put out

610
00:34:25,000 --> 00:34:29,399
Speaker 6: for US. Now on flip side, in India, when they

611
00:34:29,480 --> 00:34:36,600
Speaker 6: send a completed tablet to the US, there's no checking

612
00:34:36,680 --> 00:34:42,319
Speaker 6: after they send it and they ship it to the distributorship.

613
00:34:43,560 --> 00:34:44,799
Speaker 2: Incredible, Tom.

614
00:34:44,840 --> 00:34:46,759
Speaker 1: What I love about your message is that you know

615
00:34:46,840 --> 00:34:50,080
Speaker 1: most companies out there, most CEOs out there, would would

616
00:34:50,160 --> 00:34:53,080
Speaker 1: not be asking for competition, but you are saying there

617
00:34:53,120 --> 00:34:56,719
Speaker 1: need to be more Oxford Pharmaceuticals. So for you, it

618
00:34:56,800 --> 00:34:59,600
Speaker 1: seems like this is a patriot mission because you recognize

619
00:34:59,640 --> 00:35:01,399
Speaker 1: the national security aspect of it.

620
00:35:02,160 --> 00:35:07,120
Speaker 6: That's right, and I fully support an ongoing Commerce Department

621
00:35:07,320 --> 00:35:13,880
Speaker 6: investigation of two thirty two that would allow the government

622
00:35:13,960 --> 00:35:18,759
Speaker 6: to act faster. The government. You know, it takes a

623
00:35:18,800 --> 00:35:23,240
Speaker 6: long time to pass a bill, but since everybody's in agreement,

624
00:35:23,960 --> 00:35:27,920
Speaker 6: if the Commerce Department affirms that two thirty two, it

625
00:35:27,960 --> 00:35:32,440
Speaker 6: gives a whole lot of it clears up a lot

626
00:35:32,440 --> 00:35:34,440
Speaker 6: of the red tape, let me put it that way,

627
00:35:34,920 --> 00:35:42,960
Speaker 6: and the administration can pursue some of these initiatives through VA,

628
00:35:43,160 --> 00:35:48,600
Speaker 6: through Medicare, through the DOW that absolutely has to occur.

629
00:35:49,200 --> 00:35:51,520
Speaker 6: And when you bring on the volume and that you

630
00:35:51,600 --> 00:35:59,080
Speaker 6: say by USA made product, that will attract competition on shore,

631
00:35:59,200 --> 00:36:02,040
Speaker 6: which I willcome absolutely.

632
00:36:02,200 --> 00:36:03,879
Speaker 2: Tom. We love what you're doing.

633
00:36:04,000 --> 00:36:06,240
Speaker 1: Thank you so much for spreading the word on Capitol

634
00:36:06,280 --> 00:36:08,239
Speaker 1: Hill and also here on our show.

635
00:36:08,280 --> 00:36:10,480
Speaker 2: I hope you have a very happy new year.

636
00:36:10,480 --> 00:36:13,800
Speaker 1: Tom Neely, chairman of the board at Oxford Pharmaceuticals.

637
00:36:13,800 --> 00:36:16,280
Speaker 2: Thank you so much, sir, Thank you, Amanda.

638
00:36:16,280 --> 00:36:17,280
Speaker 9: I appreciate it.

639
00:36:17,719 --> 00:36:19,880
Speaker 2: All right, everybody, coming up on the other side of

640
00:36:19,880 --> 00:36:22,400
Speaker 2: this break, we have much more in this very very

641
00:36:22,400 --> 00:36:24,040
Speaker 2: critical issue. We'll be right back.

642
00:36:33,719 --> 00:36:35,719
Speaker 1: Welcome back to just the news and no noise. We

643
00:36:35,800 --> 00:36:39,600
Speaker 1: have another American pharmaceutical manufacturer to get to now to

644
00:36:39,760 --> 00:36:42,360
Speaker 1: explain what more needs to be done to revitalize the

645
00:36:42,400 --> 00:36:45,319
Speaker 1: industry here in the United States and shore up our

646
00:36:45,440 --> 00:36:48,440
Speaker 1: national security when it comes to this issue. So joining

647
00:36:48,520 --> 00:36:50,600
Speaker 1: us now David shuk He is the co founder of

648
00:36:50,640 --> 00:36:52,840
Speaker 1: our gentleman David, Welcome back, Happy.

649
00:36:52,560 --> 00:36:55,760
Speaker 10: New Year, Happy new year to you as well, Amanda,

650
00:36:55,800 --> 00:36:57,120
Speaker 10: and thank you for having me on the show.

651
00:36:57,920 --> 00:36:59,959
Speaker 2: Absolutely, thanks so much for being here.

652
00:37:00,080 --> 00:37:04,560
Speaker 1: And from the manufacturer side of things, if you had

653
00:37:04,600 --> 00:37:07,359
Speaker 1: to send out a memo to every single person on

654
00:37:07,440 --> 00:37:11,360
Speaker 1: Capitol Hill, every advisor over at EEO B, everybody in

655
00:37:11,400 --> 00:37:14,160
Speaker 1: the White House talking to President Trump about this, what

656
00:37:14,239 --> 00:37:16,920
Speaker 1: would be the top two or three things that you

657
00:37:16,920 --> 00:37:18,919
Speaker 1: would say, boom boom boom, this needs to be done

658
00:37:18,960 --> 00:37:19,520
Speaker 1: to fix it all.

659
00:37:19,520 --> 00:37:21,000
Speaker 2: And maybe there's more than three, but what are the

660
00:37:21,040 --> 00:37:21,520
Speaker 2: top three?

661
00:37:22,960 --> 00:37:23,280
Speaker 5: Sure?

662
00:37:23,400 --> 00:37:26,440
Speaker 10: So, first of all, I would want to thank President

663
00:37:26,480 --> 00:37:28,480
Speaker 10: Trump for all of the work that I've seen from

664
00:37:28,520 --> 00:37:31,799
Speaker 10: the administration so far on just being aware of this

665
00:37:31,880 --> 00:37:35,759
Speaker 10: issue and being interested in addressing it. What we've seen

666
00:37:35,840 --> 00:37:38,719
Speaker 10: so far are a number of major announcements between the

667
00:37:38,760 --> 00:37:44,800
Speaker 10: administration and the branded drug industry also known as big pharma.

668
00:37:45,400 --> 00:37:48,520
Speaker 10: But really, big Pharma has nothing to do with this

669
00:37:48,640 --> 00:37:50,799
Speaker 10: issue that we're talking about today. You know, what we

670
00:37:50,880 --> 00:37:57,240
Speaker 10: have today is basically almost no US, truly US generic

671
00:37:57,320 --> 00:38:04,360
Speaker 10: drug industry, meaning that the the APIs come from China,

672
00:38:03,760 --> 00:38:07,520
Speaker 10: the key ingredients that go into making generic drugs come

673
00:38:07,520 --> 00:38:11,040
Speaker 10: from China and India, the finished dose forums come from

674
00:38:11,120 --> 00:38:13,240
Speaker 10: China and India. At best, we might have a few

675
00:38:14,120 --> 00:38:17,560
Speaker 10: what your previous guests Vick referred to as repackaging companies

676
00:38:17,600 --> 00:38:21,719
Speaker 10: that take ingredients or finished dose forms from China and

677
00:38:21,719 --> 00:38:26,360
Speaker 10: India and repackage them to be sold as quote unquote

678
00:38:26,480 --> 00:38:30,759
Speaker 10: US products. They're really not US products though, So this

679
00:38:30,840 --> 00:38:34,359
Speaker 10: is the problem that companies like ours and a few

680
00:38:34,400 --> 00:38:36,719
Speaker 10: others are looking to address and looking to sort of

681
00:38:36,800 --> 00:38:38,360
Speaker 10: raise awareness on this issue.

682
00:38:39,840 --> 00:38:42,560
Speaker 2: How on earth did that become the thing?

683
00:38:42,800 --> 00:38:46,239
Speaker 1: Because this also happens, by the way, in the food industry.

684
00:38:47,360 --> 00:38:49,359
Speaker 1: Everybody knows I think at this point now that if

685
00:38:49,400 --> 00:38:52,239
Speaker 1: you buy beef that was manufactured elsewhere, as long as

686
00:38:52,280 --> 00:38:54,440
Speaker 1: it's packaged here in the United States, they slap that

687
00:38:54,560 --> 00:38:57,000
Speaker 1: label on there and they are legally able to say

688
00:38:57,440 --> 00:38:59,960
Speaker 1: product of the USA. Is that kind of what we're

689
00:39:00,080 --> 00:39:02,400
Speaker 1: talking about here with pharmaceuticals.

690
00:39:03,200 --> 00:39:05,839
Speaker 10: I actually can't speak to food. I don't I am

691
00:39:05,880 --> 00:39:08,520
Speaker 10: not an expert on food. That's that's really interesting and

692
00:39:08,560 --> 00:39:09,920
Speaker 10: I'd love to learn more about that.

693
00:39:09,960 --> 00:39:11,720
Speaker 8: But I'm guessing here maybe right.

694
00:39:11,800 --> 00:39:15,360
Speaker 10: That this is but what this really comes down to

695
00:39:15,480 --> 00:39:19,880
Speaker 10: is price, And you know, I look pricing and cost

696
00:39:20,040 --> 00:39:22,320
Speaker 10: in the healthcare industry. It is a hot button issue

697
00:39:22,320 --> 00:39:28,239
Speaker 10: for everybody you know, and pharmaceuticals is no different in

698
00:39:29,239 --> 00:39:31,640
Speaker 10: but really that issue with price has a lot to

699
00:39:31,640 --> 00:39:35,160
Speaker 10: do with has everything to do with branded drugs.

700
00:39:35,880 --> 00:39:37,560
Speaker 8: Generic drugs sort of.

701
00:39:38,680 --> 00:39:41,640
Speaker 10: There's an entirely different set of economic rules that dictate

702
00:39:41,719 --> 00:39:45,080
Speaker 10: generic drugs. It is all about how can we get

703
00:39:45,080 --> 00:39:49,239
Speaker 10: this at the cheapest cost possible and it is then

704
00:39:49,320 --> 00:39:56,399
Speaker 10: sold through an intermediary marketplace ultimately to pharmacies.

705
00:39:56,719 --> 00:39:58,640
Speaker 8: And these are drugs that.

706
00:40:00,080 --> 00:40:03,279
Speaker 10: Really nothing has mattered in the industry more than how

707
00:40:03,320 --> 00:40:07,520
Speaker 10: can you sell me the absolute lowest cost.

708
00:40:07,440 --> 00:40:09,040
Speaker 8: Version of this drug?

709
00:40:09,080 --> 00:40:10,840
Speaker 10: And what I'm talking about when I say this drug,

710
00:40:10,840 --> 00:40:14,680
Speaker 10: I mean the vast majority, meaning ninety percent plus of

711
00:40:14,880 --> 00:40:19,200
Speaker 10: critical essential medicines in this country are generic. Big Pharma

712
00:40:19,280 --> 00:40:22,120
Speaker 10: has nothing to do with making or selling those medicines.

713
00:40:22,840 --> 00:40:29,000
Speaker 10: And so, because it's so dictated by how can the industry,

714
00:40:29,160 --> 00:40:32,560
Speaker 10: the buying industry in this country just simply get the

715
00:40:32,680 --> 00:40:35,200
Speaker 10: cheapest version of that drug so long as it's approved

716
00:40:35,200 --> 00:40:39,359
Speaker 10: by the FDA, That has been the reason why the

717
00:40:39,920 --> 00:40:45,120
Speaker 10: US manufacturing of generic drugs has become so hollowed out.

718
00:40:46,080 --> 00:40:50,320
Speaker 1: Yeah, talk to us about argentam because you like another

719
00:40:50,360 --> 00:40:52,319
Speaker 1: guest we had on the show, it seems like you

720
00:40:52,840 --> 00:40:55,560
Speaker 1: are one of those folks who you care about having

721
00:40:55,600 --> 00:40:57,719
Speaker 1: this here in the United States so we can check

722
00:40:57,760 --> 00:40:59,839
Speaker 1: on quality control. It can be right here under our

723
00:40:59,840 --> 00:41:02,040
Speaker 1: thad because all of your operations are here right.

724
00:41:02,600 --> 00:41:04,919
Speaker 8: Correct, correct.

725
00:41:06,160 --> 00:41:07,040
Speaker 2: To all of that here.

726
00:41:08,440 --> 00:41:11,840
Speaker 10: Well, we are effectively a startup company. We're a new business.

727
00:41:12,920 --> 00:41:18,120
Speaker 10: We're privately privately held US based, American owned generic pharmaceutical company,

728
00:41:18,560 --> 00:41:20,799
Speaker 10: and we have been for a number of years now

729
00:41:20,840 --> 00:41:25,160
Speaker 10: investing in bringing new generic drugs to the market. And

730
00:41:25,360 --> 00:41:27,600
Speaker 10: what we're now investing in a little bit of the

731
00:41:27,640 --> 00:41:33,520
Speaker 10: nuance here is is investing in bringing bringing old generics

732
00:41:33,520 --> 00:41:36,879
Speaker 10: to the market, meaning existing generics, meaning that we want

733
00:41:36,920 --> 00:41:39,520
Speaker 10: to create generics that are already available in the US

734
00:41:39,600 --> 00:41:42,400
Speaker 10: coming from China and India, but manufacture some of those

735
00:41:42,480 --> 00:41:45,960
Speaker 10: critical medicines right here in the US to the extent possible,

736
00:41:46,480 --> 00:41:51,080
Speaker 10: using active pharmaceutical ingredients and key source materials also manufactured

737
00:41:51,160 --> 00:41:55,799
Speaker 10: in the US or derived from US sources. That's that's

738
00:41:56,120 --> 00:41:58,319
Speaker 10: the role that our gentam is looking to play in

739
00:41:58,360 --> 00:42:00,120
Speaker 10: this and correcting this issue.

740
00:42:00,880 --> 00:42:01,440
Speaker 2: I love that.

741
00:42:01,880 --> 00:42:05,200
Speaker 1: So David, help me look at a hypothetical scenario just

742
00:42:05,239 --> 00:42:07,720
Speaker 1: so our audience can get an idea of the direness

743
00:42:07,760 --> 00:42:10,600
Speaker 1: of this situation. Now, obviously supply would not be cut

744
00:42:10,600 --> 00:42:12,920
Speaker 1: off from India and China for the same reasons. For

745
00:42:13,000 --> 00:42:16,000
Speaker 1: China would probably something be something having to do with

746
00:42:16,040 --> 00:42:19,759
Speaker 1: the trade dispute or something involving our technology sector, and

747
00:42:19,800 --> 00:42:22,040
Speaker 1: it would be a deliberate cutting off. When it comes

748
00:42:22,120 --> 00:42:24,960
Speaker 1: to India, maybe it's a quality control thing. Maybe they

749
00:42:25,000 --> 00:42:27,840
Speaker 1: have to recall medications and we have to stop importing

750
00:42:27,920 --> 00:42:31,920
Speaker 1: drugs from them. If that happened from either country or both,

751
00:42:32,400 --> 00:42:35,239
Speaker 1: how long would our current supply that we have here

752
00:42:35,280 --> 00:42:39,200
Speaker 1: in the United States last for some pretty critical conditions

753
00:42:39,239 --> 00:42:42,960
Speaker 1: like liver disease, heart disease. I mean, these are chronic

754
00:42:43,120 --> 00:42:46,080
Speaker 1: issues that can be life threatening if medication is deprived

755
00:42:46,160 --> 00:42:46,640
Speaker 1: for days.

756
00:42:47,520 --> 00:42:54,040
Speaker 10: Many of these drugs there is effectively sixteen week supply

757
00:42:54,719 --> 00:42:59,239
Speaker 10: on and this varies by drug. It could be less

758
00:42:59,320 --> 00:43:01,560
Speaker 10: than that, it could be more than that, but there

759
00:43:01,719 --> 00:43:05,120
Speaker 10: is you know, you're talking about just a period of

760
00:43:05,160 --> 00:43:08,000
Speaker 10: a few months of supply that we have on hand

761
00:43:08,040 --> 00:43:09,280
Speaker 10: in this country.

762
00:43:09,160 --> 00:43:10,280
Speaker 8: For most of these drugs.

763
00:43:10,320 --> 00:43:13,360
Speaker 10: And these are I'm talking about every day admbiotics for kids,

764
00:43:13,400 --> 00:43:20,200
Speaker 10: every day antibiotics for hospitals, cabs and caps for dozens

765
00:43:20,239 --> 00:43:24,560
Speaker 10: of different chronic diseases such as rheumatoid arthritis, or osteoporosis,

766
00:43:24,680 --> 00:43:29,360
Speaker 10: or certain cardiac conditions. All of these drugs we just

767
00:43:29,440 --> 00:43:32,239
Speaker 10: don't really think about. We take them for granted, right,

768
00:43:32,480 --> 00:43:37,880
Speaker 10: and they have always been there. Sometimes there's an issue

769
00:43:37,880 --> 00:43:40,680
Speaker 10: with supply that gets corrected after some period of time.

770
00:43:40,760 --> 00:43:43,360
Speaker 10: Sometimes there's a safety issue that gets corrected over some

771
00:43:43,440 --> 00:43:47,040
Speaker 10: period of time. But I think that the underlying issue

772
00:43:47,080 --> 00:43:52,359
Speaker 10: is just if if of this is coming from from

773
00:43:52,400 --> 00:43:56,920
Speaker 10: outside the US, is that a strategic concern? Should that

774
00:43:57,000 --> 00:44:01,000
Speaker 10: be a strategic concern? We think it it should be,

775
00:44:01,480 --> 00:44:03,960
Speaker 10: and we think there should be more attention paid to this.

776
00:44:05,200 --> 00:44:07,800
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean look at it like a financial advisor

777
00:44:08,040 --> 00:44:11,560
Speaker 1: would diversify your portfolio. You never want everything coming from

778
00:44:11,600 --> 00:44:15,440
Speaker 1: one source. David Shuk, co founder of our Gentem Pharmaceuticals.

779
00:44:15,480 --> 00:44:17,520
Speaker 1: Thanks so much for your perspective on this tonight.

780
00:44:17,840 --> 00:44:19,240
Speaker 8: Thank you for having me on, Amanda.

781
00:44:19,920 --> 00:44:22,719
Speaker 1: Absolutely all right, everybody, We've got more on this coming

782
00:44:22,760 --> 00:44:23,439
Speaker 1: up after the break.

783
00:44:34,400 --> 00:44:35,640
Speaker 2: Welcome back, everybody.

784
00:44:35,760 --> 00:44:38,120
Speaker 1: Let's pull this all together and put a pretty little

785
00:44:38,200 --> 00:44:40,200
Speaker 1: bow on it. And the perfect person from this show

786
00:44:40,239 --> 00:44:41,840
Speaker 1: tonight to bring back on to help me do that

787
00:44:41,960 --> 00:44:44,840
Speaker 1: is Vic Suarez. He is the founder and principal growth

788
00:44:44,880 --> 00:44:48,600
Speaker 1: partner at Blue Zone Biosciences and Supply Chain Solutions.

789
00:44:48,680 --> 00:44:50,720
Speaker 2: Vic, thank you so much for coming back. I promised

790
00:44:50,719 --> 00:44:52,239
Speaker 2: my audience that you would come back on.

791
00:44:52,160 --> 00:44:54,359
Speaker 1: With me to help me dissect all of this one

792
00:44:54,400 --> 00:44:56,880
Speaker 1: more time before we head out. So, I think the

793
00:44:56,920 --> 00:45:00,120
Speaker 1: first thing I want to ask you is timeline. All right, So,

794
00:45:00,120 --> 00:45:02,880
Speaker 1: so if history, and when I say history, I mean

795
00:45:02,920 --> 00:45:05,359
Speaker 1: this past year since President Trump has been back in office,

796
00:45:05,440 --> 00:45:08,480
Speaker 1: so very recent history, if history has shown us what

797
00:45:08,600 --> 00:45:11,000
Speaker 1: the future is going to look like. As far as

798
00:45:11,160 --> 00:45:13,640
Speaker 1: implementing a lot of the solutions that you spoke about

799
00:45:13,719 --> 00:45:15,799
Speaker 1: on Capitol Hill, a lot of the solutions that you've

800
00:45:15,800 --> 00:45:19,560
Speaker 1: spoken to us about on the show. Do you anticipate

801
00:45:19,640 --> 00:45:21,840
Speaker 1: that this time next year, if we do another special

802
00:45:21,960 --> 00:45:25,360
Speaker 1: like this with you, that we'll be saying this is

803
00:45:25,360 --> 00:45:28,320
Speaker 1: one hundred percent fix, this is fifty percent of the way.

804
00:45:28,640 --> 00:45:30,000
Speaker 2: What do you expect for that timeline?

805
00:45:31,160 --> 00:45:32,640
Speaker 9: Yeah, So I don't think we're going to say it's

806
00:45:32,640 --> 00:45:34,399
Speaker 9: going to be one hundred percent fixed by next year.

807
00:45:34,440 --> 00:45:37,720
Speaker 9: This is a multi year effort, somewhere in the range

808
00:45:37,719 --> 00:45:40,200
Speaker 9: of three to five years to kind of put in

809
00:45:40,320 --> 00:45:44,279
Speaker 9: irreversible momentum in about a decade to completely reverse our

810
00:45:44,440 --> 00:45:48,319
Speaker 9: over alliance on overseas supply chains for essential generics. I

811
00:45:48,360 --> 00:45:51,520
Speaker 9: do think though, that if we revisit this topic again

812
00:45:51,600 --> 00:45:54,680
Speaker 9: by next summer twenty twenty six, one of the great

813
00:45:54,719 --> 00:45:57,520
Speaker 9: things to maybe put as a milestone marker of success

814
00:45:57,719 --> 00:46:01,040
Speaker 9: is do we have all the programs in place to

815
00:46:01,280 --> 00:46:04,080
Speaker 9: start to ignite more companies like your guests that you

816
00:46:04,160 --> 00:46:07,080
Speaker 9: had on there to get into the game of making

817
00:46:07,360 --> 00:46:10,840
Speaker 9: quality medicines here in the United States, or existing companies

818
00:46:10,920 --> 00:46:13,959
Speaker 9: like Oxford that you had on earlier where they are

819
00:46:14,280 --> 00:46:17,160
Speaker 9: able to get market share or growth growth in market

820
00:46:17,160 --> 00:46:20,640
Speaker 9: share because they're manufacturing drugs in the United States and

821
00:46:20,680 --> 00:46:24,759
Speaker 9: selling them to either civilian hospitals, distributors or even the

822
00:46:24,800 --> 00:46:27,640
Speaker 9: military health system. And I think that's kind of going

823
00:46:27,680 --> 00:46:31,280
Speaker 9: to be really the tailtale marker is next summer, are

824
00:46:31,320 --> 00:46:33,560
Speaker 9: we really seeing an uptick in this area?

825
00:46:34,239 --> 00:46:35,839
Speaker 2: Back to you is what is.

826
00:46:35,760 --> 00:46:39,520
Speaker 1: The reason vic that we don't have more Oxford pharmaceuticals

827
00:46:39,680 --> 00:46:42,120
Speaker 1: or our gentoms. Is it a profit thing, because obviously

828
00:46:42,200 --> 00:46:44,200
Speaker 1: you're not going to make as much money I would

829
00:46:44,239 --> 00:46:48,000
Speaker 1: think on pharmaceuticals just because the price of it is

830
00:46:48,080 --> 00:46:50,280
Speaker 1: so much lower than it is some of these retails,

831
00:46:50,520 --> 00:46:53,680
Speaker 1: you know, these these brand name drugs. Is what is

832
00:46:53,719 --> 00:46:57,120
Speaker 1: the obstacle that's stopping there from being more of those

833
00:46:57,160 --> 00:46:58,640
Speaker 1: types of companies here in the US.

834
00:46:59,600 --> 00:47:04,160
Speaker 9: Yeah, the biggest thing is really the competitors that they

835
00:47:04,160 --> 00:47:07,959
Speaker 9: are competing against are not playing by the same rules, right,

836
00:47:08,040 --> 00:47:11,560
Speaker 9: So these companies typically will ensure that the quality of

837
00:47:11,600 --> 00:47:14,279
Speaker 9: these medicines are adhered to. They're not going to cut

838
00:47:14,320 --> 00:47:17,160
Speaker 9: corners when it comes to those things. Also because the

839
00:47:17,200 --> 00:47:21,040
Speaker 9: reglatory agency is really right in their backyard. And so

840
00:47:21,320 --> 00:47:24,160
Speaker 9: part of this has been now decades in the works

841
00:47:24,239 --> 00:47:27,759
Speaker 9: of really an uneven playing field where the regulatory agency

842
00:47:28,400 --> 00:47:32,160
Speaker 9: was holding to the standards with these American companies and

843
00:47:32,600 --> 00:47:34,960
Speaker 9: therefore they had their cost of goods sold were at

844
00:47:34,960 --> 00:47:38,640
Speaker 9: a higher margin, and as a result, they weren't as profitable.

845
00:47:39,239 --> 00:47:41,880
Speaker 9: And so when they're competing against companies that are playing

846
00:47:41,880 --> 00:47:44,759
Speaker 9: by these loopholes or where the regulatory agency isn't able

847
00:47:44,840 --> 00:47:48,800
Speaker 9: to monitor them as closely, then there's a distinct advantage

848
00:47:48,840 --> 00:47:52,880
Speaker 9: of moving those supply chains and those manufacturing overseas. And

849
00:47:52,920 --> 00:47:55,160
Speaker 9: that's really been due to just out of the eighties

850
00:47:55,160 --> 00:48:00,160
Speaker 9: and nineties, this globalization movement in all the sectors, and

851
00:48:00,200 --> 00:48:03,320
Speaker 9: so one of the things that is really keeping a

852
00:48:03,320 --> 00:48:06,920
Speaker 9: lot of these companies from able to really compete on

853
00:48:07,040 --> 00:48:10,160
Speaker 9: an even playing field is something as simple as how

854
00:48:10,200 --> 00:48:13,720
Speaker 9: we do procurement policy. So this is really a message

855
00:48:13,719 --> 00:48:16,680
Speaker 9: to those that are in the procurement business, whether they're

856
00:48:16,680 --> 00:48:19,759
Speaker 9: in the federal government at the VA, the Military Health System,

857
00:48:20,080 --> 00:48:23,360
Speaker 9: or HHS, is we really need to follow some of

858
00:48:23,360 --> 00:48:26,640
Speaker 9: the guidance we've seen from the executive orders about preferring

859
00:48:27,320 --> 00:48:33,000
Speaker 9: true procurement practices towards true American made products and really

860
00:48:33,080 --> 00:48:36,880
Speaker 9: decipher that away from those that have used these loopholes

861
00:48:36,920 --> 00:48:39,799
Speaker 9: and say that they're American made products. That's something you

862
00:48:39,800 --> 00:48:43,319
Speaker 9: can do without legislation. You might deal with it in

863
00:48:43,360 --> 00:48:45,919
Speaker 9: court like you did in like the federal government did

864
00:48:46,000 --> 00:48:49,239
Speaker 9: in February of twenty twenty. But I think we are

865
00:48:49,320 --> 00:48:53,440
Speaker 9: now more informed about the ramifications of not doing this,

866
00:48:54,040 --> 00:48:57,400
Speaker 9: and so I would just encourage policy makers, those that

867
00:48:57,520 --> 00:49:01,880
Speaker 9: lead these agency procurement offices to really relook their procurement

868
00:49:01,920 --> 00:49:05,160
Speaker 9: methods in favor American made medicines.

869
00:49:06,000 --> 00:49:06,280
Speaker 3: Yeah.

870
00:49:06,480 --> 00:49:09,560
Speaker 1: Absolutely, I hope this time next year we are saying

871
00:49:09,640 --> 00:49:11,520
Speaker 1: that it's at least fifty percent better.

872
00:49:11,719 --> 00:49:12,840
Speaker 2: I would be happy with that.

873
00:49:13,000 --> 00:49:13,120
Speaker 6: Vic.

874
00:49:13,200 --> 00:49:15,120
Speaker 2: I think you probably would be too. But like you said,

875
00:49:15,440 --> 00:49:16,440
Speaker 2: this is multi years.

876
00:49:16,640 --> 00:49:18,400
Speaker 1: This is going to take a bit, but once we

877
00:49:18,440 --> 00:49:20,560
Speaker 1: get there, it's going to be incredible, and I think

878
00:49:20,560 --> 00:49:22,560
Speaker 1: it will happen by the end of this term under

879
00:49:22,560 --> 00:49:23,200
Speaker 1: President Trump.

880
00:49:23,280 --> 00:49:25,040
Speaker 2: Vicswarez, thanks so much for being with us.

881
00:49:25,080 --> 00:49:27,799
Speaker 1: Thank you for everything you do over at Blue Zone Bioscience,

882
00:49:28,080 --> 00:49:28,799
Speaker 1: and we'll talk to you in.

883
00:49:28,800 --> 00:49:31,640
Speaker 2: The new year. Happy New Year to you, Thank you,

884
00:49:31,920 --> 00:49:32,719
Speaker 2: Thanks so much.

885
00:49:32,760 --> 00:49:35,040
Speaker 1: All right, everybody that's going to do it for us tonight,

886
00:49:35,080 --> 00:49:38,040
Speaker 1: we appreciate you being with us, and thanks for being

887
00:49:38,120 --> 00:49:40,040
Speaker 1: keen on hearing about these issues.

888
00:49:40,040 --> 00:49:41,279
Speaker 2: It's very important. You know.

889
00:49:41,320 --> 00:49:43,640
Speaker 1: There have been a lot of hearings, like VIC participated

890
00:49:43,640 --> 00:49:45,960
Speaker 1: in up on Capitol Hill, but I think enough hearings

891
00:49:45,960 --> 00:49:48,360
Speaker 1: have happened. They've heard everything they need to hear, and

892
00:49:48,400 --> 00:49:50,040
Speaker 1: they just need to act on it. So we'll be

893
00:49:50,080 --> 00:49:52,640
Speaker 1: all looking forward to those types of actions in the

894
00:49:52,640 --> 00:49:55,200
Speaker 1: new year. Everybody, have a great evening and we will

895
00:49:55,200 --> 00:49:57,320
Speaker 1: be back tomorrow regular time, six pm EASTERNS.

896
00:49:57,360 --> 00:50:00,320
Speaker 2: See them