Speaker 1: Broadcasting live from the Abraham Lincoln Radio Studio, the George
Speaker 1: Washington Broadcast Center, Jack Armstrong and Joe Getty.
Speaker 2: Arm Strong and Getty and he Armstrong and Getty.
Speaker 3: Governor, just to follow up on that, the question was
Speaker 3: can you explain the direancy?
Speaker 4: All I said on this was is I got there
Speaker 4: that summer and misspoke on this, So I will just
Speaker 4: that's what I've said. So I was in Hong Kong
Speaker 4: and China during the democracy protest went in and from
Speaker 4: that I learned a lot of what needed to be
Speaker 4: in governance.
Speaker 5: Thank you, Governor.
Speaker 2: I found that perfectly satisfiying.
Speaker 1: That was a good moment for Margaret Brennan, who I
Speaker 1: am about to complain about because it was just horrific
Speaker 1: the moderation.
Speaker 2: But she didn't follow up on that.
Speaker 1: She didn't get let him get away with not answering
Speaker 1: that question, and then she let that hang there when
Speaker 1: she could have jumped in and rescued him. She just
Speaker 1: let that silence hang there. And you haven't finished your thought,
Speaker 1: and it doesn't make sense. So we're just gonna sit
Speaker 1: here and look at each other for a little bit
Speaker 1: and wonder how you hit.
Speaker 2: So today it was one of those moments.
Speaker 1: Andrew McCurry or does anybody want any more potato salad?
Speaker 2: That's a good one.
Speaker 1: Andrew McCarthy of National Review tweeted this out during the debate.
Speaker 1: I was feeling this hard. The media bias in this
Speaker 1: debate is nearly as bad as the Trump hairs debate.
Speaker 1: It's not as evident because Vance has navigated it brilliantly true.
Speaker 1: He also said, after Wall speaks, every CBS question to answer,
Speaker 1: rather than inviting him just to respond, is loaded with
Speaker 1: a diversion, usually framing a Trump position inaccurately. He handles
Speaker 1: it with good cheer and poise, but it's you know,
Speaker 1: it is a form of bias.
Speaker 6: Absolutely, just talking about the idea of illegal immigration, perhaps
Speaker 6: kicking certain people out of the country. Are you going
Speaker 6: to separate parents from their children who will be ripped
Speaker 6: crying from the bosom of their mother?
Speaker 2: Wait?
Speaker 7: What, how?
Speaker 2: What this is our immigration question? Yeah? It was unbelievable.
Speaker 1: And when then we go to Walls, they would just say,
Speaker 1: what's your immigration plan? Let him lay it out with uh.
Speaker 1: With Vance, you try to put him on the defensive
Speaker 1: right from the get going. One more tweet from Andy McCarthy,
Speaker 1: who we've had on the show many times. CBS doesn't
Speaker 1: think anyone sees this. When they ask Vance to respond,
Speaker 1: they loaded the question to Shield Walls. Last answer when
Speaker 1: they ask Walls to respond, it's however you want to respond,
Speaker 1: big guy, and still Vance is in command.
Speaker 2: But that is right.
Speaker 1: Walls would give an answer that it didn't quite make sense,
Speaker 1: and instead of just going to Vans and letting him
Speaker 1: respond to that and point that out, they would, you know,
Speaker 1: try to put him on the defensive with some quote
Speaker 1: often incorrect or fact right.
Speaker 6: Yeah, yeah, absolutely, a pattern over and over again. So
Speaker 6: Katie Greener esteemed to use woman joins us And this
Speaker 6: is just a quick aside, but I find myself as
Speaker 6: a bit of a wordsmith trying to avoid venting my
Speaker 6: discontent with the moderator ladies by using female specific insults, empathets,
Speaker 6: whatever you want to call it, because it feels sexist
Speaker 6: to me, and it's a funny aspect of the language,
Speaker 6: probably because men and women are very different that if
Speaker 6: I'm angry at the performance of a woman, I'm going
Speaker 6: to go to a woman's specific word. You know what
Speaker 6: I'm saying. Yeah, we all know what that list is
Speaker 6: you as darling woman? Darling is one of them? No,
Speaker 6: it's not on my list, sweems. What list are you
Speaker 6: looking at?
Speaker 2: Sweetheart? There you go?
Speaker 6: Right, So you as a woman, if you are thinking, no,
Speaker 6: O'Donnell and what's her face?
Speaker 2: The Brennan are Margaret? They call her.
Speaker 6: Are doing a terrible job that bias. Would you use
Speaker 6: a female specific term there?
Speaker 5: I think you absolutely could.
Speaker 2: Yeah, well, I mean, but you just if you're in
Speaker 2: real life?
Speaker 6: What'd you think of the moderators last night TC?
Speaker 2: There are many options, yeah, many many letters.
Speaker 8: Not to go down the like swear word, call him
Speaker 8: a couple of cat ladies, nitwitz, I like that.
Speaker 6: So I think I just need to go with gender
Speaker 6: neutral terms because I would not want to be thought
Speaker 6: of as a misogynist, because I'm not so just jackass.
Speaker 2: Of course that's male specific, isn't.
Speaker 8: Dang bats Bembo's Bembo's is kind of ama.
Speaker 6: That's female, right, yeah, No, if if it were a fellow,
Speaker 6: I might tie him to his gen and.
Speaker 1: Colin right, yeah, yeah, exactly, you know, might be gentle
Speaker 1: related nickname, but a.
Speaker 5: Couple of jumps, I don't know.
Speaker 6: Yeah, yeah, I just it's funny anyway.
Speaker 8: I can see what you mean though, because it would
Speaker 8: sound like it degrading, which I don't understand. I don't
Speaker 8: know where in that line of communication that happened.
Speaker 6: But a couple of smug phonies, lying biased advocates for
Speaker 6: one side over the other, pretending to be neutral.
Speaker 2: I can't stand them all. True, but Joe dropped some
Speaker 2: unkind no.
Speaker 6: No, hey, hey, behind closed doors privileged communication, attorney client
Speaker 6: something or other.
Speaker 5: Right ones, though more so than the ones we can
Speaker 5: stay on the air.
Speaker 6: Yeah, well anyway, so, yeah, they're horribly biased. But I
Speaker 6: thought mister Vance held his own quite nicely, and Tim
Speaker 6: Walls came off as a bald headed Sarah Palin. But
Speaker 6: it depends who you ask, what poles you look at.
Speaker 6: It could be the eye of the beholder.
Speaker 1: Certainly, Sarah Palin killed in that first debate by the
Speaker 1: way she was in absolutely true.
Speaker 6: Yeah, it was only later that her lack of depths.
Speaker 2: Walls did not run out.
Speaker 7: Wow.
Speaker 1: Again, the short poles are roughly even, I think, because
Speaker 1: so many people are just buried in there.
Speaker 2: I'm for this side or not or that side. Yeah,
Speaker 2: I would.
Speaker 6: I would love to see them somehow restrict poles, although
Speaker 6: you couldn't too. Are you an undecided voter in a
Speaker 6: swing state? If the answers no move on.
Speaker 1: Everybody would love if you could poll just undecided voters
Speaker 1: in swing states that because that's the whole game.
Speaker 6: Well right, Because if you're a decided voter, there's a
Speaker 6: very very small chance that you found jd Vance so
Speaker 6: transcendent you've decided to vote for Trump almosting already decided
Speaker 6: to vote for Harris.
Speaker 2: So those poles are are kind of silly.
Speaker 6: Anyway, to the substance of the debate, the one topic
Speaker 6: everyone can agree is incredibly important, the economy. Michael will
Speaker 6: start with sixty in roll from there.
Speaker 9: A lot of what Kamala Harris proposes to do, and
Speaker 9: some of it, I'll be honest with you, it even
Speaker 9: sounds pretty good. Here's what you want here is that
Speaker 9: Kamala Harris has already done it. Because she's been the
Speaker 9: Vice president for three and a half years, she had
Speaker 9: the opportunity to enact all of these great policies, and
Speaker 9: what she's actually done instead is drive the cost of
Speaker 9: food higher by twenty five percent, drive the cost of
Speaker 9: housing higher by about sixty percent. Open the American southern
Speaker 9: border and make middle class life unaffordable for a large
Speaker 9: number of Americans. If Kamala Harris has such great plans
Speaker 9: for how to address middle class problems, then she ought
Speaker 9: to do them now, not one asking for promotion, but
Speaker 9: in the job the American people gave her three and
Speaker 9: a half years ago, And the fact that she isn't
Speaker 9: tells you a lot about how much you can trust
Speaker 9: her actual plans.
Speaker 6: Number one theme in our email this morning drop us
Speaker 6: a note mail bag at Armstrong and Geddy dot com.
Speaker 6: Number one theme by far not even close, is I
Speaker 6: wish Jade Vance could be the candidate because he's able
Speaker 6: to clearly articulate the case against Kamala Harris like he
Speaker 6: did right there.
Speaker 2: It was really good stuff.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that was a take by a couple of my
Speaker 1: favorite pundits that I was watching last night. Is it
Speaker 1: was a great night for JD. Vance's political career. It
Speaker 1: may not have changed anything with this current presidential election,
Speaker 1: but it was really good for him as a guy
Speaker 1: who's only forty years old and his future in twenty
Speaker 1: eight thirty two, She's thirty eight, forty six.
Speaker 2: Whatever the next numbers are.
Speaker 1: Because he's only forty and since we're willing to elect
Speaker 1: eighty year old, he's got a long way to go.
Speaker 6: Well now, to be fair, let's give the Florida old
Speaker 6: coach Waltz, who's fresh back from tian Men Square where
Speaker 6: he was participating in the Apollo program.
Speaker 2: Next clip, Michael.
Speaker 4: My pro tip of the day is this, if you
Speaker 4: need heart surgery, listen to the people at the Mayo
Speaker 4: Clinic in Rochester, Minnesota.
Speaker 2: Not Donald Trump, Governor.
Speaker 9: You say, trust the experts, But those same experts for
Speaker 9: forty years said that if we shipped our manufacturing base.
Speaker 2: Off to China, we'd get cheaper goods. They lied about that.
Speaker 9: They said if we shipped our industry base off to
Speaker 9: other countries, to Mexico and elsewhere, it would make the
Speaker 9: middle class stronger.
Speaker 2: They were wrong about that.
Speaker 9: They were wrong about the idea that if we made
Speaker 9: America less self reliant, less productive in our own nation,
Speaker 9: that it would somehow make us better off.
Speaker 2: And they were wrong about it.
Speaker 9: And for the first time in a generation, Donald Trump
Speaker 9: had the wisdom and the courage to say, to that
Speaker 9: bipartisan consensus, we're not doing it anymore.
Speaker 6: I'm reminded of Churchill's famous rejoinder when he was pointing
Speaker 6: out that he'd changed his position on an issue, and
Speaker 6: he said, the facts have changed, so I've changed my opinion.
Speaker 6: And a lot of the philosophies of the twentieth century
Speaker 6: in terms of trade and economics, I think they're no
Speaker 6: longer valid because the world has changed so much, and
Speaker 6: you're seeing that on the Republican side of the aisle.
Speaker 2: More and more voters are saying, yeah.
Speaker 6: The free trade thing lovely as far as it went,
Speaker 6: but not anymore, especially because we're in bed with our
Speaker 6: greatest geopolitical adversary, that is, as we speak, figuring out
Speaker 6: how to bring us to Ruin through every gizmo they
Speaker 6: send us and every bit of trade they engage in.
Speaker 1: There is no specific questions about China at all, or
Speaker 1: the war between Russia and Ukraine, or the debt. Of
Speaker 1: course that never comes up. Debt and spending never comes up,
Speaker 1: so that's that's not unique here.
Speaker 2: It is part is an issue in its way. Yeah,
Speaker 2: it is.
Speaker 1: It's crazy that Ukraine and Russia didn't come up, especially
Speaker 1: since jd. Vance is a pretty extreme position on it,
Speaker 1: has said some pretty extreme things about it. I'm surprised
Speaker 1: they didn't use that as an opportunity to attack him,
Speaker 1: but that, yeah, didn't come up abortion. We like half
Speaker 1: the debate a climate change for like the other half
Speaker 1: of the debate abortion climate change.
Speaker 6: Yeah, if you're just tuning in and sometimes we forget
Speaker 6: that people you know, come and go and the rest
Speaker 6: of it. It was much more gentlemanly and policy focused
Speaker 6: than any debate for quite a long time.
Speaker 2: It was.
Speaker 6: It was very very good in a lot of ways.
Speaker 6: The moderating wasolutely terrible, and it was weird that they
Speaker 6: steered clear of those issues Jack just mentioned. But they
Speaker 6: made it seem like the average American woman has an
Speaker 6: abortion about as frequently as she goes to the grocery
Speaker 6: store once every week or so at least, right, I mean,
Speaker 6: like abortion is it's the topic you talk about every
Speaker 6: day among the family.
Speaker 2: Have any abortions today, honey?
Speaker 10: No?
Speaker 2: But work was good. It's amazing, it is. It absolutely is.
Speaker 1: Oh and by the way, and I've had this story
Speaker 1: for weeks and haven't gotten to it because I'm never
Speaker 1: in the mood to talk about late term abortion or infanticide.
Speaker 2: But Tim Walls is.
Speaker 1: Absolutely freaking either wrong or lying depending on what his
Speaker 1: motives are about his role in that law and babies
Speaker 1: in Minnesota and babies surviving abortions and whether they die.
Speaker 1: The Dispatch had a fact check on her last night,
Speaker 1: and there's hardly a news organization in America. I trust
Speaker 1: more than the Dispatch to get it right. And they
Speaker 1: have the statistics eight babies died after an abortion because
Speaker 1: of they don't offer the services to keep them alive,
Speaker 1: as signed by Tim Wall specifically.
Speaker 2: And you know there was no fact checking on that
Speaker 2: last night.
Speaker 6: No, indeed, and that is absolutely provable. I wanted to
Speaker 6: do more on the economy, but we rented and raved
Speaker 6: too much, sez too Yes, please stop yelling at me,
Speaker 6: you she ass uh yes, So more to come after
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Speaker 5: Armstrong and Yetti, I'll get this.
Speaker 12: In a new swing state, Paul Harris is losing voters
Speaker 12: aged sixty five and older by seven points. Yeah, it
Speaker 12: seems like older voters might be her biggest weakness, which
Speaker 12: explains why she changed her campaign slogan a few times recently.
Speaker 2: Yeah, look at this.
Speaker 12: Kamala twenty twenty four, A chair in every shower.
Speaker 2: Look at this one.
Speaker 12: Here is Kama twenty two five, where your glasses are
Speaker 12: on your head, you're welcome. And finally there's Kamala twenty
Speaker 12: twenty four. I'm going to find out where that draft
Speaker 12: is coming from.
Speaker 2: Like, wow, it's cold right every No, I don't. I
Speaker 2: don't appreciate the you know, having.
Speaker 1: Sport with the older voter at a restaurant the other night,
Speaker 1: and I brought up a cold draft at the restaurant
Speaker 1: to the waiter. Oh, my kids mocked me endlessly for that.
Speaker 1: Katie's Katie's look on your face?
Speaker 2: What? What did?
Speaker 8: What did the sweet waitress say when you brought up
Speaker 8: a cold draft?
Speaker 1: Jack, I said, hasn't anybody ever said that before? She said, no,
Speaker 1: put on a shawl or stay at home and you're
Speaker 1: really hot, hot house grandpa.
Speaker 2: Oh, it's funny. It was freezing.
Speaker 1: I've never been that cold in a restaurant in my life.
Speaker 1: Something had gone wrong. It's also like the chair in
Speaker 1: the shower joke, that's pretty funny. It's Fat Bear Week
Speaker 1: in Alaska, and Joe said, oh, I love Fat Bear Week.
Speaker 6: What's fat I'm a big fan, big fan. They've got
Speaker 6: these bear cams where the bears are in the rivers
Speaker 6: fishing for the salmon, and and everybody votes on which
Speaker 6: bear has gotten the fattest's feasting on the salmon, because
Speaker 6: you know with bears, they eat a tremendous amount and
Speaker 6: then they hibernate for the winter, which is coming up.
Speaker 6: That says like a good plank gets some big, fat,
Speaker 6: grizzly bears and everybody picks their fath I might try
Speaker 6: that some year. They've been back to back winners and
Speaker 6: then young up starts to come along as very exciting
Speaker 6: you can to try the bear.
Speaker 5: We're gonna have a fat Jack.
Speaker 1: I'm gonna get as fat as I can like during
Speaker 1: the summer months and then just sleep all winter as
Speaker 1: much as like, yeah, perfectly, hardly get out of bed,
Speaker 1: just don't eat much, and then wake up.
Speaker 2: We fill out my revenge bod in the spring. Um. Sure,
Speaker 2: that's how it works.
Speaker 1: We're gonna talk to a lot of each gen about
Speaker 1: last night's debate coming up. He's one of the best
Speaker 1: political pundits in America, and he's helped coach people for
Speaker 1: debates and.
Speaker 2: All that sort of stuff, so he's got a lot
Speaker 2: of knowledge there.
Speaker 1: Did you see the guy who bought the Taylor Swift guitar? No,
Speaker 1: and then smashed it. So he paid a whole bunch
Speaker 1: of money for a Taylor Swift guitar that was up
Speaker 1: for sale as like a charity or something like that,
Speaker 1: and he bought it, he smashed it.
Speaker 2: He's the sort of YouTube provocateur, that sort of guy.
Speaker 2: Of course, people went nuts.
Speaker 8: So they went nuts, and he actually had to well
Speaker 8: he well he didn't have to, but he apologized saying
Speaker 8: that by destroying it he wasn't meaning to be violent.
Speaker 1: Right, And now he's going to do a fundraiser of
Speaker 1: some sort of around the smash guitar to raise even
Speaker 1: more money for the charity.
Speaker 6: But brings to mind John Hyatt's fabulous, perfectly good guitar.
Speaker 6: Great song if you're into the rock and roll music?
Speaker 2: How old can you? How old Jay is? Is? A
Speaker 2: old Walls Tim Wall held.
Speaker 1: Might be he's sixty turn he just turned sixty, that's
Speaker 1: right to remember when he made a big deal out
Speaker 1: of his birthday he reads much older, which might be
Speaker 1: an advantage in politics mostly, but it's you'd never know
Speaker 1: he was the same age as Kamala Harris. I mentioned
Speaker 1: that to somebody last night watching the Baby said, no,
Speaker 1: he's like seventy eight.
Speaker 2: Nice, he's sixty. Yeah, he's sixty.
Speaker 6: I mean it was what thirty thirty five years ago
Speaker 6: that he was heavyweight champion of the world and simultaneously
Speaker 6: the American League batting champ.
Speaker 1: You're insinuating that he exaggerates about his resume.
Speaker 6: Everything all the time. There's not an aspect of his resume.
Speaker 6: His wife is probably just his girlfriend. I mean, he
Speaker 6: exaggerates everything.
Speaker 2: Mind your own damn business.
Speaker 1: Lots of politicians, it turns out, do this, and so
Speaker 1: it's got to be when they run for a big office,
Speaker 1: when people start looking into their stories, they go, oh, oh,
Speaker 1: I've been getting away with this my whole life, the
Speaker 1: whole I was at Tieneman Square or whatever you're claiming.
Speaker 6: Oh no, now you people are checking this sort of thing.
Speaker 6: I better go through this. Mentally, I'm not sure what's
Speaker 6: true and what's not anymore, because it's never mattered.
Speaker 1: Did the debate matter, did it move the needle? Among
Speaker 1: the things we'll talk to lanahe Chin about coming.
Speaker 8: I'm just stay with us Armstrong and Getty.
Speaker 13: My overall impression is that both men came to seem likable,
Speaker 13: and I think it's quite possible that both men achieved
Speaker 13: that task.
Speaker 8: I think the lack of interviews that he has done
Speaker 8: with national media with local media, it showed he needed more.
Speaker 1: Talking about Tim Walls there that second person, I guess
Speaker 1: Jake Tapper nailed that on CNN because on their own polling,
Speaker 1: both candidates went up by double digits in terms of
Speaker 1: their favorability after the debate, So both came came away
Speaker 1: more likable, apparently. So I took in a ton of
Speaker 1: punditry right after the debate, and it varied from depending
Speaker 1: on you know you like going into Walls was either
Speaker 1: nervous and unprepared or seemed like a regular guy up
Speaker 1: there because of his nervousness in the way he talks.
Speaker 1: And jd Vance was either hold about.
Speaker 2: Coronavirus freaking COVID.
Speaker 1: Jd Vance was either polished and skilled or slick and
Speaker 1: some other word differ, Yeah, something like that. So it's
Speaker 1: funny how you know you can call something polished or slick,
Speaker 1: and they have two different, two different meanings you're trying
Speaker 1: to convey even though they're the same thing.
Speaker 6: Yeah, I love the notion of he seemed like a
Speaker 6: regular guy. I think the greatest superpower on Earth has
Speaker 6: the right task for an irregular guy, like an exceptional guy,
Speaker 6: to lead the country or be second in command.
Speaker 2: But that's just me.
Speaker 6: Let's discuss the debate with Lanai Chen David and Diane
Speaker 6: Stephie fellow in American Public Policy Studies at the Uber
Speaker 6: Institution and the Director of Domestic Policy Studies at Stanford University.
Speaker 2: Lonnie, how are you. I'm fine.
Speaker 7: Great to be with you guys.
Speaker 1: So what was your own expert pundit takeaway after you
Speaker 1: watch the debate?
Speaker 7: Well, I don't know about expert.
Speaker 11: I mean, look, I think, first of all, if you're
Speaker 11: not an expert, who the hell is an expert?
Speaker 2: You're an expert.
Speaker 7: There are no experts anymore.
Speaker 11: I think, first of all, I was really I guess
Speaker 11: I felt really good after the debate because I thought
Speaker 11: there was a level of civility and substance to the
Speaker 11: conversation that we've been missing in our politics for a while.
Speaker 11: I mean, I remember telling my kids like, this is
Speaker 11: what politics was like when I was growing up, and
Speaker 11: it felt.
Speaker 7: A little bit like that.
Speaker 11: In terms of the impacts, I think both sides will
Speaker 11: find things to take from it. I mean, clearly, Vance,
Speaker 11: in my view, had the stronger performance on substance and
Speaker 11: on style. You know, people can say that Tim Walls
Speaker 11: came off like an ordinary guy. The reality is that
Speaker 11: I think we do have an expectation that if you're
Speaker 11: going to be vice president, you know you're gonna have
Speaker 11: to step up a little bit. And I think the
Speaker 11: first let's call it fifteen minutes of the debate for
Speaker 11: Walls were not great, and I think that set the
Speaker 11: tone for him. I think the other reason why it
Speaker 11: felt like Vance had the stronger debate is because there
Speaker 11: weren't any moments in the debate that were just major
Speaker 11: missteps for Vance, whereas I felt like Walls's answer on
Speaker 11: like were you actually in China for the Tienamen Square
Speaker 11: massacre one of the most significant events in world history,
Speaker 11: you should be able to remember whether you were there
Speaker 11: or not, And the fact that he gave an answer
Speaker 11: which was basically like, well, I misspoke that one's going.
Speaker 7: To have a long tail, I fear for Tim Walls.
Speaker 11: If you're a Tim Walls fan or a Harris Van's
Speaker 11: a Harris Walls fan, I think there'll be a long
Speaker 11: tail on that one. So that moment was the only
Speaker 11: one for me that I think could cause trouble for
Speaker 11: either campaign down the road.
Speaker 6: My impression was that and this is only relevant for
Speaker 6: the undecided voters in swing states. Honestly, I think the
Speaker 6: most relevant or important development last night was that JD.
Speaker 6: Vance came off as somebody you could picture as president
Speaker 6: and Walls did not.
Speaker 2: Am I just being biased? No?
Speaker 7: I think Vance passed the test.
Speaker 11: I mean there were two things he had to do
Speaker 11: coming into the evening, and in my view, number one
Speaker 11: was to paint himself in a more favorable light, because
Speaker 11: all of the survey research coming into the debate was
Speaker 11: that people viewed JD.
Speaker 7: Unfavorably.
Speaker 11: Now I don't know why, in particular, given that you
Speaker 11: know he aside from the couple comments he's made, I
Speaker 11: don't know that there's been a whole lot out there
Speaker 11: about him. So I think that the first thing was
Speaker 11: he had to paint himself in a more favorable light.
Speaker 7: The second thing was.
Speaker 11: He had to make Kamala Harris into the incumbent. That
Speaker 11: was his goal in this debate, in case that wasn't
Speaker 11: obvious to people, is to basically say, listen, for all
Speaker 11: the things that Kamala Harris has said about trying to
Speaker 11: solve America's problems, She's had an opportunity to solve them
Speaker 11: for the last three and a half years and she
Speaker 11: hasn't done so. So on both of those accounts, I
Speaker 11: thought Vance was successful.
Speaker 7: Walls, you know.
Speaker 11: I mean, look, I think the first fifteen minutes of
Speaker 11: debate were very problematic for him and that will carry through,
Speaker 11: even though I do think he found his footing and
Speaker 11: did have some moments in the so let's say the
Speaker 11: last hour of the debate. I just think you're right
Speaker 11: that this was a stronger debate for Vance and we'll
Speaker 11: have a longer tail of advantage for the Trump Vance ticket.
Speaker 1: So I hate to even bring this topic up because
Speaker 1: it's kind of tired, but it seems to be getting worse.
Speaker 1: And even some of my favorite pundits said, oh my god,
Speaker 1: not again. CBS was practically as bad as ABC with
Speaker 1: the whole it's going to be three on one. Is
Speaker 1: there anything the Republicans can do about it. They said,
Speaker 1: no fact checking, and then of course there they were
Speaker 1: fact checking the Republican.
Speaker 7: Yeah, it's very challenging.
Speaker 11: I think this has been a challenging cycle for the
Speaker 11: media and I think what if anything this demonstrates to
Speaker 11: me at least, is that the old system we had.
Speaker 11: You may remember before this campaign, we had a commission
Speaker 11: on presidential debates and they tended to vet. They didn't
Speaker 11: tend to they did they vetted and picked the moderators.
Speaker 11: And not that the moderators pre twenty twenty four were
Speaker 11: universally good. I mean, I remember Candy Crowley being atrocious
Speaker 11: in twenty twelve.
Speaker 2: You had to mass how I think you were on
Speaker 2: that campaign with the believe me.
Speaker 7: I mean that was had to that.
Speaker 11: I mean you talk about the ultimate, uh biased fact check.
Speaker 7: That was it.
Speaker 11: But but you know, for the as a general matter,
Speaker 11: putting Candy and maybe one other example like a big
Speaker 11: of a side like they they had reasonably good moderators.
Speaker 11: And I think what we found now that the media
Speaker 11: organizations have taken over the debates in this cycle is
Speaker 11: that the moderation has been much more uneven. And to
Speaker 11: your point, you know, if you're going to say at
Speaker 11: the outset we're not going to fact check, then don't
Speaker 11: fact check, right, I mean, be one way or the other.
Speaker 11: If you're going to say, like listen, we're going to
Speaker 11: fact check, then do it and do it evenly with
Speaker 11: both candidates. Because there were things, you know, they could
Speaker 11: have pressed Walls a lot harder. On the tenement square thing.
Speaker 11: I think they did press them a little bit. They
Speaker 11: should have pressed them a little bit more. There are
Speaker 11: several of the things during this campaign that have been
Speaker 11: said by Walls about his background that are questionable. Those
Speaker 11: are things they should have fact checked or at least
Speaker 11: put out there. The fact that that wasn't done, to me,
Speaker 11: suggests that we need to go back to a system
Speaker 11: where there's a mutual agreement on moderators.
Speaker 7: And that's really that.
Speaker 11: Really give some thought to that ahead of time, because
Speaker 11: I agree thus far I think the moderation in this
Speaker 11: cycle hasn't been great.
Speaker 2: Just in general.
Speaker 6: Do you think last night's debate was more important than
Speaker 6: most VP debates, which have been completely unimportant in the past.
Speaker 2: I don't know.
Speaker 11: My gut tells me no, it's going to be pretty
Speaker 11: much the same. And again, there wasn't a huge viral moment.
Speaker 11: I mean, if you think back to VP debates in
Speaker 11: the past, when they've really stood out, it's been you know,
Speaker 11: when Lloyd Benson went after I think it was Dan Quayle,
Speaker 11: when Quayle compared himself to John F. Kennedy and Benson said,
Speaker 11: you know, I knew him, he was a friend, you know,
Speaker 11: Jack Kennedy.
Speaker 2: That was a moment.
Speaker 11: There have been moments in these debates that have stood out.
Speaker 11: That's the only way in which a VP debate does
Speaker 11: tend to have a lasting influence on public opinion. And
Speaker 11: I just didn't see it night, so to me, at least,
Speaker 11: you know, when you see some short term movement, yes,
Speaker 11: does it affect the trajectory of the race as being
Speaker 11: a very close race? It's going to be tightly contested
Speaker 11: in the six or seven states we're talking about. No,
Speaker 11: I think this debate did not have that kind of influence.
Speaker 2: Saw.
Speaker 1: I was reminded yesterday reading a couple of different pieces
Speaker 1: from pundits that the Harris Walls ticket is the most
Speaker 1: liberal ticket in US history by a major party, and
Speaker 1: I had forgotten that. I mean, it clearly is the
Speaker 1: Trump campaign somehow needs to do a better job of
Speaker 1: just hammering that over and over and over again to
Speaker 1: where even if people decide that's the direction they want
Speaker 1: to go, knowing that's the direction they're.
Speaker 11: Going, that is the direction they need to go in.
Speaker 11: And I mean, if you look at again, if you
Speaker 11: look at what the research tells us, that is the
Speaker 11: point on which Harris Walls are most vulnerable, which is
Speaker 11: this notion that they are well to the left of
Speaker 11: the American mainstream. And I think actually last night JD.
Speaker 11: Vance demonstrated what a concerted and substantive attack on some
Speaker 11: of those fronts. Looks like he was a very focused
Speaker 11: debater last night, which I think is of course in
Speaker 11: contrast to Trump, because when Trump's up there, he talks
Speaker 11: about whatever Trump wants to talk about, right, and that's
Speaker 11: not nearly as focused as Vance. I thought Vance was
Speaker 11: very effective because he did prosecute some of that case
Speaker 11: last night. But I agree completely with you that the
Speaker 11: only way I think that they continue to make headway
Speaker 11: that the Trump dance ticket is by emphasizing how and
Speaker 11: to what degree the Democratic ticket is is to the
Speaker 11: left of where the American mainstream is on many issues,
Speaker 11: not just by the way I think their proposals have
Speaker 11: moderated quite frankly. If you look at the proposals that
Speaker 11: they put out there during the last couple of weeks,
Speaker 11: they appear very moderate. But if you look at their
Speaker 11: governing histories, both Kamala Harris and Tim Walls, you do
Speaker 11: have a very left of center record, particularly in Walls.
Speaker 7: I mean, Walls has done.
Speaker 11: Some wacky things in Minnesota, and the Trump dance ticket
Speaker 11: needs to figure out a way to get that out there.
Speaker 1: One day, Lon Heatchen is running for governor of California,
Speaker 1: and we're going to do everything in our power to
Speaker 1: get you over the top.
Speaker 11: Well, I appreciate that it's gonna have to be a
Speaker 11: very different world than the one we live in now.
Speaker 11: It's birth two on which that happens.
Speaker 2: Unfortunately.
Speaker 6: Yeah, well, and I was just gonna say, if undecided
Speaker 6: voters a fall for the whole no no, no, I'll
Speaker 6: govern is a moderate thing. Again, that will be very
Speaker 6: frustrating for me. So, lanhie Chen of the Hoover Institution,
Speaker 6: Stanford University, you have an event tonight, I believe, not
Speaker 6: far from the radio ranch in scenic Sacramento, California.
Speaker 2: What's going on?
Speaker 11: Yeah, we'll be up there in Sacramento talking about the
Speaker 11: election with some folks from the Sacramento area. So if
Speaker 11: people are interested, it's a Sacramento County Republican Party event,
Speaker 11: they can check it out.
Speaker 7: And you know, would love to see you there and
Speaker 7: would love.
Speaker 11: To talk more about last night's debate and what we
Speaker 11: think is going to happen in the elections and just
Speaker 11: have a great chat. I love being up in sacrament
Speaker 11: I think it's been a little hot up there today,
Speaker 11: but aside from that, Aside from that, I always love
Speaker 11: being in the area and look forward to seeing some
Speaker 11: old friend.
Speaker 6: Why two revelations there turns out there is a Republican
Speaker 6: Party in Sacramento, California, and Sacramento, apparently.
Speaker 2: Is there talking to me from the control room, is.
Speaker 6: The capital of California. Lanihe Chen, thanks so much. Great
Speaker 6: to talk to you as always.
Speaker 7: Hey, great to be with you guys.
Speaker 2: Take care yep.
Speaker 1: Yeah, we had a private conversation with Lonnie and we
Speaker 1: went out to dinner with him when we were at
Speaker 1: the convention, and I don't think he would mind us
Speaker 1: sharing this and that he's pretty pessimistic about politics in
Speaker 1: California getting any better anytime. Soon as well he should be,
Speaker 1: which is just depressing as hell.
Speaker 2: Doomed.
Speaker 7: Doom.
Speaker 1: You can get doomed if you become a one party state, Yeah,
Speaker 1: particularly if one party has captured certain institutions like public
Speaker 1: employee unions that can turn out enough vote and to
Speaker 1: get into this circular money thing where they give each
Speaker 1: other money.
Speaker 6: And so it's just the average voter cannot break through.
Speaker 6: It's I read, Oh, I held on to it now
Speaker 6: I can't remember where. It is an absolutely elegant way
Speaker 6: to express That's what I've been talking about for years,
Speaker 6: which is if you have concentrated benefit but disperate cost,
Speaker 6: the benefit people will always win because they really really
Speaker 6: make out, but the cost is spread across the entire
Speaker 6: tax base, and so those people never like come together
Speaker 6: and rise up and the scam. And California is all
Speaker 6: about that scam.
Speaker 1: Often playing a big role, certainly in California Union. Speaking
Speaker 1: of that topic, that didn't come up last night, the
Speaker 1: big long shortman strike. The guy that's the head of
Speaker 1: that union is quite a piece of work. If you
Speaker 1: don't know his whole story.
Speaker 6: Yeah, I actually don't want to talk about him, because
Speaker 6: when I go to sleep tonight, I don't want it
Speaker 6: to be with the fishes if you follow me, Wow,
Speaker 6: what are you hinting at?
Speaker 2: So that's coming up? Discuss right?
Speaker 10: All right?
Speaker 2: Shut up, we get it.
Speaker 1: The Democrats are the party unions, and one of the
Speaker 1: biggest unions in the country's on striker right now. The
Speaker 1: long sharman didn't come up on the debate last night
Speaker 1: because it wouldn't have been good for.
Speaker 2: The left, so they didn't want to get into that topic.
Speaker 2: I guess. So let's get into it now.
Speaker 6: Ladies and gentlemen, we give you the head of the
Speaker 6: long Shoreman's Union, Herald Jade Daggett.
Speaker 9: Are you worried that this strike is gonna hurt the
Speaker 9: everyday American?
Speaker 2: The farmers that need to read they reached the export market.
Speaker 2: They're telling me that they're gonna hurt them.
Speaker 10: Start to realize who the long shoremen are, right, nobody
Speaker 10: can keep and Nevi gave it about us until now
Speaker 10: when they finally realize that the chain is being broke. Now,
Speaker 10: cars won't come in, food won't come in, clothing won't
Speaker 10: come in. You know how many people depend on odd
Speaker 10: jobs half the world, and it's time for them, and
Speaker 10: time for Washington to put so much pressure on them
Speaker 10: to take care of us, because we took care of
Speaker 10: them and we're here one hundred and thirty five years
Speaker 10: and brought to where they are today, and they don't
Speaker 10: want to share.
Speaker 6: These people today don't know what a strike is, said
Speaker 6: a fiery mister Daggett.
Speaker 2: I'll cripple you. I will cripple you.
Speaker 1: And he doesn't sound like the kind of guy that's
Speaker 1: mobbed up out of a movie at all, or exactly.
Speaker 2: It's like he was. He was like he was a
Speaker 2: paid actor.
Speaker 1: I want you to portray a union boss is mobbed up. Okay,
Speaker 1: I think I can do it. You know, we need
Speaker 1: to do another take. That was a little over the top.
Speaker 1: Can we ease back on that a little bit so.
Speaker 6: Daggett's work at the union has sometimes attracted the attention
Speaker 6: of authorities who've previously accused him of mob ties, a
Speaker 6: claims he has denied.
Speaker 2: Really he said, he didn't say, you got me.
Speaker 6: In five he stood trial in Brooklyn on wire and
Speaker 6: mail fraud charges alongside another ILA official and an alleged mobster,
Speaker 6: accused of steering union benefits to contracts to firms that
Speaker 6: paid kickbacks to organized crime. Again, I say witnesses testified
Speaker 6: the Daggett was elevated. This is witnesses under oath in
Speaker 6: public testifying Daggitt was elevated through the ila by the
Speaker 6: mob because he was an associate of the Genevese crime family.
Speaker 6: He denies it, said he's terrified of crime families and
Speaker 6: went out of his way to avoid them. He says
Speaker 6: they forget about it. The three defendants were acquitted. Lawrence Ricci,
Speaker 6: the defendant alleged to be a Genovi's crime family member,
Speaker 6: went missing during the trial and was later found partly
Speaker 6: decomposed in the trunk of a car outside the Huck
Speaker 6: Finn Diner in Scenic Union, New Jersey.
Speaker 2: That is too much.
Speaker 1: I mean, that is too on the nose to even
Speaker 1: be believable. So this guy you just heard from that
Speaker 1: has the longshoreman on strike, that's costing the country five
Speaker 1: billion dollars a day. And there are now forty ships
Speaker 1: backed up off the coast in the Gulf forty. There
Speaker 1: were a couple yesterday, forty today. It'll be two hundred
Speaker 1: by next week if this keeps going anyway. So that
Speaker 1: guy's on trial and one of the key witnesses disappears
Speaker 1: and is found in the true bunk up a car
Speaker 1: behind a diner in New Jersey, like it's out of
Speaker 1: a bad Sopranos copy show clarification.
Speaker 6: He was one of the defendants. And it's pretty obvious
Speaker 6: that the family thought this guy's gonna crack. I can
Speaker 6: tell by looking at it. He's gonna crack. Gotcha? So
Speaker 6: he went to sleep in a trunk and decomposed. It
Speaker 6: could happen to anybody. Oh, let's see. So Daggett has
Speaker 6: called leave a drunk. He called the allegations of mob
Speaker 6: influenced total bullless in a dark, ugly attack on Italian America.
Speaker 2: How dare you?
Speaker 6: Last year, according to the US Labor Department filings, he
Speaker 6: earned seven hundred and twenty eight thousand dollars as head
Speaker 6: of the ILA and a further one hundred and seventy
Speaker 6: three grand as president emeritus of the Mechanics Local Chapter
Speaker 6: at Port Newark. His son Dennis, who has senior roles
Speaker 6: in both groups, was paid a total of more than
Speaker 6: seven hundred thousand dollars himself.
Speaker 1: Wow, so Dad's getting about a million dollars a year
Speaker 1: and with benefits would be worth a lot more than that,
Speaker 1: because I heard him talking about their vacation and the
Speaker 1: healthcare plans they have and everything like that, and then
Speaker 1: the way you get to use vacation time blah blah blah,
Speaker 1: and then his son's making crazy money.
Speaker 2: Wow.
Speaker 6: Leaving the cargo terminal in Elizabeth, New Jersey, New Jersey,
Speaker 6: early Tuesday morning, he suggested in his gruff manner that
Speaker 6: he and ILA members are digging in for a lengthy showdown.
Speaker 6: Somebody asked him how long the strike might last, and
Speaker 6: the poet Laureate of American Labor said, and I quote,
Speaker 6: I don't have an effing crystal ball between my legs,
Speaker 6: but it will last very long.
Speaker 2: I would tell you that. Woh my god, Wow my god.
Speaker 6: When you don't even feel like you have to pretend anymore,
Speaker 6: that's what's most amazing about this.
Speaker 1: And you've seen this with the United autoworkers sometimes too.
Speaker 1: They feel so untouchable they can just basically say it
Speaker 1: out loud. Yeah I'm mobbed up. Yeah I'm rich. He
Speaker 1: drives a Bentley, this guy, so he's not it's not
Speaker 1: like he's trying to hide his success.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 6: He and P Diddy could probably compare notes on feeling untouchable.
Speaker 2: But you're right.
Speaker 1: The fact that they don't feel like they even need
Speaker 1: to pretend that they're not what they are, Yeah, is
Speaker 1: how untouchable they feel and have been for a very
Speaker 1: long time.
Speaker 2: Wait for miss an hour.
Speaker 1: Get the podcast Armstrong and Getty on demand Armstrong and
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